Speaker 1: We're Tom A Loarenz and this is the Pop Style
Opinion Fest. Hallikan is welcome back to another edition of
the Pso I am the teen, your te Low Tom Fitzgerald,
and I'm here with the Low and your Telo and
the Lorenso my cousband loved the husband, you lovely. Husband
has been very busy. I knew we're planning our trip.
I knew there was a lot of want to tip
my hat and thank him publicly, Like you guys have
no idea. He does everything. I'm just like, tell me
where to show up and when to show up.
Speaker 2: I just hand him the passport and we had to
does he.
Speaker 1: Absolutely does, And we're going to have a fabulous time.
Speaker 2: Yes.
Speaker 1: We leave on Saturday for Edinburgh. Yes, and then we
spend some time there, then a little bit of time
in Dublin, then a little bit of time in Donnengaal
for Internet we're attending, and then we go back to
Dublin and then we fly home.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: It's very exciting, very exciting, and we're hitting the parts
of Europe that are not I know, in the throes
of a heat. I mean we'll be in Scotland and.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean We've been checking the temperatures and it
looks okay, you know, as opposed to everything.
Speaker 1: Has be very rainy, which is the Scottish experience.
Speaker 2: I know. I mean I expect that. Yeah, I mean,
everything I've been reading says that you can have a
predict what the weather's going to be. So we're just
gonna go and enjoy.
Speaker 1: But you we are flying out on which is crazy.
I don't even know.
Speaker 2: I I don't even know what I'm thinking.
Speaker 1: Very very interested. I have no idea. What what is
an airport like on July fourth? Are they full? Is
it full of people or is it empty? No?
Speaker 2: They say Thursday is the worst day.
Speaker 1: I can't imagine people are traveling on the dead probably yeah,
but then again we're hitting the international gates, so who knows. Yeah,
but it'll be interesting. Like I don't even know what
time we're leaving for the airwork. Because you have to remember,
folks were in Philadelphia right. Not only are we in Philadelphia,
we are in the historic Section. The Betsy Ross, Betsy
Ross's House, Benjamin Franklin's Grave, and the Liberty Bell are
all within three blocks of where we live, so we
are like a ground zero of patriotism at this time
of year, but I don't, and the World Cup's going on,
so we have a lot of you know, I have
no idea what traffic is going to be like that day.
Our flight isn't until the evening, but I have a
feeling mister planner here is going to have us sitting
at the gate at nine o'clock that morning.
Speaker 2: No, but but we're gonna have to leave early anyway.
It is what it is. I don't know what I
was thinking. I guess I was just thinking. I don't
know that we needed to be there a certain day
and wasn't thinking about the holiday.
Speaker 1: But it doesn't make a difference.
Speaker 2: Don't make any difference because if I had booked it
on Friday or or you know, Thursday or whatever, it's
still crazy. It's been crazy. It's been crazy. You go
out on the street because we go to the gym
near us here, it's the streets are packed with tourists.
Speaker 1: It's packed with World Cup people, and it's it's packed
with patriotism fans. That's the thing We've talked about this before,
that you know, the cutest time of year. It's it's
a lot of people in flag clothes.
Speaker 2: I love walking.
Speaker 1: I love it, yes and no, I've said this before.
I do love it. But we've mentioned this before. It
is a tourist area in the summer, and you will
quite often be asked directions somewhere by tourists, and so
it's very common for people to walk up to you
in their American flag t shirts and their American flag
ball caps and everything and ask for directions or ask
A common one is where's a good to get a
cheese steak? And more than once, more than a dozen
times over the years, I have opened my mouth to
speak to people and they I could see the reaction
to my big gay voice. You're homosexual, And it wasn't
a good I mean it was you know, because it's
not it's people from out of town, let's put.
Speaker 2: It that way.
Speaker 1: So you get all kinds of you get all kinds
of just and sometimes the people most likely to wear
an American flag ball cap are the same people who
don't want to talk to a flaming homosexual about cheese steaks.
Speaker 2: But I still like, I mean, they have like school
groups and you know, like stuff like that, which is adorable. Yeah,
you see those kids, you know, visiting every place and
they get all excited about it. I like it. I
like it.
Speaker 1: I having said that, I am not. I mean, I
originally felt some kind of way about us exiting the
Country Lifeboard on the two hundred the anniversary. Maybe we
shouldn't do that, And then as the day kept getting closer,
I'm like, yeah, I'm not. I'll be honest, I'm not
feeling this whole two hundred and fifty thing right now.
And that is something I'm segueing into this. Before I
segue into this, let me just give you the late lamb.
We're going to talk a little bit about the you know,
the Great American Fair happening in Washington, d C. And
what a debacle that is. We're going to talk a
little bit about that those silly people who climb the
Empire State Building yesterday. We're gonna talk a little bit
about Taylor and Travis's wedding because it's getting entirely out
of hand. And we're going to talk about how said
the Dragons second episode of the third season, which shut
my mouth on everything I was complaining about the show
lest truly last podcast, and then they come out with
this fucking banger of an episode that I'm like, all right,
I'm in it. I'm fully in it, all right. So
that's what we're talking about, Philly. If you don't have
plans and your aunt anywhere within driving distance, I gotta say,
Philly's looking great for July fourth. There's so much The
city looks great. I Dina Menzel is giving a concert
two blocks of our apartment.
Speaker 2: Oh my god. Yeah.
Speaker 1: If it wasn't so hot and we didn't have all
our packing to do, I would go down there. We
interviewed her one time.
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, she's lovely.
Speaker 1: The celebrations look great, the city looks great, and uh yeah.
You never hear me pump up Philly, but this is
the one time I'm going to do it. Because all
the money went.
Speaker 2: To d C.
Speaker 1: As his case, like, as a Philadelphian, I have watched
New York and DC and Boston grabbed the glory when
it comes to July fourth, Bitch, that's ours, that's ours.
It happened here, I know exactly. Boston you get the
tea party, New York you get everything else. But this
is us, this is us not and whatever the problem
the DC thing I think has, it's made me even
more depressed. About the state of the country, the debacle
of the Great American Fair debacle. First off, you know,
we never get into Trump on this thing, because God almighty,
who the fuck wants to listen to us talk about that?
And it's just depressing For the most part. We want
our site, our podcast to be a place where you
can get away from that sort of stressful stuff. But
you know, in terms of like the national mood or
whatever that I don't think anything can sum it up
than that swampy ass looking thing that nobody is attending.
All the stars are canceling, can none of the stars
are doing concerts, are even like fucking vanilla ice canceling.
The reflecting pool is loaded with algae and floaties and god,
ducks are dying in it, and the whole thing is
just so damn depressing. It's And then on the fourth
they're apparently going to set off eight hundred and fifty
thousand fireworks, which because they want to be in the
Guinness Book of World's Records, and they're telling people, oh,
you might have to wear a mask, you might not
be able to breathe, and it's some people might want
to stay inside. What is the point of having a
fireworks thing.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, yeah, I mean I I I'm trying
to stay away from all of this. We've been so
focused on traveling, and like I said, it is nice
to see all the people here celebrating because you know,
it is it is something to celebrate. And I guess
if you do it your way without the you know,
pumping circumstance that we're seeing in DC, I.
Speaker 1: Don't even see pump. It's it's shitty game shows.
Speaker 2: Shit, that's the thing.
Speaker 1: I would welcome pomp and circumstance. I would welcome a
little bit of grandeur. But that arch, that vinyl cardboard
arch that everyone's been making fun.
Speaker 2: Of, and it looks just like the arc the trip
in Paris. It's, oh my god.
Speaker 1: Plastic and it looks like it would blow over in
a strong storm. I don't even understand. I got to say, like,
why did you plan all these outdoor events for DC
in July? It is a swamp, it is. I mean,
it's just not a place people want to be at
that time, not outside.
Speaker 2: No, we've been there and it's it's brutal.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, oh yeah, I just don't think having
everything outdoor is on the Mall in July when temperatures
were very likely going to hit over a hundred. Just
the whole thing has been incredibly poorly planned. It's not
about It wasn't planned by people who have a real
love of this country and want who celebrated. It was
planned by people who only know how to celebrate themselves.
And so it's tacky and it's cheap, and they're going
to try and break a world record and they're probably
going to wind up setting the Capitol on fire when
they do.
Speaker 2: It's it's I think it has a lot to do
with the fact that it it's not a celebration for everybody,
you know, clearly clearly not clearly not. And I think
people are turned off by it. Yeah, most people are,
so Yeah. I mean it doesn't feel like you're celebrating
everybody as you should as a country, and that's not happening.
So yeah, I mean, why would you participate if you
don't feel like you're going to be celebrating yourself in
your community. It's tough, it's sad that, but again, it's
it's just very interesting that everything that is important happens
when he's mad this minute in charge.
Speaker 1: Yeah, apparently he wants to give a two hour speech
in like one hundred and eight degree weather, and I'm like,
you know, you should.
Speaker 2: I heard that.
Speaker 1: That's all I'll say.
Speaker 2: Anyway, Yeah whatever.
Speaker 1: I think it's depressing, and I think all all smart
America and should probably just not give it their attention
at all. Go to your local thing, go to your
local fireworks. Come here to Philly. Yeah, but do not
even pay attention to that. It's very pretty right now,
sad little debacle, that cheap ass looking thing.
Speaker 2: Yes, don't. We have the first bank in the second
Bank of America. The first bank just open and I
think they have exhibits inside now. It looks gorgeous inside.
I can't wait to see it. So, yeah, we have
all that stuff going on here in Philadelphia, so you
should come now.
Speaker 1: You just reminded me because the Second Bank of Philadelphia
is right off Bank Street.
Speaker 2: Yes, and Bank.
Speaker 1: Street is where Harlow's nightclub was. Harlow was the trans
woman that we were writing about and talking about for many,
many years. And we had to announced a couple of
weeks back that Harlow walked away from the project. So
we will not be publishing the book. But in a
little bit of irony. Right after finding that out, we
received a journalism award for the pace that we wrote
in the Inquirer in December, and it's it's the National
Association of Gay Lesbian Journalists and excellent some profile writing.
And it is literally the first award my writing has
ever gotten, which is sweet. It's sweet because it would
have been nice to have a book deal to go
with it. But like we said, Rachel, she bounced and
that's not happening.
Speaker 2: But it's a beautiful article in the Philadelphia Inquiry. You
can find it online and it's really really wonderful.
Speaker 1: Yes, I'm very proud of it.
Speaker 2: Yes, and I'm glad you got that kind of record recognition. Yes, absolutely,
thank you.
Speaker 1: All right, So that's our July fourth stuff.
Speaker 2: So enjoyed the holiday. You know, celebrate however you feel
like celebrating. Remember you still American, You still should be
pre me the people.
Speaker 1: Yeah, celebrate with your people. Don't worry about those fucking
game show hosts.
Speaker 2: Yeah up as just celebrate the future.
Speaker 1: Yeah, just yeah, don't give them your energy. I'm actually,
like I said, I was, I felt some kind of
way about leaving the country on the during this time
and then I was like, you know what, I really
don't want to be here for any of this. I'm sorry,
but I don't Philly. It does look great though, and
there's a minor bit of bread that I'm not going
to be here in Philly for the celebrations, but no,
I'm happy to get the hell out of here. Do
you want to take a break now, let's take a
breakin all right, let's take a quick break and we'll
be back with some celebrity stuff and pop culture stuff.
We'll be right back. We're back, and just to kill
some time, we're going to talk about those dumbasses who
climbed to the top of the Empire State Building yesterday.
In case you missed it, yesterday, a couple climbed to
the top of the spire of the Empire State Building,
where they unfurled a banner when the Power that read
when the power of Love beats the love of power,
the world knows peace. And then I should also mention
that they were wearing cat masks and that he got
down on one knee and proposed, and then they climbed
down and prompatly got arrested. Their names are I mean,
as soon as it happened literally as soon as it
popped up on social media. Oh my god, there's a
couple climbing the spire. I was like, all right, what
are they promoting? Like?
Speaker 2: What? Right?
Speaker 1: So it turns out her name is Angela Nicolau and
her name is his name is Evon Berkus, and they
had a Netflix documentary that came out in twenty twenty
four called Skywalker's a Love Story. Now, they weren't promoting
that documentary it came out two years ago, but clearly
there's a bit of attention. See can going on there?
Speaker 2: Do you think? I mean, it's the usual of social
media thing. How many people have died climbing shit and
then you know, falling and dying and because they went
a picture because they want something for their social media
account and to promote whatever this is it I'm you know,
and and the funny thing you go online because that's
my favorite part to read the comments and they're divided.
Speaker 1: They think it's amazing. How are you going to beat that? Yes,
that's the part that I'm like, what first thought? They
were called activists in the additional report, I'm like, just
because they unfurl the flag does not make them activists.
They're fame whores and with no fear of heights, which
which I admire because I watched some of the footage
and like they're standing there and like, oh my god,
I could never do that. No, never do that with
no protection whatsoever. But they do that all the time.
And and and it's usually I legal stuff they do.
I mean they climb these things without any any permit
or any that's the thing. Not to sound like such
a hall monitor or cop, but like the the Empire
State Building released a statement and said, at no point
was anyone in any danger. And I'm like, that is
so very clearly true, because putting aside the danger that
they put themselves in, if they fall right, literally anybody
underneath them is in danger.
Speaker 2: All right, But let's let's forget these two in and
what if it was like some terrorist attack or whatever
to bomb the whole thing down. I mean, think about it.
We've been to the Empire shape, but.
Speaker 1: Its on the observation deck in December.
Speaker 2: I've been there about like three times, maybe now or
four times. I've taken my mom, my brother, everybody. Anyway,
I mean, you get yelled at five guards before you
get to the top. I mean to do certain things.
Walk this way, go this way, don't walk here, don't
do this. How did these people get all the way
up there with nobody stopping them? That's that's I don't well.
Speaker 1: I mean once you got to figure once, once they
start the climb, there's no way to stop them, climb
after them, and no security guard is doing that.
Speaker 2: But my place, how do you get there without some
security person you know, watching your I.
Speaker 1: Mean on the observation deck if you wanted to, you
could climb on over it and get up to the spire.
Many nuts to do so. But anyway, what bothers me
is that, you know, it's just a tension seeking nonsense
that people tend to like, Oh it's so romant, And
I'm like, yeah, all right, but copycats exist, right, And
as you said, that is a security risk, like someone
could go up there with a bomb or something, right,
And I know that sounds hysterical, you know it is,
and I get it. But my point is, I'm not
I'm not proclaiming potential disaster. And I don't even know
have an idea of whether those two should be. I mean,
I don't know the law about any of this. I
just don't feel like it's anything admirable or something that
we should be praising them for.
Speaker 2: You know, the thing that bothers me with social media
and these people doing these things to get you know, attention,
is that it's such it's so disruptive. You see all
these videos of people, you know, playing these pranks and
all this stuff, you know, you know, talking to people
and making fun of people and filming them, you know,
that kind of stuff. I think it's such it's so
invasive to me, you know, to the public that you
just decide that you're going to make fun of somebody
or or or you're going to create a situation so
that you can get hits on your social media, pretending,
you know, do whatever, fight so all kinds of stuff
just to get attention, just to get people to click
on whatever you're showing and you know, get your money.
I just think it's right too much. I don't I
think there are worse things they could have done. And
like I said, I'm not suggesting that they, you know,
the book should be thrown at them, but I don't
agree when people treat this as some sort of harmless thing,
I'm like, I don't know how harmless that is, they
put people in danger. Regardless of what the Empire State
Buildings says. If either of them had fallen off that building,
anybody below them was going to be in danger of
what would happen when the impact when they you know,
hit the street.
Speaker 1: So I just don't believe that. I also, you know,
they're lucky that know, like ambitious security guard tried to
go after them, because then what if someone someone did
stupidly try and get them to come down and then
injure themselves. This is what I mean. None of this
happens in a vacuum. You're not the time, you do
not exist in your own little world. You did this
in the middle of a very very busy, you know, metropolis,
and it's an organism. Everybody gets affected by what you do.
Speaker 2: You have to assign people to go after them, you know,
to to to arrest him, all that that those are resources.
Speaker 1: Wasted of this attention seeking moment again not some grand
crime whatever. But I just don't feel that these things
are neutral.
Speaker 2: I just don't. I yeah, yeah, I find the whole
thing at the very I think especially the fact that
you know, you're not even from here. You come here
and then you do shit like that.
Speaker 1: Now, Okay, that sounds weirdly anti immigrant. Now, it's just
a little like, I mean, you're visiting and then you
breaking a law, breaking the law.
Speaker 2: I don't know. I just feel a little like you
have no yeah, authoritation to do what you're doing. I
don't know. Just feels a little weird to me.
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, moving on to that other New York
couple who is dominating the city at the moment. It's
Taylor and Travis's wedding, which apparently is happening in the
next couple of days. Supposedly it's happening tomorrow. Yeah, which
uh I wondered briefly. I was like, oh shit, we're
leaving on Saturday. We won't be able to cover it.
But there's not going to be caught, like she is
going to control the images.
Speaker 2: Well, my understanding is that you know, people are going
to go into the thing that you're not even not
gonna You're not going to even see who's coming as
a guest or you know.
Speaker 1: It's like it was all that covered. Yeah, it's a
covered entrance. And I think, so why the fuck? Because
you want your privacy, you want to celebrate, you want
your privacy, So you're having it at Madison Square Garden.
Speaker 2: I questioned that a lot. I was like, why of
all places? But then I was watching listening to NPR
this morning, and there is an explanation. I mean, she's
done a lot there, like apparently her first talent show
competition when she was a kid, like twelve years old
or whatever in two thousand and three. I believe I
was there, So she has this sort of attachment to
the place. You know, she performed there many times. I mean,
she's a fan of games and all that, so she
wants to do it there. Listen. I always feel.
Speaker 1: The plans are getting a little out of hand, but
I mean once you booked to MSG, it was out
of hand.
Speaker 2: I mean, what else do you expect is tell a
Swift getting married. So of course it's going to be.
Speaker 1: Into a football player.
Speaker 2: Ye, it's going to it's like Princess Diana level of
attention on them. You know, yes, obviously it's like the
Princess of America getting married and yeah, And I'm here's
my thing. I can't stand weddings in general. I think
it's too much attention on them the whole time. That's
my take on ye. I'm not a wedding person, but
I understand.
Speaker 1: So I think our own wedding was thirty five people
in around. We just bought everybody dinner. We just did
not want some big, showy, look at us thing.
Speaker 2: We closed the restaurant and then then had just a
celebration with family and friends. But that's us.
Speaker 1: That's us.
Speaker 2: Family members have you know, got married much bigger venues
and done wonderful things. I think it's your day. You
do whatever you want to do. It's your day, your celebration,
and and you should do whatever fu is right for you.
And when you have money and that kind of fame
and attention on you, of course is going to be huge.
So I wasn't expecting anything small. I mean it is
going to be big. They're talking about, well maybe they're
getting married someplace else, and that's just a place where
fames are going to go to watch the wedding, which
is crazy. That's not just i'sstand.
Speaker 1: It's funny because you would think I want I want
to find out about the dress because we write about fashion,
but I'm actually like, I want to see how this
is going to be stay right, Like, how are you
processing in what is the is all of this happening
on a stage or so all the seats are empty.
You're in like an empty venue with a thousand people
and then thirty thousand empty seat or actually more.
Speaker 2: Than I don't remember what it looks like inside. Is
it a theater or is it as.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's yeah, yeah, yeah, it's like a yeah,
it's a it's an arena, so it's whatever they would
share the basketball games in there. They have concerts in there,
so you know, it's not a it's not a personium stage.
It's it's a center court. So I guess that's what happened.
And apparently there's I mean, I just I think it's
going to be so over the top engross, but we're
probably not going to see pictures. Apparently there was a
castle set. There's like this fairy tale. It's so they're
going to be so we I mean, they're they're they're
monitoring everything that goes inside that place.
Speaker 2: And apparently there's like castle parts.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean we'll see. Well see, let's say it's
your day or in your thirties, it's your day. This
is a prom Listen to me. I know, I believe
you're being so because I feel like.
Speaker 2: It's your day. You do whatever you feel like doing it,
and if you have the power and the money to
do it, it's a billionaire or whatever they're doing. I mean,
people spend millions, you know, on their weddings if they
have the money, because they feel like they that's the
way they should be celebrating. I like small things, elegant things,
you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have newfound respect for Thomas Anddeia. They just
did it. Nobody even knows what she wore or when
it happened. I mean, actually think they're lying about that.
I think the wedding hasn't happened yet, although they are
wearing the I think they're wearing wedding bands. But I
still think there's a wedding that they haven't had yet, right.
Speaker 2: I mean, we just saw Dalle and what's his name
Turner get married and it was big. It wasn't as
big I guess, but it was big in Italy.
Speaker 1: I understand celebrity weddings are big things, but I mean
ranting out Madison Square garden and building a castle inside
it is wow. But that is a lot, even for you,
Taylor Swift.
Speaker 2: I know, but they're not known for their taste, so
so and more subtle or again yes, and they're famous,
and like, I mean, come on, I knew that they
was gonna come. Taylors was gonna get married and it
was going to be huge.
Speaker 1: So I'm assuming they're confiscating everybody's phone as they go
in and all that sort of nonsense. I wonder who
her bridesmaids are.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean her friends that those hind sisters or whatever.
Speaker 1: Like, oh, I know, but she's got a lot of
famous late friends, so maybe she's one of those. Is
gonna have like fifty brides Well that's the trend.
Speaker 2: Now you have twenty five, you know, people next to you,
so lessen money, money, money, money, There is no limit
to whatever they can dream of for the day. And
like I said, today, enjoy break his.
Speaker 1: Ship and even for her, I'm like, wow, that is
a lot. Is a level of it? Is I just
I you know, yeah, whatever, like you said, she's got
the money, she's allowed to do it. And we said
this a couple of weeks when we were talking about it.
I actually this might come off naive, but I do
think this is it for her. I don't I do think,
you know, there's done, like this is the man she's
Unless there's some disaster, no, I think I think, yeah,
I think that they're gonna be always the case with
the marriage. But yeah, I just I think that is
how she's treating it. I waited a long time for
this one, and I am not doing this again.
Speaker 2: I like this is I think she found her man.
Uh and she's she's had an amazing career. Not that
she's going to stop doing whatever she's doing, but you know,
there's one big career here that she can be very
proud of.
Speaker 1: It's why I think she's gonna be She's gonna have
a baby very very.
Speaker 2: Probably and then continue her career, maybe a different way
of you know, creating art.
Speaker 1: We'll see that baby is going to be crowned, especially
if it's a girl. Oh my god, she has a
daughter that she will be princess whatever. Yeah, but that's
that's that's how it is. I wished him well and
enjoy their billionaires. I wish them as much as enjoy it.
Just I can wish any billionaire well. But uh yeah,
I'm not unhappy for them. Go go have have your big, tacky,
ostentatious wedding and I will do my best to cover
it depending on any pictures.
Speaker 2: I mean, she likes the contruth.
Speaker 1: Why would you have such an attention seeking style of wedding?
And then I mean, what's the point in having that
castle set if no one's going, Well, I guess your
guests are going to see it, and that's all that matters
to you.
Speaker 2: I think you can. I think you can have any
enormous wedding, huge celebration just for the people you invited.
I don't think you have to have that. I can.
Speaker 1: And I mean she could have had it on a
private island somewhere like. Instead she had it in the
busiest dansas city in America in its major venue.
Speaker 2: Because apparently in New York means a lot to her,
I can't believe. And Madison Square Garden also means a
lot to her.
Speaker 1: So I guess, yeah, all right, listen, I go with
with whatever. Wow, this is a new found now, It's just.
Speaker 2: That it is a uh. We get invited to weddings
a lot, and I go because I love the people
that are getting married, but it's it's always a lot
to me. Weddings are a lot. And but you know,
I also respect that that's your day and then you
get to celebrate.
Speaker 1: However, you feel like the other thing is with a
wedding this elaborate. There has to be pre parties, after parties,
brunch hit like there's it's a whole weekend.
Speaker 2: Oh, I mean it would happened to be.
Speaker 1: Yeah, although I would be surprised if any of that
stuff was happening in New York City, but maybe it is.
The thing is, you can't rent out a restaurant or
a hall or whatever without people knowing. So I'm just
very curious about what what supplemental. There's no way this
is the main event and that's all they're I think.
Speaker 2: I think one reason also to do to do the
wedding at Medicine Career Garden it is because it's easy
to it's easier to contrue. I mean people can't you know, well.
Speaker 1: They're blocking it off from blocks in several directions, so
it's not easy. It's it's actually elaborate.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean they're doing all the work to protect
that that you know dome.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So so so nobody can like you know, jump on
the roof or or you know, break a window to
see the wedding. Yeah. I mean it to day lady
to day.
Speaker 1: And I mean I'm assuming that, like the reception is
in the probably you can't just I mean, I well.
Speaker 2: They they had they saw trucks bringing food and apparently
there's okay, yeah, there's chicken, there's chicken. There's all kind
of been things delivered. And they apparently named the chef
that I can't remember his name right now. He's a
very famous chef. So I guess they're gonna yeah. I
mean it's a huge place, right, they can do everything
in there, they can stay there for days.
Speaker 1: Supposedly the dress is dere.
Speaker 2: Uh yeah, yes, Like I said, it's gonna be a
very traditional I think I'd be shocked if she went
with the Kelvin Kleine kind of like modern modern look
satin white sat. No, I don't think that's gonna be.
I think it's gonna be a little lathe thirty pounds
laise very deal, which again, hey go dere right, and
I mean why not. I mean I would go Dior
Chanelle if I had the money.
Speaker 1: And she got the money. All right, that's it for that.
Why don't we take a short break and when we
come back, we're going to talk about House of the Dragon.
We're back and now we're going to talk about season three,
episode two of House of the Dragon, Queen's Landing and
it you know should go without saying this. This part
of the conversation is going to be full of spoilers.
But it aired three nights ago, so you know, if
you haven't watched it yet, get on that, especially since,
as I said, I was ambivalent about coming back to
House of the Dragon. When these shows take so much
time off, it's very hard for me to get excited
about them coming back. And as I've said in the
past about this show, I don't think the story, the
basic story is interesting at all, and sometimes the show
is can be a real slog not because there's nobody
to root for it and there is nobody to root for,
but there's nobody having any fun with it. There's no one,
there's no sense of real fun in how the story's told.
It's very very great and you know, if that's what
you're looking for, that's what you're looking for, but it's
it can be hard for me to sustain an interest
in a story like this. And last after last week's
episode with Jasarah's you know, getting plugged with arrows and
sinking beneath the ocean. I was like, these people are
all fucking idiots, Like they're all dumb and corrupt and
evil people. And like I said last week, if it
was fun to watch that, then I wouldn't have a complaint.
But the show can get very self serious, it can
get very morose, and sometimes that really weighs it down.
And now I loved this episode. In fact, I think
it was one of the best in the series, and
I would rank it high with any of the highest
House of the I mean Game of Thrones episodes. Part
of the I'm sorry, I totally agree with you.
Speaker 2: I was. I absolutely loved the episode. And first of all,
we was stunning beautiful. I mean, they spend so much money,
it is gorgeous. But I also think that a show
like this that that realized heavily on on on fights
and and and you know and history and all that
and death and family, they have to bring what they
what I think they brought this episode, It is emotion,
you know, like it's people feeling something. Yeah, can I
just And when you bring that in, then then you
know they become humans.
Speaker 1: That's it. Uh, Because going off my point, what I
was saying, was this episode did not suddenly make these
characters more fun to watch. Certainly no one was having
like a campy moment or anything like that. It was
still very, very self serious. But you nailed it. I
felt like people were acting like people like people were
even because of that, the drama was engaging. But really
the number one thing for me throughout this episode, I
kept thinking of myself, Wow, this is so well written
when you think of the number of moving parts in
this story and the number of people with opposing agendas
and overlapping agendas, right, and the fact that you can
keep track of this without even trying all that hard.
Because I said that going into this season, I was like,
I'm not doing the research. I'm not doing any of it.
These episodes have to stand on their own, I agree,
And this episode I was like, Wow, there is so
much going on. There are so many people moving back
and forth throughout these scenes, and I get it. I
get all of it. And when we were watching Allison
desperately trying to manage that situation, I was like, Wow,
this is all so fucked up because they set all
the pieces up so well, Like, I don't know that
Alison knew that Jasiras was dead.
Speaker 2: I don't probably not.
Speaker 1: I don't understand how Lady Jane of the Veil who
told Ryana that he was I don't know how she
knew that, but whatever, there's spies or whatever. But I
did not get the impression that Alison understood that that
Cessaras was dead. They didn't know a lot of things.
They didn't know a lot of it, didn't know about
her father, right, there's a lot. So there were all
of these moving parts and then like Rhyania, and again
it's like you don't realize that until a character voice
is this. They Rania and Damon came into the castle
thinking they were going to find Agon there and they
didn't even know that Agon is gone, which makes it
makes to show more reo, I think, because but yeah,
that's the part of it that it's like nobody text
he that works really well is that lack of communication.
To be honest, this was something that Tolkien was really
really big on h in his work, and I guess
George R. R. Martin has has brought that into it. The
idea that when you have this many moving parts, when
you have these many people with agendas and everything lack
of communication can be an absolute disaster people who don't
know what's going on.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you saw that a lot with Lord of the Rings,
where situations happening and and and things moving right separately.
You know, they didn't even know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I did love that all throughout the episode
as Alison, who I disliked tumendously, but you could feel it,
the rising panic in her throat and everything as she
was trying to manage this situation, and she actually did
at the end of it. She actually did manage the
situation really well and survived an attempted rape on top
of it.
Speaker 2: I know, which which apparently he's not part of the book.
Speaker 1: I didn't mind it. There were people getting mad at it,
because of course House of the Dragon was sort of
infamous for that, for having far too many scenes of
sexual assault and kind of lingering on that thing. Give
me Lord of the Rings not I mean, I'm sorry. Yeah,
Game of Thrones lingered on that had too many rape
scenes in it. But House of the Dragon is, more
so than Game of Thrones ever, was specifically about patriarchal systems.
It's about women seeking power in systems that don't allow
them to seek power, and because of that, and because
of the criticisms of Game of Thrones, I think they
sort of took a step back from depicting that too much.
But I did think it worked in that scene. I
did think it made sense in that scene. First off,
there was nothing lascivious about it, or I mean it was.
It was shot in as coldly clinical a manner as
you can shoot a scene like that, and it was
over fairly quickly, so I didn't feel like they lingered
on it or exploited it. It should be noted that the
director of the episode was a woman, and I don't
think that's coincidental.
Speaker 2: Make a very good point. You felt it felt brutal
without sexualizing no anyway.
Speaker 1: Or being fatcy about it.
Speaker 2: It's brutal and.
Speaker 1: Ugly and quick. And I also think there's something to
be said for having violent acts depicted in that way,
you know, depicting them in a manner that what the
fuck just happened, because that's often the case with violin acts.
They don't linger, they don't act, there's not balatic actions
in them. They're quick and ugly and they leave people confused.
So I actually thought all of that was handled really
really well, So Rightierra, Okay, Emma Darcy, this whole episode
is their Emmy reel. I'm sorry, I'm very distracted because
there's a twenty two pound cat who insists on sitting
right next to my microphone. I literally don't have any
place to put my hands right now. So this was
Emma Darcy's Emmy's real. Emma Darcy's Emmy's real. Uh, that's
not easy to say. The scene where Ryan Neier, it's
difficult because right, neerer is is a she, but Emma
is a day. So if you hear me using she,
I am referring to her character. Uh, the scene where
she uh sees Sarah's and and oh god, it's so
beautifully done because I mean I remember when the scene
first started. I was like, oh, look, they're going to
show it. They're going to show this, and this is
going to be hard, like it's a mother's you know,
discovering her son's death. And I just think, Darcy, the
way they handled that scene, just just the confusion at
the beginning, and then the the the way she would
not accept it. You know, she kept saying, just Era's wait,
you know, get up that sort of thing. What is
this what have you done? And then when the realization
comes in, and then it goes from sobbing, from crying
to that the kind of full body racking sobs that
you would need an actor to do in a scene
like that, because that's the thing that's got to be
one of the hardest things any actor has to pull off.
Any decent actor can cry on command, but to do
that a mother's grief over there. Yeah, I never forgot
broad Church. Yes, that was when Olivia Coleman when she
found and that wasn't grief. That was actually she found
out something terrible about her husband. And that was the
first time I had seen her. That was and I
remember thinking, Jesus Christ, that is some of the best
I like to pull that kind of despair out of
yourself where it just is coming from your whole body.
Speaker 2: I think this show works also because of those two ladies,
I mean, no ladies, those two actors, actress Olivia Cook
and Amma Dorsey. They're very good.
Speaker 1: I should say I had the alac but I think
your Cook is great. But she makes me hate Allison.
Speaker 2: Right, she's great. I mean they're young, they're both young actors,
but they're good. Yeah, they're very good.
Speaker 1: So yes, and then Ranier returns on her whole council,
and I thought for a minute there she was going
to order all of them to kill themselves.
Speaker 2: I just want to point out that apparently in the
book she's never locked and then and the body was
never found.
Speaker 1: Of the Sarah's body. Ye.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so that was something that the show decided, and
I think it was for the It worked, it really worked.
Speaker 1: And also, yeah, her anger at being locked into that
room really plays with the themes of the show, which
is that these women look at that scene at the
Red Keep in the Throne room where they are faced
with the King's guard and she unsheathes her sword and
they all start laughing at her. And I mean, you
saw this in Game of Thrones as well, anytime a
woman achieved power. All the men were very condescending about it. Sure,
and you know that's very painfully accurate to the real
world as well. But I thought it played well with
the themes of the story that the men that the
women in these stories are are seeking power, but they
rely on the men. Yes, they do execute their will,
and that is a dichotomy that none of them can
get past. This whole thing. You saw that with Allison,
where she was in mortal danger the entire episode, while
at the same time she was trying to execute her
queenly will, trying to order men around and hoping that
just her will could get this done for her, and
it did.
Speaker 2: I think that's one of the hardest things as a
viewer is to watch that because you have to be
true to the books, but at the same time, you
want these these lady characters succeed in do well and
have power.
Speaker 1: Now I don't, I don't, and I don't want either
one of them to exactly.
Speaker 2: I do know how the story ends, and I do know.
You know.
Speaker 1: The thing is, there is no winner. It's just who,
you know, who gets to sit on the throne until
they're violently overthrown. I'm not giving anything away. I was
a little surprised that she wound up on the throne
so quick quickly. But I will say this whole episode,
these two episodes felt like the end of a season.
This would have been that shot of Allison looking at
her father's body would have been a perfect way to
end a season, like what a cliffhanger, But apparently they
only have six more episodes to go, and there's a
lot of stuff, but I was unhappy with the way
the previous season ended. And man, if these first two
episodes had been the last two episodes, I would have
been saying I would have been fully on board for
season three.
Speaker 2: But even HBO didn't have them.
Speaker 1: They didn't have the money. But what else can we
talk about? I think one of the characters, go ahead,
I just want about Lord Laris and Aggon. Yes, yes,
they are quickly turning into the sort of uh comedic
right uh you know, foils of the story. They're not
exactly hilarious, but there's humor. There's humor there, and honestly,
I don't know where that's going. They got out of
that situation and and then he he basically you know,
asserted himself over Laris. So I don't know, I actually
have no idea where that story's going at.
Speaker 2: That because referring back to Lord of the Rings, it's
one of those situations where there's a there will be
another story going on, you know, and nobody knew. Everybody
think he's dead.
Speaker 1: Game of Thrones was always very good about that. The
previous series was it was always good about sending characters
off and on side quests and on side stories. So
I am actually looking for to where they take these
two and what's going on with them. Similarly, Rhyana and
Sheep Stealer, I think she's a great character. I think
she's a really great character. And I think Phoebe Campbell
is doing I didn't mention this, but in last week's episode,
the whole scene of her approaching sheep Stealer and again
I'm using her to refer to Rhyina because Phoebe Campbell
is non binary. That whole scene of her approaching sheep
Stealer and trying to get on his back and everything,
and the acting is so the beer on their face
and everything, And I remember sitting there thinking they they
did this in the studio with a green scream. None
of this was happening. I know, sometimes, especially with the
dragon stuff, you really need to take a moment and
realize as realistic as those things, there's nothing behind, nothing,
not they were in a studio shooting this stuff, looking
at a tennis ball that drive it act scared, I thought.
Speaker 2: Conversation with Lady Lady Jane, I think, yeah.
Speaker 1: Lady Jane is such a bitch. I love her. First
of all, she's gorgeous, her costumes are beautiful. She's cold, Yeah,
give me more characters like that. Entertaining bitchy characters.
Speaker 2: You know, that is something to show. But my point
is that her expression, her face, her despair. When she's
starting her despair, it's.
Speaker 1: Not really bad. It really killed a family member essentially,
and now Rainier wants to know who was right again,
I love that because they think that it's someone you know,
it's on the green side, and they need to find
out who this person is. That no idea that all
of this is getting more and more complicated because people
don't have information.
Speaker 2: All they know she's heading two pintos or yeah, that place,
who knows what what? Well, she's staying in the veil
apparent right right, I mean, apparently she has no place
to go. She's gonna have to hide with her directon.
Speaker 1: With her dragon. Yeah so and then oh yeah, sir
Simon Strong got killed at harn such a great his
useless large adult sons, I know, but they did manage
to get aimoned. I mean he did collapse on the
floor in front of Alice Rivers. And who the hell
knows she's going to sleep with him. She's gonna, I
guess she hates Damon now because Damon laughed at her
when she asked.
Speaker 2: For doesn't want to give her a castle.
Speaker 1: That doesn't want to give her a castle, and she
is a witch. So she's gonna my favorite character.
Speaker 2: She's going to give her, give her something.
Speaker 1: Yeah, But what a turn of events, because now what
what happens with the Greens, Like they all seem to
be kind of powerless at the moment. Outahi Tower is
dead by the way, my god, he's yeah, Aimond is incapacitated,
Aigon is wandering somewhere, and Helena just wants to raise chickens.
So what what's left? As you said, it would have
been a great and I know, and then of a season.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the fact that.
Speaker 1: They wound up beheading Otto High Tower because they wanted
to be head Agon and that was the plan. And
Allison actually agreed to have her son be killed by Rhinia.
She did not agree to have her father be killed
by her, And so she's going to kind of treat
this as a betrayal. But as with everything Allison does,
I'm like, is it really a betrayal lady? Like your
father is the reason why all of this happened, right,
And when she and Rhiniera had that meeting list season,
I mean, they understood and they made it very clear
in order for ray Near to take the throne, people
will need to be executed in Allison's family, So she
didn't execute her son. She executed her father. And like, Okay,
I guess you can be mad, but how mad can
you be? You agreed to this, you set this up,
I know, and I loved. I loved the beheading scene,
which is such a crazy things like that. It was brutal,
it was, but it was two things about it that
I was like, good directing, very very very good directing.
Speaker 2: When she walked.
Speaker 1: Around behind him, yes, and the whole crowd surged forward
because they all wanted a better view of his beheading,
And if you know anything about public executions in like
the medieval era or like, that was what they were
like people, even though even the you know, the aristocracy
loved a good beheading. So I love that so weird
to me. And then the moment where she walks to
the throne and slips in his blood, and I'm like,
I know that's not subtle, but I still think it's
great direct.
Speaker 2: The shot of the throne reflected in the Blood, which
was absolutely fantastic, really.
Speaker 1: Well staged, really well.
Speaker 2: Now I think the show is great. Nothing's pretty, you know.
Speaker 1: Everything, it's just but I was so impressed with this
episode everybody. The acting was fantastic, the writing was so
sharp and smart, and the directing was just you gotta
really have a handle on this material or it just
becomes a muddy mess. Yeah, and we've seen that happen
with both Game of Thrones and episodes of House of
the Dragon, where you can tell the material just kind
of got away from the director, the or the screenwriters.
But this was an episode where it's like everybody is
so on their game right now. They it really felt
like everybody involved was like, Okay, we need to move
the story, all of the stories forward, but we also
need to not lose the audience. Like everything needs to
be crystal clear.
Speaker 2: And I think, as you said, the show did a
very good job showing everything and keep you interested even
if you never read the books. I mean like that's
how I felt. Yeah, watching the entire episode, I was like,
this is good. I'm enjoyed this to the point that
I almost watch it again. Yeah, that's a good time.
I might watch it again just because because it was
it was great. It was great.
Speaker 1: Also, I did love that corless Filaria. I was going
to be united with his family firely black family now, yeah,
and although they have no place to go, but I
did love that scene with Bayla and his two sons
and where she said to Alan, She's like, I'm tired
of losing people. And I'm like, all right, what's this family?
Speaker 2: Now? What are you all going to have?
Speaker 1: Because that their castle was burning, and yeah, I don't
know what happens, what's going to happen? Literally, that's the thing.
We're in a spot where it's like, wow, I have
no idea where any of this is going, and I
am very happy with that.
Speaker 2: That's good. So it's great. I can't wait for the
next episode. Same.
Speaker 1: I can't believe he said that, but like.
Speaker 2: I said, it was really well done. And and my
frustration sometimes watching shows like these. You said, I didn't
read the books, so I don't know these people. I
don't know their history. You know, all these eggs and
dropping in, I have no clue what they are, you know,
like you know what I mean. But so you just
want to appreciate the show for what it is, and
when they do a good job with that, then yeah,
they succeed.
Speaker 1: I agree, And with that, I think we're going to
wrap u up. We will not be back next week
because we're going to be on vacation, but we will
have a Bitter Kitten Movie Club dropping next Friday. We're
going to be watching The Materialists. We're recording that tonight
nice and we'll publish that next Friday, and then we'll
be back, so we will. We will not be recapping
the next House of the Dragon until we get back
in two weeks. Until then, take care of yourselves, love
you mean it.
Speaker 2: Bye bye bye