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<v Speaker 1>Welcome, dear listener, and thanks for joining us. And I'm

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<v Speaker 1>Stephen and.

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<v Speaker 2>This is a podcast all about the weird and wonderful

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<v Speaker 2>world of the Dark comedy anthology series Inside number nine.

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<v Speaker 1>On each episode, we'll be diving into another one of

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<v Speaker 1>Steve Pemberton and Reese Shearsmith's twisted tales, putting it under

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<v Speaker 1>a lens, and examining it within an inch of its life.

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<v Speaker 2>So make yourself comfortable, grab a cup of tea, and

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<v Speaker 2>join us for the ninth degree. Hello, Hello, Hello, welcome back.

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<v Speaker 2>How are you?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I'm all right. How are you?

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<v Speaker 2>I'm good? Thank you old, I'm old? Yeah, thank exciting

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<v Speaker 2>going on with you?

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, we've got a new sofa delivered. That's about

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<v Speaker 1>as exciting as it gets. All saying that I finished

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<v Speaker 1>my book oh yeah, which was good, which I was

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<v Speaker 1>going to bring up in this episode anyway.

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<v Speaker 2>Actually, so well, if it's all I think it is,

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<v Speaker 2>it kind of fits exactly.

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<v Speaker 1>So yeah, more on that later. Yeah, but yes, should

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<v Speaker 1>we reveal last week's hair Hmmm?

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<v Speaker 2>It was one of mine. It was quite an obvious one.

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<v Speaker 2>But I feel like we're getting to the point in

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<v Speaker 2>the series where they're maybe going to start getting a

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<v Speaker 2>bit more obvious. It was control alt escape. They're going

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<v Speaker 2>to take control of the situation with Arlow distracting the

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<v Speaker 2>guards and all the people. They're going to swap out

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<v Speaker 2>the coffee for some reason. They're going to run away

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<v Speaker 2>with the diamonds. So you could say their plot is

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<v Speaker 2>just to control escape. I know it was obvious, but yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>the same term, I'm not sure where we're going to

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<v Speaker 2>get it in.

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<v Speaker 1>No exactly, we're getting to the point where the ones

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<v Speaker 1>we've been leaving because we've been thinking out how are

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<v Speaker 1>we going to get that in? They're kind of all

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<v Speaker 1>stacking up now.

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<v Speaker 2>But yes, so this week, yes, we are back with

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<v Speaker 2>episode two of series six. Simon says the summary for

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<v Speaker 2>this on it's quite a long one, everyone says the

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<v Speaker 2>season seven finale of Fantasy Epic The Ninth Circle was

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<v Speaker 2>pretty disappointing. Even show a Spencer Maguire is keen to

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<v Speaker 2>move on to new projects, but not everyone thinks that

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<v Speaker 2>it has to be the end of the matter. In fact,

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<v Speaker 2>Ninth Circle obsessive Simon Smethurst decides to visit his hero

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<v Speaker 2>to help put things right, because that's what the fans

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<v Speaker 2>would want.

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<v Speaker 1>Cool, it's almost as long as the episode.

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<v Speaker 2>Thoughts, I like it, I really like it. A couple

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<v Speaker 2>of gripes, but yeah, I do really like it.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's quite an awkward one to be sitting here

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<v Speaker 1>doing a podcast about it. Yeah, how ironic.

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<v Speaker 2>But yeah, with a podcast, of course you do.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean I think that's quite understandable, making a

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<v Speaker 1>podcast about a show he loves, Great Adventure, Mystery Romance.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, it's obviously a very good show.

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<v Speaker 2>He's clearly everyone loved it. It is. It is so

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<v Speaker 2>like relevant that it's like continues to be with every

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<v Speaker 2>big series that gets a finale. It just reinforces this

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<v Speaker 2>thing that it's almost impossible to stick a landing in

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<v Speaker 2>these things that pleases. It is everyone not even pleases,

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<v Speaker 2>everyone pleases a majority is impossible.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I do think it's because everyone gets so invested

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<v Speaker 1>in it and they've invested a lot of time in it. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>and then it lives in your own imagination.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Plus it's the sort of wisdom of crowds thing

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<v Speaker 2>of like go back twenty years or not even that long,

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<v Speaker 2>Like people couldn't talk so openly about it and discuss

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<v Speaker 2>it as easily. It would just be with their friends,

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<v Speaker 2>and that would be it. Whereas now you've got Reddit

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<v Speaker 2>and you've got all these forums and all these things,

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<v Speaker 2>and people will ultimately, like a crowd of thousands will

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<v Speaker 2>ultimately come up with a better ending than one person could. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>and it's never going to live up to what they want.

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<v Speaker 2>And even if it does live up to what they say, well,

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<v Speaker 2>then they're going to be disappointed because oh, well that

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<v Speaker 2>was the obvious answer or whatever. Yes, you just can't win.

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<v Speaker 1>No, But also it is that you know, artistic integrity

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<v Speaker 1>and like, you know, the person who created it, surely

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<v Speaker 1>their vision must count for something.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you think so.

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<v Speaker 1>So I don't know. It's tricky, isn't it. Yeah, And

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<v Speaker 1>obviously for them as as you know, creators, writers, showrunners themselves,

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<v Speaker 1>it's well, there's that side of it. But I feel

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<v Speaker 1>like they're also quite nerdy, fan inclined people themselves, So

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<v Speaker 1>I feel like there's probably the two sides there. They

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<v Speaker 1>probably understand both sides.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, they are such fanboys of certain genres. Yeah, it's

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<v Speaker 2>so hard not to do what they complain fans do. Like,

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<v Speaker 2>everyone's got an opinion. It doesn't mean your opinion's worth anything,

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<v Speaker 2>but everyone's got one.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, I mean, obviously we will get into it,

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<v Speaker 1>but I feel like this episode does quite a good

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<v Speaker 1>job of showing Okay, you know there's the extreme unpleasant

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<v Speaker 1>side of fandom, but there's also a more gentle, sort

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<v Speaker 1>of appreciative and nicer side of it as well.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's all about trying to stay on the right side.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes exactly. But I don't think anyone thinks they're on

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<v Speaker 1>Simon's side, just that you all think you're doing the

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<v Speaker 1>right thing. It's like, you know, the villain is never

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<v Speaker 1>the villain in their own story.

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<v Speaker 2>It's the Internet to blame. I blame the Internet for

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<v Speaker 2>all of that.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, the Internet is the root of all evil,

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<v Speaker 1>says we're making a podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>But it's where it comes from. If it's come from

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<v Speaker 2>a place of actual love of the thing, oh exactly, exactly,

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<v Speaker 2>then it's a bit different.

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<v Speaker 1>The Internet's just the just the medium. It's the people

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<v Speaker 1>and the the culture that can come up. Because I

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<v Speaker 1>don't know, I was I was going to bring this up.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm not sure when was the right moment, but maybe

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<v Speaker 1>now that it's it's interesting. I don't get it. But

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<v Speaker 1>Reys Sheersmith mm HM has quite a following and some

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<v Speaker 1>of his fans can be a bit strange to put

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<v Speaker 1>it that way. I mean, obviously this episode is a

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<v Speaker 1>lot about parasocial relationships, and I feel like, I don't

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<v Speaker 1>know what it is about this man, Reece Shearsmith that

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<v Speaker 1>seems to inspire an awful lot of that from what

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<v Speaker 1>I've seen online.

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<v Speaker 2>Interesting yep, And I mean I feel.

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<v Speaker 1>Sorry for him that he has this going on.

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<v Speaker 2>It must be so scary. Yeah, you put these things

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<v Speaker 2>out into the world and it's just oh, well, like

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<v Speaker 2>I don't make a spreadsheet at work and then expect

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<v Speaker 2>to get vilified on the internet for it.

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<v Speaker 1>Whatever.

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<v Speaker 2>It's just at work, I replied to an email or whatever,

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<v Speaker 2>like it's the same thing at the end of the day. Yes,

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<v Speaker 2>but your work is seen by millions hopefully, and yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>it's then what people do with that. Yeah, it must

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<v Speaker 2>be weird. Like, you know, when you go to these conventions,

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<v Speaker 2>it's like all these most people have gone are meaning well,

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<v Speaker 2>but when you get someone that's you know, brings up

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<v Speaker 2>some pasta glued together the thing of you or whatever

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<v Speaker 2>that they want to give you, and it must be

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<v Speaker 2>really weird.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean, yeah, I guess a pasta glue together

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<v Speaker 1>thing isn't isn't that?

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<v Speaker 2>You know what you see? You see all the tiktopes

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<v Speaker 2>of people presenting things to people. Yeah yeah, oh I

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<v Speaker 2>don't know. I get such secondhand embarrassment.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Now, I think for me it's more like the

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<v Speaker 1>you know, keeping tabs on where you're going to be

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<v Speaker 1>and being there so that you can follow them and

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<v Speaker 1>sort of you know, it becomes a bit stalkrish.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, yeah, but no, but.

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<v Speaker 1>All of it is. I know it's a it's all related,

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<v Speaker 1>but it's like where you draw the line, like between

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<v Speaker 1>being a fan and being inappropriate and not respectful.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, there's one thing like going to a stage door

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<v Speaker 2>of for play. There's another thing like hunting them down

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<v Speaker 2>at a restaurant or wherever.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah yeah, so yeah, I'm sure none of our

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<v Speaker 1>listeners are that way inclined.

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<v Speaker 2>Yea, yeah, don't find me and Tesca.

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<v Speaker 1>No, oh, I didn't mean for us. I meant for.

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<v Speaker 2>I have to go out in the big hat and

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<v Speaker 2>the glasses.

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<v Speaker 1>Now yeah, yeah, someone will just seeing Tescas and they

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<v Speaker 1>just hear some voice saying I haven't considered that.

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<v Speaker 2>I know that. Someone did say to me at work

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<v Speaker 2>they'd heard I did a podcast and I was like,

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<v Speaker 2>that's weird. How did that happen?

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<v Speaker 1>How did that get around?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I don't know. He didn't want, he wouldn't say,

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<v Speaker 2>And I'm like, that's even creepier.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that is funny, isn't it.

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<v Speaker 2>You told anyone? Yeah, it's very weird. Hi, if you're listening, Pablo.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, a few quite a few episodes ago, we did

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<v Speaker 1>Empty Orchestra. I was saying about the character that Steve

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<v Speaker 1>played reminded me very much of my colleague. And then

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<v Speaker 1>when I left my place of work, my colleague said, oh,

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<v Speaker 1>I might listen to your podcast now you're leaving. No,

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<v Speaker 1>listen to that one, oh dear. Anyway, So the moral

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<v Speaker 1>of that little diversion was, don't be weird about people.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, just be normal, Just be normally.

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<v Speaker 1>Respectful, understand that people are human beings.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>And also just because you've seen someone on the TV

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<v Speaker 1>a lot and they've been in your living room, because

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<v Speaker 1>they're on your TV, he doesn't mean you know them.

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<v Speaker 2>No, And like it's one thing if they're like a

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<v Speaker 2>director or something where they're not playing a character, but

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<v Speaker 2>especially for actors and things where you really don't know

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<v Speaker 2>them you've never seen the real them very much.

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<v Speaker 1>So weird though, isn't it? Because you hear about people

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<v Speaker 1>who've like played villains and things, or they've been in

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<v Speaker 1>a soap and they've done something horrible to someone and

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<v Speaker 1>then they get attacked in the street or people like

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<v Speaker 1>spit at them in the street and stuff. It's like,

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<v Speaker 1>it's not me, that's a character.

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<v Speaker 2>So weird, isn't it.

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<v Speaker 1>And certain people just can't People can't get their heads

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<v Speaker 1>around it.

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<v Speaker 2>No. I remember. I know this is going back a

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<v Speaker 2>very long time, but a friend of mine's dad once

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<v Speaker 2>worked as a taxi driver in Manchester and he'd got

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<v Speaker 2>someone asking to be taken to the courthouse in Manchester

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<v Speaker 2>because they wanted to see Deirdre's trial from Coronation Street.

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<v Speaker 2>This is going back and he was like, oh, you're

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<v Speaker 2>going to go and see it being filmed? Is that now?

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<v Speaker 2>I want to go and sit and watch the trial.

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<v Speaker 2>You know it's not real, right, it's insane Jesus. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>So I worry about people.

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<v Speaker 1>It's like these people who don't don't understand that writers exist,

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<v Speaker 1>and they seem to think the actors just make it

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<v Speaker 1>up as they go along.

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<v Speaker 2>You see, there's a lot more to the credits than.

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<v Speaker 1>The very strange the way people's minds work.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I worry about people.

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<v Speaker 1>Speaking of which, shall we discuss the episode?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, probably should. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>So Steve's character, Spencer Maguire, great name.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's a great way.

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<v Speaker 1>Great hair. Yeah, it's amazing, isn't it.

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<v Speaker 2>It's an interesting I like it. I like it.

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<v Speaker 1>And then the glasses he just he comes across as

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<v Speaker 1>such a pretentious you know, he's very he's obviously a

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<v Speaker 1>very crafted image. And that's another thing like that. We

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<v Speaker 1>are in this world now where creates on TV shows

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<v Speaker 1>like that are the sort of becoming public figures in

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<v Speaker 1>a way that they weren't before. Yeah, like Russell cy

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<v Speaker 1>Davies for example. Yeah, you know, he's a face of

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<v Speaker 1>like say, doctor Who in a way that it just

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<v Speaker 1>wouldn't have been in like the nineties, or you've.

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<v Speaker 2>Never heard of him, like not never heard of him,

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<v Speaker 2>but you wouldn't ever hear about what he has to

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<v Speaker 2>think about anything, yeah, thirty years ago. Yeah, in the

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<v Speaker 2>same way. It's strange.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's interesting. It So obviously he's been to an

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<v Speaker 1>awards night, got very drunk in his.

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<v Speaker 2>Club indeed, and come back covered in blood. There's always

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<v Speaker 2>a good way to end a night. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>I think when when you first watch it, the immediate

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<v Speaker 1>assumption is that he has murdered someone. I think he's

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<v Speaker 1>so like, oh my god, clean, clean, clean, and panicking

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<v Speaker 1>like that. Yeah, like he's trying to get rid of

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<v Speaker 1>any evidence.

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<v Speaker 2>It's creepy music and all that dark room and yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>what's he done.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's a nice apartment he has.

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<v Speaker 2>M Yeah, it's nice. Which were not necessarily in a

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<v Speaker 2>nine this week the apartment wise, no, which is fine.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not complaining. I thought you're going to tell.

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<v Speaker 1>Me of no. No, I know, well, I don't have

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<v Speaker 1>a problem.

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<v Speaker 2>With it in a way that it's not the apartment

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<v Speaker 2>meant they could have gone to different locations, yet they

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<v Speaker 2>still stuck to the apartment.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, because it's very much a staple, isn't it. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>So the way I see it, obviously, the show is

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<v Speaker 1>called the Ninth Circle, which is a reference to the

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<v Speaker 1>circles of Hell. Yes, and I see it as that

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<v Speaker 1>Simon is putting Spencer into the Ninth Circle of Hell

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<v Speaker 1>by what he's doing to him effectively, so he is

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<v Speaker 1>inside it in a sense.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, especially considering he's not interested anyway in the series,

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<v Speaker 2>like he's given. Yeah, he's dragging him back. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>So he is inside the nine of the Ninth Circle?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yes, yeah, so I can't remember my Dante. What

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<v Speaker 2>is the ninth circle?

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know what the ninth one is now. I

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<v Speaker 1>was going to look that up and I forgot.

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<v Speaker 2>Is that betrayers? I think that's betrayers and things? I

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<v Speaker 2>don't know, because I'm sure that's one step up from

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<v Speaker 2>the Devil who's in like Ice at the bottom, right,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm sure it's like Judice and stuff. Yes, if and

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<v Speaker 2>Brightly is in the ninth Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>So this show, I mean it's it's obviously a Game

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<v Speaker 1>of Thrones standing.

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<v Speaker 2>No, No, not at all.

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<v Speaker 1>Are you a Game of Thrones fan?

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<v Speaker 2>Yes? And no, I have watched it. I thought it

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<v Speaker 2>was okay. Yeah, I enjoyed it, but not in the

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<v Speaker 2>same way that everyone went mental over it.

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<v Speaker 1>No, I've never watched a single episode of it. No,

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<v Speaker 1>I sounded like one of those people. Then, I've never

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<v Speaker 1>watched a single episode of it. That I'm so proud

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<v Speaker 1>of myself. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>I held out until about series five and then I

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<v Speaker 2>watched it.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, it was all right, yeah, fair enough, I guess

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<v Speaker 1>part of the inspiration for this whole episode is because

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<v Speaker 1>it was it was quite a cultural thing that even

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<v Speaker 1>though I have never watched an episode, but I know

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<v Speaker 1>that the fandom was widely disappointed with the finale.

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<v Speaker 2>Massively yeah, and yeah, I was one of the Okay, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>I wasn't massively keen on it. It was very strange

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<v Speaker 2>finale it, considering it was such a massive phenomenon and

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<v Speaker 2>like making presumably an absolute fortune for Sky or HBO whoever.

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<v Speaker 2>The last series felt really rushed, I think was the

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<v Speaker 2>main issue, right, and like, I wouldn't have been as

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<v Speaker 2>against how it ended if it had had another five

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<v Speaker 2>or six episodes to get to that point and it

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00:14:28.159 --> 00:14:31.000
<v Speaker 2>made more logical sense. But it very much felt like

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<v Speaker 2>they got to an episode or two before the end

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<v Speaker 2>and went, oh shit, we've got to wrap this up now.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, right, this happens, that happens, that apps done. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>And it didn't logically build to it in the same

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<v Speaker 2>way that it should have, which is weird considering how

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<v Speaker 2>big it was. I can't imagine that HBO would have said, Nah,

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00:14:45.440 --> 00:14:48.480
<v Speaker 2>you've not got any more episodes, No, do you want

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00:14:48.480 --> 00:14:49.639
<v Speaker 2>to keep spinning it? Out fine.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, absolutely, Yeah, it's just endings are so hard, aren't they.

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00:14:55.000 --> 00:14:57.399
<v Speaker 1>And also I was thinking, like, for a show that

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<v Speaker 1>runs for so long like that, it just add to

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<v Speaker 1>this thing we were saying about it gives you the

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<v Speaker 1>fans more time with it in their heads and talking

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00:15:04.799 --> 00:15:07.159
<v Speaker 1>to each other. Yeah, Like if you just if it's

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<v Speaker 1>just a one season thing and it's it's already been

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<v Speaker 1>made and it's done, and then it airs like you've

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00:15:12.559 --> 00:15:14.519
<v Speaker 1>got till the end of that season and it's already

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<v Speaker 1>been done, you don't have as much time to sort

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<v Speaker 1>of think about, oh, it would be good if this

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00:15:18.080 --> 00:15:21.159
<v Speaker 1>happened and that happened. Whereas when it runs for years

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00:15:21.159 --> 00:15:23.480
<v Speaker 1>and years, you know, you've got all this sort of expectation.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I don't know how you end them well, no,

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00:15:28.200 --> 00:15:28.559
<v Speaker 2>in a way.

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00:15:28.600 --> 00:15:30.120
<v Speaker 1>Can you think of an example of a show that's

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00:15:30.120 --> 00:15:30.840
<v Speaker 1>done it really well?

321
00:15:34.519 --> 00:15:38.320
<v Speaker 2>No? Not really. The other commonly quoted one is Lost,

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00:15:38.840 --> 00:15:42.919
<v Speaker 2>which I think ends well. But and this sounds so

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00:15:43.360 --> 00:15:47.639
<v Speaker 2>like condescending that if you don't think it ended well,

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<v Speaker 2>you probably didn't really get it. I knew you were

325
00:15:49.799 --> 00:15:54.720
<v Speaker 2>going to say that, which is such a dickish thing

326
00:15:54.759 --> 00:15:56.120
<v Speaker 2>to say, but it's so true.

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00:15:56.559 --> 00:15:58.639
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I haven't watched it, but it's another one of

328
00:15:58.639 --> 00:16:02.200
<v Speaker 1>those such a sort of culturally prominent things.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I think it ended reasonably well okay personally, but

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00:16:07.039 --> 00:16:08.799
<v Speaker 2>I first watch I hated it.

331
00:16:08.879 --> 00:16:09.120
<v Speaker 1>Right.

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00:16:09.320 --> 00:16:11.120
<v Speaker 2>It was only on the second watch when I watched

333
00:16:11.120 --> 00:16:14.039
<v Speaker 2>it like series one to six back to back, okay,

334
00:16:14.159 --> 00:16:16.039
<v Speaker 2>rather than waiting a year year and a half between them.

335
00:16:16.080 --> 00:16:17.960
<v Speaker 1>So when your first watch, you were one of those thickets.

336
00:16:18.000 --> 00:16:20.840
<v Speaker 1>I didn't understand it. Yeah.

337
00:16:20.879 --> 00:16:22.519
<v Speaker 2>And then most people wrote it off and never watched

338
00:16:22.519 --> 00:16:25.360
<v Speaker 2>it again, I say, whereas a few years later I

339
00:16:25.360 --> 00:16:27.159
<v Speaker 2>went back to it. Yeah, yeah, I love it now

340
00:16:27.159 --> 00:16:28.919
<v Speaker 2>I'm rewatching it at the moment with my housemates, so

341
00:16:29.039 --> 00:16:31.080
<v Speaker 2>oh good. We'll see what he thinks at the end.

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00:16:33.159 --> 00:16:35.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I was toying with watching it at one point.

343
00:16:35.080 --> 00:16:36.919
<v Speaker 1>I was like, that seems like a big commitment and

344
00:16:36.919 --> 00:16:38.919
<v Speaker 1>it is something that is widely panned as like it

345
00:16:38.919 --> 00:16:41.480
<v Speaker 1>didn't didn't end well, is there? What is it worth?

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00:16:41.679 --> 00:16:44.080
<v Speaker 2>Yeah? I get into it, but yeah, their biggest problem

347
00:16:44.159 --> 00:16:46.000
<v Speaker 2>for me it feels like it was a show that

348
00:16:46.080 --> 00:16:49.240
<v Speaker 2>was designed to be about three series, and the studio went,

349
00:16:49.279 --> 00:16:50.759
<v Speaker 2>this is doing really well, make it.

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00:16:50.720 --> 00:16:53.519
<v Speaker 1>Six oh yeah, and.

351
00:16:53.440 --> 00:16:55.080
<v Speaker 2>They padded it and padded it and padded it and

352
00:16:55.080 --> 00:16:58.679
<v Speaker 2>padded it. Yeah, like those whole episodes that are rotterly pointless.

353
00:16:58.919 --> 00:17:00.840
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, and it was back in the day of

354
00:17:00.840 --> 00:17:04.680
<v Speaker 2>twenty fourish twenty five ish episode series. Yeah, and then

355
00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:06.759
<v Speaker 2>there was a big like one of those right strike

356
00:17:06.839 --> 00:17:09.640
<v Speaker 2>things that happened. And yeah, from series four onwards it's

357
00:17:09.640 --> 00:17:11.920
<v Speaker 2>cut down to about thirteen ish okay, and it's so

358
00:17:12.000 --> 00:17:12.680
<v Speaker 2>much better.

359
00:17:12.480 --> 00:17:14.759
<v Speaker 1>For it, oh yeah, slimmed down.

360
00:17:15.039 --> 00:17:17.319
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, it still should have ended a lot earlier

361
00:17:17.359 --> 00:17:19.720
<v Speaker 2>than it did, oh dear. And then they had to

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00:17:19.720 --> 00:17:21.759
<v Speaker 2>throw in so many weird ideas to keep it going,

363
00:17:22.319 --> 00:17:24.680
<v Speaker 2>which I think what kind of hurt it a lot.

364
00:17:26.039 --> 00:17:31.599
<v Speaker 2>But watch it. It's great. Maybe one day at least

365
00:17:31.599 --> 00:17:32.319
<v Speaker 2>watch the first series.

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00:17:32.359 --> 00:17:36.200
<v Speaker 1>The first is great, okay, but also like the American

367
00:17:36.240 --> 00:17:38.680
<v Speaker 1>thing as well, where they have you know, writer's rooms,

368
00:17:39.200 --> 00:17:42.680
<v Speaker 1>and it's a huge collaboration. I think sometimes that can

369
00:17:42.680 --> 00:17:44.920
<v Speaker 1>be a bit of a too many cooks situation.

370
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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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00:17:46.000 --> 00:17:47.720
<v Speaker 1>And then over here we've got more of the sort

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00:17:47.759 --> 00:17:50.599
<v Speaker 1>of you know, the singular show runner model. Yeah, and

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00:17:50.640 --> 00:17:53.359
<v Speaker 1>that that I think is maybe more, is maybe stronger,

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00:17:53.400 --> 00:17:56.640
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. Sometimes, Yeah, I guess you get it varies.

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00:17:56.799 --> 00:17:58.640
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you can get pros and cons. Like I said earlier,

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00:17:58.640 --> 00:18:00.440
<v Speaker 2>the wisdoms of crowds thing. If you have a group,

377
00:18:00.519 --> 00:18:02.799
<v Speaker 2>why you know, a big writers room, they can come

378
00:18:02.839 --> 00:18:04.400
<v Speaker 2>up with a really clever solution.

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00:18:04.160 --> 00:18:05.400
<v Speaker 1>To something that's true.

380
00:18:05.480 --> 00:18:08.200
<v Speaker 2>But equally, like you said, too many cooks and it

381
00:18:08.440 --> 00:18:10.119
<v Speaker 2>just you lose track of what's going on.

382
00:18:10.200 --> 00:18:12.440
<v Speaker 1>Then oh, you've got a big writer's room. But then

383
00:18:12.440 --> 00:18:15.559
<v Speaker 1>there's one like Headhuncho and they don't listen to anyone's ideas.

384
00:18:15.599 --> 00:18:20.160
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, people's motivations get like characters, sorry, motivations get

385
00:18:20.200 --> 00:18:25.240
<v Speaker 2>lost because people read them differently and it feels less believable.

386
00:18:25.359 --> 00:18:25.720
<v Speaker 2>I don't know.

387
00:18:25.960 --> 00:18:31.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, what can undrum m hm AnyWho. We've covered about

388
00:18:31.559 --> 00:18:32.720
<v Speaker 1>two minutes of this episode, so.

389
00:18:33.200 --> 00:18:35.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's in blood recently even turned up yet.

390
00:18:36.400 --> 00:18:40.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so he assaulted someone, Yeah, we find out. Yeah,

391
00:18:40.160 --> 00:18:43.200
<v Speaker 1>there's a ring of his intercom and it's this Simon chap.

392
00:18:44.440 --> 00:18:48.559
<v Speaker 2>Reese always looks creepy in and monitor. He always looks

393
00:18:48.559 --> 00:18:51.160
<v Speaker 2>really creepy and a monitor. I'm sure it's happened several times,

394
00:18:51.200 --> 00:18:52.759
<v Speaker 2>and it happens once in the last series as well.

395
00:18:54.440 --> 00:18:59.079
<v Speaker 1>He's a great character, Simon. He's weird, Yeah, creepy and

396
00:18:59.359 --> 00:18:59.920
<v Speaker 1>kind of scared.

397
00:19:00.359 --> 00:19:02.319
<v Speaker 2>Hm, you just don't know what he's going to do

398
00:19:02.359 --> 00:19:03.000
<v Speaker 2>at any moment.

399
00:19:03.319 --> 00:19:06.599
<v Speaker 1>No, but he's so he's so clever as well at

400
00:19:06.640 --> 00:19:08.000
<v Speaker 1>the manipulation.

401
00:19:08.000 --> 00:19:10.880
<v Speaker 2>So invested, Like how long has he been planning this?

402
00:19:11.240 --> 00:19:13.839
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, Like he knows exactly what to say at

403
00:19:13.880 --> 00:19:16.240
<v Speaker 1>any given moment, just to make things to play on

404
00:19:16.480 --> 00:19:17.279
<v Speaker 1>Spencer's mind.

405
00:19:17.640 --> 00:19:19.359
<v Speaker 2>It's been exactly how he wants it to work.

406
00:19:19.440 --> 00:19:21.279
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Like even right at the beginning when he's you know,

407
00:19:21.599 --> 00:19:23.880
<v Speaker 1>Spencer's trying to ignore him and like he wants to

408
00:19:23.880 --> 00:19:26.359
<v Speaker 1>pretend he's not there, and then he just says about

409
00:19:26.400 --> 00:19:28.319
<v Speaker 1>making a statement to the police. He's like, maybe I'll

410
00:19:28.359 --> 00:19:30.559
<v Speaker 1>just go and do that, And then immediately that that

411
00:19:30.640 --> 00:19:33.079
<v Speaker 1>makes him say, no, no, come on up. Yeah, he

412
00:19:33.119 --> 00:19:36.640
<v Speaker 1>knows exactly what buttons to push. Yeah he's amazing.

413
00:19:37.000 --> 00:19:38.880
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah he's a clever guy.

414
00:19:39.680 --> 00:19:41.640
<v Speaker 1>Yeah an asshole, but.

415
00:19:41.839 --> 00:19:43.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, oh yeah, I do not don his actions.

416
00:19:46.519 --> 00:19:49.680
<v Speaker 1>And again, I know we say this many episodes, but

417
00:19:49.799 --> 00:19:52.079
<v Speaker 1>I really really felt this one was a play like

418
00:19:52.319 --> 00:19:53.960
<v Speaker 1>needs to be on the stage.

419
00:19:54.319 --> 00:19:57.400
<v Speaker 2>I was going to say that, yeah totally. Was it

420
00:19:57.400 --> 00:19:58.759
<v Speaker 2>more fact that said, you know you've written a good

421
00:19:58.759 --> 00:20:01.400
<v Speaker 2>episode when you think, oh, there's a film idea gone, Yeah,

422
00:20:02.440 --> 00:20:03.799
<v Speaker 2>this would work so well as a player or a

423
00:20:03.839 --> 00:20:05.200
<v Speaker 2>film or something like a bigger thing.

424
00:20:05.359 --> 00:20:08.720
<v Speaker 1>Then yeah, but even you know, it's a very small

425
00:20:08.759 --> 00:20:11.200
<v Speaker 1>cast and it is just that one location that I

426
00:20:11.200 --> 00:20:13.680
<v Speaker 1>could totally see this on the stage.

427
00:20:13.400 --> 00:20:16.039
<v Speaker 2>Like yeah, it'd be p yeah, perfect.

428
00:20:16.160 --> 00:20:20.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So Simon tells him that he basically he filmed

429
00:20:20.920 --> 00:20:24.200
<v Speaker 1>this incident with another fan yeah, called Gavin.

430
00:20:25.519 --> 00:20:27.480
<v Speaker 2>At this point, Spencer only thinks he's hurt him.

431
00:20:27.759 --> 00:20:29.799
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, he only thinks he's hurt him. But then

432
00:20:30.000 --> 00:20:32.119
<v Speaker 1>Simon just casually drops that, oh he's dead.

433
00:20:32.039 --> 00:20:35.200
<v Speaker 2>So casually, yeah, I think you're pressed charges he's dead.

434
00:20:37.000 --> 00:20:42.319
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, yeah, poor Spencer at this point, like it's

435
00:20:42.359 --> 00:20:44.119
<v Speaker 2>that thing that you sort of feel like you might

436
00:20:44.160 --> 00:20:47.160
<v Speaker 2>lose your temper for two seconds and that's your life

437
00:20:47.240 --> 00:20:51.279
<v Speaker 2>over just because of something you did by mistake. Yeah,

438
00:20:51.640 --> 00:20:53.400
<v Speaker 2>what must be going through Spencer's mind at that point.

439
00:20:53.400 --> 00:20:55.359
<v Speaker 2>It doesn't really take much for Simon to really skew

440
00:20:55.440 --> 00:20:56.920
<v Speaker 2>him in the direction he wants him to go.

441
00:20:57.039 --> 00:20:59.359
<v Speaker 1>I mean, even when he thinks it's just he's just

442
00:20:59.400 --> 00:21:02.720
<v Speaker 1>assaulted it, h that's bad enough. The level of panic

443
00:21:02.759 --> 00:21:04.960
<v Speaker 1>that he has about oh god, this is probably ruined

444
00:21:04.960 --> 00:21:10.480
<v Speaker 1>my career. Yeah, to then realize actually he's dead. Crazy.

445
00:21:11.079 --> 00:21:13.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Do you find it a bit of a stretch though,

446
00:21:13.759 --> 00:21:17.119
<v Speaker 2>that he thinks that Simon's phone will be the only evidence.

447
00:21:17.359 --> 00:21:19.440
<v Speaker 2>When he's in apparently the center of London, there'll have

448
00:21:19.480 --> 00:21:22.440
<v Speaker 2>been like two hundred and seven CCTV cameras point at

449
00:21:22.480 --> 00:21:22.920
<v Speaker 2>that spot.

450
00:21:23.319 --> 00:21:27.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Maybe it was a dark alley.

451
00:21:27.640 --> 00:21:29.920
<v Speaker 2>I mean it was near embankment. I don't imagine his

452
00:21:30.000 --> 00:21:31.440
<v Speaker 2>own one. There's going to be a camera every two

453
00:21:31.480 --> 00:21:32.440
<v Speaker 2>inches in that area.

454
00:21:32.880 --> 00:21:37.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Oh well, and helpfully Simon has got rid of

455
00:21:38.000 --> 00:21:38.359
<v Speaker 1>the body.

456
00:21:39.599 --> 00:21:41.559
<v Speaker 2>I saw it. It's fine, You're good.

457
00:21:42.279 --> 00:21:43.759
<v Speaker 1>Because he's his number one fan.

458
00:21:44.640 --> 00:21:45.960
<v Speaker 2>Do anything for him.

459
00:21:46.200 --> 00:21:49.759
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So weird, isn't it? Like I said earlier, this

460
00:21:49.799 --> 00:21:52.880
<v Speaker 1>parasocial thing. He talks to him straight away, talks to

461
00:21:52.920 --> 00:21:54.279
<v Speaker 1>him like he's known him all his life.

462
00:21:54.880 --> 00:21:57.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's so weird, like when someone knows you but

463
00:21:58.000 --> 00:22:00.960
<v Speaker 2>you have no idea about anything about them. Yeah, he's

464
00:22:00.960 --> 00:22:02.640
<v Speaker 2>so uncomfortable for Spencer.

465
00:22:03.119 --> 00:22:07.839
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and the ownership as a fan, like the ownership

466
00:22:07.920 --> 00:22:10.200
<v Speaker 1>over the work. When he says about is this the

467
00:22:10.240 --> 00:22:13.799
<v Speaker 1>award that we won? Yeah, what do you mean we like?

468
00:22:13.920 --> 00:22:18.839
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I don't remember you filming anything proofreading my script.

469
00:22:18.880 --> 00:22:21.960
<v Speaker 1>So yeah, although sports people are the same, Like when

470
00:22:22.000 --> 00:22:25.240
<v Speaker 1>my mum's like, oh, you know we won against man

471
00:22:25.319 --> 00:22:28.240
<v Speaker 1>you last night, did you? I didn't know you won.

472
00:22:28.119 --> 00:22:32.160
<v Speaker 2>The pitch, let's say that to my mum as well.

473
00:22:37.359 --> 00:22:38.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean he's a very unlikeable I think.

474
00:22:39.079 --> 00:22:39.400
<v Speaker 2>I don't know.

475
00:22:39.440 --> 00:22:41.880
<v Speaker 1>I don't think Spence is a particularly likable character. I

476
00:22:41.880 --> 00:22:45.319
<v Speaker 1>think Simon is just so creepily unlikeable.

477
00:22:46.000 --> 00:22:48.960
<v Speaker 2>No that's not the best, but yeah, Simon is weird.

478
00:22:49.559 --> 00:22:52.240
<v Speaker 1>Thing is you can like, yeah, Spencer is not very nice,

479
00:22:52.440 --> 00:22:55.799
<v Speaker 1>but he is in a very high stress situation, and

480
00:22:56.160 --> 00:22:59.200
<v Speaker 1>you can you can understand, like when he's being treated

481
00:22:59.519 --> 00:23:02.079
<v Speaker 1>like this by somebod who doesn't know, like yeah, you

482
00:23:02.079 --> 00:23:03.480
<v Speaker 1>can understand him and pissed.

483
00:23:03.200 --> 00:23:07.319
<v Speaker 2>Off, like yeah he's been blackmailed like oh yeah, and

484
00:23:07.400 --> 00:23:09.519
<v Speaker 2>presumably he's been drinking as well, so he's not going

485
00:23:09.519 --> 00:23:13.079
<v Speaker 2>to be exactly fully there, like he's going to be

486
00:23:13.079 --> 00:23:15.039
<v Speaker 2>saying what he thinks rather than you're not going to

487
00:23:15.079 --> 00:23:22.759
<v Speaker 2>be polite about it. M M. Circumventing. It's a fantastic podcast, Yeah,

488
00:23:22.960 --> 00:23:25.839
<v Speaker 2>very clever. Is there some team somewhere that's just churning

489
00:23:25.839 --> 00:23:28.839
<v Speaker 2>out pun names for stuff? Probably like This is great.

490
00:23:30.000 --> 00:23:31.920
<v Speaker 2>It's like whenever you see a coffee shop in a show,

491
00:23:31.960 --> 00:23:34.680
<v Speaker 2>and it's always like has been or been there, done

492
00:23:34.759 --> 00:23:38.559
<v Speaker 2>that or whatever. If they're not some clever pun i'd

493
00:23:38.599 --> 00:23:40.200
<v Speaker 2>feel like someone's wasted the time.

494
00:23:40.640 --> 00:23:45.039
<v Speaker 1>Yes, you mentioned it earlier, but just that fantastic moment

495
00:23:45.079 --> 00:23:47.440
<v Speaker 1>of I have a podcast. Of course you fucking do.

496
00:23:50.119 --> 00:23:53.359
<v Speaker 2>It's almost like I can imagine them. I love both

497
00:23:53.400 --> 00:23:55.839
<v Speaker 2>of these guys, but I'm a little bit scared of

498
00:23:55.880 --> 00:23:59.279
<v Speaker 2>Reese and I can imagine like having that exact response

499
00:24:00.039 --> 00:24:00.759
<v Speaker 2>then yeah.

500
00:24:01.119 --> 00:24:02.799
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, like if you met him at stage door and

501
00:24:02.839 --> 00:24:04.599
<v Speaker 1>you said, I'll actually do a podcast about your work.

502
00:24:08.160 --> 00:24:10.759
<v Speaker 1>Oh great, Right, what's it called a listen.

503
00:24:12.680 --> 00:24:14.079
<v Speaker 2>Queue if you don't have a podcast.

504
00:24:14.400 --> 00:24:20.279
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's just I just love the dynamic and the

505
00:24:20.960 --> 00:24:24.200
<v Speaker 1>sort of the power play where like Spencer's trying to

506
00:24:24.200 --> 00:24:26.440
<v Speaker 1>get rid of him, like you know, I'll book you

507
00:24:26.480 --> 00:24:29.079
<v Speaker 1>a taxi and all that. Yeah, and then again he

508
00:24:29.119 --> 00:24:30.680
<v Speaker 1>didn't knows exactly what to say. It's like, oh, I

509
00:24:30.720 --> 00:24:32.400
<v Speaker 1>hope the police don't question me. I'm not very good

510
00:24:32.480 --> 00:24:33.079
<v Speaker 1>under pressure.

511
00:24:33.519 --> 00:24:38.759
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, he's so good, But.

512
00:24:38.680 --> 00:24:41.160
<v Speaker 1>Then it also shifts a bit, and you think because

513
00:24:41.200 --> 00:24:43.200
<v Speaker 1>he tells him to go and go into the other

514
00:24:43.279 --> 00:24:45.279
<v Speaker 1>room or whatever, and he, you know, slides the chain

515
00:24:45.319 --> 00:24:47.720
<v Speaker 1>on the door, and it's like he looks a bit sinister,

516
00:24:48.359 --> 00:24:51.039
<v Speaker 1>and you think, oh, actually, is this manipulation getting him

517
00:24:51.039 --> 00:24:53.480
<v Speaker 1>in trouble? And he's he's in danger. What's what's s

518
00:24:53.480 --> 00:24:54.799
<v Speaker 1>Spencer going to do to him?

519
00:24:55.079 --> 00:24:57.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this isn't ton of mine. He very easily could

520
00:24:57.920 --> 00:25:00.279
<v Speaker 2>have killed him right then. The whole ex it could

521
00:25:00.279 --> 00:25:04.920
<v Speaker 2>have been covering it up or whatever. But yeah, Simon's

522
00:25:04.920 --> 00:25:07.319
<v Speaker 2>got a great way with people and has totally chose

523
00:25:07.359 --> 00:25:08.480
<v Speaker 2>to use these powers for evil.

524
00:25:10.240 --> 00:25:15.839
<v Speaker 1>Yes, he's a weezy little ship. So he stays the

525
00:25:15.920 --> 00:25:16.920
<v Speaker 1>night m M.

526
00:25:16.920 --> 00:25:19.240
<v Speaker 2>Because the taxi back to sometimes would be quite expensive.

527
00:25:22.559 --> 00:25:24.920
<v Speaker 1>It would be I imagine, Yes, it would be a lot.

528
00:25:25.200 --> 00:25:29.519
<v Speaker 2>Yes, that's at least five hours of driving. It's a

529
00:25:29.559 --> 00:25:32.319
<v Speaker 2>long old way. But E's happy because he gets to

530
00:25:32.359 --> 00:25:36.920
<v Speaker 2>stay in the spare room with the head of facts. Yeah,

531
00:25:37.359 --> 00:25:39.279
<v Speaker 2>and the way he's like, oh, the fans will wet

532
00:25:39.319 --> 00:25:41.759
<v Speaker 2>themselves over this or whatever. It's like I fully expected

533
00:25:41.759 --> 00:25:43.920
<v Speaker 2>Spencer to be like, you're not telling the fans about this?

534
00:25:44.920 --> 00:25:48.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I know exactly, Yeah, but he's like yeah, yeah,

535
00:25:48.160 --> 00:25:50.720
<v Speaker 1>go along with it. But yeah, he's got such a

536
00:25:50.759 --> 00:25:54.519
<v Speaker 1>glow of like I'm special, I get to stay the

537
00:25:54.640 --> 00:25:56.160
<v Speaker 1>night at Spencer a Guire's house.

538
00:25:57.440 --> 00:25:58.279
<v Speaker 2>His plans working.

539
00:25:59.079 --> 00:26:04.359
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's I don't know, it's so cringey. M So

540
00:26:05.200 --> 00:26:09.200
<v Speaker 1>next morning, yep, we find out his goal what he wants.

541
00:26:09.799 --> 00:26:13.279
<v Speaker 2>We'll have an ultimate finale. Please get on that straight away.

542
00:26:14.319 --> 00:26:16.599
<v Speaker 2>I don't going back to Game of Thrones. That was

543
00:26:16.599 --> 00:26:18.279
<v Speaker 2>a big thing at the time. People want Game of

544
00:26:18.319 --> 00:26:20.680
<v Speaker 2>Thrones that there was like people putting with petitions and

545
00:26:20.680 --> 00:26:21.960
<v Speaker 2>stuff for them to refilm it.

546
00:26:22.039 --> 00:26:24.200
<v Speaker 1>I heard about this that apparently there was a go

547
00:26:24.400 --> 00:26:27.079
<v Speaker 1>fundme so like trying. You know, I don't know what

548
00:26:27.119 --> 00:26:28.920
<v Speaker 1>they thought was going to happen.

549
00:26:30.839 --> 00:26:34.599
<v Speaker 2>No, I don't know either, but yeah, there definitely was

550
00:26:35.079 --> 00:26:37.519
<v Speaker 2>m It's like, what they're going to do get everyone

551
00:26:37.519 --> 00:26:39.559
<v Speaker 2>back together, like all these sets will be locked to bits,

552
00:26:39.599 --> 00:26:42.240
<v Speaker 2>Like how how do you really think this is going

553
00:26:42.319 --> 00:26:47.119
<v Speaker 2>to work? But it was so hated that it almost

554
00:26:47.119 --> 00:26:50.519
<v Speaker 2>sort of started to make sense that it could happen. Yeah,

555
00:26:51.400 --> 00:26:54.920
<v Speaker 2>obviously I never believed it would, but yeah, at what

556
00:26:54.960 --> 00:26:56.799
<v Speaker 2>point does something have to be that hated that they

557
00:26:56.839 --> 00:26:57.359
<v Speaker 2>would do it?

558
00:26:58.440 --> 00:27:00.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's weird because yeah, they would never it would

559
00:27:00.720 --> 00:27:04.079
<v Speaker 1>be an omission that they were wrong essentially, and you

560
00:27:04.119 --> 00:27:05.480
<v Speaker 1>know they're never going to do that.

561
00:27:07.160 --> 00:27:10.400
<v Speaker 2>The similar thing with Stranger Things recently when that ended.

562
00:27:10.519 --> 00:27:11.519
<v Speaker 1>Oh yes I heard about that.

563
00:27:11.599 --> 00:27:14.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but everyone was like it wasn't a bad ending

564
00:27:15.240 --> 00:27:17.160
<v Speaker 2>spoilers if you a Strange of Things fan and had

565
00:27:17.240 --> 00:27:20.039
<v Speaker 2>watched it, But it was very much like if you'd

566
00:27:20.039 --> 00:27:21.640
<v Speaker 2>put a gun to someone's head and said, how end

567
00:27:21.680 --> 00:27:23.880
<v Speaker 2>this like the most straightforward way you can? That would

568
00:27:23.880 --> 00:27:26.720
<v Speaker 2>be kind of how it ends. Like it's not it's

569
00:27:26.759 --> 00:27:29.200
<v Speaker 2>not particularly clever, it just sort of ends how you

570
00:27:29.279 --> 00:27:30.039
<v Speaker 2>might expect it would.

571
00:27:30.160 --> 00:27:32.200
<v Speaker 1>Well, that's that's better than something.

572
00:27:32.200 --> 00:27:35.160
<v Speaker 2>It's not bad. Yeah, it's just not what people maybe

573
00:27:35.200 --> 00:27:35.920
<v Speaker 2>hoped it would be.

574
00:27:36.160 --> 00:27:40.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but I'd rather a straightforward, yeah that works ending

575
00:27:40.599 --> 00:27:44.599
<v Speaker 1>rather than you know, one that goes completely off the boy. Yeah.

576
00:27:44.640 --> 00:27:47.759
<v Speaker 2>But then everyone was like afterwards saying that they thought

577
00:27:47.759 --> 00:27:52.279
<v Speaker 2>it was so obviously like so straightforward and boring.

578
00:27:52.440 --> 00:27:54.079
<v Speaker 1>They thought it was going to be a secret finale,

579
00:27:54.119 --> 00:27:54.480
<v Speaker 1>didn't they.

580
00:27:55.759 --> 00:27:57.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but they thought that this was all like a

581
00:27:57.960 --> 00:28:02.759
<v Speaker 2>dream and like yeah, and people had themselves so convinced

582
00:28:02.799 --> 00:28:06.759
<v Speaker 2>over it, like part of me almost wants someone to

583
00:28:06.759 --> 00:28:09.319
<v Speaker 2>do that. How cool would that be if just out

584
00:28:09.319 --> 00:28:12.079
<v Speaker 2>of the Blue, they drop a new episode that was

585
00:28:12.279 --> 00:28:15.480
<v Speaker 2>you weren't expecting. Yeah, that says that, yeah, everything you

586
00:28:15.519 --> 00:28:18.599
<v Speaker 2>watch was wrong, Like this is the real ending. But

587
00:28:18.640 --> 00:28:21.079
<v Speaker 2>to do that, you've got to be so confident that

588
00:28:21.119 --> 00:28:23.039
<v Speaker 2>what you're ending, that your real ending.

589
00:28:22.839 --> 00:28:24.599
<v Speaker 1>Is actually good is yeah, it's worse.

590
00:28:26.759 --> 00:28:28.599
<v Speaker 2>So your real ending is not that great, but it's

591
00:28:28.799 --> 00:28:33.000
<v Speaker 2>even worse. But as of recording, there isn't a secret

592
00:28:33.039 --> 00:28:34.119
<v Speaker 2>episode that's dropped.

593
00:28:34.920 --> 00:28:40.319
<v Speaker 1>Of course not so yes, so he wants Spencer to

594
00:28:40.640 --> 00:28:43.440
<v Speaker 1>write a new finale. It's a serious seven M and

595
00:28:43.480 --> 00:28:45.680
<v Speaker 1>we get all this back and forth about things that

596
00:28:45.720 --> 00:28:48.039
<v Speaker 1>are thought of in the fan and like the two

597
00:28:48.079 --> 00:28:52.279
<v Speaker 1>heterosexual men that the fans ship yep, which is hilarious.

598
00:28:53.759 --> 00:28:55.039
<v Speaker 1>That happens all the time.

599
00:28:55.160 --> 00:28:59.720
<v Speaker 2>All the time. Sometimes you feel like it's intentional, and

600
00:28:59.759 --> 00:29:02.720
<v Speaker 2>sometime times is just the fans finding anything.

601
00:29:02.480 --> 00:29:06.200
<v Speaker 1>That's the thing. Yeah, Like sometimes it's it's kind of arguable,

602
00:29:06.680 --> 00:29:09.400
<v Speaker 1>mm hmm. Like I know in the Sherlock fandom, there

603
00:29:09.440 --> 00:29:11.559
<v Speaker 1>was a huge I mean there's lots in Sherlock, but

604
00:29:11.640 --> 00:29:15.799
<v Speaker 1>like mainly Sherlock and John people were like, oh, they

605
00:29:16.119 --> 00:29:19.799
<v Speaker 1>have such a chemistry and blah blah blah. And I

606
00:29:19.839 --> 00:29:23.079
<v Speaker 1>know that Martin Freeman and Benedict cumberbat Is, both quite

607
00:29:23.119 --> 00:29:25.880
<v Speaker 1>serious actors that take themselves quite seriously, got quite pissed

608
00:29:25.880 --> 00:29:28.160
<v Speaker 1>off with it, and we're like, you know, I remember

609
00:29:28.200 --> 00:29:30.559
<v Speaker 1>them being interviewed once or a panel or something, and

610
00:29:30.599 --> 00:29:33.039
<v Speaker 1>Benedict cumberback to being like, it's just quite frustrating when

611
00:29:33.039 --> 00:29:34.880
<v Speaker 1>it goes against what you're trying to do as an actor,

612
00:29:35.640 --> 00:29:37.640
<v Speaker 1>and Stephen Moffat sitting next to him sort of trying

613
00:29:37.640 --> 00:29:39.440
<v Speaker 1>to say, shut up, you know, don't puss them off.

614
00:29:41.279 --> 00:29:42.480
<v Speaker 2>We need these fans.

615
00:29:42.799 --> 00:29:44.279
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

616
00:29:43.400 --> 00:29:46.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, they can write what they want on Reddit and

617
00:29:46.599 --> 00:29:49.200
<v Speaker 2>make all the fan fictions they want exactly, but we

618
00:29:49.240 --> 00:29:52.279
<v Speaker 2>need them. Yeah. That was another one, wasn't it? Sherlock?

619
00:29:52.359 --> 00:29:54.640
<v Speaker 2>That ended on what everyone thought was going to be,

620
00:29:54.680 --> 00:29:56.359
<v Speaker 2>that there was a secret another episode coming.

621
00:29:56.559 --> 00:29:58.359
<v Speaker 1>Oh I don't remember. I remember the finale, and I

622
00:29:58.359 --> 00:30:00.559
<v Speaker 1>remember it being a lot of people disappointed.

623
00:30:01.160 --> 00:30:02.799
<v Speaker 2>So many people hated it that they were certain that

624
00:30:02.839 --> 00:30:06.160
<v Speaker 2>it was intentionally done badly, which must be the most

625
00:30:06.400 --> 00:30:09.160
<v Speaker 2>galling thing to not only people don't like it, but

626
00:30:09.200 --> 00:30:11.000
<v Speaker 2>people think you've intentionally made it. Yeah.

627
00:30:11.559 --> 00:30:14.799
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, oh, come on, stop pulling our legs. That wasn't

628
00:30:14.839 --> 00:30:17.039
<v Speaker 1>really what you're delivering as the ending.

629
00:30:17.079 --> 00:30:18.519
<v Speaker 2>That was really the best I could manage.

630
00:30:18.559 --> 00:30:25.240
<v Speaker 1>Sorry, yeah, good one. Stephen pull the other one.

631
00:30:27.720 --> 00:30:29.759
<v Speaker 2>At the press night, feeling like, guys, are you free

632
00:30:29.799 --> 00:30:31.119
<v Speaker 2>next week to film another end?

633
00:30:35.000 --> 00:30:37.599
<v Speaker 1>And so yeah, so he plays his his chump card

634
00:30:37.920 --> 00:30:41.799
<v Speaker 1>keeps coming back to he's got this footage that Spencer

635
00:30:41.839 --> 00:30:45.640
<v Speaker 1>thought deleting off the phone meant that it was gone forever.

636
00:30:46.880 --> 00:30:52.519
<v Speaker 2>Bless him. So yeah, fall on blackmail territory, and it's

637
00:30:52.519 --> 00:30:55.559
<v Speaker 2>gotten proper creepy, like he stole his phone. He's arranged

638
00:30:55.559 --> 00:30:59.720
<v Speaker 2>a meeting with the agent for like now he's apparently

639
00:30:59.759 --> 00:31:03.920
<v Speaker 2>got he's his pa now. Yes, it's all escalated very quickly.

640
00:31:04.319 --> 00:31:06.240
<v Speaker 1>I was going to say, I'm surprised that the agent

641
00:31:06.400 --> 00:31:08.119
<v Speaker 1>went along with it, but I suppose he could have

642
00:31:08.160 --> 00:31:10.880
<v Speaker 1>just pretended, you know, he's hired me as PA or whatever.

643
00:31:11.640 --> 00:31:16.279
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, the agent's an interesting character, Loretta lamb. Yeah, I

644
00:31:16.279 --> 00:31:19.079
<v Speaker 2>find it weird if an agent doesn't actually like the

645
00:31:19.160 --> 00:31:21.839
<v Speaker 2>thing that you make, like that your main work. Yes,

646
00:31:23.720 --> 00:31:26.559
<v Speaker 2>I could understand it if like maybe she'd liked his

647
00:31:27.279 --> 00:31:29.519
<v Speaker 2>she'd like this, but she'd not liked his second project

648
00:31:29.519 --> 00:31:31.559
<v Speaker 2>he'd come on to. But yeah, his main thing that

649
00:31:31.599 --> 00:31:32.240
<v Speaker 2>he's known for.

650
00:31:33.119 --> 00:31:36.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well I mean he talks about years of experience

651
00:31:36.200 --> 00:31:39.000
<v Speaker 1>in the industry. I'm assuming maybe she liked something he'd

652
00:31:39.000 --> 00:31:42.279
<v Speaker 1>worked on previously. Yeah, and then this thing that happened

653
00:31:42.279 --> 00:31:44.839
<v Speaker 1>to be really successful. She wasn't keen on herself, but

654
00:31:45.359 --> 00:31:47.599
<v Speaker 1>I suppose, but it is. It is a funny moment

655
00:31:47.599 --> 00:31:49.640
<v Speaker 1>when she says, oh, I haven't seen it, Darling leaves

656
00:31:49.680 --> 00:31:53.680
<v Speaker 1>me cold. All that dungeons and dragons. Yeah, she's great

657
00:31:53.680 --> 00:31:55.880
<v Speaker 1>though that. She's so like showbiz Darling.

658
00:31:55.960 --> 00:32:03.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, Darling, Darling. Yeah, she's well happy. Yeah. I

659
00:32:03.480 --> 00:32:05.680
<v Speaker 2>guess work for him is probably drying up a little

660
00:32:05.720 --> 00:32:08.319
<v Speaker 2>bit because he didn't do so well. She's probably thinking

661
00:32:08.640 --> 00:32:11.799
<v Speaker 2>we can redeem this. I won't lose maybe my biggest

662
00:32:11.799 --> 00:32:16.720
<v Speaker 2>client or whatever. Yeah. Yeah, she's all on board. Oh,

663
00:32:16.799 --> 00:32:18.200
<v Speaker 2>she doesn't really know what it is, but she knows

664
00:32:18.200 --> 00:32:18.640
<v Speaker 2>it was bad.

665
00:32:19.599 --> 00:32:21.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, she knows the reaction was bad. Yeah. I just

666
00:32:22.000 --> 00:32:25.319
<v Speaker 1>like how Simon's trying to sort of excite her about

667
00:32:25.319 --> 00:32:27.319
<v Speaker 1>the plot. She just doesn't give a shit. No, I

668
00:32:28.279 --> 00:32:32.920
<v Speaker 1>guess who lit the flame of whatever it was. I

669
00:32:32.920 --> 00:32:33.680
<v Speaker 1>don't know, Darling.

670
00:32:33.759 --> 00:32:39.359
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, better than who did the last time.

671
00:32:39.920 --> 00:32:44.079
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Oh, is this the scene where he says about

672
00:32:44.240 --> 00:32:46.720
<v Speaker 1>characters doing things they should have done in the first place. Yeah,

673
00:32:46.920 --> 00:32:47.960
<v Speaker 1>really passive, aggressively.

674
00:32:52.400 --> 00:32:55.400
<v Speaker 2>It just escalates so quickly, and Spencer's in the middle

675
00:32:55.400 --> 00:32:58.359
<v Speaker 2>of this, going what were apparently we're announcing something that

676
00:32:58.400 --> 00:33:02.000
<v Speaker 2>I only heard about twenty minutes ago, Like, yeah, I know,

677
00:33:02.079 --> 00:33:05.160
<v Speaker 2>he thinks he's killed someone. Obviously that's bad. But the

678
00:33:05.200 --> 00:33:07.960
<v Speaker 2>grip he's lost on his entire life in the space

679
00:33:08.000 --> 00:33:13.279
<v Speaker 2>of about twelve hours is crazy, insane, And he's not

680
00:33:13.319 --> 00:33:16.079
<v Speaker 2>won the award. But we didn't expect it.

681
00:33:16.119 --> 00:33:18.640
<v Speaker 1>Darling, No, no, what.

682
00:33:18.720 --> 00:33:20.960
<v Speaker 2>Don't matter unless they're my clients.

683
00:33:20.960 --> 00:33:23.000
<v Speaker 1>Yes, in which case it was absolutely the right decision.

684
00:33:25.119 --> 00:33:27.359
<v Speaker 1>It's just very scary, Like so you do feel sorry

685
00:33:27.440 --> 00:33:31.200
<v Speaker 1>for Spencer, even though he's not that likable a lot

686
00:33:31.200 --> 00:33:33.440
<v Speaker 1>of the time. He's in a horrible situation.

687
00:33:33.880 --> 00:33:36.519
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, obvious he's not done a good thing, but it's

688
00:33:36.519 --> 00:33:40.000
<v Speaker 2>not like he's intentionally murdered someone, like, oh, he's just

689
00:33:40.039 --> 00:33:42.200
<v Speaker 2>snapped and presumably pushed him or whatever, and he's fallen

690
00:33:42.240 --> 00:33:46.279
<v Speaker 2>awkwardly like exactly, yeah, as far as he knows, and

691
00:33:46.319 --> 00:33:46.839
<v Speaker 2>it was it.

692
00:33:46.759 --> 00:33:50.160
<v Speaker 1>Was set up obviously to provoke him, because you know,

693
00:33:50.279 --> 00:33:53.680
<v Speaker 1>supposedly Gavin attacked or not attacked him, but touched him

694
00:33:53.680 --> 00:33:54.160
<v Speaker 1>first in.

695
00:33:54.119 --> 00:33:57.720
<v Speaker 2>Some way, and we've seen how manipula Simon is, like

696
00:33:57.880 --> 00:34:03.759
<v Speaker 2>people have engineered this situation. Jumping ahead a bit, but yeah.

697
00:34:02.400 --> 00:34:03.920
<v Speaker 1>So he's just he has him in the palm of

698
00:34:03.920 --> 00:34:07.000
<v Speaker 1>his hand. Now he can just make him do whatever.

699
00:34:07.680 --> 00:34:10.079
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and even when Spencer's trying to get out of it,

700
00:34:10.199 --> 00:34:12.960
<v Speaker 2>he's like just sort of waving the phone under his chin,

701
00:34:13.199 --> 00:34:17.320
<v Speaker 2>like I can ruin all of this for you, Like, yeah, yeah,

702
00:34:17.360 --> 00:34:19.440
<v Speaker 2>Simon is disgustingly sleazily awful.

703
00:34:19.440 --> 00:34:22.760
<v Speaker 1>And oh yeah, I feel this is why I should mention.

704
00:34:22.960 --> 00:34:25.760
<v Speaker 1>So the book that I've just finished, I've been reading

705
00:34:25.760 --> 00:34:28.679
<v Speaker 1>Stephen King's Misery yep, which I've been wanting to read

706
00:34:28.679 --> 00:34:31.599
<v Speaker 1>for a while, and I really enjoyed it.

707
00:34:32.000 --> 00:34:32.360
<v Speaker 2>Good.

708
00:34:32.760 --> 00:34:35.320
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, much better than The Shining in my opinion, right,

709
00:34:35.480 --> 00:34:37.719
<v Speaker 1>possibly because it's so sort of self contained and it's

710
00:34:37.760 --> 00:34:39.639
<v Speaker 1>like quite a small cast obviously characters.

711
00:34:40.119 --> 00:34:41.119
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's quite.

712
00:34:40.920 --> 00:34:43.239
<v Speaker 1>Inside Number nine actually when you think about it, Yeah,

713
00:34:43.280 --> 00:34:46.320
<v Speaker 1>you know, one location pretty much. But yeah, like I'm

714
00:34:46.800 --> 00:34:49.599
<v Speaker 1>having just finished that book and watching this episode, I

715
00:34:49.719 --> 00:34:52.159
<v Speaker 1>kept thinking of it just kind of like you know,

716
00:34:52.199 --> 00:34:54.119
<v Speaker 1>in the book Misery, she she claims to be his

717
00:34:54.199 --> 00:34:57.039
<v Speaker 1>number one fan, and she's she's got all this power

718
00:34:57.079 --> 00:34:59.360
<v Speaker 1>over him because he's lost the use of his legs. Yeah,

719
00:34:59.400 --> 00:35:02.000
<v Speaker 1>and she's just like, you know, forcing him to change

720
00:35:02.039 --> 00:35:04.559
<v Speaker 1>the ending of a book that she didn't like, like

721
00:35:04.719 --> 00:35:07.559
<v Speaker 1>to bring character back that died. It's very similar.

722
00:35:07.639 --> 00:35:10.039
<v Speaker 2>Actually, yeah, I don't I've not read it and I've

723
00:35:10.039 --> 00:35:12.320
<v Speaker 2>not seen the film, but that I was quite struck.

724
00:35:12.320 --> 00:35:14.360
<v Speaker 2>How what I knew?

725
00:35:14.800 --> 00:35:15.960
<v Speaker 1>I plan to watch the film.

726
00:35:16.079 --> 00:35:17.599
<v Speaker 2>The film's meant to be really good, I think, but

727
00:35:17.599 --> 00:35:19.719
<v Speaker 2>then everyone goes on says how great the shining is

728
00:35:19.800 --> 00:35:22.840
<v Speaker 2>so well maybe and I'm not such a fan.

729
00:35:23.519 --> 00:35:26.079
<v Speaker 1>Yes, I did read about I mean no spoilers for

730
00:35:26.199 --> 00:35:27.840
<v Speaker 1>I won't go to spoilers, but I did read about

731
00:35:27.880 --> 00:35:30.880
<v Speaker 1>one thing that they changed for the film, the Misery,

732
00:35:31.079 --> 00:35:35.039
<v Speaker 1>which seems a bit disappointing, but I'm sure they had

733
00:35:35.039 --> 00:35:37.880
<v Speaker 1>their reasons. But apparently Kathy Bates won an Oscar for it,

734
00:35:37.920 --> 00:35:39.360
<v Speaker 1>So yeah, I think she should be good.

735
00:35:40.159 --> 00:35:42.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's what made her a big name, isn't it.

736
00:35:42.760 --> 00:35:47.320
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that character of Annie Wilks was just so fascinating

737
00:35:47.960 --> 00:35:50.159
<v Speaker 1>and like delicious to read, like because she is in

738
00:35:50.239 --> 00:35:54.039
<v Speaker 1>set she's absolutely insane. Yeah, and yeah, I got a

739
00:35:54.079 --> 00:35:56.280
<v Speaker 1>lot of vibes of that from Simon in this.

740
00:35:57.000 --> 00:35:58.679
<v Speaker 2>I never heard any like them say that it was

741
00:35:58.679 --> 00:36:02.320
<v Speaker 2>intentionally based on it, But no, hard to imagine it isn't.

742
00:36:02.920 --> 00:36:06.760
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, influenced, I would imagine. Yeah, it's just having having

743
00:36:06.760 --> 00:36:09.360
<v Speaker 1>that much power. I mean, it's never a good thing,

744
00:36:09.440 --> 00:36:12.480
<v Speaker 1>is it having that much power over somebody?

745
00:36:12.920 --> 00:36:16.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's what the execs are for the studio.

746
00:36:18.559 --> 00:36:23.679
<v Speaker 1>So he makes him do his podcast. I love that

747
00:36:23.760 --> 00:36:25.920
<v Speaker 1>bit about do you have any idea how many times

748
00:36:25.960 --> 00:36:28.519
<v Speaker 1>a week I asked to do podcasts? And I have

749
00:36:28.559 --> 00:36:31.000
<v Speaker 1>great pleasure in saying no to every single one.

750
00:36:33.519 --> 00:36:36.480
<v Speaker 2>You must get inundated with it, Oh yeah, all these

751
00:36:36.519 --> 00:36:40.760
<v Speaker 2>people and effectively like it's like a job interview, Like

752
00:36:40.880 --> 00:36:43.199
<v Speaker 2>you're having to be on Like it's not like you

753
00:36:43.239 --> 00:36:46.880
<v Speaker 2>can just casually do a thing, Like if you say something,

754
00:36:46.960 --> 00:36:48.800
<v Speaker 2>it's going to be taking out of context and all

755
00:36:48.840 --> 00:36:50.159
<v Speaker 2>sorts of things are going to get said.

756
00:36:50.159 --> 00:36:54.199
<v Speaker 1>And yeah, it's it's not a casual thing when you're

757
00:36:54.199 --> 00:36:55.039
<v Speaker 1>in the public eye.

758
00:36:56.800 --> 00:36:57.920
<v Speaker 2>Should we get recent Stephen?

759
00:36:58.559 --> 00:37:04.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well, funny you just say that I sent an

760
00:37:04.559 --> 00:37:07.599
<v Speaker 1>email the other day. Did you know I was going

761
00:37:07.639 --> 00:37:09.440
<v Speaker 1>to going to joke? And so I've got a reply

762
00:37:09.559 --> 00:37:20.119
<v Speaker 1>back saying I take pleasure and saying no, it would

763
00:37:20.119 --> 00:37:21.360
<v Speaker 1>be quite an honor, actually, wouldn't it.

764
00:37:26.199 --> 00:37:30.519
<v Speaker 2>I've dissed Hold too many times to.

765
00:37:28.480 --> 00:37:34.639
<v Speaker 1>To well, I'm sure he feels the same. So yeah,

766
00:37:35.000 --> 00:37:39.360
<v Speaker 1>I quite enjoy the podcast scene because again, it's so uncomfortable,

767
00:37:39.400 --> 00:37:41.760
<v Speaker 1>like the way he's is. I mean, you know, if

768
00:37:41.800 --> 00:37:43.920
<v Speaker 1>you get a guest on a podcast, then it's a

769
00:37:43.920 --> 00:37:46.800
<v Speaker 1>guest of that caliber, like you kind of want to

770
00:37:46.840 --> 00:37:48.159
<v Speaker 1>be nice.

771
00:37:48.360 --> 00:37:51.039
<v Speaker 2>Yes, sir, No, so three bass and not.

772
00:37:50.960 --> 00:37:53.320
<v Speaker 1>Just sort of like reading them all the terrible reviews

773
00:37:53.360 --> 00:37:58.000
<v Speaker 1>and yeah, it's so awful, it's so painful, and he

774
00:37:58.119 --> 00:38:01.599
<v Speaker 1>just has to go along with it all. Hmmm when

775
00:38:01.639 --> 00:38:04.239
<v Speaker 1>he says to him about how does it feel hearing

776
00:38:04.280 --> 00:38:06.400
<v Speaker 1>all those because presumably didn't set it out to make

777
00:38:06.440 --> 00:38:14.320
<v Speaker 1>a bad episod TV. No, of course I didn't. Oh

778
00:38:14.360 --> 00:38:16.800
<v Speaker 1>my god. I mean there are a lot of people

779
00:38:16.880 --> 00:38:20.840
<v Speaker 1>like this in online fandom who probably would say those things.

780
00:38:21.239 --> 00:38:23.280
<v Speaker 2>And that's half the reason why everyone will say no

781
00:38:23.360 --> 00:38:25.679
<v Speaker 2>to doing podcasts, because they're like, once you've said yes

782
00:38:25.679 --> 00:38:27.519
<v Speaker 2>and you're on it, like, then what do you do

783
00:38:27.559 --> 00:38:29.039
<v Speaker 2>when they start asking you weird questions?

784
00:38:29.280 --> 00:38:31.360
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there's no sort of control for you, is there.

785
00:38:31.480 --> 00:38:34.000
<v Speaker 2>No, it's not like you're going on Graham Norton, like,

786
00:38:34.119 --> 00:38:36.320
<v Speaker 2>and you know that the kind of thing they're going

787
00:38:36.360 --> 00:38:38.800
<v Speaker 2>to ask you. M h like even the questions might

788
00:38:38.840 --> 00:38:40.920
<v Speaker 2>be vetting in advance or whatever. You can say, don't

789
00:38:40.960 --> 00:38:43.960
<v Speaker 2>ask me about X, Y and Z like you do

790
00:38:44.000 --> 00:38:46.480
<v Speaker 2>some random person's podcast. Yeah, it's very who knows what's

791
00:38:46.480 --> 00:38:49.880
<v Speaker 2>going to happens, very ad hoc. Yeah, I hope, I hope.

792
00:38:49.960 --> 00:38:53.719
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, this is obviously like a caricature. M yeah, I

793
00:38:53.719 --> 00:38:55.480
<v Speaker 1>hope we don't come across like that.

794
00:38:55.760 --> 00:38:56.440
<v Speaker 2>God, I hope not.

795
00:38:57.400 --> 00:38:58.079
<v Speaker 1>I don't think so.

796
00:38:58.719 --> 00:39:00.760
<v Speaker 2>I like to think we're positive as much as we

797
00:39:00.800 --> 00:39:04.400
<v Speaker 2>can be, and like always constructively positive, constructive criticism rather

798
00:39:04.480 --> 00:39:06.480
<v Speaker 2>than actual just outright I hate the thing.

799
00:39:07.119 --> 00:39:13.360
<v Speaker 1>Yes, well, right in, and let us know. The first

800
00:39:13.360 --> 00:39:15.920
<v Speaker 1>person to tweet us, we'll get a knife degree badge

801
00:39:15.920 --> 00:39:22.639
<v Speaker 1>in a word search, a cryptic crossword. I love that

802
00:39:22.719 --> 00:39:26.320
<v Speaker 1>it's a word search as well. That's so shit.

803
00:39:27.039 --> 00:39:33.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, dear, So this is the point where you get

804
00:39:33.280 --> 00:39:38.400
<v Speaker 2>another trope of casting nobody's as extras or background characters

805
00:39:38.559 --> 00:39:41.920
<v Speaker 2>or whatever in something because they want a competition characters. Yeah,

806
00:39:42.039 --> 00:39:43.719
<v Speaker 2>or in this case, actually yeah, they go to quite

807
00:39:43.719 --> 00:39:46.840
<v Speaker 2>a big character. I assume this was parodying again Game

808
00:39:46.880 --> 00:39:49.679
<v Speaker 2>of Thrones when they had like they had ed sheering

809
00:39:49.760 --> 00:39:54.320
<v Speaker 2>randomly in a scene. Yeah, he plays like a is

810
00:39:54.320 --> 00:39:57.840
<v Speaker 2>he guard and he ends up singing a song and yeah,

811
00:39:57.880 --> 00:40:01.559
<v Speaker 2>it's it's a bit weird. So I'm guessing that's what

812
00:40:01.559 --> 00:40:04.360
<v Speaker 2>they're sort of joking about here. Okay, but again, isn't

813
00:40:04.719 --> 00:40:07.039
<v Speaker 2>it isn't a random like it is a person but

814
00:40:07.400 --> 00:40:09.840
<v Speaker 2>in the industry in a way, but they're not an actor.

815
00:40:11.440 --> 00:40:14.440
<v Speaker 1>But I'm like, who are all these listeners that he

816
00:40:14.519 --> 00:40:18.400
<v Speaker 1>has for this podcast, because apparently eighty seven percent of

817
00:40:18.440 --> 00:40:21.000
<v Speaker 1>them are voted that he should play this role.

818
00:40:21.719 --> 00:40:22.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, is he is?

819
00:40:22.880 --> 00:40:25.639
<v Speaker 1>That just him? With like loads of different accounts.

820
00:40:26.599 --> 00:40:29.440
<v Speaker 2>He's just wrote that it's just it's just a word docular.

821
00:40:31.559 --> 00:40:32.519
<v Speaker 1>That's a PowerPoint.

822
00:40:33.360 --> 00:40:39.119
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's just a PowerPoint slide. Show me your figures,

823
00:40:39.159 --> 00:40:40.599
<v Speaker 2>like I want to see the lugs.

824
00:40:40.960 --> 00:40:43.800
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. But he's it's like he's got no self awareness

825
00:40:43.880 --> 00:40:47.159
<v Speaker 1>at all of how awkward is and that he's just

826
00:40:47.199 --> 00:40:50.079
<v Speaker 1>coming across like, you know, writing if you think I

827
00:40:50.079 --> 00:40:53.480
<v Speaker 1>should audition for the part, Like yeah, why would you

828
00:40:53.559 --> 00:40:53.960
<v Speaker 1>say that?

829
00:40:54.760 --> 00:40:57.920
<v Speaker 2>And even like Spencer's opening question, you know, he talks

830
00:40:57.960 --> 00:40:59.440
<v Speaker 2>about how you know this was my thing and now

831
00:40:59.480 --> 00:41:01.000
<v Speaker 2>it's up for any want to pull in any direction

832
00:41:01.039 --> 00:41:05.000
<v Speaker 2>they want. And Simon's like, yep, exactly, Like he doesn't

833
00:41:05.039 --> 00:41:07.840
<v Speaker 2>make any bones about sort of hiding what he's doing.

834
00:41:08.000 --> 00:41:10.679
<v Speaker 1>No, I think I guess part of what this episode

835
00:41:10.719 --> 00:41:13.360
<v Speaker 1>is doing is looking at like, you know, when you've

836
00:41:13.400 --> 00:41:16.960
<v Speaker 1>got consumers of a thing that by and large don't

837
00:41:17.039 --> 00:41:20.840
<v Speaker 1>understand what goes into making something, and they just and

838
00:41:20.880 --> 00:41:24.480
<v Speaker 1>you know, they sort of armchair experts. Yeah, like we

839
00:41:24.559 --> 00:41:25.760
<v Speaker 1>are on this podcast, I suppose.

840
00:41:25.760 --> 00:41:30.400
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, it's like that tweet you see whenever whenever

841
00:41:30.400 --> 00:41:32.199
<v Speaker 2>the's an election comes around and it's like, oh, the

842
00:41:32.199 --> 00:41:35.400
<v Speaker 2>comments section is about to terms to the House of Comments. Yeah,

843
00:41:35.599 --> 00:41:37.239
<v Speaker 2>everyone suddenly becomes an expert.

844
00:41:37.400 --> 00:41:40.599
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but there's a way of doing it sensitively, which

845
00:41:40.679 --> 00:41:41.800
<v Speaker 1>I like to think we try and do.

846
00:41:42.000 --> 00:41:43.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I like to think we do.

847
00:41:43.719 --> 00:41:48.760
<v Speaker 1>Whereas sensitive is completely not what Simon is completely insensitive

848
00:41:49.280 --> 00:41:50.920
<v Speaker 1>and just ham fisted.

849
00:41:51.880 --> 00:41:54.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, we're also treated.

850
00:41:54.039 --> 00:41:57.559
<v Speaker 1>To a bit of Simon's quote unquote acting.

851
00:41:58.400 --> 00:42:00.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, which kind of is back again.

852
00:42:06.000 --> 00:42:08.519
<v Speaker 1>Oh my god, I love that that's what he thinks

853
00:42:08.559 --> 00:42:11.440
<v Speaker 1>acting is. You've got this nabbing.

854
00:42:15.039 --> 00:42:20.719
<v Speaker 2>I'm just talk angry. But yeah, he can do what

855
00:42:20.760 --> 00:42:21.760
<v Speaker 2>he wants at this point.

856
00:42:21.800 --> 00:42:24.840
<v Speaker 1>Really, that's the thing he has become king if it's

857
00:42:25.239 --> 00:42:29.519
<v Speaker 1>his own little world or Queen Beets described later.

858
00:42:30.920 --> 00:42:32.519
<v Speaker 2>And this is the other thing that we never get

859
00:42:32.559 --> 00:42:36.320
<v Speaker 2>to see, Like what the reaction to this new final episode?

860
00:42:36.559 --> 00:42:38.599
<v Speaker 2>I know, I suppose we do. Don't we get some

861
00:42:38.599 --> 00:42:41.239
<v Speaker 2>more series? But could have equally been just as terrible.

862
00:42:42.159 --> 00:42:43.320
<v Speaker 2>That would have been interesting.

863
00:42:43.199 --> 00:42:46.760
<v Speaker 1>Only one person's idea, really if yeah, two people maybe.

864
00:42:46.519 --> 00:42:49.559
<v Speaker 2>But two people like what what Simon? How Simond have

865
00:42:49.559 --> 00:42:52.599
<v Speaker 2>reacted if the fan base hated his finale as well,

866
00:42:53.280 --> 00:42:56.840
<v Speaker 2>because they're going to yeah, yeah, by comparison, they might

867
00:42:56.880 --> 00:43:00.320
<v Speaker 2>like it more. So I suppose it looks good, but yeah,

868
00:43:00.519 --> 00:43:02.119
<v Speaker 2>go back to the question of how you make it good.

869
00:43:02.480 --> 00:43:05.119
<v Speaker 2>It reminds me of a quote from Sheldon in Big

870
00:43:05.159 --> 00:43:07.599
<v Speaker 2>Bang Theory Races. Why can't they just do like VI

871
00:43:07.599 --> 00:43:10.320
<v Speaker 2>did in Heroes and slowly gradually reduce the quality series

872
00:43:10.320 --> 00:43:11.880
<v Speaker 2>by series until are begging for it to end.

873
00:43:12.920 --> 00:43:15.519
<v Speaker 1>That's a great line.

874
00:43:17.400 --> 00:43:23.079
<v Speaker 2>So that is the fair way to do it, intentionally,

875
00:43:23.079 --> 00:43:24.079
<v Speaker 2>make no more care about you.

876
00:43:24.119 --> 00:43:26.199
<v Speaker 1>For exactly Yeah, many shares could take a leaf out

877
00:43:26.199 --> 00:43:31.079
<v Speaker 1>of that book. So is this where we get the

878
00:43:31.119 --> 00:43:33.519
<v Speaker 1>montage of him working on it and everything.

879
00:43:33.880 --> 00:43:37.119
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, bowling up paper, throwing it off screen. Do we

880
00:43:37.159 --> 00:43:39.320
<v Speaker 2>get the idea that at this point they're sort of

881
00:43:39.599 --> 00:43:43.320
<v Speaker 2>Spencer's getting a bit on board with it, like, maybe, Begod,

882
00:43:43.360 --> 00:43:44.920
<v Speaker 2>you need to start with him. Maybe he's actually getting

883
00:43:44.920 --> 00:43:45.760
<v Speaker 2>a little bit into it.

884
00:43:46.320 --> 00:43:48.679
<v Speaker 1>Maybe. I mean I felt like it was simply because

885
00:43:48.679 --> 00:43:49.880
<v Speaker 1>he had to to be honest.

886
00:43:50.199 --> 00:43:51.760
<v Speaker 2>Well, maybe I don't.

887
00:43:51.559 --> 00:43:54.280
<v Speaker 1>Think he's ever he's ever particularly thrilled about it, because

888
00:43:54.280 --> 00:43:56.400
<v Speaker 1>he does say later about, you know, as if I

889
00:43:56.440 --> 00:43:59.159
<v Speaker 1>would revisit my own work and whatever it is.

890
00:43:59.159 --> 00:44:01.920
<v Speaker 2>He says the difference between wanting to not wanting to

891
00:44:01.960 --> 00:44:04.480
<v Speaker 2>revisit it, though, and being forced to and now you're

892
00:44:04.519 --> 00:44:06.840
<v Speaker 2>in it, trying to make it the best it can be.

893
00:44:07.760 --> 00:44:09.719
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, maybe I didn't get the impression that he was

894
00:44:09.800 --> 00:44:11.239
<v Speaker 1>at all at any point into it.

895
00:44:11.280 --> 00:44:14.400
<v Speaker 2>But I don't think he's into it, but that he's

896
00:44:14.679 --> 00:44:17.519
<v Speaker 2>you know, doing what he can, Okay, because at the

897
00:44:17.599 --> 00:44:18.719
<v Speaker 2>end of the day, his name's gonna be honest.

898
00:44:18.800 --> 00:44:21.280
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, let's try and make a best of.

899
00:44:21.280 --> 00:44:25.159
<v Speaker 2>A bad situation. Yeah, he's got a final draft that

900
00:44:25.199 --> 00:44:27.760
<v Speaker 2>he's sending over to the writer, so it's actually happening.

901
00:44:28.559 --> 00:44:29.719
<v Speaker 2>And then the ship hits the fan.

902
00:44:30.079 --> 00:44:33.159
<v Speaker 1>Yes, so I put him. I put him big capsule letters, twist.

903
00:44:32.840 --> 00:44:41.480
<v Speaker 2>One, yes, damn dune, Damn Gavin isn't dead so little

904
00:44:41.559 --> 00:44:45.719
<v Speaker 2>nick my habit. Yeah, he's so sweet, isn't he? With

905
00:44:45.719 --> 00:44:46.400
<v Speaker 2>his little accent?

906
00:44:47.000 --> 00:44:50.360
<v Speaker 1>I added question mark that I'm not sure why why

907
00:44:50.360 --> 00:44:53.679
<v Speaker 1>the Scottish accent? Why not just use your your normal voice,

908
00:44:53.760 --> 00:44:56.360
<v Speaker 1>because there's certain lines It does really feel like it's

909
00:44:56.719 --> 00:45:02.400
<v Speaker 1>a bit of a strug. Oh but yeah, no, he's lovely.

910
00:45:02.159 --> 00:45:02.920
<v Speaker 2>He's adorable.

911
00:45:03.039 --> 00:45:06.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So it turns out it was the whole thing

912
00:45:06.199 --> 00:45:08.960
<v Speaker 1>was staged so that they could get access to him.

913
00:45:09.320 --> 00:45:11.440
<v Speaker 2>And Gavin would eventually get access, and he's not been

914
00:45:11.480 --> 00:45:12.639
<v Speaker 2>happy that he's been cut out of it.

915
00:45:13.519 --> 00:45:16.320
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. They get very very fussy with each other, very like,

916
00:45:16.360 --> 00:45:18.840
<v Speaker 1>you know, you know, I'd like some time with mister

917
00:45:18.920 --> 00:45:25.119
<v Speaker 1>maguire and you know, you need yourself, queen Bee the fandom.

918
00:45:25.280 --> 00:45:27.440
<v Speaker 2>I can just imagine what Spencer's saying in the background

919
00:45:27.440 --> 00:45:29.639
<v Speaker 2>to all these people in the forums and stuff, like

920
00:45:29.719 --> 00:45:31.639
<v Speaker 2>you will be selling it all like, oh, Spencer's my

921
00:45:31.679 --> 00:45:33.440
<v Speaker 2>best friend. Now, look at what we're doing together and

922
00:45:33.480 --> 00:45:36.800
<v Speaker 2>all this. Oh god, Yeah, it would be unbearable.

923
00:45:36.119 --> 00:45:39.360
<v Speaker 1>Posting photos on Instagram like selfies together.

924
00:45:39.480 --> 00:45:45.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, absolutely unbearable. So Gavin's had enough and he wants

925
00:45:45.519 --> 00:45:48.159
<v Speaker 2>his ship signed with his special silver pen.

926
00:45:50.760 --> 00:45:53.480
<v Speaker 1>And so Simon. It seems that Simon is very angry

927
00:45:53.480 --> 00:45:56.880
<v Speaker 1>with Gavin for kind of ruining the plan and that

928
00:45:56.920 --> 00:46:01.440
<v Speaker 1>he's been found out. Yeah, there's a rather unsavory thing

929
00:46:01.480 --> 00:46:07.840
<v Speaker 1>about photoshopped pictures, yeah, which which kind of takes on

930
00:46:07.880 --> 00:46:11.280
<v Speaker 1>more relevance later as well. Yeah, so it's very deliberately

931
00:46:11.320 --> 00:46:14.599
<v Speaker 1>placed there to sort of so the seed that Simon

932
00:46:14.800 --> 00:46:17.199
<v Speaker 1>has more, it's more than just a sort of love

933
00:46:17.280 --> 00:46:21.800
<v Speaker 1>for his creativity. It's you know, the man himself. But yeah,

934
00:46:21.800 --> 00:46:25.159
<v Speaker 1>it's a bit weird Reese's reaction when he's like, you

935
00:46:25.159 --> 00:46:27.320
<v Speaker 1>know that they were d m T in private, not

936
00:46:27.320 --> 00:46:31.320
<v Speaker 1>for a public forum, as if that makes it okay,

937
00:46:32.079 --> 00:46:32.719
<v Speaker 1>just weird.

938
00:46:32.800 --> 00:46:39.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, spicky. Yeah, all comes to head with Checkovs

939
00:46:39.880 --> 00:46:45.920
<v Speaker 2>yeah seeded a bit earlier on and stabs him with

940
00:46:46.039 --> 00:46:46.760
<v Speaker 2>an empty air war.

941
00:46:46.840 --> 00:46:49.320
<v Speaker 1>Yes, I love that. How quite early in the episode

942
00:46:49.360 --> 00:46:51.360
<v Speaker 1>he just says, oh you could well, he says, you

943
00:46:51.360 --> 00:46:53.639
<v Speaker 1>could bash someone's brains out with this, but you know

944
00:46:53.760 --> 00:46:55.880
<v Speaker 1>you can't say that in side number nine episode and

945
00:46:55.920 --> 00:46:58.400
<v Speaker 1>then not not expected to murder someone with it later.

946
00:46:58.559 --> 00:47:02.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I should clarify it's an NTA trophy, not an

947
00:47:02.400 --> 00:47:05.199
<v Speaker 2>NTA award, because an NTA award is a tautology. It is.

948
00:47:06.800 --> 00:47:08.800
<v Speaker 2>Well I realized once I said it, and then you

949
00:47:08.840 --> 00:47:10.760
<v Speaker 2>carried on talking. I was like, no, that your left.

950
00:47:11.280 --> 00:47:12.320
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you can't let that go.

951
00:47:12.599 --> 00:47:18.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, quite right, even my notes I've got NTA award

952
00:47:18.400 --> 00:47:22.840
<v Speaker 2>and halfway through writing award, by.

953
00:47:22.760 --> 00:47:25.880
<v Speaker 1>The way, apparently originally wanted it to be an em yes,

954
00:47:26.400 --> 00:47:28.840
<v Speaker 1>because apparently they're particularly spiky.

955
00:47:29.360 --> 00:47:32.320
<v Speaker 2>They are. Have you seen one? No, they do look

956
00:47:32.480 --> 00:47:33.639
<v Speaker 2>very much like a murder weapon.

957
00:47:33.719 --> 00:47:34.360
<v Speaker 1>Well there we go.

958
00:47:34.599 --> 00:47:36.800
<v Speaker 2>They're like an angel sort of statue, but its wings

959
00:47:36.800 --> 00:47:41.039
<v Speaker 2>are like really sharp, ah pointed straight up makes sense

960
00:47:41.119 --> 00:47:43.800
<v Speaker 2>And yeah, but no the emmy said no.

961
00:47:44.480 --> 00:47:45.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so yeah NTA it.

962
00:47:46.000 --> 00:47:48.000
<v Speaker 2>Was who apparently don't care.

963
00:47:48.559 --> 00:47:51.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, oh yeah with one of our awards. Fine, why not.

964
00:47:52.880 --> 00:47:54.920
<v Speaker 2>I'd love to know what their order of like then

965
00:47:54.960 --> 00:47:57.199
<v Speaker 2>we'd have gone to bafter and then we'd have gone

966
00:47:57.239 --> 00:48:01.440
<v Speaker 2>to like our YouTube for you a trophy or whatever.

967
00:48:01.880 --> 00:48:03.800
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, they were talking about this on the podcast and

968
00:48:03.800 --> 00:48:05.639
<v Speaker 1>they were saying, you know, they didn't even think about

969
00:48:05.679 --> 00:48:07.880
<v Speaker 1>bafter because it just it does. They wanted it to

970
00:48:07.920 --> 00:48:11.119
<v Speaker 1>be a stabbing, not a bludgeting. Yeah, and so they

971
00:48:11.119 --> 00:48:13.159
<v Speaker 1>needed something point makes sense.

972
00:48:13.400 --> 00:48:17.599
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and when they all like someone's actual trophies that

973
00:48:17.639 --> 00:48:18.559
<v Speaker 2>were on the crew or something.

974
00:48:18.639 --> 00:48:21.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, the producer Adam Tandy, I think, yeah, just casually

975
00:48:22.000 --> 00:48:28.920
<v Speaker 1>brings in all his like Nevill Griffin in misdirection. Yeah, yeah,

976
00:48:29.280 --> 00:48:31.159
<v Speaker 1>put them out on the side.

977
00:48:32.199 --> 00:48:33.920
<v Speaker 2>That must be an awkward conversation, like we need to

978
00:48:33.960 --> 00:48:35.440
<v Speaker 2>have a load of trophies and you just sat there

979
00:48:35.440 --> 00:48:37.840
<v Speaker 2>in the corner going do it look like a dick

980
00:48:37.880 --> 00:48:44.280
<v Speaker 2>if I say I've got shiploads of yeah, I could

981
00:48:44.320 --> 00:48:46.159
<v Speaker 2>save them a fortune of having to hire a load

982
00:48:46.199 --> 00:48:50.880
<v Speaker 2>of things. Yeah. Poor Spencer at this point he must

983
00:48:50.880 --> 00:48:53.239
<v Speaker 2>have been like, oh it's oh no, it isn't anymore.

984
00:48:53.320 --> 00:48:54.280
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, what a roller coaster.

985
00:48:54.400 --> 00:48:57.920
<v Speaker 2>He had a brief five minutes it was safe.

986
00:48:58.719 --> 00:49:00.360
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it really is a roller coaster, isn't it.

987
00:49:01.880 --> 00:49:06.159
<v Speaker 2>That doesn't slow down? So yeah, this bit I find

988
00:49:06.199 --> 00:49:10.239
<v Speaker 2>so uncomfortable. Oh very I'd forgotten how uncomfortable it was

989
00:49:10.320 --> 00:49:11.199
<v Speaker 2>until I rewatched this.

990
00:49:11.719 --> 00:49:17.719
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's horrible because Spencer looks so defeated and powerless,

991
00:49:17.760 --> 00:49:20.079
<v Speaker 1>and it's it's just very Yeah.

992
00:49:20.159 --> 00:49:22.840
<v Speaker 2>Simon sort of drags him into the bedroom.

993
00:49:22.880 --> 00:49:24.599
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, he says, I just want us to be together.

994
00:49:26.280 --> 00:49:29.440
<v Speaker 1>It's punctuated by the quite amusing turning the head away

995
00:49:29.519 --> 00:49:30.159
<v Speaker 1>so that he's.

996
00:49:30.000 --> 00:49:32.360
<v Speaker 2>Not looking at it, isn't looking at us.

997
00:49:32.480 --> 00:49:37.079
<v Speaker 1>We don't want him looking at a stew we. I

998
00:49:37.119 --> 00:49:38.920
<v Speaker 1>was on this when I was watching this the second time,

999
00:49:39.079 --> 00:49:41.280
<v Speaker 1>making notes. I was trying to sort of watch very

1000
00:49:41.280 --> 00:49:45.639
<v Speaker 1>carefully what exactly what Reese's character does. All he really

1001
00:49:45.639 --> 00:49:48.280
<v Speaker 1>does is invite him to lie down, and then I

1002
00:49:48.320 --> 00:49:53.159
<v Speaker 1>think he possibly strokes him slightly or something. But the

1003
00:49:53.199 --> 00:49:55.280
<v Speaker 1>idea obviously is that it seems like he's trying to

1004
00:49:55.280 --> 00:49:56.360
<v Speaker 1>blackmail him into.

1005
00:49:57.719 --> 00:50:00.159
<v Speaker 2>Which the naked photos makes more.

1006
00:50:00.079 --> 00:50:02.079
<v Speaker 1>Sense now exactly exactly.

1007
00:50:02.079 --> 00:50:03.679
<v Speaker 2>These are things that I think we said earlier what

1008
00:50:03.719 --> 00:50:05.400
<v Speaker 2>you would do in a play like I think you

1009
00:50:05.440 --> 00:50:08.360
<v Speaker 2>could flesh out, expand that more, that more and make

1010
00:50:08.400 --> 00:50:10.920
<v Speaker 2>it a little bit more, a little bit less jarring

1011
00:50:10.920 --> 00:50:11.840
<v Speaker 2>when it happens at the end.

1012
00:50:12.480 --> 00:50:16.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it does. It does come suddenly very quickly. Yeah,

1013
00:50:16.639 --> 00:50:27.960
<v Speaker 1>let's not go and then yeah, Spencer suddenly suffocates with

1014
00:50:27.960 --> 00:50:28.360
<v Speaker 1>a pillow.

1015
00:50:28.800 --> 00:50:31.159
<v Speaker 2>If it goes on for a very long time.

1016
00:50:31.480 --> 00:50:34.559
<v Speaker 1>It's a great shot, isn't It's just that's one one

1017
00:50:34.599 --> 00:50:37.039
<v Speaker 1>shot and it's just like actually quite realistic.

1018
00:50:38.280 --> 00:50:40.000
<v Speaker 2>Well, didn't re say that he felt like he was

1019
00:50:40.719 --> 00:50:42.280
<v Speaker 2>actually going to kill him? Yeah?

1020
00:50:42.280 --> 00:50:44.400
<v Speaker 1>There was. I mean I'm not sure how serious they were,

1021
00:50:44.480 --> 00:50:46.840
<v Speaker 1>but that he said there was a moment when he

1022
00:50:47.000 --> 00:50:50.480
<v Speaker 1>slightly lost control and wasn't a wouldn't wouldn't have been

1023
00:50:50.480 --> 00:50:51.719
<v Speaker 1>able to save himself if you needed it.

1024
00:50:51.880 --> 00:50:53.679
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you think you'd have a certain tap on the

1025
00:50:53.719 --> 00:50:59.760
<v Speaker 2>shoulder signal, I like to hope, but yeah, you can

1026
00:51:00.239 --> 00:51:03.880
<v Speaker 2>get it. Yeah, don't condone it. No, I understand that

1027
00:51:04.000 --> 00:51:04.599
<v Speaker 2>the situation.

1028
00:51:04.760 --> 00:51:07.280
<v Speaker 1>I completely understand it. Like I spent I spent the

1029
00:51:07.280 --> 00:51:09.880
<v Speaker 1>whole of misery reading it, thinking, well, he's got a killer,

1030
00:51:09.920 --> 00:51:11.760
<v Speaker 1>He's got a killer. How's he going to get out

1031
00:51:11.760 --> 00:51:13.599
<v Speaker 1>of this? He's got a killer? Like, because you would

1032
00:51:13.840 --> 00:51:18.679
<v Speaker 1>like in that situation, like what else could you do? Yeah,

1033
00:51:19.719 --> 00:51:24.320
<v Speaker 1>for legal reasons, Yeah, I don't condone that.

1034
00:51:24.400 --> 00:51:30.880
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, he just goes for it. Timon is no more.

1035
00:51:31.280 --> 00:51:33.000
<v Speaker 2>There's wanky little glasses.

1036
00:51:33.000 --> 00:51:34.679
<v Speaker 1>And the horrible bit of blood come out his nose.

1037
00:51:34.960 --> 00:51:38.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, because it is like you say, all one cut

1038
00:51:38.320 --> 00:51:42.119
<v Speaker 2>of that. Yeah, and Reese is wearing the glasses like

1039
00:51:42.480 --> 00:51:44.480
<v Speaker 2>how he he must have had to knock them off

1040
00:51:44.519 --> 00:51:48.360
<v Speaker 2>his face just before, because otherwise Steve is just pushing

1041
00:51:48.400 --> 00:51:49.440
<v Speaker 2>these glasses into his face.

1042
00:51:50.119 --> 00:51:50.800
<v Speaker 1>Oh that's true.

1043
00:51:50.840 --> 00:51:53.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, which, and he probably goes for it and he

1044
00:51:53.800 --> 00:51:56.760
<v Speaker 2>has to make it look real. Yeah, yeah, that could

1045
00:51:56.800 --> 00:52:00.320
<v Speaker 2>do a lot of damage. Yeah, never mind, So getting

1046
00:52:00.360 --> 00:52:01.840
<v Speaker 2>him like you could have blinded him more.

1047
00:52:03.039 --> 00:52:05.360
<v Speaker 1>Well, I'm sure they worked the logistics of that out.

1048
00:52:05.280 --> 00:52:09.119
<v Speaker 2>I hope. So I assume you must knock them to

1049
00:52:09.159 --> 00:52:11.199
<v Speaker 2>the side when you can't see it or whatever.

1050
00:52:13.280 --> 00:52:16.280
<v Speaker 1>But yes, then we get another big twist.

1051
00:52:17.960 --> 00:52:20.280
<v Speaker 2>Kevin ain't dead again again, So.

1052
00:52:20.199 --> 00:52:23.119
<v Speaker 1>I say another twist. It's actually basically the same twist again.

1053
00:52:26.039 --> 00:52:27.559
<v Speaker 2>Twist one was good, I'll do it again.

1054
00:52:27.880 --> 00:52:30.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And it's a bit like, you know, first from

1055
00:52:30.400 --> 00:52:32.960
<v Speaker 1>Spencer's point of view, it's like that fool me once,

1056
00:52:34.000 --> 00:52:36.960
<v Speaker 1>shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. Thing.

1057
00:52:37.079 --> 00:52:40.519
<v Speaker 1>It's like, wow, they've just done the same thing and

1058
00:52:40.559 --> 00:52:44.039
<v Speaker 1>fooled you again with the same thing, fooling.

1059
00:52:43.760 --> 00:52:46.440
<v Speaker 2>You the second time. Doctor, that's a privilege.

1060
00:52:46.719 --> 00:52:53.840
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, the same way. But yeah, I find this

1061
00:52:53.880 --> 00:52:56.480
<v Speaker 1>a bit confusing now because I'm like, yeah, this is

1062
00:52:56.519 --> 00:52:59.320
<v Speaker 1>my gripe. Yeah, the intention, what was the intention?

1063
00:52:59.519 --> 00:53:03.840
<v Speaker 2>Because so they explain it that this was all Simon's

1064
00:53:04.239 --> 00:53:07.320
<v Speaker 2>audition for the Baron play this role of the Baron. Yes, yeah,

1065
00:53:07.320 --> 00:53:12.360
<v Speaker 2>which I get makes sense. I don't get why it

1066
00:53:12.400 --> 00:53:15.519
<v Speaker 2>had to be Gavin, Like, it doesn't make any sense

1067
00:53:15.599 --> 00:53:18.920
<v Speaker 2>because he's given up all of his leverage before he's

1068
00:53:18.920 --> 00:53:19.360
<v Speaker 2>got anything.

1069
00:53:19.519 --> 00:53:21.639
<v Speaker 1>He wouldn't have wanted. He wouldn't have wanted Gavin to

1070
00:53:21.639 --> 00:53:22.039
<v Speaker 1>come up.

1071
00:53:22.440 --> 00:53:24.920
<v Speaker 2>No, I couldn't. I could understand Hi wanting to do

1072
00:53:24.960 --> 00:53:28.199
<v Speaker 2>all of this, and like if he'd got another fan, like,

1073
00:53:28.280 --> 00:53:30.679
<v Speaker 2>surely he knows enough people that someone would have agreed

1074
00:53:30.719 --> 00:53:33.480
<v Speaker 2>to do this. Yeah, that's true, And I know, I

1075
00:53:33.519 --> 00:53:35.440
<v Speaker 2>know it works nicely for us to get the reveal

1076
00:53:35.480 --> 00:53:36.920
<v Speaker 2>of Gavin still being alive.

1077
00:53:36.679 --> 00:53:39.400
<v Speaker 1>Because yeah, because it once you once you know the

1078
00:53:39.920 --> 00:53:43.599
<v Speaker 1>full twist, it means that that whole argument they had

1079
00:53:43.639 --> 00:53:47.760
<v Speaker 1>about oh, you've ruined everything was all fake. Yeah, which

1080
00:53:48.920 --> 00:53:51.159
<v Speaker 1>it turns out that Simon is a much better actor

1081
00:53:51.199 --> 00:53:53.280
<v Speaker 1>than we thought then, because that was you know, that

1082
00:53:53.360 --> 00:53:54.159
<v Speaker 1>was very convincing.

1083
00:53:54.559 --> 00:53:58.079
<v Speaker 2>Yes, but surely you would only do all of that

1084
00:53:58.239 --> 00:54:00.920
<v Speaker 2>if you genuinely believe that Spencer was on side now.

1085
00:54:00.840 --> 00:54:04.000
<v Speaker 1>Exactly, so maybe maybe he has come around, or maybe

1086
00:54:04.000 --> 00:54:05.239
<v Speaker 1>at least Simon thinks he has.

1087
00:54:06.239 --> 00:54:09.920
<v Speaker 2>But during that whole thing. Spencer's all called the agent,

1088
00:54:09.960 --> 00:54:11.679
<v Speaker 2>get this canceled. Why do you think I would ever

1089
00:54:11.760 --> 00:54:14.199
<v Speaker 2>do this? This isn't nonsense? I hate this. Yeah, Like,

1090
00:54:15.159 --> 00:54:18.599
<v Speaker 2>surely Simon would know that this isn't isn't working. I

1091
00:54:18.599 --> 00:54:20.559
<v Speaker 2>don't know, and we'll just spun it some other I

1092
00:54:20.639 --> 00:54:22.960
<v Speaker 2>don't know. It just seems a weird plan.

1093
00:54:23.440 --> 00:54:24.159
<v Speaker 1>Yes, it does.

1094
00:54:24.639 --> 00:54:28.719
<v Speaker 2>That sort of throws away all of his leverage for nothing.

1095
00:54:29.280 --> 00:54:29.679
<v Speaker 1>Hmmm.

1096
00:54:30.960 --> 00:54:32.719
<v Speaker 2>And this is just Is it just that he's getting

1097
00:54:32.719 --> 00:54:33.199
<v Speaker 2>too cocky?

1098
00:54:33.280 --> 00:54:36.880
<v Speaker 1>I guess, yeah, possibly, or.

1099
00:54:36.800 --> 00:54:39.639
<v Speaker 2>Maybe he's gotten the point of thinking that like that

1100
00:54:39.719 --> 00:54:42.599
<v Speaker 2>Spencer's so undry, is dumb, and that he thinks Simon's

1101
00:54:42.639 --> 00:54:45.280
<v Speaker 2>so crazy that he'll go along with anything, because who

1102
00:54:45.320 --> 00:54:47.599
<v Speaker 2>knows what Simon's going to do if you say no, hmm.

1103
00:54:49.119 --> 00:54:51.199
<v Speaker 1>I think for me, I think it's it comes down

1104
00:54:51.239 --> 00:54:54.599
<v Speaker 1>to that the sort of double twist. It feels like

1105
00:54:54.679 --> 00:54:57.519
<v Speaker 1>it's written for the benefit of the audience, so that

1106
00:54:57.599 --> 00:55:02.440
<v Speaker 1>we get the and then we get the second. But but

1107
00:55:01.960 --> 00:55:06.039
<v Speaker 1>it doesn't quite make sense. No, like it does. I don't.

1108
00:55:06.079 --> 00:55:09.159
<v Speaker 1>I don't believe that Simon would go through that whole

1109
00:55:09.400 --> 00:55:10.440
<v Speaker 1>you know, that whole spiel.

1110
00:55:11.079 --> 00:55:14.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, be one thing, if he'd if he had already

1111
00:55:14.320 --> 00:55:17.559
<v Speaker 2>got a contract signed and then he could still pretend

1112
00:55:17.559 --> 00:55:20.360
<v Speaker 2>to be annoyed that he's you know, cause problems and

1113
00:55:20.400 --> 00:55:22.599
<v Speaker 2>all this sort of stuff, and then done the plan

1114
00:55:22.679 --> 00:55:23.679
<v Speaker 2>exactly how he planned it to be.

1115
00:55:24.159 --> 00:55:24.559
<v Speaker 1>Mm hmm.

1116
00:55:25.159 --> 00:55:27.519
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, when he actually hasn't got anything signed and

1117
00:55:27.559 --> 00:55:30.360
<v Speaker 2>it could all fall through, it's an odd choice.

1118
00:55:30.880 --> 00:55:34.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. And also the fact that he, you know, supposedly

1119
00:55:34.559 --> 00:55:36.360
<v Speaker 1>this is an audition for the baron, so he can

1120
00:55:36.400 --> 00:55:39.760
<v Speaker 1>show that he can do the he can do the manipulation,

1121
00:55:39.960 --> 00:55:42.960
<v Speaker 1>and he can do the romance or whatever. But you know,

1122
00:55:43.079 --> 00:55:44.840
<v Speaker 1>why does why does he have to make it so

1123
00:55:45.039 --> 00:55:49.440
<v Speaker 1>sort of relatable to the real situation, Like why does

1124
00:55:49.480 --> 00:55:52.119
<v Speaker 1>he have to say that, oh, I'm going to stab

1125
00:55:52.159 --> 00:55:54.159
<v Speaker 1>Gavin and that means that I can still blackmail you

1126
00:55:55.199 --> 00:55:58.280
<v Speaker 1>and then you know, I'm going to seduce you in

1127
00:55:58.320 --> 00:56:00.800
<v Speaker 1>this bedroom? Why why why does have to be like that?

1128
00:56:01.880 --> 00:56:05.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, again, like you said, for the for the audience's benefit,

1129
00:56:05.360 --> 00:56:05.760
<v Speaker 2>more so.

1130
00:56:05.719 --> 00:56:07.719
<v Speaker 1>Because we still think that it's real at that point.

1131
00:56:08.719 --> 00:56:13.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, everything up to that bit, it's fantastic. Yeah, it

1132
00:56:13.440 --> 00:56:16.679
<v Speaker 2>really works well for me, and it's just it's just

1133
00:56:16.719 --> 00:56:22.920
<v Speaker 2>a bit weird at the end. Kind of summarizes their problem. Well, yeah,

1134
00:56:23.880 --> 00:56:24.559
<v Speaker 2>is difficult to do.

1135
00:56:25.320 --> 00:56:27.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so that maybe that was deliberate. Then maybe it

1136
00:56:27.519 --> 00:56:28.000
<v Speaker 1>is better.

1137
00:56:36.159 --> 00:56:37.440
<v Speaker 2>I don't think it's ship.

1138
00:56:37.360 --> 00:56:41.320
<v Speaker 1>No, no, no, no, it's just a bit odd.

1139
00:56:41.559 --> 00:56:42.920
<v Speaker 2>Maybe it's not quite in character.

1140
00:56:43.239 --> 00:56:45.320
<v Speaker 1>It's one of those where on a first watch, I

1141
00:56:45.320 --> 00:56:47.840
<v Speaker 1>think it's very effective and you think, oh wow, that

1142
00:56:47.920 --> 00:56:49.960
<v Speaker 1>was so good, but when you do kind of revisit

1143
00:56:50.039 --> 00:56:52.280
<v Speaker 1>it and you think about it a bit more, it's

1144
00:56:52.320 --> 00:56:53.480
<v Speaker 1>slightly unravels.

1145
00:56:53.800 --> 00:56:56.679
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. I feel it's it's more our problem than anything,

1146
00:56:56.679 --> 00:57:00.840
<v Speaker 2>because we overthink these things. Yeah, for most people it

1147
00:57:00.880 --> 00:57:02.440
<v Speaker 2>works really well. Yeah. Yeah.

1148
00:57:03.599 --> 00:57:06.360
<v Speaker 1>So yeah, he's now actually for real killed someone.

1149
00:57:07.840 --> 00:57:08.840
<v Speaker 2>It's not Gavin for once.

1150
00:57:10.039 --> 00:57:13.639
<v Speaker 1>He's been tricked into it essentially, and so all you

1151
00:57:13.679 --> 00:57:15.480
<v Speaker 1>can think to do is to kill the other person.

1152
00:57:16.800 --> 00:57:17.880
<v Speaker 2>Gavin got to die for real?

1153
00:57:18.400 --> 00:57:18.639
<v Speaker 1>M hm.

1154
00:57:19.519 --> 00:57:23.039
<v Speaker 2>How How how he's then got rid of two bodies? Well,

1155
00:57:23.239 --> 00:57:26.480
<v Speaker 2>like in the countryside, I couldn't stand it central London, Yeah,

1156
00:57:26.599 --> 00:57:30.000
<v Speaker 2>from a flat Yeah.

1157
00:57:28.760 --> 00:57:33.159
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, no, but people probably do it.

1158
00:57:33.519 --> 00:57:38.320
<v Speaker 2>Well, Yeah, time jump of a bit. Yes, episodes or good.

1159
00:57:38.400 --> 00:57:43.679
<v Speaker 2>It was a success, got another two series, and in

1160
00:57:43.800 --> 00:57:46.480
<v Speaker 2>being asked for quote about the whole thing, he said

1161
00:57:46.519 --> 00:57:47.840
<v Speaker 2>he did it for the fans.

1162
00:57:48.280 --> 00:57:50.039
<v Speaker 1>Yes, of course he did.

1163
00:57:50.440 --> 00:57:53.199
<v Speaker 2>I never did address that that. I liked Gavin's whole

1164
00:57:53.239 --> 00:57:56.519
<v Speaker 2>speech about the fandom, like, yeah, you might hate them,

1165
00:57:56.920 --> 00:57:59.480
<v Speaker 2>but ultimately, if it weren't for the fans, like who

1166
00:57:59.519 --> 00:58:01.800
<v Speaker 2>is buying all your merchandise? Who is watching a program?

1167
00:58:01.800 --> 00:58:03.960
<v Speaker 2>Who is? It is true, ultimately you are making it

1168
00:58:04.000 --> 00:58:04.599
<v Speaker 2>for the fans.

1169
00:58:04.760 --> 00:58:05.480
<v Speaker 1>It is true.

1170
00:58:05.719 --> 00:58:08.719
<v Speaker 2>They're the ones that are providing the money. Ultimately, as

1171
00:58:08.719 --> 00:58:10.880
<v Speaker 2>weird as they may be. Sometimes there's also, you.

1172
00:58:10.800 --> 00:58:13.079
<v Speaker 1>Know, there's a line between are you making it for

1173
00:58:13.119 --> 00:58:14.880
<v Speaker 1>a general audience or are you making it for the

1174
00:58:14.920 --> 00:58:18.119
<v Speaker 1>real diehard fanatics that go weird about it?

1175
00:58:18.320 --> 00:58:20.920
<v Speaker 2>You know, and without wanting to generalize the likes of

1176
00:58:21.000 --> 00:58:24.280
<v Speaker 2>people that are watching something called the Ninth Circle are

1177
00:58:24.360 --> 00:58:29.199
<v Speaker 2>probably the more fanatical side. Well yeah, they're probably going

1178
00:58:29.199 --> 00:58:30.159
<v Speaker 2>to be the weird obsessives.

1179
00:58:30.239 --> 00:58:32.239
<v Speaker 1>Although you say that Game of Thrones.

1180
00:58:31.920 --> 00:58:34.400
<v Speaker 2>Like very mainstream.

1181
00:58:33.960 --> 00:58:36.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, exactly, so I imagine it. I imagine it quite similar,

1182
00:58:36.440 --> 00:58:37.199
<v Speaker 1>But it could easily have.

1183
00:58:37.199 --> 00:58:40.719
<v Speaker 2>Gone the other way. Yeah. Yeah, so I've just been

1184
00:58:40.719 --> 00:58:43.239
<v Speaker 2>told he's done it for however long. I guess Spencer's like,

1185
00:58:43.280 --> 00:58:46.599
<v Speaker 2>well as well, like this, he's already rationalized in his head.

1186
00:58:47.199 --> 00:58:49.400
<v Speaker 2>He's already sort of had to deal with the mental

1187
00:58:49.400 --> 00:58:53.000
<v Speaker 2>gymnastics of accepting that he's killed someone, So is it

1188
00:58:53.039 --> 00:58:54.280
<v Speaker 2>that hard to actually then do it?

1189
00:58:55.000 --> 00:58:58.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, he doesn't particularly seem remorseful. No, In fact, he

1190
00:58:58.599 --> 00:59:01.800
<v Speaker 1>jokes about it, Yeah, for his own amusement.

1191
00:59:02.039 --> 00:59:04.159
<v Speaker 2>But I suppose we don't know how long time jump.

1192
00:59:04.440 --> 00:59:06.159
<v Speaker 2>It must be quite a while to a film the

1193
00:59:06.239 --> 00:59:10.559
<v Speaker 2>whole pre post productions happened. Things out probably at least

1194
00:59:10.559 --> 00:59:11.119
<v Speaker 2>a year later.

1195
00:59:11.639 --> 00:59:14.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So you think after a year after killing someone,

1196
00:59:14.519 --> 00:59:19.159
<v Speaker 1>you'd be over it and you'd be Jacob why there's

1197
00:59:19.159 --> 00:59:25.159
<v Speaker 1>a time limit. Yeah, I'm still not. I think overall,

1198
00:59:25.159 --> 00:59:27.960
<v Speaker 1>I'm on the feeling of he's not likable as a character,

1199
00:59:29.199 --> 00:59:32.079
<v Speaker 1>even though I think it's possible for him to not

1200
00:59:32.119 --> 00:59:34.679
<v Speaker 1>be likable, But you also feel sympathy for him, yes,

1201
00:59:35.000 --> 00:59:35.920
<v Speaker 1>which which I do.

1202
00:59:36.159 --> 00:59:38.039
<v Speaker 2>I mean, no one's other than Gavin. No, one's really

1203
00:59:38.119 --> 00:59:39.199
<v Speaker 2>very likable in this episode.

1204
00:59:39.360 --> 00:59:41.599
<v Speaker 1>No exactly. I quite like the agent.

1205
00:59:41.840 --> 00:59:43.960
<v Speaker 2>She's quite nice. Yeah, but she's a bit. She just

1206
00:59:44.079 --> 00:59:46.559
<v Speaker 2>goes along with anything, doesn't she. She's just like, yeah,

1207
00:59:46.679 --> 00:59:49.599
<v Speaker 2>darling whatever, anything for an easy life.

1208
00:59:49.760 --> 00:59:54.599
<v Speaker 1>Just yeah. I also rather liked the end credits music

1209
00:59:54.599 --> 00:59:57.239
<v Speaker 1>this week. It just sounds like it would have been

1210
00:59:57.239 --> 00:59:58.679
<v Speaker 1>the theme tune to the ninth Circle.

1211
00:59:59.000 --> 01:00:01.679
<v Speaker 2>Really they went hard it, didn't they. Someone puts some

1212
01:00:01.760 --> 01:00:02.360
<v Speaker 2>time into that.

1213
01:00:03.039 --> 01:00:07.760
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, should we give it a rating? It's always interesting

1214
01:00:07.800 --> 01:00:10.639
<v Speaker 1>what what I write down before we come to recording, and.

1215
01:00:10.559 --> 01:00:12.199
<v Speaker 2>Then I never write anything down.

1216
01:00:12.440 --> 01:00:15.159
<v Speaker 1>Oh, I put a provisional thing down. This is probably

1217
01:00:15.480 --> 01:00:17.079
<v Speaker 1>Then it often changes.

1218
01:00:17.280 --> 01:00:19.719
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, because I yeah, same as in it's not what

1219
01:00:19.760 --> 01:00:21.159
<v Speaker 2>I think it maybe would have been. But I've never

1220
01:00:21.159 --> 01:00:25.280
<v Speaker 2>written anything down for it. But the end throws it

1221
01:00:25.320 --> 01:00:28.480
<v Speaker 2>a bit for me. Yeah, because I remember really liking

1222
01:00:28.519 --> 01:00:31.599
<v Speaker 2>this one before and then really watching it today the

1223
01:00:31.639 --> 01:00:36.079
<v Speaker 2>first time, thinking this is really good. I really enjoyed

1224
01:00:36.079 --> 01:00:39.360
<v Speaker 2>the first eighty percent of the episode, and in the

1225
01:00:39.440 --> 01:00:42.920
<v Speaker 2>last couple of minutes is a little bit off, but

1226
01:00:43.360 --> 01:00:47.079
<v Speaker 2>I still really like it. What do I go with?

1227
01:00:48.199 --> 01:00:51.119
<v Speaker 2>I think a seven? Yeah, I think a seven.

1228
01:00:51.559 --> 01:00:54.519
<v Speaker 1>That's exactly what I've got. Yeah, Originally I was going

1229
01:00:54.599 --> 01:00:57.440
<v Speaker 1>to say in eight, right, but yeah, it's knocked down

1230
01:00:57.440 --> 01:00:59.400
<v Speaker 1>a bit. After discussing the ending.

1231
01:00:59.719 --> 01:01:00.840
<v Speaker 2>I was torn seven eight.

1232
01:01:01.000 --> 01:01:03.079
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Yeah, I was a bit confused with the ending,

1233
01:01:03.159 --> 01:01:06.079
<v Speaker 1>and I think discussing it with you and finding out

1234
01:01:06.119 --> 01:01:10.639
<v Speaker 1>that it wasn't just me it was it doesn't quite work. Yeah,

1235
01:01:10.760 --> 01:01:12.559
<v Speaker 1>it's it's a really enjoyable episode.

1236
01:01:12.800 --> 01:01:14.199
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, yeah, it's really.

1237
01:01:14.039 --> 01:01:15.719
<v Speaker 1>Great characters, great performances.

1238
01:01:16.000 --> 01:01:19.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and with something interesting to say, like, yeah, exactly.

1239
01:01:20.079 --> 01:01:21.280
<v Speaker 2>It is an interesting debate.

1240
01:01:21.880 --> 01:01:22.719
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, definitely.

1241
01:01:24.320 --> 01:01:26.519
<v Speaker 2>So did you spot the hair? Well?

1242
01:01:27.119 --> 01:01:29.599
<v Speaker 1>To be honest, I never really even think about it

1243
01:01:29.719 --> 01:01:31.960
<v Speaker 1>until it gets to this point and I know you're

1244
01:01:31.960 --> 01:01:35.159
<v Speaker 1>about to ask me, No, I didn't spot it, but

1245
01:01:35.679 --> 01:01:38.559
<v Speaker 1>I'm assuming it's got to be on the side where

1246
01:01:38.559 --> 01:01:41.039
<v Speaker 1>all the awards are, Like, surely it would blend in there, it.

1247
01:01:41.039 --> 01:01:43.880
<v Speaker 2>Would make sense. But no Ah, this is one of

1248
01:01:43.920 --> 01:01:45.639
<v Speaker 2>the ones I did know where it was in advance.

1249
01:01:46.119 --> 01:01:48.199
<v Speaker 2>It's stuck out I think from the podcast where they

1250
01:01:48.199 --> 01:01:50.199
<v Speaker 2>talk about you know, they'd say which where it was

1251
01:01:50.239 --> 01:01:52.280
<v Speaker 2>each week for the previous week. Yeah, and it really

1252
01:01:52.280 --> 01:01:55.000
<v Speaker 2>stuck out in my head for that. It's next to

1253
01:01:55.400 --> 01:01:58.760
<v Speaker 2>the head of Faxos when he turns the head round

1254
01:01:59.079 --> 01:02:01.760
<v Speaker 2>and it because it was filmed when it was he's

1255
01:02:01.800 --> 01:02:05.280
<v Speaker 2>wearing a little a little face mask to show that

1256
01:02:05.320 --> 01:02:08.280
<v Speaker 2>it was COVID times. Oh that's sweet, good a tiny

1257
01:02:08.280 --> 01:02:11.920
<v Speaker 2>little face mask on. That's cute. Okay.

1258
01:02:13.039 --> 01:02:14.360
<v Speaker 1>I thought they were going to fudge it and that

1259
01:02:14.559 --> 01:02:16.920
<v Speaker 1>imagine it was you know, the golden hair a wall

1260
01:02:17.599 --> 01:02:17.920
<v Speaker 1>or something.

1261
01:02:19.119 --> 01:02:20.599
<v Speaker 2>It would fit very well on that shelf.

1262
01:02:20.760 --> 01:02:23.239
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well there we go.

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<v Speaker 2>Did you spot our hair? Dear listeners, and we will

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<v Speaker 2>tell you where it was.

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<v Speaker 1>Next week we will when we'll be back for lip service.

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<v Speaker 2>We will interesting one. Yes, look forward to that.

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<v Speaker 1>But until then, it's time to close the door on

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<v Speaker 1>number nine.

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<v Speaker 2>Every leave do you?

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<v Speaker 1>Thanks for listening to the Ninth Degree. If you'd like

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<v Speaker 1>to get in touch, you can find us on Instagram, Twitter,

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<v Speaker 1>and TikTok at ninth Degree Pod, or email us at

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<v Speaker 1>ninth Degree Pod at gmail dot com. You can also

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<v Speaker 1>leave us a rating or a review wherever you get

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<v Speaker 1>your podcasts. Bending mm hm