Speaker 1: It's the Lapsed Fan Wrestling podcast special report.
Speaker 2: The Lapse Fan presents the Complete Hull Coogan, a real
Speaker 2: American story brought to you by Garage Pierre al Gpa.
Speaker 1: As you know what, we're trying to really get as
Speaker 1: much of the flavor of what the WWF Hul Cokein
Speaker 1: worked in his first run in New York in on
Speaker 1: the complete Hull Cooke.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, I mean that's the only way we can we
Speaker 3: can call, we can claim take the claim to be the.
Speaker 4: Complete Hull cook That's right.
Speaker 1: And we have watched so many matches, yes, the promos
Speaker 1: from Allentown and Hamburg, PA, where they did their TV
Speaker 1: at the time, and when it wasn't Joe McHugh on
Speaker 1: the microphone, it was the one and only superstar ww
Speaker 1: announcer as well Gary Michael Capetta ringing in Hogan and
Speaker 1: the rest of the casting characters that existed in seventy
Speaker 1: nine to eighty one. And we have mister Kapetta here,
Speaker 1: the author of Body Slams Memoirs of a Wrestling Pitchman,
Speaker 1: highly recommended, a wrestling book that's been out there for
Speaker 1: some time, and we've talked about it many times over
Speaker 1: the course of the show, and we're really privileged to
Speaker 1: have Gary in with us here on the complete Gary,
Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining us. Okay, right off
Speaker 1: the top, Gary, we'd love your memories of what it
Speaker 1: was like in the circuit at the time we're talking
Speaker 1: about seventy nine to eighty one, or of course the tapings.
Speaker 1: I think every three weeks, Gary, did you announce the
Speaker 1: Hamburg or the Allentown shows?
Speaker 5: When I first started, I.
Speaker 2: Yeah, at the Philadelphia Arena, and after about a year
Speaker 2: and a half I switched over to Hamburg and I
Speaker 2: was in Hamburg. The Philadelphia shows were every third Tuesday night.
Speaker 2: The Hamburg shows were every third Wednesday night. So it
Speaker 2: was I think it was probably eight years all together,
Speaker 2: and the first year and a half was in Philadelphia
Speaker 2: and then the rest of that stretch was in Hamburg.
Speaker 4: Pretty good.
Speaker 1: So what was it like if you can recall anything
Speaker 1: about Whenhult came in, do you remember buzz around him?
Speaker 1: What was it like announcing him?
Speaker 5: M Well, no, my only reference would be would.
Speaker 2: Come from seeing ah, you know, seeing videos today of
Speaker 2: what happened back then. Sure, back then there wasn't anything
Speaker 2: special about him.
Speaker 5: He's the first time he came in.
Speaker 2: He wore a cape which was like a silk, multi
Speaker 2: colored cape, which I thought was kind of chintzy and
Speaker 2: cheap looking. But no, there was nothing special other than
Speaker 2: you know, his side. He was a big guy, and
Speaker 2: I knew that they were pushing him because they gave
Speaker 2: him a manager. But no, there was nothing, nothing special
Speaker 2: about him at all.
Speaker 1: Very interesting. So what degree did did you have interactions
Speaker 1: with the talent before you went to the ring to announced?
Speaker 1: Did you have to converse with them backstage at all
Speaker 1: or did you just show up and start doing your announcing.
Speaker 2: Well, at the time, I was teaching school and I
Speaker 2: was three hours away by car, so by the time
Speaker 2: that I got to the arena, it usually would only
Speaker 2: be within a half hour before we started taping. And
Speaker 2: on those nights we did three TV hours, so that's
Speaker 2: eighteen matches wow wow, and at least one dark match,
Speaker 2: which was at the end of the night, which was
Speaker 2: a competitive have matched, And that was to draw the
Speaker 2: people to the show and to keep them to the end.
Speaker 5: So I and this was the first place that.
Speaker 2: New people to the territory would come because they would
Speaker 2: be put on TV before it's sent around to the
Speaker 2: local arenas, so I had to get information about them
Speaker 2: because I had never introduced them before. There wasn't much
Speaker 2: time to interact with anybody, and there was maybe six
Speaker 2: to eight minute intermissions in between the first and the
Speaker 2: second hour, and then the second and the third hour,
Speaker 2: and I would always change because I didn't want to
Speaker 2: be seen wearing the same clothes two weeks in a row. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so I to answer your question for all those res
Speaker 2: since I didn't have much interaction with the restlers.
Speaker 1: As we've watched all these shows, Gary and JP can
Speaker 1: certainly attest to this. Jp, we note the differences between
Speaker 1: when Hulk is called the fabulous, yes, when he's called
Speaker 1: the incredible And I don't know Michael if Gary, sorry
Speaker 1: if you can remember, remember this part of it. But
Speaker 1: we muse endlessly about how some weeks, either you or
Speaker 1: Joe refer to him. Well, actually, if Gary, you were
Speaker 1: the one who took the note apparently to call him
Speaker 1: the fabulous whole Cogan, Joe would call me incredible Hull Cogan,
Speaker 1: and then Vince on commentary would correct him and say
Speaker 1: the fabulous whole Cogan. I mean, do you remember that
Speaker 1: specific note?
Speaker 2: No? No, okay, Now, as I sit here today. It's
Speaker 2: it's insignificant.
Speaker 5: But yeah, I know there was no big deal. It
Speaker 5: was I received.
Speaker 2: Let me think a second, sure, hmm, Maybe I did
Speaker 2: not receive anything printed. There was a list of the
Speaker 2: matches that was taped to the wall, and there probably
Speaker 2: was nothing. There was nothing typed out, so I would
Speaker 2: just get the information from the wall and when I
Speaker 2: would talk to the wrestler the first time he came in,
Speaker 2: he gave me where he was from, when he weighed,
Speaker 2: and if there was anything special about introducing him, and
Speaker 2: I guess it was at that point that I learned
Speaker 2: if he had a manager, who was manager was and
Speaker 2: then if there was, then I never would check back
Speaker 2: with him like in the coming takings, and if there
Speaker 2: was any change to be made, they let me know
Speaker 2: that there was a change.
Speaker 5: Otherwise I wouldn't I wouldn't know.
Speaker 4: Cool. So it's good to know that's how it worked.
Speaker 1: The reason we've talked about it Gary over the weeks
Speaker 1: as we've looked at Hult's career is when he first
Speaker 1: started out in Alabama in the spring of seventy nine,
Speaker 1: he was called the Hulk for the first time, and
Speaker 1: that was clearly a ripoff of what was going on
Speaker 1: with lu Frigno and the Incredible Hulk at the time.
Speaker 1: Ripoff is, you know, not the best way to put it,
Speaker 1: but that's where they got it from, and I think
Speaker 1: there was some sensitivity. We talked to Charlie Platt, who
Speaker 1: did the television announcing down there back then, and there
Speaker 1: was a bit of sensitivity about, you know, Marvel coming
Speaker 1: after them on copyright grounds if they called him the
Speaker 1: Incredible Hulk, which of course was a character in the
Speaker 1: Marvel series. So we wondered if at any point there
Speaker 1: was word to you guys as announcers, as the voices
Speaker 1: of the show, that we don't want to call him incredible,
Speaker 1: we want to call him fabulous. Maybe interchange the two
Speaker 1: so that we can't be accused of, you know, trying
Speaker 1: to use someone else's copyright.
Speaker 5: If that was the case, I was not aware of it.
Speaker 4: Very good, fair enough.
Speaker 1: So here you are announcing these shows and we were
Speaker 1: at the Spectrum one time he was wrestling on and
Speaker 1: there was a little bit of jostling while you're holding
Speaker 1: the microphone. Holt kind of gets in your face, and
Speaker 1: I think even kind of gives you a little bit
Speaker 1: of a shove. Do you remember anything like that where
Speaker 1: you were in the ring and wrestlers Hogan or anybody
Speaker 1: else would kind of jump at you and try to
Speaker 1: get some heat by giving you a hard time. Was
Speaker 1: that talked about ahead of time? I was curious about that.
Speaker 5: Everything was spontaneous.
Speaker 1: So how did you handle that? If he's coming at
Speaker 1: you like that?
Speaker 2: Just do what makes sense. That's that's the bottom line.
Speaker 2: If you do what's logical.
Speaker 5: If if.
Speaker 2: You're five eight and one hundred and fifty pounds and
Speaker 2: this three hundred pound guy who's let's say six four
Speaker 2: or five six comes after you, what.
Speaker 5: Would you do? Just do it? Just do what's logical.
Speaker 3: Run away, get out of the arena, go as far
Speaker 3: away as possible for me?
Speaker 4: Is I would? I would leave the arena never to
Speaker 4: be seen again.
Speaker 5: You just watched what I did, and that's what was logical.
Speaker 1: Yep, yep, that was That was fascinating to know that
Speaker 1: that was spontaneous, because yeah, that's that's where the're putting
Speaker 1: folks on the spot. But they it was a different
Speaker 1: business back then. I'd imagine if you haven't.
Speaker 5: I wouldn't want to know, right, I wouldn't want to
Speaker 5: know I had interactions with George Steele, Jimmy Snooka, Mousse, Monroe, Hogan, Andre,
Speaker 5: you know, just spur Mike Sharp, Just things happen, and.
Speaker 2: Sometimes the decisions that they make are spur of the
Speaker 2: moment decisions and it's up to me to react however,
Speaker 2: you know, whatever is appropriate.
Speaker 4: All right, good?
Speaker 1: Can you tell us about Joe McHugh, your dealings with him?
Speaker 4: What kind of guy he was?
Speaker 1: He's an interesting character in this time period in WWF.
Speaker 2: I didn't have dealings with Joe. There was no for
Speaker 2: the two of us to be at the same place
Speaker 2: at the same time.
Speaker 1: Oh never, okay, understood? Yeah, well it was his was
Speaker 1: he sort of with the commission in terms of why
Speaker 1: he got assigned to shows? I had the understanding that
Speaker 1: the WWF, if they had their choice, might not have
Speaker 1: used him as much as they did. Did you get
Speaker 1: any sense of that in your time there?
Speaker 5: I don't know, because I wasn't around him at all. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Well, one character that's around quite a bit. Character perhaps
Speaker 1: isn't the greatest word, but is doctor George Zaharni, and
Speaker 1: you see him front row on a ton of these
Speaker 1: shows in this time period. What was your sense of
Speaker 1: George and kind of what he was he was there
Speaker 1: to do, and to what degree were you surprised when
Speaker 1: all the controversy happened with him.
Speaker 5: I wasn't surprised.
Speaker 2: I mean, he he had you know, he was freely
Speaker 2: distributing drugs to the guys, and yeah, I mean, and
Speaker 2: that's what he was accused and convicted of, So there
Speaker 2: was no surprise. Once again, I didn't have any interaction
Speaker 2: with him. He was a little bit of a ham
Speaker 2: you know. You can tell. You can tell, I mean
Speaker 2: especially if you if you watch the show now and
Speaker 2: you take a look at it back then. At the time,
Speaker 2: I didn't necessarily like watching myself on television, so I
Speaker 2: wasn't watching the TV show. But now when I take
Speaker 2: a look at it, I see, you know, for instance,
Speaker 2: there might be a certain referee who just happens every
Speaker 2: time I'm introducing someone who happens to be right behind me.
Speaker 2: You know that that's not that just doesn't happen. He's
Speaker 2: positioning himself so he gets on camera, So.
Speaker 1: He gets on camera. That I'm glad for that color
Speaker 1: because I did wonder if he had to sit right there,
Speaker 1: you know, hard camera, right in the center, so to speak,
Speaker 1: and of course he did angles. You might remember the
Speaker 1: night he didn't get involved with Eddie Gilbert got pile
Speaker 1: driven on the floor and he did like a fiery
Speaker 1: promo like he was a manager or something.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I have no memory of that, Okay.
Speaker 1: When it comes to Backland, Backland was the champion at
Speaker 1: the time that Hogan came in, of course, and they
Speaker 1: worked together, particularly in the earliest days of Hogan's arrival,
Speaker 1: and some of the matches we've seen were quite good.
Speaker 1: Can you take us back to any memories you have
Speaker 1: of sort of the energy Backland was able to create
Speaker 1: in the arenas at this time period and how different
Speaker 1: it was than a Bruno or a Hogan.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I h it was less. I mean I can't. Yeah,
Speaker 5: I don't. When you say create energy, I don't even
Speaker 5: associate that with Backlind.
Speaker 4: That's a good point.
Speaker 5: With Runo, there was.
Speaker 2: The reaction of the fans came from their heart and
Speaker 2: it was an emotional reaction. Reaction to Hogan now starting
Speaker 2: to use music was more of a this is a
Speaker 2: cool thing to do, and the reaction came more from
Speaker 2: their brain as opposed there to their heart. And so
Speaker 2: there were energies, but different kinds of energies. I don't
Speaker 2: associate either of those with with Backland. And it's not
Speaker 2: that people didn't care. People care, but it was it
Speaker 2: wasn't as deep. I guess that's how I would put it.
Speaker 4: Very good.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that is a perfect way to put it, I think,
Speaker 1: because you hear so much about you know, he was
Speaker 1: howdy doty, he was boring, he was he wasn't, you know,
Speaker 1: the most charismatic force, of course, coming after Superstar. But
Speaker 1: then Gary, we go back and watch these matches JP
Speaker 1: and in some cases it's like he's got the house
Speaker 1: on fire.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 4: It's like it's hard for us, not.
Speaker 1: Sitting in the seats in the arenas at the time,
Speaker 1: to see what people are even talking about with him.
Speaker 1: I get that he's dull looking and sounding, but the
Speaker 1: crowd seems excited for him.
Speaker 3: And I was surprised actually in some of the matches
Speaker 3: at how fast paced he was because I'm you know,
Speaker 3: I'm a kid of the nineties, and so I remember
Speaker 3: watching him and like in the early nineties when he
Speaker 3: first made his come back to w W, and he's
Speaker 3: being kind of slow and not exciting, and and I
Speaker 3: was surprised at how at the level he was able
Speaker 3: to bring Hulk Hogan up to in the ring.
Speaker 5: Well, of the three of them, he's the best wrestler.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like, technically, there's there's no doubt about that. But
Speaker 2: the best wrestler doesn't always sell the most tickets.
Speaker 4: Of course, that's true.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And that's another kind of head scratcher with Bob
Speaker 1: because you know, while the Garden wasn't teeming at the
Speaker 1: brim like it was with Bruno, in terms of attendance,
Speaker 1: for Bob he did quite well too. His Garden attendances
Speaker 1: were pretty solid. It's it's a fascinating run that doesn't
Speaker 1: get talked about a lot. And of course mentioned he
Speaker 1: took the belt off Superstar. What did you think Gary
Speaker 1: about Superstar Graham versus hul Cochin. I don't know if
Speaker 1: you ever thought about the two in contrast but or
Speaker 1: in comparison, but it really looks and sounds like Hulk
Speaker 1: was taking so much from Superstar at the time that
Speaker 1: they maybe even saw Hulk as a replacement for Superstar,
Speaker 1: who wasn't even in the mix at the time Hulk
Speaker 1: came in in seventy nine. Did you think that a
Speaker 1: Hulk was you know, maybe too much of an imitation
Speaker 1: of Billy Graham.
Speaker 2: The Hulk, Well, just just my opinion, he was more manufactured.
Speaker 5: He was more manufactured by management.
Speaker 2: So I'm not saying that the way Superstar League Grant
Speaker 2: presented himself was natural or the way he the way
Speaker 2: you know he ordinarily would be, but that all came
Speaker 2: from him, and I think Hogan was more of a creation,
Speaker 2: an external creation.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a very stude point. Yeah, that's sort of
Speaker 1: what I meant by that could sound like an imitation.
Speaker 1: Is with Graham, you could tell it was coming from
Speaker 1: his gut, coming from this sort of you know, idea
Speaker 1: he had created of how he talks and how it
Speaker 1: carries himself, and it did come off natural. Hogan, it
Speaker 1: seemed like he was really trying to do his best
Speaker 1: to have the same intonation as Billy Graham, really sound
Speaker 1: exactly like him. And that's exactly what it is. He's
Speaker 1: sort of being being told or telling himself to mold
Speaker 1: himself to that model.
Speaker 2: When so, I guess the question is which to which
Speaker 2: I don't have the answer is if you are correct,
Speaker 2: and I don't know, I don't know anything that would
Speaker 2: contradict what you just said. Why didn't they just stick
Speaker 2: with superstar Billy Graham?
Speaker 4: Yeah, I know.
Speaker 1: I think not not to get to the history lessons,
Speaker 1: because I'm not an expert in all this, but I
Speaker 1: think Billy kind of left after they put the title
Speaker 1: on Backland in seventy eight. I don't know if you
Speaker 1: remember much of this, but Billy was very vocal in
Speaker 1: his book and in interviews before his passing about how
Speaker 1: vehemently against losing the title he was to Backland in
Speaker 1: that he thought he was really rolling, you know, that
Speaker 1: the garden was sold out. The people, even though he
Speaker 1: was a heel, were showing up just in as much
Speaker 1: of a droves as they would for a Bruno in
Speaker 1: some ways, and he really did. He kind of felt
Speaker 1: slighted by the fact that they stuck with this concrete
Speaker 1: plan to put the belt on Bob Backland at a
Speaker 1: day and time certain, even though he had more than
Speaker 1: earned the chance to see how much further he could
Speaker 1: take it. So I don't know if that jobs with
Speaker 1: your recollection, Gary, but I think it was less that
Speaker 1: they got rid of Graham and more that he skipped
Speaker 1: town because he was frustrated by that decision. But maybe
Speaker 1: it's more complicated than that.
Speaker 4: I don't know.
Speaker 2: I'm looking at you're you're saying that he left town
Speaker 2: after they made the decision, and I'm saying, why did
Speaker 2: they make that decision? So I agree, So, I you know,
Speaker 2: I agree with his with his take on things.
Speaker 5: I would have been frustrated too.
Speaker 2: I can understand where he's coming from, especially if you.
Speaker 5: Fast forward and knowing that.
Speaker 2: After Backland's run, that the next law run was someone
Speaker 2: who who's appeal was even though it was manufactured, it
Speaker 2: was along the same lines of what brought to the table.
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, you can't you can't stick with me, but
Speaker 1: you can go with him. Perhaps the difference then, Garrett,
Speaker 1: I'd love your thoughts on this to the degree you
Speaker 1: were able to observe it. Seventy eight we're talking Vince Senior.
Speaker 1: Eighty four when Hulk is made, We're talking Vince Junior.
Speaker 1: You know, how did that transition land in your kind
Speaker 1: of awareness? Did those changes you know, become evident to
Speaker 1: you over time that Vince Junior is really the one
Speaker 1: who has bought this thing. I think it was an
Speaker 1: eighty two and it is kind of steering the ship.
Speaker 2: Now not from the creative side of things, because in
Speaker 2: order to be in the know on that, you would
Speaker 2: have to be behind the scenes in their meetings and
Speaker 2: on their eavesdropped in their telephone calls between the partner.
Speaker 2: So I don't think there's anybody who other than there's
Speaker 2: nobody alive today other than Vinnie who would know that
Speaker 2: answer to that question. But I definitely saw the changes
Speaker 2: and how they affected me, which the main one was
Speaker 2: grillamant Soon losing his partnership status affected me because I
Speaker 2: was brought into wrestling by grillam on Soon, and I
Speaker 2: was kept working by grillam on Soon, and I was
Speaker 2: put on TV and kept on TV by Grilla Monson.
Speaker 2: So when Grilla mon Soon lost his power, I lost
Speaker 2: my position.
Speaker 3: You were pretty tack with girl, Yes, how how far
Speaker 3: by did that relationship.
Speaker 2: Go nineteen seventy four when he was he brought me
Speaker 2: into wrestling?
Speaker 3: Did did you ever partake in his Italian sandwiches that
Speaker 3: I've heard so much about? We've heard so much.
Speaker 2: About Italian sandwiches that I have no memory of that.
Speaker 5: He's a lapsed fan.
Speaker 1: Wrestling podcast with Jack and Carnacio and JP.
Speaker 5: Soorro he's a lapsed fan.
Speaker 1: Wrestling podcast Brent Solomon just came out with a book
Speaker 1: and he talked about how Gorilla would famously slap together
Speaker 1: sandwiches on the road and it was kind of a
Speaker 1: it was kind of a luxurious thing to travel with
Speaker 1: him because he, you know, obviously insisted on the finest
Speaker 1: foods in some ways.
Speaker 2: Well, I read and I participated in Brian's book. But
Speaker 2: you just answered the question you said on the road.
Speaker 2: I was teaching school at the time. I wasn't on
Speaker 2: the road.
Speaker 4: Just showing up at the tapings, right. Yeah, we noticed that.
Speaker 1: I noticed going back through Hogan's career, saw that really
Speaker 1: one of the first people that was fed to him
Speaker 1: was Gorilla. He pinned Gorilla very early in that run.
Speaker 1: I think it was as early as February of nineteen
Speaker 1: eighty after coming in in November of seventy nine. Do
Speaker 1: you have any memories of talking to Gorilla Gary about
Speaker 1: kind of where he saw his role establishing new guys
Speaker 1: in the territory like that or was that just something
Speaker 1: for Hogan.
Speaker 5: I'm not understanding your question.
Speaker 1: When new guys would come into the territory, would they
Speaker 1: often be put over Gorilla to establish themselves as challengers
Speaker 1: to the champion.
Speaker 5: When you say put over, you mean would they lose?
Speaker 5: Would they beat Gorilla? Is that what you're saying?
Speaker 4: That's right? Yeah, pardon me, Yes, would they beat Gorilla? Often?
Speaker 4: Did he see that as part of his role?
Speaker 5: Hey, there are two Gorillas.
Speaker 2: There's the wrestler guerrilla, uh, and there's management Gorilla. That's
Speaker 2: why I didn't understand your question. I guess the answer
Speaker 2: is sometimes, But they were, you know, they were always once.
Speaker 2: Once Gorilla was more was closer to retirement, then he
Speaker 2: would have been and you're what you're what, you're really.
Speaker 5: Stepping stone to the champion. Yes, and yes, I.
Speaker 2: Mean sometimes he would. He would serve and you know,
Speaker 2: in that role. So then he would have been not
Speaker 2: necessarily a headliner by then, but like a semi final wrestler.
Speaker 5: And that would be.
Speaker 2: Those would be the guys, the semi final wrestlers would
Speaker 2: be the guys that do the job for well, he
Speaker 2: really do the job. It really sounds one sided. I
Speaker 2: don't meet a one sided kind of battle. But they
Speaker 2: would lose to the new guy in the territory to
Speaker 2: establish his credibility excellent, very good.
Speaker 1: We know from books that have come out in the
Speaker 1: past several years, really that Vince Junior, Vinnie took over
Speaker 1: and bought the company from his dad in eighty two.
Speaker 1: That's when all the paperwork was passed. But I think
Speaker 1: a lot of the fans thought it really didn't happen
Speaker 1: until maybe late eighty three eighty four, because that's when
Speaker 1: you really started to see the talent raids and a
Speaker 1: lot of the other aggressive moves. And of course Vince
Speaker 1: Senior died in eighty four. Do you remember being at
Speaker 1: the tapings and such as you were at that time
Speaker 1: period buzz about Vinnie actually buying the whole company or
Speaker 1: did he have his hands on it before people really
Speaker 1: realize that.
Speaker 2: I said, the only way it affected me where I
Speaker 2: worked and how often I worked.
Speaker 1: Yeah, when it comes to not Joe MQ. When it
Speaker 1: comes to the tapings, and we noticed that the fans
Speaker 1: hit the ring with autograph seekers. You know, they have
Speaker 1: their posters, they have their programs and things like that.
Speaker 1: That's obviously lost history. You don't see that anymore. Fans
Speaker 1: can't get anywhere near the ring. They're actually tackled if
Speaker 1: they do. How did that all work? You know, what
Speaker 1: was the understanding between the audience and the wwfs to
Speaker 1: when they could hit the ring like that.
Speaker 4: What we were curious about.
Speaker 5: That in between matches once.
Speaker 2: Once the wrestlers started being introduced fans, we'd go back
Speaker 2: to their seats.
Speaker 5: That's the way it was back from when I was
Speaker 5: a little boy and going to the matches in the sixties.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so you would, you would, I mean, and you
Speaker 2: either knew enough or a local policeman who would be
Speaker 2: serving as security quote unquote security for the night, would
Speaker 2: you know, would say, hey, kids, you know, back to
Speaker 2: your seats.
Speaker 5: Back to your seats. It was he just knew that.
Speaker 5: That's how it worked.
Speaker 3: Not not to get too far off topic, but it
Speaker 3: just made me think, what was your what was maybe
Speaker 3: your favorite moment going to matches as a kid, or
Speaker 3: any specific memory.
Speaker 5: There was.
Speaker 2: Asbury Bark Convention Hall was the first place and I
Speaker 2: was brought to wrestling, and then after that I went
Speaker 2: to various mostly there were armories in northern New Jersey
Speaker 2: and one match in particular was and they would the
Speaker 2: promotion would do this, not often at all, I mean
Speaker 2: it was very seldom, but it was a six man
Speaker 2: tag match and Bruno San Martino.
Speaker 5: He was my guy, he was my hero.
Speaker 2: And so he was in the six man tag and
Speaker 2: these were three out of five fall matches and he
Speaker 2: got hurt badly in I think it was the first fall,
Speaker 2: could have been the second fall, so badly that they
Speaker 2: took him from the ring. He was bleeding and he
Speaker 2: went back to the locker room and the match continued.
Speaker 5: So it was three on two.
Speaker 2: And eventually it came to the rubber match and Bruno, miraculously,
Speaker 2: with a bandage around his head, would.
Speaker 5: Would shoot from the locker room.
Speaker 2: Remember we didn't have stages, you know, the guy would
Speaker 2: just come down the aisles and he came back into
Speaker 2: the match to win the match. And probably as a kid,
Speaker 2: that was the most exciting event that I witnessed. Imagine
Speaker 2: as a fan, I also want to Shay Stadium, you know,
Speaker 2: to to that into you know, a huge I guess
Speaker 2: that was Bruno versus Pedro, But as far as what
Speaker 2: really got me into the moment and the excitement, it
Speaker 2: would have been that six man tag match.
Speaker 3: I imagine that there were many people, if not all the
Speaker 3: people in the audience that night who lost their voices
Speaker 3: after Bruno came back in after getting injured.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, it was, it was. It was just wonderful.
Speaker 3: We were you close with Bruno during your time.
Speaker 5: I became close with Bruno. Yeah, during my time and after.
Speaker 2: We had interactions all the way through into the nineties.
Speaker 2: When I was with w CW, Bruno was brought in
Speaker 2: a couple of times to referee matches in w CW.
Speaker 5: He also was there for the Him and Andre were
Speaker 5: there for the I guess it was twenty fifth anniversary
Speaker 5: of wrestling on TBS, Yeah, which we did out of
Speaker 5: the Center stage in Atlanta. And Yeah, and I we
Speaker 5: socialized after the show. They had an after party. And then.
Speaker 2: A little later on when I left w CW, I
Speaker 2: did some voiceover work in New York for they had
Speaker 2: had at the time the nine hundred wrestling lines and
Speaker 2: they had the nine hundred boxing lines, and there was
Speaker 2: need for me to talk to Bruno about how to
Speaker 2: pronounce certain Italian towns where the boxers in particular were from.
Speaker 2: And yeah, and I'm trying to remember whether or not
Speaker 2: it's possible that he was.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Bruno also was brought into Ring of Honor when
Speaker 2: I worked. That's when I did the backtrage interviewing with
Speaker 2: Ring of Honor, and I think he was in New
Speaker 2: York City. Yeah, so I had a relationship with Bruno
Speaker 2: through all those years.
Speaker 3: Wow, did you ever have the privilege of going to
Speaker 3: his home?
Speaker 5: Not Bruno? No, I didn't.
Speaker 2: I didn't announce in Pittsburgh when.
Speaker 5: I was with w w F.
Speaker 2: When I was with w c W, I was on
Speaker 2: the road and there were one night ers and we
Speaker 2: were in and out. It wasn't like my relationship with
Speaker 2: Curl Monsoon, who we both lived in the same state,
Speaker 2: about an hour away, and with Monsoon I would socialize
Speaker 2: and get to know him and his family, not so
Speaker 2: much with Bruno.
Speaker 1: That's terrific. You mentioned the Shae Stadium. It was actually
Speaker 1: seventy two pedro versus Bruno. What was it like watching
Speaker 1: matches at Shaye Stadium, Gary.
Speaker 2: That's not my favorite kind of thing to do, whether
Speaker 2: it's whether it's wrestling or whether it's a concert. It's
Speaker 2: a little bit removed. Yeah, And if memory serves me correctly,
Speaker 2: wasn't that a one hour match?
Speaker 4: Yes, the Curfew draw, I think it was seventy five minutes.
Speaker 5: So that was you know, that was kind of tough
Speaker 5: to sit through.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a lot to ask. It didn't happen to
Speaker 1: rain that night, did it? That's always the big fear.
Speaker 5: I don't remember.
Speaker 1: They did Shay three times seventy two, they did it
Speaker 1: in seventy six when they had the Ali Enoki match,
Speaker 1: and then I think Andre wrestled Chuck Webner, and then
Speaker 1: in nineteen eighty for the last time, they did it
Speaker 1: Bruno versus Abesco and Hogan versus Andre. Were you perchance
Speaker 1: at any of those? Just the first one, the very
Speaker 1: first one, Okay, very good, Yeah, because we were always
Speaker 1: wondering what unique challenges it might present to a ring announcer.
Speaker 1: Vince Junior actually does the ring announcing for the nineteen
Speaker 1: eighty one. To be in a stadium like that, it
Speaker 1: must be much a much different proposition than announcing at
Speaker 1: a at the Hamburg tapings.
Speaker 2: Now, I guess the closest I can come to. I
Speaker 2: did some of the domes, not that we not that
Speaker 2: we ever had in w c W, and not that
Speaker 2: we ever filled the dome. But I remember Flair Steamboat
Speaker 2: in New Orleans Super the super Dome. I remember, Oh,
Speaker 2: let's see, maybe Toronto had a dome, the Hubert H.
Speaker 5: Humphrey Metro Dome with.
Speaker 2: The A W A Super Super Clash maybe two.
Speaker 5: I announced that the Dome in Houston. Yeah, no, I.
Speaker 2: With what I did, there wasn't much. I didn't change
Speaker 2: it up. I didn't change what I did. It really
Speaker 2: wasn't necessary. You know, in those with those shows there
Speaker 2: were only I don't know, maybe twelve thousand people tops,
Speaker 2: so we're not talking eighty thousand as you see today
Speaker 2: with WWE.
Speaker 1: Joran' also not open air like in Chase Stadium, which
Speaker 1: is a different deal as well.
Speaker 5: Bruno would do comments true.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, WWF had Bruno in the chair announcing when
Speaker 1: Hogan first came in. He was there for a few
Speaker 1: years with Vince and then he left the chair and
Speaker 1: Pat Patterson did the announcing. Could you tell us anything
Speaker 1: about why you think Bruno and Pat switch rolls there
Speaker 1: and towards the end of eighty if you remember that
Speaker 1: at all.
Speaker 2: Once again, that was an executive decision. You'd have to
Speaker 2: be in the room, you'd have to.
Speaker 5: I could.
Speaker 2: My guess is Bruno did what Bruno wanted to do,
Speaker 2: and for whatever reason, Bruno, and you know, he was
Speaker 2: vocal about his dissatisfaction with the direction of what was
Speaker 2: going on in the ring, and that's probably why he
Speaker 2: wanted to distance himself from it.
Speaker 1: It's interesting, Gary, mean, he said, what's going on in
Speaker 1: the ring? What do you mean by that?
Speaker 5: The style of wrestling.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's interesting to watch the contrast and styles at
Speaker 1: the time because Hogan comes in and pretty much just
Speaker 1: he just bulldozes these guys and two on one matches
Speaker 1: and it's it's really it's it's really not much to
Speaker 1: look at. Do you think that that's kind of what
Speaker 1: Bruno would take issue with? Some of these matches were
Speaker 1: just so so formulaic and just not technical at all.
Speaker 2: Not necessarily about it being technical, because Bruno wasn't.
Speaker 5: A technical wrestler. He was he was.
Speaker 2: More in favor of wrestling being emphasized and less in
Speaker 2: favor of entertainment being.
Speaker 5: Emphasized.
Speaker 2: His philosophy was more that people should be entertained by
Speaker 2: the wrestling, not that you know, not that they shouldn't
Speaker 2: be entertainment, because no one would come if there was
Speaker 2: it wasn't entertaining.
Speaker 5: And also he was turned off by what he saw.
Speaker 2: Backstage with the use of steroids and drugs.
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, he certainly was observing that in the chair
Speaker 1: ring side for sure. Well, Gary, it is terrific to
Speaker 1: get your memories of this time period. We really appreciate
Speaker 1: you revisiting what it was like. We're asking all of
Speaker 1: our guests as part of this Hulk Cogan project just
Speaker 1: to kind of reflect on Hulk and what you thought
Speaker 1: of the career he made and in contrast to just
Speaker 1: the guy that you know, as you said at the beginning,
Speaker 1: was sort of forgetful or not forgetful, but forget a bull.
Speaker 1: When when you first laid eyes on him, what was
Speaker 1: it like to see him take off to become such
Speaker 1: a big attraction.
Speaker 4: What what did you make of what he was able
Speaker 4: to achieve?
Speaker 5: Yeah, that was it was incredible.
Speaker 2: I'm remembering the Meadowlands Arena and him wrestling Big John
Speaker 2: stud in the the Body Slams Challenge matches.
Speaker 5: Sure.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean when when Hogan was was brought to
Speaker 2: the ring and I was introducing him, you know, you
Speaker 2: couldn't hear yourself, you know, talk, The building would shake,
Speaker 2: it would be thunderous.
Speaker 5: It was. It was like nothing that we had experience
Speaker 5: prior to that. Mm hmm. Yeah, So it was incredible. Mhm.
Speaker 1: Gary, Michael Capetta. We want to thank you so much
Speaker 1: for giving us some of your time today as part
Speaker 1: of the project.
Speaker 4: We really appreciate it.
Speaker 5: You're welcome, thanks for asking.
Speaker 3: Really is.
Speaker 4: A production of the Labs Entertainment Group.
Speaker 5: Its content is intended for reven use only.
Speaker 4: Really, we want