Speaker 1: Understand the thinking atheist. It's not a person, it's a symbol,
an idea.
Speaker 2: The population of atheists this country is going through the.
Speaker 1: Rule, rejecting faith, pursuing knowledge, challenging the sacred. If I
tell the truth, it's because I tell the truth, not
because I put my hand on a book and made
a wish and working together for a more rational world.
Speaker 2: Take the risk of thinking. Feel so much more happiness. Truth,
Fusian wisdom will come to you that way.
Speaker 1: Assume nothing, question everything, and start thinking. This is the
Thinking Atheist podcast hosted by Seth andrews.
Speaker 3: Oh.
Speaker 2: I woke up cranky today, he ever, just wa wake
up cranky for no reason that you're aware of. You
can't think, well, there's one trigger. There's something that bothered me.
I saw a news report or had an argument or whatever.
You just woke up cranky. That's me. Natalie's like, well,
something must have upset you. What specifically happened. I can't
put a finger on it and just grabby. Don't have
any bandwidth, short fuse, not in the mood. I know
you know exactly what I'm talking about. I know it.
Some days you think maybe this is not the day
I should be having personal encounters. They shouldn't be going
out and dealing with people. And it passes. It usually passes,
but it's like you wake up wrong. I woke up wrong.
So that's what you got to today. This is what
you're stuck with. My apologies in advance. Yeah, maybe I
should have. Actually, we got Chinese food yesterday, and of
course always comes with a little fortune cookie, and I
ask for extra because I love the taste of a
fortune cookie. Maybe my fortune is going to be a
good one. Hang on, let me see what my fortune is.
I purposefully left it sealed and wrapped so this would
be a surprise for both of us. I'm sure this
will be some sort of a sacarin horror effects evergreen
kind of thing. But let's see what it says. Okay,
regularly engage in acts of kindness and generosity. Yeah, yeah,
today's not the day. Fortunately, I now have a fortune cookie.
Just knock on the day, call me if you'd like
to talk about something today. I enjoy these sort of
popa reshows. I do themed broadcast. Sorry I'm still chewing.
I do theme to broadcast. Last week we talked to
a spiritual atheist and we've done stuff on Christian nationalism.
We debunk the Bible with Justin de Z I like
the themed stuff, and then we break it up with
just Poe Poree shows where you decide what we want
to chat about. And there's so much going on in
the world. Everybody's still talking about the Super Bowl, Bad Bunny, etc.
And the Epstein files. Jamie Raskin is grilling Pam Bondy
at the time of our conversation today over the fact
that the government was required to make all the files available.
It has not, and the files that it has made
available are so heavily redacted that they scream cover up. Plus,
while they were required by law to cover up the
names of the victims, many of whom have not previously
been known. They are anonymous for a reason. They are
victims who do not want to be known publicly. Those
names have been released, and the perpetrates are being redacted
and blanked out and covered up. And what the actual
hell and where is the bad Bunny level of outrage? Oh?
Worst super Bowl halftime show ever, worst ever, not a
word of English all these people. But it's funny because
all the people who were pissed off about Bad Bunny
you can tell that they didn't watch the kid Rock
Alternative show at Turning Point, USA, because they were bitching
about all the specific stuff at the Super Bowl, which
had a record audience for the halftime. And I watched it.
Did I understand a word of what he was singing? Hell? No,
I don't speak Spanish do I kind of wish there
had been some subtitles so I can understand what was
being sung. Okay, cool, But I wasn't threatened by it.
I wasn't bothered by it. I thought it was kind
of awesome. And then when I saw the symbolism and
so much of what was going on, like the power lines,
at first I wasn't connecting the dots. Well, that was
a referendum on the fact that the United States had
left Puerto Rico essentially in the dark on the power
grid after the massive storms devastated the area. We just
left him hanging. And you know the messages about love
and inclusion, right, the only thing more powerful than hate
is love. We are all Americans. These are not controversial
points of view, and part of me is like, why
not mix it up, Let's get a variety of cultures.
Why would thirteen minutes be threatening to anybody who wasn't
already in outrage mode. This is a culture disperate to
be persecuted, right. I didn't see one white face during
that halftime show. This is an outrage. I'm just like,
what's wrong with people? Why wouldn't you? And I said,
that's kind of cool. It's different. We are celebrating part
of our culture. Oh I wish they'd have brought an
American on, And I'm like, do you understand that Puerto
Rico was part of America? You know, it's a we're
all America anyway, and the listing of the Americas, you know,
and just the whole vibe is positive. Who can turn
a positive and do a negative? Who can take the
bright cloud and find the dark lining? Right, the silver
cloud with the black lining? Who can find that better
than freaking outrage culture? Megan Kelly lost her mind over
the super Bowl, and I am here for it. I'm
here for it. Let her wail and gripe and bitch
and I just knock you to knock yourself out. Of course,
I saw a lot of people who were like, well,
I don't watch football because I'm like, you know, this
kind of superior thing. I don't really watch football either.
So what somebody likes football, let him like football. I
think we've all got our distractions. You know, you do
sci fi television, you collect stamps, you do collectibles. You
know you work on cars, you play dungeons, and I
can who gives a shit? Find what you love and
stop dissing other people. If they happen to love football.
I'll watch the game and enjoy it. I kind of
get it fine, And I follow the NFL. It's not
really my bag. I get around people and they're talking specifics.
You know, so and so ran for one hundred and
thirty yards and someone shows a candidate for the MBF
Trophy of the Hall of Fame of the dah blah,
and I just drool at them. I'm like, if we
were talking about Classic star Trek, I can play. I
can do that. But if you're asking me about football stats,
fantasy football, way over my head. But I don't look
at them with that eyebrow of judgment and go, you
drugla DUTs, you primitive, primitive people who love football. You
like football? Great? Do you think stop being freaking snobs
about everything? Anyway? I digress. Sorry, I just got a
text from a friend of mine who is traveling in Florida,
and so this is a random thing. She sends a
message to Natalie and Me with an update, And here's
what I'm doing down in Florida. A friend of mine
gave me this little tidbit of information that I did
not previously know. Apparently, in Florida, when the temperatures drop
below what fifty iguanas will fall from the sky. Really
wait a minute, lizard rain. Lizard rain in Florida. And
I guess this is legit. I'm gullible, you know, so,
I mean, I'll believe a lot of stuff. Apparently they
go into a kind of hibernation way up in the
branches of whatever tree they happen to be in because
it's freaking cold, and then they hit the ground motionless,
and they look down. They are not dead, and people
have to be told don't like bury throwaway the iguana
body because it's still alive. And he just took a
very long fall because the weather made him freeze. He
goes into a lizard coma. I did not know this
was a thing. I have learned some new information that's
wild to me. It's wild. Back to the Super Bowl, sorry.
Back to the super Bowl, and again the phone lines
are open. If anybody wants to talk about whatever's on
their mind, I would love to talk to you. There
were a ton of commercials about A. Now Big Tech
is really trying to shove AI down our throats. I
just read that Mozilla Firefox is going to be the
first high profile web browser that's going to allow people
to opt out of AI options, which I think it's
about freaking ton because every time I pull up a
search engine, it says AI, and then if I search
for something, the first answer is AI, and I'm like, well,
I would rather have a vetted, reputable source, thank you
very much. I can't trust AI. Maybe it's a guide
that points me in a certain direction toward a reputable source,
but I'm I don't trust it, and with good reason.
And Big Tech has put so many of their cards
on AI investing. They have had major, major investors put
billions and billions of dollars into AI because they are
all expecting a suite return. And yet there are warnings
everywhere about an AI bubble, like the dot com bubble,
It's going to spike for a few and then it's
going to fall apart. People are not buying what AI
is selling. I mean overall, overall, in very specific ways.
I know a lot of people who enjoy chad GPT.
I've used it myself, we've all dabbled in it. But
people are resentful and they're resisting and distrustful. So we're
watching all the Super Bowl commercials. The best one, I
think was the Budweiser commercial with the eagle and the horse.
It was so beautiful, But a lot of the other
ones were about AI. One of them was about a
lost dog and AI cameras ring cameras, which are these
doorbell cameras and you know, you ring them and then
you know, the person in the house can see who's
on the porch. It's a security thing, a convenience thing. Well,
now apparently there's a mode for lost dogs where the
camera can be on or activate if a dog wanders
into your yard or on the porch, and then that
ring camera talks to all the other ring cameras and
then the dog is maybe identified and the owner is
discovered and the dog is returned home. So the idea
behind the commercial was this is amazing technology because little
Fifi is going to be able to find a safe
way back to his or her parents. And on the surface,
I understand what they were trying to do. But I
watched it, and apparently millions of other people watched it,
and they got the chills because they didn't just see
little Fife getting found and returned safely home. They saw surveillance,
state surveillance, state camera's watching everywhere, facial recognition, reporting, reporting reporting.
Are you added than to a database we know to
a degree it's already happening. Right You can't even drive
your car under a light pole or a bridge without
having your license plate documented. Did you ever see those
shows where somebody's trying to escape the law and they're
in a vehicle and cameras pick up a license plate
number three states away and immediately the Feds know where Tom.
It's already happening. There's probably a satellite overhead right now
watching me. I mean, I'm not opposed to using new
technology to find a lost dog. I mean, what are
the tanks that you can embed in their collars and
then if they do happen to run away, there is
a way to log on and GPS them so you
can see them wherever they're wandering about. You can go
find them. I mean, that's I think a little bit
different than Hey, let's you scan everybody who approaches your
property and then add them to a database which is
shared and utilized and even monetized by somebody. I mean,
that's that's kind of a different conversation. Anyway, let's talk
to you. I've got Brian on the line at nine
to eight. Brian, are you there?
Speaker 4: Hi, Seth. I've listened to your show on and off
for a little while, and I hear a lot of
things that you say that have really resonated with me,
and so I just fancied Colin in today while I
was out uber driving to kind of get your opinion
on something. It kind of deals with some things that
you've said in videos that have been I think several
months back, regarding how we relate to people that supported
Trump in twenty twenty four. One of the things that
came out in your videos, you said that they had
invited an arsonist into your house, And I guess I
kind of have always had that sentiment because I feel
like I was able to recognize a lot of what
was going on even before Trump was on the scene.
I think probably you and a lot of people were
able to as well. You know, even back in like
two thousand and nine, when we started to see like
the noise that the Westboro Baptist Church was making and
the Birtherism movement, we saw these strains of the Ku
Klux Klan and the rise of American fascism, and I
was telling everybody around me, those are Nazis. They're just
waiting on a Hitler at this point, and I felt
like it could have been Rick Santorum in twenty twelve,
but it turned out that it took four more years,
and it was much much more disappointing because it had
to have that sad like deflated americanized mythology that only
the stupidity of early twenty first century reality television could create.
And so I feel like at this point, with everything
that we've seen, that somebody who voted for Trump in
twenty sixteen could have been stupid. They could have just
been dumb. And even in twenty twenty, after the ludicrous
speech that he gave on the fourth of July and
the kerfuffle and Lafayette Square, you were likely evil, but
you still could have just been seriously, seriously dumb. But
after the events of January sixth and espousing all of
these Nazi influencers and everything support for him in twenty
twenty four, With all of that information on the table,
I feel like has really nailed a lot of people
that I grew up around, and even people that I've
been friends with for my whole life in a category
where you are either so evil that you are just irredeemable,
or you're so catastrophically and dangerously stupid that any reasonable
adult in the room has to treat you as though
you are evil because agency on your part in the
world at large is just going to end up killing
people completely unnecessarily and for unbelievably dumb reasons.
Speaker 3: And watching all.
Speaker 4: This unfold and this kind of feeds into the question
that I want to ask, and the opinion that I
wanted to get from you is I've got a five
year old daughter, she'll be six very soon, and I'm
staring at the barrel of this burgeoning Christian nationalism the
eyes of a parent that's witnessing these people trying to
take hold for reasons that, you know, beyond just like
hating people that are a different color than them. Many
of them also seriously hate women, and it tears me
up because when I look at this realistically, I view
all of these people supporting him, really, no matter what
reasons they supported him for, as people who essentially have
fired a gun at my child, and it fills me
with just frightening levels of rage. I didn't know that
I could be this angry at people, and it scares me,
and it also has kind of kickstarted me to this
kind of frantic like you know, what can I do?
I think a lot of us are probably in that
headspace where we're like, what can we do to make
a difference? What can we do to course correct? And
lately I've been considering getting into politics, trying to run
for some kind of office. I'm a white guy. I'm
a straight white guy, and because of this, you know,
if we put all of the moral problems with MAGA
aside and we just look at the hard arithmetic reality
that we live in a country that has admitted that
it would rather elect possibly its worst white man than
one of its best and brightest women of color, I
wonder if right thinking white guys kind of have a
responsibility to try and get to the front. And I
worry as well about my particular motivations, if that motivation
is informed by an urgency that came from this gut
churning rage that I'm dealing with. I wonder like, if
we're just talking about any random gray blob of a person,
do you think somebody like that should even consider running
for office in this country?
Speaker 2: I think circumstances. I'm not sure if I like the
word radicalize, although it does happen, but they activate. I mean,
I'm like, if you're not angry, you're not paying attention
the fact that you are feeling to your marrow. That
kind of anger means that you have a compass and
that it does matter, and you're thinking beyond yourself. You're
thinking about your family, You're thinking about your human family.
You're outraged at the outrageous that's motivated a lot of
people to move out into activist circles, including politics. I
wouldn't discard that at all. You don't sound like someone
who is leading with unchecked rage, where it's just raw, unfettered,
unconsidered emotion. I feel like you have reasoned through why
this stuff makes you so angry, and it resonates. I
think your words actually resonate with a lot of people
who are listening now, they're like, yes, I know exactly
what he means. I would support that in a candidate,
some kind of a leader somewhere who was able to
give voice to the rest of us. I think that's
totally valid. It's almost like when you come out of religion,
some people apologize. You know, I went through my angry
phase when I left religion. Well, anger is totally understandable.
You are angry at the fact that you would waste
the time. You're angry at the fact that you aren't
being treated fairly by the fundamentalists who are taking you
not very seriously on your journey or cutting you off.
Anger then motivates you to want to go out and
make the path easier and better for other people. I
think that's totally valid. I think those reasons are just
as valid, if not more than any others. Embrace it
as long as it doesn't overwhelm, consume, and ruin you.
I think anger is an understandable and often productive thing.
I get angry as well.
Speaker 4: Okay, well, thank you so much for your time. Seth's
that's all I wanted to ask.
Speaker 2: Well, you're very kind. I don't I mean, I'm not
an expert, but I am an activist who has come
out of high control environments, and I've been watching what's happening,
and I'm angry and it motivates much of what I do.
Doesn't make me irrational, it just means I'm I got
my eyes open. So hang in there, Brian. Appreciate you
so much. How many people saw an injustice and they
were outraged. Christy Burke I mentioned her friend of mine
who is running for office. She was outraged. Former fundie
Christian who is now a freethinker online, has her own
YouTube channel and has done a lot of good work
out there helping others to deconstruct his seeing the rise
of Christian nationalism, and has decided, you know what, I'm
going to get even more in the game. She is
outraged at the outrageous and she is now going to
run for office. Good. What a great motivator that anger
has been means she's paying attention, wants to make a difference.
That's awesome. Short break, Lots more to talk about with you,
and we will do that next. On the event calendar
for twenty twenty six, we are just a few tickets,
I think less than twenty five tickets from selling out
March seventh with myself, Forrest Valci and Gotsig given in Tulsa.
There is the Western Canadian Reason Conference first weekend of
May in Calgary, Baja, KHN. August twenty first through twenty
third in Sarnia, Ontario, Rocket City Reason and Huntsville, Alabama,
third weekend in October. More events being added all the time.
Just bookmarkt and check it often for tickets and details.
The Thinkingatheist dot com slash events and I've got hal
dialing in from Canada, al what's up?
Speaker 5: Well A short intro here. I'm seventy one years old,
and I became an atheist the honest way by looking
for God. As I like to say, I've had all
three Christian baptisms. I spoke in tongues at nineteen, and
strange enough, after I converted to Russian Orthodoxy about twenty
five years ago. I realized then that I just could
not do those daily rituals, and I said to myself,
what are you doing? This is seventh century mysticism, and
so a long story short, I gave it up, and
here I am. And I've been following you Seth since
the days before you went public with your identity, so
you know how long ago that is.
Speaker 2: Let's see, I think I first showed my face in
twenty eleven. You've been with me for a decade.
Speaker 5: Old half before then, before then, when you had the
thinking atheists on there, and I stumbled across, I said, well,
who's this guy's This guy's like my brother from another mother.
Speaker 2: According to the note I have here, you're calling about
something that we as atheists have in common. What would
that be?
Speaker 5: Well, here's the thing, Now, here's the thing. At first,
I became a diehard atheist. I became, you know, very
antitheists and everything. My YouTube, my first YouTube channel was
Lord's Sawceness, like I was a representative on Earth of
the flying Spaghetti Monster as a way of being fartastic.
And then I became strident atheist, and then it became
the secular atheist. And now I've kind of toned down
a bit. And you know it really got me going
was my mother passed away in twenty fifteen, and she
was a Christian and she knew exactly what happened to me.
And I asked her, I said, Mom, before you die,
give me some advice that I can carry with me.
So did she tell me to go back to church
get right with God. No, she said this to me,
be good to people.
Speaker 3: That's all.
Speaker 5: Just be good to people. That was her advice to me.
And you know, Seth, we all know when we're not
being good to somebody. We know what being good to
people means. And that got me thinking and rolling in
my mind. And now I'm just you know, like I
saw that earlier today, that the lady you had on
about spiritual atheism, and I thought, you know, I wouldn't
call myself a spiritual atheist, but I really enjoyed that
because it made me. It reminded me of the only
thing I have in common with somebody else who is
an atheist is the fact that they don't believe in God.
That's it. We can have zero in common. I like
a lot of things in life. I like music, I
like playing guitar, I like working out, I like health,
I like science. I can have all that in common
with many theists and zero of that in common with
any atheists. So I don't walk around in the morning
and say, oh, you know, God, I'm an atheist. I
wake up and enjoy the things I like to enjoy
and I've come to learn that whether you're a good
person or a bad person, if you're a Christian or
an atheist, that's just an add on tag at the
end of you being good or bad.
Speaker 2: This speaks to the larger point that values are more
important than beliefs. I've met some amazing atheists, and I've
met some horrible atheists. I've met some wonderful Christians and
terrible Christians. It really comes down to values. So if
somebody says, I believe in Jesus, but we align in
terms of humanism and protecting other people, condemning cruelty, take that.
We can talk about theology down the way. But I've
got a lot of believers in my own life, so
I take your point. I think it's a good one.
Same here.
Speaker 5: I mean, all we've got to do is look what
Mega is doing right now. And I'm thinking to myself,
you know, I know my Bible real well. I probably
forgot more about the Bible than most any maga Christian
would know. And I know right away watching Donald Trump,
he is the exact description of the anti Christ in
the Bible that saying should come if possible to see
the elect Well, if we're going to consider born than
Christians to be the elect? Are they not fully being
the seed?
Speaker 3: Right now?
Speaker 2: Let meet you on that one. How let meet you
on that one. Okay. Now, I may have thoughts and
I'm going to attempt to nuance, but be safe over
there in Windsor, Ontario. And I look forward to being
in Canada here in a few months. Okay, my friend, I.
Speaker 5: Want to try and get up there or see you there.
Thanks for talking to me so appreciate pleasure.
Speaker 2: I should do a whole show on this. There is
an idea that people say that maga Christianity is not
true Christianity. We're going to have to define true Christianity.
And the problem is is that people make a religion
in their own image. So somebody can be a progressive
Christian and they are a true Christian. My allies, who
are believers, whether it's Amanda Tyler or April la Joy
or somebody else, they're Jesus followers and they are legitimately
true Christians. Okay. The people who aren't engaged at all
in scripture, but they said the prayer and believe in
Jesus are true Christians. They're Christians, all right. The people
who are fundamentalist, dominionist, Old Testament hell fire Christians are Christians.
So I think the whole no true Christian or they're
not practicing Christianity correctly ignores the fact that Christianity has
a thousand different shades, and I think most of them
are Christians. You believe in Jesus and in some way
you hold to the Bible or Christian values. You identify
a Christian, You're a Christian. You are a Christian. So
again we have to peel that back and say, what
kind of freaking person are you? Are you kind? Are
you generous? Are you nasty? Are you cruel? Are you bigoted?
Are you an egalitarian? Do you see us all as
the human condition? Or are you a supremacist of some kind?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 2: That speaks two values. Now again, the two are married
and they often exist in the same space, which is
why you can see those who love the God of
judgment and those who love a God of love and acceptance.
But they're all Christians. And this gets so messy. It's
so hard to navigate these conversations, especially in the online space.
George is dialing in from five to four zero. Welcome George,
thanks for calling.
Speaker 6: Hi.
Speaker 7: You got it wrong, but that's.
Speaker 2: I want to get it right. It says, George, what
is your name, Lina? How in the world did it
give me George? Lena?
Speaker 7: I gave them my last name.
Speaker 2: I blame AI for this. I don't care if it's
responsible or not. I'm just in that kind of crabby mood.
All right, Lena, let's talk what's on your mind.
Speaker 7: I just wanted to say thank you for everything you do.
I'm an eighty year old atheist and I became an
atheist at fifteen, and I wanted to quickly give you
my dee conversions, which is very short. I was thirteen
and I was becoming moving in my Sunday school from
older children to the young adult and my Sunday school
teacher took me aside and explained to me why slavery
was right, that God had condoned slavery, and that there
was nothing wrong with slavery, and I was horrified. I
didn't say anything because nobody spoke to you adults other
than to say yes, sir. But anyway, I went home
that day from Sunday school and started reading the Bible
because I was certain that God did not condone in slavery.
It didn't take me long to find out that yes
he did. Indeed, I had never even heard of atheism,
and so for two years I believed this God was
going to send me to hell because I would not
worship an evil god. Finally, at fifteen, I learned about atheism.
I think I got it from Mark Twain, who was
a favorite of mine, And at that time I became
an instant atheist. And that's my story. But I listened
to you guys all the time, and I really have
difficulty understanding how Christians read the passages on slavery. And
don't understand, I mean, just excuse it. And that's that's
really my one question.
Speaker 2: I think people, except for a number of reasons. You
look at the two major determiners of someone's religious belief,
family and geography. Right where were you born? What was
the religion of your parents? In the church, we called
it the four to fourteen windows. So when I was
a very very very young child, the same people who
taught me how to tie my shoes and made sure
I had food in my belly and put a roof
over my head that I trusted for so much, you know,
to protect and educate me in this world. Those same
people told me that there was a god in heaven
and it was the Christian God in the Bible is true.
And then they put me in a culture of reinforcement.
Whereverwhere I went, everybody was like that Christian school, Christian music,
Christian a peril, Christian culture, et cetera. And it becomes
your normal. Then they embed fear. So just like you,
you dare to question, you dare to acknowledge, doubt. You
think I'm going to cook forever, I'm going to be
earning and screaming forever. In hell, God's going to judge me.
You're taught to doubt yourself, trust, not in your own understanding.
All these things plus other issues. Religions like to grab
people at a vulnerable spot in their lives. This is
why we see addiction recovery and divorce recovery and other programs.
You find somebody at a low point and then you
love bomb them and they feel validated and attended to
and part of a community, and they respond emotionally to that.
And then once you've made that relationship, you've kind of
married yourself to the religion. It becomes a matter of
defending your decision to believe or to stay in the belief,
And somebody comes to you and they're like, well, Adam
and Eve falls apart, and there was no global flood
and people didn't live to be a thousand years old,
and there weren't sea monsters, and slavery is wrong and
blah blah blah. Instead of immediately saying, oh, well, I
need to dismantle or at least analyze this, you defend
it and you're like, whoa, whoah, Because if it's not true,
what are the consequences? The house of cards comes down,
you may be back at square one, or worse, does
your community cast you off? Do you go to hell?
If you're wrong? There's so many thousands upon thousands of
reasons that people accept the unacceptable, that they rereason the unreasonable.
And so while I'm not a psychologist, I've been around
the block a few times and I was indoctrinated. It
took me a long time to crawl out. So sometimes
I beat myself up for being an idiot, and other
times I give myself grace and say, you were a
kid and they didn't give you a choice. Give yourself
credit for finally getting there. I don't know. Does that
make any sense to you, Lena, Yeah, it does.
Speaker 7: I never told anybody in my family that I was
an atheist.
Speaker 2: And why not because I knew.
Speaker 7: They would come down on me like a ton of bricks. Yeah,
so I just kept it to myself. But I didn't
go to church anymore, and that I took flat for that.
But since a lot of my cousins didn't go to
church even though they believed, they let it go.
Speaker 2: It's remarkable that you figured it out so young, and
I so admire you and your journey, and I'm thankful
for your kind words, Lena. It just made my day
much appreciated.
Speaker 7: Well, I appreciate everything you do. Thank you so much.
Speaker 2: All Right, be safe out there, take care, okay.
Speaker 3: Bye.
Speaker 2: Sometimes I'll run into antitheists and they're so condescending to
the believers. Grow up, grow up, Santa Claus. For adults
on the surface, I get it, but it's so dismissive.
It's not compassionate, it's not empathetic, it's not humanistic. It's
just superior, snobby and kind of shitty. Yeah, that's a
whole other show. I've got a four oh five area
code that sounds like Oklahoma. Hi, what do I call you?
Speaker 3: This is Paul.
Speaker 2: Hi, Paul, thanks for calling. What's up?
Speaker 3: Well?
Speaker 6: I just want to first off, thank you very much
because about well, it was right around COVID that I
started waking up and I used to be a night
janitor and I couldn't listen to your podcast without screaming.
But I was glad that I was a knight janitor
because I could yell. And now you know, all these
years later, I finally looked at it with a much
more nuanced approach, and I just was thankful for what
you had on yesterday with the spiritual or two days
ago or something with a spiritual atheist. I would have
screamed at that when I first became an atheist, but
I kind of landed there myself.
Speaker 2: Why did you scream when you first listened to my show?
Speaker 6: Because I was raised Southern Baptist and a church family,
a preacher family, and I was beaten severely and abused emotionally,
and everything you said I was just the trauma. I
wasn't mad at you. I was screaming because I was saying,
I can't listen to these topics without getting mad.
Speaker 2: It's understandable. I think people who have been beaten up
by high control cultures should be angry. You know, I
don't know where you are in your journey. Are you
doing better today?
Speaker 6: I'm doing a lot better. So what I did was
I was the anger atheist for a while. But I'm
very curious, and so I got into quantum physics and
a bunch of different other studies of Buddhism stuff like that,
and I kept realizing, and I don't want to scare
off listeners, but I kept realizing that everyone that looks
for a higher power keeps pointing to a certain thing,
that we are all connected. And I'm not saying that's God,
but that's where I.
Speaker 2: Land now, Like we are all the human condition and
we control our destinies. Is that what you're saying.
Speaker 6: Well, at first I thought it was we are all
just ones and zeros, and I I was very comfortable
with that, But then I kept saying, no, I have
felt things. I feel a connection between people. And then
you look at quantum entanglement, and Einstein talked about a
booky action at a distance, and there are just certain
things that connect us throughout the universe that we can't explain.
And I'm not saying it's God. I definitely know it's
not the God of the Bible, but there is something
out there, and that's why I was just happy that
you had that person on the other day.
Speaker 2: Quantum entanglement is something that I, a layperson, had to
look up just now. The phenomenon wherein the quantum state
of each particle in a group cannot be described independently
of the state of the others, even when the particles
are separated by a large distance.
Speaker 6: There does seem to be something out there that connects us.
Speaker 2: A spiritual force, something that is an energy or are
we just talking about how we perceive each other as
part of the human condition, Fellow travelers, how do you
mean it?
Speaker 6: Well, in the sense of the hippies, how we are
all cells and everything is a vibration. We keep with
the tools that we have, we keep looking. We thought
that this most thing was atoms, but then we saw
that we got down to the plank length, and with
more tools, we'll keep getting farther and farther down, and
we see that everything is just vibrations that make up
a whole scene that we say is reality. And that
seems to be well, like ninety of what our atmosphere is.
We don't know what it is. We call it dark energy,
and that sounds a lot like God as described in
the Bible or other religions. Are you tracking well.
Speaker 2: I'm trying I understand what you are saying. Sorry, I
turned my volume down because every Wednesday at noon they
fire off the tornado sirens in Oklahoma to test them.
You know, we're getting into spring tornado season, and so
I'm sitting here listening intently, and all of a sudden,
that siren, which is three blocks from me, starts sounding
at high volume, and all the dogs start to howl,
et cetera. It's just one of those weird things. But yes,
I am listening. I'm going to be a hard sell
on the vibrations thing. I mean, Einstein gets invoked even
by Christians, by other religious people, so I mean Einstein
was into a lot of things. He certainly didn't believe
in a personal God because he told us so. But
you know, the idea that we are all connected by
a vibrating energy, that's a hard cell for me. I
will say that I'm open if evidence becomes available. In
the meantime, I think we should invent quantum Buddhism, because
you talked about both of those and I was like, oh,
you know, I maybe we can combine those two so
we can meditate and vibrate together. Maybe you and I
can start that quantum Buddhism. How's that sound.
Speaker 6: I like that?
Speaker 2: Okay, I don't know. You know, I'm not a physicist.
I'm a little bit dubious about the vibrating energy thing.
What I really like for me is to see each other,
as you know, we choose to see each other as
a connected species, connected to all living things into each other.
That's magical enough for me. But it's an interesting topic.
And I appreciate you calling.
Speaker 6: Well, thank you for all you what you do.
Speaker 2: Be very kind, all right, be good. Tornado sirens you
can tell people who live in Tornado Alley because whenever
there are warnings and the radar turns dark red or
purple and the sirens are going off, most of us
run outside with our cell phone cameras. They said it
was coming in from the southwest. You turn southwest. You're
watching the clouds. There's a roiling green kind of low
cloud and the air down here is still, and it's
really muggy. It's got almost a certain smell to it,
tornado weather and the like. Will I catch rotation on
my camera? I gauged the distance to my in ground
underground storm shelter. It's in my garage, and so we've
got the dogs ready and we know where the cat
is and we're you know, we're ready to go underneath.
But until I absolutely have to, I want to catch
a video, right, I want documentation. I want to see
what's going on. And I fantasize, and I'm sure I
wouldn't do this, but if the thing's passing a block
from me, I'm in the shelter with the garage door open,
and I've got my hand and a phone sticking out
the top, how's the footage? Should I shoot it vertically
or horizontally? I find tornadoes exhilarating. I've been through two
in my life. One was a direct hit. It actually
sort of skipped just over my house, the house I
was living in I was five years old, through the
neighbor's roof in our yard and we lost a few shingles.
And my family was convinced this was Jesus. Jesus, Jesus
caused that tornado to skip right over. We should have
been hit directly by that June eighth tornado. Oh but
the Lord smiled on us, and I'm like, well, this
poor bastard who lives next to us, he just lost
half his house. God's like, I screw that guy, We're
gonna help you. It just didn't make any sense to
me anyway. I'm sorry. I totally, I totally. I got
Bill at two five zero, Bill, are you with me?
Speaker 3: I'm with you? Set. It's Bill Lidgerwood of Imagine No Religion.
Speaker 2: Bill, I've done. I spoke at that event through two
three times something like that.
Speaker 3: I think you were a regular.
Speaker 2: Yeah, dude, it's been a long time. How are things
up north?
Speaker 3: Some things are going well here? How are you and
your lovely wife?
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, the country's on fire and people suck,
but beyond that we're delightful. Actually, yeah, that's unfair. A
lot of really good people are doing really good things.
But I don't know if you guys get those headlines
up north. But there are people who are going to
be in late March again, marching in public by the millions.
They're calling their representatives, they're going online sounding the alarm.
We've got Olympic athletes overseas who are saying, we love
our country, we're happy to represent it, but we don't
agree with all the horrible stuff that's going on. So
I haven't completely given up on my country. But you
get it, right, it's crazy down here.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, oh yeah, we get it for sure. It's
unbelievable actually to look at what's going on down there.
But you know what, it's not. It's not a lot
better here. It's just more undercover here. I live in
British Columbia, which is probably the wokest province of Canada,
possibly the wokest place in the world. I think that's
where woke was invented. Anyway, One of the things I
wanted to just mention to you is we just had,
actually yesterday a school shooting in a small town in
northern BC called tumblr Ridge. This guy killed ten, killed
ten people, killed himself, wounded twenty something in a tiny
little town in a junior secondary school. And all I'm
hearing and of course this is this is awful, and
the fact that it was they couldn't describe, they couldn't
describe this guy before they knew that he was dead,
and they were putting out warnings. But they said it
was a woman in a dress with brown hair. Well
it wasn't. It was a trans guy in a dress,
brown hair, and they still did right now, won't even
identify him as a heat anyway, that's beside the point.
All the politicians, of course, are oh, we're praying for
the for the victims, and I'm like, well, it's a
bit late for that, isn't it. I mean, God, if
you have, if there's a god, he allowed this to happen,
and you're praying for the victims. Like, it's pathetic really
when they do that, and they do it all the
time here, your country, everywhere. Yeah, so that's.
Speaker 2: What's going on here. It's uh, hang on just a second.
I mean, so, if it was a trans person who
identifies as a woman, is that what happened? Yes, okay,
your beef is what that the trans problem? It's a
man ah, which explains earlier.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's yeah, it's not a woman. It's it's a guy.
It's a man.
Speaker 2: You and I are going to probably have a disagreement
as to you know, the person identifies as a woman.
I don't know that person's story, but it sounds to
me like you're not going out after the murderer as
much as you're going after the trans person who was woke?
Who was? I mean, what are you trying to tell me?
Speaker 8: Bill?
Speaker 3: No, I'm not going after the murderers, just that he
should be described accurately, especially when he's on the loose.
When they think he's on the loose, everybody's looking for
a woman. It's not a woman, it's a man. That's
my point. Of course, I'm talking about the murder, and
I'm talking about how the media describes it, and in
all these woke terms, they refused to say it was
a trans person.
Speaker 2: Due they won't even say that.
Speaker 3: I am the media, all the media.
Speaker 2: You and I I think if I recall, Bill, wasn't
there a conversation we had a long time ago about
some of the people that we disagreed with on some
of these subjects, and I think the word woke had
come up where you were were you defending Lawrence Krause
and a few others.
Speaker 3: Absolutely?
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well you realize how problematic Krause has become. And
of course now we see an association with Jeffrey Epstein, etc.
I mean, I worry that you may not be on
the right side of some of these critical and I
think humanistic conversations. This needs to be treated with compassion.
These are human beings who identify in a very specific way,
and so I think you and I may they do,
stand very much apart on a great much of this.
I'm so sorry about you know what had happened in Canada.
I've been so busy perusing our headlines. I hadn't seen those.
Do you know what motivated the shooting? Was it a
mentally ill person? Was it politically motivated, a combination something else?
Speaker 3: What happened, Well, they don't know, but of course it's
a mentally ill person. Anybody that thinks for the opposite
sex is.
Speaker 2: Meant Jesus Christ. Bill, We're talking about a shooter, and
I'm asking if that person was motivated for an agenda
of some kind. And the first place you go is
that they are broken because they are trans You're not
going to get that platform here. You and I stand apart,
and I think it's disrespectful. It's disrespectful to me, to
the show and to our listeners to call up and
dehumanize people in that way. I just disupernize them. You
are very much real dehumanizing. You are very much telling
the truth, Removie. Well, you can say the word truth
over and.
Speaker 3: It's about telling the truth. It's about dealing with facts
and science.
Speaker 2: You can say truth and facts. And you know who
else says truth in facts? Religious people of all the truth,
conspiracy theorists say truth in facts. It doesn't make them
truth in facts. Bill, You and I simply stand apart,
and I don't find this a charitable or productive conversation.
I would rather us look at what truly motivated the
violence in Canada. Not that they were trans but what
truly motivated it? What was the agenda? What actually happened,
because I pretty much can tell you it's not because
the person identified as a man or a woman. This
is someone who simply wants to come the terms with
who they are. I mean, what else was going on?
I'll look the story up. I'd like to see how
the news has reported. Maybe maybe there's something that you
and I could both discover. Is that fair?
Speaker 3: Well? You will never know because he killed himself and
he killed his parents.
Speaker 2: You don't know that. We won't know. Is there a
paper trail where their emails are? Their forums? Are there?
Is there are there social media. Have you ever heard
about someone who mash who is involved in a mass shooting,
and after they are killed by the police or whatever,
or killed themselves, we discover a paper trail. There are
motivational posts on social media. Some people write manifestos, some
people actually write letters to explain why they did what
they did. We can be a forensic examiner at the
crime scene, so I'm not going to say we can't know.
I think we must try our best to know. That's fair,
isn't it, Bill, Yes, of course it's let's do that.
You must try our best to know. Let's do it.
Speaker 3: Let the media won't tell us even if we do know,
how about that because they refuse to acknowledge the fact,
the simple fact. So they're not going to tell us.
I mean, if he did this because he was motivated
by his trans cult, then they will never tell us that.
Speaker 2: Bill. I'm gonna let you go. I wish you the best,
Thank you so much. All right, We'll see you later.
Jesus Okay. I debated as to whether or not to
leave that phone call in the final edit of this
show before release. But we're all adults here, and it
provides me a chance to maybe clarify some stuff, and
none of this is unfair to Bill, just backstory. So
Bill and his wife were just lovely hosts for that
event in Canada Imagine No Religion, and there were a
lot of great people on the stage. Bradley o'neishi, who
is one of the hosts of the Straight Wide American
Jesus podcast and he's been going hard at Christian nationalism.
Just a lovely Miriamnimazi human rights activist who has been
standing up for women in Islamic nations and beyond. I
was there with Matt Delahunty and ur and Raw. We
brought the Unholy Trinity to a big Saturday night show
at IANR and it was just a blast, and it
was universally positive. I never heard a bad word about
anybody's behavior or conduct, but we know that there were
some people on stage who have since become very problematic.
Right as the information came out, Jerry Coin, author of
Why Evolution Is True, a book which really helped me.
Jerry's gone out and said some very unfortunate things about
trans people. Same with Richard Dawkins. Dawkins has been in
the hot seat with his conflict with Rebecca Watson. Watson
said she was inappropriately or uncomfortably approached at a pre
thought event, and Dawkins essentially told her to stop whining,
grow up, get over it. And then Dawkins identified a
few years ago as a cultural Christian and started singing
the praises of the great American Elon Musk. So I've
been watching this guy whose book The God Delusion was
so instrumental in my life. I mean, it was a
seminal work in my life. They've just changed my life.
It's been hard to watch this guy slip off the
rails and go down into oblivion. And then, of course
there is Lawrence Krause, theoretical physicist, but it comes to
light that he has been accused on many fronts of
sexual misconduct and appropriate behavior freethought conferences at the university.
I think it was Case Western University, where he was
serving as professor. There were allegations. BuzzFeed had a big
article which released about it in twenty eighteen, listing the victims.
Lawrence Kraus denied the allegations that it was all a
bunch of crap. Arizona State University, where Kraus was a professor.
I think he was heading up the Origins project. There,
they did their own investigation and found what they called
a preponderance of evidence enough for them to essentially recommend
that he be removed from his post. He was gone
from the university in short order. And so Lawrence Krauss,
as you know, he has just been one of those
falling stars, a guy you're like you were a science
educator at the top of his game, a household name
in your field, and look, you know, I feel like
you just self immolated. Well, now we've got the Epstein
files and the names of various scientists listed in the files.
And this gets messy because Jeffrey Epstein operated a bunch
of foundations that actually funded different science events. So at
one point, I think there was a physics conference in
two thousand and six, and he had twenty of the
physicists from the conference that one of his foundations helped
to fund. They traveled to his island. Who knows what
happened there could have been everything, it could have been nothing.
We have no idea. We know that there were people
like Neil Schuben, the scientist, the palaeontologist who was just
appointed to head up the National Academy of sciences. He
said that he had met Jeffrey Epstein, there was a
listing of his name at some encounter, but he said
he immediately distanced himself, so there was really nothing there.
We don't know what the relationship with Richard Dawkins was.
It looks like he was kind of on the outside.
I think he had maybe email Lawrence Krauss about his
own frustrations about being poorly treated by those movement feminists
who need to grow up and grow his skin, and
Kraus forwarded those onto Ebstein or something along those lines.
I'll have to go back and look that up to
get more specific, or you can as well. I want
to make sure that I'm not being unfair, but you
get it. Krause himself, according to the recently released documents,
can be seen having one on one email exchanges with
Jeffrey Epstein where Lawrence is asking for Jeffrey's advice on
how to deal with all of these sexual misconduct allegations. Hey,
what do you think I ought to do about all this?
I guess this is PR reputation management something along those lines.
He's asking Epstein for counsel. I don't know how much
Lawrence Krause knew. You don't know how much Lawrence Krause knew,
but I am hearing nothing but alarm bells on this one.
A guy with a history of sexual misconduct allegations asking
for advice says to how to deal with the accusations
from Jeffrey Epstein. I think that connection is an awfully
big coincidence, if ever there was one. But I'll leave
the speculation to everybody else, so let's try to work
the evidence. The bottom line is this, when I ask
Bill about Lawrence Krause, he is still a defender of
Lawrence Krause because and I don't think this is unfair
to Bill, but he believes that people like Jerry Con
Richard Dawkins, Lawrence Krause, etc. Have been unfairly targeted by
the woke libs who are now a cancer in the
atheist movement. I had a chance to think about my
most recent encounter with Bill. I think it was a
couple of years ago on Facebook. I can't remember what
I had posted online. I'm sure he considered it to
be woke lib trash, and he swooped in out of
nowhere into the comments section. We hadn't spoken in for it.
I don't think we'd spoken since the last conference I
was at, and he was pretty pissed. It's almost like
we'd never met. Bill. We've had a friendly relationship, but
he's obviously got a really bad taste in his mouth
and he brought it to the show today, and I
just I don't think it's unfair to say, maybe trans
people deserve better than to be told they have broken
brains and that might motivate them to grab weapons and
massacre people in the streets. How was that unfair? You know,
I've met a lot of trans people. I have trans
friends and allies in my life. You know what the
trans agenda is. They just want to live in peace.
They want to be able to walk out the door
and be who they are and be comfortable in their
own skin. And many people are going to argue that
Richard Dawkins and Jerry Coyn are evolutionary biologists, but there's
a ton of other biology science coming in studies published
in Nature. I just saw one recently from the Hudson
Institute of Medical Research and elsewhere. Other biologists are saying
we have discovered so much more about sex and gender
beyond the gamytes right, whether it's brain science, genetic variations,
other factors going on, this is a subject which deserves
our compassion and a measured, thoughtful approach. And I don't
think the previous call from Bill qualifies, but I will
let you talk about it. Sure, I'm going to get
crucified in the comments section. What else is new? Okay?
What else is new? Anyway, that's the backstory which colors
a little bit inside those lines, so you know a
little bit more about what is going on. Okay, let's
take a short break at that spot and I'll be
right back with more of your calls next. So glad
you are listening, So thankful you are part of this
family and this community. You are much appreciated. We are
talking to you about whatever is on your mind. Joe
is dialing in. Joe, welcome, Thanks for waiting. What's up, hey,
South thousand?
Speaker 9: Things going?
Speaker 2: I am just peachy. What's happening in your world? And
what do you want to talk about?
Speaker 8: Well, not too bad.
Speaker 9: I'm down south of Tampa and I've had one burning
question that I've heard you dressed on other shows, and
this is since this is ask you anything I figured
I would do that I would ask you anything. So
I've heard you mentioned several times about the correct way
to load a dishwasher, and I'd love to keep on
that topic.
Speaker 2: Okay, Now this comes down to two different types of
people in this world. There's the person who loads the dishwasher,
and then there's the person who goes back, takes everything out,
and then reloads it because the first person apparently threw
the dishes in from the other side of the kitchen.
Which one are you? Are you meticulous or are you
the person who just haphazardly loads it up.
Speaker 9: Well, I've got my version of meticulous. Yes, where things
have to go in certain spots. I'm not going to
disagree with you on that, but I figured, being the
expert on that topic, you might have like a like
a loading map of your dishwasher. That's the shows where
everything goes.
Speaker 2: That's why it goes there. Lighthearted question after my previous calls.
So my thing is this, don't cover other dishes with dishes,
Like if there's a cup and it's facing down toward
the agitator and the sprayer, why would you put a
bowl or a cup over that Because it's not going
to be properly exposed to the washing mechanism. I don't
get that. And when I see this sort of weird layering,
it just does not work that way. Everything has to
be properly exposed to the mechanisms which clean the dishes.
And also there's a tetris element to it. So if
there's all this unused space, these weird little gaps, that's
a problem. You have to take everything out and you
have to make sure that you've assembled things so that
those little gaps are gone, or you've made room for
more dishes. More dishes can go in in the cycle.
Am I preaching the word? My friend? Do you are
you picking up what I'm throwing down?
Speaker 3: Amen?
Speaker 2: My brother, got You've got it.
Speaker 3: You've got it nailed.
Speaker 2: You've got it nailed. Thanks for thanks for the question.
You made us all smile. Anything else before I move?
Speaker 9: Oh yeah, that's what I wanted to. I just wanted
to lighten it up a bit. And one other thing.
And I don't know if you if you've considered this
or not, but I mean, since I started watching you
and listening to your podcast, I mean, I've got you
on Spotify, I listened to your short stories and all that,
and It's all great.
Speaker 3: I love it.
Speaker 2: Thank you.
Speaker 9: The one thing I think, I don't know if you
consider doing this or not. Have you ever considered being
a voiceover coach? And if not, why not? And if
you do, I would gladly hand over some cash.
Speaker 2: I'm not you know, I'm not Yoda on this stuff.
I've done it a long time. There are some trapdoors
I help people avoid when they ask. But you know,
there are so many people who do this better than
I do. There are you know. I've got a lot
of heroes in this business, and I guess these days
we're all on the bubble of being replaced by AI anyway,
so maybe I'll be obsolete in six months. I don't know.
But to you know, if you ever want any pointers
or tips, I can tell you what I think. You
can take it or leave it, drop me an email, okay.
Speaker 8: Sounds good.
Speaker 2: Appreciate you together.
Speaker 8: Thanks, I see you.
Speaker 3: Yep, have a good one.
Speaker 2: I mean, I've got opinions. Who doesn't have an opinion?
I know. One of the mistakes I made that I
tried to sound like an announcer when I was doing
professional radio stuff, doing commercials and a radio show where
you kind of punch. Those continents in radio we call
them pukers. Don't be a puker. Right at that point,
you're talking at people, You're not speaking to them. This
is a medium about relationships, right, be yourself if that's
a good thing. Unless you're an asshole, then don't be
that person. You talk to people, develop a relationship with people. Relax.
That was one of the big ones. I was also
amazed at how many people were told my family and
friends because they had a great deep voice, that they
should be good on a radio show, on a broadcast,
and that is very much not the case. I met
a lot of people. Hell, I tried to train a
lot of people in my FM days who had amazing
resonant sounds coming out of their mouth. They were the
worst broadcasters, communicators, storytellers. You couldn't relate to them. They
couldn't change three words together, even though they had raw materials.
This was not their gift. Their gifts lay elsewhere. And
yet because someone said, wow, you got a deep voice,
you'd be great, they just assumed they would be great. Meanwhile,
there are a ton of people who don't have that
sort of signature radio sound, who had such amazing personalities,
and they were so smart and funny and relational and
all those things that they were just must listen radio, right,
So don't let somebody put that in a box. It's
not about the tenor of your voice necessarily. It's about
what you do. You have microsoft word wonderful? Can you
write a best seller? These are two different questions. Practice
is a big thing, especially when you're starting out. Make
bullet point notes, cute cards, make notes on your phone, whatever,
and then use those guidelines the bullet points to practice
talking about what you want to talk about, I mean,
to yourself, if you're at home by yourself, if you're
in the car. The car is probably the best place
to practice doing a monologue or storytelling, because if you're
in an intersection and you're verbalizing something and another person
sees you through the window, you can act like you're
either singing or you're talking on the phone. You can
totally fake your way through it. But practice, practice, practice,
How in the world do athletes do what they do
without practice? Everybody in a profession needs to hone it,
work it out, figure it out, iron out the kinks
and the wrinkles, and vocal work is very much the
same way, and ultimately, at the end of the day,
I just tell people to play to their gifts. If
you're good at something, do that. If you know you're
not good at something and you probably won't ever get
good at that something, then maybe you should do something else.
I never want to kill a dream, but I'll tell
you I met a lot of people who had they
had visions of greatness and they couldn't talk their way
through an order at the McDonald's drive through. And sometimes
you have to protect people from themselves and just give
them the hard news this is not going to be
your thing anyway. Just a couple of things that popped
into my brain six'. Four one is dialing In. Hi
what's your? Name?
Speaker 10: Jan?
Speaker 2: Hi, jan appreciate. You what's?
Speaker 5: Up?
Speaker 10: Hi thanks for taking my? Call, yeah enjoying. Yourself just
have a question for you play do you identify as an?
Atheist rather than.
Speaker 2: Ask why DO i identify as an atheist rather than an? Agnostic,
Well i'm kind of both. AGNOSTIC i don't know that
there might not be something out there. SOMEWHERE i am
atheist BECAUSE i simply don't believe that there. IS i
haven't seen any evidence to suggest that there. IS i
know there's not an, involved, personal Theistic, God so why
does it have to be one or the. Other which are?
Speaker 10: You, okay, WELL i am, agnostic and my feeling is
that everyone it's. Agnostic, Christians, buddhists, atheists nobody really.
Speaker 2: Knows, Right but if they think they, know then they
are a. Believer they would not be.
Speaker 10: Agnostic, WELL i guess you have a. POINT i guess
it's just a matter of semantics that you. Know agnostic
is defined as that it can't cannot be, known so
nobody can really. Know it can't be.
Speaker 2: Known you AND i, agree even the people who say
they know the origin of all things do not. Know
the people who say that they know there is A
god do not. KNOW i mean we can look at
that and, say, okay, fine BUT i see identifying as
one or the other a product of agency you. Have you,
know this is how you brand. Yourself SO i don't
believe OR i don't, know but if someone says they,
DO i would be more apt to call them a. Believer,
PERSONALLY i don't get hung up too much on the.
Labels it is what it. Is knock yourself, out call
yourself whatever you, Want, Okay.
Speaker 10: Okay, Yeah LIKE i, say my point is to believe
that everyone is really. AGNOSTIC i, mean they can add
whatever they want to, that but they'll be everybody is
agnostic because there's no way that we can.
Speaker 2: Know how do you know there's no way we could ever?
Know what if one day we develop a method which
will tell us yes or. No i'm not ready to
give up just. Yet, okay you have a. Point will
we see the technology to probe the universe and check
under every cosmic rock for a?
Speaker 8: God?
Speaker 2: NAH i mean SO i understand what you're, saying but you,
KNOW i don't like to say we will never because,
hey what if we're all existing in a giant snow
globe somewhere and we discovered there might be? Something SO
i appreciate you calling, Though thanks so, Much, Jan.
Speaker 10: Thank you all?
Speaker 2: Right, Oh i've seen arguments online about. This are you
an ather used to an? Agnostics somebody was arguing about
whether or not rocks are agnostic or? Atheist And i'm, Like,
jesus is this what you want to do with your
time and? Energy you know What i'm, Saying is this
what you want to do with your time and? Energy
jeremiah's dialing in from four to three to. Two thanks for.
Waiting what's going? On, no not?
Speaker 8: Much hang, on, okay my one's not on. SPEAKER i
just wanted to pick your brain about movies BECAUSE i
hear you like horror. Movies.
Speaker 2: Movies, yeah, WELL i a lot of different types of,
movies BUT i do have a soft spot for the horror.
Genre what are you.
Speaker 8: Thinking, well there's a recent indie horror hit Called Iron.
Lung have you heard of?
Speaker 2: IT i. Have it was made on a shoe string
and it's well. Reviewed it's like folk, horror Like The
witch AS i.
Speaker 8: Understand oh, no it is cosmic.
Speaker 5: Horror. Really.
Speaker 8: Yeah it is a high concept sci fi setting involving
a cosmic. Being And i've seen it twice now BECAUSE
i really enjoyed. It and the thing that really stands
out to me is that it does not rely on
cheap jump. Scares it just puts scary things on the
screen and lets you sit with.
Speaker 2: It you know. WHAT i was thinking of another film
that is folk horror that was made for almost, nothing
AND i got those two. Conflated, okay so you're saying
it's worth a. WATCH i THINK i saw it listed
on shutter or. Something SO i, Mean i'll give it
a watch if you like.
Speaker 8: IT i highly recommend. It it's a good. Time it
just benefit greatly from a second. Viewing it's one of
those movies that is not interested in answering your questions.
Easily it wants you to THINK i have.
Speaker 2: Been reading That Mike, flanagan who is a genius behind
films Like hush and the Series The haunting Of Hill
house And The fall of The house Of husher and,
others has made Another exorcist. Film, now NORMALLY i would
Hear exorcist film and say stop, it, right it's been
fifty three, years just stop. It but because It's.
Speaker 8: Mike flann the same Way, Aliens i'm.
Speaker 2: In because It's Mike, FLANAGAN I i'm. Going he's the
one GUY i would trust to be a. Steward AND
i don't know if he can make it spooky or scary.
AGAIN i, mean The exorcist was scary WHEN i was
a believer because of all the demonic, stuff and nineteen
seventy three was very much right at the beginning of
The satanic, panic and there were all These it really
was lightning in a bottle and then all the sequels
came along in a squillion different, ripoffs and you, know
it robbed it all of its. Power you, know The
Linda blair, jokes you, know the vomiting peace soup, jokes
all those. Things But Mike flanagan might be able to
pull it. Off it. RELEASES i think in a few
WEEKS i will be watching. Closely, Okay, Jeremiah.
Speaker 8: Well thank you for putting that on my. RADAR i
will also be watching.
Speaker 2: It all, right we'll all watch, yours you watch, mine
and we'll.
Speaker 8: Rendezvous, okay all, right, Excellent thanks for talking to, me you,
later all.
Speaker 2: Right, Bye. OKAY i went and looked At april. Fast
the ONE i was thinking of at first Was mother Of,
flies which was made for like a buck and a,
half directed by a guy Named John. Adams of all,
things it's like a, dark, magic witchy folk horror kind of.
Thing so that was the. One i'm always up for,
that AND i love a good indie, flick somebody thinking
out of the, box shooting a movie with you, know
a handheld and no. Budget. Hell one of my favorite
horror movies of all time is Called, host came out
five six years, ago shot entirely with cell. Phones it's
refine and it's. Awesome let's call that a show and
we'll do it again next. Time thank you so much for.
Listening hang in, There i'll see you.
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