Speaker 1: You'll be away five seventeen. Do you want to report
Speaker 1: a UFO hanging in?
Speaker 2: We don't want.
Speaker 1: To report every thirty one.
Speaker 3: Do you wish to report a.
Speaker 2: UFO over hey, we want to one of.
Speaker 1: Those areas thirty one.
Speaker 4: Do you wish to find a report of any kind
Speaker 4: of it?
Speaker 2: I wouldn't know what kind of reports clouds time areas
Speaker 2: thirty one?
Speaker 3: Me neither there. See if it was anybody a h
Speaker 3: above us to pass us, like thirty seconds.
Speaker 4: Ago, we were sending one of golf negative, okay, OFFI
Speaker 4: the UFO.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's murder ten nine o'clock. Yes, I'll just passed over,
Speaker 2: I go. I don't know what it was, but it's
Speaker 2: from at least to three thousand feet above us. See,
Speaker 2: I passed out over the top of US.
Speaker 4: Ninety one one.
Speaker 2: You just called up to me before.
Speaker 4: They're after staying the airplanes.
Speaker 2: Here to God on an unidentified object every Liberty four
Speaker 2: call or calm on an Unidentified flying object.
Speaker 5: A Welcome to UFO Chronicles a place where people share
Speaker 5: their experiences of the strange and unexplained. If you've had
Speaker 5: an encounter, I would like to be on the show.
Speaker 5: You can email me at UFO Chronicles at gmail dot com.
Speaker 4: Hello everyone, and welcome to the show. How are you
Speaker 4: all doing. I'm the contact and this is the UFO
Speaker 4: Chronicles podcast. In tonight's episode, we're joined by Jeff calling
Speaker 4: in from Missouri. Jeff is the founder and lead investigator
Speaker 4: of Tracking the Unknown, an independent project focused on structured
Speaker 4: documentation and analysis of unidentified aerial phenomena. Jeff approaches a
Speaker 4: subject from an evidence driven perspective with a clear separation
Speaker 4: between observation and interpretation, and that framework was put to
Speaker 4: the test in August of twenty twenty five when during
Speaker 4: an active investigation, he experienced an encounter with an unidentified object.
Speaker 4: The event was documented at the time and was followed
Speaker 4: by acute physiological and cognitive effects that lasted several days,
Speaker 4: as well as an estimated forty five minutes of unaccounted time.
Speaker 4: Jeff is up next, but.
Speaker 3: First, if you enjoy the show and you would like
Speaker 3: to help support the podcast on Patreon, you can do
Speaker 3: this for as little as one dollar a month. Head
Speaker 3: on over to patreon dot com forward slash UFO Chronicles podcast.
Speaker 3: You can also find a link in the description of
Speaker 3: this episode. Any help is very much appreciated. Now on
Speaker 3: with the show.
Speaker 4: Hello, Jeff, welcome to the podcast.
Speaker 1: It's a pleasure to be here.
Speaker 4: It is our pleasure. It is great to have you
Speaker 4: with us. And you're calling from the state of Missouri.
Speaker 1: That is correct. Yeah, write City, Missouri, a little rural town,
Speaker 1: middle of nowhere.
Speaker 4: Is the state banging the center of the United States.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's quite I'd say Kansas would be the more
Speaker 1: central part of the states, but it's very close, okay.
Speaker 4: And you were saying at the very beginning you were
Speaker 4: getting a bit of the old snow.
Speaker 1: Yes, sir, I'm snowed in at this time. It's about
Speaker 1: fourteen inches of snow outside negative one and I'm not
Speaker 1: going anywhere today.
Speaker 4: And I think a lot of the listeners tonight can
Speaker 4: totally relate to you. I reckon they're probably in the
Speaker 4: same position.
Speaker 1: Indeed.
Speaker 4: Indeed, now, Jeff, you have some experiences to share with us.
Speaker 4: Would you like start a beginning, please, sir.
Speaker 1: The very beginning, well before I ever had a sighting,
Speaker 1: I remember reading about the declassification of a Pentagon program
Speaker 1: called the Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program. I remember they
Speaker 1: released the Gimbal video, the go Fast video, and then
Speaker 1: a list of observables for what these objects do across
Speaker 1: these videos, and I remember taking a mental note on
Speaker 1: it because I thought it was fascinating. The first one
Speaker 1: is sudden and instantaneous acceleration, and another one is positive
Speaker 1: lift without aerodynamic surfaces or otherwise known as anti gravity,
Speaker 1: defying the Earth's gravity. The other one is hypersonic velocities
Speaker 1: without signatures like no sonic boom for its low observability
Speaker 1: and cloaking. Five trans medium travel with the ability to
Speaker 1: go through space, the atmosphere and the sea with no
Speaker 1: degradation in performance, and then six biological effects. This project
Speaker 1: has been going on since July twenty twenty five and
Speaker 1: is still ongoing here. In January, and all six of
Speaker 1: those A tip observables had been documented here now, so
Speaker 1: on July seventh of twenty twenty five. I mean, at
Speaker 1: this point it was an abstract thought. It was like
Speaker 1: junk food for the break. I would think about this
Speaker 1: and I thought it was interesting, but I never thought
Speaker 1: I would see anything myself. I went outside to have
Speaker 1: a cigarette and it was just before the Percy had
Speaker 1: media shower, so I was watching the sky within tent
Speaker 1: as I was dragging on my cigarette. But then this
Speaker 1: object came from the west. It appeared almost like a
Speaker 1: distant aircraft or maybe even a meteor, but it was
Speaker 1: moving at what appeared to be hypersonic velocity in my direction,
Speaker 1: so due east. And what was weird is it got bright,
Speaker 1: similar to a bow eyed or a fireball meteor. But
Speaker 1: then it changed in color and went from being a
Speaker 1: bright orange white to a black, hazy color, and it
Speaker 1: noticeably decelerated into a full stop. And the object in
Speaker 1: the center at this point appeared starlike, but then it shrunk,
Speaker 1: as if it gained distance or even shrunken size. It's
Speaker 1: hard to say, but I was watching it. It stayed
Speaker 1: still for about thirty seconds. Then it started instantly repositioning
Speaker 1: in the sky or zigzag behavior from one point to
Speaker 1: the next point, very large portions of the sky. Thing
Speaker 1: it did was it shot off to the south instantly,
Speaker 1: and it blew my mind. It was one of the
Speaker 1: most incredible things I've ever seen. I never thought I'd
Speaker 1: see anything like it again. So I wrote down every
Speaker 1: single thing I saw, sent it into moufon the mutual
Speaker 1: UFO network Newfork, and I thought that would be my
Speaker 1: only sighting but it turns out it wasn't. July eighteenth
Speaker 1: of twenty twenty five, another object similar profile. It just
Speaker 1: looked like a luminous orb floated over my position, or
Speaker 1: it just transited silently. Initially I took a recording of it,
Speaker 1: deleted the recording, thinking oh, it's probably just a drone.
Speaker 1: I'm skeptical by nature. I'm I try to not be
Speaker 1: prone to observer bias, but this object, it was just
Speaker 1: so strange. I ended up recovering the recording due to
Speaker 1: sightings on July twenty seven, twenty ninth, August first and second,
Speaker 1: now the twenty seventh. That was the night that I
Speaker 1: knew I had something extraordinary going on over my skies.
Speaker 1: Objects moving at hypersonic velocities with no flight surfaces, no
Speaker 1: FAA lights, doing things that are super strange, like disappearing
Speaker 1: and reappearing on different flight paths, moving through each other,
Speaker 1: and instantaneous accelerations. One object flew right over my head
Speaker 1: on July twenty eighth. When I say right over my head,
Speaker 1: it could have been a few thousand feet up, but
Speaker 1: it disappeared. It just disappeared out of nowhere. Through sole
Speaker 1: motion analysis, you can see this thing goes from maybe
Speaker 1: one hundred miles per hour to thousands of miles per
Speaker 1: hour just basically disappears in two frames into the sky.
Speaker 1: And these sightings just kept going and going. Then August
Speaker 1: first comes around. I started filming pretty earlier on in
Speaker 1: the day into the night and discovered something very interesting.
Speaker 1: Some of these objects that appear like stars, they appear
Speaker 1: like a point source. They would deviate from their position
Speaker 1: if you film them long enough. Not saying they're related,
Speaker 1: but these objects will mimic celestial objects and sort of
Speaker 1: blend in with the star field. But the motion that
Speaker 1: they exhibit makes it clear that it's between the observer
Speaker 1: and the stars, so it's something much closer clearly. But
Speaker 1: August second, that's the day that this whole thing changed.
Speaker 1: That was a more serious incident. I'll start at the
Speaker 1: beginning of the day. I started filming during daylight hours.
Speaker 1: Many weird things were already happening. As soon as I
Speaker 1: went outside. Objects were zigzagging all over the sky. There
Speaker 1: was one where these things can sometimes exhibit what appears
Speaker 1: to be an uncanny sense of situational awareness. There was
Speaker 1: one object that looked like a almost like a cylindrical
Speaker 1: metallic object no flight surfaces. I would lift my phone
Speaker 1: to record it and it would disappear behind the veil
Speaker 1: of the atmosphere, and then I put my phone back
Speaker 1: down because I think it's gone, and then it would
Speaker 1: pop right back out. Lifted my phone to record it again,
Speaker 1: and it did the same thing, disappeared behind the blue
Speaker 1: veil of the atmosphere, and I kept recording. There was
Speaker 1: a lot of strange things, objects moving around the sky
Speaker 1: and making extreme turns that are indicative of high G force,
Speaker 1: like extreme G forces, the kind of stuff that would
Speaker 1: turn a human pilot into soup. Things that are shouldn't
Speaker 1: be possible. But where the night took a very I
Speaker 1: would say negative turn was about nine o'clock PM. I
Speaker 1: started filming a long form video at nine o'clock. This object,
Speaker 1: it was, I guess you could call it hovering, highly luminous,
Speaker 1: almost starlac, and I had noticed that its movement had
Speaker 1: deviated from the starfield, so I kept recording it. This
Speaker 1: is on my old phone, so the quality is not
Speaker 1: the best. The footage is ambiguous at best. But I
Speaker 1: filmed from nine o'clock to about nine to twenty six PM,
Speaker 1: and I was outside with my dog at about nine
Speaker 1: to twenty six. I mean I went from feeling real healthy,
Speaker 1: real good, like I could run a mile, to feeling
Speaker 1: as though all the energy got sapped from me, like blackout,
Speaker 1: adjacent fatigue, shortness of breath in slight dizziness too. I
Speaker 1: had actually buckled over and was trying to regain my composure.
Speaker 1: It was very weird. It was like all the energy
Speaker 1: was just sapped from me. And once I regained my composure,
Speaker 1: I recorded the object for maybe another forty seconds, and
Speaker 1: I just had a feeling like, ah, this just I
Speaker 1: don't feel good. This is getting a little bit weird.
Speaker 1: Initially I attributed the symptoms to something personal. I wasn't
Speaker 1: going to automatically say that it was the object that
Speaker 1: was responsible for these symptoms. But I decided to disengage
Speaker 1: from filming and go inside. I got up, walked inside.
Speaker 1: It's probably about nine to twenty seven PM, and I
Speaker 1: opened the back door. My dog runs in.
Speaker 2: I go in.
Speaker 1: I locked the door behind me. As I'm walking through
Speaker 1: my kitchen past the there's a counter in there. Three
Speaker 1: things happen all simultaneously. I flashed both through my southern window.
Speaker 1: I got a blast of fatigue, not just like a
Speaker 1: minor wave like it was outside. It it felt like
Speaker 1: I was hit by something. All the lights in my
Speaker 1: house flickered, and my dogs started going insane, and the symptoms,
Speaker 1: the immediate onset of acute and very strong symptoms hit
Speaker 1: A shortness of breath right as it hit me. It
Speaker 1: was like a split second paralysis. I had to catch
Speaker 1: myself on one of the chairs that was propped up
Speaker 1: against one of the counters. Immediately went into like fight
Speaker 1: or flight, because I mean what I was feeling. I
Speaker 1: went from feeling relatively normal to borderline concussed. I felt nausea,
Speaker 1: I was disoriented, my vision wasn't so good. Extreme vertigo,
Speaker 1: like really bad vertigo, like barely being able to walk straight.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I armed myself. There's a weapon on the counter.
Speaker 1: I work in law enforcement, so I'm pretty used to
Speaker 1: having firearms around, and my dogs were going absolutely insane. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a little hard to talk about. I ran full
Speaker 1: speed to my room. I locked the door and was
Speaker 1: in a like a threat ready position, aiming at the
Speaker 1: door because I had this very strong feeling like I
Speaker 1: wasn't alone. Another symptom of whatever this was. It was
Speaker 1: like an unnatural fear response, hypervigilance, almost a feeling like
Speaker 1: predator and prey, like a primal fear. Nothing I've ever
Speaker 1: felt before. I've been in many situations that induced fight
Speaker 1: or flight and adrenaline, but this was different. I've never
Speaker 1: felt this before. I was aiming at the door, I
Speaker 1: realized I was completely alone. I was isolated. There was
Speaker 1: no one else at the house, and where I live
Speaker 1: it's very far away from anyone, so I realized, ya,
Speaker 1: I was very much isolated. I called my ex girlfriend.
Speaker 1: She knew what I was doing. I had been sending
Speaker 1: her videos in the previous days, and as soon as
Speaker 1: she answered, the first thing I said was they're here.
Speaker 1: If the phone line cuts out, it's not me, which
Speaker 1: understandably freaked her out. But as I was on the phone,
Speaker 1: the dogs just kept going crazy. I noticed they wouldn't
Speaker 1: go near my door, and the air itself didn't feel right.
Speaker 1: With the air around me, it felt charged, heavy, almost oppressive,
Speaker 1: and that feeling of being watched it was almost overwhelming.
Speaker 1: But I've been trained to handle my self and stressful times,
Speaker 1: you know, It's something I have to do quite often.
Speaker 1: Working in Saint Louis, it's a high crime urban environment.
Speaker 1: But what was weird too. Was later checked the time
Speaker 1: log of when I called her, and it should have
Speaker 1: been close to nine thirty pm, but it was It
Speaker 1: said ten fifteen pm. This is about a good forty
Speaker 1: five minutes of on account to for time and the
Speaker 1: full list of symptoms. Actually, I'll get to that in
Speaker 1: a moment. I'll tell the rest of the story. So
Speaker 1: it felt as though it was like a standoff was
Speaker 1: in my room. I'm on the phone to de isolate myself,
Speaker 1: was telling her what was going on. She could hear
Speaker 1: the dogs going crazy in the background, and it wasn't
Speaker 1: like a dog's barking at someone passing the house. This
Speaker 1: was low growls, threat barking, and as I said, you
Speaker 1: could feel it in the air. It wasn't right about yeah,
Speaker 1: thirty minutes goes by. I had the phone call connected
Speaker 1: to my parents, who were out of town on vacation
Speaker 1: at the time, and because I didn't want to sound crazy,
Speaker 1: I told them I believe there may be an intruder
Speaker 1: in the house. I told them call nine to one one,
Speaker 1: get an officer to come out here and do the
Speaker 1: patrol of the property. Right as I said nine one one.
Speaker 1: The dogs stopped barking. The air felt as though it
Speaker 1: went back to normal, and it felt as though it ended.
Speaker 1: I ended up leaving my room and clearing the top
Speaker 1: level of my house before leaving my house with great haste.
Speaker 1: I left a lot of stuff behind, and I didn't
Speaker 1: even bring chargers. I didn't bring my EESIG. I just left,
Speaker 1: drove down the road, stopped at a gas station, and
Speaker 1: I bought a different EASIG. Was telling this person behind
Speaker 1: the counter how crazy my night had been, because I
Speaker 1: remember my h hands still shaking from the adrenaline. As
Speaker 1: I was going to put my debit card in the reader,
Speaker 1: I could barely get a debit card in there because
Speaker 1: my hand was shaking so much. But as I got
Speaker 1: back into my car, like this whole time, I'm still
Speaker 1: on the phone with my AX, because I didn't want
Speaker 1: to be alone at any point after what I had
Speaker 1: just been through. But I ended up getting off the
Speaker 1: phone to see if I can get my GPS going,
Speaker 1: because my plan was to leave the state to go
Speaker 1: stay with her, because she lived in Illinois and I
Speaker 1: was staying in right City at the time, and I said,
Speaker 1: she's my AX. We were going through problems at the time,
Speaker 1: but I'm not going to devils at many details about that.
Speaker 1: I remember I could not get my phone to connect
Speaker 1: to my car. No matter what I did, Bluetooth, direct wire,
Speaker 1: nothing worked. As though my phone was it was impossible
Speaker 1: to connect it to my car. I probably tried fifty
Speaker 1: or sixty times, and so I started driving. I realized
Speaker 1: it was like, I know this route. I've done this
Speaker 1: drive probably hundreds of times. So I decided to just go.
Speaker 1: As I'm driving, I'm realizing that my driving is not
Speaker 1: so good. I'm kind of swerving, I'm not driving well.
Speaker 1: They keep in mind I was sober as a judge
Speaker 1: this night, and I hadn't had a drink or anything.
Speaker 1: It was whatever had occurred while filming and walking inside
Speaker 1: that was making me feel this way. And when the
Speaker 1: adrenaline wore off, I just I started noticing symptom after
Speaker 1: symptom after symptom. So I have a whole list of
Speaker 1: symptoms here. So it started with acute pressure, shortness of breath,
Speaker 1: split second paralysis, nausea, dizziness, disorientation, visual sensitivity, extreme vertigo,
Speaker 1: My face was numb, paresthesia or nerve tingling, sensation throughout
Speaker 1: my whole body. Tachycardia and my neurological symptoms were severe
Speaker 1: as well, the whole blackout adjacent fatigue initially, and the
Speaker 1: fatigue lingered for days. Brain flog, severely compromised short term memory.
Speaker 1: It was really i'd be saying something, I'd forget what
Speaker 1: I was saying halfway through saying it. Type memory, the
Speaker 1: unnatural fear response, hypervigilance, the predator prey feeling. And here
Speaker 1: let me flip my notes over see, I wrote everything
Speaker 1: down in the days of and the days after what
Speaker 1: I experienced. That's what I have written down for that.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I drove to her house. I probably missed
Speaker 1: about fifteen turns, maybe more because my memory is compromised
Speaker 1: at this point. When I finally arrived and got out,
Speaker 1: and she had me go into the basement and she
Speaker 1: brought me some food because she was just worried about me.
Speaker 1: I mean, I must have looked like a total mess
Speaker 1: showing up. It was disoriented, confused. I mean I showed
Speaker 1: up with my duty belt on, I was armed. It
Speaker 1: was just a psychological comfort. Like when I think about it. However,
Speaker 1: these objects are so advanced that having a firearm would
Speaker 1: be like having a caveman's club in comparison, but it's
Speaker 1: just a psychological comfort. She had me sit down. She
Speaker 1: brought me a bowl of oatmeal, and I remember I
Speaker 1: set it down on my lap and I forgot it
Speaker 1: was there, probably like eight different times. My short sort
Speaker 1: of memory was just blasted. I remember trying to stand
Speaker 1: up and walk around and barely being able to walk straight.
Speaker 1: It was really disoriented, and the fear it didn't feel
Speaker 1: like natural fear. For anyone who's ever taken up medication,
Speaker 1: you understand that you'll take a medication and it'll it'll
Speaker 1: be there, like you'll feel that like let's say it's
Speaker 1: an SSRI. It'll balance out your feelings. It'll balance the
Speaker 1: chemicals in your brain in a certain way, and it
Speaker 1: stays that way for a little while. It kind of
Speaker 1: felt like that, like medicinal fear. I know that sounds crazy,
Speaker 1: but it didn't feel natural because it lasted for days.
Speaker 1: Unnatural fear, especially of studed lights and being outside at night.
Speaker 1: I didn't go outside at night for almost a month
Speaker 1: after this incident. But what compelled me to continue filming
Speaker 1: was telling people this story, this exact story. I would
Speaker 1: receive cognitive dissonance, disrespect, disbelief, or people would immediately chalk
Speaker 1: it up to something that was conventional, which I'm not
Speaker 1: going to say something conventional isn't possible. But this was
Speaker 1: just too strange and too related. It's hard to dismiss
Speaker 1: it when I was actively filming an object of anomalist
Speaker 1: nature before these symptoms occurred. Might I mention too, while
Speaker 1: I was in my room and armed, I was expecting
Speaker 1: a third wave of whatever this was. I know for
Speaker 1: sure that if a third wave hit, it probably would
Speaker 1: have completely incapacitated me. Like, when I think back on it,
Speaker 1: it could have been a number of things. It could
Speaker 1: have been a close proximity event, you know, I've heard
Speaker 1: that there are certain biological effects that can occur when
Speaker 1: you're in close proximity to these objects. Who knows their
Speaker 1: method of moving around, Like think about this anology, like
Speaker 1: if you're standing right behind a jet when it's taking off,
Speaker 1: you're going to get burned. Maybe it's something like that,
Speaker 1: or it could have been something else. I have heard
Speaker 1: tell of directed energy waves from these objects, and that's
Speaker 1: not something that our military doesn't currently have. It is
Speaker 1: possible as far as origin of these objects, I can't say.
Speaker 1: I don't know. It could be a number of things.
Speaker 1: Many people think extraterrestrial, which is possible based on the
Speaker 1: extreme physics I've seen. Some people say crypto terrestrial, like
Speaker 1: it's from here, and some people say interdimensional, but all
Speaker 1: of which I can't verify. But that experience was a
Speaker 1: big inspiration as to why I started tracking the unknown.
Speaker 1: August thirtieth is when I resumed filming. I started capturing
Speaker 1: objects that like the first video I took on August thirtieth,
Speaker 1: it was daytime. An object that had no flight surfaces
Speaker 1: appeared oblong in shape, similar to a tic tac like
Speaker 1: the breath ment, was flying by silently, transitting from south
Speaker 1: to north. That was the first video, and I had
Speaker 1: noticed second and very objects near it, like these small
Speaker 1: sphere like objects that would move at extreme velocity. You
Speaker 1: can only capture through slow motion analysis. Otherwise it's a
Speaker 1: blink of an eye, and these things are there and gone.
Speaker 1: And I just kept filming and filming, and I would
Speaker 1: send my stuff into Moufon and I was working directly
Speaker 1: with their Star team. Their Star team handles like the
Speaker 1: top one percent of cases as far as UFOology goes
Speaker 1: So it was I was working with Margie k and
Speaker 1: before that it was Debbie Ziegelmeyer. She's been on the
Speaker 1: Ancient Alien Show. She's an author. She was one of
Speaker 1: the people that gave me one of the biggest and
Speaker 1: most helpful tips to establish that this is really a
Speaker 1: recurring phenomenon rather than just a one off. She told
Speaker 1: me that these sightings are very common during the summer
Speaker 1: around nine PM. So I took a mental note of
Speaker 1: that and kept filming. But then that led up to
Speaker 1: the August second anomalous health incident. But this project, what
Speaker 1: I decided to do. The direction I would go is
Speaker 1: I would film the objects, do slow motion analysis and
Speaker 1: also do frame by frame analysis with AI comparing to
Speaker 1: conventional and celestial objects. Trying to disprove my own footage
Speaker 1: before I put it out, because if I can't, if
Speaker 1: I can disprove it, someone else can't. So I try
Speaker 1: to debunk my own footage before it goes out. But
Speaker 1: that's been the idea is analysis before speculation, and uh,
Speaker 1: I guess that's how tracking the Unknown came to be.
Speaker 1: Discover quite a few things with tracking the unknown and
Speaker 1: filming these objects. After upgrading to telescopic captures, and even
Speaker 1: it purchased a diffraction grading to study their light spectra.
Speaker 1: Like the spectrum of light on these objects is very interesting,
Speaker 1: but the data is preliminary at this time and still
Speaker 1: waiting for more baseline data to compare it to. So
Speaker 1: there was another incident because like I've been doing these
Speaker 1: recordings night after night after night, so at nighttime it's
Speaker 1: easier to see these objects due to contrast the dark
Speaker 1: sky the object's luminosity, it's easier to study light behavior
Speaker 1: and motion analysis because during the day it's not quite
Speaker 1: as clear, there's more contrast, it's brighter. The objects are
Speaker 1: not as clear during the day, I've noted, but at
Speaker 1: night their luminosity stands out. So November tenth, there was
Speaker 1: an incident. I was I had gotten my telescope, so
Speaker 1: the first time I captured the IP and a telescopic
Speaker 1: capture was on Halloween of twenty twenty five. It's this object.
Speaker 1: It was beautiful, honestly, it's They're hauntingly beautiful through a telescope.
Speaker 1: But they come in different sizes and shapes, and it's
Speaker 1: hard to say that there's any definitive look to these objects.
Speaker 1: But there's one thing that's consistent is their luminosity in
Speaker 1: the diffuse haze. Like when you see a comet going by,
Speaker 1: there's usually like a diffuse kind of haze behind it,
Speaker 1: but this is different. It's almost luminous in nature, even
Speaker 1: to the naked eye. I'm going all over the place here.
Speaker 1: There's a lot to talk about. November tenth, I got
Speaker 1: the telescope out and I was looking to the to
Speaker 1: the northeast. There was an object. It was very bright
Speaker 1: to the naked eye, almost starlike, and I was trying
Speaker 1: to get focus on it. I was using my phone
Speaker 1: to look through the telescope to try to see it,
Speaker 1: and I just could not get a good view of it.
Speaker 1: For some reason, it was all blurred out. I just
Speaker 1: I couldn't see anything, and I eventually look up for
Speaker 1: my telescope when I see a circular, exclusive looking cloud
Speaker 1: that's directly in my line of sight with my telescope.
Speaker 1: I take my phone off my telescope, I zoom in
Speaker 1: on it, zoom out, zoom back in, and make sure
Speaker 1: it's not some kind of optical thing, and the cloud
Speaker 1: immediately disappears and I once again see the point source
Speaker 1: of light of the object I was trying to track.
Speaker 1: So then I started trying to film it again through
Speaker 1: the telescope, and then I started feeling those physical effects
Speaker 1: again similar to August second, pressure on the front and
Speaker 1: back of my chest. This time, blurred vision was notable,
Speaker 1: and fatigue not as strong as August second, but I
Speaker 1: started feeling fatigue. Decided to disengage from filming that night.
Speaker 1: And let's see, oh I have in my notes there
Speaker 1: was another incident August third, so I guess the day
Speaker 1: after the anomalous health incident. I had come back home
Speaker 1: because I stayed the night at my ex's house. I
Speaker 1: didn't want to be at that house after what had occurred.
Speaker 1: I remember the same thing someone can cigarette on the
Speaker 1: back porch with my dog Daisy, and I saw another
Speaker 1: one of these. It appeared to be one of these objects,
Speaker 1: almost starlike in appearance, but moving against the background sky,
Speaker 1: and I noticed it was behind the tree line. I
Speaker 1: would move to the right and it would move to
Speaker 1: the left, and it was it seemed as though it
Speaker 1: was concealing itself with my tree line. Like I moved left,
Speaker 1: it would move right right behind the trees. Did this
Speaker 1: a few times before my dog, which was relaxed and
Speaker 1: laying down out of nowhere yit very loud, jumped up,
Speaker 1: ran to the door. I let her in, and she
Speaker 1: sprinted across the house like in fear. So I've had
Speaker 1: quite a few things that were very strange while doing
Speaker 1: this project. Yeah, I guess. Yeah. You really never know
Speaker 1: what's going to happen when you're dealing with the unknown.
Speaker 1: I mean, anytime you're filming or watching these objects, it's
Speaker 1: your shadow boxing with something unknown, and there's clearly certain
Speaker 1: dangers that should be considered. Things I've discovered, I know
Speaker 1: I mentioned the Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Programs observables, but
Speaker 1: I've kind of noted some of my own observables that
Speaker 1: have been recurring in nature throughout the time of doing
Speaker 1: this project. One thing I've noted that's quite common is
Speaker 1: proximal micro flashes. There are these little flashes of light
Speaker 1: that occur around UAP. What they are, I can't say.
Speaker 1: It could be secondary objects, it could be an atmospheric effect.
Speaker 1: I'm not sure, but it's recurring. It happens a lot.
Speaker 1: And then with the November tenth incident, ecclusive counter measures,
Speaker 1: these cloudlike it is perfectly circular. It's happened a few times.
Speaker 1: I guess where your view is blocked. Another observable would
Speaker 1: be celestiomimicry. Sometimes these objects will literally blend in with
Speaker 1: the starfield. They'll move with the stars, But if you
Speaker 1: watch them long enough, they can deviate from that and
Speaker 1: move in different directions or even pick up in their
Speaker 1: velocity though their speed. One really interesting aspect about them
Speaker 1: is I've been studying their light, in particular the extreme
Speaker 1: luminosity and an isotropic behavior. Like the light it misbehaves.
Speaker 1: It doesn't act like normal stellar isotropic light, which is symmetrical.
Speaker 1: This light is asymmetrical and can vary based on view
Speaker 1: of observation, both telescopically to the naked eye through binoculars
Speaker 1: and through the phone as well. So different angles produce
Speaker 1: different visuals and different effects. It's very very strange. But actually, yeah,
Speaker 1: there's an incident involving the anisotropic light behavior that I
Speaker 1: could mention. I noticed an object in the sky to
Speaker 1: the believe that was the east. It was oblong, highly luminous.
Speaker 1: It looked like a vertical tic tac hovering in the sky.
Speaker 1: There's something I noticed I would tilt my head left,
Speaker 1: the object would tilt with me. I tilt my head right,
Speaker 1: it would tilt that same way to the right. So
Speaker 1: it's apparent visual signature would change based on your view.
Speaker 1: It's something I've noted while these objects fly by, while
Speaker 1: they're slowly hovering by in the sky. But yes, anisotropic
Speaker 1: light signatures, that's been one of the big recurring things.
Speaker 1: And I know I already mentioned diffuse luminous haze. When
Speaker 1: they're slowly hovering through the sky, you'll notice a haze
Speaker 1: around them. It's usually uneven, and like when they're moving
Speaker 1: through the sky at closer range, there's still like a
Speaker 1: luminous haze behind them, almost like a trailing wake. Directionally based.
Speaker 1: So the baseline spectral emission, like I use a diffraction grading,
Speaker 1: it's a metric diffraction with green dominant uneven spectral intensity.
Speaker 1: It's baseline data at this time, so I can't say
Speaker 1: it's conclusive. But it didn't match LEDs or dollar spectra
Speaker 1: or planetary spectra or any artificial known light sources.
Speaker 4: It was.
Speaker 1: It was different from everything, So the conclusion is still
Speaker 1: unknown at this time.
Speaker 4: One Life, One Story, a podcast about real people and
Speaker 4: a single moment or a series of moments that changed everything.
Speaker 4: Each episode is someone sharing a story in their own words.
Speaker 4: Sometimes it's tragic, sometimes it's hopeful. These are experiences that
Speaker 4: stay with you, moments that reshape how you see the world,
Speaker 4: yourself and the people around you. And if you have
Speaker 4: a story that you'd like to share, email me at
Speaker 4: One Life, One Story podcast at gmail dot com, One Life,
Speaker 4: One Story, listen wherever you get your podcasts. Good stuff.
Speaker 4: Thank you for sharing all that.
Speaker 1: Jeff, It's a lot to share. It's been a lot
Speaker 1: going on, and the goal is to lower the ambiguity
Speaker 1: of the phenomenon through clearer captures and upgraded equipment. I've
Speaker 1: got a new telescope on the way. It's a dabsonian.
Speaker 1: It's got a very stable base and the optics, the
Speaker 1: optical effects should be reduced. So the goal is just
Speaker 1: to keep continuing and progressing and getting better data to study.
Speaker 1: So it's one of the things I noticed. There was
Speaker 1: a NASA commission for UAP study and one of the
Speaker 1: guys threw his hands up in the air and said,
Speaker 1: we just don't have data to study. So my project
Speaker 1: aims to change that.
Speaker 4: So this is what tracking you known is doing and
Speaker 4: first off, thank of your service. Guys do a tough job.
Speaker 4: And i'd imagine, knowing your background in law enforcement, what
Speaker 4: you're trained to do is document evidence.
Speaker 1: Yes, and documented objectively, without narrative, without speculation, just what
Speaker 1: you see and then you write it down because it
Speaker 1: can end up in a court of law, and if
Speaker 1: you start filling a narrative, it can really bite you
Speaker 1: in the butt later. So I try to take that
Speaker 1: same report writing style and I put it into this. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I've just kept a continual learning attitude and I try
Speaker 1: not to fall into observer bias.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Of course, from from an investigator's perspective, how challenging is
Speaker 4: it to remain analytical when you become part of the case.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was one thing I never expected was to
Speaker 1: become a data point myself. But I have heard people
Speaker 1: say that, you know, whenever you study these things, you
Speaker 1: may be ended up or you may end up being
Speaker 1: studied yourself. And it turned out to be true. In
Speaker 1: my case. It was tough. I mean it's the physical
Speaker 1: effects were severe. I mean it was about a three
Speaker 1: day recovery time, and I remember going to work and
Speaker 1: still feeling that brain fog, that weird feeling, that short
Speaker 1: term memory loss. It didn't go away for I want
Speaker 1: to say I recovered my short term memory after about
Speaker 1: three days. But yeah, I just made sure to be
Speaker 1: very precise with logging on my symptoms. I'm a former EMT,
Speaker 1: so I know the body decently and I even have
Speaker 1: my blood pressure check the very next day after the
Speaker 1: August second incident, and it was a elevated blood pressure
Speaker 1: about one fifty eight over eighty, which is hypertensive. So
Speaker 1: it could be stress induced because it was very stressful
Speaker 1: to go through. Yeah, I never would I have thought
Speaker 1: that I would have what Heinich would consider a close
Speaker 1: encounter of the second kind, because it's environmental effects, it's
Speaker 1: physical effects, there's a cute animal response it was. It
Speaker 1: was scary. It's probably one of the scariest things I've
Speaker 1: ever gone through. And I've been held at gunpoint before
Speaker 1: and that doesn't even pay It pales in comparison.
Speaker 4: So no any trained but are used to these high
Speaker 4: stress situations. And I'd imagine being in law enforcement you
Speaker 4: have to go through regular health checks periodically.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean they do the psychological exam and
Speaker 1: they train us for really high intensity events like active
Speaker 1: shooter stuff, an emergency response to traumatic events such as that.
Speaker 1: I've seen quite a few things, but this was definitely unique,
Speaker 1: and after that event, it's a big motivator for wanting
Speaker 1: to raise awareness of this phenomenon that it is most
Speaker 1: certainly real. There are objects of unknown origin in our
Speaker 1: skies almost all the time. This is recurring. It's night
Speaker 1: after night after night, day after day after day. It
Speaker 1: deserves to be treated more seriously. One thing I really
Speaker 1: wish is that our government here in the States would
Speaker 1: disclose more information about the subject, because boy, I could
Speaker 1: have probably used er like emergency help. I probably should
Speaker 1: have gone to the emergency room after that due to
Speaker 1: the extreme neurological effects, but I didn't want to end
Speaker 1: up in the psychic unit. I know how it goes.
Speaker 1: I know the drill. If someone comes in saying, oh,
Speaker 1: I was filming UAPs and now I have all these
Speaker 1: health effects, they're going to be like, oh, yeah, this
Speaker 1: guy's a looney. You know, it'd be nice for them
Speaker 1: to have some standard operating procedures for anomalous health events,
Speaker 1: because I mean, it's real, it does happen, and some
Speaker 1: people refer to it as Havana syndrome, and my symptoms
Speaker 1: very closely mirrored what is referred to as Havna syndrome.
Speaker 4: You know, you mentioned a lot of these physiological effects.
Speaker 4: They had lasted. It was several days now, not including
Speaker 4: like the adrenaline and that. But were there any symptoms
Speaker 4: that you encountered after that you had experienced before in
Speaker 4: your life?
Speaker 1: It was very unique. I mean fatigue, yes, like let's
Speaker 1: say I haven't slept in a day or two. Most
Speaker 1: of it was brand new. I'd never had short term
Speaker 1: memory loss like that, the neurological effects, the sensitivity to light. No,
Speaker 1: I can't say I've had anything that was that list
Speaker 1: of symptoms all at once. That was brand new for me.
Speaker 1: I was healthy, I was in a good mood. Even
Speaker 1: walking inside after the first wave of symptoms, I still
Speaker 1: felt good. I was calm as a cucumber. So I
Speaker 1: wasn't expecting anything. I wasn't anxious. It just hit me.
Speaker 1: It was like a wave of energy going through me.
Speaker 1: So it was very unique in that aspect.
Speaker 4: Okay, and approximately forty five minutes of an accounted time,
Speaker 4: did you first become aware of that when you was
Speaker 4: talking on the phone with your ex.
Speaker 1: I became aware of that after the fact because I
Speaker 1: looked at the call logs and noted the time anomaly,
Speaker 1: and I looked at the timestamps and the videos and
Speaker 1: it just didn't match up. When I called her, it
Speaker 1: should have been around nine thirty PM, but it said
Speaker 1: ten fifteen, so forty five minutes of on account at
Speaker 1: four time. Now, whether this was psychologically induced, maybe because
Speaker 1: I know that my short term memory was most certainly impacted,
Speaker 1: or if it was an external factor, like something from
Speaker 1: the object itself, it's certainly plausible. Yeah, I can't say
Speaker 1: what caused that. I understand that there's theories on these
Speaker 1: objects bending space time to move, which honestly would kind
Speaker 1: of make sense with some of the physics I'm seeing
Speaker 1: the disappearing and reappearing on different flight paths, like the
Speaker 1: old the World War II fighter pilots calling them Foo fighters.
Speaker 1: They said they skipped through the air like a saucer,
Speaker 1: and that's something I see time and time again. They'll
Speaker 1: literally on our flight path, they'll skip from one point
Speaker 1: to the next to the next. I guess it would
Speaker 1: make sense if you're bending space time to do that,
Speaker 1: like it's some kind of time dilation.
Speaker 4: I mean, yeah, there's been certainly a lot of effects
Speaker 4: on witnesses that have come in close proximity of some
Speaker 4: of these objects. You did take steps and check verified
Speaker 4: timelines and timestamps on the videos and that did you
Speaker 4: check your video cameras for any time jumps or anything
Speaker 4: like that?
Speaker 1: Now, that was something. One thing I noticed on the
Speaker 1: video of August second is the interference on my phone
Speaker 1: during the incident. While I the first wave of symptoms,
Speaker 1: it was on camera. I was filming actively when I
Speaker 1: was outside, and I started feeling that blackout adjacent fatigue,
Speaker 1: the pressure on the front and back of my chest,
Speaker 1: the shortness of breath, and I buckled over and I
Speaker 1: was still filming while I was buckled over. I was
Speaker 1: aiming at the ground, but because I couldn't sit up right,
Speaker 1: I was just drained of energy momentarily. And I mean
Speaker 1: it was about a minute, almost a full minute, I
Speaker 1: would guess, of feeling that way. In the video, I
Speaker 1: noticed that there is some what appears to be electronic interference.
Speaker 1: Is far more camera noise during that, like a lot
Speaker 1: of camera noise. But yeah, that's about it. Unfortunately, the
Speaker 1: older footage on my older phone. I ended up upgrading
Speaker 1: phones later due to the quality of camera. I've now
Speaker 1: got iPhone seventeen with all the bells and whistles, because
Speaker 1: I want the clearest captures I can possibly get, just
Speaker 1: lots of camera noise and what appears to be electronic
Speaker 1: interference during the incident.
Speaker 4: Okay, see you had some technical anomalies recorded alongside the encounter.
Speaker 4: Did you notice anything environmental.
Speaker 1: As far as environmental the second wave of symptoms when
Speaker 1: I was inside, all the lights in the entire house
Speaker 1: flickering right as I got hit, almost like a similar
Speaker 1: to a power surge. But what was weird is nothing
Speaker 1: in the house had to be reset. Usually when there's
Speaker 1: a power surge and everything goes out, you have to
Speaker 1: reset all your clocks, and I didn't have to do that.
Speaker 1: It was something else. The dogs reacting. Honestly, they were reacting,
Speaker 1: I would say violently. They were. I've never heard them
Speaker 1: for what a half hour straight, low growls and threat
Speaker 1: barking like something was in the house. Potentially I wouldn't
Speaker 1: know because my door was closed and I was armed
Speaker 1: and ready for something to come through. I didn't know
Speaker 1: what was happening. It was very disorienting, and also the
Speaker 1: air feeling different. I guess you could consider that an
Speaker 1: environmental factor. It felt charged in heavy and that pressure sensation.
Speaker 1: I'll never forget it. It was. It felt as though
Speaker 1: I was definitely not alone. You just know, it's hard
Speaker 1: to explain. I've also heard theories of these things exhibiting
Speaker 1: something in between quantum theory and consciousness, and after that experience,
Speaker 1: I would say that's definitely possible, because it felt as
Speaker 1: though whatever it was that was there had complete control
Speaker 1: of the environment. And that's speculative, I'll admit that, but
Speaker 1: it's what it felt like. It felt like being in
Speaker 1: the presence of something with godlike power. I know I'm
Speaker 1: going far saying that, but it's just it's simply what
Speaker 1: it felt like. That was my takeaway that it was
Speaker 1: something immensely powerful, and my handgun, as I said, felt
Speaker 1: like I may as well have been a caveman with
Speaker 1: the club, but it was a psychological comfort at the time.
Speaker 4: And that feeling of being in the presence that something
Speaker 4: else is around. Is that something you've experienced before. I'm
Speaker 4: not talking about in the company of criminals or anything
Speaker 4: like that.
Speaker 1: No, it was a very unique experience something that I
Speaker 1: will never forget until the day I die, without a
Speaker 1: doubt it was. It was all inspiring and absolutely terrifying
Speaker 1: at the same time. Yeah, just that wave of energy
Speaker 1: hitting me and almost completely incapacitated me. I'm surprised I
Speaker 1: was able to move and respond the way I was,
Speaker 1: and I'm thankful for my training in that aspect that
Speaker 1: I was able to make a game plan and respond
Speaker 1: the way I did to de isolate myself with a
Speaker 1: phone call, and once I felt as though the threat
Speaker 1: had disappeared, I left the area. So yeah, unique, it's
Speaker 1: it was for a while. It was kind of PTSD inducing,
Speaker 1: to be honest. When I did finally come back home
Speaker 1: the next day, Yeah, I remember just looking at the
Speaker 1: inside of my door from inside my room and just
Speaker 1: having flashbacks to that moment. It's a it's a real fear,
Speaker 1: and there's no fear that's quite like the unknown, because
Speaker 1: with the unknown, there's infinite possibilities. I didn't know what
Speaker 1: was going to happen, if a third wave was going
Speaker 1: to hit and I was just going to black out
Speaker 1: disappear for five days like Travis Walton, But thankfully that
Speaker 1: didn't occur. It's very scary to go through. Some people
Speaker 1: wish for close encounters, and I say, be careful what
Speaker 1: you wish for.
Speaker 4: Absolutely. Yeah, when you called ux now and you said
Speaker 4: they're here, How did she respond to that?
Speaker 1: Fear? Serious fear. It's funny because she warned me the
Speaker 1: day before on August first, I was telling her about
Speaker 1: some of the videos. Like on August first, I saw
Speaker 1: there was one object I've recorded. It was a luminous
Speaker 1: point moving through the sky, and shortly after pressing record,
Speaker 1: an exclusive cloud appeared around it and it almost became
Speaker 1: invisible to the camera, which is indicative of the low
Speaker 1: observability cloaking a tip observable. And I was excited about that.
Speaker 1: I was telling her about it, and she warned me.
Speaker 1: She's like, you better be careful. She's like, something could happen,
Speaker 1: like abduction or who knows what else. And initially I
Speaker 1: dismissed it. I thought it was an absurd idea. I'm
Speaker 1: very skeptical by nature. I was like, Ah, that's bs,
Speaker 1: that's not going to happen, blah blah blah. The very
Speaker 1: next day this incident occurred. So to say that she
Speaker 1: was freaked out would be anunderstatement. She was afraid because
Speaker 1: she could hear the fear in my voice and she
Speaker 1: could hear the dogs going insane in the background.
Speaker 4: She did try and warn you, yep, and I was.
Speaker 1: I guess you could say I was ignorant about it.
Speaker 1: I was borderline rude. I dismissed it. And that bit
Speaker 1: me in the butt, that's for sure. She tried to
Speaker 1: warn me, and I should have listened. But hindsight is
Speaker 1: twenty twenty nowadays. When I go and I observe, I
Speaker 1: do so with instrumentation, with EMF, with a Geiger counter,
Speaker 1: even to measure radioactivity. If there's anything that's like, if
Speaker 1: I start feeling any health effects, I immediately disengage. Thankfully,
Speaker 1: that hasn't occurred since November tenth, but it's been siding
Speaker 1: after siding since. And yeah, the goal is just to
Speaker 1: keep putting stuff out and show people we might not
Speaker 1: be alone.
Speaker 4: And what kind of what interested you having the subject
Speaker 4: before I.
Speaker 1: Found the documentaries about a tip to be fascinating. Anything
Speaker 1: with luel Zando. I remember watching the Bob Lazar documentary.
Speaker 1: I thought that was fascinating him talking about the objects,
Speaker 1: how they move. And I know he worked at area
Speaker 1: S four, which is south of area fifty one, is
Speaker 1: what he claims. I thought that was a fascinating story.
Speaker 1: It was more of an abstract idea to me at
Speaker 1: the time, thought it was fascinating, you know. I viewed
Speaker 1: it as like science fiction at the time, but just
Speaker 1: really interesting science fiction. But after what I've observed for
Speaker 1: seven months, I honestly think it is plausible that one
Speaker 1: of these objects has probably crashed, if not many of
Speaker 1: these objects, because there's a lot of them. Well, one
Speaker 1: thing I noted I forgot to bring up is multi
Speaker 1: object coordination. I'll often be tracking one primary object, and
Speaker 1: I'll note other objects mirroring its movements flying with it.
Speaker 1: Like there'll be one large object and then multiple smaller
Speaker 1: objects within proximity that move with it. And sometimes those
Speaker 1: smaller objects will deviate from the primary object's flight path
Speaker 1: and go somewhere else, so it's almost like coordinated behavior.
Speaker 1: And fast movers, I believe, are the smaller objects people
Speaker 1: talk about fast movers. These smaller objects will zip around
Speaker 1: all the sky. They could be task based, who knows,
Speaker 1: I can only speculate, but they're the ones that exhibit
Speaker 1: the most extreme flight characteristics and like during the day
Speaker 1: they appear almost fear like, and at night time they
Speaker 1: appear like a small luminous orb. Sometimes they'll appear as
Speaker 1: like a diffuse haze without a static geometric profile. It's
Speaker 1: very interesting.
Speaker 4: I mean, there is certainly a lot of objects out there.
Speaker 4: You also use in all the apps as well for
Speaker 4: satellites and all that kind of stuff to kind of
Speaker 4: make sure you don't picking up anything like that.
Speaker 1: Yes, and I also use the AI analysis and we'll
Speaker 1: ask if it matches the light profile of a satellite.
Speaker 1: And usually a satellite pass will be dim with maybe
Speaker 1: periodic brightness due to reflection, and it'll often follow a
Speaker 1: linear path, whereas a lot of these objects will move
Speaker 1: in a nonlinear way. So I'll do motion analysis, light analysis,
Speaker 1: and the apps I use. I use the flight Radar
Speaker 1: monitor flights and the stargazser app to know which stars
Speaker 1: are ware, which planets are where. Yeah, it's good to
Speaker 1: do to have controls to make sure you're looking at
Speaker 1: something that shouldn't be there. But yeah, I do compare
Speaker 1: to satellites, rocket launches, ISS, starlink meteors, which are always
Speaker 1: very fast, linear, very bright, very brief. I try to
Speaker 1: compare to all atmospheric, celestial and conventional phenomena. Like if
Speaker 1: it's a plane, it's going to have FAA light signatures,
Speaker 1: it's going to move in a linear ballistic path, and
Speaker 1: a lot of times these objects move in a non
Speaker 1: ballistic motion, which is interesting in itself. There are things
Speaker 1: that can move in a non balistic way, like drones
Speaker 1: and stuff like that. But the altitudes vary in an
Speaker 1: extreme way. Sometimes I'll be filming something at zero degrees
Speaker 1: elevation that's like right above the ground, behind the tree line.
Speaker 1: And sometimes I'm filming stuff that appears to be like
Speaker 1: an orbital altitude, very very far. It's all across the
Speaker 1: spectrum as far as altitudes. Never any FAA lights are sound,
Speaker 1: they're always silent.
Speaker 4: Okay, of course, you know in this field it's important
Speaker 4: to be skeptical, but you're analyzing a lot of object
Speaker 4: Do you go out regularly.
Speaker 1: Yes, anytime it's a clear night if the wind is low,
Speaker 1: because wind is something that I have to be very
Speaker 1: considerate of my current telescopic set up. Any wind shape
Speaker 1: can make motional analysis useless. If there's no wind, if
Speaker 1: the environment is perfect for filming, then I'll be out
Speaker 1: there filming sometimes for hours. There have been nights where
Speaker 1: I don't capture much, and then there's been nights where
Speaker 1: it's just a plethora of crazy activity in the sky.
Speaker 1: But yeah, consistency with observations has been key, and to
Speaker 1: keep putting out footage. Whenever I see things that don't
Speaker 1: match what I compare them to. If it fails all
Speaker 1: categories of conventional explanation, it goes on my page. Thus
Speaker 1: the page is called Tracking the Unknown. It's something a
Speaker 1: lot of people conflate or mischaracterized with the word UFO.
Speaker 1: It's called UFO. It means unidentified flying object, with a
Speaker 1: key emphasis on unidentified. I try to respect the unknown
Speaker 1: aspect of this phenomenon. Who knows the origin of these objects?
Speaker 1: I can't say, so I just focus on what I
Speaker 1: see in the behavioral characteristics.
Speaker 4: And do you also keep an eye on any UFO
Speaker 4: reports of the state and newspaper articles any other witnesses.
Speaker 1: I have had some people message me some very interesting
Speaker 1: stuff that aligns with my sidings, people from all over
Speaker 1: the world since I've made the page. There's one family
Speaker 1: from Portugal that sent me a message that explained that
Speaker 1: they had had physiological effects and had seen an object
Speaker 1: that was similar in profile to some of the things
Speaker 1: I've recorded, and that was very interesting. It's one of
Speaker 1: my favorite things to do is to connect with people
Speaker 1: around the world and talk about this phenomenon with a
Speaker 1: more serious, analytical tone. But yeah, as far as sidings,
Speaker 1: I do follow the mouf on page and sometimes people
Speaker 1: put stuff on there. I'm like, oh, that's legit. I
Speaker 1: can tell just looking at it and the way it's
Speaker 1: moving and it's luminosity that it matches what I see.
Speaker 1: It's easier to spot fakes nowadays, like some people will
Speaker 1: superimposed photos, like they'll copy and paste something into a picture,
Speaker 1: or they'll generate it with AI or something. It's easy
Speaker 1: to pick out from the real thing these days.
Speaker 4: Yeah, tell me about it. I get sent all that.
Speaker 1: Oh gosh, I've been sent. I've been sent some very
Speaker 1: crazy theories as well from conspiratorial thinkers. That can always
Speaker 1: get interesting.
Speaker 4: Working in law enforcement. Now, when you went back to
Speaker 4: Saint Louis, did you mention this to your colleagues?
Speaker 1: Actually, yes, I got a little story about that. I'm
Speaker 1: glad you asked. A co worker of mine. He's a
Speaker 1: combat veteran. He was a Navy corman and he's uh,
Speaker 1: he's seen some things in his time. He's one of
Speaker 1: my best buddies at work. He was one of the
Speaker 1: few people that let me tell my story from beginning
Speaker 1: to end. And after I told him about August second,
Speaker 1: he looked at me and said, Wow, that's that's the
Speaker 1: real deal. I can see it in your eyes. I
Speaker 1: was like, what do you mean. He's like, will people
Speaker 1: tell me when I tell my combat stories, I have
Speaker 1: a thousand yards stare. He's like, you had that one.
Speaker 1: He's like, I can see why I could. He's like,
Speaker 1: I could see it in your eyes as you told
Speaker 1: the story. He was very supportive. He still is supportive,
Speaker 1: My good buddy, Brian. Yeah, that was interesting. But other people,
Speaker 1: like you'll start telling them, they'll interrupt you and they'll
Speaker 1: try to give you some narrative like, oh, it's probably this,
Speaker 1: is probably that, and some people just chalk it up
Speaker 1: to something normal, and I don't know. Three day recovery
Speaker 1: time is not normal with the physical symptoms, and it's
Speaker 1: a lot. It is a lot. And he was one
Speaker 1: of the few people I could really tell and continue
Speaker 1: to talk to about my experiences and my sightings. And
Speaker 1: and he's been a good he's been a good buddy.
Speaker 1: A few people at my upper command are also interested
Speaker 1: in the recurring videos, but I can't say I've told
Speaker 1: them about the story. A lot of times, I keep
Speaker 1: this story of August second, mostly to myself, because it's
Speaker 1: hard for a lot of people to digest that something
Speaker 1: like this could lead to direct interaction if that's what
Speaker 1: it was. Yeah, cognitive dissonance is very real, especially in
Speaker 1: the States.
Speaker 4: That's good that Brian was like that. And sometimes you
Speaker 4: can say it to people and do give you that reaction.
Speaker 4: They don't even ask a question. They just kind of
Speaker 4: look around and offer up an explanation very very quickly.
Speaker 4: And it's generally because they haven't experienced anything themselves. I mean,
Speaker 4: I've had a lot of law enforcement on here over
Speaker 4: the years that I've shared the all kinds of strange stuff.
Speaker 1: Yes, we do, and I mean one of the things
Speaker 1: we're trained to do is to patrol our route, establish
Speaker 1: a baseline, and look for anomalies, look for things that
Speaker 1: aren't supposed to be there. So that was already my
Speaker 1: methodology for work. I just applied that to hear established baselines,
Speaker 1: learned about FA a signatures and how a plane is
Speaker 1: supposed to look as opposed to how it's not supposed
Speaker 1: to look, you know, and the A tip observables. That's
Speaker 1: been a huge foundational aspect of being able to spot
Speaker 1: these objects and differentiate them from conventional ones. But yeah,
Speaker 1: that law enforcement background, it definitely helps, especially with objectivity
Speaker 1: and spotting things that aren't supposed to be there, because
Speaker 1: that's what we do every day.
Speaker 4: I couldn't agree more. In fact, you could probably train
Speaker 4: a few Movefon investigators.
Speaker 1: Well, thank you, my goodness. I don't want to get
Speaker 1: a big head over here, but thank you. Move on Now.
Speaker 1: They're all over the place there. There's some interesting folks
Speaker 1: in MOFON, and some of them are incredible. Debbie Ziegelmeyer
Speaker 1: really impressed me. She was one of the reasons why
Speaker 1: I kept spotting these objects is because she said, oh,
Speaker 1: these sightings are sometimes reoccurring. And so I took that
Speaker 1: note and I was like, Okay, I'll test that theory,
Speaker 1: and I started spotting more and and more. So I
Speaker 1: thank her for that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I know, Margie K mentioned Margie.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Missouri state director of move On. I was dealing
Speaker 1: directly with her for quite a while emailing back and forth,
Speaker 1: and I kind of were independent because observation bias is
Speaker 1: a big reason some people see what they want to see.
Speaker 1: And I feel as though I'm quite disciplined now. I
Speaker 1: have a pretty strict methodology and just been independent as
Speaker 1: of late. Join move on.
Speaker 4: I mean, they could always use someone. Don't your your expertise.
Speaker 4: To be honest with you to our listeners. If you're
Speaker 4: interested in following Jeff's work with Track and the Unknown,
Speaker 4: what I'll do is I'll put all this information below
Speaker 4: in the description and on the website, because Jeff, you've
Speaker 4: got a lot of videos up there on your YouTube channel.
Speaker 1: Indeed, yes, Facebook, YouTube x and Instagram. It's it's quite
Speaker 1: a large data set.
Speaker 4: Great stuff. Well, we wish you the best of luck
Speaker 4: and certainly keep us updated. If you do experience anything
Speaker 4: like you did back in August, to do let us know,
Speaker 4: and of course keep yourself safe.
Speaker 1: Yes, sir, I'll utilize situational awareness and fingers crossed that
Speaker 1: that does not happen again. I'd rather not go through
Speaker 1: all that again. But thank you so much for having
Speaker 1: me on your podcast. It's truly a pleasure.
Speaker 4: But it didn't stop you did it because you went
Speaker 4: back out again just a few weeks later.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm I'm pretty stubborn. I'm very stubborn because before
Speaker 1: August second, it was it was all video recording. After
Speaker 1: August second, I decided to up the game, get more recordings,
Speaker 1: and then even go telescopic, and I continue to keep
Speaker 1: upgrading optics and the goal is to get the clearest
Speaker 1: captures of these objects possible.
Speaker 4: So you're going to keep on upgrade in the equipment.
Speaker 4: So you've got a bug. Now you've got the bug.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, it's a need.
Speaker 4: To know, you know, a need to try and capture
Speaker 4: and document the unexplained.
Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely, because it's it's more common than most people
Speaker 1: could possibly imagine. I guess that's the only way I
Speaker 1: could put it. It's a recurrent, constant thing day and night.
Speaker 1: Because yeah, the goal is to spread awareness and get
Speaker 1: people to understand that there is truly unknown objects in
Speaker 1: our skis. I know, I'm like a broken record over here.
Speaker 4: Where do you stand on this subject? I mean, would
Speaker 4: you say you're very physical and evidence orientated that's some boats.
Speaker 4: Is that kind of where you stand or are you
Speaker 4: open to it all?
Speaker 1: I take theories with a grain of salt. But I
Speaker 1: do have the mindset of great discoveries require great evidence.
Speaker 1: So the more evidence I can collect and put out there,
Speaker 1: the better. And there is a big distinction between evidence
Speaker 1: and proof, and evidence is the best thing you could
Speaker 1: capture with this phenomenon. For proof is borderline impossible to
Speaker 1: come by. Yeah, I guess it's a very evidence spased
Speaker 1: mindset and analysis before assumption. That's where I go, That's where.
Speaker 4: I lean good stuff.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for having me on. I'm honored.
Speaker 1: Thank you.
Speaker 4: Well, keep documenting and watching them skies, Jeff.
Speaker 1: Yes, well, thanks for letting me Rands on your show.
Speaker 1: It's been an honor.
Speaker 4: Now you're more than welcome, Jeff. I really appreciate you
Speaker 4: coming on sharing that for our listeners.
Speaker 1: Well, thank you for having me, sir, and we.
Speaker 4: Will speak soon and enjoy the rest of your day
Speaker 4: you as well, sir. Take care bye for now, Jeff, Hi, bye.
Speaker 4: Well that is all for this episode. Keep updated and
Speaker 4: connected with the show on x, Facebook and Instagram, And
Speaker 4: if you have an encounter that you'd like to share
Speaker 4: on the podcast, you can email me at UFO Chronicles
Speaker 4: at gmail dot com, or you can reach out to
Speaker 4: me via the contact page on my website, UFO Chronicles
Speaker 4: podcast dot com. A big fangaded Jeff for sharing tonight,
Speaker 4: and thank you all for listening. I will be back
Speaker 4: next week. Till then, stay safe and keep watching the skies.
Speaker 1: Goodbye,