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Speaker 3: PW Torch and Speaker bring you the Wade Keller Pro
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Speaker 1: Ten years ago. This week, Jason Paul joined me on
Speaker 1: the flagship and we talked about WWW network type on
Speaker 1: rabinin before and wondered if WWW network wind air pay
Speaker 1: per views next year. Also SummerSlam developments on Raw, a
Speaker 1: disappointing turn in the Stephanie Breese storyline, I look at
Speaker 1: TNA's future, speculation about it, Global Force Wrestling announcements that
Speaker 1: was a weekly tradition at that point, and more, including
Speaker 1: live callers and email questions. So let's get to it.
Speaker 1: This is the ten years ago flagship Flashback of the
Speaker 1: Way color podcast for Monday, August fifth, twenty twenty four.
Speaker 1: Here we go, Welcome to THEPW Torch Live cast. IM
Speaker 1: Wade Keller, editor and publisher of the Pro Wrestling Torch
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Speaker 1: August fifth, twenty fourteen, and the PW torch Live Cast
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Speaker 1: pro Wrestling Torch. If you want to talk about last
Speaker 1: night's Raw or anything in the news, including WWE business figures,
Speaker 1: WWWE network, TNA's future, uh, anything like that, give us
Speaker 1: a call. Six four six seven nine eight two eight.
Speaker 1: That's six four six seven two one nine eight two eight,
Speaker 1: as Roman Raine would say it. I said, call us.
Speaker 1: The other half of us today is as usual. Jason
Speaker 1: Powell from Pro Wrestling dot Net. Jason, welcome to the show. Hey,
Speaker 1: good to be here, Good to have you last night.
Speaker 1: I'll just lead with one discussion point. Uh, Stephanie and Forrie,
Speaker 1: you've got up on your website. The note that the
Speaker 1: third hour of Raw viewership declined again after a streak
Speaker 1: of an unusual streak of weeks where the Raw viewership
Speaker 1: actually went up in the third hour compared to the
Speaker 1: first two. I have not the last two weeks been
Speaker 1: on the ledger of thinking that the Stephanie Bree segments
Speaker 1: have been great. I think aspects of them have been good,
Speaker 1: but other aspects of them have been disappointing. I was
Speaker 1: a big fan three shows ago of the Stephanie being
Speaker 1: arrested version of the feud. I like Stephanie Moore as
Speaker 1: a reluctant fighter who's been backed into a corner where
Speaker 1: she the only reason she agreed to fight Bree is
Speaker 1: to stay out of jail. I thought last week it
Speaker 1: took a turn for the worse when she suddenly out
Speaker 1: of nowhere, went from oh my god, I don't want
Speaker 1: to fight you, or I don't want to fight you,
Speaker 1: but if it means staying out of jail, okay, I'll
Speaker 1: agree to the lesser of two evils. And now she's
Speaker 1: like all gung ho about fighting her at the end
Speaker 1: of last week's segment and all this week. I can't
Speaker 1: wait to get you in the ring. I'm brutal, I'm bad,
Speaker 1: I'm a mcmanon, I'm going to kick your ass the
Speaker 1: whole thing. Just it seems like they switched writers in
Speaker 1: the middle of the storyline and one writer decided to
Speaker 1: go completely new direction. And I think this is the
Speaker 1: weaker version of those two directions, Jason.
Speaker 4: And it does take some of the fun out of
Speaker 4: it for the viewers who want to see steph get
Speaker 4: hers and they ultimately will, but you want to see
Speaker 4: her sweating it the whole time. And so I also
Speaker 4: think it's been a mistake. And last night boy I Bribella.
Speaker 4: I really like her personality and total divas. It doesn't
Speaker 4: come across the same way on television. She I mean,
Speaker 4: she has issues with Stephane McMahon, obviously, but she's always
Speaker 4: angry and I don't think that's helping.
Speaker 1: I don't think she's particularly good on the MIC and
Speaker 1: in the storyline. I think part of it is what
Speaker 1: she's been what she what she The script that she's
Speaker 1: been given is I think bad. I think it's full
Speaker 1: of platitudes and cliches, and it's just poorly written driven.
Speaker 1: I just don't and I think it's it comes across
Speaker 1: as forced and nasty, and it just doesn't feel like
Speaker 1: what she would say. So I think it's you know,
Speaker 1: Steve Bostin's talked about this on his podcast When you Talk,
Speaker 1: you wrestling fans connect with the wrestler when they feel
Speaker 1: that they're talking from the heart, not from a memorized script.
Speaker 1: And you know, Randy Orton is known for just pacing
Speaker 1: backstage with a script, memorizing it word or word methodically.
Speaker 1: Of course, we learned on Twitter days ago, maybe it's
Speaker 1: good that he scripted, but that's a whole other issue.
Speaker 1: You what a stupid thing to say on Twitter and
Speaker 1: to not realize it. But but nevertheless, he referred to
Speaker 1: somebody who was shooting with on Twitter as miss Piggy
Speaker 1: because well she was overweight, so you know she's a stalker.
Speaker 1: But that's you know what that well, you know what
Speaker 1: she could she could have like poisoned his dog. You
Speaker 1: don't have to call her miss piggy because that means
Speaker 1: she's a bad person. Because she looks overweight to me
Speaker 1: and she's ugly. That's what bullying is is when you
Speaker 1: don't pick on somebody for their actions. You pick on
Speaker 1: somebody for something they're not in control over that day.
Speaker 1: You know, their looks or whatever. It's just like, it's
Speaker 1: just he needs to be smarter than that in this age.
Speaker 1: That's not a sophisticated in sulfur guy in his mid
Speaker 1: thirties and as a public figure representing company that makes
Speaker 1: a big deal of being anti bullying. It was just
Speaker 1: it was not the right way to respond. He should
Speaker 1: have taken the high road. And he has since apologized,
Speaker 1: so fair enough, but he showed really bad judgment initially
Speaker 1: because I mean, if he's just a guy out there
Speaker 1: and he wants to be a jerk and pick on
Speaker 1: women for being overweight as his way to get back
Speaker 1: at them for being a stalker, fine, but he represents WWE,
Speaker 1: and that's just that's just immature and stupid.
Speaker 4: Lord knows WWE has never mocked a Latino woman for
Speaker 4: being overweight on television.
Speaker 1: Street tell me about it. I mean hypography one so
Speaker 1: deep it does no, it's I mean and miss I
Speaker 1: mean Piggy James. I interviewed Mick Mickey James on this
Speaker 1: show a year or so ago, and you know, talked
Speaker 1: about that very angle and how just they're just such impogrants.
Speaker 1: But and Vicky ger obviously all right, But back to
Speaker 1: my point is Brie comes across like she's not She's
Speaker 1: just she's been told read these words and be angry
Speaker 1: every syllable. Yeah, and that's all she does. And it's
Speaker 1: just it's not I mean, it's not awful. I've seen worse,
Speaker 1: but it's not good. And I think it's hurting the
Speaker 1: storyline because and also we kind of had to the
Speaker 1: stephan McMahon. You know, when like Scott Hall and Kevin
Speaker 1: ash would respond to a Babyface promo by holding their
Speaker 1: fingers up and wiggling them and mocking how scared they are. Like, right,
Speaker 1: Stephanie did that. Like Brie has a script written out
Speaker 1: last night, and she delivers it all angry, and it's
Speaker 1: really intimidating. I'm going to tear you apart. Two weeks ago,
Speaker 1: Stephanie was in tea and so scared of going to jail,
Speaker 1: but she didn't want to wrestle. That scared her too,
Speaker 1: But she only agreed to fight for because she was
Speaker 1: even more scared of jail Okay, So now bree promises
Speaker 1: to terror into pieces and her response is, oh, good job,
Speaker 1: Bree boy. That was so scary, And I'm like, that
Speaker 1: just took all the juice out of the whole purpose
Speaker 1: of Breeven talking because Steph's not selling it as if
Speaker 1: she's scared. So now steps back into the bad habit
Speaker 1: of you know, the Hall and Nashee, who you're so
Speaker 1: scary and triple as done that over the years too,
Speaker 1: instead of what we loved three episodes ago, which was
Speaker 1: Stephanie finally showing vulnerability and giving the fans somebody a
Speaker 1: laugh at same thing we praised her for when she
Speaker 1: got knocked into the mud in Vicki's departure.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, I mean that's the whole thing. It's just
Speaker 4: for some reason, she is suddenly a tough girl. And
Speaker 4: I mean we know off camera she lifts and all that,
Speaker 4: but I was kind of hoping for some of the
Speaker 4: fish out of Water training videos a little bit tongue
Speaker 4: in cheek, but at the same time, you know, just
Speaker 4: she does something in there to make you continue to
Speaker 4: dislike her character. It's I don't even know why it's on.
Speaker 4: In the final segment last night was the first time
Speaker 4: I really felt that way. I'd liked last week segment
Speaker 4: despite the weird character shift. I didn't think it was
Speaker 4: like out of place last night, just maybe it was
Speaker 4: because of the week before. But when it was like, oh,
Speaker 4: this is the final segment again, it was there was
Speaker 4: a bit of a disconnect for me, and maybe, you know,
Speaker 4: based on the ratings or the viewership numbers we've seen,
Speaker 4: maybe there was for the audience as well.
Speaker 1: I'm all for promoting more than just the main event
Speaker 1: in main segments, and I think by putting each other
Speaker 1: in the final segment it helps elevate it. But it's
Speaker 1: a little suspicious that it's a McMahon in the final
Speaker 1: segment McMahon.
Speaker 4: Right before preseason football starts next week on Monday nights.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so, I mean that manipulation has been there. Hunter
Speaker 1: was part of it. You know, Hall and Ash learned
Speaker 1: from Hogan. You know, you put yourself in segments that
Speaker 1: will make you look good that you can make your
Speaker 1: case to management. Hunter and stuff don't need to do
Speaker 1: it because they're not, you know, Hall and Ash trying
Speaker 1: to manipulate Eric Bishoff and the bigger contracts. But they
Speaker 1: still do it and it's just it. I just don't
Speaker 1: know that that is main segment worthy. Now. That said,
Speaker 1: in their defense, there was no John Cena, there was
Speaker 1: no Brocolister. It was they had thereat, the great stellar
Speaker 1: video package they put together on them. But I don't
Speaker 1: know what else they would have made evented with. It
Speaker 1: wasn't a packed show, Jason, with a lot of other
Speaker 1: candidates to be the main segment.
Speaker 5: No.
Speaker 4: No, it's not like I can pick something out on
Speaker 4: the show. It's I guess I just would have written
Speaker 4: the show differently so that you did have something that
Speaker 4: felt worthy there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and frankly, you know what, you can move Chris
Speaker 1: Jericho into that spot. Bray Whyatt's a big star, that's
Speaker 1: a big match on SummerSlam. I don't know if Jericho
Speaker 1: Bray is a bigger selling point than Steph Bree. I'd
Speaker 1: say no. I'd say no based on the positioning. But
Speaker 1: I bet if you put Jericho in the main event
Speaker 1: last night against Harper, I think you could because people
Speaker 1: would proceed that feud as higher.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Well, yeah, I mean we have we had a couple
Speaker 4: of weeks with Stephen Brie in the main slot, so
Speaker 4: that help their cause. Yeah, I guess it would have
Speaker 4: been nice to kind of plain to what you said
Speaker 4: originally there, just to shake things up, and the more
Speaker 4: you can make it seem like several matches on SummerSlam
Speaker 4: are huge deals, the better and they're not doing that.
Speaker 4: It's just basically Brock and Sina and then Brian Steph
Speaker 4: and then kind of everything. It has that kind of
Speaker 4: everything else feel to it.
Speaker 1: Yep, yep, I agree, I agree, Jason. Let's just do
Speaker 1: a very early plug for your website and anything you
Speaker 1: want to mention, and then we'll go right into phone
Speaker 1: calls and let callers kind of lead us the way
Speaker 1: through the rest of our hour here. Jason, take it.
Speaker 4: Away absolutely on the site today, I'm pro wrestling dot Net.
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Speaker 1: other tiers and receive even more benefits through Patreon. Hey said,
Speaker 1: everyone for all I toot your horn, but you don't
Speaker 1: toot yours very often. I've tried for years. Why should
Speaker 1: people care more about what you have to say about wrestling?
Speaker 1: This sounds like such a bad way. I wish my
Speaker 1: phrasing O. What is it about your coverage and what
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Speaker 1: knowledge and perspective? What's this? Why do your customers pay
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Speaker 1: Very cool. Yeah, I mean, I just sometimes I think
Speaker 1: there's so many podcasts out there, and I think both
Speaker 1: you know, I do my thing at the beginning of
Speaker 1: the show. You know, since the Reagan administration, I've been
Speaker 1: doing this and all that, But you don't really talk
Speaker 1: about your background much. So like three times a year,
Speaker 1: I corner you and I either talk about your background
Speaker 1: or throw you throw you a question and have you
Speaker 1: do it so people kind of know why you're not
Speaker 1: just some guy hired by some corporate wrestling website to
Speaker 1: put up, you know, eight articles a day and he
Speaker 1: gets paid ten dollars per article, and you know, and
Speaker 1: you can just tell their gloman news off of somebody else,
Speaker 1: and they don't know the experience to know how to
Speaker 1: interpret it. And you know, what really about what is news?
Speaker 1: What's credible? How interpret that news? Sometimes there's items taken
Speaker 1: from your reporting, my reporting in various other places that
Speaker 1: actually our first run news sites and newsletters and publications,
Speaker 1: and they'll just take a little snippet and turn into
Speaker 1: this big thing just because they're trying to please some
Speaker 1: corporate boss who runs seventeen other sports related webs or
Speaker 1: you know, men's related websites, and that, you know, I mean,
Speaker 1: there's there are some there's some really bad online reporting
Speaker 1: out there that I'll just lead you in the wrong direction.
Speaker 1: And there I guess my point in asking you that
Speaker 1: too is just to differentiate. I mean, I feel the Torch.
Speaker 1: I feel the same way about the Torch. But you've
Speaker 1: got the experience to take a story and let people
Speaker 1: know not just what's happening, but why it's happening, and
Speaker 1: cut through the BS too, and it make that clear.
Speaker 1: So hopefully that comes across just inherently in our analysis
Speaker 1: of the shows and the audio that we do here
Speaker 1: at blog Talk. But but I think it's it's worth
Speaker 1: mentioning because there's just so I mean, it's just the
Speaker 1: stuff we get sent. I know, you do two jays
Speaker 1: and the stuff we gets in here at the Torch
Speaker 1: of links to other stories and I'll read it and
Speaker 1: I'll be like, oh god, I mean it's just so off.
Speaker 1: You know, It's just it's like something that they're trying
Speaker 1: to reinterpret from somewhere else, and it's just it doesn't
Speaker 1: it's not the actual correct interpretation of what it means
Speaker 1: or where it's going.
Speaker 4: So you see it, go to the source. I mean,
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Speaker 4: going to take shots and anybody in particular. But if
Speaker 4: you notice a story that was that we wrote that
Speaker 4: was pretty similar somewhere else and you're wondering where it
Speaker 4: came from, well we're not stealing things from other places,
Speaker 4: let's put it that way.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're full time and tons of experience and creating
Speaker 1: original news and talking to sources, talking to people in
Speaker 1: the business every day. So all right, very good. Let's
Speaker 1: let's go to the full lines and let's begin. You
Speaker 1: know what I did not bring up, but I'll do
Speaker 1: that next. Let's let's begin with aer code five six one,
Speaker 1: five six one. Please let me know your name and
Speaker 1: the city you're calling from today.
Speaker 6: Hey, this is Matt from North Carolina. I'm a THEFU members.
Speaker 1: Hey Matt, thanks for coming on the VFA Express Line.
Speaker 1: What have you got for Jason to me today?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 6: I agree with everything as we're saying about breeze, Like
Speaker 6: my best friend and my girlfriend and we said around
Speaker 6: to watch it. We always yell at the last thing
Speaker 6: that she's about to say together and you're a da
Speaker 6: da da bitch. Hell like becoming like kind of a
Speaker 6: drinking game in my house. Yes, I thought the nine
Speaker 6: to ninety nine thing was really weird last night, Like
Speaker 6: it was almost like somebody told them, like they had
Speaker 6: to say it so many times throughout the shows they're
Speaker 6: made like an ongoing running joke about it to have
Speaker 6: fun with it or something. But I thought that was
Speaker 6: really weird. I don't think I was just gonna ask
Speaker 6: you is I can't remember someone was talking about recently.
Speaker 6: I don't know if it was You're a Bruce, But
Speaker 6: you know the idea that heels. You know, if they
Speaker 6: get cheered, then they're not doing their job right, right,
Speaker 6: So how do you think that that kind of contrasts
Speaker 6: with Cina and that he has been the face for
Speaker 6: like the past ten years, but he spent like half
Speaker 6: that time getting booed by half the audience. That would
Speaker 6: you argue that means he's not playing a good face.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I think I think I do think wwe
Speaker 1: would be better off if John Cena on a way
Speaker 1: to not just connect with the kids, but edit himself
Speaker 1: in terms of the loose sts, the goofy, exaggerated facial
Speaker 1: expressions that if I saw those once, I would never
Speaker 1: do it again on camera if I were him, And
Speaker 1: the poopy stuff and the corny, you know, like the
Speaker 1: derivative rock humor that carried over, and some of the
Speaker 1: bad writing that was handed to over the years, and
Speaker 1: and part of it is just he's kind of a goofy,
Speaker 1: overgrown toddler wrestling style at times. And I'm usually a
Speaker 1: defender of John Cena's wrestling style, but I mean, there's
Speaker 1: things about him stylistically that in the ring look kind
Speaker 1: of clunky in a way that it doesn't matter to
Speaker 1: the kids and the women, but the guys compare him
Speaker 1: to some of the really great athletic, tough guy, more
Speaker 1: graceful athletes out there that just seem more cool, and
Speaker 1: he pales in comparison, So he has his weaknesses. Now,
Speaker 1: I've spent so much time on this show defending that
Speaker 1: John Cena should be the top star. He's not the
Speaker 1: perfect dollar around top star, but he's one of the best,
Speaker 1: and he's been very effective. Could somebody else have been
Speaker 1: more effective had seen it not been in the picture.
Speaker 1: Maybe they kind of played that up a little bit
Speaker 1: with the who Lesner dynamic last night in the video,
Speaker 1: But no, John Cena is not a perfect babyface in
Speaker 1: that respect. He does his job as a top star
Speaker 1: really well, and he has so so so many people
Speaker 1: cheering him and paying money to see him and buying
Speaker 1: his merchandise that I don't think that gets offset by
Speaker 1: the people who are booing him. I think that in
Speaker 1: and of itself, there's enough people cheering him. It works
Speaker 1: if a heel is getting incredibly intense booze from even
Speaker 1: forty five percent, but you know, fifty five to sixty
Speaker 1: sixty five percent of the audience, but some people choose
Speaker 1: to cheer them. I don't think that they're doing their
Speaker 1: job poorly at that point, but I would say they'd
Speaker 1: be doing their job better if they could find a
Speaker 1: way to turn everybody against them. So I'd say the
Speaker 1: same thing with John Cena. There's so many assets he
Speaker 1: has going for him, but it would be more ideal
Speaker 1: if it was more along the lines of stone cold
Speaker 1: Steve Austin, where he's just thoroughly, thoroughly, thoroughly almost one
Speaker 1: hundred percent well, probably one hundred percent cheered during his
Speaker 1: top babyface run. Jason to me, it's tightened.
Speaker 4: Things up a little bit. I think he's just gotten
Speaker 4: away with the excuse of he's being himself and this
Speaker 4: is who he is for too long and there's no
Speaker 4: reason he can't just change something. And it makes some
Speaker 4: minor tweaks. I'm not asking him to go out there
Speaker 4: and just be someone that he's completely not, but it
Speaker 4: really when you've noticed that you are doing things that
Speaker 4: do push away a good portion of the audience, maybe
Speaker 4: not away from the product, which is another thing he
Speaker 4: clings to that he's getting a reaction, Well, you know,
Speaker 4: work a little bit harder to try to win those
Speaker 4: people over. And we've seen at times that when he
Speaker 4: drops some of the silliness and the cornball routines and
Speaker 4: he goes out there and he delivers a good, straightforward promo,
Speaker 4: people acknowledge it, and then he'll come right back the
Speaker 4: next week and do something that loses those people again.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, and that they're just things about Tina, that
Speaker 1: about uncessary. I mean, Matt, what's your take on what
Speaker 1: we had to say? And you brought up the subject yourself.
Speaker 1: What's your opinion?
Speaker 6: No, I agree, I think that. I mean, if it
Speaker 6: was my company, i'd be writing it too. I mean,
Speaker 6: he's definitely the best option. He's making the most money
Speaker 6: so on the most tickets. I mean, all the statistics
Speaker 6: are there, so I don't blame them for going with him.
Speaker 6: But yeah, he cut out all the the goofball stuff.
Speaker 6: I know I'd like him because I'm not a scene
Speaker 6: a hater. So like when he gets into his serious stuff,
Speaker 6: like the stuff he's gone to see him punk or
Speaker 6: the stuff he's done with Lessner. I just rewatched that
Speaker 6: match the other night. He's he's pretty damn good. But
Speaker 6: then he just loses it. He does the whole thing
Speaker 6: like with Bray Wyatt. He just shrugs it off, and
Speaker 6: I know, as his wholeham attitude just loses me completely,
Speaker 6: or starts making jokes about poop and stuff.
Speaker 2: It's like, dude, you can be so.
Speaker 1: Good, Like I don't get that, And that's that's what's heartbreaking,
Speaker 1: you know. I Mean you can even see with Steve
Speaker 1: Austin when he's like, you know, on the podcast which
Speaker 1: on Sena last wasn't least November or something, he interview. No,
Speaker 1: but he was just like, or mean, it's just earlier
Speaker 1: this year in January whatever. He's like, you know, hey,
Speaker 1: you know, dude, can you just like tighten up the
Speaker 1: STF for me? And he's like what what? Oh oh okay,
Speaker 1: uh sure sure, you know, like totally, like nobody dared
Speaker 1: to tell John that before, like how awful it looked.
Speaker 1: And I've said this, I would have respected John Cena.
Speaker 1: I would respect John Cena if someday he comes out
Speaker 1: and I'm giving him this out if he cares to
Speaker 1: take it, which is well, you knows Ben Well saying
Speaker 1: I didn't want any kids hurting other kids with this
Speaker 1: hole if they imitated me, So I applied it loose
Speaker 1: and try to make it seem like it was more,
Speaker 1: you know, torquing the body and not squeezing the neck
Speaker 1: in the head that made the move effective. And maybe
Speaker 1: it wasn't ideal, but I just figured it was, you know,
Speaker 1: in light of the Benwall stuff, should probably apply that
Speaker 1: a little bit looser so we don't have any kids
Speaker 1: choking each other out. If you like said that, I'd
Speaker 1: be like, okay, maybe you know what I mean, Like,
Speaker 1: you know, there's so many other things in wrestling that
Speaker 1: could heart if kids imitated, I would say, just pick
Speaker 1: a different finisher that you can apply well. But I
Speaker 1: don't think that even cross Teena's mine. I just don't
Speaker 1: think he thinks about that stuff. And I think he's
Speaker 1: so insulated as a top guy, not because he's a
Speaker 1: bad guy and has insulated himself. It is kind of
Speaker 1: natural when you're like the top go to guy in
Speaker 1: the company, nobody wants to only Steve Austen, you know,
Speaker 1: separated from the business, retired and made more money than
Speaker 1: Seen up per year, you know, on average, I mean've
Speaker 1: seen has made more money in his career. But in
Speaker 1: his peak years, Austin was responsible for turning the tide
Speaker 1: of WWE against ww Austin has the credibility to do that,
Speaker 1: and very few other people, apparently, if anybody, has ever
Speaker 1: done that. So it's too bad, you know. I think
Speaker 1: Seena isn't isn't highly self aware of certain things, and
Speaker 1: in because of his stature, he doesn't have what we
Speaker 1: all have, which is friends who tell us the truth
Speaker 1: so without worrying about losing their jobs or you know,
Speaker 1: their standing in their in their in their chosen professions.
Speaker 7: So need an extra dose of positivity in your wrestling podcasts.
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Speaker 7: Paradise at Pine Torch VIP as we mask on the
Speaker 7: bright side of wrestling and focus on some of the
Speaker 7: great matches and shows from around the world, be it US, Japan,
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Speaker 1: Anyhow, man, any help?
Speaker 2: Brook?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 6: I had someone on Roman Reigns the past couple weeks,
Speaker 6: it kind of seems to me like they're pulling back
Speaker 6: a little with the segments for giving them and the
Speaker 6: time to giving them, and it seems to me like
Speaker 6: the crowds kind of not I mean it's not obviously
Speaker 6: he's getting still getting good reactions, but it seems like
Speaker 6: they're pulling on.
Speaker 1: Him just a little bit.
Speaker 6: This doesn't seem to be as much rains a Mania,
Speaker 6: I guess you could say, And looking at it, I
Speaker 6: think the guys, like I've called about this a couple
Speaker 6: of times, but I think he's definitely like two, if
Speaker 6: not three years away from being where they want him
Speaker 6: to be. And I think if their plan is to
Speaker 6: put him up against Lesnar at Wrestlemanian Pass the Torch,
Speaker 6: He's gonna get booed hard by that WrestleMania crowd and
Speaker 6: it's going to really change the tide long term. And
Speaker 6: I think long term they're doing damage to him by
Speaker 6: putting in that spot now. And if they think it's potential,
Speaker 6: I think that they should have just held off a
Speaker 6: little bit longer, And especially like last night, whenever Daniel
Speaker 6: Briant gets mentioned, I think that there's still that Daniel
Speaker 6: Bryan Mania going on. I mean, every time they mentioned name,
Speaker 6: the crowd just erupts into the s chant. And I
Speaker 6: just don't think Roman Rains is ready for that spot,
Speaker 6: and I don't think the crowd's ready to give up
Speaker 6: on Daniel Brian, and I think pushing him in that
Speaker 6: WrestleMania spot's going to be a huge mistake if they
Speaker 6: continue that way.
Speaker 1: And that's when you guys thought on that. Yeah, great,
Speaker 1: great topics, is match good, good way to kick off
Speaker 1: the show. Jason, your you and I talked last week
Speaker 1: on the life gest I think in the VF the
Speaker 1: after show portion, and you were kind of correct me
Speaker 1: if my memory's wrong, but you were kind of leaning
Speaker 1: towards they should do Daniel Brian against Lesner at Mania
Speaker 1: thirty one, not Rains against Lesner.
Speaker 4: Yeah, if Daniel Brian's healthy, I just think it's the
Speaker 4: safe for bet. I think Rain's I mean, and I
Speaker 4: reserve the right to change my tune as we get
Speaker 4: closer to many if something clicks with Rains, but he's
Speaker 4: he still has a lot to prove in the ring.
Speaker 4: I do think promo wise, he's done a nice job
Speaker 4: with what they've given him that they protect him, and
Speaker 4: rightfully so, but I just don't see enough consistency with
Speaker 4: him in the ring. I don't see the move set
Speaker 4: that I think he's going to need. And I fear
Speaker 4: that if it just feels a little too predictable, that
Speaker 4: the Mania crowd is really going to turn on I
Speaker 4: just right now as things stand to me, if Daniel
Speaker 4: Brian were healthy, that just feels like the bigger match
Speaker 4: than Rains. But I did you know, last night I
Speaker 4: was starting to feel the same way about another crowd
Speaker 4: seemed to be kind of drifting away from Rain a
Speaker 4: little bit, and then last night I thought they were
Speaker 4: really with him, and it was so one crowd if nothing,
Speaker 4: but still that particular crowd was really into Rains for
Speaker 4: that fifteen minute match with Cain.
Speaker 1: There's a little tell last night. I talked about this
Speaker 1: longer on my Keller hotline last night and my vip
Speaker 1: raw report. The text version that I put up earlier today,
Speaker 1: Rain's at the end like said, you know, you beat
Speaker 1: me down, but I'm still here, And it like ended
Speaker 1: with like it's like when you're reading a sentence and
Speaker 1: there's an exclamation point at the end, but you didn't
Speaker 1: know what was coming until you're reading the last word,
Speaker 1: and so you just you're reading it normal and you
Speaker 1: get to the last word and you're like, oh, there's
Speaker 1: exclamation point, So I better say the last word of
Speaker 1: the sentence really loud, even if that's not the natural
Speaker 1: stress point.
Speaker 4: Jo Guerrero Junior.
Speaker 1: Yes, so there's nothing about standing where Rains was standing
Speaker 1: right there, that was really what was the natural stress point.
Speaker 1: So Rain's's reciting lines and he thinks he's supposed to
Speaker 1: sound end on a strong note, so he ends with here.
Speaker 1: But if you go listen to like Steve Austin and
Speaker 1: the Rock and Hack Brett Hard and Rick Flair and
Speaker 1: the Michael Hayes and great great promo people, they're in
Speaker 1: They're not sitting there trying to figure out like, Okay,
Speaker 1: what am I supposed to say and why am I
Speaker 1: supposed to say it? There they know, they feel their promo.
Speaker 1: They are in that character and it's not it's not
Speaker 1: like rehearsal at a high school or college acting class.
Speaker 1: They are in a zone. And Rain's is not in
Speaker 1: a zone. He's he doesn't know who he is as
Speaker 1: a character yet, and he's not speaking from the heart.
Speaker 1: And you know, It's not like that just saying here
Speaker 1: anyone's aware of, like they're not going, why did he
Speaker 1: say here? Really loud? It's not like fans are saying
Speaker 1: that specifically. But what happens is there's this intangible feeling
Speaker 1: when Rain's talks that I think is hurting him, which
Speaker 1: is he's saying rehearse lines. It's what screws up Brandy
Speaker 1: Orton as a babyface, you know, where people react to
Speaker 1: Orton as a top star when they see him, like
Speaker 1: I've seen this guy in so many great WWE moments,
Speaker 1: who will cheer him, but they but it doesn't I
Speaker 1: don't think it can. I don't think when he's a
Speaker 1: babyface really connects at the level that's necessary because he
Speaker 1: just seems kind of soul less and empty and unengaged.
Speaker 1: And it's just a staccato rehearsal of what he scripted
Speaker 1: to say, and Rains is more in that zone right
Speaker 1: now and he's not. I just don't feel he's speaking
Speaker 1: from the heart. And again Steve Austin says it's better
Speaker 1: than anybody when he talks about the art of the promo,
Speaker 1: and I think it was when he and I were
Speaker 1: on when he had me on his show left November.
Speaker 1: We talked about this and the art of the promo
Speaker 1: and and the scripting, and I know he's brought it
Speaker 1: up other times and that that to me is that's
Speaker 1: even more important than the moves that So yeah, I'm curious.
Speaker 1: I'm I mean, this is why we watch wrestling and
Speaker 1: love to follow it as grown ups. You know is
Speaker 1: is you follow it. You know what they're trying to do,
Speaker 1: but there's just things that are not in their control.
Speaker 1: And watching the Rains push play out is gonna be
Speaker 1: It's gonna be fascinating to watch. What whether you're cheer
Speaker 1: and former against him or you want Brian it up,
Speaker 1: but whatever it is, WWE is tentatively banking on him
Speaker 1: to be a breakout star and they're putting the machine
Speaker 1: behind him right now, the machine is behind Johnson and Lesnar,
Speaker 1: and Rains against Orton is a supporting match, just like
Speaker 1: Jericho Bray and Brie Steph. In fact, Brie STEP's get
Speaker 1: more of a push than rains Orton. So kind of
Speaker 1: have to wait till after SummerSlam to see where they go.
Speaker 1: I mean, but I think it does seem like maybe
Speaker 1: they're pulling back a little bit, but more just because hey,
Speaker 1: we're selling summer Slam and Rains isn't in the main
Speaker 1: event like it was last month, so that's probably part
Speaker 1: of the reason. All right. I do want to remind
Speaker 1: people the pod Torch live cast is brought to you
Speaker 1: by Audible, a leading provider of spoken audio information and entertainment,
Speaker 1: exclusively with this free trial. But you have to go
Speaker 1: to audibletrial dot com slash Pro Wrestling Torch. Now you
Speaker 1: see why it's stressed trial there because I don't want
Speaker 1: you to go to audible dot com. So I'm stressing
Speaker 1: the word trial Audible trial dot com slash Pro Wrestling Torch.
Speaker 1: That's where you can go and claim your free audiobook.
Speaker 1: All right, let's move on to more phone calls here
Speaker 1: and we'll go next to area code nine to five two.
Speaker 1: This is VIP member Brian. Brian confirmed, this is you
Speaker 1: and the city are calling from today.
Speaker 8: I am confirming it's me Wade and I'm calling from Minneapolis, Minnesota.
Speaker 1: No, Minneapolis, Minnesota. Sorry, no, no, no, I don't say
Speaker 1: it like that.
Speaker 8: I was gonna talk about that a little bit. That
Speaker 8: that is something I've noticed more and more and when
Speaker 8: you said it really hit the hail on the tail,
Speaker 8: the head just right on point. He doesn't have that
Speaker 8: ability yet, like he wants to be the rock, but
Speaker 8: I don't think there's that like he's not comfortable in
Speaker 8: his skin yet. And I don't know if he's going
Speaker 8: to get that because there was a time where the
Speaker 8: rock was.
Speaker 2: Similar where could see him putting the pieces together.
Speaker 8: And he'd stumble, but then eventually he got it and
Speaker 8: I hope that for rains someone I think who really
Speaker 8: has it though, And I talked about this as traffics
Speaker 8: Bryan is and he's on a simmer right now. Is
Speaker 8: Dean Ambrose. When he got that pop last night and
Speaker 8: had that wide audience shot, there was a lot of
Speaker 8: people standing with that crumby music hitting like they still
Speaker 8: stood up and got up for him. So he definitely
Speaker 8: has something going.
Speaker 1: And you know what, that's a really good Brian, just
Speaker 1: jump in real quick. That's a really good contrast because
Speaker 1: Dean Ambrose is in that zone that I talk about.
Speaker 1: He knows who he is as a character. You do
Speaker 1: you not think he's anybody, but that he's not trying
Speaker 1: to be anything. He just is And I think that
Speaker 1: authenticity is what really helps fans connect with somebody, and
Speaker 1: Dean Ambrols has it. I actually think Seth Rollins has
Speaker 1: it better than Roman Rings does too.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 8: I would agree with you, yeah, one hundred percent on that.
Speaker 8: That's that's what I've been seeing. My question for you guys,
Speaker 8: I had one more thing to say to you, and
Speaker 8: then one question you guys were talking about it.
Speaker 2: How your review for.
Speaker 8: O s Field Domain Wrestling Show. I just wanted to
Speaker 8: say that the red haired wrestler is Ricky Loves. He's
Speaker 8: one of my favorite indie guys.
Speaker 1: Yes, and Jason, we should have remembered that because I
Speaker 1: think we were talking about Johnny Love and Ricky Rice.
Speaker 1: That's right, and we're like, oh, Ricky Love because they
Speaker 1: both were Ricky Rice and Johnny Love were top guys
Speaker 1: in p WA in the late eighties and we and
Speaker 1: then when he was Ricky Love had made us talk
Speaker 1: about that. So anyway, yeah, we should have remembered that. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So he's one, Brian, he's one of your favorites.
Speaker 3: Ah.
Speaker 8: Yeah for the young upstar guys, I'm a big Yeah.
Speaker 8: Just has that great baby comeback. I can't have had
Speaker 8: a lot of shows working with him and stuff. And
Speaker 8: it's just like the fans are getting a lot of
Speaker 8: girls scream and that's something I'm always a fan of.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I mean that's a sign that I'm
Speaker 1: on the question. Yep.
Speaker 8: Absolutely. My question for you this week besides get on
Speaker 8: the bush, is have you guys gotten a chance to
Speaker 8: see the Paul Caman DVD yet?
Speaker 1: A commentary Jason.
Speaker 4: I had every intention of watching it before today show.
Speaker 4: I went to Walmart. They had the standard copy, and
Speaker 4: I'm like, I know, no blue Rail. I'll go to
Speaker 4: Target next door. They didn't have either. I'm like, well,
Speaker 4: I'll just go to best Buy, even though it's way
Speaker 4: across town or whatever. I stopped off at a Walmart
Speaker 4: that was on the way. Again standard, no Blu Ray.
Speaker 4: Go to best Buy. I'm like, they have to have it.
Speaker 1: Nothing.
Speaker 4: So I just threw my hands up and wasted a
Speaker 4: good chunk of my day in search of the Paul
Speaker 4: Hayman DVD. So, no, I haven't seen it. It's kind
Speaker 4: of a sore spot with me.
Speaker 1: We're about to go to a commercial break. Why listed
Speaker 1: commercial breaks when you can go vi IP and experience
Speaker 1: our shows with the ads and plugs removed. PW torch
Speaker 1: dot com slash go VP. That's PW Torch dot com
Speaker 1: slash go VIP for full details, or go to Patreon
Speaker 1: Patreon dot com slash PW Torch. VIP rate start as
Speaker 1: low as four dollars in ninety nine cents to remove
Speaker 1: the ads and plugs through Patreon. Full VIP membership starts
Speaker 1: at nine dollars in ninety nine cents to treat yourself
Speaker 1: to a streamlined, add and plug free listening experience with
Speaker 1: a VIP or Patreon membership. Yeah, and I have not
Speaker 1: seen it yet either, and I would have. It would
Speaker 1: have been nice if we got a promotional copy by now, Jason.
Speaker 1: I mean not that we're being cheap. I'm just saying
Speaker 1: we're so busy covering wrestling stuff. It'd be nice if
Speaker 1: wwe still still sent that out to us, But no,
Speaker 1: we got to go out and hunt for him, and
Speaker 1: so no, we can't review it. Have you seen it
Speaker 1: right away, Brad?
Speaker 2: Yes, I can.
Speaker 8: I can't believe that they don't send you guys like
Speaker 8: digital copy links like to review that. Yeah, it would
Speaker 8: be I would think vital anyway. Yeah, I've gotten a
Speaker 8: chance to see it, and I really just want to
Speaker 8: hear your guys's take on the on the perspective of
Speaker 8: the film, the authenticity. So I guess i'll call back
Speaker 8: next week. Can hear your guys' take, because I don't
Speaker 8: hear it.
Speaker 1: In the meantime, I will. I'll be watching it this
Speaker 1: week and I'll be reviewing it for VP members on
Speaker 1: on the Ketler Hotline or if or watch or Bruce
Speaker 1: Mitchell Audio Show or maybe both. So we'll definitely we'll
Speaker 1: definitely have it covered soon here, but just not on
Speaker 1: today's libcast.
Speaker 8: All right, guys, have a good show, Thank you so
Speaker 8: much again.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, but Brian, I'm you watched it and you are
Speaker 1: just curious about the authenticity. They're worth watching it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I enjoyed it.
Speaker 8: I don't want to, you know, say a whole lot
Speaker 8: about I want to hear your guys' take, but I
Speaker 8: mean I liked it. It was on far with the
Speaker 8: ECW apologize my.
Speaker 1: Incentive sat Oh that's nine yep.
Speaker 8: It was on part It was on hollow with.
Speaker 6: The ec wdvds.
Speaker 8: They didn't stuff in there. It was more close to
Speaker 8: the cmpunk documentary in terms of quality of set.
Speaker 6: I just want to hear about your guys.
Speaker 1: Yeah, take yeah, no, I look forward to it. I
Speaker 1: thought the commercial Jason was really good.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: I like when Paul Hayman sounds somewhat introspective and saying,
Speaker 1: you know, I get into fights I have no reason
Speaker 1: or business getting into, or you know, I pick fights
Speaker 1: and get into battles that I have no business getting
Speaker 1: into or there's no advantage, you know. Like I like
Speaker 1: teasers that somebody's going to be actually introspective about themselves,
Speaker 1: you know, as they look back at their career. But yeah,
Speaker 1: we got to see the whole thing to.
Speaker 4: Really judge it, which is so rare for Paul. I mean,
Speaker 4: that's something that he just doesn't like looking back, and
Speaker 4: you can get into the reasons as to why that
Speaker 4: may be, and then we can speculate. But it's just
Speaker 4: he's not someone that sits around and relives the glory
Speaker 4: days of ECW. It's just not his style. So this
Speaker 4: is very rare for him to do this. I'm not
Speaker 4: surprised they finally got around to doing it. But I
Speaker 4: think he's told the story. I think he did it
Speaker 4: between the Ropes Dot Common interview where he just said,
Speaker 4: like he made them, he put the thing off like
Speaker 4: six seven times or something like that, and just kept
Speaker 4: giving them the run around and doing the interview because
Speaker 4: he was dreading it so much.
Speaker 1: Funny Funny, We got an email from Peter Torch VIP
Speaker 1: member Idan Baramani of Abington, Maryland just while we've been
Speaker 1: doing the show here and he's we're talking about the
Speaker 1: Shield members, you know who's doing the best, and he
Speaker 1: just said, if WWE's concerned about ratings, financials in their
Speaker 1: bottom line, the solution is simple. Dean Ambrose, despite not
Speaker 1: featuring him every week and cooling him lately with strange booking,
Speaker 1: the crowd is taken to him. I know the company
Speaker 1: is full on with Roman reigns, but they should take
Speaker 1: note Dean has dollar signs in main event written all
Speaker 1: over him. Last night segment with Rowlins was campy, but
Speaker 1: I loved it Ambrose's facials and mannerisms, especially when he
Speaker 1: tore up the money in the bank contract. Are wrestling Gold?
Speaker 1: Your thoughts? I liked it a lot too. James Caldwell
Speaker 1: and his report on PW Torch dot com a little
Speaker 1: cooler on it than I was, and thought it was
Speaker 1: kind of like, just, you know, high schoolers pranking each
Speaker 1: other or something like that. I thought Ambrose when he
Speaker 1: was tearing it up and having kind of that mock, Oh,
Speaker 1: I know this hurts you so much, Seth rollins, what
Speaker 1: am I about to do? What am I doing? Everything?
Speaker 1: Just he's spot on with that stuff, and you know, yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean it's you know, the hat and the briefcase.
Speaker 1: You know, you can imagine Vincent Man sitting in the
Speaker 1: back going this this hilarious. J b OL's head is
Speaker 1: covered in colon and popcorn and all. I mean, not
Speaker 1: everything about it was great, but I thought that, you know,
Speaker 1: creating a distraction for Seth to lose to a guy
Speaker 1: that he was heavily favored against was fine. I mean
Speaker 1: that worked for me in the spot on the show
Speaker 1: those in and I just think, Yeah, Dean Ambrose does
Speaker 1: everything that he's asked to do really well, And I
Speaker 1: don't have much of any critique. I think he knows
Speaker 1: who he is. He's in step with his character, and
Speaker 1: he gives off that sense of authenticity and he's good
Speaker 1: and intense in the ring he is. There's that, there's Dick,
Speaker 1: some Dick Slator, there's some Roddy Piper, There's who's the
Speaker 1: third person that we we came to conclusion he's a
Speaker 1: combo with three people, and I can only think of
Speaker 1: Slater and Piper.
Speaker 4: I always go with Heath Ledger's joker, But I'm sure
Speaker 4: you're looking for someone wrestling wise.
Speaker 1: Yeah, someone wrestling wise. There, he's like a combination of
Speaker 1: three people. But anyway, I forgot, but Jason, yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: are you as high on on Ambrose is as weird
Speaker 1: I am.
Speaker 4: I don't know that people are going to get their
Speaker 4: wish where all of a sudden they're just going to
Speaker 4: abandon ship on Rains in favor of pushing Ambrose to
Speaker 4: the top. But I think long term, I still believe
Speaker 4: the payoff for this is going to be Rains is
Speaker 4: the guy and Ambrose becomes his Roddy Piper like Foyle,
Speaker 4: and I think the longer they play up some sort
Speaker 4: of a friendship between them, the longer you have to
Speaker 4: get away from the seth Rawlins thing. You don't want
Speaker 4: to do that too soon because then it's just going
Speaker 4: to bee like Rawlins did the same thing. So I
Speaker 4: hope there's a real slow build up to that moment
Speaker 4: when he turns, because I know he's really over as
Speaker 4: a Babyface. And I'm not saying I wouldn't take that
Speaker 4: approach with him, but I just think I don't know
Speaker 4: that he's going to be Vince McMahon's guy, you know,
Speaker 4: but I think he can be a really strong heel
Speaker 4: player for them. But I think that one of the
Speaker 4: real I guess one of the things that stands out
Speaker 4: about Ambrose to me is there, even though I'm sure
Speaker 4: he's doing every single thing they tell him to do,
Speaker 4: just like everybody else in that company, there's an element
Speaker 4: of danger when he's out there that's missing with so
Speaker 4: many of the other guys on the rock. Sure.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's that's a good phrase too. Yeah, that's a
Speaker 1: good point. All right, very good. If you joined us,
Speaker 1: we are past midway point of the p W Torch
Speaker 1: Live Cast. I am Wade Keller joined by Jason Powell
Speaker 1: of Pro Wrestling dot Net and you can find this
Speaker 1: show live at PW torch live cast dot com. That
Speaker 1: is again Friday, several years ago. The goal was, you know, hey,
Speaker 1: let's get the big names on that are current, you know,
Speaker 1: and talk you know, guys who just get fired like Hernandez,
Speaker 1: Guys who have a new paper view going on from
Speaker 1: their training center, but are willing to talk to us
Speaker 1: like Booker t who are national stars, legendary take team
Speaker 1: guys like Devon Dudley, AJ Styles. Shortly after leaving TNA,
Speaker 1: Jake the Snake, Robertson Scott Hall did their first interviews
Speaker 1: with us after being announced for the Hall of Fame,
Speaker 1: Stone Called Steve Boston did his first public comments about
Speaker 1: WrestleMania thirty on this show just days after WrestleMania. We
Speaker 1: love all that. We've also wanted to do history pieces
Speaker 1: and we've had different people on historians like mccarsh and
Speaker 1: George Shire and Greg Oliver, and we've also wanted We've
Speaker 1: also had legendary wrestlers on. And one guy that you're
Speaker 1: gonna have on on this Friday show I'm really looking
Speaker 1: forward to this interview is the grappler Len Detton from Portland, Oregon.
Speaker 1: He's got a autobiography that is out Jim and you've
Speaker 1: been reading that, You've had You've got me excited to
Speaker 1: read it, and you're going to have him on the
Speaker 1: show on Friday. And you are the perfect person to
Speaker 1: interview him because that is your home territory and that's
Speaker 1: where he was such a big star. So give us
Speaker 1: a little preview of what to expect and sell people
Speaker 1: on checking out Friday show.
Speaker 3: You know, you mentioned a lot of the people that
Speaker 3: have been on the show. You know you mentioned Jake Roberts.
Speaker 3: You know his legend has it. The grappler Lennon Denton
Speaker 3: was the first victim inadvertently of the DDT in the
Speaker 3: Mid South promotion. Grappler finished up his career here in
Speaker 3: the Northwest, but you know he made his name in
Speaker 3: Mid South as a masked wrestler under Bill Watts. He
Speaker 3: was North American Champion during prime of the Junkyard Dogs
Speaker 3: main event Big Money super Dome runs in in Mid
Speaker 3: South in the in the early eighties. You he was
Speaker 3: a main heel, one of Junkyard Dogs, you know, biggest
Speaker 3: opponents during his you know, his biggest run ever in wrestling.
Speaker 3: So you know, Len Denton has done a lot. So
Speaker 3: I mean, if you're a fan of great wrestling stories,
Speaker 3: you know Lena is rentled in Texas, in Mid South,
Speaker 3: in Mid Atlantic, Central States, Memphis, Portland, you know a
Speaker 3: lot more. You know, he was underneath guy for years
Speaker 3: and you know, you read a lot of books and
Speaker 3: you know quite Honestly, you go, Okay, I don't really
Speaker 3: want to read about your childhood.
Speaker 1: I don't really want to read about.
Speaker 3: Your early days. This is really boring, to be honest,
Speaker 3: I find the most compelling part of the book his
Speaker 3: early days. Has a job guy. You know, as a
Speaker 3: job guy, he drove Rick Flair around the Carolinas. So
Speaker 3: you get these great stories and great theories on wrestling
Speaker 3: from and great advice for from Rick Flair. He worked
Speaker 3: in Calgary, so he gets some great Stu Hart stories.
Speaker 3: And you know he worked made events with Brett Hart
Speaker 3: in in Calgary. You know, he booked for Harley Race
Speaker 3: in Missouri when the WWF was breaking the rules, you know,
Speaker 3: in in you know, the early eighties, and ran a
Speaker 3: TV taping in Saint Louis. I mean that was a
Speaker 3: that was a huge deal. Plus, you know he talks,
Speaker 3: you know about backstage stuff. You know, he got into
Speaker 3: altercations with with fans. You know, I mean, everybody knows
Speaker 3: about the infamous Louisiana fans. Everyone has heard Jim Cornett
Speaker 3: stories about the Louisiana fans. Well, you know, he has
Speaker 3: some some stories of his own. You know, he worked
Speaker 3: for Bill Watts. Bill Wats a strong personality. He talks
Speaker 3: about his altercations with the Bill Watts. He also talks
Speaker 3: about a confrontation with with one of your all time
Speaker 3: favorite wrestlers, Wade Jerry Blackwell. Yes, you know, he was
Speaker 3: managed by Jim Cornett and Jimmy Hart. You know he
Speaker 3: he worked with Andre, He worked with Dusty and dB Ossi.
Speaker 3: You know, he was on the USA Network with Southwest
Speaker 3: Wrestling before w w F was on was on, was
Speaker 3: on the USA Network. And you know, in for for
Speaker 3: MMA fans, Chail san the guy who has made millions
Speaker 3: off of his talking more than his fighting, you know,
Speaker 3: stole a lot of his promos and a lot of
Speaker 3: pat lines growing up in Portland for the grappler. You know,
Speaker 3: the grappler's famous line is they got a name for you.
Speaker 3: If you're a great wrestler. They don't call you a
Speaker 3: great wrestler, they call you the grappler. Beat me if
Speaker 3: you can substitute the words Chail Saun and and you
Speaker 3: have his catchphrase, yes very cool. So you know this guy,
Speaker 3: this guy, this guy goes from you know, from the
Speaker 3: early seventies all the way. You know, he's you know,
Speaker 3: because of Chail Saun and he's relevant right now. So
Speaker 3: even though you may not have heard of him, you know,
Speaker 3: this book has got a million stories and you know,
Speaker 3: I'm not quite done with it, and it's great and
Speaker 3: nothing you could have be way before I go. It's written. Uh,
Speaker 3: you know the great it's the grappler stories. But there's
Speaker 3: a writer for the book, as many wrestling books have,
Speaker 3: and he's a reporter for a television station in Portland
Speaker 3: and he is an excellent writer. So many wrestling books
Speaker 3: just sound like someone dictated, you know, a tape recording,
Speaker 3: and you know they're just kind of, you know, a
Speaker 3: stream of consciousness. This is really well written. I think
Speaker 3: this is the best written wrestling book since probably The
Speaker 3: Queen of the Ring, the Story of Mildred Burke. I mean,
Speaker 3: this is a this is I in all honesty, I
Speaker 3: did not expect much from this book because I thought
Speaker 3: the grappler that that I had talked to in the
Speaker 3: past was kind of a K fave guy and protected
Speaker 3: the business. And I didn't expect much because it's self published.
Speaker 3: But this is, you know, this is, in my opinion,
Speaker 3: of a very top notch wrestling book.
Speaker 9: I'm Kelly Wells host of PWT Talks NXT, the longest
Speaker 9: running NXT podcast anywhere. Join me along with Nate Lindberg,
Speaker 9: Bruce Lee, Hazelwood, and special guests, live every Tuesday night,
Speaker 9: just minutes after NXT, where we cover the good, the bad,
Speaker 9: and the ugly on the way to becoming a star
Speaker 9: in WWE. Check us out live on YouTube or stream later.
Speaker 2: Wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 1: Very good. We look forward to the interview on Friday.
Speaker 1: We especially want to call out to fans who watched
Speaker 1: the Grappler during his career are familiar with him. We
Speaker 1: have all age ranges listening to our show, and if
Speaker 1: you are a fan or have knowledge of his career
Speaker 1: and you have specific questions and want to bring out
Speaker 1: some stories from him, feel free to call on the show. Jim,
Speaker 1: I know you'll have no trouble filling your time with
Speaker 1: a Grappler talking about stories that Grappler talked about on
Speaker 1: the book and extracting details and reactions from him. So
Speaker 1: we really look forward to that. If you have an
Speaker 1: email question for the Grappler because you can't listen or
Speaker 1: call live, the email address is PW Torchlive cast at
Speaker 1: gmail dot com. Just be sure to put in the
Speaker 1: subject line question for Grappler and we'll and Jim will
Speaker 1: take a look at those and filtering questions ahead of time.
Speaker 1: So again the Grappler lend and comes on the PW
Speaker 1: Torch Livecast one Interview Friday, following in the footsteps of
Speaker 1: other legendary names who have been on the PW Torch
Speaker 1: Live Cast Interview Friday, like Jake Roberts, Teddy Biassi, JJ Dillon,
Speaker 1: Paul Bear, Jerry Jarrett, Tommy Young, Jimmy Hart, and Nikita
Speaker 1: Koloff and others. Those are all big names from the
Speaker 1: nineteen eighties and even the seventies. So I hope you'll
Speaker 1: check that out, Jim, thank you very much, Jim. I
Speaker 1: also hosted a wrestling radio show in the early two thousands.
Speaker 1: What was the full year range, Jim.
Speaker 3: Two thousand and two thousand and two.
Speaker 1: There you go. So during that, you know, roughly three
Speaker 1: year stretch, did a lot of radio called Total Cast Radio.
Speaker 1: We exclusively feature those shows for VIP members and we're
Speaker 1: putting up one, maybe two shows per month right now.
Speaker 1: From that run in the early two thousands, kind of
Speaker 1: the tail end of the Attitude era. Really fascinating time
Speaker 1: to go back and listen to a familiar voice here
Speaker 1: for live cast listeners and a long long time pros
Speaker 1: and Torch reader, and that is Jim Valley, with an
Speaker 1: award winning radio show host and those shows it's a
Speaker 1: pocket a time where there's not a lot of audio.
Speaker 1: Frankly about pro wrestling preceded the PW Torch VIP section
Speaker 1: by just a couple of years, so it really does
Speaker 1: fit the pocket of time where there is an audio,
Speaker 1: and it's really really really cool to have access to
Speaker 1: those and VIP members get to enjoy hearing kind of
Speaker 1: a smart for lack of better term, you know, insider
Speaker 1: perspective on professional wrestling with special guests, live calls and
Speaker 1: Jim your your review and point of view on big
Speaker 1: events during that time period, So a real perk going VIP.
Speaker 1: PW torch dot Com slash go vi is the place
Speaker 1: to go if you want to sign up as a
Speaker 1: VIP member. Jim, thanks for taking time to come on
Speaker 1: and preview the show and I relud forward to listening
Speaker 1: on Friday.
Speaker 3: Ah Man, thanks guys, you guys have a great show
Speaker 3: and talk to Jaden, Jason and Wade later. Man take
Speaker 3: it easy.
Speaker 1: Sounds great, Thanks Jim. Thanks Javelli substitute hosting for me
Speaker 1: on Friday for the second time. I'll be out of
Speaker 1: town but hopefully listening to the show live and you
Speaker 1: can check his interview with Devon Dudley. I'm a few
Speaker 1: weeks back at pw torchlivecast dot com. When you go
Speaker 1: to pwet torchlivecast dot com, also you get to there
Speaker 1: are links to our rssp So if you want to
Speaker 1: subscribe on your phone, if you've got Podbean on Android
Speaker 1: or whatever app you use on Android, to get your
Speaker 1: Torch dot Com slash Go VIP is where you can
Speaker 1: sign up. It's ten bucks a month, not ninety nine,
Speaker 1: but ten dollars a month. To get on board with that, Jason,
Speaker 1: I'm going to save our nine to ninety nine rant
Speaker 1: for the VIP after show. We'll give our thoughts on that.
Speaker 1: I'm not even gonna tease tease it, but we'll just
Speaker 1: discuss that in the VIP after show. But we can
Speaker 1: get back to the phone lines and let's go to
Speaker 1: another VIP Express caller. This is VIP member Scott. Just
Speaker 1: confirm this is you and let us know the city
Speaker 1: you're callin from.
Speaker 2: Today Anyway, this is Scott. I'm in james Burg, New Jersey.
Speaker 2: Proud VIP member.
Speaker 1: Excellent, Thank you, Scott. What's your favorite part about being VIP?
Speaker 1: If I may pry a plug out of you, well, I'll.
Speaker 2: Start by saying, Wade, you should have listened to me
Speaker 2: with Bruce Mitchell last week because I did a big
Speaker 2: plug for the VIP said you want the live cast
Speaker 2: members to hear. Every true wrestling fan should go VIP.
Speaker 2: I was a VIP member over ten years ago, got
Speaker 2: back into got back into wrestling. I'm one of those
Speaker 2: people that the WWE termed with the network for the
Speaker 2: lost fan, the last fan. Yeah, I'm the last family.
Speaker 2: But I give all the credit to you guys from
Speaker 2: Ivory enthusiasm with wrestling, the Bruce Mitchell audio shows. I've
Speaker 2: been working my way back. I'm into some stuff from
Speaker 2: two thousand and eight and to hear the history of
Speaker 2: the business with you and Bruce just talking and just
Speaker 2: really give an insight into anything you can think of
Speaker 2: in the business. I would say for the last past
Speaker 2: fifty years, I heard you guys feeling a rant about
Speaker 2: wrestling before TV, what wrestling was like before TV, you know,
Speaker 2: reading the old newsletters. It helps fill in the gaps
Speaker 2: that you missed from you know, I stopped watching in
Speaker 2: two thousand and four. WRESTLINGIA twenty was the last pay
Speaker 2: per view I purchased. I got the net. I went
Speaker 2: VIP last July based on one of the sales you
Speaker 2: guys did that was in conjunction with the ass the
Speaker 2: Torch calling me each day. Yeah, and it just rekindled
Speaker 2: my love for the business. My wife, I'm can't get
Speaker 2: over how much I'm back into wrestling. Considering our first
Speaker 2: nine years together, I wasn't touching anything with wrestling and
Speaker 2: the way I'm back involved and enjoying everything. Looking forward
Speaker 2: to talking to you guys and calling Bruce and Travis
Speaker 2: on their audio show. But the Bruce Mitchell audio show
Speaker 2: was truly it's the best thing ever. The Startcare reviews
Speaker 2: he just did incredible even for someone who wasn't watching
Speaker 2: wrestling at that time. I was five years old in
Speaker 2: those starcades where and I really enjoyed reliving them through
Speaker 2: Bruce and just amazing and Wade. Everything you do, You're
Speaker 2: just such, You're so on top of everything. I had
Speaker 2: a problem with my subscription. I sent you an email
Speaker 2: when you were speaking to some of those old live
Speaker 2: cast interviews to interview with Jim Ross in May. I
Speaker 2: had a problem with my subscription with my credit card.
Speaker 2: You were quick enough got back to me that within
Speaker 2: an hour, reconnecting my password and everything to get me
Speaker 2: through so I could hear all that stuff that weekend.
Speaker 2: It was the weekend of a paper on a WWE special,
Speaker 2: but you were just there for your customers, and any
Speaker 2: true wrestling fan should go vi Ida.
Speaker 1: Well, I didn't expect that, Scott when I asked, but
Speaker 1: thank you. I brought a smile to my face. And
Speaker 1: I really appreciate, uh, really appreciate you saying what you
Speaker 1: said there. I know you called for a reasoning as well.
Speaker 2: What it's called about. I'm a network subscriber, guys, and
Speaker 2: just like you guys, I've been fascinated just with the
Speaker 2: what's everything with the network. I've talked to Bruce a
Speaker 2: couple of times about ways to improve the network, and
Speaker 2: I enjoyed the Bruce Mitch audio show about a month
Speaker 2: ago where you guys spent like ninety minutes just how
Speaker 2: to make the network better. And I just have a
Speaker 2: couple of things and questions for you guys. The first
Speaker 2: question I have is this with the Rogers Network deal,
Speaker 2: one of my biggest disappointments is a network subscriber. Is
Speaker 2: there's no structure to the live I know you guys
Speaker 2: have talked about it. You know it started, you know
Speaker 2: the Tuesday nights you have the WrestleMania rewinds and you
Speaker 2: have the countdown, and you have your main event. You know,
Speaker 2: then you have your superstars on Thursday n Next Team
Speaker 2: and Saturday night's the behind you know they showed the
Speaker 2: documentaries with the behind the Ring. But the fact is
Speaker 2: network now going on six months. The fact that there's
Speaker 2: still no structure, that there's no If I tune in
Speaker 2: every Saturday night it's six o five, I should be
Speaker 2: able to see something that like built in, like the
Speaker 2: old WCW on TVs or I mean the Saturday night
Speaker 2: Saturday Night's main event or just like you've always said, Wade,
Speaker 2: when am I going to get on a Wednesday night
Speaker 2: eight o'clock every week I can watch Mid South Wrestling,
Speaker 2: or every Friday night at seven o'clock I can turn
Speaker 2: on and I can watch Old AWA. The fact that
Speaker 2: there's no structure and we're now six months in is
Speaker 2: a big problem, and I'm wondering if the fact that
Speaker 2: the Rogers deal in Canada, if it's going to be
Speaker 2: on cable, are they just going to show the live feed?
Speaker 2: Is that all they're going to get? And does that
Speaker 2: lead to more structure for the network.
Speaker 1: You don't have to wait for the way Keller Prog
Speaker 1: Wrestling post show to find out what I thought of
Speaker 1: Monday Night Raw and SmackDown. Each week, you can check
Speaker 1: out my reports that are updated live throughout Raw and
Speaker 1: SmackDown at pwtorch dot com. I written report will tell
Speaker 1: you what's happening in detail in case you missed the show,
Speaker 1: and it'll all also analyze key segments and give my
Speaker 1: random thoughts quips on what I am watching as it airs.
Speaker 1: So check it out every Monday night and Tuesday night
Speaker 1: at pwtorch dot com. That also applies to WWE pay
Speaker 1: per views. I cover those live at pw torch dot
Speaker 1: com with a detailed written report with star rating. And
Speaker 1: of course you can find other TV reports from other
Speaker 1: contributors to PW torch such as nxt roh, Impact Wrestling
Speaker 1: and more. Check it out pw torch dot com your
Speaker 1: first stop for TV and pay per view written reports
Speaker 1: no great topics. I you know, yes, because when you
Speaker 1: subscribe online to the over the top method in the US,
Speaker 1: you have access to anything anytime. And I think WWE
Speaker 1: has has let has not been as serious about making
Speaker 1: destination programming, like you said, in terms of a structure
Speaker 1: and a schedule, because they figure, what's the big deal?
Speaker 1: You know how lazy they have to be to not
Speaker 1: just click through the menu and pick something out. Why
Speaker 1: would you even watch our live stream? Well, they should
Speaker 1: give you a reason to watch the live stream because
Speaker 1: you make it a communal experience. And then one of
Speaker 1: the things and I won't go into all of it,
Speaker 1: but you're right, Bruce and I talked at length about this,
Speaker 1: and one of the things they can do is utilize
Speaker 1: Hulk Hogan, for instance, to give exclusive introductions and break
Speaker 1: in in the middle of a show of an old
Speaker 1: WW pay per view or an old Saturday Night's Made
Speaker 1: event and do a break in. They don't have a
Speaker 1: ninety minute Saturday Night's Made event minus commercials, is you
Speaker 1: know what, sixty two minutes or something? Have Hogan do
Speaker 1: have some commentary sitting at a table, use Tom Phillips
Speaker 1: or Renee Young or anybody. I mean in WWE, sit
Speaker 1: down with Hulk, spend a day and sit down and
Speaker 1: actually watch it with him and have him react to
Speaker 1: things and splice that into the show and premiere it.
Speaker 1: So you go, you know, Wednesday night, we're gonna air
Speaker 1: Sentate's made event number three and it's when Hulk Hogan
Speaker 1: took on Big Boss Man in a cage. I don't
Speaker 1: know what what was number three, but whatever it was,
Speaker 1: and say, and Hogan's going to be sitting in uh
Speaker 1: interviewed with Tom watching the show with Tom Phillips breaking
Speaker 1: in with commentary, do a director's cut type thing. If
Speaker 1: not that, at least when something airs on Saturday night
Speaker 1: or Sunday night, have a communal Twitter where you have
Speaker 1: hashtag WWE network, you know sat for Saturday or you
Speaker 1: know whatever, and you can at least have an ongoing
Speaker 1: discussion and have somebody sitting there putting the tweets that
Speaker 1: people are saying while it's airing live on there. There's
Speaker 1: just there's a lot of things they could be doing
Speaker 1: to make it feel more like a happening. And again,
Speaker 1: Bruce and I talked at length, and there are a
Speaker 1: lot of other ideas, and Jason, it does seem like
Speaker 1: they've lacked creativity in that regard to make it feel
Speaker 1: like when you're if you're not watching the network, you're
Speaker 1: missing out on kind of a party. WW is so
Speaker 1: effective with WW Nitro by having Nitro parties and sending
Speaker 1: Gene Okerland or or the lately Martial Art out to
Speaker 1: you know, these college parties and these get togethers, and
Speaker 1: they made it seem like the place to be and
Speaker 1: the thing to do. And I just think they've they've
Speaker 1: done a thirty five percent job of promoting the easy,
Speaker 1: cheap stuff to make the thirty five percent of the
Speaker 1: obvious stuff they've done, but they're sixty five percent more marketing.
Speaker 1: That to me is just obvious and just a brainstorming
Speaker 1: session and a few dollars away from making happen. So, anyway,
Speaker 1: your thoughts on that, and then also, do you have
Speaker 1: any knowledge yet of the of the Rogers cable on
Speaker 1: demand library situation.
Speaker 4: I'll start with Rogers. If I understanding is that there's
Speaker 4: going to be some on demand content. I don't know
Speaker 4: if it's going to be through I assume they have
Speaker 4: their own on demand platform as well, but they're also
Speaker 4: going to at some point. They kind of made it
Speaker 4: seem like during the conference call that they hope to
Speaker 4: have basically what we have available now the app version
Speaker 4: of it available in Canada as well, So I'm not
Speaker 4: it's a bit confusing. I say, it's something I definitely
Speaker 4: want to talk with WWEPR about now. I'll try to
Speaker 4: get some more details on that.
Speaker 1: But the idea is if you're thinking and you're hearing
Speaker 1: that if you subscribe to Rogers Cable, they will give
Speaker 1: you access to watch on your mobile devices.
Speaker 4: I'm not quite sure how that exactly is going to work.
Speaker 4: I would assume that's it. I don't think they're going to,
Speaker 4: you know, basically compete with Rogers for their own product.
Speaker 4: I'm sure Rogers was smart enough to make sure that's
Speaker 4: not going to happen, so I'm not that that would be.
Speaker 4: My guess though, is yeah, you can. You don't have
Speaker 4: to watch it on Rogers necessarily, but you know, I
Speaker 4: think we'll have a better idea here in a matter
Speaker 4: of days. I guess August twelfth, I think, is when
Speaker 4: that thing when it launches, and you know, that's one
Speaker 4: to watch because I do think there are people that
Speaker 4: if it were available on their television and they didn't
Speaker 4: have to go get a device or just take the
Speaker 4: various approaches to getting it. Would would would have subscribed
Speaker 4: for this, it haven't. So if that model is very successful,
Speaker 4: I'm curious to see if they look to expand that
Speaker 4: that model elsewhere outside of Canada. As far as the network,
Speaker 4: to me, it's just get me more now. That continues
Speaker 4: to be my biggest gripe about the network, and there
Speaker 4: are many. I mean, it's a you can't beat the
Speaker 4: price for considering the pay per views alone, but outside
Speaker 4: of you know, what incentive do I have to turn
Speaker 4: on the network today? There should be some Why isn't there?
Speaker 3: You know?
Speaker 4: My big thing is give me a two three five
Speaker 4: minute news update at the top of the hour, just
Speaker 4: to get me going there. And it can be like
Speaker 4: the old MTV news where okay, sometimes you're gonna see
Speaker 4: a repeat from earlier today. I don't expect them to
Speaker 4: sit there twenty four hours a day, but give me
Speaker 4: some incentive to turn that to turn it on. And
Speaker 4: I don't expect her to be Bombshelle News at the
Speaker 4: top of every hour, but give me a little something
Speaker 4: that makes me feel current, makes me feel like, oh,
Speaker 4: I need to turn this on right now because because
Speaker 4: or at the you know, the top of the hour,
Speaker 4: because there might be something there that maybe they're gonna
Speaker 4: announce a pay per view match, maybe you're gonna announce
Speaker 4: a match for Raw. There's just there's really no incentive
Speaker 4: for that. It's the only thing now, it feels like
Speaker 4: that they have is you go there for the pay
Speaker 4: per views, you go there for NXT and you know
Speaker 4: what else. Way I mean, there's I guess the Raw
Speaker 4: pre show and everything else is this great back catalog,
Speaker 4: and that's nice, and they can certainly do a better
Speaker 4: job of laying that out as well. But I just
Speaker 4: I think that's where they're really missing right now. It's
Speaker 4: the platform is a young man's platform, and here they're
Speaker 4: giving their younger audience that you would think you would
Speaker 4: want to hook on this network a lot of old
Speaker 4: material and not nearly enough new.
Speaker 1: It's one of my big disappointments is they haven't done
Speaker 1: that live studio call in show. You know, I if
Speaker 1: they just had a two hour live show from you know,
Speaker 1: five to seven Eastern or yeah, I guess I'd be
Speaker 1: head to head with us. But whatever, you know, like
Speaker 1: doing something at a point kids get home or guy,
Speaker 1: you know, people get home from school, get home from work.
Speaker 1: Every day you're like, you know what, there's something live
Speaker 1: happening right now. I can put it on my iPad,
Speaker 1: my laptop. I can put my headphones in at the
Speaker 1: college library and log into the internet and stream it.
Speaker 1: I can go to the coffee shop and do it.
Speaker 1: Or I can sit at home with my Apple TV
Speaker 1: box or whatever Roku and turn it on and it's
Speaker 1: happening right now. And they're talking about the gruesome Paul
Speaker 1: George injury and comparing it to other big wrestling injuries
Speaker 1: over the years and different recoveries of athletes, and you
Speaker 1: mix and you talk about Guardians of the Galaxy and
Speaker 1: Batista and his role in it, and people calling in
Speaker 1: and reviewing it. And then you also have a part
Speaker 1: of the show where you go, hey, coming up, we
Speaker 1: just added Senate It's made Event to the network. Let's
Speaker 1: bring in Hacksaud Jim Doug and talk about some of
Speaker 1: his his matches on sentence Made Event and what to
Speaker 1: look for and what it was like. You know, going
Speaker 1: from syndicated TV to NBC Saturday Night's a completely different
Speaker 1: larger platform for WWE exposure, bringing Roddy Piper to talk
Speaker 1: about that era on the show. There's so many possibilities,
Speaker 1: and I think that would make people feel like they're
Speaker 1: not you know, when you subscribe to the network, it's
Speaker 1: you get the pay per views and you get basically
Speaker 1: access to a Blockbuster store or you know. I guess
Speaker 1: Netflix would be a more contemper example of all wrestling stuff.
Speaker 1: And that's great, and seven hundred thousand people are for that,
Speaker 1: but I think there's hundreds of thousands of people out
Speaker 1: there who want their wrestling fix every day. And if
Speaker 1: we were I think if w do we plugged our show,
Speaker 1: which they would never do. You know, they have no
Speaker 1: interest in doing so when I understand that, but if
Speaker 1: they plugged our show, we would grow huge because talking
Speaker 1: wrestling live every day with callers with a variety I guess,
Speaker 1: a variety of host, a variety of subjects, a variety
Speaker 1: of perspectives, and we're on every day Monday through Friday live.
Speaker 1: Nobody else does that in pro wrestling, and I just
Speaker 1: think it would take off huge. And wwbe's chosen not
Speaker 1: to do that, and I don't think it would be
Speaker 1: that expensive and if they showed on Ron SmackDown clips
Speaker 1: of variety Piper sitting down live with callers, You're seeing
Speaker 1: it with everybody else, You're commenting on Twitter with everybody
Speaker 1: else as it happens. I just think you would have
Speaker 1: a lot more engaged users and people would thus get
Speaker 1: addicted to it, and if their credit card expired, or
Speaker 1: their or their PayPal ran out of funds, or they
Speaker 1: canceled after six months for some reason, they would be like,
Speaker 1: I need back, I need to get that back. And
Speaker 1: now it sort of feels like, well, if I let
Speaker 1: it laps, I can always go back and you know,
Speaker 1: sign up again if I'm in the mood to watch
Speaker 1: wrestling for a couple of months, you know, all this extra.
Speaker 1: But now it's football season and I don't know. I
Speaker 1: just there's so much more they could be doing for
Speaker 1: not that much money, and it feels like they're pulling
Speaker 1: back at a time when they should be adding. And
Speaker 1: I think they're being penny smart and dollar foolish in
Speaker 1: that process.
Speaker 4: Absolutely, and you know, and chiming in on that older
Speaker 4: content as well, just expand the library. I mean, how
Speaker 4: many of the same episodes of ECW are you going
Speaker 4: to show at four o'clock in the morning.
Speaker 1: Oh right, yep, No, I know, I know.
Speaker 10: I'm Chris Maitland and I'm Justin mcclellands. We host Wrestling
Speaker 10: Coast to Coast, where we scour the wrestling scene to
Speaker 10: find the best wrestling from the smallest places.
Speaker 11: There are thousands of matches happening every week, so Wrestling
Speaker 11: Coast to Coast is here to discover the men and
Speaker 11: women who could be big time stars in a few years.
Speaker 10: There are plenty of podcasts to voters at w W
Speaker 10: and AW, but what's happening in the armories and gymnasiums
Speaker 10: local wrestling hotspots around the country.
Speaker 11: We can't wait to help you find the true hidden
Speaker 11: gyms of the wrestling world. Plus, you can hear Chris
Speaker 11: complained about bad referees.
Speaker 10: And justin bemoaning dogpole fins.
Speaker 11: Don't forget my feudal search to see a blue Thunderbomb
Speaker 11: win a match.
Speaker 1: How can I like?
Speaker 10: The name says we cover the hottest independent promotions from
Speaker 10: around the country, So just as Prestige Action, West Coast,
Speaker 10: Pro Revolver and Beyond Wrestling.
Speaker 11: Actually, Chris, I think we stick pretty much to wrestling.
Speaker 10: No, I mean Beyond Wrestling out of Wooster, Oh right.
Speaker 10: Our show's part of the PW Torch Daily Cast lineup
Speaker 10: and typically drops on Thursdays. Search PW Torch in your
Speaker 10: podcast app a, subscribe to the PW Torch Daily Cast,
Speaker 10: or stream our shows directly from PW touch dot com.
Speaker 10: Find full details on the PW Torchdailycast lineup at Pwtrchdailycast
Speaker 10: dot com.
Speaker 1: Scott appreciate the call.
Speaker 2: Anything else you want to ask, I just want to
Speaker 2: say last thing, just thanks for your response, and I
Speaker 2: did you were saying. That's part VFP. I didn't get
Speaker 2: to finish going through to go to be a companion
Speaker 2: into the network lade. When you don't know what's going on,
Speaker 2: if you read the back issues you go, you can
Speaker 2: get yourself filled in for anything you missed. And that's
Speaker 2: one thing I've been doing. I've been going through two
Speaker 2: thousand and four right now, watching the pay per views,
Speaker 2: reading the back issues to see the progressions of storylines.
Speaker 2: No one does it better than the Torch, No one
Speaker 2: does it better than you. Way, Jason, You're awesome as well.
Speaker 2: And the last thing I'll say though, is what you
Speaker 2: just said. Guys one last thing that they can do
Speaker 2: so easy, that costs nothing. Why don't we spend like
Speaker 2: a fifth, you know, thirty seconds an hour on raw
Speaker 2: saying hey, this debuted this week on the the network.
Speaker 2: He's Saturday Night's main event from you know, I just
Speaker 2: saw they posted more Storday Knightsman event show, a fifteen
Speaker 2: second clip of whoever you want? Yeah, show that, let
Speaker 2: the young audience see that, and just to promote the network.
Speaker 2: It's like you know, how on HBO when you go
Speaker 2: in between the shows, they'll show things that are coming
Speaker 2: up that you know, some things that are going to
Speaker 2: be on the network. You know, if you've ever watch
Speaker 2: like let's say, of programming ends on WWE network at
Speaker 2: fifty three after they'll show you some things like they
Speaker 2: did it a little bit for the new Satay Night's
Speaker 2: main events, and it's coming promote what you have. You
Speaker 2: have so much, you have so much in that ball,
Speaker 2: you know, just I know you're letting it out in
Speaker 2: pieces and it's a ten year plan. And I totally
Speaker 2: agree with you. Wage you've always made that reference to
Speaker 2: the car wash down the street from your house. This
Speaker 2: isn't an overnight thing. This isn't going to be we
Speaker 2: put the network on there and boom, we're a thirty
Speaker 2: million subscribers. It's going to take time, and you know,
Speaker 2: but use what you have, use the resources you have,
Speaker 2: and I know that they're trying. I agree with what
Speaker 2: you just said. It's penny wise, dollars foolish. Spend to
Speaker 2: make money, you must spend money. And I agree their
Speaker 2: corporate so they have to be looking out for Wall Street.
Speaker 2: But there has to be ways, and I agree with you, Jason.
Speaker 2: The value nine ninety nine a month, it's great. It's
Speaker 2: a great value, but there's so much more they can do.
Speaker 2: It has so much potential, and it just doesn't feel
Speaker 2: like they're putting all into it that they even put
Speaker 2: into the w From what it sounds like to the
Speaker 2: WWE classics on demands, sounded like there was more rhyme
Speaker 2: or reason in scheduling with that which monthly. You know,
Speaker 2: I'm like, say, wait, I called it April when they
Speaker 2: were doing a weekly special this is the Warrior Week,
Speaker 2: than they did the whole theme week and then they
Speaker 2: dropped it nothing else since why not do something like that.
Speaker 1: I think it's a god. I think it's the I
Speaker 1: think it's a shiny new toy syndrome, and they had
Speaker 1: such high hopes and they wanted to be fast and easy.
Speaker 1: They just they wanted it. And now they don't want
Speaker 1: to work really hard to add five and ten thousand
Speaker 1: people per month. They they you know, they're they're growing,
Speaker 1: you know, counting the offset of drop offs, are growing
Speaker 1: at about one thousand a week. And if that's the number,
Speaker 1: that that's the number they're growing by. And that's going
Speaker 1: to searge for SummerSlam, and that's going to search for
Speaker 1: the Royal Rumble. Assuming the Row rumbles on the network,
Speaker 1: they're gonna have surges. They they haven't had that that
Speaker 1: that WrestleMania week type search. So I wasn't shocked by
Speaker 1: the lower numbers, uh in terms of subscriber count. And
Speaker 1: if you only listen to the Tuesday live cast, you know,
Speaker 1: that's kind of your main way to keep up on wrestling.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of other stuff going on, so definitely
Speaker 1: check out other podcasts that we've done, and obviously the websites,
Speaker 1: and if you're a VIP member, you're certainly up to
Speaker 1: speed with a Bruce Mitchelladio show and Wade Killer hotliner
Speaker 1: on dot net the dot Net Weekly Show and Jason's
Speaker 1: Q and A and everything else. But last week was
Speaker 1: a huge week for news with the WWB financials being released,
Speaker 1: and that seven hundred thousand subscriber number is alarming to
Speaker 1: some people, but to me, what it says is it's
Speaker 1: worth doing all of these things we talked about, Scott,
Speaker 1: because they all they need to do is turn that
Speaker 1: thousand into three thousand people a week signing up, and
Speaker 1: there's going to be two thousand people who are excited
Speaker 1: about some of the things that you're saying that are
Speaker 1: on the fence, and they just aren't bothering.
Speaker 2: Wade. You said it before. It's the niche. The network
Speaker 2: should be all about a niche. If you can grab
Speaker 2: four thousand people who are excited to watch Stampede Ratsley,
Speaker 2: you can grab three thousand people who would tune in
Speaker 2: for Tuesday Night Titans, and you can maybe but wait,
Speaker 2: it's just so much. You know, you were saying the
Speaker 2: younger audience, Jason, this is just a thing, and I'm like,
Speaker 2: this might sound it ridiculous wrestling, you know, think I'm
Speaker 2: an elementary school teacher just like Bruce, and I know
Speaker 2: how many students are into wrestling. Okay, little ideas like
Speaker 2: marketing wise, do a tie in with Toys r US
Speaker 2: and be able to purchase six months to the network
Speaker 2: for your at Toys br US and maybe Toys r
Speaker 2: US takes a twenty dollars hit. But you know what
Speaker 2: you can get people in to me this is you know,
Speaker 2: you go and Toys r US and you see all
Speaker 2: the WWE paraphernalian things that they sell there, the belts,
Speaker 2: the wrestling dollars, all that stuff. Well, you know what
Speaker 2: put something so someone like you know, my uncle, I'm
Speaker 2: going to buy my nephew a president. I know he
Speaker 2: loves WWE. Well that would be cool. I combined six
Speaker 2: months of WWE network for sixty dollars. All he has
Speaker 2: to do is type in the code. That's more money
Speaker 2: for Titan and a kid when that runs out in
Speaker 2: six months. If they love the network, they love the product,
Speaker 2: they're gonna want to keep that. Yeah, there are so
Speaker 2: many little things that can be done. And again there's
Speaker 2: so much potential. And you know, I always think, though
Speaker 2: I look back with you to do as a VIP member,
Speaker 2: you do things chronologically.
Speaker 1: Wait, yeah, you do.
Speaker 2: Things there's in order. There's a rhyme or reason. There
Speaker 2: is none what they should look when they do the
Speaker 2: live feed. When you do this dat in history. You
Speaker 2: know you said it best when we were saying with
Speaker 2: the Great American Bashes, why aren't you having Summer Slam
Speaker 2: Summer Slam month? Every day at a certain time, put
Speaker 2: up the summer you know, just like I said, Jason,
Speaker 2: how many times do I want to watch the same
Speaker 2: that so the superstars on the live feed? Yea one,
Speaker 2: put Summer Slam ninety seven up there. Put up Summer Slam.
Speaker 8: You know, do a chronologically.
Speaker 2: You're doing whatever you want, Scott, I got, I got
Speaker 2: shared all your time. Guys.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I appreciate it very much. I appreciate your passion
Speaker 1: and all your ideas. And hopefully somebody in WWE listens
Speaker 1: and uh and goes to the trouble to do this. Jason,
Speaker 1: I know they have all these budget cutbacks. I know
Speaker 1: they're worried about short term results in Wall Street, and
Speaker 1: it's you know, everybody is everybody's being caught. You know,
Speaker 1: Ricardo Roderiguez is gone, and and it's just but it's
Speaker 1: a shame that it seems like they are being pennywise
Speaker 1: and they're foolish right now with the network.
Speaker 4: Oh absolutely, I mean that this is the time for
Speaker 4: them to invest in. I don't think the things we're
Speaker 4: proposing would cost them a lot of money.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm saying, yeah.
Speaker 4: Surely you have someone at your studio in Stanford that
Speaker 4: could serve as the host for what I'm proposing, and
Speaker 4: then really just kind of cleaning things up and just
Speaker 4: having a little more order to that live stream. I mean,
Speaker 4: for a while there, I'm just like, what purpose does
Speaker 4: the live stream serve? I know it's clearly not going away,
Speaker 4: given the approach they're taking in Canada, but I didn't
Speaker 4: quite I just put up a link to the pay
Speaker 4: per view and you can still stream it live on
Speaker 4: the you know, on your network platform, but it doesn't
Speaker 4: have to really be a live feed. And now that
Speaker 4: we know it's sticking, it's time for them to really
Speaker 4: step up and do more with that.
Speaker 1: Very good. I want to note that Jim Valley's Interview
Speaker 1: with a Grappler will be starting at a special time
Speaker 1: on Friday. The show will be starting at six thirty Eastern,
Speaker 1: so starting an hour later than normal. Normally the show
Speaker 1: starts at five thirty, but Grappler had another radio inter
Speaker 1: your talking about his book locally in the Portland area.
Speaker 1: I believe during our normal time slot, so there'll be
Speaker 1: a rare time shift, So this Friday, The Grappler Lendett
Speaker 1: and You'll be on with PW Torch Live Cast guest
Speaker 1: host Jim Valley this Friday, six thirty Eastern five thirty
Speaker 1: Central time. And you can send email questions for the
Speaker 1: Grappler to PW Torch Live Cast at gmail dot com.
Speaker 1: PW torch dot com. Slash go vip is where you
Speaker 1: go not to sign up for a VIP membership but
Speaker 1: also our newsletter. For ninety nine dollars a year, you
Speaker 1: get a home delivery of around fifty weekly newsletters who
Speaker 1: take a week off maybe twice a year on average.
Speaker 1: But for ninety nine bucks you get a whole year
Speaker 1: of the Prossing Torch newsletter and it is this week's issue,
Speaker 1: for instance, will be packed with a ton of details
Speaker 1: on WWE financials. Greg Parks has reviews of some of
Speaker 1: the top wrestler hosted podcasts with pros and cons about
Speaker 1: how Jim Rossteve Boston, Chris Jericho, how they're transitioning from
Speaker 1: wrestling promos and announcing to hosting a podcast. Also part
Speaker 1: twelve of the Paul Bear Torch Talk with his first
Speaker 1: hand story in Michael Hayes Go way Back. They were
Speaker 1: best friends till the Dave Paul Bart died a couple
Speaker 1: of years back, a year and a half back, and
Speaker 1: Paul Bart talks indapt about the birth of the Freebirds
Speaker 1: and Michael Hayes proposing the idea to him and the
Speaker 1: whole chronology of that Buddy Roberts's role in the Free Birds.
Speaker 1: We do a Legends Torch Talk just about every week
Speaker 1: in the Prosing Torch Newsletter. Plus I'll have excerpts of
Speaker 1: my interview with Hernetez last week, so if you didn't
Speaker 1: catch that, I'll be pulling out some key quotes and
Speaker 1: adding wrap around a commentary for me in page two Radar.
Speaker 1: Page two Radar usually features exclusive quotes from people in
Speaker 1: the wrestling business in one form or another, talking about
Speaker 1: a hot topic in wrestling, and sometimes there's some off record,
Speaker 1: inside backstage information tossed into so that's part of the mix.
Speaker 1: Plus the Torch news Wire, I take the top stories
Speaker 1: of the week, add some details, add some analysis, put
Speaker 1: it in chronological order. It's a way to have something
Speaker 1: land in your mailbox every week, where if you've had
Speaker 1: a busy week and you feel like, man, I didn't
Speaker 1: go to websites for a few days, and I'm probably
Speaker 1: missing out on stuff. The newsletter's a way to just say,
Speaker 1: all right, I know I've got I'm caught up on
Speaker 1: everything for the last week, and I was able. I
Speaker 1: was able to read every you know, catch up on
Speaker 1: all the news in twenty thirty minutes in the news section,
Speaker 1: reading over it, plus my cover story, my endnotes, my
Speaker 1: page Drew Radar, Bruce Mitchell's weekly column, Greg Parks's weekly column,
Speaker 1: the weekly Legends Torch Talk series, the exclusive pay per
Speaker 1: view roundtable reviews with our Torch staffs scores and reviews
Speaker 1: of the shows, so much more. My new thot exclusive
Speaker 1: raw reports with analysis of many, many, many segments in
Speaker 1: raw also part of that newsletter. If you would like
Speaker 1: to get home delivery of the print newsletter, it's ninety
Speaker 1: nine bucks for a full year. If you combine that
Speaker 1: with an online VIP membership, there's a huge huge discount
Speaker 1: if you've decide to bundle both, So details on that
Speaker 1: at PW torch dot com. Slash go VIP. We're going
Speaker 1: to move to the VIP after show, but Jason, you've
Speaker 1: got your sale going on with dot net membership, and
Speaker 1: let's nd the show with you reminding people how they
Speaker 1: can take advantage of that great sale.
Speaker 4: Absolutely very simple. Go to Pro Wrestling dot Net, look
Speaker 4: for the sign up. You're right there on the main page.
Speaker 4: Once you're in there, enter the coupon code live Live, and.
Speaker 1: You anytime you're watching WWE Raw or SmackDown or AEW
Speaker 1: Dynamite in particular, send us an email if you've got
Speaker 1: thoughts on the show or a topic you want us
Speaker 1: to address or a question for us. Wadekeller Podcast at
Speaker 1: pwtorch dot com. Wadkeller Podcast at pewtorch dot com. If
Speaker 1: there's anything else going on in pro wrestling that you
Speaker 1: want us to address on our main podcast during our
Speaker 1: mailbank segments, that same email applies Wadekeller Podcast at pwtorch
Speaker 1: dot com. We invite that interaction. Let us know what
Speaker 1: you think of what we're saying, and let us know
Speaker 1: what you want us to talk about and ask us
Speaker 1: specific questions. Wadkeller Podcast at pw torch dot com. Excellent
Speaker 1: thank you everybody for joining us tomorrow. Pat McNeil texted
Speaker 1: me his line up his guests just a few minutes
Speaker 1: ago and let me pull that up here mentioned this earlier,
Speaker 1: but I've got to navigate through my phone here. Oh wait, No,
Speaker 1: he didn't text me, so that means either emailed me
Speaker 1: or Facebook message me. So I'm going to go to
Speaker 1: my messenger.
Speaker 4: And I wish I could to help you, because he
Speaker 4: did try to call me today, but that was when
Speaker 4: I was out in my on my quest for the
Speaker 4: Paul aim And DVD.
Speaker 1: I was at an Indian buffet eating a late lunch
Speaker 1: when he called me. Todd Kennelly and Evolved Champion Chris Hero,
Speaker 1: So that should be good. That is on tomorrow show,
Speaker 1: Pat McNeil. We talked about in your Friday a Lot.
Speaker 1: Pat McNeil has interviews every Wednesday and all start panel
Speaker 1: discussions and you can check that out tomorrow. Todd Kennelly,
Speaker 1: former t and A announcer and then Evolve Champion Chris
Speaker 1: Hero on the show with him tomorrow. James Caldwell likely
Speaker 1: co hosting with Greg Parks on Thursday, and then Jim
Speaker 1: Valley guest hosting an hour later. Star time that's important.
Speaker 1: Six thirty Eastern, five thirty Central this Friday with It
Speaker 1: should be a really really good interview. A guy who's
Speaker 1: seen a lot, been around a lot, and has a
Speaker 1: lot of stories to tell. And Jim has read his book,
Speaker 1: he'll know what question to ask to bring out some
Speaker 1: great stories, some behind the scenes stories about life on
Speaker 1: the road with some top names over the decades. The
Speaker 1: Grappler On with Jim Valley this Friday. Don't forget to
Speaker 1: check out my interview with Hernandez last Friday created a
Speaker 1: lot of buzz. Two hours with Hernandez the full VIP show,
Speaker 1: but nearly an hour and a half free for VFP.
Speaker 1: Excuse me for PW Torch livecast listeners at PW torchlivecast
Speaker 1: dot com. Two weeks ago, Booker t was my guest.
Speaker 1: Three weeks ago, Devon Dudley was Jim Vally's guest, and
Speaker 1: Drew McIntyre his only I think still to this date
Speaker 1: is only Wrestling Journalists Podcast interview to date, a really
Speaker 1: good interview with Drew McIntyre. If you haven't checked that out,
Speaker 1: please go back and check it out and you can
Speaker 1: go all the way back to say the week right
Speaker 1: after WrestleMania thirty for my interview with Stone Cold Steve
Speaker 1: Austin with his first public comments about the death of
Speaker 1: Ultimate Warrior and what happened at Usmania thirty, including the
Speaker 1: brock Lesnar loss. So so so much worth listening to
Speaker 1: and checking out. We thank you for your support of
Speaker 1: this show. If you are subscribing to us on iTunes,
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Speaker 1: that would be fantastic. Subscribe, give us five star rating,
Speaker 1: give a quick positive review if you like what we
Speaker 1: do here at PW Towards Live cast. All right, on
Speaker 1: that note, Waite Teller thanking our callers stay really good
Speaker 1: group of callers and appreciate all our listeners. And on
Speaker 1: the other side of the music, we will have the
Speaker 1: the after show. Jason, Paul and I have got some
Speaker 1: good email topics waiting for us, and we're going to
Speaker 1: talk about the nine ninety nine thing yesterday and too
Speaker 1: and try to make sense of that. So Jason, thank
Speaker 1: you very much.
Speaker 4: Hey, thank you.
Speaker 1: Not all right where now in the VIPU after show
Speaker 1: portion of program, I've been talking about this. It stuck
Speaker 1: out to me for weeks. Now it becomes more and
Speaker 1: more relevant. A lot of people just wrote it off
Speaker 1: initially as well as you know, they're just saying the
Speaker 1: end of the year, because the six months I wouldake
Speaker 1: you to the end of the year, now a six
Speaker 1: months ww ME network subtakes you into February Passorial rumble.
Speaker 1: They continue to, very very specifically, Jason say that a
Speaker 1: network subscription gets you every pay per view through the
Speaker 1: end of the year. What is up with that, Jason?
Speaker 1: What's your information on possible changes in what you get
Speaker 1: with a network subscription.
Speaker 4: I don't have any info, but believe me, it's idea.
Speaker 4: It is also on the list for WWEPR and I
Speaker 4: don't know we're going to get a straight answer on
Speaker 4: that one, but it's very If they really are going
Speaker 4: to just move forward with all pay per views being
Speaker 4: on the network, it certainly is strange wording on their part,
Speaker 4: and they have to know that. It's not just there's
Speaker 4: plenty of people going, wait a minute, what does this mean?
Speaker 4: What are you doing? What?
Speaker 1: I wait?
Speaker 4: I mean, that's their WrestleMania, the Rumble, and Summer Slam.
Speaker 4: Seemed like there are three key annual times to just
Speaker 4: drive up network subscriptions. And if you take the pay
Speaker 4: per views away, even if it's just for instance, say
Speaker 4: it is just WrestleMania, you're going to lose people. There's
Speaker 4: going to be a lot of people that are bitter
Speaker 4: and just say I'm done, I'm out, I don't need this,
Speaker 4: forget it.
Speaker 1: And all they had to do we talked about this
Speaker 1: is is say WrestleMania last year was as a special
Speaker 1: bonus for network subscribers. We're including WrestleMania this year. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and that's you know, that's it, and not make a
Speaker 1: big deal out of it, but make it clear that
Speaker 1: you know what we may or may not. You know,
Speaker 1: you don't have to be specific. We may or may
Speaker 1: not give you WrestleMania next year. But it is uh,
Speaker 1: it is peculiar language. I think they're trying to keep
Speaker 1: their options open. My my hunch may be slightly educated hunch.
Speaker 1: And as far as it goes, I think WWE's keeping
Speaker 1: things kind of close to the best. I just don't
Speaker 1: think they've decided yet, and I just don't think they
Speaker 1: want to make promises about including the world rumbled And
Speaker 1: I think what they're gonna do is they're going to
Speaker 1: learn this month with SummerSlam, how much can we grow?
Speaker 1: How did we get ninety eight percent of people who
Speaker 1: are going to be interested for the next two years
Speaker 1: when we offered Restlemania thirty for nine ninety nine? Or
Speaker 1: are we going to see incremental but only occasional surges
Speaker 1: and subs and SummerSlam is surge number two? And if
Speaker 1: they get an extra two hundred and fifty thousand people
Speaker 1: to subscribe this month because seeing a Lesnard, they do
Speaker 1: a stellar job promoting it and it's SummerSlam and people
Speaker 1: are gung ho, and a lot of people who dropped off,
Speaker 1: you know, sign back up. Then WWE is going to say, oh,
Speaker 1: let's stick with what we're doing. You know, let's just
Speaker 1: stick with what we're doing. We'll include rumbling Mania next year.
Speaker 1: But if they go through SummerSlam and they end up
Speaker 1: at seven hundred eight thousand or seven hundred forty thousand,
Speaker 1: and it's just a relatively small increase and they kind
Speaker 1: of paste it out and go crap, you know, we
Speaker 1: really did kind of saturate. We got most people we're
Speaker 1: going to get when we in the first month and
Speaker 1: it's going to be really slow from here. They might
Speaker 1: just look at twenty fifteen and go, we need WrestleMania
Speaker 1: to be a separate event. We need that money back.
Speaker 1: We think we can still get, you know, cable companies
Speaker 1: to come back on board if we offer them WrestleMania
Speaker 1: as an exclusive and that gets them back on board.
Speaker 1: That might be what they need to do for their
Speaker 1: business plan. Even so ninety nine is a good deal.
Speaker 1: The other thing people have talked about, which is kind
Speaker 1: of interesting, Jason, is WWE Network offers an in arena,
Speaker 1: in ring event that's two hours long on Saturday, that
Speaker 1: is WrestleMania WrestleMania preview show or Night one, and then
Speaker 1: they do a night too that's three hours, and that's
Speaker 1: what you have to pay for. So you get WrestleMania
Speaker 1: Night one on the network, WrestleMania Night two. You got
Speaker 1: a pay full price for something like that, or you
Speaker 1: offer the first two hours or WrestleMania on the network,
Speaker 1: but the last two hours with the three biggest matches
Speaker 1: are part of inexclusive pay per views, I mean, or
Speaker 1: they offer it on the network, which you have to
Speaker 1: be a premier tier subscriber where you're paying an extra
Speaker 1: five dollars every month in order to get WrestleMania and
Speaker 1: Rumble in SummerSlam, the premier pay per views. There's a
Speaker 1: lot of things that they might be thinking about, but
Speaker 1: it just to me seems like they're keeping their options open.
Speaker 4: It does, but you know, they owe it to people
Speaker 4: with these subscriptions coming up here. I believe around the
Speaker 4: twenty fourth if you sign up day one, I think
Speaker 4: August twenty fourth is when your network subscription will expire.
Speaker 4: People should know going in. Okay, if I lock myself
Speaker 4: in for six months, and in some cases, I mean
Speaker 4: I know, you can cancel and many ways and get
Speaker 4: out of paying your ten dollars a month, but if
Speaker 4: you do go through a platform or you're signing up
Speaker 4: dropping that sixty bucks right out of the gate, and
Speaker 4: there are somewhere you have to you should know what
Speaker 4: you're signing up for. And it shouldn't be well, we
Speaker 4: told you through the end of the year. That's to me,
Speaker 4: it's just shady and oh well, it says in the
Speaker 4: fine print. I mean, b as if they are doing this,
Speaker 4: then they need to figure it out out and tell
Speaker 4: people upfront, because right now you know if you sign up,
Speaker 4: if you do, if you roll your subscription over at
Speaker 4: at the first six month expiration time, you better be
Speaker 4: you better know if you're getting Royal rumble an elimination chamber,
Speaker 4: because those fall in that window wrestle Mania, they still
Speaker 4: have time to play around with, but they need to
Speaker 4: They need to come clean on this and do it
Speaker 4: quickly or I mean that's just poor customer service to
Speaker 4: to kind of mislead people and still well what you know.
Speaker 4: JBL kept saying on raw through the end of the year.
Speaker 4: BS they know what people are expecting and if they're
Speaker 4: not going to deliver it, they need to come right
Speaker 4: out and say it.
Speaker 1: I totally agree. And you can't be cute with language
Speaker 1: and expect people to keep your goodwill with your customer base.
Speaker 1: And they could screw I mean, they could just said
Speaker 1: be be in a really bad position in February where
Speaker 1: fans just go, I can't trust them, they're being slick there.
Speaker 1: I feel tricked, I feel deceived, and I think it
Speaker 1: could really backfire. What what's your what's your interpretation or
Speaker 1: your take on nine ninety nine as a shtick last
Speaker 1: night started by Triple ation, carried throughout the show.
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, I'm curious. Do you think that was planned
Speaker 4: the whole time, like, Hey, we're really going to have
Speaker 4: fun with this nine to ninety nine thing, or do
Speaker 4: you think it was kind of organic when the crowd
Speaker 4: set it along with Triple h the third time, they
Speaker 4: just took it and ran with it.
Speaker 1: I thought it felt planned. I'm not saying, you know,
Speaker 1: JBL holding up the sign, you know, nine ninety nine
Speaker 1: on paper was planned. You know, they might have improvised
Speaker 1: here and there, but I think they they deliberately went
Speaker 1: in with the plan to really push the price point
Speaker 1: in a way that people would remember. I said this
Speaker 1: on the Keller hotline for VFP members last night. I
Speaker 1: don't think the price is the issue. I think it's
Speaker 1: what Scott said VFP members. Scott said, it's content. I
Speaker 1: don't think nine ninety nine is what people are confused
Speaker 1: about or what's stopping them is they thought, oh I
Speaker 1: thought it was twenty four ninety five. Oh it's only
Speaker 1: nine ninety nine. Well then I'll subscrit that isn't what
Speaker 1: they need to clarify. That's not what's gonna be as
Speaker 1: fans callb will puts it a call to action to
Speaker 1: get people to subscribe. The call to action isn't hey,
Speaker 1: it's a penny less than ten bucks. You know, it's
Speaker 1: a subway sandwich and the coke. You know. It's like,
Speaker 1: that's not what they need to be selling people on.
Speaker 1: They need to be selling people on that they are
Speaker 1: missing out on something special, and other marketing does that.
Speaker 1: But I also a problem with forri ble H being
Speaker 1: the guy to push the price. It's just it's started
Speaker 1: to feel like a cheesy infomercial. And when you're number
Speaker 1: one of your top heels, is the guy who you
Speaker 1: know is going to benefit from it and he's the
Speaker 1: guy who wants you to subscribe, is the guy that
Speaker 1: you're also supposed to hate it. It's it's such a
Speaker 1: problem with the presentation of the narrative of the product.
Speaker 12: Are you a fan of AW looking to sit back,
Speaker 12: relax and listen to some like minded podcasters who share
Speaker 12: your passion. Do you want to be topped off the
Speaker 12: ladge after a segment that has you wondering what the
Speaker 12: heck are they thinking? Do you want to join a
Speaker 12: discussion on what AW is doing right and what they
Speaker 12: could do to improve.
Speaker 4: Then join me Joel and.
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Speaker 4: We're totally on the same page. I wrote a lot
Speaker 4: of this in Today's hit list as well, and I
Speaker 4: mean the nine to ninety nine thing. To me, it
Speaker 4: just if it was just for sake of argument, if
Speaker 4: it was organic, they went too far with it. I
Speaker 4: still think Michael Cole is an issue. I don't think
Speaker 4: he does okay. I mean, there's times when he's very good,
Speaker 4: but he's not that trusted voice. That continues to be
Speaker 4: an issue, and so you can't when when Michael Cole
Speaker 4: tries to sell you on something, it doesn't sound sincere
Speaker 4: doesn't sound like he's genuinely excited about it. It sounds
Speaker 4: like he's a pitch man, and I don't like it
Speaker 4: coming from him. I don't like it coming from Jerry Lawler,
Speaker 4: who clearly doesn't even know how half the things function.
Speaker 4: JBL is kind of the heel commentator. Shouldn't come from him,
Speaker 4: shouldn't come from Triple Ah and Stephanie. I still think
Speaker 4: you find creative ways to use some of your stars
Speaker 4: so it feels somewhat organic and not your heel stars.
Speaker 4: But if they're convinced everyone loves John Cena, we'll find
Speaker 4: different ways, unique ways for John Sena just started working
Speaker 4: it in make it feel organic rather than rather than
Speaker 4: just the force product placement that they do from out
Speaker 4: and do on a regular basis. They need to be
Speaker 4: a little more creative with that end of things. And
Speaker 4: I got a kick out of that club turned on
Speaker 4: them at the end. They were having fun with it,
Speaker 4: especially that third time Triple Ah said it, and then
Speaker 4: if you notice the last time was probably him. I
Speaker 4: think it was him, but that crowd it was groans
Speaker 4: and Booze, it wasn't. They were having funds going along
Speaker 4: with it, and yet nine to ninety nine, Wait, aren't
Speaker 4: they the company that compares themselves to Netflix? Only better?
Speaker 4: And I guess at that point you better be better
Speaker 4: because I think they charge more than Netflix.
Speaker 1: And they have not picked a selling point in a
Speaker 1: marketing approach to this, I mean, they're just bouncing all
Speaker 1: over the place, desperate. There's not there's not a catchphrase
Speaker 1: that sticks with people. There's not a call to action
Speaker 1: that sticks with people. It's half assed, disorganized and desperate.
Speaker 1: And they're just I mean you can just see it
Speaker 1: in their faces. They're like, but you can watch Legends
Speaker 1: House and in Total Divas and every pay per view
Speaker 1: through the end of the year and it's just nine
Speaker 1: ninety nine, Like why aren't another million of you doing this?
Speaker 1: And they just can't believe it, And it comes across
Speaker 1: as just needy and not confident. There's not a bravado
Speaker 1: to it. There's a desperation that I think the average
Speaker 1: viewer senses, and I think people want they want to
Speaker 1: feel like they're part of something that's hot. And yes,
Speaker 1: I like that. You know, they talk about the ninety
Speaker 1: percent or whatever percent it was, you know, satisfaction rating
Speaker 1: among customers. They need to pitch that, and but there's
Speaker 1: a there. It is frustrating because I mean, I mean,
Speaker 1: I've run my own business for two and a half decades.
Speaker 1: I mean, and I'm not a don't have an advertising partment,
Speaker 1: orn ththing like that. But like you think about it
Speaker 1: when you're on your business, like, you know, how do
Speaker 1: we market this, what's the what's the what's the pitch?
Speaker 1: What's work? You study what works? You try to make
Speaker 1: sure you reach the audience that would find a fair
Speaker 1: value for what you charge in exchange for what you do.
Speaker 1: And WWE just is all over the place and they
Speaker 1: don't know what they are and who they're marketing to.
Speaker 1: And I think they just wanted it, Jason to come
Speaker 1: easy and it didn't, and now they're just mad and
Speaker 1: kind of sadly pathetically desperate. And it's just not cohesive.
Speaker 1: That's that's a phrase I look for. It's not a
Speaker 1: cohesive marketing effort.
Speaker 4: What happened to this bac Man the promoter? I know,
Speaker 4: I mean as seriously as that, like wrestling is the
Speaker 4: only thing he can promote. He can't even promote a
Speaker 4: wrestling network.
Speaker 1: I know, Yeah, I just but you're all right, you
Speaker 1: draw that picture of you know, Cole and j B
Speaker 1: al l Law are sitting there and trying to sell it,
Speaker 1: and you know JBL with that just that weird creepy
Speaker 1: smile that he has when he's not talking they're.
Speaker 4: Not cool guys who can saying it doesn't seem fun
Speaker 4: when they're saying, it's just like these guys are dorks.
Speaker 1: I think they should have they should go back and
Speaker 1: look at some event centers the Todd pett And gill
Speaker 1: And and Sean Mooney hosted. But put Renee Young there
Speaker 1: because Renee is way better than Todd, Penon gill and
Speaker 1: tremendously better than Sean Mooney. Have her stand there and
Speaker 1: create you know this wolf Blitzer like CNN, you know,
Speaker 1: virtual network reality, and she can be standing there in
Speaker 1: front of a big video wall and she can point
Speaker 1: over here and go this week and touch and touch
Speaker 1: the screen and boom, their center. It's made event highlights.
Speaker 1: That's what's on on Wednesday night. And you're not watching,
Speaker 1: you're missing out. And I'm going to be hashtagging. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna be on Twitter, which with hashtag you know ww
Speaker 1: network talking with you guys during it. It's like and
Speaker 1: then she leans to the points to the points to
Speaker 1: her left and points at the summer slime. It's going
Speaker 1: to be arring on Sunday night. And then and then
Speaker 1: tout and hey, you know you you you want to
Speaker 1: look at Old Wrestling and you know, learn about the
Speaker 1: history of the industry you're a longtime fan or his
Speaker 1: here's world class and here's the episode we're putting up
Speaker 1: this week of Scanneract Bar devastation in corporation, like show
Speaker 1: us highlights and get people excited in this in this
Speaker 1: event center type atmosphere, and and I mean there's just again,
Speaker 1: it's just it's frustrating because this is a product that
Speaker 1: people should be more excited about, and more people should understand,
Speaker 1: and more people should be going and watching the live stream.
Speaker 1: They don't even talk about the live stream that much
Speaker 1: other than right after rob this match will beyond.
Speaker 4: So no, it's to watch John scene and beat brock Lessner.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, really, yeah, for you know, sort of for
Speaker 1: free on the network.
Speaker 4: So we're telling you, you know, you brocks are indestructible
Speaker 4: and my god, Johnson didn't take the beating of a lifetime.
Speaker 4: But tune in to watch John scene to beat brock Lessure.
Speaker 1: It's a tough It's that is the biggest challenge of
Speaker 1: marketing seeing a Lesner right now is they're not owning
Speaker 1: that scene to beat them, right, and and because it
Speaker 1: contradicts with Lesner being unbeatable. He'd bet Undertaker. We don't
Speaker 1: want to remind people of it, but we can't not
Speaker 1: mention it because it was too recent. So it's not
Speaker 1: like Undertaker Lesner from what was it, No Way Out
Speaker 1: three or whatever? Pay per view? That's Zach Gwen fought
Speaker 1: pensic mannon you know that was that was you know,
Speaker 1: ten years earlier, So you could get away with not
Speaker 1: drawing a lot of attention to it. Hard not to
Speaker 1: mention Lesner and Sena have fought on pay per view
Speaker 1: in recent years, but it is I think I just
Speaker 1: was it. Robert Kennedy said, shine a lantern on your problems,
Speaker 1: you know, don't don't let other people define your weaknesses.
Speaker 1: Own it, and and I think they need to own
Speaker 1: the fact that Lesner and Sena fought, and that Sena one,
Speaker 1: and that should be part of Lesner's argument.
Speaker 4: With you know, and and again you know, how about
Speaker 4: playing on the diverticulitis she worked for USC.
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, just I mean, yeah, you could have Paul
Speaker 1: Hayman going John Cena Brock. Lesner gave you the beating
Speaker 1: of his life, and the only thing that stopped him
Speaker 1: from finishing you off is he was recovering from serious
Speaker 1: surgery and and and in the end he ran out
Speaker 1: of steam. As we know from what we thought WrestleMania,
Speaker 1: the that was then and this is now, and that
Speaker 1: history will not repeat itself. Brock will finish the job
Speaker 1: that he dished out for twenty two minutes before you
Speaker 1: got lucky before and he is obsessed. He is obsessed
Speaker 1: with getting that win back. And I've never seen him
Speaker 1: more motivated. And after the win with Undertaker, he knows
Speaker 1: there is no stopping him and he is at one
Speaker 1: hundred percent. Just own it, and then you know, like
Speaker 1: and then and then you can sell the Lesner Scena
Speaker 1: match by having Michael Cole say, fans watch brock Lesner
Speaker 1: give Seena the beating of his life, and you decide,
Speaker 1: how did John Cena beat Lesner last time after taking
Speaker 1: that beating? And is did brock Lesner today stronger as
Speaker 1: Paul Hayman says, than he was back then? Did he
Speaker 1: prove it by beating Undertaker? You be the judge. Network
Speaker 1: subscribers watch it now. If you're not a network subscriber,
Speaker 1: sign up right now and watch it or watch it
Speaker 1: on demand tomorrow. There's just just you watch the show
Speaker 1: and you're solf frustrating because, like you said, Jason, where's
Speaker 1: Vincent manna promoter? This stuff isn't that hard, you know,
Speaker 1: they're just.
Speaker 4: At their handcuff where they're trying to serve so many masters,
Speaker 4: like well, we can't offend the pay per view company
Speaker 4: because we're in bed with one in Comcast, because you
Speaker 4: would think, yeah, nine to ninety nine, you do drive
Speaker 4: that home if you can compare it to here's what
Speaker 4: you suckers are still paying on pay per view. We're
Speaker 4: the good guys here. We're trying to eliminate that middleman,
Speaker 4: bring the cost down for you. Get on board for
Speaker 4: nine to ninety nine. Rather than paying fifty five dollars
Speaker 4: for the HDEP, he will give you nine to ninety
Speaker 4: nine HD same thing plus all this other stuff. And
Speaker 4: that's where ninety nine comes into play. The way they're
Speaker 4: doing it, they don't ever bring up the savings anymore.
Speaker 4: I think they just got scared away from doing that
Speaker 4: because I mean, it's I get it with Comcast, but
Speaker 4: you already lost you lost this network, you lost Direct TV.
Speaker 4: There's part of me that actually feels way the best
Speaker 4: thing that could happen to them when it comes to
Speaker 4: selling their own network is for Comcast to follow suit,
Speaker 4: and just so you know what, we're out of here,
Speaker 4: because then the gloves can come off.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yep, No, you're right. I think they are serving
Speaker 1: too many masters and that has muddled what could be
Speaker 1: a clear concise message with Bravado.
Speaker 3: You know this is why.
Speaker 1: But they have to do a nine ninety nine. It's
Speaker 1: like read between the lines, idiots. Do you see what
Speaker 1: we're trying to tell you here? It's only nine ninety nine,
Speaker 1: but we can't tell you what that nine ninety nine
Speaker 1: is so great relative to And you know it was
Speaker 1: the concern from the beginning. There are two concerns from
Speaker 1: the beginning one well many many, but two of them
Speaker 1: were they're going to redefine They're going to define down
Speaker 1: what pay per views are worth by including them as
Speaker 1: part of a nine to ninety nine package every month.
Speaker 1: It's gonna make pay per view seem less valuable because
Speaker 1: now you're charging less. To a degree, that's true. But
Speaker 1: to a degree what you're trying to do is is
Speaker 1: and this is just simple economics. One oh one. By
Speaker 1: charging a lower price, you're gonna have more people who
Speaker 1: might buy. You're expanding it and the technology allowed for it,
Speaker 1: and so there wasn't there weren't going to be a
Speaker 1: million people who were going to pay for Summer Slammer
Speaker 1: money in the bank, and the best Summer Slam ever
Speaker 1: did six seven hundred thousand buys. So the idea is
Speaker 1: they were hoping to get to one quickly and eventually
Speaker 1: two million people paying ten bucks with a higher percentage
Speaker 1: of money that they kept in lower overhead. They figured
Speaker 1: this is the way of the future, so it made
Speaker 1: sense to charge less. Who cares the people to find
Speaker 1: down the price of pay per view? They were going
Speaker 1: all in and they took that chance, and I applaud
Speaker 1: them forward and I made my case for why it
Speaker 1: was smart, knowing what they knew to do what they
Speaker 1: did for WrestleMania thirty with the launch. So I'm fine
Speaker 1: with all that. But the other concern Jason, when we
Speaker 1: were dismissing this is they're not going to even try anymore,
Speaker 1: you know, because while they'll just have everybody's money and
Speaker 1: they won't have to promote pay per views. Well, we
Speaker 1: see with that video of Sina Lesner and how hard
Speaker 1: that they are pushing this lineup and Triple A's talking
Speaker 1: about a prowdie as of the lineup and the way
Speaker 1: that they're pushing Summer Slam that we thought it was
Speaker 1: kind of ridiculous that they would just sit back. I
Speaker 1: think if they had two million subscribers right now, Jason,
Speaker 1: they'd still be promoting SummerSlam as hard because they'd be
Speaker 1: seeing money growing on trees. And let's just promote the
Speaker 1: hell out of this because it's such a successful concept.
Speaker 1: Let's get the best Summer Slim we can and get
Speaker 1: even more people on board. Thanks for downloading today's show.
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Speaker 4: I worry now that they're desperate to get that number
Speaker 4: up to one million by the end of the year,
Speaker 4: and that they're rushing this worldwide rollout that they're doing.
Speaker 4: I really that's the thing where if they had the
Speaker 4: number they needed right now, then I don't know that
Speaker 4: you'd be seeing this on August twelfth. They would probably
Speaker 4: take their time do it.
Speaker 1: I agree with that, but I don't think they'd be
Speaker 1: promoting Summer slam less.
Speaker 4: No, No, I mean no, We've been very consistent with
Speaker 4: that that you know it's there. What incentive do they
Speaker 4: have just to sit back and tank it? I mean
Speaker 4: there's none. You're answering to Wall Street. Wall Street always
Speaker 4: wants more. So if you came out of the gate
Speaker 4: and this thing was a massive success with two million
Speaker 4: subscribers in the US alone, well the next quarter, Wall
Speaker 4: Street's going to want, you know, two point five million
Speaker 4: if they can get it.
Speaker 1: It's just the way Wall Street works. Yep, all right,
Speaker 1: let's switch subjects. We got an email from Steve dare
Speaker 1: or Darey of Bristol, UK. He said, hey, guys, love
Speaker 1: the show, worth every penny of my nine ninety nine. Okay,
Speaker 1: very funny. My question is about explay here. Is it
Speaker 1: more important for him to go over who said it, SummerSlam?
Speaker 1: Is it more important for him to go over on Ruce?
Speaker 1: It's some for summ Okay. I know there's a feeling
Speaker 1: going around that Ruscev is being set up for John Cena,
Speaker 1: But Sweger has just earned thirty has just turned thirty two,
Speaker 1: and this could be his last chance to get over
Speaker 1: the American hero things seems to be working in the
Speaker 1: crowd loves patriarch to be patriotic whenever possible. He's been
Speaker 1: given plenty of chances in the past. Falling asleep at
Speaker 1: the production meeting and the DUI didn't help, so some
Speaker 1: of the management seems to like him to give him
Speaker 1: this opportunity. Just wondering what you think the future holds
Speaker 1: for him, Jason, What's what's the finish of the flag match?
Speaker 4: I do think Swagger goes over. It's a flag match.
Speaker 4: You know, there's a way to do it where Ruscev
Speaker 4: doesn't look he can still look dominating yet lose a
Speaker 4: flag match. You know. I mean, yeah, assume they haven't
Speaker 4: really explained how this flag match is going to work.
Speaker 4: I assume it's put the flags in opposite corners and
Speaker 4: whoever gets to it first. I mean, that's there's ways
Speaker 4: to protect Russev, and I think Swagger needs a win
Speaker 4: to keep this going, because it's anytime he stands up
Speaker 4: to Ruscep in a match, so far he's been he's
Speaker 4: been manhandled.
Speaker 1: All right, man, I think they I I don't think
Speaker 1: they're gonna get behind Sweger, but if Sweger beats Russev,
Speaker 1: they're getting behind him, you know. I think we'll learn
Speaker 1: a lot from that. Finishally, I don't.
Speaker 4: Think they're going to either, but I think they want
Speaker 4: to get another month out of the feud. I don't
Speaker 4: think they're looking much beyond that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just I wonder if they want Russev's first
Speaker 1: loss to be against somebody who they are committed to
Speaker 1: making money with. So if they're committed to making money
Speaker 1: with Swager, he'll get a push beyond September. If they're not,
Speaker 1: I think Rusev will win because wanna, you know, pull
Speaker 1: something off, and Sweger loses due to some interference, so
Speaker 1: Swager has an out, they come back again. They do
Speaker 1: another screw finish, but John Cena, damn it, he's had
Speaker 1: enough after losing to Lesnar and getting you know, beat
Speaker 1: by Lesner. He's got to go do something that fans
Speaker 1: can get rally behind him for. And taking on Roussev
Speaker 1: at house shows in a pay per view would do
Speaker 1: it again. I think you can't have seen a battling
Speaker 1: somebody who couldn't even beat Jack Swager given Swager's push,
Speaker 1: So I think Sweger can't win unless they really are
Speaker 1: going to give Swager a big push so that fans
Speaker 1: look back and go, wow, that was the beginning of
Speaker 1: Swagger really turning his career around. Okay, let's tackle a
Speaker 1: couple of emails two before I wrap up. This comes
Speaker 1: from E Manual, who says, how do you think Roman
Speaker 1: Range is a tire will affect his championship potential? I know,
Speaker 1: WWE's not a fashion show. Who I disagree with that
Speaker 1: it kind of is, but a tire does matter. Axel
Speaker 1: failed at a failed outfit HBK Brown tights from a
Speaker 1: first elimination chamber match, et cetera. I can't see Rains
Speaker 1: with a title in that outfit. What would be a
Speaker 1: cool looking alternative, in your opinion, an Adam Bomb style single,
Speaker 1: it a test tile shorts. I'm sorry, test style shorts.
Speaker 1: Just curious, Jason, I'm kind of fine with it. Rains,
Speaker 1: Where's I don't think that is going to I don't
Speaker 1: think that's on my top five list of things that
Speaker 1: are that'll make or break them.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean I actually like the old look a
Speaker 4: little bit more, and but I just don't think, you know,
Speaker 4: that might be personal taste. I mean, for all I know,
Speaker 4: everyone's going, oh, this is better, So I just kind
Speaker 4: of left I've left that alone. Yeah, but it's you know,
Speaker 4: even if people are like like me, where it's like
Speaker 4: they like the old look better, it's not like this
Speaker 4: current look he has with the the stitching or whatever
Speaker 4: you want to call it is, is like a make
Speaker 4: or break thing.
Speaker 1: No, I'm with you on this, Yeah, you know, I
Speaker 1: mean he's still there's a little bit of big, deaddy
Speaker 1: cool going on with with what they're doing with Rains,
Speaker 1: and I don't know, you know, Yeah, to me, it's
Speaker 1: it's connected with the crowd. It's it's it's promos, it's
Speaker 1: it's working the rain, it's it's the presence that he has,
Speaker 1: and I mean, I just yeah, I think the outfit
Speaker 1: doesn't hurt a lot, it doesn't help a lot. It's
Speaker 1: for me, relatively neutral when it comes to what's going
Speaker 1: to help and get over. He also says the Sina
Speaker 1: loses that Summer Slam, will there be a big rematch
Speaker 1: for the title as it should be, or will it
Speaker 1: go all the way to other or will it go
Speaker 1: the way of other big match rematches for the title
Speaker 1: that never happened rox senem or so Many of twenty
Speaker 1: nine or in Brian from as so Many thirty, et cetera.
Speaker 1: And Asina does not get his rematch, well, it will
Speaker 1: be the logical storyline reason for it, like injury timering
Speaker 1: off et cetera. And third to Ceth Rowlins ever realistically catching.
Speaker 4: On Brock good seth Rowlands cash in on Brock. I
Speaker 4: don't think he should have that. I mean, I've kind
Speaker 4: of wondered, you know, with with Brock and his contract,
Speaker 4: if he is just the same artment, if he's not
Speaker 4: going to be around nearly as much as they'd like
Speaker 4: him to be. It is there a way where Brock
Speaker 4: gets dq'ed but he beats the Holy hell out of
Speaker 4: scene and Rawlins comes out and and uh, he's planning
Speaker 4: b for that show, And that way, you don't get
Speaker 4: a Brock doesn't come out of SummerSlam with the title.
Speaker 4: He loses, but it's by DQ, but he still looks
Speaker 4: just dominant.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I guess, you know, and that would solve that.
Speaker 1: I mean, that's part of the intrigue of this show.
Speaker 1: You know, if Lesner does not come away with the title,
Speaker 1: then how do you keep him strong? And if he
Speaker 1: does come up with the title, you know, do you
Speaker 1: really have him all the until Mania thirty one but
Speaker 1: only have him wrestle, you know, for five times between
Speaker 1: then and now?
Speaker 4: And shouldn't they be keasing that right now? I mean,
Speaker 4: regardless of what their plan is, shouldn't it shouldn't Triple
Speaker 4: hb out there basically gloating that's seen his days are
Speaker 4: numbered because whether even if Brock doesn't get him, Seth
Speaker 4: is going to.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, play that up. I mean, having Ambrose rip
Speaker 1: up the contract and player on with the briefcase is
Speaker 1: fine to create a distraction for a match, But what
Speaker 1: about the briefcase? What about you know, how Seth fits
Speaker 1: in relative to to Lesnar? Yeah, I do. I do
Speaker 1: not know the answer to that. What were the other ones, sir? I, oh, well,
Speaker 1: it's Seena loses. What's next for him? And what's the excuse?
Speaker 4: Oh boy? I mean somebody called last night, so I
Speaker 4: looked it up during the show. I mean, he's he's
Speaker 4: pretty much back now. I mean, movie shoot schedules can
Speaker 4: change a little bit too, but it looks like he's
Speaker 4: back as far as Raw is concerned going forward. This
Speaker 4: looks like the last one he's gonna miss for a while. So,
Speaker 4: I mean, he's advertised for everything post Summer Slam. It
Speaker 4: doesn't look like he's going to be just disappearing after
Speaker 4: SummerSlam for a while.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 4: I still it could be RUSCEV, like you said, I mean,
Speaker 4: I guess, I just don't know who else it would
Speaker 4: be if it's If it's not RUSCEP. And as far
Speaker 4: as the rematch goes, I don't do it before. I mean,
Speaker 4: well it's I was gonna say, you don't do it
Speaker 4: before Wrestle Nania, But I don't go with that match
Speaker 4: there either, unless it's just another kick ass match and
Speaker 4: people are really creating seen in Lesnar again, And then
Speaker 4: I at least consider that also because I'm still not
Speaker 4: convinced Rain's Lesners is the way to go. But hmm,
Speaker 4: I might sit on that one until next summer slim.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: But the tricky part there is, you know, you do
Speaker 4: have those subscriptions coming up. I think Night of Champions
Speaker 4: is a very important show.
Speaker 1: For them as Yeah, I know, I know, I do
Speaker 1: not know the answer. I mean, there's a lot of
Speaker 1: things they can do, but not one thing pops out
Speaker 1: to me as the obvious thing to do. Chris from Iceland,
Speaker 1: New Jersey says, wait and Jason, I'm wondering what the
Speaker 1: planets are seth rawlins in the way in the bank.
Speaker 1: If brock Wu does win and holds the title until
Speaker 1: Mania thirty one, it doesn't make much sense to have
Speaker 1: Rowlins carry the briefcase and hold it over Lesner's head.
Speaker 1: I'd actually make the stipulation for Ambrose Rowlins a tummerslam
Speaker 1: for money in the bank briefcase to be on the
Speaker 1: line and have Ambrose leave with it. There can be
Speaker 1: a good story to be told with crazy Dan Ambrose
Speaker 1: catching it on Lesner and taking him to his limit.
Speaker 4: What do you think I fear that's what they're going
Speaker 4: to do. You know, I fear that tonight at the
Speaker 4: Knackdown taping, Ambrose is going to announce that as a stipulation.
Speaker 4: And it makes sense for his character, it makes sense
Speaker 4: for you. Why wouldn't he want that? I just hate
Speaker 4: the idea of you had the money in the bank match.
Speaker 4: I mean, it should just be concrete. You never want
Speaker 4: him label it as such. But in less there's a
Speaker 4: situation like there was when they had to do these
Speaker 4: the change to take it off Anderson and put it
Speaker 4: on edge because of injuries. And I get not just
Speaker 4: coming out and saying no matter what, he still has it.
Speaker 4: But I just don't go there. I want to protect
Speaker 4: your royal rumble outcomes, your money in the bank outcomes.
Speaker 4: I don't think those should just be, you know, just
Speaker 4: thrown out through his stipulations in a match.
Speaker 5: Longing for some nostalgia or maybe you want to learn
Speaker 5: some wrestling history, don't miss the nineties Past Cast Every
Speaker 5: Friday on the PW Torch Daily Cast Feed. Alex and
Speaker 5: Patrick will transport you thirty years into the past by
Speaker 5: taking you through the Torch issue from that very week.
Speaker 5: Follow news from the WWF and WCW and all the
Speaker 5: happenings from across the wrestling industry in real time, as
Speaker 5: The Torch reported it thirty years ago. That's the nineties
Speaker 5: past cast every Friday on the PW Torch Daily Cast Feed.
Speaker 1: All Right, my final email, I'm kind of w to there.
Speaker 1: I mean, it can't be good though, you know if
Speaker 1: Ambrose does end up with it. I mean yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean I remember reasons for it, but I asked it
Speaker 1: for the reasons you're against it, So I'm kind of torn, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: Jerry from Illinois says, I sanzwitever. Randy Orton called a
Speaker 1: woman a Latin miss picking. How is Randy Orton? How
Speaker 1: can Randy Orton crap in women's gym baggs, call people
Speaker 1: stupid in the ring, and generally act like an ass
Speaker 1: and still have a job. At one point do you
Speaker 1: say this guy's unprofessional? In cut your losses? Well, I mean,
Speaker 1: that's been ten years of WWE frustration. Jason.
Speaker 4: How did Randy Moss run over a meter maid? How
Speaker 4: did Randy Moss have a joint in the ash tray
Speaker 4: that wasn't his because a lot of people drive his car?
Speaker 4: How did Randy Moss do a lot of things during
Speaker 4: his NFL care and not just Randy Moss. I'm just
Speaker 4: using him because it's close to home.
Speaker 1: No, he's the only NFL guy ever get in trouble.
Speaker 4: Right exactly. But now, I mean it's just they see
Speaker 4: something in Randy. I don't know. As time goes on,
Speaker 4: and right now with just his things seem to be
Speaker 4: picking up a little bit for him. I sense there's
Speaker 4: a little more interest in Rain's Orton than there's been
Speaker 4: in Orton in some time. But still, just as time
Speaker 4: goes on, I think they may lose patience for that
Speaker 4: because I don't think Randy Orton means as much as
Speaker 4: he wants stat They don't have the perception that he
Speaker 4: can be the guy that they like they once did.
Speaker 1: He's a ten twelve year vet now who is there
Speaker 1: to help elevate Roman raints, you know, I mean that
Speaker 1: that's a posiness and he's in The reason he's in
Speaker 1: that spot, and the reason it isn't the Sena Orton era,
Speaker 1: but it's the Sena era. And the reason people were
Speaker 1: booing one of them, you know, booing and saying we've
Speaker 1: had enough of this when they did see Orton the
Speaker 1: last time last year, is for all those reasons that
Speaker 1: management can't get one hundred percent behind him for a
Speaker 1: lot of good reasons. And there are there are you know,
Speaker 1: maturity issues and management trying to manage him issues, and
Speaker 1: there's judgment issues with him and they've been consistent and
Speaker 1: he has not outgrown them. And you know, publicly laughing
Speaker 1: at somebody as a Latinus piggy just I mean, yes,
Speaker 1: there's all the hypocrisy of WWE making him apologize, but
Speaker 1: because of the way that they are. But it's just
Speaker 1: it's just it's a dumb thing to say as a
Speaker 1: public figure, even as a heel. I mean, you just
Speaker 1: have to understand your rolin already.
Speaker 4: You know, gives might you know you want to have
Speaker 4: a moment with your girlfriend. There's just saying called direct message.
Speaker 1: Yes exactly. So yeah, I should kind of disqualify you
Speaker 1: from you know, being a favorite WW wrestler at least
Speaker 1: if if they can't trust you in that way. And
Speaker 1: that's where seen it by contrasts have been such a model,
Speaker 1: you know, a model guy, and such the right choice.
Speaker 4: And call me created. I don't know, but if there's
Speaker 4: a if I'm worried that someone could be a Stoker type.
Speaker 4: I don't know that I'm going to like publicly humiliate them.
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, Oh, I know, you're just asking for asking
Speaker 1: for trouble. Yeah. At that point, Jason, that's it for me.
Speaker 1: On emails and topics, any any last one you want
Speaker 1: to throw them before a wrap.
Speaker 4: Up anything new on TNA, And I just I kind
Speaker 4: of throw my hands up because I just everyone seems
Speaker 4: to have a different story or interpretation of what's going on.
Speaker 1: Well, my take is Spike decided not to renew them,
Speaker 1: and I don't know this to be true, but I
Speaker 1: think they're still open to carrying them, and I don't
Speaker 1: think they have like another deal in place. There are
Speaker 1: a hundred percent committed to it. But I think they
Speaker 1: get frustrated and said, you know, screw it, We're not
Speaker 1: going to pay what you're asking for, and if you're
Speaker 1: going to insist on this, we're going to walk away.
Speaker 1: And the Russo thing was the last straw, and now
Speaker 1: you know, they went the PR Agency went crawling back
Speaker 1: to uh Spike and said, all right, let's let's just
Speaker 1: try to make this work. You know, we're sorry, we
Speaker 1: handle things on professionally. Let's make this work. And I
Speaker 1: think I'll try to figure that out.
Speaker 3: I was.
Speaker 1: I was intrigued, but I don't know, you know, it
Speaker 1: could be there just trying to get through this week's tapings. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and and uh and they're going to do it like
Speaker 1: Paul Hayman did you know, just let everybody know through
Speaker 1: word of mouth that uh. I mean, that's one of
Speaker 1: the worst things that comes across and in documentaries on
Speaker 1: on ecw is is is the way that Hayman strong
Speaker 1: leads guys along to work for him and sacrifice for
Speaker 1: him because of that carrot. And he didn't make personal
Speaker 1: phone calls to top to bottom of the roster and
Speaker 1: and tell them you know this is this is the
Speaker 1: sad truth, and he just kind of disappeared and ended
Speaker 1: up in WWF. That I think is one of the
Speaker 1: dark parts about Hayman. If T and A is going under,
Speaker 1: I hope or they don't get on Spike and they
Speaker 1: don't have revenue and they have to fold. I hope
Speaker 1: they do things better, but their history indicates they'll probably
Speaker 1: find a way to do it even worse than that. Unfortunately,
Speaker 1: I did it fight it intriguing that Vince Russo said
Speaker 1: in his writing his public statement that John Geberrick told
Speaker 1: a TV official about me, and I was told they
Speaker 1: were okay with it. So therefore, and of course, you know,
Speaker 1: we can't help with the all caps any reports that
Speaker 1: Spike was Spike canceled t ANDA because of me or
Speaker 1: false then three four paragraph later or whatever it was,
Speaker 1: VINCERUZI goes, So if John was telling me the truth,
Speaker 1: then that means that these stories aren't true. And it's like,
Speaker 1: so he's calling everybody saying everybody's inaccurate and saying he
Speaker 1: was a final straw. But even he's not sure if
Speaker 1: what John told him is actually true. So he doesn't
Speaker 1: even know if the reason Spike dropped stop negotiations and
Speaker 1: essentially canceled IMPACT is because John lied to him and said, no,
Speaker 1: Spike's not you know that Spike never said they were
Speaker 1: okay with it or the right person didn't. So that
Speaker 1: I thought was kind of an interesting, you know, to
Speaker 1: Russo explanation.
Speaker 4: Yeah, well I've grown because I thot you're talking about
Speaker 4: his initial statement that basically TNA suggested that he take
Speaker 4: a break. I'm like, are you serious? So that I
Speaker 4: mean basically they were just going to repeat history, Like
Speaker 4: why don't you just lay low for a while. It's away.
Speaker 4: I took that, and I know TNA's get their take
Speaker 4: on it is. No, that's not what was said. But
Speaker 4: if that was, wow, I mean that that's embarrassing and
Speaker 4: jumping back to you know, if this were to be
Speaker 4: the end of TNA, I don't think those phone calls
Speaker 4: will come from Dixie. I mean her her. I'm not
Speaker 4: saying it won't come from someone in the company. It
Speaker 4: could be John Goborick or whomever. But with Dixie, this
Speaker 4: woman hates delivering bad news. It's I don't understand. I mean,
Speaker 4: no one likes to, but she hides from it, and
Speaker 4: it just someday. I'm sure the story of Sting's final days,
Speaker 4: I've heard bits and pieces, and you know, they had,
Speaker 4: by all accounts, a good relationship and she just no
Speaker 4: contact there towards the end, and it put people interrupt
Speaker 4: position that had to deal with him toward the end
Speaker 4: because she wouldn't just you know, do the right thing
Speaker 4: and talk to him about what was going on and
Speaker 4: why not just hey, we can't make it work, but
Speaker 4: thank you and move on. I don't understand that.
Speaker 1: Well, maybe they'll just be a sweet Hernandez.
Speaker 4: The guy you interviewed on Friday, I mean, just shed
Speaker 4: by Bile. All accounts loved Hernandez at one point. I
Speaker 4: don't know if something changed in their relationship or whatever.
Speaker 4: But my god, you can't just pick up the phone
Speaker 4: and hey, Sean, here's what's going on. No, just avoid it, like,
Speaker 4: I mean, it's crazy.
Speaker 1: No, it is. I mean the stories you hear one
Speaker 1: after another about so many facets of the way TENA
Speaker 1: is run. It's not. The leadership isn't there to execute
Speaker 1: a wrestling company constantly. It just isn't. And you know,
Speaker 1: and it doesn't get better. You know, there's consistencies. You know,
Speaker 1: Bob Ryder has been there from the beginning, there's you know, changeover,
Speaker 1: there's new people like Dixie added to the mix with
Speaker 1: the ownership change, and there's people who come and go,
Speaker 1: like Bruce Prichard and John Goburick. But you just the
Speaker 1: stories continue. Nobody's come in there and just cleaned it up.
Speaker 4: No, And it's too bad, I mean, And part of that,
Speaker 4: I think is she doesn't want to give people that
Speaker 4: power to clean it up. I think that's why they
Speaker 4: haven't been able to reach agreements with Paul Hayman and
Speaker 4: Jim Ross, and you know, it's it's frustrating. I think
Speaker 4: things could be so much better than they are, and
Speaker 4: hopefully they'll get there. But it's all okay, wait, because
Speaker 4: Jeff Jarrett just announced today that he has worked at
Speaker 4: a new working agreement with an independent promotion from South
Speaker 4: Africa that I've never heard of.
Speaker 1: You do this to me every week now, almost every
Speaker 1: He's like, oh, GWF News and I'm like, and I
Speaker 1: know you're tongue cheek at this point, but I'm like,
Speaker 1: show me the card, show me the building they're renting,
Speaker 1: show me something. Besides, it's almost like he's filming a mockumentary,
Speaker 1: Like I do. I think Jeff Jarrett is filming a
Speaker 1: mockumentary about my journey starting a fake wrestling company, and
Speaker 1: I'm going to do it.
Speaker 4: That would be all the reality show.
Speaker 1: It would be fun. And yeah, he's filming a reality
Speaker 1: show and the only expense is a monthly fee a
Speaker 1: like go Daddy for web hosting, and his frequent flyer
Speaker 1: miles he's acquired over the years just fly around the
Speaker 1: world and just throw out these platitudes about international relationships
Speaker 1: and all that and it's just going to be a mockumentary.
Speaker 1: I'm going to start a wrestling company and it's going
Speaker 1: to get all this buzz. Of course I'm not biting,
Speaker 1: but you know it's going to get all this buzz,
Speaker 1: and I have no intention of ever running. I'm never
Speaker 1: going to hire a wrestler. I'm never going to hire anybody.
Speaker 1: But I'm going to have affiliations worldwide and a website,
Speaker 1: and let's see how far this can go Unlet's see
Speaker 1: where leads us. That's what it comes across to me,
Speaker 1: more than a serious business plan and execution. But if
Speaker 1: that's the case, he stringings some people along. I mean,
Speaker 1: I know people that he's talked to about jobs down
Speaker 1: the line, front office and wrestlers, and I mean it
Speaker 1: so I don't think it's really happening. I'm just for effect.
Speaker 1: For I'm just saying it. This just feels like it's
Speaker 1: a satire to me. I'm only just shut up and
Speaker 1: hire some people and announce something when you have something
Speaker 1: to announce.
Speaker 4: See, I knew you were going to come back with
Speaker 4: something way. But it's okay because Jef Jared also announced
Speaker 4: that he has a partnership with a promotion in India
Speaker 4: as well.
Speaker 1: Oh, I read that quote. I've been there. I'm familiar,
Speaker 1: and I know there's a lot of fans, rabid fans.
Speaker 4: Yes, and there are absolutely no I think it would.
Speaker 4: I'd watch that mockumentary because I think you'd also see
Speaker 4: Jeff and Karen like going to these indie shows where
Speaker 4: they get paid money to come in and scout and
Speaker 4: also paid money to hold these seminars, and then as
Speaker 4: soon as like everybody leave or they go outside, they
Speaker 4: can be sitting there snickering and laughing about how wow,
Speaker 4: this guy just paid me for the scout talent for
Speaker 4: this promotion that doesn't exist.
Speaker 1: It'd be awesome, it would it would. I mean, you
Speaker 1: know what if maybe they can just turn it into
Speaker 1: that if it doesn't come through the way they want.
Speaker 1: But who knows. We could be somebody could play this
Speaker 1: back for me in two years and go, Wade Boyd,
Speaker 1: did you underestumeate Jeff Jarrett? You know?
Speaker 3: Oh?
Speaker 1: And I hope so I do too.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, No, I mean, I sincerely hope this thing
Speaker 4: gets off the ground. I just don't other than just
Speaker 4: to keep the name. I don't understand why make your partnerships,
Speaker 4: and that's that's all well and good, but what are they?
Speaker 4: What are these? I mean, okay, what next week it's
Speaker 4: going to be you found an indie promotion in Norway
Speaker 4: that wants to do some sort of an agreement for
Speaker 4: a non existent wrestling promotion.
Speaker 1: Whoopee do I know? No, I exactly. So anyway, that
Speaker 1: is literally the time I will give another second. So Jason,
Speaker 1: thank you very much. Good show, good callers, good email questions.
Speaker 1: Kind of a just maintenance edition of RAW for the
Speaker 1: most part, but some stuff for us to sink our
Speaker 1: teeth into. We'll both on our respective sites be covering
Speaker 1: all the other stuff. And we've already talked in more
Speaker 1: in depth about the financials and network and all that,
Speaker 1: so we didn't get into that today, but all the
Speaker 1: fresh news from this week coming out of RAW, I
Speaker 1: think we hit a lot of the key topics. So anyway,
Speaker 1: appreciate it, Appreciate our members for their support, and I'm
Speaker 1: behalf of Jason Powell. This is Wade Keller signing off.
Speaker 1: Invite you to email the show with feedback or questions
Speaker 1: or comments. That email address is Wadekeller Podcast at petewtorch
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Speaker 1: welcome your feedback on Twitter. Even follow us on Twitter
Speaker 1: at pw torch and follow me at the Wade Keller.
Speaker 1: That's at PW Torch and at the Wadekeller.
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