1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:03,040 Speaker 1: Arrow dot net a r r oe dot net not 2 00:00:03,160 --> 00:00:07,839 just a podcast. It is a podcast network nineteen different 3 00:00:08,039 --> 00:00:13,039 unique content driven lifestyle podcasts that connect with your life. 4 00:00:13,080 --> 00:00:17,160 For instance, if you love cooking, chefs, cookbooks, and everything 5 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:20,519 that goes with food, then you need the Foodie Paradise. 6 00:00:20,839 --> 00:00:24,920 It's on Arrow dot net r r oe dot Net. 7 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:28,679 Enjoy the exploration. How are you doing today, Miss Kate? 8 00:00:29,440 --> 00:00:30,879 Speaker 2: I'm great? How are you doing? 9 00:00:31,239 --> 00:00:33,640 Speaker 1: Very very excited to share a conversation with you because 10 00:00:33,719 --> 00:00:36,200 you're finally covering a subject here that so many people 11 00:00:36,240 --> 00:00:38,640 should have brought up a long time ago. But you've 12 00:00:38,679 --> 00:00:41,079 got the courage to say, hey, look, either mind or 13 00:00:41,119 --> 00:00:42,719 move on that that's just the way that you know. 14 00:00:42,960 --> 00:00:45,119 It's like exactly, It's like my boss wants telling me. 15 00:00:45,320 --> 00:00:47,520 He says, you either like change or there's the door, 16 00:00:47,640 --> 00:00:48,840 just go just get out of here. 17 00:00:50,320 --> 00:00:50,520 Speaker 3: Right. 18 00:00:51,719 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 2: That's great. 19 00:00:52,560 --> 00:00:54,560 Speaker 1: Where did you gain the confidence to be able to 20 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:56,079 have the courage to be able to look at this 21 00:00:56,240 --> 00:00:58,679 generation and say mend or move on? 22 00:01:00,840 --> 00:01:04,239 Speaker 3: Well, I've been a licensed psychotherapist for almost twenty years, 23 00:01:04,319 --> 00:01:07,239 and so I know the clinical work really well. And 24 00:01:07,480 --> 00:01:10,040 I've also experienced this in my personal life, so I 25 00:01:10,079 --> 00:01:13,159 know it from that dimension too, and with enough time 26 00:01:13,239 --> 00:01:16,000 and experience on this, I think it just only makes 27 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:18,200 sense to help support other people move through it. 28 00:01:18,599 --> 00:01:20,640 Speaker 1: What's really interesting is that we all have our own 29 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:23,840 interpretation of what a toxic relationship is. I mean, even 30 00:01:23,879 --> 00:01:26,439 Britney Spear is saying about toxic, and the thing is 31 00:01:26,439 --> 00:01:28,640 is that do we really know what it is and 32 00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:31,239 is it really what we think it is? 33 00:01:32,840 --> 00:01:35,560 Speaker 3: Well, I think that's a pretty big problem these days actually, 34 00:01:35,640 --> 00:01:39,519 especially on social media, is words like toxic get thrown 35 00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:42,640 around a lot of pop psychology words, you know, they 36 00:01:42,680 --> 00:01:45,359 tend to just sort of go into the mainstream and 37 00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:49,079 people misuse them. So I actually provide definitions at the 38 00:01:49,159 --> 00:01:52,359 very front of my book for what toxic actually means, 39 00:01:52,480 --> 00:01:55,680 what a toxic relationship is, what a healthy relationship is, 40 00:01:55,920 --> 00:01:58,680 to help with the discernment around that, so that people 41 00:01:58,719 --> 00:02:03,560 aren't mislabeled a relationship that's maybe just misaligned or has 42 00:02:03,719 --> 00:02:06,319 expired with one that's truly toxic. 43 00:02:06,480 --> 00:02:08,360 Speaker 1: See I would be that freak that would be standing 44 00:02:08,439 --> 00:02:10,360 right there at Barnes and Noble just to watch people 45 00:02:10,360 --> 00:02:12,319 go through the front part of that book, because that's 46 00:02:12,319 --> 00:02:14,360 how so many people judge it, you know, they want 47 00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:16,400 to read that first paragraph, and man, when you're putting 48 00:02:16,439 --> 00:02:18,159 that kind of stuff up there in the beginning, ooh, 49 00:02:18,560 --> 00:02:21,800 that's a good worm on the hook. Let's go that route. 50 00:02:22,120 --> 00:02:22,479 Speaker 2: Yeah. 51 00:02:22,560 --> 00:02:25,360 Speaker 3: I mean, I think it's important really, especially as a book. 52 00:02:25,439 --> 00:02:27,520 It's all about words, and we have to be careful 53 00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:29,240 with the words we use and intentional. 54 00:02:29,400 --> 00:02:31,599 Speaker 2: So I try to give people a roadmap. 55 00:02:31,159 --> 00:02:34,280 Speaker 3: From the very first page about what to expect and 56 00:02:34,360 --> 00:02:35,479 how to use this work. 57 00:02:35,560 --> 00:02:37,719 Speaker 1: How is it you're able to see us while you're writing, 58 00:02:37,759 --> 00:02:39,400 because a lot of people say, no, I wasn't even 59 00:02:39,439 --> 00:02:41,719 thinking about the reader. And yet I feel all the 60 00:02:41,759 --> 00:02:43,719 way through this book that you did see us, and 61 00:02:43,759 --> 00:02:45,759 that you do feel that we exist. 62 00:02:46,680 --> 00:02:47,360 Speaker 2: Oh, thank you. 63 00:02:47,639 --> 00:02:50,639 Speaker 3: That's a lovely thing to say. I really realize that 64 00:02:50,719 --> 00:02:53,120 this is a global problem. 65 00:02:52,759 --> 00:02:53,400 Speaker 2: At this point. 66 00:02:53,599 --> 00:02:56,360 Speaker 3: I think, you know, nobody can deny that we have 67 00:02:56,599 --> 00:02:58,680 a lot of hatred, a lot of division, there's a 68 00:02:58,680 --> 00:02:59,639 lot of negativity. 69 00:03:00,159 --> 00:03:02,400 Speaker 2: And I really think that when we. 70 00:03:02,439 --> 00:03:06,039 Speaker 3: Work on ourselves and our individual relationships, then we plug 71 00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:08,919 back into the collective from a healthier place, and we 72 00:03:08,960 --> 00:03:10,599 attract healthier relationships. 73 00:03:10,759 --> 00:03:11,719 Speaker 2: And when we raise our. 74 00:03:11,639 --> 00:03:14,520 Speaker 3: Standards, then we model that for other people, so they 75 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:16,800 can also raise their standards, and that's how we make 76 00:03:16,840 --> 00:03:17,560 the world better. 77 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:19,960 Speaker 1: You know, you talked about how the word toxic is 78 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:21,680 one of those words that we tend to throw around, 79 00:03:21,719 --> 00:03:24,759 so our compassion and empathy, because people will go, oh, 80 00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:28,000 I've got empathy, Oh I've got compassion. Well, how come 81 00:03:28,039 --> 00:03:30,680 it's only used as words and words the actions that 82 00:03:30,719 --> 00:03:32,280 should go with each one of those words. 83 00:03:34,199 --> 00:03:36,759 Speaker 3: I actually spend some time defining that as well, and 84 00:03:36,840 --> 00:03:41,960 including sympathy too, because compassion, empathy, and sympathy can get 85 00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:43,080 a little intertwined. 86 00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:45,919 Speaker 2: But really they're different. If you'd like I can explain. 87 00:03:46,479 --> 00:03:48,400 Speaker 1: I would love to, And then I get to explain 88 00:03:48,479 --> 00:03:51,120 to you when you say sympathy like that, that my 89 00:03:51,199 --> 00:03:53,520 wife has grown up on a quote that you may 90 00:03:53,560 --> 00:03:55,919 be familiar with, but I mean it is something that 91 00:03:55,960 --> 00:03:58,199 we live by because of that quote that her mother 92 00:03:58,199 --> 00:03:59,639 gave to her as a child. 93 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:03,199 Speaker 2: Oh, I would love to hear the quote, Yeah. 94 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:04,639 Speaker 1: I'm gonna cuss? Is that okay for a sec? 95 00:04:05,800 --> 00:04:05,919 Speaker 2: Oh? 96 00:04:06,039 --> 00:04:08,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, Where do you find sympathy in a dictionary? Between 97 00:04:08,879 --> 00:04:13,319 shit and syphilis? And so. But when you start thinking 98 00:04:13,319 --> 00:04:15,400 of it like that, you sit there and you and 99 00:04:15,439 --> 00:04:18,319 you go, oh my god, and all of a sudden, 100 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:20,319 you start getting a new definition of it, not just 101 00:04:20,399 --> 00:04:23,839 that word, all words, even compassion and empathy. So for 102 00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:25,759 you to put a definition up there, my god, that's 103 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:28,920 a brave step that you are really opening up a door. 104 00:04:30,240 --> 00:04:33,000 Speaker 3: Well, I just want people to really understand the language 105 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:36,639 they're using. So I define empathy as sort of when 106 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:40,360 when you lose yourself in someone else's experience, you feel 107 00:04:40,399 --> 00:04:42,399 so deeply what they feel that it's. 108 00:04:42,240 --> 00:04:43,279 Speaker 2: In your own body. 109 00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:46,800 Speaker 3: You have your own nauseous response or headache in response 110 00:04:46,839 --> 00:04:47,079 to them. 111 00:04:47,120 --> 00:04:50,120 Speaker 2: Your heart is breaking as though it's happening to you. 112 00:04:50,560 --> 00:04:53,399 Speaker 3: And empathy is a place where we can really drown 113 00:04:53,560 --> 00:04:54,519 with the other person. 114 00:04:54,600 --> 00:04:56,040 Speaker 2: There's not a lot of boundaries there. 115 00:04:56,040 --> 00:05:00,000 Speaker 3: It's like a big mushy pile of everyone's feelings altogether, 116 00:05:00,639 --> 00:05:04,879 whereas compassion is sort of like empathy with mindfulness and 117 00:05:04,920 --> 00:05:05,639 with boundaries. 118 00:05:05,680 --> 00:05:07,680 Speaker 2: So you can feel for someone, you. 119 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:10,680 Speaker 3: Have warmth and love and support for them, but you 120 00:05:10,759 --> 00:05:14,079 also remember that you're separate, you're somebody different. This isn't 121 00:05:14,079 --> 00:05:16,800 happening to you, you're witnessing it, and you're showing up 122 00:05:16,800 --> 00:05:20,279 with warmth. And then sympathy is kind of like feeling 123 00:05:20,319 --> 00:05:23,120 badly for them from a distance where you say like, gosh, 124 00:05:23,120 --> 00:05:25,439 that really that's too bad. I feel really bad for you, 125 00:05:25,519 --> 00:05:26,959 But then you just go on with your life and 126 00:05:26,959 --> 00:05:28,439 it doesn't impact you too much. 127 00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:31,279 Speaker 1: Even with with a sympathy don't aren't those fighting words 128 00:05:31,319 --> 00:05:34,720 in the way of I guess I hear somebody sympathy 129 00:05:34,720 --> 00:05:37,199 and I have been quoted to say I don't need 130 00:05:37,240 --> 00:05:39,600 that right now. I need to figure this out first. 131 00:05:39,680 --> 00:05:41,680 And then if you really think that you need to 132 00:05:41,759 --> 00:05:44,639 use that word sympathy, you don't have to around me. 133 00:05:44,680 --> 00:05:47,600 And so am I creating that barrier of mind it 134 00:05:47,720 --> 00:05:48,199 or move on? 135 00:05:50,160 --> 00:05:51,240 Speaker 2: Well, not necessarily. 136 00:05:51,279 --> 00:05:53,720 Speaker 3: I think every person gets to decide what kind of 137 00:05:53,759 --> 00:05:57,720 support feels the most supportive for them. And really, there's 138 00:05:57,839 --> 00:06:00,399 most people in our lives are not our close most 139 00:06:00,399 --> 00:06:02,839 intimate people. If you think about all the people you're 140 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:05,879 connected with, right all the people you run into, most 141 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:08,199 of us have about one hundred and fifty people in 142 00:06:08,360 --> 00:06:11,959 our greater social network, and so most of those people 143 00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:15,319 can probably only have capacity for sympathy. They're not close 144 00:06:15,399 --> 00:06:17,639 enough to you to have the level of care and 145 00:06:17,720 --> 00:06:21,240 compassion maybe dipping into empathy that someone really close to 146 00:06:21,279 --> 00:06:24,439 you would have and that's why we have varying levels 147 00:06:24,519 --> 00:06:27,800 of closeness with people, because we simply couldn't manage one 148 00:06:27,879 --> 00:06:31,319 hundred and fifty deep relationships. So maybe it's okay for 149 00:06:31,399 --> 00:06:34,120 some people to treat you with sympathy, but you know 150 00:06:34,240 --> 00:06:36,399 the people who are in your life closer who you 151 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:39,439 really would rather have compassion or empathy from, and that 152 00:06:39,439 --> 00:06:40,639 can be a smaller number. 153 00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:42,680 Speaker 1: I love the way you think only because I have 154 00:06:42,720 --> 00:06:46,000 a podcast that's called Defragging, and it's based on ask 155 00:06:46,040 --> 00:06:49,319 yourself the questions and question the answers, and I really 156 00:06:49,360 --> 00:06:51,560 do really hit hard when I say, I didn't say, 157 00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:54,279 go ask a friend the questions that you have, I said, 158 00:06:54,319 --> 00:06:56,879 ask you because your friend has not worn your shoes. 159 00:06:57,160 --> 00:06:59,360 And that's what I love about this book is that 160 00:06:59,399 --> 00:07:03,160 you're giving me the opportunity to see into other people's 161 00:07:03,199 --> 00:07:06,800 lives and to really experience them, you know what I 162 00:07:06,800 --> 00:07:08,759 mean by that. But in the way of that, with 163 00:07:08,879 --> 00:07:11,439 the sympathy, the compassion as well as the empathy, it's 164 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:15,360 a better understanding of relationship. What are you doing here, Kate? 165 00:07:15,439 --> 00:07:17,800 This is about a relationship. 166 00:07:18,279 --> 00:07:21,319 Speaker 3: Right, and it's not just your romantic relationship, which is 167 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:25,120 such a common misunderstanding like this goes for family, for friends, 168 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:28,879 for work relationships, even for those kind of acquaintanceships that 169 00:07:28,920 --> 00:07:30,680 you walk away from and you're like, gosh, am I 170 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:32,519 better from that? Or am I worse from that? Did 171 00:07:32,560 --> 00:07:35,839 that take something from me that I really needed? Relationships 172 00:07:35,879 --> 00:07:38,399 are everywhere and we really need to be conscious about 173 00:07:38,399 --> 00:07:40,839 them because they impact how well we are in a 174 00:07:40,839 --> 00:07:42,519 psychological and physical level. 175 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:46,000 Speaker 4: Please do not move There's more with Kate King coming 176 00:07:46,079 --> 00:07:51,160 up next, the name of her book, mend or move On. 177 00:07:51,720 --> 00:07:53,240 We are back with Kate King. 178 00:07:53,879 --> 00:07:56,720 Speaker 1: So now, in your studies to put together mend or 179 00:07:56,800 --> 00:07:59,519 move On? Did you come across anything that took place 180 00:07:59,560 --> 00:08:02,639 before this particular generation. And the only reason why I 181 00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:05,199 bring that up is because it feels like and we 182 00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:08,160 all talk about how families and friends are splitting up 183 00:08:08,199 --> 00:08:11,240 because of political decisions or whatever, whatever, whatever. I don't care. 184 00:08:11,480 --> 00:08:13,879 The thing is is that I believe that this has 185 00:08:14,120 --> 00:08:16,560 always gone on. We just seem to make it more 186 00:08:16,600 --> 00:08:19,079 acceptable to talk about it today. Am I wrong to 187 00:08:19,120 --> 00:08:19,720 think like that? 188 00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:21,720 Speaker 2: You're right? 189 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:25,199 Speaker 3: I actually think that calling things like estrangement and no 190 00:08:25,319 --> 00:08:29,120 contact a trend is really just an avoidance mechanism because 191 00:08:29,120 --> 00:08:32,679 it's so uncomfortable that social media and the media has 192 00:08:32,720 --> 00:08:34,320 brought these conversations to the. 193 00:08:34,320 --> 00:08:36,879 Speaker 2: Surface, and so we may be seeing them more. 194 00:08:37,080 --> 00:08:39,639 Speaker 3: But this is certainly not the first generation that has 195 00:08:39,679 --> 00:08:43,320 been cutting away and pulling back from unhealthy relationships. And 196 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:46,759 to answer your question, I mostly try to use current 197 00:08:46,799 --> 00:08:49,080 research in my book so that it's most up to date. 198 00:08:49,440 --> 00:08:50,919 Speaker 2: But I can attest to this. 199 00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:53,799 Speaker 3: In my personal family and my lineage, we have had 200 00:08:54,159 --> 00:08:58,279 multi generational estrangement, and I actually write about some of 201 00:08:58,279 --> 00:09:02,919 my personal experience because this does move intergenerationally through families, 202 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:06,279 and it's amazing how patterns can really show up. And 203 00:09:06,519 --> 00:09:09,200 that brings up the concept of people who are breaking cycles, 204 00:09:09,240 --> 00:09:12,480 who are doing things differently, teaching their kids new things 205 00:09:12,480 --> 00:09:15,600 that are healthier, new patterns, and sometimes in order to 206 00:09:15,639 --> 00:09:19,039 protect your family and the next generation, you have to 207 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:22,480 cut ties with the previous generation because they're not willing 208 00:09:22,519 --> 00:09:24,679 to change and they're not willing to look at themselves. 209 00:09:24,759 --> 00:09:27,000 Speaker 1: See that's why I'm kind of freaked out when people say, yeah, 210 00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:29,559 we've been really good friends for forty plus years, and 211 00:09:29,600 --> 00:09:30,720 I want to look at and say, how the hell 212 00:09:30,759 --> 00:09:33,480 did that even happen? Oh my god, I dumb people 213 00:09:33,519 --> 00:09:35,679 forty years ago? What are you talking about? 214 00:09:36,679 --> 00:09:36,919 Speaker 2: Right? 215 00:09:37,120 --> 00:09:40,639 Speaker 3: So, sometimes the longevity of a relationship doesn't indicate how 216 00:09:40,639 --> 00:09:41,360 healthy it is. 217 00:09:41,559 --> 00:09:43,559 Speaker 2: It just indicates that they may. 218 00:09:43,440 --> 00:09:45,720 Speaker 3: Have tolerated a lot, they may have looked the other way, 219 00:09:45,840 --> 00:09:49,519 they may be enduring really unhealthy dynamics that they're not 220 00:09:49,559 --> 00:09:52,519 willing to talk about or heal. And sometimes you do 221 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:56,200 have really long relationships that are healthy, And that's where 222 00:09:56,240 --> 00:09:59,639 we have those nuggets of really knowing that those relationships 223 00:09:59,720 --> 00:10:01,279 probably we have strong boundaries. 224 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:02,480 Speaker 2: Boundaries are a good thing. 225 00:10:02,799 --> 00:10:06,559 Speaker 3: Those relationships have hard conversations, they're not afraid to tell 226 00:10:06,559 --> 00:10:09,679 each other the truth, and that can contribute to their longevity. 227 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:12,399 So I would say, you know, before we decide if 228 00:10:12,399 --> 00:10:15,000 someone's long relationship is healthy or not, we have to 229 00:10:15,039 --> 00:10:17,960 ask those questions about like how do you handle conflict together? 230 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:21,159 How afraid are you of the truth? How honest are 231 00:10:21,639 --> 00:10:23,840 you with each other? And that's how you can really tell. 232 00:10:24,120 --> 00:10:26,279 Speaker 1: Don't you think that starts so with having that honest 233 00:10:26,279 --> 00:10:29,000 to God conversation with somebody and you go, look, here's 234 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:31,600 the thing. My mind is currently crowded up right now 235 00:10:31,639 --> 00:10:33,840 with all the content and things going on. Give me 236 00:10:33,879 --> 00:10:36,559 two seconds to readjust so I can find my focus 237 00:10:36,559 --> 00:10:39,639 in you. My wall is down, let's talk, let's heal. 238 00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:44,360 Speaker 3: Everyone has to come to the table like that. Otherwise 239 00:10:44,519 --> 00:10:47,759 progress and growth isn't really possible. There's I have these 240 00:10:47,759 --> 00:10:50,720 seven traps of toxic relationships, and one of them is 241 00:10:51,600 --> 00:10:55,120 false ownership, which is when one person takes it upon 242 00:10:55,159 --> 00:10:57,879 themselves to heal the entire relationship and they think it's 243 00:10:57,919 --> 00:11:00,559 all their fault, which is never the truth. But in 244 00:11:00,600 --> 00:11:04,159 many toxic relationships, someone is identified as sort of the 245 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:06,559 bad one or the scapegoat, and they tend to hold 246 00:11:06,639 --> 00:11:09,519 all the negative projections because the other person won't look 247 00:11:09,559 --> 00:11:12,279 at it. So if you're not able to come to 248 00:11:12,320 --> 00:11:15,320 the table with everyone willing to say, Okay, this is 249 00:11:15,360 --> 00:11:17,480 what I've done wrong, this is where I could do better, 250 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:19,799 this is where I'm willing to listen and get curious, 251 00:11:20,080 --> 00:11:23,360 you can't get any healing unless everyone has that perspective. 252 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:25,480 Speaker 1: You're going to think I'm a freak here. But the 253 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:28,639 very second that Facebook started to take over, with Instagram 254 00:11:28,679 --> 00:11:31,559 and MySpace and all of this social media junk, it's 255 00:11:31,600 --> 00:11:34,360 almost like all of these people that we disconnected from 256 00:11:34,399 --> 00:11:36,879 because we had a no contact rule, all of a 257 00:11:36,919 --> 00:11:39,320 sudden we had to reconnect with them because they said, 258 00:11:39,320 --> 00:11:40,639 you want to be my freer and you want to 259 00:11:40,759 --> 00:11:42,919 like me, and it's like, oh, for the love of God. 260 00:11:43,240 --> 00:11:46,240 But I swear that social media is trying to bring 261 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:48,399 us back together. But it's going to require more than. 262 00:11:48,240 --> 00:11:50,320 Speaker 2: That, right. 263 00:11:50,480 --> 00:11:53,360 Speaker 3: Well, you know, sometimes you can be in sort of 264 00:11:53,480 --> 00:11:56,360 low contact with a person through social media where maybe 265 00:11:56,360 --> 00:11:59,360 they see, you know, the curated pictures and posts of 266 00:11:59,399 --> 00:12:02,080 your life, but that's not really who you are, and 267 00:12:02,120 --> 00:12:04,879 that's not really who they are. So it's a misconception 268 00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:08,960 in modern society that social media is an accurate depiction 269 00:12:09,039 --> 00:12:12,399 of what's really going on in someone's life. Real relationships 270 00:12:12,519 --> 00:12:15,879 happen outside of the Internet. They happen in people's homes, 271 00:12:15,919 --> 00:12:18,840 over the phone, in coffee shops. So I think I 272 00:12:18,879 --> 00:12:21,759 don't know what the intentions of social media are. I mean, honestly, 273 00:12:21,799 --> 00:12:25,519 I think they're probably pretty insidious. But it is a 274 00:12:25,960 --> 00:12:28,799 challenge for how much can you allow people in your 275 00:12:28,840 --> 00:12:31,200 life on the digital versus in person. 276 00:12:31,600 --> 00:12:33,679 Speaker 2: And that's part of this work too. Sometimes you have 277 00:12:33,720 --> 00:12:34,480 to be discerning. 278 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:37,799 Speaker 1: You hit something that is so spot on, and I 279 00:12:37,799 --> 00:12:40,919 want listeners to really really be this the plan and 280 00:12:40,960 --> 00:12:42,879 the purpose of adding this book to their life, and 281 00:12:42,919 --> 00:12:45,360 that is when it comes to being curious. I believe 282 00:12:45,399 --> 00:12:47,000 that my wife and I have been together for thirty 283 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:50,639 three thirty four years is because we always remain curious. 284 00:12:52,919 --> 00:12:57,039 Speaker 3: Curious is my single most favorite quality to bring into 285 00:12:57,080 --> 00:13:00,279 a relationship and into your relationship with yourself as well well, 286 00:13:00,559 --> 00:13:03,759 because if you hold a curious mindset, then you're open 287 00:13:03,840 --> 00:13:07,120 for feedback, You're open to learn more. You ask questions, 288 00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:09,440 you'd like tell me more about that, rather than just 289 00:13:09,519 --> 00:13:12,720 inserting judgment or assumption, which are two traps that can 290 00:13:12,759 --> 00:13:15,559 get us really stuck. So I think curiosity is the 291 00:13:15,600 --> 00:13:18,480 first ingredient that I would really recommend people bring into 292 00:13:18,519 --> 00:13:19,399 their relationships. 293 00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:21,120 Speaker 1: I love sitting down with these people that have been 294 00:13:21,120 --> 00:13:23,440 married fifty plus years and the way that that you know, 295 00:13:23,480 --> 00:13:25,799 it's so funny to watch the older man because you know, 296 00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:27,559 he kind of just looks at the wife and says, 297 00:13:27,600 --> 00:13:28,840 I just did it her way, and I'm going, oh, 298 00:13:28,919 --> 00:13:31,840 there's so much more to that. Oh there's more to 299 00:13:31,919 --> 00:13:34,679 that story, you know, because she gave in to you too, dude. 300 00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:36,919 I mean, it was it was a partnership. They're a 301 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:38,200 business in the making. 302 00:13:39,639 --> 00:13:40,919 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a flow. 303 00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:43,679 Speaker 3: You know, it's never actually fifty to fifty. 304 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:45,440 Speaker 2: It's over the lifespan. 305 00:13:45,559 --> 00:13:47,559 Speaker 3: You would hope that it would feel fifty to fifty, 306 00:13:47,759 --> 00:13:50,480 but really each person has to give and take in 307 00:13:50,519 --> 00:13:53,440 the cadence of the relationships. So sometimes we have a 308 00:13:53,440 --> 00:13:56,200 difficult season, we need to take more, we don't give 309 00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:58,960 as much, but then when we come back into level footing, 310 00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:01,519 we can give more and the other person can receive. 311 00:14:01,639 --> 00:14:05,039 So I'm talking about a concept called reciprocity, where there's 312 00:14:05,080 --> 00:14:07,639 a give and take. There's deposits and withdrawals, and as 313 00:14:07,679 --> 00:14:10,360 long as you have a balance of that, relationships can 314 00:14:10,399 --> 00:14:14,200 really thrive. But you get into troublesome territory when people 315 00:14:14,279 --> 00:14:16,879 give more than they take, or they keep, you know, 316 00:14:17,120 --> 00:14:19,879 taking so much that there's nothing left to give, and 317 00:14:19,919 --> 00:14:22,759 that's really imbalancing for all kinds of relationships. 318 00:14:22,799 --> 00:14:25,519 Speaker 1: Speaking of give and take, Okay, here's something that listeners 319 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:27,240 may be able to relate with, but I'm going to 320 00:14:27,360 --> 00:14:29,000 hit you up with it, and that is as a 321 00:14:29,039 --> 00:14:32,039 creative person, when you're putting books together, your profession, your 322 00:14:32,039 --> 00:14:35,360 life at home, those right, there are three individual personalities. 323 00:14:35,519 --> 00:14:37,440 How do you give and take to each one of 324 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:39,120 them and give them the right amount of love so 325 00:14:39,159 --> 00:14:41,320 that you have something like this mend or move on 326 00:14:41,440 --> 00:14:43,120 for a book, because there had to have been that 327 00:14:43,159 --> 00:14:45,759 other side of your personality that said, come on, cage, 328 00:14:46,200 --> 00:14:48,200 let's go bowling, let's go do something. 329 00:14:50,080 --> 00:14:52,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, being a. 330 00:14:52,399 --> 00:14:56,159 Speaker 3: Therapist, I just really want to help, and I think 331 00:14:56,240 --> 00:14:58,919 during the pandemic I became really aware of how much 332 00:14:59,039 --> 00:15:01,440 need there really was. That's when I wrote my last book, 333 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:04,279 The Radiant Life Projects, which is like a it's like 334 00:15:04,320 --> 00:15:07,840 a general sort of how to master class of self healing. 335 00:15:08,240 --> 00:15:12,120 And I love to help support the greater well being 336 00:15:12,159 --> 00:15:14,519 and mental health of everyone and anyone, but I can't 337 00:15:14,519 --> 00:15:17,279 reach them all in my practice, and so these books 338 00:15:17,320 --> 00:15:19,679 provide that. And so I feel like a lot of 339 00:15:19,759 --> 00:15:24,320 inspiration and spark around writing and bringing together research and 340 00:15:24,399 --> 00:15:28,000 science and creativity and spirituality. It's a very sort of 341 00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:31,240 eclectic personality we have over here, and so the books 342 00:15:31,279 --> 00:15:33,720 give me a really nice place to gel all of 343 00:15:33,759 --> 00:15:36,159 that together. And you're right, I do have to have 344 00:15:36,200 --> 00:15:38,559 boundaries with it in terms of making time for my 345 00:15:38,600 --> 00:15:41,159 family and not just burning the midnight oil and not 346 00:15:41,240 --> 00:15:42,879 showing up well for my clients. 347 00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:44,080 Speaker 2: It's a balancing act. 348 00:15:44,639 --> 00:15:47,000 Speaker 3: But here on my third book, I think I figured 349 00:15:47,039 --> 00:15:49,000 that out at least to the degree where it does 350 00:15:49,039 --> 00:15:49,919 feel pretty good for me. 351 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:52,399 Speaker 1: Where can people go to find out more about you, Kate, 352 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:54,279 Because I do believe that you've got the makings of 353 00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:57,080 a reality show here, and it's like, Okay, I'll patiently 354 00:15:57,120 --> 00:15:59,600 sit back and watch all this unfold, but there's something 355 00:15:59,639 --> 00:16:02,000 going on here, and I want people to support and 356 00:16:02,080 --> 00:16:03,360 love you from the very beginning. 357 00:16:04,559 --> 00:16:04,919 Speaker 2: Thank you. 358 00:16:05,080 --> 00:16:07,399 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean sometimes it does feel like a reality show. 359 00:16:07,399 --> 00:16:10,360 And I even say, like, my my family should be 360 00:16:10,440 --> 00:16:10,919 a movie. 361 00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:12,360 Speaker 2: Yeah it's not. 362 00:16:12,639 --> 00:16:16,039 Speaker 3: You know, it's pretty entertaining, especially if they're not your family. 363 00:16:16,080 --> 00:16:17,360 Speaker 2: I think it's very entertaining. 364 00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:21,279 Speaker 3: But so my website is the radiantlifeproject dot com. 365 00:16:21,279 --> 00:16:22,039 Speaker 2: That's my hub. 366 00:16:22,279 --> 00:16:24,600 Speaker 3: I'm also on all the social media as My handle 367 00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:27,519 is the Radiant Life Project and I just love community. 368 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:30,200 I love connecting. So feel free to DM me, to 369 00:16:30,279 --> 00:16:33,159 email me and we'll connect and I can help support 370 00:16:33,159 --> 00:16:34,639 you through this really meaningful work. 371 00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:35,960 Speaker 1: Well that means you got to come back to this 372 00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:38,000 show anytime in the future. The door is always going 373 00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:38,799 to be open for you. 374 00:16:40,080 --> 00:16:42,120 Speaker 2: Thank you. I would love that this has been a 375 00:16:42,159 --> 00:16:43,000 great conversation. 376 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:44,639 Speaker 1: Will you be brilliant today? 377 00:16:44,679 --> 00:16:48,600 Speaker 3: Okay, thank you you as well, have a great day.