WEBVTT 1 00:00:42.960 --> 00:00:47.439 Well, here we are. It is officially Autumn Equinox. It's 2 00:00:47.520 --> 00:00:52.000 the beginning of autumn, September twenty second to the twenty third. 3 00:00:52.119 --> 00:00:57.079 It is an energy change and this is also a 4 00:00:57.119 --> 00:01:00.920 special edition of Earth Ages. This clip your host of 5 00:01:01.000 --> 00:01:04.239 Earth Ancients, and today we are presenting a look at 6 00:01:04.239 --> 00:01:07.959 the rainforest of the Amazon. In the book we're focusing 7 00:01:08.040 --> 00:01:12.480 on is Rainforest Medicine, which was written by Jonathan Miller 8 00:01:13.280 --> 00:01:19.719 Weisberger almost eleven years ago, and it's very appropriate today 9 00:01:19.760 --> 00:01:25.359 because we're talking about plant medicines from an ethnobotanist who 10 00:01:25.519 --> 00:01:28.840 can give us not only the insight on the medicines 11 00:01:28.920 --> 00:01:36.040 that are psychedelic based ayahuasca, DMT and other plant derivatives 12 00:01:36.079 --> 00:01:40.280 that cause us to leave our conscious minds and move 13 00:01:40.280 --> 00:01:46.640 into other dimensions, but it's a chance to also celebrate Earth, 14 00:01:47.400 --> 00:01:53.599 celebrate the changing seasons, and also consider how we move forward, 15 00:01:54.239 --> 00:01:58.280 what the next phase of our evolution is. You might say, 16 00:01:58.640 --> 00:02:01.519 how does that fit in with the Earth Ancients theme. Well, 17 00:02:02.280 --> 00:02:07.599 as you will hear we're talking about lost realms. You've 18 00:02:07.640 --> 00:02:11.759 heard of move which is also known as limoria. Of 19 00:02:11.800 --> 00:02:14.120 course we talk about Atlantis, but in part of our 20 00:02:14.120 --> 00:02:20.240 interview today there are regions of the Amazon that are 21 00:02:20.759 --> 00:02:25.159 recognized as being populated by people who migrated from Limoria 22 00:02:25.719 --> 00:02:29.759 and move and there's a there's a region that also 23 00:02:30.479 --> 00:02:36.080 was home to giants, people that were over seven feet 24 00:02:36.159 --> 00:02:44.000 tall and left their wisdom with the people known as 25 00:02:44.039 --> 00:02:48.000 the Sequoia Indians of the Amazon. And we're gonna learn 26 00:02:48.039 --> 00:02:51.479 about not only the giants, but some of the plant 27 00:02:51.520 --> 00:02:55.639 medicine wisdom that was handed down thousands and thousands of 28 00:02:55.680 --> 00:02:59.439 years ago. We don't hear enough about plant medicine used 29 00:02:59.479 --> 00:03:03.520 from ancient, an ancestral point of view, how our ancestors 30 00:03:03.520 --> 00:03:06.719 incorporated it. Another thing that I didn't realize is this 31 00:03:06.719 --> 00:03:10.599 book that we're talking about today gets into the proper 32 00:03:10.639 --> 00:03:16.639 preparations for ayahuasca and how to collect the leaves and 33 00:03:16.680 --> 00:03:20.759 who to work with, because there's a lot of different 34 00:03:21.080 --> 00:03:24.360 people who are claiming to be ayahuasca experts and this 35 00:03:24.479 --> 00:03:28.599 is becoming some kind of an industry, especially in Peru. 36 00:03:28.800 --> 00:03:33.000 We know that people like our friend Graham Hancock travels 37 00:03:33.039 --> 00:03:39.879 to Peru occasionally and partakes in ceremony vision quest. But 38 00:03:39.919 --> 00:03:42.680 you have to be very very careful who you get 39 00:03:42.719 --> 00:03:46.280 involved with. So there's steps in this book reinforest medicine, 40 00:03:46.319 --> 00:03:53.039 on how to look for the good shaman, how to partake, 41 00:03:53.159 --> 00:03:59.240 how to prepare a tea or a broth, and most importantly, 42 00:03:59.240 --> 00:04:03.319 how to prepare and what intentions to use for the 43 00:04:03.400 --> 00:04:07.319 ayahuasca ceremony. But again that's only part of our discussion. 44 00:04:07.400 --> 00:04:13.759 This is actually gets into some important anthropology, some archaeological 45 00:04:13.840 --> 00:04:17.480 parks that we will talk about archaeology as a whole, 46 00:04:19.319 --> 00:04:24.959 all in celebration of the autumn equinox. So today's program 47 00:04:25.079 --> 00:04:35.040 is Rainforest Medicine, and my guest is Jonathan Miller Weisberger. Hey, 48 00:04:35.079 --> 00:04:37.639 we're going to be in the jungle this December first 49 00:04:37.720 --> 00:04:42.639 through the twelfth on the Guatemala Sacred Temple Tour, and 50 00:04:42.680 --> 00:04:45.439 this is an opportunity not only to climb pyramids, but 51 00:04:45.920 --> 00:04:49.720 to interact with the local shaman in understanding what the 52 00:04:49.800 --> 00:04:54.399 Maya were up to, their state of mind and ceremony, 53 00:04:54.480 --> 00:04:57.519 to connect with the sacred temples and pyramids that we'll 54 00:04:57.519 --> 00:05:00.519 interact with. This is a chance to not only climb 55 00:05:00.639 --> 00:05:06.360 pyramids connect with them, but also to take in the 56 00:05:06.399 --> 00:05:11.720 spirit and the consciousness that is the genius of the Maya. 57 00:05:11.839 --> 00:05:15.000 If you'd like to join us, go to Earthancients dot com, 58 00:05:15.040 --> 00:05:18.560 forward slash Tours and you'll see all the details. To 59 00:05:18.639 --> 00:05:22.199 get details on the Guatemalo tour, send an email to 60 00:05:22.240 --> 00:05:25.199 me at Earth Ancients the number four the letter you 61 00:05:25.759 --> 00:05:29.079 at gmail dot com and join me for a private 62 00:05:29.160 --> 00:05:35.800 zoom conference with our hosts Lydia and Arturo Di Leong. Again. 63 00:05:35.879 --> 00:05:40.040 The Guatemalo tour is December first to the twelfth, twenty 64 00:05:40.120 --> 00:05:43.759 twenty five. For more information, go to earth Agents dot com, 65 00:05:43.800 --> 00:05:47.160 forward slash Tours or send me an email earth Agents 66 00:05:47.240 --> 00:05:49.720 the number four the letter YOUU at gmail dot com 67 00:05:49.759 --> 00:05:52.839 for a discussion on just what we'll be doing. This 68 00:05:53.000 --> 00:05:54.439 tour is perfect for you. 69 00:06:18.639 --> 00:06:23.360 Another rain he as tonon. I don't know what to do. 70 00:06:23.879 --> 00:06:26.480 I just miss you more than anything. 71 00:06:29.240 --> 00:06:32.639 We haven't talked enough about the rainforest of the Amazon. 72 00:06:33.079 --> 00:06:36.000 When we had Graham Hancock on the program, he discussed 73 00:06:36.040 --> 00:06:41.439 his trips to the rainforest for ayahuasca journeys. And today 74 00:06:41.519 --> 00:06:46.480 we're talking with Jonathan Miller Weisberger, who is the author 75 00:06:46.519 --> 00:06:49.920 of Rainforest Medicine, and this is a book that came 76 00:06:49.959 --> 00:06:53.560 out in twenty thirteen that really highlights not only ayahuasca, 77 00:06:53.600 --> 00:06:58.040 but the sacred plants in the Amazon forest. And really 78 00:06:58.079 --> 00:07:00.079 what to look for when you're taking an eye I 79 00:07:00.120 --> 00:07:02.879 watch a journey. It's just a really well written book. 80 00:07:03.240 --> 00:07:05.079 But there's so much more we want to talk about today. 81 00:07:05.120 --> 00:07:08.839 So Jonathan, welcome to Earth Ancients. Great to have you 82 00:07:08.879 --> 00:07:09.600 on the program. 83 00:07:10.639 --> 00:07:13.160 Thank you so much. An It's an honor and a 84 00:07:13.279 --> 00:07:16.319 joy to be here. Listens to program for quite a 85 00:07:16.319 --> 00:07:20.040 well known It's wonderful to be here. Thank you so much. 86 00:07:20.680 --> 00:07:22.920 I want to mention and get an idea from you. 87 00:07:23.000 --> 00:07:26.519 You're an ethnobotanist, which is really and I want to 88 00:07:26.519 --> 00:07:28.959 get your definition of it, because this is somebody who 89 00:07:29.160 --> 00:07:32.480 is relating plants to how people use those plants, but 90 00:07:32.560 --> 00:07:37.680 not only that, how plants can be turned into two food, clothing, 91 00:07:38.920 --> 00:07:44.399 and other I guess you could call them beneficial projects. 92 00:07:45.199 --> 00:07:50.079 Give me an idea of what you how you decided 93 00:07:50.120 --> 00:07:53.279 to become an ethno botanist, but also the region that 94 00:07:53.360 --> 00:07:55.920 you chose, which is Northern Amazon. 95 00:07:57.160 --> 00:08:02.319 Yeah, well, I mean in the northern northeast from northwestern Amazon. 96 00:08:02.360 --> 00:08:08.759 Reasion is the pinnacles terrestrial botanical and biological diversity. But 97 00:08:09.279 --> 00:08:11.480 I was raised in Equator, so I guess the jungle 98 00:08:11.560 --> 00:08:15.639 chose me circumstances. I was raised in Equator and when 99 00:08:15.680 --> 00:08:18.639 I was about eleven, and then again thirteen years old, 100 00:08:18.680 --> 00:08:23.680 a friend of my parents was an ethnobotanist. We lost 101 00:08:23.680 --> 00:08:27.439 touch with and he hasn't have any publications. It's been 102 00:08:27.439 --> 00:08:32.720 a mystery. And he brought me to the Amazon with 103 00:08:32.799 --> 00:08:35.679 him and I helped him press plants. But what most 104 00:08:35.720 --> 00:08:39.039 impressed me is the seeing nettle bush. You know, I 105 00:08:39.360 --> 00:08:41.679 brushed up against the steeing nettle and now they're they're 106 00:08:41.759 --> 00:08:45.279 pretty potent. The nettles, all nettles, some especially where then 107 00:08:45.279 --> 00:08:46.960 other's been in the Amazon. They got some metals that 108 00:08:47.000 --> 00:08:48.919 you really feel it when they get you. I was 109 00:08:48.960 --> 00:08:52.679 just amazed that a plant can sting you. That really 110 00:08:52.759 --> 00:08:55.200 she brought me in. That was my first like. And 111 00:08:55.240 --> 00:08:57.159 then I learned that the use of the nettles, and 112 00:08:57.679 --> 00:09:00.679 later I'm living amongst the wallwood. I the what Arnie 113 00:09:01.480 --> 00:09:04.879 called the nettle the mother of all medicines. And it's 114 00:09:04.879 --> 00:09:08.480 because they use the nettle to transmit their energy to 115 00:09:08.559 --> 00:09:11.000 the younger generation. Like if a parent's come back from 116 00:09:11.200 --> 00:09:14.000 or a father comes back from a successful hunting trip, 117 00:09:14.039 --> 00:09:15.879 he'll grab the nettles and the kids will run off. 118 00:09:15.919 --> 00:09:19.799 He'll chase them down and he'll spank his the nettle 119 00:09:19.840 --> 00:09:22.679 on their on his child, and that asses that that 120 00:09:23.360 --> 00:09:26.679 success of the triumph of a good day onto their child. 121 00:09:26.759 --> 00:09:29.519 So the mother of the medicine, because the waite Arnies 122 00:09:29.559 --> 00:09:32.399 use very few medicinal plants because they're a remote wilderness 123 00:09:32.399 --> 00:09:35.840 tribe and they don't have many illnesses, is really how 124 00:09:35.879 --> 00:09:40.159 to transmit ones like chi they call your invite energy 125 00:09:40.200 --> 00:09:44.200 to onto their children. So it's interesting. But yeah, and 126 00:09:44.240 --> 00:09:47.399 so ethnobotany, you know, at in essence is the study 127 00:09:47.399 --> 00:09:50.879 of the relationship between people and plants. Ethnos, people and 128 00:09:50.960 --> 00:09:55.840 botany plants, and like you said, mentioned there's it's you know, 129 00:09:55.919 --> 00:09:59.919 ethnobotany is all the relate ways that we relate to plants. 130 00:10:00.039 --> 00:10:02.000 So later when I went on to study at the 131 00:10:02.080 --> 00:10:03.879 Humble State University. 132 00:10:04.799 --> 00:10:11.440 Humble, Northern California, Humble in San Francisco, that's my backyard. Wow. Okay, Yeah, 133 00:10:11.519 --> 00:10:15.600 were you raised in like Eureka or where were you raised? 134 00:10:15.919 --> 00:10:17.720 No, I was actually I was born here in the 135 00:10:17.759 --> 00:10:21.759 East Bay in Berkeley, and okay, and I'm in al 136 00:10:21.799 --> 00:10:25.320 so Bronte, else Bronte. That's awesome. Yeah, I was raised 137 00:10:25.360 --> 00:10:28.200 in Equador. My parents had a Vegetarian Cultural Center in 138 00:10:28.240 --> 00:10:31.600 Ecuador when I was growing up, and there's a there's 139 00:10:31.320 --> 00:10:34.240 a book that spoke about them, called The Making of 140 00:10:34.279 --> 00:10:36.960 an un American, and there's a chapter in there where 141 00:10:37.000 --> 00:10:40.799 my mom she put a complaint to this supermarket where 142 00:10:40.799 --> 00:10:43.440 we used to go shopping, because they had the indigenous 143 00:10:44.200 --> 00:10:47.159 people would go to buy the dog meat, which was 144 00:10:48.120 --> 00:10:50.799 that they sold for dogs, which was actually quality beef, 145 00:10:51.360 --> 00:10:53.559 but just like you know, sides and pieces and or 146 00:10:53.600 --> 00:10:57.000 the bones. But they wouldn't let them buy there. And 147 00:10:57.039 --> 00:10:59.879 so my mom put a complaint and they got the 148 00:11:00.200 --> 00:11:02.720 the store owners to realize that there was no reason 149 00:11:02.759 --> 00:11:04.639 why they couldn't buy there, so then they were allowed 150 00:11:04.679 --> 00:11:06.519 to buy the natives there. So she was written up 151 00:11:06.519 --> 00:11:08.679 in the book. So I come from a family of 152 00:11:08.720 --> 00:11:10.679 you know, like activists, I guess you could say, working 153 00:11:11.080 --> 00:11:13.559 to improve the quality of life for other people, for 154 00:11:13.639 --> 00:11:16.519 the planet. And yeah, so that's about me. Is a 155 00:11:16.559 --> 00:11:19.960 fascinating way to you know, it's just led me on 156 00:11:20.039 --> 00:11:21.720 a lot of journeys ten years in the Amazon. 157 00:11:22.679 --> 00:11:27.879 Yeah. Yeah, And so this book, this wonderful book you wrote, 158 00:11:28.480 --> 00:11:33.200 and I'm curious, Jonathan, was it because there was a 159 00:11:33.279 --> 00:11:39.000 growing interest in these ayahuasca journeys that you decided to 160 00:11:39.039 --> 00:11:41.879 give people a definition not only of the plant itself, 161 00:11:41.919 --> 00:11:45.320 the importance of the plant and how to journey correctly, 162 00:11:45.360 --> 00:11:48.559 but also who to do it with, what to look for, 163 00:11:48.720 --> 00:11:51.639 how to have an intention because you were working with 164 00:11:51.799 --> 00:11:54.320 the uh and we're gonna talk about this in a minute, 165 00:11:54.360 --> 00:12:01.559 the Sequoia people of the of the Amazon, and how 166 00:12:01.559 --> 00:12:07.120 the indigenous people were working with this psychedelic So, I mean, 167 00:12:07.320 --> 00:12:09.879 it seems because I mean, the book has so much 168 00:12:09.879 --> 00:12:12.519 more depth to it than what I'm mentioning, but it 169 00:12:12.559 --> 00:12:19.480 seems like it's your helpful guide to psychedelics and the 170 00:12:19.519 --> 00:12:22.919 importance of having good intention to talk about that because 171 00:12:23.759 --> 00:12:27.039 so much of the book is really not only focused 172 00:12:27.039 --> 00:12:31.559 on ayahuasca. But I guess you call it yeah yahee 173 00:12:31.679 --> 00:12:36.120 as well yeah hey yeah he yeah yeah right. 174 00:12:37.639 --> 00:12:40.679 Well. I worked between nineteen ninety and the year two thousands, 175 00:12:40.679 --> 00:12:43.919 and when I was studying botany at humble Se University 176 00:12:43.960 --> 00:12:49.480 of Music, about the music of the plants, I returned tequitor. 177 00:12:49.600 --> 00:12:52.000 It took a year leave of absence that turned into 178 00:12:52.039 --> 00:12:55.600 ten years, and because it was just too exciting, my 179 00:12:55.639 --> 00:12:59.000 parents supported me too on it, and I worked with 180 00:12:59.039 --> 00:13:05.679 an organization who, well, at first a prior student a 181 00:13:05.919 --> 00:13:09.120 Humboldt State who I'm still very close friends with, founded 182 00:13:09.320 --> 00:13:12.639 an organization in Equator that started a biological reserve called 183 00:13:12.639 --> 00:13:15.080 hatun Sascha the Big Forest. And so I went to 184 00:13:15.159 --> 00:13:17.360 volunteer on the creation of minicial plank Guard and I 185 00:13:17.360 --> 00:13:19.000 got in touch with them and they said they're starting, 186 00:13:19.039 --> 00:13:22.799 they need some volunteers. So simultaneously there was another organization 187 00:13:22.840 --> 00:13:26.559 called the Reinforced Information Center that was organizing this project 188 00:13:26.559 --> 00:13:31.000 to begin the demarcation of the waward Any People's ancestr homelands. 189 00:13:31.399 --> 00:13:34.519 The what any people received one thing, it's about one 190 00:13:34.600 --> 00:13:37.559 third of their ancestral lands, which is a huge area. 191 00:13:37.720 --> 00:13:40.759 It was probably like a few million acres. And it 192 00:13:40.840 --> 00:13:44.120 was an oil company road that went down south to 193 00:13:44.200 --> 00:13:47.480 this colonization frontier town called Coca, and so it was 194 00:13:47.519 --> 00:13:50.759 a canyon of colonization. So it was one hundred and 195 00:13:50.759 --> 00:13:54.720 thirty kilometers that we had to create the boundary lines 196 00:13:54.759 --> 00:13:58.080 of so that the colonists in this canyon of colonization 197 00:13:58.120 --> 00:14:02.720 wouldn't go into the wa Ani territory to make their adjudication. 198 00:14:03.360 --> 00:14:06.519 I'm irrelevant at ground level that was there's a chapter 199 00:14:06.600 --> 00:14:09.080 in the book that I talked someone about that the 200 00:14:09.120 --> 00:14:13.759 deep forest perspective of the Wildernie. And anyway, I worked 201 00:14:13.759 --> 00:14:15.879 a bunch of years in the Amazon before we could 202 00:14:15.879 --> 00:14:19.679 say Ayahuasca became or yahi became popular. And then after 203 00:14:20.159 --> 00:14:22.639 nineteen ninety five the project with the wat Onnie came 204 00:14:22.679 --> 00:14:25.440 to a conclusion. But some close friends of mine had 205 00:14:25.480 --> 00:14:28.519 been working with the Sieko Pie or the Sequoia, a 206 00:14:28.600 --> 00:14:31.440 province to the north of where the ones lived in 207 00:14:31.480 --> 00:14:33.799 the Equador in Amazon, and so I went to go 208 00:14:33.840 --> 00:14:37.759 collaborate there because I was always fascinated by the Sequoia 209 00:14:37.799 --> 00:14:39.840 because when I was a kid growing up in Ecuador, 210 00:14:40.279 --> 00:14:42.759 there was a postcard that you would see at a 211 00:14:42.759 --> 00:14:45.879 lot of the gift shops, and it was a face 212 00:14:45.919 --> 00:14:50.039 and he's a photo of like two elders, very happy, smiling, 213 00:14:50.200 --> 00:14:53.879 just ribbing, a smile familiar to ear, with a feathered 214 00:14:53.960 --> 00:14:56.720 crown and flowers in their ears. I was like, these 215 00:14:56.720 --> 00:14:59.480 guys are amazing. The imagery stuck with me and said 216 00:14:59.480 --> 00:15:02.240 those are the so my I finally had the opportunity 217 00:15:02.240 --> 00:15:04.600 to go down there with some friends, and I went 218 00:15:05.360 --> 00:15:08.039 and then I became friends off the first trip with 219 00:15:10.320 --> 00:15:15.240 who became my maestro, Don Cesardio Piaguay. May his name 220 00:15:15.279 --> 00:15:18.120 be a blessing to all that here. He passed a 221 00:15:18.200 --> 00:15:20.600 year and a half ago at one hundred and twenty 222 00:15:21.080 --> 00:15:24.039 amazing years of age. He had great age, one hundred 223 00:15:24.080 --> 00:15:27.279 and twenty, one hundred and twenty. He passed on Eastern Friday, 224 00:15:27.720 --> 00:15:30.360 and he was laid to rest on the Resurrection Sunday. 225 00:15:31.799 --> 00:15:34.600 And so was he was he a shaman. 226 00:15:35.120 --> 00:15:37.120 He was a yahead drinker with the way the sequoia 227 00:15:37.159 --> 00:15:39.679 caused yahe and cuckoo. The yeah, they don't use the 228 00:15:39.679 --> 00:15:43.360 word sharming, but yeah, that's the equivalent a yahead drinker. 229 00:15:43.840 --> 00:15:46.679 He was a high level maestro the yahid realities, and 230 00:15:46.759 --> 00:15:49.919 the great healer and a great friend and anyone whoever 231 00:15:50.240 --> 00:15:54.039 came met him, and a very accomplished healer too, a 232 00:15:54.080 --> 00:15:58.120 spiritual healer who he could help woman. He learned from 233 00:15:58.120 --> 00:16:01.919 the celestial Doan immortals that he would commune with a 234 00:16:01.960 --> 00:16:06.279 magic cure where he would enchant invocation over a cotton 235 00:16:06.320 --> 00:16:10.720 flower just recently opening up cotton flower, and then and 236 00:16:10.799 --> 00:16:13.360 then with that she would help women who weren't able 237 00:16:13.399 --> 00:16:17.679 to conceive to have children. That's one of his famous attributes, 238 00:16:18.200 --> 00:16:21.840 And there was a French woman who came who her 239 00:16:21.919 --> 00:16:25.399 husband had an eco lodge up river. They couldn't have children, 240 00:16:25.480 --> 00:16:28.759 and she has like three children now thanks to hint too. Yeah, 241 00:16:28.840 --> 00:16:31.679 so he's a very effective filer on that level and 242 00:16:31.720 --> 00:16:34.360 then the other levels. Yeah, don't Socidia. So I we 243 00:16:34.440 --> 00:16:37.559 became friends, and he invited me back, and he was 244 00:16:37.600 --> 00:16:40.840 amazed that I had worked amongst the wilde any Indians. 245 00:16:40.840 --> 00:16:43.639 And he said, if I learned how to make the 246 00:16:43.720 --> 00:16:46.799 arrow poisons, And sure enough I had actually studied the 247 00:16:46.879 --> 00:16:49.000 making of the arrow poison among the waite Anie from 248 00:16:49.000 --> 00:16:52.360 a from a waite Antie by the name of Webbe. 249 00:16:52.600 --> 00:16:57.600 Grandfather Wepe and Houstle lived a great age. Webbe in 250 00:16:57.639 --> 00:16:59.759 the last month of his life, he never laid down. 251 00:16:59.879 --> 00:17:02.720 He just sat up until and without eating for a 252 00:17:02.759 --> 00:17:05.880 whole month. He was also great age, well over one 253 00:17:05.920 --> 00:17:08.359 hundred and when he laid down, he was on the 254 00:17:08.359 --> 00:17:12.799 other side. And I visited Webbe and worked with him. 255 00:17:12.799 --> 00:17:15.759 Finally we met on the boundary line demarcation. But finally 256 00:17:15.799 --> 00:17:17.759 I went. I took a four day journey across the 257 00:17:17.839 --> 00:17:21.119 territory to his home and spent a month there. And 258 00:17:21.160 --> 00:17:23.440 it was amazing. And when I was living with him, 259 00:17:23.440 --> 00:17:26.240 he would never lay down. I got to see that firsthand, 260 00:17:26.279 --> 00:17:29.200 like what they talk about in Chuangsu, the wise men 261 00:17:29.240 --> 00:17:32.400 of old, like thousands of years back, still in existence. 262 00:17:32.440 --> 00:17:35.200 He would never lay down. And I had read I 263 00:17:35.240 --> 00:17:41.119 was moved by the French anthropologist uh Levy Strauss's book Tropeque. 264 00:17:41.200 --> 00:17:44.039 I read that. So he said that to studying the natives, 265 00:17:44.079 --> 00:17:45.559 he wanted to be the first one up and the 266 00:17:45.640 --> 00:17:48.440 last one to sleep. So I tried that, and Web 267 00:17:48.519 --> 00:17:50.680 immediately knew what I was up there. She would when 268 00:17:50.680 --> 00:17:54.200 I'd fall asleep, and he'd come and light my fire 269 00:17:52.960 --> 00:17:56.519 and wake up, and he's giggled and like retreating to 270 00:17:56.839 --> 00:18:00.279 his to his hammock, like Katia, you never to be 271 00:18:00.319 --> 00:18:03.240 the first one up or the last one to sleep here, buddy. 272 00:18:03.799 --> 00:18:06.319 Let that settle in for a while, you know. And 273 00:18:06.400 --> 00:18:09.200 he would literally never lay down. He never laid down 274 00:18:09.200 --> 00:18:11.880 the whole month that was there. So but I learned 275 00:18:11.880 --> 00:18:14.319 the water on the arrow poisoning technique from whip it, 276 00:18:14.400 --> 00:18:16.559 and so I taught society. We went out to the 277 00:18:16.599 --> 00:18:19.240 forest in the sequor tert where we found the plants, 278 00:18:19.839 --> 00:18:21.920 and his wife made the clay pot so we made it, 279 00:18:22.440 --> 00:18:25.240 and then we went out hunting with the blowpipe he had, 280 00:18:25.720 --> 00:18:28.920 and sure enough we stuck a wild boar and the 281 00:18:28.960 --> 00:18:31.319 thing ran off like a little bit and dropped, and 282 00:18:31.400 --> 00:18:33.480 he was just like amazed. He couldn't believe it. They 283 00:18:33.480 --> 00:18:36.279 we're smoking meat. He's like that. Then that's like huge 284 00:18:36.319 --> 00:18:38.359 to the Sequoia is to be smoking a wild boar. 285 00:18:38.400 --> 00:18:41.480 And then you start talking real story, you know. And 286 00:18:41.519 --> 00:18:44.160 then so he's like, what, we got to drink your head? 287 00:18:44.200 --> 00:18:46.079 And I was like sure, I'd love to, and so 288 00:18:46.119 --> 00:18:48.920 we started drinking yeah hey, And then I was blown 289 00:18:48.960 --> 00:18:52.119 to a million pieces and managed to pull myself back together. 290 00:18:52.319 --> 00:18:56.319 That the first time you had yeah hey? Uh you 291 00:18:56.319 --> 00:18:58.640 know while you were down there, or had you had 292 00:19:00.119 --> 00:19:01.960 ayahuasca or other psychedelics. 293 00:19:03.319 --> 00:19:05.279 I had tried to the ayahuasca once when I was 294 00:19:05.319 --> 00:19:07.680 thirteen years old with my friend Fred, who brought my 295 00:19:07.720 --> 00:19:09.759 mother's friend who brought me to the Amazon who's death 296 00:19:09.839 --> 00:19:12.119 no botanist, and he said that I couldn't. He was 297 00:19:12.160 --> 00:19:15.599 going to be away for the night and I just 298 00:19:15.680 --> 00:19:18.400 to stay in this lot. And then then so I 299 00:19:18.440 --> 00:19:20.880 was like, yeah, right, I'm saying. So when he left, 300 00:19:20.880 --> 00:19:23.359 I followed him. I snuck behind him because I wasn't 301 00:19:23.359 --> 00:19:25.480 going to stay in this hut on the forest all alone. 302 00:19:25.480 --> 00:19:29.079 I'm following Fred because I was thirteen. He was my mentor, 303 00:19:29.119 --> 00:19:31.680 like my father there and so I and I was like, 304 00:19:32.279 --> 00:19:34.680 so I snuck behind him, and then he got to 305 00:19:34.720 --> 00:19:37.920 the ceremony lodge and then I walked in and once 306 00:19:38.359 --> 00:19:40.519 the tradition is that you get to the ceremony lodge 307 00:19:40.680 --> 00:19:42.920 right before a ceremony, you can't leave. You have to 308 00:19:42.960 --> 00:19:45.319 stay there to the night. So they ended up giving 309 00:19:45.359 --> 00:19:47.039 me the drink because they asked me directly, you want 310 00:19:47.079 --> 00:19:47.559 I was like sure. 311 00:19:47.640 --> 00:19:49.960 So Fred was like, uh oh, my my god. 312 00:19:50.079 --> 00:19:52.000 I must have said, whatever you do, don't give any 313 00:19:52.000 --> 00:19:54.720 of that. And then I drank it when I was thirteen. 314 00:19:54.799 --> 00:19:56.960 But I mean, really with the sequoias is then when 315 00:19:57.000 --> 00:19:59.519 I started having the really full blown experiences, you know, 316 00:19:59.519 --> 00:20:02.920 because we were drinking and doing society was prepared very strong. 317 00:20:02.960 --> 00:20:04.960 You taught me how I was. I became designated. 318 00:20:05.039 --> 00:20:08.720 Yeah, he cook, so you understand the combination to make 319 00:20:08.759 --> 00:20:11.359 a a ayahuasca brew. 320 00:20:12.440 --> 00:20:15.359 Correct. In my book, I described that chapter five, Preparing 321 00:20:15.359 --> 00:20:17.880 a proper Brew. I was the chef for five years 322 00:20:17.880 --> 00:20:21.079 for the Master and when you cook it wrong, he'll 323 00:20:21.119 --> 00:20:23.200 get a headache and he can't sing. And he said, 324 00:20:23.319 --> 00:20:24.880 I would be out in the forest cooking and I 325 00:20:25.000 --> 00:20:27.119 do what I'd make a mistake, and that night you 326 00:20:27.160 --> 00:20:29.039 have a headache. The Master's like, we're not going to 327 00:20:29.119 --> 00:20:31.480 drink this. And he explains to me what I did wrong. 328 00:20:32.039 --> 00:20:34.599 He said, son, you took off your tunic right when 329 00:20:34.640 --> 00:20:36.160 when you were cooking. I was like, I did because 330 00:20:36.160 --> 00:20:38.519 it was so hot. He said, then you can't because 331 00:20:38.519 --> 00:20:40.599 you're you have to fast all day when cooking the 332 00:20:40.680 --> 00:20:43.200 yeah and something, and then you have to like down 333 00:20:43.240 --> 00:20:44.839 there it was rough. You have to haul water from 334 00:20:44.839 --> 00:20:47.039 the slip creek up the slippery muddy bank. 335 00:20:47.400 --> 00:20:51.960 Subtle preparation that have to be followed for the brew 336 00:20:52.000 --> 00:20:52.960 to be just right. 337 00:20:54.160 --> 00:20:55.960 For sure. It's a lot of a lot of things. 338 00:20:56.319 --> 00:20:58.799 And so she saw he and the visions that I 339 00:20:58.880 --> 00:21:01.519 basically took off my two and then you have you 340 00:21:01.640 --> 00:21:03.920 dumped the brew, bad brew. Dump it. But when you 341 00:21:03.960 --> 00:21:07.319 finally get it right and everything comes together, the Master, 342 00:21:07.519 --> 00:21:10.039 like you know, he puts us both of his hands 343 00:21:10.039 --> 00:21:13.119 together up into the sky, and when he opens his hands, 344 00:21:14.880 --> 00:21:18.440 the most exquisite reality you can ever imagine, just comes 345 00:21:18.519 --> 00:21:21.079 cascading down. You're just engulfs and you're in heaven. 346 00:21:21.839 --> 00:21:26.680 Talk about your understanding of the history of ayahuasca and 347 00:21:26.759 --> 00:21:31.799 ya hey, because it seems to me that it's been 348 00:21:31.799 --> 00:21:34.799 taken out of context. Now it's like I want a trip, 349 00:21:35.279 --> 00:21:39.319 so I'm going to Peru to do so ayahuasca. What 350 00:21:39.480 --> 00:21:44.119 is it traditionally or from an indigenous perspective? 351 00:21:44.880 --> 00:21:48.880 What does it use for that's a great question. Let 352 00:21:48.880 --> 00:21:51.000 me get to Let me just summarize the last question. 353 00:21:51.079 --> 00:21:55.440 So that the book came came out later many years later, 354 00:21:55.519 --> 00:21:57.839 seeing that this is, you know, traveling the world over. 355 00:21:57.960 --> 00:22:00.720 The book came out of more of an active social 356 00:22:00.759 --> 00:22:03.599 responsibility because it's it's quite a bit of work. At 357 00:22:03.599 --> 00:22:06.240 the time, I was already in full swing and running 358 00:22:06.240 --> 00:22:08.920 the eco Lodge. And also so I'd wake up at 359 00:22:08.920 --> 00:22:12.119 three in the morning. For three straight years, I woke 360 00:22:12.160 --> 00:22:13.960 up at three in the morning till sunrise. It was 361 00:22:14.000 --> 00:22:16.599 the only time I had to work without interruptions. And 362 00:22:16.640 --> 00:22:18.960 I wrote the book more, as I say, not the 363 00:22:19.000 --> 00:22:22.680 social responsibility to share the some of the information and 364 00:22:22.759 --> 00:22:25.839 the oral traditions. Because plants, they travel, but the oral 365 00:22:25.880 --> 00:22:28.920 tradition gets left behind, and that's the pinka. The pinta 366 00:22:29.000 --> 00:22:32.160 is like the spiritual cloud. That's why, like when the 367 00:22:32.240 --> 00:22:34.880 eye has harvested, you have to harvest it slowly and 368 00:22:34.920 --> 00:22:36.480 put it down. You can't throw it down so that 369 00:22:36.519 --> 00:22:40.160 the pinta doesn't get disturbed. The energetic essence that like 370 00:22:40.240 --> 00:22:43.400 engulfs the vine and that's easy to disperse. And so 371 00:22:43.440 --> 00:22:47.599 that's the one thing is alkaloid soup. Another thing is 372 00:22:48.079 --> 00:22:52.359 like an ecstatically charged sacred beverage. That's that is owned 373 00:22:52.440 --> 00:22:55.200 by the celestial divine immortals and we're just just for 374 00:22:55.200 --> 00:22:58.079 a little bit we can experience what the reality is like. 375 00:22:58.680 --> 00:23:03.440 And so that's the that's the purpose of the And 376 00:23:03.480 --> 00:23:05.000 so yeah, the hopefully of the book is to sort 377 00:23:05.000 --> 00:23:08.400 of kind of guide this ayahuasca or yahi bards that's 378 00:23:08.440 --> 00:23:11.920 floating the world over and guide it steered an auspicious 379 00:23:11.960 --> 00:23:15.440 directions so that the original intentions of this can be 380 00:23:15.519 --> 00:23:20.160 what prevails, which is as a medicine to heal all 381 00:23:20.279 --> 00:23:22.559 kinds of things. This can heal from physical elements like 382 00:23:22.640 --> 00:23:25.359 cancer to like CycL you know, to like you know, 383 00:23:25.400 --> 00:23:29.200 emotional things to help people find their life path. When 384 00:23:29.240 --> 00:23:32.599 it's so the proper intentions of the yahey in yahuasca 385 00:23:32.720 --> 00:23:36.319 are are positive to help make the world a better 386 00:23:36.359 --> 00:23:39.279 place and community on the personal, community and planetary level. 387 00:23:39.720 --> 00:23:43.359 But of course, up one of the International Irbal Symposiums 388 00:23:44.200 --> 00:23:46.759 two years ago, I was invited to give a talk 389 00:23:47.200 --> 00:23:49.920 precisely this topic, and so I thought about it quite 390 00:23:49.920 --> 00:23:51.359 a bit, and I came up with the with the 391 00:23:51.400 --> 00:23:53.799 title for the talk. It was called And there's a 392 00:23:53.839 --> 00:23:55.880 blog on my that we'll mention at the end of 393 00:23:55.920 --> 00:23:59.559 my website too, about this the delicate nature, right, the 394 00:23:59.599 --> 00:24:03.480 delicate nature of ayahuasca, and yeah, hey and so and so. 395 00:24:03.519 --> 00:24:06.000 I asked the question to a group of maybe fifty 396 00:24:06.119 --> 00:24:11.359 or sixty participants. I said, who here has seen has 397 00:24:11.400 --> 00:24:14.240 participated in yaousca ceremony? And almost everyone rose her hands. 398 00:24:14.559 --> 00:24:17.039 And I asked, how many people have seen the nyausca ceremony, 399 00:24:17.119 --> 00:24:21.079 go haywire, and like eighty percent of the you know 400 00:24:21.279 --> 00:24:23.039 the people rose your hand. And I've heard one too 401 00:24:23.079 --> 00:24:25.839