WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.240 --> 00:00:04.759 Vouchers is the name and school choices the game. There 2 00:00:04.759 --> 00:00:08.359 are more lawsuits of Bruin and Scott has the story 3 00:00:08.439 --> 00:00:09.160 Scott Well. 4 00:00:09.199 --> 00:00:11.439 We have a pair of articles about efforts for and 5 00:00:11.560 --> 00:00:15.679 against school voucher programs. First, from Maine, Crosspoint Church is 6 00:00:15.720 --> 00:00:19.120 appealing a ruling that requires religious schools in state tuition 7 00:00:19.280 --> 00:00:23.120 program to comply with the state's anti discrimination law, which 8 00:00:23.160 --> 00:00:26.640 protects LGBTQ students and staff. This follows the Supreme Court 9 00:00:26.640 --> 00:00:29.399 decision that allowed religious schools to participate in the program 10 00:00:29.440 --> 00:00:32.520 in the first place. The church argues that Maine lawmakers 11 00:00:32.520 --> 00:00:36.640 are targeting religious institutions by enforcing the law. Another similar 12 00:00:36.719 --> 00:00:40.799 lawsuit involves the Roman Catholic Diocese of Portland. Both cases 13 00:00:40.840 --> 00:00:43.920 are being appealed after federal judge's ruling, which may be 14 00:00:44.039 --> 00:00:46.960 reviewed by a higher court. Next, we go to Nebraska. 15 00:00:47.079 --> 00:00:49.640 The Nebraska Supreme Court ruled that a ballot measure to 16 00:00:49.719 --> 00:00:53.799 repeal a law providing taxpayer funded private school tuition can 17 00:00:53.880 --> 00:00:57.679 appear on the November ballot. The court rejected claims that 18 00:00:57.920 --> 00:01:02.000 the measure illegally targeted a government of propreation. Nebraska Secretary 19 00:01:02.039 --> 00:01:06.319 of State Bob Envin Evnin Bob Evnin had initially certified 20 00:01:06.359 --> 00:01:08.599 the repeal, but later claimed it was a mistake and 21 00:01:08.640 --> 00:01:12.000 sought to withdraw his certification. The court disagreed, stating that 22 00:01:12.079 --> 00:01:15.239 once certified, the measure could not be revoked. Public school 23 00:01:15.280 --> 00:01:19.159 advocates who gathered signatures for the repeal praised the decision, 24 00:01:19.359 --> 00:01:22.319 while school choice proponents are preparing to campaign against it. 25 00:01:22.599 --> 00:01:26.239 These articles are from National Catholic Reporter by Religion News 26 00:01:26.239 --> 00:01:30.159 Service on September tenth, twenty twenty four, and AP News 27 00:01:30.239 --> 00:01:34.120 by Marjorie A. Beck on September thirteenth, twenty twenty four. 28 00:01:34.640 --> 00:01:37.040 Thank you, Scott, and I have my first question for you, 29 00:01:37.280 --> 00:01:42.120 all right, So, how do differing interpretations of the law 30 00:01:42.200 --> 00:01:50.599 reflect broader societal tensions between religious freedom and anti discrimination protections. 31 00:01:51.280 --> 00:01:53.560 Well, I think what we're seeing here is just that 32 00:01:53.680 --> 00:01:56.760 I think we're seeing different interpretations of the law by 33 00:01:56.879 --> 00:02:01.000 the same kinds of bodies that had different opinions before. 34 00:02:01.040 --> 00:02:03.680 We see that there's a shift happening here. There's a change. 35 00:02:03.760 --> 00:02:07.079 Most notice noticeably, the change is happening in the Supreme Court. 36 00:02:07.519 --> 00:02:11.840 A few years ago, we wouldn't expect court, the Supreme 37 00:02:11.840 --> 00:02:16.360 Court to be supporting uh funneling public funds to private 38 00:02:16.919 --> 00:02:20.599 education institutions. But apparently that that's okay now, And so 39 00:02:21.159 --> 00:02:24.080 I don't want to say it's unconstitutional per se, because 40 00:02:24.319 --> 00:02:29.520 technically the Supreme Court it's their job to interpret the Constitution. 41 00:02:29.759 --> 00:02:35.240 So technically what they're doing is correct constitutionally by definition. Now, 42 00:02:35.280 --> 00:02:38.280 you could argue that they're going against past history, which 43 00:02:38.280 --> 00:02:42.280 I think is what's happening here. We're seeing that that 44 00:02:42.479 --> 00:02:45.240 there's this conflict. So we have the group that want 45 00:02:45.280 --> 00:02:48.599 to discriminate basically, which which to me is is baffling. Here, 46 00:02:48.639 --> 00:02:50.759 I want to read a quote on that note here, 47 00:02:50.759 --> 00:02:53.879 and I know I'm getting sidetracks within sidetracks here, but 48 00:02:54.039 --> 00:02:55.919 this is here's what they said in the article. An 49 00:02:55.960 --> 00:02:59.560 attorney for Cross Point Church in Bangor accused main lawmakers 50 00:02:59.599 --> 00:03:02.039 of apply eying the anti discrimination lot to create a 51 00:03:02.080 --> 00:03:05.719 barrier for religious schools. After the hard fought Supreme Court victory. 52 00:03:05.919 --> 00:03:09.520 The main legislature largely deprived this is a quote. The 53 00:03:09.560 --> 00:03:12.680 main legislature largely deprived the client of the fruits of 54 00:03:12.719 --> 00:03:15.919 their victory by amending the law, said David hack Hacker 55 00:03:15.960 --> 00:03:18.560 from the First Liberty Institute, which filed the appeal this 56 00:03:18.599 --> 00:03:21.479 week to the First US Circuit Court of Appeals in Boston. 57 00:03:21.680 --> 00:03:25.879 Here's the stinger. Here, it's engineered to target a specific 58 00:03:26.000 --> 00:03:29.960 religious group. That's unconstitutional. And so, going back to what 59 00:03:30.000 --> 00:03:33.400 you were asking about the tensions between religious freedom and 60 00:03:33.479 --> 00:03:36.639 the anti discrimination protections, here we have religious groups that 61 00:03:36.680 --> 00:03:40.080 are specifically saying, if you tell me I can't discriminate, 62 00:03:40.240 --> 00:03:41.840 that's going against my religion. 63 00:03:41.960 --> 00:03:44.560 I mean, that is just a that is literally saying 64 00:03:44.599 --> 00:03:45.439 the quiet. 65 00:03:45.080 --> 00:03:45.800 Part out loud. 66 00:03:45.800 --> 00:03:48.159 I mean, you couldn't have much of a bigger admission 67 00:03:48.199 --> 00:03:52.039 than that. They're saying. Nobody said anything about Christianity. No, 68 00:03:52.479 --> 00:03:55.439 it was about discrimination. If you accept these funds, you 69 00:03:55.479 --> 00:03:58.039 can't discriminate. Wait a minute, why are you picking on 70 00:03:58.159 --> 00:03:58.960 Christians like that? 71 00:03:59.159 --> 00:03:59.599 Whoops? 72 00:04:00.199 --> 00:04:00.639 Say there. 73 00:04:01.000 --> 00:04:05.719 I mean, it's definitely characteristic of the types of things 74 00:04:05.759 --> 00:04:09.080 that we cover very often on the nonprofits and it 75 00:04:09.840 --> 00:04:12.840 perfectly illustrates that tension that you're talking about. We have 76 00:04:13.120 --> 00:04:17.000 religious groups that want to be free to discriminate because 77 00:04:17.040 --> 00:04:20.120 of their religion, and then we have the government whose job, 78 00:04:20.519 --> 00:04:22.680 in theory at least, is to protect the rights of 79 00:04:22.759 --> 00:04:27.720 everybody from being discriminated against. And so you know, it's 80 00:04:28.240 --> 00:04:30.639 I don't think it's going to be going and anytime soon. 81 00:04:30.720 --> 00:04:32.720 But I'm not surprised that we have so many stories 82 00:04:32.800 --> 00:04:34.800 like this on just this topic. 83 00:04:35.079 --> 00:04:38.399 You know, it's so interesting, And then AJM want to 84 00:04:38.399 --> 00:04:41.560 bring you into it, because like this is just nothing 85 00:04:41.600 --> 00:04:45.000 but a circulation of history. If you guys remember, you know, 86 00:04:45.079 --> 00:04:47.240 for those of you all who may be out there 87 00:04:47.360 --> 00:04:51.240 in Internet land who are old enough to remember that 88 00:04:52.519 --> 00:04:57.680 Liberty University and Bob Jones University were told specifically and 89 00:04:57.720 --> 00:05:00.000 they lost the Supreme Court case back in this say 90 00:05:00.879 --> 00:05:05.279 that said that if you want to receive government funds, 91 00:05:05.759 --> 00:05:10.199 you cannot discriminate against who you could have coming to 92 00:05:10.319 --> 00:05:15.920 your school. And at that time they were actively keeping 93 00:05:16.160 --> 00:05:20.959 out black students from their schools. I would love to 94 00:05:21.040 --> 00:05:23.160 ask the black students at the time who applied to 95 00:05:23.199 --> 00:05:25.800 go to Bob Jones University and Liberty University, what the 96 00:05:25.800 --> 00:05:29.480 fuck is wrong with you? But I digress. They said 97 00:05:29.560 --> 00:05:34.639 to them, hey, you cannot discriminate your emissions, so you 98 00:05:34.800 --> 00:05:38.199 have to or let them in if you want to 99 00:05:38.240 --> 00:05:42.279 get funds, right, and they reluctantly did it. And then 100 00:05:42.360 --> 00:05:46.160 then they changed their politics to be, you know, against abortion, 101 00:05:46.319 --> 00:05:48.879 which historically they weren't. Just the way they can rally 102 00:05:48.879 --> 00:05:50.639 the right. But you know, that's a different story and 103 00:05:50.680 --> 00:05:54.000 it's a different topic. So but I found it like 104 00:05:54.079 --> 00:05:58.920 so ironic that religious institutions like Liberty University, like Bob 105 00:05:59.000 --> 00:06:02.800 Jones University, it's basically doing the same damn thing all 106 00:06:02.959 --> 00:06:06.600 over again in twenty twenty four. I mean, o MG. 107 00:06:07.240 --> 00:06:09.680 But this is my issue, and this is what I'm 108 00:06:09.680 --> 00:06:12.240 concerned about. And then, AG, I want you to respond. 109 00:06:12.800 --> 00:06:16.879 My concern is that now the target is LGBTQI plus people, 110 00:06:17.480 --> 00:06:21.279 and the argument could be, of course, we can discriminate 111 00:06:21.319 --> 00:06:28.199 against the LGBTQ community because their mere existence is sinful. 112 00:06:28.680 --> 00:06:33.360 God doesn't like these people, therefore we don't like these people, 113 00:06:33.720 --> 00:06:37.160 and therefore we can discriminate. AJ Now that I have 114 00:06:37.199 --> 00:06:38.800 brought that up, what are your. 115 00:06:38.720 --> 00:06:43.240 Thoughts, Scott said? He said he was not surprised, and 116 00:06:43.279 --> 00:06:46.040 here I am why am I not surprised that a 117 00:06:46.120 --> 00:06:51.199 religious organization is asking basically for permission to be hateful. 118 00:06:51.480 --> 00:06:55.399 Two of the schools involved in the lawsuit in Maine, 119 00:06:55.519 --> 00:06:58.439 Cross Point Church and Saint Dominic's Academy, which is a 120 00:06:58.439 --> 00:07:03.959 Catholic church. I tend to not follow these anti excuminatory laws, 121 00:07:04.079 --> 00:07:07.360 and this allows a qual any school participating in the 122 00:07:07.399 --> 00:07:11.240 tuition program religious or not to buide by the main 123 00:07:11.399 --> 00:07:16.959 Human Rights Act. This Act includes protections for LGBTQ students 124 00:07:16.959 --> 00:07:20.000 and faculty, so it goes for both all of the 125 00:07:20.040 --> 00:07:24.079 students and the people that were there, the teachers, the janitor, anybody. 126 00:07:24.879 --> 00:07:30.879 But so right here, these are protections for gender identity, 127 00:07:30.959 --> 00:07:35.160 for example, for expression, for sexual orientation, and they're also 128 00:07:35.319 --> 00:07:39.480 made it illegal for these types of schools or institutions 129 00:07:39.560 --> 00:07:44.399 to force students into conversion therapy, which was only banned 130 00:07:44.639 --> 00:07:48.560 very recently in twenty nineteen in Maine, and there are 131 00:07:48.639 --> 00:07:55.079 still twenty states in the United States that allow conversion therapy, 132 00:07:55.319 --> 00:07:59.560 including Oklahoma, Nebraska, Louisiana, and Texas. Right, and these kinds 133 00:07:59.600 --> 00:08:03.399 of school want to be able to use public school 134 00:08:03.560 --> 00:08:06.199 funds and they want to draw them for the vultures 135 00:08:06.360 --> 00:08:11.839 and then do eaching programs, all the while discriminating freely 136 00:08:12.000 --> 00:08:16.600 against LGBTQ people the same way that they discriminated back 137 00:08:16.639 --> 00:08:17.920 then against black people. 138 00:08:18.160 --> 00:08:19.920 You know, I would just want to tell these people 139 00:08:19.959 --> 00:08:22.360 like listen, yeah, go ahead to discriminate all you want, 140 00:08:22.399 --> 00:08:24.519 but you can't use taxpayer moneys in order for you 141 00:08:24.560 --> 00:08:25.639 to fund to run. 142 00:08:25.600 --> 00:08:29.240 Teams obvious, yeah, forward, Yeah. 143 00:08:29.079 --> 00:08:31.160 Yeah, I mean like it was the same way with 144 00:08:31.240 --> 00:08:33.639 Liberty University and Bob Jones University, Like, hey, if you 145 00:08:33.639 --> 00:08:35.879 don't want to let black people in, you can't get fundled, 146 00:08:35.879 --> 00:08:38.559 you can't get federal funding, right yeah, And it's the 147 00:08:38.559 --> 00:08:41.000 same way with these particular schools, like listen, if you 148 00:08:41.039 --> 00:08:43.639 want to take advantage of getting state state funding in 149 00:08:43.720 --> 00:08:46.559 order for you to operate, then you can't discriminate. If 150 00:08:46.600 --> 00:08:49.759 you want to discriminate, then do it on your own dine, 151 00:08:49.840 --> 00:08:51.600 don't do it on ours. 152 00:08:51.200 --> 00:08:52.519 Right yeah. Yeah. 153 00:08:52.559 --> 00:08:55.840 And it's not just uh, you know, racial issues too, 154 00:08:55.879 --> 00:09:00.120 there's also LGBTQ issues as you mentioned, but also on 155 00:09:00.240 --> 00:09:03.000 hiring practices too. You know, if if they accept, if 156 00:09:03.000 --> 00:09:05.720 they accept these monies, then they not only have a 157 00:09:05.759 --> 00:09:09.720 responsibility to their students, but also to their faculty and staff. 158 00:09:09.840 --> 00:09:12.480 And so that's been a that's been a rubbing point 159 00:09:12.519 --> 00:09:15.879 as well. And so yeah, it it boils down to this. 160 00:09:16.120 --> 00:09:18.960 You know, we want religious freedom, and that means we 161 00:09:19.080 --> 00:09:21.360 also want to be able to break these other laws 162 00:09:21.440 --> 00:09:24.919 about discrimination. And you know it's really it's really uh 163 00:09:25.039 --> 00:09:30.360 an offensive privileged position, and it's it's surprising to me 164 00:09:30.519 --> 00:09:33.039 it's not surprising that they're doing it, but it's surprising 165 00:09:33.080 --> 00:09:36.000 to me that they are able to uh say these 166 00:09:36.080 --> 00:09:38.360 kind of things out in public in front of people, 167 00:09:38.720 --> 00:09:42.440 and uh yeah and there, and they're they're expecting to 168 00:09:42.519 --> 00:09:47.039 be respected for that, like they're like they're sticking with 169 00:09:47.159 --> 00:09:50.039 their religious guns here, and it's it's, I don't know, 170 00:09:50.120 --> 00:09:54.000 it's really appalling. If it's just another example of where 171 00:09:54.039 --> 00:09:56.960 where's the harm and religion? If if you know, if 172 00:09:56.960 --> 00:09:59.279 it takes if good people do good things and bad 173 00:09:59.279 --> 00:10:01.720 people do bad thing, but it takes religious something like 174 00:10:01.759 --> 00:10:04.799 religion to make good people do bad things. Here's some 175 00:10:04.799 --> 00:10:08.679 good people doing presumably doing some bad things, and it's 176 00:10:08.720 --> 00:10:10.840 because of this, I mean, it's I don't know. I 177 00:10:10.879 --> 00:10:13.519 almost want to just say, I'm not going to comment. 178 00:10:13.639 --> 00:10:16.159 You can keep talking, because you're making my case for 179 00:10:16.320 --> 00:10:17.080 me kind of a thing. 180 00:10:17.679 --> 00:10:21.039 Yeah, exactly, Like you know, the more that you actually 181 00:10:21.159 --> 00:10:25.039 keep using these hateful narratives in order for you to 182 00:10:25.080 --> 00:10:28.679 push your point, the more that you are look, you know, 183 00:10:28.799 --> 00:10:30.799 making our argument work for. 184 00:10:30.840 --> 00:10:32.759 Us, exactly. Yeah. 185 00:10:32.799 --> 00:10:35.399 But I want to ask you both, what do you 186 00:10:35.519 --> 00:10:40.480 think or how do you think the personal stories like 187 00:10:40.600 --> 00:10:44.639 those families involved in these lawsuits are shaping or can 188 00:10:44.759 --> 00:10:48.120 shape public opinion. Ag I want you to chime in 189 00:10:48.200 --> 00:10:51.159 on that, and then Scott, I want you to reply. 190 00:10:51.720 --> 00:10:55.759 So, I think these stories actually shape both sides. They 191 00:10:55.799 --> 00:10:59.559 can shape this side of religious people where they feel 192 00:10:59.639 --> 00:11:02.840 more empowered to come out and say all these hateful 193 00:11:02.960 --> 00:11:08.039 things and to demand to continue to demand unreasonable rewards. 194 00:11:08.080 --> 00:11:10.840 I guess you could say with the tuition programs, because 195 00:11:10.879 --> 00:11:14.519 they think that no matter what rules they said, they 196 00:11:14.600 --> 00:11:17.720 still should be able to get the benefits. And at 197 00:11:17.759 --> 00:11:21.320 the same time, it brings light to all this hatefulness, 198 00:11:21.440 --> 00:11:25.960 and it allows people to realize how harmful this is becoming, 199 00:11:26.320 --> 00:11:31.519 and how we cannot allow all these religious organizations to 200 00:11:31.639 --> 00:11:35.320 draw from public funding that could go to public schools 201 00:11:35.519 --> 00:11:38.720 and use it for their indoctrination purposes. 202 00:11:40.320 --> 00:11:42.440 Scrit what about you? What do you think? How? 203 00:11:43.039 --> 00:11:45.240 I think AJ nailed it right there. 204 00:11:45.759 --> 00:11:51.279 I think that personal stories added an element to the 205 00:11:51.440 --> 00:11:55.519 to the data. Really, you know, we as human beings 206 00:11:55.559 --> 00:12:00.759 were very storytelling oriented. We try to describe things using stories. 207 00:12:01.000 --> 00:12:06.840 Our memory works based on storytelling associations, and so hearing 208 00:12:06.919 --> 00:12:10.440 a story of real harm that's being caused by these 209 00:12:10.480 --> 00:12:13.519 policies can have a huge impact on somebody. 210 00:12:13.639 --> 00:12:16.399 As as a statistics teacher, I also. 211 00:12:16.879 --> 00:12:20.039 Worry about having individual stories have too having too much 212 00:12:20.039 --> 00:12:23.840 of an impact, right we say we often say that anecdotes, 213 00:12:24.000 --> 00:12:26.639 the plural of anecdotes is not data. And so I 214 00:12:26.639 --> 00:12:28.759 think we just lost Cynthia. So we'll just keep talking 215 00:12:30.080 --> 00:12:33.240 until we get her back here. But but so having 216 00:12:33.240 --> 00:12:36.480 these personal stories too for for people to latch on 217 00:12:37.000 --> 00:12:40.639 can make a big difference here. And I want to 218 00:12:40.679 --> 00:12:44.879 point out something that that I saw in the Nebraska 219 00:12:45.039 --> 00:12:47.759 in the story on the Nebraska a ballot initiative AJ 220 00:12:47.919 --> 00:12:49.679 and then maybe you can you can comment on what 221 00:12:49.720 --> 00:12:50.360 I saw here. 222 00:12:50.759 --> 00:12:53.919 But I mean, not only are we uh. 223 00:12:53.840 --> 00:12:56.279 Is it is it this being harmful to people, but 224 00:12:56.360 --> 00:13:00.639 it's really undermining the the voice of the public. Right, 225 00:13:00.679 --> 00:13:04.080 It's really I mean, we have this this what was 226 00:13:04.080 --> 00:13:06.639 he Secretary of State? Right not only does he want 227 00:13:06.679 --> 00:13:11.240 to uh support these school voucher programs, but he also 228 00:13:11.360 --> 00:13:15.679 wants to keep the public from airing their opinion on it. 229 00:13:15.919 --> 00:13:19.840 And and that's really what what the ballot initiative was for. 230 00:13:20.000 --> 00:13:24.120 And so Cynthia, we went on to another question while you. 231 00:13:24.080 --> 00:13:28.279 Were away, So I hope we can reconnect here when 232 00:13:28.320 --> 00:13:31.159 when I'm done with this. But but yeah, so, I mean, 233 00:13:31.240 --> 00:13:33.480 I I read when I was doing my research for this, 234 00:13:33.559 --> 00:13:36.399 I came across a claim in Forbes magazine, and I 235 00:13:36.440 --> 00:13:39.039 couldn't verify this, so I'm just offering it for food 236 00:13:39.039 --> 00:13:39.440 for thought. 237 00:13:39.480 --> 00:13:40.799 But their claim was that no. 238 00:13:40.799 --> 00:13:43.799 Voucher proposal has ever survived a direct vote by a 239 00:13:43.840 --> 00:13:47.879 state's taxpayers. And whether or not that's true, that's certainly 240 00:13:47.919 --> 00:13:51.440 what's what's happening here is that there's a clear majority 241 00:13:51.960 --> 00:13:55.879 among the taxpayers that want this thing repealed. They they 242 00:13:56.240 --> 00:14:01.240 they had a certain amount of thousands of signatures that 243 00:14:01.279 --> 00:14:03.759 they needed, and they went several thousand beyond that, and 244 00:14:03.799 --> 00:14:08.360 so there's this massive upwelling of support for for repealing this, uh, 245 00:14:08.440 --> 00:14:12.559 this law that allows Nebraska to funnel money into private 246 00:14:12.919 --> 00:14:17.480 religious organizations. But it's just really underhanded the way this 247 00:14:17.600 --> 00:14:20.559 Secretary of State is approaching this. He's he's literally trying 248 00:14:20.759 --> 00:14:22.919 to shut the public up when his job is the 249 00:14:22.960 --> 00:14:23.960 exact opposite of that. 250 00:14:24.200 --> 00:14:29.639 Sorry, Cynthia, You're you're You're totally fine, because that was 251 00:14:29.679 --> 00:14:32.919 actually where I was heading to, is about the referrera. 252 00:14:32.799 --> 00:14:34.879 Right, Yeah, we're we're here. 253 00:14:35.200 --> 00:14:35.960 Yeah. 254 00:14:37.480 --> 00:14:39.360 The first question on the Nebraska. 255 00:14:40.000 --> 00:14:48.840 Yeah, yeah, Glenn added all of this anyway, Oh yes, 256 00:14:49.759 --> 00:14:53.039 but yeah, but I I but I did want. 257 00:14:52.840 --> 00:14:55.399 To talk a little bit more about the referendum because, like, 258 00:14:55.480 --> 00:14:59.720 you know, I'm thinking that that in my head if 259 00:14:59.720 --> 00:15:02.519 we're like trying to do like a correlation between both 260 00:15:02.559 --> 00:15:06.720 of these stories. You have one area where you know, 261 00:15:07.159 --> 00:15:10.840 they don't want to they don't want to let in 262 00:15:11.000 --> 00:15:13.919 certain students or they want to feel free to discriminate 263 00:15:14.279 --> 00:15:18.360 against students, against faculty and still get you know, government funding. 264 00:15:18.919 --> 00:15:23.759 But going on to Nebraska, we have like the whole 265 00:15:23.879 --> 00:15:28.360 portion of the public being able to weigh in on 266 00:15:28.759 --> 00:15:33.759 if they want to repeal the program, the private school funding, 267 00:15:34.320 --> 00:15:38.440 and you actually seem to have support from the public 268 00:15:38.720 --> 00:15:41.519 to say that, yes, this is something that we want 269 00:15:41.559 --> 00:15:45.200 to do. But the Secretary of State is like nauhh, 270 00:15:45.679 --> 00:15:48.840 you know, because that is the best argument ever to 271 00:15:48.919 --> 00:15:53.120 have in life, as we all know. But I'm wondering, 272 00:15:53.480 --> 00:15:57.000 and I think that you possibly touched on this a bit, Scott, 273 00:15:57.759 --> 00:16:00.200 but AJ if you can kind of just like you know, 274 00:16:00.279 --> 00:16:04.120 running with your your thoughts about it's like, how can 275 00:16:04.240 --> 00:16:09.200 shifts in state legislation like those scene in Nebraska impact 276 00:16:09.240 --> 00:16:15.600 the accessibility and funding of public education compared to private education. 277 00:16:16.120 --> 00:16:26.519 That it is a good question, right and. 278 00:16:27.080 --> 00:16:30.159 Scott, if you want to jump in on that question, 279 00:16:30.360 --> 00:16:35.000 and then AJ you can first reply to your thoughts, 280 00:16:35.399 --> 00:16:36.320 please do so. 281 00:16:36.759 --> 00:16:38.240 Could you give me a quick repeat? 282 00:16:39.399 --> 00:16:43.399 I certainly can. I really can. Watch out here, here's 283 00:16:43.440 --> 00:16:50.120 a repeat, Glenn edit. How can how can shifts in 284 00:16:50.279 --> 00:16:55.440 state legislation like those scene in Nebraska impact the accessibility 285 00:16:55.639 --> 00:16:59.679 and funding of public education compared to private education? 286 00:17:00.080 --> 00:17:00.320 Sure? 287 00:17:00.399 --> 00:17:04.519 And and and if by that if you mean shifts 288 00:17:04.599 --> 00:17:09.240 towards supporting voucher programs, then I mean I've talked about 289 00:17:09.279 --> 00:17:12.920 voucher programs so many times on the nonprofits. It's just 290 00:17:13.480 --> 00:17:15.640 it's it's like a permanent record going on in my 291 00:17:15.720 --> 00:17:19.559 mind right now. And the voucher programs undermine public education 292 00:17:20.000 --> 00:17:22.960 significantly in many different ways. But as you're talking about, 293 00:17:23.119 --> 00:17:25.799 it makes it difficult for those schools to uh, to 294 00:17:25.960 --> 00:17:29.279 get some of the funding, I mean, to support their programs, 295 00:17:29.279 --> 00:17:32.640 and so the programs suffer, and so then they give 296 00:17:32.640 --> 00:17:35.640 the impression that the public schools are not doing as well. 297 00:17:35.839 --> 00:17:37.680 Why are they not doing as well? Maybe they're not 298 00:17:37.720 --> 00:17:39.880 as good, you know, And and so let's give them 299 00:17:39.920 --> 00:17:43.000 even less money, and so it can it can start 300 00:17:43.079 --> 00:17:45.640 kind of this snowball effect, which I don't know. I 301 00:17:45.640 --> 00:17:47.559 don't know this for sure, but I have a strong 302 00:17:47.599 --> 00:17:51.359 suspicion that destroying the public education system is part of 303 00:17:51.400 --> 00:17:54.480 the plan. And it sure seems that way to me, 304 00:17:54.559 --> 00:17:57.880 at least it sure seems that way. And so so 305 00:17:58.000 --> 00:18:00.359 when we like in Nebraska, when we see the books 306 00:18:00.359 --> 00:18:03.440 starting to push to push back, then we can see 307 00:18:03.519 --> 00:18:06.480 what the lawmaker what they need to resort to. 308 00:18:06.880 --> 00:18:11.240 They need to give their argument and say, oops, I 309 00:18:11.279 --> 00:18:13.319 approve that, but I need that back. Can I have 310 00:18:13.359 --> 00:18:14.920 that back? Can you just give you that back to me? 311 00:18:15.279 --> 00:18:18.519 And then I'll deny it instead, And you know, it's 312 00:18:18.640 --> 00:18:22.359 just it's I don't know, it's just not flying. Well, 313 00:18:22.680 --> 00:18:25.680 in this case, it's not flying because the Nebraska Supreme 314 00:18:25.680 --> 00:18:30.720 Court supported his initial assessment of the program. But yeah, 315 00:18:30.799 --> 00:18:34.960 I mean, it's just voucher programs already target that money 316 00:18:35.000 --> 00:18:38.119 that's needed by the public education system, and this just 317 00:18:38.440 --> 00:18:39.720 exacerbates that whole thing. 318 00:18:40.079 --> 00:18:43.759 Yeah, I think god Scott just said, it's actually very true. 319 00:18:44.160 --> 00:18:46.359 It is part of the plan, because it is part 320 00:18:46.400 --> 00:18:50.640 of what the conservative said is trying to do, specifically 321 00:18:50.680 --> 00:18:54.640 with Project twenty twenty five, they are actually trying to 322 00:18:54.880 --> 00:18:58.880 not just not just use the voucher programs, but actually 323 00:18:59.119 --> 00:19:02.279 completely under my and then Department of Education. And this 324 00:19:02.480 --> 00:19:05.519 coast shows that they are trying to make it to 325 00:19:06.559 --> 00:19:09.119 less people are going to go into public schools and 326 00:19:09.200 --> 00:19:12.240 more people are going to go into all these private schools, 327 00:19:12.240 --> 00:19:15.440 which believe about seventy five percent are religious. 328 00:19:16.079 --> 00:19:20.640 Right, it's not even like undermined the Department of Education. 329 00:19:20.680 --> 00:19:22.880 They want to completely get rid of it. Yeah, yeah, 330 00:19:23.240 --> 00:19:25.640 completely get rid of it and just basically just have 331 00:19:26.000 --> 00:19:30.519 the control of how education looks be determined by the state. 332 00:19:30.880 --> 00:19:34.200 But the scary part about any of this, like when 333 00:19:34.200 --> 00:19:36.079 we're looking at whether if we look at Maine, if 334 00:19:36.079 --> 00:19:38.319 we look at Nebraska, or if we even look at 335 00:19:38.359 --> 00:19:40.200 like you know, other states that we have covered on 336 00:19:40.240 --> 00:19:44.359 the nonprofits previously, is that we already know that school 337 00:19:44.440 --> 00:19:48.559 voucher programs are not equitable. They are going to and 338 00:19:48.680 --> 00:19:53.880 school choice is not real choice choice. Yeah. And also 339 00:19:54.519 --> 00:19:57.880 the main people that are going to suffer under particular 340 00:19:57.880 --> 00:20:01.039 programs like this, especially when you diverse money away from 341 00:20:01.039 --> 00:20:05.359 the public education system on marginalized groups and yeah, and 342 00:20:05.759 --> 00:20:09.880 so and especially like if you are able to have 343 00:20:10.000 --> 00:20:14.599 funding on the public level, go to a private school 344 00:20:14.880 --> 00:20:20.680 that is allowed to discriminate. What type of education do 345 00:20:20.759 --> 00:20:24.680 you believe will be accessible to those who happen to 346 00:20:24.720 --> 00:20:28.240 be in a marginalized community if they want to roll 347 00:20:28.319 --> 00:20:32.839 back protections for LGBTQ people, or even if we say, hey, 348 00:20:32.920 --> 00:20:36.160 we want to go back to how we used to operating, 349 00:20:36.279 --> 00:20:40.599 Jim Crow. You know, and as we talked about even 350 00:20:40.640 --> 00:20:44.799 in earlier segments, how a young person at the time 351 00:20:45.240 --> 00:20:48.960 was exposed to racist rhetoric and it was backed up 352 00:20:49.000 --> 00:20:52.359 by the Bible, and that is what that particular church 353 00:20:52.519 --> 00:20:55.920 used in order for them to say that you being 354 00:20:55.960 --> 00:20:59.039 who you are because you are you're black or what 355 00:20:59.160 --> 00:21:03.119 have you, that you are automatically inferior so and God 356 00:21:03.160 --> 00:21:05.400 and God made you that way. So that means that 357 00:21:05.480 --> 00:21:08.839 you have to have a subservient attitude and you also 358 00:21:08.960 --> 00:21:14.400 have to have a subpar living condition, subpar education, subpart everything, 359 00:21:14.480 --> 00:21:16.799 because that is the position that you're supposed to be. 360 00:21:17.440 --> 00:21:19.960 But you know, I'm curious to know, and both of 361 00:21:20.000 --> 00:21:22.480 you are, please weigh in on this. A j I 362 00:21:22.519 --> 00:21:25.000 want you to start, and then Scott, I'll have you 363 00:21:25.079 --> 00:21:30.480 round up what strategies my public school advocates employ to 364 00:21:30.640 --> 00:21:36.319 effectively counteract the financial resources of school choice proponents in 365 00:21:36.559 --> 00:21:37.839 upcoming elections. 366 00:21:37.960 --> 00:21:40.720 I think you know, I've got to really plays a 367 00:21:40.799 --> 00:21:45.559 key role in counteracting bad legislation, whether it has already 368 00:21:45.559 --> 00:21:49.160 been enacted or if it's something that is observing. I'm 369 00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:51.200 gonna have just thought of it. Did you hear anything? 370 00:21:51.759 --> 00:21:55.759 Yeah, is going to have the greatest time. 371 00:21:57.480 --> 00:21:58.039 Tonight. 372 00:21:59.440 --> 00:22:01.599 I must not from our start from the top to 373 00:22:01.640 --> 00:22:07.160 make it easier on them. Okay, So advocacy plays a 374 00:22:07.240 --> 00:22:11.240 key le in counteracting bad legislation, whether it has already 375 00:22:11.319 --> 00:22:15.279 been enacted or it's been voted on. And this isn't 376 00:22:15.319 --> 00:22:18.839 the first time that Republicans have tried to use public 377 00:22:18.920 --> 00:22:23.640 money to found private school tuition. Last year, Republicans in 378 00:22:23.680 --> 00:22:28.400 the Nebraska argislature actually passed a bill to allow corporations 379 00:22:28.400 --> 00:22:32.319 and individuals to divert millions of dollars that they owe 380 00:22:32.400 --> 00:22:37.480 in state income taxes to nonprofit organizations. Right then these 381 00:22:37.519 --> 00:22:41.640 non profits will give that money as a gifted scholarship 382 00:22:41.720 --> 00:22:45.440 to private schools. But we have to consider that nearly 383 00:22:45.480 --> 00:22:49.079 eighty percent of private schools in the US are religious. 384 00:22:49.359 --> 00:22:54.279 So public school advocates with their organization called Support Our 385 00:22:54.359 --> 00:22:59.200 Schools successfully gathered signators to repeal on that allow. However, 386 00:22:59.400 --> 00:23:04.039 Support of the Private school fundingbal just replaced the build 387 00:23:04.119 --> 00:23:07.880 with another one this year, and that dumped the tax 388 00:23:08.039 --> 00:23:13.440 credit funded funding system. And it's simply just awards private 389 00:23:13.519 --> 00:23:19.400 schools scholarships directly from state funds. That's a big problem here. 390 00:23:20.079 --> 00:23:22.960 Yeah, and I would echo that too. I think you 391 00:23:22.960 --> 00:23:25.599 know what Ago is talking about, advocacy. I think that's 392 00:23:25.680 --> 00:23:30.559 really the main weapon that we have to support public schools. 393 00:23:30.880 --> 00:23:33.920 It's because we're in an age of information, but we're 394 00:23:33.920 --> 00:23:36.680 also in an age of misinformation, and so I think 395 00:23:36.960 --> 00:23:40.920 I'm a strong believer that knowledge is power, and so 396 00:23:41.119 --> 00:23:44.240 knowing about the situation not only helps you to recognize 397 00:23:44.240 --> 00:23:47.200 that it's happening, which you know, many people, depending on 398 00:23:47.240 --> 00:23:49.640 your news source, depending on what part of the country 399 00:23:49.640 --> 00:23:52.079 you live in, depending on you know, are you part 400 00:23:52.079 --> 00:23:54.359 of your parents household, and you know, have to go 401 00:23:54.400 --> 00:23:56.200