Speaker 1: All right, don't forget you can hear the CFE semi
Speaker 1: final at the Capitol One Orange Bowl. Let's give the
Speaker 1: sponsor a shout out tonight following the Craig Smith Coaches Show.
Speaker 1: Notre Dame Penn State and our next guest, I have
Speaker 1: to imagine is excited for it Tonight's festivities, Uncle Ted,
Speaker 1: as he's gone around these parts, the great Ted Robinson
Speaker 1: on a Thursday. Ted, Happy Thursday, sir, how are you well?
Speaker 2: It's great to be back with you. Happy New Year?
Speaker 2: And yeah, I mean it's it's nice to see and look,
Speaker 2: Penn State's a terrific school itself, so and I think
Speaker 2: many of us, I guess you probably are not surprisday
Speaker 2: we say this, are very happy that the SEC is
Speaker 2: not of office. Texas is not the SEC, even though
Speaker 2: they're taking the money from us. It's it's been good.
Speaker 2: And you know what, the games last week actually ended
Speaker 2: up being being pretty good. And I was happy for
Speaker 2: that because we all know the first week that Friday
Speaker 2: Saturday was.
Speaker 1: Not good, oh for sure. And you know I do
Speaker 1: want to get to some Macro takeaways. But since you
Speaker 1: are a proud Notre Dame alum, I wanted to have
Speaker 1: you on today to talk about what exactly would it
Speaker 1: mean for this institution, and folks such as yourself did
Speaker 1: care about it. If Notre Dame was not only able
Speaker 1: to win tonight, but go in their first national championship
Speaker 1: since what nineteen eighty.
Speaker 2: Eight, Wow, well yeah, it would mean it would mean
Speaker 2: a ton And I will always proclaim that Notre Dame
Speaker 2: won the national championship in nineteen ninety three since the
Speaker 2: beat Florida State head to head in November and the
Speaker 2: two schools ended up with the same record. But back
Speaker 2: then there was not a whole lot of love for
Speaker 2: Lou Holtz and Bobby Bowden was beloved by the media,
Speaker 2: had never won the national championship, and so they gave
Speaker 2: it to him. And that's just the way it is.
Speaker 2: And that's why, you know, it's one of the many
Speaker 2: reasons why we eventually got to various forms of playoffs
Speaker 2: is because that was just ridiculous. I mean, the two
Speaker 2: teams met head to head in November, not a week zero,
Speaker 2: and Notre Dame beat him and you end up with
Speaker 2: the same record. That usually means the tie break, right,
Speaker 2: But that didn't have an idea anyway. What it would
Speaker 2: mean in the present day would be a lot. It
Speaker 2: would be confirmation for Marcus Freeman. I'm very open with
Speaker 2: the fact that I met Marcus Freeman once. I met
Speaker 2: him last year when Notre Dame played at Stanford the
Speaker 2: final PAC twelve Network football game, very impressive. I'm thrilled
Speaker 2: for the university because it was way too long to
Speaker 2: have diversity in our coaching ranks. Being the prim and
Speaker 2: Catholic university in the world, that should be something that
Speaker 2: is important to us, and we didn't practice it enough
Speaker 2: in my view until recently. And Marcus Freeman even now
Speaker 2: has gotten heat from alums because of some of the
Speaker 2: losses Notre Dame's had in this three years, including Northern
Speaker 2: Illinois this year, and I'm thrilled for the results because
Speaker 2: it just silenced all of that. Admittedly, Notre Dame didn't
Speaker 2: have the toughest schedule this year because the ACC wasn't great.
Speaker 2: USC was not great, so it wasn't it wasn't the
Speaker 2: gauntlet that some of the SEC teams have to face.
Speaker 2: Let's let's be clear on that. But Notre Dame handled
Speaker 2: their business and they handled it pretty well.
Speaker 1: So James Franklin with some comments about his belief that
Speaker 1: every school should have a you know, should be in
Speaker 1: a conference, and Notre Dame has always been the one institution,
Speaker 1: the one brand that's been able to make this model work.
Speaker 1: And if they win the national championship, I think the
Speaker 1: check is twenty twenty one million, which goes to Notre Dame.
Speaker 3: They don't have to split it to the winner, goes
Speaker 3: to Spoil.
Speaker 1: So help us understand a little bit more as to
Speaker 1: why the independent dynamic is so important to the lifeblood
Speaker 1: of not just the football program, but the institution that
Speaker 1: is Notre Dame.
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, I don't know what I didn't I'm not
Speaker 2: familiar with James Franklin's comment there. I don't understand it,
Speaker 2: as you related. I don't know. First of all, none
Speaker 2: of his business. And secondly, I don't know why is
Speaker 2: there a constitutional mandate here that every school has to
Speaker 2: be a part of something that doesn't seem to make
Speaker 2: a whole lot of sense. But anyway, having said that's,
Speaker 2: let me say two things. One, Notre Dame is really
Speaker 2: part of the conference. They are in the ACC for
Speaker 2: every sport except hockey because the ACC doesn't play hockey.
Speaker 2: Notre Dame actually plays in the Big Ten believe it
Speaker 2: or not hockey conference. They're in the ACC for every
Speaker 2: other sport, and they play between four and five ACC
Speaker 2: games a year. That also means that when the ACC
Speaker 2: school plays at Notre Dame, that school has taken home
Speaker 2: a pretty nice TV paycheck as a visiting team on
Speaker 2: a national NBC telecast. So the one, or I should say,
Speaker 2: the two elements that the independence means for Notre Dame,
Speaker 2: and it's only two, is the TV the home television
Speaker 2: contract only the home games. And secondly, it's scheduling enabled
Speaker 2: to Notre Dame to schedule probably half a dozen games
Speaker 2: a year, including what they termed the Shamrocks Series, which
Speaker 2: means it's a neutral sight game usually in a big
Speaker 2: market in the country that has a lot of Notre
Speaker 2: Dame alms, and Notre Dame schedule is one of those
Speaker 2: every year. That's the extent of their independence. So my
Speaker 2: point to you is it's vastly overrated. I'm also my
Speaker 2: second point would be, this was back in the late nineties,
Speaker 2: probably Jim Delaney opened the door for Notre Dame to
Speaker 2: join the Big Ten as the twelfth member. I was
Speaker 2: very Adam. Within the Notre Dame world, I thought it
Speaker 2: was a great idea. I thought we belonged to the
Speaker 2: Big Ten for all of our sports. Women's sports were
Speaker 2: just growing, we were starting to develop Olympic sports, and
Speaker 2: to be in the Big Ten just made a ton
Speaker 2: of sense. For all the apparent reasons, the Notre Dame
Speaker 2: faculty largely wanted that associations of the Big Ten schools,
Speaker 2: not the new Big Ten, but the original Big Ten schools.
Speaker 2: Most of them are excellent academic schools. They're large state
Speaker 2: universities with good library systems, with good research programs, with
Speaker 2: medical schools, and Notre Dame's faculty wanted that association. At
Speaker 2: the end of the day, football independence won out, and
Speaker 2: that's how powerful it is in the Notre Dame world.
Speaker 2: That was the only reason Notre Dame turned down the
Speaker 2: Big Ten membership, and that has never come back, although
Speaker 2: I suspect it will someday because I think it's known
Speaker 2: the Big Ten has clauses in their TV deals that
Speaker 2: would reflect adding Notre Dame that would have a lot
Speaker 2: more money. So I'm assuming that somewhere down the line
Speaker 2: that opening will come up again for Notre Dame. I
Speaker 2: don't know how long it'll take, but I hope that
Speaker 2: Notre Dame the Big ten isn't the Big ten anymore,
Speaker 2: so I have to revise that thought. But I've always
Speaker 2: thought ten the core Big ten is a great place
Speaker 2: for another name to be.
Speaker 3: Well, excuse me.
Speaker 1: We could talk about what the Big ten is right now,
Speaker 1: but we would probably have to recalibrate not too long
Speaker 1: after because everything continues to change and ebb and flow,
Speaker 1: which allows me to transition into more of a macro
Speaker 1: question because I keep using this line over the past
Speaker 1: few weeks ted where I've just leaned into from a
Speaker 1: sports radio approach, diagnosing and not prognosticating, because we're all
Speaker 1: learning this as we go. It's a new format, it's
Speaker 1: a new sports as far as your ability to have
Speaker 1: talent off the field with a transfer portal and the
Speaker 1: and the nil situation, and of course it's a twelve
Speaker 1: team expanded CFP, and all the conferences look much different
Speaker 1: than they did a year ago.
Speaker 3: Most of them do, as far as.
Speaker 1: You know, conferences adding teams, several of the teams that
Speaker 1: you and I are familiar with as the PAC twelve crumbled.
Speaker 1: But since I haven't had a chance to catch up
Speaker 1: with you for a while. How do you feel about
Speaker 1: the current state of college football, the sport that we
Speaker 1: all love to consume.
Speaker 2: Well, that's a wide open palette there, Spence, So you know,
Speaker 2: I'll let me personalize this to my experience this football season.
Speaker 2: So the Pac twelve still existed in the form of
Speaker 2: two schools. As everyone knows, those two schools did a
Speaker 2: television deal with the CW network, which is an over
Speaker 2: the air network has an outlet and I think just
Speaker 2: about every significant market in America. So the Washington State
Speaker 2: and Oregon State home games were aired all on the
Speaker 2: CW this year. I was part of that package. The
Speaker 2: season began with a lot of hope for Oregon State,
Speaker 2: it quickly pivoted to Washington State, and I ended up
Speaker 2: doing five Washington State games. So being around the Cougar
Speaker 2: program a lot this year was the collision of where
Speaker 2: I think college sports are right now. It was an
Speaker 2: incredibly uplifting season for them. I am a huge fan
Speaker 2: of their head coach. I think Jake Dickard is terrific
Speaker 2: and these meant to be a coach and he's only
Speaker 2: forty one years old. The quarterback story having cam Ward
Speaker 2: had this huge build up in the twenty three season
Speaker 2: and then basically fall flat and the Cougars collapsed at
Speaker 2: the end of the year. Cam Ward collapsed and then
Speaker 2: he ended up getting a million plus to go to Miami,
Speaker 2: which you saw what happened this year. So what's Washington's
Speaker 2: ta going to do a quarterback? Well, they had a
Speaker 2: kid from Texas who was under recruited. He had been
Speaker 2: there for a couple of years, and it's his turn.
Speaker 2: And John Mattier made himself into a player that I
Speaker 2: actually put on my Heisman ballad this year, that's how
Speaker 2: good he was. The team. Sadly, their defense was not
Speaker 2: good and they collapsed in the last three games and
Speaker 2: took themselves out of you know, they were on the
Speaker 2: fringe of the playoff conversation and would say no more
Speaker 2: than that, but just being there was a miracle, and
Speaker 2: sadly they fell out the last three games. What happens,
Speaker 2: John Mattier goes to Oklahoma. Rumors are three million offensive
Speaker 2: coordinator goes to Oklahoma, and then Jake Dicker turns around
Speaker 2: and I would have even stunned me takes the job
Speaker 2: of Wake Forest. So this incredibly wonderful, uplifting story for
Speaker 2: the school that got left behind. The school that's out
Speaker 2: in the prairies, you know, doesn't have wealthy the roles
Speaker 2: of alums. You know a lot of individuals who succeeded
Speaker 2: in farming an bag and business. But they chip in
Speaker 2: to a collective and they have this wonderful season and
Speaker 2: the program survives the first year of this anarchy, and
Speaker 2: then suddenly it collapses within a couple of days. So
Speaker 2: I'm uplifted, and then I'm really dismayed because that's the point,
Speaker 2: and it's very obvious for everyone to see, is that
Speaker 2: the Washington States right now and the Oregon States and
Speaker 2: other programs around the country are just farm teams and
Speaker 2: until there's some order in all of this, and no
Speaker 2: one knows how that's going to happen, but until there is,
Speaker 2: this is this is the case. So to your question
Speaker 2: that I hope that explains this internal collie I've experienced,
Speaker 2: I'm so happy to be part of that Washington State
Speaker 2: football season. And at the end, you go, man, that's
Speaker 2: really stinks.
Speaker 1: Yeah from that vantage point for sure, And there's nothing
Speaker 1: really to debate there because you're not wrong, and you
Speaker 1: know from a local standpoint, Ted, It's interesting to see
Speaker 1: where Utah football finds themselves because, as you know covering
Speaker 1: the program as part of the Pac Tweld Network, Coach
Speaker 1: Witt has built Utah football on the ethos of recruit
Speaker 1: and develop. That's how they do it. And they don't
Speaker 1: necessarily rely on number of four and five star guys.
Speaker 1: They go find Utah guys and then they bring them
Speaker 1: on campus and over the course of a number of years,
Speaker 1: they basically indoctrinate them into the Kyle Whittingham way. He's
Speaker 1: saying is we will not become you, you will become us.
Speaker 1: In the most successful seasons in Utah football history have
Speaker 1: been with third, fourth, fifth year players that sign on
Speaker 1: the dotted line, often overlooked from other schools, came in
Speaker 1: and learned the Kyle way, put in the work, and
Speaker 1: you know, at times it paid off with conference championships
Speaker 1: and Rose Bowl appearances. Can you build a football program
Speaker 1: in the modern day and age of college football with
Speaker 1: the ethos of recruit and develop over time?
Speaker 3: Anymore?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Hard? I mean my initial answer is that Spence
Speaker 2: is really hard. I hope somebody does it. Uh, you know,
Speaker 2: it's I would I'm trying to think of an example
Speaker 2: right now. I mean, it's it's it's I mean, we're
Speaker 2: sitting here waiting tomorrow night to watch Texas play, and
Speaker 2: here's Texas having its best football season in a long time,
Speaker 2: and everyone's talking about should the quarterback come back to
Speaker 2: Texas next year or should he get a huge NIL
Speaker 2: deal to go to another school which would likely pay
Speaker 2: more than he would make in his first NFL season.
Speaker 2: I mean, that's what that's. I'm sorry that just lunacy
Speaker 2: what you think of what that means. But it is
Speaker 2: where the world is, and so I would think I
Speaker 2: would take this. Maybe if I can spend a background
Speaker 2: on that question, Spence, here's my concern, having raised kids
Speaker 2: and now raising grandkids, it's extremely wise to respect the
Speaker 2: fact that players athletes now in the top college sports
Speaker 2: can earn. I have no objection to that. I don't
Speaker 2: know that any smart minded person has an objection to that.
Speaker 2: The way it's done, maybe that's where we would start
Speaker 2: to have some difference of opinion. And what I feel
Speaker 2: very strongly about is I fear that this generation represented
Speaker 2: by these eighteen to twenty five year olds and damn
Speaker 2: near thirty year olds now in some cases playing college
Speaker 2: athletics are being are being raised and are living through
Speaker 2: an experience completely devoid of character, character commitment. When a
Speaker 2: quits in the middle of the season. How many times
Speaker 2: did we see that top level college football this year
Speaker 2: where quarterback just quit the quarterback of a football team.
Speaker 2: Is there any more leadership demanded position in sport and
Speaker 2: quarterback and football? And you had several guys just quit
Speaker 2: in the middle of the season on their team, And
Speaker 2: you reference the Kyle phrase with the word US, and
Speaker 2: I'm very fearful from what I see in football and
Speaker 2: men's basketball, there's no US. It's me me II, me me.
Speaker 2: And so the concept of an athlete being able to
Speaker 2: be compensated when everybody else around them is fine, we
Speaker 2: get that. To do it without character is really I mean,
Speaker 2: that's long term ramifications for us, way beyond sport.
Speaker 3: Well said, we'll end with because I know you got
Speaker 3: to go.
Speaker 1: We'll end with your thoughts on because the fact of
Speaker 1: the matter is, you know, we can bellier about the
Speaker 1: state of the sport and then you just look at
Speaker 1: the ratings and the numbers, and people are consuming it
Speaker 1: at a historic level, and it happens to be a
Speaker 1: multi billion dollar business with a failed business model, which
Speaker 1: makes it probably very appealing to folks in.
Speaker 3: The private equity world.
Speaker 1: And it does feel like we are in this like
Speaker 1: neoliberal capitalism type takeover of college athletes. On the horizon
Speaker 1: out it feels like very powerful, rich people are going
Speaker 1: to start to buy potentially college football programs. A lot
Speaker 1: of rumors already circulating that that thing is going to happen,
Speaker 1: and it is inevitable. Is there part of you that
Speaker 1: is hopeful that at some point the business model of
Speaker 1: college football can be fixed to the level where most
Speaker 1: of the problems that are plaguing the sport can go
Speaker 1: away and we can all kind of sit and enjoy
Speaker 1: whatever the final paradigm shift is with this sport.
Speaker 2: Whenever that happens, yes, I think I think the business
Speaker 2: models in place, I don't think it will change. I mean,
Speaker 2: unless somebody else gets a case of the Supreme Court
Speaker 2: and the Supreme Court has another, you know, Judge Kavanaugh
Speaker 2: life decision that reverses things. I think We're way gone.
Speaker 2: It's professional nothing. There's nothing college about the top anymore.
Speaker 2: It's professional. So now to me, the question is how
Speaker 2: in the name of goodness, do we get structured. And
Speaker 2: I listen to smart people who believe now with the
Speaker 2: results of the election, that there's a much better chance
Speaker 2: that Congress will get involved and help orchestrate some guardrails,
Speaker 2: build some guard rails because the universities clearly are I mean,
Speaker 2: there is no NCAA anymore, and the universities don't because
Speaker 2: they're all involved in self interest. There's no collective concern
Speaker 2: to build those guard rails. So I believe that that's
Speaker 2: the ultimate answer here, is that the business models in place,
Speaker 2: but let's make it so it's just like the pros
Speaker 2: where everybody can make money in the proch but there's
Speaker 2: a way you do it. There's a structure because and
Speaker 2: you say, why do I have to have structure, Because
Speaker 2: you sell tickets. You're a competitive enterprise. And if we
Speaker 2: don't have competition, then we have wrestling, which is performance.
Speaker 2: And that's fine. If you want to call performance art,
Speaker 2: that's great. That's what wrestling is. And wrestling no longer
Speaker 2: tries to hide it. I think sport doesn't want that.
Speaker 2: And if you want to make sure that we have
Speaker 2: a competitive enterprise, then there has to be structure, which
Speaker 2: the NFL of course, is the gold standard to make
Speaker 2: sure they're all thirty two of their members every year
Speaker 2: have a chance. So I strongly feel that's where this
Speaker 2: thing has to happen. And again I'm not smart enough
Speaker 2: to go. But here's let me throw one other thing
Speaker 2: that you spend because we haven't talked for a while,
Speaker 2: and I'll just finish with this. And I thought a
Speaker 2: lot about this during the year, my belief that we're
Speaker 2: going to have a Super League and it could be
Speaker 2: anywhere forty to fifty teams anymore. And I've started to
Speaker 2: realize I think we already had it. And if you
Speaker 2: look at the SEC Georgia, Alabama, LSU, Florida, now that's
Speaker 2: maybe very equivalent to the forty nine Ers, Bears, Giants, Cowboys,
Speaker 2: Eagles of the NFC. The SEC is owned by a network,
Speaker 2: ESPN owns them. The n s C is owned by
Speaker 2: a network Fox. Then you look at the big ten
Speaker 2: and wait a second, we have Michigan, Ohio, State, Penn State, USD.
Speaker 2: Now Oregon is pushing its way into trying to be
Speaker 2: that national brand. And you can say that's kind of
Speaker 2: like having the Steelers and the Patriots and the Raiders
Speaker 2: and the Broncos and the Chiefs, and the ASC is
Speaker 2: owned by a network, CBS, and Fox owns the Big Ten.
Speaker 2: They own it. Okay, what's to stop the ESPN and
Speaker 2: Fox and their respective conferences that they owned from just saying, listen,
Speaker 2: each of our leagues, we're just going to play off
Speaker 2: and have a champ. We'll have our Big Ten champ
Speaker 2: and our SEC champ and then we're just going to
Speaker 2: play a super Bowl. The heck with his twelve teams?
Speaker 2: Why are we sharing with Boise State and Notre Dame
Speaker 2: and pay our pen division as they tend, but Arizona State,
Speaker 2: why are we sharing with them? We'll just do our
Speaker 2: own super Bowl, college Bowl, whatever you want to call it.
Speaker 2: I think that's maybe a more realistic end game, and
Speaker 2: that would achieve the breakaway of the schools that are
Speaker 2: already professional, and it would leave the Florida States and
Speaker 2: Clemson's and the Notre Dames and you know, probably a
Speaker 2: couple of other schools that want to think they're in
Speaker 2: that category to get Wait a second, what about us,
Speaker 2: can't leave us behind?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: You know, Ted, when we have more time, you and
Speaker 1: I are just going to fix college football in the world.
Speaker 1: My friends, but I know you have to run. It's
Speaker 1: always a pleasure. I hope you're well, and anytime you
Speaker 1: have time, you know we have time for you here.
Speaker 2: Okay, No, and it goes the same way, s Benson.
Speaker 2: I'll enjoy talking to you and say hi everybody. I
Speaker 2: missed coming to see live. I saw Colin in the
Speaker 2: spring Mill miss I missed football as you're and I
Speaker 2: miss seeing Craig and basketball. So hopefully I'll get back soon.
Speaker 3: For sure, we'll be pulling for the Irish tonight. Okay,
Speaker 3: all right?
Speaker 1: Great Ted Robinson Notre Dame alum. He is a broadcasting legend.
Speaker 1: He has done everything Olympics, golf, tennis, basketball, football. Was
Speaker 1: the first voice hired by the PAC twelve and obviously
Speaker 1: you know PAC twelve didn't last, sadly,