WEBVTT 1 00:00:02.200 --> 00:00:04.839 You see something's going to happen. 2 00:00:06.320 --> 00:00:10.599 What's going to happen? 3 00:00:12.359 --> 00:00:12.880 I think. 4 00:00:15.480 --> 00:00:28.679 What Welcome to the Occult Rejects. In this episode, we 5 00:00:28.760 --> 00:00:31.920 got a part two to the call Crusher. I guess 6 00:00:32.000 --> 00:00:36.079 growing up in womanism and today co hosting with me. 7 00:00:36.320 --> 00:00:40.119 We got Teresa, we got Thrash, and we got Mike. 8 00:00:41.079 --> 00:00:43.200 Thank you both for all three of us for jumping 9 00:00:43.200 --> 00:00:46.799 on tonight and making it happen with me. If you 10 00:00:46.840 --> 00:00:48.359 want to check out any of this stuff, I will 11 00:00:48.439 --> 00:00:50.719 leave their links in the bottom and I'll have them 12 00:00:50.719 --> 00:00:53.880 plug themselves at the end of the show. And Carl, 13 00:00:54.280 --> 00:00:56.799 my man, thank you very much for coming back on again. 14 00:00:57.079 --> 00:01:01.119 It's always great, great chats. You know, you're already blowing 15 00:01:01.119 --> 00:01:03.600 my mind before the show. It's this new stuff you 16 00:01:03.640 --> 00:01:06.079 got going on that it's like, damn, I want to 17 00:01:06.079 --> 00:01:07.760 talk about this now instead of the other topic. 18 00:01:07.799 --> 00:01:09.959 But I gotta finish. I got to finish, you know, 19 00:01:10.560 --> 00:01:12.840 finish this. But we will get we will get to it. 20 00:01:12.959 --> 00:01:16.120 So I'm telling you, you know, definitely wait to the 21 00:01:16.200 --> 00:01:16.680 end of the show. 22 00:01:16.799 --> 00:01:18.319 We'll be going into something a little. 23 00:01:18.120 --> 00:01:22.599 Bit different besides what the show is completely about. But Carl, please, 24 00:01:22.640 --> 00:01:26.239 in case there's new listeners by the time this drops. 25 00:01:27.239 --> 00:01:29.879 Let everybody know where they can find your work and 26 00:01:29.920 --> 00:01:30.879 what you're about a little bit. 27 00:01:32.120 --> 00:01:35.599 Yeah, just look online, especially on YouTube for Carl Crusher. 28 00:01:36.359 --> 00:01:38.239 That's the name that I go by, so it's easy 29 00:01:38.280 --> 00:01:41.680 to spell and remember. I post all of my content 30 00:01:41.799 --> 00:01:46.000 and work on there. If I'm going to different research 31 00:01:46.079 --> 00:01:52.040 locations to investigate strange phenomena or mysteries at different places 32 00:01:52.840 --> 00:01:55.959 or whatever, I document all of it. Working with the 33 00:01:56.079 --> 00:01:59.680 History Channel or Discovery Channel and different side projects like that. 34 00:02:00.400 --> 00:02:02.719 But yeah, I post all of that all over. You 35 00:02:02.719 --> 00:02:06.120 can find me as Carl Crusher everywhere we listen. 36 00:02:06.159 --> 00:02:07.159 Thank you very much. 37 00:02:07.239 --> 00:02:09.960 And you know, I will say, and I've pretty much 38 00:02:10.000 --> 00:02:11.919 mentioned it every time I have him on The Magic 39 00:02:11.960 --> 00:02:14.080 Mesa and a few other episodes that I've watched from 40 00:02:14.159 --> 00:02:16.879 him from around that time. I think he's some of 41 00:02:16.919 --> 00:02:21.199 the best in my opinion on paranormal footage on YouTube. 42 00:02:21.520 --> 00:02:23.759 You know, there's actually like legit shit that I think 43 00:02:23.840 --> 00:02:25.919 is simple but actually mind blowing at the same time 44 00:02:26.400 --> 00:02:29.319 to show you that there's something going on that I 45 00:02:29.360 --> 00:02:30.360 always aren't picking up. 46 00:02:30.800 --> 00:02:33.719 You know, Yeah, for sure, there's definitely something too, like 47 00:02:33.879 --> 00:02:39.520 ancient indigenous locations that I realized that people were who 48 00:02:39.560 --> 00:02:43.400 were highly qualified and highly funded and contracted with the 49 00:02:43.439 --> 00:02:47.840 government or working for the government, were very interested in 50 00:02:47.919 --> 00:02:52.439 the same thing, like going to these ancient sacred sites 51 00:02:52.680 --> 00:02:57.199 that they called access points on the longitudinal nodes of 52 00:02:57.240 --> 00:02:59.560 the array, that's how they talked about it. But they 53 00:03:00.080 --> 00:03:03.280 they were spots that they considered like ancient indigenous locations 54 00:03:03.280 --> 00:03:06.360 where you could go and sit there and meditate and 55 00:03:06.439 --> 00:03:10.400 it would amplify psychic abilities. And they were like super 56 00:03:10.439 --> 00:03:14.159 into that clear back into the nineteen seventies and eighties, 57 00:03:14.159 --> 00:03:16.280 and when I kind of figured that out, I got 58 00:03:16.319 --> 00:03:20.919 really fascinated with it. And Magic Mesa is one of 59 00:03:20.960 --> 00:03:25.199 those places. It's definitely I nicknamed it that Magic Mesa 60 00:03:25.280 --> 00:03:28.759 because it's full of that kind of phenomena, Like you 61 00:03:28.800 --> 00:03:31.680 can go and sit there at night, and when you're quiet, 62 00:03:31.719 --> 00:03:35.520 you'll swear that you hear voices of people that just 63 00:03:35.560 --> 00:03:38.360 are not there, like you'll hear a woman talking, or 64 00:03:39.000 --> 00:03:43.000 you'll hear someone ride right past you, like a cowboy 65 00:03:43.120 --> 00:03:47.240 on horseback and there's literally nobody there. And then just 66 00:03:47.319 --> 00:03:50.159 all kinds of strange stuff, even seeing like UFOs and 67 00:03:51.280 --> 00:03:54.680 strange plasma lights on the hillside that flow around all 68 00:03:54.759 --> 00:03:55.719 kinds of cool stuff. 69 00:03:57.159 --> 00:03:59.400 Yeah, you even had some cool stuff with that Mount 70 00:03:59.439 --> 00:04:01.280 Wilson ran to that I found interesting. 71 00:04:02.840 --> 00:04:08.080 Yeah, there's allegedly a UFO hiding underground, which is like 72 00:04:08.120 --> 00:04:11.919 a big thing. Like Ross Coltard just came out on 73 00:04:12.000 --> 00:04:14.439 News Nation and they've been doing all these specials, like 74 00:04:14.599 --> 00:04:19.720 multiple interviews with these Green Berets and Delta Force operators 75 00:04:20.439 --> 00:04:23.279 that are coming out as whistleblowers as part of the 76 00:04:23.360 --> 00:04:27.759 actual UFO crash recovery program for the government that have 77 00:04:27.879 --> 00:04:30.519 done it for over a decade, and they're coming out 78 00:04:30.560 --> 00:04:34.759 on the news and saying that these UFOs are coming 79 00:04:34.800 --> 00:04:37.839 out of the mountain. They're like phasing right out of 80 00:04:37.879 --> 00:04:40.879 the ground. They'll just come out of the ground and 81 00:04:40.920 --> 00:04:44.319 out of the mountain, and then they use what they 82 00:04:44.360 --> 00:04:49.240 call psionic assets or like a remote viewer that's part 83 00:04:49.319 --> 00:04:52.600 of the Green Beret team with the unit, and they 84 00:04:52.720 --> 00:04:57.160 use telepathy to take control of the UFO and either 85 00:04:57.279 --> 00:05:00.040 land it or to crash it. And then the the 86 00:05:00.480 --> 00:05:04.519 Green Beret Delta Force team goes in and they capture 87 00:05:04.560 --> 00:05:07.879 it in the entities and everything. And this has all 88 00:05:07.920 --> 00:05:09.839 just come out in like the last week and a half. 89 00:05:09.920 --> 00:05:13.959 It's kind of wild. So like, yeah, over there at 90 00:05:14.000 --> 00:05:16.399 the Mount Wilson and Nevada is one of those spots 91 00:05:17.040 --> 00:05:20.120 that big ol Aerospace back in the day with how 92 00:05:20.240 --> 00:05:23.439 put Off and those original remote viewers and a bunch 93 00:05:23.480 --> 00:05:26.720 of scientists were up there looking for one of these 94 00:05:26.759 --> 00:05:31.480 things that was like hiding underground, like some chamber that 95 00:05:31.639 --> 00:05:35.160 has a UFO in it or some kind of a 96 00:05:35.279 --> 00:05:38.000 object in it. So yeah, we worked with the History 97 00:05:38.079 --> 00:05:41.839 Channel and part of Skinwalker Ranch to try and bring 98 00:05:41.879 --> 00:05:44.279 some people out of the government and a bunch of 99 00:05:44.279 --> 00:05:48.160 funding and equipment with drones and ground penetrating radar, and 100 00:05:48.199 --> 00:05:50.920 we tried to find this thing and where it was 101 00:05:51.480 --> 00:05:54.600 and then try to communicate with it. And we did 102 00:05:54.639 --> 00:05:57.800 that for two seasons on the History Channel on a 103 00:05:57.839 --> 00:05:59.759 show called Beyond Skinwalker Ranch. 104 00:06:01.480 --> 00:06:03.600 It's awesome. Good for you, Good for you. Can you 105 00:06:03.600 --> 00:06:06.000 plug your upcoming thing or is that like something you 106 00:06:06.040 --> 00:06:06.759 can't talk about it. 107 00:06:08.000 --> 00:06:09.680 I don't think I sign an NBA so well, I 108 00:06:09.759 --> 00:06:11.399 think I can plug it. I don't know when it's 109 00:06:11.439 --> 00:06:14.879 going to come out, but there's a on Discovery Channel. 110 00:06:16.360 --> 00:06:19.920 My last trip when I went over to Norway as 111 00:06:19.959 --> 00:06:24.519 part of Project Hestalen, I went over there and my 112 00:06:24.680 --> 00:06:27.079 first day there, I did an experiment where I did 113 00:06:27.399 --> 00:06:30.800 meditation with a small group of people, and then on 114 00:06:30.839 --> 00:06:34.560 the night vision camera, I filmed a UFO that appeared 115 00:06:34.600 --> 00:06:37.600 in the sky and came down and like landed on 116 00:06:37.639 --> 00:06:39.279 the ground on the other side of the lake and 117 00:06:39.360 --> 00:06:42.319 moved around all weird, kind of like the Rendel schump 118 00:06:42.360 --> 00:06:45.639 for since it, I filmed like over twenty minutes of this, 119 00:06:45.839 --> 00:06:51.839 so excuse me. The Discovery Channel saw that footage and 120 00:06:51.879 --> 00:06:55.600 they actually wanted to use that footage. They did a 121 00:06:55.600 --> 00:06:58.199 whole interview with me, and then they went over to 122 00:06:58.279 --> 00:07:01.879 Norway and filmed like two whole episodes where they tried 123 00:07:01.920 --> 00:07:05.800 to replicate like the whole thing, like the meditation experiment 124 00:07:05.879 --> 00:07:09.319 and stuff. So that's a whole new thing that's going 125 00:07:09.399 --> 00:07:11.240 to be coming out. I don't know if it's on 126 00:07:11.439 --> 00:07:14.839 Expedition X is the name of the show or whatnot, 127 00:07:14.879 --> 00:07:17.399 but I'm I'm supposed to be interviewed on camera with 128 00:07:17.439 --> 00:07:19.800 the host and then they're gonna show some of my 129 00:07:19.879 --> 00:07:22.800 footage and then the team from Discovery Channel goes to 130 00:07:22.839 --> 00:07:25.839 Norway and and does the same thing. 131 00:07:27.879 --> 00:07:30.079 That's really very cool. 132 00:07:31.600 --> 00:07:36.079 Yeah, all right, nice Carl. 133 00:07:36.160 --> 00:07:39.800 Have you heard of a guy named George Van Tassel. 134 00:07:41.399 --> 00:07:44.319 Sounds super familiar if you jog my memory for a second. 135 00:07:44.480 --> 00:07:48.199 Okay, so have you heard of Giant Rock And. 136 00:07:49.680 --> 00:07:53.600 It's okay, it's in Landers, California, Yes, yes, and it's 137 00:07:53.680 --> 00:07:56.519 it's basically the start of a lot of the UFO 138 00:07:56.920 --> 00:08:01.040 movement stuff. And they basically he had like a meet 139 00:08:01.120 --> 00:08:06.199 out at Giant Rock since like nineteen. I'm going to 140 00:08:06.240 --> 00:08:09.360 be wrong on the date, but let's just say fifty one. Yeah, 141 00:08:09.399 --> 00:08:14.000 and I basically had a group meditation that they would 142 00:08:14.040 --> 00:08:19.199 have out at the rock. And I just randomly stumbled 143 00:08:19.279 --> 00:08:22.120 upon it because one day I seen an article on 144 00:08:22.199 --> 00:08:29.600 an alien named Ashtar and my name is Ashton, So 145 00:08:29.680 --> 00:08:30.199 am I home? 146 00:08:30.240 --> 00:08:30.519 Weird? 147 00:08:30.600 --> 00:08:32.879 I wonder where that is? So I look it. 148 00:08:32.919 --> 00:08:38.720 Up and I literally grew up twenty minutes from that place. 149 00:08:39.879 --> 00:08:43.440 I had no clue or anything, but that same place. 150 00:08:44.799 --> 00:08:49.039 He built this place called it's called the Integatron, and 151 00:08:49.080 --> 00:08:53.480 he was supposed to have got like telepathic messages on 152 00:08:53.519 --> 00:08:56.759 how to build it, and then he passed away before 153 00:08:56.840 --> 00:08:57.919 it was ever complete. 154 00:08:59.120 --> 00:09:01.919 Yeah. I was supposed to be like a big psychic resonator, 155 00:09:01.960 --> 00:09:04.360 like a dome all made of wood that you go 156 00:09:04.480 --> 00:09:07.320 in and lay down inside and you meditate, and then 157 00:09:07.320 --> 00:09:10.919 they would project your consciousness up into space. That was 158 00:09:10.960 --> 00:09:12.559 the same thing they were trying to do with the 159 00:09:12.600 --> 00:09:15.960 Big Rock. And it goes back to the idea of 160 00:09:16.519 --> 00:09:21.519 stone Hinge and all of the monoliths and megalists and 161 00:09:21.559 --> 00:09:25.039 even the pyramids, and this theory that they're part of 162 00:09:25.080 --> 00:09:28.320 a grid system that taps into the ether or of 163 00:09:28.360 --> 00:09:31.639 the electromagnetic field of the Earth. So just like we 164 00:09:31.639 --> 00:09:35.600 were saying, how like even in the Montalk project and everything, 165 00:09:35.720 --> 00:09:40.919 how they were looking at those ancestral nodes. There's like 166 00:09:41.080 --> 00:09:47.279 this invisible electromagnetic field that goes through all of reality. 167 00:09:47.279 --> 00:09:49.679 It goes through the whole Earth and everything like a 168 00:09:49.720 --> 00:09:53.440 big grid. So everything that you see is reality is 169 00:09:53.559 --> 00:10:00.519 full of this invisible electric field energy that's all connected. Basically, 170 00:10:01.679 --> 00:10:07.120 like they realized that there were certain places where that 171 00:10:07.279 --> 00:10:13.360 electric field runs longitudinally, like horizontally this way, like across 172 00:10:13.399 --> 00:10:15.759 the surface of the Earth, like in layers like a 173 00:10:15.799 --> 00:10:20.240 pancake or an onion. But then there's also transverse energy 174 00:10:20.279 --> 00:10:23.519 that goes up vertically that goes clear out into space 175 00:10:23.559 --> 00:10:27.559 and connects like through quantum entanglement. Everything. That's like how 176 00:10:27.600 --> 00:10:30.879 everything works with gravity and all that. But at these 177 00:10:30.879 --> 00:10:37.000 spots where the transverse and longitudinal waves cross, there's these 178 00:10:37.279 --> 00:10:40.559 X points that they call a node. And if you 179 00:10:40.840 --> 00:10:44.399 find one of those nodes and go sit in that node, 180 00:10:45.039 --> 00:10:53.480 there's usually weird geological formations, and there's also strange ancient artifacts. 181 00:10:53.759 --> 00:10:56.960 And usually it's this sacred site or there's some kind 182 00:10:56.960 --> 00:11:00.600 of a temple or petroglyphs or pyramids, or you're going 183 00:11:00.679 --> 00:11:05.080 to find something there that signifies that ancient people knew 184 00:11:05.279 --> 00:11:07.960 and could sense that there was a powerful place. And 185 00:11:07.960 --> 00:11:11.399 the idea is you go sit in that spot and 186 00:11:11.440 --> 00:11:14.399 then you go out of body, or you meditate or 187 00:11:14.440 --> 00:11:18.639 pray or do your ritual, and it's like you leave 188 00:11:18.799 --> 00:11:23.399 your brain and just the housing of your body and 189 00:11:23.559 --> 00:11:26.480 jump into that array. So all of a sudden, you 190 00:11:26.559 --> 00:11:30.120 can it's like jumping onto the Internet of the universe 191 00:11:30.240 --> 00:11:33.480 or whatever. So that's how remote viewing works, and telepathy, 192 00:11:34.480 --> 00:11:40.559 how getting messages from aliens and remote viewing, all that 193 00:11:40.600 --> 00:11:46.080 stuff works along that grid like this invisible Wi Fi system. 194 00:11:46.759 --> 00:11:49.559 But somehow ancient people knew that. And when you go 195 00:11:49.639 --> 00:11:53.679 to these spots, allegedly there's a lot of like you're 196 00:11:53.720 --> 00:11:56.320 going to find stone hinge or ancient petroglyphs or like 197 00:11:56.360 --> 00:11:59.679 the big stump like big round rock or whatever, and 198 00:11:59.720 --> 00:12:03.559 people will feel compelled, just like a homing pigeon or 199 00:12:03.559 --> 00:12:07.279 whatever to gather around and to like try and manifest 200 00:12:07.279 --> 00:12:10.440 their consciousness or to communicate with aliens and different stuff. 201 00:12:10.480 --> 00:12:13.240 There's like a strange energy there, but that's a that's 202 00:12:13.279 --> 00:12:15.879 a very common thing all over the place, and there's 203 00:12:15.879 --> 00:12:19.360 definitely something to it, and the government is really active 204 00:12:19.399 --> 00:12:23.279 and trying to figure all that out, find how it 205 00:12:23.360 --> 00:12:26.600 really works, find people that are good at it, and 206 00:12:26.960 --> 00:12:30.720 find ways to weaponize it, you know, And so that's 207 00:12:30.720 --> 00:12:34.200 a that's kind of the dark side of it, but yeah, 208 00:12:34.360 --> 00:12:37.440 it's a it's an interesting thing then, and there's definitely 209 00:12:37.440 --> 00:12:38.120 something to it. 210 00:12:42.759 --> 00:12:47.679 Thank you, Uh all right, not to get off the 211 00:12:47.720 --> 00:12:50.360 topic of this stuff, but we'll. 212 00:12:50.200 --> 00:12:51.519 Get back we'll get back to it. 213 00:12:52.399 --> 00:12:52.679 Sure. 214 00:12:53.000 --> 00:12:54.679 I think in the last episode we kind of like 215 00:12:54.720 --> 00:12:56.960 I think you talked about like the baptisms and like 216 00:12:57.000 --> 00:12:59.679 the marriages and stuff like that, the temples. I don't 217 00:13:00.120 --> 00:13:03.879 really nowhere else you wanted to go after that or 218 00:13:03.919 --> 00:13:05.879 any other things you want to get into. 219 00:13:07.440 --> 00:13:11.279 This is really tough to you. 220 00:13:09.879 --> 00:13:12.759 You know, we pretty much talked about like my upbringing 221 00:13:12.799 --> 00:13:16.440 and how strange that is, and really how they they 222 00:13:16.480 --> 00:13:20.159 don't tell you what goes on in the Temple. But 223 00:13:20.240 --> 00:13:23.320 when you're a little kid growing up, you're like singing 224 00:13:23.399 --> 00:13:27.320 songs about the Temple, about how you're excited to go 225 00:13:27.320 --> 00:13:29.639 go to the Temple and how you want to get 226 00:13:29.679 --> 00:13:32.519 married there someday and all this stuff. So you're like 227 00:13:32.639 --> 00:13:35.480 really looking forward to it. And when you just go 228 00:13:35.519 --> 00:13:40.600 to church on Sunday, it's very boring. You know, when 229 00:13:40.679 --> 00:13:43.600 I went, it was just you're singing hymns and you're 230 00:13:43.639 --> 00:13:47.200 sitting in meetings and you're being taught lessons about the 231 00:13:47.679 --> 00:13:49.960 leaders of the church and out of the Bible and 232 00:13:49.960 --> 00:13:53.000 the Book of Mormon, and it's pretty benign, and you're 233 00:13:53.039 --> 00:13:55.960 doing a lot of like work projects and weird service 234 00:13:56.000 --> 00:13:59.279 projects and stuff. But when you are older and you 235 00:13:59.320 --> 00:14:03.440 go to the Temple, then suddenly you're plunged into like 236 00:14:03.559 --> 00:14:09.600 this deep level of like Mormon version of Masonic initiations 237 00:14:09.639 --> 00:14:13.799 and stuff. But even as a kid, there's a lot 238 00:14:13.840 --> 00:14:19.759 of like weird memories where in conjunction with the cub 239 00:14:19.799 --> 00:14:24.559 Scouts or the Boy Scouts of America program and the 240 00:14:24.639 --> 00:14:27.200 relationship that it had with the church. Like as I 241 00:14:27.279 --> 00:14:30.960 was growing up, the profit of the church. He would 242 00:14:31.000 --> 00:14:34.440 say right over the pulpit to everybody that, like the 243 00:14:34.759 --> 00:14:37.960 cub Scouts and Boy Scouts of America was a part 244 00:14:38.000 --> 00:14:41.759 of the gospel, like trying to get your ego Scout 245 00:14:41.960 --> 00:14:46.480 was a part of being a faithful young man. I 246 00:14:46.480 --> 00:14:46.759 think that. 247 00:14:48.320 --> 00:14:49.840 I think that was like a paid advertisement. 248 00:14:50.919 --> 00:14:51.320 Yeah. 249 00:14:51.559 --> 00:14:51.919 Yeah. 250 00:14:52.039 --> 00:14:55.039 And the way that the church is really you know, 251 00:14:55.679 --> 00:14:58.879 with secret gut parts of the government and with other 252 00:14:58.919 --> 00:15:01.919 agencies like that, and the cub Scouts, it's super weird, 253 00:15:02.039 --> 00:15:05.559 you know what they were doing. But there is a 254 00:15:05.600 --> 00:15:08.519 lot of times where I was told, Hey, there's a 255 00:15:08.559 --> 00:15:12.840 cub Scout service project, and then I would dress up 256 00:15:12.840 --> 00:15:15.759 in my cub Scout uniform or not or whatever and 257 00:15:15.799 --> 00:15:18.879 then go meet up at the church with my friends. 258 00:15:19.360 --> 00:15:21.039 And then we would load up in a truck or 259 00:15:21.039 --> 00:15:25.080 in a van and go out to like state lands 260 00:15:25.159 --> 00:15:28.559 or public land or some government facility and do like 261 00:15:28.720 --> 00:15:29.960 child labor all day. 262 00:15:30.440 --> 00:15:32.600 Oh my god, this is the haven't you guys seen 263 00:15:32.639 --> 00:15:36.639 the movie or read the book Holes? Yes, Oh my god, 264 00:15:37.320 --> 00:15:41.919 what kid's describing. My kids just watched it like recently. 265 00:15:41.960 --> 00:15:43.480 That's so funny and I got them the book and 266 00:15:43.480 --> 00:15:45.080 they're like, Mom, this is scary. 267 00:15:46.360 --> 00:15:49.360 Yeah, pretty much. Have I told you guys the story 268 00:15:49.399 --> 00:15:52.480 on this show yet about how I was taken out 269 00:15:52.519 --> 00:15:57.559 to the facility that was doing genetic testing between goats 270 00:15:57.600 --> 00:15:58.360 and spiders. 271 00:15:59.320 --> 00:16:03.000 Yeah, yeah, Yeah, that was fucked fucked out. 272 00:16:04.120 --> 00:16:06.679 Yeah, that was super weird. That was probably the weirdest 273 00:16:06.720 --> 00:16:08.200 one aside from going to do that. 274 00:16:08.320 --> 00:16:10.320 I think I missed that one. Actually, I think that 275 00:16:10.399 --> 00:16:11.399 was the one. He wasn't here. 276 00:16:12.440 --> 00:16:17.639 Yeah, Like, I don't think I heard that story. 277 00:16:16.919 --> 00:16:18.720 This for those that don't know it. I was just, 278 00:16:18.879 --> 00:16:21.159 you know, one of those same projects where I showed 279 00:16:21.200 --> 00:16:23.360 up and was taken on a white van and we 280 00:16:23.519 --> 00:16:26.360 drove for like two two and a half hours out 281 00:16:26.399 --> 00:16:28.440 into the desert. I was told it was to a 282 00:16:28.480 --> 00:16:30.919 town called mud Lake, but I don't know if that's 283 00:16:30.960 --> 00:16:31.759 where it really. 284 00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:31.960 Was or not. 285 00:16:32.600 --> 00:16:36.600 But basically, we shoveled goat shit out of the stalls 286 00:16:36.639 --> 00:16:40.200 for the animals, uh And it was a genetic laboratory 287 00:16:40.279 --> 00:16:44.159 for the government where they were doing uh cross genetics 288 00:16:44.200 --> 00:16:48.639 between goats and spiders, and they were mixing the spider 289 00:16:48.759 --> 00:16:51.840 silk in with the goat proteins and they could get 290 00:16:51.879 --> 00:16:53.720 it out of the wool or out of the milk, 291 00:16:54.519 --> 00:16:57.799 and they were making advanced kevlar and body armor and 292 00:16:57.919 --> 00:17:01.440 different proteins and using it. All kinds of weird stuff, 293 00:17:01.440 --> 00:17:04.680 but that's what they told me. And then after that project, 294 00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:06.960 when I was telling my dad, he was like, Oh, yeah, 295 00:17:06.599 --> 00:17:11.200 that's a secret government facility out there. That's weird. But yeah, 296 00:17:11.279 --> 00:17:14.200 I was taken there as a kid for the church 297 00:17:14.480 --> 00:17:17.400 and the cub Scouts to do like child labor there. 298 00:17:18.279 --> 00:17:20.599 You know, I don't even know if they fed me lunch. 299 00:17:20.680 --> 00:17:25.440 It's like, yeah, it literally was like holes. Then it 300 00:17:25.480 --> 00:17:27.680 was a lotter, Oh my god. 301 00:17:27.640 --> 00:17:30.640 Just shoveling out there. You know, it's always an adventure. 302 00:17:30.759 --> 00:17:32.640 We would be up in the mountains somewhere at some 303 00:17:32.839 --> 00:17:36.480 place like fixing fence or running chainsaws. I'd be like 304 00:17:36.519 --> 00:17:39.279 twelve years old. Half the time. I thought it was 305 00:17:39.319 --> 00:17:42.319 pretty cool. But looking back on it, I'm like, I'm 306 00:17:42.319 --> 00:17:44.319 pretty sure a lot of that was kind of illegal. 307 00:17:45.400 --> 00:17:45.640 You know. 308 00:17:46.440 --> 00:17:48.200 You know something I do want to ask. It just 309 00:17:48.240 --> 00:17:51.200 popped it to my head down. Maybe I had an 310 00:17:51.240 --> 00:17:56.279 idea and I forgot what is like, why is like womanism? 311 00:17:56.400 --> 00:18:02.119 So I guess pushing or associated with the boy scout, Like, you. 312 00:18:02.079 --> 00:18:04.920 Know, I was always taught that it had to do 313 00:18:05.039 --> 00:18:08.720 with like preparedness and how to It was like an 314 00:18:08.799 --> 00:18:13.240 essential part of development. There's this underlying layer during the 315 00:18:13.279 --> 00:18:16.960 generation that I was brought up in, and it kind 316 00:18:17.000 --> 00:18:20.119 of evolves like when I if I talked about this, now, 317 00:18:20.240 --> 00:18:22.960 my brothers and people my age and stuff would all 318 00:18:23.279 --> 00:18:26.799 this would resonate with them. But now they don't talk 319 00:18:26.880 --> 00:18:29.920 the same way. But when I was growing up, there 320 00:18:29.960 --> 00:18:32.720 was really this idea that we were at the end 321 00:18:32.720 --> 00:18:36.000 of times, Like the real name of the church is 322 00:18:36.000 --> 00:18:39.240 the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints, and 323 00:18:39.279 --> 00:18:42.599 the ideas that we were in the latter days or 324 00:18:42.599 --> 00:18:46.759 the last days and the clock is ticking, and basically 325 00:18:46.799 --> 00:18:50.359 that means that there's going to be wars all over 326 00:18:50.400 --> 00:18:56.039 the world, big cataclysms, all kinds of disasters, and like 327 00:18:56.359 --> 00:18:59.440 basically Book of Revelations kind of stuff, as all those 328 00:18:59.480 --> 00:19:02.200 prophecies are going to come true, and a lot of 329 00:19:02.240 --> 00:19:05.319 it's going to happen in America, and a lot of 330 00:19:05.359 --> 00:19:09.839 it's going to involve the Church. So it's kind of 331 00:19:09.960 --> 00:19:13.720 like how scientology has the Sea Org. You know, they 332 00:19:13.759 --> 00:19:17.640 have like this fake Navy that l Ron Hubbard, he's 333 00:19:17.720 --> 00:19:20.039 like a fan of the He was part of the Navy, 334 00:19:20.079 --> 00:19:24.519 and so he adopted all that stuff out of the Navy. Well, 335 00:19:25.240 --> 00:19:29.440 the Mormon Church they sort of took on the ritualistic 336 00:19:29.519 --> 00:19:35.160 and the occult side of freemasonry, but then also adopted 337 00:19:35.319 --> 00:19:41.759 kind of this militia and doomsday cult kind of mindset 338 00:19:43.039 --> 00:19:46.319 as they moved west as pioneers and as they settled 339 00:19:46.359 --> 00:19:49.279 in Salt Lake City, and then they started preparing for 340 00:19:49.319 --> 00:19:52.039 the end of the world. And so this idea of 341 00:19:52.240 --> 00:19:54.359 cub Scouts was like when I would go up to 342 00:19:54.400 --> 00:19:57.680 Scout camp or would go to Scout camp projects, we 343 00:19:57.759 --> 00:20:01.240 would pray at the beginning. It was all mixed in 344 00:20:01.359 --> 00:20:03.839 with the church at the same time. We did it 345 00:20:03.880 --> 00:20:07.839 as a church group and Scouts, and we would do 346 00:20:07.880 --> 00:20:10.519 Scouts at the church building all the time. It was 347 00:20:10.559 --> 00:20:13.039 all mixed together. But I had to do with this 348 00:20:13.119 --> 00:20:17.559 idea of like you're kind of like being raised as 349 00:20:17.599 --> 00:20:20.119 a soldier sort of like to prepare for the end 350 00:20:20.160 --> 00:20:22.119 of the world. So you had to be able to 351 00:20:22.160 --> 00:20:27.079 start a fire, shoot a gun like doomsday. Yeah. Yeah, 352 00:20:27.200 --> 00:20:31.119 this idea is that, yeah, when the when the cataclysm happens, 353 00:20:31.160 --> 00:20:33.279 we might have to go live in the wilderness or 354 00:20:33.319 --> 00:20:36.200 like camp out in the mountains, apocalypse, whatever it is. 355 00:20:38.279 --> 00:20:41.079 That sounds like. A friend of mine was actually raised 356 00:20:41.079 --> 00:20:43.880 in a cult called the world Wide Church of God, 357 00:20:44.759 --> 00:20:47.279 and it sounds very similar. I think. Actually, I just 358 00:20:47.279 --> 00:20:50.480 looked it up really quick. The founder, Herbert Armstrong, browed 359 00:20:50.559 --> 00:20:54.319 many ideas from Mormonism, so that's interesting. It's very much 360 00:20:54.319 --> 00:20:58.079 like a doomsday prepper. What right the world was ending? 361 00:20:58.319 --> 00:21:00.200 What a friend of mine for. 362 00:21:00.279 --> 00:21:04.920 That guy on my show, Herbert Herbert Ormshaw. Oh shit, 363 00:21:05.119 --> 00:21:08.960 sorry that bugged out, No, that is bugged out. He know, 364 00:21:09.519 --> 00:21:11.559 we only dropped it maybe two months ago. Yeah, this 365 00:21:11.599 --> 00:21:14.279 guy had some This guy met with all these world leaders. 366 00:21:14.440 --> 00:21:20.920 It was there's something going on besides Jesus. 367 00:21:18.720 --> 00:21:24.640 Oh yeah guy, Yeah, and then it was like a cult. 368 00:21:24.920 --> 00:21:26.559 She grew up in that, and she was like, it's 369 00:21:26.599 --> 00:21:28.160 not a way to live, that's for sure. 370 00:21:30.759 --> 00:21:32.799 Yeah, I grew up with a version of that. And 371 00:21:32.839 --> 00:21:36.480 then there's even these like there's like these pocket groups 372 00:21:36.519 --> 00:21:40.559 that would form in communities and around certain figures too. 373 00:21:41.079 --> 00:21:43.960 I don't know if you guys are aware of Chad 374 00:21:44.079 --> 00:21:50.119 day Bell. Chad Daybell and Laurie Vallo basically They're a 375 00:21:50.720 --> 00:21:54.960 couple that were up in Rexburg, Idaho, which is where 376 00:21:55.000 --> 00:21:57.839 I lived, so I lived in group, was born in Rexburg, 377 00:21:57.960 --> 00:22:00.279 went to high school in Sugar City, and was all 378 00:22:00.319 --> 00:22:03.880 in the same kind of area right there. But basically, 379 00:22:03.920 --> 00:22:08.400 this guy, Chad Dabel, he was a Mormon guy and 380 00:22:08.440 --> 00:22:12.759 a bishop, and he became friends with a couple of 381 00:22:12.759 --> 00:22:16.559 people that had had near death experiences where they swear 382 00:22:17.240 --> 00:22:19.799 that they saw God and they saw Jesus and then 383 00:22:19.839 --> 00:22:22.640 they saw visions of the end of the world and 384 00:22:22.680 --> 00:22:24.839 they saw all these details of when it was going 385 00:22:24.880 --> 00:22:27.119 to happen, how it was going to involve the church 386 00:22:27.240 --> 00:22:29.960 in Salt Lake City, and how people were going to 387 00:22:30.000 --> 00:22:32.119 have to go flee out in the wilderness and all 388 00:22:32.160 --> 00:22:35.480 this stuff. And there was this book that got published 389 00:22:35.519 --> 00:22:39.240 called Visions of Glory that came out, and this anonymous 390 00:22:39.240 --> 00:22:43.400 publisher that had this or author that had this near 391 00:22:43.440 --> 00:22:46.480 death experience was claiming, you know that he's a Mormon 392 00:22:46.559 --> 00:22:48.720 guy in Salt Lake City and he saw the end 393 00:22:48.759 --> 00:22:51.519 of the world and all this stuff in that book. 394 00:22:51.960 --> 00:22:55.200 And around that book there was a couple of more books. 395 00:22:55.680 --> 00:22:58.119 A lady named Julie Rowe also had this near death 396 00:22:58.200 --> 00:23:00.440 experience or claims that she did. And she wrote like 397 00:23:00.480 --> 00:23:03.559 three books that said kind of the same stuff, like 398 00:23:03.599 --> 00:23:08.200 the end times, visions and things. But Chad Daybell, he 399 00:23:08.640 --> 00:23:11.599 was like this independent book publisher that latched onto this 400 00:23:12.119 --> 00:23:17.079 and started publishing these books. And so within Mormonism and 401 00:23:17.119 --> 00:23:20.599 even in Idaho, especially up in Rexburg where I was, 402 00:23:21.160 --> 00:23:24.039 I was still a member of the church back then, 403 00:23:24.200 --> 00:23:26.759 it was like a cult within the cult. So there 404 00:23:26.799 --> 00:23:31.000 was like people reading these books that weren't actually official 405 00:23:31.079 --> 00:23:33.519 church books, but they were kind of because they were 406 00:23:33.920 --> 00:23:38.119 written by members published by a bishop. And so there 407 00:23:38.160 --> 00:23:41.640 was people going to these meetings with Chad Daybel and 408 00:23:41.839 --> 00:23:45.240 Julie Rowe and these other people talking about their near 409 00:23:45.279 --> 00:23:48.319 death experiences. And it was all like in secret, and 410 00:23:48.359 --> 00:23:50.640 I had family members that were all sucked into this, 411 00:23:50.759 --> 00:23:52.920 and I was like, what is going on? But it 412 00:23:53.000 --> 00:23:55.960 all had to do with people wanting to know when 413 00:23:55.960 --> 00:23:57.640 the end of the world was going to happen, and 414 00:23:57.640 --> 00:24:01.480 who's going to be president? Is China going to invade 415 00:24:01.559 --> 00:24:04.000 from into Oregon? And there's because all this stuff is 416 00:24:04.000 --> 00:24:08.519 in these books, right, But at the end of the day, Uh, 417 00:24:08.599 --> 00:24:12.880 this guy Chad Dabell who's publishing these books ends up 418 00:24:13.440 --> 00:24:16.839 like the same story as always having like affairs on 419 00:24:17.000 --> 00:24:20.079 his wife. There's mysterious deaths, and then in the end 420 00:24:20.880 --> 00:24:24.839 him and his new wife there now in prison because 421 00:24:24.880 --> 00:24:28.319 they murdered their kids and burned them in a bonfire 422 00:24:28.359 --> 00:24:31.960 in the backyard. And then they flew to Hawaii and 423 00:24:32.039 --> 00:24:35.359 hiding because they thought that the end times were here, 424 00:24:36.000 --> 00:24:38.000 and then Jesus was on his way back and so 425 00:24:38.319 --> 00:24:40.839 it was time to fulfill the prophecies, and so they 426 00:24:40.880 --> 00:24:43.359 went out they literally murdered their kids and burned him 427 00:24:43.359 --> 00:24:46.799 in the backyard, and then they went on a trip 428 00:24:46.839 --> 00:24:50.880 to and got arrested like pool side in Hawaii. Wow, 429 00:24:51.039 --> 00:24:53.240 but that was all like this a weird cult within 430 00:24:53.319 --> 00:24:57.319 the church and within the like super bizarre. 431 00:25:00.279 --> 00:25:03.200 After they did that, what's that they're like sitting there 432 00:25:03.200 --> 00:25:05.440 at the beach shipping on drinks with umbrellas in it, 433 00:25:05.519 --> 00:25:06.720 after they did some shit like that. 434 00:25:06.960 --> 00:25:10.079 Literally the bodycam footage when the police officers show up 435 00:25:10.119 --> 00:25:13.920 to arrest them. They're in like Kawaii and Hawaii, and 436 00:25:13.960 --> 00:25:19.200 they're sitting at a resort by the pool and Lori 437 00:25:19.400 --> 00:25:23.680 Valo is laying there in her bikini and she has 438 00:25:23.839 --> 00:25:28.960 that book Visions of Glory sitting there next to her, 439 00:25:29.000 --> 00:25:32.079 open like she was reading that book and they're there 440 00:25:32.200 --> 00:25:35.640 in Kawaii because waiting for Jesus to come back and 441 00:25:35.920 --> 00:25:39.200 had just got done murdering three kids. 442 00:25:39.640 --> 00:25:42.920 Oh oh man, I think I might even seen something 443 00:25:42.920 --> 00:25:44.000 about it on Netflix. 444 00:25:44.960 --> 00:25:47.200 Yeah. I think there's a whole documentary on there. There's 445 00:25:47.240 --> 00:25:50.559 a ton of news reports and stuff on YouTube. Yeah, 446 00:25:50.720 --> 00:25:55.759 Chad Dabell and Lori Valo and uh Julie Row and 447 00:25:55.799 --> 00:25:58.359 then this. Yeah, the book is called The Visions of 448 00:25:58.359 --> 00:26:01.279 Glory and the Time is now. But yeah, there was 449 00:26:01.319 --> 00:26:04.200 like a whole mini cult within the church that started 450 00:26:04.799 --> 00:26:08.880 that was all like literally excited like the end times, 451 00:26:08.920 --> 00:26:11.519 just when there's like the third Blood Moon and all 452 00:26:11.559 --> 00:26:13.319 this stuff, because it's like all this crap. 453 00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:17.960 This sounds so similar. There's a Catholic prophecy called the 454 00:26:18.000 --> 00:26:22.039 illumination of conscience and that sounds like super similar actually, 455 00:26:22.079 --> 00:26:25.319 because apparently when the illumination happens, that's when we're all 456 00:26:25.400 --> 00:26:28.920 see like the state of our soul as God sees it, 457 00:26:29.519 --> 00:26:32.519 and then we'll have this opportunity to like change if 458 00:26:32.519 --> 00:26:35.920 we need to change or whatever. And then apparently there'll 459 00:26:35.960 --> 00:26:38.319 be a time of like refuges so everyone needs to 460 00:26:38.400 --> 00:26:40.880 like whoever's a believer is going to like need to 461 00:26:40.920 --> 00:26:44.000 flee into the forest, and like there's people who have 462 00:26:44.119 --> 00:26:48.559 already started to prepare refuges for like massive amounts of people. 463 00:26:49.640 --> 00:26:52.640 I don't know, it's interesting, but yeah. 464 00:26:52.480 --> 00:26:54.680 It's like the same kind of pattern that goes clear 465 00:26:54.720 --> 00:26:58.880 back to like Moses in the Bible fleeing Egypt and cross. 466 00:26:58.880 --> 00:27:02.119 See there's like that mythology of happening to go survive. 467 00:27:01.759 --> 00:27:03.200 In the mountains exactly. 468 00:27:04.240 --> 00:27:08.119 Yeah, yeah, that's the same pattern. Like they're just looking 469 00:27:08.160 --> 00:27:11.200 forward to that repeating. But then at the last time, 470 00:27:11.400 --> 00:27:14.440 when it's the real one and the final one, then 471 00:27:14.519 --> 00:27:17.000 everybody thinks that their church is going to be the winner. 472 00:27:17.880 --> 00:27:20.160 Yes, right, seems to be a common theme. 473 00:27:21.519 --> 00:27:23.119 On that one. 474 00:27:23.880 --> 00:27:24.680 Yeah, exactly. 475 00:27:25.960 --> 00:27:28.279 But you got to do is check everybody's dates and 476 00:27:28.359 --> 00:27:29.920 go for one of a few of the years after 477 00:27:29.960 --> 00:27:32.720 the fact, because you can keep them a little bit longer. 478 00:27:34.200 --> 00:27:38.079 So far, nothing's happening, like like my my grandpa, he 479 00:27:38.240 --> 00:27:41.920 was prophesied and given blessings and told that he was 480 00:27:41.960 --> 00:27:45.200 going to be there and help build like the Temple 481 00:27:45.279 --> 00:27:48.119 and New Jerusalem, which is supposed to be in Missouri 482 00:27:48.960 --> 00:27:52.160 by the way in America. But he had all these 483 00:27:52.160 --> 00:27:54.279 blessings saying that he was supposed to be there and 484 00:27:54.319 --> 00:27:57.200 help build that temple, but like he died a long 485 00:27:57.279 --> 00:28:00.599 time ago, so then they just changed the story and say, well, 486 00:28:00.920 --> 00:28:03.359 maybe he'll be there as an angel, you know, he'll 487 00:28:03.400 --> 00:28:07.279 help as a spirit or something. Okay, so they just 488 00:28:07.400 --> 00:28:13.000 rationalize it and move on. Everybody does. Yeah, but yeah, 489 00:28:13.039 --> 00:28:15.400 growing up as a member, it was just different like that, 490 00:28:15.519 --> 00:28:19.480 you know, you just before the internet, there's no way 491 00:28:19.640 --> 00:28:22.960 to fact check, There's no way to look anything up. 492 00:28:23.119 --> 00:28:26.920 Like if you had any questions, there was like some 493 00:28:27.640 --> 00:28:30.480 maybe a few pamphlets and things going around, and maybe 494 00:28:30.519 --> 00:28:33.599 a couple of videos. But like when I was a 495 00:28:33.599 --> 00:28:36.400 missionary and went out when I was nineteen years old 496 00:28:36.400 --> 00:28:39.359 and went to Arkansas for two years. That was my 497 00:28:39.440 --> 00:28:42.680 first time ever even hearing anybody talk bad about the 498 00:28:42.759 --> 00:28:45.359 church or about the leaders of the church. And I 499 00:28:45.400 --> 00:28:50.759 was like nineteen, you know. But up until then, everybody 500 00:28:50.759 --> 00:28:53.079 that I knew loved the church. They were all members 501 00:28:53.200 --> 00:28:55.599 or my family, the whole community. It was like living 502 00:28:55.640 --> 00:28:59.200 on an island, you know, and had no idea. But 503 00:28:59.240 --> 00:29:03.240 then when I got to Arkansas, it was like immediate conflict. 504 00:29:03.279 --> 00:29:06.119 There was like actually people educated with the Bible and 505 00:29:07.200 --> 00:29:10.200 could counter claims and say no, this didn't happen, and 506 00:29:10.759 --> 00:29:13.519 point out things that I didn't know, and you know, 507 00:29:14.160 --> 00:29:17.240 tell me that Joseph Smith actually was a polygamist and 508 00:29:17.279 --> 00:29:19.039 I was like, oh, he wasn't. And then you go 509 00:29:19.079 --> 00:29:21.640 look it up, You're like, oh, you know he was. 510 00:29:22.119 --> 00:29:22.359 You know. 511 00:29:23.079 --> 00:29:25.359 I'm like, I'm a missionary and I didn't know that. 512 00:29:26.359 --> 00:29:28.960 So weird stuff like that happens to you like along 513 00:29:29.000 --> 00:29:33.160 the way. But yeah, once the Internet came out, it's 514 00:29:33.200 --> 00:29:37.440 like becomes a slow unraveling because then you can suddenly 515 00:29:37.480 --> 00:29:41.200 you can check with with archaeology, and you can check 516 00:29:41.359 --> 00:29:45.720 genetic histories, and you can look up other you could 517 00:29:45.720 --> 00:29:47.880 see the other side of the story and see the 518 00:29:47.920 --> 00:29:50.240 back of the tapestry, and then suddenly you're like, oh, 519 00:29:50.319 --> 00:29:53.839 there's this whole dark history that's way different than what 520 00:29:53.960 --> 00:29:57.440 I was taught, you know. But that took me a 521 00:29:57.480 --> 00:30:02.119 long time, like my whole my whole life. You would 522 00:30:02.200 --> 00:30:05.720 think that when you're in the middle of doing the 523 00:30:05.839 --> 00:30:10.480 Masonic rituals for the first time, that it would like 524 00:30:10.519 --> 00:30:13.359 occur to you that this is bs or like what 525 00:30:13.400 --> 00:30:16.839 am I doing here? This is crazy, and honestly, it 526 00:30:17.079 --> 00:30:20.599 does occur to I think everybody. Like the first time 527 00:30:20.599 --> 00:30:23.759 that I went through and was doing my initiation and 528 00:30:23.880 --> 00:30:27.400 endowment and all that stuff where you're changing into all 529 00:30:27.440 --> 00:30:31.319 the costumes and the robes and doing the hand signs 530 00:30:31.359 --> 00:30:34.319 and passwords and all that, Like the whole time I 531 00:30:34.480 --> 00:30:37.720 was thinking it was like a paradox inside me. I 532 00:30:37.759 --> 00:30:40.799 was like, on the one side, I was thinking, holy shit, 533 00:30:40.960 --> 00:30:44.720 this is freaking weird, Like this is so bizarre, Like 534 00:30:45.039 --> 00:30:48.079 what are we doing here? Like how why are we 535 00:30:48.119 --> 00:30:51.119 all dressed like this? Are we really? Is this really 536 00:30:51.119 --> 00:30:53.920 what it is? Like that was all going on. But 537 00:30:54.039 --> 00:30:58.200 on the other side, there was this whole life since 538 00:30:58.240 --> 00:31:01.359 I was a child growing up that was like baked 539 00:31:01.400 --> 00:31:04.440 into me and basically brainwashed to look forward to this 540 00:31:04.599 --> 00:31:07.799 moment like this was real, and I was taught like, oh, 541 00:31:07.839 --> 00:31:10.400 this is just like the old Biblical temple. So I'm 542 00:31:10.440 --> 00:31:14.839 like my brain is just looking to make it make sense. 543 00:31:15.279 --> 00:31:17.279 So on the other side of it, I'm also like 544 00:31:17.359 --> 00:31:20.799 trying to tell myself, oh, it just feels like this 545 00:31:20.920 --> 00:31:24.039 because it's you had no idea like oh, this is 546 00:31:24.079 --> 00:31:27.359 what the church is really about. Wow, And I just 547 00:31:27.400 --> 00:31:31.079 tried to stay like curious and everything, and I actually 548 00:31:31.160 --> 00:31:34.599 became really obsessed with going to the temple and like 549 00:31:34.799 --> 00:31:38.319 memorizing all of it and like trying to learn all 550 00:31:38.359 --> 00:31:41.799 of the mysteries about it and dig into where it 551 00:31:41.839 --> 00:31:45.960 all came from. And ultimately that's a that's like a 552 00:31:45.960 --> 00:31:50.319 two edged sword, because like that's the problem that the 553 00:31:50.400 --> 00:31:54.000 church has, and that I think any any big organization 554 00:31:54.160 --> 00:31:57.400 or cult has, is that if you have a member 555 00:31:57.519 --> 00:32:01.119 like me who's really passionate about it and really loves 556 00:32:01.160 --> 00:32:05.160 it and really believes it and is actually having paranormal 557 00:32:05.240 --> 00:32:07.960 or and spiritual experiences in your life and so you're 558 00:32:08.039 --> 00:32:11.920 looking for answers like this is real, then what happens 559 00:32:12.000 --> 00:32:15.640 is you dig into it like a tick and you 560 00:32:16.119 --> 00:32:19.480 study it like really hard, and what happens is you 561 00:32:19.559 --> 00:32:23.039 end up finding out, like as a Mormon, like why 562 00:32:23.079 --> 00:32:26.039 are we doing all these handshakes? And where did these 563 00:32:26.039 --> 00:32:29.400 passwords comes? Where do they come from? Where does this 564 00:32:29.440 --> 00:32:33.359 originate from? And oh does it come from Solomon's Temple? 565 00:32:33.519 --> 00:32:36.160 Does it come from the Knight's templar? Like where does 566 00:32:36.279 --> 00:32:38.319 the roots come from? I want to study that too. 567 00:32:38.839 --> 00:32:41.519 So as you're digging to try and learn and to 568 00:32:41.559 --> 00:32:47.559 become more spiritually deepened through study and everything. You end 569 00:32:47.640 --> 00:32:51.319 up realizing, oh, well, a lot of it did come 570 00:32:51.359 --> 00:32:56.279 from Solomon, but it came from Solomon's books of demonology. Whoops, 571 00:32:57.200 --> 00:33:01.079 and you go, oh, it did come from this book 572 00:33:01.079 --> 00:33:03.599 in this book, but they came out of Freemasonry, and 573 00:33:03.640 --> 00:33:06.759 they originated in these rituals that involved this other stuff 574 00:33:06.799 --> 00:33:09.319 that I had no idea about. Oh, and so all 575 00:33:09.319 --> 00:33:13.279 of a sudden you're torn with like, while you're digging 576 00:33:13.319 --> 00:33:16.319 for spiritual truth to try and deepen your life and 577 00:33:16.359 --> 00:33:20.440 to get closer to God, you're realizing that what you're 578 00:33:20.440 --> 00:33:22.799 doing and what you're studying and where it came from, 579 00:33:24.000 --> 00:33:26.680 you've kind of been lied to about and it didn't 580 00:33:26.920 --> 00:33:29.880 come from where you thought it did. And maybe you 581 00:33:30.039 --> 00:33:33.000 got tricked and you're doing things you shouldn't be or whatever, 582 00:33:33.079 --> 00:33:35.680 and you're better off on your own like figuring it out, 583 00:33:36.519 --> 00:33:39.920 or like, all of a sudden, you're like, wait a second. 584 00:33:40.480 --> 00:33:42.880 The origins of the church, and a lot of these 585 00:33:43.000 --> 00:33:47.920 rituals have their roots in like Enochian magic from John 586 00:33:47.960 --> 00:33:52.599 Dee and Ed Kelly that were like basically eight hundred 587 00:33:52.680 --> 00:33:55.480 years before Joseph Smith, and they were doing the same stuff. 588 00:33:55.920 --> 00:33:58.799 But until the Internet, until you run into that stuff 589 00:33:58.799 --> 00:34:01.519 and study it out, you would never know, like you 590 00:34:01.559 --> 00:34:05.640 would have no idea. It's just like mysteries like you 591 00:34:05.680 --> 00:34:07.720 would read in the Bible or in the scriptures, you know, 592 00:34:07.799 --> 00:34:11.639 like miracles and weird mysteries about people, you know, Moses 593 00:34:11.679 --> 00:34:14.559 goes and talks to God and the burning bush and things, 594 00:34:14.599 --> 00:34:17.800 and so you don't really take you don't really question 595 00:34:17.880 --> 00:34:21.960 it until you're older and you can really uh speculate 596 00:34:21.960 --> 00:34:24.599 about things and stuff. So it took me like over 597 00:34:24.639 --> 00:34:27.920 thirty five thirty five to thirty eight years to really 598 00:34:28.039 --> 00:34:29.679 unravel all that stuff. 599 00:34:31.639 --> 00:34:34.440 Well, yeah, I'm sure. 600 00:34:37.280 --> 00:34:38.280 What was it like when like. 601 00:34:40.079 --> 00:34:43.480 When you did so coming across that, I mean, did 602 00:34:43.480 --> 00:34:44.760 I hit you pretty hard at first? 603 00:34:46.519 --> 00:34:49.880 Yeah? I think the biggest thing for me was when 604 00:34:49.920 --> 00:34:52.960 I was when I was on a mission in Arkansas 605 00:34:53.079 --> 00:34:56.039 at nineteen. That was the first time that like a 606 00:34:57.760 --> 00:35:02.320 like a minister, a preacher from another church, they would 607 00:35:02.360 --> 00:35:07.119 see us as like hostile entity, Like we're basically a 608 00:35:07.199 --> 00:35:11.679 foreign invader into their territory because their whole livelihood and 609 00:35:11.719 --> 00:35:15.199 everything is off of their congregation and coming to church 610 00:35:15.239 --> 00:35:18.079 and paying tithings. So now these Mormon missionaries are there 611 00:35:18.719 --> 00:35:22.039 knocking on all the doors, mowing people's lawns, doing community 612 00:35:22.119 --> 00:35:25.400 service and like saying come over here, come join our church, 613 00:35:25.440 --> 00:35:29.039 and trying to proselytize their community. So we're like trying 614 00:35:29.039 --> 00:35:32.519 to steal their customers, you know. So we would be 615 00:35:32.639 --> 00:35:36.159 out going door to door talking about the Book of Mormon, 616 00:35:36.239 --> 00:35:39.800 about Mormonism and stuff, and these preachers would just pull 617 00:35:39.920 --> 00:35:42.719 up in their vans or trucks or whatever and get 618 00:35:42.719 --> 00:35:45.639 out and just start yelling at us, you know, and 619 00:35:45.719 --> 00:35:49.159 they would just start dropping the SPACs. Oh yeah. They 620 00:35:49.159 --> 00:35:51.760 would be like, I condemn you in the name of 621 00:35:51.800 --> 00:35:53.480 the Lord, and they would put their arm in the 622 00:35:53.480 --> 00:35:55.599 sky and they would oh man, they would get right 623 00:35:55.599 --> 00:35:58.079 in our face and they would grab the Book of 624 00:35:58.079 --> 00:36:00.320 Mormon and pull it right out of our hands, throw 625 00:36:00.320 --> 00:36:03.719 it on the ground and stuff on it. Oh, it 626 00:36:03.760 --> 00:36:08.639 was just direction. You're not welcome here. I'm going to 627 00:36:08.679 --> 00:36:11.360 go around. And so they would go around to their 628 00:36:11.400 --> 00:36:17.960 congregation and then even hold meetings and educate their their congregation, like, hey, 629 00:36:18.039 --> 00:36:22.079 when the Mormon missionaries show up with their name tags, uh, 630 00:36:22.119 --> 00:36:24.239 this is what you tell them, you know, ask them 631 00:36:24.280 --> 00:36:27.079 about why the Book of Mormons says that people with 632 00:36:27.199 --> 00:36:30.280 black skin is a curse because they got black skin 633 00:36:30.360 --> 00:36:33.239 because of their they didn't follow the gospel back in 634 00:36:33.280 --> 00:36:35.800 the old days or whatever, and ask them about this, 635 00:36:35.840 --> 00:36:38.880 so they would they would give the members of the 636 00:36:38.920 --> 00:36:43.760 community all of this information about church history, about polygamy, 637 00:36:44.840 --> 00:36:47.320 about all these problems with the Book of Mormon and 638 00:36:47.360 --> 00:36:51.280 how and just things with the church that I had 639 00:36:51.360 --> 00:36:55.719 no idea existed growing up as a kid in the church. 640 00:36:55.920 --> 00:37:00.000 I had no preparation for whatsoever. So then all sudden, 641 00:37:00.039 --> 00:37:03.280 I'm out there and not only are these ministers and 642 00:37:03.320 --> 00:37:06.480 preachers throwing it in my face, but now everybody in 643 00:37:06.519 --> 00:37:11.159 the community's got pamphlets. They've watched these anti Mormon movies 644 00:37:11.159 --> 00:37:13.519 at church about us and all the stuff and about 645 00:37:13.519 --> 00:37:18.039 our doctrine and teachings and a lot of it. I'm 646 00:37:18.079 --> 00:37:20.519 like hearing this, like that's not true, and I'm just 647 00:37:20.679 --> 00:37:23.760 arguing back, like, no, that's totally lie. That's not true. 648 00:37:23.800 --> 00:37:26.519 That's not true because, like I said, there's really no 649 00:37:26.800 --> 00:37:30.360 internet back then, Like this was right right before when 650 00:37:30.400 --> 00:37:32.719 I came home from my mission, when I was like 651 00:37:32.760 --> 00:37:35.239 twenty one. That was when I got my first cell 652 00:37:35.280 --> 00:37:37.760 phone and it didn't even have internet. You just texted 653 00:37:37.800 --> 00:37:40.960 as well as old Nokia's you know. But when we 654 00:37:41.000 --> 00:37:44.599 finally got like internet and could look things up later, 655 00:37:45.559 --> 00:37:48.400 then it's like those things that I heard on my 656 00:37:48.519 --> 00:37:51.079 mission back then, that these preachers said and that I 657 00:37:51.199 --> 00:37:54.119 ran into in people's homes, Like they would just say 658 00:37:54.159 --> 00:37:59.079 this stuff to me, Like why would they promote John C. 659 00:37:59.199 --> 00:38:02.559 Bennett to first counselor of the church within one year 660 00:38:02.639 --> 00:38:05.159 when he was an abortion doctor and he lived with 661 00:38:05.239 --> 00:38:08.400 Joseph Smith right when he was doing polygamy? Were they 662 00:38:08.400 --> 00:38:11.480 doing abortions? And I was just like, what, I didn't 663 00:38:11.519 --> 00:38:14.639 even know Joseph Smith was doing polygamy? What is polygamy? 664 00:38:15.039 --> 00:38:18.559 Like I was so naive, you know. Like so then 665 00:38:19.320 --> 00:38:22.800 when I got home from my mission and married, you 666 00:38:22.920 --> 00:38:25.079 kind of go back in that bubble. I'm like back 667 00:38:25.079 --> 00:38:27.840 in Idaho and back in Utah. You just kind of 668 00:38:27.880 --> 00:38:30.880 push all that out of your mind. Like I'd been 669 00:38:31.519 --> 00:38:35.679 at war in Iraq or something. You know, I survived 670 00:38:35.719 --> 00:38:39.480 all this hostile fire. But then when you're sitting there 671 00:38:39.519 --> 00:38:43.960 at home at night, you know, that same thing that 672 00:38:44.039 --> 00:38:47.360 I would do. I would be wondering about the temple, 673 00:38:47.599 --> 00:38:50.960 about the secret handshakes. So I'd be wondering about the 674 00:38:51.000 --> 00:38:53.960 Book of Mormon talks about all this ancient history, like 675 00:38:54.000 --> 00:38:56.519 these big cities where they would have these battles with 676 00:38:57.039 --> 00:38:59.880 one hundred thousand warriors and they would be on horses 677 00:39:00.159 --> 00:39:02.880 chariots with swords and armor, and I would be like, 678 00:39:02.960 --> 00:39:05.480 where did that happen? You know, there should be a 679 00:39:05.599 --> 00:39:08.559 chariot somewhere, there should be helmets or swords, there should 680 00:39:08.559 --> 00:39:13.199 be artifacts. So you start, as you get older all 681 00:39:13.280 --> 00:39:15.559 these things that I had run into since I was 682 00:39:15.960 --> 00:39:20.960 younger and on my mission. Eventually you're like home at 683 00:39:21.079 --> 00:39:24.079 night and you run into things on the internet or 684 00:39:24.119 --> 00:39:27.239 a YouTube video comes up or something like that, and 685 00:39:27.280 --> 00:39:30.440 pretty soon you're going down the rabbit hole, even though 686 00:39:30.719 --> 00:39:34.239 you might have good intentions. Pretty soon you're on a 687 00:39:34.280 --> 00:39:38.519 website that explains, oh, that's where the secret Temple handshakes 688 00:39:38.559 --> 00:39:42.400 come from. Oh that's why the Book of Mormon was 689 00:39:42.440 --> 00:39:44.880 this way, that's why this and that, and all of 690 00:39:44.920 --> 00:39:49.480 a sudden you realize, like wait a second, Like for me, 691 00:39:49.559 --> 00:39:52.239 I can remember exactly like where I was sitting in 692 00:39:52.280 --> 00:39:57.119 the moment and when it actually occurred to me that 693 00:39:57.800 --> 00:40:00.599 the only way that any of this stuff makes sense 694 00:40:00.719 --> 00:40:03.159 with the Book of Mormon and the church history. The 695 00:40:03.159 --> 00:40:05.159 only way that any of it makes any sense at 696 00:40:05.159 --> 00:40:08.920 all is if it's all made up, if it's literally 697 00:40:08.960 --> 00:40:11.880 all a lie or fake. And as soon as that 698 00:40:11.960 --> 00:40:15.440 occurred to me, it was like I allowed myself to 699 00:40:15.559 --> 00:40:18.679 consider that as a possibility for the first time, and 700 00:40:18.760 --> 00:40:21.679 it was like literally like coming out of a hypnosis. 701 00:40:21.760 --> 00:40:26.039 It was. It was so strange. It was so strange. 702 00:40:26.079 --> 00:40:30.280 It was like finally getting the getting the punchline to 703 00:40:30.360 --> 00:40:33.039 a joke that I hadn't gotten for over thirty years 704 00:40:33.119 --> 00:40:36.000 or something. It was like, wow, it was like this 705 00:40:36.159 --> 00:40:40.800 huge realization that there's no way, this is the only 706 00:40:40.840 --> 00:40:43.280 way any of this makes sense is if it's all fake, 707 00:40:45.400 --> 00:40:49.920 if it's fictional like Chronicles of Narnia or some fake shit. 708 00:40:50.079 --> 00:40:51.800 You know, like that's the only way and you know, the. 709 00:40:52.000 --> 00:40:52.800 Way to make sense of this. 710 00:40:54.519 --> 00:40:57.760 Yeah, And then it was like devastating. Then it was 711 00:40:57.840 --> 00:41:02.519 like heartbreaking because suddenly all these characters and the scriptures 712 00:41:02.559 --> 00:41:06.159 in the Book of Mormon, everybody who they were all 713 00:41:06.199 --> 00:41:11.079 my heroes, These were all characters that did these amazing 714 00:41:11.159 --> 00:41:13.920 things that were like examples to me since I was 715 00:41:13.960 --> 00:41:16.159 a child, you know, And now all of a sudden, 716 00:41:16.199 --> 00:41:18.320 I was like, wait, they're just they're not even real. 717 00:41:18.679 --> 00:41:23.800 They're literally just imaginary people that like Joseph Smith made 718 00:41:23.880 --> 00:41:29.039 up like a comic book. And that was like devastating, 719 00:41:29.159 --> 00:41:31.519 Like all of my role models and heroes since I 720 00:41:31.599 --> 00:41:34.639 was a kid, and like I realized were totally fictional, 721 00:41:34.800 --> 00:41:37.480 you know what I mean. So, I mean all of 722 00:41:37.519 --> 00:41:41.159 that like was a big unraveling. And then and then 723 00:41:41.159 --> 00:41:43.079 you go through all those levels of like, well what 724 00:41:43.280 --> 00:41:46.360 is real? Then, you know what I mean, Yeah. 725 00:41:46.360 --> 00:41:50.599 This starts a whole questioning. It's insane, yeah, and unravels. 726 00:41:50.599 --> 00:41:54.960 I had a similar experience like when I sort of 727 00:41:55.360 --> 00:41:58.199 start speaking out more online in like twenty twenty, and 728 00:41:58.239 --> 00:42:01.559 then a lot of like because I'm a raceed Catholic, right, 729 00:42:01.599 --> 00:42:03.519 so a lot of like Christians would come at me 730 00:42:03.760 --> 00:42:06.559 with like, oh, well why did the Catholic syst and 731 00:42:06.599 --> 00:42:08.960 why did that? And it was like for the first time, 732 00:42:09.079 --> 00:42:12.360 I was like whoa, Like I never received this sort 733 00:42:12.400 --> 00:42:14.320 of like how the preachers would come at you and 734 00:42:14.360 --> 00:42:17.400 be like get out of here. I'd be like, ah, 735 00:42:17.599 --> 00:42:21.360 like it just I never had that experience in like 736 00:42:21.440 --> 00:42:25.159 real life to that extent before. So it was pretty wild. 737 00:42:25.239 --> 00:42:30.519 And yeah, it makes you start to look at everything differently, right, get. 738 00:42:30.480 --> 00:42:33.280 Very defensive and like that's the thing that makes it 739 00:42:33.320 --> 00:42:36.760 so difficult as that. And I remember being this way 740 00:42:37.039 --> 00:42:40.239 as a member, when I was like an ingrained believer 741 00:42:40.400 --> 00:42:44.679 in the church and everything is that like when when 742 00:42:44.719 --> 00:42:47.039 I try to bring up things about the founder of 743 00:42:47.079 --> 00:42:49.760 the church, Joseph Smith, and be like have you ever 744 00:42:49.800 --> 00:42:53.639 thought about like why he married a fourteen year old girl? 745 00:42:54.360 --> 00:42:57.519 And like what is the whole deal with child brides anyways? 746 00:42:57.679 --> 00:43:00.840 Like and and all that. If you bring it up, 747 00:43:01.320 --> 00:43:03.639 even if it's just like a fair question or a 748 00:43:03.679 --> 00:43:08.440 logical thought to consider, they immediately jump to a response 749 00:43:08.559 --> 00:43:13.519 like you're offending Jesus, Like you're literally hurting the Lord 750 00:43:13.599 --> 00:43:16.719 because that's his prophet. And this is where you're not 751 00:43:16.719 --> 00:43:20.239 supposed to question it, you know. It's like touching. It's 752 00:43:20.280 --> 00:43:23.320 like it's like going into something that you're not even 753 00:43:23.360 --> 00:43:27.719 supposed to mention, you know, And so you're offending them, 754 00:43:27.800 --> 00:43:31.679 and you're offending the Spirit, and you're you're offending God 755 00:43:31.840 --> 00:43:36.000 just by bringing it up. And that's so built into 756 00:43:36.039 --> 00:43:40.320 you as a member of the church that even internally, 757 00:43:40.679 --> 00:43:43.599 like when you're sitting there alone by yourself and you 758 00:43:43.639 --> 00:43:47.079 start to have questions or a doubt pops in your mind. 759 00:43:47.760 --> 00:43:51.599 You even have protocol trained into you where you where 760 00:43:51.639 --> 00:43:55.320 you literally push that negative thought or that doubt away. 761 00:43:55.880 --> 00:43:58.639 There's these mantras like doubt your doubts that you're taught 762 00:43:58.719 --> 00:43:59.920 to repeat to yourself. 763 00:44:00.079 --> 00:44:02.599 Doubt your doubts, you know, out your doubts. 764 00:44:02.920 --> 00:44:05.280 That's literally one of the things that the prophet taught 765 00:44:05.559 --> 00:44:06.400 doubt your doubts. 766 00:44:06.440 --> 00:44:08.840 You know, it's lighting. 767 00:44:09.639 --> 00:44:12.480 And then you would say prayers and reconnect with the 768 00:44:12.480 --> 00:44:16.559 spirit again and immediately go back to reading the scripture. 769 00:44:16.599 --> 00:44:20.960 So it's basically like anti virus software kicks in within 770 00:44:21.000 --> 00:44:24.079 you and pushes you back into the church. And then 771 00:44:24.119 --> 00:44:28.239 you feel bad that you even doubted, like like you're guilty, 772 00:44:28.760 --> 00:44:34.119 like you yeah, even yourself within the loune, in the 773 00:44:34.239 --> 00:44:36.880 in the boundaries you know, all the time. And then 774 00:44:36.920 --> 00:44:40.840 as a father, you know, you do that within your household, 775 00:44:40.960 --> 00:44:43.320 you know, and as a couple, and so you're like 776 00:44:43.840 --> 00:44:46.360 taking your kids to church, teaching them to pray, getting 777 00:44:46.360 --> 00:44:50.360 them ready, and your whole family and everybody's watching you. 778 00:44:50.480 --> 00:44:54.199 But yeah, when all that comes unraveling on you, that's 779 00:44:54.239 --> 00:44:56.519 the big challenges because like as soon as you realize 780 00:44:56.559 --> 00:44:59.880 it's not true, like the Book of Mormon isn't real, 781 00:45:00.119 --> 00:45:03.920 Joseph Smith is a calm man. All this stuff comes unraveling. 782 00:45:05.079 --> 00:45:09.079 Then you're in the middle of this giant labyrinth that 783 00:45:09.119 --> 00:45:11.559 you've been running around your whole life like a rat 784 00:45:11.599 --> 00:45:14.960 in a maze, and you realize, I cannot get out 785 00:45:15.000 --> 00:45:20.079 of this without literally every friend that I have all 786 00:45:20.119 --> 00:45:23.079 the way back since my childhood, all the way through 787 00:45:23.159 --> 00:45:28.039 high school, my entire family, my wife, my kids, my 788 00:45:28.199 --> 00:45:32.119 in laws, everybody, and you're literally looking at your entire 789 00:45:32.320 --> 00:45:38.119 life that if you leave the church, they're all going 790 00:45:38.199 --> 00:45:42.000 to know, they're all going to look at you like great. Now, 791 00:45:42.159 --> 00:45:45.840 when Doomsday happens, when Jesus comes back and we're supposed 792 00:45:45.840 --> 00:45:48.559 to go in the wilderness to survive, you're not going 793 00:45:48.639 --> 00:45:51.559 to be there, you know. And then in the spirit 794 00:45:51.639 --> 00:45:54.880 world when we die in the afterlife, like, I'm not 795 00:45:54.960 --> 00:45:57.199 going to be in heaven with them anymore, neither are 796 00:45:57.199 --> 00:45:59.559 my kids, and so they're like all devastated, you know. 797 00:46:00.199 --> 00:46:03.159 So there's a huge amount of pressure around that. Like 798 00:46:04.039 --> 00:46:07.400 when when we actually decided we were going to leave 799 00:46:07.400 --> 00:46:10.559 the church, I even had a sister in law call 800 00:46:10.639 --> 00:46:14.000 me on the phone, and she was weeping and crying, 801 00:46:14.039 --> 00:46:17.159 and she was saying, how like when we're supposed to 802 00:46:17.199 --> 00:46:20.679 go into the wilderness to survive, where are you going 803 00:46:20.719 --> 00:46:22.639 to be? You're not going to be there? Where's your 804 00:46:22.679 --> 00:46:25.079 kids going to be? And she was like crying to 805 00:46:25.119 --> 00:46:28.239 me on the phone. And that was all because they 806 00:46:28.280 --> 00:46:30.800 were reading those books that Chad dave Bell wrote, that 807 00:46:30.840 --> 00:46:33.920 guy that murdered his kids in the backyard. They were 808 00:46:33.960 --> 00:46:37.719 all those doomsday books. Like her and my brother and everybody, 809 00:46:37.719 --> 00:46:40.400 they were all reading those books when they were saying that. 810 00:46:40.440 --> 00:46:41.880 And that's part of why I got out of the 811 00:46:41.960 --> 00:46:44.639 church too, was like this is too too wild, Like 812 00:46:45.639 --> 00:46:49.119 this is crazy, you know. But yeah, there was there's 813 00:46:49.199 --> 00:46:54.000 all that family pressure and we had to move. Like 814 00:46:54.039 --> 00:46:57.559 we were living in Idaho in a town called Pocatello, 815 00:46:58.320 --> 00:47:01.159 and I was in a leadership position at the church 816 00:47:01.199 --> 00:47:05.960 at the time, in the high priest group leadership. And 817 00:47:06.000 --> 00:47:09.079 then it literally occurred to me that the church wasn't true. 818 00:47:09.320 --> 00:47:12.039 And I talked to my wife about it and she 819 00:47:12.199 --> 00:47:15.119 kind of realized that too. We talked about it for 820 00:47:15.159 --> 00:47:18.400 like three months and we realized, like we have to move, 821 00:47:18.559 --> 00:47:20.760 we have to move out of the state and then 822 00:47:20.920 --> 00:47:23.159 leave the church, because if we leave the church now, 823 00:47:23.280 --> 00:47:27.480 like every day somebody's going to come over and drive 824 00:47:27.559 --> 00:47:31.039 us space, Like we're never going to get away from it. 825 00:47:31.159 --> 00:47:33.320 So to be on the on the receiving end of 826 00:47:33.440 --> 00:47:37.800 the Mormon missionaries, you're like, no, Yeah. 827 00:47:38.119 --> 00:47:40.559 Even when we did move and we got out of 828 00:47:40.599 --> 00:47:43.760 the church. After we moved down to southern Utah, even 829 00:47:43.800 --> 00:47:48.000 the local church members, like within within two weeks they 830 00:47:48.280 --> 00:47:51.280 sent like eight different group star house. There was like 831 00:47:51.960 --> 00:47:54.960 a group of kids came over, the young women's came over, 832 00:47:57.159 --> 00:48:00.199 Home teachers came over, the elder scorn came over. There 833 00:48:00.239 --> 00:48:03.920 was multiple different groups from the church and and couples 834 00:48:03.960 --> 00:48:06.599 and things like that that came over and tried to 835 00:48:06.599 --> 00:48:08.559 talk to my wife and my kids when I wasn't 836 00:48:08.599 --> 00:48:13.360 home and everything to try and get us to go back. Yeah, 837 00:48:13.639 --> 00:48:17.559 we had to. We had to use lawyers, an organization 838 00:48:17.679 --> 00:48:21.239 out of Salt Lake City called quit lds dot org, 839 00:48:22.320 --> 00:48:26.119 and they actually filed paperwork with the church that made 840 00:48:26.119 --> 00:48:28.920 it stop where it said if anybody from the church 841 00:48:29.000 --> 00:48:32.239 comes and tries to talk to me or my family 842 00:48:32.320 --> 00:48:35.719 or my kids, that it would be considered religious harassment 843 00:48:36.440 --> 00:48:38.320 because they literally wouldn't leave us alone. 844 00:48:38.960 --> 00:48:41.000 Wow, that's crazy. 845 00:48:41.519 --> 00:48:44.840 Yeh see see I grew up Jehovah's Witness. 846 00:48:45.599 --> 00:48:49.880 Yeah, and it's kind of the opposite would happen. I 847 00:48:49.920 --> 00:48:53.199 feel like they would if you, if you decided to 848 00:48:53.280 --> 00:48:56.719 leave we're back at It's kind of a similar thing, 849 00:48:56.880 --> 00:48:59.960 but instead of them hounding you in the entire family 850 00:49:00.000 --> 00:49:04.119 and people showing up, every single person you've known your entire. 851 00:49:03.920 --> 00:49:07.760 Life just completely cuts contact from you and they don't 852 00:49:07.800 --> 00:49:09.960 talk to you at all, just shunned. 853 00:49:10.400 --> 00:49:12.280 Like scientology does that, I think. 854 00:49:12.159 --> 00:49:17.000 Right, Yeah, it's like the same thing that's wild. 855 00:49:17.400 --> 00:49:20.480 Yeah, there's a mix of that. So the family kind 856 00:49:20.519 --> 00:49:23.960 of all does that. So it's really tricky. So like 857 00:49:24.639 --> 00:49:28.119 all of my nephews, most of my family, a lot 858 00:49:28.119 --> 00:49:31.440 of my cousins and siblings, my sister in laws and stuff. 859 00:49:31.519 --> 00:49:35.400 Basically they all just unfollowed me and blocked me online 860 00:49:35.400 --> 00:49:39.000 because they're afraid that I'm going to post something about 861 00:49:39.119 --> 00:49:42.039 the church, that I'm going to post a video or 862 00:49:42.079 --> 00:49:44.159 the fact that I'm doing an interview right now with 863 00:49:44.280 --> 00:49:46.840 you guys. This is going to get clipped or could 864 00:49:46.880 --> 00:49:49.519 get made into an Instagram reel and I might share it, 865 00:49:50.039 --> 00:49:54.519 and then they're gonna hear it. So now my brother, 866 00:49:54.719 --> 00:49:57.239 his wife and his kids that go all the way 867 00:49:57.280 --> 00:49:59.760 down to like thirteen years old are going to see 868 00:50:00.079 --> 00:50:05.360 Carl talking bad about the Temple and about the Mormon 869 00:50:05.440 --> 00:50:08.800 Church and about and they all still believe it, you know. 870 00:50:09.440 --> 00:50:12.639 So it's safer and easier for them to just do that, 871 00:50:12.719 --> 00:50:16.039 to cut me off, to shun me, to not follow 872 00:50:16.079 --> 00:50:19.800 me online, and they'll invite me to things and stuff. 873 00:50:19.840 --> 00:50:21.480 But I can tell, like when I show up to 874 00:50:21.559 --> 00:50:25.760 family events, it's like like they all have to edit 875 00:50:25.840 --> 00:50:29.519 themselves around me, like their normal way of talking, how 876 00:50:29.519 --> 00:50:32.679 they would how they would gather to pray around dinner 877 00:50:32.719 --> 00:50:35.519 and everything. There's everybody's glancing at me like am I 878 00:50:35.599 --> 00:50:37.599 going to say something or cause a scene, you know, 879 00:50:37.679 --> 00:50:41.320 Like it's just like a weird aura because I've left 880 00:50:41.320 --> 00:50:44.760 the church now, so I'm not one of them, you know, 881 00:50:45.719 --> 00:50:49.599 on the house. But now all these things have happened, 882 00:50:49.599 --> 00:50:53.880 where like they were, they swore that the end times 883 00:50:53.880 --> 00:50:55.880 were going to happen. They swore Jesus was going to 884 00:50:55.960 --> 00:50:58.920 come back, the New Jerusalem was going to be built, 885 00:50:58.960 --> 00:51:02.440 the prophecies, the moons, all this stuff written in the books, 886 00:51:02.440 --> 00:51:05.239 and now not only has none of that come true. 887 00:51:05.280 --> 00:51:09.159 But chat Dabell and his wife are in prison, and 888 00:51:09.239 --> 00:51:12.320 like all these other things have happened, and the Internet 889 00:51:12.480 --> 00:51:16.760 just keeps chugging along showing like you can get on 890 00:51:16.880 --> 00:51:21.280 chat GPT and you can say is there evidence of 891 00:51:21.320 --> 00:51:24.480 plagiarism in the Book of Mormon, and chat GPT within 892 00:51:24.559 --> 00:51:28.119 like five seconds will say, yes, there is in this chapter, 893 00:51:28.159 --> 00:51:29.599 in this chapter, in this chapter, da da da da 894 00:51:29.639 --> 00:51:31.679 da da da, And it will literally explain to you 895 00:51:32.920 --> 00:51:37.400 where there's like flat out evidence of plagiarism and scamming 896 00:51:37.559 --> 00:51:40.920 in the Mormon scriptures and stuff. And so there's no 897 00:51:41.119 --> 00:51:44.719 excuse except for putting the blinders on, like just like 898 00:51:44.800 --> 00:51:46.960 I'm just going to believe and just continue to have 899 00:51:47.079 --> 00:51:51.639 my faith, you know. Yeah, you have to want to believe, 900 00:51:51.719 --> 00:51:54.119 you know. And in the end that's going to create 901 00:51:54.239 --> 00:52:00.280 like a really really passionate Orthodox core that's going to 902 00:52:00.360 --> 00:52:03.800 cling on to it like a barnacle to the end, 903 00:52:04.000 --> 00:52:06.480 you know, and there they'll always be there. That's just 904 00:52:06.519 --> 00:52:10.280 like why there's still polygamous uh in Utah and stuff 905 00:52:10.280 --> 00:52:13.199 that are still practicing polygamy knowing that it's illegal, they'll 906 00:52:13.239 --> 00:52:16.559 just cling on to those beliefs like like it has 907 00:52:16.639 --> 00:52:18.840 to be true, like they're hanging on to a rope. 908 00:52:18.960 --> 00:52:19.159 You know. 909 00:52:20.480 --> 00:52:24.639 It's so interesting that you never it never occurred to 910 00:52:24.679 --> 00:52:27.920 you till you like stepped outside of your bubble, right, 911 00:52:28.639 --> 00:52:30.679 you know, like when you started doing the missionary work 912 00:52:30.719 --> 00:52:32.679 and whatnot, and like that's the first time you really 913 00:52:32.760 --> 00:52:37.280 encountered like any opposition. And then like but when you 914 00:52:37.320 --> 00:52:40.920 were in your group and doing the rituals and whatever, 915 00:52:41.239 --> 00:52:44.440 you had that sense of like something is a miss, 916 00:52:45.039 --> 00:52:47.519 but you shoved it down right, And I think it 917 00:52:47.679 --> 00:52:50.400 just like that reminds me of like the whole you know, 918 00:52:50.480 --> 00:52:53.119 twenty twenty experience that we all had. It's like a 919 00:52:53.119 --> 00:52:55.000 lot of us knew something was a miss, but then 920 00:52:55.119 --> 00:52:58.960 like just stade quiet because it's like you're looking at 921 00:52:58.960 --> 00:53:01.079 everyone around you, and every one around you is doing it, 922 00:53:01.079 --> 00:53:05.519 so you're like, I guess it's okay then, right, or 923 00:53:05.760 --> 00:53:07.159 I don't want to be the one to like poke 924 00:53:07.159 --> 00:53:08.960 my head up. Like it takes a lot of courage 925 00:53:09.079 --> 00:53:11.920 to do what you did and basically blow up your 926 00:53:11.920 --> 00:53:16.639 whole life because you realize the truth and you understanding 927 00:53:16.719 --> 00:53:18.360 your truth right, it. 928 00:53:18.440 --> 00:53:23.239 Really can be devastating and very very terrifying, and you 929 00:53:23.400 --> 00:53:26.239 have to be someone like like I was always one 930 00:53:26.239 --> 00:53:30.079 of those kids that was like I would I wanted justice, 931 00:53:30.159 --> 00:53:32.880 you know, like if somebody stole something from me, like 932 00:53:32.960 --> 00:53:35.039 in school as a kid, I wanted to track it 933 00:53:35.079 --> 00:53:37.880 down and make it right. You know, if somebody lied 934 00:53:37.920 --> 00:53:39.679 to me, I want them to go confront him. And 935 00:53:39.719 --> 00:53:42.440 I was kind of like one of those types of 936 00:53:42.519 --> 00:53:47.039 kids and stuff, and so you know, it was it 937 00:53:47.079 --> 00:53:50.760 goes two ways. Yeah, Like I think traveling and getting 938 00:53:50.760 --> 00:53:55.880 out and opening up yourself to the world, you are 939 00:53:56.000 --> 00:53:59.840 exposed to things that suddenly you realize the punchline to 940 00:53:59.880 --> 00:54:03.199 the joke, or you hear this thing about church history 941 00:54:03.360 --> 00:54:06.840 that you can't unhear, and then it will just sit 942 00:54:06.920 --> 00:54:09.400 and eat at you. It's just like a thorn. You know. 943 00:54:09.599 --> 00:54:12.719 They call it like breaking your shelf. It's like you 944 00:54:12.800 --> 00:54:14.639 learn a thing, and it's like you pick up that 945 00:54:14.760 --> 00:54:17.079 book that you just learned that thing, and you put 946 00:54:17.119 --> 00:54:19.719 it on the shelf. How many things can you hear 947 00:54:20.039 --> 00:54:23.480 about the church that you realize are bad until your 948 00:54:23.480 --> 00:54:26.679 shelf actually caves in and breaks and you realize that 949 00:54:26.760 --> 00:54:29.519 it's not good. But the problem is is that your 950 00:54:29.559 --> 00:54:34.960 whole life until that moment happens, you're taught and programmed, 951 00:54:35.199 --> 00:54:39.920 and the cycle is that you're the problem. You're the 952 00:54:39.960 --> 00:54:43.760 one that's the odd one out. You're the common denominator. Like, 953 00:54:43.800 --> 00:54:46.639 look at everyone else in your family is doing fine, 954 00:54:47.159 --> 00:54:49.880 all your friends, the whole community has no problem with 955 00:54:49.960 --> 00:54:52.519 any of this. And now here I am. I haven't 956 00:54:52.519 --> 00:54:56.280 gone to church in three months, and everyone knows. They 957 00:54:56.280 --> 00:54:58.599 know I'm not there. You know, they literally take roll 958 00:54:58.679 --> 00:55:01.360 every Sunday and they know on not there, they're going 959 00:55:01.400 --> 00:55:03.800 to start sending my friends over to invite me back, 960 00:55:03.920 --> 00:55:07.679 you know. And so you just always have this built 961 00:55:07.920 --> 00:55:11.440 in pressure that like as soon as you start feeling 962 00:55:11.519 --> 00:55:14.400 like I don't like this. Like, for example, growing up, 963 00:55:14.440 --> 00:55:17.320 one of the things was the church started being really 964 00:55:17.320 --> 00:55:21.639 big on when you're a deacon, you're basically like twelve 965 00:55:21.719 --> 00:55:26.559 years old, and that's when you start passing the communion 966 00:55:26.760 --> 00:55:31.239 or the sacrament. So the bread and the water gets blessed, 967 00:55:31.280 --> 00:55:34.559 and Catholic churches bread and wine, right, and we do 968 00:55:34.599 --> 00:55:37.719 bread and water and Mormon church because they don't drink alcohol, 969 00:55:38.239 --> 00:55:40.639 so it's like bread and water. It's literally just like 970 00:55:40.639 --> 00:55:43.119 a loaf of bread, wonder bread from the store that 971 00:55:43.159 --> 00:55:47.000 they wow. Yeah, but they do like a whole prayer 972 00:55:47.199 --> 00:55:49.480 that they recite and they read it off of a card, 973 00:55:49.920 --> 00:55:55.199 and then the deacons get up and pass the sacrament around, 974 00:55:55.239 --> 00:55:57.239 so you carry the trays of the bread and then 975 00:55:57.280 --> 00:55:59.760 the water around when and you're like a little kid, 976 00:56:00.360 --> 00:56:04.119 and they started instituting this thing like you can't pass 977 00:56:04.199 --> 00:56:07.599 the sacrament as a deacon unless you have a white 978 00:56:07.639 --> 00:56:10.400 shirt on. And so it was like a whole thing 979 00:56:10.639 --> 00:56:13.840 because my family was like poor. I literally went to 980 00:56:13.960 --> 00:56:16.239 church for several Sundays and all I had was like 981 00:56:16.239 --> 00:56:18.920 a denim shirt exactly like I'm wearing now that I 982 00:56:18.960 --> 00:56:22.400 wore a church And because of that, literally, because of 983 00:56:22.440 --> 00:56:25.800 the color of my shirt, I couldn't pass the sacrament. 984 00:56:25.960 --> 00:56:30.880 So I was like unworthy and couldn't participate in the 985 00:56:31.039 --> 00:56:34.000 ordinance and pass the sacrament even if I wanted to, 986 00:56:34.760 --> 00:56:37.639 literally because of the color of my shirt. And that 987 00:56:37.719 --> 00:56:41.360 was like the first thing as a kid where I 988 00:56:41.440 --> 00:56:44.679 started thinking, like when my mom finally got me a 989 00:56:44.679 --> 00:56:47.079 white shirt so that I could do it, I thought, 990 00:56:47.360 --> 00:56:50.880 I thought to myself, if I had a closet that 991 00:56:51.000 --> 00:56:53.559 was full of shirts and at one end was perfectly 992 00:56:53.599 --> 00:56:56.280 white and at the other end was like a black shirt, 993 00:56:56.559 --> 00:57:00.159 and every Sunday, I just went one shade grayer all 994 00:57:00.159 --> 00:57:02.679 the way, Like, at what point would they say that 995 00:57:02.760 --> 00:57:06.639 I wasn't worthy anymore? Like what shade of color do 996 00:57:06.719 --> 00:57:09.559 I have to be where I can't participate? And I 997 00:57:09.639 --> 00:57:12.960 had all those kinds of experiences where I realized I 998 00:57:13.000 --> 00:57:15.639 didn't fit in or like the church wasn't working for me. 999 00:57:16.239 --> 00:57:18.599 But I always felt like I was the problem, Like 1000 00:57:18.719 --> 00:57:21.599 I was the stubborn one. Why can't everybody else is 1001 00:57:21.639 --> 00:57:23.599 fine just putting on a white shirt? Why do I 1002 00:57:23.679 --> 00:57:26.800 have to be this little pill? You know that like 1003 00:57:27.119 --> 00:57:30.599 is stubborn and causes a problem and goes to church 1004 00:57:30.679 --> 00:57:34.559 on purpose with a DMIM shirt on, like as a protest. 1005 00:57:34.599 --> 00:57:34.760 You know. 1006 00:57:34.880 --> 00:57:37.519 I was like that kid, Like I would go like 1007 00:57:37.920 --> 00:57:40.400 and they would say who wants to pass the sacrament? 1008 00:57:40.440 --> 00:57:43.679 And I would raise my hand, knowing I'm wearing the 1009 00:57:43.719 --> 00:57:46.239 wrong color shirt and to make them tell me I 1010 00:57:46.239 --> 00:57:48.840 couldn't do it, you know, Like, And I was kind 1011 00:57:48.880 --> 00:57:51.840 of like that as a kid. So it makes sense 1012 00:57:51.880 --> 00:57:54.519 that ultimately I would get out of the church and 1013 00:57:54.639 --> 00:57:57.760 other people wouldn't because I was kind of always a 1014 00:57:57.760 --> 00:58:01.239 little bit stubborn that way. Even for me, it was 1015 00:58:01.639 --> 00:58:05.480 it was super hard, and it did cost me everything. 1016 00:58:05.519 --> 00:58:07.719 When we finally left the church and got out of it, 1017 00:58:09.519 --> 00:58:11.920 you look back through your life and you realize, like 1018 00:58:12.760 --> 00:58:14.880 the whole reason, like we felt like we were supposed 1019 00:58:14.920 --> 00:58:17.920 to get married because we prayed about it in the temple, 1020 00:58:18.679 --> 00:58:20.920 you know, So if that's not real, what do we 1021 00:58:20.960 --> 00:58:23.760 even what do we even know? What even is real anymore? 1022 00:58:24.280 --> 00:58:26.760 And so like it can cost you your marriage, it 1023 00:58:26.800 --> 00:58:31.239 can cost you your family, can you can go through 1024 00:58:31.440 --> 00:58:34.400 a lot, you know, And then you're also left, like 1025 00:58:35.400 --> 00:58:39.920 if you've had strange experiences in your life, or or 1026 00:58:40.719 --> 00:58:45.280 spiritual experiences or paranormal encounters, you're left wondering, well, what 1027 00:58:45.360 --> 00:58:48.559 about all that? You know, because you used to explain 1028 00:58:48.599 --> 00:58:51.559 it all through the church and through the scriptures of 1029 00:58:51.840 --> 00:58:54.920 what's going on now? And so that's kind of why 1030 00:58:54.960 --> 00:58:59.039 I'm doing what I do now, looking into UFOs and 1031 00:58:59.119 --> 00:59:02.280 paranormal stuff like that, because even though I'm not a 1032 00:59:02.320 --> 00:59:04.719 member of the church, I still look back at my 1033 00:59:04.840 --> 00:59:07.800 life growing up as a kid in the church and 1034 00:59:07.840 --> 00:59:11.639 even on my mission and stuff, and I have to 1035 00:59:11.760 --> 00:59:14.960 wonder about a lot of the things that happened that 1036 00:59:15.519 --> 00:59:19.360 I thought were miracles or that I thought was literally 1037 00:59:19.400 --> 00:59:22.719 like a psychic experience where I was given an answer 1038 00:59:22.760 --> 00:59:25.239 to a prayer and so is someone else and we 1039 00:59:25.360 --> 00:59:27.960 both got the same answer. And so I'm like still 1040 00:59:28.039 --> 00:59:31.039 super curious about, like, well what happened there, because something 1041 00:59:31.119 --> 00:59:34.159 actually did happen, But if it had nothing to do 1042 00:59:34.239 --> 00:59:37.000 with being a Mormon, then what was it? You know? 1043 00:59:37.159 --> 00:59:39.159 And can I still do it? You know, even though 1044 00:59:39.159 --> 00:59:41.280 I'm not a member? Can I can it still work? 1045 00:59:41.440 --> 00:59:44.519 You know? So all that stuff is really interesting to 1046 00:59:44.559 --> 00:59:48.079 go through, so good questions. 1047 00:59:49.079 --> 00:59:51.760 I totally have had the same experience kind of like 1048 00:59:51.840 --> 00:59:55.639 where we're at one point. You know, I'm not a 1049 00:59:55.719 --> 00:59:59.159 Jehovah's witness, but those beliefs are still pretty ingrained in 1050 00:59:59.199 --> 01:00:04.079 my head where I'm using just their prayers, just their Bible, 1051 01:00:05.039 --> 01:00:10.400 but I've had what seemed like prayers answered in that way. 1052 01:00:12.800 --> 01:00:16.920 Yeah, Like yeah, Like when I was a missionary, for example, 1053 01:00:17.000 --> 01:00:21.239 You're like you're swimming in religion and in the Church 1054 01:00:21.280 --> 01:00:24.920 and Mormonism and the scriptures all day. Like from the 1055 01:00:25.000 --> 01:00:27.960 second that you wake up, you literally roll out of 1056 01:00:27.960 --> 01:00:30.280 your bread, your bed, and you get on your knees 1057 01:00:30.320 --> 01:00:32.760 and say your morning prayer and then you go in 1058 01:00:32.800 --> 01:00:35.320 with your mission companion the other guy that you're living with. 1059 01:00:35.679 --> 01:00:39.480 You pray together, then you study the scriptures together, you 1060 01:00:39.519 --> 01:00:43.840 study alone, and then you practice your missionary just like 1061 01:00:43.920 --> 01:00:47.920 your whole day is literally just swimming in the church. 1062 01:00:48.079 --> 01:00:52.360 And so we used to, like, you know, we would 1063 01:00:52.360 --> 01:00:54.800 get put two of us in this apartment in this 1064 01:00:54.960 --> 01:00:59.320 small town, and there would be this like area that 1065 01:00:59.360 --> 01:01:02.000 we're supposed to cover, that we're responsible for, and it's 1066 01:01:02.039 --> 01:01:05.920 literally our job just to go out and talk to people, 1067 01:01:06.280 --> 01:01:09.000 find people who are members of the church and have left, 1068 01:01:09.360 --> 01:01:12.079 and then just go knock doors and try to recruit 1069 01:01:12.119 --> 01:01:16.039 people and do service projects. And then like every Friday 1070 01:01:16.119 --> 01:01:18.440 night they call and you have to tell them how 1071 01:01:18.480 --> 01:01:20.440 many people you talk to, how many copies of the 1072 01:01:20.480 --> 01:01:23.199 Book of Mormon you gave out, all that stuff. So 1073 01:01:23.239 --> 01:01:25.760 it's like you're just swimming in out all the time. 1074 01:01:26.679 --> 01:01:29.519 And we would get in this community and you would 1075 01:01:29.519 --> 01:01:33.679 be like nothing's going on. Like we're literally walking around 1076 01:01:34.199 --> 01:01:37.599 like Walmart or the Kroger, and we're trying to talk 1077 01:01:37.639 --> 01:01:41.519 to strangers at the fishing section about things and nobody 1078 01:01:41.639 --> 01:01:44.519 is talking to us. Like knocking on doors and they 1079 01:01:44.559 --> 01:01:46.920 just open the door and slam the door in our face, 1080 01:01:47.000 --> 01:01:50.480 Like we're going to have to on Fridays coming they're 1081 01:01:50.519 --> 01:01:53.159 gonna call us and we're gonna have zeros, Like we 1082 01:01:53.239 --> 01:01:56.320 haven't given out anything, you know. So you get desperate. 1083 01:01:56.599 --> 01:01:59.679 So you have one or two choices. You either as 1084 01:01:59.679 --> 01:02:03.760 a missionary, you either lie when that phone rings and 1085 01:02:03.760 --> 01:02:06.039 you say, oh, yeah, we gave out three copies of 1086 01:02:06.039 --> 01:02:08.119 the Book of Mormon and we talked to ten people. 1087 01:02:08.760 --> 01:02:11.079 We talk and you make up numbers even though you 1088 01:02:11.360 --> 01:02:16.159 talk to nobody, or you get desperate with your faith 1089 01:02:16.239 --> 01:02:19.360 and you start praying for miracles like hardcore and you 1090 01:02:19.400 --> 01:02:22.079 put it to the test, like God, we're gonna you 1091 01:02:22.119 --> 01:02:25.000 need to send us people like and so that's what 1092 01:02:25.079 --> 01:02:29.320 we did this one time in Jacksonville. And it's funny 1093 01:02:29.360 --> 01:02:31.280 looking back on it now because it was one hundred 1094 01:02:31.320 --> 01:02:34.239 percent like a remote viewing that we did. It was 1095 01:02:34.280 --> 01:02:38.639 a straight up Stanford Research Institute remote viewing protocol that 1096 01:02:38.679 --> 01:02:41.599 we did. But we were just literally like trying to 1097 01:02:41.599 --> 01:02:44.519 figure out who who in this town needs us as 1098 01:02:44.559 --> 01:02:47.400 missionaries to come and talk to them today. And what 1099 01:02:47.440 --> 01:02:49.480 we did was we got a we got a map 1100 01:02:49.480 --> 01:02:52.400 of the town out and we laid it on the 1101 01:02:52.480 --> 01:02:56.199 kitchen table in the apartment and then what we did 1102 01:02:56.440 --> 01:03:01.039 was I went in the bedroom and I closed the door, 1103 01:03:01.079 --> 01:03:03.000 so I was by myself, and then I left my 1104 01:03:03.239 --> 01:03:06.440 mission companion out there with the map. And what we 1105 01:03:06.480 --> 01:03:11.039 did was I prayed for him to receive inspiration from 1106 01:03:11.039 --> 01:03:13.639 God as to where we were supposed to go, exactly 1107 01:03:13.679 --> 01:03:15.840 on the map, where are we supposed to go today? 1108 01:03:16.440 --> 01:03:18.760 And then when he felt like he got an answer, 1109 01:03:18.840 --> 01:03:21.920 he was supposed to write it down and then fold 1110 01:03:21.960 --> 01:03:24.320 it up and hide it in his pocket, and then 1111 01:03:24.320 --> 01:03:26.639 when he was done, he would come knock on the door, 1112 01:03:26.679 --> 01:03:29.599 and then we would trade and he would pray for me. Well, 1113 01:03:29.639 --> 01:03:32.039 I looked at the map, so that's what we did, 1114 01:03:32.800 --> 01:03:35.880 and so I went in and prayed for him, and 1115 01:03:35.920 --> 01:03:38.719 pretty soon he came and knocked on the door. We traded, 1116 01:03:39.119 --> 01:03:41.239 and then I looked at the map and I sat 1117 01:03:41.280 --> 01:03:43.519 there while he was in there praying for me. And 1118 01:03:43.639 --> 01:03:47.159 immediately in my mind it was like the name Cherry 1119 01:03:47.199 --> 01:03:50.840 Street came to me, like Cherry Street immediately. It was 1120 01:03:50.880 --> 01:03:52.639 like I saw it immediately. So I was like, okay, 1121 01:03:53.199 --> 01:03:55.039 So I wrote it down on my piece of paper 1122 01:03:55.159 --> 01:03:57.519 and then it was like nothing, like I got no 1123 01:03:57.760 --> 01:04:00.880 other names. I just sat there. It was like nothing 1124 01:04:00.920 --> 01:04:03.880 felt right, So I felt weird and I just sat 1125 01:04:03.880 --> 01:04:06.199 there for a minute, looked at a couple of others. 1126 01:04:06.239 --> 01:04:07.960 So I wrote like two more down on the piece 1127 01:04:08.000 --> 01:04:10.519 of paper, and I thought, well, that didn't work, you know, 1128 01:04:11.480 --> 01:04:16.199 So I went and knocked on the door. Got my 1129 01:04:16.199 --> 01:04:18.239 mission companion. He came out and I said, well, I 1130 01:04:18.280 --> 01:04:21.400 don't know if this worked or not. So we pulled 1131 01:04:21.400 --> 01:04:24.719 out our pieces of paper and he says, well, I 1132 01:04:24.760 --> 01:04:27.000 don't think it worked because I only wrote down one 1133 01:04:27.599 --> 01:04:30.039 and he unfolds this piece of paper and it says 1134 01:04:30.199 --> 01:04:34.519 Cherry Street, like out of the whole city, out of 1135 01:04:34.559 --> 01:04:37.960 all of Jacksonville, Arkansas. We both at the top of 1136 01:04:37.960 --> 01:04:41.800 the list both wrote down Cherry Street. So we were like, hey, 1137 01:04:42.440 --> 01:04:45.480 there's the answer God told us, you know. So we 1138 01:04:45.519 --> 01:04:48.519 like finished getting ready and everything, we like got on 1139 01:04:48.599 --> 01:04:52.800 our on our bikes and we rode across town and 1140 01:04:52.840 --> 01:04:54.960 we went to Cherry Street. We like hooked up our bikes, 1141 01:04:55.840 --> 01:04:59.000 and this is where it got weird because like when 1142 01:04:59.000 --> 01:05:01.679 we got to Cherry Street, we normally what we would 1143 01:05:01.719 --> 01:05:04.320 do was knock on every single door. So we'd knock 1144 01:05:04.480 --> 01:05:06.599 on every door down one side of the street and 1145 01:05:06.599 --> 01:05:08.480 then cross the street and knock on all the doors 1146 01:05:08.480 --> 01:05:10.079 all the way back, and then we're back where we 1147 01:05:10.119 --> 01:05:13.440 parked our bikes and so, but this time we parked 1148 01:05:13.440 --> 01:05:15.960 our bikes and for some reason, we just like walked 1149 01:05:16.000 --> 01:05:19.719 past like the first three or four houses and didn't 1150 01:05:19.719 --> 01:05:22.880 even go up to him. We're just like walking like, 1151 01:05:23.199 --> 01:05:26.000 that's not it, that's not it, and we weren't really 1152 01:05:26.079 --> 01:05:28.840 questioning it. And then all of a sudden, there's a 1153 01:05:28.880 --> 01:05:32.119 truck in this driveway that has Idaho license plates on it, 1154 01:05:32.239 --> 01:05:35.400 which is like where I'm from. I'm like, no way, Idaho, 1155 01:05:35.519 --> 01:05:37.760 I'm like and I literally just said, hey, this is it. 1156 01:05:38.480 --> 01:05:41.400 So we went up to the door and knocked, and 1157 01:05:41.480 --> 01:05:45.800 this lady she opens the door and immediately sees us 1158 01:05:45.800 --> 01:05:49.760 and just starts bawling. She just starts crying, and she goes, 1159 01:05:49.800 --> 01:05:53.159 how did you know? How did you know? And we 1160 01:05:53.159 --> 01:05:56.440 were like, what's going on? She just starts crying, and 1161 01:05:56.440 --> 01:05:59.719 we're like, well, hey, I'm a missionary from Idaho and 1162 01:05:59.760 --> 01:06:02.599 we saw your truck out here with Idaho plates and 1163 01:06:02.639 --> 01:06:05.880 we were just like praying to God who needed our 1164 01:06:05.920 --> 01:06:08.840 help today and we were supposed to come and talk 1165 01:06:08.880 --> 01:06:12.400 to you, and so she lets us in, tells us 1166 01:06:12.760 --> 01:06:16.360 she goes, oh, yeah, my husband was a Mormon, never 1167 01:06:16.400 --> 01:06:19.440 went to church or anything. But just like a week ago, 1168 01:06:19.599 --> 01:06:23.440 he drowned in a boating accident and she was there 1169 01:06:23.480 --> 01:06:26.400 by herself trying to pack up all of her stuff 1170 01:06:26.480 --> 01:06:28.159 to try and move out of her house and had 1171 01:06:28.239 --> 01:06:33.440 no help. And she said that it was like she 1172 01:06:33.719 --> 01:06:37.039 prayed for someone to come help her, and right when 1173 01:06:37.079 --> 01:06:39.199 she prayed, we knocked on the door. 1174 01:06:39.920 --> 01:06:40.039 Right. 1175 01:06:42.400 --> 01:06:45.679 I don't know how so to me as a missionary, 1176 01:06:45.719 --> 01:06:49.719 I'm like, church is true, Like this is real. That 1177 01:06:49.800 --> 01:06:53.079 was a real miracle, you know what I mean. But 1178 01:06:53.440 --> 01:06:58.039 I mean since then, even not as a member of 1179 01:06:58.119 --> 01:07:01.760 the church, out of the church, being an ex Mormon, 1180 01:07:02.400 --> 01:07:09.159 I've had just as many amazing telepathic and spiritual experiences 1181 01:07:09.239 --> 01:07:12.159 like that since where I've known I was supposed to 1182 01:07:12.199 --> 01:07:14.400 go help somebody, and I've called them or gone and 1183 01:07:14.440 --> 01:07:17.480 helped them, same kind of thing. But as a missionary, 1184 01:07:17.519 --> 01:07:20.719 when I was like nineteen twenty years old, that was like, 1185 01:07:21.920 --> 01:07:25.239 holy shit, this is real, this is real, Like we 1186 01:07:25.320 --> 01:07:27.840 knew right where to go. First story knocked on. She 1187 01:07:28.000 --> 01:07:31.079 was literally praying for someone to come help her. And 1188 01:07:31.119 --> 01:07:34.760 it was even crazier because where she was moving to 1189 01:07:35.199 --> 01:07:38.199 she packed up all of her stuff to go back 1190 01:07:38.239 --> 01:07:41.039 and move back with her family, and where she was 1191 01:07:41.079 --> 01:07:44.480 moving to was in back to North Carolina, which was 1192 01:07:44.519 --> 01:07:48.119 where my brother was on his mission. So I was 1193 01:07:48.159 --> 01:07:50.880 actually able to get permission to call my brother. So 1194 01:07:50.920 --> 01:07:53.280 I helped her pack her stuff up and helped her move, 1195 01:07:54.000 --> 01:07:58.079 and then she ended up getting help unpacking and moving 1196 01:07:58.079 --> 01:08:02.000 into her house with my brother in North Carolina. Like, 1197 01:08:02.039 --> 01:08:05.280 the odds of it were just crazy to me, like 1198 01:08:05.880 --> 01:08:09.679 how that all happened, But we definitely like we connected 1199 01:08:09.719 --> 01:08:15.199 to something like to her, to me, the map, the 1200 01:08:15.199 --> 01:08:18.199 the intentions to try and help someone that needed help 1201 01:08:18.279 --> 01:08:21.640 that day, there was really something magical to that. I 1202 01:08:21.640 --> 01:08:24.279 don't think it had anything necessarily to do with being 1203 01:08:24.880 --> 01:08:27.720 a missionary or a member of the church, but it 1204 01:08:27.800 --> 01:08:31.279 definitely put us in our consciousness in that right formula 1205 01:08:31.399 --> 01:08:34.399 to where it happened, you know, where that that really 1206 01:08:34.439 --> 01:08:40.560 took place. Yeah, that was one of those cool ones, 1207 01:08:42.000 --> 01:08:42.520 very cool. 1208 01:08:43.159 --> 01:08:43.840 That's bugged out. 1209 01:08:43.920 --> 01:08:45.000 Yeah, that's a wild story. 1210 01:08:45.880 --> 01:08:48.119 Yeah, a lot of people, you know, you have experiences 1211 01:08:48.159 --> 01:08:49.760 like that as a member of the church, and you 1212 01:08:50.000 --> 01:08:53.479 never leave you know, you never ever question your your 1213 01:08:53.479 --> 01:08:56.119 belief in the church, Like and you hang on to 1214 01:08:56.239 --> 01:08:58.760 those experiences, like you come back from your mission and 1215 01:08:59.319 --> 01:09:01.720 you hear different things about the church, but then you 1216 01:09:01.800 --> 01:09:05.399 hang on to that like I can't explain those things 1217 01:09:05.439 --> 01:09:08.199 that happened to me and stuff, and those are kind 1218 01:09:08.239 --> 01:09:10.880 of what keep you in. But the whole trick is, 1219 01:09:10.920 --> 01:09:13.680 like I said, even after you get out of the 1220 01:09:13.760 --> 01:09:17.239 church and you leave it, you realize you can do 1221 01:09:17.319 --> 01:09:21.680 the same thing. Like I'll I'm not religious and don't 1222 01:09:21.680 --> 01:09:25.640 go to church at all, but like on Sunday or whatever, 1223 01:09:25.800 --> 01:09:28.199 just like you would go to church, I might sit 1224 01:09:28.279 --> 01:09:31.279 here and do a meditation at home where I just 1225 01:09:31.439 --> 01:09:34.960 go clear and I meditate and I'm very present and 1226 01:09:35.039 --> 01:09:37.159 connect with the universe. And then I might feel like 1227 01:09:37.199 --> 01:09:40.039 I want to go hike and look for petroglyphs and 1228 01:09:40.159 --> 01:09:43.880 have a whole spiritual experience exactly the same way, you know, 1229 01:09:44.920 --> 01:09:46.640 just like when I was a member of the church, 1230 01:09:46.880 --> 01:09:51.199 and you kind of realize really quick that belonging to 1231 01:09:51.239 --> 01:09:55.520 the organization had nothing to do with those spiritual experiences. 1232 01:09:56.319 --> 01:09:58.680 It just happened to be the case that you were 1233 01:09:59.159 --> 01:10:02.000 a member of the organization when it happened, you know. 1234 01:10:02.800 --> 01:10:04.840 But if you're a good person and you're still trying 1235 01:10:04.840 --> 01:10:07.520 to do that stuff. Like if I sat here right 1236 01:10:07.560 --> 01:10:10.760 now and really focused my consciousness, like who in my 1237 01:10:10.800 --> 01:10:14.079 neighborhood needs help right now? And I went outside and 1238 01:10:14.119 --> 01:10:16.960 started walking around following my intuition, I guarantee you i'd 1239 01:10:17.000 --> 01:10:20.479 find somebody. You know, you'd run into somebody that was 1240 01:10:20.640 --> 01:10:25.000 looking for help, like and uh, I think the church 1241 01:10:25.119 --> 01:10:27.239 just kind of church is just kind of like they 1242 01:10:27.359 --> 01:10:31.039 know that, and so good people, good people get the 1243 01:10:31.079 --> 01:10:33.800 confirmation they're looking for in those in those moments. 1244 01:10:35.960 --> 01:10:38.840 Yeah, exactly. I think that's such a good point that 1245 01:10:38.880 --> 01:10:42.119 you raise, Carl, because it's like, you know, are is 1246 01:10:42.159 --> 01:10:44.840 it the church, is it the religion, the organization, or 1247 01:10:44.920 --> 01:10:48.880 is it just like spiritually inclined people, because I can 1248 01:10:48.920 --> 01:10:50.359 think of lots of people I know they go to 1249 01:10:50.439 --> 01:10:55.840 church that are not spiritually inclined whatsoever, you know exactly. 1250 01:10:56.039 --> 01:10:58.880 Yeah, Well, they tell you that it's like your access 1251 01:10:58.920 --> 01:11:02.720 to the church. In Mormonism, they you know, it's clearly 1252 01:11:02.840 --> 01:11:06.920 they teach you that it's your ability to work in 1253 01:11:06.960 --> 01:11:11.000 the priesthood so as a man, like when you're first 1254 01:11:11.000 --> 01:11:13.319 a deacon at twelve years old and you start to 1255 01:11:13.439 --> 01:11:16.399 pass the bread and the water, they give you what 1256 01:11:16.439 --> 01:11:22.159 they call the ironic priestood, like the initial basic beginner priestoo, 1257 01:11:22.760 --> 01:11:28.560 and that's like your authority to participate in the ordinances 1258 01:11:28.600 --> 01:11:31.800 of the church or the rituals and actually conduct them, 1259 01:11:31.920 --> 01:11:34.319 or to say the prayers and to be an officiator 1260 01:11:34.359 --> 01:11:37.479 in those rituals. So you start off in these lower 1261 01:11:37.560 --> 01:11:41.319 level priesthood authorities and then ultimately as you go up 1262 01:11:41.359 --> 01:11:45.560 through the priesthood, you're also the jobs that you get 1263 01:11:45.560 --> 01:11:48.199 in the church they call them callings or like the 1264 01:11:48.720 --> 01:11:50.840 jobs that they ask you to do, get higher and 1265 01:11:50.920 --> 01:11:55.279 higher up and more important, you know. But basically you're 1266 01:11:55.359 --> 01:12:00.079 afraid that if you're not like reading the scriptures, if 1267 01:12:00.079 --> 01:12:02.520 you're not faithful, if you're not going to church every 1268 01:12:02.560 --> 01:12:05.520 Sunday and going to the meetings doing what you're supposed to, 1269 01:12:06.319 --> 01:12:10.920 that your connection to that priestood authority separates, like you're 1270 01:12:11.000 --> 01:12:15.199 falling away and you're pulling away, just like your contact 1271 01:12:15.479 --> 01:12:18.319 and closeness to the power of God is slipping through 1272 01:12:18.319 --> 01:12:21.920 your fingers. So it's like you literally are supposed to 1273 01:12:21.960 --> 01:12:24.399 get up in the morning and you put the garments on, 1274 01:12:24.520 --> 01:12:26.560 like the underwear that you get in the temple, and 1275 01:12:26.640 --> 01:12:28.880 you do your n downment. So every day and all 1276 01:12:29.000 --> 01:12:32.279 day and all night. While you're sleeping, you're wearing the 1277 01:12:32.319 --> 01:12:36.000 garments that have the symbols, the Masonic symbols, and you're 1278 01:12:36.119 --> 01:12:38.600 saying your prayers, and even when you're at your job 1279 01:12:38.680 --> 01:12:41.319 all day, in the back of your mind, you know 1280 01:12:41.520 --> 01:12:44.960 that like you're a member of the church, that you 1281 01:12:45.039 --> 01:12:48.000 have the priesthood, that you have the power of the 1282 01:12:48.000 --> 01:12:51.239 Holy ghosts and all that. So, like if you go 1283 01:12:51.319 --> 01:12:54.439 home at night and you watch some rated movie or whatever, 1284 01:12:55.239 --> 01:12:58.279 and you fall into sin, or you do something wrong, 1285 01:12:58.840 --> 01:13:01.760 or drink alcohol or even drink coffee or whatever, even 1286 01:13:01.800 --> 01:13:06.800 think a bad thought in your head, and basically it's 1287 01:13:06.840 --> 01:13:10.279 like you're sinning and you become dirty, and you lose 1288 01:13:10.319 --> 01:13:13.279 that connection to God and you lose your priests. So 1289 01:13:14.239 --> 01:13:17.399 the church teaches you that the only way to keep 1290 01:13:17.399 --> 01:13:19.760 that is by going back, Like you've got to go 1291 01:13:19.840 --> 01:13:21.920 back and take the sacrament. You got to go back 1292 01:13:21.960 --> 01:13:24.520 and confess your sins of the bishop, and you've got 1293 01:13:24.560 --> 01:13:26.920 to keep attending and going to the meetings, and you 1294 01:13:27.000 --> 01:13:30.520 got to stay on the hampster your wheel. Otherwise you're 1295 01:13:30.560 --> 01:13:33.600 just going to fall away and become filthy and become 1296 01:13:33.720 --> 01:13:36.840 part of the world. You know, and so that's what 1297 01:13:36.880 --> 01:13:39.600 my family thinks I did, Like I left the church. 1298 01:13:41.000 --> 01:13:44.760 I've got tattoos, I do meditation, I'm interested in aliens. 1299 01:13:44.840 --> 01:13:48.239 So like, I'm like this heathen that's falling away from 1300 01:13:48.239 --> 01:13:52.199 the church and what they call an apostate. You know, 1301 01:13:53.159 --> 01:13:54.399 I have apostasized. 1302 01:13:55.560 --> 01:13:57.119 This rhetoric sounds familiar. 1303 01:13:57.520 --> 01:14:00.640 You really state you. 1304 01:14:00.840 --> 01:14:05.560 Yes, I'm an ex Mormon, anti Mormon apostasys. Yeah. And 1305 01:14:05.600 --> 01:14:07.520 the fact that I go on podcasts and I talk 1306 01:14:07.560 --> 01:14:10.079 about it and I tell my story makes me an 1307 01:14:10.159 --> 01:14:13.760 actual anti Mormon. So they would say I am a 1308 01:14:13.800 --> 01:14:17.319 part of the Antichrist movement. So I'm literally like I 1309 01:14:17.359 --> 01:14:21.279 can't say it. I'm like an enemy to the Lord. Yeah, 1310 01:14:21.960 --> 01:14:23.960 but I get around my family and they all hug 1311 01:14:24.039 --> 01:14:27.119 me in this smile and we're family and they hope 1312 01:14:27.119 --> 01:14:30.000 that like someday God works it all out and will 1313 01:14:30.039 --> 01:14:33.279 all be together in heaven or whatever. But yeah, I'm 1314 01:14:33.359 --> 01:14:36.159 like a falling away guy. And the fact that I'm 1315 01:14:36.199 --> 01:14:41.000 like divorced or any if anything goes wrong in my 1316 01:14:41.319 --> 01:14:44.760 in my life, everybody that knows me looks at that 1317 01:14:44.920 --> 01:14:47.920 like confirmation, Like ah see. 1318 01:14:47.960 --> 01:14:51.199 Because because you left the church as he left the church. 1319 01:14:51.319 --> 01:14:53.640 Now, look at these bad things happening to him. Look 1320 01:14:53.640 --> 01:14:56.600 at him struggle. Now, he just lost his family, you know. 1321 01:14:56.680 --> 01:14:58.960 And they so they all look at that like see, 1322 01:14:59.119 --> 01:15:01.399 oh I leave the church, or you're going to end 1323 01:15:01.439 --> 01:15:05.119 up divorced too, and so they just like they just 1324 01:15:05.159 --> 01:15:07.680 talk about you like that. That's pretty wild. 1325 01:15:09.279 --> 01:15:11.279 Yes, that is very wild. 1326 01:15:12.159 --> 01:15:12.359 Yeah. 1327 01:15:12.520 --> 01:15:14.279 Oh look how bad their life is going since they 1328 01:15:14.399 --> 01:15:15.000 left the church. 1329 01:15:16.560 --> 01:15:19.880 Yeah, but it's funny like when when I realized that 1330 01:15:19.920 --> 01:15:23.159 the church wasn't true, I was sitting on it at 1331 01:15:23.159 --> 01:15:26.680 my computer desk at my house in Poketello, Idaho, and 1332 01:15:26.720 --> 01:15:31.800 I was four hundred pounds, I had bad vision, I 1333 01:15:31.880 --> 01:15:37.359 was like all pre diabetic, super unhealthy, u super depressed, 1334 01:15:38.000 --> 01:15:42.359 and like when that came unraveling, it felt like my 1335 01:15:42.439 --> 01:15:47.079 whole life was falling apart. But fast forward and I've 1336 01:15:47.119 --> 01:15:51.279 lost like one hundred and seventy five pounds now like 1337 01:15:51.560 --> 01:15:54.840 I've got You could say I got divorced, but I 1338 01:15:54.880 --> 01:15:58.720 actually got out of a bad marriage, Like I got 1339 01:15:58.760 --> 01:16:01.520 out of a bad religion and out of a cult 1340 01:16:01.560 --> 01:16:04.680 that I didn't belong in. And like since then, I've 1341 01:16:04.720 --> 01:16:09.680 had like I'm more in touch with myself and my 1342 01:16:10.319 --> 01:16:15.199 genuine authentic, just my own thoughts in my head and 1343 01:16:15.279 --> 01:16:18.359 knowing who I am when I think my own thoughts 1344 01:16:18.359 --> 01:16:21.960 and my own emotions and being clear about that to 1345 01:16:22.039 --> 01:16:24.920 me is so valuable now. And I as a member 1346 01:16:24.960 --> 01:16:28.439 of the church, I never had that, you know. I 1347 01:16:28.600 --> 01:16:31.119 never had peace of mind or piece of emotion, of 1348 01:16:31.600 --> 01:16:35.039 any kind of peace at all in my life. It 1349 01:16:35.119 --> 01:16:37.760 was always like, got to do more. I got to 1350 01:16:37.760 --> 01:16:39.439 go back to church, I got to read my scriptures. 1351 01:16:39.520 --> 01:16:42.039 I didn't say my prayers this morning. It's like all 1352 01:16:42.079 --> 01:16:45.039 these things that you feel like you've got to live 1353 01:16:45.159 --> 01:16:47.600 up to, you know, and when all that goes away, 1354 01:16:50.000 --> 01:16:52.439 you feel like it's going to be devastating. In some ways, 1355 01:16:52.439 --> 01:16:54.640 it is, but it's also like finally coming up for 1356 01:16:54.720 --> 01:16:58.800 air and like finally being able to understand your own 1357 01:16:58.880 --> 01:17:02.840 mind and your own emotions and your own spirituality without 1358 01:17:02.880 --> 01:17:07.119 all of that shoved in there. And it's crazy because 1359 01:17:08.680 --> 01:17:11.399 there's songs that will come on the radio, or I'll 1360 01:17:11.399 --> 01:17:14.159 see just something on the shelf at the grocery store 1361 01:17:14.199 --> 01:17:19.680 or whatever, and it will trigger a memory of like 1362 01:17:19.720 --> 01:17:22.640 a song of when I was in primary school, when 1363 01:17:22.640 --> 01:17:25.479 I was like nine years old, and I was like 1364 01:17:25.520 --> 01:17:28.439 a sunbeam at church, like and they were teaching me 1365 01:17:28.520 --> 01:17:32.239 these songs. You know, Jesus wants me for a sun 1366 01:17:32.720 --> 01:17:36.800 being too shiny for me, and like these songs like 1367 01:17:36.880 --> 01:17:40.720 are baked into my head. I'm like forty six years old, 1368 01:17:41.279 --> 01:17:47.600 and I'll catch myself still like yeah, in the back 1369 01:17:47.640 --> 01:17:49.800 of my head, I'll have these phrases that come up 1370 01:17:49.840 --> 01:17:51.640 that were totally from the church or out of the 1371 01:17:51.640 --> 01:17:54.920 Book of Mormon. I'm like, get out of there, dude, Like, 1372 01:17:55.279 --> 01:17:57.800 who even am I without all that stuff in there? 1373 01:17:58.399 --> 01:17:59.399 It's weird. 1374 01:18:00.239 --> 01:18:03.000 Yeah, it just shows the depth of the conditioning, right, 1375 01:18:04.359 --> 01:18:06.600 you know, it's a whole process, and you're like you're 1376 01:18:06.640 --> 01:18:10.239 so much more tapped into like your authenticity and that's 1377 01:18:10.359 --> 01:18:13.279 probably what allowed you to like like go of a 1378 01:18:13.359 --> 01:18:16.520 lot of things and lose weight, take better care of yourself, 1379 01:18:16.680 --> 01:18:20.000 like get more aligned in your relationships like all that. 1380 01:18:20.239 --> 01:18:23.720 Right, There's there's tons of stuff like that, like just 1381 01:18:23.840 --> 01:18:27.439 everything in your environment. Like even like when you go 1382 01:18:27.520 --> 01:18:29.880 out on a cold morning and you try to start 1383 01:18:30.079 --> 01:18:34.039 the truck up and it's struggling. There's your condition like 1384 01:18:34.239 --> 01:18:37.960 as a Mormon to like start going, come on, you 1385 01:18:38.000 --> 01:18:40.479 can do it, Like you're almost talking to your car, 1386 01:18:41.000 --> 01:18:43.880 like it can hear you like you're talking like your 1387 01:18:43.960 --> 01:18:48.640 truck is a living thing, but you're also subconsciously like praying. 1388 01:18:49.079 --> 01:18:52.079 Come on, you could do it. And you're like, and 1389 01:18:52.159 --> 01:18:54.840 I wonder sometimes I'm like, how much of that is 1390 01:18:54.880 --> 01:18:57.520 because I was taught so much to pray? Or is 1391 01:18:57.520 --> 01:19:00.279 that like a normal thing that normal people do? If 1392 01:19:00.319 --> 01:19:02.520 your car is not starting, do you talk to it too? 1393 01:19:02.720 --> 01:19:05.560 Like there's there's so many weird things about yourself that 1394 01:19:05.640 --> 01:19:08.800 suddenly you wonder is that like a normal thing or 1395 01:19:08.840 --> 01:19:11.279 does that come from like growing up in a cult 1396 01:19:11.479 --> 01:19:14.199 where I like literally talk to myself in my own 1397 01:19:14.239 --> 01:19:17.000 head all day like I have like it's like a 1398 01:19:17.000 --> 01:19:22.159 form of counterfeit schizophrenia almost where you're raised a member 1399 01:19:22.159 --> 01:19:24.000 of the Mormon Church, and it's like you have the 1400 01:19:24.039 --> 01:19:27.239 Holy Ghost that's listening to you, you have the Light 1401 01:19:27.319 --> 01:19:31.279 of Christ, You've got Heavenly Father. There's all your dead relatives, 1402 01:19:31.279 --> 01:19:36.359 there's all the spirits of Satan and the evil demons 1403 01:19:36.359 --> 01:19:38.800 that are trying to tempt you and everything. These are 1404 01:19:38.840 --> 01:19:43.119 all like voices and thoughts and emotions that are going 1405 01:19:43.159 --> 01:19:45.560 on inside of you, and you're supposed to sort all 1406 01:19:45.600 --> 01:19:49.119 that out and just listen to the gospel, or just 1407 01:19:49.159 --> 01:19:51.319 listen to the truth and listen to the prophet. He's 1408 01:19:51.359 --> 01:19:53.960 the only one that can keep you safe, you know, 1409 01:19:54.039 --> 01:19:56.680 like going to church and listening to the leaders and 1410 01:19:56.720 --> 01:20:00.680 following them. They actually say stay in the boat, like 1411 01:20:01.359 --> 01:20:04.079 don't get out of the boat, You'll drowned in the ocean. 1412 01:20:04.159 --> 01:20:06.880 Like just stay a member of the church. Stay in 1413 01:20:06.960 --> 01:20:09.640 the boat, don't get out. And they say like that, 1414 01:20:09.720 --> 01:20:13.079 you know, and really what that is is like stay gullible, 1415 01:20:13.920 --> 01:20:16.399 keep your head buried in the sand, stay in the cave, 1416 01:20:16.840 --> 01:20:19.439 don't go look outside and realize there's a whole world 1417 01:20:19.439 --> 01:20:21.239 out there. Just stay in the boat. 1418 01:20:21.640 --> 01:20:21.840 You know. 1419 01:20:22.760 --> 01:20:25.479 It's such inbred thinking that it's really hard to get 1420 01:20:25.520 --> 01:20:27.479 out of. It's really really hard to get out of. 1421 01:20:28.000 --> 01:20:31.640 You never learn to trust your own voice. That's like abuse, 1422 01:20:32.479 --> 01:20:32.760 you know. 1423 01:20:33.640 --> 01:20:36.800 Yeah, they really hijack from the time you're eight years 1424 01:20:36.800 --> 01:20:40.159 old when they do a baptism and then they do 1425 01:20:40.319 --> 01:20:45.079 the Gift of the Holy Ghost ordinance, they basically ingrain 1426 01:20:45.199 --> 01:20:49.640 into you that there's a spirit that's inside of you 1427 01:20:49.760 --> 01:20:53.239 and following you around all day and watching and listening 1428 01:20:53.239 --> 01:20:55.920 to everything that you do. That is a part of 1429 01:20:55.960 --> 01:20:59.159 God and like part of the Godhead, and when you're 1430 01:20:59.199 --> 01:21:01.399 eight years old, they do a ritual where they give 1431 01:21:01.439 --> 01:21:03.720 you that gift of the Holy ghosts and that spirit. 1432 01:21:04.279 --> 01:21:07.920 So you're suddenly instead of just being a kid going 1433 01:21:07.960 --> 01:21:11.319 around just having your own thoughts to yourself, now all 1434 01:21:11.319 --> 01:21:14.840 of a sudden, it's like there's God's watching, you know, 1435 01:21:15.159 --> 01:21:17.399 and and the Holy ghost is there, and he's like 1436 01:21:17.439 --> 01:21:21.000 a spirit that sees everything that you're doing, everything that 1437 01:21:21.000 --> 01:21:23.520 you're thinking. So as soon as you have like a 1438 01:21:23.560 --> 01:21:26.399 bad thought where you're like that asshole or something like 1439 01:21:26.439 --> 01:21:28.720 that in your back of your mind, you're like ooh, 1440 01:21:28.800 --> 01:21:31.600 and it's like like the little angel on your shoulder 1441 01:21:31.640 --> 01:21:35.039 going ah ah, you know, and that's built into you 1442 01:21:35.760 --> 01:21:39.359 to immediately self correct like that, you know, and you're 1443 01:21:39.399 --> 01:21:42.960 taught that's God speaking to you self correcting. But the 1444 01:21:43.000 --> 01:21:47.279 problem with it is it's so unreliable because it's so 1445 01:21:47.399 --> 01:21:51.039 subjective to an individual that you can get off on 1446 01:21:51.119 --> 01:21:54.119 these paths. And that's like that guy Chad daybel that 1447 01:21:54.279 --> 01:21:58.000 murdered the kids and in the backyard or whatever he 1448 01:21:58.720 --> 01:22:00.800 thought up to the moment when he did that and 1449 01:22:00.960 --> 01:22:03.680 was burning those kids in the bonfire, that he was 1450 01:22:03.760 --> 01:22:07.720 listening to that spirit, you know, he's sitting in prison 1451 01:22:07.840 --> 01:22:11.119 right now up in Idaho, telling himself get down on 1452 01:22:11.119 --> 01:22:13.319 his knees, probably saying his prayers to go to bed 1453 01:22:13.319 --> 01:22:17.640 tonight right now in prison, and he believes that he 1454 01:22:17.800 --> 01:22:21.640 was listening to the same spirit that other people have 1455 01:22:22.359 --> 01:22:25.359 listened to and had to make those hard decisions, just 1456 01:22:25.439 --> 01:22:29.520 like Abraham being asked to sacrifice Isaac in the Bible. 1457 01:22:30.119 --> 01:22:32.479 They call it like the Abrahamic tests, you know, like 1458 01:22:33.359 --> 01:22:37.119 you do really have the faith to do that if 1459 01:22:37.159 --> 01:22:39.600 God asks you to, and he's I guarantee you he's 1460 01:22:39.600 --> 01:22:43.159 sitting in prison right now holding on to that and 1461 01:22:43.560 --> 01:22:46.199 believes that he's still listening to the Holy Ghost, you know. 1462 01:22:46.600 --> 01:22:50.000 So I mean, it's just completely unreliable. That's the problem. 1463 01:22:50.279 --> 01:22:54.720 It's just you. It's just you questioning yourself and giving 1464 01:22:54.760 --> 01:23:01.239 yourself a bunch of internal split personality basically, you know, 1465 01:23:02.000 --> 01:23:04.119 and you think that you're talking to God, and really 1466 01:23:04.880 --> 01:23:08.600 you're just chasing your own internal thoughts around like a 1467 01:23:08.640 --> 01:23:11.760 dog chasing his tail, that's all. 1468 01:23:11.720 --> 01:23:16.760 Said, Yeah, chasing. I guess that's why so many Mormon 1469 01:23:16.800 --> 01:23:21.960 women are on like all these different anti anxiety meds, 1470 01:23:22.119 --> 01:23:26.720 and but I don't know that's what that's what Haidi said, Yeah, hew, 1471 01:23:26.760 --> 01:23:28.800 do you love She told me. She told me about 1472 01:23:28.840 --> 01:23:29.760 that a couple of times. 1473 01:23:29.800 --> 01:23:32.760 So there's everything is off limits. You know, when you 1474 01:23:32.800 --> 01:23:34.920 live in that culture where you don't even pick your 1475 01:23:34.920 --> 01:23:37.439 own underwear. You get up in the morning and you 1476 01:23:37.439 --> 01:23:40.359 don't even choose the underwear that you put on. The 1477 01:23:40.439 --> 01:23:45.079 church decides all of that for you. You can't drink coffee, 1478 01:23:44.880 --> 01:23:49.800 you know, like real hot drinks. Really, no beer, no weed, 1479 01:23:51.399 --> 01:23:53.439 you're not you can't even think thoughts in your head. 1480 01:23:53.479 --> 01:23:56.840 There's so many things like that. So there's there's only 1481 01:23:56.880 --> 01:23:58.880 a couple of things that you feel like you don't 1482 01:23:58.880 --> 01:24:01.079 have to feel guilty about, and that's if the doctor 1483 01:24:01.119 --> 01:24:04.760 prescribes it, Like if they prescribe your hydro codon and 1484 01:24:04.800 --> 01:24:07.760 you get hooked on opiates that way, then you can 1485 01:24:07.800 --> 01:24:10.880 be like doctor said, it's okay, and the church doesn't 1486 01:24:10.920 --> 01:24:13.760 say anything about that. And the other one is just food. 1487 01:24:14.520 --> 01:24:18.319 Like so a lot of Mormons are super overweight and 1488 01:24:18.399 --> 01:24:21.359 out of shape because they get addicted to food because 1489 01:24:21.399 --> 01:24:25.359 you can't drink, you can't smoke, you can't you can't 1490 01:24:25.359 --> 01:24:29.119 even you're sitting there as a grown man and you're 1491 01:24:29.159 --> 01:24:32.520 watching Disney movies. You know, you can't even watch RATEDAR movies, 1492 01:24:33.359 --> 01:24:35.920 and pretty soon that's like a pressure cooker, you know 1493 01:24:35.960 --> 01:24:38.760 what I mean. And so if the one thing that 1494 01:24:38.800 --> 01:24:42.359 you can do is eat pizza, that's how you wind 1495 01:24:42.439 --> 01:24:44.680 up four hundred pounds like I was. He's just like, 1496 01:24:45.039 --> 01:24:47.880 it's you just didn't can indulge in the one thing 1497 01:24:47.960 --> 01:24:52.199 you don't feel guilty about, you know. Yeah, so it 1498 01:24:52.279 --> 01:24:54.760 can be a bad formula for sure. 1499 01:24:56.319 --> 01:25:03.399 Absolutely begging for a So I think, what's with the 1500 01:25:03.439 --> 01:25:05.600 Noah hot drinks? Where's that? Do you know where that 1501 01:25:05.640 --> 01:25:06.640 comes from? 1502 01:25:07.039 --> 01:25:11.800 You know? An arbitrary rule like yeah, Joseph Smith back 1503 01:25:11.800 --> 01:25:15.640 in the day when he was the prophet, basically as 1504 01:25:15.680 --> 01:25:18.279 soon as that was established and he had a following 1505 01:25:18.640 --> 01:25:20.960 that believed that he was the prophet, that he was 1506 01:25:21.000 --> 01:25:24.520 talking to God, then suddenly everybody was coming to him like, 1507 01:25:24.560 --> 01:25:27.479 well what about this? Is this right? Is this wrong? 1508 01:25:27.800 --> 01:25:31.520 What about that? You know? And so it was really 1509 01:25:32.359 --> 01:25:35.239 how they built the church to begin with was through 1510 01:25:35.279 --> 01:25:38.600 plagiarizing and through borrowing bits and pieces and building it 1511 01:25:38.600 --> 01:25:41.279 together like a puzzle. And so one of the more 1512 01:25:41.319 --> 01:25:44.640 popular things that Joseph Smith's time was the Temperance movement 1513 01:25:45.399 --> 01:25:48.479 and they had a belief that if you drink hot 1514 01:25:48.600 --> 01:25:51.880 drinks that were like like hot coffee and tea, that 1515 01:25:52.000 --> 01:25:55.279 it would actually like boil the inside of your stomach 1516 01:25:55.399 --> 01:25:59.199 and kill the healthy parts of your gut and things, 1517 01:25:59.199 --> 01:26:03.079 and that you should only drink liquids at room temperature 1518 01:26:03.079 --> 01:26:05.479 and things. And it's just a myth, you know, that's 1519 01:26:05.520 --> 01:26:08.960 been proven that it's not even true, but it was 1520 01:26:09.039 --> 01:26:12.119 part of the temperance movement. So when everybody started coming 1521 01:26:12.119 --> 01:26:14.359 to Joseph Smith and they're like, well, what about tobacco 1522 01:26:14.399 --> 01:26:17.319 and what about alcohol? And what about this? What about that? 1523 01:26:17.359 --> 01:26:20.199 They had to come back with an answer, and so 1524 01:26:20.800 --> 01:26:23.640 they came up with what's called the Doctrine Covenants, and 1525 01:26:23.680 --> 01:26:26.880 it's considered scripture now, just like the Bible and the 1526 01:26:26.880 --> 01:26:30.000 Book of Mormon they consider in the church, they consider 1527 01:26:30.039 --> 01:26:33.239 it part of the scriptures. And it's published printed right 1528 01:26:33.319 --> 01:26:35.680 as a part of the scriptures too, in the same binding. 1529 01:26:36.359 --> 01:26:39.159 And it's basically there's a whole chapter in there that's 1530 01:26:39.680 --> 01:26:43.039 the Lord's Law of health, and they call it the 1531 01:26:43.079 --> 01:26:46.960 Word of Wisdom, and it's basically Joseph Smith just saying like, 1532 01:26:48.319 --> 01:26:50.800 don't eat a lot of meat except for in times 1533 01:26:50.800 --> 01:26:54.439 of famine or in times of winter, no coffee or tea, 1534 01:26:54.840 --> 01:26:59.159 avoid hot drinks, and it just basically no tobacco, made 1535 01:26:59.199 --> 01:27:03.680 up a whole bunch of health rules and stuff, you know, 1536 01:27:04.399 --> 01:27:07.880 and the church members of the church don't even really 1537 01:27:07.960 --> 01:27:12.600 follow it that well, except for like the way it 1538 01:27:12.720 --> 01:27:16.159 kind of has rattled down through the generations is basically, 1539 01:27:16.239 --> 01:27:21.640 don't drink coffee or tea, don't drink alcohol, don't smoke 1540 01:27:21.760 --> 01:27:25.319 or use tobacco products, and then anything that's like an 1541 01:27:25.359 --> 01:27:28.840 addictive chemical they consider against the Word of wisdom, you know. 1542 01:27:29.640 --> 01:27:32.279 And when you go to talk to your bishop to 1543 01:27:32.359 --> 01:27:35.720 try and get permission to go to the temple, they 1544 01:27:35.800 --> 01:27:38.880 ask you if you live according to the Word of wisdom, 1545 01:27:39.079 --> 01:27:41.399 like if you follow the Lord's lot of law of health, 1546 01:27:41.680 --> 01:27:44.359 and if you're drinking coffee, like if you went to 1547 01:27:44.399 --> 01:27:47.760 Starbucks that morning, then you can't go to the temple. 1548 01:27:47.840 --> 01:27:50.479 They'll say, no, they won't give you the recommend so 1549 01:27:50.560 --> 01:27:53.880 you have to be following the law of health. But 1550 01:27:53.960 --> 01:27:57.279 it's all super arbitrary because like, like I've sat in 1551 01:27:57.359 --> 01:28:01.000 church where they've talked for a whole hour about the 1552 01:28:01.039 --> 01:28:03.000 Word of Wisdom and the law of health and all 1553 01:28:03.000 --> 01:28:06.119 that stuff, and right in there it says not to 1554 01:28:06.159 --> 01:28:09.319 eat very much meat, like to just eat meat sparingly, 1555 01:28:09.359 --> 01:28:13.039 almost like a vegetarian, you know. And as soon as 1556 01:28:13.039 --> 01:28:14.960 the meeting was over, they get done talking about it 1557 01:28:15.000 --> 01:28:18.439 for a whole hour and then the High priestcript leader 1558 01:28:18.479 --> 01:28:20.720 gets up and he's like, Hey, this Tuesday night, we're 1559 01:28:20.760 --> 01:28:23.399 having a big steak fry. We're gonna be cooking a 1560 01:28:23.439 --> 01:28:25.720 bunch of steaks in the fryer, and are you come 1561 01:28:25.760 --> 01:28:27.880 over in my house? So let's you know what I mean. 1562 01:28:28.640 --> 01:28:30.680 They talk about it and get up there and everybody 1563 01:28:30.880 --> 01:28:33.640 acts like they're following it, and then they announced the 1564 01:28:33.640 --> 01:28:37.279 steak fry immediately after. So it's like some of that 1565 01:28:37.319 --> 01:28:39.760 you're looking around, like if you really believe the church 1566 01:28:40.199 --> 01:28:42.479 like I did, I would look around. I'm like, nobody's 1567 01:28:42.520 --> 01:28:45.000 even really following this, Like what are we doing here? 1568 01:28:46.359 --> 01:28:48.239 Those were some of those moments where I'm like, a 1569 01:28:48.319 --> 01:28:55.199 steak fry, like we just got them talking about this, guys, Like. 1570 01:28:53.800 --> 01:28:56.399 How many people in that congregation actually caught that? 1571 01:28:56.960 --> 01:28:57.279 I don't know. 1572 01:28:57.399 --> 01:28:58.399 The only one. 1573 01:28:58.399 --> 01:29:00.279 Like that was the one where yeah, I would. I 1574 01:29:00.319 --> 01:29:01.920 went home from that meeting. I was like, what the 1575 01:29:01.960 --> 01:29:05.760 hell's going on here, like, are we really like literally 1576 01:29:05.760 --> 01:29:07.640 we talked about that for an hour and then we 1577 01:29:07.720 --> 01:29:10.199 got up like it didn't even matter, just announce the 1578 01:29:10.239 --> 01:29:14.239 steak fry like nobody's even gonna fry. Was like it 1579 01:29:14.279 --> 01:29:18.199 was hilarious, Like that happened. That stuff happens all the time. Man, 1580 01:29:18.279 --> 01:29:20.279 that's funny. Man. 1581 01:29:20.600 --> 01:29:23.600 I wonder how many like dietary guidelines come from that. Actually, 1582 01:29:23.800 --> 01:29:26.840 that just kind of like migrated from Mormonism into like 1583 01:29:27.279 --> 01:29:31.840 modern dietary mythos, you know, like the little to know 1584 01:29:32.000 --> 01:29:34.760 me like that's what they teach in school. 1585 01:29:35.239 --> 01:29:37.760 I don't know, but when all those different when those 1586 01:29:37.760 --> 01:29:41.279 different dietary trends come up or down or shift or whatever, 1587 01:29:41.439 --> 01:29:45.439 whenever one one kind of hits, they're like see Joseph 1588 01:29:45.479 --> 01:29:49.960 Smith knew like they right, Like when one comes up 1589 01:29:50.079 --> 01:29:53.239 like this this is the new healthy thing, then the 1590 01:29:53.239 --> 01:29:57.119 more are like see see Joseph Smith was right. You know, 1591 01:29:57.119 --> 01:29:59.600 two hundred years ago we knew he was a prophet. 1592 01:30:00.079 --> 01:30:05.199 You know, it's like, come on, you could get come around. 1593 01:30:06.359 --> 01:30:09.920 I'm pretty sure that the in Utah that most of 1594 01:30:10.079 --> 01:30:13.239 like the supplement and vitamin industry comes from there as well. 1595 01:30:13.319 --> 01:30:18.800 Right, Yeah, it's totally unregulated on that end too, like 1596 01:30:18.800 --> 01:30:21.279 like I could start, uh, I could start like a 1597 01:30:21.319 --> 01:30:25.479 creatine company or like a protein powder way protein powder 1598 01:30:25.560 --> 01:30:28.439 company here in my kitchen. And as long as I 1599 01:30:28.520 --> 01:30:31.840 just copied the ingredients over from where I got the stuff, 1600 01:30:32.319 --> 01:30:34.319 I could put my own label on it. And it's 1601 01:30:34.359 --> 01:30:37.920 like in the state of Utah, it's almost completely unregulated. 1602 01:30:37.960 --> 01:30:41.439 And then I could sell it on Amazon, like it's 1603 01:30:41.479 --> 01:30:45.119 a and you have no idea what's in it, Like 1604 01:30:45.640 --> 01:30:48.680 there's tons of MLM things like that. And Mormons are 1605 01:30:48.760 --> 01:30:52.039 big on like tons of people drinking energy drinks. Like 1606 01:30:52.439 --> 01:30:57.159 around here instead of Starbucks, they have what's called swigs 1607 01:30:57.279 --> 01:31:01.880 or like pops, and they're basically they're like drive through 1608 01:31:01.920 --> 01:31:06.439 soda shops, so like you could pull through and be like, oh, 1609 01:31:06.680 --> 01:31:09.439 I want a Big Joe or something like that, and 1610 01:31:09.479 --> 01:31:14.319 it's literally like a diet coke with coconut cream and lime. 1611 01:31:15.079 --> 01:31:19.199 And they basically try to treat every soda and diet 1612 01:31:19.199 --> 01:31:21.560 soda you can think of, like doctor Pepper or whatever. 1613 01:31:22.239 --> 01:31:25.439 Like it's a bar, like it's a mixture drink bar. 1614 01:31:25.920 --> 01:31:29.079 And so you in the summertime, you go look at 1615 01:31:29.119 --> 01:31:31.560 the swigs here in Saint George Utah, and there is 1616 01:31:31.720 --> 01:31:35.159 a line clear down the road, like of cars trying 1617 01:31:35.159 --> 01:31:37.600 to go through the drive through because you can't drink 1618 01:31:37.600 --> 01:31:40.239 coffee can like instead of getting up and going to 1619 01:31:40.239 --> 01:31:43.920 Starbucks or whatever to get amocha, they all go get 1620 01:31:43.920 --> 01:31:44.439 their swig. 1621 01:31:45.640 --> 01:31:48.760 That is fascinating. Yeah. I didn't know about the no 1622 01:31:48.920 --> 01:31:51.319 caffeine and the no hot drinks for the longest time, 1623 01:31:51.800 --> 01:31:54.319 and then a friend of mine started selling this stuff. 1624 01:31:54.359 --> 01:31:58.199 An MLM is called a mare Global or something. It's 1625 01:31:58.199 --> 01:32:01.520 from Utah and it's in and enter like it's a 1626 01:32:01.600 --> 01:32:05.560 neurotropic so basically gives you this sort of the effects 1627 01:32:05.600 --> 01:32:08.760 of caffeine, but like makes you literally feel like you're 1628 01:32:08.800 --> 01:32:11.640 on like M D M A Like. I tried it 1629 01:32:11.680 --> 01:32:14.039 and I was like, yo, I don't even want this 1630 01:32:14.199 --> 01:32:17.319 every day, like what they call it happy juice. Yeah, 1631 01:32:17.640 --> 01:32:19.720 And I was like, no, wonder it comes from Utah, 1632 01:32:19.800 --> 01:32:21.199 Like now that makes so much sense. 1633 01:32:21.439 --> 01:32:23.680 And then you're like have you looked at the ingredients 1634 01:32:23.720 --> 01:32:24.199 And they're. 1635 01:32:24.039 --> 01:32:30.520 Like, it's not caffeine. So it's a loud right, Like. 1636 01:32:30.680 --> 01:32:35.000 They don't want to if it lands on the radar 1637 01:32:35.079 --> 01:32:37.720 of the church, then the church theaters might come out 1638 01:32:37.720 --> 01:32:39.560 and mention it and then all of a sudden they're like, oh, 1639 01:32:39.640 --> 01:32:41.239 we got to quit drinking this now. 1640 01:32:41.319 --> 01:32:43.800 No, but I think I think it's Mormon run company. 1641 01:32:44.000 --> 01:32:46.840 Like I was just like, ah, I know, getting around 1642 01:32:46.840 --> 01:32:47.800 the caffeine loophole. 1643 01:32:48.920 --> 01:32:51.079 They do that all over the place. There's there's so 1644 01:32:51.119 --> 01:32:55.920 many MLMs and companies and startups like that, Like all 1645 01:32:55.920 --> 01:32:59.720 over the place. There's a huge one called Mela Luca. 1646 01:33:00.039 --> 01:33:03.720 It's like a huge makeup and lotion and like health 1647 01:33:03.760 --> 01:33:09.159 and beauty supply store whatever, a massive, massive company. But yeah, 1648 01:33:09.199 --> 01:33:12.079 I remember I was like a little kid when that started. 1649 01:33:12.079 --> 01:33:15.359 But a lot of those start in Idaho and Utah 1650 01:33:16.079 --> 01:33:20.960 and half of half of how Las Vegas and Nevada, 1651 01:33:21.760 --> 01:33:26.479 and a lot of the secret military installations were contracts 1652 01:33:26.520 --> 01:33:29.640 through the government and the state of Nevada and Utah 1653 01:33:29.680 --> 01:33:31.840 and the Church, and a lot of people don't know that, 1654 01:33:32.000 --> 01:33:36.079 but there was a lot of relationship back and forth. 1655 01:33:37.680 --> 01:33:41.920 Like when the mafia was building Las Vegas, the Mormon 1656 01:33:42.000 --> 01:33:45.800 Church moved in with all of their money and basically 1657 01:33:46.199 --> 01:33:48.840 Mike bought up and controlled over half of the city 1658 01:33:49.359 --> 01:33:52.600 and then got the government involved. And that's a lot 1659 01:33:52.600 --> 01:33:55.680 of how like Area fifty one and doug Way Airfield, 1660 01:33:56.479 --> 01:33:59.119 NSA headquarters in Utah, and a bunch of that stuff 1661 01:33:59.159 --> 01:34:02.760 got done. Part of why the church is one of 1662 01:34:02.800 --> 01:34:05.399 the richest in the country now, if not the richest 1663 01:34:05.920 --> 01:34:10.119 church in the country. But yeah, they make deals behind 1664 01:34:10.119 --> 01:34:11.079 the curtain all the time. 1665 01:34:13.640 --> 01:34:16.479 Yeah, I had a guest on that like pretty much 1666 01:34:16.560 --> 01:34:18.640 like it was showing stuff like that about like I 1667 01:34:18.640 --> 01:34:21.399 think the government giving them money pretty much of the CIA, 1668 01:34:22.239 --> 01:34:23.960 so they kind of get involved inside the church. 1669 01:34:25.720 --> 01:34:30.199 Yeah, the Mormon Church has gotten caught before. Like I said, 1670 01:34:30.239 --> 01:34:33.520 I went on a mission to Arkansas when I was nineteen, 1671 01:34:34.279 --> 01:34:36.600 and before you go on a mission, you have to 1672 01:34:36.640 --> 01:34:40.279 go to the Missionary Training Center. They call it the MTC. 1673 01:34:40.600 --> 01:34:44.359 It's like a boot camp. It's basically like a college 1674 01:34:44.399 --> 01:34:48.439 campus in Provo, Utah, right next to BYU, and you 1675 01:34:48.560 --> 01:34:51.359 actually go live there in the dorms and it's like 1676 01:34:51.439 --> 01:34:55.039 you're training and living like a missionary full time, but 1677 01:34:55.159 --> 01:34:58.039 it's all supervised. So before they send you out, like 1678 01:34:58.600 --> 01:35:02.239 to the Philippines or Guatemala or something like that, or 1679 01:35:02.239 --> 01:35:04.239 like I went to Arkansas, you have to go there. 1680 01:35:04.600 --> 01:35:07.800 So like I only went for I think I went 1681 01:35:07.840 --> 01:35:10.479 for six weeks, but some missionaries if you're learning a 1682 01:35:10.560 --> 01:35:13.920 foreign language, you'll go for like three months and live 1683 01:35:13.960 --> 01:35:17.359 there because you're like every day and all day you're 1684 01:35:17.399 --> 01:35:20.640 like speaking Spanish or whatever to learn the new language. 1685 01:35:20.960 --> 01:35:22.560 And then at the end of the three months, they 1686 01:35:22.600 --> 01:35:24.760 ship you out and they pair you up with somebody, 1687 01:35:24.800 --> 01:35:27.039 and then you've got to do it, you know. But 1688 01:35:27.159 --> 01:35:30.239 when you go into the NTC, you're like in the 1689 01:35:30.359 --> 01:35:34.079 uniform all day and you're you're living with a bunch 1690 01:35:34.079 --> 01:35:37.159 of people you don't know, and the that are just 1691 01:35:37.239 --> 01:35:39.319 from all over the place that are all going through 1692 01:35:39.319 --> 01:35:42.399 the same thing. It's just like going into army boot camp. 1693 01:35:44.840 --> 01:35:47.920 But the Church has gotten caught a few times where 1694 01:35:47.960 --> 01:35:52.520 they've made deals where they've had CIA agents go in 1695 01:35:52.920 --> 01:35:58.600 with fake identities, like fake passports and fake IDs, pretending 1696 01:35:58.680 --> 01:36:01.920 to be a nineteen year old missionary, and then they 1697 01:36:01.960 --> 01:36:05.159 go through the MTC just like they're one of the kids. 1698 01:36:05.720 --> 01:36:10.239 And then they the church assigns them like to go 1699 01:36:10.880 --> 01:36:16.720 to Uruguay or somewhere, or down to Cuba or something, 1700 01:36:16.800 --> 01:36:20.560 you know, and then next thing you know, there's two 1701 01:36:20.640 --> 01:36:25.640 CIA assets pretending to be Mormon missionaries that are in 1702 01:36:25.760 --> 01:36:29.920 Cuba together, and then the mission president gets the order 1703 01:36:30.840 --> 01:36:33.840 to put these two missionaries together to work together in 1704 01:36:33.880 --> 01:36:37.600 the community. And then you've basically the church has helped 1705 01:36:37.600 --> 01:36:43.520 the CIA smuggle two spies to do espionage. And then 1706 01:36:43.560 --> 01:36:46.960 you've got two CIA assets living together pretending to be 1707 01:36:47.000 --> 01:36:50.279 Mormon missionaries in a foreign country. And they even the 1708 01:36:50.359 --> 01:36:53.319 church even paid to teach them the language, you know. 1709 01:36:54.239 --> 01:36:57.399 And then they yeah, and they can go around all 1710 01:36:57.479 --> 01:37:00.479 day in the daytime and put their hour in and 1711 01:37:00.520 --> 01:37:03.279 just play the role and do the missionary thing on 1712 01:37:03.319 --> 01:37:07.399 the surface. But then they're actually going out as CIA 1713 01:37:07.520 --> 01:37:11.680 assets and getting intel doing their doing their real job. 1714 01:37:12.399 --> 01:37:14.319 But they've gotten caught. I mean, you can google it, 1715 01:37:14.399 --> 01:37:17.159 look it up. The church has gotten caught a couple 1716 01:37:17.199 --> 01:37:22.079 of times with the CIA assets embedded into the missionary 1717 01:37:22.119 --> 01:37:26.600 training program pretending like they were nineteen year old missionaries. Yeah, 1718 01:37:27.319 --> 01:37:32.159 it's a whole thing. Yeah, yeah, no one suspects you. 1719 01:37:32.159 --> 01:37:33.960 You're able to go to door to door and. 1720 01:37:35.560 --> 01:37:37.319 Right, it's the perfect cover. 1721 01:37:37.760 --> 01:37:38.000 Yeah. 1722 01:37:39.119 --> 01:37:41.239 Yeah. They just look like a like a couple of 1723 01:37:41.319 --> 01:37:43.319 nineteen year old kids that are out there helping the 1724 01:37:43.359 --> 01:37:46.479 old lady mold the lawn. You'd have no idea that 1725 01:37:46.520 --> 01:37:52.000 they're spying on the embassy, you know, good cover. 1726 01:37:52.560 --> 01:37:54.239 Yeah, that is genius. 1727 01:37:58.079 --> 01:38:00.359 Yeah, a lot of those deals get done, like and 1728 01:38:00.399 --> 01:38:04.479 it's easy to use Mormons and wealthy members of the 1729 01:38:04.560 --> 01:38:07.279 church and the church itself to do like land grabs, 1730 01:38:07.399 --> 01:38:10.479 the buy real estate and things like that, and then 1731 01:38:10.520 --> 01:38:14.439 they'll lease it out through government contracts to put like 1732 01:38:14.479 --> 01:38:17.560 big government installations and things on the land. And so 1733 01:38:17.600 --> 01:38:19.920 there's a ton of that that goes on too, because 1734 01:38:19.920 --> 01:38:23.680 the church can go like imagine like up in Idaho 1735 01:38:23.760 --> 01:38:29.039 or Utah, the church can see this this farmer out here, 1736 01:38:29.319 --> 01:38:32.079 he's got all this acreage, he's got like five hundred 1737 01:38:32.079 --> 01:38:35.680 acres that his great grandpa had that he inherited or whatever. 1738 01:38:36.279 --> 01:38:40.640 The Church can go out there and pressure them and 1739 01:38:40.720 --> 01:38:43.159 guilt trip them and be like this is the work 1740 01:38:43.199 --> 01:38:46.119 of the Lord, you know, and manipulate that guy to 1741 01:38:46.199 --> 01:38:49.800 selling the land for almost nothing or even giving it 1742 01:38:49.960 --> 01:38:52.079 donating it to the church like it's a test of 1743 01:38:52.119 --> 01:38:55.039 his faith, you know. So the church will just take 1744 01:38:55.079 --> 01:38:58.279 all that land and then they'll turn around and either 1745 01:38:58.359 --> 01:39:00.159 build like a big shopping mall on it or a 1746 01:39:00.159 --> 01:39:02.880 big condo on it or whatever. They don't even build 1747 01:39:02.920 --> 01:39:05.880 like a temple or anything religious on it, or they'll 1748 01:39:06.159 --> 01:39:12.600 they'll establish the land and like build another NSA headquarters 1749 01:39:12.600 --> 01:39:14.720 on on it or something and lease it back to 1750 01:39:14.760 --> 01:39:18.880 the government. So that's why they're busy do it and 1751 01:39:18.960 --> 01:39:23.600 why they're so wealthy. Yeah, it's like it's a really 1752 01:39:23.640 --> 01:39:25.720 easy way to get away with it and the launder 1753 01:39:25.760 --> 01:39:28.239 the money and to make it look like charities and 1754 01:39:28.439 --> 01:39:29.359 just do whatever you want. 1755 01:39:32.000 --> 01:39:36.359 Damn. Yeah, that is wild. 1756 01:39:39.079 --> 01:39:41.199 Yeah, I see, And some people figure that out, like 1757 01:39:41.239 --> 01:39:43.520 as members of the church, you see how wealthy the 1758 01:39:43.600 --> 01:39:46.359 church is and what they're doing, and you just tell 1759 01:39:46.399 --> 01:39:50.079 yourself that you're glad you're on the winning team, you know, like, God, 1760 01:39:50.119 --> 01:39:52.000 it's hard guys, like, we're right. 1761 01:39:52.520 --> 01:39:54.640 Oh my god. That's one way to look at it. 1762 01:39:55.239 --> 01:39:57.880 Yeah, well it's better us. Who else do you think 1763 01:39:57.920 --> 01:40:01.199 should have all this money? Course it should be the prophet. 1764 01:40:05.800 --> 01:40:07.640 I would give him. I would give him my house 1765 01:40:07.680 --> 01:40:10.039 if he asked me as a test of my faith. 1766 01:40:10.159 --> 01:40:13.960 You know, that's the spirit, you know, those are the 1767 01:40:13.960 --> 01:40:15.840 promises that you make though when you go through the 1768 01:40:15.840 --> 01:40:18.560 Temple and the endowment. One of the covenants and the 1769 01:40:18.600 --> 01:40:22.359 promises that you make in the temple is that you 1770 01:40:22.439 --> 01:40:26.199 will give all of your time, talents, and resources and 1771 01:40:26.319 --> 01:40:30.760 everything that you have to the church if required. That's 1772 01:40:30.800 --> 01:40:33.680 literally almost word for word what they ask you. And 1773 01:40:33.720 --> 01:40:35.920 you have to raise your arm in the air and 1774 01:40:35.960 --> 01:40:39.159 then bow your head and say yes out loud and 1775 01:40:39.239 --> 01:40:43.520 make those like you'll give all your time, talents, and 1776 01:40:44.000 --> 01:40:46.319 all that you have. It says, even your life if 1777 01:40:46.399 --> 01:40:49.560 necessary to the building up of the Church of Jesus 1778 01:40:49.640 --> 01:40:52.279 Christ and Latter day Saints and the Lord's Kingdom. And 1779 01:40:52.319 --> 01:40:54.119 you put your arm in the air and you say yes, 1780 01:40:54.760 --> 01:41:00.079 and you make so when you leave, it's like a 1781 01:41:00.119 --> 01:41:02.199 big deal, you know, yeah, like. 1782 01:41:02.479 --> 01:41:08.520 For sure, Damn, that's crazy. 1783 01:41:08.720 --> 01:41:09.880 That's a very big deal. 1784 01:41:10.039 --> 01:41:10.439 Come on. 1785 01:41:11.600 --> 01:41:15.000 Yeah, well, I guess that's why they build up years 1786 01:41:15.000 --> 01:41:19.800 of like you know, kind of crushing your questioning spirit, 1787 01:41:20.800 --> 01:41:23.880 you know, to then bring you to that point. 1788 01:41:25.199 --> 01:41:27.920 Yeah, when you're finally in there making those oaths, when 1789 01:41:27.960 --> 01:41:32.479 you're going through the temple, it's like everybody around you, 1790 01:41:33.279 --> 01:41:36.960 even like your dad, your uncle, your brothers, are in there, 1791 01:41:37.239 --> 01:41:40.920 like you're going through for the first time, the whole community, 1792 01:41:41.039 --> 01:41:43.640 Like you know, half of the people in the room 1793 01:41:43.760 --> 01:41:47.119 or from your church, you know, they're there for you 1794 01:41:48.640 --> 01:41:51.000 to go through. It's like your birthday or whatever, you know, 1795 01:41:51.039 --> 01:41:53.760 it's like a whole big deal, like your baptism. So 1796 01:41:53.800 --> 01:41:57.800 it's like a big thing everybody's been looking for, looking 1797 01:41:57.880 --> 01:42:00.800 forward to you going through the temple, and then you 1798 01:42:00.840 --> 01:42:05.960 get in there and you're they're like, you're what's your choice? Is? Like, 1799 01:42:06.000 --> 01:42:08.960 what's your option? You either go through with it and 1800 01:42:09.039 --> 01:42:12.000 follow along and just mimic what everybody else is doing 1801 01:42:12.039 --> 01:42:14.640 and get through the whole thing. You're like, you've already 1802 01:42:14.640 --> 01:42:17.000 gone through all these curtains, You've already gone through all 1803 01:42:17.079 --> 01:42:20.079 these different steps, and you're in so deep. Now you're 1804 01:42:20.079 --> 01:42:23.159 in this whole room and everybody's chanting and you're like yes, yes, 1805 01:42:23.239 --> 01:42:25.399 and you're all praying, you're doing all this weird shit. 1806 01:42:25.760 --> 01:42:28.199 But you're looking around and there's your dad, there's your grandpa, 1807 01:42:28.319 --> 01:42:31.159 your brothers, everybody's going along with it like it's like 1808 01:42:31.199 --> 01:42:35.319 it's the right thing to do, like like it's just normal, 1809 01:42:35.520 --> 01:42:38.439 you know, like they've and they're like, isn't this cool? 1810 01:42:38.520 --> 01:42:40.800 You know, wow, isn't this such a special experience? 1811 01:42:40.840 --> 01:42:41.000 You know? 1812 01:42:41.079 --> 01:42:43.960 And you're like, I guess, so, you know, I guess 1813 01:42:43.960 --> 01:42:47.279 it's kind of weird, but you just like go along 1814 01:42:47.279 --> 01:42:49.079 with it because you feel like I'm the weird one, 1815 01:42:49.159 --> 01:42:51.039 you know, like I'm the one who doesn't get it. 1816 01:42:51.399 --> 01:42:54.720 I'm just confused because I I've never done it before. 1817 01:42:54.840 --> 01:42:56.520 So you just feel like you're the one who doesn't 1818 01:42:56.520 --> 01:42:59.279 get what's going on. But yeah, so you just put 1819 01:42:59.279 --> 01:43:02.039 your arm up and just go through it, and inside 1820 01:43:02.079 --> 01:43:04.920 yourself you're just like, please help me figure this out. 1821 01:43:05.279 --> 01:43:06.119 The hell's going on? 1822 01:43:06.880 --> 01:43:07.039 You know. 1823 01:43:08.680 --> 01:43:11.119 Yeah, But I remember going home after I went through 1824 01:43:11.159 --> 01:43:13.680 the temple the first time, my mind was just blowing. 1825 01:43:13.760 --> 01:43:17.119 I remember I told one of my friends who hadn't 1826 01:43:17.119 --> 01:43:19.800 gone through yet, and I was like, dude, you have 1827 01:43:19.960 --> 01:43:22.239 no idea. He's like, what are you talking about. I 1828 01:43:22.239 --> 01:43:25.520 was like, I think, like I went through the temple 1829 01:43:25.560 --> 01:43:27.359 and it's like I know what the church is really 1830 01:43:27.399 --> 01:43:29.079 all about now. And he's like, well, what is it 1831 01:43:29.119 --> 01:43:31.239 all about? I was like, I don't know, and I'm 1832 01:43:31.279 --> 01:43:36.039 not supposed to tell you. It's like a whole bunch 1833 01:43:36.039 --> 01:43:39.159 of handshakes, all that Masonic initiation stuff, you know, Like 1834 01:43:39.560 --> 01:43:42.199 it was so different than normal Sunday church. I was 1835 01:43:42.279 --> 01:43:46.119 like wow, Like but to me, part of me was like, 1836 01:43:47.079 --> 01:43:50.079 if this is real, then this is like how you 1837 01:43:50.199 --> 01:43:53.560 learn real magic, Like this is really like you're telling 1838 01:43:53.600 --> 01:43:57.079 me like like God or an angel can show up 1839 01:43:57.119 --> 01:43:59.520 inside the temple and like I might see one in there, 1840 01:43:59.600 --> 01:44:01.680 and so you just get like obsessed with it, like 1841 01:44:01.720 --> 01:44:04.680 if it's true, you want to get really good at it. 1842 01:44:04.720 --> 01:44:08.159 You know. I tried to memorize it all. I tried 1843 01:44:08.199 --> 01:44:10.279 to I tried to be really good at it. I 1844 01:44:10.319 --> 01:44:13.520 went to the temple and did all the time. All 1845 01:44:13.560 --> 01:44:16.119 the time. I went back and over and over and 1846 01:44:16.159 --> 01:44:19.760 over again. And then you get out of the church 1847 01:44:19.800 --> 01:44:21.199 and you look back and you go, well, that was 1848 01:44:21.239 --> 01:44:27.359 a waste of time, you know, right, Yeah, it would 1849 01:44:27.399 --> 01:44:30.319 have been better to go like help real people, like 1850 01:44:31.439 --> 01:44:33.520 in a homeless place or something. 1851 01:44:33.520 --> 01:44:33.760 You know. 1852 01:44:35.680 --> 01:44:38.760 Yeah, it seems like it contradicts the teachings of Jesus 1853 01:44:38.880 --> 01:44:43.560 quite a bit, you know. It seems you know, he's 1854 01:44:43.960 --> 01:44:47.840 knocking over the exchanging money at the church and all that, 1855 01:44:48.000 --> 01:44:50.920 and so how do they reconcile. 1856 01:44:50.439 --> 01:44:54.720 That they don't? You know that those were all some 1857 01:44:54.760 --> 01:44:57.880 of the things that made me ultimately realize that the 1858 01:44:57.960 --> 01:45:01.119 church was corrupt and why I left it. It was 1859 01:45:01.399 --> 01:45:04.239 one of the things they did was the church built 1860 01:45:04.760 --> 01:45:08.840 the City Creek Mall. They spent like almost forty million 1861 01:45:08.920 --> 01:45:12.119 dollars building a huge shopping mall right across the street 1862 01:45:12.199 --> 01:45:16.439 from the Salt Lake Temple. And to me, there's like, 1863 01:45:16.520 --> 01:45:18.920 straight up, like you said, the story right in the 1864 01:45:18.960 --> 01:45:23.800 Bible where Jesus goes to the temple and he sees 1865 01:45:24.439 --> 01:45:28.199 the priests, the Pharisees and the Sadducees and stuff the 1866 01:45:28.199 --> 01:45:31.239 priests of the temple and they're like working at the 1867 01:45:31.239 --> 01:45:33.199 steps of the temple and right across the street, and 1868 01:45:33.199 --> 01:45:36.560 they've turned it into a marketplace. So he gets mad 1869 01:45:37.079 --> 01:45:39.560 and literally chases him off with a whip, you know, 1870 01:45:39.880 --> 01:45:44.560 for desecrating his house. And then the Mormon Church spends 1871 01:45:44.600 --> 01:45:48.119 like forty million dollars and builds a giant outdoor shopping 1872 01:45:48.119 --> 01:45:50.880 mall right across the street. And I'm like, instead of 1873 01:45:50.920 --> 01:45:54.960 a homeless shelter or like something that actually helps people, 1874 01:45:55.000 --> 01:45:58.960 they built like a giant, multimillion dollars shopping mall. I'm like, 1875 01:45:59.079 --> 01:46:03.119 it's just obvious that if Jesus actually comes back, like 1876 01:46:03.119 --> 01:46:06.399 like they're counting on for doomsday, if he was going 1877 01:46:06.479 --> 01:46:09.560 to toss the tables over back then in Jerusalem, what 1878 01:46:09.600 --> 01:46:10.880 do you think is he's going to do to the 1879 01:46:10.880 --> 01:46:15.199 city creek mall like that, Like, what do you really 1880 01:46:15.239 --> 01:46:17.960 think is going to happen, like and they when you 1881 01:46:18.000 --> 01:46:19.760 bring that stuff up, like when I try to bring 1882 01:46:19.760 --> 01:46:21.760 it up with my brothers or anybody who's still a 1883 01:46:21.840 --> 01:46:26.079 member of the church, they just like they just say, well, 1884 01:46:26.239 --> 01:46:30.319 the corporations of the church are different than the religious 1885 01:46:30.359 --> 01:46:33.560 institutions of the church, and they just compartmentalize it all. 1886 01:46:33.600 --> 01:46:36.640 And they also say, like when I talk about Chad 1887 01:46:36.720 --> 01:46:40.000 Daybell murdering his kids in the backyard or whatever, they 1888 01:46:40.039 --> 01:46:43.600 just say, well, the members of the church are individual 1889 01:46:43.680 --> 01:46:47.039 people with problems. They don't represent the gospel or the 1890 01:46:47.319 --> 01:46:49.600 or the church as a whole, you know, And they 1891 01:46:49.680 --> 01:46:54.000 just have a way to rationalize anything that happens, you know, 1892 01:46:54.560 --> 01:46:57.119 like they look at the shopping mall, they look at 1893 01:46:57.159 --> 01:47:00.119 all of that, and instead of they're putting it on 1894 01:47:00.159 --> 01:47:03.319 their shelf and their shelf breaking, they just bottle all 1895 01:47:03.359 --> 01:47:05.960 that up like a pressure cooker and they just stay faithful, 1896 01:47:06.119 --> 01:47:08.319 you know, they just bury it and keep going. They 1897 01:47:08.319 --> 01:47:12.760 don't even question it. They doubt their doubts as soon 1898 01:47:12.760 --> 01:47:15.319 as they start to think about that. As soon as 1899 01:47:15.359 --> 01:47:17.439 they start to question it or start to feel like 1900 01:47:17.600 --> 01:47:21.840 that's bad, that must be a temptation from the from 1901 01:47:21.840 --> 01:47:23.760 the devil trying to get them to leave the church, 1902 01:47:23.840 --> 01:47:26.119 and so you just shut it off, you know, go 1903 01:47:26.159 --> 01:47:28.680 see your prayers and get back on to the rituals. 1904 01:47:29.000 --> 01:47:32.039 That's a line and a half. Doubt your dots out. 1905 01:47:31.920 --> 01:47:34.159 Your doubts collect slogan. 1906 01:47:34.560 --> 01:47:37.600 Well, my kids sometime when. 1907 01:47:37.359 --> 01:47:39.840 The prophet came out and said when the prophet came 1908 01:47:39.880 --> 01:47:42.680 out and said that, like over the pulpit, that was 1909 01:47:42.720 --> 01:47:45.279 like a whole thing like that was like a slogan 1910 01:47:45.399 --> 01:47:48.760 forever for like ten years, everybody went around in the 1911 01:47:48.840 --> 01:47:55.000 church saying that doubt your doubts. Yeah, and stay in 1912 01:47:55.039 --> 01:47:58.239 the boat. That was another one I've. 1913 01:47:58.079 --> 01:48:01.960 Heard that, Yeah, even when Catholicism and stuff. 1914 01:48:02.000 --> 01:48:06.680 You know, it's interesting, Yeah, similar to I've heard a 1915 01:48:06.680 --> 01:48:10.399 lot of similar things with Jehovah's witness that similar kind 1916 01:48:10.439 --> 01:48:13.359 of thing of the shunning, and yeah, it's. 1917 01:48:13.239 --> 01:48:17.359 Really interesting, a lot of similar patterns. I think some 1918 01:48:17.399 --> 01:48:20.359 of those organizations that were founded during that same era 1919 01:48:21.079 --> 01:48:25.680 that came up and became different American religions all have 1920 01:48:25.960 --> 01:48:28.600 sort of that that weird basis. 1921 01:48:29.359 --> 01:48:33.520 Yeah, there's there's even like like the Jove's Witnesses, like 1922 01:48:33.720 --> 01:48:40.680 the original guys they like built this house because there's 1923 01:48:40.720 --> 01:48:44.000 about seven dates they have for Armageddon, but I want 1924 01:48:44.000 --> 01:48:46.640 to say it was a nineteen fourteen date they chose, 1925 01:48:47.199 --> 01:48:51.600 and they built a whole house for the angels to 1926 01:48:52.039 --> 01:48:57.359 basically stay in for for Armageddon, like like angels would 1927 01:48:57.359 --> 01:48:59.600 need material items and right houses. 1928 01:48:59.640 --> 01:49:05.800 And that's the idea. What I can't get about, like 1929 01:49:05.960 --> 01:49:08.439 every Mormon temple and why they think there needs to 1930 01:49:08.520 --> 01:49:11.680 be a temple in New Jerusalem and they literally think 1931 01:49:11.720 --> 01:49:14.760 that the temple in Salt Lake City. So I've been there. 1932 01:49:14.800 --> 01:49:18.319 I've been inside the Salt Lake Temple, the main one. 1933 01:49:18.359 --> 01:49:20.239 I mean, they've got hundreds of temples all over the 1934 01:49:20.239 --> 01:49:23.359 world now, but the big main one in Salt Lake 1935 01:49:23.399 --> 01:49:26.760 City is very Masonic and very old school. It was 1936 01:49:26.800 --> 01:49:29.039 built like by Brigham Young back in the old day, 1937 01:49:29.119 --> 01:49:33.159 you know, like the original. And man, you go in 1938 01:49:33.239 --> 01:49:38.039 there and it's like they have a room in the 1939 01:49:38.159 --> 01:49:41.000 upper level, like you go up these spiral staircases, you 1940 01:49:41.039 --> 01:49:43.840 go through all the different stuff, and then once you 1941 01:49:44.279 --> 01:49:47.760 finish the endowment and you go through the veil, you're 1942 01:49:47.840 --> 01:49:50.039 in what they call the Celestial Room, and it's like 1943 01:49:50.079 --> 01:49:54.279 this big ornate room with all these stained glass and 1944 01:49:54.319 --> 01:49:56.760 it's like vaulted ceilings and all this crazy stuff, all 1945 01:49:56.960 --> 01:49:59.960 ornately done. But off to the side, there's like this 1946 01:50:00.199 --> 01:50:04.640 room that's like locked with these huge doors, and they've 1947 01:50:04.640 --> 01:50:07.720 got these big like vases, like planters with plants in 1948 01:50:07.760 --> 01:50:10.199 front of it, and there's like a person standing there 1949 01:50:10.199 --> 01:50:13.760 all dressed in white, and they swear that that's the 1950 01:50:13.800 --> 01:50:17.680 Holy of Holies, the exact same thing as what Moses 1951 01:50:17.680 --> 01:50:20.920 had in the Tabernacle, where they kept the Arc of 1952 01:50:20.960 --> 01:50:24.640 the Covenant, where God or Jehovah would appear. You know, 1953 01:50:24.680 --> 01:50:28.800 they would go through the different animal sacrifices out in 1954 01:50:28.840 --> 01:50:32.520 the outer chamber of the Tabernacle and then go in 1955 01:50:32.680 --> 01:50:34.960 and burn the incense and then go into the veil 1956 01:50:35.000 --> 01:50:37.119 into the Holy of Holies, and then God would appear 1957 01:50:38.039 --> 01:50:40.720 and tell the children of Israel what to do. And 1958 01:50:40.760 --> 01:50:43.880 in the Salt Lake Temple, they believe that they have 1959 01:50:45.039 --> 01:50:48.039 the real Holy of Holies and that it's there. Like 1960 01:50:48.079 --> 01:50:50.800 I've gone up and like touched the doorknob and the door. 1961 01:50:51.119 --> 01:50:53.039 There was one time where the doors were open and 1962 01:50:53.079 --> 01:50:57.119 I looked in the room. It's like all the walls 1963 01:50:57.199 --> 01:51:01.279 and that there's these two mirrors on either side. So 1964 01:51:01.319 --> 01:51:04.119 they like when you look in the mirror. They reflect 1965 01:51:04.119 --> 01:51:08.079 each other, like the walls are both giant mirrors, and 1966 01:51:08.119 --> 01:51:11.720 so like each mirror is like an infinity mirror. So 1967 01:51:11.760 --> 01:51:15.039 when you look in one, it reflects all the way 1968 01:51:15.199 --> 01:51:18.439 to the other for infinity in both directions. It's just 1969 01:51:18.560 --> 01:51:22.079 like two giant infinity mirrors. And then the whole room 1970 01:51:22.159 --> 01:51:24.479 is done with like all these rubies and gems and 1971 01:51:24.560 --> 01:51:28.399 jewels and like all this crazy ornate stuff and all 1972 01:51:28.520 --> 01:51:32.079 or elaborate. But yeah, they swear that the Mormon prophet 1973 01:51:32.159 --> 01:51:34.840 and the apostles or whatever go in there and they 1974 01:51:34.840 --> 01:51:37.319 say their prayers or whatever, and then like like Jesus 1975 01:51:37.359 --> 01:51:42.319 appears to them and tells them what to do. That's 1976 01:51:42.319 --> 01:51:44.359 why they are members of the church. Are like okay 1977 01:51:44.399 --> 01:51:46.800 with whatever they do. If they build a shopping mall 1978 01:51:46.960 --> 01:51:50.720 or whatever, if they hoard three hundred billion dollars, they 1979 01:51:50.720 --> 01:51:53.119 don't care because they think, you know, the Holy of 1980 01:51:53.159 --> 01:51:56.399 Holies like Gods is literally showing up in the slike 1981 01:51:56.439 --> 01:52:01.399 temple and running the church. They believe. They believe that 1982 01:52:01.439 --> 01:52:04.319 it is being run by Jesus, like the prophet is 1983 01:52:04.359 --> 01:52:10.640 just a spokesperson. Like my brother flat out believes that 1984 01:52:11.239 --> 01:52:16.680 Jesus appears and materializes in that room in the Holies 1985 01:52:16.680 --> 01:52:20.560 in Salt Lake and tells Russell M. Nelson what to 1986 01:52:20.560 --> 01:52:24.680 do with the church. Every every time he goes in there. Wow, 1987 01:52:26.079 --> 01:52:26.880 that's the belief. 1988 01:52:27.880 --> 01:52:28.920 That's true. 1989 01:52:30.439 --> 01:52:33.000 I'd argue there's something in there he's talking. 1990 01:52:32.720 --> 01:52:39.159 To, and he's talking to something for sure. It's all 1991 01:52:39.159 --> 01:52:44.439 the lawyers from Curtin McConkey. They're just handed him a 1992 01:52:44.479 --> 01:52:47.199 stack at child abuse lawsuits. He's got a deal and 1993 01:52:47.239 --> 01:52:55.159 that's what he's that's what he's thinking about in there. Ye. Yeah, 1994 01:52:55.199 --> 01:52:57.600 who knows what he's talking about or who he's talking to. 1995 01:52:57.920 --> 01:53:01.600 Where that all originated was from Joseph Smith doing that 1996 01:53:01.760 --> 01:53:05.359 and Nochian magic, putting a herestone in a hat, putting 1997 01:53:05.359 --> 01:53:07.279 his space in it, and then talking to God through 1998 01:53:07.319 --> 01:53:10.079 a rock in the hat. So like they still have 1999 01:53:10.199 --> 01:53:12.640 that rock and they still have the hat. So he 2000 01:53:12.680 --> 01:53:15.399 probably goes in there and tries to do that. Probably know, 2001 01:53:16.039 --> 01:53:17.399 Oh my god. 2002 01:53:18.359 --> 01:53:20.920 I gotta tell Carl something that happened when we did 2003 01:53:20.920 --> 01:53:22.279 that Eclipse episode. 2004 01:53:22.920 --> 01:53:23.640 Yeah, I was. 2005 01:53:23.840 --> 01:53:28.239 I was reading up on Joseph Smith looking into the hat. 2006 01:53:29.359 --> 01:53:35.399 And then at work the next day at one of 2007 01:53:35.399 --> 01:53:39.479 my restaurants, I delivered to this this lady walks out 2008 01:53:39.560 --> 01:53:44.279 with one of those old hats in her hand and 2009 01:53:44.479 --> 01:53:47.960 walks to her car and it was an old one too, 2010 01:53:48.479 --> 01:53:50.359 gets in the car and drives off. 2011 01:53:52.159 --> 01:53:56.439 Really, what the heck out of a restaurant too? 2012 01:53:56.560 --> 01:53:59.840 Oh my god? What are the odds on top hat? 2013 01:54:00.680 --> 01:54:02.840 Just like that, just an old copad in her hand, 2014 01:54:02.840 --> 01:54:04.960 and she's like waiting across the street. 2015 01:54:05.840 --> 01:54:07.600 And she didn't come out until as soon. 2016 01:54:07.479 --> 01:54:10.239 As I pulled into the plates and there where the 2017 01:54:10.319 --> 01:54:11.119 restaurant is at. 2018 01:54:12.039 --> 01:54:20.000 Yeah, that's hilarious. Yes, I still have to just because 2019 01:54:20.000 --> 01:54:23.199 of just because of being brought up in the church. 2020 01:54:23.279 --> 01:54:26.239 Like we were joking earlier about how like when my 2021 01:54:26.279 --> 01:54:28.920 car won't start or something, I'll like talk to it 2022 01:54:29.000 --> 01:54:31.960 and still like catch myself like I'm praying or something. 2023 01:54:32.000 --> 01:54:34.680 Even though I don't have those beliefs anymore, it's like 2024 01:54:34.680 --> 01:54:37.880 baked into me. I still when I go places, like 2025 01:54:38.319 --> 01:54:41.000 when I go up and visit like Skinwalker Ranch, or 2026 01:54:41.239 --> 01:54:44.760 I'm someplace where there's supposed to be a UFO crash 2027 01:54:44.880 --> 01:54:48.760 or whatever, I cannot help myself. I like I have 2028 01:54:48.840 --> 01:54:53.039 to find a weird looking rock and like take it 2029 01:54:53.079 --> 01:54:55.479 and I bring it back and I feel like somehow 2030 01:54:55.520 --> 01:54:58.640 deepen down like like this rock knows and wants to 2031 01:54:58.680 --> 01:55:01.279 come home with me and I and I don't care, 2032 01:55:01.399 --> 01:55:03.279 like I know that some of that comes from the 2033 01:55:03.359 --> 01:55:06.840 Church and from Joseph Smith and the Seerstone thing, because 2034 01:55:06.920 --> 01:55:09.800 like you're always like I wonder if there's a Searstone 2035 01:55:09.840 --> 01:55:13.319 for me, you know, and so like like I have 2036 01:55:13.520 --> 01:55:16.760 my desk right now, I've got rocks from Skinwalker ranching 2037 01:55:16.840 --> 01:55:18.800 all over the place and all over my house because 2038 01:55:18.840 --> 01:55:20.640 I like, I can't help myself. It's like one of 2039 01:55:20.680 --> 01:55:23.399 those one of those things probably from the Church and 2040 01:55:23.520 --> 01:55:26.880 Joseph Smith and Seerstone. Where now I'm a little like 2041 01:55:26.920 --> 01:55:29.880 a rock collector. When I go somewhere special, I'm like 2042 01:55:29.960 --> 01:55:32.920 that rock's supposed to come home with me. That's a 2043 01:55:32.960 --> 01:55:33.640 special one. 2044 01:55:35.720 --> 01:55:35.840 Man. 2045 01:55:35.880 --> 01:55:36.800 I don't feel bad. 2046 01:55:37.000 --> 01:55:37.600 I got them all. 2047 01:55:39.520 --> 01:55:42.000 Are you like going through my phone or something? 2048 01:55:42.079 --> 01:55:45.000 I swear every every time we talk, you talk about 2049 01:55:45.000 --> 01:55:48.479 the very things I'm looking into weeks before. 2050 01:55:50.560 --> 01:55:53.439 Feels like that sometimes, right, for sure. 2051 01:55:53.920 --> 01:55:57.119 It does feel like that sometimes. Do you have any 2052 01:55:57.159 --> 01:55:57.800 ams tonight? 2053 01:55:58.920 --> 01:56:03.880 Don't have any what Amson night? And it's Amazon? 2054 01:56:04.279 --> 01:56:08.279 Amazon? Amazon Night? Yeah, like Amazon, I don't think. 2055 01:56:08.079 --> 01:56:09.359 I do, huh. 2056 01:56:09.560 --> 01:56:13.039 No, all right, it's a stone, a crystal, right, Yeah, 2057 01:56:13.520 --> 01:56:16.000 it was special powers or something. 2058 01:56:16.720 --> 01:56:22.000 Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it's like supposedly like one of the. 2059 01:56:21.199 --> 01:56:24.119 Solomon warred on his chest. We got tons of it 2060 01:56:24.199 --> 01:56:26.239 out here in Colorado. The youths used to pull it 2061 01:56:26.239 --> 01:56:28.680 out of the ground and make medicine wheels with it. 2062 01:56:28.680 --> 01:56:30.600 It's like a bluish greenstone. 2063 01:56:31.359 --> 01:56:34.680 Oh okay, Yeah, it's kind it's kind of like turquoise, 2064 01:56:34.720 --> 01:56:36.000 but it's it's different. 2065 01:56:37.600 --> 01:56:37.800 Yeah. 2066 01:56:37.840 --> 01:56:40.319 I might actually have a piece of that out on 2067 01:56:40.359 --> 01:56:42.960 my entertainment center by my TV. I didn't know what 2068 01:56:43.000 --> 01:56:45.279 it was called, but that's probably it. It looks like 2069 01:56:45.439 --> 01:56:48.279 turquoise like blue with like this a weird almost it 2070 01:56:48.279 --> 01:56:53.560 looks almost like toothpaste, like like a turquoise green going through. 2071 01:56:53.359 --> 01:56:55.960 It, exactly. 2072 01:56:56.600 --> 01:56:57.199 Yeah. 2073 01:56:57.760 --> 01:57:03.800 The Egyptians, the Phoenicians, you, King Solomon on his breastplate 2074 01:57:03.920 --> 01:57:05.800 had one in it and it was really important to 2075 01:57:05.840 --> 01:57:06.159 the hut. 2076 01:57:07.359 --> 01:57:09.000 So it's pretty special stone. 2077 01:57:09.479 --> 01:57:11.920 That's cool. Yeah, I'm into it. I wish I was 2078 01:57:11.960 --> 01:57:14.000 better at geology, and I wish I knew more of 2079 01:57:14.039 --> 01:57:15.920 them more. Most of it's just like that's a weird 2080 01:57:15.960 --> 01:57:17.880 looking rock, and so I take it home with me 2081 01:57:18.640 --> 01:57:20.800 and then sometimes I find out later what it is. 2082 01:57:20.880 --> 01:57:24.720 But yeah, that's cool. I like stuff like that. 2083 01:57:24.800 --> 01:57:28.720 But all right, uh, if you guys don't mind, just 2084 01:57:28.800 --> 01:57:30.800 due to time and stuff, I'm gonna probably have to 2085 01:57:30.800 --> 01:57:34.920 wrap this episode up, uh, Carl, I will definitely if 2086 01:57:34.960 --> 01:57:36.439 you don't mind, I would love to get you back 2087 01:57:36.479 --> 01:57:38.359 on in the future and actually talk about this little 2088 01:57:38.399 --> 01:57:40.960 machine you got going on and everything else going on separately. 2089 01:57:41.000 --> 01:57:42.880 Maybe we can get you on because if I pull 2090 01:57:42.920 --> 01:57:44.039 that up now, we're going to be in here for 2091 01:57:44.039 --> 01:57:45.119 another twenty thirty minutes. 2092 01:57:45.159 --> 01:57:46.880 So yeah, you know what I'm saying. 2093 01:57:46.960 --> 01:57:49.119 Yeah, yeah, conversation. 2094 01:57:48.760 --> 01:57:50.800 Yeah yeah, And I'm actually thinking like if I give 2095 01:57:50.840 --> 01:57:52.800 you some time, you might actually just have more stuff 2096 01:57:52.800 --> 01:57:54.119 to talk about anyway, you know. 2097 01:57:54.359 --> 01:57:57.279 Along, Yeah, that's all kind of tentative. We got, yeah, 2098 01:57:57.520 --> 01:58:00.319 big announcements coming with the modular study that we have 2099 01:58:00.479 --> 01:58:03.880 going on with doctor Gym Sigala, but all that's still tentative, 2100 01:58:03.960 --> 01:58:06.920 but hopefully being able to make a big announcement soon. 2101 01:58:06.960 --> 01:58:08.560 But yeah, we'll save that for another. 2102 01:58:08.359 --> 01:58:10.760 One, definitely, definitely, And if that definitely goes through, I'll 2103 01:58:10.760 --> 01:58:12.199 have you on just to you know, talk about like 2104 01:58:12.239 --> 01:58:16.079 you said, so thank you very much. Call, I always 2105 01:58:16.079 --> 01:58:18.319 appreciate your stories. I know this one is a little 2106 01:58:18.319 --> 01:58:20.439 bit different, like the last episode was a little bit 2107 01:58:20.479 --> 01:58:23.279 more personal about your other things. But uh, this is 2108 01:58:23.319 --> 01:58:25.880 a plethora of information and just to hear the experience 2109 01:58:25.880 --> 01:58:28.600 that somebody had, you know, and thank you for you know, 2110 01:58:28.720 --> 01:58:30.840 very much for being so candid and just open and honest. 2111 01:58:31.359 --> 01:58:32.640 You know, I appreciate that pleasure. 2112 01:58:32.960 --> 01:58:36.399 Yes, yes, and uh, Teresa, real quick, let everybody know 2113 01:58:36.399 --> 01:58:39.159 where they can find your wonderful show at. 2114 01:58:40.039 --> 01:58:40.279 Yeah. 2115 01:58:40.359 --> 01:58:43.520 So I have the Spiritual Gangsters, which is on of 2116 01:58:43.520 --> 01:58:47.439 course YouTube, Rumble, all the audio platforms where you can 2117 01:58:47.439 --> 01:58:51.279 find podcasts, and also doing my tinfoil hats again, so 2118 01:58:51.359 --> 01:58:54.159 if anyone wants a hat that says whatever you want 2119 01:58:54.199 --> 01:58:55.920 on it. But a lot of people seem to like 2120 01:58:55.960 --> 01:58:58.600 the tinfoil one. But yeah, I'm doing those right now 2121 01:58:59.000 --> 01:59:01.159 and those are all my link tree and whatnot. 2122 01:59:01.319 --> 01:59:04.359 Yeah, definitely go check those out tin foil hats or 2123 01:59:04.399 --> 01:59:07.720 whatever else you get. A RIZ no cap. 2124 01:59:08.000 --> 01:59:12.720 Yeah for the teens out there folk, the Riz and 2125 01:59:12.800 --> 01:59:15.239 skivity and all this know what they mean. 2126 01:59:16.640 --> 01:59:19.159 Awesome, Yeah, her links, her links will be. 2127 01:59:19.199 --> 01:59:21.840 In the bottom and Carl, let everybody know again where 2128 01:59:21.880 --> 01:59:23.439 they can find your work as well. 2129 01:59:24.479 --> 01:59:29.159 Yeah, just look up Carl Crusher on YouTube, Instagram, everywhere, rumble. 2130 01:59:29.199 --> 01:59:30.960 If you type in Carl Crusher you'll be able to 2131 01:59:31.000 --> 01:59:32.319 find me. You should pop right up. 2132 01:59:33.039 --> 01:59:33.399 Awesome. 2133 01:59:33.399 --> 01:59:35.239 Thank you very much and I will have your show 2134 01:59:35.279 --> 01:59:38.279 notes in the bottom and thrash of Mike. Thank you 2135 01:59:38.439 --> 01:59:41.960 very much for coming on again as usual. I'm sure 2136 01:59:42.000 --> 01:59:45.439 I will see you guys shortly as well. Yeah, and 2137 01:59:45.520 --> 01:59:48.279 that is the end of another Occult Rejects and until 2138 01:59:48.319 --> 01:59:50.560 the next one, everybody be well. 2139 01:59:50.680 --> 01:59:50.880 Later