WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.320 --> 00:00:04.440 Berg and the recent passing of two heavyweights and when 2 00:00:04.440 --> 00:00:09.800 I say super heavyweights, actually David Rockefeller and a Big 3 00:00:09.839 --> 00:00:14.599 New Brazinski. And our next guest is an author. He's 4 00:00:14.640 --> 00:00:17.199 also the founder of Jay's Analysis dot com but also 5 00:00:17.320 --> 00:00:20.679 the author of the recent release the book is called 6 00:00:20.839 --> 00:00:25.199 Esoteric Hollywood. And Jay is also a regular on Alternate 7 00:00:25.239 --> 00:00:28.920 Current Radio's Boiler Room, which are broadcast live every Thursday 8 00:00:29.239 --> 00:00:33.600 on ACR, hosted by the One the Only Hesher also 9 00:00:33.640 --> 00:00:37.560 hosted the Hessian Session, and Jay Dyer is going to 10 00:00:37.640 --> 00:00:42.799 help us hopefully navigate a little bit through what was 11 00:00:42.920 --> 00:00:46.200 the Big New Brazinski all about. He is definitely one 12 00:00:46.200 --> 00:00:49.039 of the most influential geopolitical thinkers I think of the 13 00:00:49.079 --> 00:00:52.719 last one hundred years, but his work also follows on 14 00:00:53.159 --> 00:00:56.920 from other people before him. But welcome to the Sunday Wire, Jay, 15 00:00:56.960 --> 00:00:57.960 Great to have you back. 16 00:00:58.759 --> 00:01:01.880 Thanks Patrick. I'm glad to be back. It's been probably 17 00:01:01.920 --> 00:01:04.959 six or eight months since I was last on. And yeah, 18 00:01:05.000 --> 00:01:08.959 we've seen the passing away of two, you know, within 19 00:01:09.040 --> 00:01:11.200 the span of what a couple of months, both a 20 00:01:11.319 --> 00:01:14.439 Rockfeller and Brazenski. And that's very interesting. 21 00:01:15.079 --> 00:01:17.319 I didn't think David was going to die Storry to interrupt. 22 00:01:17.400 --> 00:01:20.000 Yeah, right, how many hearts is supposedly he had I 23 00:01:20.000 --> 00:01:21.120 don't know if that's a true. 24 00:01:20.879 --> 00:01:23.879 Story, er no, but he had a state of the 25 00:01:23.959 --> 00:01:28.280 art trauma or heart sort of hospital thing bolted to 26 00:01:28.359 --> 00:01:30.920 his house with full time medical staff. 27 00:01:31.519 --> 00:01:35.959 And well, it's it's fitting because Brazanski, of course is 28 00:01:36.040 --> 00:01:39.719 a kind of a protege of David Rockefeller, and there's 29 00:01:39.760 --> 00:01:42.480 a lot of quotes where he spoke of him in 30 00:01:42.519 --> 00:01:45.239 that way. So so you kind of have this passing 31 00:01:45.280 --> 00:01:47.719 of the torch and then they're now both dead. So 32 00:01:48.159 --> 00:01:50.879 you know, it's fitting as well that Builderberg is going 33 00:01:50.920 --> 00:01:54.319 on because they're both obviously intimately tied into Bilderberg. 34 00:01:55.319 --> 00:01:59.120 And you know, Brazinski, uh really came on the scene 35 00:01:59.599 --> 00:02:02.920 in a big way as Jimmy Carter's national security advisor 36 00:02:03.200 --> 00:02:06.319 at a really pivotal time in history as well, in 37 00:02:06.359 --> 00:02:10.199 the late nineteen seventies and mid nineteen seventies nineteen seventy 38 00:02:10.199 --> 00:02:13.759 six actually, but a lot was going on there. Brazinski 39 00:02:14.639 --> 00:02:18.560 has been credited with many things Jay, not least of 40 00:02:18.560 --> 00:02:22.759 all the creation of al Qaeda or helping with that process, 41 00:02:22.800 --> 00:02:25.520 but also at a time when you know, a pivotal 42 00:02:25.520 --> 00:02:28.319 time in US Soviet relations as well. And this is 43 00:02:28.560 --> 00:02:30.879 really coming to the latter stages of the Cold War, 44 00:02:31.400 --> 00:02:34.479 and so just walk us through. You know, why is 45 00:02:34.520 --> 00:02:38.599 Brazinski so important? Why was he so influential. We'll talk 46 00:02:38.639 --> 00:02:41.000 about his books in a minute, but you know what 47 00:02:41.120 --> 00:02:46.080 was it about? Why was Brazinski holding this sort of 48 00:02:46.120 --> 00:02:50.439 grand plan and why others were not as influential. Why 49 00:02:50.599 --> 00:02:51.520 was he so special? 50 00:02:52.439 --> 00:02:56.560 Well, it's partly because of his experience growing up. The 51 00:02:56.599 --> 00:03:00.479 story at least is that because of Soviet occupation and Poland, 52 00:03:00.560 --> 00:03:05.599 and because of his noble Polish descent, you know, the 53 00:03:05.639 --> 00:03:09.199 family had to flee and they landed in Canada and 54 00:03:09.240 --> 00:03:11.759 it's from there that Brazienski kind of rose into the 55 00:03:11.840 --> 00:03:16.319 ranks of academia and the academic establishment. And then he 56 00:03:16.360 --> 00:03:19.919 would go to McGill University, which is very interesting because 57 00:03:20.000 --> 00:03:24.919 McGill is a very well connected deep state school. You 58 00:03:24.960 --> 00:03:27.240 could say, because anyone who's done a lot of research 59 00:03:27.319 --> 00:03:31.199 on the what's public in regard to the mk ulture program, 60 00:03:31.599 --> 00:03:34.800 McGill was central to that. Many of the studies were 61 00:03:34.840 --> 00:03:39.120 actually done there, as well as dozens of other universities. 62 00:03:39.159 --> 00:03:40.960 And the reason I bring that up is not to 63 00:03:41.000 --> 00:03:45.120 be over the conspiratorial but rather if you know what 64 00:03:45.360 --> 00:03:47.879 in culture was really about, not so much, you know, 65 00:03:47.960 --> 00:03:51.240 creating a mind control assassin, but rather social engineering. I 66 00:03:51.240 --> 00:03:55.759 think that really informs his first nineteen seventy book, which is, 67 00:03:56.560 --> 00:03:59.599 you know, between two Ages, and it's in between two 68 00:03:59.599 --> 00:04:04.360 ages where you have the presentation of a lot of futurism, 69 00:04:05.080 --> 00:04:09.680 technocratic managerial control, and this is what would catch the 70 00:04:09.719 --> 00:04:12.840 eye of David Rockefeller. Many writers who've written on this 71 00:04:12.879 --> 00:04:17.480 have discussed that that it was really the book that 72 00:04:17.600 --> 00:04:20.920 impressed David Rockefeller, that kind of got him recruited into 73 00:04:22.279 --> 00:04:26.519 the NGO complex. And really, in many ways, Brazenski is 74 00:04:26.600 --> 00:04:30.160 kind of the godfather. I think you posted an article 75 00:04:30.199 --> 00:04:33.439 showing him as a machiavellian character behind the Prince. I 76 00:04:33.439 --> 00:04:36.160 think that's very accurate. He's really the father of this 77 00:04:36.199 --> 00:04:41.439 whole NGO smart complex, soft power approach and technology that 78 00:04:41.480 --> 00:04:45.120 we're seeing played out not only in Syria, but also 79 00:04:45.160 --> 00:04:48.399 in the last several conflicts the last few decades, back 80 00:04:48.399 --> 00:04:52.319 to as you mentioned nineteen seventy nine with Afghanistan and. 81 00:04:52.240 --> 00:04:55.959 So David Rocke. You talked about the synergy between Rockefeller 82 00:04:56.959 --> 00:04:59.759 in Brazenski and how the book Between Two Ages by 83 00:04:59.800 --> 00:05:02.199 his big new Brazinski, why that would have caught the 84 00:05:02.240 --> 00:05:06.240 eye of David Rockefeller. And is it because underlying the 85 00:05:06.279 --> 00:05:10.000 sort of the un idea, the one child policy in China, 86 00:05:10.279 --> 00:05:13.680 population control, Underneath all this is the need for some 87 00:05:13.879 --> 00:05:18.879 kind of technocratic expertise. And is this what Rockefeller saw 88 00:05:19.000 --> 00:05:22.639 in Between Two Ages? Or because this book is yes, 89 00:05:22.959 --> 00:05:25.959 it's kind of foreshadowing a lot of stuff that actually 90 00:05:25.959 --> 00:05:26.959 has come to fruition. 91 00:05:27.439 --> 00:05:30.720 Yeah, I say it's the book is like HG. Wells 92 00:05:30.959 --> 00:05:37.240 meets Carol Quiggly meets Bertrand Russell, and you can throw 93 00:05:37.279 --> 00:05:41.360 out all of the friendly veneer of Carol Quigglely with 94 00:05:41.519 --> 00:05:45.439 his pseudo Catholic approach. This is just the hardcore technocratic 95 00:05:47.720 --> 00:05:51.560 skeletal remains of what you find in Quigley, with all 96 00:05:51.600 --> 00:05:54.920 the excess baggage shed and it's just straight into the point. 97 00:05:55.279 --> 00:05:57.160 And I think that was part of the reason that 98 00:05:57.839 --> 00:06:02.040 David Rockefeller was prompted to actually call a Kissinger and 99 00:06:02.079 --> 00:06:04.399 he said, you know, I've got a guy that I 100 00:06:04.439 --> 00:06:07.519 want to set up as the chairman of a new 101 00:06:08.040 --> 00:06:11.480 entity that will kind of, in a way supersede the CFR, 102 00:06:11.600 --> 00:06:14.399 and so this is kind of a SUPERDFR if you 103 00:06:14.439 --> 00:06:17.680 will well, which is Allateral Commission. It was founded by 104 00:06:17.800 --> 00:06:22.800 Rockefeller and featured Brazinski as its first head in nineteen 105 00:06:22.920 --> 00:06:25.040 seventy two slash three. 106 00:06:25.279 --> 00:06:30.360 And so so the Trilateral Commission Commission hugely influential, especially 107 00:06:31.199 --> 00:06:34.800 on the Pacific RIM as well with the emerging China. 108 00:06:35.120 --> 00:06:39.079 But also if you know the TAP, the transpecific partnership, 109 00:06:39.120 --> 00:06:40.920 A lot of people believe that's the life's work of 110 00:06:40.959 --> 00:06:46.279 the of the Trilateral Commission. So what other work was 111 00:06:46.680 --> 00:06:47.399 involved in? 112 00:06:47.959 --> 00:06:51.120 Yeah, it's very important, I think to understand all of 113 00:06:51.120 --> 00:06:54.199 what I mean, there's so much that's in between two 114 00:06:54.199 --> 00:06:57.959 ages that that it really it's really difficult to boil down. 115 00:06:58.040 --> 00:07:01.519 But I mean, he talks about the death of ideology, 116 00:07:02.279 --> 00:07:05.120 and along with the he lists three things. Basically, you 117 00:07:05.160 --> 00:07:10.279 have the death of ideology, you have the death of religion, 118 00:07:10.680 --> 00:07:15.800 you have the death of nationalism. And so these forces 119 00:07:16.240 --> 00:07:22.480 have been replaced by consumerism and the international liberal market order. 120 00:07:22.920 --> 00:07:27.079 But Brazinski is not really he doesn't buy into anything 121 00:07:27.120 --> 00:07:31.000 like a capitalist socialist dialectic. He thinks that you know, 122 00:07:31.040 --> 00:07:34.680 all of those ideologies are again part of that section 123 00:07:34.839 --> 00:07:37.480 of things that have gone the old way. Their dinosaurs, 124 00:07:37.480 --> 00:07:41.199 they're dead. We're moving into a new age, where the 125 00:07:41.240 --> 00:07:44.160 hints the title between two ages. The new age that 126 00:07:44.240 --> 00:07:48.759 we're moving into will be one that will have to 127 00:07:48.759 --> 00:07:51.959 be dominated by some superpower. And at that time when 128 00:07:51.959 --> 00:07:54.399 he was writing that in nineteen seventy, of course, it 129 00:07:54.519 --> 00:07:57.160 was the United States, and he was arguing that, you 130 00:07:57.199 --> 00:07:59.199 know that the Soviet Union could not be in any 131 00:07:59.240 --> 00:08:02.000 way allowed to have supremacy. You know, he has that 132 00:08:02.160 --> 00:08:05.040 virulent anti Russian stance going all the way back to 133 00:08:05.079 --> 00:08:09.079 his childhood. And so that's really the amazing foresight in 134 00:08:09.120 --> 00:08:12.879 that book is that he kind of foresaw the dismantling 135 00:08:12.959 --> 00:08:15.040 of the soul Union. He also laid out many of 136 00:08:15.079 --> 00:08:19.360 the plans and strategies to as to how to do that, 137 00:08:19.759 --> 00:08:21.360 and that would come to fruition, you know, in the 138 00:08:21.439 --> 00:08:24.639 nineteen ninety seven book Grand Chess Board. But again, what's 139 00:08:24.680 --> 00:08:28.680 so crucial is not just the consumerism, not just the 140 00:08:28.680 --> 00:08:34.679 the rejecting of any ideology or religion, but the explicit 141 00:08:34.759 --> 00:08:39.879 statements of all of the techniques of technocracy, managerial controlled 142 00:08:39.919 --> 00:08:46.080 by bureaucrats, moving this into a global sphere, dismantling the 143 00:08:46.320 --> 00:08:49.039 older ideas of nation state and religion, and that you 144 00:08:49.039 --> 00:08:54.879 could literally control the population, you could literally control mass communications, 145 00:08:55.399 --> 00:08:58.960 and even beyond that into the spheres of you know, 146 00:08:59.080 --> 00:09:05.720 exotic weapons with weather modification, electromagnetic pulse control through towers 147 00:09:05.879 --> 00:09:09.279 that would actually target whole continents. I mean, you know, 148 00:09:09.320 --> 00:09:13.559 he's really he's really the source for why so many 149 00:09:14.039 --> 00:09:18.279 people who are derided as conspiracy theorists have a legitimate, 150 00:09:18.919 --> 00:09:22.559 I think argument as to why weather modification and geoengineering 151 00:09:22.600 --> 00:09:25.840 and all this stuff is very real. So you know, 152 00:09:25.879 --> 00:09:29.039 when we hear all this stuff about climate change, you know, 153 00:09:29.080 --> 00:09:31.679 how come nobody ever brings up the fact that Brazinski 154 00:09:31.759 --> 00:09:34.480 said that weather modification could be used for this kind 155 00:09:34.519 --> 00:09:35.639 of stuff, you know what I mean. 156 00:09:36.440 --> 00:09:40.000 Yeah, that's amazing that when this book was written, you know, 157 00:09:40.399 --> 00:09:43.720 theoretically anyway, maybe this technology, some of the technology was around, 158 00:09:43.720 --> 00:09:47.399 but it was way way before some of the trends 159 00:09:47.600 --> 00:09:48.960 had sort of become clear. 160 00:09:50.320 --> 00:09:54.279 And give you one example, he even says that through 161 00:09:54.279 --> 00:09:56.559 the net, and he's writing this again in nineteen seventy 162 00:09:56.559 --> 00:10:00.399 the internet. He says that in the future will be 163 00:10:00.399 --> 00:10:03.879 taking their university classes on the net. So that's how 164 00:10:03.919 --> 00:10:04.720 that's how far ahead. 165 00:10:04.759 --> 00:10:07.600 He was, Yeah, so I mean, based on this Jay Is, 166 00:10:07.759 --> 00:10:09.519 I'm what I'm the point I was trying to make 167 00:10:09.759 --> 00:10:12.159 to some people a few weeks ago after we posted 168 00:10:12.200 --> 00:10:16.440 the obituary of Brazinski, I said, you know, judgments aside. 169 00:10:16.720 --> 00:10:19.639 This is my exact words, judgments aside. This is one 170 00:10:19.639 --> 00:10:23.559 of the most influential thinkers of the last hundred years. 171 00:10:24.080 --> 00:10:25.759 And do you think that's a fair assessment. 172 00:10:26.480 --> 00:10:28.799 I would say so, because he's he's one of these 173 00:10:28.840 --> 00:10:30.960 A lot of people characterize him as the brains. You know, 174 00:10:31.000 --> 00:10:33.240 you have the bankers, and then maybe the bloods, the 175 00:10:33.240 --> 00:10:37.120 old money and then but they're not always necessarily engaged 176 00:10:37.159 --> 00:10:41.039 in strategies and psychological warfare. You need guys who are 177 00:10:41.080 --> 00:10:43.320 the brains to do that. And so you know, you 178 00:10:43.360 --> 00:10:47.159 have the Kissingers, you have the Brazienskis, you have the Quiglies. 179 00:10:47.200 --> 00:10:48.200 You know, these are the brains. 180 00:10:48.240 --> 00:10:53.039 So absolutely, and so following on from that, one of 181 00:10:53.080 --> 00:10:56.519 his big seller's best sellers after that was The Grand 182 00:10:56.600 --> 00:10:59.759 Chess Board. And so now we're getting into sort of 183 00:11:00.080 --> 00:11:03.759 real politic geopolitical style, and so a lot of his 184 00:11:05.000 --> 00:11:08.960 theories he's built on top of the Halford mckinder uh 185 00:11:09.039 --> 00:11:12.240 you know, world island the heartland theory. You know, whoever, 186 00:11:12.360 --> 00:11:16.600 whoever can capture that that precious patch of land known 187 00:11:16.639 --> 00:11:21.279 as the Eurasian land bridge, you know around Georgia, Ukraine, 188 00:11:21.720 --> 00:11:26.919 Crimea and the steps of the urals there, that is 189 00:11:26.960 --> 00:11:29.679 the basically the person who's going to basically rule the world. 190 00:11:29.919 --> 00:11:32.720 And that's kind of been true in the last few 191 00:11:32.799 --> 00:11:35.919 hundred years. So many countries have fought, you know, to 192 00:11:36.000 --> 00:11:39.559 win or to occupy that old Silk road route or 193 00:11:39.600 --> 00:11:43.840 that Eurasian piece of midpoint between Europe and Asia as 194 00:11:44.000 --> 00:11:48.440 or and so is this I know, this has dominated 195 00:11:48.519 --> 00:11:52.000 geopolitical thought and strategy for pretty much the whole twentieth 196 00:11:52.000 --> 00:11:55.519 century and still even you could argue into the twenty 197 00:11:55.559 --> 00:12:00.440 first century. Uh, but did Brazilski or anybody see is 198 00:12:00.480 --> 00:12:04.080 becoming secondary in the future. In other words, maybe technology 199 00:12:04.200 --> 00:12:08.279 or fast air travel or something might eclipse the need 200 00:12:08.399 --> 00:12:11.080 to basically rule that area in order to rule the 201 00:12:11.080 --> 00:12:13.000 world absolutely. 202 00:12:13.039 --> 00:12:16.000 You know, this is, as he calls it, the geopolitical 203 00:12:16.039 --> 00:12:20.159 pivot in that region, He argues, because of its resources, 204 00:12:20.279 --> 00:12:24.960 because of its minerals, because of its population. You know, 205 00:12:25.039 --> 00:12:27.519 seventy five percent of the population is in the Eurasian 206 00:12:27.559 --> 00:12:30.759 land mass. All of this, Brazienski argues just flat out, 207 00:12:30.799 --> 00:12:32.759 by the way, it's not a conspiracy theory. He just 208 00:12:32.799 --> 00:12:36.519 specifically says this is in nineteen ninety seven at least 209 00:12:36.519 --> 00:12:40.879 crucial for the Anglo American establishment to control, to maintain 210 00:12:40.960 --> 00:12:44.159 American hegemony. And what's amazing also is that he says 211 00:12:44.200 --> 00:12:48.440 that if the Western Empire, and he uses the terms 212 00:12:48.440 --> 00:12:51.559 of imperialism, he says that if they don't control these vassals, 213 00:12:52.399 --> 00:12:56.480 and if they don't actually cause the destabilization in a 214 00:12:56.480 --> 00:13:00.960 lot of the former Soviet satellites, then the world will 215 00:13:01.000 --> 00:13:04.200 fall into anarchy. So in other words, if I don't 216 00:13:04.240 --> 00:13:08.320 cause anarchy, the world will fall into anarchy. Uh. It's 217 00:13:08.519 --> 00:13:11.480 very again, Maketbellian. And that's why Brazinski, from the first 218 00:13:11.519 --> 00:13:14.039 book all the way to his last book, Strategic Vision, 219 00:13:14.759 --> 00:13:18.960 was consistently talking about Manichean dialectics, and he's always saying that, yes, 220 00:13:19.000 --> 00:13:21.960 you've got to control both sides of the conflict. He says, 221 00:13:21.960 --> 00:13:26.519 the internationalists will always have the upper hand precisely because 222 00:13:26.519 --> 00:13:30.519 they're not caught up in ideology or left right or 223 00:13:30.559 --> 00:13:33.320 you know, good guy bad guy there, they supersede that 224 00:13:33.440 --> 00:13:36.759 and so they're able to kind of say above the 225 00:13:36.840 --> 00:13:39.559 fray and therefore manage it. So he's kind of the 226 00:13:39.600 --> 00:13:44.080 father of the modern hybrid warfare, you know, approach to 227 00:13:44.799 --> 00:13:49.360 managing controlled chaos. And that's actually what he wrote as well. 228 00:13:49.399 --> 00:13:53.559 In between two ages. It also mentions the possibilities of 229 00:13:54.000 --> 00:14:00.919 exploiting religious, social class differences and tensions in any specific 230 00:14:01.039 --> 00:14:05.200 region to exacerbate a political revolution or a coup or 231 00:14:05.240 --> 00:14:07.360 a you know, replacing head of state. All of that, 232 00:14:08.039 --> 00:14:10.519 you know, is laid out very clear in the old 233 00:14:10.720 --> 00:14:13.600 old work, and then in the nineteen ninety seven book 234 00:14:13.639 --> 00:14:17.679 it's kind of just an updated approach to really setting 235 00:14:17.679 --> 00:14:19.679 the stage for the war on terror. You know, he 236 00:14:20.000 --> 00:14:23.960 mentioned some of the same phraseology of the Project for 237 00:14:24.080 --> 00:14:26.519 the American Century, where he talks about, you know, a 238 00:14:26.559 --> 00:14:32.080 new pearl harbor could give the impression of the great 239 00:14:32.120 --> 00:14:35.679 external threat, and then that great external threat could of 240 00:14:35.679 --> 00:14:38.440 course always be a justification for any kind of foreign 241 00:14:38.440 --> 00:14:42.360 policy ventures or domestic surveillance. You know. He again, Brazenski 242 00:14:42.399 --> 00:14:46.039 is really the brainchild of a lot of the practice 243 00:14:46.559 --> 00:14:50.480 of how the US is operated, not just since you know, 244 00:14:50.519 --> 00:14:54.720 the sixties and Carter and trial otoral Commission, but also 245 00:14:54.799 --> 00:14:56.720 since the nine to eleven in the War on Terror. 246 00:14:56.759 --> 00:15:00.279 So I think Brazenski was a big thinker in sort 247 00:15:00.320 --> 00:15:05.080 of formulating where the US would go further into this 248 00:15:05.240 --> 00:15:08.279 and mindless, you know, expansionist perspective. 249 00:15:09.039 --> 00:15:13.159 So I can imagine him in the situation room, you know, 250 00:15:13.240 --> 00:15:16.879 with any of these presents, basically saying He's telling them, look, 251 00:15:16.879 --> 00:15:19.039 it's going it's going to blow eventually, so we're going 252 00:15:19.080 --> 00:15:21.000 to make it blow, and this is how we're going 253 00:15:21.039 --> 00:15:23.360 to manage the fallout, and this is how we're going 254 00:15:23.440 --> 00:15:26.120 to benefit from that on the back end, you know, 255 00:15:26.320 --> 00:15:30.200 just a full solution from beginning end. You know, we're 256 00:15:30.240 --> 00:15:32.200 going to light the match, we're going to burn it, 257 00:15:32.279 --> 00:15:34.120 and then we're going to put out the fire, and 258 00:15:34.159 --> 00:15:36.519 then we're going to rebuild. I could see, I could 259 00:15:36.519 --> 00:15:40.360 see where his sort of strategy. This guy, I mean, 260 00:15:40.360 --> 00:15:43.120 if you look at him compared to other National Security Advisors, 261 00:15:43.200 --> 00:15:46.120 Jay who I don't know much about, but I do know, 262 00:15:46.159 --> 00:15:48.320 like Susan Rice, for instance, and I look at the 263 00:15:48.360 --> 00:15:51.600 stuff that Brazinsky was putting out forty years ago, and 264 00:15:51.639 --> 00:15:55.480 I'm like, this guy is very hardcore compared quite an 265 00:15:55.480 --> 00:16:00.879 IQ deferential between Brazenski and these characters, not saying that 266 00:16:00.879 --> 00:16:03.919 Brazenski was a virtuous man, but more so on the 267 00:16:04.279 --> 00:16:05.919 cunning Machiavelian side. 268 00:16:06.399 --> 00:16:10.399 But definitely a great iq disparity there between these these 269 00:16:10.759 --> 00:16:14.679 present day clowns. But you know, again to look at 270 00:16:14.720 --> 00:16:19.600 an example of this, this fore planning foresight. You know, 271 00:16:19.679 --> 00:16:22.279 in the Grand Chessboard, he talks about how Ukraine is 272 00:16:22.360 --> 00:16:26.399 crucial to Russia. Fifty two million people he's running in 273 00:16:26.440 --> 00:16:30.840 nineteen ninety seven, a lot of economic and power and 274 00:16:30.879 --> 00:16:35.039 resource there, and Brazenski says that the US will have 275 00:16:35.159 --> 00:16:40.200 to remove Ukraine from the sphere of Russia. So in 276 00:16:40.279 --> 00:16:43.960 nineteen ninety seven, Brazenski is telegraphing to you what would 277 00:16:43.960 --> 00:16:45.120 happen in twenty fourteen. 278 00:16:45.440 --> 00:16:48.080 Absolutely, Mike, this reminds me of like he was maybe 279 00:16:48.080 --> 00:16:50.879 he was trained by the British or something. Where do 280 00:16:50.960 --> 00:16:54.000 you get this where do you get this Machiavelian mindset from? 281 00:16:54.039 --> 00:16:59.120 It's extraordinary though the track record from the nineteen six. 282 00:16:58.919 --> 00:17:01.960 He's also the father of Putin as Hitler, which is 283 00:17:02.000 --> 00:17:05.039 not brought up very often, but that meme really comes 284 00:17:05.039 --> 00:17:05.920 from Brazinski. 285 00:17:07.720 --> 00:17:12.440 Jay just uh, you talk about his foresight and so on, 286 00:17:12.480 --> 00:17:17.680 and and his UH his concerns about Soviet influence in 287 00:17:17.680 --> 00:17:20.240 the world and so on. But he while he was 288 00:17:20.279 --> 00:17:23.799 in office, of course, he he helped normalize relationship with China, 289 00:17:23.839 --> 00:17:27.799 and then later on he UH broke relations with China 290 00:17:28.000 --> 00:17:30.759 over Taiwan and so on. So but what what did 291 00:17:30.799 --> 00:17:32.799 he have to say about chain Did he foresee what 292 00:17:33.160 --> 00:17:35.400 they influence of China was eventually going to have in 293 00:17:35.440 --> 00:17:35.799 the world. 294 00:17:36.559 --> 00:17:40.440 Yeah, And that's interesting because the older Brazinski back during 295 00:17:40.440 --> 00:17:44.640 the Cold War would write about China and Russia as threats, 296 00:17:45.599 --> 00:17:48.920 and then as you move up into the nineties, he 297 00:17:49.200 --> 00:17:53.079 warms up to China and again, you know, the main 298 00:17:53.519 --> 00:17:57.880 force in Grand Chess board, that is the concern, is 299 00:17:58.319 --> 00:18:02.359 what Patrick said, the perennial concern of the British Empire Russia, 300 00:18:02.440 --> 00:18:06.160 you know, the the eternal enemy. But then by the 301 00:18:06.240 --> 00:18:10.319 time of Strategic Vision, which was also written right around 302 00:18:10.359 --> 00:18:13.039 the twenty thirteen or fourteen, right around the time actually 303 00:18:13.039 --> 00:18:18.200 of the the Ukraine situation, he begins to actually warm 304 00:18:18.279 --> 00:18:21.359 up to both and he's and he says, we can 305 00:18:21.640 --> 00:18:24.799 move into an international order where we can actually work 306 00:18:24.839 --> 00:18:29.079 with China, but Russia is still the main concern. So 307 00:18:29.119 --> 00:18:32.440 I don't know in particular about the situation with Taiwan 308 00:18:32.519 --> 00:18:35.720 as to whether that really was a big deal with 309 00:18:35.720 --> 00:18:37.680 with Brazenski, because I think he's more of a long 310 00:18:37.759 --> 00:18:42.680 term strategist. He's mainly concerned with the end goal, which 311 00:18:42.720 --> 00:18:44.680 is how are we going to get to the international order. 312 00:18:44.720 --> 00:18:47.079 I mean, this pretty much dominates all the books. It's 313 00:18:47.400 --> 00:18:50.160 we've got to get the international order. This is one 314 00:18:50.160 --> 00:18:54.039 of the reasons why Brazenski has a kind of pseudo 315 00:18:54.119 --> 00:18:57.359 critic of the neocons and Bush is that that after 316 00:18:57.440 --> 00:19:00.240 the big terror events, they he says, they don't to 317 00:19:00.480 --> 00:19:04.200 the the international order the way it should be done. 318 00:19:04.559 --> 00:19:08.079 They rely on this sort of you know, American imperial 319 00:19:08.160 --> 00:19:11.079 model when it really needs to shift into into more 320 00:19:11.119 --> 00:19:16.839 of the United Nations model. So by strategic vision, he's 321 00:19:17.000 --> 00:19:20.240 arguing that we really need to, you know, look past 322 00:19:20.319 --> 00:19:24.920 any of these kind of older divides of Russia or 323 00:19:25.720 --> 00:19:29.720 Russian nationalism or any kind of nationalism. It's it's just 324 00:19:29.759 --> 00:19:33.599 time to move past that and create the international order. 325 00:19:34.279 --> 00:19:37.079 And with some of these these characters Jay, you see 326 00:19:37.079 --> 00:19:39.839 that later in life, sort of in their twilight years, 327 00:19:39.880 --> 00:19:44.599 they do light lighten up to some degree in compared 328 00:19:44.680 --> 00:19:47.920 to their hardcore form or selfs. Brazinski had a statement 329 00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:49.759 that I that stuck in my head. He said that 330 00:19:49.880 --> 00:19:53.039 the one thing that could threaten the world order, or 331 00:19:53.240 --> 00:19:55.440 sort of our design of it, is some kind of 332 00:19:55.440 --> 00:19:59.319 a global awakening brought on by some great wave of 333 00:19:59.319 --> 00:20:02.160 political a way awareness or something. And I wasn't sure 334 00:20:02.200 --> 00:20:04.000 if he was speaking about that as if it was 335 00:20:04.039 --> 00:20:06.640 a threat to the world order, or if it was 336 00:20:06.680 --> 00:20:11.480 going to be absorbed into the orders as possibly a 337 00:20:11.519 --> 00:20:14.759 positive thing. It was hard. It was an ambivalent statement. 338 00:20:14.799 --> 00:20:17.039 I don't know. Did you did you see that. 339 00:20:17.519 --> 00:20:20.079 This has dealt with in Strategic Vision the last book, 340 00:20:20.119 --> 00:20:23.400 And what he talks about is he, you know, as 341 00:20:23.440 --> 00:20:26.240 that strategist, he's not really putting a positive or negative 342 00:20:26.960 --> 00:20:30.240 appraisal on it. He's basically looking at the facts and 343 00:20:30.279 --> 00:20:32.880 he's saying, all right, this is going to happen. You're 344 00:20:32.920 --> 00:20:35.559 going to have this mass awakening because of the move 345 00:20:35.599 --> 00:20:38.880 of internationalism is obviously going to upset a lot of people. 346 00:20:38.960 --> 00:20:42.599 You're gonna have reactions, and so what needs to happen 347 00:20:42.880 --> 00:20:46.079 is that these reactionary movements have to be kind of 348 00:20:46.119 --> 00:20:48.640 corralled and co opted. He actually talks about co opting 349 00:20:48.680 --> 00:20:51.839 these things, and I think that's what the whole you know, 350 00:20:51.960 --> 00:20:55.240 NNGO model is there to do in any of these 351 00:20:55.279 --> 00:20:58.359 regions where you have reactions, Uh, you know, the soft 352 00:20:58.400 --> 00:21:01.079 power model that we talked about the you and Vanessa 353 00:21:01.119 --> 00:21:04.680 Bilia written so well about. You know that Brazenski has 354 00:21:04.720 --> 00:21:07.279 been saying for decades that that's really the key to 355 00:21:08.559 --> 00:21:12.599 containing the discontent that's going to happen as a result 356 00:21:12.599 --> 00:21:15.759 of globalism. So, yes, he knows there's going to be 357 00:21:15.799 --> 00:21:18.200 an awakening, he talks about it, but he definitely wants 358 00:21:18.240 --> 00:21:22.440 to see it co opted and turned into the anti 359 00:21:22.519 --> 00:21:25.359 American globalist model. And so that's where I think the 360 00:21:25.480 --> 00:21:29.079 key to understanding Brezenski is that when he was arguing 361 00:21:29.079 --> 00:21:32.200 for American imperialism back in nineteen ninety seven, that was 362 00:21:32.279 --> 00:21:35.039 just as a tool. And so it's kind it's kind 363 00:21:35.079 --> 00:21:39.240 of a cloak or a skelet, it's kind of a 364 00:21:39.279 --> 00:21:42.839 costume that can be shed. And so once you get 365 00:21:43.039 --> 00:21:46.559 the movement, once America has been demonized to a certain 366 00:21:46.559 --> 00:21:50.160 degree that is actually part of the plan, you can 367 00:21:50.200 --> 00:21:53.039 just kind of discard it for the new international order. 368 00:21:53.119 --> 00:21:55.400 Oh that's here to fix us or to here to 369 00:21:55.440 --> 00:21:59.880 fix the problems you know that America caused. Now I'm 370 00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:03.880 very critical of America and American ideology, but I'm saying 371 00:22:03.880 --> 00:22:07.559 that from the Brazinski Machiavellian standpoint, he doesn't have a 372 00:22:07.599 --> 00:22:10.039 problem saying, Look, if we can use America for a 373 00:22:10.079 --> 00:22:12.319 time period to create a global order, and this is 374 00:22:12.319 --> 00:22:17.079 what he says, to extend consumerism, then we can shift 375 00:22:17.119 --> 00:22:22.200 into the new phase of the technocratic global order that 376 00:22:22.319 --> 00:22:26.200 doesn't need America and its baggage anymore. We can shed 377 00:22:26.240 --> 00:22:27.440 that skin. 378 00:22:28.559 --> 00:22:31.839 That's very interesting. So, you know, I don't want to 379 00:22:31.880 --> 00:22:36.599 get into comparing his vision to the present day, but 380 00:22:36.759 --> 00:22:39.680 you know, do you think it's possible that some of 381 00:22:39.720 --> 00:22:42.319 this is happening right now, that we are actually moving 382 00:22:42.359 --> 00:22:45.039 into that phase or in the future. 383 00:22:46.079 --> 00:22:48.559 Yeah. I think what he was arguing in nineteen seventy 384 00:22:48.720 --> 00:22:52.079 was that the internet consumerism. This is another big point 385 00:22:52.160 --> 00:22:55.839 that he talks about in between two ages, and then 386 00:22:55.920 --> 00:22:58.440 into interviews that he would give in the nineteen nineties. 387 00:22:58.599 --> 00:22:59.839 I read a whole bunch of those, and he was 388 00:22:59.839 --> 00:23:03.720 saying that consumerism is key because it is going to 389 00:23:03.720 --> 00:23:08.119 destroy the traditional ideologies. So you have this idea of 390 00:23:08.480 --> 00:23:11.279 and this is why he's hard depend down on capitalism 391 00:23:11.359 --> 00:23:13.960 or communism, and people can't figure out if Brazenski's a 392 00:23:13.960 --> 00:23:16.400 socialist or a capitalist or he's more of it. He's 393 00:23:16.400 --> 00:23:19.960 a he's a pragmatist, so he's he's interested in consumerism 394 00:23:20.039 --> 00:23:23.640 destroying existing cultures, and this is what he says. Uh, 395 00:23:24.000 --> 00:23:29.160 then you have an open field for moving these deracinated 396 00:23:29.200 --> 00:23:35.240 people into something new, which will be the technocratic modus 397 00:23:35.240 --> 00:23:37.920 operandi of the city state models like you talked about. 398 00:23:37.960 --> 00:23:40.279 I think that's very much in line with with what 399 00:23:40.720 --> 00:23:43.480 Brazenski would would like to see in the future. So 400 00:23:44.319 --> 00:23:49.160 the global awakening, Yeah, he's he sees that and he 401 00:23:49.160 --> 00:23:51.720