1 00:00:16,079 --> 00:00:18,879 Speaker 1: And we are back with another edition of the Federalist 2 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:22,359 Radio Hour. I'm Matt Kittle, senior Elections correspondent at The 3 00:00:22,359 --> 00:00:27,120 Federalist and your experienced Shirpa on today's quest for Knowledge. 4 00:00:27,559 --> 00:00:29,839 As always, you can email the show at radio at 5 00:00:29,879 --> 00:00:34,079 the Federalist dot com, follow us on x at FDR LST, 6 00:00:34,840 --> 00:00:37,880 make sure to subscribe wherever you download your podcast, and 7 00:00:37,920 --> 00:00:40,960 of course to the premium version of our website as well. 8 00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:45,840 Our guest today is Tristan Justice, excellent reporter for The 9 00:00:45,880 --> 00:00:50,240 Federalist and author of the new book Fat and Unhappy, 10 00:00:50,840 --> 00:00:56,840 How body Positivity is Killing Us and How to Save Yourself. Tristan, 11 00:00:57,479 --> 00:01:00,280 thank you so much for being here on this of 12 00:01:00,320 --> 00:01:01,399 the Federalist Radio Hour. 13 00:01:02,600 --> 00:01:04,200 Speaker 2: Thank you grabbing me. It always fun to be on. 14 00:01:04,920 --> 00:01:09,439 Speaker 1: This is your first foray in two authorship as it 15 00:01:09,519 --> 00:01:14,680 relates to books. You've written thousands of stories, excellent investigative 16 00:01:14,719 --> 00:01:18,000 pieces over your journalism career, but this is your first book. 17 00:01:18,280 --> 00:01:20,599 Let's start there. How does it feel to be a 18 00:01:20,719 --> 00:01:24,280 published author of a book that is doing quite well? 19 00:01:24,319 --> 00:01:25,439 As I understand it. 20 00:01:26,799 --> 00:01:27,920 Speaker 2: Right hot off the press. 21 00:01:28,200 --> 00:01:30,400 Speaker 3: So we were number five, and we got to number three, 22 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:33,400 number two, and new releases on nutrition and Amazon, so 23 00:01:33,640 --> 00:01:36,400 that was just really exciting to see. But no, I 24 00:01:36,480 --> 00:01:40,920 always had this interest in nutrition, mental health, just health broadly. 25 00:01:40,959 --> 00:01:42,400 Speaker 2: It was actually one of the first topics that. 26 00:01:42,359 --> 00:01:45,239 Speaker 3: I'd been writing out writing about at the Federalist when 27 00:01:45,239 --> 00:01:48,000 I started this job five years ago, and about a 28 00:01:48,079 --> 00:01:50,840 year and a half ago I came up with this idea. 29 00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:54,640 I made like a ten point outline and sent it 30 00:01:54,640 --> 00:01:57,480 to Molly Hemingway and she loved the idea, told me 31 00:01:57,519 --> 00:01:59,640 to run with it, and then two years later, here 32 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:02,560 we are promoting the book on Federalist Radio Hour. 33 00:02:02,680 --> 00:02:04,040 Speaker 2: So it's a huge relief. 34 00:02:05,680 --> 00:02:08,680 Speaker 3: It's a project I felt passionately about, I felt strongly about, 35 00:02:09,159 --> 00:02:11,840 and I'm excited to see people are starting to read 36 00:02:11,840 --> 00:02:12,439 it well. 37 00:02:12,479 --> 00:02:16,840 Speaker 1: It's very well written and always timely, but even more timely, 38 00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:19,759 I think than it would have been even you know, 39 00:02:19,879 --> 00:02:23,000 three or four years ago, because so much has changed, 40 00:02:23,039 --> 00:02:25,520 and as you noted in your book, so much of 41 00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:29,879 this is politics and power. But I must admit, my friend, 42 00:02:30,120 --> 00:02:32,719 this comes at an interesting time, the release of this 43 00:02:32,759 --> 00:02:37,199 book right around Thanksgiving and the Christmas holiday season, the 44 00:02:37,199 --> 00:02:41,919 holiday season in general, where everybody is walking that line 45 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:45,759 of oh do I have that second plate of cookies. Well, 46 00:02:45,759 --> 00:02:49,000 maybe that's my particular issue. It certainly is how much 47 00:02:49,039 --> 00:02:52,280 more turkey can I possibly eat? Or ham and all 48 00:02:52,319 --> 00:02:55,680 of the stuff. We're all dealing with this kind of 49 00:02:55,719 --> 00:03:00,000 thing because this is a nation that has become very 50 00:03:00,159 --> 00:03:05,759 fat based on the numbers, and in many ways very unhappy. 51 00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:09,520 How do folks navigate through all of that, particularly this 52 00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:10,439 time of the year. 53 00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:14,319 Speaker 3: Well, it definitely makes me feel like the most popular 54 00:03:14,360 --> 00:03:17,120 person at the dinner table telling everybody what's in their food. 55 00:03:18,199 --> 00:03:21,360 So there is that no. I mean, well, for one, 56 00:03:21,439 --> 00:03:24,319 eat the ham, eat meat. We are very pro meat 57 00:03:24,319 --> 00:03:28,000 in the book, I think, but one of the things 58 00:03:28,120 --> 00:03:29,080 is no. 59 00:03:29,400 --> 00:03:30,639 Speaker 2: And I thought about this. 60 00:03:30,599 --> 00:03:32,039 Speaker 3: When the publisher said it was going to come out 61 00:03:32,080 --> 00:03:34,400 right for Thanksgiving. I said, Wow, what a way to 62 00:03:34,439 --> 00:03:37,159 become a popular author telling people to pay attention to 63 00:03:37,159 --> 00:03:40,360 the work they're eating about around the holidays. So the 64 00:03:40,479 --> 00:03:43,599 cookies enjoyer family, spend time. You know, it's food is 65 00:03:43,680 --> 00:03:46,360 such a cultural cultural thing. But I think in our 66 00:03:46,599 --> 00:03:50,759 everyday lives, Americans have begun to treat every day like 67 00:03:50,800 --> 00:03:54,400 a holiday. And you really see that play out throughout 68 00:03:54,439 --> 00:03:59,199 the data. Sugar consumption has risen nine percent since eighteen 69 00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:03,680 hundred and so as the American diet has just fundamentally 70 00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:06,719 transformed for the past few hundred years with the industrial Revolution, 71 00:04:06,840 --> 00:04:10,199 it's become industrialized, and our food is manufactured. 72 00:04:10,199 --> 00:04:11,879 Speaker 2: We don't know even know where it comes from. 73 00:04:12,000 --> 00:04:14,879 Speaker 3: We don't know who grew it, who made it. It 74 00:04:14,919 --> 00:04:18,639 was often manufactured in a factory three states away, grown 75 00:04:18,959 --> 00:04:19,920 four states beyond that. 76 00:04:21,120 --> 00:04:22,240 Speaker 2: People think milk comes. 77 00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:26,480 Speaker 3: From the grocery store and so, but I think Americans 78 00:04:26,519 --> 00:04:29,040 should be cognizant of how they're living in their everyday 79 00:04:29,040 --> 00:04:33,240 life because what we've been doing for the past seventy 80 00:04:33,319 --> 00:04:37,480 eighty ninety years is obviously not working. Forty two percent 81 00:04:37,519 --> 00:04:40,600 of the nation is categorically obese. More than seventy percent 82 00:04:40,639 --> 00:04:43,560 of the country is overweight, So that means if you 83 00:04:43,600 --> 00:04:46,279 are at an otherwise healthy weight, you are in the minority. 84 00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:50,800 For six and ten Americans have at least one chronic 85 00:04:50,800 --> 00:04:53,879 disease already four and ten have at least two or more. 86 00:04:55,800 --> 00:04:59,160 About one in five have excuse me, about one in 87 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:02,879 ten have five or more. And so you're seeing these 88 00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:07,199 twin epidemics of obesity and chronic disease just explode over 89 00:05:07,199 --> 00:05:11,560 the past especially seventy years, and I think most of it, 90 00:05:11,560 --> 00:05:13,879 it all has to do with our food supply, how 91 00:05:13,920 --> 00:05:16,639 we're eating, how we're living, and we're also seeing that 92 00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:20,399 play out with this mental health crisis. People view the 93 00:05:20,439 --> 00:05:22,839 mess separately, but they're really not. That was one of 94 00:05:22,839 --> 00:05:24,879 the things that really surprised me as I was doing 95 00:05:24,879 --> 00:05:27,720 the research for this book is just how much our 96 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:32,040 mental health crisis has exploded alongside our physical crisis, and 97 00:05:32,079 --> 00:05:35,879 they're really one and the same. One in five Americans 98 00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:39,959 already have some sort of mental health or substance abuse disorder. 99 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:42,480 At least half of American adults can expect to meet the 100 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:45,160 criteria for a mental health disorder. 101 00:05:44,759 --> 00:05:45,519 Speaker 2: In their lifetime. 102 00:05:46,160 --> 00:05:48,600 Speaker 3: And so, and I was doing the research for the book, 103 00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:51,040 I found, you know, the brain is really no different 104 00:05:51,560 --> 00:05:54,279 from any other organ in the body, and that if 105 00:05:54,319 --> 00:05:57,040 you are not nourishing it properly, it is not going 106 00:05:57,079 --> 00:05:58,240 to function properly. 107 00:05:59,079 --> 00:06:00,720 Speaker 2: And so you're seeing. 108 00:06:00,920 --> 00:06:04,879 Speaker 3: These you know, this health crisis continue to swell and 109 00:06:04,959 --> 00:06:08,759 swell and swell, and it's all kind of one crisis. 110 00:06:08,920 --> 00:06:12,879 It's all metabolic dysfunction driven by a toxic food supply. 111 00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:17,920 Speaker 1: Of course, all of these screens that we have subjected 112 00:06:17,920 --> 00:06:22,120 ourselves to and modern life has subjected us to not 113 00:06:22,319 --> 00:06:26,040 helping the brain health issues. Certainly we can delve into 114 00:06:26,160 --> 00:06:28,680 that coming up at a later point. But you know, 115 00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:32,800 it's interesting you noted a bit ago about how Americans, 116 00:06:32,839 --> 00:06:37,199 and obviously true, they don't know where their food is 117 00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:40,040 coming from in so many ways. And I'm telling you 118 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:43,759 that as a guy talking to you from the great 119 00:06:43,879 --> 00:06:48,199 state of Iowa, the red state of Iowa, farm country. 120 00:06:48,399 --> 00:06:50,920 This is hogland if there ever was. I mean, this 121 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:54,560 is corn country. We know where our food is coming 122 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:57,079 from in Iowa. There are still a lot of fat 123 00:06:57,120 --> 00:07:03,000 people in Iowa, and you know that is the issue. 124 00:07:03,120 --> 00:07:07,319 While even those who know and live next to farms 125 00:07:07,439 --> 00:07:11,160 know where their food is grown, we don't exactly know 126 00:07:11,240 --> 00:07:16,680 what happens to it on the farm and to the. 127 00:07:16,560 --> 00:07:21,000 Speaker 3: Market, right and what we're growing isn't necessarily the most 128 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:25,120 conducive to a healthy society. The reason we grow so 129 00:07:25,199 --> 00:07:27,759 much wheat, corn and soi is because we subsidize it 130 00:07:28,720 --> 00:07:32,240 like crazy in this country. And we continue to subsidize 131 00:07:32,240 --> 00:07:34,439 it because the food industry has gotten really good at 132 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:38,000 making us subsidize it. The food industry lobby is on 133 00:07:38,120 --> 00:07:40,600 par with the defense lobby in Washington. I would argue 134 00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:43,480 it's actually probably a little more powerful than the defense 135 00:07:43,519 --> 00:07:47,160 industry in Washington. But I think it just speaks to 136 00:07:47,240 --> 00:07:52,480 general awareness of how the self awareness Americans generally have 137 00:07:52,519 --> 00:07:54,360 about their diet. I think there's a lot of ignorance 138 00:07:54,399 --> 00:07:57,199 about what a healthy diet really is because there's so 139 00:07:57,279 --> 00:08:01,000 much misinformation out there, and people get confused, and they 140 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:04,600 get confused from institutions that otherwise should know better, like 141 00:08:04,639 --> 00:08:08,759 their government that promoted this low fat diet. 142 00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:09,839 Speaker 2: For seventy years. 143 00:08:09,920 --> 00:08:13,079 Speaker 3: And now we're really reaping the consequences of that, because 144 00:08:13,560 --> 00:08:16,120 I think the data is pretty clear now that the 145 00:08:16,160 --> 00:08:19,519 low fat diet was catastrophic. We have about twenty five 146 00:08:20,079 --> 00:08:26,560 good studies and men analyzes contradicting the narrative that saturated 147 00:08:26,600 --> 00:08:30,160 fat is linked with heart disease. So the low fat 148 00:08:30,199 --> 00:08:34,399 diet was this kind of charade that took over public 149 00:08:34,399 --> 00:08:38,759 health institutions, and Americans embraced out of concern for their health. 150 00:08:38,960 --> 00:08:41,679 You had since nineteen seventy grain consumption in this country 151 00:08:41,720 --> 00:08:44,679 go up by thirty percent, and that's from the Pew 152 00:08:44,720 --> 00:08:48,440 Research Center, And so Americans embraced things like the low 153 00:08:48,480 --> 00:08:51,960 fat diet and now you're seeing the consequences of that 154 00:08:52,000 --> 00:08:56,759 seventy years later, with these epidemics of obesd chronic disease, 155 00:08:57,720 --> 00:08:59,080 and mental health. 156 00:09:00,120 --> 00:09:02,360 Speaker 1: There are so many fad diets and that has been 157 00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:04,799 the case, of course for years and years, especially as 158 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:10,240 we became this fat conscious society, this obesity conscious society, 159 00:09:10,279 --> 00:09:12,120 all of that sort of thing. And I want to 160 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:14,759 get into that, but it's an interesting point that you 161 00:09:14,960 --> 00:09:18,639 raise about how much money is involved, how much power 162 00:09:18,720 --> 00:09:21,919 is involved in the food industry. But it means a 163 00:09:21,960 --> 00:09:26,000 lot of jobs in this country, it means a lot 164 00:09:26,039 --> 00:09:29,320 of wealth in this country. Certainly as I talk to 165 00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:33,840 you in farm country, there's a huge lobby here for 166 00:09:33,960 --> 00:09:36,399 all of that sort of thing. So how do you 167 00:09:36,480 --> 00:09:41,480 go about changing that? I know that we have a 168 00:09:42,200 --> 00:09:45,480 nominee for the Department of Health and Human Services in 169 00:09:46,919 --> 00:09:50,279 Bobby Kennedy Junior, who wants to make America healthy again. 170 00:09:50,919 --> 00:09:52,799 How do you take on so much money? 171 00:09:54,960 --> 00:09:57,600 Speaker 3: Well, that's the four and a half trillion dollar question, right. 172 00:09:58,600 --> 00:10:01,320 So I think we can do I just think we 173 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:03,639 could do things better. I think we can grow our 174 00:10:03,639 --> 00:10:06,919 food better. We can grow better food better ways, more 175 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:10,159 sustainable ways. And I think that's going to be a 176 00:10:10,200 --> 00:10:14,080 primary key to making America healthy again. We don't need 177 00:10:14,120 --> 00:10:17,919 to subsidize wheat, corn and soy the way we do 178 00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:19,559 in this country. So much of that corn gets to 179 00:10:19,559 --> 00:10:22,759 turned into sugar high fruit toast corn syrup, and so 180 00:10:23,159 --> 00:10:25,240 I just think we can do things better and we 181 00:10:25,279 --> 00:10:28,679 don't have to pay for that in lost jobs. We 182 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:30,639 don't have to pay for that in some of these 183 00:10:30,639 --> 00:10:32,960 different ways that the food industry likes to fear monger. 184 00:10:34,039 --> 00:10:39,399 We can incentivize organic farming and ranching, we can subsidize 185 00:10:39,720 --> 00:10:43,279 healthier products, and there's so many things that Robert F. 186 00:10:43,360 --> 00:10:45,159 Kennedy Junior is going to be able to do at 187 00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:47,440 the top of AHHS. So on one hand, it's a 188 00:10:47,440 --> 00:10:50,159 really exciting time. But I also want to emphasize, and 189 00:10:50,200 --> 00:10:52,480 this is what makes me the most probably unpopular person 190 00:10:52,519 --> 00:10:54,799 at the dinner table, is that at the end of 191 00:10:54,799 --> 00:10:56,639 the day, we're all still a product of our choices. 192 00:10:56,799 --> 00:10:59,679 You know, when we can blow the whistle on the 193 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:02,240 cigarettes causing cancer, for example, but at the end of 194 00:11:02,279 --> 00:11:05,120 the day, Americans still had to quit smoking. And so 195 00:11:05,879 --> 00:11:08,559 that paradigm is the same thing that's playing it with 196 00:11:08,600 --> 00:11:11,679 food today. And I think we're one of the primary 197 00:11:11,679 --> 00:11:13,759 themes of my book is that our food supply has 198 00:11:13,799 --> 00:11:15,000 become addictive. 199 00:11:15,919 --> 00:11:17,720 Speaker 2: And there's so many parallels. 200 00:11:17,200 --> 00:11:19,559 Speaker 3: With big tobacco and big food here, and I think 201 00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:21,200 we that's one of the things I think we did 202 00:11:21,279 --> 00:11:24,159 really well in this book is outline how we have 203 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:27,679 an extremely addictive food supply and we need to look 204 00:11:27,720 --> 00:11:30,799 at our food supply the way we do with tobacco. 205 00:11:31,320 --> 00:11:35,440 And one example I like to tell people is, you know, 206 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:38,360 the next time they go to eat something out of stress, 207 00:11:38,440 --> 00:11:41,639 whether it's some type of favor cereal or some type 208 00:11:41,639 --> 00:11:45,399 of candy bar, to kind of meditate on the kind 209 00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:48,240 of trance state that people will go into when they're 210 00:11:48,240 --> 00:11:49,279 consuming these products. 211 00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:51,399 Speaker 2: I mean, it is. 212 00:11:50,759 --> 00:11:54,440 Speaker 3: So powerful that the chemicals that are released in our 213 00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:57,600 brain when we're more consuming something like a bowl of 214 00:11:57,600 --> 00:12:03,360 cocoa puffs or something else is such highly sugary and 215 00:12:03,440 --> 00:12:11,320 highly processed. There's system molecules to the chemicals released from marijuana, 216 00:12:11,720 --> 00:12:14,200 and so that's what we're dealing with. We've essentially the 217 00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:17,879 food industry is essentially engineered a nation of heroin addicts 218 00:12:17,960 --> 00:12:22,480 shopping grocery stores full of heroin. I am convinced that's 219 00:12:22,519 --> 00:12:25,679 how strong our national food addiction has become and we're 220 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:27,759 seeing that really play out in the data by just 221 00:12:27,799 --> 00:12:30,639 how sick everyone's is becoming. And I think everyone kind 222 00:12:30,639 --> 00:12:32,879 of understands that a lot of the foods that they're 223 00:12:32,919 --> 00:12:37,600 eating is generally unhealthy, but then they get tricked by 224 00:12:37,879 --> 00:12:40,759 healthy labels in the boxes telling them that these different 225 00:12:40,759 --> 00:12:43,480 products are still healthy when they still have twelve, thirteen, 226 00:12:43,519 --> 00:12:44,960 fourteen grams of sugar in them. 227 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:47,759 Speaker 2: So the food industry praise on that ignorance. 228 00:12:48,039 --> 00:12:50,759 Speaker 3: At the end of the day, Americans, we are product 229 00:12:50,759 --> 00:12:54,120 of our choices, and that's why people should buy my 230 00:12:54,159 --> 00:12:57,759 book and see kind of some strategies of how to 231 00:12:57,799 --> 00:12:59,200 come out of that twilight zone. 232 00:12:59,399 --> 00:13:01,240 Speaker 1: Knowing you're right, we are a product of choices, and 233 00:13:01,279 --> 00:13:04,360 we're blessed to be. We are a product of choices 234 00:13:04,440 --> 00:13:07,840 because of the great blessings of this republic, because of 235 00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:11,360 the Founding Document, because of the freedoms that we have, 236 00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:15,559 that freedom of choice, and well, we've kind of talked 237 00:13:15,600 --> 00:13:21,679 about this. Nobody is despised more than a scold. Ask 238 00:13:21,799 --> 00:13:27,440 Hillary Rodham, Clinton, ask Michelle Obama in this particular context. 239 00:13:27,519 --> 00:13:30,360 And I believe me, Tristan, my friend, I am not 240 00:13:30,399 --> 00:13:34,600 equating you to either of those skolds. But you know 241 00:13:34,639 --> 00:13:38,399 a lot of Americans, like yours truly, we have done 242 00:13:38,519 --> 00:13:41,960 things in our lives like quit smoking because we know 243 00:13:42,080 --> 00:13:45,399 how awful it is. And a lot of folks have 244 00:13:45,480 --> 00:13:48,639 cut down on drinking because they know the health related 245 00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:54,480 problems therein, or any number of behaviors that they understand 246 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:59,320 and have been told constantly this could really damage you 247 00:13:59,519 --> 00:14:05,320 physic mentally and ultimately kill you. And the one the 248 00:14:05,360 --> 00:14:09,639 one vestige of freedom that we all think that we have, 249 00:14:10,519 --> 00:14:16,559 the one last area that is not seen as heroin 250 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:22,879 or some you know, awful drug is food, you know, 251 00:14:23,080 --> 00:14:28,440 but now that's becoming just like cigarettes or the scolds 252 00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:31,679 are telling us this is just like cigarettes or heroin 253 00:14:31,799 --> 00:14:36,080 or what have you. And there is a natural resistance 254 00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:38,799 to that. You kind of talked about it, but how 255 00:14:38,840 --> 00:14:42,080 do you break through that resistance as the consumer? 256 00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:43,120 Speaker 4: Right? 257 00:14:43,159 --> 00:14:45,279 Speaker 3: Well, Americans don't like to be lectured, and we really 258 00:14:45,279 --> 00:14:48,200 saw that play out with Michelle Obamas Let's Move campaign. 259 00:14:48,799 --> 00:14:52,519 She launched this initiative just as Americans were reeling from 260 00:14:52,639 --> 00:14:55,799 the two thousand and eight financial crisis, and it was 261 00:14:56,399 --> 00:15:03,200 very much in elite driven campaign, recruiting celebrities lecturing children 262 00:15:03,240 --> 00:15:06,679 and parents about the obesity crisis. But I think Michelle 263 00:15:06,679 --> 00:15:08,639 Obama made two mistakes in that. One, she tried to 264 00:15:08,639 --> 00:15:10,799 make an ally of the very industry she was trying 265 00:15:10,799 --> 00:15:14,960 to defeat, the food industry. The food industry lobbied so 266 00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:18,879 effectively to take out any teeth from the bipartisan legislation 267 00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:21,480 that was the legislative pillar of that campaign. 268 00:15:21,559 --> 00:15:25,159 Speaker 2: So there's that. But also I think. 269 00:15:25,039 --> 00:15:29,360 Speaker 3: The Obomba administration made a fundamental mistake by almost kind 270 00:15:29,399 --> 00:15:33,080 of blaming parents and children for the crisis while they 271 00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:35,600 were trying to make friends with the food industry. And 272 00:15:35,639 --> 00:15:38,519 I think the approach that Kennedy is embracing is going 273 00:15:38,600 --> 00:15:41,960 to be much more effective. We're a little farther removed 274 00:15:41,960 --> 00:15:45,279 from the COVID crisis than the Obama administration was from 275 00:15:45,480 --> 00:15:50,919 the jous and A financial crisis. And also I think 276 00:15:51,039 --> 00:15:54,840 what Kennedy's doing, far different from what Obama was doing, 277 00:15:55,559 --> 00:15:59,200 was that he's convincing Americans to put down the junk food, 278 00:15:59,279 --> 00:16:01,120 not by just telling them put down the junk food, 279 00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:02,679 but by telling them what's in that food. 280 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:04,360 Speaker 2: Michelle and Mama wasn't doing that. 281 00:16:04,399 --> 00:16:07,360 Speaker 3: She was just dancing on Ellen Degenerous's talk show and 282 00:16:07,480 --> 00:16:09,919 asking people to live healthy, and it just wasn't working. 283 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:13,519 It just wasn't a receptive message. People found it condescending. 284 00:16:14,440 --> 00:16:16,440 People didn't like being lectured. 285 00:16:16,120 --> 00:16:16,519 Speaker 2: In that way. 286 00:16:16,559 --> 00:16:19,720 Speaker 3: But you know, there was this understanding across the country, 287 00:16:19,759 --> 00:16:23,279 even among conservatives who kind of mocked a campaign, that yeah, 288 00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:26,360 we know that the food that we're eating is unhealthy, 289 00:16:26,879 --> 00:16:29,000 but we don't want to be lectured by elites to 290 00:16:29,240 --> 00:16:29,799 eat healthy. 291 00:16:30,080 --> 00:16:32,000 Speaker 1: Well what what what? What? Whoa wait? Wait a minute, now, 292 00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:35,120 are you telling me that dancing on the Ellen Degenera 293 00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:37,600 show is not a ticket to success? 294 00:16:38,799 --> 00:16:42,960 Speaker 3: Well, obviously, I remember she was doing this social media 295 00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:45,559 campaign post give me five but five. 296 00:16:45,360 --> 00:16:47,279 Speaker 2: Things on the interview that you're doing to live healthy. 297 00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:48,279 It just wasn't going to work. 298 00:16:48,320 --> 00:16:51,559 Speaker 3: And so, but there's this amazing quote in JD. Vance's 299 00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:54,360 Hillbilly Elogy I read this summer where he talks about 300 00:16:54,399 --> 00:16:58,279 the different insecurities that the Obama family kind of puts 301 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:02,159 on his naighbors, and one of them was that, you know, 302 00:17:02,200 --> 00:17:06,279 Michelle Obama, Barack Obama's wife tells us to eat healthy 303 00:17:06,319 --> 00:17:08,839 things on TV, and we hate her for it, not 304 00:17:08,960 --> 00:17:12,160 because we think she's wrong, but because we know she's right, 305 00:17:13,519 --> 00:17:14,799 and I think that really just. 306 00:17:14,759 --> 00:17:16,839 Speaker 2: Gets the hard part of all this. 307 00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:19,160 Speaker 3: You know, there's this problem understanding that we need to 308 00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:22,000 live healthier lifestyles. Americans just don't know how. And that 309 00:17:22,079 --> 00:17:24,640 was the launch op ed for this book. Americans don't 310 00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:26,039 want to be fat and unhappy anymore. 311 00:17:26,119 --> 00:17:29,839 Speaker 2: They want to be happy and healthy. And yeah, we talked. 312 00:17:29,880 --> 00:17:32,400 Speaker 3: I mean, the book fundamentally is about body image and 313 00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:34,799 the body positivity movement, and it's a response to that, 314 00:17:34,839 --> 00:17:36,680 but it's about so much more than just a couple 315 00:17:36,680 --> 00:17:41,119 of influencers who are kind of reflecting the frustration of 316 00:17:41,359 --> 00:17:43,200 seventy years of the low fat diet. 317 00:17:43,279 --> 00:17:45,400 Speaker 2: It's really about how we got to where we are. 318 00:17:45,759 --> 00:17:47,680 Speaker 3: If you want to explain where the Make America Healthy 319 00:17:47,720 --> 00:17:50,480 Again movement comes from, our book explains that and how 320 00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:53,960 we got there in a way out. But I think again, 321 00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:55,799 what Kennedy is going to do is so much more effective. 322 00:17:55,839 --> 00:17:58,359 It's yes, we're all a product of our choices, but 323 00:17:58,400 --> 00:18:01,480 at the same time, placing blame and responsibility on the 324 00:18:01,519 --> 00:18:05,480 food industry is just exactly what happened with the tobacco industry. 325 00:18:05,480 --> 00:18:07,400 And I think that's such a more receptive message to 326 00:18:07,559 --> 00:18:12,359 Americans by a giving them some validation that it's not 327 00:18:12,519 --> 00:18:15,960 entirely their fault. They were, you know, given this live 328 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:18,960 of the low fat diet. They were lied to by 329 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:23,160 the USDA, the FDA telling them to eat products that 330 00:18:23,240 --> 00:18:27,119 were verifiably unhealthy, and that got us where we are. 331 00:18:27,519 --> 00:18:29,200 But the end of the day, I think also kind 332 00:18:29,240 --> 00:18:32,119 of disgusting Americans from the food that they're eating is 333 00:18:32,119 --> 00:18:33,359 going to be an effective tactic. 334 00:18:34,160 --> 00:18:37,960 Speaker 1: Well, you know, it's interesting because you know, over the years, 335 00:18:38,119 --> 00:18:42,359 we've had government regulations saying that McDonald's and Wendy's and 336 00:18:42,480 --> 00:18:44,880 the rest of the fast food places wherever you eat, 337 00:18:45,480 --> 00:18:48,119 they've got a list the calorate count all of those 338 00:18:48,160 --> 00:18:51,519 sorts of things on the menu. And you know, I'm 339 00:18:51,519 --> 00:18:53,960 going through the drive through the other day and I 340 00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:59,200 you know, I have a penjont for a sausage egg McMuffin, 341 00:18:59,799 --> 00:19:03,920 and I've I've just looked past the fact that that's 342 00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:10,279 a six hundred calories sandwich, you know, because it's there, 343 00:19:10,799 --> 00:19:13,759 We know that it's there, but we're not following that. 344 00:19:13,799 --> 00:19:19,400 What does that specifically ultimately mean if we're already getting 345 00:19:19,559 --> 00:19:22,960 some of that, you know, nutrition information on the boxes 346 00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:26,759 and what have you, and we're not responding to that. 347 00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:32,079 Speaker 3: I can't wait until we kill the calorie. Frankly, I 348 00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:34,960 just I think calories tell us next to nothing about nutrition. 349 00:19:36,799 --> 00:19:39,839 I think Americans use calories often as an excuse to 350 00:19:40,559 --> 00:19:44,319 cheat on their diets often. I think it's calories are 351 00:19:44,319 --> 00:19:48,440 confusing for people. They don't really quite understand that the 352 00:19:48,680 --> 00:19:52,519 nutrition is so much more about quality than quantity. I 353 00:19:52,599 --> 00:19:54,119 just I think the calorie is one of the most 354 00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:56,599 misleading metrics in nutrition. I know that's some of a 355 00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:59,880 controversial opinion, even within the Make America Healthy Again community, 356 00:20:00,960 --> 00:20:03,440 But one hundred calories of a brownie versus one hundred 357 00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:09,279 calories of almonds are going to digest fundamentally differently than otherwise. 358 00:20:09,319 --> 00:20:11,519 And so I just I think the calorie it's so 359 00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:14,519 confusing for people to follow, and people use calories as 360 00:20:14,559 --> 00:20:18,440 a license to eat things that are going to essentially 361 00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:22,079 spoil progress that they've made. What Americans have to realize 362 00:20:22,200 --> 00:20:25,559 is depending on how you know, we're all starting at 363 00:20:25,559 --> 00:20:28,759 different places, right, but depending on how our metabolism is 364 00:20:28,839 --> 00:20:33,039 when we're starting out, you have to essentially biochemically re 365 00:20:33,200 --> 00:20:37,559 engineer the fuel yoursells run on. Americans have been running 366 00:20:37,559 --> 00:20:40,079 on carbs, and our bodies were not designed to run 367 00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:43,079 on these high sugar, high carb diets all the time 368 00:20:43,799 --> 00:20:46,720 because the insulin, you know, fast towards is all about 369 00:20:47,400 --> 00:20:50,720 the insulin response and when you when you have chronically 370 00:20:50,799 --> 00:20:54,400 elevated levels of insulin throughout the day. And this is 371 00:20:54,400 --> 00:20:56,160 one of the big misconceptions I hope we clear up 372 00:20:56,160 --> 00:20:58,200 in the book, is that it's not just about fast 373 00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:02,279 storage too, it's about chronics and insulin effects just about 374 00:21:02,279 --> 00:21:05,599 every tissue in the body. When you have chronically elevated 375 00:21:05,640 --> 00:21:09,279 levels of insulin, that's where you get not just OBCD, 376 00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:13,599 but chronic disease. And so I think calories just kind 377 00:21:13,599 --> 00:21:16,960 of mask the quality of what we're eating, and people 378 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:19,839 just kind of used a calorie as some type of 379 00:21:20,039 --> 00:21:22,200 get algael three car free card at times. 380 00:21:22,559 --> 00:21:27,000 Speaker 1: Yeah. But see here's here's the ultimate problem. I like 381 00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:32,240 the brownie, I don't care about ye See, that's and 382 00:21:32,279 --> 00:21:35,039 that's what we struggle with or more. And so you know, 383 00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:39,480 I like the breakfast sandwich, and I don't much care 384 00:21:39,640 --> 00:21:44,440 for the dried oaks or you know, whatever it is. 385 00:21:46,599 --> 00:21:49,640 Speaker 4: The irs wants to do your tax returns. The watched 386 00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:52,440 out on Wall Street podcast with Chris Markowski. Every day 387 00:21:52,519 --> 00:21:55,480 Chris helps unpack the connection between politics and the economy 388 00:21:55,519 --> 00:21:55,839 and how it. 389 00:21:55,839 --> 00:21:56,759 Speaker 2: Affects your wallet. 390 00:21:56,799 --> 00:21:59,640 Speaker 4: The IRS now has a one hundred and fourteen million 391 00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:03,599 dollar budget to expand their direct file program. Filing with 392 00:22:03,680 --> 00:22:07,359 the IRS is like playing poker with mirrored sunglasses. Don't 393 00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:09,839 show your cards. Whether it's happening in DC or down 394 00:22:09,839 --> 00:22:11,559 on Wall Street, it's affecting you financially. 395 00:22:11,640 --> 00:22:12,160 Speaker 2: Be informed. 396 00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:14,359 Speaker 4: Check out the Watchdot on Wall Street podcast with Chris 397 00:22:14,400 --> 00:22:17,319 Markowski on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. 398 00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:25,279 Speaker 1: We are having a conversation about our health where we 399 00:22:25,319 --> 00:22:28,000 are at in America today. Our guest today on this 400 00:22:28,119 --> 00:22:31,599 edition of the Federalist Radio Hour is Tristan Justice and 401 00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:36,960 Well from the Federalist, excellent reporter here, author of the 402 00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:40,519 new book Fat and Unhappy, How body positivity is killing 403 00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:45,200 us and how to save yourself. How much, Tristan does 404 00:22:45,279 --> 00:22:48,960 the FDA, the USDA, so many of these government entities 405 00:22:49,039 --> 00:22:52,880 that have their little fiefdoms of regulation, How much do 406 00:22:52,960 --> 00:22:55,559 they play a part in this crisis in America? 407 00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:58,400 Speaker 3: Well, I want to circle back to the brownie first, 408 00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:02,960 because everybody loves a brownie. Oh. Food is social and 409 00:23:03,039 --> 00:23:05,759 it's fun to bake with mom from time to time, 410 00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:14,119 But when someone's feeling hungry, hunger is the feeling that 411 00:23:14,279 --> 00:23:20,640 drives the need to fix malnourishment. Hunger signals malnourishment when 412 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:22,920 you eat something like a brownie or a Twinkie. I 413 00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:25,559 use twinkiees as an example because the Twinkie CEO came 414 00:23:25,599 --> 00:23:29,799 out attacking RFK last weekend. When you eat a twinkie, 415 00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:32,960 you solve you might solve the problem of hunger, but 416 00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:36,440 you're not solving the problem of malnourishment. So you're essentially 417 00:23:37,079 --> 00:23:41,319 masking the emotion that is supposed to drive you to fix. 418 00:23:41,119 --> 00:23:42,519 Speaker 2: The malnourishment problem. 419 00:23:42,799 --> 00:23:47,599 Speaker 3: And so several out minutes hours later, when you're hungry again, 420 00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:50,839 that hunger comes back stronger, and you're even because you're 421 00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:52,759 even more malnourished than you were before. 422 00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:55,319 Speaker 2: So you kind of see how this begins to break down. 423 00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:00,839 Speaker 3: You don't solve the problem of malnourishment by eating brownies, 424 00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:02,599 Twinkies some of these other snacks. 425 00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:07,839 Speaker 1: No, that's certainly understandable. 426 00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:12,279 Speaker 3: But you also asked about the FDA and how the 427 00:24:12,319 --> 00:24:14,400 government has kind of played a role in this crisis. 428 00:24:15,160 --> 00:24:17,640 I really think, you know, I love the idea that 429 00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:20,440 Robert F. Kennedy is going to take over AHHS and 430 00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:23,000 he's going to do things like re examine that generally 431 00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:26,720 recognized as safe list, which is the list of additives 432 00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:28,480 that the FDA approves in our food supply. 433 00:24:28,599 --> 00:24:31,000 Speaker 1: Well, hold on just just a minute, Interesstan, because I 434 00:24:31,039 --> 00:24:34,000 did I did want to say this because you brought 435 00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:40,000 it up. Where does the executive of the Hostess Cupcake, 436 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:48,000 a corporate conglomerate, have standing in this argument? Listen, I 437 00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:53,119 am a as big a fan of the Twinkie and 438 00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:57,079 of Captain Cupcake as you can possibly imagine. But how 439 00:24:57,119 --> 00:25:01,039 does he get off entering this conversation. 440 00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:04,160 Speaker 2: He's got profits to save. 441 00:25:05,480 --> 00:25:08,680 Speaker 3: I'm actually, frankly kind of shocked that he came out 442 00:25:08,759 --> 00:25:12,960 in native statement kind of rejecting this make America Healthy 443 00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:16,079 Again a movement. If I were them, I would have 444 00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:19,640 kind of kept my head down. But also he is 445 00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:22,960 probably speaking to shareholders who are concerned about this kind 446 00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:26,839 of change in American snacking habits, and so maybe there's 447 00:25:26,839 --> 00:25:31,640 some politics at play behind the scenes. But I was 448 00:25:31,759 --> 00:25:35,400 amazed that the CEO came out to kind of attack 449 00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:36,640 a crackdown on snacks. 450 00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:41,000 Speaker 1: I'm just seeing this kind of funny skip play out 451 00:25:41,039 --> 00:25:44,960 in my mind where Tweaky the Kid and fruit Pie 452 00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:50,920 the Magician go to DC and lobby Congress in an 453 00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:55,319 impassioned pitch, and a mister Smith goes to Washington and 454 00:25:55,440 --> 00:26:00,319 passioned pitch for the fruit the apple, fruit pie or 455 00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:03,400 the twinkie as we said. But I'm sorry to interrupt. 456 00:26:03,480 --> 00:26:06,119 I thought that was very curious, and obviously it is. 457 00:26:06,759 --> 00:26:09,279 It is somewhat timely. But back to the FDA and 458 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:11,119 what they have done over the years, as well as 459 00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:14,079 the USDA, well, I. 460 00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:15,880 Speaker 3: Think the most fundamental problem that we solve from our 461 00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:18,559 government was the low fat diet, and I think we're 462 00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:21,839 going to see some significant shifts in the dietary guidelines 463 00:26:21,839 --> 00:26:24,000 in the next five years if the right people get 464 00:26:24,039 --> 00:26:27,680 into the administration. Kennedy is a good start, but Kennedy 465 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:31,039 can't do everything. But also again, I just want to 466 00:26:31,079 --> 00:26:34,519 emphasize this point above all others before before going into 467 00:26:34,559 --> 00:26:38,279 the grass list and whatever. Americans should not confuse healthier 468 00:26:38,279 --> 00:26:41,039 with healthy. The government can do all it can to 469 00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:44,519 blow the whistle on food like it did with tobacco, 470 00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:46,440 but at the end, of the day. You know, fruit 471 00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:50,240 loops in Canada might have less food dyes and colorings 472 00:26:50,319 --> 00:26:52,960 that than in the United States, but that doesn't necessarily 473 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:55,799 mean they're healthy. The fruit loops in Canada still have 474 00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:58,559 I believe the number was roughly fourteen grams of sugar 475 00:26:58,599 --> 00:26:59,160 per cup. 476 00:27:00,319 --> 00:27:01,000 Speaker 2: That's not healthy. 477 00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:04,119 Speaker 3: Americans are not going to solve the health crisis doing that. 478 00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:07,160 And so while there's a lot of really exciting things 479 00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:10,279 that the government can do, like transforming the dietary guidelines 480 00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:15,359 orforming snap benefits, again, Americans need to kind of be 481 00:27:15,440 --> 00:27:19,519 cognizant that this is an addiction and we're going to 482 00:27:19,559 --> 00:27:22,240 have to embrace some addiction strategies to get out of that. 483 00:27:22,799 --> 00:27:25,279 Now that being said, there's a number of things that 484 00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:29,079 Kennedy can do to help the crisis, help us get 485 00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:32,359 out of this crisis. One of those things is to 486 00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:35,119 re examine the generally recognize as Safe List by the FDA, 487 00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:38,559 the list of additives that are allowed in different manufactured 488 00:27:38,559 --> 00:27:39,640 products to go on the shelf. 489 00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:41,400 Speaker 2: It's a privatized list. 490 00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:47,519 Speaker 3: Theware companies can submit their own research to put different 491 00:27:47,680 --> 00:27:50,279 chemicals and additives in the food supply. So I think 492 00:27:50,319 --> 00:27:55,119 that's one area that Kennedy, and it can make some reforms, 493 00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:58,480 but I think the primary is the dietary guidelines and 494 00:27:58,519 --> 00:28:03,039 really lifting the limits on dietary fats and cracking down 495 00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:08,519 on sugars, especially in K twelve classrooms. I think those 496 00:28:08,559 --> 00:28:10,279 are probably the two main areas. 497 00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:16,799 Speaker 1: So who is ever held accountable for all of this stuff? 498 00:28:16,599 --> 00:28:23,720 If this was in certain ways by design through industry 499 00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:29,960 and government collusion. To borrow a word, who is ever 500 00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:31,759 held accountable for all of this? 501 00:28:33,240 --> 00:28:35,160 Speaker 3: That's one of the more frustrating things about all this 502 00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:39,000 because the FDN USD don't really have teeth to enforce 503 00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:42,079 some of these different regulations. That was one of the 504 00:28:42,079 --> 00:28:45,640 primary issues that doctor Robert Lustig wrote about in his 505 00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:51,440 book Metabolical, which is on the processed food industry. The 506 00:28:51,519 --> 00:28:54,400 USDA and the FDA have all these regulations and guidelines 507 00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:57,759 and they can find companies, but they often lack a 508 00:28:57,759 --> 00:29:00,319 lot of teeth to enforce these different rules and regulations. 509 00:29:00,759 --> 00:29:02,920 I think at the end of the day, Americans pay 510 00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:05,880 the price by virtue of declining health. 511 00:29:05,960 --> 00:29:06,559 Speaker 1: Right We. 512 00:29:08,279 --> 00:29:11,400 Speaker 3: During the research in the book, we found people who 513 00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:15,440 are obese pay double and medical expensures expenditures over their 514 00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:18,400 lifetime than people at an otherwise healthy way. And as 515 00:29:19,160 --> 00:29:22,559 there are weight rises, that number goes up exponentially. And 516 00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:24,720 so the people paying the price for all this are 517 00:29:25,119 --> 00:29:29,200 our neighbors. It's us, and there's not there's never it 518 00:29:29,359 --> 00:29:33,160 seems like there's never accountability in Washington for some of 519 00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:33,960 these different issues. 520 00:29:34,119 --> 00:29:35,599 Speaker 2: And we saw that play with COVID, right. 521 00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:39,319 Speaker 3: We saw how the lockdowns were devastating and catastrophic, and 522 00:29:39,559 --> 00:29:43,000 there was a significant lack of accountability for the people 523 00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:46,279 who are promoting this monolithic narrative that lockdowns were the 524 00:29:46,319 --> 00:29:49,759 only prescriptions out of this crisis. I think COVID was 525 00:29:49,839 --> 00:29:52,480 really the wake up call on which Americans slept. I 526 00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:55,519 think Americans kind of waking up on it now this year, 527 00:29:55,599 --> 00:30:00,200 especially with the RFK appointments. I just watched as they 528 00:30:00,200 --> 00:30:03,480 continue to shut down gyms and businesses and tell people 529 00:30:03,519 --> 00:30:07,200 will stay home and binge on carbs, sugar, Netflix, the 530 00:30:07,240 --> 00:30:09,880 snack industry. Their profits went up by ten billion over 531 00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:13,119 those first two years of lockdown. The pharmaceutical industry made 532 00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:17,759 one hundred about one hundred billion dollars on vaccines, COVID vaccines, 533 00:30:17,759 --> 00:30:21,279 which were more like therapeutics and so and there was 534 00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:24,880 a breathtaking lack of accountability for all that. And so 535 00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:28,000 hopefully we'll see what happens in the next four years 536 00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:29,880 in terms of these new people in charge. 537 00:30:30,079 --> 00:30:31,400 Speaker 2: Where are they going to find? Are they going to 538 00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:32,480 conduct investigations? 539 00:30:32,519 --> 00:30:35,759 Speaker 3: Are they going to conduct, you know, the COVID tribunals 540 00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:39,599 that Robert F. Kennedy talked about. I'm curious to see 541 00:30:39,599 --> 00:30:41,720 what kind of stuff is going to come to light. 542 00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:48,599 Speaker 1: As an old emphasis on old, jaded investigative reporter, I 543 00:30:48,599 --> 00:30:53,319 am not very confident that many, if any, will be 544 00:30:53,359 --> 00:30:56,240 held accountable for all of the stuff that you just mentioned. 545 00:30:56,279 --> 00:30:59,640 Speaker 2: But I can hear the paper shrudder is running from that. 546 00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:03,079 Speaker 1: I can too. A boy can dream, just in a 547 00:31:03,079 --> 00:31:06,279 boy can dream. There's been a lot of focus, of course, 548 00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:11,559 on the dysfunctional and absolutely broken healthcare system in America, which, 549 00:31:11,599 --> 00:31:14,440 by the way, let us first and foremost point out 550 00:31:14,559 --> 00:31:19,000 the fix is not a single payer, government run healthcare system. 551 00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:22,359 Let's get that out right off the bat, or all 552 00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:25,839 of the that's another show, all the myriad problems of 553 00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:32,240 those very bad ideas. But there's certainly a problem with 554 00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:36,519 our healthcare system, big problems with our healthcare system. And 555 00:31:36,559 --> 00:31:39,279 we have been talking about that, even more so over 556 00:31:39,319 --> 00:31:43,400 the last several days with the accused assassin, the accused 557 00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:49,039 killer of the United Health CEO. How much of the 558 00:31:49,079 --> 00:31:53,400 food related crisis, the diet related crisis we're talking about, 559 00:31:53,519 --> 00:31:57,400 feeds in to the problems we've experienced in the health 560 00:31:57,400 --> 00:31:59,880 care industry. 561 00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:03,119 Speaker 3: Well, we want to pill for every ill, and it's 562 00:32:03,160 --> 00:32:05,599 not really solving anything. There is so much more money 563 00:32:05,599 --> 00:32:08,279 to be made in a sick care system treating sick 564 00:32:08,359 --> 00:32:12,720 patients than a true healthcare system curing sick patients. And 565 00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:16,319 what we've created is four point five trillion dollar health 566 00:32:16,319 --> 00:32:20,920 care industry that is running on a nation that's left 567 00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:25,000 chronically fat, sick, and depressed. And that's kind of the 568 00:32:25,039 --> 00:32:27,720 whole case of the book. It's that big food and 569 00:32:27,759 --> 00:32:30,920 big pharma have kind of engineered these crises in a 570 00:32:30,920 --> 00:32:35,319 way to maximize their profits, to create this hyper addicted 571 00:32:35,440 --> 00:32:39,400 nation that's just wants to be, that's just enabled their 572 00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:43,400 lifestyles through medication. I think ozampic is kind of running 573 00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:47,680 a parallel to ssriys. People just want the quick fix. 574 00:32:47,799 --> 00:32:49,680 I think people are looking at a xampic as is 575 00:32:49,759 --> 00:32:52,279 kind of get out of jail free card. I think 576 00:32:52,519 --> 00:32:55,599 some of these different weight loss medications can be bridges 577 00:32:55,759 --> 00:32:58,960 to weight loss and success, especially for people in extreme cases. 578 00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:02,279 I don't think they're appropriate for children as young as 579 00:33:02,319 --> 00:33:06,400 twelve and thirteen, which were the new recommendations from the 580 00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:11,720 American Academy Pediatrics last year. But you know, this pill 581 00:33:11,759 --> 00:33:14,160 for every ill mentality that Americans have found themselves in, 582 00:33:14,240 --> 00:33:18,319 it's clearly not working. We have record use of antidepressants, 583 00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:23,640 yet suicides are still going up, depression anxiety are still 584 00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:27,440 going up, and you have these weight loss medications being used, 585 00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:30,839 and you're not seeing a significant decline in OBC and 586 00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:34,200 a weight loss. And I suspect if we do see 587 00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:38,319 a significant decline in weight with these weight loss medications, 588 00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:41,839 I wonder what our chronic disease burden will be after that. 589 00:33:42,319 --> 00:33:45,759 I think there's so many unknowns we know not to 590 00:33:46,079 --> 00:33:49,000 pull Donald Rumsfeld year, but there are I think there 591 00:33:49,039 --> 00:33:51,519 are a lot of known unknowns about the long term 592 00:33:51,559 --> 00:33:54,359 effects of these weight loss medications that we don't even 593 00:33:54,640 --> 00:33:55,759 understand quite yet. 594 00:33:56,440 --> 00:33:58,759 Speaker 1: Well, it is the holiday station, and what an appropriate 595 00:33:58,799 --> 00:34:02,400 time to bring up Donald run Rumsfeld, because nobody captured 596 00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:06,000 the spirit of the holidays quite like old Don Rumsfeld. 597 00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:13,679 I'm very curious about another crisis in America, and as 598 00:34:13,719 --> 00:34:16,840 a reporter at the Federalist. As reporters at the Federalist, 599 00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:20,119 we know very well what that crisis is. And that 600 00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:25,000 crisis demonstrated itself in full force on November fifth this 601 00:34:25,159 --> 00:34:29,039 year in a sea change election in this country. That's 602 00:34:29,079 --> 00:34:37,159 a crisis of trust. So while obviously the majority of 603 00:34:37,199 --> 00:34:43,400 Americans and strong majorities across this country rejected the current 604 00:34:43,559 --> 00:34:50,119 regime because of that trust deficit, we're mindset of Americans. 605 00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:57,000 As Americans anyway, we're already predisposed to being you know, jaded, 606 00:34:57,199 --> 00:35:01,559 I think is the word about things, justifiably more so 607 00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:04,719 over these last four years. Of all the things that 608 00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:10,199 you mentioned, lockdowns, the responses to COVID masks, everything that 609 00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:14,159 the government has done, so many lies told to us. 610 00:35:14,880 --> 00:35:20,440 How can Americans trust anybody moving forward with that sense 611 00:35:20,519 --> 00:35:23,159 of we've been lied to too many times? 612 00:35:25,239 --> 00:35:26,880 Speaker 3: Well, I definitely think it's going to be something that 613 00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:30,079 the Trump administration is going to have to grapple with here. 614 00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:33,400 I certainly feel like I'm wearing a tinfoil half some times, 615 00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:36,440 and I'm walking around the grocery store just after having 616 00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:39,760 read so many books on our food supply health and nutrition. 617 00:35:40,039 --> 00:35:42,840 I just I'm almost scared to walk down the center 618 00:35:42,880 --> 00:35:46,559 aisles the grocer store. I shop almost exclusively on the 619 00:35:46,599 --> 00:35:51,519 outside aisles unless I need something like contact solution. But 620 00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:55,880 it's something that the government is going to have to 621 00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:58,599 grapple with. There's been such a loss of trust, especially 622 00:35:58,639 --> 00:36:03,920 in our public health institutions after COVID, that Americans don't 623 00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:06,480 really know who to go to for trust and information. 624 00:36:06,599 --> 00:36:09,880 But that could change. A lot of things have to happen. 625 00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:14,800 But I think Americans should trust their local butcher. 626 00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:16,800 Speaker 2: If I didn't name. 627 00:36:16,679 --> 00:36:19,760 Speaker 3: Anybody, I think local food is probably the best food 628 00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:21,719 in so many cases at this point. 629 00:36:22,719 --> 00:36:26,280 Speaker 2: I I I just I you know, it's it's hard to. 630 00:36:28,079 --> 00:36:29,840 Speaker 3: I feel a lot safe for eating a raw apple 631 00:36:30,000 --> 00:36:33,800 than I do picking up some apple sauce and so uh, 632 00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:36,280 it's it's a good question, it's not really one I 633 00:36:36,320 --> 00:36:39,039 have an answer for in terms of how we get 634 00:36:39,360 --> 00:36:41,079 how we maintain some of this trust and get some 635 00:36:41,119 --> 00:36:42,000 of this trust back. 636 00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:42,480 Speaker 2: Into the government. 637 00:36:43,039 --> 00:36:45,599 Speaker 3: I think it's healthy, it's healthy to be skeptical of 638 00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:49,840 authority at this point, especially after COVID. But again, it's 639 00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:51,679 it's that's that's going to be one one for the 640 00:36:51,719 --> 00:36:53,400 Trump administration to deal with. 641 00:36:53,599 --> 00:36:57,119 Speaker 1: Or anyone who has freshly read Upton Sinclair's The Jungle 642 00:36:57,960 --> 00:37:01,719 Local Butcher is definitely leave the Way to Go Low 643 00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:06,280 a century plus later. Finally, as we close out our conversation, 644 00:37:06,440 --> 00:37:09,159 let's delve into some solutions. Because we've talked a lot 645 00:37:09,199 --> 00:37:12,760 about the problems, and you've talked some about the solutions. 646 00:37:12,800 --> 00:37:18,639 But what can we addicted Americans do in terms of 647 00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:28,079 changing lifestyle, changing the foods that we consume, and strategies 648 00:37:28,199 --> 00:37:32,639 I suppose to get over the hurdle of we have 649 00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:37,599 been given healthy choices, but they simply don't taste as 650 00:37:37,679 --> 00:37:40,360 good to us as the unhealthy choices. 651 00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:44,000 Speaker 3: Right, So the entire second half of this book is 652 00:37:44,039 --> 00:37:47,880 on this point, and we make we outlined five chapters 653 00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:52,760 with solid recommendations based on what we found throughout our 654 00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:55,639 more than five hundred citation sources throughout the book on 655 00:37:56,079 --> 00:37:56,760 kind of how to. 656 00:37:58,360 --> 00:37:59,599 Speaker 2: Fix our lifestyle crisis. 657 00:37:59,679 --> 00:37:59,880 Speaker 1: Right. 658 00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:02,400 Speaker 3: I don't think we have a mental health crisis or 659 00:38:02,519 --> 00:38:04,599 a physical crisis as much as we just broadly have 660 00:38:04,639 --> 00:38:05,480 a lifestyle crisis. 661 00:38:05,519 --> 00:38:06,880 Speaker 2: I think the data is pretty clear on that. 662 00:38:07,159 --> 00:38:11,159 Speaker 3: So it's it's you know, positive food, positive exercise, positive sleep, 663 00:38:11,599 --> 00:38:16,760 positive community, and positive prayer, because I think there's this 664 00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:22,320 misconception that Americans generally want a savior. Americans just want 665 00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:26,639 to be saved. But to be honest, no one's coming 666 00:38:26,639 --> 00:38:30,639 to save you after Jesus. We have to just kind 667 00:38:30,639 --> 00:38:33,760 of pick ourselves up and get ourselves moving, get ourselves 668 00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:34,239 eating right. 669 00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:37,400 Speaker 1: But sure, word, it's truer word. It's never said. 670 00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:40,719 Speaker 3: By the way, the only person, the only person who 671 00:38:40,719 --> 00:38:43,079 can save us after Jesus is ourselves. No one else 672 00:38:43,119 --> 00:38:47,920 is coming to save us. So and so I so. 673 00:38:48,199 --> 00:38:50,440 In terms of food, cut the carbs. This is a 674 00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:54,599 carb driven crisis. Cut the processed food and cut the 675 00:38:54,880 --> 00:38:59,800 especially just just limit carbontake. That's our primary recommendation for 676 00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:03,800 of course, this is all very subjective based on where 677 00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:08,199 you are in your metabolic milestones and age, and that's 678 00:39:08,239 --> 00:39:15,039 all qualified. But also people exercise, regulate metabolism, get out 679 00:39:15,119 --> 00:39:20,400 and move sleep. I think Americans generally don't even know 680 00:39:20,440 --> 00:39:23,360 how they're sleeping. A lot of Americans think they're sleeping 681 00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:26,639 enough sleeping, well, they're often not, and that I think 682 00:39:26,719 --> 00:39:29,760 is the silence is a huge silent killer. So I 683 00:39:29,840 --> 00:39:34,320 think just being cognizant and almost testing yourself how you're sleeping, 684 00:39:34,320 --> 00:39:36,239 and paying more attention how you sleep. But I think 685 00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:40,159 community and prayer are also very underappreciated in how the 686 00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:45,000 influence our own health. Americans aren't living in the community 687 00:39:45,119 --> 00:39:48,679 that humans were meant to live. We all kind of 688 00:39:48,760 --> 00:39:50,639 I think a lot too many Americans are still living 689 00:39:50,639 --> 00:39:53,559 in so much isolation after COVID, spending too much time 690 00:39:53,599 --> 00:39:58,960 on artificial interfaces and believing that's genuine social interaction. I 691 00:39:59,039 --> 00:40:01,559 think Americans still spend way too much time on screens. 692 00:40:02,679 --> 00:40:05,199 So I think just getting out living in community is huge. 693 00:40:05,679 --> 00:40:09,320 But honestly, my favorite chapter of the book was Positive Prayer. 694 00:40:10,239 --> 00:40:14,599 This book just capping off the book on having faith 695 00:40:14,679 --> 00:40:19,119 in something larger than yourself and having a purpose around that. 696 00:40:19,599 --> 00:40:21,280 Speaker 2: There's so much data now. 697 00:40:21,159 --> 00:40:24,239 Speaker 3: To show that people who are very spiritual and take 698 00:40:24,280 --> 00:40:27,639 religion very seriously in their lives often live longer but 699 00:40:27,679 --> 00:40:32,079 also healthier, and I think that's such an underappreciated point 700 00:40:32,159 --> 00:40:37,079 in our culture. So positive Prayer is I think just 701 00:40:37,400 --> 00:40:40,119 huge in fixing our lifestyle crisis. We have to believe 702 00:40:40,159 --> 00:40:42,119 in something larger than ourselves, and that's why I made 703 00:40:42,119 --> 00:40:44,480 that point. You know nothing is coming to save you 704 00:40:46,079 --> 00:40:49,480 of course it's for anyone who's not Christian. You know, 705 00:40:49,519 --> 00:40:52,320 whatever your faith is, but at least your Christian lens, 706 00:40:52,360 --> 00:40:55,000 no one's going to save you after Jesus. And so 707 00:40:55,880 --> 00:41:00,079 I think people, it takes some resilience, it takes some discipline, 708 00:41:00,119 --> 00:41:03,239 and I hope the book is helpful for anyone who's 709 00:41:03,239 --> 00:41:04,159 struggling with anything. 710 00:41:04,719 --> 00:41:06,760 Speaker 1: I think that you make a great point about the 711 00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:10,360 power of prayer and the power of faith, and obviously 712 00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:12,920 that's changed. And just to put a finer point on that, 713 00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:18,880 I remember covering the parade of contenders and pretenders in Iowa, 714 00:41:19,000 --> 00:41:23,960 the Republican presidential candidates throughout twenty twenty three, and a 715 00:41:24,039 --> 00:41:28,079 guy who is about to be in the Trump administration 716 00:41:28,159 --> 00:41:31,599 of the Big Ramaswami running for the nomination, talked about 717 00:41:31,639 --> 00:41:37,559 that void that it is in a lot of Americans' lives, 718 00:41:37,679 --> 00:41:40,639 you know, and that void has been filled with all 719 00:41:40,760 --> 00:41:46,280 kinds of dangerous and deadly things, from drugs to pornography 720 00:41:46,599 --> 00:41:53,159 to arguably fat foods. And I think at the end 721 00:41:53,239 --> 00:41:57,920 of the day, that's what your book really is all about, 722 00:41:58,199 --> 00:41:59,400 and how to change all of that. 723 00:42:01,960 --> 00:42:07,679 Speaker 3: Absolutely, and I hope people will will take away at 724 00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:09,480 least something from this book that will help them from 725 00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:12,559 their day to day lives. And I'm I'm now that 726 00:42:12,559 --> 00:42:15,119 it's been out almost a month, I'm just now getting 727 00:42:15,159 --> 00:42:18,320 some feedback, and it's just it's been very rewarding to 728 00:42:18,360 --> 00:42:21,199 hear that it's already impacted some people, at least close 729 00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:25,800 to me. And so I hope any listeners who buy 730 00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:28,360 the book read the book. I I I hope they 731 00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:31,280 find it interesting. I tried to make it entertaining and 732 00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:34,880 try to make this not a boring policy book. It 733 00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:37,719 deals with policy, but it was a fun topic. I 734 00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:42,159 tried to make it entertaining and readable. It's pretty pretty digestible. 735 00:42:42,199 --> 00:42:45,280 Speaker 2: It's not it's not long and dense. 736 00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:48,800 Speaker 3: It's it's pretty brief, and we kept each chapter pretty succinct. 737 00:42:48,920 --> 00:42:50,519 Speaker 2: And I hope it helps a lot of people. 738 00:42:51,119 --> 00:42:53,360 Speaker 1: Well, I think in the movie, you probably are our 739 00:42:53,400 --> 00:42:56,920 best advised to have our hero go after Twinkie the 740 00:42:57,000 --> 00:43:04,920 Kid and their band of given the Hostess Cupcake lobbies 741 00:43:05,239 --> 00:43:09,199 recent comments out there. But I am indeed waiting for 742 00:43:09,880 --> 00:43:12,880 the movie version of the book. It's a very interesting read, 743 00:43:13,079 --> 00:43:18,559 it's a thought provoking read, and it's an excellent effort. 744 00:43:19,000 --> 00:43:23,400 Thanks to my guest today, Kristen Justice, excellent reporter for 745 00:43:23,519 --> 00:43:27,239 The Federalist and author of the new book Fat and Unhappy, 746 00:43:27,800 --> 00:43:32,199 How Body Positivity is Killing Us and How to Save Yourself. 747 00:43:33,679 --> 00:43:36,320 You've been listening to another edition of The Federalist Radio Hour. 748 00:43:36,719 --> 00:43:40,079 I'm Matt Kittle's senior correspondent at The Federalist. We'll be 749 00:43:40,159 --> 00:43:43,639 back soon with more. Until then, stay lovers of freedom 750 00:43:44,000 --> 00:43:59,199 and anxious for the fray. 751 00:44:00,159 --> 00:44:00,960 Speaker 2: Robe sent