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<v Speaker 1>Oh bed of Bard, Hello, and welcome to the show.

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<v Speaker 2>This is the Cult of Conspiracy and I'm the Cage

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<v Speaker 2>to Night And today we are continuing with our holiday

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<v Speaker 2>season extravaganza, and today we are going to be talking

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<v Speaker 2>about Chris Proper, and by that we mean the American

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<v Speaker 2>traditions of Christmas that we all know and love. So

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<v Speaker 2>let's just go ahead and get this out of the

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<v Speaker 2>way now. There is a lot of controversies surrounding some

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<v Speaker 2>of the traditions of modern Christmas, specifically among the Christian community.

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<v Speaker 2>We've had for years now, we've had people talk about

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<v Speaker 2>how Santa and Satan are actually the same thing. They're

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<v Speaker 2>both red, they're both drunk, they both love children. It's

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<v Speaker 2>a whole thing, you know, whatever, right, and you just

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<v Speaker 2>change the words around and it's the same thing. It

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<v Speaker 2>is a take. It is a take. We have had

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<v Speaker 2>people talk about how bringing trees into your home during

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<v Speaker 2>this time is actually satanic and has spoken about in

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<v Speaker 2>Jeremiah ten. So it there is a section of the

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<v Speaker 2>Bible where they're talking about this. However, uh, there's a

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<v Speaker 2>bit of context missing from that section. So at the

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<v Speaker 2>gift giving, obviously it's try to recreate Saturnalia in all

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<v Speaker 2>these which is not exactly correct. It's obviously a combination

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<v Speaker 2>of so many winter Solstice traditions and that's why and

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<v Speaker 2>how Christmas became what it is. Historically speaking, that's also

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<v Speaker 2>not accurate, and today we're going to talk about that

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<v Speaker 2>and peel back some of the layers on this. So Raven,

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<v Speaker 2>I know that you have some opinions as far as

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<v Speaker 2>this is concerned. I mean, we've talked about the Yule

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<v Speaker 2>time of year, yes, which we are going to go

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<v Speaker 2>in depth on this episode of cult members, and some

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<v Speaker 2>of these traditions do overlap absolutely, but as we'll learn

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<v Speaker 2>here today, it's not just because there is a correlation

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<v Speaker 2>doesn't mean there's absolutely a connection. And that's that's something

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<v Speaker 2>that I feel like a lot of people miss overall.

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<v Speaker 2>For one, the solstice ends December twenty first every year.

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<v Speaker 3>But that's also a point of contention and argument because

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<v Speaker 3>of the Julie calendar and the other calendar that yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>they that actually the original solstice is actually the twenty

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<v Speaker 3>first and twenty fifth, but it's.

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<v Speaker 2>The day of the month or the actual date because

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<v Speaker 2>the sun is the shortest across the sky on the

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<v Speaker 2>same day regardless of whatever day we want.

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<v Speaker 3>To call it the day of the month.

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<v Speaker 2>Actually, so you're saying on the Julian count well, it

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<v Speaker 2>wouldn't be the Julians, the Gregorian, and the because the

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<v Speaker 2>Julian is a three sixty five calendar, so like there's

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<v Speaker 2>no months.

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<v Speaker 4>Here's the article that I actually gave to you.

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<v Speaker 3>It actually does talk about the specific solstice day, okay,

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<v Speaker 3>and the old day and how it ties into each other.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, Well, I'm excited to learn more about this. I

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<v Speaker 2>got a couple of articles pulled up. Ravenly as a

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<v Speaker 2>couple of articles pulled up, and we are going to

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<v Speaker 2>be talking about all this in depth. How much of

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<v Speaker 2>what we know about modern Christmas as far as American

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<v Speaker 2>traditions go, how much of that is rooted in paganism,

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<v Speaker 2>and how much of that is rooted in Christendom, Because,

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<v Speaker 2>as we've said, there's a few things that are they're

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<v Speaker 2>just fraught with misunderstanding, honestly, on both sides of that conversation.

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<v Speaker 2>To be completely honest here, I've seen so many scholars

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<v Speaker 2>come out and say that actually a lot of the

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<v Speaker 2>traditions that people think are pagan were actually adopted from

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<v Speaker 2>Christianity into pagan cultures as a way to prevent more

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<v Speaker 2>of their followers from turning Christian. But then we've also

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<v Speaker 2>heard other scholars say that the flip opposite is true

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<v Speaker 2>and that so many Christian churches started adopting pagan practices

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<v Speaker 2>to easily convert the pagans into Christendom. So I feel

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<v Speaker 2>like on this episode, as we peel back the layers,

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<v Speaker 2>we're going to answer some of those questions together, and

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<v Speaker 2>I'm excited.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, Christmas everyone.

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<v Speaker 2>Merry Christmas everyone.

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<v Speaker 3>We're gonna go ahead and get started here.

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<v Speaker 2>We're going to share the screen for anybody who would

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<v Speaker 2>like to see what we are talking about rather than

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<v Speaker 2>just hear about it. What you need to do is

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<v Speaker 2>go to patreon dot com slash Cult Conspiracy Podcast. That

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<v Speaker 2>is the only place where you will ever be able

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<v Speaker 2>to see the video of all of our episodes. We

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<v Speaker 2>have a couple of tiers for entry over there. If

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<v Speaker 2>you go to that five dollars a month tier, only

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<v Speaker 2>five dollars, that's a beer at a bar, that's one

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<v Speaker 2>that's not even a whole cocktail at a bar. Honestly,

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<v Speaker 2>you will get all of the videos of all the

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<v Speaker 2>episodes that we put up. You will get the episodes

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<v Speaker 2>a couple of days in advance, sometimes even up to

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<v Speaker 2>a week in advance. You'll get all of the behind

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<v Speaker 2>the scenes things. You will get the Q and A

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<v Speaker 2>sessions that we do. But more than anything, you will

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<v Speaker 2>also get these shows absolutely commercial free. Listening, y'all, absolutely listen.

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<v Speaker 2>Ads suck. Commercials suck. We know that. Kick the ads

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<v Speaker 2>out of here. Come to patreon dot com slash cult

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<v Speaker 2>But if you go to that ten dollars a month tier,

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<v Speaker 2>that third Eye all the way open tier, you will

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<v Speaker 2>also be able to join us for our Tuesday night

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<v Speaker 2>lives we host every Tuesday night at nine pm Central.

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<v Speaker 3>We hope to see you there.

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<v Speaker 2>It's always a blast, it's always unhinged, and we will

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<v Speaker 2>be doing it on the week of Christmas as well.

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<v Speaker 2>Which of that episode, as you know, gets dropped in kind,

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<v Speaker 2>that episode will be dropping as you're listening to this tomorrow,

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<v Speaker 2>will be dropping on Friday. But anyway, let's get into

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<v Speaker 2>a good cult members without any further ado. All right,

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<v Speaker 2>So to get started here, we had this article pulled

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<v Speaker 2>up yesterday as a matter of fact, but we felt

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<v Speaker 2>like it would actually do better on tonight's episodes. So

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<v Speaker 2>fifteen fascinating Winter Solstice traditions from around the world. Because

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<v Speaker 2>as we talk about Christmas, a lot of times Winter

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<v Speaker 2>Solstice comes up in the conversation. So let's learn a

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<v Speaker 2>little bit more about some of these more obscure traditions together.

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<v Speaker 2>So this is from readers Digest Winter Solstice traditions from

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<v Speaker 2>around the globe. Christmas isn't the only time for a

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<v Speaker 2>magical celebration. There's also Winter Solstice, a mystical event marking

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<v Speaker 2>the shortest day and longest night of the year. Across

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<v Speaker 2>the globe, people come together to honor this special day

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<v Speaker 2>with the unique Winter Solstice traditions, and we're excited to

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<v Speaker 2>share some of the most fascinating ones with you. In

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<v Speaker 2>the Northern Hemisphere, the winter Solstice usually falls around December

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<v Speaker 2>twenty first or December twenty second. In twenty twenty five,

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<v Speaker 2>it will be on December twenty first, while in the seconds.

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<v Speaker 3>It's tomorrow as of time recording.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, as listening to this on Christmas Day, which Merry

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<v Speaker 2>Christmas to everybody, But yeah, we recorded this on the

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<v Speaker 2>twentieth but uh yeah, so tomorrow is the solstice?

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<v Speaker 3>It is? It is.

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<v Speaker 2>Indeed, while in the southern hemisphere it's around June, ones

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<v Speaker 2>create creating festive wreaths and lighting candles to welcome the

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<v Speaker 2>return of longer days. From China to England, Guatemala and beyond,

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<v Speaker 2>people embrace the season with traditional foods, lively festivals, and

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<v Speaker 2>even more time honored rituals like sharing a cozy winter

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<v Speaker 2>quote or two. So keep reading to learn all about

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<v Speaker 2>the winter solstice, All right, cool, get reader to digest.

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<v Speaker 2>So now we have in British Columbia, Vancouver, they have

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<v Speaker 2>the Winter Solstice Lantern Festival.

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<v Speaker 3>I absolutely love the lantern festivals. I thought it's so gorgeous.

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<v Speaker 3>I thought the outlawed them because of all the forest

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<v Speaker 3>fires and shit. I don't believe. I think some countries

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<v Speaker 3>still have them. Some places still have them. They're beautiful though.

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<v Speaker 3>When they actually do have them, they actually have biodegradable

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<v Speaker 3>ones now, so that way they don't pollute anything.

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<v Speaker 2>That makes sense.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, they actually like kind of crumble with the water

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<v Speaker 3>and it's a whole thing.

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<v Speaker 2>So hell yeah. So if anybody doesn't know what this

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<v Speaker 2>is or doesn't know what it looks like, first of all,

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<v Speaker 2>just come to patreon dot com slash could conspiracy and

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<v Speaker 2>see for yourself. But if you've ever seen the movie Tangled, the.

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<v Speaker 4>Oh man, my favorite is that your favorite?

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<v Speaker 3>I love the love scene, the whole song. Oh yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>I know.

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<v Speaker 4>I immediately almost was like, mm, don't mind me.

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<v Speaker 3>As soon as I saw it, I was like, oh no,

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<v Speaker 3>But I'm also a sucker for romances, so I know

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<v Speaker 3>I might not look.

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<v Speaker 2>At Ryder was kind of a piece of shit though, true, true, true,

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<v Speaker 2>but I like super like the romance of the scene

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<v Speaker 2>itself was really great.

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<v Speaker 3>Fair Fair Yeah, he was kind of a hot, flipping mess.

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<v Speaker 2>It'd be like that sometimes, you know, but then you

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<v Speaker 2>know they change for the good ones where some do anyway,

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<v Speaker 2>But anyway, So the Winter Solstice Lantern Festival British Columbia

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<v Speaker 2>Vancouver or Vancouver, British Columbia. To honor the many culture

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<v Speaker 2>cultural Winter Solstice traditions, Vancouver's Secret Lantern Society created the

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<v Speaker 2>city's annual Winter Solstice Lantern Festival. Participants can attend workshops

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<v Speaker 2>to create their lanterns. On the night of the Solstice,

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<v Speaker 2>processions march through the city, culminating in fire performances. Attendees

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<v Speaker 2>can also try to find their way through the Labyrinth

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<v Speaker 2>of Light, a maze of six hundred candles that invites

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<v Speaker 2>visitors to let go of old thoughts and find new

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<v Speaker 2>possibilities for the new year. This year, the festival is

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<v Speaker 2>taking place on Saturday, December twenty first.

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<v Speaker 3>Okay, I want to do that so bad.

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<v Speaker 2>I think it's cool.

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<v Speaker 4>I think it's such a cool tradition.

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<v Speaker 2>That means we'd also have to go to Canada for

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<v Speaker 2>December though it's cold.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that's like freezing. That's like negative forty degrees like

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<v Speaker 3>it' to us.

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<v Speaker 2>It might as well be an Arctica. I know people

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<v Speaker 2>in BC are gonna be like, oh, oh, you folcan

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<v Speaker 2>Americans down there, you're so pussy. Yeah, okay, fine, fine, yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>But like they have special boots that their kids have

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<v Speaker 3>to weird to get on the bus so that they

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<v Speaker 3>don't freeze.

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<v Speaker 2>Listen if I have to shit.

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<v Speaker 3>I know this for a fact because my girlfriend lives

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<v Speaker 3>in Alberta and no Calgary, excuse me, and she used

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<v Speaker 3>to drive a bus and we talked to had a

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<v Speaker 3>huge conversation. She's like, yeah, we have to go buy

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<v Speaker 3>these the boots, And I was like, what boots? She's

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<v Speaker 3>like every year we have to buy these, you know,

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<v Speaker 3>expensive boots so that way the kids don't their feet

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<v Speaker 3>don't freeze because it's so cold outside when they have

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<v Speaker 3>to go get down the bus. And I'm like, no, no, listen,

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<v Speaker 3>buy me out, bro count me the fuck out. Like

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<v Speaker 3>I love snow, but not that much.

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<v Speaker 2>If I got to wear a special face mask because

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<v Speaker 2>the air going inside my lungs is so cold that

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<v Speaker 2>it might collapse my lungs. Otherwise, I don't need to

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<v Speaker 2>live there. That's that is that's psychotic, you know what.

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<v Speaker 3>There's a lot of awesome things though up there, but

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<v Speaker 3>he has She has so many cool adventures and stuff

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<v Speaker 3>that she goes and does. And I'm just jealous every

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<v Speaker 3>time that she tells me all all this cool stuff.

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<v Speaker 2>But and don't think I'm just shitting on Canada. Chicago.

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<v Speaker 2>They have to do the thing because the air is

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<v Speaker 2>too cold and will collapse their lungs. Like I don't

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<v Speaker 2>know why people live in Chicago either, So like, just

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<v Speaker 2>so we're clear, I'm not just shedding on our neighbors

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<v Speaker 2>to the Great White North. I'm talking about people even

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<v Speaker 2>in certain states in America. I don't understand why people

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<v Speaker 2>live that far away from the equator. It makes no

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<v Speaker 2>sense to me. People live everywhere that again, I get it.

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<v Speaker 2>I know this makes no sense that that doesn't even

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<v Speaker 2>make logical.

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<v Speaker 3>Sense to me.

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<v Speaker 2>Such a baby brow if you're literally fighting for survival

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<v Speaker 2>to breathe, to breathe.

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<v Speaker 4>But God, where is it.

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<v Speaker 3>It's not Norway Finland probably them too well, know the

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<v Speaker 3>ones that they leave all their babies out in the

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<v Speaker 3>strollers and those cool little the little zip up things,

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<v Speaker 3>and they all their babies that you can see like

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<v Speaker 3>little strollers all over the place of the baby sleeping outside.

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<v Speaker 2>So they want their children to get kidnapped.

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<v Speaker 3>They have it does not happen.

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<v Speaker 2>They don't only have a lot of crime there.

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<v Speaker 3>Now you should really I forget where it's at. And

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<v Speaker 3>I don't want to misspoke speak, but somewhere in the

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<v Speaker 3>great white north of your over there, there's a whole

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<v Speaker 3>cool thing you can watch about it like a whole

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<v Speaker 3>bunch of babies are just see little strollers with all

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<v Speaker 3>the little babies out there sleeping and the little vests

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<v Speaker 3>and stuff. And they yeah, it's to help, like they

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<v Speaker 3>actually change the body chemistry to be able to survive

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<v Speaker 3>in the colder environments and they sleep better though, So

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<v Speaker 3>to that.

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<v Speaker 2>Point, why would you live there if you have to

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<v Speaker 2>like train your infant child to survive there?

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<v Speaker 3>Perhaps, but they actually all sleep way better like they

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<v Speaker 3>do because of the cold your body. Have you ever

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<v Speaker 3>been really cold in your house and under your blankets

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<v Speaker 3>and you sleep so much? Sound like more soundly?

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<v Speaker 2>No, if I had my way, I would sleep in

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<v Speaker 2>eighty degrees every night.

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<v Speaker 3>You're absolutely discussing. I am aware.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't do that because my children are like, it's

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<v Speaker 2>so hot, and I'm like, you're in the south.

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<v Speaker 3>But is hot? Who sleeps? Who wants to sleep in

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<v Speaker 3>eighty to.

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<v Speaker 2>Your weather under a thick ass comforter live in my

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<v Speaker 2>best life?

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<v Speaker 3>You know what? Yeah, you're of the devil.

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<v Speaker 2>No, I am meant for tropical climates. I am just

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<v Speaker 2>simply not meant for the cold, that's all it is.

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<v Speaker 2>And for the record, I'm not Mexico. Their babies have

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<v Speaker 2>to get a climated to the parasite when they get

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<v Speaker 2>born because the water is so shit there, so like

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<v Speaker 2>it's not the same thing that's even closer to the

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<v Speaker 2>equator than us.

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<v Speaker 3>So I guess I don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>People are just people in the just complaining. Yeah, maybe

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<v Speaker 2>I'm just bitching little bit.

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<v Speaker 3>What this is Christmas? These people want holidays. Yeah, but

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<v Speaker 3>you're some cold weather. It's sorry, it isn't even affecting you.

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<v Speaker 3>Not right now.

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<v Speaker 2>It's like eighty outside. It's wonderful.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah it is.

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<v Speaker 4>It is actually really hot. Yesterday it was cold as balls.

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<v Speaker 3>Today it's hot because I'm telling you, the South is

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<v Speaker 3>a hormonal like menopausal woman. Yeah, straight up. That's what's happening.

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<v Speaker 3>Every two seconds is a hot flash. It's freezing cold,

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<v Speaker 3>it's raining, it's not it's like you you have to

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<v Speaker 3>pack everything in your car for whatever event might be

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<v Speaker 3>happening with the goddamn weather down here.

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<v Speaker 2>So seriously, Louisiana, and I know that a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>places have weather that swing's crazy. I get that Louisiana

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<v Speaker 2>has when Ravenlee is very much on par here. So

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<v Speaker 2>we have had sub freezing halloweens before, and we've had

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<v Speaker 2>ninety five degree halloweens before. Now cut to December. We

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<v Speaker 2>have had twenty degree decembers before. We have also had

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<v Speaker 2>ninety degree decembers. Like Christmas is Christmas morning, you wake up,

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<v Speaker 2>you go outside and like shorts in a tank and

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<v Speaker 2>like not because like, oh you just love the cold.

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<v Speaker 3>No, no, like it's that hot. And then there's other

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00:14:27.519 --> 00:14:29.919
<v Speaker 3>times we're by the pool today, yeah, like the kids

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00:14:29.919 --> 00:14:32.679
<v Speaker 3>were playing in the pool because it was in the

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00:14:32.720 --> 00:14:35.759
<v Speaker 3>eighties and it was it was actually really nice weather

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<v Speaker 3>though it was not too humid, it was not too hot.

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<v Speaker 3>It was just the right temperature outside.

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<v Speaker 2>So but we're also in that time where the morning

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<v Speaker 2>time will be balls cold.

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<v Speaker 3>Yes, it was forty No, it's like forty one degrees

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00:14:49.799 --> 00:14:53.320
<v Speaker 3>this morning, so forty one to eighty. Yeah, and it

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00:14:53.360 --> 00:14:56.840
<v Speaker 3>only it happens within hours, like you're talking like two hours.

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<v Speaker 3>It can change and then all of a sudden it

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<v Speaker 3>will rain sometimes and then all like mon soon, which,

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<v Speaker 3>by the way, for the people that don't live in

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<v Speaker 3>the South, that have never experienced an actual monsoon down here,

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<v Speaker 3>I tried to explain it to people when I first

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<v Speaker 3>moved to the South, I'm like, what kind of weather

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<v Speaker 3>is happening right now?

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<v Speaker 2>For the days of the sky telling you to go fuck.

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<v Speaker 4>Yourself, I've lived in the rain.

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<v Speaker 3>Actually currently shout out to all of my Oregonians right

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<v Speaker 3>now that are currently dealing with the flood. My family

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00:15:24.000 --> 00:15:26.080
<v Speaker 3>is actually dealing with a lot of flood issues. They're

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<v Speaker 3>evacuating a lot of places. So I hope that you

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<v Speaker 3>all are safe, and I hope that everything is working

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<v Speaker 3>out now that it's been a few days from what's

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<v Speaker 3>happening as of current right now, but as of right

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<v Speaker 3>now it is flooding big time and organ and is

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00:15:38.320 --> 00:15:41.159
<v Speaker 3>expected to flood more. So hopefully you're all doing well.

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<v Speaker 3>But that being said, they down here when it rains,

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<v Speaker 3>like when it the little term rains cats and dogs

317
00:15:49.240 --> 00:15:52.120
<v Speaker 3>is what it's doing. It's such bad rain you can't

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00:15:52.159 --> 00:15:54.919
<v Speaker 3>even see your hood of your car, Yeah, which is

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00:15:54.919 --> 00:15:57.519
<v Speaker 3>completely different than the rain that I've experienced until I

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<v Speaker 3>moved down here. And then I try to explain it

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<v Speaker 3>to them. You don't understand, like it's it's it doesn't

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00:16:01.840 --> 00:16:04.720
<v Speaker 3>just like kind of rain. It's like motherfucker ray.

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<v Speaker 2>And then we even have rain when the sun's out,

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00:16:07.320 --> 00:16:10.399
<v Speaker 2>like yeah, every day when the devil's beating his wife,

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00:16:10.559 --> 00:16:12.600
<v Speaker 2>and that's the expression in the South, when it's raining

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<v Speaker 2>and the sun is shining.

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<v Speaker 3>That happens a lot every single day, though at about

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<v Speaker 3>two o'clock. At about two o'clock, without fail, from two

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00:16:19.960 --> 00:16:22.559
<v Speaker 3>to four, you'll likely have it happen in the summer.

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<v Speaker 3>In the summer, yeah, it just it will be what

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00:16:24.919 --> 00:16:26.840
<v Speaker 3>it is, and it will be nice outside. It might

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00:16:26.840 --> 00:16:28.960
<v Speaker 3>the humidity might not be too bad, but then that

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00:16:29.039 --> 00:16:32.320
<v Speaker 3>motherfucker rains, and then it's so god awful you can

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00:16:32.399 --> 00:16:33.919
<v Speaker 3>like taste it in your mouth. Oh.

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00:16:33.919 --> 00:16:37.039
<v Speaker 2>The worst is whenever it's just a fifteen to twenty

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00:16:37.080 --> 00:16:40.240
<v Speaker 2>minute days and then it just lifts and the sun's

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00:16:40.240 --> 00:16:43.399
<v Speaker 2>out shining. It's just enough to make everything super wet

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<v Speaker 2>and now superhumid.

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00:16:45.039 --> 00:16:48.120
<v Speaker 3>It's some mosquitoes. It's some mosquitoes that pissed me off

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<v Speaker 3>the most.

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00:16:48.559 --> 00:16:50.399
<v Speaker 2>You got to make peace with them. You gotta make

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00:16:50.399 --> 00:16:51.080
<v Speaker 2>a deal with them.

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00:16:51.279 --> 00:16:54.440
<v Speaker 4>No, they're bastards, like they should all die.

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00:16:54.519 --> 00:16:56.840
<v Speaker 2>And then there's that chemical biological thing where some people

345
00:16:56.879 --> 00:16:57.480
<v Speaker 2>just don't get.

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00:16:57.320 --> 00:16:59.240
<v Speaker 3>Bit Yeah well I have that. I don't have that.

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00:16:59.320 --> 00:17:02.320
<v Speaker 3>I have that blood you got, I got that blood type.

348
00:17:02.320 --> 00:17:05.240
<v Speaker 3>They're like hmm, it's all good girl, And I'm like, no, bitch,

349
00:17:05.279 --> 00:17:07.000
<v Speaker 3>go away. Yeah, that's a thing.

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<v Speaker 2>That a thing anyway, All right, back to the Christmas

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<v Speaker 2>conversation here. Christmas midwinter day in Antarctica, whyes on the solstice.

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<v Speaker 2>Antarctica has a tradition believe it or not.

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<v Speaker 3>Wait, there's no settlements, so that are permanently They don't

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00:17:20.640 --> 00:17:23.400
<v Speaker 3>have permanent residence of Antarctica.

355
00:17:22.640 --> 00:17:27.000
<v Speaker 2>But they have had people working there quite some time.

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<v Speaker 2>This goes back to eighteen ninety eight.

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<v Speaker 3>Eight turned narder Hurt in the year of all Old.

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<v Speaker 2>Indeed, on June twenty first, in the heart of Antarctica,

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00:17:36.319 --> 00:17:40.559
<v Speaker 2>which is their winter solstices in June, right the heart

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00:17:40.640 --> 00:17:43.440
<v Speaker 2>of Antartica comes alive with the winter solstice tradition of

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00:17:43.440 --> 00:17:47.640
<v Speaker 2>celebrating midwinter. For most national bases, this is the biggest

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<v Speaker 2>event of the year, out shining even Christmas or other

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00:17:50.599 --> 00:17:54.319
<v Speaker 2>traditional holidays. The very first midwinter celebration dates back to

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00:17:54.480 --> 00:17:57.000
<v Speaker 2>eighteen ninety eight and is still a time filled with

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00:17:57.279 --> 00:18:01.480
<v Speaker 2>icy swims, gift exchanges, warm greetings, and plenty a festive fun.

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00:18:02.279 --> 00:18:04.759
<v Speaker 4>Sounds like you just want to be there, no icy,

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00:18:04.960 --> 00:18:05.680
<v Speaker 4>icy swims.

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00:18:06.359 --> 00:18:07.440
<v Speaker 3>I'm good, yummy.

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00:18:07.960 --> 00:18:11.079
<v Speaker 2>So this is these people in Antarctica in the eighteen

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00:18:11.359 --> 00:18:15.839
<v Speaker 2>hundreds celebrating this. But I know it's ice wand nobody

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00:18:15.880 --> 00:18:20.519
<v Speaker 2>can go there, but whatever. Anyway, moving on, Saturnalia in

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<v Speaker 2>Rome in Rome, which and you'll see on screen right now,

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<v Speaker 2>these are people that are re enacting a Saturnalia parade

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00:18:27.359 --> 00:18:29.839
<v Speaker 2>for lack of better words, although they do not do

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00:18:30.039 --> 00:18:32.599
<v Speaker 2>the traditions of like the slaves and the masters swap

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00:18:32.720 --> 00:18:34.480
<v Speaker 2>roles for a day, and like all. There was a

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00:18:34.480 --> 00:18:36.519
<v Speaker 2>lot of things that went into Saturnalia, and it became

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00:18:36.599 --> 00:18:38.359
<v Speaker 2>it was supposed to be like a two day festival.

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00:18:38.680 --> 00:18:40.279
<v Speaker 2>Before it was all said and done, it became like

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00:18:40.359 --> 00:18:43.480
<v Speaker 2>a ten day free for all in Roman society. It

381
00:18:43.519 --> 00:18:47.279
<v Speaker 2>was just wild things. So let's read about it together

382
00:18:47.359 --> 00:18:50.480
<v Speaker 2>here in Rome. Saturnalia is an ancient Roman festival and

383
00:18:50.599 --> 00:18:53.839
<v Speaker 2>is often seen as a forerunner to modern Christmas celebrations.

384
00:18:54.000 --> 00:18:56.720
<v Speaker 2>This lively holiday was a time for honoring their Roman

385
00:18:56.759 --> 00:19:01.000
<v Speaker 2>gods Saturn and embracing pagan winter Solstice traditions. Originally hailed

386
00:19:01.039 --> 00:19:04.279
<v Speaker 2>on December seventeenth, the festivities were so beloved that they

387
00:19:04.279 --> 00:19:07.079
<v Speaker 2>were extended to last from the seventeenth to the twenty third,

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00:19:07.480 --> 00:19:11.200
<v Speaker 2>filled with feasts, gift giving and more. While Saturnalia isn't

389
00:19:11.240 --> 00:19:14.160
<v Speaker 2>widely celebrated today, the city of Chester in the UK

390
00:19:14.319 --> 00:19:18.039
<v Speaker 2>keeps the tradition of live in honor of its Roman history. Yeah,

391
00:19:18.119 --> 00:19:21.720
<v Speaker 2>let UK be doing the Roman holidays. Yes, I understand

392
00:19:21.720 --> 00:19:23.440
<v Speaker 2>they had of settlement out that way, but like that

393
00:19:23.599 --> 00:19:27.039
<v Speaker 2>is the outermost borderland of the Roman Empire for a

394
00:19:27.160 --> 00:19:32.000
<v Speaker 2>very small snippet of time. But okay, sure, each year

395
00:19:32.200 --> 00:19:34.920
<v Speaker 2>Roman soldiers marched through the city center, handing out glow

396
00:19:35.000 --> 00:19:38.039
<v Speaker 2>sticks and adorning their homes with greenery, bringing a touch

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00:19:38.039 --> 00:19:42.480
<v Speaker 2>of ancient festivity to the modern times. Okay, okay, I

398
00:19:42.559 --> 00:19:44.200
<v Speaker 2>honestly didn't know. I thought that was in Rome.

399
00:19:44.920 --> 00:19:48.039
<v Speaker 4>I actually thought it was Rome too, so I didn't

400
00:19:48.079 --> 00:19:49.000
<v Speaker 4>know it was the UK.

401
00:19:49.319 --> 00:19:51.160
<v Speaker 2>Leave it to the British. Tell me more about your

402
00:19:51.240 --> 00:19:58.640
<v Speaker 2>cultural appropriation anyway. Saint Lucia Day, okay. In Scandinavia, as

403
00:19:58.640 --> 00:20:03.200
<v Speaker 2>with many modern celebrations, ancient festivals observing the winter solstice

404
00:20:03.279 --> 00:20:05.960
<v Speaker 2>merged with the newer winter solstice rituals to create the

405
00:20:06.000 --> 00:20:09.799
<v Speaker 2>holiday season as we know today. In Scandinavia, Saint Lucia Day,

406
00:20:09.960 --> 00:20:13.480
<v Speaker 2>also known as Saint Lucie's Day, on December thirteenth is

407
00:20:13.680 --> 00:20:16.680
<v Speaker 2>the solstice. By the old calendar, it marks the start

408
00:20:16.720 --> 00:20:19.039
<v Speaker 2>of the Christmas season. So the old calendar that you

409
00:20:19.039 --> 00:20:21.559
<v Speaker 2>were referring to earlier puts solstice at the thirteenth, not

410
00:20:21.640 --> 00:20:25.400
<v Speaker 2>the twenty first. That's interesting, now, that might be a

411
00:20:26.200 --> 00:20:29.319
<v Speaker 2>Nordic calendar as opposed to a Greek or Roman, because

412
00:20:29.319 --> 00:20:31.279
<v Speaker 2>that's the other thing too. The Gregorian was the Roman.

413
00:20:31.880 --> 00:20:35.000
<v Speaker 2>I forget what the Greeks had it listed as. But

414
00:20:35.079 --> 00:20:37.880
<v Speaker 2>then in this is just Scandinavia, maybe like the Normans

415
00:20:37.920 --> 00:20:39.799
<v Speaker 2>had a different one, maybe the Danes had a different one.

416
00:20:39.839 --> 00:20:42.640
<v Speaker 2>That's you know, especially with the Viking cultures, a lot

417
00:20:42.680 --> 00:20:45.839
<v Speaker 2>of things do traverse, but there are some very key

418
00:20:45.920 --> 00:20:48.440
<v Speaker 2>differences from tribe to tribe. So maybe that's something here.

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00:20:48.559 --> 00:20:49.000
<v Speaker 3>I don't know.

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00:20:49.880 --> 00:20:51.720
<v Speaker 2>The Solstice, by the old calendar marks the start of

421
00:20:51.720 --> 00:20:54.839
<v Speaker 2>the Christmas season. A procession of young women in white robes,

422
00:20:54.920 --> 00:20:58.039
<v Speaker 2>red sashes and wreaths of candles on their heads lights

423
00:20:58.079 --> 00:21:00.880
<v Speaker 2>the way through the darkness of winter, honoring Saint Lucia

424
00:21:01.039 --> 00:21:06.000
<v Speaker 2>aka Saint Lucy. This festival incorporates pagan winter solstice traditions,

425
00:21:06.000 --> 00:21:10.519
<v Speaker 2>marked by bonfires, ginger snaps, saffron flavored buns, and glog.

426
00:21:11.880 --> 00:21:16.240
<v Speaker 3>Glog is that like a grog. It's a it's an ale, okay,

427
00:21:16.279 --> 00:21:16.880
<v Speaker 3>so it's a drink.

428
00:21:17.119 --> 00:21:22.400
<v Speaker 2>It's a drink, are traditionally served. Interesting Moving on, the

429
00:21:22.640 --> 00:21:27.160
<v Speaker 2>dong Z Festival in China. So the dong Z Festival

430
00:21:27.240 --> 00:21:30.880
<v Speaker 2>is a that is eight thousands. Yeah, it says a thousands,

431
00:21:31.000 --> 00:21:32.880
<v Speaker 2>which is weird. So yeah, it's one thousands of years

432
00:21:32.880 --> 00:21:35.960
<v Speaker 2>old festival that takes place between December twenty first and

433
00:21:36.000 --> 00:21:39.039
<v Speaker 2>December twenty third each year. The day is celebrated with

434
00:21:39.079 --> 00:21:42.000
<v Speaker 2>family gatherings and a big meal including rice balls called

435
00:21:42.160 --> 00:21:48.200
<v Speaker 2>tang wan probably mispronounced it, my apologies. Thought to mark

436
00:21:48.240 --> 00:21:50.559
<v Speaker 2>the end of the harvest season. The holiday also has

437
00:21:50.640 --> 00:21:54.240
<v Speaker 2>roots in Chinese concept of ying and yang. After the solstice,

438
00:21:54.279 --> 00:21:56.480
<v Speaker 2>the abundance of darkness in winter will begin to be

439
00:21:56.599 --> 00:21:58.079
<v Speaker 2>balanced with the light of the sun.

440
00:21:58.400 --> 00:22:00.359
<v Speaker 3>I don't know if you've ever seen the festival and

441
00:22:00.880 --> 00:22:03.160
<v Speaker 3>how they do it. It's not, oh, it's really cool

442
00:22:03.559 --> 00:22:05.519
<v Speaker 3>people making like rice ball. Yeah, but they have a

443
00:22:05.519 --> 00:22:07.519
<v Speaker 3>whole bunch of like cool stuff that they do with it,

444
00:22:07.599 --> 00:22:10.359
<v Speaker 3>and the decorations are so vibrant and all out and

445
00:22:10.400 --> 00:22:12.400
<v Speaker 3>stuff like that. So yeah, I know it's it's actually

446
00:22:12.440 --> 00:22:14.960
<v Speaker 3>a really cool festival that's cool as hell.

447
00:22:15.359 --> 00:22:17.119
<v Speaker 2>And that's not really around the Chinese New Year, if

448
00:22:17.160 --> 00:22:20.200
<v Speaker 2>I'm not mistaken. There's is like in was like September

449
00:22:20.319 --> 00:22:21.440
<v Speaker 2>or something as the Chinese New Year.

450
00:22:21.720 --> 00:22:24.119
<v Speaker 3>I actually don't know. I just actually know that that

451
00:22:24.160 --> 00:22:25.599
<v Speaker 3>festival in particular.

452
00:22:25.480 --> 00:22:27.279
<v Speaker 2>Google that because I want to misspeak on that, because

453
00:22:27.279 --> 00:22:29.920
<v Speaker 2>I remember seeing Chinese New Year stuff every so often.

454
00:22:29.960 --> 00:22:32.599
<v Speaker 2>It's like, wait, this is when they celebrate it and it's.

455
00:22:32.480 --> 00:22:33.440
<v Speaker 3>Not Stone Hinge.

456
00:22:33.720 --> 00:22:36.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, let's talk about this when the Stone Hinge

457
00:22:36.960 --> 00:22:38.079
<v Speaker 2>gathering yet again.

458
00:22:38.480 --> 00:22:41.960
<v Speaker 3>England, I cannot wait to go, yeah to the festivals.

459
00:22:42.000 --> 00:22:43.759
<v Speaker 4>There's three festivals that they are.

460
00:22:44.039 --> 00:22:46.480
<v Speaker 3>They have now made such a big thing that you

461
00:22:46.519 --> 00:22:49.079
<v Speaker 3>can actually travel to and I know a couple people

462
00:22:49.079 --> 00:22:51.400
<v Speaker 3>that are going next year. Hell yeah.

463
00:22:51.440 --> 00:22:54.359
<v Speaker 2>So in England, although no one knows exactly why the

464
00:22:54.400 --> 00:22:57.200
<v Speaker 2>ancient circle of stone Hinge was built, there's no denying

465
00:22:57.200 --> 00:22:59.200
<v Speaker 2>it lines up with the movement of the sun. It's

466
00:22:59.240 --> 00:23:03.000
<v Speaker 2>only it's one the global monuments built around the summer solstice.

467
00:23:03.240 --> 00:23:07.400
<v Speaker 2>So we're talking about summer solstice and archaeological research suggests

468
00:23:07.440 --> 00:23:09.599
<v Speaker 2>that winter solstice festivals happened there.

469
00:23:09.799 --> 00:23:12.319
<v Speaker 3>That makes sense. Oh it says the first day of

470
00:23:12.359 --> 00:23:14.720
<v Speaker 3>the Chinese New Year falls on the new moon that

471
00:23:14.799 --> 00:23:17.559
<v Speaker 3>appears between the twenty first of January and the twentieth

472
00:23:17.559 --> 00:23:18.319
<v Speaker 3>of February.

473
00:23:18.519 --> 00:23:21.119
<v Speaker 2>Oh, I was off, I said September. So it's in January,

474
00:23:21.799 --> 00:23:24.480
<v Speaker 2>but later in January it's the Chinese New year. H okay,

475
00:23:24.599 --> 00:23:25.119
<v Speaker 2>fair enough.

476
00:23:25.720 --> 00:23:27.960
<v Speaker 3>So it says as of twenty twenty six, it will

477
00:23:27.960 --> 00:23:29.799
<v Speaker 3>be February seventeenth.

478
00:23:29.839 --> 00:23:33.920
<v Speaker 2>Got you wow, middle of February. Yeah, that's interesting.

479
00:23:34.720 --> 00:23:35.079
<v Speaker 3>I don't know.

480
00:23:35.440 --> 00:23:38.759
<v Speaker 4>Sorry everyone, I interrupted the Stonehenge.

481
00:23:38.799 --> 00:23:39.119
<v Speaker 3>Sorry.

482
00:23:39.359 --> 00:23:42.759
<v Speaker 2>So they say that Winter Solstice festivals happened at Stonehenge

483
00:23:42.759 --> 00:23:46.359
<v Speaker 2>as well. Historically speaking, modern rivelers have taken up the

484
00:23:46.400 --> 00:23:49.480
<v Speaker 2>tradition gathering at dawn the day after the longest night

485
00:23:49.519 --> 00:23:51.920
<v Speaker 2>to witness the magical occurrence of the sun rising through

486
00:23:51.920 --> 00:23:55.079
<v Speaker 2>the stones. The best part, it's free of charge, although

487
00:23:55.119 --> 00:23:57.599
<v Speaker 2>parking as limited. Visitors can even walk right up to

488
00:23:57.640 --> 00:24:00.559
<v Speaker 2>the stones, an area usually roped off for the peaceful

489
00:24:00.640 --> 00:24:02.440
<v Speaker 2>and sacred Winter Solstice celebration.

490
00:24:02.640 --> 00:24:05.240
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. So last year they had this really cool gathering

491
00:24:05.839 --> 00:24:07.880
<v Speaker 3>that they did and they I watched the whole thing

492
00:24:08.000 --> 00:24:10.680
<v Speaker 3>live while it was happening, and they were actually able

493
00:24:10.680 --> 00:24:13.519
<v Speaker 3>to all go up to stone, the actual stones, and

494
00:24:13.519 --> 00:24:16.640
<v Speaker 3>they had like about a thousand people gathered, and it

495
00:24:16.680 --> 00:24:18.720
<v Speaker 3>was a really cool festival that they had, and they

496
00:24:18.720 --> 00:24:22.039
<v Speaker 3>had one they had the certain performers that were being

497
00:24:22.079 --> 00:24:25.480
<v Speaker 3>the stars of the whole festivities and stuff.

498
00:24:25.720 --> 00:24:26.440
<v Speaker 2>That's really cool.

499
00:24:26.519 --> 00:24:30.240
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, they all got dressed up everyone was in you know, garb.

500
00:24:30.279 --> 00:24:32.519
<v Speaker 3>Everyone had their face painted and it was really cool.

501
00:24:32.920 --> 00:24:38.119
<v Speaker 2>Yes, indeed, hmm. So moving on, let's go into shab

502
00:24:38.519 --> 00:24:44.119
<v Speaker 2>I Yalda in Iran. Okay, this's an ancient Persian festival,

503
00:24:44.160 --> 00:24:47.240
<v Speaker 2>so this probably has its roots in Zoroastrianism rather than

504
00:24:47.440 --> 00:24:51.039
<v Speaker 2>the Iranian you know, Muslim takeover that took place. But anyway,

505
00:24:51.599 --> 00:24:55.279
<v Speaker 2>an ancient Persian festival, like many other winter solstice holidays,

506
00:24:55.359 --> 00:24:58.000
<v Speaker 2>celebrates the end of the shorter days and the victory

507
00:24:58.000 --> 00:25:01.759
<v Speaker 2>of light over darkness meaning bird y'all dub is marked

508
00:25:01.759 --> 00:25:06.000
<v Speaker 2>by family gatherings, candles originally fires lit all night, poetry readings,

509
00:25:06.000 --> 00:25:07.839
<v Speaker 2>and a feast to get through the longest night of

510
00:25:07.880 --> 00:25:11.160
<v Speaker 2>the year. Nuts and fruits, including watermelon and pomegranates, are

511
00:25:11.200 --> 00:25:15.200
<v Speaker 2>traditionally eaten. Legend has that eating these fruits of summer

512
00:25:15.319 --> 00:25:17.359
<v Speaker 2>will protect you from the illness in winter.

513
00:25:18.480 --> 00:25:21.200
<v Speaker 4>I really like that. Actually, wow, I'm not gonna lie.

514
00:25:21.480 --> 00:25:22.920
<v Speaker 3>That's something I might want to adopt.

515
00:25:23.359 --> 00:25:27.720
<v Speaker 2>Eating watermelon for the solstice. Yeah, that's I didn't know.

516
00:25:28.279 --> 00:25:28.480
<v Speaker 3>Cool.

517
00:25:28.519 --> 00:25:30.960
<v Speaker 2>The pomegranates I could see, you know, that's that's definitely

518
00:25:30.960 --> 00:25:31.279
<v Speaker 2>a thing.

519
00:25:31.440 --> 00:25:33.839
<v Speaker 3>Oh, hey, did you get the log? I did the

520
00:25:33.880 --> 00:25:36.799
<v Speaker 3>poop dog will commence. I did. I did. I tell

521
00:25:36.880 --> 00:25:39.519
<v Speaker 3>my kids all about it today. We actually I had

522
00:25:39.559 --> 00:25:42.319
<v Speaker 3>pulled the article and they're like, Okay, we're pumped to

523
00:25:42.319 --> 00:25:43.319
<v Speaker 3>do this, we need to do this.

524
00:25:43.519 --> 00:25:45.640
<v Speaker 2>I told my family about it, and they looked at

525
00:25:45.640 --> 00:25:47.279
<v Speaker 2>me like I had a dick growing out in my forehead.

526
00:25:47.799 --> 00:25:50.400
<v Speaker 3>My kids were like, we wait, show me the picture.

527
00:25:50.799 --> 00:25:52.160
<v Speaker 3>So I showed them the picture.

528
00:25:52.039 --> 00:25:54.079
<v Speaker 2>Not my kids, because we just came from a family

529
00:25:54.119 --> 00:25:56.039
<v Speaker 2>get together, and I was telling my brother and my

530
00:25:56.400 --> 00:25:58.200
<v Speaker 2>brother in law and my dad and they're like, they

531
00:25:58.240 --> 00:26:01.640
<v Speaker 2>do what now? Shit out of this log knit poops,

532
00:26:01.759 --> 00:26:04.640
<v Speaker 2>candy and presents and they're like, that's weird.

533
00:26:05.119 --> 00:26:06.319
<v Speaker 3>So I'm here for it though.

534
00:26:06.880 --> 00:26:08.519
<v Speaker 2>Even the article said the more you think about, the

535
00:26:08.559 --> 00:26:10.559
<v Speaker 2>less sense it makes. Just roll with it, and they're like, nah,

536
00:26:10.640 --> 00:26:12.279
<v Speaker 2>we're good, we're gonna I'm.

537
00:26:12.160 --> 00:26:14.559
<v Speaker 3>Like, I think we're gonna have to do tomorrow. Maybe

538
00:26:14.559 --> 00:26:16.720
<v Speaker 3>we'll grab a watermelon. I think it's gonna have to

539
00:26:16.759 --> 00:26:19.559
<v Speaker 3>happen if you can find one Walmart.

540
00:26:20.039 --> 00:26:21.599
<v Speaker 2>Does Walmart sell watermelons right now?

541
00:26:21.640 --> 00:26:26.440
<v Speaker 3>Probably they have no seasonal shit anymore. Really, they pretty

542
00:26:26.480 --> 00:26:27.279
<v Speaker 3>much year round.

543
00:26:27.599 --> 00:26:28.880
<v Speaker 2>You can find chunks. I don't know if you'll be

544
00:26:28.920 --> 00:26:30.480
<v Speaker 2>able to find a whole one, but you'll definitely able

545
00:26:30.480 --> 00:26:31.799
<v Speaker 2>to find like chunks for sure.

546
00:26:32.000 --> 00:26:35.319
<v Speaker 3>All right, yeah, we'll make it, we'll make it. Oh yeah.

547
00:26:35.400 --> 00:26:38.000
<v Speaker 2>So if you eat summer fruits during the winter solstice,

548
00:26:38.079 --> 00:26:40.519
<v Speaker 2>it will prevent you from.

549
00:26:39.920 --> 00:26:42.519
<v Speaker 3>What is it, kem burrow on the screen for.

550
00:26:42.880 --> 00:26:46.720
<v Speaker 2>Let's talk about that kaby bara toji, which is a

551
00:26:46.759 --> 00:26:50.519
<v Speaker 2>festival in Japan the winter solstice in Japan called toji.

552
00:26:50.599 --> 00:26:53.079
<v Speaker 3>Do they eat them? Uh? Oh no?

553
00:26:53.240 --> 00:26:55.200
<v Speaker 2>Which you know, that's a thing that the Catholic Church

554
00:26:55.200 --> 00:26:56.720
<v Speaker 2>had to give the blessing one.

555
00:26:57.279 --> 00:26:58.880
<v Speaker 3>To eat the kabby barro.

556
00:26:58.880 --> 00:27:04.440
<v Speaker 2>Okay, so tangent side tangent. This is so listen, listen, listen, listen, Linda. Okay,

557
00:27:04.440 --> 00:27:09.960
<v Speaker 2>here's what happened. Everybody, listen, Linda, listen. So back in

558
00:27:10.039 --> 00:27:12.200
<v Speaker 2>the day, back in the day when there was Jesuit

559
00:27:12.240 --> 00:27:15.480
<v Speaker 2>missionaries that were working in Latin America Lent what happened

560
00:27:16.000 --> 00:27:20.240
<v Speaker 2>and they had to get special permission to eat this

561
00:27:20.400 --> 00:27:22.839
<v Speaker 2>animal during Lent because you're only supposed to eat fish.

562
00:27:23.079 --> 00:27:27.079
<v Speaker 2>And they're like, listen, Pope, this animal spends more time

563
00:27:27.079 --> 00:27:29.599
<v Speaker 2>in the water than on land. I think we should

564
00:27:29.640 --> 00:27:31.720
<v Speaker 2>call that a fish. And the Pope's like send it

565
00:27:31.799 --> 00:27:33.880
<v Speaker 2>good to go. So they started being able to eat

566
00:27:33.920 --> 00:27:36.880
<v Speaker 2>the cappy bar during limp because they was classified as

567
00:27:36.880 --> 00:27:37.960
<v Speaker 2>a fish by the Catholic Church.

568
00:27:40.039 --> 00:27:42.920
<v Speaker 3>Wild shit, y'all. Yep, I'm gonna leave that where it is.

569
00:27:43.079 --> 00:27:45.920
<v Speaker 2>Oh, it's ridiculous. It's fucking ridiculous. Although I want to

570
00:27:45.960 --> 00:27:49.400
<v Speaker 2>try it, I'm assuming it tastes like neutra, which is delicious.

571
00:27:49.759 --> 00:27:50.160
<v Speaker 3>I don't know.

572
00:27:51.640 --> 00:27:52.559
<v Speaker 2>How are they nasty?

573
00:27:52.799 --> 00:27:56.200
<v Speaker 3>Is it the look they look like the beavers look

574
00:27:56.279 --> 00:27:56.960
<v Speaker 3>better than they do.

575
00:27:57.160 --> 00:27:58.519
<v Speaker 2>They look like a stumptail beaver.

576
00:27:59.039 --> 00:28:01.880
<v Speaker 3>They just they crazy as shit looking.

577
00:28:02.039 --> 00:28:05.599
<v Speaker 2>They only eat fresh vegetation. They never eat anything rotten

578
00:28:05.680 --> 00:28:05.920
<v Speaker 2>or bad.

579
00:28:06.039 --> 00:28:07.960
<v Speaker 3>It's just nasty looking. Every time I see when, I'm

580
00:28:08.000 --> 00:28:11.160
<v Speaker 3>just like, oh, cru they're so tasty. They remind me. God,

581
00:28:11.160 --> 00:28:12.920
<v Speaker 3>they remind me that movie where they had those big

582
00:28:12.960 --> 00:28:15.160
<v Speaker 3>ash rats that would come across the screen. That's what

583
00:28:15.200 --> 00:28:15.799
<v Speaker 3>they remind me.

584
00:28:15.759 --> 00:28:18.240
<v Speaker 2>Of, Princess Bride. Yes, yeah, all right.

585
00:28:19.240 --> 00:28:21.480
<v Speaker 3>I know, so sad, that's what it reminds me of,

586
00:28:21.480 --> 00:28:25.240
<v Speaker 3>doing fucking nasty things. Anyway, So moving on here.

587
00:28:25.279 --> 00:28:27.720
<v Speaker 2>This is called toji in Japan, and it has a

588
00:28:27.720 --> 00:28:31.880
<v Speaker 2>few interesting customs associated with it. Traditionally, a winter squash

589
00:28:31.960 --> 00:28:35.240
<v Speaker 2>called kobacha is eaten, one of only a few crops

590
00:28:35.279 --> 00:28:37.599
<v Speaker 2>that would have even been available in the days of old.

591
00:28:37.960 --> 00:28:40.200
<v Speaker 2>You'll feel as if you were on a warm winter

592
00:28:40.279 --> 00:28:46.440
<v Speaker 2>getaway after taking a hot bath with uzu yuzu uzu

593
00:28:46.599 --> 00:28:49.440
<v Speaker 2>citrus frind fruits. So I guess it's like a their

594
00:28:49.519 --> 00:28:50.400
<v Speaker 2>version of orange.

595
00:28:51.039 --> 00:28:51.359
<v Speaker 3>Okay.

596
00:28:51.880 --> 00:28:54.359
<v Speaker 2>The bath is believed to refresh the body and spirit,

597
00:28:54.440 --> 00:28:57.119
<v Speaker 2>ward off illness and soothe dry winter skin.

598
00:28:58.000 --> 00:28:59.200
<v Speaker 3>It's actually really nice.

599
00:28:59.400 --> 00:29:02.839
<v Speaker 2>Apparently, rodents called kapy barrows love yu zoo bats as well,

600
00:29:03.279 --> 00:29:06.079
<v Speaker 2>and in a modern twist on an age old tradition,

601
00:29:06.519 --> 00:29:09.000
<v Speaker 2>some Japanese zoos will throw the fruit into the warm

602
00:29:09.000 --> 00:29:12.480
<v Speaker 2>waters that the animals will soak in on the winter solstice.

603
00:29:12.640 --> 00:29:14.839
<v Speaker 3>Thank god they're not eating them, man, cause I mean

604
00:29:14.920 --> 00:29:18.880
<v Speaker 3>Japan be and Japan was just out there for a second.

605
00:29:18.880 --> 00:29:21.480
<v Speaker 3>I was like, oh God, they're like so beloved by

606
00:29:21.519 --> 00:29:23.640
<v Speaker 3>the kids nowadays, and I'm like, oh real, Oh.

607
00:29:23.559 --> 00:29:25.960
<v Speaker 2>My daughter hates them because of what happened when we

608
00:29:26.039 --> 00:29:30.440
<v Speaker 2>met them. Oh no, last Christmas or two Christmases ago.

609
00:29:30.519 --> 00:29:34.720
<v Speaker 2>Excuse me. There was like this glorified massive petting zoo

610
00:29:34.720 --> 00:29:37.319
<v Speaker 2>where you could also do pancakes with Santa, which for

611
00:29:37.400 --> 00:29:40.160
<v Speaker 2>the record, I've never been to a positive pancakes with

612
00:29:40.160 --> 00:29:41.039
<v Speaker 2>Santa get together.

613
00:29:41.440 --> 00:29:41.960
<v Speaker 3>There's none.

614
00:29:42.079 --> 00:29:45.480
<v Speaker 2>The pancakes are always super cold. There's always a massive line.

615
00:29:45.680 --> 00:29:48.279
<v Speaker 2>You pay all this money to do this whole experience

616
00:29:48.319 --> 00:29:50.519
<v Speaker 2>and then like it's it's yeah, it's kind of a waste.

617
00:29:50.559 --> 00:29:52.839
<v Speaker 2>But the kids had fun for the most part. There

618
00:29:52.880 --> 00:29:54.599
<v Speaker 2>was kapy bars and you could totally go up and

619
00:29:54.599 --> 00:29:57.079
<v Speaker 2>pet them, and my daughter, having her long curly hair,

620
00:29:57.480 --> 00:29:59.200
<v Speaker 2>was petting one of them and was kind of looking

621
00:29:59.240 --> 00:30:01.240
<v Speaker 2>at it. Another one it came up and started eating

622
00:30:01.240 --> 00:30:03.000
<v Speaker 2>her hair and it took a chunk.

623
00:30:03.640 --> 00:30:04.160
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

624
00:30:04.240 --> 00:30:06.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so she says, fuck those cat bonas.

625
00:30:06.680 --> 00:30:08.960
<v Speaker 3>So when I was younger, I went on a zoo

626
00:30:09.000 --> 00:30:10.839
<v Speaker 3>trip to the zoo and I had really long hair,

627
00:30:10.880 --> 00:30:14.960
<v Speaker 3>it was past my butt, and goats happened to super

628
00:30:15.079 --> 00:30:18.559
<v Speaker 3>love long hair, and like I didn't have just one goat,

629
00:30:18.599 --> 00:30:22.200
<v Speaker 3>I had multiple goats. I still don't fuck with goats. Well,

630
00:30:22.240 --> 00:30:24.519
<v Speaker 3>I mean, I've worked with goats though that liked to

631
00:30:24.559 --> 00:30:26.319
<v Speaker 3>scream at me while I was trying to clean horse

632
00:30:26.359 --> 00:30:28.640
<v Speaker 3>stalls the entire time.

633
00:30:29.359 --> 00:30:31.559
<v Speaker 4>I don't know if you've ever heard goats screams.

634
00:30:32.079 --> 00:30:35.240
<v Speaker 3>They've gone viral multiple times. Yeh, No, but like obnoxiously.

635
00:30:35.400 --> 00:30:38.200
<v Speaker 3>Like you hear the screaming goats, They're like, what cool?

636
00:30:38.799 --> 00:30:40.160
<v Speaker 3>Unless you work with one.

637
00:30:41.000 --> 00:30:41.359
<v Speaker 1>You can't.

638
00:30:41.400 --> 00:30:46.559
<v Speaker 3>Even with death metal on, you'll hear this in the

639
00:30:46.599 --> 00:30:52.359
<v Speaker 3>background non fucking stop, and it's like, okay, you shit, Yeah,

640
00:30:52.519 --> 00:30:55.880
<v Speaker 3>it's the babies. Aren't even that bad, just certain ones.

641
00:30:56.039 --> 00:30:59.599
<v Speaker 3>Alex Alex the goat. No, no offense to anybody named Alex,

642
00:30:59.640 --> 00:31:02.279
<v Speaker 3>but yes, the goat was named Alex. His name is

643
00:31:02.279 --> 00:31:05.319
<v Speaker 3>still Alex. He's alive, but yeah, he's a shit. Yeah,

644
00:31:05.359 --> 00:31:06.319
<v Speaker 3>and I eat plastic.

645
00:31:06.559 --> 00:31:09.079
<v Speaker 2>My daughter does not fuck with kafy bars ever since then.

646
00:31:09.359 --> 00:31:12.039
<v Speaker 2>But I mean to be fair with the Japanese culture

647
00:31:12.079 --> 00:31:15.359
<v Speaker 2>of toji uh the whole kapy bar thing, that could

648
00:31:15.359 --> 00:31:16.200
<v Speaker 2>have gone one of two ways.

649
00:31:16.359 --> 00:31:17.480
<v Speaker 3>I really thought they were gonna eat them.

650
00:31:17.519 --> 00:31:19.680
<v Speaker 2>But I saw the fruit. I saw them swimming in water.

651
00:31:19.759 --> 00:31:21.079
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, oh, is that a pot?

652
00:31:21.839 --> 00:31:22.039
<v Speaker 3>Oh?

653
00:31:22.079 --> 00:31:26.039
<v Speaker 2>No, just eating just yes, shit, that's not the weirdest

654
00:31:26.039 --> 00:31:27.279
<v Speaker 2>thing Japan has ever done.

655
00:31:27.440 --> 00:31:28.039
<v Speaker 3>Nope, you know.

656
00:31:28.240 --> 00:31:30.960
<v Speaker 2>But anyway, So now let's go to the next one,

657
00:31:31.160 --> 00:31:36.039
<v Speaker 2>the Santo Tomas festival in Guatemala. Although the Catholic Church

658
00:31:36.079 --> 00:31:39.319
<v Speaker 2>now observes the Feast of Saint Thomas on July third

659
00:31:39.559 --> 00:31:47.519
<v Speaker 2>in Chichi Custennango, Chichi Cosenango. I think I might have

660
00:31:47.640 --> 00:31:50.400
<v Speaker 2>killed it. Guatemala. The festival is still celebrated for a

661
00:31:50.480 --> 00:31:53.640
<v Speaker 2>week leading up to the winter solstice on December twenty first.

662
00:31:53.960 --> 00:31:57.039
<v Speaker 2>Why likely because it's a mix of the Catholic ceremony

663
00:31:57.039 --> 00:32:00.559
<v Speaker 2>with the native Mayan rituals that may have been timed

664
00:32:00.640 --> 00:32:06.519
<v Speaker 2>to the solstice today. The feast features brightly colored traditional costumes, masks, parades, fireworks,

665
00:32:06.599 --> 00:32:10.519
<v Speaker 2>and music, making Guatemala a great winter destination. The highlight

666
00:32:10.559 --> 00:32:13.759
<v Speaker 2>of the death defying custom of the flying pole dance

667
00:32:14.200 --> 00:32:16.640
<v Speaker 2>climbing up a one hundred foot pole, trying on a

668
00:32:16.759 --> 00:32:19.240
<v Speaker 2>rope and jumping or tying on a rope and jumping

669
00:32:19.279 --> 00:32:19.799
<v Speaker 2>off the top.

670
00:32:21.599 --> 00:32:22.880
<v Speaker 3>I like this, good for them?

671
00:32:23.119 --> 00:32:23.200
<v Speaker 2>What?

672
00:32:23.839 --> 00:32:25.759
<v Speaker 3>Yeah? No, I like this, this is this is wonderful.

673
00:32:25.799 --> 00:32:26.279
<v Speaker 3>Good job.

674
00:32:26.480 --> 00:32:30.000
<v Speaker 2>I don't want to try bungee jumping like that. That's crazy.

675
00:32:30.279 --> 00:32:32.799
<v Speaker 2>I wanted to jump bungee jumping, but not just for

676
00:32:32.880 --> 00:32:33.440
<v Speaker 2>the fuck of it.

677
00:32:34.039 --> 00:32:36.200
<v Speaker 3>I mean, it's for the festival. So you know, here

678
00:32:36.240 --> 00:32:36.759
<v Speaker 3>we go, and.

679
00:32:36.720 --> 00:32:38.759
<v Speaker 2>There's no way of knowing if that pole, that rope

680
00:32:38.839 --> 00:32:40.160
<v Speaker 2>is like stretchy or if it's just going.

681
00:32:40.079 --> 00:32:42.920
<v Speaker 3>To cut hard. That's just a you know, it's one

682
00:32:42.960 --> 00:32:44.640
<v Speaker 3>of those fucker and find out moments.

683
00:32:46.119 --> 00:32:51.640
<v Speaker 2>Guatemalans are wild, Okay, hell yeah? Continuing on soil from

684
00:32:51.680 --> 00:32:55.279
<v Speaker 2>the Hopi tribe, which very very interesting tribe as far

685
00:32:55.279 --> 00:32:58.799
<v Speaker 2>as the Native Americans are concerned. The indigenous Hope people

686
00:32:59.119 --> 00:33:02.039
<v Speaker 2>of present day the northern Arizona celebrate the winter solstice

687
00:33:02.079 --> 00:33:06.119
<v Speaker 2>as part of their religious tradition honoring kachina or catsina,

688
00:33:06.599 --> 00:33:10.759
<v Speaker 2>which are ancestral spirits representing the natural world. During the

689
00:33:10.799 --> 00:33:14.359
<v Speaker 2>soil Solstice ceremony, which is led by a tribal chief,

690
00:33:14.519 --> 00:33:17.119
<v Speaker 2>the sun is welcomed back to its summer path with

691
00:33:17.240 --> 00:33:21.000
<v Speaker 2>ritual dances, gift giving to children, prayers for the coming year.

692
00:33:21.359 --> 00:33:24.519
<v Speaker 2>Singing and storytelling are also part of the festivities. Prayer

693
00:33:24.559 --> 00:33:27.960
<v Speaker 2>sticks and kachina dolls are often made in preparation for

694
00:33:28.039 --> 00:33:31.400
<v Speaker 2>the celebration, so these would be the dolls in question. Wow,

695
00:33:31.880 --> 00:33:36.160
<v Speaker 2>been nice, I like it. Moving on, burning of the

696
00:33:36.200 --> 00:33:39.039
<v Speaker 2>clocks in Brighton, England. So I'm just gonna point this out.

697
00:33:39.359 --> 00:33:42.920
<v Speaker 2>Three of these obscure solstice traditions are all in England,

698
00:33:43.000 --> 00:33:44.359
<v Speaker 2>and almost none of them connect.

699
00:33:45.319 --> 00:33:46.200
<v Speaker 3>I bet yeah.

700
00:33:46.279 --> 00:33:48.160
<v Speaker 4>The English be wild. They be doing a lot of

701
00:33:48.200 --> 00:33:48.720
<v Speaker 4>weird shit.

702
00:33:48.920 --> 00:33:51.119
<v Speaker 2>They just be taking cultures from here and a little

703
00:33:51.119 --> 00:33:53.759
<v Speaker 2>bit from there, and now it's British. It's not though,

704
00:33:53.920 --> 00:33:56.200
<v Speaker 2>it's not. Y'all are just mixing and matching over here.

705
00:33:56.480 --> 00:33:58.839
<v Speaker 2>They took over the entire world with all the spices

706
00:33:58.880 --> 00:34:02.119
<v Speaker 2>and used none of them. But whatever, that's a thing, yo.

707
00:34:02.200 --> 00:34:03.519
<v Speaker 3>They eat some weird ass ship.

708
00:34:03.599 --> 00:34:05.319
<v Speaker 2>They just be boiling everything for the fuck of it.

709
00:34:05.519 --> 00:34:07.480
<v Speaker 3>Oh my god. Some of their food though, some of

710
00:34:07.519 --> 00:34:12.159
<v Speaker 3>their food is just why. Yeah, I don't under don't understand,

711
00:34:12.280 --> 00:34:14.280
<v Speaker 3>but that's I mean, that's every culture has a lot

712
00:34:14.280 --> 00:34:15.239
<v Speaker 3>of weird shit. Though.

713
00:34:15.400 --> 00:34:18.360
<v Speaker 2>They put beans on toast and breakfast.

714
00:34:18.519 --> 00:34:20.360
<v Speaker 3>I was sitting here thinking about beans on toast, but

715
00:34:20.400 --> 00:34:24.599
<v Speaker 3>I wasn't. The dishwashing thing, though, What you've never heard

716
00:34:24.639 --> 00:34:27.920
<v Speaker 3>about the dish washing. Break it down, okay real quick

717
00:34:27.960 --> 00:34:30.960
<v Speaker 3>before we get back to this. So they don't rinse

718
00:34:31.159 --> 00:34:35.800
<v Speaker 3>their dishes after they wash them, after they wash them,

719
00:34:35.840 --> 00:34:39.079
<v Speaker 3>after they wash them. Now, you guys might all think

720
00:34:39.079 --> 00:34:42.199
<v Speaker 3>that I'm crazy. Go to fucking TikTok and Instagram and

721
00:34:42.400 --> 00:34:43.760
<v Speaker 3>look at them tons of people.

722
00:34:43.880 --> 00:34:46.159
<v Speaker 2>Wait, when you get your dishes out of the dishwasher,

723
00:34:46.480 --> 00:34:47.559
<v Speaker 2>you rinse them.

724
00:34:48.039 --> 00:34:52.599
<v Speaker 3>No, they're hand washing them. Oh, and they're not rinsing them.

725
00:34:52.960 --> 00:34:56.840
<v Speaker 3>They're hand washing and not rinsing. They're ye like, let it.

726
00:34:57.000 --> 00:34:59.360
<v Speaker 2>Then, I'm trying. I'm trying to make sure I understanding yourself.

727
00:34:59.360 --> 00:35:02.119
<v Speaker 3>The leave residue on it, They leave the soap residue

728
00:35:02.119 --> 00:35:05.039
<v Speaker 3>on it. And I've seen so many videos of people

729
00:35:05.079 --> 00:35:06.639
<v Speaker 3>agreeing that this is what they do, and they're like,

730
00:35:06.639 --> 00:35:08.760
<v Speaker 3>why are you guys crashing out about this? What the

731
00:35:08.800 --> 00:35:10.559
<v Speaker 3>fuck you mean? Why are we crashing out about that?

732
00:35:10.800 --> 00:35:12.960
<v Speaker 3>That's like the people that wash the chicken all weird

733
00:35:13.239 --> 00:35:16.639
<v Speaker 3>and they like bleach it out or whatever. Yeah, yeah,

734
00:35:16.679 --> 00:35:19.320
<v Speaker 3>that's you know, have you seen people make the Oh god,

735
00:35:19.360 --> 00:35:22.840
<v Speaker 3>have you seen people make the lasagna in the dishwasher?

736
00:35:23.599 --> 00:35:28.239
<v Speaker 2>You listen, listen, oh white people, let's have a conversations, not.

737
00:35:28.199 --> 00:35:30.440
<v Speaker 3>Just why it's not just white people. I've seen what No,

738
00:35:30.519 --> 00:35:31.119
<v Speaker 3>it's not just white.

739
00:35:31.320 --> 00:35:33.320
<v Speaker 2>Name a culture that's doing the other than the white people.

740
00:35:34.760 --> 00:35:38.039
<v Speaker 3>Well, this this is a mixed race, uh you know

741
00:35:38.199 --> 00:35:41.400
<v Speaker 3>country and no time out, time out.

742
00:35:41.400 --> 00:35:43.400
<v Speaker 2>You're telling me there is black and Hispanic people that

743
00:35:43.400 --> 00:35:45.199
<v Speaker 2>are making lasagna and dishwashers.

744
00:35:45.679 --> 00:35:47.960
<v Speaker 3>One of them that I saw was of a different

745
00:35:48.039 --> 00:35:51.519
<v Speaker 3>ethnicity than white. So yeah, no, there's some wild shit

746
00:35:51.599 --> 00:35:51.920
<v Speaker 3>going on.

747
00:35:52.000 --> 00:35:55.320
<v Speaker 2>What the only acceptable thing? And I will give a

748
00:35:55.360 --> 00:35:57.639
<v Speaker 2>weird caveat to this. I've never done it, but I

749
00:35:57.679 --> 00:36:00.599
<v Speaker 2>have seen it done, and I could maybe have this

750
00:36:00.679 --> 00:36:04.800
<v Speaker 2>conversation steaming vegetables no soap, but you're basically running the

751
00:36:04.840 --> 00:36:07.920
<v Speaker 2>dishwasher and you're steaming like a massive amount of vegetables

752
00:36:07.960 --> 00:36:10.679
<v Speaker 2>at the same time for like a big party. It

753
00:36:10.760 --> 00:36:12.679
<v Speaker 2>sounds crazy, but it does work.

754
00:36:12.760 --> 00:36:16.920
<v Speaker 3>I don't even understand now, but yeah, so apparently this

755
00:36:16.960 --> 00:36:20.199
<v Speaker 3>is a thing that happens in England with some people.

756
00:36:20.559 --> 00:36:23.599
<v Speaker 3>Now I cannot speak to being ever over there, so

757
00:36:23.679 --> 00:36:26.000
<v Speaker 3>I don't know if this is like actually base, but

758
00:36:26.079 --> 00:36:28.840
<v Speaker 3>I have seen a whole bunch of people and content

759
00:36:28.880 --> 00:36:31.960
<v Speaker 3>creators say that this is a real thing. Then I

760
00:36:32.039 --> 00:36:35.159
<v Speaker 3>read the comments of people from England being like, yet, no,

761
00:36:35.239 --> 00:36:39.280
<v Speaker 3>I don't know why you're crashing out about this. I'm sorry, what.

762
00:36:38.360 --> 00:36:41.800
<v Speaker 2>What's that's a little absurd, Like they're just leaving giant

763
00:36:41.960 --> 00:36:44.159
<v Speaker 2>clumps of like soap resident in the bubbles like on

764
00:36:44.239 --> 00:36:45.280
<v Speaker 2>the side, and it just dries.

765
00:36:46.159 --> 00:36:48.519
<v Speaker 4>I guess I don't know any especially.

766
00:36:48.119 --> 00:36:51.280
<v Speaker 3>So just like diarrhea, especially especially you with like how

767
00:36:51.280 --> 00:36:53.559
<v Speaker 3>crazy you are with your dishes. I can only imagine

768
00:36:53.599 --> 00:36:55.719
<v Speaker 3>how you'd feel how.

769
00:36:55.559 --> 00:36:56.920
<v Speaker 2>Crazy I am with my dishes.

770
00:36:57.000 --> 00:37:00.440
<v Speaker 3>You No, No, I mean all of us are like cleanly about, but.

771
00:37:00.719 --> 00:37:02.519
<v Speaker 2>There's only a few things in my house I really

772
00:37:02.519 --> 00:37:04.239
<v Speaker 2>care about as far as like cleanliness goes.

773
00:37:04.360 --> 00:37:06.039
<v Speaker 4>My mom is one of those people that triple wash

774
00:37:06.119 --> 00:37:06.639
<v Speaker 4>their dishes.

775
00:37:06.760 --> 00:37:10.599
<v Speaker 3>Like she'll wash it, rinse it off, potentially wash it again,

776
00:37:10.880 --> 00:37:12.599
<v Speaker 3>then put it in the dish washing And I'm like, white,

777
00:37:12.599 --> 00:37:13.960
<v Speaker 3>why are you doing all that work? Mom?

778
00:37:14.119 --> 00:37:18.480
<v Speaker 2>No, I'll hand washed to get like the chunks off

779
00:37:18.519 --> 00:37:21.079
<v Speaker 2>and stuff. But like that's and usually it's no soap

780
00:37:21.159 --> 00:37:22.719
<v Speaker 2>unless it's needed. If it's a dish you have to

781
00:37:22.719 --> 00:37:24.880
<v Speaker 2>hand wash or whatever. He's like, you know, a scrub

782
00:37:24.920 --> 00:37:26.960
<v Speaker 2>Daddy will go hard and then like you put in

783
00:37:26.960 --> 00:37:28.400
<v Speaker 2>the dish washer and it's good to go.

784
00:37:28.760 --> 00:37:30.840
<v Speaker 3>But anyway, I had to just tell you about that

785
00:37:30.840 --> 00:37:32.760
<v Speaker 3>since we were talking about England and they're weird shit

786
00:37:33.119 --> 00:37:35.079
<v Speaker 3>now for the England, because I know we do have

787
00:37:35.159 --> 00:37:40.239
<v Speaker 3>English listeners, cult members, cult members, so if you can

788
00:37:40.519 --> 00:37:43.360
<v Speaker 3>confirm or deny this is a real.

789
00:37:43.159 --> 00:37:45.199
<v Speaker 4>Thing, that would be great because.

790
00:37:45.000 --> 00:37:47.320
<v Speaker 2>Also for the Australian and New Zealand people, because so

791
00:37:47.440 --> 00:37:50.320
<v Speaker 2>many cultural things from Britain have made their way and

792
00:37:50.360 --> 00:37:53.840
<v Speaker 2>then there are certain very different cultural things. But just

793
00:37:53.920 --> 00:37:56.400
<v Speaker 2>curious that this is the thing for Australia, New Zealand

794
00:37:56.760 --> 00:37:58.079
<v Speaker 2>anything in the British Commonwealth.

795
00:37:58.519 --> 00:38:01.920
<v Speaker 3>Apparently it's literally own in English.

796
00:38:01.920 --> 00:38:03.920
<v Speaker 2>I should hope he we have Irish listeners too, Yo,

797
00:38:04.159 --> 00:38:06.599
<v Speaker 2>hit us up in Ireland. Do y'all be rinsing your

798
00:38:06.599 --> 00:38:08.239
<v Speaker 2>dishes when you're done because this is kind of a

799
00:38:08.280 --> 00:38:09.280
<v Speaker 2>thing we need to talk about.

800
00:38:09.559 --> 00:38:11.679
<v Speaker 3>Well, I knew you're gonna have a fit about it.

801
00:38:11.719 --> 00:38:13.679
<v Speaker 2>I'm not having a fit. That's just it makes no sense,

802
00:38:14.039 --> 00:38:14.960
<v Speaker 2>that's absurd.

803
00:38:15.280 --> 00:38:16.280
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, no, I get it.

804
00:38:16.440 --> 00:38:18.320
<v Speaker 2>These people just love tearing their stomachs up.

805
00:38:18.360 --> 00:38:21.199
<v Speaker 3>What about the rice thing about rinsing rice or not

806
00:38:21.320 --> 00:38:24.400
<v Speaker 3>rinsing rice, that's a heavily debated topic about people.

807
00:38:24.519 --> 00:38:27.320
<v Speaker 2>So some people have issues with extra starch. I don't

808
00:38:27.360 --> 00:38:28.000
<v Speaker 2>understand it.

809
00:38:28.320 --> 00:38:31.440
<v Speaker 3>But whatever, you know, there's a lot of different people

810
00:38:31.480 --> 00:38:34.320
<v Speaker 3>do a lot of weird stuff, and include.

811
00:38:33.280 --> 00:38:35.559
<v Speaker 2>You know, washing the chicken. That is the thing that

812
00:38:35.639 --> 00:38:38.000
<v Speaker 2>I didn't realize was such a cultural divide between white

813
00:38:38.000 --> 00:38:39.239
<v Speaker 2>and black America.

814
00:38:40.079 --> 00:38:42.480
<v Speaker 3>I mean, I washed my chicken sometimes when it has

815
00:38:42.480 --> 00:38:45.360
<v Speaker 3>that slimy residue to it. That's the only time I'll

816
00:38:45.400 --> 00:38:47.880
<v Speaker 3>actually wash it. But I mean i'll cut the I'll

817
00:38:47.880 --> 00:38:49.559
<v Speaker 3>cut the bad parts off of it and the fact

818
00:38:49.599 --> 00:38:51.719
<v Speaker 3>I'll trim it up and stuff like that. But if

819
00:38:51.719 --> 00:38:55.239
<v Speaker 3>it has like that weird feeling to it, I'm just

820
00:38:55.280 --> 00:38:56.960
<v Speaker 3>gonna rinse it off real quick. I'm not gonna sit

821
00:38:56.960 --> 00:38:59.320
<v Speaker 3>there and scrub my shit. I have seen people use

822
00:38:59.360 --> 00:39:04.000
<v Speaker 3>dond dishwash soap online. I'm not joking you, Okay, I'm

823
00:39:04.039 --> 00:39:06.159
<v Speaker 3>not joking. I've seen all sorts of weird shit.

824
00:39:06.480 --> 00:39:09.159
<v Speaker 2>Ye know, A squirt of lemon and then rinse it

825
00:39:09.239 --> 00:39:11.519
<v Speaker 2>under the sink real quick before you wash. That's all

826
00:39:11.519 --> 00:39:14.599
<v Speaker 2>it really takes, y'all. We don't have to do all this. Extorists.

827
00:39:14.599 --> 00:39:16.760
<v Speaker 2>You don't need to use bleach. I saw the video

828
00:39:16.800 --> 00:39:20.320
<v Speaker 2>somebody using bleach. I genuinely thought I thought it was satire.

829
00:39:20.679 --> 00:39:23.920
<v Speaker 3>I thought it was for the content. Yeah. No, I've

830
00:39:24.000 --> 00:39:25.960
<v Speaker 3>seen a lot of stuff that I believe is actually

831
00:39:26.000 --> 00:39:29.239
<v Speaker 3>fake and satire. But you see so many people do

832
00:39:29.280 --> 00:39:31.079
<v Speaker 3>it over and over again. It's like, Okay, is that

833
00:39:31.360 --> 00:39:32.360
<v Speaker 3>is that fake? Or is that not?

834
00:39:32.519 --> 00:39:35.199
<v Speaker 4>Because it's kind of confusing, But I don't know.

835
00:39:35.400 --> 00:39:36.960
<v Speaker 2>We fucked up someone.

836
00:39:37.039 --> 00:39:40.880
<v Speaker 3>Hopefully while you are eating your beautiful Christmas dinner right now.

837
00:39:41.519 --> 00:39:46.320
<v Speaker 3>You are not having weird soapy food or you are

838
00:39:46.360 --> 00:39:51.559
<v Speaker 3>not having weird bleached chicken either. You're having delicious, amazing food.

839
00:39:51.800 --> 00:39:52.800
<v Speaker 2>Like could you imagine?

840
00:39:52.679 --> 00:39:54.599
<v Speaker 3>Tell me what you're eating, by the way, like I

841
00:39:54.639 --> 00:39:57.000
<v Speaker 3>want to hear what other everybody else? Yeah, because I've

842
00:39:57.039 --> 00:40:00.519
<v Speaker 3>already currently I'm having a situation with a turn at

843
00:40:00.519 --> 00:40:03.000
<v Speaker 3>my house because I'm cooking in Turkey tomorrow for the

844
00:40:03.079 --> 00:40:07.840
<v Speaker 3>Christmas celebration, and somebody, not to mention names myself, I

845
00:40:07.920 --> 00:40:12.639
<v Speaker 3>forgot to pull it out. So we're doing the rapid

846
00:40:12.880 --> 00:40:14.760
<v Speaker 3>defrost situation right now.

847
00:40:14.920 --> 00:40:18.760
<v Speaker 2>And so what do you mean rapid defrost like in

848
00:40:19.039 --> 00:40:20.559
<v Speaker 2>a pot of hot water.

849
00:40:20.679 --> 00:40:21.639
<v Speaker 3>In the bathtub?

850
00:40:22.639 --> 00:40:24.719
<v Speaker 2>Fuck it, I've done it.

851
00:40:24.760 --> 00:40:27.519
<v Speaker 3>I've done it before. Don't worry everybody. I cleaned out

852
00:40:27.519 --> 00:40:30.440
<v Speaker 3>the bathtub. It's still in the wrapper. It's still on

853
00:40:30.480 --> 00:40:33.760
<v Speaker 3>the wrapper. But I know. But people are like, no,

854
00:40:34.039 --> 00:40:35.159
<v Speaker 3>I washed the bathtub first.

855
00:40:35.679 --> 00:40:38.239
<v Speaker 2>And then with all the we've talked about these people

856
00:40:38.280 --> 00:40:39.920
<v Speaker 2>and soap, do not come at us for.

857
00:40:41.400 --> 00:40:45.920
<v Speaker 3>Apparently I forgot to put it back in the I

858
00:40:46.079 --> 00:40:48.360
<v Speaker 3>forgot to take it out of the freezer. I thought

859
00:40:48.400 --> 00:40:50.639
<v Speaker 3>I did, and then I was got home tonight and

860
00:40:50.679 --> 00:40:52.880
<v Speaker 3>I looked at it and went, oh my god, I

861
00:40:52.960 --> 00:40:58.199
<v Speaker 3>have like ten hours. Ah, so it's a vibe right now.

862
00:40:58.360 --> 00:41:02.039
<v Speaker 3>But I'm doing the you know, deviled eggs and the

863
00:41:02.239 --> 00:41:08.039
<v Speaker 3>cast role because I'm what, you know, I hate that

864
00:41:08.119 --> 00:41:11.679
<v Speaker 3>I'm allergic to a because I used to so good

865
00:41:12.599 --> 00:41:15.760
<v Speaker 3>then they're my favorite. I'm doing the rice crispy treats.

866
00:41:15.840 --> 00:41:19.480
<v Speaker 3>I'm doing the cool Lot cheese. I'm doing the cheese.

867
00:41:19.559 --> 00:41:23.440
<v Speaker 3>Oh I did get my hoghead cheese tonight. I actually went.

868
00:41:23.280 --> 00:41:26.519
<v Speaker 2>And look at you assimilating to the culture. Wait where

869
00:41:26.519 --> 00:41:27.760
<v Speaker 2>did you get it? This is important?

870
00:41:28.119 --> 00:41:28.239
<v Speaker 3>Oh?

871
00:41:28.239 --> 00:41:30.480
<v Speaker 4>I got it way out in like Port Vincent area.

872
00:41:30.599 --> 00:41:32.719
<v Speaker 3>I went. I went to like those little mom Paw

873
00:41:32.840 --> 00:41:35.840
<v Speaker 3>shops and I was like, I don't.

874
00:41:35.639 --> 00:41:37.639
<v Speaker 2>Know it's called it's got a giant pig on the sign.

875
00:41:37.840 --> 00:41:40.800
<v Speaker 3>Yeah good, yeah, yeah. I was like, hey, you got

876
00:41:40.840 --> 00:41:43.400
<v Speaker 3>some hoghead cheese? They had two blocks left, and I

877
00:41:43.440 --> 00:41:46.039
<v Speaker 3>was like, oh, I got one, secured it. I love it.

878
00:41:46.440 --> 00:41:48.760
<v Speaker 2>For anybody who doesn't know what hoghead cheese is, you

879
00:41:48.800 --> 00:41:50.840
<v Speaker 2>are missing out. It's also the same as saying like

880
00:41:50.880 --> 00:41:53.320
<v Speaker 2>you don't know what budhan is, Like listen, you're missing out,

881
00:41:53.559 --> 00:41:56.320
<v Speaker 2>and that's okay. If you ever come through Louisiana, you

882
00:41:56.360 --> 00:41:59.800
<v Speaker 2>do need to try both. And it's it's uh, it's

883
00:41:59.840 --> 00:42:01.000
<v Speaker 2>just the way it.

884
00:42:01.079 --> 00:42:04.840
<v Speaker 3>Just what about the blood, uh, the blood put it? Yeah,

885
00:42:04.880 --> 00:42:05.559
<v Speaker 3>the blood pudding.

886
00:42:06.000 --> 00:42:08.639
<v Speaker 2>Uh so black black and white pudding, which is blood

887
00:42:08.679 --> 00:42:10.679
<v Speaker 2>sausage and pork sausage. I'm gonna be honest with you.

888
00:42:11.000 --> 00:42:14.039
<v Speaker 2>I've tried it. People make it out to be nasty.

889
00:42:14.480 --> 00:42:17.159
<v Speaker 2>Shit's good, Shit's good. I fuck with it.

890
00:42:17.440 --> 00:42:21.559
<v Speaker 3>I've only actually seen it made twice by two different people.

891
00:42:21.639 --> 00:42:23.960
<v Speaker 2>I've never seen it made. Now, calm down, you mean

892
00:42:24.079 --> 00:42:26.440
<v Speaker 2>cooked or you mean like like tubed up.

893
00:42:26.760 --> 00:42:28.920
<v Speaker 4>Like tubed up and like actually like made.

894
00:42:29.000 --> 00:42:30.960
<v Speaker 2>I don't want to know. I never want to see

895
00:42:31.000 --> 00:42:32.719
<v Speaker 2>the sausage getting made. Just tell me if it's so.

896
00:42:32.760 --> 00:42:35.039
<v Speaker 3>I saw so. I saw somebody make it one time,

897
00:42:35.079 --> 00:42:37.519
<v Speaker 3>and then I actually saw like the after like they

898
00:42:37.880 --> 00:42:40.480
<v Speaker 3>just got done making it, and I was like, you know,

899
00:42:42.679 --> 00:42:45.320
<v Speaker 3>it's it's one of those things where it's like I

900
00:42:45.360 --> 00:42:49.199
<v Speaker 3>don't I don't think I canna like make my mouth not.

901
00:42:49.199 --> 00:42:53.199
<v Speaker 2>Stop watering, and you can't watch how it's made that

902
00:42:53.480 --> 00:42:54.559
<v Speaker 2>us everything.

903
00:42:54.239 --> 00:42:55.840
<v Speaker 3>It does, it really does.

904
00:42:56.320 --> 00:42:58.880
<v Speaker 2>Now I've had some blood sausage to where it's like

905
00:42:59.119 --> 00:43:02.280
<v Speaker 2>black pudding, uh to where it is a lot more

906
00:43:02.320 --> 00:43:04.400
<v Speaker 2>sage heavy, and that's like all you can taste. And

907
00:43:04.400 --> 00:43:07.119
<v Speaker 2>I've had some that's a little more on the blood side,

908
00:43:07.119 --> 00:43:09.159
<v Speaker 2>and it's it's got more of a savory vibe.

909
00:43:09.440 --> 00:43:11.719
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, more of an iron tang to it.

910
00:43:11.719 --> 00:43:14.039
<v Speaker 2>It depends some of its dog shit, some of it's

911
00:43:14.079 --> 00:43:15.960
<v Speaker 2>really good, depends on you.

912
00:43:15.920 --> 00:43:16.840
<v Speaker 3>Know, my dad had it.

913
00:43:16.880 --> 00:43:18.679
<v Speaker 4>Actually, my dad got it for us an Organ.

914
00:43:19.400 --> 00:43:21.320
<v Speaker 2>I believe it. You you're talking about how Organ is

915
00:43:21.320 --> 00:43:22.920
<v Speaker 2>such an eclectic place. I could understand.

916
00:43:22.960 --> 00:43:25.599
<v Speaker 3>It has a lot of different cultures to it. And

917
00:43:25.639 --> 00:43:28.239
<v Speaker 3>he loved like Polish dogs and all this stuff. So

918
00:43:28.280 --> 00:43:30.599
<v Speaker 3>he would like find all these little weird places to

919
00:43:30.639 --> 00:43:32.440
<v Speaker 3>get food in Washington and Organ.

920
00:43:32.519 --> 00:43:34.559
<v Speaker 2>And be honest with you, I put brought worst over

921
00:43:34.719 --> 00:43:36.840
<v Speaker 2>kill bossa any day. That's just my Oh.

922
00:43:36.880 --> 00:43:39.960
<v Speaker 3>My dad was a brought worst fiend. I get down

923
00:43:40.480 --> 00:43:43.400
<v Speaker 3>every every kind of sausage you could think of. He

924
00:43:43.519 --> 00:43:46.239
<v Speaker 3>was like a connoisseur of sausage. So it was his

925
00:43:46.320 --> 00:43:46.960
<v Speaker 3>whole vibe.

926
00:43:47.519 --> 00:43:49.280
<v Speaker 2>And then I also like on Dewey.

927
00:43:50.559 --> 00:43:53.719
<v Speaker 3>But actually like on Dewey but speaking of sausages, back

928
00:43:53.760 --> 00:43:59.519
<v Speaker 3>to England, what a weird segue. I don't know. I

929
00:43:59.559 --> 00:44:01.679
<v Speaker 3>don't know. I just think of like they would maybe

930
00:44:01.719 --> 00:44:04.480
<v Speaker 3>potentially fuck with sausage. But oh yeah, yeah, I thought

931
00:44:04.480 --> 00:44:04.960
<v Speaker 3>they did.

932
00:44:04.800 --> 00:44:10.360
<v Speaker 2>The Bangers show, that's why. And blood blood pudding is sausage.

933
00:44:10.440 --> 00:44:13.800
<v Speaker 3>Okay, see, okay, okay, fair enough.

934
00:44:14.199 --> 00:44:16.360
<v Speaker 2>So now getting back to the list here. Burning the

935
00:44:16.360 --> 00:44:19.840
<v Speaker 2>Clocks in Brighton, England, fire needed to light the dark

936
00:44:19.920 --> 00:44:21.960
<v Speaker 2>days of winter has traditionally been a part of winter

937
00:44:22.000 --> 00:44:25.679
<v Speaker 2>Solstice celebrations. The modern day Burning of Clocks festival in

938
00:44:25.719 --> 00:44:28.719
<v Speaker 2>the seaside town of Brighton took up that notion for

939
00:44:28.800 --> 00:44:32.760
<v Speaker 2>its early or for its yearly Solstice parade, bonfire and

940
00:44:32.840 --> 00:44:37.079
<v Speaker 2>fire show. Okay, a parade of bonfire and a fire

941
00:44:37.159 --> 00:44:40.480
<v Speaker 2>show in Brighton, I like it. People wearing costumes representing

942
00:44:40.559 --> 00:44:44.039
<v Speaker 2>clocks and the passage of time marched to the beach

943
00:44:44.079 --> 00:44:47.159
<v Speaker 2>with lanterns made of wood and paper. There the lanterns

944
00:44:47.159 --> 00:44:50.360
<v Speaker 2>are burned in a huge bonfire, symbolizing the wishes, hopes,

945
00:44:50.400 --> 00:44:53.400
<v Speaker 2>and fears that all will be passed into the flames.

946
00:44:53.519 --> 00:44:54.880
<v Speaker 4>It's like a burning man for them.

947
00:44:55.039 --> 00:44:57.320
<v Speaker 2>It seems like, look, these are the lanterns. These are huge.

948
00:44:57.360 --> 00:44:59.239
<v Speaker 2>You got a witch doctor over here. You got a

949
00:44:59.559 --> 00:45:00.960
<v Speaker 2>hot air balloon, you got a Star.

950
00:45:01.159 --> 00:45:03.360
<v Speaker 3>You know what, that sounds really fun. I love all

951
00:45:03.400 --> 00:45:05.920
<v Speaker 3>these different festivals that we've been learning about. It sounds

952
00:45:05.920 --> 00:45:07.880
<v Speaker 3>like great times everywhere around the world.

953
00:45:08.159 --> 00:45:10.320
<v Speaker 2>It really does. I don't know when that started, but

954
00:45:10.400 --> 00:45:12.880
<v Speaker 2>that's legit. Oh, this is one. This is one of

955
00:45:12.960 --> 00:45:14.559
<v Speaker 2>my favorites. And as much as you want to go

956
00:45:14.679 --> 00:45:17.440
<v Speaker 2>to the burn not burning man, I'm sorry for a

957
00:45:17.599 --> 00:45:20.159
<v Speaker 2>stone in trecked, Yes, So as much as you want

958
00:45:20.159 --> 00:45:22.840
<v Speaker 2>to go to Stonehenge, I want to go to New Grange.

959
00:45:23.320 --> 00:45:25.440
<v Speaker 3>Oh I know where this is, and yeah, I know

960
00:45:25.480 --> 00:45:26.840
<v Speaker 3>what you're talking about. I know what this is.

961
00:45:26.960 --> 00:45:29.840
<v Speaker 2>So let's talk about New Grange and the gathering there

962
00:45:29.880 --> 00:45:30.719
<v Speaker 2>in Ireland.

963
00:45:30.920 --> 00:45:33.199
<v Speaker 3>This tomb is so cool, by the way it is.

964
00:45:33.199 --> 00:45:35.239
<v Speaker 2>And oh, it's so amazing. Let's read into it. So

965
00:45:35.320 --> 00:45:39.559
<v Speaker 2>the five thousand, two hundred year old New Grange Passage

966
00:45:39.599 --> 00:45:43.599
<v Speaker 2>tomb and ancient temple are aligned to the winter solstice.

967
00:45:44.199 --> 00:45:45.880
<v Speaker 2>I'm going to say that again for those in the back.

968
00:45:46.239 --> 00:45:51.599
<v Speaker 2>This tomb predates the Pyramids five two hundred year old.

969
00:45:51.840 --> 00:45:55.559
<v Speaker 3>It is a really cool story to the whole background

970
00:45:55.559 --> 00:45:56.840
<v Speaker 3>and history of it.

971
00:45:56.920 --> 00:45:59.679
<v Speaker 4>They have a really cool YouTube video all about this.

972
00:46:00.039 --> 00:46:01.599
<v Speaker 2>And they have a couple of different beliefs as far

973
00:46:01.639 --> 00:46:03.400
<v Speaker 2>as what it may have been used for, right, they

974
00:46:03.440 --> 00:46:05.760
<v Speaker 2>think it was a tomb. It may have like it said,

975
00:46:05.800 --> 00:46:08.119
<v Speaker 2>it was a tomb and temple. I think it may

976
00:46:08.119 --> 00:46:10.079
<v Speaker 2>have been used for multiple things over the years.

977
00:46:10.119 --> 00:46:11.719
<v Speaker 3>For sure, I think it was a temple, to be

978
00:46:11.719 --> 00:46:12.280
<v Speaker 3>honest with you.

979
00:46:12.440 --> 00:46:14.480
<v Speaker 2>But there's also like little I don't want to call

980
00:46:14.519 --> 00:46:16.760
<v Speaker 2>them cubby holes, but there's like little spots where they

981
00:46:16.840 --> 00:46:20.400
<v Speaker 2>have found human remains. So are these the remains of

982
00:46:20.440 --> 00:46:23.159
<v Speaker 2>whatever ruling family there was? Is this the remains of

983
00:46:23.159 --> 00:46:25.719
<v Speaker 2>whatever high priest or high druid was there at that time?

984
00:46:25.800 --> 00:46:28.760
<v Speaker 4>Like there's so many killing off people to sacrifices.

985
00:46:29.280 --> 00:46:33.159
<v Speaker 2>Maybe the druids weren't known for human sacrifice, but it

986
00:46:33.239 --> 00:46:36.119
<v Speaker 2>wasn't a thing that they They definitely did, but it

987
00:46:36.119 --> 00:46:38.719
<v Speaker 2>wasn't like their main thing. So maybe I don't know.

988
00:46:38.639 --> 00:46:41.559
<v Speaker 3>Maybe they are special sacrifices, or maybe they are high

989
00:46:41.599 --> 00:46:43.960
<v Speaker 3>priests and you know, high priests or something like that.

990
00:46:44.119 --> 00:46:47.119
<v Speaker 2>Yeah kings, I mean, who knows, who knows? But anyway,

991
00:46:47.159 --> 00:46:51.119
<v Speaker 2>so this temple slash tomb in in Ireland, rather a

992
00:46:51.159 --> 00:46:54.400
<v Speaker 2>small opening above the entrance fills with light on several

993
00:46:54.440 --> 00:46:59.039
<v Speaker 2>sunrises surrounding the solstice gradually extending throughout the chamber to

994
00:46:59.119 --> 00:47:03.239
<v Speaker 2>illuminate it. The dramatic effect lasts for seventeen minutes. Although

995
00:47:03.280 --> 00:47:06.679
<v Speaker 2>the exact reason the tomb was created this way isn't known,

996
00:47:07.039 --> 00:47:09.199
<v Speaker 2>it's speculated that it marks the beginning of a new

997
00:47:09.280 --> 00:47:12.800
<v Speaker 2>year and the triumph of light over darkness. Today, visitors

998
00:47:12.840 --> 00:47:15.519
<v Speaker 2>can apply for a lottery drawing to be inside the

999
00:47:15.559 --> 00:47:18.039
<v Speaker 2>temple at the moment of the sunrise. Others will gather

1000
00:47:18.119 --> 00:47:19.159
<v Speaker 2>outside the monument.

1001
00:47:19.320 --> 00:47:22.280
<v Speaker 3>I've I've seen it in the inside and will I

1002
00:47:22.280 --> 00:47:24.119
<v Speaker 3>would totally want to do it and be able to

1003
00:47:24.159 --> 00:47:27.199
<v Speaker 3>see it. It's really cool for seventeen minutes, and it

1004
00:47:27.239 --> 00:47:29.639
<v Speaker 3>makes you really believe. I mean, it makes you really question,

1005
00:47:30.280 --> 00:47:32.880
<v Speaker 3>you know, why and how do they decide to do

1006
00:47:32.960 --> 00:47:33.760
<v Speaker 3>all these things?

1007
00:47:33.880 --> 00:47:38.880
<v Speaker 2>And see this is using sacred geometry in building structures.

1008
00:47:39.079 --> 00:47:41.920
<v Speaker 2>I one hundred percent get down with this. So many

1009
00:47:41.920 --> 00:47:44.320
<v Speaker 2>people on the internet take sacred geometry to mean so

1010
00:47:44.400 --> 00:47:47.079
<v Speaker 2>many things that have no basis in facts whatsoever. When

1011
00:47:47.119 --> 00:47:50.519
<v Speaker 2>we have actual architectural buildings that still stand today that

1012
00:47:50.719 --> 00:47:52.800
<v Speaker 2>use sacred geometry.

1013
00:47:52.480 --> 00:47:56.119
<v Speaker 3>Thinking geometry is really fascinating too. Really, I forget why

1014
00:47:56.199 --> 00:47:58.000
<v Speaker 3>I had to read into it. We did an episode

1015
00:47:58.000 --> 00:48:00.920
<v Speaker 3>with somebody base forg Yeah, and that's why I ended

1016
00:48:01.000 --> 00:48:03.320
<v Speaker 3>up reading a whole bunch into it even more because

1017
00:48:03.320 --> 00:48:04.719
<v Speaker 3>I kind of had a base knowledge of it, but

1018
00:48:05.000 --> 00:48:07.639
<v Speaker 3>I wanted to know more before went into that. It's

1019
00:48:07.719 --> 00:48:10.800
<v Speaker 3>super fascinating and I mean, it's interesting how it was

1020
00:48:10.920 --> 00:48:13.320
<v Speaker 3>used in the time periods in which it was used

1021
00:48:13.320 --> 00:48:16.599
<v Speaker 3>in and how they knew so much, and that kind

1022
00:48:16.599 --> 00:48:19.280
<v Speaker 3>of goes ties into how I feel like we've lost

1023
00:48:19.320 --> 00:48:23.079
<v Speaker 3>history or lost something with us or been reset. But

1024
00:48:23.360 --> 00:48:25.480
<v Speaker 3>that's just my own personal opinion. But I think this

1025
00:48:25.519 --> 00:48:28.840
<v Speaker 3>is a really cool way to celebrate Solstice.

1026
00:48:29.079 --> 00:48:38.360
<v Speaker 2>Agreed, Absolutely, agreed. Moving onward. Illuminations California's mission churches, Okay,

1027
00:48:38.800 --> 00:48:41.719
<v Speaker 2>an illumination effect similar to that scene in Ireland's New

1028
00:48:41.719 --> 00:48:44.840
<v Speaker 2>Grange Tomb have been discovered halfway around the world in

1029
00:48:44.920 --> 00:48:49.360
<v Speaker 2>more recent though still old structures mission churches in California

1030
00:48:49.400 --> 00:48:54.159
<v Speaker 2>and Latin America, such as Old Mission San Juan Bautista,

1031
00:48:54.199 --> 00:48:56.760
<v Speaker 2>built by Spanish missionaries in the late eighteenth and early

1032
00:48:56.840 --> 00:49:01.039
<v Speaker 2>nineteenth centuries to convert Native Americans to Catholicism. At dawn

1033
00:49:01.119 --> 00:49:03.599
<v Speaker 2>on the winter solstice, a shaft of light enters the

1034
00:49:03.679 --> 00:49:06.960
<v Speaker 2>church and illuminates the altar or a sacred object.

1035
00:49:07.320 --> 00:49:08.239
<v Speaker 3>The church appears.

1036
00:49:08.599 --> 00:49:11.280
<v Speaker 2>The churches appear to have been built purposely to align

1037
00:49:11.320 --> 00:49:13.440
<v Speaker 2>with the sun's path and what could have been an

1038
00:49:13.480 --> 00:49:16.440
<v Speaker 2>effort to merge the indigenous people's reverence for the solstice

1039
00:49:16.480 --> 00:49:19.400
<v Speaker 2>with the Christian beliefs. Today, people gather at the churches

1040
00:49:19.440 --> 00:49:23.559
<v Speaker 2>to witness this recently rediscovered phenomenon and celebrate with the

1041
00:49:23.639 --> 00:49:25.599
<v Speaker 2>Native American and Catholic traditions.

1042
00:49:26.039 --> 00:49:29.679
<v Speaker 3>You know what it reminds me of is Uh Indiana Jones.

1043
00:49:30.840 --> 00:49:32.159
<v Speaker 3>You know when they have to put the poll in

1044
00:49:32.239 --> 00:49:35.079
<v Speaker 3>and has the eye. You know how they put the

1045
00:49:35.079 --> 00:49:38.280
<v Speaker 3>pull in and with the eye and they have the mirror. Yeah,

1046
00:49:38.280 --> 00:49:40.000
<v Speaker 3>and the mirror and it comes through the light and

1047
00:49:40.039 --> 00:49:42.719
<v Speaker 3>it shows in. Yeah. It just I don't know, maybe

1048
00:49:42.960 --> 00:49:43.679
<v Speaker 3>totally think of that.

1049
00:49:43.920 --> 00:49:44.480
<v Speaker 2>I like it.

1050
00:49:44.559 --> 00:49:45.320
<v Speaker 3>I like it a lot.

1051
00:49:45.880 --> 00:49:49.159
<v Speaker 2>Now, let's go to South Korea and let's talk about dong.

1052
00:49:49.039 --> 00:49:51.599
<v Speaker 4>G It's like gridbeans and rice, isn't it.

1053
00:49:51.599 --> 00:49:54.280
<v Speaker 2>It kind of looks like that, right. But also I think,

1054
00:49:54.360 --> 00:49:56.320
<v Speaker 2>are these of these dates and peanuts?

1055
00:49:56.440 --> 00:49:57.599
<v Speaker 3>I think that's states and peanuts.

1056
00:49:57.679 --> 00:50:01.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, interesting, Okay. In South three of the winter solstice

1057
00:50:01.119 --> 00:50:04.679
<v Speaker 2>is known as Donge. One of the winter solstice rituals

1058
00:50:04.719 --> 00:50:08.599
<v Speaker 2>includes eating red bean porridge called pot joke. Red is

1059
00:50:08.639 --> 00:50:10.800
<v Speaker 2>considered to be a lucky color, so the dish is

1060
00:50:10.840 --> 00:50:13.440
<v Speaker 2>meant to keep bad spirits away while embracing good wishes

1061
00:50:13.480 --> 00:50:17.960
<v Speaker 2>for the coming year. Other Dongy traditions include giving calendars,

1062
00:50:18.000 --> 00:50:22.480
<v Speaker 2>as Korean kings used to do, and socks. Okay, so

1063
00:50:22.559 --> 00:50:27.079
<v Speaker 2>the kings would give calendars, that seems like a weird gift.

1064
00:50:27.320 --> 00:50:29.239
<v Speaker 3>That's a weird gift for a keen to give. But

1065
00:50:29.760 --> 00:50:32.519
<v Speaker 3>the socks thing makes sense because I give socks every

1066
00:50:32.559 --> 00:50:35.880
<v Speaker 3>single year for Christmas. Every year, without fail, I'm giving

1067
00:50:35.880 --> 00:50:38.280
<v Speaker 3>people socks. I don't know why either. It's been a

1068
00:50:38.280 --> 00:50:40.880
<v Speaker 3>thing though since I was a child. I got socks

1069
00:50:41.079 --> 00:50:43.960
<v Speaker 3>every year. I still get socks. And then I give

1070
00:50:44.039 --> 00:50:47.119
<v Speaker 3>my kids socks, yeah, and my mom. So I don't know,

1071
00:50:47.400 --> 00:50:48.320
<v Speaker 3>it's weird.

1072
00:50:48.400 --> 00:50:51.480
<v Speaker 2>It's a weird thing that like this makes sand America too,

1073
00:50:51.519 --> 00:50:55.000
<v Speaker 2>for sure, the socks, But like the kings giving people calendars. Hell,

1074
00:50:55.000 --> 00:50:56.679
<v Speaker 2>I mean, there's a we have a family member that

1075
00:50:56.719 --> 00:50:59.039
<v Speaker 2>will make calendars every year for like the upcoming year,

1076
00:50:59.079 --> 00:51:01.480
<v Speaker 2>and like put and people all of the family members

1077
00:51:01.519 --> 00:51:03.159
<v Speaker 2>pictures on like birthdays and all this stuff. And that's

1078
00:51:03.159 --> 00:51:05.079
<v Speaker 2>like a really thoughtful gift. I'm not shitting on the

1079
00:51:05.079 --> 00:51:09.119
<v Speaker 2>calendar as a gift, but for ancient Korean kings, always.

1080
00:51:08.920 --> 00:51:10.800
<v Speaker 3>To let them know that, like, hey, you have to

1081
00:51:10.840 --> 00:51:14.599
<v Speaker 3>work Monday through Friday, don't worry, but I extended every

1082
00:51:14.639 --> 00:51:16.679
<v Speaker 3>single day of the year. Yeah, just so you know

1083
00:51:16.800 --> 00:51:17.840
<v Speaker 3>that you have no days off.

1084
00:51:19.679 --> 00:51:22.280
<v Speaker 2>And this is a day where Korean's wish for snow

1085
00:51:22.400 --> 00:51:24.559
<v Speaker 2>as cold weather on the winter solstice is said to

1086
00:51:24.559 --> 00:51:29.599
<v Speaker 2>bring a bountiful harvest. Okay. Interesting. And the last on

1087
00:51:29.639 --> 00:51:35.039
<v Speaker 2>this list is the Montola England in Cornwall, England. Jesus England,

1088
00:51:35.400 --> 00:51:39.960
<v Speaker 2>y'all love, y'all Solstice shit, I love this a reinterpretation

1089
00:51:40.079 --> 00:51:43.880
<v Speaker 2>of ancient Cornish winter Solstice rituals. The Winter Solstice festival

1090
00:51:43.920 --> 00:51:46.679
<v Speaker 2>of Montol, begun in two thousand and seven in the

1091
00:51:46.719 --> 00:51:52.679
<v Speaker 2>town of Penzance, celebrates the culture of England's westernmost peninsula.

1092
00:51:53.079 --> 00:51:57.119
<v Speaker 2>Wearing carnival like costumes, geysers, those wearing disguises, form a

1093
00:51:57.159 --> 00:52:00.760
<v Speaker 2>procession with lanterns, creating a river of fire quote unquote,

1094
00:52:01.039 --> 00:52:03.159
<v Speaker 2>meant to celebrate the return of the sun. In the

1095
00:52:03.239 --> 00:52:06.719
<v Speaker 2>old custom, guysers would roam the streets, putting on skits,

1096
00:52:06.800 --> 00:52:09.639
<v Speaker 2>singing songs and pulling pranks. Part of the fun was

1097
00:52:09.679 --> 00:52:12.440
<v Speaker 2>trying to guess who was who. Today, traditional music, dancing,

1098
00:52:12.440 --> 00:52:15.519
<v Speaker 2>and performances add to their festive Winter Solstice traditions.

1099
00:52:15.840 --> 00:52:18.440
<v Speaker 3>Okay, so I guess we're gonna need to make a

1100
00:52:18.840 --> 00:52:21.880
<v Speaker 3>trip to England for all the Winter Solstice activities.

1101
00:52:21.960 --> 00:52:23.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but we're gonna have to be in four places

1102
00:52:23.559 --> 00:52:23.960
<v Speaker 2>at once.

1103
00:52:25.000 --> 00:52:27.000
<v Speaker 3>Are they all on the same day, all on.

1104
00:52:26.960 --> 00:52:28.159
<v Speaker 2>The Solstice the twenty first?

1105
00:52:29.880 --> 00:52:31.760
<v Speaker 3>Well, I mean it's not like England's that big though.

1106
00:52:31.800 --> 00:52:33.519
<v Speaker 3>You can literally drive the whole thing.

1107
00:52:33.840 --> 00:52:35.000
<v Speaker 2>That's very true.

1108
00:52:35.280 --> 00:52:37.400
<v Speaker 3>And I mean, shit, we drove twenty four hours. We

1109
00:52:37.440 --> 00:52:42.760
<v Speaker 3>could make a three hour drive. It's like boom boom way,

1110
00:52:42.880 --> 00:52:45.079
<v Speaker 3>It's not that it's that big. I couldn't believe when

1111
00:52:45.119 --> 00:52:48.599
<v Speaker 3>so many they made a comparison of like how big

1112
00:52:48.639 --> 00:52:51.719
<v Speaker 3>this the country is versus how big a state is here, and.

1113
00:52:51.639 --> 00:52:53.760
<v Speaker 4>I was like, no way, Yeah, well you could easily

1114
00:52:53.800 --> 00:52:54.320
<v Speaker 4>drive that bitch.

1115
00:52:54.320 --> 00:52:57.599
<v Speaker 3>You could take the damn trains and like all in

1116
00:52:57.639 --> 00:52:58.000
<v Speaker 3>one day.

1117
00:52:58.079 --> 00:53:01.000
<v Speaker 2>People in the schol Festival. If fuck, people in Europe

1118
00:53:01.239 --> 00:53:04.280
<v Speaker 2>don't really get like grasp how large America is, because

1119
00:53:04.320 --> 00:53:06.280
<v Speaker 2>I mean, if you live in France, you could jump

1120
00:53:06.320 --> 00:53:09.199
<v Speaker 2>on a train and be in three different countries over

1121
00:53:09.199 --> 00:53:11.360
<v Speaker 2>the course of a weekend and just go out and

1122
00:53:11.360 --> 00:53:13.559
<v Speaker 2>do your thing. In America, it's like, yo, it will

1123
00:53:13.559 --> 00:53:16.800
<v Speaker 2>take you give or take twelve hours to drive across Texas.

1124
00:53:17.440 --> 00:53:21.119
<v Speaker 3>My god, I hate driving across Texas. I hate drive.

1125
00:53:21.239 --> 00:53:24.679
<v Speaker 3>I will say that again. I passionately hate with every

1126
00:53:24.679 --> 00:53:27.079
<v Speaker 3>fire room my being driving across Texas. I have been

1127
00:53:27.239 --> 00:53:28.400
<v Speaker 3>like it so many times.

1128
00:53:28.400 --> 00:53:32.039
<v Speaker 2>There's so many BUCkies and so many as I hate.

1129
00:53:32.280 --> 00:53:35.199
<v Speaker 3>I hate driving across that state. It just takes way

1130
00:53:35.239 --> 00:53:38.119
<v Speaker 3>too long. And I just it's never ending because.

1131
00:53:37.960 --> 00:53:40.639
<v Speaker 2>They don't want you to leave. That's the point.

1132
00:53:39.840 --> 00:53:43.920
<v Speaker 3>I I'm good. I'm really good. I'll say that though.

1133
00:53:43.960 --> 00:53:47.239
<v Speaker 3>I just I love all the little memes and stuff

1134
00:53:47.239 --> 00:53:50.639
<v Speaker 3>where you see people make on the internet of you know,

1135
00:53:51.000 --> 00:53:54.719
<v Speaker 3>of people from Europe and they're like, oh man, it's

1136
00:53:54.760 --> 00:53:57.599
<v Speaker 3>never ending. And they're driving across like one of our

1137
00:53:57.639 --> 00:54:02.239
<v Speaker 3>small estates. Yeah, and they're like so long, and I'm like, no,

1138
00:54:02.880 --> 00:54:05.199
<v Speaker 3>you're in and out in like four or five hours.

1139
00:54:05.239 --> 00:54:06.159
<v Speaker 3>What are you talking about.

1140
00:54:06.239 --> 00:54:09.000
<v Speaker 2>I've been driving for three hours and I'm still in Delaware, Like,

1141
00:54:09.199 --> 00:54:12.679
<v Speaker 2>oh brother, oh man, you just made some traffic.

1142
00:54:12.719 --> 00:54:14.000
<v Speaker 3>That's all. Yeah too.

1143
00:54:14.400 --> 00:54:16.519
<v Speaker 4>Wait wait, till you get to some of the other states.

1144
00:54:17.199 --> 00:54:18.320
<v Speaker 3>It takes so long.

1145
00:54:19.280 --> 00:54:22.599
<v Speaker 2>So now let's go into the Pagan festival of Yule.

1146
00:54:22.760 --> 00:54:24.079
<v Speaker 2>And I do think this would be a good place

1147
00:54:24.079 --> 00:54:26.000
<v Speaker 2>for us to start before we start kind of peeling

1148
00:54:26.039 --> 00:54:28.199
<v Speaker 2>back the layers on some of these things. This is

1149
00:54:28.239 --> 00:54:31.679
<v Speaker 2>from the Orton Academy, which is a UK publication. Again

1150
00:54:32.039 --> 00:54:33.280
<v Speaker 2>UK doing the things.

1151
00:54:33.639 --> 00:54:35.840
<v Speaker 3>Is this one I gave you yep, oh, okay, it's

1152
00:54:35.840 --> 00:54:36.679
<v Speaker 3>an eight minute read.

1153
00:54:36.920 --> 00:54:40.880
<v Speaker 2>Okay, So the Pagan Festival of Yule. In our last

1154
00:54:40.920 --> 00:54:44.320
<v Speaker 2>post we dived into the debate about pagan origins of Christmas,

1155
00:54:44.360 --> 00:54:47.760
<v Speaker 2>but it's also illuminating and fairer to both Christians and

1156
00:54:47.840 --> 00:54:50.920
<v Speaker 2>Pagans to think about the festivals separately. So this week

1157
00:54:50.960 --> 00:54:53.719
<v Speaker 2>we are taking a look at the pagan festival of Yule.

1158
00:54:54.320 --> 00:54:56.440
<v Speaker 2>For Northern European Pagans, the season of Yule was a

1159
00:54:56.480 --> 00:55:00.440
<v Speaker 2>time for feasting and merrymaking vowels, ghosts and witches. The

1160
00:55:00.480 --> 00:55:04.039
<v Speaker 2>power of the spirits was at its height on Yule's Eve.

1161
00:55:04.559 --> 00:55:06.559
<v Speaker 2>Not only was it a season of darkness in the

1162
00:55:06.559 --> 00:55:10.880
<v Speaker 2>winters of the cold North, but it also but it

1163
00:55:10.960 --> 00:55:13.679
<v Speaker 2>is also a dark time historically, as we don't have

1164
00:55:13.719 --> 00:55:16.039
<v Speaker 2>a lot of written description of pagan practices in pre

1165
00:55:16.159 --> 00:55:20.679
<v Speaker 2>modern times. Doctor Orton investigates, so let's dive in here.

1166
00:55:21.159 --> 00:55:25.360
<v Speaker 2>Written evidence isn't everything. Oral tradition can be invaluable, as

1167
00:55:25.480 --> 00:55:31.480
<v Speaker 2>is archaeological evidence in research about religious history. When we're

1168
00:55:31.519 --> 00:55:34.039
<v Speaker 2>looking at the pagan history of Europe, written evidence is

1169
00:55:34.079 --> 00:55:37.039
<v Speaker 2>particularly hard to find. But can we at least use

1170
00:55:37.079 --> 00:55:39.400
<v Speaker 2>written sources to start to build a picture of the

1171
00:55:39.400 --> 00:55:44.320
<v Speaker 2>festival of Yule. Yule and Christmas are often used as synonyms,

1172
00:55:44.320 --> 00:55:47.159
<v Speaker 2>and there is a common argument that Christians or excuse me,

1173
00:55:47.280 --> 00:55:50.440
<v Speaker 2>Christmas is derived from Pagan festival of Yule. Having said this,

1174
00:55:50.760 --> 00:55:55.760
<v Speaker 2>the two have very different origins. Christmas was originally Mediterranean festival,

1175
00:55:56.039 --> 00:55:59.239
<v Speaker 2>of which we have written evidence from the at least

1176
00:55:59.440 --> 00:56:03.960
<v Speaker 2>fourth sent Yule is actually a season, not just a festival,

1177
00:56:04.280 --> 00:56:08.400
<v Speaker 2>but this season includes feasting and celebration. The earliest mention

1178
00:56:08.440 --> 00:56:11.239
<v Speaker 2>of Yule is from the sixth century in Northern Europe,

1179
00:56:11.400 --> 00:56:14.639
<v Speaker 2>so Christmas itself goes back to the fourth century as

1180
00:56:14.639 --> 00:56:17.280
<v Speaker 2>far as written documentation goes. Keep this in mind, and

1181
00:56:17.320 --> 00:56:20.840
<v Speaker 2>at least written documentation Yule only is written about in

1182
00:56:20.840 --> 00:56:23.840
<v Speaker 2>the sixth century in Northern Europe. This is from a

1183
00:56:23.880 --> 00:56:26.719
<v Speaker 2>calendar of Saints Days from the five hundreds, and it

1184
00:56:26.760 --> 00:56:32.840
<v Speaker 2>is from a palimpspet a recycled manuscript. I honestly didn't know.

1185
00:56:32.840 --> 00:56:35.639
<v Speaker 3>What that word was me either. When I read it,

1186
00:56:35.679 --> 00:56:38.159
<v Speaker 3>I was like, palm, I'm gonna have to look that up,

1187
00:56:38.159 --> 00:56:39.800
<v Speaker 3>but thankfully they gave us a translation.

1188
00:56:39.920 --> 00:56:44.800
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, and it contains the phrase fruma Yules, which

1189
00:56:44.880 --> 00:56:48.679
<v Speaker 2>means either first part of Yule or before Yule. The

1190
00:56:48.800 --> 00:56:55.239
<v Speaker 2>Old English Martyrology The Study of Martyrs Wow, a collection

1191
00:56:55.320 --> 00:56:58.320
<v Speaker 2>of saints biographies written in the late ninth century, calls

1192
00:56:58.360 --> 00:57:01.440
<v Speaker 2>the twenty fifth of December the first Yule day. December

1193
00:57:01.559 --> 00:57:04.840
<v Speaker 2>is called former Yule, in January is called after Yule.

1194
00:57:05.639 --> 00:57:10.159
<v Speaker 2>Very interesting, Minnie. Pagans today celebrate Yule on the winter solstice.

1195
00:57:10.199 --> 00:57:13.679
<v Speaker 2>The Julian calendar, named after Emperor Julius Caesar, was the

1196
00:57:13.719 --> 00:57:16.920
<v Speaker 2>common European calendar until the late sixth century, and under

1197
00:57:16.920 --> 00:57:20.719
<v Speaker 2>this calendar, the solstice fell on December twenty fifth. This

1198
00:57:20.880 --> 00:57:23.800
<v Speaker 2>was replaced by the Gregorian calendar from fifteen eighty two,

1199
00:57:24.199 --> 00:57:27.199
<v Speaker 2>according to which the solstice usually falls on the twenty

1200
00:57:27.239 --> 00:57:29.119
<v Speaker 2>first or twenty second of December.

1201
00:57:29.679 --> 00:57:32.519
<v Speaker 3>Okay, so that so the Jewelian Yeah, yes, That's what

1202
00:57:32.559 --> 00:57:33.400
<v Speaker 3>I was getting at.

1203
00:57:33.960 --> 00:57:38.719
<v Speaker 2>Very interesting. Bede's detor I'm not Gonna The Reckoning of Time,

1204
00:57:38.760 --> 00:57:41.519
<v Speaker 2>written around seven point thirty a d. Says that the

1205
00:57:41.599 --> 00:57:46.039
<v Speaker 2>lunar month of Guile corresponds with December and January, and

1206
00:57:46.039 --> 00:57:51.000
<v Speaker 2>that the English calendar began on the twenty fifth of December. Wow.

1207
00:57:51.199 --> 00:57:53.920
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, So this dude, from everything that I can find,

1208
00:57:54.119 --> 00:57:57.559
<v Speaker 3>he is he is the one of two people that

1209
00:57:57.719 --> 00:58:02.079
<v Speaker 3>is commonly referred to the discussion of Yule is brought up,

1210
00:58:02.440 --> 00:58:05.440
<v Speaker 3>the Betty guy, and this other one is a monk

1211
00:58:05.559 --> 00:58:07.920
<v Speaker 3>that's been brought into it too. So there's two people

1212
00:58:07.920 --> 00:58:12.000
<v Speaker 3>that they've found the most literature about Yule and when

1213
00:58:12.159 --> 00:58:15.559
<v Speaker 3>potentially it could have been or could not have been started.

1214
00:58:15.920 --> 00:58:17.840
<v Speaker 3>And so you'll see his name. He gets brought up

1215
00:58:17.840 --> 00:58:20.440
<v Speaker 3>a lot throughout this whole thing. But because they were

1216
00:58:20.480 --> 00:58:24.159
<v Speaker 3>the ones that wrote everything down right verse just being

1217
00:58:24.320 --> 00:58:25.920
<v Speaker 3>oral translations.

1218
00:58:25.400 --> 00:58:30.039
<v Speaker 2>And the Yule season absolutely predates the written documentation vibe.

1219
00:58:30.239 --> 00:58:32.800
<v Speaker 3>I'm sure a long show goes into more about it.

1220
00:58:32.840 --> 00:58:35.519
<v Speaker 3>This is actually a really interesting read I found. But

1221
00:58:35.559 --> 00:58:38.159
<v Speaker 3>there's a lot of different ones that I did find

1222
00:58:38.960 --> 00:58:43.559
<v Speaker 3>of scholars arguing back and forth about the specific dates

1223
00:58:43.719 --> 00:58:49.480
<v Speaker 3>the Yule, its celebration itself and the festivities and what happened,

1224
00:58:49.519 --> 00:58:53.519
<v Speaker 3>what didn't happen, and if it's pre your post Christian influence.

1225
00:58:54.000 --> 00:58:56.199
<v Speaker 3>So there's a lot of there's still even today they're

1226
00:58:56.199 --> 00:59:01.000
<v Speaker 3>still arguing over specifically when it is an if Christianity

1227
00:59:01.119 --> 00:59:05.239
<v Speaker 3>either adopted it or they or they stole it kind

1228
00:59:05.239 --> 00:59:07.000
<v Speaker 3>of you know, they adopted it into their own thing,

1229
00:59:07.159 --> 00:59:09.760
<v Speaker 3>or it was pre them, and then it kind of

1230
00:59:09.760 --> 00:59:12.960
<v Speaker 3>trended in this whole other thing. And that's so it's

1231
00:59:13.000 --> 00:59:16.159
<v Speaker 3>a long standing issue, I guess you could.

1232
00:59:15.960 --> 00:59:17.880
<v Speaker 2>Say, but that is what we are diving into on

1233
00:59:17.960 --> 00:59:21.360
<v Speaker 2>this very episode. Good cult members, so continuing here, says

1234
00:59:21.440 --> 00:59:24.239
<v Speaker 2>Beid Betty or beide No, I'm not sure how to

1235
00:59:24.239 --> 00:59:26.760
<v Speaker 2>pronounce that b E d E. He also mentioned the

1236
00:59:26.800 --> 00:59:30.559
<v Speaker 2>Pagan festival of mandrain Act, which is Mother's Night, which

1237
00:59:30.559 --> 00:59:34.159
<v Speaker 2>he says the Pagan celebrate on the eighth calends of January,

1238
00:59:34.199 --> 00:59:38.719
<v Speaker 2>which is the twenty fifth of December. Somehow, when he

1239
00:59:38.880 --> 00:59:41.480
<v Speaker 2>when we celebrate the birth of the Lord, that very

1240
00:59:41.599 --> 00:59:44.440
<v Speaker 2>night which we hold so sacred, they used to call

1241
00:59:44.559 --> 00:59:47.960
<v Speaker 2>by the heathen word mandrain Act, that is Mother's Night,

1242
00:59:48.039 --> 00:59:51.920
<v Speaker 2>because we suspect of the ceremonies they enacted all that night.

1243
00:59:52.400 --> 00:59:56.360
<v Speaker 2>Mandrain Act was the new year in the English calendar. Interesting,

1244
00:59:56.840 --> 00:59:59.480
<v Speaker 2>this was the twenty fifth of December in the Julian calendar.

1245
00:59:59.760 --> 01:00:02.880
<v Speaker 2>It's possible that the festival celebrated ancestral goddess of the

1246
01:00:02.880 --> 01:00:07.440
<v Speaker 2>Anglo Saxons, which that would stand to reason personally. However,

1247
01:00:07.519 --> 01:00:11.440
<v Speaker 2>there are good arguments that historically Yule Fest was based

1248
01:00:11.480 --> 01:00:15.159
<v Speaker 2>on the lunar solar calendar, so that date change or

1249
01:00:15.199 --> 01:00:19.119
<v Speaker 2>the date changes every year. Historian of religion Andreas Nordberg

1250
01:00:19.760 --> 01:00:22.360
<v Speaker 2>argues that the pre Christian Yule feast occurred at the

1251
01:00:22.400 --> 01:00:25.119
<v Speaker 2>first full moon after the first new moon following the

1252
01:00:25.159 --> 01:00:27.960
<v Speaker 2>winter solstice, based on his study of pre Christian Nordic

1253
01:00:27.960 --> 01:00:33.119
<v Speaker 2>calendars and ritual practices. Interesting. So now let's get into Odin,

1254
01:00:33.280 --> 01:00:36.639
<v Speaker 2>kingship and sacrifice. Odin is one of the most important

1255
01:00:36.679 --> 01:00:39.360
<v Speaker 2>pagan gods to be associated with Yule. According to the

1256
01:00:39.440 --> 01:00:43.320
<v Speaker 2>archaeologist Neil Price, two of Odin's many names show his

1257
01:00:43.400 --> 01:00:49.800
<v Speaker 2>association with midwinter yu'll near yula Heara, meaning master of Yule. Interesting.

1258
01:00:51.039 --> 01:00:54.079
<v Speaker 2>Odin is also associated with kingship in England.

1259
01:00:54.360 --> 01:00:54.760
<v Speaker 3>Wodin.

1260
01:00:54.920 --> 01:00:57.599
<v Speaker 2>The English version of Odin was considered to be an

1261
01:00:57.639 --> 01:01:00.719
<v Speaker 2>ancestral chieftain from whom the Anglo Saxon Kings were descended,

1262
01:01:01.119 --> 01:01:04.719
<v Speaker 2>so much so that Beade includes him in his genealogy

1263
01:01:04.760 --> 01:01:07.840
<v Speaker 2>of the Anglo Saxon Kings. This is important because youll

1264
01:01:07.880 --> 01:01:11.360
<v Speaker 2>feasts are connected to the king in pagan texts in

1265
01:01:11.639 --> 01:01:14.719
<v Speaker 2>Helmscrilla heimskrilla Springla.

1266
01:01:16.639 --> 01:01:19.920
<v Speaker 3>I've I am terrible with the saying this word. It's

1267
01:01:20.000 --> 01:01:23.960
<v Speaker 3>like heimspringler, Okay, something like that. Yeah, that's the it's

1268
01:01:24.000 --> 01:01:25.559
<v Speaker 3>the sagas. Yeah.

1269
01:01:25.599 --> 01:01:28.320
<v Speaker 2>So this is a thirteenth century collection of sagas about

1270
01:01:28.360 --> 01:01:32.639
<v Speaker 2>Norwegian kings by Snorley Stirluson. We get a description of

1271
01:01:32.679 --> 01:01:36.400
<v Speaker 2>a ritual banquet. Quote. At this banquet everyone had to

1272
01:01:36.400 --> 01:01:39.400
<v Speaker 2>take part in the ale drinking. All kinds of domestic

1273
01:01:39.440 --> 01:01:42.599
<v Speaker 2>animals are slaughtered there, including horses, and all the blood

1274
01:01:42.599 --> 01:01:45.840
<v Speaker 2>that came from them was called halt, which is lot

1275
01:01:46.519 --> 01:01:50.639
<v Speaker 2>and what the blood was contained in halt bowls and

1276
01:01:50.880 --> 01:01:55.920
<v Speaker 2>haught twigs. These were fashioned like holy water sprinklers. With

1277
01:01:56.280 --> 01:01:58.920
<v Speaker 2>these at the altars were to be reddened all over,

1278
01:01:59.400 --> 01:02:02.480
<v Speaker 2>and also the the walls of the temple outside and inside,

1279
01:02:02.599 --> 01:02:05.599
<v Speaker 2>and the people also were sprinkled, while the meat was

1280
01:02:05.639 --> 01:02:08.039
<v Speaker 2>to be cooked for a feast. There would be fires

1281
01:02:08.079 --> 01:02:10.239
<v Speaker 2>down the middle of the floor in the temple with

1282
01:02:10.280 --> 01:02:14.719
<v Speaker 2>cauldrons over them. Okay, end quote. We also hear about

1283
01:02:14.760 --> 01:02:17.920
<v Speaker 2>the toasts that were made which link Odin, other gods

1284
01:02:17.920 --> 01:02:21.840
<v Speaker 2>and the king direct quote. First would be Odin's toast

1285
01:02:22.199 --> 01:02:24.320
<v Speaker 2>that was drunk to victory and the power of the king.

1286
01:02:24.760 --> 01:02:28.440
<v Speaker 2>And then Nyonders, which is the Norse god of the sea,

1287
01:02:28.480 --> 01:02:31.840
<v Speaker 2>wind and wealth. I'm trying to remember who is that

1288
01:02:31.840 --> 01:02:35.119
<v Speaker 2>supposed to be? Is that supposed to be Thworp? Now

1289
01:02:35.480 --> 01:02:39.679
<v Speaker 2>new orders? Okay, the Norse god of the sea, wind

1290
01:02:39.679 --> 01:02:44.599
<v Speaker 2>and wealth, toast Freyers toasts for prosperity and peace. Then

1291
01:02:44.719 --> 01:02:48.280
<v Speaker 2>after that was common for many people to drink the bragafol,

1292
01:02:48.400 --> 01:02:51.239
<v Speaker 2>which is the chieftain's toast. People also drank toast to

1293
01:02:51.239 --> 01:02:53.679
<v Speaker 2>their kinsmen, those who have been buried in mounds, and

1294
01:02:53.719 --> 01:02:57.800
<v Speaker 2>these were called mini or memorial toasts. In the same collection,

1295
01:02:58.159 --> 01:03:01.440
<v Speaker 2>the Saga of Hakon the Good tells the story of

1296
01:03:01.440 --> 01:03:06.239
<v Speaker 2>Norwegian king Hakon Hakkon, who converted to Christianity in England.

1297
01:03:06.639 --> 01:03:08.840
<v Speaker 2>When he went back to Norway, he tried to convert

1298
01:03:08.880 --> 01:03:12.360
<v Speaker 2>his people, even though quote the country was all Heathen,

1299
01:03:12.400 --> 01:03:15.320
<v Speaker 2>and there was a great deal of pagan worship end quote.

1300
01:03:15.599 --> 01:03:19.079
<v Speaker 2>Hakkon quote made it law that observance of Yule should

1301
01:03:19.079 --> 01:03:22.239
<v Speaker 2>begin at the same time as Christian people observed Christmas,

1302
01:03:22.639 --> 01:03:25.199
<v Speaker 2>and then everyone was to have a measure of ill

1303
01:03:25.519 --> 01:03:28.440
<v Speaker 2>or else pay a fine, and keep holiday as long

1304
01:03:28.519 --> 01:03:32.280
<v Speaker 2>as the ale lasted. But previously, observance of Yule began

1305
01:03:32.519 --> 01:03:36.719
<v Speaker 2>on the midwinter night and continued for three nights end quote.

1306
01:03:37.079 --> 01:03:39.519
<v Speaker 2>Some of Hakon's friends, out of friendship to him, allowed

1307
01:03:39.559 --> 01:03:43.519
<v Speaker 2>themselves to be baptized and laid aside sacrifices, and Hakon

1308
01:03:43.599 --> 01:03:47.400
<v Speaker 2>had several churches consecrated, so he is the reason why

1309
01:03:47.519 --> 01:03:51.079
<v Speaker 2>certain cultures have moved when these toasts would be given

1310
01:03:51.320 --> 01:03:54.960
<v Speaker 2>to when the Christians observed Christmas. Even though, like it

1311
01:03:55.000 --> 01:03:58.960
<v Speaker 2>said previously, the observance of Yuele began on midwinter night

1312
01:03:59.480 --> 01:04:01.840
<v Speaker 2>and continued for three nights, which makes sense. The Solces

1313
01:04:01.920 --> 01:04:03.719
<v Speaker 2>is supposed to be like a three day festival, isn't it.

1314
01:04:04.119 --> 01:04:07.039
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, And this guy actually did a lot of things,

1315
01:04:07.079 --> 01:04:10.440
<v Speaker 3>pissed off a lot of people because he forced Christianity

1316
01:04:10.559 --> 01:04:13.639
<v Speaker 3>on so many people in a really not pleasant way.

1317
01:04:13.840 --> 01:04:15.639
<v Speaker 2>On his own people, let's keep that in mind his

1318
01:04:15.679 --> 01:04:18.360
<v Speaker 2>own tribesmen. Yeah, and I've so this.

1319
01:04:18.360 --> 01:04:19.880
<v Speaker 4>Is the same dude we talked about the other day.

1320
01:04:20.039 --> 01:04:23.360
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that there's a lot of different debates about why

1321
01:04:23.440 --> 01:04:26.400
<v Speaker 3>he decided that this was like this is a fucking way,

1322
01:04:26.519 --> 01:04:28.960
<v Speaker 3>and let's destroy all of our actual beliefs that we've

1323
01:04:28.960 --> 01:04:29.760
<v Speaker 3>had for so long.

1324
01:04:30.079 --> 01:04:34.239
<v Speaker 2>So I've looked into him. I can't find any evidence

1325
01:04:34.280 --> 01:04:36.719
<v Speaker 2>to say if this was a strategic move for him,

1326
01:04:37.039 --> 01:04:40.159
<v Speaker 2>and I absolutely understand that argument for sure. He didn't

1327
01:04:40.199 --> 01:04:43.440
<v Speaker 2>gain anything from it. He gained the favor of Rome,

1328
01:04:43.880 --> 01:04:46.440
<v Speaker 2>but that didn't help him in any of his endeavors.

1329
01:04:46.599 --> 01:04:49.480
<v Speaker 2>That didn't help his tribe or his nation get put

1330
01:04:49.519 --> 01:04:53.559
<v Speaker 2>on the map in any noticeable way. He didn't whenever

1331
01:04:53.599 --> 01:04:55.559
<v Speaker 2>he would call his banners to wage war on like

1332
01:04:55.599 --> 01:04:59.320
<v Speaker 2>the other Nordic tribes. He didn't get like the hold

1333
01:04:59.360 --> 01:05:01.519
<v Speaker 2>of Roman Church to come and help him by any means.

1334
01:05:01.920 --> 01:05:05.639
<v Speaker 2>Doing this helped him, not even a little bit. But

1335
01:05:05.719 --> 01:05:07.400
<v Speaker 2>he still went out of his way to do this,

1336
01:05:07.519 --> 01:05:09.119
<v Speaker 2>which I find to be very interesting.

1337
01:05:09.440 --> 01:05:11.639
<v Speaker 3>He could have just, I don't know, taken it upon

1338
01:05:11.719 --> 01:05:14.800
<v Speaker 3>himself to just be Christian then and leave everyone else

1339
01:05:14.840 --> 01:05:16.639
<v Speaker 3>alone to be able to practice the way that they

1340
01:05:16.639 --> 01:05:17.719
<v Speaker 3>want to practice their faith.

1341
01:05:17.800 --> 01:05:21.679
<v Speaker 2>But you know they could have but the live and

1342
01:05:21.760 --> 01:05:24.800
<v Speaker 2>let live ideals of Christianity, that might be what the

1343
01:05:24.840 --> 01:05:26.719
<v Speaker 2>church was founded on. But then when you get to

1344
01:05:26.719 --> 01:05:28.920
<v Speaker 2>the Middle Ages, that kind of went by the wayside,

1345
01:05:28.960 --> 01:05:30.880
<v Speaker 2>And now we're at a level of Christianity now where

1346
01:05:30.880 --> 01:05:32.840
<v Speaker 2>we're kind of back to it by a lot of standards.

1347
01:05:32.880 --> 01:05:34.920
<v Speaker 2>There are those that are outliers that absolutely are trying

1348
01:05:34.920 --> 01:05:37.880
<v Speaker 2>to force conversions on people. I know this, but by

1349
01:05:37.920 --> 01:05:40.480
<v Speaker 2>and large, most Christians are not trying to force conversions

1350
01:05:40.519 --> 01:05:43.880
<v Speaker 2>on people. This in today's modern day and age, the

1351
01:05:43.960 --> 01:05:48.000
<v Speaker 2>Muslims are doing that in moral mass than anybody. But yeah,

1352
01:05:48.119 --> 01:05:52.159
<v Speaker 2>the Middle Ages was very much convert at sword point. Yeah,

1353
01:05:52.559 --> 01:05:55.679
<v Speaker 2>so I mean, and this guy, he wasn't forced into conversion,

1354
01:05:56.199 --> 01:05:59.800
<v Speaker 2>he but he by some accounts, absolutely forced some of

1355
01:05:59.840 --> 01:06:03.039
<v Speaker 2>his people to convert. But then even this article says

1356
01:06:03.039 --> 01:06:06.719
<v Speaker 2>that his friends, out of friendship to him, got baptized

1357
01:06:06.719 --> 01:06:08.079
<v Speaker 2>and set aside sacrifices.

1358
01:06:08.119 --> 01:06:10.239
<v Speaker 3>I don't think that's because they saw the light some

1359
01:06:10.280 --> 01:06:10.920
<v Speaker 3>of their friends.

1360
01:06:11.199 --> 01:06:13.480
<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, some of his friends. I don't think that's

1361
01:06:13.519 --> 01:06:15.199
<v Speaker 2>because they just saw the love of Christ and they

1362
01:06:15.199 --> 01:06:19.039
<v Speaker 2>saw the light by any means, And I don't they

1363
01:06:19.400 --> 01:06:21.360
<v Speaker 2>don't say that it was based out of fear either,

1364
01:06:21.800 --> 01:06:24.079
<v Speaker 2>but those are like his close croup, right, that's like

1365
01:06:24.119 --> 01:06:27.760
<v Speaker 2>his top dogs. I suppose the lower levels of his

1366
01:06:27.920 --> 01:06:33.519
<v Speaker 2>tribes they had a different experience for sure. So anyway,

1367
01:06:33.599 --> 01:06:37.320
<v Speaker 2>continue sacrifices continue to be important. However, because at another

1368
01:06:37.360 --> 01:06:40.960
<v Speaker 2>sacrificial feast, Hakone, who had previously confused people by making

1369
01:06:40.960 --> 01:06:43.400
<v Speaker 2>the sign of the cross over the horn at the

1370
01:06:43.400 --> 01:06:47.280
<v Speaker 2>first toast, refused to eat horseflesh. En quote was at

1371
01:06:47.280 --> 01:06:51.079
<v Speaker 2>the point of being attacked end quote. I don't know

1372
01:06:51.119 --> 01:06:53.559
<v Speaker 2>why you would refuse to eat horse flesh. There's nothing

1373
01:06:53.960 --> 01:06:55.760
<v Speaker 2>of biblical relevance.

1374
01:06:55.320 --> 01:06:56.840
<v Speaker 3>I would say, so is hedonistic.

1375
01:06:57.679 --> 01:06:59.480
<v Speaker 2>Eating horse flesh is not hethenistic.

1376
01:07:00.119 --> 01:07:01.159
<v Speaker 3>It was viewed as such.

1377
01:07:02.039 --> 01:07:03.679
<v Speaker 2>Well, if it was the horse that was sacrificed for

1378
01:07:03.760 --> 01:07:06.360
<v Speaker 2>this purpose, then like, okay, it's seen as like maybe tainted.

1379
01:07:06.639 --> 01:07:10.159
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I know that's they they sacrificed the sacrifice, it for.

1380
01:07:10.159 --> 01:07:13.639
<v Speaker 3>The blood, and it's viewed as he's a inistic so

1381
01:07:13.719 --> 01:07:16.400
<v Speaker 3>he refused to partake, and at that point, like you're

1382
01:07:16.480 --> 01:07:21.239
<v Speaker 3>shitting all over your people and their customs, and yeah,

1383
01:07:21.280 --> 01:07:21.679
<v Speaker 3>fuck you.

1384
01:07:21.960 --> 01:07:24.480
<v Speaker 2>But he's also a king and his power is the

1385
01:07:24.559 --> 01:07:27.519
<v Speaker 2>ultimate authority. So that's also kind of crazy that they

1386
01:07:27.519 --> 01:07:29.679
<v Speaker 2>were thinking of attacking the king during a Yule feast,

1387
01:07:29.679 --> 01:07:32.840
<v Speaker 2>which goes against the Nordic tradition as well of hospitality.

1388
01:07:32.840 --> 01:07:34.400
<v Speaker 2>You don't attack somebody at a feast.

1389
01:07:34.639 --> 01:07:37.159
<v Speaker 3>Well, I mean, he pissed off enough people and like,

1390
01:07:37.280 --> 01:07:39.840
<v Speaker 3>I mean he was forced converting people, but was.

1391
01:07:40.239 --> 01:07:42.360
<v Speaker 2>Racing them to not eat the horse. He just chose

1392
01:07:42.400 --> 01:07:43.679
<v Speaker 2>that he wasn't going to eat the horse.

1393
01:07:43.840 --> 01:07:46.239
<v Speaker 3>True, but if you look into everything else he did,

1394
01:07:46.360 --> 01:07:49.280
<v Speaker 3>he pretty much told them that you will buy by Christianity,

1395
01:07:49.880 --> 01:07:52.400
<v Speaker 3>or you will pay a fine, or you'll die from

1396
01:07:52.440 --> 01:07:55.639
<v Speaker 3>Eventually he's he attacks his people that didn't convert.

1397
01:07:56.159 --> 01:08:00.840
<v Speaker 2>So no, yeah, yeah, I mean to what all like

1398
01:08:00.920 --> 01:08:02.960
<v Speaker 2>went into that as far as like did he get

1399
01:08:03.000 --> 01:08:04.360
<v Speaker 2>to a point because it just says now at the

1400
01:08:04.360 --> 01:08:07.239
<v Speaker 2>next Yule feast, eight Norwegian chiefs resolved to root out

1401
01:08:07.320 --> 01:08:10.320
<v Speaker 2>Christianity and to oblige the king to offer sacrifice to

1402
01:08:10.360 --> 01:08:12.960
<v Speaker 2>the gods. Priests were killed and churches burned, and the

1403
01:08:13.039 --> 01:08:15.440
<v Speaker 2>king was told that he should offer sacrifice under threat

1404
01:08:15.440 --> 01:08:18.880
<v Speaker 2>of violence. So keep in mind this was the first Yule.

1405
01:08:18.960 --> 01:08:20.560
<v Speaker 2>He's like, nah, I'm just not going to take part

1406
01:08:20.600 --> 01:08:22.000
<v Speaker 2>in that. They got so mad at him that the

1407
01:08:22.119 --> 01:08:25.039
<v Speaker 2>very next Yule they decided to attack him and kill

1408
01:08:25.119 --> 01:08:27.960
<v Speaker 2>priests and then threaten him. So his response was to

1409
01:08:27.960 --> 01:08:30.359
<v Speaker 2>come after the people that were threatening him.

1410
01:08:30.399 --> 01:08:35.079
<v Speaker 3>Sure, I mean when your entire I mean, we don't

1411
01:08:35.119 --> 01:08:38.079
<v Speaker 3>know the context, but when your entire way of life

1412
01:08:38.399 --> 01:08:42.520
<v Speaker 3>is being forcibly taken from you and told that you

1413
01:08:42.640 --> 01:08:46.479
<v Speaker 3>can't practice the way that you've practiced for generations. Because

1414
01:08:46.800 --> 01:08:50.159
<v Speaker 3>this one person decided to go convert to Christianity as

1415
01:08:50.199 --> 01:08:51.960
<v Speaker 3>it's spreading across.

1416
01:08:52.359 --> 01:08:54.760
<v Speaker 2>But hold on, he wasn't taken away the Yule feast

1417
01:08:54.880 --> 01:08:56.600
<v Speaker 2>the very next Yule feast does.

1418
01:08:56.520 --> 01:09:00.720
<v Speaker 3>Though, like after this, okay, but listen, but he says

1419
01:09:00.840 --> 01:09:04.399
<v Speaker 3>it says right here though that h he wants to

1420
01:09:04.479 --> 01:09:06.600
<v Speaker 3>change it so that it's in that it's the same

1421
01:09:06.640 --> 01:09:09.880
<v Speaker 3>time as the Christian people observed a Christmas. And then

1422
01:09:10.479 --> 01:09:14.399
<v Speaker 3>he's he's wanting to convert it into Christian holiday and

1423
01:09:14.439 --> 01:09:16.119
<v Speaker 3>not and take away from Yule.

1424
01:09:16.439 --> 01:09:19.159
<v Speaker 2>But nothing about taking away sacrifices. He just said that

1425
01:09:19.199 --> 01:09:21.560
<v Speaker 2>he wasn't going to participate all these other kings.

1426
01:09:21.319 --> 01:09:24.760
<v Speaker 3>When but then if you look at it, though, Odin

1427
01:09:24.880 --> 01:09:27.079
<v Speaker 3>and the king are tied and won, and so if

1428
01:09:27.119 --> 01:09:30.399
<v Speaker 3>you're not if the King is not participating, then it's

1429
01:09:30.399 --> 01:09:33.319
<v Speaker 3>basically saying fuck you to Odin and fuck you to

1430
01:09:33.399 --> 01:09:33.920
<v Speaker 3>his people.

1431
01:09:34.520 --> 01:09:36.800
<v Speaker 2>But he's allowing everybody to practice in their own way.

1432
01:09:36.880 --> 01:09:41.159
<v Speaker 3>But he is the he is the closest to Odin,

1433
01:09:41.760 --> 01:09:45.399
<v Speaker 3>and so that's it's basically like saying if it was

1434
01:09:45.439 --> 01:09:49.359
<v Speaker 3>a Catholic priest or you know, the pope, for example,

1435
01:09:49.640 --> 01:09:52.319
<v Speaker 3>saying if the Pope was like, you know what, fuck

1436
01:09:52.399 --> 01:09:54.359
<v Speaker 3>you God today, I'm not going to do the most

1437
01:09:54.399 --> 01:09:56.960
<v Speaker 3>sacred thing in our in one of our practices, and

1438
01:09:57.039 --> 01:09:58.840
<v Speaker 3>everyone else just has to like deal with it.

1439
01:09:59.119 --> 01:10:01.239
<v Speaker 2>We had that with the last before he died.

1440
01:10:01.279 --> 01:10:06.039
<v Speaker 3>Okay, but I'm I'm simply saying these people were very true,

1441
01:10:06.159 --> 01:10:09.199
<v Speaker 3>like rooted in traditions, and if you win against the gods,

1442
01:10:09.239 --> 01:10:11.840
<v Speaker 3>you brought bad luck and everything else to everybody. And

1443
01:10:11.840 --> 01:10:15.399
<v Speaker 3>they're very superstitious, and so for him, that is the

1444
01:10:15.479 --> 01:10:18.960
<v Speaker 3>closest to got to their one of their gods pretty

1445
01:10:19.039 --> 01:10:20.880
<v Speaker 3>much says fuck you, I'm not going to participate in

1446
01:10:20.920 --> 01:10:23.359
<v Speaker 3>this because now I decided to become a Christian and

1447
01:10:23.680 --> 01:10:25.600
<v Speaker 3>if you don't do what I want and do it

1448
01:10:25.640 --> 01:10:27.760
<v Speaker 3>at this time, then you're gonna have to pay a fine.

1449
01:10:28.119 --> 01:10:30.880
<v Speaker 3>And then all that like at the same time at

1450
01:10:31.159 --> 01:10:36.079
<v Speaker 3>as during between the mules, he is like mass converting people,

1451
01:10:36.560 --> 01:10:39.880
<v Speaker 3>forcing them to convert. So like during the whole year,

1452
01:10:40.000 --> 01:10:43.600
<v Speaker 3>he's pissed off enough people that they're like, you know, no, no, no.

1453
01:10:43.880 --> 01:10:46.000
<v Speaker 2>Is there any record to say that that happened between

1454
01:10:46.000 --> 01:10:47.560
<v Speaker 2>the mules, because all we hear is the first you

1455
01:10:47.720 --> 01:10:49.840
<v Speaker 2>when he got Christianized, he said he's not going to

1456
01:10:49.920 --> 01:10:52.560
<v Speaker 2>participate the next day violence.

1457
01:10:52.720 --> 01:10:55.600
<v Speaker 3>So the one article that I read did go into him,

1458
01:10:55.920 --> 01:10:57.640
<v Speaker 3>I'll have to I could pull it up again, and

1459
01:10:57.680 --> 01:11:01.039
<v Speaker 3>probably that did talk about his reign, and he pretty

1460
01:11:01.119 --> 01:11:04.760
<v Speaker 3>much went from like it's okay, I'm Christian. This is

1461
01:11:04.760 --> 01:11:07.279
<v Speaker 3>what I want to do to every one of you

1462
01:11:07.359 --> 01:11:10.520
<v Speaker 3>have to be Christian, burn every single long house, do

1463
01:11:10.640 --> 01:11:13.479
<v Speaker 3>all of this note like this I could imagine. So no,

1464
01:11:13.640 --> 01:11:16.760
<v Speaker 3>this was before they attacked him, before they said this

1465
01:11:17.000 --> 01:11:20.720
<v Speaker 3>was like during the year span. He pretty much was like, screwt,

1466
01:11:21.600 --> 01:11:23.640
<v Speaker 3>I'm doing what I want to do, and like you better,

1467
01:11:23.840 --> 01:11:24.880
<v Speaker 3>you better bend the knee.

1468
01:11:25.119 --> 01:11:28.760
<v Speaker 2>So so this is all after or before the Norwegian

1469
01:11:28.840 --> 01:11:31.279
<v Speaker 2>chiefs resolved to route out Christianity and murder priests in

1470
01:11:31.319 --> 01:11:33.920
<v Speaker 2>their churches and burn them to the ground and force

1471
01:11:33.960 --> 01:11:35.800
<v Speaker 2>a cone to eat horse liver.

1472
01:11:36.800 --> 01:11:39.319
<v Speaker 3>Well, maybe don't be a dick and try to erase

1473
01:11:39.359 --> 01:11:40.439
<v Speaker 3>your entire history.

1474
01:11:40.600 --> 01:11:42.279
<v Speaker 2>I would like to see the dates to see. I'm

1475
01:11:42.319 --> 01:11:44.399
<v Speaker 2>not saying that you're wrong. I don't know this now.

1476
01:11:44.439 --> 01:11:45.359
<v Speaker 3>I'm gonna have to look it up.

1477
01:11:45.439 --> 01:11:47.720
<v Speaker 2>It's very possible that this did happen in that one

1478
01:11:47.800 --> 01:11:50.000
<v Speaker 2>year time span, but if you look at the entire

1479
01:11:50.319 --> 01:11:53.520
<v Speaker 2>reign of his time, this all could have taken place

1480
01:11:53.600 --> 01:11:56.119
<v Speaker 2>after he got Christianized.

1481
01:11:56.800 --> 01:12:00.079
<v Speaker 3>Well, we will, we will look, we will. While you're reading,

1482
01:12:00.119 --> 01:12:01.039
<v Speaker 3>I will be looking up.

1483
01:12:01.119 --> 01:12:03.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, let's do that. So next toasts, oath and

1484
01:12:03.920 --> 01:12:07.279
<v Speaker 2>the sacred boar, three important elements of the pagan festival

1485
01:12:07.279 --> 01:12:10.319
<v Speaker 2>of Yule. Where toasts, oaths and the sacred boar. There

1486
01:12:10.359 --> 01:12:16.079
<v Speaker 2>is evidence of this North literature the Helga helgakevita, Oh

1487
01:12:16.159 --> 01:12:18.119
<v Speaker 2>Jesus Christ. I'm not going to do that. The poem

1488
01:12:18.159 --> 01:12:22.239
<v Speaker 2>of Helgi schorwolf Son of the poetic Eda and collection

1489
01:12:22.319 --> 01:12:26.000
<v Speaker 2>of Old Norse poems, largely from the nine hundreds, describes

1490
01:12:26.079 --> 01:12:29.279
<v Speaker 2>Yule eve, on which quote the great vowels were taken,

1491
01:12:29.359 --> 01:12:32.520
<v Speaker 2>the sacred boar was bought brought in, and the men

1492
01:12:32.680 --> 01:12:35.439
<v Speaker 2>laid their hands thereon and took their vows at the

1493
01:12:35.520 --> 01:12:42.479
<v Speaker 2>king's toast. The kravs Mal, traditionally dated to nine hundred

1494
01:12:42.640 --> 01:12:46.880
<v Speaker 2>AD as well, is a fragmented Skaldic or Old Norse

1495
01:12:46.920 --> 01:12:50.600
<v Speaker 2>Icelandic verse form poem about part of a dialogue between

1496
01:12:50.680 --> 01:12:53.399
<v Speaker 2>a valkyrie, a female warrior who serves the god Odin,

1497
01:12:53.720 --> 01:12:56.760
<v Speaker 2>and a raven. The courageous leader wants to toast the

1498
01:12:56.840 --> 01:13:00.720
<v Speaker 2>Yule tide at out at sea if he alone has

1499
01:13:00.760 --> 01:13:06.960
<v Speaker 2>his way. The practice uh to the sport of Freyer. Interesting,

1500
01:13:07.640 --> 01:13:10.399
<v Speaker 2>so he wanted to practice Yule out at sea by himself.

1501
01:13:11.800 --> 01:13:14.680
<v Speaker 2>I guess the time of traditional.

1502
01:13:14.119 --> 01:13:18.079
<v Speaker 3>Oaths, that people that they survived being able to take

1503
01:13:18.159 --> 01:13:21.960
<v Speaker 3>their boats in such dangerous waters. It blows my mind.

1504
01:13:22.600 --> 01:13:24.880
<v Speaker 2>I mean a lot of that is towards the really

1505
01:13:24.920 --> 01:13:28.520
<v Speaker 2>crazy engineering that went into those So that's dope. But wait,

1506
01:13:28.560 --> 01:13:30.640
<v Speaker 2>wait is that what is that article source? By the way,

1507
01:13:30.640 --> 01:13:32.239
<v Speaker 2>because that looks very similar to the one we're going

1508
01:13:32.239 --> 01:13:32.800
<v Speaker 2>to read in a bit.

1509
01:13:33.199 --> 01:13:35.239
<v Speaker 3>Oh, I'm just trying to find one that actually goes

1510
01:13:35.279 --> 01:13:39.800
<v Speaker 3>into his his reign, because there's there's two different one,

1511
01:13:39.960 --> 01:13:43.279
<v Speaker 3>two different Hakna or how you say his name. Yeah,

1512
01:13:43.359 --> 01:13:45.880
<v Speaker 3>so there's the one that we're reading right now, it's

1513
01:13:46.199 --> 01:13:49.000
<v Speaker 3>h a k o N. And then there's the last

1514
01:13:49.039 --> 01:13:54.079
<v Speaker 3>standing Norwegian Viking chief that is h a a k

1515
01:13:54.239 --> 01:13:57.760
<v Speaker 3>o N and he is like really renowned for being

1516
01:13:57.840 --> 01:14:02.079
<v Speaker 3>like the last stronghold of paganism and the vikings and stuff.

1517
01:14:02.159 --> 01:14:04.720
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, not this guy, No, this guy.

1518
01:14:04.920 --> 01:14:07.800
<v Speaker 3>So there's there's this, So there's different years in between

1519
01:14:07.800 --> 01:14:08.880
<v Speaker 3>when this happened and stuff.

1520
01:14:08.920 --> 01:14:12.000
<v Speaker 4>So I'm currently trying to see exactly for this one.

1521
01:14:12.039 --> 01:14:15.560
<v Speaker 2>I'm trying to remember the Norwegian king Hakone convert to

1522
01:14:15.640 --> 01:14:16.800
<v Speaker 2>Christianity in England.

1523
01:14:17.000 --> 01:14:19.199
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I didn't see his dates. I think that he's

1524
01:14:19.239 --> 01:14:22.199
<v Speaker 3>in the five hundreds. Maybe I need to see exactly.

1525
01:14:22.560 --> 01:14:24.439
<v Speaker 3>I'm trying to see when it was.

1526
01:14:24.640 --> 01:14:27.279
<v Speaker 2>Do your thing, raven uh. The sacred Boar was an

1527
01:14:27.279 --> 01:14:30.079
<v Speaker 2>important part of the Yule festival. It was consecrated to Frere,

1528
01:14:30.359 --> 01:14:36.720
<v Speaker 2>the Norse got of fertility, prosperity, peace, sunshine, and good harvest. Okay,

1529
01:14:36.760 --> 01:14:40.119
<v Speaker 2>Frere rode on a boar called gul and Bursty. In

1530
01:14:40.199 --> 01:14:43.119
<v Speaker 2>a prose Eta or in the pros at A, a thirteenth

1531
01:14:43.159 --> 01:14:46.439
<v Speaker 2>century collection of Norse mythology associated with Icelandic historian and

1532
01:14:46.520 --> 01:14:52.479
<v Speaker 2>poet Snorley Sirlison. The Guilfen nae ning Yep says that

1533
01:14:52.800 --> 01:14:55.600
<v Speaker 2>Frere drove in his chariot with the boar called gold

1534
01:14:55.680 --> 01:14:59.640
<v Speaker 2>Maine or fear tusk. Fearful tusk, that's a badass name

1535
01:14:59.680 --> 01:15:02.640
<v Speaker 2>for au for a bore. In the same collection, the

1536
01:15:03.199 --> 01:15:06.880
<v Speaker 2>Skaldska par Mal says that Frere's boar could run through

1537
01:15:06.880 --> 01:15:09.600
<v Speaker 2>the air and water better than any horse, and could

1538
01:15:09.640 --> 01:15:12.720
<v Speaker 2>never become so dark with night or gloom of the

1539
01:15:12.800 --> 01:15:15.840
<v Speaker 2>murky regions that there should not be sufficient light where

1540
01:15:15.840 --> 01:15:20.640
<v Speaker 2>he went, such was the glow from its main embristles. Interesting.

1541
01:15:21.239 --> 01:15:24.319
<v Speaker 3>So this does say that if this is the right

1542
01:15:24.479 --> 01:15:30.239
<v Speaker 3>correct person. Hawk On, son of Harold Finnhair, brother to

1543
01:15:30.479 --> 01:15:34.720
<v Speaker 3>Eric blood Axe, became king in nineteen thirties. His attempt

1544
01:15:34.720 --> 01:15:37.279
<v Speaker 3>to convert his subjects was met with such success that

1545
01:15:37.319 --> 01:15:41.119
<v Speaker 3>he actually ended up becoming a pagan again. Yeah, so

1546
01:15:42.159 --> 01:15:44.039
<v Speaker 3>I don't know if this is the correct one or not,

1547
01:15:44.319 --> 01:15:47.479
<v Speaker 3>so I'm trying to find more information on him. Okay,

1548
01:15:47.680 --> 01:15:50.920
<v Speaker 3>but it's possible that this is the same one. They

1549
01:15:51.039 --> 01:15:53.439
<v Speaker 3>kind of all have the same goddamn names. Yeah, So

1550
01:15:53.920 --> 01:15:56.119
<v Speaker 3>it's kind of challenging, but fair.

1551
01:15:56.039 --> 01:15:58.119
<v Speaker 2>Enough, fair enough. So that's what I'm saying, is, if

1552
01:15:58.119 --> 01:16:00.359
<v Speaker 2>that is the guy which I don't think it is, honestly,

1553
01:16:00.399 --> 01:16:02.079
<v Speaker 2>because if that's the guy, you're telling me that he

1554
01:16:02.119 --> 01:16:04.800
<v Speaker 2>went on a mass raid and murdered a ton of

1555
01:16:04.800 --> 01:16:07.239
<v Speaker 2>his people, just convert to paganism at the end. That

1556
01:16:07.239 --> 01:16:10.399
<v Speaker 2>that sounds very unlikely to me. But Vikings be doing

1557
01:16:10.479 --> 01:16:14.039
<v Speaker 2>Viking shit, I don't know. One of the few vestiges

1558
01:16:14.079 --> 01:16:16.359
<v Speaker 2>of the sacred Boar of Yule today can be found

1559
01:16:16.399 --> 01:16:19.079
<v Speaker 2>at the Queen's College at the University of Oxford. The

1560
01:16:19.159 --> 01:16:22.039
<v Speaker 2>Queen's College performs the Boar's Head Carol at the Boar's

1561
01:16:22.039 --> 01:16:25.600
<v Speaker 2>Head Ceremony every year, a week before Christmas. The ceremony

1562
01:16:25.640 --> 01:16:28.279
<v Speaker 2>is inspired by pagan custom and commemorates the killing of

1563
01:16:28.279 --> 01:16:30.479
<v Speaker 2>a boar by a student who is said to have

1564
01:16:30.520 --> 01:16:35.119
<v Speaker 2>shoved a volume of Aristotle down a boar's throat. What what?

1565
01:16:35.720 --> 01:16:38.520
<v Speaker 2>The boar found it too hard to digest and died,

1566
01:16:39.199 --> 01:16:45.880
<v Speaker 2>saying grakham est or it is Greek hmm that they

1567
01:16:45.880 --> 01:16:49.239
<v Speaker 2>still do that to this day. The Boar's Head Carol,

1568
01:16:50.119 --> 01:16:52.840
<v Speaker 2>all right, that's a thing. That is a thing you,

1569
01:16:53.520 --> 01:16:56.199
<v Speaker 2>you British people at Oxford. I'll be wiling' all right.

1570
01:16:56.239 --> 01:16:58.760
<v Speaker 2>So the Spirits of Yule Mule is also a season

1571
01:16:58.760 --> 01:17:01.479
<v Speaker 2>of spirits and the supernow natural. Odin was the god

1572
01:17:01.479 --> 01:17:03.960
<v Speaker 2>of the dead, and Yule is a season when people

1573
01:17:04.039 --> 01:17:09.439
<v Speaker 2>can come closer to the dead. The Grittier Saga, a

1574
01:17:09.560 --> 01:17:13.119
<v Speaker 2>fourteenth century Icelandic Sanda saga, says that Yule is a

1575
01:17:13.199 --> 01:17:16.520
<v Speaker 2>time of the greatest mirth and joyants among men, but

1576
01:17:16.560 --> 01:17:19.760
<v Speaker 2>it is also a time of hauntings and supernatural activity.

1577
01:17:19.920 --> 01:17:23.800
<v Speaker 2>The saga also links Yule to the Christian tradition. No

1578
01:17:23.960 --> 01:17:26.920
<v Speaker 2>Christian man is wont to eat meat this day, because

1579
01:17:26.960 --> 01:17:30.600
<v Speaker 2>that is the morrow is the first day of Yule.

1580
01:17:31.199 --> 01:17:33.039
<v Speaker 2>Is that on the morrow is the first day of Yule?

1581
01:17:33.399 --> 01:17:39.479
<v Speaker 2>Wherefore must men first fast today? That the language didn't

1582
01:17:39.520 --> 01:17:40.079
<v Speaker 2>make a lot of.

1583
01:17:41.039 --> 01:17:42.119
<v Speaker 3>It didn't make lost sense either.

1584
01:17:42.359 --> 01:17:44.359
<v Speaker 2>So it's saying that Christian men won't eat meat the

1585
01:17:44.439 --> 01:17:47.840
<v Speaker 2>day before Christmas because they feast on the following day.

1586
01:17:49.079 --> 01:17:51.840
<v Speaker 2>I guess that's what I extrapolated from that one. But

1587
01:17:51.880 --> 01:17:54.920
<v Speaker 2>all right, Glam a dead man who has become a

1588
01:17:54.960 --> 01:17:59.479
<v Speaker 2>restless spirit, became because he refused to follow Christian customs

1589
01:17:59.520 --> 01:18:02.840
<v Speaker 2>and committed evil deeds in his life. Uh, he lay

1590
01:18:02.880 --> 01:18:06.079
<v Speaker 2>not quiet, and his supernatural activity was all the worse

1591
01:18:06.359 --> 01:18:10.039
<v Speaker 2>during Yule. Glam took to writing the house roofs at night,

1592
01:18:10.439 --> 01:18:13.880
<v Speaker 2>so that he went nigh to breaking them in. Now

1593
01:18:14.000 --> 01:18:17.760
<v Speaker 2>he walked well nigh night and day. Hardly durst Men

1594
01:18:17.880 --> 01:18:22.880
<v Speaker 2>fare into the dale. Though they had errands enough there

1595
01:18:23.319 --> 01:18:26.600
<v Speaker 2>and much scathe. The men of the countryside deemed all this.

1596
01:18:28.119 --> 01:18:29.119
<v Speaker 2>You know, old English is.

1597
01:18:30.520 --> 01:18:34.920
<v Speaker 3>Old English is rough. Man, it is, it's rough to understand. Sometimes.

1598
01:18:35.119 --> 01:18:38.119
<v Speaker 2>I've had to reread Dante's Inferno so many times just

1599
01:18:38.159 --> 01:18:40.119
<v Speaker 2>to make sure that I like got all of it,

1600
01:18:40.359 --> 01:18:42.479
<v Speaker 2>because it's written in such ways, and I'll have to

1601
01:18:42.520 --> 01:18:44.399
<v Speaker 2>stop and be like, all right, what the fuck is

1602
01:18:45.039 --> 01:18:48.399
<v Speaker 2>durst men? Like, are we talking Fred.

1603
01:18:48.279 --> 01:18:50.479
<v Speaker 3>Durst Durstman fire up into the dale?

1604
01:18:51.000 --> 01:18:53.479
<v Speaker 2>What the fuck is the dale? I don't know, actually,

1605
01:18:53.560 --> 01:18:55.159
<v Speaker 2>and I know people in the comment section, No, the

1606
01:18:55.239 --> 01:18:57.439
<v Speaker 2>dale is this you're so don't listen. I don't fucking know.

1607
01:18:57.479 --> 01:19:00.960
<v Speaker 2>I barely speak American English or right, calm down, But anyway,

1608
01:19:01.119 --> 01:19:04.079
<v Speaker 2>it is what it is, so continuing on, it, says

1609
01:19:04.119 --> 01:19:07.319
<v Speaker 2>today's Yules. Association with the supernatural can be seen in

1610
01:19:07.359 --> 01:19:11.840
<v Speaker 2>the English tradition of watling, which involves singing, drinking, bonfires,

1611
01:19:11.880 --> 01:19:14.640
<v Speaker 2>and banging pots and pans. The idea is to do

1612
01:19:14.680 --> 01:19:17.039
<v Speaker 2>this in the orchard, although it can sometimes take place

1613
01:19:17.039 --> 01:19:20.079
<v Speaker 2>in homes. It also might involve going to the doors

1614
01:19:20.079 --> 01:19:22.640
<v Speaker 2>of wealthy people to seeing in exchange for alcohol, food,

1615
01:19:22.720 --> 01:19:25.199
<v Speaker 2>or money. During the winter months, this was thought to

1616
01:19:25.239 --> 01:19:28.920
<v Speaker 2>wake up the trees and ensure a bumper crop. I'm

1617
01:19:28.960 --> 01:19:32.840
<v Speaker 2>assuming that's a better crop, and also the route out

1618
01:19:33.159 --> 01:19:36.000
<v Speaker 2>to root out the evil spirits lurking among the fruit trees.

1619
01:19:36.399 --> 01:19:37.840
<v Speaker 2>All right, what'd you find? You got a look?

1620
01:19:37.920 --> 01:19:40.880
<v Speaker 3>Oh, there's just so much literature that I'm gonna have

1621
01:19:40.920 --> 01:19:43.239
<v Speaker 3>to like read through because there's like two different ones.

1622
01:19:44.159 --> 01:19:45.960
<v Speaker 3>But then they say one of them says that they're

1623
01:19:45.960 --> 01:19:48.920
<v Speaker 3>the same person, but the other ones say that that's

1624
01:19:48.960 --> 01:19:50.840
<v Speaker 3>two different people, two different kings.

1625
01:19:51.239 --> 01:19:52.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so what the source is?

1626
01:19:52.800 --> 01:19:54.479
<v Speaker 3>And yeah, I would have to sit and read it.

1627
01:19:54.520 --> 01:19:56.399
<v Speaker 3>And I'm wanting to like listen to this, and so

1628
01:19:56.640 --> 01:19:58.479
<v Speaker 3>it's one of those scenes of if I misspoke, I

1629
01:19:58.880 --> 01:20:01.800
<v Speaker 3>might have misspoken. But from the one text that I

1630
01:20:01.800 --> 01:20:06.199
<v Speaker 3>did read was from Where Is She From? She's a

1631
01:20:06.199 --> 01:20:08.960
<v Speaker 3>scholarly lady that was talking about it, and she said

1632
01:20:09.000 --> 01:20:13.479
<v Speaker 3>pretty much that this person was seen as at first

1633
01:20:13.520 --> 01:20:15.920
<v Speaker 3>really good for his people, and then he converted. He

1634
01:20:16.000 --> 01:20:18.479
<v Speaker 3>decided to quote convert to Christianity. Then he went on

1635
01:20:18.520 --> 01:20:22.920
<v Speaker 3>a terror pretty much, and then I didn't really read

1636
01:20:23.000 --> 01:20:25.399
<v Speaker 3>like further into it. I was like, okay, whatever, I

1637
01:20:25.439 --> 01:20:26.920
<v Speaker 3>didn't really think he was going to get brought up.

1638
01:20:27.000 --> 01:20:28.560
<v Speaker 3>And then the other one that I was looking at,

1639
01:20:28.880 --> 01:20:31.560
<v Speaker 3>he was actually really good for his people. He held

1640
01:20:31.600 --> 01:20:33.840
<v Speaker 3>onto the pagan ways, but he was a very good

1641
01:20:33.880 --> 01:20:37.159
<v Speaker 3>politician and was able to like navigate being like, yeah,

1642
01:20:37.199 --> 01:20:39.800
<v Speaker 3>we're kind of Christian, but we're not, and like, so

1643
01:20:40.479 --> 01:20:42.119
<v Speaker 3>I don't know I need to. I would actually have

1644
01:20:42.159 --> 01:20:44.520
<v Speaker 3>to spend time and sit and read through all the

1645
01:20:44.560 --> 01:20:47.039
<v Speaker 3>literature before I just am like, hey, this is this dude.

1646
01:20:47.119 --> 01:20:50.239
<v Speaker 3>So as of right now, I don't know if that

1647
01:20:50.520 --> 01:20:54.479
<v Speaker 3>man did or did not intentionally piss off his people.

1648
01:20:54.560 --> 01:20:57.800
<v Speaker 3>But even in the context of potentially not being a

1649
01:20:57.840 --> 01:21:00.560
<v Speaker 3>threat to his people during that time, I could see

1650
01:21:00.600 --> 01:21:04.359
<v Speaker 3>why people would be very upset with somebody that they

1651
01:21:04.399 --> 01:21:06.520
<v Speaker 3>hold in such a high regard, that has such a

1652
01:21:06.600 --> 01:21:11.800
<v Speaker 3>high powerful position towards their gods, that decided just suddenly, hey,

1653
01:21:11.800 --> 01:21:13.479
<v Speaker 3>this is what we're doing, and I'm not going to

1654
01:21:13.479 --> 01:21:17.720
<v Speaker 3>participate in our in our deep rooted beliefs, and I'm

1655
01:21:17.760 --> 01:21:20.319
<v Speaker 3>not going to do the things that we hold sacred

1656
01:21:20.479 --> 01:21:22.600
<v Speaker 3>in pretty much fuck you guys, And.

1657
01:21:22.560 --> 01:21:24.720
<v Speaker 2>I mean we have to question this source as well,

1658
01:21:25.039 --> 01:21:27.880
<v Speaker 2>honestly like to say that, oh well, he didn't stop

1659
01:21:27.920 --> 01:21:30.600
<v Speaker 2>his people from participating in the ule sacrifices. He just

1660
01:21:30.680 --> 01:21:32.960
<v Speaker 2>wasn't going to do it himself. So I know, how incredible.

1661
01:21:33.880 --> 01:21:36.960
<v Speaker 3>This is just one of like fifteen different sources I

1662
01:21:37.079 --> 01:21:39.800
<v Speaker 3>found just right off the top, and I picked it

1663
01:21:39.800 --> 01:21:43.039
<v Speaker 3>because it had a lot of different aspects to the

1664
01:21:43.119 --> 01:21:46.119
<v Speaker 3>mule traditions overall, because I thought it just brought in

1665
01:21:46.199 --> 01:21:48.560
<v Speaker 3>a lot of different characteristics. But I did read different

1666
01:21:48.640 --> 01:21:52.039
<v Speaker 3>stuff from different sources when we were looking the other day,

1667
01:21:52.399 --> 01:21:53.800
<v Speaker 3>and so it's kind of one of those scenes that

1668
01:21:53.840 --> 01:21:57.399
<v Speaker 3>there's certain certain things that everyone can say without a doubt.

1669
01:21:57.479 --> 01:22:01.560
<v Speaker 3>You know, this monk and the beady guy beat guy

1670
01:22:01.720 --> 01:22:04.680
<v Speaker 3>were the ones that talked about it in written language,

1671
01:22:05.119 --> 01:22:07.680
<v Speaker 3>and that this is what they're saying that they observed

1672
01:22:07.760 --> 01:22:11.159
<v Speaker 3>or that they've heard and this and that. But you know,

1673
01:22:11.199 --> 01:22:13.600
<v Speaker 3>nobody was there, none of us. None of us were there,

1674
01:22:13.640 --> 01:22:16.680
<v Speaker 3>so we don't truly know unless we were physically there

1675
01:22:16.840 --> 01:22:18.079
<v Speaker 3>what actually transpired.

1676
01:22:18.199 --> 01:22:21.560
<v Speaker 2>So indeed, all right, so let's continue with this English.

1677
01:22:22.319 --> 01:22:24.960
<v Speaker 2>There are a lot of suggestions about the other pagan

1678
01:22:25.039 --> 01:22:28.159
<v Speaker 2>Yule traditions that survive at Christmas time today, but many

1679
01:22:28.159 --> 01:22:31.680
<v Speaker 2>of these are from oral narratives rather than historical texts.

1680
01:22:32.000 --> 01:22:36.119
<v Speaker 2>Vernacular narratives themselves are really valuable, but these pre modern

1681
01:22:36.159 --> 01:22:39.319
<v Speaker 2>texts can also help us to make an uh make

1682
01:22:39.880 --> 01:22:42.680
<v Speaker 2>help us to make a start in understanding the historical

1683
01:22:42.760 --> 01:22:44.079
<v Speaker 2>pagan festival of Yule.

1684
01:22:44.439 --> 01:22:46.800
<v Speaker 3>H okay. And so then, like you'll see, they have

1685
01:22:46.880 --> 01:22:50.199
<v Speaker 3>like religious if you go back up going so fast,

1686
01:22:50.279 --> 01:22:54.039
<v Speaker 3>I'm sorry right there, no find out more, find out more.

1687
01:22:54.199 --> 01:22:57.840
<v Speaker 3>It has like religious studies, history, anthropology, it has like

1688
01:22:58.079 --> 01:23:02.439
<v Speaker 3>this doctor that talks about it. They have there's just

1689
01:23:02.520 --> 01:23:04.920
<v Speaker 3>all sorts of different links that you can keep clicking

1690
01:23:04.960 --> 01:23:07.960
<v Speaker 3>on and like throughout this this article in particular, they

1691
01:23:07.960 --> 01:23:10.159
<v Speaker 3>have links to go to like different things to learn

1692
01:23:10.159 --> 01:23:13.319
<v Speaker 3>more about stuff. And then it's it's one of those

1693
01:23:13.319 --> 01:23:15.319
<v Speaker 3>things that they feel like you would keep reading. I

1694
01:23:15.359 --> 01:23:18.239
<v Speaker 3>wish we could talk to people that actually live over there,

1695
01:23:18.399 --> 01:23:20.520
<v Speaker 3>because they have their own because I follow a whole

1696
01:23:20.520 --> 01:23:24.439
<v Speaker 3>bunch of them on Instagram, and even even with the

1697
01:23:24.960 --> 01:23:27.840
<v Speaker 3>like ten that I watch all the time, all of

1698
01:23:27.880 --> 01:23:30.880
<v Speaker 3>them say something different. Yeah, so cause they live in

1699
01:23:30.920 --> 01:23:32.840
<v Speaker 3>different sectors in different places.

1700
01:23:32.439 --> 01:23:36.840
<v Speaker 2>In Sweden's backstory is completely different than Danish backstory.

1701
01:23:36.880 --> 01:23:41.880
<v Speaker 3>It's it's interesting, yeah whose story, which story is correct

1702
01:23:41.960 --> 01:23:43.560
<v Speaker 3>or which version is correct?

1703
01:23:43.640 --> 01:23:46.520
<v Speaker 2>So agreed. So now, good cult members, we are going

1704
01:23:46.600 --> 01:23:48.520
<v Speaker 2>to go to this article and I'm gonna be honest

1705
01:23:48.560 --> 01:23:51.000
<v Speaker 2>with you. It is lengthy, and I promise we are

1706
01:23:51.000 --> 01:23:54.199
<v Speaker 2>going to be stopping for some conversation throughout it. This

1707
01:23:54.439 --> 01:23:57.439
<v Speaker 2>is History for Atheists, which is the name of the

1708
01:23:57.439 --> 01:24:01.000
<v Speaker 2>website here, and it talks about pagan Chris Smith's.

1709
01:24:00.560 --> 01:24:03.479
<v Speaker 4>Again now twenty twenty four.

1710
01:24:03.720 --> 01:24:06.880
<v Speaker 2>This was written right, and so this is going to

1711
01:24:06.920 --> 01:24:11.560
<v Speaker 2>break down a lot of these myths that we've heard

1712
01:24:11.600 --> 01:24:14.239
<v Speaker 2>on the internet so many times about oh, this is

1713
01:24:14.279 --> 01:24:17.720
<v Speaker 2>clearly pagan in origin because dot dot dot, and there

1714
01:24:17.760 --> 01:24:20.079
<v Speaker 2>may be a kernel of truth to that statement. But

1715
01:24:20.119 --> 01:24:22.359
<v Speaker 2>then if you look at the historical context to it,

1716
01:24:22.359 --> 01:24:25.439
<v Speaker 2>it actually doesn't take from the Pagans. If anything, it

1717
01:24:25.479 --> 01:24:28.439
<v Speaker 2>was a Christian thing that might have been close to

1718
01:24:28.479 --> 01:24:30.800
<v Speaker 2>the Pagan thing. Maybe they were next to each other,

1719
01:24:30.880 --> 01:24:33.479
<v Speaker 2>maybe one was adopted by the other, or vice versa

1720
01:24:33.560 --> 01:24:34.479
<v Speaker 2>in a lot of cases.

1721
01:24:35.159 --> 01:24:38.239
<v Speaker 3>So I think the problem is is the term pagan

1722
01:24:38.520 --> 01:24:41.760
<v Speaker 3>and the term yule. I was thinking about this earlier

1723
01:24:41.800 --> 01:24:45.680
<v Speaker 3>tonight about why this conversation kind of like irks me

1724
01:24:45.720 --> 01:24:49.439
<v Speaker 3>a little bit, is because I guess when you're talking

1725
01:24:49.479 --> 01:24:57.159
<v Speaker 3>about Abrahammick religions, they essentially have demonized anything that isn't pertaining.

1726
01:24:57.000 --> 01:24:59.000
<v Speaker 4>Specifically to the way that they practice.

1727
01:25:00.000 --> 01:25:04.720
<v Speaker 3>And Yule has been demonized as this you know, pagan

1728
01:25:04.840 --> 01:25:09.880
<v Speaker 3>potentially which satanic thing that has transpired, and so people

1729
01:25:09.920 --> 01:25:13.680
<v Speaker 3>have been persecuted and have been you know, even probably

1730
01:25:13.760 --> 01:25:16.359
<v Speaker 3>potentially killed. I'm not going to say outright, but yeah,

1731
01:25:16.560 --> 01:25:20.119
<v Speaker 3>but killed over this, over these one of these beliefs,

1732
01:25:20.159 --> 01:25:23.479
<v Speaker 3>and there seem to be demonic or you know, practicing

1733
01:25:23.479 --> 01:25:27.159
<v Speaker 3>Satanism or something like that because they aren't adhering specifically

1734
01:25:27.199 --> 01:25:30.399
<v Speaker 3>to the Abrahamic religion. And then to find out that

1735
01:25:30.479 --> 01:25:34.800
<v Speaker 3>this is could be by all your accounts and stuff,

1736
01:25:34.840 --> 01:25:37.359
<v Speaker 3>that this could have been created by the Christian Church,

1737
01:25:37.880 --> 01:25:41.159
<v Speaker 3>just like a Halloween is created by the Catholic Church.

1738
01:25:41.600 --> 01:25:43.680
<v Speaker 3>And then to think about how many people have suffered

1739
01:25:43.720 --> 01:25:47.159
<v Speaker 3>at the hands of these specific religions because they have

1740
01:25:47.239 --> 01:25:50.720
<v Speaker 3>deemed it being a pagan thing. It's quite frustrating to

1741
01:25:50.760 --> 01:25:54.039
<v Speaker 3>me that I say that I want to string up

1742
01:25:54.079 --> 01:25:58.079
<v Speaker 3>some you know, oranges and cranberries with some popcorn and

1743
01:25:58.159 --> 01:26:02.039
<v Speaker 3>somehow that is demonic and you know that is evil,

1744
01:26:02.119 --> 01:26:05.640
<v Speaker 3>and it's just like, okay, but why can't if this

1745
01:26:05.800 --> 01:26:09.199
<v Speaker 3>is truly a Christian thing and you're still practicing in

1746
01:26:09.239 --> 01:26:13.960
<v Speaker 3>a Christian way quote unquote these pagan ways, then what

1747
01:26:14.000 --> 01:26:16.800
<v Speaker 3>are we talking about? Why are we having this discussion

1748
01:26:17.239 --> 01:26:20.159
<v Speaker 3>and why is it seen as such negative when you

1749
01:26:20.279 --> 01:26:24.760
<v Speaker 3>want to do these things You're you're talking about nothing harmful,

1750
01:26:25.119 --> 01:26:29.399
<v Speaker 3>nothing enacting. You're still having rituals within the churches, so

1751
01:26:29.640 --> 01:26:34.920
<v Speaker 3>you're still participating in rituals. So I guess that's my

1752
01:26:34.920 --> 01:26:37.199
<v Speaker 3>my hang up here is it's very frustrating to me

1753
01:26:37.359 --> 01:26:41.359
<v Speaker 3>to learn about that. You know, it's not it's not frustrating,

1754
01:26:41.359 --> 01:26:44.119
<v Speaker 3>but it's just frustrating that I hear so many devout

1755
01:26:44.199 --> 01:26:46.600
<v Speaker 3>Christians being here in the Bible Belt you say that

1756
01:26:46.680 --> 01:26:48.960
<v Speaker 3>you want to practice Yule, like I have a little

1757
01:26:49.000 --> 01:26:53.119
<v Speaker 3>mule sign that I put outside and it's Heaven Forbid.

1758
01:26:53.439 --> 01:26:57.319
<v Speaker 3>And it's like, I don't understand, Like if this is truly,

1759
01:26:57.680 --> 01:26:59.319
<v Speaker 3>I get it's it's ignorance.

1760
01:26:59.680 --> 01:27:03.960
<v Speaker 2>It is because for the record, everybody, Yule is a season.

1761
01:27:05.000 --> 01:27:07.760
<v Speaker 2>It is it's like a calendar month. It's from like

1762
01:27:07.800 --> 01:27:10.720
<v Speaker 2>the middle of December to the middle of January, give

1763
01:27:10.800 --> 01:27:13.239
<v Speaker 2>or take depending on which calendar you're looking at. It's

1764
01:27:13.319 --> 01:27:18.159
<v Speaker 2>not the pagan winter fire festival or the time where

1765
01:27:18.159 --> 01:27:21.920
<v Speaker 2>they are summoning thor And it is literally a calendar date.

1766
01:27:23.000 --> 01:27:24.880
<v Speaker 2>It's a month. They'd be like saying, we're celebrating the

1767
01:27:24.880 --> 01:27:28.119
<v Speaker 2>month of February. You hear that it's the it's the

1768
01:27:28.159 --> 01:27:30.199
<v Speaker 2>wildest shit. But to your point, it's a lot of

1769
01:27:30.239 --> 01:27:32.560
<v Speaker 2>ignorance and it's a lot of listening to whatever they've

1770
01:27:32.600 --> 01:27:34.520
<v Speaker 2>been told. We live in the day and age of

1771
01:27:34.520 --> 01:27:36.920
<v Speaker 2>information and the day and age of misinformation. That's why

1772
01:27:36.920 --> 01:27:39.880
<v Speaker 2>this show is what it is. But to look at

1773
01:27:39.880 --> 01:27:43.680
<v Speaker 2>the historical background to it, it doesn't take away there's

1774
01:27:43.720 --> 01:27:45.119
<v Speaker 2>no need yet what are you.

1775
01:27:45.119 --> 01:27:47.920
<v Speaker 3>Doing with the camera? Oh, it's like it was like

1776
01:27:48.039 --> 01:27:52.800
<v Speaker 3>falling down. I mean, there's it's just it's interesting to

1777
01:27:52.840 --> 01:27:56.439
<v Speaker 3>me that this is something that has been And.

1778
01:27:56.399 --> 01:27:59.680
<v Speaker 2>That's also why I don't like demonizing pagan cultures. There

1779
01:27:59.680 --> 01:28:02.239
<v Speaker 2>are some pagan deities that we can look at and say,

1780
01:28:02.239 --> 01:28:04.960
<v Speaker 2>you know what, that might be based in some sort

1781
01:28:04.960 --> 01:28:08.600
<v Speaker 2>of demonology there, I could see it. There's other pagan

1782
01:28:08.640 --> 01:28:12.399
<v Speaker 2>deities that yeah, and I have to admit at one

1783
01:28:12.399 --> 01:28:14.600
<v Speaker 2>point in time, I was that when I say this,

1784
01:28:14.680 --> 01:28:16.920
<v Speaker 2>like back in my youth, when I believe that pretty

1785
01:28:16.960 --> 01:28:19.640
<v Speaker 2>much every pagan deity to ever be spoken of, written

1786
01:28:19.640 --> 01:28:22.600
<v Speaker 2>about drawing whatever is clearly a demon incarnate in this

1787
01:28:22.640 --> 01:28:24.800
<v Speaker 2>way that presented itself to this tribe from way back

1788
01:28:24.840 --> 01:28:28.039
<v Speaker 2>in the day. But I've grown since then. I realized

1789
01:28:28.039 --> 01:28:31.960
<v Speaker 2>that some of them, maybe Ball for sure, Molek got you, like,

1790
01:28:32.000 --> 01:28:35.319
<v Speaker 2>there's there's a multiple Egyptian gods, Like there's ones that

1791
01:28:35.439 --> 01:28:38.920
<v Speaker 2>absolutely this was a demon. I could see it. Then

1792
01:28:38.960 --> 01:28:41.399
<v Speaker 2>others where it's like this is probably just like a

1793
01:28:41.439 --> 01:28:45.640
<v Speaker 2>symbol for the culture itself and these people, regardless of

1794
01:28:45.640 --> 01:28:47.199
<v Speaker 2>how they came up with it or how they got

1795
01:28:47.239 --> 01:28:50.600
<v Speaker 2>the iconography or whatever. To write off all of these

1796
01:28:50.640 --> 01:28:53.920
<v Speaker 2>deities as a demon is to take away thousands of

1797
01:28:54.000 --> 01:28:56.760
<v Speaker 2>years of culture and heritage and tradition that got to

1798
01:28:57.000 --> 01:29:00.039
<v Speaker 2>these people to where they were when the written I

1799
01:29:00.079 --> 01:29:02.479
<v Speaker 2>could finally caught up with them. And it's a bit

1800
01:29:02.479 --> 01:29:03.199
<v Speaker 2>of a misnomer.

1801
01:29:03.680 --> 01:29:06.159
<v Speaker 3>I just find it interesting that even now, you know,

1802
01:29:06.239 --> 01:29:10.760
<v Speaker 3>paganism in different forms of paganism, neopaganism is on the rise,

1803
01:29:11.039 --> 01:29:14.520
<v Speaker 3>and it's still being sought out after the I mean

1804
01:29:14.560 --> 01:29:17.199
<v Speaker 3>specifically I'll just use Christianity because that's the one that's

1805
01:29:17.600 --> 01:29:22.399
<v Speaker 3>like really pushing its agenda on social media platforms that

1806
01:29:22.880 --> 01:29:25.600
<v Speaker 3>this is of the devil. Anybody that practices any of

1807
01:29:25.640 --> 01:29:28.039
<v Speaker 3>this is of the devil. I mean, you're talking about

1808
01:29:28.680 --> 01:29:31.159
<v Speaker 3>you make a wreath, you know, And I just actually

1809
01:29:31.199 --> 01:29:32.600
<v Speaker 3>I had a girlfriend of mine just come over and

1810
01:29:32.640 --> 01:29:35.520
<v Speaker 3>we did we dried out oranges, which, by the way,

1811
01:29:35.560 --> 01:29:38.000
<v Speaker 3>we we messed up a little bit on some of

1812
01:29:38.039 --> 01:29:40.159
<v Speaker 3>the stuff, but we did oranges and cranberries and we

1813
01:29:40.159 --> 01:29:42.640
<v Speaker 3>did popcorn, and we strain our stuff together and you

1814
01:29:42.680 --> 01:29:45.399
<v Speaker 3>know whatnot. And I don't see anything wrong with that.

1815
01:29:45.800 --> 01:29:49.159
<v Speaker 3>I don't feel that there is anything inherently evil when

1816
01:29:49.199 --> 01:29:52.880
<v Speaker 3>you're celebrating the earth, and you're celebrating being connected to

1817
01:29:52.920 --> 01:29:55.760
<v Speaker 3>these things, and you're celebrating the solstices, and you're celebrating

1818
01:29:55.800 --> 01:29:58.439
<v Speaker 3>tradition that has been around for thousands of years, and

1819
01:29:58.479 --> 01:30:01.600
<v Speaker 3>it's just it's interesting seeing that so many people are

1820
01:30:01.680 --> 01:30:04.359
<v Speaker 3>so against all of these things and view it as

1821
01:30:04.359 --> 01:30:08.079
<v Speaker 3>such a negative thing because it doesn't adhere strictly to

1822
01:30:08.159 --> 01:30:10.880
<v Speaker 3>their religion, and it's like, well, that doesn't make any

1823
01:30:10.880 --> 01:30:11.319
<v Speaker 3>sense to me.

1824
01:30:11.439 --> 01:30:14.880
<v Speaker 2>Wreaths are based in Christianity, they're literally based off the

1825
01:30:14.920 --> 01:30:18.119
<v Speaker 2>Catholic candelabra that they use on a yearly basis. That's

1826
01:30:18.159 --> 01:30:22.439
<v Speaker 2>where the wreath with the evergreens first started. That's insane

1827
01:30:22.479 --> 01:30:25.119
<v Speaker 2>that people think that wreaths are pagan or satanic for

1828
01:30:25.159 --> 01:30:25.600
<v Speaker 2>that matter.

1829
01:30:26.079 --> 01:30:29.600
<v Speaker 4>Oh, I mean, you name it anything that is the eulog.

1830
01:30:29.199 --> 01:30:31.039
<v Speaker 2>Friends, we're gonna I'm gonna get him out of itself.

1831
01:30:31.159 --> 01:30:34.640
<v Speaker 2>This article goes into all of it. But like I said, yeah,

1832
01:30:34.680 --> 01:30:36.520
<v Speaker 2>we'll get back to the article, but I'm sure we

1833
01:30:36.560 --> 01:30:38.600
<v Speaker 2>are going to be stopping to have a good little

1834
01:30:38.640 --> 01:30:40.760
<v Speaker 2>conversation about so many things that are brought up on

1835
01:30:40.800 --> 01:30:44.279
<v Speaker 2>this article. But like we're talking about here, even Halloween, right,

1836
01:30:44.439 --> 01:30:46.119
<v Speaker 2>and we talked about that on the Halloween episode.

1837
01:30:46.239 --> 01:30:46.720
<v Speaker 3>A jack O.

1838
01:30:46.760 --> 01:30:49.520
<v Speaker 2>Lantern, Well that's because the Pagans and that was skulls.

1839
01:30:50.159 --> 01:30:52.479
<v Speaker 2>The story of the jack O lantern is a Catholic

1840
01:30:52.479 --> 01:30:54.720
<v Speaker 2>who made a deal with the devil and he made

1841
01:30:54.720 --> 01:30:57.680
<v Speaker 2>a lantern out of a turnip. That's why his name

1842
01:30:57.760 --> 01:31:01.560
<v Speaker 2>was jack That's a very popular Irish treat. But somehow, yes,

1843
01:31:01.920 --> 01:31:05.439
<v Speaker 2>pumpkins are clearly satanic. People are fucking retarded.

1844
01:31:06.079 --> 01:31:08.439
<v Speaker 3>Well, I mean that's the big push though the last

1845
01:31:08.520 --> 01:31:13.119
<v Speaker 3>few years the Christian Church has been against so against Halloween,

1846
01:31:13.159 --> 01:31:17.199
<v Speaker 3>and so many people have been turning away from Halloween.

1847
01:31:17.239 --> 01:31:20.520
<v Speaker 3>We don't celebrate it. It's of the devil, it's evil, it's demonic.

1848
01:31:20.840 --> 01:31:23.640
<v Speaker 2>People do take it too far, And I'll give you that. Like,

1849
01:31:23.880 --> 01:31:25.720
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I'm not saying like you shouldn't have the

1850
01:31:25.720 --> 01:31:28.079
<v Speaker 2>blood and the guts and do whatever. Do who celebrated

1851
01:31:28.119 --> 01:31:31.399
<v Speaker 2>however the hell you want to. Okay, fine, if you

1852
01:31:31.479 --> 01:31:34.800
<v Speaker 2>are putting up demonic iconography and you're doing that to

1853
01:31:34.920 --> 01:31:39.640
<v Speaker 2>like lean that way into Halloween, then like okay, maybe

1854
01:31:39.680 --> 01:31:42.720
<v Speaker 2>not do that. Maybe, but also like do you as

1855
01:31:42.760 --> 01:31:44.439
<v Speaker 2>a free country, you do a joint? You can worship

1856
01:31:44.479 --> 01:31:47.520
<v Speaker 2>the devil freely if you so choose. It's your prerogative,

1857
01:31:47.600 --> 01:31:47.760
<v Speaker 2>you know.

1858
01:31:47.880 --> 01:31:49.600
<v Speaker 3>I think it's just really frustrating to a lot of

1859
01:31:49.600 --> 01:31:52.880
<v Speaker 3>people that are struggling with wanting to be potentially in

1860
01:31:53.000 --> 01:31:55.600
<v Speaker 3>the church or they're shying away from the church because

1861
01:31:55.640 --> 01:32:00.600
<v Speaker 3>it's such man, they're just a bunch of judgmental that's

1862
01:32:01.039 --> 01:32:02.600
<v Speaker 3>the best way to say it. I don't know how

1863
01:32:02.800 --> 01:32:05.000
<v Speaker 3>to be nice about and politically correct.

1864
01:32:05.239 --> 01:32:07.680
<v Speaker 2>I don't understand it. They're like afraid of losing their

1865
01:32:07.720 --> 01:32:11.279
<v Speaker 2>congregates even though Christianity is the number one rising religion

1866
01:32:11.359 --> 01:32:14.039
<v Speaker 2>on Earth right now, and it's not even close.

1867
01:32:14.279 --> 01:32:18.840
<v Speaker 3>It's just very It's just I don't I don't know.

1868
01:32:19.880 --> 01:32:23.399
<v Speaker 3>They are so judgmental that so many of them, not

1869
01:32:23.439 --> 01:32:26.960
<v Speaker 3>all question all even no, I don't want it. I'm

1870
01:32:27.000 --> 01:32:30.199
<v Speaker 3>not going to use you know, whole terms of everyone

1871
01:32:30.319 --> 01:32:33.760
<v Speaker 3>is this now. There are some that are very judgmental,

1872
01:32:33.880 --> 01:32:35.399
<v Speaker 3>that are very.

1873
01:32:36.319 --> 01:32:38.720
<v Speaker 2>Oh I've met Pagans that are super judgmental as well.

1874
01:32:39.319 --> 01:32:40.199
<v Speaker 2>I don't doubt it.

1875
01:32:40.359 --> 01:32:42.880
<v Speaker 3>I mean, at this point, everyone's kind of out for

1876
01:32:42.960 --> 01:32:46.960
<v Speaker 3>their own religion and there's no just simple conversation of

1877
01:32:47.359 --> 01:32:49.079
<v Speaker 3>you know, hey, you believe what you want to believe.

1878
01:32:49.119 --> 01:32:50.520
<v Speaker 3>I believe what I want to believe. We can just

1879
01:32:50.600 --> 01:32:52.680
<v Speaker 3>kind of like chill and do whatever together and that

1880
01:32:52.840 --> 01:32:53.680
<v Speaker 3>just be what it is.

1881
01:32:53.840 --> 01:32:56.119
<v Speaker 2>But that's also part of the human condition, isn't it.

1882
01:32:56.119 --> 01:32:58.800
<v Speaker 2>It's like everybody is seeking that validation like, oh, you

1883
01:32:58.840 --> 01:33:01.680
<v Speaker 2>claim that you're a Christian, well, how Christian are you?

1884
01:33:01.800 --> 01:33:04.560
<v Speaker 2>Oh you claim that you're a pagan, Oh how pagan

1885
01:33:04.600 --> 01:33:06.760
<v Speaker 2>are you? When's the last time you've dot dot dot?

1886
01:33:07.039 --> 01:33:07.680
<v Speaker 3>Do you do this?

1887
01:33:07.760 --> 01:33:11.680
<v Speaker 2>And it's they have that my own thing? But no, no, no, I.

1888
01:33:11.600 --> 01:33:13.680
<v Speaker 3>Truly I truly just do my own thing. And I

1889
01:33:13.720 --> 01:33:15.520
<v Speaker 3>know that people have asked me. I've seen a couple

1890
01:33:15.520 --> 01:33:17.439
<v Speaker 3>of the comments ask me where I'm at, and I've

1891
01:33:17.479 --> 01:33:19.159
<v Speaker 3>kind of talked about it when I first took over

1892
01:33:19.199 --> 01:33:21.520
<v Speaker 3>and stuff. I just personally do my own stuff, and

1893
01:33:21.560 --> 01:33:23.800
<v Speaker 3>like I have no problem with whatever you know you

1894
01:33:23.840 --> 01:33:27.520
<v Speaker 3>want to do. It's just I just find it this

1895
01:33:27.600 --> 01:33:30.560
<v Speaker 3>conversation to be interesting because when I first because I came,

1896
01:33:30.600 --> 01:33:32.199
<v Speaker 3>I grew up in a very Christian home, and so

1897
01:33:32.520 --> 01:33:35.039
<v Speaker 3>when I first talked about doing pagan traditions, it was

1898
01:33:35.199 --> 01:33:39.920
<v Speaker 3>definitely not well received, right. It was very much of

1899
01:33:40.119 --> 01:33:43.760
<v Speaker 3>the word pagan is so it is synonymous with Satan

1900
01:33:43.960 --> 01:33:44.840
<v Speaker 3>and the devil.

1901
01:33:45.079 --> 01:33:48.199
<v Speaker 2>And non Christian pagan by definition just means non Christian.

1902
01:33:48.239 --> 01:33:51.720
<v Speaker 3>No, no, it's but for people that are raised in the

1903
01:33:51.800 --> 01:33:54.760
<v Speaker 3>Christian Church, and like that's what you've been brought up

1904
01:33:54.760 --> 01:33:58.960
<v Speaker 3>when at least in my in my instance, is that

1905
01:33:59.039 --> 01:34:01.840
<v Speaker 3>word in particular is synonymous with the devil, and you're

1906
01:34:02.000 --> 01:34:06.199
<v Speaker 3>you're definitely practicing witchcraft. You're trying to summon demons, you're

1907
01:34:06.239 --> 01:34:09.560
<v Speaker 3>trying to turn you're trying to sell your soul. Like

1908
01:34:09.600 --> 01:34:11.520
<v Speaker 3>you're just like completely.

1909
01:34:11.079 --> 01:34:13.119
<v Speaker 2>Because there's a duality. There's either side of the light

1910
01:34:13.199 --> 01:34:14.680
<v Speaker 2>or the side of the dark. And if you're not

1911
01:34:14.720 --> 01:34:16.760
<v Speaker 2>of Christ, then you're obviously of Satan. And that's what

1912
01:34:16.880 --> 01:34:19.960
<v Speaker 2>people have been taught for centuries. So like, I get it,

1913
01:34:20.039 --> 01:34:23.520
<v Speaker 2>I absolutely do. But again, I think that a lot

1914
01:34:23.560 --> 01:34:28.880
<v Speaker 2>of the especially historic paganism, some of it you can see,

1915
01:34:29.039 --> 01:34:31.640
<v Speaker 2>is based in something of a darker nature. A lot

1916
01:34:31.680 --> 01:34:34.399
<v Speaker 2>of it is more nature based, a lot of it

1917
01:34:34.439 --> 01:34:37.079
<v Speaker 2>is just not even necessarily worshiping the trees, being more

1918
01:34:37.159 --> 01:34:39.920
<v Speaker 2>respectful of nature and appreciating what it gives you.

1919
01:34:40.520 --> 01:34:43.119
<v Speaker 3>Yes, And to be fair though, I will say that

1920
01:34:43.319 --> 01:34:46.600
<v Speaker 3>blood sacrifice of animals and then putting the blood in

1921
01:34:47.359 --> 01:34:51.680
<v Speaker 3>does actually help grow plants. So like when they would

1922
01:34:51.680 --> 01:34:53.560
<v Speaker 3>sacrifice animals and they would drain their blood and they

1923
01:34:53.560 --> 01:34:55.239
<v Speaker 3>would take it out to their crops and they would

1924
01:34:55.279 --> 01:34:59.359
<v Speaker 3>feed the plants the blood, that actually does scientifically work. Yes,

1925
01:34:59.479 --> 01:35:03.279
<v Speaker 3>So I'm you know, now, do I say human sacrifices

1926
01:35:03.319 --> 01:35:05.880
<v Speaker 3>of the vibe? No, let's not human sacrifice people.

1927
01:35:06.039 --> 01:35:07.479
<v Speaker 2>But then you get these people like, so what's the

1928
01:35:07.520 --> 01:35:09.960
<v Speaker 2>difference between an animal life and a human life? I'm like,

1929
01:35:10.000 --> 01:35:12.840
<v Speaker 2>there's literally a whole lot, Like you know, planes and

1930
01:35:13.000 --> 01:35:15.520
<v Speaker 2>cars and buildings and shit air conditioning.

1931
01:35:15.680 --> 01:35:17.479
<v Speaker 3>I mean, there's a lot to be said between the

1932
01:35:17.960 --> 01:35:21.159
<v Speaker 3>two and stuff, but that's that. Conversation has been brought

1933
01:35:21.199 --> 01:35:23.000
<v Speaker 3>up on the cold a few times about souls, and

1934
01:35:23.039 --> 01:35:25.359
<v Speaker 3>we've talked in depth about it on lives and things

1935
01:35:25.359 --> 01:35:29.399
<v Speaker 3>like that. But yeah, no, anyways, to the Christian, Pagan

1936
01:35:29.520 --> 01:35:32.920
<v Speaker 3>Christians and Christmas again.

1937
01:35:32.880 --> 01:35:36.359
<v Speaker 2>Let's talk about it. So the Pagan Christmas. Again, Every year,

1938
01:35:36.399 --> 01:35:39.600
<v Speaker 2>without fail, we find endless articles, memes, and claims on

1939
01:35:39.640 --> 01:35:44.199
<v Speaker 2>social media that about the supposed pagan origins quote unquote

1940
01:35:44.239 --> 01:35:48.560
<v Speaker 2>of Christmas. As with Halloween and Easter, anti theis or

1941
01:35:48.600 --> 01:35:53.199
<v Speaker 2>atheists activists find themselves in furious agreement with neo Pagans

1942
01:35:53.199 --> 01:35:56.119
<v Speaker 2>and even some evangelical Christians that the date and virtually

1943
01:35:56.239 --> 01:35:58.640
<v Speaker 2>all of the main customs of tradition and traditions of

1944
01:35:58.720 --> 01:36:02.199
<v Speaker 2>Christmas are actually pagan. Pop history articles and books are

1945
01:36:02.279 --> 01:36:06.359
<v Speaker 2>full of these breathlessly confident claims, except in fact, very

1946
01:36:06.439 --> 01:36:10.399
<v Speaker 2>little about Christmas is ancient, less still is pre Christian,

1947
01:36:10.479 --> 01:36:15.119
<v Speaker 2>and almost nothing about it is pagan. Yes, that is correct.

1948
01:36:15.399 --> 01:36:20.159
<v Speaker 2>On screen right now, we got Odin doing his thing right.

1949
01:36:20.239 --> 01:36:22.800
<v Speaker 2>We got him with the holly wreath and he's wearing

1950
01:36:22.840 --> 01:36:27.600
<v Speaker 2>the pentacle medallion, and he's got a cup, and he's

1951
01:36:27.640 --> 01:36:29.800
<v Speaker 2>got a little goat dude playing a fiddle down here.

1952
01:36:29.800 --> 01:36:35.159
<v Speaker 2>He's doing his thing right. The idea that Christmas and

1953
01:36:35.199 --> 01:36:37.640
<v Speaker 2>its traditions are pagan in origin is one of those

1954
01:36:37.720 --> 01:36:41.600
<v Speaker 2>pervasive ideas that quote unquote everyone knows. It is repeated

1955
01:36:41.720 --> 01:36:45.439
<v Speaker 2>endlessly in news articles, seasonal filler segments on TV, online

1956
01:36:45.479 --> 01:36:48.800
<v Speaker 2>pop history, and of course memes. So many anti theists

1957
01:36:48.840 --> 01:36:53.520
<v Speaker 2>social media accounts present a succession of smug memes reminding

1958
01:36:53.840 --> 01:36:57.520
<v Speaker 2>Christians that everyone that and everyone else that Christmas was

1959
01:36:57.560 --> 01:37:00.680
<v Speaker 2>actually a pagan festival hijacked by Christianity. The date of

1960
01:37:00.720 --> 01:37:03.079
<v Speaker 2>the twenty fifth of December, the giving of gifts, feasting

1961
01:37:03.119 --> 01:37:06.640
<v Speaker 2>and drinking, the Christmas tree, holly mistletoe, and even Santa Claus,

1962
01:37:06.920 --> 01:37:12.359
<v Speaker 2>we are assured, all have pagan origins. Atheisluminaries like Seth

1963
01:37:12.439 --> 01:37:17.359
<v Speaker 2>Andrews and Aaron ra quote unquote go into gleeful detail

1964
01:37:17.439 --> 01:37:20.680
<v Speaker 2>informing their viewers and listeners about the pagan origins of

1965
01:37:20.720 --> 01:37:24.880
<v Speaker 2>all these things, in presentations that are noticeably heavy on assertions,

1966
01:37:24.880 --> 01:37:27.960
<v Speaker 2>but light in evidence, and totally free of any reference

1967
01:37:28.079 --> 01:37:32.000
<v Speaker 2>or scholarship. You would think these last elements would ring

1968
01:37:32.000 --> 01:37:35.239
<v Speaker 2>alarm bells for their audience of supposed quote unquote skeptics.

1969
01:37:35.560 --> 01:37:38.520
<v Speaker 2>But it seems most just accept this message without question.

1970
01:37:38.840 --> 01:37:42.600
<v Speaker 2>After all, everyone knows this is all true, right, except

1971
01:37:42.640 --> 01:37:45.800
<v Speaker 2>when it comes to history, what everyone knows often turns

1972
01:37:45.800 --> 01:37:48.319
<v Speaker 2>out to be mostly or even entirely wrong.

1973
01:37:48.920 --> 01:37:51.479
<v Speaker 3>So on screen, right now, we have an.

1974
01:37:51.520 --> 01:37:56.279
<v Speaker 2>Image, right a meme mistletoe pagan fertility ritual. Tree decorations,

1975
01:37:56.359 --> 01:38:00.479
<v Speaker 2>lights and baubles are a Roman Saturnalia tradition. An angel

1976
01:38:00.520 --> 01:38:03.239
<v Speaker 2>on top of the tree derived from Greek and Assyrian gods.

1977
01:38:03.600 --> 01:38:07.880
<v Speaker 2>The tree pagan fertility symbol. The yule log symbolic of Mithra,

1978
01:38:08.119 --> 01:38:11.520
<v Speaker 2>god of the sun, most likely born in September. By

1979
01:38:11.560 --> 01:38:16.000
<v Speaker 2>the way, Jesus not December, dropped wholesale over the Roman

1980
01:38:16.039 --> 01:38:20.800
<v Speaker 2>Saturnalia festival was the reason for the season gifts Babylonian tradition.

1981
01:38:20.840 --> 01:38:23.600
<v Speaker 2>And we've heard all of these things. So what is

1982
01:38:23.640 --> 01:38:26.279
<v Speaker 2>the actual history behind the origins of these things and

1983
01:38:26.319 --> 01:38:29.640
<v Speaker 2>how many of them, if any, actually have pagan origins.

1984
01:38:30.000 --> 01:38:33.199
<v Speaker 2>The answer is surprisingly few, But in this article we

1985
01:38:33.279 --> 01:38:35.239
<v Speaker 2>will take each of them in turn and look at

1986
01:38:35.279 --> 01:38:38.840
<v Speaker 2>what the actual evidence and scholarship tells us. So let's

1987
01:38:38.840 --> 01:38:41.920
<v Speaker 2>get into it here. We're gonna cover just briefly here,

1988
01:38:42.119 --> 01:38:47.119
<v Speaker 2>Roman Saturnalia, the birth of Mythris, Brumalia, Yule, soul, and Victis,

1989
01:38:47.199 --> 01:38:50.159
<v Speaker 2>the calculation thesis, and then there's some conclusions about that.

1990
01:38:50.199 --> 01:38:52.920
<v Speaker 2>Then we're going to talk about some Christmas traditions in totality,

1991
01:38:53.319 --> 01:38:57.960
<v Speaker 2>gift giving, feasting, holly, ivy and mistletoe, yule logs, Christmas trees,

1992
01:38:58.039 --> 01:39:00.760
<v Speaker 2>Santa Claus. All of this is to be broken down,

1993
01:39:00.800 --> 01:39:02.720
<v Speaker 2>and we're going to get to the real historical and

1994
01:39:02.760 --> 01:39:07.680
<v Speaker 2>scholarly background to all of this. Now, the date of Christmas,

1995
01:39:07.880 --> 01:39:10.479
<v Speaker 2>as we talked about here, depending on what calendar you

1996
01:39:10.520 --> 01:39:13.800
<v Speaker 2>look at, right, the winter solstice typically goes to the

1997
01:39:13.800 --> 01:39:16.960
<v Speaker 2>twenty first. So where did the twenty fifth of December

1998
01:39:16.960 --> 01:39:20.439
<v Speaker 2>come from? Traditional calendars had it on this date, Gregorian

1999
01:39:20.479 --> 01:39:24.399
<v Speaker 2>calendars put it on this date. The Julian versus Gregorian conversation.

2000
01:39:24.000 --> 01:39:24.720
<v Speaker 3>All the things.

2001
01:39:25.239 --> 01:39:27.680
<v Speaker 2>And we know that Jesus was born in September give

2002
01:39:27.760 --> 01:39:30.600
<v Speaker 2>or take probably, so why did they just decide on

2003
01:39:30.680 --> 01:39:34.840
<v Speaker 2>December twenty fifth. Let's get into it here. A remarkable

2004
01:39:34.920 --> 01:39:38.520
<v Speaker 2>number of these quote unquote pagan Christmas ideas are ultimately

2005
01:39:38.640 --> 01:39:41.159
<v Speaker 2>Christian in origin. This is because much of the Protestant

2006
01:39:41.199 --> 01:39:46.279
<v Speaker 2>tradition adopted the sola scriptura, which means by scripture alone position.

2007
01:39:46.800 --> 01:39:49.279
<v Speaker 2>Unless a doctrine or practice could be found in or

2008
01:39:49.319 --> 01:39:52.079
<v Speaker 2>based on something in the Bible, it was to be rejected.

2009
01:39:52.560 --> 01:39:55.600
<v Speaker 2>So many Catholic doctrines and traditions which they saw as

2010
01:39:55.640 --> 01:39:59.960
<v Speaker 2>being without biblical foundation were abandoned in Protestant areas. Unfortunate,

2011
01:40:00.439 --> 01:40:02.960
<v Speaker 2>some of these traditions, feast days and practices, as well

2012
01:40:03.000 --> 01:40:04.920
<v Speaker 2>as folk traditions associated with.

2013
01:40:04.880 --> 01:40:07.720
<v Speaker 3>Them, were very popular, particularly.

2014
01:40:07.079 --> 01:40:10.760
<v Speaker 2>Ones involving the feasting and fun, so sometimes Reformers and

2015
01:40:10.800 --> 01:40:13.640
<v Speaker 2>Puritans had to go through great lengths to convince people

2016
01:40:13.640 --> 01:40:16.720
<v Speaker 2>that they were a bad idea. Christmas was certainly one

2017
01:40:16.720 --> 01:40:19.159
<v Speaker 2>example of something well established and very popular that the

2018
01:40:19.199 --> 01:40:22.560
<v Speaker 2>Reformers had to preach against. One argument was that December

2019
01:40:22.600 --> 01:40:24.800
<v Speaker 2>twenty fifth as a date of jesus birth has no

2020
01:40:24.880 --> 01:40:27.600
<v Speaker 2>basis in scripture, and that the Gospels even prove it

2021
01:40:27.640 --> 01:40:30.600
<v Speaker 2>could not be the correct date, in an argument we

2022
01:40:30.640 --> 01:40:34.119
<v Speaker 2>still here repeated today even by non Christians, Jesus could

2023
01:40:34.159 --> 01:40:36.079
<v Speaker 2>not have been born then because this date is in

2024
01:40:36.079 --> 01:40:38.000
<v Speaker 2>the middle of winter and shepherds would not have been

2025
01:40:38.000 --> 01:40:40.880
<v Speaker 2>in their fields with their sheep as the gospel details.

2026
01:40:41.199 --> 01:40:43.560
<v Speaker 2>In fact, this element is only found in one of

2027
01:40:43.600 --> 01:40:46.239
<v Speaker 2>the two gospels that give an account of jesus birth, Luke,

2028
01:40:46.399 --> 01:40:50.239
<v Speaker 2>Chapter two, verses eight through twenty. Of course, critical scholars

2029
01:40:50.279 --> 01:40:53.439
<v Speaker 2>are hardly highly skeptical about whether this or any of

2030
01:40:53.479 --> 01:40:57.319
<v Speaker 2>the elements in the two highly contradictory infancy narratives quote

2031
01:40:57.359 --> 01:41:00.239
<v Speaker 2>unquote of the Gospel Luke and the Gospel Mattter you

2032
01:41:00.560 --> 01:41:03.319
<v Speaker 2>can be seen as historical. But even if we leave

2033
01:41:03.359 --> 01:41:05.920
<v Speaker 2>that on one side, the claim that shepherds here is

2034
01:41:06.000 --> 01:41:09.520
<v Speaker 2>actually wrong. The hills of Jodea are fairly arid most

2035
01:41:09.520 --> 01:41:11.960
<v Speaker 2>of the year, but November and December see the highest

2036
01:41:12.079 --> 01:41:15.119
<v Speaker 2>rainfall in the region, which means it is a period

2037
01:41:15.119 --> 01:41:18.159
<v Speaker 2>of good pasture for shepherds to this day still pasture

2038
01:41:18.239 --> 01:41:21.640
<v Speaker 2>their sheep in there in December, and there is good

2039
01:41:21.680 --> 01:41:24.560
<v Speaker 2>evidence that they have long done so. Of course, this

2040
01:41:24.600 --> 01:41:26.680
<v Speaker 2>does not mean that the traditional date of Christmas does

2041
01:41:26.680 --> 01:41:29.439
<v Speaker 2>not have a foundation in the gospels, just that this

2042
01:41:29.479 --> 01:41:32.640
<v Speaker 2>particular objection is based on a false premise. In fact,

2043
01:41:32.840 --> 01:41:35.399
<v Speaker 2>the two infancy narratives give no time of year for

2044
01:41:35.439 --> 01:41:39.640
<v Speaker 2>their stories, and notoriously contradict each other on the year

2045
01:41:39.720 --> 01:41:42.760
<v Speaker 2>Jesus was born, with a ten year gap between the

2046
01:41:42.880 --> 01:41:47.159
<v Speaker 2>historical reference points in the Gospel of Matthew, the story

2047
01:41:47.159 --> 01:41:49.520
<v Speaker 2>of Herod the Great and he died in four BC,

2048
01:41:50.239 --> 01:41:52.920
<v Speaker 2>and the ones in Luke which talks about the census

2049
01:41:53.000 --> 01:41:58.079
<v Speaker 2>of Soulplicius Cornerinus excuse me, hailed in the years of

2050
01:41:58.560 --> 01:42:01.960
<v Speaker 2>AD six and seven. So finding a specific date in

2051
01:42:02.039 --> 01:42:05.720
<v Speaker 2>these stories is pretty much impossible. So also that's another

2052
01:42:05.760 --> 01:42:08.079
<v Speaker 2>thing too, when they talk about Herod, who was the

2053
01:42:08.119 --> 01:42:10.000
<v Speaker 2>dude that sent Ince Jesus to death, that was like

2054
01:42:10.039 --> 01:42:13.880
<v Speaker 2>Herod junior, Herod the Great himself, he died in four BC,

2055
01:42:14.279 --> 01:42:17.159
<v Speaker 2>and there's outside sources that would verify that claim. So anyway,

2056
01:42:17.560 --> 01:42:21.279
<v Speaker 2>so weird side tangent, which raises the question where did

2057
01:42:21.319 --> 01:42:24.520
<v Speaker 2>the December twenty fifth date come from? If multiple pop

2058
01:42:24.600 --> 01:42:27.680
<v Speaker 2>history articles, newspaper pieces, and atheist memes can be believed,

2059
01:42:27.760 --> 01:42:30.960
<v Speaker 2>the Christians simply stole a Pagan feast date and rebadged it.

2060
01:42:31.239 --> 01:42:35.319
<v Speaker 2>Simple which pagan feast? Here are things that get confusing

2061
01:42:35.359 --> 01:42:39.239
<v Speaker 2>because multiple differing answers are given in these popular sources,

2062
01:42:39.279 --> 01:42:43.039
<v Speaker 2>and the stories told about them are highly inconsistent. So

2063
01:42:44.079 --> 01:42:47.560
<v Speaker 2>let's see here. So what about Roman Saturnalia the pagan

2064
01:42:47.640 --> 01:42:50.880
<v Speaker 2>festival perhaps nominated most often as the origin date of

2065
01:42:50.920 --> 01:42:55.119
<v Speaker 2>Christmas is the Roman festival of Saturnalia. This was we

2066
01:42:55.159 --> 01:42:58.239
<v Speaker 2>are regularly informed the origin of both the date and

2067
01:42:58.279 --> 01:43:03.159
<v Speaker 2>the traditions we associate with chriss On the traditions see below,

2068
01:43:03.279 --> 01:43:06.279
<v Speaker 2>But what was the date of Saturnalia? Was it December

2069
01:43:06.279 --> 01:43:10.600
<v Speaker 2>twenty fifth? Well, No, Sarennalia was a very ancient Roman festival.

2070
01:43:10.880 --> 01:43:13.640
<v Speaker 2>Saturn was one of the earliest Italian gods, and even

2071
01:43:13.640 --> 01:43:16.000
<v Speaker 2>the Romans were unclear about the origin or even the

2072
01:43:16.039 --> 01:43:19.039
<v Speaker 2>meaning of many of his rites and traditions. He was

2073
01:43:19.079 --> 01:43:21.680
<v Speaker 2>associated with the ancient Golden Age, and his festival in

2074
01:43:21.680 --> 01:43:26.319
<v Speaker 2>December was definitely very popular, continuing to be celebrated into

2075
01:43:26.439 --> 01:43:29.720
<v Speaker 2>at least the sixth century, so two centuries after the

2076
01:43:29.800 --> 01:43:35.640
<v Speaker 2>Roman Empire's conversion to Christianity. But Sarennalia fell on December seventeenth,

2077
01:43:36.159 --> 01:43:40.840
<v Speaker 2>not December twenty fifth. Macrobius's book Saturnalia, a fictional symposium

2078
01:43:40.880 --> 01:43:43.680
<v Speaker 2>hailed by a group of nobles on the feast, states

2079
01:43:43.720 --> 01:43:46.640
<v Speaker 2>it originally lasted but one day and was hailed only

2080
01:43:46.800 --> 01:43:50.960
<v Speaker 2>on the fourteenth day before the calends of January, so

2081
01:43:51.239 --> 01:43:54.760
<v Speaker 2>that is December seventeenth. But it was a fun festival.

2082
01:43:54.800 --> 01:43:57.359
<v Speaker 2>People kept the party going for several days after the seventeenth,

2083
01:43:57.680 --> 01:44:00.880
<v Speaker 2>and its most extended it went all the way to

2084
01:44:00.960 --> 01:44:06.760
<v Speaker 2>a final day of celebration called Sigliara, singly Sigalaria. Excuse me,

2085
01:44:07.439 --> 01:44:10.319
<v Speaker 2>but that was the twenty third of December, so we

2086
01:44:10.359 --> 01:44:13.279
<v Speaker 2>are still short of the twenty fifth. Augustus tried to

2087
01:44:13.279 --> 01:44:17.000
<v Speaker 2>reign in the festivities in the and limited to three

2088
01:44:17.079 --> 01:44:20.439
<v Speaker 2>days from the seventeenth of the twentieth, and Caligula, who

2089
01:44:20.600 --> 01:44:24.159
<v Speaker 2>loved a party, extended it again to four days. But

2090
01:44:24.279 --> 01:44:26.479
<v Speaker 2>even in its most extended form, it never got to

2091
01:44:26.520 --> 01:44:30.479
<v Speaker 2>December twenty fifth. However you cut it. Saturnalia was near Christmas,

2092
01:44:30.520 --> 01:44:34.920
<v Speaker 2>but it does not work with the origin for its date. Now,

2093
01:44:34.960 --> 01:44:37.520
<v Speaker 2>what about the birth of Mithris? Again? Plenty of pop

2094
01:44:37.600 --> 01:44:39.640
<v Speaker 2>history and memes assure us that December twenty fifth was

2095
01:44:39.680 --> 01:44:42.520
<v Speaker 2>the birthday of the Roman god Mythrs, and this is

2096
01:44:42.560 --> 01:44:45.479
<v Speaker 2>definitely the origin date of Christmas. Mythris is one of

2097
01:44:45.479 --> 01:44:47.880
<v Speaker 2>a number of gods who, it is often claimed, had

2098
01:44:47.880 --> 01:44:52.439
<v Speaker 2>their birth celebrated on December twenty fifth, including Horus, Attis, Tummus, Dionysus,

2099
01:44:52.439 --> 01:44:56.399
<v Speaker 2>and others. Unfortunately, if anyone bothers to check these claims,

2100
01:44:56.800 --> 01:44:59.159
<v Speaker 2>no evidence for them can be found. They can be

2101
01:44:59.239 --> 01:45:02.720
<v Speaker 2>traced through a range of highly unreliable modern sources, from

2102
01:45:02.800 --> 01:45:07.960
<v Speaker 2>comedian Bill Maherr, though through the notorious online conspiracy documentary

2103
01:45:08.039 --> 01:45:11.079
<v Speaker 2>Zeitgeist in two thousand and seven and the crackpot Jesus

2104
01:45:11.119 --> 01:45:15.800
<v Speaker 2>Mystic writer A Chorea s and ultimately the largely imaginary

2105
01:45:15.800 --> 01:45:19.039
<v Speaker 2>claims of Kursey Graves in his eighteen seventy five work

2106
01:45:19.119 --> 01:45:25.439
<v Speaker 2>of Estorika the Works the World's Sixteen Crucified Saviors or

2107
01:45:25.520 --> 01:45:30.239
<v Speaker 2>Christianity before Christ which I've actually looked into that book before.

2108
01:45:31.439 --> 01:45:36.760
<v Speaker 2>It is it's based in a lot of how could

2109
01:45:36.760 --> 01:45:40.560
<v Speaker 2>I put this? Old boy was making some very very

2110
01:45:40.600 --> 01:45:44.520
<v Speaker 2>bold claims without like ever reading a history book from

2111
01:45:44.520 --> 01:45:48.800
<v Speaker 2>what bullshit well to say, Like, for instance, Odin is

2112
01:45:48.800 --> 01:45:50.319
<v Speaker 2>brought up in this book because he was hung from

2113
01:45:50.359 --> 01:45:52.680
<v Speaker 2>a tree and all this is like yep, he etn

2114
01:45:52.800 --> 01:45:56.399
<v Speaker 2>die he like it wasn't the same story of Jesus

2115
01:45:56.399 --> 01:45:59.399
<v Speaker 2>like at all, And it doesn't make sense mythr is

2116
01:45:59.439 --> 01:46:02.279
<v Speaker 2>the same thing. There's so many of these stories of

2117
01:46:02.319 --> 01:46:06.079
<v Speaker 2>these virgin births and died on a tree of some

2118
01:46:06.319 --> 01:46:08.119
<v Speaker 2>type and then rose from the dead, and it's this

2119
01:46:08.199 --> 01:46:11.199
<v Speaker 2>whole thing, and it's like, I see what you're trying

2120
01:46:11.199 --> 01:46:14.520
<v Speaker 2>to do here, and I get it. But looking at

2121
01:46:14.560 --> 01:46:18.039
<v Speaker 2>the storyline, the cultural importance of every aspect of that

2122
01:46:18.119 --> 01:46:22.000
<v Speaker 2>story of Odin for instance, it doesn't even come close

2123
01:46:22.119 --> 01:46:24.640
<v Speaker 2>to the story of Jesus. And I'm not even talking

2124
01:46:24.640 --> 01:46:29.239
<v Speaker 2>about for personal religious beliefs. It's literally comparing the story

2125
01:46:29.279 --> 01:46:32.600
<v Speaker 2>of how vampires in Europe came about and the Choctaw

2126
01:46:32.720 --> 01:46:36.159
<v Speaker 2>narrative of where vampires came from. There you have one

2127
01:46:36.279 --> 01:46:38.680
<v Speaker 2>or two details and you're using that as a commonality

2128
01:46:38.720 --> 01:46:42.479
<v Speaker 2>to make the entire picture, when that's crazy out loud.

2129
01:46:42.800 --> 01:46:47.079
<v Speaker 2>So anyway, but all this, this is all nonsense. Far

2130
01:46:47.079 --> 01:46:49.319
<v Speaker 2>from being born of a virgin on December twenty fifth,

2131
01:46:49.680 --> 01:46:53.560
<v Speaker 2>Roman sources and depictions have mythrusts leaping fully formed from

2132
01:46:53.560 --> 01:46:58.159
<v Speaker 2>a rock, the so called petrogen genetrics, and given no

2133
01:46:58.359 --> 01:47:03.039
<v Speaker 2>date at all for this event, despite being repeated endlessly

2134
01:47:03.079 --> 01:47:07.439
<v Speaker 2>by popular sources. Mithraick scholar Roger Beck refers to a

2135
01:47:07.479 --> 01:47:11.239
<v Speaker 2>claim that Mithris born boorth I think I might be

2136
01:47:11.319 --> 01:47:14.760
<v Speaker 2>birth was celebrated on December twenty fifth, with some exasperation

2137
01:47:14.960 --> 01:47:20.520
<v Speaker 2>as the horriest of facts. Uh, that's a direct quote.

2138
01:47:20.560 --> 01:47:21.600
<v Speaker 3>Wow, uh.

2139
01:47:22.399 --> 01:47:26.119
<v Speaker 2>Also they give the sources for this mercle Box Mithrus

2140
01:47:26.199 --> 01:47:28.920
<v Speaker 2>by Roger Beck, and they talk about the pages as well.

2141
01:47:29.600 --> 01:47:32.640
<v Speaker 2>There are simply no references at all to Mithris being

2142
01:47:32.640 --> 01:47:35.640
<v Speaker 2>born on December twenty fifth, or any celebration of his

2143
01:47:35.760 --> 01:47:39.640
<v Speaker 2>birth on that day, so Bromalia. A less common claim

2144
01:47:39.760 --> 01:47:41.439
<v Speaker 2>is that the date of Christmas derives from the ancient

2145
01:47:41.520 --> 01:47:45.359
<v Speaker 2>Roman festival of Brumalia. This fell, or we are told,

2146
01:47:45.720 --> 01:47:49.079
<v Speaker 2>on the winter solstice, so traditionally that is December twenty fifth,

2147
01:47:49.119 --> 01:47:52.359
<v Speaker 2>and went on for a full twenty four days. Unfortunately,

2148
01:47:52.680 --> 01:47:55.880
<v Speaker 2>for these claimants, there are no references to this festival

2149
01:47:55.920 --> 01:47:58.920
<v Speaker 2>in any pre Christian sources, and all references to it

2150
01:47:58.920 --> 01:48:02.720
<v Speaker 2>are quite late and all are Eastern Roman. This seems

2151
01:48:02.720 --> 01:48:04.800
<v Speaker 2>to be a later festival that began in the eastern

2152
01:48:04.880 --> 01:48:08.039
<v Speaker 2>half of the Empire, well after both Christianity and Christmas

2153
01:48:08.039 --> 01:48:11.840
<v Speaker 2>had become adopted by Romans. In his comprehensive book Roman

2154
01:48:11.880 --> 01:48:14.520
<v Speaker 2>Festivals in the Greek East from the Early Empire to

2155
01:48:14.560 --> 01:48:17.800
<v Speaker 2>the Middle Byzantine era this is from Cambridge in twenty fifteen.

2156
01:48:18.159 --> 01:48:22.479
<v Speaker 2>Fritz Graf is categorical about this, stating through Bumalia are

2157
01:48:22.600 --> 01:48:28.880
<v Speaker 2>attested only in Byzantaneum the Byzantine Empire. Byzantine churchmen certainly

2158
01:48:28.960 --> 01:48:32.560
<v Speaker 2>disapproved of these festivals, and some believed it was ancient.

2159
01:48:32.840 --> 01:48:36.840
<v Speaker 2>John the Leadian that was from a. D. Four ninety

2160
01:48:36.840 --> 01:48:40.319
<v Speaker 2>to five sixty five sixty five seem to have thought so,

2161
01:48:40.640 --> 01:48:43.800
<v Speaker 2>but there are no references to it before his Given

2162
01:48:43.840 --> 01:48:46.760
<v Speaker 2>that the pre Christian period is the one where we

2163
01:48:46.800 --> 01:48:49.920
<v Speaker 2>have the most extensive evidence of ancient festivals, it does

2164
01:48:49.960 --> 01:48:52.279
<v Speaker 2>not make sense that we have no references to this

2165
01:48:52.479 --> 01:48:55.720
<v Speaker 2>one earlier than the sixth century if it was ancient

2166
01:48:55.800 --> 01:48:59.640
<v Speaker 2>and widespread, as is sometimes claimed. This is why scholars

2167
01:48:59.640 --> 01:49:03.800
<v Speaker 2>conclude it was a later development, which is accurate as

2168
01:49:03.880 --> 01:49:06.119
<v Speaker 2>far as the When we're talking about like the Nordic

2169
01:49:06.159 --> 01:49:12.119
<v Speaker 2>pagan rituals and rites, we're going off of third party sources.

2170
01:49:12.159 --> 01:49:14.199
<v Speaker 2>In some cases, some of them, like the prose Eta

2171
01:49:14.840 --> 01:49:18.159
<v Speaker 2>and the sagas and like those are first person accounts.

2172
01:49:19.039 --> 01:49:21.319
<v Speaker 2>Sometimes they talk about times of year in festivals, but

2173
01:49:21.359 --> 01:49:23.159
<v Speaker 2>mostly it's about the stories of the gods and the

2174
01:49:23.199 --> 01:49:25.880
<v Speaker 2>stories of the heroes. Right, it's not a big like

2175
01:49:26.840 --> 01:49:30.039
<v Speaker 2>a step by step tatorial on how to conduct a

2176
01:49:30.079 --> 01:49:33.039
<v Speaker 2>blow or blow ton I pronounce it, or how to

2177
01:49:33.119 --> 01:49:36.439
<v Speaker 2>do a sacrifice. It would talk about why sacrifices were done,

2178
01:49:36.479 --> 01:49:38.920
<v Speaker 2>and to which god you would sacrifice a certain animal.

2179
01:49:39.079 --> 01:49:42.640
<v Speaker 2>That's true, but it's not like they don't say how

2180
01:49:42.640 --> 01:49:45.239
<v Speaker 2>it's to be done or necessarily when it's supposed to

2181
01:49:45.279 --> 01:49:45.920
<v Speaker 2>be done either.

2182
01:49:46.800 --> 01:49:46.920
<v Speaker 3>So.

2183
01:49:47.479 --> 01:49:51.159
<v Speaker 2>Anyway, so when we're looking at Roman history, they have

2184
01:49:51.239 --> 01:49:54.560
<v Speaker 2>a very long description on a lot of their gods,

2185
01:49:54.640 --> 01:49:58.279
<v Speaker 2>their their pantheon, how they worship them, all these things,

2186
01:49:58.319 --> 01:50:01.920
<v Speaker 2>and they have dates for specific fas. So this sixth

2187
01:50:02.000 --> 01:50:05.439
<v Speaker 2>century thing saying that it's a long standing ancient tradition

2188
01:50:05.600 --> 01:50:07.840
<v Speaker 2>when they have no record of it before the six

2189
01:50:07.920 --> 01:50:11.000
<v Speaker 2>hundredths ady, that kind of doesn't stand to water either.

2190
01:50:11.840 --> 01:50:15.000
<v Speaker 2>Some try to claim evidence of earlier attestation by citing

2191
01:50:15.039 --> 01:50:18.560
<v Speaker 2>various references to the Bruma and claiming these are pre

2192
01:50:18.680 --> 01:50:22.119
<v Speaker 2>sixth century references to Bromelia. But these refer to the

2193
01:50:22.279 --> 01:50:25.319
<v Speaker 2>date of the start of the winter season on November

2194
01:50:25.359 --> 01:50:28.520
<v Speaker 2>twenty fourth, and are a general term for winter overall,

2195
01:50:29.000 --> 01:50:31.479
<v Speaker 2>that is bruma. Or it might be mispronouncing, maybe it's

2196
01:50:31.479 --> 01:50:34.039
<v Speaker 2>Brama and the solstice are not the same date. And

2197
01:50:34.079 --> 01:50:37.079
<v Speaker 2>it's made very clear by Varro, and it's a direct

2198
01:50:37.119 --> 01:50:40.720
<v Speaker 2>quote from Varro. Broma is so named because the day

2199
01:50:40.880 --> 01:50:46.800
<v Speaker 2>is Brevisimus' shortest and the slum because on that day

2200
01:50:46.840 --> 01:50:50.880
<v Speaker 2>the soul sun seems sistere or to halt on which

2201
01:50:50.880 --> 01:50:53.119
<v Speaker 2>it is nearest to us. When the sun has arrived

2202
01:50:53.119 --> 01:50:56.039
<v Speaker 2>midway between the Brahma and the solstium, it is called

2203
01:50:56.079 --> 01:51:00.640
<v Speaker 2>the equinoctium or the equinox, because the day it becomes

2204
01:51:00.720 --> 01:51:04.600
<v Speaker 2>aqueous or equal to the knox, which is night. So

2205
01:51:04.720 --> 01:51:07.319
<v Speaker 2>basically they're saying that these two dates are not the

2206
01:51:07.359 --> 01:51:12.000
<v Speaker 2>same whatsoever. So both his etymology and his astronomy are

2207
01:51:12.000 --> 01:51:14.319
<v Speaker 2>pretty dubious here, but the passage makes it clear that

2208
01:51:14.399 --> 01:51:17.920
<v Speaker 2>the Brahma or Bruma fell before the winter solstice and

2209
01:51:18.000 --> 01:51:19.680
<v Speaker 2>marked the beginning of the winter season.

2210
01:51:20.079 --> 01:51:20.359
<v Speaker 3>Again.

2211
01:51:20.399 --> 01:51:25.760
<v Speaker 2>Fitz Grafts discussion notes evidence mainly in Tertullian, that there

2212
01:51:25.960 --> 01:51:29.560
<v Speaker 2>was a celebration on the earlier Bruma, but shows the

2213
01:51:29.680 --> 01:51:32.880
<v Speaker 2>date for this was November twenty fourth, not December twenty fifth,

2214
01:51:33.279 --> 01:51:36.359
<v Speaker 2>or it perhaps ran until December twenty third. There's evidence

2215
01:51:36.399 --> 01:51:38.840
<v Speaker 2>of that one. But this aside. It seems that the

2216
01:51:38.880 --> 01:51:41.119
<v Speaker 2>more general use of the word bruma refers to the

2217
01:51:41.159 --> 01:51:44.680
<v Speaker 2>season of winter, which is what gave the later Byzantine

2218
01:51:44.680 --> 01:51:48.560
<v Speaker 2>festival of Brumalia its name. There was no Broomalia early

2219
01:51:48.680 --> 01:51:51.840
<v Speaker 2>enough to give it date or dates to Christmas, and

2220
01:51:52.000 --> 01:51:55.199
<v Speaker 2>earlier Brama fell on the wrong dates. So now what

2221
01:51:55.239 --> 01:51:58.520
<v Speaker 2>about Yule? Given that the name Yule is a synonym

2222
01:51:58.600 --> 01:52:00.560
<v Speaker 2>for Christmas to this day, the claim that there was

2223
01:52:00.600 --> 01:52:03.720
<v Speaker 2>a pagan festival called Yule and that this is the

2224
01:52:03.760 --> 01:52:06.399
<v Speaker 2>origin of the date of Christmas seems to make sense

2225
01:52:06.439 --> 01:52:08.920
<v Speaker 2>too many people, despite the fact that this is often

2226
01:52:08.920 --> 01:52:12.720
<v Speaker 2>claimed along with some other pagan origins claims above, which

2227
01:52:12.840 --> 01:52:16.039
<v Speaker 2>actually makes no sense at all. That aside, here we

2228
01:52:16.079 --> 01:52:19.319
<v Speaker 2>are on some slightly more solid ground regarding a possible

2229
01:52:19.520 --> 01:52:22.680
<v Speaker 2>but not certain December twenty fifth date for Yule. So

2230
01:52:22.920 --> 01:52:26.960
<v Speaker 2>classist Peter Gainsford details in a very useful online article

2231
01:52:27.079 --> 01:52:30.479
<v Speaker 2>concerning Yule, the eighteenth of December twenty eighteen is when

2232
01:52:30.479 --> 01:52:33.520
<v Speaker 2>it was posted that our earliest mention of any Yule

2233
01:52:33.880 --> 01:52:37.079
<v Speaker 2>is in a Gothic calendar of Saints Days for the

2234
01:52:37.279 --> 01:52:43.119
<v Speaker 2>five hundreds. This text mentions fruma Julius, which Gainsford reads

2235
01:52:43.159 --> 01:52:46.399
<v Speaker 2>as the beginning of Yule, and says this falls in

2236
01:52:46.520 --> 01:52:50.239
<v Speaker 2>November or December, though not on a specific date. This

2237
01:52:50.279 --> 01:52:52.920
<v Speaker 2>is not certain, however, and the Gothic language scholar David

2238
01:52:53.000 --> 01:52:56.920
<v Speaker 2>Landau notes many linguistic problems with the reading of Julius

2239
01:52:57.359 --> 01:53:00.880
<v Speaker 2>as a cognate with various Germanic words for Yule, and

2240
01:53:00.920 --> 01:53:04.520
<v Speaker 2>thinks it's probably not connected at all. There's the source

2241
01:53:04.640 --> 01:53:08.600
<v Speaker 2>of the Gothic month named Julius and cognates that's the

2242
01:53:08.640 --> 01:53:11.800
<v Speaker 2>name of the book. Gains For disputes this, but what

2243
01:53:11.960 --> 01:53:15.600
<v Speaker 2>both agree is the reference is very much a Christian context.

2244
01:53:16.000 --> 01:53:19.119
<v Speaker 2>It also does not indicate any particular date and seems

2245
01:53:19.159 --> 01:53:23.119
<v Speaker 2>to refer to the start of a season. Before I continue,

2246
01:53:23.960 --> 01:53:30.119
<v Speaker 2>the earliest reference is a Catholic Gothic text. That's the

2247
01:53:30.119 --> 01:53:33.359
<v Speaker 2>first time that Yule is even brought up. What are

2248
01:53:33.399 --> 01:53:34.199
<v Speaker 2>your thoughts?

2249
01:53:34.920 --> 01:53:36.800
<v Speaker 3>That's what we read in the other article. But then

2250
01:53:36.840 --> 01:53:39.600
<v Speaker 3>there is the month that brought it up too. I'd

2251
01:53:39.640 --> 01:53:43.079
<v Speaker 3>have to find exactly who brought it up. What was

2252
01:53:43.159 --> 01:53:45.800
<v Speaker 3>his name? I'll have to find it though.

2253
01:53:45.840 --> 01:53:47.600
<v Speaker 2>But even a monk brought it up. Though that might

2254
01:53:47.600 --> 01:53:49.199
<v Speaker 2>be the text they're talking about. To be honest, it

2255
01:53:49.279 --> 01:53:51.560
<v Speaker 2>might be, But they're then talking about it being a

2256
01:53:51.560 --> 01:53:54.479
<v Speaker 2>seasonal thing. Which we have agreed is that was the

2257
01:53:54.600 --> 01:53:57.520
<v Speaker 2>name of that time of year. It was like mid

2258
01:53:57.560 --> 01:53:59.920
<v Speaker 2>November to mid December, and it was the month of Yule.

2259
01:54:00.199 --> 01:54:03.199
<v Speaker 3>It was a jewel, and I left my notes at home.

2260
01:54:03.239 --> 01:54:06.279
<v Speaker 3>I had like seven pages of notes that I took

2261
01:54:06.319 --> 01:54:08.880
<v Speaker 3>on this too, that I did a lot of different

2262
01:54:08.920 --> 01:54:13.960
<v Speaker 3>research on. But the word it's jol joel.

2263
01:54:14.159 --> 01:54:16.159
<v Speaker 2>But in the in the Nordic you had pronounced the

2264
01:54:16.239 --> 01:54:16.600
<v Speaker 2>jay like.

2265
01:54:16.560 --> 01:54:20.119
<v Speaker 3>A y, right, So yeah, so it was mentioned before.

2266
01:54:20.680 --> 01:54:23.560
<v Speaker 3>I'm actually going to see if I can find the guy.

2267
01:54:23.680 --> 01:54:27.159
<v Speaker 3>But yeah, there's a lot of different Uh, there's him,

2268
01:54:27.279 --> 01:54:31.600
<v Speaker 3>and there's the other one of the b B bead yeah, med, Yeah.

2269
01:54:31.359 --> 01:54:33.800
<v Speaker 4>That's the one that mentions. The five hundred tea theory.

2270
01:54:33.680 --> 01:54:35.520
<v Speaker 2>Is right there, Okay, so let's get into it here.

2271
01:54:35.840 --> 01:54:38.479
<v Speaker 2>The next reference is what appears to be mules in

2272
01:54:38.560 --> 01:54:41.359
<v Speaker 2>the beds or beads on the Reckoning of Time from

2273
01:54:41.399 --> 01:54:44.600
<v Speaker 2>around seven thirty AD. So the first source you have

2274
01:54:44.720 --> 01:54:47.319
<v Speaker 2>is from the five hundreds. That's the first time Yule

2275
01:54:47.399 --> 01:54:49.800
<v Speaker 2>was ever brought up. The next reference is from seven thirty.

2276
01:54:50.439 --> 01:54:54.199
<v Speaker 2>In chapter fifteen, he lists the traditional Anglo Saxon month names,

2277
01:54:54.359 --> 01:54:57.520
<v Speaker 2>starting with the first months with is, which in Latin

2278
01:54:57.640 --> 01:55:03.920
<v Speaker 2>called January is gwilly okay, but that's January, and then

2279
01:55:04.279 --> 01:55:08.359
<v Speaker 2>ending with December Gweley, the same name by which January

2280
01:55:08.399 --> 01:55:12.199
<v Speaker 2>is called, so Gweeley seems to span both December and

2281
01:55:12.319 --> 01:55:16.159
<v Speaker 2>January and be a name for the winter season generally.

2282
01:55:16.359 --> 01:55:19.479
<v Speaker 2>But more importantly, Bee goes on to say, they the

2283
01:55:19.479 --> 01:55:23.520
<v Speaker 2>pagan Anglo Saxons began the year on the eighth calends

2284
01:55:23.680 --> 01:55:27.600
<v Speaker 2>of January, which is December twenty fifth, when we celebrate

2285
01:55:27.680 --> 01:55:31.079
<v Speaker 2>the birth of the Lord. So keep in mind they

2286
01:55:31.079 --> 01:55:33.520
<v Speaker 2>celebrate on December twenty fifth, and that was completely separate

2287
01:55:33.520 --> 01:55:37.439
<v Speaker 2>from this, but let's talk about it. Similarly, the old

2288
01:55:37.479 --> 01:55:39.960
<v Speaker 2>English martyrology, like we talked about from the late eight

2289
01:55:40.399 --> 01:55:43.800
<v Speaker 2>hundreds or first to December twenty fifth as the first

2290
01:55:43.920 --> 01:55:46.560
<v Speaker 2>day of Yule, that's from the eight hundreds and says

2291
01:55:46.720 --> 01:55:49.479
<v Speaker 2>like b that both December and January are called Yule,

2292
01:55:49.840 --> 01:55:54.119
<v Speaker 2>but that December is called Arowgiola, which is before Yule,

2293
01:55:54.520 --> 01:55:58.199
<v Speaker 2>and January is called aftera Goal, which is after Yule.

2294
01:55:58.479 --> 01:56:01.039
<v Speaker 2>So while the word Yule is used to refer to

2295
01:56:01.119 --> 01:56:04.560
<v Speaker 2>the whole winter season, these two Anglo Saxon references placed

2296
01:56:04.640 --> 01:56:08.439
<v Speaker 2>Yule properly was on a central date December twenty fifth.

2297
01:56:09.000 --> 01:56:13.199
<v Speaker 3>Okay, so this guy is the monk. Is the monk bead? Yeah?

2298
01:56:13.279 --> 01:56:19.840
<v Speaker 3>He monk? So the Pagan Temple website says medieval Icelandic

2299
01:56:19.920 --> 01:56:22.800
<v Speaker 3>sagas these stories were written down by Christian Icelanders in

2300
01:56:22.840 --> 01:56:27.920
<v Speaker 3>the twelve twelve to twelve to thirteen hundreds described pre

2301
01:56:28.079 --> 01:56:31.760
<v Speaker 3>Christian practices. The sagas mentioned Yule feast, sacrifices and customs.

2302
01:56:31.800 --> 01:56:36.720
<v Speaker 3>Even after it is written after Christianization, they preserve the

2303
01:56:36.760 --> 01:56:42.079
<v Speaker 3>pagan memories. It talks about poetry that was written down

2304
01:56:42.520 --> 01:56:45.119
<v Speaker 3>in some of the sagas that refer to Yule. It

2305
01:56:45.159 --> 01:56:50.359
<v Speaker 3>talks about archaeological evidence. Festive halls, sacrifice sites, barrel grounds

2306
01:56:50.439 --> 01:56:55.000
<v Speaker 3>from the Viking ages and earlier earlier give us physical

2307
01:56:55.000 --> 01:56:58.880
<v Speaker 3>evidence of winter celebrations at ritual practices. Later, folklore of

2308
01:56:58.920 --> 01:57:02.560
<v Speaker 3>Scandinamian skin and even and dramatic folkal or collected in

2309
01:57:02.600 --> 01:57:05.800
<v Speaker 3>later century preserves the echoes of the older Yule traditions

2310
01:57:05.840 --> 01:57:10.760
<v Speaker 3>through mixed though mixed in with Christian elements right.

2311
01:57:10.720 --> 01:57:14.199
<v Speaker 2>Right, So like they said, this has a little more

2312
01:57:15.439 --> 01:57:17.800
<v Speaker 2>like legs to it. But then it goes on to

2313
01:57:17.840 --> 01:57:20.920
<v Speaker 2>continue it. So there is later evidence which complicates this.

2314
01:57:21.039 --> 01:57:24.600
<v Speaker 2>The Icelandic collection of sagas of the Swedish and Norwegian kings,

2315
01:57:24.720 --> 01:57:26.359
<v Speaker 2>which we talked about that in the last article, and

2316
01:57:26.399 --> 01:57:28.239
<v Speaker 2>I think is what you were just referencing talks about

2317
01:57:28.279 --> 01:57:30.840
<v Speaker 2>King Haken, which we're not going to go over it again.

2318
01:57:31.319 --> 01:57:34.880
<v Speaker 2>He was confirmed Christian when he arrived in Norway, but

2319
01:57:35.039 --> 01:57:37.760
<v Speaker 2>since the land was altogether healen and much ideology prevailed,

2320
01:57:38.000 --> 01:57:39.800
<v Speaker 2>he had it established in the laws that the Yule

2321
01:57:39.840 --> 01:57:42.199
<v Speaker 2>celebration was to take place at the same time as

2322
01:57:42.199 --> 01:57:45.319
<v Speaker 2>the custom with the Christians, and at that time everyone

2323
01:57:45.520 --> 01:57:47.600
<v Speaker 2>was to have ale for the celebration, a measure of grain,

2324
01:57:47.720 --> 01:57:48.359
<v Speaker 2>or pay fines.

2325
01:57:48.399 --> 01:57:49.119
<v Speaker 3>We talked about this.

2326
01:57:49.079 --> 01:57:52.560
<v Speaker 2>Already before that Yule was celebrated on midwinter night and

2327
01:57:52.640 --> 01:57:56.119
<v Speaker 2>for the duration of three nights. So the first issue

2328
01:57:56.199 --> 01:57:59.760
<v Speaker 2>here is when the account says Yull originally fell midwinter night,

2329
01:58:00.119 --> 01:58:03.079
<v Speaker 2>that Haken moved it to at the same time as

2330
01:58:03.119 --> 01:58:06.560
<v Speaker 2>the custom with the Christians. The latter was clearly December

2331
01:58:06.560 --> 01:58:09.920
<v Speaker 2>twenty fifth, which means that midwinter night must have fallen

2332
01:58:09.960 --> 01:58:13.880
<v Speaker 2>on some other date. Samuel Lang's eighteen eighty nine translation,

2333
01:58:13.960 --> 01:58:19.359
<v Speaker 2>which is widely available online, give this as December fourteenth, okay,

2334
01:58:19.399 --> 01:58:24.359
<v Speaker 2>So Alison Finlay and Anthony Falks in twenty eleven translates

2335
01:58:24.399 --> 01:58:27.840
<v Speaker 2>put it at the twelfth of January, which is very interesting.

2336
01:58:27.840 --> 01:58:29.960
<v Speaker 2>They give a reference for this one the beginning of

2337
01:58:30.079 --> 01:58:34.520
<v Speaker 2>Alfler Trevison Viking Society of Northern Research University actually.

2338
01:58:34.319 --> 01:58:39.760
<v Speaker 3>Took So there's old boy hackeen Heiken whatever he was

2339
01:58:39.800 --> 01:58:43.279
<v Speaker 3>a king, then there was Earl was next, and then

2340
01:58:43.399 --> 01:58:47.399
<v Speaker 3>after that was Olfur or whatever that's who took over.

2341
01:58:48.079 --> 01:58:50.920
<v Speaker 3>So there's there's a certain time period in which they

2342
01:58:50.920 --> 01:58:52.920
<v Speaker 3>were all kind of in the same grouping.

2343
01:58:53.239 --> 01:58:55.520
<v Speaker 2>But the principle that they just brought up as very

2344
01:58:55.640 --> 01:59:00.000
<v Speaker 2>accurate though, So they practiced the Yule celebration at midwinter.

2345
01:59:00.079 --> 01:59:04.920
<v Speaker 2>He made its way. They practice it on Christmas, which

2346
01:59:04.960 --> 01:59:08.000
<v Speaker 2>means that the December twenty fifth date for Christmas itself

2347
01:59:08.079 --> 01:59:12.600
<v Speaker 2>predated the mixture of Yule and Christmas, which is interesting.

2348
01:59:12.640 --> 01:59:15.600
<v Speaker 2>And they're debating on if it was a December fourteenth

2349
01:59:15.720 --> 01:59:18.000
<v Speaker 2>or January twelfth, because, like we said, the month of

2350
01:59:18.079 --> 01:59:20.079
<v Speaker 2>Yule or the time of Yule kind of spanned a

2351
01:59:20.079 --> 01:59:22.319
<v Speaker 2>gap like that. So when they say mid do they

2352
01:59:22.359 --> 01:59:23.600
<v Speaker 2>mean January or December?

2353
01:59:23.840 --> 01:59:24.720
<v Speaker 3>Right? And I get this.

2354
01:59:25.479 --> 01:59:30.439
<v Speaker 2>So whichever it was, it was clearly not December twenty fifth.

2355
01:59:30.840 --> 01:59:33.159
<v Speaker 2>So the second issue here is the late date of

2356
01:59:33.199 --> 01:59:36.960
<v Speaker 2>this text and what it might mean. The Helmskrigla is

2357
01:59:37.039 --> 01:59:40.680
<v Speaker 2>usually attributed to the medieval Icelandic scholar Snowy Sterlson, who

2358
01:59:40.720 --> 01:59:43.880
<v Speaker 2>lived from eleven seventy nine to twelve forty one, though

2359
01:59:44.199 --> 01:59:46.800
<v Speaker 2>this has been disputed as the text never claims that

2360
01:59:46.840 --> 01:59:50.000
<v Speaker 2>he is the author. Even if true, we know that

2361
01:59:50.039 --> 01:59:53.840
<v Speaker 2>Sirlison reworked or drew on earlier texts and sources when

2362
01:59:53.880 --> 01:59:57.920
<v Speaker 2>producing his versions of the sagas. So is this account

2363
01:59:57.960 --> 02:00:01.159
<v Speaker 2>of King Haken moved moving the date to Yule historical?

2364
02:00:01.600 --> 02:00:02.279
<v Speaker 3>And how do we.

2365
02:00:02.239 --> 02:00:06.039
<v Speaker 2>Square with the Anglo Saxon evidence already noted, which explicitly

2366
02:00:06.039 --> 02:00:09.319
<v Speaker 2>places Yule on December twenty fifth. It could be that

2367
02:00:09.720 --> 02:00:13.199
<v Speaker 2>the Hemskrigla author is completely mistaken. If so, it seems

2368
02:00:13.239 --> 02:00:15.319
<v Speaker 2>an odd element to include in the saga if it

2369
02:00:15.359 --> 02:00:19.600
<v Speaker 2>has no basis. Alternately, or alternatively, rather, the date of

2370
02:00:19.680 --> 02:00:22.479
<v Speaker 2>Yule proper could have been celebrated on different dates within

2371
02:00:22.600 --> 02:00:26.279
<v Speaker 2>the broader midwinter season, in different places and or in

2372
02:00:26.319 --> 02:00:30.000
<v Speaker 2>different periods across the Germanic world. So perhaps it was

2373
02:00:30.039 --> 02:00:34.560
<v Speaker 2>traditionally on December twenty fifth in Pango at Pagan Anglo Saxon, England,

2374
02:00:35.039 --> 02:00:38.880
<v Speaker 2>and on January twelfth or December fourteenth in pre Christian Norway,

2375
02:00:39.800 --> 02:00:42.680
<v Speaker 2>which that makes sense. Like we talked about, although the

2376
02:00:42.720 --> 02:00:46.199
<v Speaker 2>Nordic tribes had a lot of similarities between them, they

2377
02:00:46.279 --> 02:00:49.479
<v Speaker 2>also were some distinct differences, So that might be where

2378
02:00:49.479 --> 02:00:52.239
<v Speaker 2>we're getting the mix up here. Maybe Norway did it

2379
02:00:52.239 --> 02:00:54.960
<v Speaker 2>this way, Denmark did it this way, Iceland did it

2380
02:00:55.000 --> 02:00:57.720
<v Speaker 2>this way, and the Anglo Saxon English did it this way.

2381
02:00:58.239 --> 02:01:00.720
<v Speaker 3>No, I mean, it's the same conversation we've had before,

2382
02:01:00.920 --> 02:01:04.880
<v Speaker 3>just here in different parishes. What people do differently, how

2383
02:01:04.920 --> 02:01:08.039
<v Speaker 3>they speak differently, things like that, it's the same conversation.

2384
02:01:08.239 --> 02:01:11.399
<v Speaker 3>So I mean, you can't hell within the same town.

2385
02:01:11.760 --> 02:01:15.079
<v Speaker 3>You could say, within the same street, how does this

2386
02:01:15.159 --> 02:01:19.000
<v Speaker 3>little cool sack? How many people practice Christmas the exact

2387
02:01:19.000 --> 02:01:21.760
<v Speaker 3>same way? Do the exact same thing to each other?

2388
02:01:22.159 --> 02:01:24.359
<v Speaker 3>So very well could be that there was a very

2389
02:01:24.520 --> 02:01:27.000
<v Speaker 3>narrow scope of what was being told, if it was

2390
02:01:27.079 --> 02:01:30.920
<v Speaker 3>even correct, what was being accounted for, what was written

2391
02:01:30.960 --> 02:01:34.680
<v Speaker 3>down accurately verse, what was actually happening. And you got

2392
02:01:34.680 --> 02:01:37.840
<v Speaker 3>to think of all the different tribes and what they

2393
02:01:37.840 --> 02:01:40.920
<v Speaker 3>did was different from each other. They had a similar basis,

2394
02:01:40.960 --> 02:01:43.720
<v Speaker 3>but they sure did a lot of different things, and

2395
02:01:43.840 --> 02:01:46.199
<v Speaker 3>so it very well could be the day was different

2396
02:01:46.640 --> 02:01:49.199
<v Speaker 3>it could be. It could be at all different things.

2397
02:01:49.239 --> 02:01:53.159
<v Speaker 3>So it's interesting trying to figure out how the twenty

2398
02:01:53.199 --> 02:01:55.720
<v Speaker 3>fifth of like twenty fifth became Christmas.

2399
02:01:56.039 --> 02:01:59.039
<v Speaker 2>So a third possibility is that the Hemskrigla account is

2400
02:01:59.079 --> 02:02:02.039
<v Speaker 2>accurate and something similar happened centuries earlier in the Anglo

2401
02:02:02.079 --> 02:02:05.199
<v Speaker 2>Saxon England, with the Pagan date being moved to coincide

2402
02:02:05.199 --> 02:02:08.199
<v Speaker 2>with the Christian one. Bed was writing about one hundred

2403
02:02:08.199 --> 02:02:11.479
<v Speaker 2>and thirty years after the first conversions of the Anglo Saxons,

2404
02:02:11.479 --> 02:02:15.119
<v Speaker 2>and the Old English martyrology is over a century later still,

2405
02:02:15.399 --> 02:02:16.960
<v Speaker 2>so that gives a lot of time in which the

2406
02:02:16.960 --> 02:02:20.520
<v Speaker 2>Pagan and Christian feest could come together on December twenty fifth,

2407
02:02:20.760 --> 02:02:23.520
<v Speaker 2>with Bide and the later writer simply assuming the pagan

2408
02:02:23.520 --> 02:02:27.000
<v Speaker 2>feasts had always been on the state, that could also be.

2409
02:02:28.079 --> 02:02:31.560
<v Speaker 2>Who knows, so was Yule on December twenty fifth. The

2410
02:02:31.760 --> 02:02:35.640
<v Speaker 2>very best we can say is maybe even if it was. However,

2411
02:02:36.000 --> 02:02:38.199
<v Speaker 2>this does not mean we have finally found the pagan

2412
02:02:38.239 --> 02:02:40.680
<v Speaker 2>origin of the date of Christmas, one stolen from the

2413
02:02:40.720 --> 02:02:43.840
<v Speaker 2>Germanic and Norse pagans from the far North. This is because,

2414
02:02:43.880 --> 02:02:47.159
<v Speaker 2>as you will see, Christians were already marking the birth

2415
02:02:47.279 --> 02:02:49.720
<v Speaker 2>of their Christ on December twenty fifth, way back in

2416
02:02:49.760 --> 02:02:53.199
<v Speaker 2>the third century, long before they came into any significant

2417
02:02:53.239 --> 02:02:57.039
<v Speaker 2>contact with German paganism. Both the Christians who converted Anglo

2418
02:02:57.079 --> 02:03:01.680
<v Speaker 2>Saxon England and the Christian king Hakhnu, both of their times,

2419
02:03:01.720 --> 02:03:05.039
<v Speaker 2>were already celebrating Christmas on this date. So the German

2420
02:03:05.079 --> 02:03:07.319
<v Speaker 2>Norse yule is not the origin date, and if it

2421
02:03:07.359 --> 02:03:11.279
<v Speaker 2>did perhaps coincide with it, it was just that a coincidence,

2422
02:03:12.680 --> 02:03:15.119
<v Speaker 2>which I also that's the other thing too. There's record

2423
02:03:15.199 --> 02:03:19.159
<v Speaker 2>of Romans in the third century AD celebrating Christmas or

2424
02:03:19.159 --> 02:03:21.880
<v Speaker 2>the birth of Christ on December twenty fifth. This is

2425
02:03:21.960 --> 02:03:24.279
<v Speaker 2>long before the Middle Ages and the commersion.

2426
02:03:23.920 --> 02:03:26.279
<v Speaker 4>The twenty fifth. He was born in September.

2427
02:03:26.439 --> 02:03:30.720
<v Speaker 2>Why indeed, why indeed, Raven, we're gonna talk about that.

2428
02:03:31.199 --> 02:03:34.760
<v Speaker 2>So anyway, Soul and victis, this is another conversation that

2429
02:03:34.760 --> 02:03:37.319
<v Speaker 2>they always hear. Oh, it's just the celebration of Soul

2430
02:03:37.399 --> 02:03:39.760
<v Speaker 2>and Victis, the Sun God and his victory, and that's

2431
02:03:39.920 --> 02:03:42.000
<v Speaker 2>it was on December twenty fifth, So let's talk about

2432
02:03:42.000 --> 02:03:45.520
<v Speaker 2>it here. The evidence indicates that the date of December

2433
02:03:45.520 --> 02:03:48.680
<v Speaker 2>twenty fifth was adopted by Christians relatively early and in

2434
02:03:48.720 --> 02:03:51.800
<v Speaker 2>the Mediterranean region, so much later contact with the German

2435
02:03:51.840 --> 02:03:54.359
<v Speaker 2>date of Yule cannot be the date's point of origin.

2436
02:03:54.920 --> 02:03:57.119
<v Speaker 2>But one of the few contenders for a pagan origin

2437
02:03:57.159 --> 02:03:59.359
<v Speaker 2>of the date that actually rests in evidence rather than

2438
02:03:59.399 --> 02:04:03.239
<v Speaker 2>assertion may seem to fit this bill. There certainly is

2439
02:04:03.319 --> 02:04:06.600
<v Speaker 2>evidence of a celebration of the sun god Soul under

2440
02:04:06.600 --> 02:04:09.920
<v Speaker 2>his title Soul Invictus the Unconquered Sun on this date

2441
02:04:09.960 --> 02:04:13.319
<v Speaker 2>by the Romans in the Mediterranean, and fairly early. So

2442
02:04:13.720 --> 02:04:16.000
<v Speaker 2>is this the origin date of the date of Christmas?

2443
02:04:16.239 --> 02:04:23.920
<v Speaker 2>The key evidence cited in the Calendar of Philosalus Sure Philipalus,

2444
02:04:24.640 --> 02:04:28.520
<v Speaker 2>one of the several calendrical texts and regional lists collected

2445
02:04:28.520 --> 02:04:31.840
<v Speaker 2>in the fourth century almanac known as the Chronograph of

2446
02:04:32.039 --> 02:04:36.520
<v Speaker 2>three point fifty four. The Phallocan calendar is the significant

2447
02:04:36.560 --> 02:04:39.720
<v Speaker 2>is significant here because it's entry for December twenty fifth

2448
02:04:39.760 --> 02:04:41.279
<v Speaker 2>reads and I'm not going to give you all the

2449
02:04:41.359 --> 02:04:45.399
<v Speaker 2>number designation which usually transcribed as in natilis, which is

2450
02:04:45.439 --> 02:04:49.960
<v Speaker 2>birth or nativity or perhaps dedication date in Victi of

2451
02:04:50.000 --> 02:04:55.880
<v Speaker 2>the Unconquered one serenus missus which means games ordered and

2452
02:04:55.960 --> 02:04:59.439
<v Speaker 2>thirty or thirty games were ordered for the birthday slash

2453
02:04:59.439 --> 02:05:03.600
<v Speaker 2>dedication of the unconquered one that's the overall and duro

2454
02:05:03.720 --> 02:05:07.920
<v Speaker 2>this one. So yeah, there's a inn invicti dot com xxx,

2455
02:05:08.239 --> 02:05:12.039
<v Speaker 2>but that's what it actually translates to. This single reference

2456
02:05:12.239 --> 02:05:15.520
<v Speaker 2>is the point of origin for the claim that December

2457
02:05:15.560 --> 02:05:18.760
<v Speaker 2>twenty fifth is the birthday of Mithris noted above, because

2458
02:05:18.800 --> 02:05:21.079
<v Speaker 2>Mithris was one of a number of gods given the

2459
02:05:21.119 --> 02:05:25.680
<v Speaker 2>title invictus or unconquered, but many modern scholars agree that

2460
02:05:25.720 --> 02:05:28.720
<v Speaker 2>here is the title refers to Soul, the Roman sun god,

2461
02:05:28.880 --> 02:05:32.439
<v Speaker 2>not Mythris. Soul was regularly depicted traversing the skies in

2462
02:05:32.479 --> 02:05:34.960
<v Speaker 2>a chariot, and so was associated with the popular sport

2463
02:05:35.000 --> 02:05:38.159
<v Speaker 2>of chariot racing. The massive Circus Maximus in Rome was

2464
02:05:38.199 --> 02:05:40.039
<v Speaker 2>the site of the chariot races for up to one

2465
02:05:40.119 --> 02:05:43.239
<v Speaker 2>hundred and fifty thousand spectators, and it included the city's

2466
02:05:43.279 --> 02:05:45.279
<v Speaker 2>main temple to Soul in its complex.

2467
02:05:45.640 --> 02:05:47.000
<v Speaker 3>For anybody that would like to get.

2468
02:05:46.840 --> 02:05:48.960
<v Speaker 2>A really good look at what those chariot races look like,

2469
02:05:49.039 --> 02:05:52.520
<v Speaker 2>look at the original Charlton Heston's Ben Hur. I think

2470
02:05:52.560 --> 02:05:57.680
<v Speaker 2>it's an excellent movie Juda Judah Ben which also like

2471
02:05:57.800 --> 02:06:00.520
<v Speaker 2>yo rewatching that as a kid, I'm watching this, like

2472
02:06:00.560 --> 02:06:02.319
<v Speaker 2>this is so cool. As an adult, I'm like, yo,

2473
02:06:03.159 --> 02:06:05.880
<v Speaker 2>these stuntmen like they might have actually died.

2474
02:06:05.960 --> 02:06:09.079
<v Speaker 3>I'm convinced that some of them died. It's pretty intense,

2475
02:06:09.239 --> 02:06:11.079
<v Speaker 3>Like I don't know how they did those stunts without

2476
02:06:11.119 --> 02:06:14.760
<v Speaker 3>getting broken limbs and fucked up. It's it's pretty intense.

2477
02:06:14.840 --> 02:06:17.359
<v Speaker 2>And I've looked into the chariot racing, like, yeah, gladiators

2478
02:06:17.399 --> 02:06:21.319
<v Speaker 2>were super big, super popular. No sport drew as much

2479
02:06:21.359 --> 02:06:24.439
<v Speaker 2>attention as the chariot races and they had and they're

2480
02:06:24.520 --> 02:06:27.279
<v Speaker 2>so brutal too though. They had four teams and like

2481
02:06:27.399 --> 02:06:29.560
<v Speaker 2>we talk about sports riots, right, like your team wins

2482
02:06:29.600 --> 02:06:32.279
<v Speaker 2>the Super Bowl, so you tear your town apart, Yo,

2483
02:06:32.439 --> 02:06:36.399
<v Speaker 2>that's nothing. Romans actually had like whole wars start because

2484
02:06:36.680 --> 02:06:39.079
<v Speaker 2>there was the Red, the Greens, the Whites, and the Yellows.

2485
02:06:39.119 --> 02:06:42.640
<v Speaker 2>If I'm not mistaken, these four teams were like the

2486
02:06:42.840 --> 02:06:46.039
<v Speaker 2>shit and there was multiple accounts of the Greens and

2487
02:06:46.079 --> 02:06:48.920
<v Speaker 2>the Whites going to actual blood in the streets over

2488
02:06:49.079 --> 02:06:52.640
<v Speaker 2>their support of their chariot team. Wow, yeah, Romans got

2489
02:06:52.800 --> 02:06:54.560
<v Speaker 2>they went hard shit.

2490
02:06:55.119 --> 02:06:57.760
<v Speaker 3>But then that's probably where the British and Irish got

2491
02:06:57.840 --> 02:06:59.560
<v Speaker 3>it from with their soccer teams.

2492
02:07:00.920 --> 02:07:02.800
<v Speaker 2>What the British and Irish hate each other for other reasons.

2493
02:07:02.840 --> 02:07:05.319
<v Speaker 3>But colors go yet yet No, I meant just like

2494
02:07:05.439 --> 02:07:08.239
<v Speaker 3>in the sense of, like, you know, they're so gung

2495
02:07:08.359 --> 02:07:09.640
<v Speaker 3>ho when it comes to soccer.

2496
02:07:09.960 --> 02:07:14.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, Cooligan football firms or it's crazy. Have you

2497
02:07:14.920 --> 02:07:16.680
<v Speaker 2>ever seen Green Street Hooligans?

2498
02:07:16.840 --> 02:07:17.000
<v Speaker 3>Yes?

2499
02:07:17.199 --> 02:07:19.880
<v Speaker 2>Yes, I love the movie. I love it Death Anyway,

2500
02:07:19.880 --> 02:07:22.560
<v Speaker 2>I'm moving on. So it would make sense that the

2501
02:07:22.640 --> 02:07:24.880
<v Speaker 2>cherry races would be held to celebrate the birth of

2502
02:07:24.920 --> 02:07:27.119
<v Speaker 2>the Sun God on December twenty fifth, which was the

2503
02:07:27.199 --> 02:07:29.880
<v Speaker 2>traditional date for the winter solstice and the date thought

2504
02:07:29.920 --> 02:07:31.840
<v Speaker 2>to mark the lengthening of the days of the year.

2505
02:07:32.399 --> 02:07:34.960
<v Speaker 2>This is why nineteenth century. In the nineteenth century, some

2506
02:07:35.039 --> 02:07:38.760
<v Speaker 2>prominent German Protestant scholars what is known as the I'm

2507
02:07:38.800 --> 02:07:40.640
<v Speaker 2>not going to read that it's the History of Religious

2508
02:07:40.720 --> 02:07:45.359
<v Speaker 2>school or Religion's School, argued this was the origin date

2509
02:07:45.439 --> 02:07:48.319
<v Speaker 2>of Christmas. This was an influential school of thought in

2510
02:07:48.399 --> 02:07:52.239
<v Speaker 2>the nineteenth century that saw Christianity as one ancient religion

2511
02:07:52.279 --> 02:07:54.920
<v Speaker 2>among many, and saw to understand it in an ancient

2512
02:07:54.960 --> 02:07:58.520
<v Speaker 2>religious context. The scholars of the school tended to assume

2513
02:07:58.640 --> 02:08:03.960
<v Speaker 2>a high level of sink gitim syncretism. Yeah and borrowing

2514
02:08:04.119 --> 02:08:07.039
<v Speaker 2>of earlier pagan elements by Christianity, to the extent that

2515
02:08:07.119 --> 02:08:09.960
<v Speaker 2>the scholars often went to great and often fanciful links

2516
02:08:10.000 --> 02:08:13.520
<v Speaker 2>to find quote unquote pagan influences and parallels, even when

2517
02:08:13.520 --> 02:08:16.239
<v Speaker 2>they really were not there. This school of thought had

2518
02:08:16.279 --> 02:08:19.279
<v Speaker 2>a huge impact on later religion studies and is the

2519
02:08:19.399 --> 02:08:21.840
<v Speaker 2>origin of many of the pop history claims about pagan

2520
02:08:21.920 --> 02:08:25.640
<v Speaker 2>origins still in circulation today. In this case, the main

2521
02:08:25.760 --> 02:08:28.920
<v Speaker 2>early prominent idea that Christianity borrowed the Feast of Soul

2522
02:08:28.960 --> 02:08:31.600
<v Speaker 2>and Victus and turned it into Christmas was Hermann Uncer.

2523
02:08:32.119 --> 02:08:36.760
<v Speaker 2>In eighteen eighty nine, he wrote, it's a big German word,

2524
02:08:36.800 --> 02:08:39.720
<v Speaker 2>but he cited a chronograph of three point fifty four

2525
02:08:39.800 --> 02:08:42.760
<v Speaker 2>text and two other sources to support this idea. The

2526
02:08:42.840 --> 02:08:46.039
<v Speaker 2>first was a passage from the twelfth century Syriac Orthodox

2527
02:08:46.119 --> 02:08:50.600
<v Speaker 2>writer Dionysus bar Salibi, who was a bishop in what

2528
02:08:50.800 --> 02:08:54.920
<v Speaker 2>was now southeastern Turkey. In his commentary on the Four Gospels,

2529
02:08:55.039 --> 02:08:58.039
<v Speaker 2>bar Salibi states that in the month of January, the

2530
02:08:58.119 --> 02:09:00.479
<v Speaker 2>Lord was born on the same day on which we

2531
02:09:00.640 --> 02:09:05.800
<v Speaker 2>celebrate the Epiphany January sixth, since this was the date

2532
02:09:05.840 --> 02:09:11.239
<v Speaker 2>of Jesus birth. According to Barslibi, Eastern Christian tradition, they

2533
02:09:11.279 --> 02:09:13.520
<v Speaker 2>do celebrate that. They celebrate the birth of Christ on

2534
02:09:13.720 --> 02:09:16.000
<v Speaker 2>January sixth in the Eastern Orthodox.

2535
02:09:17.000 --> 02:09:20.279
<v Speaker 3>I don't know why. My thought immediately thought about January sixth,

2536
02:09:20.359 --> 02:09:22.760
<v Speaker 3>the whole thing here in America, and I was like,

2537
02:09:23.119 --> 02:09:25.439
<v Speaker 3>there's some people where I was like, what are the coincidence?

2538
02:09:25.600 --> 02:09:27.079
<v Speaker 3>As soon as you said that, I was just sitting

2539
02:09:27.119 --> 02:09:29.199
<v Speaker 3>here listening to you. I was like, what are the

2540
02:09:29.279 --> 02:09:31.920
<v Speaker 3>odds that this is somehow tied together in some.

2541
02:09:32.039 --> 02:09:34.800
<v Speaker 2>Way, shape or form. There are some connections that people

2542
02:09:34.840 --> 02:09:35.520
<v Speaker 2>have made before.

2543
02:09:36.239 --> 02:09:36.399
<v Speaker 3>Now.

2544
02:09:36.439 --> 02:09:38.760
<v Speaker 2>I don't think that the Ortho Bros. Were the actual

2545
02:09:38.840 --> 02:09:42.600
<v Speaker 2>masterminds behind the jan sixth, quote unquote insurrection, but it's

2546
02:09:43.840 --> 02:09:45.159
<v Speaker 2>it's funny to talk about, for sure.

2547
02:09:45.239 --> 02:09:46.800
<v Speaker 4>I mean, I was just it was just random.

2548
02:09:46.840 --> 02:09:48.920
<v Speaker 3>And when you read that date, I was like, hmm,

2549
02:09:49.640 --> 02:09:52.079
<v Speaker 3>that's a weird date to be coincidentally with that.

2550
02:09:52.720 --> 02:09:56.079
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it'd be like that. But he goes on to

2551
02:09:56.119 --> 02:09:58.880
<v Speaker 2>explain why other Christians hold that he was born on

2552
02:09:59.000 --> 02:10:03.640
<v Speaker 2>December twenty fifth, The reason why the aforesaid solemnity was

2553
02:10:03.760 --> 02:10:06.279
<v Speaker 2>transferred by the fathers from the sixth of January to

2554
02:10:06.359 --> 02:10:09.319
<v Speaker 2>the twenty fifth of December, they say was this, it

2555
02:10:09.439 --> 02:10:11.359
<v Speaker 2>was traditional for the Pagans to celebrate the birth of

2556
02:10:11.399 --> 02:10:13.960
<v Speaker 2>the Sun on this very day, twenty fifth of December.

2557
02:10:14.199 --> 02:10:16.880
<v Speaker 2>To further enhance the celebration of the day, they used

2558
02:10:16.880 --> 02:10:19.960
<v Speaker 2>slight fires, to which rights they were accustomed to invite

2559
02:10:20.039 --> 02:10:24.159
<v Speaker 2>and admit even Christian people. When therefore the doctors noticed

2560
02:10:24.199 --> 02:10:27.319
<v Speaker 2>that the Christians were inclined to that custom, they devised

2561
02:10:27.359 --> 02:10:29.560
<v Speaker 2>a plan to establish on that day the feasts of

2562
02:10:29.760 --> 02:10:32.359
<v Speaker 2>his birth, But on the sixth of January they ordered

2563
02:10:32.399 --> 02:10:36.600
<v Speaker 2>that the epiphemy be celebrated. In addition, he noted an

2564
02:10:36.600 --> 02:10:41.079
<v Speaker 2>anonymous fourth century sermon titled on the Solstices and the Equinoxes,

2565
02:10:41.560 --> 02:10:46.079
<v Speaker 2>often wrongly attributing to John Christism. This sermon tries to

2566
02:10:46.279 --> 02:10:48.840
<v Speaker 2>tie key elements to the lives of Jesus and John

2567
02:10:48.880 --> 02:10:51.760
<v Speaker 2>the Baptist to the astronomical turning points of the year.

2568
02:10:52.359 --> 02:10:54.399
<v Speaker 2>The sermon noted that the Lord was born on December

2569
02:10:54.399 --> 02:10:56.560
<v Speaker 2>twenty fifth in the winter. They also called this date

2570
02:10:56.680 --> 02:10:59.680
<v Speaker 2>the birthday of the Invictus. But who is invictus on

2571
02:10:59.760 --> 02:11:02.560
<v Speaker 2>co if not our Lord who suffered death and then

2572
02:11:02.600 --> 02:11:05.640
<v Speaker 2>conquered it. Or when they call the birthday of the Sun, well,

2573
02:11:05.800 --> 02:11:08.239
<v Speaker 2>Christ is the son of the Righteous and that the

2574
02:11:08.319 --> 02:11:11.600
<v Speaker 2>prophet Malachi spoke of. So basically they're just trying to

2575
02:11:11.680 --> 02:11:17.359
<v Speaker 2>make these connections from taking cherry picked verses and the

2576
02:11:17.479 --> 02:11:21.439
<v Speaker 2>Roman pagan worship. Okay, so taking these references with the

2577
02:11:21.520 --> 02:11:24.680
<v Speaker 2>calendar of Philococcus, Unser argued that December twenty fifth was

2578
02:11:24.680 --> 02:11:28.359
<v Speaker 2>an established festival for the birthday of Sol Invictus, celebrated

2579
02:11:28.359 --> 02:11:32.359
<v Speaker 2>by Terrus races and unsurped by or usurved rather by

2580
02:11:32.479 --> 02:11:35.039
<v Speaker 2>Christianity as the birthday of Jesus Christ, thus the date

2581
02:11:35.079 --> 02:11:37.920
<v Speaker 2>of Christmas. But there are multiple problems with this argument.

2582
02:11:38.600 --> 02:11:42.159
<v Speaker 2>The Dionysus Barsalabi text is very late, dating a full

2583
02:11:42.239 --> 02:11:44.720
<v Speaker 2>eight hundred and fifty years after any festival of Sol

2584
02:11:44.800 --> 02:11:49.640
<v Speaker 2>Invictus offer over in a far off Rome. Barsleibi also

2585
02:11:49.800 --> 02:11:54.359
<v Speaker 2>has a polemiic polemical acts to grind the date of

2586
02:11:54.479 --> 02:11:57.119
<v Speaker 2>Christmas was a point of contingent between Eastern and Western

2587
02:11:57.199 --> 02:12:00.439
<v Speaker 2>traditions of Christianity, and Barsilebi considers January six to be

2588
02:12:00.479 --> 02:12:03.439
<v Speaker 2>the correct and original date. So his association with December

2589
02:12:03.479 --> 02:12:06.520
<v Speaker 2>twenty fifth, alternatively with pagan festival as an attempt to

2590
02:12:07.560 --> 02:12:10.920
<v Speaker 2>denigrate and discredit it. And that's something that you'll see

2591
02:12:10.960 --> 02:12:14.079
<v Speaker 2>a lot with the early church fathers of what would

2592
02:12:14.079 --> 02:12:17.840
<v Speaker 2>become the Western or Roman Catholic Church. In the Eastern

2593
02:12:18.039 --> 02:12:21.760
<v Speaker 2>or Eastern Orthodox, they would go out of their way

2594
02:12:21.920 --> 02:12:25.680
<v Speaker 2>to draw comparisons and pull punches with each other just

2595
02:12:25.800 --> 02:12:28.760
<v Speaker 2>to make a point, and a lot of them you

2596
02:12:28.800 --> 02:12:33.479
<v Speaker 2>could tell their biases outright. So this checks out on

2597
02:12:33.640 --> 02:12:37.520
<v Speaker 2>the solstices and equinoxes at least dates to the right

2598
02:12:37.640 --> 02:12:40.640
<v Speaker 2>period to be more reliable. But it does not actually

2599
02:12:40.720 --> 02:12:42.800
<v Speaker 2>state that this is the birthday of the sun was

2600
02:12:42.800 --> 02:12:46.000
<v Speaker 2>appropriated by Christians. It just notes that the date had

2601
02:12:46.079 --> 02:12:51.079
<v Speaker 2>that pagan designation and then gives it a Christian exegetical spin.

2602
02:12:51.920 --> 02:12:54.560
<v Speaker 2>So does the calendar of Philocaccus actually refer to an

2603
02:12:54.600 --> 02:12:58.840
<v Speaker 2>ancient pagan festival of Sole Invictus that the Christians appropriated. Unfortunately,

2604
02:12:59.000 --> 02:13:02.800
<v Speaker 2>for Usner's thesis and all the pop history sources that

2605
02:13:02.840 --> 02:13:05.800
<v Speaker 2>have repeated it, it does not seem so. On the contrary,

2606
02:13:05.920 --> 02:13:09.239
<v Speaker 2>it appears that this December twenty fifth solar feast was

2607
02:13:09.359 --> 02:13:12.560
<v Speaker 2>actually very new and possibly not very significant at all.

2608
02:13:13.520 --> 02:13:16.119
<v Speaker 2>The modern historian who is the leading scholar were on

2609
02:13:16.560 --> 02:13:20.680
<v Speaker 2>Roman solar cult, Stephen Hidgemans, has literally written the book

2610
02:13:20.760 --> 02:13:23.520
<v Speaker 2>on the Roman Sun God's Soul. His two volume work

2611
02:13:23.680 --> 02:13:26.000
<v Speaker 2>Soul and the Meaning of the Sun in Roman Art

2612
02:13:26.079 --> 02:13:29.760
<v Speaker 2>and Religion collects the relevant material on the Roman worship

2613
02:13:29.800 --> 02:13:33.079
<v Speaker 2>of the Soul of Soul and shows the evidence for

2614
02:13:33.279 --> 02:13:36.680
<v Speaker 2>various very ancient feasts for this deity. These fell on

2615
02:13:36.800 --> 02:13:40.920
<v Speaker 2>August eighth and ninth, August twenty eighth, October nineteenth and

2616
02:13:40.960 --> 02:13:46.119
<v Speaker 2>twenty second, and December eleventh. Higman's shows strong evidence that

2617
02:13:46.239 --> 02:13:49.199
<v Speaker 2>these were the ancient, significant and well established feast days

2618
02:13:49.279 --> 02:13:52.159
<v Speaker 2>for the cult of Soul, and an article specifically on

2619
02:13:52.279 --> 02:13:54.159
<v Speaker 2>the relationship between the date of Christmas and Soul in

2620
02:13:54.199 --> 02:13:59.319
<v Speaker 2>Victus reference the document. He says one must conclude that

2621
02:13:59.479 --> 02:14:02.199
<v Speaker 2>in the early on fourth century a d anyone surveying

2622
02:14:02.279 --> 02:14:05.159
<v Speaker 2>festivities in honor of Soul would identify the period from

2623
02:14:05.199 --> 02:14:08.199
<v Speaker 2>October nineteenth to twenty second as far more important than

2624
02:14:08.279 --> 02:14:11.680
<v Speaker 2>December twenty fifth, and the festival of August as far older.

2625
02:14:13.399 --> 02:14:16.039
<v Speaker 2>This is because, with the exception of the calendar of

2626
02:14:16.079 --> 02:14:19.439
<v Speaker 2>Philicaucus and perhaps the on the Solstice sermon, there are

2627
02:14:19.600 --> 02:14:22.000
<v Speaker 2>no references to a feast of Soul on this date.

2628
02:14:22.520 --> 02:14:26.479
<v Speaker 2>This indicates this was a less significant and seemingly very

2629
02:14:26.600 --> 02:14:30.800
<v Speaker 2>new established feast So when was this rather new feast established.

2630
02:14:31.079 --> 02:14:32.319
<v Speaker 3>The short answer is, we really.

2631
02:14:32.199 --> 02:14:34.920
<v Speaker 2>Don't know, but it is very possible that the word

2632
02:14:35.119 --> 02:14:38.319
<v Speaker 2>Nautilus in the calendar of Philic Caucus does not refer

2633
02:14:38.439 --> 02:14:42.159
<v Speaker 2>to a birthday but to the anniversary of an establishment.

2634
02:14:41.680 --> 02:14:45.039
<v Speaker 3>Of a temple of a temple. Huh.

2635
02:14:45.399 --> 02:14:47.800
<v Speaker 2>So the whole conversation about Soul and Victus and that's

2636
02:14:47.800 --> 02:14:50.840
<v Speaker 2>where Christmas comes from. When you look at actual Roman

2637
02:14:50.920 --> 02:14:55.920
<v Speaker 2>document documentary documentation, thank you. I was gonna say documentary, Yeah, yeah, num.

2638
02:14:56.039 --> 02:14:57.079
<v Speaker 4>I can never say that word.

2639
02:14:57.279 --> 02:14:58.119
<v Speaker 2>I get this mixed up.

2640
02:14:58.199 --> 02:15:00.119
<v Speaker 4>I'm terrible with that word for some reason, and it

2641
02:15:00.239 --> 02:15:01.319
<v Speaker 4>just is a tongue tie for me.

2642
02:15:01.520 --> 02:15:03.520
<v Speaker 2>Words are hard. We're gonna skip ahead a little bit.

2643
02:15:03.560 --> 02:15:07.880
<v Speaker 2>But long story short, the Sole and Victis conversation has

2644
02:15:08.000 --> 02:15:12.279
<v Speaker 2>no actual credibility outside of two sources that were clearly

2645
02:15:13.479 --> 02:15:16.399
<v Speaker 2>biased and trying to shit on Roman Catholicism.

2646
02:15:16.880 --> 02:15:19.479
<v Speaker 3>Okay, so she and then it says right there that

2647
02:15:19.560 --> 02:15:23.319
<v Speaker 3>it notes that it's most most likely dating note earlier

2648
02:15:23.439 --> 02:15:24.960
<v Speaker 3>than two hundred and seventy.

2649
02:15:24.680 --> 02:15:30.720
<v Speaker 2>Four eighty Yeah, excuse me, actually that so yeahs went

2650
02:15:30.800 --> 02:15:33.640
<v Speaker 2>for the December feast was not important. The thirty Chariots

2651
02:15:33.800 --> 02:15:36.199
<v Speaker 2>as a significant number, and all of that they agree

2652
02:15:36.319 --> 02:15:38.840
<v Speaker 2>and reinforce this idea that the festival is relatively new

2653
02:15:39.319 --> 02:15:42.199
<v Speaker 2>to seventy four a d. So okay, again, the whole

2654
02:15:42.279 --> 02:15:45.439
<v Speaker 2>Christian conversation as far as December twenty fifth predates that.

2655
02:15:46.039 --> 02:15:48.159
<v Speaker 2>And this is significant because we have a reference to

2656
02:15:48.319 --> 02:15:50.960
<v Speaker 2>Christians noting December twenty fifth as the birth of Jesus

2657
02:15:51.159 --> 02:15:54.279
<v Speaker 2>well before two seventy four a d. Which means the

2658
02:15:54.399 --> 02:15:56.920
<v Speaker 2>idea that they simply usurped the Sole and Victis festival

2659
02:15:56.960 --> 02:16:01.119
<v Speaker 2>for their Christmas date really does not work. So the

2660
02:16:01.199 --> 02:16:04.880
<v Speaker 2>calculation thesis. If we do the rather obvious thing and

2661
02:16:05.000 --> 02:16:07.479
<v Speaker 2>actually turn to Christian sources to find what they say

2662
02:16:07.479 --> 02:16:09.760
<v Speaker 2>about the date of jesus birth, we find they had

2663
02:16:09.800 --> 02:16:11.840
<v Speaker 2>a great interest in the dates of key events in

2664
02:16:11.920 --> 02:16:17.000
<v Speaker 2>his life and the symbolic and comological significance of these dates.

2665
02:16:17.239 --> 02:16:19.439
<v Speaker 2>I think that might supposed to mean cosmological.

2666
02:16:19.920 --> 02:16:20.840
<v Speaker 4>I am not sure.

2667
02:16:20.960 --> 02:16:22.079
<v Speaker 3>To be honest with you, I thought that was a

2668
02:16:22.119 --> 02:16:22.720
<v Speaker 3>weird word too.

2669
02:16:23.439 --> 02:16:26.760
<v Speaker 2>As early as the second century we find lively discussion

2670
02:16:26.840 --> 02:16:29.680
<v Speaker 2>in various calculations of these important events and their dates.

2671
02:16:30.039 --> 02:16:32.520
<v Speaker 2>We also find a variety of conclusions and a great

2672
02:16:32.600 --> 02:16:35.799
<v Speaker 2>deal of disagreement and debate. This is because the Gospels,

2673
02:16:35.840 --> 02:16:38.159
<v Speaker 2>the main source of information about jesus life, are not

2674
02:16:38.360 --> 02:16:41.680
<v Speaker 2>very detailed regarding dates and years, and actually contain confusing

2675
02:16:41.719 --> 02:16:45.319
<v Speaker 2>and sometimes contradictory information on the subject. So reconciling these

2676
02:16:45.360 --> 02:16:47.840
<v Speaker 2>issues and working out when things happened in Jesus' life

2677
02:16:47.920 --> 02:16:51.639
<v Speaker 2>became a major scholarly puzzle for early Christian writers, and

2678
02:16:51.760 --> 02:16:57.680
<v Speaker 2>this sacred chnography carnography became an important element in Christian

2679
02:16:57.719 --> 02:17:00.479
<v Speaker 2>writings in this period. One of the few precise dates

2680
02:17:00.520 --> 02:17:05.000
<v Speaker 2>reference in Christian chronographers had to work with was found

2681
02:17:05.120 --> 02:17:08.879
<v Speaker 2>in John nineteen fourteen, which states that Jesus was executed

2682
02:17:09.000 --> 02:17:12.159
<v Speaker 2>on the day of preparation of the Passover, which is

2683
02:17:12.479 --> 02:17:15.840
<v Speaker 2>all which was also a Friday. From this and other

2684
02:17:15.920 --> 02:17:19.840
<v Speaker 2>gospel references, several of these scholars fitted the lunar Jewish

2685
02:17:19.920 --> 02:17:23.680
<v Speaker 2>calendar to the solar Roman calendar and calculated that Jesus

2686
02:17:23.760 --> 02:17:26.639
<v Speaker 2>died on March twenty fifth in twenty nine a d

2687
02:17:27.520 --> 02:17:30.840
<v Speaker 2>Another dates and years were proposed by Christian scholars and

2688
02:17:30.959 --> 02:17:34.680
<v Speaker 2>still are, but March twenty fifth has a cosmological significance

2689
02:17:34.719 --> 02:17:38.079
<v Speaker 2>because it was the traditional date of the spring equinox,

2690
02:17:38.280 --> 02:17:43.920
<v Speaker 2>making it a propitious date. Propitious, Yeah, for what Christians

2691
02:17:43.920 --> 02:17:47.319
<v Speaker 2>regarded as the turning point in cosmic history. We think

2692
02:17:47.360 --> 02:17:56.000
<v Speaker 2>that prosperous, propitious, maybe propitious, this person being he'd been

2693
02:17:56.040 --> 02:17:57.159
<v Speaker 2>doing some words, dude.

2694
02:17:57.440 --> 02:17:57.520
<v Speaker 3>Ye.

2695
02:17:58.719 --> 02:18:01.760
<v Speaker 2>We then find an increasing acceptance of March twenty fifth

2696
02:18:01.959 --> 02:18:05.559
<v Speaker 2>as also being the date of Jesus conception. So this

2697
02:18:05.879 --> 02:18:09.760
<v Speaker 2>day is the date of the feast of the Annunciation

2698
02:18:10.120 --> 02:18:14.680
<v Speaker 2>or Lady Day, and virtually all Christian liturgical traditions. Not

2699
02:18:14.920 --> 02:18:18.479
<v Speaker 2>only was this date the traditional spring equinox, it also

2700
02:18:19.040 --> 02:18:21.799
<v Speaker 2>it's also regarded as the date of God's creation of

2701
02:18:21.879 --> 02:18:25.040
<v Speaker 2>the world, giving it multiple layers of tradition and significance.

2702
02:18:25.399 --> 02:18:27.360
<v Speaker 2>Now I don't know where they would pull that from.

2703
02:18:27.559 --> 02:18:30.079
<v Speaker 2>What Why would March twenty fifth be the day that

2704
02:18:30.159 --> 02:18:33.799
<v Speaker 2>God created the world? I don't get it, But hey,

2705
02:18:33.879 --> 02:18:35.559
<v Speaker 2>if this is what the early Church followers did for

2706
02:18:35.639 --> 02:18:38.399
<v Speaker 2>whatever reason, then cool. But this also goes back, and

2707
02:18:38.639 --> 02:18:40.360
<v Speaker 2>I think they're going to talk about it in this article,

2708
02:18:40.399 --> 02:18:44.879
<v Speaker 2>But it was seen as proper and holy for you

2709
02:18:45.079 --> 02:18:48.239
<v Speaker 2>to die on the day that you were conceived, not born,

2710
02:18:48.520 --> 02:18:49.200
<v Speaker 2>but conceived.

2711
02:18:49.799 --> 02:18:52.879
<v Speaker 3>The fuck are they going to know that? Well?

2712
02:18:55.200 --> 02:18:58.479
<v Speaker 2>I don't understand that, but that is what these people believe.

2713
02:18:58.600 --> 02:18:59.680
<v Speaker 2>I think they're going to talk about it here in

2714
02:18:59.680 --> 02:19:02.680
<v Speaker 2>a minute. But anyway, not only was this the date

2715
02:19:02.840 --> 02:19:05.159
<v Speaker 2>of the true I talked about that already. It appears

2716
02:19:05.200 --> 02:19:08.440
<v Speaker 2>this date was arrived at via a long standing idea

2717
02:19:08.479 --> 02:19:12.280
<v Speaker 2>that holy men lived perfect and therefore highly symmetrical lives,

2718
02:19:12.799 --> 02:19:15.959
<v Speaker 2>being born and dying on the same date. In addition

2719
02:19:16.120 --> 02:19:18.680
<v Speaker 2>to this, there was a very early Christian tradition, based

2720
02:19:18.719 --> 02:19:21.600
<v Speaker 2>on largely on references in the Gospel of Luke's accounts

2721
02:19:21.799 --> 02:19:24.120
<v Speaker 2>on the conception of the birth of John the Baptist

2722
02:19:24.239 --> 02:19:27.319
<v Speaker 2>and of Jesus, that Jesus was born in winter, meaning

2723
02:19:27.399 --> 02:19:33.079
<v Speaker 2>his conception was in the previous spring. So continuing on, hey.

2724
02:19:32.959 --> 02:19:36.959
<v Speaker 3>But how would you know the exact date to the

2725
02:19:37.120 --> 02:19:37.680
<v Speaker 3>day they know?

2726
02:19:38.959 --> 02:19:41.840
<v Speaker 2>I mean, depends on the sources here. And that's what

2727
02:19:41.959 --> 02:19:43.959
<v Speaker 2>I wanted to go in on this one, because it's

2728
02:19:44.159 --> 02:19:47.479
<v Speaker 2>very thorough. Recent work by Thomas Schmidt has strengthened the

2729
02:19:47.559 --> 02:19:50.840
<v Speaker 2>argument made by Ferdinand Piper in eighteen fifty six and

2730
02:19:50.959 --> 02:19:53.959
<v Speaker 2>then in more detail by Lewis Duschen in eighteen eighty eight,

2731
02:19:54.360 --> 02:19:56.959
<v Speaker 2>that for Jesus it was a thought his symmetrical life

2732
02:19:57.040 --> 02:19:59.600
<v Speaker 2>meant that he was conceived and died on the same date.

2733
02:20:00.120 --> 02:20:02.120
<v Speaker 2>Schmidt makes a detailed study of the use of the

2734
02:20:02.200 --> 02:20:07.159
<v Speaker 2>word genesis among contemporaries of the influential chronographer Hoppolitus of Rome.

2735
02:20:07.639 --> 02:20:09.920
<v Speaker 2>I think I'm mispronounced it, but whatever, finding that when

2736
02:20:10.000 --> 02:20:16.159
<v Speaker 2>referring to a person, it meant conception and not birth, okay. Furthermore,

2737
02:20:16.200 --> 02:20:20.520
<v Speaker 2>Schmidt notes that Hoppolitis chronicon appears to place the birth

2738
02:20:20.559 --> 02:20:23.360
<v Speaker 2>of Christ exactly nine months after the anniversary of the

2739
02:20:23.399 --> 02:20:26.319
<v Speaker 2>creation of the world, ie March twenty fifth. This would

2740
02:20:26.360 --> 02:20:29.479
<v Speaker 2>indicate that the idea was conceived on March. Yeah, that

2741
02:20:29.600 --> 02:20:32.120
<v Speaker 2>he was conceived on March twenty fifth and was born

2742
02:20:32.239 --> 02:20:35.520
<v Speaker 2>after a perfect nine month gestation on December twenty fifth

2743
02:20:35.959 --> 02:20:38.680
<v Speaker 2>was something that developed in the Western Christian tradition very

2744
02:20:38.799 --> 02:20:41.680
<v Speaker 2>early on, at least by the first decades of the

2745
02:20:41.760 --> 02:20:42.479
<v Speaker 2>third century.

2746
02:20:44.280 --> 02:20:47.399
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, because that totally happens. There's no babies that are

2747
02:20:47.440 --> 02:20:49.959
<v Speaker 3>ever just late. Wait, you feel like that, no doubt,

2748
02:20:50.000 --> 02:20:50.840
<v Speaker 3>no doubt birth early.

2749
02:20:51.040 --> 02:20:53.120
<v Speaker 2>But hear me out. Though, the idea of December twenty

2750
02:20:53.159 --> 02:20:57.840
<v Speaker 2>fifth is documented in the early two hundreds AD, so

2751
02:20:57.959 --> 02:21:01.280
<v Speaker 2>the conversation that the Christians threw it on that date

2752
02:21:01.399 --> 02:21:04.639
<v Speaker 2>because of this pagan or this group or this god

2753
02:21:04.799 --> 02:21:07.120
<v Speaker 2>or this feast or whatever they.

2754
02:21:07.120 --> 02:21:08.319
<v Speaker 3>Did math to come to that.

2755
02:21:08.600 --> 02:21:11.040
<v Speaker 2>It's a guestman though, it's a guestimate, but it was

2756
02:21:11.079 --> 02:21:13.479
<v Speaker 2>a Christian guestimate. It had nothing to do with pagan

2757
02:21:13.559 --> 02:21:17.399
<v Speaker 2>influences my point. Okay, Right, so we talk about the

2758
02:21:18.120 --> 02:21:19.840
<v Speaker 2>We can go more into this and all this, but

2759
02:21:20.000 --> 02:21:22.399
<v Speaker 2>essentially that is the conclusion as far as the December

2760
02:21:22.399 --> 02:21:28.159
<v Speaker 2>twenty fifth conversation goes. Now, let's talk about Christmas traditions. Okay,

2761
02:21:29.040 --> 02:21:31.760
<v Speaker 2>and this one also a lot of these pop art

2762
02:21:32.000 --> 02:21:36.920
<v Speaker 2>history groups and the documentaries and all these people regurgitate

2763
02:21:37.000 --> 02:21:39.159
<v Speaker 2>information to say that this is super pagan, This is

2764
02:21:39.200 --> 02:21:41.120
<v Speaker 2>super pagan, this is super pagan, all these things that

2765
02:21:41.200 --> 02:21:45.520
<v Speaker 2>we have as far as Christmas iconography. This is going

2766
02:21:45.600 --> 02:21:47.360
<v Speaker 2>to break this down a little bit, and again I

2767
02:21:47.479 --> 02:21:50.159
<v Speaker 2>expect that this will lead to some very decent conversation

2768
02:21:50.479 --> 02:21:54.239
<v Speaker 2>about the subjects. So let's get into it here. There

2769
02:21:54.319 --> 02:21:57.440
<v Speaker 2>are several problems. Let's see, so the date of Christmas

2770
02:21:57.600 --> 02:21:59.840
<v Speaker 2>is not actually derived from anything pagan. What about our

2771
02:22:00.040 --> 02:22:03.840
<v Speaker 2>various Christmas customs and traditions? Yet every year, again, every year,

2772
02:22:03.879 --> 02:22:06.040
<v Speaker 2>we hear and read a plethora of articles about the

2773
02:22:06.120 --> 02:22:10.040
<v Speaker 2>origins of Christmas customs, assuring us that everything from gift

2774
02:22:10.079 --> 02:22:13.239
<v Speaker 2>giving to Christmas trees actually have pagan origin quote unquote.

2775
02:22:13.559 --> 02:22:15.559
<v Speaker 2>So how much of this is true? There are several

2776
02:22:15.639 --> 02:22:19.000
<v Speaker 2>problems here. Firstly, it is actually very difficult to trace

2777
02:22:19.040 --> 02:22:21.600
<v Speaker 2>the origin of a custom. The best we can do

2778
02:22:21.840 --> 02:22:24.319
<v Speaker 2>is usually work out when it first appeared and tried

2779
02:22:24.360 --> 02:22:28.319
<v Speaker 2>to discern its possible origin from context. Despite what journalists

2780
02:22:28.319 --> 02:22:31.920
<v Speaker 2>assure us in these seasonal quote unquote origin articles, most

2781
02:22:32.040 --> 02:22:35.520
<v Speaker 2>elements of our traditional Christmas are actually quite recent, usually

2782
02:22:35.600 --> 02:22:38.840
<v Speaker 2>dating back no more than the Victoria error, which that

2783
02:22:39.040 --> 02:22:43.479
<v Speaker 2>checks out. Secondly, the logic of these claims assumes that

2784
02:22:43.639 --> 02:22:47.360
<v Speaker 2>anything traditional is very old, anything very old is pre Christian,

2785
02:22:47.479 --> 02:22:51.159
<v Speaker 2>and anything pre Christian is religious in origin and so pagan.

2786
02:22:51.879 --> 02:22:54.319
<v Speaker 2>There are three large leaps of assumption that at play here.

2787
02:22:54.639 --> 02:22:57.200
<v Speaker 2>As already noted, most of our Christmas traditions are not

2788
02:22:57.399 --> 02:23:00.959
<v Speaker 2>very old at all, let alone ancient. Further, even the

2789
02:23:01.079 --> 02:23:04.920
<v Speaker 2>genuinely old traditions are not necessarily pre Christian. The idea

2790
02:23:05.000 --> 02:23:07.959
<v Speaker 2>that all old traditions develop before Christianity and then no

2791
02:23:08.159 --> 02:23:12.799
<v Speaker 2>further traditions appeared makes absolutely no sense. Finally, even in

2792
02:23:12.840 --> 02:23:15.159
<v Speaker 2>the few cases where we can trace a traditional back

2793
02:23:15.200 --> 02:23:18.159
<v Speaker 2>to some or a tradition back to something genuinely pre Christian.

2794
02:23:18.559 --> 02:23:22.559
<v Speaker 2>Ascribing actual quote unquote pagans significance to it is very difficult.

2795
02:23:23.159 --> 02:23:25.280
<v Speaker 2>Much of what we find in pop history about pagan

2796
02:23:25.399 --> 02:23:28.719
<v Speaker 2>origins of our traditions simply repeats claims that, as we

2797
02:23:28.799 --> 02:23:32.399
<v Speaker 2>will see, are dubious at best or often simply made up,

2798
02:23:32.760 --> 02:23:35.559
<v Speaker 2>and things which may look both ancient and possibly pagan

2799
02:23:35.959 --> 02:23:40.079
<v Speaker 2>usually or not. In a thousand years, people may well

2800
02:23:40.200 --> 02:23:42.840
<v Speaker 2>read plausible sounding claims that the elf on the shelf

2801
02:23:42.879 --> 02:23:47.079
<v Speaker 2>tradition is ancient and pagan in origin. It's clearly just

2802
02:23:47.079 --> 02:23:53.600
<v Speaker 2>like Labubu's. They're clearly demonic in nature, right, And we've

2803
02:23:53.639 --> 02:23:55.600
<v Speaker 2>talked about this too, and a thousand years when people

2804
02:23:55.719 --> 02:23:59.680
<v Speaker 2>read back the texts that we have in our day

2805
02:23:59.680 --> 02:24:02.120
<v Speaker 2>and age, what the fuck are they going to think

2806
02:24:02.319 --> 02:24:04.760
<v Speaker 2>we put real significance behind I.

2807
02:24:04.760 --> 02:24:07.760
<v Speaker 3>Don't know, I mean, I have no idea. I wonder

2808
02:24:07.840 --> 02:24:11.280
<v Speaker 3>what they're they're gonna say. I mean, it just depends

2809
02:24:11.360 --> 02:24:14.239
<v Speaker 3>on who rates the history very true and goes from there.

2810
02:24:15.079 --> 02:24:18.959
<v Speaker 2>So with lots of references to the pre Christian folklore

2811
02:24:19.000 --> 02:24:20.760
<v Speaker 2>of elves, yeah, I can see the elf on the

2812
02:24:20.799 --> 02:24:23.840
<v Speaker 2>shelf becoming a whole thing. Oh yeah, one thousand years

2813
02:24:23.840 --> 02:24:25.799
<v Speaker 2>from now, they're going to say that they brought back

2814
02:24:25.840 --> 02:24:27.559
<v Speaker 2>pagan worship in America.

2815
02:24:27.680 --> 02:24:29.920
<v Speaker 3>Maybe, and it was a demon that was watching over

2816
02:24:29.959 --> 02:24:32.559
<v Speaker 3>the children, ready to take their soul to the fiery

2817
02:24:32.639 --> 02:24:35.760
<v Speaker 3>depths of hell if they didn't, you know, I don't

2818
02:24:35.760 --> 02:24:36.840
<v Speaker 3>know pray correctly.

2819
02:24:37.079 --> 02:24:38.840
<v Speaker 2>It was said that they moved on their own at

2820
02:24:38.920 --> 02:24:41.000
<v Speaker 2>night and got into all kinds of mischief and all that.

2821
02:24:41.200 --> 02:24:43.920
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Yeah, they didn't have a they didn't have enough

2822
02:24:43.959 --> 02:24:45.120
<v Speaker 3>crucifixes on the walls.

2823
02:24:45.600 --> 02:24:48.600
<v Speaker 2>Right, But we know the origin of this popular modern tradition.

2824
02:24:48.799 --> 02:24:50.760
<v Speaker 2>It was marketing. It was a marketing campaign for a

2825
02:24:50.799 --> 02:24:52.840
<v Speaker 2>two thousand and five American picture book.

2826
02:24:53.479 --> 02:24:56.399
<v Speaker 3>Really two thousand and five, Yeah, I told you this

2827
02:24:56.600 --> 02:24:58.479
<v Speaker 3>was well, you told me, but I had no idea

2828
02:24:58.559 --> 02:25:02.959
<v Speaker 3>that it was. It was around then. Well, I mean, honestly,

2829
02:25:03.000 --> 02:25:04.399
<v Speaker 3>I thought it was sooner than that. I was like

2830
02:25:04.600 --> 02:25:06.200
<v Speaker 3>maybe like twenty ten.

2831
02:25:06.600 --> 02:25:08.879
<v Speaker 2>It was a marketing campaign in the mid two thousands,

2832
02:25:08.879 --> 02:25:11.079
<v Speaker 2>but it didn't really take root and like get popular

2833
02:25:11.520 --> 02:25:13.159
<v Speaker 2>until like their early twenty teens.

2834
02:25:14.040 --> 02:25:14.239
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

2835
02:25:14.799 --> 02:25:18.120
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but anyway, our future pop folklores would be wrong.

2836
02:25:18.440 --> 02:25:20.840
<v Speaker 2>We have to be aware of superficial similarities and glib

2837
02:25:20.920 --> 02:25:24.000
<v Speaker 2>associations and pay attention to the evidence. So now let's

2838
02:25:24.000 --> 02:25:27.159
<v Speaker 2>talk about gift giving, which I think is to say

2839
02:25:27.200 --> 02:25:30.120
<v Speaker 2>that they the Christians started giving gifts because Pagans did it.

2840
02:25:30.680 --> 02:25:33.479
<v Speaker 2>That's ridiculous to me personally. I think we could probably

2841
02:25:33.520 --> 02:25:38.159
<v Speaker 2>skip over this because giving gifts is not a pagan practice.

2842
02:25:38.760 --> 02:25:40.879
<v Speaker 2>That's a that's a love language.

2843
02:25:40.559 --> 02:25:43.239
<v Speaker 3>For a lot. I mean, that's everybody practice. So I

2844
02:25:43.280 --> 02:25:45.399
<v Speaker 3>mean you had chiefs give each other gifts, you know,

2845
02:25:45.760 --> 02:25:48.280
<v Speaker 3>as a sign of respect in all different types of cultures.

2846
02:25:48.319 --> 02:25:50.719
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, so we could skip over the gift giving one.

2847
02:25:50.799 --> 02:25:54.280
<v Speaker 2>That's that's just extra for me, super long too. Oh yeah,

2848
02:25:54.319 --> 02:25:57.360
<v Speaker 2>shit feasting again, I think we could skip over. So

2849
02:25:57.440 --> 02:25:59.319
<v Speaker 2>you're telling me that you're celebrating something in you.

2850
02:26:00.319 --> 02:26:02.559
<v Speaker 3>I can I can skim really quickly. So I mean

2851
02:26:02.959 --> 02:26:03.799
<v Speaker 3>to say, I'd like.

2852
02:26:03.840 --> 02:26:06.719
<v Speaker 2>To say that we at the Christmas in American tradition,

2853
02:26:06.879 --> 02:26:10.639
<v Speaker 2>take away religious iconography for it, just the feast of Christmas.

2854
02:26:11.399 --> 02:26:14.239
<v Speaker 2>That's not taken from anybody. People are getting together for

2855
02:26:14.280 --> 02:26:17.479
<v Speaker 2>a Christmas party. Somebody's gonna throw some food on it. Yeah,

2856
02:26:18.040 --> 02:26:22.520
<v Speaker 2>there's gonna be drinks exchanged. Oh so pagan so.

2857
02:26:22.760 --> 02:26:26.520
<v Speaker 3>Pagan, I think, how dare you make a turkey that

2858
02:26:26.879 --> 02:26:27.959
<v Speaker 3>that satanic part?

2859
02:26:28.079 --> 02:26:30.639
<v Speaker 2>You see my point? You see you're baking a ham

2860
02:26:31.239 --> 02:26:34.520
<v Speaker 2>like Thor's ham. No, dude, what, No, it's a It's

2861
02:26:34.559 --> 02:26:36.959
<v Speaker 2>a fucking a giant piece of meat that feeds a party.

2862
02:26:37.280 --> 02:26:40.440
<v Speaker 2>What are we talking about here? So again to say

2863
02:26:40.479 --> 02:26:40.760
<v Speaker 2>that and.

2864
02:26:40.799 --> 02:26:43.879
<v Speaker 3>Talks about practical jokes and gifts and amusement for people

2865
02:26:45.120 --> 02:26:49.920
<v Speaker 3>you know later. Uh, let's see it says Saturny game

2866
02:26:50.040 --> 02:26:52.959
<v Speaker 3>is sometimes claimed to be the origin of the later

2867
02:26:53.120 --> 02:26:59.040
<v Speaker 3>medieval Christmas traditions of Lord of Misrule or the Boy Bishop. Yeah,

2868
02:26:59.360 --> 02:27:00.639
<v Speaker 3>that doesn't sound wrong at all.

2869
02:27:00.879 --> 02:27:03.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this is that age like milk didn't it.

2870
02:27:04.120 --> 02:27:07.200
<v Speaker 3>This is potentially possible, but it's hard to establish a.

2871
02:27:07.280 --> 02:27:09.959
<v Speaker 2>Genuine line of derivation.

2872
02:27:10.239 --> 02:27:14.040
<v Speaker 3>Sorry I can't. I'm like, I'm squinting my contacts. I'm like, okay,

2873
02:27:14.040 --> 02:27:17.680
<v Speaker 3>I'm squinting from the pagan Roman practice to the medieval

2874
02:27:17.799 --> 02:27:21.319
<v Speaker 3>Christian ones. So yeah, it just kind of talks about the.

2875
02:27:22.799 --> 02:27:24.680
<v Speaker 2>Around for forever anytime it's a celebration.

2876
02:27:24.799 --> 02:27:27.319
<v Speaker 3>Another seeing, it does talk about Yule feasting.

2877
02:27:27.520 --> 02:27:28.920
<v Speaker 2>Okay, let's let's get to there.

2878
02:27:29.040 --> 02:27:33.520
<v Speaker 3>So another Pagan Yule feasting story is found in the

2879
02:27:33.600 --> 02:27:38.239
<v Speaker 3>same book that we talked about earlier, the hem I Scriggler.

2880
02:27:38.520 --> 02:27:40.760
<v Speaker 3>I even watched. I even watched how to Say It

2881
02:27:41.079 --> 02:27:43.680
<v Speaker 3>No Joke, like fifteen times before, just so I got

2882
02:27:43.760 --> 02:27:46.799
<v Speaker 3>it right. I know, I'm terrible with names, yeah and

2883
02:27:46.920 --> 02:27:52.239
<v Speaker 3>saying stuff. So the hymn screw screw Screwler, I don't know. Anyways,

2884
02:27:52.319 --> 02:27:57.200
<v Speaker 3>it involves the good old Handkun guy and being unable

2885
02:27:57.319 --> 02:27:59.639
<v Speaker 3>to avoid eating some of the horse meat from the

2886
02:27:59.719 --> 02:28:02.280
<v Speaker 3>Yule sacrifice. Okay, so he forced himself to eat some

2887
02:28:02.319 --> 02:28:06.079
<v Speaker 3>of the horse liver and drink yule oas drink yule

2888
02:28:06.159 --> 02:28:10.600
<v Speaker 3>oas without without making the sign of the crossover them Okay.

2889
02:28:11.280 --> 02:28:12.760
<v Speaker 3>So yeah, it just talks about that.

2890
02:28:12.959 --> 02:28:14.760
<v Speaker 2>And I have yet to see anyone try to claim

2891
02:28:14.799 --> 02:28:17.079
<v Speaker 2>eating horse meat at Yule is connected to any modern

2892
02:28:17.159 --> 02:28:20.840
<v Speaker 2>Christmas tradition. However, So again, I don't really know a.

2893
02:28:20.840 --> 02:28:22.479
<v Speaker 3>Bunch of people to eat horse meat. I mean, we

2894
02:28:22.600 --> 02:28:25.000
<v Speaker 3>did did cover the other people that wore the horse

2895
02:28:25.079 --> 02:28:27.559
<v Speaker 3>head around the Walsh, but yeah, the Welish, but I

2896
02:28:27.600 --> 02:28:29.239
<v Speaker 3>don't think they were eating horse meat.

2897
02:28:29.440 --> 02:28:33.120
<v Speaker 2>So I mean, so how pagan is eating and drinking

2898
02:28:33.200 --> 02:28:36.840
<v Speaker 2>on Christmas? There's no doubt Pagans did do some feasting

2899
02:28:37.000 --> 02:28:39.520
<v Speaker 2>at midwinter, and there is possibly our eating ham and

2900
02:28:39.600 --> 02:28:42.399
<v Speaker 2>pork at Christmas is a dim echo of Germanic sacrifices

2901
02:28:42.440 --> 02:28:44.879
<v Speaker 2>that you'll I did bring that up. But midwinter is

2902
02:28:44.959 --> 02:28:47.360
<v Speaker 2>also a logical time for people to stay indoors, eat

2903
02:28:47.399 --> 02:28:50.079
<v Speaker 2>and drink. The weather is colder, even in southern Europe.

2904
02:28:50.280 --> 02:28:52.280
<v Speaker 2>It is also a time when there are fewer major

2905
02:28:52.360 --> 02:28:55.799
<v Speaker 2>agricultural tasks other than repairing tools and waiting for the spring.

2906
02:28:56.200 --> 02:28:58.719
<v Speaker 2>A feast around the solstice simply makes sense, and people

2907
02:28:58.840 --> 02:29:01.440
<v Speaker 2>in all cultures like eating and drinking to mark festivals,

2908
02:29:01.479 --> 02:29:05.959
<v Speaker 2>So pagan, not particularly so. So fair enough. Now let's

2909
02:29:06.000 --> 02:29:09.520
<v Speaker 2>talk about holly, ivy and mistletoe. Now, this one is

2910
02:29:09.600 --> 02:29:11.360
<v Speaker 2>interesting and I don't know how this article is gonna

2911
02:29:11.360 --> 02:29:14.760
<v Speaker 2>play out, but there is a reference written by Roman

2912
02:29:14.799 --> 02:29:18.079
<v Speaker 2>scholars of druids climbing a scaffold and cutting a bit

2913
02:29:18.120 --> 02:29:20.440
<v Speaker 2>of mistletoe from a tree with a golden scythe so

2914
02:29:20.600 --> 02:29:24.079
<v Speaker 2>saying that mistletoe had some real significance to the Druids

2915
02:29:24.280 --> 02:29:27.680
<v Speaker 2>absolutely true. And there's references to the Nordics saying that

2916
02:29:27.760 --> 02:29:30.079
<v Speaker 2>mistletoe was also seen as sacred because it was one

2917
02:29:30.079 --> 02:29:33.120
<v Speaker 2>of the only things that wasn't agreed to, not was

2918
02:29:33.159 --> 02:29:37.280
<v Speaker 2>it Balder? The one plant that wasn't agreed couldn't harm Balder.

2919
02:29:37.399 --> 02:29:40.040
<v Speaker 2>So somehow Loki made a spear out of mistletoe. No

2920
02:29:40.159 --> 02:29:42.159
<v Speaker 2>fucking clue how that's possible, by the way, but it's

2921
02:29:42.239 --> 02:29:44.920
<v Speaker 2>myth that it doesn't matter, But like he actually killed

2922
02:29:44.959 --> 02:29:48.680
<v Speaker 2>Balder with a spear of mistletoe. So to say that

2923
02:29:48.879 --> 02:29:52.159
<v Speaker 2>holly ivy and mistletoe at Christmas have pagan origins, let's

2924
02:29:52.159 --> 02:29:52.680
<v Speaker 2>talk about it.

2925
02:29:52.879 --> 02:29:56.000
<v Speaker 4>I have holly at my house and mistletoe as well.

2926
02:29:56.280 --> 02:30:00.840
<v Speaker 2>Most Christmas celebrants do, regardless of what you call it.

2927
02:30:01.000 --> 02:30:03.159
<v Speaker 2>Most people at this time do that because that's a

2928
02:30:03.200 --> 02:30:06.280
<v Speaker 2>part of the iconography, especially in America. So let's get

2929
02:30:06.319 --> 02:30:10.159
<v Speaker 2>into it. This seasonal Origins of Christmas Customs article tend

2930
02:30:10.239 --> 02:30:12.319
<v Speaker 2>to be in agreement that the traditional use of holly,

2931
02:30:12.440 --> 02:30:15.280
<v Speaker 2>ivy and mistletoe as Christmas decorations has its origins in

2932
02:30:15.360 --> 02:30:18.840
<v Speaker 2>pre Christian times and emphasize any pagan association with them.

2933
02:30:19.239 --> 02:30:21.600
<v Speaker 2>Like we talked about holly, we are assured was sacred

2934
02:30:21.639 --> 02:30:24.399
<v Speaker 2>to the Druids. We talked about that, and it's regularly

2935
02:30:24.479 --> 02:30:27.280
<v Speaker 2>invoked these pagan origins claims. Despite the fact that we

2936
02:30:27.399 --> 02:30:29.760
<v Speaker 2>know about them from the ancient sources could be written

2937
02:30:29.799 --> 02:30:32.399
<v Speaker 2>on a very small piece of paper, which is true.

2938
02:30:32.520 --> 02:30:39.120
<v Speaker 2>We have no record, no record of Druidic practices. Yeah,

2939
02:30:39.159 --> 02:30:42.360
<v Speaker 2>I know, we have no idea which gods they actually worshiped.

2940
02:30:42.399 --> 02:30:44.479
<v Speaker 2>We can infer it based off of tribes that were

2941
02:30:44.559 --> 02:30:46.840
<v Speaker 2>around that area. We don't know that for a fact.

2942
02:30:47.520 --> 02:30:50.639
<v Speaker 2>We don't know to what level and extent anything about

2943
02:30:50.680 --> 02:30:54.399
<v Speaker 2>the Druids because they were viciously rooted out and murdered

2944
02:30:54.440 --> 02:30:58.120
<v Speaker 2>by the Romans, and that started pre Christian. Just gonna

2945
02:30:58.159 --> 02:30:58.600
<v Speaker 2>throw that out.

2946
02:30:59.799 --> 02:31:03.239
<v Speaker 4>The actually did have magic, and the Romans did not

2947
02:31:03.479 --> 02:31:03.680
<v Speaker 4>like it.

2948
02:31:04.559 --> 02:31:08.040
<v Speaker 2>We're talking pre Christian. Romans did not like the Druids,

2949
02:31:08.079 --> 02:31:12.159
<v Speaker 2>and they sought to genocidally murder all of them. I mean,

2950
02:31:12.600 --> 02:31:14.639
<v Speaker 2>then the Christians took up the Mantelin continued, I'm not

2951
02:31:14.680 --> 02:31:16.280
<v Speaker 2>going to deny that fact, but that I'm just saying

2952
02:31:16.280 --> 02:31:21.440
<v Speaker 2>it started pre Christian anyway, so much better. It's not better.

2953
02:31:21.639 --> 02:31:23.200
<v Speaker 2>I'm just saying, like to say that it was the

2954
02:31:23.319 --> 02:31:25.239
<v Speaker 2>Christians that tried to murder all these people and it

2955
02:31:25.319 --> 02:31:27.719
<v Speaker 2>was their fault, like they were picking up the mantle

2956
02:31:27.799 --> 02:31:32.159
<v Speaker 2>from their Roman predecessors. Not good but also there's it's

2957
02:31:32.239 --> 02:31:32.959
<v Speaker 2>not shit.

2958
02:31:33.360 --> 02:31:35.559
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I mean, they still did a lot of horrible

2959
02:31:35.799 --> 02:31:39.040
<v Speaker 3>things in youry so much history.

2960
02:31:39.760 --> 02:31:41.479
<v Speaker 2>But the Druids also never wrote things down.

2961
02:31:41.719 --> 02:31:43.639
<v Speaker 3>To be fair, though, I wonder if the Druids really

2962
02:31:43.680 --> 02:31:47.399
<v Speaker 3>did have like actual magic and or did had I

2963
02:31:47.440 --> 02:31:49.440
<v Speaker 3>don't know, maybe they were tied to the Nephelo, maybe

2964
02:31:49.440 --> 02:31:51.680
<v Speaker 3>they were, like I don't know, they could have been

2965
02:31:51.760 --> 02:31:54.440
<v Speaker 3>something really special for them to still, like at least

2966
02:31:54.479 --> 02:31:56.600
<v Speaker 3>their name and like the myth of them to still

2967
02:31:56.680 --> 02:31:58.559
<v Speaker 3>be around. Yeah. Something.

2968
02:31:58.760 --> 02:32:01.200
<v Speaker 2>But it also kills me when I like neo pagans

2969
02:32:01.239 --> 02:32:03.440
<v Speaker 2>say oh I'm more into the Druidic practices of the

2970
02:32:03.520 --> 02:32:07.040
<v Speaker 2>Druidic teachings, no one has any fucking clue what those are.

2971
02:32:07.440 --> 02:32:11.799
<v Speaker 3>I think it more Yeah, it mostly means that you're

2972
02:32:11.920 --> 02:32:16.840
<v Speaker 3>more of the land, that you're more connected to the

2973
02:32:16.959 --> 02:32:19.879
<v Speaker 3>more spiritual things like of of Earth is what I

2974
02:32:19.920 --> 02:32:21.079
<v Speaker 3>think a lot of people would bring.

2975
02:32:21.719 --> 02:32:23.840
<v Speaker 4>What does that ri I've druid from is?

2976
02:32:24.399 --> 02:32:27.600
<v Speaker 2>But is that what the druids believed? Because in these tribes,

2977
02:32:27.680 --> 02:32:30.799
<v Speaker 2>to be a druid was to basically have a doctorate degree.

2978
02:32:31.600 --> 02:32:33.399
<v Speaker 3>So I mean, I think it's one of those things

2979
02:32:33.440 --> 02:32:36.520
<v Speaker 3>that again people don't have enough knowledge, and so they're

2980
02:32:36.520 --> 02:32:40.559
<v Speaker 3>filling in the gaps, like just at ie the Yule

2981
02:32:40.680 --> 02:32:44.200
<v Speaker 3>celebration and how it's been turned into a weaponized thing

2982
02:32:44.440 --> 02:32:48.000
<v Speaker 3>against people that is evil and demonic and and should

2983
02:32:48.040 --> 02:32:48.879
<v Speaker 3>not be practiced.

2984
02:32:49.120 --> 02:32:50.799
<v Speaker 2>Glad you brought it up, because the Yule log's coming

2985
02:32:50.879 --> 02:32:54.079
<v Speaker 2>up here, we go, Oh yeah. Anyway, So Holly, we

2986
02:32:54.200 --> 02:32:56.680
<v Speaker 2>are assured, was sacred to the Druids as well, a

2987
02:32:56.760 --> 02:32:59.520
<v Speaker 2>group that are regularly invoked in these pagan origins claims,

2988
02:32:59.559 --> 02:33:01.200
<v Speaker 2>despite the fact that what we know about them from

2989
02:33:01.200 --> 02:33:02.959
<v Speaker 2>ancient sources could be written on a very small piece

2990
02:33:02.959 --> 02:33:05.079
<v Speaker 2>of paper. Suffice it to say, none of those ancient

2991
02:33:05.120 --> 02:33:08.600
<v Speaker 2>sources make any mention of the sacredness of Holly at all.

2992
02:33:09.239 --> 02:33:11.520
<v Speaker 2>Ivy we are also informed with sacred to the Druids

2993
02:33:11.559 --> 02:33:14.559
<v Speaker 2>for various pagan traditions. It is sometimes claimed that Ivy

2994
02:33:14.719 --> 02:33:17.559
<v Speaker 2>was the feminine equivalent to holly for these Pagans, which

2995
02:33:17.639 --> 02:33:21.159
<v Speaker 2>is another fascinating detail that is found precisely nowhere in

2996
02:33:21.319 --> 02:33:21.959
<v Speaker 2>ancient source.

2997
02:33:22.440 --> 02:33:25.120
<v Speaker 4>You do realize that this person is extremely biased when

2998
02:33:25.120 --> 02:33:26.319
<v Speaker 4>they're talking about stuff.

2999
02:33:26.079 --> 02:33:28.639
<v Speaker 2>Right, but they're also showing their receipts. I know there

3000
02:33:28.719 --> 02:33:31.280
<v Speaker 2>is no ancient source to say that this whole duality

3001
02:33:31.319 --> 02:33:33.719
<v Speaker 2>of feminine and masculine with holly and ivy, that's that's

3002
02:33:33.799 --> 02:33:36.559
<v Speaker 2>made up. There's no historical background for that, Okay.

3003
02:33:36.879 --> 02:33:39.479
<v Speaker 3>I'm just simply saying, like, throughout this entire article, you

3004
02:33:39.520 --> 02:33:42.479
<v Speaker 3>can definitely tell there's an extreme biased tone in this

3005
02:33:43.520 --> 02:33:44.000
<v Speaker 3>whole thing.

3006
02:33:44.280 --> 02:33:47.159
<v Speaker 2>I see this, I do, okay, but it doesn't also

3007
02:33:47.239 --> 02:33:48.159
<v Speaker 2>take away from the facts.

3008
02:33:49.079 --> 02:33:52.200
<v Speaker 3>True. But I mean having a yin yang when it

3009
02:33:52.280 --> 02:33:56.879
<v Speaker 3>comes to masculine feminine view on things like that's and

3010
02:33:57.799 --> 02:34:00.920
<v Speaker 3>that's not a just new hot tape. I mean many

3011
02:34:01.319 --> 02:34:04.360
<v Speaker 3>for cultures have believed in the ying yang of female

3012
02:34:04.559 --> 02:34:05.239
<v Speaker 3>and men, and.

3013
02:34:05.600 --> 02:34:08.239
<v Speaker 2>Even ancient Mail and Brew alchemy talks about these divine

3014
02:34:08.280 --> 02:34:11.680
<v Speaker 2>feminine masculine qualities. I'm with you, But the conversation that

3015
02:34:11.799 --> 02:34:15.040
<v Speaker 2>holly and ivy are seen as that dualistic thing that

3016
02:34:15.280 --> 02:34:17.280
<v Speaker 2>has no basis in actual facts.

3017
02:34:17.079 --> 02:34:20.879
<v Speaker 3>That's just assumed. Okay, So fair enough.

3018
02:34:22.319 --> 02:34:25.680
<v Speaker 2>These claims appear to be a simply recent invention that

3019
02:34:25.840 --> 02:34:28.840
<v Speaker 2>we just get repeated endlessly. The most common claim is

3020
02:34:28.879 --> 02:34:31.920
<v Speaker 2>that the Romans merely decorated their homes with holly, ivy

3021
02:34:31.959 --> 02:34:34.559
<v Speaker 2>and mistletoe and hung up wreaths at Saturnalia, and this

3022
02:34:34.719 --> 02:34:37.879
<v Speaker 2>is the origin for our customary decoration. Unfortunately, if we

3023
02:34:37.959 --> 02:34:41.559
<v Speaker 2>search various references to Saturnalia customs and Roman sources, there's

3024
02:34:41.600 --> 02:34:45.799
<v Speaker 2>absolutely no references to holly ivy or missletoe or wreaths.

3025
02:34:46.479 --> 02:34:50.120
<v Speaker 2>Modern Christmas rereads were originally an Advent wreath, a decorated

3026
02:34:50.120 --> 02:34:53.280
<v Speaker 2>circle with four candles, which one lit on each of

3027
02:34:53.319 --> 02:34:56.680
<v Speaker 2>the fasting Sundays before Christmas. So it is completely Christian

3028
02:34:56.760 --> 02:35:00.840
<v Speaker 2>tradition with again no sign of any pagan order. Which

3029
02:35:01.079 --> 02:35:02.520
<v Speaker 2>if you've ever been in a Catholic church and you

3030
02:35:02.600 --> 02:35:04.680
<v Speaker 2>see the Advent candles, there's a pink one and there's

3031
02:35:04.680 --> 02:35:07.920
<v Speaker 2>three purple ones. That's always on a wreath. That's a

3032
02:35:07.959 --> 02:35:10.399
<v Speaker 2>thing that they do once for lynt it's the thing.

3033
02:35:11.079 --> 02:35:14.280
<v Speaker 2>So there's no indication that any of that came from Saturdanalia.

3034
02:35:14.440 --> 02:35:16.760
<v Speaker 2>There's no indication that the Druids did reads or anything

3035
02:35:16.840 --> 02:35:20.600
<v Speaker 2>like that either, which is interesting. This leaves us with mistletoe,

3036
02:35:20.799 --> 02:35:23.879
<v Speaker 2>and here the Pagan origins articles at least have a

3037
02:35:23.959 --> 02:35:26.399
<v Speaker 2>couple of pre Christian references that they can utilize with

3038
02:35:26.479 --> 02:35:29.600
<v Speaker 2>a bit of work. Unlike the holly claims, we actually

3039
02:35:29.639 --> 02:35:31.799
<v Speaker 2>do have an ancient source link in the ancient Celtic

3040
02:35:31.879 --> 02:35:35.239
<v Speaker 2>priestly class of Druids to missletoe in the first century

3041
02:35:35.360 --> 02:35:38.879
<v Speaker 2>AD encyclopedia Natural History, by Plenty of the Older he

3042
02:35:38.959 --> 02:35:43.159
<v Speaker 2>writes about missletoe, which before we get into that, plenty

3043
02:35:43.200 --> 02:35:46.399
<v Speaker 2>of the older shit on flat earthers in this book

3044
02:35:46.520 --> 02:35:49.000
<v Speaker 2>called Natural History, which by all accounts we can just

3045
02:35:49.040 --> 02:35:52.600
<v Speaker 2>say was the first encyclopedia ever written. I'm not saying

3046
02:35:52.639 --> 02:35:54.959
<v Speaker 2>it was all accurate, but I am saying that he

3047
02:35:55.239 --> 02:35:57.200
<v Speaker 2>was even shitting on flat earthers in that. And this

3048
02:35:57.360 --> 02:35:58.959
<v Speaker 2>was in the first century eighty. I think it was

3049
02:35:59.000 --> 02:36:03.239
<v Speaker 2>finally compiled in like seventy or seventy two ady, But anyway,

3050
02:36:04.840 --> 02:36:07.239
<v Speaker 2>it continues on. It gives a direct quote here, But

3051
02:36:07.360 --> 02:36:09.239
<v Speaker 2>this is what I was talking about earlier. Clad in

3052
02:36:09.239 --> 02:36:11.479
<v Speaker 2>a white robe, the priest ascends the tree and cuts

3053
02:36:11.479 --> 02:36:13.879
<v Speaker 2>the mistletoe with a golden sickle, which is received by

3054
02:36:14.000 --> 02:36:17.559
<v Speaker 2>others in a white cloak. Then they immolate the victims,

3055
02:36:17.680 --> 02:36:20.719
<v Speaker 2>offering up their prayers that God will render this gift

3056
02:36:20.879 --> 02:36:25.360
<v Speaker 2>of his propitious to those or his proprietas okay, to

3057
02:36:25.479 --> 02:36:28.120
<v Speaker 2>those whom He has granted it. It is the belief

3058
02:36:28.239 --> 02:36:31.000
<v Speaker 2>with them that the mistletoe taken in drink will impart

3059
02:36:31.760 --> 02:36:35.200
<v Speaker 2>fecundity to all animals that are barren, and that it

3060
02:36:35.319 --> 02:36:38.600
<v Speaker 2>is an antidote for all poisons, which is crazy, because

3061
02:36:38.600 --> 02:36:41.079
<v Speaker 2>mistletoe is actually a poison and if you ingest it,

3062
02:36:41.159 --> 02:36:43.879
<v Speaker 2>you will die. You might get very sick, but like

3063
02:36:44.239 --> 02:36:46.680
<v Speaker 2>the probability of you dying is extremely high. So the

3064
02:36:46.760 --> 02:36:49.760
<v Speaker 2>druids doing that, that leads me to believe some other stuff.

3065
02:36:49.799 --> 02:36:52.280
<v Speaker 2>But neither here nor they're moving on. So if any

3066
02:36:52.319 --> 02:36:54.680
<v Speaker 2>of this is accurate, and with plenty that is far

3067
02:36:54.760 --> 02:36:57.399
<v Speaker 2>from certain. Here is at least what we have some

3068
02:36:57.559 --> 02:37:00.799
<v Speaker 2>evidence of a pagan association with mistletoe. But has this

3069
02:37:00.920 --> 02:37:03.600
<v Speaker 2>got anything to do with the midwinter decoration or the

3070
02:37:03.719 --> 02:37:07.760
<v Speaker 2>origins of the Christmas tradition regarding mistletoe. No, it is

3071
02:37:07.799 --> 02:37:10.000
<v Speaker 2>not enough to gesture to some ancient pagan belief about

3072
02:37:10.000 --> 02:37:12.760
<v Speaker 2>mistletoe and then decide that this means our use of

3073
02:37:12.879 --> 02:37:15.840
<v Speaker 2>it is pagan in origin. There's actually no evidence here

3074
02:37:16.040 --> 02:37:19.000
<v Speaker 2>of any connection. So moving on here, we talked about

3075
02:37:19.000 --> 02:37:22.159
<v Speaker 2>the misstletoe, the holly, the ivy, these things, and we

3076
02:37:22.239 --> 02:37:24.719
<v Speaker 2>can keep reading it, but it does talk about in

3077
02:37:24.799 --> 02:37:27.280
<v Speaker 2>the seventeen hundreds this became a thing that more or

3078
02:37:27.360 --> 02:37:31.840
<v Speaker 2>less found its way into Christian and Christmas iconography. So

3079
02:37:32.040 --> 02:37:32.719
<v Speaker 2>moving on here.

3080
02:37:33.079 --> 02:37:33.920
<v Speaker 3>Yule logs.

3081
02:37:34.600 --> 02:37:36.799
<v Speaker 2>Now, this is an interesting one, to be honest with you,

3082
02:37:36.879 --> 02:37:39.040
<v Speaker 2>because I didn't know what the origins of this was.

3083
02:37:40.040 --> 02:37:42.520
<v Speaker 2>Let's break it down. Yule logs tend to be a

3084
02:37:42.639 --> 02:37:45.799
<v Speaker 2>traditional element of Christmas, more referred to and included in

3085
02:37:45.920 --> 02:37:49.159
<v Speaker 2>imagery than actual practice these days. It was a tradition

3086
02:37:49.399 --> 02:37:51.760
<v Speaker 2>of finding and dragging a large log into the home,

3087
02:37:52.000 --> 02:37:55.120
<v Speaker 2>making sure it was one sufficiently large to burn from

3088
02:37:55.200 --> 02:37:58.639
<v Speaker 2>Christmas Eve through the following day. In other iterations, it

3089
02:37:58.719 --> 02:38:01.239
<v Speaker 2>was burned incrementally each day from Christmas Eve to the

3090
02:38:01.280 --> 02:38:04.440
<v Speaker 2>twelfth night. In various versions of the tradition, the cutting, dragging,

3091
02:38:04.559 --> 02:38:06.639
<v Speaker 2>and lighting of the yule log was accompanied by drinking

3092
02:38:06.760 --> 02:38:09.360
<v Speaker 2>and singing, and the log was sometimes sprinkled with wine

3093
02:38:09.440 --> 02:38:12.319
<v Speaker 2>or spirits. Sometimes a fragment of the log was kept

3094
02:38:12.360 --> 02:38:14.360
<v Speaker 2>and used the next year to light the next Yule log,

3095
02:38:14.760 --> 02:38:17.319
<v Speaker 2>though its variants of the custom was simply kept for luck,

3096
02:38:17.520 --> 02:38:20.600
<v Speaker 2>or used to light fires on particularly stormy nights, and

3097
02:38:20.719 --> 02:38:24.120
<v Speaker 2>still some other versions its ashes were used to sprinkle

3098
02:38:24.200 --> 02:38:27.879
<v Speaker 2>over the fields. This all looks and feels rather pagan,

3099
02:38:28.239 --> 02:38:30.280
<v Speaker 2>and so it is usually claimed that the tradition, if

3100
02:38:30.559 --> 02:38:35.399
<v Speaker 2>now largely unpracticed, Christmas custom, was deep pagan roots. Back

3101
02:38:35.440 --> 02:38:38.719
<v Speaker 2>in seventeen seventy seven, the English antiquarian Henry Born declared

3102
02:38:38.760 --> 02:38:41.200
<v Speaker 2>the custom to be pagan in origin, but had to

3103
02:38:41.280 --> 02:38:44.079
<v Speaker 2>use a lot of speculative language to do so, noting

3104
02:38:44.239 --> 02:38:47.840
<v Speaker 2>Bead's eighth century references to pagan Yule following falling on

3105
02:38:47.959 --> 02:38:51.799
<v Speaker 2>December twenty fifth, the Yule clog, which is log, therefore

3106
02:38:51.879 --> 02:38:54.760
<v Speaker 2>hath probably been a part of these ceremonies which were

3107
02:38:54.799 --> 02:38:58.799
<v Speaker 2>performed the knights that night's ceremonies. It seems to have

3108
02:38:58.879 --> 02:39:01.040
<v Speaker 2>been used as an mblas of the return of the

3109
02:39:01.120 --> 02:39:03.639
<v Speaker 2>sun and the lightning or the lengthening of days, for

3110
02:39:03.719 --> 02:39:06.600
<v Speaker 2>as both December and January were called Gweley and Yule

3111
02:39:07.079 --> 02:39:09.959
<v Speaker 2>upon account of the sun's returning and the increase of days.

3112
02:39:10.200 --> 02:39:13.360
<v Speaker 2>So I am apt to believe the log had has

3113
02:39:13.440 --> 02:39:16.120
<v Speaker 2>had the name of the Eule Log from its being

3114
02:39:16.200 --> 02:39:18.280
<v Speaker 2>burnt as an emblem of the returning sun and the

3115
02:39:18.360 --> 02:39:20.879
<v Speaker 2>increase of light and heat. This is probably the reason

3116
02:39:20.920 --> 02:39:24.000
<v Speaker 2>for the custom among the Heathen Saxons. This means that

3117
02:39:24.120 --> 02:39:26.799
<v Speaker 2>Bourne does not actually find any ancient references to the

3118
02:39:27.360 --> 02:39:30.319
<v Speaker 2>ejule Log, so he assumes them and reads them into bead.

3119
02:39:31.159 --> 02:39:34.639
<v Speaker 2>All this really tells is that he is assuming pagan origins. Okay,

3120
02:39:35.239 --> 02:39:39.239
<v Speaker 2>so that's fair. Okay, it sounds like it is often

3121
02:39:39.319 --> 02:39:41.920
<v Speaker 2>stated that there is a much earlier German reference to

3122
02:39:41.920 --> 02:39:43.799
<v Speaker 2>the yule log tradition, dating all the way back to

3123
02:39:43.840 --> 02:39:47.360
<v Speaker 2>eleven eighty four. However, Peter Gainsford has tracked this back

3124
02:39:47.440 --> 02:39:50.200
<v Speaker 2>to its source, an edict from the privileges of the

3125
02:39:50.280 --> 02:39:54.239
<v Speaker 2>parish priest Alhan, Westphalia, and found it simply says a

3126
02:39:54.399 --> 02:39:57.200
<v Speaker 2>tree is to be provided to the priest at the

3127
02:39:57.399 --> 02:39:59.600
<v Speaker 2>nativity of the Lord, to be brought for his own

3128
02:39:59.680 --> 02:40:02.280
<v Speaker 2>fire at the festival. So this does not seem to

3129
02:40:02.360 --> 02:40:04.719
<v Speaker 2>be any reference to the Yule law custom and appears

3130
02:40:04.760 --> 02:40:07.479
<v Speaker 2>to simply be a utilitarian provision of firewood for the

3131
02:40:07.559 --> 02:40:12.159
<v Speaker 2>local priest. So continuing on this dude, Ronald Hutton notes

3132
02:40:12.200 --> 02:40:16.079
<v Speaker 2>fairly skepticism about, or fairly early skepticism about the ancient

3133
02:40:16.120 --> 02:40:19.360
<v Speaker 2>origins of the custom, pointing out to Alexander Till's observations

3134
02:40:19.399 --> 02:40:23.079
<v Speaker 2>in eighteen eighty nine that Herrick is the earliest reference

3135
02:40:23.159 --> 02:40:27.159
<v Speaker 2>to it in Britain Till notes some medieval German references

3136
02:40:27.239 --> 02:40:30.040
<v Speaker 2>to the provision of firewood at Christmas, which he had

3137
02:40:30.639 --> 02:40:34.479
<v Speaker 2>he and Hutton thinks may be the origin of the tradition,

3138
02:40:35.000 --> 02:40:39.040
<v Speaker 2>though these two seem largely utilitarian rather than ritual. Hutton

3139
02:40:39.079 --> 02:40:42.200
<v Speaker 2>also notes that the later references shown by the nineteenth

3140
02:40:42.239 --> 02:40:45.239
<v Speaker 2>century versions of the julaw tradition was found in France,

3141
02:40:45.399 --> 02:40:48.600
<v Speaker 2>the Italian Apps, and Serbia, but also was found in

3142
02:40:48.760 --> 02:40:51.399
<v Speaker 2>most parts of Europe. He believes the tradition began in

3143
02:40:51.479 --> 02:40:54.559
<v Speaker 2>medieval Germany, pointing to the fact that all iterations of

3144
02:40:54.639 --> 02:40:58.600
<v Speaker 2>it by the nineteenth century ringed German. So once again,

3145
02:40:58.760 --> 02:41:02.239
<v Speaker 2>while claims that this was ancient pagan custom, there's little

3146
02:41:02.280 --> 02:41:05.719
<v Speaker 2>evidence to support either idea. The yule log custom appears

3147
02:41:05.760 --> 02:41:08.479
<v Speaker 2>to be a local, you know, local variant or tradition

3148
02:41:08.559 --> 02:41:11.840
<v Speaker 2>that began as purely practiced aspect of a midwinter festival,

3149
02:41:12.280 --> 02:41:14.639
<v Speaker 2>making sure there is enough log to keep everyone.

3150
02:41:14.399 --> 02:41:15.159
<v Speaker 3>Warm for the duration.

3151
02:41:15.840 --> 02:41:20.000
<v Speaker 2>M I didn't know that, Honestly, I didn't either, But

3152
02:41:20.719 --> 02:41:22.680
<v Speaker 2>and that makes sense. Like as far as the decoration

3153
02:41:22.799 --> 02:41:25.000
<v Speaker 2>of the yule log, as we see people doing today,

3154
02:41:25.319 --> 02:41:27.760
<v Speaker 2>cool decorate your yule log, there's no problem.

3155
02:41:27.840 --> 02:41:30.920
<v Speaker 3>But also I don't have well, I don't have anywhere,

3156
02:41:31.079 --> 02:41:32.639
<v Speaker 3>like I don't have a fire pit or anywhere to

3157
02:41:32.680 --> 02:41:35.079
<v Speaker 3>be able to burn the log sure for the time needed,

3158
02:41:35.120 --> 02:41:36.719
<v Speaker 3>and you're supposed to burn it for a certain amount

3159
02:41:36.719 --> 02:41:38.079
<v Speaker 3>of time. I have no place to do that. So

3160
02:41:38.520 --> 02:41:40.280
<v Speaker 3>normally what I do with my little log is I

3161
02:41:40.440 --> 02:41:43.920
<v Speaker 3>have the colors for Yule. So I have three three

3162
02:41:44.040 --> 02:41:46.559
<v Speaker 3>candle holes, and I have the colors three different types

3163
02:41:46.600 --> 02:41:48.959
<v Speaker 3>of candles that I put in and I light every

3164
02:41:49.000 --> 02:41:50.719
<v Speaker 3>single day for a certain amount of time because I

3165
02:41:50.760 --> 02:41:54.040
<v Speaker 3>don't or I let them burn down and then I

3166
02:41:54.399 --> 02:41:57.000
<v Speaker 3>replace them every day, depends if I like I'm actually

3167
02:41:57.000 --> 02:41:59.639
<v Speaker 3>gonna be there or not. And then around the log

3168
02:41:59.680 --> 02:42:02.760
<v Speaker 3>it's so elf. I have orange slices, I have pine cones.

3169
02:42:02.840 --> 02:42:06.959
<v Speaker 3>I have mistletoe. I have we else do I have.

3170
02:42:07.399 --> 02:42:08.559
<v Speaker 3>I have a couple other.

3171
02:42:08.440 --> 02:42:10.360
<v Speaker 4>Things, cranberries probably cranberries.

3172
02:42:10.440 --> 02:42:13.959
<v Speaker 3>I have pomegranate. Yeah, I have pomegranate seeds. And I

3173
02:42:14.079 --> 02:42:17.479
<v Speaker 3>have one other thing too, it's a I don't know why,

3174
02:42:17.559 --> 02:42:20.399
<v Speaker 3>it's just skeep in my mind. It's another plant that's

3175
02:42:20.479 --> 02:42:23.319
<v Speaker 3>involved with mule. And I normally have it like set

3176
02:42:23.399 --> 02:42:25.399
<v Speaker 3>up all the way around it and stuff like that,

3177
02:42:25.559 --> 02:42:27.520
<v Speaker 3>and so that's kind of what I have is my

3178
02:42:27.639 --> 02:42:30.959
<v Speaker 3>little mule setup and what I normally do every single year,

3179
02:42:31.000 --> 02:42:32.840
<v Speaker 3>and it's on my counter because that's the only place

3180
02:42:32.840 --> 02:42:34.680
<v Speaker 3>I don't I don't have anywhere to be able to

3181
02:42:34.760 --> 02:42:36.479
<v Speaker 3>do the like the full tradition for it.

3182
02:42:36.600 --> 02:42:39.040
<v Speaker 4>So sure, but sometimes I get the little goat.

3183
02:42:39.120 --> 02:42:40.399
<v Speaker 3>I have two little goats too.

3184
02:42:40.760 --> 02:42:42.600
<v Speaker 2>Those Scannadian goats, yet little scan and.

3185
02:42:42.639 --> 02:42:45.120
<v Speaker 3>Even wooden goats. I have them, but I couldn't find

3186
02:42:45.159 --> 02:42:46.639
<v Speaker 3>them this year. Normally I have two of them that

3187
02:42:46.680 --> 02:42:47.959
<v Speaker 3>I put out on both sides.

3188
02:42:47.719 --> 02:42:52.520
<v Speaker 2>Of it, So no doubt. But again, there's nothing endemically

3189
02:42:52.719 --> 02:42:56.120
<v Speaker 2>saying that the yule log practice has any pagan origin.

3190
02:42:56.719 --> 02:43:00.200
<v Speaker 3>That's it's kind of disheartening.

3191
02:43:03.239 --> 02:43:03.520
<v Speaker 2>Tradition.

3192
02:43:03.719 --> 02:43:05.479
<v Speaker 3>I know, It's not like super disheartingment. It's kind of

3193
02:43:05.520 --> 02:43:09.319
<v Speaker 3>like ow all right, I mean, because man, it's like

3194
02:43:09.440 --> 02:43:10.879
<v Speaker 3>finding out Santa Claus is real.

3195
02:43:11.959 --> 02:43:14.440
<v Speaker 2>Wait what yep, it's finally out. The elf on the

3196
02:43:14.520 --> 02:43:17.600
<v Speaker 2>shelf is a la boo boo. Anyway, So now let's

3197
02:43:17.600 --> 02:43:21.440
<v Speaker 2>talk about Christmas trees. So many people talk about these

3198
02:43:21.479 --> 02:43:25.280
<v Speaker 2>Christmas trees demonitory clearly so decorating.

3199
02:43:25.559 --> 02:43:28.239
<v Speaker 3>Somehow a tree is gonna be of the devil it's

3200
02:43:28.280 --> 02:43:29.840
<v Speaker 3>gonna come and get you. It's going to drag you

3201
02:43:29.920 --> 02:43:31.479
<v Speaker 3>to hell. It's gotta be right.

3202
02:43:31.639 --> 02:43:33.719
<v Speaker 2>And that's also crazy because we talked about this, I

3203
02:43:33.760 --> 02:43:36.920
<v Speaker 2>think yesterday's episode. In the Philippines, they do like mangoes

3204
02:43:36.920 --> 02:43:40.840
<v Speaker 2>and banana trees, yeah, they do. And somehow these evergreen trees,

3205
02:43:41.399 --> 02:43:44.879
<v Speaker 2>yeah yeah, but somehow in Europe, these evergreen trees, you mean,

3206
02:43:45.000 --> 02:43:49.120
<v Speaker 2>like the Nordics, Like, wait, stop, bro, what what I just.

3207
02:43:50.719 --> 02:43:52.959
<v Speaker 3>It's just so wild to me, Like, I don't understand

3208
02:43:53.399 --> 02:43:57.920
<v Speaker 3>how so many themes have become so demonized and such

3209
02:43:57.959 --> 02:44:01.280
<v Speaker 3>a weapon against people of like you don't believe in

3210
02:44:01.360 --> 02:44:04.440
<v Speaker 3>this particular thing, and my blah blah blah blah. It's

3211
02:44:04.479 --> 02:44:06.680
<v Speaker 3>like wait, what so you could do frank and sense

3212
02:44:06.719 --> 02:44:08.440
<v Speaker 3>and murder and like feel some type of way about

3213
02:44:08.440 --> 02:44:11.600
<v Speaker 3>having that, but like we can't have some orange slices, bro,

3214
02:44:12.200 --> 02:44:16.440
<v Speaker 3>Like that orange slice is gonna get you. He's going

3215
02:44:16.520 --> 02:44:17.399
<v Speaker 3>to take you to hell.

3216
02:44:17.799 --> 02:44:19.680
<v Speaker 2>This is my issue with it. But again, it's like

3217
02:44:20.079 --> 02:44:25.239
<v Speaker 2>anything can be done with negative or evil intent, and

3218
02:44:25.280 --> 02:44:27.360
<v Speaker 2>I think we could both agree with that, right. I

3219
02:44:27.399 --> 02:44:29.159
<v Speaker 2>don't believe that when you're putting out your yule log,

3220
02:44:29.239 --> 02:44:31.000
<v Speaker 2>you're trying to imbuse aatan no.

3221
02:44:31.200 --> 02:44:34.319
<v Speaker 3>I mean, it's about rebirth. It's about starting your your

3222
02:44:34.840 --> 02:44:37.680
<v Speaker 3>new year in a better light. Like there's a there's

3223
02:44:37.719 --> 02:44:40.639
<v Speaker 3>a good tradition that a lot of people do where

3224
02:44:40.719 --> 02:44:42.559
<v Speaker 3>you write down all the things that you want for

3225
02:44:43.120 --> 02:44:44.840
<v Speaker 3>or you want to get rid of all the negative

3226
02:44:44.879 --> 02:44:46.920
<v Speaker 3>thoughts or all the negative things that have happened that

3227
02:44:47.079 --> 02:44:49.600
<v Speaker 3>year to you, and you burn them and release him,

3228
02:44:50.000 --> 02:44:53.239
<v Speaker 3>and then you plant you write down all this stuff

3229
02:44:53.280 --> 02:44:55.959
<v Speaker 3>that you want and then you plant it under a

3230
02:44:56.079 --> 02:44:59.879
<v Speaker 3>tree or any kind of plant you have in your house,

3231
02:45:00.079 --> 02:45:01.799
<v Speaker 3>and then I have it in my house. I have

3232
02:45:01.879 --> 02:45:02.760
<v Speaker 3>a couple of them that.

3233
02:45:02.840 --> 02:45:06.120
<v Speaker 2>You So the idea that the ulog is a pagan

3234
02:45:06.200 --> 02:45:08.719
<v Speaker 2>thing and we're going to learn this later on as

3235
02:45:08.760 --> 02:45:11.479
<v Speaker 2>far as the Christmas trees are concerned as well, these

3236
02:45:11.600 --> 02:45:15.239
<v Speaker 2>are things that were based off of at least Christian

3237
02:45:15.319 --> 02:45:20.559
<v Speaker 2>culture and then was adopted by Pagans later on. Okay,

3238
02:45:20.879 --> 02:45:24.360
<v Speaker 2>because Pagans were losing so many members to the Christianization

3239
02:45:24.479 --> 02:45:28.639
<v Speaker 2>of Europe that they try to start acting like Christians

3240
02:45:28.719 --> 02:45:31.200
<v Speaker 2>for lack of better words, to keep their pagan people.

3241
02:45:32.520 --> 02:45:37.639
<v Speaker 3>That's interesting because that's completely contradicting everything I've read. History

3242
02:45:37.719 --> 02:45:39.920
<v Speaker 3>is a bit of a lie. Sometimes well, I.

3243
02:45:39.959 --> 02:45:42.079
<v Speaker 4>Mean, but these are by scholars that I've read.

3244
02:45:42.399 --> 02:45:45.399
<v Speaker 2>We are quoting scholars, okay.

3245
02:45:45.200 --> 02:45:48.120
<v Speaker 4>But you're also I mean, we just have read like

3246
02:45:48.319 --> 02:45:49.719
<v Speaker 4>multiple different sources.

3247
02:45:49.760 --> 02:45:52.440
<v Speaker 2>Like I'm just so many scholars are going after the

3248
02:45:52.520 --> 02:45:55.280
<v Speaker 2>Christian faith because like, clearly Christians are the reason for

3249
02:45:55.360 --> 02:45:56.559
<v Speaker 2>all the bad shit in the world.

3250
02:45:57.719 --> 02:46:00.719
<v Speaker 3>I mean, I at least from the by they didn't

3251
02:46:00.719 --> 02:46:02.600
<v Speaker 3>seem like they had biased tones in the ones that

3252
02:46:02.680 --> 02:46:05.719
<v Speaker 3>I've read in the last few days. It's simply and

3253
02:46:05.799 --> 02:46:08.520
<v Speaker 3>it even said that there's two sides of it. It

3254
02:46:08.639 --> 02:46:12.040
<v Speaker 3>talked about both sides and both opinions. This one in

3255
02:46:12.079 --> 02:46:15.639
<v Speaker 3>particular woman she's a doctorate, Her doctorate is in like

3256
02:46:15.760 --> 02:46:19.079
<v Speaker 3>two different things, and she pretty much goes into this

3257
02:46:19.319 --> 02:46:22.159
<v Speaker 3>is one this one side is believing all of these things.

3258
02:46:22.280 --> 02:46:24.680
<v Speaker 3>This one side is believing all of these things. There

3259
02:46:24.799 --> 02:46:28.079
<v Speaker 3>is mixed information on all accounts, because there's so many

3260
02:46:28.120 --> 02:46:31.600
<v Speaker 3>things that were written down, not written down, that have

3261
02:46:31.719 --> 02:46:34.879
<v Speaker 3>been misconstruted that potentially could be this and and pretty

3262
02:46:34.959 --> 02:46:37.959
<v Speaker 3>much it was like a wash. You could say that

3263
02:46:38.520 --> 02:46:41.559
<v Speaker 3>this is a this is what these people believe, this

3264
02:46:41.719 --> 02:46:43.920
<v Speaker 3>is what this people wrote down. These people didn't really

3265
02:46:44.000 --> 02:46:46.360
<v Speaker 3>have a written language that they like went out of there.

3266
02:46:46.520 --> 02:46:48.040
<v Speaker 3>They had it, but they didn't go out of their

3267
02:46:48.079 --> 02:46:50.920
<v Speaker 3>way to discuss all of these things. They were trying

3268
02:46:50.959 --> 02:46:53.639
<v Speaker 3>to preserve their actual heritage and not talk about everything

3269
02:46:53.680 --> 02:46:56.079
<v Speaker 3>that was going on, and so it was just it

3270
02:46:56.159 --> 02:46:59.360
<v Speaker 3>was like a wash completely. When it came to who

3271
02:46:59.520 --> 02:47:02.879
<v Speaker 3>is right, it's aiss in the wind kind of a thing, like, okay.

3272
02:47:02.959 --> 02:47:06.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's fair, honestly, And again, there are some of

3273
02:47:06.600 --> 02:47:10.280
<v Speaker 2>these traditions that I could see why certain assumptions would

3274
02:47:10.280 --> 02:47:12.040
<v Speaker 2>be made, and there are certain ones that like we

3275
02:47:12.120 --> 02:47:13.639
<v Speaker 2>honestly don't have much of a source.

3276
02:47:13.680 --> 02:47:15.079
<v Speaker 3>It's just one of the things that came about.

3277
02:47:15.200 --> 02:47:16.680
<v Speaker 4>I mean, Christmas trees are dramatic.

3278
02:47:16.920 --> 02:47:19.399
<v Speaker 2>So Christmas trees are one of those things. It has

3279
02:47:19.440 --> 02:47:23.159
<v Speaker 2>become such a popular iconographal look of when you think

3280
02:47:23.200 --> 02:47:26.000
<v Speaker 2>of Christmas, you think of a decorated Christmas tree, right,

3281
02:47:26.479 --> 02:47:29.000
<v Speaker 2>So let's get into this one now. Decorating Christmas trees

3282
02:47:29.120 --> 02:47:31.799
<v Speaker 2>are so ubiquitous in modern Christmas traditions that they have

3283
02:47:31.920 --> 02:47:34.840
<v Speaker 2>become the de facto symbol of the season, and they

3284
02:47:34.879 --> 02:47:37.799
<v Speaker 2>are among the Christmas customs most usually declared to be

3285
02:47:37.920 --> 02:47:42.319
<v Speaker 2>pagan in origin, with confident pronouncements that they variously have

3286
02:47:42.479 --> 02:47:46.360
<v Speaker 2>their origins in Celtic tradition, Germanic mule customs, or yet

3287
02:47:46.399 --> 02:47:51.000
<v Speaker 2>again Roman saturnalia. After all, many ask what has putting

3288
02:47:51.079 --> 02:47:53.239
<v Speaker 2>up a tree in our home and hanging decorations when

3289
02:47:53.280 --> 02:47:55.399
<v Speaker 2>it got to do with the birth of Christ. Clearly

3290
02:47:55.479 --> 02:47:58.000
<v Speaker 2>it's assumed that this has been has to be pagan

3291
02:47:58.040 --> 02:48:01.799
<v Speaker 2>in origin. Some Christians are those most insistent of this

3292
02:48:01.959 --> 02:48:04.719
<v Speaker 2>pagan origin, even declaring it to be so ancient and

3293
02:48:04.840 --> 02:48:08.760
<v Speaker 2>pagan that these wicked trees are explicitly condemned in the Bible.

3294
02:48:09.600 --> 02:48:10.200
<v Speaker 3>They cite.

3295
02:48:10.559 --> 02:48:13.680
<v Speaker 2>The text sided here is Jeremiah ten two through four,

3296
02:48:14.120 --> 02:48:16.239
<v Speaker 2>and it is often given the King James version for

3297
02:48:16.360 --> 02:48:20.440
<v Speaker 2>the extra old world. Zing good people, I'm gonna I'm

3298
02:48:20.479 --> 02:48:23.520
<v Speaker 2>gonna break this down because I'm gonna jump ahead from

3299
02:48:23.520 --> 02:48:25.120
<v Speaker 2>what he's talking about here, but I'm gonna read the

3300
02:48:25.200 --> 02:48:28.280
<v Speaker 2>quote here. Thus saith the Lord, learn not the way

3301
02:48:28.360 --> 02:48:30.920
<v Speaker 2>of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the sign

3302
02:48:31.159 --> 02:48:34.079
<v Speaker 2>of heaven, for the heathen are dismade at them, or

3303
02:48:34.239 --> 02:48:36.959
<v Speaker 2>the customs of the people are vain. For one cuteth

3304
02:48:37.000 --> 02:48:39.440
<v Speaker 2>the tree out of the forest, the work of the

3305
02:48:39.600 --> 02:48:42.159
<v Speaker 2>hands of the workmen, with an axe. They deck it

3306
02:48:42.239 --> 02:48:44.520
<v Speaker 2>with silver and gold. They fasten it with nails and

3307
02:48:44.600 --> 02:48:50.479
<v Speaker 2>with hammers that it moved. Not okay, y'all, they are

3308
02:48:50.559 --> 02:48:56.440
<v Speaker 2>talking about making wooden idols, no shit, But clearly they're

3309
02:48:56.479 --> 02:49:00.600
<v Speaker 2>talking about cutting a tree down, carving a sculpture and

3310
02:49:00.719 --> 02:49:03.079
<v Speaker 2>idle out of it, and adorning it with silver and gold.

3311
02:49:04.120 --> 02:49:07.639
<v Speaker 2>How people took this and made it to be clearly

3312
02:49:07.760 --> 02:49:11.680
<v Speaker 2>a Christmas tree, I actually don't understand how they made

3313
02:49:11.719 --> 02:49:14.520
<v Speaker 2>that connection, especially when you look at the context of

3314
02:49:14.600 --> 02:49:16.959
<v Speaker 2>the time and place that Jeremiah was speaking. But anyway,

3315
02:49:17.600 --> 02:49:21.600
<v Speaker 2>we're gonna jump ahead here. There is no pagan Christmas

3316
02:49:21.680 --> 02:49:24.280
<v Speaker 2>tree to be found here as far as that conversation goes.

3317
02:49:24.680 --> 02:49:27.559
<v Speaker 2>Another commonly repeated story of the origin of the Christmas

3318
02:49:27.600 --> 02:49:30.399
<v Speaker 2>tree is attributed to Saint Boniface in six seventy five

3319
02:49:30.440 --> 02:49:32.760
<v Speaker 2>and seven fifty four, and I'm gonna jump ahead on

3320
02:49:32.799 --> 02:49:36.520
<v Speaker 2>this one as well. Apparently this saint cut down a

3321
02:49:36.680 --> 02:49:39.760
<v Speaker 2>sacred oak to Odin as a sign of his power

3322
02:49:39.840 --> 02:49:42.559
<v Speaker 2>over the old gods, and finds an evergreen tree standing

3323
02:49:42.639 --> 02:49:46.200
<v Speaker 2>behind it, or miraculously growing in its place, and he declares,

3324
02:49:46.600 --> 02:49:48.760
<v Speaker 2>this little tree, a young child of the forest, shall

3325
02:49:48.799 --> 02:49:51.120
<v Speaker 2>be your holy tree tonight. It is the wood of peace.

3326
02:49:51.479 --> 02:49:53.200
<v Speaker 2>It is the sign of the endless life where it

3327
02:49:53.319 --> 02:49:57.399
<v Speaker 2>leaves our evergreen, so how it points upwards to heaven.

3328
02:49:58.079 --> 02:50:01.799
<v Speaker 2>So okay, here's the deal. There is no historical context

3329
02:50:02.200 --> 02:50:06.600
<v Speaker 2>to say that the oak is important to Odin. There

3330
02:50:06.680 --> 02:50:11.120
<v Speaker 2>are certain woods that were very sacred to the Nordic traditions.

3331
02:50:11.440 --> 02:50:14.879
<v Speaker 2>I'm not denying that whatsoever. There is no references to

3332
02:50:14.959 --> 02:50:18.120
<v Speaker 2>say that the oak tree was even like a thing

3333
02:50:18.200 --> 02:50:23.600
<v Speaker 2>for Odin whatsoever. So that connection to say that he

3334
02:50:23.840 --> 02:50:26.360
<v Speaker 2>was doing this as a trounce to the Nordic tradition

3335
02:50:26.520 --> 02:50:29.920
<v Speaker 2>and then took the fir behind it to be the

3336
02:50:30.040 --> 02:50:35.879
<v Speaker 2>replacement is on shaky ground at best. So again, as

3337
02:50:35.879 --> 02:50:38.559
<v Speaker 2>it's talking about the life of Saint Boniface circus seven sixty,

3338
02:50:39.159 --> 02:50:41.440
<v Speaker 2>but the Christmas tree element is not found there, and

3339
02:50:41.600 --> 02:50:44.440
<v Speaker 2>there is nothing in that or similar accounts that associates

3340
02:50:44.479 --> 02:50:48.079
<v Speaker 2>the pagan oak tree with the midwinter or Yule. Roger

3341
02:50:48.200 --> 02:50:50.719
<v Speaker 2>Pierce has tracked that ending of the story and that

3342
02:50:50.879 --> 02:50:53.840
<v Speaker 2>quote from the Saint back to a eighteen ninety one

3343
02:50:53.959 --> 02:50:57.479
<v Speaker 2>short story by Henry van Dyke called The Oak of Geismer,

3344
02:50:57.959 --> 02:51:01.719
<v Speaker 2>first published in Scribner's Magazine. The story was a hit

3345
02:51:01.840 --> 02:51:04.360
<v Speaker 2>and later published in expanded form as a novel, The

3346
02:51:04.440 --> 02:51:06.760
<v Speaker 2>First Christmas Tree, A Story of the Forest, in eighteen

3347
02:51:06.840 --> 02:51:10.040
<v Speaker 2>ninety seven. They don't even think the dude actually did this.

3348
02:51:12.799 --> 02:51:15.239
<v Speaker 2>This was a quote hundreds of years after he died

3349
02:51:15.280 --> 02:51:18.079
<v Speaker 2>that was made popular in the eighteen hundreds, so like,

3350
02:51:18.479 --> 02:51:21.639
<v Speaker 2>it's not a thing. So while this story is still

3351
02:51:21.680 --> 02:51:25.920
<v Speaker 2>repeated mainly by Catholic publications as the very first Christian

3352
02:51:25.959 --> 02:51:28.479
<v Speaker 2>origin of the Christmas Tree, it has also given rise

3353
02:51:28.479 --> 02:51:31.479
<v Speaker 2>to the idea that Boniface stole quote unquote the custom

3354
02:51:31.879 --> 02:51:34.719
<v Speaker 2>from the Pagans he converted. So it is claimed that

3355
02:51:34.799 --> 02:51:37.159
<v Speaker 2>the sacred oak cut down was the original Christmas tree,

3356
02:51:37.239 --> 02:51:41.040
<v Speaker 2>despite being an oak not associated with midwinter, Yule or

3357
02:51:41.159 --> 02:51:44.200
<v Speaker 2>Christmas time in any way. Most claims of the pagan

3358
02:51:44.239 --> 02:51:46.280
<v Speaker 2>origins of the Christmas Tree do not even bother with

3359
02:51:46.399 --> 02:51:49.040
<v Speaker 2>an origin story or even references to source at all.

3360
02:51:49.399 --> 02:51:51.360
<v Speaker 2>We are simply informed that these trees are set up

3361
02:51:51.399 --> 02:51:54.159
<v Speaker 2>by Pagans at midwinter and decorated, and that this is

3362
02:51:54.200 --> 02:51:56.760
<v Speaker 2>the origin of our custom. This is despite the fact

3363
02:51:56.799 --> 02:52:01.079
<v Speaker 2>that our few references to Saturdayalea or Yule or any

3364
02:52:01.159 --> 02:52:05.479
<v Speaker 2>midwinter festivals have absolutely no reference to any such thing.

3365
02:52:05.799 --> 02:52:08.360
<v Speaker 2>It is a claim that has strength and currency purely

3366
02:52:08.440 --> 02:52:09.600
<v Speaker 2>out of endless repetition.

3367
02:52:10.360 --> 02:52:10.840
<v Speaker 3>That's the thing.

3368
02:52:11.280 --> 02:52:14.559
<v Speaker 2>Even in the Nordics, the traditional Yule thing of cutting

3369
02:52:14.600 --> 02:52:16.680
<v Speaker 2>down a tree and bringing it they didn't do that.

3370
02:52:17.520 --> 02:52:19.680
<v Speaker 3>I don't know why they would, though. I would see

3371
02:52:19.760 --> 02:52:23.079
<v Speaker 3>them decorating a tree outside in the woods. In the woods,

3372
02:52:23.120 --> 02:52:25.040
<v Speaker 3>for sure, because they decorated a lot of the trees

3373
02:52:25.120 --> 02:52:27.920
<v Speaker 3>for the festivals, and they you know, they cut them

3374
02:52:27.959 --> 02:52:31.440
<v Speaker 3>down to be able to build stuff. But inherently you're

3375
02:52:31.959 --> 02:52:34.840
<v Speaker 3>more tuned with nature, So I don't see them just

3376
02:52:34.920 --> 02:52:36.959
<v Speaker 3>cutting it down and bringing it in for no reason.

3377
02:52:37.040 --> 02:52:40.040
<v Speaker 3>I could see them decorating the trees all outside, sure,

3378
02:52:40.319 --> 02:52:41.879
<v Speaker 3>and doing that kind of a thing.

3379
02:52:42.760 --> 02:52:44.840
<v Speaker 2>Well, let's get into it more, says once again. However,

3380
02:52:44.920 --> 02:52:47.600
<v Speaker 2>it seems this custom is relatively recent, not ancient, and

3381
02:52:47.719 --> 02:52:50.360
<v Speaker 2>not pigging in any way. The earliest evidence for a

3382
02:52:50.479 --> 02:52:53.760
<v Speaker 2>Christmas tree comes from the forestry regulations from the Rhineland

3383
02:52:53.879 --> 02:52:57.799
<v Speaker 2>cities of Sulfon and Bergen dating to the thirteen hundreds,

3384
02:52:58.000 --> 02:53:00.719
<v Speaker 2>so we're talking about Germany. Now, these put limits on

3385
02:53:00.799 --> 02:53:04.239
<v Speaker 2>people's collecting fur trees or branches in the period around Christmas.

3386
02:53:05.000 --> 02:53:08.120
<v Speaker 2>So long story short, we then get similar walls in

3387
02:53:08.159 --> 02:53:10.840
<v Speaker 2>the fourteen hundreds and also from the Upper Rhine region,

3388
02:53:10.920 --> 02:53:13.280
<v Speaker 2>limiting the number and size of trees people could take

3389
02:53:13.319 --> 02:53:16.239
<v Speaker 2>from the forest at Christmas. A couple of these specifically

3390
02:53:16.319 --> 02:53:20.159
<v Speaker 2>referred to them being used as decorated poles, probably much

3391
02:53:20.280 --> 02:53:23.440
<v Speaker 2>like may poles. Finally, in the fifteen hundreds we get

3392
02:53:23.520 --> 02:53:26.879
<v Speaker 2>descriptions of decorated trees or poles set up in public

3393
02:53:26.920 --> 02:53:30.879
<v Speaker 2>squares in cities in Latvia and Estonia. So I actually

3394
02:53:30.920 --> 02:53:33.360
<v Speaker 2>did more research into this. In the thirteen hundreds, it

3395
02:53:33.520 --> 02:53:35.840
<v Speaker 2>was so common for even the peasantry to go out

3396
02:53:35.920 --> 02:53:38.920
<v Speaker 2>into their lord's land and cut certain trees down to

3397
02:53:38.959 --> 02:53:39.760
<v Speaker 2>bring in to decorate.

3398
02:53:39.799 --> 02:53:41.280
<v Speaker 3>And again super Christian.

3399
02:53:41.319 --> 02:53:43.399
<v Speaker 2>At this time in the thirteen hundreds, there was already

3400
02:53:43.479 --> 02:53:44.959
<v Speaker 2>multiple crusades that had taken place.

3401
02:53:45.000 --> 02:53:45.319
<v Speaker 3>In all this.

3402
02:53:46.639 --> 02:53:48.719
<v Speaker 2>It was done to where they couldn't bring in a

3403
02:53:48.959 --> 02:53:50.239
<v Speaker 2>tree taller than seven foot.

3404
02:53:51.399 --> 02:53:54.040
<v Speaker 3>I forget, I actually looked into the tree thing long

3405
02:53:54.159 --> 02:53:56.879
<v Speaker 3>time ago, so I didn't actually look at any I

3406
02:53:56.959 --> 02:53:59.799
<v Speaker 3>knew you'd already have looked into this, but I remember

3407
02:53:59.840 --> 02:54:03.760
<v Speaker 3>the there is a story about where this actually came from,

3408
02:54:04.280 --> 02:54:06.200
<v Speaker 3>long long time ago, but it's a very it's a

3409
02:54:06.239 --> 02:54:10.159
<v Speaker 3>folk tale, so it's it's not. It's very obscure and

3410
02:54:10.360 --> 02:54:12.959
<v Speaker 3>most people don't hold me weight to it. But pretty

3411
02:54:13.040 --> 02:54:16.799
<v Speaker 3>much it's a story. It's a little short story about

3412
02:54:16.879 --> 02:54:19.719
<v Speaker 3>how this tree was sacred and how they brought it,

3413
02:54:19.920 --> 02:54:22.280
<v Speaker 3>like why they brought it in and why they decorated it.

3414
02:54:22.360 --> 02:54:24.239
<v Speaker 3>And they really didn't even decorate. They kind of just

3415
02:54:24.360 --> 02:54:26.799
<v Speaker 3>like put like little stuff up and little scraps up

3416
02:54:26.840 --> 02:54:30.040
<v Speaker 3>and stuff like that. But I don't know, it's it's

3417
02:54:30.079 --> 02:54:31.600
<v Speaker 3>been a long time since I read it, but it

3418
02:54:31.719 --> 02:54:34.760
<v Speaker 3>was way way, way way way back, but well before

3419
02:54:34.840 --> 02:54:37.639
<v Speaker 3>this time period, and it was like this little tiny

3420
02:54:37.760 --> 02:54:40.159
<v Speaker 3>story that there was a blip in this big book

3421
02:54:40.239 --> 02:54:42.399
<v Speaker 3>that I read about it, and it was kind of like,

3422
02:54:42.600 --> 02:54:45.319
<v Speaker 3>this is where we think it came from and why

3423
02:54:45.399 --> 02:54:47.760
<v Speaker 3>this kind of makes sense to us and why this happened.

3424
02:54:47.840 --> 02:54:50.600
<v Speaker 2>But and there may be something to that, especially in

3425
02:54:50.680 --> 02:54:54.040
<v Speaker 2>the in the northern Germany. I mean that there's all

3426
02:54:54.159 --> 02:54:56.879
<v Speaker 2>kinds of customs and traditions there that make no sense

3427
02:54:56.959 --> 02:55:00.159
<v Speaker 2>outside of that region. So I mean, who's to say it.

3428
02:55:00.200 --> 02:55:02.079
<v Speaker 3>Was it was? I wish I would have. I wish

3429
02:55:02.159 --> 02:55:03.959
<v Speaker 3>I know the actual name of the story. It's been

3430
02:55:04.000 --> 02:55:05.680
<v Speaker 3>a long time. It was in one of those books,

3431
02:55:05.959 --> 02:55:07.520
<v Speaker 3>you know, back in the day when we actually had

3432
02:55:07.600 --> 02:55:11.680
<v Speaker 3>like borders, yeah, Barnes and Noble. I'm talking like years ago.

3433
02:55:11.760 --> 02:55:15.239
<v Speaker 3>I read this and it was a It was a honestly,

3434
02:55:15.360 --> 02:55:17.719
<v Speaker 3>it was like a two page story, so it wasn't

3435
02:55:17.760 --> 02:55:19.879
<v Speaker 3>anything crazy. But they're like, this is where we kind

3436
02:55:19.920 --> 02:55:22.920
<v Speaker 3>of think this comes from. And I always thought years ago,

3437
02:55:22.959 --> 02:55:24.760
<v Speaker 3>I was like, hmm, I wonder if that's actually where

3438
02:55:25.079 --> 02:55:27.680
<v Speaker 3>trees come like this whole decorating of trees come from.

3439
02:55:28.120 --> 02:55:31.120
<v Speaker 2>Well, I mean, who's to say. It could be an

3440
02:55:31.159 --> 02:55:33.840
<v Speaker 2>old local folk lord it was.

3441
02:55:34.280 --> 02:55:36.239
<v Speaker 3>It was a folk lore. It was to ward off

3442
02:55:36.399 --> 02:55:39.159
<v Speaker 3>I think, spirits, and it had like another it was

3443
02:55:39.520 --> 02:55:41.239
<v Speaker 3>it was this little cabin in the wood, Like the

3444
02:55:41.280 --> 02:55:43.319
<v Speaker 3>picture that it had with it was this little cabin

3445
02:55:43.360 --> 02:55:45.360
<v Speaker 3>in the wood out in the middle of nowhere, and

3446
02:55:45.479 --> 02:55:48.120
<v Speaker 3>it had to do with the spirits, and it had

3447
02:55:48.159 --> 02:55:50.319
<v Speaker 3>to do with like this little this little old lady

3448
02:55:50.399 --> 02:55:52.559
<v Speaker 3>and two kids, and it was just like this. It

3449
02:55:52.680 --> 02:55:54.239
<v Speaker 3>was a really interesting little story.

3450
02:55:54.360 --> 02:55:58.360
<v Speaker 2>But and warding off spirits is not endemically Christian or pagan.

3451
02:55:58.920 --> 02:56:01.120
<v Speaker 2>All cultures have their own version of this. And if

3452
02:56:01.159 --> 02:56:03.760
<v Speaker 2>you question that, look at Gargoyle's on old Catholic churches.

3453
02:56:05.000 --> 02:56:08.319
<v Speaker 2>It goes across all cultural bounds, So if that is

3454
02:56:08.399 --> 02:56:11.600
<v Speaker 2>the origin story, it's not endemically one or the Other's

3455
02:56:11.639 --> 02:56:12.520
<v Speaker 2>just one of those things.

3456
02:56:12.920 --> 02:56:15.120
<v Speaker 3>No. I think it was just it was from this

3457
02:56:15.280 --> 02:56:18.719
<v Speaker 3>little bitty town and they had a little blurp of

3458
02:56:18.840 --> 02:56:21.079
<v Speaker 3>the story that they heard that it had been passed

3459
02:56:21.120 --> 02:56:22.879
<v Speaker 3>down and passed down and passed down, and so they

3460
02:56:22.959 --> 02:56:24.559
<v Speaker 3>kind of wrote down what they had heard from the

3461
02:56:24.639 --> 02:56:27.159
<v Speaker 3>locals and they're like, maybe this is where it comes from.

3462
02:56:27.239 --> 02:56:30.600
<v Speaker 3>And that was you know, but it's it's been like, honestly,

3463
02:56:30.760 --> 02:56:32.920
<v Speaker 3>like two decades, so it's been a long time since

3464
02:56:32.959 --> 02:56:34.719
<v Speaker 3>I read it, so Continuous says.

3465
02:56:34.760 --> 02:56:37.479
<v Speaker 2>By sixteen fifty seven, the practice have moved to private

3466
02:56:37.559 --> 02:56:41.200
<v Speaker 2>homes and was common enough for Protestant theologian Johann Conrad

3467
02:56:41.360 --> 02:56:45.879
<v Speaker 2>Donhauer to condemn Christmas trees as trifles and describe them

3468
02:56:45.920 --> 02:56:50.120
<v Speaker 2>as decorated with dolls and sugar. Exactly why the custom

3469
02:56:50.200 --> 02:56:53.239
<v Speaker 2>began is not clear. It could just be an extension

3470
02:56:53.239 --> 02:56:56.719
<v Speaker 2>of using evergreen branches as midwinter decorations, or it could

3471
02:56:56.719 --> 02:56:59.879
<v Speaker 2>be the medieval Christian Christmas Eve produced productions of the

3472
02:57:00.079 --> 02:57:03.159
<v Speaker 2>play of Atom with a tree of Paradise as its

3473
02:57:03.319 --> 02:57:07.559
<v Speaker 2>central prop usually a fur decorated with apples inspired the custom.

3474
02:57:07.799 --> 02:57:10.600
<v Speaker 2>Which that's another thing too, So back in these days,

3475
02:57:10.639 --> 02:57:13.600
<v Speaker 2>most of the people couldn't read, right, like the gift

3476
02:57:13.680 --> 02:57:17.959
<v Speaker 2>of the place. Yeah, the gift of illumination, i e.

3477
02:57:18.159 --> 02:57:21.120
<v Speaker 2>Being able to read was something only for the noble class.

3478
02:57:21.520 --> 02:57:24.680
<v Speaker 2>So how would you teach the peasantry about Jesus except

3479
02:57:24.760 --> 02:57:27.879
<v Speaker 2>give them plays? And so the story of the Play

3480
02:57:27.920 --> 02:57:30.479
<v Speaker 2>of Adam was very, very popular at this time, and

3481
02:57:30.559 --> 02:57:33.000
<v Speaker 2>it was done during the winter months as a celebration thing,

3482
02:57:33.079 --> 02:57:36.159
<v Speaker 2>especially because everybody's not going out into the fields, they're inside.

3483
02:57:36.959 --> 02:57:40.159
<v Speaker 2>And typically for the tree of the good of evil

3484
02:57:40.239 --> 02:57:42.399
<v Speaker 2>the fruit, excuse me, the tree of the knowledge of

3485
02:57:42.440 --> 02:57:45.360
<v Speaker 2>good and evil the fruit, they would need a tree

3486
02:57:45.559 --> 02:57:48.879
<v Speaker 2>to use as a prop. Typically they would cut down

3487
02:57:49.079 --> 02:57:51.200
<v Speaker 2>an evergreen tree and just kind of like place some

3488
02:57:51.319 --> 02:57:54.799
<v Speaker 2>apples in it. As the iconography. But there's that's kind

3489
02:57:54.879 --> 02:57:57.079
<v Speaker 2>of an idea of maybe where it came from, But

3490
02:57:57.120 --> 02:58:00.799
<v Speaker 2>there's actually no real backing to that one either. So

3491
02:58:01.120 --> 02:58:04.360
<v Speaker 2>this inspired that custom possibly. What we do know is

3492
02:58:04.399 --> 02:58:07.000
<v Speaker 2>that the earliest clear references to Christmas trees date to

3493
02:58:07.040 --> 02:58:11.440
<v Speaker 2>the early modern period. Claims of ancient pre Christian origins

3494
02:58:11.639 --> 02:58:15.840
<v Speaker 2>are fanciful Christmas trees had not become ubiquitous international custom

3495
02:58:16.159 --> 02:58:19.120
<v Speaker 2>they are today until the eighteen hundreds, after Queen Victoria

3496
02:58:19.200 --> 02:58:23.120
<v Speaker 2>made this previously German and Northern European custom fashionable across

3497
02:58:23.239 --> 02:58:26.440
<v Speaker 2>the English speaking world, also because she had German origins.

3498
02:58:26.959 --> 02:58:29.319
<v Speaker 2>It seems that because it was so common today, people

3499
02:58:29.399 --> 02:58:32.280
<v Speaker 2>assume it must have always been a traditional Christmas custom

3500
02:58:32.360 --> 02:58:35.120
<v Speaker 2>and so must be ancient and have Pagan roots. But

3501
02:58:35.200 --> 02:58:37.680
<v Speaker 2>there's just simply no evidence that this is the case.

3502
02:58:38.280 --> 02:58:40.079
<v Speaker 2>Most of the claims about the pagan origins of the

3503
02:58:40.159 --> 02:58:43.120
<v Speaker 2>Christmas trees are simply vague assertions, though the few people

3504
02:58:43.120 --> 02:58:46.280
<v Speaker 2>who try to make more specific claims can be highly creative.

3505
02:58:46.760 --> 02:58:49.079
<v Speaker 2>The idea that decorating a pine tree carried to the

3506
02:58:49.600 --> 02:58:52.399
<v Speaker 2>Temple of Cybel in Rome is the origin of the

3507
02:58:52.440 --> 02:58:54.799
<v Speaker 2>custom does not really work, given that this was done

3508
02:58:54.840 --> 02:58:58.079
<v Speaker 2>on March twenty second. When people attempt to claim Cato

3509
02:58:58.159 --> 02:59:01.079
<v Speaker 2>the Elder's instructions to cut oak polls for the cultivation

3510
02:59:01.200 --> 02:59:04.120
<v Speaker 2>of grape vines in midwinter in his second century BC

3511
02:59:04.280 --> 02:59:07.520
<v Speaker 2>farming manual, this is somehow related to the Christmas trees.

3512
02:59:07.559 --> 02:59:11.280
<v Speaker 2>To these people, its creativity is given a way to desperation.

3513
02:59:11.639 --> 02:59:15.440
<v Speaker 2>Christmas trees are a medieval Christian custom, not an ancient

3514
02:59:15.559 --> 02:59:19.840
<v Speaker 2>pagan one. So okay, there we have that we can

3515
02:59:19.920 --> 02:59:22.840
<v Speaker 2>get into Santa Claus. But honestly, there's so many different

3516
02:59:22.879 --> 02:59:25.040
<v Speaker 2>backstories to the Santa Claus thing. And that's the thing

3517
02:59:25.399 --> 02:59:27.799
<v Speaker 2>when we're talking about the American Santa Claus versus the

3518
02:59:27.840 --> 02:59:30.319
<v Speaker 2>French Papa Noel versus the Italian what was the name

3519
02:59:30.360 --> 02:59:34.920
<v Speaker 2>we learned last night, the Boga Pepero or something versus

3520
02:59:35.120 --> 02:59:40.120
<v Speaker 2>the British Father Christmas to the Russian Santa Cloch with

3521
02:59:40.280 --> 02:59:44.000
<v Speaker 2>his winter queen. There's so many different backgrounds to this one.

3522
02:59:44.479 --> 02:59:46.239
<v Speaker 2>I think we can all just kind of acknowledge that

3523
02:59:46.319 --> 02:59:50.040
<v Speaker 2>Santa Claus does not have pagan origins. If anything, that's

3524
02:59:50.159 --> 02:59:53.799
<v Speaker 2>just a culture thing country to country, So fair enough.

3525
02:59:53.879 --> 02:59:58.600
<v Speaker 2>Here there is that claim that the eight reindeer came

3526
02:59:58.680 --> 03:00:04.239
<v Speaker 2>from slept near right, which is Loki's son from when

3527
03:00:04.360 --> 03:00:07.600
<v Speaker 2>he turned himself into a female horse to stop the

3528
03:00:07.680 --> 03:00:09.959
<v Speaker 2>workhorse of the giant from creating the wall to keep

3529
03:00:10.000 --> 03:00:12.959
<v Speaker 2>the ice giants out, and slept near his eight legs.

3530
03:00:13.000 --> 03:00:15.920
<v Speaker 2>And during Ragnarok, Odin is supposed to ride slept near

3531
03:00:15.959 --> 03:00:18.959
<v Speaker 2>into battle, and that's clearly Odin is Sanna, and the

3532
03:00:19.040 --> 03:00:22.079
<v Speaker 2>eight legged slept near horse is the eight reindeer. Again,

3533
03:00:22.159 --> 03:00:25.360
<v Speaker 2>this is we are drawing at some very very thin

3534
03:00:25.799 --> 03:00:29.559
<v Speaker 2>threads of evidence to like back that claim. I think

3535
03:00:29.600 --> 03:00:32.600
<v Speaker 2>we can all, like actually with a logical brain, acknowledge that.

3536
03:00:33.799 --> 03:00:37.920
<v Speaker 2>So moving on, let's see, that's just kind of the

3537
03:00:37.959 --> 03:00:41.440
<v Speaker 2>conclusions on all of this. And again this kind of

3538
03:00:41.479 --> 03:00:43.520
<v Speaker 2>breaks it all down here. A lot of these things

3539
03:00:43.559 --> 03:00:48.079
<v Speaker 2>that people think are sober pagan are not at all

3540
03:00:48.200 --> 03:00:52.239
<v Speaker 2>pagan whatsoever, and if anything, are Christian in origin. And

3541
03:00:52.680 --> 03:00:56.600
<v Speaker 2>there is a disagreement whether the Pagans adopted some of

3542
03:00:56.639 --> 03:01:01.040
<v Speaker 2>these to seem like they were trying to keep their

3543
03:01:01.079 --> 03:01:05.520
<v Speaker 2>pagan roots and keep their people from becoming Christianized. I'm

3544
03:01:05.559 --> 03:01:08.399
<v Speaker 2>not sure if that's a how strong that claim is.

3545
03:01:09.239 --> 03:01:13.280
<v Speaker 2>But to say that the yule log or mistletoe, or

3546
03:01:13.440 --> 03:01:17.000
<v Speaker 2>Christmas trees, or gift giving or feasting or even December

3547
03:01:17.040 --> 03:01:22.200
<v Speaker 2>twenty fifth is pagan in origin, that's there's no credibility

3548
03:01:22.280 --> 03:01:23.360
<v Speaker 2>behind any of these claims.

3549
03:01:24.799 --> 03:01:27.399
<v Speaker 3>I feel, I honestly feel like it's the opposite, to

3550
03:01:27.479 --> 03:01:30.280
<v Speaker 3>be honest with you, Okay, what do you mean? I

3551
03:01:30.399 --> 03:01:36.399
<v Speaker 3>feel that this is Christianity adopted paganism or pagan I

3552
03:01:36.399 --> 03:01:39.840
<v Speaker 3>wouldn't even see pagan I would say winter Solstice traditions

3553
03:01:39.879 --> 03:01:42.920
<v Speaker 3>that potentially could have had, like you know, using evergreens

3554
03:01:43.000 --> 03:01:46.799
<v Speaker 3>or using different types of things to decorate and converting

3555
03:01:46.840 --> 03:01:52.120
<v Speaker 3>it into trying to meld Christmas and Mule or winter

3556
03:01:52.239 --> 03:01:57.239
<v Speaker 3>Solstice practices together to draw in more Pagans to becoming Christians.

3557
03:01:57.520 --> 03:02:00.000
<v Speaker 2>But was there any source, not even in that art

3558
03:02:00.040 --> 03:02:02.440
<v Speaker 2>or I'm asking you, is there any source to say

3559
03:02:02.479 --> 03:02:05.959
<v Speaker 2>that even the practitioners of Nordic paganism way back when,

3560
03:02:06.280 --> 03:02:09.719
<v Speaker 2>that they would bring evergreen trees into their homes, if anything,

3561
03:02:09.719 --> 03:02:11.159
<v Speaker 2>they would decorate him in the forest. And I agree

3562
03:02:11.159 --> 03:02:15.120
<v Speaker 2>one hundred percent with that. But the idea behind hell,

3563
03:02:15.440 --> 03:02:19.040
<v Speaker 2>the first Christmas tree properly decorated was done by Martin Luther.

3564
03:02:19.600 --> 03:02:20.719
<v Speaker 3>I know, I was just looking at that.

3565
03:02:20.920 --> 03:02:23.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's also pretty crazy. The first devout League guy

3566
03:02:24.000 --> 03:02:26.120
<v Speaker 2>to go against the Catholic Church is also the first

3567
03:02:26.200 --> 03:02:28.600
<v Speaker 2>dude to decorate a Christmas tree in Germany.

3568
03:02:28.879 --> 03:02:32.200
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. A famous piece of folklore credits the sixteenth century

3569
03:02:32.760 --> 03:02:36.479
<v Speaker 3>Protestant reform Martin Luther with the first being the first

3570
03:02:36.559 --> 03:02:39.120
<v Speaker 3>to put candles on the tree after being inspired by

3571
03:02:39.159 --> 03:02:40.719
<v Speaker 3>the side of the stars shining.

3572
03:02:40.479 --> 03:02:41.680
<v Speaker 4>Through an evergreen forest.

3573
03:02:42.200 --> 03:02:44.719
<v Speaker 3>Is noted, though that there is no definitive proof that

3574
03:02:44.799 --> 03:02:46.959
<v Speaker 3>he was actually the first, but he was commonly credited

3575
03:02:47.319 --> 03:02:51.879
<v Speaker 3>with making the practice more popular, and also because I

3576
03:02:51.959 --> 03:02:54.200
<v Speaker 3>was looking for I was looking for that story, honestly,

3577
03:02:54.319 --> 03:02:59.559
<v Speaker 3>it says Count Odin Vaughan Gorgas. One romantic legend from

3578
03:02:59.559 --> 03:03:03.200
<v Speaker 3>the seventh seventh century tells us of a cold hearted nobleman,

3579
03:03:03.440 --> 03:03:07.239
<v Speaker 3>Count Oda, who fell in love with a fairy princess.

3580
03:03:07.360 --> 03:03:10.079
<v Speaker 3>She appeared to him in a room where a magnificent

3581
03:03:10.159 --> 03:03:13.639
<v Speaker 3>tree stood, its branches glittering with diamonds and pearls. Though

3582
03:03:13.719 --> 03:03:16.440
<v Speaker 3>she eventually left him, he counted he continued to set

3583
03:03:16.520 --> 03:03:19.520
<v Speaker 3>up a tree, a lightened tree. Excuse me, every Christmas

3584
03:03:19.559 --> 03:03:22.479
<v Speaker 3>Eve in her memory is one of the is one

3585
03:03:22.520 --> 03:03:26.760
<v Speaker 3>of the German evolutions of folklore. The paradise tree is mentioned.

3586
03:03:26.799 --> 03:03:30.200
<v Speaker 3>I was looking for that small little story. I was like,

3587
03:03:30.559 --> 03:03:32.079
<v Speaker 3>can I find this story really quick?

3588
03:03:32.159 --> 03:03:36.799
<v Speaker 2>But also decorating a Christmas tree with candles inside your

3589
03:03:36.879 --> 03:03:38.799
<v Speaker 2>home that is fucking wild.

3590
03:03:39.120 --> 03:03:42.040
<v Speaker 3>It's not like they thought to probably put it in water,

3591
03:03:42.639 --> 03:03:44.719
<v Speaker 3>I mean, or had like a big enough pot to well,

3592
03:03:44.719 --> 03:03:46.680
<v Speaker 3>I mean they did, but they I don't think. They

3593
03:03:46.920 --> 03:03:48.559
<v Speaker 3>just were like, hey, you know what, let's put this

3594
03:03:48.719 --> 03:03:52.200
<v Speaker 3>pot of water to keep it alive. Bro Levage dries

3595
03:03:52.319 --> 03:03:53.520
<v Speaker 3>out so quick I.

3596
03:03:53.600 --> 03:03:57.680
<v Speaker 2>Have thrown freshly cut trees on a fire. They still

3597
03:03:57.760 --> 03:04:00.520
<v Speaker 2>take the fuck off. That sap is both yea like

3598
03:04:00.559 --> 03:04:04.399
<v Speaker 2>ancient gasoline. So for him to put candles, and I

3599
03:04:04.479 --> 03:04:06.280
<v Speaker 2>understand thea they didn't have electric lights. I get that

3600
03:04:06.399 --> 03:04:10.399
<v Speaker 2>decorating it with stuff cool cool broke candles on an

3601
03:04:10.479 --> 03:04:14.559
<v Speaker 2>evergreen bro You fucking wild, Martin Luther Okay.

3602
03:04:15.000 --> 03:04:21.319
<v Speaker 3>Allegedly, Apparently the Christmas tree in America really took off

3603
03:04:21.440 --> 03:04:23.680
<v Speaker 3>in New York City, the hub of Dutch and German

3604
03:04:23.760 --> 03:04:28.239
<v Speaker 3>and culture. Yeah, and tradition's final step for it, said,

3605
03:04:28.520 --> 03:04:33.239
<v Speaker 3>The tradition's final step for cultural practice to commercialize phenomenon

3606
03:04:33.399 --> 03:04:36.799
<v Speaker 3>came in December of eighteen fifty one. A woodsman from

3607
03:04:36.920 --> 03:04:41.600
<v Speaker 3>the Catskills called Mark Carr recognized the business opportunity and

3608
03:04:41.760 --> 03:04:44.440
<v Speaker 3>hauled two sleds loaded with fur trees to the street

3609
03:04:44.479 --> 03:04:46.959
<v Speaker 3>corner in New York City. He sold them. He sold

3610
03:04:47.040 --> 03:04:49.799
<v Speaker 3>all of them, becoming the first commercial Christmas tree vendor

3611
03:04:50.159 --> 03:04:54.399
<v Speaker 3>and solidifying the trees place as it ever, enduring at

3612
03:04:54.600 --> 03:04:58.120
<v Speaker 3>the Trees Place as an enduring American institution.

3613
03:04:58.799 --> 03:05:00.479
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's fair.

3614
03:05:00.680 --> 03:05:02.280
<v Speaker 3>I didn't actually know that, to be honest with you.

3615
03:05:02.319 --> 03:05:04.079
<v Speaker 3>I didn't know when it really made its way over

3616
03:05:04.200 --> 03:05:06.760
<v Speaker 3>here and how that really got started.

3617
03:05:06.959 --> 03:05:10.000
<v Speaker 2>To can continue on here this article from the Church Times.

3618
03:05:10.040 --> 03:05:12.920
<v Speaker 2>Here the Yule candle that is first mentioned in Scotland

3619
03:05:12.959 --> 03:05:16.120
<v Speaker 2>in eighteen oh eight, the Yule Games first mentioned in

3620
03:05:16.159 --> 03:05:19.959
<v Speaker 2>sixteen eleven, Yu'll log first mentioned in seventeen twenty five,

3621
03:05:20.559 --> 03:05:24.040
<v Speaker 2>and the Yule Tide is first mentioned in fifteen seventy two.

3622
03:05:24.600 --> 03:05:28.280
<v Speaker 2>All of these are super after the Christianization of Europe.

3623
03:05:29.040 --> 03:05:31.719
<v Speaker 2>So it's a lot of these. And yes, Yu'll being

3624
03:05:31.799 --> 03:05:35.920
<v Speaker 2>the season of the north to mark winter for its

3625
03:05:36.159 --> 03:05:39.399
<v Speaker 2>all of the winterness things, yes, one hundred percent, But

3626
03:05:39.520 --> 03:05:41.399
<v Speaker 2>there's so many sources to say that it is not

3627
03:05:41.600 --> 03:05:45.559
<v Speaker 2>in any way actually a pagan thing. It's just kind

3628
03:05:45.559 --> 03:05:49.600
<v Speaker 2>of one of those things. Now I'm talking about how

3629
03:05:49.680 --> 03:05:52.000
<v Speaker 2>December twenty fifth became Christmas. We kind of touched on

3630
03:05:52.040 --> 03:05:53.319
<v Speaker 2>it a bit. We really don't have to read this

3631
03:05:53.479 --> 03:06:00.040
<v Speaker 2>article here, but yeah, I mean to say that, but

3632
03:06:00.280 --> 03:06:03.120
<v Speaker 2>so many of our Christmas traditions are based in some

3633
03:06:03.360 --> 03:06:06.840
<v Speaker 2>sort of paganism. There's not much evidence to back that

3634
03:06:06.920 --> 03:06:10.200
<v Speaker 2>claim whatsoever. Your thoughts on this, Raven.

3635
03:06:12.120 --> 03:06:15.079
<v Speaker 3>I think it's interesting. I think that for so long

3636
03:06:15.120 --> 03:06:18.239
<v Speaker 3>we've been told that the story, the narrative that's been

3637
03:06:18.280 --> 03:06:21.479
<v Speaker 3>passed down is that all of this is from paganism

3638
03:06:21.920 --> 03:06:24.680
<v Speaker 3>or from pagans, and that this is uh, you know,

3639
03:06:24.799 --> 03:06:27.959
<v Speaker 3>inherently not a good thing because it's not from the Church. Right.

3640
03:06:28.479 --> 03:06:32.600
<v Speaker 3>So I think it's interesting that there's that the articles

3641
03:06:32.639 --> 03:06:35.760
<v Speaker 3>that you brought are saying that these are not pagan

3642
03:06:36.079 --> 03:06:38.639
<v Speaker 3>in root, that they are actually Christian root, and that

3643
03:06:39.559 --> 03:06:42.959
<v Speaker 3>the Church is the reason why for these specific traditions

3644
03:06:43.000 --> 03:06:46.559
<v Speaker 3>that have been believed and demonized as you know, inherently

3645
03:06:46.840 --> 03:06:50.000
<v Speaker 3>bad and they're weaponized against people that believe in anything

3646
03:06:50.079 --> 03:06:53.959
<v Speaker 3>other than Christianity or you know, Catholicism.

3647
03:06:54.399 --> 03:06:58.319
<v Speaker 4>And so I think it's a it's an interesting thing.

3648
03:06:58.399 --> 03:07:00.760
<v Speaker 3>I mean, I really did not believe. Honestly, I did

3649
03:07:00.840 --> 03:07:04.399
<v Speaker 3>not know. I still think it's interesting that scholars don't

3650
03:07:04.479 --> 03:07:07.000
<v Speaker 3>believe inherently or agree with each other that there's two

3651
03:07:07.000 --> 03:07:11.440
<v Speaker 3>different sides to this. But also history is what is

3652
03:07:11.520 --> 03:07:14.360
<v Speaker 3>written down and by who is it written like, who

3653
03:07:14.440 --> 03:07:17.639
<v Speaker 3>wrote it down? What influences do they have? The bias

3654
03:07:18.479 --> 03:07:21.559
<v Speaker 3>the biases that they showed what their background was, what

3655
03:07:22.000 --> 03:07:26.639
<v Speaker 3>information information was pertinent to them versus what actually was

3656
03:07:26.680 --> 03:07:28.959
<v Speaker 3>taking place. Did they speak the language correctly, did they

3657
03:07:29.079 --> 03:07:33.120
<v Speaker 3>understand all of the information. Who gave them the information?

3658
03:07:33.239 --> 03:07:35.159
<v Speaker 3>Did they go and actually observe with their own eyes

3659
03:07:35.239 --> 03:07:37.559
<v Speaker 3>or did they hear it secondhand? Did they you know?

3660
03:07:38.399 --> 03:07:42.719
<v Speaker 3>Everything about what we know is we don't know all

3661
03:07:42.879 --> 03:07:45.319
<v Speaker 3>of the historical context to it, So we only know

3662
03:07:45.479 --> 03:07:48.120
<v Speaker 3>I feel like a snibbet of what potentially would have

3663
03:07:48.239 --> 03:07:52.520
<v Speaker 3>been those winter solstice practices, and so at least if

3664
03:07:52.559 --> 03:07:56.719
<v Speaker 3>there is anything that was inherently from those cultures that

3665
03:07:56.920 --> 03:07:59.840
<v Speaker 3>is still around, it's still a good thing. I do

3666
03:08:00.120 --> 03:08:03.399
<v Speaker 3>think that maybe more people should get educated on this

3667
03:08:03.559 --> 03:08:07.239
<v Speaker 3>topic and stop believing that everything is of the devil,

3668
03:08:07.440 --> 03:08:09.680
<v Speaker 3>and anybody that believes in anything.

3669
03:08:09.440 --> 03:08:13.399
<v Speaker 4>Other than what they believe in is just evil inherent.

3670
03:08:13.639 --> 03:08:16.639
<v Speaker 3>I think it's we should all be practicing at least

3671
03:08:17.200 --> 03:08:21.440
<v Speaker 3>more customs that involve us at least recognizing that, you know,

3672
03:08:21.840 --> 03:08:25.120
<v Speaker 3>we we do belong here, and we do inherently live

3673
03:08:25.200 --> 03:08:27.479
<v Speaker 3>on earth, and we do connect with nature in many

3674
03:08:27.520 --> 03:08:30.000
<v Speaker 3>different ways, and so we should at least give some

3675
03:08:30.200 --> 03:08:32.399
<v Speaker 3>thanks to nature in and of itself.

3676
03:08:33.159 --> 03:08:35.399
<v Speaker 4>I don't feel like that is evil in any way possible.

3677
03:08:35.520 --> 03:08:39.000
<v Speaker 2>So no, same one hundred percent, even if you are

3678
03:08:39.040 --> 03:08:42.879
<v Speaker 2>a Christian acknowledging that nature is extremely important and extremely

3679
03:08:42.959 --> 03:08:45.680
<v Speaker 2>good for the soul. I don't think that takes away

3680
03:08:45.719 --> 03:08:48.239
<v Speaker 2>from your religious beliefs at all.

3681
03:08:48.520 --> 03:08:52.399
<v Speaker 4>But that being said, I do enjoy decorating my Christmas trees.

3682
03:08:52.440 --> 03:08:54.079
<v Speaker 3>I do have my yule logs out. I am a

3683
03:08:54.159 --> 03:08:56.879
<v Speaker 3>complex human being that likes to practicell different things, and

3684
03:08:56.920 --> 03:08:59.280
<v Speaker 3>I can't wait to put out the poop blog they bo.

3685
03:09:00.559 --> 03:09:04.079
<v Speaker 3>I'm so pumped about this damn pooplog. I think it's

3686
03:09:04.200 --> 03:09:06.120
<v Speaker 3>just like the best. It's so fun.

3687
03:09:06.639 --> 03:09:08.639
<v Speaker 2>I do have a log for you, but it's not massive.

3688
03:09:08.680 --> 03:09:09.280
<v Speaker 2>It's like this big.

3689
03:09:09.479 --> 03:09:11.559
<v Speaker 3>It's fine. We're gonna we're gonna make mini poop blog

3690
03:09:11.719 --> 03:09:15.280
<v Speaker 3>like it's gonna be great. It's baby snakes, little baby ones.

3691
03:09:15.319 --> 03:09:21.639
<v Speaker 2>I'm gonna have a little little little.

3692
03:09:19.879 --> 03:09:21.799
<v Speaker 3>Baby boo booz. I actually do have like a whole

3693
03:09:21.799 --> 03:09:23.440
<v Speaker 3>bunch of little babyluo boo booths. So I'm gonna have

3694
03:09:23.479 --> 03:09:27.879
<v Speaker 3>like the little ones coming out and like Christmas little

3695
03:09:27.959 --> 03:09:30.559
<v Speaker 3>Christmas hats on them like from the elves. That's gonna

3696
03:09:30.559 --> 03:09:33.319
<v Speaker 3>be awesome. No, yes, but as you're listening to this

3697
03:09:33.479 --> 03:09:36.879
<v Speaker 3>on Christmas, I hope you are enjoying your family, your friends,

3698
03:09:37.360 --> 03:09:40.360
<v Speaker 3>your time, and just you know, taking a moment to

3699
03:09:40.600 --> 03:09:43.879
<v Speaker 3>really just remember, you know what's important, whatever that is

3700
03:09:44.000 --> 03:09:47.879
<v Speaker 3>to you practice wise, you know, if you have a religion, if.

3701
03:09:47.760 --> 03:09:50.920
<v Speaker 4>You don't have religion. But yeah, that's kind of where I'm.

3702
03:09:50.799 --> 03:09:51.120
<v Speaker 3>At with it.

3703
03:09:51.479 --> 03:09:55.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean I agree. Honestly, we have done multiple

3704
03:09:55.639 --> 03:09:59.200
<v Speaker 2>episodes on this show about the pagan origins of Christmas,

3705
03:09:59.319 --> 03:10:02.239
<v Speaker 2>and I and look any deeper, to be honest, like

3706
03:10:02.319 --> 03:10:06.159
<v Speaker 2>some of them like okay, sure, the trees, the evergreens,

3707
03:10:06.159 --> 03:10:07.879
<v Speaker 2>it's because of this there or the third I had

3708
03:10:08.000 --> 03:10:11.799
<v Speaker 2>never done any more digging onto it. This with the

3709
03:10:12.000 --> 03:10:16.959
<v Speaker 2>backing and the citations and all of this. And that's

3710
03:10:17.000 --> 03:10:18.680
<v Speaker 2>something that I want all the good cult members to

3711
03:10:18.719 --> 03:10:21.200
<v Speaker 2>take with them, not just with the Christmas traditions, but

3712
03:10:21.319 --> 03:10:25.280
<v Speaker 2>with everything. Look at the citations and look at their biases,

3713
03:10:25.600 --> 03:10:28.280
<v Speaker 2>look at the years where they were written. For instance,

3714
03:10:28.600 --> 03:10:30.920
<v Speaker 2>I personally would take plenty of the Elder speaking on

3715
03:10:31.040 --> 03:10:33.799
<v Speaker 2>behalf of Rome as way more of a credible source

3716
03:10:33.879 --> 03:10:36.120
<v Speaker 2>than somebody writing about Rome in the eighteen hundreds.

3717
03:10:37.239 --> 03:10:38.360
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that being.

3718
03:10:38.280 --> 03:10:40.440
<v Speaker 2>Said, you gotta take plenty of the elder with a

3719
03:10:40.479 --> 03:10:42.159
<v Speaker 2>grain of salt. Because as he was writing about the

3720
03:10:42.239 --> 03:10:44.280
<v Speaker 2>druids and they were cutting down missletoe and they were

3721
03:10:44.319 --> 03:10:46.440
<v Speaker 2>giving it to people to drink or whatever the case was,

3722
03:10:46.959 --> 03:10:49.239
<v Speaker 2>keep in mind he was Roman, so he inherently hated

3723
03:10:49.280 --> 03:10:54.040
<v Speaker 2>the druids. So although he might have a first person

3724
03:10:54.079 --> 03:10:58.159
<v Speaker 2>account of them cutting missletoe down, was he giving them

3725
03:10:58.200 --> 03:11:00.600
<v Speaker 2>their fair due? Did he understand what they were doing

3726
03:11:00.680 --> 03:11:00.959
<v Speaker 2>or why?

3727
03:11:01.200 --> 03:11:01.680
<v Speaker 3>Clearly not.

3728
03:11:02.479 --> 03:11:05.799
<v Speaker 2>So all this is why the word context gets me

3729
03:11:05.920 --> 03:11:09.159
<v Speaker 2>so fucking worked up, because it's so important to everything

3730
03:11:09.239 --> 03:11:12.479
<v Speaker 2>we talk about. I'm just saying, especially when we're talking

3731
03:11:12.520 --> 03:11:16.879
<v Speaker 2>about ancient sources or religious texts, including the Sagas and Eda's,

3732
03:11:17.319 --> 03:11:20.360
<v Speaker 2>the context really matters. If you're reading it like a

3733
03:11:20.399 --> 03:11:22.639
<v Speaker 2>bedtime story, then like fine, you're only going to take

3734
03:11:22.680 --> 03:11:24.719
<v Speaker 2>it as a bedtime story. If you're looking for the

3735
03:11:24.840 --> 03:11:27.639
<v Speaker 2>lesson learned from that story, it has a lot more

3736
03:11:27.760 --> 03:11:32.079
<v Speaker 2>depth and meaning in the context behind everything really matters. So,

3737
03:11:33.239 --> 03:11:35.959
<v Speaker 2>good cult members, we want to hear from you. As

3738
03:11:36.079 --> 03:11:38.399
<v Speaker 2>Raven said, I hope that you are enjoying your Christmas.

3739
03:11:38.760 --> 03:11:42.040
<v Speaker 2>You're enjoying your festivities, whatever you are celebrating at this time.

3740
03:11:42.120 --> 03:11:44.760
<v Speaker 2>With your families, or your loved ones or whatever. I

3741
03:11:44.920 --> 03:11:47.120
<v Speaker 2>hope it's a good one. I hope you have a blast.

3742
03:11:47.200 --> 03:11:48.879
<v Speaker 2>I hope that you are safe, and I hope that

3743
03:11:48.959 --> 03:11:50.840
<v Speaker 2>you are getting fat and happy off of some good

3744
03:11:50.920 --> 03:11:53.319
<v Speaker 2>ass food. I think we can all agree on that,

3745
03:11:53.639 --> 03:11:57.479
<v Speaker 2>regardless of culture. So, with all this being said, good

3746
03:11:57.520 --> 03:12:00.600
<v Speaker 2>cult members, if you are looking to get your start

3747
03:12:00.639 --> 03:12:03.000
<v Speaker 2>in the buying and selling and trading of gold and

3748
03:12:03.159 --> 03:12:05.280
<v Speaker 2>silver bullion, than the best place to go is to

3749
03:12:05.399 --> 03:12:08.200
<v Speaker 2>go to the link in the description to coecsilver dot

3750
03:12:08.280 --> 03:12:10.079
<v Speaker 2>com and get your start today. Do you want to

3751
03:12:10.079 --> 03:12:11.680
<v Speaker 2>buy a little bit of golden silver, a lot of

3752
03:12:11.719 --> 03:12:14.479
<v Speaker 2>gold and silver? Listen, talk to your financial advisor, ask

3753
03:12:14.600 --> 03:12:17.440
<v Speaker 2>him what they earthed, her, what they think about the

3754
03:12:17.559 --> 03:12:19.440
<v Speaker 2>investing in precious medals, And I promise you they're going

3755
03:12:19.479 --> 03:12:20.719
<v Speaker 2>to tell you that at least a portion of your

3756
03:12:20.760 --> 03:12:23.920
<v Speaker 2>retirement portfolio needs to be invested in precious metals. We're

3757
03:12:23.959 --> 03:12:26.959
<v Speaker 2>not talking stock price, We're talking about having actual tangible

3758
03:12:27.079 --> 03:12:29.959
<v Speaker 2>silver and gold in your Handmail to your door once

3759
03:12:30.079 --> 03:12:31.360
<v Speaker 2>get the best place to get your start, but you

3760
03:12:31.399 --> 03:12:34.600
<v Speaker 2>go to CEC silver dot com. But good Colt members,

3761
03:12:34.639 --> 03:12:36.520
<v Speaker 2>we want to hear from you. What do you think

3762
03:12:36.520 --> 03:12:38.719
<v Speaker 2>about this episode. What do you think about these sources?

3763
03:12:39.200 --> 03:12:41.360
<v Speaker 2>What do you have that you hold as a Christmas

3764
03:12:41.440 --> 03:12:44.079
<v Speaker 2>tradition that may or may not have some sort of

3765
03:12:44.120 --> 03:12:45.719
<v Speaker 2>a background that most people don't know about.

3766
03:12:45.959 --> 03:12:48.079
<v Speaker 3>Let us know about it. The best place would be

3767
03:12:48.280 --> 03:12:49.360
<v Speaker 3>too Please.

3768
03:12:49.600 --> 03:12:51.520
<v Speaker 2>Hit the five stars, hit the shares like scotch comments,

3769
03:12:51.559 --> 03:12:53.319
<v Speaker 2>leave a post of reviews, shares at the friends and family,

3770
03:12:53.360 --> 03:12:55.719
<v Speaker 2>shares that we're here's the deal. The more activity the

3771
03:12:55.760 --> 03:12:58.440
<v Speaker 2>algorithm seats across all of our listening platforms, the more

3772
03:12:58.440 --> 03:13:00.719
<v Speaker 2>we get promoted, more potential listeners who can then become

3773
03:13:00.760 --> 03:13:03.040
<v Speaker 2>potential court members. Actor rest of you, fine ladies and gentlemen,

3774
03:13:03.239 --> 03:13:05.319
<v Speaker 2>why are you already? Go check out Menimistics Jonathan Show

3775
03:13:05.319 --> 03:13:06.639
<v Speaker 2>and give them the same lover respect over there with

3776
03:13:06.639 --> 03:13:08.559
<v Speaker 2>the five star reviews and the positivity in the comments.

3777
03:13:08.799 --> 03:13:11.120
<v Speaker 2>Come check out the Cajun Night and come join each

3778
03:13:11.200 --> 03:13:13.600
<v Speaker 2>of us for our individual Patreon lies we host every

3779
03:13:13.639 --> 03:13:15.719
<v Speaker 2>Wednesday night at nine pm Central. Links to those are

3780
03:13:15.760 --> 03:13:17.559
<v Speaker 2>in the description as well. And we thank you for

3781
03:13:17.600 --> 03:13:20.000
<v Speaker 2>everybody's already gone and have done so. And with all

3782
03:13:20.079 --> 03:13:20.840
<v Speaker 2>of this being.

3783
03:13:20.760 --> 03:13:22.840
<v Speaker 3>Said, we wish you a merry Christmas.

3784
03:13:23.120 --> 03:13:26.399
<v Speaker 2>Merry Christmas, a happy Yule a happy I'm not go

3785
03:13:26.520 --> 03:13:27.920
<v Speaker 2>whatever the fuck you're celebrating.

3786
03:13:28.200 --> 03:13:31.840
<v Speaker 3>We hope it's a goblin. And this happy Soltice whatever

3787
03:13:32.159 --> 03:13:34.719
<v Speaker 3>all of it blade when you read, when you hear this,

3788
03:13:34.799 --> 03:13:35.639
<v Speaker 3>it's seem to be blayed.

3789
03:13:35.719 --> 03:13:38.120
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, yeah, happy, happy, happy joy, joy to all

3790
03:13:38.200 --> 03:13:41.840
<v Speaker 2>the festivities. And this was another beautiful episode of the

3791
03:13:42.079 --> 03:13:43.559
<v Speaker 2>Cult of Conspiracy.

3792
03:13:44.040 --> 03:13:45.840
<v Speaker 3>And I am a Cajun night, I am ravingly.

3793
03:13:46.680 --> 03:13:49.559
<v Speaker 2>And there's one very important, extremely vital piece of information

3794
03:13:49.680 --> 03:14:08.399
<v Speaker 2>media learn just as soon as human if possible, sp