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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to having your leadership.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Chris and I'm Lorenzo.

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<v Speaker 1>And Lorenzo. On this episode, I want to go over

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<v Speaker 1>a listener question that we got on LinkedIn with a

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<v Speaker 1>person who messaged us asking how they go about solving

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<v Speaker 1>a problem they were having. They said that they have

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<v Speaker 1>kind of a diverse set of goals on their team.

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<v Speaker 1>They're different people on the team with different goals. How

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<v Speaker 1>do they go about making sure that there's alignment and

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<v Speaker 1>an agreement on what the desired outcomes are so that

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<v Speaker 1>everybody's working towards the same thing. And I think it's

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<v Speaker 1>a great question. It can it can rear its head

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<v Speaker 1>in terms of just you know, kind of individual day

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<v Speaker 1>to day things that can cause people going off in

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<v Speaker 1>different directions, or this can be you know, kind of

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<v Speaker 1>larger goals that inform a compensation or bonus strategy. So

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<v Speaker 1>I think it's important to be on the same page

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<v Speaker 1>with the with your teams and your peers and your coworkers.

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<v Speaker 1>But there's no way to completely eliminate this concept of

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<v Speaker 1>having different goals for different people, because there are different

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<v Speaker 1>positions in organizations that you might have you know, competing,

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<v Speaker 1>So this is it's an interesting question. I think it's

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of a lot of time pack here.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know, it immediately took me back to a

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<v Speaker 2>long time ago when I was a pro audio manager

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<v Speaker 2>at Guitar Center. It was one of those situations where

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<v Speaker 2>it's a team that you know, is a commission based team,

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<v Speaker 2>so selling things and making money on the margins of

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<v Speaker 2>the things that you sold was a big deal and

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<v Speaker 2>that's how people got paid. And I just remember taking

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<v Speaker 2>on that role. It was the first time I ever

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<v Speaker 2>kind of had a team that was in that model,

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<v Speaker 2>and really like the first time I was kind of

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<v Speaker 2>responsible for, like leading a team. I had worked in

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<v Speaker 2>other retail before, like MAM and pop music stores and

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<v Speaker 2>things like that, and I had given like keyholder duties

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<v Speaker 2>and you know, make sure that these tasks got completed,

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<v Speaker 2>not like responsible for a team working together. And you transfer,

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<v Speaker 2>you transported me back there because I remember like thinking, well,

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<v Speaker 2>how do I get them to work together? Because I've

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<v Speaker 2>got somebody that does like high end recording equipment. I've

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<v Speaker 2>got somebody that does like the keyboards. I've got somebody

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<v Speaker 2>who does the DJ gear. I've got somebody who does

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<v Speaker 2>like the microphones. I've got someone that does kind of

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<v Speaker 2>the table top digital recorders at that time. So I've

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<v Speaker 2>got all these specialists and people that have different things

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<v Speaker 2>that they're good at, different things that they're responsible for

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<v Speaker 2>growing from not just a business standpoint, but like their

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<v Speaker 2>own personal paycheck standpoint. And the path that I took was,

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<v Speaker 2>let me bring them all together. You know, we were

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<v Speaker 2>doing these trainings on Sunday mornings where we would bring

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<v Speaker 2>the team together, we talk about what was the upcoming

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<v Speaker 2>sales goals, what were some of the things that that

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<v Speaker 2>we wanted to make sure we were aware of, and

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<v Speaker 2>some of the promotions and whatnot. And I decided to

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<v Speaker 2>bring in some of the vendors and say, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>let's do vendor trading. Let's bring in people here to

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<v Speaker 2>talk about the equipment in the gear. Let's do it

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<v Speaker 2>together as a team. Let's spend some time there. But

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<v Speaker 2>more importantly, as we help customers, how can we better

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<v Speaker 2>leverage each other. So, and I use myself as the example.

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<v Speaker 2>If somebody comes in and says, hey, I want to

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<v Speaker 2>buy this really expensive mixing board for live music, I

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<v Speaker 2>knew that I knew something about it, but that that Blake,

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<v Speaker 2>he was the guy who really was the professional and

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<v Speaker 2>understanding mixing consoles and would have had all this experience,

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<v Speaker 2>but sometimes he didn't work every single day. So we

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<v Speaker 2>kind of had this thing where we worked it out

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<v Speaker 2>to say, well, hey, if Blake's not here, I'll kind

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<v Speaker 2>of take this lead. I will get the information, I'll

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<v Speaker 2>answer the questions that I can, and I'll have the

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<v Speaker 2>customer come back and speak with him the next day

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<v Speaker 2>that he's working. And so by doing that, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>I would get a small percentage if they bought something,

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<v Speaker 2>and then vice versa. If Blake is working the day

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<v Speaker 2>and somebody walks in they want to buy DJ gear,

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<v Speaker 2>and I'm not working or available at that moment, Blake

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<v Speaker 2>would answer questions, Blake would get them going, and then

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<v Speaker 2>I would be able to come in and have the

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<v Speaker 2>vast majority of the conversation and be able to sell

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<v Speaker 2>them the thing. And then Blake, we get a small

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<v Speaker 2>percentage of that. And we talk through this. And I

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<v Speaker 2>know that it's like it's a monetary way of building

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<v Speaker 2>a team and having teamwork, but I think it makes

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<v Speaker 2>sense even in spaces where maybe you're not working on commission,

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<v Speaker 2>where you really have to take the time to bring

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<v Speaker 2>the team together talk about how we're going to support

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<v Speaker 2>one another, talk about the fact that it's okay that

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<v Speaker 2>we all have individual goals, that we have things that

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<v Speaker 2>we're trying to do, that we may even have them

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<v Speaker 2>very personal because it might be our paychecks, but like

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<v Speaker 2>talk about the things that we're looking to accomplish and

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<v Speaker 2>then talk about how collectively we can make sure that

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<v Speaker 2>we get these things done because we all want to succeed,

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<v Speaker 2>and we all may have to step into different spaces

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<v Speaker 2>to help each other be successful. And it might not

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<v Speaker 2>be our main job that we have, but there may

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<v Speaker 2>be some time we can dedicate to help that person

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<v Speaker 2>accomplish that thing. And if we do this collectively, we

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<v Speaker 2>have a much better chance of moving things together and

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<v Speaker 2>having success as a team. And I think that's that

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<v Speaker 2>would be the first thing that kind of came across

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<v Speaker 2>my mind in the space, is like really taking the

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<v Speaker 2>time to bring people together and share what those goals are,

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<v Speaker 2>share what those objectives are, and share the fact that

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<v Speaker 2>we all want to be successful and by doing that

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<v Speaker 2>we have to work together.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think that's spot on the I think the

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<v Speaker 1>there's a misconception amongst leaders in a lot of places

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<v Speaker 1>and that misconception is that goals that are different must

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<v Speaker 1>be opposed to each other. Meaning if one leader is

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<v Speaker 1>bonused based on the amount of labor spent and one

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<v Speaker 1>leader is based on the amount of revenue brought in,

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<v Speaker 1>it could seem that the right thing to do for

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<v Speaker 1>one leader would be to have as few employees as possible,

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<v Speaker 1>and for the other leader it would be to have

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<v Speaker 1>as many employees as possible. But if at the end

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<v Speaker 1>of the day, the goal is the overall profitability, then

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<v Speaker 1>both of those leaders need to be cognizant of what

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<v Speaker 1>things impact the other leaders, so they're all working towards

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<v Speaker 1>the same goal. It doesn't mean that you can say, oh,

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<v Speaker 1>my goal is more important than your goal, because then

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<v Speaker 1>what you'll have is just leaders who feel like they're

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<v Speaker 1>always in competition with each other and not working together

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<v Speaker 1>as a team. It is more likely that both leaders

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<v Speaker 1>will fail to meet their goals if that's the mindset

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<v Speaker 1>they're taking towards it. But even if the goals from

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<v Speaker 1>a monetary or bonus standpoint are different from role to role,

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<v Speaker 1>because let's let's be real here, in an organization, you

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<v Speaker 1>might not have any control over what the bonus structure

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<v Speaker 1>is or or or you know or compensation structure is

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<v Speaker 1>or or the you know what ins whether or not

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<v Speaker 1>your review is written well or not, you might not

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<v Speaker 1>have any control over that, but you do have control

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<v Speaker 1>over the communication you have with your peers. You do

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<v Speaker 1>have control over the relationships that you have with your

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<v Speaker 1>peers and how you can work together to ensure that

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<v Speaker 1>nobody is thinking only for themselves and that everybody is

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<v Speaker 1>thinking about the business as a whole, because it is

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<v Speaker 1>very likely that you will win together or lose together.

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<v Speaker 1>And the more that you focus on just your one

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<v Speaker 1>particular goal, because that's the one you think matters the

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<v Speaker 1>most for your review or your bonus or whatever that is.

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<v Speaker 1>If you focus solely on that, you're not gonna be

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<v Speaker 1>there all the rest of the time, and you have

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<v Speaker 1>to rely on the other peers of yours that you

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<v Speaker 1>have to help you get to your goals, which means

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<v Speaker 1>you have helped them get to theirs too. And so

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<v Speaker 1>having that open dialogue in that communication that says we're

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<v Speaker 1>all going to work together and I'm not going to

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<v Speaker 1>prioritize my one personal goal over what it looks like

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<v Speaker 1>to have us all succeed together, it's very very important

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<v Speaker 1>to do, not just from a succeed succeeding standpoint, but

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<v Speaker 1>from a relationship standpoint. You don't want to have animosity

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<v Speaker 1>or or you know, negative energy between you and your

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<v Speaker 1>your peers. You want to make sure that it's all

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<v Speaker 1>positive and that you, uh, you feel like you have

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<v Speaker 1>each other's backs when in the absence of whoever is

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<v Speaker 1>not there that day.

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<v Speaker 2>It's such a big deal when it comes to to

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<v Speaker 2>really building the teamwork aspect of it. And again, I

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<v Speaker 2>think that there's always gonna be elements where it's not easy.

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<v Speaker 2>There's gonna be you know, like, there's gonna be days

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<v Speaker 2>when we're short tempered. There's gonna be days when you're

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<v Speaker 2>ahead of your objective and I'm behind on mine. There's

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<v Speaker 2>gonna be like, there's gonna be a lot of things

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<v Speaker 2>that in the people business are are gonna you know,

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<v Speaker 2>uh cause some tension in elements of that. But I

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<v Speaker 2>think a lot of it can be solved when you're

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<v Speaker 2>when you're willing to have that open dialogue, when you're

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<v Speaker 2>when you're you have some healthy debates, when when you're saying, hey,

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<v Speaker 2>we if we are at team, we have to move

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<v Speaker 2>as a team, and we have to talk about things

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<v Speaker 2>as a team, and that means that you know, objective

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<v Speaker 2>number one is making sure that we can all accomplish

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<v Speaker 2>the things that we're focused on. And then the next

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<v Speaker 2>meeting might not be so easy after you start that,

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<v Speaker 2>because you might find out that like, well, in fact,

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<v Speaker 2>maybe somebody wasn't helping their peer when they could have.

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<v Speaker 2>Maybe somebody still doing the habits of prioritizing their work.

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<v Speaker 2>And you have to work through those types of things.

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<v Speaker 2>And then you run at those situations where well, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>some of this work or this time of the year

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<v Speaker 2>or this project, you know, these things require less of

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<v Speaker 2>somebody's time and effort right now and more of somebody else's.

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<v Speaker 2>And then how much do you help that person? How

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<v Speaker 2>much can you afford to step out of your main

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<v Speaker 2>responsibility to help support somebody else on their main responsibility. Like,

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<v Speaker 2>these are real things that will happen in those conversations

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<v Speaker 2>and in those meetings. But I think that I think

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<v Speaker 2>that you have to do that. You have to create

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<v Speaker 2>the space to have those things. You have to be

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<v Speaker 2>able to be willing to address those issues as they

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<v Speaker 2>come up, and you have to really commit and pour

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<v Speaker 2>in your time as the leader to believe that that

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<v Speaker 2>working through those situations, working through those you know, those

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<v Speaker 2>debates slash arguments, and helping have a team learn how

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<v Speaker 2>to lift each other up in the in the shorter

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<v Speaker 2>term will have a long term payoff and it will

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<v Speaker 2>create a great cohesive team that is really focused on

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<v Speaker 2>understanding that like we we we are the collective of

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<v Speaker 2>our individual efforts, but when we win together, nothing feels

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<v Speaker 2>better than that.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you're right, I think I think there are two

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<v Speaker 1>different kind of scenarios here. I think if you're a

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<v Speaker 1>leader of leaders, then part of your job is to

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<v Speaker 1>make sure that these conversations are happening, that you are

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<v Speaker 1>that you are kind of enforcing the requirement of the

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<v Speaker 1>people who report up to you to have these conversations

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<v Speaker 1>and to work out how this will look so that

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<v Speaker 1>they all feel supported by each other and that none

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<v Speaker 1>of them feel like they are competing with each other.

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<v Speaker 1>If you are one of those people themselves who are

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<v Speaker 1>in a situation where you feel like a coworker or

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<v Speaker 1>a peer has a competing agenda and you want to

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<v Speaker 1>make sure that you are aligned, then talk to them.

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<v Speaker 1>Then it's on you, in the absence of your leader,

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<v Speaker 1>that you share with this other person facilitating the conversation.

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<v Speaker 1>For you to do that, and how that looks best

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<v Speaker 1>is to you for you to go to them and say, hey,

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<v Speaker 1>I can see based on where the numbers are that

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<v Speaker 1>you're falling short of your bonus or whatever it is

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<v Speaker 1>because of this number. What can I do to support you?

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<v Speaker 1>What can I do to help you? It starts out

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<v Speaker 1>by reaching out to that person to make sure that

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<v Speaker 1>they know that when you come in to do your job,

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<v Speaker 1>you're not just looking at what your job is. You're

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<v Speaker 1>looking at the collective jobs of all the people that

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<v Speaker 1>have to work together for the success of the big business.

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<v Speaker 1>And if you happen to, unfortunately be in a situation

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<v Speaker 1>where your organization has it set up to where you

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<v Speaker 1>have competing agendas that could lead to this kind of

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<v Speaker 1>butting of heads or animosity, that you have all the

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<v Speaker 1>control in the world to compete against that, you have

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<v Speaker 1>all the control in the world to not let that

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<v Speaker 1>be the situation, even if on paper it looks like

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<v Speaker 1>that's what it is. And that is done by having

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<v Speaker 1>those conversations. It's done by proactively talking to your peers

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<v Speaker 1>or your coworkers to make sure that they know that

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<v Speaker 1>you have their back, and that will be met almost

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<v Speaker 1>universally with the exact same reciprocation from them when it

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<v Speaker 1>comes time to they have the opportunity to do it

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<v Speaker 1>for you they need to, but if they see it

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<v Speaker 1>coming from you first, they will feel almost if they're

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<v Speaker 1>a good person, almost obligated to do the exact same

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<v Speaker 1>thing for you. And you'll be surprised how quickly both

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<v Speaker 1>of your results rise when you're both working together as

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<v Speaker 1>opposed to thinking about, you know, how can I just

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<v Speaker 1>help myself?

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely? And with that it brings us to this episode's

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<v Speaker 2>women a hack. But first, if you've worse from our sponsors.

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<v Speaker 1>All right for this episode, what manhakers or want you

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<v Speaker 1>to do. If you're a leader of leaders, it is

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<v Speaker 1>your job to make sure that the people reporting up

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<v Speaker 1>through you on your team, who may have individualized goals,

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<v Speaker 1>that they are well versed in knowing what the individualized

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<v Speaker 1>goals are of their coworkers and their peers, so that

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<v Speaker 1>they can pick up the slack for each other when needed,

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<v Speaker 1>and so that they are informed intimately on how each

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<v Speaker 1>of those individualized goals impact the overall team goal as

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<v Speaker 1>a whole, Because even though each of them might have

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<v Speaker 1>different disciplines or different rules or responsibilities as far as

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<v Speaker 1>insurance success on one item or one measure or metric

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<v Speaker 1>or scorecard. If they all have individualized ones, what your

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<v Speaker 1>organization is saying is that all of these things matter,

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<v Speaker 1>and it's really difficult to you know the old adage,

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<v Speaker 1>when it's everybody's job, it's nobody's job. That's a that's

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<v Speaker 1>a real thing. And so organizations can have a tendency

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<v Speaker 1>to assign individualized jobs to individualized people. But that's from

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<v Speaker 1>an accountability standpoint and a responsibility standpoint to make sure

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<v Speaker 1>that you can go to a person the other where

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<v Speaker 1>does the buck stop? Who do I talk to about

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<v Speaker 1>making sure that this thing is done? That's why those

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<v Speaker 1>goals might be individualized, but that doesn't mean that the

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<v Speaker 1>other things are not the responsibility of each other. It

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<v Speaker 1>just means that at some point there is a person

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<v Speaker 1>who it's their responsibility to ensure this thing gets done.

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<v Speaker 1>And as a leader of leaders, you need to make

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<v Speaker 1>sure that all of your people know how to speak

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<v Speaker 1>to all of those things, because all of those goals

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<v Speaker 1>are important and they all inform the overall success of

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<v Speaker 1>the team. If each of your people can't speak intimately

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<v Speaker 1>to that or how they can do things to positively

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<v Speaker 1>impact not just their own goals, but the goals of

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<v Speaker 1>their team members. Then you need to spend some work

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<v Speaker 1>there because they need to be able to speak to it.

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<v Speaker 1>Almost like if a person was watching from the outside,

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<v Speaker 1>they wouldn't be able to tell which of your people

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<v Speaker 1>was responsible for which thing, because they all talk about

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<v Speaker 1>all of those things in a way that implies they

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<v Speaker 1>all feel personal ownership towards them and they're all working

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<v Speaker 1>towards the same goal.

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<v Speaker 2>Some things are easier than other things. I think that

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<v Speaker 2>when you have businesses that run day to day where

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<v Speaker 2>there are tasks that need to kind of be completed

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<v Speaker 2>each day, and you can people have different responsibilities, you

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<v Speaker 2>can kind of you know, delegate them out, and you're

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<v Speaker 2>gonna have some overlap so that the collective can like

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<v Speaker 2>measure the accomplishment day by day. Then that makes it

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<v Speaker 2>a little bit easier to kind of bring that team

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<v Speaker 2>together and have the common goal of well, before today

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<v Speaker 2>wraps up, all these things have to be done regardless

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<v Speaker 2>of who's here or what's going on, So like we're

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<v Speaker 2>gonna work together to accomplish this. It becomes much more

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<v Speaker 2>difficult when you have longer term deadlines, bigger, larger projects,

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<v Speaker 2>things that will take time and follow up and checks

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<v Speaker 2>where people are very much immersed in their responsibilities for weeks,

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<v Speaker 2>if not months, Like, there's definitely more difficulty there because

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<v Speaker 2>you can't find those shorter term kind of celebration points

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<v Speaker 2>of like, look, see we did it together as a team,

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<v Speaker 2>didn net feel great, Let's do it again tomorrow. Look

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<v Speaker 2>at that way we did it as a team, like

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<v Speaker 2>you kind of like you really have to make sure

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<v Speaker 2>that as a leader that you are make sure you're

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<v Speaker 2>checking in on those milestones and then celebrating those milestones

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<v Speaker 2>that are happening, especially when you see their right behavior,

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<v Speaker 2>when you see the team starting to work together, when

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<v Speaker 2>you see somebody flexing into another space to help them

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<v Speaker 2>with that thing, you have to be able to call

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<v Speaker 2>that out and keep that top of mind to make

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<v Speaker 2>sure that you're adding fuel to that strategy around feeling

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<v Speaker 2>really great about you know, when the collective team has

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<v Speaker 2>a big win, right.

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<v Speaker 1>And especially when it's individualized, so it's not hey, if

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<v Speaker 1>Chris does something to help out Lorenzo, but the leader

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<v Speaker 1>that we share calls out Lorenzo for the job that

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<v Speaker 1>they did to get this thing done. Then that isn't

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<v Speaker 1>the right thing to do. The right thing to do

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<v Speaker 1>is to call out Lorenzo for getting that thing done,

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<v Speaker 1>but also to call out Chris for helping to make

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<v Speaker 1>sure that thing got done. So it's a it's an

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<v Speaker 1>individualized recognition combined with a team recognition because at some

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<v Speaker 1>point Lorenzo's responsible for this goal, and so the recognition

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<v Speaker 1>that it got done is there. But maybe the work

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<v Speaker 1>that Lorenzo did on that goal wasn't direct work on it.

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<v Speaker 1>Maybe the work that Lorenzo did on the goal was

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<v Speaker 1>relationship work amongst his peers to ensure that they were

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<v Speaker 1>all aligned and on the same page. So he had

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<v Speaker 1>people kind of working on his behalf all the time,

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<v Speaker 1>even when he wasn't there. That work is could arguably

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<v Speaker 1>be more important than the direct work Lorenzo could have

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<v Speaker 1>done on that goal, you know, himself. And so recognition

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<v Speaker 1>for the job being done can't just stop at what

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<v Speaker 1>the metric was and that it was accomplished. It needs

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<v Speaker 1>to go deeper into the how it was done. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>congratulations to Lorenzo for getting this done. I know that

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<v Speaker 1>you've worked really hard over the last three or four

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<v Speaker 1>months to make sure that you have that your peers

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<v Speaker 1>are informed on what it takes to hit these goals.

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<v Speaker 1>And I've seen the efforts out of them working on

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<v Speaker 1>your behalf to get this done, and I've seen you

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<v Speaker 1>do it for them too. That kind of process is

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<v Speaker 1>just as important as the fact that you got the

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<v Speaker 1>goal to begin with. So as a leader, it's your

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<v Speaker 1>job to make sure that you're recognizing not just the

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<v Speaker 1>right things, but recognizing them publicly in a way that

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<v Speaker 1>clarifies this is what is important to you. And what's

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<v Speaker 1>important to you is not just that you get the

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<v Speaker 1>goal accomplished, but how you got it done, because the

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<v Speaker 1>behaviors that got you there are going to be the

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<v Speaker 1>ones that are replicable even in times when the numbers

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<v Speaker 1>might be harder to meet.

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, and with that it brings us to the end

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<v Speaker 2>of this episode is a Hackey leadership. I'm Lorenzo and

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Chris, and we'll talk to you all next time.