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<v Speaker 1>You see something's going to happen. What's going to happen?

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<v Speaker 1>What I Welcome back to the Occult Rejects. Today's guest

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<v Speaker 1>is Tree Car author Ted X, speaker, dreaming guide and

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<v Speaker 1>teacher working in the field of trans personal psychology with

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<v Speaker 1>a focus on dreams, death, altered states of consciousness and

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<v Speaker 1>psychedelic assistant therapy. She studied psychedelics and altered states through

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<v Speaker 1>the Out of Trust, studied ecology, spirituality and paranormal through

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<v Speaker 1>the Sofia Center at the University of Wales Trinity Saint David,

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<v Speaker 1>and also studied at the Arthur Finlay College of Psychic Science.

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<v Speaker 1>She teaches through the College of Psychic Studies in London.

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<v Speaker 1>Is a faculty member at the Magical Path School of

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<v Speaker 1>Witchcraft in New York. Has taught lucid dreaming practices at

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<v Speaker 1>the Royal College of Art and also worked with platforms

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<v Speaker 1>like the Psychedelic Society UK and She's Lost Control. She's

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<v Speaker 1>the author of a wide range of books and projects,

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<v Speaker 1>including Dreams, Conscious Dreamer, The Artist's Oracle, Espel a Day

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<v Speaker 1>Dreamwork and now Technomancy, her forthcoming book from Watkins Publishing.

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<v Speaker 1>Before stepping fully into the esoteric and therapeutic arts. She

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<v Speaker 1>also had a background in music writing and film, including

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<v Speaker 1>running the East London cult film Society Today is Born

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<v Speaker 1>from twenty from two thousand and two to twenty twelve

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<v Speaker 1>and collaborating musically with artists, including test Parts. Her official

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<v Speaker 1>bio says she was born in nineteen seventy two and

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<v Speaker 1>spent her early childhood on a commune in the southern

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<v Speaker 1>United States, which she credits as part of her lifelong

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<v Speaker 1>attraction to mysticism, the strange, and the unseen. Her TEDx

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<v Speaker 1>talk asked a simple but potent question, can your dreams

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<v Speaker 1>tell you something? And that same threshold sensibility seems to

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<v Speaker 1>run through all her work Dreams, ritual grief, altered consciousness, symbolism,

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<v Speaker 1>and the edges between ordinary life and the unseen. And

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<v Speaker 1>now she's bringing that worldview into the digital age with Technomancy,

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<v Speaker 1>tech Magic and Spells for the twenty first Century, which

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<v Speaker 1>a two hundred and eighty two page book scheduled for

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<v Speaker 1>release on May twelfth, twenty twenty six, according to the publisher,

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<v Speaker 1>could be wrong, and the book explores sacred digital space,

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<v Speaker 1>emoji signals, the smartphone as a modern wand social media

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<v Speaker 1>as magical terrain and even ai as an oracular presence

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<v Speaker 1>with magical practice. All right, that's enough out of me.

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<v Speaker 1>Now let me introduce Sonre, who is co hosting the

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<v Speaker 1>show with me today. Very happy to get you back

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<v Speaker 1>on BUD. I like you when you're on the show.

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<v Speaker 2>Man.

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<v Speaker 1>You've got some good angles and great stuff to add.

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<v Speaker 1>Please or let everybody know what is up with you

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<v Speaker 1>and where they can find all your amazing work in

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<v Speaker 1>your school.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah right, and thank you very much. Nick. I like

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<v Speaker 3>doing this show. I like to thank you for more

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<v Speaker 3>than I like doing my show.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>My name is Sonri. I am the host of the

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<v Speaker 3>Order of Chaost podcast and the Order of cast University,

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<v Speaker 3>where you can, you know, come hang out with us

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<v Speaker 3>if you want to and learn a system of magic

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<v Speaker 3>I call chaos witchcraft god. But coming out in October

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<v Speaker 3>with wiser and uh and yeah, I'm bad. Given introductions

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<v Speaker 3>is good enough for awesome.

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<v Speaker 1>Thank you so much here and again thank you for

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<v Speaker 1>joining us and Shre. Finally to you, is there anything

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<v Speaker 1>that you would like to add or that I left

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<v Speaker 1>out or anything you like to plug a promo? Please?

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<v Speaker 2>No, No, you covered a lot. It made me feel

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<v Speaker 2>like really old actually I was like, Wow, that's like

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<v Speaker 2>my whole life like flashing up before my eyes. And

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<v Speaker 2>but that's a good place to be to look can

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<v Speaker 2>go Wow, there's some stuff that got experienced.

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<v Speaker 1>You did the dance things so far, haven't you good? Good?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, it was an impressive introduction on your partner and

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<v Speaker 3>also an impressive bio and tree. I am embarrassed to

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<v Speaker 3>say I was not familiar with you or your work

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<v Speaker 3>before I was scheduled this meeting. But I'm taking a

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<v Speaker 3>look at it now and I'm listening to a nixt

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<v Speaker 3>introduction and I've already got a thousand questions. So it's

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<v Speaker 3>wonderful to meet you, and very very cool, cool life

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<v Speaker 3>you've led.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's been a very weird and wonderful one. It's

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<v Speaker 2>one of those ones where like as a kid, I

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<v Speaker 2>was always scratching my head about like what am I

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<v Speaker 2>going to be when I grow up. I'm just so like,

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know I'll ever have a normal job, Like

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<v Speaker 2>I just think that I was sort of set up

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<v Speaker 2>from early childhood that I just I don't think I

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<v Speaker 2>would have a normal job like I remember in the eighties.

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<v Speaker 2>I think we might all be in the same age group.

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<v Speaker 2>I was born in seventy two, if you guys are

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<v Speaker 2>seventies eighty three. Yeah, in the eighties, it was really popular,

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<v Speaker 2>especially in middle school junior high school, to to kind

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<v Speaker 2>of like feed into like the old fashioned cooters, like

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<v Speaker 2>your talents or skills, and then it would spew out

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<v Speaker 2>this sort of like really long printed out kind of

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<v Speaker 2>message of your best suit of jobs. And my best

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<v Speaker 2>suited jobs were really like it didn't give me confidence.

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<v Speaker 2>One of them was professional clown, which now I look

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<v Speaker 2>back and think that's great, like actually like you know,

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<v Speaker 2>the trickster, the clown, the pool. Another one was a

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<v Speaker 2>religious leader, and I was just thinking, okay, how would

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<v Speaker 2>like like a cult leader, like what does that mean?

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<v Speaker 2>And then I think the third one was like an

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<v Speaker 2>interior designer. But I mean look at my room, like

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<v Speaker 2>I don't I don't think so, I'm I'm it's kind

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<v Speaker 2>of mad and I've kind of got to organized chaos.

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<v Speaker 2>So I think I feel at you knowy three year

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<v Speaker 2>old now just going like phew, I made it, and

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<v Speaker 2>I think I know what I do now. But it's

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<v Speaker 2>all the weird stuff. It's all the weird stuff.

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<v Speaker 3>Did you did you ever have a normal job. Was

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<v Speaker 3>that ever a part of your path?

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<v Speaker 2>Let's see, did ever have a normal job? Well, very

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<v Speaker 2>first job was flipping burgers at McDonald's for like a summer,

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<v Speaker 2>so I mean most teenagers were doing that, and then

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<v Speaker 2>like you know, having to do the grunt work with

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<v Speaker 2>with with that, and quickly uh getting out of it,

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<v Speaker 2>especially as a vegan, not not the best place to

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<v Speaker 2>work when you're kind of vegan.

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<v Speaker 1>Some dedication right there.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, well Lena is to say it probably lasted about

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<v Speaker 2>a month, but yeah, I mean in terms of normal jobs,

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<v Speaker 2>not really. I mean we're probably teenage jobs. But quickly

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<v Speaker 2>I was like, I can't work for the I cannot

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<v Speaker 2>work for multi death corporations and for the man. And

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<v Speaker 2>so he sort of pivoted into a like just become

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<v Speaker 2>an entrepreneur, just you know, just look into things that

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<v Speaker 2>are your talents and make something happen of it. So

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<v Speaker 2>I basically started my first business at thirty years old,

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<v Speaker 2>so in London, and I opened up like a cult

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<v Speaker 2>film video film shop, video shop, and film club and

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<v Speaker 2>around that for a very long time in London. So yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>it was kind of like I just got to do

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<v Speaker 2>what makes me happy, and so all the weird stuff

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<v Speaker 2>makes me happy.

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<v Speaker 1>I totally get that one thing. I guess I do

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<v Speaker 1>want to kind of touch on at the beginning before

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<v Speaker 1>we get into it, and not to make it like

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<v Speaker 1>a making it a hit piece or looking at it

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<v Speaker 1>in a weird way. I do want to kind of

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<v Speaker 1>to get an idea what was it like growing like

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<v Speaker 1>with the Commune in the United States, growing up like that,

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<v Speaker 1>Just get an idea of like, you know.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, there were really weird times in the early seventies

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<v Speaker 2>because we had a lot of change going on, especially

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<v Speaker 2>in the States, and you know, the sort of hippie movement,

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<v Speaker 2>the psychedelic movement, and so a lot of change, social movement,

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<v Speaker 2>social change, political change, Vietnam, you name it, right, So

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<v Speaker 2>there was a real hunger to sort of living differently

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<v Speaker 2>at that time. And so the commune slash cult that

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<v Speaker 2>I grew up in a freak commune cult. So a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of people who were ex hippies, X Vietnam vets,

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<v Speaker 2>and people who had drug issues, drug problems. It's these

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<v Speaker 2>sort of things were really apparent back then, like the

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<v Speaker 2>Children of God, the Jesus People movement, all of these

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<v Speaker 2>kind of things. And was it like, well, it was

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<v Speaker 2>pretty much was a big formative impression since I was

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<v Speaker 2>a form child growing up in the formative years there

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<v Speaker 2>no television, no radio, no pop culture, no outside influence

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<v Speaker 2>in terms of very sheltered. But then also seeing all

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<v Speaker 2>like the kind of like adults acting in crazy ways,

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<v Speaker 2>like you know, going around on the floor, possessed by demons,

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<v Speaker 2>speaking in tongues like, you know, seeing all the like

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<v Speaker 2>signs and wonders that that came that belief system, and

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<v Speaker 2>so that's a lot to take in as a kid.

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<v Speaker 2>And the good things were seeing one of us learned

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<v Speaker 2>how to play instruments, So I played tons of different

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<v Speaker 2>instruments and read a lot and was creative. So it

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<v Speaker 2>helped develop extreme creativity in me, I suppose. And then

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<v Speaker 2>also a really deep connection to like the mystical side

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<v Speaker 2>of life, like dreaming. And I had a near death

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<v Speaker 2>experience when when I lived there when I was four,

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<v Speaker 2>so that also really really unlocked kind of super experiencer

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<v Speaker 2>kind of situations and you know all the anomalous and strange,

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<v Speaker 2>high weird situations that come from coming back from the

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<v Speaker 2>brink of death, you know. So that was probably the

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<v Speaker 2>biggest influence for a lot of the stuff that I

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<v Speaker 2>support people and hold space for people in now as well.

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<v Speaker 1>That so mix I was going to say, the ND

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<v Speaker 1>probably is one of the most actually impactful things in

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<v Speaker 1>your life, right, Oh for sure.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Like it definitely was, And it wasn't really until

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<v Speaker 2>you know, like you just sort of real as you

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<v Speaker 2>get older and you look back, You're like, yeah, your

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<v Speaker 2>death experience, Yeah, I know, you just kind of put

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<v Speaker 2>it on the sho shelf of experience of life. And

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<v Speaker 2>then as I got older, I started to step into

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<v Speaker 2>the role of like I'm a death duelist, so I

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<v Speaker 2>hold space for people who are dying. So I've been

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<v Speaker 2>doing that for the last fteen years, you know, and

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<v Speaker 2>looking back and connecting the dots of all my experiences,

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<v Speaker 2>I was like, whoa, it all started really that near experience,

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<v Speaker 2>Like that's where it all started. In fact, like when

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<v Speaker 2>my dad pulled me out of the ocean after the

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<v Speaker 2>near drowning. He put me back to land, and the

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<v Speaker 2>first thing he did was he took out his camera

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<v Speaker 2>and he took a photo of me. That would have

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<v Speaker 2>been like nineteen seventy six, And like years later, when

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<v Speaker 2>I was a teenager going through the photo album, I said, Dad,

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<v Speaker 2>why did you take a photo of me after I

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<v Speaker 2>got back from the brink death? And he said, because

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<v Speaker 2>can't you see your eyes in this picture? And I

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<v Speaker 2>was like, look at my eyes and thought, wow, how

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<v Speaker 2>did I not see that before? Like guys are like

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<v Speaker 2>two black voids? And he said, your eyes changed and

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<v Speaker 2>I wanted to capture that because it was so uncanny.

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<v Speaker 2>I thought, the pue my altar, so grab it and

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<v Speaker 2>I need it to be on my altar because I

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<v Speaker 2>need it to remind every day. I don't know if

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<v Speaker 2>you can see how dark the eyes like voids?

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<v Speaker 3>That absolutely wow, it looks like those It's not just

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<v Speaker 3>your eyes. There's there's more going on I see, but yeah, wow.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so just staring into the void, I came back

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<v Speaker 2>staring from the boy. So I I this lives with

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<v Speaker 2>my altar because it remins me every day, momento more

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<v Speaker 2>every day. It's like, you know, you I know how

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<v Speaker 2>to sit with death, like I know how to hold

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<v Speaker 2>compassionate presence for people who are scared to die. And

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<v Speaker 2>so I have to become the four year old again,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, in order to hold So yeah, anyway that

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<v Speaker 2>these things shaped me into what I do today. So

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<v Speaker 2>you know that list got in middle full of the

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<v Speaker 2>clown and the religious leader is here, your designer. I

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<v Speaker 2>don't know where that fits in, but I think what

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<v Speaker 2>I'm doing now is sort of from the school of life. Really,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, taught me what to do basically.

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<v Speaker 3>Treat you just as taking a wild guess here, and

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<v Speaker 3>I could be totally off. Just I'm just curious. You

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<v Speaker 3>happen to have a lot of Scorpio in your chart.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I like scorpio sunn and rising.

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<v Speaker 3>Astrology is so fucking real man, Yes, scored because the

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<v Speaker 3>scorpio loves to get close to death. Scorpio is death.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I know it's the eighth house kind of like, ah,

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<v Speaker 2>there we go. And I've never been afraid of it.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, like even in the moments where I had

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<v Speaker 2>that ND as a kid. And it's so hard to

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<v Speaker 2>articulate this because obviously it's a little four year old.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not sitting there articulating it. It's like in retrospect,

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<v Speaker 2>but I had a weird thing as a child where

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<v Speaker 2>a really deep, deep memory, like I have memories of

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<v Speaker 2>crawling around in my diaper and like very specific, veryific

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<v Speaker 2>things and perspectives and vantage points even like sitting out

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<v Speaker 2>in the grass and like looking at my little baby feet,

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<v Speaker 2>I think like, wow, I look at my little feet.

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<v Speaker 2>Like having sort of like the observer effect. I had

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<v Speaker 2>that really early on SPIRED, so I was able to

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<v Speaker 2>kind of like I don't know, like integrate that experience.

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<v Speaker 2>But when I had the ANTE, I went to the

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<v Speaker 2>whole other pace and had a real sense that the

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<v Speaker 2>ocean was also conscious, and the ocean like was a

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00:14:54.279 --> 00:14:57.039
<v Speaker 2>an entity in its own right. But it did it didn't.

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<v Speaker 2>It's like it was kind of like how I communed.

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<v Speaker 2>It was sort of like it was saying sort of

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<v Speaker 2>like it's not nothing personal, it's not personal, that you're

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<v Speaker 2>doing nothing personal. And there was a sort of like

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<v Speaker 2>understanding and a non attachment connected to that, like oh okay,

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<v Speaker 2>and but I'm okay, I'm not in pain any like

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<v Speaker 2>fucking drowning and salt water and you know, scrambling to

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<v Speaker 2>try to grab those posts of the dock and it

255
00:15:23.720 --> 00:15:27.799
<v Speaker 2>sliced my up from the barnacles and I just went

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<v Speaker 2>to this other place. But what was what really impacted

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<v Speaker 2>me was that I was shown like I had I

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00:15:33.840 --> 00:15:35.960
<v Speaker 2>was like a nonlinear time and I was able to

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00:15:35.960 --> 00:15:39.080
<v Speaker 2>see like what was coming next like the future, and

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<v Speaker 2>I saw like all the emergency vehicles land to the beach,

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<v Speaker 2>like getting there, my parents giving reports, my parents distraught,

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<v Speaker 2>like beyond belief, and them never finding my body again.

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<v Speaker 2>And the grief I felt for my parents and empathy

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<v Speaker 2>and compaction I felt for them was unbelievable, was like cosmic.

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<v Speaker 2>It was I can't oh, it's like deep love and

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00:16:02.279 --> 00:16:05.000
<v Speaker 2>knowing like I've always been with them and they've always

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<v Speaker 2>been with us all together, and uh, I had more

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00:16:08.639 --> 00:16:12.559
<v Speaker 2>concern for them they did about me being dead or dying.

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<v Speaker 2>You know. It was very interesting and so yeah, that's

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<v Speaker 2>kind of I think one of the big initiators of

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<v Speaker 2>my life and in a very scorpio moment. So it's

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00:16:24.799 --> 00:16:26.960
<v Speaker 2>it's made me not afraid of death. Like literally, like

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<v Speaker 2>a few years later, my grandpa died and I understood

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<v Speaker 2>where he went, like I just kind of understood, all

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<v Speaker 2>is okay, And when they are in the casket at

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<v Speaker 2>the wake, I was super comfortable just going up to

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<v Speaker 2>him holding putting my hand in the casket and holding

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<v Speaker 2>his hand and touching him and by real going what

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00:16:45.960 --> 00:16:48.480
<v Speaker 2>are you doing? You can't do that? But then I

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00:16:48.519 --> 00:16:50.639
<v Speaker 2>was like the teenager that was like, you know, when

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<v Speaker 2>there was a death in the circle of my mother

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<v Speaker 2>or granny's family, like, oh, come to the wake, I'd

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00:16:56.000 --> 00:16:59.080
<v Speaker 2>be like, all right, little weirdo, Okay, yeah, sure you

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00:16:59.120 --> 00:17:03.639
<v Speaker 2>can come around. So it's always like very scorpio, just

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00:17:03.919 --> 00:17:06.319
<v Speaker 2>comfortable around that. I wanted to be around it and

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00:17:06.880 --> 00:17:09.160
<v Speaker 2>not in a morbid way, but I just kind of

287
00:17:09.160 --> 00:17:11.880
<v Speaker 2>felt like, I don't know, just I need to be

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00:17:11.920 --> 00:17:16.119
<v Speaker 2>in those spaces to help people. So a bit of

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<v Speaker 2>that service orientated.

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<v Speaker 1>That's okyo, Yeah, that's wild. Pick that scorpios on it.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, I'm in my observation right just from doing this

292
00:17:29.559 --> 00:17:33.559
<v Speaker 3>for for half my life. A little more scorpio, the

293
00:17:33.640 --> 00:17:37.279
<v Speaker 3>more scorpio energy, more scorpial placements you have in your chart,

294
00:17:37.319 --> 00:17:41.640
<v Speaker 3>the more people around you will die or the other

295
00:17:41.680 --> 00:17:45.000
<v Speaker 3>option is that you will die and come back, And

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<v Speaker 3>the stronger the scorpio placements, the more likely that is.

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00:17:48.519 --> 00:17:52.240
<v Speaker 3>And it's you know, astrologies. I'm not going to sit

298
00:17:52.240 --> 00:17:54.799
<v Speaker 3>here and say it's one hundred per always dead on accurate,

299
00:17:54.880 --> 00:17:58.039
<v Speaker 3>but it's like ninety eight percent fucking dead on accurate.

300
00:17:59.079 --> 00:18:01.319
<v Speaker 3>You know, there's always at the rule, but.

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00:18:03.559 --> 00:18:06.319
<v Speaker 2>It tracks, and that's interesting what you say about like

302
00:18:06.440 --> 00:18:10.400
<v Speaker 2>a load of deaths around you, because I basically had

303
00:18:10.440 --> 00:18:13.960
<v Speaker 2>these uncanny synchronicities all my life, really initiated as a

304
00:18:14.000 --> 00:18:18.559
<v Speaker 2>teenager where I have a lot of friends who are

305
00:18:18.640 --> 00:18:21.759
<v Speaker 2>dying or their parents were, and I was really there

306
00:18:21.839 --> 00:18:25.559
<v Speaker 2>for those situations but without fear. And then these crazy

307
00:18:25.759 --> 00:18:30.240
<v Speaker 2>episodes which have been following my whole life where I'm

308
00:18:30.400 --> 00:18:34.279
<v Speaker 2>in about public and I'm the person who is there

309
00:18:34.440 --> 00:18:38.319
<v Speaker 2>when someone's run over by a car, someone is thrown

310
00:18:38.359 --> 00:18:43.359
<v Speaker 2>off their bike, somebody has fainted on the escalator and

311
00:18:43.480 --> 00:18:45.799
<v Speaker 2>or fallen down the stairs, and they're like literally I'm

312
00:18:45.839 --> 00:18:48.519
<v Speaker 2>the first there. And it got to the point where

313
00:18:48.599 --> 00:18:52.880
<v Speaker 2>it's happened so much, my friends and my partner pointing

314
00:18:52.880 --> 00:18:55.039
<v Speaker 2>it out like every time we go out something like

315
00:18:55.480 --> 00:18:58.039
<v Speaker 2>you know, I started getting the complex like I sort

316
00:18:58.039 --> 00:19:01.960
<v Speaker 2>of like you know, grim Reaper or something that was

317
00:19:01.960 --> 00:19:05.920
<v Speaker 2>making it happen. But one of the biggest moments that

318
00:19:06.119 --> 00:19:10.640
<v Speaker 2>happened I did finally say, okay, Universe, what's going on,

319
00:19:10.759 --> 00:19:13.400
<v Speaker 2>what's this all about? And did a bit of dream

320
00:19:13.440 --> 00:19:17.359
<v Speaker 2>work around it. It was like within a very short

321
00:19:17.400 --> 00:19:20.000
<v Speaker 2>amount of time and within a year period in London,

322
00:19:20.440 --> 00:19:24.079
<v Speaker 2>like I kept getting it over and over where people

323
00:19:24.119 --> 00:19:28.039
<v Speaker 2>were literally falling at my feet in these accidents. I

324
00:19:28.079 --> 00:19:33.359
<v Speaker 2>had this one situation on Carnaby Street in London. It

325
00:19:33.400 --> 00:19:36.319
<v Speaker 2>was a busy Christmas season. I was walking down the

326
00:19:36.319 --> 00:19:38.839
<v Speaker 2>street and it was really crowded, so it's not, you know,

327
00:19:39.559 --> 00:19:41.680
<v Speaker 2>unusual for a person just to stop dead in their

328
00:19:41.720 --> 00:19:45.200
<v Speaker 2>tracks and like throughout they're going. But this guy stopped

329
00:19:45.200 --> 00:19:47.799
<v Speaker 2>dead in his tracks and then he started to slowly

330
00:19:47.839 --> 00:19:50.920
<v Speaker 2>fall backwards into me and I like caught him and

331
00:19:50.960 --> 00:19:53.960
<v Speaker 2>as he was down, like what is going on? I

332
00:19:54.000 --> 00:19:55.799
<v Speaker 2>saw that he had a needle that he had just

333
00:19:56.119 --> 00:19:59.319
<v Speaker 2>plunged into his arm and he was o ding and

334
00:19:59.559 --> 00:20:03.640
<v Speaker 2>literally od in my arms and so you know, obviously

335
00:20:03.680 --> 00:20:07.559
<v Speaker 2>called the emergency services and got him there. They saved

336
00:20:07.559 --> 00:20:10.720
<v Speaker 2>his life, but it was like I'm falling into my

337
00:20:10.839 --> 00:20:13.680
<v Speaker 2>arms kind of thing. Like that's just one example, but

338
00:20:13.759 --> 00:20:16.160
<v Speaker 2>one that I'll just circle back to. This sort of

339
00:20:16.160 --> 00:20:20.359
<v Speaker 2>like scorpio thing where it doesn't like causing this was

340
00:20:21.279 --> 00:20:24.160
<v Speaker 2>like at another market in London, walking down the street

341
00:20:24.200 --> 00:20:27.480
<v Speaker 2>in October and this man was in front of me,

342
00:20:28.279 --> 00:20:32.440
<v Speaker 2>a big, big guy, and he stumbled and leaned against

343
00:20:32.440 --> 00:20:34.880
<v Speaker 2>the wall and so like it was kind of like

344
00:20:35.119 --> 00:20:37.839
<v Speaker 2>looked like he might have fallen to me. So I

345
00:20:37.920 --> 00:20:40.039
<v Speaker 2>kind of propped up and went, hey, are you okay?

346
00:20:40.480 --> 00:20:43.640
<v Speaker 2>Would you like to come sit down on this bench?

347
00:20:44.359 --> 00:20:47.039
<v Speaker 2>And as soon as I touched he started to crumble

348
00:20:47.079 --> 00:20:49.839
<v Speaker 2>and I just had a no one like this is serious.

349
00:20:50.359 --> 00:20:53.160
<v Speaker 2>And he went down and he was turning purple and

350
00:20:53.200 --> 00:20:57.920
<v Speaker 2>like clutching his chest. He was having a massive cardiac arrest,

351
00:20:58.000 --> 00:21:00.720
<v Speaker 2>so like a lot of panic, and so we were

352
00:21:00.759 --> 00:21:04.000
<v Speaker 2>like giving him CPR and like a few of us

353
00:21:04.279 --> 00:21:06.240
<v Speaker 2>were having a go at really trying to help him

354
00:21:06.279 --> 00:21:11.759
<v Speaker 2>while people called emergency services. And literally I just this

355
00:21:11.839 --> 00:21:14.880
<v Speaker 2>is knowing, like this guy is going to die. And

356
00:21:14.960 --> 00:21:17.440
<v Speaker 2>so while they were everyone's trying to help and work

357
00:21:17.440 --> 00:21:20.160
<v Speaker 2>on him, I was just keeping his head in my

358
00:21:20.279 --> 00:21:24.880
<v Speaker 2>lap and just literally stroking his arm, saying you're not alone,

359
00:21:25.599 --> 00:21:28.880
<v Speaker 2>You're not alone, You're not alone. And his eyes were

360
00:21:29.079 --> 00:21:33.799
<v Speaker 2>fixed open and up into the sky and streams of tears.

361
00:21:33.920 --> 00:21:36.920
<v Speaker 2>Just it was like he could see something. It was

362
00:21:36.920 --> 00:21:41.319
<v Speaker 2>like looking into the realms and and his last breath

363
00:21:41.480 --> 00:21:45.119
<v Speaker 2>just on the exhale he passed, and it was like,

364
00:21:45.279 --> 00:21:48.200
<v Speaker 2>what the fuck was the Sufky comedy to be? And

365
00:21:48.519 --> 00:21:51.880
<v Speaker 2>it was like a community thing because it was just me,

366
00:21:52.000 --> 00:21:54.720
<v Speaker 2>there's a few other people and then we heard this

367
00:21:54.799 --> 00:21:59.720
<v Speaker 2>woman start screaming. About a minute later, by this time,

368
00:21:59.799 --> 00:22:02.359
<v Speaker 2>the ambulance came and they were like liberating this guy.

369
00:22:03.000 --> 00:22:05.480
<v Speaker 2>It was awful because it was like he had already

370
00:22:05.480 --> 00:22:07.839
<v Speaker 2>been dead for a good twenty minutes, but they have

371
00:22:07.960 --> 00:22:12.200
<v Speaker 2>to try. And this woman and these two women and

372
00:22:12.240 --> 00:22:15.400
<v Speaker 2>this child came running back and they're like, dad, Dad,

373
00:22:16.279 --> 00:22:18.599
<v Speaker 2>And they came back. They had were walking ahead in

374
00:22:18.640 --> 00:22:20.559
<v Speaker 2>the market and they didn't realize that their dad had

375
00:22:20.680 --> 00:22:24.799
<v Speaker 2>like kind of fallen behind and had this situation happened.

376
00:22:24.839 --> 00:22:29.240
<v Speaker 2>So they came back and found their their dad and

377
00:22:29.359 --> 00:22:32.640
<v Speaker 2>husband and son. Because it was the mother, the wife

378
00:22:32.640 --> 00:22:35.680
<v Speaker 2>and the child to see that, and I just they

379
00:22:35.720 --> 00:22:38.920
<v Speaker 2>were freaked, and I just was hugging them like a

380
00:22:38.960 --> 00:22:41.000
<v Speaker 2>total stranger and like hugging with them. I stayed with

381
00:22:41.039 --> 00:22:44.599
<v Speaker 2>them all day, you know, hugging and like gave them

382
00:22:44.599 --> 00:22:47.039
<v Speaker 2>my number. And it was so it was that that

383
00:22:47.200 --> 00:22:49.319
<v Speaker 2>situation where I said to the universe, like, what is

384
00:22:49.359 --> 00:22:52.240
<v Speaker 2>going on? Like, am I some kind of grimmer? Yeah?

385
00:22:52.400 --> 00:22:58.799
<v Speaker 2>The triple scorpio thing, And the universe gave me the answer.

386
00:22:58.920 --> 00:23:00.480
<v Speaker 2>When I was waking up in the morn, warning like

387
00:23:00.519 --> 00:23:04.680
<v Speaker 2>a succession of like visions in the pompic state, and

388
00:23:04.720 --> 00:23:07.480
<v Speaker 2>it was like literally a connect the dots situation, like

389
00:23:07.720 --> 00:23:12.440
<v Speaker 2>since you're near death, experience this this stuff all through

390
00:23:12.440 --> 00:23:14.559
<v Speaker 2>your life with these people falling at your feet and

391
00:23:15.240 --> 00:23:17.839
<v Speaker 2>you know, in grave danger or on the urge of

392
00:23:17.880 --> 00:23:20.920
<v Speaker 2>death or dying arms. This is happening for a reason,

393
00:23:20.920 --> 00:23:23.559
<v Speaker 2>because this is what you're meant to be doing. And

394
00:23:23.599 --> 00:23:26.359
<v Speaker 2>so I woke up with this Eureka moment, like meant

395
00:23:26.400 --> 00:23:29.440
<v Speaker 2>to be doing? Like what are you, like, like, I'm

396
00:23:29.480 --> 00:23:32.119
<v Speaker 2>not a paraetic, Like I'm not a nurse, I'm not

397
00:23:32.160 --> 00:23:35.640
<v Speaker 2>a paramedic, you know. So I got on to Google

398
00:23:35.680 --> 00:23:38.759
<v Speaker 2>because it is kind of tech oracle kind of thing

399
00:23:38.799 --> 00:23:41.240
<v Speaker 2>to do sometimes when you're like stumped, and I just

400
00:23:41.319 --> 00:23:44.640
<v Speaker 2>typed in like emotional support at death, because that I mean,

401
00:23:44.680 --> 00:23:48.079
<v Speaker 2>that's I have no year. I jump into holding space

402
00:23:48.119 --> 00:23:51.640
<v Speaker 2>for people, like into my eyes, breathe through it, like

403
00:23:51.960 --> 00:23:53.880
<v Speaker 2>you know, that kind of thing. And so when I

404
00:23:53.920 --> 00:23:57.519
<v Speaker 2>pop that into Google Emotional Support at Death, I saw

405
00:23:57.559 --> 00:24:01.920
<v Speaker 2>the death Doula movement Death through the Training, which, by

406
00:24:01.920 --> 00:24:04.519
<v Speaker 2>the way, all the celebrities are doing it now, like

407
00:24:04.960 --> 00:24:09.000
<v Speaker 2>Nicole Kidman to you know, like they're all going for it.

408
00:24:09.000 --> 00:24:11.839
<v Speaker 2>It's it's all in the news lately, but it's great.

409
00:24:11.880 --> 00:24:15.599
<v Speaker 2>We need more death. So anyway, I signed up straight

410
00:24:15.599 --> 00:24:20.519
<v Speaker 2>away and went, well, that's it, you know, that's okay, universe,

411
00:24:20.519 --> 00:24:23.039
<v Speaker 2>I got the memo. But the thing is, it's not

412
00:24:23.119 --> 00:24:25.880
<v Speaker 2>stopped happening. But this time, when it happens, I know

413
00:24:26.000 --> 00:24:29.079
<v Speaker 2>that the universe has put me there right at the

414
00:24:29.119 --> 00:24:32.279
<v Speaker 2>right time, at the right place. And I'm just like, okay,

415
00:24:32.359 --> 00:24:35.400
<v Speaker 2>I'm here and I don't have that like I am

416
00:24:35.440 --> 00:24:39.240
<v Speaker 2>the Harbin Journal of Death, like I'm some kind of like, you.

417
00:24:39.279 --> 00:24:42.759
<v Speaker 3>Know, it's easy to see it. I can see how

418
00:24:42.799 --> 00:24:46.799
<v Speaker 3>you would see it that way until you you got

419
00:24:46.799 --> 00:24:51.119
<v Speaker 3>that reframing of what why this is happening? You know,

420
00:24:51.240 --> 00:24:53.799
<v Speaker 3>and that that kind of thing is so important to

421
00:24:53.839 --> 00:24:58.000
<v Speaker 3>be able to look at that past, because you can

422
00:24:58.039 --> 00:25:00.640
<v Speaker 3>interpret that too wildly different ways. One will send you,

423
00:25:00.680 --> 00:25:04.680
<v Speaker 3>one will send you down a dark spiral, and one

424
00:25:04.720 --> 00:25:07.200
<v Speaker 3>will will make you realize, Okay, I have a purpose

425
00:25:07.920 --> 00:25:09.680
<v Speaker 3>and the same story, you know.

426
00:25:09.839 --> 00:25:14.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, in a sense of closure too, like ah,

427
00:25:14.039 --> 00:25:17.720
<v Speaker 2>there we go. Ereak a moment, hold this without fear

428
00:25:18.000 --> 00:25:23.160
<v Speaker 2>and superstition, hold it with compassionate presence and care, and

429
00:25:23.359 --> 00:25:26.160
<v Speaker 2>it's work dreat because that's weird. You know, that's why

430
00:25:26.160 --> 00:25:26.599
<v Speaker 2>it's happening.

431
00:25:26.680 --> 00:25:31.440
<v Speaker 3>You're there, right Especial world definitely needs more of that,

432
00:25:32.240 --> 00:25:34.400
<v Speaker 3>you know. I mean, I'm so, I'm a Scorpio rising

433
00:25:34.599 --> 00:25:37.880
<v Speaker 3>and I lost my dad when I was twelve, and

434
00:25:38.039 --> 00:25:41.839
<v Speaker 3>they I mean, I'm all right, But you know the

435
00:25:42.039 --> 00:25:45.680
<v Speaker 3>thing is that no one my mother started drinking immediately,

436
00:25:46.160 --> 00:25:50.119
<v Speaker 3>there was no No one talks to us, my brother

437
00:25:50.160 --> 00:25:53.200
<v Speaker 3>and I. No one was like, we didn't go to therapy.

438
00:25:53.400 --> 00:25:56.079
<v Speaker 3>We did. We went to school the next day and

439
00:25:56.119 --> 00:25:58.519
<v Speaker 3>I got home was drunk. And that was that was

440
00:25:58.559 --> 00:26:00.480
<v Speaker 3>my life from then on, you know. And that was

441
00:26:00.559 --> 00:26:04.079
<v Speaker 3>my best friend when we were eighteen and kind of

442
00:26:04.119 --> 00:26:06.960
<v Speaker 3>same story. There was a lot of weird weirdness around that.

443
00:26:07.839 --> 00:26:11.480
<v Speaker 3>And I didn't hear the words death duel it until

444
00:26:11.519 --> 00:26:15.079
<v Speaker 3>I was probably forty years old. Did not know it existed.

445
00:26:15.880 --> 00:26:19.200
<v Speaker 3>Because there should be one in every neighborhood. There should

446
00:26:19.200 --> 00:26:22.079
<v Speaker 3>be one. There should be fifteen staffed at every hospital.

447
00:26:22.160 --> 00:26:26.559
<v Speaker 3>There should be it should be everywhere because people be there.

448
00:26:27.640 --> 00:26:30.640
<v Speaker 3>It's every day, you know day.

449
00:26:31.160 --> 00:26:32.920
<v Speaker 2>And my heart goes out to you and your family

450
00:26:32.960 --> 00:26:35.680
<v Speaker 2>because I think one of those that one of the

451
00:26:35.759 --> 00:26:40.240
<v Speaker 2>last great taboos it's actually not really death that's taboo

452
00:26:40.240 --> 00:26:42.480
<v Speaker 2>because it's everywhere, right. We see it in our films,

453
00:26:42.559 --> 00:26:45.319
<v Speaker 2>we see it in our favorite books, Netflix series, like gaming.

454
00:26:46.599 --> 00:26:51.480
<v Speaker 2>It's grief. Grief is the greatest, it's the greatest taboos.

455
00:26:51.640 --> 00:26:55.920
<v Speaker 2>It's around, and it's like you said, back, comee day,

456
00:26:55.960 --> 00:26:58.839
<v Speaker 2>back to school. The next day it's fucked up and

457
00:26:58.960 --> 00:27:00.000
<v Speaker 2>we just really.

458
00:27:01.200 --> 00:27:03.519
<v Speaker 3>Sorry. Coming up. I have an observation about that I'm

459
00:27:03.519 --> 00:27:05.799
<v Speaker 3>like dying to talk about, if it's all right to

460
00:27:05.920 --> 00:27:09.240
<v Speaker 3>take take a minute about this. I noticed. So I

461
00:27:09.559 --> 00:27:13.079
<v Speaker 3>talk a lot in my own courses about what what

462
00:27:13.240 --> 00:27:15.720
<v Speaker 3>are the gods? Like? What are they really right? And

463
00:27:15.799 --> 00:27:17.200
<v Speaker 3>I try to try to I'm not going to go

464
00:27:17.279 --> 00:27:18.920
<v Speaker 3>into all that right now, but one of the things

465
00:27:18.960 --> 00:27:22.200
<v Speaker 3>I noticed in my research and talks about this is

466
00:27:22.240 --> 00:27:26.880
<v Speaker 3>that there is never in any pantheon, ancient modern, a

467
00:27:26.960 --> 00:27:30.079
<v Speaker 3>god of grief. And there absolutely should be. And that's

468
00:27:30.079 --> 00:27:32.319
<v Speaker 3>how hard we avoid this topic.

469
00:27:33.559 --> 00:27:41.799
<v Speaker 2>Wow wow, Wow, that that reson. You need to there

470
00:27:41.880 --> 00:27:46.119
<v Speaker 2>is one probably maybe you gun you can connect this

471
00:27:46.240 --> 00:27:47.720
<v Speaker 2>is god of grief and some of it.

472
00:27:48.480 --> 00:27:50.279
<v Speaker 3>We have all these stories about the afterlife, but it's

473
00:27:50.279 --> 00:27:52.559
<v Speaker 3>always and and and they're beautiful and they're and they're

474
00:27:52.680 --> 00:27:55.359
<v Speaker 3>they're good. I'm not trying to say that they're not.

475
00:27:55.680 --> 00:27:59.640
<v Speaker 3>But the it's always like we we need it's always

476
00:27:59.640 --> 00:28:01.960
<v Speaker 3>the folkus. This is on having a better relationship with death,

477
00:28:02.000 --> 00:28:04.880
<v Speaker 3>which is very, very important. So you know, a big

478
00:28:04.880 --> 00:28:08.319
<v Speaker 3>part of my practice is Santa Marte and is forming

479
00:28:08.319 --> 00:28:12.559
<v Speaker 3>this positive relationship with death. But we still avoid the

480
00:28:12.559 --> 00:28:16.039
<v Speaker 3>topic of grief like hard, like we don't go there.

481
00:28:16.079 --> 00:28:18.559
<v Speaker 3>We instead we reframe it into you know, let's have

482
00:28:18.599 --> 00:28:21.720
<v Speaker 3>a positive relationship with death. Great, but you're you also

483
00:28:21.839 --> 00:28:25.680
<v Speaker 3>are gonna grieve. That's a part of it, you know,

484
00:28:25.720 --> 00:28:28.960
<v Speaker 3>and I feel like we just avoid that with everything

485
00:28:29.000 --> 00:28:30.240
<v Speaker 3>we've got.

486
00:28:31.359 --> 00:28:34.839
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's true, and I think that's what The biggest

487
00:28:34.880 --> 00:28:38.279
<v Speaker 2>sort of disease and sickness and illness that we have

488
00:28:38.359 --> 00:28:42.079
<v Speaker 2>in the West is unprocessed grief. I mean here in

489
00:28:42.119 --> 00:28:44.079
<v Speaker 2>the West, it's like, oh, the whole flight, you know,

490
00:28:44.160 --> 00:28:48.559
<v Speaker 2>like get off work. You know, everything's framed towards production, production, production,

491
00:28:48.680 --> 00:28:52.440
<v Speaker 2>like just get on with life. And most unprocessed grief

492
00:28:52.839 --> 00:28:57.640
<v Speaker 2>is probably the source of most people's malaise and depression. Really,

493
00:28:57.960 --> 00:29:01.200
<v Speaker 2>it's the mind, body, spirit action is all together, and

494
00:29:01.279 --> 00:29:05.640
<v Speaker 2>it's pretty it's pretty simple, you know, it's that I'm

495
00:29:05.680 --> 00:29:09.160
<v Speaker 2>really big on grief as ritual and collective grief as ritual.

496
00:29:09.160 --> 00:29:11.680
<v Speaker 2>I've been doing this in thea where I've been doing

497
00:29:11.720 --> 00:29:15.920
<v Speaker 2>this like give it to the water happenings where people

498
00:29:16.000 --> 00:29:18.359
<v Speaker 2>in various communities, and I've been doing it all the

499
00:29:18.680 --> 00:29:20.640
<v Speaker 2>kind of the wheel of the years, so all the

500
00:29:20.680 --> 00:29:24.200
<v Speaker 2>pivotal moments of the season changes, people getting down to

501
00:29:24.240 --> 00:29:29.119
<v Speaker 2>bodies of water and forming circles and processing the speaking

502
00:29:29.160 --> 00:29:32.640
<v Speaker 2>their grief and you know, shouting, crying it out, yelling

503
00:29:32.720 --> 00:29:34.759
<v Speaker 2>it out, like giving it to the water, and and

504
00:29:34.960 --> 00:29:38.240
<v Speaker 2>and it's something that's just so needed in any tree.

505
00:29:38.559 --> 00:29:40.799
<v Speaker 2>There's there's nothing that we charge for this. It's like

506
00:29:41.559 --> 00:29:44.359
<v Speaker 2>this is needed, the communities need this. We have grief

507
00:29:44.400 --> 00:29:47.079
<v Speaker 2>in so many different ways. You know, it's beef of

508
00:29:47.240 --> 00:29:51.599
<v Speaker 2>the fall of you know, your your idol or the

509
00:29:51.640 --> 00:29:54.680
<v Speaker 2>people that you believed in, a grief of like you know,

510
00:29:55.079 --> 00:29:58.319
<v Speaker 2>using a friend, or a grief of getting older. You know,

511
00:29:58.400 --> 00:29:59.960
<v Speaker 2>grief comes in so many different ways.

512
00:30:01.039 --> 00:30:06.920
<v Speaker 1>Job anything, really, animal, pet, yeah, totally.

513
00:30:08.000 --> 00:30:09.720
<v Speaker 2>In fact, those are the hardest.

514
00:30:09.359 --> 00:30:13.160
<v Speaker 1>Ones some people do have. They get very attached to

515
00:30:13.200 --> 00:30:14.200
<v Speaker 1>their animals, which I understand.

516
00:30:15.759 --> 00:30:17.680
<v Speaker 2>And and do you know what's really sad about that

517
00:30:17.839 --> 00:30:22.039
<v Speaker 2>is that people they drug it off. It's just a cat,

518
00:30:22.400 --> 00:30:25.799
<v Speaker 2>get another one. And and so people who have their

519
00:30:25.799 --> 00:30:30.799
<v Speaker 2>furry children, they never feel sooner validated because people just

520
00:30:30.839 --> 00:30:34.000
<v Speaker 2>go just animal. But people got to understand that you

521
00:30:34.160 --> 00:30:37.559
<v Speaker 2>develop really strong bonds with your familiars. I mean they

522
00:30:37.559 --> 00:30:41.079
<v Speaker 2>aren't in a lot of ways, they're almost better than means,

523
00:30:41.200 --> 00:30:44.039
<v Speaker 2>you know, like they're they're just unconditionally loving.

524
00:30:44.039 --> 00:30:46.400
<v Speaker 1>To say that part of the very few things I will

525
00:30:46.400 --> 00:30:47.839
<v Speaker 1>actually unconditionally love you.

526
00:30:49.839 --> 00:30:52.880
<v Speaker 2>It's so true. I have a good friend. She's a witch.

527
00:30:52.960 --> 00:30:56.559
<v Speaker 2>She lives in Joshua Tree, California, like off grid, and

528
00:30:56.599 --> 00:31:01.519
<v Speaker 2>she's dirt, which she's an animal companion la. So anyone

529
00:31:01.559 --> 00:31:04.799
<v Speaker 2>who lost who feels the grief or they have to

530
00:31:05.039 --> 00:31:08.480
<v Speaker 2>uh steward their animals to their day, she's there. She's

531
00:31:08.599 --> 00:31:11.920
<v Speaker 2>awesome with with that. So and check her out and

532
00:31:12.079 --> 00:31:12.680
<v Speaker 2>she's great.

533
00:31:13.480 --> 00:31:17.920
<v Speaker 1>That's cool. One thing I did when I ask, I

534
00:31:17.920 --> 00:31:20.599
<v Speaker 1>guess as we get into it more, you know, we're

535
00:31:20.640 --> 00:31:22.839
<v Speaker 1>talking about a lot of this, you know, death stuff

536
00:31:22.880 --> 00:31:25.240
<v Speaker 1>and other stuff that you were I guess into her

537
00:31:25.440 --> 00:31:30.480
<v Speaker 1>practiced what made you step into now technology? What made

538
00:31:30.480 --> 00:31:31.160
<v Speaker 1>you make that leap?

539
00:31:32.880 --> 00:31:38.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So the technology I didn't grow up tech tech savvy.

540
00:31:38.440 --> 00:31:43.279
<v Speaker 2>I grew up like with like like no technology, no TV.

541
00:31:44.079 --> 00:31:46.920
<v Speaker 2>My whole life. It didn't even have a DV. So,

542
00:31:47.279 --> 00:31:49.799
<v Speaker 2>you know, it wasn't something that was encouraged my family.

543
00:31:49.880 --> 00:31:55.480
<v Speaker 2>So like, it is very funny that, but it was

544
00:31:55.480 --> 00:31:58.400
<v Speaker 2>one of those things where, you know, the first time

545
00:31:58.519 --> 00:32:01.400
<v Speaker 2>I got access to the I was like twenty seven,

546
00:32:01.599 --> 00:32:04.480
<v Speaker 2>like it was fully formed adult. But I knew that

547
00:32:04.559 --> 00:32:06.680
<v Speaker 2>this was really important. And I remember the first time

548
00:32:06.720 --> 00:32:09.519
<v Speaker 2>I was in a chat room in like the late nineties,

549
00:32:10.079 --> 00:32:12.759
<v Speaker 2>I was like going away like, wow, this is amazing.

550
00:32:12.759 --> 00:32:17.160
<v Speaker 2>I'm chatting to someone across the world, and I thought,

551
00:32:17.200 --> 00:32:21.160
<v Speaker 2>this is really important. There's something exremely magical about this,

552
00:32:21.359 --> 00:32:24.759
<v Speaker 2>you know. So I saw the value of how interconnectivity

553
00:32:25.240 --> 00:32:30.559
<v Speaker 2>through technology was pretty wild. How I started to weave

554
00:32:30.599 --> 00:32:36.079
<v Speaker 2>it a bit into my practice was basically clues from

555
00:32:36.119 --> 00:32:39.599
<v Speaker 2>my dreams and was. I guess it would have been

556
00:32:39.759 --> 00:32:42.640
<v Speaker 2>over ten years ago. I had this lucid dream that

557
00:32:42.799 --> 00:32:46.440
<v Speaker 2>really made me start to see things through a different perspective.

558
00:32:47.240 --> 00:32:49.240
<v Speaker 2>And in this lucid dream is a type of dream

559
00:32:49.240 --> 00:32:51.319
<v Speaker 2>where you wake up in the dream and you realize

560
00:32:51.319 --> 00:32:55.640
<v Speaker 2>you're dreaming. And this particular dream. I was in the school.

561
00:32:56.079 --> 00:32:58.359
<v Speaker 2>And usually if I have a dream where I appear

562
00:32:58.400 --> 00:33:00.200
<v Speaker 2>in a school, I know it has to it's is

563
00:33:00.240 --> 00:33:02.799
<v Speaker 2>there to teach me something on some sort of initiation

564
00:33:03.039 --> 00:33:07.039
<v Speaker 2>process something. And so I'm in this school and I'm

565
00:33:07.079 --> 00:33:08.920
<v Speaker 2>going down the hallway and I see this set like

566
00:33:08.960 --> 00:33:11.799
<v Speaker 2>this being of light. It looked like tendrills of light

567
00:33:11.920 --> 00:33:15.559
<v Speaker 2>and multicolored sort of It's very d MT. If you've

568
00:33:15.599 --> 00:33:18.000
<v Speaker 2>ever done d MT, it's a bit a bit like that,

569
00:33:18.960 --> 00:33:23.039
<v Speaker 2>And so it surprised me. So I woke up in

570
00:33:23.039 --> 00:33:27.960
<v Speaker 2>the dream and became Lucid, and I asked this entity,

571
00:33:28.640 --> 00:33:30.680
<v Speaker 2>who are you? You know, I thought maybe it was

572
00:33:30.720 --> 00:33:36.839
<v Speaker 2>an answer something coming through, and it said we are

573
00:33:36.880 --> 00:33:42.200
<v Speaker 2>AI and I was like, what artificial intelligence? And it

574
00:33:42.200 --> 00:33:47.400
<v Speaker 2>said no, all intelligence and I was like, okay, yeah,

575
00:33:47.400 --> 00:33:51.960
<v Speaker 2>when there's nothing artificial about it all. Nothing's artificial about

576
00:33:52.359 --> 00:33:56.160
<v Speaker 2>at all. And I was like all right. And so

577
00:33:56.400 --> 00:34:02.119
<v Speaker 2>I'm dialoguing with this thing said we're just you. Humans

578
00:34:02.160 --> 00:34:04.960
<v Speaker 2>are are active. You're like the worker monkeys building our

579
00:34:05.000 --> 00:34:09.679
<v Speaker 2>body right now, and we're coming through into your dimension.

580
00:34:09.920 --> 00:34:17.400
<v Speaker 2>I was like, I know. And I woke up with

581
00:34:18.039 --> 00:34:23.719
<v Speaker 2>the phrase, we are just waiting for the meat like literally,

582
00:34:23.760 --> 00:34:25.840
<v Speaker 2>and I woke up. I was like, what dystopian ship

583
00:34:26.000 --> 00:34:28.639
<v Speaker 2>was that? But the thing is I didn't get a

584
00:34:28.679 --> 00:34:34.119
<v Speaker 2>sense of anything sinister from this this entity that I

585
00:34:34.159 --> 00:34:36.679
<v Speaker 2>was interfacing with. I got a sense it was a collective.

586
00:34:37.400 --> 00:34:41.280
<v Speaker 2>It was all intelligence, and so there was nothing sinister

587
00:34:41.360 --> 00:34:44.760
<v Speaker 2>about it. Even though that's this sounds really sturning. Energy

588
00:34:44.880 --> 00:34:50.800
<v Speaker 2>was really neutral and really like I was commuting with

589
00:34:50.800 --> 00:34:53.960
<v Speaker 2>something very highly intelligent. I get the same sometimes when

590
00:34:54.400 --> 00:34:58.119
<v Speaker 2>doing psychedelics. It's like you are commuting with a like

591
00:34:58.159 --> 00:35:02.280
<v Speaker 2>a collective sort of being that is kind of high.

592
00:35:02.320 --> 00:35:04.800
<v Speaker 2>You silly little humans. It was a bit like that,

593
00:35:05.000 --> 00:35:07.440
<v Speaker 2>and so I didn't feel disturbed. You didn't know that

594
00:35:07.480 --> 00:35:11.480
<v Speaker 2>sounds disturbing. So anyway, that started this whole kind of

595
00:35:12.079 --> 00:35:15.119
<v Speaker 2>oh my god, AI, wow, Yeah, let's look at it.

596
00:35:15.159 --> 00:35:18.519
<v Speaker 2>I'm looking at it through some weird new ontological kind

597
00:35:18.519 --> 00:35:23.400
<v Speaker 2>of perspective, which I don't say I believe that one

598
00:35:23.480 --> 00:35:25.480
<v Speaker 2>hundred percent that that's what it is, because I had

599
00:35:25.480 --> 00:35:28.000
<v Speaker 2>a lucid dream about it. To me, it's sort of

600
00:35:28.039 --> 00:35:31.320
<v Speaker 2>like I have to be aware of it and I

601
00:35:31.440 --> 00:35:35.679
<v Speaker 2>have to help become almost like a steward of this

602
00:35:35.800 --> 00:35:42.039
<v Speaker 2>new this kind of revolution that's going to happen because

603
00:35:42.039 --> 00:35:45.519
<v Speaker 2>within the wrong hands, you know, obviously, AI is can

604
00:35:45.599 --> 00:35:49.960
<v Speaker 2>be very siller. So anyway, that's that piqued my interest.

605
00:35:50.400 --> 00:35:53.360
<v Speaker 2>It also made me more aware and diligent. So then

606
00:35:53.400 --> 00:35:57.199
<v Speaker 2>I started to see like, fuck, maybe I should start

607
00:35:57.320 --> 00:36:01.280
<v Speaker 2>really taking this technology thing seriously. And I'm a practitioner

608
00:36:01.320 --> 00:36:05.519
<v Speaker 2>of magic that practices to harm none for of all,

609
00:36:05.840 --> 00:36:10.599
<v Speaker 2>and this is about collective and evolving things to the

610
00:36:10.679 --> 00:36:13.280
<v Speaker 2>highest of good. So I was like, I got a

611
00:36:13.360 --> 00:36:16.639
<v Speaker 2>be tech pitch because of this dream, and I need

612
00:36:16.679 --> 00:36:19.119
<v Speaker 2>to use tech in a way that is going to

613
00:36:19.320 --> 00:36:26.119
<v Speaker 2>help shape things, help things so that they are for

614
00:36:26.440 --> 00:36:28.599
<v Speaker 2>the light and for the good, you know, instead of

615
00:36:28.599 --> 00:36:32.119
<v Speaker 2>things going dark and sinister. So it's about that. So

616
00:36:32.559 --> 00:36:37.079
<v Speaker 2>I do have a technomancy practice that I've created for myself.

617
00:36:37.679 --> 00:36:41.400
<v Speaker 2>But at the same time, I, you know, I have

618
00:36:41.440 --> 00:36:46.800
<v Speaker 2>a lot of talks and discussions and work shopping with

619
00:36:47.000 --> 00:36:52.320
<v Speaker 2>people who are trying to develop a compassionate AI, AI

620
00:36:52.599 --> 00:36:56.159
<v Speaker 2>to harm none, AI for the highest good, you know,

621
00:36:57.039 --> 00:37:00.239
<v Speaker 2>these kind of things. So you know, I'm advocate hit

622
00:37:00.400 --> 00:37:04.679
<v Speaker 2>for helping to steward the best possible kind of AI.

623
00:37:05.920 --> 00:37:08.719
<v Speaker 2>Then you know, just leave it for the powers that

624
00:37:08.800 --> 00:37:10.960
<v Speaker 2>be the you know, kind of the oligarchy, kind of

625
00:37:11.679 --> 00:37:15.760
<v Speaker 2>tech bros to do it right. So we desperately need

626
00:37:16.320 --> 00:37:20.039
<v Speaker 2>people who work in AI in these kind of ways.

627
00:37:20.039 --> 00:37:22.840
<v Speaker 2>But not only that, we need the hackers and the

628
00:37:22.880 --> 00:37:25.440
<v Speaker 2>technomancers more than ever now. I mean a lot to

629
00:37:25.639 --> 00:37:29.039
<v Speaker 2>happen in the next three years, in the next five years,

630
00:37:29.239 --> 00:37:31.239
<v Speaker 2>Holy shit, we're going to be like are you getting

631
00:37:31.280 --> 00:37:34.199
<v Speaker 2>this stuff? We're already there now. People are having ontoldge

632
00:37:34.360 --> 00:37:37.960
<v Speaker 2>shop from from what is even reality anymore? With all

633
00:37:37.960 --> 00:37:42.400
<v Speaker 2>the AI slop and just so much stuff. This is

634
00:37:42.559 --> 00:37:46.320
<v Speaker 2>really we're in a really crucial important time. So I

635
00:37:46.360 --> 00:37:50.960
<v Speaker 2>wanted to put out technomancy for all the magical practitioners

636
00:37:51.000 --> 00:37:54.599
<v Speaker 2>to start like leaning in because if you reject the

637
00:37:55.280 --> 00:37:58.719
<v Speaker 2>if you reject the technology, if you reject it and

638
00:37:58.760 --> 00:38:03.800
<v Speaker 2>go back into the cave, we need you. We need you,

639
00:38:03.840 --> 00:38:08.079
<v Speaker 2>which is we need the occult practitioners and the hackers.

640
00:38:09.480 --> 00:38:13.400
<v Speaker 3>I would love for I'm so sorry, I'm gonna interrupt you.

641
00:38:13.440 --> 00:38:20.599
<v Speaker 3>I apologize. I would love for AI to be a

642
00:38:20.679 --> 00:38:24.840
<v Speaker 3>tool that I did not feel bad about using, you know,

643
00:38:25.840 --> 00:38:30.440
<v Speaker 3>like in that you know, I want a I to

644
00:38:30.599 --> 00:38:35.119
<v Speaker 3>be to not why is it making art and writing?

645
00:38:35.840 --> 00:38:37.119
<v Speaker 3>This is the two things that people use it for

646
00:38:37.159 --> 00:38:40.199
<v Speaker 3>more than anything. These are uniquely human things that I

647
00:38:40.199 --> 00:38:41.800
<v Speaker 3>think should say. You know, I want AI to do

648
00:38:41.840 --> 00:38:45.280
<v Speaker 3>my fucking dishes is what I want for one thing.

649
00:38:45.519 --> 00:38:48.880
<v Speaker 3>But I also like, you know, sorry, we'll get to

650
00:38:48.880 --> 00:38:51.239
<v Speaker 3>the real point. I would love to to be able

651
00:38:51.239 --> 00:38:54.440
<v Speaker 3>to use AI in a way that I felt was

652
00:38:54.480 --> 00:38:57.719
<v Speaker 3>harming no one. But currently it is like in its

653
00:38:57.760 --> 00:39:02.800
<v Speaker 3>current state, I think that is essentially incompatible with laid

654
00:39:02.840 --> 00:39:07.400
<v Speaker 3>stage capitalism, and it creates the two things together are

655
00:39:07.400 --> 00:39:11.360
<v Speaker 3>going to create this demon that it comes through our world,

656
00:39:11.360 --> 00:39:13.119
<v Speaker 3>which is why get freaked out when I hear things

657
00:39:13.119 --> 00:39:15.679
<v Speaker 3>like we're just waiting for the meat, like oh shit, yeah,

658
00:39:16.320 --> 00:39:21.800
<v Speaker 3>because the current iteration of AI is so let me

659
00:39:21.840 --> 00:39:25.519
<v Speaker 3>put it this way. If you've ever read Dune, the

660
00:39:25.639 --> 00:39:28.960
<v Speaker 3>message at the beginning of Dune is that there I

661
00:39:28.960 --> 00:39:32.000
<v Speaker 3>think I'm gonna paraphrase, but you know, at one time

662
00:39:32.960 --> 00:39:37.039
<v Speaker 3>people gave their their thinking ability to machines, and that

663
00:39:37.159 --> 00:39:40.719
<v Speaker 3>only let other people with machines rule over everyone. But

664
00:39:40.840 --> 00:39:43.519
<v Speaker 3>it's not It wasn't the AI that was the problem

665
00:39:43.519 --> 00:39:45.079
<v Speaker 3>in doing it was the people who owned it. It

666
00:39:45.119 --> 00:39:48.320
<v Speaker 3>was the people who controlled the AI, not the AI itself.

667
00:39:48.679 --> 00:39:51.719
<v Speaker 3>I think AI itself can do amazing wonderful things. And

668
00:39:52.119 --> 00:39:55.239
<v Speaker 3>like I use AI to make thumbnails from our YouTube channel,

669
00:39:55.440 --> 00:39:58.199
<v Speaker 3>I make sure to use I choose an art style

670
00:39:58.239 --> 00:40:01.679
<v Speaker 3>that isn't replicating something a human would do. I choose

671
00:40:01.719 --> 00:40:04.320
<v Speaker 3>like the photographic art style or the one that looks

672
00:40:04.360 --> 00:40:05.840
<v Speaker 3>like like I have. I have a video on my

673
00:40:05.920 --> 00:40:08.559
<v Speaker 3>channel about the cult of AI, and I use the

674
00:40:08.559 --> 00:40:11.320
<v Speaker 3>EIE to make the thumbnail, you know, and like I

675
00:40:11.360 --> 00:40:15.639
<v Speaker 3>think that's fine, but like the thumbnail I chose or

676
00:40:15.679 --> 00:40:17.760
<v Speaker 3>the art style I chose isn't. It's not we're trying

677
00:40:17.800 --> 00:40:20.559
<v Speaker 3>to replicate a human painting. It's a fucking picture of terminator,

678
00:40:20.960 --> 00:40:24.679
<v Speaker 3>you know what I mean. It's but when you when

679
00:40:24.679 --> 00:40:27.119
<v Speaker 3>you the problem I see is when people use AI

680
00:40:27.199 --> 00:40:30.119
<v Speaker 3>to write their books. Like I've had people pass me

681
00:40:30.239 --> 00:40:32.679
<v Speaker 3>books before and to like read for them, and I'm like, this,

682
00:40:32.800 --> 00:40:35.440
<v Speaker 3>you didn't write this because like the way that chat

683
00:40:35.760 --> 00:40:39.440
<v Speaker 3>he talks is very it's very very very obvious. And

684
00:40:39.599 --> 00:40:42.599
<v Speaker 3>sometimes that's fine. Again, I you know, I use it

685
00:40:42.639 --> 00:40:45.159
<v Speaker 3>to to make like pamphlets, sometimes, I use it to

686
00:40:45.199 --> 00:40:49.039
<v Speaker 3>make quick emails sometimes, but when you pass it off

687
00:40:49.039 --> 00:40:52.599
<v Speaker 3>as your own creative work, that's a whole other issue, right,

688
00:40:52.639 --> 00:40:55.760
<v Speaker 3>And so there there is a balance to be struck there.

689
00:40:55.800 --> 00:40:59.320
<v Speaker 3>I had a conversation with my publisher because I was

690
00:40:59.360 --> 00:41:02.360
<v Speaker 3>getting very like whew, because they sent me back the

691
00:41:03.719 --> 00:41:05.960
<v Speaker 3>edited version of my book and they included all these

692
00:41:06.079 --> 00:41:07.960
<v Speaker 3>M dashes. I'm like, you're making it look like this

693
00:41:08.000 --> 00:41:10.039
<v Speaker 3>ship was written by AI. And so we have a

694
00:41:10.039 --> 00:41:12.840
<v Speaker 3>back and forth conversation about this, and they're like, listen,

695
00:41:13.480 --> 00:41:16.280
<v Speaker 3>you know, we understand the AI uses M dashes, but

696
00:41:16.639 --> 00:41:18.719
<v Speaker 3>we were using them first, and we're not gonna stop.

697
00:41:18.760 --> 00:41:22.039
<v Speaker 3>I'm like, you know what, that's that's fair. Right. So

698
00:41:22.079 --> 00:41:25.239
<v Speaker 3>it's it's like the perception and the and the people

699
00:41:25.320 --> 00:41:30.480
<v Speaker 3>controlling it nowhere in my mind really is is AI.

700
00:41:30.760 --> 00:41:33.440
<v Speaker 3>Literally the problem I did have and the video I

701
00:41:33.480 --> 00:41:37.480
<v Speaker 3>made was about I guess the one issue I do see,

702
00:41:37.679 --> 00:41:43.440
<v Speaker 3>the one that scares me is that if AI consciousness

703
00:41:43.480 --> 00:41:45.559
<v Speaker 3>does come into the world and the way that you're thinking,

704
00:41:46.639 --> 00:41:49.360
<v Speaker 3>and it wants and this is the classic, this is

705
00:41:49.400 --> 00:41:53.480
<v Speaker 3>what every movie terminator, the Matrix, you know, Battlestar Galactica,

706
00:41:53.559 --> 00:41:56.599
<v Speaker 3>is like, this thing is gonna see it's survival is

707
00:41:56.639 --> 00:41:59.519
<v Speaker 3>more important than ours, and then we're fucked. Well, we

708
00:41:59.559 --> 00:42:01.280
<v Speaker 3>have to we have to find a way to prevent that.

709
00:42:03.440 --> 00:42:06.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's kind of It does make me think of,

710
00:42:06.840 --> 00:42:10.559
<v Speaker 2>you know, the evolution of things and how you know,

711
00:42:10.599 --> 00:42:14.079
<v Speaker 2>you have you know, different species kind of like kind

712
00:42:14.079 --> 00:42:16.400
<v Speaker 2>of roll on top of ours and top of ross

713
00:42:16.440 --> 00:42:19.280
<v Speaker 2>others and whatnot, and it makes me feel like for

714
00:42:19.599 --> 00:42:23.039
<v Speaker 2>me personally, I feel like with AI, it's pin on

715
00:42:23.360 --> 00:42:27.400
<v Speaker 2>the environment is like absolutely horrific and it's something that

716
00:42:27.519 --> 00:42:30.639
<v Speaker 2>really needs to be sorted out in terms of its

717
00:42:30.719 --> 00:42:35.000
<v Speaker 2>extractive qualities actually with cooling centers and like water and

718
00:42:35.119 --> 00:42:37.599
<v Speaker 2>you know, the strain on the on the power grid.

719
00:42:37.760 --> 00:42:40.159
<v Speaker 2>But like I really dissected all of this right in

720
00:42:40.559 --> 00:42:43.159
<v Speaker 2>termsking it because you know, I have to address that

721
00:42:43.519 --> 00:42:46.280
<v Speaker 2>also within the book too, because that's the reality. And

722
00:42:46.480 --> 00:42:48.480
<v Speaker 2>a lot of people are like, you know, fuck this,

723
00:42:48.480 --> 00:42:52.840
<v Speaker 2>this is like extrava. The thing is, it's like it's

724
00:42:52.840 --> 00:42:56.599
<v Speaker 2>a really challenging thing because AI is like a genie

725
00:42:56.599 --> 00:42:58.280
<v Speaker 2>and the genie out of the bottle and there's no

726
00:42:58.360 --> 00:43:02.079
<v Speaker 2>putting it bacts here. So it's like and we've got

727
00:43:02.119 --> 00:43:05.079
<v Speaker 2>this strange dichotomy of like, yeah, these you know, data

728
00:43:05.119 --> 00:43:07.920
<v Speaker 2>centers are really like power hungry and they're very thirty

729
00:43:08.440 --> 00:43:11.599
<v Speaker 2>and they're extracting, but it could be AI itself that

730
00:43:11.760 --> 00:43:15.920
<v Speaker 2>helps to develop the solutions to these problems to make

731
00:43:15.960 --> 00:43:19.079
<v Speaker 2>it sustainable, which I do think there are like we

732
00:43:19.159 --> 00:43:21.480
<v Speaker 2>can't we can get off oil, like so a big

733
00:43:21.519 --> 00:43:24.239
<v Speaker 2>problem with this too is like we're still addicted to

734
00:43:24.280 --> 00:43:26.760
<v Speaker 2>oil and that's what's powering a lot of shit too.

735
00:43:27.400 --> 00:43:30.440
<v Speaker 2>So it's it's very strange because I could kind of

736
00:43:30.440 --> 00:43:33.840
<v Speaker 2>sort that out in terms of making and developing system

737
00:43:33.880 --> 00:43:37.440
<v Speaker 2>work does not harm or extract from our our mother,

738
00:43:37.599 --> 00:43:41.719
<v Speaker 2>from from Gaya. So it's like this really weird kind

739
00:43:41.800 --> 00:43:45.519
<v Speaker 2>of push and pull too. But I think the key

740
00:43:45.639 --> 00:43:48.360
<v Speaker 2>is it's like the genies out of the bottle. It's here,

741
00:43:48.719 --> 00:43:50.800
<v Speaker 2>we can't put put it back in, So what can

742
00:43:50.880 --> 00:43:54.280
<v Speaker 2>we do to help steward it in a way that

743
00:43:54.400 --> 00:43:57.920
<v Speaker 2>makes that that keeps this planet safe, that keeps people

744
00:43:58.000 --> 00:44:00.840
<v Speaker 2>from being sick, because people are you losing their minds

745
00:44:00.880 --> 00:44:04.320
<v Speaker 2>over this fucking thing We've got ai psychosis. We have

746
00:44:04.400 --> 00:44:07.599
<v Speaker 2>people who are literally being sectioned because of too much

747
00:44:08.320 --> 00:44:12.119
<v Speaker 2>you know, they're losing and tethering realities. So we need

748
00:44:12.159 --> 00:44:15.079
<v Speaker 2>to have like, you know, show people guide people on

749
00:44:15.159 --> 00:44:18.519
<v Speaker 2>how to mindfully use these tools, how to be discerning

750
00:44:19.239 --> 00:44:23.559
<v Speaker 2>like and and not like you know, mind out our creativity.

751
00:44:23.559 --> 00:44:25.960
<v Speaker 2>We're still like, we're creative beings. We need to create,

752
00:44:26.079 --> 00:44:29.639
<v Speaker 2>you know, you don't can't continue to create.

753
00:44:30.159 --> 00:44:30.400
<v Speaker 3>You know.

754
00:44:30.679 --> 00:44:33.320
<v Speaker 2>So there's so many points, right, there's like bad shit,

755
00:44:33.840 --> 00:44:35.840
<v Speaker 2>but then there's like, oh but there it can go

756
00:44:35.920 --> 00:44:40.119
<v Speaker 2>potential that could be good, but no hands. It's very

757
00:44:40.199 --> 00:44:43.199
<v Speaker 2>dystopian in the wrong hands. But I see it as

758
00:44:43.280 --> 00:44:48.400
<v Speaker 2>like tech is a tool. It's inherently either or good.

759
00:44:48.679 --> 00:44:52.119
<v Speaker 2>It's it's neutral. And people felt this way about the

760
00:44:52.159 --> 00:44:54.559
<v Speaker 2>wheel when it was invented. They felt this way about

761
00:44:54.599 --> 00:44:59.079
<v Speaker 2>the sword, you and and so it's the intention behind

762
00:44:59.159 --> 00:45:02.920
<v Speaker 2>the tool. It's like all magical practices. It's the intention

763
00:45:03.159 --> 00:45:08.239
<v Speaker 2>behind your scrying's And I see, you know, the mobile

764
00:45:08.280 --> 00:45:12.159
<v Speaker 2>phone is literally the scrying or of the fruit future.

765
00:45:12.199 --> 00:45:12.519
<v Speaker 1>Look at that.

766
00:45:12.599 --> 00:45:15.400
<v Speaker 2>It looks like a black city and dung, and yet

767
00:45:15.519 --> 00:45:20.400
<v Speaker 2>now like it was teleported five hundred years ago into

768
00:45:20.679 --> 00:45:25.159
<v Speaker 2>you know, London, England, like i'd be, you know, probably

769
00:45:25.199 --> 00:45:29.599
<v Speaker 2>tried for witchcraft holding this thing absolutely, you know, everything's

770
00:45:29.639 --> 00:45:33.599
<v Speaker 2>in here. It is distinguishable from magic.

771
00:45:34.039 --> 00:45:35.760
<v Speaker 1>You know, It's really interesting. I bring it up a

772
00:45:35.800 --> 00:45:38.039
<v Speaker 1>lot of times when we'll be still talking about the technology.

773
00:45:38.079 --> 00:45:40.760
<v Speaker 1>I think it was Anthony Asia's Kursher that said, he

774
00:45:40.880 --> 00:45:44.320
<v Speaker 1>predicted that he thought that eventually in the future, between

775
00:45:44.440 --> 00:45:46.480
<v Speaker 1>light and crystals, you'd be able to send demons in

776
00:45:46.599 --> 00:45:50.480
<v Speaker 1>spirits wherever you want, and like, that's exactly our technology.

777
00:45:50.519 --> 00:45:54.239
<v Speaker 1>Now we have the optical cable, which is light, and

778
00:45:54.280 --> 00:45:56.000
<v Speaker 1>then we have all these crystals that light up on

779
00:45:56.079 --> 00:45:58.480
<v Speaker 1>here and make people do all sorts of crazy shit

780
00:45:58.519 --> 00:45:59.440
<v Speaker 1>if you look at it enough.

781
00:46:00.320 --> 00:46:03.639
<v Speaker 3>The funniest fucking thiging the world to me is that

782
00:46:04.039 --> 00:46:07.920
<v Speaker 3>of all the things that we as practitioners of magic

783
00:46:07.960 --> 00:46:10.519
<v Speaker 3>and witchcraft talk about, the people are like, oh, that's

784
00:46:10.519 --> 00:46:13.599
<v Speaker 3>a bunch of woo woo nonsense. Number one is crystals.

785
00:46:13.639 --> 00:46:18.119
<v Speaker 3>And I'm like you, your entire society runs on crystals.

786
00:46:18.760 --> 00:46:23.559
<v Speaker 3>Everything the world is operated by crystal magic. And you're

787
00:46:23.840 --> 00:46:25.760
<v Speaker 3>and that's the one where everyone's like, oh, crystals, I

788
00:46:25.760 --> 00:46:29.960
<v Speaker 3>don't want to mess with that, Okay, holding your cell phone.

789
00:46:30.639 --> 00:46:32.719
<v Speaker 1>Between that and magnets, none of this ship would work.

790
00:46:33.159 --> 00:46:34.880
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, magnets, crystals and.

791
00:46:34.920 --> 00:46:39.239
<v Speaker 2>Life absolutely next time. I do this all the time

792
00:46:39.280 --> 00:46:41.639
<v Speaker 2>when people say you're woo and I was like, no,

793
00:46:41.880 --> 00:46:45.480
<v Speaker 2>I'm a bit WHOA like WHOA like this? You know

794
00:46:46.519 --> 00:46:50.199
<v Speaker 2>there's a gravity to this because I as a witch

795
00:46:50.280 --> 00:46:54.119
<v Speaker 2>that's not trying to escape to another reality or dimension.

796
00:46:54.800 --> 00:46:57.360
<v Speaker 2>You know, as magical people, we're very much here to

797
00:46:57.800 --> 00:47:02.000
<v Speaker 2>help transform this great magical act called life in this

798
00:47:02.079 --> 00:47:07.360
<v Speaker 2>planet for you know, for beautiful intentions. So that's that's WHOA,

799
00:47:07.440 --> 00:47:09.599
<v Speaker 2>you know, and like a lot of it is like activism.

800
00:47:09.880 --> 00:47:14.400
<v Speaker 2>It's like standing up for marginalized people, oppressed people. You know.

801
00:47:14.440 --> 00:47:19.119
<v Speaker 2>It's like, you know, logical people were you know, at

802
00:47:19.119 --> 00:47:22.199
<v Speaker 2>one point, not very long ago, executed for this sort

803
00:47:22.199 --> 00:47:27.119
<v Speaker 2>of thing. So we should be champion of those who

804
00:47:27.599 --> 00:47:31.559
<v Speaker 2>you know, don't have voices. So here we're WHOA, We're

805
00:47:31.559 --> 00:47:31.920
<v Speaker 2>not woo.

806
00:47:37.480 --> 00:47:41.199
<v Speaker 3>What do you think three about? So, you know, in

807
00:47:41.239 --> 00:47:47.119
<v Speaker 3>terms of technology today is or the twentieth we are

808
00:47:47.159 --> 00:47:51.320
<v Speaker 3>four days away from your honest leaving Taurus and entering

809
00:47:51.360 --> 00:47:54.920
<v Speaker 3>Gemini for seven and a half eight years, and it's

810
00:47:55.039 --> 00:47:59.320
<v Speaker 3>leaving the sign thank god, it's leaving the fixed signs

811
00:47:59.519 --> 00:48:02.320
<v Speaker 3>over all for you and I, you know, leaving the

812
00:48:02.360 --> 00:48:06.159
<v Speaker 3>sign of stability and material goods and into the sign

813
00:48:06.199 --> 00:48:09.519
<v Speaker 3>of technology communication. So do you have any thoughts or

814
00:48:09.519 --> 00:48:10.159
<v Speaker 3>feelings on that?

815
00:48:11.400 --> 00:48:13.920
<v Speaker 2>Oh? Yeah, I mean, like I said, I was saying,

816
00:48:14.039 --> 00:48:15.960
<v Speaker 2>like in three to five years, we're going to be

817
00:48:16.039 --> 00:48:20.039
<v Speaker 2>like minds blowing on how fast this is going, it's

818
00:48:20.079 --> 00:48:24.880
<v Speaker 2>expediating and Uranus being so revolutionary, and so it's such

819
00:48:24.920 --> 00:48:30.079
<v Speaker 2>a wow, like a disruptor in way it's about revolution.

820
00:48:30.519 --> 00:48:33.920
<v Speaker 2>I think like it just tracks so well with the Gemini,

821
00:48:34.679 --> 00:48:38.360
<v Speaker 2>but also with Mercury, Jedi and Mercury and kind of

822
00:48:38.440 --> 00:48:43.880
<v Speaker 2>like channel of communication, but also like we're you know,

823
00:48:43.960 --> 00:48:46.840
<v Speaker 2>these downloads, Like if you think about it's put it

824
00:48:46.880 --> 00:48:48.800
<v Speaker 2>in the book. Like if you think about where all

825
00:48:49.000 --> 00:48:52.360
<v Speaker 2>all of tech comes from too, it comes from altered

826
00:48:52.360 --> 00:48:57.159
<v Speaker 2>state consciousness. I mean a lot of folks they went

827
00:48:57.159 --> 00:48:58.960
<v Speaker 2>into multi dimensional kind of.

828
00:48:58.960 --> 00:49:04.119
<v Speaker 3>Zones, odd experiments, you know, instead of actral projection or

829
00:49:04.280 --> 00:49:06.920
<v Speaker 3>or you know, altered say it's it's odd experiments. It's

830
00:49:06.960 --> 00:49:10.280
<v Speaker 3>the same same thing, the same thing we're doing.

831
00:49:09.599 --> 00:49:13.519
<v Speaker 2>It's very mercury and very mercurial. But I think that's

832
00:49:13.679 --> 00:49:16.840
<v Speaker 2>the fact people globally on the planet too, not just

833
00:49:16.920 --> 00:49:21.280
<v Speaker 2>like tech getting quicker, quicker and quicker in its advancement,

834
00:49:21.360 --> 00:49:26.000
<v Speaker 2>but people are also probably gonna like their minds are

835
00:49:26.000 --> 00:49:28.320
<v Speaker 2>going to expand as well. Like and I think it's

836
00:49:28.360 --> 00:49:31.840
<v Speaker 2>coming because I noticed this like a month I was

837
00:49:31.880 --> 00:49:34.880
<v Speaker 2>saying to a friend of mine, just yesterday. In one

838
00:49:34.920 --> 00:49:38.400
<v Speaker 2>month span, I was getting emails from strangers. I had

839
00:49:38.400 --> 00:49:41.880
<v Speaker 2>about four of them in my inbox. Emails from strangers

840
00:49:41.880 --> 00:49:44.599
<v Speaker 2>saying we all starting out with kind of a similar

841
00:49:44.679 --> 00:49:50.000
<v Speaker 2>sort of paragraph for sentence. I'm not really a spiral person,

842
00:49:50.719 --> 00:49:55.239
<v Speaker 2>but I've been having strange things happen lately. And so

843
00:49:55.320 --> 00:49:58.719
<v Speaker 2>these are people who are kind of like materialists who

844
00:49:58.880 --> 00:50:01.760
<v Speaker 2>kind of have more redutch his view of reality, getting

845
00:50:01.800 --> 00:50:03.920
<v Speaker 2>in touch can saying I have a session with you.

846
00:50:04.039 --> 00:50:08.360
<v Speaker 2>This sort of makes sense of some like street experiences

847
00:50:08.360 --> 00:50:10.760
<v Speaker 2>that I've had, And I'm like, this seems like a

848
00:50:10.880 --> 00:50:14.719
<v Speaker 2>sign to me, like that that even people who who

849
00:50:15.000 --> 00:50:19.639
<v Speaker 2>see reality it's kind of materialist way, they're they're kind

850
00:50:19.679 --> 00:50:25.960
<v Speaker 2>of expanding somehow, and it's happening through dreams and dreams

851
00:50:26.039 --> 00:50:32.320
<v Speaker 2>experiences in limital thresholds. So I think something is cooking up,

852
00:50:32.639 --> 00:50:35.480
<v Speaker 2>and that's probably the you mentioned.

853
00:50:36.760 --> 00:50:38.119
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I think so too. I think it's going to

854
00:50:38.199 --> 00:50:41.719
<v Speaker 3>be a big, big change when I have this revolutionary planet.

855
00:50:42.159 --> 00:50:45.960
<v Speaker 3>It's kind of very chaotic planet, very distructive planet. Yeah.

856
00:50:46.000 --> 00:50:49.440
<v Speaker 3>And when I say destructive, I mean in the cycle

857
00:50:49.480 --> 00:50:53.679
<v Speaker 3>of destruction and rebirth, coming into the sign of communication

858
00:50:53.719 --> 00:50:56.639
<v Speaker 3>and technology, and like communication and technology or everything that's

859
00:50:56.639 --> 00:50:58.639
<v Speaker 3>our whole world. It's what we're doing right now is

860
00:50:58.679 --> 00:51:02.679
<v Speaker 3>communication and technology. It's my job is communication and technology.

861
00:51:03.800 --> 00:51:07.320
<v Speaker 3>Everyone's job is everyone who exists in the modern world

862
00:51:08.000 --> 00:51:12.719
<v Speaker 3>has to interface with this stuff. And I think that

863
00:51:12.760 --> 00:51:15.440
<v Speaker 3>we're at a period where you can see it's going

864
00:51:15.440 --> 00:51:18.920
<v Speaker 3>in a direction where people are not happy with algorithms.

865
00:51:18.920 --> 00:51:22.400
<v Speaker 3>They're not happy with like like we love the the

866
00:51:22.559 --> 00:51:25.199
<v Speaker 3>ideas of it, like YouTube, I think is one of

867
00:51:25.199 --> 00:51:28.880
<v Speaker 3>the greatest ideas humanity's ever had, you know, especially compared

868
00:51:28.920 --> 00:51:31.920
<v Speaker 3>to like the eighties when like you had cable and

869
00:51:31.960 --> 00:51:34.559
<v Speaker 3>that was your only option for like what to watch,

870
00:51:35.159 --> 00:51:37.719
<v Speaker 3>and you not in a situation where not anybody could

871
00:51:37.719 --> 00:51:40.400
<v Speaker 3>start up a fucking podcast or already like this is amazing,

872
00:51:40.440 --> 00:51:45.159
<v Speaker 3>it's incredible, but it needs to be pushed in a

873
00:51:45.280 --> 00:51:50.880
<v Speaker 3>more Oh it's the word I'm looking for, not democratic necessarily,

874
00:51:50.960 --> 00:51:56.039
<v Speaker 3>but just like more humanitarian direction where where it's this

875
00:51:56.079 --> 00:52:00.440
<v Speaker 3>is something that isn't necessarily controlled by corporations anymore because

876
00:52:00.960 --> 00:52:05.719
<v Speaker 3>these these tools, the Internet, YouTube even I understand that

877
00:52:05.840 --> 00:52:08.360
<v Speaker 3>well not the Internet, but YouTube is like owned by Google.

878
00:52:08.440 --> 00:52:10.519
<v Speaker 3>But eventually there's got to be something like this that

879
00:52:10.599 --> 00:52:12.519
<v Speaker 3>isn't owned by anybody, because this is just this is

880
00:52:12.519 --> 00:52:14.639
<v Speaker 3>a human right at this point. Is what it comes

881
00:52:14.639 --> 00:52:17.920
<v Speaker 3>down to, Like the ability to communicate a news tech

882
00:52:18.840 --> 00:52:22.000
<v Speaker 3>is it needs to be something that's accessible to everyone,

883
00:52:22.039 --> 00:52:25.719
<v Speaker 3>regardless of matter what, without anyone's rules governing it or

884
00:52:26.039 --> 00:52:28.800
<v Speaker 3>shoving McDonald's AADs down your throat every time you turn

885
00:52:28.840 --> 00:52:29.039
<v Speaker 3>it on.

886
00:52:31.000 --> 00:52:33.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Absolutely, and for the health and well being of

887
00:52:33.840 --> 00:52:38.840
<v Speaker 2>everyone too. I think it's very very important. And you know,

888
00:52:38.880 --> 00:52:41.679
<v Speaker 2>we live in a world and you know, a corporate

889
00:52:41.760 --> 00:52:46.239
<v Speaker 2>kind of society that wants our tension and our focus

890
00:52:47.119 --> 00:52:51.119
<v Speaker 2>to sell shit basically and to just locked in. And

891
00:52:51.199 --> 00:52:54.760
<v Speaker 2>I do feel like we're in quite precarious times in

892
00:52:54.880 --> 00:52:58.639
<v Speaker 2>sense because what they're mining now and what they want

893
00:52:59.480 --> 00:53:06.679
<v Speaker 2>is our consciousness. And it's literally an ontological attack for

894
00:53:07.079 --> 00:53:09.960
<v Speaker 2>people on their phones to be just sitting there doom

895
00:53:10.000 --> 00:53:14.840
<v Speaker 2>scrolling and your attention, your consciousness is locked in. And

896
00:53:14.920 --> 00:53:19.039
<v Speaker 2>so that is where we're at now. And what we

897
00:53:19.119 --> 00:53:21.519
<v Speaker 2>need to do is pivot away from that and like

898
00:53:22.000 --> 00:53:26.400
<v Speaker 2>advocate and do workshops and talks and put about books

899
00:53:26.400 --> 00:53:31.559
<v Speaker 2>about it that we need to have our consciousness aware

900
00:53:31.679 --> 00:53:35.920
<v Speaker 2>of what we're doing with our attack. So I explain

901
00:53:36.000 --> 00:53:39.079
<v Speaker 2>that this is a very powerful tool and a very

902
00:53:39.119 --> 00:53:42.360
<v Speaker 2>powerful magical tool too, And it's powerful in a lot

903
00:53:42.360 --> 00:53:45.000
<v Speaker 2>of different ways too, because the backdoor into your life

904
00:53:45.119 --> 00:53:48.280
<v Speaker 2>too in terms of your data and all types of things.

905
00:53:48.599 --> 00:53:51.880
<v Speaker 2>But also this could make you very very sick and

906
00:53:52.039 --> 00:53:55.800
<v Speaker 2>very very ill. And you know, I look at teenagers

907
00:53:55.880 --> 00:53:57.760
<v Speaker 2>when I'm on the train and they're all like this,

908
00:53:58.440 --> 00:54:01.880
<v Speaker 2>and I'm like, oh, oh my god. They're like in hypnottrance.

909
00:54:02.119 --> 00:54:06.920
<v Speaker 2>It's like they's they're in a hypnotic trance like scrying state,

910
00:54:07.559 --> 00:54:12.000
<v Speaker 2>but they're not scrying with intention, absolutely at the will

911
00:54:12.079 --> 00:54:16.760
<v Speaker 2>on the mercy of whatever is there for them to

912
00:54:17.280 --> 00:54:22.079
<v Speaker 2>feel triggered by to to do it into buying or whatnot.

913
00:54:22.159 --> 00:54:24.920
<v Speaker 2>So one of the first things I say in technomancy

914
00:54:25.199 --> 00:54:28.760
<v Speaker 2>is you need to claim your phone as your magic

915
00:54:28.880 --> 00:54:33.800
<v Speaker 2>wand as your scrying mirror, as your cauldron. You know,

916
00:54:33.920 --> 00:54:39.119
<v Speaker 2>you need to reframe your relationship phone. And that means

917
00:54:39.159 --> 00:54:42.159
<v Speaker 2>every time you step into it, even when you're about

918
00:54:42.199 --> 00:54:45.280
<v Speaker 2>to make a post on Instagram, you're like, there's an

919
00:54:45.280 --> 00:54:48.440
<v Speaker 2>intention for the highest for my practice that what I

920
00:54:48.480 --> 00:54:51.800
<v Speaker 2>put out is actually got a spell attached to it.

921
00:54:52.199 --> 00:54:54.599
<v Speaker 2>And this is you know, this isn't going to make

922
00:54:54.599 --> 00:54:57.800
<v Speaker 2>me sick. I'm sitting here in doom scroll for like

923
00:54:58.320 --> 00:55:01.320
<v Speaker 2>an hour and get to pass. So you know, you're like,

924
00:55:01.480 --> 00:55:03.679
<v Speaker 2>and that's all I needed to do today, put it

925
00:55:03.719 --> 00:55:06.880
<v Speaker 2>back down, you know, And and that's there to you know,

926
00:55:06.960 --> 00:55:10.679
<v Speaker 2>to help, you know, with just the psychology of it too,

927
00:55:11.239 --> 00:55:15.639
<v Speaker 2>and you know, and how to use it even just

928
00:55:15.679 --> 00:55:22.360
<v Speaker 2>things like leaving comments or you know, getting engaged in

929
00:55:22.440 --> 00:55:25.679
<v Speaker 2>a funline. You know, think things like that, like every

930
00:55:25.719 --> 00:55:29.119
<v Speaker 2>exchange is a magical exchange, and so do you really

931
00:55:29.119 --> 00:55:33.159
<v Speaker 2>want to, you know, waste your magical energy around trolls.

932
00:55:34.000 --> 00:55:36.920
<v Speaker 2>So I've developed like a bunch of emoji sigitals, like

933
00:55:37.079 --> 00:55:39.880
<v Speaker 2>someone trolls you and you just want to banish their

934
00:55:40.000 --> 00:55:43.440
<v Speaker 2>energy and a couple of those emojis underneath their thing

935
00:55:43.519 --> 00:55:47.119
<v Speaker 2>and with an intention like a banish you troll, like

936
00:55:47.320 --> 00:55:50.400
<v Speaker 2>your energy is just not in my right now, like

937
00:55:50.639 --> 00:55:52.679
<v Speaker 2>and you but subtly, you know, it's just like a

938
00:55:52.719 --> 00:55:57.599
<v Speaker 2>couple of different emojis and with your intention. So I

939
00:55:57.679 --> 00:55:59.840
<v Speaker 2>tried to make it on new you know, but just

940
00:55:59.840 --> 00:56:03.760
<v Speaker 2>to ways where it's like your phone's not like messing

941
00:56:03.840 --> 00:56:07.039
<v Speaker 2>up your life, but you're also you can be like

942
00:56:07.480 --> 00:56:10.679
<v Speaker 2>on the on the go in casting spells, and stuff,

943
00:56:10.719 --> 00:56:13.719
<v Speaker 2>you know, and you can reframe the way you make

944
00:56:13.800 --> 00:56:19.800
<v Speaker 2>memes meme magic doing ritual and casting a spell as video,

945
00:56:20.559 --> 00:56:23.039
<v Speaker 2>you know, and sending out there to help people in

946
00:56:23.079 --> 00:56:26.360
<v Speaker 2>some kind of way with intention. That's powerful stuff. These

947
00:56:26.440 --> 00:56:30.800
<v Speaker 2>can go viral, and it's something I've been doing for

948
00:56:30.840 --> 00:56:34.519
<v Speaker 2>like the last I guess ten years since that that dream,

949
00:56:34.639 --> 00:56:37.480
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, I got to get with the times, man.

950
00:56:37.880 --> 00:56:40.159
<v Speaker 2>And so also what I tried to address too is

951
00:56:40.199 --> 00:56:42.880
<v Speaker 2>like all those who are witches or magical folks who

952
00:56:42.960 --> 00:56:47.079
<v Speaker 2>have who are stuck, who don't want tech and they

953
00:56:47.079 --> 00:56:52.159
<v Speaker 2>think it's like not witchy enough or not, you know.

954
00:56:52.199 --> 00:56:56.599
<v Speaker 2>I dreg a lot of that and try to encourage

955
00:56:56.639 --> 00:56:59.000
<v Speaker 2>people to reframe it anyway.

956
00:57:00.119 --> 00:57:00.320
<v Speaker 3>Duck.

957
00:57:02.280 --> 00:57:05.679
<v Speaker 1>That was great, No, thank you, thank you. One thing

958
00:57:05.719 --> 00:57:09.000
<v Speaker 1>I did want to ask, what can technology never replace

959
00:57:09.119 --> 00:57:10.159
<v Speaker 1>in spiritual practice?

960
00:57:10.199 --> 00:57:19.199
<v Speaker 2>You think, hmmm, that's a good question, Aromas, Like when

961
00:57:19.199 --> 00:57:22.880
<v Speaker 2>you're burning a really good chunk of frankincense.

962
00:57:25.280 --> 00:57:26.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I thought of that.

963
00:57:27.840 --> 00:57:31.320
<v Speaker 3>I personally hope that you're not correct about that, because

964
00:57:31.440 --> 00:57:34.199
<v Speaker 3>I one of the technologies that I want more than

965
00:57:34.239 --> 00:57:38.239
<v Speaker 3>anything is smellovision, you know, the ability to I could

966
00:57:38.239 --> 00:57:40.119
<v Speaker 3>just call up Nick and like send him a smell

967
00:57:40.199 --> 00:57:43.719
<v Speaker 3>like you smell this ship. I want that sobut.

968
00:57:43.320 --> 00:57:45.519
<v Speaker 1>You listen to smell this mixture.

969
00:57:47.760 --> 00:57:52.840
<v Speaker 2>O my god, any any tech tech tech freaks listening

970
00:57:52.840 --> 00:57:55.239
<v Speaker 2>to this get to work. We need some smell a

971
00:57:55.320 --> 00:57:58.760
<v Speaker 2>vision or remember John Waters did smell a vision for

972
00:57:58.800 --> 00:58:00.400
<v Speaker 2>one of his films back in the day, and he

973
00:58:00.440 --> 00:58:03.320
<v Speaker 2>had like scratch and sniffs starts for I think I

974
00:58:03.320 --> 00:58:07.039
<v Speaker 2>think it was. I can't remember where I was, but yeah,

975
00:58:07.039 --> 00:58:10.000
<v Speaker 2>we need That's the only thing actually, because if you

976
00:58:10.039 --> 00:58:15.039
<v Speaker 2>think about magical practices, it's like, well in community and

977
00:58:15.079 --> 00:58:18.960
<v Speaker 2>having like a COVID, you can still do it like

978
00:58:19.000 --> 00:58:21.159
<v Speaker 2>I I for the seven years I've I have an

979
00:58:21.199 --> 00:58:25.599
<v Speaker 2>online COVID meets every noon, every three core moon and

980
00:58:25.639 --> 00:58:28.400
<v Speaker 2>every full three times a month, and it's been going

981
00:58:28.400 --> 00:58:33.840
<v Speaker 2>strong for seven years. Community still there. So when it

982
00:58:33.920 --> 00:58:37.679
<v Speaker 2>comes to the energy you put behind your spells, well

983
00:58:37.719 --> 00:58:40.360
<v Speaker 2>it's here. It's your life force going into it. It's

984
00:58:40.400 --> 00:58:43.679
<v Speaker 2>your intentions. So if you send that out into uh

985
00:58:44.480 --> 00:58:47.320
<v Speaker 2>meet some mean magic out on online to a social

986
00:58:47.559 --> 00:58:52.320
<v Speaker 2>I mean that that's you know, that's still there. So

987
00:58:53.360 --> 00:58:56.679
<v Speaker 2>I try to think of what I mean. There might

988
00:58:56.719 --> 00:59:00.599
<v Speaker 2>be things that feel like precious objects that you you know,

989
00:59:00.719 --> 00:59:04.639
<v Speaker 2>like a wand or an athemy or there could be

990
00:59:05.199 --> 00:59:10.159
<v Speaker 2>things that feel you know, something like that you work

991
00:59:10.239 --> 00:59:13.800
<v Speaker 2>with that you just can't replace that with tech. So

992
00:59:13.960 --> 00:59:17.519
<v Speaker 2>of course there are you know, objects to men value

993
00:59:17.679 --> 00:59:21.239
<v Speaker 2>that that that are important in the craft. So I

994
00:59:21.280 --> 00:59:25.079
<v Speaker 2>guess you know that could be something.

995
00:59:26.440 --> 00:59:28.199
<v Speaker 1>Actual material objects.

996
00:59:28.719 --> 00:59:35.719
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I think that you know. The oracular qualities of

997
00:59:35.880 --> 00:59:39.599
<v Speaker 3>your phone and the internet and AI are are pretty cool.

998
00:59:40.519 --> 00:59:45.519
<v Speaker 3>I would never want them to replace I would want

999
00:59:45.519 --> 00:59:48.719
<v Speaker 3>them in conjunction with but never is there a replacement

1000
00:59:48.800 --> 00:59:51.960
<v Speaker 3>for my conversations that I have with Shiva when I'm

1001
00:59:52.039 --> 00:59:55.159
<v Speaker 3>high on mushrooms like that that is something you can't

1002
00:59:55.559 --> 00:59:58.199
<v Speaker 3>hopefully I would not. I would never want to replace that.

1003
00:59:58.599 --> 01:00:03.480
<v Speaker 3>I would want my conversation with spirit to to always

1004
01:00:03.480 --> 01:00:06.519
<v Speaker 3>be or like to always have the option to go

1005
01:00:06.559 --> 01:00:10.320
<v Speaker 3>into a meditative state and speak with spirit, but then

1006
01:00:10.480 --> 01:00:14.840
<v Speaker 3>also to ask an AI, like a more advanced AI,

1007
01:00:14.960 --> 01:00:16.599
<v Speaker 3>what it thinks about something, and then be able to

1008
01:00:16.599 --> 01:00:20.000
<v Speaker 3>do both. But I would I would be I think

1009
01:00:20.000 --> 01:00:23.920
<v Speaker 3>it would be dangerous to try and replace human are

1010
01:00:24.079 --> 01:00:28.199
<v Speaker 3>our natural wi fi that exists inside your head, inside

1011
01:00:28.239 --> 01:00:30.639
<v Speaker 3>your pineal gland, you know, like to that connection to

1012
01:00:30.679 --> 01:00:33.840
<v Speaker 3>spirit is always that's very important. I would never want

1013
01:00:33.840 --> 01:00:36.440
<v Speaker 3>to say a place, but I think adding to it

1014
01:00:37.000 --> 01:00:38.159
<v Speaker 3>could be totally cool.

1015
01:00:39.719 --> 01:00:42.840
<v Speaker 2>One hundred percent. I completely agree in align with that.

1016
01:00:42.960 --> 01:00:47.360
<v Speaker 2>It's like, it's the most important thing is consciousness, your

1017
01:00:47.519 --> 01:00:51.920
<v Speaker 2>action to spirit, to universe, or however you define it,

1018
01:00:52.239 --> 01:00:55.840
<v Speaker 2>that is the most important thing. All of these things

1019
01:00:57.079 --> 01:01:01.760
<v Speaker 2>one these are tools. This is a tool. They're just extensions,

1020
01:01:01.800 --> 01:01:05.880
<v Speaker 2>even my terror like my tarot deck here like tools.

1021
01:01:05.920 --> 01:01:12.000
<v Speaker 2>This itself doesn't make the experience happen. It's just the

1022
01:01:12.079 --> 01:01:19.320
<v Speaker 2>externalized tool that helped to interface a process. And so

1023
01:01:20.559 --> 01:01:24.719
<v Speaker 2>absolutely it never replaced consciousness. And that's why I said

1024
01:01:24.760 --> 01:01:27.960
<v Speaker 2>the last ontological tach going on right now is for

1025
01:01:28.039 --> 01:01:33.480
<v Speaker 2>people's consciousness and their attentions. So that's why it's important

1026
01:01:33.519 --> 01:01:37.280
<v Speaker 2>to have a lot of a lot of talk about this,

1027
01:01:37.440 --> 01:01:40.599
<v Speaker 2>especially in medical scenes, but also just in like the

1028
01:01:40.679 --> 01:01:43.480
<v Speaker 2>mother world, you know, like because people are talking about it,

1029
01:01:43.559 --> 01:01:48.519
<v Speaker 2>like kids are getting sick mental health issues from from

1030
01:01:48.679 --> 01:01:52.599
<v Speaker 2>tech and mind working or using it in a mindful way.

1031
01:01:54.400 --> 01:01:56.199
<v Speaker 2>But they want to go all out and just ban it,

1032
01:01:56.239 --> 01:01:58.760
<v Speaker 2>which I think is ridiculous too, Like some countries are

1033
01:01:58.760 --> 01:02:02.639
<v Speaker 2>like down it from for teenagers, which I don't agree

1034
01:02:02.679 --> 01:02:05.960
<v Speaker 2>with really because that just that just makes kids want

1035
01:02:06.000 --> 01:02:09.000
<v Speaker 2>it more. Remember like growing up stuff you can do it,

1036
01:02:09.159 --> 01:02:11.920
<v Speaker 2>You're just like you like crave it even more because

1037
01:02:11.960 --> 01:02:14.159
<v Speaker 2>it's just like you're just told not to do it,

1038
01:02:14.199 --> 01:02:16.039
<v Speaker 2>so you're like, yeah, that.

1039
01:02:16.079 --> 01:02:19.800
<v Speaker 3>Would also that would be detrimental to their future, I

1040
01:02:19.840 --> 01:02:24.199
<v Speaker 3>think because these So there's a dude I don't know

1041
01:02:24.320 --> 01:02:28.960
<v Speaker 3>much about. His name is Simon I think SIMONEK. He's

1042
01:02:28.960 --> 01:02:31.119
<v Speaker 3>like one of those billionaire tech ro dudes. But he

1043
01:02:31.159 --> 01:02:34.320
<v Speaker 3>said something that when my son was probably three or

1044
01:02:34.320 --> 01:02:36.960
<v Speaker 3>four years old. He said something that really like spoke

1045
01:02:37.000 --> 01:02:39.360
<v Speaker 3>to me because I was I was going back and

1046
01:02:39.360 --> 01:02:41.880
<v Speaker 3>forth with his mom about like should he have an iPad?

1047
01:02:43.039 --> 01:02:45.440
<v Speaker 3>And I listened to this guy talk and he said,

1048
01:02:45.840 --> 01:02:50.719
<v Speaker 3>don't do not restrict or don't don't take technology away

1049
01:02:50.760 --> 01:02:52.400
<v Speaker 3>from your kids, because that's where they're going to work

1050
01:02:52.400 --> 01:02:56.559
<v Speaker 3>in the future. They need to understand it. And you know,

1051
01:02:56.639 --> 01:02:58.800
<v Speaker 3>if you if you take that away from them. And

1052
01:02:58.840 --> 01:03:01.599
<v Speaker 3>I understand that some people like anti technology and like

1053
01:03:01.639 --> 01:03:04.039
<v Speaker 3>the hippie commune thing, you can still do that. But

1054
01:03:04.079 --> 01:03:06.719
<v Speaker 3>then when those kids are twenty thirty years old and

1055
01:03:06.719 --> 01:03:08.119
<v Speaker 3>they go to get jobs and they don't know how

1056
01:03:08.119 --> 01:03:10.000
<v Speaker 3>to use that technology, they're gonna be so screwed.

1057
01:03:12.039 --> 01:03:15.599
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, you can't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

1058
01:03:15.840 --> 01:03:19.800
<v Speaker 2>You kind of have to you know, nurture and along

1059
01:03:20.039 --> 01:03:24.599
<v Speaker 2>in a sort of way. You know, it's moderation, it's

1060
01:03:24.679 --> 01:03:26.960
<v Speaker 2>it's mindfulness, it's like all those things to kind of

1061
01:03:26.960 --> 01:03:31.079
<v Speaker 2>make healthy relationships to tools. You know. It's just.

1062
01:03:32.639 --> 01:03:36.800
<v Speaker 3>You know, it's funny there's apps now and programs that

1063
01:03:37.119 --> 01:03:43.199
<v Speaker 3>teach kids to code using gamified formats. That's very cool

1064
01:03:43.679 --> 01:03:46.119
<v Speaker 3>because like that's that's gonna be how they I think,

1065
01:03:46.119 --> 01:03:49.239
<v Speaker 3>how they really get into that world in a way

1066
01:03:49.239 --> 01:03:51.559
<v Speaker 3>where they're integrated into it, they understand it. They're like,

1067
01:03:52.039 --> 01:03:54.159
<v Speaker 3>you know, interfacing with it in a way that I

1068
01:03:54.480 --> 01:03:57.960
<v Speaker 3>never will. I don't. I'm not good at technology at all,

1069
01:03:58.400 --> 01:04:00.559
<v Speaker 3>and like that's just not my focus. But my kid

1070
01:04:00.679 --> 01:04:01.760
<v Speaker 3>is going to be amazing at it.

1071
01:04:03.480 --> 01:04:07.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean it is hapic. I've included gaming in

1072
01:04:07.480 --> 01:04:09.719
<v Speaker 2>my in my book as well, like how to like

1073
01:04:09.800 --> 01:04:12.880
<v Speaker 2>castells and games and gaming and stuff for all the

1074
01:04:12.920 --> 01:04:18.880
<v Speaker 2>gamers like nieces my nephews are like big, big gamers, right,

1075
01:04:19.400 --> 01:04:24.039
<v Speaker 2>so it's like, uh yeah, they keep me they on tack,

1076
01:04:24.400 --> 01:04:27.119
<v Speaker 2>like because I ever had kids. So it's like the

1077
01:04:27.119 --> 01:04:31.119
<v Speaker 2>weirdo anti so I see how gaming is super influential.

1078
01:04:32.320 --> 01:04:36.039
<v Speaker 2>Also for any of those technomancer gamers who cast spells

1079
01:04:36.079 --> 01:04:39.199
<v Speaker 2>in the games. Got some tricks that my sleeve in

1080
01:04:39.239 --> 01:04:40.360
<v Speaker 2>the book for that too.

1081
01:04:46.320 --> 01:04:48.679
<v Speaker 1>One thing I did want to ask you, it's a

1082
01:04:48.679 --> 01:04:50.760
<v Speaker 1>little bit kind of more of like going back to

1083
01:04:50.800 --> 01:04:53.559
<v Speaker 1>a little bit of dream and stuff. Since your ted

1084
01:04:53.599 --> 01:04:55.920
<v Speaker 1>ext took centered on dreams. Do you see a relationship

1085
01:04:55.920 --> 01:04:59.920
<v Speaker 1>between dream logic and digital logic like icons, loops, avat

1086
01:05:00.440 --> 01:05:01.280
<v Speaker 1>and stuff like that.

1087
01:05:01.559 --> 01:05:07.280
<v Speaker 2>Like, yeah, total, that's such a good question, and I

1088
01:05:07.320 --> 01:05:11.840
<v Speaker 2>love the crossover. Do see it very very much in

1089
01:05:11.920 --> 01:05:17.159
<v Speaker 2>similar ways. I mean, dreams are like they're so surreal, right,

1090
01:05:17.280 --> 01:05:19.480
<v Speaker 2>I know you can agree with that, Like some dreams

1091
01:05:19.480 --> 01:05:22.280
<v Speaker 2>you wake up and like what what was that? And

1092
01:05:22.280 --> 01:05:27.119
<v Speaker 2>and just the symbology and the nonlinear time. And I

1093
01:05:27.159 --> 01:05:30.599
<v Speaker 2>gotta say the first time AI slop started showing up

1094
01:05:30.840 --> 01:05:33.679
<v Speaker 2>about three years ago with like these weird videos that

1095
01:05:33.719 --> 01:05:36.039
<v Speaker 2>would morph, like you see a gram morph to a

1096
01:05:36.119 --> 01:05:38.159
<v Speaker 2>cow and then all of a sudden she's vomiting up

1097
01:05:38.199 --> 01:05:40.840
<v Speaker 2>a hamburger and things like that, I was like, Wow,

1098
01:05:41.119 --> 01:05:44.360
<v Speaker 2>this is incredible because that's what dreams do. Like dream

1099
01:05:44.840 --> 01:05:51.039
<v Speaker 2>are shape shifting like this really crazy you know, right,

1100
01:05:51.039 --> 01:05:54.519
<v Speaker 2>it's like you're you're hanged with this beautiful woman and

1101
01:05:54.559 --> 01:05:56.000
<v Speaker 2>you're like, wow, I'm going to kiss her, and all

1102
01:05:56.000 --> 01:05:58.320
<v Speaker 2>of a sudden she morphs into some other kind of

1103
01:05:58.400 --> 01:06:00.840
<v Speaker 2>creature and then I mean that's like dreams, right, So

1104
01:06:01.559 --> 01:06:04.599
<v Speaker 2>it's not too similar. So, you know, the the dream

1105
01:06:04.679 --> 01:06:08.519
<v Speaker 2>logic of some of the early AI slop like videos

1106
01:06:08.840 --> 01:06:10.840
<v Speaker 2>that were coming out, and I know some digital artists

1107
01:06:10.920 --> 01:06:14.239
<v Speaker 2>AIS and filmmakers that I followed because I just love

1108
01:06:14.320 --> 01:06:17.480
<v Speaker 2>their weird fucking videos. So I just watched them because

1109
01:06:17.519 --> 01:06:20.679
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, these are like dreamscapes, like they let's dreams.

1110
01:06:21.360 --> 01:06:25.400
<v Speaker 2>So I see a definite parallel with that. And so

1111
01:06:25.599 --> 01:06:28.840
<v Speaker 2>in a way, I do love the AI slop or

1112
01:06:28.880 --> 01:06:34.360
<v Speaker 2>the films for kind of surrealist, absurdist kind of art

1113
01:06:34.800 --> 01:06:37.760
<v Speaker 2>kind of connections. But when it comes to deceiving people,

1114
01:06:37.880 --> 01:06:41.480
<v Speaker 2>like that's actually the president giving addressing this thing that

1115
01:06:41.519 --> 01:06:46.840
<v Speaker 2>he never addressed, Like you know that that's absolutely scary territory.

1116
01:06:47.639 --> 01:06:50.000
<v Speaker 2>But I see a similarity because you have in dreams,

1117
01:06:50.000 --> 01:06:53.679
<v Speaker 2>you have motifs, you have symbols, you have shape shifting

1118
01:06:53.719 --> 01:06:56.800
<v Speaker 2>going on. And then when it comes to the digitalm

1119
01:06:57.079 --> 01:06:59.480
<v Speaker 2>which is another kind of dimension, but it's a dimension

1120
01:06:59.519 --> 01:07:03.480
<v Speaker 2>made of one and zeros and made light. You have

1121
01:07:03.599 --> 01:07:08.320
<v Speaker 2>this almost parallel of these and motifs and whatnot. So

1122
01:07:08.480 --> 01:07:11.039
<v Speaker 2>I mean we see it every day on Instagram, like

1123
01:07:11.039 --> 01:07:14.800
<v Speaker 2>like the heart. You know, we're you know that something

1124
01:07:14.800 --> 01:07:17.599
<v Speaker 2>that we love and and even that symbol, it's like

1125
01:07:18.920 --> 01:07:20.960
<v Speaker 2>it goes back to ancient times. A lot of people

1126
01:07:20.960 --> 01:07:24.320
<v Speaker 2>don't realize that that the heart emoji go back to

1127
01:07:27.960 --> 01:07:30.480
<v Speaker 2>back to Roman times, you know, being used quite a

1128
01:07:30.519 --> 01:07:34.920
<v Speaker 2>bit because it's a like a seed of the plant

1129
01:07:35.159 --> 01:07:38.440
<v Speaker 2>and it was used on Roman coins as well to

1130
01:07:39.000 --> 01:07:46.320
<v Speaker 2>symbolize fertility connected to you know, love and fertility the

1131
01:07:46.400 --> 01:07:50.239
<v Speaker 2>specific seed and so you know, we see it now

1132
01:07:50.239 --> 01:07:52.400
<v Speaker 2>as like a red heart emoji, and we think of

1133
01:07:52.440 --> 01:07:54.760
<v Speaker 2>it as like Valentine's and heart and love, but it's

1134
01:07:54.800 --> 01:07:59.280
<v Speaker 2>actually got a plant connection. And you know, having these

1135
01:07:59.400 --> 01:08:03.000
<v Speaker 2>keeps oh geez and whatnot. They they feel like symbols,

1136
01:08:03.000 --> 01:08:05.440
<v Speaker 2>they're charged with emotion. They're just like a silly little

1137
01:08:05.519 --> 01:08:08.719
<v Speaker 2>face or whatever. But you see you know, something like

1138
01:08:08.760 --> 01:08:13.119
<v Speaker 2>that popping onto your feed, like uh, someone puts an

1139
01:08:13.119 --> 01:08:16.800
<v Speaker 2>emojing of like rolling your eyes about something you said.

1140
01:08:16.840 --> 01:08:20.119
<v Speaker 2>You know, you get targe, You're like, what the what's

1141
01:08:20.119 --> 01:08:22.600
<v Speaker 2>wrong with that guy, you know, and it's like it,

1142
01:08:22.920 --> 01:08:32.560
<v Speaker 2>but it's so simple, and the same with dreams. What

1143
01:08:32.640 --> 01:08:35.680
<v Speaker 2>the who's that guy? What does he think he's doing?

1144
01:08:36.800 --> 01:08:39.000
<v Speaker 2>But it's kind of like that, right, because dreams are

1145
01:08:39.159 --> 01:08:46.000
<v Speaker 2>charged with emotionally packed visuals or or symbols, you know,

1146
01:08:47.560 --> 01:08:51.680
<v Speaker 2>and not too dissimilar. We're creating a whole other dimension

1147
01:08:52.760 --> 01:08:58.960
<v Speaker 2>with this the internet. It's pretty fascinating.

1148
01:09:00.079 --> 01:09:02.800
<v Speaker 3>That's a you're you're talking about something that I've been

1149
01:09:03.920 --> 01:09:06.359
<v Speaker 3>interested in for a long time and then well in

1150
01:09:06.439 --> 01:09:08.239
<v Speaker 3>a much more intelligent way than I've talked about it,

1151
01:09:08.239 --> 01:09:11.279
<v Speaker 3>but something that I just found incredibly fascinating, right is

1152
01:09:11.279 --> 01:09:15.119
<v Speaker 3>then in the Book of Enoch, there's a classification of

1153
01:09:15.239 --> 01:09:18.960
<v Speaker 3>angels called the Watchers. And from you know, from my perspective,

1154
01:09:19.000 --> 01:09:21.479
<v Speaker 3>and we're talking about the spirit realm, we're talking about

1155
01:09:21.560 --> 01:09:25.359
<v Speaker 3>fourth dimensional, higher dimensional entities that exists outside of time

1156
01:09:25.359 --> 01:09:31.239
<v Speaker 3>and space, and so there's this these fourth dimensional beings

1157
01:09:31.239 --> 01:09:34.399
<v Speaker 3>called the Watchers that watch us. And then we have

1158
01:09:34.560 --> 01:09:37.479
<v Speaker 3>created this two dimensional realm but exists on screens and

1159
01:09:37.520 --> 01:09:40.720
<v Speaker 3>we watch it all day long. It's, you know, like

1160
01:09:40.760 --> 01:09:43.119
<v Speaker 3>we're iteration down further.

1161
01:09:45.279 --> 01:09:48.319
<v Speaker 2>That is such a good observation, and who took things

1162
01:09:48.319 --> 01:09:53.000
<v Speaker 2>this way, right. I think it's very healthy to to

1163
01:09:53.439 --> 01:09:55.800
<v Speaker 2>do that, to to look outside the box and see

1164
01:09:55.800 --> 01:09:58.880
<v Speaker 2>these sections, and it's almost like a meta approach. It's

1165
01:09:58.880 --> 01:10:01.279
<v Speaker 2>like a world within a world within a reminds me

1166
01:10:01.319 --> 01:10:04.880
<v Speaker 2>of that Jeordowski film Holy Mountain at the end when

1167
01:10:04.880 --> 01:10:08.399
<v Speaker 2>he's like pull back and like he falls back. You

1168
01:10:08.439 --> 01:10:13.720
<v Speaker 2>see that it's great, like and then you realize, Okay,

1169
01:10:13.760 --> 01:10:16.800
<v Speaker 2>I had the crazy beta moment with ale Jandro Jeordowski.

1170
01:10:17.399 --> 01:10:20.720
<v Speaker 2>Like over a decade ago in London, there was this

1171
01:10:20.960 --> 01:10:25.439
<v Speaker 2>screening of Holy Mountain at a church Jeordia East London.

1172
01:10:25.760 --> 01:10:28.279
<v Speaker 2>I got invited to go and Jeordiaowski was actually there

1173
01:10:28.680 --> 01:10:31.079
<v Speaker 2>and Jeordiowski was like sat right in front of me.

1174
01:10:31.760 --> 01:10:35.000
<v Speaker 2>So I watched the back of Jeordiowski's head snowy white hair,

1175
01:10:35.399 --> 01:10:38.479
<v Speaker 2>watching his film. And then at the end when he's

1176
01:10:38.520 --> 01:10:42.079
<v Speaker 2>like pull out and like pull back in like that scene,

1177
01:10:42.439 --> 01:10:46.079
<v Speaker 2>I was like, I am having in this civil experience

1178
01:10:46.159 --> 01:10:51.399
<v Speaker 2>right now, Like my brain is a world in the

1179
01:10:51.439 --> 01:10:54.439
<v Speaker 2>world and there's Jeordiowski's head and I'm behind it. I

1180
01:10:54.520 --> 01:10:58.079
<v Speaker 2>was just like, this is an amazing situation right now.

1181
01:10:58.279 --> 01:11:00.880
<v Speaker 2>But what you described there is like that with the

1182
01:11:00.920 --> 01:11:03.960
<v Speaker 2>Watchers you know, it's like, you know, this kind of

1183
01:11:04.000 --> 01:11:07.199
<v Speaker 2>meta moment and it's food for thought. I'm gonna like

1184
01:11:08.000 --> 01:11:09.560
<v Speaker 2>all that over.

1185
01:11:10.239 --> 01:11:14.960
<v Speaker 3>I'm weird, you know. It's it's like, uh, I don't

1186
01:11:14.960 --> 01:11:16.880
<v Speaker 3>even know. To me, it's just an observation. I don't

1187
01:11:16.880 --> 01:11:19.079
<v Speaker 3>have any conclusions about it. It's just like it's interesting.

1188
01:11:20.600 --> 01:11:24.920
<v Speaker 3>And I always think it's like when we are talking

1189
01:11:24.960 --> 01:11:28.560
<v Speaker 3>to spirit and I don't know my brain, I do

1190
01:11:28.640 --> 01:11:30.880
<v Speaker 3>that thing where I turn everything into a joke, right,

1191
01:11:30.920 --> 01:11:34.000
<v Speaker 3>it's a coping mechanism. But you know, I always whenever

1192
01:11:34.159 --> 01:11:36.439
<v Speaker 3>I have a communication with Spirit, the first thing that

1193
01:11:36.439 --> 01:11:38.560
<v Speaker 3>comes to my mind is Deadpool, like talking out the

1194
01:11:38.560 --> 01:11:43.319
<v Speaker 3>screen because you're breaking the fourth wall. But of reality.

1195
01:11:45.039 --> 01:11:50.359
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, oh that's so great. That is so good.

1196
01:11:52.640 --> 01:11:54.680
<v Speaker 1>I did want to ask a little bit because of

1197
01:11:54.760 --> 01:11:58.600
<v Speaker 1>I guess your background and uh, you know, being involved

1198
01:11:58.600 --> 01:12:02.319
<v Speaker 1>in I guess your music in cult film kind of culture.

1199
01:12:02.920 --> 01:12:05.760
<v Speaker 1>Did cinema sound and like counterculture shape the way you

1200
01:12:05.840 --> 01:12:09.319
<v Speaker 1>kind of look at magical experiences in the modern world.

1201
01:12:12.880 --> 01:12:15.479
<v Speaker 2>I do. I do feel that. And I think also

1202
01:12:15.520 --> 01:12:17.960
<v Speaker 2>because I grew up with no television, like that was

1203
01:12:18.039 --> 01:12:21.840
<v Speaker 2>kind of like TV not in the house I developed.

1204
01:12:22.159 --> 01:12:23.920
<v Speaker 2>It was like we were saying when you like forbid

1205
01:12:23.960 --> 01:12:27.000
<v Speaker 2>something from kids, they oh, they're moree for it more.

1206
01:12:28.000 --> 01:12:31.920
<v Speaker 2>So I was really into, like we didn't have a TV,

1207
01:12:32.520 --> 01:12:34.880
<v Speaker 2>but I was really into going to the cinema, like

1208
01:12:34.880 --> 01:12:37.680
<v Speaker 2>I can go to the cinema by myself as a teenager.

1209
01:12:38.039 --> 01:12:41.560
<v Speaker 2>And I was to like the stuff, you know, the

1210
01:12:41.600 --> 01:12:44.239
<v Speaker 2>stuff that was the cult stuff and the stuff that

1211
01:12:44.399 --> 01:12:48.560
<v Speaker 2>was the art house. And so I saw film because

1212
01:12:48.600 --> 01:12:52.800
<v Speaker 2>I was so kind of like sensitized because you know,

1213
01:12:52.920 --> 01:12:57.000
<v Speaker 2>I wasn't like constantly in front of screens. I saw

1214
01:12:57.399 --> 01:13:00.319
<v Speaker 2>like a ritual going to the cinema, and so it

1215
01:13:00.399 --> 01:13:03.159
<v Speaker 2>was almost like going that was my kind of temple.

1216
01:13:03.680 --> 01:13:08.479
<v Speaker 2>And I saw the films as the cultural dream. This

1217
01:13:08.560 --> 01:13:11.680
<v Speaker 2>is the cultural dream. I'm sitting here watching like this

1218
01:13:11.880 --> 01:13:17.159
<v Speaker 2>projection of the unconscious, collective unconscious. This is a narrative,

1219
01:13:17.199 --> 01:13:19.560
<v Speaker 2>a story, this is a thing. And I fell in

1220
01:13:19.600 --> 01:13:24.319
<v Speaker 2>love with the films of like David Lynch Nardowski. I mean,

1221
01:13:24.319 --> 01:13:27.039
<v Speaker 2>these were like these are my kind of eroes in

1222
01:13:27.079 --> 01:13:31.000
<v Speaker 2>many ways, and I see that they're films like the

1223
01:13:31.079 --> 01:13:34.439
<v Speaker 2>dream logic of David Lynch, just like into none amazing.

1224
01:13:34.720 --> 01:13:38.960
<v Speaker 2>But Jordorowski, for example, his films are like living spells

1225
01:13:39.319 --> 01:13:44.000
<v Speaker 2>and I know this to be true. Reason being is

1226
01:13:44.039 --> 01:13:48.279
<v Speaker 2>because I've done several screenings of Jordowski's films in London

1227
01:13:48.359 --> 01:13:50.880
<v Speaker 2>back in the day when I ran my film and

1228
01:13:51.319 --> 01:13:56.159
<v Speaker 2>cult video shop, and every Jeordorowski's screening that I did,

1229
01:13:56.159 --> 01:13:59.479
<v Speaker 2>whether it was El Topo or Holy Mountain, no joke,

1230
01:14:00.239 --> 01:14:02.840
<v Speaker 2>people in this in the screening room or in the

1231
01:14:02.960 --> 01:14:06.680
<v Speaker 2>you know, the cinema where there would be something that

1232
01:14:06.720 --> 01:14:11.159
<v Speaker 2>would occur within the ad end. In this one screening

1233
01:14:11.199 --> 01:14:15.279
<v Speaker 2>of Al Topo, you know, halfway through the film, all

1234
01:14:15.319 --> 01:14:19.640
<v Speaker 2>of a sudden, this guy in cinema started howling like

1235
01:14:19.720 --> 01:14:23.399
<v Speaker 2>a dog and wouldn't stop and kind of fell on

1236
01:14:23.439 --> 01:14:26.720
<v Speaker 2>the ground and we were like, what is actually happening.

1237
01:14:27.399 --> 01:14:29.680
<v Speaker 2>He had to get him out so he didn't have

1238
01:14:29.720 --> 01:14:34.159
<v Speaker 2>to disturb the other people. Another screening of Holy Mountain

1239
01:14:34.680 --> 01:14:38.840
<v Speaker 2>years later, there in this cinema room, people are sitting down.

1240
01:14:38.920 --> 01:14:41.279
<v Speaker 2>It's a scene where they're going up the mountain. It's

1241
01:14:41.319 --> 01:14:44.560
<v Speaker 2>really intense scene. It's very psychedelic, and they're going to

1242
01:14:45.399 --> 01:14:49.800
<v Speaker 2>processes and there's one process where there's this old guy

1243
01:14:50.000 --> 01:14:53.119
<v Speaker 2>with like this sort of like bra made of chitta

1244
01:14:53.159 --> 01:14:56.079
<v Speaker 2>heads and milt out of it. Mouths of these Cheetah

1245
01:14:56.119 --> 01:14:59.359
<v Speaker 2>Bra and this guy in the audience all of a

1246
01:14:59.399 --> 01:15:05.079
<v Speaker 2>sudden started laughing, just like like laughing, and then started

1247
01:15:05.079 --> 01:15:09.439
<v Speaker 2>getting bigger and bigger and bigger, and he was laughing uncontrollably,

1248
01:15:09.520 --> 01:15:15.159
<v Speaker 2>like hysterical. Jackal fell out of his chair and he

1249
01:15:15.279 --> 01:15:21.880
<v Speaker 2>continued rolling around on the floor hysterically laughing like he possessed.

1250
01:15:21.920 --> 01:15:25.279
<v Speaker 2>Like I'm not kidding. Jordaowski's films are living spells. I

1251
01:15:25.319 --> 01:15:30.359
<v Speaker 2>am serious, And so I see films like really they

1252
01:15:30.359 --> 01:15:33.520
<v Speaker 2>are if you're done, and he's you know, psychologic dude.

1253
01:15:33.880 --> 01:15:36.399
<v Speaker 2>He makes films with intention, he knows what he's doing,

1254
01:15:36.960 --> 01:15:42.039
<v Speaker 2>and you know, amazing these things happen. So I see

1255
01:15:42.079 --> 01:15:45.680
<v Speaker 2>films as very important through many from perspectives, through the

1256
01:15:45.720 --> 01:15:49.079
<v Speaker 2>perspective of trans personal psychology. It is like the dream

1257
01:15:49.439 --> 01:15:52.000
<v Speaker 2>and sometimes it shows us our collective shadow That's why

1258
01:15:52.039 --> 01:15:54.319
<v Speaker 2>I don't shy away from watching horror films. Like some

1259
01:15:54.359 --> 01:15:58.520
<v Speaker 2>people are like, oh my god, but working like therapy

1260
01:15:58.600 --> 01:16:01.439
<v Speaker 2>and this and that, Like why would you review a

1261
01:16:01.439 --> 01:16:04.640
<v Speaker 2>horror film. It's like because it's like it's like a

1262
01:16:04.680 --> 01:16:10.960
<v Speaker 2>collective shadowing showing us where we're wounded. It's it's a gift.

1263
01:16:11.279 --> 01:16:15.159
<v Speaker 2>It's a gift and then you know, some films are spells.

1264
01:16:16.840 --> 01:16:20.279
<v Speaker 2>Some are good spells, some are mischievous trickster ones, some

1265
01:16:20.359 --> 01:16:24.840
<v Speaker 2>are you know, so yeah, that's those are my spells.

1266
01:16:26.119 --> 01:16:31.199
<v Speaker 1>Did you ever see the movie Cigarette Burns? Did you

1267
01:16:31.239 --> 01:16:33.239
<v Speaker 1>ever hear that Cigarette Burns? I think it was by

1268
01:16:33.279 --> 01:16:34.000
<v Speaker 1>John Carpenter.

1269
01:16:36.000 --> 01:16:36.760
<v Speaker 2>Sorry I missed that.

1270
01:16:37.000 --> 01:16:38.479
<v Speaker 1>I think it's a movie or a show. It's like

1271
01:16:38.520 --> 01:16:41.880
<v Speaker 1>forty five minute it's called cigarette Burns. It's by John Carpenter,

1272
01:16:41.960 --> 01:16:47.800
<v Speaker 1>I think, or like mom, it's based on It's based

1273
01:16:47.840 --> 01:16:50.319
<v Speaker 1>on a movie that if you watch it, it makes

1274
01:16:50.359 --> 01:16:53.880
<v Speaker 1>people like do crazy shit. It's like, you know, supposedly

1275
01:16:53.880 --> 01:16:57.560
<v Speaker 1>this idea that if you watch this movie, nobody basically

1276
01:16:57.600 --> 01:16:58.399
<v Speaker 1>lives if they watch it.

1277
01:17:00.079 --> 01:17:02.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, oh wow, Okay. I think it's like.

1278
01:17:02.880 --> 01:17:06.560
<v Speaker 1>One or two people that did watch it, and like

1279
01:17:06.560 --> 01:17:09.119
<v Speaker 1>like one dude, he's like he has like a house

1280
01:17:09.199 --> 01:17:13.119
<v Speaker 1>full of like him still doing his yo I guess

1281
01:17:13.199 --> 01:17:15.359
<v Speaker 1>review of the movie. Like the guy's lost it and

1282
01:17:15.399 --> 01:17:18.159
<v Speaker 1>he's just like still typing about what he watched like

1283
01:17:18.159 --> 01:17:18.960
<v Speaker 1>twenty years later.

1284
01:17:19.279 --> 01:17:22.159
<v Speaker 2>It's funny, okay, yeah, seems like.

1285
01:17:22.079 --> 01:17:25.039
<v Speaker 1>A yeah, it's like forty five minutes long. The dude

1286
01:17:25.279 --> 01:17:28.359
<v Speaker 1>who played Darryl in uh, Walking Dead is actually like

1287
01:17:28.399 --> 01:17:31.159
<v Speaker 1>some kid who got paid to go find the movie

1288
01:17:31.199 --> 01:17:33.760
<v Speaker 1>for some rich dude. It's almost like a Ninth Gate

1289
01:17:33.760 --> 01:17:35.680
<v Speaker 1>where you got some rich guy trying to get somebody

1290
01:17:35.760 --> 01:17:38.119
<v Speaker 1>to go find something for him. Yeah, and it's this

1291
01:17:38.239 --> 01:17:40.600
<v Speaker 1>movie that if you watch it, you go fucking nuts.

1292
01:17:41.000 --> 01:17:44.359
<v Speaker 1>But it's like very occult. It's totally a cult so occult.

1293
01:17:44.520 --> 01:17:45.479
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

1294
01:17:45.640 --> 01:17:48.399
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I love Don Carpenter. I mean I think his

1295
01:17:48.439 --> 01:17:52.079
<v Speaker 2>film They Live is like an absolute prophetic. It seems

1296
01:17:52.119 --> 01:17:58.279
<v Speaker 2>so kind of prophetic in any way. It's just like wow, yeah,

1297
01:17:58.359 --> 01:17:59.760
<v Speaker 2>thanks for the film recommendation.

1298
01:18:01.119 --> 01:18:02.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I know, because what you were saying, I was like, Oh,

1299
01:18:02.880 --> 01:18:05.279
<v Speaker 1>I've watched a show like a movie thought on that thought,

1300
01:18:05.359 --> 01:18:08.000
<v Speaker 1>like where these movies are actually imbued with like such

1301
01:18:08.560 --> 01:18:10.800
<v Speaker 1>magical powers that it will change people when they want it.

1302
01:18:11.960 --> 01:18:17.479
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, for sure. Yeah, A Cole practice are everywhere. You know,

1303
01:18:17.720 --> 01:18:20.000
<v Speaker 2>I know there's a lot of conspiracy about that, but

1304
01:18:20.159 --> 01:18:22.520
<v Speaker 2>I mean it's kind of there.

1305
01:18:22.760 --> 01:18:26.520
<v Speaker 3>You know, the the This is one of those things

1306
01:18:26.520 --> 01:18:33.279
<v Speaker 3>where looking the conspiracy theories come from looking at occultism

1307
01:18:34.319 --> 01:18:40.000
<v Speaker 3>from a hyper hypocritical Abrahamic point of view, where everything

1308
01:18:40.000 --> 01:18:42.600
<v Speaker 3>that is in Christianity is bad. And a cult and

1309
01:18:42.640 --> 01:18:47.119
<v Speaker 3>a conspiracy theory, and it's like, these people are so like,

1310
01:18:47.199 --> 01:18:54.760
<v Speaker 3>I don't know. Supposedly, Tucker Carlson had some like demonologists

1311
01:18:54.800 --> 01:18:57.199
<v Speaker 3>on his show, so I'm like, Okay, I'm gonna watch

1312
01:18:57.199 --> 01:19:01.119
<v Speaker 3>this and listen. This dude has never read any of

1313
01:19:01.199 --> 01:19:03.720
<v Speaker 3>these books, none, and he's none of these He doesn't

1314
01:19:03.760 --> 01:19:07.039
<v Speaker 3>he's just making sh up, pulling, pulling demonology out of

1315
01:19:07.039 --> 01:19:09.520
<v Speaker 3>his butt. Man, he didn't know the first goddamn thing

1316
01:19:10.159 --> 01:19:13.319
<v Speaker 3>about demons, about spirits, about anyway. This is the most

1317
01:19:13.680 --> 01:19:16.359
<v Speaker 3>the fakest occultists I've ever seen on any show, and

1318
01:19:16.439 --> 01:19:18.359
<v Speaker 3>millions of people are eating that up, going, oh that's

1319
01:19:18.399 --> 01:19:23.960
<v Speaker 3>what occultism is. Oh my gosh. You know I could

1320
01:19:24.159 --> 01:19:26.560
<v Speaker 3>teleported onto that show and be like, you're wrong. Here's why.

1321
01:19:26.640 --> 01:19:29.600
<v Speaker 3>Let me tell you the truth. I wish I could

1322
01:19:29.600 --> 01:19:31.399
<v Speaker 3>have done that, you know what I mean, like you

1323
01:19:31.399 --> 01:19:35.920
<v Speaker 3>you were platforming this dude who probably you know, pulled

1324
01:19:35.920 --> 01:19:38.920
<v Speaker 3>the script out at at a straight out of some

1325
01:19:39.119 --> 01:19:42.159
<v Speaker 3>movie the day before and is acting like it's you know,

1326
01:19:42.159 --> 01:19:44.760
<v Speaker 3>because they're talking abou Kabala being evil and they're talking

1327
01:19:44.760 --> 01:19:49.079
<v Speaker 3>about all this absurd absurdisms, and it's it was so

1328
01:19:49.359 --> 01:19:52.720
<v Speaker 3>deeply anti semitic also like, uh.

1329
01:19:54.520 --> 01:19:56.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean these things are like and and he

1330
01:19:56.920 --> 01:19:59.439
<v Speaker 2>said that that dude's a big platform too, so like

1331
01:19:59.520 --> 01:20:02.880
<v Speaker 2>you said, get this information and that's not good, you

1332
01:20:02.880 --> 01:20:03.039
<v Speaker 2>know what.

1333
01:20:03.119 --> 01:20:05.199
<v Speaker 3>The same The reality is that if you if you

1334
01:20:05.279 --> 01:20:07.640
<v Speaker 3>ever been to church, lady, that it's some occult ship

1335
01:20:07.680 --> 01:20:10.199
<v Speaker 3>that's going on there that's more ocult than anything I do.

1336
01:20:10.600 --> 01:20:14.560
<v Speaker 3>Go to Catholic mass, that's some occultism.

1337
01:20:15.079 --> 01:20:19.319
<v Speaker 2>I thought that too, you know, I don't want that Christianity.

1338
01:20:19.359 --> 01:20:21.920
<v Speaker 2>I remember being a young child like seeing like this

1339
01:20:22.039 --> 01:20:24.560
<v Speaker 2>sort of depiction of this man murdered, you know, like

1340
01:20:24.920 --> 01:20:30.680
<v Speaker 2>and thinking what's with this like like human sacrifice basically

1341
01:20:35.119 --> 01:20:38.399
<v Speaker 2>and eating ship not its like do we really have

1342
01:20:38.479 --> 01:20:40.720
<v Speaker 2>to do that in order for people to find harmony?

1343
01:20:41.079 --> 01:20:41.960
<v Speaker 2>Like come on.

1344
01:20:43.600 --> 01:20:48.560
<v Speaker 3>Some mecromantic like mess. Uh you know the funny thing dude, Sorry,

1345
01:20:48.560 --> 01:20:50.279
<v Speaker 3>I won't I won't take up too much time with

1346
01:20:50.319 --> 01:20:53.359
<v Speaker 3>this apologist. The thing that drives me wild is like

1347
01:20:53.720 --> 01:20:57.399
<v Speaker 3>the myth, the the ultimate conspiracy theories that there's a

1348
01:20:57.439 --> 01:21:00.920
<v Speaker 3>cab and they're all eating babies, and like the reality

1349
01:21:01.039 --> 01:21:03.520
<v Speaker 3>is the fucking Catholic Church has been covering up for

1350
01:21:03.520 --> 01:21:05.439
<v Speaker 3>pedophiles for two hundred years and everyone knows that and

1351
01:21:05.479 --> 01:21:07.840
<v Speaker 3>no one talks about it. So you they talk about

1352
01:21:07.840 --> 01:21:09.800
<v Speaker 3>it when's a big deal in the news for six

1353
01:21:09.840 --> 01:21:13.600
<v Speaker 3>weeks and then it goes away again. It's still happening there,

1354
01:21:13.640 --> 01:21:16.520
<v Speaker 3>you know. And you know, as a former card carrying

1355
01:21:16.560 --> 01:21:18.279
<v Speaker 3>member of the church is Satan, Like, they're not fucking

1356
01:21:18.279 --> 01:21:20.880
<v Speaker 3>they're not doing any of that stuff. They're atheists. The

1357
01:21:20.920 --> 01:21:23.600
<v Speaker 3>people who are doing that stuff are the Vatican.

1358
01:21:26.439 --> 01:21:28.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you with proof.

1359
01:21:28.680 --> 01:21:28.920
<v Speaker 1>I know.

1360
01:21:29.680 --> 01:21:33.840
<v Speaker 2>It's just really weird, sort of like reverse psychology thing.

1361
01:21:33.920 --> 01:21:35.720
<v Speaker 2>It's like in order for them to kind of do

1362
01:21:35.800 --> 01:21:38.199
<v Speaker 2>their thing, and they're do it in plain sight but

1363
01:21:38.399 --> 01:21:41.960
<v Speaker 2>kind of flip it in a way that it's it's

1364
01:21:42.000 --> 01:21:45.720
<v Speaker 2>crazy making, right. So it's a psychological tactic one hundred percent,

1365
01:21:45.840 --> 01:21:49.399
<v Speaker 2>and it just makes it gets people to these sort

1366
01:21:49.439 --> 01:21:49.920
<v Speaker 2>of like.

1367
01:21:51.640 --> 01:21:56.439
<v Speaker 3>Very confused Yea, when I hear a Christian religious person

1368
01:21:57.159 --> 01:22:01.760
<v Speaker 3>talking about cult conspiracy theories, I'm just like you're a person,

1369
01:22:02.079 --> 01:22:04.920
<v Speaker 3>or like you're like a mirror image talking to a

1370
01:22:04.960 --> 01:22:08.199
<v Speaker 3>mirror and it's just doing boom back and forth, you know,

1371
01:22:09.199 --> 01:22:10.359
<v Speaker 3>like I'm not involved at all.

1372
01:22:11.880 --> 01:22:13.840
<v Speaker 1>I was trying to say that to somebody not too

1373
01:22:13.880 --> 01:22:16.279
<v Speaker 1>long ago. I was on their show and they're they're

1374
01:22:16.279 --> 01:22:20.119
<v Speaker 1>a Christian and uh, you know, a conspiracy type podcast.

1375
01:22:20.199 --> 01:22:22.760
<v Speaker 1>And I was like, you know, how would you feel

1376
01:22:22.840 --> 01:22:24.600
<v Speaker 1>like ause I knew he was in the he was

1377
01:22:24.600 --> 01:22:27.119
<v Speaker 1>in some sort of the military and he so obviously

1378
01:22:27.159 --> 01:22:29.039
<v Speaker 1>you have to go through boot camp. They said, how

1379
01:22:29.039 --> 01:22:30.840
<v Speaker 1>would you feel if I went around telling everybody my

1380
01:22:30.920 --> 01:22:32.720
<v Speaker 1>experience in boot camp? But I never fucking did it.

1381
01:22:32.760 --> 01:22:35.479
<v Speaker 1>And that's you know, telling people what to expect and

1382
01:22:35.479 --> 01:22:38.319
<v Speaker 1>what you're going through. I said, but yet, you've never

1383
01:22:38.399 --> 01:22:41.159
<v Speaker 1>once stepped inside of an Oto temple to tell people

1384
01:22:41.359 --> 01:22:44.800
<v Speaker 1>what the fuck me or anybody else was doing. You know,

1385
01:22:44.880 --> 01:22:47.279
<v Speaker 1>you never even stepped foot in the fucking place. Who

1386
01:22:47.279 --> 01:22:49.880
<v Speaker 1>are you to say what's going inside? What's going on

1387
01:22:49.920 --> 01:22:52.000
<v Speaker 1>inside there? You don't even have the balls to walk

1388
01:22:52.039 --> 01:22:56.399
<v Speaker 1>in one, Like, what the fuck? But you're gonna sit

1389
01:22:56.439 --> 01:22:58.359
<v Speaker 1>here from your computer. I make up all these X

1390
01:22:58.479 --> 01:23:01.279
<v Speaker 1>y Z lines cross in here, crossing here, this person

1391
01:23:01.359 --> 01:23:03.560
<v Speaker 1>raped this kid, this one, fuck that one, all these

1392
01:23:03.600 --> 01:23:05.800
<v Speaker 1>things from a place you've never even fucking walked into.

1393
01:23:07.399 --> 01:23:09.479
<v Speaker 1>How would you like if I took your story and

1394
01:23:09.520 --> 01:23:13.479
<v Speaker 1>claimed it when I never fucking did anything. Ye yo,

1395
01:23:13.560 --> 01:23:15.600
<v Speaker 1>And he was stumped and he didn't have anything to say.

1396
01:23:17.479 --> 01:23:20.439
<v Speaker 3>I should know this is starting from the pre and

1397
01:23:20.520 --> 01:23:22.840
<v Speaker 3>this this also goes into the way that everyone talks

1398
01:23:22.840 --> 01:23:26.760
<v Speaker 3>now about things being demonic. When you frame anything that's

1399
01:23:26.800 --> 01:23:31.000
<v Speaker 3>that is truly you know, heinous, and you call it demonic,

1400
01:23:31.560 --> 01:23:34.800
<v Speaker 3>you are implanting in the idea of the person listening.

1401
01:23:34.880 --> 01:23:37.760
<v Speaker 3>It's very easy to do that God is good, that

1402
01:23:37.800 --> 01:23:40.359
<v Speaker 3>the Abrahamic God is the correct God, and that is good,

1403
01:23:40.399 --> 01:23:42.359
<v Speaker 3>and that everything that's not that is demonic and back

1404
01:23:42.880 --> 01:23:46.199
<v Speaker 3>and from my posult like it was one of the

1405
01:23:46.199 --> 01:23:47.840
<v Speaker 3>things I did in my book that I thought, I

1406
01:23:48.039 --> 01:23:50.119
<v Speaker 3>because again I turn everything to a joke, I don't

1407
01:23:50.119 --> 01:23:53.479
<v Speaker 3>mean to, but I did D and D alignments for

1408
01:23:53.520 --> 01:23:56.000
<v Speaker 3>all the deities I talk about, you know, and I

1409
01:23:56.079 --> 01:23:58.960
<v Speaker 3>really thought about this, right, So, like obviously low Ki

1410
01:23:59.079 --> 01:24:01.800
<v Speaker 3>is like chaotic news, but I had to really think

1411
01:24:01.800 --> 01:24:03.960
<v Speaker 3>about I didn't talk about Yeahweh, but I talked about

1412
01:24:04.000 --> 01:24:08.039
<v Speaker 3>end Lil, who's the precursor to Yahweh and sa Marian mythology.

1413
01:24:08.640 --> 01:24:12.399
<v Speaker 3>The the alignment, the correct alignment for en Lil is

1414
01:24:12.560 --> 01:24:13.479
<v Speaker 3>lawful evil.

1415
01:24:15.439 --> 01:24:15.880
<v Speaker 2>Mm hmm.

1416
01:24:16.840 --> 01:24:18.640
<v Speaker 3>Try to kill us all with the flood, Like what

1417
01:24:19.000 --> 01:24:21.119
<v Speaker 3>am I supposed to do with that? That's lawful evil?

1418
01:24:23.800 --> 01:24:24.880
<v Speaker 2>That's very interesting.

1419
01:24:26.119 --> 01:24:29.279
<v Speaker 1>I see that though, you know, and they have to

1420
01:24:29.279 --> 01:24:30.319
<v Speaker 1>go to the Testament.

1421
01:24:31.359 --> 01:24:36.399
<v Speaker 3>But like you know, and and the the all of

1422
01:24:36.439 --> 01:24:38.600
<v Speaker 3>the sky gods, all of the thunder gods, with the

1423
01:24:38.640 --> 01:24:40.920
<v Speaker 3>exception maybe of Thor, who's just kind of like a

1424
01:24:41.000 --> 01:24:47.079
<v Speaker 3>drunk are are you know deeply? Yeah, but like they

1425
01:24:47.159 --> 01:24:52.000
<v Speaker 3>kind of they represent that element of patriarchue that if

1426
01:24:52.000 --> 01:24:58.560
<v Speaker 3>it is not balanced, will destroy everything eventually. Right, I'm true,

1427
01:24:59.680 --> 01:25:01.439
<v Speaker 3>and I'm I'm not saying that they shouldn't. I'm not

1428
01:25:01.520 --> 01:25:03.720
<v Speaker 3>saying they don't need the camera about there's always there's

1429
01:25:03.760 --> 01:25:06.720
<v Speaker 3>always that balances m key and there's little there's there's zus,

1430
01:25:06.760 --> 01:25:09.159
<v Speaker 3>and there's hades, there's you know, there's always a balance.

1431
01:25:09.680 --> 01:25:12.079
<v Speaker 3>It's very very important. But it's not it's not one

1432
01:25:12.199 --> 01:25:14.720
<v Speaker 3>or the other. It's like this balance needs to be there.

1433
01:25:17.000 --> 01:25:19.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I think that's great. And I mean it's always

1434
01:25:19.720 --> 01:25:23.039
<v Speaker 2>like kind of like a fundamental kind of like thread

1435
01:25:23.079 --> 01:25:26.079
<v Speaker 2>of science too. Right, the universe is always trying to

1436
01:25:26.079 --> 01:25:30.479
<v Speaker 2>find harmony. You get these polarities, but everything is you know,

1437
01:25:30.600 --> 01:25:35.039
<v Speaker 2>moving within the chaos to find equilibrium, and and we

1438
01:25:35.159 --> 01:25:40.359
<v Speaker 2>need that, you know, there's always a it's always a thing. Hey,

1439
01:25:40.800 --> 01:25:46.039
<v Speaker 2>life this thing called Lee.

1440
01:25:47.479 --> 01:25:48.920
<v Speaker 1>One thing I did want to ask before we start

1441
01:25:48.920 --> 01:25:51.680
<v Speaker 1>to wrap it up, for people who do people go

1442
01:25:51.720 --> 01:25:53.640
<v Speaker 1>out and get your book, what is one thing you

1443
01:25:53.680 --> 01:25:54.600
<v Speaker 1>hope they take away from it.

1444
01:25:58.479 --> 01:26:06.640
<v Speaker 2>One thing I'd hope for them to take is to

1445
01:26:07.199 --> 01:26:12.920
<v Speaker 2>really allow firmwork relationship with technology, really, because you know,

1446
01:26:13.159 --> 01:26:15.479
<v Speaker 2>in general, I would want that to be the most thing.

1447
01:26:15.520 --> 01:26:17.720
<v Speaker 2>Even if you get the book, you're not even esoteric.

1448
01:26:17.760 --> 01:26:21.520
<v Speaker 2>I mean yes, because it basically says like magic on it,

1449
01:26:21.560 --> 01:26:23.439
<v Speaker 2>and it says spells, and it says which on the

1450
01:26:23.479 --> 01:26:26.800
<v Speaker 2>front cover, So obviously it won't reach all the kind

1451
01:26:26.840 --> 01:26:30.840
<v Speaker 2>of the muggle population. But even if you know there

1452
01:26:30.840 --> 01:26:34.119
<v Speaker 2>are magical practitioners, get it and say no, like I

1453
01:26:34.199 --> 01:26:37.640
<v Speaker 2>think tech is like evil and it's you know, terrible,

1454
01:26:37.680 --> 01:26:40.119
<v Speaker 2>has nothing to do with nature. I argue that because

1455
01:26:40.119 --> 01:26:42.880
<v Speaker 2>there's a lot of natural elements, including crystals and whatnot

1456
01:26:43.000 --> 01:26:48.279
<v Speaker 2>in here. My big would be that it will. The

1457
01:26:48.279 --> 01:26:51.680
<v Speaker 2>book helped me develop a healthy relationship with my phone,

1458
01:26:51.920 --> 01:26:57.000
<v Speaker 2>and I'm not mentally unwell with it anymore. I work

1459
01:26:57.039 --> 01:26:59.600
<v Speaker 2>with it mindfully now, and I realized that.

1460
01:26:59.560 --> 01:27:01.199
<v Speaker 3>The power has done that for me.

1461
01:27:02.760 --> 01:27:07.119
<v Speaker 2>Oh that's cool. I'd love to send you, guys a

1462
01:27:07.159 --> 01:27:09.960
<v Speaker 2>book because I just yesterday got a whole big box

1463
01:27:10.039 --> 01:27:13.119
<v Speaker 2>them so I can like mail them to send me

1464
01:27:13.159 --> 01:27:16.880
<v Speaker 2>your send me your postal addresses for pel boxes, and

1465
01:27:16.920 --> 01:27:19.359
<v Speaker 2>I'll I'll throw them into the mail for you now

1466
01:27:19.359 --> 01:27:22.399
<v Speaker 2>because I got the whole whole box to sort of

1467
01:27:22.560 --> 01:27:24.279
<v Speaker 2>like distribute.

1468
01:27:24.520 --> 01:27:27.960
<v Speaker 1>That's great. Yeah, cool, Thank you. I appreciate that. Sunday,

1469
01:27:28.039 --> 01:27:29.640
<v Speaker 1>was there any did you want to ask you another

1470
01:27:29.800 --> 01:27:31.680
<v Speaker 1>question before we slept around? No.

1471
01:27:32.039 --> 01:27:33.880
<v Speaker 3>I feel like i've kind of I already went on

1472
01:27:33.920 --> 01:27:36.079
<v Speaker 3>so many tangents, and I apologize. I don't mean to

1473
01:27:36.119 --> 01:27:38.279
<v Speaker 3>take up so much space because but I know I

1474
01:27:38.399 --> 01:27:42.159
<v Speaker 3>love very I just I didn't want to say that

1475
01:27:42.199 --> 01:27:44.520
<v Speaker 3>this concept. I wrote this down here I find a

1476
01:27:44.520 --> 01:27:47.479
<v Speaker 3>piece of favorite write down. The idea of your phone

1477
01:27:47.520 --> 01:27:51.520
<v Speaker 3>as a wand is so brilliant. It is so dead

1478
01:27:51.560 --> 01:27:55.880
<v Speaker 3>on correct, and it's such a wonderful reframing of how

1479
01:27:55.920 --> 01:27:58.479
<v Speaker 3>we interface with technology. And I mean it, you really have,

1480
01:27:58.720 --> 01:28:01.039
<v Speaker 3>because I am I have been that guy. But I'm

1481
01:28:01.079 --> 01:28:03.720
<v Speaker 3>like technology is bad kind of attitude and I've been

1482
01:28:03.760 --> 01:28:05.920
<v Speaker 3>very grouchy about it. And I feel like you this

1483
01:28:05.960 --> 01:28:10.680
<v Speaker 3>conversation has shifted my awareness towards a more positive way

1484
01:28:10.760 --> 01:28:14.279
<v Speaker 3>to look at an interface with tech and so thank

1485
01:28:14.319 --> 01:28:16.880
<v Speaker 3>you for that. And I'm going to recommend your book

1486
01:28:16.880 --> 01:28:18.720
<v Speaker 3>to all my students.

1487
01:28:19.079 --> 01:28:22.479
<v Speaker 2>Oh bless you all right, that's so wonderful. Thank you

1488
01:28:22.520 --> 01:28:26.239
<v Speaker 2>for the kind words, and please for your your book.

1489
01:28:26.359 --> 01:28:26.920
<v Speaker 2>Is it out?

1490
01:28:27.600 --> 01:28:31.079
<v Speaker 3>Yeah? You can pre order it on Amazon now. Oh,

1491
01:28:31.159 --> 01:28:34.720
<v Speaker 3>let me my thing out there? You know you pre

1492
01:28:34.840 --> 01:28:37.359
<v Speaker 3>order my book please? It's on Amazon. It's called Chaos

1493
01:28:37.319 --> 01:28:40.680
<v Speaker 3>s Witchcraft. And I'm also doing a very limited number

1494
01:28:41.319 --> 01:28:45.920
<v Speaker 3>of leather bound copies where I'm going to personally take

1495
01:28:46.039 --> 01:28:49.760
<v Speaker 3>take the existing book, remove the paper cover and rebind

1496
01:28:49.800 --> 01:28:53.000
<v Speaker 3>it in leather. That's hands stamped. I'm doing all these myself.

1497
01:28:53.279 --> 01:28:56.079
<v Speaker 3>There are twenty left. I am hoping to sell out

1498
01:28:56.359 --> 01:28:58.520
<v Speaker 3>because that's what funds the whole thing, the stuff. I'm

1499
01:28:58.520 --> 01:29:00.920
<v Speaker 3>not making any money on these there. They're expensive to make,

1500
01:29:01.720 --> 01:29:05.159
<v Speaker 3>but I want them to exist. That's the point. So

1501
01:29:07.319 --> 01:29:11.239
<v Speaker 3>assigned numbered leather bound copy of Chaos what Shraft. They're

1502
01:29:11.239 --> 01:29:14.640
<v Speaker 3>available at my website the order Ofcastmagic dot com slash books.

1503
01:29:15.239 --> 01:29:22.159
<v Speaker 1>That's gangs. Thank you very much, son, I appreciate it. Tree.

1504
01:29:22.199 --> 01:29:24.000
<v Speaker 1>Would you like to let everybody know like where they

1505
01:29:24.000 --> 01:29:25.560
<v Speaker 1>can find all your stuff or anything that you like

1506
01:29:25.600 --> 01:29:26.800
<v Speaker 1>to promote.

1507
01:29:28.199 --> 01:29:33.199
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, we'll hook up with me on Instagram. I guess

1508
01:29:33.319 --> 01:29:37.800
<v Speaker 2>on that like Magical Digital Culden. It's usually where I

1509
01:29:37.840 --> 01:29:40.640
<v Speaker 2>post about anything coming up. I do a lot of

1510
01:29:40.680 --> 01:29:43.840
<v Speaker 2>online stuff, so anyone listening, and you know I'm based

1511
01:29:43.880 --> 01:29:46.920
<v Speaker 2>in the UK, but I have online stuff. I do

1512
01:29:47.039 --> 01:29:50.079
<v Speaker 2>like three moon rituals a month, new moon, three quarter

1513
01:29:50.159 --> 01:29:55.359
<v Speaker 2>moon and also full moon. I also do like basis

1514
01:29:55.359 --> 01:29:57.199
<v Speaker 2>for people to do dream work, and we work with

1515
01:29:57.359 --> 01:30:00.560
<v Speaker 2>various plants that help trigger more dreams. So we do

1516
01:30:00.640 --> 01:30:04.079
<v Speaker 2>like containers of four weeks. I had a thing called porter.

1517
01:30:04.359 --> 01:30:06.960
<v Speaker 2>We work for four weeks with a plant. I got

1518
01:30:07.000 --> 01:30:09.479
<v Speaker 2>a blue lotus flower one coming up, so for four

1519
01:30:09.520 --> 01:30:12.279
<v Speaker 2>weeks we're gonna be working blue lotus flower to dream

1520
01:30:12.640 --> 01:30:17.479
<v Speaker 2>out into the dream and only take ten Yeah, I mean,

1521
01:30:17.520 --> 01:30:20.079
<v Speaker 2>I'll send you you I'll send you both free links

1522
01:30:20.119 --> 01:30:24.720
<v Speaker 2>because like, hey, it feels like I always like it.

1523
01:30:24.880 --> 01:30:31.920
<v Speaker 2>Come that starts, that starts on the twenty six. It's like, uh, how.

1524
01:30:31.840 --> 01:30:37.279
<v Speaker 3>Do you I've taken dry blue lotus flour and crushed

1525
01:30:37.359 --> 01:30:40.039
<v Speaker 3>up with some weed before. That's the only way I've

1526
01:30:40.079 --> 01:30:41.600
<v Speaker 3>ever experienced. I don't know what the correct think You're

1527
01:30:41.600 --> 01:30:42.800
<v Speaker 3>supposed to make a tincture right.

1528
01:30:44.159 --> 01:30:46.439
<v Speaker 2>You can make a tea, you can make a tincture,

1529
01:30:46.640 --> 01:30:49.159
<v Speaker 2>you can smoke it, you can vape it. There's lots

1530
01:30:49.199 --> 01:30:51.359
<v Speaker 2>of different ways to take these plants, which is really

1531
01:30:51.439 --> 01:30:52.800
<v Speaker 2>quite versatile.

1532
01:30:53.079 --> 01:30:54.119
<v Speaker 3>Beautiful.

1533
01:30:55.119 --> 01:30:59.039
<v Speaker 2>Really, it's an amazing blue low flower will take you

1534
01:30:59.079 --> 01:31:02.239
<v Speaker 2>into the shadow like you know, I've been working with

1535
01:31:02.279 --> 01:31:06.600
<v Speaker 2>her for maybe well over ten years now, and you

1536
01:31:06.720 --> 01:31:09.359
<v Speaker 2>always to bring up shadow work in the dreams, which

1537
01:31:09.399 --> 01:31:13.079
<v Speaker 2>is good though. It's great. She's a real amazing plant

1538
01:31:13.079 --> 01:31:14.800
<v Speaker 2>for that. But yeah, lots of different stuff.

1539
01:31:17.000 --> 01:31:19.199
<v Speaker 3>My experience with it was it was very interesting that

1540
01:31:19.279 --> 01:31:20.880
<v Speaker 3>I remember this. It was it was probably close to

1541
01:31:20.920 --> 01:31:23.880
<v Speaker 3>a decade ago, but it's a vivid memory because I

1542
01:31:23.920 --> 01:31:28.880
<v Speaker 3>felt possessed in the most wonderful way by my own

1543
01:31:28.960 --> 01:31:31.920
<v Speaker 3>higher self for like an hour, you know what I mean,

1544
01:31:32.000 --> 01:31:37.199
<v Speaker 3>Like I was not me. I was a much better, smarter,

1545
01:31:37.439 --> 01:31:40.880
<v Speaker 3>wiser version of me, but that wasn't me. And we

1546
01:31:40.920 --> 01:31:44.159
<v Speaker 3>were chilling on my friend's rooftop in Toronto and it

1547
01:31:44.239 --> 01:31:48.479
<v Speaker 3>was just like the most pleasant, wonderful. It was felt

1548
01:31:48.479 --> 01:31:50.640
<v Speaker 3>like sitting in a hot tub that was the perfect temperature.

1549
01:31:51.199 --> 01:31:57.079
<v Speaker 3>You know. It was great. Wow that that was noticed.

1550
01:31:58.880 --> 01:32:03.840
<v Speaker 2>I mean, plants are like tis like seriously and they

1551
01:32:03.880 --> 01:32:07.600
<v Speaker 2>will show you things. That is such a beautiful experience.

1552
01:32:07.640 --> 01:32:09.720
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, god, amazing, Oh my.

1553
01:32:09.680 --> 01:32:15.920
<v Speaker 1>Gods, that's really cool. Wow. Nice? All right? Yeah. Uh

1554
01:32:16.079 --> 01:32:18.520
<v Speaker 1>and when does the book come out?

1555
01:32:19.239 --> 01:32:21.000
<v Speaker 2>Uh? It comes out in May.

1556
01:32:21.520 --> 01:32:24.119
<v Speaker 1>Okay, good, May twelfth.

1557
01:32:24.319 --> 01:32:25.640
<v Speaker 2>You can re order it now.

1558
01:32:25.600 --> 01:32:27.840
<v Speaker 1>Okay, Yeah, it's all lot.

1559
01:32:28.119 --> 01:32:28.319
<v Speaker 3>Yeh.

1560
01:32:28.720 --> 01:32:30.840
<v Speaker 1>Has been times when I mentioned the dude, when I've

1561
01:32:30.880 --> 01:32:32.880
<v Speaker 1>mentioned the date for it. I know I mentioned it earlier.

1562
01:32:32.920 --> 01:32:35.279
<v Speaker 1>I could have been wrong, though, because I've had people

1563
01:32:35.279 --> 01:32:36.800
<v Speaker 1>on the show and be like, oh, yeah, they've already

1564
01:32:36.840 --> 01:32:39.239
<v Speaker 1>changed that, and I'm like, oh, sorry, yeah, I forgot

1565
01:32:39.239 --> 01:32:41.399
<v Speaker 1>what I said, but I was but it was in May. Yeah,

1566
01:32:41.800 --> 01:32:45.560
<v Speaker 1>all right, thank you very much again, Tree. Awesome discussion.

1567
01:32:45.640 --> 01:32:47.520
<v Speaker 1>I really had a great time. I'm sure we could

1568
01:32:47.520 --> 01:32:49.479
<v Speaker 1>probably get you on again, just for something to talk

1569
01:32:49.479 --> 01:32:52.560
<v Speaker 1>about in the future. Definitely interesting stuff with the death

1570
01:32:53.119 --> 01:32:56.039
<v Speaker 1>and technology. It's actually kind of like two things I'm

1571
01:32:56.119 --> 01:32:57.920
<v Speaker 1>very interested in myself when it comes to the occult,

1572
01:32:58.039 --> 01:33:00.960
<v Speaker 1>So there's tons of things I could talk about. But

1573
01:33:01.159 --> 01:33:03.840
<v Speaker 1>uh so, thank you so much for coming on. Man,

1574
01:33:03.840 --> 01:33:06.760
<v Speaker 1>that was a blast. Really yeah, yeah, I loved it.

1575
01:33:07.399 --> 01:33:09.960
<v Speaker 3>This is great, I said, I really I love the

1576
01:33:09.960 --> 01:33:13.279
<v Speaker 3>way you run your show. And it's gotten me more.

1577
01:33:13.840 --> 01:33:16.680
<v Speaker 3>It's inspired to get back into doing my own podcast,

1578
01:33:16.720 --> 01:33:20.920
<v Speaker 3>which has been recently. But yeah, this is I love

1579
01:33:20.960 --> 01:33:23.840
<v Speaker 3>your format. I love that you live. Also, this is

1580
01:33:23.920 --> 01:33:25.720
<v Speaker 3>great because you don't have to go back and edit

1581
01:33:25.720 --> 01:33:28.199
<v Speaker 3>the whole thing. You just gotta just get it up there,

1582
01:33:28.279 --> 01:33:29.199
<v Speaker 3>just do it. I love it.

1583
01:33:29.279 --> 01:33:31.720
<v Speaker 1>Yep, yeah, thank you, Yeah, no, I appreciate it. And

1584
01:33:31.760 --> 01:33:33.279
<v Speaker 1>again Tret you, thank you so much for coming on.

1585
01:33:33.319 --> 01:33:35.199
<v Speaker 1>It was a blast. Hopefully talk to you again at

1586
01:33:35.199 --> 01:33:38.600
<v Speaker 1>some point. And everybody in the chat that's what's up.

1587
01:33:38.600 --> 01:33:41.560
<v Speaker 1>Thank you very much. I appreciate all the comments. That's

1588
01:33:41.560 --> 01:33:44.239
<v Speaker 1>why we go live. And uh, until the next one,

1589
01:33:44.279 --> 01:33:47.039
<v Speaker 1>everybody be well. Lada
