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Speaker 1: And I remember it kind of caught my attention, and

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I had a friend actually at the time. He was

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getting into it, and he was trying to argue with me,

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and I, like most people, argued against bitcoin, and I

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was like, Oh, this is a scam. It's to get

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us into a cash lists control drid.

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Speaker 2: It is not. And so I thought I.

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Speaker 1: Knew what it was from a kind of an overly

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conspiratorial perspective. But I'm glad all that happened because it

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forced me to look deeper into it to see if

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that in fact was the case, and I just every

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one of my objections kind of fell the more that

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I looked into it.

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Speaker 3: I wrote The Bible and Bitcoin for you Bible believing

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Christian and in it, I lay out the Biblical basis

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for what money is, why our current fiat monetary system

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is on godly in how bitcoin is the best and

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most viable biblically compliance replacement for government fiat money. There's

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even a small group study guide in the back with

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additional resources to study with your church small group. Get

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it on Amazon or pay with the Bitcoin at the

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Bible and Bitcoin dot Com.

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Speaker 2: For a discount.

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Speaker 3: Welcome to another episode of the Bible and Bitcoin Podcast.

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I'm your host, Alan Armstrong aka Pastor Coin and on

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today's episode have mister Jay Dyer. Welcome to the show, Jay.

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Speaker 2: What's up man? Glad to be here. Thanks for reaching out,

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looking forward to conversing with you.

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Speaker 3: Yes, indeed, I found you debating Muslims and I thought, wow,

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I like this guy, and followed you on Twitter and

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enjoyed much of your work, and then I saw that

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you are a bitcoin proponent. I guess you could say, so,

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tell me a little bit about yourself. Tell us a

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little bit about yourself, your background, your your beliefs, and

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things like that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I come from the Bible Belt.

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Speaker 1: I was raised in Tennessee, grew up part of the

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time in California. My dad was in the Navy, so

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I was always in the church, so speak from a

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young age Baptist Church. Eventually, by the time I was

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senior in high school college started studying church history and

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that got me more moving in the direction of at

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that time Catholicism and Orthodoxy. I was trying to decide

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between the two. This was a long time ago. Eventually

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ended up in the Orthodox Church, so I defend that

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as Christianity. From my advantage point. Yeah, the last say

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five years, I think has really kind of picked up

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in terms of Muslim debates. That's not something I really

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thought I was going to be doing. It just kind

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of fell into my lap. Hooked up with the Shimoun

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maybe four or five years ago as well. We started

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doing a lot of podcasts and interviews and teamed up

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on some debates, and so that was a that's its

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own kind of sphere of stuff. We've done a lot

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of atheist debates. We've done a lot of debates with

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other religions and groups. So that's one thing I do.

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But I also do a lot of film analysis symbolism.

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So I've written a couple of books on Hollywood and

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and film symbolism and kind of the messaging that's.

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Speaker 2: Going on in movies.

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Speaker 1: I've hosted the fourth hour of the Alex Jones Show

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for the last four or five years. Every Friday, we

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did a TV show based on my book, and then

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I cover a lot of other books that you see

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behind me. I do a lot of lectures through these

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texts to kind of do people's homework for them. So

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I call it the Global Elite Book Series, which gives

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you an insight into how the elite they themselves think

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from their own writing. So we do all of that

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as well as some comedy and live events, and you

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can find all that at my website, Jaysnalysis dot com.

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Speaker 3: Tremendous. I didn't know all that, so I'll have to

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go pick up the book and check all that out

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and after this interview. So, speaking of Sam Schmun, it's

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funny because last year I offered to to tip him

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in bitcoin. I said, Sam, offer bitcoin as a as

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an option to give, and he literally laughed at me

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and insulted my mother and then and then then and

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then just kind of ignored me. That's okay, I don't mind.

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It's Sam. When he insulted me, I took it as

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a as a badge of honor. You know, not everyone

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gets insulted by Sam Schmun, So I absolutely don't mind.

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Speaker 1: So Sam if I haven't talked to Sam about anything

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outside of theology, so I don't know. I have no

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idea what he would think about that, but he probably

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thinks as you. You know, I'm sure both of us

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have had infinite conversations trying to explain this kind of

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stuff to people who have so many misconceptions, So he

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probably has a misconceptions.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, no doubt.

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Speaker 2: So.

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Speaker 3: So I started following you and then recently saw you

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posting about bitcoin and and and some really some really

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good tweets and stuff like that. You've been apparently I did.

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I did some homework. I went back in time, and

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you've been an outspoken supporter of bitcoin for a while now.

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So when did that aha moment come when you were like, Wow,

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this bitcoin thing is more than just you know, some

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numbers on the screen. You know what contributed to you

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publicly coming out and supporting bitcoin.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the story in brief was in about twenty fourteen fifteen,

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I was invited to a kind of a conspiracy alternatemmedia

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conference in.

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Speaker 2: Texas, and I met some guys that were at.

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Speaker 1: The conference who were really cool in Austin, and they

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ran a show called The Crypto Show.

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Speaker 2: At the time, I had heard a bitcoin because I'd

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heard Max Kaiser.

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Speaker 1: I used to go on Alex Jones all the time

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back in the day, and he would talk about bitcoin.

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But I just kind of put it in the back

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of my mind. I was like, I don't know what

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that is, doesn't mean anything to me. So I'm at

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this conference in about twenty fourteen and fifteen somewhere in there,

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and these guys were like.

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Speaker 2: Hey, get a wallet, I'll give you a couple bitcoin.

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And I'm like, I don't let her know what you mean.

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I don't know what a wallet is. So I just

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didn't take the time to do it.

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Speaker 1: And at around that that was around the time that

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bitcoin hit maybe one thousand, two thousand, somewhere in there

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in that range, and I remember it kind of caught

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my attention. And I had a friend actually at the time.

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He was getting into it, and he was trying to

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argue with me, and I, like most people argue against bitcoin,

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and I was like, Oh, this is a scam. It's

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to get us into a cash list control grid.

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Speaker 2: It's this and that. And so I thought I.

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Speaker 1: Knew what it was from a kind of an overly

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conspiratorial perspective. But I'm glad all that happened because it

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forced me to look deeper into it to see if that,

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in fact was the case.

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Speaker 2: And I just every one of my objections kind of fell.

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Speaker 1: The more that I looked into it. I don't think

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it's you know, it's not centralized, it doesn't have a CEO.

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It doesn't have a controller, it's not invented by and

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run by the CIA and the NSA, and it's not

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you know, going to be tracking and tracing everybody in

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the world. It's not the more of the Beast, on.

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Speaker 2: And on on.

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Speaker 1: So all those objections eventually fell, and I decided about

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twenty seventeen that I would start buying. I wasn't confident

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enough yet to talk about it publicly, because at that

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time it was still pretty That was around the time

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it hit three or four and twenty seventeen, somewhere early

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twenty seventeen, maybe May summer period, and so I wasn't

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confident enough, and I was kind of an idiot still

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about crypto, and I remember just buying all kinds of

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random coins because you know that's.

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Speaker 2: Everybody has these phases.

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Speaker 1: You think, oh, I'm gonna buy this one and this one,

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and they're all gonna this is the next bitcoin.

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Speaker 2: Right then you.

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Speaker 1: Realize, well, there's not really going to be a next bitcoin, probably, but.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So by about twenty.

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Speaker 1: Nineteen twenty, I got a little more confident.

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Speaker 2: I'd read a lot more and studied a lot more.

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Speaker 1: I met a girl who was a friend of mine

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who had written a book, co written a book on bitcoin.

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Speaker 2: Her book was really insightful.

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Speaker 1: She actually wrote it from a Christian perspective too, So

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when I met somebody who was, you know, believing and

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a Bible believing person who also wanted to promote bitcoin,

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that was another kind of like, Okay, you could actually

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defend this from a Christian perspective, from you know, the

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ethics of money, this is.

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Speaker 2: Actually ethical money.

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Speaker 1: So her book, Julia Toroyanski's book on Bitcoin, is really good.

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That was a big game change for me back in

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about twenty nineteen. And yeah, it was just kind of

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like I think, what happens with most of us is

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we just learn more and more and more. The more

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you interact with and start stacking bitcoin. Over time, you

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get more confident. You realize, just from an investing perspective,

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it's not bad. And then we couple that with the

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ethics and you realize, you know, this is non you know,

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scam money. This is actually the hardest type of money.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 1: Proverbs says to not have deceptive weights and measures for

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your interactions. And the more I thought about that verse

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and Proverbs, the more I thought this really applies to

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the principles behind fair, ethical, objective hard money in terms

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of bitcoin. So those are some of the things that

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you know, like big things that happened on the way.

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And then yeah, like I said about twenty twenty, I

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just got more confident about being vocal and public about it,

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tweeting about it, started using Twitter more, you know, right.

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That was around the time of the you know, COVID crisis.

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So yeah, I mean, I think it's just born itself

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out now that we have the institutional acceptance that it's

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not going away. It's not a scam, it's not backed

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by nothing, it's legit.

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Speaker 3: I'd love to get your take, if you're willing to

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give it on Well, maybe I should word it this way.

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If you had a Christian come to you and say, hey, man,

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the bitcoin it looks like the mark of the beast.

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It smells like the mark of the beast. It's got

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to be the market the beast. How do you answer

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that question, because that's one question or objection. Rather I

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get yeah all too often, and I've done articles, I've

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made videos about it. But how would you answer that

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question or that objection If a Christian says, dude, it's

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the mark of the beast. Can't you see I mean,

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you're Jay Dyer, you should see this.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I've heard the same objection, and I probably thought

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at one time, maybe in twenty fourteen fifteen, maybe it's

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something around the same lines. And I think I wrote

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a whole article which I had to eventually take down.

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Speaker 2: IM so embarrassed about it because I wrote this article.

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Speaker 1: It wasn't saying it was the mark of the Beast,

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but I was arguing in twenty fourteen fifteen that oh,

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this is the cash list grid that.

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Speaker 2: They want to put us in and all that.

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Speaker 1: And I think the more that I looked at, first

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of all, what money is, so I think you have

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to do a little more background information. You realize that,

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you know, money is a representation of our time and energy,

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and it's a way to store and transact through currency

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that time and energy and value. So it's ultimately a

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kind of a It tended to be a store of value.

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That's at least what bitcoin is. And everybody's familiar with gold.

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And when I was in various Christian circles back in

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my twenties, I was around a lot of Protestants who

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were very into ron Paul. They were very into the

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gold standard, and so when I started thinking about it

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from that perspective, I kind of sold it to a

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lot of people as digital gold. When you think about

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it that way, I think especially for a lot of

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boomers or for a lot of Gen X people who

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might not understand that there can be value for things

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that are electronic.

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Speaker 2: Right. Think about your even a boomer.

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Speaker 1: For example, you have an app on your phone where

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you do your banking, and you're not actually using physical

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cash when you do your banking, but you don't think

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of your online banking app.

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Speaker 2: As the mark of the beast.

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Speaker 1: You don't think of using zell to transfer cash as

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the mark of the beast. Right, So when I start

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to I usually try to use these kinds of basic

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examples about how you know, bitcoin's not really that different

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from gold. Gold wasn't the mark of the beast. The

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dollar wasn't the mark of the beast. It's a superior

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form to those things. And if you look at the

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mark of the beast, there's I think some key indicators

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that bitcoin just doesn't match up to that, like the.

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Speaker 2: Mark of the beast.

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Speaker 1: Whatever it is, however it comes about, actually has to

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be a way to shut down and turn off people

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economic abilities if they don't worship the Satanic system or

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the Satanic Antichrist or whatever.

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Speaker 2: Right, But there's.

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Speaker 1: Nothing in bitcoin, the protocol, the way it runs, it's

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decentralized node system that would at all.

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Speaker 2: Work for that.

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Speaker 1: There's a public private ledger system, but it's not even

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going to be possible if, for example, let's say the

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majority of the world converts to utilizing bitcoin as a

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reserve standard or as some kind of medium of exchange standard. Like,

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there's not feasibly any way to track everyone's economic you know,

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interactions and to quote turn off you know, anybody's and

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there's no you know, you're not marked with bitcoin on

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your forehead or your hand. It's like there's so many

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things about bitcoin that just don't at all match up

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and actually would be contrary to.

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Speaker 2: You know, the so called market the beast.

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Speaker 3: Do you view the mark of the beast as being

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a primarily physical or spiritual or a mix like are

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you are you? Are you anticipating an actual sort of

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physical thing where if you take it then you're marked

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or is this you know, like what's your what's your

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take on.

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Speaker 2: That that's a good question.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I mean I I just had an

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interview with my godfather and he published a he's just

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published a trilogy commentary on the Book of Revelation by

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a famous kind of Anglican guy named James Jordan, and

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that commentary makes the very point actually.

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Speaker 2: That you're just talking about. That.

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Speaker 1: He argues that the mark of the Beast is primarily

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something that's spiritual that will essentially for the you know,

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angels and demons mark people for you know, which kingdom

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they're a part of. So it may not necessarily be

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an implant or a microchip or a nano dot or

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whatever the possibilities might be. Maybe it's some kind of implant,

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microchip or something down the road. I don't know, but

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there is a there's a strong case to be made

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that it's contrasted to, for example, in the Book of Revelation,

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the servants of God who are marked also with the

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name of God.

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Speaker 2: That's presumably not physical.

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Speaker 1: You're not gonna get yahweh tattooed on your forehead, right,

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so you're spiritually marked, contrasted to the spiritual marking that

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may be the case for the people who accept the

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Beast or whatever. So, yeah, you can make a case

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that it's not even physical. I don't personally know, but

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I think you could make that case.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: The way I've understood it is that, you know, after

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it seems Revelation thirteen, everything the beast does is the

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counterfeit of what the lamb does or did, and so

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the mark of the beast is the counterfeit of the

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of the mark of the lamb, or the name of

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God on the forehead and so forth. So even in

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that paradigm, bitcoin can't be that thing, because it seems

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like the mark of the beast is anything which would

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give allegiance to a godless system for economic gain. That's

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what it seems like to me at least. So something

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like the COVID vaccine was a type of mark of

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the beast because a lot of people were like, hey,

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take this shot, or else you can't work, or else

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we're kicking you out of the economic system. Here, Essentially,

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the COVID vaccine mandates were take this or starve. That

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was sort of the the ultimatum. So bitcoin doesn't fit

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in anyway you look at it, and it can't.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, really, the only parallel I could even loosely see

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would be that it's quote cashless. But I mean there's

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nothing in the Book of Revelation or you know, other

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apocalyptic texts that necessarily demonstrates that this economic control system

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has to be non physical, like you said, it could

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be spiritual, it could be there's different possibilities.

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Speaker 2: But we are basically already.

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Speaker 1: Not in a quote cash system, right, So it's like, well,

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if the mark of the beast is essentially whatever's quote cashless,

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I mean, I just think it makes more sense to say, well,

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we're already in a cashless society, so it's like the.

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Speaker 2: Most part I mean.

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Speaker 1: And on top of that, you know, cash itself is unethical.

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Speaker 2: So if anything.

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Speaker 1: Was beast like, it would be the fiat theft based system,

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because fiat currency is stealing from future generations purchasing power.

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Speaker 2: It's a form of theft.

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Speaker 1: That's more of a best system than what bitcoin is

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and principle ethically.

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Speaker 3: Bitcoin Well is a non custodial bitcoin platform in Canada

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and the USA that means every single Satoshi you buy

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goes straight to your self custody. They offer free withdrawals,

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a simple one percent spread, and they have the Bitcoin

340
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Wishing Well where you can win up to a million

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satosis by earning points and throwing the coin in the well.

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In fact, you get five coin tosses to the Bitcoin

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wishing well when you sign up at bitcoin well dot

344
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com slash pastor coin. Yeah, that was gonna be My

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next question was Fiat appears to be a lot more

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beastly than bitcoin is. So how would you interact with

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somebody who is a sort of a normy in this

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and just say, hey, man, hey, this is what this

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is one of my bet my pet peeves when people

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say cash is king, right, I hear this, especially with

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maybe the older types who the boomers who went through

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COVID and were freedom fighters. They said, no, man, cash

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is king. How do you explain to these people that

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that physical paper cash is controlled by the same entity

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that and they could, you know, they could just sort

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of cancel that cash any minute. So how do you

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respond to to the Cash's king crowd.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a great question. Yeah, I'm just like you,

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I'm tired of that objection. Just think about the Canadian protesters.

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They had their bank account accounts off. Now for most people,

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they don't have, you know, stacks of dollars like you know, rappers,

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and you know, like they don't have big wads of

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cash sitting under their bed.

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Speaker 2: Maybe a few old generation.

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Speaker 1: People do, but for most people the cash means their

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bank account and their you know, check card or whatever.

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Speaker 2: But the Canadian protesters had all that shut off.

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Speaker 1: They got d banked and hence they're in a worse

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situation because they believed cash was king when although it

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is a little bit of a hassle at this stage

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in the world, it is possible to have bitcoin or

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perhaps stable pins or something like that if you couldn't

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transaction with bitcoin, but you can get apps like BitPay

374
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where you actually can buy groceries, gift cards, et cetera

375
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with crypto right now. So it is technically possible to

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live on crypto right now if you're debanked. And already

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quite a few people who did get debanked. As that

378
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Mark Andresen, who was talking to Joe Rogan the other day,

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he pointed out that a lot of people were already

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kind of you know, have been saved. You you can

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infer from having various forms of crypto. Obviously, I think

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I'm a bigcoin supremacist. I think it's the best. There

383
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might be some uses for stable coins or something like that.

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But so maybe you know, in the future, people might

385
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have to you know, if they're forced to sell bigcoin

386
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to survive, you might have to sell it into something

387
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else or buy gift cards or something like that. So

388
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that's possible now, and that's already for people who've been debanked,

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like they've already experienced the necessity of these alternate payment

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systems and these alternate forms.

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Speaker 2: Of currency transactions.

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Speaker 1: So that is is a defeater I think for cashus

393
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king again that andresen guy already told Rogan that there's

394
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a secret group that basically tells.

395
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Speaker 2: Companies who to debank. Wow. Yeah, so this was like

396
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that they're Rogan in the other day that was going around.

397
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If you saw it, it's he's some kind of Silicon Valley.

398
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Speaker 1: I wouldn't trust that dude, But I think what he's

399
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saying is true, because like Alex was debanked multiple times

400
00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:18,400
because some unknown bureaucratic entity basically just said debanked this person,

401
00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:21,119
this person, this person, this person, and down the road

402
00:20:21,160 --> 00:20:24,160
that could be all Christians, right, Christians need to be

403
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debanked because.

404
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Speaker 2: There are hate speech people or whatever.

405
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Speaker 1: So cash is king doesn't work for that reason, just

406
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in terms of the last four years.

407
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Speaker 2: And then cash is not king because cash is based

408
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on fiat.

409
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Speaker 1: It is fiat since the you know, Nixon shot doctrine

410
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of taking us off the goaltender.

411
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Speaker 2: So it's not based on anything.

412
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Speaker 1: It's that's the Keynesian model of you can print forever,

413
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and every fiat currency ever has gone to zero because

414
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it's too much of a temptation for centralized private banking

415
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entities that control the money printer to just keep printing

416
00:21:02,839 --> 00:21:06,599
into oblivion because they can print and sell the fiat

417
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currency to themselves, buy it up through the bonds, treasuries

418
00:21:09,720 --> 00:21:12,519
or whatever, and they can buy up real assets with

419
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the fake money. So once you figure out that it's

420
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a scam, then you realize, oh no, actually cash isn't king.

421
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Cash is like the ultimate scam. I mean the way

422
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cash is now fiat I'm.

423
00:21:24,799 --> 00:21:30,039
Speaker 3: Saying right, right, because bitcoin is technically peer to peer

424
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electronic cash according to the Well and the White paper.

425
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Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly to be to be precise, like the way

426
00:21:37,799 --> 00:21:44,119
that the way that the gold bugs believed about gold

427
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and the fill of reserve, like they ought to be

428
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the most bitcoin right affiliated people, because this is a

429
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better form of gold, and it's based on all the

430
00:21:56,480 --> 00:22:00,400
same principles of what gold at least wanted to and

431
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tried to be.

432
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Speaker 2: Right.

433
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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it wasn't necessarily gold's problem. It was a

434
00:22:05,599 --> 00:22:09,279
man problem, right, That temptation to centralize, that temptation to

435
00:22:09,279 --> 00:22:12,880
print more than you have, it's never it's not going away.

436
00:22:13,039 --> 00:22:18,160
And so gold's the vulnerability of gold has been exploited.

437
00:22:18,240 --> 00:22:21,000
It's already out there. You can't put that rabbit back

438
00:22:21,039 --> 00:22:23,240
in the hat. So it's gonna keep happening. That's why

439
00:22:23,279 --> 00:22:24,880
I tell people who are gold bugs, hey, this is

440
00:22:24,920 --> 00:22:26,920
get on the gold standard. Well we'll just end up

441
00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:29,759
on a fiat standard in you know, a couple decades. Again,

442
00:22:30,119 --> 00:22:33,240
it's not fixing the problem. Bitcoin actually fixes the problem.

443
00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:37,160
And speaking of the problem, Donald Trump, Now I'm Canadian,

444
00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:39,400
so I went through the whole truckers thing. I wasn't

445
00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:42,000
I'm not a trucker. I wasn't in Autawa for that,

446
00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:44,599
but I know people who were affected. As a matter

447
00:22:44,640 --> 00:22:47,079
of fact, the woman that I buy my eggs from,

448
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there's a woman. She lives in the county and she

449
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has chickens. We buy eggs, great delicious farm eggs. She

450
00:22:53,319 --> 00:22:59,039
gave twenty five dollars to the truckers and was debanked

451
00:22:59,079 --> 00:23:03,119
for a week. Oh wow, for a twenty five dollar donation.

452
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Speaker 2: Wow.

453
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Speaker 3: And I felt bad for her because she couldn't access

454
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her money to buy groceries obviously, and so they had

455
00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:12,319
to start killing some of their chickens just to eat

456
00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:18,920
that week. And so it was absolutely bonkers up here.

457
00:23:18,319 --> 00:23:23,599
And bitcoin was for many people the saving grace they

458
00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:26,160
needed in that time. Yeah, and it opened up, It

459
00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:30,240
opened up bitcoin to a whole new, whole new crowd.

460
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:33,920
Now you're in America and Donald Trump's talking about this

461
00:23:34,039 --> 00:23:36,960
strategic bitcoin and reserve, he hinted at it. I saw

462
00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:39,079
you were in Nashville. I was there too, would have

463
00:23:39,119 --> 00:23:40,640
been nice to meet up, but I didn't really know

464
00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:43,559
you back then. But so you were there, you saw

465
00:23:43,599 --> 00:23:46,720
the speech. Do you think this is actually gonna happen?

466
00:23:46,799 --> 00:23:50,000
Is this a serious thing or is he just saying

467
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:52,559
what needs to be said? Uh?

468
00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:57,079
Speaker 1: Of course, you know, politicians oftentimes say what needs to

469
00:23:57,119 --> 00:23:59,640
be said, and then you know you're lucky if they

470
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follow through with half of their or one third of

471
00:24:03,480 --> 00:24:06,720
their promises. So you know, politics is all about compromise.

472
00:24:06,839 --> 00:24:09,000
So I don't know if this will ever actually happen.

473
00:24:09,039 --> 00:24:12,799
But I am optimistic because at least it looks like

474
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he's kind of doing and trying to follow through on

475
00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:20,359
some of the stuff, at least maybe half three fourths

476
00:24:20,359 --> 00:24:21,440
of what he said he's going to do.

477
00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:24,599
Speaker 2: So I think so.

478
00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:28,720
Speaker 1: I think the bill from Senator Loomis, and I remember

479
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:30,839
her being there. I walked right past her and didn't

480
00:24:30,839 --> 00:24:33,400
realize who she was. I probably would have said something,

481
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:36,200
but yeah, because I listened to her speech, to her

482
00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:38,720
talk about the bill, and I think.

483
00:24:38,559 --> 00:24:39,799
Speaker 2: That they're going to try.

484
00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:43,920
Speaker 1: For sure, they have, you know, hopefully the votes and

485
00:24:43,960 --> 00:24:48,880
the support, and I think as more corporations pile in,

486
00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:51,839
and now that they've figured out what it is, you

487
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:54,799
get more and more companies doing what Microsoft mean micro

488
00:24:54,839 --> 00:24:57,720
Strategy has been doing. It's going to be harder to

489
00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:02,119
ignore it and act like this isn't a legitimate thing

490
00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:05,559
and that this isn't real money. So I would that

491
00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:08,119
on hopefully I think they I think there will move

492
00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:08,759
in that direction.

493
00:25:08,839 --> 00:25:08,960
Speaker 2: Now.

494
00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:10,359
Speaker 1: I mean there's a lot of people in the country

495
00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:14,119
who you know, are still legacy, you know, committed to

496
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:16,000
what I think is an evil system, that are going

497
00:25:16,079 --> 00:25:19,680
to try everything they can to you know, undermine this,

498
00:25:20,359 --> 00:25:22,759
but no, I think they're going to actually do it.

499
00:25:23,039 --> 00:25:24,519
Speaker 2: People are going to start figuring out.

500
00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:29,400
Speaker 1: That it's actually working against your interest to oppose this right.

501
00:25:29,400 --> 00:25:30,599
Speaker 2: And so if the US.

502
00:25:30,559 --> 00:25:35,039
Speaker 1: Doesn't start doing this, more countries will be like Ol Salvador, Bhutan.

503
00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:37,799
They're going to do it, and they're going to front

504
00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:41,759
run and they're going to have uh, you know, more

505
00:25:41,839 --> 00:25:44,960
bitcoin in the window of open bitcoin for one hundred

506
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:48,559
thousand versus trying to get into bitcoin when it's five

507
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:51,400
hundred thousand, when it's a million in five ten years.

508
00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:52,920
Speaker 2: Yeah.

509
00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:56,400
Speaker 3: The Canadian Prime minister literally called the bottom last cycle

510
00:25:57,759 --> 00:26:01,640
when the Conservative candidate was going on bitcoin podcast and

511
00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:04,240
he was being very bitcoin friendly, and then you know,

512
00:26:04,279 --> 00:26:07,160
we hit the bottom and that's when Justin Trudeau said

513
00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:11,160
it was irresponsible for him to recommend bitcoin. That was

514
00:26:11,200 --> 00:26:12,759
the literal sixteen k bottom.

515
00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:13,440
Speaker 2: Oh wow.

516
00:26:13,599 --> 00:26:16,720
Speaker 3: And then so this is the trading strategy, guys, just

517
00:26:16,759 --> 00:26:19,160
do what do the opposite of what Justin Trudeau says,

518
00:26:20,119 --> 00:26:22,640
you'll and you'll do very very well with bitcoin. He

519
00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:27,880
called the bottom. Yeah, exactly in verse Kramer and verse Trudeau,

520
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:30,920
and you'll do very well. It's it's really that that easy.

521
00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:32,839
So it's going to be interesting to see how this

522
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:35,119
plays out if the United States does, even if it's

523
00:26:35,119 --> 00:26:37,960
not a million bitcoin, even if it's two hundred thousand whatever,

524
00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:41,400
it is to see how the other countries of the world, respond,

525
00:26:41,519 --> 00:26:44,400
especially Canada, because I mean, the US is right there

526
00:26:44,519 --> 00:26:47,680
without you or nothing, and so we're gonna have to

527
00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:48,880
pick up the slack as well.

528
00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:50,160
Speaker 2: Yeah.

529
00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:56,559
Speaker 1: I saw the France was discussing there's fully socialist policies

530
00:26:56,599 --> 00:27:01,240
of taxing all bitcoin unrealized gains is what they didn't

531
00:27:01,319 --> 00:27:03,720
pass per se, but they're discussing wanting to do that,

532
00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:05,880
so yeah, I mean, I think what happens is that

533
00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:09,519
these socialist countries that are fully on board with Fabian

534
00:27:09,599 --> 00:27:13,279
socialism and even more than Fabian's just full on marxsist socialism,

535
00:27:13,319 --> 00:27:17,200
like they're gonna suffer and people.

536
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:19,119
Speaker 2: Will leave, and bitcoin will leave.

537
00:27:19,319 --> 00:27:22,720
Speaker 1: Bitcoin will fly to the places where there is liberty,

538
00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:24,799
and those are the places they are going to prosper.

539
00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:30,039
So again, it's really against your own interests to act

540
00:27:30,079 --> 00:27:30,640
this way.

541
00:27:30,799 --> 00:27:34,640
Speaker 2: But people who are committed to these evil systems like socialism,

542
00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:37,559
like they just double down.

543
00:27:37,599 --> 00:27:41,359
Speaker 1: They always commit to their own self destruction no matter what.

544
00:27:42,559 --> 00:27:46,799
Speaker 3: Yeah, that capital will flee quickly. If anything like that

545
00:27:46,839 --> 00:27:50,440
happens in Canada, I'm gone and there's not a chance,

546
00:27:52,039 --> 00:27:57,200
you tweeted on November twenty sixth, A really interesting thing recently,

547
00:27:57,200 --> 00:27:59,920
you said, I've been listening to various boomer financial ex

548
00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:03,440
podcasts and interviews going back a few years to see

549
00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:06,680
why they thought bitcoin was soon going to zero. Most

550
00:28:06,839 --> 00:28:11,240
just repeated MSM fud to sound smart. Many are still

551
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:13,680
doing this. And here's the thing that caught my attention

552
00:28:13,759 --> 00:28:17,839
this sentence. Here, there's a human psychological reaction here that

553
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:21,319
is purely religious. Did you elaborate a bit more on

554
00:28:21,359 --> 00:28:25,039
what you meant by that term that purely religious?

555
00:28:25,559 --> 00:28:30,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that human beings are fundamentally religious beings, meaning.

556
00:28:30,559 --> 00:28:33,519
Speaker 2: That the way they operate about their.

557
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:36,519
Speaker 1: Attachments and what they believe in and what they like

558
00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:41,000
and love becomes religious for them. Even if you're an

559
00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:44,640
atheist and you don't believe in any God or you know,

560
00:28:44,759 --> 00:28:47,599
transcendent realm or anything like that, you're still going to

561
00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:52,519
have some kind of religious faith commitment to atheism to

562
00:28:53,519 --> 00:28:57,359
you know, your magical big bang worldview that something comes

563
00:28:57,400 --> 00:29:02,519
out of nothing that you know, the mud causes minds

564
00:29:02,559 --> 00:29:06,359
to exist, Like, there's so many magical things going on

565
00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:08,079
in the atheist world view that when you really drill

566
00:29:08,119 --> 00:29:11,200
into it as an example, it's hard to see how

567
00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:15,440
they are not magical thinking beings, even way more so

568
00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:16,240
than Christians.

569
00:29:16,319 --> 00:29:16,759
Speaker 2: Right, So.

570
00:29:18,359 --> 00:29:22,599
Speaker 1: I was noticing the type of attachment that people have

571
00:29:22,799 --> 00:29:28,559
to their positions, even in situations where there's all the

572
00:29:28,599 --> 00:29:31,480
evidence to the contrary. And I think we all know

573
00:29:31,519 --> 00:29:34,920
about this as like you know, cognitive dissonance, you know,

574
00:29:35,119 --> 00:29:39,640
confirmation bias, all these terms that express the same way

575
00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:43,519
that people have religious commitments to things, even if they're irreligious,

576
00:29:43,680 --> 00:29:48,160
or even if their positions are demonstrably false, they'll still

577
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:50,599
cling to it. And there's a lot of reasons why

578
00:29:50,599 --> 00:29:53,160
people do that. One reason is just pride. People are,

579
00:29:53,519 --> 00:29:56,640
you know, humans are falling, and so therefore their sin

580
00:29:56,720 --> 00:29:57,440
is rooted in pride.

581
00:29:57,440 --> 00:29:58,519
Speaker 2: They don't want to be wrong, They.

582
00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:01,880
Speaker 1: Want to perceive and be he perceived as see themselves

583
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:06,799
as always correct, geniuses, et cetera. So one thing that

584
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:10,599
happens with probably you and me and everybody who's gone

585
00:30:10,599 --> 00:30:13,359
through this journey for this stuff is you know, we

586
00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:17,720
get humbled by it. You know, I could have had

587
00:30:17,759 --> 00:30:20,640
two more bitcoin. Had I listen to the dudes in

588
00:30:20,680 --> 00:30:23,599
twenty fourteen and not just assume that, oh, well I

589
00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:26,000
know better than this and that you know, I know

590
00:30:26,039 --> 00:30:27,960
what this is and blah blah blah, I could have

591
00:30:28,039 --> 00:30:31,160
been doing much better. So I'm happy and thankful that

592
00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:34,480
I did, you know, get involved in twenty seventeen. But

593
00:30:35,000 --> 00:30:37,119
if I had been a little more perceptive and pay

594
00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:39,279
more attention and not been arrogant, I probably would have

595
00:30:39,359 --> 00:30:42,079
been doing even better. So we end up really being

596
00:30:42,079 --> 00:30:45,359
our own enemies. And you know, I'm I like to

597
00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:47,160
make jokes. I don't hate boomers. I just make a

598
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:49,079
lot of Boomer jokes. It's just kind of a shick

599
00:30:49,079 --> 00:30:50,480
I've been doing for like ten years.

600
00:30:51,559 --> 00:30:54,119
Speaker 2: And so bitcoin is just one of those classic.

601
00:30:53,759 --> 00:30:55,880
Speaker 1: Things that I love to kind of prod boomers about

602
00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:59,720
because they're so hardheaded about it. And I thought that

603
00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:03,440
it was just so it was like perfect when I

604
00:31:03,519 --> 00:31:05,480
was looking at YouTube the other day and the algorithm

605
00:31:05,519 --> 00:31:08,079
fed me this video of I think it was like

606
00:31:08,119 --> 00:31:10,720
an old video Peter Shift and then an old video

607
00:31:10,839 --> 00:31:13,480
of Dave Ramsey and like all of the you know,

608
00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:16,319
the boomer commentators, and they were just talking about why

609
00:31:16,319 --> 00:31:18,599
they don't like bitcoin, why it's going to zero? I

610
00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:20,839
went and found that Peter z iihon video where he's

611
00:31:20,839 --> 00:31:22,920
on you Joe Rogan, the famous video where.

612
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:25,880
Speaker 2: Bitcoin's about to go to zero last year or something,

613
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:28,440
and of course it's been obviously, but uh.

614
00:31:28,559 --> 00:31:30,759
Speaker 1: And I was watching these interviews and listening to all

615
00:31:30,759 --> 00:31:34,480
their reasonings, and I noticed, like you said, like they

616
00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:37,519
didn't actually put in time and effort to study and

617
00:31:37,519 --> 00:31:41,279
look at it and understand it. They were literally, as

618
00:31:41,519 --> 00:31:45,640
like financial expert men, just repeating what other mainstream media

619
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:48,200
sources had said against bitcoin, which to me tells me

620
00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:49,759
that's just laziness.

621
00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:52,559
Speaker 2: That's laziness and arrogance. And I'm just going to stick

622
00:31:52,559 --> 00:31:54,160
to my position because.

623
00:31:54,119 --> 00:31:57,680
Speaker 1: Well I'm a successful gold investor and I know my position,

624
00:31:57,839 --> 00:32:00,079
so I can't be wrong, right, which is.

625
00:32:00,079 --> 00:32:01,799
Speaker 2: Again it's just hurting yourself.

626
00:32:01,839 --> 00:32:05,559
Speaker 1: It's the same mindset, ironically as a socialist who in

627
00:32:05,599 --> 00:32:08,119
France just want to steal everybody's money, and even though

628
00:32:08,119 --> 00:32:10,799
they know that's going to like destroy the country, they

629
00:32:10,839 --> 00:32:12,079
just double down and keep doing it.

630
00:32:12,599 --> 00:32:13,880
Speaker 2: So it's a religious commitment.

631
00:32:15,759 --> 00:32:18,680
Speaker 3: When I started getting involved in bitcoin more heavily and

632
00:32:18,839 --> 00:32:21,759
speaking about it, it's not like I was preaching about

633
00:32:21,759 --> 00:32:23,920
it at church, but you know, after church, you talk

634
00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:26,920
to people, you have conversations whatever, And I would bring

635
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:29,519
up bitcoin. And there was one guy I remember in

636
00:32:29,559 --> 00:32:34,279
particular who was so offended. It was like I offended

637
00:32:34,359 --> 00:32:38,319
his mother mm hm. When I said, hey, maybe fiat

638
00:32:38,319 --> 00:32:40,960
money is the problem, you know, just throwing it out there.

639
00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:43,400
I wasn't being a toxic MAXI just hey, have you

640
00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:46,519
considered maybe fiat money might be might be the actual problem.

641
00:32:46,799 --> 00:32:49,079
And he got really offended when I said, hey, you

642
00:32:49,119 --> 00:32:52,559
need to realize that every dollar is debt, like like

643
00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:56,160
fiat money is a debt system, and the Bible is

644
00:32:56,200 --> 00:32:59,079
not friendly to debt, Like debt is not good. So

645
00:32:59,079 --> 00:33:01,440
if you build a whole system them on debt, yeah,

646
00:33:01,440 --> 00:33:03,599
that can't be good and that can't be ethical, that

647
00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:07,960
can't be consistent with God's words. So and he got

648
00:33:08,079 --> 00:33:10,839
so offended, like I offended his mother. It was the

649
00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:12,880
most bizarre thing. And when I read your tweet, I

650
00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:19,440
was like, oh, that's why, because it's religious, this field

651
00:33:19,839 --> 00:33:20,680
the same conversation.

652
00:33:20,759 --> 00:33:22,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

653
00:33:22,799 --> 00:33:26,119
Speaker 1: I think a lot of people also they understand like

654
00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:30,400
in America, for example, the dollar, right, I mean, the

655
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:33,079
dollar kind of is almost this sort of religious thing.

656
00:33:33,119 --> 00:33:37,079
It's like a mystical sort of thing that everything that

657
00:33:37,160 --> 00:33:42,680
America represents, whether it's you know, space travel and you know,

658
00:33:43,119 --> 00:33:47,359
winning the world wars and liberty and the constitution, Like,

659
00:33:47,400 --> 00:33:49,920
it's also kind of symbolized by the dollar. And so

660
00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:52,640
if you go against the dollar in the mindset of

661
00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:56,480
so many people, you're going against you know, America, and

662
00:33:57,279 --> 00:34:01,440
it's it's weird because the the point is that, no,

663
00:34:01,559 --> 00:34:06,039
it's the elites that have gone against America by destroying

664
00:34:06,079 --> 00:34:09,360
the dollar, you see, So the dollar needs to be rescued,

665
00:34:09,519 --> 00:34:12,559
is actually the point. The only way to rescue the

666
00:34:12,599 --> 00:34:14,599
dollar would be again, like I don't even know if

667
00:34:14,599 --> 00:34:17,119
it could be done, given how big the debt is,

668
00:34:17,159 --> 00:34:22,280
but like to get basically into the federal reserve system

669
00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:25,880
base it on bitcoin is about the only way to

670
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:28,639
save the dollar if you were to try to save

671
00:34:28,679 --> 00:34:30,920
the dollar. But I don't even know if the dollar

672
00:34:31,119 --> 00:34:33,079
can or could be saved given the.

673
00:34:33,039 --> 00:34:36,440
Speaker 2: Fact that there's always going to be the temptation with.

674
00:34:36,559 --> 00:34:40,639
Speaker 1: The dollar to like you said, run up the money

675
00:34:40,679 --> 00:34:43,800
printer again, or to go off of a hard standard.

676
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:46,119
I mean, there's nothing that because it's not actually a

677
00:34:46,119 --> 00:34:49,400
bitcoin there's nothing that prevents the dollar from falling back

678
00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:52,440
into the same problems of the dollar, which can't happen

679
00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:55,559
with bitcoin. There's no fiat bitcoins unless you're talking about

680
00:34:55,599 --> 00:34:59,360
some kind of old coins, right, there's no fiat bitcoin. So,

681
00:35:00,079 --> 00:35:02,760
but the dollar can even if it got pegged somehow

682
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:06,840
or backed up by bitcoin, which I think would be helpful.

683
00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:10,119
It's really the only lifeline for the dollar. But I

684
00:35:10,119 --> 00:35:12,400
also I'm not sure that the dollar needs to be saved,

685
00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:15,880
because it's can just like you said, like go back

686
00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:18,760
to being another fiat scam problem.

687
00:35:19,119 --> 00:35:19,599
Speaker 2: Yeah.

688
00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:21,519
Speaker 3: The only way I could ever see this working is

689
00:35:21,559 --> 00:35:27,239
if somehow you programmatically connected each dollar to the bitcoin

690
00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:29,440
and reserve in a decentralized way.

691
00:35:29,559 --> 00:35:30,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, something like that.

692
00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:33,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, but then you're asking the government to relinquish all

693
00:35:34,039 --> 00:35:37,840
power over over the money, which is their only business

694
00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:41,960
right that the government is in one business, the money business,

695
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:46,480
the centralizing controlling of the money. If if you separate

696
00:35:46,599 --> 00:35:50,440
money in state, there essentially is no state. Yeah, because

697
00:35:50,480 --> 00:35:53,440
what else are they going to do at that point?

698
00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:56,559
It's just a free market, like hey, you need to

699
00:35:56,599 --> 00:35:58,639
pay for this service or else you don't get it.

700
00:35:58,639 --> 00:36:01,599
It's not really government it's not really taxation anymore. You're

701
00:36:01,599 --> 00:36:04,719
just paying for service voluntarily, which is ideal. You know,

702
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:07,599
this is what we want to see, and I think

703
00:36:07,639 --> 00:36:08,519
bitcoin can do that.

704
00:36:08,679 --> 00:36:10,679
Speaker 1: I also heard a good argument too about this in

705
00:36:10,679 --> 00:36:14,159
regards to war. I think it was that Samson mal

706
00:36:14,159 --> 00:36:17,360
Guy was making an argument that war. I mean, obviously

707
00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:19,639
you can have war for reasons other than money. You

708
00:36:19,679 --> 00:36:23,920
could have ethnic, tribal, you know, resource war. Sure, but

709
00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:26,599
a lot of wars are actually, at least in the

710
00:36:26,599 --> 00:36:30,920
modern world, propped up by and funded by fiat money.

711
00:36:31,199 --> 00:36:34,400
So if fiat money was gone, it's not that you

712
00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:37,239
couldn't have war, but a lot of the reasons why.

713
00:36:37,079 --> 00:36:38,719
Speaker 2: We have modern war would be gone.

714
00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:42,239
Speaker 1: So, yeah, there might still be resource wars, but if

715
00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:44,800
we were on a bitcoin standard, it would be a lot.

716
00:36:44,599 --> 00:36:48,599
Speaker 2: Less easy to have war based around Viat dollars.

717
00:36:49,199 --> 00:36:52,079
Speaker 3: Yeah, the wars would certainly become a lot shorter in

718
00:36:52,159 --> 00:36:55,639
duration as nations run out of bitcoin. And then you

719
00:36:55,719 --> 00:36:59,719
got to think, too, is it worth it? This happens

720
00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:01,519
in your personal life, I'm sure it happened on a

721
00:37:01,599 --> 00:37:04,519
national scale too. Once you start saving in bitcoin, you realize,

722
00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:07,199
do I really need that thing? Is it really worth

723
00:37:07,239 --> 00:37:09,559
it to spend my bitcoin on you know, X, y Z,

724
00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:11,400
you actually become more frugal.

725
00:37:12,360 --> 00:37:14,480
Speaker 2: It's save exactly.

726
00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:17,559
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a phenomenon that is strange to those on

727
00:37:17,639 --> 00:37:20,480
the outside. But the more the more your money increases

728
00:37:20,519 --> 00:37:25,039
in value, the less you spend on stupid things, you know,

729
00:37:25,039 --> 00:37:27,639
you become a lot less more financially savvy, a lot

730
00:37:27,679 --> 00:37:29,119
more wise and prudent.

731
00:37:29,159 --> 00:37:31,239
Speaker 1: And how you use Why would I want to I

732
00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:34,519
don't want to spend bitcoin right now. If I spend

733
00:37:34,519 --> 00:37:37,239
one thousand dollars in bitcoin right now, and I think

734
00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:40,880
about the fact that you know, in five to seven.

735
00:37:40,679 --> 00:37:42,039
Speaker 2: Years that can be a ten x.

736
00:37:42,679 --> 00:37:46,559
Speaker 1: I'm spending ten thousand dollars of future money on something

737
00:37:46,559 --> 00:37:48,719
that's one thousand dollars now right.

738
00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:52,480
Speaker 3: It doesn't make much sense. The value has to match up.

739
00:37:52,519 --> 00:37:58,079
And I think that those incentives. Bitcoin is re naturalizing

740
00:37:58,559 --> 00:38:01,840
the true incentive of value in people's minds. And it

741
00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:04,239
starts in the mind and it works out into the economy.

742
00:38:04,360 --> 00:38:06,960
So I think we're going to see an interesting next

743
00:38:07,039 --> 00:38:11,440
decade with with how how money operates. As bitcoin infiltrates

744
00:38:11,760 --> 00:38:15,840
trojan horses its way into Wall Street and even into government.

745
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:17,199
We've already seen it in.

746
00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:21,239
Speaker 1: El Salvador exactly, and I remember some people criticized.

747
00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:23,519
Speaker 2: I remember some criticisms of a few years back where

748
00:38:23,559 --> 00:38:25,960
it was like, well, but you know, this is uh,

749
00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:27,559
it's this.

750
00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:31,800
Speaker 1: Is like money that is international, and so therefore it's

751
00:38:31,800 --> 00:38:34,119
like a globalist type of money because it's not a

752
00:38:34,239 --> 00:38:37,239
nation state money. But the problem is that the nation

753
00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:41,159
state money itself is also still a problem. Yeah, it's

754
00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:45,559
the nation state money allows the state to control the

755
00:38:45,599 --> 00:38:51,400
issuance of money and currency, which allows them to have, like,

756
00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:55,719
like we've been saying that on this ridiculous level of

757
00:38:55,760 --> 00:39:00,000
power that is just too easy and natural for government

758
00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:05,559
and private controlled governments to abuse. And so in other words,

759
00:39:05,599 --> 00:39:08,920
even if we were to say, go back to a

760
00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:11,039
gold standard, and let's say we got rid of the

761
00:39:11,039 --> 00:39:14,159
federal reserve and we went back to a gold standard

762
00:39:14,199 --> 00:39:16,360
and the government issued the money the way a constitution

763
00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:19,000
talks about and not private federals or bank and all

764
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:23,639
this kind of stuff, like, there's still the temptation to

765
00:39:23,679 --> 00:39:27,480
meddle with finagle the system, go to wars for the

766
00:39:27,639 --> 00:39:32,559
for that go back and issue more notes than there

767
00:39:32,599 --> 00:39:33,719
is actual holdings.

768
00:39:33,760 --> 00:39:35,360
Speaker 2: Because first of all.

769
00:39:35,239 --> 00:39:39,000
Speaker 1: I mean, who actually audits to see that the government

770
00:39:39,039 --> 00:39:41,599
has the goal to back up the dollars? Are we

771
00:39:41,639 --> 00:39:44,880
going to trust aligning government to tell us, oh promise,

772
00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:46,800
we promised, We've got all of you know, it's a

773
00:39:46,840 --> 00:39:48,880
one to one peg one dollar to you know how

774
00:39:49,039 --> 00:39:52,639
much goal. We can't trust them, right, So we're just

775
00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:56,159
back to the It's like we would be going back

776
00:39:56,199 --> 00:39:57,360
to an earlier.

777
00:39:57,079 --> 00:39:58,440
Speaker 2: Version of the problem system.

778
00:39:58,920 --> 00:40:02,199
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, let's go back the windows two thousand,

779
00:40:02,280 --> 00:40:02,760
not XP.

780
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:05,519
Speaker 2: You know, it's like the same bugs are going to

781
00:40:05,599 --> 00:40:06,239
be there, you know what I mean?

782
00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:10,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, gold, here's the thing with when people talk about

783
00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:15,519
globalist money, having a global money is not the problem. Right,

784
00:40:15,639 --> 00:40:17,599
Gold was the global money for a long time.

785
00:40:17,840 --> 00:40:18,199
Speaker 2: Exactly.

786
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:21,480
Speaker 3: It wasn't that gold was defective. Gold is just a

787
00:40:21,719 --> 00:40:25,320
it's just the metal. It is what it is. It's

788
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:29,000
is the money fair, ethical and true? And if it is,

789
00:40:29,039 --> 00:40:31,840
why shouldn't it be global? Of course, every human being

790
00:40:32,480 --> 00:40:39,079
should have access to fair, honest money. So globalism in well,

791
00:40:39,119 --> 00:40:41,119
maybe globalism is the wrong term, but having a money

792
00:40:41,159 --> 00:40:43,599
that all humans can use is not a bad thing

793
00:40:44,519 --> 00:40:51,920
unless it's unfair, unjust measure that that's the real right.

794
00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:57,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, people think that the fact that the money is

795
00:40:57,199 --> 00:41:01,239
international it self is what makes it sus bad when

796
00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:04,679
it's not that, it's the misuse of the thing. And

797
00:41:04,719 --> 00:41:09,960
in fact, it precisely ought to be an objective, mathematics based,

798
00:41:10,360 --> 00:41:14,679
protocol based money that can't be inflated and tampered with.

799
00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:17,719
That's why it has to be not a nation state

800
00:41:18,079 --> 00:41:19,440
controlled system.

801
00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:20,079
Speaker 2: Right.

802
00:41:20,920 --> 00:41:23,840
Speaker 3: There's this meme that goes around the bitcoin circles every

803
00:41:23,880 --> 00:41:27,000
now and then, Jesus with the court of whips in

804
00:41:27,039 --> 00:41:30,000
the temple driving out the money changers. And the parallel

805
00:41:30,119 --> 00:41:33,519
is that if Jesus was walking the earth physically in

806
00:41:33,559 --> 00:41:36,679
his body today, he would be doing the same thing

807
00:41:36,679 --> 00:41:39,559
in the Federal Reserve in Central Banks. Do you think

808
00:41:39,559 --> 00:41:42,800
that's an appropriate parallel. I've heard different takes.

809
00:41:44,159 --> 00:41:47,440
Speaker 1: It's a loose, loosely appropriate parallel, because I mean, in

810
00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:50,440
the context, you know, Jesus is angry over the fact

811
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:53,800
that what's supposed to be a house of prayer is

812
00:41:53,840 --> 00:41:57,400
being turned into a kind of you know, profiteering operation.

813
00:41:58,199 --> 00:42:00,880
So that's the immediate context, and obviously that you know,

814
00:42:00,920 --> 00:42:03,559
that's what drove him to, you know, clear them out.

815
00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:07,079
But I think the basic principle is there again kind

816
00:42:07,079 --> 00:42:11,000
of going back to proverbs that having unjust measures and

817
00:42:11,079 --> 00:42:13,880
weights and so is a form of theft, and obviously

818
00:42:14,039 --> 00:42:17,840
theft violates the Ten Commandments, so the principle is applicable.

819
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:24,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, would you this is This is the question that

820
00:42:24,599 --> 00:42:28,320
gets maybe some trouble for me and others who ask it,

821
00:42:28,320 --> 00:42:32,119
but I'd like to ask it to Christians because I

822
00:42:32,159 --> 00:42:35,159
think it's interesting to get their take. Do you think

823
00:42:35,239 --> 00:42:37,800
Jesus would be a bitcoiner or is a bitcoiner since

824
00:42:37,840 --> 00:42:38,760
obviously he's alive.

825
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:44,920
Speaker 1: I do think that God gives these kinds of gifts

826
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:47,960
providentially within history, you know. I think if you look

827
00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:54,880
at big advancements in medicine, advancements in technology from Western civilization,

828
00:42:55,079 --> 00:42:58,599
a lot of those come from people who believed in God,

829
00:42:58,719 --> 00:43:04,440
believed in a meaning for universe, believed in you know, health, healing,

830
00:43:04,599 --> 00:43:07,239
doing good things for people. So I think a lot

831
00:43:07,280 --> 00:43:11,239
of those motivations of people within history were because of

832
00:43:11,599 --> 00:43:14,400
belief in God, and I think they were providential gifts

833
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:15,280
from God.

834
00:43:15,519 --> 00:43:16,519
Speaker 2: And so, yeah, I think that.

835
00:43:16,800 --> 00:43:18,599
Speaker 1: And I think I did a podcast on this maybe

836
00:43:18,719 --> 00:43:21,599
three or four years ago, that it's like kind of

837
00:43:21,800 --> 00:43:24,639
God money in the sense, I don't know, God is money.

838
00:43:24,639 --> 00:43:27,159
But I mean that it's a gift, I would say,

839
00:43:27,199 --> 00:43:34,039
providentially for humans to have a solution to a problem

840
00:43:34,199 --> 00:43:36,960
that has plagued humans for a long time. It's not

841
00:43:37,679 --> 00:43:40,679
the salvation from all problems, obviously, it's not going to

842
00:43:40,719 --> 00:43:42,880
make all conflicts or wars go away. It's not going

843
00:43:42,920 --> 00:43:46,599
to solve every economic crisis, but it is a basic

844
00:43:47,079 --> 00:43:51,239
solution to man's economic issues, kind of like you know,

845
00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:54,280
if you think about the early days of the spread

846
00:43:54,280 --> 00:43:58,360
of Christianity, you kind of had to have providentially coin

847
00:43:58,440 --> 00:44:02,039
a Greek being spoken by the empire for.

848
00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:03,440
Speaker 2: The message to be able to spread.

849
00:44:03,599 --> 00:44:07,159
Speaker 1: And that was providentially the case because Alexander the Great

850
00:44:07,239 --> 00:44:11,000
and et cetera. So, and it's the same way like

851
00:44:11,119 --> 00:44:14,639
the Internet needed to exist before we could have something

852
00:44:14,760 --> 00:44:18,519
like this. This type of thing wouldn't be possible obviously

853
00:44:18,599 --> 00:44:21,239
without the level of technology that we have. So yeah,

854
00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:24,079
I think it's a it's a providential blessing.

855
00:44:24,119 --> 00:44:28,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I would agree as well. I see you're

856
00:44:28,360 --> 00:44:31,039
wearing a Sotoshi shirt, so maybe the last question I

857
00:44:31,079 --> 00:44:34,360
ask is do you have any theories as to who

858
00:44:34,440 --> 00:44:37,760
he might be. I don't think it's a she. People

859
00:44:37,800 --> 00:44:39,400
say he or she I don't think it's a sheet,

860
00:44:39,440 --> 00:44:40,840
but anyways.

861
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:41,280
Speaker 2: I don't.

862
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:43,760
Speaker 1: I mean, I've looked at a lot of these, you know,

863
00:44:43,840 --> 00:44:46,519
claims and the people and this and that over the years,

864
00:44:46,559 --> 00:44:48,079
and I'm not really worried about it.

865
00:44:48,639 --> 00:44:50,039
Speaker 2: I don't have any real theories.

866
00:44:50,159 --> 00:44:52,400
Speaker 1: I mean, I've always kind of thought maybe Max Kaiser,

867
00:44:52,440 --> 00:44:55,960
but nobody thinks this Max Kaiser. But Max was involved

868
00:44:56,039 --> 00:45:05,039
in the inventing a a kind of algorithmic tracking system

869
00:45:05,199 --> 00:45:12,639
for betting on It was called the Hollywood Stock Exchange.

870
00:45:12,320 --> 00:45:13,400
Speaker 2: And he sold it.

871
00:45:14,199 --> 00:45:15,719
Speaker 1: So there's a patent on it, and he always he

872
00:45:15,719 --> 00:45:18,280
would always talk about this patent to kind of talk

873
00:45:18,320 --> 00:45:23,039
about his pedigree, and I was always wondering, well, why

874
00:45:23,119 --> 00:45:24,639
was he always talking about that patent and Petrick Now,

875
00:45:24,639 --> 00:45:26,639
I mean, obviously that's not bitcoin, But what it shows

876
00:45:26,719 --> 00:45:31,039
is that he foresaw a future and when he was

877
00:45:31,159 --> 00:45:33,000
going on Alex back in the day in twenty eleven,

878
00:45:33,079 --> 00:45:35,519
he was always talking about the.

879
00:45:35,360 --> 00:45:37,840
Speaker 2: Future casino goolog where people would be.

880
00:45:39,480 --> 00:45:41,920
Speaker 1: Living out their life on the internet and like buying

881
00:45:41,960 --> 00:45:46,400
and trading fake currencies. I don't think he was talking

882
00:45:46,400 --> 00:45:49,159
about bitcoin. I think he was talking about the imposter versions.

883
00:45:49,719 --> 00:45:52,079
And so I've always thought maybe he might have had

884
00:45:52,079 --> 00:45:54,400
a roll. Maybe so too, she was multiple people in

885
00:45:54,440 --> 00:45:58,599
the community of the cyberpunks or whatever. But no, I

886
00:45:58,599 --> 00:46:00,880
don't have any hard theories. Obviously, I don't think it's

887
00:46:00,920 --> 00:46:04,920
like Craig Wright, but I don't know.

888
00:46:05,679 --> 00:46:11,039
Speaker 3: What do you think it personally? I think it's Adam Back.

889
00:46:11,239 --> 00:46:12,679
Speaker 2: Yeah. I thought I was gonna say he's probably the

890
00:46:12,719 --> 00:46:14,199
next best content.

891
00:46:14,719 --> 00:46:19,599
Speaker 3: But you know, it is what it is like to me,

892
00:46:19,639 --> 00:46:22,440
it doesn't matter either. The thing is is it took

893
00:46:22,440 --> 00:46:25,440
on a life of its own. Even if Satoshi came

894
00:46:25,440 --> 00:46:29,800
out and sold all his bitcoin today, and I mean

895
00:46:29,840 --> 00:46:31,639
he would be not be incentivized to do so. But

896
00:46:31,719 --> 00:46:34,000
even if he did, I think you see a market

897
00:46:34,079 --> 00:46:37,639
dump and then it recovers. So it really doesn't matter

898
00:46:37,679 --> 00:46:39,880
at this point. I just think it's a fun, fun

899
00:46:39,880 --> 00:46:43,719
little thing to think about. He left some interesting little clues,

900
00:46:43,760 --> 00:46:46,639
you know, October thirty first the white paper, and then

901
00:46:47,119 --> 00:46:51,360
in January whatever he issues the software and stuff. So

902
00:46:53,840 --> 00:46:56,360
the Genesis block. You know, there's all these theories about

903
00:46:56,440 --> 00:47:01,599
is he a Christian? Did he have biblical you know,

904
00:47:01,760 --> 00:47:05,239
did he leave little biblical things along the way. I

905
00:47:05,239 --> 00:47:09,800
don't know, maybe, but regardless, it is what it is,

906
00:47:09,840 --> 00:47:11,760
and I'm glad he's he's anonymous, and it kind of

907
00:47:11,760 --> 00:47:15,679
had to be that way because e cash failed or

908
00:47:15,719 --> 00:47:18,760
e goold I think. I think it's called egold because

909
00:47:18,760 --> 00:47:21,440
it was centralized. The only way a digital currency is

910
00:47:21,480 --> 00:47:24,400
going to survive in this day and age is if

911
00:47:24,639 --> 00:47:27,639
no one knows who made it and it just proliferates

912
00:47:27,639 --> 00:47:28,039
by itself.

913
00:47:28,039 --> 00:47:30,400
Speaker 1: I think it had to be. It had to be

914
00:47:30,440 --> 00:47:32,960
an anonymous beginning for it to work.

915
00:47:33,039 --> 00:47:35,119
Speaker 2: Absolutely. Yeah.

916
00:47:35,480 --> 00:47:36,960
Speaker 3: So do you have any last words?

917
00:47:38,239 --> 00:47:40,639
Speaker 1: You find people want to check out my stuff? I

918
00:47:40,679 --> 00:47:42,920
have a link for swan bitcoin. If they want to

919
00:47:42,920 --> 00:47:44,760
get started with bitcoin, you can use my link it

920
00:47:44,840 --> 00:47:47,719
so it's in all my videos. You can follow me

921
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:51,719
on YouTube, Twitter under my name, and if you want to.

922
00:47:51,679 --> 00:47:53,119
Speaker 2: Get my books, you can get him at the shop

923
00:47:53,119 --> 00:47:54,079
at my website.

924
00:47:55,039 --> 00:47:57,599
Speaker 3: Awesome, thanks so much for coming on. I appreciate your time.

925
00:47:58,199 --> 00:48:01,440
Until next time, everyone, thanks for watching and grace and peace.

926
00:48:01,840 --> 00:48:04,519
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927
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928
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929
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930
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931
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932
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933
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934
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937
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938
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