Speaker 1: What if sanctuary wasn't just a place, but a way
Speaker 1: of living. Welcome to the Sanctuary Network, your weekly home
Speaker 1: for conversations that awaken the heart, heal the body, and
Speaker 1: inspire the spirit. I'm your host, Mary Ellen Poppick, the
Speaker 1: creator of Spirit Fest and the Natural Wellness expos. For
Speaker 1: two decades, I've been creating spaces, now creating a bold
Speaker 1: new broadcast from Mind, Body and Spirit, where seekers, healers,
Speaker 1: and teachers come together to share wisdom, laughter, and transformation.
Speaker 1: We've seen what happens when communities gather, people become enlivened. Now,
Speaker 1: through the Sanctuary Network, that same spirit is reaching you
Speaker 1: wherever you are in the world.
Speaker 2: Each week, we'll sit down with.
Speaker 1: Thought leaders, authors, and everyday visionaries. Will also shine a
Speaker 1: light on the grassroots voices of the Sanctuary marketplace, the healers, vendors,
Speaker 1: and practitioners who make this movement thrive.
Speaker 2: This isn't just another show.
Speaker 1: It's your sanctuary, a space to pause, reflect, and reconnect.
Speaker 2: With what matters most. So take a deep breath, open
Speaker 2: your heart and join me together. Let's step into the Sanctuary.
Speaker 1: From everyone, to the Sanctuary for Mind, Body, and Spirit.
Speaker 1: We have got some really strong women here tonight, and
Speaker 1: we are going to have some really interesting and fun conversation.
Speaker 2: The title of the show, and I'm just gonna.
Speaker 1: Say it we I edited it a little bit for
Speaker 1: the social media boss bitch like it's a bad thing.
Speaker 1: I take it as a compliment, and I thought I've
Speaker 1: heard it enough that it would be timely to have
Speaker 1: a conversation about whether it is a compliment or whether
Speaker 1: it's not. And we're going to discuss sort of where
Speaker 1: that term comes about, maybe look at some of the
Speaker 1: stigmas that are associated with that and why perhaps women
Speaker 1: are sometimes perceived differently than men in business. So I'd
Speaker 1: like to introduce before we get started, thank you ladies
Speaker 1: for being here. Our first guest, Mindy Dpietro.
Speaker 2: Did I say that right?
Speaker 3: I did?
Speaker 4: Good?
Speaker 2: Thank you.
Speaker 1: She has helped establish experts turn fifteen years of lived
Speaker 1: expertise into a brand and business that's entirely their own.
Speaker 1: She's an expert on intellectual property, sovereign wealth, and building
Speaker 1: something that outlasted.
Speaker 2: Your current role.
Speaker 1: She is the CEO at Esthetic Treatment Centers in Naples, Florida,
Speaker 1: where she's led the development and execution of the SPA's
Speaker 1: business strategy and ever growing business.
Speaker 2: So you've got a lot to lend.
Speaker 1: It sounds like that you've got a lot of experience,
Speaker 1: so thank you very much for being here. And Susan
Speaker 1: Williams is an entrepreneur, business leader and owner of My
Speaker 1: Enchanted Path. Over the course of a thirty year career,
Speaker 1: so I'm pretty sure she started working when she was
Speaker 1: four or five. She has led teams ranging from five
Speaker 1: employees to more than six hundred and fifty, manage multimillion
Speaker 1: dollar operations, and built a reputation for driving results through accountability, adaptability,
Speaker 1: and a willingness to challenge conventional thinking.
Speaker 2: So thank you Susan for joining us as well.
Speaker 1: Mindy, I didn't note on your intro the management course
Speaker 1: that you present to people that is million dollar wealth?
Speaker 3: Was that what?
Speaker 5: It was? A million dollar brand accelerator? Yes, and I
Speaker 5: am no longer the owner of esthetic treatment Centers. Okay,
Speaker 5: that's how I got into helping other people build their businesses.
Speaker 2: Oh awesome. Well it's a good trajectory.
Speaker 1: So we we've talked a little bit about do you
Speaker 1: guys have any examples. I definitely have some where I
Speaker 1: feel like maybe I need to be a certain way,
Speaker 1: or I've been perceived in a way that maybe I didn't.
Speaker 1: Going along with the topics that we're talking about, Susan,
Speaker 1: do you have any examples over your career where you
Speaker 1: have been perceived not how you expected.
Speaker 6: I think there's two great examples I can give you,
Speaker 6: And the first one is I worked in a security
Speaker 6: industry for a long time, and that's physical security with
Speaker 6: armed security officers running security for music festivals, and it
Speaker 6: was far in few between to see women in a
Speaker 6: leadership position there, which is very male dominated. I just
Speaker 6: don't think they expect that I'd have a strong mind,
Speaker 6: I'd be outspoken and hold firm to safety and strategies
Speaker 6: throughout the event. So definitely in that space I was
Speaker 6: they didn't know what to expect from me. Yeah, we'll
Speaker 6: go with that.
Speaker 1: I remember you were sharing a story where they were
Speaker 1: surprised when they met you that.
Speaker 2: You're very analytical minded and.
Speaker 6: Oh sure, sure. Somebody was helping me at an event
Speaker 6: doing setup and I'm very processed, driven, very much ABC,
Speaker 6: very virgo, very very virgo, So my mind is sort
Speaker 6: of robotic, and that's what they said to me, They
Speaker 6: said they didn't expect that of me. That I thought
Speaker 6: in a very process driven, very robotic way, and I
Speaker 6: took a step back. I'm like, okay, so that's how
Speaker 6: they see me, and I'm inside a fluffy bunny full
Speaker 6: of rainbows and butterflies, but very process driven. So I'd
Speaker 6: kind of changed my approach a little bit so they
Speaker 6: didn't feel like, you know, they were working with like
Speaker 6: a block of ice.
Speaker 2: Do you think that that perceived how they communicated with
Speaker 2: you afterwards.
Speaker 6: That particular situation. I actually brought it up to them
Speaker 6: maybe a week later, and I said, you know, that
Speaker 6: comment that you shared with me that I was robotic,
Speaker 6: it kind of impacted me because I never want to
Speaker 6: be received as cold or you know, just you know,
Speaker 6: unconnected or not connected to the people that I'm working with.
Speaker 6: And they nicely actually reframed it as they appreciated it,
Speaker 6: so they liked the how I was direct and very
Speaker 6: clean with what I was saying.
Speaker 2: That Mindy, have you had any experiences like that?
Speaker 1: And then I'm also going to ask, when you're doing
Speaker 1: your coaching, does anything like this ever come up?
Speaker 3: It really does.
Speaker 5: And I am a manifesting generator in human design, which
Speaker 5: means I have done a lot of different things. They
Speaker 5: all kind of follow the same path, but I've worked
Speaker 5: with a lot of different kinds of people. I've worked
Speaker 5: with a lot of physicians, both male and female. And
Speaker 5: I started my career as a speech pathologist, and I
Speaker 5: realized when I got into the workforce in the school
Speaker 5: system that I was definitely the first generation, probably all
Speaker 5: of us are the first generation of women who really
Speaker 5: were starting to be perceived as equals in the workplace.
Speaker 3: So the women that I worked for were tough.
Speaker 5: They were really tough because they had to really fight
Speaker 5: their way through. I know, I had a principal who
Speaker 5: I loved, but she was so tough, and she just
Speaker 5: felt like she couldn't let her guard down because she
Speaker 5: needed to be perceived as as strong as the rest
Speaker 5: of the male administrators because they were by far mostly
Speaker 5: male at that time. Which is interesting because in the
Speaker 5: school system, most of the workforce is female, and at
Speaker 5: that time, most of the administration was male, so there
Speaker 5: was a big dichotomy there. And I came to Naples
Speaker 5: in nineteen eighty eight. I was young, I was a
Speaker 5: single mom, I had just gotten out of school, and
Speaker 5: so I had to learn to just deal with it
Speaker 5: and figure it out whenever I was presented with that,
Speaker 5: and I think it served me well to just kind
Speaker 5: of ignore it, because when I ignored it, I think there's
Speaker 5: a lot of power in feeling a little bit or
Speaker 5: being perceived a little underestimated. I think there's a lot
Speaker 5: of power in that because when you're underestimated, the expectations
Speaker 5: are low, so when you perform, it almost seems a
Speaker 5: little bit a little bit higher.
Speaker 3: Than it is.
Speaker 5: So that's how I worked with it early in my career,
Speaker 5: and I bumped up against it in a lot of
Speaker 5: management situations. I worked for a lot of business owners
Speaker 5: or really with because I helped them build medical spots,
Speaker 5: worked with physicians business owners, and the perception is, you know,
Speaker 5: whoever brings the money is the boss. It doesn't matter
Speaker 5: if they know or anything about the subject matter or
Speaker 5: they don't. And you know, when they weren't getting you know,
Speaker 5: when they weren't getting that agreement, they could.
Speaker 3: Be a little bit aggressive.
Speaker 5: But I really think you know, communication skills, Stay calm,
Speaker 5: stay in control, say what you need to say, kind
Speaker 5: of in that broken record kind of kind of voice,
Speaker 5: to say the same thing over and over in a
Speaker 5: in a calm tone, and in my experience it has
Speaker 5: seemed to really help with it. But you know, there
Speaker 5: are really always funny situations that come up, you know,
Speaker 5: in that I had, I had a man stand up
Speaker 5: in a meeting with his with his hands on the
Speaker 5: table and standing in front of me, and I was
Speaker 5: I was kind of surprised, so I just stood up
Speaker 5: and kept talking to him and the situation was neutralized.
Speaker 5: But you know, what are you going to do? You
Speaker 5: can't just sit there and let someone yell at you.
Speaker 2: Right, oh, right, right. You brought up an interesting word though,
Speaker 2: about being aggressive. I'm interested in.
Speaker 1: The perception about the difference between assertive and aggressive.
Speaker 2: Do you guys have any feelings about that, Susan?
Speaker 6: Yeah. For me, assertive is how I would be assertive,
Speaker 6: would be considering what needs to take place, what's the
Speaker 6: best measure, what needs to be communicated, and for the
Speaker 6: benefit of the vision or the goal. And being aggressive
Speaker 6: is not taking into consideration anybody else in the room,
Speaker 6: any other guidelines, any other factors, and just you know,
Speaker 6: inserting myself above all else.
Speaker 2: Maybe what are your thoughts on that?
Speaker 3: I think that's really true.
Speaker 5: I mean, being assertive is having your convictions in the
Speaker 5: school system. That conviction was, you know, I don't work
Speaker 5: there anymore. I'm not good at bureaucracies. You know, I
Speaker 5: worked there about twelve years and I was gone. But
Speaker 5: being assertive to me was trying to get my students,
Speaker 5: who were usually pretty severe, the services they need. And
Speaker 5: you're basically fighting you know, federal guidelines, you're fighting state
Speaker 5: and you know school system guidelines. But you really want
Speaker 5: that child to get the services they need. So I
Speaker 5: felt like if I have if I'm coming from the
Speaker 5: right place and I have the right convictions and people
Speaker 5: understand my convictions, it doesn't My perceived wanting to get
Speaker 5: my way in the situation was always perceived as you know,
Speaker 5: doing the best thing for the child. So I mean,
Speaker 5: being aggressive is just demanding your way again. And you
Speaker 5: know you put it so well, Susan not taking anyone
Speaker 5: else into consideration and just getting your way. And as
Speaker 5: as a boss owning my own business is this has
Speaker 5: definitely been an area for growth for me.
Speaker 3: You know, because where's the line.
Speaker 5: Time there was a situation like that, it was almost
Speaker 5: always about boundaries, right, It was about me not setting
Speaker 5: the proper boundary, me not holding the proper boundary. And
Speaker 5: me sometimes being too busy to stop and explain to
Speaker 5: the employee. And in this case, I don't think it
Speaker 5: matters if it's women or men. I mean, I think
Speaker 5: women can be just as as have a perception about
Speaker 5: the gender of their boss.
Speaker 3: Right at times.
Speaker 5: So it was it was really about me not holding
Speaker 5: the proper boundary, not taking the time to say something correctly,
Speaker 5: and that's how those misunderstandings came in. And I'm sure
Speaker 5: I heard the B word whispered not so quietly under
Speaker 5: people's breath many times. But you know, you know, you
Speaker 5: live and learn and you go through iterations of your
Speaker 5: businesses and try not to take it personally right.
Speaker 2: The first time that I heard the term was on TEO.
Speaker 1: Have you ever watched it, Susan, I don't think you have.
Speaker 6: I've watched all of it. It was fantastic.
Speaker 2: You watched Ted Lasso.
Speaker 1: I love Rebecca and that when that little girl calls
Speaker 1: her out like that, I.
Speaker 2: Just it's just she's just so it's just such a
Speaker 2: powerhouse and I just love her.
Speaker 1: Highly recommend but uh, we we talked about times where
Speaker 1: have we been perceived differently? And I manage I run
Speaker 1: the company. Sorry, I run the business, and then also
Speaker 1: I have to run the shows, and in running the business,
Speaker 1: I do my best to be patient and really, you know,
Speaker 1: one on one, really explained things to people.
Speaker 2: I'm very also very cut and dry, but at the
Speaker 2: shows a.
Speaker 1: Lot of times I feel like I'm not really taken seriously.
Speaker 1: And I wonder if I was a man, if people
Speaker 1: would when I say some things, if I would be
Speaker 1: perceived differently that Sometimes I feel like when I say
Speaker 1: this is how it needs to be, it's more of
Speaker 1: a suggestion than a direction, and I feel like that's
Speaker 1: when I might get more aggressive, is when I don't
Speaker 1: feel like people are listening, because I don't feel like
Speaker 1: if I if I do it any other way that
Speaker 1: they're going to listen, that they're going to take me seriously.
Speaker 1: And these are about things like about space or safety
Speaker 1: things or things like that. So I also kind of
Speaker 1: try to find that balance a little bit, Mary Ellen.
Speaker 6: There's also the effect that you have on the vendors
Speaker 6: of like when you go to their booths to say hello,
Speaker 6: and they're like, am I in trouble? So they know
Speaker 6: that you're a person of authority. They absolutely do. It's
Speaker 6: just maybe it's the thing that you're addressing that gives
Speaker 6: them the idea. Oh no, I don't I can do
Speaker 6: it over there at that event. So here, I'm not
Speaker 6: going to listen to Mary Ellen. She's just whatever. She's
Speaker 6: only the show on her whatever.
Speaker 1: Oh and We've got so many stories to tell to
Speaker 1: about the things people try and do. But that would
Speaker 1: be an example about, you know, when I maybe become
Speaker 1: a little bit more forward than I feel like that
Speaker 1: I want to be. And I don't know, because there's
Speaker 1: a lot of men that are warm and fuzzy too,
Speaker 1: Like there are men owners that would go around and
Speaker 1: talk to people at the booths or things like that.
Speaker 1: So you know, part of that is just again the
Speaker 1: stigma of that. So one of the things, Mindy, that
Speaker 1: we talked about before the show was about the hidden cost.
Speaker 2: Of dimming your voice.
Speaker 1: So can you speak to with women about would you
Speaker 1: call it being assertive or would you just call it
Speaker 1: using your voice or what do you really how do
Speaker 1: you explain that?
Speaker 5: You know, I would just call it being doing their
Speaker 5: job right to the best of their ability and not
Speaker 5: letting other people's perceptions interfere with that. And you know,
Speaker 5: I work in my business coaching a lot with Human
Speaker 5: Design and the Voice Center.
Speaker 3: I'm going to be doing a course on your voice
Speaker 3: by Design.
Speaker 5: So because everyone is meant to communicate in a different way,
Speaker 5: and if you're trying to force yourself to communicate in
Speaker 5: a way that's unnatural to you, it can come off
Speaker 5: as either insecure, it can come off as unsure of
Speaker 5: your subject matter, and it can come off sometimes either
Speaker 5: too soft or too hard, you know, too aggressive or
Speaker 5: whatever it is. But I do think that the cost
Speaker 5: of that, it costs them visibility. You know, if you're
Speaker 5: if you don't speak up in a meeting, it costs
Speaker 5: you visibility. It changes your income, it changes your ability
Speaker 5: to be promoted, it changes.
Speaker 3: The perception of your co workers.
Speaker 5: So if you let that creep in, and if you
Speaker 5: let that and I think if there are any people
Speaker 5: out there, but particularly women, if there are any women
Speaker 5: out there who are having trouble finding that balance, it's
Speaker 5: so important to do it, and it's important to do
Speaker 5: it early because it really will affect your income over time.
Speaker 1: The leadership traits to I feel like, do you feel
Speaker 1: like that there's the same standard for women that there
Speaker 1: are for men.
Speaker 5: Either of you thought the standards different in a lot
Speaker 5: of ways. You know, the standards different in how you
Speaker 5: should dress, the standards different in how you should think.
Speaker 5: And I think that tone of voice when women.
Speaker 3: Get stressed, their pitch goes up.
Speaker 5: And people stop listening to you and all of us
Speaker 5: here kind of work with energetics in one way or another. Right, So,
Speaker 5: learning to control your HRV or understand your heart rate
Speaker 5: variability can help with that. If you're having trouble and
Speaker 5: being confident in the workplace takes practice. It's a skill,
Speaker 5: it's not something. It's not a personality trait. So you
Speaker 5: can practice that skill and just practicing speaking up when
Speaker 5: you don't feel like it sometimes, and practice practicing being
Speaker 5: you know, insisting that you're in the right room, insisting
Speaker 5: that you're part of the decision making process. All of
Speaker 5: these things are are really important, and you know, little
Speaker 5: by little you develop that confidence.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I've always said, you can say something people don't want
Speaker 1: to hear and say it nice because.
Speaker 5: It's just it's just business, right, But it can also
Speaker 5: come off as too nice. Yes, If it comes off
Speaker 5: as too nice, you also might not be taken really seriously, right, Yeah,
Speaker 5: So so you have to find that balance and it's
Speaker 5: really practice finding that balance, and I do so encourage
Speaker 5: anybody who's in the workplace. If you if you I
Speaker 5: feel like there's a little balance of power, you're working
Speaker 5: with people who are more experienced than you, older than you,
Speaker 5: more assertive than you, then you seek help with that.
Speaker 5: I help with that. I'm sure a bunch of other
Speaker 5: coaches help with it. Because if you can get that
Speaker 5: down early on, and if you can make what you
Speaker 5: say match how you feel, people respect you more.
Speaker 2: Susan, what are your thoughts?
Speaker 6: I just wanted to share a story that when I
Speaker 6: spoke up about a challenge. I was working in a
Speaker 6: reasonably well known catering food company and it was holiday
Speaker 6: prep and I was in the weeds. I was behind.
Speaker 6: I needed help. It was my first holiday season with
Speaker 6: this company and I wasn't sure how to troubleshoot my
Speaker 6: way out of what was going on. So my district
Speaker 6: manager calls to check in. I said, Hey, this is
Speaker 6: what's happening, and I'm behind on my production. I've got
Speaker 6: to get to this number, this is where I'm going,
Speaker 6: and I'm just having challenges, and he said a few things,
Speaker 6: shared some tips. I worked my booty off to try
Speaker 6: to make changes. Hour hour and a half later, he
Speaker 6: shows up and he said, Susan, you didn't tell me
Speaker 6: how bad it was. And I said, I told you
Speaker 6: I was having trouble. I told you that my numbers
Speaker 6: weren't hitting the goals that I needed to fulfill what
Speaker 6: I needed for the for the day and for the weekend.
Speaker 6: He's like, yeah, but you weren't freaking out. And I'm like,
Speaker 6: I needed to freak out, Like what do you mean
Speaker 6: I needed to freak out? Like I wasn't yelling, I
Speaker 6: wasn't raising my voice, I wasn't failing. I wasn't I
Speaker 6: don't know. I wasn't presenting myself in an hysterical manner
Speaker 6: that I guess he expected from his female general manager.
Speaker 2: I'm like, I.
Speaker 6: Presented the issues. I told him my numbers, and I
Speaker 6: was just taken aback and I was like, I don't.
Speaker 6: I don't react like that. I'm very calm under pressure.
Speaker 6: I work very well in that space. So I was
Speaker 6: I was, just like I said, I was just very
Speaker 6: that I needed to freak out for him to hear me.
Speaker 2: So I'm wondering how many mail managers freak out.
Speaker 6: I don't know.
Speaker 3: Dude, are out in different ways.
Speaker 1: Well, and that's what I was thinking, because I've worked
Speaker 1: with men before, and usually the more stressful it.
Speaker 2: Gets, the more for letter words get dropped.
Speaker 1: Quite easily as a matter of fact, too, So I'm
Speaker 1: not sure really what what would consider freaking out, but
Speaker 1: that's when I would get more loud and just more
Speaker 1: to the point, was just you know, as we're as
Speaker 1: things are getting more serious.
Speaker 2: That's just my way of doing that, I guess.
Speaker 1: And I don't know if men would come across more
Speaker 1: scary or more authoritative or what really the difference would be.
Speaker 1: But we all have our different management styles. We are
Speaker 1: you gonna say, Susan, And.
Speaker 6: I think that's just it. I think it's it's not
Speaker 6: necessarily here a gendered response. It's about your management style. Well,
Speaker 6: because I've worked for probably equal number women and men,
Speaker 6: and the women tend to I mean, I've seen them
Speaker 6: get loud and get crazy just like i've seen men.
Speaker 6: The men were a little like you said, use more
Speaker 6: colorful language, and the women kind of like buckle down
Speaker 6: and focus. Okay, what are we doing here, let's figure
Speaker 6: it out. But about equal on each side, right right, do.
Speaker 1: You guys have any examples of managers that you've had
Speaker 1: that were either really good or really not good. I
Speaker 1: am thinking of some of the when I worked at Disney,
Speaker 1: when I very first started, I worked in more of
Speaker 1: a corporate type situation, and I remember there was some
Speaker 1: female managers that were not warm and fuzzy at all,
Speaker 1: and they were actually really scary. And I'm trying to
Speaker 1: think of some men that were that way, and I
Speaker 1: really can't, interestingly enough. So again, I think it might
Speaker 1: be about perception. But mindy, have you had managers that
Speaker 1: you've either really looked up to or that you really did.
Speaker 2: Not ever want to be?
Speaker 5: Like, well, you know, since my career has taken, you know,
Speaker 5: not a really super linear path, I've had different managers
Speaker 5: and in different industries they are very different. So you know,
Speaker 5: physicians when they are managing you are often very short
Speaker 5: and curt right, and that just comes from there. They're
Speaker 5: in the operating room. They have a more scientific mind.
Speaker 5: They have the perception that they're responsible for everything, you know,
Speaker 5: so they'll kind of bark in order and move on.
Speaker 3: You're like, oh wait a second, I need a little
Speaker 3: more information of that.
Speaker 5: And you know, I've had most of the people who
Speaker 5: have managed me, I have liked, you know, I've liked
Speaker 5: traits that they've had or traits that they haven't had.
Speaker 5: And I think there's the biggest difference was in their
Speaker 5: reactiveness to situations. So, you know, I've had female and
Speaker 5: male managers who are like super reactive, and I can't
Speaker 5: say that I didn't act like that at times when
Speaker 5: I was when I was managing, being reactive to a situation,
Speaker 5: especially in like the health and wellness industry, when something's
Speaker 5: when something's going on has to be fixed right away,
Speaker 5: so everything is just out of your mind and you're
Speaker 5: just focused on that problem right right, And so I do,
Speaker 5: you know, I did really appreciate those those managers that
Speaker 5: I had that were more steady, you know, and they
Speaker 5: just had it. They just had a demeanor that was
Speaker 5: a little more even even killed. And I do think,
Speaker 5: you know, sometimes men are perceived that way more than
Speaker 5: women because we're emotional, we're caretakers, were you know, when
Speaker 5: an employee could be driving us crazy and we're telling
Speaker 5: them the same thing that ten thousandth time, we're still
Speaker 5: trying to.
Speaker 3: Explain it, and we're still trying to.
Speaker 5: You know, help them and I do have a lot
Speaker 5: of friends in business who are CEOs and that kind
Speaker 5: of thing, and the one says, Mindy higher, slower, fire faster,
Speaker 5: and that's just that's just me not keeping a boundary, right.
Speaker 5: I explained a million times over and over to the
Speaker 5: same employees to the point that I drove myself crazy, right,
Speaker 5: and that that wasn't the best way for me to
Speaker 5: be a manager and take into account or a founder
Speaker 5: or a CEO, whatever I was at the moment, and
Speaker 5: to take into account what was happening and how the
Speaker 5: problem got solved.
Speaker 1: We've got just a few minutes still break, So Susan,
Speaker 1: when we come back, I'm going to ask you to
Speaker 1: talk about your most and your least favorite managers that
Speaker 1: you've had over the years.
Speaker 2: But first of all, tell us where people can find you. Susan.
Speaker 6: I can be found at my enchantedpath dot com, where
Speaker 6: I make charming items for an enchanted life.
Speaker 1: You'll find her at Spiritfest also, and you can find
Speaker 1: a full list list of our Spiritfest shows at SPIRITFESTUSA
Speaker 1: dot com.
Speaker 2: Excuse me, and Mindy work is the best place for
Speaker 2: people to find you.
Speaker 5: They can fund me on Instagram at a million dollar
Speaker 5: brand accelerator and they can finance upstack right now.
Speaker 3: I love and substack on Substack.
Speaker 1: Yes, And if you are on the Transformation Network, both
Speaker 1: of our ladies have guest profiles on there and you
Speaker 1: can find their websites and all of their links as well.
Speaker 2: So all right, well, we will be right back after
Speaker 2: just a few breaks.
Speaker 7: Thanks everybody for sticking with us.
Speaker 6: Hi. I'm Susan from my Enchanted Path, where I create
Speaker 6: divinely guided candles and tension oil, soaps and north that
Speaker 6: make spiritual practice simple, no complicated rituals. The names may
Speaker 6: be playful, but every product is serious about helping you
Speaker 6: shift your energy. All fragrances are clean and safe, free
Speaker 6: from major toxins no one wants in their home or
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Speaker 2: Welcome back to the Sanctuary from mind, body, and spirit. Everyone.
Speaker 1: We are having a discussion today about being a boss bitch,
Speaker 1: like it's a bad thing. As we know, women are
Speaker 1: sometimes perceived a little bit differently than men in business.
Speaker 1: Sometimes when women are strong and dominant, they're often perceived
Speaker 1: as intimidating or cold. When men display the same qualities,
Speaker 1: sometimes they're perceived as shrewd or driven business men. So
Speaker 1: we're discussing the different perceptions and how we want to
Speaker 1: be perceived in business as women. So I'm here with
Speaker 1: Mindy d Pietro and Susan Williams, and we were talking
Speaker 1: about management styles. So Susan and your experience when you've
Speaker 1: been working for other people, what are some management role
Speaker 1: models that you might have had that.
Speaker 2: You either did not want to be like or that
Speaker 2: you did want to be like.
Speaker 6: Yeah. Sure, So there are a few that really stand
Speaker 6: out in my mind. And one of the first female
Speaker 6: she wasn't a boss, but she was like we were peers,
Speaker 6: but kind of different divisions. She had a way of
Speaker 6: seeing people, understanding what they brought to the table, what
Speaker 6: they were capable of. It's like she really understood them.
Speaker 6: And I remember one day, I said to her, I said,
Speaker 6: I really wish that I could hone that skill that
Speaker 6: you have. Over the years, I learned that leading with
Speaker 6: my intuition and really listening and my natural intuition kind
Speaker 6: of helped me with that. But just watching her take
Speaker 6: like a motley crew of staff and achieve such great
Speaker 6: things really blew my mind. Later in my career, there
Speaker 6: was a woman that I worked with. She was in
Speaker 6: the vice president capacity. She was cold and calculated. She
Speaker 6: gave you very little information. She was one of the
Speaker 6: She was very tough to work with because I don't
Speaker 6: need to be managed or talked to in a light, soft,
Speaker 6: cuddled kind of way, but I need a little bit
Speaker 6: more information than do this thing by this deadline or
Speaker 6: that's you know, you're out, very hard kind of way
Speaker 6: of communicating. And it it just shattered a lot of
Speaker 6: the ranks. There was a lot of people that fell
Speaker 6: out because her management styleist wasn't great. There was another
Speaker 6: gentleman that I worked with that it was so warm,
Speaker 6: such a great family man. He really connected to the
Speaker 6: end visuals made everybody feel like they were also part
Speaker 6: of the family, like part of his family. But I
Speaker 6: was surprised and what ultimately led me to leave the
Speaker 6: company was that's not who he was behind the scenes.
Speaker 6: And me in that company, I was in a human
Speaker 6: resources role and I had to enforce the company policies.
Speaker 6: It made it very uncomfortable for me to have to
Speaker 6: do things on behalf of the company that were morally
Speaker 6: ethically wrong. They just it just felt so uncomfortable, like
Speaker 6: We're going to promote this person for this criteria and
Speaker 6: fire this person on the same criteria, and I could
Speaker 6: not It could not work in that space. I learned
Speaker 6: a lot, was very appreciative of him, But ultimately the
Speaker 6: first person that I mentioned really helped me develop the
Speaker 6: ability to look at this person, see them, and understand them.
Speaker 6: Those three people really stand out to me. Then I
Speaker 6: had somebody that was another peer that she was brutally honest.
Speaker 6: She was the sweetest thing, kind of abrasive, but people
Speaker 6: loved her like she would get the job done and
Speaker 6: I would just.
Speaker 2: Mean, you don't need to talk about me like this.
Speaker 2: I'm sitting righty.
Speaker 6: Yes, she was just the greatest person to work with
Speaker 6: and people didn't get her, but I got her, and
Speaker 6: I'm forever grateful that I was able to see just
Speaker 6: how she worked with the customers and employees and getting
Speaker 6: things done.
Speaker 1: Something that occurred to me when we're talking about how
Speaker 1: you were learning to kind of analyze people's skills weaknesses.
Speaker 1: For what you're talking about the role that intuition plays
Speaker 1: with women in leadership. I believe men have really good
Speaker 1: intuition too, they have good perception, but women really have
Speaker 1: a refined sense of intuition.
Speaker 2: So how does intuition, Mandy, play with how you lead?
Speaker 5: I think intuition is super important, and whenever I've gotten
Speaker 5: into trouble, it's usually because I have just overridden my
Speaker 5: own intuition, right, So, I think training yourself to pay
Speaker 5: attention to those gut feelings or whatever it happens to
Speaker 5: be training yourself to when you don't feel you're making
Speaker 5: the right decision or you're not sure, sleep on it.
Speaker 5: You know, don't be forced into making that decision right away.
Speaker 5: And I think when we get to the point where
Speaker 5: we are leaders in whatever industry it is, then we
Speaker 5: need to help develop the intuitive skills, the intuitive business
Speaker 5: skills of our new people and the people who are
Speaker 5: coming up and think it's those skills aren't rewarded in
Speaker 5: the workplace. M hm, And I think we need to
Speaker 5: we need to reward that. In the health and wellness business,
Speaker 5: we probably do prioritize prioritize that a little bit higher
Speaker 5: than in other kinds of businesses. And I think that's
Speaker 5: a leadership skill we all need to pay attention to.
Speaker 1: Susan, you one of the things that you sell in
Speaker 1: your business basically is ways for people to be more
Speaker 1: intuitive and sort of use that the sixth sense things.
Speaker 1: But how how so talk about not just your corporate experience,
Speaker 1: but how you use that in your business now?
Speaker 6: Oh, how I use it in my business now? So
Speaker 6: that's hard for me to say without I'm reading it
Speaker 6: people all day long when I'm working with them as customers.
Speaker 6: When somebody asks me for a product for a certain symptom, right,
Speaker 6: my third eye is blocked, i'd have my intuition is
Speaker 6: not on my my my throat chakra is blocked. I
Speaker 6: just can't find the words. So there's usually a secondary
Speaker 6: there's something behind the scenes that's blocking that. Is it fear?
Speaker 6: Is it is it courage that you're that you really
Speaker 6: have to work on? Is at the root of it?
Speaker 6: So I just asked the question behind the question. I
Speaker 6: read a book by that title a million years ago
Speaker 6: and it just kind of stuck with me. But I
Speaker 6: asked questions and I to find out really the root
Speaker 6: cause intuitively, I just go through the feel of things.
Speaker 6: I'll tell you a business based intuition, intuitive judgment that
Speaker 6: I made. This Back in the corporate space, there was
Speaker 6: one of the business owners a major clothing brand. The
Speaker 6: business owner was doing a tour of stores and he
Speaker 6: asked my decision on why I did I was a
Speaker 6: visual merchandising brand management. Why I made some decisions the
Speaker 6: way that I did? And I said, well, he asked me,
Speaker 6: why is your best seller way back there? And I said,
Speaker 6: because then all the people have to walk by it
Speaker 6: all these other things to get to what we know
Speaker 6: they're going to buy anyway, why you're going to put
Speaker 6: it on the front table so they could pick up
Speaker 6: that thing and leave. And he appreciated that it was
Speaker 6: an intuitive movement. I'm sure there's retail management strategies out
Speaker 6: there that say that, but at the time, which was
Speaker 6: about twenty years ago, I didn't know of that. But
Speaker 6: it was an intuitive move.
Speaker 1: Mindy, you do a lot of work with the e
Speaker 1: Women's Network down in southwest Florida. Do you think that,
Speaker 1: But because you work with a lot of women, do
Speaker 1: you think women are inherently more intuitive than men?
Speaker 5: I would say women are more likely to listen to
Speaker 5: their intuition. And you know from my speech pathology days,
Speaker 5: the brain, the hemispheres of the brain and women are
Speaker 5: more connected. So the connective tissue in the middle, which
Speaker 5: is called the corpus closum, is thicker in women. So
Speaker 5: we are much more easily working between the halves of
Speaker 5: our brain than men are. So there is some biology
Speaker 5: to that. And I also think women, you know, I
Speaker 5: learned to follow my intuition from my grandmother's and I
Speaker 5: don't think that my brothers were necessarily taught to look
Speaker 5: at things in the same way. And so I think
Speaker 5: there's a lot e women network is very special because
Speaker 5: there are a lot of special women in there. They
Speaker 5: already arrive with qualities that are I think that have
Speaker 5: helped them advance in their careers. So they come with
Speaker 5: knowing themselves a little more, and they come with being
Speaker 5: open to meeting other people more. So. I really feel
Speaker 5: when I left my business, I was just it was
Speaker 5: I was kind of overraight. It was after COVID. I'm
Speaker 5: not as young as I used to be. I don't
Speaker 5: want that kind of liability of owning that a medical
Speaker 5: business anymore, and I decided to go out on my own.
Speaker 5: It was super lonely now. I sat at my computer.
Speaker 5: I learned my craft here like it was a master's degree,
Speaker 5: and I have as many hours at least into it.
Speaker 5: So I was really lonely because I was working and
Speaker 5: I didn't even know I was lonely. But when I
Speaker 5: met these people at e Women Network and I started
Speaker 5: talking to Laney, I'm like I was. I was getting
Speaker 5: dressed up to go to the meeting and I was
Speaker 5: telling my fans that I.
Speaker 3: Know, I'm just going to meet friends there. I'm back
Speaker 3: in I'm.
Speaker 5: Back in this like environment where there are supportive women.
Speaker 3: So I really do love that.
Speaker 5: Again, they're super special, and I think they are a
Speaker 5: little bit more intuitive.
Speaker 1: And that's I'm glad you were at Spirit Fast Fort
Speaker 1: Myers the last week because it's it's very much like
Speaker 1: a supportive family there too, whether you are just starting,
Speaker 1: but people are just willing to help each other and
Speaker 1: their true community, and that is something that's really great
Speaker 1: men women.
Speaker 2: And we talked about.
Speaker 1: You know, our men, I feel like are more analytical.
Speaker 1: You know, women I say emotional, and I just mean
Speaker 1: maybe more intuitive that maybe they just go more with
Speaker 1: the right side of the brain. But that's why I
Speaker 1: feel like men and women work really well together because
Speaker 1: you know, we all have our different weaknesses and strengths, so,
Speaker 1: you know, and as a whole, I just think there's
Speaker 1: no right or wrong way to do anything. But that's
Speaker 1: what's interesting is it's maybe other people's perception of management
Speaker 1: styles are about you know, why a strong woman or
Speaker 1: a successful woman in business, Oh, she must have done
Speaker 1: this and this and this to be able to get there,
Speaker 1: instead of no, maybe she's really brilliant and she works
Speaker 1: really hard. So at Spirrifest, we have a lot of
Speaker 1: different vendors, I'll say, and they've all created their own
Speaker 1: businesses at some point, and we've seen people do fundraisers
Speaker 1: to be able to afford their first booth and that
Speaker 1: I love watching the trajectory, you know, of how they've
Speaker 1: gotten to where they are.
Speaker 2: And I'm wondering if you.
Speaker 1: Guys have noticed and again based on your experience with
Speaker 1: what you're doing right now and then also your experience
Speaker 1: back with.
Speaker 2: The corporate world. Do you see anything.
Speaker 1: With the different ages of people, the different generations. You know,
Speaker 1: some of the people that are now in their early
Speaker 1: twenties that are working, that are making their own businesses,
Speaker 1: are getting into leadership skills compared to people of a
Speaker 1: certain age, which you know. I grew up at a
Speaker 1: time where women did not earn. I say grew up
Speaker 1: I was young, but I.
Speaker 2: Women did not earn the same as men.
Speaker 1: Women still wore girdles when I was, you know, able
Speaker 1: to form it for my perceptions about things. So I'm
Speaker 1: interested to know what you guys are thinking about that.
Speaker 2: So Susan, let's start with you.
Speaker 6: So I've been out of I haven't had a staff
Speaker 6: of my own and since COVID since since twenty twenty,
Speaker 6: which has been great. So I've been solo, just me,
Speaker 6: not having to deal with managing people and learning new style.
Speaker 6: But what I what I did experience just before I
Speaker 6: left the corporate space was the work ethic was very
Speaker 6: different across the board with the younger group. Like when
Speaker 6: I was twenty twenty two, twenty three, twenty five, I worked,
Speaker 6: I paid attention in class, like I did what the
Speaker 6: boss needed. I did not call out. You know, I
Speaker 6: showed up, I worked, and it seemed like now it's
Speaker 6: just there's so many jobs and there's so many opportunities,
Speaker 6: and they just it's very entrepreneurial, which is great. They're
Speaker 6: going to go run their own business, they're going to
Speaker 6: go do hair, they're gonna whatever they want to do.
Speaker 6: But there's there's definitely not a corporate loyalty mindset anymore.
Speaker 6: There is no that I can see a career mindset
Speaker 6: over the years. Yeah, I've definitely seen a difference in
Speaker 6: just older I've gotten the less dependable that sounds bad
Speaker 6: that people can be, the less you know, driven they
Speaker 6: are to do what's right. And I'll say, I remember
Speaker 6: one time I said to somebody, you know, well you
Speaker 6: asked all these favors of your boss, and they did
Speaker 6: what you needed. And they were it was the fortieth
Speaker 6: age range. And then the boss came to them and said, hey,
Speaker 6: you know, I need a favor from you in returning
Speaker 6: like no, I don't want to do it, no, but no,
Speaker 6: It just it just blew my mind how much they
Speaker 6: you know, the mindset shifted from you know, as a team,
Speaker 6: let's do things.
Speaker 2: There was a thing it was.
Speaker 1: I first heard of it not long after the pandemic,
Speaker 1: but called silent quitting, where basically you would go to
Speaker 1: work but you just wouldn't do.
Speaker 2: Anything and you were just quiet, pitting quiet. That's it.
Speaker 2: That's it.
Speaker 1: But I've also noticed that what offends people or what
Speaker 1: they feel. There was a movie recently about it, and
Speaker 1: I'm sorry I can't remember the name of it, but
Speaker 1: it was people sitting around talking about the worst thing
Speaker 1: they ever did, and two of them did some really
Speaker 1: bad things, but they got into a disagreement about which
Speaker 1: was worse, and the whole point of the movie was
Speaker 1: just that dialogue about what is important to people now.
Speaker 2: So mindy have you?
Speaker 1: Are you noticing anything when you're working with younger people
Speaker 1: differences and what they think is important or how they
Speaker 1: run their businesses.
Speaker 3: I do.
Speaker 5: I think there's a lot of there's a lot of
Speaker 5: social pressure and things that aren't necessarily true that are
Speaker 5: being fed to, you know, the youngest generation that's coming
Speaker 5: out of college now, and that you'll never be able
Speaker 5: to afford a house, You're never going to you know,
Speaker 5: your parents bought a house for seventy thousand dollars, blah blah, blah, right,
Speaker 5: but you know that is true. But our salaries were
Speaker 5: also very low, and we scrimped and saved when we
Speaker 5: bought our house. We grimped and saved to buy our house.
Speaker 5: And when we scrimped and saved after we weren't eating
Speaker 5: dinners that we weren't doing things, our lifestyle had to
Speaker 5: change to be able to afford the house.
Speaker 3: And then you know, once you're in.
Speaker 5: The housing market, you can you can move up. And
Speaker 5: so I don't think that I don't think that's being
Speaker 5: shared enough. There's just a lot of social pressure to
Speaker 5: say you're never going to make it, so wide try.
Speaker 5: But on the other hand, I've always worked in very
Speaker 5: personal service businesses, so I always did have a lot
Speaker 5: of young people coming up, so in the aesthetic world
Speaker 5: and all of that, and there are some really great
Speaker 5: ones out there that are so excited about about their business,
Speaker 5: and in those kind of businesses, they get more one
Speaker 5: on one time with you know, me or whoever is
Speaker 5: you know working with them at the time, and so
Speaker 5: I think that helps they get a lot of attention.
Speaker 3: But of course there are.
Speaker 5: Some that just aren't you know, they're just not going
Speaker 5: to work out, and their mindset is not right.
Speaker 3: I don't know about you guys, but I.
Speaker 5: Grew up in you know, in my career in the nineties,
Speaker 5: and this is like hustle culture. Hustle, hustle, hustle, you
Speaker 5: know you're going to And I always kind of made
Speaker 5: a joke of it, saying, well, I'm working weekends, but
Speaker 5: it's a short term sacrifice for a long term gain.
Speaker 3: And I think that.
Speaker 5: It's not necessarily a bad thing that these younger people
Speaker 5: don't want to work all all the time, like maybe
Speaker 5: their parents me included, did you know, So I worked
Speaker 5: from home a lot, and so my children were with me,
Speaker 5: but they saw me, they saw me really hustle. M h.
Speaker 5: And maybe they don't want to do it. Although my
Speaker 5: kids are they're you know, they're workers.
Speaker 1: I also noticed after the pandemic that there was a
Speaker 1: lot of people that quit their full time gig and
Speaker 1: then started working several smaller jobs. And that was when
Speaker 1: I think a lot of people came up with their
Speaker 1: own businesses and their own way to be able to
Speaker 1: do what they love. They say, when you do what
Speaker 1: you love, you don't work a day in your life.
Speaker 1: And I think that that has been a shift definitely
Speaker 1: with both men and women, seeing more people be.
Speaker 2: Able to follow their joy so to speak to you know,
Speaker 2: their passion.
Speaker 1: But one of the things that we always like to
Speaker 1: reinforce at Spiritfest is that it's not always about dollars
Speaker 1: and cents. It's not you know, don't look at what
Speaker 1: you earned or your profit at the end of the weekend,
Speaker 1: because a lot.
Speaker 2: Of times it's connections.
Speaker 1: It's new people that you've met, the networking like you
Speaker 1: do with the with the E Women's Network. And then Susan,
Speaker 1: you did a fantastic business during the pandemic? Do I
Speaker 1: remember that correctly?
Speaker 6: Yes? I did.
Speaker 2: When did that start? Was it actually during the shutdown?
Speaker 2: Or when did notice the upsurd?
Speaker 3: Sure?
Speaker 6: So I opened my online business, my website and NATSI
Speaker 6: shop twenty seventeen, so slowly building s flolly, creating products,
Speaker 6: building momentum. But it was, you know, just actually just
Speaker 6: before the pandemic, and then it just skyrocketed. I seven
Speaker 6: times over. My business increased and it didn't taper for
Speaker 6: a good sixteen months after that. And it was for
Speaker 6: me that was tremendous. I could not believe the success
Speaker 6: that I have. I was just strategically positioned at a
Speaker 6: time when the world needed a spiritual hub. I had
Speaker 6: a product or products that people found relevant, that they
Speaker 6: that they appreciated. So I, my little Etsy was going
Speaker 6: to chang to ching to change change like many many
Speaker 6: times a day, and I was so so, so so blessed. Yeah,
Speaker 6: it's sixteen months. It just kept going. I could not
Speaker 6: believe it. So now we're still at a good business
Speaker 6: pace because I've picked up wholesale opportunities and just more marketing,
Speaker 6: so it's it's still good. But the pandemic, I just
Speaker 6: could not believe it. Like I never I'd never had
Speaker 6: downtime during the pandemic where people was I was. I
Speaker 6: say this, I was blessed. I was so so blessed
Speaker 6: with that. But I didn't have that staring at walls
Speaker 6: for weeks on end board.
Speaker 2: I didn't have that.
Speaker 6: Didn't have that opportunity.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's what I say.
Speaker 1: Like at Fort Myers it was so unexpectedly busy. There
Speaker 1: was some vendors that nearly ran out of inventory the
Speaker 1: first day, and I said, well, sorry, you're so busy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so mindy.
Speaker 1: It was the pandemic also the catalyst for you to
Speaker 1: leave the where the business that you owned, or tell
Speaker 1: us more more specifically about your how you segued out
Speaker 1: of owning your salon to doing what you do now.
Speaker 5: I think that the pandemic was it. You know, it
Speaker 5: showed some flaws in the liability of that business. Right.
Speaker 8: We actually we actually did decently well, but the employees
Speaker 8: didn't come back when they could come back, and so,
Speaker 8: you know, revenue did not come.
Speaker 5: Back in the same way because the employees were still
Speaker 5: getting COVID money. And the way they looked at it
Speaker 5: is well, when that runs out, I can get a
Speaker 5: job as an esthetician at another med spot.
Speaker 3: I don't have to come back here. So, you know,
Speaker 3: it did.
Speaker 5: It did expose some flaws in what could happen. And
Speaker 5: you know, people who are in business for ourselves, it's
Speaker 5: because we it's because we love it and we're driven
Speaker 5: to do that. It's not always because because the margins
Speaker 5: are great in a in a particular business, and the
Speaker 5: men's business is expensive to you know, brings in a
Speaker 5: lot of revenue, but does not generate a lot of
Speaker 5: income or as much as you would think it would.
Speaker 5: So it was time for me to take that, you know,
Speaker 5: it was time for me to move on from that,
Speaker 5: But I do want to just take a second to
Speaker 5: say about Spiritfest. I had the opportunity to be there,
Speaker 5: and I believe it was the Saturday, and how fascinating
Speaker 5: it was, and what a great job you did. Everything
Speaker 5: was so orderly and organized, and I was just looking
Speaker 5: at it of like, what an amazing business incubator. This is,
Speaker 5: like giving people this opportunity to make this to make
Speaker 5: money from their businesses. And to have all of those
Speaker 5: clients coming in, all of those potential clients who were
Speaker 5: super friendly, super happy to be there.
Speaker 3: It was a.
Speaker 5: Great atmosphere and I I just loved it.
Speaker 1: No, I'm so glad. I'm so glad that you were
Speaker 1: there and that we were able to connect in that
Speaker 1: way too. But I always tell the vendors, they don't
Speaker 1: the people don't come to see me.
Speaker 2: They come to see you guys, and.
Speaker 1: You know what all you guys have to offer, because
Speaker 1: it's just great. We have great vendors, practitioners and the
Speaker 1: people that do the different things like the e Women's Network.
Speaker 1: Not everybody's heard of it, so it's just a great
Speaker 1: way to, you know, let people experience it and talk
Speaker 1: to people like you. You know that are involved with
Speaker 1: all of that. So we're almost time to go to
Speaker 1: break again. So if you Susan, tell us again the
Speaker 1: name of your website and where to find you.
Speaker 6: My Enchanted Path, or you can find me on at
Speaker 6: c look for shop Myenchantedpath dot etc. Dot Shop Charming
Speaker 6: Items for an Enchanted Life.
Speaker 1: And you can find Susan at all of our Spiritfest events.
Speaker 1: The list is on our website Spiritfestusa dot com. And mindy,
Speaker 1: where can we find you?
Speaker 5: You can find me at million Dollar Brand Accelerator on Instagram.
Speaker 5: But I do have a coupon for people to have
Speaker 5: a complimentary consultation if they want. It's usually two hundred
Speaker 5: and ninety seven dollars. So if your viewers want that,
Speaker 5: maybe we can put it in the show notes. My
Speaker 5: little adorable assistant just made a QR code for it.
Speaker 2: Awesome. Yes, yeah, let's plan on that.
Speaker 1: We will put it on our social media sites. And
Speaker 1: then also if people they can comment on the show
Speaker 1: or even call in. You can speak to the ladies
Speaker 1: or you can actually speak to our producer if you've
Speaker 1: got a question or.
Speaker 2: A comment too.
Speaker 1: So if anybody would like that right now and doesn't
Speaker 1: want to wait, you can message us on either Facebook
Speaker 1: or through the Transformation Network site. So the million dollar
Speaker 1: brand accelerators on Instagram, you said, yes, okay, And then.
Speaker 2: You've also got a page on substack.
Speaker 5: Do It's called the IP files the ID like intellectual property,
Speaker 5: and all can find it under my name.
Speaker 1: Okay, all right, And then we're also connected on social media.
Speaker 1: I'm connected to all of the ladies on our social
Speaker 1: media posts, and then you can usually find them on
Speaker 1: Facebook and Instagram as well. So we're going to head
Speaker 1: into a few more breaks, and then we're going to
Speaker 1: be back for a last segment with more interesting conversation.
Speaker 6: Hi. I'm Susan from my Enchanted Path, where I create
Speaker 6: divinely guided candles and tension oil, soaps and more that
Speaker 6: make spiritual practice simple, no complicated rituals. The names may
Speaker 6: be playful, but every product is serious about helping you
Speaker 6: shift your energy.
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Speaker 1: Spirit Fusted twenty twenty six. Welcome back to the Sanctuary
Speaker 1: from Mind, Body, and Spirit. We are having some really
Speaker 1: great conversation conversation with some boss bitches here. We all
Speaker 1: are very strong women who have created our own businesses,
Speaker 1: and we're discussing is it a compliment or not when
Speaker 1: we're called the boss bitch. I think it's a big compliment.
Speaker 2: And we're talking about how sometimes women are perceived a
Speaker 2: little bit differently than men business.
Speaker 1: But we've got an interesting thing that I'm noticing is
Speaker 1: because Mindy helps people with her million dollar brand accelerator,
Speaker 1: and she does a lot of mainstream businesses, but a lot.
Speaker 2: Of times you're using intuition.
Speaker 1: And you're using a lot of the body, mind spirit
Speaker 1: principles that we use with Spiritfest to do that as well.
Speaker 1: And saying with Susan, that's literally your business is helping
Speaker 1: people use their intuition, you know, in sixth sense kind
Speaker 1: of ways to be able to make their lives better
Speaker 1: as well. So I think that that kind of sets
Speaker 1: us apart from the corporate world. But we've all come
Speaker 1: from the corporate world. We've all worked for different people
Speaker 1: and had different experiences which shaped us into the people
Speaker 1: that we are now. And we've seen how the perception
Speaker 1: sometimes between men and women, or even the expectations can
Speaker 1: be a little bit different, and about you know that
Speaker 1: we might not be perceived exactly how we had intended
Speaker 1: in the past.
Speaker 2: So one of the things that I wanted to.
Speaker 1: Talk about is asking for help and support in your business.
Speaker 2: And so it might not just be hey, can you help.
Speaker 1: Me lift this, which is sometimes literal and sometimes not.
Speaker 1: But do you think that that's the same for men
Speaker 1: or for women? Also, what do you think, mindy?
Speaker 5: I think often women are concerned about asking for help
Speaker 5: or support because they're concerned about looking weak. I have
Speaker 5: worked in primarily male businesses, primarily female businesses, and then
Speaker 5: businesses that are a mix of both, and I think
Speaker 5: in the businesses that are primarily female. I left speech
Speaker 5: pathology when my daughter was young. She was sick and
Speaker 5: it happened pretty abruptly and I needed to replace my income,
Speaker 5: so I went to mary Kay Medics ended up driving
Speaker 5: a pink Cadillac, and honestly, I would not have I
Speaker 5: would not know anything about business if it wasn't for
Speaker 5: Mary Kay. Because we were all independent and the assistance
Speaker 5: that you could get, the knowledge people would freely share,
Speaker 5: like there was no We were all dependent on each
Speaker 5: other in that company, and so there was really no.
Speaker 3: Friction.
Speaker 5: We all wanted each other's units to you know, we
Speaker 5: share the units. They could go to meetings anywhere. We
Speaker 5: wanted everyone to succeed.
Speaker 3: It was. It was a whole.
Speaker 5: Different story then sometimes male dominated places where where everyone
Speaker 5: has a job, it's very specific, it's not as cooperative.
Speaker 5: I do think women can work in that, but most
Speaker 5: women cannot adapt.
Speaker 3: To you try to.
Speaker 5: If they try to get out of their feminine energy,
Speaker 5: they are lost in that situation, right because you can't
Speaker 5: You can't compete with all that male energy. And I
Speaker 5: think it becomes an advantage then when you can stay
Speaker 5: in your feminine energy, still have the same skills, but
Speaker 5: still have some communication skills that are a little bit different.
Speaker 5: I think then that becomes a superpower. In fact, the
Speaker 5: Kathy Ireland Show, I've been on it twice, and the
Speaker 5: second time, they asked me to do a show of
Speaker 5: how you made it in a male dominated world, and
Speaker 5: I said, please, I don't want to do that because
Speaker 5: I really I think sometimes it's actually an unfair advantage
Speaker 5: to be a women in a male dominated situation because
Speaker 5: you just bring a calmer energy to that situation usually.
Speaker 1: Right, Mary Kay is the front runner in teaching about
Speaker 1: women about sales and about how to be strong in business.
Speaker 1: And I remember reading the literature.
Speaker 2: I did it. I did it because it's a great product.
Speaker 2: First of all, it still is.
Speaker 1: But she talked about putting on panty hose and always
Speaker 1: making sure that you had polish on your nails, and
Speaker 1: all of those things to set yourself ahead, you know,
Speaker 1: to set yourself apart from men.
Speaker 2: And you know, always look your best. But she grew
Speaker 2: up in that same era where.
Speaker 1: We had to work that much harder just to be
Speaker 1: able to, you know, be perceived in the same way
Speaker 1: as men. So if anybody is looking for good sales techniques,
Speaker 1: I definitely encourage people to check out Mary Kay.
Speaker 3: She has her biography. That's great.
Speaker 1: What was her last name, ash Mary Kaykh that's right,
Speaker 1: but yeah, no, no, she she was really awesome. So uh,
Speaker 1: now that I've gotten off to Mary Kay, I forgot
Speaker 1: what the original question was.
Speaker 2: We were talking about what I'm so sorry.
Speaker 3: Women and women in men's businesses.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so yeah, Susan, what are your thoughts?
Speaker 6: So? I remember when I was a branch manager for
Speaker 6: a security company in Florida and my vice president was, Susan,
Speaker 6: what kind of resources can we give you? What do
Speaker 6: you need? IM like, I'm out here on an island.
Speaker 6: I'm fine, I don't really need anything. But when I
Speaker 6: did need something, I would I would go and I'd ask,
Speaker 6: and I knew who to ask because there were some
Speaker 6: of the male of the men in the leadership positions
Speaker 6: that weren't going to be forthcoming with sharing how I
Speaker 6: could be successful as a leader in the security industry,
Speaker 6: Like how do I prep an event? How do I
Speaker 6: do this? How do I access? You know, I need
Speaker 6: to build my sales. I got a close convention sales.
Speaker 6: There were some of them that were going to be
Speaker 6: helpful and others. And this isn't necessarily a male versus
Speaker 6: a female aspect. I just know that it's really an
Speaker 6: individual Some people will help you and some people won't
Speaker 6: beuse they want a gatekeep, and they don't want to
Speaker 6: come together and bring the team up. So but I mean,
Speaker 6: I've never been shy to ask for help, even though
Speaker 6: if I'm not screaming hysterically like the one boss thought
Speaker 6: it should sound like.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I, when working from other people, never minded asking
Speaker 1: for help because I wanted to learn new things. You know,
Speaker 1: if there was something that I didn't understand. There was
Speaker 1: this program called SAP, and it would be something that
Speaker 1: like a giant conglomeration would use for all of their
Speaker 1: human resources to pay their bills, to pay their taxes.
Speaker 2: And it is so not user friendly.
Speaker 1: I used to say it stood for slow and painful,
Speaker 1: and truly it's a great thing, just but when you
Speaker 1: only use it for one or two things, it was
Speaker 1: a lot to learn and it could be very overwhelming.
Speaker 1: So I just decided that when things like that came up,
Speaker 1: I would just make friends with it. I would ask
Speaker 1: for the manual. Don't just show me how to do
Speaker 1: that one thing. I would want the whole overview of
Speaker 1: things like that. So I never was afraid to ask
Speaker 1: for help. And if I was falling behind or something,
Speaker 1: whether it was you know, due to my own fault
Speaker 1: or not I would just let people know.
Speaker 2: That was the very least and I you know, I didn't.
Speaker 1: Really feel too bad about it, you know, I would
Speaker 1: rather have help have people know I guess where I
Speaker 1: stood there. So and again going back to communities that
Speaker 1: we're building through the e Women's Network through Spiritfest, that
Speaker 1: is one of the good things that I know, Susan.
Speaker 2: We were talking about how beautiful your booth is.
Speaker 1: You have got some of the most clever ideas and
Speaker 1: design in your booth, and you freely share when people
Speaker 1: talk about your booth and things like that, you'll you know,
Speaker 1: help people, and that's the way that it should be,
Speaker 1: is building community like that. So that's another thing that's
Speaker 1: really I think special about being a boss bitch is
Speaker 1: being able to help people. And you know, I don't
Speaker 1: know if you'd call that leadership or not, but it's
Speaker 1: just being supportive. And that's what we're here for really,
Speaker 1: is to help each other. So let's see, let's talk
Speaker 1: about standards. What we have certain standards with our business,
Speaker 1: and how can we make sure that people meet our
Speaker 1: standards without coming across in a way that might be
Speaker 1: perceived as overly lenient or without being too assertive.
Speaker 3: Mindy, let's start with you. That's a really hard one.
Speaker 5: And as I said, it hasn't always been my best skill,
Speaker 5: but over the years, when when you know, you have
Speaker 5: to diagnose the problem, So does the person not understand?
Speaker 5: Do they truly not understand? Do they not care? Is
Speaker 5: it out of their is it out of their knowledge base.
Speaker 5: I've been working a lot with VAS in the Philippines
Speaker 5: and it's it's really a good education for me because
Speaker 5: one of the things that they say, and I'm helping
Speaker 5: I'm helping my VA start a VA agency, but one
Speaker 5: of the things that they're taught to say is noted.
Speaker 5: And if an employee says to you, noted, you know
Speaker 5: that sounds rude, right, But so it's those communication skills
Speaker 5: and it you know, it's setting expectations and it's creating boundaries,
Speaker 5: and then it's following through.
Speaker 3: And you know that follow through part. There's the coaching.
Speaker 5: Part where you do try to be really supportive, and
Speaker 5: then there's the you know, the part where the rubber
Speaker 5: is hitting the road. You know, we need to master
Speaker 5: this skill, especially in health and wellness because you're you know,
Speaker 5: I'm trusting my employees behind closed doors with hot things
Speaker 5: and sharp things, so you know, I need to know
Speaker 5: that they are holding that standard for the business right.
Speaker 5: And it's very hard, it's very hard to get that
Speaker 5: exact right tone. And I think we stumble through it.
Speaker 5: I mean, if we're being honest, we stumble through it.
Speaker 5: And it really has to do with has to do
Speaker 5: with us in our development of our leadership skills, and
Speaker 5: it has something totally different to the way the person
Speaker 5: perceives it. So it really is trial and error. I
Speaker 5: think you just have to learn best practices. You have
Speaker 5: to learn from your mistakes, and you're not going to
Speaker 5: win them all.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I do use that term noted because given the circumstances,
Speaker 1: if you say okay, sometimes that signifies agreement, and sometimes
Speaker 1: it doesn't require an agreement, but sometimes that might be
Speaker 1: the perception.
Speaker 2: So when I.
Speaker 1: Have a communication, if there's a misunderstanding, I try to
Speaker 1: look at what I could have done to do different,
Speaker 1: I guess, and that would be to say that something
Speaker 1: like that, And I admit sometimes it doesn't cross come
Speaker 1: across very analytical, but you know, just.
Speaker 2: Just a way so okay, so and I did it again.
Speaker 2: Where were we, Susan.
Speaker 6: When you had when you were, your delivery of your
Speaker 6: standards and what your expectations were pulled together, she pulls
Speaker 6: together very well. It's like it's kind of a person
Speaker 6: by person you never understand and know for sure how
Speaker 6: the delivery is going to land. So this is also
Speaker 6: something that I have struggled with over the year. I
Speaker 6: know I've lost staff to this, so I've really had
Speaker 6: to find the sweetness. And I found just to share
Speaker 6: in my experience that if I gave them kind of
Speaker 6: the overview of the why, then it's less feeling like
Speaker 6: it's micromanagement. I come back to reiterate a part of
Speaker 6: the process or a standard that they kind of missed.
Speaker 6: Is it okay that labels this would be me that
Speaker 6: labels not quite right?
Speaker 5: Now?
Speaker 6: Does that screen but that's a TJ Max product? Or
Speaker 6: does that feel like it could be on the shelf
Speaker 6: at Bloomingdale's. It's there's, you know, communicating standards and really
Speaker 6: helping them understand. I found made a difference.
Speaker 1: You've also got standards though with public that you don't
Speaker 1: have never met. When people order on your Etsy shop,
Speaker 1: you've got people that might kind of try to pull
Speaker 1: some things or that might and so how do you do.
Speaker 1: That's do you do a lot of chat GPT with
Speaker 1: your responses or so.
Speaker 6: I know I am not the best writer because I
Speaker 6: am very dirapped. Somebody will say, and I give them
Speaker 6: the benefit of the doubt. This arrived broken. I'm like,
Speaker 6: did it? It was wrapped in four layers of bubble wrap?
Speaker 6: And I know I put six layers of this. I'm like,
Speaker 6: there is no no way. It's like, okay, let's give
Speaker 6: them the benefit of the doubt. Let's find a way
Speaker 6: to say yes to support, to get on their side
Speaker 6: before I just, in my heart of heart, I know
Speaker 6: that they're just trying to rob me. And every once
Speaker 6: in a while it's very blatant that they're trying to
Speaker 6: run a scam. And then I just called those out.
Speaker 6: I call a spade for spade, But yeah, it's usually
Speaker 6: just trying to get on their side and see how
Speaker 6: how could I make this them happy if this happened
Speaker 6: to me? How well that's but there are a few
Speaker 6: I call my my cheapy tea bot Lulu, like, hey, Lulu,
Speaker 6: make this sound nice for me, because I'm not feeling
Speaker 6: any kind of nice. Yeah, And then they give me
Speaker 6: it actually okay, Yes, that's what I meant.
Speaker 1: You gave me that advice once and I thought that
Speaker 1: that was really funny. There was a vendor that was
Speaker 1: claiming they had gotten an email, no, that they had
Speaker 1: sent us an email asking for something and we did
Speaker 1: not get it, and they I asked them to please
Speaker 1: forward me the email, and it was really clear what
Speaker 1: they sent had been altered.
Speaker 2: It was not authentic in any way.
Speaker 1: So we had to reply to them and let them
Speaker 1: know that we weren't buying it basically, and that was
Speaker 1: something that was good because I do like to write.
Speaker 1: But I'm also again very to the point, and we
Speaker 1: did ask for help with that. I remember chat GPT,
Speaker 1: chat GPD definitely did make it sound much nicer. But
Speaker 1: that's another example of standards and asking for help all
Speaker 1: in the same thing. And I'm not a huge fan
Speaker 1: of AI, but we're learning to use it now. We're
Speaker 1: really figuring out where it can be helpful, and it's
Speaker 1: it's developing itself too, it's learning new things. I am
Speaker 1: noticing that it's pulling from what's already out there, and
Speaker 1: we're in specialized niches a lot, and so I have
Speaker 1: to be careful because if.
Speaker 2: I ask it for enough ideas.
Speaker 1: I'm realizing it's pulling from other people with similar businesses
Speaker 1: to ours, and there's just not that many, so I
Speaker 1: can see where it's doing that. So you know, it's
Speaker 1: we're using it for reference, you know, not anything else.
Speaker 1: I did know that they just did an upgrade with
Speaker 1: the when you ask it to do flyers, it's now
Speaker 1: got all of this flourish and all of this information
Speaker 1: on it.
Speaker 2: If I have seen that once.
Speaker 1: I've seen it twenty times this week alone.
Speaker 6: As somebody's website that was entirely chat GPT generated the
Speaker 6: other day. And it's fine, right, it's got to happen.
Speaker 6: They need to get their message out there. They resonated
Speaker 6: with it. Just you know, maybe there's not good a graphic.
Speaker 6: It's well, it's not top the graphics.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but you know a lot of the wording we
Speaker 1: can get from that, and just advice in general, because
Speaker 1: it does Remember if you're not if you're okay with
Speaker 1: you know, them knowing all of your business, which I
Speaker 1: feel like they do now anyway or not.
Speaker 2: Mindy are your customers your clients using a lot of AI?
Speaker 5: We are, In fact, I make a super super super
Speaker 5: customized chatbot for them, so it's customized to them. It
Speaker 5: doesn't search the web. It has my frameworks in it,
Speaker 5: it has some of their frameworks in it, and it
Speaker 5: has a little.
Speaker 3: Bit of magic in it.
Speaker 5: And that thing can write for them better than it
Speaker 5: can put it this way, it can write for me
Speaker 5: better than I write me if I sit down to
Speaker 5: do it really quickly. So I think AI is a tool,
Speaker 5: and I actually tell my clients when they're using that tool,
Speaker 5: I'm coaching them with the tool. So I have a
Speaker 5: totally done with you. I have it done with product,
Speaker 5: and that's that product, and I have it done for
Speaker 5: you product. If you don't want to, if you don't
Speaker 5: want to have the ikea of coaching, meaning you have
Speaker 5: to put it together yourself, right, we have a bespoke
Speaker 5: done for you product. We set up your Kajabi, we
Speaker 5: pull out your frameworks, we pull out the best of
Speaker 5: what you have, the most monetizable, and then we spend
Speaker 5: the rest of that year monetizing and reiterating and maybe
Speaker 5: adding some more programs. But the mid level program is
Speaker 5: AI based and it's a tool. It can't you can
Speaker 5: outsource your business, yourself, your voice to anyone else, and
Speaker 5: even if it comes out of that tool, I think
Speaker 5: it's going to be pretty factual. But is it going
Speaker 5: to necessarily say exactly what you want.
Speaker 3: In the way you want?
Speaker 5: You know, you really need to you really need to
Speaker 5: look at it, You really need to make it yours,
Speaker 5: and you really need to take all those silly ashes
Speaker 5: out and words like actually out because it puts the
Speaker 5: word actually in fifty thousand times you know.
Speaker 2: Oh, doesn't noted noted and some.
Speaker 3: Other works where you can really see that it's AI.
Speaker 5: So if you use it as a tool, if you
Speaker 5: if you let it right for you, it's just going
Speaker 5: to sound like everyone else.
Speaker 3: If you let any AI, they all have their own.
Speaker 1: We can one hundred percent tell when we get emails
Speaker 1: from people that is AI, and it's not uncommon that
Speaker 1: it'll be two or three paragraphs of AI and then
Speaker 1: they'll put another paragraph at the bottom in.
Speaker 2: Their own words, and it's just even that much more obvious.
Speaker 1: And people do that, it just tells me that they
Speaker 1: may not really know what they're talking about. To me,
Speaker 1: it's not good when I see that. You know, it's
Speaker 1: supposed to be a guide, I guess AI, but it
Speaker 1: definitely is very there's a lot of really good things
Speaker 1: that it could do.
Speaker 2: And that's why I.
Speaker 1: Encourag more people to see what it can do for them.
Speaker 1: Not let it do the work for you, but but
Speaker 1: to see for them too. So all right, so we've
Speaker 1: got just we've got to be what's that.
Speaker 6: I want to share this One note about that is
Speaker 6: I was interviewing somebody once. Oh okay, I thought I
Speaker 6: froze for a second. I was interviewing somebody for a
Speaker 6: management position and they came in, they sat down, and
Speaker 6: their resume I saw it beforehand. I'm like, I need
Speaker 6: to have a conversation with this person because their resume
Speaker 6: was very clearly generated, like AI generated with all of
Speaker 6: these these words, and I'm like, there's no way that
Speaker 6: they understand half of what's in here. So the gentleman
Speaker 6: came in and sat down. We had a good chat,
Speaker 6: and I said, now, can you can you tell me
Speaker 6: what this is? Can you tell me what this was
Speaker 6: that you said that you did blank face, no idea.
Speaker 6: I'm like, yes, I was like I was like a
Speaker 6: cat with a dead lizard, like playing a little bit.
Speaker 6: And maybe that was It's not the most ethical thing,
Speaker 6: but the point is it's very clear when it's not
Speaker 6: your voice, when it's all generated and it's like you said, mindy,
Speaker 6: when it says actually in all of these intros and
Speaker 6: words that it's just not authentic, and they want to
Speaker 6: connect with you as a woman, as a business owners,
Speaker 6: as a person coming to a job from.
Speaker 2: An esoteric standpoint too.
Speaker 1: We cautioned the vendors early on, maybe three four years ago,
Speaker 1: when it first started becoming, when social media was offering
Speaker 1: to write it for you in AI, it takes out
Speaker 1: your energy of the words, even if you wrote it
Speaker 1: and it rewrites your words, it does. It just takes
Speaker 1: that out, and I really do believe there's a vibration
Speaker 1: to it.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 6: Then I played some of my labels on some of
Speaker 6: my products because I love the creative aspect of changing
Speaker 6: up the labels on my products. And so I went
Speaker 6: in to chat GPT and I said, create a label.
Speaker 6: Here's the inspiration, like, here's what I'm using. Now create
Speaker 6: a version and okay, I like this. And this was early,
Speaker 6: like when chappy GPT was just starting to generate for you.
Speaker 6: So I put it on some products and wouldn't you
Speaker 6: know that those particular items slowed in sales. Wow, it's
Speaker 6: receptive to it. So I'm like, okay, that's the proof
Speaker 6: in the pudding, Like this is a great great seller
Speaker 6: before and now the last three shows or online sales
Speaker 6: have have slowed down. Like people, there's definitely a vibration difference.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, no, I believe that, ladies. We were just
Speaker 1: about out of time and this flew by. Can you
Speaker 1: believe this was an hour and a half we could this? Yeah,
Speaker 1: this was great conversation. I cannot wait so to let
Speaker 1: everybody know they can watch this and replay on YouTube
Speaker 1: because we covered so many really great important subjects. So
Speaker 1: before I do the closing message, Susan, where can they
Speaker 1: find you?
Speaker 2: What's your two websites?
Speaker 6: Yep, you can find me on my entransitpath dot com,
Speaker 6: or you can find me on Etsy if you look
Speaker 6: for the shop my chansit path and Mindy what about you.
Speaker 5: The easiest is insta Graham at the million Dollar Brand
Speaker 5: Accelerator or a sub stack at Mindy DiPietro the ip files.
Speaker 1: And you are going to get a code for a
Speaker 1: discount for a consultation right.
Speaker 5: With the yes, I am, can you put that in
Speaker 5: the show notes if I send it to you?
Speaker 1: I will, and then we're also going to put it
Speaker 1: on your guest page on the Transformation Network. So if
Speaker 1: you have followed that link and they'll go to your
Speaker 1: guest page, we'll.
Speaker 2: Add it there as well.
Speaker 3: Okay, perfect, Yeah, I'm.
Speaker 2: Excited about that.
Speaker 1: And then and then again you can message here too
Speaker 1: on Facebook. We'll we'll find that before or after the show.
Speaker 2: So thank you, ladies for being here.
Speaker 1: Our closing message, leadership is not about being loud, aggressive
Speaker 1: or controlling. It's about having the courage to make decisions,
Speaker 1: the confidence to stand behind them, and the wisdom to
Speaker 1: see the people around you. Women do not need to
Speaker 1: be smaller, quieter, and more agreeable.
Speaker 2: To be effective leaders. The most powerful leaders are those
Speaker 2: who know who they are, communicate with authenticity, and create
Speaker 2: opportunities for others to succeed along with them.
Speaker 1: And ladies, I know that you guys are the epitome
Speaker 1: of that, and you're great leaders and your boss bitches,
Speaker 1: And thank you so much for joining us tonight, and
Speaker 1: I look forward to having more conversations in the future.
Speaker 3: Thank you, bye, Thank.
Speaker 1: You for spending this time with me here on the
Speaker 1: Sanctuary Network. Tune in every Wednesday at five pm Pacific
Speaker 1: eight pm Eastern.
Speaker 2: On the Transformation Network as we gather to share.
Speaker 1: Stories, wisdom, and practices that remind us of something essential.
Speaker 2: Sanctuary isn't just a place you go, It's a space.
Speaker 1: You create in your heart, your home, and your daily life.
Speaker 1: I hope today's conversation sparks something in you, a sense
Speaker 1: of belonging, a new idea, or simply a reminder that.
Speaker 2: You are not alone on this journey. If this touched you,
Speaker 2: please share it with someone who could use a little light.
Speaker 1: Together we can grow this circle of sanctuary and inspire
Speaker 1: a ripple of healing around the world. And don't forget
Speaker 1: The journey continues at SPIRITFESTUSA dot com, the Sanctuarynetwork dot com,
Speaker 1: and Natural Wellness Expo dot com, and of course every
Speaker 1: week right here on Transformation Network.
Speaker 2: Until next time
Speaker 1: May you be well, may you be inspired, and may
Speaker 1: you live fully in sanctuary.