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Speaker 1: Understand the thinking atheist. It's not a person, it's a symbol,

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an idea.

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Speaker 2: The population of atheists this country is going through the.

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Speaker 1: Rule, rejecting faith, pursuing knowledge, challenging the sacred. If I

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tell the truth, it's because I tell the truth, not

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because I put my hand on a book and made

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a wish and working together for a more rational world.

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Speaker 2: Take the risk of thinking. Feel so much more happiness. Truth,

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Fusian wisdom will come to you that way.

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Speaker 1: Assume nothing, question everything, and start thinking. This is the

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Thinking Atheist podcast hosted by Seth andrews.

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Speaker 3: Oh.

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Speaker 2: I woke up cranky today, he ever, just wa wake

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up cranky for no reason that you're aware of. You

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can't think, well, there's one trigger. There's something that bothered me.

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I saw a news report or had an argument or whatever.

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You just woke up cranky. That's me. Natalie's like, well,

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something must have upset you. What specifically happened. I can't

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put a finger on it and just grabby. Don't have

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any bandwidth, short fuse, not in the mood. I know

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you know exactly what I'm talking about. I know it.

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Some days you think maybe this is not the day

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I should be having personal encounters. They shouldn't be going

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out and dealing with people. And it passes. It usually passes,

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but it's like you wake up wrong. I woke up wrong.

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So that's what you got to today. This is what

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you're stuck with. My apologies in advance. Yeah, maybe I

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should have. Actually, we got Chinese food yesterday, and of

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course always comes with a little fortune cookie, and I

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ask for extra because I love the taste of a

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fortune cookie. Maybe my fortune is going to be a

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good one. Hang on, let me see what my fortune is.

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I purposefully left it sealed and wrapped so this would

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be a surprise for both of us. I'm sure this

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will be some sort of a sacarin horror effects evergreen

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kind of thing. But let's see what it says. Okay,

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regularly engage in acts of kindness and generosity. Yeah, yeah,

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today's not the day. Fortunately, I now have a fortune cookie.

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Just knock on the day, call me if you'd like

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to talk about something today. I enjoy these sort of

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popa reshows. I do themed broadcast. Sorry I'm still chewing.

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I do theme to broadcast. Last week we talked to

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a spiritual atheist and we've done stuff on Christian nationalism.

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We debunk the Bible with Justin de Z I like

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the themed stuff, and then we break it up with

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just Poe Poree shows where you decide what we want

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to chat about. And there's so much going on in

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the world. Everybody's still talking about the Super Bowl, Bad Bunny, etc.

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And the Epstein files. Jamie Raskin is grilling Pam Bondy

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at the time of our conversation today over the fact

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that the government was required to make all the files available.

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It has not, and the files that it has made

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available are so heavily redacted that they scream cover up. Plus,

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while they were required by law to cover up the

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names of the victims, many of whom have not previously

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been known. They are anonymous for a reason. They are

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victims who do not want to be known publicly. Those

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names have been released, and the perpetrates are being redacted

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and blanked out and covered up. And what the actual

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hell and where is the bad Bunny level of outrage? Oh?

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Worst super Bowl halftime show ever, worst ever, not a

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word of English all these people. But it's funny because

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all the people who were pissed off about Bad Bunny

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you can tell that they didn't watch the kid Rock

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Alternative show at Turning Point, USA, because they were bitching

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about all the specific stuff at the Super Bowl, which

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had a record audience for the halftime. And I watched it.

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Did I understand a word of what he was singing? Hell? No,

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I don't speak Spanish do I kind of wish there

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had been some subtitles so I can understand what was

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being sung. Okay, cool, But I wasn't threatened by it.

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I wasn't bothered by it. I thought it was kind

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of awesome. And then when I saw the symbolism and

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so much of what was going on, like the power lines,

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at first I wasn't connecting the dots. Well, that was

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a referendum on the fact that the United States had

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left Puerto Rico essentially in the dark on the power

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grid after the massive storms devastated the area. We just

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left him hanging. And you know the messages about love

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and inclusion, right, the only thing more powerful than hate

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is love. We are all Americans. These are not controversial

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points of view, and part of me is like, why

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not mix it up, Let's get a variety of cultures.

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Why would thirteen minutes be threatening to anybody who wasn't

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already in outrage mode. This is a culture disperate to

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be persecuted, right. I didn't see one white face during

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that halftime show. This is an outrage. I'm just like,

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what's wrong with people? Why wouldn't you? And I said,

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that's kind of cool. It's different. We are celebrating part

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of our culture. Oh I wish they'd have brought an

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American on, And I'm like, do you understand that Puerto

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Rico was part of America? You know, it's a we're

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all America anyway, and the listing of the Americas, you know,

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and just the whole vibe is positive. Who can turn

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a positive and do a negative? Who can take the

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bright cloud and find the dark lining? Right, the silver

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cloud with the black lining? Who can find that better

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than freaking outrage culture? Megan Kelly lost her mind over

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the super Bowl, and I am here for it. I'm

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here for it. Let her wail and gripe and bitch

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and I just knock you to knock yourself out. Of course,

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I saw a lot of people who were like, well,

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I don't watch football because I'm like, you know, this

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kind of superior thing. I don't really watch football either.

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So what somebody likes football, let him like football. I

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think we've all got our distractions. You know, you do

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sci fi television, you collect stamps, you do collectibles. You

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know you work on cars, you play dungeons, and I

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can who gives a shit? Find what you love and

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stop dissing other people. If they happen to love football.

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I'll watch the game and enjoy it. I kind of

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get it fine, And I follow the NFL. It's not

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really my bag. I get around people and they're talking specifics.

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You know, so and so ran for one hundred and

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thirty yards and someone shows a candidate for the MBF

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Trophy of the Hall of Fame of the dah blah,

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and I just drool at them. I'm like, if we

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were talking about Classic star Trek, I can play. I

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can do that. But if you're asking me about football stats,

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fantasy football, way over my head. But I don't look

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at them with that eyebrow of judgment and go, you

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drugla DUTs, you primitive, primitive people who love football. You

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like football? Great? Do you think stop being freaking snobs

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about everything? Anyway? I digress. Sorry, I just got a

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text from a friend of mine who is traveling in Florida,

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and so this is a random thing. She sends a

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message to Natalie and Me with an update, And here's

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what I'm doing down in Florida. A friend of mine

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gave me this little tidbit of information that I did

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not previously know. Apparently, in Florida, when the temperatures drop

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below what fifty iguanas will fall from the sky. Really

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wait a minute, lizard rain. Lizard rain in Florida. And

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I guess this is legit. I'm gullible, you know, so,

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I mean, I'll believe a lot of stuff. Apparently they

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go into a kind of hibernation way up in the

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branches of whatever tree they happen to be in because

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it's freaking cold, and then they hit the ground motionless,

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and they look down. They are not dead, and people

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have to be told don't like bury throwaway the iguana

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body because it's still alive. And he just took a

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very long fall because the weather made him freeze. He

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goes into a lizard coma. I did not know this

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was a thing. I have learned some new information that's

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wild to me. It's wild. Back to the Super Bowl, sorry.

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Back to the super Bowl, and again the phone lines

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are open. If anybody wants to talk about whatever's on

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their mind, I would love to talk to you. There

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were a ton of commercials about A. Now Big Tech

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is really trying to shove AI down our throats. I

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just read that Mozilla Firefox is going to be the

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first high profile web browser that's going to allow people

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to opt out of AI options, which I think it's

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about freaking ton because every time I pull up a

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search engine, it says AI, and then if I search

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for something, the first answer is AI, and I'm like, well,

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I would rather have a vetted, reputable source, thank you

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very much. I can't trust AI. Maybe it's a guide

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that points me in a certain direction toward a reputable source,

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but I'm I don't trust it, and with good reason.

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And Big Tech has put so many of their cards

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on AI investing. They have had major, major investors put

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billions and billions of dollars into AI because they are

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all expecting a suite return. And yet there are warnings

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everywhere about an AI bubble, like the dot com bubble,

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It's going to spike for a few and then it's

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going to fall apart. People are not buying what AI

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is selling. I mean overall, overall, in very specific ways.

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I know a lot of people who enjoy chad GPT.

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I've used it myself, we've all dabbled in it. But

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people are resentful and they're resisting and distrustful. So we're

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watching all the Super Bowl commercials. The best one, I

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think was the Budweiser commercial with the eagle and the horse.

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It was so beautiful, But a lot of the other

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ones were about AI. One of them was about a

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lost dog and AI cameras ring cameras, which are these

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doorbell cameras and you know, you ring them and then

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you know, the person in the house can see who's

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on the porch. It's a security thing, a convenience thing. Well,

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now apparently there's a mode for lost dogs where the

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camera can be on or activate if a dog wanders

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into your yard or on the porch, and then that

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ring camera talks to all the other ring cameras and

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then the dog is maybe identified and the owner is

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discovered and the dog is returned home. So the idea

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behind the commercial was this is amazing technology because little

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Fifi is going to be able to find a safe

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way back to his or her parents. And on the surface,

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I understand what they were trying to do. But I

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watched it, and apparently millions of other people watched it,

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and they got the chills because they didn't just see

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little Fife getting found and returned safely home. They saw surveillance,

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state surveillance, state camera's watching everywhere, facial recognition, reporting, reporting reporting.

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Are you added than to a database we know to

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a degree it's already happening. Right You can't even drive

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your car under a light pole or a bridge without

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having your license plate documented. Did you ever see those

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shows where somebody's trying to escape the law and they're

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in a vehicle and cameras pick up a license plate

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number three states away and immediately the Feds know where Tom.

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It's already happening. There's probably a satellite overhead right now

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watching me. I mean, I'm not opposed to using new

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technology to find a lost dog. I mean, what are

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the tanks that you can embed in their collars and

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then if they do happen to run away, there is

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a way to log on and GPS them so you

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can see them wherever they're wandering about. You can go

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find them. I mean, that's I think a little bit

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different than Hey, let's you scan everybody who approaches your

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property and then add them to a database which is

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shared and utilized and even monetized by somebody. I mean,

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that's that's kind of a different conversation. Anyway, let's talk

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to you. I've got Brian on the line at nine

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to eight. Brian, are you there?

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Speaker 4: Hi, Seth. I've listened to your show on and off

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for a little while, and I hear a lot of

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things that you say that have really resonated with me,

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and so I just fancied Colin in today while I

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was out uber driving to kind of get your opinion

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on something. It kind of deals with some things that

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you've said in videos that have been I think several

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months back, regarding how we relate to people that supported

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Trump in twenty twenty four. One of the things that

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came out in your videos, you said that they had

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invited an arsonist into your house, And I guess I

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kind of have always had that sentiment because I feel

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like I was able to recognize a lot of what

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was going on even before Trump was on the scene.

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I think probably you and a lot of people were

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able to as well. You know, even back in like

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two thousand and nine, when we started to see like

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the noise that the Westboro Baptist Church was making and

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the Birtherism movement, we saw these strains of the Ku

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Klux Klan and the rise of American fascism, and I

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was telling everybody around me, those are Nazis. They're just

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waiting on a Hitler at this point, and I felt

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like it could have been Rick Santorum in twenty twelve,

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but it turned out that it took four more years,

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and it was much much more disappointing because it had

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to have that sad like deflated americanized mythology that only

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the stupidity of early twenty first century reality television could create.

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And so I feel like at this point, with everything

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that we've seen, that somebody who voted for Trump in

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twenty sixteen could have been stupid. They could have just

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been dumb. And even in twenty twenty, after the ludicrous

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speech that he gave on the fourth of July and

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the kerfuffle and Lafayette Square, you were likely evil, but

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you still could have just been seriously, seriously dumb. But

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after the events of January sixth and espousing all of

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these Nazi influencers and everything support for him in twenty

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twenty four, With all of that information on the table,

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I feel like has really nailed a lot of people

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that I grew up around, and even people that I've

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been friends with for my whole life in a category

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where you are either so evil that you are just irredeemable,

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or you're so catastrophically and dangerously stupid that any reasonable

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adult in the room has to treat you as though

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you are evil because agency on your part in the

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world at large is just going to end up killing

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people completely unnecessarily and for unbelievably dumb reasons.

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Speaker 3: And watching all.

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Speaker 4: This unfold and this kind of feeds into the question

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that I want to ask, and the opinion that I

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wanted to get from you is I've got a five

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year old daughter, she'll be six very soon, and I'm

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staring at the barrel of this burgeoning Christian nationalism the

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eyes of a parent that's witnessing these people trying to

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take hold for reasons that, you know, beyond just like

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hating people that are a different color than them. Many

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of them also seriously hate women, and it tears me

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up because when I look at this realistically, I view

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all of these people supporting him, really, no matter what

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reasons they supported him for, as people who essentially have

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fired a gun at my child, and it fills me

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with just frightening levels of rage. I didn't know that

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I could be this angry at people, and it scares me,

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and it also has kind of kickstarted me to this

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kind of frantic like you know, what can I do?

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I think a lot of us are probably in that

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headspace where we're like, what can we do to make

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a difference? What can we do to course correct? And

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lately I've been considering getting into politics, trying to run

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for some kind of office. I'm a white guy. I'm

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a straight white guy, and because of this, you know,

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if we put all of the moral problems with MAGA

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aside and we just look at the hard arithmetic reality

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that we live in a country that has admitted that

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it would rather elect possibly its worst white man than

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one of its best and brightest women of color, I

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wonder if right thinking white guys kind of have a

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responsibility to try and get to the front. And I

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worry as well about my particular motivations, if that motivation

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is informed by an urgency that came from this gut

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churning rage that I'm dealing with. I wonder like, if

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we're just talking about any random gray blob of a person,

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do you think somebody like that should even consider running

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for office in this country?

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Speaker 2: I think circumstances. I'm not sure if I like the

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word radicalize, although it does happen, but they activate. I mean,

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I'm like, if you're not angry, you're not paying attention

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the fact that you are feeling to your marrow. That

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kind of anger means that you have a compass and

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that it does matter, and you're thinking beyond yourself. You're

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thinking about your family, You're thinking about your human family.

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You're outraged at the outrageous that's motivated a lot of

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people to move out into activist circles, including politics. I

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wouldn't discard that at all. You don't sound like someone

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who is leading with unchecked rage, where it's just raw, unfettered,

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unconsidered emotion. I feel like you have reasoned through why

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this stuff makes you so angry, and it resonates. I

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think your words actually resonate with a lot of people

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who are listening now, they're like, yes, I know exactly

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what he means. I would support that in a candidate,

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some kind of a leader somewhere who was able to

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give voice to the rest of us. I think that's

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totally valid. It's almost like when you come out of religion,

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some people apologize. You know, I went through my angry

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phase when I left religion. Well, anger is totally understandable.

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You are angry at the fact that you would waste

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the time. You're angry at the fact that you aren't

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being treated fairly by the fundamentalists who are taking you

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not very seriously on your journey or cutting you off.

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Anger then motivates you to want to go out and

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make the path easier and better for other people. I

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think that's totally valid. I think those reasons are just

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as valid, if not more than any others. Embrace it

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as long as it doesn't overwhelm, consume, and ruin you.

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I think anger is an understandable and often productive thing.

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I get angry as well.

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Speaker 4: Okay, well, thank you so much for your time. Seth's

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that's all I wanted to ask.

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Speaker 2: Well, you're very kind. I don't I mean, I'm not

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an expert, but I am an activist who has come

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out of high control environments, and I've been watching what's happening,

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and I'm angry and it motivates much of what I do.

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Doesn't make me irrational, it just means I'm I got

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my eyes open. So hang in there, Brian. Appreciate you

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so much. How many people saw an injustice and they

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were outraged. Christy Burke I mentioned her friend of mine

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who is running for office. She was outraged. Former fundie

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Christian who is now a freethinker online, has her own

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YouTube channel and has done a lot of good work

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out there helping others to deconstruct his seeing the rise

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of Christian nationalism, and has decided, you know what, I'm

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going to get even more in the game. She is

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outraged at the outrageous and she is now going to

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run for office. Good. What a great motivator that anger

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has been means she's paying attention, wants to make a difference.

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That's awesome. Short break, Lots more to talk about with you,

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and we will do that next. On the event calendar

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for twenty twenty six, we are just a few tickets,

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I think less than twenty five tickets from selling out

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March seventh with myself, Forrest Valci and Gotsig given in Tulsa.

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There is the Western Canadian Reason Conference first weekend of

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May in Calgary, Baja, KHN. August twenty first through twenty

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third in Sarnia, Ontario, Rocket City Reason and Huntsville, Alabama,

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third weekend in October. More events being added all the time.

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Just bookmarkt and check it often for tickets and details.

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The Thinkingatheist dot com slash events and I've got hal

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dialing in from Canada, al what's up?

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Speaker 5: Well A short intro here. I'm seventy one years old,

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and I became an atheist the honest way by looking

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for God. As I like to say, I've had all

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three Christian baptisms. I spoke in tongues at nineteen, and

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strange enough, after I converted to Russian Orthodoxy about twenty

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five years ago. I realized then that I just could

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not do those daily rituals, and I said to myself,

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what are you doing? This is seventh century mysticism, and

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so a long story short, I gave it up, and

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here I am. And I've been following you Seth since

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the days before you went public with your identity, so

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you know how long ago that is.

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Speaker 2: Let's see, I think I first showed my face in

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twenty eleven. You've been with me for a decade.

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Speaker 5: Old half before then, before then, when you had the

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thinking atheists on there, and I stumbled across, I said, well,

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who's this guy's This guy's like my brother from another mother.

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Speaker 2: According to the note I have here, you're calling about

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something that we as atheists have in common. What would

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that be?

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Speaker 5: Well, here's the thing, Now, here's the thing. At first,

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I became a diehard atheist. I became, you know, very

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antitheists and everything. My YouTube, my first YouTube channel was

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Lord's Sawceness, like I was a representative on Earth of

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the flying Spaghetti Monster as a way of being fartastic.

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And then I became strident atheist, and then it became

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the secular atheist. And now I've kind of toned down

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a bit. And you know it really got me going

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was my mother passed away in twenty fifteen, and she

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was a Christian and she knew exactly what happened to me.

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And I asked her, I said, Mom, before you die,

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give me some advice that I can carry with me.

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So did she tell me to go back to church

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get right with God. No, she said this to me,

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be good to people.

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Speaker 3: That's all.

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Speaker 5: Just be good to people. That was her advice to me.

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And you know, Seth, we all know when we're not

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being good to somebody. We know what being good to

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people means. And that got me thinking and rolling in

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my mind. And now I'm just you know, like I

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saw that earlier today, that the lady you had on

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about spiritual atheism, and I thought, you know, I wouldn't

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call myself a spiritual atheist, but I really enjoyed that

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because it made me. It reminded me of the only

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thing I have in common with somebody else who is

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an atheist is the fact that they don't believe in God.

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That's it. We can have zero in common. I like

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a lot of things in life. I like music, I

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like playing guitar, I like working out, I like health,

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I like science. I can have all that in common

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with many theists and zero of that in common with

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any atheists. So I don't walk around in the morning

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and say, oh, you know, God, I'm an atheist. I

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wake up and enjoy the things I like to enjoy

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and I've come to learn that whether you're a good

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person or a bad person, if you're a Christian or

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an atheist, that's just an add on tag at the

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end of you being good or bad.

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Speaker 2: This speaks to the larger point that values are more

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important than beliefs. I've met some amazing atheists, and I've

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met some horrible atheists. I've met some wonderful Christians and

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terrible Christians. It really comes down to values. So if

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somebody says, I believe in Jesus, but we align in

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terms of humanism and protecting other people, condemning cruelty, take that.

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We can talk about theology down the way. But I've

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got a lot of believers in my own life, so

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I take your point. I think it's a good one.

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Same here.

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Speaker 5: I mean, all we've got to do is look what

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Mega is doing right now. And I'm thinking to myself,

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you know, I know my Bible real well. I probably

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forgot more about the Bible than most any maga Christian

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would know. And I know right away watching Donald Trump,

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he is the exact description of the anti Christ in

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the Bible that saying should come if possible to see

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the elect Well, if we're going to consider born than

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Christians to be the elect? Are they not fully being

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the seed?

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Speaker 3: Right now?

440
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Speaker 2: Let meet you on that one. How let meet you

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on that one. Okay. Now, I may have thoughts and

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I'm going to attempt to nuance, but be safe over

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there in Windsor, Ontario. And I look forward to being

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in Canada here in a few months. Okay, my friend, I.

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Speaker 5: Want to try and get up there or see you there.

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Thanks for talking to me so appreciate pleasure.

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Speaker 2: I should do a whole show on this. There is

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an idea that people say that maga Christianity is not

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true Christianity. We're going to have to define true Christianity.

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And the problem is is that people make a religion

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in their own image. So somebody can be a progressive

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Christian and they are a true Christian. My allies, who

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are believers, whether it's Amanda Tyler or April la Joy

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or somebody else, they're Jesus followers and they are legitimately

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true Christians. Okay. The people who aren't engaged at all

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in scripture, but they said the prayer and believe in

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Jesus are true Christians. They're Christians, all right. The people

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who are fundamentalist, dominionist, Old Testament hell fire Christians are Christians.

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So I think the whole no true Christian or they're

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not practicing Christianity correctly ignores the fact that Christianity has

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a thousand different shades, and I think most of them

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are Christians. You believe in Jesus and in some way

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you hold to the Bible or Christian values. You identify

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a Christian, You're a Christian. You are a Christian. So

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again we have to peel that back and say, what

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kind of freaking person are you? Are you kind? Are

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you generous? Are you nasty? Are you cruel? Are you bigoted?

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Are you an egalitarian? Do you see us all as

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the human condition? Or are you a supremacist of some kind?

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Speaker 3: Right?

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Speaker 2: That speaks two values. Now again, the two are married

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and they often exist in the same space, which is

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why you can see those who love the God of

474
00:28:29,799 --> 00:28:34,279
judgment and those who love a God of love and acceptance.

475
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:37,799
But they're all Christians. And this gets so messy. It's

476
00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:42,200
so hard to navigate these conversations, especially in the online space.

477
00:28:42,960 --> 00:28:46,599
George is dialing in from five to four zero. Welcome George,

478
00:28:46,599 --> 00:28:47,400
thanks for calling.

479
00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:48,039
Speaker 6: Hi.

480
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:51,119
Speaker 7: You got it wrong, but that's.

481
00:28:51,599 --> 00:28:54,160
Speaker 2: I want to get it right. It says, George, what

482
00:28:54,359 --> 00:28:57,920
is your name, Lina? How in the world did it

483
00:28:57,960 --> 00:28:59,720
give me George? Lena?

484
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:01,720
Speaker 7: I gave them my last name.

485
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:05,440
Speaker 2: I blame AI for this. I don't care if it's

486
00:29:05,519 --> 00:29:08,640
responsible or not. I'm just in that kind of crabby mood.

487
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:11,839
All right, Lena, let's talk what's on your mind.

488
00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:16,319
Speaker 7: I just wanted to say thank you for everything you do.

489
00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:21,519
I'm an eighty year old atheist and I became an

490
00:29:21,519 --> 00:29:25,640
atheist at fifteen, and I wanted to quickly give you

491
00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:30,920
my dee conversions, which is very short. I was thirteen

492
00:29:31,519 --> 00:29:36,079
and I was becoming moving in my Sunday school from

493
00:29:36,359 --> 00:29:40,599
older children to the young adult and my Sunday school

494
00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:44,480
teacher took me aside and explained to me why slavery

495
00:29:44,759 --> 00:29:50,599
was right, that God had condoned slavery, and that there

496
00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:56,640
was nothing wrong with slavery, and I was horrified. I

497
00:29:56,680 --> 00:30:00,759
didn't say anything because nobody spoke to you adults other

498
00:30:00,799 --> 00:30:03,960
than to say yes, sir. But anyway, I went home

499
00:30:04,039 --> 00:30:07,640
that day from Sunday school and started reading the Bible

500
00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:11,480
because I was certain that God did not condone in slavery.

501
00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:14,920
It didn't take me long to find out that yes

502
00:30:15,200 --> 00:30:19,799
he did. Indeed, I had never even heard of atheism,

503
00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:24,119
and so for two years I believed this God was

504
00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:26,640
going to send me to hell because I would not

505
00:30:26,799 --> 00:30:32,599
worship an evil god. Finally, at fifteen, I learned about atheism.

506
00:30:33,079 --> 00:30:35,480
I think I got it from Mark Twain, who was

507
00:30:35,519 --> 00:30:39,559
a favorite of mine, And at that time I became

508
00:30:39,599 --> 00:30:44,920
an instant atheist. And that's my story. But I listened

509
00:30:44,920 --> 00:30:47,720
to you guys all the time, and I really have

510
00:30:47,799 --> 00:30:54,759
difficulty understanding how Christians read the passages on slavery. And

511
00:30:54,880 --> 00:31:00,119
don't understand, I mean, just excuse it. And that's that's

512
00:31:00,119 --> 00:31:01,359
really my one question.

513
00:31:02,039 --> 00:31:06,039
Speaker 2: I think people, except for a number of reasons. You

514
00:31:06,039 --> 00:31:09,720
look at the two major determiners of someone's religious belief,

515
00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:13,160
family and geography. Right where were you born? What was

516
00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:15,359
the religion of your parents? In the church, we called

517
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:18,359
it the four to fourteen windows. So when I was

518
00:31:18,359 --> 00:31:21,359
a very very very young child, the same people who

519
00:31:21,359 --> 00:31:24,200
taught me how to tie my shoes and made sure

520
00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:26,559
I had food in my belly and put a roof

521
00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:30,240
over my head that I trusted for so much, you know,

522
00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:32,759
to protect and educate me in this world. Those same

523
00:31:32,759 --> 00:31:34,880
people told me that there was a god in heaven

524
00:31:35,119 --> 00:31:37,559
and it was the Christian God in the Bible is true.

525
00:31:37,559 --> 00:31:40,359
And then they put me in a culture of reinforcement.

526
00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:45,000
Whereverwhere I went, everybody was like that Christian school, Christian music,

527
00:31:45,079 --> 00:31:50,079
Christian a peril, Christian culture, et cetera. And it becomes

528
00:31:50,119 --> 00:31:54,759
your normal. Then they embed fear. So just like you,

529
00:31:54,759 --> 00:31:57,960
you dare to question, you dare to acknowledge, doubt. You

530
00:31:58,039 --> 00:31:59,920
think I'm going to cook forever, I'm going to be

531
00:32:00,039 --> 00:32:03,359
earning and screaming forever. In hell, God's going to judge me.

532
00:32:04,359 --> 00:32:08,440
You're taught to doubt yourself, trust, not in your own understanding.

533
00:32:08,599 --> 00:32:12,359
All these things plus other issues. Religions like to grab

534
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:15,200
people at a vulnerable spot in their lives. This is

535
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:19,440
why we see addiction recovery and divorce recovery and other programs.

536
00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:21,880
You find somebody at a low point and then you

537
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:25,880
love bomb them and they feel validated and attended to

538
00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:29,079
and part of a community, and they respond emotionally to that.

539
00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:33,160
And then once you've made that relationship, you've kind of

540
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:36,680
married yourself to the religion. It becomes a matter of

541
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:40,319
defending your decision to believe or to stay in the belief,

542
00:32:40,359 --> 00:32:42,440
And somebody comes to you and they're like, well, Adam

543
00:32:42,440 --> 00:32:45,440
and Eve falls apart, and there was no global flood

544
00:32:45,480 --> 00:32:47,920
and people didn't live to be a thousand years old,

545
00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:51,119
and there weren't sea monsters, and slavery is wrong and

546
00:32:51,160 --> 00:32:54,240
blah blah blah. Instead of immediately saying, oh, well, I

547
00:32:54,319 --> 00:32:57,759
need to dismantle or at least analyze this, you defend

548
00:32:57,799 --> 00:33:00,559
it and you're like, whoa, whoah, Because if it's not true,

549
00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:04,000
what are the consequences? The house of cards comes down,

550
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:06,759
you may be back at square one, or worse, does

551
00:33:06,799 --> 00:33:09,839
your community cast you off? Do you go to hell?

552
00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:13,519
If you're wrong? There's so many thousands upon thousands of

553
00:33:13,599 --> 00:33:19,279
reasons that people accept the unacceptable, that they rereason the unreasonable.

554
00:33:19,519 --> 00:33:21,960
And so while I'm not a psychologist, I've been around

555
00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:24,960
the block a few times and I was indoctrinated. It

556
00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:27,559
took me a long time to crawl out. So sometimes

557
00:33:27,599 --> 00:33:30,279
I beat myself up for being an idiot, and other

558
00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:33,119
times I give myself grace and say, you were a

559
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:36,799
kid and they didn't give you a choice. Give yourself

560
00:33:36,839 --> 00:33:39,079
credit for finally getting there. I don't know. Does that

561
00:33:39,119 --> 00:33:41,839
make any sense to you, Lena, Yeah, it does.

562
00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:45,200
Speaker 7: I never told anybody in my family that I was

563
00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:46,279
an atheist.

564
00:33:46,759 --> 00:33:49,960
Speaker 2: And why not because I knew.

565
00:33:49,839 --> 00:33:52,960
Speaker 7: They would come down on me like a ton of bricks. Yeah,

566
00:33:53,079 --> 00:33:55,920
so I just kept it to myself. But I didn't

567
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:58,640
go to church anymore, and that I took flat for that.

568
00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:01,680
But since a lot of my cousins didn't go to

569
00:34:01,759 --> 00:34:04,359
church even though they believed, they let it go.

570
00:34:05,319 --> 00:34:09,159
Speaker 2: It's remarkable that you figured it out so young, and

571
00:34:09,559 --> 00:34:12,400
I so admire you and your journey, and I'm thankful

572
00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:14,800
for your kind words, Lena. It just made my day

573
00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:15,880
much appreciated.

574
00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:19,920
Speaker 7: Well, I appreciate everything you do. Thank you so much.

575
00:34:20,159 --> 00:34:22,760
Speaker 2: All Right, be safe out there, take care, okay.

576
00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:23,199
Speaker 3: Bye.

577
00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:29,079
Speaker 2: Sometimes I'll run into antitheists and they're so condescending to

578
00:34:29,159 --> 00:34:35,639
the believers. Grow up, grow up, Santa Claus. For adults

579
00:34:36,519 --> 00:34:40,159
on the surface, I get it, but it's so dismissive.

580
00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:45,840
It's not compassionate, it's not empathetic, it's not humanistic. It's

581
00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:50,559
just superior, snobby and kind of shitty. Yeah, that's a

582
00:34:50,559 --> 00:34:54,840
whole other show. I've got a four oh five area

583
00:34:54,920 --> 00:34:58,119
code that sounds like Oklahoma. Hi, what do I call you?

584
00:34:58,840 --> 00:34:59,480
Speaker 3: This is Paul.

585
00:35:00,079 --> 00:35:02,760
Speaker 2: Hi, Paul, thanks for calling. What's up?

586
00:35:03,320 --> 00:35:03,639
Speaker 3: Well?

587
00:35:04,159 --> 00:35:06,159
Speaker 6: I just want to first off, thank you very much

588
00:35:06,199 --> 00:35:09,280
because about well, it was right around COVID that I

589
00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:12,800
started waking up and I used to be a night

590
00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:17,079
janitor and I couldn't listen to your podcast without screaming.

591
00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:19,199
But I was glad that I was a knight janitor

592
00:35:19,239 --> 00:35:23,639
because I could yell. And now you know, all these

593
00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:25,960
years later, I finally looked at it with a much

594
00:35:25,960 --> 00:35:29,480
more nuanced approach, and I just was thankful for what

595
00:35:29,519 --> 00:35:33,440
you had on yesterday with the spiritual or two days

596
00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:36,320
ago or something with a spiritual atheist. I would have

597
00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:38,480
screamed at that when I first became an atheist, but

598
00:35:38,639 --> 00:35:41,000
I kind of landed there myself.

599
00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:44,000
Speaker 2: Why did you scream when you first listened to my show?

600
00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:48,400
Speaker 6: Because I was raised Southern Baptist and a church family,

601
00:35:48,559 --> 00:35:53,320
a preacher family, and I was beaten severely and abused emotionally,

602
00:35:54,159 --> 00:35:58,000
and everything you said I was just the trauma. I

603
00:35:58,039 --> 00:36:01,159
wasn't mad at you. I was screaming because I was saying,

604
00:36:01,400 --> 00:36:03,880
I can't listen to these topics without getting mad.

605
00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:08,400
Speaker 2: It's understandable. I think people who have been beaten up

606
00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:11,719
by high control cultures should be angry. You know, I

607
00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:13,360
don't know where you are in your journey. Are you

608
00:36:13,480 --> 00:36:14,599
doing better today?

609
00:36:15,039 --> 00:36:17,599
Speaker 6: I'm doing a lot better. So what I did was

610
00:36:17,639 --> 00:36:20,760
I was the anger atheist for a while. But I'm

611
00:36:20,880 --> 00:36:26,079
very curious, and so I got into quantum physics and

612
00:36:26,159 --> 00:36:29,599
a bunch of different other studies of Buddhism stuff like that,

613
00:36:30,440 --> 00:36:33,239
and I kept realizing, and I don't want to scare

614
00:36:33,280 --> 00:36:36,679
off listeners, but I kept realizing that everyone that looks

615
00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:39,679
for a higher power keeps pointing to a certain thing,

616
00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:42,920
that we are all connected. And I'm not saying that's God,

617
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:45,639
but that's where I.

618
00:36:45,639 --> 00:36:50,159
Speaker 2: Land now, Like we are all the human condition and

619
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:53,480
we control our destinies. Is that what you're saying.

620
00:36:54,119 --> 00:36:56,840
Speaker 6: Well, at first I thought it was we are all

621
00:36:56,880 --> 00:37:01,079
just ones and zeros, and I I was very comfortable

622
00:37:01,119 --> 00:37:03,159
with that, But then I kept saying, no, I have

623
00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:06,559
felt things. I feel a connection between people. And then

624
00:37:06,599 --> 00:37:10,679
you look at quantum entanglement, and Einstein talked about a

625
00:37:10,719 --> 00:37:14,360
booky action at a distance, and there are just certain

626
00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:18,559
things that connect us throughout the universe that we can't explain.

627
00:37:18,679 --> 00:37:21,199
And I'm not saying it's God. I definitely know it's

628
00:37:21,199 --> 00:37:24,280
not the God of the Bible, but there is something

629
00:37:24,320 --> 00:37:27,480
out there, and that's why I was just happy that

630
00:37:27,519 --> 00:37:29,400
you had that person on the other day.

631
00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:34,280
Speaker 2: Quantum entanglement is something that I, a layperson, had to

632
00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:38,239
look up just now. The phenomenon wherein the quantum state

633
00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:42,000
of each particle in a group cannot be described independently

634
00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:45,039
of the state of the others, even when the particles

635
00:37:45,039 --> 00:37:48,000
are separated by a large distance.

636
00:37:49,360 --> 00:37:53,400
Speaker 6: There does seem to be something out there that connects us.

637
00:37:53,199 --> 00:37:58,760
Speaker 2: A spiritual force, something that is an energy or are

638
00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:01,639
we just talking about how we perceive each other as

639
00:38:01,719 --> 00:38:04,639
part of the human condition, Fellow travelers, how do you

640
00:38:04,679 --> 00:38:05,000
mean it?

641
00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:09,480
Speaker 6: Well, in the sense of the hippies, how we are

642
00:38:09,519 --> 00:38:12,800
all cells and everything is a vibration. We keep with

643
00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:15,000
the tools that we have, we keep looking. We thought

644
00:38:15,039 --> 00:38:17,559
that this most thing was atoms, but then we saw

645
00:38:17,599 --> 00:38:20,599
that we got down to the plank length, and with

646
00:38:20,719 --> 00:38:24,119
more tools, we'll keep getting farther and farther down, and

647
00:38:24,159 --> 00:38:27,679
we see that everything is just vibrations that make up

648
00:38:27,840 --> 00:38:33,639
a whole scene that we say is reality. And that

649
00:38:33,880 --> 00:38:38,000
seems to be well, like ninety of what our atmosphere is.

650
00:38:38,360 --> 00:38:40,599
We don't know what it is. We call it dark energy,

651
00:38:41,039 --> 00:38:44,000
and that sounds a lot like God as described in

652
00:38:44,039 --> 00:38:48,440
the Bible or other religions. Are you tracking well.

653
00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:51,280
Speaker 2: I'm trying I understand what you are saying. Sorry, I

654
00:38:51,360 --> 00:38:55,239
turned my volume down because every Wednesday at noon they

655
00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:59,480
fire off the tornado sirens in Oklahoma to test them.

656
00:39:00,519 --> 00:39:03,000
You know, we're getting into spring tornado season, and so

657
00:39:03,039 --> 00:39:05,199
I'm sitting here listening intently, and all of a sudden,

658
00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:09,400
that siren, which is three blocks from me, starts sounding

659
00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:12,280
at high volume, and all the dogs start to howl,

660
00:39:12,400 --> 00:39:15,119
et cetera. It's just one of those weird things. But yes,

661
00:39:15,280 --> 00:39:18,119
I am listening. I'm going to be a hard sell

662
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:22,440
on the vibrations thing. I mean, Einstein gets invoked even

663
00:39:22,519 --> 00:39:26,000
by Christians, by other religious people, so I mean Einstein

664
00:39:26,119 --> 00:39:27,960
was into a lot of things. He certainly didn't believe

665
00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:30,559
in a personal God because he told us so. But

666
00:39:30,880 --> 00:39:33,000
you know, the idea that we are all connected by

667
00:39:33,039 --> 00:39:36,519
a vibrating energy, that's a hard cell for me. I

668
00:39:36,599 --> 00:39:40,199
will say that I'm open if evidence becomes available. In

669
00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:44,599
the meantime, I think we should invent quantum Buddhism, because

670
00:39:44,639 --> 00:39:46,559
you talked about both of those and I was like, oh,

671
00:39:46,599 --> 00:39:49,280
you know, I maybe we can combine those two so

672
00:39:49,320 --> 00:39:53,159
we can meditate and vibrate together. Maybe you and I

673
00:39:53,199 --> 00:39:56,320
can start that quantum Buddhism. How's that sound.

674
00:39:56,559 --> 00:39:57,159
Speaker 6: I like that?

675
00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:01,519
Speaker 2: Okay, I don't know. You know, I'm not a physicist.

676
00:40:02,079 --> 00:40:06,039
I'm a little bit dubious about the vibrating energy thing.

677
00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:08,960
What I really like for me is to see each other,

678
00:40:09,119 --> 00:40:11,960
as you know, we choose to see each other as

679
00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:15,760
a connected species, connected to all living things into each other.

680
00:40:15,880 --> 00:40:18,760
That's magical enough for me. But it's an interesting topic.

681
00:40:18,800 --> 00:40:19,960
And I appreciate you calling.

682
00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:22,280
Speaker 6: Well, thank you for all you what you do.

683
00:40:23,239 --> 00:40:28,840
Speaker 2: Be very kind, all right, be good. Tornado sirens you

684
00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:32,559
can tell people who live in Tornado Alley because whenever

685
00:40:32,599 --> 00:40:35,559
there are warnings and the radar turns dark red or

686
00:40:35,639 --> 00:40:39,360
purple and the sirens are going off, most of us

687
00:40:39,440 --> 00:40:43,000
run outside with our cell phone cameras. They said it

688
00:40:43,079 --> 00:40:47,039
was coming in from the southwest. You turn southwest. You're

689
00:40:47,079 --> 00:40:50,760
watching the clouds. There's a roiling green kind of low

690
00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:54,599
cloud and the air down here is still, and it's

691
00:40:54,639 --> 00:40:57,800
really muggy. It's got almost a certain smell to it,

692
00:40:57,960 --> 00:41:01,960
tornado weather and the like. Will I catch rotation on

693
00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:05,920
my camera? I gauged the distance to my in ground

694
00:41:06,039 --> 00:41:09,400
underground storm shelter. It's in my garage, and so we've

695
00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:11,519
got the dogs ready and we know where the cat

696
00:41:11,679 --> 00:41:14,559
is and we're you know, we're ready to go underneath.

697
00:41:14,599 --> 00:41:18,000
But until I absolutely have to, I want to catch

698
00:41:18,000 --> 00:41:21,440
a video, right, I want documentation. I want to see

699
00:41:21,440 --> 00:41:23,519
what's going on. And I fantasize, and I'm sure I

700
00:41:23,519 --> 00:41:25,760
wouldn't do this, but if the thing's passing a block

701
00:41:25,840 --> 00:41:28,760
from me, I'm in the shelter with the garage door open,

702
00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:31,480
and I've got my hand and a phone sticking out

703
00:41:31,559 --> 00:41:38,199
the top, how's the footage? Should I shoot it vertically

704
00:41:38,440 --> 00:41:44,599
or horizontally? I find tornadoes exhilarating. I've been through two

705
00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:47,199
in my life. One was a direct hit. It actually

706
00:41:47,360 --> 00:41:50,400
sort of skipped just over my house, the house I

707
00:41:50,440 --> 00:41:52,639
was living in I was five years old, through the

708
00:41:52,679 --> 00:41:57,519
neighbor's roof in our yard and we lost a few shingles.

709
00:41:57,599 --> 00:42:03,280
And my family was convinced this was Jesus. Jesus, Jesus

710
00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:07,079
caused that tornado to skip right over. We should have

711
00:42:07,159 --> 00:42:11,519
been hit directly by that June eighth tornado. Oh but

712
00:42:11,679 --> 00:42:13,760
the Lord smiled on us, and I'm like, well, this

713
00:42:13,920 --> 00:42:19,079
poor bastard who lives next to us, he just lost

714
00:42:19,079 --> 00:42:24,400
half his house. God's like, I screw that guy, We're

715
00:42:24,440 --> 00:42:27,599
gonna help you. It just didn't make any sense to

716
00:42:27,639 --> 00:42:31,239
me anyway. I'm sorry. I totally, I totally. I got

717
00:42:31,280 --> 00:42:34,079
Bill at two five zero, Bill, are you with me?

718
00:42:35,119 --> 00:42:38,360
Speaker 3: I'm with you? Set. It's Bill Lidgerwood of Imagine No Religion.

719
00:42:38,639 --> 00:42:42,679
Speaker 2: Bill, I've done. I spoke at that event through two

720
00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:45,199
three times something like that.

721
00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:47,079
Speaker 3: I think you were a regular.

722
00:42:47,679 --> 00:42:51,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, dude, it's been a long time. How are things

723
00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:52,400
up north?

724
00:42:54,199 --> 00:42:55,800
Speaker 3: Some things are going well here? How are you and

725
00:42:55,840 --> 00:42:57,400
your lovely wife?

726
00:42:57,800 --> 00:43:01,800
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, the country's on fire and people suck,

727
00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:05,760
but beyond that we're delightful. Actually, yeah, that's unfair. A

728
00:43:05,760 --> 00:43:08,159
lot of really good people are doing really good things.

729
00:43:08,199 --> 00:43:10,400
But I don't know if you guys get those headlines

730
00:43:10,480 --> 00:43:13,719
up north. But there are people who are going to

731
00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:17,360
be in late March again, marching in public by the millions.

732
00:43:17,400 --> 00:43:21,320
They're calling their representatives, they're going online sounding the alarm.

733
00:43:21,760 --> 00:43:25,639
We've got Olympic athletes overseas who are saying, we love

734
00:43:25,639 --> 00:43:29,079
our country, we're happy to represent it, but we don't

735
00:43:29,119 --> 00:43:31,760
agree with all the horrible stuff that's going on. So

736
00:43:31,840 --> 00:43:34,760
I haven't completely given up on my country. But you

737
00:43:34,880 --> 00:43:36,800
get it, right, it's crazy down here.

738
00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:41,119
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, oh yeah, we get it for sure. It's

739
00:43:42,039 --> 00:43:45,079
unbelievable actually to look at what's going on down there.

740
00:43:45,079 --> 00:43:48,159
But you know what, it's not. It's not a lot

741
00:43:48,360 --> 00:43:53,119
better here. It's just more undercover here. I live in

742
00:43:53,159 --> 00:43:57,199
British Columbia, which is probably the wokest province of Canada,

743
00:43:57,360 --> 00:44:00,559
possibly the wokest place in the world. I think that's

744
00:44:00,920 --> 00:44:05,480
where woke was invented. Anyway, One of the things I

745
00:44:05,519 --> 00:44:07,559
wanted to just mention to you is we just had,

746
00:44:08,320 --> 00:44:13,760
actually yesterday a school shooting in a small town in

747
00:44:13,880 --> 00:44:19,840
northern BC called tumblr Ridge. This guy killed ten, killed

748
00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:24,079
ten people, killed himself, wounded twenty something in a tiny

749
00:44:24,119 --> 00:44:29,039
little town in a junior secondary school. And all I'm

750
00:44:29,079 --> 00:44:32,159
hearing and of course this is this is awful, and

751
00:44:32,199 --> 00:44:35,400
the fact that it was they couldn't describe, they couldn't

752
00:44:35,440 --> 00:44:40,360
describe this guy before they knew that he was dead,

753
00:44:40,599 --> 00:44:43,559
and they were putting out warnings. But they said it

754
00:44:43,599 --> 00:44:46,159
was a woman in a dress with brown hair. Well

755
00:44:46,199 --> 00:44:48,639
it wasn't. It was a trans guy in a dress,

756
00:44:49,039 --> 00:44:52,039
brown hair, and they still did right now, won't even

757
00:44:52,280 --> 00:44:56,320
identify him as a heat anyway, that's beside the point.

758
00:44:56,360 --> 00:44:59,760
All the politicians, of course, are oh, we're praying for

759
00:44:59,800 --> 00:45:02,800
the for the victims, and I'm like, well, it's a

760
00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:06,679
bit late for that, isn't it. I mean, God, if

761
00:45:06,679 --> 00:45:09,039
you have, if there's a god, he allowed this to happen,

762
00:45:10,960 --> 00:45:14,320
and you're praying for the victims. Like, it's pathetic really

763
00:45:14,360 --> 00:45:15,920
when they do that, and they do it all the

764
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:20,760
time here, your country, everywhere. Yeah, so that's.

765
00:45:20,559 --> 00:45:24,199
Speaker 2: What's going on here. It's uh, hang on just a second.

766
00:45:24,280 --> 00:45:28,440
I mean, so, if it was a trans person who

767
00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:33,719
identifies as a woman, is that what happened? Yes, okay,

768
00:45:34,239 --> 00:45:37,920
your beef is what that the trans problem? It's a

769
00:45:37,920 --> 00:45:43,559
man ah, which explains earlier.

770
00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:48,079
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's yeah, it's not a woman. It's it's a guy.

771
00:45:48,159 --> 00:45:48,760
It's a man.

772
00:45:48,920 --> 00:45:51,599
Speaker 2: You and I are going to probably have a disagreement

773
00:45:51,719 --> 00:45:54,119
as to you know, the person identifies as a woman.

774
00:45:54,400 --> 00:45:58,000
I don't know that person's story, but it sounds to

775
00:45:58,079 --> 00:46:01,079
me like you're not going out after the murderer as

776
00:46:01,159 --> 00:46:04,960
much as you're going after the trans person who was woke?

777
00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:07,760
Who was? I mean, what are you trying to tell me?

778
00:46:07,840 --> 00:46:08,079
Speaker 8: Bill?

779
00:46:08,440 --> 00:46:10,719
Speaker 3: No, I'm not going after the murderers, just that he

780
00:46:10,760 --> 00:46:13,920
should be described accurately, especially when he's on the loose.

781
00:46:13,960 --> 00:46:16,440
When they think he's on the loose, everybody's looking for

782
00:46:16,480 --> 00:46:19,000
a woman. It's not a woman, it's a man. That's

783
00:46:19,000 --> 00:46:21,760
my point. Of course, I'm talking about the murder, and

784
00:46:21,800 --> 00:46:24,400
I'm talking about how the media describes it, and in

785
00:46:24,519 --> 00:46:27,400
all these woke terms, they refused to say it was

786
00:46:27,519 --> 00:46:28,599
a trans person.

787
00:46:28,400 --> 00:46:29,920
Speaker 2: Due they won't even say that.

788
00:46:30,039 --> 00:46:32,079
Speaker 3: I am the media, all the media.

789
00:46:32,239 --> 00:46:36,280
Speaker 2: You and I I think if I recall, Bill, wasn't

790
00:46:36,320 --> 00:46:39,239
there a conversation we had a long time ago about

791
00:46:39,760 --> 00:46:42,760
some of the people that we disagreed with on some

792
00:46:42,800 --> 00:46:45,360
of these subjects, and I think the word woke had

793
00:46:45,360 --> 00:46:49,679
come up where you were were you defending Lawrence Krause

794
00:46:49,960 --> 00:46:50,840
and a few others.

795
00:46:51,559 --> 00:46:52,199
Speaker 3: Absolutely?

796
00:46:52,320 --> 00:46:56,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well you realize how problematic Krause has become. And

797
00:46:56,159 --> 00:46:59,559
of course now we see an association with Jeffrey Epstein, etc.

798
00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:02,719
I mean, I worry that you may not be on

799
00:47:02,760 --> 00:47:05,960
the right side of some of these critical and I

800
00:47:06,039 --> 00:47:09,760
think humanistic conversations. This needs to be treated with compassion.

801
00:47:10,079 --> 00:47:13,599
These are human beings who identify in a very specific way,

802
00:47:14,400 --> 00:47:16,159
and so I think you and I may they do,

803
00:47:16,360 --> 00:47:20,119
stand very much apart on a great much of this.

804
00:47:20,199 --> 00:47:22,880
I'm so sorry about you know what had happened in Canada.

805
00:47:22,920 --> 00:47:26,159
I've been so busy perusing our headlines. I hadn't seen those.

806
00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:29,639
Do you know what motivated the shooting? Was it a

807
00:47:29,679 --> 00:47:33,400
mentally ill person? Was it politically motivated, a combination something else?

808
00:47:33,440 --> 00:47:37,679
Speaker 3: What happened, Well, they don't know, but of course it's

809
00:47:37,719 --> 00:47:41,159
a mentally ill person. Anybody that thinks for the opposite

810
00:47:41,159 --> 00:47:41,639
sex is.

811
00:47:41,599 --> 00:47:45,320
Speaker 2: Meant Jesus Christ. Bill, We're talking about a shooter, and

812
00:47:45,400 --> 00:47:50,519
I'm asking if that person was motivated for an agenda

813
00:47:50,639 --> 00:47:54,320
of some kind. And the first place you go is

814
00:47:54,400 --> 00:47:57,519
that they are broken because they are trans You're not

815
00:47:57,519 --> 00:48:00,239
going to get that platform here. You and I stand apart,

816
00:48:00,519 --> 00:48:03,559
and I think it's disrespectful. It's disrespectful to me, to

817
00:48:03,639 --> 00:48:05,639
the show and to our listeners to call up and

818
00:48:05,719 --> 00:48:10,800
dehumanize people in that way. I just disupernize them. You

819
00:48:10,960 --> 00:48:15,000
are very much real dehumanizing. You are very much telling

820
00:48:15,079 --> 00:48:17,960
the truth, Removie. Well, you can say the word truth

821
00:48:18,039 --> 00:48:18,360
over and.

822
00:48:20,480 --> 00:48:23,440
Speaker 3: It's about telling the truth. It's about dealing with facts

823
00:48:23,519 --> 00:48:24,119
and science.

824
00:48:24,440 --> 00:48:27,320
Speaker 2: You can say truth and facts. And you know who

825
00:48:27,360 --> 00:48:31,280
else says truth in facts? Religious people of all the truth,

826
00:48:32,199 --> 00:48:36,239
conspiracy theorists say truth in facts. It doesn't make them

827
00:48:36,280 --> 00:48:38,920
truth in facts. Bill, You and I simply stand apart,

828
00:48:38,960 --> 00:48:42,320
and I don't find this a charitable or productive conversation.

829
00:48:42,559 --> 00:48:46,280
I would rather us look at what truly motivated the

830
00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:49,559
violence in Canada. Not that they were trans but what

831
00:48:49,679 --> 00:48:53,159
truly motivated it? What was the agenda? What actually happened,

832
00:48:53,800 --> 00:48:56,039
because I pretty much can tell you it's not because

833
00:48:56,039 --> 00:48:58,599
the person identified as a man or a woman. This

834
00:48:58,639 --> 00:49:00,599
is someone who simply wants to come the terms with

835
00:49:00,679 --> 00:49:03,920
who they are. I mean, what else was going on?

836
00:49:04,239 --> 00:49:06,079
I'll look the story up. I'd like to see how

837
00:49:06,119 --> 00:49:09,400
the news has reported. Maybe maybe there's something that you

838
00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:11,320
and I could both discover. Is that fair?

839
00:49:12,280 --> 00:49:14,880
Speaker 3: Well? You will never know because he killed himself and

840
00:49:14,920 --> 00:49:15,840
he killed his parents.

841
00:49:16,039 --> 00:49:18,360
Speaker 2: You don't know that. We won't know. Is there a

842
00:49:18,400 --> 00:49:22,519
paper trail where their emails are? Their forums? Are there?

843
00:49:22,599 --> 00:49:27,079
Is there are there social media. Have you ever heard

844
00:49:27,119 --> 00:49:30,480
about someone who mash who is involved in a mass shooting,

845
00:49:30,599 --> 00:49:34,800
and after they are killed by the police or whatever,

846
00:49:34,920 --> 00:49:38,239
or killed themselves, we discover a paper trail. There are

847
00:49:38,639 --> 00:49:43,480
motivational posts on social media. Some people write manifestos, some

848
00:49:43,559 --> 00:49:46,800
people actually write letters to explain why they did what

849
00:49:46,960 --> 00:49:49,880
they did. We can be a forensic examiner at the

850
00:49:49,920 --> 00:49:52,400
crime scene, so I'm not going to say we can't know.

851
00:49:52,679 --> 00:49:55,159
I think we must try our best to know. That's fair,

852
00:49:55,199 --> 00:49:59,119
isn't it, Bill, Yes, of course it's let's do that.

853
00:49:59,159 --> 00:50:01,159
You must try our best to know. Let's do it.

854
00:50:01,280 --> 00:50:03,280
Speaker 3: Let the media won't tell us even if we do know,

855
00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:07,920
how about that because they refuse to acknowledge the fact,

856
00:50:08,320 --> 00:50:11,760
the simple fact. So they're not going to tell us.

857
00:50:12,079 --> 00:50:14,199
I mean, if he did this because he was motivated

858
00:50:14,239 --> 00:50:18,320
by his trans cult, then they will never tell us that.

859
00:50:19,039 --> 00:50:22,199
Speaker 2: Bill. I'm gonna let you go. I wish you the best,

860
00:50:22,320 --> 00:50:24,519
Thank you so much. All right, We'll see you later.

861
00:50:25,199 --> 00:50:29,119
Jesus Okay. I debated as to whether or not to

862
00:50:29,199 --> 00:50:31,639
leave that phone call in the final edit of this

863
00:50:31,719 --> 00:50:34,199
show before release. But we're all adults here, and it

864
00:50:34,239 --> 00:50:37,000
provides me a chance to maybe clarify some stuff, and

865
00:50:37,039 --> 00:50:41,400
none of this is unfair to Bill, just backstory. So

866
00:50:41,800 --> 00:50:45,000
Bill and his wife were just lovely hosts for that

867
00:50:45,159 --> 00:50:49,079
event in Canada Imagine No Religion, and there were a

868
00:50:49,119 --> 00:50:52,800
lot of great people on the stage. Bradley o'neishi, who

869
00:50:52,880 --> 00:50:54,960
is one of the hosts of the Straight Wide American

870
00:50:55,119 --> 00:50:59,119
Jesus podcast and he's been going hard at Christian nationalism.

871
00:50:59,159 --> 00:51:03,079
Just a lovely Miriamnimazi human rights activist who has been

872
00:51:03,079 --> 00:51:06,920
standing up for women in Islamic nations and beyond. I

873
00:51:07,039 --> 00:51:09,320
was there with Matt Delahunty and ur and Raw. We

874
00:51:09,360 --> 00:51:12,519
brought the Unholy Trinity to a big Saturday night show

875
00:51:12,599 --> 00:51:15,559
at IANR and it was just a blast, and it

876
00:51:15,679 --> 00:51:20,039
was universally positive. I never heard a bad word about

877
00:51:20,400 --> 00:51:24,760
anybody's behavior or conduct, but we know that there were

878
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:28,400
some people on stage who have since become very problematic.

879
00:51:28,480 --> 00:51:32,599
Right as the information came out, Jerry Coin, author of

880
00:51:32,800 --> 00:51:36,599
Why Evolution Is True, a book which really helped me.

881
00:51:37,280 --> 00:51:40,920
Jerry's gone out and said some very unfortunate things about

882
00:51:40,920 --> 00:51:44,360
trans people. Same with Richard Dawkins. Dawkins has been in

883
00:51:44,400 --> 00:51:49,239
the hot seat with his conflict with Rebecca Watson. Watson

884
00:51:49,280 --> 00:51:52,880
said she was inappropriately or uncomfortably approached at a pre

885
00:51:52,960 --> 00:51:56,199
thought event, and Dawkins essentially told her to stop whining,

886
00:51:56,239 --> 00:51:59,840
grow up, get over it. And then Dawkins identified a

887
00:51:59,840 --> 00:52:04,039
few years ago as a cultural Christian and started singing

888
00:52:04,079 --> 00:52:08,000
the praises of the great American Elon Musk. So I've

889
00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:11,199
been watching this guy whose book The God Delusion was

890
00:52:11,239 --> 00:52:13,400
so instrumental in my life. I mean, it was a

891
00:52:13,559 --> 00:52:16,679
seminal work in my life. They've just changed my life.

892
00:52:17,400 --> 00:52:20,559
It's been hard to watch this guy slip off the

893
00:52:20,639 --> 00:52:23,840
rails and go down into oblivion. And then, of course

894
00:52:23,880 --> 00:52:28,199
there is Lawrence Krause, theoretical physicist, but it comes to

895
00:52:28,280 --> 00:52:32,960
light that he has been accused on many fronts of

896
00:52:33,199 --> 00:52:39,280
sexual misconduct and appropriate behavior freethought conferences at the university.

897
00:52:39,639 --> 00:52:42,000
I think it was Case Western University, where he was

898
00:52:42,039 --> 00:52:45,480
serving as professor. There were allegations. BuzzFeed had a big

899
00:52:45,559 --> 00:52:48,960
article which released about it in twenty eighteen, listing the victims.

900
00:52:49,039 --> 00:52:52,360
Lawrence Kraus denied the allegations that it was all a

901
00:52:52,400 --> 00:52:56,880
bunch of crap. Arizona State University, where Kraus was a professor.

902
00:52:56,960 --> 00:52:59,760
I think he was heading up the Origins project. There,

903
00:53:00,360 --> 00:53:03,159
they did their own investigation and found what they called

904
00:53:03,199 --> 00:53:08,119
a preponderance of evidence enough for them to essentially recommend

905
00:53:08,159 --> 00:53:11,000
that he be removed from his post. He was gone

906
00:53:11,000 --> 00:53:14,840
from the university in short order. And so Lawrence Krauss,

907
00:53:15,079 --> 00:53:18,199
as you know, he has just been one of those

908
00:53:18,360 --> 00:53:21,360
falling stars, a guy you're like you were a science

909
00:53:21,480 --> 00:53:23,920
educator at the top of his game, a household name

910
00:53:23,960 --> 00:53:26,599
in your field, and look, you know, I feel like

911
00:53:26,639 --> 00:53:30,679
you just self immolated. Well, now we've got the Epstein

912
00:53:30,840 --> 00:53:35,840
files and the names of various scientists listed in the files.

913
00:53:35,880 --> 00:53:40,119
And this gets messy because Jeffrey Epstein operated a bunch

914
00:53:40,159 --> 00:53:44,559
of foundations that actually funded different science events. So at

915
00:53:44,599 --> 00:53:46,960
one point, I think there was a physics conference in

916
00:53:47,000 --> 00:53:49,800
two thousand and six, and he had twenty of the

917
00:53:49,840 --> 00:53:53,079
physicists from the conference that one of his foundations helped

918
00:53:53,079 --> 00:53:55,880
to fund. They traveled to his island. Who knows what

919
00:53:56,039 --> 00:53:58,320
happened there could have been everything, it could have been nothing.

920
00:53:58,360 --> 00:54:01,559
We have no idea. We know that there were people

921
00:54:01,599 --> 00:54:05,280
like Neil Schuben, the scientist, the palaeontologist who was just

922
00:54:05,559 --> 00:54:08,760
appointed to head up the National Academy of sciences. He

923
00:54:08,800 --> 00:54:11,679
said that he had met Jeffrey Epstein, there was a

924
00:54:11,719 --> 00:54:14,400
listing of his name at some encounter, but he said

925
00:54:14,440 --> 00:54:18,880
he immediately distanced himself, so there was really nothing there.

926
00:54:19,360 --> 00:54:22,519
We don't know what the relationship with Richard Dawkins was.

927
00:54:22,559 --> 00:54:24,880
It looks like he was kind of on the outside.

928
00:54:25,199 --> 00:54:28,719
I think he had maybe email Lawrence Krauss about his

929
00:54:28,760 --> 00:54:34,079
own frustrations about being poorly treated by those movement feminists

930
00:54:34,119 --> 00:54:37,079
who need to grow up and grow his skin, and

931
00:54:37,239 --> 00:54:41,840
Kraus forwarded those onto Ebstein or something along those lines.

932
00:54:41,880 --> 00:54:44,039
I'll have to go back and look that up to

933
00:54:44,079 --> 00:54:46,639
get more specific, or you can as well. I want

934
00:54:46,639 --> 00:54:48,599
to make sure that I'm not being unfair, but you

935
00:54:48,679 --> 00:54:53,800
get it. Krause himself, according to the recently released documents,

936
00:54:53,880 --> 00:54:57,599
can be seen having one on one email exchanges with

937
00:54:57,719 --> 00:55:02,559
Jeffrey Epstein where Lawrence is asking for Jeffrey's advice on

938
00:55:02,719 --> 00:55:07,079
how to deal with all of these sexual misconduct allegations. Hey,

939
00:55:07,519 --> 00:55:09,639
what do you think I ought to do about all this?

940
00:55:09,840 --> 00:55:14,320
I guess this is PR reputation management something along those lines.

941
00:55:14,360 --> 00:55:20,079
He's asking Epstein for counsel. I don't know how much

942
00:55:20,280 --> 00:55:24,760
Lawrence Krause knew. You don't know how much Lawrence Krause knew,

943
00:55:25,079 --> 00:55:28,719
but I am hearing nothing but alarm bells on this one.

944
00:55:29,000 --> 00:55:33,360
A guy with a history of sexual misconduct allegations asking

945
00:55:33,440 --> 00:55:36,320
for advice says to how to deal with the accusations

946
00:55:36,320 --> 00:55:40,519
from Jeffrey Epstein. I think that connection is an awfully

947
00:55:40,559 --> 00:55:44,880
big coincidence, if ever there was one. But I'll leave

948
00:55:44,920 --> 00:55:47,679
the speculation to everybody else, so let's try to work

949
00:55:47,760 --> 00:55:50,719
the evidence. The bottom line is this, when I ask

950
00:55:50,840 --> 00:55:54,159
Bill about Lawrence Krause, he is still a defender of

951
00:55:54,239 --> 00:55:57,480
Lawrence Krause because and I don't think this is unfair

952
00:55:57,480 --> 00:56:00,920
to Bill, but he believes that people like Jerry Con

953
00:56:01,079 --> 00:56:06,920
Richard Dawkins, Lawrence Krause, etc. Have been unfairly targeted by

954
00:56:07,000 --> 00:56:10,880
the woke libs who are now a cancer in the

955
00:56:10,920 --> 00:56:15,559
atheist movement. I had a chance to think about my

956
00:56:15,679 --> 00:56:18,320
most recent encounter with Bill. I think it was a

957
00:56:18,320 --> 00:56:21,519
couple of years ago on Facebook. I can't remember what

958
00:56:21,639 --> 00:56:24,159
I had posted online. I'm sure he considered it to

959
00:56:24,199 --> 00:56:28,199
be woke lib trash, and he swooped in out of

960
00:56:28,199 --> 00:56:31,599
nowhere into the comments section. We hadn't spoken in for it.

961
00:56:31,639 --> 00:56:34,119
I don't think we'd spoken since the last conference I

962
00:56:34,239 --> 00:56:37,519
was at, and he was pretty pissed. It's almost like

963
00:56:37,559 --> 00:56:40,639
we'd never met. Bill. We've had a friendly relationship, but

964
00:56:40,679 --> 00:56:43,000
he's obviously got a really bad taste in his mouth

965
00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:46,280
and he brought it to the show today, and I

966
00:56:46,400 --> 00:56:50,400
just I don't think it's unfair to say, maybe trans

967
00:56:50,480 --> 00:56:53,320
people deserve better than to be told they have broken

968
00:56:53,400 --> 00:56:57,119
brains and that might motivate them to grab weapons and

969
00:56:57,199 --> 00:57:02,239
massacre people in the streets. How was that unfair? You know,

970
00:57:02,320 --> 00:57:04,760
I've met a lot of trans people. I have trans

971
00:57:04,800 --> 00:57:07,000
friends and allies in my life. You know what the

972
00:57:07,039 --> 00:57:10,559
trans agenda is. They just want to live in peace.

973
00:57:11,599 --> 00:57:14,079
They want to be able to walk out the door

974
00:57:14,159 --> 00:57:16,639
and be who they are and be comfortable in their

975
00:57:16,679 --> 00:57:19,119
own skin. And many people are going to argue that

976
00:57:19,280 --> 00:57:24,440
Richard Dawkins and Jerry Coyn are evolutionary biologists, but there's

977
00:57:24,559 --> 00:57:28,440
a ton of other biology science coming in studies published

978
00:57:28,480 --> 00:57:31,159
in Nature. I just saw one recently from the Hudson

979
00:57:31,199 --> 00:57:35,079
Institute of Medical Research and elsewhere. Other biologists are saying

980
00:57:35,159 --> 00:57:38,639
we have discovered so much more about sex and gender

981
00:57:38,840 --> 00:57:44,159
beyond the gamytes right, whether it's brain science, genetic variations,

982
00:57:44,320 --> 00:57:48,719
other factors going on, this is a subject which deserves

983
00:57:48,840 --> 00:57:53,920
our compassion and a measured, thoughtful approach. And I don't

984
00:57:53,960 --> 00:57:58,159
think the previous call from Bill qualifies, but I will

985
00:57:58,239 --> 00:58:00,679
let you talk about it. Sure, I'm going to get

986
00:58:00,719 --> 00:58:04,800
crucified in the comments section. What else is new? Okay?

987
00:58:05,239 --> 00:58:08,760
What else is new? Anyway, that's the backstory which colors

988
00:58:08,840 --> 00:58:11,519
a little bit inside those lines, so you know a

989
00:58:11,559 --> 00:58:16,199
little bit more about what is going on. Okay, let's

990
00:58:16,239 --> 00:58:18,960
take a short break at that spot and I'll be

991
00:58:19,079 --> 00:58:29,159
right back with more of your calls next. So glad

992
00:58:29,199 --> 00:58:32,559
you are listening, So thankful you are part of this

993
00:58:32,719 --> 00:58:36,840
family and this community. You are much appreciated. We are

994
00:58:36,880 --> 00:58:42,119
talking to you about whatever is on your mind. Joe

995
00:58:42,199 --> 00:58:45,960
is dialing in. Joe, welcome, Thanks for waiting. What's up, hey,

996
00:58:46,000 --> 00:58:46,519
South thousand?

997
00:58:46,519 --> 00:58:46,880
Speaker 9: Things going?

998
00:58:47,519 --> 00:58:50,440
Speaker 2: I am just peachy. What's happening in your world? And

999
00:58:50,440 --> 00:58:51,519
what do you want to talk about?

1000
00:58:51,920 --> 00:58:52,760
Speaker 8: Well, not too bad.

1001
00:58:52,880 --> 00:58:57,800
Speaker 9: I'm down south of Tampa and I've had one burning

1002
00:58:57,920 --> 00:59:01,440
question that I've heard you dressed on other shows, and

1003
00:59:01,480 --> 00:59:03,960
this is since this is ask you anything I figured

1004
00:59:03,960 --> 00:59:05,760
I would do that I would ask you anything. So

1005
00:59:06,320 --> 00:59:09,519
I've heard you mentioned several times about the correct way

1006
00:59:09,599 --> 00:59:12,199
to load a dishwasher, and I'd love to keep on

1007
00:59:12,199 --> 00:59:12,800
that topic.

1008
00:59:15,159 --> 00:59:18,440
Speaker 2: Okay, Now this comes down to two different types of

1009
00:59:18,440 --> 00:59:23,360
people in this world. There's the person who loads the dishwasher,

1010
00:59:23,719 --> 00:59:26,760
and then there's the person who goes back, takes everything out,

1011
00:59:26,880 --> 00:59:30,320
and then reloads it because the first person apparently threw

1012
00:59:30,400 --> 00:59:32,880
the dishes in from the other side of the kitchen.

1013
00:59:33,039 --> 00:59:35,960
Which one are you? Are you meticulous or are you

1014
00:59:36,039 --> 00:59:38,880
the person who just haphazardly loads it up.

1015
00:59:39,920 --> 00:59:44,199
Speaker 9: Well, I've got my version of meticulous. Yes, where things

1016
00:59:44,280 --> 00:59:46,000
have to go in certain spots. I'm not going to

1017
00:59:46,039 --> 00:59:49,360
disagree with you on that, but I figured, being the

1018
00:59:49,440 --> 00:59:52,519
expert on that topic, you might have like a like

1019
00:59:52,599 --> 00:59:55,800
a loading map of your dishwasher. That's the shows where

1020
00:59:55,840 --> 00:59:56,679
everything goes.

1021
00:59:56,840 --> 01:00:02,280
Speaker 2: That's why it goes there. Lighthearted question after my previous calls.

1022
01:00:02,360 --> 01:00:06,800
So my thing is this, don't cover other dishes with dishes,

1023
01:00:07,159 --> 01:00:10,079
Like if there's a cup and it's facing down toward

1024
01:00:10,199 --> 01:00:13,039
the agitator and the sprayer, why would you put a

1025
01:00:13,079 --> 01:00:15,800
bowl or a cup over that Because it's not going

1026
01:00:15,840 --> 01:00:19,280
to be properly exposed to the washing mechanism. I don't

1027
01:00:19,320 --> 01:00:23,039
get that. And when I see this sort of weird layering,

1028
01:00:23,519 --> 01:00:26,199
it just does not work that way. Everything has to

1029
01:00:26,239 --> 01:00:31,039
be properly exposed to the mechanisms which clean the dishes.

1030
01:00:31,599 --> 01:00:36,039
And also there's a tetris element to it. So if

1031
01:00:36,039 --> 01:00:40,440
there's all this unused space, these weird little gaps, that's

1032
01:00:40,480 --> 01:00:42,519
a problem. You have to take everything out and you

1033
01:00:42,559 --> 01:00:45,000
have to make sure that you've assembled things so that

1034
01:00:45,079 --> 01:00:48,480
those little gaps are gone, or you've made room for

1035
01:00:48,840 --> 01:00:52,480
more dishes. More dishes can go in in the cycle.

1036
01:00:52,760 --> 01:00:55,480
Am I preaching the word? My friend? Do you are

1037
01:00:55,480 --> 01:00:57,920
you picking up what I'm throwing down?

1038
01:00:57,519 --> 01:00:58,360
Speaker 3: Amen?

1039
01:00:58,480 --> 01:00:59,880
Speaker 2: My brother, got You've got it.

1040
01:01:00,000 --> 01:01:00,760
Speaker 3: You've got it nailed.

1041
01:01:00,840 --> 01:01:04,760
Speaker 2: You've got it nailed. Thanks for thanks for the question.

1042
01:01:04,880 --> 01:01:07,320
You made us all smile. Anything else before I move?

1043
01:01:07,360 --> 01:01:08,960
Speaker 9: Oh yeah, that's what I wanted to. I just wanted

1044
01:01:09,000 --> 01:01:10,480
to lighten it up a bit. And one other thing.

1045
01:01:10,519 --> 01:01:12,599
And I don't know if you if you've considered this

1046
01:01:12,760 --> 01:01:15,159
or not, but I mean, since I started watching you

1047
01:01:15,199 --> 01:01:17,239
and listening to your podcast, I mean, I've got you

1048
01:01:17,280 --> 01:01:19,559
on Spotify, I listened to your short stories and all that,

1049
01:01:19,599 --> 01:01:20,280
and It's all great.

1050
01:01:20,320 --> 01:01:20,880
Speaker 3: I love it.

1051
01:01:21,000 --> 01:01:21,360
Speaker 2: Thank you.

1052
01:01:22,280 --> 01:01:24,320
Speaker 9: The one thing I think, I don't know if you

1053
01:01:24,440 --> 01:01:26,960
consider doing this or not. Have you ever considered being

1054
01:01:27,159 --> 01:01:30,679
a voiceover coach? And if not, why not? And if

1055
01:01:30,719 --> 01:01:34,119
you do, I would gladly hand over some cash.

1056
01:01:34,360 --> 01:01:37,760
Speaker 2: I'm not you know, I'm not Yoda on this stuff.

1057
01:01:37,639 --> 01:01:40,599
I've done it a long time. There are some trapdoors

1058
01:01:40,639 --> 01:01:44,159
I help people avoid when they ask. But you know,

1059
01:01:44,199 --> 01:01:46,199
there are so many people who do this better than

1060
01:01:46,239 --> 01:01:48,159
I do. There are you know. I've got a lot

1061
01:01:48,159 --> 01:01:51,360
of heroes in this business, and I guess these days

1062
01:01:51,360 --> 01:01:55,000
we're all on the bubble of being replaced by AI anyway,

1063
01:01:55,239 --> 01:01:58,960
so maybe I'll be obsolete in six months. I don't know.

1064
01:01:59,800 --> 01:02:02,119
But to you know, if you ever want any pointers

1065
01:02:02,199 --> 01:02:03,840
or tips, I can tell you what I think. You

1066
01:02:03,880 --> 01:02:06,280
can take it or leave it, drop me an email, okay.

1067
01:02:06,599 --> 01:02:07,159
Speaker 8: Sounds good.

1068
01:02:07,280 --> 01:02:08,159
Speaker 2: Appreciate you together.

1069
01:02:08,400 --> 01:02:09,320
Speaker 8: Thanks, I see you.

1070
01:02:09,440 --> 01:02:10,760
Speaker 3: Yep, have a good one.

1071
01:02:11,559 --> 01:02:14,440
Speaker 2: I mean, I've got opinions. Who doesn't have an opinion?

1072
01:02:14,559 --> 01:02:17,000
I know. One of the mistakes I made that I

1073
01:02:17,039 --> 01:02:19,320
tried to sound like an announcer when I was doing

1074
01:02:19,360 --> 01:02:24,159
professional radio stuff, doing commercials and a radio show where

1075
01:02:24,199 --> 01:02:26,840
you kind of punch. Those continents in radio we call

1076
01:02:26,880 --> 01:02:31,000
them pukers. Don't be a puker. Right at that point,

1077
01:02:31,039 --> 01:02:33,880
you're talking at people, You're not speaking to them. This

1078
01:02:33,960 --> 01:02:38,679
is a medium about relationships, right, be yourself if that's

1079
01:02:38,719 --> 01:02:40,800
a good thing. Unless you're an asshole, then don't be

1080
01:02:40,880 --> 01:02:48,199
that person. You talk to people, develop a relationship with people. Relax.

1081
01:02:48,599 --> 01:02:50,639
That was one of the big ones. I was also

1082
01:02:50,760 --> 01:02:53,639
amazed at how many people were told my family and

1083
01:02:53,679 --> 01:02:56,719
friends because they had a great deep voice, that they

1084
01:02:56,920 --> 01:03:00,920
should be good on a radio show, on a broadcast,

1085
01:03:00,960 --> 01:03:03,800
and that is very much not the case. I met

1086
01:03:03,840 --> 01:03:05,800
a lot of people. Hell, I tried to train a

1087
01:03:05,800 --> 01:03:08,840
lot of people in my FM days who had amazing

1088
01:03:09,000 --> 01:03:12,159
resonant sounds coming out of their mouth. They were the

1089
01:03:12,400 --> 01:03:16,920
worst broadcasters, communicators, storytellers. You couldn't relate to them. They

1090
01:03:16,920 --> 01:03:21,199
couldn't change three words together, even though they had raw materials.

1091
01:03:21,280 --> 01:03:26,000
This was not their gift. Their gifts lay elsewhere. And

1092
01:03:26,079 --> 01:03:28,199
yet because someone said, wow, you got a deep voice,

1093
01:03:28,239 --> 01:03:32,000
you'd be great, they just assumed they would be great. Meanwhile,

1094
01:03:32,519 --> 01:03:34,519
there are a ton of people who don't have that

1095
01:03:34,559 --> 01:03:39,159
sort of signature radio sound, who had such amazing personalities,

1096
01:03:39,159 --> 01:03:42,239
and they were so smart and funny and relational and

1097
01:03:42,280 --> 01:03:46,519
all those things that they were just must listen radio, right,

1098
01:03:47,280 --> 01:03:49,480
So don't let somebody put that in a box. It's

1099
01:03:49,519 --> 01:03:52,519
not about the tenor of your voice necessarily. It's about

1100
01:03:52,559 --> 01:03:56,320
what you do. You have microsoft word wonderful? Can you

1101
01:03:56,440 --> 01:04:02,079
write a best seller? These are two different questions. Practice

1102
01:04:02,159 --> 01:04:05,679
is a big thing, especially when you're starting out. Make

1103
01:04:05,920 --> 01:04:09,920
bullet point notes, cute cards, make notes on your phone, whatever,

1104
01:04:10,000 --> 01:04:14,480
and then use those guidelines the bullet points to practice

1105
01:04:14,599 --> 01:04:16,719
talking about what you want to talk about, I mean,

1106
01:04:16,920 --> 01:04:20,679
to yourself, if you're at home by yourself, if you're

1107
01:04:20,679 --> 01:04:22,960
in the car. The car is probably the best place

1108
01:04:23,000 --> 01:04:26,840
to practice doing a monologue or storytelling, because if you're

1109
01:04:26,880 --> 01:04:31,400
in an intersection and you're verbalizing something and another person

1110
01:04:31,480 --> 01:04:33,800
sees you through the window, you can act like you're

1111
01:04:33,800 --> 01:04:36,199
either singing or you're talking on the phone. You can

1112
01:04:36,239 --> 01:04:39,639
totally fake your way through it. But practice, practice, practice,

1113
01:04:39,679 --> 01:04:42,079
How in the world do athletes do what they do

1114
01:04:42,159 --> 01:04:46,079
without practice? Everybody in a profession needs to hone it,

1115
01:04:46,360 --> 01:04:49,119
work it out, figure it out, iron out the kinks

1116
01:04:49,159 --> 01:04:52,599
and the wrinkles, and vocal work is very much the

1117
01:04:52,679 --> 01:04:55,400
same way, and ultimately, at the end of the day,

1118
01:04:55,440 --> 01:04:58,079
I just tell people to play to their gifts. If

1119
01:04:58,079 --> 01:05:01,239
you're good at something, do that. If you know you're

1120
01:05:01,280 --> 01:05:04,039
not good at something and you probably won't ever get

1121
01:05:04,079 --> 01:05:06,840
good at that something, then maybe you should do something else.

1122
01:05:07,119 --> 01:05:08,880
I never want to kill a dream, but I'll tell

1123
01:05:08,920 --> 01:05:11,199
you I met a lot of people who had they

1124
01:05:11,239 --> 01:05:14,880
had visions of greatness and they couldn't talk their way

1125
01:05:14,920 --> 01:05:19,400
through an order at the McDonald's drive through. And sometimes

1126
01:05:19,400 --> 01:05:22,239
you have to protect people from themselves and just give

1127
01:05:22,280 --> 01:05:25,360
them the hard news this is not going to be

1128
01:05:25,519 --> 01:05:28,760
your thing anyway. Just a couple of things that popped

1129
01:05:28,760 --> 01:05:33,639
into my brain six'. Four one is dialing In. Hi

1130
01:05:34,280 --> 01:05:35,000
what's your? Name?

1131
01:05:35,480 --> 01:05:35,719
Speaker 10: Jan?

1132
01:05:36,239 --> 01:05:37,840
Speaker 2: Hi, jan appreciate. You what's?

1133
01:05:37,920 --> 01:05:38,119
Speaker 5: Up?

1134
01:05:38,320 --> 01:05:43,840
Speaker 10: Hi thanks for taking my? Call, yeah enjoying. Yourself just

1135
01:05:43,920 --> 01:05:48,159
have a question for you play do you identify as an?

1136
01:05:48,199 --> 01:05:49,639
Atheist rather than.

1137
01:05:49,519 --> 01:05:56,119
Speaker 2: Ask why DO i identify as an atheist rather than an? Agnostic,

1138
01:05:56,920 --> 01:06:01,079
Well i'm kind of both. AGNOSTIC i don't know that

1139
01:06:01,119 --> 01:06:05,400
there might not be something out there. SOMEWHERE i am

1140
01:06:05,440 --> 01:06:09,280
atheist BECAUSE i simply don't believe that there. IS i

1141
01:06:09,320 --> 01:06:12,199
haven't seen any evidence to suggest that there. IS i

1142
01:06:12,280 --> 01:06:17,239
know there's not an, involved, personal Theistic, God so why

1143
01:06:17,280 --> 01:06:19,480
does it have to be one or the. Other which are?

1144
01:06:19,519 --> 01:06:25,800
Speaker 10: You, okay, WELL i am, agnostic and my feeling is

1145
01:06:25,840 --> 01:06:32,559
that everyone it's. Agnostic, Christians, buddhists, atheists nobody really.

1146
01:06:32,280 --> 01:06:37,480
Speaker 2: Knows, Right but if they think they, know then they

1147
01:06:37,519 --> 01:06:39,519
are a. Believer they would not be.

1148
01:06:40,239 --> 01:06:44,519
Speaker 10: Agnostic, WELL i guess you have a. POINT i guess

1149
01:06:44,599 --> 01:06:49,440
it's just a matter of semantics that you. Know agnostic

1150
01:06:49,639 --> 01:06:55,400
is defined as that it can't cannot be, known so

1151
01:06:55,599 --> 01:06:58,079
nobody can really. Know it can't be.

1152
01:06:58,199 --> 01:07:01,280
Speaker 2: Known you AND i, agree even the people who say

1153
01:07:01,320 --> 01:07:04,880
they know the origin of all things do not. Know

1154
01:07:05,159 --> 01:07:07,400
the people who say that they know there is A

1155
01:07:07,400 --> 01:07:09,639
god do not. KNOW i mean we can look at

1156
01:07:09,639 --> 01:07:14,079
that and, say, okay, fine BUT i see identifying as

1157
01:07:14,119 --> 01:07:17,760
one or the other a product of agency you. Have you,

1158
01:07:17,800 --> 01:07:20,599
know this is how you brand. Yourself SO i don't

1159
01:07:20,679 --> 01:07:23,639
believe OR i don't, know but if someone says they,

1160
01:07:23,800 --> 01:07:26,280
DO i would be more apt to call them a. Believer,

1161
01:07:26,440 --> 01:07:28,320
PERSONALLY i don't get hung up too much on the.

1162
01:07:28,400 --> 01:07:31,440
Labels it is what it. Is knock yourself, out call

1163
01:07:31,519 --> 01:07:33,239
yourself whatever you, Want, Okay.

1164
01:07:33,559 --> 01:07:36,480
Speaker 10: Okay, Yeah LIKE i, say my point is to believe

1165
01:07:36,519 --> 01:07:40,519
that everyone is really. AGNOSTIC i, mean they can add

1166
01:07:40,559 --> 01:07:44,039
whatever they want to, that but they'll be everybody is

1167
01:07:44,079 --> 01:07:46,079
agnostic because there's no way that we can.

1168
01:07:46,119 --> 01:07:48,800
Speaker 2: Know how do you know there's no way we could ever?

1169
01:07:48,880 --> 01:07:53,599
Know what if one day we develop a method which

1170
01:07:53,840 --> 01:07:55,880
will tell us yes or. No i'm not ready to

1171
01:07:55,960 --> 01:08:00,599
give up just. Yet, okay you have a. Point will

1172
01:08:00,639 --> 01:08:04,280
we see the technology to probe the universe and check

1173
01:08:04,400 --> 01:08:06,360
under every cosmic rock for a?

1174
01:08:06,400 --> 01:08:06,679
Speaker 8: God?

1175
01:08:07,119 --> 01:08:10,280
Speaker 2: NAH i mean SO i understand what you're, saying but you,

1176
01:08:10,320 --> 01:08:12,840
KNOW i don't like to say we will never because,

1177
01:08:13,159 --> 01:08:15,559
hey what if we're all existing in a giant snow

1178
01:08:15,559 --> 01:08:19,279
globe somewhere and we discovered there might be? Something SO

1179
01:08:19,840 --> 01:08:22,199
i appreciate you calling, Though thanks so, Much, Jan.

1180
01:08:22,640 --> 01:08:23,439
Speaker 10: Thank you all?

1181
01:08:23,520 --> 01:08:26,800
Speaker 2: Right, Oh i've seen arguments online about. This are you

1182
01:08:26,840 --> 01:08:29,640
an ather used to an? Agnostics somebody was arguing about

1183
01:08:29,640 --> 01:08:33,960
whether or not rocks are agnostic or? Atheist And i'm, Like,

1184
01:08:34,039 --> 01:08:35,840
jesus is this what you want to do with your

1185
01:08:35,920 --> 01:08:39,600
time and? Energy you know What i'm, Saying is this

1186
01:08:39,680 --> 01:08:41,760
what you want to do with your time and? Energy

1187
01:08:42,279 --> 01:08:45,119
jeremiah's dialing in from four to three to. Two thanks for.

1188
01:08:45,159 --> 01:08:47,199
Waiting what's going? On, no not?

1189
01:08:47,319 --> 01:08:50,720
Speaker 8: Much hang, on, okay my one's not on. SPEAKER i

1190
01:08:50,800 --> 01:08:52,960
just wanted to pick your brain about movies BECAUSE i

1191
01:08:53,000 --> 01:08:54,119
hear you like horror. Movies.

1192
01:08:54,680 --> 01:08:58,720
Speaker 2: Movies, yeah, WELL i a lot of different types of,

1193
01:08:58,720 --> 01:09:01,279
movies BUT i do have a soft spot for the horror.

1194
01:09:01,359 --> 01:09:02,199
Genre what are you.

1195
01:09:02,239 --> 01:09:05,840
Speaker 8: Thinking, well there's a recent indie horror hit Called Iron.

1196
01:09:05,960 --> 01:09:06,880
Lung have you heard of?

1197
01:09:06,920 --> 01:09:09,560
Speaker 2: IT i. Have it was made on a shoe string

1198
01:09:09,600 --> 01:09:12,840
and it's well. Reviewed it's like folk, horror Like The

1199
01:09:12,880 --> 01:09:13,520
witch AS i.

1200
01:09:13,600 --> 01:09:17,199
Speaker 8: Understand oh, no it is cosmic.

1201
01:09:17,239 --> 01:09:19,680
Speaker 5: Horror. Really.

1202
01:09:20,359 --> 01:09:23,560
Speaker 8: Yeah it is a high concept sci fi setting involving

1203
01:09:23,600 --> 01:09:27,079
a cosmic. Being And i've seen it twice now BECAUSE

1204
01:09:27,119 --> 01:09:30,399
i really enjoyed. It and the thing that really stands

1205
01:09:30,399 --> 01:09:32,039
out to me is that it does not rely on

1206
01:09:32,159 --> 01:09:34,920
cheap jump. Scares it just puts scary things on the

1207
01:09:34,960 --> 01:09:36,119
screen and lets you sit with.

1208
01:09:36,159 --> 01:09:40,720
Speaker 2: It you know. WHAT i was thinking of another film

1209
01:09:40,960 --> 01:09:44,520
that is folk horror that was made for almost, nothing

1210
01:09:44,520 --> 01:09:47,840
AND i got those two. Conflated, okay so you're saying

1211
01:09:47,880 --> 01:09:50,000
it's worth a. WATCH i THINK i saw it listed

1212
01:09:50,119 --> 01:09:52,880
on shutter or. Something SO i, Mean i'll give it

1213
01:09:52,880 --> 01:09:53,640
a watch if you like.

1214
01:09:53,680 --> 01:09:56,520
Speaker 8: IT i highly recommend. It it's a good. Time it

1215
01:09:56,720 --> 01:09:59,079
just benefit greatly from a second. Viewing it's one of

1216
01:09:59,119 --> 01:10:02,199
those movies that is not interested in answering your questions.

1217
01:10:02,239 --> 01:10:05,319
Easily it wants you to THINK i have.

1218
01:10:05,920 --> 01:10:09,039
Speaker 2: Been reading That Mike, flanagan who is a genius behind

1219
01:10:09,079 --> 01:10:12,880
films Like hush and the Series The haunting Of Hill

1220
01:10:12,920 --> 01:10:14,960
house And The fall of The house Of husher and,

1221
01:10:15,079 --> 01:10:20,039
others has made Another exorcist. Film, now NORMALLY i would

1222
01:10:20,079 --> 01:10:24,680
Hear exorcist film and say stop, it, right it's been

1223
01:10:24,760 --> 01:10:28,600
fifty three, years just stop. It but because It's.

1224
01:10:28,439 --> 01:10:30,680
Speaker 8: Mike flann the same Way, Aliens i'm.

1225
01:10:30,680 --> 01:10:35,960
Speaker 2: In because It's Mike, FLANAGAN I i'm. Going he's the

1226
01:10:36,000 --> 01:10:39,239
one GUY i would trust to be a. Steward AND

1227
01:10:39,359 --> 01:10:41,800
i don't know if he can make it spooky or scary.

1228
01:10:41,920 --> 01:10:44,399
AGAIN i, mean The exorcist was scary WHEN i was

1229
01:10:44,439 --> 01:10:47,319
a believer because of all the demonic, stuff and nineteen

1230
01:10:47,359 --> 01:10:50,439
seventy three was very much right at the beginning of

1231
01:10:50,479 --> 01:10:52,800
The satanic, panic and there were all These it really

1232
01:10:52,840 --> 01:10:55,119
was lightning in a bottle and then all the sequels

1233
01:10:55,159 --> 01:10:58,279
came along in a squillion different, ripoffs and you, know

1234
01:10:58,319 --> 01:11:01,239
it robbed it all of its. Power you, know The

1235
01:11:01,319 --> 01:11:04,760
Linda blair, jokes you, know the vomiting peace soup, jokes

1236
01:11:04,800 --> 01:11:07,720
all those. Things But Mike flanagan might be able to

1237
01:11:07,760 --> 01:11:09,720
pull it. Off it. RELEASES i think in a few

1238
01:11:09,720 --> 01:11:13,439
WEEKS i will be watching. Closely, Okay, Jeremiah.

1239
01:11:12,760 --> 01:11:14,560
Speaker 8: Well thank you for putting that on my. RADAR i

1240
01:11:14,560 --> 01:11:15,359
will also be watching.

1241
01:11:15,399 --> 01:11:18,000
Speaker 2: It all, right we'll all watch, yours you watch, mine

1242
01:11:18,039 --> 01:11:18,399
and we'll.

1243
01:11:18,399 --> 01:11:21,560
Speaker 8: Rendezvous, okay all, right, Excellent thanks for talking to, me you,

1244
01:11:21,680 --> 01:11:22,159
later all.

1245
01:11:22,159 --> 01:11:25,239
Speaker 2: Right, Bye. OKAY i went and looked At april. Fast

1246
01:11:25,279 --> 01:11:27,800
the ONE i was thinking of at first Was mother Of,

1247
01:11:28,039 --> 01:11:31,079
flies which was made for like a buck and a,

1248
01:11:31,199 --> 01:11:34,680
half directed by a guy Named John. Adams of all,

1249
01:11:34,760 --> 01:11:38,319
things it's like a, dark, magic witchy folk horror kind of.

1250
01:11:38,359 --> 01:11:40,640
Thing so that was the. One i'm always up for,

1251
01:11:40,680 --> 01:11:43,840
that AND i love a good indie, flick somebody thinking

1252
01:11:43,880 --> 01:11:47,199
out of the, box shooting a movie with you, know

1253
01:11:47,319 --> 01:11:50,439
a handheld and no. Budget. Hell one of my favorite

1254
01:11:50,479 --> 01:11:54,199
horror movies of all time is Called, host came out

1255
01:11:54,359 --> 01:11:59,359
five six years, ago shot entirely with cell. Phones it's

1256
01:12:00,079 --> 01:12:06,039
refine and it's. Awesome let's call that a show and

1257
01:12:06,399 --> 01:12:09,520
we'll do it again next. Time thank you so much for.

1258
01:12:09,560 --> 01:12:11,840
Listening hang in, There i'll see you.

1259
01:12:11,880 --> 01:12:15,880
Speaker 1: Soon Follow The Thinking atheist On facebook And twitter for

1260
01:12:15,960 --> 01:12:19,600
a complete archive of podcasts and, videos products like mugs

1261
01:12:19,600 --> 01:12:22,720
and t shirts featuring The Thinking atheist, logo links to

1262
01:12:22,920 --> 01:12:26,720
atheist pages and, resources and details on upcoming free thought

1263
01:12:26,720 --> 01:12:31,640
events and. Conventions log onto our, Website The thinkingatheist dot.

1264
01:12:31,680 --> 01:12:34,319
Com