Speaker 1: Welcome back in your leadership. I'm Chris, I'm Lorenzo, and Lorenzo.
Speaker 1: On this episode, we're continuing our discussion on the Forbes
Speaker 1: article written by their coach's counsel on the pieces of
Speaker 1: advice they would give to their younger sells or you know,
Speaker 1: people to themselves earlier in their career. We've been doing
Speaker 1: this for a few weeks now, and the advice is
Speaker 1: really good advice, Like there's there's a lot of things
Speaker 1: on there that can help you become not just a
Speaker 1: better coach, but a better leader and even ah you know,
Speaker 1: better in relationships in general as you go through your career.
Speaker 1: On the last episode, we talked about following your passions
Speaker 1: and knowing your worth. On this episode, the first one
Speaker 1: I want to go over is the idea of resilience
Speaker 1: over success. And I've heard this a lot, kind of
Speaker 1: more recently in the last couple of years. This idea
Speaker 1: of that the you know, kind of like the if
Speaker 1: you're if you're a leader of people and you're looking
Speaker 1: for where your talent lies, you should be looking for
Speaker 1: areas of resilience more so than success, and so the
Speaker 1: ability to bounce back, the ability to pick yourself off,
Speaker 1: pick yourself up, and dust off the knees and get
Speaker 1: back at it after something didn't go the right way.
Speaker 1: And the reason why that is being kind of more
Speaker 1: valued now than it has been in the past is
Speaker 1: because it's possible to be successful at something accidentally almost
Speaker 1: you know, it's possible to have like the beginner's luck
Speaker 1: or you know, maybe a streak of beginner's good luck.
Speaker 1: But if you don't know how somebody is going to
Speaker 1: react or respond when that luck inevitably runs out at
Speaker 1: some point, because it will, then you don't know, really
Speaker 1: you know how solid a person or well rounded a
Speaker 1: person you have. But a person who can get through
Speaker 1: the failures of life and the issues and the problems,
Speaker 1: those are people who you know, once they find success,
Speaker 1: that's great, and then when they're not finding it, you
Speaker 1: don't really have to worry much about kind of picking
Speaker 1: them up because they can pick themselves up.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we talk a lot about things like perseverance and grit,
Speaker 2: and I've shared i think probably on the show a
Speaker 2: few times and also what leaders that I talked to.
Speaker 2: But what we don't talk about is like what it
Speaker 2: feels like to have to persevere and when you have
Speaker 2: to use crit and those are not fun places like that,
Speaker 2: those are those you know but by definition, right, you're
Speaker 2: having to work through something that you really don't want
Speaker 2: to have to work through, or that you don't have
Speaker 2: a choice but to work through. But they are such
Speaker 2: critical elements of who we are as people, and it's
Speaker 2: a great measurement in understanding or assessment of how you know,
Speaker 2: people will show up for themselves and for others when
Speaker 2: they can explain and walk you through some of the
Speaker 2: resilience they've had in their life or you know, times
Speaker 2: when they've had to be resilient. So like it's it's
Speaker 2: one of those situations where I think it's wrong when
Speaker 2: leaders want to say, like, well, I'm going to create
Speaker 2: an environment like to make you more resilient. That's like
Speaker 2: you it just means you're gonna be a jerk. You
Speaker 2: know what I'm saying, Like you're gonna be a jerk.
Speaker 2: And then you're basically telling people that just to deal
Speaker 2: with me. Yeah, execut I've testing them right, Yes, you're
Speaker 2: you're going to be a jerk. And you're telling your
Speaker 2: people that like you're gotta they gonna deal with you
Speaker 2: being a jerk. That's not it, right, No, not not
Speaker 2: as something that is a takeaway, that is something that's
Speaker 2: going to be impactful, that's going to help them in
Speaker 2: the future understand when they have to be resilient and
Speaker 2: and you know why it's such an important thing. I
Speaker 2: think as well, especially in the space of leadership, that
Speaker 2: there is a there's an alignment of resilience with tenure,
Speaker 2: meaning that the longer that you do a job, the
Speaker 2: more likely you are to run across things that are
Speaker 2: going to cause you to have to be resilient. And
Speaker 2: you're gonna you're gonna feel that effect of having success
Speaker 2: and then having to have more success on top of
Speaker 2: the success. So it's like it's kind of with the
Speaker 2: whole Like you did great this year, Well, then what
Speaker 2: happens next year? Right now, you have to do better
Speaker 2: than what you did this year. So like there's this
Speaker 2: kind of built in element that is requiring you to
Speaker 2: kind of get better year over year over year, and
Speaker 2: sometimes that's just not going to happen. That's not going
Speaker 2: to be the case. There are going to be things
Speaker 2: that are going to impact your business, your team. Maybe
Speaker 2: you developed a bunch of people and they've all gotten promoted,
Speaker 2: they've moved along. Like, now you have a team that
Speaker 2: you know where the outcomes of the team months ago
Speaker 2: or a year ago were phenomenal, but now the team's
Speaker 2: different and now you have to you know, help to
Speaker 2: teach and to mold again. These are all elements I
Speaker 2: think around resilience that as a leader, when you work
Speaker 2: through all of that, it helps you to understand in
Speaker 2: the long term that you're going to come across these
Speaker 2: pockets and these hurdles, but you're built to be able
Speaker 2: to work through them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're spot on with that. I think it's you know,
Speaker 1: we talk about oftentimes when someone is is blessed with failure,
Speaker 1: you know, I for that term used before you earlier
Speaker 1: on in their career or in life or in general.
Speaker 1: And so like here's my my hecking leadership BINGO parenting
Speaker 1: reference here. You know, when when my four year old
Speaker 1: doesn't get what she wants for dinner, it's the worst
Speaker 1: thing in the world. Right, When I don't get what
Speaker 1: I want for dinner, I just eat what the thing
Speaker 1: is that's in front of me instead, right, and I
Speaker 1: just move on. So this is a lot of this
Speaker 1: truly is about life experience. So the more experiences you
Speaker 1: have in life, the more you can keep things in
Speaker 1: perspective whatever that is. So when something is truly truly terrible,
Speaker 1: or if something is not that bad, the only difference
Speaker 1: between what your perspective on that is is the other
Speaker 1: things that you've experienced in your life. You can't compare
Speaker 1: it to other people. You can't compare your life to
Speaker 1: others or to you know, to judge. It's like it's
Speaker 1: like the whole you know, how can you complain about
Speaker 1: your stub toe when someone is dying of cancer. It's like, well,
Speaker 1: because you never had cancer, right, like you have subtoe.
Speaker 1: So yes, of course you can complain about your stub toe.
Speaker 1: It's all perspective, and everybody's life and experience and perspective
Speaker 1: is different. But once you have both of those things,
Speaker 1: you worry about the stubs toe less, right, And it's
Speaker 1: all the exact same thing. So the first time you
Speaker 1: don't get a promotion might be the worst thing in
Speaker 1: the world. But but if you've been laid off before
Speaker 1: and then use your network to find a new job
Speaker 1: and to move on, the next time you don't get
Speaker 1: a promotion, it doesn't feel as bad because you've been
Speaker 1: through it before you have the Sometimes the resilience comes
Speaker 1: from the experience of getting through something so that you
Speaker 1: can look back at that and go, oh, you know what,
Speaker 1: I've gotten through this before, I can get through it again.
Speaker 1: But the first time you have to go through it,
Speaker 1: it's a lot harder to get through because you don't
Speaker 1: have that perspective of that experience, you know, to try
Speaker 1: to get through it. I think oftentimes the way that
Speaker 1: we get through things like that and how how good
Speaker 1: we are at being resilient, most of the time it
Speaker 1: comes from how strong our network is, how strong the
Speaker 1: people are around us that we can lean on, that
Speaker 1: we can ask questions to the people who can kind
Speaker 1: of read us and look at us and think, Okay,
Speaker 1: you know, christ needs some help right now, Lorenzo needs
Speaker 1: some help right now. Let's see what I can what
Speaker 1: I can do to reach out and help out That
Speaker 1: those are the people that tend to get through things
Speaker 1: faster and to learn from them in order to you know,
Speaker 1: kind of make them happen again.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I agree. I think that it's you know,
Speaker 2: there's so much there to unpack, Like I really appreciate
Speaker 2: that this is included in this list here, But I
Speaker 2: think we cannot understate the importance of resilience, and because
Speaker 2: I think that it it's a place where challenges when
Speaker 2: done correctly, and like when you work through it, challenges
Speaker 2: then become confidence.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: It's kind of how I see the resilience piece of this,
Speaker 2: where it's like the more that you run up against
Speaker 2: some of these things and work through them, the more
Speaker 2: confidence you have in you know, in running up against
Speaker 2: things similar to this in the future. Like you kind
Speaker 2: of stated this as well, but it's like there's there's
Speaker 2: a piece of this where it really is a necessary
Speaker 2: thing so that when you when you have these hurdles
Speaker 2: or these obstacles, you know, in your career, as you
Speaker 2: continue to elevate your career, they become a lot less like,
Speaker 2: you know, just overbearing you. Just like, Okay, I've been
Speaker 2: through something similar before, or I've felt this way before.
Speaker 2: I felt like, man, I'm up again, something tough here,
Speaker 2: But I can now recall from how I work through it,
Speaker 2: how I made it through, and how I was more
Speaker 2: successful because of that, and that allows you to kind
Speaker 2: of have the energy to push through these things.
Speaker 1: Right right. I like what you said there because it's
Speaker 1: less about I've done this before, because that's a very
Speaker 1: easy tie in. If you've done it before, you can
Speaker 1: do it again. But I've felt this way before, is
Speaker 1: what you said. And I like that a lot, because
Speaker 1: you might not often go through the same thing again
Speaker 1: and again and again. You might be going through different things.
Speaker 1: But if you can channel that into yourself and think, Okay,
Speaker 1: where have I felt this way before? Not just what
Speaker 1: have I done before? Or have I done this before?
Speaker 1: Because oftentimes the things that we can do to make
Speaker 1: us more resilient are often in the feelings that we
Speaker 1: are feeling at the time and the other things that
Speaker 1: we've done in the past that made us feel the
Speaker 1: same way. And so because the having to be resilient
Speaker 1: implies that there's there's something bad happened, something that you
Speaker 1: really wish hadn't happened happened, and however that thing is
Speaker 1: making you feel, even if it's the first time it's
Speaker 1: ever happened, you've probably felt that way before, even if
Speaker 1: it was caused by something else. And so being able
Speaker 1: to tie those together and think about how you got
Speaker 1: through the last time you felt this way, the things
Speaker 1: that you did to get through it or the things
Speaker 1: that you didn't do and then it lasted longer and
Speaker 1: you are saying yourself, I'm never gonna let that happen again.
Speaker 1: They're both equally important. You know, you need to be
Speaker 1: able to channel that into yourself because again, the experiences
Speaker 1: you have in life are not going to repeat themselves
Speaker 1: over and over and over again, but the feelings that
Speaker 1: you're getting and that you're having when you go through
Speaker 1: them will often repeat themselves. And finding those patterns and
Speaker 1: how you got through them is going to be key
Speaker 1: to having that level of resilience. Then the next one
Speaker 1: I want to go over in this episode is it
Speaker 1: talks about the power of asking questions. And I like
Speaker 1: this because this can go either way. This could be
Speaker 1: a very powerful thing and you can use it well,
Speaker 1: or you could alienate people and kill relationships by doing
Speaker 1: it the wrong way. And so that's what I what
Speaker 1: I like is it's like it's not just something that's
Speaker 1: very straightforward and just do what it says. There's a
Speaker 1: right way and a wrong way to asking questions and
Speaker 1: asking the right questions, uh, in order to you know,
Speaker 1: kind of be more successful and to have you know,
Speaker 1: stronger and healthier relationships.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree with that, man. I think I've been
Speaker 2: talking a lot about not just active listening, but active
Speaker 2: questioning recently and the importance of that. Yeah, like like
Speaker 2: what questions are you asking and why are you asking
Speaker 2: those questions? And then how are you leveling up the
Speaker 2: questions that you ask in a way that that that
Speaker 2: allow someone to provide you with their kind of non
Speaker 2: directive answer, right, and so like it's one of those
Speaker 2: things that I think a lot of times, and I
Speaker 2: guess it's just human nature, but specifically in leadership, like
Speaker 2: I'll ask you a question in a way way that
Speaker 2: you know what answer I want to hear, right, And.
Speaker 1: Sometimes that's okay, But but if that's your go to,
Speaker 1: that but.
Speaker 2: It's it's a lot of people's go to because a
Speaker 2: lot of them even end with like this positive affirmation
Speaker 2: that they're correct. So they'll say things like Chris, like
Speaker 2: that was absolutely the right strategy, right, Yes, of course
Speaker 2: it was there, you go see, right, versus something like Chris,
Speaker 2: I want to talk about that last strategy.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's leading, it's leading the witness in courtant correct, yes, Like,
Speaker 1: but this happens so so often.
Speaker 2: It's such a part of our way of moving things faster,
Speaker 2: or looking for quick agreement, or not wanting to have
Speaker 2: the dot like I think some people do it so
Speaker 2: often they don't realize how much they do it and
Speaker 2: how it just shuts down anybody's want to have to
Speaker 2: then create conflict to say actually not right, no, no, no,
Speaker 2: I don't agree with that, like you're you're stating in
Speaker 2: such a way that it becomes an even more conflicting
Speaker 2: response because of how you asked the question versus asking
Speaker 2: questions in a much more open way, in a way
Speaker 2: that creates a dialogue. Hey, Chris, of the strategy that
Speaker 2: we just implemented, what to you stuck out as like
Speaker 2: a big win and then what was definitely the thing
Speaker 2: that need to be addressed. Now, I'm giving you permission
Speaker 2: to tell you mean, what's wrong?
Speaker 1: Right? And not only that, but you've removed any any
Speaker 1: hint of bias that you might have a preference or
Speaker 1: an answer that you were searching for. Because even if
Speaker 1: as a leader, you aren't unconfident in your leadership ability,
Speaker 1: even if you are completely okay with someone challenging you,
Speaker 1: if the person you're talking to is not okay with
Speaker 1: challenging you, then saying the wrong thing can stifle that
Speaker 1: in somebody, even if you weren't intending to. So it's
Speaker 1: very this has to be done very intentionally. It can't
Speaker 1: just be that, oh, I'm not going to be a jerk.
Speaker 1: You could be not intending to be a jerk. And
Speaker 1: do these make these mistakes with when the with the
Speaker 1: questions you're asking with with no you know, bad intents
Speaker 1: at all. It's it's you're just going about your business.
Speaker 1: But if you're talking to the wrong person or a
Speaker 1: person who's just you know, less willing to challenge you
Speaker 1: or push back, you're not going to get the answers
Speaker 1: that you need. And they might have some great insights
Speaker 1: that you're gonna you know, not pick up on because
Speaker 1: you didn't ask the questions in the right way.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, and with that it brings us to this episodes
Speaker 2: one minute hack. But first, if you're worse from our sponsors.
Speaker 1: All right, for this episode is one minute hack. Here's
Speaker 1: or I want you to do. I want you to
Speaker 1: look at your calendar, at the list of kind of
Speaker 1: one on ones that you have set up with your
Speaker 1: people or that you have scheduled or coming up on
Speaker 1: the schedule, and look at each other people on there,
Speaker 1: and I want you to write down a list of
Speaker 1: questions that you plan on asking them during this one
Speaker 1: on one meeting that you have, And then I want
Speaker 1: you to practice asking those questions, either to yourself or
Speaker 1: to someone that you trust, someone that the have a
Speaker 1: working relationship with, to see if there's that if the
Speaker 1: questions come out with any type of bias or leading
Speaker 1: in them to where you may not get the most
Speaker 1: honest answer in return, but rather an answer that the
Speaker 1: person you're talking to believes you want to hear. Anytime
Speaker 1: you can, you know, edit those questions or use the
Speaker 1: right verbiage where you're you're essentially asking the same thing,
Speaker 1: but you're asking in a way that takes into account
Speaker 1: human emotion and the desire to please and the desire
Speaker 1: to to you know, be looked upon uh positively in
Speaker 1: a good light by your leader. All those things can
Speaker 1: can edit the way a person chooses how to answer
Speaker 1: a question, even if you don't mean to do that.
Speaker 1: And so go through those questions and make sure make
Speaker 1: sure you ask them in a way that that makes
Speaker 1: people feel like any answer they have is right as
Speaker 1: long as it's honest. Any answer they give you that
Speaker 1: is truly rooted in what happened and what they're looking
Speaker 1: for and what they want and what they truly think.
Speaker 1: As long as it's rooted in those things and without
Speaker 1: regard to what you you want to hear or that
Speaker 1: what you want them to say, those are good questions. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think it's a great woman to hack and it's
Speaker 2: such an important piece I believe of leadership. When you're
Speaker 2: looking to build a culture of great dialogue and healthy debates,
Speaker 2: you know, I think it becomes it becomes conflict if
Speaker 2: you don't ask questions in such a way that people
Speaker 2: feel the ability to be able to share what they're thinking.
Speaker 2: And then you have those you know, people walk away
Speaker 2: from a meeting and be like, I should have said
Speaker 2: something like I don't agree with that, but I just
Speaker 2: shook my head like that happens quite a bit. When
Speaker 2: you ask proper questions, and you ask them in such
Speaker 2: a way that allows people to really share what they're thinking,
Speaker 2: you have a lot less of that. They know that
Speaker 2: they have a space, they know that they can, you know,
Speaker 2: ask questions, they know they can provide their feedback or
Speaker 2: inside or pushback, and it's done in a very healthy way.
Speaker 2: Over time, that just becomes something that really helps to
Speaker 2: create amazingly healthy culture.
Speaker 1: Right right, There's something to be said about about, you know,
Speaker 1: kind of self temperance when it comes to asking questions
Speaker 1: or raising your hand in a meeting or whatnot. This
Speaker 1: this the old adage of does this need to be
Speaker 1: said by me now? And and and you shouldn't. All
Speaker 1: three of those answers should be yes in order for
Speaker 1: you to you know, kind of interject something. But if
Speaker 1: you find yourself leaving interactions with people or meetings often
Speaker 1: thinking to yourself, I really should have said something like
Speaker 1: you know, sometimes it's hard to recognize that you should
Speaker 1: have until the opportunity is pasted and you're kind of
Speaker 1: looking at it in hindsight. But if you do that often,
Speaker 1: then that that that will lead to a complete lack
Speaker 1: of engagement. You know, no, no one needs to No
Speaker 1: one should feel like they can't do that. And so
Speaker 1: if the reason you're not saying something is because you
Speaker 1: think you shouldn't, and then later on you think, you
Speaker 1: know what, maybe I really should have, you know, kind
Speaker 1: of channel that into yourself and think about, Okay, these
Speaker 1: were the things I was thinking last time when I
Speaker 1: thought I shouldn't have said something, and I'm think feeling
Speaker 1: the same way now, so maybe I should say something.
Speaker 1: And and you know, the worst that could happen is
Speaker 1: you you feel a little sheepish, and you move on.
Speaker 1: But but sometimes the most profound and important moments in
Speaker 1: a person's career happened when they chose to raise their
Speaker 1: hand and say something that needed to be said in
Speaker 1: the moment, as opposed to just keeping it inside. Those
Speaker 1: are the things that can.
Speaker 2: Change company culture absolutely with that. This is the end
Speaker 2: of this episode. This is hacking leadership. I'm Lorenzo and
Speaker 2: I'm Chris, and we'll talk to you all next time.