Speaker 1: Hey, this is Alisander Giuliani, doctor Emil Hamilton on Smallville
Speaker 1: and you are listening to Always hold on to Smallville. Enjoy.
Speaker 1: Welcome to Always hold On to Smallville. In this podcast,
Speaker 1: we talk about each and every episode of Young Superman Show.
Speaker 1: They were from two thousand and one to twenty eleven
Speaker 1: on the WB and the CW. I'm her host Sach Moore,
Speaker 1: and I'm joined by the hosts of the All Star
Speaker 1: super Fan podcast, Rob O'Connor, Hello, glad to be back,
Speaker 1: and Alan.
Speaker 2: Burke, glad to be back. Too great to see is ech.
Speaker 1: I don't think I've had you both on at the
Speaker 1: same time before.
Speaker 3: We did an episode of Always Held On to the
Speaker 3: Flash together. I think that's right.
Speaker 1: Was the Flash? It was the Flash, yes, But as
Speaker 1: far as Smallville goes, I think just for various scheduled
Speaker 1: reasons and whatnot, I had you both at the same
Speaker 1: time in the same place.
Speaker 3: So actually I'm supposed to be on the last episode
Speaker 3: I was on, and there was a last minute work
Speaker 3: thing or something, wasn't.
Speaker 1: There, Ellen, there was, that's right, Silver Ranchi episode. Yes,
Speaker 1: that was it. That was good, that was it, and
Speaker 1: yeah it was figured out. She wasn't even Irish though, Alan, so.
Speaker 2: She wasn't even Irish. That was a great episode. I
Speaker 2: enjoyed listen to it. Yeah, I got caught up work,
Speaker 2: I was, I was heartbroken. But yeah, no, that that
Speaker 2: was a great episod.
Speaker 1: I want to have you both on here in the
Speaker 1: final season of Smallville. Listen. I do a lot of podcasting.
Speaker 1: I listened to a lot of podcasts, and one of
Speaker 1: my favorite other Superman podcasts is y'all's podcasts, So I
Speaker 1: always enjoy whenever it drops in my feed. I'm like
Speaker 1: looking forward to these guys have to say. Also, your
Speaker 1: podcast is very long, much like mine, so it makes
Speaker 1: it feel good that other people talk for two and
Speaker 1: a half hours about.
Speaker 3: This nonsense, sometimes longer.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean for me. I mean for me. I'm
Speaker 1: talking about a forty five in episode for two hours,
Speaker 1: which is ridiculous, And you guys are at least talking
Speaker 1: about a lot of things over two and a half hours.
Speaker 1: So there you have it. But we're here in Smallville
Speaker 1: season ten. Rob let's start with you. Just do you
Speaker 1: ever think about Smallville season ten? But he doesn't even
Speaker 1: when you think of small Ovil season ten, what do
Speaker 1: you think of what are your thoughts of it?
Speaker 3: When I think of Smallville Season ten, I think of
Speaker 3: the ending, obviously, the final episode of the much discussed
Speaker 3: final episode, one of the most disclosed episodes of the
Speaker 3: of the whole series, I would wager, and one of
Speaker 3: the most screen grabbed episodes of the of the whole series,
Speaker 3: because it has the shirt ripping. I also think of
Speaker 3: the thriller jacket and how much I hate it. Yes,
Speaker 3: and I usually and I think it's something that's gonna
Speaker 3: come up tonight. I think of season ten as basically
Speaker 3: just a Superman show at that point, and that that
Speaker 3: would be probably my biggest issue with it. I was,
Speaker 3: by the way, fully back watching every single episode of
Speaker 3: the show as they were airing by this point, so
Speaker 3: I've seen this one at the time and probably not since,
Speaker 3: but I was I was fully back engaged in Smallville,
Speaker 3: having really enjoyed season nine, so this one was familiar
Speaker 3: to me when I watched it today. But those are
Speaker 3: usually for me. Actually, to answer your question, when I
Speaker 3: think of Smallville in general, I think it's like seasons one, two, three,
Speaker 3: and then season nine and ten. It's that chunk in
Speaker 3: the middle where I kind of just haven't really engaged
Speaker 3: it at all.
Speaker 1: Those middle five seasons, that middle half of the show. Yes, yeah,
Speaker 1: oh no, I hear you there. I mean obviously I
Speaker 1: was there the whole time, but other shows I've watched,
Speaker 1: I too have jumped on at the end, like, oh well,
Speaker 1: I got to see how this all turns out. So
Speaker 1: I'm going to tune into the last season, So sometimes
Speaker 1: the last episode, but sometimes the last season time allowing
Speaker 1: So I feel that. But alan about you Smavel season ten.
Speaker 1: Were you watching at the time or do you have
Speaker 1: any thoughts on when you hear the words Smovel season ten?
Speaker 1: Does that even conjure up a memory for you?
Speaker 2: It does? Similar to Rob, I had come back to
Speaker 2: watching it at that point. I had kind of phased
Speaker 2: out of it around season six, seven eight, Like Rob,
Speaker 2: that's kind of a blank to me. A lot of
Speaker 2: those episodespecial when we go back and watch them now.
Speaker 2: But I knowing that it was the final season and
Speaker 2: we're going to finally get a conclusion, I ventured back
Speaker 2: to small though, and for the most part, I really
Speaker 2: enjoyed it. Again. Like Rob said, the finale is the
Speaker 2: thing that sticks out in my mind, and how disappointed.
Speaker 2: I was with that for various reasons that I'm sure
Speaker 2: loads of people have spoken about it knowsium already.
Speaker 1: No, I don't know what you're talking about.
Speaker 2: I haven't revisited as I. As I said last night,
Speaker 2: I actually had to remove the plastic covering on my
Speaker 2: Season ten DVD, which I purchased at the time in
Speaker 2: twenty eleven, twenty twelve, whenever that came out, because I
Speaker 2: bought the single seasons as they as they came out,
Speaker 2: even the ones I hadn't been keeping up with. When
Speaker 2: I saw them in a Golden discs or whatever, I'd
Speaker 2: go in and pick them up so i'd have n't
Speaker 2: a hand. And yeah, it's really just the finale. Like
Speaker 2: Rob said again, by that stage, it's the Superman show.
Speaker 2: I had forgotten really how much of a Superman show
Speaker 2: it had become at that time. I loved the Turler jacket.
Speaker 2: I have to say, probably the unpopular opinion, but in
Speaker 2: this episode I was struck by the end how good
Speaker 2: Clark looked in in the Turler jacket and how Superman
Speaker 2: like he looked. But yeah, no, I have to say, yeah,
Speaker 2: I was. I enjoyed the experience of watching the episode.
Speaker 2: I watched it twice, watched on DVD last night, I
Speaker 2: watched an Amazon Prime earlier on today, and yeah, I
Speaker 2: enjoyed it.
Speaker 3: I should stress, by the way, the reason I hate
Speaker 3: the trailer jacket is less to do with the local
Speaker 3: the jacket, which it does kind of look cool like
Speaker 3: it's and it's a fun thing you can wear conventions
Speaker 3: and stuff. I don't have a huge issue with that.
Speaker 3: It's more just.
Speaker 4: The idea of it.
Speaker 3: Like, once he puts on that jacket, he is basically Superman.
Speaker 3: So what's the point of the show.
Speaker 1: Then? Yeah, you know, no, I I have seen many
Speaker 1: a jacket like that at a convention. It's it's a
Speaker 1: great item. People love it. I I don't think i'd
Speaker 1: ever get with myself, but I understand the appeal. And
Speaker 1: you know, I have a I've said on calling it
Speaker 1: the monogram jacket because lowest cause of that in an episode,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, there you go. If anyone says anything
Speaker 1: on screen, I can latch onto. I'm like, that's what
Speaker 1: we called it. I was calling the biker jacket before
Speaker 1: I'm going with monogram jacket. We you know, just to
Speaker 1: get ahead of everything. It does appear in this episode,
Speaker 1: we do have a plus one for it. So, but
Speaker 1: one of my curiosities of tracking this is we're you know,
Speaker 1: we're eleven episodes in eleven, We're halfway through the season.
Speaker 1: This is this is the mid season of this exciting,
Speaker 1: this is the midseason value. Someone argued the previous episode
Speaker 1: there should have been the mid season finale, much stronger episode,
Speaker 1: much stronger ending. But but eleven episodes in y'all, we've
Speaker 1: introduced a new costume for Clark for him to wear
Speaker 1: right for season ten. How many episodes do you think
Speaker 1: he wears this, including this one.
Speaker 3: I knew you were gonna say yes, Oh I yeah,
Speaker 3: I'd say it. And there's a reason I'm asking this,
Speaker 3: I'd say it's not that many times. Yeah, Like I
Speaker 3: there was even scenes in this episode where I was like,
Speaker 3: why is he not wearing his uniform? You know, like,
Speaker 3: and I remember thinking that at the time, And I
Speaker 3: remember thinking about the trench coat in season nine as well,
Speaker 3: that there was a lot of times where it was like,
Speaker 3: he should be in his superhero suit right now and
Speaker 3: he isn't. So I would wager he wears it six times.
Speaker 2: Okay, I'm going to say.
Speaker 1: Twelve okay, well, well hold on, are we guessing the
Speaker 1: whole season?
Speaker 2: Now?
Speaker 1: Are we guessing just the first half?
Speaker 2: Oh? Sorry, the whole season? I was guessing.
Speaker 1: No, no, no, yeah, yeah no this half half?
Speaker 3: We half this half, i'd say four.
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, i'd say six.
Speaker 1: Well five, so you're if you add your score as
Speaker 1: a team, you win. You're correct. We're we're five. And
Speaker 1: half of those has just been him standing around. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because like the episode he premieres ind it in he
Speaker 1: walks out on top of the Deli Planet, stands in
Speaker 1: from the American flag. It's a great image, right.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 1: Then we see it next he's at his father's grave
Speaker 1: talking to him. I would question why he would visit
Speaker 1: Jonathan Kent's grave in his superhero costume, but that's, you know,
Speaker 1: neither here nor there. He does wear it for a
Speaker 1: little bit of superhero activity a couple of times, and
Speaker 1: then he wears it here again, just like at a funeral.
Speaker 1: So it's like, dude, like, what do you if no
Speaker 1: one can see you anyway, why does it matter? I
Speaker 1: think it's kind of Rob's point as well, So no,
Speaker 1: I yeah, with the record, I'm more aligned with Robin,
Speaker 1: like I don't like kind of the concept of what
Speaker 1: it is more so than like visually it's cool, it's
Speaker 1: cool jacket out and absolutely so.
Speaker 2: So I just never I just I don't think I
Speaker 2: ever really connected with the black long jacket because it
Speaker 2: always just felt me even at the time that it
Speaker 2: was very kind of matrix y and Bled doesn't love
Speaker 2: the matrix. But it's not Superman.
Speaker 3: But he's not Superman. That's the whole point, Like he's
Speaker 3: on a journey to become Superman, and the whole point
Speaker 3: of this season as well is he has to overcome
Speaker 3: the darkness, and that's the darkness within him as well.
Speaker 3: And by putting on his jacket at the start of
Speaker 3: the season, it's like, well then that makes the whole
Speaker 3: character arc of the season irrelevant anyway. So it's like
Speaker 3: it would have made.
Speaker 2: One of those I'm sure we're all in one of
Speaker 2: those black men the jacket paces like when we're teenagers.
Speaker 2: I find out, I know what I did.
Speaker 3: I Actually, the more I think about it, the more
Speaker 3: I wish he had worn the black trench cout all
Speaker 3: the way up until the end of season ten, where
Speaker 3: right fully banishes that look and then becomes Superman. Because
Speaker 3: it's such a contrast, whereas this kind of half measure
Speaker 3: it just never never made sense to me.
Speaker 1: You don't need multiple transitional costumes, as my what I'm thinking.
Speaker 1: And also if you look at the season t in
Speaker 1: opening credits that black jackets all over it trench call
Speaker 1: here there, you would never know that he did have
Speaker 1: a different costumes. Anyway, I just since you Broth brought
Speaker 1: it up, I wanted to address it. Now. We don't
Speaker 1: talk about any further real quick before a jump into within.
Speaker 1: Just as Society characters, they're all over this episode. We
Speaker 1: get some hawk Man, we get some star Girl, we
Speaker 1: get some wet green Arrows. The main character now, so
Speaker 1: it's not a special to have him around, But thoughts
Speaker 1: on these characters, I mean, it was exciting. This is
Speaker 1: the first I mean, look, if we don't count the
Speaker 1: Legend of the Superheroes with Adam Westburt Ward and Frank
Speaker 1: Or Yes, we know there was a guy dressed up
Speaker 1: like Hawkman in that. Okay, yes I know that. Moving
Speaker 1: on from that, this is your first live action representation
Speaker 1: of these characters. So that's exciting, and I don't know,
Speaker 1: I kind of go back and forth with how like well,
Speaker 1: they were done here, at least visually, Like, what do
Speaker 1: you guys thoughts on these characters.
Speaker 2: I liked them. I always kind of felt that they
Speaker 2: seemed a little bit kind of cheap, which is fine. Look,
Speaker 2: it's it's of its time and it's of its era,
Speaker 2: and you know, they have whatever budget they had and stuff.
Speaker 2: I always but I always kind of felt that even
Speaker 2: at the time. I remember seeing the trailer for the
Speaker 2: Doctor Fate episode I think was or the Justice Slide episode,
Speaker 2: have been super excited for that and liking that, and
Speaker 2: then going back last night and again today, I was
Speaker 2: surprised to see the different I forgot that there was
Speaker 2: a Stargirl in us who was not the subsequent Stargirl
Speaker 2: and who doesn't like, Yeah, what is Michael Michael Shanks?
Speaker 1: Is this the guy from Stargate Q, Starget se Sequest.
Speaker 2: Yes, that just dates me right there.
Speaker 1: The captain from Sequest twenty thirty is Lois's dad, Micha Ironside.
Speaker 2: So yes, and but yeah, I enjoyed him. I enjoyed
Speaker 2: Michael Shanks in this episode. I enjoyed the conclusion, which
Speaker 2: we'll talk about in a bit. And I'm a big
Speaker 2: fan of this Oliver Queen. I think Justin Hartley does
Speaker 2: a great job as Oliver Queen. I like him throughout
Speaker 2: the entire series. I think I prefer him to Stephen
Speaker 2: Amill to be honest myself, but then I didn't really
Speaker 2: I didn't really stick with that show, I have to
Speaker 2: be honest. I really enjoyed him and Small that I
Speaker 2: liked him when he turned up, So yeah, it comes
Speaker 2: up from me.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't have much said to that. I think
Speaker 3: they really do highlight how different the show it is now,
Speaker 3: because you would never dream of seeing so many like
Speaker 3: explicitly comic booky characters in the earlier seasons of Small,
Speaker 3: butl you just it just wouldn't even work with the
Speaker 3: aesthetic of the show at that point, so it's it's
Speaker 3: just so so different. I think Hawkman is pretty great.
Speaker 3: I mean, it's hard to get that helmet right, and
Speaker 3: I don't know if it's possible to ever get it
Speaker 3: quite right without it looking silly. But I think they
Speaker 3: do a really really good job, and the the wing
Speaker 3: effects is pretty impressive for a TV show. If you
Speaker 3: had told me that Stargirl was in more than one
Speaker 3: episode of this, I would have told you I would
Speaker 3: have said you were a liar im being like a
Speaker 3: character so so prominent, the character that she goes to
Speaker 3: Clark and Lows's engagement party, and I was like, how's
Speaker 3: this other character here? Like you know, but yeah, no,
Speaker 3: I think they did a good job. But again, it
Speaker 3: just comes back to the problem of like when when
Speaker 3: Clark is in the scenes with the other Justice Society
Speaker 3: and Justice League characters, he's basically just Superman, Like there's
Speaker 3: no he doesn't feel like the upstart who still has
Speaker 3: to go on a journey anymore. He just feels like
Speaker 3: the hero. So it just there's this really weird clash
Speaker 3: for me in these later episodes where some episodes are
Speaker 3: about Clark's journey to becoming Superman, and then other episodes
Speaker 3: it just feels like he already is Superman but they
Speaker 3: can't call him that yet, and they they are a
Speaker 3: big part of this whole v R A storyline at
Speaker 3: the top of season ten, it really just feels like
Speaker 3: a Superman storyline. It doesn't feel like it has any
Speaker 3: bearing on Clark becoming to him anyway. But no, yeah,
Speaker 3: I really like, really like Michael Shanks, think he's great,
Speaker 3: and I remember doctor Fate being cool. Was he just
Speaker 3: season nine doctor Fan and.
Speaker 1: He died in an absolute justice Yeah, it's just so
Speaker 1: he's not coming back.
Speaker 2: I had. I had a senior moment last night when
Speaker 2: I was watching it and I was like, when did
Speaker 2: he When did the recast like Katie Cassidy in this
Speaker 2: And I was like, I don't remember that happening. And
Speaker 2: then I turned it off and I literally woke up
Speaker 2: this morning and the first thing that came into my
Speaker 2: mind was, that's a different universe. Different universe.
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, Elena Huffin's black Canary doesnt appear. She she would,
Speaker 1: you know, she was in some Stargate shows as well
Speaker 1: as well as I understand her, so she's she was
Speaker 1: a more available Canadian actress as I as I understand it,
Speaker 1: so she would pop up more often than some of
Speaker 1: the other Justice League cast members, like she was in
Speaker 1: the beginning of season eight, and she she shows up
Speaker 1: a couple more times in season ten, so she was
Speaker 1: she was available, and whenever they do a conference calls,
Speaker 1: she's on the screen and sudden sometimes she shows up
Speaker 1: in person. So Elena Huffman, I feel like I I
Speaker 1: think I called her Eleana Huffman for like several years
Speaker 1: on this podcast, so she had a lot of l's
Speaker 1: and a's, and I is in her name, so I
Speaker 1: apologize for saying her name wrong, but yes, she's she's
Speaker 1: here as well as Black Canary is one of the
Speaker 1: you know, I one of my hopes for the DCU,
Speaker 1: if it goes somewhere, is we have Green Arrow and
Speaker 1: Black Canary and they're like a couple and like their
Speaker 1: h their comic book accurate, because that's something we've yet
Speaker 1: to see.
Speaker 3: Then, Yeah, when I saw her, I had forgotten that
Speaker 3: there was a black Canary in this, and then I
Speaker 3: suddenly remembered, Oh god, this is where the like eye
Speaker 3: makeup instead of a mask thing that was in Narrow
Speaker 3: Season one came from imagine how long that takes. I'd
Speaker 3: forgotten that they do that in Narrow Season one. Was like,
Speaker 3: oh god, that was so bad.
Speaker 1: Small Bull is the blooprint everyone, But let's get into it. Then, Icarus.
Speaker 5: I've seen this level of hatred before humanity's darkest hours.
Speaker 5: Every time it looked like the world would be consumed
Speaker 5: by hatred and darkness, another force arose to send the
Speaker 5: darkness back.
Speaker 2: Well, this time it's us and we need to start
Speaker 2: by stalking.
Speaker 6: Slate Smallville All new episode this Friday at eight seventh Central.
Speaker 1: Icarus is the eleventh episode of Smallville's tenth season. It
Speaker 1: turned on December tenth, twenty ten. Was written by Jenneity
Speaker 1: Sparling and directed by Marzy Almus. Ratings watch, guys are
Speaker 1: playing the game where you guess what the ratings were
Speaker 1: for this episode back in twenty ten. Uh. To give
Speaker 1: you a little context, the previous week, the episode Luther
Speaker 1: got two point seven to six million, and then way
Speaker 1: back in the season premiere Lazarus in September twenty ten,
Speaker 1: that episode got two point nine to eight million. So
Speaker 1: those are the numbers we're working with again, two point
Speaker 1: nine eight for this season premiere and then two point
Speaker 1: seven to six for the previous episode. So with those
Speaker 1: numbers in mind, Alan, let's start with you. What do
Speaker 1: you think this episode got on a Friday night on
Speaker 1: the CW back in twenty ten?
Speaker 2: Two point five?
Speaker 3: All right, Rob, I'm gonna say mid season finale. They
Speaker 3: were probably pushing the proposal in a big way in
Speaker 3: the promos, so I'm gonna say this was probably a hi.
Speaker 4: This is probably two point nine, all.
Speaker 1: Right, two point five to five.
Speaker 3: WHOA, well, don't allen, I'm my dance you got.
Speaker 1: You guys are on these I'm throwing out these gay games.
Speaker 1: If you guys are guessing, great man, you guys are
Speaker 1: great games. And I think, no, your your logic does
Speaker 1: make sense, Rob, But this is like the middle of December.
Speaker 1: People are on college break, they're on vacation. This is
Speaker 1: pretty late. I mean small Though rarely went this deep
Speaker 1: into December. Sometimes they would have like one episode in
Speaker 1: December and that was it. To have eleven episodes before
Speaker 1: the mid season finale, like or before the hiatus, that's
Speaker 1: a lot. Usually it was like nine or ten max. So,
Speaker 1: but you know what, it's the final season, so readings
Speaker 1: don't matter. They were gonna get. They're gonna get the
Speaker 1: whole season anyway. They were renewed, and here we go
Speaker 1: so famously Lois and Clark the show the Proposal, Right,
Speaker 1: it's a big moment for the Lows and Clark through
Speaker 1: Adventures super Man. The TV show Smallville does it here.
Speaker 1: Every show requires its own, you know, approach to this
Speaker 1: sort of thing. I think it's never did I think
Speaker 1: watching Smallville back in two thousand and one in high
Speaker 1: school like, this show will end with Clark Kent proposing
Speaker 1: to less Lane. They'll be all the way. So all
Speaker 1: that aside, I mean, I know you guys respond well
Speaker 1: to the romantic angle of it. That's why you like
Speaker 1: Lowis and Clark's watch. But this whole scene here right,
Speaker 1: Clark's on the street, Lois Is are on a lay.
Speaker 1: They have some cute talk. He's trying to get her
Speaker 1: this nice dinner, but she's like, man, let's just go home.
Speaker 1: He's like, you know, you're a hard person. Ask a
Speaker 1: simple question. You like, I think the set up here
Speaker 1: is very beautiful. He spreads these rose petals everywhere. So yeah,
Speaker 1: what did you guys make of this? You know, this
Speaker 1: is really, I mean, a very important scene of the
Speaker 1: characters' lives here, Clark proposing Lowis. What are you guys thoughts?
Speaker 2: I thought lows and c acted it better. I remember
Speaker 2: that day, well, that summer's afternoon, watching that Cliffhanger episode
Speaker 2: and being, oh my god, I had to wait three
Speaker 2: months for the conclusion, or six months even maybe it
Speaker 2: was nice. I thought it was really overly sentimental. It was.
Speaker 2: It was very kind of old Mark channelish. I thought
Speaker 2: it was really like the music in the background I
Speaker 2: found really distracting throughout the entire scene. And they're both
Speaker 2: on fire. Eric Durantz is superb blow us as always.
Speaker 2: Clark Tom wedding was a great Clark Kent and it
Speaker 2: was nice. It was romantic, and you know, we have
Speaker 2: the rose pedals and you have everything that goes down,
Speaker 2: and it kind of reminded me of a little bit
Speaker 2: of that Adam Allinger comic book that supermindos one where
Speaker 2: they can't kind of get a date to work out
Speaker 2: because stuff's going on or whatever. But yeah, for me
Speaker 2: and I am a bit of a romantic and I
Speaker 2: loved all that about Los and Clark and stuff. It
Speaker 2: felt a little bit too sentimental and a bit too
Speaker 2: homemark for me, but I still enjoyed it.
Speaker 1: Fair. What about you, Rob, I mostly agree with that.
Speaker 3: It's interesting that you brought up the music. I actually
Speaker 3: had a similar thought. And Mark Snow is long gone
Speaker 3: now it's it's Louis Louis feb Febre.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I always do God bless them, but I do notice
Speaker 3: when Mark Snow leaves and the other guy comes in.
Speaker 3: The scores were never sorry not to offend the composer,
Speaker 3: but I just never thought the composers the scores were strong.
Speaker 3: I don't think it's as well done on Low and Clark.
Speaker 3: I think it's nice. I think it's it's sweet that
Speaker 3: the pedals is a really nice little Superman touch, and
Speaker 3: they do it practically and it's slowly and I'm thinking
Speaker 3: I remember thinking, oh, they probably only got one chance
Speaker 3: to do that, or they'd have to clean it.
Speaker 1: I was impressed by Again, practically there wasn't much a cgi.
Speaker 1: I was impressed by that.
Speaker 3: I thought it was odd putting it at the top
Speaker 3: of the episode. It was like it was this big
Speaker 3: emotional high and then everything else after the episode just
Speaker 3: kind of came down from that a bit. It feels
Speaker 3: like something you should put at the end of an episode.
Speaker 3: And I was trying to remember. I was like, I
Speaker 3: don't even remember this the first watching the show first
Speaker 3: time round. And the iconic romantic scene I remember from
Speaker 3: these latter seasons is when he tells her that he's
Speaker 3: the Blur and she like jumps on top of him
Speaker 3: and starts kissing him, and then they kind of I
Speaker 3: think they dance in the barn at the end and
Speaker 3: he kind of floats and it's like, I really.
Speaker 1: Those are real. Those are two different ending scenes from
Speaker 1: the from the fourth and fifth episode. Okay, so some
Speaker 1: might argue they should have combined those, yeah, but I
Speaker 1: would agree, like those are some emotional high notes there. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you know, maybe maybe combining all these things together
Speaker 1: might have been the best. But that's the question to post,
Speaker 1: you guess, because yes, we've seen Lewis and Clark in
Speaker 1: their relationships and all these different versions, right, really do
Speaker 1: we get to the point where like they are gonna
Speaker 1: you know, get engaged and get married, like, you know,
Speaker 1: we didn't see that in a lot of the shows,
Speaker 1: but now we're in kind of that era where that happens.
Speaker 1: That's great, right, So these two they've known each other
Speaker 1: since the fourth season, they've been dating on and off. Well,
Speaker 1: they liked each other romantically in the eighth season, they
Speaker 1: were dating in the ninth season, and now here we
Speaker 1: are in the tenth season, they're just oh, okay, we're
Speaker 1: getting married, like, you know, not saying you need to
Speaker 1: wait forever, but I'm like, it's kind of quick, right,
Speaker 1: I don't.
Speaker 2: Know, to be fair, Lewis and Clark dated for like
Speaker 2: two weeks, you.
Speaker 1: Know, that's yeah, that's before the question she was taking
Speaker 1: out with that what's his name, Dan Scardina that's yes.
Speaker 3: Yeah, like the week before right, another point that was
Speaker 3: gonna make I'm sorry, I feel like I do this
Speaker 3: every time I'm on your show. I also don't think
Speaker 3: Tom Welling is as good that the romantic stuff as
Speaker 3: other Superman actors have been. And he looks a little
Speaker 3: bit uncomfortable in this scene for me when he's like
Speaker 3: when he's doing his big proposal speech, I just don't
Speaker 3: see the same kind of.
Speaker 1: Wouldn't she be uncomfortable if you were in that position.
Speaker 3: There? But like a charming way, just just it in
Speaker 3: like a fact way.
Speaker 1: I actually I do undertotally see what you're saying, because
Speaker 1: I think that most of the time on the show.
Speaker 1: I think when Tom and Eric are together, they kind
Speaker 1: of there's a certain energy that she that she brings
Speaker 1: out of him, which is very charming and romantic in
Speaker 1: all the sou because he has a lot of wheelhouses, right,
Speaker 1: I mean, I think when he's the villain, when he's
Speaker 1: a bad guy, excellent, When he is like that older
Speaker 1: brother right to like a kid on the show, excellent,
Speaker 1: And then when he's like doing romantic stuff with Lewis excellent, right,
Speaker 1: I do see what you're saying here, Rob, It's not
Speaker 1: quite as charming as I would have liked it, you know.
Speaker 1: I think the stuff leading up to it is when
Speaker 1: he's like walking across the street and maybe a little
Speaker 1: flatter than I would have liked sort of thing. And
Speaker 1: maybe it's because they'll have one take. Maybe that was
Speaker 1: t you guys point with all the rose petals, like Tom,
Speaker 1: you gotta nail this at the first take, zooming out
Speaker 1: my bigger Superman question, y'all. Is because it's a different
Speaker 1: approach here, uh here from when like Lows and Clark was.
Speaker 1: But here she knows that he is the blur that
Speaker 1: he Suberman, she knows his secrets. They know everything about each.
Speaker 4: Other at this point.
Speaker 1: And then hey, now that we know everything, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: ask you to marry me. And I I think that's
Speaker 1: probably the better approach than like. But but I do
Speaker 1: understand on Lols and Clark that he wants Clark on
Speaker 1: that show, wants Lowis to love him for just being Clark,
Speaker 1: not Superman. At the same point, it's like, dude, like,
Speaker 1: shouldn't you tell somebody this before? Like that's kind of
Speaker 1: a I don't know, like because in the comic books
Speaker 1: it was kind of at the same time, right, he
Speaker 1: reveals he's Superman. It's that famous comic image he's ripping
Speaker 1: over with the shirt and it's like, will you marry me?
Speaker 1: And Lois is like, oh, right, that's so it's simultaneously
Speaker 1: and Lolis and Clark like, dude, are you gonna tell
Speaker 1: her you're Superman at some point? And so what what
Speaker 1: are your thoughts on her knowing the secret or not knowing?
Speaker 1: Why didn't he proposes?
Speaker 2: It's the much better is Like I said, I love
Speaker 2: Loews and Clark and go up with a huge nostalgia
Speaker 2: factor to me. But that's an issue Lois. Whether she's
Speaker 2: told by Clark, which I prefer that he tells her
Speaker 2: rather than her figuring it out, well, you know what,
Speaker 2: that's not technique true. I do like the fact that
Speaker 2: she's smart enough to figure it out, but she should
Speaker 2: know by the time that he's popping the question. As
Speaker 2: a huge issue I have with the Loews and Clark season. Now,
Speaker 2: technically Lois did know when Clark proposed, but he didn't
Speaker 2: know that she knew because she only knew for about
Speaker 2: twelve minutes. So but yeah, no, I think, you know,
Speaker 2: if you were this kind of bastion for honesty and
Speaker 2: hope and truthfulness and all those kind of things, you know,
Speaker 2: you can't hide fifty percent of who you are, have
Speaker 2: this massive secret in your life and then not share
Speaker 2: with the person that you're you're asking to spend the
Speaker 2: rest of your life with. So when it comes to that,
Speaker 2: I absolutely prefer this take.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm conflicted on it because on the one hand,
Speaker 3: I think him not telling her is narratively more interesting
Speaker 3: and it leads to better conflict and it it's an
Speaker 3: issue then that they have to work through and he
Speaker 3: has to become a better person by by working through it.
Speaker 3: But it's deeply it's deeply problematic, you know, you know,
Speaker 3: And it's just the classic problem with the whole Clark
Speaker 3: Kent secret identity thing.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 3: It's just it's difficult to tell those kinds of stories
Speaker 3: in the modern kind of landscape we live in where,
Speaker 3: you know. So I think in that sense, I think
Speaker 3: Smallville was wise to sort of steer away from it.
Speaker 3: And I do really like going back to the scene
Speaker 3: I was talking about before that that scene where he
Speaker 3: tells her that he's the blur, and she just embraces him,
Speaker 3: and she's like, yes, you know that this means that
Speaker 3: we can really be together and we can bring the
Speaker 3: relationship to next level now because I was waiting for
Speaker 3: you to trust me too with your secret, and now
Speaker 3: you have. And I just thought that was a really
Speaker 3: sweet inversion of what we're usually seeing in these Superman stories,
Speaker 3: where she'll find out and sort of attack him with
Speaker 3: this information that he didn't share with her, or he'll
Speaker 3: just tell her like which they did in Superman and
Speaker 3: Lowis and they did in the comics and stuff. I
Speaker 3: think there needs to be a bit of a there
Speaker 3: need they need to play it a little bit. But yeah,
Speaker 3: I think the problem with her knowing is the heat
Speaker 3: kind of leaves then the marriage proposal because of course
Speaker 3: he's gonna say yes, you know right. Yeah, So it
Speaker 3: is it's a tricky one. I don't I don't know
Speaker 3: how best to handle it, but I am. I like
Speaker 3: what they did in Elson Clark, and I quite like
Speaker 3: what they did here as well.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I like there a lot of variationship because it
Speaker 1: is a complicated situation, as you all said, like it's like, well,
Speaker 1: I've been lying to you every day for two years?
Speaker 1: Will you marry me? I'm like, well, let's we need
Speaker 1: to we need to talk about some things here before.
Speaker 3: Actually, last thing I'll say is I actually.
Speaker 4: Don't like how they did it in the comics.
Speaker 3: I think that was just sort of like he doesn't
Speaker 3: tell her a secret, and then he proposes, and then
Speaker 3: he kind of just tells her a secret a little
Speaker 3: while later and she's fine with it, and then they
Speaker 3: you know, it's not as it's not as.
Speaker 4: Kind of interesting the way they do it there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I do have in my notes here, I
Speaker 1: do have the lions that the lions that took out
Speaker 1: to me most were like, you don't make it easy
Speaker 1: to ask a simple question, but that's what makes sure
Speaker 1: you And I thought that was adorable and that's that's
Speaker 1: so true to them and it's a beautiful moment. And
Speaker 1: I get your hallmark comments there, Alan, you know, but
Speaker 1: your wilds made very that that was the space we're
Speaker 1: existing in here, But yes, it is.
Speaker 2: The hallmark was just more about the kind of the
Speaker 2: overall feel of it. I thought I kind of just
Speaker 2: felt like it was that over sentimentality kind of stuff.
Speaker 2: But no, that's that was That was a great line.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and uh on the empty streets of the seasons
Speaker 1: in Metropolis because there's no budget, there's no no extras,
Speaker 1: there's no one but you know, the middle of the night.
Speaker 1: And yeah, but she says yes, and that's a great moment,
Speaker 1: and we we've had out and then we go to
Speaker 1: the opening credits, and now she's gonna be they're gonna
Speaker 1: little did we know? We're heading towards the wedding for
Speaker 1: the for the series finale.
Speaker 4: Of Ever Become Superman.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's the thing, right, I mean, that's a conversation
Speaker 1: for another episode. But yeah, not only do we spend
Speaker 1: an exorbitant amount of time on a wedding at the
Speaker 1: series finalite, they actually don't get married.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I just spent all that time. So oh man. So
Speaker 1: we go to the opening credits. We come back with
Speaker 1: the Daily Planet. You know they've established so there's like
Speaker 1: a borderline martial law going on a metropolis right now,
Speaker 1: there's these curfews, right, people getting checked in in the
Speaker 1: Daily Planet and scan Right. What's cute though, is because
Speaker 1: you know, well it just got engaged. She has this
Speaker 1: engageing rate and she wants people to notice it, and
Speaker 1: no one is noticing it, like just going through the courage.
Speaker 1: She's like, oh, I forgot to take this off. Hope
Speaker 1: it doesn't make the thing go off like next nobody
Speaker 1: cares like it's pretty cute.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I also was.
Speaker 1: Nice Cat Grant. I get you, guys. This is a
Speaker 1: great episode for you guys to be on being so
Speaker 1: Lewis and Clark is in your DNA. You're a Superman fandom, right,
Speaker 1: Cat Grant on small though? I gotta say not not
Speaker 1: not a big fan of Cat Grant. What are your thoughts, y'all?
Speaker 3: Which one?
Speaker 1: Well, everybody loves the first Cat Grant because it was
Speaker 1: it was a one off name they used in season
Speaker 1: nine and she was gonna be a TV show host,
Speaker 1: And I don't know if they ever thought about reincorporating
Speaker 1: her if they want to start from scratch with a character.
Speaker 1: What's so interesting is I had forgotten this rewatching season
Speaker 1: two doing the podcast. This Krant's name isn't even her name,
Speaker 1: like she has she has another name. She was like
Speaker 1: hiding from, like her her ex husband, like to protect
Speaker 1: her son and all this. I was like, oh, well,
Speaker 1: you're really not Cat Grant then, So that's that's interesting.
Speaker 1: But all I have to say, like I am a
Speaker 1: big supporter, as I know you guys are too of
Speaker 1: like expand the Daily Planet cast and having other characters
Speaker 1: around and people bounce off of, and I'm like, this,
Speaker 1: ain't it though, the same thing? This is what I
Speaker 1: was thinking.
Speaker 3: Honestly, I don't mind this character. I thought it was
Speaker 3: it was a nice little spin, making her kind of
Speaker 3: this conservative, you know, and busy body like that. I
Speaker 3: like the bit where she hanslawis a sniakerdoodle. Yeah, And like,
Speaker 3: you know, they take a lot of stuff from the
Speaker 3: comics here with her son and being on their own
Speaker 3: from an abusive husband or whatever. That that that's from
Speaker 3: the comics as well, So I kind of like that.
Speaker 3: I just think it's wild that they had a different
Speaker 3: Cat Krant last year, completely different character, and now they
Speaker 3: brought her back already. That that's the bit I can
Speaker 3: never get my head around. I don't mind her. I
Speaker 3: think a lot of people forget that the the way
Speaker 3: they did the Tracy Scoggins version on the On the
Speaker 3: Loss of Clark show that was exclusive to that show
Speaker 3: at the time, Like she wasn't this kind of like
Speaker 3: sexually charged character like that. In the comics, she was
Speaker 3: kind of just another romantic foil for Clark, and she
Speaker 3: was another go getter reporter, and she was a single
Speaker 3: mother and all that kind of stuff. That the whole.
Speaker 2: They sexualized her in the art though, didn't they didn't
Speaker 2: they sexualize her kind of She had big.
Speaker 3: Blonde hair, and I think she had other nice features,
Speaker 3: but I not not to the extent that she was like.
Speaker 3: It was only in Jeff John's kind of comics in
Speaker 3: the in the mid two thousands that they made her
Speaker 3: explicitly more like the Tracy Scoggin's version, and they gave
Speaker 3: her breast and plants and all this sort of stuff.
Speaker 3: And then and they did this weird joke where I
Speaker 3: think Supergirl is like, what's wrong with that woman? There's
Speaker 3: there's all this silicone her.
Speaker 1: It's really weird.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 3: I don't I don't have any huge issue, but there
Speaker 3: was a nice, interesting little twist to make her this way. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I found her super annoying, and she kind of struck
Speaker 2: me as the kind of person who would have, you know,
Speaker 2: ratted out and Frank for hiding in the attic. You know,
Speaker 2: she's she's that kind of a character. And I when
Speaker 2: she came back and I was like, oh, yeah, I
Speaker 2: forgot about this this cat Grand. But look, she has
Speaker 2: a little redemption later on in the episode where you know,
Speaker 2: she she has the opportunity to really throw those under
Speaker 2: the bus and she doesn't. And you know, I like
Speaker 2: that that was brought about and how Lois kind of
Speaker 2: brings that about by you know, explained to her that
Speaker 2: she's been saved a few times without her.
Speaker 7: Evennoying it or whatever. But overall, she she does great
Speaker 7: on me, like she wouldn't be. She wouldn't be my
Speaker 7: favorite live action duration by a long shot. And hashtag
Speaker 7: justice for Tracy's Coggins. Whatever happened to that cat Grand,
Speaker 7: We'll never know.
Speaker 1: I'll never know.
Speaker 2: We'll never know.
Speaker 1: We'll never know. When they come out with Loewis and
Speaker 1: Clark ninety three comic book, we might find.
Speaker 2: Out what happened with Tracy's You'll be waiting for that.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I you know, her function is to be
Speaker 1: an annoyance, and I get there. But there's a way
Speaker 1: to have characters like that and then to kind of
Speaker 1: but you enjoy them being an annoyance and versus they
Speaker 1: annoy you being an annoyance, and that's kind of where
Speaker 1: I am with the character. But uh so she comes
Speaker 1: in the other they have something. They have some talk here.
Speaker 1: But you know what, y'all, I almost forgot we have
Speaker 1: we have a note is Lois Lane? Is this Lewis?
Speaker 1: They say, you never know what fate has in store
Speaker 1: for us, but I say, you can see some happy
Speaker 1: innings coming from a mile away, and like, who could
Speaker 1: it be? Who could be from? And we have a
Speaker 1: flash to Chloe, who I've forgotten about honestly on this show.
Speaker 1: I had to look this up. I was like, I wonder,
Speaker 1: is this a scene that they just didn't use before
Speaker 1: or did is this one of Allison Mack's appearances this season?
Speaker 1: And no, y'all, this is a scene they actually shot
Speaker 1: for Lazarus the season premiere, and they left it on
Speaker 1: the cutter room floor. And that's why Alison Mack is
Speaker 1: uncredited for this appearance because she's not in the opening credits.
Speaker 1: All the other episodes that she appears in, she's in
Speaker 1: the opening credits, and when she's on the episode, she's
Speaker 1: not in the opening credit.
Speaker 2: So is there a significance to the the chain that
Speaker 2: she gets with the letter that I missed her.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have no idea.
Speaker 2: Did that come back? I just found very odd.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm maybe I need to turn my
Speaker 1: smum lil fan card. But that's a very valid question
Speaker 1: I have to answer for you. They have There's not like,
Speaker 1: oh oh yeah, it's our thing or no, you didn't
Speaker 1: have a thing. You were just cousbands who lived together
Speaker 1: sometimes in the talent apartment. Because I thought to myself, like,
Speaker 1: did they film this for this episode? But then no,
Speaker 1: because the talent got blown up a couple episodes ago,
Speaker 1: so they potentially didn't have this set anymore as far
Speaker 1: as the apartment goes. So it's it seemed it's so
Speaker 1: funny because it seems like something they would film and say, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: this happened back then. You guys just didn't see it.
Speaker 1: But it literally is something that happened. We didn't see it.
Speaker 1: So and the talk about Fate is because then you
Speaker 1: mentioned doctor Fate. She put on the doctor Fate helmet
Speaker 1: at the beginning of the season too to find Alliver
Speaker 1: Queen because he'd been kidnapped, and so that's why she
Speaker 1: has seen the future. She literally has seen the future.
Speaker 1: So that's why was like, oh, it's I swear. Chloe
Speaker 1: is like sometimes you can see the future. So getting
Speaker 1: back to can't grant test. Mercer comes in right starts
Speaker 1: talking to Lois. Hey, Leis, congratulations, hope that doesn't interfere
Speaker 1: with your duties here at the office, and and then
Speaker 1: she kind of shows kat Ran away, which is amusing.
Speaker 1: She's like, none of which concern you. She leaves, and hey,
Speaker 1: they're gonna do a REDNA scan at the Watchtower tonight,
Speaker 1: y'all everybody be there and I'm root to REDNA scan
Speaker 1: up in security, Like okay, cool. Because she speaking of Chloe,
Speaker 1: tests has become Chloe. Now she's running watch Tower. She's
Speaker 1: the computer person.
Speaker 3: That was another thing I'd completely forgotten. But she's like
Speaker 3: an ally to like even remotely a villain by this stage.
Speaker 3: I know she gets with a meal, doesn't she.
Speaker 1: That's that's in the Hangover episode.
Speaker 3: That's correct Hangover episode. My goodness, gracious too, I remember
Speaker 3: that one. That was a weird one that was like
Speaker 3: two episodes from the end, and we're doing this Hangover nonsense.
Speaker 1: Actually, like like yeah, look, I'm for a good movie.
Speaker 1: Pause an episode right anytime but not when you're like
Speaker 1: in the countdown to the Let's make sure we make
Speaker 1: the time for this hangover inspired epis. So the kids
Speaker 1: are gonna love it, let me tell you. But guess
Speaker 1: what Lowe shows up for a retina scant. Clark's there
Speaker 1: too at the same time. What a surprise, right weird? Anyway,
Speaker 1: let's go in this dark room. Oh surprise, it's an
Speaker 1: engagement party from all the guest stars. We could get
Speaker 1: back this episode.
Speaker 2: The four of them.
Speaker 1: We have every star girl. You know, your close social
Speaker 1: friend stargirl hawk Van is here. Sorry I kissed your
Speaker 1: fiance a couple episodes ago, I said a vision of
Speaker 1: my dead wife. Sorry Hawkman did that.
Speaker 4: And a couple episodes ago.
Speaker 1: And doctor Emil. I love how they call him doctor.
Speaker 1: You talked about two cat grants. We have two doctor
Speaker 1: Hamilton's on this show now. They were Space Style a
Speaker 1: little more and Steven Hamilton was Joe Morton's character in
Speaker 1: the first two seasons. This is a meal Hamilton, but
Speaker 1: I bring it out and people probably sick of me
Speaker 1: singing this, but like, whenever it comes up, I find
Speaker 1: it so amusing. They call him doctor Emial all the
Speaker 1: time because they guess they don't want to confuse people.
Speaker 1: And it just makes me laugh. Like they it said
Speaker 1: to me, it sounds like he's a pediatrician doctor. He's
Speaker 1: gonna give you your shot. You're gonna get your lollipop anyway.
Speaker 1: But it's a wholesome scene, right, will slow down people.
Speaker 1: These characters just enjoy life together, sharing life advice. So
Speaker 1: we don't see a lot of this on Small Way.
Speaker 1: It was nice and we joke about who's not here,
Speaker 1: but it is impressive the amount of people they did get,
Speaker 1: I think for this scene.
Speaker 2: Yes, just for context, where is Martha came to this stage?
Speaker 2: Is she a senator? Is she of senatoring or is
Speaker 2: that finished with she?
Speaker 1: She is off senatoring, yes, but but she she does
Speaker 1: come back for a few episodes in season ten. Okay,
Speaker 1: so yeah, you would think his mom should be here,
Speaker 1: Is that what you think?
Speaker 2: Or even just a phone call or something just a
Speaker 2: little a little kind of a scene there with a
Speaker 2: phone call or congratulations.
Speaker 1: Lois's sister might be here, you know, just out there.
Speaker 3: It's the classic problem with any of these teen shows
Speaker 3: that but by this point in the series, when people
Speaker 3: are getting married, they don't want to pay to bring
Speaker 3: the parents back, so the parents are never there and
Speaker 3: the siblings are never there. Lane absolutely no.
Speaker 1: No to this season's credit though, like everyone is not
Speaker 1: here at the same time, but they piece mail everybody together,
Speaker 1: right because a couple ago, Lois's dad instance, we both
Speaker 1: came back, Supergirl was back field bed. That's a person
Speaker 1: I think should be here. His cousin, you know where
Speaker 1: she is. Maybe you guys probably thought they recast Supergirl
Speaker 1: with the Stargirl here. No, that's not Supergirl, that Stargirl,
Speaker 1: so you should be here.
Speaker 3: But when I saw Stargirl in this scene, I was like,
Speaker 3: is that just an extra? Like it's not just one
Speaker 3: of their other friends who we don't see, you know.
Speaker 1: Like the people that show up at their wedding, like
Speaker 1: the people right now.
Speaker 3: Oh. But what I'll say though, is, you know, yeah,
Speaker 3: other people should be there and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3: But my god, do they really make you believe that
Speaker 3: Clark and Oliver are just best friends now? And it's
Speaker 3: it's such a strength of these later seasons. They have
Speaker 3: such great kind of Batman and Superman energy to their
Speaker 3: friendship and you completely you know, it always feels weird
Speaker 3: to me in the later seasons of these teen shows
Speaker 3: where a lot of the main characters are gone, So
Speaker 3: like when when when he has when when the guy
Speaker 3: who's getting married has to pick the best man, he
Speaker 3: picks someone who he probably wasn't great friends with in
Speaker 3: ther seasons. Sorry to bring up Beverly Hills none of
Speaker 3: two and No, that happens in that as well, And
Speaker 3: it's just like, what that guy would not be his
Speaker 3: best man? What are you talking about? But I completely
Speaker 3: believe that Clark would ask Oliver to be his best man,
Speaker 3: and they just he added so much to this show
Speaker 3: when I think it really really needed it, And yeah,
Speaker 3: it's it was such a good idea to have like
Speaker 3: a Batman type character for Clark to fence off of.
Speaker 3: And I'm glad that they continued continued that with Superman
Speaker 3: and Lowis and John Henry Irons, which is kind of
Speaker 3: the same dynamic. And yeah, I just thought their energy
Speaker 3: in the scene where he asked him to be the
Speaker 3: best man really made the scene for me. I thought
Speaker 3: it was great.
Speaker 1: I totally agree. I mean spoilers for Superman Lowis season four.
Speaker 1: But Kyle Cushing gets married, who do you guys to
Speaker 1: be his best man.
Speaker 3: That was so stupid, right, it made no sense. Well,
Speaker 3: I guess like do you not have any other friends?
Speaker 3: Kyle push the.
Speaker 1: Guy at the fire station or something?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 1: I mean, come on right, I mean I get married
Speaker 1: in Superman's house like that's fun at all. But I
Speaker 1: mean that was like, okay, that's exactly mean it's fresh
Speaker 1: as of this recording against fresh on my Mom. That's
Speaker 1: exactly where my mind went when he was saying, pick
Speaker 1: what other main character who is Clark's best man? When
Speaker 1: on Loewis and Clark with Jimmy did they have a
Speaker 1: wedding party?
Speaker 2: Was Jimmy?
Speaker 3: It was Jimmy? And you know what, I actually thought
Speaker 3: it was stupid there as well. It's like he would
Speaker 3: have another friend who he would ask, like, you know, I.
Speaker 2: Don't think Dean Kane has it. I mean I don't
Speaker 2: think Clark Kent has any friends. No.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so yeah, like in the comics, was it was
Speaker 3: it Batman It's best man? Or was it someone else?
Speaker 3: I'm trying to remember. Maybe it was Jimmy. I can't
Speaker 3: remember Pete Ross remember now?
Speaker 2: Yeah, because you think even like Peter, where's peace in
Speaker 2: this note? Because I know he came back he comes
Speaker 2: back from.
Speaker 1: Now Allan Allan uh as a as a man of
Speaker 1: the law. You'll be happy to know that the actor
Speaker 1: was currently unavailable for law reasons at this time.
Speaker 2: But did he not come back in the later episodes?
Speaker 1: He came back in season seven.
Speaker 2: That was that was before his trouble, right, Okay.
Speaker 3: So I could really go for some chewing him right now.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, he is currently being a roadie for One
Speaker 1: Republic in Universe right now, so hard to track their
Speaker 1: during schedule, so that's why it wasn't invited. But but yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, Oliver, him and Clark have really they have
Speaker 1: been through a lot together, you know, so it's it's
Speaker 1: fair that he would ask him to be his best man.
Speaker 1: And and uh, it's so fun. It's so interesting to
Speaker 1: go back and watch Justice Justin Hartley on the show
Speaker 1: after seeing one This is Us and other things, and
Speaker 1: you see like the origins of the guy he would become.
Speaker 2: I may not have actually managed to appear on the
Speaker 2: Banshie episode, but I did all the research and I
Speaker 2: watched it before, and even in that I really enjoyed.
Speaker 2: He's two and he's too and fourth with the like
Speaker 2: Chloe and everybody in the in the Honeymoon Hotel and
Speaker 2: all that stuff, and yeah, he was really great. I
Speaker 2: really like Justin Hartley a lot, Like I compared him
Speaker 2: to Stephen Mla earlier on Like I one like the
Speaker 2: suit as much, but I much prefer this, I do.
Speaker 2: I much prefer the role. I think he's great.
Speaker 1: Well, I do think you know, we were talking about
Speaker 1: Bruce Wayne and Batman energy here, like this Oliver Queen
Speaker 1: is more like the comic book Oliver Queen, Like he's
Speaker 1: got cheerie and all that. Yeah, somewhat more politically minded,
Speaker 1: you know. On Arrow, it's like, oh, yeah, the Dark
Speaker 1: Knight trilogy, We'll just do that with green hair. That's it.
Speaker 1: There's that's it now. It goes on the show.
Speaker 3: During the day.
Speaker 1: The Lamborghini then, So that's the difference between that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I would have loved to see a goateee on this guy, right,
Speaker 1: but it is. It was they were not going to
Speaker 1: have God forbid people wear glasses and facial hair on
Speaker 1: the c W ten drama that we're watching right now.
Speaker 1: So some cute back and forth though, but you know,
Speaker 1: they talk to hawk Man and they're like, hey, you
Speaker 1: and Srey were married what like a hundred times, right,
Speaker 1: how is that? Maybe that's weird, Maybe it's not weird.
Speaker 1: He's like, we all have to lose each other one
Speaker 1: hundred times too. I'm like, well, man, come on, Bill.
Speaker 2: Right, I actually thought that was a good I was like,
Speaker 2: oh that's I actually thought that was nicely no theory,
Speaker 2: but yeah, time and place, man, time and place.
Speaker 1: I do like, you know, I was joking by doctor Meil,
Speaker 1: I like, how you s here he is in the
Speaker 1: inner circle. I would have I mean, I don't know
Speaker 1: how the how the contracts and budgets work. I would
Speaker 1: have made him a regular for season ten. You know,
Speaker 1: I just have him. There was no no he was.
Speaker 1: He was in a handful of episodes, but never never enough.
Speaker 1: You know, if you do that, uh that thirteen episode
Speaker 1: contract that Eric Durantz and John Glover had so many years,
Speaker 1: who'd have been solved? Someone else for them to talk to?
Speaker 1: Because you know, as you've seen, when Alison Mack's not
Speaker 1: there four main characters of the show right now, Okay,
Speaker 1: that's Molson Clark had more than that.
Speaker 2: Come on, yeah, yeah, true.
Speaker 3: I remember actually watching the opening credits this week, thinking
Speaker 3: this feels longer for some reason. It's like, it feels
Speaker 3: like they use more of this, and now I'm thinking
Speaker 3: that it must be that because Alison Mack wasn't in it.
Speaker 1: Right, Just more money shots, more Clark doing super things,
Speaker 1: more of the black trench coat, more of that, let's
Speaker 1: see more of that, possuly he doesn't wear anymore.
Speaker 2: I remember being surprised last night when Erica Dranz was
Speaker 2: the second billing in the credits. I remember that kind
Speaker 2: of that kind of surprised me, as like oladok.
Speaker 1: Her ten years. Well, it took her, I guess, six
Speaker 1: years to get well.
Speaker 2: She don't get me wrong, she deserves it, like she's
Speaker 2: a highlight of the series. I absolutely love her. But yeah,
Speaker 2: that was great to see. It's gotten that now.
Speaker 1: Green Arrow and Hawkman traditionally you are at odds with
Speaker 1: each other. They play with some of that in the
Speaker 1: Absolute Justice two parter as well, and here you know
Speaker 1: they have an actual human moment between them. He's like
Speaker 1: he's just all warm and fuzzy, but you know, I'm
Speaker 1: sorry about Chloe, and he's like, you're not gonna hug
Speaker 1: you now, are you? And so I like how you
Speaker 1: need to establish the camaraderie between these guys, and you
Speaker 1: slow down, you take time to get to know them.
Speaker 1: It's like them Justice League limited with it. They're like
Speaker 1: sitting at the cafeteria talking like that. That's the humanizing
Speaker 1: stuff you need. And so many of these shows are
Speaker 1: just you know, plot point, plot point, action action. You
Speaker 1: don't get that. So this is a fun moment for that.
Speaker 1: Oliver gives them a good speech, is big cheers for everybody,
Speaker 1: and but yeah, I guess this kind of stuff makes
Speaker 1: me think, oh yeah, that's why it makes sense to
Speaker 1: have the proposal at the beginning of an episode, right
Speaker 1: because it's not a unlike Wilson Clark, it's not a
Speaker 1: cliffhanger what she gonna say. It's not like you guys said,
Speaker 1: she knows he's the blurd. She's gonna say yes. So
Speaker 1: you get to have these moments throughout and that's not
Speaker 1: the cliffhanger. To be hattier, they whole another They have
Speaker 1: a whole nother cliffhanger in mine. But yeah, it's it's
Speaker 1: it's cute. And then after this wonderful, you know, heartwarming party,
Speaker 1: everybody's walking home and Oliver tries to stop a crime
Speaker 1: and then everybody turns against him, and I'm like, oh, okay.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it turns, it turns. It turns pretty dark pretty quickly,
Speaker 2: like what is a mugging or an assault or whatever.
Speaker 2: And then he steps in and the crowd just turns
Speaker 2: on him really quickly and turns super violent, very fast,
Speaker 2: and real meanness to it and stuff. So I was
Speaker 2: I was actually surprised by that.
Speaker 3: I'm talking about no extras in the other scenes. There's
Speaker 3: loads of extras in this scene. Yeah, they put the
Speaker 3: boy seems to have gone into this scene.
Speaker 1: Your budget went to this seat, right, because it's this.
Speaker 1: It's as simple like a person mugging. Alver tries to
Speaker 1: stop it. You know, he's not going to change into
Speaker 1: green arrow because he's right there on the street. And
Speaker 1: then his identity is public, you know, So he pulls
Speaker 1: off a water poster off the wall right before this
Speaker 1: to kind of establish that, you know, he's he's an outlaw, right,
Speaker 1: he's been brandon terrorist now right because because of some
Speaker 1: his activities, blown up some nefarious government government projects. But
Speaker 1: this person nature, he's like, oh, he attacked me out
Speaker 1: of nowhere. Let's get him the whole, the whole, you know,
Speaker 1: the whole mob goes on him, and and I think,
Speaker 1: I don't see. This is where things get kind of muddied,
Speaker 1: because the whole plot of the season is like the
Speaker 1: darkness is taking over and like you see this omega
Speaker 1: symbol on people's skulls, and like where all these people
Speaker 1: have been taken over by the darkness. Yet maybe that's
Speaker 1: why they turn so quick. I don't know. I hate
Speaker 1: it when they undercut I love a good human condition commentary, right,
Speaker 1: so I kind of hate when they undercut it with
Speaker 1: like oh no, no, no, no, that was just this
Speaker 1: evil force made him do it. Don't worry. I'm like, oh, well,
Speaker 1: that's kind of a cop out, Like loo, can't you
Speaker 1: wonder Woman the first film?
Speaker 2: Not only that, like whatever about the ugliness on the street?
Speaker 2: And it might have seemed a bit unreal, Like if
Speaker 2: you watched this in twenty eleven. I can't remember my
Speaker 2: mindset at the time, but I could have watched it
Speaker 2: and thought that's they they want? Didn't that would never happen.
Speaker 2: They'd never attack a hero, they never attack it, But
Speaker 2: like what would their issues? But how could they turn
Speaker 2: the crowd like that? And obviously now fast forward thirteen
Speaker 2: years and it's absolutely plausible and can happen. What I
Speaker 2: didn't like, and again I haven't followed the whole season
Speaker 2: through for quite a while, Like the reference to this
Speaker 2: omega darkness or whatever you want to call it, infecting
Speaker 2: everybody and then kind of putting things like the Third
Speaker 2: Reich down to that and other things that have happened
Speaker 2: in history, like the Inquisitions and stuff. I don't like
Speaker 2: that kind of thing, like we need to acknowledge that
Speaker 2: as a race, we're horrendous to each other and there's
Speaker 2: a bit of personal responsibility there. I don't really like
Speaker 2: when it's an extraterrestrial force that to justify, you know,
Speaker 2: the massacre of millions of people, and you know.
Speaker 3: It is It is pretty DC comics accurate, though, isn't it?
Speaker 8: Like so many things absolutely as if the plays Yeah,
Speaker 8: like if if if it had been a case where
Speaker 8: maybe you saw someone who was friendly to Oliver earlier
Speaker 8: on or something and they.
Speaker 2: Had turned or a group of people who liked him
Speaker 2: had turned or something. But just kind of like, look,
Speaker 2: it's not really the people. People are genuinely decent and stuff.
Speaker 3: Can I can I ask that because my memory of
Speaker 3: the whole the darkness thing is that it's it's not
Speaker 3: that people like individual people are all just getting possessed.
Speaker 3: It's like a cumulative kind of spreading atmosphere of darkness
Speaker 3: that that infects people's souls as opposed to them just
Speaker 3: being possessed.
Speaker 1: Yes, so a couple of people get possessed, possessed like
Speaker 1: Godfrey gets possessed Earth too, Lionel Luther gets possessed. But
Speaker 1: outside of that, yeah, it's it's this this pray is
Speaker 1: on your fear and your your you know, your your
Speaker 1: worst tendency, that's the webs, and then that that kind
Speaker 1: of makes you more inclined to react negatively and you know, xenophobia,
Speaker 1: you know, and all these sorts of things come out,
Speaker 1: and that's that's kind of what they're doing. And that's
Speaker 1: about the the UH Vigilante Registration Act. That's why people
Speaker 1: are on board for it, because oh, yeah, these heroes
Speaker 1: are bad news after all. And then you know, and it's
Speaker 1: like a snowball effect that compiles and compiles and compiles,
Speaker 1: which not a bad idea, but I don't know if
Speaker 1: they quite figure out exactly how to articulate it at
Speaker 1: the end of the day, because ultimately how does it
Speaker 1: gets solved? They see a cgi Superman push a planet away,
Speaker 1: and they're like, oh, well, I guess we're okay. I'm like, well,
Speaker 1: that's not really I needed this. I need to Superman
Speaker 1: for speech to the United Nations to solve all these
Speaker 1: But if we can't see Tom Money in the costume,
Speaker 1: you can't do it. And what are you gonna do?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 1: So all these things just kind of it's a house
Speaker 1: of cards that kind of doesn't quite hold on.
Speaker 3: I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry to give ahead, but
Speaker 3: I'm I'm assuming you've got other plans for the finale.
Speaker 3: So I do have to ask this boy, Superman in
Speaker 3: this show is literally strong enough to push a planet away?
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's the best.
Speaker 3: Does that not make him the most power the Superman ever?
Speaker 3: Like even more powerful than like the Christopher Reever.
Speaker 1: Christoph you saw him struggling to push that moon get
Speaker 1: out of here? Man he puts to another galaxy.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like it's a planet that's supposed to be
Speaker 3: bigger than Earth. I want to say as well, So
Speaker 3: it's like that is absolutely the biggest feat of strength
Speaker 3: we've ever seen Superman.
Speaker 2: Do it?
Speaker 1: Absolutely take that Brandon ofth lifting up a continent and
Speaker 1: it's nothing, all right, So no, it's h he is
Speaker 1: true silvery superman power level at the end. That's why
Speaker 1: the show has to end because no, there's no other
Speaker 1: obstacle for him in that one. Yeah that's a good question. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well he gave up his powers, Allen, Okay. His family
Speaker 1: is not a weakness, Allen, Okay.
Speaker 2: So I often think about just retiring at forty.
Speaker 1: Look, there's plenty of other police officers. They got it
Speaker 1: under they got it fined. You go home with your
Speaker 1: family the next generation. So the government they're raiding everywhere.
Speaker 1: They're going to Luther Corp. They're going to the hospital,
Speaker 1: they're collecting all these people. Uh fortunately, kind of like
Speaker 1: in between all this, Lewis and Clark go home. When
Speaker 1: they're like unpacking their presence and having a nice oh
Speaker 1: this and things aren't things wonderful, They turn on the
Speaker 1: TV and they see all this going down with Oliver,
Speaker 1: and again this establishes Lois as a good understanding for
Speaker 1: like what his priorities are and he's like, no, I
Speaker 1: need to change that, and this has been the party
Speaker 1: for too long. But they're they're at a good place right,
Speaker 1: So she literally hands in the jacket right to go
Speaker 1: save the day that he does doesn't put it on though,
Speaker 1: by the way, to my point earlier, he's just see
Speaker 1: its hand of the jacket and he and yeah, he
Speaker 1: is super speeds off. She's like, oh, I guess the
Speaker 1: honeymoon's over. And I thought, you, guys, is that a
Speaker 1: writing thing or you're not married?
Speaker 3: This is oh yeah.
Speaker 1: I was just just saying, like, it doesn't there's perfectly
Speaker 1: void thing to say. I thought that was a funny line,
Speaker 1: like they act like they just got back from their
Speaker 1: wedding and their honeymoon and they had to go be
Speaker 1: Superman all of a sudden. But but you know, she's like, hey,
Speaker 1: you know, i'm journalism and ice cream your superhero stuff,
Speaker 1: Like I don't know. I this is a good scene
Speaker 1: in t thems for all for all the faults and
Speaker 1: criticisms we're having, for all these things, Like I think
Speaker 1: they their relationship is solid and the way they're presenting
Speaker 1: it to us is solid.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I would agree with that.
Speaker 1: Then we start we start rounding up the test mercer. Right,
Speaker 1: she's reading the Daily Star, which I like the comment
Speaker 1: about the Daily Star cat Grant. Yeah, okay, kudos to
Speaker 1: cat Grant. I mean I was talking mess about her before.
Speaker 1: But she's like, hey, we should roam with this article.
Speaker 1: You know, we're losing subscribers. And she's like, well that
Speaker 1: was unsubstantiated facts, Like well, I mean he did get arrested.
Speaker 1: I mean like whatever, whatever, like he did, there was
Speaker 1: a story there, but obviously she's you know, protecting him.
Speaker 1: And Kat is very anti vigilante, so that that's in
Speaker 1: line with her character. But then the the government comes
Speaker 1: to take tests away and she's like, we'll talk to
Speaker 1: my you know, assistant, like we've cleared your schedule. So
Speaker 1: the government that's a threatening government line. They go, they
Speaker 1: go get doctor Hamilton with the hospital and they got
Speaker 1: all these characters. They put them in you know, the
Speaker 1: Daily Planet test his office basically and start injerrogating them.
Speaker 1: And meanwhile the heroes are at are at Watchdower and
Speaker 1: it's a it's Oliver and Hawkman and Stargirl and Black
Speaker 1: Canera's on the screen. So she's there, Hey, to their credit,
Speaker 1: you see like there's a picture of Flash on the screen.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, we're they exit, they're not here, but
Speaker 1: they're still here sort of.
Speaker 2: And it's around this time that they raid the farm,
Speaker 2: isn't it.
Speaker 1: Yes, small farm they're looking for I guess they were
Speaker 1: looking for Lowis, we're looking for Clark. I don't know
Speaker 1: which one they were looking for.
Speaker 2: So this this was my question. It hasn't been established
Speaker 2: that they know that Clark is the Brow at this
Speaker 2: point before.
Speaker 1: That was my question as well.
Speaker 2: Alan, Oh, okay, because I just assumed that there was
Speaker 2: some kind of something in a previous episode where they
Speaker 2: established this, like they put in two and two together
Speaker 2: and Kicking four.
Speaker 3: That they're smarter than any other Superman villains because the League.
Speaker 1: They're like, well, obviously this guy is the Blur, right, which.
Speaker 2: So I think that was because yeah, I was wondering,
Speaker 2: but I was wondering if it was it because Lois
Speaker 2: was engaged to Clark and they were aware that there
Speaker 2: was some kind of relationship between the two. Maybe and
Speaker 2: like that's obviously he's him. That's the only thing I
Speaker 2: was But I was worried that I had missed something
Speaker 2: in a previous episode where it would have been definitive,
Speaker 2: definitively established, but maybe not.
Speaker 1: You know, Well, in the episode where Stroke his first episode.
Speaker 1: At the end of it, Clark shows up to save
Speaker 1: the day and just talks to him like a person,
Speaker 1: like with no mask or anything. So, yeah, maybe that's
Speaker 1: how they know. So that could be the angle or
Speaker 1: they were just looking for Lois it was. It was
Speaker 1: vague to me too, Alan So but oh that the
Speaker 1: same Oh by the way, the same reporter. Shout out
Speaker 1: to this reporter. If it were today, she'd be Bethany
Speaker 1: Snow on News fifty two. But she's the one that
Speaker 1: interviewed Oliver Queen when he came out and said I
Speaker 1: am Green Arrow. She's the one on the news and like,
Speaker 1: vigilantes are attacking our citizens and all that sort of things. So, uh,
Speaker 1: to bring that whole thing into focus, they decide we
Speaker 1: got to go underground, right, We're gonna turn off they
Speaker 1: just we're gonna turn off watchtowers. So they go over
Speaker 1: to the big switch and they they.
Speaker 3: Turn off from the Batman is no more.
Speaker 1: That's not the same thing.
Speaker 3: You can't there's monsters out there.
Speaker 1: Batman is what does he say?
Speaker 4: Badman is to protect the people.
Speaker 1: Sorry, Jase's coming over for dinner. I'm telling her everything.
Speaker 1: This this this overreaction of like everyone wants to retire
Speaker 1: and shut everything down in fine, And just the fact
Speaker 1: that there'd be a giant lever for him, like like
Speaker 1: a mad scientist laugher and just turn it all off, Well,
Speaker 1: I felt bad for his black Canary.
Speaker 3: They don't even say goodbye. The screen just goes black.
Speaker 3: I I had trouble with this because it's a secret hideout.
Speaker 3: Why do they need to shut down the secret hideout?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 3: They don't, Like, there's no tactical advantage to this at all.
Speaker 3: And I'm close, Like, as much as we're talking about
Speaker 3: the blur and his costume, his modus operandi is still
Speaker 3: that no one can see him operate, Like they don't
Speaker 3: even have a picture of him on the wanted poster.
Speaker 3: I want to get back to that wanted poster.
Speaker 4: In a sec.
Speaker 3: But yeah, that the whole idea of them going dark
Speaker 3: as heroes doesn't just didn't. I understand that Clark needs
Speaker 3: to make himself scarce scarce as Clark Kent as well,
Speaker 3: That that part makes sense, But the idea of the
Speaker 3: heroes having to give up in here, I just didn't didn't.
Speaker 2: But even the fact that they're already underground exactly that
Speaker 2: they're operating under the radar, so we're just.
Speaker 3: Going to secret identity, deep undercover, deeper under cover.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because like Carter Hall, your own sabbatical, Courtney Whitmore,
Speaker 1: you're studying abroad, Clark Kin no more? How long is
Speaker 1: this sustainable? You know?
Speaker 2: I was I was half expecting to just kind of
Speaker 2: show a scene of them walking out of the Watchtown
Speaker 2: with like fake mustaches or glasses.
Speaker 1: I gotta say that they're they're walking out after they
Speaker 1: shut everything down, way over dramatic.
Speaker 3: Why did they do?
Speaker 1: It's like like so motion. I'm like, it's not it's
Speaker 1: not the end.
Speaker 2: It's not the end of stand by Me, like where
Speaker 2: people are just disappearing.
Speaker 1: What it did remind me of, though, is the end
Speaker 1: of the season eight, right, because that's when you know
Speaker 1: the doomsday episode when it's just Chloe and Clark is like,
Speaker 1: Clark k is dead. Humananity is by weakness, I need
Speaker 1: to embrace by alien side. He just and you just
Speaker 1: slowly feel the dreams fades away and through those same doors.
Speaker 1: I was like, guys, it doesn't just stop with that.
Speaker 1: That's it doesn't work anyway. It was just Oh, also
Speaker 1: in this whole sequence is when they find out Slatest
Speaker 1: still alive. You also had a death stroke in your
Speaker 1: final season on your show. I call it your show.
Speaker 1: You guys know what I mean? He knows which one's worse.
Speaker 1: I honestly don't know.
Speaker 2: I reminded of a skit from a Family Guy where
Speaker 2: the general Halls are sitting at the table talking about
Speaker 2: you know which one is better, and Peter goes, you're
Speaker 2: both just awful. You're both awful. Yeah, death stroke and
Speaker 2: Clark was never really death stroke in anything but Name
Speaker 2: and this guy. I think I saw a poster a
Speaker 2: comment you made during the week where you call him
Speaker 2: death stroke McCann or.
Speaker 1: John m you guys being non Americans. John McCain's a
Speaker 1: famous politician, we were not.
Speaker 2: We're not that real mode.
Speaker 3: I don't know the world is watching.
Speaker 2: But yeah, that that that was very apt and like
Speaker 2: the one thing that that didn't. This actor play a
Speaker 2: very similar role in Battle Clever.
Speaker 1: Michael Hogan. He played Colonel Tyle. Boss got a fantastic show.
Speaker 1: I highly recommend The Boss. Anyone who is interested in
Speaker 1: sci fi is when the best sci fi shows ever.
Speaker 1: He plays a great character on that show. He has
Speaker 1: an eye patch on that show, So I'm like, oh, well,
Speaker 1: I guess that's good. I don't really think about death
Speaker 1: stroke when I was watching Smallville, I was like, well,
Speaker 1: that's kind of a weird old guy with okay, sure whatever,
Speaker 1: And now like I know what death stroke is, I'm like,
Speaker 1: this is terrible casting. No, he did a good job
Speaker 1: in his episode Patriot and he was just the character,
Speaker 1: but now he's he's this and where do you come down?
Speaker 1: You come down on lels and Clark is better than
Speaker 1: this one.
Speaker 3: I would say. I agree with Alan, Like the biggest
Speaker 3: problem with death stroke and Lewson Clark is that he's
Speaker 3: called death stroke. If they called him doctor Polaris, that
Speaker 3: actually would have been perfect doctor Polaris because he has
Speaker 3: magneto powers, you know, and it's actually really cool. It's
Speaker 3: a fun little episode in a really bad season of
Speaker 3: that show, whereas here it's like one step forward and
Speaker 3: two steps back or like four step back, like you know,
Speaker 3: he actually isn't the worst, Like conceptually, he's not the
Speaker 3: worst iteration of death stroke. Like a lot of the
Speaker 3: stuff is there, I think, And I'm like, he's a
Speaker 3: master's swordsman, and does death stroke have a healing factor.
Speaker 4: Is that a thing.
Speaker 1: I don't think so, I mean, I don't know. I
Speaker 1: mean Deadpool, he's a dead Deadpool is a rip off
Speaker 1: a death Strokes. Maybe that's maybe the lions get blurred there.
Speaker 1: I see what you mean.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think conceptually it's all fine. The casting is
Speaker 3: all wrong on the look is all wrong. That line
Speaker 3: he says near the end Fellas.
Speaker 1: We're gonna we're gonna save on that. We're gonna We're
Speaker 1: gonna hold that line.
Speaker 3: So I would say I'm conflicted, but I kind of
Speaker 3: feel like this one's worse.
Speaker 1: Yeah, sorry to both your points. The loophole is on
Speaker 1: Lewis and Clark. He's not like death stroke really, it's
Speaker 1: a name they attached to somebody. So that's the loophole
Speaker 1: that makes him not the worst death stroke in this
Speaker 1: They were trying to do the Slade Wilson death stroke
Speaker 1: and it's not good. So I and I'm tired of
Speaker 1: small little Season ten. I have to say, you know, well,
Speaker 1: this is the worst version of this character, and this
Speaker 1: is the worst version of this character. And this is
Speaker 1: the worst version of this character. I'm like, it's getting exhaustingly.
Speaker 1: The suicide squad is lame, this season dark Side and
Speaker 1: his minions are lame. This Granny Goodness was good, but
Speaker 1: the other one's lame. I'm like, oh, Man, season ten,
Speaker 1: you're you're you were doing so well Smavo with all
Speaker 1: your interpretations of other characters. And to Rob's point, it's
Speaker 1: because we're in supermanland now, and like that's that's a
Speaker 1: huge thing because he's in ten. Is this it's very
Speaker 1: kind of Mitch smash all these things and this episode
Speaker 1: is a great it's a great representation of how just
Speaker 1: everything is here and sometimes everything doesn't fit together too well.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he doesn't.
Speaker 1: He's the TV's like, wow, I survived the explosion was
Speaker 1: not with that great costs? And he points to this
Speaker 1: giant ass can I can?
Speaker 3: I just just one thing that the Superman homepage review
Speaker 3: alerted me to this fact the wanted poster that has
Speaker 3: all the heroes and it has Impulse on it, which
Speaker 3: is nice. It was cyberguns. And come back to the
Speaker 3: main question. Though Supergirl, she's called Supergirl? I did not.
Speaker 3: I never Oh, yes, she is literally called Supergirl in
Speaker 3: the kindon of the show.
Speaker 1: Is that correct, Well, there's an episode it's called Supergirl.
Speaker 1: That episode, Yeah, I know that chat, and then I
Speaker 1: had seen I want to bring this up, so I'm
Speaker 1: glad you so like there was like a Maiden of
Speaker 1: Might headlines and I'm like, okay, I see you want
Speaker 1: to call that because there's absolutely no way you would
Speaker 1: call her Supergirl for Superman exists.
Speaker 2: Of course.
Speaker 1: And then here they're like, oh, what's Supergirl right the
Speaker 1: prop department something the wires got crossed.
Speaker 3: Somewhere crazy, Yeah, it's the hero as often as they
Speaker 3: do because they say that word a lot, like that
Speaker 3: word shouldn't exist either, but like literally calling her a Supergirl,
Speaker 3: it's just like.
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, I mean it's the It's so yeah, that's
Speaker 1: literally the next scene is that this this most wanted
Speaker 1: we have the blur, right, We had just have his
Speaker 1: S picture, which is funny because Supergirl is also she
Speaker 1: has the S on her bracelet.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: So my thinking was, you know, I'm rewriting all these
Speaker 1: episode season T episodes as as I go, as I
Speaker 1: cover him, like they should have said Supergirl was the
Speaker 1: blur and that could have solved a lot of problems
Speaker 1: for Clark and like that, oh that was a different
Speaker 1: entity and now Superman is different or whatever. But yeah,
Speaker 1: just just to see her called Supergirl. What's also funny
Speaker 1: to me? In this wanted poster, by the way, green
Speaker 1: Arrow is a sketch. You have a picture of Oliver Queen.
Speaker 1: I don't know Dan. That's weird now, Achaman, they know
Speaker 1: who he is because I think Lex knew he was
Speaker 1: years ago, and that Sitana got mixed up in this
Speaker 1: like she she knows them, But why are you shoot
Speaker 1: on this list? Like she's a magician at a a
Speaker 1: traveling magician as far as they know. But Hawkman is hit.
Speaker 1: That's his mug shot from the well, I would say
Speaker 1: from the eighties. But you know, I had Jeff John's
Speaker 1: on the show. We talked about absolute justice and in
Speaker 1: his mind, the Jess society was always like in the forties.
Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, yeah, I don't know how that works
Speaker 1: in the timeline of small though, but fair enough, like
Speaker 1: that's what they're on new drills and stuff, and so
Speaker 1: that's that's how long Hawkman's been around. But yeah, that's
Speaker 1: I'm trying to think of any heroes they would be
Speaker 1: missing here. Oh with Marsha Manhunter, Martian Manhunter's not not here,
Speaker 1: another the cyborg m So.
Speaker 3: I'm where is Marshmann Hunder at this point in the show.
Speaker 1: Oh, well, he's gonna be the funeral later. But that's it,
Speaker 1: Like he's a detective in Metropolis. He had a great
Speaker 1: checkmate in season nine, was a fantastic Martian Man Hunter
Speaker 1: showcase episode. And to your point, Rob about how this
Speaker 1: is a Superman show, that was episode straight out of
Speaker 1: JAILU Like everybody was involved. Amanda Waller was there, Clark
Speaker 1: had to break in like it was a great episode.
Speaker 1: That was his last episode.
Speaker 3: That's a Jackie Brown plays.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Phil Morris, Jackie Chiles, that's who. Yeah, but oh
Speaker 1: jack I would say Jackie Brown. I was sign filled
Speaker 1: Jackie Brown, Pam Greer, Amanda Waller got it. Yeah, it
Speaker 1: across my streams there.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 1: Phil Morris did appear on a screen at the end
Speaker 1: of season nine. That was his official ending, and then
Speaker 1: they mentioned him once. Kloe calls him my favorite Martian
Speaker 1: sometime this season, which is hilarious. But that's that's the
Speaker 1: end of him.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: They should have Cyberg on here. Yeah, I mean they
Speaker 1: both should be on here more than Zatana. You know,
Speaker 1: I'm sure Luther Korp has some security finish of him
Speaker 1: doing something but anyway, and this is what I'm saying, y'all, Like,
Speaker 1: I don't I don't know if this was the right
Speaker 1: thing to conflate all these plot lines in season ten,
Speaker 1: Like we have dark Side in his minions. We have
Speaker 1: like the government coming after the Heroes. We have Clark
Speaker 1: becoming Superman. We have Lows and Clark getting engaged, like
Speaker 1: I don't know, like we have the returnal legs too,
Speaker 1: Like it's way too much going on now. I think
Speaker 1: they're hedging their bets because they didn't really know how
Speaker 1: the Lex Luthor thing was gonna turn out. I mean, honestly,
Speaker 1: like that was probably a big reason they threw all
Speaker 1: the stuff off the wall.
Speaker 2: If you were to go back and cut something, would
Speaker 2: you would you cut some of those stories completely out
Speaker 2: of it?
Speaker 1: If you could go back, and I would probably cut
Speaker 1: dark Side, And I would get that because because you
Speaker 1: should make make the government the villain. I mean, I
Speaker 1: don't know, I don't know, But it's just like these
Speaker 1: emerging superpowered people, there would be people who would want
Speaker 1: to control them, and then Superman would come out of
Speaker 1: the end and say no, no, no, like like like
Speaker 1: he should be the guy that turns the Tide and
Speaker 1: what however, that books right at the end, and then
Speaker 1: you just you don't need dark Side or Apocalypse or
Speaker 1: Granny Goodness or Decide or godfree like like to our
Speaker 1: point here, like you don't need evil forces whispering in
Speaker 1: people's ears to be bad people like people are gonna
Speaker 1: be people are gonna be bad all the light on
Speaker 1: their own. So I would cut I would cut that
Speaker 1: out entirely, and I think you would have enough real
Speaker 1: estate is And then I would also remove the suicide
Speaker 1: Squad because for some reason, the Suicide Squad got conflated
Speaker 1: with like the VR thing. I'm like, you guys are, yeah,
Speaker 1: Chloe's gonna show up being in charge of them and
Speaker 1: like being in the matrix like the next episode, and
Speaker 1: I'm like, what is this about? I would also remove
Speaker 1: remove that. So that's what I would do.
Speaker 3: I actually disagree. I I really like, well, I have
Speaker 3: to be careful what to say here.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 3: I get that it is a bad adaptation of Dark Side,
Speaker 3: Like there's no arguments there, but I do really like
Speaker 3: that the the overall challenge that Clark has to become
Speaker 3: in his final hurdle to becoming Superman, as he has
Speaker 3: to take on this darkness that is kind of just
Speaker 3: this etherial metaphysical thing that's affecting the whole world, and
Speaker 3: only a beacon of light and courage and hope as
Speaker 3: powerful as Superman can can stop that. But first, in
Speaker 3: order to stop that, Clark has to, you know, tackle
Speaker 3: the darkness that's growing inside himself. And it as a wonderful,
Speaker 3: wonderful scene with Jonathan as a ghost at the top
Speaker 3: of the season where he's talking about the darkness that's
Speaker 3: coming and all this stuff. I really like all that stuff.
Speaker 3: What I I don't like this v ra stuff at all.
Speaker 3: I remember at the time thinking this just feels like
Speaker 3: a huge filler storyline. It's kind of ripping off Watchmen,
Speaker 3: which had only recently the movie had come out, and
Speaker 3: everyone was saying that at the time, like this is
Speaker 3: just copying Watchmen, and and it also the fact that
Speaker 3: we even need a Vigilanti Registration Act because there are
Speaker 3: so many superheroes in this world just highlights how ridiculous
Speaker 3: it is that there are so many superheroes in a
Speaker 3: world that does before Superman, before Superman. It just even
Speaker 3: then I remember thinking, God, this is this is a lot,
Speaker 3: you know, and so yeah, I would get rid of
Speaker 3: the v Ra stuff and just focus on the Darkness
Speaker 3: and Clark becoming Superman.
Speaker 1: And I see that, I think thematically, I understand that.
Speaker 1: I just I think dark Side, like he the reach
Speaker 1: exceeded their grasp with dark Side, and especially knowing what
Speaker 1: they ended up having to do, like the Returnal likes
Speaker 1: Luthor though more than anything, that would be my number
Speaker 1: one plot.
Speaker 2: But yeah, but yeah, but I can I can cletely
Speaker 2: understand why they couldn't nail themselves to that cross with
Speaker 2: you know, casting and stuff. But I can kind of
Speaker 2: see from both your angles. Yes, I don't think the
Speaker 2: dark Side stuff or the Omega stuff was done very well.
Speaker 2: The Apocalypse stuff has done very well. I think you
Speaker 2: could have a situation where the government has overreach and
Speaker 2: you know, things are really grim and Metropolis or grimm
Speaker 2: around the world, and the only thing that kind of
Speaker 2: drags hu many out of that is the appearance of Superman.
Speaker 2: Who's this you know, bastion of Hope and everything. I
Speaker 2: don't know if the government storyline could have would have
Speaker 2: worked for twenty four episodes. I don't know if they
Speaker 2: would have gone twenty four episodes out of that I
Speaker 2: think it's a lot. Maybe you'd have to add something
Speaker 2: to you have to have some kind of a big
Speaker 2: bad for him to fight in the final episode. Was
Speaker 2: there ever any kind of.
Speaker 1: Like los Allen asked to fight in the final episode?
Speaker 1: Was that river?
Speaker 2: And maybe maybe you don't know that, but was the river?
Speaker 2: Any kind of a discussion about maybe having him turn
Speaker 2: into Superman before the very end of the season, maybe
Speaker 2: having a few episodes off him or anything like that
Speaker 2: where maybe in the mid season he would turn into
Speaker 2: Superman and you just get some kind of.
Speaker 1: Well as the story goes out. The original script for
Speaker 1: the series finale was he was gonna be Superman like
Speaker 1: in the first scene, and then I have two episodes
Speaker 1: of Superman.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: And then Tom Allen was like, Nah, I don't think
Speaker 1: that's our show, and I don't want to wear the costume.
Speaker 1: We're gonna change that, and that is the biggest we got.
Speaker 1: What we got?
Speaker 3: Soh my god, man.
Speaker 1: Lots of conflicting interest. Now here's here's the thing, right,
Speaker 1: I have been pretty hard on Tom over the years
Speaker 1: about that. I think look, in twenty twenty four, Tom
Speaker 1: would have been Superman, right, but at the time he
Speaker 1: just wasn't there for it, man, And it's still frustration,
Speaker 1: like I'm not gonna lie. I'm like the whole one
Speaker 1: of the show has he become Superman. But when he
Speaker 1: signed up in two thousand and one to do this,
Speaker 1: you know, that was like, sure, I'll do like a
Speaker 1: last scene or some one thing. I guess now, Alan Miles, right,
Speaker 1: the creator of the show, They have said like, look,
Speaker 1: if they were still around, they would have gotten Tom
Speaker 1: to put on a Superman costume. Like they probably had
Speaker 1: more sway over him than now because he's an executive
Speaker 1: producer on the show. I mean, he's putting this time.
Speaker 1: He has his say, that's his right to do it,
Speaker 1: but come on, man.
Speaker 3: Like I just this thing I keep coming back to
Speaker 3: is he was concerned about only ever being seen as Superman.
Speaker 3: You know. But you know, even then, if you googled
Speaker 3: Tom Welling Superman, like your Google images would just be
Speaker 3: full of photoshops of them wearing the costume. Like everyone
Speaker 3: I talked to about the show who didn't watch it,
Speaker 3: they're all they're always like, oh, yeah, well he obviously
Speaker 3: wore the suit at one stage, right, And I was like, nope,
Speaker 3: he never wore it, and They're like, wait, what, they
Speaker 3: don't believe you because they've seen all these images of
Speaker 3: him wearing the suit that are just photoshopped, so it
Speaker 3: didn't even make sense. Then, you know, I just.
Speaker 2: Never I'm still I'm still bitter whatever, but I'm not
Speaker 2: even wearing the suit, which is bad enough. I'm still
Speaker 2: bitter about the fact that they didn't have their own
Speaker 2: suit because they didn't have the show.
Speaker 1: Well, if he would have worn it, they would have
Speaker 1: had to make their own suit. But since it was like, well,
Speaker 1: you're not gonna wear it, well, then here, we'll just
Speaker 1: use the Superman Returns prop. There you are, and it's tough, y'all.
Speaker 1: It's it's I'm coming down to like the realization again
Speaker 1: that he didn't put on the costume and stuff.
Speaker 3: Now, maybe he would have put on the Superman Lives costume.
Speaker 1: I I would have. It's so interesting that, you know,
Speaker 1: Superman Returns came out during the show, so the show
Speaker 1: kind of had to adopt that. I mean, you look
Speaker 1: at the as it's not exactly the Superme Returns S,
Speaker 1: but it's it's way more in that style than anything else.
Speaker 1: But I'm like that never showed up. They would have
Speaker 1: stuck with like the probably more christ Reeve as Gas
Speaker 1: and you know, because so much because you know the
Speaker 1: the CGI Superman we always see he has the gold
Speaker 1: ass on the back of his cape and anyway, yeah,
Speaker 1: oh man, but yes, it's I think we're all agree
Speaker 1: with whatever they were doing wasn't quite working, wasn't quite
Speaker 1: fitting together, and I think dropping some element to make
Speaker 1: another element would have been preferred. And I think to
Speaker 1: me the answer is lex Luthor. But if you don't
Speaker 1: have the actor and they're not gonna recast, and they
Speaker 1: went down to the last possible second before they got
Speaker 1: Michael back, so they can't hitch all your horses on
Speaker 1: that wagon, right, But I don't know, it's it's tough,
Speaker 1: and you didn't. The thing is, if you, like you said,
Speaker 1: could could the v R A kind of take that
Speaker 1: whole Could it carry a whole season? Maybe not, but
Speaker 1: then you have more opportunity for episodic stuff like, oh,
Speaker 1: here's a let's do it. I have an idea. Let's
Speaker 1: have a story as the Daily Planet, and we have
Speaker 1: to cover this episode or for example, because at this
Speaker 1: point everything is everything is the big plot. There's no
Speaker 1: side stuff anymore. Why season nine is That's why I
Speaker 1: like Season nine so much. It's this whole arcing season,
Speaker 1: but there are a little you have this episode or
Speaker 1: that episode, and you know, and all it's all kind
Speaker 1: of building towards the same thing. Season ten is just
Speaker 1: like we are all over the place.
Speaker 2: Well that's what That's what I liked with that bench
Speaker 2: episode because I often say it like I said that
Speaker 2: a nauseum that you know, I grew up in that
Speaker 2: episodic like we ordered that episodic generation of TV like
Speaker 2: TNG and all that kind of stuff. And I really
Speaker 2: enjoyed watching Benshi because it was pretty self contained, you know,
Speaker 2: the one where they go on their their couple's retreat
Speaker 2: or whatever. But I was a little bit worried that
Speaker 2: this one, remembering that season ten was was a full
Speaker 2: story arc throughout that I would be completely lost. But
Speaker 2: I slid back into it pretty quickly and pretty easily,
Speaker 2: and even just for one shot. Even though it's a
Speaker 2: lot of stuff obviously happening, and a lot of stuff
Speaker 2: leaving up to this, and there's a lot of stuff
Speaker 2: to come afterwards, I still enjoyed the episode, the experience
Speaker 2: of sitting down and watching it and following the story
Speaker 2: of this one episode and the fact that I had
Speaker 2: a proposal and it had all that kind of stuff
Speaker 2: and it you know, I didn't enjoy it. I did
Speaker 2: enjoy that those aspects of it.
Speaker 1: Well, no, I'm glad I was. I was a little
Speaker 1: concerned because once I rewatched this, I was like, man,
Speaker 1: this is pretty heavy for these guys. I know you
Speaker 1: had some small knowledge from before, so only that helped you.
Speaker 1: Because this is literally every plot line going on here
Speaker 1: is here. So they're interrogating all the good guys, right,
Speaker 1: And Lieutenant Trotter is a death Strokes lieutenant here and
Speaker 1: she was in uh Patriot a couple of sodes ago,
Speaker 1: she's in this episode. She's in the next episode as well,
Speaker 1: and she's uh. She actually in her interview with Ola
Speaker 1: speaking about do they know Clark is the Blur, She's like,
Speaker 1: I hope your fiance is not the jealous type considering
Speaker 1: your close relationship with the Blur, I'm like, okay, so
Speaker 1: that makes me think, you know they know? Yeah, And
Speaker 1: they also, by the way, they also know his his
Speaker 1: his weakness because they make a kryptonite cage in the
Speaker 1: episode that the death stroke dies in, so Okay, you
Speaker 1: know they know a lot about what's going on. Well, yeah,
Speaker 1: because the next thing, they all the Green Arrow, Hawkman,
Speaker 1: and Clark all show up in your death Strokes office here.
Speaker 1: And it's funny because they had said, we got to
Speaker 1: go off the grid. We can't communicate with don't you
Speaker 1: have like a secret channel you could? I mean, right,
Speaker 1: what have you guys been doing anyway? Like no, wonder
Speaker 1: we don't see cyborg impulse than anybody. You guys can't
Speaker 1: even communicate here, right, But it's it's it's bringing the
Speaker 1: three of them together and uh, they're like, what are
Speaker 1: you doing here? The same thing as you looking for answers?
Speaker 1: And you know, I like hawk Here's my struggle with
Speaker 1: Hawkman is I think Michael Shanks is like character wise
Speaker 1: and like, yes, he's the best hawk Man. The only
Speaker 1: thing I'm like, ah, man, his helmet kind of looks weird,
Speaker 1: but I think, you know, we'll see it in a
Speaker 1: second here. But the feathers, I think they finally figure
Speaker 1: out the feathers like they look good in this episode
Speaker 1: because and absolute justice. I was like, I don't know, y'all,
Speaker 1: that's a little but I think they have perfected that
Speaker 1: so there's I think just made that that cow look
Speaker 1: better on hawk Man. But but I like it, like
Speaker 1: he's the veteran hero. He's the one here taking charge,
Speaker 1: you know. So so I like his approach, like his
Speaker 1: angle here and he's the one like he led the
Speaker 1: golden age of superheroes on Smallville and Clark is gonna
Speaker 1: lead the silver age of superheroes on Smallville.
Speaker 3: So I love it. When they said that was great,
Speaker 3: you lead this generation.
Speaker 1: Silverage pure, it was yeah. But you know, during this scene,
Speaker 1: Clark's like, oh, man, like if they know about Lois
Speaker 1: and the blur, like what kind of marriage is that
Speaker 1: gonna be? So they're they're planning some doubts unfortunately for Clark,
Speaker 1: which you're gonna like that's the thing, right, Like they're
Speaker 1: on the same page. Things are great, but they keep
Speaker 1: they gotta find that drama. So literally, up until the
Speaker 1: second to last episode, I was like, I don't know
Speaker 1: if we can get married Clark, because you're gonna be
Speaker 1: a superhero. I'm like, guys, could we not have done that?
Speaker 1: Like it's just like, oh my goshhough and it's been
Speaker 1: done before for for Smallville, Like at least that's the
Speaker 1: more adult, like, that's a real conversation to have on
Speaker 1: like all the Lata high school stuff. So we have
Speaker 1: matured in our CW drama.
Speaker 2: I think how old are Clark and Lewis in season ten? Roughly?
Speaker 2: Are they like twenty six twenty five?
Speaker 1: They are twenty five? Lois maybe twenty because Clark is
Speaker 1: fifteen and season one he's probably fourteen, and I round
Speaker 1: up a little bit, so at some point he's fifteen, yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: and then ten years later Low's twenty.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because twenty. It's one thing that when I was
Speaker 2: watching it the last night, obviously, look, they have to
Speaker 2: progress the relationship, but I always thought that I can
Speaker 2: never quite accept Lowis Lane wanted to be a wife
Speaker 2: and married to twenty five.
Speaker 1: Well that's why they don't get married for seven more
Speaker 1: years out. Yeah, maybe that's part of it. I think
Speaker 1: she's then thirty two. It's insane how young these people
Speaker 1: are supposed to because we're all much older than them now,
Speaker 1: and I just still got there. I was like, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna grow up and be this Clark getting one day
Speaker 1: I'm way older than him.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I turned forty two weeks ago, man, and it's wow.
Speaker 2: Not me for six?
Speaker 1: How old and just how old are how old Lewis
Speaker 1: and Clark? How old are Lowis and Clark on Lewis
Speaker 1: and Clark in their mid twenties.
Speaker 3: Their twenty Clark is twenty six in season one?
Speaker 2: Wait, because then yeah, he turns up he's twenty six.
Speaker 4: Okay, Yeah, that was holding.
Speaker 1: That's amazing that, like Dean and Terry were younger than
Speaker 1: Tom and Erica were when they like started playing these
Speaker 1: younger versions of the characters.
Speaker 3: I think right, Gerard Christopher, who played super Boy, was
Speaker 3: thirty one he played super Boy, and he was like
Speaker 3: seven years older than Dean Kine was when he played
Speaker 3: super a couple of years.
Speaker 2: It's like, what was what was Chrisphreevey twenty six in
Speaker 2: Superman Movie twenty six? Like it's he's.
Speaker 3: Four twenty four when he got cast cast film most
Speaker 3: of it.
Speaker 1: They don't make him like they used to guys.
Speaker 2: No, no, they don't.
Speaker 1: Did you wonder who else was gonna pop out of
Speaker 1: the shadows though? In the scene, because like first it's
Speaker 1: Clark and then it's hawk Man and the green Arrow
Speaker 1: was like, well the big three of us? Is everybody here?
Speaker 1: Like I thought that was amusing.
Speaker 2: I just wanted to know how they found the office
Speaker 2: and got into it so quick, because you know, there
Speaker 2: was it was it was like that. That's how there's
Speaker 2: there's an episode in the season one of those in
Speaker 2: Clark where they have to break into his government facility
Speaker 2: and there's a guy who gives him a key card.
Speaker 2: He talks about how amazing the security system is, and
Speaker 2: it's just swiping the card and walking straight in. There's
Speaker 2: nothing to do with a kind of interview that.
Speaker 1: There's something to be said for, like what kind of episode,
Speaker 1: what kind of story we tell it? Are we telling?
Speaker 1: We got to break in this facility, like because you
Speaker 1: could make an entire episode about what they are doing
Speaker 1: right now, But instead it's like one scene and they're
Speaker 1: all there and they're like all right, yeah, we move on.
Speaker 1: They all have people except for green Earrow. What's funny
Speaker 1: is like they talk about Greenrow like we're not really
Speaker 1: interested in you, We're just interested in your French because
Speaker 1: you're just a human, you have no abilities.
Speaker 2: And then they find this document. This is the kind
Speaker 2: of operational document is Icarus document? And is that that's
Speaker 2: just a list basically of all the vigilantes and all
Speaker 2: their associates that they're going to target. Is that what
Speaker 2: that is?
Speaker 1: It is the list of all of the Double O
Speaker 1: agents and their code names. It is the is the
Speaker 1: list of Mission impossible in Skyfall, every espionage film ever made.
Speaker 1: But this is you know, this is by the way,
Speaker 1: episode titles an episode post one because Icarus. Right. It
Speaker 1: was weird because later on we see Hawkman in his
Speaker 1: wings on fire. I'm like, oh, is that that's the
Speaker 1: Icarus reference? But no, it's it's it's this. I'm like, oh, okay, sure, small, well,
Speaker 1: that's fine.
Speaker 3: I have a I have kind of a life rule
Speaker 3: that anytime I hear someone explain the legend of Icarus
Speaker 3: in a TV show or a movie, now I have
Speaker 3: to finish my drink just for the rest.
Speaker 4: Of my life.
Speaker 3: It's just a drinking game I'm playing because it happens
Speaker 3: in every single genre show. Cobra Kai last year, we're
Speaker 3: talking about Icarus. You know this that James Bond on
Speaker 3: another day it's it's Icarus and we have to explain
Speaker 3: what Icarus is and he flew too close the Sun.
Speaker 3: It just seems to come up every single time, and
Speaker 3: every single time we have to explain but it's it's
Speaker 3: in everything.
Speaker 4: Man.
Speaker 3: I'm just like, we get it, we know whats is.
Speaker 3: You don't need to explain.
Speaker 1: I'm sure there's a Star Trek episode where they just
Speaker 1: bound to be.
Speaker 3: It's probably the US. There's a scene.
Speaker 2: Surely there's a scene in a previous season where John
Speaker 2: Glover mentions it or something.
Speaker 1: Surely the story Vicarus.
Speaker 3: We ever heard the story of us claw Icarus was
Speaker 3: and his son day Dallas, but.
Speaker 2: He didn't realize.
Speaker 3: You can actually see that. You can see the way
Speaker 3: they'd frame that scene.
Speaker 4: Absolutely, I can picture my head gex I.
Speaker 3: I thought it was so funny that Oliver Oliver I
Speaker 3: had to explain to Hawkman what Icarus was. Cowman Oliver.
Speaker 1: Like, well, hawk Man, he's he's a historian here, obviously
Speaker 1: he's been for thousands of years. He starts talking about
Speaker 1: and this is what we're talking about.
Speaker 2: Probably knew the guy.
Speaker 1: I knew it. Ni Cheras was an asshole. But he's
Speaker 1: talk talking about the Spanish Inquisition, the Third Reich. You know,
Speaker 1: the darkness has been here before several times, right, I'm like, okay,
Speaker 1: well they I've forgotten this element. And I thought, like
Speaker 1: I thought the darkness like the only thing that stopped
Speaker 1: here was Superman, but I guess other things stopped it before,
Speaker 1: so I guess Superman is not that special. Uh, I
Speaker 1: don't know what are you saying here?
Speaker 3: Show?
Speaker 1: Like, I don't know. I had forgotten the fact that
Speaker 1: they had. As we talked about earlier, I conflated the
Speaker 1: darkness of history with choice, you feel like, but using
Speaker 1: using world history atrocities to kind of like hype up
Speaker 1: your villain is an odd choice.
Speaker 3: I don't know if I agree with.
Speaker 2: No, that's what I'm saying earlier on. I don't like it.
Speaker 2: I don't like when they try and justify things that
Speaker 2: have legitimately happened with this stuff. But look, it is
Speaker 2: what it is.
Speaker 3: Yeah, within Like, where do you guys stand on Nazis
Speaker 3: being used as villains in genre movies like Indiana Jones
Speaker 3: and stuff.
Speaker 2: I don't mind that as bad.
Speaker 1: That's a different speed though, don't you think, because like
Speaker 1: they're in the era and like obviously those are the
Speaker 1: bad guys there. Yeah, they didn't say, oh no, Hitler
Speaker 1: would have been cool if like dark Side didn't come
Speaker 1: tell them what to do, like you know, like that's
Speaker 1: the difference.
Speaker 2: Yea, if the Arc of the Covenants had created the Nazis,
Speaker 2: I would have been like, okay, no, the fact that
Speaker 2: they're the actual No, I don't mind that. I don't
Speaker 2: mind that at all. I don't mind that at all.
Speaker 3: The reason I bring it up was we were watching
Speaker 3: of all things, Crisis on Earth cht and seriously saw
Speaker 3: these Nazis. She was like, wait, what there's Nazis like
Speaker 3: and they can just do that. I'm like, yeah, they
Speaker 3: do that all the time in comic book stuff. It's
Speaker 3: not a big deal. And she's like, yes, it is.
Speaker 1: She was like, it's interesting. Okay.
Speaker 2: I remember I had I had an ex girlfriend a
Speaker 2: long time ago, and her father took issue with the
Speaker 2: fact he didn't like like, you know, like Medal of
Speaker 2: Honor games and stuff like that, you know, like where
Speaker 2: you play PlayStation games where you relive historical events like
Speaker 2: the you know, storming Omaha Beach and stuff for entertainment.
Speaker 2: But then I was like, but you watch these movies
Speaker 2: all the time and for entertainment, and he was like, yeah,
Speaker 2: but that's different. But yeah, I can see his point
Speaker 2: of them.
Speaker 1: A little bit older, so you get more of this
Speaker 1: government interrogation stuff.
Speaker 2: I want to I just want to say the government
Speaker 2: interrogation stuff. I love a secret door and I like
Speaker 2: the fact that lowest mental contraption under the under the
Speaker 2: desk to make good or escape, Like Test just has
Speaker 2: this kun It reminded me of Alkilmer's slide under the
Speaker 2: chair in in Batman Forever. Just this door to a slide,
Speaker 2: and I was like, wow, where does this go? Obviously
Speaker 2: goes into like some kind of you know, high tech
Speaker 2: base or something, and she just walks out of a
Speaker 2: car door. It's it's literally just brings of the office.
Speaker 3: I like that as well. It's a gag that they
Speaker 3: didn't need to do.
Speaker 1: It was just yes, yeah, And I think it kind
Speaker 1: of plays in a like Test with this like Checkmate agent,
Speaker 1: and she had all this stuff in her office, so
Speaker 1: it's not completely out of like out of context, like
Speaker 1: it is completely out of over but knowing like she
Speaker 1: had had some some superhero sheanigans there before you know.
Speaker 3: I saw the signal ready.
Speaker 1: You know so much of like why I'm interested in,
Speaker 1: like I do this ascreed on multimedia editing all this stuff.
Speaker 1: A lot of this comes from my favorite movies as
Speaker 1: a kid finding out, Hey, you know this movie you
Speaker 1: watch a thousand times. Actually it originally was made this way.
Speaker 1: I'm like, what, how is that even possible? You know,
Speaker 1: And because because of Batman Forever, that sequence was supposed
Speaker 1: to start the movie not happened in the middle of
Speaker 1: it and all that stuff. So anyway, released the Shoemaker
Speaker 1: cut is what I say. I would love to see it, So.
Speaker 3: Not to go too off topic controversially, as much as
Speaker 3: I want the Shoemaker still go back into the movie,
Speaker 3: I think that that was the correct move starting the
Speaker 3: movie the way they did.
Speaker 4: I thought it was more.
Speaker 1: Really starting like in the heat of the action with
Speaker 1: two faces.
Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, yeah. I mean it made it feel different
Speaker 3: to the other two, and it just makes it more exciting.
Speaker 3: It just rattles along at the pace. There's a great
Speaker 3: the virtual work print fan edited Batman Forever, if if
Speaker 3: anyone is interested in the humor Shoemaker cut, I believe
Speaker 3: that is probably the closest to what the Schumaker cut
Speaker 3: will end up being if we ever see it. And
Speaker 3: I always find whenever I watched that the movie is
Speaker 3: kind of a bit plotting at the start because they
Speaker 3: rearrange it. But anyway, topic for another.
Speaker 2: Part, it is just just for Terry though. Is it
Speaker 2: is it that he uses that escape, that that office,
Speaker 2: the turbo lift or whatever you want to call it,
Speaker 2: to go to the two face situation? Get ready for that?
Speaker 3: Yes. So the first scene in the movie is actually
Speaker 3: Bruce Wayne meeting Edward Nigma and he sees the signal
Speaker 3: and then he goes back into his office and then
Speaker 3: we see him.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I just wanted to put the Red Book
Speaker 1: stuff back in there. That would kind of flesh out one.
Speaker 2: Absolutely.
Speaker 3: Yeah, always hold on to.
Speaker 1: Batman forever need But you know what goes out to
Speaker 1: shoot here, She finds the secret exit in tests his
Speaker 1: office and runs into cac rant And you know that
Speaker 1: this is a as you guys said, it's a redeeming
Speaker 1: moment for Grant because she could have she could have
Speaker 1: turned her in, right, because she is the kind of
Speaker 1: character with that as you said, Alan would have sold
Speaker 1: out and and Frank and Frank, Yeah, sold out and Frank.
Speaker 1: But you know she's not. She proves that she's not,
Speaker 1: and that makes her, you know, some redeemable quality. She
Speaker 1: might be annoying, but that doesn't mean she's a bad person.
Speaker 1: So Lois gets out.
Speaker 2: We find out that the he's CCV, right, all right,
Speaker 2: he has access to like it's like big brother. He's
Speaker 2: access to CCV all over the city and all the hospitals,
Speaker 2: all the offices, Oliver's office, all that, all that stuff
Speaker 2: and keep being under constant surveillance for god knows how long. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I thought that was I thought that was cool. I
Speaker 2: thought that was good.
Speaker 1: Yeah, which, which tracks is exactly what the government and
Speaker 1: government would do, right. I mean, the episode that introduced
Speaker 1: Lady Wilson was called Patriot right, the Patriot Act, very
Speaker 1: small of this post nine to eleven America, y'all, let's
Speaker 1: not forget. So that's what really with here. Clark gets
Speaker 1: tests and Hamilton out he sleeper speeds them out. They
Speaker 1: get they get put the safety. Lois goes up to
Speaker 1: Oliver his office, uh, starts going through stuff in his office,
Speaker 1: and then we have death stroke and like we've seen
Speaker 1: him on a screen and now he's in person, And
Speaker 1: I don't know, would we have liked it better if
Speaker 1: he was in a costume of some kind, maybe, but
Speaker 1: would then you could have had a stuntman, yeah, some
Speaker 1: things and not see this old man swinging around a katana.
Speaker 3: Let's yeah, though, considering it's an old man. They did
Speaker 3: a pretty good job with the fight scene, like, and
Speaker 3: there's probably a stone Man in there somewhere, but if
Speaker 3: there is, they eyed him pretty well. Like I didn't.
Speaker 3: I didn't think he looked too ridiculous running around with
Speaker 3: the sword.
Speaker 2: He looked. I thought he looked good, like with with
Speaker 2: his intuction with Lois and then with the with Hawkman
Speaker 2: as well. I thought it was he did a decent job.
Speaker 2: I'm wondering how all that man actually was because we
Speaker 2: keep calling him in the man. I'm afraid to look
Speaker 2: it up in case we find out like he was
Speaker 2: forty three at.
Speaker 1: The time, he was in his late fifties if not.
Speaker 4: Sixty, Okay, okay.
Speaker 1: Confrontation with Lois here smacks her around, yeah, very physical, right,
Speaker 1: and then then he pulled a gun on those points
Speaker 1: in her head. Right, and then just when he's about
Speaker 1: to you know, kill her, a hawkman comes in and
Speaker 1: saves the day. And this is where this one I
Speaker 1: was like, damn, Like they really kind of figured it out.
Speaker 1: Hawkman's wings and feathers, like you see the texture, Yeah,
Speaker 1: the whole wings that kind of go in and outer.
Speaker 2: So did it did look a lot worse, did it?
Speaker 2: Because when I watched it last night, I was like,
Speaker 2: this looks a hell of a lot better than I
Speaker 2: remember it.
Speaker 4: Looking I remember.
Speaker 2: So it was was it? Was it worse than previous
Speaker 2: episodes like the wings and the feathers and stuff or
Speaker 2: am I?
Speaker 3: They were practical and upset Joseph, weren't they?
Speaker 1: Yeah? There was there were some shots where he was
Speaker 1: just kind of like hanging there. It didn't okay, yeah
Speaker 1: it looked weird, but here they were totally cgi nothing
Speaker 1: pretty s The the glass breaking was a little weak,
Speaker 1: I thought, c g I wise, but he himself was
Speaker 1: pretty solid. His wings contract, That's the thing, right, I
Speaker 1: think it's got in the comboos. His wings don't contract.
Speaker 1: They're just there, and like that's so much of the character,
Speaker 1: Like leave those on, Like that's when it goes away.
Speaker 1: You're just this guy with his breastplate and this giant
Speaker 1: bird head. And I think that's why the cow looks
Speaker 1: all off at that point so it can hide. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's hard to choreograph it some giant wings on your back.
Speaker 3: Can I ask you, Zach, because I genuinely have not
Speaker 3: seen black at him. Do they do that in Black
Speaker 3: at him or does he just have the wa they.
Speaker 1: Do, they do the thing where they did, but well
Speaker 1: the masks disappear. Now that's infuriating to me, Like the
Speaker 1: whole I hate. It's like have a hood, you know
Speaker 1: that you put on take off, like it's something about
Speaker 1: you pushing a button and your mask goes away. Is
Speaker 1: so lame and so now visually Black at him as
Speaker 1: the best hawk Man. But the problem is they don't.
Speaker 1: They don't touch on anything like reincarnation or his history.
Speaker 1: He just and I like Aldri's hot. She's like he's
Speaker 1: a great actor and and it looks great as Hawkman.
Speaker 1: But they like so much of that movie was so
Speaker 1: surface level, like how do you have a movie with
Speaker 1: doctor Fate, Black Adam and Hawkman not talk about any
Speaker 1: like any relationship with them from thousands of years ago.
Speaker 1: It's such a missed opportunity. But yeah, but yeah, man
Speaker 1: old Man Michael Hoagan pulls out this katana and him
Speaker 1: and the Hawkman are going at it with a mace
Speaker 1: and small villa, which is nearly not big on the
Speaker 1: physical combat this is and we all jokes aside about
Speaker 1: death stroke. It's not an unimpressive fight.
Speaker 2: That no, No, I thought it was pretty decent. I
Speaker 2: have to I have to say, I thought it was
Speaker 2: pretty decent. I thought it was going to be corny.
Speaker 2: I thought it was I thought it was pretty good.
Speaker 2: And like you they're when they're rolling the mace hits
Speaker 2: the ground as you know, the force impact of it,
Speaker 2: and like you really feel like there's real stakes at
Speaker 2: play here, that someone someone, someone's really going to get together.
Speaker 3: It's classic Smallville though, that like, on the one hand
Speaker 3: you have this like perfect comics accurate hawkman, and then
Speaker 3: on the other hand, she just old man like when
Speaker 3: it could have been if this had actually been death
Speaker 3: stroke in a death row costume, having this fight like
Speaker 3: it would have been epic. It would have been iconic.
Speaker 3: People would be talking about it for years. But because
Speaker 3: it's just this half measure, you're like, what are we doing?
Speaker 2: That's true, such a strange choice.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean there's no reason he couldn't. It was
Speaker 1: just like put on pulled on the mask for the fight,
Speaker 1: even but he's in his dress uniform. You just fighting cockman,
Speaker 1: you know, And I know, like the industrial look is
Speaker 1: in at these office buildings and stuff. But maybe Oliver Clean,
Speaker 1: maybe if it didn't have these pipes on the side
Speaker 1: of your office. Maybe when we hit it with the sword,
Speaker 1: it wouldn't blow up and almost kill Lois. Now while
Speaker 1: this is going on, like so he deth Tro hits
Speaker 1: one of the sword, one of the pipes blows up
Speaker 1: like and we get steam everywhere. And then in this
Speaker 1: distraction is when Destro kills Hawkbat. He stabs in through
Speaker 1: the heart through the back. Now Hawkman had predicted his
Speaker 1: death was coming soon, and we saw him in shields.
Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, it's fair, makes sense he would die.
Speaker 1: But he has one and there's one lad to rock act.
Speaker 1: His wings come back on. He uses them to shield
Speaker 1: himself and jump out from the fire that blows up.
Speaker 1: Lowis gets blown out the window because of this explosion
Speaker 1: that this chain reaction, this explosion, and then he jumps.
Speaker 1: It's a pretty fun visual, right, He jumps out of
Speaker 1: the window with his wings on fire, much like Icarus.
Speaker 1: His wings melted.
Speaker 2: Son I got the impression that he opened the wings
Speaker 2: solely to protect Lows from the blast and that she
Speaker 2: kind of went out as a result of the whatever
Speaker 2: you want to call it, the force or the blowback
Speaker 2: that he when when the explosion was coming. He puts
Speaker 2: the wings up to shield her because you see the
Speaker 2: fire kind of being deflected off her. And then she
Speaker 2: gets blown out the window. And then I was full
Speaker 2: sure you.
Speaker 1: Know how hard you have to get blown out to
Speaker 1: shatter an office building window. She must have broken a
Speaker 1: bone or two just breaking that glass. Right, But it's
Speaker 1: a great vision because you see Lois falling down and
Speaker 1: we see him swooping in with his wings on fire,
Speaker 1: like that's as Clark was was going to catch her. Well,
Speaker 1: we are running like where's Clark right now? Because he's
Speaker 1: because he asked where's Wallis? Right with the other the
Speaker 1: other two umbers right? Yeah, great visual, But then uh
Speaker 1: we cut to just death stroke walking around. I guess
Speaker 1: he well, we see the explosion happened to him, and
Speaker 1: like then I guess he just went downstairs. He's in
Speaker 1: like the loading dock of Luther Corp. Or whatever. Him
Speaker 1: and Clark have a confrontation here and we see his
Speaker 1: his dress uniform was a little battle damage. You know, Clarks,
Speaker 1: I hear the explosion. You heard it, Okay, Well you
Speaker 1: didn't do anything about it, but that's.
Speaker 3: He was definitely not dressed as.
Speaker 1: The why the hell is he not wearing Is it
Speaker 1: because they're underground? I mean, why is that? Why is
Speaker 1: that their excuse for not him not wearing the costume? Well,
Speaker 1: this is there's a lot of lines that people quote
Speaker 1: in small But that are like infamous lines, and this
Speaker 1: is one of the most infamous lines in the show.
Speaker 1: So Clark's like, I thought you were dead more or less,
Speaker 1: and here's what death stroke says. Let's just say the
Speaker 1: Reaper can swing his sick let me, but I'm beyond
Speaker 1: death stroke.
Speaker 3: Now, Oh my goodness, gracious.
Speaker 1: Someone wrote that as a line of dialogue.
Speaker 2: Now it is.
Speaker 3: It is definitely not worse than I'm you only a
Speaker 3: little bit more bizarre.
Speaker 1: That is the other line I was thinking of Robins,
Speaker 1: I said, there was a lot of lines like that.
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, that.
Speaker 3: In this line of defense. If you were just a
Speaker 3: fan of Smallville and not Superman comics or DC comics
Speaker 3: or anything like that, and you heard him say that,
Speaker 3: you wouldn't think wait what, You would just think, oh,
Speaker 3: that's just the dialogue. That's fine. You know, where's the
Speaker 3: only a little bit more bizarre line? It just doesn't
Speaker 3: make any sense. Yeah, So it's like, no one would
Speaker 3: ever say that, whereas someone like this, you know, swing
Speaker 3: a sigle, but I'm beyond death stroke. Now you probably
Speaker 3: wouldn't really think about it if you weren't a comic
Speaker 3: book plan. So in that respect, I think it's better,
Speaker 3: but it is still ridiculous that he said.
Speaker 1: That, and that's why he's called death drogs. But Clark
Speaker 1: trews the reason with him. He's like, we're supposed to
Speaker 1: protect people, know you can you can't love people. He's like, no,
Speaker 1: you don't believe that. I know you had a family before.
Speaker 1: And that kind of shows like the darkness is influence
Speaker 1: and I was like what is I was like, what
Speaker 1: is Clark going to do here? I'm like, what's gonna happen?
Speaker 1: We just saw him kill Hawkman and like he's obviously
Speaker 1: possessed by the darkness, and and then of course he
Speaker 1: mentions Operation Icarus again and you know you would fall
Speaker 1: because of your faith in humanity and faith your own invincibilium. Okay, fine, fine, fine, fine,
Speaker 1: that tracks right? Does this actually see a man with
Speaker 1: burning wings? So they do? They do tie it to
Speaker 1: the individual right from the sky. So Clark he just
Speaker 1: puts his little Phantom Zone Crystal on him and just
Speaker 1: he raproizes him away, and we have not seen this
Speaker 1: or seen him do this in seasons, so this is
Speaker 1: such an out of nowhere.
Speaker 2: So that was that was gonna be my question. Has
Speaker 2: this featured anywhere previously? Because I couldn't remember this little
Speaker 2: esque crystal. Well assume he's sending him to the phantom zone.
Speaker 1: That yes, yes, as we find out and way later
Speaker 1: this season when when Oliver and Clark get trapped in
Speaker 1: the Phantom Zone, he talks to Zod there and so
Speaker 1: I was like, what are you sending your your own
Speaker 1: criminals so your father will be disgusted, which is actually
Speaker 1: a good argument from Zod.
Speaker 3: Actually yeah, so.
Speaker 1: Okay, you mentioned the bizarre lion right in that episode
Speaker 1: the season six finale phantom Clark uses really is crystal
Speaker 1: and whatever not, but he takes it to He's been
Speaker 1: using it on phantoms throughout the season. If they are
Speaker 1: phantoms that have possessed physical people, it will take that
Speaker 1: phantom out and put them in the phantom zone. He
Speaker 1: tries to use that crystal on Batista, and Batista's like, hey,
Speaker 1: nice shy, but I'm not a phantom. So it doesn't work. Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: we've established it doesn't work on physical people. Then that
Speaker 1: the phantom who becomes Bizarro, shatters that crystal and it's
Speaker 1: and it's gone forever, and we've never talked about it since.
Speaker 1: Now John Jones, the Martial Men owner, has his own
Speaker 1: Phantom Zone crystal. But the whole point of the Legion
Speaker 1: episode is the Persuader comes back in time and tries
Speaker 1: to go Clark with his big axe. He destroys that crystal.
Speaker 1: There are no more crystals, there's no more Phantom Zone projectors,
Speaker 1: there's nothing. I remember watching this episode live, like, what
Speaker 1: the hell happened? I didn't understand. Like I've watched every
Speaker 1: episode of this show, and I don't know what you
Speaker 1: just showed me show. And so somewhere along the line,
Speaker 1: either they forgot or didn't care. I'm like, ah, we'll
Speaker 1: do this, and like that was their solution for him
Speaker 1: to just judge jury and executioner send this guy off
Speaker 1: to you know, Purgatory Land was like, I don't know, man,
Speaker 1: So I'm glad Zod calls him out of it later.
Speaker 3: Honestly, if if if Anthony Desiato is listening, this is
Speaker 3: the Smallville equivalent of Superman flying the criminals off to
Speaker 3: that cabin opened the costume.
Speaker 1: Yes Yes, shout out to another exciting episode and the
Speaker 1: eventually Supermann our friend Anthony Deciata's podcast whenevery way, when
Speaker 1: anybody finds out Clark's secret, the running gag he has
Speaker 1: on that podcast, He's going to take him off to
Speaker 1: this cabin on the top of him. But now Clark's
Speaker 1: is going to send people off to the Phantom Zone
Speaker 1: because actual to complete my mission and Clarks will consider
Speaker 1: it finished, and he just zaps him off with this Crystal.
Speaker 2: I assume this isn't the end of death stroke mechanics.
Speaker 1: As I presume, what do you think, Alan, do you think?
Speaker 1: Do you think he comes back out?
Speaker 2: I would assume that he does come back.
Speaker 1: You would, wouldn't you know? He doesn't. Wow, there's a
Speaker 1: new member. That's why he's so frustratcause there's a news
Speaker 1: report that he shows back up. Because that's how Zod
Speaker 1: gets Clark back in the Phantom Zone. He gets his
Speaker 1: attention by sending these people back out.
Speaker 3: Because I was gonna ask that that episode where they
Speaker 3: go into the Phantom Zone and they need Zod and
Speaker 3: he's now like the combined ZOD of season five and
Speaker 3: season nine. Yeah, does that happen after this or is that.
Speaker 1: Before that's after this?
Speaker 3: That's okay, but they don't meet they don't meet that
Speaker 3: stroke in the final of that.
Speaker 1: No, because that they see that like a news alert
Speaker 1: that he's reappeared. Okay, SOD sent him back out to get.
Speaker 2: We never physically see Michael Hogan again in the show.
Speaker 1: That's why this is ridiculous. Like if he had evolved
Speaker 1: into more of the death stroke, maybe I'd be like, oh,
Speaker 1: and next time you see him, he's in another level
Speaker 1: and he has his costume. No, this is it ridiculous.
Speaker 1: That's insane, ridiculous.
Speaker 2: I didn't realize that. I didn't realize that. I thought
Speaker 2: he was I literally thought he'd be back in like
Speaker 2: the next.
Speaker 1: Episode, well like in the Phantom Zone, or he.
Speaker 2: Had something I assumed, you know, Dark Slight didn't release
Speaker 2: him or something.
Speaker 1: I'm all for a Phantom Zone projector like, you know,
Speaker 1: I think him sending Dooms out of the Phantom Zone
Speaker 1: was a great idea. But you know, when he was
Speaker 1: going to do that at the Fortress, because all his
Speaker 1: other crystals had been destroyed, right, but no, he couldn't
Speaker 1: do it anyway.
Speaker 4: That's nuts.
Speaker 1: Season ten has really great conduity in some areas and
Speaker 1: then awful continuity in other areas. And this is one
Speaker 1: but Clark he's renied with Lois and and Carter because
Speaker 1: Destro told him that they were dead, right, But you know,
Speaker 1: Hawkman opens his wings and Lois is there and so
Speaker 1: they embrace.
Speaker 2: I like that. I like that that he was protecting
Speaker 2: her in his wings on the ground. I really I
Speaker 2: really like that. Yeah, never sawid very heroic, very heroic.
Speaker 1: Michael Shanks was great as his character, and he'd this
Speaker 1: isn't one it done like he this is his like
Speaker 1: fourth episode if he count him on the screen, right,
Speaker 1: because he had some whyes in Salvation. So he is
Speaker 1: a a significant guest character in the last air of
Speaker 1: the show, and you know, it's a good moment. He's like,
Speaker 1: I'm a pro dyeing, remember, Like that's that's cute. Of
Speaker 1: course you would say something like that as he was dying,
Speaker 1: but you feel his loss because he was this veteran
Speaker 1: hero that they all looked up to. And now I really.
Speaker 3: Like he says to him in his dying moments, He's like,
Speaker 3: there has to be a balanced clerk. We can't do
Speaker 3: what we do with an engines in our hearts. I
Speaker 3: thought that was really really nice, and it's it's a
Speaker 3: thing that I hold true in all Superman stories, is
Speaker 3: that he actually should end up Willows. That shouldn't be
Speaker 3: the thing like Superman two where he has to like
Speaker 3: his own.
Speaker 1: Of celibacy, you know, that kind of thing, and that's
Speaker 1: why he marries a lot and Superman three guys, right, Yeah.
Speaker 2: I particularly like when when Clark looks at Lewis and
Speaker 2: and Hoffman kind of sees the love that they have
Speaker 2: is confirmed and he says that he knows he made
Speaker 2: the right decision. I really enjoyed that to it. Thought
Speaker 2: that was a nice touch, and.
Speaker 1: It has even more weight because him and we had
Speaker 1: a whole episode together, like Shield, the second episode of
Speaker 1: the season. Like, so that's not just oh yeah, that's
Speaker 1: Clark's beance your girlfriend over there, Like, no, he he
Speaker 1: knows her and they had a they've had a heart
Speaker 1: to heart, so like he has insight into both of them.
Speaker 1: So that kind of means a lot, and you know,
Speaker 1: he has some party parts, some final wisdom to Clark
Speaker 1: here as he passes away, and it's solid stuff. I
Speaker 1: was gonna miss Hawkman. I'm not gonna miss Dethrop, but
Speaker 1: I'm gonna miss awk Man. He's like, I'm sorry, I won't
Speaker 1: be there to help you fight the darkness. And I'm like, oh, man,
Speaker 1: so he's gonna I don't know how the cycle works,
Speaker 1: but he's gonna be somebody's baby, I guess soon. And
Speaker 1: we start the cycle again. Uh and yeah, so this
Speaker 1: is you guys aren't really that familiar with the Arrovers,
Speaker 1: but you know they had Hawkman over there.
Speaker 3: Oh no, legends, Yeah I remember that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, this this Hawkman's better, right all right?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, yeah he is.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Michael Shank, Michael Shanks kicks as in this.
Speaker 1: And a nice final shot off we see Clark and
Speaker 1: Lewis and Carter all in the background, him kind of
Speaker 1: pan down with a camera and we see, you know,
Speaker 1: Hawkman's helmet in the foreground and we comeing too focus
Speaker 1: on them, like, okay, that's like it's like the comic
Speaker 1: book cover, like a death of a Hero.
Speaker 3: I think it literally looks like the Identity Crisis. Do
Speaker 3: you remember that there's a panel in that that it
Speaker 3: looks like they actually took it from that.
Speaker 4: I think.
Speaker 2: I just really like how heroes always kind of die
Speaker 2: on c really conveniently, like you know, you say, you
Speaker 2: say the really heroic thing, and then you just drift
Speaker 2: off where I always imagine what would be like if
Speaker 2: it took another twenty four minutes.
Speaker 1: That's that's all I got. I got nothing else for you, Clark.
Speaker 1: It as beautiful as that. That shot is of the
Speaker 1: Hawkman cow there I found there their shot of I
Speaker 1: guess Africa amusing where it's like these camels, like okay,
Speaker 1: sure that looked like animation to me, like like I
Speaker 1: don't I don't even know if it was like a
Speaker 1: real shot of something. But uh, they're often some temple
Speaker 1: somewhere in Egypt, and they're going to where Shira is,
Speaker 1: presumably because they put his body next to hers. Now,
Speaker 1: this is this is an interesting scene here because we
Speaker 1: see the we quote unquote see the entire Justice League.
Speaker 1: All right, Lois is there, Black Canary, Stargirl, Green Arrow, Clark,
Speaker 1: and then back there in the very back we don't
Speaker 1: see him. Let we see Impulse in Martian Manhunter. Oh cool,
Speaker 1: they're clearly standing. It's like, well it's easy for Impulse
Speaker 1: because he's got the hood on so he don't see
Speaker 1: his face. But you know the guy, the guy who's
Speaker 1: standing in for Martian man Hunter, he's like just has
Speaker 1: his head like down so he can't really tell it's
Speaker 1: not Phil Morris.
Speaker 2: I had to laugh. This is the second Superman TV
Speaker 2: Show podcast left on this week. I was recorded with
Speaker 2: Anthony earlier on this week, and that episode was Star
Speaker 2: of Faith where they also go to stock footage of
Speaker 2: camels in Egypt and Georgia Leaves picks up the pyramid,
Speaker 2: and I was like, oh, what's the likelihood in both
Speaker 2: episodes seventy six years Apartment.
Speaker 1: Goes to locations, goes to the location, but it's not
Speaker 1: just then. So the in the white shot, you see
Speaker 1: Impulse and you see Martian Mander. But then they have
Speaker 1: an overhead shot and you see all come in. He's
Speaker 1: got his hood up. You see Cyborg. You don't really
Speaker 1: see you kind of see his shoulder, sees a ton
Speaker 1: of back there, we see something. So these are all
Speaker 1: stand ins, right, But I appreciate the fact, like, hey,
Speaker 1: just league members died, everybody needs to be here. They
Speaker 1: call everybody up, and I appreciate the fact they all
Speaker 1: showed up, and uh, that's plays the factor into the
Speaker 1: next episode because they've taken out the entire Justice League.
Speaker 1: So this is part of the part of the plane here, right.
Speaker 1: So oh, by the way, Clark's wearing his monogram jacket
Speaker 1: plus one. It's not zipped up, by the way, because
Speaker 1: why would you zip it up.
Speaker 3: And he's not wearing a blue shirt he's wearing, right,
Speaker 3: Is it is?
Speaker 1: It is?
Speaker 2: It is blue. It's like a baby blue.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but it is not. Maybe it's the lighting there
Speaker 1: in this place, but it doesn't look like great vibrant.
Speaker 1: It looks great. No one's ever gonna see it.
Speaker 2: I thought, you look, I really thought he he just
Speaker 2: looked like Superman. You know, sounds costume obviously, but he
Speaker 2: just looked like Superman off the page. I thought he
Speaker 2: really looked great.
Speaker 1: Well, they started to like dabble with the island his
Speaker 1: hair as well when he's in when he's in the
Speaker 1: Blorder costume. So that helps with the supermanler too. And
Speaker 1: you know that that Shira helmet and her weapon used
Speaker 1: to be in that museum. But I guess the museum
Speaker 1: closed after Absolute Justice, I don't know, or maybe after
Speaker 1: Carter Hall die. They said they're taking all your stuff.
Speaker 1: But where We're in Egypt and they spent a lot
Speaker 1: of time in Africa, and he's in a small boy
Speaker 1: between you know, the woas is there, the isis is
Speaker 1: from there, and you know here we are at Hawkman's funeral,
Speaker 1: but we don't.
Speaker 2: I I dunked on the soundtrack earlier on I said
Speaker 2: the music was crap. I thought the music for the
Speaker 2: funeral scene was okay. It was pretty good. It sounds
Speaker 2: like kind of a soft rock song or something the
Speaker 2: generic stuff like. But I just thought I thought it
Speaker 2: was all right.
Speaker 1: City Lights by Paulton Edge.
Speaker 2: Up Ah, that means that means nothing to me.
Speaker 1: It never made it on one of my small bl
Speaker 1: mix CDs, but that was fair enough.
Speaker 3: He says, nothing says pyramids like city Lights.
Speaker 1: But it's you know, it's a somber moment right with
Speaker 1: black Harry and Stargirler come from each other, and then
Speaker 1: you know, what, what's that? What's what's We're in Egypt,
Speaker 1: there's a pyramid coming out. Is this part of the
Speaker 1: is this part of the funeral procession? That's part of
Speaker 1: the No, it's not. It's some device put there by
Speaker 1: the government, I guess, to wipe out all the superheroes.
Speaker 1: So it comes up and it goes off, and then
Speaker 1: big flash of light and then we see all the
Speaker 1: Justice League just laying on the ground, and that is
Speaker 1: your mid season finale.
Speaker 4: Nuts.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, what a cliffhanger, y'all. I hope they're okay.
Speaker 1: I don't know, like this didn't really do it much
Speaker 1: for me. I'm just gonna say, for a cliff.
Speaker 2: How long on average would you have to wait? I
Speaker 2: just can't remember how long would you have to wait?
Speaker 1: About six weeks or so. Usually came back, you know,
Speaker 1: into January, beginning February something like that.
Speaker 3: I always have a problem in these scenes where it's
Speaker 3: like the entire Justice Let you get knocked out, and
Speaker 3: it happens a lot on the cartoon where they'll all
Speaker 3: get knocked out by like electricity or something like that,
Speaker 3: including Superman, and I meanwhile, you just have a human
Speaker 3: character there, like Lois or Batman, and she is also
Speaker 3: knocked out, and you're like, if that thing was strong
Speaker 3: enough to knock out Superman, do you.
Speaker 2: Think they should have ended this? Do you think it's
Speaker 2: a strong enough cliff hanger? I was wondering after I
Speaker 2: watched it. Should they have ended this maybe with Lowe's
Speaker 2: going out the window or no.
Speaker 1: Generic as an episode, that's fine, right. My problem is,
Speaker 1: like Luthor the previous episode, like it ends with with
Speaker 1: the only fourth wall break in the history of Smallville
Speaker 1: and arguably the greatest fourth wall break of all time.
Speaker 1: It's it's Earth two line of Luther has And you
Speaker 1: know I talked about last week time, Right, that's a
Speaker 1: strong statement. I stand by that statement.
Speaker 3: Oh wow, because that's John Glover saying I want to
Speaker 3: see how it all turns out that one, Yes, because
Speaker 3: all time.
Speaker 1: He's talking to you, the viewer, because you've been watching
Speaker 1: small ovivirgineers. Don't you want to see how it all
Speaker 1: turns out? And he opens his umbrella and he goes
Speaker 1: through the crowd. Oh my god, Lionel's back shows in
Speaker 1: what's called mag I do want to see how it
Speaker 1: all turns out. I'm fired up bringing on small to this.
Speaker 1: I'm like, what what just happened? Like I just and
Speaker 1: then part of it might be I know that Collateral.
Speaker 1: The next episode is the one they're like in the
Speaker 1: Matrix and it's like not good at all. That's where
Speaker 1: I I'm like, maybe I'm holding that against the end
Speaker 1: of this episode. I don't know, but look, it's fun
Speaker 1: to see the Justice League together, right, Obviously you have
Speaker 1: a funeral for a hero, right, that's that's monumental for
Speaker 1: these guys. But then to end on that kind of
Speaker 1: awkward note of they're all passed out, like how do
Speaker 1: they know where they're like, I guess because they were
Speaker 1: monitoring everybody, like they know where Carter Hall's secret tomb
Speaker 1: is and they have this thing in the ground planning
Speaker 1: they're waiting to come out. I'm like, what are you.
Speaker 1: I don't know, y'all.
Speaker 4: I didn't know that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, I didn't love it. That's what I was
Speaker 2: trying to I was trying to think to myself afterwards,
Speaker 2: is there is there a better cliffhanger with what was
Speaker 2: in the episode that they could have kind of left
Speaker 2: it on? But maybe not?
Speaker 1: No, No, See, Smallville didn't do cliff fingers like that.
Speaker 1: Alan Like it's unless like every now and then probably
Speaker 1: maybe like a third of the season finales were like
Speaker 1: a pick it up with the next shot, you know,
Speaker 1: but episode episode they always had like their their you
Speaker 1: know epilogue like you know a kind of stuff, And
Speaker 1: it was never like a do we continue unless it
Speaker 1: was a premiere of finale, sometimes a two parter so.
Speaker 2: O Slave Were You Married?
Speaker 4: A Small Villa?
Speaker 6: All new episode this Friday at eighty seventh Central.
Speaker 2: Up a very Street Echanti, They said.
Speaker 4: He wanted, so what are you mad? Super mad yet?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 4: And what if my soulmate comes along and I'm too
Speaker 4: blind to see it?
Speaker 5: Just follow your heart and you'll always do the right thing.
Speaker 4: I'm mad.
Speaker 1: Past, My world needs your clack.
Speaker 2: What about what we need? Man need.
Speaker 4: Sad jeans?
Speaker 2: This we said, who are you? Lois lost?
Speaker 1: My three past?
Speaker 4: It's just s You're more than just a hero.
Speaker 5: You're a superhero.
Speaker 2: Give me a nerd with glasses any day of the week.
Speaker 1: Wome Something dark is coming.
Speaker 4: You're gonna be tested like you have never been tested before. Street,
Speaker 4: I know my destiny.
Speaker 6: Small Fille season from here next Friday at eight seventh Central,
Speaker 6: New one, Blu Ray and DVD.
Speaker 2: This is where it's all been leading.
Speaker 1: You have become.
Speaker 4: That's great to say it.
Speaker 3: More than two hours of special features the final season
Speaker 3: of Small on Blue Ray and DVD November twenty nine,
Speaker 3: and on the Complete series collection on DVD.
Speaker 1: Icorous got an eight point seven out of ten on IMDb,
Speaker 1: and Douglas Trumble from the Superman homepage g at a
Speaker 1: four out of five.
Speaker 2: So ty on.
Speaker 1: The letter grade scale, y'all, Alan, let's start with you.
Speaker 1: What would you give vigorous.
Speaker 2: On the letter grade scale? So I would probably give
Speaker 2: it a B minus. I thought, look, overall, if you're
Speaker 2: if you're revisiting this, it is kind of a filler exposition,
Speaker 2: kind of an episode, you know, mid season, not a
Speaker 2: hell of that happens throughout. But when I sat down
Speaker 2: and watched it last night, I enjoyed it. It flew by.
Speaker 2: I enjoyed the characterizations. I enjoyed the story of it.
Speaker 2: I enjoyed the proposal and all that stuff to it. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I had issues with death stroke and stuff like everybody else,
Speaker 2: and some of the writing and some of the decisions
Speaker 2: that they made, But overall, I wasn't bored. I wasn't
Speaker 2: looking at my watch watching it. I knew what it
Speaker 2: was when I was going into it. I had a
Speaker 2: vague memory of it, but I thought they did it
Speaker 2: pretty well. And I liked the death of Walkman. I
Speaker 2: thought that was covered really well, and the way he
Speaker 2: went out on an I note. I enjoyed that. So yeah,
Speaker 2: to be honest, I can't find much fault with it
Speaker 2: over sentimentality at the start, with the proposal and stuff
Speaker 2: like that, and like I said, some weird choices here
Speaker 2: and there, but overall I thought it was pretty solid.
Speaker 3: Be minus, I would agree with all of that. To
Speaker 3: be honest, I'm also being minus. I think it pushed
Speaker 3: the plot of the season along nicely enough, and there
Speaker 3: was a lot of kind of clunkiness in some of
Speaker 3: some of the logistics of the riding and stuff like that,
Speaker 3: but it didn't bother me too much. It was only
Speaker 3: really watching it the second time when I was kind
Speaker 3: of going back and think of it.
Speaker 4: Certain stuff but still.
Speaker 3: Really stuck out, like it is not a remarkable episode,
Speaker 3: but I think just the inclusion of Hawkman doing as
Speaker 3: much Hawkman stuff as he does, as impressively as they
Speaker 3: do it, and then the proposal happening, and you know,
Speaker 3: as we said, like seeing all the Justice League together,
Speaker 3: even though not all of them play a role in
Speaker 3: the episode, just stuff like that they committed to the assignment.
Speaker 3: And I don't really care for this storyline at all.
Speaker 3: But I think that this is a pretty harmless, decent episode. Yeah,
Speaker 3: for all the flaws we've discussed, I would give it
Speaker 3: a be mine.
Speaker 1: You know, I was gonna give it a B minus,
Speaker 1: but since both of y'all did, I'm gonna go with
Speaker 1: C plus now, just to give us some variety. Just
Speaker 1: being so steeped in the season as I am, I'm like, eh,
Speaker 1: you know, so, I'm very happy that you guys liked
Speaker 1: it as much as you did, and I don't dislike it.
Speaker 1: You know, C plus is above average, But the proposal
Speaker 1: stuff was great. Death stroke is as bad and not
Speaker 1: as bad as I remember. At the same time, the
Speaker 1: doucex Machina really of the oh I'll just said to
Speaker 1: the phantoms, I'm like, well, do why haven't you been
Speaker 1: doing that all the time? You shouldn't be. But the
Speaker 1: fact that you did at all, I'm like, well, what's
Speaker 1: that about?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 1: Hawkman? I I did. I did enjoy all Hawkman's things.
Speaker 1: He was one of the stronger guest heroes on smavel.
Speaker 1: I think, you know, when people think about I think
Speaker 1: everybody's I don't know, you have a strong I don't
Speaker 1: know if you guys have strong opinions about this. But
Speaker 1: when people think about, oh, who's the best, like guest
Speaker 1: hero in Smallville, Green Arrows not on the table because
Speaker 1: he became a main cast member. But I think everybody
Speaker 1: says the flash they were impulse. I think that's everybody's
Speaker 1: inclination because of that. That first episode was so strong.
Speaker 1: I mean, he probably be my be my favorite. But Hawkman,
Speaker 1: he don't. Don't don't lose out a Hawkman because he
Speaker 1: was a great He was a great presence on the show.
Speaker 1: That's the great thing about Smallville and one of the
Speaker 1: many great things on smaball brought a lot of it tension,
Speaker 1: Like these characters seeing them for the first time in
Speaker 1: live action are basically for the first time live characters
Speaker 1: live action for most of them, characters like Cyborg and
Speaker 1: you know, it was a Tanna and all the all
Speaker 1: the the stand ins who were here at the funeral,
Speaker 1: all those characters too, you know, and and the the
Speaker 1: dude bro Ackaman. That's Smallville presented is lives on to
Speaker 1: this day, for better or for worse, right, But you
Speaker 1: know all that to say, there was hey, there was
Speaker 1: action in here. There was stuff going on. Uh, there
Speaker 1: was an impressive amount of supporting cast members that returned.
Speaker 1: And I'm gonna give it a C plus, So be
Speaker 1: minus for you guys, C plus for me. Let's go
Speaker 1: to the tally board short telliboard. You only had a
Speaker 1: couple of talies head and episode title set an episode
Speaker 1: because they had Operation Icarus. They talk about it later
Speaker 1: to see a man fall from the sky with wings. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: that brings us to eighty eight so far. And then uh,
Speaker 1: the monogram jacket, as I already talked about off the
Speaker 1: top plus one, that brings us to five so far.
Speaker 1: Five in eleven episodes. I gave myself the over under
Speaker 1: was ten when the season started. I'm sticking with the under.
Speaker 1: We'll see because I know for a fact he doesn't
Speaker 1: wear it in the series finale.
Speaker 2: So do you think it was a case that he
Speaker 2: didn't want to wear or do you think it was
Speaker 2: a case that they tried to hold back on a
Speaker 2: little bit so that they wouldn't there'd be more of
Speaker 2: a maybe a chasm between this and the Superman suits
Speaker 2: and the finale.
Speaker 1: I just think they weren't really sure how to use it.
Speaker 1: I mean, he should have been wearing it in this episode,
Speaker 1: like when in that scene where he confronts Slate at
Speaker 1: the end, he's just wearing streat clothes, like what are
Speaker 1: you doing? But he can go wear for this funeral though,
Speaker 1: So I don't know. It's it's it's I'm fascinated's one
Speaker 1: of it's I'm fascinated by it. And that's why I
Speaker 1: made it a tally board. And we're gonna continue to
Speaker 1: hear me ransom for the rest of the rest of
Speaker 1: the podcast. So Bechdel Test pass because of the government
Speaker 1: agent talking to everybody, like I mean, yes, they talk
Speaker 1: about like superhero stuff, but like talking to tests, you know.
Speaker 1: I think in the spirit of the Bechdel Test, it
Speaker 1: passes because we have this hardcore government agent. We also
Speaker 1: have Lois and Kat talk. So I think the combination
Speaker 1: of all those I think we passed.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so.
Speaker 1: So in some redemption for Cat Grant maybe, I don't know.
Speaker 1: I'll keep that in mind next time I see her.
Speaker 1: I think she I think she only has one more episode.
Speaker 1: I think it's Booster, the Booster Gold episode.
Speaker 4: So the little Booster Gold episode.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I better like her in that one because I'm
Speaker 1: pretty sure I've been talking to Jef Johns about that
Speaker 1: on the podcast, it was like, who wrote this character?
Speaker 1: This is awful.
Speaker 3: Booster Gold episode always reminds me of Chris Simms reviewing
Speaker 3: the finale when Olie looks up and see Superman fly
Speaker 3: by and he's like, come on, Clark, and Chris Sims
Speaker 3: was like, why did he know that was Clark? Why
Speaker 3: didn't he assume that was Booster Gold because he's the
Speaker 3: only flying hero in this universe at that point.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because he doesn't know Clark can fly. Yeah, exactly,
Speaker 1: Well that's gonna do it for this episode. But guys,
Speaker 1: a lot of fun talking episodes. Fut so great to
Speaker 1: have you both on here at the same time. If
Speaker 1: people want to find you out there and whatever order
Speaker 1: you guys want to promote yourselves, take it away.
Speaker 3: We are All Star super Fan Podcast. We're on all
Speaker 3: the socials, Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. Twitter is Allstar super
Speaker 3: Pod on Facebook and Instagram are All Star super Fan
Speaker 3: And yeah, we have a bunch of episodes. You have
Speaker 3: appeared on quite a number of them and some really
Speaker 3: really cool kind of compires and episodes where we look
Speaker 3: at different Superman episodes and across across the eighty five year.
Speaker 4: Multimedia legacy of the Man of Steel.
Speaker 3: We talk about all sorts of fun stuff, and we've
Speaker 3: also done some ridiculed interviews with actors and writers and
Speaker 3: creators from Superman related things.
Speaker 1: Awesome what he said.
Speaker 2: It's been great, Zich, thanks so much for having us on.
Speaker 2: Really really thirtally enjoyed it. And I have to say,
Speaker 2: like I said, watching the Bench episode a few months ago,
Speaker 2: for what was being my appearents of that episode, and
Speaker 2: then watching this again, really enjoyed getting back to the
Speaker 2: show and getting back into it. You know, it's always
Speaker 2: and I think it's just before in the back of
Speaker 2: my mind. I always it's always kind of a little
Speaker 2: bit tarnished by how long it went on and what
Speaker 2: I thought was a dropping quality really over kind of
Speaker 2: those mid seasons. And then obviously the finale really just
Speaker 2: pissed me off, like I did so many other people.
Speaker 2: But I have to say, going back and watching it
Speaker 2: like these just as the characters and stuff, this episode
Speaker 2: is what nearly fifteen years old now fourteen thirteen years old,
Speaker 2: and I thought I held up pretty good. You know,
Speaker 2: it's out of its time and stuff. But I thought,
Speaker 2: like that Hawkman looked great. I thought some of the
Speaker 2: story elements were good, and I just came in here
Speaker 2: last night, I sat down in this room, I put
Speaker 2: it on, I took out the DVD, put it on
Speaker 2: and just really really enjoyed it and kind of let
Speaker 2: me again would have wanted to go back and watch more.
Speaker 2: So Yeah, thanks Emilly.
Speaker 3: Absolutely I will echo all that. And I think as
Speaker 3: much as I have a litany of issues with the show,
Speaker 3: I think there is something beautiful about the fact that
Speaker 3: they were able to mine ten years out of Superman's argent.
Speaker 4: I think that's really really cool.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and Zach just need to say this again one
Speaker 3: more time. You have been such a supporter of our show,
Speaker 3: and we really really appreciate it. And I think it
Speaker 3: is safe to say that your show is one of,
Speaker 3: if maybe the best Superman.
Speaker 4: Podcasts out there.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, so a hearty congratulations to you for making it
Speaker 3: this far. And I can't wait to see how it
Speaker 3: all turns out.
Speaker 5: Well.
Speaker 1: No, I appreciate it that guys. I yeah, definitely, you know,
Speaker 1: I enjoy all's content, so I definitely want to rebroadcast it.
Speaker 1: And you know, we have a lot of friends to
Speaker 1: do this, and I'm glad we've kind of had this
Speaker 1: community that we can all kind of be on each
Speaker 1: other shows and it's all we're all part of the
Speaker 1: same team, right, So that's that's the fun of it, right,
Speaker 1: So these are fun times for real times. I not
Speaker 1: gonna believe it when it's over, probably, but but here
Speaker 1: we are.
Speaker 3: So I gotta be real with you, though, Man, if
Speaker 3: you do under tune a Heroes podcast, I don't know
Speaker 3: how far I'm making it. In and rewatch the show
Speaker 3: Devny season one. After that, I'm not sure.
Speaker 1: Tease that so many times, and I feel obligated maybe
Speaker 1: at some point to do it. But we'll see, we'll see,
Speaker 1: look forward to it. All right, Well, let's gonna do
Speaker 1: it for this episode of Always Won the Smable. Stay
Speaker 1: tuned next time when we talk about Collateral, but until then,
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