WEBVTT 1 00:00:07.679 --> 00:00:11.880 Welcome to the One on one Podcast with your host 2 00:00:12.519 --> 00:00:42.679 one A Yalla, Welcome back. 3 00:00:42.479 --> 00:00:45.079 To another episode of the One on one Podcast. I'm 4 00:00:45.079 --> 00:00:47.679 your host. As always, make sure the follow the show 5 00:00:47.719 --> 00:00:51.200 on social media at the One on one Podcast pretty 6 00:00:51.280 --> 00:00:54.200 much all social media platforms. Make sure to check out 7 00:00:54.240 --> 00:00:58.759 the Patreon, Patreon dot com, slash the one Podcast www 8 00:00:58.880 --> 00:01:02.799 dot tj OJP dot com, all the links down in 9 00:01:02.840 --> 00:01:06.840 the description. And today joining us for the very first time, 10 00:01:07.359 --> 00:01:09.519 Larry Hancock, sir, how are you. It's a pleasure to 11 00:01:09.519 --> 00:01:09.840 meet you. 12 00:01:10.680 --> 00:01:12.719 I'm good, it's great to be here and thanks for 13 00:01:12.760 --> 00:01:13.239 having me. 14 00:01:13.879 --> 00:01:16.159 Yea, sir? Can you let people know where they can 15 00:01:16.200 --> 00:01:18.719 find you, Larry, if this is the first time they've 16 00:01:18.719 --> 00:01:20.439 heard about you, and where they can find your book, 17 00:01:20.439 --> 00:01:25.000 which we will be covering today, the Oswald Puzzle reconsidering 18 00:01:25.280 --> 00:01:26.480 Lee Harvey Oswald. 19 00:01:27.480 --> 00:01:29.920 Yeah. Probably the best word to see all my works 20 00:01:29.920 --> 00:01:33.480 and I've done some twelve fourteen books over the last 21 00:01:33.519 --> 00:01:37.599 few years is on Amazon's author page, So just look 22 00:01:37.640 --> 00:01:42.159 for Larry Hancock on books on Amazon. The books are available. 23 00:01:42.239 --> 00:01:47.079 They also puzzles available pretty much everywhere, including Walmart's website, 24 00:01:47.159 --> 00:01:50.079 which is kind of interesting, so you can find it anywhere. 25 00:01:50.120 --> 00:01:52.319 But the other place to see what I'm doing is 26 00:01:52.359 --> 00:01:56.840 I have a blog on WordPress, so it's Larry Hancock 27 00:01:56.920 --> 00:01:59.319 and WordPress. Do a search for that and you'll find me. 28 00:02:00.840 --> 00:02:03.159 Awesome. And I'll post the links down the description after 29 00:02:03.159 --> 00:02:05.920 the show so people can check it out and check 30 00:02:05.920 --> 00:02:07.719 out the book. I actually I was telling you I 31 00:02:07.719 --> 00:02:11.759 haven't talked about the jfk assassination on my show because 32 00:02:11.759 --> 00:02:15.400 it's one of those conspiracies. Because it is a conspiracy. 33 00:02:15.439 --> 00:02:16.240 I mean, at the end of the. 34 00:02:16.199 --> 00:02:16.800 Day that. 35 00:02:18.199 --> 00:02:23.439 The governmental hey, the CIA and the FBI both investigated 36 00:02:23.479 --> 00:02:25.879 that the CI and the FBI had no wrongdoing, so 37 00:02:25.960 --> 00:02:27.680 we're good to go, like that sort of thing. I 38 00:02:27.719 --> 00:02:31.639 don't find that interesting. What I find interesting is what 39 00:02:31.719 --> 00:02:34.759 happens after the fact. So we have the event, which 40 00:02:34.800 --> 00:02:38.000 was obviously the jfk assassination that we know for a 41 00:02:38.039 --> 00:02:41.560 fact happened, right, he was taken out. Now the whole 42 00:02:41.599 --> 00:02:45.840 conspiracy is who actually did it, how did he pull 43 00:02:45.879 --> 00:02:50.439 it off, motivations as to why he would do it, right, 44 00:02:50.879 --> 00:02:54.639 and of course the patsy or the fall guy that 45 00:02:55.120 --> 00:02:58.319 took the hit for this, which we will never truly know. 46 00:02:58.400 --> 00:03:03.280 The actual truth is Lee Harvey Olswalk. How many years, Larry, 47 00:03:03.319 --> 00:03:06.639 have you been at it? Researching the JFK assassination and 48 00:03:06.879 --> 00:03:08.360 topics related to this. 49 00:03:09.599 --> 00:03:13.360 I started in the mid nineties, so over thirty years 50 00:03:13.639 --> 00:03:19.039 on JFK, but not just JFK, basically political actions in 51 00:03:19.080 --> 00:03:23.240 the sixties and early seventies where there's JFK, MLK, RFK. 52 00:03:23.960 --> 00:03:27.240 I've written on all of them, plus basically the national 53 00:03:27.400 --> 00:03:33.240 security that's my wheelhouse, national security activities during the Cold War. 54 00:03:33.639 --> 00:03:36.400 So yeah, over over three decades, and as you say, 55 00:03:37.120 --> 00:03:40.639 also down lots of rabbit holes. If there were rabbit 56 00:03:40.680 --> 00:03:42.759 holes to be found, I fell in them. 57 00:03:43.280 --> 00:03:46.080 Is there any in particular that you enjoy the most. 58 00:03:45.879 --> 00:03:53.199 Larry, I would say I would say researching and writing 59 00:03:53.479 --> 00:04:00.840 about real American history, deniable operations, covert activities, partially because 60 00:04:00.879 --> 00:04:03.560 we know a lot about that now. I mean, everybody 61 00:04:03.560 --> 00:04:06.199 says you're only gonna know what really happened, like fifty 62 00:04:06.280 --> 00:04:09.360 years after the fact. History. History is never immediate, right. 63 00:04:09.479 --> 00:04:12.400 Historians write about the past, and I'm a history buff, 64 00:04:12.759 --> 00:04:16.480 I'm a document buff. So it's satisfying to go back 65 00:04:16.519 --> 00:04:20.639 to something like Vietnam or something like the Tonkin Gulf, 66 00:04:20.920 --> 00:04:24.240 things that were very real to me, that's my period 67 00:04:24.319 --> 00:04:27.800 of time, you know, and find out now what was 68 00:04:27.920 --> 00:04:30.519 really happening that we didn't know at the time. So 69 00:04:30.720 --> 00:04:34.040 I would say that's probably the most satisfying for me, 70 00:04:34.160 --> 00:04:36.839 especially when you find it and find proof of it 71 00:04:36.920 --> 00:04:38.040 in the records. 72 00:04:38.800 --> 00:04:41.040 So it's safe to say that aliens that didn't take 73 00:04:41.120 --> 00:04:42.600 JFK out, would you. 74 00:04:43.680 --> 00:04:46.040 I'm pretty good on no on know on that one. 75 00:04:46.160 --> 00:04:49.120 Yeah know on that one. And it wasn't the relatives 76 00:04:49.160 --> 00:04:52.480 of the crew of the Thresher submarine that blamed them 77 00:04:52.519 --> 00:04:56.000 for that. And yeah, there are a few others like that. Yeah. 78 00:04:56.839 --> 00:04:58.560 Out of all of those, we can write at least 79 00:04:58.600 --> 00:04:59.040 some off. 80 00:05:00.279 --> 00:05:04.120 How has this research putting in so much time? And 81 00:05:04.240 --> 00:05:07.399 there are people who write their doctors who dedicate their 82 00:05:07.519 --> 00:05:11.600 entire lives to studying one particular field of medicine historians 83 00:05:11.639 --> 00:05:17.120 that you know, like yourself, that you're studying this niche areas. 84 00:05:17.399 --> 00:05:22.120 How has researching at least the JFK assassination shaped your 85 00:05:22.160 --> 00:05:23.959 worldview if any. 86 00:05:23.759 --> 00:05:28.160 At all, It really has shaped my worldview. And you 87 00:05:28.199 --> 00:05:30.399 bring up a very good point, and it's a point 88 00:05:30.439 --> 00:05:34.839 that often gets lost in the conspiracy community, and that is, 89 00:05:34.879 --> 00:05:38.519 if you've studied just one piece of history, you tend 90 00:05:38.600 --> 00:05:43.959 to become fixated. But all history is situational. All needs context. 91 00:05:44.439 --> 00:05:46.720 If you don't know, if I tried to study JFK 92 00:05:47.519 --> 00:05:51.920 without knowing how the CIA really operated, I would lose, 93 00:05:52.079 --> 00:05:54.600 or how the FBI operated. You've got to know how 94 00:05:54.639 --> 00:05:59.399 they're organized, how they're structured, what their standard operating practices are. 95 00:06:00.160 --> 00:06:04.560 So without that kind of context, you go down these 96 00:06:05.000 --> 00:06:07.920 rabbit holes and never come back. So for me, that's 97 00:06:08.319 --> 00:06:11.680 that's been really the biggest thing that I've become aware 98 00:06:11.680 --> 00:06:14.879 of and learned is that you you can't you can't. 99 00:06:15.399 --> 00:06:17.639 You can't slice it too Finally, it's kind of like 100 00:06:17.720 --> 00:06:20.279 painting with too broad a brush. If you do that, 101 00:06:20.680 --> 00:06:22.839 you may you're never going to get the right answer. 102 00:06:22.879 --> 00:06:25.439 It's kind of like again painting, You've got to be 103 00:06:25.480 --> 00:06:28.800 able to do broad brush in detail to make it right. 104 00:06:30.560 --> 00:06:33.519 How does someone go about writing a book like this 105 00:06:33.639 --> 00:06:37.399 that's very heavy on documents? You know, I want to 106 00:06:37.439 --> 00:06:41.319 focus on what what what the documents and what the 107 00:06:41.959 --> 00:06:45.480 facts say from the people who are providing it. And 108 00:06:46.040 --> 00:06:48.000 a follow up question from that, how do you not 109 00:06:48.199 --> 00:06:52.720 let your thinking be tainted by the conspiracy realm of 110 00:06:52.839 --> 00:06:55.759 things and how do you not let your mind wander 111 00:06:55.920 --> 00:06:57.360 as you're doing this research. 112 00:06:58.360 --> 00:07:01.360 Boy that that is a real channel. But the first 113 00:07:01.360 --> 00:07:04.920 thing you have to you have to look for what 114 00:07:05.639 --> 00:07:07.439 put it this way. You have to look for what 115 00:07:07.519 --> 00:07:10.160 you find, not what you want to find. The thing 116 00:07:10.199 --> 00:07:14.199 that I'm always most pleased about is if I'm finding 117 00:07:14.279 --> 00:07:17.519 something that I didn't expect, I know I'm on the 118 00:07:17.600 --> 00:07:20.639 right track. If I find what I was thinking was there, 119 00:07:20.680 --> 00:07:24.480 and only that, you know, I'm afraid I'm driving myself. 120 00:07:25.319 --> 00:07:28.519 So when I'm actually going down a trail and find 121 00:07:28.519 --> 00:07:32.079 something unexpected, I think I'm going in the right direction. 122 00:07:32.600 --> 00:07:34.800 And you've got to do that with documents, which means 123 00:07:34.800 --> 00:07:37.040 that you have to look at not just one set 124 00:07:37.079 --> 00:07:40.560 of documents. For example, I've found a lot of things 125 00:07:40.600 --> 00:07:44.959 about CIA operations and practices in general looking at State 126 00:07:45.000 --> 00:07:49.560 Department documents because State department has their version of what's 127 00:07:49.600 --> 00:07:52.560 going on, and if they think the CIA is doing 128 00:07:52.600 --> 00:07:56.600 something stupid or they'll write it down. Same for the 129 00:07:56.600 --> 00:08:00.639 CIA versus the State, same for military intelligence. If you 130 00:08:00.680 --> 00:08:04.399 look at multiple sources in the documents describing the same event, 131 00:08:04.879 --> 00:08:08.720 it becomes very informative. So you've got to bounce this 132 00:08:08.759 --> 00:08:12.120 stuff against each other. You can't just go down one trail. 133 00:08:12.600 --> 00:08:16.279 And then that requires a huge amount of document work, 134 00:08:16.720 --> 00:08:20.120 you know, tens of thousands of pages and learning how 135 00:08:20.160 --> 00:08:22.920 to read the documents one of the things that's been 136 00:08:23.000 --> 00:08:25.680 most valuable for us. And you might be surprised. People 137 00:08:25.720 --> 00:08:29.279 are surprised kind of like, well, you've got documents, but 138 00:08:29.399 --> 00:08:30.959 how do you read them? And the first thing you've 139 00:08:30.959 --> 00:08:32.320 got to do is you've got to be able to 140 00:08:32.399 --> 00:08:36.879 crack the names in the documents, the pseudonyms, the aliases, 141 00:08:37.559 --> 00:08:42.240 the organizations. If you don't go do your homework and 142 00:08:42.360 --> 00:08:44.320 are not able to find that, you won't really even 143 00:08:44.360 --> 00:08:47.519 know what you're reading because it will talk about something 144 00:08:47.559 --> 00:08:50.440 going on, but you don't know who conducted it, who 145 00:08:50.440 --> 00:08:54.000 they're connected to. Just one of the things that's allowed 146 00:08:54.080 --> 00:08:56.039 us to crack a lot of stuff in regard to 147 00:08:56.120 --> 00:09:00.480 JFK assassination is being able to basically what we call 148 00:09:00.960 --> 00:09:04.960 busting pseudonyms, find out the names that are used in 149 00:09:05.000 --> 00:09:08.000 the documents to describe real people, who were they and 150 00:09:08.039 --> 00:09:11.879 what are their aliases? So we contract them ensu who's 151 00:09:11.919 --> 00:09:16.519 really involved and what their networks were long winded answer 152 00:09:16.600 --> 00:09:18.080 to it's a lot of slogging. 153 00:09:19.519 --> 00:09:20.879 Do you do it by yourself there or do you 154 00:09:20.960 --> 00:09:22.320 have a team that helps you out with this? 155 00:09:23.440 --> 00:09:26.720 Usually I work with well, usually just a small group 156 00:09:26.840 --> 00:09:29.279 of say like half a dozen people that really get 157 00:09:29.320 --> 00:09:32.000 to be expert in you know, how do we read 158 00:09:32.080 --> 00:09:36.200 the CIA operations files out of the Cuban branch in Miami? 159 00:09:36.600 --> 00:09:39.200 You know, in the whole world, that's a small group 160 00:09:39.240 --> 00:09:42.399 of people, maybe a dozen people. And then to pursue 161 00:09:42.440 --> 00:09:45.759 any particular line of thought, it's it's usually two or 162 00:09:45.799 --> 00:09:48.840 three people that really dig in, which was why in 163 00:09:48.879 --> 00:09:50.840 many of my books I do it with a co author, 164 00:09:51.240 --> 00:09:54.000 And often the co author is really is really the 165 00:09:54.080 --> 00:09:57.960 document expert with the Oswald puzzle, David Boyle, and is 166 00:09:58.000 --> 00:10:02.600 the fellow who had the had the intensity to essentially 167 00:10:03.080 --> 00:10:07.720 construct an organization chart of CIA operations in Miami. Now 168 00:10:07.720 --> 00:10:10.639 you've got to imagine that if I talk about slogging 169 00:10:10.679 --> 00:10:13.240 for me, it's even more for him. So it's it, 170 00:10:13.639 --> 00:10:17.639 and we talk with each other. We share information, like 171 00:10:17.679 --> 00:10:21.919 on the cryptonim busting, you know who ran across it? 172 00:10:22.000 --> 00:10:24.440 A real kind of an interesting thing is there that 173 00:10:24.720 --> 00:10:28.279 aliens and krypton ms were So we're done to confuse 174 00:10:28.320 --> 00:10:31.399 the Soviets. I mean, they're not done to confuse us 175 00:10:31.440 --> 00:10:34.279 and the documents, but they actually get to the point 176 00:10:34.320 --> 00:10:37.679 where they confuse the readers. So a CI officer will 177 00:10:37.720 --> 00:10:40.720 pencil in a little annotation going, oh, this is really 178 00:10:40.799 --> 00:10:43.639 this person or true name or whatever, kind of like, Okay, 179 00:10:43.679 --> 00:10:46.440 we got them. And those notes were never supposed to 180 00:10:46.519 --> 00:10:50.559 be on the documents, right, somebody's just trying to help themselves. 181 00:10:50.799 --> 00:10:53.080 When you start finding those, you make progress. 182 00:10:54.159 --> 00:10:56.320 So a lot of these documents are safe to say. 183 00:10:56.720 --> 00:10:59.279 They're encoded in some sort of way in case information 184 00:10:59.320 --> 00:11:01.600 gets leaked to foreign power, that way they won't be 185 00:11:01.679 --> 00:11:03.879 able to read it. But then at the same time, 186 00:11:03.919 --> 00:11:06.919 as a layman, a person who is not in the organization, 187 00:11:07.720 --> 00:11:11.399 you can sometimes take things for face value and then 188 00:11:11.440 --> 00:11:13.799 you're led off a completely wrong track. 189 00:11:14.559 --> 00:11:18.919 Yeah, absolutely if and you will make wrong assumptions. You 190 00:11:19.120 --> 00:11:23.000 maybe assume it's a different organization. One of the most 191 00:11:23.039 --> 00:11:27.120 fascinating things about him is to learn the distribution, who's 192 00:11:27.159 --> 00:11:31.519 getting what information, who's copied, what offices or what copied, 193 00:11:31.960 --> 00:11:35.200 what individuals or what copied. What's happening to the control 194 00:11:35.240 --> 00:11:38.440 of the information And in CIA, one of the things 195 00:11:38.440 --> 00:11:41.200 that's become very helpful to us in regard to le 196 00:11:41.320 --> 00:11:46.000 Avrey Oswald is to find out who is getting information 197 00:11:46.320 --> 00:11:48.679 on him at various points and times and who has 198 00:11:48.720 --> 00:11:52.639 been withhell from compartmentalization can tell you a lot. And 199 00:11:52.679 --> 00:11:55.720 what you find out in Oswald's case in particular, at 200 00:11:55.720 --> 00:11:58.879 different points of time, certain parts of the CIA are 201 00:11:58.919 --> 00:12:03.600 not telling other parts of the CAAA who ask about him. 202 00:12:04.039 --> 00:12:08.240 They're holding back information. And there's only one real interpretation 203 00:12:08.440 --> 00:12:12.440 for that, and that the organization holding the information is 204 00:12:13.279 --> 00:12:16.960 using not him as an agent, but using information about 205 00:12:17.000 --> 00:12:21.600 him for some purposes. So even even distribution can be informative. 206 00:12:23.240 --> 00:12:25.559 So not to throw the baby out with the bathwater, 207 00:12:25.600 --> 00:12:29.759 But can the documents be trusted Larry at all? 208 00:12:29.879 --> 00:12:33.879 Yeah, they can be trusted. Here's the thing is, the 209 00:12:33.919 --> 00:12:37.759 documents we're talking about are day to day operational documents. 210 00:12:38.360 --> 00:12:41.039 If people could not do their day job without them, 211 00:12:41.600 --> 00:12:45.120 and we know based on them and things that happen. Next, 212 00:12:45.200 --> 00:12:48.360 it's like things that were discussed in the documents did 213 00:12:48.399 --> 00:12:52.799 happen people that discussed You know, you can reality check 214 00:12:52.840 --> 00:12:57.919 the documents. Now. It is true that on occasion fake 215 00:12:58.080 --> 00:13:02.919 documents were creative, but usually the strange thing is the 216 00:13:02.960 --> 00:13:07.240 fake documents that we have found are generally created outside 217 00:13:07.279 --> 00:13:12.080 agencies for some other purpose, you know, to fool someone. 218 00:13:12.639 --> 00:13:16.200 We've even and it's very infrequent, but we've run a 219 00:13:16.320 --> 00:13:21.559 couple of cases where someone outside an agency will do 220 00:13:21.639 --> 00:13:25.480 a document, know enough to do a good document, and 221 00:13:25.519 --> 00:13:28.720 then actually go into the National Archives and plant it. 222 00:13:29.399 --> 00:13:32.120 The good news is, though, you can track that down 223 00:13:32.559 --> 00:13:36.960 because the National Archives, doing their job, has a record 224 00:13:37.039 --> 00:13:39.720 of all their intake, so they can go back and 225 00:13:39.799 --> 00:13:41.720 you and we work with them and it's kind of like, 226 00:13:41.960 --> 00:13:45.440 did you guys ever really take this document in? Nope, no, 227 00:13:45.480 --> 00:13:50.639 we didn't. Aha a case of a particular case of 228 00:13:50.679 --> 00:13:54.559 that is there's a document that circulates about every three years, 229 00:13:55.080 --> 00:13:58.759 seen it like eight times over the decades, and it's 230 00:13:58.799 --> 00:14:03.039 a document saying that Oswald was actually briefed by the 231 00:14:03.080 --> 00:14:07.559 Office and Naval Intelligence for going into Russia, and it's 232 00:14:07.559 --> 00:14:11.039 supposed to be a correspondence between you know, like senior 233 00:14:11.080 --> 00:14:14.399 people at both agencies. Well, now, first of all, that 234 00:14:14.440 --> 00:14:18.200 would never be written down. That's not standard operating practice 235 00:14:18.559 --> 00:14:22.440 to write an inner agency membo after the assassination to 236 00:14:22.559 --> 00:14:26.200 confirm this sort of thing, you know, doesn't happen. But 237 00:14:26.399 --> 00:14:30.639 as it turns out that document never existed in reality, 238 00:14:31.000 --> 00:14:36.279 it was planted to support somebody's books, somebody's story, whatever. 239 00:14:36.679 --> 00:14:39.120 But it can be checked, so we have devices to 240 00:14:39.200 --> 00:14:42.559 check that sort of thing. And people people often ask me, 241 00:14:42.600 --> 00:14:45.399 it's like, well, if somebody makes up a series of 242 00:14:45.480 --> 00:14:50.360 fake documents, would would is that illegal? And the interesting 243 00:14:50.440 --> 00:14:54.000 thing is, if there's no actual crime involved, no fraud, no, 244 00:14:54.639 --> 00:14:57.200 you know, it's sort of like if if it's not 245 00:14:57.360 --> 00:15:02.440 a real government document, there's nothing illegal about circulating it. 246 00:15:02.639 --> 00:15:07.399 If it was never classified, never a real document. You know, 247 00:15:07.759 --> 00:15:10.840 I can the FBI can investigate it. And we know 248 00:15:11.039 --> 00:15:13.919 instances where the FBI or the Air Force or someone 249 00:15:14.000 --> 00:15:18.159 has investigated a document and go it's bogus, and it's like, well, 250 00:15:18.200 --> 00:15:21.039 you're going to prosecute them. Well, it's not a crime 251 00:15:21.360 --> 00:15:24.639 because they didn't profit from it. They didn't. They just 252 00:15:25.120 --> 00:15:31.519 used it for self agran astisement or promoting themselves or 253 00:15:32.080 --> 00:15:35.960 gaining influence. So it's not a crime per se unless 254 00:15:36.159 --> 00:15:38.440 you can't prove it really is part of a fraud. 255 00:15:40.279 --> 00:15:42.720 That's actually pretty amazing and kind of scary at the 256 00:15:42.759 --> 00:15:47.799 same time, because it's just making me want to trust 257 00:15:47.799 --> 00:15:52.639 the government less because Hey, who's to say. I mean, 258 00:15:52.679 --> 00:15:55.399 that just opens up a whole can of worms. If 259 00:15:55.440 --> 00:15:59.120 you're able to insert information that, hey, it's not a 260 00:15:59.159 --> 00:16:03.360 crime technically, and they nothing happened. That's crazy, Larry, like, 261 00:16:03.399 --> 00:16:04.320 how that could happen? 262 00:16:05.159 --> 00:16:07.440 But we can find it. I guess that's the good news. 263 00:16:07.480 --> 00:16:12.519 You you ask, is it possible the government does check itself. 264 00:16:12.679 --> 00:16:15.960 I mean I think that's like the FBI can investigate. 265 00:16:16.200 --> 00:16:19.240 They will call in document experts. We're at the point 266 00:16:19.360 --> 00:16:21.559 I have friends who are experts enough to say, you know, 267 00:16:22.200 --> 00:16:24.840 is the record keeping in this document? It's a serial 268 00:16:24.960 --> 00:16:27.840 number ride every you know, look at this document? Is 269 00:16:27.840 --> 00:16:31.080 it right or it's wrong? So the government can investigate 270 00:16:31.120 --> 00:16:34.799 those sort of things. NARA controls it's archives and does 271 00:16:34.840 --> 00:16:37.320 a good job. Like I say, it was, it was 272 00:16:37.440 --> 00:16:40.960 easy to check that Oswald document. It didn't require a 273 00:16:40.960 --> 00:16:43.559 lot of time. It's just like Nara, this thing is 274 00:16:43.600 --> 00:16:46.120 floating around and people are saying, it's real. Did you 275 00:16:46.159 --> 00:16:51.159 ever hold this document? No, So there's you have to 276 00:16:51.200 --> 00:16:55.480 be cautious about, and frankly, you have to be cautious 277 00:16:55.600 --> 00:16:59.000 in the more sensational claims like that you mentioned earlier, 278 00:16:59.200 --> 00:17:01.360 Like one of the frauds that I was talking about 279 00:17:01.399 --> 00:17:03.159 had to do with the aliens at JFK. 280 00:17:03.919 --> 00:17:05.680 I mean, is there really a document saying that. 281 00:17:06.519 --> 00:17:10.079 There are there are actually documents saying that the government 282 00:17:10.200 --> 00:17:15.160 knew all about alien contact and had alien contact from 283 00:17:15.279 --> 00:17:19.480 nineteen forty seven. It's called the Majestic Series of Documents, 284 00:17:20.039 --> 00:17:25.079 and that JFK was going to expose this and and 285 00:17:25.160 --> 00:17:27.319 it's yeah, it's a whole thing in and of itself, 286 00:17:27.440 --> 00:17:30.519 so but you know, we've learned how to deal with 287 00:17:30.559 --> 00:17:33.240 that sort of thing. But yeah, you bet, Yeah, I'm 288 00:17:33.240 --> 00:17:35.200 sure you thought it was joking and where he's going, 289 00:17:35.240 --> 00:17:39.720 it's just a pain and a rear another alien JFK. 290 00:17:39.440 --> 00:17:42.799 Thing I was, I was kidding. I've heard I've heard 291 00:17:42.839 --> 00:17:45.680 that before, but I didn't know it was an actual thing. 292 00:17:46.440 --> 00:17:49.519 You know that there's actual documents and an idea that 293 00:17:49.559 --> 00:17:51.839 it could happen that And this is how little I've 294 00:17:51.880 --> 00:17:54.839 looked into the JFK assassination. And it's kind I'm kind 295 00:17:54.839 --> 00:17:57.680 of doing it backwards with your book because it's more 296 00:17:57.759 --> 00:18:00.400 on you know, you focus on more of Lee Harvey 297 00:18:00.440 --> 00:18:03.039 Oswald and you don't really get into the events of JFK, 298 00:18:03.240 --> 00:18:05.799 even though you have written about them. And I remember 299 00:18:06.839 --> 00:18:11.039 back in I think I was still in in high school, 300 00:18:11.359 --> 00:18:14.440 I read one of the many many books on the 301 00:18:14.559 --> 00:18:18.079 magic bullet. I think at one point where that again, 302 00:18:18.119 --> 00:18:20.400 that's a whole nother rabbit hole, and I don't even 303 00:18:20.440 --> 00:18:22.400 I don't ever think I finished it, but again that 304 00:18:22.480 --> 00:18:24.599 that's the whole thing. But I want to get your 305 00:18:24.720 --> 00:18:27.200 because I heard you. I watched a few of your interviews, 306 00:18:27.599 --> 00:18:30.279 and I heard you talk about memory and how memory 307 00:18:30.319 --> 00:18:33.279 can be tainted. And right off the bat in the 308 00:18:33.440 --> 00:18:38.279 forward by Rex Bradford, he gets into what the Attorney 309 00:18:38.359 --> 00:18:42.160 General wrote the White House, right, the public must be 310 00:18:42.279 --> 00:18:45.599 satisfied that Oswald was the assassin, that he did not 311 00:18:45.920 --> 00:18:50.079 have any did not have confederates who are still at large. 312 00:18:50.599 --> 00:18:55.480 Uh So the public must be what it say here, 313 00:18:55.559 --> 00:18:59.480 must be satisfied, like, Hey, this is what we're dishing out, 314 00:19:00.240 --> 00:19:03.160 this is what you're going to accept. But I've heard 315 00:19:03.160 --> 00:19:07.680 you talk about how memory itself can be tainted very easily. 316 00:19:07.759 --> 00:19:09.960 Can you talk a little bit about that, because it 317 00:19:10.039 --> 00:19:14.480 seems that history relies a lot on memory. And then 318 00:19:14.559 --> 00:19:18.559 if the people writing that history, if they're doing their 319 00:19:18.640 --> 00:19:21.279 due diligence, how you guys are doing double checking and 320 00:19:21.359 --> 00:19:23.680 fact checking all these documents. If they're not doing good 321 00:19:23.759 --> 00:19:27.079 job doing that, they weren't there to experience what happened. 322 00:19:27.359 --> 00:19:27.599 You know. 323 00:19:29.319 --> 00:19:32.960 There have been a lot of really good studies done 324 00:19:33.000 --> 00:19:36.799 on that, and what we learn is say, the experience 325 00:19:36.839 --> 00:19:41.640 of a witness is good for well, it's good until 326 00:19:41.640 --> 00:19:44.559 they start talking to other people. If you can catch 327 00:19:44.599 --> 00:19:48.279 them within an hour or so after the event, take 328 00:19:48.319 --> 00:19:51.720 a statement, get as much detail as you can, you're 329 00:19:51.759 --> 00:19:55.559 pretty good. But once they start circulating and talking to 330 00:19:55.599 --> 00:19:59.440 other people or listening to the news, they become less 331 00:19:59.440 --> 00:20:03.000 and less liable over time, and they essentially absorbed these 332 00:20:03.039 --> 00:20:08.720 things you're talking about gaining the narrative. People can absorb 333 00:20:08.839 --> 00:20:13.720 the narrative, just like because through media, through people, through 334 00:20:14.279 --> 00:20:17.279 We have people that first had witnesses within the first 335 00:20:17.359 --> 00:20:20.319 hour or two who describe things that they later go 336 00:20:20.480 --> 00:20:23.160 back and it stuns me. It's sort of like I've 337 00:20:23.160 --> 00:20:28.759 seen statements taken later by the Warrant Commission that says, well, 338 00:20:29.200 --> 00:20:31.240 I heard more than three shots, but I must have 339 00:20:31.319 --> 00:20:33.920 been wrong. Wait a minute, why do you think you 340 00:20:33.960 --> 00:20:38.680 were wrong? Because the narrative was that there can only 341 00:20:38.720 --> 00:20:41.160 be three shots, and they actually say this in interview, 342 00:20:41.200 --> 00:20:44.319 it's like, I know what I saw, but I must 343 00:20:44.319 --> 00:20:48.880 have been wrong. Well, no, that's not very useful. I'll 344 00:20:48.920 --> 00:20:52.720 give you a plastic example of that and how things 345 00:20:53.039 --> 00:20:56.279 can go bad, not from the JFK assass nation, but 346 00:20:56.359 --> 00:20:59.640 from the RK Asas nation. There was a young woman 347 00:20:59.720 --> 00:21:04.440 who named Santa Serrano, who saw people run away from 348 00:21:04.440 --> 00:21:08.920 the RFK assassination, heard them talk about actually laughing about 349 00:21:08.960 --> 00:21:12.960 the fact that they'd managed to kill RFK. She became 350 00:21:13.279 --> 00:21:19.119 a prime witness in that case. Ultimately she was disregarded 351 00:21:20.039 --> 00:21:24.599 because of a bogus polygraph test that was administered. The 352 00:21:24.720 --> 00:21:27.799 net was that the line was that she had been 353 00:21:27.839 --> 00:21:31.160 brought into a pantry and sat down with other witnesses, 354 00:21:31.720 --> 00:21:34.279 and she'd picked this whole story up from other people, 355 00:21:34.319 --> 00:21:38.240 and it was just it was not true. The problem was, 356 00:21:38.480 --> 00:21:42.759 for the official story is an assistant da out of 357 00:21:42.799 --> 00:21:47.359 Los Angeles had talked to her within minutes before she 358 00:21:47.519 --> 00:21:50.960 ever went anywhere else, and actually ended up writing number 359 00:21:51.119 --> 00:21:54.759 of letters saying she told him exactly what she said 360 00:21:54.880 --> 00:21:58.759 later before she could ever have been contaminated by anyone else. 361 00:22:00.960 --> 00:22:02.720 You have to be able to parse through that stuff. 362 00:22:02.720 --> 00:22:05.119 And they ignored her and they ignored him. After two 363 00:22:05.200 --> 00:22:07.759 or three letters, he just kind of gave up. And 364 00:22:07.759 --> 00:22:14.799 this isn't associate DA. But we've also learned in lots 365 00:22:14.799 --> 00:22:20.000 of experiments, for example, a classroom of students, a professor 366 00:22:20.119 --> 00:22:24.400 can perform and has done, perform experiments in a psychology 367 00:22:24.440 --> 00:22:28.480 class of having something unexpected happened at the part of 368 00:22:28.480 --> 00:22:30.799 the front of the room, in front of the whole class. 369 00:22:31.759 --> 00:22:35.720 Then he has them right down what they saw that day, 370 00:22:36.880 --> 00:22:39.200 open up that thing at the end of or having 371 00:22:39.240 --> 00:22:41.200 them write down at the end of semester what they 372 00:22:41.279 --> 00:22:45.759 recall seeing. Open up their letters, and they're going, well, 373 00:22:46.160 --> 00:22:49.720 I must have made a mistake when I write the 374 00:22:49.720 --> 00:22:54.640 The bottom line is interview witnesses on aspects of detail 375 00:22:54.799 --> 00:23:00.400 of an event weeks, months, years after the fact is 376 00:23:00.519 --> 00:23:04.359 very problematic and just get you in trouble. I'm surprised 377 00:23:04.440 --> 00:23:09.279 now that the new Congressional Committee on Disclosure is going 378 00:23:09.319 --> 00:23:13.279 to Dallas to interview witnesses. You know, it's way too late. 379 00:23:14.079 --> 00:23:17.240 You know they if you go back to their first 380 00:23:17.319 --> 00:23:20.359 day state, let's take those. Don't interview them now. You're 381 00:23:20.400 --> 00:23:23.079 not going to get You're going to get overlays. 382 00:23:24.799 --> 00:23:27.720 They really went back because one of the main things 383 00:23:27.759 --> 00:23:30.240 I saw keeping up with the news is that I 384 00:23:30.279 --> 00:23:34.440 think Trump unclassified a ton of new documents. Have you 385 00:23:34.720 --> 00:23:36.599 had a chance to look through those? Have you your 386 00:23:36.599 --> 00:23:39.599 colleagues looked through those? Is there any new information that 387 00:23:39.680 --> 00:23:42.519 would perhaps change the outcome of this book at all, 388 00:23:42.599 --> 00:23:45.960 or is there any new revelation that has come from 389 00:23:45.960 --> 00:23:46.400 that at all? 390 00:23:47.279 --> 00:23:50.480 Well, what's what has happened is he wrote a directive 391 00:23:50.559 --> 00:23:54.480 that literally said, and then the interest of disclosure. Within 392 00:23:55.119 --> 00:23:58.720 fifteen days, I'm appointed a team under the Director of 393 00:23:58.799 --> 00:24:04.839 National Intelligence to come up with a plan to release documents. 394 00:24:04.880 --> 00:24:07.599 Supposedly they submitted it to the White House. We've seen 395 00:24:07.640 --> 00:24:11.160 nothing about it. Within forty five days. There was to 396 00:24:11.200 --> 00:24:15.079 be a plan to address MLK. The first plan was 397 00:24:15.160 --> 00:24:19.359 just JFK, MLK and RFK. We've seen nothing of either 398 00:24:19.400 --> 00:24:22.400 of those. We've see no DO documents. And one of 399 00:24:22.440 --> 00:24:24.720 the troubling things is if you look at like the 400 00:24:24.799 --> 00:24:28.160 fine print in that directive, it also says that the 401 00:24:28.279 --> 00:24:33.359