WEBVTT 1 00:00:01.879 --> 00:00:04.400 Okay, we are alive. How this is William Ramsey. Welcome 2 00:00:04.480 --> 00:00:06.919 to William Ramsey Investigates. On today's show. I have a 3 00:00:07.000 --> 00:00:09.800 very special guest of returning guest. We spoke back in 4 00:00:09.839 --> 00:00:13.279 September of twenty twenty two about a book I was 5 00:00:13.320 --> 00:00:16.120 interested in, and the full title of the book we 6 00:00:16.199 --> 00:00:19.719 talked about two years ago is It's Not about the sex. 7 00:00:19.879 --> 00:00:23.600 True stories of human trafficking from a law enforcement officer, 8 00:00:23.760 --> 00:00:29.000 a survivor, a brothel madam, and an advocate. And the 9 00:00:29.000 --> 00:00:31.120 book has become even more timely now. We were just 10 00:00:31.199 --> 00:00:33.960 kind of chatting in the pre show about so much 11 00:00:33.960 --> 00:00:36.039 as in the news, and like I was mentioning to 12 00:00:36.159 --> 00:00:39.000 him some of my recent experiences I had staying at 13 00:00:39.000 --> 00:00:42.439 a hotel and also just hearing other stories. I think 14 00:00:42.439 --> 00:00:45.079 it's the head of the DHS as a homan or 15 00:00:45.119 --> 00:00:47.399 something that's going to be a new guy. Like all 16 00:00:47.439 --> 00:00:51.799 of these places where they're builders are building new apartments 17 00:00:51.840 --> 00:00:54.880 or something like that, they have kind of their own 18 00:00:55.039 --> 00:00:59.119 sex workers attached to these projects and things like that, 19 00:00:59.200 --> 00:01:00.920 and that's just the tip of the iceberg. And it's 20 00:01:00.920 --> 00:01:04.560 incredible that you pay taxes to have your government kind 21 00:01:04.560 --> 00:01:06.680 of bungle these things, but that's not what we're gonna 22 00:01:06.680 --> 00:01:09.439 We're gonna kind of mention that today. But the reason 23 00:01:09.519 --> 00:01:13.760 for this interview is that John D. Girolamo has has 24 00:01:14.560 --> 00:01:16.519 published a new book. And if you're watching this on 25 00:01:16.879 --> 00:01:20.560 x rockfin or Rumble, the full title of this book 26 00:01:20.640 --> 00:01:23.599 is It's Not about the d E V I L 27 00:01:23.680 --> 00:01:26.000 Devil spelled a little differently, it's not about the devil 28 00:01:26.159 --> 00:01:29.359 or not about the Evil. Subtitle is true Stories about 29 00:01:29.359 --> 00:01:32.200 fighting evil in the modern world. A police officer battles 30 00:01:32.239 --> 00:01:36.400 online predators, abortion doctor transforms into your pro life advocate, 31 00:01:36.480 --> 00:01:41.079 and the extorcist team confronts diabolic forces. So it's broken 32 00:01:41.120 --> 00:01:44.359 into three parts. And I was just kind of reading 33 00:01:44.439 --> 00:01:49.000 through his website, which is it is not about dot com. 34 00:01:49.000 --> 00:01:51.400 So it's all the words it's not it's it's I 35 00:01:51.560 --> 00:01:54.239 T I S N O T A B O U 36 00:01:54.319 --> 00:01:56.599 T dot com. So he's an author speaker. He has 37 00:01:56.640 --> 00:01:59.719 two other books. One is It's Not About the Badge, 38 00:01:59.719 --> 00:02:02.239 Real Cops, Real Stories join their Journey, and the other 39 00:02:02.239 --> 00:02:04.920 one is It's Not About the Predator Parents Guide to 40 00:02:05.000 --> 00:02:08.479 Internet and Social Media Safety, which is very important these days. 41 00:02:09.000 --> 00:02:11.680 I just hear so many stories, just even recent stories 42 00:02:12.120 --> 00:02:18.000 through pau person online. Somebody told crazy stuff and then 43 00:02:18.159 --> 00:02:21.479 you know, these horrible events occurs. So there's a lot 44 00:02:21.479 --> 00:02:24.560 of that. It ties into this book. It's not about 45 00:02:24.599 --> 00:02:28.000 the devils. So John di Jirolama, welcome back to the show. 46 00:02:29.560 --> 00:02:32.319 Hey, thanks for having me. Really appreciate to be back. 47 00:02:32.680 --> 00:02:34.560 Excellent. So for people we haven't talked in a couple 48 00:02:34.560 --> 00:02:36.840 of years, maybe you can just for people who haven't 49 00:02:36.840 --> 00:02:39.039 heard our earlier interview, maybe you could just do an 50 00:02:39.080 --> 00:02:42.039 overview of your career. I have some of the stuff 51 00:02:42.080 --> 00:02:45.080 that you had at the back of the book about 52 00:02:45.080 --> 00:02:47.719 the book and that you're a member of the Christian 53 00:02:47.759 --> 00:02:53.680 Author's Network Christian Indie Publishing Association also speaker. Like I said, 54 00:02:53.719 --> 00:02:55.639 maybe you can just do an overview of your background 55 00:02:55.919 --> 00:02:57.639 and what led up to writing this new book. 56 00:02:57.680 --> 00:03:01.879 It's not about the double so you know I wrote 57 00:03:01.879 --> 00:03:05.000 the first book. It's not about the badge featuring police 58 00:03:05.000 --> 00:03:09.159 officers during the kind of the George Floyd twenty twenty 59 00:03:09.240 --> 00:03:11.960 type of era where I really I didn't feel like 60 00:03:12.120 --> 00:03:14.800 police officers were given a voice, and I wanted to 61 00:03:14.840 --> 00:03:17.960 do that, and so I wanted to get the human side. 62 00:03:17.960 --> 00:03:20.479 Who's that person behind the badge? And one of the 63 00:03:20.479 --> 00:03:25.639 guys I was interviewing would ask easy questions at the end, 64 00:03:25.840 --> 00:03:28.120 you know, what's your favorite song, what would you do 65 00:03:28.159 --> 00:03:30.719 if you want the lottery? And he just sort of 66 00:03:30.759 --> 00:03:34.120 stopped stone cold and said, I'd quit my job and 67 00:03:34.240 --> 00:03:37.919 hunt down human traffickers. And I was kind of stunned 68 00:03:37.919 --> 00:03:42.400 by this response, And at that moment, I knew that 69 00:03:42.719 --> 00:03:45.520 I had my next book, and more importantly, I didn't 70 00:03:45.520 --> 00:03:47.919 know anything about human trafficking. So it's sort of set 71 00:03:47.960 --> 00:03:51.680 me down this path to find out more and tell 72 00:03:52.159 --> 00:03:55.800 the stories of real people from different perspectives. And as 73 00:03:55.840 --> 00:03:59.800 you mentioned, there's kind of four different ways, you know, 74 00:03:59.840 --> 00:04:03.840 to kind of look at that issue and just the 75 00:04:04.000 --> 00:04:09.120 terrible atrocity that we have. And for me, you know, 76 00:04:09.240 --> 00:04:11.479 human trafficking is one of the most evil things that 77 00:04:11.560 --> 00:04:14.879 somebody can do to another person. And I started speaking 78 00:04:14.879 --> 00:04:18.519 about it and I was getting questions, and I realized 79 00:04:18.560 --> 00:04:23.000 that the online portion of human trafficking was growing. But 80 00:04:23.519 --> 00:04:26.879 also predators online are looking for a bunch of other 81 00:04:26.920 --> 00:04:30.600 stuff besides human trafficking. You know, they may want to meet, 82 00:04:30.199 --> 00:04:34.319 they may want to export your child, or they might 83 00:04:34.519 --> 00:04:38.959 want more content. And so so then I put together 84 00:04:39.040 --> 00:04:41.639 this I would just say common sense, you know, fifty 85 00:04:41.680 --> 00:04:45.040 plus page book that that kind of just gives parents 86 00:04:45.079 --> 00:04:49.439 an idea of what's going on. And that led me 87 00:04:49.519 --> 00:04:53.759 to my latest book, which was, well, Who's the Ultimate Predator? 88 00:04:54.079 --> 00:04:57.879 It's really Satan and the Devil's real and a lot 89 00:04:57.920 --> 00:05:01.639 of secular society wants to discount that. They don't want 90 00:05:01.639 --> 00:05:05.279 to believe that, And I wanted to feature three people 91 00:05:05.360 --> 00:05:09.120 who are fighting evil in their own unique way, and 92 00:05:09.240 --> 00:05:13.639 that's what I came up with. So so I think 93 00:05:13.680 --> 00:05:17.800 it's some some pretty interesting stories about this modern evil 94 00:05:17.839 --> 00:05:19.759 that we're seeing, right. 95 00:05:19.639 --> 00:05:21.120 And there's a lot of it out there. There's a 96 00:05:21.160 --> 00:05:23.279 lot of different things. A lot of things are happening online. 97 00:05:23.279 --> 00:05:27.279 Now that everybody is online, it's become a way for 98 00:05:27.560 --> 00:05:29.319 good things to happen, Like you and I can talk 99 00:05:29.920 --> 00:05:33.279 and cheer information and cheer books. But there's also a 100 00:05:33.399 --> 00:05:35.879 darker side, right, a darker side to the web. 101 00:05:37.160 --> 00:05:41.839 Yeah, and kids are getting online earlier and earlier than 102 00:05:41.920 --> 00:05:45.759 ever before. You know, it's not just high schoolers. You know, 103 00:05:45.759 --> 00:05:47.920 how many times have you seen a three or four 104 00:05:47.959 --> 00:05:51.480 year old playing with some iPad or their parents phone 105 00:05:51.560 --> 00:05:54.120 or something like that, And so they have no idea 106 00:05:54.160 --> 00:05:57.720 how to navigate the online world. I mean, you wouldn't 107 00:05:57.800 --> 00:06:01.879 let your eleven year old wantunder the mall by him 108 00:06:01.959 --> 00:06:05.680 or herself, So why would you let that child wander 109 00:06:05.759 --> 00:06:08.519 the internet when there's a lot more danger out there 110 00:06:09.839 --> 00:06:10.639 right right? 111 00:06:11.399 --> 00:06:13.279 And there's a lot of danger, a lot of catfishing, 112 00:06:13.360 --> 00:06:15.839 a lot of fake names, a lot of fronts, a 113 00:06:15.920 --> 00:06:17.879 lot of strange things like I followed the seven to 114 00:06:17.959 --> 00:06:24.160 six four group really dark satanic, like super dark, spiritual evil. 115 00:06:24.720 --> 00:06:28.680 But they get people on very benign sites. So your 116 00:06:28.759 --> 00:06:31.519 kids could even be on Roadblocks, right, and that they 117 00:06:31.519 --> 00:06:33.639 strike up a conversation there. So there's a lot of 118 00:06:35.040 --> 00:06:37.720 places that you may think that are safe but aren't. 119 00:06:39.000 --> 00:06:41.240 Well yeah, and that's one of the big myths for 120 00:06:41.560 --> 00:06:45.800 parents is you know, ABC Males, Roadblocks, places like that 121 00:06:45.800 --> 00:06:51.120 that might be age appropriate doesn't mean child safe. And 122 00:06:51.199 --> 00:06:57.240 so programs like Roadblocks have cat features and they advertise 123 00:06:57.439 --> 00:07:00.800 chat play with you know, people from all over the world. World. Well, 124 00:07:00.800 --> 00:07:03.439 where do you think the predators are hanging out? Right? 125 00:07:03.519 --> 00:07:07.319 They're going to where the kids are, And so an 126 00:07:07.399 --> 00:07:11.040 unsuspecting parent may may find that their kid is being 127 00:07:11.120 --> 00:07:16.399 chatted up by a predator from who knows where, right. 128 00:07:16.319 --> 00:07:18.639 And it could be anywhere. I mean, and you kind 129 00:07:18.639 --> 00:07:21.240 of on your first section of this book, you just 130 00:07:21.319 --> 00:07:23.480 show that some of these people can just be your 131 00:07:23.480 --> 00:07:28.120 average guy, you know, down the street, right, the average 132 00:07:28.120 --> 00:07:30.199 benign looking guy down the street. 133 00:07:30.480 --> 00:07:32.839 Yeah, it's it's it's really hard to tell just by 134 00:07:32.839 --> 00:07:35.439 looking at somebody, you know, it's it's I mean, yes, 135 00:07:35.519 --> 00:07:38.879 there's definitely the you know, the pedophiles that are you know, 136 00:07:39.000 --> 00:07:42.000 never leave the house in their parents' basement, you know, 137 00:07:42.120 --> 00:07:46.560 all day. But many times they're functioning members of society. 138 00:07:46.600 --> 00:07:50.360 They have jobs, they are married, many times may have 139 00:07:50.439 --> 00:07:54.319 kids themselves, and so you just can't really look at it. 140 00:07:54.319 --> 00:07:57.920 And you could see headline after headline of somebody who 141 00:07:58.600 --> 00:08:01.639 seems like a normal member of society, and yet they 142 00:08:02.160 --> 00:08:06.199 might be collecting, you know, child pornography pictures, they may 143 00:08:06.199 --> 00:08:09.879 be trying to meet somebody. And the police officers that 144 00:08:09.959 --> 00:08:13.319 I interviewed and the one featured in this book, you know, 145 00:08:13.519 --> 00:08:19.160 they arrested somebody who was exactly that just looked like 146 00:08:19.240 --> 00:08:21.160 a very normal member of society. 147 00:08:24.360 --> 00:08:28.560 Right, So these guys could be anything, but there's usually 148 00:08:28.800 --> 00:08:31.720 a long it gets worse than wors. So there's like 149 00:08:31.759 --> 00:08:35.759 a grooming process. So back in the day before the internet, 150 00:08:36.039 --> 00:08:40.679 the grooming process when in person, but this takes place online, right. 151 00:08:41.879 --> 00:08:45.519 Yeah, exactly. And what they're going to do is they're 152 00:08:45.559 --> 00:08:49.279 just going to, you know, throw as many darts and 153 00:08:49.320 --> 00:08:53.639 see what sticks. Because somebody who reacts to an online 154 00:08:53.919 --> 00:08:58.200 inquiry or a friend, work press, something like that, that's 155 00:08:58.240 --> 00:09:00.919 who they're going to zoom in on. And you know, 156 00:09:00.960 --> 00:09:04.759 the kids today, they've grown up on the internet, grown 157 00:09:04.840 --> 00:09:09.559 up on it, and they view a friend online as 158 00:09:09.600 --> 00:09:12.559 the equivalent of a friend that they might have in 159 00:09:12.679 --> 00:09:15.480 their in their class, you know, somebody that they see 160 00:09:15.480 --> 00:09:17.960 in person every day, they see that as the equivalent. 161 00:09:18.080 --> 00:09:22.080 And that's not you know, our generation, we know that 162 00:09:22.159 --> 00:09:25.159 there's a difference between an online person that you've never 163 00:09:25.240 --> 00:09:29.519 met and somebody who you see every day. But today's team, 164 00:09:29.799 --> 00:09:32.000 they they kind of see that as a bit of 165 00:09:32.039 --> 00:09:34.960 a blurry line. And if you if you talk to 166 00:09:35.039 --> 00:09:40.000 teens and different surveys that I've seen, you know, it's 167 00:09:40.000 --> 00:09:45.000 a high number that have met somebody who's a stranger 168 00:09:45.039 --> 00:09:49.840 online in person, or have chatted with that person, sent 169 00:09:49.960 --> 00:09:53.759 pictures things like that. It's a really high percentage that 170 00:09:53.840 --> 00:09:56.120 should really terrify every parent. 171 00:09:57.240 --> 00:09:59.799 Yeah, and it's much more common dating takes place online 172 00:09:59.840 --> 00:10:03.440 now out for younger people meeting people all that stuff. 173 00:10:03.440 --> 00:10:06.080 Like you said, so, who do you know if this 174 00:10:06.120 --> 00:10:08.159 person is real? I know people who've gone out to 175 00:10:08.200 --> 00:10:10.759 meet these people in howdy they say they are or 176 00:10:10.759 --> 00:10:15.360 they have fake you know, pictures or things like that, 177 00:10:15.440 --> 00:10:18.240 So it's really dicey. And then you throw in, you know, 178 00:10:18.279 --> 00:10:22.120 a thirteen fourteen year old child on roadblocks, and some 179 00:10:22.159 --> 00:10:25.600 of these are really bad, Like, it gets very very dark, 180 00:10:25.639 --> 00:10:27.000 and there's a lot of what it can be. You 181 00:10:27.000 --> 00:10:29.679 can be blackmailed, and it leads to some of these 182 00:10:29.759 --> 00:10:34.159 kids doing you know, hurting themselves and all kinds of stuff. 183 00:10:34.159 --> 00:10:36.840 And then there's like a what a lot of people 184 00:10:36.960 --> 00:10:38.960 don't know what you mentioned in your book is there's 185 00:10:39.120 --> 00:10:44.639 like squads of online pedophiles competing against each other, which 186 00:10:44.679 --> 00:10:45.360 is really sick. 187 00:10:47.720 --> 00:10:50.559 Yeah, and what most parents don't realize is it can 188 00:10:50.679 --> 00:10:55.080 happen really really fast. So and I talked to multiple 189 00:10:55.240 --> 00:10:59.519 police officers about this. So, for example, one of the 190 00:10:59.559 --> 00:11:04.600 ways that they will target boys, which sometimes surprises a parent. 191 00:11:04.799 --> 00:11:08.440 They think they're just after females, but that's really not true. 192 00:11:08.879 --> 00:11:11.600 So what someone will do is they'll create, typically a 193 00:11:11.600 --> 00:11:15.000 fake profile of a a good looking college age girl. 194 00:11:15.559 --> 00:11:20.960 This person will send a friend request to a teenage 195 00:11:21.000 --> 00:11:25.279 boy and chat that person up. And the next thing, 196 00:11:25.320 --> 00:11:28.879 you know, this good looking, you know, college age girl 197 00:11:29.360 --> 00:11:33.600 is sending explicit pictures. It's probably a freak profile. They 198 00:11:33.639 --> 00:11:36.840 probably downloaded this from a pornography site. But they sent 199 00:11:36.960 --> 00:11:40.399 us to this team to get his attention and have said, look, 200 00:11:40.480 --> 00:11:44.080 I've shown you, now you show me. And so that 201 00:11:44.159 --> 00:11:48.399 team is then pressured into sending a picture explicit picture 202 00:11:48.399 --> 00:11:54.399 of himself. He does, and then immediately that person can 203 00:11:54.440 --> 00:11:59.919 extort for money and if they pay, they will meet 204 00:12:00.320 --> 00:12:03.320 ask for money once again. And if they don't pay, 205 00:12:04.159 --> 00:12:08.120 if they're seeing what you know, social network that you're in, 206 00:12:08.480 --> 00:12:13.759 they will absolutely follow through with the threat of exposing 207 00:12:13.799 --> 00:12:18.879 this picture to you know, to that social network, making 208 00:12:18.919 --> 00:12:21.799 it come. And what the police officers have told me 209 00:12:22.240 --> 00:12:27.320 is that scenario I just described twenty four hours can 210 00:12:27.399 --> 00:12:31.080 happen twenty four hours. So the parent might think, hey, 211 00:12:31.159 --> 00:12:35.840 yesterday their kid was fine. Today, their moody, disturb upset, stress, 212 00:12:36.440 --> 00:12:38.879 they have no idea what happened, and yet it could 213 00:12:38.919 --> 00:12:42.279 be so fast that the parents really have to have 214 00:12:42.360 --> 00:12:47.080 that awkward conversation with their teens and say this is real, 215 00:12:47.159 --> 00:12:51.039 this can happen, and if it does, if you get caught, 216 00:12:51.080 --> 00:12:55.320 if you make a mistake, please come to me the parent. 217 00:12:56.519 --> 00:12:59.960 Don't think that you're in it alone. But so many teams, 218 00:13:00.240 --> 00:13:01.919 you know, they don't talk to their parents, or maybe 219 00:13:01.919 --> 00:13:05.720 they're not supervised, maybe they come from a difficult household. 220 00:13:06.320 --> 00:13:10.679 And now this team is feeling very isolated and lonely, 221 00:13:10.759 --> 00:13:13.320 and as you mentioned, there's gonna be a lot of 222 00:13:13.320 --> 00:13:17.960 self harm associated with this because the teen doesn't know 223 00:13:18.000 --> 00:13:18.360 what to. 224 00:13:18.279 --> 00:13:21.759 Do and leading to suicide. I mean, it's a terrible thing. 225 00:13:22.200 --> 00:13:25.840 It can happen, So yeah, very. 226 00:13:25.720 --> 00:13:31.480 Serious, absolutely, it's it's really it's really tragic and evil 227 00:13:31.720 --> 00:13:35.799 what these predators are doing to get, you know, a 228 00:13:35.840 --> 00:13:38.720 few hundred bucks out of a team. 229 00:13:39.039 --> 00:13:41.879 And there's people online. There was a guy busted in Texas. 230 00:13:41.919 --> 00:13:47.480 He was a teenager and his life was grooming and 231 00:13:47.559 --> 00:13:51.279 abusing other children online. He literally spent ten hours a 232 00:13:51.360 --> 00:13:54.399 day doing it on these on these what on these sites, 233 00:13:54.480 --> 00:13:57.320 Like I've done other shows on this, he's on Roadblocks 234 00:13:57.399 --> 00:14:01.080 and Fortnite and other things like that that are very 235 00:14:01.600 --> 00:14:04.799 inocuous or tain. I guess you wouldn't think anything's going on. 236 00:14:04.840 --> 00:14:07.799 But then he says, come here, I've got a discord 237 00:14:07.919 --> 00:14:11.039 channel or I've got some other channel or telegram, and 238 00:14:11.080 --> 00:14:12.799 then it gets worse and worse and worse, just like 239 00:14:12.840 --> 00:14:15.679 you said in these like you said, it's what happens 240 00:14:15.679 --> 00:14:17.799 to boys too. A lot of them are women and 241 00:14:17.840 --> 00:14:20.480 they just get led down and it's almost like how 242 00:14:20.559 --> 00:14:21.600 much can they get away with? 243 00:14:21.720 --> 00:14:27.679 So, yeah, the disturbing the disturbing trend is when you've 244 00:14:27.720 --> 00:14:32.960 got really a child on child type of situation. It's 245 00:14:33.120 --> 00:14:35.919 you know, they're definitely the adult pedophiles out there, But 246 00:14:36.440 --> 00:14:40.600 the disturbing trend you talk to counselor psychologists, et cetera, 247 00:14:41.279 --> 00:14:45.639 is it's the teenager on a younger child. 248 00:14:46.759 --> 00:14:48.600 Yeah, that's pretty bad, and now it's going to get 249 00:14:48.600 --> 00:14:51.639 more sophisticated. Chuck in the chat says they've been faking 250 00:14:51.679 --> 00:14:55.039 profiles even more with AI audio video or pick. Yeah, 251 00:14:55.120 --> 00:14:59.120 so throwing some AI in there. Wow, So people really 252 00:14:59.159 --> 00:15:01.720 need to be careful. Really do they really need to 253 00:15:01.799 --> 00:15:03.360 keep an eye on their kids and what they're up 254 00:15:03.399 --> 00:15:06.279 to and who they're talking to. And also, Tom think, 255 00:15:06.320 --> 00:15:09.279 don't you think it's information or telling them the risks 256 00:15:09.279 --> 00:15:10.279 online are important. 257 00:15:11.720 --> 00:15:17.759 Yeah, you really have to talk to your child about 258 00:15:17.879 --> 00:15:21.080 what they're doing online and who are they talking to, 259 00:15:22.080 --> 00:15:26.480 and letting them know that there's dangers, there's risks and 260 00:15:26.919 --> 00:15:29.720 if they do run into trouble to come and come 261 00:15:29.759 --> 00:15:33.080 and talk to the parent. And it starts early, you know, 262 00:15:33.240 --> 00:15:37.519 if you you know, talk to a lot of different experts. 263 00:15:37.519 --> 00:15:40.639 They're telling you to have to start the conversation at 264 00:15:40.679 --> 00:15:45.200 around age seven, because not only are a lot of 265 00:15:45.240 --> 00:15:47.480 seven year olds online, a lot of these kids have 266 00:15:47.679 --> 00:15:50.320 you know, Chrome books at school, and the schools will 267 00:15:50.320 --> 00:15:53.840 tell you they're safe. I've talked to people who will 268 00:15:53.879 --> 00:15:57.240 tell you that's absolutely not safe. But the other risk 269 00:15:57.320 --> 00:16:00.759 that parents don't realize is, hey, maybe you're really controlling 270 00:16:00.799 --> 00:16:03.080 what your child is looking at because they're only seven 271 00:16:03.240 --> 00:16:05.679 or ten. But then they go over a friend's house 272 00:16:06.360 --> 00:16:09.559 and who knows what they're seeing over there, And there's 273 00:16:09.600 --> 00:16:13.799 plenty of stories out there about his being exposed to 274 00:16:13.960 --> 00:16:19.799 all kinds of things, including pornography through just hanging out. Spreads. 275 00:16:21.240 --> 00:16:23.279 Right, No, it's incredible and I think it's good. Like 276 00:16:23.320 --> 00:16:25.120 a lot of these states are starting to have sign 277 00:16:25.200 --> 00:16:28.480 ins checking age for pornography things like that, which I 278 00:16:28.519 --> 00:16:31.320 think is a good change. I'm surprised they did it 279 00:16:31.399 --> 00:16:35.240 with some of these legislation wasn't there in the past, 280 00:16:35.360 --> 00:16:38.960 but I guess they're catching up. But the public has 281 00:16:39.000 --> 00:16:42.080 to figure out, like be very careful. There really are 282 00:16:42.120 --> 00:16:43.320 a lot of pregators out. 283 00:16:43.200 --> 00:16:45.600 There and horrible. 284 00:16:44.799 --> 00:16:47.679 Stories like but that's not the only the kind of 285 00:16:47.720 --> 00:16:50.480 the content. You also cover kind of the perils of 286 00:16:51.720 --> 00:16:55.080 kind of you know, people who have had abortions and 287 00:16:55.559 --> 00:16:58.799 then become pro life, and also exorcism, right, can you 288 00:16:58.799 --> 00:16:59.840 talk a little bit about. 289 00:16:59.639 --> 00:17:06.079 That, Yeah, sure, so. So the other two stories are 290 00:17:06.359 --> 00:17:11.200 you know, real people individuals that that I interviewed, got testimony, 291 00:17:11.279 --> 00:17:14.640 looked at case files. One of them was an abortion 292 00:17:14.799 --> 00:17:17.960 doctor who has a has a story of how she 293 00:17:18.160 --> 00:17:23.480 transformed into a pro life advocate. It's it's a very 294 00:17:23.480 --> 00:17:27.079 compelling story that's decades long in the making for her 295 00:17:28.640 --> 00:17:31.880 and and how she really it parallels how she came 296 00:17:31.920 --> 00:17:34.880 back to the church and it's a it's it's it's 297 00:17:34.880 --> 00:17:39.960 a very christ centered story of how her relationship with 298 00:17:40.079 --> 00:17:44.880 God really helped her realize not only what she was 299 00:17:44.920 --> 00:17:49.039 doing was wrong, but to speak up about it because 300 00:17:49.680 --> 00:17:53.160 her personality was not to engage in conflict. And yet 301 00:17:53.240 --> 00:17:57.720 now decades later, this person has testified in front of 302 00:17:57.720 --> 00:18:04.359 a state legislature about abortion laws things like that, and 303 00:18:04.400 --> 00:18:07.599 it and it just you know, goes through that transformation 304 00:18:07.799 --> 00:18:12.880 where you know that that person had a miscarriage, you 305 00:18:13.079 --> 00:18:18.079 had to do abortion recovery, met people along the way 306 00:18:18.359 --> 00:18:21.079 who had similar stories. So I think it's really going 307 00:18:21.160 --> 00:18:25.519 to resonate with the readers to see you know, gaining 308 00:18:25.599 --> 00:18:29.000 strength through this transformational journey. 309 00:18:31.039 --> 00:18:32.559 Right, And it's in the news like this was a 310 00:18:32.640 --> 00:18:36.200 huge issue like women's rights and things like that in 311 00:18:36.279 --> 00:18:39.759 this last election twenty twenty four. So it's kind of 312 00:18:39.799 --> 00:18:42.920 like a more thoughtful inquiry than something is shrill where 313 00:18:42.920 --> 00:18:45.279 they're going to kind of take away your rights or whatever. 314 00:18:46.240 --> 00:18:48.640 You know, it's going to be the handmaiden's tail or 315 00:18:48.680 --> 00:18:51.680 something like that. Like it seems like that. 316 00:18:53.160 --> 00:18:56.240 And that's the environment that you know, doctor Wheeler has 317 00:18:56.359 --> 00:19:00.200 had to live it, right, is this you know, out 318 00:19:00.279 --> 00:19:03.559 and be proud about your abortion. And her journey was 319 00:19:03.920 --> 00:19:09.920 really seeing the value of human life and in returning 320 00:19:09.920 --> 00:19:14.119 to the church and really you know, coming to the 321 00:19:14.119 --> 00:19:20.200 conclusion that supporting women through unplanned pregnancies. That's how you 322 00:19:20.279 --> 00:19:24.279 help women, It isn't, you know, pushing them towards an abortion. 323 00:19:25.920 --> 00:19:30.400 And it's just the cultural situation that we're in that 324 00:19:30.480 --> 00:19:33.759 you see this, you know, be proud about your abortion, 325 00:19:34.200 --> 00:19:38.400 you know, things like that. So those are those are 326 00:19:38.519 --> 00:19:40.720 tied in there. So it's to me, it's not a 327 00:19:40.759 --> 00:19:44.279 political statement per se. It's this person's journey. She gets 328 00:19:44.480 --> 00:19:51.359 very personal, very upfront about all of her you know, triumphs, failures, 329 00:19:51.440 --> 00:19:54.240 et cetera. And it's told from the first person point 330 00:19:54.240 --> 00:19:56.319 of view. It's the only chapter like that, so she's 331 00:19:57.039 --> 00:20:02.440 literally telling you her story. And it's like you're having 332 00:20:02.519 --> 00:20:06.000 a conversation in your living room and doctor Wheeler is 333 00:20:06.160 --> 00:20:09.079 sitting across on a chair telling you that story. So 334 00:20:09.160 --> 00:20:12.240 it really, you know, it's really that personal in depth, 335 00:20:12.559 --> 00:20:14.640 and I think you really get to know the person. 336 00:20:15.240 --> 00:20:17.440 And I think it resonates with readers. 337 00:20:18.559 --> 00:20:20.119 I mean, and I think so, I mean, there's just 338 00:20:21.119 --> 00:20:23.799 there's so much craziness going on around that subject. I've 339 00:20:23.839 --> 00:20:25.960 never seen anything like it, So I think it's sensible 340 00:20:26.160 --> 00:20:30.200 rational reading of this book will help anybody else. But 341 00:20:30.279 --> 00:20:32.920 you also kind of talk about I mean, as a 342 00:20:32.960 --> 00:20:36.960 Catholic kind of this another thing that's happening, like the occult. 343 00:20:37.000 --> 00:20:40.759 These people are tampering with things and getting in trouble, 344 00:20:43.200 --> 00:20:45.039 looking into the darker side of things. 345 00:20:45.079 --> 00:20:50.599 Right, Yeah, So the third chapter is all about spiritual warfare. 346 00:20:50.759 --> 00:20:55.720 And you know, most people learn about exorcisms or evil 347 00:20:55.759 --> 00:21:01.079 influences from Hollywood, which news splash. I'm most people realize 348 00:21:01.160 --> 00:21:05.480 that's not a great source. And so before writing this book, 349 00:21:05.599 --> 00:21:08.880 I didn't know anything about extorcism. So I really wrote 350 00:21:08.880 --> 00:21:12.400 it for the non expert, and I was able to 351 00:21:12.519 --> 00:21:18.920 interview the guy who co wrote the training manual for exorcists, 352 00:21:19.000 --> 00:21:22.480 so I've got a really great source and we go 353 00:21:22.599 --> 00:21:27.799 through his story on how he helps while it's you know, 354 00:21:27.880 --> 00:21:32.359 happening in the room when they're performing in exorcism, but 355 00:21:32.720 --> 00:21:36.480 it's all the stuff that happens before, during, and after. 356 00:21:37.279 --> 00:21:40.640 And you kind of touched on that be occult. I mean, 357 00:21:40.720 --> 00:21:46.319 that seems to be more popular than ever and we're 358 00:21:46.319 --> 00:21:52.720 seeing a decline in church attendance. You know, celebrities the 359 00:21:52.759 --> 00:21:55.400 media seem to make front of Christians all the time, 360 00:21:56.119 --> 00:21:58.839 and we as humans are kind of built to have 361 00:21:58.920 --> 00:22:05.680 this higher power relationship with God. And if you're not 362 00:22:06.079 --> 00:22:09.279 doing that well, that vacuum is going to get filled. 363 00:22:09.400 --> 00:22:11.799 And so a lot of people think, you know, the 364 00:22:11.799 --> 00:22:15.160 occult is funding games, it's no big deal. But if 365 00:22:15.200 --> 00:22:18.960 you think about it from a high level, from a 366 00:22:19.039 --> 00:22:21.960 Christian point of view, if you invite God into your life, 367 00:22:22.000 --> 00:22:26.240 he's going to respond. But if you invite the demon 368 00:22:26.319 --> 00:22:29.680 into your life, well he's going to respond as well. 369 00:22:30.359 --> 00:22:33.000 And a lot of times people get in a little 370 00:22:33.000 --> 00:22:36.400 bit over their head when it comes to the occult, 371 00:22:37.039 --> 00:22:40.599 and quite frankly, they're marketing it to a lot of 372 00:22:40.640 --> 00:22:43.880 young people, which is of TikTok, you know, one of 373 00:22:43.920 --> 00:22:50.160 the most popular places that especially young females go, and 374 00:22:50.240 --> 00:22:53.519 it gets a lot of views and they're just presenting 375 00:22:53.559 --> 00:22:56.319 this as this you know, you know, kind of fun 376 00:22:56.400 --> 00:22:59.640 and games type of situation. But it's really opening the 377 00:22:59.680 --> 00:23:04.039 door and if you invite the diabolic into your life, 378 00:23:04.960 --> 00:23:05.680 you're going to have. 379 00:23:05.720 --> 00:23:11.039 Problems, right, And I mean that's the real kind of 380 00:23:11.079 --> 00:23:14.680 the you mentioned Hollywood and talking about this, but the 381 00:23:14.720 --> 00:23:17.039 real story of exorcistm is based on a real book 382 00:23:17.400 --> 00:23:21.400 in the Midwest called The Possessed or Possessed, and it's 383 00:23:21.400 --> 00:23:24.039 about a real exorcism. Like that's really the guy was 384 00:23:24.079 --> 00:23:27.599 taking around the Ouiji board, and I actually read an 385 00:23:27.640 --> 00:23:33.160 interesting article through What's the Treasure at school in Omah 386 00:23:33.160 --> 00:23:35.440 Creighton that they had they like went back and did 387 00:23:35.440 --> 00:23:37.799 a retrospective. I'll send you the link. I'll put a 388 00:23:37.799 --> 00:23:40.279 link to that article actually in the show notes. But 389 00:23:40.319 --> 00:23:45.079 they did a retrospective about the actual priest who conducted 390 00:23:45.119 --> 00:23:50.160 that extorcism, like they had like real spirit like negative 391 00:23:50.200 --> 00:23:52.839 spiritual events happen. It's really something else. Let me see 392 00:23:52.839 --> 00:23:54.480 if I can find it. But yeah, maybe you can 393 00:23:54.519 --> 00:23:57.519 talk about your story because you mentioned a guy whose 394 00:23:57.640 --> 00:24:01.640 name I didn't hurt, Gabriel a morph and maybe you 395 00:24:01.680 --> 00:24:04.119 can talk. I actually had another guy on about exorcism 396 00:24:04.599 --> 00:24:07.039 and ask him an interesting question about the Catholic Church. 397 00:24:07.160 --> 00:24:11.480 Why does the Catholic Church continue or maybe have a 398 00:24:11.519 --> 00:24:15.079 specialty of exorcism or other churches don't. And I think 399 00:24:15.799 --> 00:24:17.480 I think because it goes all the you know, it 400 00:24:17.480 --> 00:24:20.000 goes all the way back to Peter and Christ, you 401 00:24:20.000 --> 00:24:24.079