WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.800 --> 00:00:04.080 For the importance events of today, very important events. 2 00:00:04.320 --> 00:00:05.040 One big bill. 3 00:00:05.240 --> 00:00:08.240 Check you in deportations of illegal sucea spot throughout the 4 00:00:08.320 --> 00:00:11.199 day on fifty five KARC, the talk station. 5 00:00:14.119 --> 00:00:18.079 TATO five here fifty five KRC, the Talk Station. It's 6 00:00:18.079 --> 00:00:20.640 been a very happy Friday to you. Good to have 7 00:00:20.800 --> 00:00:25.399 in studio detective retired detective Jim Grindle, who's written a 8 00:00:25.399 --> 00:00:27.920 book comic Side Investigation in the interview, Jim, good to 9 00:00:27.960 --> 00:00:29.440 have you in studio and bible to see you face 10 00:00:29.480 --> 00:00:30.960 to face and talk with you. And let me start 11 00:00:30.960 --> 00:00:33.520 by thanking you for your storied career in law enforcement. 12 00:00:33.719 --> 00:00:35.520 Well, I definitely appreciate that. Thank you for having me. 13 00:00:35.600 --> 00:00:39.920 Happy to do it man, And I told you before 14 00:00:40.039 --> 00:00:42.960 when the mix came on. It's been my experience in 15 00:00:43.000 --> 00:00:46.039 my coming up on sixty years that if you're sitting 16 00:00:46.079 --> 00:00:49.039 across the table with a retired police officer or an 17 00:00:49.079 --> 00:00:52.000 active police officer and enjoying a beer, they're the best 18 00:00:52.000 --> 00:00:54.399 people to talk with because they have the most outlangious 19 00:00:54.399 --> 00:00:57.399 and crazy stories, real things that happened that never happened 20 00:00:57.399 --> 00:00:59.679 anybody else because of, you know, being involved with the 21 00:00:59.679 --> 00:01:01.799 criminal element. It's just it's crazy what you have to 22 00:01:01.840 --> 00:01:03.399 deal with over the years, and we have a lot 23 00:01:03.439 --> 00:01:05.400 of fun with the stories, for sure. Oh I bet 24 00:01:05.719 --> 00:01:10.439 now you are not really retired right now, as I understand. 25 00:01:10.879 --> 00:01:13.920 No, Actually, my career started back in nineteen seventy nine. 26 00:01:15.120 --> 00:01:20.560 Actively retired in twenty thirteen, following twenty one years in investigations. 27 00:01:21.920 --> 00:01:24.719 The spray Dew Police Department has a program which allows 28 00:01:24.760 --> 00:01:27.599 officers to come back and work in an auxiliary position. 29 00:01:28.799 --> 00:01:31.640 We don't do any active enforcement, but we do a 30 00:01:31.640 --> 00:01:34.640 lot of the paper pushing and things like that. 31 00:01:35.280 --> 00:01:37.680 Well, fair enough, but you got it assaulted by a 32 00:01:37.680 --> 00:01:38.920 fourteen year old the other day. 33 00:01:39.400 --> 00:01:42.560 Well, he was autistic, and is this in the line 34 00:01:42.599 --> 00:01:43.000 of duty? 35 00:01:43.040 --> 00:01:43.560 This happened? 36 00:01:43.640 --> 00:01:46.799 This was an off duty detail, okay. And he was 37 00:01:46.879 --> 00:01:50.120 a regular at the church that we go to and 38 00:01:50.719 --> 00:01:52.000 he was just having an episode. 39 00:01:52.159 --> 00:01:55.319 I understand. Look, you were an out serving award or 40 00:01:55.400 --> 00:01:56.040 something like that. 41 00:01:56.400 --> 00:01:58.799 No, no, no, okay. And it wasn't intentional on his part. 42 00:01:58.840 --> 00:01:59.599 I don't believe either. 43 00:02:00.000 --> 00:02:02.120 All right, Well, that's good. Well, let's pivot over to 44 00:02:02.120 --> 00:02:05.239 the homicide investigation. The interview. Explain to my listeners what 45 00:02:05.319 --> 00:02:07.239 this book consists of. Jim. 46 00:02:07.760 --> 00:02:10.159 Well, the book starts, well, basically, the reason for the 47 00:02:10.159 --> 00:02:15.080 book was is during the interview, the individual portrayed a 48 00:02:15.159 --> 00:02:20.520 lot of body language that was beyond just your normal interviews. 49 00:02:21.039 --> 00:02:24.319 Pretty much displayed everything that you can actually display during 50 00:02:24.360 --> 00:02:26.840 an interview. And I always thought, man, i'd be great 51 00:02:26.840 --> 00:02:27.360 for a book. 52 00:02:27.719 --> 00:02:32.400 So, so body language is indicating a guilt, right, Well. 53 00:02:32.199 --> 00:02:36.639 It's basically a nonverbal communication, you know, through body posturing, 54 00:02:37.840 --> 00:02:42.120 facial expressions, movements, things of that nature. And you know 55 00:02:42.240 --> 00:02:45.199 that it's a lot about signs of deception or that 56 00:02:45.240 --> 00:02:46.159 they're not being truthful. 57 00:02:46.159 --> 00:02:51.199 And during the interview, So I imagine a young detective or 58 00:02:51.199 --> 00:02:53.960 someone in law enforcement who's going to be interviewing suspects 59 00:02:54.240 --> 00:02:57.199 could learn a lot from this, Well, I would hope. 60 00:02:57.240 --> 00:02:59.639 So I asks maybe one of the points you of 61 00:02:59.639 --> 00:03:01.159 your or put his book together. 62 00:03:01.400 --> 00:03:03.360 Well, the book's got a lot of clips in there 63 00:03:03.400 --> 00:03:05.479 showing when I talk about the different kind of language 64 00:03:05.680 --> 00:03:07.680 that he's portraying. It's there in the book, and there's 65 00:03:07.719 --> 00:03:11.120 also a two hour interview and it's entirety that could 66 00:03:11.120 --> 00:03:11.919 be watched as well. 67 00:03:12.000 --> 00:03:14.039 All right, how how many years experience did you have 68 00:03:14.199 --> 00:03:16.680 at the time you interviewed this suspect. 69 00:03:17.479 --> 00:03:21.520 Maybe as a police officer about thirteen years, fourteen years. 70 00:03:21.599 --> 00:03:23.879 Because as I understand it, and here you can be 71 00:03:24.120 --> 00:03:26.360 correct me if I'm wrong. I mean, there's a real 72 00:03:26.400 --> 00:03:30.039 skill in an art form to getting information out of witnesses. 73 00:03:32.039 --> 00:03:34.639 I would agree with that. Basically, you pretty much got 74 00:03:34.680 --> 00:03:37.120 to sit down as if we know each other, and 75 00:03:37.199 --> 00:03:39.360 once they get a little trust in you, they're more 76 00:03:39.400 --> 00:03:40.719 apt to talk to you and tell you things that 77 00:03:40.800 --> 00:03:41.280 you need to know. 78 00:03:41.280 --> 00:03:43.039 All right, So being a bad cops not a good 79 00:03:43.039 --> 00:03:44.479 idea under these circumstances. 80 00:03:44.599 --> 00:03:45.719 It works for the good cops. 81 00:03:46.199 --> 00:03:50.439 It works for the good cops. Now, But is this 82 00:03:50.520 --> 00:03:53.199 a learned skill? Like do you sit in a class, 83 00:03:53.199 --> 00:03:56.039 a cadet training class or some other follow up, you know, 84 00:03:56.159 --> 00:04:00.120 a continuing police education class to learn what you needed 85 00:04:00.240 --> 00:04:02.000 to do and how you need to conduct yourself the 86 00:04:02.039 --> 00:04:04.280 best interview witnesses and get information out of them. 87 00:04:04.759 --> 00:04:07.240 There are classes. I tell a lot of people that 88 00:04:07.840 --> 00:04:12.000 are in this kind of job to watch everybody's interviews 89 00:04:12.039 --> 00:04:15.479 and learn what you like about their approach, what works 90 00:04:15.479 --> 00:04:17.519 for them, and then kind of develop that into your own. 91 00:04:18.920 --> 00:04:20.480 The big thing with interviews you got to have a 92 00:04:20.519 --> 00:04:23.120 lot of patience. You got to you know, get a 93 00:04:23.199 --> 00:04:26.040 report with the individuals, And I feel that once people 94 00:04:26.079 --> 00:04:29.560 feel trusted with you, they people want to brag about themselves, 95 00:04:29.639 --> 00:04:32.120 So it's not hard to get a confession. Once you 96 00:04:32.160 --> 00:04:33.959 get that response, you know through them. 97 00:04:34.279 --> 00:04:35.959 Hey, is there have you learned over the years? I mean, 98 00:04:36.000 --> 00:04:40.319 is there certain certain psychological profile that kind of fits 99 00:04:40.360 --> 00:04:43.480 people who would commit very dangerous acts? I mean there 100 00:04:43.519 --> 00:04:45.720 is no one size fits all? Or do they sort 101 00:04:45.720 --> 00:04:49.480 of fall into a pattern? If I if I can 102 00:04:49.680 --> 00:04:50.399 call it that, I. 103 00:04:50.399 --> 00:04:52.360 Don't know if I agree with that. I mean I've 104 00:04:52.360 --> 00:04:55.160 sat down with people who you think absolutely could not 105 00:04:55.199 --> 00:04:57.560 have done something like this and find out they did. 106 00:04:59.199 --> 00:05:02.240 My philosophy is always, you know, I assume everybody's guilty 107 00:05:02.319 --> 00:05:04.079 until I prove am innocent. So that way I'm not 108 00:05:04.199 --> 00:05:05.160 lazy about what I do. 109 00:05:05.560 --> 00:05:08.040 Fair enough, Now, how much advanced work do you have 110 00:05:08.079 --> 00:05:10.680 to do before you're interviewing someone? Evidence gathering, you know, 111 00:05:10.839 --> 00:05:14.279 by the crime scene information photographs? Do you use all 112 00:05:14.319 --> 00:05:16.240 that incorporated in your interview or you just kind of 113 00:05:16.279 --> 00:05:17.319 hit the ground running with it. 114 00:05:17.480 --> 00:05:20.240 Well, in this case here, I kind of spent about 115 00:05:20.240 --> 00:05:21.879 two days to getting prepared because there was a lot 116 00:05:21.920 --> 00:05:24.839 of paperwork involved in it. And when I do the 117 00:05:24.879 --> 00:05:28.439 interview that that stuff is on my table. I use 118 00:05:28.480 --> 00:05:32.040 a lot of that as props. There's actually there's times 119 00:05:32.079 --> 00:05:35.319 where I'll take out photographs of the victim or of 120 00:05:35.399 --> 00:05:38.360 things that are uncomfortable source be sure, and I will 121 00:05:38.439 --> 00:05:40.399 leave them out there and during the interview just kind 122 00:05:40.439 --> 00:05:42.439 of watch his response and how he reacts to the 123 00:05:42.439 --> 00:05:44.360 photographs and stuff that are sitting in front of him. 124 00:05:44.439 --> 00:05:46.879 All right, let's turn specifically to the subject matter of 125 00:05:46.920 --> 00:05:50.079 the interview in your book, off side Investigation the interview, 126 00:05:50.240 --> 00:05:52.800 What was he what was he suspected of when you 127 00:05:52.800 --> 00:05:53.879 were interviewing. 128 00:05:54.800 --> 00:05:59.120 Well, there was a robbery that occurred involving three Hispanic 129 00:05:59.199 --> 00:06:04.680 males in an apartment complex there in Springdale. After that 130 00:06:04.759 --> 00:06:09.279 robbery occurred and the fleeing of that vehicle, an individual shot. 131 00:06:09.360 --> 00:06:11.480 He's actually one of the people that was, you know, 132 00:06:11.560 --> 00:06:15.000 involved in the actual robbery. Right, So basically it's an 133 00:06:15.000 --> 00:06:20.759 accidental shooting. Bad guy in Ohio. Though that would only 134 00:06:20.800 --> 00:06:24.560 basically be, you know, an accidental accident shooting. But the 135 00:06:24.600 --> 00:06:28.759 fact they're leaving a homicide or a robbery, I should say, uh, 136 00:06:28.839 --> 00:06:33.839 it would make a felony. And therefore, you know, a homicide. 137 00:06:33.199 --> 00:06:37.560 And anybody involved in the crime where the homicide happens, 138 00:06:37.759 --> 00:06:41.240 is himself or herself also going to be charged with 139 00:06:41.279 --> 00:06:42.120 that homicide? 140 00:06:42.319 --> 00:06:44.600 That's correct, And the purpose of the interview was one 141 00:06:44.680 --> 00:06:47.959 to establish they were involved in the actual robbery and 142 00:06:48.079 --> 00:06:50.639 who actually fired the round that killed Lamore. 143 00:06:51.199 --> 00:06:53.480 And I presume at the outset of the interview the 144 00:06:53.480 --> 00:06:54.959 guy denied even being there. 145 00:06:56.600 --> 00:06:58.759 This was a two hour, tenmidte interview, and it wasn't 146 00:06:58.839 --> 00:07:00.240 until about an hour and a half in to it 147 00:07:00.279 --> 00:07:02.360 that we actually got something out of him that put 148 00:07:02.439 --> 00:07:02.839 him there. 149 00:07:03.040 --> 00:07:05.839 Okay, well, what was your first indication that you had 150 00:07:05.879 --> 00:07:06.399 the right guy? 151 00:07:07.199 --> 00:07:11.879 What do he sat down down? Well, the reason I 152 00:07:11.879 --> 00:07:14.279 say that is the work had already been done. The 153 00:07:14.279 --> 00:07:17.120 search works were done. We had text messaging, and we 154 00:07:17.160 --> 00:07:20.600 had phone records, so when we sat down, we pretty 155 00:07:20.639 --> 00:07:22.959 much knew everything we were going to be asking him. 156 00:07:23.439 --> 00:07:27.240 Then, Okay, well, when confronted with hard evidence like well, 157 00:07:27.240 --> 00:07:29.560 here's your cell phone and here's the text information back 158 00:07:29.560 --> 00:07:31.240 and forth, and this is why it's relevant to this 159 00:07:31.240 --> 00:07:33.879 particular case, how does someone just deny that? All right? 160 00:07:33.920 --> 00:07:35.680 I presume it's some measure of the guy denied it. 161 00:07:36.079 --> 00:07:39.879 No, he denied, strong, strong denials with his non involvement 162 00:07:39.920 --> 00:07:42.600 of it. But and actually it's kind of interesting that 163 00:07:42.639 --> 00:07:45.439 the photograph is sitting in front of him. He actually 164 00:07:45.519 --> 00:07:48.680 turns around and actually points out and says she did it, 165 00:07:49.920 --> 00:07:54.879 and starts actually pointing on the photograph. 166 00:07:55.000 --> 00:07:57.600 I said, that's rather damning under the circumstances that he 167 00:07:57.639 --> 00:08:00.439 can't say you weren't there and then identified someone who 168 00:08:00.480 --> 00:08:02.639 was involved with it. If you weren't there, it don't 169 00:08:02.639 --> 00:08:05.560 work very well. It doesn't work well. So what's a 170 00:08:05.600 --> 00:08:07.399 guy's reaction like that when he pointed out to him? 171 00:08:07.439 --> 00:08:09.480 He's denied it, denied it, and then he points to 172 00:08:09.519 --> 00:08:11.879 the photograph, said she did it. I mean, did you 173 00:08:11.920 --> 00:08:14.800 see Well, wait a second, you said you weren't there. 174 00:08:14.839 --> 00:08:16.000 How is it you know she did it? 175 00:08:16.639 --> 00:08:18.839 Well, the other problem was who was driving the car, 176 00:08:18.879 --> 00:08:21.920 who actually fired around? So at this point he claims 177 00:08:21.959 --> 00:08:23.480 now that he's the driver of the car and had 178 00:08:23.519 --> 00:08:25.240 nothing to do with actually firing around. 179 00:08:24.959 --> 00:08:27.560 That killed him. But truly that doesn't really matter under 180 00:08:27.560 --> 00:08:29.839 the circumstances because again he was involved in the crime. 181 00:08:29.920 --> 00:08:34.720 That's correct, all right, Well, what is one of the 182 00:08:34.720 --> 00:08:38.600 more interesting sort of developments during this interview that you 183 00:08:38.639 --> 00:08:40.679 knew you had the right guy, I guess because I'm 184 00:08:40.679 --> 00:08:43.360 just kind of wondering how this all unfolds. 185 00:08:44.080 --> 00:08:46.279 Well, when he first sits down and everything, you know, 186 00:08:46.480 --> 00:08:48.600 the two of them were best friends. They grew up 187 00:08:48.759 --> 00:08:52.559 in school together at Princeton. The person was actually killed 188 00:08:53.000 --> 00:08:55.759 was an up and coming football sensation. They thought he'd 189 00:08:55.759 --> 00:09:00.279 make it actually to the NFL, and he played off 190 00:09:00.279 --> 00:09:02.039 of the fact that they were great, you know, great 191 00:09:02.039 --> 00:09:07.039 friends and everything. And when the shooting took place. Lamar 192 00:09:07.080 --> 00:09:09.519 didn't actually pass the night of the shooting. It was 193 00:09:09.559 --> 00:09:13.279 a couple of days thereafter. And this individual would actually 194 00:09:13.279 --> 00:09:16.240 stay with the family, you know, as a friend and 195 00:09:16.240 --> 00:09:17.720 everything else, and he had no idea that he was 196 00:09:17.759 --> 00:09:20.320 actually part of the homicide while he was living with 197 00:09:20.399 --> 00:09:21.039 an asshold. 198 00:09:22.320 --> 00:09:25.159 All right, well, we'll bring Jim Grendel back again, storied 199 00:09:25.200 --> 00:09:27.480 law enforcement crever with the Springdale Police Department. He's been 200 00:09:27.519 --> 00:09:31.159 involved in a lot of different cases, some fascinating ones 201 00:09:31.200 --> 00:09:32.960 to me. We can touch base on a few more 202 00:09:32.960 --> 00:09:34.879 of those and talk about his career in law enforcement. 203 00:09:34.960 --> 00:09:38.519 God bless those in law enforcement. Jim Grinnell will continue. 204 00:09:38.519 --> 00:09:40.480 It's eighty fifteen right now, fifty five K see the 205 00:09:40.559 --> 00:09:44.320 talk station. Be right back fifty five car the talk 206 00:09:44.399 --> 00:09:50.279 station our iHeartRadio music. Here is your Channa night. First 207 00:09:50.279 --> 00:09:52.879 one to what aforecast gets some showers and storms possible 208 00:09:52.919 --> 00:09:55.600 Today eighty five is going to be all high overnight 209 00:09:55.639 --> 00:09:58.279 lows seventy one, with more opportunities for some rain. Slim though, 210 00:10:00.000 --> 00:10:02.519 well let's see better chance of stores begin around one 211 00:10:02.559 --> 00:10:05.159 pm tomorrow. The little chance in the morning. Tomorrow's high 212 00:10:05.200 --> 00:10:08.320 eighty six seventy two. Over night they'll be very humid 213 00:10:08.399 --> 00:10:12.000 and also a chance of some rain. Finally, for Sunday, 214 00:10:12.200 --> 00:10:14.600 very humid again and another chance of some rain eighty 215 00:10:14.639 --> 00:10:17.080 seven for the high day. Right now, it's seventy three degrees. 216 00:10:17.159 --> 00:10:18.200 Time for a traffic update. 217 00:10:18.279 --> 00:10:21.799 Chuck from the UCL Traffic Center. The UC Health Brain 218 00:10:21.840 --> 00:10:24.759 Tumor Center finds answers for some of the most complex 219 00:10:24.799 --> 00:10:29.360 brain tumors. Learn more at ucehelp dot com. Cruse continue 220 00:10:29.399 --> 00:10:32.159 to work to clear an accident he's found. Viral's ramp 221 00:10:32.240 --> 00:10:35.120 to Ridge sapbound seventy five slows a bit at the 222 00:10:35.120 --> 00:10:37.759 Reagan Highway, then a bit more below the Western Hills 223 00:10:37.799 --> 00:10:42.320 Viaduct into downtown sapbound two seventy five. Break lights between 224 00:10:42.320 --> 00:10:45.559 the Lawrence Burn ramp and the Carroll Cropper Bridge Chuck 225 00:10:45.679 --> 00:10:48.679 Ingram on fifty five krc DE talk station. 226 00:10:50.320 --> 00:10:53.320 Eight eighteen Here fifty five KRCD talk station. Jim Grindle 227 00:10:54.240 --> 00:10:57.519 retired from the Springdal Police Department and he did a 228 00:10:57.519 --> 00:11:00.360 whole bunch of years as a police officer but also 229 00:11:00.360 --> 00:11:02.759 an investigator. I'm talking about one of the cases he 230 00:11:02.799 --> 00:11:07.000 did in interview on and ultimately the suspect was incarcerated 231 00:11:07.240 --> 00:11:11.919 homicide investigation. In the interview, it's a very interesting work 232 00:11:11.960 --> 00:11:13.480 of you know, how you get information out of a 233 00:11:13.480 --> 00:11:16.960 guy who's an absolute, outright denial and lying to you 234 00:11:17.039 --> 00:11:19.799 through his teeth. I thought it was a rather funny exchange, Jim, 235 00:11:19.840 --> 00:11:22.639 you're He says, I wasn't there, I wasn't in the car. 236 00:11:22.639 --> 00:11:24.639 I wasn't in the car. And you say, wait a second, 237 00:11:24.840 --> 00:11:27.399 I got your phone records. Man, we know you were there. 238 00:11:27.960 --> 00:11:30.919 And he denied even knowing the woman that was involved 239 00:11:30.960 --> 00:11:33.600 in the crime, although he had like twenty two different 240 00:11:33.600 --> 00:11:35.840 phone calls to her. I mean, this guy was just 241 00:11:36.080 --> 00:11:38.600 an exercise of futility of his in his denials. 242 00:11:39.120 --> 00:11:41.200 Well, he only claimed to know her for a short 243 00:11:41.200 --> 00:11:43.320 period of time. But because of those records, we know 244 00:11:43.360 --> 00:11:45.639 that the actual robbery has been playing like four days 245 00:11:45.679 --> 00:11:48.240 in prior to that, and that they'd actually known each 246 00:11:48.279 --> 00:11:49.480 other for over a week. 247 00:11:50.200 --> 00:11:52.519 Wow, how did the person get shot because it was 248 00:11:52.559 --> 00:11:53.519 an accidental shooting? 249 00:11:53.519 --> 00:11:56.840 He set Well, Well, one of them was driving the car. 250 00:11:57.039 --> 00:11:59.480 And I really don't want to throw the actual shooter 251 00:11:59.519 --> 00:12:02.200 out yet here because it's in the book and I 252 00:12:02.200 --> 00:12:04.279 think it'd be interesting for people to kind of it's 253 00:12:04.320 --> 00:12:08.480 a good type thing. Sure, But in the getaway leaving 254 00:12:08.519 --> 00:12:13.000 the crime scene of the robbery, he shot. The individual 255 00:12:13.000 --> 00:12:14.559 gets shot is in the front seat of the car. 256 00:12:14.759 --> 00:12:15.639 It was an accident. 257 00:12:15.840 --> 00:12:17.559 The shot came from the back seat. So you ever 258 00:12:17.600 --> 00:12:19.679 see pulp fiction? I did not see that. 259 00:12:19.759 --> 00:12:24.159 Oh well, there's a scene in pulp fiction the one 260 00:12:24.159 --> 00:12:25.639 of the gangsters in the front of the car and 261 00:12:25.679 --> 00:12:28.840 he's got his forty five automatic, but he has his 262 00:12:28.879 --> 00:12:31.320 finger on the trigger and he's talking to a kid 263 00:12:31.360 --> 00:12:33.559 that's in the back seat asking him a question, and 264 00:12:34.080 --> 00:12:36.120 the gun goes off and it blows the kid's head off. 265 00:12:36.120 --> 00:12:39.080 As a total accident, but that sounds analogous to what happens. 266 00:12:39.120 --> 00:12:40.200 That's pretty much what happened. 267 00:12:40.440 --> 00:12:43.399 Okay, keep your finger off the trigger unless you are 268 00:12:43.480 --> 00:12:47.360 intending to shoot the firearm. A little lesson there. So 269 00:12:47.600 --> 00:12:50.679 it's called the Homicide Investigation. The interview, real fascinating stuff 270 00:12:50.679 --> 00:12:54.840 with Jim. Jim, I understand you have another book in 271 00:12:54.879 --> 00:12:56.279 the works. What's that one about? 272 00:12:56.679 --> 00:13:01.159 That's actually a homicide from nineteen ninety nine Walker, It's 273 00:13:01.240 --> 00:13:04.919 gonna be the Walker Files. It's the sixty seven year 274 00:13:04.919 --> 00:13:06.960 old man that was beaten to death in his home. 275 00:13:08.360 --> 00:13:11.120 We know that the people response before the death or 276 00:13:11.159 --> 00:13:14.799 out of the Indianapolis, Indiana area, two people were actually 277 00:13:15.240 --> 00:13:18.320 apprehended for using the credit cards after about a thirty 278 00:13:18.519 --> 00:13:22.720 day surveillance of some gas stations, and then from there 279 00:13:22.960 --> 00:13:28.120 some other suspects were they're really strong, strong, you know, 280 00:13:28.159 --> 00:13:30.000 people of Ventuest. Because of some of the things that 281 00:13:30.039 --> 00:13:32.639 occurred in Indianapolis and also here in Cincinnati, we could 282 00:13:32.639 --> 00:13:34.639 put them in the locations here. 283 00:13:34.519 --> 00:13:37.879 All right, So another sort of who'd done it? And 284 00:13:38.200 --> 00:13:39.960 a crime book in the works. We're here from Jim 285 00:13:40.039 --> 00:13:41.720 on that one. After it's out and done, make sure 286 00:13:41.720 --> 00:13:42.559 you give me a copy of it. 287 00:13:43.240 --> 00:13:43.840 Absolutely. 288 00:13:44.679 --> 00:13:46.639 Let me just get your comments and thoughts about we. 289 00:13:47.320 --> 00:13:49.600 I'm a huge supporter of law enforcement. You know that 290 00:13:49.639 --> 00:13:51.200 we've already talked about it, and I think you were 291 00:13:51.240 --> 00:13:53.159 aware from listening to the show. My sister retired from 292 00:13:53.159 --> 00:13:58.399 the CINCINNT Police Department after twenty five years of career 293 00:13:58.519 --> 00:14:02.840 law enforcement. Perception of what's going on now, we have 294 00:14:03.840 --> 00:14:07.679 a difficult time recruiting police officers. Now, the defund the police, 295 00:14:07.759 --> 00:14:09.679 the police are a bunch of racists. You know that 296 00:14:09.679 --> 00:14:12.960 that kind of narrative has permeated through the society. Are 297 00:14:13.000 --> 00:14:15.279 since a police departments down one hundred and fifty officers. 298 00:14:15.320 --> 00:14:17.080 They're losing more and more every day. I know, they 299 00:14:17.159 --> 00:14:18.720 got some classes lined up and they're trying to do 300 00:14:18.759 --> 00:14:21.679 it some loatderal hires. What's your take on law enforcement 301 00:14:21.799 --> 00:14:23.639 right now? You know, for someone out there that maybe 302 00:14:23.720 --> 00:14:26.639 considered for a career, and do you think things have 303 00:14:26.759 --> 00:14:29.879 kind of, you know, run off the rails as we 304 00:14:30.039 --> 00:14:32.919 exist in a society here relative to our perceptional law enforcement. 305 00:14:33.480 --> 00:14:36.799 Well, from when I started in nineteen eighty, things have 306 00:14:36.919 --> 00:14:39.840 come a long way. And I say that not in 307 00:14:39.879 --> 00:14:43.000 a good way. When you got law enforcement back then, 308 00:14:43.159 --> 00:14:45.879 it was a brotherhood. It was something you really wanted 309 00:14:45.919 --> 00:14:48.960 to do. Now it's a job for just money. I mean, 310 00:14:49.000 --> 00:14:51.320 people come and get to work. You know, I see 311 00:14:51.320 --> 00:14:54.519 people turning down details pay fifty five sixty dollars an hour. 312 00:14:56.600 --> 00:14:59.320 There's not a strong brotherhood like there used to be. 313 00:15:00.120 --> 00:15:02.399 And it's like you said that with the courts and 314 00:15:02.440 --> 00:15:04.480 what they're doing now with the people that are you know, 315 00:15:04.919 --> 00:15:08.000 I think what they do is they protect mostly the 316 00:15:08.039 --> 00:15:11.919 bad people and the people that are good people. It 317 00:15:12.039 --> 00:15:13.320 just it's just don't work for them. 318 00:15:13.440 --> 00:15:15.519 Well, in your motivation to go into law enforcement, I 319 00:15:15.519 --> 00:15:18.080 suppose comes out of your sense of community. You want 320 00:15:18.080 --> 00:15:19.840 to help the community. You want to you know, get 321 00:15:19.840 --> 00:15:22.759 the bad guys and see the justices served well. 322 00:15:22.759 --> 00:15:25.159 With everything said like that, here I am forty four 323 00:15:25.240 --> 00:15:26.759 years later and I still enjoy it like it was 324 00:15:26.840 --> 00:15:27.879 the day one for me. 325 00:15:28.039 --> 00:15:30.639 Yeah, well, one sense of community doesn't disappear with age. 326 00:15:30.679 --> 00:15:32.879 I mean, you can become jaded and cynical, but it's 327 00:15:32.919 --> 00:15:35.519 the reason you entered into law enforcement. And it's kind 328 00:15:35.559 --> 00:15:37.879 of a shame that it's it's it's it's it's gotten 329 00:15:37.879 --> 00:15:40.000 the way it has. And you're right, I said, the 330 00:15:40.200 --> 00:15:45.399 the the core to the justice system, the key, you know, 331 00:15:45.559 --> 00:15:49.120 leg on the stool of the justice system is holding 332 00:15:49.159 --> 00:15:52.720 people accountable and and and and you know, punishing them 333 00:15:52.720 --> 00:15:55.159 for their crimes. It acts as a deterrent so that 334 00:15:55.279 --> 00:15:57.519 others do not do it. He's that person's held out 335 00:15:57.519 --> 00:16:00.000 as an example. Look, what's going to happen to you 336 00:16:00.039 --> 00:16:01.919 if you do the same damn thing, So you're not 337 00:16:01.960 --> 00:16:03.600 inclined to do it. I wouldn't want to go to jail, 338 00:16:03.639 --> 00:16:05.240 for God's sake. It's enough of a deterurn for me 339 00:16:05.279 --> 00:16:07.559 just keep my nose clean my entire life. But if 340 00:16:07.559 --> 00:16:10.200 you take that away, things run amuck. 341 00:16:11.080 --> 00:16:13.559 Well, And with that said, I mean I've worked with 342 00:16:13.600 --> 00:16:15.840 a lot of great people. My career wouldn't be like 343 00:16:15.879 --> 00:16:18.559 it is without the people I worked side by side with. 344 00:16:19.600 --> 00:16:21.679 And I mean there's a lot of good people out there, 345 00:16:21.720 --> 00:16:23.080 and then a lot of them have the same feelings 346 00:16:23.120 --> 00:16:25.200 I do that this is a great career. I still 347 00:16:25.200 --> 00:16:27.440 recommend it to people. Good for you, I'm glad so. 348 00:16:28.000 --> 00:16:29.399 And that's what you put into it. I mean, if 349 00:16:29.399 --> 00:16:30.879 you go into it with a you know, where you 350 00:16:30.879 --> 00:16:32.759 get along with people, you like to work with people, 351 00:16:33.960 --> 00:16:34.600 it'll work for. 352 00:16:34.559 --> 00:16:36.919 You, right, And no one's going to tell meybody, it's 353 00:16:36.960 --> 00:16:39.240 an easy job, that's for sure, but it can be 354 00:16:39.360 --> 00:16:40.000 very rewarding. 355 00:16:40.320 --> 00:16:40.679 It is. 356 00:16:41.799 --> 00:16:44.320 Yeah, Well, Jim, it's been a real pleasure having you 357 00:16:44.360 --> 00:16:46.840 in the studio talking. Joe's gonna put your book up 358 00:16:46.840 --> 00:16:48.600 on my blog page forty five krsy dot com. Do 359 00:16:48.639 --> 00:16:50.600 you look you publish this yourself or do you have 360 00:16:50.799 --> 00:16:54.559 luckily published because you didn't go to Chili Dog Press? 361 00:16:54.600 --> 00:16:55.000 Did you? 362 00:16:55.279 --> 00:17:01.840 I did not, now that you. That's one I don't remember. 363 00:17:01.840 --> 00:17:03.440 I know exactly what it is. I just can't say 364 00:17:03.440 --> 00:17:04.119 the name of it now. 365 00:17:04.279 --> 00:17:04.759 That's all right. 366 00:17:04.759 --> 00:17:07.359 It's a local right there off of Fairfax. 367 00:17:07.480 --> 00:17:09.000 Joe put it on the blog page if you five 368 00:17:09.039 --> 00:17:11.880 carecy dot com. I noted one more thing I gotta 369 00:17:11.920 --> 00:17:13.839 ask you before we part company today, and I wish 370 00:17:13.880 --> 00:17:18.440 you best of the weekend. The Russia White Plastic investigations 371 00:17:18.480 --> 00:17:20.160 one of the high profile cases you mentioned in the 372 00:17:20.200 --> 00:17:22.000 liner notes on the back of the book. Real quick, 373 00:17:22.039 --> 00:17:23.279 what's that all about? 374 00:17:23.559 --> 00:17:25.839 Well, well, at what they were doing is they were 375 00:17:25.839 --> 00:17:29.000 coming in and this was going all over the country. 376 00:17:29.000 --> 00:17:33.720 But they were taking you know, credit cards. Are they 377 00:17:33.720 --> 00:17:35.839 got the little strip on the backside of them. What 378 00:17:35.839 --> 00:17:38.000 they were doing is they were they were encoding them 379 00:17:38.039 --> 00:17:41.920 with you know stuff that they stole information off other cards. 380 00:17:42.400 --> 00:17:45.599 Then they would go to ATM machines and start withdrawing money. 381 00:17:46.200 --> 00:17:48.000 And they were doing this all over the country, and 382 00:17:48.000 --> 00:17:50.359 they were out of Turkey and some people out of Russia, 383 00:17:50.480 --> 00:17:52.759 and Secrett Service did the majority of that, but it 384 00:17:52.839 --> 00:17:57.039 started a lot. Actually in Springdale, they went to a 385 00:17:57.640 --> 00:18:01.119 what was that a travel They were taking the cards 386 00:18:01.119 --> 00:18:03.119 and putting nine thousand, nine hundred and ninety nine dollars 387 00:18:03.160 --> 00:18:06.960 on them, and that started the investigation with us. 388 00:18:07.039 --> 00:18:09.400 Well, Iuess, you also work with the FBI, got secret 389 00:18:09.440 --> 00:18:12.079 service there, and you're involved in a multitude of cases 390 00:18:12.119 --> 00:18:14.480 over your entire career. Jim, it's been a real pleasure 391 00:18:14.519 --> 00:18:16.160 talking with you. Thanks for putting it down on paper 392 00:18:16.200 --> 00:18:18.440 and letting us enjoy and learn from your experience as 393 00:18:18.480 --> 00:18:19.400 a law enforcement officer. 394 00:18:19.440 --> 00:18:20.440 Well, I appreciate you for having me. 395 00:18:21.079 --> 00:18:23.119 It's been a real pleasure. Have a wonderful weekend, sir. 396 00:18:23.160 --> 00:18:26.079 Eight twenty six. Right now, local stories coming up. Alternatively, 397 00:18:26.160 --> 00:18:28.039 Jo's got the phone lines open. You can call. Maybe 398 00:18:28.039 --> 00:18:29.880 there's something you want to talk about. Five one, three, seven, 399 00:18:29.920 --> 00:18:31.799 four nine, fifty five hundred, eight hundred and eighty two 400 00:18:31.799 --> 00:18:35.079 to three talk pound five fifty on AT and T phones. 401 00:18:35.119 --> 00:18:35.880