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Speaker 1: What is a fellas it cost? I'm Dan for Valley.

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The twenty twenty five twenty twenty six NBA Season look

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Ahead train continues to roll along. We're onto the Orlando Magic.

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I have the distinct pleasure of being joined by a

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first time guest. They don't know what they're in for now,

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so they'll they'll have to reconcile that later. But I

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am joined by Philip Rossman Reich. He is He hosts

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the Lockdown Magic podcast break podcast go check it out,

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and he is the senior writer at Orlando Magic Daily.

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You can find the links to his work and his

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social media profiles will be in the podcast and YouTube description. Philip,

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thank you so much for joining me. Apologies in advance.

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This is your first time. You don't know what you're

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in for, but how the heck are you doing?

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Speaker 2: I am doing good.

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Speaker 3: It is it is an It is my honor to

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be on the hardwoodknockx podcast.

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Speaker 2: Love love the love the work that you guys do.

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Speaker 3: I do listen occasionally, have like twenty million podcasts that

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I there so working, but.

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Speaker 1: There's so much, so many guys out there.

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Speaker 2: But I do appreciate you guys.

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Speaker 3: Is you you try you hit the whole league, and

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that's not always the case in national podcasts. So definitely, definitely, definitely,

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very honored to be on the show.

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Speaker 1: And with that, we'll get into why Palo Bankara will

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request the trade from the Magic within the next two

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that's what we're going.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's how this goes, probably to the Lakers.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I forgot I needed to be better at naming

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bigger markets man this team. They're so fascinating, But I

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think we have to start with the basic question. Is

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everyone kind of recognized that this was the off season,

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if not the last off season for the Magic to

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go after it on the trade market. They did. They

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get Desmond Bain in a move I certainly just did

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not see coming. What do you make of just kind

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of their off season in their totality the Palo extensions

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in there they get tyas Jones, but mainly you go out,

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you get Desmond Bayin. How do you feel about identifying

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him as that guy? And then the price paid to

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bring him in?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's it's very clear that he The

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first thing is the Magic believe that Paalo bank Caro

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and Franz Wagner are players that you can build a

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championship team around. Now, whether that is a good bet

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or a bad bet, I'm sure there's billions of ways

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to debate that, but the first step to winning a

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championship is saying, like, these are our guys, we need

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to maximize them as much as possible.

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Speaker 2: And with the way that.

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Speaker 3: Salaries are structured, the way that the collective bar agreement is,

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this had to be the summer that the Magic made

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an aggressive move. You know, they kind of they went

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forward a little bit last summer when they had their

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kind of last bite at free agency, their last opportunity

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to spend money in free agency before the Caps started

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to get to them, and it didn't work out. Look,

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Kntavio Scolopope had a really poor season. Like I think

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if we would have done this podcast last year, you

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would have said something very very similar, saying like, oh,

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the Magic pushed some chips in, they got some skin

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in the game. Now they went out and got this

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great veteran, this champion hets.

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Speaker 1: Because we were doing Bleacher Reports Live Free Agency show

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at the time, they were like the first team to

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make a move with KCP and all Grant and I

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could talk about was this works and it's clearly not

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going to be the only major move that they make,

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like they're really going in this offseason, they were a tease, They.

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Speaker 3: Were a little bit of teas and look, Jeff, Jeff

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Wellman is very much a fan of continuity. Believes that,

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you know, like they I mean, look, they won forty

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seven games in twenty twenty four.

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Speaker 2: They they made they they made.

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Speaker 3: Some major strides and took some major steps and believed

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that they had another leap in them just based off

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of how young they are and they're still a very

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very young team. Obviously things didn't work out. Why they

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didn't work out, I can't tell you. Injuries played a

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part of that obviously. Just Katavi's Gullupope was probably the

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wrong kind of shooter, just not enough of a volume

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shooter for who the Magic are. And again, you just

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had a bad year, like what you what are you

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gonna do?

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Speaker 1: They didn't have that probably didn't Yeah, that they were.

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Speaker 2: Lebron that doesn't that doesn't help.

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Speaker 3: But like, look, Katavi's Gullupope had his worst three point

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shooting year since I think twenty sixteen, back when he's

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with Detroit. So he's not just a shooter because of

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Jokic and Lebron just with the volume that he'soul said,

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he shot what five threes per game, and the Magic

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play a slow offense anyway, not a very high volume

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three point shooting team. Probably not exactly what they were

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looking for. And I've I've had this conversation with people,

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like I think that he would have found a way

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to right the ship, or he would have been fine

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if Powow doesn't get hurt five games into the season.

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There's there's just a little bit of a baseline that

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needed to be established. That like, if Palow gets hurt

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in late November early December rather than rather than October thirtieth,

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maybe that's established. Maybe that rhythms there, Maybe he understand

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understands the role and where his shots are coming from

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a little bit better.

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Speaker 2: And look he shot or last eighteen games, he shot.

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Speaker 3: Forty six forty seven percent from three. So he had

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a nice little stretch at the end of the season

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helping Magic make the playoffs. But it very much felt

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like the Magic needed a different kind of shooter, and

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the question I think entering the offseason was whether the

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Magic could get that shooter without compromising their defense. And

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adding a player who's just such a negative on defense.

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You know, a lot of us, a lot of us

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had like the low hanging for Anthony Simon's Colin Sexson

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were kind of like the two guys if you weren't

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going for a star like LaMelo Ball or Tree Young,

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which I don't think the Magic were super interested in.

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But like Andrey Simons not has never been asked to

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defend in his life, in his pro basketball life, Like

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I'm like, go offense to the Portland Trailblazers, like not

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exactly a sterling defense, defensive defensive environment. Going after Desmond

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being just felt like it was the perfect cultural fit.

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And so the Magic just kind of back to the

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original point. Then the Magic believe that Palo and Franz

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are two stars they can build their team around. Knowing

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that Franz's extension kicks in this year, Palo would get

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his extension. Everyone knew it would be back is just

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to the degree of what Max would kick it next year.

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They knew they'd be a second Apron team next year.

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And I don't think people understand how expensive this Magic

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team is going to be. In the twenty twenty seventh season,

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they had to push their chips in. Now they had

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if they were going to go for broke, if they

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were going to the championship team, they had to do

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it this summer. And so like the cost is big

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if it doesn't work out for whatever reason.

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Speaker 2: Look, Palo and Franz are good enough.

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Speaker 3: The Magic should be in the playoffs every year regardless,

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as long as they're healthy. They had to push their

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chips in and they had to go for it. And

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I think again, Desmond bin is a really good cultural fit.

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Like he may not be an all defensive team level player,

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but he's gonna hold.

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Speaker 2: His own and compete on defense. And he is a

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different kind of shooter.

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Speaker 3: He's gonna take seven eight threes per game, He's gonna

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be able to create a little bit off the drible.

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He can do more than just be a three point shooter,

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which I think was ultimately what Continus called what Pope's

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problem was is that he's just a spot up shooter,

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and if the spot up shots aren't going down, it's

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just like, well, what do you do with him? Desmond

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Bain is gonna find other ways to score, and I

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think that is what the Magic we're looking for to

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try and unlock this offense, which is very clearly like

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the big missing ingredient for this team.

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Speaker 2: Now.

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Speaker 1: I think though his shooting does get most of the

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attentions particalarly pull up three point shooting, and it will

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be huge for this team. But is there something else

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about him that you think maybe's flying under the radar

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that I know you mentioned already sort of the ball

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handling with him, But is there anything else about his

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fit with Orlando that people should be clocking more so

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than just this guy's gonna get up threes.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I think the fact that he's averaged

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five assists per game in the last two seasons is

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a big, big deal. You know, if you ask most people,

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they would say the Magic's biggest need.

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Speaker 2: Is a point guard.

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Speaker 3: And the Magic obviously you have not addressed the point

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guard position. They're still going to kind of go into

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the season with this I'm calling it a point guard.

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They're moneyballing the point guard position between Desmond Bine, Jalen Suggs,

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Pallo Bangkara, Franz Wagner. They can create a point guard

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in the aggregate, and I think that's the idea of

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what they're trying to do. So you add in a

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player like Desmond Baine, who when John Morant was out

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last year, took on a lot more that playmaking responsibility

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can keep the ball moving. It isn't just going to

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stop in his hands. I think that's a big thing

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because the Magic have been kind of a low pass

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team if you just look at like total number of passes.

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They play a slow pace anyway, but yeah, they're they

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can evolve a little bit into an ISO team. So

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having another guy that you can kick out to attack

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as a secondary creator, you know, initiate.

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Speaker 2: Offense with I think that's a big deal.

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Speaker 3: And on top of that, like Desmond beans a dog

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like he he doesn't back down from anybody like that.

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Like I talked, like I mentioned that if it's perfect

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perfectly kind of in the culture of the Magic, the Magic,

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the Magic, you know, they they're they're the kind of

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team that just fouls you and dares the refs to

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call everything. They they they don't back down, like Jalen

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Suggs is barking at you the entire time.

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Speaker 2: Mo wogner Is is a known instigator. Paolo bang Cao

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is an underrated jabber during during games, like Franz Wagner

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will even talk a little bit like he's he's a

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little more quiet, but like when he gets into it,

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he can He'll talk on the court like Desmond bans,

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Desmond bands. Just gonna fit that perfectly. The Magic are

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going to.

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Speaker 3: Be extremely annoying to play, especially if they're beating you,

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because they're they're gonna be talking a lot on the floor.

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Speaker 1: Actually, I was doing the Cavs look Ahead with Justin

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Rohan of the Chase Down podcast, and we were talking

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about the Magic as the team that you always, no

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matter the outcome, win or lose, you're always going to

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feel playing them, And I guess you're always going to

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hear while you're playing them.

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Speaker 2: Yep.

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Speaker 1: As well, what you mention is interesting about the ball

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handling element the assists from Desmond Vane. If you look

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at what I think we all assume is going to

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be their starting lineup, they kind of just have five

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guys that can all do stuff with the ball. Now,

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is there any chance that we see Jamal Mosley break

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out some funky stuff? I don't know. If it's more

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like is it guard screening for guards? It Franz Wagner

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baby screening? Is there anything you want to see or

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that you think that we might see differently from this

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team than in years past.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I think this is something they've always

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been toying around with. Like the Magic are very much

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a team that's like if they sense that you're switching

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and your defensive strategy against them is to switch, they're

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going to pick out the guy they want guarding Palo

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and they'll bring Jalen Stuggs over and sit and have

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him set a screen for Palo or you know, they

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don't run a lot of Palo frond stuff together. But

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you know we're seeing you know, as we're recording this,

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your basket hasn't started, but we're seeing with with Germany,

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they're experimenting a lot more with Franz as a screener

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and diving to the basket a little bit more and

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setting up on post ups a little bit more.

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Speaker 2: And just for the.

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Speaker 3: Record, Magic assistant coach Rady Gregory is one of the

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assistant coaches for the German national team. They always the

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Magic have a lot of staff with the German national team.

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It's that I don't think this is you know, Alex

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Mumbrow is gonna do what Alex Mumbrow does. He's a

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he's a decorated coach in EuroLeague that I don't think

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any of this is happening in isolation. So I do

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think we'll start to see them use frowns in different ways.

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I'm sure we'll talk about the shooting. So that's part

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of the reason why they have to do that. Yeah,

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it's it's not good, but it's better. But it's not good.

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Speaker 2: We'll we'll.

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Speaker 3: I think we'll see them use frowns in different ways.

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I think we'll see them use inverted pick and rolls.

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I know Jamal Moseley hates being asked about those. It

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wouldn't shock me if we see some more lineups about

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Jonathan Isaac with Jonathan Isaac at center, even though he

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kind of struggled in that role last year a little bit.

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There's certainly the possibility to go with a kind of

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we're all shooting lineup, or you know, a super big

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lineup with Palo and Frond sliding to the guard spots

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or or Palo sliding to the center spots. So there's

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a lot of potential to be creative with this roster.

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I think the struggle with being creative was just the

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Magic didn't have enough shooting to make things functional, and

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so you couldn't experiment with Jonathan Isaac at center or

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Jonathan Isaac in different places because you didn't have enough

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shooting to give the space for that to work. You

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kind of you needed Jonathaniaac.

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Speaker 2: To be a spacer, which he obviously wasn't.

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Speaker 3: But you know, hopefully with some better shooting and some

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more versatile offensive pieces, they can begin to like test

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some of the limits of what they can do off

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do with these lineups and you know, create some advantages

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that way.

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Speaker 1: But do you have any like question marks or concerns

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about how they might integrate Bane or is this a

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no notes type of acquisition?

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Speaker 3: I mean it, there's look so little scarred that Katavio

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Scowopope was so bad. Like you shot what thirty two

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percent last year? The Blazers are the thirty four percent

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for three. The Blazers are the team where it seems

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like players go there and shoot better from three, or

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like the Magic the team that players go there.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Shoot, I haven't given that enough thought to make the analogy.

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Speaker 3: But the Magic, the Magic, the Magic Havevint had an

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offense outside the bottom ten in the League since Dwight

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and twenty twelve.

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Speaker 1: That's a long time.

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Speaker 3: It's a long time. I've I've watched a lot of

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bad offense.

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Speaker 2: You know. The joke.

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Speaker 3: The joke was when after Game three, were sitting in

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the media room and all the Celtics writers were like, man,

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that game was ugly, and me, Jason Beattie of the

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Orlando Sentinel, Mason Williams, who was with Magic on this side,

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we all kind of perked up and we're like, that's

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that's normal. We can name like four or five games

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that are we can we started like rattling off like six, seven,

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eighteens that were just that were just like so much

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worse than this. It's just like, this is this is

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how they play, this is how they have to do it.

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Speaker 2: My concern is still that.

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Speaker 3: The issue, Yeah, the issue is a little bit the

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way that Paolo likes to play, where they're just a

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slow down team. They don't they don't play fast enough

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to kind of take advantage of it or and look,

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I know we'll get into some of the Palo stuff here,

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but I think some of the issue with Palo is

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he's still a young player learning when to speed the

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game up.

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Speaker 2: And when to slow it down.

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Speaker 3: And his default and is his preference, I think, is

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to play this kind of you know, not ugly, but

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this like very two thousand style ISO game where he's

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going to kind of stop and survey the defense and

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jab step and and you know, do his moves to

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get to his spots. And I think that does take

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guys out of rhythm a little bit. The Magic, the

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Magic struggled so much to create fast break opportunities, and

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they're still so young, so I think some of these are.

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Speaker 2: Just young team mistakes.

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Speaker 3: It's the concern that I still have is just that

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the Magic just don't move the ball enough. They're just

323
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they're not that they're selfish or guys don't want to

324
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pass the ball, but everything is just maybe a step

325
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slower than it needs to be to play at the

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level that that this group clearly wants to play at.

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Speaker 2: And so.

328
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Speaker 3: Just these little things that knock you a little bit

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off rhythm. That still concerns me a little bit that

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the Magic won't take full advance. I think they'll be better,

331
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Don't get me wrong. I don't think Desmond Bain is

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gonna suddenly shoot like thirty two percent liked cac F did.

333
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But my concern is that they won't take as full

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advantage of this opportunity. And some of it is just

335
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some of it might be like, yeah, the stars aren't

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aren't compatible, or the stars have have a ceiling on them,

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which I which you know, I think is definitely a thing.

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Speaker 1: So when you mentioned the transition stuff, because this is

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actually something that's been like a like, we've nitpicked on

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this podcast a bunch of times, and I understand the

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Palo of it all, but like, even when he's off

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the floor, it's not like they're blitzing these teams after

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live rebounds or even when they're forcing turnovers. Is that

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just like a philosophical thing? Is it a personnel issue

345
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that you know extends past Palo. I look at this

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team and even before they had Desmond Baine, but now

347
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that they do, I'm like, no, Like you can run

348
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off live balls for sure, if and even Paalo is

349
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just grab and go, But like you said, his proclivity

350
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is that I want to slow things down and break

351
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down against that defense as sure, But I think I've

352
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been more like even the numbers were kind of all

353
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like I had Franz and I'm not I'm a Franz

354
00:15:12,240 --> 00:15:14,960
Wagner skeptic, full disclosure, But he made he was fourth

355
00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:17,840
on my MVP ballot, and then he got injured like

356
00:15:17,879 --> 00:15:20,360
five games later or something like that earlier this season. Yeah,

357
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but like it even felt like there was they were

358
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leaving like low hanging fruit on the tree with with

359
00:15:25,360 --> 00:15:27,519
stuff like that when Palo's off the flour or injured too.

360
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Speaker 3: Yeah, No, I don't think I don't think that's wrong

361
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at all. I mean, typically when you think of young teams,

362
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you think of teams that just want to go get

363
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out and run, use their speed, use their athleticism, and

364
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get as many easy points as there as possible. And

365
00:15:39,480 --> 00:15:41,919
the Magic just don't do that, or they don't do

366
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it consistently enough. Obviously you get a few here and

367
00:15:44,159 --> 00:15:47,039
there throughout the course of a game, but there's definitely

368
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I think a I think there's just a lot of.

369
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Speaker 2: Youthful mistakes like it.

370
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Speaker 3: Like they you know, they turned the ball over a

371
00:15:52,759 --> 00:15:54,759
lot on fast breaks, they make the wrong read, or

372
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they're a little laid on a read.

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Speaker 2: Perhaps in transition.

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Speaker 3: Some of it is Jalen Suggs is one of the

375
00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:02,840
few guys that really likes to push the tempo, oh yeah,

376
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and him being out for a good chunk of the

377
00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:09,000
season or him you know, him having to be the

378
00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:11,080
lead guy for a good chunk of the season probably

379
00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:12,519
slowed the team down a lot too.

380
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Speaker 2: And so that's I think part of it. And you know,

381
00:16:16,759 --> 00:16:17,639
well I am.

382
00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:21,080
Speaker 3: I am optimistic that they'll be able to kind of

383
00:16:21,240 --> 00:16:24,679
work without a point guard. I think there are intangible

384
00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:27,039
things that come from a point guard, from just knowing

385
00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:29,159
how to manage a game, how to you know, when

386
00:16:29,200 --> 00:16:31,320
to push the tempo, where to get the ball, where

387
00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:33,200
to be, how to fill lanes, how to like kind

388
00:16:33,200 --> 00:16:35,919
of put guys in the right spot. And the Magic

389
00:16:36,159 --> 00:16:38,600
just don't have that, or they they haven't really had that,

390
00:16:38,679 --> 00:16:41,960
you know, Like Markel Foltz was solid for what he was,

391
00:16:42,120 --> 00:16:45,039
but you know, he's a limited player, you know, ty

392
00:16:45,159 --> 00:16:47,519
I think Tis Jones being on the floor is going

393
00:16:47,559 --> 00:16:50,600
to help this team a bunch and how he works

394
00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:52,799
and might tell the Magic like, hey, we might actually

395
00:16:52,799 --> 00:16:54,360
need a point guard here. You know, I don't think

396
00:16:54,399 --> 00:16:56,480
Tys Jones is a starting point guard, you know, I

397
00:16:56,480 --> 00:16:58,799
think we saw that experiment play out in Phoenix. Although

398
00:16:59,279 --> 00:17:02,279
Orlando's much or defensive atmosphere and environment for him, but

399
00:17:03,080 --> 00:17:05,880
he's got limitations. I wouldn't want him starting, especially if

400
00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:09,279
you're trying to win a championship. But I think that

401
00:17:09,319 --> 00:17:11,519
there are still you know, there's there's some maturity things.

402
00:17:11,559 --> 00:17:15,279
There's just some like experience being in these situations, you know,

403
00:17:15,359 --> 00:17:18,880
some instinct things, and again some personnel things that I

404
00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:20,039
think keep the Magic again.

405
00:17:20,079 --> 00:17:21,920
Speaker 2: This this is These are easy points. These are easy

406
00:17:21,960 --> 00:17:22,599
ways to score.

407
00:17:23,359 --> 00:17:25,160
Speaker 3: They don't have the great three point shooting to like

408
00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:28,319
kind of spread the floor and twist defences around in transition.

409
00:17:28,759 --> 00:17:31,920
Everyone just starts walling the paint and says, okay, try

410
00:17:31,960 --> 00:17:34,039
and you know they only have two guys going up

411
00:17:34,039 --> 00:17:36,279
against these three. But none of your guys were worried

412
00:17:36,279 --> 00:17:38,359
about it the three point line or if that, if

413
00:17:38,400 --> 00:17:40,880
they take a three, let's see you make some before

414
00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:42,799
we go out and there and guard it. So it's

415
00:17:42,799 --> 00:17:44,920
all conn it's all connected. A lot of it just

416
00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:48,000
goes back to the shooting being so bad. But you know,

417
00:17:48,039 --> 00:17:49,799
I think I think there are definitely things the Magic

418
00:17:49,839 --> 00:17:51,880
need to do to increase their transition and play faster.

419
00:17:52,559 --> 00:17:55,480
Speaker 1: Unless Phoenix totally corrupted, Tias Jones like he should at

420
00:17:55,559 --> 00:17:57,559
least help with some of the game management perspective, like

421
00:17:57,559 --> 00:17:59,680
even in half court situations for them, Yeah, do you

422
00:17:59,720 --> 00:18:02,559
think that addition is getting enough attention or is it

423
00:18:02,559 --> 00:18:05,079
getting the proper amount of attention because one of another

424
00:18:05,200 --> 00:18:07,720
sticking point with what it seems like with Jamal Mosley

425
00:18:07,799 --> 00:18:10,559
is just if you're not like a super plus on defense,

426
00:18:10,839 --> 00:18:12,359
he doesn't really want to give you a chance. And

427
00:18:12,559 --> 00:18:14,079
I'm not sure who needs to hear this, but like

428
00:18:14,119 --> 00:18:16,960
Tias Jones is not a super positive impact defender.

429
00:18:17,960 --> 00:18:22,759
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think I don't think people are giving it

430
00:18:22,799 --> 00:18:25,519
the full attention. Maybe it deserves, but at the same time,

431
00:18:25,519 --> 00:18:27,720
it also feels like a very short term move. Because

432
00:18:27,759 --> 00:18:30,519
he's signed a one year deal, it feels like it's

433
00:18:30,559 --> 00:18:33,880
more stable. They're they're more using him to stabilize the

434
00:18:33,880 --> 00:18:36,519
bench group and and you know, who knows what that

435
00:18:36,559 --> 00:18:38,440
bench group is going to be. Like I'm I'm a

436
00:18:38,519 --> 00:18:40,240
you know, like, if there's one complaint I have about

437
00:18:40,319 --> 00:18:44,119
Jamal Mosley and his rotations, he is very insistent on

438
00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:46,640
a ten man rotation that does sometimes include an all

439
00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:51,599
bench lineup. And like we're at the point where personally,

440
00:18:51,680 --> 00:18:53,839
I think the Magic this year probably need to go

441
00:18:53,920 --> 00:18:59,079
nine man. One of their four like Suggs, Bain, Franz Pallo.

442
00:18:59,160 --> 00:19:00,400
One of those four need to be on the floor

443
00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:01,039
at all times.

444
00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:03,559
Speaker 2: He can like what he probably.

445
00:19:03,240 --> 00:19:05,519
Speaker 3: Should be too by the playoffs, it should be too.

446
00:19:06,440 --> 00:19:08,359
But they, I mean, they need to figure out what

447
00:19:08,400 --> 00:19:11,039
the right pairings between those those four are. But yeah,

448
00:19:11,160 --> 00:19:14,680
like like two of those four should probably be for

449
00:19:14,759 --> 00:19:16,519
big games, especially two of the four should be on

450
00:19:16,559 --> 00:19:18,960
the floor at all times. So you know, I think

451
00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:21,839
that Taias is there to kind of stabilize things. Maybe

452
00:19:21,920 --> 00:19:25,079
maybe be uh you know, take Anthony Black under his

453
00:19:25,160 --> 00:19:26,960
wing to try and help him get a little bit

454
00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:30,000
better as a point guard. But I do think that's

455
00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:32,960
gonna be stabilizing. Like again, like he's an excellent three

456
00:19:32,960 --> 00:19:35,720
point shooter. Unless something's in the water here in Orlando

457
00:19:35,759 --> 00:19:40,200
that keeps people from shooting. There's there there's that's gonna

458
00:19:40,200 --> 00:19:42,559
help on its own that he is an elite catch

459
00:19:42,599 --> 00:19:45,359
and shoot three point shooter, like what forty forty three,

460
00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:47,440
forty four percent on like that last year even in Phoenix,

461
00:19:47,920 --> 00:19:49,960
like they have the defense around him, Like he's gonna

462
00:19:49,960 --> 00:19:52,279
be in lineups where Anthony Black is next to him,

463
00:19:52,279 --> 00:19:54,440
where Jalen Suggs is next to him, or Jonathan Isaac's

464
00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:57,359
behind him, Yogabtadz is behind him, Like he'll be in

465
00:19:57,400 --> 00:19:59,799
lineups where they can cover for his defense. And he's

466
00:19:59,799 --> 00:20:02,599
not starting, He's not playing thirty minutes a game, so

467
00:20:02,599 --> 00:20:07,079
they can probably do well in those minutes, but I

468
00:20:07,119 --> 00:20:09,839
think the stabilization that he'll bring is gonna be really poor.

469
00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:13,839
Speaker 1: The Magic have shown they have the stomach for patients

470
00:20:13,839 --> 00:20:16,000
based on how long they waited to even go in

471
00:20:16,039 --> 00:20:17,880
on a move like Desmond Bane. But I think what's

472
00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:21,599
interesting about their situation now is they have other moves

473
00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:25,359
they could make. But like you've changed like your personnel

474
00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:27,039
to the extent that you would want to change it.

475
00:20:27,160 --> 00:20:28,759
And so do you view this as sort of a

476
00:20:29,079 --> 00:20:31,160
I don't like boiling it down to make or break,

477
00:20:31,200 --> 00:20:35,680
but like this is a telltale year for Jamal Mosley, Right, Yeah?

478
00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:36,440
Speaker 2: I think so.

479
00:20:36,839 --> 00:20:40,759
Speaker 3: And And you know, I'm a big believer that coaches

480
00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:44,359
have roles the same way players do. Some coaches are

481
00:20:45,279 --> 00:20:48,119
the rebuild coach that kind of build the foundations for

482
00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:50,359
everything and gets you to the playoffs. Some coaches are

483
00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:52,519
I'm gonna you know, Steve Goifford was this way he

484
00:20:52,559 --> 00:20:54,160
gets you into the playoffs. He's not getting you to

485
00:20:54,240 --> 00:20:57,000
the next round or the round after like he built like,

486
00:20:57,000 --> 00:20:59,839
but like Steve like everywhere. Like the years in Charlotte,

487
00:21:00,039 --> 00:21:03,160
those Starlett teams outplayed their their talent, the years in Orlando,

488
00:21:03,240 --> 00:21:06,000
those teams outplayed their talent like he gave them the

489
00:21:06,039 --> 00:21:10,440
base to be playoff teams, just not much more. Some

490
00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:12,400
coaches are the guy that gets over the hump to

491
00:21:12,400 --> 00:21:14,319
the championship, and you know, sometimes you don't know who

492
00:21:14,359 --> 00:21:15,160
that coach is until.

493
00:21:14,960 --> 00:21:16,759
Speaker 2: They actually win one.

494
00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:19,039
Speaker 3: This I think is a big year for Jamal Moseley

495
00:21:19,119 --> 00:21:22,319
to show that he's not just the rebuild coach. I

496
00:21:22,319 --> 00:21:25,319
think he's done a really good job obviously building a

497
00:21:25,359 --> 00:21:30,000
culture and having everybody believe and willing to run through

498
00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:33,720
a wall for him. But now comes the pressure of results,

499
00:21:34,079 --> 00:21:37,519
and you know, they it was a miracle they finished

500
00:21:37,559 --> 00:21:39,119
forty one and forty one last year with all the

501
00:21:39,119 --> 00:21:41,559
injuries that they had and the fact that they rallied.

502
00:21:41,599 --> 00:21:43,960
I think they went what was it, They went twelve

503
00:21:44,000 --> 00:21:46,039
and six over their last eighteen games to get to

504
00:21:46,079 --> 00:21:48,519
five hundred and win the when the division win the

505
00:21:48,519 --> 00:21:51,079
seven seed, like that was coming off of a one

506
00:21:51,079 --> 00:21:52,720
in six home stand, to go twelve and six the

507
00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:55,000
rest of the year. I think that was like a

508
00:21:55,039 --> 00:21:57,920
masterful job of like everyone kind of getting a gut

509
00:21:58,000 --> 00:21:59,799
check and going. And I thought he had a good

510
00:21:59,799 --> 00:22:02,240
game playing against the Celtics. It just you know, didn't

511
00:22:02,279 --> 00:22:05,480
have the talent to execute it fully. Because the Celtics

512
00:22:05,480 --> 00:22:10,359
are are a real or were a related team. This

513
00:22:10,519 --> 00:22:13,400
is a big year because now you're a second Apron

514
00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:15,839
team next year. And I'll let you know you're you're

515
00:22:15,880 --> 00:22:18,319
the Magic are paying the tax this season, assuming they

516
00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:20,319
keep their salaries the way they are. The Magic are

517
00:22:20,359 --> 00:22:22,000
paying the tax this season for the first time since

518
00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:25,400
twenty twelve. When Palo's extension kicks in next year, they'll be,

519
00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:28,400
if not in the second Apron, very very close to it.

520
00:22:30,359 --> 00:22:32,799
That that means it's winner bus. That means you are

521
00:22:32,839 --> 00:22:37,960
competing for a championship. And if this team is the

522
00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:40,279
five seed again and loses in the first round, if

523
00:22:40,279 --> 00:22:43,799
they're if they don't like I don't think they have

524
00:22:43,839 --> 00:22:46,720
to win a championship this year, but they clearly need

525
00:22:46,720 --> 00:22:49,000
to be pointing in that direction. And if they're not

526
00:22:49,079 --> 00:22:52,799
pointing in that direction, the acts is gonna fall on

527
00:22:52,839 --> 00:22:54,720
the coach or the pressure is gonna fall on the coach. Now,

528
00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:57,400
obviously it's like depends on what happens and how you

529
00:22:57,440 --> 00:23:00,200
get there. But Jabal Moseley's proven he can build an

530
00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:02,960
elite defense. Now he's got to prove that he can

531
00:23:03,000 --> 00:23:06,319
bring the offense up with it, start winning winning games

532
00:23:06,319 --> 00:23:09,160
in the playoffs and winning playoff series and pointing this

533
00:23:09,279 --> 00:23:11,920
team to competing for the big prize at the end

534
00:23:11,920 --> 00:23:14,480
of the season, because that's what that's what the Devas

535
00:23:14,559 --> 00:23:17,200
family's paying for at this point. And if you're not

536
00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:19,839
putting in that direction, then you probably and the way

537
00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:22,799
the cap is situated, you can't stay in that tax

538
00:23:22,839 --> 00:23:23,799
bracket for very long.

539
00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:27,839
Speaker 1: I have to ask this question. I feel like every season,

540
00:23:27,880 --> 00:23:30,559
what makes Powell Bankro such a divisive player? Is it

541
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:34,559
just the efficiency? People are looking at the stats and

542
00:23:34,559 --> 00:23:36,960
they say, oh, like blow average or barely average true

543
00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:40,079
shooting percentage or effective field goal percentage or field goal percentage,

544
00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:43,440
And that's just it what makes him so polarizing.

545
00:23:44,440 --> 00:23:47,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's that's that's a million dollar question, because like

546
00:23:47,039 --> 00:23:49,359
I sit here and I watch him every game, and

547
00:23:50,119 --> 00:23:52,839
I'm just like, this is the exact kind of guy

548
00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:57,799
that the NBA markets like crazy or the NBA should

549
00:23:57,839 --> 00:23:59,960
be marketing like crazy. He scores a lot of points.

550
00:24:00,559 --> 00:24:03,400
He's you know, unique Bill, He's good, he's a good kid.

551
00:24:03,480 --> 00:24:06,880
Speaker 2: Number. On top of all that, he's a matchup nightmare.

552
00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:09,119
Like everyone around the league I think respects him.

553
00:24:09,799 --> 00:24:12,519
Speaker 3: And it just comes down to the Magic aren't on

554
00:24:12,519 --> 00:24:15,000
TV a lot, and so the only way people watch

555
00:24:15,039 --> 00:24:17,200
him is I mean, like I hate to say it,

556
00:24:17,279 --> 00:24:19,319
like it's still that's still a thing. The Magic just

557
00:24:19,359 --> 00:24:22,359
aren't part of the national conversation. And so the people

558
00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:26,640
talking about Pallo are people trying to compare him to

559
00:24:26,359 --> 00:24:29,880
other players or people like just box score watching. And

560
00:24:29,960 --> 00:24:32,960
look the stats. The advanced stats aren't great, the efficiency

561
00:24:33,039 --> 00:24:35,440
isn't great. But I would sit here and say, like, well,

562
00:24:35,839 --> 00:24:37,160
look at the shooting that he has.

563
00:24:37,319 --> 00:24:37,880
Speaker 2: Look at the.

564
00:24:37,839 --> 00:24:40,200
Speaker 3: Fact that I think he was in the top ten

565
00:24:40,279 --> 00:24:42,519
or top fifteen in the league in most double teams

566
00:24:42,519 --> 00:24:45,519
face like he faces a wall of players in front

567
00:24:45,519 --> 00:24:48,079
of him every game. It got to a point last

568
00:24:48,119 --> 00:24:50,759
year that we've danced around this the magic shot like

569
00:24:50,799 --> 00:24:53,279
thirty one point something percent from three last year.

570
00:24:53,319 --> 00:24:55,720
Speaker 1: His teammate got we're in the b Ball Index has

571
00:24:55,720 --> 00:24:57,279
that great tool. We could look at where the teammates

572
00:24:57,319 --> 00:25:01,000
ranked percentile the zero fith percentile of catch and shoot

573
00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:04,559
three point efficiency. That's the type of BAK spacing. Excuse me,

574
00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:07,720
Carol's been working with his entire career basically.

575
00:25:07,319 --> 00:25:09,319
Speaker 3: And and like and like last year it got to

576
00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:12,480
the point where he'd be taking these contested mid range

577
00:25:12,559 --> 00:25:15,240
jumpers and there'd be open players in the opposite corner.

578
00:25:15,319 --> 00:25:18,279
I'd be just like, that shot is probably a better

579
00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:21,440
higher percentage shot by the analytics than than passing to

580
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:23,920
an open corner three at this point, and so there

581
00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:27,160
there's a like, there's a there's a general lack of trust.

582
00:25:27,319 --> 00:25:29,519
Like like, at a certain point last year, the three

583
00:25:29,519 --> 00:25:32,519
point shooting just became endemic. It just became like, we

584
00:25:32,559 --> 00:25:34,799
don't trust for we're gonna make threes, Like we'll take

585
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:36,920
them if they're open. But you could see that little

586
00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:38,799
bit of doubt and in some of the players as

587
00:25:38,839 --> 00:25:41,440
they were taking threes. It just it just got to

588
00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:43,440
that point last year and it was just you know,

589
00:25:43,519 --> 00:25:47,240
you can't do very much at that point. This is

590
00:25:47,279 --> 00:25:49,319
a big year for Powell because that yeah, now he

591
00:25:49,359 --> 00:25:51,759
has Desmond Pain, Now he should have a little bit

592
00:25:51,759 --> 00:25:54,319
more spacing. And so you do want to see him

593
00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:56,799
take a little bit of a leap efficiency wise, Like, look,

594
00:25:56,839 --> 00:25:59,279
he's still the thing that most annoys me about the

595
00:25:59,279 --> 00:26:03,079
Palo discussion. People talk about him like he's some twenty

596
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:05,400
eight year old established veteran and this is as good

597
00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:08,000
as he's going to get. He's still twenty two years old,

598
00:26:08,079 --> 00:26:09,720
you know, like he's entering his I think year twenty

599
00:26:09,759 --> 00:26:12,559
three season, Like he's still going to get a whole

600
00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:15,079
lot better. And now that the Magic have work to

601
00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:18,759
improve their roster, hopefully the idea is that he is

602
00:26:18,839 --> 00:26:23,400
going to make those passes and have the teammates make

603
00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:26,599
shots and be in a better spot to get good looks.

604
00:26:26,640 --> 00:26:28,440
And then it just comes down to his decision making

605
00:26:28,519 --> 00:26:30,039
of when do I pass, When do I shoot?

606
00:26:30,039 --> 00:26:31,000
Speaker 2: When do I go get mine?

607
00:26:31,279 --> 00:26:33,519
Speaker 3: You know, the things that you typically see Star struggle with,

608
00:26:33,599 --> 00:26:35,920
like all of his early all of his like first

609
00:26:35,920 --> 00:26:38,640
three year numbers, you compare him to like Lebron to

610
00:26:38,799 --> 00:26:40,519
Kevin Durant. And I'm not saying he's as good as

611
00:26:40,519 --> 00:26:42,400
those players. Those guys had better numbers through his first

612
00:26:42,440 --> 00:26:45,680
three years, but he's doing all the things that elite

613
00:26:45,759 --> 00:26:49,160
NBA players do early in their career. Now it's just okay,

614
00:26:49,319 --> 00:26:52,359
take that next step to superstartom and you know, do it.

615
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:53,920
Do it in front of people to kind of change

616
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:54,720
the narrative about you.

617
00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:57,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I'm almost interested to see, like what

618
00:26:57,519 --> 00:26:59,559
and whether they have enough shooting. I think Jalen Suggs

619
00:26:59,599 --> 00:27:01,759
is kind of key important to this too, is Yeah,

620
00:27:01,799 --> 00:27:03,839
Palo's three point volume. I don't know if it Maybe

621
00:27:03,839 --> 00:27:05,440
it can still climb, but I think it's like kind

622
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:07,599
of where it's gonna be. But he has like some

623
00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:10,079
of the lowest shot quality metrics around the rim, and

624
00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:12,440
he doesn't finish as well as like he plays with

625
00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:16,079
this like bletic brutality that I think he should just

626
00:27:16,119 --> 00:27:18,000
be able to score well from everywhere, And his finishing

627
00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:20,640
at the rim, even relative to the quality, it's always

628
00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:23,359
just been a little weird. And I'm wondering now, you know,

629
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:25,359
we talk about having more space for him to operate,

630
00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:27,279
maybe he can get to the mid range those are

631
00:27:27,319 --> 00:27:28,640
higher quality, Like I want to see if he can

632
00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:30,880
get to the basket more, see if he can finish

633
00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:32,839
it more efficient clip there, and that might be where

634
00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:35,480
having a healthy Sugs who had shot the ball really

635
00:27:35,559 --> 00:27:38,119
well in twenty three, twenty four and of course Baine

636
00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:39,680
might help him out a ton too.

637
00:27:40,240 --> 00:27:42,640
Speaker 3: But the biggest, the biggest thing, so like the biggest

638
00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:44,839
thing that I said coming out of Game seven against

639
00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:48,519
the Cavs in twenty twenty four is they just need

640
00:27:48,559 --> 00:27:50,799
to find a way to get Palo and Fronds just

641
00:27:50,839 --> 00:27:53,440
a few easy shots, like like one or two more

642
00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:56,039
catch and shoot threes. Give Palo a shot in the

643
00:27:56,079 --> 00:27:57,960
dunker spot you never see him like get a dump

644
00:27:58,000 --> 00:27:59,839
off to the dunker spot or or or.

645
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:01,960
Speaker 2: Out for a catch and shoot. Like the Magic just

646
00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:02,759
don't don't have.

647
00:28:02,799 --> 00:28:05,519
Speaker 3: Enough playmakers or creators to take the ball out of

648
00:28:05,559 --> 00:28:07,880
Palow in Franz's hands. Like I like the last two

649
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:11,319
playoff series. I would literally tell people like these playoff

650
00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:14,240
series have been pallowing Franz banging their head against a wall,

651
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:16,119
and they put a lot of cracks in those walls.

652
00:28:16,119 --> 00:28:17,799
They're they're good enough to put cracks in the walls,

653
00:28:17,839 --> 00:28:20,400
but they can't break through. They need someone to get

654
00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:22,279
them an easy look here and there. And that's the

655
00:28:22,279 --> 00:28:25,559
difference between a guy, you know, scoring twenty five twenty

656
00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:28,519
five inefficiently and a guy scoring twenty five on pretty

657
00:28:28,559 --> 00:28:31,240
good efficiency is like, oh, he gotta lay up because

658
00:28:31,519 --> 00:28:33,240
Jalen Suggs drove the lane and dumped it off to

659
00:28:33,319 --> 00:28:35,599
him in the dunker spot, or you know, Desmon being

660
00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:37,359
drove and kicked it out to Franz who made a

661
00:28:37,359 --> 00:28:38,279
three for change.

662
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:42,039
Speaker 2: It's it's it's it's they did.

663
00:28:42,319 --> 00:28:45,079
Speaker 3: Those easy shots just aren't part of their diets right now,

664
00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:47,440
And I think the hope is that with more creation,

665
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:51,400
more playmaking, kind of more secondary playmaking, you know, they

666
00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:53,240
get you know, maybe they're shot and they're useduld just

667
00:28:53,279 --> 00:28:55,640
go down a little bit, but they'll get some easy

668
00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:58,440
shots that theoretically means they can make make some make

669
00:28:58,480 --> 00:29:00,400
the same un score the same amount of play points

670
00:29:00,759 --> 00:29:01,880
on fewer field goals.

671
00:29:02,279 --> 00:29:04,799
Speaker 1: Do you think he or not that he would have

672
00:29:04,839 --> 00:29:06,759
any trouble, but do you think there could be an

673
00:29:06,759 --> 00:29:08,440
issue where he has to get used to what it's

674
00:29:08,559 --> 00:29:11,240
like to scale down Like this is someone where basically

675
00:29:11,279 --> 00:29:13,079
two thirds of his two pointers for his career have

676
00:29:13,079 --> 00:29:16,000
gun unassisted, and so putting him in easy spots would

677
00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:18,920
actually be a stark departure from the role he's needed

678
00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:21,799
to operate in for most, if not his entire career.

679
00:29:22,759 --> 00:29:24,839
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I think there'll be a little bit

680
00:29:24,839 --> 00:29:27,759
of adjustment there, and you know, it'll be curious to

681
00:29:27,799 --> 00:29:32,160
see how the Magic used Desmond being and and how

682
00:29:32,319 --> 00:29:34,799
how much kind of responsibility they give him, because you know,

683
00:29:34,799 --> 00:29:37,880
I think the whole idea like it isn't It isn't

684
00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:39,839
like adding LaMelo ball or Trey Young, which is like

685
00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:41,960
kind of the big move that you know, all the

686
00:29:42,319 --> 00:29:44,000
that everyone was like, oh, the Magic should be in

687
00:29:44,039 --> 00:29:45,799
on Trey Young. If the Hawks are going trade Trey Young,

688
00:29:46,319 --> 00:29:48,200
Magic go after him, and I'd be like, no, because

689
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:50,000
that takes the ball out of Poalo's hands. I don't

690
00:29:50,039 --> 00:29:52,200
think they want to do that, Like they still want

691
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:56,880
Pollo as the primary initiator and creator. But whenever you

692
00:29:56,920 --> 00:29:59,519
add a new player that's going to take shots and

693
00:30:00,119 --> 00:30:02,000
the ball in his hands a little bit, you're gonna

694
00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:03,480
have to adjust a little bit. You're gonna have to

695
00:30:03,559 --> 00:30:05,440
get a little bit creative and get used to doing

696
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:08,119
something different. And so I think there will be a

697
00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:10,680
little bit of an adjustment on that front. But at

698
00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:12,240
the end of the day, like if you find a

699
00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:13,960
way to keep winning, if you find a way to

700
00:30:14,119 --> 00:30:18,319
kind of make those pieces fit, then you're happy to

701
00:30:18,359 --> 00:30:21,200
make the sacrifice. Like I think they're like Poalow gets

702
00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:23,480
compared to Carmelo Anthony a lot, and I think a

703
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:25,559
lot of the discots, you know, Carmelo is still a

704
00:30:25,599 --> 00:30:26,240
much better player.

705
00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:27,839
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna I'm not saying.

706
00:30:27,559 --> 00:30:30,799
Speaker 1: Palo is actually already a much better defender than Camel Anthony.

707
00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:33,119
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I probably agree with that.

708
00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:35,839
Speaker 3: And there are things about Palo's defense that he needs

709
00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:37,839
to keep getting better at, but he's he's engaged on

710
00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:39,880
that end. Like that's I still think that's one of

711
00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:42,599
the miracles of Jamal Boseley is he's really taught Paalo

712
00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:44,519
at a young age to care about defense, even if

713
00:30:44,519 --> 00:30:49,039
there's still things he can get better at. But like

714
00:30:49,039 --> 00:30:52,519
like Camel, like kind of like Carmelo Anthony, like he

715
00:30:53,079 --> 00:30:55,759
has to learn, he has to kind of learn when

716
00:30:55,799 --> 00:30:57,759
to assert himself, when when to kind of take a

717
00:30:57,799 --> 00:30:58,319
step back.

718
00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:01,119
Speaker 2: And like I think is a willing passer.

719
00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:03,920
Speaker 3: Like I don't think he's some selfish player who just

720
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:06,440
wants to chuck shots and put up numbers, like he's

721
00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:09,480
still average like five, you know, five almost six assists

722
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:13,079
per game last year. I think he's going to look,

723
00:31:13,119 --> 00:31:14,920
he's going to want to pass the ball. He is

724
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:18,799
a willing passer. He just hasn't had the teammates that

725
00:31:18,880 --> 00:31:21,160
he trusts to do that. And at the end of

726
00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:24,440
the day, like the magic's best bet was Pallo ducking

727
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:25,920
his head, get into the foul line, get into the

728
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:27,839
basket and trying to make something happen, to make the

729
00:31:27,839 --> 00:31:29,279
defense collapse around him.

730
00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:31,519
Speaker 1: All Right, so we've reached the point of I have

731
00:31:31,559 --> 00:31:33,720
to ask you about where are you at with Frod

732
00:31:33,799 --> 00:31:35,119
Vagner and hashtag.

733
00:31:34,799 --> 00:31:39,039
Speaker 2: Jump shot watch. We're recording this.

734
00:31:39,359 --> 00:31:40,680
Speaker 3: I don't know when this is coming out, so we're

735
00:31:40,799 --> 00:31:43,440
I'm gonna date my date of timestamp this recording this

736
00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:45,799
on August twenty first, in the evening. If you had

737
00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:48,759
asked me yesterday, I would have been like, it's it's

738
00:31:48,799 --> 00:31:52,680
getting better. I'm not worried yet, I'm officially and I'm

739
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:56,440
a little bit concerned mode. He's gone three for twenty

740
00:31:56,440 --> 00:31:58,759
four on threes for the German national team in five

741
00:31:58,799 --> 00:32:04,000
exhibition games. He was zero for six against Spain. Uh

742
00:32:04,559 --> 00:32:06,400
the day that we're recording this, on August twenty first,

743
00:32:08,119 --> 00:32:11,319
the hitch is gone. Like that's that's the best news.

744
00:32:12,079 --> 00:32:14,920
It's it's not pretty yet. The results just starn't there,

745
00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:19,480
and it's no one has any answers for why, Like

746
00:32:19,559 --> 00:32:22,319
he does everything else well, he's shooting well from mid range,

747
00:32:22,440 --> 00:32:24,920
like he's able still able to get to the basket.

748
00:32:25,000 --> 00:32:27,160
Like his free throw shooting has been weird this summer,

749
00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:29,240
but he's an eighty plus percent free throw shooter.

750
00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:32,240
Speaker 2: I don't think anyone's super concerned. No one knows.

751
00:32:32,039 --> 00:32:34,559
Speaker 3: Why the three point SHOT's gone as wayward as it has.

752
00:32:34,599 --> 00:32:37,640
It's It was obviously wayward before the oblique injury. The

753
00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:41,400
oblique injury made it worse. He shot significantly worse after

754
00:32:41,599 --> 00:32:44,279
his injury, that included the little hitch that.

755
00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:45,160
Speaker 2: A lot of us noticed.

756
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:49,559
Speaker 3: It's I I am officially in concerned. I want I

757
00:32:49,839 --> 00:32:53,960
want to wait and see what it looks like in

758
00:32:54,039 --> 00:32:57,440
real games and in the EuroBasket games. And on top

759
00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:01,359
of that, like context for EuroBasket, they play, they're very

760
00:33:01,440 --> 00:33:04,640
much like the Magic It's Dennis shooter, Franz Wagner and

761
00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:07,440
nobody else on the ball, and.

762
00:33:07,160 --> 00:33:09,240
Speaker 2: They're shooting extremely poorly.

763
00:33:09,279 --> 00:33:11,599
Speaker 3: That that team is usually a pretty good shooting team,

764
00:33:12,319 --> 00:33:15,559
but Maldolow's hurt, like they've all all their shooters are

765
00:33:15,559 --> 00:33:18,000
struggling just so far in in the exhibition games. So

766
00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:19,799
maybe that'll change. When they get to get to Finland

767
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:23,119
and start the games for real. He's still scoring a

768
00:33:23,160 --> 00:33:24,960
lot of points. He's still gonna get you the points,

769
00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:28,680
but the shot is still very, very concerning, and I

770
00:33:28,680 --> 00:33:31,200
think it's it's to a point where it's just like, okay,

771
00:33:31,359 --> 00:33:34,839
like what's up or stop shooting three s frons Like

772
00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:36,839
it's that's just not a good shot for you anymore.

773
00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:39,079
Speaker 1: So much of the focus is paid to the three

774
00:33:39,079 --> 00:33:41,839
point percentage. It's kind of a testament to how good

775
00:33:41,839 --> 00:33:45,279
he is already without having that in his arsenal basically

776
00:33:45,319 --> 00:33:46,880
for like what two and a half of his career

777
00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:49,359
three thir like seventy five percent of his career. What

778
00:33:49,759 --> 00:33:52,880
else do people need to zero in on about Franz Vogner,

779
00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:55,119
Whether it's some of the secondary passing, some of the defense,

780
00:33:55,160 --> 00:33:58,039
somebody he plays with like this live dribble, fuck you

781
00:33:58,559 --> 00:34:00,000
like a little bit when he gets into the lane.

782
00:34:00,079 --> 00:34:01,680
There's there's a lot of stuff about his game, as

783
00:34:01,759 --> 00:34:04,000
even someone who like I said, as a Frozvagner skeptic

784
00:34:04,319 --> 00:34:07,200
that I think it's easy to appreciate when you watch him.

785
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:09,800
What what should people be looking at aside from the

786
00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:10,960
three point shooting? With him.

787
00:34:11,199 --> 00:34:15,119
Speaker 3: I mean his his footwork is incredible, Like when he

788
00:34:15,440 --> 00:34:21,280
is in the open floor going downhill, he he probably

789
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:24,880
euro steps as well as Dwayne Wader monugenobily does like it.

790
00:34:25,039 --> 00:34:28,079
Like his his euro step in his ability to weave

791
00:34:28,119 --> 00:34:31,559
his way through the defenses without without dribbling rafter he

792
00:34:31,559 --> 00:34:34,119
picks up his dribble is incredible, Like he'll do this

793
00:34:34,159 --> 00:34:36,639
thing where he'll kind of take it like if a

794
00:34:36,679 --> 00:34:38,960
guy is like setting up to take a charge instead

795
00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:41,280
of eurostepping like past him, he'll step to the side

796
00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:43,119
and just shoot a floater over them. Like his his

797
00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:50,079
footwork on the move is just incredible, and like that's obviously,

798
00:34:50,159 --> 00:34:53,159
like the big ticket with him is if he is

799
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:56,000
going toward the basket with the head of steam, like

800
00:34:56,079 --> 00:34:58,760
he can stop on a dime, He can change directions

801
00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:00,880
on a dime like he like there's just not there's

802
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:02,559
nothing you can do. Like the whole point of a

803
00:35:02,599 --> 00:35:06,000
defense against Franz is keep him on the perimeter, keep

804
00:35:06,039 --> 00:35:08,480
him from picking up that like extra gear going downhill,

805
00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:10,920
because you know, once once he's once he has the

806
00:35:10,920 --> 00:35:12,719
basket in his view and a little bit of speed

807
00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:15,599
behind him, it's it's over. Like he's gonna figure out

808
00:35:15,599 --> 00:35:17,639
a way to score on you or make the right

809
00:35:17,679 --> 00:35:20,519
play on you. I am also convinced that he's going

810
00:35:20,559 --> 00:35:22,400
to be an all defensive, all defense. He has all

811
00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:25,039
defensive team capabilities. I don't know if you'll ever get there,

812
00:35:25,039 --> 00:35:26,920
because I think Jalen Suggs will take all the attention

813
00:35:27,039 --> 00:35:31,599
on this team. But I think he is he He

814
00:35:31,639 --> 00:35:34,679
doesn't look as strong as he is, but he will

815
00:35:34,719 --> 00:35:37,920
take contact and kind of stonewall guys off the dribble,

816
00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:40,400
and I think and he can defend multiple positions, like

817
00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:42,639
he can defend smaller guys as much as he can

818
00:35:42,719 --> 00:35:46,559
defend bigger guys. So I everything about Franz Vogner's game

819
00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:51,719
is awesome except the three point shooting, and that's obviously

820
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:53,800
so important, especially on a team that doesn't shoot. I

821
00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:55,800
think he still led the team in three point attempts

822
00:35:55,800 --> 00:35:57,639
per game last year. Is that he shoots like five

823
00:35:57,719 --> 00:35:59,760
six threes a game, and so it's just like, if

824
00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:01,400
he can you figure out how to even shoot like

825
00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:04,199
thirty three percent, go two for six on threes every night,

826
00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:06,840
like that would be such a huge boost to his

827
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:08,559
game and such a huge boost to the magic. But

828
00:36:09,119 --> 00:36:11,960
everything else about his game is just is just it's

829
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:14,800
delightful to watch, and it's just sometimes I wonder if

830
00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:17,920
Franz understands how good he is, because I feel like

831
00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:20,199
his personality and that's why I think him and Poalo

832
00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:22,679
works so well together. Honestly, his personality, I think is

833
00:36:22,679 --> 00:36:25,039
to defer to people like I think he. I think

834
00:36:25,039 --> 00:36:28,320
he prefers being the beat, the Scotti to Pallo's Jordan.

835
00:36:28,679 --> 00:36:30,159
If that comparison makes sense.

836
00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:31,719
Speaker 1: How do you read it? I didn't throw those in

837
00:36:31,760 --> 00:36:32,840
the outline I sent to you. But what do you

838
00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:34,920
make of Like there's been people I don't say they

839
00:36:34,960 --> 00:36:36,719
try to pit them against one another, but you look

840
00:36:36,719 --> 00:36:38,119
at some of the line up data and it's gonna

841
00:36:38,119 --> 00:36:39,880
show like, oh, the offense is just way better the

842
00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:42,800
Magic way better when Franz plays without Polo. I think

843
00:36:42,840 --> 00:36:46,000
that there's just a lot of context missing from that. Mostly, Yeah,

844
00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:48,440
what's the type of lineups they're going up against? Is

845
00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:50,840
that an actual conversation at all?

846
00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:55,960
Speaker 3: I don't think it's a conversation among among like Magic fans,

847
00:36:56,840 --> 00:36:58,920
because like, look, at the end of the day, if

848
00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:02,599
you want to win a championship, you need multiple top

849
00:37:02,639 --> 00:37:05,559
twenty players like you need as many good players.

850
00:37:05,199 --> 00:37:06,400
Speaker 2: As you as you can get.

851
00:37:07,039 --> 00:37:10,679
Speaker 3: So it shouldn't it shouldn't ever be either or it's both,

852
00:37:10,719 --> 00:37:13,119
and like the Magic or not, we're not talking about

853
00:37:13,119 --> 00:37:15,800
the Magic as a potential Eastern Conference contender this year

854
00:37:16,239 --> 00:37:19,519
if not for both Franz and Palo, or for or

855
00:37:19,559 --> 00:37:23,840
both Palo and Franz. Franz is typically the first guy

856
00:37:23,840 --> 00:37:25,280
that comes out of the lineup when the when the

857
00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:27,760
Magic break their lineup, he plays a lot with that bench.

858
00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:31,679
Speaker 2: Group, and the Magic have typically had a very strong bench.

859
00:37:32,199 --> 00:37:35,800
Speaker 3: You know, when Movager is healthy, Gogobaitadze, Jonathan Isaac's an

860
00:37:35,800 --> 00:37:39,599
excellent defender, they'd have Cole Anthony, they have a they've

861
00:37:39,599 --> 00:37:42,679
typically had over the last two years. So maybe not typically,

862
00:37:42,760 --> 00:37:44,400
but over the last two years they've had a very

863
00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:47,000
strong bench, and Franz is the anchor of those bench

864
00:37:47,039 --> 00:37:51,119
groups allows him to flourish against weaker defenders. I think

865
00:37:52,079 --> 00:37:54,280
I think that there is probably a little bit of

866
00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:57,480
you know, not I don't say lack of respect for Franz,

867
00:37:57,519 --> 00:38:01,280
but just Franz doesn't I think garner the same kind

868
00:38:01,280 --> 00:38:04,440
of respect from defenses that Palo does, or the same

869
00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:07,280
way to defend him that Palo does, because just Palo

870
00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:09,239
is just a tank. Like you have to throw as

871
00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:12,280
many guys as you can at him to try and

872
00:38:12,320 --> 00:38:16,320
slow him down. But I think that context matters. But like, look,

873
00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:18,880
Palo is still taking you know Paalo. I think Franz

874
00:38:19,119 --> 00:38:20,800
is more of the analytics starling.

875
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:21,559
Speaker 2: You know he is.

876
00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:25,119
Speaker 3: He is essentially only taking layups and threes. He added

877
00:38:25,159 --> 00:38:28,320
some mid range shots this year, it's still like below fifty,

878
00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:30,679
it's still like fewer than fifty for the entire season.

879
00:38:31,039 --> 00:38:32,960
He's pretty good at making them. Like, I think there's

880
00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:34,840
a case to be made that Frauan should be looking

881
00:38:34,840 --> 00:38:36,559
for more mid rangehots, especially if the three is not

882
00:38:36,599 --> 00:38:38,960
going to fall, because he hits the mid range at

883
00:38:38,960 --> 00:38:40,599
a pretty high clip, which makes a three point shooting

884
00:38:40,639 --> 00:38:41,320
even more confusing.

885
00:38:42,760 --> 00:38:46,039
Speaker 2: Polo Paalo takes a lot.

886
00:38:47,039 --> 00:38:50,079
Speaker 3: I think Palo tends to take the superstar shots or

887
00:38:50,119 --> 00:38:53,639
the shots a star thinks that a superstar takes, and

888
00:38:53,719 --> 00:38:57,159
those are obviously low percentage shots, whereas Franz I think

889
00:38:57,679 --> 00:39:00,000
very rarely settles for those kinds of shots, like he's

890
00:39:00,159 --> 00:39:03,440
he's he's very much like a again like rim or

891
00:39:03,480 --> 00:39:05,719
three pointer, like those those are really the big areas

892
00:39:05,719 --> 00:39:07,599
that that he tends to shoot and score, and so

893
00:39:08,239 --> 00:39:09,920
I think that's all part of it. And again it's

894
00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:12,639
just the lineups are going up against. Palow's typically going

895
00:39:12,679 --> 00:39:15,519
up against UH starters for the most most part. When

896
00:39:15,559 --> 00:39:18,079
he's in, Franz gets to eat a healthy bit of

897
00:39:18,119 --> 00:39:19,440
diet against against reserves.

898
00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:22,000
Speaker 1: I mean, when they're on the court together, Palo's going

899
00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:24,719
to draw not only more attention but the presumably it

900
00:39:24,760 --> 00:39:27,079
depends on the size of the other team's like best defender.

901
00:39:27,159 --> 00:39:31,000
But you're gonna face those toughest matchups at that end too. Yes,

902
00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:34,360
So I'm a big Jalen Suggs believer on offense, a

903
00:39:34,400 --> 00:39:37,559
truther maybe sometimes spreading disinformation about it on borderline. I

904
00:39:37,559 --> 00:39:37,880
don't know.

905
00:39:38,239 --> 00:39:40,039
Speaker 2: Oh, I'm I'm your propaganda minister.

906
00:39:40,119 --> 00:39:44,159
Speaker 1: Then the more I think about this team, I'm not.

907
00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:47,880
I don't want to underrate the impact that Tias Jones

908
00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:50,239
and Desmond Bank can have on the offense. But all right,

909
00:39:50,239 --> 00:39:52,639
you've added two guys like Desmond Bain is the caps

910
00:39:52,679 --> 00:39:54,800
lock shooter. Tias Jones can shoot, but we don't know

911
00:39:54,800 --> 00:39:56,719
how much he's gonna play. And the more I thought

912
00:39:56,719 --> 00:39:59,280
about it, just like they need Jalen Suggs to be

913
00:39:59,400 --> 00:40:01,559
really really good on offense. And I'm not just talking

914
00:40:01,559 --> 00:40:04,679
about the three point shooting, which I think I don't

915
00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:06,599
want to say like it's guaranteed, but I think he's

916
00:40:06,599 --> 00:40:09,079
shown enough on the higher quality looks the past two years,

917
00:40:09,119 --> 00:40:11,519
even before he was injured this season, that I'm comfortable

918
00:40:11,559 --> 00:40:13,960
with it. But you mentioned the transition stuff before, like

919
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:17,320
it really felt like something changed in twenty twenty four

920
00:40:17,360 --> 00:40:19,440
a little bit where he was helping them with that.

921
00:40:19,840 --> 00:40:22,039
But then there's also just the decision making on drives

922
00:40:22,039 --> 00:40:23,960
of someone who could do that. And so the more

923
00:40:23,960 --> 00:40:26,800
I think about this team, like he feels I know

924
00:40:26,840 --> 00:40:29,440
he's he's paid pretty well now, but he just feels

925
00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:31,880
like this massive swing piece for how good they could

926
00:40:31,880 --> 00:40:34,400
be on the side of the floor they've struggled most.

927
00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:38,199
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm I'm with you there one hundred percent. You know,

928
00:40:38,199 --> 00:40:40,440
I think you look at his full season numbers last

929
00:40:40,480 --> 00:40:41,880
year and they don't look great, Like I think he

930
00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:44,360
shot ended up shooting like thirty one percent from three

931
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:48,440
or something like that. But if you look at his

932
00:40:48,519 --> 00:40:51,599
first five games before Paolo gets hurt, and so small

933
00:40:51,679 --> 00:40:54,079
small sample size here, So don't you know, like I

934
00:40:54,159 --> 00:40:57,280
fully acknowledge that he shot I think forty six or

935
00:40:57,320 --> 00:40:59,320
forty seven percent on catch and shoot threes on like

936
00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:02,239
six or seven attempts per game in those first five games.

937
00:41:02,239 --> 00:41:05,719
So again small, small, small sample, but to me, that

938
00:41:06,039 --> 00:41:07,920
was a continuation of what he did in twenty twenty four,

939
00:41:07,920 --> 00:41:10,000
where he shot forty two percent on like five or

940
00:41:10,039 --> 00:41:14,320
six catch and shoot threes. And so if you're like thinking, like, oh,

941
00:41:14,360 --> 00:41:17,119
the magically add at Desmond Bane as a shooter, I

942
00:41:17,159 --> 00:41:19,519
think moving. I think one of the problems the Magic

943
00:41:19,519 --> 00:41:21,679
have had in Jalen Suck's career is like they didn't

944
00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:23,679
know what his ideal offensive role was.

945
00:41:24,239 --> 00:41:25,400
Speaker 2: Obviously, you draft.

946
00:41:25,199 --> 00:41:28,239
Speaker 3: Him fifth, you think he's going to be your number

947
00:41:28,239 --> 00:41:30,519
one guy. Like when the Magic, you know, coming out Againstzaga,

948
00:41:30,519 --> 00:41:34,000
everyone thought this is a future like on ball, you know,

949
00:41:34,599 --> 00:41:38,280
star type player and the Magic obviously in a rebuild moment,

950
00:41:38,320 --> 00:41:40,119
they just gave him the ball and said go do

951
00:41:40,159 --> 00:41:43,719
your thing. And so he was I think a little

952
00:41:43,760 --> 00:41:47,719
overwhelmed being the lead guy, you know, having to handle

953
00:41:47,719 --> 00:41:50,760
the ball, handle the ball as the primary creator, primary playmaker,

954
00:41:51,119 --> 00:41:53,320
you know, just kind of recklessly going to the basket

955
00:41:53,360 --> 00:41:56,519
like he's he's a maniac on the floor on both ends.

956
00:41:57,440 --> 00:42:01,039
Speaker 2: That might be why he gets injured a lot. But

957
00:42:01,159 --> 00:42:02,480
he's all effort.

958
00:42:02,519 --> 00:42:05,000
Speaker 3: He's one hundred and ten percent and even that probably

959
00:42:05,039 --> 00:42:08,960
isn't enough to describe his effort. And so I think

960
00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:14,079
what I'm most interested in is, yes, the Magic want

961
00:42:14,119 --> 00:42:16,280
him to be a secondary creator and get out on

962
00:42:16,320 --> 00:42:18,960
the break and kind of lead them that way, but

963
00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:21,000
they don't need him to do that as much like

964
00:42:21,079 --> 00:42:24,719
he is the fourth option on offense. Like Desmond bin Is,

965
00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:27,760
you know, twenty point per game score, a pretty established guy,

966
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:31,920
he's theoretically the third option on offense. I'm really interested

967
00:42:31,920 --> 00:42:35,199
to see what Jalen Suggs does when he is not

968
00:42:35,719 --> 00:42:38,000
maybe not strictly a three and D type guy, but

969
00:42:38,119 --> 00:42:41,000
like the main diet of his offense are these catch

970
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:44,719
and shoot threes that over the last two you know,

971
00:42:45,239 --> 00:42:47,280
when the team has been healthy over the last two seasons,

972
00:42:47,320 --> 00:42:50,760
he's shown he's gonna knock them down at decent volume.

973
00:42:51,679 --> 00:42:55,239
And so I think I think the Suggs development is

974
00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:59,599
more they're evolving him into a place where like, yes,

975
00:42:59,599 --> 00:43:01,840
he can hack off the dribble and do all these things,

976
00:43:02,480 --> 00:43:05,840
but he doesn't have to. His his primary responsibility on

977
00:43:05,880 --> 00:43:09,039
offense is to space the floor and be a three

978
00:43:09,079 --> 00:43:11,920
point threat and when the time comes when the closeout

979
00:43:11,960 --> 00:43:14,760
comes to attack it, and then he'll get some of

980
00:43:14,760 --> 00:43:16,760
those reps obviously, like coming off the bench or with

981
00:43:16,800 --> 00:43:18,880
whatever group season when when the lineups broke, when the

982
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:21,800
lineup's broken up. But if the majority of his minutes

983
00:43:21,840 --> 00:43:25,119
are alongside Palo, Franz and Baine or you know, with

984
00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:29,119
even two of those, even two of those guys, he's

985
00:43:29,199 --> 00:43:30,800
going to be in a space where he's going to

986
00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:34,320
get better quality looks and the defense is going to

987
00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:36,280
be shifted away from him where maybe he can get

988
00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:38,159
better looks at the rim where he you know, he

989
00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:41,000
was decent in twenty twenty four, like last year, just

990
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:43,280
you know, he had to do so much last year,

991
00:43:43,400 --> 00:43:46,639
like once once Palo went out, his role changed, Once

992
00:43:46,920 --> 00:43:49,880
Franz went out, his role change, and he just isn't

993
00:43:49,920 --> 00:43:50,440
that player.

994
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:53,000
Speaker 2: He isn't a primary option guy, but.

995
00:43:53,000 --> 00:43:55,519
Speaker 3: As a fourth option guy who's the like the Magic

996
00:43:55,519 --> 00:43:57,280
describe him as the head of the snake on their defense,

997
00:43:57,320 --> 00:43:59,719
the guy that like really gives them energy on defense.

998
00:44:00,559 --> 00:44:03,320
Like I think that's that's gonna unlock him in a

999
00:44:03,360 --> 00:44:06,760
way that we haven't seen him unlocked because the magic,

1000
00:44:07,280 --> 00:44:09,280
the Magic needed too much for him or more than

1001
00:44:09,519 --> 00:44:11,119
he could give them on a winning team. Now, I

1002
00:44:11,119 --> 00:44:14,280
feel like he's in a role that is gonna really

1003
00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:16,599
emphasize his strengths and maybe cover up some of his

1004
00:44:16,679 --> 00:44:18,000
weaknesses a little bit on offense.

1005
00:44:18,480 --> 00:44:21,079
Speaker 1: This isn't a perfect comp because the team context is

1006
00:44:21,119 --> 00:44:23,679
so different in their different players, but this feels like

1007
00:44:23,840 --> 00:44:26,880
the Derek White going to Boston type bump season for

1008
00:44:27,079 --> 00:44:29,920
Jalen Suggs offensively is like what I could almost see

1009
00:44:29,920 --> 00:44:32,679
it being, and I probably would even consider predicting.

1010
00:44:33,639 --> 00:44:35,079
Speaker 2: Yeah, something to that effect.

1011
00:44:35,400 --> 00:44:38,840
Speaker 3: Uh I think, I think that's a fair way to describe,

1012
00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:40,519
you know, what we could see from from Sugs. Like

1013
00:44:40,559 --> 00:44:43,440
I'm I'm like, I'm glad that I'm not the I'm

1014
00:44:43,480 --> 00:44:45,679
not the only person that is like looking at Suggs's

1015
00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:48,320
numbers and being like this, there's something here, There's there's

1016
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:50,360
there's something that could develop and like, look at the

1017
00:44:50,440 --> 00:44:52,360
end of the day, like Suggs has to stay healthy

1018
00:44:52,440 --> 00:44:54,880
and that's the biggest thing he hasn't proven in his career,

1019
00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:58,840
Like he's been mostly injured for three of his four seasons,

1020
00:44:58,920 --> 00:45:03,800
and uh, I think the magic and this is not

1021
00:45:03,840 --> 00:45:06,920
their fault, but I think the Magic played off the

1022
00:45:06,960 --> 00:45:09,719
injury that he had as not as serious as it is,

1023
00:45:10,119 --> 00:45:14,480
at least publicly to the public. Like the troclia injury

1024
00:45:14,639 --> 00:45:17,159
is a very weird, little weird injury that he had,

1025
00:45:17,239 --> 00:45:20,519
the surgery that he had to repair, it is not

1026
00:45:20,760 --> 00:45:23,199
a small injury. He had a what's called a mosaic plasty,

1027
00:45:23,239 --> 00:45:26,760
which is like a it's not reconstructive, but they like

1028
00:45:27,599 --> 00:45:31,400
take they like take they take like muscle or cartilage,

1029
00:45:31,440 --> 00:45:34,840
and they like they literally like lay it down as

1030
00:45:34,840 --> 00:45:37,239
a mosaic to try and strengthen that knee. And so there,

1031
00:45:37,320 --> 00:45:40,519
I think there were some bigger concerns with that injury,

1032
00:45:40,679 --> 00:45:43,320
and it wasn't as like my like it's Initially they

1033
00:45:43,320 --> 00:45:44,960
made it sound like, oh, he's just getting a scope.

1034
00:45:44,960 --> 00:45:47,440
And I know, like every surgery, surgery, surgery, no matter what,

1035
00:45:47,559 --> 00:45:49,960
but a scope is as basic as a surgery gets

1036
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:53,480
for a knee. This was not that, Like he had

1037
00:45:53,480 --> 00:45:56,719
a pretty involved surgery. It sounds like he's gonna be

1038
00:45:56,719 --> 00:45:59,039
fine for training camp. You know, he's on the court.

1039
00:45:59,119 --> 00:46:01,320
They've shown photos of him working out on the court.

1040
00:46:01,320 --> 00:46:03,039
I don't know if he's playing or doing contact, But

1041
00:46:05,119 --> 00:46:07,760
it it that that the injury stuff is still the

1042
00:46:07,800 --> 00:46:10,360
biggest concern with him because he's had one healthy season

1043
00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:12,920
in four and it was a good season. You know,

1044
00:46:13,000 --> 00:46:15,679
Magic benefited a lot from it, but he's he's got

1045
00:46:15,800 --> 00:46:16,639
to prove that he can stay healthy.

1046
00:46:16,719 --> 00:46:18,239
Speaker 1: Do you think there's a chance they were just excited

1047
00:46:18,239 --> 00:46:20,159
it wasn't an oblique injury last year and.

1048
00:46:20,119 --> 00:46:23,440
Speaker 3: So they hundred percent one hundred percent. I think anytime

1049
00:46:23,519 --> 00:46:26,320
anybody twists, they hold their breath a little bit.

1050
00:46:27,039 --> 00:46:29,079
Speaker 1: Can we run through some of like the younger guys

1051
00:46:29,119 --> 00:46:30,960
on this team and just get either of your early impressions,

1052
00:46:31,039 --> 00:46:34,079
role expectations, what you'll be watching for whatever next season.

1053
00:46:35,000 --> 00:46:37,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know you mentioned like Jalen Suggs is a

1054
00:46:37,519 --> 00:46:39,960
big swing guy. I think Anthony Black's a huge swing

1055
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:43,199
guy for this team, and and it's someone that if

1056
00:46:43,239 --> 00:46:44,920
the Magic are gonna pet are going to compete for

1057
00:46:44,920 --> 00:46:47,840
a championship, Like I'm pretty certain what the magicer could

1058
00:46:47,840 --> 00:46:52,159
get from their starters. The bench concerns me a little

1059
00:46:52,199 --> 00:46:56,280
bit just because there is a lot of inexperience and

1060
00:46:56,360 --> 00:46:58,840
not a lot of offense. Like Tyas Jones is a

1061
00:46:58,840 --> 00:47:02,480
solid offensive player. Vagner, we're probably not gonna see him

1062
00:47:02,480 --> 00:47:05,119
till December coming back from the ACL and and that

1063
00:47:05,239 --> 00:47:07,880
and then that instance, like who knows how ready he's

1064
00:47:07,920 --> 00:47:11,880
gonna be. I think the magic, the Magic need to

1065
00:47:11,880 --> 00:47:14,119
figure out what Anthony Black is first and foremost, Like

1066
00:47:14,199 --> 00:47:19,480
obviously he's I think a really strong defender offensively, no

1067
00:47:19,559 --> 00:47:22,360
clue what he is, you know, Like, uh, the favorite

1068
00:47:22,400 --> 00:47:24,239
stat that I have with him is like in wins,

1069
00:47:24,800 --> 00:47:27,000
he averages like ten points in the thirty nine and

1070
00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:29,119
thirty nine wins. Last year he averaged ten points per

1071
00:47:29,159 --> 00:47:32,199
game and shot forty one percent from three.

1072
00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:34,519
Speaker 2: In thirty nine.

1073
00:47:34,360 --> 00:47:36,800
Speaker 3: Losses, he averaged like eight points per game and shot

1074
00:47:36,920 --> 00:47:40,159
twenty eight twenty nine percent from three. And so it's

1075
00:47:40,199 --> 00:47:44,239
like it's like like that's not like that's correlation, not causation,

1076
00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:47,920
but it it like kind of shows you the swing,

1077
00:47:48,039 --> 00:47:50,840
the wild swings in his game and and how good

1078
00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:52,159
he how good he can be, and how good the

1079
00:47:52,159 --> 00:47:55,119
Magic can be when he's that good, and how much

1080
00:47:55,119 --> 00:47:58,159
he can struggle, and how bad the Magic were when

1081
00:47:58,159 --> 00:48:00,519
he struggled. And obviously think the magic on him a

1082
00:48:00,559 --> 00:48:03,079
little bit more last year, they don't really know if

1083
00:48:03,079 --> 00:48:05,559
he's a point guard, you know, they don't really know

1084
00:48:05,599 --> 00:48:05,840
how to.

1085
00:48:05,880 --> 00:48:06,679
Speaker 2: Use him offensively.

1086
00:48:06,679 --> 00:48:10,079
Speaker 3: He fits their their identity defensively, but he's the next

1087
00:48:10,119 --> 00:48:12,480
big contract they have to worry about, Like he's extension

1088
00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:15,760
eligible next summer. I don't If you ask me, what

1089
00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:17,039
what do you pay Anthony Black?

1090
00:48:17,320 --> 00:48:18,920
Speaker 2: I I have no clue. I don't know what the

1091
00:48:18,960 --> 00:48:19,559
answer to that is.

1092
00:48:19,599 --> 00:48:23,039
Speaker 3: He's probably destined for the restricted free agency that all

1093
00:48:23,039 --> 00:48:24,840
these guys are going through right now, because you just

1094
00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:26,679
how do you know what he's worth at this point?

1095
00:48:27,719 --> 00:48:28,519
Speaker 2: And so I think he.

1096
00:48:30,079 --> 00:48:33,320
Speaker 3: Figuring out what his role is and how to make

1097
00:48:33,360 --> 00:48:36,920
the most of him. I think that's the swing between

1098
00:48:36,920 --> 00:48:38,880
the Magic being merely a very good team and being

1099
00:48:39,000 --> 00:48:40,880
a championship level team because now you have an extra

1100
00:48:40,920 --> 00:48:44,079
ball handler, you have another unique player, you know, maybe

1101
00:48:44,079 --> 00:48:46,400
you have someone that you can make someone else on

1102
00:48:46,440 --> 00:48:48,960
the roster expendable, h so you can help cut some

1103
00:48:49,039 --> 00:48:50,079
costs like that.

1104
00:48:50,079 --> 00:48:50,719
Speaker 2: That stuff.

1105
00:48:50,880 --> 00:48:53,559
Speaker 3: That's that's kind of the next big question. And the

1106
00:48:53,559 --> 00:48:54,760
other guy that I'm watching.

1107
00:48:54,559 --> 00:48:55,360
Speaker 2: Is Tristan de Silva.

1108
00:48:55,599 --> 00:48:59,360
Speaker 1: I think I was like what I was like, Oh

1109
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:00,960
my god, I didn't really they have no wings depth

1110
00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:01,599
on the s.

1111
00:49:01,960 --> 00:49:02,519
Speaker 2: The Silva is.

1112
00:49:02,519 --> 00:49:05,559
Speaker 3: Gonna play like and like look, he stepped in in

1113
00:49:05,599 --> 00:49:07,800
a big moment early in his rookie season last year.

1114
00:49:08,239 --> 00:49:09,360
Speaker 2: Maybe hit the rookie wall.

1115
00:49:09,519 --> 00:49:11,760
Speaker 3: Maybe he wasn't you know, maybe he was too passive

1116
00:49:11,920 --> 00:49:13,920
and too much trying to fill in gaps for what

1117
00:49:13,960 --> 00:49:17,760
the Magic needed considering other injuries. The Magic need him

1118
00:49:17,760 --> 00:49:21,000
to be a reliable three point shooter and like unlike

1119
00:49:21,039 --> 00:49:24,000
Franz Tristan shooting very well in in the EuroBasket prep

1120
00:49:24,039 --> 00:49:25,719
games like he is, he is playing pretty well for

1121
00:49:25,800 --> 00:49:28,760
Germany out playing for Germany as they prep for EuroBasket.

1122
00:49:29,880 --> 00:49:31,760
They need him to be a reliable kind of three

1123
00:49:31,760 --> 00:49:33,559
and D just traditional three and D guy, just like

1124
00:49:33,599 --> 00:49:33,880
you're not.

1125
00:49:33,960 --> 00:49:35,400
Speaker 2: We don't want you to drive, We don't need you

1126
00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:36,280
to do anything crazy.

1127
00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:39,239
Speaker 3: Attack when it's open, shoot when it's open, keep the

1128
00:49:39,239 --> 00:49:41,239
ball moving, just you know, kind of stay out of

1129
00:49:41,239 --> 00:49:41,840
the way a little bit.

1130
00:49:41,880 --> 00:49:43,199
Speaker 2: But that's something he can do.

1131
00:49:43,280 --> 00:49:44,960
Speaker 3: That's why they drafted him, and so they need to

1132
00:49:45,000 --> 00:49:46,599
kind of show that that these draft picks are going

1133
00:49:46,639 --> 00:49:49,159
to pay pay off, because like, we're not gonna talk

1134
00:49:49,159 --> 00:49:51,880
about Jed Howard because they don't think he's unless he

1135
00:49:51,960 --> 00:49:55,280
suddenly starts shooting the shooting the cover off the ball

1136
00:49:55,320 --> 00:49:57,000
and holds his own on defense.

1137
00:49:57,199 --> 00:49:58,119
Speaker 2: He's just not some of the magic.

1138
00:49:58,159 --> 00:49:59,480
Speaker 1: I don't think he's ever going to hold his own

1139
00:49:59,480 --> 00:49:59,960
on defense.

1140
00:50:00,400 --> 00:50:01,119
Speaker 2: I don't think so either.

1141
00:50:01,159 --> 00:50:03,360
Speaker 3: I I that's why I took him off my board

1142
00:50:03,360 --> 00:50:05,159
and was shocked when the magic took him.

1143
00:50:05,480 --> 00:50:08,159
Speaker 1: My favorite Anthony Black stat is that he is shooting

1144
00:50:08,280 --> 00:50:10,320
over forty percent on corner threes for his career on

1145
00:50:10,320 --> 00:50:12,639
like one hundred and twenty something attempts or whatever outside

1146
00:50:12,679 --> 00:50:15,320
of the cleaning glasses on garbage time. Is that like

1147
00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:18,159
a possible? It was just like, because you mentioned they

1148
00:50:18,159 --> 00:50:20,440
have these other ball handlers, can they just streamline his offensive?

1149
00:50:20,440 --> 00:50:21,840
World'll be like hey, like if you got a fan

1150
00:50:21,880 --> 00:50:23,880
out in the corner and he moves pretty well off

1151
00:50:23,880 --> 00:50:26,639
the ball, like his defensive floor navigation, if you want

1152
00:50:26,639 --> 00:50:30,480
to watch someone on defense, like whether they're guarding the

1153
00:50:30,480 --> 00:50:32,639
ball or not, like he is one of those players,

1154
00:50:32,639 --> 00:50:35,679
like he will run through a gauntlet of bodies and angles.

1155
00:50:35,719 --> 00:50:36,480
It's insane.

1156
00:50:37,199 --> 00:50:39,920
Speaker 3: It's just finding a way to have him consistently contribute

1157
00:50:39,960 --> 00:50:42,440
on offense and not be such a negative and like

1158
00:50:42,480 --> 00:50:44,280
again like some of that, Like I.

1159
00:50:44,039 --> 00:50:46,840
Speaker 2: I like Aby is the sweetest.

1160
00:50:46,480 --> 00:50:49,440
Speaker 1: Kid, and he looks like a kid. He looks like

1161
00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:49,719
a kid.

1162
00:50:49,800 --> 00:50:51,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, he's said me.

1163
00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:54,119
Speaker 3: And one of the other reporters actually adopted him. He's

1164
00:50:54,119 --> 00:51:00,039
a child. But uh, he's I sometimes think he he

1165
00:51:00,039 --> 00:51:02,920
doesn't understand how good he is, and like like like

1166
00:51:03,000 --> 00:51:05,519
he's just like this very quiet, like I don't want

1167
00:51:05,559 --> 00:51:07,320
to say shy, he's this very quiet kid. And even

1168
00:51:07,360 --> 00:51:09,079
in a group of young guys, like he still feels

1169
00:51:09,079 --> 00:51:09,840
like he's the rookie.

1170
00:51:10,519 --> 00:51:11,440
Speaker 2: And so it's just like.

1171
00:51:11,400 --> 00:51:14,679
Speaker 3: How do you get him to understand, like, this is

1172
00:51:14,679 --> 00:51:15,480
what I'm good at.

1173
00:51:15,599 --> 00:51:17,760
Speaker 2: Im I can do these things. I am good enough

1174
00:51:17,760 --> 00:51:18,440
to do these things.

1175
00:51:18,960 --> 00:51:22,280
Speaker 3: And again, like you're drafting eighteen nineteen year olds, it

1176
00:51:22,400 --> 00:51:24,079
may you know, you don't want to give up on.

1177
00:51:24,039 --> 00:51:27,079
Speaker 2: Them too soon. So yeah, like getting a b in

1178
00:51:27,079 --> 00:51:27,480
the corner.

1179
00:51:27,519 --> 00:51:30,920
Speaker 3: Like again another area where having like Pallo and Franz

1180
00:51:31,039 --> 00:51:33,760
sucking an attention, another guy, you know, getting some attention.

1181
00:51:34,440 --> 00:51:37,320
Uh you know, it's all about you know, having better

1182
00:51:37,400 --> 00:51:41,360
players helps you get easier shots. And so like if

1183
00:51:41,360 --> 00:51:43,360
you can get him open threes in the corner, especially

1184
00:51:43,400 --> 00:51:45,960
like he's a reliable shooter and and he'll he'll hit

1185
00:51:46,000 --> 00:51:46,440
them more.

1186
00:51:46,280 --> 00:51:46,800
Speaker 2: Than you think.

1187
00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:49,719
Speaker 1: Do you have any none of us expect him to

1188
00:51:49,719 --> 00:51:51,719
play a huge role next season. But any early impressions

1189
00:51:51,760 --> 00:51:54,760
of Jace Richardson after watching him in Summer League.

1190
00:51:55,320 --> 00:52:00,440
Speaker 3: He's he's you know, he's small, which hurts him, but

1191
00:52:00,519 --> 00:52:03,719
he's feisty, like he like he is very much like

1192
00:52:03,719 --> 00:52:05,519
if the Magic we're gonna draft someone who's maybe a

1193
00:52:05,559 --> 00:52:08,800
little undersized, He's the kind of guy they would draft

1194
00:52:08,840 --> 00:52:09,280
like he is.

1195
00:52:09,599 --> 00:52:10,920
Speaker 2: He's fearless, you know.

1196
00:52:10,920 --> 00:52:13,360
Speaker 3: I know he was really strong at finishing at the

1197
00:52:13,400 --> 00:52:16,199
rim at Michigan State and not carried over into Summer League,

1198
00:52:16,199 --> 00:52:19,400
which was really encouraging to see. He'll fight on defense

1199
00:52:19,480 --> 00:52:21,239
and like that's half the battle is just are you

1200
00:52:21,280 --> 00:52:22,639
gonna put in the effort defensively?

1201
00:52:23,679 --> 00:52:25,199
Speaker 2: I don't know how much you'll play Like.

1202
00:52:25,239 --> 00:52:27,800
Speaker 3: They'll be injuries. There are always injuries during the course season.

1203
00:52:27,800 --> 00:52:30,679
Do I think Jalen Sugg is gonna play eighty two games? No, Like,

1204
00:52:30,719 --> 00:52:33,280
you'll probably still miss ten fifteen games over the course

1205
00:52:33,320 --> 00:52:36,039
of a season just because of bumps and bruises or

1206
00:52:36,039 --> 00:52:38,679
the Magic trying to protect him. Like we have we

1207
00:52:38,679 --> 00:52:40,760
have a running joke among mat I have a running

1208
00:52:40,840 --> 00:52:43,039
joke among with Magic fans know there's a running joke

1209
00:52:43,079 --> 00:52:46,159
among Magic fans. If Jonathan Isaac has a hangnail, he's

1210
00:52:46,199 --> 00:52:49,320
out for the next month. Jalen Suggs could have a

1211
00:52:49,360 --> 00:52:52,599
shoulder detached, three fingers falling off his knees.

1212
00:52:53,199 --> 00:52:54,679
Speaker 2: He's be replaced. He's back.

1213
00:52:54,760 --> 00:52:56,440
Speaker 3: He's back at he rubbed some dirt on him. He's

1214
00:52:56,440 --> 00:52:57,920
back in the game, like that dude. That dude is

1215
00:52:57,920 --> 00:53:00,280
held together with Duck two with a duck tape and

1216
00:53:00,360 --> 00:53:01,880
super blue.

1217
00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:03,480
Speaker 2: But like, like, look, the.

1218
00:53:03,440 --> 00:53:06,119
Speaker 3: Magic are the Magic are hoping to play an extra

1219
00:53:06,159 --> 00:53:08,400
month of basketball, so if they need to preserve him

1220
00:53:08,440 --> 00:53:10,199
in some way, they need to make sure they have

1221
00:53:10,239 --> 00:53:13,400
a plan to do so. So, like Jase, I think

1222
00:53:13,400 --> 00:53:16,480
we'll get some opportunity. The shooting looked like it'll translate.

1223
00:53:16,559 --> 00:53:18,880
Like he's looked pretty comfortable at the NB three point line.

1224
00:53:19,519 --> 00:53:21,800
He just seems like very he seems very very fearless,

1225
00:53:21,800 --> 00:53:24,039
which I think is is very very good. The guy

1226
00:53:24,079 --> 00:53:26,280
that I'm actually really more interested in seeing if he

1227
00:53:26,320 --> 00:53:29,679
can get playing time is no Appenda. I think like

1228
00:53:29,760 --> 00:53:33,199
Penda's not ready, Like he's still really really young and raw,

1229
00:53:33,920 --> 00:53:36,960
but the tools for him to be this like point

1230
00:53:37,000 --> 00:53:41,519
forward type guy and this like versatile inside out type

1231
00:53:41,519 --> 00:53:44,239
forward like he does. He does look a lot like

1232
00:53:44,360 --> 00:53:46,039
you know, play a lot like Boris Diaallett.

1233
00:53:46,039 --> 00:53:49,280
Speaker 2: At his best, He's he.

1234
00:53:48,960 --> 00:53:51,920
Speaker 3: He could be like when the Magic drafted him, it

1235
00:53:51,960 --> 00:53:54,039
was like it felt like, Okay, this is the kind

1236
00:53:54,039 --> 00:53:56,360
of player that you know. Makes Jonathan Isaac and his

1237
00:53:56,519 --> 00:53:58,440
fourteen and a half million dollars a little bit more

1238
00:53:58,440 --> 00:54:01,119
expendable if you're looking to cut caught somewhere, because you know,

1239
00:54:01,159 --> 00:54:02,840
fourteen a half million dollars for a guy that's playing

1240
00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:05,079
fifteen minutes a game, probably not the best use of

1241
00:54:05,119 --> 00:54:08,199
your resources if you're in look. I think we'll see

1242
00:54:08,199 --> 00:54:10,840
what Jai does this year, but Penda does a lot

1243
00:54:10,880 --> 00:54:12,079
of good things defensively.

1244
00:54:12,159 --> 00:54:14,000
Speaker 2: He needs a little bit more seasoning, but.

1245
00:54:14,480 --> 00:54:16,599
Speaker 3: That's a prospect that I'll be very interest to see

1246
00:54:16,639 --> 00:54:19,079
what happens when he when he gets an opportunity, inevitably

1247
00:54:19,119 --> 00:54:19,800
during the season.

1248
00:54:20,400 --> 00:54:23,039
Speaker 1: With Richardson and I think if you're small, then you

1249
00:54:23,239 --> 00:54:25,719
use the word fearless, which is perfect. You always have

1250
00:54:25,760 --> 00:54:27,400
to have a level of skill of getting your shot

1251
00:54:27,440 --> 00:54:29,519
off if you're going to get into the paint. I

1252
00:54:29,559 --> 00:54:31,239
came away from Summer League because I just don't have

1253
00:54:31,280 --> 00:54:33,000
a lot of priors on these guys, except for the

1254
00:54:33,039 --> 00:54:35,400
top guys when they're coming out of the draft. The

1255
00:54:35,400 --> 00:54:36,920
way he's able to get into the paint and get

1256
00:54:36,920 --> 00:54:40,199
his shots up over the trees is just was insane.

1257
00:54:40,239 --> 00:54:42,239
And so I always want to temper expectations for someone

1258
00:54:42,280 --> 00:54:44,559
who's listened. And six foot was drafted. It was a

1259
00:54:44,639 --> 00:54:47,000
twenty fifth, but my god, And then you mentioned like

1260
00:54:47,039 --> 00:54:49,199
the defensive field, like, okay, the three point shot cool,

1261
00:54:49,239 --> 00:54:51,840
but the defensive intensity is is bonkers too. So I'm

1262
00:54:51,840 --> 00:54:55,920
excited to see him. The thing you mentioned a couple

1263
00:54:55,960 --> 00:54:58,840
of times now there is their depth, and we talked

1264
00:54:58,840 --> 00:55:01,719
about with the wings, is there chance that they or

1265
00:55:01,760 --> 00:55:03,079
not even a chance, but do you expect them to

1266
00:55:03,119 --> 00:55:04,760
need to make something, not a huge move, but some

1267
00:55:04,800 --> 00:55:06,519
type of a move to address it, because it's not

1268
00:55:06,639 --> 00:55:09,320
just oh, look at the lack of wing depth, it's

1269
00:55:09,559 --> 00:55:11,280
they're kind of they have a bunch of bigs, but

1270
00:55:11,320 --> 00:55:14,239
they might be super fragile up front. With Jonathan Isaac

1271
00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:16,719
Wendell Carter junior, like he played in sixty eight games

1272
00:55:16,760 --> 00:55:18,960
last year, it felt like a revelation for them and

1273
00:55:19,079 --> 00:55:21,519
I was like, high, yeah, oh wasn't okay.

1274
00:55:21,840 --> 00:55:25,400
Speaker 3: High he played he played the most games consecutively in

1275
00:55:25,480 --> 00:55:29,440
his career. Last year, he like the same game that

1276
00:55:29,519 --> 00:55:31,679
Pallo got hurt, he had a knee issue and like

1277
00:55:32,239 --> 00:55:35,199
he missed the Cleveland game, came back against Dallas, re hurt,

1278
00:55:35,199 --> 00:55:37,320
his knee missed two weeks. He played the rest of

1279
00:55:37,320 --> 00:55:39,400
the season, no problem. It was a it was a miracle.

1280
00:55:39,440 --> 00:55:41,599
He couldn't shoot, you know, like struggle on offense like

1281
00:55:41,599 --> 00:55:43,119
everyone else did that.

1282
00:55:43,199 --> 00:55:44,679
Speaker 2: It was a miracle that he played the whole season.

1283
00:55:45,920 --> 00:55:47,599
Speaker 1: So do you think that that's something that they're gonna

1284
00:55:47,679 --> 00:55:49,760
have to or yeah, I would even use the word

1285
00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:51,320
have to where they're gonna have to look at Oh,

1286
00:55:51,320 --> 00:55:53,440
do we have to make some type of someone who's

1287
00:55:53,480 --> 00:55:55,719
durable and we know can log a certain type of

1288
00:55:55,719 --> 00:55:57,840
minutes Maybe not just even if it's just to eat

1289
00:55:57,960 --> 00:56:01,239
regular season innings, or is it we want someone that's

1290
00:56:01,239 --> 00:56:03,239
part of the playoff because they have a lot of guys.

1291
00:56:03,239 --> 00:56:05,639
But I think you said this before, it's they're entering

1292
00:56:05,840 --> 00:56:07,559
they have a lot of younger guys, and so though

1293
00:56:07,679 --> 00:56:12,199
they are by nature mysterious, mystery boxes, wildcards, whatever you

1294
00:56:12,239 --> 00:56:14,440
want to call them, and you're now entering this weird

1295
00:56:14,480 --> 00:56:17,840
window where I think we've seen contenders, which I would

1296
00:56:17,840 --> 00:56:20,679
classify the Magic as struggle with this time and again

1297
00:56:20,719 --> 00:56:24,400
of well, how do you balance player development of key

1298
00:56:24,599 --> 00:56:27,679
youngsters versus well, we have immediate expectations. Now, what's our

1299
00:56:27,719 --> 00:56:31,440
stomach for going through these learning curves, these growing pains.

1300
00:56:32,280 --> 00:56:34,639
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's I think it's a little bit

1301
00:56:34,719 --> 00:56:37,559
of we'll see where they're at in February. Like if

1302
00:56:37,639 --> 00:56:41,679
they're if they're like the three seed half game behind

1303
00:56:41,719 --> 00:56:43,800
New York for two, you know, game and a half,

1304
00:56:43,840 --> 00:56:46,840
two games back of Cleveland, and they're like looking at

1305
00:56:46,880 --> 00:56:49,639
themselves and like we're we're good enough now, Like there's

1306
00:56:49,719 --> 00:56:52,320
there's no we can't there's no waiting for next year,

1307
00:56:52,400 --> 00:56:54,960
Like we need to go for this now, or we're

1308
00:56:54,960 --> 00:56:57,719
not getting enough from you know, we're not getting enough

1309
00:56:58,079 --> 00:57:00,599
from Tristan to Silva. We need to fill that role,

1310
00:57:00,599 --> 00:57:02,079
Like we're not gonna win in the playoffs. We're not

1311
00:57:02,119 --> 00:57:03,199
going to go as far as we want in the

1312
00:57:03,199 --> 00:57:05,760
playoffs if we don't fill this role. We'll figure out

1313
00:57:05,760 --> 00:57:09,719
the financial stuff afterward. And again by then, like they'll

1314
00:57:09,719 --> 00:57:11,599
have some guys that are expendable, to be perfectly honest,

1315
00:57:11,679 --> 00:57:14,519
but if you know, by February, like no vager will

1316
00:57:14,519 --> 00:57:16,880
be healthy back in the rotation. If he looks good,

1317
00:57:17,440 --> 00:57:20,039
go Gebatadze at seven and a half million dollars or

1318
00:57:20,079 --> 00:57:22,760
eight million dollars, whatever he is, that's a movable trade

1319
00:57:22,800 --> 00:57:25,000
chip to get something of value, and a team would

1320
00:57:25,039 --> 00:57:26,840
take him and make him their backup center or their

1321
00:57:26,880 --> 00:57:29,519
starting center, which he's he's certainly earned, Like he's a luxury,

1322
00:57:30,239 --> 00:57:33,119
you know. Again, Like Jonathan Isaac, his contract is weird.

1323
00:57:33,159 --> 00:57:36,000
He's fourteen and a half million dollars, but he's he's

1324
00:57:36,039 --> 00:57:40,039
got he's got two years left, but he's he's got

1325
00:57:40,119 --> 00:57:43,719
three years left including this one. But each year is

1326
00:57:44,239 --> 00:57:46,800
only becomes guaranteed after he plays I think fifty two games,

1327
00:57:47,800 --> 00:57:51,679
so he's quasi non guaranteed, depending on how how things

1328
00:57:51,719 --> 00:57:54,320
go with his health. But like like I said, like

1329
00:57:54,840 --> 00:57:58,079
if you know, no, appenda looks better than you think,

1330
00:57:58,239 --> 00:58:00,480
now you know, maybe maybe that's the time to move them.

1331
00:58:00,480 --> 00:58:02,360
So they got they got some pieces that they can

1332
00:58:02,400 --> 00:58:06,519
still move around. Whether they do so, I think depends

1333
00:58:06,559 --> 00:58:09,119
on how ready they are. Like like, if you ask

1334
00:58:09,239 --> 00:58:11,360
me what my prediction for the season is, is like, well,

1335
00:58:11,760 --> 00:58:14,119
the match could be good enough to get home court advantage,

1336
00:58:14,159 --> 00:58:16,480
they'll you know, fight for they'll they'll probably be around

1337
00:58:16,480 --> 00:58:18,679
fifty went well, I think we're getting to that later,

1338
00:58:18,760 --> 00:58:21,039
but they're probably they're gonna be around the fifty win mark.

1339
00:58:21,079 --> 00:58:22,760
They're gonna get to the second round of the playoffs,

1340
00:58:22,760 --> 00:58:24,760
and they're gonna use this season to figure out, Okay,

1341
00:58:24,760 --> 00:58:27,079
like how close are we like, are like we pushed

1342
00:58:27,079 --> 00:58:30,000
all these chips in, are we going in the right direction?

1343
00:58:30,159 --> 00:58:33,079
Where where are our holes so that we can get

1344
00:58:33,320 --> 00:58:35,119
get over the hump and get to that next step.

1345
00:58:35,360 --> 00:58:37,199
But if we get to February and they're sitting like,

1346
00:58:37,280 --> 00:58:38,440
let's say they're sitting in the one seed.

1347
00:58:38,480 --> 00:58:40,679
Speaker 2: I don't think that's so crazy to say.

1348
00:58:40,760 --> 00:58:43,440
Speaker 3: It's it's it's it's not you know, it's not likely,

1349
00:58:43,480 --> 00:58:45,719
but it's not super crazy. If they're sitting in the

1350
00:58:45,719 --> 00:58:48,320
one seed and they're like, well, we need this to

1351
00:58:48,360 --> 00:58:50,480
beat Oklahoma City, we need this to beat Denver, we

1352
00:58:50,519 --> 00:58:53,639
need this to beat Houston, then they need.

1353
00:58:53,559 --> 00:58:55,760
Speaker 2: To go for it. Like so it's it's hard, Like

1354
00:58:56,039 --> 00:58:57,239
it's hard to predict.

1355
00:58:56,920 --> 00:58:58,880
Speaker 3: The trade deadline now, like we can see like the

1356
00:58:58,920 --> 00:59:04,159
contours of something as we're sitting here, but what they

1357
00:59:04,199 --> 00:59:06,679
ultimately go for and what they ultimately need that has

1358
00:59:06,679 --> 00:59:08,000
to play out on the court, because like, at the

1359
00:59:08,039 --> 00:59:09,679
end of the day, we don't know how this group

1360
00:59:09,760 --> 00:59:10,480
is going to work together.

1361
00:59:10,480 --> 00:59:11,840
Speaker 2: We don't know if these things are going to work

1362
00:59:11,840 --> 00:59:12,239
the way.

1363
00:59:12,119 --> 00:59:14,960
Speaker 3: We think they are, and how they adjust from there

1364
00:59:15,039 --> 00:59:17,400
is going to be gonna be the question that will

1365
00:59:17,440 --> 00:59:18,960
answer as the season goes on.

1366
00:59:19,800 --> 00:59:21,719
Speaker 1: This I think is I don't know if it's easier

1367
00:59:21,719 --> 00:59:24,360
to answer, but it's worth asking now because their payroll

1368
00:59:24,400 --> 00:59:27,199
situation is just kind of funny because Jet Howard is

1369
00:59:27,280 --> 00:59:29,639
almost the perfect salary to get them out of the tax,

1370
00:59:29,719 --> 00:59:31,800
you do have to fill that roster spot. I do

1371
00:59:31,960 --> 00:59:33,920
view them as a team that is not going to

1372
00:59:33,960 --> 00:59:36,280
pay the tax because why start the repeater clock when

1373
00:59:36,320 --> 00:59:39,719
you're about to get so expensive knowing that Jet Howard

1374
00:59:39,719 --> 00:59:42,400
alone doesn't get you out of it. Like, what would

1375
00:59:42,400 --> 00:59:44,159
be a player I know you mentioned the weirdness of

1376
00:59:44,239 --> 00:59:47,039
Jonathan Isaac's contract, is it does Mo Wagner come back

1377
00:59:47,079 --> 00:59:50,079
and you feel like Gogo Batadz is expendable. What's one

1378
00:59:50,199 --> 00:59:52,000
or two players that you're looking at and say, Okay,

1379
00:59:52,000 --> 00:59:54,880
they might be on salary dump watch entering this season.

1380
00:59:55,320 --> 00:59:58,159
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean Jet Howard's obviously the obvious one because

1381
00:59:58,360 --> 01:00:00,599
like you could, someone's gonna take a second draft flyer

1382
01:00:00,639 --> 01:00:03,079
on him, like like you know young player.

1383
01:00:03,159 --> 01:00:04,719
Speaker 1: Orleans will do it, and then they'll trade him to

1384
01:00:04,719 --> 01:00:06,159
get out of the tax next year.

1385
01:00:06,159 --> 01:00:11,280
Speaker 3: Probably yeah, exactly exactly, Like go like Goga Batazze, like

1386
01:00:12,440 --> 01:00:14,679
he feels like a luxury, Like, I don't know if

1387
01:00:14,719 --> 01:00:16,119
that gets them completely under the tax.

1388
01:00:16,159 --> 01:00:20,519
Speaker 1: He's yeah, he's over eight yeah, yeah, and it's and

1389
01:00:20,559 --> 01:00:23,480
it's de escalating, so it's it's frontloaded as a frontloaded deal,

1390
01:00:24,079 --> 01:00:24,920
which is the well one.

1391
01:00:24,840 --> 01:00:28,880
Speaker 3: Special he he just feels like a luxury, Like that

1392
01:00:28,920 --> 01:00:32,960
guy should be in an NBA rotation and on this

1393
01:00:33,079 --> 01:00:33,639
Magic team.

1394
01:00:33,719 --> 01:00:34,320
Speaker 2: He's just not.

1395
01:00:34,679 --> 01:00:38,719
Speaker 3: Like you know, they they have a emergency third center

1396
01:00:38,719 --> 01:00:42,000
and a two way contract in Orlando Robinson. But you know,

1397
01:00:42,440 --> 01:00:45,840
for the first time ever, the Magic could probably trade someone,

1398
01:00:46,000 --> 01:00:48,159
keep an open they have an open roster spot, and

1399
01:00:48,320 --> 01:00:50,599
go go into the mercenary market and find someone on

1400
01:00:50,599 --> 01:00:52,320
the buyout market at the at the end of the year.

1401
01:00:53,079 --> 01:00:55,119
So like if you traded gogabataz and you still need

1402
01:00:55,119 --> 01:00:59,199
a third center, someone's going to wriggle free. Is that

1403
01:00:59,239 --> 01:01:01,679
when they bring to Cole Probably.

1404
01:01:01,320 --> 01:01:06,519
Speaker 4: Not, but but but but but I fans have asked

1405
01:01:06,559 --> 01:01:11,079
fans have asked me about him, and I'm just like, no, stop, Yeah,

1406
01:01:11,320 --> 01:01:13,920
I'm I'm a guy, is my guy.

1407
01:01:15,280 --> 01:01:16,360
Speaker 2: No, he's.

1408
01:01:17,920 --> 01:01:20,159
Speaker 1: He's still he's still giving back to a franchise.

1409
01:01:20,360 --> 01:01:23,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly, exactly the Bulls. The Bulls are just the

1410
01:01:23,039 --> 01:01:27,960
franchise that keeps on giving. But like go like but

1411
01:01:28,119 --> 01:01:31,760
TODs feels like that guy. He's a position of need

1412
01:01:31,880 --> 01:01:34,000
around the league. So like you could even have two

1413
01:01:34,079 --> 01:01:37,400
contenders make a trade like that, where you know a

1414
01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:39,440
team that's trying to buy, you know, like I always

1415
01:01:39,440 --> 01:01:41,960
say the trade deadlines about buyers and sellers, like you

1416
01:01:42,000 --> 01:01:44,440
know that you're you're not typically gonna find two teams

1417
01:01:44,440 --> 01:01:46,800
that are gonna do something mutual because it's becomes mutually

1418
01:01:46,920 --> 01:01:49,719
sure destruction. If I'm helping you and we meet in

1419
01:01:49,719 --> 01:01:51,679
the playoffs, you're gonna you're gonna hurt me with that.

1420
01:01:53,920 --> 01:01:55,719
But like go go a Toadzi is the kind of

1421
01:01:55,719 --> 01:01:58,280
player that, like, you know, this is the low hanging

1422
01:01:58,320 --> 01:02:00,760
fruit on that end. But like the Lakers need bigs,

1423
01:02:00,800 --> 01:02:03,639
they need centers, not that they have any wings or

1424
01:02:03,639 --> 01:02:06,199
guards that the Magic want, which is probably what keptaz

1425
01:02:06,280 --> 01:02:09,480
trade from happening this summer. But like you can make,

1426
01:02:09,519 --> 01:02:11,639
you can find a way to make something happen and

1427
01:02:11,880 --> 01:02:15,239
probably get to playoff level teams that that accomplish what

1428
01:02:15,239 --> 01:02:17,000
they want to accomplish that way.

1429
01:02:17,039 --> 01:02:18,079
Speaker 2: So it feels like.

1430
01:02:19,719 --> 01:02:22,159
Speaker 3: I'm still shocked that Pataz signed the contract that he

1431
01:02:22,199 --> 01:02:24,599
did because, like to me, he was already a rotation

1432
01:02:24,679 --> 01:02:27,039
level big and the Magic did not have a rotation

1433
01:02:27,159 --> 01:02:31,320
spot for him. But that feels like the move to

1434
01:02:31,440 --> 01:02:33,679
make if you're looking to do something at the dumbing

1435
01:02:33,960 --> 01:02:35,440
this one are looking to get under the tax.

1436
01:02:35,599 --> 01:02:37,360
Speaker 1: This will be the second team with the first one

1437
01:02:37,400 --> 01:02:40,280
being the Knicks that I've campaigned to trade for this player.

1438
01:02:41,239 --> 01:02:45,119
A Goga Batadze for Justin Champagni deal with Washington makes

1439
01:02:45,159 --> 01:02:48,440
a ton of sense. Washington could use additional They have

1440
01:02:48,519 --> 01:02:51,840
Trician Vukevich in addition to Marvin Back excuse me, addition

1441
01:02:51,880 --> 01:02:54,400
to Alex Sar But oh, go ahead, where are you

1442
01:02:54,400 --> 01:02:54,760
gonna say?

1443
01:02:54,760 --> 01:02:58,519
Speaker 3: I think the Magic just acquired Julian Champenne's G League

1444
01:02:58,559 --> 01:02:59,159
return rights.

1445
01:03:00,840 --> 01:03:01,760
Speaker 2: Oh what.

1446
01:03:03,679 --> 01:03:06,440
Speaker 1: His brother, right, Justin Champagnie is on the They just

1447
01:03:07,039 --> 01:03:09,679
uh Julian, Yeah, I know who Julian Champagne is. On

1448
01:03:09,719 --> 01:03:10,199
the spurs.

1449
01:03:11,480 --> 01:03:14,760
Speaker 2: Uh they they were they acquired someone's Geleague returns the right.

1450
01:03:14,760 --> 01:03:16,199
Maybe I have that wrong. I don't.

1451
01:03:16,239 --> 01:03:18,000
Speaker 3: I don't follow the Osteolo Magic as closely as I

1452
01:03:18,000 --> 01:03:18,960
should perhaps, but.

1453
01:03:19,800 --> 01:03:21,559
Speaker 1: Yeah, but something like a trade like that where it

1454
01:03:21,599 --> 01:03:24,079
cuts payroll and if you hit someone you very rarely

1455
01:03:24,079 --> 01:03:26,039
see like the big for wing trades. But like Washington

1456
01:03:26,119 --> 01:03:27,440
might be a team where that would.

1457
01:03:27,280 --> 01:03:31,079
Speaker 3: Be but like yeah, yeah, and Washington's uh seller obviously

1458
01:03:31,119 --> 01:03:33,320
not not so much a buyer, and they just have quietly.

1459
01:03:33,480 --> 01:03:34,800
Speaker 1: I mean, the Hornets would make a lot of sense,

1460
01:03:34,840 --> 01:03:37,840
but they don't have anybody who's cheap that I mean

1461
01:03:38,039 --> 01:03:39,800
if they were going to give you Liam McNeely, but

1462
01:03:39,800 --> 01:03:42,719
they won't. They don't have anyone who's cheap who should

1463
01:03:42,760 --> 01:03:45,760
interest the Magic, and just Washington still has all this

1464
01:03:45,840 --> 01:03:47,400
flexibility underneath.

1465
01:03:47,119 --> 01:03:48,760
Speaker 3: And the Magic and the Magic still have an open

1466
01:03:48,880 --> 01:03:53,000
roster spot because they're one point three million dollars under

1467
01:03:53,039 --> 01:03:56,519
the first Apron hard cap and they can't they so

1468
01:03:56,559 --> 01:03:59,039
they obviously they can't sign anybody because I would minimum

1469
01:03:59,079 --> 01:04:00,800
contract would exceed the hard cap.

1470
01:04:01,239 --> 01:04:03,280
Speaker 2: So like they'll I think the Magic will be a

1471
01:04:03,280 --> 01:04:04,280
player in the buy art market.

1472
01:04:04,320 --> 01:04:06,960
Speaker 3: I think they'll they'll they'll probably look to supplement themselves

1473
01:04:06,960 --> 01:04:09,320
a little bit there. Like I've I've seen some people

1474
01:04:09,360 --> 01:04:12,039
pitch like, oh, when Washington buys out Chris Middleton, like

1475
01:04:12,079 --> 01:04:13,400
that's that's who the Magic bring in.

1476
01:04:13,440 --> 01:04:15,159
Speaker 2: I'm just like, uh, it's just.

1477
01:04:15,159 --> 01:04:18,039
Speaker 1: Not a playoff killer. But that's just like another.

1478
01:04:17,920 --> 01:04:19,480
Speaker 2: A crazy idea but not.

1479
01:04:19,920 --> 01:04:22,199
Speaker 3: But like you feel like if you stick Chris Middleton

1480
01:04:22,239 --> 01:04:25,079
where Tristan de Silva is, that's not going to kill

1481
01:04:25,079 --> 01:04:27,320
you as much as like relying on him to be

1482
01:04:27,360 --> 01:04:27,760
a starter.

1483
01:04:28,679 --> 01:04:29,199
Speaker 1: Are you ready?

1484
01:04:29,599 --> 01:04:31,320
Speaker 2: It's it's a long way away.

1485
01:04:31,360 --> 01:04:33,559
Speaker 1: Yes it is. But I think would you do you

1486
01:04:33,559 --> 01:04:35,320
think that the goal is going to be that they'll

1487
01:04:35,360 --> 01:04:37,599
end up ducking attack somehow, just given the state of

1488
01:04:37,639 --> 01:04:39,519
their books moving forward.

1489
01:04:39,159 --> 01:04:41,480
Speaker 2: I didn't realize how close they were.

1490
01:04:42,920 --> 01:04:45,440
Speaker 1: They don't have any contract incentives that they're like waiting

1491
01:04:45,440 --> 01:04:47,400
on either. I think everyone's salaries just no.

1492
01:04:47,559 --> 01:04:49,159
Speaker 3: I mean the only one is like, the only one

1493
01:04:49,199 --> 01:04:51,880
is like Isaac's you know guarantee, which I think like

1494
01:04:51,960 --> 01:04:53,760
at this point it's a likely incentive because he hit

1495
01:04:53,760 --> 01:04:59,519
it last year. Yeah, I think the tricky part about

1496
01:04:59,559 --> 01:05:04,119
it is is the Magic want to win, and so

1497
01:05:05,480 --> 01:05:09,039
they're not gonna you know, if they're like the four

1498
01:05:09,039 --> 01:05:11,760
of the five seed, would they would they like, I

1499
01:05:11,800 --> 01:05:13,280
don't say a band in the season, because they're not

1500
01:05:13,360 --> 01:05:16,639
trading anyone that important to abandon the season. But are

1501
01:05:16,679 --> 01:05:19,199
they gonna if they're the four of the five seed

1502
01:05:19,280 --> 01:05:21,400
or they're not having the season? They thought, like, yeah, absolutely,

1503
01:05:21,480 --> 01:05:24,440
like duck the tax and do that. But if they're not,

1504
01:05:24,559 --> 01:05:27,320
and obviously they can't add a ton more salary, they're

1505
01:05:27,320 --> 01:05:30,559
not gonna do anything to I don't say sabotage their

1506
01:05:30,599 --> 01:05:33,039
team because that's that's again we're not talking about that

1507
01:05:33,199 --> 01:05:34,639
level of player.

1508
01:05:35,679 --> 01:05:37,800
Speaker 1: Howard, that's just me.

1509
01:05:38,000 --> 01:05:42,079
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean Jet Jet's a good locker room guy,

1510
01:05:42,119 --> 01:05:44,719
but he is. But but but not in that way.

1511
01:05:46,360 --> 01:05:50,199
But yeah, like, if they can, I'm sure they would,

1512
01:05:50,760 --> 01:05:53,119
but I feel like they're not gonna do anything out

1513
01:05:53,119 --> 01:05:54,960
of their way to do so, if that makes sense.

1514
01:05:55,559 --> 01:05:58,000
Speaker 1: Are you ready to enter our cookie cutter lightning Round

1515
01:05:58,000 --> 01:05:59,360
portion of the podcast.

1516
01:05:59,000 --> 01:05:59,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's do it.

1517
01:06:00,440 --> 01:06:03,239
Speaker 1: We've talked a lot about flaws strengths of this team.

1518
01:06:03,280 --> 01:06:05,639
What do you view as their biggest need right now

1519
01:06:05,679 --> 01:06:08,840
ahead of their training camp in the regular season Three

1520
01:06:08,840 --> 01:06:09,440
point shooting.

1521
01:06:10,199 --> 01:06:11,719
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna I'm not gonna believe they can make

1522
01:06:11,719 --> 01:06:12,519
threes until they do.

1523
01:06:14,599 --> 01:06:16,840
Speaker 2: They I am.

1524
01:06:16,960 --> 01:06:19,400
Speaker 3: I'm willing to go with this experiment at the point

1525
01:06:19,400 --> 01:06:21,440
guard spot. Like I like I mentioned earlier, this like

1526
01:06:21,480 --> 01:06:23,320
putting this moneyballing the point guard position.

1527
01:06:24,519 --> 01:06:26,400
Speaker 2: I still think they're going to get to a point.

1528
01:06:26,639 --> 01:06:28,480
Speaker 3: And it may not. It may be in the playoffs.

1529
01:06:28,519 --> 01:06:30,119
This here, it may not be something that happened. It

1530
01:06:30,119 --> 01:06:32,760
may just be something they realize when they're, you know,

1531
01:06:32,880 --> 01:06:36,239
playing those big games, they need a point guard, or

1532
01:06:36,239 --> 01:06:38,760
they just need someone. They need someone in that starting

1533
01:06:38,800 --> 01:06:41,000
lineup who knows how to organize things. But you know,

1534
01:06:41,119 --> 01:06:43,000
I don't think that's a question we can answer until

1535
01:06:43,039 --> 01:06:45,760
they fail at it, Until they fail at it.

1536
01:06:45,800 --> 01:06:48,880
Speaker 1: Is there anything about this team a strength weakness storyline

1537
01:06:48,920 --> 01:06:51,400
that you think is flying under the radar right now?

1538
01:06:52,159 --> 01:06:57,960
Speaker 2: Under the radar, I think the biggest thing is.

1539
01:06:59,400 --> 01:07:01,800
Speaker 3: People we haven't talked a lot about him, So let's

1540
01:07:01,840 --> 01:07:03,679
use this as if we gole talk about him.

1541
01:07:04,159 --> 01:07:05,440
Speaker 2: People underrate Wendell Carter.

1542
01:07:06,719 --> 01:07:09,400
Speaker 3: I think that, you know, like the fan, like I

1543
01:07:09,440 --> 01:07:12,239
was on Blocked Down Fantasy Basketball, Josh Lloyd, and like

1544
01:07:12,440 --> 01:07:15,039
he would say, like a lot of fantasy owners don't

1545
01:07:15,119 --> 01:07:18,400
understand why Goo Gooa Toadse doesn't play Gogaba Todse racks

1546
01:07:18,480 --> 01:07:20,280
up all the stats like he's a you know, he'll

1547
01:07:20,280 --> 01:07:22,800
get you. He'll get you eight and eight off the

1548
01:07:22,800 --> 01:07:25,760
bench in fifteen minutes, Like he's gonna he's gonna pick

1549
01:07:25,800 --> 01:07:27,360
up a lot of rebounds. He's gonna block a shot

1550
01:07:27,400 --> 01:07:29,760
or two per game, like he's he's the fantasy darling.

1551
01:07:29,760 --> 01:07:32,079
And no one understands why the Magic don't play him often,

1552
01:07:32,480 --> 01:07:34,760
And I'll be like no, Like Wendell Carter is like

1553
01:07:35,440 --> 01:07:37,719
as much of the lynchpin of this defense as anyone

1554
01:07:37,719 --> 01:07:39,920
else because he can step out and guard on the perimeter.

1555
01:07:40,400 --> 01:07:40,880
Speaker 2: He can guard.

1556
01:07:40,960 --> 01:07:43,199
Speaker 3: He's a solid post defender. You look look up his

1557
01:07:43,280 --> 01:07:45,840
numbers against Nikola Jokic. He's among the best defenders against

1558
01:07:45,920 --> 01:07:48,559
Nikola Jokic in the league, which again, like Jokic still

1559
01:07:48,599 --> 01:07:52,360
gets like twenty five and however many, but he defend,

1560
01:07:52,400 --> 01:07:54,599
he defends a lot of those low post, low post

1561
01:07:54,599 --> 01:07:55,400
bigs really well.

1562
01:07:56,039 --> 01:07:59,159
Speaker 2: He was a central figure and a really important.

1563
01:07:58,800 --> 01:08:02,639
Speaker 3: Part of the Magic looked so impressive in their series

1564
01:08:02,639 --> 01:08:04,760
against Boston, and you know that that was a five

1565
01:08:04,800 --> 01:08:08,559
game series ended up you know, being pretty pretty pro forma.

1566
01:08:08,599 --> 01:08:11,760
But they frustrated Boston with the three point shooting because

1567
01:08:11,760 --> 01:08:14,360
Wendell Carter was able to switch on to Jalen Brown

1568
01:08:14,840 --> 01:08:15,840
fairly comfortably.

1569
01:08:16,159 --> 01:08:17,600
Speaker 2: Jalen Brown made those shots.

1570
01:08:18,319 --> 01:08:21,319
Speaker 3: Boston made all the shots they missed against Boston made

1571
01:08:21,319 --> 01:08:23,319
all the shots against Orlando that they missed against New

1572
01:08:23,399 --> 01:08:28,359
York And it was very frustrating to watch that. But like,

1573
01:08:28,520 --> 01:08:32,159
Wendell Carter is a bigger piece of this team's defense

1574
01:08:32,199 --> 01:08:34,800
that people I think give him credit for. And if

1575
01:08:34,840 --> 01:08:37,199
he can bounce back offensively, if he can, you know,

1576
01:08:37,239 --> 01:08:39,239
and he's going to be in a smaller role offensively,

1577
01:08:39,239 --> 01:08:42,479
so if he's averaging you know, ten and ten, ten

1578
01:08:42,479 --> 01:08:44,159
and ten is probably too much. But like, if he

1579
01:08:44,199 --> 01:08:47,680
can make threes at thirty two, thirty three, thirty four percent,

1580
01:08:48,079 --> 01:08:50,560
be a little bit more present in the paint in

1581
01:08:50,600 --> 01:08:52,520
the dunker spot, you know, get if you get, if

1582
01:08:52,560 --> 01:08:54,880
you know, get up his assists a little bit. He

1583
01:08:54,960 --> 01:08:56,720
can be a real big folk rum for why the

1584
01:08:56,720 --> 01:08:59,760
Magic's offense figures some things out even if he's not scoring.

1585
01:08:59,800 --> 01:09:01,239
So here's a lot of things that just don't show

1586
01:09:01,279 --> 01:09:02,760
up on if you're just box score watching.

1587
01:09:03,279 --> 01:09:04,920
Speaker 1: I know you said that you think they should run

1588
01:09:04,920 --> 01:09:07,039
a nine man rotation. But if you're like looking and

1589
01:09:07,079 --> 01:09:08,880
trying to think, Okay, who will be the ten most

1590
01:09:08,960 --> 01:09:11,680
used players this season, who do you have in that

1591
01:09:11,760 --> 01:09:13,479
it does feel like the starting lineup is at least

1592
01:09:13,479 --> 01:09:14,119
locked into Stelly.

1593
01:09:14,199 --> 01:09:16,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, the starting the starting lineup should be said, It'll

1594
01:09:16,239 --> 01:09:20,720
be Suggs, Bain, Franz Pallo, Carter Uh coming off the bench,

1595
01:09:20,760 --> 01:09:24,760
they'll death, you know, Tias Jones, Anthony Black, Jonathan Isaac,

1596
01:09:25,279 --> 01:09:28,199
one of Mo Wagner or Gogobitadze. Like I said, Bo

1597
01:09:28,239 --> 01:09:30,239
will probably be out until December with the with the

1598
01:09:30,279 --> 01:09:33,119
a CL recovering from the a CL, and then I

1599
01:09:33,399 --> 01:09:35,399
do think like Tristan de Silva is gonna hold down

1600
01:09:35,439 --> 01:09:39,760
that tenth spot at the three essentially. I think that's

1601
01:09:39,840 --> 01:09:41,840
I think that's kind of the ten men that they're

1602
01:09:41,840 --> 01:09:43,159
going to go and go into the season with.

1603
01:09:43,319 --> 01:09:45,119
Speaker 1: What do you think that there's gonna be now that

1604
01:09:45,239 --> 01:09:47,600
you're throwing Bain and Tias Jones in the fold, Like,

1605
01:09:47,600 --> 01:09:50,800
what should we expect from the look of their secondary lineups?

1606
01:09:50,800 --> 01:09:52,840
I know you mentioned a lot of like bench mob stuff,

1607
01:09:52,840 --> 01:09:55,079
but like if you're trying to build the ideal, like

1608
01:09:55,119 --> 01:09:58,439
it's the non core lineup, Like what direction do you

1609
01:09:58,439 --> 01:10:00,920
want to see the magic track, either in terms of

1610
01:10:00,920 --> 01:10:03,399
personnel makeup or just the style of play.

1611
01:10:04,479 --> 01:10:06,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I kind of want to.

1612
01:10:06,800 --> 01:10:09,560
Speaker 3: I kind of like the lineups that they had that

1613
01:10:09,640 --> 01:10:12,840
were just Sugs and Frons together, Okay, And so I think,

1614
01:10:12,960 --> 01:10:15,800
like I think what you might see is, like Franz

1615
01:10:15,880 --> 01:10:17,479
is usually the first one out of the lineup. They'll

1616
01:10:17,560 --> 01:10:21,319
usually bring either Isaac in, they would bring like twenty

1617
01:10:21,359 --> 01:10:22,720
twenty four, they bring Ingles in, So.

1618
01:10:22,720 --> 01:10:24,359
Speaker 2: Maybe that changes a bit.

1619
01:10:25,119 --> 01:10:28,239
Speaker 3: Maybe it'll be like Black coming in for Franz, and

1620
01:10:28,279 --> 01:10:32,960
so they'll run a Sugs, Black, Bain, Pallo Carter lineup

1621
01:10:32,960 --> 01:10:34,920
for a little bit when they break those lineups. But

1622
01:10:35,279 --> 01:10:38,199
maybe you take Sugs out earlier too, and you run

1623
01:10:38,279 --> 01:10:40,840
ti Us a lot with maybe Polo and Bain, and

1624
01:10:40,880 --> 01:10:43,920
then you have a Tias, Sugs, Fronds kind of core

1625
01:10:44,039 --> 01:10:47,239
lineup to open to to be your bench lineup. So

1626
01:10:47,279 --> 01:10:53,119
it would be Sugs, Tias, Sugs, Franz, Isaac and the Toads.

1627
01:10:53,479 --> 01:10:55,439
Let's say, so you have a good pick and roll

1628
01:10:55,439 --> 01:10:58,600
threat between Tias, Jones and Gogoba TODs perhaps or Mo

1629
01:10:58,680 --> 01:11:00,520
Vioger's also excellent on pick and roll so that that

1630
01:11:00,520 --> 01:11:03,279
that transitions easily. Yeah, I have a good defender, a

1631
01:11:03,319 --> 01:11:05,800
good perimeter defender, and Suggs to cover for whatever Tias

1632
01:11:05,880 --> 01:11:08,279
Jones is dealing with. You got Isaac behind him. You

1633
01:11:08,279 --> 01:11:10,159
know you're you're still that that group is still going

1634
01:11:10,239 --> 01:11:12,720
to be pretty good defensively. It's just that's gonna be

1635
01:11:12,720 --> 01:11:14,279
the group that you can run a lot more with.

1636
01:11:14,359 --> 01:11:16,600
I think a lot more with. I think so you can.

1637
01:11:16,800 --> 01:11:19,000
I think having Sugs with that group helps helps a

1638
01:11:19,039 --> 01:11:22,800
ton and just generally like getting Sugs together with Tias

1639
01:11:22,800 --> 01:11:25,880
I think helps cover whatever defensive issues he might have.

1640
01:11:26,439 --> 01:11:29,000
Speaker 1: When you're looking at the players who will play, do

1641
01:11:29,039 --> 01:11:32,880
you see like any potential for a Stark Riser or

1642
01:11:33,039 --> 01:11:35,159
Fallower where you could look back and and be like, oh,

1643
01:11:35,199 --> 01:11:37,640
he was squeezed out of the primaritation all or this

1644
01:11:37,720 --> 01:11:39,800
dude played a bunch more minutes than I was expecting.

1645
01:11:40,720 --> 01:11:43,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I think I think Anthony Block's the

1646
01:11:43,239 --> 01:11:48,159
answer to that, where you know he he he could

1647
01:11:48,159 --> 01:11:50,159
either be a guy that's like, oh, this is a

1648
01:11:51,000 --> 01:11:52,680
you know, the sixth man essentially, like why do we

1649
01:11:52,720 --> 01:11:55,079
even have Tias Jones Because Anthony Black has such command

1650
01:11:55,119 --> 01:11:58,159
over everything, or it's just like we don't know what

1651
01:11:58,199 --> 01:12:00,880
this kid is. Maybe we need to give Jason try.

1652
01:12:00,880 --> 01:12:02,920
We can't play Jason too much with Tyas Jones, but

1653
01:12:03,760 --> 01:12:06,319
like you know, Tys Jones is kind of that guy too,

1654
01:12:06,359 --> 01:12:09,760
where it's just like, well he's struggling on defense, he's

1655
01:12:09,800 --> 01:12:11,960
not giving us very much. Maybe we need to get

1656
01:12:11,960 --> 01:12:14,079
what we can for him, or maybe we need to

1657
01:12:14,119 --> 01:12:16,359
try Jason that spot next to Jalen Suggs and just

1658
01:12:16,399 --> 01:12:19,119
say like this is just something different, something different. So

1659
01:12:19,520 --> 01:12:21,760
you know, I think those guards are still a little

1660
01:12:21,760 --> 01:12:23,359
bit of a question a little bit of a question mark.

1661
01:12:23,399 --> 01:12:25,880
And again like we just don't know what Anthony Black

1662
01:12:26,000 --> 01:12:28,439
is at this point. And again we're two years in,

1663
01:12:28,640 --> 01:12:30,399
so it's just like, okay, you got to show us

1664
01:12:30,399 --> 01:12:33,000
who you are, or maybe the Magic need to move on.

1665
01:12:33,399 --> 01:12:35,279
Speaker 1: Tyas Jones was actually my answer to that, because I

1666
01:12:35,319 --> 01:12:37,039
think he probably has a cap unless there's an injury

1667
01:12:37,039 --> 01:12:39,039
on how much he will play. But I actually kind

1668
01:12:39,039 --> 01:12:40,800
of thinking out like, oh if Anty Black plays well,

1669
01:12:40,840 --> 01:12:42,880
and then you mentioned even they give Jace Richardson a look.

1670
01:12:43,000 --> 01:12:45,079
When we were talking about the tax thing. This is

1671
01:12:45,279 --> 01:12:46,720
like a couple of weeks ago. I was writing to my head,

1672
01:12:46,760 --> 01:12:48,520
I was like, is there a scenario where it's mid

1673
01:12:48,560 --> 01:12:50,439
season he just gets shipped to Utah, bought out and

1674
01:12:50,479 --> 01:12:52,800
signs in Denver. That's how they duck the tax because

1675
01:12:53,079 --> 01:12:55,159
Anty Black is so good, or they decide that they

1676
01:12:55,159 --> 01:12:57,680
don't need what he's bringing to.

1677
01:12:57,920 --> 01:13:00,119
Speaker 2: To that point. To that point, like a guy you

1678
01:13:00,159 --> 01:13:01,000
get squeezed out.

1679
01:13:01,840 --> 01:13:04,079
Speaker 3: Tyas probably gets squeezed out when they make the playoffs

1680
01:13:04,600 --> 01:13:07,119
and you start limiting his minutes a little bit more

1681
01:13:07,600 --> 01:13:10,159
because just this the defense. You lose so much defensively,

1682
01:13:10,239 --> 01:13:13,119
unless he's just so important to functioning on offense, which

1683
01:13:13,119 --> 01:13:15,680
like Corey Joseph was last year, and you know ante

1684
01:13:15,960 --> 01:13:18,680
like I like, look, it's crazy.

1685
01:13:18,720 --> 01:13:19,279
Speaker 2: I agree it.

1686
01:13:19,680 --> 01:13:21,960
Speaker 3: Like I when the Magic signed Corey Joseph last summer,

1687
01:13:22,439 --> 01:13:23,960
people ask me, why are they signing him?

1688
01:13:23,960 --> 01:13:25,119
Speaker 2: It's just like he's just a good vet.

1689
01:13:25,159 --> 01:13:28,319
Speaker 3: If he's playing, something terrible has happened, and what do

1690
01:13:28,359 --> 01:13:32,680
you know, many terrible happened. Yeah, many terrible things happen,

1691
01:13:32,720 --> 01:13:35,600
But like he stabilized that lineup, and like Corey Joseph

1692
01:13:35,600 --> 01:13:36,960
was a good argument for why you actually need a

1693
01:13:36,960 --> 01:13:40,000
point guard and why why even like a Corey Joseph

1694
01:13:40,000 --> 01:13:44,279
figure was so important for that team.

1695
01:13:43,079 --> 01:13:45,640
Speaker 1: Is that this can be to some extent matchup dependent.

1696
01:13:45,760 --> 01:13:47,239
But for them, do you think the fir go to

1697
01:13:47,399 --> 01:13:50,119
closing unit will wind up just being the starting five

1698
01:13:50,239 --> 01:13:52,279
or is there the potential for Jamal Moseley to futzon

1699
01:13:52,319 --> 01:13:52,840
fiddle there.

1700
01:13:54,239 --> 01:13:56,960
Speaker 3: I think generally it'll be that starting five. Like I think,

1701
01:13:57,640 --> 01:14:00,720
I think Boseley, throughout his tenure as the coach has

1702
01:14:00,760 --> 01:14:02,600
been willing to ride the hot hand a little bit

1703
01:14:02,680 --> 01:14:05,960
like he's he's He's had a lot of a lot

1704
01:14:05,960 --> 01:14:09,760
of moments where he will the bench group will be

1705
01:14:09,800 --> 01:14:11,279
playing really well and you'll just leave him in for

1706
01:14:11,319 --> 01:14:14,159
the whole fourth quarter. Like that hasn't happened as much,

1707
01:14:14,279 --> 01:14:18,079
or that hasn't happened since they've got really good, but he's.

1708
01:14:17,920 --> 01:14:18,720
Speaker 2: Done that before.

1709
01:14:19,600 --> 01:14:22,560
Speaker 3: I think I think there's the potential for like if

1710
01:14:22,600 --> 01:14:27,560
they need if they're on offense, especially maybe Tias Jones

1711
01:14:27,760 --> 01:14:30,159
is in and they either take out depending on matchup,

1712
01:14:30,159 --> 01:14:32,000
they take out Suggs or they take out a player

1713
01:14:32,039 --> 01:14:34,199
who's not shooting well or Carter or something like that.

1714
01:14:35,000 --> 01:14:37,760
Because Mosley likes to like have the have the guys

1715
01:14:37,760 --> 01:14:39,760
figured out, like like he got yelled at by fans

1716
01:14:39,800 --> 01:14:42,359
last year because he had two instances late in a

1717
01:14:42,359 --> 01:14:44,600
game where he didn't call time out after after a

1718
01:14:44,600 --> 01:14:47,680
misfree throw rebound, and like, I'm generally like I'm of

1719
01:14:47,720 --> 01:14:49,640
the school that's just like that's I don't have a

1720
01:14:49,680 --> 01:14:51,479
problem with that, Like you're going to catch a defense

1721
01:14:51,479 --> 01:14:53,199
off guard. Like if if you run into a problem,

1722
01:14:53,199 --> 01:14:55,159
maybe you need to call time out, which happened in

1723
01:14:55,199 --> 01:14:58,399
one of those games. But otherwise, like you know, balls

1724
01:14:58,399 --> 01:15:00,239
in the hands of your best player, just go like

1725
01:15:00,279 --> 01:15:02,119
what do you what? What player are you really drawing up?

1726
01:15:02,119 --> 01:15:04,359
That isn't that, that isn't just that catch the defense

1727
01:15:04,399 --> 01:15:07,800
off guard. So having a guy like Tyas Jones that

1728
01:15:07,880 --> 01:15:10,159
you can get the ball to and make that decision

1729
01:15:10,159 --> 01:15:14,359
and transition might be more advantageous. But generally, I think

1730
01:15:14,359 --> 01:15:16,079
their closing lineup is going to be their starting group.

1731
01:15:16,119 --> 01:15:19,159
Those are their five best players, and I think generally

1732
01:15:19,199 --> 01:15:22,119
the Magic's overall philosophy is we just want to put

1733
01:15:22,159 --> 01:15:24,159
our five best players on the floor as much as possible.

1734
01:15:24,720 --> 01:15:26,840
Speaker 1: Is there a weirdo or funky lineup you'd like to

1735
01:15:26,880 --> 01:15:28,079
see Mosley try this year?

1736
01:15:29,880 --> 01:15:35,159
Speaker 3: I would like to see him try, Like I know,

1737
01:15:35,199 --> 01:15:36,600
I just did this whole thing about point guards, like

1738
01:15:36,640 --> 01:15:41,520
this point guardless lineup that's like Bain Palo, Franz Isaac,

1739
01:15:43,479 --> 01:15:46,800
you know, maybe Suggs, like like try and putting I day.

1740
01:15:46,840 --> 01:15:48,359
I put on the weight last year and it was

1741
01:15:48,359 --> 01:15:51,000
a disaster, but playing him at center is still a

1742
01:15:51,000 --> 01:15:53,560
good idea playing like having some minutes where Palo is

1743
01:15:53,560 --> 01:15:56,159
the five and you're playing five out, Like the Magic

1744
01:15:56,199 --> 01:15:58,319
didn't have the shooting in the past to really do

1745
01:15:58,479 --> 01:16:01,319
that now they did. Like if you know, you could

1746
01:16:01,319 --> 01:16:05,600
put a lineup of Tias Jones, Jalen Suggs, Desmond Dane, Pallo,

1747
01:16:05,640 --> 01:16:08,640
Bane Carol, Jonathan Isaac and probably have enough shooting to

1748
01:16:08,760 --> 01:16:10,920
get by or Tristan da Silvas instead of one of

1749
01:16:10,920 --> 01:16:13,760
those guys. You probably have enough shooting to get by

1750
01:16:13,880 --> 01:16:16,880
now in a way that you didn't before. And so

1751
01:16:16,960 --> 01:16:20,359
I'd like to see them try, you know, these small

1752
01:16:20,359 --> 01:16:23,119
ball center lineups, Like Steve Kerr loved playing Palo at

1753
01:16:23,119 --> 01:16:25,039
the five during the during the World Cup a few

1754
01:16:25,079 --> 01:16:29,520
years ago and like it didn't work great, But that's

1755
01:16:29,600 --> 01:16:32,079
I think more of a function of FEBA. People think

1756
01:16:32,119 --> 01:16:34,039
like those death lineups are like something you do all

1757
01:16:34,039 --> 01:16:35,279
the time. It's like, no you do it for the

1758
01:16:35,359 --> 01:16:37,039
last two minutes at the end of a quarter to

1759
01:16:37,079 --> 01:16:39,319
throw the other team off a little bit, where you know,

1760
01:16:39,359 --> 01:16:41,279
it's it's it's a limited timeframe. You kind of go

1761
01:16:41,399 --> 01:16:43,439
all out, you go to locker room, you recover, and

1762
01:16:43,479 --> 01:16:48,039
that's that. Just having at versatility I think's really really important.

1763
01:16:48,039 --> 01:16:50,319
And the Magic, you know, should have some freedom to

1764
01:16:50,399 --> 01:16:51,880
try some different things and and.

1765
01:16:51,920 --> 01:16:53,640
Speaker 2: Might depend on what other teams are doing and what.

1766
01:16:53,600 --> 01:16:55,920
Speaker 3: They expect to see in the playoffs, like you know,

1767
01:16:56,239 --> 01:16:58,840
the I mean, let's just be let's be real. The

1768
01:16:59,279 --> 01:17:01,399
Nicks and the cab they're they're the two teams that

1769
01:17:01,399 --> 01:17:03,560
they're probably going to be going after, and the Pistons

1770
01:17:03,600 --> 01:17:05,680
the team like right behind them too, and even the Hawks.

1771
01:17:06,079 --> 01:17:07,560
Speaker 2: Those are teams that are gonna go big.

1772
01:17:07,920 --> 01:17:10,520
Speaker 3: So maybe the Magic need to try more Carter Batadze

1773
01:17:10,640 --> 01:17:12,880
lineups together than they have in the past, which they've

1774
01:17:12,880 --> 01:17:14,119
they've experimented with.

1775
01:17:14,039 --> 01:17:15,399
Speaker 2: It a little bit.

1776
01:17:15,920 --> 01:17:18,359
Speaker 3: But if Carter's three point shot is back, they should

1777
01:17:18,359 --> 01:17:22,039
absolutely be testing out Carter Batadze lineups, you know, with Palo,

1778
01:17:22,079 --> 01:17:24,520
with Franz, with whoever's the at the one, two and three.

1779
01:17:24,600 --> 01:17:27,720
Speaker 2: But that's probably the direction they need to go, I.

1780
01:17:27,600 --> 01:17:31,000
Speaker 1: Want to see four guards. Give me Jace Richardson with Suggs,

1781
01:17:31,079 --> 01:17:34,039
Baine and Anthony Black and then you could put Palo

1782
01:17:34,199 --> 01:17:36,119
or Jonathan Isaac in the middle. I want to see what.

1783
01:17:36,079 --> 01:17:37,479
Speaker 2: That looks like. Something like that would be great.

1784
01:17:37,560 --> 01:17:41,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, So do you have anything else that you want

1785
01:17:41,840 --> 01:17:43,319
to talk about or you think we need to discuss

1786
01:17:43,359 --> 01:17:45,119
with this team before we get into predictions.

1787
01:17:46,560 --> 01:17:47,720
Speaker 2: I think we covered most of it.

1788
01:17:47,840 --> 01:17:51,960
Speaker 3: I can't think of anything, you know, just that this

1789
01:17:52,000 --> 01:17:54,199
team has to prove itself, Like I think that's the

1790
01:17:54,399 --> 01:17:56,319
big They're like all young teams that are kind of

1791
01:17:56,319 --> 01:17:58,319
fresh on the scene. They they've never done it before,

1792
01:17:58,399 --> 01:17:59,880
so they got to They got to prove themselves.

1793
01:18:00,880 --> 01:18:03,199
Speaker 1: So how many games would you if you want to

1794
01:18:03,199 --> 01:18:04,920
give a range that's fine, would you see them winning?

1795
01:18:04,920 --> 01:18:06,800
And where do you see them falling for the regular

1796
01:18:06,880 --> 01:18:09,680
season in terms of an Eastern Conference seed.

1797
01:18:10,600 --> 01:18:12,640
Speaker 3: I think they're like I said, I think they're gonna

1798
01:18:12,640 --> 01:18:14,640
be right around fifty wins, So I probably put them

1799
01:18:14,640 --> 01:18:17,720
in like the forty eight to fifty four fifty five range.

1800
01:18:18,239 --> 01:18:22,960
There's definitely a world where like everything clicks, their offense

1801
01:18:23,039 --> 01:18:25,199
is sudden, you know, not the best offense in league.

1802
01:18:25,199 --> 01:18:28,840
But their offense is top half of the league. Their

1803
01:18:28,880 --> 01:18:31,720
defense is still elite, and that's enough to really push

1804
01:18:31,800 --> 01:18:34,960
them up the standings and make them just a dangerous team.

1805
01:18:35,000 --> 01:18:37,680
Like the one stat we didn't talk about here, to

1806
01:18:37,680 --> 01:18:41,279
bring it back to shooting, the Magic's record when they

1807
01:18:41,359 --> 01:18:44,960
shot thirty three percent or better from three last year

1808
01:18:45,680 --> 01:18:46,760
was twenty seven to ten.

1809
01:18:48,920 --> 01:18:49,560
Speaker 2: That's such a low.

1810
01:18:49,720 --> 01:18:51,520
Speaker 1: They not have to shoot too that's crazy.

1811
01:18:51,520 --> 01:18:54,199
Speaker 3: It's thirty three percent. It is still the worst three

1812
01:18:54,199 --> 01:18:56,479
point shooting percentage in the league. The Wizard shot thirty

1813
01:18:56,479 --> 01:18:59,079
three point two or three or four something like that percent.

1814
01:19:00,159 --> 01:19:03,319
They just had to be competent, And by competent, I

1815
01:19:03,319 --> 01:19:06,119
mean they just had to be not the worst shooting

1816
01:19:06,119 --> 01:19:09,439
team of the last ten years, and they gave themselves

1817
01:19:09,439 --> 01:19:10,359
a really good chance to win.

1818
01:19:11,279 --> 01:19:14,079
Speaker 2: So there's definitely a universe where they're.

1819
01:19:13,920 --> 01:19:16,560
Speaker 3: Like eighteenth in the league and three point field goal

1820
01:19:16,600 --> 01:19:18,920
percentage and that's enough to make them twelfth in the

1821
01:19:19,000 --> 01:19:22,079
league in offensive rating, and they're like third or fourth

1822
01:19:22,079 --> 01:19:22,880
in defensive rating.

1823
01:19:22,920 --> 01:19:24,399
Speaker 2: Maybe their defense takes a little bit.

1824
01:19:24,279 --> 01:19:28,000
Speaker 3: Of a step back, and that's probably enough to get them,

1825
01:19:28,319 --> 01:19:30,439
you know, to have them compete. That's that's enough to

1826
01:19:30,439 --> 01:19:32,039
get them to the three seed in the East. I

1827
01:19:32,039 --> 01:19:34,560
think they should be aiming for the three seed. They

1828
01:19:34,600 --> 01:19:37,159
should feel like, you know, we're the third best team

1829
01:19:37,159 --> 01:19:39,880
in the Eastern Conference. Like anyone who is predicting us

1830
01:19:39,920 --> 01:19:42,359
to be worse than the Pistons or the Bucks or

1831
01:19:42,399 --> 01:19:45,399
any of these other teams, they're forgetting that we won

1832
01:19:45,439 --> 01:19:48,359
forty seven games two years ago and we're still essentially

1833
01:19:48,439 --> 01:19:51,800
the same team we lost, only we won we lost

1834
01:19:51,880 --> 01:19:55,720
only we won only six fewer games last year, even

1835
01:19:55,800 --> 01:19:58,760
with our top four scorers missing significant time. You know,

1836
01:19:59,279 --> 01:20:02,279
the top four score last year where Palo, Franz, Jalen Suggs, Movoger,

1837
01:20:02,680 --> 01:20:06,319
Jalen Suggs played thirty six games, Moe was out since Christmas.

1838
01:20:07,000 --> 01:20:09,600
Paalo missed twenty game, missed a two months in, Franz

1839
01:20:09,600 --> 01:20:10,439
missed twenty games.

1840
01:20:10,479 --> 01:20:12,800
Speaker 2: Like they they were still a.

1841
01:20:12,800 --> 01:20:16,640
Speaker 3: Really tough team, but obviously, like getting from getting to

1842
01:20:16,680 --> 01:20:19,159
fifty wins is a bigger, bigger step, So they got

1843
01:20:19,359 --> 01:20:20,880
they gotta do a lot of things better, and there's

1844
01:20:20,880 --> 01:20:23,119
just and there's certainly a universe where they're like a

1845
01:20:23,119 --> 01:20:24,600
little bit of the same as they were in twenty

1846
01:20:24,600 --> 01:20:27,079
twenty four, and even then they're probably in the upper

1847
01:20:27,079 --> 01:20:28,279
forties as far as wins.

1848
01:20:28,279 --> 01:20:31,399
Speaker 2: That probably leaves them as the four of the five seed, but.

1849
01:20:32,119 --> 01:20:34,640
Speaker 3: That's kind of their baseline unless they have another like

1850
01:20:34,800 --> 01:20:37,279
run of injuries, Like, I can't see them falling much

1851
01:20:37,279 --> 01:20:37,880
far below that.

1852
01:20:38,000 --> 01:20:41,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, their floor feels like four. And I think I'm

1853
01:20:41,359 --> 01:20:43,840
pretty high on the Cavs, but I am not entirely

1854
01:20:43,880 --> 01:20:46,960
convinced that the Knicks should just be favored over the Magic.

1855
01:20:47,039 --> 01:20:50,920
Speaker 3: I think I get the feeling that, like those teams especially,

1856
01:20:51,800 --> 01:20:54,520
they're gonna pace themselves in a way like a team

1857
01:20:54,560 --> 01:20:58,079
like the Magic wouldn't like for the Magic, like winning

1858
01:20:58,159 --> 01:21:00,399
fifty games the first time, they're gonna go four, like

1859
01:21:00,399 --> 01:21:02,359
they're gonna you know, like, yeah, that's that's kind of

1860
01:21:02,399 --> 01:21:04,880
how those teams go. Whereas like Cleveland's not gonna win

1861
01:21:04,920 --> 01:21:07,560
sixty games next year, like they're gonna piece themselves a

1862
01:21:07,560 --> 01:21:09,640
little bit like New York, Like they know there are battles.

1863
01:21:09,640 --> 01:21:12,479
Speaker 1: They paced themselves and won sixty plus last year. Anyway, Yeah,

1864
01:21:12,479 --> 01:21:13,960
so CAW's when I do that again. I don't think

1865
01:21:13,960 --> 01:21:16,119
the Knicks had that type of depth. I mean, everyone's

1866
01:21:16,119 --> 01:21:18,479
making I think they were good signings, but you know,

1867
01:21:18,520 --> 01:21:22,560
they're making Gershon Yabouseli and Jordan Clarkson into being like these.

1868
01:21:22,880 --> 01:21:24,600
Speaker 2: I'm, yeah, I agree with that.

1869
01:21:24,840 --> 01:21:29,720
Speaker 3: I'm I'm a little worried that, like, like.

1870
01:21:30,039 --> 01:21:31,319
Speaker 2: Not to make this next podcast.

1871
01:21:31,880 --> 01:21:35,039
Speaker 3: My big concern with the next is that they are

1872
01:21:35,079 --> 01:21:39,520
a function of Tom Thibodeau, and you take whatever Thibodeau has,

1873
01:21:40,560 --> 01:21:44,319
whatever magic Thibodeaux has, and they're not the same.

1874
01:21:44,760 --> 01:21:46,760
Speaker 2: They're still good, don't get me wrong, still very good. Well,

1875
01:21:46,880 --> 01:21:48,520
but Thibodeau is just Thibodeau.

1876
01:21:48,600 --> 01:21:51,439
Speaker 1: That's honestly, I haven't heard that framing yet. That's an

1877
01:21:51,439 --> 01:21:54,039
interesting way to frame it. My concern is I'm an alarmist,

1878
01:21:54,119 --> 01:21:56,600
which is a character flaw, And so I look at

1879
01:21:56,640 --> 01:22:00,920
the durability they've gotten from McHale, Bridges other teams his

1880
01:22:01,039 --> 01:22:04,039
entire career, Josh Hart the past few years, Ogi Ananobi

1881
01:22:04,119 --> 01:22:07,560
last year, and I'm sitting here thinking, Oh, they're due

1882
01:22:07,560 --> 01:22:10,199
to get fucked. That's that's like my mind.

1883
01:22:10,359 --> 01:22:11,680
Speaker 2: She's gonna drop at some point, right.

1884
01:22:12,199 --> 01:22:15,720
Speaker 1: So, looking way ahead into a potential playoff matchup, what

1885
01:22:15,840 --> 01:22:20,239
is a team in the East that you find most intriguing, fascinating,

1886
01:22:20,239 --> 01:22:22,920
even most concerning of a matchup for Orlando.

1887
01:22:24,279 --> 01:22:28,079
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, we've we've obviously seen this team play

1888
01:22:28,359 --> 01:22:35,159
Cleveland before and they're essentially still similar teams. The the

1889
01:22:35,199 --> 01:22:40,119
Cleveland series, I was like, I was still so impressed

1890
01:22:40,199 --> 01:22:44,760
with how the Magic played that series, but I think

1891
01:22:45,680 --> 01:22:48,760
even Magic fans forget Jared Allen missed essentially the whole series.

1892
01:22:48,800 --> 01:22:50,439
Like he took an elbow to the ribs and game

1893
01:22:52,960 --> 01:22:54,680
and yeah, and it was out. He was out for

1894
01:22:54,680 --> 01:22:56,680
the whole series. Like like he played a little bit

1895
01:22:56,720 --> 01:22:58,760
in Game four and left in the first half, and like, look,

1896
01:22:58,800 --> 01:23:01,319
the Magic, you know, you always win that first game

1897
01:23:01,359 --> 01:23:06,800
coming back home, Jared Allen crushed the Magic and moving

1898
01:23:06,840 --> 01:23:11,000
Evan Mobley to the five, I think opened the door

1899
01:23:11,039 --> 01:23:13,079
for the Magic to make that a much more competitive

1900
01:23:13,079 --> 01:23:17,600
series than it was. Like Donovan Mitchell still did Donovan

1901
01:23:17,600 --> 01:23:20,199
Mitchell things like maybe the Magic size on the perimeter

1902
01:23:20,319 --> 01:23:25,079
bugged Darius Garland a lot more. You know, one thing

1903
01:23:25,119 --> 01:23:28,079
in that series was they kind of used Jalen Suggs

1904
01:23:28,119 --> 01:23:31,279
to shut down Darius Garland in that series because they

1905
01:23:31,279 --> 01:23:34,079
had Gary Harris to kind of help slow down Donovan Mitchell.

1906
01:23:34,079 --> 01:23:35,840
And obviously he didn't slow him down because done slows

1907
01:23:35,880 --> 01:23:38,720
down Donald Mitchell in the playoffs. But except for donovand

1908
01:23:38,720 --> 01:23:45,279
Mitchell's body, the uh, the Magic, I think there's still

1909
01:23:45,279 --> 01:23:47,159
an interesting matchup for Cleveland. I don't think they're like

1910
01:23:47,159 --> 01:23:49,039
a pushover. I don't think that's like a sweep or anything.

1911
01:23:49,079 --> 01:23:54,199
But the Magic tend to struggle with very big lineups,

1912
01:23:54,239 --> 01:23:56,640
and especially like Evan Mobley is a defensive Player of

1913
01:23:56,640 --> 01:23:59,239
the Year, Like he is a very good defender. They

1914
01:23:59,239 --> 01:24:02,359
didn't get to see him guard Palo or Fronz, like essentially,

1915
01:24:02,439 --> 01:24:05,279
like entering that series, I said, the Magic need to

1916
01:24:05,279 --> 01:24:08,359
attack whoever Evan Mobley's not guarding. So like if Bobli's

1917
01:24:08,399 --> 01:24:11,600
on Palo, Franz take the lead. If Bobli's on Franz,

1918
01:24:11,760 --> 01:24:14,439
Pallo take the lead. And it ended up like Jared

1919
01:24:14,439 --> 01:24:16,560
Allen went out, they didn't have to worry about that anymore.

1920
01:24:16,560 --> 01:24:18,439
Both guys were able to kind of get themselves going.

1921
01:24:18,520 --> 01:24:21,680
So I think Cleveland is still a really tough matchup

1922
01:24:21,680 --> 01:24:27,039
for Orlando. New York's five out, Like the Magic, didn't

1923
01:24:27,039 --> 01:24:28,960
you like job with Boston, They're like, mate, they're like

1924
01:24:29,000 --> 01:24:32,399
four out, They're like five out, yes, yeah, yeah. With

1925
01:24:32,479 --> 01:24:34,439
Josh Hart, yeah, you probably end up putting like Carter

1926
01:24:34,560 --> 01:24:37,439
on on Heart and and like but I don't know,

1927
01:24:37,520 --> 01:24:40,640
like the Magic like to switch so much. It it

1928
01:24:41,039 --> 01:24:44,439
like keeping a guy away from the paint. I think

1929
01:24:44,560 --> 01:24:47,319
exposes a quiet weakness of this defense. Like the Magic

1930
01:24:47,359 --> 01:24:50,439
are not particularly strong defending the rim. And that's not

1931
01:24:50,479 --> 01:24:52,079
just because they don't have a great shop blocker. It's

1932
01:24:52,119 --> 01:24:54,680
it's they Their strategy is, we're going to keep you

1933
01:24:54,720 --> 01:24:57,520
from shooting threes and try and crowd you in the

1934
01:24:57,520 --> 01:25:00,279
paint and if we value whatever, But they they still

1935
01:25:00,279 --> 01:25:01,880
give up a fair share of shots at their rim,

1936
01:25:01,920 --> 01:25:05,560
and they could test them decently, but it always I'm

1937
01:25:05,560 --> 01:25:07,680
always concerned, and this is just maybe my old school

1938
01:25:07,720 --> 01:25:11,439
defensive mentality. I'm still always scared to death of not

1939
01:25:11,640 --> 01:25:14,680
having a big able to rotate quickly to the to

1940
01:25:14,720 --> 01:25:16,680
the to the to the basket and defend the paint

1941
01:25:16,720 --> 01:25:19,039
and leaving that paint wide open. So five out offenses

1942
01:25:19,039 --> 01:25:21,279
still bug me. And you know, again, we'll see what

1943
01:25:21,319 --> 01:25:22,920
it looks like this yere. But teams that get hot

1944
01:25:22,920 --> 01:25:25,119
from three, like the Magic tried its best they can

1945
01:25:25,199 --> 01:25:26,920
to take away threes, but they've never been able to

1946
01:25:27,000 --> 01:25:29,119
keep up with three point shooting. So like when they

1947
01:25:29,199 --> 01:25:30,920
play a Boston, they'd make a ton of threes. It'd

1948
01:25:30,920 --> 01:25:32,600
be like, well, that's there's nothing we can do about

1949
01:25:32,600 --> 01:25:36,680
that tonight. So I still think the Magic are an

1950
01:25:36,680 --> 01:25:38,760
interesting matchup for the top two teams in the East.

1951
01:25:39,319 --> 01:25:42,159
But I think both those teams still have advantages that

1952
01:25:42,199 --> 01:25:44,520
the Magic have to prove they can handle, which which

1953
01:25:45,119 --> 01:25:47,479
they haven't did a playoff setting yet.

1954
01:25:47,680 --> 01:25:50,039
Speaker 1: I want to see a Magic Piston series because.

1955
01:25:52,680 --> 01:25:55,720
Speaker 3: But the thing is, like we said this before the

1956
01:25:55,720 --> 01:25:58,239
Magic Cavs series in twenty twenty four, everybody says they

1957
01:25:58,239 --> 01:26:00,720
want the nineties back, and they get it in a

1958
01:26:00,720 --> 01:26:02,520
playoff series and they stick it on NBA TV.

1959
01:26:03,439 --> 01:26:05,119
Speaker 1: Well, look, the NBA is gonna and I like it

1960
01:26:05,159 --> 01:26:07,439
in you go back and watch early two thousands or

1961
01:26:07,479 --> 01:26:10,239
night late nineties basketball, like no, thank you. But I

1962
01:26:10,279 --> 01:26:12,680
can appreciate the nostalgia of it, and it's like the

1963
01:26:12,680 --> 01:26:15,960
modern day slant because it's so far into us like this, Yeah,

1964
01:26:15,960 --> 01:26:17,479
I don't want to use the word violence, but the

1965
01:26:17,479 --> 01:26:20,359
physicality of it. These two teams are like if the

1966
01:26:20,439 --> 01:26:22,439
Rockets and the Magic played in the same conference, or

1967
01:26:22,479 --> 01:26:23,760
if they met in the NBA finals.

1968
01:26:23,800 --> 01:26:28,439
Speaker 3: My god, people, people, people don't understand, Like, so Magic Pistons.

1969
01:26:28,640 --> 01:26:31,800
I think that is the next fun like young rivalry

1970
01:26:31,800 --> 01:26:35,640
in the league. They've gotten into fights both the past

1971
01:26:35,640 --> 01:26:39,760
two years like they like like like two years ago,

1972
01:26:39,840 --> 01:26:43,119
Killian Hayes literally shoved Mo Wagner into the Pistons bench.

1973
01:26:43,720 --> 01:26:46,199
Mo Wogner like like went after him, like they had

1974
01:26:46,199 --> 01:26:47,760
to do a poll apart. Like players came off the

1975
01:26:47,760 --> 01:26:49,680
Magic's bench because it was over by the Pistons bench

1976
01:26:50,159 --> 01:26:52,079
player Magic players got suspended for coming off the bench.

1977
01:26:52,119 --> 01:26:52,760
Speaker 2: They didn't know the rules.

1978
01:26:53,479 --> 01:26:57,279
Speaker 3: Last year, the Magic, like it felt like a must

1979
01:26:57,319 --> 01:26:58,239
win game for the Magic.

1980
01:26:58,399 --> 01:26:59,840
Speaker 2: They left their starters in.

1981
01:27:00,119 --> 01:27:01,920
Speaker 3: It was the first like Jalen Suggs had just come

1982
01:27:01,960 --> 01:27:03,600
back from a back from back spasms.

1983
01:27:04,760 --> 01:27:05,319
Speaker 2: He played.

1984
01:27:05,359 --> 01:27:08,239
Speaker 3: They the Magic main starter is usually all lead. You know,

1985
01:27:08,319 --> 01:27:11,000
Palo Frands, they don't start the fourth quarter. All three

1986
01:27:11,000 --> 01:27:12,680
of those guys started the fourth quarter. They started on

1987
01:27:12,720 --> 01:27:15,000
a like a twelve oh run to turn a four

1988
01:27:15,000 --> 01:27:16,960
point game into an eight to four point deficit into

1989
01:27:16,960 --> 01:27:19,359
an eight point lead, and then like midway through the

1990
01:27:19,359 --> 01:27:22,560
fourth quarter, the Magic are up by like twelve, fourteen points.

1991
01:27:22,600 --> 01:27:26,520
Isaiah Stewart and I forget who's Isaiah Stuart And someone

1992
01:27:26,560 --> 01:27:28,199
got into it over by the Magic S bench.

1993
01:27:28,800 --> 01:27:30,079
Speaker 2: They needed to be pulled apart.

1994
01:27:30,520 --> 01:27:32,680
Speaker 3: Jalen Suggs actually hurt his knee in the fro and

1995
01:27:32,800 --> 01:27:35,000
the like fracas or around the fracas, and he left

1996
01:27:35,000 --> 01:27:37,439
the game after that point. But it like these two

1997
01:27:37,479 --> 01:27:41,359
teams like like they get after each other. They like

1998
01:27:41,399 --> 01:27:42,760
there there's definitely something there.

1999
01:27:43,000 --> 01:27:44,199
Speaker 2: We're gonna get a preview of it.

2000
01:27:44,199 --> 01:27:46,199
Speaker 3: They're in the NBA Cup together, in the same group

2001
01:27:46,199 --> 01:27:48,640
in the NBA Cup, last game of group play for

2002
01:27:48,720 --> 01:27:51,199
both teams. I think it probably determines who wins that

2003
01:27:51,199 --> 01:27:53,439
group and who advances so in Detroit, so it'll be

2004
01:27:54,479 --> 01:27:56,680
there's definitely something there with the Magic Pistons. I'd love

2005
01:27:56,680 --> 01:27:58,079
to see a Magic Piston series two.

2006
01:27:58,760 --> 01:28:02,359
Speaker 1: Finally, mister Phillip Rossman Reich of Orlando Magic Daily and

2007
01:28:02,439 --> 01:28:05,680
the Lockdown Magic Podcast, can I get one more Magic

2008
01:28:05,680 --> 01:28:08,359
prediction from you for this season? It can be whatever

2009
01:28:08,399 --> 01:28:08,800
you want.

2010
01:28:09,560 --> 01:28:11,560
Speaker 3: I mean, the the easy one is that the streak's

2011
01:28:11,600 --> 01:28:14,319
gonna end, that the Magic will get out of the

2012
01:28:14,319 --> 01:28:16,560
bottom ten and offensive rating for the first time since

2013
01:28:16,600 --> 01:28:20,359
twenty twelve. That that I said that last year, I'm

2014
01:28:20,399 --> 01:28:21,199
gonna say it again this year.

2015
01:28:21,199 --> 01:28:23,960
Speaker 2: It's gonna happen. It's gonna happen. One more prediction from me.

2016
01:28:26,399 --> 01:28:27,159
I think that.

2017
01:28:30,159 --> 01:28:32,000
Speaker 3: I think the Magic will have two All Stars I think.

2018
01:28:32,319 --> 01:28:34,079
I don't think that's maybe going out too far in

2019
01:28:34,079 --> 01:28:36,399
alim but I think Powo and Franz will both be

2020
01:28:36,439 --> 01:28:39,800
All Stars this year. I think Palo will make All

2021
01:28:39,920 --> 01:28:43,560
NBA and and get the super get all the super

2022
01:28:43,600 --> 01:28:48,159
Max that comes with it. I think Desmond Dane is

2023
01:28:48,159 --> 01:28:49,399
going to be pretty close. I don't know if he's

2024
01:28:49,399 --> 01:28:52,479
gonna get in, but he's in the East. Now he's

2025
01:28:52,520 --> 01:28:53,039
in the East.

2026
01:28:53,359 --> 01:28:54,079
Speaker 2: He's in the East.

2027
01:28:54,159 --> 01:28:57,439
Speaker 3: Without Tatum Embiid's probably not gonna get it, get an

2028
01:28:57,439 --> 01:28:58,119
All Stars.

2029
01:28:57,920 --> 01:29:00,399
Speaker 1: And Bean was eliminated from Awards voting the moment the

2030
01:29:00,399 --> 01:29:02,600
schedule came out. The six or have sixteen back backs.

2031
01:29:02,640 --> 01:29:03,119
He's done.

2032
01:29:03,319 --> 01:29:05,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, that doesn't mean anything for All Star Game though.

2033
01:29:05,960 --> 01:29:09,399
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that's right. Okay, yeah, yeah, I like that one.

2034
01:29:11,199 --> 01:29:12,399
Speaker 2: I'll do another one. I'll do another one.

2035
01:29:12,439 --> 01:29:15,119
Speaker 3: Then the Magic are gonna be going to Vegas for

2036
01:29:15,199 --> 01:29:16,039
the NBA Cup Final.

2037
01:29:16,840 --> 01:29:19,039
Speaker 1: All right, that's the NBA isna.

2038
01:29:20,439 --> 01:29:22,640
Speaker 3: They have been a good They've been a good NBA

2039
01:29:22,720 --> 01:29:25,880
Cup team. They they when they finished their game in

2040
01:29:25,880 --> 01:29:28,079
the first the first year they finished their their Cup

2041
01:29:28,319 --> 01:29:30,479
their group games against Boston, they had like a twenty

2042
01:29:30,520 --> 01:29:34,039
point lead. Boston beat Chicago by thirty something, with Joe

2043
01:29:34,039 --> 01:29:35,920
Misula telling Billy Donovan like, I got to win this

2044
01:29:35,960 --> 01:29:39,640
game by thirty to advance. Last year, they had a

2045
01:29:39,640 --> 01:29:41,960
thirty two point lead heading into New York. New York

2046
01:29:42,560 --> 01:29:44,319
went up by thirty five just to prove a point.

2047
01:29:44,359 --> 01:29:46,239
And then Orlando went to Milwaukee and lost to the

2048
01:29:46,279 --> 01:29:48,560
to the eventual NBA Cup champions. Don't don't ever say

2049
01:29:48,600 --> 01:29:52,039
Damian Lillard didn't win anything in Milwaukee lost to the

2050
01:29:52,239 --> 01:29:55,279
eventual NBA Cup champions in the Bucks. I think the

2051
01:29:55,319 --> 01:29:57,560
Magic are going to Vegas at the very least, and

2052
01:29:57,600 --> 01:29:59,079
I think they'll be in the NBA Cup Final.

2053
01:29:59,439 --> 01:30:01,760
Speaker 1: I love it. Philip, this was great. Thank you for

2054
01:30:01,880 --> 01:30:04,199
giving me so much of your time. Are you able

2055
01:30:04,239 --> 01:30:06,319
just to tell our listeners, anyone who's watching our audience

2056
01:30:06,319 --> 01:30:09,800
where they can find you in all the fantabulous work

2057
01:30:09,880 --> 01:30:10,600
that you put out.

2058
01:30:11,319 --> 01:30:12,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, best place to find me.

2059
01:30:13,079 --> 01:30:15,079
Speaker 3: If you enjoy listening to my voice or seeing my

2060
01:30:15,119 --> 01:30:17,279
smiling face, you can check me out on the Lockdown

2061
01:30:17,319 --> 01:30:20,000
Magic podcast. You can download that wherever you download podcasts.

2062
01:30:20,000 --> 01:30:22,520
We're also on YouTube to search for Lockdown Magic, and

2063
01:30:22,600 --> 01:30:25,600
you can find my writing at Orlando Magic Daily dot com.

2064
01:30:26,239 --> 01:30:28,159
Best place to follow me is on Twitter at Philip

2065
01:30:28,319 --> 01:30:31,239
r Underscore O and d or at Omagic Daily.

2066
01:30:31,319 --> 01:30:33,359
Speaker 2: I'm also on Blue Sky at Philip r R.

2067
01:30:33,680 --> 01:30:35,520
Speaker 1: You can find the links to his social media stuff

2068
01:30:35,520 --> 01:30:37,560
and his work at Lockdown Magic. It will be in

2069
01:30:37,560 --> 01:30:40,199
the YouTube podcast description. Again, thank you so much. This

2070
01:30:40,319 --> 01:30:42,159
was great. Can't believe it took me so long to

2071
01:30:42,199 --> 01:30:44,960
get you on this podcast. Rest assured I will be

2072
01:30:45,000 --> 01:30:47,880
pestering you again down the line, and as always, leave

2073
01:30:47,880 --> 01:30:49,560
everybody with the shout out to the one and the

2074
01:30:49,640 --> 01:30:51,279
only mister Frank Neil A Kina