Speaker 1: Live. This is pet Life Radio. Let's Talk Pets.
Speaker 2: Hello, feline friends, Welcome to Katatude. I'm your show host
Michelle Burne. Now, who among us cat lovers does not
love a good cat book, right, and especially when there's
a little mystery. I really love this book. I am
so excited to have this New York Times bestselling author
on our show. So stay tuned. We'll be right back.
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Speaker 4: Let's Talk Pets on Petlifradio dot com.
Speaker 2: Welcome back everyone. I'd like to welcome Gwen Cooper. As
I mentioned, Chi's a New York Times bestselling author, and
so Gwen with their cats, Clayton and Fanny write these
amazing books. So welcome Gwen. I'm so happy to have
you on Catitude.
Speaker 5: Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 2: So obviously, Clayton and Fanny just desist. But can you
give a little bit about your background and then tell
us about your cats?
Speaker 5: Yeah? Sure.
Speaker 6: So I've been a writer for a while now. Some
of your listeners are probably familiar with my memoir Homer's Odyssey,
A Fearless view line tail or How I Learned about
Love and Life with a blind wonder Cat.
Speaker 5: So that book came out a few years ago. I
wrote a couple of follow up books.
Speaker 6: I also wrote a novel called Love Saves the Day,
which is narrated mostly from a cat's point of view.
Speaker 5: And you guess, so that's what I do.
Speaker 6: I also am very passionate about animal rescue, and I
to do a lot of work with the animal rescue
organizations in the US and also around the world. Seems
to be a lot more natural disasters these days, so
there's sort of always somebody who needs a little bit
more of a platform. Yeah, I feel like now I'm
just rambling a little bit but that's pretty much my
deal that that's who I am, that's what I do.
Speaker 2: Thanks for sharing that. Now we're going to talk about
your new book, which is you Own We Live Nine Times. Yes,
I love the title.
Speaker 5: Thank you.
Speaker 2: Before I asked you about the book, what inspired you
as a writer to have cats, as they're not always
the center character, but they're subcenter. How would you say.
Speaker 5: That feline detectives?
Speaker 6: How to What inspired me to write to write a
novel in which talking cats solve a murder?
Speaker 5: I think is is that that's a good way to
get it. Yes, I will add by the way the
cats talk to each other, not to the humans around them.
This is not like a doctor do a little thing.
Speaker 6: There's no supernatural cats who are supernatural humans who can
like mind meld with cats. The cats talk to each other,
the humans talk to each other. The cats try to
figure out ways to get the humans to know what
they're doing. But getting back to your question, so again,
those who have read Homer's Odyssey will be familiar with
this story. But back when I had a couple of
years after I had adopted Homer, who was a blind cat,
I had just moved into to my new apartment. It
was my first apartment that I was living in by myself,
without my parents, without a roommate, and I woke up
at four o'clock in the morning one day and there
was a strange man standing at the foot of my bed.
I will not you can read the entire story in
Homer's honesty, but suffice it to say that Homer, who
was a very small black cat, but who was really fearless,
and he was an incredibly friendly cat, but he seemed
to sense that this man was dangerous and he attacked
the man, who turned and ran out of my apartment,
and we called the police, and in the end everything
was okay thanks to Homer. So this idea of Homer
as a crime fighting cat has sort of always been
in the back of my mind. And yeah, a couple
of years ago, I thought it would be a really
fun idea to write this cozy mystery series. And it's
set in my native Miami Beach. Born and raised to
Miami Beach, and I spent a number of years living
on South Beach in the nineties, so the book is
set during that time. South Beach was very much like
a small I mean it was it's still small time.
Speaker 2: I don't know about now because we're I'm based in
South Florida, I don't know about okay, how so much.
Speaker 6: But it was and so you know exactly what I'm
talking about. In Southeach, it's like two square miles. It's tiny,
and back in the nineties it was very much like
you knew everyone and everyone knew you, and it was
a very small town kind of vibe. And it just
seemed like a fun idea, especially because I know this
is like everybody my age says about the time when
they were in their twenties, but it just seems like
the nineties was a much you know, it was just
things were a lot less.
Speaker 5: I don't know, everyone seemed a lot friendlier back in
the nineties.
Speaker 6: So yeah, so it just seemed like a fun idea
to set this novel circa nineteen ninety eight in South
Beach and to have cats solving a murder, which is
also what it came together.
Speaker 2: Okay, Well, first of all, I'm glad Homer attacked that man.
That is an incredible story.
Speaker 5: It was truly an incredible cat he really was.
Speaker 2: Wow. Yes, I am going to read Homer's odysty because
I have not not that I can recall. I don't
always remember the books I read and then I reread them,
which is not a bad thing.
Speaker 6: That happens to me all the time, by the way.
Speaker 2: So I love the setting. I love how you have
the cats talking to each other and also to the
one dog. I think they do actually really speak to
each other in their own way.
Speaker 5: I would actually tend to agree with that. I really do.
I feel that.
Speaker 6: I mean, obviously, animals have ways of communicating with each
other that are not going to be known to us,
because why would they be. I mean, they don't, just
like they don't understand what we are saying to each other.
Speaker 5: So this is my theory as well.
Speaker 2: Some people beg to different everybody has different opinions, but
I think they understand each other better than my cat
might not understand me, or cheese is not, or my
cats rather or cheese is not to understand me.
Speaker 6: Well, that is the eternal question, of course with cats.
Do they not understand or do they choose not to understand.
I've caught my cats understanding more than they would probably
like me to know.
Speaker 5: They do.
Speaker 2: Yes, that's the key. Okay, let's get back to what
inspired you to write you only lived nine times.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 6: I had the idea very spontaneously a few years ago.
I honestly don't remember what the initial impetus was. I
had not yet at that time read really any cozy mysteries.
Speaker 5: I know that there is.
Speaker 6: An entire subgenre of cozy mysteries with cats, and I
had not at that point read any of those books.
But it was a spontaneous idea that I had, and
I just kind of you know, Homer still has a
very active social media community, and so I just kind
of floated the idea there and people were very enthusiastic,
and I was like, Okay, you know what, I'm going
to do this. And then for two years I was
so intimidated at the thought of doing it because I'm
not a puzzle person. I've never written anything even close
to a mystery, and I was pretty sure I could
not do it. I was just really really intimidated. And
then one day last year, I told myself, look, it's
been like three years since you first talked about this,
so you're in and you're out. You're either gonna do
this or you got to tell everyone that you were
just talking and you didn't really mean it, and I
didn't like that idea, so I decided it was less
scary to try to write the novel.
Speaker 2: Well, I think you did a good job, because I
do read a lot of recording this right before Halloween
and that's coming up. But I'm not a fan of
gore and horror and that kind of stuff. But I
neither am I, by the way, not my thing, but
like going into some haunted place where people jumping out
would be like no, no, not for me either, But
novels and you know, mysteries and all that. Fine with that.
James Patterson is one of my favorite authors, but his
early stuff, so I love when there's a twist also,
but we'll get to that a little later. Why did
you choose that title? What made you decide you only
lived nine times?
Speaker 5: It just so spontaneously occurred.
Speaker 6: I mean again, as soon as I had the idea
for writing a cozy mystery novel in which Homer or
Homer and his two sisters would in some way solve
a murder, at that same moment, I had the idea
for the title. I can't even really tell you how
it popped. It just popped into my head. It was
not a thought process. It was not like I sat
down and I will tell you that for the second
book in the series, which I am already at work on,
which is called The Cat War Black, and I was
looking at my shelf. You know, I've read some more
mysteries since I decided to write this. In the last
few years, I have read more, and I've write not
just cozy mysteries but others, and I've really gotten to
enjoy Cornell Woolrich.
Speaker 5: So I saw him kind of sitting on the shelf
and the bridewar black, and I was like, ah, the cat.
Speaker 6: He is a black cat, the Catwar Black, and you know,
so that's there, you go, that's how that happened.
Speaker 2: Yes, obviously Patterson's not cozy mystery, but I like cozy
mysteries too, So there's not many books I don't like.
Speaker 5: I'm kind of right there with you on that.
Speaker 6: Actually, as long as it's you know, a paper with
words between covers, I'm in right.
Speaker 2: Although there are sometimes books where I won't really jive
with the voice.
Speaker 6: Absolutely well, it's a very personal thing and ultimately an
author's voice I think you need. You know, every art form,
every mode of creative expression, has its strength and its weaknesses.
I think, what are the great strengths of writing? And
if books is that it's very intimate, it's a voice
in your head. And if it's not a voice that
you like having in your head, then you got to
just get rid of it. You got to close the
book and move on to the next one.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I try to force myself through, but at
times it's like, Okay, this is it.
Speaker 5: Life is too short for bad books.
Speaker 2: Yes, that'll be a good T shirt. So let's talk
about different perspectives that you wanted to explore. So you
have a character in the book that talks to the
casts that's not a cat.
Speaker 5: Well, there's a dog and there is a bird.
Speaker 6: I think in terms of actually being able to speak
directly with the cats, I think that's it.
Speaker 5: The animals can all talk to each other.
Speaker 6: I do like to feel that Rachel, who's my human protagonist,
and she is Homer and Scarlet, and there's the other
two cats who Homer lives with homeer Scarlet and Vashdi,
and she is there human. So I do like to
feel that there is kind of a really good unspoken
communication between them.
Speaker 5: But ultimately Rachel.
Speaker 6: Is not able to have conversations with the cats, like
the one that you and I are having right.
Speaker 2: Now, okay, and I get that are any of the
situations in the book based on any of the occurrences
that have happened between you and your cats? Like do
you have a dumbwaiter in your house or no? So
most people don't unless you have an older house.
Speaker 6: Yees, So I had to you know, this was one
of actually the challenges, and this was one thing that
really because then there are also practical considerations in writing
the book. I'm writing these three cats who people know,
but I'm writing them with a human who is in
some ways based on me, but it is ultimately not me.
And people who know my cats know that they have
always been strictly into our cats. But if the cats
are going to investigate murders without their human knowing about it,
there has to be a way for them to get
out of their home without her knowing. And really that
took me a little while to come up with the
mechanism by which the cats are ultimately able to sneak
out of the house without Rachel knowing that that was
not as immediate as the title or the idea for
the book that was actually something that took some thought
over a period of time.
Speaker 5: You know, something that would be just believable.
Speaker 6: It doesn't have to really be completely believable, just plausible
enough that people are like, Okay, I could see it,
it could happen.
Speaker 2: And there's some other antics that are could that really happen?
And you think about it and though, yeah, it probably could.
I'm not going to give boy all details, but the oil,
I don't want to get into it, but the situation
with the oil, and I hope this doesn't say so much,
but I actually did wash Dennis because he's part man coon.
Say he's like a dog, part dog cat. And I
only say that because he's pretty chill. But that's yeah,
that's not easy.
Speaker 5: I will say.
Speaker 7: So.
Speaker 6: There's a scene where one of the cats get stuck
in their mode of escape and so they deploy Wesson
oil to help ease her out. But I will say
that I one and there are always people who are
whorder mystery Ficinado's what will tell you what Some of
the rules of the genre are. One rule that I
set for myself, and it was a very strict no
cheating rule that anything I had the cats do had
to be something that cats could actually do that they
did not. Suddenly, you know, I didn't want them to
be able to read a name, or I mean to
do something that would would genuinely be beyond.
Speaker 5: The skills or physical abilities of a cat.
Speaker 6: So everything that cats do in the book is something
that a cat could do in real life. And maybe
you will start to wonder why your cats are doing
some of the inexplicable, seemingly inexplicable things that they're doing
when you.
Speaker 5: See the thought process with the cats in the book out.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it does get you thinking, we're going to take
a short break and we'll be right back. Real people,
real stories.
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Speaker 4: Let's talk past it.
Speaker 5: Let's done past Talk about.
Speaker 1: Life Radio Headline Radio.
Speaker 9: Pet Live radio dot com.
Speaker 2: Welcome back everyone. We're talking to Gwen Cooper, who is
a New York Times bestselling author and we're talking about
her book You Only Live Nine Times? So do you
have a favorite character in your book?
Speaker 5: I will tell you.
Speaker 7: So.
Speaker 6: There is one character in the book who is there
to bed to be disliked. He's like if you've ever
like seen in kids like a puppet, you know, a
punch and Judy pappat show. He's the one who's there
for you to say boo boo. You know, every time
you love to hate him, he is there for you
to love to hate him. And he might be and
it's very obvious when you read the book who he is.
He's like a villain, but he's a comical villain, so
you know, he's the chill Meil basically. And I have
to say, I really do love him. I love this character. First,
you know, I started off loving to hate him and
and now he just cracks me up. I think he's
a big I really wanted the book to be fun,
and I think he is actually a big part of
what makes the book fun. He develops this intense rivalry
with the snootiest of the three cats at the center
of the story, and he always sees coming this from
this rivalry from a very human perspective, and she's coming
at it from a very feline perspective. I think anybody
listening to this knows what a snooty cat who really
does not like a specific person.
Speaker 5: How intense that can be.
Speaker 6: And I actually think it's one of the most fun
parts of the books that I did not originally conceptualize
when I've sat down to write the book. But this
character sort of kept intruding himself and I finally let
him in, and I am very glad that I did.
Speaker 2: So, you know that brings me this question. I've read
quite a few books on that authors have written on
how they write, and I've heard over and over again
because it's on my bucket list to write a book.
I don't know if it'll happen, but hopefully, but I've
heard that sometimes you have the characters, you have everything,
the scenario, your protagonist, everything, and then the book kind
of writes itself. Things change.
Speaker 6: I would say for me, it's so there are some
writers who and every writer has a philosophy on this.
I think, you know, Stephen King is very anti outlined.
He is very much at the school you sit down
and you start following the characters around basically, and they
reveal themselves to you.
Speaker 5: And then I know there are writers who are very
intense about outlines.
Speaker 6: I would not have had the nerve to sit down
to start, you know, I'm kind of in the middle
with this book. I would not have had the nerve
to sit down and start writing a murder mystery without
knowing who the killer was going to be generally, and
some of this did change, you know, in some of
the details, but in the broadest strokes, I always knew
who the killer was. I always knew what the clues
leading to that person. I always knew what the red
herrings were going to be. But having said that, a
lot of who the characters were, a lot of the
stuff in the town.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 6: The great thing about a cozy mystery is that it's
not just about the murder. It's about a town. It's
about the people in the town. It's the characters who
inhabit it. If you've done your job as a cozy
mystery writer, people should be like, you know, despite the murders,
I would really love to live in this town and
hang out with these people. And so my cast of characters,
you know, especially the supporting characters, that was much more
of an organic kind of a process. Where as I
was writing people, you know, some of the characters surprised
me in some ways, and I went with it, and
and I think the book is better for it.
Speaker 2: It's a great book, really really did really great book.
In writing and living with cats. What is the one
thing that you wish people understood more about cats? So
it could be, you know, people that have cats that
not all of us that have cats know everything about cats.
Or it could be just you know, we have listeners
that don't have cats that want to have cats, or
just like listening. So thank you for listening. But what
would you like people to know?
Speaker 6: So I would never presume to speak to other cat people,
because I'm definitely one of those people who I feel like,
you know, the only thing I really know about cats
is that I know nothing about cats, sort of. That
could be Really, I have people who write to me
all the time, and they have very intense questions, and
I always have to say I always have to preface
anything that I say with I am ultimately a an
expert in my own cats, and even that is really
barely an expertise. But that having been said, it is
only surprising to me how surprising it is to people
who aren't cat people how very differentiated cat's personalities are.
And having lived with both cats and dogs, I would
say I have seen more variety in cats personalities than
in dogs, which is not to be dismissive of dogs
or say that I've not seen variety and personality. But
you know one thing I really do try to show
in this book. There are five cat characters, three central
characters and two kind of friends from the neighborhood, and
each one of them has a very different personality, a
very different worldview, a very different conception of their relationships
with each other with humans. Again, I think that is
something and maybe this is also for people who live
with cats to not get frustrated when cats don't conform
behavior really to how you think they should be in acting.
It really is not only easier, it's actually better to
kind of let the cat lead you a little bit
in that sense, and pay attention to what they are
telling you about themselves. Again, I don't mean like literally
talking in words, but just like with people, cats will
eventually show you who they are if you give them
the space in which to do so.
Speaker 2: Very true, and I agree with you on the personalities.
I had always had dogs, and then Dennis adopted me,
and then Moore came. So once I had five, two
were more community, but we took care of them. They
were still outdoor, So three indoor, two outdoor, and each
one very distinct personalities. So that you have to pay
attention and learn who they are. But yes, very distinct.
So I kind of agree with that. Do you think
readers might be more influenced to adopt a cat, especially
more than one cat, after reading your book?
Speaker 5: You know what?
Speaker 6: I were sat down to write Homer's Odyssey and it
was my second book, and the literary agent I had,
who had sold my first book, was incredibly discouraging about
the idea of writing Homer's Odyssey.
Speaker 5: And I went on a little bit of a journey
with that.
Speaker 6: I talked to some people and found other people who
had blind cats.
Speaker 5: I just wanted to get to send You know, is
he right?
Speaker 6: Is this a terrible idea for a book? Is this
a terrible story that nobody's going to want to hear?
And you know, we sort of all came to the
conclusion that if a book like Homer's Odyssey could persuade
even one person to adopt one, if one blind cat
ended up with a home who otherwise would not have
had one, then it was worth at least trying to
write this book and get it published.
Speaker 5: You know, I never know.
Speaker 6: Ultimately, I don't think anybody really knows what ultimately moves
somebody to make a decision like that. But I do
always hope in my writing, and especially when I write
about now that Homer's is almost like a character. But
when I write about a special needs cat, and certainly
when I worried about rescue cats, I always, in the
back of my mind want to show what I think
it incredibly enriching and rewarding experience it can be, even
if it's not to adopt a special needs cat specifically,
but just to get out of the one rigid idea
box you have of what a certain kind of relationship
has to look like. And so I guess I always
have it in my head, I, you know, the hope
that somebody might be persuaded in that direction. I don't
know whether that happens, and when it does, I think
it ultimately is a culmination effect. A lot of other
things obviously go into making a decision like this, So
you know, maybe it's just like a little push.
Speaker 2: A little push is good, and especially about adopting a
special needs cat, and I think also adopting and keeping
a misunderstood cat that's the same.
Speaker 5: I agree with you, Yes.
Speaker 2: I don't think any of your characters really fit that.
Why do mine. Cats fit that role. But she was
feral adopted four months in Charlotte nine years. Still doesn't
know what a letter box is. But that's not what
this story this is about. But she's misunderstood. So if
we were too, I don't think you return, you know,
you adopt, but she adopted me. But I think that
I'm earning karma points someplace. But we you know, she's
just has issues. And while she's not distabled except in
her mind a little bit.
Speaker 6: This is this is her way of communicating, right I
actually so, I wrote a book and it's an essay collection.
It's called My Life in a Cat House and one
of the story, one of the essays in that is
called the Picasso of p And that story is about
my cat, Vashti, who, in real life, not in the book,
but in real life, you used her own urine as
a very expressive method of communication over the years.
Speaker 5: And so I do feel you on this one. I
do not know what you're.
Speaker 6: She she had very specific insecurities and concerns, and she liked
to send a message, let's say.
Speaker 5: So I do appreciate that too, you know.
Speaker 6: Again, and that's part of why I say that cats
all have very different personalities, and they do if you
want to be a cat person, they do force you
to pay attention.
Speaker 5: But I think that's a good thing.
Speaker 6: I actually think that's why so many writers gravitate toward cats,
because to be a good writer, you also have to
pay attention to You have to pay attention to others
and get a sense of why they're doing what they're
doing in order to create believable characters. And living with
cats I think forces you to do that, to pay
close attention.
Speaker 5: Certainly to try to figure out what your cat. You know,
why your cat's to doing what they're doing.
Speaker 2: Right, And I'm still trying to figure her out. I
like that though, because of fee. I'm going to keep
that in mind because I'm a big art fand too,
so can you give us a little hint about what
your next book is going to be? It's what the
Cat Wore Black.
Speaker 6: It is called the cad War Black. It will be
Homer who Done It? Number two? It is going to
take place or it's gonna be set among the high
stakes world of high fashion modeling. In this you know,
small coastal town that resembles South Beach.
Speaker 5: And I'm still working through it, I do. It's gonna
be a lot of fun.
Speaker 6: I know that sounds really lame, but I have just
actually yesterday finished my preliminary sketching out just where I
you know, one of the first steps that I take.
It's not an outline, but I just kind of sit
down and in three thousand words, I write the whole
plot of the book, beginning to end. And I just
finished doing that yesterday. I'm so excited about this one,
and I'm so looking forward to writing these characters, to
bringing back the original cats. I'm also introducing an amazing
new feline character. I'm just so in love with her already,
and I really think readers are gonna like her too.
So there will be six cats in this book in
addition to all the other characters. So the feline cast
is growing, but they are all very different from each other.
And this new edition, her name is Celia, and Celia
is amazing, So he is the best.
Speaker 5: I'm really excited to write art.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm excited to read the ear book. I can't
wait for to be published. But I have a question. Well,
we have you have our listening audience. Tell them why
should they buy your book?
Speaker 6: Oh you know, I really do think if you are
the right person for this book, if you like cozy mysteries,
if you like cozy mysteries with cats, I think it's
a lot of fun. I just think it's a really fun,
escapist read that is in no way stupid or insulting
to the intelligence.
Speaker 5: Of the readers. I actually think it's smart.
Speaker 6: I really did work hard on the actual mystery so
far readers, not just my existing readers, but actually you know,
I've put this up for a review on some of
you know, mystery book review websites and have been getting
really good feedback.
Speaker 5: So it's a good mystery.
Speaker 6: And if the idea of spending like a couple of
weeks on Miami Beach in nineteen ninety eight with some
amazing cats hits you on all the right levels, you
will definitely enjoy this book. If you are looking for
just an escape from all the depressing news, you will
really like this book. If you like feline hijinks, I
think you'll really like this book. And I'm really I'm
not usually this good a cheerleader from my books.
Speaker 5: To tell you the church, it's a really good book.
Speaker 2: And also just to interject, I would not know this
is your first cozy mystery because it's not blatant. So
there's twists like it which make it even more interesting.
Speaker 5: Yeah. I always like twists, you know.
Speaker 6: That's I mean, that's the fun of it, right, And
but I do, you know, try to lay the groundwork
like I never. I mean, this is the thing I think.
You also have to be careful.
Speaker 5: I am not.
Speaker 6: I'm not a writer. I'm not trying to be smarter
than my readers. I assume my readers are as smart
as I am, So I like to get them there
before the characters get there, but not as quickly as
they think they've gotten there, you know.
Speaker 5: So it's so it's a fun reveal.
Speaker 2: Goodwill Where can people find out more about you and
your book?
Speaker 5: So the best place is too.
Speaker 6: I have actually my own shop online where I sell
directly to my readers, and I donate ten percent of
everything that I earn there to organizations that rescue abused,
abandoned and disabled animals, and they can find that at
shop dot gwen Cooper dot com. Having said that, you
can certainly that the book is available everywhere books are sold.
If your bookstore does not have it in they can
or it for you. You can buy it on Amazon,
you can get the e book on you know, Apple,
et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 5: It is available.
Speaker 6: The ebook is available for check out through libraries. Again,
your library may or may not have a physical copy,
but they should be able to get you an ebook copy.
So basically you can find it anywhere. But again, I
do sell it for less in my store than it
has sold other places, and you, in purchasing it directly
for me, are also supporting rescue organizations. Right now, I
am donating. I'm making most of my donations to Cobble
Small Animal Rescue in Cobble, Afghanistan, which is run by
an American woman who is its founder named Charlotte Maxwell Jones,
who was just doing unbelievable rescue work under unimaginable circumstances.
Speaker 2: Oh, I applaud you for doing that, for giving back,
that's wonderful, So thank you so much for that. Listeners
Shop dot Gwen Cooper dot com and Gwen, I want
to thank you so much for coming on Catitude.
Speaker 5: Thank you so much for having me. It's been really fun.
Speaker 2: Cat Levers, I hope you enjoyed this show. What a
great book. Please be sure to check out You Only
Live Nine Times and hey also Homer's Odyssey, both written
by New York Times bestselling author Gwen Cooper. You can
buy her books at shop dot Gwen Cooper dot com
and also I'm sure wherever books are sold. Again, thank
you Gwen for coming on Catitude. I want to thank
everyone that listens to Catitude. I appreciate you so much
over the years. This has been an amazing ride that
is hopefully going to continue for many more years. Thanks
to my cat crew Dennis, Charlotte and Molly who talks
among themselves all the time, I know it, And of
course a huge thank you to my producer Mark Winter
for doing all you do and making our shows on
pet Life Radio sound amazing. And hey, remember lose the Attitude,
have Catitude
Speaker 4: Let's Talk Pets every week on demand only on Petlifradio
dot com.