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<v Speaker 1>Here we go again, another episode coming to you for

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<v Speaker 1>the XRB pod. And of course today is going to

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<v Speaker 1>be a little bit different because I am in the

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<v Speaker 1>presence of Mickkel.

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<v Speaker 2>Today and now are you man nice?

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<v Speaker 3>Say? It's a pleasure to finally get to meet you

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<v Speaker 3>in person and do this live.

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<v Speaker 1>A lot of people don't realize that we had never

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<v Speaker 1>met physically. We have only been meeting in our online

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<v Speaker 1>show each week. So it's been good to kind of

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<v Speaker 1>get everything caught up here.

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<v Speaker 3>No, absolutely, it was really surreal, kind of had to

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<v Speaker 3>finally have that experience. I mean, it's been a blast

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<v Speaker 3>coming on the show and getting to meet in person

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<v Speaker 3>and do this in verson. It's just a really cool

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<v Speaker 3>twist on everything. And this has been a blast as well.

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<v Speaker 1>All Right, So you look at this event yesterday, absolute

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<v Speaker 1>rock star lineup. We had garling House up there, David

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<v Speaker 1>Schwartz up there, we had the guy from Vassbank. I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>it was Matt the ETF, roundtable, star studded performances by everybody.

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<v Speaker 1>In terms of where the market is, let's go into

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<v Speaker 1>a little bit the strategy of what Ripple is trying

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<v Speaker 1>to do here, because Brad mentioned a lot of different

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<v Speaker 1>things that I think the audience needs to hear and understand.

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<v Speaker 1>When you heard him talk about not only where they

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<v Speaker 1>were around an IPO, where they.

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<v Speaker 2>Are in clarity, what's stuck out to you most.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, one of my favorite things about Ripple Strategy right

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<v Speaker 3>now is what they're doing is they're acquiring critical infrastructure

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<v Speaker 3>from the traditional system. I think one of the things

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<v Speaker 3>that has been lost in the crypto world is everyone

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<v Speaker 3>wants to build these very cryptocentric businesses, but Ripple's focused

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<v Speaker 3>on finance, and right now, finance happens on the legacy,

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<v Speaker 3>outdated rails. So one of the things Brad specifically talked

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<v Speaker 3>about was how these acquisitions that they made this year

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<v Speaker 3>are going to be critical for XRP. So what they're

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<v Speaker 3>doing is they're acquiring critical infrastructure, prime brokerage, husciity and

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<v Speaker 3>making it so this infrastructure that these traditional firms were

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<v Speaker 3>going to plug into will ultimately become the rails which

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<v Speaker 3>will lead to the XRP ledger. One of the things

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<v Speaker 3>he mentioned that I thought was super interesting was some

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<v Speaker 3>of their plans on ReOC wiring shares off the secondary market,

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<v Speaker 3>really building a business that is centered around enterprise, something

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<v Speaker 3>that I think there's really going to resonate with investors

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<v Speaker 3>and also timetables. It seemed to me, while he wasn't

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<v Speaker 3>retting to say, hey, we're looking to IPO, it seemed

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<v Speaker 3>like he floated the idea a little bit more than previously.

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<v Speaker 3>And one of the only reasons I could think that

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<v Speaker 3>they'd be sucking up all those shares off the secondary

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<v Speaker 3>market was to control that share account going into maybe

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<v Speaker 3>a little bit more of an exciting part of the

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<v Speaker 3>back end of the year. I think of all that

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<v Speaker 3>plays out, he could be alluding to something there.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think the indicators right now when you think

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<v Speaker 1>about just the strength of the roster of products that

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<v Speaker 1>they've been acquiring over the last eighteen months, including the

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<v Speaker 1>strategy going forward. We had Jack McDonald on the final

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<v Speaker 1>panel yesterday and I point blanked him on SATs and

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<v Speaker 1>I said, what are you missing?

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<v Speaker 2>And he said he smiled a little bit, almost as

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<v Speaker 2>there was something into work.

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<v Speaker 1>So, if you think about the roster of acquisitions that

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<v Speaker 1>they've done, what do you think is missing right now?

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<v Speaker 2>That's a great question.

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<v Speaker 3>One of the things that I have thought Ripple would

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<v Speaker 3>step into is going to be some kind of a

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<v Speaker 3>market maker, because if you look at what the XRP

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<v Speaker 3>ledger is. At the core, it's a decentralized exchange with

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<v Speaker 3>XRP as that liquidity. Right now, market making happens in

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<v Speaker 3>a very centralized way. But if you could have the

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<v Speaker 3>XRP ledger be a superdex for all kinds of assets,

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<v Speaker 3>issued assets as well as crypto assets, taking a centralized

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<v Speaker 3>market maker in making the core of that infrastructure of

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<v Speaker 3>the XRP ledger could be a very interesting way to

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<v Speaker 3>create a lot of tokenization and a lot of volume

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<v Speaker 3>on the native XRP ledger decks. And that's how I

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<v Speaker 3>think real world adoption happens. I think it's by a

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<v Speaker 3>player like Ripple acting as almost in Amazon Web Services,

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<v Speaker 3>going to these companies and integrating infrastructure directly into the

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<v Speaker 3>XRP ledger, because they're always going to be the experts

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<v Speaker 3>in building that business and integrating it, and they're going

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<v Speaker 3>to work with players who are used to running their

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<v Speaker 3>business not necessarily being a blockchain business.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, ledger as a service kind of thing.

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<v Speaker 1>ZOUCH is interesting because when you think about adoption and

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<v Speaker 1>the curves that we've seen not only on B to

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<v Speaker 1>B but the banking side of it, we also had

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<v Speaker 1>fast Bank on and Former You know, when you look

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<v Speaker 1>at former Ripple guy really understanding where the banking industry is,

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<v Speaker 1>what's missing there, what they need.

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<v Speaker 2>To kind of move forward.

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<v Speaker 1>Ripples in the perfect spot to play that intermedia area.

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<v Speaker 2>So I don't know. I just think there's a lot

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<v Speaker 2>of opportunity here, mikel Oh I do as well.

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<v Speaker 3>And one of the things that I think is lost

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<v Speaker 3>in the community and really outside the community is what

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<v Speaker 3>DeFi of tomorrow will look like in comparison to DeFi

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<v Speaker 3>of today.

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<v Speaker 2>If you look at the.

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<v Speaker 3>Traditional financial system, people aren't really running around taking crazy

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<v Speaker 3>LTV loans in terms of their most common activity, right

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<v Speaker 3>it's things like checkings accounts, savings accounts, brokerage accounts, very

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<v Speaker 3>simple loans structures in terms of financing mortgages.

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<v Speaker 2>These are the types of high volume.

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<v Speaker 3>Products, things that have a whole bunch of value runn

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<v Speaker 3>Durham right now in the traditional system that I think

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<v Speaker 3>the x are leder has a really long runway in

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<v Speaker 3>terms of build out. If you listen to David Schwartz

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<v Speaker 3>talk about where he thinks the future of DeFi is going,

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<v Speaker 3>he talks about a lot of very simple products that

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<v Speaker 3>dominate the traditional financial system that aren't built out in crypto.

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<v Speaker 3>So I think while we've seen a huge emergence of

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<v Speaker 3>DeFi one point zero, which has been a lot of

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<v Speaker 3>yield generation and a lot of different high risk loans

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<v Speaker 3>i'll call them, I feel like the scenario we're heading

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<v Speaker 3>into is institutional DeFi DeFi two point zero, where ripples

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<v Speaker 3>recreating a lot of the financial services that already exist

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<v Speaker 3>in the world today and bringing those to blockchain, and

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<v Speaker 3>I think those will be a lot more sustainable and

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<v Speaker 3>a lot more useful.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, and the banks have now started to really create

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<v Speaker 1>this hybrid approach, which we're seeing it with SOFI. They

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<v Speaker 1>launched their platform now Wh're you in grab XRP, But

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<v Speaker 1>I think that's still just an intermediary step before we

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<v Speaker 1>really see onboarding of traditional banks. But also more importantly

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<v Speaker 1>is the next generation bank. So what those are going

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<v Speaker 1>to look like? If you could put together a today

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<v Speaker 1>and you say they're going to be a crypto bank,

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<v Speaker 1>they're going to have traditional services, they're going to have

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<v Speaker 1>maybe some sort of DeFi play in it.

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<v Speaker 2>What would that look like for you?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, Well, actually I think a lot of those application

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<v Speaker 3>new fintech sort of banks, the Robin Hoods of the

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<v Speaker 3>world have done a great job on UI and attracting

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<v Speaker 3>people and creating broad products that encompass a lot of

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<v Speaker 3>what people are looking for. But if you look at

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<v Speaker 3>the direction of where someone like a Robinhood is going,

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<v Speaker 3>they're moving towards tokenization. It's those forward looking banks, the

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<v Speaker 3>ones that really nailed UI and really nailed customer acquisition,

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<v Speaker 3>who are extremely innovative, and they're looking at ways to

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<v Speaker 3>make their business more efficient, and that is upgrading the plumbing.

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<v Speaker 3>So by moving over to blockchain technology and integrating a

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<v Speaker 3>lot of tools like the XRP ledger, they're going to

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<v Speaker 3>revolutionize the back end like they did the front end.

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<v Speaker 1>What do you make of flair Flair, of course we

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<v Speaker 1>had h gone yesterday. They're moving into a pretty accelerated

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<v Speaker 1>mode in terms of being able to put XRP to

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<v Speaker 1>work in DeFi through their FST. You consider Flare and

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<v Speaker 1>a handful of others that have kind of started in

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<v Speaker 1>the space, x ORP still somewhat underserved in that space.

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<v Speaker 1>Do you like that strategy or are you more on a.

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<v Speaker 2>Traditional route I do.

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<v Speaker 3>I think people need to understand that what Flare is

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<v Speaker 3>is really a back end, back end tool.

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<v Speaker 2>So what it allows people to do.

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<v Speaker 3>Especially large asset managers who historically couldn't have done this

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<v Speaker 3>is take something like an XRP, wrap it and deploy

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<v Speaker 3>it in different strategies and.

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<v Speaker 2>Structures on other protocols.

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<v Speaker 3>Right volts are a great example, a lot of vulture

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<v Speaker 3>on off smart contracts. What FLAIR allows is for XRP

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<v Speaker 3>to be wrapped and put in a vault where I

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<v Speaker 3>think we might see the future of asset management.

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<v Speaker 2>Big time.

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<v Speaker 3>Vaults allow for a lot of different things in terms

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<v Speaker 3>of SMAs, where you can get out of the legacy

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<v Speaker 3>fund structures that make a lot of these things vastly

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<v Speaker 3>more efficient. What FLAIR is doing is unlocking xrp's ability

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<v Speaker 3>to participate in a lot of these things. So I

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<v Speaker 3>think a lot of people thought, oh, I just wrapped

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<v Speaker 3>my XRP because that XRP and yield starts falling from

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<v Speaker 3>the sky. That's the mindset we need to get away

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<v Speaker 3>from and understand that this is going to link to

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<v Speaker 3>different strategies, to different managers to run different strategies that

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<v Speaker 3>might produce an income on your XRP. But what FLAIR

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<v Speaker 3>is doing is allowing and being the infrastructure to make

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<v Speaker 3>that happen.

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<v Speaker 1>All right, last point I'm gonna get on his clarity.

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<v Speaker 1>Many people on stage yesterday I felt that they were

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<v Speaker 1>trying to sidestep the clarity issue, almost to the point

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<v Speaker 1>as if they knew something and at whether or not

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<v Speaker 1>they were confident that we were going to get through.

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<v Speaker 1>We just shot a show this morning. You know, you

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<v Speaker 1>got Tom Tillis on the board right now or on

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<v Speaker 1>the on the rail right now in terms of ethics

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<v Speaker 1>and what the Trump family is doing. Now you have

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<v Speaker 1>Senator Kennedy coming in with holding out because of what's

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<v Speaker 1>happening on the housing business.

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<v Speaker 2>So now you've got all.

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<v Speaker 1>These senators starting to hold this thing up. My question, Michel,

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<v Speaker 1>does this get done?

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<v Speaker 3>So? You know, I think it's unfortunate what we've seen

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<v Speaker 3>develop in terms of more firepower for the Democrats to

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<v Speaker 3>attack cryptocurrency industry. It kind of seemed like maybe we

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<v Speaker 3>could convince everyone that we could get this jammed through.

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<v Speaker 2>It seems like the Republicans.

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<v Speaker 3>Have put a lot of hurdles in their way and

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<v Speaker 3>firepower against it.

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<v Speaker 2>It seems like things are getting tight.

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<v Speaker 3>It seems like if you talk to people to know,

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<v Speaker 3>like you said there's earning to dodge the question. I

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<v Speaker 3>know a lot of people are gonna feel very disappointed

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<v Speaker 3>by maybe Clarity not happening before midterms. I will say this, though,

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<v Speaker 3>I don't think all this time is being spent for nothing.

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<v Speaker 3>I think it's extremely possible what the Democrats might try

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<v Speaker 3>to do is take over the House and then repitch

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<v Speaker 3>some of this Clarity stuff under what they're doing so

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<v Speaker 3>they can maybe change their narrative about being the anti

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<v Speaker 3>crypto party. While there are leaders in the Democratic Party

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<v Speaker 3>like Elizabeth Warren, we're very anti crypto if you actually

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<v Speaker 3>look at a lot of it, Coinbase actually had a

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<v Speaker 3>very interesting sight breaking it down, there are a lot

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<v Speaker 3>of people in that party where extremely extremely pro crypto.

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<v Speaker 3>I think they could potentially want to take credit for Clarity,

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<v Speaker 3>not give that win to the Republicans, to say, hey,

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<v Speaker 3>we did this, flip the narrative.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't think they want to waste all this work.

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<v Speaker 3>I think the banks want clarity, I want the crypto

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<v Speaker 3>currency companies also want clarity.

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<v Speaker 2>I think they get it over the board.

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<v Speaker 3>I don't think they're going to want to hand it

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<v Speaker 3>over as a win to Trump, though, especially with some

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<v Speaker 3>of these things well, yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>With ethics. Now you've got Kennedy coming and.

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<v Speaker 1>Almost giving them an out because of housing, you start

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<v Speaker 1>to strengthen this position. I don't necessarily like it, but

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<v Speaker 1>I unfortunately believe that's

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<v Speaker 2>Kind of the play right now that we're dealing with