Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Reality TV Bridge. I am one
Speaker 1: of your hosts, deal and I'm here with my real
Speaker 1: tight homegirl and my daughter in law, the beloved Beetrice.
Speaker 2: That's me.
Speaker 1: We are here to talk sister wives, honey, and specifically
Speaker 1: to talk about the catfish.
Speaker 2: We're finally here.
Speaker 1: I think we've been talking about the catfish since we've
Speaker 1: started our podcast. I think we've been doing this podcast
Speaker 1: for what four or five years?
Speaker 2: I think it's like four and a half at this point.
Speaker 1: That's amazing. I know we've been doing this forever, but
Speaker 1: like we've been talking about it from the very beginning,
Speaker 1: we're finally here, Beatrice.
Speaker 2: We made it.
Speaker 1: We did make it. Before we get into this reecap,
Speaker 1: we do have to issue you a disclaimer though, please
Speaker 1: how'd your wife looks good? Room in the class. We're
Speaker 1: in a reverend podcast. Obviously, we say stupid things. We
Speaker 1: make a lot of jokes. Nothing is to be taken seriously,
Speaker 1: and so live yourself. Get out here, William. You might
Speaker 1: want to find yourself another dumpster. But if you're ready
Speaker 1: to have Caleb ask Cody for Maddy's hand in grooming marriage,
Speaker 1: then welcome to this dumpster.
Speaker 2: And if you like what we do over here, please
Speaker 2: be sure to follow us on the Instagram at reality
Speaker 2: tv crnch and join us on Patreon, patron dot com, sosh,
Speaker 2: reality tv Cringe. The VIP dumpster is where it's at. Honestly,
Speaker 2: you get all of our weekly episodes ad free, plus
Speaker 2: bonus content.
Speaker 1: What Morgan you was so much content?
Speaker 2: Guys.
Speaker 1: Now, if you are watching on YouTube, please don't forget
Speaker 1: to like and comment and share, a subscribe, and also
Speaker 1: hype your girls up. We are working for this money
Speaker 1: and we are working for the hypes. Every little thing
Speaker 1: you do helps us send the algorith ball allegedly allegedly,
Speaker 1: and so thank you in advance.
Speaker 2: Thank you.
Speaker 1: Hey, do you have to warn you? I'm on one.
Speaker 2: Yeah, me too.
Speaker 1: I'm like energy is all over the place. I'm excited,
Speaker 1: I'm very tired. I'm about to be drinking. This could
Speaker 1: get very wild, my debt.
Speaker 2: They will.
Speaker 1: So before we get into the recap, I have to
Speaker 1: ask you, Beatrice, did you have any takeaways on this
Speaker 1: the final episode of season nine.
Speaker 2: Well, I've seen this episode before, but it's been a
Speaker 2: minute and so rewatching it again, I can't get over
Speaker 2: how they like edited the catfish conversation because like when
Speaker 2: the adults are talking in Alaska, Mary's just like, I
Speaker 2: don't know what I want to do, so I'm gonna leave.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna do something, but.
Speaker 2: I don't know what it is. But she's not saying, hey,
Speaker 2: I was having phone sex.
Speaker 1: I was having an actual emotional affair with a guy
Speaker 1: who turned out to.
Speaker 2: A woman a woman like, she's not saying that, but
Speaker 2: then to the camera she's airing out all of the
Speaker 2: catfish drama.
Speaker 1: But even then she's skirting around things. She's not just
Speaker 1: coming out plainly and talking about what happened. It was
Speaker 1: really annoying.
Speaker 2: Yeah, super annoying.
Speaker 1: Well, my takeaway is that I think this is a
Speaker 1: very nuanced situation because Mary was really annoying me with
Speaker 1: the way that she was communicating or not communicating. But
Speaker 1: at the same time, I had a lot of sympathy
Speaker 1: and compassion for her because of what she has been
Speaker 1: through in her relationship with Cody. So there's just a
Speaker 1: lot going on. Yeah, I was feeling a lot. Me too.
Speaker 2: Actually, I feel like it's gonna be a very interesting
Speaker 2: discussion today me too.
Speaker 1: So without further ado, let's get into our recap of
Speaker 1: Sister Wives Season nine, episode twelve.
Speaker 2: Twelve, twelve twelve and tot Mary Catfish. She got gone
Speaker 2: by the internet, and I've got some shit to say
Speaker 2: about that when we get to that, because I mean,
Speaker 2: you got a stupid a little bit.
Speaker 1: But oh yeah, it's fine, she admits it.
Speaker 2: Actually she does a little bit. But we resume the
Speaker 2: last half of the Alaska vacation. It's like the fifth
Speaker 2: day or whatever in Alaska. Everybody in the family is like,
Speaker 2: this is the best most fun vacation we've ever had
Speaker 2: in our lives. Like everyone's super happy, especially Cody and Robin,
Speaker 2: Like everyone's living their best life. We have like a
Speaker 2: little scene where we have the older kids, Logan, Michelle, Caleb,
Speaker 2: and Maddie go out to dinner or lunch or whatever
Speaker 2: together and this was like kind of a nothing burger.
Speaker 2: They're kind of like talking about their relationships and growing
Speaker 2: up in polygamy, and Logan does talk a little bit
Speaker 2: about how being the eldest boy in a polygamist family,
Speaker 2: everybody just automatically assumes he's going to be a polygamist
Speaker 2: as well. And actually this is why Michelle didn't pursue
Speaker 2: him at first, even though she thought he was what
Speaker 2: she then realized that he doesn't want to be a polygamist.
Speaker 2: He's a one woman man, and so then she snatched
Speaker 2: him right up.
Speaker 1: Yep. And then I think both Logan and Maddie asked
Speaker 1: their partners whether they were nervous to meet the entire family.
Speaker 1: Were they intimidated by Cody? And Michelle talks about how
Speaker 1: she loves Cody. He's got such a fun, quirky spirit,
Speaker 1: and Caleb's like, yeah, he doesn't intimidate me, not at all.
Speaker 1: Why would he? Yeah, we're the same age.
Speaker 2: Seriously though, it's kind of ridiculous. But I did find
Speaker 2: it interesting when Maddie was talking about like her dating
Speaker 2: experience in high school, because she said, you know, for her,
Speaker 2: she would have boyfriends or whatever, and they would find
Speaker 2: out she grew up in polygamy, and so then they
Speaker 2: would just automatically think it was okay for them to
Speaker 2: date other women while they're dating her, which is whack.
Speaker 2: But she ultimately found Caleb. He sold me, Oh god,
Speaker 2: and I'm just like I'm looking at him and I'm like,
Speaker 2: this dude is like a year younger than me. In
Speaker 2: this episode, you know, and they don't.
Speaker 1: I don't want to be mean. Well, but he's kind
Speaker 1: of a schlub. I mean, he's kind of a schlub.
Speaker 1: And Maddie's eighteen years old, yeah, or like nineteen years
Speaker 1: old or whatever. She is, Like, she's a young chippy.
Speaker 1: You can go out into the world. Man, are a
Speaker 1: diim a dozen? Trust me? Like why are we attracted
Speaker 1: to Caleb brush? But God bless, yeah, that's your life.
Speaker 1: I'm glad you're happy. But I mean, it's a little
Speaker 1: he looks like a character from whovill. He just kind
Speaker 1: of looks like a Marsupial I don't know. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: he's like already balding. God bless, God bless. It happens, funny,
Speaker 1: it does, right, it does.
Speaker 2: But you know whatever. Then we hear from the adults
Speaker 2: a little bit on the couch talking about Logan and
Speaker 2: Michelle and Caleb and Maddie. And it's weird the way
Speaker 2: that they're talking about it, because like Janelle seems a
Speaker 2: little like worried or concerned about Logan and Michelle and
Speaker 2: like whether or not they're gonna get married and what
Speaker 2: their relationship's gonna look like. But when it comes to Maddie,
Speaker 2: and Caleb. She's like super supportive. Everybody in the family
Speaker 2: actually is super supportive and really excited about this twenty eight.
Speaker 1: Year old band. Why do you think that is. I
Speaker 1: don't know.
Speaker 2: I was like watching it, thinking like, maybe it's because
Speaker 2: he was a family he was part of the family before,
Speaker 2: and so they know that he's not creepy. But then
Speaker 2: at the same time, I'm like, it's still kind of creepy,
Speaker 2: like the age difference.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but is he Mormon as well? I don't really
Speaker 1: know if that's been established, because we know that Maddie
Speaker 1: was not accepted into mainstream Mormonism. Yeah, and I'm wondering
Speaker 1: if Caleb practices. So I'm just wondering if there's some
Speaker 1: sort of an alignment religiously because he's been around the
Speaker 1: polygamist structure, he's safe. Yeah, he's a safe person to
Speaker 1: be around. Maybe.
Speaker 2: I just think it's bizarre and it's actually interesting because
Speaker 2: Robin's the only one that points out that disparity. On
Speaker 2: the couch, she says something like, it's weird how we
Speaker 2: have these two extremes, like we're super careful with Logan
Speaker 2: and Michelle, but when it comes to Maddie and Caleb
Speaker 2: were like super gung ho and excited and like already
Speaker 2: planning their wedding. It's just kind of bizarre.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but Michelle is an outsider for sure. Yeah, imperatively speaking.
Speaker 2: Maybe they are just distrustful because they don't know her. Yeah,
Speaker 2: religious extremists or something. It's just bizarre. And then we
Speaker 2: have the family kind of splitting off into two groups
Speaker 2: to do some various activities. We have Cody and Janelle
Speaker 2: and a bunch of the kids going fishing, and then
Speaker 2: we have Christine and Robin and I think Mary's there,
Speaker 2: or maybe she's back at the cabin talking to Sam.
Speaker 2: I don't know. But we have Christine and Robin and
Speaker 2: some of the other kids going to do dog sledding,
Speaker 2: and it's kind of cute. I guess, like the fishing
Speaker 2: trip is fun. I would have rather gone fishing than
Speaker 2: dog sledding for me, sure.
Speaker 1: Because the fish looked amazing, Oh my god, fresh caught halibe.
Speaker 2: And the salmon hitch. Yes, Oh, I would be eating
Speaker 2: so good. And it looked like fun. Christine and Robin
Speaker 2: they're dog sledding and on the couch they're kind of
Speaker 2: commiserating a little bit, talking shit about how it's really
Speaker 2: great that Cody's not there at the dog sledding arena
Speaker 2: because then Cody would see how well behaved the dogs
Speaker 2: are and want his wives to act well, behave like dogs.
Speaker 2: And I'm just like, whoa, you guys are telling on
Speaker 2: yourselves a little bit here. And it was interesting how
Speaker 2: Robin was like even playing into it. Yeah, and she
Speaker 2: seems like she's genuine right, Like she seems like she's
Speaker 2: totally shooting the shit with Christine and laughing and making
Speaker 2: jokes about how Cody would want to treat them like dogs,
Speaker 2: and Robin says something like, well, Nick, the guy who
Speaker 2: holds all of these sled dogs treats them.
Speaker 1: Well, and that's the difference.
Speaker 2: And that's the difference. And I'm like, why is she
Speaker 2: saying that?
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was kind of telling. And this is another attempt,
Speaker 1: I think by Robin to align herself with the other
Speaker 1: wives and sort of Kiki and say, oh my god,
Speaker 1: he treats us like dogs. He treats us so badly.
Speaker 1: But we know, yeah that at this time in the timeline,
Speaker 1: she's absolutely getting favored and getting everything, So it's not
Speaker 1: that funny to me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And it's just interesting to me that she feels
Speaker 2: comfortable making jokes like that that put Cody in a
Speaker 2: bad light because of her alliance and allegiances to Cody
Speaker 2: only always like do you think he watches that back
Speaker 2: and then gets mad at Robin for saying no, I
Speaker 2: think he understands that she's being tactical. Yikes, that's so diabolical.
Speaker 2: But yeah, anyway, so everybody goes vision and they do
Speaker 2: dogs litting and Christine is loud and screaming, and Cody
Speaker 2: on the cow talks about how Christine can't be quiet
Speaker 2: at all. That's why she can't go fishing because she's
Speaker 2: a loud ass bitch.
Speaker 1: She's gonna scare all the fish. We were talking about
Speaker 1: this last week, how annoying she just.
Speaker 2: Has to scream all the time, Like, just use your
Speaker 2: inside voice.
Speaker 1: Chill out, it's not that deep.
Speaker 2: So then we returned back home to the little rental,
Speaker 2: and this is where Caleb actually pulls Cody aside to
Speaker 2: basically ask permission to marry Maddie and ask for her
Speaker 2: handed marriage, which we all saw coming. And Cody is
Speaker 2: giddy and he's like super happy about it, absolutely.
Speaker 1: Just grinning ear to ear. I will say, though, in
Speaker 1: terms of Caleb and the kind of guy he is.
Speaker 1: He seemed very sincere. Yes, and when he was talking
Speaker 1: about his affection for Maddie and how she's his soulmate
Speaker 1: and he thought he would never find his soulmate, and
Speaker 1: like he's just loves her so much, Like I could
Speaker 1: feel that from him. I do think, irrespective of the
Speaker 1: questionable nature around their meeting and courtship, like, I do
Speaker 1: think these two people are made for each other. Me too.
Speaker 1: And he loves her and Maddie loves him.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I like the whole old fashioned like guy
Speaker 2: goes asks the daughter to wait, Guy go ask the daughter,
Speaker 2: Guy go asks the father right for the daughter's hands.
Speaker 1: The patriarchy, I know for sure, but property.
Speaker 2: I know. But it's cute though, Okay.
Speaker 1: I just think it's cute. Tradwife Beatrice, No, Well, I
Speaker 1: was thinking about it.
Speaker 2: I'm like, man, I should ask you for permission for
Speaker 2: your daughter's hand in marriage.
Speaker 1: I just went, oh my god, i'd ever gotten drunk.
Speaker 1: We would have watched rom com. It would have been great.
Speaker 1: Do you know that my husband actually asked my brother
Speaker 1: really for his blessing, not permission, because that really is
Speaker 1: misogynistic but as for my brother's blessing to ask for
Speaker 1: my hand, and my brother was so enthusiastic about it.
Speaker 1: But like I just I do like so sweet. I
Speaker 1: do like that tradition, saying I like a little bit
Speaker 1: of the old fashioned energy.
Speaker 2: Yeah maybe, like I obviously don't agree with women being
Speaker 2: of course, but it's like I thought it was sweet,
Speaker 2: and I think that Caleb is earnest even though you know,
Speaker 2: it's a little way whenever age limit. Okay, it's weird,
Speaker 2: but they're married now, they've got kids. It's a moot
Speaker 2: point at this point. But Cody to the camera has
Speaker 2: some interesting commentary about marriage after this, and he says
Speaker 2: something like Caleb is the essence of manhood. And so
Speaker 2: what I just thought, if Cody's like flamboyantly gay, I thought,
Speaker 2: are you crushing on Caleb or something like it. He
Speaker 2: is such a man, Okay, he's a real man. It's weird,
Speaker 2: it's a little bizarre, strange. But then he talks about
Speaker 2: how he gives full support because he thinks Caleb's a
Speaker 2: good guy and you know, the whole family knows him
Speaker 2: because he was his brother's brother in law or whatever.
Speaker 2: And then he says marriage is the biggest challenge that
Speaker 2: anybody can face in their life. And then he says
Speaker 2: love it sometimes isn't always enough, because one day you
Speaker 2: can love your partner, but then the next day they're
Speaker 2: your enemy. And I'm like, ahm into West States, who's.
Speaker 1: Your enemy today? All three of those original wives.
Speaker 2: Ye. And then when they get back inside after the
Speaker 2: little conversation, this is where Cody and Caleb unpack their
Speaker 2: fish because they're going to debone them or whatever. And
Speaker 2: Grillam and Robin's there and she's pregnant. I will give
Speaker 2: her this. She immediately pukes because of the fishy smell.
Speaker 2: And I'm sure people are like, oh my god, she's
Speaker 2: so dramatic, But I'm like, she's pregnant this morning sickness.
Speaker 1: Or if you know, you were looking with a more
Speaker 1: cynical eye, you could ask yourself like is she stealing
Speaker 1: the limelight from those who went fishing? And is she
Speaker 1: making this big deal about her nausea and her having
Speaker 1: to run off to throw up, Like is it real?
Speaker 2: I don't know, Maybe I just thought it was a
Speaker 2: little crazy, like she goes and throws up and then
Speaker 2: her kids go and comfort her too, which I thought
Speaker 2: was bizarre, like Dayton.
Speaker 1: Runs immediately as soon as she leaves the room, yes,
Speaker 1: right behind her, which actually made me stop and think
Speaker 1: about what that means for how they grew up with her,
Speaker 1: you know, and how they have this kind of caretaking
Speaker 1: role with her.
Speaker 2: It's not healthy.
Speaker 1: It's not healthy at all.
Speaker 2: It's not healthy for kids.
Speaker 1: But also, I mean, maybe it's just genuine care and love.
Speaker 1: I don't know, but it just felt a little strange
Speaker 1: to me.
Speaker 2: To me, it feels like unhealthy because it was Dayton
Speaker 2: and then Aurora showed up right after, and then on
Speaker 2: the couch, those three kids are like defending her and
Speaker 2: being like, well, she's pregnant and she's sick and the
Speaker 2: fish smells bad, and like like, Okay, your kids, chill out.
Speaker 2: M m. You know, it's not a big deal. It's
Speaker 2: not a big deal. But they grow up that fish.
Speaker 2: It looked really good. I'm jealous. Yeah, And then we
Speaker 2: have the conversation. We have the five adults, Christine, Janelle, Cody,
Speaker 2: and Robin going out to dinner.
Speaker 1: At Jack Spratt. I've been there before.
Speaker 2: I was wondering if you had.
Speaker 1: I had been there before. Yeah, it was pretty good. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we had some seafood. It was it was tasty. I
Speaker 1: love seas It's very expensive, but like, sure, very tasty.
Speaker 2: So they go out to dinner and they start off
Speaker 2: with a toast and Cody in particular, is in a
Speaker 2: really good mood. He's like, this is the best vacation
Speaker 2: that we've ever been on. I'm so glad our whole
Speaker 2: family was here. Everybody is like in really light spirits,
Speaker 2: except for Mary.
Speaker 1: Sitting in the corner, her face all red. Just something's
Speaker 1: bothering Mary, and you can tell very odd energy. It
Speaker 1: is weird with her.
Speaker 2: And I'm just going to preface this by saying, I
Speaker 2: don't think that this was the right time for her
Speaker 2: to bring any of this up.
Speaker 1: No, not at all.
Speaker 2: But I think she brought it up because maybe shit
Speaker 2: was getting leaked at this point and so she felt
Speaker 2: the need to bring it up or maybe the producers
Speaker 2: forced her to talk about it at this point.
Speaker 1: Well, but sidebar, do we think or as a community
Speaker 1: in a dumpster, do we think that everybody knew already
Speaker 1: at this point? Because to me, if Mary is just
Speaker 1: going to as a non sequitor drop a bomb like hey,
Speaker 1: I might be leaving the family with absolutely no context
Speaker 1: for that, Like that's a shocking thing to say. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but nobody at the table really seemed shocked. They were
Speaker 1: more like, well, what do you mean? And how can
Speaker 1: we take care of you? What do you need from us?
Speaker 1: Like it just seemed like a strange conversation to have.
Speaker 1: I have a feeling, Well, if you believe the rumors,
Speaker 1: then you know that Robin has been accused of knowing
Speaker 1: all about the Catfisher, and through her friend Kendra, was
Speaker 1: actually gathering intel on what Mary was doing with the Catfisher.
Speaker 1: So Robin then passed that information along to Cody. So
Speaker 1: before Mary even maybe even knew what was going on
Speaker 1: with the catfish, they knew about what was happening. So
Speaker 1: I just feel like, at least Robin and Cody know
Speaker 1: what's going on. But I also just have a feeling
Speaker 1: that maybe Christine and Janelle know as well. What do
Speaker 1: you think?
Speaker 2: My vibe was like, maybe they didn't know. Okay, now
Speaker 2: that you're bringing this up, I'm like, I could see
Speaker 2: maybe Robin and Cody, if we're to believe the rumors,
Speaker 2: I could see Robin and Cody knowing, or at the
Speaker 2: very least just Robin. Maybe she hasn't said anything. I
Speaker 2: don't know. To me, it just felt really weird to
Speaker 2: like glaze over the catfish at the dinner.
Speaker 1: But she's saying in her talking heads that they don't
Speaker 1: even know about it yet. No, yeah, in this moment, right,
Speaker 1: So she's not talking about the catfish. They don't know
Speaker 1: about it a lot at all, okay.
Speaker 2: And so when Mary sits down, she starts off being like,
Speaker 2: it's no surprise, I've been struggling with stuff, Like, okay,
Speaker 2: what stuff.
Speaker 1: It's kind of a surprise to us because we thought
Speaker 1: you were happy about the adoption and you were glad
Speaker 1: at least for the legal marriage with Robin so that
Speaker 1: the kids could be adopted. We thought everything was okay, Like,
Speaker 1: what are you talking about?
Speaker 2: And Mary kind of brings up things that would be
Speaker 2: valid excuses, right, like Leon is no longer living with Mary,
Speaker 2: but Leon hasn't been at home for two years, so
Speaker 2: Mary has been alone for that long, and then you know,
Speaker 2: the divorce and everything. Like, she doesn't really name any
Speaker 2: particular thing or any particular situation as a blame or
Speaker 2: a cause for what she's feeling. She just says she's
Speaker 2: going through shit. To the camera. She tells us that
Speaker 2: she is so lonely and isolated that her house is
Speaker 2: so quiet every single day that she wakes up and
Speaker 2: has to turn music on just so she like doesn't
Speaker 2: go crazy because her house is lonely. And to the viewer,
Speaker 2: it's like, Okay, obviously Cody's not coming over to your house, right,
Speaker 2: He's obviously not even like hanging out with you or
Speaker 2: having a dinner, like you are just alone and like
Speaker 2: none of the family comes over to hang out with you. Now. Granted,
Speaker 2: I don't know if Mary has really like an open
Speaker 2: door policy with the family, because I think was it
Speaker 2: in Christine's book she had mentioned something like you have
Speaker 2: to knock to go to Mary's house.
Speaker 1: That was and Robin too. I didn't think Mary.
Speaker 2: I thought Mary was similar. I don't know. Maybe it
Speaker 2: was at the Lee High House. Maybe I'm talking out
Speaker 2: my ass. But Mary says that she's super lonely and
Speaker 2: isolated and she's just been feeling a lot, and she
Speaker 2: has been withdrawing.
Speaker 1: Okay, so let me comment here just because I'm sure
Speaker 1: the kernel of that is absolutely true. I believe that
Speaker 1: after they were divorced, and actually well before that, Cody
Speaker 1: had one hundred percent pulled away from Mary. I feel
Speaker 1: she has every right to make a decision for herself
Speaker 1: to leave that relationship because she's not getting what she needs.
Speaker 1: She has sold a bill of goods and now she's
Speaker 1: getting the short end of the stick, and she has
Speaker 1: every right to be upset and to leave. However, it
Speaker 1: felt to me in some of these interstitials or the
Speaker 1: talking heads that she was kind of campaigning and setting
Speaker 1: herself up to be a victim and getting the audience
Speaker 1: to sympathize with what she's going through, although she never
Speaker 1: showed it to us before this, so that's why it's
Speaker 1: kind of hard for us to like say, well, what
Speaker 1: are you talking about? Like, I'm sure if I was
Speaker 1: watching back then, which I did, I think start right
Speaker 1: around now, I didn't understand because well, I thought everything
Speaker 1: was good because you guys are always putting on a
Speaker 1: united front. Now all of a sudden, you're telling me
Speaker 1: that it's a haunted house, that you're living in the
Speaker 1: original haunted house, that you're alone all the time, and
Speaker 1: I don't know, I just felt like some of that
Speaker 1: was duplicitous to me. And also the way she was
Speaker 1: just skirting around how everything happened, and I don't know.
Speaker 1: If it were me, I would have been like they
Speaker 1: got me.
Speaker 2: I was lonely.
Speaker 1: And the fact is is Cody hasn't touched my punani
Speaker 1: for years. I'm in a wife, I'm unhappy in this relationship,
Speaker 1: and nobody gives a fuck about me. And so, yeah,
Speaker 1: I made a mistake. I started talking to who I
Speaker 1: thought was a guy, but turns out it was a chick.
Speaker 1: You know, joke's on me. I feel like a fool,
Speaker 1: But there's kind of a reason that it all happened,
Speaker 1: and now I can confront what's really going on in
Speaker 1: my marriage or non marriage and maybe try to fix
Speaker 1: it or maybe I need to leave that. If she
Speaker 1: had said that at the time, I just feel like
Speaker 1: we would have all been on her side and rooting
Speaker 1: for her.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it would be more authentic, it'd be more real.
Speaker 1: This is just like a bunch of word salad. Like
Speaker 1: he was making me laugh. I needed to laugh. I'm like, well,
Speaker 1: but you were also in a tub with a banana
Speaker 1: having conversations just joke, and I assume this is a
Speaker 1: phallic banana and that you're touching yourself in the tub
Speaker 1: because you need some sensual love or whatever, like it's
Speaker 1: more than that from the very beginning. What this shows
Speaker 1: us is that she was not ever prepared to admit
Speaker 1: to her pardon it. And this is why Leon's gonna
Speaker 1: get really mad at Mary, because Leon was there and
Speaker 1: Leon was telling Mary this is what's going on. I
Speaker 1: think Leon even called out that this is probably a catfish.
Speaker 1: Mary didn't listen to them, proceeded to do this to herself,
Speaker 1: and now here we are. I just wish she was
Speaker 1: more direct and more truthful.
Speaker 2: In my opinion, I think the only like duplicitous part
Speaker 2: of it was her skirting around the fact that she
Speaker 2: was like having an online relationship with this person, because
Speaker 2: she talks about it like, well, I was just like
Speaker 2: talking to people on social media and I was like
Speaker 2: making friends and then like I met this one guy
Speaker 2: and he was like becoming like my best friend, and
Speaker 2: like we were laughing and joking and he was expressing
Speaker 2: love for me and kindness and attraction, but like we
Speaker 2: were just friends. Though. Like that's where I'm like, h okay,
Speaker 2: be honest, here, be real. The part where she's like
Speaker 2: kind of victimizing herself. I have more empathy for only
Speaker 2: because I feel like in this religious context, like these
Speaker 2: women are supposed to perform a lot, and they're supposed
Speaker 2: to put on this like facade, and so with Mary,
Speaker 2: it's like I gotta pretend like I'm happy and I
Speaker 2: enjoy being here. I gotta pretend like I'm still like
Speaker 2: a part of this family so I can empathize with
Speaker 2: it doesn't make it right for her to like be
Speaker 2: faking throughout her life and stuff. I just think, Mary,
Speaker 2: I think you're right. Like, Mary didn't expect any of
Speaker 2: this to come out. I think she was expecting to
Speaker 2: run off into the sunset with Sam and like and
Speaker 2: like live her best life and just leave the family
Speaker 2: for Sam. But then it got blown up in her
Speaker 2: face and she got embarrassed. And the whole thing is
Speaker 2: like super embarrassing. I mean, imagine like having your online
Speaker 2: affair be blasted on national TV, like and at the
Speaker 2: time it was everywhere, it was in magazines and stuff,
Speaker 2: like it was a big dial So I feel for her.
Speaker 1: It's just it's just it's the theme of lying, and
Speaker 1: I think it comes part and parcel with the religion itself.
Speaker 1: They have to lie because they have to hide, and
Speaker 1: so there's always secrets so like it. It's just this
Speaker 1: culture of being dishonest. And I think that in this moment,
Speaker 1: Mary is not being accountable for what she consented to
Speaker 1: do with this person who she thought was a man.
Speaker 1: Like I think she was all in. I think she
Speaker 1: was having an absolute emotional affairs. She wanted to meet him.
Speaker 1: She would have probably laid it low and spread it
Speaker 1: wide and had a full blown physical affair if Sam
Speaker 1: was real. So like, just cop to that, own.
Speaker 2: That, And that was interesting that she even admitted to that,
Speaker 2: like saying like, oh, I definitely wanted to meet him.
Speaker 2: I tried to meet up with him a few times,
Speaker 2: but he always refused to meet me. And it's like, Okay,
Speaker 2: that was your first fucking clue, right, And as we're talking.
Speaker 1: About twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen, every other Doctor Phil episode
Speaker 1: was about a catfish or you're a woman, It's something like,
Speaker 1: how did you not know?
Speaker 2: Well?
Speaker 1: She even says that she had a feeling in the
Speaker 1: very beginning that he was feeding her a line of bullshit.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, Mary, if you had a feeling, you're
Speaker 1: a smart cookie, you're running your own business. Why don't
Speaker 1: you do a little bit of investigative journalism and just
Speaker 1: check this person out. But like and maybe, and that's
Speaker 1: where the nuance comes in, because maybe she wanted to
Speaker 1: believe maybe maybe like this was it for her. This
Speaker 1: was the only scrap of attention and affection that she
Speaker 1: had in her universe, and so she just put the
Speaker 1: blinders on and proceeded with Sam slash Jackie. Like it
Speaker 1: stinks all the way around, though, But Mary, you had
Speaker 1: a hand in that one hundred percent, and that's a betrayal. Like,
Speaker 1: and here's the thing, Like, if you're in a terrible
Speaker 1: relationship and you're with an awful partner, like that's not
Speaker 1: good and you have every right to leave, but like
Speaker 1: it's not okay though for your reaction to that to
Speaker 1: be to cheat, exactly and to go out and find
Speaker 1: somebody else that's out of into.
Speaker 2: Yes, And like I think you can. You can empathize
Speaker 2: with her to an extent because she obviously was like
Speaker 2: desperate and isolated and lonely or whatever. But she isn't
Speaker 2: this like blameless person for having this online affair. And again,
Speaker 2: like I said at the beginning of this episode, like
Speaker 2: I thought it was really weird how they kind of
Speaker 2: spliced these conversations together, because when we're back at Jack's
Speaker 2: Bratt and she's talking to the family, like she isn't
Speaker 2: saying I mean, at least what we see in the
Speaker 2: edited footage, she's not saying anything about the catfish. She's
Speaker 2: not talking about not at all. I brought something evil
Speaker 2: into the family. I got this catfish demon, and I'm
Speaker 2: trying to protect you guys. Like she's not saying any
Speaker 2: of that. What she's saying to the family is I
Speaker 2: don't know what I want to do. I don't know
Speaker 2: what I need. I might leave the family. Don't be
Speaker 2: surprised if I'm just up and gone one day. Like
Speaker 2: she's saying these like really extreme statements, and again, like
Speaker 2: I think there's some validity to it because she's obviously unhappy.
Speaker 2: Like you had said, she has every right to leave,
Speaker 2: but like to just drop that bomb, That's where I
Speaker 2: was like saying, I feel like this is not the
Speaker 2: appropriate time to have this conversation on this beautiful vacation
Speaker 2: that everybody's excited about, like to be like, yeah, so
Speaker 2: I've been struggling and I might just leave and disappear
Speaker 2: forever well.
Speaker 1: And it's like the way she beats around the bush.
Speaker 1: Even in that conversation, she can't just come right out
Speaker 1: and say, I'm thinking about leaving the family. I haven't
Speaker 1: been happy for a while. You have all noticed this.
Speaker 1: And then we have Christine in her talking head and
Speaker 1: even Robin saying, yeah, she hasn't been herself these last
Speaker 1: few months. So something is going on with Mary and
Speaker 1: everybody knows it. But she can't just sit down at
Speaker 1: the table and say, hey, this is what it is,
Speaker 1: this is what I think I'm gonna do. I'll let
Speaker 1: you know as soon as I know. It's just this
Speaker 1: beating around the fucking bush, this lack of communication. These
Speaker 1: people don't know how to communicate.
Speaker 2: Not at all, and really like the only people and
Speaker 2: Mary points us out, like the only people that are
Speaker 2: being supportive and understanding of her are Christine and Janelle. Robin,
Speaker 2: according to Mary, has like not wanted anything to do
Speaker 2: with her, doesn't know what to do with her at
Speaker 2: this point because of what she's been struggling with. But
Speaker 2: Robin to the camera says, yeah, when I first noticed
Speaker 2: something was up with Mary, I just made sure to
Speaker 2: talk to her more and know that and let her
Speaker 2: know that we're here for her. We love her, and
Speaker 2: obviously my dream and my hope would be for her
Speaker 2: and Cody to stay married, because I want the whole
Speaker 2: family to.
Speaker 1: Stay that that sweet sweet money.
Speaker 2: I need all of that money because I'm about to
Speaker 2: have another kid and I need another nanny. So I
Speaker 2: just really hope that they can work things out. And
Speaker 2: it's weird because, like Robin did the camera, it does
Speaker 2: kind of seem like she knows that it's about the catfish,
Speaker 2: whereas with Christine and Janelle, like Christine says something like,
Speaker 2: I've noticed that Mary's been struggling. You know, she comes
Speaker 2: to the family events as little as possible. You know,
Speaker 2: she's always on her phone. She's really distant, and I
Speaker 2: just wanted to know that we love her, we're here
Speaker 2: for her. And Janelle' say's the same thing, like no
Speaker 2: matter what our differences are, like we are a support system,
Speaker 2: We're here for her. But Robin is really weird about it.
Speaker 1: And then she cries, does she because I was looking
Speaker 1: for a tear, Honey, she has to break down thinking
Speaker 1: about Mary leaving the family and being unhappy, and it's
Speaker 1: so performative.
Speaker 2: And like way to make it about you, Yeah, Like
Speaker 2: how are you so heartbroken about Mary struggling.
Speaker 1: Kind of like she started to throw up, yet with
Speaker 1: the fish like just snatching that spotlight back to her
Speaker 1: good point.
Speaker 2: And then when they're at the dinner, like Cody's not
Speaker 2: saying anything. He's literally silent.
Speaker 1: Which is weird because you would think if your wife,
Speaker 1: who you love is telling you in the family, I
Speaker 1: might have to bounce doses. Yeah, you'd be like shell shocked.
Speaker 1: You'd be like, what what's going on here? Please tell
Speaker 1: me more? He says nothing at all, sits there with
Speaker 1: a weird smile on his face.
Speaker 2: It's really bizarre, and he like doesn't even look at
Speaker 2: her in the eye, and she's like crying and looking away,
Speaker 2: and then Cody did the camera's like, I don't.
Speaker 1: Know what She's like, she's gonna leave. I don't know.
Speaker 1: That's because Cody already knows. Cody has been in the
Speaker 1: loop with this catfish for months through Kendra, Robin's friend.
Speaker 1: They all know, I don't, I mean Robin, Kendra, and Cody.
Speaker 1: I don't know about Janelle and Christine.
Speaker 2: I feel like Janelle and Christine I believe that they know.
Speaker 2: I mean, like maybe if Cody told Janelle something maybe
Speaker 2: she could know, but I know, I feel like Christine
Speaker 2: didn't know until it got aired out or whatever. My
Speaker 2: thing is, if Robin truly was behind the catfish and
Speaker 2: her goal was to secure her empire, why would she
Speaker 2: be behind this and essentially destroy like Mary and her
Speaker 2: spat in the family and her reputation, Like what would
Speaker 2: her why?
Speaker 1: See, I don't think Robin was behind it. Like, I
Speaker 1: don't think she called up Jackie or whatever her name
Speaker 1: was and said, hey, let's pull this scam on Mary.
Speaker 1: I think that she caught wind of what was happening.
Speaker 1: And I don't know if that's because she was also
Speaker 1: on social media noticing what was happening, or if Kendra
Speaker 1: inserted herself into Jackie's life or whatever, but like at
Speaker 1: some point she became aware of what was happening and
Speaker 1: then they started to just talk about it behind the scenes.
Speaker 2: Then why would she like egg it on? Why would
Speaker 2: she continue to know about it? Well?
Speaker 1: What was her comment last season when she was confronted
Speaker 1: about this? She said something like, well, if Mary thinks
Speaker 1: that I had anything to do with that, then that's
Speaker 1: her problem, or like she got really defensive about the catfish.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and so I'm like, Okay, if you did have
Speaker 2: a hand in it, then like why if you wanted
Speaker 2: to keep the family together, I don't understand. That's my
Speaker 2: whole thing that I don't.
Speaker 1: Because she doesn't. And she's saying that she's so grateful
Speaker 1: for Mary's sacrifice by getting a divorce to Cody so
Speaker 1: that she could marry him and he could adopt her kids.
Speaker 1: Like she keeps saying she loves Mary, she's there for Mary,
Speaker 1: but in truth, I don't think she is at all.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree, Yeah, And it's pretty sad. And Like, ultimately,
Speaker 2: when I was watching this, even though I was frustrated
Speaker 2: by Mary just like beating around the bush and just
Speaker 2: like not saying what she fully means or saying the
Speaker 2: full truth, I did feel really bad for her because
Speaker 2: she was crying a lot. And this is like, again,
Speaker 2: really embarrassing to have it be aired out. I do
Speaker 2: wish that she could have been more honest about the
Speaker 2: fact that she fell in love with this made up
Speaker 2: dude with a fake photo.
Speaker 1: And she's probably being forced to do this on camera yea,
Speaker 1: because the whole nation is going to talk about it exactly,
Speaker 1: and so they're gonna have to address it. So can
Speaker 1: you imagine she knows she's going to the gallows, she's
Speaker 1: going to this dinner, and she's gonna have to say
Speaker 1: something to these people, and it's going to be terrible,
Speaker 1: it's gonna be embarrassing, and so she kind of just
Speaker 1: falls apart and doesn't say much. Yeah, she's obviously emotional.
Speaker 1: I liked seeing Christine being very supportive and so, but
Speaker 1: I kind of also understand why Mary didn't turn to Christine,
Speaker 1: for example, to sort of share what was going on
Speaker 1: with her and in her life or the catfish, because
Speaker 1: Christine is so judgmental from that Mormon aub perspective. If
Speaker 1: anybody at that table would have been there, I think
Speaker 1: for Mary it would have been Janelle. I think Janelle
Speaker 1: would have sat down with her, heard about the catfish,
Speaker 1: heard about her situation, and honestly helped her.
Speaker 2: Janelle the Taurus would have been like the only grounding force.
Speaker 2: I feel like, I feel like she would have been
Speaker 2: the only one that would have quietly listened, like without judgment.
Speaker 2: Maybe she would have had a little bit of like
Speaker 2: what the fuck, but like not enough to like put
Speaker 2: Mary off or whatever. I feel like Christine one hundred
Speaker 2: percent would have judged her. And it's funny because Christine
Speaker 2: said something in this episode like Mary wants to run away,
Speaker 2: but we're more of a support system than that, Like
Speaker 2: you owe us to stay here because we'll support you.
Speaker 2: And I'm like, well, really though, because you guys don't
Speaker 2: really like each other. And that's the other layer of
Speaker 2: all of this. It's like Christine and Janelle are saying
Speaker 2: like they're really supportive, but like Mary and Janelle don't
Speaker 2: really like each other. Christine doesn't get along with Mary
Speaker 2: because we know from her book that Mary was mean
Speaker 2: and has always been mean, and like Christine's jealous of
Speaker 2: Robin and doesn't like her. Janelle doesn't really like her,
Speaker 2: but she tolerates her. Like none of these women actually
Speaker 2: like each other, right, so there really isn't a support system.
Speaker 1: At all, or isn't actually safe at that table at all?
Speaker 2: No, And like in the family, like Mary doesn't really
Speaker 2: have anybody at all, and she has no friends, like
Speaker 2: she hasn't met Jen at this point. I don't think
Speaker 2: I think she has this. Well, then she should have
Speaker 2: fucking talked Jen.
Speaker 1: She probably did. Maybe maybe Jen new, Maybe Jen new,
Speaker 1: I don't know, but I think she could have shared
Speaker 1: with Janelle. I mean Janelle left Cody a couple of times. Yeah,
Speaker 1: moved out of the state, fuck you both fingers right,
Speaker 1: and left his ass. Like I think she would totally
Speaker 1: get it and hopefully support Mary, but like that's just
Speaker 1: a relationship. It's like two ships in they just never
Speaker 1: get that shit together Janelle and Mary.
Speaker 2: No, not at all. And like I will say, I
Speaker 2: think Mary is a little bit dumb for being catfish
Speaker 2: by somebody online because I'm just like, this is so stupid. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and like you're also like a TV personality, Like why
Speaker 2: don't you think about totally the fact that people are
Speaker 2: totally going to be messaging you to try and get
Speaker 2: dirt on you.
Speaker 1: So his profile picture, and I don't know if y'all
Speaker 1: remember what that was, it was like a black and
Speaker 1: white sort of business y sort of picture. He was
Speaker 1: a young man with dark hair. He was very classically handsome.
Speaker 1: So she saw the profile picture and she was just like,
Speaker 1: let me get a banana.
Speaker 2: It's so embarrassing.
Speaker 1: It is embarrassing, And she's so embarrassed in this moment.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because it's cringe dude, like twenty sixteen, Like you're
Speaker 2: like in your forties. It's not even like you're a
Speaker 2: boomer who's like learning how to use a computer for
Speaker 2: the first time, Like, oh, you're an adult. You know
Speaker 2: how technology.
Speaker 1: Weren't on the internet probably for well she's a Mormon,
Speaker 1: I don't know, but like I was on the internet
Speaker 1: ninety three, honey, Yeah, I was on the internet for real.
Speaker 2: Well, Facebook was invented in like two thousand and eight, Like,
Speaker 2: it's not like it was so new, like you could
Speaker 2: I don't know. I just think it was really silly
Speaker 2: to like fall for this very obviously fake profile. But
Speaker 2: she was like talking to him on the phone and
Speaker 2: again probably having phone sex and just like living her
Speaker 2: best life.
Speaker 1: So was this chick Jackie like just doing a male
Speaker 1: voice or did she have some sort of like voice
Speaker 1: transformer or something like what happened with that? I don't know.
Speaker 1: How would you not know?
Speaker 2: Because I thought was it Leon that said it or
Speaker 2: Christine that said it? Like Leon had overheard the conversations
Speaker 2: and like knew that it was a woman. Like so
Speaker 2: I don't know if Sam was even using any voice
Speaker 2: altering stuff. I know that stuff exists, and it definitely exists,
Speaker 2: back existed back then, But like was Mary just falling
Speaker 2: for a bush?
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's the next thing. Let's continue to ascend
Speaker 1: because maybe at some point, like if, as she says
Speaker 1: this episode, she had a feeling, like one week into
Speaker 1: their conversation Mary and Sam, she had a feeling that
Speaker 1: he was horseshitting her. Maybe at some point she realized, Oh,
Speaker 1: I'm I'm talking to a chick and I like it.
Speaker 1: Maybe and I'm not mad at it. So I'm gonna
Speaker 1: continue to have this conversation. I don't know, because she
Speaker 1: does seem very betrayed by Jackie, and.
Speaker 2: I know she like calls him a bastard, like she's
Speaker 2: super pissed off that he would have the audacity to
Speaker 2: fake a profile. But I'm like, you still, like you'd said,
Speaker 2: you still chose to talk to him and have phone
Speaker 2: sex and send pictures with your banana in your mouth.
Speaker 1: It's like, though you were dubious, but this person was.
Speaker 1: And remember didn't Mary go to Disneyland? And Sam sent
Speaker 1: his best friend Jackie to meet Mary because I can't go.
Speaker 1: I'm very busy. I'm a businessman, so but I'm gonna
Speaker 1: send my friend who's really good with technology. You don't
Speaker 1: want to mess with her. I'm gonna send her to Disneyland.
Speaker 1: And Mary actually met Jackie at this time. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: think before this time, she's already been to Disneyland. She
Speaker 1: thought she was meeting Sam's best friend, but she was
Speaker 1: meeting her actual catfish. So she did meet her.
Speaker 2: And that's what's crazy to me, So like you were
Speaker 2: actively going to meet this person outside of your family,
Speaker 2: outside of your marriage. I will say she did mention
Speaker 2: a little bit of that, being like, you know, I
Speaker 2: can't believe I did this type of a thing. I'm
Speaker 2: a married woman and like I have a family, but
Speaker 2: it was lonely and I was talking to me for I.
Speaker 1: Don't think she was ever as overt as that.
Speaker 2: She did say something like I was married, and why
Speaker 2: am I doing this outside of my marriage? But I was.
Speaker 2: It was my friend, my friend who.
Speaker 1: Said made me laugh. I was laughing again in my
Speaker 1: lonely house, and.
Speaker 2: He said he was attracted to me and my poor nanny.
Speaker 1: Oh god. So it's sad, it's also enraging. It's also
Speaker 1: like Crinn, but it's what happened to Mary Brown. And
Speaker 1: here we are going into the next season.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and so that's the question, are we going to
Speaker 2: watch the tell all for this because I do remember
Speaker 2: in this season they do address the catfish and the
Speaker 2: tell all and it is with Tambern Hall.
Speaker 1: Can we not do it as like a recap of
Speaker 1: an episode, but like maybe we can just watch it before. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we'll spark notes and then we'll watch the first episode
Speaker 1: of season ten and we can talk about anything that
Speaker 1: was germane from this tell all.
Speaker 2: It sounds good to me, okay.
Speaker 1: Babes Well, is that the last thing that happened.
Speaker 2: That was pretty much it? It was like the whole
Speaker 2: conversation of just the catfish and Cody's confused okay about
Speaker 2: what she means? And the season ends.
Speaker 1: Well, what are your thoughts out there? Guys? Were you
Speaker 1: around when this dropped in twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen, whenever
Speaker 1: it aired? What were your thoughts then? What are your
Speaker 1: thoughts now? Knowing what you know, Like, what do you
Speaker 1: think about Mary now and how she dealt with it
Speaker 1: throughout the entire rest of their marriage? I'm interested? Yeah,
Speaker 1: is there anything else that we need to say to
Speaker 1: these beautiful raccoons before we get up on out of here?
Speaker 2: Beadrels Well, if you love our podcast, please do us
Speaker 2: a favor, go to your favorite podcast platform and Lebo's
Speaker 2: a glowing five star review. Really helps us grow the
Speaker 2: pod and we really appreciate it, so thank you very much.
Speaker 1: We're gonna be back next week to get into season
Speaker 1: ten this Bitch finally, yes, and talk a little bit
Speaker 1: more about the catfish. And also, didn't I send you
Speaker 1: something on Instagram on a new show that might be interesting?
Speaker 2: What was it Married at First Site? Right, there's a revamp.
Speaker 1: Married at First Site has been taken over by Peacock
Speaker 1: and they've refreshed it. It's not two hours each episode,
Speaker 1: I think. Let me know if I'm wrong about that.
Speaker 1: But it's also modernized, so I don't know if it's
Speaker 1: like a little bit more like Love Island or like
Speaker 1: a little bit more like something like that. I don't know. Guys,
Speaker 1: if you're watching, tell us what you think about it.
Speaker 1: But we're thinking about maybe covering it.
Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, it sounds interesting if it's better than the original,
Speaker 2: I'm down.
Speaker 1: Well, did you also see that thing I sent to
Speaker 1: you on Instagram about those wives who are doing only
Speaker 1: fans and the men who manage them. Yeah?
Speaker 2: What was it called?
Speaker 1: Like something about I don't know, ladies out just in
Speaker 1: Suburbia being oas God on the internet, which is my favorite.
Speaker 1: I love a huah, I.
Speaker 2: Did find it. What is it called tillim like the
Speaker 2: Mom next Door? Double Lives of Suburban Wives.
Speaker 1: Gosh, you just never know, do you?
Speaker 2: Oh my god, I would be into that if it's
Speaker 2: a bunch of soccer moms being.
Speaker 1: I'm like so gunshy with TLC after poly Family and
Speaker 1: like suddenly Homage, Like those were so overly produced, they
Speaker 1: were such a drag. I didn't want to watch them anymore.
Speaker 2: But these ones look legit though.
Speaker 1: Kind of are you guys gonna watch? Do you have
Speaker 1: any suggestions for something that we can watch until the
Speaker 1: new season of Sister Wives comes on?
Speaker 2: Perfectly, something that's not like a slog to watch, like
Speaker 2: a fucking ninety day.
Speaker 1: I don't have that kind of time.
Speaker 2: Two hour episodes and like for four weeks we're in
Speaker 2: the same scene. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's got to be something out there though that
Speaker 1: we can watch and have some fun with double lives
Speaker 1: of supermin lives. Okay, I don't married at first sight. Okay,
Speaker 1: let us know what you guys think. We'll be back
Speaker 1: next week, Like I said, until then, please do not
Speaker 1: forget that we have nothing but love for you, and
Speaker 2: Please all night