Speaker 1: Recording the hood.
Speaker 2: Conial mature audience listener, just question, is that much?
Speaker 1: Hey, how's it going.
Speaker 3: I'm Nicole and I'm Ben, and you're listening to Wicked
Speaker 3: and Grim, a true crime podcast, and just like that,
Speaker 3: here we are, here, we are. We are welcome an
Speaker 3: awesome episode today. Are we are? We are?
Speaker 1: We?
Speaker 3: Yes?
Speaker 1: Yeah we are. It's very much sort of requested episode.
Speaker 3: It is. But before we get into that, we have
Speaker 3: other things to talk about.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we knew. We had breakfast for dinner tonight and
Speaker 1: it was awesome.
Speaker 3: Awesome, bacon, eggs, hash browns, toast, what else, strawberries, strawberries, Oh,
Speaker 3: the strawberries made it. That was like a nice little dessert.
Speaker 1: Was that epic? And it made me feel like I
Speaker 1: was twelve years old? But I was okay with it.
Speaker 3: Was amazing. I came home from work and the smoke
Speaker 3: alarm was going off, so I knew Nichole was cooking dinner.
Speaker 1: Okay, that's not fair. The tiny home smoke alarm goes
Speaker 1: off constantly. Yes, yes, And I had one of our
Speaker 1: dogs outside posted for sale. It was just not it
Speaker 1: was just not going well for me.
Speaker 3: Anyone want to buy a dog.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, welcome home, Ben.
Speaker 3: It was actually great. The smoke alarm was good. Joke.
Speaker 3: I was like, oh, dinner's done, but yet. No, it
Speaker 3: was just because K and cook and bacon for breakfast,
Speaker 3: and bacon can get smoky in a tiny space, that
Speaker 3: smoke alarm goes nuts.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I thought. And it doesn't even seem like it's
Speaker 1: smoky in here, but it's like it just goes off.
Speaker 1: So it just I don't know. Anyway, anyway, there anyway
Speaker 1: things to happen that wasn't that bad.
Speaker 3: I agree.
Speaker 1: It was a delicious dinner.
Speaker 3: It was delicious. What else were we going to talk about? Oh,
Speaker 3: we got to talk about this. This is very important.
Speaker 1: Oh you're a bit delayed there, dude.
Speaker 3: Yeah, throwing everyone for a loop?
Speaker 1: Wow?
Speaker 3: Keep and I'm guessing you know, got to be on
Speaker 3: your toes.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we do actually keep people on their toes.
Speaker 3: It's important.
Speaker 1: We'll have to post how we warm up for episodes.
Speaker 1: You were singing Moana.
Speaker 3: I was singing some ma Wana. We already posted that
Speaker 3: as a story on our Patreon.
Speaker 1: So and I was dancing around like a hippi because
Speaker 1: my shoulders were killing me, and I was trying to.
Speaker 3: You look like you're in some sort of like cult
Speaker 3: dance spiritual thing. You're doing some weird moves there.
Speaker 1: It actually helped, though I feel a little.
Speaker 3: I'm sure it looked odd, but I'm sure it helped.
Speaker 1: Oh whatever works.
Speaker 3: Yeah. But speaking of patron though, we've got some patrons
Speaker 3: who signed up this week that we got to thank
Speaker 3: de Wey. We have quite a few people who signed up.
Speaker 1: Are you going to re Actually yeah, like it's in
Speaker 1: my mind, like it's so every time I go on
Speaker 1: then there's more people and I'm just like, oh my gosh, yeah,
Speaker 1: so excited.
Speaker 3: It's amazing everyone who's supporting us over there. So big
Speaker 3: shout out to you guys, thank you, and we're going
Speaker 3: to say everyone who signed up this week, Nichole's gonna
Speaker 3: do it.
Speaker 1: I don't even have the list, so I have it.
Speaker 3: I show you, I can show you.
Speaker 1: You fly at her, all.
Speaker 3: Right, I'll do it. Fine, Okay, So we have thank
Speaker 3: yous to send out to Elizabeth Hutchins, Sabrina Randall, Hannah Campbell.
Speaker 3: Loved the last name Campbell. By the way, I'm a
Speaker 3: Bruce Campbell fan, so you got me on your side
Speaker 3: right there. Marizia Chitwood, Kim Amanda Kingry, kat Peterson, Kayla Peyton,
Speaker 3: Katie Tautman, and Rachel Dullit's wow. Thank you all of
Speaker 3: you for being so amazing and supporting us over on
Speaker 3: that platform. It makes it it, Honestly, you guys what
Speaker 3: helps us keep going. So thank you so much.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I think I've said this before, but I
Speaker 1: literally have my notifications turned off on most things but
Speaker 1: not not Patron because it makes my day.
Speaker 3: Okay, I just want to say one thing though. I've
Speaker 3: tried time and time and time again to turn the
Speaker 3: notifications on for messages on Patreon, but for whatever reason,
Speaker 3: Patreon does not.
Speaker 1: Notify us when we get I don't get those.
Speaker 3: So if we are behind on Patreon messages, guys, I mean, anyone,
Speaker 3: we've talked to you, we've already told you that. But
Speaker 3: if you message us on Patreon and we don't message
Speaker 3: for a few days, it's just because Patreon didn't tell
Speaker 3: us that you messaged us. We will find the message
Speaker 3: and we will message you back, and we will eventually.
Speaker 1: It is very odd actually, like, yeah, you'll get notification
Speaker 1: for someone signing up a comment, but yeah, not a message.
Speaker 1: And you think that's like the most important.
Speaker 3: And like I said, I've gone in. I've turned those
Speaker 3: notifications on my phone several.
Speaker 1: Times and they're just like no, yeah, I mean yeah, in.
Speaker 3: The in the settings, it says it's on, but it
Speaker 3: just doesn't doesn't tell us yeah, do better. Patreon. Yeah,
Speaker 3: it also pisses me off. They don't let us upload videos.
Speaker 3: That makes me so mad. I'll be doing like little
Speaker 3: logs all the look at us.
Speaker 1: I feel like last time we were bitching about Spotify,
Speaker 1: now we're mentioned about Patreon.
Speaker 3: Yeah. We also do have to thank a few people
Speaker 3: who went out o their way and gave us reviews
Speaker 3: when we requested it last week. So thank you so much.
Speaker 1: Yes, that was awesome.
Speaker 3: We had some awesome comments, So thank you so much
Speaker 3: for viewing us, giving us those five stars, giving us
Speaker 3: those comments.
Speaker 2: You guys, we super appreciate it. We're so lucky to
Speaker 2: have supporters like you. Seriously, yes, we're very, very, very lucky.
Speaker 2: I don't feel very lucky that I decided to pick
Speaker 2: this case or not pick it. I had on my
Speaker 2: list forever, and I'm like, I want to do it,
Speaker 2: but I'm like, well, so daunting.
Speaker 3: Since day one, we've had this on our list, and
Speaker 3: since day one we've had people requesting this. Yeah, this
Speaker 3: is probably our most requested case. So what case is that?
Speaker 1: So, well, it's the case of Robert Picton. Yes it
Speaker 1: is mister Robert Picton.
Speaker 3: This one's a little bit close to home for us. Yeah,
Speaker 3: mind you, he's a little bit of a distance away.
Speaker 3: He's probably nine hours, which I think we're.
Speaker 1: Talking about that in my notes. Dude, you're jumping ahead.
Speaker 3: Sorry, may I go ahead? I think he's about eight
Speaker 3: hundred kilometers away from us where he was, but us
Speaker 3: being in a small northern town, like the distance doesn't
Speaker 3: matter because it's just like the next big city sort of,
Speaker 3: so it might as well be just next door.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And like, so this was very much so in
Speaker 1: the news for us. I mean it probably was maybe worldwide,
Speaker 1: but like very much so. I remember living through this
Speaker 1: kind of thing right coming out of news and all
Speaker 1: I'm just being like, wow, just flabbergasted. Really Yeah, it
Speaker 1: was disgusting.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a very light way of putting it. This
Speaker 3: man is trash.
Speaker 1: Yeah he's nasty.
Speaker 3: Yeah, nasty picked it and.
Speaker 1: I'm going to be very kind. This is going to
Speaker 1: be like a two parter. So I'm being very kind
Speaker 1: because you guys will probably be all at me where
Speaker 1: I end. So if you want to save it until
Speaker 1: you can watch or list watch, listen to both of
Speaker 1: them at the same time. Fly at her.
Speaker 3: But and it's going to be worth listening to both, oh.
Speaker 1: Gosh, because yeah, well the second one is just going
Speaker 1: to be better. Yeah, there's a lot of shit we
Speaker 1: have to go through before it gets a bit more interesting.
Speaker 1: I guess you could say, yeah, a bit more shitty.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 3: Shitty the things that he did, but yeah, can I
Speaker 3: know what you mean by yeah? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Okay, So let's dive in here. Heh, you ready to
Speaker 1: rock and roll?
Speaker 3: I got a drink? I'm ready?
Speaker 1: I got waa. Okay. So I'm going to start this
Speaker 1: case off by sharing the very broad but sad truth
Speaker 1: about it, and that is that between nineteen seventy eight
Speaker 1: and two thousand and one, at least sixty five women
Speaker 1: disappeared from Vancouver's downtown east Side, and in all honesty,
Speaker 1: that number is probably low because some woman may never
Speaker 1: have been reported is missing at all?
Speaker 3: Yeah, one hundred percent correct.
Speaker 1: Right, So for all of those who you haven't heard of,
Speaker 1: Vancouver's downtown east Side. I'll share with you it is
Speaker 1: unfortunately a very sad picture to paint. The City of
Speaker 1: Vancouver's website describes it as being an area in recent
Speaker 1: years that has struggled with many complex challenges including drug use, crime, homelessness,
Speaker 1: housing issues, unemployment, and loss of businesses in the community,
Speaker 1: which is a very polite way of saying, you don't
Speaker 1: want to find yourself in this area.
Speaker 3: Definitely, definitely.
Speaker 1: It was in the nineteen eighties that the area began
Speaker 1: to rapidly decline for many reasons. There was an increase
Speaker 1: of hard drug use policies, aka the government basically pushed
Speaker 1: sex workers and drug related activity out of nearby areas
Speaker 1: areas into a centralized area. And I don't think that's
Speaker 1: like was a Vancouver thing. I think that's happened other Oh, definitely,
Speaker 1: lots of places and the lack of the lack or
Speaker 1: end I should say, of funding for social housing. It
Speaker 1: is essentially an eight block long and six block deep
Speaker 1: hell on earth. Drug addiction, overdoses, poverty, people living on
Speaker 1: the street, sex work, disease, mental illness. It's dirty, it's unsafe.
Speaker 1: It was described in many articles I read that if
Speaker 1: you end up here, you've hit rock bottom. And it's
Speaker 1: the sad, sad truth about the area.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And to sum it all up, it's essentially like,
Speaker 3: if you end up there, it's society has abandoned you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, okay, there are resources down there though,
Speaker 1: and I think there are still people down there trying
Speaker 1: to help. Like I'm just going to say that, but yeah,
Speaker 1: like like you really, Ah, it's so sad and it
Speaker 1: sucks you even you try to get out, it sucks
Speaker 1: you back in often.
Speaker 3: Yes, that's very, very true.
Speaker 1: So, and I've actually driven through. I remember driving through
Speaker 1: that area as a kid and just being like whoa,
Speaker 1: it was just like a different world.
Speaker 3: I went through that area just a couple of weeks
Speaker 3: ago when I was in Vancouver.
Speaker 1: Oh did you have to walk through that area?
Speaker 3: No? I didn't walk through it. I was in a
Speaker 3: cap and.
Speaker 1: We drove through there, Oh did you Heyah, Well, it's
Speaker 1: quite close to Gastown, isn't it, which is where we
Speaker 1: love in Vancouver.
Speaker 3: Gas Town is gorgeous. Some cool stuff down.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think when we went to the Police
Speaker 1: Museum that they had there, it was like pretty darn close.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, it was there were some crazy things in
Speaker 3: that police museum.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm, it is. It was a cool place to
Speaker 1: check out.
Speaker 3: I remember one thing particularly in that police museum. There
Speaker 3: was those cabinets of like confiscated weapons, some of the stuff,
Speaker 3: like there was literal shurricans, like ninja Shurricans throwing stars.
Speaker 3: But there was a whip made of chainsaw chains. Oh
Speaker 3: my god, do you remember.
Speaker 1: I don't remember that. I was more interested in the
Speaker 1: morgue part, which is really I'm not sure what that
Speaker 1: sounds about me.
Speaker 3: There was like baseball bats with of course barbed wire,
Speaker 3: and like a lot of things, but that whip made
Speaker 3: of chainsaw chains was messed up.
Speaker 1: I remember the brain, the slice of the brain. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: those are the things that stand out. So anyway, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like literally just quite gut wrenching is a way
Speaker 1: to describe it. The community has a low trust of
Speaker 1: the police. This case maybe an example of why. But
Speaker 1: I've also read that the residents of vancouver Downtown east
Speaker 1: Side experienced Canada's highest rate of death from encounters with police.
Speaker 1: So that's scary as hell.
Speaker 3: Wow, really I didn't know that. Yeah, that's sad.
Speaker 1: I know. I didn't really look into that further, but
Speaker 1: I was like, holy shit. So, like I said, it's
Speaker 1: a really sad picture to paint, but unfortunate. It's the
Speaker 1: reality of the situation, a situation that Robert Picton very
Speaker 1: much so took advantage of.
Speaker 3: Took advantage of, and was probably very much so a
Speaker 3: part in creating or at least.
Speaker 1: Well definitely wasn't helping.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly, he was a part of it, and he
Speaker 3: might have been a part of its birth.
Speaker 1: I don't know if I would say his birth.
Speaker 3: Well, at birth in this century.
Speaker 1: It definitely was put unncessary fear into people that were
Speaker 1: already fear stricken.
Speaker 3: You could say that, Yeah, well, I guess maybe not
Speaker 3: it's birth, but he helped perpetuate it. He could have
Speaker 3: made it worse.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean well, yeah, anytime you actually read anything
Speaker 1: about down Vancouver downtown east Side, he's mentioned. So he's
Speaker 1: very much associated with it. Okay, So Robin was Robin?
Speaker 1: Who the fuck is Robin?
Speaker 3: Shout out to my sister. Robin.
Speaker 1: Robert was born on October twenty fourth, nineteen forty nine.
Speaker 1: His full name Robert William Pickton. A lot of people
Speaker 1: call him Willy and You'll listen to a lot of
Speaker 1: podcasts or they say Willy, but I'm not saying Willy.
Speaker 1: I just don't want to say Lilly. This whole thing.
Speaker 3: He's Robert Picton, Robert.
Speaker 1: We're calling him Robert.
Speaker 3: Fuck you, Robert, fuck you, and your name Willy.
Speaker 1: I know he's nasty. His parents were d and Louise Picton.
Speaker 1: Robert was the middle child with an older sister and
Speaker 1: a younger brother. The family were pig farmers, operating their
Speaker 1: pig farm out of Port Coquitlam, which is about twenty
Speaker 1: seven kilometers east of Vancouver and, like we had mentioned,
Speaker 1: about nine hours drive away from US.
Speaker 3: Can I give you a pat on your back for something?
Speaker 1: Absolutely okay?
Speaker 3: You listen to like ninety nine percent of podcasts out
Speaker 3: there talking about Robert Picton. None of them or n
Speaker 3: of them don't know how to say Coquitlam.
Speaker 1: No, but I know how to say it.
Speaker 3: We get shit for our bad pronunciation. We can say.
Speaker 1: Coquitlam, we can say Port Coquitlam, we.
Speaker 3: Can so fuck yeah. We got one up on all
Speaker 3: those for that. I know.
Speaker 1: It was actually funny. There was a few people that
Speaker 1: are like, I don't know to say these Canadian cities.
Speaker 1: Yeah we got it, and then yeah we do get
Speaker 1: people get we get a hard time sometimes. I mean,
Speaker 1: that's a hard city to say, but I don't know,
Speaker 1: I don't know how to say it.
Speaker 3: You do, and you did well, So good job, patt
Speaker 3: in your back. Thank you.
Speaker 1: I feel like my comminance is just exploding out of me.
Speaker 3: Perfect. That's what we want. High five, high five, high five. Bohm, okay,
Speaker 3: keep going.
Speaker 1: Okay. So Robert's upbringing wasn't exactly great. His mother, Louise,
Speaker 1: was an interesting character to say the least, asides from
Speaker 1: her looks of rotting teeth, lost hair, and a go tea.
Speaker 1: Apparently she had a go tea. I know, right, I
Speaker 1: can feel her pain. Though I got some serious hairs
Speaker 1: on my chin. Sometimes on the chin. I need to
Speaker 1: like get that dealt with that. It just happens as
Speaker 1: you get older.
Speaker 3: It does.
Speaker 1: It's so I don't I don't. I feel bad for her. Really,
Speaker 1: I'm not shaming her.
Speaker 3: With that, but I'm sure it didn't add to her well.
Speaker 1: She could have. She could have maintained her go tea.
Speaker 1: Let's just say that.
Speaker 3: I maintain, so do I. Facial hair maintenance is important.
Speaker 1: She had a high pitched voice. Also don't shamber for that,
Speaker 1: but it was often heard calling for her children across
Speaker 1: the neighborhood. I suppose you could say she dressed in
Speaker 1: a house dress over jeans and rubber boots, which is
Speaker 1: quite the visual. Both her and Leonard did not care
Speaker 1: about their parents or their hygiene, and that was passed
Speaker 1: down to their children. One interesting, yet disgusting fact is
Speaker 1: that the farm animals had the run of the farm,
Speaker 1: including the house their house. Yeah, which is so beyond fucked.
Speaker 3: Yeah. So I do know a lot about this case.
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, we both do.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, generally we're presenting to each other and we
Speaker 3: don't know the case. But yeah, I know a lot
Speaker 3: of this, and that's.
Speaker 1: I think you'll probably know the majority of it, to
Speaker 1: be honest, I don't even know if there'll be much
Speaker 1: in here that will shock you.
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I've researched this before, but it's been a while.
Speaker 3: But yeah, the one that really stuck with me is, Yeah,
Speaker 3: the animals get the run of the house.
Speaker 1: So yeah, they're tracking in dirt, manure, and they're relieving
Speaker 1: themselves in the house. Yeah, because animals don't give a
Speaker 1: fuck where they go. They got to go, they go.
Speaker 3: Which is understandable. Think you have a dog that's got
Speaker 3: to go, it's got to go, and it doesn't get
Speaker 3: outside fast enough. It's going to go in the house.
Speaker 1: But you clean it up.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you usher the dog outside, let it have its space,
Speaker 3: and you clean up afterwards, not just belying oh there's
Speaker 3: a pile of shit on.
Speaker 1: The floor, Oh well yeah, which she had that attitude.
Speaker 1: Oh well, yeah, the smell didn't affect her. Oh well, yeap,
Speaker 1: Like okay, that that.
Speaker 3: Is just beyond The family is effectively farm animals themselves.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're pretty much living in like a barn in
Speaker 1: a sense really like because I mean, hey would have
Speaker 1: been get brought in like a lot of shit would
Speaker 1: just get her all in there.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So the poor children, especially the boys, had high expectations
Speaker 1: of working on the farm and would often be going
Speaker 1: to school dirty and I'm sure you could imagine not
Speaker 1: smelling all that pleasant. They only received weekly bass if
Speaker 1: they were lucky, which was not enough to remove the
Speaker 1: dirt and the odor and just at all so gross.
Speaker 3: I need me like frequent showers.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that's just so sad. Oh, because I
Speaker 1: didn't even put it in here, but like Robert had
Speaker 1: a fear basically of like showering. Yeah, like what the heck?
Speaker 3: And that's because of his upbringing. Yeah, because of his
Speaker 3: parents and what they did to him.
Speaker 1: Yeah, which is like his childhood wasn't great.
Speaker 3: No, the So this is not just Robert Picton, this
Speaker 3: is his family.
Speaker 1: Yes, but it is more so and I'd probably say
Speaker 1: this in later, but it is more so the brothers,
Speaker 1: the sisters. Seemed like she was treated a bit differently,
Speaker 1: and she'd been interviewed at times too, and didn't often
Speaker 1: I kind of said that with an accent, didn't often
Speaker 1: describe is like the situations is that terrible? And then
Speaker 1: I do think when she was in high school she
Speaker 1: went and lived with relatives and Vancouver and stuff, so
Speaker 1: she she really like wanted to be away from this
Speaker 1: whole situation. I think she handib she was a lot different.
Speaker 1: So this obviously caused them to be called names by
Speaker 1: their fellow classmates like Piggy or stinky piggy, and school
Speaker 1: is rough. If you're in any way different, it does
Speaker 1: not go unnoticed.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, so.
Speaker 1: I would imagine the bullying had to be pretty bad.
Speaker 3: Towards them, no kidding, I got bullied just from my
Speaker 3: name because that like muscle cream, the ointment Ben Gay.
Speaker 3: Of course kids latched to that. My name's Ben.
Speaker 1: Oh geez, did you not know that I literally went
Speaker 1: to high school? I think I did, but like I
Speaker 1: forgot because it's just so silly. Yeah, I know, right,
Speaker 1: I don't know everything. That just is people bullying. It's silly.
Speaker 3: Yeah, high school is brutal.
Speaker 1: So yeah, they got. I'm sure it wasn't great for them.
Speaker 1: Robert had some sad stories to share from his childhood.
Speaker 1: At age three, he crashed his father's truck. He was
Speaker 1: sitting in it when it started to roll. His father
Speaker 1: was yelling at him to stop, but he was three
Speaker 1: year old, three years old and would have no idea
Speaker 1: how to do that, and inevitably he and the truck
Speaker 1: crashed into a tree. Afterwards, he received a beating from
Speaker 1: his father. That's honestly the father's fault.
Speaker 3: Oh, I can't. I can't imagine an adult blaming a
Speaker 3: three year old for a piece of equipment like that
Speaker 3: rolling into a week.
Speaker 1: He fucked up, The dad fucked up.
Speaker 3: Yeah, even if picked in as a kid took off
Speaker 3: the e break.
Speaker 1: Or did take he wouldn't have done it intentionally exactly.
Speaker 3: He doesn't know what he's doing. He's a kid. You
Speaker 3: shouldn't have left him in there.
Speaker 1: Yeah. So, at the age of four, Robert was forced
Speaker 1: to smoke a cigar by his mother after being caught
Speaker 1: smoking a cigarette. This was her idea to cure him
Speaker 1: of ever wanting to smoke again.
Speaker 3: Yeah, not that I agree with it, but that was
Speaker 3: a popular practice back in the day.
Speaker 1: Oh was it? Actually, I've never heard of that.
Speaker 3: On TV shows. Lots you heard that, like that seventy
Speaker 3: show or whatever, like, Oh, you catch your kids smoking
Speaker 3: a cigarette, They're going to sit down and make you
Speaker 3: smoke the whole pack.
Speaker 1: Oh my go.
Speaker 3: The idea was that you're going to smoke again, get sick.
Speaker 3: They're going to get sick and be deterred from it.
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh.
Speaker 3: Not that I agree with it. That's basically abuse.
Speaker 1: But I mean it did work for him.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the theory is there, which.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, okay. But the worst of all might have
Speaker 1: been When Robert was twelve years old, he saved up
Speaker 1: thirty five dollars to buy a three week old calf.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, with the intention that he would keep the
Speaker 1: calf for the rest of his life. He treated the
Speaker 1: calf as his companion, taking care of it and enjoying
Speaker 1: spending time with it, until one day he came home
Speaker 1: and his calf was nowhere to be found. After searching
Speaker 1: and searching, he was told to check the barn, where
Speaker 1: I'm sure you guessed it, he found his caf hanging
Speaker 1: upside down butchered.
Speaker 3: So brutal.
Speaker 1: This just devastated him. He would he wouldn't talk to
Speaker 1: anyone for four days, and I like, I honestly don't
Speaker 1: even blame him. That shit at twelve years old would
Speaker 1: impact your life in my opinion, Like, that is like brutal.
Speaker 3: I'm pretty sure that is the moment that directed picked
Speaker 3: and down this path to be a serial killer, because
Speaker 3: at that moment, I'm sure he lost all compassion.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like I just oh, it almost makes me want
Speaker 1: to bawl my face off because that is just so sad.
Speaker 3: Well, I imagine that was the literally the only thing
Speaker 3: he loved that he had, Yeah, and then it was
Speaker 3: just taken away and then he was just left.
Speaker 1: And then they thought too and they were like, oh
Speaker 1: what are you like, have some up because like they
Speaker 1: were eating it. Yeah, and this will make you feel better,
Speaker 1: and the moment offered to like rebuy him a calf
Speaker 1: and another calf and stuff, because like they didn't realize
Speaker 1: it would devastate him to this much, this extent, I guess,
Speaker 1: But no, that was like his calf. It wasn't like replaceable.
Speaker 3: Yeah, like oh, which I mean, that's that's farm culture
Speaker 3: for you. Because to the parents it wasn't a pet.
Speaker 1: It was but they should have known that how important
Speaker 1: it was to their son.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I know that. But yeah, to the parents
Speaker 3: it was not a pet. It was food. Yeah, but
Speaker 3: two pickt in it was a pet. There is a
Speaker 3: very those are very two different lines for for general
Speaker 3: society and farmers. Yeah. So his parents didn't realize it
Speaker 3: was a pet, which I mean, that's their fault for
Speaker 3: not knowing they should have that connection with their kid
Speaker 3: to fucking know that.
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. Well yeah, and the fact that he
Speaker 1: bought it with his own money and stuff, right, he
Speaker 1: saved up for this exactly, Like that is it just
Speaker 1: destroys me. Actually, it's so sad.
Speaker 3: Oh and the pict Ins were rather well off too,
Speaker 3: so it could just go buy some fucking food.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I don't know, per se, if the
Speaker 1: parents necessarily were super well off anything, they wouldn't have struggled.
Speaker 1: Now any the kids became well off, and we'll talk
Speaker 1: about that.
Speaker 3: Ye.
Speaker 1: So at the age of fourteen, grade eight, Robert would
Speaker 1: drop out of school in nineteen sixty three. He had
Speaker 1: a tough time in school. Along with the bullying, Robert
Speaker 1: was a quiet boy and was considered slow. He dropped
Speaker 1: out of school or him dropping out of school didn't
Speaker 1: bother his mother, Louise. It just meant more help around
Speaker 1: the farm. She also wanted him to learn how to butcher,
Speaker 1: so after leaving school, he would start an apprenticeship with
Speaker 1: a butcher in nineteen seventy. He would leave that to
Speaker 1: work full time at the family farm, being around twenty one.
Speaker 1: One other noteworthy thing to mention from Robert's childhood, Oh God,
Speaker 1: involves his brother Do you know where I'm going?
Speaker 3: I know where you're going.
Speaker 1: When David was sixteen years old and new to driving,
Speaker 1: as he was driving home in the family truck, he
Speaker 1: would strike a neighborhood cas Timothy Barrett. I think it's
Speaker 1: Barrett from behind, who was walking home from a friend's house.
Speaker 1: Tim was a grade nine student and had only lived
Speaker 1: in the neighborhood for a year, moving there from Winnipeg. David,
Speaker 1: instead of being a decent fucking human being, I don't
Speaker 1: have that in my notes, instead of stopping to see
Speaker 1: if Tim was still alive, he panicked and he raced
Speaker 1: home to tell his parents.
Speaker 3: Yep.
Speaker 1: What happened next is so appalling and maybe a glimpse
Speaker 1: into why Robert thought nothing of taking a human life.
Speaker 1: David was told to take the family truck he was
Speaker 1: driving to the shop right away to get the damage done,
Speaker 1: repaired and essentially covered up yep, while Louise herself went
Speaker 1: to search the road where the accident happened. Shortly later,
Speaker 1: she came across Tim's body. She looked him over, but
Speaker 1: without hesitation, then proceeded to haul Tim's body ten feet
Speaker 1: to the edge of a slough and rolled his body
Speaker 1: into it. Before heading home.
Speaker 3: She literally chucked him in the fucking ditch.
Speaker 1: Like I just can't I just can't even believe this.
Speaker 1: And just wait, because it gets worse. Tim's dad had
Speaker 1: phoned the friend's house the night of the accident in
Speaker 1: search of his son, but they hadn't seen him since
Speaker 1: the early evening. Apparently the buddy's house that he went to,
Speaker 1: like was busy so that he couldn't he couldn't play,
Speaker 1: which they're probably like, oh my gosh, I wish like
Speaker 1: he wasn't busy, Like there's that just happens with so
Speaker 1: many things. Apparently, also Tim was he wasn't walking like
Speaker 1: facing traffic like you're supposed to do. So if he was,
Speaker 1: he'd been on like the other side of the road, Like,
Speaker 1: it's just shit.
Speaker 3: Hindsight's twenty twenty though.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you can always change something exactly, Okay. So the
Speaker 1: police were informed, but there was no news until the
Speaker 1: early morning when tim dad and the friend's dad went
Speaker 1: out to search the road. As they searched, Tim's dad
Speaker 1: came across his son's shoe on the side of the road,
Speaker 1: and then he spotted Tim, as you can imagine, practically
Speaker 1: collapsing from devastation. Wow, it didn't take a rocket science
Speaker 1: to have the incident lead back to the Pictons, being
Speaker 1: that the mechanic who had worked on the truck the
Speaker 1: night before heard the story on the radio and called
Speaker 1: the police. Tim's death was deemed an accidental death, with
Speaker 1: David being charged in juvenile court for failing to remain
Speaker 1: on a scene of an incident. He was convicted and
Speaker 1: placed on indefinite probation, with his driver's license suspended until
Speaker 1: he was twenty one. Louise's role was only a thing
Speaker 1: of neighborhood rumor because she got away scott free, with
Speaker 1: the real kicker being Tim's cause of death was from drowning.
Speaker 3: Yeap.
Speaker 1: The injuries he suffered from being hit would have badly
Speaker 1: injured him, but it was determined they most likely would
Speaker 1: not have killed him.
Speaker 3: So he wasn't dead when she fucking ran in the ditch.
Speaker 1: And if either one of them would have just like
Speaker 1: called an ambulance, he would have lived yep, which is
Speaker 1: just holy, oh my gosh, it actually like makes me
Speaker 1: rage inside.
Speaker 3: Oh, through and through. It just shows what kind of
Speaker 3: fucking people these are.
Speaker 1: These people are just unbelievably disgusting human beings.
Speaker 3: If we haven't showed enough already, like clearly they're fucked.
Speaker 1: Like I can't, I honestly can't believe. Like he was
Speaker 1: a little boy, well, I mean he was a teenager,
Speaker 1: but that's like for the span of your life. That's
Speaker 1: a young boy, Like he had his whole life ahead
Speaker 1: of him, and they just fucked it over.
Speaker 3: And could you imagine looking at a unconscious, clearly young
Speaker 3: boy in the middle of the road, even if he
Speaker 3: thought he was dead or not, and just rolling him
Speaker 3: into the ditch.
Speaker 1: I think that she would have known that he was alive. Probably,
Speaker 1: I actually, in like, I just think that she would
Speaker 1: have known, probably because moving him and rolling him. I
Speaker 1: think that you would have.
Speaker 3: Been able to tell, I would assume. So there probably
Speaker 3: would have been some moaning, some breathing, some gasping something.
Speaker 1: Oh, it's just devastating, Okay, I have to move on,
Speaker 1: like that's just rough to move on from. Robert's father
Speaker 1: would pass away in nineteen seventy eight of cancer, dying
Speaker 1: at the age of eighty one. The following year, cancer
Speaker 1: would strike again, this time killing Louise at the age
Speaker 1: of sixty seven, so there was like a pretty big
Speaker 1: age difference between the two of them. Robert was the
Speaker 1: mom's full time caregiver, so she like or he took
Speaker 1: every bit of need that she had while she was dying,
Speaker 1: which probably for that is pretty awesome. I didn't mention
Speaker 1: this earlier, but Robert's father was super involved in raising
Speaker 1: the children and their rumors. He was abusive to Robert,
Speaker 1: but Robert's sister didn't describe him this way. Robert was, however,
Speaker 1: very close with his mother, a mama's boy. They were
Speaker 1: two peas in a pod. So there was a bit
Speaker 1: of a shock when it came to the reading of
Speaker 1: the will. So Louise's will that she left behind everything
Speaker 1: was left to the children, but with Robert's inheritance, he
Speaker 1: got a twenty thousand dollars lump some payment, but he
Speaker 1: wouldn't get the remaining unless he stayed working on the
Speaker 1: farm until he was forty years old.
Speaker 3: Wow, I don't think I knew that part.
Speaker 1: And he would have only been about thirty years when
Speaker 1: his mother passed away, Like holy shit, Wow, I'm assuming
Speaker 1: that this was her way of making sure the farm
Speaker 1: was taken care of and the other two children didn't
Speaker 1: really have the same interest in the farm that Robert did.
Speaker 1: But then for the fact that he like he changed
Speaker 1: her diapers and everything, like he did like everything for her,
Speaker 1: and this made him completely disappointed and feel stuck.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, yeah, you're right, but look at it
Speaker 3: as clearly he's the more competent one of the children
Speaker 3: because he is looking after and everything. So who better
Speaker 3: to make look after the farm.
Speaker 1: I don't know if I would say he's the most competent, well.
Speaker 3: You know what I mean in showing his mother he
Speaker 3: was the competent one.
Speaker 1: I guess. Well, and then he I think like he
Speaker 1: ended up getting that twenty thousand I think was like
Speaker 1: an extra twenty thousand, if I can remember correctly, and
Speaker 1: then he get like what his siblings got when he
Speaker 1: was forty, so like technically he was getting more money.
Speaker 1: There was something too that I had read. If the
Speaker 1: dad had died first, it was like completely oh my
Speaker 1: myke heeps exciting. It was like having some uh, I'm
Speaker 1: having some issues here.
Speaker 3: It's some mic dysfunction.
Speaker 1: It's just dropping so weird.
Speaker 3: Okay, it doesn't usually happen like that. It usually stands
Speaker 3: straight up and performs really well.
Speaker 1: Okay, So if the dad had died first, I hope
Speaker 1: I'm remembering this correctly. It was basically that the sister
Speaker 1: I think, only got like twenty thousand and the rest
Speaker 1: was split between the brothers. So like the dad was
Speaker 1: like leaving like nothing to the sister.
Speaker 3: Really, yeah, gotcha, that's interesting. Yeah, that's I wonder why.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, so I mean, I think it was
Speaker 1: just that she wanted the farm looked after, and he
Speaker 1: was the only one that had an interest in it,
Speaker 1: is my assumption, gotcha. So the years after the passing
Speaker 1: of the parents, Robert and his siblings, his sister being
Speaker 1: a realtor, sold much of the farm for urban urban development,
Speaker 1: making millions. So I think they sold three different chunks
Speaker 1: of land, and so they earned five point two five
Speaker 1: point two three million, Like that is a lot of money.
Speaker 3: Oh, they probably would have got like ten times that today.
Speaker 1: Oh gosh, yeah, But I mean that wouldn't have done
Speaker 1: anything for Robert.
Speaker 3: No.
Speaker 1: Uh, actually know, they wouldn't have because the farm would
Speaker 1: just be like, okay, if nothing happened, you mean, if
Speaker 1: nothing had happened.
Speaker 3: Honestly, no, like even if they if the the property,
Speaker 3: if everything still happened and the property was sold today,
Speaker 3: that property, I'm not talking about like the farmhouse, the
Speaker 3: farm itself.
Speaker 1: I'm talking to the land that's stale. Would people want
Speaker 1: that shit?
Speaker 3: I guess probably land like that close to Vancouver.
Speaker 1: Like that, that's true, that's true, that's.
Speaker 3: Big, But I'm just like that is prime real estate.
Speaker 1: Robert would maintain a small scale livestock operation at the farm. Well,
Speaker 1: the majority of the land seemed to be used for
Speaker 1: Robert's brothers endeavors. Robert, Yeah, Robert was the older one
Speaker 1: of the two brothers. It seemed like the brother, the
Speaker 1: younger brother, had like a lot of control over him,
Speaker 1: almost it did seem from my ratings. So the endeavors
Speaker 1: that the brother had included a top soil business and
Speaker 1: he used the land for a parking lot for trucks
Speaker 1: and heavy equipment for his excavation and demolition business. Dave
Speaker 1: also had an interest with the known group the Hell's Angels,
Speaker 1: and the farm was also used as a chop shop,
Speaker 1: which Robert ran as David was busy with his businesses
Speaker 1: and Robert had a gift for vehicle salvaging.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so they were quite the pseudo entrepreneurs kind of Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because in some reports even said that like Robert
Speaker 1: owned the demolition business with David.
Speaker 3: But then it wasn't nothing was every clear, Like I couldn't.
Speaker 1: Fully clarify that. So I know David ow them for sure,
Speaker 1: not sure, but Robert, and so for anyone too that
Speaker 1: doesn't know what a chop shop is, it's a place
Speaker 1: where stolen vehicles are basically dismantled so that the parts
Speaker 1: can be sold or used to repair other stolen vehicles
Speaker 1: or items sometimes are hidden all together and claimed for insurance.
Speaker 1: So they would be like burying shit, and sometimes they
Speaker 1: wouldn't even bury it. They would just like cover it
Speaker 1: with top soil or whatever. Like their farm was disgusting,
Speaker 1: like it was just a complete mess. They just destroyed
Speaker 1: everything about it.
Speaker 3: Well, if you look at the picture, the picture you posted.
Speaker 1: I did post, Yeah, it looks like a mess.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, it's disgusting.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I've seen farms before, and I mean, farms are gross.
Speaker 3: It's a muddy cross place. It's understandable you have animals
Speaker 3: and everything growing around, but that just looked fucking gross. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So the next endeavor for the Picton brothers would be
Speaker 1: what they called Piggy Palace.
Speaker 3: And this was Piggy Palace.
Speaker 1: Piggy Palace.
Speaker 3: This is my favorite part of the story just because
Speaker 3: of how ridiculous it is.
Speaker 1: It seems pretty ridiculous, like absolutely, I can't even believe
Speaker 1: that this happened.
Speaker 3: I know so.
Speaker 1: And that was in nineteen ninety five, nineteen ninety six.
Speaker 1: So they purchased property not far from the farm and
Speaker 1: converted a large corrugated metal shed to have a long bar,
Speaker 1: full restaurant kitchen, walk and fridge, and raised dance floor.
Speaker 1: Old beer signs were hung, fluorescent lighting, and a revolving
Speaker 1: disco ball and sound system. I mean, am I was
Speaker 1: kind of interesting there. I actually should try to find
Speaker 1: a photo. I didn't try to find a photo.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm sure there is pictures out there.
Speaker 1: Because this is also almost like in farmland, And it
Speaker 1: was like, like, I feel like I would never go there,
Speaker 1: Like I feel like I would just get freaking murdered.
Speaker 3: It's called Piggy Palace and it's on a.
Speaker 1: Farm like there's I don't think that I would ever
Speaker 1: go to something like that.
Speaker 3: And it was a known hangout area for people like
Speaker 3: the Hell's Angels. Yes, yeah, that's not a place I'm
Speaker 3: going to just go chill right Saturday night.
Speaker 1: It seemed like a lot of people would go check
Speaker 1: it out, though, so there were enough tables and chairs
Speaker 1: to fit upwards of one hundred and fifty people. There
Speaker 1: was a cover to get in the place of like
Speaker 1: ten to twenty dollars, and they would bring in usually
Speaker 1: no less than ten thousand dollars like on an average night,
Speaker 1: which is cool, Like that's a lot of money. And
Speaker 1: I think there was one it said one night they
Speaker 1: made like forty over forty thousand, Holy shit. So the
Speaker 1: place was just like Hoppin'.
Speaker 3: Piggy Palace rolling in the dough.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the place made a lot of people excited, including Robert.
Speaker 1: He hoped this was his chance to find a steady
Speaker 1: girlfriend he had. He had had very few relationships in
Speaker 1: the past. Most females either friend zoned him or were
Speaker 1: basically like repulse by him. I don't know how to
Speaker 1: say that. I think I can say that, Yeah, he's nasty.
Speaker 3: I'm not surprised repulsed. You're nasty. Pick then you're nasty.
Speaker 1: He was briefly engaged, so he said, to a woman
Speaker 1: named Connie when he was twenty four. She was a
Speaker 1: pen pal friend. He like that was his thing. He
Speaker 1: was like, had pen pal friends mostly and they're mostly female.
Speaker 3: Well, if you don't have much charisma, that's where you go.
Speaker 1: I know.
Speaker 3: So he going online? Azel. Does anyone remain remember Azel
Speaker 3: asl no no chat remember that the fucking late like
Speaker 3: MSN Well, like I'm talking like internet chat rooms, not
Speaker 3: just msn.
Speaker 1: Oh like, and you could chat with anyone in another one.
Speaker 3: Yeah. So you like Azel, you'd ask people Azel be
Speaker 3: age sex location. So how old do you are you girl? Guy?
Speaker 3: What and where do you live? Oh? Interesting, you don't
Speaker 3: remember that shit.
Speaker 1: You had too much time on your hands, dude.
Speaker 3: I had a lot of time.
Speaker 1: I was. I was too busy.
Speaker 3: I was playing fucking Diablo and StarCraft and talking to
Speaker 3: people in chat rooms.
Speaker 1: Okay, so where was I here? So he went to
Speaker 1: visit her at one point and holy shit, I'm actually
Speaker 1: reading in the wrong line smooth.
Speaker 3: It's so easy to do that.
Speaker 1: Well, you messed me up. Okay. Yeah, so he went
Speaker 1: and visited her, but she was she was living in Michigan,
Speaker 1: so apparently, like he came back, they were engaged, but
Speaker 1: she had a job in Michigan and he was like
Speaker 1: pretty attached to the farm. So it just like didn't
Speaker 1: work out.
Speaker 3: Gotcha. Also, I like how I tried to cover for
Speaker 3: you there so you can have.
Speaker 1: Time, and then I just blamed you.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm like, it's so easy to do that, and
Speaker 3: you're like, fuck you, Ben, it's your fault. Thanks, love
Speaker 3: you too, babe. Trying to have you back here.
Speaker 1: Oh, that's us to a tea. Okay. So he also
Speaker 1: had a thing for one of his brother's girlfriends, Sandy,
Speaker 1: and Sandy, from what I could tell, was the mother
Speaker 1: of David's kids, and when they broke up, it devastated Robert.
Speaker 1: He apparently asked her to marry him, but she turned
Speaker 1: him down. So like, that's really interesting.
Speaker 3: I'm just singing songs from Greece right now, Sandy. Oh gosh.
Speaker 1: I was like, you seem really into that, Okay. So
Speaker 1: the idea of this picky palace excited him, and so
Speaker 1: apparently for a very brief period in his life, he
Speaker 1: decided to clean himself up to not be like such
Speaker 1: a disgusting, nasty motherfucker.
Speaker 3: Wow.
Speaker 1: So he like got new clothes. I think he bathed
Speaker 1: a little bit more. I can't remember what the hell
Speaker 1: it's called, but like he was balding at the top.
Speaker 1: He had like nasty kind of long hair, and then
Speaker 1: he got this hair piece that would like sit on
Speaker 1: the top of his head like a too pey. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was like, I can't remember what it's called. So
Speaker 1: like people notice at first, like oly, shit, like he
Speaker 1: looked like a new man really, like who is this guy.
Speaker 3: Which again props to him for trying to turn himself
Speaker 3: around and not necessarily saying it has to do with looks,
Speaker 3: but I mean respecting himself and cleaning himself and hygiene.
Speaker 1: That probably made him feel so good.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so props to him for that, Like you.
Speaker 1: Can absolutely turn your life around at times, I think,
Speaker 1: like you just you just got to have a will.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So it shows like Robert Picton could have been
Speaker 3: a good person.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm. I honestly feel like I don't know in
Speaker 1: a sense, andimes I think he could. He really could
Speaker 1: have been if this so many things had been different.
Speaker 3: I think so too.
Speaker 1: It's like they say, sometimes serial killers are made, and
Speaker 1: I think in this story that's the truth.
Speaker 3: I think he hit the nail on the head there
Speaker 3: one percent. Yeah, through and through. Yeah, okay, but it's true.
Speaker 3: So yeah, he cleaned himself up very briefly, but then
Speaker 3: like he didn't take care of this two pay is
Speaker 3: that what we decided? It was called yeah, hair pieces.
Speaker 1: And so it very quickly got disgusting and like he
Speaker 1: was just I don't know, it's just very quickly. So
Speaker 1: like he went back to his old waist because he
Speaker 1: even had gotten like a new motor home, but like
Speaker 1: he just didn't keep up with anything. It's like it's
Speaker 1: not he almost didn't know how or something. So the
Speaker 1: brothers would later incorporate Piggy Palace to be I always
Speaker 1: want to say it with plural piggies, but I don't
Speaker 1: think it is. So they incorporate it to be Picky
Speaker 1: Palace Good Time Society and registered it as a non
Speaker 1: profit charity. I'm like, how how with a mandate to
Speaker 1: raise for charitable groups through events such as dances and
Speaker 1: shows on behalf of service organizations, sports organizations, and other
Speaker 1: worthy groups like lofuck. Though the Palace attracted all types
Speaker 1: of crowds, including it didn't like it said this in
Speaker 1: numerous things, off duty police officers, city officials, and the
Speaker 1: mayor of Port Equiplament at one time even had an
Speaker 1: appearance there, very brief, but he did. But in all
Speaker 1: reality it was a biker hangout attracting a rougher crowd
Speaker 1: on a more normal basis, including the Hell's Angels which
Speaker 1: would take over every couple of weeks for private parties.
Speaker 3: I think there were certain events.
Speaker 1: Where charitable events. Probably yes, certain.
Speaker 3: Charitable events that would have attracted those those more official types,
Speaker 3: and then like maybe the weekends or something like that,
Speaker 3: and then when it was back to the weekdays, that's
Speaker 3: when it was the regular's toll in or something like that.
Speaker 1: But it is surprising because the zoning of that shit
Speaker 1: must it just like they must have just had a
Speaker 1: complete idea that they shouldn't be there.
Speaker 3: I feel like, you know, I never even considered zoning.
Speaker 3: I wonder if it was like even a thing. Well, yeah,
Speaker 3: it would have been.
Speaker 1: I have this later because it was zoned for agricultural purposes.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's very much so.
Speaker 1: And there's a bar there like that is just it's
Speaker 1: just like the opposite of what it was zoned for.
Speaker 3: People just not asking questions, I guess.
Speaker 1: So. Neighbors would complain often of the rowdiness, drug use,
Speaker 1: and noise coming from the parties. At one point they
Speaker 1: were sued by Port Coquitlam officials for violating zoning. Audience audiences,
Speaker 1: I think that's how you would say that.
Speaker 3: How come you just questioned the zoning when you just
Speaker 3: had the answer in the next sentence. You totally set
Speaker 3: me up. Thanks appreciate it. You just wrote me around.
Speaker 3: Well played, Well, that's how we roll.
Speaker 1: But that's how we roll.
Speaker 3: Throw Ben into the bus every time. Everything.
Speaker 1: Okay, you're making me sound like a terrible person. I
Speaker 1: made you a delicious dinner, a delicious cheese. K Okay,
Speaker 1: you out to swain that it's just is it just
Speaker 1: for no? What's it called?
Speaker 3: Last One Laughing?
Speaker 1: Last One Laughing? Holy shit? But it was a Canadian show, right.
Speaker 3: Well, it's not a Canadian show, but there was a
Speaker 3: Canadian version. So if you don't know, there's a show
Speaker 3: called Last One Laughing. This is totally not.
Speaker 1: It's totally off talk about it.
Speaker 3: It's just fun. But there's a show where basically comedians
Speaker 3: get thrown in a house like Big Brother, and they
Speaker 3: have to stay in there for like ten hours and
Speaker 3: they're not allowed to laugh, so you have to make
Speaker 3: the others laugh to leave the house, and last One
Speaker 3: Laughing wins. And there was a Canadian version of it
Speaker 3: where all all the contestants were Canadian only contestants, and
Speaker 3: yet Tom Green is Canadian and he was one of
Speaker 3: the ones in there and he just kept going after
Speaker 3: this one other girl, this other comedian, and he's just
Speaker 3: like making grilled cheese sandwiches, and he saw that she
Speaker 3: was laughing just the way he's saying grilled cheese, semam.
Speaker 3: And so he just kept going, would you like me
Speaker 3: to make you a delicious cheese sandwich?
Speaker 1: And he just over and over constantly. It was the
Speaker 1: funniest shit I've ever seen. And now I cannot hear
Speaker 1: or say the word delicious without thinking.
Speaker 3: That delicious cheese.
Speaker 1: So we constantly just say delicious cheese sandwich in this house.
Speaker 3: We should have a shirt that says delicious cheese sandwich.
Speaker 1: Actually i'd wear I'm rock it. Okay, holy shit, where
Speaker 1: was I here?
Speaker 3: Sorry, We're the worst.
Speaker 1: Okay. So, like basically everything else in their life, the
Speaker 1: brothers ignored these legal pressures, eventually getting banned for holding
Speaker 1: future parties, and ultimately in two thousand, the city shut
Speaker 1: down Piggy Palace. It's honestly surprising that they had their
Speaker 1: fun for like that many years. That it was probably
Speaker 1: four years.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's absurd.
Speaker 1: I cannot even believe that they got away with that
Speaker 1: for four years.
Speaker 3: Bringing in, like you said, like ten grand a night.
Speaker 1: I know, like they must like run rich as heck.
Speaker 1: I don't know. Maybe there was high costs of running it,
Speaker 1: but there was also along with like Hell's Angels. There
Speaker 1: was sex workers that would come and like people from
Speaker 1: the downtown east Side and stuff. So I don't know,
Speaker 1: like it's just the fact. And then it was being
Speaker 1: ran as a charity and stuff. It just seems like
Speaker 1: the most interesting.
Speaker 3: Regardless it promoted a very not so much healthy lifestyle.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know, the whole situation just seemed so
Speaker 1: crazy to me. Okay. So now, during much of this time,
Speaker 1: from the span of Robert losing his father slash mother
Speaker 1: just shortly after the close of Piggy Palace, there was
Speaker 1: a wide known problem happening in Vancouver's downtown east Side,
Speaker 1: and it was the disappearing of women, more specifically sex workers.
Speaker 1: As the rate of disappearances escalated, rumors of a sex
Speaker 1: section I know, I got this, but I'm like, I'm
Speaker 1: just like really reading too fast. So rumors of a
Speaker 1: serial killer began to circulate. The women were in fear
Speaker 1: of their life. They began walking in groups and writing
Speaker 1: down license plate numbers of vehicles picking up their friends,
Speaker 1: which is which is awesome. Like they were looking out
Speaker 1: for each other each other's back, which is really awesome.
Speaker 3: And clearly because the RCMP.
Speaker 1: City Police they didn't feel like anyone else did.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the police didn't have their back. So I don't
Speaker 3: think RCMPR in Vancouver. It's city police, aren't they.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's like Vancouver Police Department. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: don't think. I don't think it's rc ANDP.
Speaker 3: So I just wanted to clarify because I said RCMP four.
Speaker 1: Oh okay. So family members and friends were also reaching
Speaker 1: out to police, reporting their loved ones as missing and
Speaker 1: having no idea why or how they vanished, but knowing
Speaker 1: their loved ones were leaving behind personal identification, treasured children's pictures, medications,
Speaker 1: and uncashed welfare checks. Things that you wouldn't necessarily be
Speaker 1: leaving behind if you were just like skipping town. Yeah, no, kidding,
Speaker 1: very important items really.
Speaker 3: Yeah, someone who's skipping town, you know, running away from
Speaker 3: a lifestyle or other individuals that they're probably going to
Speaker 3: need all the income they can get and they're going
Speaker 3: to take that with them.
Speaker 1: M they're medications, and they're probably going to get the
Speaker 1: photos of their.
Speaker 3: Children, right exactly. They're going to take those possessions that
Speaker 3: are close to them.
Speaker 1: Absolutely. Most of the senior police officers in the Vancouver
Speaker 1: Police Department refuse to believe a serial killer was at
Speaker 1: work because of the marginalized lifestyles and transient habits of
Speaker 1: the victims going missing, The police were not taking the
Speaker 1: concerns seriously and believe there was no indication of a
Speaker 1: serial killer on the loose, instead suggesting that an increasing
Speaker 1: level of violence and disputes over drugs in the downtown
Speaker 1: East Side were likely to blame. But they also did
Speaker 1: not give an explanation for the lack of bodies being
Speaker 1: found if that were the case.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I mean just playing devil's advocate here, say
Speaker 3: the police are right, and that is playing a role.
Speaker 3: I'm sure it is playing a role. I'm sure it's
Speaker 3: not the entire reason, though maybe there is. It is
Speaker 3: accounting for a couple, but it's definitely not accounting for all.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean some of them would have been overdoses,
Speaker 1: but then they would have had a body, and some
Speaker 1: people did go missing later to be found. So it's
Speaker 1: like I I but the amount of numbers that were
Speaker 1: going missing was too high to ignore. Really. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: So in nineteen eighty seven, the RCMP did set up
Speaker 1: a special team to investigate the disappearances.
Speaker 3: You said, RCMP.
Speaker 1: Shit, I do have RCMP. Okay, now I'm gonna have
Speaker 1: to double check.
Speaker 3: I'm pretty sure. I'm gonna give here a quick Google while.
Speaker 1: Your tah no, let's just look right now.
Speaker 3: Okay. So we just gave it a quick Google search,
Speaker 3: and just to clarify if RCMP are operating within Vancouver,
Speaker 3: here's what Google says. It says the Northern sorry, the
Speaker 3: North Vancouver. Wow, I can't talk good thing I'm not
Speaker 3: presenting today. The North Vancouver City District and provincial RCMP units,
Speaker 3: for example, make up the North Vancouver detachments. So there
Speaker 3: is both RCMP and city police in Vancouver.
Speaker 1: Okay, which makes sense because I do kind of go
Speaker 1: back and forth a little bit.
Speaker 3: So yeah, so they're they're operating together basically.
Speaker 1: There's also Google reviews for RCMP, which seems wild to me.
Speaker 1: They are happily they have a two point eight goog review.
Speaker 3: Why am I not surprised?
Speaker 1: That's really interesting. They should be having not reviews on there. Okay,
Speaker 1: but I also just have to say something really quick,
Speaker 1: is we are garbage jump in town. I have to
Speaker 1: like google it sometimes to look at the hours, and
Speaker 1: there's literally a five star review on there. That says
Speaker 1: some they what did it? Would say, it's a garbage dump.
Speaker 1: I dump things, and every time I look at the hours,
Speaker 1: I just like freaking laugh my ass off. It's so funny.
Speaker 1: Five stars, five stars and lets me dump things.
Speaker 3: Yep.
Speaker 1: Okay. So in nineteen eighty seven, the oh did I Okay,
Speaker 1: that's where we left off, and then we're like, oh,
Speaker 1: there's yeah. So I'm just gonna say that lining in.
Speaker 1: The RCMP did set up a special team to investigate
Speaker 1: the disappearances, but due to limited progress, it was disbanded
Speaker 1: in nineteen eighty nine. In nineteen ninety one, families of
Speaker 1: the missing women, along with advocates for sex trade workers,
Speaker 1: would establish an annual Valentine's Day a Remembrance Walk, as
Speaker 1: a memorial to remember or to the murder to missing victims.
Speaker 1: The hopes of this was to bring light to the
Speaker 1: situation and that police may once again start an investigation,
Speaker 1: but the police were sluggish to respond. The Vancouver Sun
Speaker 1: a key was the police of geving low priority to
Speaker 1: crimes committed against sex workers. They were also criticized for
Speaker 1: their reluctance to adopt new emerging methods of investigation, such
Speaker 1: as psychological criminal profiling, and geo profiling. Though the creep
Speaker 1: factor was high with Robert Picton, he wasn't necessarily under
Speaker 1: radar until he was actually caught. We'll talk about these
Speaker 1: are the complaints that would come in regarding Robert. But
Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety seven, there was a significant missed opportunity
Speaker 1: that could have prevented the death of many women, and
Speaker 1: that was the incident with Wendy Lynn Eiestetter and my friends.
Speaker 1: That's also we're going to stop today's episode.
Speaker 3: That was information overload.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we had to get through all that stuff to
Speaker 1: be able to tell the rest of the story.
Speaker 3: Well, it's severely important to consider what happened after words,
Speaker 3: because now we kind of have a picture of his
Speaker 3: history and what kind of individual he has become, yes,
Speaker 3: and the opportunities he had to turn himself around and
Speaker 3: never really fully took advantage of them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so we'll be we'll be doing part two next week.
Speaker 1: And I also wanted to showed out a book. So
Speaker 1: this book was written by Stevie Cameron and it's titled
Speaker 1: On the Farm Robert William picked him and the tragic
Speaker 1: story of Vancouver Missing women. And so I'm finally reading
Speaker 1: a book for a case, which I'm like, yes, some'vering awesome.
Speaker 3: You generally don't have the time to read a full
Speaker 3: book for.
Speaker 1: It, I know, And this time I'm just like, you
Speaker 1: know what, I'm just going to like do it. So
Speaker 1: I'm I am like skimming because i mean, it's like
Speaker 1: seven on our pages and we're not going to have
Speaker 1: like a seven hour podcast. So if you really wanted to,
Speaker 1: like dive super deep, you could read that. And because
Speaker 1: it's really well done, it's just like a wealth of information.
Speaker 1: But yeah, next week we'll be giving you more details
Speaker 1: on this and this nasty character that we're talking about here.
Speaker 3: Yeah, one that hits close to home for us and
Speaker 3: one that is known worldwide because this is crazy.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's very crazy.
Speaker 3: Well well done so far, that was really good.
Speaker 1: Thank you.
Speaker 3: Yeah, if you guys want to see more of us,
Speaker 3: of course, check out our social media links that are
Speaker 3: in the description or the show notes of this podcast.
Speaker 3: You can find us on Instagram, Facebook, all those good ones,
Speaker 3: and of course Patreon, Patreon, and you can check out
Speaker 3: the new merch we dropped this week.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, we had some super cool merch.
Speaker 3: Actually, we had three new designs, all colored designs for
Speaker 3: T shirt stickers, water bottles, you name it, all designed
Speaker 3: by the guy who's talking right now. And socks, Yes, socks.
Speaker 1: The socks are actually dope. They are I love They're
Speaker 1: so good. Yeah, And honestly, if you have a moment,
Speaker 1: we would love, love, love for you to give us
Speaker 1: a rating because it really really helps.
Speaker 3: Reviews and ratings help the algorithm actually shout our podcast
Speaker 3: out to other people who might think that, you know,
Speaker 3: Spotify is like, hey, this person might like this.
Speaker 1: Podcast, which is honestly how we got to where we
Speaker 1: are too, was getting pushed by the algorithm. Really yeah,
Speaker 1: so if you got along with all these awesome people.
Speaker 3: Yes, definitely don't get me wrong there, but if you
Speaker 3: guys could help, you know, give us a review, hey,
Speaker 3: even maybe tell a friend about our podcast, it means
Speaker 3: a world of difference and it definitely helps. So thank
Speaker 3: you very much for all the support you've given us
Speaker 3: so far, and just wait for part two of Robert Pickton.
Speaker 3: So until then, until next
Speaker 1: Week, stay wicked.