WEBVTT 1 00:00:21.719 --> 00:00:24.000 Olga Paz America. I'm Dan Pfeifer. You're about to hear 2 00:00:24.000 --> 00:00:26.160 a great conversation I just had with Amanda Liibman, co 3 00:00:26.239 --> 00:00:28.399 founder and president of Run for Something, an organization that 4 00:00:28.399 --> 00:00:30.760 has recruited more than two hundred and fifty thousand people 5 00:00:30.800 --> 00:00:32.880 to run for office since it's founding in twenty seventeen, 6 00:00:33.200 --> 00:00:35.079 and she's the author of When We're in Charge, the 7 00:00:35.119 --> 00:00:38.200 Next Generation's Guide to Leadership. I invited Amanda on because 8 00:00:38.240 --> 00:00:40.359 I wanted to hear her perspective on where Democrats are 9 00:00:40.359 --> 00:00:42.320 heading into the twenty twenty six midterms, how the fight 10 00:00:42.359 --> 00:00:45.119 between establishment and insurgent candidates is playing out in races 11 00:00:45.159 --> 00:00:48.640 across the country, especially in a heated Democratic primary in Michigan, 12 00:00:48.960 --> 00:00:51.759 and where the party goes from here. I also asked 13 00:00:51.799 --> 00:00:53.880 her about how grand Platnir's desician to drop out of 14 00:00:53.880 --> 00:00:56.359 the main Senate race could impact Democrats' chances of taking 15 00:00:56.359 --> 00:00:58.520 back the Senate, and what she thinks, as someone who 16 00:00:58.520 --> 00:01:01.399 has worked with thousands of candidates, about the recruitment inventing 17 00:01:01.439 --> 00:01:03.719 process that led him to jump into the race. It 18 00:01:03.759 --> 00:01:05.280 was a great conversation and we'll get to it in 19 00:01:05.280 --> 00:01:06.920 a minute, but before we do, If you want more 20 00:01:06.920 --> 00:01:09.680 analysis heading into the midterms, consider subscribing to my newsletter 21 00:01:09.680 --> 00:01:11.719 of the Message Box, where I pull back from day 22 00:01:11.719 --> 00:01:14.000 to day punditry to offer deeper analysis on the trends 23 00:01:14.000 --> 00:01:16.879 affecting our politics. Go to crookad dot com FLUS Yes 24 00:01:16.920 --> 00:01:18.920 we Dan for a twenty percent disc on your subscription, 25 00:01:19.439 --> 00:01:22.400 and as always, considered becoming a paying subscriber to Friends 26 00:01:22.439 --> 00:01:24.680 of the Pod, where you'll get this episode in many 27 00:01:24.719 --> 00:01:27.159 more ad free, which now includes ad free episodes of 28 00:01:27.200 --> 00:01:30.439 Alex Wagner's phenomenal Runaway Country. Head to crooked dot com 29 00:01:30.480 --> 00:01:33.400 slash friends to subscribe today. All right, here's Amanda Libman. 30 00:01:33.519 --> 00:01:35.840 Amanda Lipman, Welcome back to Potsave America. 31 00:01:36.000 --> 00:01:37.079 Thanks for having me Dan. 32 00:01:37.400 --> 00:01:38.920 I wanted to have you on for so many reasons. 33 00:01:38.959 --> 00:01:40.920 I want to talk about the midterms. I want to 34 00:01:40.920 --> 00:01:42.879 talk about the battle within the Democratic Party between the 35 00:01:42.959 --> 00:01:46.439 insurgents and the establishment, the left, the right, etc. But 36 00:01:46.719 --> 00:01:48.519 I feel like the best place to start and maybe 37 00:01:48.560 --> 00:01:50.760 the worst place to start with this conversation is main 38 00:01:51.519 --> 00:01:54.719 a topic we've talked a lot about now. I don't 39 00:01:54.719 --> 00:01:58.480 think we need to go through our own personal histories 40 00:01:58.480 --> 00:02:00.560 with Graham Plattner or who we liked, we like them, 41 00:02:00.560 --> 00:02:02.400 We've all we've all done that. I went deep with 42 00:02:02.439 --> 00:02:04.879 Alex Wagner on last week's pot. You've written about this, 43 00:02:04.959 --> 00:02:07.319 you've talked about and you've tweeted about it. I want 44 00:02:07.400 --> 00:02:10.759 your perspective, as someone who has worked with thousands of candidates, 45 00:02:11.520 --> 00:02:13.439 about how we ended up in this situation, and I 46 00:02:13.439 --> 00:02:16.960 want only begin with a candidate recruitment process. Dana Morath 47 00:02:17.039 --> 00:02:20.479 and Leeann Fann, two progressive activists who have done a 48 00:02:20.560 --> 00:02:22.879 very did a very aggresive media tour about their about 49 00:02:22.879 --> 00:02:27.639 their plans for recruiting Grand Platner. They went looking for 50 00:02:27.680 --> 00:02:29.759 a candidate in Maine. They looked through FEC records. They 51 00:02:29.759 --> 00:02:31.840 look for a lobsterman. Then they looked for an oyster farmer. 52 00:02:32.159 --> 00:02:35.280 They looked at then they saw a video of Grand Platiner. 53 00:02:35.360 --> 00:02:37.360 They went with, met with them, convinced them to run 54 00:02:37.360 --> 00:02:40.599 for office. This has come under a withering critique for 55 00:02:40.680 --> 00:02:43.520 lots of people. What did they do right? What did 56 00:02:43.520 --> 00:02:45.520 they do wrong? What's your take on this recruitment process? 57 00:02:45.520 --> 00:02:47.919 And we'll get to the vetting after this, because that's 58 00:02:48.000 --> 00:02:51.800 that's a different topic, but related obviously, what did they 59 00:02:51.879 --> 00:02:52.199 do right? 60 00:02:52.280 --> 00:02:54.960 They looked for someone new. I think that's good. I 61 00:02:54.960 --> 00:02:56.719 think we should open the door to as many new 62 00:02:56.800 --> 00:02:59.639 voices as possible. We should expand our idea of what 63 00:02:59.639 --> 00:03:01.960 a good candidate looks like. That's the end of the 64 00:03:01.960 --> 00:03:04.159 list of things they did right. What they think what 65 00:03:04.199 --> 00:03:07.319 they did wrong is you cannot play king maker, and 66 00:03:07.360 --> 00:03:10.759 you really cannot play mad libs with candidate recruitment. You 67 00:03:10.840 --> 00:03:13.400 cannot look at a state like Maine or any district 68 00:03:13.439 --> 00:03:17.080 and say, you know what, we need X kind of occupation, Y, demographic, 69 00:03:17.360 --> 00:03:19.879 Z type of politics. We're going to make this person 70 00:03:20.000 --> 00:03:22.360 into a candidate. One, we have no idea who the 71 00:03:22.400 --> 00:03:25.759 fucking win, We have no idea. But two, it is 72 00:03:26.319 --> 00:03:31.520 leaves open so much space for it to feel like 73 00:03:31.879 --> 00:03:34.919 a puppet master is creating the candidate, as opposed to 74 00:03:35.000 --> 00:03:40.199 the candidate coming up organically. It is possible that he, like, 75 00:03:40.560 --> 00:03:43.719 notwithstanding all of his other personal stuff that he might 76 00:03:43.759 --> 00:03:45.840 have come up through and you know, seeen an ad 77 00:03:45.879 --> 00:03:48.199 and run for something, or gone to a main Democratic 78 00:03:48.159 --> 00:03:50.000 party event and said you know what, maybe maybe I 79 00:03:50.039 --> 00:03:52.199 do see myself here and then gone through the kind 80 00:03:52.240 --> 00:03:55.280 of rigorous, thoughtful process you need before you actually get 81 00:03:55.319 --> 00:03:58.479 on the ballot that maybe could have been so, but 82 00:03:58.560 --> 00:04:00.400 they did not do that. They said, we're going to 83 00:04:00.439 --> 00:04:02.599 make this man into a senator, and they tried to 84 00:04:02.639 --> 00:04:06.560 pop a master it into being that will backfire any 85 00:04:06.639 --> 00:04:07.199 number of ways. 86 00:04:07.400 --> 00:04:09.759 I obviously agree with all of that. The like people 87 00:04:09.840 --> 00:04:11.120 have to want to run for office, you have to 88 00:04:11.120 --> 00:04:13.240 start with that, right, which is and we'll talk a 89 00:04:13.240 --> 00:04:14.840 lot about run for something in the course of the conversation, 90 00:04:14.919 --> 00:04:17.879 but people find you because they want to run for something. 91 00:04:18.079 --> 00:04:19.800 Yes, And I think it's I just I think it's 92 00:04:19.839 --> 00:04:22.079 really important to say that running for office sucks like, 93 00:04:22.160 --> 00:04:25.000 it is miserable, It is hard, you are your life 94 00:04:25.040 --> 00:04:26.959 is going to be under a microscope. You need to 95 00:04:27.040 --> 00:04:29.959 want to do it. Anyway, we should not convince people 96 00:04:30.040 --> 00:04:31.720 to run. We should open the door to them and 97 00:04:31.720 --> 00:04:33.680 then if they say, guess, help them walk through it. 98 00:04:33.800 --> 00:04:35.120 We shouldn't push them through it. 99 00:04:35.560 --> 00:04:37.360 So that's one aspect of this, right, trying to take 100 00:04:37.360 --> 00:04:38.879 someone who doesn't want to profress and get them run 101 00:04:38.920 --> 00:04:40.639 for it or rays never thought about it, right, It's 102 00:04:40.639 --> 00:04:42.600 one thing to you've kind of thought about it for 103 00:04:42.639 --> 00:04:44.519 a while, you're you know, maybe you want to do it, 104 00:04:44.519 --> 00:04:46.560 maybe you don't. Your weigh in considerations and then people 105 00:04:46.639 --> 00:04:48.839 try to convince them to do it. The party committees 106 00:04:48.839 --> 00:04:50.160 do that all the time. That's how she had at 107 00:04:50.160 --> 00:04:51.839 Mills ended up in this race, which is she didn't 108 00:04:51.839 --> 00:04:53.680 really want want to run for office, and I guess 109 00:04:53.720 --> 00:04:57.199 you would stop calling her yes. But there's another element 110 00:04:57.240 --> 00:04:58.680 of this too that has got a lot of attention, 111 00:04:58.680 --> 00:05:00.319 which is they went looking for a very specific type 112 00:05:00.319 --> 00:05:05.399 of person. Now, this to me doesn't seem that different 113 00:05:05.399 --> 00:05:08.439 from what the D Triple C or other organizations do, 114 00:05:08.800 --> 00:05:12.160 right They just you know, they look at a district, 115 00:05:12.480 --> 00:05:15.680 they look at the political environment, they say, these are 116 00:05:15.720 --> 00:05:18.000 the kinds of people who should run, who would be 117 00:05:18.040 --> 00:05:20.800 good candidates in this district or in this political environment. 118 00:05:21.279 --> 00:05:24.319 In the two thousand and six cycle, Democrat the D 119 00:05:24.360 --> 00:05:26.000 Trible C in a Roma Manu whe Out recruited a 120 00:05:26.000 --> 00:05:30.079 whole bunch of Iraq and Afghanistan vets to run for office. 121 00:05:30.519 --> 00:05:33.000 You know, an environment where people very anti warrior upside 122 00:05:33.000 --> 00:05:35.120 with Rock won a lot of races that way. D 123 00:05:35.199 --> 00:05:37.160 Trible C. This cycle has looked at you know, in 124 00:05:37.160 --> 00:05:41.319 the past, we've looked at prosecutor sheriffs, still veterans, you know, 125 00:05:41.519 --> 00:05:44.240 fired federal workers or a group here? Is there anything 126 00:05:44.319 --> 00:05:46.800 wrong with thinking about like the kind of profession that 127 00:05:46.800 --> 00:05:49.519 would be the right people Like it's like, I understand 128 00:05:49.519 --> 00:05:52.240 the idea from these peoples perpective, which is we want 129 00:05:52.319 --> 00:05:55.680 a working class candidate in me, right, we can like 130 00:05:55.720 --> 00:05:57.720 there's all kinds of conversations about what whether grip Putet 131 00:05:57.759 --> 00:05:59.399 was actually working class, but let's just put that aside 132 00:05:59.439 --> 00:06:04.360 for a second. And what is a great job in 133 00:06:04.519 --> 00:06:07.199 Maine to be a working that is like says I 134 00:06:07.240 --> 00:06:10.160 am Maine in their original conception was lobster nt Like, 135 00:06:10.240 --> 00:06:13.160 let's get someone who fishes for lobsters? Is there anything 136 00:06:13.199 --> 00:06:15.639 wrong with that approach, that sort of casting call approach 137 00:06:15.680 --> 00:06:15.920 to it? 138 00:06:16.879 --> 00:06:19.399 I think it assumes that we know who can win, 139 00:06:19.519 --> 00:06:22.199 which sometimes will make a good guess. But like, you 140 00:06:22.240 --> 00:06:24.920 can come up with dozens of examples of people who 141 00:06:24.920 --> 00:06:28.240 would never have been asked to run. Barack Obama being 142 00:06:28.279 --> 00:06:30.600 another like a top of the list who would have 143 00:06:30.639 --> 00:06:33.360 asked the one term state senator, two terms state senator, 144 00:06:33.439 --> 00:06:36.480 con law professor to run for our office. No one 145 00:06:37.000 --> 00:06:39.480 who would have asked someone like Lauren Underwood, a nurse 146 00:06:39.519 --> 00:06:41.759 who was a black woman in a majority white district, 147 00:06:41.759 --> 00:06:43.920 to run for office. Who would have asked AOC, who 148 00:06:43.959 --> 00:06:46.959 would have asked you know, Ayana Presley. These leaders who 149 00:06:47.000 --> 00:06:51.959 are truly amazing public like figures in our party, who 150 00:06:52.160 --> 00:06:53.959 you probably wouldn't have picked if you were going to 151 00:06:54.000 --> 00:06:57.000 start from scratch, but who because they care, because they 152 00:06:57.000 --> 00:06:58.839 had problems they want to solve, and the offices that 153 00:06:58.879 --> 00:07:01.399 they saw gave them power to solve it, decided to 154 00:07:01.399 --> 00:07:04.199 get in the fight. So I think it is so 155 00:07:04.439 --> 00:07:06.439 risk averse and we are at a moment where our 156 00:07:06.439 --> 00:07:07.959 party can't afford to be risk averse. 157 00:07:08.800 --> 00:07:11.600 Yeah, and I want to talk about how the platter 158 00:07:11.680 --> 00:07:14.040 thing affects our risk a version in a second. But 159 00:07:14.079 --> 00:07:16.839 let's pivot to the vetting, because there's never been so 160 00:07:16.959 --> 00:07:20.120 much talk about vetting in history, and in part once 161 00:07:20.120 --> 00:07:22.959 again because Marath and Fan did these interviews where they 162 00:07:23.480 --> 00:07:29.360 almost giddily admitted to barely vetting Platner, how do you 163 00:07:29.399 --> 00:07:32.759 think about the process of candidate vetting? And obviously did 164 00:07:32.800 --> 00:07:35.160 not work here, but like what is a what can 165 00:07:35.480 --> 00:07:38.480 one reasonably expect to find out? And like what were 166 00:07:38.199 --> 00:07:39.720 the failure points here? 167 00:07:40.279 --> 00:07:42.279 So I say, Run for Something has endorsed more than 168 00:07:42.319 --> 00:07:45.600 four thousand candidates over the last ten years. I believe 169 00:07:45.600 --> 00:07:48.399 we've had to riscend fewer than a dozen of those 170 00:07:48.480 --> 00:07:52.839 endorsements in the last decade. Pretty good track record. And 171 00:07:52.879 --> 00:07:54.879 for those incidents is have been things that have come up, 172 00:07:54.920 --> 00:07:58.000 like after the campaign has already started. Now part of 173 00:07:58.040 --> 00:07:59.639 us we work on the local level. The stakes are 174 00:07:59.639 --> 00:08:03.040 a little bit different there. But also we do deep 175 00:08:03.079 --> 00:08:06.480 background checks, we do social media scraps, we ask local operatives, 176 00:08:06.480 --> 00:08:08.959 we dig deeper. We also ask candidates and this I 177 00:08:08.959 --> 00:08:11.399 think is the most important part that Platner would have 178 00:08:11.439 --> 00:08:14.680 failed here. What are we going to find? Like is 179 00:08:14.759 --> 00:08:16.519 what is the OPO report on you? What is the 180 00:08:16.560 --> 00:08:19.360 opposition going to say? If your worst secrets are on 181 00:08:19.399 --> 00:08:23.000 the front page of the newspaper, what's that headline going 182 00:08:23.040 --> 00:08:24.680 to read? And how are you going to feel about it? 183 00:08:25.199 --> 00:08:27.759 I think for us, and this is true of our 184 00:08:27.759 --> 00:08:31.319 most betting reports, what the candidate says in their own 185 00:08:31.399 --> 00:08:36.279 like self OPO is the nut to crack. And it 186 00:08:36.279 --> 00:08:38.440 doesn't seem like Platner was going to be honest about 187 00:08:38.480 --> 00:08:40.679 those things. Maybe he didn't think they were flags in 188 00:08:40.679 --> 00:08:42.720 the first place, or he didn't remember them, whatever it 189 00:08:42.799 --> 00:08:46.039 might be. For some of them, I think that is 190 00:08:46.080 --> 00:08:48.759 where it really matters that people want to do this 191 00:08:49.000 --> 00:08:50.759 so that they can be very open and honest with 192 00:08:50.799 --> 00:08:53.600 the teams and voters more importantly about what they're going 193 00:08:53.639 --> 00:08:53.960 to find. 194 00:08:54.600 --> 00:08:57.600 Yeah, I really have been struggling with this because, as 195 00:08:57.679 --> 00:09:01.120 you say, the process, you know, and it's different levels, right, 196 00:09:01.159 --> 00:09:03.639 what you guys would do for state senate candidates, different 197 00:09:03.679 --> 00:09:05.720 than what theoretically should have happened in a high profile 198 00:09:05.759 --> 00:09:08.120 senate race. And that is light years apart from what 199 00:09:08.120 --> 00:09:09.639 would happen in a presidential. 200 00:09:09.200 --> 00:09:11.519 Race, which is why you don't pluck people from obscurity 201 00:09:11.559 --> 00:09:12.679 to run for senate. 202 00:09:13.000 --> 00:09:15.360 Right right, and who don't want to write like that 203 00:09:15.879 --> 00:09:18.519 is the thing. And but if you look at the 204 00:09:18.519 --> 00:09:22.240 platinum thing, like there's there is the social media post. Now, 205 00:09:22.320 --> 00:09:24.960 a good vetting should have found that, because CNN found it. 206 00:09:25.480 --> 00:09:25.960 And. 207 00:09:27.360 --> 00:09:28.919 I don't know whether he told them that he had 208 00:09:28.919 --> 00:09:30.720 been doing it's been doing a lot of Reddit posting 209 00:09:30.720 --> 00:09:32.720 in an earlier station's life. I imagined that would have 210 00:09:32.759 --> 00:09:35.159 been something that would have been easier to say than 211 00:09:35.200 --> 00:09:37.360 some of the other things have happened that should have 212 00:09:37.360 --> 00:09:39.960 been found. The tattoo is an interesting one. I've thought 213 00:09:39.960 --> 00:09:43.639 about this a lot like what is the like I 214 00:09:43.679 --> 00:09:46.120 don't know that in any Canic questionnaires. Well there will be. 215 00:09:46.120 --> 00:09:47.799 Now I guess, do you do you have any Nazi 216 00:09:47.799 --> 00:09:50.360 like tattoos? Do you have any problematic tattoos? Let be 217 00:09:50.559 --> 00:09:53.840 ex like dys robes where I can examine your tattoos. 218 00:09:53.960 --> 00:09:56.480 His taed nasti tattoos not showing up in a Bux's 219 00:09:56.480 --> 00:09:58.840 nexus or a Google search about his history or public 220 00:09:58.879 --> 00:10:00.679 record search. But if you would talk to lots of 221 00:10:00.679 --> 00:10:02.840 people around them, some of them might have said, because 222 00:10:03.039 --> 00:10:04.120 this is one of the reason why you talk to 223 00:10:04.120 --> 00:10:06.840 people is they want to help their friends and family 224 00:10:07.720 --> 00:10:09.720 do this right and not get embarrassed. So they will 225 00:10:09.720 --> 00:10:12.200 often tell you things like, you know, just one thing 226 00:10:12.200 --> 00:10:14.000 I would ask him about is there's this kind of 227 00:10:14.000 --> 00:10:17.080 weird tattoo you know that like that could have come up, 228 00:10:17.120 --> 00:10:19.159 but like you also see how that falls through the 229 00:10:19.159 --> 00:10:21.759 cracks in a traditional particularly if you believe, which I 230 00:10:21.759 --> 00:10:24.200 am now very skeptical of, that he did not know 231 00:10:24.480 --> 00:10:28.600 until that it was Nazi related until the end. Now, 232 00:10:28.679 --> 00:10:30.639 I don't believe that he got it to be a Nazi, 233 00:10:30.679 --> 00:10:33.120 but I don't think he's been truthful about when he 234 00:10:33.159 --> 00:10:33.679 found out. 235 00:10:33.840 --> 00:10:35.799 I do think like it is worth thinking about what 236 00:10:35.879 --> 00:10:37.759 are the things good vetting would have found and what 237 00:10:37.799 --> 00:10:39.799 are the things that we never could have known. 238 00:10:40.000 --> 00:10:42.240 Yeah, the Reddit post stuff should have been found, Yeah, 239 00:10:42.279 --> 00:10:46.480 for sure. And then you get to his relationships with women. 240 00:10:46.840 --> 00:10:48.879 The I mean, I can't even have it to have 241 00:10:48.919 --> 00:10:51.960 this conversation about this, but the quote unquote consensual sexting 242 00:10:52.200 --> 00:10:55.600 that went on was discovered in the vetting process. His 243 00:10:55.679 --> 00:10:58.120 wife did what she was supposed to do, which is 244 00:10:58.159 --> 00:11:02.000 she told the campaign the exact question that you raised. 245 00:11:02.159 --> 00:11:04.840 She answered with, there was this, and the campaign made 246 00:11:04.840 --> 00:11:09.000 a decision not to deal with it in any way, 247 00:11:09.000 --> 00:11:12.440 shape or form, or not to proactively disclose it. You 248 00:11:12.480 --> 00:11:15.399 know that that cannect to bite them. And then the 249 00:11:15.440 --> 00:11:17.919 other stuff, like the tossic nature of those relationships, the 250 00:11:17.960 --> 00:11:21.679 sexual assault allegation are things that a campaign can only 251 00:11:21.759 --> 00:11:25.240 find out if the candidate tells them. If the candidate 252 00:11:25.279 --> 00:11:27.879 is unwilling to tell them, they may never know because 253 00:11:27.919 --> 00:11:30.919 it's just it doesn't show up in that Now. Once again, 254 00:11:31.120 --> 00:11:34.600 in a presidential level vetting or VP level vetting, the 255 00:11:34.679 --> 00:11:36.080 campaign would have gone out and talked to all the 256 00:11:36.080 --> 00:11:38.639 ex girl friends. I don't know that that's a reasonable 257 00:11:38.679 --> 00:11:42.360 expectation for a Senate race. But Planner is a failure 258 00:11:42.360 --> 00:11:44.399 of vetting on one end. But the things that ended 259 00:11:44.440 --> 00:11:47.000 as campaign is a failure of character on his part 260 00:11:47.039 --> 00:11:49.559 to be willing to tell them to the campaign right. 261 00:11:49.799 --> 00:11:52.320 I'm not trying to thank Marafin fan, but it just 262 00:11:52.720 --> 00:11:56.279 I've gotten so many questions about vetting in this process. 263 00:11:56.440 --> 00:11:58.320 I think it's just worth to help people understand, like 264 00:11:58.399 --> 00:12:02.480 what is reasonable. And they failed miserably, but ultimately the 265 00:12:02.480 --> 00:12:03.679 failure was also Platner's. 266 00:12:03.879 --> 00:12:05.840 I think that's right, and I think his failure to 267 00:12:05.879 --> 00:12:07.600 be honest with them, even about some of the things 268 00:12:07.639 --> 00:12:09.720 should have been the red flag to that people talking 269 00:12:09.759 --> 00:12:10.080 to him. 270 00:12:10.200 --> 00:12:13.480 Yes, yes, that's exactly right. There were clearly red flags 271 00:12:13.519 --> 00:12:16.159 that in their interactions with him that should have raised 272 00:12:16.200 --> 00:12:18.159 more questions that led to more vetting. So in my 273 00:12:18.200 --> 00:12:23.519 conversations with you know, listeners of the show Democrats out there, 274 00:12:23.519 --> 00:12:27.120 there's a fair amount of defeatism about Maine post Platner, 275 00:12:27.919 --> 00:12:32.360 the sense that we had this gold opportunity, everything went wrong, 276 00:12:32.720 --> 00:12:36.120 wrong candidate, wrong approach from the d SEC to kind 277 00:12:36.120 --> 00:12:37.639 of clear the field. So we ended up with this 278 00:12:37.799 --> 00:12:41.840 choice between a flawed candidate and a candidate who didn't 279 00:12:41.840 --> 00:12:43.960 really want to run and couldn't beat that flawed candidate. 280 00:12:44.399 --> 00:12:46.080 How are you feeling about the race going forward? And 281 00:12:46.120 --> 00:12:49.080 we're recording this on Thursday, a couple of hours before 282 00:12:49.519 --> 00:12:52.399 the first debate that the Main Democratic Party is holding 283 00:12:52.679 --> 00:12:54.399 for the nomination to replace Platner. 284 00:12:54.639 --> 00:12:56.879 I think the Main Democratic Party so far has done 285 00:12:56.879 --> 00:12:58.879 a pretty good job of setting up a process that 286 00:12:58.960 --> 00:13:00.600 people feel like they can be a part of, because 287 00:13:00.600 --> 00:13:02.600 I think that was the real danger was like the 288 00:13:02.639 --> 00:13:06.320 party would just pick somebody and then like force it 289 00:13:06.399 --> 00:13:09.559 down voters' throats for lack of a better term or 290 00:13:09.639 --> 00:13:12.120 than their choice their menu. They seem to have set 291 00:13:12.200 --> 00:13:15.039 up a process that gives people a voice, and it 292 00:13:15.120 --> 00:13:17.120 seems like all of the candidates who are jumping in 293 00:13:17.279 --> 00:13:19.480 at least have some amount of run through the ringer, 294 00:13:19.519 --> 00:13:22.799 whether they ran for governor, they ran for Congress, they're 295 00:13:22.879 --> 00:13:28.720 public businessmen. Like there's not not as many nobodies. I 296 00:13:28.759 --> 00:13:31.879 am still cautiously optimistic. I mean, Maine is a state 297 00:13:31.919 --> 00:13:35.159 that voted for Kamala Susan Collins is deeply unpopular. Trump 298 00:13:35.240 --> 00:13:38.159 is even more unpopular. There does seem to be like 299 00:13:38.240 --> 00:13:43.159 a deep frustration with Susan Collins among mayners. It's not 300 00:13:43.279 --> 00:13:46.799 a foregone conclusion that it's a non starter. I am 301 00:13:46.840 --> 00:13:49.759 curious to see how quickly whoever takes the nomination can 302 00:13:49.840 --> 00:13:52.080 raise money, and what Platner does with his money and 303 00:13:52.120 --> 00:13:56.639 his infrastructure, and how much he really engages with the 304 00:13:57.279 --> 00:14:00.559 potential nominee or if he as his dropout video seem 305 00:14:00.600 --> 00:14:03.600 to indicate, Harbor's a lot of ill will towards this process. 306 00:14:03.799 --> 00:14:06.399 Yeah, like his money is incredibly useful. Now he can 307 00:14:06.440 --> 00:14:09.000 only give a small amount of it to the nominee, 308 00:14:09.399 --> 00:14:11.200 but he could theoretically give it all to the d 309 00:14:11.279 --> 00:14:13.399 SEC of the DNC, and the DNC could then, now 310 00:14:13.440 --> 00:14:15.840 thank you to the Roberts Court, use that money in 311 00:14:15.879 --> 00:14:19.759 an un in a fully coordinated fashion to spend it 312 00:14:19.919 --> 00:14:23.720 unlimitedly on behalf of the nominee. You know, I feel 313 00:14:24.559 --> 00:14:27.639 and maybe this is just cope on my part. I 314 00:14:27.679 --> 00:14:29.200 and this is going depend how the process plays out. 315 00:14:29.200 --> 00:14:30.759 But if the process plays out like I hope it will, 316 00:14:30.840 --> 00:14:33.840 which is I agree the main Democratic Party is doing 317 00:14:34.600 --> 00:14:38.039 so far a great job, Ideally you'd have another primary 318 00:14:38.039 --> 00:14:41.360 eyone going to vote that is not obviously logistically feasible 319 00:14:41.480 --> 00:14:44.759 on this very tight timeline. This is certainly better than 320 00:14:45.440 --> 00:14:49.360 just the party committee voting on one person behind closed doors. 321 00:14:49.440 --> 00:14:51.639 This is at least people. It'll happen, and there'll be 322 00:14:51.639 --> 00:14:53.960 a couple of debates, it'll happen, but this convention will 323 00:14:53.960 --> 00:14:56.240 be very interesting. Lots of people will watch it. The 324 00:14:56.279 --> 00:14:57.960 people will get a test. This is kind of what 325 00:14:58.919 --> 00:15:01.440 might have helped us better in twenty twenty four if 326 00:15:01.480 --> 00:15:04.000 other people had wanted to run against Kamala. They didn't, 327 00:15:04.000 --> 00:15:05.759 so we'd never had that process. But there's like a 328 00:15:05.799 --> 00:15:08.600 testing ground here where you'll get to see if some 329 00:15:08.679 --> 00:15:10.799 of these people. You know, it's not exactly like a 330 00:15:10.799 --> 00:15:12.519 primary campaign, but it's as close as we're going to get. 331 00:15:12.559 --> 00:15:16.440 So I think that's good. I think we are if 332 00:15:16.440 --> 00:15:17.960 this process plays out and we end up with a 333 00:15:18.000 --> 00:15:21.480 candidate without a Nazi tattoo or a bunch of other things, 334 00:15:22.120 --> 00:15:24.320 we're in a better position than we probably would have 335 00:15:24.399 --> 00:15:28.039 been had we ended up with either Platiner or Mills. 336 00:15:28.120 --> 00:15:31.080 Platner in this like in this state, if Platner before 337 00:15:31.120 --> 00:15:33.559 the sexu assault like a allegation, just Platner as he 338 00:15:33.639 --> 00:15:36.279 was on primary day, or Mills is the nominee, like 339 00:15:36.320 --> 00:15:38.399 I think we actually have a chance that this race could, 340 00:15:38.840 --> 00:15:41.679 god forbid, be about Susan Collins, which is what you 341 00:15:41.720 --> 00:15:43.960 want it to be, because in that Times poll that 342 00:15:44.039 --> 00:15:46.279 we're an even platner after all this stuff was going on, 343 00:15:46.320 --> 00:15:49.320 was still winning by two points by I think it's 344 00:15:49.320 --> 00:15:52.320 an eleven point margin. People in Maine want the Democrats 345 00:15:52.360 --> 00:15:54.519 control the Senate. So if you can actually just make 346 00:15:54.519 --> 00:15:56.279 this race about a vote for Sustan Collins is a 347 00:15:56.360 --> 00:15:59.159 vote to let Donald Trump control the Senate, put Supreme 348 00:15:59.159 --> 00:16:01.039 Court justices on and do all these bad things, like, 349 00:16:01.080 --> 00:16:02.519 you have a real shot. And you can just have 350 00:16:02.600 --> 00:16:06.360 a generic Democrat who is a like not generic cammer 351 00:16:06.440 --> 00:16:08.440 is the right word. You need a talented generic Democrat, right, 352 00:16:08.440 --> 00:16:13.080 someone who can just isn't flawed, can campaign well, but 353 00:16:13.360 --> 00:16:17.879 allows the focus to be on the candidate on Susan Collins, 354 00:16:18.000 --> 00:16:20.519 not their own personal foibles like that. That's it seems 355 00:16:20.559 --> 00:16:22.720 like a in some ways are like a decent shot. 356 00:16:22.759 --> 00:16:23.960 I still think we have a very real shot to 357 00:16:24.000 --> 00:16:24.879 win this race. I really do. 358 00:16:25.120 --> 00:16:27.200 I do too, And I think the candidate who takes 359 00:16:27.200 --> 00:16:29.720 this nomination forward sort of has an indicator of where 360 00:16:29.799 --> 00:16:32.600 voters are now, like can really speak to the anger 361 00:16:32.639 --> 00:16:34.799 that you know, Platner for all of his fuck ups, 362 00:16:34.799 --> 00:16:37.960 and there are many like he caught fire. Something like 363 00:16:38.039 --> 00:16:41.200 one percent of Maine was volunteering for his campaign. That 364 00:16:41.360 --> 00:16:43.840 he spoke to the anger and the frustration that people feel. 365 00:16:43.960 --> 00:16:48.679 He put forward some real like clarity of positions, and 366 00:16:48.799 --> 00:16:51.799 the nominee who moves forward should be able to tap 367 00:16:51.840 --> 00:16:54.200 into that, even if they don't weren't able to capture 368 00:16:54.200 --> 00:16:55.519 it in the primary themselves. 369 00:16:55.960 --> 00:16:59.519 You know, I got served a TikTok video a platinar 370 00:16:59.559 --> 00:17:01.759 because you know, obviously nothing on TikTok is connected to 371 00:17:01.799 --> 00:17:05.759 the calendar, so it actually was posted weeks and weeks ago, 372 00:17:06.160 --> 00:17:08.240 and it's Platiner talking about how we have to stop 373 00:17:08.240 --> 00:17:09.720 making this between left and right, and we got a 374 00:17:09.759 --> 00:17:11.920 point fingers up, not down. That's not pointing each other. 375 00:17:12.240 --> 00:17:15.279 It's about the billionaire. So like that is a legitimately 376 00:17:15.359 --> 00:17:18.440 good message that someone else could also have, and it 377 00:17:18.480 --> 00:17:21.039 also is a reminder of it does remind you because 378 00:17:21.039 --> 00:17:24.799 I think some of the discourse is, you know, it's 379 00:17:24.839 --> 00:17:27.799 all because you know, Pozzi American's taken a lot of 380 00:17:28.680 --> 00:17:30.720 SLINKs and narrows over this, But it's all because these 381 00:17:31.079 --> 00:17:33.440 dumb podcasts with other people like Platinir that he wanted 382 00:17:33.440 --> 00:17:37.200 and people forget he actually got seventy percent of the 383 00:17:37.240 --> 00:17:40.119 vote in the primary and blew the doors off the 384 00:17:40.160 --> 00:17:43.160 two term incumbent governor. Like he was doing something he 385 00:17:43.240 --> 00:17:45.839 was he was the wrong vessel, but he was doing 386 00:17:45.880 --> 00:17:48.480 something that people have made very much wanted, and they 387 00:17:48.519 --> 00:17:51.400 were all very well aware of everything up until this 388 00:17:51.480 --> 00:17:53.960 last until the sexual salt Delegation's very aware of his things, 389 00:17:53.960 --> 00:17:56.000 and they still wanted him. And that's there's something in 390 00:17:56.039 --> 00:17:58.200 there that Democrats have. 391 00:17:58.119 --> 00:18:01.480 To take from that ad because I have also taken 392 00:18:01.519 --> 00:18:03.920 some heat here and I share the frustration of like 393 00:18:04.400 --> 00:18:07.680 this was at no point ever a clearly moral right 394 00:18:07.759 --> 00:18:10.839 or wrong, because at every point up until he dropped out, 395 00:18:11.279 --> 00:18:14.480 it was either him or Susan Collins and a Trump 396 00:18:14.839 --> 00:18:17.920 Chalk Supreme Court, Like those were the choices. Which is 397 00:18:17.960 --> 00:18:21.359 better for women, Graham Platner in the United States Senate 398 00:18:21.759 --> 00:18:26.640 or Trump Supreme Court justices? Ah, you know, Like it 399 00:18:27.400 --> 00:18:29.200 was bad, It was all bad. And I am so 400 00:18:29.359 --> 00:18:32.480 glad that he ultimately did the right thing and stepped aside. 401 00:18:32.480 --> 00:18:33.960