WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.120 --> 00:00:01.000 Live in studio. 2 00:00:01.679 --> 00:00:05.480 After very successful johnts down to spring training, where he 3 00:00:05.639 --> 00:00:08.919 was in eighty degree weather every day, looking very tan 4 00:00:09.119 --> 00:00:12.679 and very rested. Forty years with the Utah Jazz Richard 5 00:00:12.720 --> 00:00:15.439 Smith Onday Wednesday afternoon, Smitty, Happy Wednesday, Sir? 6 00:00:15.480 --> 00:00:16.879 Are you same to you? Spence? 7 00:00:16.920 --> 00:00:19.199 It's good to be back in Salt Lake for a 8 00:00:19.199 --> 00:00:20.839 few days anyway. 9 00:00:20.800 --> 00:00:22.399 And you got something else coming up? 10 00:00:22.440 --> 00:00:25.800 Well? I always making a priority to stop by the drive, 11 00:00:26.160 --> 00:00:28.960 you know, whenever I'm in town and and make sure 12 00:00:29.000 --> 00:00:31.920 that I can I can bring your show down to 13 00:00:32.079 --> 00:00:35.119 the h down to the depths where it usually isn't 14 00:00:35.520 --> 00:00:37.240 isn't used to being when I'm on the air. 15 00:00:37.640 --> 00:00:39.399 Well, that's not true, as we all know. But what 16 00:00:39.719 --> 00:00:41.960 are you? Are you out again? You have another trip planned? 17 00:00:42.439 --> 00:00:43.920 You know what? You know what doing? Spence? 18 00:00:44.640 --> 00:00:50.280 I last year I volunteered to work at the UH 19 00:00:50.320 --> 00:00:54.159 the Indian Wells Tennis tournament down in Palm Springs, and 20 00:00:54.200 --> 00:00:57.679 that's coming around starting on Monday, and so we'll go 21 00:00:57.719 --> 00:00:59.679 heading back down there. I'm gonna work down there as 22 00:00:59.679 --> 00:01:03.159 a bombluntier and uh, I love you know, you know me, Spence. 23 00:01:03.359 --> 00:01:06.159 I love being out among the people, you know, and 24 00:01:06.840 --> 00:01:08.959 I'm a guy of the of the people, and so 25 00:01:09.519 --> 00:01:13.159 anything I can do to to help out the cause, uh, 26 00:01:13.200 --> 00:01:16.280 that that's where you'll find me. So so last year 27 00:01:16.280 --> 00:01:18.280 we did it, and and the first few days I worked. 28 00:01:18.280 --> 00:01:20.519 The first day, who walks right by me? And I 29 00:01:20.560 --> 00:01:23.319 do one of those double takes with Steve Nash and 30 00:01:23.359 --> 00:01:26.079 I go, is that Stevens? And then like the minute, lady, 31 00:01:26.079 --> 00:01:29.120 he walked back, you know by. And then next day 32 00:01:29.599 --> 00:01:33.760 who walks by Derk Novitski you know, just cruising, cruising, uh, 33 00:01:33.959 --> 00:01:36.920 cruising along the plaza there. So it's it's a it's 34 00:01:36.920 --> 00:01:40.719 a fun event. It's considered by tennis officionados as the 35 00:01:40.760 --> 00:01:44.519 fifth major, and so everybody plays both the the A 36 00:01:44.640 --> 00:01:48.840 t P and the w t A play uh, and 37 00:01:49.159 --> 00:01:51.400 so it's a fun tournament to be be part of. 38 00:01:51.480 --> 00:01:54.519 And so so we're heading down there, uh this week. 39 00:01:54.680 --> 00:01:56.000 Yeah, good for you, good for you. 40 00:01:56.120 --> 00:02:01.079 Well, while you were away, we had some news drop 41 00:02:01.319 --> 00:02:04.040 here locally where the University of Utah is now looking 42 00:02:04.040 --> 00:02:06.760 for a new head coach, Craig Smith relieved of his 43 00:02:06.840 --> 00:02:09.719 duties in his fourth year. It's a six year contract. 44 00:02:09.800 --> 00:02:12.120 He's due roughly five mill a little less than that. 45 00:02:13.319 --> 00:02:15.400 I think they're still paying Larry, So it's a lot 46 00:02:15.400 --> 00:02:17.400 of dead money to make coaches that you decided to 47 00:02:17.439 --> 00:02:20.280 move on from. Before we get into these kind of 48 00:02:20.319 --> 00:02:21.840 the nuts and bolts of but what was your reaction 49 00:02:21.879 --> 00:02:22.800 when you heard the news? 50 00:02:23.039 --> 00:02:24.879 Well, I was, first of all, I was very surprised 51 00:02:24.879 --> 00:02:27.919 that happened during the season. I was at the at 52 00:02:28.000 --> 00:02:31.919 the Kansas game the week earlier where they played well 53 00:02:31.960 --> 00:02:34.680 and and and be beat a good Kansas team that's 54 00:02:34.680 --> 00:02:37.319 been not not playing very well lately. But but we 55 00:02:37.360 --> 00:02:41.360 all know what they're about. And then they had the uh, 56 00:02:41.960 --> 00:02:45.520 the tough uh, the tough game against Central Florida the 57 00:02:45.560 --> 00:02:48.319 other day. Tough, tough way to lose a game at 58 00:02:48.319 --> 00:02:51.520 the end. But I'll tell you one thing, Craig Smith 59 00:02:51.680 --> 00:02:53.080 is is a very good coach. 60 00:02:53.719 --> 00:02:54.000 Uh. 61 00:02:54.080 --> 00:02:57.960 He works extremely hard at it. His teams really get 62 00:02:58.000 --> 00:03:03.439 after especially defensively. I'm surprised they did this. I don't 63 00:03:03.479 --> 00:03:06.639 know if it was a move made because of the 64 00:03:07.199 --> 00:03:10.159 coaching or they expect more. I don't know what you 65 00:03:10.159 --> 00:03:12.719 would expect more out of this roster. I don't think 66 00:03:12.719 --> 00:03:16.240 it's it's a great roster. I think it's what it 67 00:03:16.319 --> 00:03:19.800 really is. When you look at the standings is that 68 00:03:19.800 --> 00:03:22.599 they're a middle of the road Big twelve team at 69 00:03:22.599 --> 00:03:24.960 the moment. I don't know if it was an indictment 70 00:03:25.039 --> 00:03:29.000 on recruiting and not getting better players. I don't know 71 00:03:29.080 --> 00:03:32.360 what the thinking was behind the scenes, but I think 72 00:03:32.360 --> 00:03:37.960 it was, for me, my own personal opinion, very premature 73 00:03:38.039 --> 00:03:41.560 and very shortsighted. When you have a good coach like 74 00:03:41.599 --> 00:03:44.960 Craig Smith at the helm of your program, I think 75 00:03:45.000 --> 00:03:48.120 there are other ways to go about trying to strengthen 76 00:03:48.159 --> 00:03:50.800 and increase what you're trying to do. 77 00:03:50.759 --> 00:03:54.199 With that some good points there, and you know, let's 78 00:03:54.280 --> 00:03:55.719 kind of dig into some of the elements of this 79 00:03:55.759 --> 00:03:58.800 conversation before we get into what could come next and 80 00:03:58.840 --> 00:04:02.439 what that looks like. You know, my instant reaction was 81 00:04:02.479 --> 00:04:04.520 just kind of gutted for a good man, right, There's 82 00:04:04.560 --> 00:04:07.039 a personal side of these things that I don't think 83 00:04:07.080 --> 00:04:09.919 we cover very well on the media side, you know, 84 00:04:10.080 --> 00:04:12.120 And as you know, you know, my father was never 85 00:04:12.159 --> 00:04:14.240 a coach, but he was an executive and we uprooted 86 00:04:14.360 --> 00:04:17.079 several times because of his career. There's a family that 87 00:04:17.399 --> 00:04:21.120 has things, you know, kind of thrown into a little 88 00:04:21.160 --> 00:04:23.519 bit of chaos when a father loses a job and 89 00:04:23.519 --> 00:04:25.879 you've got to figure something out. The money, obviously, is 90 00:04:25.879 --> 00:04:29.000 a nice parachute in college sports. The reason why coaches 91 00:04:29.480 --> 00:04:34.319 negotiate buyouts like this is you're hired to be fired oftentimes. 92 00:04:34.920 --> 00:04:37.279 But like you, I was a little bit surprised. I 93 00:04:37.319 --> 00:04:40.079 kind of raised my eyebrows a little bit. So let's 94 00:04:40.160 --> 00:04:44.079 talk about the timing of it and why this could be. 95 00:04:44.399 --> 00:04:48.439 I've heard people say this gives the program some runway 96 00:04:48.680 --> 00:04:51.879 to retain some of the players, to get them back 97 00:04:51.920 --> 00:04:55.720 next year. I honestly don't know on this roster who 98 00:04:55.720 --> 00:04:57.160 you really want back next year. 99 00:04:57.199 --> 00:04:58.079 That's just my opinion. 100 00:04:58.079 --> 00:05:01.279 Because Gabe's a senior, so is Loss, and I think 101 00:05:01.360 --> 00:05:04.279 Jake Wallen's a nice player. I think Ezra Asar has 102 00:05:04.279 --> 00:05:07.519 shown some nice things. But I've heard that's one of 103 00:05:07.519 --> 00:05:11.120 the reasons I can't coroborate that. I really don't know why, 104 00:05:11.199 --> 00:05:13.800 because they had just be the two Kansas schools. This 105 00:05:13.839 --> 00:05:15.879 cannot be made just because they had a road loss 106 00:05:15.879 --> 00:05:18.040 to UCF. And if it's made because of that, that's 107 00:05:18.079 --> 00:05:20.720 like in a vacuum, which is unfair. So why do 108 00:05:20.759 --> 00:05:22.839 you think they decided to do this when there are 109 00:05:22.879 --> 00:05:24.240 still games left to be played? 110 00:05:24.360 --> 00:05:28.399 Well, I think One of the things is probably the 111 00:05:28.439 --> 00:05:33.199 notion that behind closed doors, if they thought, and they 112 00:05:33.279 --> 00:05:37.480 being the Athletic Department, Mark Harlan and whoever advises him 113 00:05:37.800 --> 00:05:40.879 or works with him in those kinds of things, if 114 00:05:40.920 --> 00:05:44.000 they were talking about this and it was something they 115 00:05:44.079 --> 00:05:49.240 had decided in their minds, we're going to do this anyway. 116 00:05:49.639 --> 00:05:53.720 It's an eventuality that we've come to the conclusion of doing, 117 00:05:54.279 --> 00:05:57.000 then you might as well do it, you know, when 118 00:05:57.040 --> 00:06:00.560 you feel comfortable that that's the decision and we're going 119 00:06:00.600 --> 00:06:03.879 to make anyway, you cut it clean, you cut it early. 120 00:06:04.279 --> 00:06:07.199 And then it also gives it gives you a chance 121 00:06:07.240 --> 00:06:10.000 a leg up on maybe other coaches who are either 122 00:06:10.040 --> 00:06:13.480 out there or coaches who might be uh interested or 123 00:06:13.519 --> 00:06:17.839 and or available, uh to get a head up on 124 00:06:17.839 --> 00:06:20.800 on maybe getting in with them in terms of conversations 125 00:06:20.839 --> 00:06:24.399 about about the job. The flip side of it for me, 126 00:06:24.519 --> 00:06:27.720 Spence is when you do this in the college ranks, 127 00:06:28.399 --> 00:06:33.319 it really in some regards, it really smacks of a 128 00:06:33.360 --> 00:06:38.680 little bit of uh urgency by the program. Uh, you know, 129 00:06:38.800 --> 00:06:43.000 a little bit of maybe excitability by the by the 130 00:06:43.120 --> 00:06:48.000 decision makers that they're uh, they're nervous or they're anxious 131 00:06:48.040 --> 00:06:51.160 about what's going on, and they're not They don't quite 132 00:06:51.759 --> 00:06:54.439 like what's happening now, so they're just gonna they're just 133 00:06:54.480 --> 00:06:57.480 gonna cut the cord. Uh. With that, I don't I 134 00:06:57.480 --> 00:07:00.199 don't like that feeling. I don't like the fact that 135 00:07:00.199 --> 00:07:04.800 that that you're not letting that coaching staff and those 136 00:07:04.839 --> 00:07:07.519 players see through the end of the season to see 137 00:07:07.519 --> 00:07:10.199 what could happen. You know, they've had some good wins, 138 00:07:10.600 --> 00:07:13.279 but but hey, you know, the the other part of 139 00:07:13.319 --> 00:07:16.959 it also is there they're one in seven on the road, uh, 140 00:07:17.079 --> 00:07:18.240 you know, in the Big twelve. 141 00:07:19.319 --> 00:07:20.600 But but you know. 142 00:07:20.639 --> 00:07:22.439 They look at the standing and say, well, do you 143 00:07:22.959 --> 00:07:26.160 the Big twelve or sixteen teams and their tenth and 144 00:07:26.199 --> 00:07:28.959 they're right in the middle. To me, we talked about 145 00:07:28.959 --> 00:07:31.920 that spence when the season began. That's what I expected 146 00:07:31.959 --> 00:07:34.439 them to be. I didn't expect them to be any 147 00:07:34.480 --> 00:07:37.120 world beaters in the in the Big twelve. Uh. They 148 00:07:37.160 --> 00:07:39.680 got a lot of heavy hitters in this league. And 149 00:07:40.600 --> 00:07:43.040 you know, if they want to make something, they want 150 00:07:43.120 --> 00:07:47.319 to make something happen now and get ahead of the curve. 151 00:07:47.560 --> 00:07:52.560 That's probably what I would assume they're they're thinking. I'm 152 00:07:52.600 --> 00:07:55.399 not sure it's a good look for the university when 153 00:07:55.480 --> 00:08:00.120 you do that, you know, during a season, Because to me, 154 00:08:00.759 --> 00:08:02.519 then it would say if I'm a coach, if I'm 155 00:08:02.519 --> 00:08:04.800 a perspective coach and I'm looking at that as a 156 00:08:04.879 --> 00:08:08.439 possible landing spot for me, the first thing I would 157 00:08:08.480 --> 00:08:11.360 say would be, Okay, who are the people calling the shots? 158 00:08:11.439 --> 00:08:14.920 Is it the the booster club, is it the athletic director? 159 00:08:15.360 --> 00:08:19.240 Are there other people involved in that decision making process? 160 00:08:19.519 --> 00:08:21.920 And who are they that I'm going to be working 161 00:08:21.959 --> 00:08:25.759 with that would make this kind of a decision during 162 00:08:25.800 --> 00:08:28.600 a season with the current coaching staff, That's a thing 163 00:08:28.639 --> 00:08:31.600 that would would come back to me as a question 164 00:08:31.680 --> 00:08:34.000 I would want to have answered, you know, as a 165 00:08:34.039 --> 00:08:38.240 perspective candidate, because that tells me that that you know, 166 00:08:38.320 --> 00:08:41.080 maybe the you know, the people you're working for aren't 167 00:08:41.120 --> 00:08:44.279 with you in the row boat when it's sinking and 168 00:08:44.320 --> 00:08:47.159 aren't willing to stay with you when it's not going 169 00:08:47.200 --> 00:08:49.639 as well as they want it to that they jump 170 00:08:49.720 --> 00:08:52.600 ship on you. And that's a concern that I would 171 00:08:52.600 --> 00:08:53.240 have as well. 172 00:08:53.799 --> 00:08:58.279 For four years of data with Craig and you know, 173 00:08:58.360 --> 00:09:01.440 some good moments, some good wins, I just I'm sitting 174 00:09:01.519 --> 00:09:03.360 or shaking my head that we haven't had an NCAA 175 00:09:03.399 --> 00:09:06.759 tournament team here since twenty sixteen. I mean, it's it's 176 00:09:06.759 --> 00:09:11.039 nearly been a decade. And ultimately, I you know, I 177 00:09:11.080 --> 00:09:13.919 think a lot of this, from what I've been told, 178 00:09:14.120 --> 00:09:16.000 was booster driven. I don't know how much of this 179 00:09:16.200 --> 00:09:17.639 was just Mark making a call. 180 00:09:18.360 --> 00:09:18.840 Uh, you know. 181 00:09:18.919 --> 00:09:23.159 I could foresee a scenario where the Huntsman's of the world, 182 00:09:23.279 --> 00:09:26.159 the Echoes of the world, the Garths of the world, 183 00:09:26.879 --> 00:09:30.080 called Taylor Randall and say we're not with this. It's 184 00:09:30.120 --> 00:09:32.759 not working. It's not it's not moving the direction that 185 00:09:32.799 --> 00:09:35.720 we want. I know, you're out of town. Josh Grant 186 00:09:35.720 --> 00:09:37.600 came on the show two days ago and just went 187 00:09:37.720 --> 00:09:41.080 scorched earth on the entire thing, and he even said 188 00:09:41.080 --> 00:09:41.840 he was excited. 189 00:09:41.879 --> 00:09:43.080 Did they decided to do this? 190 00:09:43.639 --> 00:09:46.320 I can't coroborate any of this, but Josh's claim is 191 00:09:46.360 --> 00:09:50.799 several alumni tried to contact Craig to off for help, 192 00:09:51.039 --> 00:09:53.879 and Craig wasn't open to that, which I'm conflicted about 193 00:09:53.960 --> 00:09:56.039 if I'm honest, Because if I'm Craig, I say I'm 194 00:09:56.080 --> 00:09:59.360 running a program. I have a team to coach. You know, 195 00:09:59.600 --> 00:10:02.399 his job is not to uh, you know, kind of 196 00:10:02.519 --> 00:10:04.759 cout out or whatever the alumni want him to do. 197 00:10:04.879 --> 00:10:07.360 But when the heavy hitters, the guys that are writing 198 00:10:07.399 --> 00:10:09.960 the checks aren't happy with the directionsmittee. If you're Mark Carlin, 199 00:10:10.000 --> 00:10:11.639 you probably are kind of forced to do something. 200 00:10:11.840 --> 00:10:13.399 Well, I mean, and and that's the thing. 201 00:10:13.440 --> 00:10:15.320 If you if you're the head guy, you know, Mark 202 00:10:15.360 --> 00:10:18.399 Carlan is the athletic director, then who are you answering to? 203 00:10:18.759 --> 00:10:23.600 And and who who is your your constituency? You know, Look, 204 00:10:23.919 --> 00:10:27.559 if you know anything about basketball, if you're if you're 205 00:10:27.559 --> 00:10:30.679 a student of the game, if you profess to love 206 00:10:30.759 --> 00:10:34.440 the game and watch it, and you're sitting courtside and 207 00:10:34.480 --> 00:10:37.519 you're you're watching these players, and you're watching the teams 208 00:10:37.559 --> 00:10:41.480 that come through and who you're playing against, you cannot 209 00:10:41.639 --> 00:10:44.360 look at You could not look at the roster, you know, 210 00:10:44.440 --> 00:10:48.200 for the for Utah this year and and say, oh, 211 00:10:48.279 --> 00:10:51.720 that's a highly competitive team that's gonna be you know, 212 00:10:51.799 --> 00:10:54.440 you know, battle for a top four spot in the 213 00:10:54.480 --> 00:10:55.600 conference standings. 214 00:10:56.000 --> 00:10:56.279 Uh. 215 00:10:56.360 --> 00:11:01.080 They they don't have that kind of personnel. Souh. You 216 00:11:01.840 --> 00:11:04.919 as the athletic director and the people making those decisions, 217 00:11:05.080 --> 00:11:09.559 is that what you're basing your your your response, your 218 00:11:09.600 --> 00:11:12.879 your knee jerk reaction to h Are you doing it 219 00:11:12.919 --> 00:11:16.440 because you don't like the way the coach handles his team? 220 00:11:16.960 --> 00:11:20.200 You do it because you think they're not running the 221 00:11:20.279 --> 00:11:23.679 right offense, their their defense is it's stout enough in 222 00:11:23.759 --> 00:11:26.639 tough circum you know, whatever it is that that you 223 00:11:27.000 --> 00:11:30.600 that you think you're hanging your hat on. But but 224 00:11:30.720 --> 00:11:34.000 this team, you know, this program the way it is 225 00:11:34.039 --> 00:11:36.240 at the current time, and and and I can see 226 00:11:36.240 --> 00:11:38.480 some of this. You know, I'm a Craig Smith fan 227 00:11:38.600 --> 00:11:42.320 because I know him somewhat not great, but I know 228 00:11:42.399 --> 00:11:44.840 that he's a very good coach, and I know that 229 00:11:44.879 --> 00:11:49.480 he works extremely hard, you know, at it, and he's 230 00:11:49.519 --> 00:11:53.360 got a sincere will uh with his team and gets 231 00:11:53.360 --> 00:11:56.480 his team to buy into his approach and what he's 232 00:11:56.519 --> 00:12:00.799 trying to do. His issue this year has been that 233 00:12:00.879 --> 00:12:03.960 he just doesn't have the horses to stay in the race. 234 00:12:04.120 --> 00:12:08.799 That that's just that's a fact if you study basketball, 235 00:12:08.840 --> 00:12:11.759 if you know anything about it. They also had what, 236 00:12:11.960 --> 00:12:16.960 to me Spence was a very soft pre conference schedule, 237 00:12:17.320 --> 00:12:20.080 and so that makes their record look maybe a little 238 00:12:20.080 --> 00:12:23.039 bit better than what the team really is. And I 239 00:12:23.120 --> 00:12:27.240 understand that also in terms of college scheduling. Every college 240 00:12:27.240 --> 00:12:30.399 team tries to get you know, what they call built 241 00:12:30.440 --> 00:12:33.720 in wins in November and December to get your team, 242 00:12:33.879 --> 00:12:38.960 you know, positively affected and get them confidence for for 243 00:12:39.039 --> 00:12:44.240 going into their conference uh seasons each year. But if 244 00:12:44.480 --> 00:12:47.399 they made this decision based on boosters and based on 245 00:12:47.840 --> 00:12:50.720 you know, people who are paying you know, the money 246 00:12:50.759 --> 00:12:54.279 into ni L's or whatever it is, and they're letting 247 00:12:54.320 --> 00:12:57.039 those guys you know, have a loud voice in the room, 248 00:12:57.639 --> 00:13:01.639 then then that's really a major problem for the whole 249 00:13:01.679 --> 00:13:07.679 program in my opinion, because now you're you're expecting a 250 00:13:07.720 --> 00:13:12.679 coach to do miracles with a limited roster and limited 251 00:13:13.080 --> 00:13:15.360 resources that they have available to them. 252 00:13:15.519 --> 00:13:18.799 Yeah, I agree with you on the talent level of 253 00:13:18.840 --> 00:13:21.120 this team. I just every and I watch every game. 254 00:13:21.159 --> 00:13:23.240 I watch every minute of every Utah basketball game, and 255 00:13:23.279 --> 00:13:25.279 I've been to a grip of them this year, and 256 00:13:25.320 --> 00:13:27.840 I just felt like Craig did not have the same 257 00:13:27.879 --> 00:13:30.759 amount of talent as his peers did. And Big twelve 258 00:13:30.759 --> 00:13:34.000 plays specifically, you know, teams kind of rolling into the 259 00:13:34.039 --> 00:13:36.759 Huntsman Center with better players, or you know, Craig going 260 00:13:36.759 --> 00:13:39.720 out on the road and going into gyms. That Houston game, 261 00:13:40.200 --> 00:13:43.159 it wasn't even fair, Like, it wasn't even a fair fight. 262 00:13:43.559 --> 00:13:45.919 At one point, I think they had eight turnovers in 263 00:13:45.960 --> 00:13:49.440 three baskets because Houston defensively overwhelmed you. They could not 264 00:13:49.440 --> 00:13:51.559 even get a shot off. So I do believe that 265 00:13:51.639 --> 00:13:54.480 there is a talent issue with the current roster. Do 266 00:13:54.559 --> 00:13:56.639 respect to the young men who are working, young men 267 00:13:56.639 --> 00:13:59.000 who were working hard to get better. But the problem, 268 00:13:59.039 --> 00:14:02.120 tommitdt is in that's on the coach too, you know. 269 00:14:02.440 --> 00:14:06.080 So like of course, ultimately I am with you when 270 00:14:06.120 --> 00:14:08.240 it comes to, you know, being gutted and seeing a 271 00:14:08.240 --> 00:14:10.879 good man losing his job. But there is part of 272 00:14:10.919 --> 00:14:14.919 me that doesn't mind this statement that this is not 273 00:14:15.080 --> 00:14:19.039 good enough. We are a basketball community that once upon 274 00:14:19.080 --> 00:14:20.960 a time had a team at the University of Utah 275 00:14:21.080 --> 00:14:24.080 not just make the NCAA tournament, but make deep runs 276 00:14:24.120 --> 00:14:27.759 and almost win national championships. And I don't think it's 277 00:14:27.799 --> 00:14:31.799 a bad thing to want a different standard while at 278 00:14:31.799 --> 00:14:33.759 the same time feeling bad for a good man who's 279 00:14:33.759 --> 00:14:35.720 lost his job. I think two things can be true there. 280 00:14:36.159 --> 00:14:39.759 Yeah, well, I think again, I think there's other forces 281 00:14:39.799 --> 00:14:41.080 that get involved in that. 282 00:14:41.480 --> 00:14:42.000 I don't know. 283 00:14:42.399 --> 00:14:45.399 Again, I don't know, pretend to know what the University 284 00:14:45.399 --> 00:14:50.000 of Utah scenario is in that regard, I'm just surprised 285 00:14:50.320 --> 00:14:53.399 that it happens, you know, during the course of the season, 286 00:14:54.360 --> 00:14:56.919 when you've been watching this team and you just came off, 287 00:14:57.240 --> 00:14:59.879 you know, where you saw that a team that's not 288 00:15:00.080 --> 00:15:04.120 as talented can go out and uncertain nights, you know, 289 00:15:04.799 --> 00:15:10.320 give Arizona a run for the money. You know, play 290 00:15:10.440 --> 00:15:15.639 Kansas very well. You know, play b YU very well, 291 00:15:15.759 --> 00:15:18.120 which is a very you know, so you know, yeah, 292 00:15:18.240 --> 00:15:21.600 it's been an uneven season for them. I understand that, 293 00:15:22.679 --> 00:15:25.759 I have to. I have to guess that they wanted 294 00:15:25.759 --> 00:15:28.279 to get ahead of the curve on a decision that 295 00:15:28.759 --> 00:15:33.399 had already been made at some other point, and they 296 00:15:33.399 --> 00:15:35.679 were just trying to figure out the best way to 297 00:15:35.759 --> 00:15:38.720 do it and to maybe, uh, you know, get up 298 00:15:39.360 --> 00:15:41.879 ahead of the pack on a new hiring. 299 00:15:42.039 --> 00:15:44.000 All right, before we catch a break, we'll do pro 300 00:15:44.120 --> 00:15:46.559 basketball coming up on the other side, Let's talk smitty 301 00:15:46.600 --> 00:15:49.919 about what could come next. So, you know, one of 302 00:15:49.919 --> 00:15:53.639 my favorite things about March Madness and the NCAA Tournament 303 00:15:53.879 --> 00:15:58.440 is watching coaches that get an automatic you know, qualifier 304 00:15:58.559 --> 00:16:02.080 spot after winning the Hurriz or something, win a couple 305 00:16:02.159 --> 00:16:05.279 of games and their life changes because they parlay that 306 00:16:05.480 --> 00:16:08.559 run into a bigger job at a bigger school where 307 00:16:08.559 --> 00:16:10.600 you get paid in a way that you never have 308 00:16:10.679 --> 00:16:12.960 to work again. I mean, your life literally changes if 309 00:16:13.000 --> 00:16:15.039 you're one of these coaches that rises up through the ranks. 310 00:16:15.519 --> 00:16:19.360 So there's that direction, and Jeff Bordella from ESPN to 311 00:16:19.399 --> 00:16:22.679 put together list of these young coaches that are in 312 00:16:22.720 --> 00:16:26.360 line to get a bigger job u Se San Diego, 313 00:16:26.799 --> 00:16:31.159 Eric Olsen, Colorado State, Nico medved South Dakota State, Eric Henderson, 314 00:16:31.200 --> 00:16:34.759 Boise State, Leon Rice u c Irvine, Russell Turner. Those 315 00:16:34.759 --> 00:16:38.600 are the four coaches he lists as candidates for Utah 316 00:16:38.840 --> 00:16:41.759 that fit the mold of younger coaches at smaller schools 317 00:16:41.759 --> 00:16:44.320 that are kind of rising through the ranks. Now on 318 00:16:44.360 --> 00:16:47.240 the other side, the community seems to have latched on 319 00:16:47.320 --> 00:16:49.399 to this idea of Alex Jensen as your head coach 320 00:16:49.399 --> 00:16:53.240 and Andre Miller as your assistant. And five years ago 321 00:16:53.399 --> 00:16:57.039 when Mark fired Larry Kascoviak, I was asked about Alex 322 00:16:57.080 --> 00:16:59.919 as a possibility, and I thought smitty at the time 323 00:17:00.159 --> 00:17:03.240 you were working with him, he was Quinn's lead assistant 324 00:17:03.720 --> 00:17:05.400 with the work he did with Rudy and how many 325 00:17:05.440 --> 00:17:07.200 games you guys want. I thought Alex would get a 326 00:17:07.200 --> 00:17:10.599 look and get an MBA job. Five years later, he 327 00:17:10.640 --> 00:17:12.960 still hasn't out an NBA job. Maybe he views this 328 00:17:13.160 --> 00:17:16.200 as I am labeled as a lifetime assistant in the pros, 329 00:17:16.759 --> 00:17:18.359 and maybe he looks at the Utah job. 330 00:17:18.480 --> 00:17:19.240 What are your thoughts? 331 00:17:19.640 --> 00:17:21.680 Well, I don't know. I can't speak for Alex. I 332 00:17:21.759 --> 00:17:24.839 don't know what his you know, what his druthers would be. 333 00:17:26.319 --> 00:17:29.000 I think, you know, the whole idea of the concept 334 00:17:29.079 --> 00:17:33.200 of trying to bring trying to bring back your uh 335 00:17:33.240 --> 00:17:36.519 your former heroes, you know, to resurrect and save the 336 00:17:36.640 --> 00:17:39.039 day and and and get you right on top at 337 00:17:39.079 --> 00:17:42.160 the mountaintop. I think that's I think that's a little 338 00:17:42.480 --> 00:17:47.119 preposterous to expect that, you know, type of reaction. 339 00:17:48.240 --> 00:17:48.839 Uh, you know. 340 00:17:48.920 --> 00:17:51.400 I think people are just grasping it thrust. Now, these 341 00:17:51.480 --> 00:17:53.799 guys might have an interest, they may come and do it. 342 00:17:54.079 --> 00:17:56.640 I don't know any of that. I think what you're 343 00:17:56.640 --> 00:17:59.119 trying to do as a program is you're trying to 344 00:17:59.160 --> 00:18:02.880 find the best coach that you think can get you 345 00:18:03.559 --> 00:18:07.599 good players where you can compete. And and again, I'm 346 00:18:07.640 --> 00:18:10.680 going back to what I think and in my my 347 00:18:10.759 --> 00:18:14.839 own opinion as to what they were probably looking at 348 00:18:15.160 --> 00:18:18.920 in this regard with Craig Smith, is that is that 349 00:18:18.960 --> 00:18:21.160 they probably looked and said, hey, we just don't have 350 00:18:21.319 --> 00:18:23.920 We got to have someone who can recruit and get 351 00:18:23.960 --> 00:18:27.839 in better players to be able to compete, you know, 352 00:18:27.920 --> 00:18:31.240 the way that we think we should be because his 353 00:18:31.400 --> 00:18:36.079 basketball knowledge is acumen, his approach, all those things have 354 00:18:36.559 --> 00:18:40.839 proven to be successful. Do they think someone else they 355 00:18:41.079 --> 00:18:45.240 they have on their radar can bring in those players? 356 00:18:45.680 --> 00:18:48.000 Do you bring in those It's not like the old days, Spence, 357 00:18:48.039 --> 00:18:50.799 where you're recruited and you just tried to recruit on 358 00:18:50.880 --> 00:18:54.200 reputation and coaching and and the things that you can 359 00:18:54.640 --> 00:18:58.519 give to a player to help them along their path. Uh, 360 00:18:58.799 --> 00:19:01.200 and then you know you didn't have to worry about 361 00:19:01.279 --> 00:19:04.640 nil stuff. Now it seems to be all related to 362 00:19:04.680 --> 00:19:07.880 how much money you have available. And and you know, 363 00:19:08.160 --> 00:19:10.720 the whole college thing to me is so out of whack, 364 00:19:10.799 --> 00:19:14.000 and it's so so way out out there in space, 365 00:19:14.079 --> 00:19:18.319 because this is really not college athletics. This is now 366 00:19:18.480 --> 00:19:23.079 just another version of a pro approach because you're in fact, 367 00:19:23.400 --> 00:19:26.119 it's it's really even you can even look at it 368 00:19:26.680 --> 00:19:29.599 and and as you study it say that it's even 369 00:19:29.720 --> 00:19:35.200 more so another step beyond like the NBA, for example, 370 00:19:35.240 --> 00:19:39.359 which has salary caps in certain restricts. In in college 371 00:19:39.720 --> 00:19:42.000 you can just get offer guys whatever you can you 372 00:19:42.160 --> 00:19:45.279 have to offer them, and there's no there's no contracts. 373 00:19:45.559 --> 00:19:47.960 So the player can come, he can come for a 374 00:19:47.960 --> 00:19:51.319 freshman year. It doesn't work, it doesn't you know, whatever 375 00:19:51.359 --> 00:19:53.920 it is, he's playing better than what you thought he 376 00:19:54.160 --> 00:19:56.920 was or the nil that you have available for him. 377 00:19:57.119 --> 00:19:59.680 So he goes to another school the next year. You know, 378 00:19:59.680 --> 00:20:01.319 he does don't have to sit out a year. He 379 00:20:01.359 --> 00:20:03.720 doesn't have to, you know, get out of conference. You 380 00:20:03.799 --> 00:20:06.599 can just do whatever he wants. And so you know this, 381 00:20:06.599 --> 00:20:10.359 this notion of the wild wild West in college basketball 382 00:20:10.680 --> 00:20:11.559 is really true. 383 00:20:11.599 --> 00:20:12.799 And if you if you. 384 00:20:12.759 --> 00:20:15.240 Want to be one of those one of those guys 385 00:20:15.240 --> 00:20:18.839 that is competing, if that's your thing, then you have 386 00:20:18.880 --> 00:20:21.599 to do like the approach the b YU is taken, 387 00:20:21.680 --> 00:20:24.880 which is jumping all in and saying we're gonna set 388 00:20:24.920 --> 00:20:27.680 it up like an NBA program, or we're gonna we're 389 00:20:27.720 --> 00:20:29.720 gonna get a lot of money in the n i 390 00:20:29.880 --> 00:20:32.359 L and we're gonna start recruiting guys and you know, 391 00:20:32.519 --> 00:20:36.519 there's no way a b YU program gets in with 392 00:20:36.759 --> 00:20:39.079 a conversation, even with an AJ debanza. 393 00:20:39.599 --> 00:20:42.119 Uh, you know five years ago, there's no way. 394 00:20:42.440 --> 00:20:45.559 So so if your if that's what your goal is, 395 00:20:45.720 --> 00:20:48.960 if that's what your aim is toward, then you jump 396 00:20:49.079 --> 00:20:52.000 all in. And maybe that's what this is about, is 397 00:20:52.000 --> 00:20:55.359 about the you saying, Okay, we gotta we gotta get 398 00:20:55.680 --> 00:20:58.039 we gotta get some some headway here. So we gotta 399 00:20:58.079 --> 00:21:00.759 get a new start, and we had to figure out 400 00:21:00.759 --> 00:21:03.960 how to redirect the program from where it is at 401 00:21:03.960 --> 00:21:04.599