Speaker 1: You're listening to Sorry for Asking.
Speaker 2: Sorry for Asking.
Speaker 3: I'm Cole Connor and I'm Adam Ramsey. This is where
Speaker 3: we talk, shop, ask questions, tell stories, and laugh and
Speaker 3: laughs about being creators as well.
Speaker 1: As consumers of adult content.
Speaker 2: He love watching too, we certainly do.
Speaker 3: We also discussed the impact adult films have had on us,
Speaker 3: on our guests, and on the LGBTQ community.
Speaker 1: So strap on and strap in.
Speaker 2: And here we go. Hello, and welcome back to Sorry
Speaker 2: for Asking. Hi. I'm Cole Connor and I'm Adam Ramsey.
Speaker 3: Without about an introduction or anything, well we didn't, he
Speaker 3: did himself. Well, the surprise is out. Yes, we have
Speaker 3: Hayden Harding here with us. He's he's everywhere, all at once.
Speaker 4: Everything everywhere on the present, Yes, and so quickly. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 4: we're gonna get into all of that. Hi, you guys
Speaker 4: is Hateen Harding.
Speaker 2: Yay. I don't even know how it happened.
Speaker 4: I met you at a party two years ago, and
Speaker 4: then all of a sudden you were just everywhere in
Speaker 4: my life, on my feed, among my friends.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: I have to say he did do a lot of
Speaker 3: collabing with me at the beginning.
Speaker 5: I did so much to the point where you're the
Speaker 5: gate I can't film with col anymore.
Speaker 4: Cole, do you feel like you're like a gateway these days?
Speaker 4: Like for a lot of these these the new kids, I.
Speaker 3: Feel like I when I film, it's usually with people
Speaker 3: coming through LA film with a lot of people, even
Speaker 3: host people I.
Speaker 2: Have, and then they stay too long. Yeah I remember names.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, but it's I mean, you've been there, You've
Speaker 3: seen it happen, and I've.
Speaker 2: Seen I think two and then more than just you. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: they usually I'm not the only one that happens.
Speaker 5: Yeah, but uh so it's kind of your fault because no,
Speaker 5: but it happens not learning.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 3: I spoke about this with my therapist and I was like,
Speaker 3: I need to be clear with my boundaries because even
Speaker 3: if I say something like you can stay two nights,
Speaker 3: but you got to go Sunday, if I say it
Speaker 3: with a smile, they don't.
Speaker 2: Really hear it.
Speaker 5: So just stating back to be forcing you to be
Speaker 5: like yeah, so that they're like, this was the agreement,
Speaker 5: this is what I said.
Speaker 2: People want to hear.
Speaker 3: People hear what they want to hear, you know, So
Speaker 3: like if if they're like, Okay, he means I can
Speaker 3: stay for like a couple of days. I'm sure he
Speaker 3: doesn't care if it's one more day. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 3: but I do, he does, he does.
Speaker 5: You guys, they're rigid boundaries, not they're not porous.
Speaker 2: Rigid not porous.
Speaker 4: Porest boundaries means that like oh yes, yeah, no, I'm
Speaker 4: I'm very familiar with my habit of porous boundaries.
Speaker 5: Yeah, how do you feel you Wow, you can actually
Speaker 5: see right through your your support.
Speaker 3: I mean, how do you feel about your boundaries? Do
Speaker 3: you feel like horrible?
Speaker 5: You're horrible horrible hoo horrible, horrible, horrible boundaries they're getting
Speaker 5: more and more rigid or I want to say balance,
Speaker 5: like closer to the It takes some work to actually
Speaker 5: my patience is just wearing thinner and thinner. Well, you're
Speaker 5: very busy, Yeah, you're very trying to keep myself busy.
Speaker 5: I mean, lately I feel like I haven't been busy enough.
Speaker 2: Is that true? But I still am.
Speaker 5: Like the one thing I just can't stand is when
Speaker 5: people don't respect my time.
Speaker 2: Like people, especially people like in the industry. There's two
Speaker 2: types of people.
Speaker 5: Those that do it because they're really good at what
Speaker 5: they do and like, I know, they're.
Speaker 2: Made for it. And then there's people that do it
Speaker 2: because they can't do anything.
Speaker 5: Else and they want attention and they want attention or
Speaker 5: like their face is just pretty enough and they don't
Speaker 5: want to get a real job, so.
Speaker 2: They do porn.
Speaker 4: Wait, no, no, I want to unpack all of it.
Speaker 4: We usually try to start at the beginning, but let's
Speaker 4: start in the present. It seems like maybe today you
Speaker 4: had an experience where your time was not respected.
Speaker 2: Well, I mean it's not us.
Speaker 5: I guess like I have like like a threshold for
Speaker 5: like how many things I can take in a week,
Speaker 5: and it's like this person canceled, this person canceled, this
Speaker 5: person canceled, And I'm about to have a hair transplant in Turkey,
Speaker 5: so I'm trying to build a bunch of content before
Speaker 5: that too, you know, to make sure I have my
Speaker 5: workload schedule eyebrows and there.
Speaker 2: No, oh my god, no, it slipped.
Speaker 5: But yeah, but I'm gonna be out of work for like,
Speaker 5: right at least a month, if not two or three.
Speaker 5: And even if I jump back in it, it might not
Speaker 5: be very good because it'll be fine. Yeah, Well we'll
Speaker 5: see who knows.
Speaker 3: Well, you can always wear a hat, but I know
Speaker 3: people that have that have had that done and then
Speaker 3: they just they wear a hat for all their Yeah,
Speaker 3: they just say.
Speaker 5: Like it's not the best for you to wear a
Speaker 5: hat afterwards making it a successful surgery. But yeah, but anyways,
Speaker 5: so I've been trying to get a lot of content
Speaker 5: in a very short amount of time, and this last week,
Speaker 5: my roommate was out of town, and so it was like, perfect,
Speaker 5: I have a place to myself, I can use the
Speaker 5: living room which has like beautiful natural light, and like
Speaker 5: what I want to do or what I want to use,
Speaker 5: And so I scheduled just shit tone of the collabs
Speaker 5: in that time. And then it's just like one thing
Speaker 5: after another happened where it's like, oh, the sales has
Speaker 5: to get rescheduled.
Speaker 2: This all has to get rescheduled.
Speaker 5: And so now I'm kind of just like, Okay, I've.
Speaker 2: Took too much work on the first time.
Speaker 5: So it's like anyone that's canceling for a reason that
Speaker 5: I think is like kind of bullshit, Like I'm I
Speaker 5: just don't want to get up and work today. Like
Speaker 5: I'm like, okay, well, yeah we can reschedule, but you
Speaker 5: can host, and you can find the cameraman, and you
Speaker 5: can pay for.
Speaker 2: All of it.
Speaker 5: And I just like, I guess I kind of like like, okay,
Speaker 5: if I'll put an equal effort. So I'm like, if
Speaker 5: you show me that you're willing to put in some
Speaker 5: effort and like put some commitment behind it, then it's
Speaker 5: like then we'll go again, or like or then I'll then.
Speaker 4: We'll you know, why is this such a common story lately,
Speaker 4: Like the last minute cancelations, I feel like.
Speaker 2: I hear it all.
Speaker 5: I think it's the people that just don't They are
Speaker 5: just in this because they don't want to work, and like, man,
Speaker 5: just like the last few months.
Speaker 4: I just feel like I've been hearing a lot of
Speaker 4: stories from friends of mine who are content creators who
Speaker 4: were just like, oh, well got canceled on again today.
Speaker 2: Yeah, just like constant cancelations.
Speaker 5: I mean there's people that like will also way over
Speaker 5: book themselves in like you know, like from that, but
Speaker 5: then also people will do it in preparation of cancelations.
Speaker 5: So like some guy will be visiting Los Angeles for
Speaker 5: one week and schedule three collapse a day knowing that
Speaker 5: two will cancel. Wow, and then if all three go through,
Speaker 5: then he'll cancel fucking exhausted.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I the last actually, the only time I can think
Speaker 3: of that I canceled was the guy that was from
Speaker 3: out of town and I knew he had a lot
Speaker 3: of stuff going on anyway, and I was just like,
Speaker 3: I'm not going to I mean, I'm.
Speaker 2: Guilty of it too.
Speaker 5: I've canceled, but like I feel like I could count
Speaker 5: the number of times in one hand. Yeah, like one hand,
Speaker 5: and they're always like good, Like if I have an STI,
Speaker 5: I'm not gonna film with you, please don't everyone.
Speaker 4: I mean the s c I is often I've heard
Speaker 4: an excuse, Yeah, like a not real one, one of.
Speaker 5: That people use really easy think about.
Speaker 2: It's like you got to tell it to one person.
Speaker 3: You gotta tell either way you're a human, and then
Speaker 3: you gotta and then you gotta wait.
Speaker 2: If it's a lie, then you still have to do
Speaker 2: the whether you're lying about having it or you're spreading it,
Speaker 2: are all just horrible people. Sorry, still lie about us.
Speaker 5: Just don't lie and make your commitments, show up on time,
Speaker 5: prep be ready to work, or just know yourself and
Speaker 5: don't overbook yourself.
Speaker 2: If you know that, you're like, you're not doing to
Speaker 2: in one day. You used to though, right, I.
Speaker 3: Have on like a content trip, but I don't usually
Speaker 3: if I've never really I'm on a trip to in
Speaker 3: one days to breezy, I could do one a day
Speaker 3: for a long stretch. Yeah, but even that's too.
Speaker 2: Much for me.
Speaker 5: I mean, if I'm if I'm in another city where
Speaker 5: I'm like not doing anything else and that I get bored,
Speaker 5: I'm like, okay, i could do three a day, but
Speaker 5: I'm going to space them out, or I'm gonna do
Speaker 5: no time.
Speaker 2: I know, there's different ways.
Speaker 3: Else, if you're verse, you can be like I can
Speaker 3: have a topping scene and then a bottoming scene.
Speaker 2: Yes exactly. So I'm going to London and one of them.
Speaker 5: Is like, Okay, these three guys are all very close
Speaker 5: to each other.
Speaker 2: I'm going to film back to back with all three
Speaker 2: of them. I kind of like, that's one douche.
Speaker 3: I'd rather put them all together and do a hot Yeah.
Speaker 5: I'll do that too, you know, but then sometimes they
Speaker 5: want separate, so those so it's kind of like you
Speaker 5: do like I'd rather than throw them all together in
Speaker 5: one shoot and get it all over done with with.
Speaker 3: William c It and Malik Delgatti that I went downtown
Speaker 3: for them to do like a three way, and then
Speaker 3: they both wanted two. I was like, I'll do one
Speaker 3: with William, but I don't have enough in me for two.
Speaker 3: For getting yeah, because I have one with I've done
Speaker 3: a duo with him already and he was on there.
Speaker 3: He was wearing condoms at the time, so I was like,
Speaker 3: I don't need another Condra Cass.
Speaker 4: I want to talk about you, okay, because I met
Speaker 4: you at a party, Yes, okay, Well, I don't know
Speaker 4: much about you. I know that we like you, know,
Speaker 4: I fucking love you as a person, but it's only
Speaker 4: because I know you for the last two and a
Speaker 4: half years. We met at a party through our friend Colin,
Speaker 4: and you're just so sweet and positive and bubbly. I
Speaker 4: think drama kind of follows you, but I don't know
Speaker 4: that side of you very much.
Speaker 2: I just know you to be a very positive and
Speaker 2: happy person.
Speaker 4: And then it was like, once you plugged yourself into
Speaker 4: the adult film gay adult film world, you were just
Speaker 4: like always working and so like what I like to work.
Speaker 4: I like to be busy, like in general, you're like
Speaker 4: a work in general.
Speaker 2: Yeah, like I get restless, had a job at the
Speaker 2: times you still I had a day job. You don't
Speaker 2: do not anymore. Do you want to talk about that
Speaker 2: decision process?
Speaker 3: Well, because I feel like you got really I feel
Speaker 3: like you started traveling more and stuff when that well, yeah,
Speaker 3: so once that ended, then that's like my boyfriend travels
Speaker 3: all the time for work, and he does this too,
Speaker 3: but it's but not as much as me.
Speaker 5: He has like a full time, full time job, and
Speaker 5: so when he travels, like I feel my time to
Speaker 5: make sure I'm like just as busy as him, except
Speaker 5: mine's like all sex work are like all collaborations or photos.
Speaker 2: Like when you travel together.
Speaker 5: You mean, yeah, so he'll be he'll be doing his
Speaker 5: like full time job job, and then I'll be just
Speaker 5: doing a bunch of collabs. So it's kind of because
Speaker 5: some of it comes from that, like just trying to
Speaker 5: fill time, but also it's like trying to take advantage
Speaker 5: of being in a different place and like work with
Speaker 5: other creators in those locations.
Speaker 2: But you started in studios, right, I started in studio
Speaker 2: through my neighbors.
Speaker 4: Our mutual friends, Okay, yes, Lee, and then known as
Speaker 4: Levi on Sean Cody s Coty, who got involved.
Speaker 2: In all this.
Speaker 3: When was the first time, yea a Shawan Coty. It
Speaker 3: was like a year or two ago, two years, two years,
Speaker 3: two and a half years maybe, And I met you
Speaker 3: right before you went to Europe in August of last year. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: so you've done.
Speaker 5: At first, I was just doing Shancoty and then through
Speaker 5: that got into men and then I was like, okay, well,
Speaker 5: well I'm getting this exposure, I should at least create
Speaker 5: a Twitter and start building up a following in case
Speaker 5: I ever want to start only fans.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then I'm.
Speaker 5: Glad I did that, of course, and now I have
Speaker 5: Now I'm doing only fans and I'm getting like before,
Speaker 5: I was definitely getting way more money in studio work
Speaker 5: than ever and only fans.
Speaker 2: Well because Sean Coty pays.
Speaker 4: I mean, like for people who are listening who don't know,
Speaker 4: Sean Cody is one of the studios who's long been
Speaker 4: known in the among the industry as like the highest
Speaker 4: paying studios.
Speaker 2: Yes, and it's also like the one it's.
Speaker 5: More they try to like maintain exclusivity.
Speaker 2: With their models for sure. Degree So yes, like this
Speaker 2: makes sense.
Speaker 5: There's exceptions, but yeah, but that's why people with if
Speaker 5: you already have a huge following, you're less likely to
Speaker 5: work with Sean Cody. Ah, if you have worked with
Speaker 5: other studios, it's very unlikely that they'll bring you in.
Speaker 2: Just kind of an interesting business model, like what do
Speaker 2: you think And they also just have like first names.
Speaker 4: Yeah, they all just have first name, so they like
Speaker 4: kind of like build people, they build their own star.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well their name is Sean Cody.
Speaker 3: So like it's definitely by design that like people think
Speaker 3: that they're watching like someone named Sean Cody.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Interesting, they can't remember the name of the model that
Speaker 3: they remember Shan Cody, right, figure, they can always That's
Speaker 3: how I always felt about.
Speaker 2: Ambiguous, Like oh I love Paul from Shankoch.
Speaker 3: And they're like, this guy doesn't really have a follower.
Speaker 3: I have to come to Shan Cody.
Speaker 2: Right right, right right. Interesting.
Speaker 4: So you were for like a period of time Sean
Speaker 4: Cody's Hayden Yeah right.
Speaker 5: I think I think so. Maybe I wasn't as aware
Speaker 5: of it at the time, but like happily.
Speaker 2: So like I love working with Shaan Cody. Yeah, team,
Speaker 2: you had a good experience.
Speaker 5: Yeah, men dot com as well like they because it's
Speaker 5: all owned by al the same parent company.
Speaker 2: Was Levi your first scene partner?
Speaker 5: Levi was my first scene partner, the first person to
Speaker 5: top him on camera?
Speaker 2: Wow, what a distinction. What a distinction. I mean that special,
Speaker 2: I mean you are. I mean he's a reliable top. Yes,
Speaker 2: gets heart, easy, comes easy. Yeah, but you know that
Speaker 2: about him.
Speaker 3: But he comes easy to because it comes easy, you guys,
Speaker 3: because we've had sex off camera too, and I'm like,
Speaker 3: just come, just do it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, please don't know. We don't need to be labor this.
Speaker 5: Most most people when they're filming, they have to take breaks,
Speaker 5: so like get hard again.
Speaker 2: I have to take breaks, so I don't come. That's
Speaker 2: so cute. I love it. I don't know if you were.
Speaker 2: Were you surprised that you were such a hit at
Speaker 2: Seawan Cody?
Speaker 5: I have a bit because I was pretty barry, Like, yeah,
Speaker 5: you're you're like and not there and I'm leaner now
Speaker 5: than I was then, Like so I was even chunkier.
Speaker 2: You were never chunky, thank you, but yes you were.
Speaker 2: You were. I was a bigger boy.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you were me and fuzzy, which is like not
Speaker 4: usually Sean Coty's thing, So how did you?
Speaker 2: I don't know, I don't know what. Uh it's that
Speaker 2: fucking smile. I can't even look at I just charmed
Speaker 2: the producers.
Speaker 3: They were just like, we want to work, yes, yeah,
Speaker 3: if you're reliable, and you're like that is the thing
Speaker 3: where it's like what I was saying about people that
Speaker 3: are in this because they show up and people that
Speaker 3: are in it because they don't want to do anything else.
Speaker 5: Seawan Cody is I think tired of like because it
Speaker 5: studio works expensive to make, Like you have to pay
Speaker 5: for all the models, you have to pay for all
Speaker 5: the tests that they have to clear for if you
Speaker 5: if they don't clear, that's still out of your pocket.
Speaker 2: And so I think they're tired of just.
Speaker 5: Paying for people that flaked or I guess like they
Speaker 5: give people a certain number of flakes before they're like, Okay,
Speaker 5: we're not asking.
Speaker 2: This person anymore.
Speaker 5: They've told me, they've told me like, like you're reliable,
Speaker 5: So like that's why they told me that.
Speaker 2: That's one of the reasons they bring me in. And
Speaker 2: I think also because I.
Speaker 5: Helped treat like and like I wasn't great in my
Speaker 5: first couple of studio scenes either. But like there are
Speaker 5: some people that are catch on a little more quickly
Speaker 5: about like fucking the camera and not fucking the.
Speaker 2: Person in front of you.
Speaker 5: So sometimes there's some teaching moments that really help. If
Speaker 5: you're a scene partner, is like helping helping steer you there,
Speaker 5: because most people like if you give them a gentle push,
Speaker 5: like the lead, then they catch on.
Speaker 4: Was there a person who did kind of was kind
Speaker 4: of the guide for you in that regard?
Speaker 5: I think just watching my own content and seeing my
Speaker 5: fuck ups, seeing my mistake, I was like, ooh, I
Speaker 5: hate that angle or.
Speaker 2: Ooh that doesn't And then also the producers help you.
Speaker 5: Too, like they say like like hey, Hayden, face the camera.
Speaker 4: I've got to say a lot as someone who's been
Speaker 4: doing this a very long time, there are a lot
Speaker 4: of people who do this who don't have that instinct,
Speaker 4: who don't have that skill or that awareness to know that,
Speaker 4: like being camera aware is super important.
Speaker 2: And I filmed you two days ago.
Speaker 4: I was behind the camera lucky me for one of
Speaker 4: his scenes, and I noticed when you were aware.
Speaker 2: This is one day ago, yesterday. That was not yesterday,
Speaker 2: that was yesterday, it actually wasn't you.
Speaker 3: No, it was because you asked because texted me. I'm
Speaker 3: sure he texted about No, it.
Speaker 4: Was Wednesday, girls, literally day, No, yesterday, I had gym class.
Speaker 2: It was Wednesday, And what the did I do this? Earl?
Speaker 2: What did you do yesterday? You don't even know?
Speaker 5: Ah, no, yesterday?
Speaker 6: Okay, I was like, I was like crazy, no, because
Speaker 6: like after I wrapped up with you, I went to
Speaker 6: Brogan's house because he filmed me for a thing that
Speaker 6: was definitely not yesterday.
Speaker 2: Thank you. I'm not greaty, I'm the one anyway.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I noticed that you were just like really aware
Speaker 4: of where I was moving because you would twist the
Speaker 4: body to me. You would move your arm out of
Speaker 4: the way. Why don't these guys know to move your
Speaker 4: arm out of the way.
Speaker 2: Arms all the time? Move I've actually seen you do that.
Speaker 2: You move your arm. Your arm is in the way
Speaker 2: of the thing that people want to see. The camera
Speaker 2: is right there. The arm I moved the most is
Speaker 2: my deck. Like, oh, well that's a different story. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that is a different sting.
Speaker 4: But yeah, like so, so I'm sure that that is
Speaker 4: probably a big reason like that, I think being reliable
Speaker 4: and being camera aware.
Speaker 3: I think also it might be like people that do
Speaker 3: mostly stationary like know where the camera usually is where
Speaker 3: it's set someone moving around, and they're not used to
Speaker 3: like being aware of the movement of the Vido video grip.
Speaker 5: Like I can't like personally, like I do not I
Speaker 5: hate the stationary setup too, Like I am not happy
Speaker 5: with the word it's so much longer, it takes so
Speaker 5: much longer. I can't enjoy it at all, and like
Speaker 5: like normally like if I'm not, like I am more
Speaker 5: camera aware, and that definitely kind of makes it takes
Speaker 5: you out of the sex a little bit and like
Speaker 5: you're a little less present in some ways. But I
Speaker 5: look forward to being present when I watch it and
Speaker 5: like kind of reliving or like enjoying it for the
Speaker 5: first time as a viewer, right, and like more than
Speaker 5: like as the actual person having sex, which.
Speaker 2: I love how I love to watch that stuff.
Speaker 5: I try to like skim through at least each video
Speaker 5: after it's done, Like but like that's that's kind of
Speaker 5: like my reward is like rather than like I want
Speaker 5: because I want the product to be good.
Speaker 2: I want my final I take pride in my work.
Speaker 2: I want it to look good, Like that's yeah, I.
Speaker 5: Think that's hotter than the thirty minutes or the twenty minutes.
Speaker 5: Like for me, it's ten minutes of my ten minute
Speaker 5: video where it's like, you know, I spend two hours
Speaker 5: douching for this, two hours doing for ten minutes. But
Speaker 5: it's like, but I look at it is like I
Speaker 5: spent two hours douching for a film that will last
Speaker 5: for forever that I'll watch once, but I think I
Speaker 5: enjoy it more after like watching it after, Like that's
Speaker 5: my that's I guess my way of saying that, or
Speaker 5: my way of justifying being less present in the scene
Speaker 5: is that it'll be a better video, like right.
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Speaker 2: Well, let me ask you this. Let's go back a
Speaker 2: little bit. Where are you from? Originally?
Speaker 5: I am from Pasadena, California.
Speaker 2: Oh, you're a fucking la boy like me. Did I
Speaker 2: know this about you? I don't know.
Speaker 5: But I also jumped around, like my family moved a lot.
Speaker 5: I was part I grew up in a very big
Speaker 5: Roman Catholic family. I'm one of eleven children. I have
Speaker 5: five brothers and five sisters.
Speaker 2: Where are you in the line, I am the third
Speaker 2: third of eleven. Yeah.
Speaker 7: Wow.
Speaker 5: So I don't really talk to any of them because
Speaker 5: they're super religious and just totally still totally different mindset
Speaker 5: and like it's just frustrating to stay in contact.
Speaker 2: So I don't Is that difficult or are you kind
Speaker 2: of relieved? I'm at this point.
Speaker 5: I'm relieved and like it's more like if something comes
Speaker 5: up that brings me back into that world, it only
Speaker 5: brings stress and like headache, and it's kind of like
Speaker 5: what is this, Like I kind of thought about it
Speaker 5: a long time ago where it's like, well I wanted
Speaker 5: that when I was a kid, and now I'm like,
Speaker 5: there's no need for parents and so yeah, there's no
Speaker 5: benefit for me to have parents or to have a
Speaker 5: family like that.
Speaker 2: That's right, that I don't that isn't fun to be around.
Speaker 5: And like just like how I like most people, most
Speaker 5: straight people like don't like being around their family, or
Speaker 5: like people dread going home for the holidays because they
Speaker 5: don't enjoy time with their family.
Speaker 4: And I'm kind of relieved of that. Yeah, you can
Speaker 4: make your own holidays.
Speaker 2: Yeah, or I can choose my own family.
Speaker 4: Family absolutely, as you know, we gay people, we get
Speaker 4: to choose likes.
Speaker 2: It's so true though, there's a reason RuPaul's successful. She
Speaker 2: says a lot of things, right, Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 3: Well we're lucky. We both we both have good standings
Speaker 3: with our.
Speaker 4: We do, yes, But but I totally I I can
Speaker 4: see also like the how his perspective that is also.
Speaker 2: Crat I'm not every Yeah, it's not everyone.
Speaker 4: Right, but no, but I also think that there's huge
Speaker 4: value in chosen family, which we also have.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and I love like when I was younger, we
Speaker 5: would find like resentment towards people that cared about their
Speaker 5: parents' opinions at all, and then.
Speaker 2: Like over time, I'm like, Okay, now some parents are good.
Speaker 5: Some people owe their parents more than what I owe mine, right, right, right,
Speaker 5: So it's I've learned not to project my past onto
Speaker 5: everyone else, absolutely, but yeah, very smart. But yeah, I
Speaker 5: grew up all over California. When I turned went to
Speaker 5: the little Catholic private school in Pasadena, and then when
Speaker 5: it's called Saint Monica Academy, it was like Boulevard.
Speaker 2: By the Rose Bowl, gotcha.
Speaker 5: And then when I turned eighteen, I moved to Washington
Speaker 5: State briefly to work at a winery and then just
Speaker 5: doing the harvest, which is like all manual labor.
Speaker 2: And then from there I.
Speaker 5: Got to know some people that were going to go
Speaker 5: into a harvest in Australia, and so when I was eighteen,
Speaker 5: I moved there and I stay there for a year
Speaker 5: until my visa expired, then moved to New Zealand. Stayed
Speaker 5: there until my views expired and then moved to Napa
Speaker 5: because that was the only place it's like kind of
Speaker 5: close to home that makes wine, and so then I got.
Speaker 2: Into the wine industry there.
Speaker 5: Lived there for four years, and then I kind of
Speaker 5: got into like administrative work for like a wine packaging company.
Speaker 2: Wow. Yeah, you have a wine background. Yeah, you know from.
Speaker 5: When I was eighteen, because you can drink wine in
Speaker 5: Australia at eighteen.
Speaker 2: You know a lot about wine because of it, yeah, said, I.
Speaker 5: Definitely know more about more about wine than most or yeah,
Speaker 5: which I really wasn't like super super into it when
Speaker 5: I was like eighteen nineteen, but then by the time
Speaker 5: it was like in my later twenties, I started taking
Speaker 5: more interest into it.
Speaker 2: Do you have a favorite wine? Oh?
Speaker 5: Probably like a Pinut greet or no, sorry, Pino noir? No,
Speaker 5: like like the Sonma Peano noirs. You like a California
Speaker 5: versus a New Zealand? Yeah, I like the the over
Speaker 5: ripe fruit.
Speaker 2: Is that why California is known.
Speaker 5: For its well California it's like a warmer climate, so
Speaker 5: like the grapes are usually picked a lot later in
Speaker 5: the year, like French wine is like they call it
Speaker 5: more green, which is where this is so boring for
Speaker 5: most people.
Speaker 2: I don't know harvest.
Speaker 5: They harvest grapes earlier when there's lower sugar acid, and
Speaker 5: then there's less alcohol in the final product. And then
Speaker 5: in California, because there's more sugar, there's more alcohol after
Speaker 5: it for mens. And then we also water water it
Speaker 5: down because that's legal here and it's not in France. Oh,
Speaker 5: we water it down until it's at the wine tax
Speaker 5: bracket and not the whoa yeah, or until it's at
Speaker 5: the wine alcohol level and you can lie at like
Speaker 5: one point five percent alcohol on it. So most wine
Speaker 5: is like one point five percent stronger than what it
Speaker 5: says it is.
Speaker 2: Do a lot of vineyards do that? Fourteen? Yeah?
Speaker 5: I mean I worked for a Constellation brands that Ravens
Speaker 5: with winery and it was basically synthetic wine dropped.
Speaker 4: And everything because you on the big it's like don't
Speaker 4: buy Ravens.
Speaker 2: Or not Pronsia or like yellowtail. Yeah.
Speaker 5: I worked at a Cassella processing winery, which is yellow
Speaker 5: tail in Australia.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yellowtes Australian.
Speaker 4: But yeah, you know what, people will watch this face
Speaker 4: talk about anything, have a glass wine too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it gets you drunk. Sure. Well the story.
Speaker 4: So was there like a part in this process where
Speaker 4: you realized you were gay?
Speaker 2: Was there a coming out process?
Speaker 1: Oh?
Speaker 2: I realized it was gay when I was in high
Speaker 2: school or younger? Okayih grade? Did you come out or not? Really?
Speaker 5: I knew that I just had to wait until I
Speaker 5: could move out. But I did get found out. Like
Speaker 5: I was a lifeguard when I was sixteen at Raging
Speaker 5: Water sand Demus and I've been any time, and I
Speaker 5: like that was my first time where I met people
Speaker 5: outside of like my family's approved circle, outside of our
Speaker 5: little Catholic colt. And so I met a gay person
Speaker 5: and I was curious and I had questions, and so
Speaker 5: I messaged them on Facebook when that was a thing,
Speaker 5: and also on a desktop computer because my parents wouldn't
Speaker 5: let me have a smartphone. Oh And I ran upstairs
Speaker 5: to go grab something, and my mom jumped on the
Speaker 5: computer and went through my messages and saw it. And
Speaker 5: my parents took away my phone that I paid for
Speaker 5: with my summer job. They took away the keys. I
Speaker 5: was driving like through two hours of traffic every day
Speaker 5: to get to school. Basically like put me on lockdown,
Speaker 5: and so I just like bowed my head down and
Speaker 5: told them I was gonna They wanted to make conversion
Speaker 5: therapy and I was like, no, I'll do it on
Speaker 5: my own and just.
Speaker 2: Lab for two years.
Speaker 5: So I was a senior and then graduated high school
Speaker 5: and then fucked off the struggle.
Speaker 2: Did you tell that?
Speaker 3: Did you tell them that you were like actively going
Speaker 3: somewhere to No.
Speaker 2: I told them that.
Speaker 5: I was like, no, I'll just work on it internally
Speaker 5: or like I'll just pray the gay away.
Speaker 2: Like because that works. Yeah.
Speaker 5: Oh, I like accepted myself much earlier on, and I'm
Speaker 5: so glad I did, because like I went through like
Speaker 5: stuff that a lot of people go through in like
Speaker 5: their twenties or thirties and like their identity crisis, and yeah,
Speaker 5: I went through all of that like self hate kind
Speaker 5: of thing in like seventh and eighth grade, so by
Speaker 5: by high school, I was like fuck it all and
Speaker 5: it was just like all which is great because it's
Speaker 5: all downhill from there.
Speaker 4: Like well, I mean like that like self actualizing that
Speaker 4: early enough to be like I'm just gonna lie to these.
Speaker 2: People until I'm eighteen.
Speaker 5: Yeah, And like was that like a hardship or you're like,
Speaker 5: well that was it was hardship because like you're around
Speaker 5: people that are homophobic. Yeah, for two years and like
Speaker 5: all the and like I knew that everyone I knew
Speaker 5: and everyone that was close to me I was gonna
Speaker 5: lose or like they were like and that did happen,
Speaker 5: Like it is a real thing.
Speaker 2: It was still the right choice. I don't regret it
Speaker 2: for a second, and I'm all the happier for it. Wow.
Speaker 2: Are they all still in Pasadena?
Speaker 5: No, they moved to Bakersfield because their traditional family set
Speaker 5: up is my dad is the soul breadwinner. My mom
Speaker 5: was to stay at home mom, and my dad got
Speaker 5: early on set dementia and then couldn't work, and so
Speaker 5: they packed up all their ship bought a house in Bakersfield,
Speaker 5: and my mom supports the family by teaching like.
Speaker 2: Wow, yeah, but you are all they're all.
Speaker 5: They're also super conservative and now my dad is on welfare,
Speaker 5: which is something they don't believe in. Like I kind
Speaker 5: of like gently pointed out to him, like so this
Speaker 5: thing you don't believe in, you're using. It's like and
Speaker 5: it's like your family would be starving if you didn't.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and he's like, what do you want me to do?
Speaker 2: I'm like, I want you just to realize that it's.
Speaker 5: A good thing, yeah for anyone, Like I watched you
Speaker 5: to have the benefit but also see the benefit.
Speaker 2: Of the benefit, right right? Wow? Interesting? Yeah, So then
Speaker 2: when did you make it to l A.
Speaker 5: I was in NAPA for like four years, and then
Speaker 5: during when COVID happened, I broke up with my ex there.
Speaker 2: Who I'm still really good friends with your exend NAPA.
Speaker 2: My exend Napacha big tall, big boy. We love those.
Speaker 5: He was in the closet when I started dating him,
Speaker 5: and I was like, I'm not going back in the
Speaker 5: closet for anything, And so he came out, and then
Speaker 5: that same night his brother and his sister came out
Speaker 5: as well.
Speaker 2: Whoa, And that was all three of them. You only
Speaker 2: have two siblings. So look all the good you.
Speaker 5: Do turned everybody gay.
Speaker 3: That's like, it can't be any worse than what I've
Speaker 3: been through.
Speaker 5: You Like, yeah, I mean, because my parents were so
Speaker 5: far on one side, I'm kind of grateful because it
Speaker 5: pushed me out of it sooner, where like I feel
Speaker 5: like if my parents were more accepting or more wishy washy,
Speaker 5: I would have stayed in the closet longer. So yeah,
Speaker 5: and in a lot of ways, I'm grateful for what
Speaker 5: I had.
Speaker 2: At like you had to like.
Speaker 5: It also gave me a lot of life perspective because
Speaker 5: now I have I grew up with this with the
Speaker 5: mindset of a conservative that you know, growing up gay
Speaker 5: in LA you wouldn't think you'd ever have that experience.
Speaker 2: But it does give you perspective on how they think.
Speaker 5: Even now, I believe nothing they believe, like it at
Speaker 5: least kind of like gives you an understanding of why
Speaker 5: they don't see what you see.
Speaker 2: So after you guys broke up, you might to La.
Speaker 5: So COVID was awful and we were like working and
Speaker 5: living together out of the house and it drove us crazy.
Speaker 2: And then I moved out of his house.
Speaker 5: This is the house he was born in and so
Speaker 5: and his parents moved out and left him in the house.
Speaker 2: So yeah, I got out of that.
Speaker 5: And then everyone I knew in that in small town
Speaker 5: Napa was through my ex boyfriends. So it was just
Speaker 5: not a good setup because like at that time, and
Speaker 5: so I had to get out and I had been
Speaker 5: wanting to come back to La for a long time,
Speaker 5: so I did and moved down. I quit my job
Speaker 5: so I did not get any of that fun employment
Speaker 5: from COVID and started working at a small doctor's office
Speaker 5: in Beverly Hills. That wasn't super long because then I
Speaker 5: got a job for this software sales startup.
Speaker 2: We got a lot of jobs.
Speaker 5: Yeah, well this was This was all like very because
Speaker 5: when I first came down to La, like finding a
Speaker 5: job was like, a good job is not easy.
Speaker 2: There's so many shady businesses down here.
Speaker 5: But yeah, that's speaking of this software sales company, which
Speaker 5: was like hey, great and like taught me a lot
Speaker 5: about sales and how to manipulate people. It felt like
Speaker 5: Wolf of Wall Street, like sales floor, like like a
Speaker 5: bunch of people with mic and just like screaming at
Speaker 5: people to spend money, like you'd have to get someone
Speaker 5: to spend ten grand in five minutes over the phone,
Speaker 5: cold calling and we get like three sales a day
Speaker 5: from calling like four hundred people if you were good
Speaker 5: at it. But I also didn't really know what I
Speaker 5: was talking about and then so it wasn't until I
Speaker 5: was out there for a couple months to realize like, oh,
Speaker 5: this is shady as hell, and I started looking for
Speaker 5: other work. And then while I was looking for other work,
Speaker 5: they got shut down because it was shady as hell.
Speaker 5: And then I got this other job at this super
Speaker 5: super cute little COVID lab startup in Venice Beach.
Speaker 4: Okay, I'm gonna ask you, in an interest of time,
Speaker 4: to make this a quick ste trying to get to
Speaker 4: the park when we've got into porn.
Speaker 5: Okay, so then, so then my neighbor Levi asked me
Speaker 5: if I would do a scene with him for Sean Cody.
Speaker 2: He said I would, and I don't regret it, like
Speaker 2: it was fun.
Speaker 5: Like a lot of my friends had even told me that,
Speaker 5: like Andrew, you're kind of built for porn because I
Speaker 5: was just a massive slut.
Speaker 3: Okay, were you a big fan of porn? Watching to porn?
Speaker 3: And like what kind of stuff did you.
Speaker 2: Like to watch? I watched a lot of weird ship
Speaker 2: talk about it.
Speaker 5: It all had to do about like with what was
Speaker 5: taboo or like what wasn't allowed.
Speaker 2: I think Catholic guilt interesting, like.
Speaker 5: Because it's wrong, it's what I want to do or
Speaker 5: like or like associated what what I wanted the most
Speaker 5: as being bad okay, but that I don't really have
Speaker 5: any of that anymore. I feel like after you go
Speaker 5: to therapy you lose all your kinks, but I don't
Speaker 5: know about that, which is what I told you.
Speaker 3: Wait, really well, I think it's gonna sound king shame,
Speaker 3: but I think some of the more extreme things are
Speaker 3: unresolved traumas.
Speaker 2: Or people that just want to relive that trauma over
Speaker 2: and over and over again. Yeah.
Speaker 3: So I've been very uncomfortably with you at a park situation.
Speaker 2: For like ten minutes, and then they're like, oh, that
Speaker 2: has with unresolved trauma. That's all about substance abuse. Wow,
Speaker 2: she just opened so many doors. I don't know which
Speaker 2: one to open. Oh God, proceed with caution.
Speaker 4: Okay, all right, so you used to watch more kinky stuff.
Speaker 4: Now you don't because you've clearly resolved all your traumas.
Speaker 4: Must be nice.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's kind of boring to be honest, now, besides
Speaker 3: your own.
Speaker 5: Just tricking off to your m I don't know, but
Speaker 5: it's really not interesting because it does get kind of boring,
Speaker 5: like it's more about it sounds so corny, but now
Speaker 5: I am more about connection than like the people.
Speaker 2: I like people I know there's nothing corny about that.
Speaker 4: Actually, this this is particularly why I don't film as
Speaker 4: much as I do lately, just because I mostly just
Speaker 4: want to have sex with people I already know and
Speaker 4: like having sex with.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and they can be friends, they can be like
Speaker 5: it doesn't always have to be my boyfriend, but like you.
Speaker 4: Were probably the last person I filmed with, to be honest, Yeah,
Speaker 4: and that was a while ago, that minute.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but yeah, it takes it's like very rare that
Speaker 2: like I have a collab.
Speaker 5: I don't want to say very rare, but like and
Speaker 5: there's like there's people I love working with, but it's
Speaker 5: kind of rare that I find like chemistries there. I
Speaker 5: find them attractive right like just objectively without.
Speaker 2: Hearing them talk or getting to know them.
Speaker 5: And then yeah, like I guess we can name names
Speaker 5: and we're saying positive things, but.
Speaker 2: Like please bend Bison. In London.
Speaker 5: When I went there, it's like just so fun to
Speaker 5: be around. Like I was like, do you just want
Speaker 5: to follow me around all day? And like join all
Speaker 5: my collapse And then I met I'm going back to London.
Speaker 5: I was like, hey, I'm coming back, like join me.
Speaker 2: I don't know, Ben bison. He's super sweet. Yeah, cool. Yeah.
Speaker 4: Do you want to talk about what it's like dating
Speaker 4: somebody while you're part of this industry because you have.
Speaker 3: Dated someone who's not in it while you're like when
Speaker 3: you're starting who was.
Speaker 2: In the who was in the entertainment industry.
Speaker 3: But not and and then you and now you're dating
Speaker 3: somebody that has that has been in it for a while.
Speaker 3: So what's what are some of the challenges with both?
Speaker 5: Well, either way, you cannot have any kind of jealous boyfriend.
Speaker 2: They have to just like really just accept you for
Speaker 2: who you are.
Speaker 5: They have to meet you where you're at in your
Speaker 5: life at that moment and not try to change it
Speaker 5: because you know, at the end of the day, that's
Speaker 5: where you may make your money. And I mean, if
Speaker 5: you don't do porn in your data, someone that does porn,
Speaker 5: like I also like, that's got to be hard for
Speaker 5: you because your boyfriend.
Speaker 2: It's a choice. Yeah, it's a it's a choice, like
Speaker 2: a choice.
Speaker 5: I respect, like it shows that you love your partner
Speaker 5: because it's not easy, and it's.
Speaker 3: The choice that will like keep you making that choice
Speaker 3: again and again, and as things come up, you'll have
Speaker 3: to keep deciding to either do.
Speaker 2: It yeah or stop.
Speaker 5: Yeah, And I think that it's like I know one
Speaker 5: of my good friends he does porn and his partner
Speaker 5: does not, And I think it's kind of like just
Speaker 5: shows his love more if he sets that all aside.
Speaker 5: But yeah, like having someone that's just like fucking people
Speaker 5: all the time and you don't like if you don't film,
Speaker 5: you don't know that they're not like super into all
Speaker 5: this sex they're having because you only perceive sex as
Speaker 5: something you do when you want to right right, right right,
Speaker 5: and not saying that like having sex for work is
Speaker 5: like this big struggle, but it's like some days it's work,
Speaker 5: like like just like you don't like going to work
Speaker 5: some days, like I go, I don't want to go
Speaker 5: to work some days, but I still do, right, Yeah,
Speaker 5: even if I like my scene partner.
Speaker 2: Do you see this happening for a lot longer? Are
Speaker 2: you enjoying it?
Speaker 5: I'm enjoying it now, Yeah, I do think. I mean,
Speaker 5: no one can play this game for forever, right, But
Speaker 5: also you can't do a lot of jobs for forever, right,
Speaker 5: So I think I'll like keep my options. I'll keep
Speaker 5: gently looking around and see what comes available.
Speaker 2: What are you interested in?
Speaker 3: Like so it would make you stop it right now
Speaker 3: if you got busy doing.
Speaker 2: Something that you really wanted to do. A rich husband
Speaker 2: sounds great. I mean there's a lot of things I
Speaker 2: would love to do.
Speaker 5: I mean I really just like being busy and having
Speaker 5: purpose and like, as long as it's not for a
Speaker 5: shady business.
Speaker 2: I like anything that keeps me busy.
Speaker 5: I used to work in HR, which I liked because
Speaker 5: it's kind of it was a job that was like
Speaker 5: really like helped you helped me grow. Because there's ever
Speaker 5: a problem, I kind of had to put it on
Speaker 5: myself to fix.
Speaker 2: It, like problem solving, yeah, or it's like a.
Speaker 5: Problem with anyone, Like it was my job to fix it,
Speaker 5: And like I like it's kind of helped with the
Speaker 5: like personal accountability in general because it stops like the
Speaker 5: boo who like blaming someone else for problems in your
Speaker 5: life and just says like, well, I'm the only person
Speaker 5: that can change my life, or like I'm the only
Speaker 5: person I can control changing my life. So there's something wrong,
Speaker 5: what can I do to fix it? Rather than going
Speaker 5: to my boss and bitching.
Speaker 4: Like where do you think that workhorse tendency comes from comes.
Speaker 5: From being very much not that when I was younger,
Speaker 5: I was super lazy, had no drive. I was diagnosed
Speaker 5: ADHD like later in life, and then like adderall literally
Speaker 5: changed me as a human being because I took it
Speaker 5: for years religiously as prescribed, like Monday through Friday. I'd
Speaker 5: take the smallest amount of my prescription on Monday, and
Speaker 5: then by Friday was at the peak, and then I'd
Speaker 5: take it. I do nothing on the weekends so that
Speaker 5: I would like have time to so that Monday would
Speaker 5: hit again. And it rewired my brain, gave me structure,
Speaker 5: you know, did so so many right things, but after
Speaker 5: a couple of years, it just wasn't working the same
Speaker 5: way right and it took months to like get off
Speaker 5: of it and be able to work without it. But
Speaker 5: once I did, like now I feel like so much
Speaker 5: more balanced because I still have those habitual like that
Speaker 5: habitual structure that Adderal gave me, so I can like
Speaker 5: set myself into like a like I really have to
Speaker 5: like set my time, like plan my day, like this
Speaker 5: is focus time, this is fun time. But I think
Speaker 5: like taking adderle for years really just like taught me
Speaker 5: the ability to focus, or gave me the habit.
Speaker 4: I guess if you're like now, I just want to
Speaker 4: focus on everything. Is there anything you're really excited about
Speaker 4: as we close out the year besides your hair, trying
Speaker 4: new head of hair, your new hair, lot of mons
Speaker 4: and Brussels. I've never been to Brussels.
Speaker 2: About that? Okay, what you're going to? What in Brussels?
Speaker 2: What's that? Parties? Oh parties? We love those? Yeah around
Speaker 2: you know?
Speaker 5: Yes, And I'm excited to go to London again, because London.
Speaker 2: Because Benson, I clearly got this. Go to London and
Speaker 2: see Ben Bison. You're welcome for the plug Ben Bison.
Speaker 2: His handle is right.
Speaker 4: Do we have anything else? I don't think so. I
Speaker 4: think I've covered all the bases. Is there anything else
Speaker 4: you want to share with us?
Speaker 2: Hayden Harding, No, I wish I could take some stuff back, but.
Speaker 5: Late for that the world on the record, I wish
Speaker 5: I had a filter.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'll edit it and uh and just hold it
Speaker 4: for ransom in case you ever pissed me off and
Speaker 4: use that smile for evil instead of good.
Speaker 2: Okay, just kidding. We love you.
Speaker 4: I'm very happy it's been so successful and that you're
Speaker 4: having a good time.
Speaker 2: And that you're our friend. Yeah, and that's it. We
Speaker 2: just jumped into Hayden Harding like people like to do,
Speaker 2: or have him jumped into you.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 2: That he's so good at it. Took care of here
Speaker 2: the all right. Well, I'm Adam Ramsey and I'm Hayen Harding.
Speaker 2: Sorry for asking. See you next time.
Speaker 1: This has been.
Speaker 2: Sorry for asking.
Speaker 3: Be sure to like, comment and subscribe, and until next time,
Speaker 3: stay sexy.
Speaker 1: Where they lived