WEBVTT 1 00:00:30.280 --> 00:00:32.560 Welcome back to our next series of episodes from The 2 00:00:32.560 --> 00:00:35.640 Pathwent Chile. I'm Robin and as I mentioned in our 3 00:00:35.679 --> 00:00:38.719 last few episodes, Ashley, Yeah, for personal reasons, has had 4 00:00:38.759 --> 00:00:40.960 to take some time off, but hopefully she will be 5 00:00:41.039 --> 00:00:43.600 back very soon. So for the moment, I will be 6 00:00:43.679 --> 00:00:46.079 sharing the details about a case with jewels and she 7 00:00:46.159 --> 00:00:49.240 will give off her reaction. So, Jeules, have you ever 8 00:00:49.280 --> 00:00:51.200 heard of the murder of Patsy Wright? 9 00:00:52.240 --> 00:00:55.200 I don't think so. I mean, Patsy Wright sounds like 10 00:00:55.240 --> 00:00:58.000 one of those names that I've heard before, but the 11 00:00:58.039 --> 00:01:01.399 details aren't coming to me. Maybe I've heard it, maybe 12 00:01:01.399 --> 00:01:04.159 I heard it on the Trail and Cold, but either way, 13 00:01:04.239 --> 00:01:06.799 it's not ringing any bells right now, so I'm excited 14 00:01:06.840 --> 00:01:08.040 for you to tell me about the case. 15 00:01:09.239 --> 00:01:11.319 Well, of course, this is another case which I did 16 00:01:11.319 --> 00:01:13.760 cover on The Trail Went Cold, which was also featured 17 00:01:13.840 --> 00:01:17.120 on Unsolved Mysteries. And what's interesting about it is the 18 00:01:17.159 --> 00:01:19.920 method of murder because Patsy Wright was a victim of 19 00:01:20.079 --> 00:01:23.599 strychnine poisoning, which is very rare these days. This is 20 00:01:23.640 --> 00:01:26.920 something that you would often find in old Agatha Christie 21 00:01:26.959 --> 00:01:30.439 mysteries and was a common poisoning method during the eighteen 22 00:01:30.519 --> 00:01:34.439 hundreds or the early twentieth century, but this case took 23 00:01:34.519 --> 00:01:38.480 place in Texas in nineteen eighty seven, and on the 24 00:01:38.560 --> 00:01:41.680 Unsolved Mystery segment, Robert Stack even said that at the 25 00:01:41.680 --> 00:01:44.879 time of this episode, there was only one other confirmed 26 00:01:44.920 --> 00:01:49.040 case of strychnine poisoning by a homicide since nineteen fifty 27 00:01:49.159 --> 00:01:52.159 because at that particular point, strychnine was very hard to 28 00:01:52.239 --> 00:01:55.480 obtain and sales of it were strictly regulated, so it 29 00:01:55.519 --> 00:01:58.200 would be very difficult to obtain strychnine and use it 30 00:01:58.239 --> 00:02:00.599 to commit a murder and get away with it. But 31 00:02:00.760 --> 00:02:03.079 this is one of the rare cases of it because 32 00:02:03.359 --> 00:02:07.359 someone managed to slip strychnine into a Patsy Writes Nike will, 33 00:02:07.680 --> 00:02:10.120 which she always took before she went to bed every night, 34 00:02:10.360 --> 00:02:12.719 and it wound up killing her. And here we are, 35 00:02:12.919 --> 00:02:15.599 nearly forty years later, and we still don't know who 36 00:02:15.639 --> 00:02:17.080 did it or what their motive was. 37 00:02:17.599 --> 00:02:21.159 So this is interesting for multiple different reasons. We've been 38 00:02:21.199 --> 00:02:24.719 covering old timey Hollywood mysteries and this one isn't an 39 00:02:24.719 --> 00:02:26.960 old timy mystery. I mean, it's from the eighties, so 40 00:02:27.039 --> 00:02:32.479 it is somewhat old. But there's elements of yesteryear kind 41 00:02:32.479 --> 00:02:34.879 of peppered in when we have the method of murder 42 00:02:35.039 --> 00:02:38.439 being that which was common in like the eighteen hundreds 43 00:02:38.840 --> 00:02:42.400 with strychnine, and I would think that someone would have 44 00:02:42.439 --> 00:02:44.800 to have like a commercial license to be able to 45 00:02:45.439 --> 00:02:48.439 procure large amounts of strychnine, that it would be rather 46 00:02:48.879 --> 00:02:52.599 controlled and regulated. But refresh my memory. Is strych nine 47 00:02:52.639 --> 00:02:54.719 one of the main components in rat poison. 48 00:02:55.680 --> 00:02:58.439 It is, yes, like it's mostly used as a pesticide 49 00:02:58.439 --> 00:03:01.680 to kill birds and rodents, and of course during the 50 00:03:01.719 --> 00:03:05.039 eighteen hundreds this was a popular method for serial killers 51 00:03:05.080 --> 00:03:07.800 because if you put strych nine into someone's drink or 52 00:03:07.840 --> 00:03:10.080 food and then you weren't at the scene when they died, 53 00:03:10.199 --> 00:03:12.560 it would be easier to get away with it. And 54 00:03:12.599 --> 00:03:15.599 there's a very famous unsolved case involving strick nine. One 55 00:03:15.639 --> 00:03:19.479 of the co founders of Stanford University, Jane Stanford, actually 56 00:03:19.520 --> 00:03:22.159 died from strychnine poisoning all the way back in nineteen 57 00:03:22.199 --> 00:03:24.840 oh five. But of course by nineteen eighty seven this 58 00:03:25.000 --> 00:03:27.919 was just very very uncommon because you would either have 59 00:03:28.000 --> 00:03:30.319 to have a license to sell it. So it's been 60 00:03:30.360 --> 00:03:33.039 speculated because they never figured out where this stryck nine 61 00:03:33.039 --> 00:03:35.960 came from. That whoever killed Patsy either stole it from 62 00:03:36.240 --> 00:03:39.439 a lab or something or obtained it on the black market. 63 00:03:39.759 --> 00:03:43.080 That's really interesting. This is a total side thing and 64 00:03:43.120 --> 00:03:46.080 like not really all that relevant, but I'm just curious 65 00:03:46.120 --> 00:03:48.639 if you know the answer, because it has to do 66 00:03:48.680 --> 00:03:52.400 with poisoning. Are you aware of And I don't really 67 00:03:52.439 --> 00:03:56.120 know if these claims were ever fully substantiated or corroborated, 68 00:03:56.199 --> 00:04:01.280 but the Borgias were rumored to, like Rodrigo and Lucrezia 69 00:04:01.319 --> 00:04:04.879 and Cesaret were rumored to have guests over for dinner 70 00:04:04.919 --> 00:04:08.199 parties and then poison them and throw their bodies in 71 00:04:08.280 --> 00:04:10.319 the Tyber River. Do you think that they would have 72 00:04:10.400 --> 00:04:11.960 used something similar to strychnine. 73 00:04:12.240 --> 00:04:15.759 Possibly. I'm not really familiar with the Borges case, but 74 00:04:16.120 --> 00:04:18.839 I do know that there are some documented serial killers 75 00:04:18.839 --> 00:04:22.120 who used it back several centuries ago, So it not 76 00:04:22.199 --> 00:04:24.839 surprised me if they did that because back then, obviously 77 00:04:24.959 --> 00:04:28.160 strychnine was not highly regulated and you could probably just 78 00:04:28.199 --> 00:04:31.120 go into a shop and purchase it, so that's why 79 00:04:31.160 --> 00:04:33.360 it was used as an effective method to kill people. 80 00:04:34.120 --> 00:04:36.439 You should do an episode on the trail when cold 81 00:04:36.560 --> 00:04:39.600 of the crimes of the Borges. That would be so interesting. 82 00:04:39.639 --> 00:04:41.959 There's so much more associated with it, and it would 83 00:04:42.000 --> 00:04:46.000 be like obviously impossible to corroborate a lot of the details, 84 00:04:46.360 --> 00:04:48.199 but it would be really fascinating. 85 00:04:48.959 --> 00:04:51.199 How long ago was it? What century do you remember? 86 00:04:52.839 --> 00:04:53.839 Yeah, I'm not sure. 87 00:04:54.160 --> 00:04:57.480 I'm just gonna look it up out of my curiosity. Yeah, 88 00:04:57.519 --> 00:05:01.000 the Borgia family took place in the oh waitter is 89 00:05:01.040 --> 00:05:04.439 it in like the fifteenth and sixteenth century, So that 90 00:05:04.480 --> 00:05:06.720 would definitely be a story where the trail went really 91 00:05:06.839 --> 00:05:07.480 really cold. 92 00:05:08.040 --> 00:05:11.199 Oh yeah, But there's so much with that family, Like, 93 00:05:11.240 --> 00:05:14.639 there's so many layers. It's like Game of Thrones type stuff. 94 00:05:15.399 --> 00:05:19.319 Interesting. But this one takes place in Arlington, Texas, in 95 00:05:19.399 --> 00:05:22.279 nineteen eighty seven, and the victim is forty three year 96 00:05:22.319 --> 00:05:25.839 old Patsy Bolton Wright, who is a very successful business woman. 97 00:05:26.639 --> 00:05:29.199 She has been divorced twice. She had two children with 98 00:05:29.240 --> 00:05:32.480 her first husband, Bill Wright, a son named Wayne and 99 00:05:32.519 --> 00:05:35.959 a daughter named Leslie, who are both in their early twenties. 100 00:05:36.160 --> 00:05:39.079 And she got married a second time and this marriage 101 00:05:39.120 --> 00:05:40.920 did not go well. But I'll talk more about that 102 00:05:41.000 --> 00:05:44.240 a bit later. But at this particular point, Patsy has 103 00:05:44.240 --> 00:05:46.439 been dating quite a few people. She's involved in a 104 00:05:46.480 --> 00:05:49.959 relationship with a man named Larry Todd, but she isn't 105 00:05:50.000 --> 00:05:53.279 really in any hurry to get married again. And she's 106 00:05:53.319 --> 00:05:56.000 also living in a temporary rental house because she is 107 00:05:56.040 --> 00:05:59.000 planning to purchase a ranch because she is really into 108 00:05:59.240 --> 00:06:02.720 horses and is hoping to raise and train three horses 109 00:06:02.839 --> 00:06:06.240 on her new property. But what's interesting is that Patsy 110 00:06:06.319 --> 00:06:09.920 and her sister Sally are both millionaires because they wound 111 00:06:10.000 --> 00:06:13.399 up collecting a sizable inheritance from their late father because 112 00:06:13.439 --> 00:06:17.240 he was a creator of two very popular wax museums. 113 00:06:17.399 --> 00:06:20.600 And this is interesting because this wax museums are going 114 00:06:20.639 --> 00:06:22.800 to be a major part of this story, as they 115 00:06:22.800 --> 00:06:26.759 were apparently insanely popular in Texas back during the nineteen eighties. 116 00:06:27.199 --> 00:06:29.879 So Patsy and her sister have a combined net worth 117 00:06:29.920 --> 00:06:31.839 of six million dollars because. 118 00:06:31.560 --> 00:06:35.399 Of it, and in the eighties six million dollars, So 119 00:06:36.079 --> 00:06:39.040 say Patsy's worth three million, that would be more like 120 00:06:39.199 --> 00:06:42.839 six million in today's money roughly, So that would be 121 00:06:43.000 --> 00:06:46.439 a sizeable amount and enough that it would give her 122 00:06:46.439 --> 00:06:49.319 the freedom to be able to date and to be 123 00:06:49.319 --> 00:06:54.000 able to choose a partner based on not necessarily She's 124 00:06:54.000 --> 00:06:56.519 not necessarily needing to look for somebody who would be 125 00:06:56.959 --> 00:07:00.000 a good provider for her children. She would be able 126 00:07:00.120 --> 00:07:03.240 to choose somebody based on love alone and hopefully that 127 00:07:03.279 --> 00:07:05.879 they would be a good and supportive parent to her children, 128 00:07:06.279 --> 00:07:10.000 but being a supportive provider in a monetary sense would 129 00:07:10.040 --> 00:07:14.199 take a back seat. So I think that her having 130 00:07:14.240 --> 00:07:15.920 this money it can be a bit of a double 131 00:07:16.000 --> 00:07:18.319 edged sword. It can be a real benefit because it 132 00:07:18.360 --> 00:07:20.879 does give her that freedom, but it might attract the 133 00:07:20.959 --> 00:07:24.560 wrong type of individuals. But it also would allow her 134 00:07:24.600 --> 00:07:26.879 to do things like be able to get into the 135 00:07:26.920 --> 00:07:30.480 horse business that is not an inexpensive business to be in. 136 00:07:31.040 --> 00:07:33.399 And I've known many a horse girl in my life, 137 00:07:33.480 --> 00:07:35.240 and I have a special spot in my heart for 138 00:07:35.279 --> 00:07:36.160 horse girls. 139 00:07:36.720 --> 00:07:39.000 Yes, it sounds like Patsy was living her best life 140 00:07:39.040 --> 00:07:41.519 at this point because she had two marriages which did 141 00:07:41.519 --> 00:07:43.920 not end well. So she's just saying, I'm not going 142 00:07:43.959 --> 00:07:45.920 to get married again until I find the right guy, 143 00:07:46.000 --> 00:07:48.759 and in the meantime try to pursue my passions and 144 00:07:48.800 --> 00:07:51.800 interests such as horses. And at this particular point, she 145 00:07:51.920 --> 00:07:55.040 was even thinking about opening up Ripley's believe it or 146 00:07:55.040 --> 00:07:58.199 not museum in San Antonio, so she wants to expand 147 00:07:58.240 --> 00:08:02.639 this whole wax museum bit business. Before she died, Patsy 148 00:08:02.680 --> 00:08:05.639 went on a two week camping trip with her daughter, Leslie, 149 00:08:05.680 --> 00:08:08.639 and the day she got back, she went horseback riding, 150 00:08:08.839 --> 00:08:11.079 met up with a realtor to talk more about purchasing 151 00:08:11.160 --> 00:08:14.360 the ranch, and then she attended a Halloween party at 152 00:08:14.360 --> 00:08:16.920 one of her museums because they had a big Halloween 153 00:08:16.959 --> 00:08:19.759 show scheduled a week later, because this took place on 154 00:08:19.759 --> 00:08:22.519 October the twenty second, and they were having a whole 155 00:08:22.600 --> 00:08:25.279 dress rehearsal for the show, and as far as anyone 156 00:08:25.319 --> 00:08:28.319 can tell, after the show ended at nine pm, she 157 00:08:28.399 --> 00:08:30.639 went to a bar with a friend and then went home. 158 00:08:31.000 --> 00:08:35.080 But at around three am on October the twenty third, Sally, 159 00:08:35.200 --> 00:08:38.159 her sister, was woken up by a phone call from Patsy. 160 00:08:38.320 --> 00:08:42.279 Sally was living with her husband, Steve Horning, and Patsy 161 00:08:42.320 --> 00:08:44.039 on the phone said that she had just taken some 162 00:08:44.159 --> 00:08:46.480 night quill to help her sleep, but she was now 163 00:08:46.519 --> 00:08:50.600 feeling very nauseous and having trouble breathing and just suddenly 164 00:08:50.639 --> 00:08:54.399 collapsed where it seemed like she was unconscious so Steve 165 00:08:54.519 --> 00:08:58.159 and Sally started panicking. And this is an interesting detail 166 00:08:58.200 --> 00:09:00.279 because Steve and Sally are going to be look dat 167 00:09:00.320 --> 00:09:04.120 has potential suspects. And they would claim that they tried 168 00:09:04.159 --> 00:09:06.480 to call nine one one to get an ambulance to 169 00:09:06.519 --> 00:09:10.480 Patsy's residence, but they just could not remember the address 170 00:09:10.559 --> 00:09:13.399 because this was a rental home where she hadn't been 171 00:09:13.440 --> 00:09:15.879 there all that long. So they were just blanking when 172 00:09:15.919 --> 00:09:17.799 they tried to tell the ambulance where to go, and 173 00:09:17.840 --> 00:09:20.639 then just decided, well, we can't really do much from here, 174 00:09:20.679 --> 00:09:23.440 so let's drive over to our house. Because they said, 175 00:09:23.559 --> 00:09:25.360 we know the route to the house, we know which 176 00:09:25.399 --> 00:09:27.919 turns to make, which streets to go, we just don't 177 00:09:27.960 --> 00:09:30.320 know the exact address. And so I wanted to ask 178 00:09:30.360 --> 00:09:32.919 if you found that unusual, because I can tell you 179 00:09:32.919 --> 00:09:36.279 from experience that I'm someone where I will know where 180 00:09:36.320 --> 00:09:38.600 like a close friend or family members live, where I 181 00:09:38.639 --> 00:09:40.600 will know the route to drive how to get there. 182 00:09:40.879 --> 00:09:43.080 But if you ask me their exact address, I might 183 00:09:43.159 --> 00:09:43.759 draw a blank. 184 00:09:44.600 --> 00:09:47.559 Oh I don't think it's strange at all to remember 185 00:09:47.600 --> 00:09:50.360 somebody's exact address. Yeah, I'm the exact same as you. 186 00:09:50.519 --> 00:09:53.240 I know how to get there. What turns to take, 187 00:09:53.679 --> 00:09:56.200 but knowing the address, Like I'm just trying to think, 188 00:09:56.240 --> 00:09:58.559 like I'm going to my parents' house or something. Do 189 00:09:58.639 --> 00:10:01.000 I know their actual address? No, but I know exactly 190 00:10:01.000 --> 00:10:04.360 where they live, and especially if it's somewhere that I 191 00:10:04.399 --> 00:10:06.679 could tell you the street, but like the address that 192 00:10:06.759 --> 00:10:10.600 would elude me. So in that moment of panic, if 193 00:10:10.639 --> 00:10:13.360 she's been if she hasn't been living there that long, 194 00:10:13.639 --> 00:10:16.480 and it's a rental home, I don't find it odd 195 00:10:16.480 --> 00:10:18.879 that they don't know. And this would have been before 196 00:10:18.960 --> 00:10:20.759 the time that they would have been able to trace 197 00:10:20.840 --> 00:10:25.039 the call very accurately and then send an ambulance there. 198 00:10:25.679 --> 00:10:28.759 So I can only imagine that feeling of panic, And 199 00:10:28.799 --> 00:10:32.759 it's easy to judge if you're somebody who just remembers 200 00:10:32.840 --> 00:10:36.679 addresses or files that away in something that's necessary. It's 201 00:10:36.759 --> 00:10:39.679 just not in ever filed into my brain is something 202 00:10:39.679 --> 00:10:41.600 that I'm going to need to know at a later date. 203 00:10:42.360 --> 00:10:44.840 Yeah, That's what I'm thinking myself, because I've seen online 204 00:10:44.840 --> 00:10:47.759 discussions about this case where some people get suspicious of 205 00:10:47.799 --> 00:10:50.159 Steve and Sally for this reason, thinking that they were 206 00:10:50.240 --> 00:10:52.279 using this as an excuse to go to the house 207 00:10:52.600 --> 00:10:55.559 baby commit the poisoning and dispose of evidence before they 208 00:10:55.559 --> 00:10:59.159 called the ambulance from Patsy's bedroom. But I can tell you, 209 00:10:59.279 --> 00:11:01.919 like I use to visit my grandparents' house all the time. 210 00:11:01.960 --> 00:11:04.159 They're like several hours away from me, and I could 211 00:11:04.159 --> 00:11:06.480 probably do the route like it's been in my head 212 00:11:06.519 --> 00:11:08.279 from driving there so many times that I could do 213 00:11:08.320 --> 00:11:10.279 it by heart. But if you ask me the address 214 00:11:10.360 --> 00:11:12.840 of where my grandparents used to live, I drawing a 215 00:11:12.840 --> 00:11:15.799 complete blank because that's just information I never needed to know. 216 00:11:16.799 --> 00:11:19.480 Yeah, it becomes irrelevant if you know how to get there. 217 00:11:19.879 --> 00:11:22.559 The address is something that you need to file away 218 00:11:22.600 --> 00:11:24.679 as important if you don't know how to get to 219 00:11:24.720 --> 00:11:28.080 a location, and like these days we'd put it into 220 00:11:28.639 --> 00:11:31.240 you know, ways or Google maps or something like that. 221 00:11:31.360 --> 00:11:34.399 But back then you might look at a map and 222 00:11:34.440 --> 00:11:37.960 then figure your way to the location. But if you 223 00:11:38.080 --> 00:11:40.759 know how to get there, then why would you need 224 00:11:40.799 --> 00:11:43.360 to remember the address unless you're sending like a Christmas 225 00:11:43.360 --> 00:11:45.919 card or something. And that's really the only time that 226 00:11:45.960 --> 00:11:48.679 I'm ever like, oh, what's this person's address? Is when 227 00:11:48.720 --> 00:11:50.720 I need to send a Christmas card or a Birthday card. 228 00:11:51.320 --> 00:11:55.080 Yeah, that totally makes sense to me. So when Steve 229 00:11:55.159 --> 00:11:57.600 and Sally arrived. They discovered that the front door for 230 00:11:57.639 --> 00:12:00.440 Patsy's residence was locked, so they couldn't get in, but 231 00:12:00.840 --> 00:12:03.279 when they went to Patsy's bedroom window, they discovered that 232 00:12:03.360 --> 00:12:06.120 she had left it partially open, so they were able 233 00:12:06.159 --> 00:12:09.120 to enter through there. So they found Patsy on her 234 00:12:09.159 --> 00:12:11.840 bed and it looked like she was unconscious at that point, 235 00:12:11.879 --> 00:12:14.000 but she was still alive and they were trying to 236 00:12:14.039 --> 00:12:17.080 revive her but cannot wake her up. So while Sally 237 00:12:17.159 --> 00:12:20.159 was phoning for the paramedics for help, Steve attempted to 238 00:12:20.159 --> 00:12:24.240 perform to mouth resuscitation on Patsy but was surprised when 239 00:12:24.320 --> 00:12:27.960 green liquid kept entering his mouth, which he subsequently spit out, 240 00:12:28.080 --> 00:12:30.840 and in retrospect, it turned out that was the cough 241 00:12:30.879 --> 00:12:33.639 syrup that she had taken right before she went to bed, 242 00:12:33.679 --> 00:12:36.320 because I'm guessing she was unable to digest it properly 243 00:12:36.759 --> 00:12:39.679 because it had traces of strychnine in it. So the 244 00:12:39.720 --> 00:12:42.600 paramedics soon arrived and even though they made an attempt 245 00:12:42.639 --> 00:12:45.600 to revive Patsy, they were unsuccessful, and while in the 246 00:12:45.639 --> 00:12:48.879 midst of taking her to the hospital, that's when she died. 247 00:12:49.120 --> 00:12:51.759 And at first they had no idea what happened here, 248 00:12:51.840 --> 00:12:55.480 because obviously strychnine poisoning is not something that's going to 249 00:12:55.519 --> 00:12:58.159 immediately come into your head when while a loved one 250 00:12:58.240 --> 00:13:01.600 dies of very strange causes. So since she was only 251 00:13:01.639 --> 00:13:03.720 forty three years old and she appeared to be in 252 00:13:03.759 --> 00:13:06.159 good health, they could not figure out what happened at 253 00:13:06.200 --> 00:13:09.879 first because she seemed like a very healthy person and 254 00:13:10.000 --> 00:13:12.879 it just seemed to be like an undetermined medical issue. 255 00:13:13.200 --> 00:13:15.720 But it was not until over a week later, after 256 00:13:15.840 --> 00:13:19.399 Patsy's funeral and memorial service had happened, that they decided 257 00:13:19.440 --> 00:13:23.120 to form a routine autopsy where they used a mass 258 00:13:23.120 --> 00:13:27.200 spectrometer to check for fifty six thousand different foreign substances 259 00:13:27.200 --> 00:13:30.360 in her blood samples, and suddenly the machine gave off 260 00:13:30.399 --> 00:13:34.320 a violent reaction, and when the lab technician asked for identification, 261 00:13:34.720 --> 00:13:37.279 he discovered that it was strychnine in her bloodstream and 262 00:13:37.320 --> 00:13:38.480 this was the cause of her death. 263 00:13:39.519 --> 00:13:42.200 This just feels like an I get a Christian novel. 264 00:13:42.240 --> 00:13:45.879 At this point, you think that there is this undetermined 265 00:13:45.879 --> 00:13:49.279 medical cause and that she died and that it's tragic. 266 00:13:49.679 --> 00:13:52.240 There doesn't seem to be any major underlying health issues 267 00:13:52.799 --> 00:13:55.799 and she's got her whole life out of her, so 268 00:13:56.120 --> 00:13:59.080 it's tragic. But then when you layer that on with 269 00:13:59.159 --> 00:14:02.480 this last autopsy, whatever made them choose to do this 270 00:14:02.600 --> 00:14:05.360 at the very last moment, It makes me wonder who 271 00:14:05.399 --> 00:14:09.840 pushed for this and why with somebody acting strangely, was 272 00:14:09.919 --> 00:14:11.720 there a reason to believe that it could have been 273 00:14:11.759 --> 00:14:15.000 something other than natural causes. I'm not sure, but I 274 00:14:15.000 --> 00:14:18.519 would love to know the answer. And then to find 275 00:14:18.600 --> 00:14:22.759 out that it's strick nine and everything flips it used 276 00:14:22.759 --> 00:14:25.919 to be. It was once looked at as this accidental 277 00:14:26.039 --> 00:14:30.919 death and this overwhelming tragedy where two children no longer 278 00:14:30.919 --> 00:14:34.919 have their mother and everybody is bereft, but now it's 279 00:14:35.039 --> 00:14:38.399 murder and the police have to look at it through 280 00:14:38.399 --> 00:14:42.120 a completely different lens. And unfortunately, what could have been 281 00:14:42.120 --> 00:14:44.320 looked at as the quote unquote scene of the crime 282 00:14:45.320 --> 00:14:48.960 was disturbed and they wouldn't have taken any proper evidence 283 00:14:49.000 --> 00:14:51.480 because they just assumed it was a medical emergency. And 284 00:14:51.720 --> 00:14:56.879 I can completely understand why. But I guess there's the 285 00:14:57.039 --> 00:15:01.200 possibility that whoever had access and who ever spiked that 286 00:15:01.360 --> 00:15:04.039 night quill, she might not have taken niquill on a 287 00:15:04.080 --> 00:15:06.559 regular basis. They might have just put it in that 288 00:15:06.679 --> 00:15:09.559 night quill and bided their time and thought, eventually she's 289 00:15:09.600 --> 00:15:12.200 going to use it, and maybe it will have been 290 00:15:12.360 --> 00:15:15.039 months since I've been here, so it will be impossible 291 00:15:15.320 --> 00:15:17.679 to point the finger at me exactly. 292 00:15:17.759 --> 00:15:21.240 And that's why they originally thought that whoever killed Patsy 293 00:15:21.360 --> 00:15:23.720 was someone who knew her well and had intimate knowledge 294 00:15:23.720 --> 00:15:26.399 of her routine, because it was common practice for her 295 00:15:26.440 --> 00:15:29.159 to take niightquill before she went to bed because she 296 00:15:29.159 --> 00:15:32.759 would sometimes have trouble sleeping. And you're right, they did 297 00:15:32.799 --> 00:15:35.879 not secure the scene as a potential homicide at first, 298 00:15:35.879 --> 00:15:38.200 because they just thought she may have died of natural 299 00:15:38.240 --> 00:15:41.879 causes or some random medical issue. But thankfully, they still 300 00:15:41.919 --> 00:15:45.519 had the bottle of niquill inside her bathroom and they 301 00:15:45.559 --> 00:15:48.679 decided to check it, and sure enough, they found traces 302 00:15:48.679 --> 00:15:51.240 of strychnine in it, and even though a few grams 303 00:15:51.279 --> 00:15:53.559 of it are enough to be fatal, there was enough 304 00:15:53.600 --> 00:15:56.240 strychnine in the cough syrup to kill eight or nine people. 305 00:15:56.320 --> 00:15:58.600 So whoever did it like really wanted to cover their 306 00:15:58.639 --> 00:16:01.679 bases and make sure that once she ingested it, she 307 00:16:01.759 --> 00:16:05.080 would die. And it's a very cruel way to kill someone. 308 00:16:05.159 --> 00:16:07.720 Because strick nine does not work quickly, like once you 309 00:16:07.919 --> 00:16:11.720 ingest it, you have breathing problems, you have paralysis, you 310 00:16:11.840 --> 00:16:15.000 start coughing. And I know that Steven Sally kind of 311 00:16:15.039 --> 00:16:17.759 witnessed it firsthand when Patsy phoned them in the middle 312 00:16:17.759 --> 00:16:20.080 of the night and said that she was having trouble breathing, 313 00:16:20.120 --> 00:16:22.919 and it sounded like she was really suffering at that time. 314 00:16:22.960 --> 00:16:25.720 And she did not actually die until maybe like thirty 315 00:16:25.799 --> 00:16:28.879 forty minutes after she ingested it. So they figured that 316 00:16:28.960 --> 00:16:31.720 whoever did it not only had a potential motive to 317 00:16:31.720 --> 00:16:34.039 want or debt, but wanted to see or suffer first, 318 00:16:34.159 --> 00:16:36.279 because you have to obviously go to a lot of 319 00:16:36.320 --> 00:16:39.120 trouble in order to obtain strick nine in the first place. 320 00:16:39.480 --> 00:16:41.919 But it seemed like someone wanted to ensure that Patsy 321 00:16:42.000 --> 00:16:44.080 had the most miserable death possible. 322 00:16:44.639 --> 00:16:48.240 And I'm wondering if it comes down to did they 323 00:16:48.279 --> 00:16:52.000 want her to suffer or is this the easiest method 324 00:16:52.200 --> 00:16:56.320 by which to kill Patsy that they could be physically 325 00:16:56.480 --> 00:16:59.919 at a great distance away, like poison serves that purpose. 326 00:17:00.120 --> 00:17:03.399 And I mean, I don't know how many different substances 327 00:17:03.440 --> 00:17:07.279 one would have access to that you could end somebody's 328 00:17:07.359 --> 00:17:10.279 life that would be more comfortable than that. I really 329 00:17:10.319 --> 00:17:12.440 have no idea, and I don't know if that would 330 00:17:12.440 --> 00:17:14.240 have been a factor or if it was just sort 331 00:17:14.279 --> 00:17:17.279 of like, I've got access to Strict nine. I don't 332 00:17:17.279 --> 00:17:20.240 have to physically be there like you would to strangle 333 00:17:20.400 --> 00:17:23.279 or use a gun or to stab. So to be 334 00:17:23.400 --> 00:17:26.839 able to give yourself that physical distance gives you some 335 00:17:26.960 --> 00:17:30.359 kind of plausible deniability unless somebody knows that you were 336 00:17:30.440 --> 00:17:33.519 there and somehow had access to that bottle of niquil. 337 00:17:34.119 --> 00:17:37.519 Yeah, and makes me wonder if the perpetrator was literally 338 00:17:37.559 --> 00:17:40.599 reading old Agatha Christie mysteries and thinking that, ooh, this 339 00:17:40.720 --> 00:17:42.960 is a good way to kill someone, because Patsy can 340 00:17:43.119 --> 00:17:45.519 ingest it when I'm far away from the scene, and 341 00:17:45.599 --> 00:17:47.480 I can potentially get away with it. But of course, 342 00:17:47.480 --> 00:17:49.960 by this point it was not so easy to obtain 343 00:17:50.000 --> 00:17:52.359 Strict nine, so it was still a big mystery about 344 00:17:52.359 --> 00:17:54.200 how they got it in the first place. Of course, 345 00:17:54.240 --> 00:17:57.000 they checked the official government records all the sales that 346 00:17:57.039 --> 00:17:59.440 had taken place during that time period, but it didn't 347 00:17:59.480 --> 00:18:02.279 lead anywhere, so it seemed obvious that whoever did this 348 00:18:02.480 --> 00:18:05.799 either stole it from someplace like a lab or somehow 349 00:18:05.880 --> 00:18:08.000 was able to obtain it on the black market. 350 00:18:09.039 --> 00:18:12.200 Just a quick question. So you said that she routinely 351 00:18:12.319 --> 00:18:15.119 took night quill at night to help her sleep. Was 352 00:18:15.160 --> 00:18:16.880 this Do you know if this was like a once 353 00:18:16.920 --> 00:18:20.200 a week thing or if this was a daily thing, almost. 354 00:18:19.920 --> 00:18:22.200 A daily thing like apparently she did it a lot. 355 00:18:22.319 --> 00:18:24.519 So I think whoever did this knew that we're not 356 00:18:24.559 --> 00:18:26.160 going to have to wait a couple of weeks or 357 00:18:26.160 --> 00:18:28.000 a month, because she, like I mentioned, she was on 358 00:18:28.039 --> 00:18:30.319 a camping trip, so they probably figured the first night 359 00:18:30.359 --> 00:18:32.839 she gets home, she's going to take this, and sure enough, 360 00:18:32.880 --> 00:18:33.640 that's what happened. 361 00:18:34.359 --> 00:18:37.839 So whommever did this likely had access to her home 362 00:18:38.400 --> 00:18:40.519 while she was away on this camping trip and spiked 363 00:18:40.599 --> 00:18:42.680 the bottle of Nike will then correct? 364 00:18:42.880 --> 00:18:44.880 I think so yeah, Because as we're going to talk about, 365 00:18:44.960 --> 00:18:47.440 Patsy kept a spare key to her house, which she 366 00:18:47.599 --> 00:18:50.640 thought had gone missing. So it's very possible that they 367 00:18:50.799 --> 00:18:53.079 entered the locked house while she was away, put the 368 00:18:53.319 --> 00:18:55.319 stryct night in the ni quill, then locked the door 369 00:18:55.359 --> 00:18:57.559 when they left, and no one was none the wiser. 370 00:18:58.640 --> 00:19:02.240 So investigators did look into the possibility of suicide. But 371 00:19:02.319 --> 00:19:05.079 of course Patsy was very wealthy and successful. She had 372 00:19:05.079 --> 00:19:07.440 a great relationship with her children, seemed to be living 373 00:19:07.440 --> 00:19:09.920 a good life, and of course, even if they're having 374 00:19:09.960 --> 00:19:11.960 like a great life and seem happy, you can never 375 00:19:12.039 --> 00:19:14.279 rule out the idea of suicide. But it just seemed 376 00:19:14.359 --> 00:19:17.400 ridiculous an idea in this particular case, because she had 377 00:19:17.440 --> 00:19:20.160 set her alarm clock for later that morning, so all 378 00:19:20.160 --> 00:19:22.640 the signs indicated that she was planning to get up 379 00:19:22.720 --> 00:19:25.960 after she went to bed, and of course she called 380 00:19:26.039 --> 00:19:28.319 Sally when she was having breathing problems, so it was 381 00:19:28.359 --> 00:19:31.119 a strong indicator that she was wanting to be helped. 382 00:19:31.119 --> 00:19:34.160 She wanted to be saved. And of course, poisoning yourself 383 00:19:34.160 --> 00:19:37.319 with strychnine is such an odd method of suicide, which 384 00:19:37.359 --> 00:19:40.720 means you're going to suffer a long, protracted death before 385 00:19:40.759 --> 00:19:42.799 you pass away. So if she wanted to end her 386 00:19:42.839 --> 00:19:45.039 own life, she could have just taken sleeping pills or 387 00:19:45.039 --> 00:19:48.279 something like that. So, needless to say, thankfully, the police 388 00:19:48.279 --> 00:19:50.759 did not push forward the suicide narrative and ruled it 389 00:19:50.799 --> 00:19:51.960 out relatively quickly. 390 00:19:52.799 --> 00:19:56.759 Yeah, suicide isn't really lining up for me, because it 391 00:19:56.799 --> 00:19:59.599 seems like a really odd message choose because it would 392 00:19:59.599 --> 00:20:03.000 be extreme me painful, and when most people are choosing 393 00:20:03.079 --> 00:20:07.000 the method by which to exit this world, especially women, 394 00:20:07.559 --> 00:20:10.680 it wouldn't be typical to choose something like strick nine. 395 00:20:10.799 --> 00:20:13.920 That just seems like who would want to invite more 396 00:20:14.000 --> 00:20:18.240 pain onto an already painful situation. It seems extremely odd 397 00:20:18.279 --> 00:20:21.079 and the alarm set like I could go either way 398 00:20:21.079 --> 00:20:24.599 on that, but I'm not seeing anything here to lead 399 00:20:24.640 --> 00:20:27.720 me to believe that that was the objective, especially calling 400 00:20:27.799 --> 00:20:30.960 Sally and Stephen. If that was your objective, it would 401 00:20:31.000 --> 00:20:33.400