Speaker 1: What is up, fellows, sickos. I am Dan Fa Valley
coming at you with the one, the only, my certified
fantabulous co host, mister Grant Hughes. We are here to
talk about the actual biggest threats to the Oklahoma City Thunder.
It's been in the top, it's been. It's more topical
now because of what the Spurs just recently did to them,
and now we have the Yokis injury to factor it
in a lot of interesting teams out west. We're gonna
talk about some of the East teams too, and we're
gonna break down a bunch of these teams and we
will give our picks at the end.
Speaker 2: So that's right, you have to stick around.
Speaker 1: Do you know why you also have to stick around
because I'm gonna go on my Draymond Green rant here
how the NBA players who make tens of millions of
dollars a year had to work on Christmas just like
concessions stand workers at that arenas. I'm working on my
birthday right now, Folks, to bring you this content.
Speaker 2: So you know what you're gonna do.
Speaker 1: You're gonna subscribe across all platforms and you're gonna send
this video or just recommend us not just right now,
but non stop for all of twenty twenty six as
a well much deserved birthday present to me. But with
all sincerity, this is our first podcast of twenty twenty six.
Speaker 2: We want to thank everyone.
Speaker 1: For their support as always our siccos we love them
around these parts a hard one knock, so appreciate every
single one of you. Go join our discord if you
want more sycoism and it's free to everybody. The link
is in the podcast YouTube description. I will now ask
the question that we want to know the answer to,
even more so than who the biggest threat to the
Oklahoma City Thunder is, Grant, just how the heck are
you doing?
Speaker 3: I'm doing great because I remembered your birthday. I wish
you happy birthday.
Speaker 4: I did.
Speaker 1: It was a big that's like a big milestone birthday,
so I know, I.
Speaker 3: Didn't know if you're going to reveal the your ear
age's that's very brave of you. I did have the
thought of waiting until nine oh one pm last night
to be the first because I would have won right,
I would have been the first official birthday well wisher.
May if I might have had to do it right
at nine because you're three hours ahead.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 3: Didn't do it because I'm a good friend, not a
great one.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 3: And I like to I like to make sure that
you don't get your hopes too high.
Speaker 1: I was shocked that you not that you remembered. I
guess I was shocked that you knew. I didn't anticipate
that you knew. And then that was the first thing
you said when we logged on. So you are, you
know you are, You're a great friend.
Speaker 3: I was ready. I was ready. I like to keep
the friendship dynamics such that, like, all right, I remembered yours.
You got ten months. You're gonna blow it, You're gonna
are you gonna reciprocate? We'll see. I think you did
give me a pretty early on birthday. Well wishing.
Speaker 1: Here here's the problem, folks, before we get started. Grant
is a fucking just safe and he threw away the key.
He gives me lots of the things I have found
out about Grant through not Grant himself, or just these
major things that happened, and then I'll find out months later.
And meanwhile, I'm here spewing my deepest, darkest thoughts. Before
we get on air. I do have your birthday in
my calendar as well, because I know that you will.
Speaker 2: Never you never. I didn't even find out it was
your birthday.
Speaker 1: We had a mutual friend, Bill, who had texted me
saying he forgot your birthday once that house like it
was the day after. I was like, it was Grant's
birthday yesterday. We had literally recorded a couple of days.
I was like, you have any like things coming up?
What's going on this weekend? Nope?
Speaker 2: Nothing.
Speaker 3: Well, the truth is there wasn't anything special planned, so
I didn't I didn't mislead you. I just didn't volunteer
certain information. Yeah. Well again, it's about leverage. This this way,
I can never lose the friendship battle because I will
always know more about I can be more thoughtful. It
puts you at a disadvantage. I'm just trying to win friendship,
that's all. That's competitive.
Speaker 1: Look, I'm trying to win against the Oklahoma City Thunder.
If I'm another NBA team, I'm not throwing at the
pole house.
Speaker 3: Good say way one two, good luck. It's not gonna
be crazy.
Speaker 2: Good luck.
Speaker 1: And I think I wanted to start here before we
go through our actual teams, But we're all in agreement
that I know. There's been a lot of stuff about
the Spurs of late the Oklahoma City Thunder are the
standard standard bearer for NBA title contention right now, I
think they might look more vulnerable or that the Spurs were.
I can't even say the Spurs were built to beat
the Thunder so much as a lot of it as
whenby exists, We're gonna get to the Spurs, and I
promised the analysis goes beyond that. But do you feel
any worse about the Thunder overall? After watching those Spurs games,
even them lose to the to the Timberwolves.
Speaker 3: Well, let's remember I only picked them for sixty two
wins this year, so I feel about the seventy, I
feel about the same as I have. I mean, definitely
do I feel worse about them? I mean, I guess
you have to a little bit, just because prior to
that recent stretch where Spurs beat them left, right and center,
it just seemed like, well, nobody can do this, and
just the Spurs gave you a little like Okay, no,
it's like not impossible. You actually can beat them and
not do it once by being lucky like you can
just outplay them a certain percentage of the time, which,
by the way, I think that's great because it's I'd like,
as much as I want to see something I've never
seen before, like seventy four wins or whatever, I do
think I'm I just the way that I feel about
the Thunder now and the season as a whole. It's
more interesting to me if if we're if we can
have the discussion that we're about to have, because had
we done this prior to those Spurs losses, it'd be
like what would we even talk about? You know, how
do you beat the Thunder? I don't know, you be
the Portland Trailblazers one time and get lucky or whoever
I can't remember who else beat them, But like, well,
you know, it's just like there's there's not a lot
of analysis to be done, and what what little there
is would be like speculative. It's like, well, we haven't
seen this work before, but I don't know, maybe if
you win on the offensive glass to like some crazy
extent like that might work. I don't know. Now we
have like a little bit more actual proof I guess
of like what you need to do and like where
the vulnerabilities might be. So that's a good thing. But
to answer the original question, yeah, they're like they're still
the favorite. Like I, we're still talking about them as
the how do you beat them team, not any of
these other, you know, squads that we're going to discuss.
It's like the thunderer over here. Everybody else is trying
to get there, but maybe everybody else is like slightly
closer to where the thunder are than we thought. And
that's cool. I like that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it reinforces the notion that one this season is
not a foregone conclusion for me, and that's I love.
Speaker 2: I just love the NBA. I love what we do.
Speaker 1: It can be stressful and frustrating at points, but I
love what we do and so I appreciate everything, the
dynasties but also the parody. The idea though that we
might just have this all time great team and then
maybe a foil or two or three in the league
is just objectively kind of cool. And so with that,
who is the first team? We are not ranking these,
We're gonna give our picks at the end. So I
just want to reiterate down who's the first team that
you would like to discuss uh.
Speaker 3: I think we should let's get Denver out of the
way for a couple of reasons. One, they haven't played
the Thunder yet this year, so we don't have a
ton of recent information. We don't know what the rebuilt,
deeper version of the Nuggets might be able to do
against Okay, see, however, we may not see that version
of the Nuggets for a while, just because literally everybody
except for Jamal Murray is hurt. Way vals goes down recently,
Like I didn't even know about the Valentunas injury, like
until a couple of days after it happened, maybe maybe
only a day, but like, what is what's happening?
Speaker 5: Like?
Speaker 2: How and how is it Jamal?
Speaker 1: How is Jamal Murray the last man of all people standings?
I'm not wishing you, but we go from Jamal Murray's
never in shape. He's the one who's always injured. At times,
it felt like he was more banged up than Michael
Porter Junior across the reular seasons to.
Speaker 3: Now Junior Loki was super durable, by the way, for
like most of his Nuggets tenure.
Speaker 1: Man, I've already started getting messages from friends and like
dms with people that we work with or both know, like, oh,
was the Cam Johnson trade a mistake?
Speaker 2: And I'm just not ready to travel down.
Speaker 1: That because look, I think MPJ, the stuff he's doing
on offense, there's a lot of differences from what he like.
He's kind of the same player, but he's also has
more freedom and so I'm not ready to revisit that.
Speaker 2: There's other flexibility that was opened up.
Speaker 1: But yeah, the Nuggets are they were always vulnerable because
of the team that they lean on their starters the most.
Like they're just metrics that show they're playing their starters
aligned share of their minutes more than any other team.
But this is just this is brutal because now it's
who's your who's your backup big man?
Speaker 2: Rant?
Speaker 3: Well, I think we know who it is, and we
discuss him because of his contract more than anything. I mean,
has done right well right, but like he's been wildly disappointed.
I mean, it's how high were your expectations? Really? But like, yeah,
so it's it's gonna be bad. Holmes and Nause are
not like that's a rough center duo. That's us out.
Speaker 1: Did you see I think it was enjoy basketball whatever, whatever,
Kenny Beacham's associated with posted the meme. It's like just
Nausey's picture and he's smiling. It says, accidentally became important
at work.
Speaker 3: I mean a lot of players are gonna be accidentally important,
like Spencer Jones two ways already already and now it's
just like guess what you're gonna get eight to ten
shots at night, have fun. So so again, the Nuggets,
we don't know when they're gonna be whole again. I
haven't looked ahead oft the schedule to see if, like
you know, if Yo get just back in four weeks,
is there gonna be a Thunder game within that window
or after it? Hopefully after, but just so some context,
go ahead.
Speaker 1: Just for their first game against the Thunder is February first,
so that's right on the borderline. And then they play
them February twenty twenty seventh, March ninth, and April tenth.
Speaker 3: If Jokic is not back for that second February game,
I mean, where are the Nuggets in the standings? Won?
But like that, that's that's a real shame. If two
of those meetings aren't like useful Informationally, I didn't want to.
Speaker 1: Say Toci ask you this, how does the Jokic injury
actually impact how you feel about the Nuggets going up
against the Thunder, because it's not he's going to be
backed by the and if he's not, then we're having
like a whole different conversation. Yeah, but I think it
comes down to how much do you think seeding matters
when you're measuring the Nuggets versus the Thunder, Because if
they don't want to face them into the conference finals, it's, well,
we're better off finishing sixth than still trying to fight
for fourth or fifth. But I mean, if you're gonna
have to go through them anyway, I know it makes
the rest of the bracket you would prefer to avoid
them as long as possible, just because of what it
means for your other opponents. But I when I saw
I was relieved at the actual news. Right and now
with us out, it's okay, how far could they slide
down the standings? But that game against the Raptors was
at least slightly encouraging. My first thought was, I don't
know that it changes how I feel about the Nuggets
at all as title contenders, because if they're sixth, even
if they have to go through the play in. It's
not ideal, but you're gonna have to go through the
thunder anyway. You're either full strength or you're not.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, here's the thing. The home court I
think matters in some ways. It matters a ton, right
because they went to seven last year in the playoffs
and the Thunder had home court, and who knows, maybe
that decided it. But it also doesn't matter at all
because the Nuggets are not catching the Thunder right right,
like record wise, that's out. So you're gonna be the
lower seat anyway. So if you do have a conference
finals meeting or one sooner, you're like, it's it doesn't Yeah,
it's set. You're gonna be the road team, as Denver like, regardless,
it might matter. The seating stuff and the slippage with
with all these guys hurt might matter because maybe someone catches,
you know, the punt, one of those punchers chance teams
catches you around earlier. As from Denver's perspective, then you
wanted to and you're out before you even see the thunder,
like that's on the table, especially if like half those
guys that are out, you know, aren't ramped back up
or that seems like a long way off, but like
maybe there's lingering something or you if it's a hamstring,
maybe that leads to a groin or whatever like that.
That's all someome to think about. But I don't know.
I think just based on last year's postseason, the two
and two record during the last regular season between Denver
and okase, like you have to take the Nuggets as
seriously as anybody as threats to the Thunder. But it's
just what version of the team are we talking about,
Like the one that exists today is going to lose
by one hundred if if they're fully healthy. Theoretically, this
Denver team is better than last year's team, which pushed
the Thunder far right. So I think it's just it's
speculative because we haven't seen them meet up this year.
We might not see that until the spring, and you know,
keeping make the case of the Thunder or all so improved.
So I just don't want to discount the Thunder, but
we did need to kind of put them aside because
they haven't played yet this year.
Speaker 1: Right, And I think a lot of what would have
held true in that Denver series still holds true now.
And there was I can't remember if it was Game three,
but it felt like they found them solves for shake
Gilgi Alexander to where if they would more liberally switched
Jamal Murray onto him, and then you have Christian Brown
kind of in like the foe zone or whatever. I
do wonder now that Michael Porter Junior canto Ony the
low man stuff, does that impact them at all? But
you still have positional size if you want to control
the glass. I think you can point to and say offensively,
Aaron Gordon was just the best three point shooter alive in.
Speaker 2: That series apparently.
Speaker 1: But you look at what Jamal Murray shot from three.
What Michael Porter Junior at that time we're shooting from three.
He was dealing with the shoulder injury. It feels like
with Spencer Jones and we're just gonna assume that he
gets converted and as eligible to play, and should they
keep Peyton Watson past the trade deadline? Having Christian Brown
Aaron Gordon to me kind of feels yolkic is the
skeleton key for everything.
Speaker 2: But Aaron Gordon feels if I.
Speaker 1: Don't know if it's an X factor or whatever, but
you're not to me, you're not winning that series without
Aaron Gordon because I feel you could use him to
a bunch of different things.
Speaker 2: You need someone to maybe turn.
Speaker 1: The water off on j dub We saw him do
that a lot in that series last year too, or.
Speaker 3: Shae really like that's not an advantage for the Thunder
if Gordon gets switched on to Shay Like, I think
that the Nuggets should want that.
Speaker 1: And I so, And I think just Denver's ability and
against the Thunder its different, but Denver's ability to be
able to draw fouls with Jokic and Murray because of
how aggressive Okay see is, you know they're going to
foul a ton. But the other thing is, relative to
most teams against the Thunder, they're also not going to
turn the ball over a ton because like Murray and
Jokic specifically, they're going to be pretty low turnover and
I think they ended up actually of the playoffs having
the lowest turnover rate against the Thunder of any team.
Okay se faced, so it was still higher than normal.
I kind of think there's been We've even had the conversations,
is this the championship caliber defense? The health is it's
just a given. I kind of think people are sleeping
on the Nuggets relative the to in the who's the
biggest Thunder. I've seen the Rockets pop up a lot,
but they feel like to me, they're they're just in
this discussion if we if we didn't have the Jokic
injury or should I say the big val injury as
the news trigger here, we would still absolutely be talking
about the Nuggets. And I think I don't know if
they're better set up to beat okac it really then
last year.
Speaker 2: I guess if you what would be the case.
Speaker 1: For why they would be better built to beat OKAYC
than they were because a lot of the stuff just
feels the same, even though some of the personnel hash.
Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, that's a good question. I think I
think you'd start. You have to just mention they've got
like three usable bench guys that maybe they didn't have
last year. I think you'd also say the three point
shoot Denver, so Denver's the best three point shooting team
in the league this year. The volume still isn't maybe
where you'd like it to be, and you might I'd
sit and the Thunder just have always given up a
lot of threes and a lot of corner threes. That's
just part of the thing. So like if then if
the Nuggets are better equipped to this season to take advantage,
Like okay, so he's been top five and opponent three
point frequency three years running, so like you're gonna you're
gonna get threes against the Thunder because they shut everything
else off. And like if you just are a better
shooting team sort of paradoxically without Porter Junior there, but
the numbers are what they are. Maybe that's a way
that you can steal a game or two. You win
the math game that way, the three more than two thing,
and you don't turn it over, which is like if
the Thunder in the past, we've seen the Thunder. If like,
if you make the Thunder play in the half court more,
they they go through droughts and if you cannot turn
it over and let them get out and run and
build twelve point leads on like breakaways, you know that
that gives you the that gives you the shot you need.
So maybe Denver in those two ways might might have
a better chance, But like, how much better does Denver's
chance need to be? If they came as close as
anybody last year of beating them, So, I mean, it's
again it's hard to hard to like be really firm
with any of this because the two teams haven't played yet.
But it's it's not like it's not a shock if
the Nuggets eliminate the Thunder from a playoff series. I
don't think.
Speaker 2: No, I don't think it would be a surprise.
Speaker 1: The final question I have, would you try just because
we haven't seen it hardly at all? I think they've
played like fifty possessions or something like that, is there
a case to go three big against the well, it's
too big with Val and Yokic if they're healthy and
then you still have Gordon on the floor or can
that not even be a consideration where your the thought
process is we're going to try and just bludget Oklahoma
City to death.
Speaker 3: It's definitely a lever i'd pull if like I was
down oh two or something. You know, I don't know,
if I don't know if I come out.
Speaker 2: That's the nicest way of saying no.
Speaker 3: Well, what realistically, like, how much utility do you think
that type of lineup would have? Like what I get,
I mean, it makes sense because there will be other
teams we talk about where it's like, Okay, the way
that this works for beating the Thunder is offensive rebounding,
second chance points like that kind of thing. So it's
like your right to suggest something like that, and Gordon
makes it so you're not giving away as much as
you otherwise would perimeter defense wise. But like, if I'm Denver,
I'm trying to beat you with hopefully my healthy starting
five and I'm gonna beat you shooting threes first and
with Jokic being unsolvable second, you know, like reverse those actually,
but yeah, you think you're gonna have to try stuff.
If you're gonna be the Thunder, you're gonna have to
try stuff.
Speaker 2: Hashtag tries hind underscore ninety.
Speaker 1: In the chat, Brown close to a return question mark
I think Zach Lowe said Aaron Gordon and Christian Brown
could both be back within the next couple of weeks.
Speaker 2: And I think Gordon.
Speaker 1: To me is huge because the Nuggets have actually there's
only been I don't I think they've only played like
eighty minutes or something together. But the Murray Gordon minutes
without Jokic this year have actually gone really well, only
forty four minutes seventeen point three net rating and so
that'd be big. But yeah, what don't you think though
you mentioned this when we were building our top five
defense with only six foot five inch players, are you
worrying about Jokic not being able to solve Alex Caruso
plus help plus.
Speaker 3: Jadeb on the back line in our configuration? I well,
I picked Caruso as the guy in an exercise we
did to guard Jokic, and that the implication was like
also plus help, So I have to give that a
little bit of thought. But like, don't you also think
that Jokic has now seen this once for a playoff
series and it's just like the beautiful mind graphics are
going up and he's just solved it all already.
Speaker 1: There's I mean, this does apply to the thunder. Is
there any inkling of Nikola Jokic is just gonna get
like four or six weeks of rest in the middle
of the season now, And that could be absolutely terrifying
for playoff opponents because it's a I mean, if it's
actually just a calf strain, and it's like, is that
really the worst thing in the world for him to
get a break? And instead of the sorry hyper there's
been so many cap strains, but now there's so many.
Speaker 3: Hyper extensions of getting confused the cap strain, right, I.
Speaker 2: Think, yeah, is that the cover?
Speaker 3: Now?
Speaker 2: I'm not No, I won't go down there.
Speaker 1: I was like, NBA teams don't want to be investigated
for their injury reports. They say capstrain. Everyone's always can't
question that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, a lot of cap strains, too many? All right,
what's the next team you pick?
Speaker 1: I feel like we need to talk about the Spurs now. Okay,
Rumor has it they've played pretty well against the Thunder
this year. I think I think, honestly, well, it's not. Honestly,
Wenby does have a ton to do with why they're
so good as being able to just basically have him, oh,
if you want him to be on a big or
if you want him to roam. I think it was
thinking Basketball had a great breakdown about how san Antonio
is doing a lot of just pre switching and Wemby's
pointing it out so that he can continue to roam
around the basket, and you're seeing it materially impact the
shots that the Thunder are taking. The Thunder are shooting
when Shay is on the floor with Wemby on the
floor forty seven point six percent on twos.
Speaker 2: When Wemby's off.
Speaker 1: The floor and Shay is on the floor, there should
be sixty two point one percent on twos. And so
Wemby is just able to to buck stuff up and
he's going to materially change just their frequency with which
you're even able to get at the rim. And so
the Thunder are not a high volume rim team. Thirty
point eight percent of their shots come there. I think
that's seventeenth in the league. That number drops all the
way to twenty two point two percent against the Spurs
so far this year.
Speaker 3: This is yeah, just a point on that. Sorry to
jump in. Two of the Thunder's three lowest rim aitem
frequency games this season have been against the Spurs. It's
just like it's a fact the Spurs, with Wemby especially,
just you don't shoot at the rim as often Wemby.
Speaker 2: On a minutes limit two.
Speaker 1: Well, here's the other thing is whether he's playing thirty
seven minutes a game or something in the playoffs. But
what I think is, and now it's starting to receive
tension is with the exception of Steph Castle, I mean
they have all Steph Castle.
Speaker 2: Devin Vessel, Dylan Harper, Darn Fox.
Speaker 1: All of those guys can get downhill, all of them,
almost all of them are very low turnover and seem
totally fine to handle pressure on the offensive end, and
so they're able to put Oklahoma City in rotation more
than most other teams would. And it's yeah, okay, maybe
some of the finishing. If it's Daron Fox, Oh is
he finishing as well during this week of a stretch.
Maybe not, But his ability to score from different levels anyway,
and the fact that all of them at Vissell.
Speaker 2: Maybe close to a liability.
Speaker 1: But just Daron Fox, Dylan Harper, and Steph Castle are
not guys that you can actively pick on on the
defensive end. And even Dylan Harper beat just as a
rookie and not having a ton of intel on him
before he's coming into the league. Had just a few
plays against the Thunder to where's he made this huge
three and he was pressuring the ball and forced the
turnover before or the Thunder even crossed the timeline. I
can't even remember if it was on Shay or j
dub who he forced to turn over on whatever that
is no other team has Wemby but now you compound
it with if you're looking for a roster that's stocked
with a bunch of dynamic on ball guys who can
get downhill and either spray or make some difficult attempts
at the river just aren't gonna be phased whether they're
operating from a dead stop or in transition by Oklahoma
City's defense, in part because who's the shortest.
Speaker 2: Of those guards? Is it the Aaron Fox and he's
six three?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, and certainly like Harper and Castle both
play bigger, but yeah, I think it's probably Fox.
Speaker 1: So that's just I don't know, No, we can throw
No other team has Wemby. But I think if you
threw Wemby out of the equation and they had a
normal all star big man or whatever, does any other
team have that type of dynamism across three separate positions
to go up against the Thunder with.
Speaker 3: You'd be hard I certainly not not while also having
the ball handling. I think it's like when the Thunder
play a lot of teams, it's a parent very quickly
that like this team just isn't. They're sped up immediately
and they never are able to like turn the throttle down.
The thunder of just chant put the game into a
state that like a lot of teams because of age,
because of ball handling issues, because of what athleticism issues are,
just like this this isn't for you, Like this is
this game is being played in a way, at a level,
at a pace that you're just like this is where
the thunder are good and you just can't stay there.
The Spurs are not one of those teams. The Spurs
very much. I'm just kind of saying what you said differently.
Between Castle, Harper, and Fox, you have three guys that
can just beat their man right like from a standstill,
three guys that can bring the ball up, three guys
that can punish pressure by getting past that first level
of wherever the pickup point is and getting the thunder
into rotation. And three guys that like just athletically are
not overwhelmed. Like even Fox, like we talk we oh
is he's slipping like he's an athleticism bassed player. How's
he gonna like? Fox right now? Is like he's very
very capable of playing at the athletic level. You have
to to like to kno get run over by the thunder.
So those three and like go down like Keldon Johnson,
very active like Keldon Johnson, will run into you over
and over until you get tired like he he's a
high motor guy. There's a lot of guys like Champagne,
Like those guys all are like are here for it. Yeah,
don't forget the unicornet. They're all capable of like just
not getting I don't know, like five minutes into a
lot of games the Thunder, when you see the Thunder
against just I pick a team, it's like the Thunder
have won this game already because they just the snowballs
already rolling down the hill with like three turnovers in
the first five minutes and break like the Spurs are
not that, but it like we've we've buried the lead
a little bit. I just think the Wemby piece of it.
If you pick the Spurs to be the biggest threat,
it's because of him. It's separate from the Guards, which
I think matters. But it's no, it's just like every
time I watched all those just every time I see
Wemby against the Thunder, all I can think about is
how the Thunder kind of it's almost like I don't
know the game's played at like different level. I've made
some version of this argument before, like the games played
at like different levels, right, and the Thunder at the
lowest level, like on the ground, like where all these
guards are flying all over the place, like you sort
of can't beat them there. But if you just move
the ball up a plane, like up above all of
that like nonsense, like above the cloud of dust that
everyone's created, Like I don't know, you're kind of a
but you're like figuratively above the fray. Like Wemby just
gives you the option to do that where he just
he plays he's dominating the level above the floor right
on defense and then on offense you throw it to him,
he can shoot over the top of any kind of
pressure you want to put on him. He makes. He's
like the kind of lob threat that you just sort
of can't account for because you can throw it higher
to like I don't know, it's kind of a hack thing,
but like the Thunder are going to beat you down
at their level, So try as much as you can
with all your guards and stuff to compete there. But
also like go up a couple floors and see what
it looks like up there. Because the Thunder are vulnerable
to size two guys that can shoot over the top,
like because lou Dor Alex Caruso great defenders, Jada great defenders,
like they're all guards and wings, you know. So I
think Chet has a role to play here, But Wemby
has kind of just kicked his ass like every time
they played. So I don't know I key about that.
Speaker 1: What I will say is the Spurs just having no
qualms about putting a smaller player on Chet is kind
of the fact that you don't want Wemby just glued
to check.
Speaker 2: Right, It's like kind of a problem, right.
Speaker 3: No, I think that's right, and like Chet may just
the next time they play, Chet may just punish that,
Like that's I believe a Homegron has a great player,
but right, like you can get away with that. I
just yeah, I think the combo to sum it up
unless you have more to add, like the combo of
guards that are like up to the challenge of playing
the way the Thunder want to play. And then wembya
is just like you guys don't have one of these,
nobody does we do? It just changes the dynamics.
Speaker 1: I should have asked this question about Denver and if
you don't have an answer, I could give it.
Speaker 2: So let's start with them really quickly.
Speaker 1: If you could add a player archetype to the Nuggets
at the deadline to make them better built the thunder
to beat the thunder, what would it be?
Speaker 3: It would be I'm worried this is gonna be my
answer for a lot of teams that we do this for.
I want give me like a Stephan Castle clone, like
I want. The archetype would be hyper athletic point of
attack defender in the back court that can can get
to the basket like I don't even know if I
need him to be a shooter like Christian Brown, super
chart with a better handle. I think so for Denver,
I think I might lean more towards I just feel
like defensively, if you have Aaron Gordon and Christian Brown
and Peyton Watson and Spencer Jones, you need to try
and figure it out with that if they get like
an Io Desumu, another ball handler aside from yok Because
who do you trust aside from Jokich or Murray to
handle Okayse's pressure on the ball.
Speaker 1: I don't think I haven't I don't have anyone it's
not Jamn Pickett. Yeah, so that would be for for
San Antonio, though I would do you think there's something
to getting more of like a bruising for next to
Wemby or is it because you could use Cornett next
to Wemby? But if if the Thunder do play Hartenstein
and Chet, is that maybe their pathway to being because
we saw now these teams, are you if you look
at the Knicks or if you look at Houston, those
teams are gonna be able to play more physical than
the Spurs can, at least their front lines are.
Speaker 2: It's a little different.
Speaker 1: When it comes to Oklahoma City because what is Hartenstein's
probably their most physical for like big frontline player. Is
that Would that be it for San Antonio? Or do
you want to have like a motion shooter or something
to give you another outlet on the offensive end.
Speaker 3: I just need the Julian Champagne that played the Knicks
and I'm good. I need I need the guy that's
a five alarm fire three point shooter. Basically I'm talking
about on the on the Spurs. So yeah, no, I
don't it's tempting to say size they're bulk. Bulk is
the better because they have size. But I think I
just want the shooting. I think I think that's that
that matters more to me, because like Harper, you know,
as it's coming gone, Castle is gonna get left alone.
Fox even is like, I don't feel great whenever Fox
shoots a three. So if you're gonna have those three
guys are so critical, well.
Speaker 2: What about when? What about when Julian Champagne he's able
to hit eleven?
Speaker 3: That's what I'm saying. If you get Nick against the Knicks, Champagne,
you're good. I just I is he gonna what was
it eleven? Did he hit eleven? There was eleven?
Speaker 1: I know that the way Tyler Kollak was against guarding him,
even though he was on fires.
Speaker 3: On Tyler, are you out?
Speaker 1: Oh no, Tyler. Tyler Kolak is like the goat. He's
gonna be on the nixt Mount Rushmore.
Speaker 3: That would have been a hard pivot last time.
Speaker 2: What is the next team you would like to discuss?
Speaker 3: Uh, let's let's do the Rockets one to zero against
the thunder this year?
Speaker 6: Uh?
Speaker 3: Plus four point that? So no problems here? Why are
they a threat to me? This is the offensive rebounding
thing like, So the Thunder don't get second chance points.
They're bottom three in the league. They also have been
pretty good at limiting opponents second chance points, but not lately.
I forget who had the stat but they're basically losing
three points three second chance points per game by allowing
too many offensive rebounds and not getting enough of their
own and not doing enough by the one with the
ones that they get. The Rockets are the best offensive
rebounding team in the league. You talk about size and bulk,
they will deliver that in greater quantities than any team
the Thunder are likely to face. I can't I can
envision a scenario where it's like Steven Adams is in
there with Shane Goon. I don't know how you're defending
in the in those setups, but you're getting too two
three cracks every time down just because you're getting all
the offensive boards. You can turn it over if you
want to, if which the Rockets do and will, but
that's gonna not kill you because you're getting several shots
every possession. It's not it's not like a complicated sort
of way forward, but it is the most obvious one
for Houston, and I think too I mean maybe I
don't know if what you were going to talk about here,
but like between like Thomas Shepherd and Durant and Reed Shepherd,
there's enough like shooting slash athletic dynamism slash playmaking. There's
like enough offensively to where you know Durant is still
gonna be able to shoot over whoever you put it.
There's other ways I'm curious besides the offensive rebounding unless
you have more on that, like what you'd look for
from Houston as a reason to believe.
Speaker 1: Well, I think yeah. So one of my biggest questions
was do we buy their first chance offense? And it's
nothing you could say they might have enough dynamic options,
but nothing with their offense feels easy. And I go
back and forth. I sat here thinking about this last night.
Does that make you feel better or worse about Houston
going up against the Thunder? Because so Houston as a backstory,
they're twenty eighth in the percentage of their jumpers that
are like uncontested, and so they're not creating particularly easy
looks relative to other teams. You're not gonna get a
ton of easy looks against the Thunder. And so if
you're used to that. Is there something to it or
does it make you just more worried because then you
are maybe so reliable because look, their first chance offense
ranks in the top five this season. That's why it's important.
It's not this is not last year or I think
it might have been seventeenth or something. So the offensive
rebounding I think absolutely matters. But they do have between Shepherd,
Kevin Durant, and even Shane Goon, like you get them differently,
and he hasn't been as efficient as you'd like them
to be. Like those are guys who will hit difficult shots.
That's having the I don't want to call him a bailout,
but having Kevin Durant, who if you want him to
put the ball on the floor now, I think he's
probably uniquely vulnerable to the thunder. And that's where I
would get worried about Houston's offense is do you trust
You might think these guys can hit these difficult shots,
but who do you trust handling the ball against the thunder?
I think Shang Gun is just the answer right now.
And then read Shepherd's probably number two, which is again
it's fine. I just don't know how that stands up
the other question I kind of had, and you alluded
to some of the okac's own offensive issues before. The
way Houston's defense is designed, though, really intrigues me with
the way that they go up against the Thunder because
they are gonna concede three point looks and the Thunder
are just They're twenty first in effective field goal percentage
on wide open jumpers. They're also not looking to run
as much off of live rebounds. They're dead last in
you can talk about. I don't know how much the
non Shay minutes matter, but they're the twenty second percent
tile of offense without Shay that goes up to the thirtieth
percentile with Jay Dubb, it goes up to the forty
second percentile with This is in the half court forty
second percent tile with both j Dub and Chet. And
by the way, the other variable here is right now
Jayalen Williams, specifically for a team like the Rockets, feels
a little easier to defend. I don't know if the
rist is still bothering him, but he just looks like
he looks different, looks like he's moving different. He's shooting
forty percent on self created twos and seventeen percent on
self created threes.
Speaker 2: He is among the fifty.
Speaker 1: Players who are averaging five or more pull up jumpers
per game. Only John Morant is more inefficient on pull
up jumpers right now, that's kind of the like and
the way that the Rockets guard Specifically, You're gonna need
Jay Dubb to make stuff happen from the perimeter, and
I think j Dubb is a pseudo number long term.
I think he's a pseudo number one option. But that's
another kind of variable here for me.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's a good one. I think if
you're just kind of looking for more ways forward, there's
a different version of the physical advantages that Houston has
on the offensive glasses, Like Shangun can just put Chet
Holmgren in the basket, and if you're playing him with
another big I think you probably have Adams or I
guess maybe it'd be Capella on Hartenstein and vice versa.
So like, I think Holmgren probably is going to be
put in a position where because you can't who else
would you even use against Shangoon If you can get
the ball into him from at the elbow and he
can do his like nonsense flailing and spinning stuff, and
or even if you get deeper position, I could just
see and that's where the volleyball on the glass starts is.
Shangun gets like a close range look that maybe doesn't
go in. I think he's a real problem for the Thunder,
especially if it's Homegron that has to guard him, because
Shangoon is shown like how many guys have put Wemby
in the basket like it. Shangoon's done it like that.
He's one of the few guys that can just it
doesn't matter if you're longer and have you know, our
great shop block, and he'll just get into you, I
think too, like athletically again, and and like trying to
find teams that like aren't just gonna get run over
like Thompson Eason, even Sheppard to some extent, like maybe
Finny Smith rounds into form. I don't feel like the
rockets are gonna get They're not gonna be just blown
off the floor by the thunders defensive intensity and pace
and stuff. So that's smaller things. But there's again, I mean,
the rockets beat them already, so there's something there.
Speaker 1: And that was before reach Sheepherd was reachepperd.
Speaker 3: They're gonna win by one hundred.
Speaker 2: Now, next team, let's do the Timberwolves.
Speaker 1: They've also just recently beat the Thunder and they're just
I feel like we should only have the Minnesota Timberwolves
play top five or ten teams in the league, right
because those objectively just feel like the only games they
get up for and don't. I don't know what it is,
but it feels like I've read so many or watched
so many postgame comments of yeah, we just didn't have
the energy tonight and it didn't get coming up. Maybe
it's time, like does Chris Finch just need to get
ejected in every single game? So what's interesting here too
is they are another team where I think that you
can throw good positional size at the Thunder because of
Rudy Gobert, of Julius Randall, you have Jane McDaniels, Anthony Edwards.
I don't actually and maybe a lot of this has
to do with the way the Thunder have played offensively,
particularly of late. I don't worry about Minnesota's defense against
OKAC too much, like because Rudy Gobert is still able
to not the same level of deterrent as Victor Wimenyama
is like, no, I mean, no one is to be fair,
but the Thunder are not getting to the rim. So
if they've played one hundred and forty two minutes with
Rudy Gobert on the floor and oh this is from
looking at last year, but since last year with Rudy
Gobert and Shake Gilders Alexander on, the Thunder just don't
get to the rim and anywhere near a league average
clip when Rigo Bert is there, I think that's a
pretty big deal. They're shooting not the best clip at
the rim during those minutes either, fifty seven point five percent.
That's actually incredibly low. So I don't worry about between
him having Jane McDaniels and we know what Anthony Edwards
will do in that type of a series, and if
they want to go due a big that might even
favor that might make it easier for Julius Randall on
the defensive end to where if you downsize and where
Randall's going to be playing against Smalls, I'd probably trust
him less there.
Speaker 2: This team just.
Speaker 1: Intrigues me against the I think first of all, they're
confusing as hell, because I don't trust them to keep
a lead in crunch time. They can be up fifteen
points heading into the final five minutes. I wouldn't trust
them and keep the lead. But if you have to,
like just draft like teams you want going up against
top five, top ten teams in the league. The Timberwolves
are up there. And what I don't know what to
make of is their offense because I don't think they
need I think Anthony Edwards just is their point guard.
Speaker 2: We saw it in crunch time.
Speaker 1: I think there was the comment from I don't know
who it was, if it was Julius Randall Orjohn Devincenzl
the other day to where the Wolves need to figure
out a way to keep everyone involved for a bulk
of the game, and then it needs to be ant
show down the stretch and like finding that balance might
be something that they've struggled with. He's just going to
be that guy, whether it's down the stretcher, like throw
out over the course of the game. Even I think
it's But at the same time, I look and say, well,
do I trust anyone on this team to handle the
ball against Okac's defense, And then how do you I
think Rudy Gobert so valuable on defense to Minnesota, what
does he look like offensively against this Thunder team is
where I would be super concerned in the playoffs. And
so that's what I can't wrap my head around. And
we forgot to ask this question about Houston. So we're
just gonna backtrack each time. What's the archetype if you're
the Rockets of player that you would say, hey, I
want to go trade for just to beat the Thunder
in this series.
Speaker 3: Don't you think they need another ball handler? Because if
we're worried about Durant and Thompson and like Shepherd, who
knows Shepherd should be okay, but like I worry about
just keeping possession of the basketball like a little bit
uh against like the pressure of the Wallaces and Dorts
and Carusos and even SGAs of the world.
Speaker 1: I think you're right the name that it came to
me because I just he wouldn't be he's smaller, but
he can rebound in defen was Peyton Pritchard would be
like an ideal Gave. I don't know in a Thunder
series maybe not though, but.
Speaker 3: Well the shooting, you get the shooting too that you
stretch the floor A little bit back to Minnesota though.
Speaker 1: What I wanted to ask you, though, is if it
was the Wolves, what is your biggest pain point for
them against?
Speaker 3: Okay, say, well you got you were getting to it.
I do think defensively, they're very well equipped to to
stay in games. They're four and by the way, Minnesota's
four and three over the last seven games against the
Thunder dating back a couple of years. I haven't looked
it up, but I bet you nobody else has been
better than that, just based on how good the Thunder
have been.
Speaker 2: Well, the Spurs now have three wins.
Speaker 3: Well that's true, but I don't know. They still might
not be better. Did they get one last year? Maybe
it's the offense. And this is a concern about the Wolves,
whether you're playing the Thunder or not. Like I think
it is true that Edwards needs to be controlling things
at the end of games, but like one at the
same time, one of my biggest I don't know concerns
I guess is that the Wolves seem to live and
die laid in games, and often die based on how
many difficult jump shots Edwards can make over contests like
you think of the highlights, like the three he hit
in the corner to send that game to overtime. He
just like he's gonna make He's gonna make or miss
really hard shots, Like what's the last really easy Anthony
Edwards late game bucket you can remember. I'm sure Wolves
fans are like, well there was this. I don't remember
a lot, And that's great that you have Anthony Edwards
because he's gonna make more of those shots than most.
But the thing is, if I'm the Thunder, I'm doubling
him immediately because I don't even want the chance that
I just get beat by a hero shot. And then
Edwards has it laudably I think shown a willingness to
get off the ball in those situations, like he will
just make the obvious outlet pass when doubled. And then
what like is Dante DiVincenzo making the play here on
offense against the Thunder Layden games? Is it?
Speaker 5: Is it?
Speaker 3: Jade McDaniels like, it is it Randall that you're trusting? Like,
I think scoring on the Thunder is gonna be really hard,
and especially Laden games, which if you're a Wolf's fan
you're like, yeah, Layden games, it's always hard for us.
So that's where that's the issue to me, like very clearly,
I think because defensively, I think you're right like between
McDaniels and Edwards and then go Bert on the back
line and just size like that's about as good as
you can hope to do.
Speaker 5: Right.
Speaker 1: I feel even better about them if I know he's
dealing with a left ankle injury. This seemed like if
Arren Shannon Junior was who I thought Aryn Shannon Junior
was gonna be this season.
Speaker 3: Just another guy who can move like, yeah, that plays
at a high energy level. That kind of thing matters.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just wonder how much would so they've been
linked to. Kobe White is the name that's been thrown
around a lot for them where and I think, by
the way, I think that's the right type of name,
at least veering away from I've seen a lot of people.
They need to point guard, they need to point guard
four general for general, I don't they don't need the
next Mike Conley. I guess it would be important, Like
setting up Gobert would be great, But if this is
gonna be aunt show anyway, you want someone who's probably
more gives you the spacing and just like the combo
guardom Okay.
Speaker 3: Yes, I mean, but Mikil Alexander Walker would be great,
would he wouldn't he? Dan? When that that's exactly who
you need, this version of him.
Speaker 1: Man, they could have kept him too, So I've arrived
that they fucked it up.
Speaker 3: It should have been Alexander Walker instead of Reid, like
if you had well, I know it wasn't as simple
as that, but like if the Alexander Walker is a
better player, like he's I mean, he's just defensively nothing
off the table does hasn't missed a corner three that
I've seen once this year. I'm sure he's shooting one
hundred percent from there. Like that's that's who we That's
who you want. That you just said combo guard, Like
that's that's who they need. It's crazy.
Speaker 1: I just don't nas Reed still feels important. I keep
coming back to. As good as he's been for this season.
I wonder if Julius Randall was the player that they
should have planned to Well.
Speaker 3: That's maybe that's that's a more interesting question.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, but that you know, and I want
to be respectful and say that this is kind of
in the vein where it's you can't you know, Trey
Young can be good, but just like the fit, you
don't know if you love that. And so that's what
I'm kind of at with, Like I'd probably rather have
if it was you could pick two of Nas Randall
and Nikkil Alexander Walker, I probably would have went because
neither Nas or Julius Randall's gonna be your center of
the future anyway. So you get more passing with Randall
for sure, and there's he has more of that girth.
But yep, but again hindsight, whatever that's done. Do you
think though, if they went after that type of a player,
let's say they can add someone who will make you
feel better about being able to attack, Okay, ces defense?
At what cost does that come to their own defense?
Because Kobe White, that's somewhere you have to cover up
for all the names because and there are somewhere you
could what do we say now, Grant split the baby,
because that's not a harrowing thing to thing about. I
would you soon move But he's not getting you those
frum scratch jumpers. And how much do you trust him
handling the ball against? Like I don't know who the
in between name or even who the perfect name non
star division of course, would would actually be Well.
Speaker 3: Aren't we talking about someone that should would close for
the for the wolves right in this? That's how I'm like,
because when you said Kobe White, I immediately was like,
I don't know if he's closing over Evencenzo? Uh maybe
would you could you know you're too small?
Speaker 1: Well, I guess the thunder could you close him over Randall?
That also, isn't that a question you need to ask?
Who do you want in the closing lineup?
Speaker 2: More? Because j mac Rudy and Ant are locks?
Speaker 3: Right? Would you prefer is pretty close to the lock?
Just because of the shooting?
Speaker 1: Like you can't like, well, right now, I think they're
closers right now? Are just I'm talking about if you're
making a trade and the idea is we need a closer.
Who is the player you're looking to upgrade from or replace?
Speaker 3: I mean, are we coming back to? I mean Devincenzo
feels like it should be him, but Randal is someone
like what if this isn't gonna happen? This, this can't happen.
But it's like if it's Trey Murphy in Randall's spot
and your forwards are McDaniels and Murphy, Like we're not
talking about quite the same level of like how are
we going to score questions? If that's what it looks like, right,
because the spacing's better, the shooting's better, you're more athletic,
you're smaller. But it's not like Randall. I guess Randall. Yeah,
Randall's size does make a difference. But if go bears
on the back line, I think you can get away
with rangier forwards next to him. McDaniels can play up.
I don't know something like that. I guess just if
we're trying to figure out how to solve the offensive
problems late you have a guy that like cannot be
left for a second in Murphy, that would maybe make
it so you can't get away with doubling the ball
out of Ant's hands all the time. Maybe that's the guy,
or that's the the issue. It's like, who can you
add to this team that in late games makes it
at least a question of should we double edwards and
get the ball out of his hands? Like who's that?
Speaker 1: We are?
Speaker 2: We are we talking about a star at that point?
Speaker 1: Because do you think that the thunder gonna let's use
Kobe White feels just the contract situation, maybe realistically the
best player.
Speaker 3: Sure they could get up to make you change your thinking.
Speaker 2: Would one of the what have they been calling them?
Speaker 1: The I can't even remember now, so I don't want
to butcher it, but any if you could just get
any of the three guards who are available, Lamello, Jaw, Trey,
who's the one that makes.
Speaker 3: Like the South something Southeast something Trinidad?
Speaker 2: Is that what it is?
Speaker 3: Trinity Southeast?
Speaker 1: Don't if anyone remembers what John Hollinger has been calling them,
that would be great.
Speaker 3: Lamello, joh and Trey is who we're talking about.
Speaker 1: And it's really just Lamello or Jaw because the salary
matching for Trey is by Rudy Gobert or by Julius.
I don't know if the Hawk would want Julius random.
Speaker 3: I mean, the thing is like that I don't like,
I don't love that type of player because I do
kind of want and to have the ball. And if
you had Jaw or LaMelo is different. LaMelo maybe the
shooting makes it more like viable, but if it's Jaw,
it's just like, well, we're taking the ball out of
Ant's hands by necessity because jaw has zero off ball
value and he will not be guarded, you know, So
I how much is that helping?
Speaker 2: What about Michael Porter Junior?
Speaker 3: So that's kind of like the Trey Murphy move right
where it's like five alarm fire away from the ball.
If you do double the ball out of Ant's hands,
it takes two passes to get its MPG. Or there's
driving lanes open because somebody's hugged up on him and
you're in a four on three like that kind of
shooter New Egg Dan shooting is important. I don't know
if we've discussed that at all over the last decade plus.
Speaker 1: Right, Man, I'm trying to like, would Wiggins or Norman
Powell Tyler hero is probably too rich for what they
could honestly, could they get if if Brooklyn was willing
to take Julius Randall, couldn't they get to Michael Porter
junior somehow? Or is Brooklyn looking for a guaranteed first
round pick right now?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 7: Right?
Speaker 3: What's the what's Minnesota got to trade?
Speaker 1: Pick wise swaps and Rob the flyer on Rob Dillingham?
Speaker 4: Maybe?
Speaker 1: I mean Tarren Shannon Junior is interesting honestly, I do.
Speaker 3: I do like the idea of a front court shooter.
I like it a lot for them.
Speaker 1: I've given Michael Porter Junior to Minnesota less than zero
thought until now, and I think I just all of
a sudden might be all in on it withoutout giving
it more than a service level because Julius makes thirty
point nine and MPJ is at where is he at
this season?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 1: He's at forty? I mean Conley Bridge is the difference?
Can you include something to.
Speaker 3: I think doesn't Dillingham Bridge the difference are pretty close
to it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but the Wolves can't take back more money. So
but you could include a third place So Dillingham, Tarren
Shannon and Randall for Michael is that too much? I
might do it. I don't know where Minnesota's out and
Rob Dillingham, because I'm all the things were saying right
now is they were probably thinking that he could be
the guy that would be at least the offensive antidote
to what a team to the pressure that a team
like the Founder could provide.
Speaker 3: I mean, man, what a high bar. Though in hindsight,
right because like now, part of the reason we don't
love another guard here is that it takes the ball
out of Ant's hands. So, like, what kind of player
would Dillingham need to be to just to like to
justify the vision of him being a I don't know,
I think we're like I don't know that Minnesota envision
Dillingham as a closer next to Ant, but like he's small.
He would have to shoot the shit out of it.
He would have to be so good as a creator
as to justify Edwards not having quite as much. Yeah
on ball time, like that, that's a great player. Like,
I don't know, I would say, like Jeremiah Fears is
way closer to being that type of player than Dillingham
is or was, But like even Fears is like he's
not going to be there for a long time if
he ever gets there, right, Like, it's just it's tough
to justify that trade the further away we get from it.
Speaker 1: Mel says they were hoping for a Kyrie clone, not yeah,
I mean.
Speaker 2: Kyrie were doing it. Yeah, that that would do it.
Speaker 3: Now what you have my attention?
Speaker 1: Now, Hey, is he available? Did I come back after
the All Star break?
Speaker 3: That's a Randall salary match, right? What does he makes
in the low thirties we could get there.
Speaker 2: Who is the.
Speaker 1: Next team you want to talk about? I think we're
on to the East. Do you have any West teams
that you need to I.
Speaker 3: Think we are that so I don't know how much
it matters what order we go in here. Let's let's
just take uh and these will be quicker, I think,
because do it the reasons it will become obvious.
Speaker 2: Let's let me ask you.
Speaker 1: Let's start here, who is your biggest threat to the
Thunder in the Eastern Conference.
Speaker 3: This is so that the teams were thinking, should I
just lay out that the three options?
Speaker 6: No?
Speaker 3: Just no, no, okay.
Speaker 2: So I want you to know.
Speaker 1: People to know maybe they think they're team you know,
if you're maybe you're a Wizards fan, think of the
Wizards's It was so hard.
Speaker 3: So there's three that I'm considering. I think there's a
good argument for each of them, but they're very different.
I will say, the biggest threat to the Thunder in
the East. Why not is the New York Knicks?
Speaker 2: Checks in the mail?
Speaker 3: Yeah no, I've mostly just said that so I could
see like what your face would do. You didn't just
fall over, so I guess I guess it wasn't as
So the case for the Knicks is a lot of
the same logic as Houston applies here. You could maybe
win a game or two just because of the offensive rebounding,
assuming Mitchel Robinson can make it through. I'm thinking like
playoff series context, and we're in the finals. By the way,
it's good job Nicks if we have to actually think
about this. Good job anybody we talk about from.
Speaker 1: So Dan is running bear chasted through the streets.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you're not here anymore. Tyler Collack has actually been elected.
They did a recall election. Tyler Collock is the mayor
of New York. Now, so Mom, Donnie didn't last very long.
It was fun, but it's it's Tyler Colex town.
Speaker 2: All those billionaires just vacated the Big Apple so they
had tap col.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I don't know what to do beyond the because they
haven't played obviously, none of the three East teams we're
going to talk about have played the Thunder this year. Obviously,
the playoff records are non existent as well. So offensive
rebounding size inside and like you've got og, you've got bridges.
I don't know what you do with Brunson. Defensively, you
got I guess you probably put him on Dort and
just hope every he stays out of the way.
Speaker 1: At this point, put him on Crusoh my god.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Well, I mean what else you got with the Knicks?
Like what are if we're grasping at straws here? Maybe
that I don't want to dismiss the Knicks. I think
they've got a pretty decent playoff track record. Brunson is
a handful like this is you know, this is not
a totally pie in the sky thing, but like, beyond
the Houston logic, what the what gives the Knicks a chance?
Speaker 2: Well?
Speaker 1: I think just having the fact you might be able
to maintain the Houston logic while having because heart will
do a lot of the offensive rebounding two if he's healthy,
and so having mcale Bridges and ogn and ob as well,
you do have a lot of these.
Speaker 2: Shifty wings to move around.
Speaker 1: And I think while McHale Bridges is not the point
of attack defender that really that he's never been.
Speaker 2: But I guess with the Knicks thought they were trading
for anyway.
Speaker 3: I mean, Phoenix Phoenix Bridges was good. Phoenix Bridges was elite,
I thought, But that guy's long gone.
Speaker 1: I also think though, like for the cadence at which
Shaye plays at, you can use McHale bridges in that
instance because this is where he's gonna struggle. Is a
lot of like the guys who are doing like the
blow arounds around screens or like have the raw speed,
and Shade is just more deliberate about the way he
operates and even looks I was looking at last season.
The Thunder is a team average point eight seven points
per possession in the two games that McHale played in
against Oka, see like when he was defending Sga on
those pestionis as a team. And then you also have
you have oj og on J Dubb or do you
want to put him on someone so that he could roam.
Speaker 2: You could have Josh Hart on J. Dubb.
Speaker 1: And so I think that there's a chance that the
Knicks can build lineups where they match up fairly well
defensively against the Thunder. My caveat being with only one
of Jalen Brunson or Karl Anthony Towns on the floor.
And I think that's where I start to trip up
on the Knicks thing is because I'll use the Heat
as an example a team that for much of this
season has avoided setting ball screens like the Plague.
Speaker 2: When they have played the Knicks, they.
Speaker 1: Will just set ball screens to get in the Karl
Anthony Towns Jalen Brunson pick and roll actions, and I
could see the Thunder like the pain points the Thunder
could press on that are kind of just between him
and Jay between excuse me, J Dub and Shay would
be absurd. But I just don't even whatever type of
offense okhomos that he's trying to push for. The Jalen
bruns and Cornthony Town's minutes I think are potentially a
detriment there, But I don't know if it helps if
you're really not buying into like when the Thunder shooters struggle,
it feels like they're struggling. If J Dubb is still
just not super efficient, if Alex Caruso can go through
these extended ruts, lou Dort going through his own extended
rut like that would probably give them a chance. I
ultimately feel like their case to where I look at
Houston specifically, I look at the Knicks and wonder if
their case is too reliant on one of Houston's strengths
to where Now, if we're trying to look at those
secondary strengths for the Knicks, what I will get really
hung up on this is more of a weakness. But like,
do I trust their second best ball handler less against
the Thunder defense than I do Houston's at this point,
if we say al Pridge and Gun on the ball
against Okay, see who's second. Let's say it's Read Shepherd.
I think is probably the answer there. Do I trust
Read Shepherd more than Tyler Kolik? Or is it Bridges?
Speaker 2: Is it og?
Speaker 1: Is it town the In fact, I don't have an
answer here. Yea, if it's Jordan Clarkson, we've already lost so.
Speaker 3: A lot of the concer I think the Cat Brunson
piece of it is. That's just a Knicks problem like that,
and that would come up if we were analyzing their
chances against any you know, deep playoff opponent. Probably it's
like you just you just can't play those two guys
together because if another team gets them in enough pick
and rolls, just it's gonna be a cascade of points
and you can't come back from that. I don't know.
I guess the Thunder are probably more even more capable
of exploiting that than most other teams, so that like, yeah,
we're gonna we're gonna have to stretch here with some
of these East teams. Do you want to nominate the
second of our three East?
Speaker 2: Struggling?
Speaker 1: I'm struggling here because there's a team that I I
my head is saying one team, in my heart is
saying another.
Speaker 2: Should I go? Should I go head or heart pick?
Speaker 3: Uh, you're gonna I want you to go with your
heart pick, And I think I know who it is.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the Detroit Pistons.
Speaker 1: This is coming from someone who has the cat had
the Calves preseason coming out of the Eastern Conference, so
they're gonna feel snubbed, as they should. But I do
not trust Detroit's offense in the half board against Okay
see at all. It is Kane and there's basically nothing
else at this point, Like you just don't have the
shooting in Holland ANDSR Thompson. Can you play both of
those guys with Duran to really even maximize your defensive benefits?
They haven't played a ton together just yet, but defensively,
my god, you have Duran and Stuart and Holland and
Thompson and oh, by the way, you have Kane too,
who's just like you could field lineups to where there's
not a single defensive weakness on there and you just
one you.
Speaker 2: Just I don't know what to space. I mean, the
Holland Tsar Duran thing makes me uncomfortable.
Speaker 3: And then you're never gonna score, but you can go.
Speaker 1: You might as well try it though against the Thunder
at that point. And so from that perspective, I if
you were to strike lightning in a bottle, the Calves
feel as if they have a better chance of beating
the Thunder than maybe any team in the East. But
if we're looking trying to balance the floor and the
ceiling the Pistons defense with what the Thunder offense is
looking to do at least right now, and then you
factor in how much they have struggled on wide open
jumpers relative to the rest of the league, like this
is a team like maybe they could turn the thunder
over a bunch, or if they're just gonna be able
to control the glass, like if you don't have to
go up against a set.
Speaker 2: Thunder defense consistently.
Speaker 1: Because that's a concern about the Knicks too, is how
much will their offense have to go up against a
set Thunder defense because the Thunder were able to score
since their defense is kind of shaky and they've been
bottom ten over like the past month plus, Detroit, you
just don't have to worry about that. And you want
to talk about think about the number of fouls they're
gonna be called this.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I and I was thinking, obviously, Detroit
allows the highest opponent free throw rate by a ton,
so there's a there's a there's a way this goes
where Shay shoots seventeen free throws a game, and this
you know, none of this is close because the Pistons
just can't stop fouling.
Speaker 1: Who's more likely to fill out in this series, Isaiah Stewart,
Thompson or Jalen Durant.
Speaker 3: The Thompson because he's gonna be on one on somebody
that's gonna say yes, Yeah, I was about to say
stop it, Isaiah Stewart. But I think built into that though,
is a pretty clear indication that the Pistons are very
comfortable playing a style that the Thunder are comfortable. So
like again, I'm just looking for teams that aren't going
to be shell shocked right away, and the Pistons are
like they're they're here for the physicality and the the
up tempo, like they'll maybe not up tempo, but just intensity.
I guess that would be of these three options of
Nick's Pistons and team to be named later, although I
think you did mention them a second ago. I would
want to see the Pistons series most just because I
think Detroit would just be so gnarly and so like
so like more physical than even in the regular season,
just because that's like, well, that's our strength. That's what
we're going to lean into a lot of like the
Houston not the offensive rebounding so much, but like between
Duran and Stewart physical physicality wise, like You're and Thompson
and kid like all in Holland everybody we mentioned on
the Pistons is like not gonna be bothered by physicality
or the thunder as everyone sees even get bowling all
the time, like well they.
Speaker 1: Even be able to penetrate within fourteen feet of the basket.
Speaker 3: Like they're just gonna get held up in fact, like yeah,
it's it's gonna be It would be a man, it
would be a it would be a low score. It
would have to be a low score. Well, a lot
of free throws, though, I just don't know what this
series would look like. I know would be physical, but
I would want to see this most.
Speaker 1: You know What's interesting because I picked them before getting
the next team, I find myself thinking about we. I
guess I'm valuing more a team that can go punch
for punch with the Thunder defense rather than shouldn't I
be looking at, well, what offense can we be crack
this Thunder defense? And I wonder if I'm kind of
thinking about it backwards, because then the answer would be
the next team.
Speaker 2: But we did. We did it again.
Speaker 1: What would be the trade target archetype for the Knicks
that would make you feel better about them going up
against the Thunder.
Speaker 2: I think you could cut it. I think it goes
one of two ways.
Speaker 1: Is that it's either a ball handler or you need
another someone who could guard as the point of attack
that has more size than a deuce McBride.
Speaker 3: Oh, I was gonna say there's maybe a third way,
which is like, I don't know who this player is,
but another guy that can give you five out spacing.
But that isn't just a massive defensive liability, and I
don't know who that guy is, Like, if there's two
of them, Miles Turner like Andez from like a few
days ago when he was really good again.
Speaker 1: Ago, Well, Brandon Carlson's on the thunder Maybe they give.
Speaker 3: Them a call or there you go.
Speaker 1: Problem solved for the Pistons, though what I think we
know what the trade tart would be, but how would
you feel if they were to address.
Speaker 2: What everyone wants them to do?
Speaker 1: And so I think the names that are mentioned the
most with them are Lowry market In or Michael Porter Junior.
At this point, this sounds because Larry Marketen is a
seven foot but like if the Pistons traded from Michael
Porter Junior, I might be on board with the Pistons
against the thunder Way more than like obviously I'd feel
better about them in general, but I would be I'd
feel better about the Pistons against the thunder than I
would if they had Lowry Markin or maybe even not
more than trade Murphy. But like that's kind of the
like MPJ on the Pistons, I think would make this
just way more of an intriguing series. And that would
be in theory the benefit of you're not getting rid
of any of the players we basically mentioned. It's Tobias
Harris plus more money, and that's how you're using to
get MPJ.
Speaker 3: Yep, you're upgrade. You're getting someone that's better at literally
everything that you have Tobias Harris currently doing right. And
I think I do think on a team like the Pistons,
as we've gone through several times and listed all these
like just defensive and physical monsters, you can and this
is an MPJ necessarily, it's what you would have called
him last year, Like you can accommodate a specialist. MPJ
is apparently not that he's apparently more well rounded and
capable as an offensive player. But like if you've got
a four other guys that just guard and rebound and attack,
you could get away with one guy. I think that
you're not super confident in defensively, and even like you said,
MPJ did some good lowman stuff while hurt last postseason
for Denver, you could even I guess what I'm saying
is you could even have like a more niche guy
than MPG in that spot, Like if it was trying
to think of just who is just an absolute lights
out shooter that like you don't love doing anything else.
I don't know who that guy is anymore because they're
they're fewer and fear like I mean, I guess I'm
kind of describing Duncan Robinson. So maybe this is a
better on the team, you know what I mean? Though,
Like the Pistons don't need a perfect defensive superstar, you
know what I mean, Like it can just be a gunner.
Speaker 1: It's the same with because you can't say that about Denver.
You can't say that. I don't even think you could
say that about Minnesota. You could say about Houston.
Speaker 3: Maybe maybe maybe.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what we have a question from Andrew. Anyway,
Detroy could keep Tobias and add MPG, they would have
to give up Isaiah Stewart in that scenario to help
make the money work, and so I would say out avoid,
I want Stewart in the lineup again, you have Robinson,
but you still.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was gonna say done since now I want
to remove him from the team since I just described
him as what they needed. Yeah, he makes sixteen Yeah
you still have to Ivy's probably in that trade. You're
at like twenty seven million there.
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, Kris Lavert LeVert, you can get get there.
Speaker 2: You can get there.
Speaker 3: But that's exactly the kind of trade. It feels like
the Pistons have just said, like, we're not we're not
gonna do that. We're gonna trust what we have, We're
not gonna put picks on the table. We're not gonna
make that kind of move. Unfortunately. Like if I'm the Pistons,
maybe that's just great posturing, but this like continued professed
unwillingness to take a little bit of a swing. I don't.
I don't like it. I guess the verbiage is like
they'll there'll be an opportunistic but not a great I
think you can be aggressive if you're the Pistons. I don't.
I wouldn't mind it.
Speaker 1: Mike, you'd have to describe to me what aggressive means,
because if they don't want to give up three or
four first round picks to go get Trey Murphy or
Lowry market and I kind of understand, it's where it's, oh,
we don't have to give up as much to get MPJ.
Speaker 2: Maybe Trey Murphy.
Speaker 1: You could talk me into I'm not gonna lie if
you it was three first round picks and like a
young player of Sasser and j and Ivy for Trey Murphy,
whatever it ends up being, I probably do it just
because he's so cheap moving forward and you gotta pay
during worry about paying Nasar Thompson. But oh, this is
a good question. Would you trade Asar Thompson as the Pistons.
What if it was for Trey Murphy? So you're lowering
your pick equity. You still have Ron Holland.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would trade Ron. Can I do Ron Holland instead?
Speaker 2: Question?
Speaker 3: I Man, I don't think I would. And I think
that's because you if you're the Pistons, I don't think
I have to that's a little bit of a cost.
So no, I wouldn't to get there. I got other
ways to get there. You don't need to be that
Like you've got the picks, you've got the salary. I
would rather trade a bunch of picks because I think
if I'm the Pistons, All, okay, cool, you got the
twenty sixth pick in several drafts. Congratulations, Like I would
trade several picks before I would moved to Thompson, just
because I think there's a the best version of the
Pistons has Thompson on it and also huge caveat he's
not a complete liability as a shooter, like that's that's
apex Pistons is Thompson matures gives you something on offense
and his first team all defensive guy.
Speaker 2: Would you trade Ron Holland for trade Murphy?
Speaker 3: Yeah? I would, I think so, I like I think,
isn't it hard to imagine both of those guys playing
major roles on a good, really good Pistons team unless
one or the other becomes.
Speaker 2: Like this, like this Pistons team, I would say that.
Speaker 3: Well, I'm saying there's another level the Pistons could get to.
It's just those two guys have such similar limitations, right,
I just it's hard for me to imagine that. What's
the what's the precedent for that working?
Speaker 1: I do wonder though we're not that we're missing the point.
But also Trey Murphy, Lowry Market and Michael Porter, who
is who are you trusting with the ball aside from
Kate against the thunder defense?
Speaker 3: Uh, I don't mind Marketing because Market is just gonna
put it down and go straight line driving dunk. He's
not gonna like you're not asking him to make plays.
I guess is that is that the question like who.
Speaker 1: Do you who? Who would be your who would be
your second pick on the pistons? Right now, it's probably Karroslovert.
Do we think it's Donnis Jenkins?
Speaker 3: Like, oh, I forgot about him? Maybe I mean he's yeah, No,
I think that's.
Speaker 1: Saying none of the guys we mentioned, even Trey Murphy,
really address that part of a concern about there. They
might open up the floor, but I don't know how
much that's gonna do against like the thunder a gonna throw, Like,
I just who's gonna punish the thunder if they decide
to throw even three guys at Kate.
Speaker 3: Well, So I I think I think this is a
diferent situation than Minnesota because Gobert being on the floor
for Minnesota makes getting the ball out of Edward's hands
like if you throw it to Gobert on offense, it's
like win as a defense because he's gonna babble it,
he's gonna turn it over, he's gonna take it. So
like substitute Duran, who, Yeah, Duran's gonna just drive it
against the shifting defense and score or decent enough passer
with some highlights in there that I trust it a
star Thompson can pass like there. It's not the same penalty.
Even though this, I think strategically that you should still
just make someone besides Kate beat you. I don't think
the Pistons suffer as much as Minnesota might with that strategy.
And that was the last thing I wanted to say,
is like we haven't given until now given enough bandwidth
to like, how how do the Pistons score? Like the defense? Yeah,
sure they match up well physically defensively whatever. I do
think Kate is one of the hardest guys. It's not
like Luca level, but the comparison exists for a reason,
like one of the hardest guys to speed up. So
I think like you could throw, you can have Dort
try to beat the shit out of him. You can
have Caruso Crusoe and Caseon Wallace try to, you know,
get their hand on every dribble. I think Cad is
better equipped than almost anybody to just like, no, guys,
we're gonna this still is gonna happen at my pace.
I do think he's really really good at that and
gives the Pistons like I don't know again to use
it overuse term like the puncher's chance, because I don't
think you get Kaid to like he's gonna turn it
over because he does, but like I don't think you
force him into like this frenzied state that you would
see a lot of other ball handlers get into.
Speaker 1: No, but he also has the skill of being able
to kind of toggle where if like he needs to
play off of some live balls more faster that he might.
I just on the season, so we're not even talking
like they're eighteenth and first chance offense, and so I
just do you lean on Durren Stewart lineups to try
and offset that against the thunder.
Speaker 2: That's it's there.
Speaker 3: You make an aggressive trade. You make an aggressive trade.
Speaker 1: But don't trade not too aggressive though, because grantsar Thompson's
off limits can't tell this. Let's talk about the Calves, Okay,
don't in theory? Is this the team that you should
maybe feel not the not even the best about. But
we just talked about having I know they're bigger on defense,
but you want dynamic attack attackers on offense. Between mobiley
and even having a Sam Merrill and then Darius Garland
and Donovan Mitchell. Shouldn't we feel better about this team?
And having waited until now to talk about them relative
to the other their Eastern Conference brethren.
Speaker 3: Well, compared to the Pistons being the heart pick, they are,
they're the head pick. They're just like, well, they won
sixty four games, they haven't been healthy yet, Like we're
the pendulum swung too far towards the calves are cooked
all that stuff, Like.
Speaker 2: Yes, I why are a stat on that? Can you?
Speaker 1: Would you care to guess how many minutes that the
poor four on Cleveland has played the game?
Speaker 3: I actually knew this down to the possession like a
couple of days ago. And of course, because it's me,
I can't remember. It's like three hundred something possessions if that,
but I don't know what that is. Eighty one minutes? Yeah, nothing,
not a lot.
Speaker 1: And by the way, in those eighty one minutes, they
have a pretty damn good net rating twenty four point
three and a one thirty one point six offensive rating.
And so if you were to kind of reverse and
we've spent a lot of time with these teams talking
about like defense going up against defense, I sometimes wonder
is the way to reverse engineer. This is like, what's
the offense that in theory could stand the test of
the Thunder defense? And in the East specifically, it's Calves
are Knicks end of list, And I think what's our
problem with the Knicks is we're not gonna trust the
secondary creators Like Tyler Koley gives you a I'm being
dead serious here, gives you a different type of dimension.
But him against oh, like, they're not gonna guard him
from beyond the arc, and they might guard Jordan Clarkson,
but Jordan Clarkson might guard defend Jordan Clarkson off the
floor at that point. So the Calves just had like
an lest you believe that Darius Garland is just and
he's had better moments lately, Like is the toe going
to be fine? Can he generate the same kind of
speed and wiggle when he's on the ball?
Speaker 2: This is the team?
Speaker 1: Like, if you want to trust the offense in the East,
who is the what's the next offense that you would
trust to score against the Thunder?
Speaker 2: Is it Denver?
Speaker 1: I guess we're people gonna pick the Spurs now after
having watched those games.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, yeah, no, that's it. I don't. I think, yeah,
I think it's here. I think it's the healthy Calves
with all their best players in the game, Denver, New York,
and that's it. Like I don't know, I don't know
who else you'd even put up there. I think, Look,
it's easy to look at Cleveland's like general postseason disappointment
trend and then also cite like two small guards, like
the thunder is just gonna eat these guys alive, Like
that seems like, but then it's like, well, Donovan Mitchell
just shows up in every playoff series, and maybe that's
like maybe that gets you. I always look at these
as like how am I gonna get game? Like I'm
I think you get a Donovan Mitchell game where he
scores forty seven points and like that that's a win. Okay,
So now you need three more, Like I think Mobiley
and Chet like one or the other is the better
player back and forth on a given night, so you
kind of cancel each other out. I mean, so much
of this, well, maybe are we overlooking the importance of
all the other guys that Cleveland has been without this year?
You know, the big four are usually like non negotiable
strus balls coming gone? Who else am I I don't know.
Speaker 1: I assum Dan Wade has been pretty available his play
his uh right.
Speaker 3: Like they just I guess maybe you don't need quite
as much of that in a playoff series if we're
trying to imagine it, but you need some like what
is Mitchell breaks down every postseason Garland you know was
hurt last year, Like you're gonna need something there offensively, Yeah,
the best version of the Calves. I mean, didn't they
weren't they basically record setting last year, like as an
offense is the best we've seen, so so like that
has to be the.
Speaker 2: Playoffs they weren't.
Speaker 1: Thats been That's also been some I know they've been
banged up, but they after having just said that, they're
kind of just the champions of excuses to and I
mean that in the sense of they always can point to, well,
this is why we just didn't live up their expectations.
So maybe there is a little bit well is this
postseason proof? And then also what I'm thinking about it
too is we asked this question about every other team,
what's the sort of archetype of player that you would
want to add to them? The motion up against the
thunder and the fact that it's the answer has to
be overwhelmingly another wing defender who preferably doesn't kill your
offensive spacing.
Speaker 3: This is like a Wiggins sweet spot to me, I think,
or someone somewhere like that. Maybe Herb Jones, Yeah, I
very yeah similar. Jones is probably a better defender at
this point, but I think Wiggins might be still better offensively.
Speaker 2: Especially he's a better two way player for sure.
Speaker 3: If you need like because if you if you sell out,
if you just say, like, hey, Herb Jones beat us
versus hey, Andrew Wiggins beat us, Like Wiggins will get
to like it won't be great shots, but he'll get
to shots. I think, yeah, yeah, it's it's got to
be that because there's no you're unless you're gonna be
like get rid of Jared Allen and let's get like
a really big physical center next to mobile or no
no center next to mobile at all, like you're really
you're you're tinkering a lot.
Speaker 1: That would be the appeal of Wiggins, because I guess
Herb Jones is pretty strong, but like you could use
Wiggins at the because they've used Max Struce at the four.
But like Wiggins at the four versus DeAndre Hunter. Max
Drew's at the four is probably better.
Speaker 3: Wiggins like on Holmgren for example. I think Wiggins like,
he's okay there if that's what you have to ask
him to do.
Speaker 1: But I guess the benefit there is Wait, I honestly
I think against the Thunder, I might prefer to have
Wiggins with both bigs versus cause I think there's a
real conversation about is Mobley better off as the five?
But thinking about the Thunder being able to have Jared
Allen put like put him on who is it? I
guess it depends on if the Thunder are going to
a big or not. But put Jared Allen on the
worst shooter and have him play off might be the
way to go there. And so yeah, I think I'd
feel better about a Wiggans Allen. Mobily said, I think
for the Thunder series you need to not like dual
big lineup would probably be super important for Cleveland.
Speaker 3: So do you think it's still fair to say, because
talking through this it's been hard to differentiate. Do you
think it's fair to say though that none of these
three East teams present as big a threat to the
Thunder as I mean, any of the West teams we
went through. Or is that because talking about it, it's like, yeah,
the Cavs have a shot, Yeah, the Knicks have a shot. Yeah,
you know you can get there if you squint with
pretty much everybody. But so is the East still just
like we don't like, we don't like there odds as
much as any West team. Or is there a West
team you'd knock out below these East teams?
Speaker 1: No, if I had to out, I don't even know
who I would knock out. I feel inclined to say Minnesota,
but I just knowing what we've seen the past few
postseasons and how they get up against the good teams,
I don't even First of all, I don't even know
which East team I would put above the team kick
out is the problem?
Speaker 3: Right? Yeah, it's it's tough, may feel a little unfair.
The good news is like, I don't know, we're not
gonna We're only gonna see one of these teams from
the East against the Thunder at most, so we'll never
get it proved wrong.
Speaker 1: We had two people say this tongue in cheek and
the chatter maybe they were serious that they said the
Celtics with Tatum.
Speaker 3: Oh that's fun. I mean I still can't get there.
But but that's that's a that's a good dark horse one.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it would just depend too much. Okay,
what does Jason Tatum look like coming back from torn Achilles?
And then they'd still be I know, the Thunder aren't huge,
but they'd still be pretty small on the front line,
like Cada might not being there. Luca Garz like, I
just don't I feel like they're bigs in that matchup
might get eaten alive.
Speaker 3: I think I think that's true.
Speaker 1: So who Grant, mister Grant Hughes, who is your single
biggest threat to the Oklahoma City Thunder repeating his NBA
champions this year?
Speaker 3: I want to say Denver, but three wins is three wins,
and I have to say the Spurs because of the
whimby of it all, because of the guard depth, because
of the athleticism, because they can just kind of they
can play how the Thunder want to play successfully. But
it's just like it's the track record that like, I
don't know, maybe I'm a recency bias has really taken
over here, But I do think the Spurs have things
they can do against the Thunder that a lot of
teams can't.
Speaker 1: Because I am a twenty five year old adult today, yes,
I'm going to take the response what I think is
the responsible choice. And for all this, we spend a
lot of time just dissecting how defense matches up against defense.
I trust the Denver Nuggets offense to figure out ok
C's defense.
Speaker 2: More than any any team that we've just mentioned.
Speaker 1: And a lot of that is if you're looking at
what the Spurs were able to do, incredible and they
might be uniquely built to be a thunder foil, but
you're dealing with a lot of just what a Dylan
Harper and Steph Castle and even Wemby look like in
their first playoff series type stuff.
Speaker 3: That's why you're right. This is why you're right.
Speaker 1: That's the argument, and I think you also, even if
the Spurs are playing at their peak, no one, if
Nikola Jokic is healthy, no one is going to be
able to figure out the thunder defense better than him.
And this version of Jamal Murray that we've gotten this season,
maybe you want to see some different type of things
from him in the non Jokic minutes, Those non Jokic
minutes don't really fucking exist when you're going into the playoffs.
Speaker 2: At that point.
Speaker 1: And I think what's interesting about the Nuggets is I
don't view them as an elite defensive team, but I
think that the best lineups are their most important lineups
have the ability to really tread water. And we saw,
I mean it helps that we saw a kind of
proof of concept against the Thunder there. So my two
stipulations would be health with Jokic is just it's a throwaway.
If he's not healthy, doesn't matter, Like Aaron Gordon is
the feels like the second most important nugget ironically in
a Thunder series, and so if he's available, they're going
to be my pick.
Speaker 3: Well, and it should be understood that literally every one
of these Thunder threats has to be fully healthy or
it's or it's just like it's a non starter.
Speaker 2: Like, well, can I.
Speaker 1: Ask the question who is the second most important player
in a Thunder series on the Spurs?
Speaker 2: Wemby's won right for you?
Speaker 4: Uh?
Speaker 3: Yeah, of course, second most important player against the Thunder.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 3: I mean you probably should say Fox, but I'm really
tempted to say Castle just because he above all is
just like he's he's a thunder player, you know what
I mean, Like he he belongs on the thunder in
terms of like his athlass, physicality and defensive mindset and
all that stuff. I think you probably have to say
Fox because to tide your Denver pick, like Fox is
the only guy on this unless you're gonna say Harrison Barnes.
Really that like understands what the playoffs look like, understand
Like the reason my Spurs pick is dumb is because
really they're going from out of the playoffs to knocking
off a historic ending champion, like the Nuggets have seen it.
The Nuggets have been to where the Thunder have been,
like and I do I know it's like coach speaker
or not analytical at all, but like that just matters.
So the Nuggets have that experience and the Thunder and
the Spurs don't. So yeah, like I guess that makes
Fox the pick. Do you think it's someone other than Fox?
Speaker 1: On San Antonio, I really think you could make a
case for Julian Champenny's I think, honestly, I think you
could make it. Casso would be the one to make
the case. I was tempted to say Dylan Harper, just
because if you're looking for someone who might be able
to create something out of nothing, he's gonna be able
to after Fox, it would be him, and he's might
There's been moments where it's, oh, he's better defensively than
their Fox already.
Speaker 3: So yeah, well, and what's he gonna look like in
two months? Like I think Harper is one of those
guys that's just like he'll be an all star by then.
Speaker 1: Of all the guards, who do you trust you're getting
like thunder pressure at the basket, who do you trust
most to finish at the rim?
Speaker 2: It might already be Dylan Harper.
Speaker 3: Well, Castle will try. We know that Castle will just
try to dunk it from wherever he is or just
like fly into people. But Harper's finishing packages are just
like that guy's gonna be He's gonna be here already,
is one of the best like guard finishers. It's gonna
be at least aesthetically, but I think his conversion rates
are just gonna eventually be ridiculous.
Speaker 1: Well, we have successfully figured out our own biggest threats
to the Oklahoma City Thunder this season. It is now
time for it is stat padding time and grant. We've
got a lot of fun stat padding stuff. I'm excited
about today's stat padding. I'm not gonna lie.
Speaker 3: I'm nervous because of your excitement levels. It always is
the difficulty rating raises the more excited you are.
Speaker 1: I'm going to I think we should build up to
what I'm most excited about. So I'm going to start
you with the one that is still awesome, but that
I am least excited about, and we can work our
way up.
Speaker 2: So are you ready, sir?
Speaker 3: So ready?
Speaker 1: Rants Seven NBA players have at least five career triple
doubles in which they did not get ten assists. How
many of these seven players can you name? I will
give you three strikes.
Speaker 3: Triple doubles without the assists.
Speaker 1: They got it with steals or blocks plus rebounds in
points mostly all right?
Speaker 3: Well, uh I I mean kim O Lajahwan.
Speaker 2: That is correct. One of seven.
Speaker 1: He's tied, fun fact, tied for the most all time
with ten.
Speaker 3: So I will I think that's the We're gonna stay
in this vein here because I think the ten blocks
are just easier than the ten steals. So I will
go David Robinson, he is on the list as well,
third place with eight. I will seven strikes do Keim
Big Matumbo he is second all time with well, he's
tied for first. Excuse me ten, you got the top three.
That's impressive. Oh I want to I'm gonna I think
I'm gonna burn a strike here and guess. Oh actually,
I'll say I gotta throw a shack out there.
Speaker 2: You can that strike one?
Speaker 3: Damn it? Oh now, I'm not really hesitant to burn
my next strike. I'm gonna burn it anyway. Uh one,
Mark Eaton.
Speaker 1: He is tied for the so it's tied for fifth place.
There's seventh players. But he has six.
Speaker 3: Okay, so we got Eton Matmbo, Elajuan, David Robinson. There's
one other guy. I gotta get here.
Speaker 2: You have three more?
Speaker 3: Oh shit, I'm never getting three more. So I know
if we if we go all the way back to
eat So how about Sean Bradley.
Speaker 2: You're on fire. That's number five.
Speaker 3: He had six. I gotta go minuw bowl.
Speaker 2: That is incorrect strike too.
Speaker 3: I don't want I'm not gonna say your dmira, Sean.
I don't think he played enough. Man. Who else is
getting ten blocks? There's gotta be some obvious ones. Can
you tell me what placed on the list? My guys
I don't have yet are.
Speaker 1: They are fourth with seven and then the final top
three way tie for fifth with six one, and I
will say one of them should probably be overwhelmingly obvious,
Tim Duncan strike three.
Speaker 3: You know what couldn't be happier to go out guessing
Tim Duncan.
Speaker 1: Though, well, we need Tim Duncan haters. We are casting
the part. Okay, Kareem was I thought you would have
got him, and then you never would have gotten Elmore
Smith at six.
Speaker 3: Not gonna happen. Yeah, Kareem's tough because like you can't
get like Will probably you know, had fifty of those games,
but you can't guess him because they didn't do blocks
back then. I always lump Kareem in there with like
they didn't track blocks until late in his career or something.
I don't even know if that's right.
Speaker 1: Okay, So when I was by the way I was,
when I was filtering it and I tried to do it.
Who got triple doubles without doing it with rebounds? There
was five guys and they all did it once and
you would have I don't even know if you would
have known who.
Speaker 2: Three of them were.
Speaker 1: So because it's a steel was one of them, because
then it's steals, blocks, points, and assists, and so it's
easier to get a triple double without assists than without rebounds,
for sure.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Draymond did it without points, didn't he against Memphis
like several years ago? I think I.
Speaker 1: Did it without point that's the most that.
Speaker 3: Okay, that was fun. What else you got or you
want me to go here?
Speaker 1: Uh, let's do I'll do my next one before we
go to you. I'm very I'm very excry about all these.
If you can't tell Grant, guess which NBA team I'm
talking about by only hearing these player nicknames, that's a
bad way to phrase it. Guess the NBA team from
their player nicknames. How's that for simplification?
Speaker 3: Succinct?
Speaker 1: And they the goal here was I tried to get
make them progressively easier. So what you get a hard
one and if it's a one shot kill, good for you.
And you only get one guess and then we move
on to the next name.
Speaker 3: Are you and I guess after each nickname? Or I
get Yeah, I don't want to wait for all the Okay, cool,
got it, you get you guess.
Speaker 2: I'll give you a nickname.
Speaker 1: You will guess, and if it's wrong, we move on
because I can't give you unlimited gain.
Speaker 2: There's only thirty teams.
Speaker 1: There's a number of like you're just running through the alphabet.
Speaker 3: Yeah, easy, well, struggle.
Speaker 1: Okay, guess the NBA team from their player nicknames. First up,
the Air Apparent.
Speaker 3: Oh, sorry, question, are these nicknames of current active players?
Speaker 1: These are all yes, these are all active players on
the current teams.
Speaker 3: The Air Apparent. Hmmm, Shadon uh, Portland Trailblazers.
Speaker 2: That is incorrect.
Speaker 1: Okay, Second, Wolverine.
Speaker 3: These nicknames, these basketball reference nicknames, there's like it's like
they workshop like, what's what's something no one's ever called
this player? There it is, that's the nickname we'll put
on his basketball reference page. Wolverine the Phoenix Suns.
Speaker 2: That is incorrect. Next up, Benjamin Buckets.
Speaker 3: I mean that should that should be easy? Who are
who are?
Speaker 5: Is?
Speaker 3: That's not the giveaway nickname?
Speaker 1: Is it?
Speaker 2: No?
Speaker 1: So there's five nicknames per team. I guess there's a
nickname that refers to two. So it's like building a
starting lineup of nick.
Speaker 3: I mean, how many Ben's are there? Benjamin's in there
in the NBA. I don't know Ben Wallace. I'll just
say the sixers, I have no idea.
Speaker 2: That is incorrect. Swaggy l.
Speaker 3: Utah Jazz, that is incorrect.
Speaker 1: The final one and you better get it. He'll Billy
Kobe little bit Lakers.
Speaker 2: That is correct. That's so hill.
Speaker 1: Billy Kobe's Austin Reeves. Swaggy l was Luka Doncic. I
thought you might have gotten it on Benjamin Buckets with lebron.
Speaker 3: Oh, yeah, I was going down. Who's named Benjamin in
the NBA? I was never gonna get there.
Speaker 2: Wolverine was Marcus Smart. I wouldn't have known that one.
Speaker 1: And the heir apparent was Bronnie James, which I'm sure
now makes a ton of.
Speaker 3: Sense to you. Yep, No, it does, No, it does.
Speaker 2: Okay, next team.
Speaker 1: First nickname, Cocaine Curry.
Speaker 3: That's I've been bagging on these nicknames. That's a good one, Uh,
Cocaine Curry. So does that mean this is a white player,
or this is a player that is very energetic, or
that has a screenplay he really wants to tell you
about and won't shut.
Speaker 1: Up about it or likes to go to you. Edm
Concerts say he's got a lot of side interests. Uh,
the thunder incorrect? The Terror twins. So this refers to
two players on the same rockets. Correct, that's on Men
Thompson and tari Eathan the other two nicknames. You would
have gotten green Room for Kevin Durant and then I
know you would have gotten this big Kiwi.
Speaker 3: So his reed shepherd Cocaine Curry and I didn't know.
Speaker 1: And that's exactly that's could you describe? Could you encapsulate
his game in a better framing than that?
Speaker 2: Probably not?
Speaker 7: Probably?
Speaker 2: Not all right?
Speaker 1: Next up nine to five.
Speaker 3: Hm, he's workmanlike. Sounds like Harrison Barnes. This is the Spurs.
Speaker 2: That is incorrect.
Speaker 1: Next nickname smooth Operator. I could sing it to you too,
He's a smooth Oh.
Speaker 3: Now I have it. I would like all the clues sung.
That's how my brain works. Sorry, I don't know it's okay,
smooth Operator. I did think Josh Smith first. But these
are active players. Uh. Did I guess the thunder? I'm
gonna guess the thunder again again?
Speaker 2: When you already h No, not them? Next nickname Ivy Drip.
Speaker 3: Hmmm the Pistons correct.
Speaker 1: Uh So Kate Cunningham was smooth Operator nine to five
is a sar Thompson I had is the giveaway was
Kate Cunningham again, Motorcade. If you didn't get that one,
I would you've gotten it on Jimmy Neutron.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I think I would have for Duncan Robinson. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Next up Blue Arrow.
Speaker 3: Nuggets.
Speaker 1: One shot killed it with Jamal Murray. I feel like
that shouldn't have been That shouldn't have been the first
one we had. Biggie Small's for Bruce Brown, Big Science
for you Wanna found You to? This one is my
favorite nickname of all time and I didn't even know
it existed. Girth Nowitzki for Nikola Jokic.
Speaker 3: Why is why is Valcuns big Science?
Speaker 2: I don't know he is a beard?
Speaker 3: Well, isn't Jonas? Isn't Jonas or Jonas Salk a scientist?
Somebody somebody in the comments verify my trivis. That's a
problem is that makes too much sense for most of
these nicknames, so it probably isn't that.
Speaker 1: I feel like Nicole j has the best nicknames that
aren't his nicknames Big Honey is just awesome. But we
just call him the yoker or yoke and that's just lame. Uh.
Speaker 2: And a giveaway one was Swatson for Peyton Watson.
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, yeah, but I don't know why. I know
the Blue Murray does the the archery celebration on threes
still right because because of that, Yes he does.
Speaker 2: And he he's also called maple Curry. I didn't know that.
What you've gotten it it well, it would have been.
Speaker 3: I would have had to maybe maybe you have to
name some Canadians. Obviously it narrows the field.
Speaker 1: Excellent one shot kill by you. Next up two more
white Steve Nash.
Speaker 3: Uh Tyler colec New York Knicks.
Speaker 1: One shot back to bear shot kills.
Speaker 2: That's incredible.
Speaker 3: It's the floppy hair. Colic has very floppy hair for
a basketball player. That's very nash esque. Ste is hilarious.
Speaker 1: Incredible stuff from you big body. Let's even guess the players.
Speaker 2: Now it's over.
Speaker 3: But big body, big body, uh Yabo right now?
Speaker 2: Yabu was le bear. That was gonna be.
Speaker 3: Big body uh ariel hook PORTI no, I have no idea.
Speaker 1: John Brunson, it's one of his nicknames. Sure, perfect noodles,
that's my favorite. That's Bridges, Oh, you would have got okay.
And then the giveaway one was the Big Bodega.
Speaker 3: Yeah okay, and that's Cat Yeah. The Knicks have apparently
some obvious ones.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: Final final team. I guess the NBA team by their
player nicknames. Grant Sleeve Nash it's incredible nickname.
Speaker 3: By the way, that is really good. It's just clean.
It's what it takes perfect. There's no there's no fat
on that one. Sleeve Nash. A lot of Nash based nicknames. Uh,
who's got sleeves? That's the kind of Steve nanashy. I
don't know. I U the Thunder again, Alex Crusoe.
Speaker 2: Not the Thunder nice try though. The Vanilla Gorilla.
Speaker 3: Uh, well, first of all, that's Joe Joel Prisbilla. Who's
the center that I have not thought about for a
long time. And it rhymed, so that's why it made sense.
I don't know who has taken Vanilla Gorilla from him
since he retired.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 3: I want to guess the Thunder again because Heartenstein. I won't.
Let's see, I don't know. Pass give me the next clue.
Speaker 1: Okay, sleek freak sleep What is these are?
Speaker 2: Another?
Speaker 1: I didn't know this one, but it's honestly it's top notch.
The Raptors incorrect. Next one up, the don give me
the Lakers again, I did not incorrect.
Speaker 2: Final one and you better get it.
Speaker 1: Fro oh the Calves, Yeah, Jared Allen.
Speaker 3: So the don is just Who's Who's sleeve sash?
Speaker 2: So the don was Donovan Mitchell.
Speaker 1: I was actually worried that that should be the giveaway one,
but I was right in saying that it shouldn't.
Speaker 2: Frow was Jared Allen. Sleep freak was Evan Mobley. I
like that one.
Speaker 1: You're dying to know who the Vanilla Gorilla is? That's
dem Yeah, sleeve Nash is Darius Garland. I love that one.
Speaker 3: Interesting. I don't picture him in sleeves. I guess I
gotta update my mental image.
Speaker 2: So do you want to give me yours? That was looked?
That was that was way more excited for that than
you were.
Speaker 3: There are some that was good.
Speaker 1: There's some fun nicknames throwing around on Basketball Reference and
read it as well, but most of these were called
from a Basketball Reference.
Speaker 3: Yes, all right, Dan, for you, I have put together
today an incredibly poorly timed Lebron centric set of stat
padding questions. The theme is loosely, the answer is not
Lebron because he leads in so many categories since he
entered the league in O three oh four that you
could just blind guess that he has the most of
a lot of things points for example, but in games
and minutes and blah blah blah blah blah turnovers. I'm
going to give you statistical categories that dating back to
three oh four, Lebron is not the leader in somebody
else is. So I think what I could do is
give you I'm gonna give you three strikes per category,
and you need to get totals yep, total cumulative total,
so like not per game, just from O three oh four,
Who's got the most of this? And it's not Lebron?
And I can then subsequently ask you where you think
Lebron ranks is like a follow up in that stat category,
so we know points is Lebron. Let's go to rebounds.
Lebron does not have the most rebounds dance since O
three oh four. Who does?
Speaker 1: Oh man, oh three h four is a long time,
But I feel like I should have the license to
be able to go more recent like who's been in
the league a while grabs a ton of boards?
Speaker 2: Is it Yokic?
Speaker 3: It is not Jokic. And I will tell you now,
Jokic will not feature in any of these to give
you a sense of like what generation like you're gonna
you're gonna get eventually slotted into like a generation of players,
oh and be like from that group. So like Jokic,
I'll tell you now, Jokic, Giannis, Shay, like all these
guys of the last like half decade plus are not
gonna feature here.
Speaker 2: Uh Drummond.
Speaker 3: Drummond is third. He is not the leader in this category.
Good guess strike two?
Speaker 2: Who's in? Who's a big I'm missing these?
Speaker 1: These are not my answers. I'm just spitballing here. So
bonus is too recent. Feels like there's Rudy Gobert, there's
Clint Cappella.
Speaker 3: My god, I will tell you that. I'll give you
a hint. The the fourth and fifth ranked guys in
rebound sin so three oh four are still in the league.
Number one is not.
Speaker 1: Number one is not in the league as good. I
was not even thinking about retired players. Uh, not in
the league. That's too late to pick a shack. Who
am I forgetting? Is it?
Speaker 7: No?
Speaker 2: I just cool? Botch a girl my face?
Speaker 1: I think basically, uh, oh man, this is hard.
Speaker 2: I love this.
Speaker 3: I want to give you. Would you take some hints?
Do you want some hints? So this guy's best best
stretch of rebounding per game started in seven eight and
ended in twelve thirteen. He averaged fourteen point two, thirteen
point eight, thirteen point two, fourteen point one, fourteen point five,
twelve point four over that stretch from basically eight to
to thirteen.
Speaker 2: All right, it's not Roy Hibbert. I know he couldn't rebound.
Speaker 3: There you go, I.
Speaker 1: Don't even have like I'm there's not even a name.
I'll punish myself when I hear it. So the best
stretch started in seven eight. Yep, this is this answer
has to be so obvious. There's gonna be people listening
right now.
Speaker 3: There are, so I will say. When I saw the answer,
I was like, well, okay, of course, but also I
wasn't gonna guess this guy like it's that kind of
it's that kind of like, oh yeah, I forgot about him,
but you don't associate. I'll give you another one. You
don't associate him with rebounding so much. It was just
sort of part of the deal. Like rebounding is not
the first thing you think of with him, You think
of something else first.
Speaker 2: I should have guessed Russell Westbrook. But he's still in
that league.
Speaker 1: Started best oh seven o eight, done by twelve thirteen.
Speaker 3: He played until twenty twenty two.
Speaker 1: I feel like that probably should help me, and it doesn't.
Speaker 3: I was done being a good, good player in like fourteen.
Oh holy crap, well done being a great player. He
was like decent through seventeen eighteen.
Speaker 1: I don't I don't even have a name here. You've
efficiently frozen me.
Speaker 2: Who is it?
Speaker 3: It's a big name. I could give you the obvious hint.
Do you want the obvious hint? Yeah? Hit man. He
won Defensive Player of the Year three years in a
row from eight on. God damn Dwight Howard. He has
dan fourteen thousand, six hundred and twenty seven rebounds. James, well,
I'll spoil it. James is second at eleven thy eight hundred.
Speaker 1: Like Howard is so so.
Speaker 3: But again, like you don't think of rebounding, it's just like, well, yeah,
he's the best big man athlete in the world. Like,
of course, that's a.
Speaker 2: Day moment where it's like, damn it.
Speaker 3: But I wouldn't have guessed him. I would have guessed
all the guys you did. DeAndre Jordan fourth, vouch fifth,
just hanging on vooch.
Speaker 2: Uh extendam Chicago.
Speaker 3: You're going to redeem yourself here, Lebron James. Dan is
not number one in total assists since two thousand and three,
two thousand and four. Can you tell me who is
Chris Paul? That is correct? Twelve five point fifty two
versus eleven six eighty two, So Lebron is gonna catch
Chris Paul over probably for most second. Yeah, I guess
you want to think. You want to take cracks at
the rest of the top five. There big names. Harden
Harden is fourth eighty five hundred and fifty three, Russ
Russ's third, ten fifty seven and fifth is a ways
behind those last two guys.
Speaker 1: But you can't stay with Steve Nash, is it? I
would get it. It's Nash, So it was all right,
here we go another one. I think you will get Dan.
Speaker 3: Lebron James does not have the most steals since two
thousand and three, two thousand and four, Can you please
tell me who does?
Speaker 2: Oh my god? Is it also Chris Paul?
Speaker 3: It also is Chris Paul had a pretty good career,
good job, who got a big Lee twenty seven and
twenty eight? Lebron's twenty three sixty?
Speaker 1: Uh?
Speaker 3: Do you want to take shots at three four and
five on that list most steels since three oh four.
Speaker 2: Oh three h four?
Speaker 1: Honestly, probably not, But let me see if I can.
Is is Dwayne Wade on there?
Speaker 3: That's a good He's not where he showed up on
some other list. We'll get maybe we'll get to it.
He's not on the list. I think, Uh, you just
got it? Like who just minutes? Like I mean, that's
that's that's my only hint. Like who's just played a
ton forever?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 1: I mean, I could just name twenty guys, but I'm
not gonna name anything like one of them because nobody's
breaking to mind.
Speaker 2: So it's not Kawhi he said play It's.
Speaker 3: Not Kawhi correct, although it is per minute. Probably is
up there?
Speaker 2: Yeah, who is it?
Speaker 3: It's Russ has over two thousand and number three. Andre
Goodala is fourth and we're not there. Yes, And James
Harden that's the minutes think him in the rush?
Speaker 1: He actually he was the only name that came to
my mind when you were saying, guys, you played a
ton of minutes, and in my head I said, there's
no way, There's just no way.
Speaker 3: Let's see, well, Lebron, James Dan is nowhere close to
first in blocks since two thousand and three, two thousand,
Derek White, No, not twenty three to twenty four minutes ago.
So who has the most blocks in so three oh four?
Speaker 2: Is it Victor Webbin? I'm just catch that does knock out?
Is it Dwight Howard? Again?
Speaker 3: It is White Howard Bye. Well, not by as much
as you might think. Brook Lopez is second twenty eighty
five to Howard's twenty two to twenty eight.
Speaker 2: Oh wow.
Speaker 3: Does Lebron rank fifteenth higher or lower than fifteenth? On
the blocks four? He's lower twentieth.
Speaker 1: Is he even gonna make the Hall of Fame at
this point?
Speaker 3: What a bum block a shot? Tim Duncan makes his appearance,
he's third on that list, even.
Speaker 2: Though when did he finish playing? I guess that was
the mid you.
Speaker 1: Had like six good years before this.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so if we've slid the window back a little bit,
he'd be up there. All right, what's most interesting here?
The three is easy? Okay? How about this is okay? Uh?
Are you answer to this? One? Is the answer to
this is Lebron James? Uh So this is going to
bump on the premise here, uh Dan, Lebron James has
the most two point field goals made since oh three
oh four by a laughable margin. Who is second on
that list? I'll give you three. Kevin Durant is third.
Speaker 1: Second and made two pointers since three oh four. I
don't want to say, but I should say now and
get the strike out of the What.
Speaker 4: Is it?
Speaker 2: Russ?
Speaker 3: Is not Russell Westbrook?
Speaker 1: Damn it is it James Harden?
Speaker 3: It's not James Harden. See he's That's why it's hard,
because he's way up there in points. But it's like
threes and free throws. So think about think about who
you would. The problem is the era. It feels like
it's too early for this guy, but it's really not,
because he's been around forever, still active. Who's just like
making two's who's just making tons of twos?
Speaker 2: DeAndre Jordan it's not a.
Speaker 3: Big It's not a big, which makes it even crazier.
Speaker 1: Just making two's. It's not steph Nope, are he's still around?
Speaker 2: Is not?
Speaker 3: No, that's a good guess. I see a lot of
those right obo jumpers. I would say you would, you
would definitely associate like much higher shooting volume with this
player than you would Chris Paul making and taking a
lot of twos.
Speaker 2: DeMar DeRozan.
Speaker 3: It is DeMar DeRozan, great guess, Like when I saw that,
I was like.
Speaker 2: Great guest after eh strikes.
Speaker 3: No, you could have given me so many just for
perspective though, so DeRozan has made as when I put
these together, because he's probably made twenty five more since
eighty six and forty one twos in that time span,
and he got started later than Lebron by by a
handful of years. Lebron has almost five thousand more made twos.
They's just like ten thousand points just right there than
the second most prolific two point scorer. It's like, it's
it's bonkers, all right, I'm going to get you a
couple more here. So again bumping the premise, uh, Lebron
is not it is in fact, first in free throws
made since O three oh four. Can you tell me
who is second?
Speaker 2: James Harden?
Speaker 3: That's correct? Do you want to keep the run going?
You have a third?
Speaker 1: Ooh no, just call it? Try to think a ton
of fouls? Did Rush shoot a ton of free throws?
Speaker 3: Uh? He did? He is their fourth, fifth, sixth, Damn
that list and made free throws. Shout out Kobe showed.
Kobe shows up only here, He's seventh and made free
throw since O three oh four. Just too much of
his career was before that.
Speaker 1: Where's Kate?
Speaker 2: Kd's not on the top five kas?
Speaker 3: Katie's third? Katie's right after hard Yeah? And then our
guy DeMar de Rosen right there behind one, one spot
ahead of Mellow. Mellow shows up on a few of these.
He was up there on the two point field goals.
I thought you might name him for that. Is there
any other weird one I want to do here?
Speaker 1: Uh?
Speaker 3: Let's see now, I think I think I think we're good. Oh,
let's do this is fun. Lebron James leads every player
on the planet in turnover since O three oh four
fifty ten? Who second?
Speaker 2: Russ?
Speaker 3: Correct? Who's there?
Speaker 1: Ah?
Speaker 2: I know it's not him. I want to ask where
he ranks on.
Speaker 1: This because he's so high up, and it says, where's
Chris Paul rank?
Speaker 3: I don't know, but he's not in the top five
in turnovers.
Speaker 2: It's impressive.
Speaker 1: Uh is it Harden?
Speaker 3: It is Harden, You're on fire? Followed by Durant, fall
by Wade. This is Wade's only appearance, I think his
turnovers Unfortunately, all right, that was fun. I won't do
minutes because that's just Chris Paul is second again and
Chris Paul the takeaway. Here's Chris Paul shows up on
a lot of these, Chris Paul and Dwight Howard already
or like.
Speaker 1: Someone argue he shows up too much and it might
cost him his job.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, he shows up and he talks a lot,
it seems like. But yeah, that was fun. You did well,
I thought, because I think we're messing with an era
that's a little bit before some of your basketball fandom starts.
So I'll because you're only twenty five, so how could
you possibly know about Yeah, about three or four.
Speaker 1: Now we left it to the end two hours. This
is the one I'm most excited about.
Speaker 2: Grant.
Speaker 1: It's gonna be hit or miss here. But you have
to guess the NBA player by hearing only their voice.
Oh are you ready?
Speaker 3: Oh I'm excited?
Speaker 2: So you're ready?
Speaker 3: Is what is?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm ready. I turn my I turned my volume up.
I'm I'm gonna smoke this.
Speaker 1: I So we'll give you three strikes per player. I
will replay it as much as you want.
Speaker 2: But okay, here, let's go.
Speaker 1: There's this guy on their team that's seven five and
takes up a lot of space on the court.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 1: Now I should have mentioned that these will I try
to stage them in leg so there'll be three levels
and they go into order of increasing difficulty.
Speaker 3: Can I just say you're going above and beyond right now?
This is this is fantastic. H that's Jayalen Williams and
it's recent. So you really did put one on a
platter for me.
Speaker 1: Okay, yes, the NBA player voice.
Speaker 5: From being at the bottom and you know, almost getting
the job done. You know I have unfinished business here
from being at the bottom and you know, almost getting
the job done. You know I have unfinished business here?
Speaker 3: Oh boy, uh I had it. I want to say,
Dylan Brooks, but it's not Dylan Brooks. I'm gonna take
the strike on that one.
Speaker 2: I think I strike one.
Speaker 3: Okay, can you play it one more time? This is
gonna be terrible podcasting because I'm I'm gonna ask you
so many times replay it.
Speaker 5: From being at the bottom and you know, almost getting
the job done, you know, I have unfinished business here.
Speaker 3: This is killing me, Dan oh Man, a little about me. Uh,
when we're watching like when we're watching like animated movies,
it annoys every everybody in my house that I'll be
like that's, uh, that's Scarlet Johansson, or like, oh that
was a more obscure than that, like someone that I
feel like I have a I'm good at picking out
the celebrity voice one more time and then I'm just
gonna have to eat it.
Speaker 5: From being at the bottom and you know, almost getting
the job done, you know I have unfinished business here.
Speaker 3: I am going to be so mad when you tell
me who's two strikes?
Speaker 1: By the way, I'll say, kid, that is incorrect strike too.
Speaker 3: From being at the bottom, I feel like I can
remember this SoundBite too. I have unfinished business here, Oh Dan, Uh,
I really like this, but I hate that I'm not
going to get this one uh, one more time. It'll
be the last time I asked you play it.
Speaker 2: You're allowed to ask as many times as you want
to hear.
Speaker 3: Nobody wants to listen to it. Everyone that knows it
has already like just thrown their computer out the window.
Speaker 5: From being at the bottom and you know, almost getting
the job done. You know, I have unfinished business here.
Speaker 3: See now I'm just ignoring the voice and trying to
figure out, like from the content of the quote.
Speaker 1: I am starting to think that I should have put
this player on level three rather than level.
Speaker 3: But now I'm terrified a level three?
Speaker 2: Uh, who don't.
Speaker 3: Finished business here? Being at the bottom. God damn it,
I don't even have a guess. I'll say, I have
no idea. I have no idea.
Speaker 1: I don't even have a name for you. You don't
have to give me strike three and tell me. I
have to know strike three And it is Devin Booker.
Speaker 3: God damn it. Uh, that's his He's.
Speaker 1: One of those guys where his voice just takes you
by surprise.
Speaker 3: I just like, I don't know. I watched he did
a postgame interview like three days that I watched, and
I couldn't get there. This is not a good sign
for level three. All right, great, great stuff by you,
bad stuff by me.
Speaker 1: I need redemption grant, I guess the NBA player's voice.
Speaker 6: Oh my gosh, this same my height. Now it's close
that the plus enough.
Speaker 3: Sorry, oh.
Speaker 6: One more time, please, Oh my gosh, this same my
height now it's close thus plus enough.
Speaker 7: Sorry.
Speaker 3: Oh I had it, I had it.
Speaker 2: Dan, you don't have a strike yet. You could burn something.
Speaker 3: You can burn time and then I will give you
a guess.
Speaker 6: Oh my gosh, this same my height now it's close
that the plus enough.
Speaker 3: Sorry, I swear it's like right. My brain is like
if you could do an MRI right now. My brain
is like tingling. Uh, it's close though, it's close, though,
Oh god, this is this is the worst. I hate.
Speaker 1: I like.
Speaker 3: I've enjoying it. I'm having a good time. I know
you can't.
Speaker 2: I'm glad.
Speaker 1: I'm glad you're enjoying the game as much as I
thought when I thought of it, I went back and
forth for days as to whether I was like, oh,
should I actually try to do This's gonna be a
little bit extra work for stat padding, but it's worth it.
Speaker 2: Just to see you struggle to be honest.
Speaker 3: This this one's even worse because I don't think I
was gonna get Booker. I just wanted this. I just
wanted on a loop. Okay, one more, one more time.
Speaker 6: Oh my gosh, this ain't my height now it's close though,
close enough.
Speaker 1: Sorry, it's Lamello and crack strike one. You didn't even
you didn't even burn a strike yet.
Speaker 3: That that's where well, the the just the wild guesses
are hard. Man. I'm surprised that's not Lamello. Now, I'm
trying to think, like, is it? Who is? Who could
that be?
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give you another hint, just because it's height related.
It's not Given Durant either.
Speaker 3: I know it's not Kevin. Yeah, that one I would
have got. I know it's not Kevin Durant. Dan, that's
a terrible that's a terrible hint. I'm gonna get really
punchy because of my feeling.
Speaker 2: Okay, here's another one. It's not Devin Booker.
Speaker 3: Oh okay, thanks great? Uh my height guys, it's close though, Yeah,
I can you give me a real hint?
Speaker 1: Okay, I feel like a real hint. These are all
active players yeah, I can give you.
Speaker 2: I feel like even if I give you that, it'll
be a dead giveaway.
Speaker 1: I'm trying to think this player is under six foot seven?
Speaker 3: Okay, is there like a oh is it Derek White?
Speaker 2: That is incorrect. Now I'll give you some warmer hints.
So that strike two?
Speaker 1: This player is.
Speaker 2: You want conference position?
Speaker 3: Maybe like level? Like is this an All Star and
All NBA guy? None of those they've.
Speaker 2: Made an All NBA team?
Speaker 1: Oh okay, well hold on, let me confirmed.
Speaker 3: Are you gonna have to beat? Okay, So he's a
fringe All NBA. Now that's good. Now I got more information.
Speaker 1: I'll give you the exact he is a four time
All Star, one time All NBA.
Speaker 3: One more time with the audio please, and then I
will guess and get strike three.
Speaker 6: Oh my gosh, this ain't my height. Now it's close
those plus enough sign?
Speaker 3: Is that Trae Young?
Speaker 2: That is Trey Young?
Speaker 4: You got it?
Speaker 1: Nice job.
Speaker 3: Man. When you once you get once the name gets
it's like, of course that's who that is, right?
Speaker 1: I So I feel like, objectively speaking, the Trey Young
one should have been easier than the devine.
Speaker 3: Based on not getting Devin Booker. I would agree with you.
Speaker 1: All right, I have one more three levels for you,
so you're ready for that subset?
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, all.
Speaker 1: Right, here we go, Grant guess the NBA player voice.
Speaker 3: Because I have for breakfast, I have a pound of
ground beef and six eggs, so it's all like mixed together,
but like when you open it, eggs don't smell that great.
Speaker 2: Level one.
Speaker 3: Not only is this h Steven Adams, but it has
also forced me to rethink my breakfast choices. Why why
not just go six eggs and a pound of ground
beef every day? First thing? Why not? Damn? That is correct?
Speaker 2: You got level one. Good job.
Speaker 1: That was my favorite sound bite too, just listening to
him describe his breakfast.
Speaker 3: I really have thought, like I could get some ground,
Like what would happen to me if I did that?
Would I also become the best rebounder on planet Earth?
That'd be cool?
Speaker 1: Okay, Grant guess the NBA player voice. Level two difficulty.
Speaker 7: You know I very first got traded here. You know,
we were we were pushing for the playoffs, and you know,
I had a vision of what it would be like
to make the playoffs here and Sack and it was
a lot of long, long days just working and just
being in the facility, being in these games, and so
you know, to run out there tonight and to see
that and to see the fans, you know, it was exciting.
But you know, honestly it was a little emotional just
you know, just being a part of that and really
just happy for the fans.
Speaker 2: So contact clues there too.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the longer it went on, the less sure I got.
But he did end with a gracious sentiment, and so
that's what tells me it's Harrison Barnes.
Speaker 1: That is correct. Two for two. That wasn't hard enough.
You can you go one shot killed across the board?
Level three grant guess the NBA player voice.
Speaker 4: There's no no love, loss or bad blood there. It's just,
you know, you have to understand business, and you know,
I've got to know that over my tenure in the
in the career of the NBA. But super excited. I'm
back here on the West Coast. I'm forty five minutes
from my house in Newport, so you know, I know
a couple guys on the team.
Speaker 3: Obviously, I appreciate the geographical clue within within the sound bite.
Speaker 1: Hm, is that is that John Collins incorrect Strike one.
Speaker 3: He's on the West Coast.
Speaker 1: You're Welmo thought about cutting the clip off before then too?
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, I need it one more time, please. I
know it's a longer one.
Speaker 4: There's no no love loss or bad blood there. It's
just you know, you have to understand business, and you
know I've got to know that over my tenure in
the in the career of the NBA. But super excited.
I'm back here on the West Coast. I'm forty five
minutes from my house in Newport, so you know, I
know a couple guys on the team obviously.
Speaker 2: Is that Marcus Smart incorrect Strike two?
Speaker 3: Oh no, I felt good about that one. The bad
blood thing, man, So I didn't think I was gonna
have to guess after that one could.
Speaker 2: Be when you're overly confident.
Speaker 3: I was, so, yeah, that's clearly who that is. The
Celtics Lakers. Rivalry's on Lakers now. I mean it's not
a well, a lot of guys have so I was
about to say it's not a Warriors player or a
King's player, because he just had like.
Speaker 2: A bunch of people leave.
Speaker 1: They must this must be pretty obvious to a lot
of people who were watching.
Speaker 3: They're just like, I don't need to stick around and
see if he gets it. Uh, it's got to be
an l a guy. Just even although like you could
have a I don't. It doesn't sound like a Warrior
to me. If it's a Warriors player and you snuck
it in there, kudos to you. I'll just say, Gabe Vincent,
that is incorrect.
Speaker 2: Strike three it was Zach Levine.
Speaker 3: Ooh, oh, I'm disappointed. I'm just he has kind of
a distinctive voice, all right.
Speaker 1: And it was at one point when you said, oh,
it's not a king, it was okay, he's clearly not.
Speaker 2: He's not gonna get this. And then if that's me,
he's kind of married too.
Speaker 3: Well, I was already all in on Marcus Smart. What
a shame great job by you. Good what an innovative.
I hope there's no rights issues with that, like having
to play the audio, but good job.
Speaker 1: No, I'm sure I wasn't like we were playing music
or anything like.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I'm sure it's fine.
Speaker 3: Well not until you start singing the clues. You're gonna
have to paraphrase the clues and sing them.
Speaker 1: To me from now on, do you have anything else
or do you want to take it out of here?
Speaker 3: Please remember, as always, rate, review, subscribe, tell your friends,
tell your enemies, joining our discord link for that on
YouTube and podcast description. As always shouts Frank la Kin. Apologies,
Jared Allen