Speaker 1: You see, somethings are going to happen. What's gonna happen?
Speaker 2: What?
Speaker 1: All right? All right, Welcome back everybody to another episode
Speaker 1: of The Aesoteric Archives. Happy Happy New Year to everyone
Speaker 1: out there. The holidays treated everyone well. Yeah, back with
Speaker 1: a super special guest again. Uh we got Nick from
Speaker 1: The Occult Rejects, one of my favorite podcasts here, so
Speaker 1: really really lucky to have them on.
Speaker 2: And yeah, I'll.
Speaker 1: Toss it over to Nick for for a quick intro
Speaker 1: and uh, we'll get the get the show on the road.
Speaker 1: Thank you very much for having me on. I appreciate it.
Speaker 1: And that's also that you listen to the show.
Speaker 3: That's great that that's like, well, you have just been
Speaker 3: so many shows that have had me on that I
Speaker 3: don't even know, like what the fuck it's about.
Speaker 1: So it's great to actually have somebody who listens to
Speaker 1: the show.
Speaker 3: So I really, I really appreciate really that you take
Speaker 3: the time out to listen to her stuff.
Speaker 1: I know it can be a lot, so I appreciate it.
Speaker 1: Yeah for sure, for sure. Oh yeah, and I guess
Speaker 1: to find the show.
Speaker 3: The Occult Rejects is on old major podcasts and bit
Speaker 3: Shoot Rumble and YouTube awesome.
Speaker 1: Awesome, Yeah, everyone go go give give a follow, a,
Speaker 1: like a subscribe, all that good stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we we wanted to have you on.
Speaker 1: So, I mean the you know, the title of our
Speaker 1: podcast is the Aesoteric Archives.
Speaker 4: So is the age off of like kindada like a
Speaker 4: don't you like?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, and also makes us a little harder to search, So.
Speaker 3: You know, I didn't really think that, but you really
Speaker 3: got to be looking to find you guys, right, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: it's yeah, that's a commitment to the to the show.
Speaker 1: But but yeah, no, so I mean, like the you know,
Speaker 1: the the theme of our show is kind of just
Speaker 1: the sort of a halt and esoteric, you know, underlying
Speaker 1: persona that Canada has that kind of flies under the
Speaker 1: radar a lot of the time, you know, So we've
Speaker 1: actually been meaning to have have someone on that understands
Speaker 1: that that world a little more and who's had some
Speaker 1: involvement in magic and uh and these uh, these different
Speaker 1: orders and stuff like that. So yeah, it's it's uh,
Speaker 1: I guess to kick it off, maybe if you wouldn't
Speaker 1: mind just sort of telling everyone a little bit about
Speaker 1: your background and kind of how you got involved in
Speaker 1: that and and how it brought you to to where
Speaker 1: you are today. Yeah, no, yeah, not a problem.
Speaker 3: I would still consider myself now, I guess like a
Speaker 3: magician or an occultist at least.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 4: I still do study.
Speaker 3: I'm big into like a uh Cabbala deimatria, planetary stuff,
Speaker 3: really big into physiology, stuff with the eyes in the
Speaker 3: brain and the nerve and nervous system.
Speaker 4: I was big into you know.
Speaker 3: I was a member of the Oto, which was a
Speaker 3: it was an order that was originally formed by Masons
Speaker 3: that eventually they handed it over to Crowley after they
Speaker 3: read his Book of the Law, and then he changed
Speaker 3: the order. He knocked out like you know, a bunch
Speaker 3: of the initiations, brought it down to thirteen and kind
Speaker 3: of based the order on the Book of the Law.
Speaker 3: Well Dinton kind of did base the order of the
Speaker 3: Book of the Law, and basically, you know, take took
Speaker 3: it over and ran it.
Speaker 1: I was in that for a while, you know, I
Speaker 1: minute probably.
Speaker 3: About six six seven years, maybe five six years, went
Speaker 3: through a few initiations.
Speaker 1: You had that experience, you know.
Speaker 3: I guess in the beginning, you know, as a kid,
Speaker 3: I was interested in I guess paranormal on UFO stuff.
Speaker 3: So I guess that somehow probably led me to where
Speaker 3: I got, but believe it in our conspiracies was what
Speaker 3: led me to the occult. So eventually, uh yeah, I mean,
Speaker 3: I know that's kind of like real quick saying a lot,
Speaker 3: but yeah, I was a member of the OTO for
Speaker 3: a while. I was into ceremonial magic.
Speaker 1: Uh you know two rituals lesser banishing ritual of the pentagram,
Speaker 1: hexagram invoking stuff.
Speaker 3: Uh, you know, I have the whole set up and
Speaker 3: everything on the altar. I may i'd meet talisman's invoked,
Speaker 3: you know, God's, Goddess's angels. I never really fucked with demons,
Speaker 3: but you know, so I do have all that experience
Speaker 3: and still cover it now. You know, the part of
Speaker 3: the show is pretty much to help I guess, decode
Speaker 3: or demystify the occult. I did spend a decent amount
Speaker 3: of time when I first started the show, I guess
Speaker 3: pointing at the negativities of.
Speaker 4: It or like like put it this way.
Speaker 3: When I left the OTO and started paying attention to
Speaker 3: I guess the world around me again instead of just
Speaker 3: worrying about studying the occult and magic, and you know,
Speaker 3: started watching the TV again and putting on the news,
Speaker 3: I was like, Yo, this ship's fucking all.
Speaker 1: In our face, you know, so like I guess.
Speaker 3: When I first started, the show is more or less
Speaker 3: bean like, Yo, Like the fucking world really is run
Speaker 3: by this ship, and uh, you know now it's more
Speaker 3: of kind of gone over into like I think I've
Speaker 3: done enough of that, and there's so many other podcasts
Speaker 3: that do that anyway, Like the fuck do I need
Speaker 3: to repeat the shit everybody else is talking about? I
Speaker 3: try to, you know, look at the positive side, because
Speaker 3: my experience in practicing magic for myself has been a
Speaker 3: positive experience. Maybe parts of the OTO was not, but
Speaker 3: my actual magical experience have all been beautiful, positive experiences
Speaker 3: that have changed my life and I think helps make
Speaker 3: me or pie help anybody become a better person. So
Speaker 3: from my experience, there is positive stuff in magic. I
Speaker 3: mean from a ceremonial magician's standpoint. The reason they're even
Speaker 3: supposed to be getting into that, if you're getting into
Speaker 3: it for the right reasons, is to having experience with
Speaker 3: the Holy Guardian Angel and they eventually having experience with God.
Speaker 3: So I mean kind of have to be a decent
Speaker 3: person to have that happen, I think, yeah, yeah, you
Speaker 3: can turn into an asshole afterwards, which is that's where
Speaker 3: I think actually the problem happens. I think people might
Speaker 3: be blessed with certain gifts and them realize they could
Speaker 3: be a piece of with it instead of health humanity.
Speaker 3: But yeah, so I basically spend a lot of time
Speaker 3: just trying to educate people on the occults. Symbolism one
Speaker 3: of the big things I do like to try to
Speaker 3: push and I'll just like say it now because I
Speaker 3: just think it's very important and it doesn't mean that
Speaker 3: we have to get into these topics.
Speaker 1: It's just.
Speaker 3: I think it will be different than most people ever
Speaker 3: hear from other occultists. My opinion, when it comes to
Speaker 3: the occult and occult symbolism and the mysteries and mysteries
Speaker 3: and the secrets of secrets, believe it or not, a
Speaker 3: lot of it is, in my opinion, in physiology, if
Speaker 3: you actually were to study the brain and the eyeballs
Speaker 3: and the nervous system, you see a lot of symbolism,
Speaker 3: You see a lot of art, see a lot of
Speaker 3: freaky shit actually inside your body that in my opinion,
Speaker 3: has been reduplicated in occult symbolism.
Speaker 1: And I do actually think.
Speaker 3: This might sound like a little scary, a little freaky,
Speaker 3: or you know, I'm not trying to be like an edgeloid,
Speaker 3: but I do think, you know, they always talk about
Speaker 3: a death and a rebirth. My opinion, you are going
Speaker 3: to have to actually be technically okay with kind of dying,
Speaker 3: believe in that to have a magical experience. So I
Speaker 3: do actually think that like death is a part of it,
Speaker 3: just like the rebirth is. And I do think a
Speaker 3: lot of stuff in occult symbolism, art, stuff that you'll
Speaker 3: see in movies, stuff that you'll read in books that
Speaker 3: doesn't make any sense.
Speaker 1: It's because you're not looking at it from the aspect
Speaker 1: of death being involved, or death already happening, or the
Speaker 1: person having this experience outside of their body. But I
Speaker 1: do think part of the mysteries and mysteries and secrets
Speaker 1: of secrets is that you will have to kind of.
Speaker 4: Click out the experience.
Speaker 3: The physical experience that you feel when this is happening,
Speaker 3: in the visions that you see when this is happening is.
Speaker 4: All over the place as well.
Speaker 3: M's my opinion, because there are some there are some
Speaker 3: things I'm not saying that everybody does, but there's certain
Speaker 3: things that I think people do share. Like there's certain
Speaker 3: symbolism I use from my experience that I know other
Speaker 3: people have noticed it because they've.
Speaker 4: Seen the same thing, right, you know.
Speaker 3: It's almost like a way of putting a calling card
Speaker 3: out there and saying like, you know, if you see this,
Speaker 3: obviously you're in the know, right you know.
Speaker 1: So that's you know, it's been my experience.
Speaker 3: So I do think it's scarier, weirdest sounds, the visions,
Speaker 3: and the feelings that you have from dying is huge
Speaker 3: also within symbolism and art and vehicle.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's I mean, that's that's a really interesting point
Speaker 1: to make. So I when I actually, yeah, well so.
Speaker 3: Am I gonna understand what's on the other side, and
Speaker 3: was like, oh there, well exactly.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. And if you know, from my personal experience,
Speaker 1: when I kind of started diving into what all this
Speaker 1: was was when I was my dad was in hospice
Speaker 1: and I was spending a lot of time in hospice,
Speaker 1: like all day, every day for four or five months.
Speaker 1: It was so it was, you know, I was surrounded
Speaker 1: by death. You could feel it that you could feel
Speaker 1: the energy of it. You could feel almost like I
Speaker 1: it was weird. I could know when someone had passed
Speaker 1: in a room that was near him, like and I'd
Speaker 1: be like, Jerry, Jerry checked out today, didn't he. It's
Speaker 1: like yep, Like it's it's just that you become when
Speaker 1: when when you remove the the outside distractions and stuff,
Speaker 1: you can really feel the life force energy beyond anything else.
Speaker 1: It's it's really really interesting. I saw uh instagram real.
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure it was real. I don't think it
Speaker 1: was ai uh where there was a cat that's in
Speaker 1: like a hospice that always knows right before the person's
Speaker 1: going to die.
Speaker 3: And it hasn't been wrong yet. It's been like actorate,
Speaker 3: like almost one hundred times in a row, I've seen
Speaker 3: that the cat will go sit with the person and
Speaker 3: basically now it's like every time they do that, they.
Speaker 1: Know the Unfortunately, they know the person's going to be
Speaker 1: about to die.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and wow, cats are supposed to have one foot in,
Speaker 2: one foot out, are they not?
Speaker 1: I believe that Yeah?
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I definitely believe that there was things that
Speaker 3: happened with my cat just from magic fucking around with
Speaker 3: magic that my cat saw shit that wasn't there that
Speaker 3: I didn't see because it was reacting and actually looking
Speaker 3: at things. It's hard to explain if we get into
Speaker 3: it later, but yeah, my cat definitely understood it, So
Speaker 3: something was going on. Yeah, to use it as a barometer,
Speaker 3: you know, like maybe I should be freaked out. Maybe
Speaker 3: they're actually just like fucking out there remold viewing. Maybe
Speaker 3: maybe they're having a better experienced sleep and that's why
Speaker 3: they sleep so much. Like this place is fucking boring.
Speaker 3: I'm going to go, you know, fucking fly off somewhere
Speaker 3: and go to spit. Yeah, fair enough.
Speaker 4: You haven't a magical experience himself, hope. So I wanted to.
Speaker 1: I want to get back into the death thing because
Speaker 1: I have a few questions around that and sort of
Speaker 1: how that plays into like ritual and and and initiation
Speaker 1: and things like that. But you had mentioned symbolism, so
Speaker 1: one of the questions I did have for you was like, obviously,
Speaker 1: like you know, we see a lot of a cult
Speaker 1: symbolism in Hollywood and stuff these days, and I've always
Speaker 1: kind of like danced with the idea of like is
Speaker 1: is this are are basically like are these guys just
Speaker 1: trying to be edgy and they know that this is
Speaker 1: what people are into these days, or are they actually
Speaker 1: using this for like with intent, you know, because I
Speaker 1: know there's there. I have heard of writers and stuff
Speaker 1: and producers putting sigils into their movies to help, you know,
Speaker 1: ensure that they succeed in things like that. But it
Speaker 1: is sort of like you said, it's so in your
Speaker 1: face these days and like thirty three everywhere and this thing,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, So like in your opinion
Speaker 1: and having dealt with this is what amount of that
Speaker 1: is actually legitimate and what amount of that is just
Speaker 1: you know, edgelrd behavior. Oh, I think some of it
Speaker 1: is edgeloged behavior.
Speaker 3: But I do think sometimes I would even say sometimes
Speaker 3: it's sort of thing like I was saying, just like
Speaker 3: a calling car to even like let you know, like
Speaker 3: who's behind this? You know, if you've seen thirty three
Speaker 3: a lot, it might be Masonic. If youve seen ninety
Speaker 3: three a lot, it might be the leaming uh symbolism.
Speaker 3: I do believe certain sigils and some stuff hold powods
Speaker 3: where I do think it could maybe start triggering stuff
Speaker 3: in your head. But I mean, just to even get
Speaker 3: down to basics. And this is something that I even
Speaker 3: covered last week part one. I have a part two
Speaker 3: coming out. How colors itself will just create change in yourself,
Speaker 3: in your mood, in your mind. So I mean you
Speaker 3: can start playing around with that in movies and do
Speaker 3: all sorts of stuff to people, give them a feelings.
Speaker 4: I mean, just think about this.
Speaker 3: If we were to watch one of all, like an
Speaker 3: old classic horror movie without music, tell me how scary,
Speaker 3: we'd actually probably yeah, no affair.
Speaker 4: Enough music that fucking gets us before it happens.
Speaker 3: You know, if you watch a Jason or Fredni movie
Speaker 3: without the fucking music, you probably be laughing at it, really,
Speaker 3: you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah for sure.
Speaker 3: So between just sound and colors, you can manipulate people
Speaker 3: a lot with that already. But I do think that
Speaker 3: is huge. I actually think that, huh. I think a
Speaker 3: lot of magic nowadays. When I say this, it's not
Speaker 3: like I'm trying to get political. It's more just the
Speaker 3: way I actually will say certain styles of magic is Nazis.
Speaker 3: It's Nazi magic. I just call it Nazi magic because
Speaker 3: I do believe that. You know, it was an occult
Speaker 3: war obviously, World War two, But I do think the
Speaker 3: Nazi is a form of style of magic, and I
Speaker 3: think part of their black magic is fooling people.
Speaker 1: With sounds and vision.
Speaker 3: It sounds, yeah, sound sound and sound insight, and I
Speaker 3: think a lot of that is what's going on, Like,
Speaker 3: especially during like the last couple of we have a
Speaker 3: lot of propaganda out there, and if you start to
Speaker 3: realize some people maybe you guys don't.
Speaker 1: Know how conspiratorlial are.
Speaker 3: You'll see sometimes that like the news does it in
Speaker 3: even conspiracy. I hate to say, it's probably worse in
Speaker 3: the conspiracy community with the propaganda where it's like we
Speaker 3: take things and kind of put it on a different
Speaker 3: spin and don't really like, all right, put it this way.
Speaker 3: Perfect example, and I'm not really a fan of the
Speaker 3: other one of them. Let's say, if you took Proud
Speaker 3: Boys and Antifa. Yeah, now, if you were to watch
Speaker 3: it on Fox, you're gonna see Antifa throwing the first punch.
Speaker 3: If you watch it on CNN, you're gonna see Proud Boys.
Speaker 4: Throwing the first punch.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a spin. Another perfect ex sample with the
Speaker 3: Ukraine War. This is a perfect example of Nazi magic.
Speaker 1: In my opinion.
Speaker 3: The Azoff battalion. They fucking throw the Nazi I mean
Speaker 3: they have the swasticker on their shit. They used they
Speaker 3: used the nineteenth Division Panzer signed as well on their stuff.
Speaker 3: When that war broke out and surf first started popping off,
Speaker 3: you have people showing all this footage of what's going on.
Speaker 1: If you were to look real, you know, most people
Speaker 1: don't pay attention.
Speaker 3: It's sometimes it's on the video itself, in fine print
Speaker 3: or even underneath who it's provided by.
Speaker 1: Almost everything that was given to us was from the
Speaker 1: Azoff battalion.
Speaker 3: So now you're telling me that I'm supposed to believe
Speaker 3: what fucking Nazis are showing me is going on over it. Yeah,
Speaker 3: they've got their own PR department. I won't even I
Speaker 3: can't even I can't even say that that's truthful. I
Speaker 3: have no idea you're having occult showing me what do
Speaker 3: you want me to believe is going on over there?
Speaker 3: I believe stuff like that where I think they will
Speaker 3: manipulate news and media, they'll put certain spins on it.
Speaker 3: What you're looking at maybe real, but not the context
Speaker 3: they're putting it in. Yeah, and I think that is huge,
Speaker 3: And I think that I believe it or not, is
Speaker 3: a style that kind of really took a hold in.
Speaker 2: World War Two, that one side versus another, like you're
Speaker 2: either on one side or this.
Speaker 4: And that's saying Hitler didn't do anything.
Speaker 3: I'm not saying he didn't do anything, but like I
Speaker 3: do think like they definitely used shit to really stir
Speaker 3: fucking feelings and fear into people. Oh one hundred yeah,
Speaker 3: I mean they use yeah prior to that, if you
Speaker 3: want to believe it, I mean I I I'm very
Speaker 3: skeptical about it because I'm like, all right, so if
Speaker 3: it's really that dangerous, we'll just build the cameras out
Speaker 3: of whatever it's built out of.
Speaker 1: But like they filmed the atomic bomb and televised it,
Speaker 1: I don't know how you filmed it.
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, yeah, like televised that ship that ripped fear
Speaker 3: in people's fucking Where we can do that. I don't
Speaker 3: even know if they was sound for that. There was
Speaker 3: a vision for it though, and that freaked well the
Speaker 3: fuck is out?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Like the mushroom cloud is like, oh, it's
Speaker 1: like a symbol of destruction war yeah yeah, well yeah,
Speaker 1: even you know, you were talking colors and music and stuff,
Speaker 1: so I was. The last interview he did was with
Speaker 1: Joe Martino, who's in media. He's founder of Collective Evolution,
Speaker 1: and we were talking to him about like it had
Speaker 1: been a while since I'd watched the news, and my
Speaker 1: wife's parents were were over like a year ago, and
Speaker 1: they threw it on and it was actually actually a
Speaker 1: bunch of the Ukraine stuff and it was scored, like
Speaker 1: there was music to it, like to the news segment,
Speaker 1: and I was like, when the fuck did they start
Speaker 1: doing this? Like what We're like, who and who's sitting
Speaker 1: there scoring this? Like there's a guy back there, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean, Like, who's god is? He went
Speaker 1: to school to be a composer and now he's like
Speaker 1: scoring the Ukraine Wars? Just insane to me.
Speaker 3: But that's putting my down in your resume. Y, I
Speaker 3: did this fucking Ukraine warup and on seeing it?
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, so I mean, yeah, you're one hundred percent right,
Speaker 1: you know what would be interesting to see.
Speaker 3: And I've seen it come out recently and I think
Speaker 3: I might want to cover it too, or or just
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 4: It was kind of contemplating it.
Speaker 1: The amount of newscase is I think in the seventies
Speaker 1: and eighties that we have have all been pretty much
Speaker 1: like actually like come out and been dropped as being
Speaker 1: ci ag Yeah. I mean a lot of their funding
Speaker 1: comes from from that world, right, Like, I mean a
Speaker 1: ton of them. It's like, yo, you're to tell any
Speaker 1: of your parents these names all be like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: I used to love them well and even indirectly, right,
Speaker 1: like how how many news agencies are like, you know,
Speaker 1: sponsored by Pfizer and Pfizers funded by DARPA and they
Speaker 1: so it's all like this yeah yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: And in Canada they're all funded by the government. Yeah,
Speaker 2: because all all media here is funded by the government.
Speaker 1: All roads lead to Rome. Yeah yeah, but yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean it's it's that's to me, is is kind of
Speaker 1: crazy that but but again it plays back into that,
Speaker 1: like so these are dark magic practitioners in your opinion,
Speaker 1: that are running all this on the other side.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: But the thing is when I'll actually say what I
Speaker 3: think is probably more of it, And again I'm that.
Speaker 4: I do think a lot of shit that we're showing
Speaker 4: is possibly fake.
Speaker 3: I think all you really have to do and this
Speaker 3: is something that I think from having the experience of
Speaker 3: crossing the abyss. My opinion, anybody that I for myself
Speaker 3: or anybody that I think has actually done that, you
Speaker 3: have to do like almost like a serial serious inventory
Speaker 3: in like how your mind works, and you do it
Speaker 3: like a lake old shadow work, or you do like
Speaker 3: a lot of work on that. Between that and I
Speaker 3: think the experiences you'll have after magic, which is hard
Speaker 3: to get into, but like I think you'll start to
Speaker 3: notice like the psychology of the human mind a lot better.
Speaker 3: And you just have to make people believe something really
Speaker 3: happen and show them something to make them believe that
Speaker 3: to create the feelings that you want, like the movie
Speaker 3: even put it this way, God forbid. If I'm wrong,
Speaker 3: I'm sorry, George Floyd. I don't believe that situation was true.
Speaker 1: We're real.
Speaker 3: Look with that spurred the fuck off right Edgargre walking
Speaker 3: down the street with b ONLM basically yeah, fucking insane. Yeah,
Speaker 3: So if that didn't really happen, you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 3: or if that I mean, I just find it so
Speaker 3: fuck away.
Speaker 1: Your guy's got his hand in his pocket instead of
Speaker 1: his knee.
Speaker 3: Technically that was his shint I think on his neck,
Speaker 3: which is you know, that's a Hebrew word on a
Speaker 3: fucking tarot card.
Speaker 1: You know, who knows what was just my opinion that wasn't.
Speaker 3: Real, you know, it spurred off all this shit, you know,
Speaker 3: or even if it was real, it was pushed to
Speaker 3: a certain way to get people to react, to get
Speaker 3: some sort of emotions going. And a lot of times
Speaker 3: I think that's what magic is, believe it or not,
Speaker 3: a lot of times it's what do you think you
Speaker 3: might be seeing that might be quite horrible is actually
Speaker 3: probably just AI or special effects or twisting something at
Speaker 3: the truth and getting people to believe that that's what
Speaker 3: they thought they saw. It was even happened with Charlie
Speaker 3: Kirk for all. I know that motherfuckers still alive somewhere.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was just going to say that, or that
Speaker 2: that the woman on the subway who got a tack
Speaker 2: from behind as well, that one seemed really weird to me. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and it was out of time where they wanted everyone
Speaker 2: bashing heads, right, It felt off.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I would even say a lot of stuff on
Speaker 1: social media that I think stirs up hate and gets
Speaker 1: people to like really get like my side versus your side.
Speaker 1: I think you have a lot of that out there
Speaker 1: is actually literally produced just to stir feelings, and isn't
Speaker 1: it's kind of like scripted yeah yeah, theater, Yeah yeah yeah.
Speaker 4: Propaganda. I think a lot of memes that we had
Speaker 4: going on.
Speaker 3: I don't know how you guys feel, but like cute
Speaker 3: on and all that shit, I think that all that
Speaker 3: shit was all propaganda to fuck us in the.
Speaker 1: As I agree, yeah yeah, and that's all those memes.
Speaker 3: A lot of stuff that were I probably shared myself
Speaker 3: was probably literally made by some fucking had off neck
Speaker 3: beard in a basement.
Speaker 1: He doesn't even realize. I think he's got on someone
Speaker 1: want some job, or just make dumb memes, some political
Speaker 1: shit out.
Speaker 4: Yeah you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, no, for sure, man. I think, uh, well,
Speaker 1: it's interesting how it's change because like obviously, like the
Speaker 1: way it's approached in in America is different than it
Speaker 1: is in in Canada. Right, Like even the way the
Speaker 1: news is produced, you guys have of that like one side,
Speaker 1: and you have that dichotomy right whereas we we don't,
Speaker 1: like it's just it's all state funded news, like and
Speaker 1: so I've been told that too. You really don't get
Speaker 1: too many views. No, it's very centralized here, it's very
Speaker 1: like controlled, and that was like you know, like as
Speaker 1: far as spells go, like Canada is under a spell,
Speaker 1: like it's the dominion spell, right like the if you
Speaker 1: look at even our parliamentary system, all of its ritual,
Speaker 1: all of it is like Rosicrucian related, you know, like
Speaker 1: there's a ton of that we have, like the Rosy
Speaker 1: Crown rights, what bigger the people think?
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I think that it's just my theory. I
Speaker 3: think the OTO is technically a Rosicrucian order. Yeah, Like
Speaker 3: I think they hide under different names, you know what
Speaker 3: I'm saying, Like they're they're in orders, but they're not
Speaker 3: as Yeah, because you even had like Rosicrucian apologists or
Speaker 3: we're you know people in the six seen hundreds, No,
Speaker 3: when the words and Crusion papers came out, and it's
Speaker 3: just like nobody really like admitted it to being one,
Speaker 3: but yet they existed. So it's like maybe you're just
Speaker 3: kind of like hiding, not hiding, but like you weren't.
Speaker 3: You're in different areas, you know what I'm getting at,
Speaker 3: Like you don't have your own order, but you have
Speaker 3: your ideas and own thoughts and experience and you're within
Speaker 3: other orders.
Speaker 1: Well, I think they use like a lot of the time,
Speaker 1: like pomp and circumstance to sort of like as like
Speaker 1: a cover for it too, right, because we view it
Speaker 1: as just tradition, and we view it as like, oh,
Speaker 1: this is just the Crown doing what they do. This
Speaker 1: is just like you know, Canada is a Crown country.
Speaker 1: So we stick to these, you know, and initiatory processes
Speaker 1: when it comes to Parliament, when it comes to like
Speaker 1: bringing in a new Prime Minister or Speaker of the House.
Speaker 1: I mean if you look at the Speaker of the
Speaker 1: House thing, it's a humiliation ritual straight up, like the
Speaker 1: leader of the opposition and then the Prime Minister literally
Speaker 1: drag the speaker down the aisle to his throne. That's
Speaker 1: like when when they bring in a new Speaker of
Speaker 1: the House, it's that he's dragged like kicking and screaming
Speaker 1: down what.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's really weird, weird to watch.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's almost sounds like some sort of like Masonic
Speaker 1: style ritual. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because like even like some of the you know,
Speaker 3: the initiations I've been through in the OTO, you can
Speaker 3: be like a little uh no, no, I haven't anything
Speaker 3: that dramatic, but like they are kind of like a
Speaker 3: little bit you know, something like that, And they're all
Speaker 3: kind of basically based off of Freemason initiations even though
Speaker 3: they're still the OTO, so they can get very theatrical
Speaker 3: those Masons and their initiations and stuff. So it just
Speaker 3: sounds like something they probably do. Yeah, well, and I
Speaker 3: think the general populations, like I said, just sees it
Speaker 3: as this like fun transition, right jerikuy if the population
Speaker 3: put doesn't really know what the fuck a Freemason is
Speaker 3: or the OTO is the Temple of Side right.
Speaker 1: The same way we put up a Christmas tree every
Speaker 1: year and no one really knows what that mean. Right.
Speaker 1: It's there's like, yeah, the amount of the amount of
Speaker 1: magic rituals that people are partaking in without even realizing
Speaker 1: that they are, you know, it's it's yeah. Is there
Speaker 1: any other others that you can like having been through,
Speaker 1: like having being well versed in the ritual side of things,
Speaker 1: Like what do you notice that people do that could
Speaker 1: be considered ritual that that they're just like unaware of.
Speaker 3: Oh oh, I mean I could get it as basically
Speaker 3: as like if you brush your teeth when you get
Speaker 3: up that's a ritual Yeah, but that could be like
Speaker 3: a deep question. I'm not sure where to go with that. Actually,
Speaker 3: I would probably even say, like our reactions to things
Speaker 3: they want to get, you know, that's I could be
Speaker 3: very ritualistic. But uh, I would probably say, and it's
Speaker 3: this sounds very basic, but I guess kind of the
Speaker 3: life that we've been programmed to believe in, you know,
Speaker 3: kind of like uh, you know the sports that that's
Speaker 3: very ritualistic. Yeah, yeah, I don't think people understand that too,
Speaker 3: even baseball.
Speaker 1: I've had it was my old co host when I
Speaker 1: first thought it.
Speaker 3: I think he covered it in his own separate show,
Speaker 3: but I mean he decovered how that's like such a
Speaker 3: Masonic like thing. Oh yeah, the baseball diamond alone like
Speaker 3: showed some of the Masonic symbolism. But yeah, I would
Speaker 3: even say, uh, stuff like that. Uh probably, I hate
Speaker 3: to say, I don't know if the people's energy you're
Speaker 3: probably being used at live events mm hmm. You know,
Speaker 3: when when artists are performing, I do believe some of
Speaker 3: them actually do understand what the fuck they're doing up
Speaker 3: on the stage.
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh the people you know paying me are doing this?
Speaker 1: Now you understand it? Too. Yeah, there's a lot of
Speaker 1: energy concentrated in one room, right, like pretty potent.
Speaker 2: And when you say used, you know what I mean,
Speaker 2: just like the way you would go to a concert
Speaker 2: and there's energy back and forth between the performer and
Speaker 2: the fans. You mean used us you.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, yeah, raised raised the energy hardest.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, hm. So I guess that kind of like
Speaker 1: brings me if we're going we want to kind of
Speaker 1: stick on the the Hollywood and like art and media
Speaker 1: kind of thing. So obviously like Crowley is is like
Speaker 1: kind of the figurehead. I don't I don't know your
Speaker 1: your personal thoughts on Crowley my mind. I mean I
Speaker 1: kind of view him as like as like a bit
Speaker 1: of a puppet in a way, like he was the
Speaker 1: one that was sort of allowed to take center stage
Speaker 1: with it.
Speaker 3: Yeah you know what I mean, tell with especially like
Speaker 3: you know, I'm trying to I'm eventually going to cover
Speaker 3: myself and I've had like seventy pages of notes on
Speaker 3: the guy, and I mean he was so much involved
Speaker 3: with intelligence on both sides. Yeah, Like who the fuck
Speaker 3: even really knows what the helble's up with this dude.
Speaker 1: Well, in the amount of like artists that were quote
Speaker 1: unquote influenced by him or or you know, inspired by him.
Speaker 1: Is just sort of like, how how did this guy
Speaker 1: make it into your field of view?
Speaker 2: You?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, sometimes even what do like if part of
Speaker 3: like like do we know him the way we're supposed to?
Speaker 1: Right? You know, I think a lot of his stories,
Speaker 1: I mean again.
Speaker 3: If he wrote them, they sound very occult symbol symbolism anyway.
Speaker 4: So it's just like it's just certain ones.
Speaker 3: Like things that I've read or looked at of his
Speaker 3: and it's like as I'm reading and I'm like, is
Speaker 3: this really a story or you just telling another occult tale?
Speaker 3: Like it's a symbolism in here that I'm supposed to
Speaker 3: catch on to to see what you're saying. Yeah, So
Speaker 3: it's like I even wonder, like what's And again, I'm
Speaker 3: not saying this to say the guy was better person
Speaker 3: than he is. No, I definitely think at times he
Speaker 3: was a degenerate drug addict. On not puttinghim on a pedestal.
Speaker 3: He even says, don't put me on a pedestal twice
Speaker 3: in his own work. I'm not, but I don't. I
Speaker 3: when it comes to some of the stories about him,
Speaker 3: I wonder how fabricated it is, like as like this
Speaker 3: bad boy image and all that, right, like everything that
Speaker 3: my opinion, I do think some of his stuff he
Speaker 3: is talking about physiology, and I do think he's talking
Speaker 3: about the experience of death. And I think when you
Speaker 3: were considered a drug addict, pervert and you've wroten perverted.
Speaker 4: Stuff, very little people are gonna look at your work.
Speaker 3: Only the people that really don't give a fuck or
Speaker 3: might be a little twisted or just like I think,
Speaker 3: like for me, I understand, and I do believe the
Speaker 3: guy wasn't a perfect human being. He probably did some
Speaker 3: fucked up shit, but I also do think he was
Speaker 3: onto something. So that's why I was interested in his stuff.
Speaker 3: M you know, so I do think, like to an extent,
Speaker 3: like they'll put that image on the person so nobody
Speaker 3: even looks.
Speaker 2: At their shit as well, staying them almost.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean there's plenty of degenerates with good ideas, right,
Speaker 1: I mean, like I had a Hunter S. Thompson phase,
Speaker 1: and like that guy was you know, he was fucked,
Speaker 1: but he's had some brilliant writing and some really ideas
Speaker 1: and stuff. You know, you kind of have to and
Speaker 1: you said like you have to experience that death, you
Speaker 1: gotta you gotta dance with the devil a little bit
Speaker 1: to understand like what he's about, you know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I would say that. Yeah, I mean it's
Speaker 4: e gonna.
Speaker 3: It was definitely like even being in the OTO, it
Speaker 3: was a good experience for me to even say, like
Speaker 3: this is who I don't want to be and do
Speaker 3: want to be.
Speaker 1: So, I mean, it all had it's it helped. What
Speaker 1: was it about the OTO that that you liked and
Speaker 1: didn't like? Like what what initially made you want to
Speaker 1: actually join a magical order versus like, you know, brought
Speaker 1: you to leave?
Speaker 2: And and what what made you leave?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Yeah, originally I was getting you know, I was practicing
Speaker 3: magic at this point. I was doing ceremonial stuff, but
Speaker 3: I was doing it out of books, and I started
Speaker 3: to notice discrepancies between stuff and books, like like a
Speaker 3: book maybe referring I'm almost positive it was somebody referring
Speaker 3: to Crowley and one of his uh I think he
Speaker 3: leab a Rush and in the book wasn't in the
Speaker 3: same order that it was when Croley wrote it.
Speaker 4: So I was just like, how the like you fucked
Speaker 4: that up?
Speaker 3: So I was like, all right, I guess, like I
Speaker 3: can't even like really count on books to be incorrect.
Speaker 3: So I was like, maybe I should see if there's
Speaker 3: one of these fucking orders or one of these things
Speaker 3: around here, and I'll just join it and see what
Speaker 3: the hell's going on. And I knew a couple of now, well,
Speaker 3: I knew like maybe a handful, like maybe two or
Speaker 3: three Freemasons from being in like which or cult Facebook
Speaker 3: groups shows you how long ago this was, when those
Speaker 3: things are actually popular and weren't all bots.
Speaker 4: It was this. So I met him.
Speaker 3: I met a couple of people through there, and I
Speaker 3: spoke to a couple of Freemasons, and one of them
Speaker 3: was like, don't even balther. If you're gonna want to
Speaker 3: get into ceremonial magic, which he was in himself, he says,
Speaker 3: the Freemason is just it's gonna take forever, he says,
Speaker 3: until they even acknowledge that shit's you know, real, he says,
Speaker 3: But if you're better off probably with like the Golden
Speaker 3: Down the Oto which he was in, or the Martinists.
Speaker 3: And there was none unless it was a Golden Down
Speaker 3: order that just I couldn't find. There was nothing near
Speaker 3: me at all except for the OTO about twenty five
Speaker 3: minutes away, which is actually like there's not too many
Speaker 3: of those in the United States, so it's actually kind
Speaker 3: of surprising, like I guess, and uh, I was like fuck,
Speaker 3: I was like, all right, I guess I'll deal with
Speaker 3: like fucking croy shit.
Speaker 1: Fuck.
Speaker 3: Totally honest with you when I say this a lot,
Speaker 3: I was much more hoping for a golden doing, right,
Speaker 3: which then kind of did have a little bit of
Speaker 3: Crowley's you know, Crowley was in it, so I had
Speaker 3: assumed that it probably had some value, you know, because
Speaker 3: he kind of ripped off a lot of their shit too.
Speaker 3: And uh, and it just seems to have like a
Speaker 3: little bit more of an academic angle to it, or
Speaker 3: didn't have like such I guess negative connotations along with it.
Speaker 3: That was a little bit more you know, I guess
Speaker 3: interested in that, but there wasn't one.
Speaker 1: So I was like, fucking I'll go to the OTO.
Speaker 3: So, you know, long story just to say all that,
Speaker 3: but yeah, basically because of me wanting to, I guess,
Speaker 3: go to a source and go to a place that
Speaker 3: has probably like an outlined like this is what's worked,
Speaker 3: you know, go by this there's still plenty in there
Speaker 3: to throw in your own stuff, but some sort of
Speaker 3: outline that you know you can go by that is,
Speaker 3: don't to worry gonna have to worry about screwing anything
Speaker 3: up or changing anything around. So that's what brought me there.
Speaker 3: Uh why did I leave? That I could say before
Speaker 3: I left, I knew I wasn't gonna stay too long.
Speaker 3: And the OTO, Uh, I guess in between the degrees
Speaker 3: sometimes there might be like, uh, things of service that
Speaker 3: you could do. Sometimes as you start going higher up,
Speaker 3: there might be like certain things you might have to
Speaker 3: like cross off on a list, or like certain things
Speaker 3: you might have to like, uh, just align with I
Speaker 3: guess in order to keep going forward. Another thing with
Speaker 3: the OTO, the first four degrees you're allowed to ask
Speaker 3: to do. From the fifth degree on, they have to
Speaker 3: ask you if you want to do. So that's like
Speaker 3: you have to realize there, that's like a little it's
Speaker 3: just different something. I think even at like the fourth degree,
Speaker 3: you're already considered like a perfected magician, so then you know,
Speaker 3: like what's past that, you know? But what I'm getting
Speaker 3: at uh, yeah, I think it was after the second
Speaker 3: degree when I had taken it. They were reading off
Speaker 3: a list of just like certain things that could be
Speaker 3: done as like service or whatever, blah blah blah in
Speaker 3: between the degrees and like again, like I said, things
Speaker 3: I might have to like line up. And at one
Speaker 3: point they as they were going up to degrees, Uh,
Speaker 3: they did mention.
Speaker 1: Like whoever you were with, like I was married at
Speaker 1: the time. Uh, she probably had to be a member
Speaker 1: or where it started coming.
Speaker 3: And I was just like, even though I've asked her
Speaker 3: a comment, she's always said no. It's just like if
Speaker 3: she did she showed up for a Gnostic mass, it
Speaker 3: probably wouldn't went well because I mean I never told her,
Speaker 3: but you know, titties come out well that ship.
Speaker 1: She were like, Yo, you're getting the fuck out of
Speaker 1: here and all the fucking yeah You're like, oh you've
Speaker 1: been coming here that long.
Speaker 4: Going on?
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah sure. But uh, I was just like,
Speaker 1: all right, so that's not gonna work, okay. I my opinion,
Speaker 1: I thought that's a little drastic. Yeah, oh that's just
Speaker 1: fucking weird to me. It's like, what if you want
Speaker 1: to break from this place like it fucking go home
Speaker 1: and it's still there.
Speaker 4: You know what I'm saying, yeah, I mean uh. And
Speaker 4: then the one thing that I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.
Speaker 1: I almost paused it was the eighth degree where they're like,
Speaker 1: you're gonna sign over everything of your ship to the OTO.
Speaker 1: Oh now it's a cult, all right, Yeah, I know
Speaker 1: this at the second degree and don't go any follow
Speaker 1: but I don't go too much fallow, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying, like, this isn't uh, this isn't gonna be
Speaker 1: a lifetime thing.
Speaker 3: This is gonna be you know, short right. I was
Speaker 3: not down with that, so that had bothered me prior.
Speaker 3: You know, at that point I'd already had it in
Speaker 3: my mind that I was like, this is you know again,
Speaker 3: this is only going to be short lived at this point,
Speaker 3: because I did find that extremely fucking weird.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then COVID.
Speaker 3: Came and then this is I don't know, I feel
Speaker 3: like at that point the OTO seemed to have a
Speaker 3: political agenda. They closed at first, but me and a
Speaker 3: couple of the members store it was a kind of silly.
Speaker 3: It's just like, yo, you need to tell me Jesus
Speaker 3: got bigger bulls and horse right now, Like like an
Speaker 3: horse is fucking scared as he hiding behind his shield,
Speaker 3: like what the fuck?
Speaker 1: Man? Like, yeah, come on.
Speaker 3: Like how about Like is there's people who have balls
Speaker 3: enough to go down there and open it up, and
Speaker 3: there's people have balls enough to go down there and
Speaker 3: hang out to.
Speaker 4: Just fucking do that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know what I'm saying, Like, because I know,
Speaker 3: between me and other people that have been there long
Speaker 3: enough that would have been able to do that. We
Speaker 3: would have been able to go down there every fucking
Speaker 3: weekend if we wanted to and actually opened something up.
Speaker 3: He came out, I'm doubted, but who knows. I'm just saying,
Speaker 3: were you know there whatever. I didn't agree with them
Speaker 3: doing that. Then, like they started doing meetings on Zoom
Speaker 3: and I was like, all right, you know, I hadn't
Speaker 3: really gone to a meeting honestly in probably six months
Speaker 3: prior to COVID, mainly because of that what we said
Speaker 3: at that thing that I did after my degree. I
Speaker 3: was a little balthered by that. Uh so I really
Speaker 3: wasn't going back too much. And there was just there's
Speaker 3: certain people there too that was just kind of like
Speaker 3: just weird.
Speaker 1: It was fair enough, yeah, yeah, yeah, And unfortunately it
Speaker 1: was like people I kind of got close.
Speaker 3: With, and I was just like, now, unfortunately, like finding
Speaker 3: out you're weird or you're just like, you know, an alcoholic.
Speaker 3: It's very uncomfortable. I don't know how to explain it. So,
Speaker 3: uh yeah, I really wasn't going that much anymore. And
Speaker 3: they started doing the zoom meetings. I'm like, you know what,
Speaker 3: that's like real easy. I don't even have to show
Speaker 3: my face to just have to see my name, you know.
Speaker 1: I listened, I turn around, mute myself on my fucking headset, and.
Speaker 4: You know, blah blah blah.
Speaker 3: It looks like I showed up, you know, because I
Speaker 3: still had in my head like, well, maybe I'll still
Speaker 3: hang out, like maybe I'll you know, I'll do another
Speaker 3: degree or two before it gets to you know, to
Speaker 3: where I don't want to go anymore, you know whatever.
Speaker 1: Might fuck myself.
Speaker 3: And so then like one day I got an email
Speaker 3: and I'm like, yo, you gotta be kidding me. They
Speaker 3: had a meeting because of the George Floyd situation. I
Speaker 3: was like, wait what, I'm like, this has nothing to
Speaker 3: do with the magic the Book of the Law.
Speaker 1: I'm like, all right, I gotta go anyway.
Speaker 3: And then like it came to me like I don't
Speaker 3: think it was like, I'm almost positive it came through
Speaker 3: liked it to who he lodge email. That wasn't like,
Speaker 3: you know, the lodge master or somebody that I was
Speaker 3: cool with sent me the email through their personal email,
Speaker 3: Like it came through the OTO.
Speaker 1: So I was just like, really, I like, what what
Speaker 1: the fuck? I was like, I gotta go check this out.
Speaker 1: This's fucking bullshit. So I got there and it basically
Speaker 1: like you know, they kind of went over the situation
Speaker 1: and then like started going around like the room, you
Speaker 1: know whatever, it's a fucking virtual rumoring. I didn't say anything.
Speaker 1: This was me and like a few people skipped and.
Speaker 3: People like talking about their experiences, like them experiencing racism.
Speaker 3: I was like, well, first off, it's fucking weird. There's
Speaker 3: only one black guy on this whole fun I was like,
Speaker 3: maybe should we address that first, like DICKX, let's truss that.
Speaker 3: I don't know what to tell you, Like, you know,
Speaker 3: I don't know the other black guy.
Speaker 1: You kicked him out because he was an alcoholic, so
Speaker 1: I mean, you have less of them.
Speaker 3: So it was just like it was just fucking weird.
Speaker 3: To start like, I was just like, what is going
Speaker 3: on here? I'm like, this has nothing to.
Speaker 4: Do I mean, I got cold.
Speaker 3: I have white privilege for talking about this situation on
Speaker 3: another which podcast, so you know, keep it on compan Yeah,
Speaker 3: white privilege because I didn't understand whether fuck George Floyd's
Speaker 3: being talked about in the OTO. I was like that,
Speaker 3: I said, listen, what happened to that guy, if it
Speaker 3: was real, was horrible. It shouldn't have happened. But that
Speaker 3: had nothing to do with going against them my will whatsoever.
Speaker 3: What happened to that guy, Unfortunately, if he's dead or not,
Speaker 3: did not fucking inflict any It didn't change my world.
Speaker 4: Yeah, didn't affect me.
Speaker 3: So why am I going to be out in the
Speaker 3: streets losing myself over that shit?
Speaker 1: Yeah? You know, I just I was like, I just
Speaker 1: don't agree with it. And I said, you know, the OTO.
Speaker 3: Pretty much supposed to be like Alcoholics Anonymous, where we
Speaker 3: have nothing to talk about except what the fuck goes
Speaker 3: on in this big book, inside this room, outside of
Speaker 3: these doors, have nothing to do with the fuck we're
Speaker 3: talking about, just the same way as the OTO, So
Speaker 3: why the fuck are we talking about George Floyd and
Speaker 3: other people's experiences with racism.
Speaker 4: I just found it very weird.
Speaker 1: And then they started, you know, going on about oh,
Speaker 1: maybe we could get protests together, and I'm like, oh, whoa,
Speaker 1: Like what the fuck is going on here? Yeah?
Speaker 3: I was like, Yo, this is weird. And then like
Speaker 3: the one, the one black guy who was also a lawyer,
Speaker 3: so that's running.
Speaker 1: His mouth going on about like if Antifa gets deemed
Speaker 1: a terrorist, which may years later they did.
Speaker 3: Our rights are going right out the window. We can't
Speaker 3: let this happen. We'll be fucked blah blah blah blah
Speaker 3: blah blah. And I was like, Yo, when did this
Speaker 3: turn into? So I'm like leftist rally? Yeah, yeah that's
Speaker 3: and I was like, what the fuck happened?
Speaker 4: To imagine?
Speaker 1: You know, like even Crawley would be like, shut the
Speaker 1: fuck up, bitches and do magic already, you fucking we
Speaker 1: probably leave that order.
Speaker 3: If that guy was alive today, he'd be like, motherfuckers
Speaker 3: are all bitches? Man, Like, yeah, that's super strange to me.
Speaker 2: I never would have imagined that that went on. Do
Speaker 2: you think it was so huge? And the George Floyd
Speaker 2: thing was pretty easy to see through. I think being
Speaker 2: not in the States as well being Canadian, Like you
Speaker 2: could see when it was put out why it was
Speaker 2: put out and to create more division, and it was
Speaker 2: just before the election, I think too, right, yeah, yeah, anyway, yeah,
Speaker 2: you think that people people would see through that.
Speaker 3: The COVID thing even weeded me out to where it's like,
Speaker 3: all right, like this could really be coincidental, really could be.
Speaker 3: But like, all right, I'm in the OTO, and like
Speaker 3: there are people who like, if you're in the OTO,
Speaker 3: you might be in the astro Argentim, or at least
Speaker 3: you know of the Astronomergentim. You might eve even like
Speaker 3: you know, uh, looked at the books that they suggest
Speaker 3: to read or whatever, like you probably know who they are,
Speaker 3: and you know that their robes are what they look like.
Speaker 3: They don't have a mouthpiece on them. It's just a
Speaker 3: fucking you Like it's literally like almost, I hate to say,
Speaker 3: it almost looks like a black version.
Speaker 1: Of a KKK out it. It's really weird.
Speaker 3: And it has like the eye and the you know,
Speaker 3: the thing on its forehead triangle and shit.
Speaker 4: I have one, and.
Speaker 3: Again like no mouthpiece and then like suggested circle size
Speaker 3: is normally six feet so like when coviing came, I
Speaker 3: was even like, yo, this is just like just like
Speaker 3: I guess maybe because I owned one. I was like,
Speaker 3: this is just so weird, Like I have my mouth's
Speaker 3: covered and six feet apart, like that's what I look
Speaker 3: like when I'm doing a ritual in my fucking living room.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm. Wow. I don't know if that had anything
Speaker 1: to do with it. And your eyes project out six
Speaker 1: feet believe it or not.
Speaker 3: Yeah, all that I was just like, listen, I maybe
Speaker 3: from a conspiratory, you know, angle. I would still think
Speaker 3: some people would be like hmm, like that seems very
Speaker 3: reminiscent of like X, Y and Z. Nobody at all,
Speaker 3: like not at one person I knew that was probably
Speaker 3: in the OTO, and very very few people that I
Speaker 3: knew were in Rich Crift and the occult community. Total,
Speaker 3: you know why that I knew saw anything weird about
Speaker 3: COVID Actually yeah, I was like, your motherfuckers, like, don't
Speaker 3: see it.
Speaker 4: It was kind of weird.
Speaker 1: The magicians and you're getting mind fucked right now? What
Speaker 1: is wrong with you? Yeah? Yeah, gives you.
Speaker 3: TV fucking BLM is walking down the streets to wherever
Speaker 3: the fuck they want right now.
Speaker 1: My opinion on some of that though, was like at
Speaker 1: the time, like the thing is is like these these
Speaker 1: like people that do magic and stuff already sort of
Speaker 1: exist out on the fringe, right, So it's like in
Speaker 1: my mind, it's like there are always people that kind
Speaker 1: of want to like remain in the shadows a little bit,
Speaker 1: not draw attention to themselves. So my thought with all
Speaker 1: of that is like, oh, these are already like organizations
Speaker 1: that are probably like looked at kind of weird. So
Speaker 1: they're just going lockstep just to you know, take the
Speaker 1: attention off of them because you know, like I mean,
Speaker 1: we saw just even Christian churches that remained open and stuff.
Speaker 1: We're getting persecuted during that time for all that, right,
Speaker 1: So I mean imagine if yeah, if the oto was like, well.
Speaker 5: We're staying running ceremonies, you know, the but if it's
Speaker 5: a secret society, you know what I mean, you think
Speaker 5: they would at least say at the meetings, you know,
Speaker 5: we're just doing this to show show face or you
Speaker 5: know what I mean, to get it off a good image.
Speaker 2: We don't actually met any of these things. Going to
Speaker 2: what he talked about, it's crazy.
Speaker 1: Another thing too, they eventually sent an email out out
Speaker 1: on that, and I don't know if you know, like
Speaker 1: if you ever heard them say ninety three, you know,
Speaker 1: it's like a you know, the limic thing.
Speaker 3: Now, I know, I would assume because they didn't ask me,
Speaker 3: they didn't ask Jordan, they didn't ask Jason, they didn't
Speaker 3: ask Michael, and I think there was one other person.
Speaker 3: It's only I know that's only five people or whatever,
Speaker 3: but there was a handful of us that I know.
Speaker 4: We never got an email for it.
Speaker 3: We got this email saying that ninety three percent of
Speaker 3: the lodge is not comfortable with opening up again unless
Speaker 3: we're vaccinated.
Speaker 4: Was I never got that email?
Speaker 1: Wow? So where did you get this ninety three percent
Speaker 1: from fucking the line? Yeah, you threw ninety three in
Speaker 1: there to probably sound cute for the fucking Elemites. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: and they just fucking ran with it and accepted it. Yeah.
Speaker 2: So do you think that someone high up knew what
Speaker 2: was going on and still just wanted to keep the
Speaker 2: sy up going or like, that's that's crazy.
Speaker 4: I don't, I'll be totally honest with you.
Speaker 1: I choke.
Speaker 2: No, Yeah, you wouldn't, really.
Speaker 3: I mean, there's a lot of things with that organization
Speaker 3: that I don't understand. I mean, I've even said at
Speaker 3: times I think I think it's quite possible if could
Speaker 3: be CIA.
Speaker 1: I said at this point, Yeah, well, I know, like
Speaker 1: so I don't know what what you know, demographic kind
Speaker 1: of makes up a lot of the OTO, but I know,
Speaker 1: with like Freemasons and stuff, like all the Masons I
Speaker 1: know are fairly like affluent people, like they're either lawyers
Speaker 1: or they're like, you know, business owners and things like that.
Speaker 1: Even thing, dude, I experienced it. It was doctors, lawyers,
Speaker 1: people own their own businesses.
Speaker 3: People that walked in there that the way people you
Speaker 3: see people walk in there like they're from the craft,
Speaker 3: you know, a very cop. You know, it looks like
Speaker 3: they came out from an interview with the vampire ship.
Speaker 1: There's a guy who like literally like almost dress like
Speaker 1: that was like fucking Jesus Christ.
Speaker 3: Well, you'd have people from there to so many roads,
Speaker 3: just like what the fuck are you doing here?
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I think I think though, like with
Speaker 1: these secret societies and stuff, they end up attracting people
Speaker 1: like that because it's all you're already like, so if
Speaker 1: you're a doctor, right, like you're already in this in
Speaker 1: this world of status, like you put a lot of academics,
Speaker 1: believe it or not, we're very, very interested in that ship.
Speaker 1: And it makes me wonder if it's if it is
Speaker 1: has more to do with the hierarchical, like, you know,
Speaker 1: just being a part of something that's a step above
Speaker 1: the average schmuck. You know, you know, I hear what
Speaker 1: you're saying, and in that sense, it's like they're you know,
Speaker 1: they're it's just their ego driving them there a lot
Speaker 1: of the time. And sure, maybe you can like you
Speaker 1: can still learn magic, and you can still learn about
Speaker 1: something without understanding the the actual meaning behind it. Just
Speaker 1: like you know, you have the Sunday Christians that are
Speaker 1: go to church and they're all nice to everyone and
Speaker 1: oh yeah they have a family man, and then they're like,
Speaker 1: you know, fucking their secretary on on Monday to Friday.
Speaker 1: You know, like it's oh yeah, yeah, there was plenty
Speaker 1: of I mean, I'm pretty sure every place has that,
Speaker 1: but there's definitely like the OTO is definitely filled that
Speaker 1: type of version of people as well. In my opinion, Yeah,
Speaker 1: but my much.
Speaker 4: Of the work.
Speaker 1: But they think that they show up and do some
Speaker 1: psycho drama and whatever. Well exactly, and that's kind of
Speaker 1: my that's kind of my point with it is like
Speaker 1: when I was looking, I was doing some research for
Speaker 1: this and just like looking into the OTO and and
Speaker 1: different orders, and then there's you know, you get the
Speaker 1: guys that kind of fall outside of that, that are
Speaker 1: very against like the hierarchy of it all. What was
Speaker 1: the guy I've I've found like Phil Hines and Grant
Speaker 1: Morrison was like another guy found that. Like they're like
Speaker 1: self self proclaimed prat practitioners, but and and it with
Speaker 1: that style of magic, but they're not like they don't
Speaker 1: believe in the hierarchy. They don't believe in the order.
Speaker 1: It's sort of it's like, you know, I.
Speaker 3: Don't exactly well yeah, I I I say, like my no,
Speaker 3: well maybe myself to an extent would be like I
Speaker 3: find something there in the LIMA, but I don't align
Speaker 3: with the UTO. Yeah, Like I'm having Georgina rose On,
Speaker 3: she's not a Note to YO member, but she practices
Speaker 3: the LIMC magic.
Speaker 1: M hm. So I don't know if that's what you're
Speaker 1: kind of getting at, like somebody who Yeah, well, I
Speaker 1: just I'm I I guess I was just kind of
Speaker 1: getting at like, it doesn't surprise me that there's a
Speaker 1: good chunk of there's a lot of people that do
Speaker 1: do that. Yeah, that are just you know, in it
Speaker 1: for the status of it, not in it for Oh okay,
Speaker 1: yeah you know what I mean. Yeah, I was even
Speaker 1: gonna say this.
Speaker 3: I guess what I'm trying to get as even a
Speaker 3: lot of people out there who don't align with these
Speaker 3: orders but still practice the magic solidarity too.
Speaker 1: Oh okay, that's a big thing as well, believe it
Speaker 1: or not.
Speaker 3: Huh, there's probably more people practicing with the Limke Magic
Speaker 3: at home than there is in the order, right, I mean,
Speaker 3: I'll keep it real and it's like I kind of
Speaker 3: bragging it not but like I have more people that listen.
Speaker 1: To my podcast and there is members of the OTO
Speaker 1: at this point.
Speaker 2: M okay, yeah, do you think there's a danger in
Speaker 2: people doing it? Maybe not a danger is the right word,
Speaker 2: Like full disclosure. I think I've went over this on
Speaker 2: a few of our other podcasts. This stuff scares me
Speaker 2: a little bit, not scares me like in the world sense,
Speaker 2: just if it was something I had to go through.
Speaker 2: Crossing that threshold is something that would even the thought
Speaker 2: of it scares me. And can things come about from
Speaker 2: people just practicing it at home? From right? Can things
Speaker 2: be open? Can things be people?
Speaker 3: The oto would have said said it, I would say
Speaker 3: almost ninety nine percent of everybody in there that was
Speaker 3: worth listening to all would say the same thing.
Speaker 1: The magic happens at home when you doing it yourself.
Speaker 3: You come here, Yes, you're doing things collectively, and maybe
Speaker 3: there might be a little bit of you know, something
Speaker 3: going on, but it really is magic is a personal
Speaker 3: Like if I'm saying what I think it is for myself,
Speaker 3: have any experience with God that is extremely personal?
Speaker 1: You know that's not happening when you're out with your friends.
Speaker 1: That's happening when you're home, like like at your altar,
Speaker 1: crying to God for something to change, you know, shit
Speaker 1: like that is when that will happen. That that then
Speaker 1: mm hmm. And that so like to Mike's point though,
Speaker 1: then is there like.
Speaker 4: There's a lot of benefits to it? I think on
Speaker 4: your own?
Speaker 1: Yeah, is there like malproducts it is. Let's say, if.
Speaker 3: You're gonna say, you know what, I'm gonna get into
Speaker 3: ceremonial magic, and I'll tell you the first thing you
Speaker 3: should do is get into meditation, and then I can
Speaker 3: list ten other things. If you just get to meditation
Speaker 3: and never even go past that, you fucking got.
Speaker 1: It all right. You're doing good because, believe it or not,
Speaker 1: I don't think you once.
Speaker 3: For me, once I had a magical experience. All I
Speaker 3: need to do after that is meditate to do it
Speaker 3: over again. I got to do no ritual. I'm gonna
Speaker 3: call down, call down this, X, Y and Z all
Speaker 3: that bullshit. I close my eyes and I know way
Speaker 3: to go right right. You've built the pathway there already. Yeah, yes,
Speaker 3: I mean that's a I think as a personal if
Speaker 3: you really my my from my experience, I do think
Speaker 3: on your own you can literally have an experience with God. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I do think he will. He will give you that chance.
Speaker 3: You just have to go to him. He's not coming
Speaker 3: to you. So I'm saying, you gonna be calling God
Speaker 3: into your fucking living room. You are gonna have to
Speaker 3: go to the other side. And in order to do that, why,
Speaker 3: I think another reason death is part of it. You're
Speaker 3: going you have to give up every fucking thing, everything.
Speaker 3: It is the ultimate sacrifice if you want to fucking
Speaker 3: actually talk to God. You're gonna have to give up
Speaker 3: all this shit you've fallen in love with before him, It's.
Speaker 1: All gotta go. You gotta leave the flesh. That's my opinion.
Speaker 1: That's the the whole ego death thing, right, like part
Speaker 1: of it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.
Speaker 3: And in that experience when you are, when I feel
Speaker 3: my self coming out of it, it literally feels like
Speaker 3: that's what's melting off of me, fear, anxiety, and hate, all.
Speaker 4: The ship my ego was.
Speaker 1: Is you literally like you feel like you're becoming weightless.
Speaker 3: Yeah, all those emotions just fucking dissipate and all you
Speaker 3: feel is love and that's it.
Speaker 1: M Like I can say, but like I've I've never
Speaker 1: done like magical practice, but I've I've messed around with
Speaker 1: psychedelics enough to have kind of been in that in
Speaker 1: that space before you know it? Is it the same thing?
Speaker 1: Is it like that when you're in that like heroic
Speaker 1: like heroes dose mushroom trip and you're like, you know,
Speaker 1: you die because I've had that happen where it's like
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, I'm dead, like this is this is
Speaker 1: where I am now? Is Is it comparable or are
Speaker 1: you talking about as different.
Speaker 4: It's interesting.
Speaker 3: I've done a lot of like hallucinogenics, a lot of
Speaker 3: acids and shroops. I never did d MT, though I've
Speaker 3: done Mescalona for you a few times. Any experiences I've
Speaker 3: had with that, I not really. But the weird thing is,
Speaker 3: though what I could attribute it to and this this
Speaker 3: might get a little weird. Every time I've ever had
Speaker 3: a magical experience, that experience itself.
Speaker 1: Has always been beautiful. There's nothing ever been negative about it.
Speaker 1: Coming back and opening up my eyes just my opinion,
Speaker 1: You're gonna have.
Speaker 4: To realize your world's going to.
Speaker 3: Change every time that happens, because there's gonna be new
Speaker 3: truths that you've experienced or sore or just things that
Speaker 3: make sense now that is probably going to fracture beliefs
Speaker 3: that you've had since you can remember. That's can sometimes
Speaker 3: be rough, and I would say times when I've it's
Speaker 3: gonna sound crazy because A're going to raise Sometimes i'd
Speaker 3: smoke PCP you get dippies, And there's been a few
Speaker 3: times when I've smoked that shit to where it made
Speaker 3: me feel like I was like like literally like one
Speaker 3: questioning if I've actually like lost my mind and that
Speaker 3: actually like felt very much the same when I came back,
Speaker 3: like the actual real like almost terror, like a terror.
Speaker 1: Within yourself, like fuck, did I really snap?
Speaker 3: You know, worrying about that like it's real that or
Speaker 3: then the whole Like there's been times on it when
Speaker 3: I really felt like my head was removed from my
Speaker 3: body and I was just like kind of witnessing.
Speaker 4: That I felt on PCP.
Speaker 1: That's a little bit like kind of experience I've.
Speaker 3: Had with magic, but never I've had plenty of people
Speaker 3: we've even told me my experience sounds very close to
Speaker 3: their follocentogenic trips like you're talking about.
Speaker 4: But I don't.
Speaker 1: I've never seen a connection too much. I mean I
Speaker 1: may not have, you know, I always kind of stuck
Speaker 1: to like, you know, splitting an eighth with the friends
Speaker 1: of Shrooms quarter, so maybe you know, maybe I don't know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, we're the similarities between what you saw
Speaker 2: and what they saw.
Speaker 3: Like a lot of times when I talk about, uh,
Speaker 3: some people they are that eclipse were kind of like.
Speaker 1: Spirals of like colors or geometric symbols stuff like that.
Speaker 1: I've had people say that they've they've seen.
Speaker 5: That or.
Speaker 3: Again it sometimes there's a lot of things that I
Speaker 3: can't even really describe, yeah, because there isn't just like
Speaker 3: it almost like it doesn't exist in this.
Speaker 1: World to have words for.
Speaker 3: But the colors can get very different, almost like almost
Speaker 3: like like you're looking at like a thermal camera type
Speaker 3: of color. I've had some people that I have thought
Speaker 3: that the way I've tried to describe the way things
Speaker 3: looked in the color and the texture, even the texture
Speaker 3: at times looked a little different. People seem to have
Speaker 3: said that they've seen that on a DMT lit mushrooms.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I've had people tell me, well, it's not like yeah,
Speaker 1: to me, it sounds a lot just like like frequency perception, right,
Speaker 1: like you know, there's the whole thing that we can
Speaker 1: only see what is it, like thirteen percent of the
Speaker 1: actual whole color spectrum.
Speaker 4: And oh yeah, things like that real quick.
Speaker 1: I'm talking about the eyeballs and how important they are
Speaker 1: in a cult symbolism. Well, that's one of the reasons
Speaker 1: that if you start looking, if.
Speaker 3: You look up animals, insects or whatever that all have
Speaker 3: like better eyes than us or can see more of
Speaker 3: this spectrum. You'll be like, oh wow, okay, yeah, that
Speaker 3: i've seen in a cold symbolism that I've seen in
Speaker 3: a cold symbolism that I've seen it cold, just not
Speaker 3: seeing similarities like something special.
Speaker 1: To do with the others. Just wanted to throw that out. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well well no and then that's yeah, that was kind
Speaker 1: of my point was like it sounds to me like
Speaker 1: what's Yeah, what's happening is like you're opening up. It's like,
Speaker 1: you know, the the eyes of perception, like you're you're
Speaker 1: just like expanding that that lens that you're able to
Speaker 1: see things through.
Speaker 4: Right, So yo, the whole shell of a scorpion is
Speaker 4: a written Really that's insane.
Speaker 1: Huh.
Speaker 2: Do you know about cat eyes? The only other animals
Speaker 2: of eyes like a cat or reptiles they have reptilian yeah,
Speaker 2: house cats they don't. Like big cats don't have the
Speaker 2: same eyes as house cats. Yeah, maybe that's what they
Speaker 2: can see everything.
Speaker 1: Yeah anyway, Yeah, well I mean this.
Speaker 3: Yeah, actually you're faster than snakes too when it comes
Speaker 3: to reaction time. Really, oh yeah, they actually are.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, a cat will just that'll smack the shit
Speaker 1: out of a fucking sneak all.
Speaker 3: Day for the most Yeah, you're even go look it
Speaker 3: up in reaction times you'd be like, holy shit, a
Speaker 3: cat is actually fastive?
Speaker 1: Huh that's cool. Yeah, yeah, I don't know it was.
Speaker 4: I don't know why the fuck I know this shit?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Funny the stuff I remember? Yeah yeah yeah, yeah right,
Speaker 2: especially when it comes to animals.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, another thing.
Speaker 4: I've been really interested in them lately.
Speaker 3: I don't know if it's because I just didn't pay
Speaker 3: attention to them enough in like the last twenty or
Speaker 3: thirty years, but like, I feel like the animals are
Speaker 3: even certain pet scene laser. It's kind of getting a
Speaker 3: little bit more like I'm not human but like self aware.
Speaker 3: And I've been wondering, like, yo, like if there is
Speaker 3: like people want to talk about this whole like it's
Speaker 3: nice to think of some hole like I guess leveling
Speaker 3: up consciously, you know what I'm saying. But if there
Speaker 3: is something along those terms, where did that go with
Speaker 3: everything alive?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 4: Why not?
Speaker 1: Just why only humans? You know?
Speaker 4: Could that be for everything?
Speaker 1: So that means like what, you know, could my cat
Speaker 1: actually start getting a little bit more intelligent? Yeah?
Speaker 3: Well, I mean or could we like not telepathically, but
Speaker 3: could we actually read each other just better?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Well, there's that that whole that whole topic now
Speaker 1: where like the Earth's magnetic field is weakening, right, so
Speaker 1: we're getting these we're getting light codes or whatever. You know,
Speaker 1: if you're into the whole New age thing, people think
Speaker 1: that you're getting we're upgrading basically.
Speaker 2: And they're not fighting it. Humans would fight it start right,
Speaker 2: Like a lot of people would fight getting an upgrade.
Speaker 2: They wouldn't want it or wouldn't even know what it was,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean, whereas an animal is just
Speaker 2: going to take it in.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's something crazy when it comes to
Speaker 3: the eyeballs, uh, and it called symbolism and just stuff
Speaker 3: that I think is weird. If you want to look
Speaker 3: at like basically our eyes pick up life from the sun.
Speaker 3: It goes inside our eyeballs, you know, bounces around off
Speaker 3: the lens and does all this other shit.
Speaker 1: But then that's something light.
Speaker 3: When it hits your optic nerve gets trans gets turned
Speaker 3: into the like electricity, the electric pulse that the rest
Speaker 3: of your body runs on. So I mean we're basically
Speaker 3: being powered technically from the sun through our eyes and
Speaker 3: there's code in there that our brain is also decoding,
Speaker 3: and it turns like I said, then turns into electricity
Speaker 3: and then sends it down into your nerves. Yeah, so
Speaker 3: we even think of like when you're looking at something
Speaker 3: that fucking bothers you, when you feel that go through
Speaker 3: your body, that's I mean, think that's the relationship from
Speaker 3: your sight, from your eye, and now how your brain's
Speaker 3: gonna perceive it.
Speaker 1: And now your nerves go flood with that of a
Speaker 1: fucking feeling you you have to well, yeah, and to
Speaker 1: take it into a conspiratorial angle, right, Like it makes
Speaker 1: sense then why they're trying to block out the sun,
Speaker 1: makes sense, why they're spraying all the ship in the
Speaker 1: sky to make it gray all the time? Right, Like, No,
Speaker 1: that's all that sun is is fucking code man. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: for surely.
Speaker 3: I mean if you even think about like the way
Speaker 3: you don't just look at the way our fucking internet works,
Speaker 3: I mean it's anything Asy's Kirtry even said this back
Speaker 3: in like the fifteen to sixteen hundreds.
Speaker 1: He detart He said he's a Jesuit priest, but in
Speaker 1: occultas said that in the future, with light in crystals,
Speaker 1: I think we'll be able to transport spirits and demons.
Speaker 1: And if you think about the way our screens work
Speaker 1: and our phones work, and the way the Internet work
Speaker 1: with optical is just basically light flashing down a fucking
Speaker 1: tube of wire until it gets put into Wi Fi
Speaker 1: or whatever. That's just light and code and light and
Speaker 1: then crystals on our screens to see what it's saying.
Speaker 4: That motherfucking nailed it.
Speaker 1: Yeah well so yeah, well, I mean like quantum computing.
Speaker 1: We we just did an episode on on quantum computing
Speaker 1: and the way the like architects of that view it
Speaker 1: is is actually like jumping into parallel universes. It's not
Speaker 1: it's not a computing thing to them. This is interdimensional like.
Speaker 3: Shoe it is if you really start looking at the
Speaker 3: shit of how this stuff works, so it can get
Speaker 3: really like, what are we really doing with this technology?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I mean we listen, we're slaves to it ourselves.
Speaker 3: This is how we do our show. But you're not
Speaker 3: thinking about You're like.
Speaker 1: What the fuck?
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean.
Speaker 4: This it's a little weird if you think about it.
Speaker 1: And I mean, on one hand, it all just exists,
Speaker 1: and it's how it hads it like magic, right, it's
Speaker 1: how you use it that determines the impact that it
Speaker 1: has on the world. So I mean it's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: this technology exists, and there's a bunch of people trying
Speaker 1: to use it to control people, and then there's a
Speaker 1: bunch of people trying to like plant seeds and open
Speaker 1: people's minds with it. You know, you know, your wings
Speaker 1: are the same bird doing the same thing. You know.
Speaker 4: Another thing I find that like weirds me out too.
Speaker 3: With like all this technology, it always and if it's
Speaker 3: just if this sounds or sight or or whatever anything
Speaker 3: like that involved, everything always has a fucking magnet.
Speaker 1: M you can't do it without a magnet. Our speakers
Speaker 1: all need a fucking magnet. Ye, these hard rize and magnets.
Speaker 1: Like wait, what the fuck is up with that? Man?
Speaker 3: Like this is like the monolith and two thousand and
Speaker 3: one space, I say, like what the fuck?
Speaker 1: I don't know, it's just weird when you saw I thinking,
Speaker 1: you know, and how you know, magnetism is huge.
Speaker 3: I think in the occult, you know, electricity and magnetism
Speaker 3: I think could really boil everything down. But like I
Speaker 3: don't know, just even like for an occult is like
Speaker 3: if they never really started looking at things like that,
Speaker 3: Like that's fucking weird.
Speaker 1: M hm. Why do you always need a magnet in
Speaker 1: order to create sounds? And it's all about polarity, Well,
Speaker 1: if you want to project it from somewhere else, yeah yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's uh and then travels like an electric pulse
Speaker 3: like our fucking sun does to our life.
Speaker 1: I mean, magnetism was considered magic when it was first
Speaker 1: brought to the fort, like people who just assumed it
Speaker 1: was magic. You know, you can create, you can displace
Speaker 1: objects and create space between objects using magnets, right, so
Speaker 1: like on a large scale, think of that, right, like.
Speaker 3: Yeah, or even like yeah, like your cassette tech in
Speaker 3: your old car, like and then it's running wires which
Speaker 3: are like our veins down to the fucking speakers that
Speaker 3: have a magnet the pump about the sound that's coming
Speaker 3: from that cassette.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but even I mean I'm saying like on a
Speaker 1: on a large scale, like we have to talk about
Speaker 1: other planets and stuff and the other dimensions, Like is
Speaker 1: it just like opposing magnets, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Like that space or.
Speaker 3: That's what I think even happens with the polar shifts,
Speaker 3: the magnetic shift changes. Yeah, you know unfortunately. You know,
Speaker 3: I think if I'm correct, like two or three planets
Speaker 3: in succession have done it now. Yeah, so like the
Speaker 3: next Toms.
Speaker 1: I hate to say, like, that's probably what's going calm
Speaker 1: down the line.
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, I mean there's to be glow about it.
Speaker 1: If you get another one or two planets that flip,
Speaker 1: I'd be like, fuck, this doesn't look good coming down
Speaker 1: the road. Yeah, we might just get warm, warm winters.
Speaker 1: You know, you guys will be like, oh, it's like
Speaker 1: Florida now exactly.
Speaker 3: There's a lot you guys, probably the craziest fertile ground
Speaker 3: that ship throws out the show Man.
Speaker 1: The ship you guys could grow would be fucking no kidding.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm thinking weed and fucking I'm thinking weed and
Speaker 3: coffee beans right away.
Speaker 1: That's that's probably all I grow. That's Toto's an egg plant.
Speaker 1: So I've italian self right on. Yeah, we've kind of
Speaker 1: we've kind of jumped all over the place a little bit.
Speaker 1: I got I got a whole bunch of questions. I
Speaker 1: wanted to kind of get back to you. So you
Speaker 1: know you were you were saying, uh, with with the
Speaker 1: rituals and and and bringing your wife at the time
Speaker 1: and then the titties coming out. This was one of
Speaker 1: one of my main questions about it, and with gnosticism
Speaker 1: and all that stuff, is I feel like one of
Speaker 1: the like main attractors too sort of you know, is
Speaker 1: the sex magic side of it. And it's you know
Speaker 1: what I mean, And it just becomes this like focal
Speaker 1: point of it when I think, like, and everything I've
Speaker 1: read about it is you don't even actually get to
Speaker 1: like really partake in that part of it until you're
Speaker 1: way way higher up in the order, right, Like, it's
Speaker 1: like sex magic is sort of there for the well initiated,
Speaker 1: it's not you know, it's like you're just joining the
Speaker 1: OTO and jumping into a Friday night orgy kind of thing.
Speaker 3: But oh yeah, uh all right real quick, if your
Speaker 3: orgy every two years, the OTO does notokon. And that's
Speaker 3: like the conference now you probably I've heard I've never
Speaker 3: gone to one. I've heard that if you go when
Speaker 3: you're in nerval or a first degree No, I think
Speaker 3: you have to be first degree. In my bed, if
Speaker 3: you go, probably won't happen if you're a nerval but
Speaker 3: first degree if you get tapped on the shoulder, and
Speaker 3: ask to come back to somebody's room. It's probably because
Speaker 3: I haven't an orgy or they're letting their wife like
Speaker 3: get you know, fucking just have a train run them out.
Speaker 1: Believe it. I'm sweat to god, sweater god. I knew
Speaker 1: people who did that shit that personally, Like I knew
Speaker 1: them through the internet through like felemic fucking groups on.
Speaker 3: Facebook that that did that shit, and so like that.
Speaker 3: I actually say that that is real that if you
Speaker 3: go to one of those things, that that might actually
Speaker 3: be going on in a hotel room somewhere that wherever
Speaker 3: that convention is happening.
Speaker 1: But in the order itself, there's been things.
Speaker 3: Higher up that I will say, like I don't know
Speaker 3: if I could you know that much, I could probably
Speaker 3: really defend that does seem like it is possibly sex magic.
Speaker 4: I it was still very questionable on.
Speaker 1: That if it's actual sex.
Speaker 3: But uh, I yeah, that would if anything like that
Speaker 3: from the things that I have heard claims about with
Speaker 3: certain degrees going high up, Yeah, that's not gonna happen
Speaker 3: until like you're up.
Speaker 1: There up there.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I feel like there was another question.
Speaker 1: Well I sort of just like that, like I just
Speaker 1: my it was kind of an open ended question, But
Speaker 1: I just sort of think, like I I kind of
Speaker 1: seem to notice that it's what attracts a lot of like, yes.
Speaker 3: That's going to go on with that, I was gonna
Speaker 3: go on unfortunately unfortunate. You are very correct on that, though. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I will say for some reason, I'm just gonna keep
Speaker 3: it real.
Speaker 4: Selemac magic and chaos magic seem.
Speaker 3: To have very much that kind of like a sex
Speaker 3: sexualized connotation with it.
Speaker 1: You know. That's because like when it comes to chaos magic,
Speaker 1: there's like a few ideas or ways people will charge
Speaker 1: their sigils to do their cigal work, mantras, a.
Speaker 3: Few other things in masturbating is one of them. So
Speaker 3: there's a lot of people who I think or you know,
Speaker 3: kind of get into it, probably just looking for a
Speaker 3: friend to freak off with.
Speaker 1: Le'll be totally honest with you.
Speaker 3: I think, like what you're getting at, that's an edge
Speaker 3: for them, and they're probably just looking to find somebody.
Speaker 1: Or they're finding it as a they're probably sexually sick.
Speaker 1: Was put it that way.
Speaker 3: You know, they're probably looking for a place to keep
Speaker 3: to keep some sort of thing going that they're into.
Speaker 3: You know this might work out if I want to
Speaker 3: be a sexual debate getting into chaos magic. I'm interested
Speaker 3: in magic. I'm interested in chaos magic. I'm interested in magic,
Speaker 3: and I'm I want to find some you know, easy
Speaker 3: people to freak off with.
Speaker 1: I know the oto has a sexual connotation to it,
Speaker 1: Fuck it, I'm just fu going there.
Speaker 3: Yeah, unfortunately, I know people were probably into this shit.
Speaker 3: Don't want to hear it, but it's fucking true.
Speaker 1: Well yeah, real when it comes to the occult, that's
Speaker 1: a hot bed of mental health to begin with.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, let's just keep it real. You know that's
Speaker 3: saying I was fucking perfect. I'm fucking I know I'm
Speaker 3: weird too.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I know that. Yeah I'm not. Yeah, I'm
Speaker 1: no pillar of mental health.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, I'm just not that weird.
Speaker 3: Like if I think someone's weird at that point, it's
Speaker 3: probably bad because I believe it or not. I am
Speaker 3: pretty you know, open to like whatever you want your
Speaker 3: own home. I don't give a shit really, yeah for sure.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just feel like I kind of stay like
Speaker 1: I And again I'm not I'm not judging. I don't care.
Speaker 1: Whatever you want to let your freak flag fly.
Speaker 6: I don't really care, but but yeah, but it's just
Speaker 6: like I feel like it almost like there's all these
Speaker 6: things that kind of like put the stain on practicing magic,
Speaker 6: whereas it's like, you know, and that's separated from sort
Speaker 6: of mainstream religion.
Speaker 1: And I've never really seen the difference, like when I've
Speaker 1: been to Catholic I have Catholic family, and I've been
Speaker 1: to Catholic masses, and I'm like, how is this not magic?
Speaker 1: Like people are fucking crazy if you think that this
Speaker 1: is not magic, Like you're performing a ritual, there's a
Speaker 1: ceremony going on, Like how is this a uh, you know,
Speaker 1: a moral version of magic? And yet like you know,
Speaker 1: individualized practice magic is the devil, Like I just you
Speaker 1: know what I mean. So yeah, I don't know that
Speaker 1: that was really that was my point with it. It's
Speaker 1: just sort of there's like it it's I feel like
Speaker 1: people focus on that side of it as a way
Speaker 1: to disparage actually like you know, looking into what the
Speaker 1: stuff actually means.
Speaker 2: And oh yeah, people are actually trying to accomplished even
Speaker 2: when you look into it, like a Nochian magic like that.
Speaker 2: Because this is something that I had to learn about
Speaker 2: over the last month. I didn't know very much about it,
Speaker 2: and I had to research and research, but it seems
Speaker 2: like in every turn there's wife swapping. The first thing
Speaker 2: when you read about the OTO or try to that
Speaker 2: the way you, at least me, I ended up going
Speaker 2: was the Babylon Working and that you know what I mean,
Speaker 2: that sex magic one hundred percent and that's and today's
Speaker 2: the eightieth anniversary of the first first day.
Speaker 1: Of that, by the way, Synchronicity.
Speaker 2: What are your thoughts on on the Babylon Babylon Working?
Speaker 2: Is there any thoughts at all? Just just kind of
Speaker 2: what we were talking about to kind of disparage the
Speaker 2: OTO and give it a bad name.
Speaker 1: Culmination of a bunch of things. I think they're probably
Speaker 1: were They're fucking around doing something. But uh I I
Speaker 1: because of I'm trying to think a way to word it.
Speaker 3: I think Hubbard's I don't know how much about Parsons
Speaker 3: by Parsons, Yeah, Unfortunately, with Lockeed Martin and Crowley, I
Speaker 3: think we're involved in the government a lot more than
Speaker 3: more people think. I think they actually had something to
Speaker 3: do with MK Ultro as well, or some Crowley did,
Speaker 3: at least by far and I think part of Hubbard
Speaker 3: did as well, that a long story short is that
Speaker 3: we also got to give you some story and some
Speaker 3: bullshit story about why they're paling around then what they
Speaker 3: were really doing.
Speaker 4: So why not why not just say they're all butt
Speaker 4: fucking each other?
Speaker 1: Yeah, fair enough.
Speaker 4: I mean they probably weren't too, you know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, It's just I do think that there's just times
Speaker 3: Crowley came to New York, went to mon talk. There's
Speaker 3: certain things that that guy's done, certain doctors that he's
Speaker 3: come across him. The thing with him too, when Parsons,
Speaker 3: you look at the chicks therewith at certain times.
Speaker 4: Follow their last names. These motherfuckers were hooked up with
Speaker 4: Lockheed Martin.
Speaker 2: Bitches man that I was gonna say. So the Babylon,
Speaker 2: the Babylon working woman was at Marjorie Cameron like so
Speaker 2: when you look into her life, she was I lived
Speaker 2: somewhere in the Midwest, I think Iowa or something like that.
Speaker 2: Then during the war, worked for the Navy, worked at
Speaker 2: the White House.
Speaker 3: Yeah, if you were to look at stan right the
Speaker 3: females around with, you'll see you'll see a little bit
Speaker 3: more of a connection of what you can really find
Speaker 3: out about you know them, you know crole.
Speaker 1: Or the exactly too much of their story. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: that was the old Cohos came across. They were looking
Speaker 1: at the women and they were like, Yo, this ship
Speaker 1: is shady. Yeah.
Speaker 2: And then Jack Parsons died and she joined like the
Speaker 2: beatnik kind of group, almost like she was infiltrating that group.
Speaker 2: And then she went to San Francisco and then she
Speaker 2: went to La and the whole time she was in
Speaker 2: all these weird a cult adjacent kind of groups, you
Speaker 2: know what I mean. Well, it's always she's very odd.
Speaker 2: And the only picture you find of her from the
Speaker 2: forties she's in a navy outfit.
Speaker 1: It's funny how it's Yeah, it's funny how that always
Speaker 1: seems to work that way because even like to jump
Speaker 1: back to you know, the Charlie Kirk stuff, like the
Speaker 1: whole Erica Kirk thing, like she she's kind of kind
Speaker 1: of looks like she's a bit of a handler, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean, Like that's that sha looks insane.
Speaker 1: It was like, Yo, was she like a spy?
Speaker 4: Well yeah, yeah, right, like really weird dude.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you could dig into you can dig into
Speaker 1: anyone that's been kind of like I look at Yoko Ono,
Speaker 1: I mean right, like John Lennon was onto something Yoko
Speaker 1: Ona made him look crazy and broke up the Beatles.
Speaker 1: I mean people, I know people argue that, but let's
Speaker 1: face it, she did and you.
Speaker 4: Know, go off and regardless, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: Well yeah, yeah, but but you know, like where does
Speaker 1: she come from? Well, she comes from the like the
Speaker 1: fine art world, like the high like where you know that.
Speaker 3: You know, some some fucking plants we did well yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: New York artist is like a very It's it's a
Speaker 3: blanket term for I worked for the CIA, yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and like yeah that was even like other things too.
Speaker 1: It's like I don't know if it was it was
Speaker 1: it Crawley, Yeah, I think that somebody there was, Like
Speaker 1: I think him and other people have been known to
Speaker 1: like their spots in the city have been known to
Speaker 1: like the CIA has used them to put other people
Speaker 1: in these places as well. Mm hmm.
Speaker 4: So it's like, come on, like this is just a
Speaker 4: known like spot toed Age.
Speaker 3: It's just working out them now really famous people actually, yeah, so.
Speaker 2: As justin Epstein kind of thing long long, long ago,
Speaker 2: the Golden Order their Hamta Don same thing. There's a
Speaker 2: few people from that who are like, we're spies in
Speaker 2: World War two mm and well known that algann On
Speaker 2: Blackwood guy was one for sure. Yeah, so it makes
Speaker 2: sense intelligent intelligence gathering.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Oh, I think a real occult is like a
Speaker 1: real magician. I think they would actually be very, very
Speaker 1: valuable to the CIA es. Like if they're huge into
Speaker 1: like jamatri and shit, you already got a fucking code breaker,
Speaker 1: I mean, or a person who can write the shit
Speaker 1: and code now, yeah, you know.
Speaker 4: Which I do think Croley did that.
Speaker 3: I actually wonder in some of his stuff if he's
Speaker 3: actually putting out shit he wasn't supposed to.
Speaker 1: M Well, like you said earlier yourself, like when you
Speaker 1: start getting into this stuff, you start to understand human
Speaker 1: psychology better, right, So the whole parapsycholic parasp psychology realm
Speaker 1: that these guys work in, Like, yeah, it would make
Speaker 1: sense that they'd be well versed in that to truly
Speaker 1: understand how to manipulate the human psyche. And you know,
Speaker 1: plant seeds and plant ideas and even like think about
Speaker 1: Jack Parsons him again, I don't know what you guys
Speaker 1: believe I I think NASA's bullshit. I think it's actually
Speaker 1: quite as well. It started the year Crowley died as well.
Speaker 3: I do think actually Roly Parsons and Hubver might all
Speaker 3: have actually indirectly had something to do or directly with NASA.
Speaker 1: That's the mine.
Speaker 3: But Jack Parsons, if he, I could be wrong, but
Speaker 3: I think I'm onto something here. And in this way
Speaker 3: of thinking, if he technically didn't come up with the
Speaker 3: type of rockets that he did, space travel never would.
Speaker 1: Have vieve it have been possible. Mm hmm.
Speaker 4: So it's like you have to follow that whole line.
Speaker 3: It's starting from an ocultist Jack Parsons, That whole lot,
Speaker 3: whole brings us to the moon in a sense, how
Speaker 3: much nazis, how much of this is real? And again,
Speaker 3: what did I say? I think Nazi magic is is
Speaker 3: by giving you images and making you think you're seeing
Speaker 3: something that's not real.
Speaker 4: That's my opinion of landing on the moon.
Speaker 2: M Sorry, I was just gonna say, And who did
Speaker 2: they use to to fut like, to further Jackpart's ideas,
Speaker 2: they use the Nazis right from Operation Paper Club.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that's it just gets interesting. Yeah, so that
Speaker 1: is your opinion even on the whole like disclosure thing, UFOs, aliens,
Speaker 1: all that bullshit.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't.
Speaker 3: Only unfortunately, just due to having magical experiences myself, I
Speaker 3: have even like I was way open to aliens.
Speaker 1: And stuff like that, my idea of that is less now.
Speaker 1: I really question most of it.
Speaker 3: I think sometimes some of the stuff in the sky's
Speaker 3: we're seeing is just like high tech, or it's as
Speaker 3: crazy as it is side effects of magic things entering
Speaker 3: or leaving.
Speaker 2: Right, It's amazing how something like that. It's happened for
Speaker 2: me as well. Over the last couple of years, as
Speaker 2: I've learned more and more, I've believed in all that
Speaker 2: stuff less and Lessah, it's a portal, or it's what
Speaker 2: I want to see, or but it's not actually what
Speaker 2: I'm seeing.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 3: Another reason why I believe that too is that, you know,
Speaker 3: unfortunately it may sound corny, but for me a lot
Speaker 3: of times when I've had magical experiences, when I'm like
Speaker 3: not here anymore and I'm somewhere else, and it's like
Speaker 3: it's like I don't have a body, I'm just like
Speaker 3: visualizing a scene, like I'm just a part of it.
Speaker 3: A lot of it looks like shit that NASA would
Speaker 3: be saying like, oh, this is like out of space.
Speaker 1: M hm. So I wonder, like, you know, they already
Speaker 1: have the idea from visuals that people.
Speaker 2: Have seen Alistair Crowley saw the first gray right like
Speaker 2: that Lamb when he saw Lamb. That's that's what every
Speaker 2: gray and every alien and everyone's brain looks like that.
Speaker 3: It's even like Whitney Streams whatever, I'm screwing his name up.
Speaker 3: When I looked at his ship after the fact, I
Speaker 3: was like, Yo, my opinion, this guy just told in
Speaker 3: a cult story and threw an alien in there.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Like if I was to look at his ship from
Speaker 3: a cult lens and a cult symbolism, I see someone
Speaker 3: crossing the abyss.
Speaker 1: Well, So his newest book, uh, he straight up says
Speaker 1: like he didn't write his his dead wife wrote it.
Speaker 1: He channeled her to write that whole book. So there
Speaker 1: you go. Yeah, yeah, it's very I mean that's what
Speaker 1: did Crowley do. Yeah, he channeled that shit. He channeled
Speaker 1: the Book of the Law to his girlfriend Rose.
Speaker 3: And that's like another thing too, just real quick for
Speaker 3: some people, why I'm going on about his ship being
Speaker 3: ciphered not me. But Lisa, who's only a cult rejects,
Speaker 3: she went down to when she lived in Austin. There
Speaker 3: is a library in Austin that has the Vision and
Speaker 3: the Voice written by Crowley in his like handnotes before
Speaker 3: it got published. You even see him telling the editor
Speaker 3: to do certain things and don't change this. He would
Speaker 3: do a lot of uppercase letters in the middle of
Speaker 3: a sentence for a reason, because.
Speaker 1: He would even note in there leave it like that.
Speaker 1: That's not a mistake.
Speaker 3: You see him writing rose and putting like the math
Speaker 3: to it and then fitting it into the paragraphs. He's
Speaker 3: not talking about his fucking girlfriend anymore.
Speaker 4: Who's doing that? This guy is ciphering shit.
Speaker 3: If people have the chance to go and look at
Speaker 3: that stuff, you will see how much Jamatri is actually
Speaker 3: in what he's writing to You got to wonder, what
Speaker 3: the fuck am I really reading? Yeah, yeah, and again
Speaker 3: I'm not trying to say like whatever, I don't know
Speaker 3: where it could be fucking worse shit in there for
Speaker 3: all I know.
Speaker 4: But I'm just saying there's a little bit more to that.
Speaker 1: Guy is right, people are what are kind of the
Speaker 1: rules with that? Though? Because so like, can someone be
Speaker 1: invoking something without knowing they're invoking it, like you know
Speaker 1: what I mean, Like if I'm not aware of these
Speaker 1: these method this methodology and I'm just reading it, Yes,
Speaker 1: does that still have the same effect.
Speaker 3: I think we get a lot of that in social media,
Speaker 3: a lot of memes and a lot let's go Brandon
Speaker 3: something like that. My opinion was actually just taking the
Speaker 3: energetic value of something else and repeating it because like
Speaker 3: if you were, if people were like I don't know,
Speaker 3: if people happen to remember, if something happens and it's
Speaker 3: just like constantly being repeated online, go put that into
Speaker 3: like the matrix and see what pops up with it,
Speaker 3: and you'll probably be like, holy shit, these things are
Speaker 3: going on right now too, to where it's like you're
Speaker 3: almost wondering, like is this all just like this energy?
Speaker 3: Since it's being talked about repeated, put it on the
Speaker 3: screen over and over again, that's what's actually fucking getting
Speaker 3: to going and keeping it going.
Speaker 1: Like feeding it. Yeah. Yeah, Like there's so many times
Speaker 1: when like things would be going on and like Mara
Speaker 1: a Lago would fucking match and it's like, well Trump
Speaker 1: fucking mar A Lago just got raded too.
Speaker 4: Yeah, very weird, especially with Trump.
Speaker 3: A lot of shit, like a lot of phrases he
Speaker 3: says and stuff about him fucking throw that shit in there.
Speaker 3: It seems like there's always something that matches what the
Speaker 3: fuck's going on, right, all like cavify shit and yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: oh yeah, weird dude. It's almost to where it's like,
Speaker 3: you know, even it.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 3: Bramovich even said he's a fucking magus. She says he's
Speaker 3: one of the best magicians out there. She's you know,
Speaker 3: she that guy is not stupid when it comes to
Speaker 3: that shit. I don't think.
Speaker 2: Doesn't his name equal ninety three? And Ja Mantria as well.
Speaker 4: Oh, Mike, I know, Uh Erica Kirk and Nicki Minaj.
Speaker 1: Both do mm hmm. Well even like that myself both.
Speaker 2: Equally ninety three and Nicki Minaj is now on Donald
Speaker 2: like she's all over Donald Trump stuff.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, she's a mega a mega.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that was what he is saying, though, now, you know,
Speaker 3: I would like to go with probably the occult angle.
Speaker 3: But somebody I was watching them, I think some I
Speaker 3: don't know, some black comedian was saying, like, the funny
Speaker 3: thing is though it's like her Man's in jail right now,
Speaker 3: and I think he's got to you know, still got
Speaker 3: like I think, like seventy years less to do. They're like,
Speaker 3: she just doing this to try to get the motherfucker
Speaker 3: a pardon.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you like to you know.
Speaker 4: I think they were trying to make like, you shoot,
Speaker 4: really that type of a bad bitch. She's going to
Speaker 4: do this to get her a man out of jail.
Speaker 3: I mean, I don't know, she's probably being selfish, but
Speaker 3: you never know, that'd be interesting to fight out like
Speaker 3: in a few months.
Speaker 1: Like all of a sudden, like she's with a boyfriend again.
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, and he certainly has no problem partning anyone.
Speaker 2: So yeah, no present really.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've seen I've seen it a lot. So I
Speaker 1: was like that most recent was a Jake. It's Jake
Speaker 1: Paul right that that fought that guy that came out
Speaker 1: of retirement, that whole thing, and then the guy got
Speaker 1: in a car accident.
Speaker 2: Yo.
Speaker 3: That is crazy, yo, And I'm telling you right now.
Speaker 3: I when I heard that ship, I remember I was
Speaker 3: telling people on the show and telling my friend Thereesa.
Speaker 3: I was like, Yo, the way he said, if you
Speaker 3: listen to what he says, he wanted.
Speaker 1: To do to him.
Speaker 3: I was like, I'm telling you right now, that motherfucker
Speaker 3: is gonna cult this because he knows what's going on.
Speaker 3: He said, I want to see his soul leave his body.
Speaker 4: Mm hmm. He says, he says, that's what bocking is about.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that's it.
Speaker 4: I'm telling you those motherfuckers that guy.
Speaker 2: That's what the guy who fought Jake Paul said, or
Speaker 2: that's what Jake.
Speaker 4: Yeah, he was saying that. I'm like, uh, he knows
Speaker 4: what it's about.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, feeling I feel like he had a choice.
Speaker 1: It was either because he's like he came out of
Speaker 1: retirement for that too, right, So I feel like it.
Speaker 3: Might have actually been one motherfucker with bulls and said
Speaker 3: fuck you, I'm gonna knocked this cocky fucker out anyway.
Speaker 1: Oh so well, that was That's what I was gonna say,
Speaker 1: is that it was either like humiliation ritual or you
Speaker 1: let this like fucking Disney Channel twerp like win, or
Speaker 1: or you know, the sacrifice. And both of his trainers
Speaker 1: died in that car accident, and so I was the
Speaker 1: thing I wanted to say about the coding with it
Speaker 1: that's interesting is so if you look up. Like like,
Speaker 1: whenever there's like a fatal car accident, it's usually motor
Speaker 1: vehicle acts, usually described as motor vehicle accident, car accent, whatever.
Speaker 1: But in every article with this it was car crash,
Speaker 1: car crash, CC three three, right, Like, yeah, it's kind
Speaker 1: of kind of trippy, but.
Speaker 4: Well you know what we cover.
Speaker 3: That equaled a lot of li mix shit like comes
Speaker 3: of stuff too out of the Book of Lies from Crowley.
Speaker 3: And it was the weirdest thing because at the time
Speaker 3: this was another example of was matching so much shit
Speaker 3: about Elon Muskin Trump was when the Gilgo Beach maurtys
Speaker 3: popped up again.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you remember that, No, I don't know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, probably because like for me, it was in New
Speaker 3: York and Long Island, so I guess. But I mean
Speaker 3: it did kind of get known across the country again
Speaker 3: maybe because you guys are in Canada.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Unfortunately, it was like this is this guy who like
Speaker 3: was killing prostitutes and them burying them at the Gilgo Beach.
Speaker 2: Oh in Long Island, yeah yeah, long.
Speaker 3: Ago, okay, Yeah, And that it was just a lot
Speaker 3: of stuff when you be sort of run into the
Speaker 3: numbers and like the victims and certain things. It was
Speaker 3: like matching shit, like straight from like Curley's Book of Lives.
Speaker 3: It was just really weird. It was even stories in
Speaker 3: there where it was just like certain things started to
Speaker 3: match up as well. It was just like even parts
Speaker 3: of the story of places that stuff happened that this
Speaker 3: is weird. But again it's just like it's something like
Speaker 3: that so meticulous. I'm like, believe it or not. I've
Speaker 3: actually wondered like is there because it's another thing I've
Speaker 3: noticed with true crime you get a lot of the
Speaker 3: same numbers. Not to wonder, am I actually like kind
Speaker 3: of just looking at the numerical code to sick shit happening?
Speaker 1: Right? Yeah, Well and it sounds like fucking bugged out weird,
Speaker 1: but like no, you got a lot of the same
Speaker 1: matching numbers over and over again. Well, and it seems
Speaker 1: so yeah, because it seems so intentional. But then you
Speaker 1: start having that conversation with yourself where it's like, so what,
Speaker 1: there's like this fucking team of people there just sitting
Speaker 1: and like in a writer's room constantly writing.
Speaker 3: This shit, where like maybe it would be possible or
Speaker 3: is it just like that's just the energetic value of
Speaker 3: shit happen, right.
Speaker 2: Thematical value of evil.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know what I mean, it's the code that
Speaker 1: this realm runs on sort of thing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, have those murders been solved? You know what, I
Speaker 3: still think that case is ongoing. Like I don't think
Speaker 3: they've actually convicted him yet.
Speaker 2: Also they've they've, they've.
Speaker 1: And like even even like the whole way they arrested
Speaker 1: him was just so cheesy with the type of DNA
Speaker 1: they used, and it's just I don't know my opinion,
Speaker 1: it's I think like the families involved more, and the
Speaker 1: family does have ties to like magic and witchcraft. So
Speaker 1: I mean that is an angle to where it's like
Speaker 1: you do sought to have to wonder like how much
Speaker 1: I don't know, have to explain how much is real,
Speaker 1: how much is fabricated? You know a lot of things
Speaker 1: with the true crime you know that. I've even noticed
Speaker 1: ones that I think might be literally that just might
Speaker 1: sound crazy. Some of them I do think.
Speaker 3: Are partially are fully fabricated just for TV and people
Speaker 3: running this, you know, be running the scenes behind the scenes.
Speaker 3: We still getting a lot of golfundbes hobby to make
Speaker 3: money off of the case. Yeah, especially from like the
Speaker 3: victims and stuff. I just uh, like with the.
Speaker 1: Go Go Beach, the Happy Face Killer lady.
Speaker 3: Somehow, I guess, you know, felt for the wife of
Speaker 3: the rex Hiroman and open up a GoFundMe for and
Speaker 3: I was like, yeah, I find that little fucking shitty.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 3: For some reason, I found that weird. And uh, I
Speaker 3: think I signed up for like itelics like a week
Speaker 3: week free and that's kind of those like a serious
Speaker 3: background search, so it's illegal, you know, but it's just
Speaker 3: you know, we'll do crazy background search for whatever. You know,
Speaker 3: it's illegally can show you that lady's been busted for
Speaker 3: financial crimes already, like scams. Like so it's like, all right,
Speaker 3: like what the fuck's really going on here?
Speaker 1: M h.
Speaker 3: It's just very weird. You know, a lot of shit
Speaker 3: was going on with that with the Idaho four case.
Speaker 3: That that case is really weird.
Speaker 1: It's like everybody got fucking cremated and then they knocked
Speaker 1: the house down before the fucking trial was even over. Yeah,
Speaker 1: there's no proof the.
Speaker 4: Fucking bodies at all.
Speaker 3: I don't they harbably even showed I think they were
Speaker 3: having problems even showing the bodies about all of them
Speaker 3: coming out of the house. Like it was just very weird,
Speaker 3: a very weird situation, and like that had like tons
Speaker 3: of a cult symbolism around it too.
Speaker 1: It was just very weird.
Speaker 4: And like a lot of their ship matched the same numbers.
Speaker 1: It was just fucking bizarre.
Speaker 3: And then those numbers, like I was saying before, match
Speaker 3: a lot of Trump and Elaunch ship, which is sucking
Speaker 3: really weird. And Back to the Future for some reason,
Speaker 3: Back to the Future pops up a lot was popular.
Speaker 1: That is weird.
Speaker 2: I've seen a there's a guy used to fall into
Speaker 2: a Biff, Biff Tannon's dual timeline who his whole thing
Speaker 2: was that Biff from Back to the Future is Donald Trump?
Speaker 1: That was this whole.
Speaker 4: Oh, I've seen that. I've seen that.
Speaker 2: It was really interesting. He has a lot of he
Speaker 2: has like hundreds of posts showing his reasons for why
Speaker 2: he thinks it's so, and I think he is. He
Speaker 2: goes on the same assumption that Trump's a master magician
Speaker 2: and is able to go in and out of time
Speaker 2: somehow or anyway.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, no, there's that whole like the Baron Trump
Speaker 1: stuff with the time traveling yea, yeah, that point too.
Speaker 2: That's that one's crazy.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: The Elon there's the right, there's a book about a
Speaker 2: boy named Elon from the fifties who makes it to Mars.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of that stuff. Yeah, it's so.
Speaker 1: Is there anything in the in the magical like magical
Speaker 1: practice that that like would tie into time travel, Like,
Speaker 1: is there any of that stuff where you can like
Speaker 1: jump timelines or.
Speaker 3: Well, I do think in a sense that's kind of
Speaker 3: like what a magical experience might actually be, right, I think,
Speaker 3: I think I do think a Nocchio magic you might
Speaker 3: start getting it more in detail of like where you
Speaker 3: want to send yourself. But I think in a sense, yeah, sybolically,
Speaker 3: the way it could be looked at is that you're
Speaker 3: going back to the form before you ended up into
Speaker 3: the flesh.
Speaker 4: So technically, if I'm going back.
Speaker 3: To the spirit world, I'm kind of going back in
Speaker 3: time right before I can aim here, and then when
Speaker 3: I come back, I guess i'd bean technically, you know,
Speaker 3: when the magician returns, I technically went from the past
Speaker 3: to the future.
Speaker 1: Now back used to be back from the future, you
Speaker 1: know whatever.
Speaker 3: So I even think like that whole thing, it was
Speaker 3: very weird. You gotta go eighty eight miles per hour. Yeah,
Speaker 3: you know, I think like that thing and you know,
Speaker 3: electricity as you needed.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 3: I do think, you know, Lightning the first one too.
Speaker 3: I do think it's just actually believed or not.
Speaker 1: I think crossing the Abyss as a magician, when they
Speaker 1: cross the Abyss and come back, I technically think that
Speaker 1: that's what happened. Mm hmmm hmm.
Speaker 4: You know, I think like he's on the Heroes, he's
Speaker 4: on the Hero's journey Martin.
Speaker 1: Yeh, Marty, Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's just kind of.
Speaker 3: I mean, he even has even like I would say
Speaker 3: I always say, I think that's like kind of you
Speaker 3: getting the cabalistic trait of life. You know, I think
Speaker 3: the Hero's journey's kind of like Toth and he starts
Speaker 3: on the sphere eight He has an orange sphere in
Speaker 3: that movie. The kid's got a fucking orange life jacker out.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: You know, if if you go, if you go look,
Speaker 3: if you go and look at the time when he's
Speaker 3: like walking across the street, you know how like the
Speaker 3: towns will have up like the little like white picket
Speaker 3: type fence with all these like little fucking signs on
Speaker 3: it that showing you things in the town, almost all
Speaker 3: of them, all of them or associated with or was
Speaker 3: started by Mason's.
Speaker 4: Mhmm, go look at all those signs that are on
Speaker 4: that fucking thing too.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Very weirdy, Yeah, that's crazy.
Speaker 1: And I was just we covered that, we could we
Speaker 1: covered that.
Speaker 3: Uh, that ship even I think the date then they
Speaker 3: jump is like Ellis Ashmole's like birthday.
Speaker 1: It was very weird. There's like even Freemason's and occultest
Speaker 1: like dates of their birthdays that match up with like
Speaker 1: the ship that they did in that movie.
Speaker 2: So you said Eli s Ashmole, Yeah, Elis Ashmole.
Speaker 1: Not super.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but that that's who brought John D's workings to
Speaker 2: the Hermetic Golden Order, isn't it. That's how Yeah, that's
Speaker 2: who had John D's work.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So who did you when you guys did that? Did
Speaker 2: you look into like, I I don't even know who
Speaker 2: wrote Back to the Future. I've seen it a bunch
Speaker 2: of times. But did you get into that at all
Speaker 2: or just into the symbolisms?
Speaker 3: There was something to do with the dates are do
Speaker 3: you know what? I think it might have been with
Speaker 3: the Elliott Ashmole. I could be wrong.
Speaker 1: It was Uh. I think the date on doc on
Speaker 1: Doc's house not to date his address.
Speaker 4: It was.
Speaker 3: It was something weird where like, yeah, there was a
Speaker 3: there was a lot of shit with him too, that's
Speaker 3: very Uh. Could you know a lot of cold symbolism
Speaker 3: around him.
Speaker 1: Oh, are you looking it up now? I was seeing
Speaker 1: who wrote it? Uh, Robert ze Mechus and Bob Gail. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that would have been a good idea to actually look
Speaker 1: at the people who wrote it. I'd never even thought
Speaker 1: of that, Yeah, both of both Bob's Yeah. Interesting.
Speaker 2: Yeah. And so that's like things like because it's the
Speaker 2: more I we look into this, the more you see
Speaker 2: it kind of everywhere, and once you start seeing it,
Speaker 2: you see it more and more and more. So is
Speaker 2: this something where you think it was intentionally written or
Speaker 2: somehow something was speaking through the person writing it.
Speaker 3: No, I think that actually that whole movie was just
Speaker 3: like this is the way I'm gonna put I think
Speaker 3: a lot of movies like this are actually done a
Speaker 3: lot of like things on TV. It's just a way
Speaker 3: of me, Uh, I guess making an imitation for art
Speaker 3: out of my experience. Yeah, it's as came back. I'm
Speaker 3: gonna make some fucking drawn out movie about it now.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well that's a pair like like so Salvador Dolly
Speaker 1: said that all of his paintings were were just images
Speaker 1: that so he would like portal jump and when he
Speaker 1: went through the portals, that's what he saw, and when
Speaker 1: he came back, the only way to like anchor himself
Speaker 1: back in this world was to paint what he saw,
Speaker 1: otherwise he'd be forever trapped in that world. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: there could be a bit of that right where it's
Speaker 1: like you have to put it out, you don't really
Speaker 1: have a choice. Oh that's what yo, That's why I
Speaker 1: showed my podcast. I was gonna have to start doing
Speaker 1: something after my experiences to get out of my head.
Speaker 3: Huh what I was? I was, and this was just
Speaker 3: the outlet I chose. I really can't row pain. So
Speaker 3: I was fucked on this so like I could run
Speaker 3: my mouth real good.
Speaker 2: I need to take a quick, quick two minute break, okay, alright, better,
Speaker 2: yeah much better, Sorry about that, hold it any longer.
Speaker 4: I'm lucky at it.
Speaker 3: When I have a bunch of people on the show,
Speaker 3: I could do that and I have to do anything.
Speaker 3: I just shut my shirt off, go piss and come back.
Speaker 3: It doesn't matter if somebody else just talking. That's why
Speaker 3: I got swivel chairs, man, you just swivel through swivel.
Speaker 2: I was trying for a bit and the hock to
Speaker 2: quick hack to quick button while I was taking a piss,
Speaker 2: So yeah, there you go.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well I while you were out, we were kind
Speaker 1: of just talking about uh, Aleister Crowley being sort of
Speaker 1: like a gatekeeper for all of it and and not
Speaker 1: really like yeah, and like Nick was saying basically like
Speaker 1: there should be more not as much should be kept secret, right,
Speaker 1: that's basically what.
Speaker 3: Ye a little bit more disclosure of like what magic
Speaker 3: might be, or a little bit more of a warning
Speaker 3: if it is what I think it is from my experience. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I think, like, you know, at least like maybe start
Speaker 3: telling people like really better make sure you're mentally fit.
Speaker 1: For this, know something like that.
Speaker 3: I don't know, just like you should have a little
Speaker 3: bit more of like take it a little bit more serious,
Speaker 3: so I really have you know, they think that, you know,
Speaker 3: I don't know, they get a fucking raise at their job,
Speaker 3: like that's magic.
Speaker 1: It's like, I don't know, I just mean the ideas
Speaker 1: of what magic is and like what happens if you
Speaker 1: just happen to have that experience when they're just gonna
Speaker 1: be like, holy fuck, what the fuck was that? Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: there's a difference between that and.
Speaker 4: It was magic was so fucking minimal.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well the whole It's trendy right now to like
Speaker 1: manifest shit right Like it's like, oh, I manifested my
Speaker 1: new house, So I manifested this, and it's like, well,
Speaker 1: very well, you know you could have, but you also
Speaker 1: like worked your job and saved a hundred grand.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: It's like even for me when I had that experience,
Speaker 3: I was like, this is not what I thought I
Speaker 3: was signed up for. Yeah, you know, it didn't even
Speaker 3: weird me the fuck out freaked me out at times,
Speaker 3: you know, I mean I was okay, Like again, when
Speaker 3: I had these experiences, they were beautiful, but just like
Speaker 3: opening up my eyes and trying to comprehend what happened
Speaker 3: and like something I might have left out And it
Speaker 3: sounds crazy, very much matrix like, but every time I
Speaker 3: open up my eyes, I understand something I didn't previously understand.
Speaker 1: It's almost start taking these ideas with these thoughts that
Speaker 1: were previously in my head, they get twisted and put
Speaker 1: together in a puzzle. I'm like, oh, that's how that
Speaker 1: makes sense with that how that connects.
Speaker 3: As crazy as it sounds, that happens every time, So
Speaker 3: not even have like voice even telling you things or
Speaker 3: like it's like a visions of like stuff coming together
Speaker 3: and making sense, and it's like it could be hard
Speaker 3: on somebody.
Speaker 1: So what's your process for like integrating this after Like
Speaker 1: do you do you journal it after and then review
Speaker 1: it in a different headspace or like how do what's
Speaker 1: your tips for kind of making sense of all of it?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I guess yeah, I journaling I think could help
Speaker 3: maybe even like I see this is so interesting, and
Speaker 3: I'm just like because I've thought of, like, oh, is
Speaker 3: this where the channeling comes into. Because there's a good
Speaker 3: chance that like even after this, you may not be
Speaker 3: able to even write fast as you're fucking as as
Speaker 3: fast as your as you're thinking.
Speaker 1: Sometimes people might have that problem just texting. You know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying, You start skipping letters because you're texting
Speaker 1: whatever as a voice recorder or somebody else there to
Speaker 1: hear what you have to say and can you know,
Speaker 1: write it down? Or whatever somehow record it that might
Speaker 1: be interesting, which again is something that we've just said before,
Speaker 1: was with what Whitley Streeber and fucking Crowley. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: it's a very interesting like again, like Crowley had these
Speaker 1: experiences when he was supposedly with the Book of the Law,
Speaker 1: you know, within these three days, and he dictated to
Speaker 1: Rose his experience.
Speaker 4: One thing that I find is interesting.
Speaker 3: I've always seen Roses in my images before I crossed
Speaker 3: the Abyss, So I questioned the whole roase thing anyway
Speaker 3: to a certain extent.
Speaker 4: But I mean, you know, again, he's.
Speaker 1: I don't know, I think he could have possibly have
Speaker 1: had a magical experience. It was just telling her the
Speaker 1: images that he had when they happened. Yeah, she wrote
Speaker 1: that with your personal experience, like you said that most
Speaker 1: of your well all of you see, I think you
Speaker 1: said all of yours were positive. Was there any anything
Speaker 1: ever that was like not negative? But that was just
Speaker 1: like too much where you're just like, yeah, not fucking yet,
Speaker 1: not yet. Yeah, it was a time, And I don't
Speaker 1: know if I consider it negative. Just to me, I
Speaker 1: felt like that might be negative and I don't want
Speaker 1: to play with it. There's always a time, like there's
Speaker 1: certain things that.
Speaker 3: Happened a lot when the when when the thing starts up,
Speaker 3: there's just a certain series of things that happens. And
Speaker 3: right before I get to the end, at one point,
Speaker 3: like I'll and there's always this eclipse that's like there.
Speaker 3: That's why it's in my art and my logo stuff
Speaker 3: all the time. This eclipse is there and it looks
Speaker 3: very much like the the one big logo that I have,
Speaker 3: like my YouTube and ship where you have like the
Speaker 3: movie reels coming out of the eclipse that's I had.
Speaker 3: I had Mario from Symbolic Studies kind of like duplicate
Speaker 3: a vision that I had, but like.
Speaker 1: Stylized it like that.
Speaker 3: Those normally wouldn't be like movie reels, but I would
Speaker 3: look like I have an eclipse. It will look like
Speaker 3: those those cells of like you know on the movie
Speaker 3: reels would be just like windows in the blackness that
Speaker 3: you would see kind of coming out. It's like as
Speaker 3: if you were standing down the middle of or a
Speaker 3: subway platform or a train station and you had two
Speaker 3: cars coming past you but going really slow, those windows
Speaker 3: would just be there like passing me by, and I
Speaker 3: normally wouldn't pay attention to them too much, but it
Speaker 3: always looked like they had like some kind of different
Speaker 3: scene going on. I was always more focused at the
Speaker 3: eclipse and what it was doing.
Speaker 1: And it starts to change after that, and I would
Speaker 1: just normally go with that and follow that.
Speaker 3: But one time I was just like, I don't know
Speaker 3: what it was. I just had this thought of, like, well,
Speaker 3: what's in these things? And like even when I thought that,
Speaker 3: my vision of the way I was looking at the
Speaker 3: situation even changed.
Speaker 1: It's almost like I turned sideways. Now my body's not there,
Speaker 1: it's just my way I'm looking at things. And I
Speaker 1: looked into one and to me, it was like, you know,
Speaker 1: either that's like Arizona or that's like post nuclear fallout,
Speaker 1: and I was like I don't want to find out
Speaker 1: either one. Mm oh, like I'm good on that. And
Speaker 1: as soon as and this is another thing, is soon
Speaker 1: when I have these experiences, as soon as I start
Speaker 1: thinking of self, it ends, which I'm assuming is because
Speaker 1: I disconnected myself from the old because I'm thinking of
Speaker 1: self as soon as I start thinking like oh where
Speaker 1: am I? What am I doing? So yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: yourself back into the monkey brain. And after earth. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it ends right after that.
Speaker 2: Huh, once you're no longer part of all the connectedness
Speaker 2: and it's just a micro thing, not a macro thing.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, that's what I believe.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you separate yourself as soon as you think
Speaker 1: of self.
Speaker 2: That totally makes sense.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's just interesting because it's not something, like
Speaker 1: I said, outside of psychedelics. It's not something I've ever
Speaker 1: like intentionally done, even like meditation. I'm it's I've alway
Speaker 1: kind of struggled with it, just like staying in that
Speaker 1: space for any lengthy period of time. But like I'm
Speaker 1: a musician and when I if I sit and just
Speaker 1: play guitar for an hour, I can get there. Like
Speaker 1: that's like it's there's a trance state that comes up.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah that I can't seem to get, you know,
Speaker 1: and otherwise, but it's, yeah, do you find because I know,
Speaker 1: like so I smoke weed and obviously I know you
Speaker 1: smoke weed too, does that affect your ability to get there?
Speaker 1: Because I know, like I don't dream very much because
Speaker 1: I smoke a lot and was kind.
Speaker 3: When I first had these experiences, it was like right
Speaker 3: prior to COVID and I had probably stopped smoking weed
Speaker 3: for about fifteen years, and when COVID came.
Speaker 1: I was like, yo, for me to deal with society
Speaker 1: and people right now, I gotta straight.
Speaker 4: I know this sounds crazy.
Speaker 3: I started smoking we because of COVID to deal with society,
Speaker 3: so I had already had these experiences. Now, since I've
Speaker 3: had those experiences and started the podcast, I have brought
Speaker 3: myself again. Like I said, there'll be like a series
Speaker 3: of visions and things that happen. I can bring myself
Speaker 3: very close to the edge before it blasts off and
Speaker 3: kind of just hang out there, and I do feel
Speaker 3: I get some benefit from that. I've never really blasted
Speaker 3: off and crushed over in a few years.
Speaker 1: But uh.
Speaker 3: So, basically what I'm saying is that, like I really
Speaker 3: haven't had the experience with using drugs per se, like
Speaker 3: I've smoked weed now, but I haven't taken myself that far.
Speaker 3: I could say from the first time it ever happened
Speaker 3: to me, it's always been very easy to get myself
Speaker 3: back into that visual space with the eclipse and everything
Speaker 3: going on.
Speaker 4: So I can't even say like the drugs is gonna.
Speaker 1: Help it go any faster, because it's it's already sped
Speaker 1: up since the tough to explain, but it's already a
Speaker 1: very easy thing for me to get to. I don't
Speaker 1: know if I'm want or whatever, but.
Speaker 3: I don't know if the drugs can help. There are
Speaker 3: times I actually this is interesting. There has been times
Speaker 3: that I forgot about this. There has been times just
Speaker 3: on Indiga.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 3: Some people sometimes they'll say if they smoke too much
Speaker 3: of that they feel like they're dying, or like like
Speaker 3: are to die.
Speaker 1: That is very close to a feeling.
Speaker 3: There was a feeling that when I'm having right before
Speaker 3: I blast off, I even think like you still have
Speaker 3: this moment of fear because it is an uncomfortable feeling
Speaker 3: that you could look like it like I can see
Speaker 3: now like it's very close to the same feeling.
Speaker 1: But for some reason it just never really affected me.
Speaker 3: It was just I don't know, but like I have
Speaker 3: noticed since now having a magical experience and that feeling
Speaker 3: that happens like right before you go. And there was
Speaker 3: times one time after the last time I did it,
Speaker 3: I didn't feel right and I kept on feeling like
Speaker 3: I was actually.
Speaker 1: Like going back out without warning to.
Speaker 3: Like I was feeling the same feelings that would happen
Speaker 3: when I was leaving my body. The first time, it
Speaker 3: felt like it was happening when I'm trying not to
Speaker 3: and that feeling from smoking too much indigo was very close.
Speaker 1: To that where you're like stuck in the head and
Speaker 1: you're like, oh fuck, am I like broken or my
Speaker 1: fucking dawning.
Speaker 3: It was almost very I was like, fuck, man, I
Speaker 3: was like, oh, it was almost a magical fucking experience
Speaker 3: right there. It did bring back like I was like, oh, fuck,
Speaker 3: this is almost a familiar feeling. Yeah, yeah, that's because
Speaker 3: that is one feeling. I will say that feeling that
Speaker 3: there's another thing that I do think, like what I'm
Speaker 3: saying is possibly real. Is that those feelings that I've
Speaker 3: had when I do think I possibly might be leaving
Speaker 3: my body having a magical experience. I have never felt
Speaker 3: those feelings again unless I do that. So I even like,
Speaker 3: that's another feeling from something else that I might be confused.
Speaker 1: No, it is. It is. I could even say, like
Speaker 1: one of the reasons why I stopped is I'll be honest,
Speaker 1: it was fucking addictive. I never felt so alive before
Speaker 1: in my life. I think I died because you feel
Speaker 1: throughout your whole body and it's just like whoa, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's definitely a feeling I've never felt before, so I'm
Speaker 1: not getting confused with something else. That's when yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: all right, cool.
Speaker 3: So like when the we kind of got me close
Speaker 3: to that, I was like, whoa, like that quote. My
Speaker 3: attention was close to a familiar feeling. Yeah, yeah, note
Speaker 3: the strain.
Speaker 1: And you know, you know what the crazy thing is.
Speaker 3: It's like you kind of like and after knowing that,
Speaker 3: it's like I kind of almost want to push myself
Speaker 3: to because that feeling is addictive because I know it'll
Speaker 3: be all right, you know what I'm saying, But in
Speaker 3: that moment, you're like, fuck, why did.
Speaker 1: I do that?
Speaker 4: It smoked too?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Not for sure, for sure. Yeah, No, I just
Speaker 1: always like because I've been toying around with the idea
Speaker 1: of like I have books on on sigil magic, and
Speaker 1: I have books on on the stuff.
Speaker 4: And I read I never yourself believe it or not.
Speaker 3: I think if you said sigil magic the right way,
Speaker 3: I honestly think you're just reprogramming your own brain.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 3: It's almost like I really think the sigil magic is
Speaker 3: more for the user on you to themselves, and then
Speaker 3: trying to contact and do things to other people. Yeah,
Speaker 3: and so my job doesn't like me, so you know,
Speaker 3: I wanted to piss razor blades next week.
Speaker 1: But if anything, that sigil is probably like an image
Speaker 1: of hate that you just burnt into your head for
Speaker 1: another person. You really shouldn't have any power you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's a lot of the things with black magic. I
Speaker 1: hate to say it is.
Speaker 3: I actually think the practitioner is fucking themselves more so
Speaker 3: you're doing is feeding hate.
Speaker 2: Yeah, getting caught that loop.
Speaker 3: Think about it that you spent this whole time to
Speaker 3: do a ritual on a motherfucker's rented space in your
Speaker 3: head over something. Who's a real magician now, who's got
Speaker 3: free fucking space.
Speaker 4: Being rented in the head? You, Well, I forgot. It's
Speaker 4: got you fucking this right now.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that plays into the whole, like the TDS ship, right,
Speaker 1: like the Trump derangement syndrome stuff like he's just living
Speaker 1: rent free and so many people's heads the rain yo, yo,
Speaker 1: the people that hate him and the people that love them.
Speaker 2: Yeah, both exactly. Both are spells.
Speaker 3: That's even another thing I say too, And I really
Speaker 3: do mean this, And I always use Kanye West as
Speaker 3: kind of an example where I'm Trump nails it too,
Speaker 3: you know, but Kanye West, I think, is a better example.
Speaker 3: You just gotta be no, it doesn't matter what the
Speaker 3: fuck comes out of him mouth sometimes, Like I think
Speaker 3: Kanye West has the bulls to embarrass himself or maybe
Speaker 3: say something of somewhat value, But I think he's cool
Speaker 3: with just looking like a fucking retat to make sure
Speaker 3: his name stays in everybody's head. He just has to
Speaker 3: stay relevant. Yeah, I think another big example, and I'm
Speaker 3: not knocking the guy. He's a piece of shit. He's
Speaker 3: done horrible things, I'm sure. But Michael Aquino, first off,
Speaker 3: a lot of his work that.
Speaker 1: We have that we know that he did came from
Speaker 1: the government, you know, fucking SCI files.
Speaker 3: So it's interesting how we don't trust the government until
Speaker 3: they drop a CIA files that we can cover on
Speaker 3: our podcast to get clicks.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, it's fucking weird on that because I even
Speaker 1: at one point stop covering shit from the CIA files
Speaker 1: because I'm like, how do I know they don't want
Speaker 1: me to this? Yeah, So I believe even more when
Speaker 1: they start hosting podcasts right, which Sean Ryan and those Well,
Speaker 1: what I'm what I'm getting at too, is that because.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna keep it straight and we're gonna keep it
Speaker 3: real because of the supposed things that we now know
Speaker 3: of that that guy did, end podcasters, he will always
Speaker 3: remain a god anyway because people are gonna repeat his
Speaker 3: name over and over and over and over. So I
Speaker 3: mean the same thing with Croley. Because of people repeating
Speaker 3: his name so much, he'll remain No. Stop saying his
Speaker 3: fucking name, nobody will remember.
Speaker 1: Yeah, stop talking about Mail and Moloch, and maybe things
Speaker 1: won't hold any more power. The only hold power if
Speaker 1: you know who the fuck they are. Put it this way,
Speaker 1: somebody can't pick as some weird sexual agenda unless somebody
Speaker 1: gives them the fucking idea to choose it. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I know for sure. Yeah, I mean it breaks down
Speaker 1: even it doesn't like outside of a magical sense, just
Speaker 1: in a psychological exactly. There's people talking, you know, like
Speaker 1: how everyone's in therapy now, and it's like, well, why
Speaker 1: is everyone depressed? Because all you're talking about is your
Speaker 1: problems all the time. But like, of course you're stuck
Speaker 1: in that, you know, So yeah, it makes it makes
Speaker 1: total sense.
Speaker 3: While you're still coming here because you were told that
Speaker 3: if you don't, you'll fuck up, and you believe it.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2: And the the anger thing I think you get it
Speaker 2: rewires your brain too, if you're constantly getting a disease.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it.
Speaker 2: Rewires your brain and then you create it more.
Speaker 3: And yeah, yo, think about that, like I could know.
Speaker 3: I'll say for myself, anger and fear. There were times
Speaker 3: when I feel that, like when I'm angry or fearful,
Speaker 3: like if it's really bad, I literally feel.
Speaker 1: An emotion run through my body.
Speaker 3: Mmhm, that's serious. That should like I don't know if
Speaker 3: we as humans normally look at that. I add, and
Speaker 3: I'm like, as a magician, I'm like, what's going on? Then,
Speaker 3: like that feeling is creating, is roborating something throughout my
Speaker 3: whole body.
Speaker 1: I just take a look at that.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, it gets your heart going right, gets your.
Speaker 3: Changes, you start sweating people, you know, just all these
Speaker 3: changes within a.
Speaker 2: Body that by thinking, yeah, there's a total physiological yeah exactly,
Speaker 2: do it right, a total response to it.
Speaker 1: It's it's it's interesting too how that stuff manifests in
Speaker 1: like different shockers as well, like We've had this conversation
Speaker 1: before where it's like, if you feel if you're stuck
Speaker 1: in survival mode and you're feeling like scared and anxious
Speaker 1: all the time, from a survival standpoint, like you're gonna
Speaker 1: have like hip issues, you're gonna have leg issues, You're
Speaker 1: gonna have shit like that. If you're feeling like you
Speaker 1: you know, you're biting your tongue. I say, you're like,
Speaker 1: you know your boss is a dick and you're not
Speaker 1: allowed to like you have no actual agency at work,
Speaker 1: and you're just whatever, you're not allowed to say anything.
Speaker 1: Those people tend to end up with like throat issues,
Speaker 1: like you know.
Speaker 4: Things like that sore. Next, then people who have had eggs.
Speaker 1: Because of stress. Yep, yeah, yeah, no, for sure, there's
Speaker 1: a I don't know if you've literally there's a total
Speaker 1: fucking skin response. If you looked into German new medicine
Speaker 1: at all, yo, that shit seems to be popping out
Speaker 1: with some crazy stuff lately.
Speaker 3: Yeah, crazy, like like real, like wow, like that's interesting.
Speaker 3: My wife's big into researching that right now.
Speaker 1: And every time I'm like, oh, on a headache or
Speaker 1: all my fucking back hurt, She's like, well, it's probably
Speaker 1: because of this and to heal your inner child.
Speaker 4: All right, a new fucking pillow.
Speaker 3: But what goes on with like relationships or just like
Speaker 3: certain things with people, how much they affect each other?
Speaker 1: Yeah, too, with certain studies they've been doing.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you gotta find it out.
Speaker 3: Like a lot of times, you know, women will take
Speaker 3: all the guy fell asleep on me. It's because there's
Speaker 3: nervous systems, like I'm safe, I can relax now. It's
Speaker 3: really like that. You know, it may not be the
Speaker 3: guy's distiny.
Speaker 1: He's just actually so comfortable they fell asleep.
Speaker 4: Same thing with a girlfriend, you know.
Speaker 1: It's like, I don't know, it's just there's a study
Speaker 1: I noticed though, butau I found very interesting. Yeah yeah, man,
Speaker 1: it's uh, I mean like we're we're magical beings, right,
Speaker 1: Like there's there's so much more to it than influence.
Speaker 3: That's why another thing. I just find that so crazy
Speaker 3: that the influence of another person mm hmm can just
Speaker 3: have that effect on someone. I mean it's it could
Speaker 3: be a great thing, or a beautiful thing, or a
Speaker 3: horrible thing.
Speaker 1: Mm hmmmm. Well that yeah, I mean back to the
Speaker 1: pet thing, right, Like it's it's like hard to be
Speaker 1: in a bad mood around a dog, right, Like it's
Speaker 1: it's an energetic thing, right, Yeah, yeah, it's an it's
Speaker 1: a total energetic well love you forever, right, you know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. So it's like that's another reason so
Speaker 1: loyalty that you think about you.
Speaker 2: And you're close to them, you know. Yeah, I can
Speaker 2: literally feel what my dog like, I know what my
Speaker 2: dog deeds or wants just from feel offers.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, is that wild?
Speaker 3: Just the relationship between humans and dogs, how well, Like
Speaker 3: you could just understand each other.
Speaker 2: Just by looking at me. I know exactly what it
Speaker 2: is she wants.
Speaker 4: And then they exactly what the you're risking. Yeah, fucking bizarre.
Speaker 2: She usually knows my mood before I know my mood.
Speaker 2: I'm not the best morning person. Wake up in the
Speaker 2: morning and someone's fifty to fifty and she'll look at
Speaker 2: me and I almost know I'm going to be it's
Speaker 2: going to be a good day from how she is.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're quite amazing animals.
Speaker 1: That's like again, like all the more reason to like
Speaker 1: practice this stuff and like like tune it in a
Speaker 1: little more, right, because it's it's a defense mechanism too.
Speaker 1: You walk into a room with shady people, and if
Speaker 1: you're tuned into that and you can feel it, you
Speaker 1: know to get the fuck out right. Like, I can't
Speaker 1: tell you how many situations I've gotten out of that
Speaker 1: would have turned really really bad. And a couple cases
Speaker 1: like not gone to parties where like people have died
Speaker 1: and things like that, like.
Speaker 3: More not worried about so much other shit. You'll pick
Speaker 3: up on stuff like that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the biggest, the most relevant example I can think
Speaker 1: of is that when my band was on tour one time,
Speaker 1: we were played the show with this other band and
Speaker 1: they were like, oh, yeah, there's this big party afterwards,
Speaker 1: come to the party whatever we're humming haunt about him.
Speaker 1: We usually would go, and there are a couple of
Speaker 1: us that were just like some feels off, man, Like,
Speaker 1: I don't know, we should let's just like go to
Speaker 1: the hotel or whatever instead, Let's just take it easy tonight.
Speaker 1: And we did. And Yeah, a guy like had like
Speaker 1: a basically like a what I would describe as like
Speaker 1: a demonic possession that night, just this skuy snapped, grabbed
Speaker 1: a knife in the kitchen and started stabbing people and
Speaker 1: ended up killing a guy.
Speaker 4: And it like yeah, oh good ship.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and need a mental It was a mental birth too,
Speaker 2: wasn't it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, caused it. He just snapped and yeah we
Speaker 1: were we were supposed to be at that party and
Speaker 1: the guy that the guy that ended up dying was
Speaker 1: the guy that invited us to the party.
Speaker 4: So crazy crazy Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I mean that's a that's a dark spin
Speaker 1: on it, but I mean it works both watching them,
Speaker 1: like what, that's fucking nuts. Yeah, yeah, for sure. So
Speaker 1: I think I think it's good to be in tune
Speaker 1: with those forces, you know, and.
Speaker 2: You definitely notice all the synchronicities a lot more when you.
Speaker 1: Are Yeah yeah, Chris no Oles talks about that a
Speaker 1: lot too, where it's like you start, when you start
Speaker 1: noticing synchronicities, they just pop up more and more and more.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, you know. It's yeah, you know, I've not
Speaker 1: I hate that it happens, and I'm not even fucking
Speaker 1: trying to grift over it. It's so fucking cheesy. But
Speaker 1: like other people have even noticed it too. I know,
Speaker 1: I get ninety three constantly, and my shit, it's like
Speaker 1: start a ball to me too much, like what the fuck?
Speaker 3: Yeah, like especially like you know, traveling come that in
Speaker 3: the number seventeen constant really yeah, just kind of.
Speaker 2: Weird something something those two numbers. I thought those are
Speaker 2: my hockey numbers really, nine seventeen and ninety three seventeen
Speaker 2: for most of my most of my life and then
Speaker 2: ninety three the last little bit.
Speaker 1: I've always got.
Speaker 2: Okay, I'm not chosen by me either of them.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I didn't think.
Speaker 1: So I've gotten thirty three like before and before I
Speaker 1: knew any of this stuff all the time, and like
Speaker 1: I've been like there's always there's always been like Freemasons
Speaker 1: in my inner circle kind of thing, so like just
Speaker 1: between family and stuff too. So it's like it's just odd,
Speaker 1: that's right. Yeah, see that's even just like I don't
Speaker 1: know sometimes like.
Speaker 3: So I don't know if you guys believe in like
Speaker 3: you know, reincarnation or whatever. Like sometimes I even wonder, like,
Speaker 3: all right, let's say you're not a Mason, but somehow,
Speaker 3: like that thirty three needed to get thrown on you somehow,
Speaker 3: like I don't know, you know.
Speaker 1: What I'm saying.
Speaker 3: With a good story being retold but just in a
Speaker 3: different way, yeah, or someone redoing it over again but
Speaker 3: just a different timeline or you know, I don't know,
Speaker 3: I look at it like that. Sometimes I wonder, Yeah,
Speaker 3: it's weird, yeah, like that like.
Speaker 1: You know, I don't know, or a code to like
Speaker 1: lead you down a certain path or like something right,
Speaker 1: like not necessarily to become a freemason.
Speaker 4: But maybe it's just the.
Speaker 3: Research because like all right to thirty three, regardless that
Speaker 3: freemason's high jacked, it probably has an overall meeting that any.
Speaker 1: Occults would understand. Yeah, I'm saying that's another thing too.
Speaker 3: Sometimes certain orders, there are things I think are kind
Speaker 3: of just blanket, blanket statements that they just stylized in
Speaker 3: that way, and a lot of people to take them
Speaker 3: like so personal or it's just like no, they're all
Speaker 3: saying the same shit just in a different way.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I do think that happens a lot for sure.
Speaker 1: For sure.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the the number things really freaked me out, Like
Speaker 2: all the Charlie Kurk I know, not trying to bring
Speaker 2: up the Charlie Kirk thing again purposely, but all the
Speaker 2: Charlie Kirk numerology with that Snake Eyes movie and like
Speaker 2: that stuff makes me not want to look at any
Speaker 2: of this for a while.
Speaker 1: It just it just does.
Speaker 2: That's my initial reaction where I'm like, this is too weird, Like.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think as you saw, wondering, like what the
Speaker 3: fuck's really going on here again, like is it all
Speaker 3: really orchestrated or is there some weird numerical fucking trail
Speaker 3: with just again shit happening. So it's like you almost
Speaker 3: don't want to kind of find both to be true
Speaker 3: or either one you know what I'm saying, one of
Speaker 3: those well, yeah, yeah, because either one of those is
Speaker 3: just fucking bizarre and weird.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, or or we just live in a computer
Speaker 1: simulation too. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, No matter what, it's kind of a shitty fucking ending. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: for sure.
Speaker 1: Huh Yeah. I don't know, man, though it's it's it's
Speaker 1: a weird, weird world certainly is I don't know if
Speaker 1: it's gonna Like do you think with people becoming more
Speaker 1: aware of the stuff that they're that their spells are
Speaker 1: having a harder time, Like are they having a harder
Speaker 1: time being successful with them?
Speaker 3: Well, I think more people sort to understand magic, and
Speaker 3: I think that will be a problem. That'll be a problem, yeah,
Speaker 3: because there'll be more people I think that are going
Speaker 3: to use it for better than moors m you know,
Speaker 3: the people, more people who understand the the better side
Speaker 3: of it, I think will start to be more. You know,
Speaker 3: I think we'll catch I think, honestly, I think there's
Speaker 3: a possibility of us almost going into like another renaissance
Speaker 3: that yeah, it's the cult is And I do actually
Speaker 3: think I might my brain, it might be kind of
Speaker 3: like a saving grace, believe it or not. And I
Speaker 3: want to hear that of a you know, kind of
Speaker 3: trying to restore you know, the goodness or whatever.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, the truth. Yeah, because there are a
Speaker 1: lot of occultists out there that don't think what's going
Speaker 1: on is great. You know, myself excluded, but there's plenty
Speaker 1: of people that are like actually out there like that.
Speaker 1: I even know what podcasts that are talking about things
Speaker 1: because they want to educate people don't want to be
Speaker 1: dumbed down, you know, they want them to know the truth.
Speaker 4: Yeah, she wanted shit isn't old just Dixon demons. There's
Speaker 4: some real deep shit.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, well it's it's it's a potency game too, right,
Speaker 1: So it's like it's almost like, you know, the bad
Speaker 1: guys don't the reason they keep it secret is because
Speaker 1: they don't want people doing good with it, right, So
Speaker 1: if if there's more people doing good and it catches on,
Speaker 1: that technically should increase the potency of the good magic,
Speaker 1: that would then counter the dark magic.
Speaker 3: Right, Because if everybody had a magical experience, I would
Speaker 3: think probably about ninety five percent of those people are
Speaker 3: going to also open up their eyes with some sort
Speaker 3: of gift that they now have and something that I
Speaker 3: think they can actually be helpful.
Speaker 1: To the human race.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, you know, they could actually like create with
Speaker 3: their hands.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I just say because I just think it's you know,
Speaker 3: I would even say that to like a lot of
Speaker 3: the musicians. Why they're so good at what they do
Speaker 3: is because they fuck with magic.
Speaker 1: Just yeah, they just explore their gifts instead of hide
Speaker 1: them away. Yeah, or they found them through that, you know.
Speaker 1: Or again, like I was like saying before, like why
Speaker 1: I start podcasting, they get out of my own head, motherfucker.
Speaker 4: Picked up the guitar and stayed playing if for so long.
Speaker 3: That's became amazing, you know what I'm It could be
Speaker 3: a mixture of a lot of different things. Yeah, but
Speaker 3: I do think magic is very huge on I mean,
Speaker 3: all these Renaissance artists.
Speaker 1: Those are all people I think I had those experiences. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's why they painted those beautiful things. That's why they
Speaker 1: sculpted those beautiful things.
Speaker 3: They're obsessed with the experience that they had and they
Speaker 3: want to show it somehow, the beauty of it m
Speaker 3: express it somehow.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's. Yeah, that's awesome. That's I'm in
Speaker 1: agreeance with that. It's a nice positive way to look
Speaker 1: at it too.
Speaker 2: I'm unfortunately, I think I'm a little too negative sometimes
Speaker 2: in my first way of thinking would be that too
Speaker 2: many people would use it for bad. But it's nice
Speaker 2: to hear, Oh you two at least think that it
Speaker 2: it would be used. I would want it to be
Speaker 2: used for good. I think I'm just too pessimistic sometimes
Speaker 2: about the state of the world too, and just people
Speaker 2: that I know and whatever, right to think that some people,
Speaker 2: I don't know, it's good. It's nice to know that
Speaker 2: that some people think it would be used for good.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, no, I definitely think so. I definitely thin And.
Speaker 2: You think it would because it would be because people's
Speaker 2: eyes would be opened up to their true calling, right
Speaker 2: if they.
Speaker 1: Know is their will. Until they have that experience. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I guarantee you part of their will is
Speaker 3: going to be somewhat associated with spreading God's word, as
Speaker 3: cheesy as that sounds, or your experience with God is
Speaker 3: probably somewhere going to be in there.
Speaker 1: With what your will is. This is my opinion, because
Speaker 1: because you're going to be like I was blessed with this,
Speaker 1: I must tell others about it and then they can
Speaker 1: have this experience. If you're a good hunted person, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's going to be part of your message. It's like, yo,
Speaker 1: you got to check this out boy, you know.
Speaker 4: And the whole thing is is that during for this experience.
Speaker 3: It has made my idea of God ten times more
Speaker 3: beautiful and personal than it never was before. Yeah, so
Speaker 3: it has actually made me a much more spiritual person.
Speaker 3: And yeah, crazy to say it. I would never think,
Speaker 3: like fifteen years ago, I would be like, you know,
Speaker 3: my experience with God or having another experience with God
Speaker 3: is like what I think about eighty percent of the day.
Speaker 3: It's fucking nuts. I mean, if you're a magician, that's
Speaker 3: what a lot of your thoughts should be about.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Cool, Yeah, no, that's awesome, man. I think, uh,
Speaker 1: I think maybe that's a nice positive way to wrap
Speaker 1: it up kind of thing. If yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: well yeah, man, I really appreciate you jumping on to
Speaker 1: this episode. It was a lot of fun.
Speaker 2: No, thanks so much, man.
Speaker 1: No, I had a great time with you guys, and
Speaker 1: we definitely got to get you on for the removing
Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah for sure. Hey, but before, I was
Speaker 1: listening to an episode a little while ago, and you
Speaker 1: had one of the guys on the Incult Rejects was
Speaker 1: from Edmonton, Alberta. Did you do you remember TJ?
Speaker 4: Yeah, it might have been TJ.
Speaker 1: It sounds familiar.
Speaker 4: Okay, your Gin might have been Gin.
Speaker 1: I don't know, okay, and either way, yeah, it's super important.
Speaker 1: I just I grew up in Edmonton, So I was like,
Speaker 1: and you don't hear you know. I was like, oh shit,
Speaker 1: what are the chances that someone from my hometown is on?
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, no, no, no, yeah, that that that had
Speaker 3: to oh ship, you know, that had to have been TJ.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Jin is an hour ahead of me, okay, yeah, and
Speaker 3: the other TJ is on that's right, he was three
Speaker 3: hours behind me, so he's got to be over by you. Yeah,
Speaker 3: that's wild. Yeah, he's a Jamatri dude though we used
Speaker 3: to have on the show a lot. Oh nice you
Speaker 3: Contemporary Problems is his name, that's his podcast too, Okay, yeah,
Speaker 3: look check him out. Yeah yeah, all contact from you
Speaker 3: and reach out.
Speaker 4: Oh yo, great to have on your show.
Speaker 1: If you're into that ship, that tad will blow your
Speaker 1: mind with fucking numbers and stuff. We love.
Speaker 2: I'd love to do a Jabatry episode.
Speaker 1: Yeah, me too. Confuses the ship out of me.
Speaker 2: But yeah, but.
Speaker 1: With it all the time cool man. Well yeah, no,
Speaker 1: thanks again, this was a lot of fun. Well we'll
Speaker 1: we'll definitely do it again. And uh happy to be
Speaker 1: part of this podcast community that we've we've jumped into.
Speaker 1: Everyone's been awesome so far, so good. Yeah yeah, I
Speaker 1: give give the people one last ear full of where
Speaker 1: they can.
Speaker 4: Find you and closing thoughts.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I guess like I said before, when it comes
Speaker 1: to magic, my my, my experience, it's a little bit
Speaker 1: more than what people think it is.
Speaker 3: Uh again, I want to focus on the whole eyeball.
Speaker 3: It just just because people don't really don't talk about this,
Speaker 3: the whole eyeball and brain symbolism and the experience of
Speaker 3: death when it comes, you know, to magic symbolism and
Speaker 3: a cult symbolism. And for the podcast, it's on bit shoot,
Speaker 3: Brumble YouTube, all major podcasts, and we do have I
Speaker 3: totally forgot before a cult research institute dot org.
Speaker 1: That's our website. It has tons if you're into reading,
Speaker 1: tons and tons of stuff to read, like there's some
Speaker 1: shows that have been put to you know form where
Speaker 1: you could read it on the on the site, So
Speaker 1: definitely check that out.
Speaker 3: It's all free, so and it's got a bunch of
Speaker 3: people from the show and people who aren't on the
Speaker 3: show that have added or contributed to certain topics. So yeah,
Speaker 3: check that out. Thank you, Thank you, guys. I actually
Speaker 3: that was a blast. It was really great questions and
Speaker 3: I had a really good.
Speaker 1: Time right on.
Speaker 2: Awesome.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's that's good. That's what we like to hear. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: everyone out there, go same thing. Subscribe, like we're on
Speaker 1: all the stuff. I just begrudgingly put everything up on YouTube.
Speaker 1: I didn't want to do that, but here we are,
Speaker 1: so I go for it.
Speaker 4: You know, there's people people watch it, you know what
Speaker 4: I'm saying.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure, for sure, Mike do your thing.
Speaker 2: Do they think?
Speaker 1: All?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 2: From the Land of the high season, the tall trees.
Speaker 2: I'm Mike, I'm Andrew. Have a great night. Catch you
Speaker 2: next time.