Speaker 1: What is up, Fellowsikos, I am Dan Favalley coming at
you with the one, the only, the certified, fantabulous, mister
Grant Hughes. We are gathered here today to draft our
biggest NBA X Factors for the rest.
Speaker 2: Of this season, could be through the playoffs.
Speaker 1: Just the regular season bonus points if there's big picture
slants involved here ro I don't think we've done an
X factor draft before. Everyone talks about them around the playoffs,
but we're gonna do them. We're gonna do them now
because that's how we roll. Mister Grant Hughes, how are you?
Speaker 3: Uh? I'm doing well. I'm just filling out my big
board right now so that I know the top five
picks that I want to make and hope that you
don't snag any of them for me. I'm doing very well.
Thank you for asking. I want you to know that
I will never try to make you into Clint Capella.
I think more highly well than that.
Speaker 2: I would also like you to know that we are
going to debut.
Speaker 1: This is a promotion a new hardware Knox item, but
I have D Money's Crunk Juice here. It's a limited
edition Sicko flavor, so you can't get it. It's gonna
be in stores, available on our Mert shop link. In
a podcast YouTube description, it's it's gonna turn you into
a superhero. There might be a godly amounts of caffeine
in it, but the d Money's crunk juice not live
at the Hardwoo Knock Shop.
Speaker 3: I feel like the people should know that I didn't
have the DeAndre Ayton like response to here, how are
you doing bit planned at all, and then you simultaneously
had a DeAndre eight and related physical prop.
Speaker 1: Yeah if you if you're only listening, I had I
created a label.
Speaker 3: Yeah, label that looks like a ransom note.
Speaker 1: I I imagine that sodaes DeAndre Ayton's water bottle.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Hopefully this will still be in the news cycle
when people listen to this. Uh yeah, that was fun.
It's just I feel like I understand Andre Ayden.
Speaker 1: Now I've I understood him beforehand because the Timeline guys
were all over this while he was in Phoenix. But
I will say, do you ever feel bad because Dave
mcmahamon wrote a hell of a piece. It's like this
in depth piece and the only two things people are
gonna remember from it are the Clint Capella and the
crunk Juice anecdotes, well.
Speaker 3: And the like multiple personalities that he speaks to teammates.
And that's good, Ale, that's right with me. Do you
want to walk back your DeAndre Aiden can't get out
of his driveway because of snow and sleeps on it,
won't buy a bed not being a big deal now
because you were always like I don't care about that,
and now it's.
Speaker 2: Just part of the pattern. Man, it's evidence of a pattern. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well hold on, was it DeAndre Ayton wasn't able
to get or was it Alejandro couldn't.
Speaker 3: Break the great question? Great question? Maybe they're not.
Speaker 1: Core finds out needs to get on this and m
Kevin Durant Berner eight. Yeah, okay, Look his teammates already
know what it is.
Speaker 2: Yeah, which is great and so there you go.
Speaker 3: They do know what it is.
Speaker 1: But X factor, So do you any before we You
will have the first pick because I am a kind
generous person, but anything you want to get off your
chest with regards to how we I think we approached
this in the same way, but we do have different
big boards.
Speaker 2: I don't know who you're gonna pick. You don't know
who I'm gonna pick. So how did you approach this?
Speaker 3: First of all, this eight and diversion made me forget
I had I had a core four and I was
just writing it down and now I can't remember what
my fourth one was. I'll have to come back. Oh yep,
just got it. Hold on, let me write that down.
Thank you. And uh so we we discussed this a
little bit before. We're gonna so X factor one, like,
what section of the season are we talking about. It's
a little nebulous. It can be like the rest of
the regular season as it relates to seating or whatever.
It can in a lot of cases it probably should
have further reaching implications in that. So an X factor
can be someone that who's impact on a title chase matters.
Uh And we're not sure which way it's gonna go that.
That's like the built in part of the X factor
is like A could happen or B could happen, and
there's a big difference in the team's outcome depending on
which of those comes to pass, And we're not sure
what it's going to look like. So we're gonna try
to stay away from like Nikola Jokic is the Nuggets
X factor, cause he'll either be great or super great,
and you know, like we're just gonna try to avoid
that kind of thing, but we'll also I'm gonna try
to avoid you know, here's a here's a ninth man
that might really factor in or like going too far
down the totem pole or too far yeah, too far
down that that would be my assessment of it. Do
you have anything to add to what it is we're
doing here today.
Speaker 2: No, I would just add that, So I do have
something to add that.
Speaker 1: There was some low hanging fruit I took because if
they're well established quote unquote X factors where you could
just say Joel Embiid's knee or Joell Ebiand's health, I
wouldn't use that as a default, but there are other
players or instances where something like that I think could
carry a ton of weight.
Speaker 2: So I did try to steer clear of on my
big board.
Speaker 1: The low hanging fruit of Joel embid is the perfect
one because hell's the caveat for everyone, but Joel Embiid's
health questions, they're not really stand out anymore, Like we
just those are baked into the Joel Embiid experience.
Speaker 3: Yep, that's fair. I already know I'm going to make
at least, well, I'm hoping to depending on what you do,
make at least two selections that are not like new issues.
But I would say they are of renewed importance based
on how things have gone this season. So will not
be picking Embiid. He's not on the board for me,
but somewhat similar situations might come up. I would say,
that's a decent tease.
Speaker 1: I guess, well, why don't you get us started with
stop teasing us, grant and give.
Speaker 2: Us your first pick.
Speaker 3: I have them organized into tears, so there's no actual
first pick. There's like four or five that I am
considering here. The one I think I want to talk
about first, just because they've this team has been top
of mind since they played the Pistons and looked so
good earlier this week. Julian Champagne for the San Antonio
Spurs to me, and we can talk more broadly about
like sort of what it means that he's starting now
over Harrison Barnes, because Barnes, in theory, gives you like
a more conventional power forward sized player. His shooting has
always been solid, sometimes better than that. But putting Champagne
in a lineup now that also has Fox and Castle
and wimen Yama and It's and Visell that whole that
group collectively had not played a lot together all year,
Vicell miss time Castle has been in and out of
the starting group. Having that four guards those guys are
all guards with wem Banyama is a really interesting experiment
because one it basically says, we believe that wem Banyama
is such as he can be the defense, and we
can put four guys and that Castle is a great
defender like all those other guys are competent or better
with maybe Vissill is the exception, but the theory of
that team is really different. If it's four guards that
can all shoot except for Castle and Wemby in the middle,
and I support it. I think that's probably the way
to go. If you have a defender that can do
what wem Banyama does, it just is gonna depend on.
So the reason Champagne is a nex factor is like
the Spurs are kind of unbeatable if he's really hot,
and him and Vissel were lights out against Detroit on Monday,
that like you could talk all you want about, like oh,
Ween Banyama's defensive impact and the Pistons had a hard
to Yeah, those are all factors, but like, if those
two dudes aren't just scorching the whole game, the Pistons
might have just won anyway. So Champagne being a high volume,
high accuracy shooter matters, and Vaselle really, for that matter,
does too. I think maybe a Vecellee is like a
little better known commodity than Champagne. But but I just
think his role on this team is like shockingly large
based on where his career was like eighteen months ago,
and so you can't count on it for sure. I
think he's gonna be really good and this lineup is
gonna work really well, but we don't know that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I with you on everything you said.
Speaker 1: He's also just kind of their only three and D
wing at this point. It's who else would Harrison Barnes
comes the closest to qualifying less you think it's Calton Johnson,
and even that is, it's not Devin, and Devin Vesselle
is not even really big enough to be considered a wing,
And so there's a lot on Julian Champagni's shoulders because
it's no, this is just kind of it. Whether he's
starting or coming off the bench, this is someone who
I look at him in a playoff context and it's
or even if the Spurs just want to get the
number one seed, this is absolutely something that needs to
be on the floor every single close game down the
stretch because that's I know you have Wemby, but just
for someone who won't compromise your offense at least if
he's gonna be making shots but also has the size
to hold up positionally at like that spot.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's essential.
Speaker 1: And the fact that they found him and the deal
is everyone knows the con just stupid under two percent.
Speaker 2: Of the salary cap or whatever. It's dumb up.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I think that's a that's a really good pick.
I did want to talk about this isn't gonna qualify
as my first pick, but I want to talk a
little bit about Steph Castle qualifies as an X factor
here too.
Speaker 3: Yeah No, let's just as an aside, like anytime we
have a like a secondary X factor issue with a team,
we should just jump to that. I so you're gonna say, what,
like just the shooting right, like, can you it's good
enough to stay on the floor because you need the
defense out there.
Speaker 1: Well right, and it's well, how much do you actually
because the offense is a lot worse with Steph statistically
with Steph Castle on the floor this season and that's
not a surprise. Now he is shooting forty five percent
from mid range, So like that's a weapon that not
even Amen Thompson has right now when you're looking at
his efficiency. At the same time, defenses already don't really
pretend to care about leaving him open. He's shooting thirty
two point eight percent on unguarded threes. That's a bottom
eleven mark among one hundred and thirty eight players who
have taken at least one hundred unguarded threes. And so
while you do have that mid range shot that it's
gone in at a reasonable clip this year, do you?
And he also just has like him getting downhill, the
on ball, physicality, in the coordination, even his off ball
relocation has gotten a lot better.
Speaker 2: To me this season.
Speaker 1: My I don't know if it's an issue, but my
inquiry will be.
Speaker 2: What does this look like?
Speaker 1: It's the playoffs for him, We've seen what he can
do in the regular season, and what happens if teams
are gonna put what the Spurs have done with Wemby
where where he's on a shooting liability and he can roam.
What happens when you do that to Steph Castle? What
happens when defenses go further under his screens? And then
at that point, if he can't create, if he can't
hit that mid range jumper. I'm not saying you take
him out of the game, but then it's well, now
he's really relying on off ball movement because you have
to put the ball back in Darren Fox's hands. And
that's been another kind of workaround for the Spurs, is
that darn Fox. I know people were saying he was
a fake All Star, but like the work he's done
off the ball, like being able to see possessions and
control a lot to Steph Castle, I think has made
things a lot easier on the Spurs navigating what is
still a real challenge. And so the fact that Steph
Castle he could get to the foul line, but he's
not gonna be the most efficient shooter while he's there either.
This is a positively impactful player. I just want to
know if that scales the same to the playoffs, at
least it at least right now, because you could say
two three years down the line, Steph Castle is gonna
be better.
Speaker 2: Maybe he is a better shooter.
Speaker 1: They just figure out more ways to use him, and
he is impacting the game at a high level in
the playoffs. But for this first sort of go round,
his debut in the postseason, I'm gonna be fascinated to
see how he actually faries.
Speaker 3: It's a it's a class of playoff question that's like
oft discussed and has been for a long time. It's
like spoiler, that exact issue is gonna come up in
some other X factors we will discuss shortly, like the
the guard or wing that defenses don't care about like
that that that is a you can get away with
it in the regular season. It's a playoff problem. I
think a couple things for me. One is the the
trade off is still Again the playoffs might prove this
to be no longer the case, but at least for now,
I think the trade off is just such a net
positive because the way that just again the Pistons game is,
you know, maybe the most consequential game of the last
few weeks, and so it's it's top of mind for me.
The way that he changes the tenor of the game
is like palpable because of how aggressive he is on
both ends of the floor, the like the defensive intensity
to just like put the shoulder down and get the
and one finish over a bigger player, like off a
two foot plant at the back. Like that kind of stuff.
Speaker 2: Is like that.
Speaker 3: There were a couple of plays like that really did
make a difference in like the next ten possessions of
the game because the Spurs were so energized by So
like that kind of stuff maybe matters less than the
playoffs when everyone's playing their ass off and like you
know what I mean, Like it's kind of like the
what we used to say about the Knicks and TIBs
is like they're throwing their fastball all the time. So
like in the playoffs, they're not different, but everybody else is.
Maybe that matters. The other thing that's different, though, is
like one of the obvious solves for a player like
Castle is like we'll just put our center on him
and then he can roam and protect the basket. Like
you can't do that because you have to have a
center on webbin Yama. So if you have to put
a guard or a forward on Castle that it creates
a maybe a more solvable set of problems for the
Spurs offense, because if you can put a center on
them and the center gets to play free, safety like
that's that's an issue, it's just less of one if
you can't get away with that. And I don't think
that you can without paying a heavy price not have
a center on wem Beanyama. Maybe you played two bigs.
I don't know, but like you know what I mean,
it's a little different because of Wemby. You can't get
away with somebody that's not tall on wem Binyama. It's
like just a non starter to me.
Speaker 1: I'm just wondering if teams, like if it's Houston, if
it's okay, see, maybe could Minnesota do that if you're
okay with Julius Randall handing some handling some Wemby responsibilities
because you get away with doing that with Rudy Gobert.
Speaker 3: Maybe I don't know, I would be I would be
reluctant to try. I'd be like, as we get to
some other guys that have a similar problem. I just
feel more comfortable. Just Wemby's presence just kind of changes
the calculus, I guess, big, big revelation.
Speaker 1: It feels lower stakes than some of the other players
that have the same issues because you have Wemby, but
also some of these other outlets also kind of reinforces
the importance of Champagnie, just that extra spacing to have,
Like if Steph Kat you need him to get downhill,
that that's gonna be huge trim as well. My pick,
so my first official pick, I'm gonna go with Scoot
Henderson of the Portland Trailblazers.
Speaker 2: We don't know if they're gonna be a playoff team.
Speaker 1: They're definitely gonna be a play in team, but it
doesn't seem like the timeline on Shadon Sharp coming back
is hazy and he might just be out the rest
of the regular season. Dennyavia banged up and now he's
missing time. Scoot has missed most of the season. Would
you care to guess how many minutes we've seen with
Scoot on the floor alongside Denny Avdya and Donovan Klingon.
Speaker 3: Oh, I mean, it's how many minutes? It's not triple digits.
I would I would feel confident saying that.
Speaker 1: It is thirteen okay, and do don Van Clinton even
missed their game against the Bulls the other night.
Speaker 2: This is just there's so much at stake here. One.
Speaker 1: If we look at just the scope of this season,
the Blazers need more offensive dynamism, and scoot in theory
can provide that. I don't know if we're ever gonna
feel okay with him as a pull up jump shooter
or just a shooter, but I'm comfortable enough to where
it's if you've looked with some of the minutes he's
played with Drew Holliday, You've seen the way that he's
been able to lift up out of the corner without
the ball, or if he's just gonna come around, snake
a ball screen and take a pull up two or
take a pull up three. I think that shot. I
don't know if I'll ever be elited it, but we're
not asking him to take like these wild lamellow ball off.
Speaker 2: The dribble jumpers.
Speaker 1: I think he needs that ball screen, and I think
that that'll be a reasonable play for him. I'm really
gonna be monitoring his finishing around the basket for two reasons.
Portland spacing isn't exactly pristine. But I do love the.
Speaker 2: Idea of Donovan.
Speaker 1: If Donovan Clinking is your big or it's Robert Williams
the third, how what's like the best shooting lineup we
could surround him with, and let's give Scoot space to
operate there? He is shooting sample size is so small,
sixty nine point two percent in the half court at
the rim, and he's had some pretty He's had like
a couple of really nifty finishes, like some reverses, some
just like over the trees. If the finishing part of
his game can be there, if he's someone who can
also generate more free throws, I really do think this
changes a lot for the Blazers in general, just as
the theory of a team. But I don't know how
much meaning this will get me into my bigger picture
question that you're willing to assign to it if we're
only gonna get basically, we'll call it the post All
Star stretch. Even though he returned before then he's extension eligible,
So what are you going to pay? How important is
he to your team right now? And then how much
harder does it get to figure out his importance when
Shane Sharp might not play again this year. And so
it's just like we have not seen Denny Avdya, Scoot Henderson,
Shade and Sharp Dot like these guys have not played
a ton of time together and we haven't seen like
throwing Drew Holliday into the fold. I like some of
the minutes from what I've seen when Scoot Henderson's on
the floor with Drew Holliday, and so I'm not worried about, Oh,
can Scoop play with other guys who need the ball.
I think him and Denny Avidya could have a symbiotic
relationship on the court, But I don't know what Scoot
is at this point. And injuries are part of that.
The way that the Blazers have been run, they've been
caught in these sort of weird spaces the past two
plus seasons has contributed to that as well. But we're
coming up on he's extension eligible or he's going to
be a restricted free agent, and the Blazers are also
this team that's decided we're done rebuilding, basically like it
they it wasn't just the Daniavia trade. Then you go
and get jew Halla and look, all this stuff has
worked out quite well for them, Drew Holliday, Denia Avida,
the whole nine.
Speaker 2: But this doesn't seem like a team that's.
Speaker 1: Prepared to take a step back to try and take
a step forward. So they're either going to make trades
look or be aggressive somewhere or hope that someone internally
pops can that be scooted for the rest of this season?
And again, even if it is, what does that mean
for how can you say, well, yeah, like let's extend,
like this is gonna work. And I don't know that
you can because the sample size one in general is
going to be large enough, but the sample size of
your most important players together is certainly not going to
be large enough if it even exists.
Speaker 3: I think I think the most interesting aspect of this
is the extension question, which sort of speaks to how,
like the scoot thing is not his X factor status
to me, is not really about this season or whatever
passes for the Blazer's postseason. It's more of like, what's
this team supposed to be and like soon because Avidia
is an All NBA caliber player now and you've got
like expensive veterans that are on this roster. I think
the short answer is, like, there will be no extension,
cause I think Portland can just say we don't have
anything close to enough information to like make a real offer,
so it'll be a low ball and then scoot. I
think will rightly be like I will just happily test
restricted free agency next next, next summer, hopefully after I've
finally stayed healthy and like found what it is I'm
supposed to really do here. I do think like his
his three point a ten frequency, his free throw ten frequency,
those are all career highs. The finishing at in like
at close range was like shockingly bad for how explosive
he looked as a prospect. Certainly as a rookie, is
like fifty percent inside three feet, which is like, okay,
he's a guard, but like that's untenable. And then like
fifty nine last year, and he's up over seventy percent
this year inside, so like there are some real signs.
I think. Then you say, well, it's been like eight
games as we're recording this, so what does what does
any of that mean? I think maybe the core question
that would inform like an extension amount, for example, won't
be answered this year, but it's like what do we
what what's his value if he is a secondary creator
in an offense run by Avdia? Like what like what
is that? Like does that even make sense based on
his skill set? And is he willing to accept that?
Because if if he is, then like I'm kind of
on board like with him as a maybe a running
off screens on the weak side attacking against a shifting defense,
not like an every down quarterback. We're spamming pick and
rolls type of thing. I could get behind that. I
don't know if he could. I don't know if I
don't know what Portland thinks about that ultimately, Like maybe
you could make the case on the flip side that
like Ovidia has been incredible, like blown away everyone's expectations
as a generator of offense, But like is that really
the path forward on a team that's much better than
we are? Like is that do we? Is it Scoot
that we need to see as the primary guy and
Avdia is the one that is like a massive luxury
one b Like I don't know. My inclination is that
it's it's this is gonna be Avdia's offense and Scoot
needs to fit into it. But like the draft pedigree
does not align with that, and the expectations of what
Scoot was gonna be don't align with that. So great
X factor pick much through a longer lens, though, I think.
Speaker 1: And even if he's good, what do you do with
you have Damian Lillard, Shadon Sharp, Drew Holliday and Scoot
who's coming off the bench. And then also you could
have say, forget to like forget the starting five stuff,
which Scoot did start against the Bulls the other night.
Speaker 2: Who's closing games because Scoo.
Speaker 1: I My whole thing with the Blazers is you're locked
into a play in spot. I feel like Scoot should
be getting these crunch time reps. And then Chicago it
did go into crunch time because Cardiac hashtag Cardiac Bulls,
but they went centerless and like Cidy Sisoko and Tamani
Kamara and Drew Holliday and Chris Murray and I think
was Jeremy Grant were on the floor, and it's feels
like that would have been a good opportunity to get
scooted like some more running like the closer minutes. And
I don't know, I'm sure he's on his minutes restriction
for now, but that seems like a situation where maybe
you want to save some of those minutes for But
that's the other thing you need to see is and
now with Avvia injured and Sharp injured as well, get
like more of the as much of the league guards
you want to see. Yeah, definitely play him next to
Drew Holliday at tons you get a sense better sense
of how he's gonna play off some of the other
guys on this team. What's the chemistry with Donovan Klingon
look like, because he's kind of a you know, if
Donovan Klington wants to pick and pop like that might
be more intuitiff scoop like the way Donovan Clington plays.
I don't know that he's like the best big like
Robert Williams. The third feels like a better big man
compliment for what Scoot Henderson is supposed to be. But
to that point, you mentioned Scoot's explosion. He's not moving
the same way as he was coming out of the draft,
and yet no, this is the best his finishing at
the basket has ever been, So maybe there is something
to that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know. He it's wild that like we're
gonna get to his fourth year as an NBA player
and be have less of an idea about what kind
of career he's gonna have. At least I will. Maybe
some people have made their minds up. I haven't yet,
but like, I feel like I would have been more
declarative about what I thought he was gonna be before
he played an NBA game. I definitely was.
Speaker 2: I think you said you were hiring him than Ja Moran.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I just thought like, this is a cannot miss,
can't miss, and that was obviously I think that was wrong.
But still I'm not even sure.
Speaker 1: Well, let's say, Okay, he's willing to sign for for
one hundred.
Speaker 2: I.
Speaker 3: Don't think you can get you can offer him more
than sharp just based on what you've seen so far.
If you're the Blazers, like, how do you justify that?
I like? And if you're Scoot, this is the dreams.
If you're if you're Scoot, you're like, I don't know.
So I don't know what the number is where everybody.
Speaker 2: I don't know. With some of the injuries he's already
dealt with, I might just take we'll see.
Speaker 3: I don't know. It's that it's this is just it
has to go to restricted free agency. I just I
just think it has.
Speaker 2: To who's your next pick.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna go Aaron Gordon on the Denver Nuggets. This
is like probably kind of goes against a couple of
X factor like rules in that he's an established veteran
and he's probably too good to really be a true
X factor. But his importance to Denver can't be overstated.
I would go so far as to say they absolutely
cannot win a championship, probably cannot make the finals if
he's not healthy and really good throughout their playoff run.
So his ability to like tip the scales is immense.
Of like the non superstar class of players, much has
been made of nikolea. Jokic's, Like it feels like his
actual defensive play is now matching up to the reputation
he got early in his career of like, you can't
build a championship defense around this player, Like they won
that title in twenty three with like a seventeen th
rank defense, and they're twenty first or twenty third this year.
And this is also the first year that opponents have
attempted a higher share of shots at the rim when
he's on the floor. Then off they're hitting him at
like sixty five percent when he's the So it's like
there's some real signs that the defense is not gonna
be good enough. If you could tell me Aaron Gordon's
gonna be healthy for the whole postseason, I'd be like,
I don't care. It's gonna be fine, because I think
he matters that much to what they do defensively. The
reason he's an X factor is he's had multiple hamstring
injuries this year. He played fifty games last year and
got hurt in the playoffs, and maybe is just that
a phase where it's like you have to assume he
won't be healthy. I don't want to get to that
point yet because that's such a doom and gloom thing,
but like it has to be like a real consideration.
So he to me is like outside of the superstar
class of players, is like the make or break guy
for Denver. I don't really care about the rest of
the regular season. Their seeding matters, but it's not you know,
that's not make or break, but as a playoff team,
they're they're cooked if he if he is not on
the floor playing normal minutes like the entire time. So
hard for me to think of somebody that is potentially
gonna matter more.
Speaker 1: I think because of the injuries, this makes like this
is a great pick, and also because of how important
he clearly still is to the defense.
Speaker 2: And this is they I think they always would have
had this problem.
Speaker 1: Bly, who is the guy that's just going to be
there other than Aaron Gordon that can just be physical
in a dude's face, but also keep up with him,
but also be this smart off ball defender who has
the same positional malleability.
Speaker 2: Is like, is Spencer Jones or Bruce Brown? Like?
Speaker 1: Is that the like Peyton Watson's more of a defensive
playmaker and disruptor Christian Brown is. There's like just certain
guys in matchups you don't want him going up against.
They're also just their defensive rating is more than eight
points better when Aaron Gordon is on the floor. Their
half court defense is way better. It He absolutely matters,
and I'm with you if he's not healthy. If he
the other thing too, is just we we saw his
three point shooting kind of keep them in a series
against the eventual champion last year while he was injured
while Michael Porter Junior was injured, so there's that swing
factor from him as well as the offense. Is what
if he just is the greatest postseason three point shooter alive.
Speaker 3: Now, I mean he had fifty earlier this year and
made like ten to eleven threes, but whatever, it was like,
like he can do that, and also he's the most
important defensive player like in the conference. Man, Like I
don't know, it's just like, what, how do you overstate
his importance? It's pretty hard.
Speaker 1: If he's available, I do think their defense would be
good enough to win the championship because this was set
on I think it was a recent DNVR show.
Speaker 2: I can't remember who said.
Speaker 1: It was probably Adamatus because he says a lot of
smart shit, but he believes that the Denver Nuggets defense
is better when they have time to prepare for an opponent,
and you just don't have that same preparation time during
the regular season. So I was just looking and again,
the sample size isn't huge because you don't get this
much rest in season, but the Nuggets have a top
ten defense. They have at least two days of rest, interesting,
and so it's now you're not gonna get a full
two days like in every playoff series, but you know
you're gonna practice probably or just have more. You're going
through the same opponent, and so it's all right, you're
not getting three days of rest in between every game.
But we know that we're playing Minnesota like for the
next seven games, and so that's why I'd be less worried.
It's more to me about is Aaron Gordon available?
Speaker 2: Is he healthy?
Speaker 3: Yep?
Speaker 1: My next pick, all right, I'm gonna go here. I'm
going to Anthony Black of the Orlando Magic.
Speaker 2: We all called sus.
Speaker 1: When Franz Wagner played in that game in Germany, only
never be heard from him again, and now he's just
still out and going to be out indefinitely. Basically, Palo
ben Caro started to play better, and I also still
I know, I'm like forever a Palo ben Caro defender,
but I still think he catches too much shit, like
even the ball stopping thing I was going, I was watching,
I can't remember what was their most recent game about
I saw he's getting off the ball so much when
you look, and I went and looked at his touch
time he's trying to get off the ball quicker okay,
and I also still just feel like the shots that
he takes that a lot of people don't like, they're
also just the symptom of the Orlando Magics offense and personnel.
Speaker 2: But to that point, you have Pallo Bancaro, you have
Desmond Bane. If Franz Voker isn't available, like Anthony Black's
offense has become so so important to this team, and
he has cooled off a bunch since the All Star break. Basically,
still if he's someone that you could trust to hit
corner threes, make some passes out of drives, handle the
ball like he's just handling the ball with a lot
more swagger this year, and then you know what he's
going to be able to bring you Defensively. That matters
so so much to this.
Speaker 1: Team right now, and it's for the rest of this
season because guess what, Franz Voctor is not playing the
Magic as we record this are in playing territory and
so you would prefer just given how banged up they are,
how up and down, and that's putting a kindly their
offense has been.
Speaker 2: You want to avoid that. And so yeah, the playoffs
will matter.
Speaker 1: Let's see if his shooting is able to hold up
when he gets to the playoffs.
Speaker 2: But he's shooting over forty percent on.
Speaker 1: Catch and shoot threes the half court this year, even
with that post All Star slide baked in. If he
can do that in addition to what he's been able
to do with something like some of his finishing at
the rim, getting more unassisted looks in those instances, it's
just it's not something.
Speaker 2: You ever have to heavily feature.
Speaker 1: And I would argue certainly in a playoff setting, but
they need it. They just need that extra outlet. And
it's Jalen Suggs is going to be up and down
as a shooter, and we know about his scattershot availability.
And then after that it's sort of, well, who do
you want it to be? Like, is it Jace Richardson,
Sacha von Carter? So I just don't I'm not even
making fun of Jace Richardson.
Speaker 3: It's no, no, it's not.
Speaker 1: So there's there's a clear vacuum for a we need
a third best do I just say offensive player overall
at this point with Franz Wagner.
Speaker 2: Out and like, I think it needs to be Anthony
Black or the fact that I think it could be
Anthony Black instead of jail and Suggs is a testament
to Anthony Black's growth.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, I would agree with everything you said. I
The only thing I'd add is is it's kind of
similar to the Scoot discussion, like where's the money coming
from for him? Like long term? Is that like in
terms of like what does the Orlando Magic look like
two years from now? Because they're wildly expensive starting yesterday
and they gotta pay this, Like I hm, I was
gonna really hot take it and say, like I feel
more comfortable with the one hundred million dollar deal for
Black than I do for Scoot. I don't know if
I go quite that far. Black is certainly like it's
is it a leap this year? It's like, what's what's
like just like an inch short of a leap? And
maybe it is a full leap, but we need to
we need a text with a firm definition of it.
But the Magic have these massive deals for Franz and
for Bankero and like Sugs. I think Suggs deal is fine,
but it's not cheap. And then Bain's deal is enormous,
Like how are you paying Anthony Black? Who's going or
or whose offer are you not matching? If he gets
the restricted free agency in a year plus, I think
if he has so, since he's an X factor here,
if he if he really does like replace a lot
of what Wagner would have given them, and if he
also is able to give you some of like some
like all step in for the Sugs role a little
bit as like more of a playmaker, Like you might
need to just figure out how to make room for
him on your books. I don't know how what that
looks like, but you can't just use him right.
Speaker 1: I do wonder if and by the way, the other
note I had here wanted to uh make is he
shooting twelve to thirty one on step back threes. That's
like thirty nine percent. So that's if you can hit
those shots in the playoff, it's a big deal.
Speaker 2: I don't even view it.
Speaker 1: I think if it comes down to them choosing, it
feels as if they'll be deciding between Jalen Suggs or
Anthony Black. If it comes down to it, they have
a year before it's a problem. Even if they extend
Anthony Black. I do wonder if they'll be more inclined
to wait because one of the financial situation that they're in.
But two, they don't want to be sort of Dyson
Daniels here with the Hawks, to where Dyson Daniels is
still a fantastic defensive player, but it just offensively contract
contract now, it doesn't look like a good contract right now.
It's so I wonder if they'll wait for that reason.
But also I think you could look at it and say, well,
if he's playing like this offensively this year with the personnel,
if they still had around him, he's been more available
than Jalen Suggs. Two, I don't know who I would
pick long time. I'm probably picking Jaieen Suggs. I love
Jalen Sung, just that's the dude. If he's available that
I just Okay, he's gonna shoot thirty one percent from three,
I will still play him thirty I mean, you can't
play him thirty minutes a game.
Speaker 2: That's the problem. But you get what I'm saying there. Yeah,
it's not gonna have to be a decision this summer.
But you're right.
Speaker 1: I didn't even think about the extension stuff. I was
more so looking at this magic team.
Speaker 2: Is the NBA's biggest disappointment I'm sure who's the bigger
disappointment than the Magic, just relative to what expectations we think.
Speaker 3: I mean, you might throw the Hawks in there, because
I remember I at least viewed those two teams preseason
as like similar ceilings. But the Hawks like just kind of,
you know, changed themselves pretty fundamentally. And there's like actually
a lot to be encouraged about with Atlanta anyway.
Speaker 2: But yeah, I could have just trade four first round picks,
is the other thing.
Speaker 3: And I would say Orlando's pretty comfortably the most disappointing
team this year.
Speaker 1: And so it's like to me, I don't know, I
don't even know what they're I guess it's the East.
Speaker 2: So it feels short of Detroit.
Speaker 1: I like, it feels like anything could happen, and Orlando
might be one of the teams that's better built to
face Detroit. Although we just went through them on a
podcast with mister Taporrek and the Magic did not make
our top six.
Speaker 2: Picks or something.
Speaker 1: I can't remember what happened there, but we go check
that podcast out. Anthony black Is this has been a
big season for him, but he's way more important to
the Magic than I think they ever intended him to
be on the offensive end.
Speaker 3: Yeah, all right, it is my turn. This this is
the value is too good here on this pick. This
late the value just this is a high value pick.
So in the notes you asked if this is too
if this fruit is hanging too low, and I said, no,
it is properly hanging. And this is Jason Tatum's achilles
specific he so the name is it's too big of
a name, So that strike one. And then also it's
an injury question, so that strike too. But like the
Celtics might be the number one seed, like it's possible
they could be the top seed in the conference. Still,
there's a lot of season left, and so just because
they are in a spot that I and I think
most people, but really I did not imagine was remotely possible.
Like I thought that was a gap. Just like they
them in the Pacers, They're just gonna just pack it in.
Speaker 1: I don't want to look at how many I know
I hit there under I don't even want to know
how many wins. I can't remember how many wins I
project them from. When we have to do our Mulligan's pot,
I'm gonna look like a fool.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, it's I'm with you. So because of that
and because of his capacity to come back, like nobody's
saying it's happening yet you know, there's no what did
he say, there's nothing set in stone or it's it's
a lot.
Speaker 2: Like it's funny. I said this to Brian Toporak.
Speaker 1: It's funny that before he started, like we see these
videos where he's like officially scrimmaging or practicing with the team,
the whole chatter was, Oh, he's definitely coming back, but
now that there's like breadcrumbs being laid, it's no, well,
we don't know if he's coming back, right.
Speaker 2: It just seems so it seems reversed.
Speaker 3: That's its own X factor. It's just like, I mean,
that's the ultimate X factor. He might play and he
also might not at all. So that's a pretty big swing.
And then within that is obviously like what does he
look like? What he's not like a he's not necessarily
it wouldn't be the same thing as integrating like prime
James Harden or like Luca or just some like ridiculously
high usage like he defines your offense type of player.
I think one of the things that makes Tatum so
great is that if he's just defending and shooting off
the ball and like making good passes, he's still a
hyper valuable player. But like Jalen Brown has become a
high usage, like fringe MVP candidate that shoots a lot
of tough jumpers and somehow the offense.
Speaker 1: Did you know that the that the Celtics are statistically
better without Jalen Brown on the floor.
Speaker 2: Yeah, have you heard that?
Speaker 3: You heard that too, heard that too. I still think
Jalen Brown has had a pretty good year. Is that
a hot take?
Speaker 2: I think he's That's the thing I've ever heard of
my entire life is someone who only looks at numbers.
Speaker 3: But you just have to talk about, like what does
the reintegration of Jason Tatum look like? How much does
he play? Who does he play with? Like do you
want to just have him play with not Jalen Brown
so that you don't like disrupt this thing that's working,
And then then you really win the non Jalen Brown
minutes because they're so good already. You just you're a
plus twenty five instead of a plus twelve or whatever
it is. Yeah, there's not a lot to say. It's
just like, will the guy that was a top five
player in the league come back at all? What will
he do? And what does that do to a team
that is, like plausibly the number one seed in its conference.
I have no idea about any of those. So he's
a pretty good X factor.
Speaker 2: He's a great one.
Speaker 1: And also what's interesting about him is if you put
some stars coming back just all of a sudden, whether
let's say it's Mark Well, it's gonna be March, because
it's basically March now, middle of March, come back after
not playing the whole season, there will be a.
Speaker 2: Disruption to the way they'll play.
Speaker 1: But Jason Tatum has always had this scalability about him. Yeah,
but it feels like rooted in how he started his
career where the Celtics were sort of good and so
it wasn't he didn't have the ball in his hands
all the time. What if you just asked him to
Anthony Simon's for the rest of this season, it's you
don't need to worry about passing or really jump starting
the officer. Just take and make shots, and then it's
sure you're not gonna be the primary Like that's still
maybe Jalen Brown's role, and I'm assuming is there a
long term question behind that? Is Jalen Brown gonna want
his own team? I don't people have been wondering that forever.
I just don't see it cropping up randomly. But for
the rest of this season, it feels like Jason Tatum
might not want to be the marquee Biller on the
offensive end anyway. But it's huge because this team is
already a top two or three team in the Eastern
Conference and is going to get back someone who is
at full strength a top five worst top seven NBA player.
Speaker 3: Have we talked about at all, like just do you
think he should do you think he should come back?
Like what have you have? You have we I don't
know if we've had that conversation yet, because there's there's
the Paul George example of like let's get let's dip
a toe in, you know, for next so we're good
for next year. It's not like a hard start next
year versus the risk reward of it, Like where do
you land on? Just if you're the Celtics and he
could play and there's like the doctors have said there's
no increased risk of injury. Uh, he's able to you know,
how we feel about his health?
Speaker 1: Are or Boston's doctors are.
Speaker 3: They the appointed ones? Yeah, so you've got a you
have a panel of unbiased observers and they're all medical professionals,
and they say risk of injury today is the same
as it'll be in mid October when next season starts.
He can play, and you're the Celtics. What what do
you do?
Speaker 1: I guess is the only downside you're worried about him
getting injured again, because that's going to be a that's
going to tell me.
Speaker 2: I don't have an MD, so everything.
Speaker 1: If what you're saying is what the messaging will be
or the prognosis is, why not just come back because
you're not the expert. Yes, you're a lot better than expected.
Who is the Let's say they win the East, who's
the Western Conference team they're going to be favored to be?
Speaker 3: Well, that's there. I mean, nobody that they might potentially see.
Speaker 1: They're kind of operating with found money anyway, So it's
more important to me to look at the bigger picture.
Speaker 2: What you did anywhere at the trade deadline.
Speaker 1: You moved a helpful player in Anthony Simon's in service
of ducking the luxury tax.
Speaker 2: So bring Jason Tatum back now. Don't bring him back.
Speaker 1: Recklessly and ask him to play thirty seven minutes a
game and every single game.
Speaker 2: But I don't see if he's not at any more
of a risk of re injuring it.
Speaker 1: I'd rather him because one, there's also the there has
to be a psychological component to this too, of just
I haven't played in an NBA game in forever. Get
that out of the way now, so that's not looming
over the start of next season.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I love the idea of just come back and
play a little bit so that opening night next year
isn't isn't a thing. It's you know, because other because
if he doesn't, if he does, if he says he's not,
if he even if he's cleared and he says like
I don't feel I'm not feeling it like I I'd
rather wait than okay, fine, you do exactly what he
would prefer to do. That's okay. I would give him
that kind of agency, and he deserves it. It's it's
his career. But just like as a pressure release for
starting next season when presumably like you're going to be
trying to win a championship from day one, the start
of twenty six, twenty seven, taking the pressure of opening
night and the beginning of that, like people won't be
talking about they'll talk about it some, but if you
don't play this year, then like you got how many
more months to just just oh, the anticipation grows and
like the press, just if you can reduce all that,
I think that alone is worth getting out there a
little bit this year, just to like just just shut
all the noise off, you know, for October. That's worth
it to me.
Speaker 2: My next pick. I want to stay on brand, so
you know what's coming, mister Reed Shepherd. I Rockets fans.
Speaker 1: Have got to be annoyed watch because they've seen more
of it than I have of seeing Houston's crunch time offense,
because it is a horror show. Their bottom three in
turnover rate, I think they're twentieth or whatever an offensive ratting.
I know the sample size is small, but they've been
in quite a few clutch situations this year, and reach
Shepherd is not a mainstay in these minutes at a
time when you don't have Fred van Fleet available, And
I kind of understand that Ime Udoka might just trust
his guys or believes that he wants players on the
quarter are gonna be more competent defensively. Your offense is
the problem, my guy. You are as a team in
the half court, you are twenty fifth in attempt rate
attempt to rate so volume in the restricted area, and
twenty ninth in three point attempt rate from above the
break puts someone on the floor who addresses at least
one of those things, and read Shepherd is gonna address
the above. The break stuff is just someone who could
create or get shots off outside of the corners, and
he's not gonna really impact I mean, in an ideal
world he would impact your rim rate because there's more
floor spacing, guys can be lined in the basket.
Speaker 2: But that he hasn't had that impact this year.
Speaker 1: There's a bunch of data to just support that this
is a bad decision when you sub him out of
certain If you're pulling Josha Kogi out of one of
their most hues lineups and sub read Shepherd in or
some variations of that, they're not all sort of spiffy like.
One of his best lineups is actually has Dorian Phiney
Smith in it, which is. I don't know how much
more of Dorian Phinise Smith we need to see, but
they're shooting better on above the break threes and more
often when he's in the game, and it's just another
weapon because Al Prince shang Gun can't do that, like
just create from just be that out. Aside from Kevin Durant,
all you have right now is Read Shepherd. That's not
Al Prin shang Gun's game, am, and Thompson needs that
downhill be line to the basket and having someone like
Read Shepherd in the game, he's going to do more
to lift out defenders than a Josha Kogi then Jabari
Smith Junior, even when he's going through one of his
hotter streets like short of Kevin Durant, Read Shepherd, I fully,
relily just has more gravity than anyone else on the team.
And I don't understand he's played, don't gay They sound
like they have him buried on the bench. But you
just go through their offensive vitals, look at what they're
like has happened to a lot of their crunch time offense.
You saw it the Knicks game where they blew that
eighteen point lead. I don't want to sit here like
Read Shepherd could have been the panacea there. I don't know,
there's gonna still be growing. He's a sophomore and he
has problems. I do think he's been way better defensively
this year than he was last year. But what are
we doing here? And this is I feel bad about
this too. I can't remember whether I saw this, read this,
heard this, or someone even texted it to me, But
there's this thought though maybe that wasn't a DM.
Speaker 2: I don't even remember at this point, but.
Speaker 1: There was a thought that the resent Houston didn't do
anything at the trade deadline was because they didn't want
to give emy Udoka more of a reason to not
play Reed Shepherd like like more than he like not
enough as he was now. And if that's what you're
actually worried about, I know there's always that tug of
war between the front office and the coaching staff. We
saw it in Denver last year. Liked shouldn't have his job.
Speaker 2: Then I'm sorry. It's it's not because I won't play
Read Shepherd. But if you're worried that he.
Speaker 1: Won't give this top three pick, who in theory conceptually
addresses a lot of what you need won't get him
on the floor when it matters most or is more
has him on this short leash. I understand the stakes
are higher because you traded for age thirty seven Kevin Durant,
but you're third in the Western Conference, and like, are
you really in danger your five losses ahead of the Suns?
So are you in danger of really falling into the
playing territory? I just I don't actually think even Udoka
deserves to be fired. But if that's the reason you're
afraid to make an upgrade, is because you're worried a
player who's minutes you need for both net, I would
argue you need him now, but yeah, this is a
this is a high stakes game for later. Like that's
just such a dumb concern. I understand from a coaching
that he's trying to win games, but you've lost a
lot of games in grunch time because of your offense,
and Kevin Durant is just he shouldn't be shouldering that,
Like just look at the way defenses are going after
him in some of those minutes.
Speaker 2: So I'm just I hope.
Speaker 1: Hope that Recheppherd actually if Reachepper's not nex factor, I
actually think it's it's not gonna be because of free Shepherd,
but the Rockets utilization of him.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think now. I also can't remember if I
where I read or heard this, but but someone raised
the point of like with Udoka, he definitely wants to win,
but in a certain way, Like you can look back
at some of the Boston teams that great defensively and
then what was the knock on them, Like, well, their
offense kind of got vanilla and bogged down and was
solvable late in games. That was a real thing. That's
the thing now, it seems like because to me, I
think if you put Shepherd on the floor consistently in
crunch time lineups or lineups where you just need to score,
like he kind of needs to be a pretty featured part.
I think you need to build the thread of him
running around off the ball or getting screened for and
shooting a lot to meaningfully change how defenses play you
and I to me, I don't think Udoka is comfortable
with this player type, which is to say, like not
a physical, defensive, rebounding like you know, good positional size
player in a prominent role. I guess maybe van Fleet
was an exception but like that's a veteran, and that's
a guy like known for his toughness and all that
other stuff. Like I think Shepard just is in the
unfortunate position of this is a coach that is not
comfortable featuring him, and I think it can I think
I would go step farther and say, like, I don't
think he just needs to play to address what the
Rockets have been doing poorly, which is scoring when you
know the chips are down. He needs to play and
like like get stuff drawn up for him a lot,
Like I think he needs to be like a real
meaningful piece of the whole operation. But in general, yeah,
I totally agree with you since we're here, I'm and
Thompson to me is is a pretty like intriguing figure
because he's representative of like the flip side of the
Shepherd question, which is Thompson does a million things that
I think Udoka likes and a million things that fit
with the Rockets identity, which is athletic physical, like you know,
can can guard whatever, like crashes the boards, like all
the all that stuff. Maybe the worst jump shooting wing
reguard in the league certainly the one I think I mean,
maybe there's like a two or three way tie with
his brother, And I'm trying to think who else. Even
Castle gets treated a little differently because he's so dynamic attacking.
I just don't like, what's the example of a Thompson
type player that has like that A team has gotten
away with using it across like multiple playoff series and
not getting like exploited or schemed against or whatever, like
you go wait, like Tony Allen or like Andre Roberson
like years ago, is like they did a lot. I mean,
Thompson's different because he has off value as like a
ball handler and attacker, a transition threat, just being athletic, whatever.
But like I think if the if the Rockets are
real contenders, which I actually don't think they are, I
don't know how that works with him on the floor
at the end of games, or just in general against
playoff defenses that are just gonna like you just go
under every screen, you don't have to guard him, you
like it, Just I don't know what you do with that,
and and I don't. To me, he hasn't developed enough
other stuff. Even even in a season where like all
of his counting stats are better, he hasn't developed enough
other stuff to offset just the very basic this guy
can't shoot and we don't like so he doesn't have
to be guarded. Honestly, like, I don't know what you
do with that as the rockets.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and look, just to back up your point, two
hundred and sixty nine players have attempted at least fifty
unguarded threes. Dyson Daniels is the only player shooting the
lower clip.
Speaker 3: I forgot about him. That was that was the other one. Yeah,
more airballs than makes Is that stat still accurate? Do
you see that?
Speaker 2: The other thing? I did not see that, but I
honestly wouldn't shock me.
Speaker 3: Just no, it's more air but it was like twelve
to eleven airballs versus mad threes or something like that.
Speaker 1: And with Thompson, the other problem is too is like,
so just to use Steph Castle as the analog, I
know they're two different players, but Thompson doesn't even have
the track record from mid range. He's I think he's
had like forty seven percent on his floaters or whatever,
but he's sub forty percent from mid range in general.
This year, he's not shooting as well from the free
throw line as a as a Steph Castle, So what
like he I neither of these players are being taken
off the floor of the playoff series. But I almost
feel like Thompson has when you look at the the
way that the Rockets are built versus the way that
the Spurs are built. If playoff defenses solve one of them,
it's a way bigger problem for Houston than it is
going to be for San Antonio.
Speaker 3: And this and the solving is just easier because we
haven't mentioned him. But shing Goon's inability to space is
another factor and you cannot take him off. I mean
they have for stretches like his spacing issues and his
need to be on the ball to have value, paired
with Thompson's is really the reason we're talking about Shepherd
as a fix, like because you just the problem is
so pronounced, whereas with the Spurs it's very, very different
because of the surrounding person Like if the Rockets had
a Champagne or of a cell or what or even
a castle instead of of Thompson. I think I don't
think the problem is as pronounced, right, No?
Speaker 2: I probably not? Probably not? And you know what else
isn't as pronounced?
Speaker 1: The offensive problems if you play Read Shepherd more in
crunch time because you want to know why he only
turns the ball over in crunch time on three point
four percent of his possessions, which is just he doesn't
have a ton of crunch time possessions.
Speaker 2: But I don't.
Speaker 1: I it's still I'm just bothered by you, maybe because
you are complete ignorance of miss future megastar Read Shepherd.
Speaker 2: Who's your official pick next? Oh?
Speaker 3: Okay, so Thompson doesn't count for me? All right, well
let's let's uh. You stayed on brand, I'll stay on brand.
It's Jalen Williams and it's specifically Jalen Williams' wrist for
the Oklahoma City Thunder. The shot has not I mean
even last year, the three point shot wasn't there. This
year it's down to thirty one percent. His assist rate
is up. The OKAC offense is like, I think it's
like a one thirteen when he's on without Shay, which
is okay, and I think it's actually better than the
one to eleven from last year, but it's still not
like a championship caliber thing, and the samples small so
you can't trust it. Plus the hamstring stuff. Now it's
easy to cite the X factor for the Thunder as
just like collective health because everybody has been hurt or
is hurt right now. But the specific issue, and this
is what I was alluding to when at the outset
I said, like, there's gonna be some familiar X factors
and the non SGA minutes with Jada bleeding the offense
definitely is one counter aj Mia, Like he's a new
wrinkle that wasn't available last year. It's a lot to
ask that Aj Mitchell is like, you're at this at
the win Games, with the stakes that the Thunder are
gonna play, like you're gonna have him as like the
primary initiator if Williams is not capable of doing it.
Speaker 2: I don't. I don't.
Speaker 3: I mean maybe you'll have to, but but that's that's
a big ask for a guy that has basically been
come out of nowhere this year to be this good.
So that because we had to talk Thunder, I don't
know where else to go other than that. Do you
is there something else that you would point to for
okay see as an X factor?
Speaker 1: I yeah, I'm gonna go with I had trouble narrowing
it down, and so he kind of had a feeling
that you were gonna go with Jaylen Williams, but they
could be a team of X actors because of the injuries.
I'm gonna say Case and Wallace, and he kind of
swayed me over the past. It's been coming out of
the All Star Break base. I think his past three
games he's like running more of the offense because he
has to, and he's done well.
Speaker 2: You look like you want to say.
Speaker 3: I was gonna say, how do you feel about that?
Speaker 2: I don't love it.
Speaker 1: But at the same time, like he's been he's had
some higher scoring performances, shooting eight of thirteen on self
created jumpers during this stretch, Like that's a big deal.
And so I'm looking at it from a zoomed out
perspective of if they get relatively healthy. So if you
have aj Mitchell and or Jalen Williams available, what does
this mean if you can put more responsibility in his hands,
specifically with regards to the non shape minutes, but if
he can continue to tick up from three point land,
like that's what the like, this is what we talk
about the thunders, I quote unquote weakness is that it
feels like their offense bogs down if Cason Wallace is
the outlet that we know he can be, but maybe
even a version of the outlet that not even an outlet,
but it's the a quasi initiator at this point.
Speaker 2: Can he be?
Speaker 1: Can you get can you buy more minutes without JDub
and Shay on the court together? Because you have Cason
Wallace and an AJ Mitchell. There's so many different things
they could do if he is the player on offense
when they have at least one of Shay or J
Dub available at the same time. The reason I ended
up selecting him as well. I mean, you can say
the same thing about Isaiah Hartenstein's bigger picture too. He's
another guy who's extension eligible.
Speaker 3: Yep, who are they gonna pay?
Speaker 2: They have AJ Mitchell on the books, he's cheap. Alex
Caruso is not cheap.
Speaker 1: Aaron Wiggins and Isaiah Joe are relatively cheap, and people
keep saying they'll be collateral damage. But do you want
to get off of those contracts when you're gonna continue
to get more expensive.
Speaker 2: I don't know when.
Speaker 1: They traded for Jared McCain who could be another potential
X factor X factor we're worried about their offense bogging
down case and walls just because of the extension eligibility.
I find so fascinating here because if he's gonna play
a more expended offensive role because he has to, and
the individual numbers are there, or even the thunders start
to come out of the SGA list minutes rut, how
much more expensive could he get? Because we already know
he's an All NBA quality defender. If you now throw
in this isn't this doesn't need to be your fifth
option on the offensive end. He could be something more
that's only going to get pricier.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's a The reason I gave you the look
when you were talking about him running more of the
offense is just like I'm I know that there's some
encouraging I mean, he's got like a handful of twenty
point games recently, he had a ten assist game in there.
That the role has changed, I'm still not sold on
him as as like there's this hidden reservoir of talent
that hasn't been able, Like they haven't tapped into it
because they're so good and they just need him to
do a couple things. I think maybe there's some of that,
but I think it's mostly because he is pretty limited still.
But like you could also say, well, the reason he's
limited is because he never gets to explore, Like you know,
if you were on a bad team for this first
three years of his career, who knows what his like
shot creation would look like. Now he just hasn't gotten
a chance. So it's a little like chicken or egg thing.
I think when it comes to him being a limited player,
I'm not sure, but I'm not sold on that. I'm curious.
As you were talking, you made me think, like because
you make a good case if it's like, all right,
Shay is off, but we think Wallace is developing as
a shot creator. Aj Mitchell has has been good at that.
Jaylen Williams can be like passable, too good at that.
Like you know, in a playoff setting, do you think
it's enough if there's like, all right, well, these three
guys are okay and they can share the load, versus
we need someone, a singular someone that can get us
a good shot like reliably, you know what I mean.
It's like if you've got three c plus's is at
the same as a b as having or something like that,
or do you need the guy?
Speaker 2: I think you need the guy.
Speaker 3: It's it's just I just made me think of that
because like it does have some appeal to be like, well,
I mean, we love having shot creators across several positions.
That's that's good. But but I it's hard to get
in a playoff series. It's like somebody's got a fucking
create a shot.
Speaker 1: Like I'm also I'm also just looking at it through
the lens of the They have to have J dub
at some point, right, and he before denelevates his injury
that game or was it the that was that game
against the Suns where he just went absolutely off and
looked like J Dub Yeah, and.
Speaker 2: Like, so that's what sucks.
Speaker 1: So I'm kicking in J Dubb is going to be
fine at some point this season. Maybe that's being a
little over ambitious and if this team has been so
banged up, but even if Cason Willis is just this
dude hits more.
Speaker 2: Threes, can do a little bit more of the ball handling. Yeah,
it's I don't know if it's You're right to frame
it that way.
Speaker 1: I think it just makes the minutes where it's just
if Jay Dubb is injured or if Shake Hills dobbx
Andrew is catching the breather. It just makes those minutes
so much easier because Cason Wass can do things defensively
that like even like aj Mitchell isn't going to do.
Speaker 2: And so you could say, like maybe Alex Caruso could,
but he's.
Speaker 1: Never gonna do the things he can't play as much,
and he's never gonna do the things offensively that maybe
Cason Wallace could do.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's fair.
Speaker 2: I think it's still me because we just piggyback off
over at case.
Speaker 3: And w.
Speaker 2: Here we go Jail and Green. I went back and
forth here. I thought about, oh, I think the Suns
are probably just a team of X factors, is what
it is. Uh Rasher Fleming is playing. Should I have
just picked him?
Speaker 1: But I thought about Ohsa Gadara was the one I
think I came closest to picking.
Speaker 2: He gave consideration to Grayson Allen.
Speaker 1: I do believe to pick anyone other than Jalen Green
would just be overthinking it. Because Devin Bookers of right
now is injured. Dylan Brooks the broken hand when is
he gonna come back? Will he be ready in time
for the play in? And they were so reliant on
Dylan Brooks offensively, not just defensively. And so you look
at Jalen Green, the sample size is so small. It's
not pretty when you look at the shooting percentages and
the fact that he is shooting a higher percentage in
the half court on step back threes or pull up
threes then he is at the rim, definitely problematic. But
I think when you watch him, there's definitely and I
think some of this is a byproduct of the way
that Phoenix's roster is, like who's available right now? He's
on the ball too much like your touch time should
not be over forty percent of his touches come when
he's holding the ball for six seconds or more. Just
for comparison's sake, Devin Booker, who is the engine of
the offense and is so good at getting off the ball,
only thirty percent of his possessions are there.
Speaker 2: And so I that's did he.
Speaker 3: Like dribble out the shot clock at the end of
a game a couple times or something? That's crazy? Sorry,
I did not know that.
Speaker 1: It is small sample too, So it's talking, That's what
I mean. But when you also watch him, though there's
he still settles for the tough shots where he wants
to be more of an escapist than get by guys.
It feels like, but he's had moments where he's getting
by guys. There have been some, or he makes a
tough baseline jumper or oh look at that finish at
the rim. I think the bigger deal for me has
actually been the moment and the shots are not going
in right now. He's shooting a higher percentage on self
created threes than catching shoot threes, which might be the
most Jayalen Green stat of all time.
Speaker 2: Quite frankly, he is.
Speaker 1: Feels like he is looking to soak up the right
space when he doesn't have the ball to where he's
going to be that second pass away. Unless it's Devin
Booker who has the ball, would just throw like a
cross court Shenanigan and it'll work out. Because I think
Devin Booker is one of the most underrated passers in
the game. That all being said, like him, whether it's
lifting out or drifting to above the break, I think
there's going to be something there when they're at full strength.
Speaker 2: Oh, Jaillen Green.
Speaker 1: Could he be more complimentary than we've seen in the past,
And that was one of the big knocks with him
in Houston is wasn't efficient enough as the focal point,
wasn't efficient enough or impactful enough. When he's playing off
the ball, He's defending better again based on what I've
seen in a small sample size in Phoenix than he
was at the end of his.
Speaker 2: Time in Houston.
Speaker 1: At the same time, do you know why he's actually
an X factor because they might him to do the
stuff that we don't want him to doep Like, you
need that tough shot maker, especially if you don't have
Dylan Brooks on the court shooting sixty percent on turnaround jumpers.
He's never gonna be a facilitator. You probably trust Grayson
Allen in that role more so than Jalen Green at
this point. But they their offense, the way this team
plays defensively, it's infectious. They're one of those teams where
if you're gonna they just play, they play with energy.
They're lively, and it's it's every night you're going to
field them. They could lose by like twenty and it's oh,
but you still remember that game. You played against the Suns,
and they just need that pure, unadulterated offensive force, and
they needed that before Dylan Brooks was injured, to be clear,
and I felt like going with Colin Gillespie wasn't in
the spirit of the exercise because of how important he's
been all year and Jalen Green is just this huge
piece they're trying to integrate. So I don't want to
see him on the ball as much as he probably
needs to be on the ball. But there's no getting
when Devin Book healthy. Sure there are ways to circumvent
that a little bit, but I have just belief and
this might be small sample belief. It's a small sample
theater or although it's also it's we're almost in March, so
this is Jalen Green's time. This this is time for
us to feel good about Jaalen Green.
Speaker 3: You should have led with that. We are we are
a right smack where Jalen Green thrives.
Speaker 1: But to be fair, he's not throughted when you look
watch him and like the shots just aren't going in.
But the aesthetics of it, I'm okay with it, except
for the fact that he's getting the rim less than
ever and it honestly feels like a choice grant and
it bugs the shit out of me when you watch him,
just the bailouts or the I want to step back,
or like I said, he wants to be more of
an escapist than someone who just attacks the basket.
Speaker 3: I just think the hamstring stuff has just changed him
this year, like it's it's it's been recurring, it's been
impossible to get over. I look at I kind of
just view this season as like a lost year for
him because he missed so much time with just the
type of injury that does make you bail out and
does make you like.
Speaker 2: He's always had that in him? Is that, you know?
Speaker 3: I mean, that's the thing, You're right, I just I
think I think the most interesting part about it is
like the Pistons, the Suns need him to be like
they need him, even if he's gonna be the worst
version of himself, like the player that we like don't
particularly care for offensively, like kind of the empty calories guy,
Like that would be enough. And if he can't do that,
even then it is truly a last year. All right,
I got do I want? I want?
Speaker 2: Yeah, He's just for context though in the half court.
He is shooting forty five point two percent from mid range,
forty five point five percent in the restricted area. Yeah,
he is shooting on pull up threes forty percent, which
is almost what he's shooting.
Speaker 1: And there's so I was a little bit off there.
That's like, again, the finishing will get better. I just
don't maybe to your point, the hamstring injuries in his
head or it's materially impacted the way he could he looks.
Speaker 2: I will say he doesn't.
Speaker 1: Bad on the ball. It's not anything thermonuclear when you're
looking at his speed. But he can still escape and
get by some guys there, just needs to be more
of a like he needs to be more deliberate about it.
Or maybe this is just always gonna be like ingrained
into him.
Speaker 2: That's just who he is.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's I don't know. I just don't feel like
we got any good information on him this year, and
maybe that'll change over down the stretch. But all again,
when when Jailly Green blows up down the stretch, it's like, okay, cool,
that's just the normal thing, doesn't mean anything. I'm gonna
snipe you because I know you just can't wait to
talk about your new York Knicks, and I'm gonna choose
Mitchell Robinson as an X factor. I remember at the
beginning of the year there was a lot of discussion
about like who should start, who should play with whom,
and all this stuff, and they've just kind of managed
his minutes to where he doesn't start. They're trying to
preserve him, I guess, or they're just not comfortable with
him in certain lineups. So that the fact of like
maybe we're holding out because we know we're gonna need
him is one thing. The other issue is just like
as I'm we were talking off air, like as I'm
looking at like what's the if it goes wrong for
each team, Like what's the reason gonna be? And to me,
it's Kat just can't be part of a functional pick
and roll defense, especially if if Brunson is involved. And
so Mitchell Robinson as a rim protector, as a better defender,
as a as a rebounder is just better. So like,
is that all gonna work out? Or are we gonna
get to the postseason and it turns out like it's
he can't hold up and play enough to really matter,
or it actually doesn't make sense to play him as
much as maybe it seems like he should. I don't
really know where else to go on the Knicks either,
to be honest, unless you'd really like to discuss uh,
let's see. Uh Yeah, I don't know. Robinson is just
such a swing figure for them. It kind of seems
like that's the case every postseason. But it's got to
be him.
Speaker 1: You could make the case that he is their second
best shot creator because of his offensive rebounding.
Speaker 3: I think there's that's a great kid. Yeah, I mean,
that's a very.
Speaker 1: He's an he's also ANX actor too, because there's been
pockets of time or pockets within games where he looks
like the dominant defender again, moving on the perimeter, snuffing
out or deturing shots at the basket. But he's been
just off, and I don't know if it's he has
not been great by his own standards defensively this year.
But you're absolutely right, I think they're gonna need We
haven't seen a ton of the dual big lineup. The
minutes they've played dual big against the Pistons this season
when they were able to, then what did not go well?
It was like nine minutes and they were minus ten
during that stretch. But he is so huge to what
they're trying because I don't think you can't just hope
to have a good enough defense for the postseason because
you have og On andob McHale Bridges and now Jose
Alvarado's print or Deduce McBride on the court.
Speaker 2: I think that he is an insult.
Speaker 1: He could be a potential insulator for Karl Anthony Towns
in certain matchups, or you just need to dominate defensively
in the minute that Cat isn't on the floor. There's
a more intuitive connection with him and Jalen Brunton, for
sure than Karl Anthony Towns two, which is another element
that you probably get talked about. He's definitely an X factor,
and I think they're probably making the right move managing
his minutes being on the maintenance program, not playing him
back to backs. We're just not gonna know though, until
because the whole thing. You can conserve him for the postseason,
But are you all of a sudden gonna play him
more minutes in the post because this is not someone
who's played twenty five plus minutes per game often this year.
Speaker 3: Sorry, you just made me think of a question. I
have to ask you because I don't know your thoughts
on it. So offensive end of the floor is the best.
Is there a case that the Knicks are better, like
you said, because of his offensive rebounding with Robinson in
the game and Cat out at center, so they're just
Cat is still the the better offensive weapon? I think
by virtually.
Speaker 1: Robs Yeah, yeah, it's just it's not even gonna be
close even with if there's numbers. That's a because Cornathie
Towns will do the defensive rebounding. He has been part
of some lineups without John Brunson. The root of and
you wrote about this, the root of most of the
Knick's defensive issues is Karnthy Towns and John Brunson playing together.
Speaker 2: And the other part of that.
Speaker 1: Is you've built a team around them where the people
are mad at McHale Bridges because he doesn't do the
thing that he's never really been supposed to do when
it comes to you don't want him at the point
of attack all the time, and he's been I think
if you didn't, if you just took away include the extension,
but if you just took away the cost it took
to acquire him, I don't think people would view mckal
bridges as just a disappointment I think, or expectations he would.
Speaker 3: Only be beloved if not for those the the cost
and then the second cost, I think right.
Speaker 1: But I think if you were going to have Towns
and Brunson, which they clearly didn't know, maybe they had
an inkling of, But if you knew you were gonna
have Brunson and Towns as the basis of your team,
you need another Ogn Andobi. You don't need to mckel bridges,
or at least you need to be bigger on the
perimeter than having Deuce McBride, Landry Shamitt, Jose Alvarado.
Speaker 2: All really good.
Speaker 1: Lady Chap has been pretty good defensively this year, but
it's just you need someone bigger than that, and mckel
bridges is bigger, but he's not gonna play the physical
brand of defense that you get from an OGN ANDOBI,
and so Mitchell Robmas is the X factor for that
reason because he can erase a lot of the problems
that are going to be in front of you. But
the question becomes how much is he like is it
just on the court with John Brunson thing or are
we gonna see more of the dual big lineups as
it like once we get to the postseason and those
have not been It's it was sort of this miss
like mystery box for the Knicks last year and now
we're just sort of huh, Like he had started some
games earlier in the year, it's just the minutes we've
seen they haven't been spectacular, and so I don't know
what you do and that, like can you just bust
that or can it become more of a staples? It
only a staple against certain teams. Who are those teams?
Those because look the way the Towns has been shooting,
been a little bit better lately, but like he's having
the least efficient season of his career, and so yeah,
he'll still have that gravity. But if he's not making threes,
and then you have Mitchell Robinson on the court, like
the floor is just shrunk because that happens, and you
also about the game it now can you have him
on the court with Mo Diawar or Jeremy so Han.
I will say I will be on this podcast Rantic
and raving if Jeremy Sohn is getting any postseason minutes
over mo Oh.
Speaker 3: I didn't know your opinion on him. I was gonna
ask you, like, where, how's fine?
Speaker 1: He's fine as a flyer, and I get why you
try him out now just to kind of understand what
you have. But there's just no kid, there's no there's
no there there, at least relative to this team that
wants to play Mitchell Robinson and Josh Hart together and
still like have really good spacing. So but yeah, I
think that that's the right pick. The only other player
I think you could go with is Landry Shammitt. And
that's almost an indictment of the Knicks that Landry has
become this important to.
Speaker 3: That he's a classic. That guy's way too important. Guy
that start.
Speaker 1: Everyone wants to see the deuce plus starters. Give me
Landry plus starters.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 3: It's terrifying that this player is too important? Is this important?
I feel like there's at least a half dozen guys
we could we could hit that with them.
Speaker 1: Could that be like, how many of the X factors
that we name no fit under that? Or did we
just rebrand X factor?
Speaker 3: Maybe we just rebranded X factor. Yeah, that's actually not
that innovative.
Speaker 1: Disregard I'm gonna go to this is probably an obvious one.
But Darius Garland for the Clippers, and it's can he
get healthy. He's apparently scrimmaging now, which is a good sign.
But I think why he's also an X factor is
people have just sort of written off the Clippers as well.
Speaker 2: They don't care about this year anymore.
Speaker 1: Look at the trades they just made with Zoobots and
Harden and yeah, sure the defense has been borderline elite
since those trades. And the thing they need the most
on offense if Kawhi Leonard is going to be there
is like someone who can like just another playmaker in
the half court and just someone to get up threes.
They're twenty ninth and three point attempt rate since the
trade deadline, twenty third in accuracy. You're not getting that
from Chris Dunn. You also don't want to see Derek
Jones Junior have to get up runners in crunch time
like he was the other night. These could all those
guys would all be X factors, by the way, you
want to pick Kobe Sanders, Jordan Miller, those would all
be accurate X factors, maybe under different circumstances. But the
unknown of Darius Garland, plus the fact that. I kind
of think that the Clippers could still be pretty fucking
good if Drek, like you maybe acquired a fringe All NBA.
I get James Harden is better having the better season,
but you might have just acquired a fringe All NBA player.
Speaker 2: So how much worse are you really going to be? Again?
Speaker 1: If Kawhi Leonard is able to be on the floor,
don't I don't know what type of noise they could make.
They are not going to get out of play in territory.
They're tenth right now, they're seven losses behind six, but
I mean short of maybe the Thunder and perhaps the Spurs. Like,
what team wants to face Kawhi in a healthy Darius
Garland in the playoffs? Maybe you want to face the
Clippers because you're gonna bet against one or both of
those guys not being healthy. But Darius Garland comes back.
I don't think the Clippers, no, I don't think they'll
be as frisky as if they still had Zubots. I
know hot take that one of their three most important
players was important to them, but like, this team's season
is not just over. If Darius Garland can get it's
not just over. He does everything that we've watched so far,
he kind of fills every hole that they still have.
Speaker 3: He is he the leader now among players where we
like to say the pendulum swung too far, like at
least for him, towards the negative because all the things
he has working against him, like the recent discourse that
just won't go maybe well founded of just like small
guards are dead. Man can't have small guards in the
NBA anymore. It's the most overvalued position. Like, look at
all the if you want to list the worst con
tracks in the league, at a lot of them are
small guards. There's that, there's the injuries, there's the like
you're trading this guy without picks for James Harden, Like
that's how out the graves are on him. The contract's
pretty big. Like is having said all that, like we're
not that far removed from like was it? It probably
wasn't last year, It's probably the year before what was Like, Actually,
Darius Garland is having a better season than Donovan Mitchell,
and Donovan Mitchell's having a great season. Do you remember that,
I know we discussed that it could have been two
years ago.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it might have been last year at
one point and then by the end of it, Donovan
Mitchell separated himself, but we both had I don't believe
he ultimately made it, but we both had him.
Speaker 2: Darius Garland on our all NBA.
Speaker 3: Baut Okay, so yeah, there was and it wasn't like
a two week thing. It was like it was a
decent stretch where Okay, Darius Garland is like at least
it's a conversation right now about who's had the better
year with Donovan Mitchell, who was just like I mean
today is a top ten player probably uh and maybe ended.
Speaker 1: Up that don Mitchell is probably gonna be top five
on the m v P ballot this year, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, on the on the default MVP ballot that we're
gonna have this year. That's super fun. We should discuss that. Yeah, anyway,
to answer my own question, the pendulum has swung a
little too far towards Darius Garland is not good anymore.
I think that's a good pick. However, there are real
questions that's why he's next factor like maybe maybe toe
injuries are the new like torn a cl or just
like a death sentence. Man, you're never gonna be this.
Speaker 1: We all thought it was cash trains. We're gonna be
the next like unraveling of the NBA. But it's really
fucking toes the toe injuries.
Speaker 3: All right, Let's see, we're running out of really obvious
ones here, so I'm gonna go for my next pick
with how suspenseful should we make it? Okay, this will
be a quick one.
Speaker 2: Spencer was actually killing me.
Speaker 3: Let's talk about Chris Asporzingis, who's that well? Uh and
if you post back up, I get it, Yeah, Quinn
post backup. He sometimes doesn't travel with the team on
road trips already because it's like, what's the point he's
not gonna play? Look, if Porzingis can be healthy, I
don't know. Yeah, I can't say like full stop, just
like healthy enough. We've discussed like he is the absolute
ideal center to put next to Draymond Green. And that's
if you think Draymond Green is still someone that you
need to like make decisions around, and for the moment,
he sort of is because he's clearly not gone anywhere.
He also might be thirty million dollars of dead money,
and then what do you do you what do you
pay him in the off season? Like you certainly don't
have enough information based on what he's done this year
with the team, because he's barely played and doesn't looked
good when he did so. I I think if you
say that the Warriors traded for him because they needed
to get Jonathan Kuminga off the team and they're only
required it was no money that goes beyond this season,
like that's a possibility. I think there was more to
it than that. I'm convinced they thought and maybe still think,
we can get this pots thing figured out. We don't
need him to be a superstar. We just need him
to give us. You know, you can rest on back
to backs, give us twenty five minutes of what you
do fifty five times a year, and then enough of
that in the playoffs and you really matter. He could
also just produce precisely zero, and so I guess it
has to be more of a big picture thing, just like,
is he this the key to getting Curry at all
one more run next year if they bring him back,
or was it just like no one ever remembers he
was on the team and he doesn't come back, and
Kaminga's gone, and that's just like we just dust our
hands off.
Speaker 1: I think even let's say twenty minutes a game in
the play in or the playoffs of the Christaps Porzingis
that you saw with Boston, because he was so up
and down this year with Atlanta, why would you want
to ever face the Warriors in that instance that because
of just the stuff that Christops Persingis can do. Yes,
the floor spacing, the room protection, for sure you mentioned
doesn't occupy the same space as Draymond Green. But you
could also lineups where if he's not the passer that
Steve Kurb probably prefers Biggs to be, like, you can
put him like in the mid post. You could put
him like just on the end, not run the offense,
but he could generate turn around hit those turnaround jumpers
or just like shoot over guys. That's the version we
saw of it was in Washington, it was in Boston.
I mean like we saw it a moments in Atlanta. I
don't think Atlanta would have wanted to have traded him
for coming of christophs Persingis was healthy. I don't think
that is that a move that they make.
Speaker 3: Probably not, No, I don't think you know, because kiming
it doesn't doesn't make sense on that team just because
of who's all there and what they If he plays
the Wizards every night, he's going to continue to be great.
Speaker 2: He's gonna get minutes over Zachary Resiche because that makes
a ton of sense.
Speaker 3: Buddy. No, I think the other thing you mentioned the
post up stuff, like the really there was that hot
minute where he was like statistically the best post up
big in the league because he could just turn around
and get fouled every time. But like from the Warriors' perspective, literally,
anybody that has a thing that they can do to
generate a point or an attempt a free throws that's
not Steph Curry is good. Like Jimmy Butler's principal ability,
like as the non Steph offensive leader was go get
fouled if they have another guy, Like if all Persingis
does is get fouled twice in a couple of minutes
he plays without Steph, that's a that's a value add
you know, like in addition to all the spacing and whatever.
But I I don't know, these are impossible things to know.
But like his health future is just like who's got
a cloudier one that doesn't have like a a major injury, right, now,
you know, like he's just you can't possibly know how
much he's gonna play going forward. It's it's unknowable.
Speaker 1: Would you give him non tax payer mid level money
this offseason as of right now if doc him back.
Speaker 2: Fifteen a year basically, Uh.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think I would, And I think I think
that's that's worth the risk. But if you go up
to like twenty five or something, which would be a
discount from what he's making aav right now, I think
that's just you really there is a massive risk that
you are setting that money on fire like that. That's
that's a real thing.
Speaker 1: Maybe you do it as if it's a one year
deal because you want again to sort of roll over
the Kaminga salary slot would be.
Speaker 3: But yeah, that would be different multi year though you can't.
I could never get up into the twenties. I don't think.
Speaker 1: Well, speaking of Johnathan Kaminga, he's my X factor.
Speaker 2: You want to know why, Grant. I don't think it's
a coincidence that John and the Kaminga gets traded to
the Atlanta Hawks, then they announce a Magic City tribute
night replete with lemon pepper wings. I don't care about
what's happening on the court.
Speaker 1: This team is aggressively middling, and whatever he does, I
don't real think it's gonna have impact. And if anything,
I fig you're just gonna have less information on Zachary
Resichet or maybe someone who's more important to your long term.
But that's why Jonathan Minga is an X factor, an
actual more of an X factor.
Speaker 2: For on court purposes.
Speaker 1: For me, Oh, I have so many different directions I
want to go in right now.
Speaker 2: All right, let's go here.
Speaker 1: Charles Lee, head coach of the Charlotte Hornets, the only
head coach we've picked so far. Right, Yeah, the Hornets
are just because I can't identify a singular player that's
responsible for it. The Hornets are sixth in points allowed
per possession since Thanksgiving. That is a huge sample size,
and there's some opponent luck caked in there. But they're also,
and I've now mentioned a bunch of times on this podcast,
your offense is good, so your defense gets set. They're
a great defensive rebounding team. Mike Sheer of Basketball Poetry
the other day made a great point about how they're
just not allowing corner threes either. Another thing that they're
doing is they just have a bunch of guys that
are holding their own one on one not getting torched on screen.
Brandon Miller has led the charge, but you have Seon
James sprinkled in there. I think Kank Nipple's done really
good with his size in a lot of the one
on one situations Musa Diabate. It's not just his ability
to be around the basket handle some of the bigs
when he switched out on to the perimeter. There's just
a lot of moving part. Even Miles Bridges has had
his defensive moments. We all know Josh Green has had
some really good defensive moments as well. This Hornets team,
on paper, I'm sorry, there is no way that for
more than half of the season they should be a
top seven defensive team. No, you look at the personnel,
there's absolutely none.
Speaker 2: And like LaMelo Ball still kind of flitters around out
there a bunch, but even he doesn't seem as like,
like as rigid.
Speaker 1: He's still gonna be targeted, but like he's just gonna
be a little bit more active. So I'm just gonna
give the credit to Charles Lee and if he's able
to keep this up, do the Hornets just get into
the playoffs through the play in at this rate, and
you're looking at everyone's singing their praises right now, which
is just a wild thing to say, because because they're
tenth in the Eastern Conference. But they've been just a really,
really good team since Thanksgiving.
Speaker 2: We're talking great, we're going on was that three months now?
That's insane.
Speaker 1: And so if they're able to get there, if like,
I wouldn't put it past them to get into the
eighth spot at.
Speaker 2: The way the way the Magic have played this year.
Speaker 1: I know they've been better lately, but I don't put
it past them to getting the seventh spot. They're not
getting to six, that would be well, there's some injuries
in Phillies.
Speaker 3: We have the emergency pod. If they I was thinking
we should we need to do an emergency pod when
they get to over five hundred, which is not that
far off.
Speaker 1: Uh So, yeah, like they might finish the season over
five hundred, which is something stupid to say, but when
you're talking about a team that hasn't been to the
playoffs in what seven years or whatever it is, they
haven't won a playoff series in twenty two years.
Speaker 2: Or whateverever it's been, it's a big deal.
Speaker 1: And I think that even last year you kind of
saw flashes of oh, they're gonna be able to punch
above their weight defensively, and now it's just like Carlesley
has kind of entrenched that in Stone and again, they
don't need to be elite. And by the way, they're
even they haven't had like the best schedule, but they
haven't been the word. It's when they go up against
top ten offenses. They're still basically fine during this stretch.
Speaker 2: So the warrants.
Speaker 1: Their offense is scary, but their defense is competent, and
I think a lot of credit has to just go
to that coaching staff, the players. Of course, Brendon Miller's
been If this was a full season's worth of Brandon Miller,
you might have had some Brandon Miller all defense talk.
Speaker 3: M That's interesting, yeah, because the performance has gone on
long enough that you can't dismiss it. And yet as
we're talking about it, I'm still just like, how is
this happening with the person Like with the personnel, like
you got at least one rookie on the floor most
of the time, sometimes more than that. LaMelo like, sometimes
your center is a rookie. Sometimes it's an undersized guy
who's like an energy player. I just like Miles Bridges
doesn't strike me as much of it, Like there's just
like how is it? How is it working? I like
the crediting the coaching staff because the personnel just you
said it punching above its Wait, let's go to the similar,
similarly small market Los Angeles Lakers, and so the player
is Jake la Ravia, but it's really just like the
the spot in the lineup because it could be him.
If you're looking to like how do we how do
we get the best version of the Lakers? It's like
Marcus Smart's gotten some starts, uh fairly for a while.
You've had bru Hachimura in there for a good chunk
of the early part of the season. Laavia seems like
the only guy that is going to give you something
on both ends at that position, and I get you know,
so far that's born out mostly offensively the the share
of time that he has spent this here's one for you.
How many possessions has Laavia played with Lebron Reeves and
Luca this year?
Speaker 2: Ooh, Lebron Reeves and Luca.
Speaker 3: Non garbage.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna say ten.
Speaker 3: Oh well, if you include DeAndre Ayton, it is exactly ten. Overall,
it's only twenty nine. So like essentially none. The offense
stupid good, the defense a little below average. I think
we need to see more. And that's not all on
La Ravia or like lineup shuffling. It's just those three
guys have all, you know, missed times. Yeah, that's that's
part of it. I'm why wouldn't.
Speaker 1: That could I ask you, why wouldn't that be your
default as the Lakers?
Speaker 2: Is it?
Speaker 1: Are you worried just about the shooting? Is that Marcus
Smart is not?
Speaker 2: You know, No, I.
Speaker 3: Think the issue. I think the issue is La Ravia
is like viewed as in the middle, which is to say,
like Hachimurra's three point shooting is just like it's real.
It's that that's you'd like more volume. But like that's
why he plays, is he's gonna make open threes, good size,
like him and La Ravia seem interchangeable, and La Ravia
is a better defender. But like you would says, we
gotta have shooting. I don't know why you'd say that,
because this offense should be fine just as long as
Luke's out there with warm bodies. So it's it's ruey
and it's like, well, we got to have somebody that's
gonna really guard, and Marcus Smart's reputation is that he's
that guy, Like I it's mostly foul drifting and flopping
and stuff. It's like, you know, he's it's not twenty
twenty one when he's like, is that the year he
won it? Or yeah? I think yeah, I think twenty
one or twenty two. Anyway, So you have, like, when
we need these extreme solutions, there's two other players that
get picked in La Ravia is the one that kind
of does both at least like theoretically, not quite as
well as the two guys on the extreme ends of
the offense and defense help scale. So maybe that's why.
But I would say that he probably should be the
choice in that lineup spot, if only because I just
would prefer the balance. I would prefer someone that like
is useful at least to some degree on both ends,
as opposed to like, all right, well, there's sacrifices you
make when Smart is the guy, and there's sacrifices you
make when it's ruy if anything, I'd lean smart of
the two extremes, just because you gotta have somebody that's
gonna muck it up and guard, and so I guess
it's him and that's probably why he's played a fair
amount lately. So yeah, I don't know, but if Laavia
can be, you know, as good as Hachimura as a
shooter for a decent stretch, then he's clearly the guy.
And if he can guard with that impact, then he's
clearly the guy.
Speaker 1: I would say if he's going to be as good
as a shooter as Ruby Hachimora, he should probably be.
Speaker 3: Maybe I should say if his offensive can be that
of Hachimura's, like, because he's just not going to be
like a mid forties three point shooter.
Speaker 1: I think that's if you had to pick a player
on the Lakers, that's because you could say one of
the other centers that's not eighton, but that just rings hollow,
and look.
Speaker 2: I would it is a crunk juice is at the end.
Speaker 3: The X factor is like, which one of him is
gonna show be there that night?
Speaker 2: Sure? Man, I have a few I want to get
all right, let's go, he do? I fuck it? So
I'm going with.
Speaker 1: I guess this is a deep cut. He's I was
worried and his minutes have been a little bit more
up and down. When you're gonna have Tyler hero Oh,
I'm picking Casper's Shakacona if anyone wants to know, pick kick.
Speaker 2: Up the Miami. He's playing. He's still been playing with
Norman Pollow and Tyler Herovail.
Speaker 1: But which is good, not as much as when you're
gonna deal with absence is of one of those, most
notably Hero, I have a take, and I think that's
maybe because of I forgetting someone who's run through Miami.
I think Casper's Shaka Owns is the best pass of
the Miami Heat have had since Lebron James.
Speaker 3: Man. I wish I had researched this because that my
first reaction is like that can't be right, but you
might be right. Make your case.
Speaker 1: I the stuff that he and it's not all the
time because they do have him playing off the ball.
And by the way, that's part of the intrigue. Is
that why I'm selecting him as this offense just needs
a jolt of adrenaline into it. After kind of the
preseason hype and some nice starts earlier in the season,
they're once again below average on the offensive end. The
half court has not been anything special. It's been worse
if you look at it since January. First throw yakahonas
in there and he's just like this variable defenses can't
account for.
Speaker 2: Even though the shooting's been.
Speaker 1: Better from beyond the arc, which has allowed him to
play off the ball more and he will move off
the ball, he's not able to get separation like he
wants to or is used to at this level. He's
really struggled inside the arc. It has been abysmal on
most nights. But the passing that he just throws, whether
he's on the move or looking ahead in transition, and
it's just kind of sending, like doing these deep fakes
to de defenses where he's looking in another direction, then
turning to another player finding guys while they're on the
move like the IQ, and then kind of the gall
is over because some of the passes he just shouldn't
be trying. And there was a pass he threw so
he's got he knows where khalil Ware is at all times,
is what it really seems like. But there was I
think they were playing was it the Nuggets, And like
the Nuggets, where was it the I don't know. They
like scram switched out of going from to get onto
khilwhare to put a bigger body on khalilwear. Maybe it
was a Timberwolves game, I remember which game it was,
but they scram switched that they get a bigger body
on khalil Ware. And just in that like millisecond, Yakichillon
is in traffic, like on the move, threads the needle
right to khalil where for a shot that should not
would not have been opened just a nano second later
than that. I don't know what the heat are this season,
but as a team that is battling for positioning in
the Eastern Conference, they're not. I mean they could still
get Philadelphia's twenty six losses the heater at twenty nine
as we're recording this, so it's not outside the Roman
possibility you could get into the time. I think you
need to get the He's a jolt of adrenaline and
it's not always gonna be end well. But even the
turnovers have been more under control than it felt like
they were in Summer League, and that probably comes with
just having more reps next to guys this, He's already
super helpful to the offense. It's better with him statistically
when they're on the floor. And I think the thing
that passes the eye test more than anything is they
get out in transition and are so much more efficient
in transition with him on the floor. And I just
like Tyler Hero can even play off him. We see
moments of that. He's good at finding guys who are
just trailing for the three pointer as well.
Speaker 2: I want more.
Speaker 3: I want.
Speaker 1: I would say Cash should have to average twenty five
plus minutes a game rest of the way, and that's why,
and I think Miami's offense would be better off for it.
Maybe maybe I'm stupid pilled though, no, no, I mean.
Speaker 3: He's got a couple twenty plus minutes in the last
couple of weeks. You've sold me. I like the I
do think the the value of like a daring passer
is is like is a real thing, because it's like
the Jokic effect is an unfair example, but it's like
guys move around in very different ways when they think, like, well,
if this window opens a crack, I'm getting the ball.
And I think if if, if Youkuchis is like anything
like that that that has like a greater impact than
like his assist raw assist numbers. If that makes sense.
I think it can make a real difference.
Speaker 2: And look, if he's gonna shoot an above average clip
from three, which very much is right, he doesn't have
to stay above what is he still north of fifty percent?
Speaker 1: It's like forty five right now, fifty seven point one
since the trade deadline. He doesn't have to stay you
know what, I'm willing to say he can come off
a little bit from fifty seven point one percent, like
how like.
Speaker 3: You know, what do we need like forty nine?
Speaker 1: Like I mean, look, he's done a little bit better
getting some shots going in inside the arc like over
the past.
Speaker 3: But still be yeah right with him?
Speaker 2: Okay, you want to do one more pick each?
Speaker 3: Yeah, sure, we got it. And I the one has
jumped out of me because we haven't talked about this
team and they. I mean, we're at the point in
the season where half the league doesn't matter, and this
is on the side of that matters. So for the Wolves,
I want to talk about Dante DiVincenzo. I bet he
was the pick last year and I think he just
will be forever because the other four starters there and
presumable closers, I guess go bear counts as that are
just known commodities. With maybe the acception of Jade McDaniels,
I guess we could talk about like how much his
individual shot creation improvement matters, on and on. But Devincenzo
to me, is just like he is their high volume
three point shooter. He's oftentimes a secondary playmaker. He is,
I mean like he has a decent sized job defensively
and like on the ball, not great, so like he
has the ability to, for good or ill impact the
game on both sides of the floor. And like we
talked about this earlier today, the Wolves are just like
they've made the last two conference finals. They have these,
like I said, these known commodities, where like McDaniels can
guard anybody, and Anthony Edwards can win you any game
with incredible shot making if you need it, and he
guards in the playoffs like few others, and then Rudy
Gobert anchors the like there's so much here and there's
so much to be Like, I just think this team
should be in the conference finals again because like why
wouldn't it. What are you picking at? And it's like
maybe the de Vincenzo tier of players that throw nas
Reed and these other guys in there are the ones
that are like, you just aren't sure, like if this
is gonna be like high end starter production or if
it's Yeah, he's the weak link relatively speaking.
Speaker 2: So I just need one.
Speaker 3: We need to talk about the Wolves a little bit.
And too, I think de Vincenzo just like he's asked
to do so much and he's and I think he
will continue to be even with some of the additions
the Wolves have made, like dissume move being the big one,
and like, I don't know, is Kyle Anderson gonna play.
Speaker 2: Now that he's hit up there like all these reunions.
Speaker 3: Yeah, good to see. But but yeah, so Devincenzo just
is asked to do like a little bit of everything
in a way that really matters, and I don't know
that he's established like he's gonna be great at enough
of those things to really to be totally reliable, if
that if that makes sense.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think the big one is too, is
they've turned him into just sort of this de facto
point guard. And but it's not someone that they're gonna
get is what he is, right, but they it's what
they need him to be. When you're because it's just
your I think you give away too much where. Okay,
Bones Hiland has been a cool story. Even having Io
des soon Mu and the things he could do, you're
just maybe giving too much back elsewhere. And I think
Devincenzo is the better ball handler and shooter than Io
des souon Mu, and he is definitely the better defender
than Bones Highland.
Speaker 2: And so if you're looking to kind of like merge the.
Speaker 1: Two archetypes and just knowing you also have Anthony Edwards
and Julius Randall as well, it's can he provide enough
of And like Julius Randall facilitates the offense in a
different way than a Dante DiVincenzo, So it's can Dante
Devincenzo handle any of the pressure or capitalize on just
the I mean, I know Anthony Edwards hit that ridiculous
just like step back corner three pointer the other night
and then told that was funny to Chris Finch, don't
forget about me. That was amazing, But like, look at
the attention he's drawing. Can he be the outlet for
that in those moments, not just as a shot maker,
but as someone who's gonna either keep the ball moving
or attack. He's their best option to do it, right.
It's I mean, it's that or because who would be
the other pick we had I had I would assume
on my board, and I ended up not gonna pick him.
I think Devincenzo's the right name here. Maybe it's Jane
McDaniels because he does more offensively, but I think it's Dante.
Speaker 3: You can even say Randall like because sometimes he can
be like a dominant player and and that's your that's
your secondary creator anyway. But it's like, at this point,
I think we kind of understand the randal of it all,
like it it just maybe that's true Devincenzo too. I
don't know, maybe it should have been assuming because we've
never seen him play a meaningful NBA game, and that's
an interesting wrinkle to him in the playoffs, Like maybe
he just has more. It could be one of those guys,
but I think I think it's Stevencenzo. But but yeah,
the Wolves are just the Wolves are a weird team.
They like they're they're almost like a no notes team,
but they're not good enough to get the no notes treatment.
And maybe it's just like we is the thing with
the Wolves, like we get it? Is that or we
don't get it. I don't know. I don't know what
I'm saying.
Speaker 1: They're I don't know if they're the no notes team,
but a team that's this talented or is able to
get up or look so good on some nights and
then just don't trust them, Like so against top ten
teams this year, they're eight and eight, so just five hundred,
but they have the league's best offense in a top
ten defense, and yet you're just five hundred in those situations.
Speaker 2: That's just I don't know.
Speaker 1: They're they're tough to figure out, and I feel like
they have been for the This is year three of
I felt like you had a handle on the Wolves
by like at some point every year, like maybe you're
wondering could they reach this ceiling or how far could
they fall? But the past three years, it's felt for
a team that's this good or this problem, like you no,
like we should feel better about them, but they're just.
Speaker 3: And then they just they just keep making the conference finals.
And then it's like, well, I guess they're just good.
So what are we gonna talk about? Yeah?
Speaker 2: Where do I go next? Grant, I'm gonna give you.
Speaker 3: I don't. This is your last book, So I know.
Speaker 2: Toronto.
Speaker 1: I got four players, two in Detroit, one in Cleveland,
or five players and two in Toronto. I just talked
about Detroit a bunch on the last pod, So Cleveland
or Toronto?
Speaker 2: Which which?
Speaker 3: Uh do Cleveland because I'm gonna I'm gonna say something
controversial and let you know that I could not be
less interested. Uh in the Raptors could make it, to
make it the Cavs, So.
Speaker 1: I have Jaellen Tyson, where he was already important to
what they were doing post up like pre hardened trade,
I would argue that they might not need him to
shoot a trillion percent from three for the rest of
the season.
Speaker 2: Now that you do have James Harden. It's a good
thing because John Tyson's cooled off a little bit from three,
but he's become just more important to the defense than ever.
Speaker 1: I know. DeAndre Hunter, who's now injured, wasn't some shutdown defender,
but had positional size. We're talking about someone who doesn't
just need to like, yeah, he'll need to handle some
of the tougher point of attack assignments, but now you're
gonna have to scale up and guard some bigger wings
because how many minutes can Dean.
Speaker 2: Wade play in that role? Wa going to play Dean.
Speaker 3: Wade going to pick too? But well, no, I think
Dean Wade is so related to Tyson. I think that's
a great call out, Like Dean Wade's starting. He that,
like that's the decision now, like you, I think they.
I think Kenny Atkinson is just like we got James
Harden and Donovan Mitchell as our we I guess let's
get bigger, let's get even bigger, and let's like we
don't need any playmaking whatsoever because with those two guys,
so me like that seemed to me to be the logic.
But yeah, you can't count on Wade to play like
a true starters minutes.
Speaker 2: But he is Wade is their best wing defender.
Speaker 1: I'm not forgetting because Kean Allis is smaller, Denis Shruter
is smaller, and then Jal and Tyson's now number two.
And when you go through b ball Index has like
grading the matchup difficulties that they faced this season. Dean
Wade is one and then Jalen Tyson is two. Now
on the rosters like Jalen Tyson's played way more minutes.
And so this is I think why it's important is
the Calves are gonna finish. I mean, actually they're fourth
now in the East. They'll finish in the top four.
They could get to two, they could get to three,
but they shouldn't draw. You don't want to see them drop.
I know the Raptors are close, but I think they're
gonna end up in the top four, just in the playoffs.
It's well, how much do we trust that he's had
a really, really impactful year.
Speaker 2: And I erroneously said that they should offer him in
a first.
Speaker 1: For Jalen Welves at the time when he was going
through one of his shooting slumps. I wouldn't make that
trade now because he just gives you more on ball
like dynamism than a Jalen Wells would. But Jalen Wells
is the better defender right now. I think he has
more positional like he can guard bigger guys. Jaleen Tyson,
You're gonna see some of those more of those matchups
now than you even were before. And also just you
want to wonder, well, what does it look like in
extensive run with and we're gonna have to wait a
little bit or to see peak depending on what's going
on with James Harden's thumb. But like, I like he's
going to be He's in theory, he's less important because
of the James Harden trade, but he's also more important
because of just the way that their wing rotation is
set up.
Speaker 2: It's you have Dean Wade and that's basically it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think too, like his role will change
a lot if you so. Part of me likes the
idea of him on second units with like Kean Ellis
and Dennis Shruder as like a we're gonna fly around
type like more energetic unit than than the starting group.
But like if he's out there with like Shrewder just
is gonna hand do most of the ball handling and
like Ellis, you know, he's more of a dependent scorer.
But like it's pretty different, Like he'll be asked to
do different stuff and he'll cert like, yeah, I just
I wonder sometimes if if moving him out of the
starting lineup is like is that gonna be a net
positive for the Cavs because like he made a lot
of sense as he still makes sense as a starter
in a lot of ways. Like I guess I just
come back to like I guess they wanted more size
to offset the best. I don't really know. I guess
do you get Wade over over Tyson at the moment?
Speaker 1: Because if you even treat Ja, I mean, Dean Wade's great,
I guess it's an interesting question.
Speaker 2: What are you worried about? Like what are you looking
to get more of along?
Speaker 1: Because you viewed James Harden defensively as a forward and
you're thinking that Dean Wade and Fringes.
Speaker 3: Well that's what I mean is like, so if James
Harden should be guarding bigger players, then wouldn't you rather
have Tyson out there guarding guards as opposed to Wade?
Like I don't know, Wades with like Wades in the
league and matters because he can guard multiple positions and
can make threes. But like, I don't know, it's it's
crazy to be like, well, Harden can't guard backcourt players,
so let's get a six to nine guy on the floor. Honestly,
Like this is a very much ad just asking questions
because I think if it's me, I might have done
the same thing and just got Wade out there as
like a purely dependent scorer. That that part of it
makes a lot of sense to me. And you put
Tyson's I guess superior. Everybody's got superior playmaking. To wait,
you put that on the second unit.
Speaker 2: They were I was curious to see what it did
look like.
Speaker 1: But the so the Tyson, Hard and Mitchell lineups have
a defensive rating of one hundred and twenty seven, okay,
which we don't want to set this second percent tile?
Speaker 2: Are you just too is it just a you think
you're okay?
Speaker 1: James Harden is positionally a forward on defense, but he's
not providing the value of one. I mean the I
mean Dan Wade. They're in the twenty ninth percent tile.
When is James Harden Donovan Mitchell. They're allowing one to
eighteen point three points.
Speaker 3: Yeah, don't know. Maybe it's not that complicated. Maybe it's
just like we don't need any more playmaking. We might
as well get a guy that's totally cool if he
takes two shots in twenty minutes or whatever, Like maybe
that's all it is.
Speaker 1: Yeah, uh, did you before you take us out of here?
Did you say you wanted to get off a nuclear
anti raptors take.
Speaker 2: I don't know where's this come.
Speaker 3: No, I just I just as we're looking at the
list like I'm not interested in this. That that was.
I guess that's my nuclear your take.
Speaker 1: I just.
Speaker 3: Nothing to say.
Speaker 2: Do you have anything else for the kids? Or are
you ready to take us out of here?
Speaker 3: I think that'll do it. Thanks everybody for listening and
for watching. Please remember to rate, review and subscribe, and
tell your friends and your enemies, and do all the things.
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description shouts Franklin Lakina. Apologies to Jared Allen, who's not
an X factor in our Hearts