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<v Speaker 1>This is pod popular podcast for the people, The Great

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<v Speaker 1>Love Debate. It's the Great Love Debate, the Great Love Debate.

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<v Speaker 1>It's a Great Love bab Hi again. Everyone's Brian Howie.

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to The Great Love Debate, the world's number one

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<v Speaker 1>dating and relationship podcast since twenty fifteen. I am here

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<v Speaker 1>in the very fine studios of Pod Populi Podcasts for

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<v Speaker 1>the People. I am at the one in Lyndhurst, Ohio,

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<v Speaker 1>just outside of Cleveland, fancy shopping complex called Legacy Village.

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<v Speaker 1>I am here. It is not warm, so I'll tell

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<v Speaker 1>you what time of year it is in Cleveland, which

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<v Speaker 1>could be anywhere from January to January. Anyway, you're in

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<v Speaker 1>there anyway. So we are at the four hundred and

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<v Speaker 1>ninety ish episode of this podcast, which means the ball

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<v Speaker 1>is dropping and countdown is on towards our big five

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<v Speaker 1>hundredth episode. It's coming up. And I asked you guys

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<v Speaker 1>for some suggestions on what we should do, and I've

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<v Speaker 1>kicked around some ideas with the longtime producer of The

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<v Speaker 1>Great Love Debate, the two time Emmy Award winning Kickup,

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<v Speaker 1>and I think it's going to be a little bit

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<v Speaker 1>of everything you guys like worst Dates, Happily Ever afters,

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<v Speaker 1>some of our greatest hits, some surprise guests, and more.

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<v Speaker 1>So you have just a couple more weeks to send

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<v Speaker 1>in your suggestions, so sent them in Great Love Debate

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<v Speaker 1>at gmail dot com. We do have our absolute finalized

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<v Speaker 1>list of the ten worst dates ever. Those are locked

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<v Speaker 1>and loaded. So I don't care what happened to you

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<v Speaker 1>this past weekend. I don't care what's going to happen

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<v Speaker 1>to you next weekend. You ain't cracking this list. These

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<v Speaker 1>are gold. We've been working on this list for ten years,

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<v Speaker 1>so look forward to that. So, because it's miserably cold

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<v Speaker 1>here in Cleveland, Ohio, apparently my guest has a cold

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<v Speaker 1>and she was going to be really good for this episode,

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<v Speaker 1>but she canceled, which you know, that could be sort

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<v Speaker 1>of related or tangential to what I'm going to get

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<v Speaker 1>into today, or maybe just coincidence. I don't know. You

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<v Speaker 1>guys often wonder do I pick my guests first and

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<v Speaker 1>then decide what I want to talk about with them?

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<v Speaker 1>What I picked the subject matter first, and then the

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<v Speaker 1>guest can sort of hit the ping pong ball back

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<v Speaker 1>around the topic. And the answer is the latter. She

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<v Speaker 1>did not show today, but it is on with the

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<v Speaker 1>show because I knew what I wanted to talk about

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<v Speaker 1>very specifically, and you know, she's really good at this.

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<v Speaker 1>But we'll see what we can do here. What I

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<v Speaker 1>want to talk about today is self sabotage, the whole thing,

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<v Speaker 1>why we do it, when we do it, how we

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<v Speaker 1>do it, because it is a whole thing. My guest,

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<v Speaker 1>she's self sabotaged having a big audience by canceling on

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<v Speaker 1>this podcast today, so Sey LEVI, but I have dated

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<v Speaker 1>my share of self sabotage. And I know what you're thinking.

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<v Speaker 1>You're like, oh, it's a mercy killing by them, or

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<v Speaker 1>you know who wouldn't want to sabotage a relationship with

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<v Speaker 1>you for self preservation. So I will pause while you

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<v Speaker 1>get your jokes and wise cracks in three two one. Good, okay,

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<v Speaker 1>And I'm sure men do this too, but I'm gonna

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<v Speaker 1>focus mostly on the female side of this because that

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<v Speaker 1>is what I've witnessed the most. They call it runaway bride,

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<v Speaker 1>not runaway groom, you know, So it is what it is.

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<v Speaker 1>Maybe it's a stereotype, but that's what we're getting in today.

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<v Speaker 1>And what do I mean by self sabotage. It means

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<v Speaker 1>that they can't handle it when it's too good, or

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<v Speaker 1>they're afraid of it getting too good, feels too right

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<v Speaker 1>too quick, or they pull away before having to even

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<v Speaker 1>decide if it's good at all. I had a girlfriend

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<v Speaker 1>once who every time we had a good time or

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<v Speaker 1>had a nice experience or positive feelings, she would say, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm just waiting for the other shoe to drop, and

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<v Speaker 1>I'm like, what what a buzzkill? It was like somehow

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<v Speaker 1>she couldn't handle things simply being nice or going okay.

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<v Speaker 1>There had to be some impending backlash or repercussions around

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<v Speaker 1>the corner, or some price to pay for the pleasantry.

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<v Speaker 1>Not to be too I literative, but the price to

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<v Speaker 1>pay for the pleasantry. And it was so incredibly frustrating,

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<v Speaker 1>definitely for me and almost assuredly for her too, that

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<v Speaker 1>she felt like she would either either jinx it or

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<v Speaker 1>set herself up for heartbreak by letting any positive feelings

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<v Speaker 1>kick in. And I kept telling her just because something

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<v Speaker 1>didn't go right before, it didn't mean something couldn't go

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<v Speaker 1>right now, and she couldn't accept it because she just

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<v Speaker 1>wouldn't believe it. There always had to be some boomerang,

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<v Speaker 1>some backsplash, and that was someone I was actually in

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<v Speaker 1>a relationship with for quite a while. And so it

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<v Speaker 1>would always be this Sissyphusian Sisyphis, the one who rolled

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<v Speaker 1>the rock up the hill and kept prolling back down, Sissyphus.

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<v Speaker 1>But how many who's the one who flew too gross

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<v Speaker 1>to the sun Icarus? Something like that Greek mythology. It's

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<v Speaker 1>a classics minor, But how many of us have steered

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<v Speaker 1>away from from green lights and towards the red flags

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<v Speaker 1>before something even had a chance. You cancel the night before,

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<v Speaker 1>or you ghosted when you started to have these feelings,

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<v Speaker 1>you pulled the parachute right before the best part of

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<v Speaker 1>the night. You know, I've had it happen. I've seen

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<v Speaker 1>it happen. They they seek an off ramp before the

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<v Speaker 1>second or third day because of the headlights ahead. Were

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<v Speaker 1>just heartbreak in their minds, almost like you from the past.

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<v Speaker 1>So that's a little bit what I want to get

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<v Speaker 1>into complicated stuff again. I don't have all the answers.

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<v Speaker 1>My jobs to raise the questions. I had somebody coming

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<v Speaker 1>in she might have the answers, but we're going to

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<v Speaker 1>seek some answers together. I'm gonna raise a few more questions,

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<v Speaker 1>but I take a quick break. We will be back

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<v Speaker 1>right after this, and we are back. So the reasons

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<v Speaker 1>people self sabotage, I think it's pretty obvious. They're almost

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<v Speaker 1>always rooted in fear, fear of being hurt, the fear

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<v Speaker 1>of being rejected, the fear of the unknown, fear of

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<v Speaker 1>the outcome. But the ways that people self sabotage, that's

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<v Speaker 1>that's such a huge range of possibilities. Sometimes it is

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<v Speaker 1>stuff you wouldn't think of. It is nit picking your

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<v Speaker 1>your partner to death. You'll you know, death by a

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<v Speaker 1>thousand paper cuts, a little bit every single day, po poke,

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<v Speaker 1>poke poke, hoping subconsciously it'll drive them away, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>knowing that your constant comments or subconsciously having it taking

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<v Speaker 1>a toll and you're unable to stop it because that

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<v Speaker 1>part of you that you can't reach and really can't

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<v Speaker 1>even understand it wants to blow it all up. Or

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<v Speaker 1>you stop communicating any positivity whatsoever. You're always harping on

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<v Speaker 1>and you're obsessed with the negative. Or you get jealous

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<v Speaker 1>for no reason and you cause a fight because of

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<v Speaker 1>the jealousy, or you don't show up for the dates,

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<v Speaker 1>or you don't speak to the future, or you reach

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<v Speaker 1>out to someone in your past. All of it can

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<v Speaker 1>do any of it, either quickly or over the long haul.

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<v Speaker 1>It can even rise to the level of cheating. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>we did an episode a couple months go on infidelity.

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<v Speaker 1>You feel too good in his arms, so let me

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<v Speaker 1>spend some time in someone else's because I don't deserve that.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't feel worthy of the good, so let me

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<v Speaker 1>revert to the bad. What happens a lot. You don't

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<v Speaker 1>know that you deserve the right to feel good, to

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<v Speaker 1>be happy, to be loved. And I learned that doing

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<v Speaker 1>this show. I never really thought about that before. We

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<v Speaker 1>had a guy named doctor Gary Solier. He's our live

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<v Speaker 1>show Bunch, but he's on this podcast too, and that

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<v Speaker 1>was his real his mantra is that all of us

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<v Speaker 1>have a right to be loved. And I never really

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<v Speaker 1>thought about it that way. You know, somebody that you've

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<v Speaker 1>heard deserved to it, or I've earned it or whatever,

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<v Speaker 1>but a fundamental human right to be loved. That was

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<v Speaker 1>this philosophy, and I think I agree with that. I

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<v Speaker 1>never thought of it that way, and sometimes either we

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<v Speaker 1>don't recognize that right or we forego that right simply

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<v Speaker 1>because it feels too right, So you don't even give

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<v Speaker 1>a new relationship a chance, or you might prevent an

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<v Speaker 1>existing relationship from being everything it could be and needed

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<v Speaker 1>to be. And it's weird. I always hear like what happened?

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<v Speaker 1>Oh he looked good on paper. So many people tend

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<v Speaker 1>to date quote unquote on paper. I go out with

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<v Speaker 1>him because he seems good on paper. This guy was

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<v Speaker 1>perfect on paper. And then somehow and sometimes it all

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<v Speaker 1>falls apart because of something that wasn't even on the paper,

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<v Speaker 1>never date on paper, or something that ever wasn't ever

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<v Speaker 1>going to be on the paper. So you're really you're

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<v Speaker 1>going this with this listless list, and then you're scrolling

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<v Speaker 1>in the margins of stuff that was never going to

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<v Speaker 1>be there in the first place, good or bad, And

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<v Speaker 1>it's simply ghosts in your head. It's ghosts of past

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<v Speaker 1>relationships or things that simply aren't real. You could not,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, ride that high to see where it might lead.

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<v Speaker 1>And I'm fundamentally an optimist when it comes to dating.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't believe in it's too good to be true.

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<v Speaker 1>I want it to be too good to be true,

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<v Speaker 1>because that means we're living in a fairy tale. And yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>even a grumpy, aging dude like me, Damn right, I

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<v Speaker 1>want to live in a fairy tale? Who want that?

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<v Speaker 1>Isn't that the dream? Isn't that why we call it

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<v Speaker 1>a dream? So why can't the dream be a reality

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<v Speaker 1>when the dream becomes real? Sign on the dotted line,

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<v Speaker 1>don't scare it away? No, I don't know. You can't

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<v Speaker 1>aim too high if you keep shooting yourself in the foot.

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<v Speaker 1>Does that make sense? I don't know. You can't win

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<v Speaker 1>the race if you can't even get out of that

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<v Speaker 1>the gate. Whatever simile or metaphor or analogy you want

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<v Speaker 1>to apply to this, it's true. We are always, almost

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<v Speaker 1>always our own worst enemies. And if we don't believe

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<v Speaker 1>in us and our ability to get everything that we

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<v Speaker 1>absolutely deserve, then the relationship has no chance, and the

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<v Speaker 1>other person never stood a chance. And so yeah, we

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<v Speaker 1>always need to look after ourselves first it But doesn't

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<v Speaker 1>it suck to know that you were depriving the other

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<v Speaker 1>person at a happy relationship and a real honest chance

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<v Speaker 1>at loving simply because of something in your head that's

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<v Speaker 1>not fair to them, and you keep doing it over

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<v Speaker 1>and over and over and it keeps happening over and

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<v Speaker 1>over and over, Like that would suck if somebody was

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<v Speaker 1>really giving you everything that you ever wanted, and you

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<v Speaker 1>found a reason to imagine that they were giving something

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<v Speaker 1>that you weren't getting in a negative like that makes

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<v Speaker 1>no sense and it's not fair to the person. Imagine

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<v Speaker 1>how frustrating that would be if you were on the

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<v Speaker 1>other end of it. I can't even imagine. Actually I

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<v Speaker 1>can imagine because it's happened to me. It sucks. And

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<v Speaker 1>I know this sounds a lot like a like a

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<v Speaker 1>pep talking, and sometimes it is. And when you know

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<v Speaker 1>it's happening to you with someone and you're trying to

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<v Speaker 1>convince them of what they're doing and how it's all

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<v Speaker 1>in their head, and it makes it even worse. It

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<v Speaker 1>sounds so insane, sounds so insane to them because they

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<v Speaker 1>don't want to believe that this is what they're doing,

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<v Speaker 1>and it sounds so insane to you because you're like,

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<v Speaker 1>is this this relationship that I'm in that I keep

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<v Speaker 1>doing everything that I think they want me to do

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<v Speaker 1>and they and they can't accept the good they cannot

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<v Speaker 1>receive I give, they don't receive, or the other way around,

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<v Speaker 1>like it has to be rooted. The dream has to

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<v Speaker 1>be rooted in reality, and the reality is what has

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<v Speaker 1>actually happened, not the negative imaginary stuff. You can imagine

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<v Speaker 1>that the good stuff that is ahead, But if you're

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<v Speaker 1>imagining bad stuff that is right in front of you,

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<v Speaker 1>like that's that's going to kill the road. It's gonna

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<v Speaker 1>kill everybody, you know. And so if you're somebody who

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<v Speaker 1>does this, generally you're aware and is the one good thing.

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<v Speaker 1>A lot of people who have done this repeated and say, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>I tend to self sabotage. I think you got to

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<v Speaker 1>let that person know up front. Don't let them know,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, when you're collecting your belongings at their house, like, yeah, sorry,

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<v Speaker 1>self sabotaged it because it's too late. Then you know,

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<v Speaker 1>be aware of you why this is fundamental. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>this is therapy one on one again. The person I

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<v Speaker 1>was going to have on here tease, he wrote a

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<v Speaker 1>whole book on it. We'll have her back if she

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<v Speaker 1>doesn't self sabotage, the opportunity be on the great love debate.

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<v Speaker 1>But if you're somebody who does it, or you've had

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<v Speaker 1>it happen to you, well not to let ourselves totally

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<v Speaker 1>off the hook. What is it about our behaviors and

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<v Speaker 1>the environment we're creating the causes somebody to self sabotage?

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<v Speaker 1>What made them pull the parachute the emergency? Uh, fire thingy,

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<v Speaker 1>fire thingy, I'm looking at one right now. What makes

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<v Speaker 1>them do that? Or is there anything about it? I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>it's not just like, oh I'm so good they couldn't

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<v Speaker 1>handle it. It's not quite that. So we all have

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<v Speaker 1>to sort of do a little inventory and self analysis

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<v Speaker 1>on this to figure it out. On this note, the

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<v Speaker 1>good people here at pod Popular, which includes me, we

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<v Speaker 1>are we did this couple of years ago, we're gonna

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<v Speaker 1>do it again. We want to do a podcast that

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<v Speaker 1>is sort of related to this, like produce a show

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<v Speaker 1>about this. And it's going to be called cold Feet,

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<v Speaker 1>and it is about from men or women who called

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<v Speaker 1>off engagements, not who got divorced three weeks after or

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<v Speaker 1>not who broke up you know before I want actual

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<v Speaker 1>called off an engagement or called off a wedding. And

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<v Speaker 1>we are looking not for stories, we are looking for

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<v Speaker 1>a host. We are going to produce this podcast. We're

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<v Speaker 1>gonna give this podcast away a year of podcasting to

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<v Speaker 1>anybody who feels they can do this, who can drive

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<v Speaker 1>this ship, has personal experience with it, interested in it,

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<v Speaker 1>and wants to We'll do the job of getting all

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<v Speaker 1>the stories. But we were looking for somebody to host

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<v Speaker 1>this show. I thought about doing it myself because I'm

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<v Speaker 1>fascinated by it, but I've never had the cold feet,

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<v Speaker 1>so I'm not a good example somebody who because the

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<v Speaker 1>hardest thing to do in the world world is to

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<v Speaker 1>call off that wedding, call off that engagement. The deposits

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<v Speaker 1>are there, the families invited, like it takes such guts

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<v Speaker 1>to do that, and so many people go through with

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<v Speaker 1>it knowing that it's not going to work out. So

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<v Speaker 1>I want to hear from the ones who stepped up

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<v Speaker 1>and did because I think it'll help a lot of people.

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<v Speaker 1>The podcast will be called cold Feet, and we are

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<v Speaker 1>looking for a host. So shoot me an email, Great

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<v Speaker 1>Love Debate at gmail dot com if you think you've

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<v Speaker 1>got the stuff to do this, and I think it's

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<v Speaker 1>got to start with your own personal experience. Those of

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<v Speaker 1>you who have reached out because you're listening to my

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<v Speaker 1>other podcast dead to me. Really, we're very gracious knowing

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<v Speaker 1>that I shared my own story. So if you're gonna

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<v Speaker 1>host the gold Feet podcast, you can have thought out

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<v Speaker 1>feet now, but they've better been cold in the future.

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<v Speaker 1>And I don't mean you live in Cleveland, Ohio in

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<v Speaker 1>the middle of the winter. So shoot us an email

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<v Speaker 1>if you think you've got a win it takes. We

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<v Speaker 1>will handle all the hard parts. If you want to

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<v Speaker 1>host the Cold feat podcast, shoot me them a Great

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<v Speaker 1>Love Debate at Gmail comm as well, if you've got

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<v Speaker 1>thoughts about self sabotage or history with it, or if

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<v Speaker 1>you want to chime in your thoughts on what we

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<v Speaker 1>should do on the five the show. I think we

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<v Speaker 1>have it locked and loaded. I have a meeting with

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<v Speaker 1>Kko about it and we're gonna break it all down. Please,

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<v Speaker 1>even after ten years, like share, follow and review this podcast.

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<v Speaker 1>Your reviews always mean a lot to me and in

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<v Speaker 1>the podcasting ecosystem because, as always at the Great Love Debate,

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<v Speaker 1>we never stop making love. See you next time the

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<v Speaker 1>Great Love Debate. It's the Great Love Debate. Degreat Love Debate.

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<v Speaker 1>It's a Great Love Debate.