Speaker 1: What are we doing tonight? We are covering this excellent
little introductory book. It's a little it's written a little weird,
but it's still a good book.
Speaker 2: I'm still very much enjoying it. It goes very.
Speaker 1: Well with our other text that we have been kind
of working our way through, which is the Whitney Webb book.
I did make further progress in that book, and this
book will tie well in with that one. So these
two texts are are companion texts.
Speaker 2: We got a nation under you know what.
Speaker 1: And then today we're going to be talking about the
first half of this excellent, little, sort of obscure nineties
book that I found. And when I say nineties, I'm
talking about the most nineties book cover ever. I'm talking
about CNC Music Factory designed cover. I'm talking about things
that make you go, things that make you go hmmm,
I'm talking. I'm talking covers that make Freedom Williams sweat.
I'm talking Freedom Williams getting a little frisky over here
when he sees this cover. Sexpionage. That's just the title
that I gave by Donald Bower. Donald Bower is a
historical writer. So today's text will be coming to you
from the domain of history, and what we're going to
see is that this is a really underrated element of
how the world really works. That's a crucial theme over
here on my channel that we've focused on for many years,
and one of the best insights into how the world
really works is the study of criminology, the study of
secret societies, the study of geopolitics, con artist, con men,
and warfare. All of those things tie together banking economy
obviously as well to understand what's really going on, because
most people operate in a sort of delusion, a facsimile
synthetic worldview where they think the world is as TV
and their teachers told them, well, I got news for you.
TV is for dummies, and teachers are the same dummies
that watch the TV.
Speaker 2: So all your teachers, for the most part, were dummies.
Speaker 1: And if they weren't dummies, they wouldn't have been teachers.
Speaker 2: They would have been doing other things.
Speaker 1: Now, nothing inherently wrong with a teacher, but very few
teachers actually figure out how the world really works and
what's really going on. Can people bring beer to your
live events? Yes, every live event that we've done allows
you to bring your own alcohol. Biob do you ever
see that word biob, that's what is referring to bring
your own alcohol, biob.
Speaker 2: That's what it means. I sure as hell I ain't
gonna bring you alcohol. I freaking hate alcohol. I'm bringing
no damn beer.
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna contribute to your tits and your fatty fatness.
I hate alcohol. I go to I fight alcohol, just alcohol.
I fight beers, not people, just beers.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 1: I go to war against IPAs. Did you not see
my ip A rant? That's figurative language too for somebody says,
all right, let's talk about some of the famous incidents
in history.
Speaker 2: Where we've seen where we've seen.
Speaker 1: Blackmail, sex espionage and spy operations play a key role
in turning massive historical.
Speaker 2: Events to the other side.
Speaker 1: We have situations where warfare intelligence was divulged through sexpionage
and it swung the entire war or the entire battle.
We have dynasties that have fallen through sexpionage. We have Hey, Janet,
she can't hear me. She turned that dang dang, ding
dang washing machine on. Actually, what husbands need to throw
out the washing machines and make sure that the wives
hand wash all that shit with that with that old
Mennonite like that rake, that big old rape machine.
Speaker 2: You know, it looks like a giant cheese grater.
Speaker 1: That's the only way clothes should be washed by all wives.
Speaker 2: There should be a law on the books. That's just
a joke too.
Speaker 1: By the way, before people freak out, did you hear
what he said? Mhm, every man should marry one minna
night wife just for that, for that cheese grater for clothes,
the giant clothes cheese greater. Anyway, we've seen dynasties fall,
we have seen cultures implode through degeneracy. We have seen
all manner of trickery, deception, studies, experiments used via sexpionage,
and that includes elements of entrapment, elements of com ramot.
Speaker 2: Have you heard of this term? Compramont?
Speaker 1: Compramont is the details and the information that you get
to blackmail a politician or a powerful person, a leader whoever.
And so Donald wrote his book in nineteen and or
was it.
Speaker 4: Ninety nineteen ninety, so far before we had the details
of this book, we did have some information that kind
of told us what was going on.
Speaker 1: And Bower begins his text by saying that.
Speaker 2: Probably the most famous element of this was.
Speaker 1: The KGB's School for Swallows and Ravens. By forty five,
the Cold War was kicking off, ramping up. And there's
an interesting part that I thought was a little contradictory
in Bower's book, which is that he says at the
beginning that the West didn't like to use operatives for.
Speaker 2: S xpionage.
Speaker 1: Yet we read in many places in his book that
they did, so I don't know where he gets this.
Speaker 2: Idea. Maybe his distinction is that the West was not actively.
Speaker 1: Engaged in training operatives for this, but rather they had
no problem, of course getting information from ladies of loose
morals and shall we say men's of morals, right, both
things going on, supposedly, Alan Dulles, and I don't think
I really believe this said that the purpose of intelligence
is to infiltrate vital elements of the adverts series apparatus
and to build up local defenses against that penetration by
keeping countries aware of the nature and extent of the
peril by assisting internal security services. So the idea is
that these types of things would not benefit the West.
Yet six in the CIA used similar quote safe houses
where Russians were also compromised. So safe houses don't just
necessarily refer to a place where a spy can find
refuge if he's on the run or something like that.
Speaker 2: If you watch the movies, that's typically.
Speaker 1: Where safe houses come into play. And yet we're told that, oh, well,
I guess British intelligence. Let's see, I did engage this. Now,
if Whitney Webb's information is correct, I think it is.
Then turns out Justin McAffrey was compromising people for everybody,
all kinds of intelligence things. So once again, this story
that the West was not doing this does not seem
to be very plausible. We get some of these kind
of boring stories early on in the in the book
about the k G.
Speaker 2: B Ravens Swallows, which.
Speaker 1: I have to think is pretty Some of these stories
must be pretty well known or common because they sound
much like the stories or just give me the episodes
that The Americans has going on. So if you remember
in the Americans, I always recommend that show. It's a
great show. It's very realistic, but it's also got a
bunch of things kind of smushed into it that it's
not very realistic.
Speaker 2: Okay, Clark, and.
Speaker 1: Well that's Clark's his name when he's sleeping with that
boring ass Martha woman. But I forget what's Kerrie Russell's
character's name. I forget her name Elizabeth and Clark right. Anyway,
this was one of the best TV shows ever, honestly.
I mean, the show is awesome. It's just a phenomenal
everything about it. And they ended it well. Most TV
shows always screw up the ending, right like lost, great show,
and then we get this goofy, weird ending. But they
ended this show very well. And there's at least two
or three sequences I can think of off the top
of my head. In the Americans, where we get stories
very similar to what pops up in Bower's book. For example,
the story of this first guy here, Philip Latour, a
KGB trapman operation with a character named Philip Latour, a
French electronics engineer, had a wife and three children. In
the late nineteen sixties, he was sent he went on
a vacation to the Mediterranean and decided to visit Russia. Now,
some many of these stories about these poor, nerdy, lonely
men and women, and a lot of these people operate
and work in sensitive areas, so I'm kind of amazed
and surprised that these people don't really they weren't a
little suspicious. I mean, like, if you're a boring ass
boomer dude, and you know you've been with like one
girl your whole life or something, you know, maybe you.
Speaker 2: Married your sweetheart, you decide to vacation.
Speaker 1: Ember one in Russia in the Cold War? Why the
hell would you want a vacation in Russia and the
Cold War? First of all, and then like a babe
comes up to you, Come on, dude, you've.
Speaker 2: Got no sense at all. Okay, nines and tens.
Speaker 1: Bombshell babes are not interested in boring ass boomers. But
what's pretty amazing throughout this book and in many of
the cases that you read of the entrapment operations or
of these kinds of raven and are going to swallow
apple operations. Typically sometimes it happens with women, but more
so obviously with the dudes. Like what is going on
in the minds of these dudes, Like they actually think
that some bombshell supervidl chick is into them when they're
totally like the most boring middle class job, but they
just happen to be working at some facility that makes
nuclear sub you know technology, or they work at some facility.
Speaker 2: That makes like I don't know, you know, black hop.
Speaker 1: Helicopters, and then it's suddenly like a babe is into
Come on, dude.
Speaker 2: It's just amazing, like the level of naivety on a
lot of these people. But such is the power of
our drive to appropriate. It's one of the most effective
ways to get people. So I'll see if we can
find this poor chap.
Speaker 1: I want to see what he looks like, Philip Latour
KGB entrapment. So let's take a look at this guy,
this French dude. And we may not have any any
pictures of him.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 1: It's hard to find pictures of these people. I don't
see any pictures, but who knows. I don't think it's
any of these dudes. What is this chick?
Speaker 2: What she doing? Is this the girl? Then it trapped him?
That was like an AI picture.
Speaker 1: I'm sick of all these AI pictures flooding everywhere, making
everything confusing, and you can't tell what's real.
Speaker 2: And what's not.
Speaker 1: Anyway, so there's no pictures. Nobody knows about this guy.
But a lot of these stories are very similar to
what we see in the episodes of The Americans. If
you've never seen it, high they recommend it. The next
example is the case I think in the very first
season Carrie Russell entraps some nerdy government dude. Do you
remember that when she's all like, it's pretty a little riskue.
Speaker 2: And then.
Speaker 1: Clark, who is the main character here, he's entraps this
woman who works at the State Department, I think, and
he develops this relationship with her, and he pretends to
be also working at a government job that doesn't allow
him to devolve much information or that he can't have
a normal relationship with her because of his spy work man.
So uh, he dons this very nerdy appearance, which is
pretty funny. Here's Clark, and here's Clark seducing Martha as
you can see.
Speaker 2: And this is I think very accurate. This is very realistic.
Speaker 1: And the next story that he gives as his example
is the exploits of a raven named Hans Suderlin, and
Hans Suderland is trained in Moscow to go after and
entrap a I think a secretary at NATO, and this
is very.
Speaker 2: Close to the type of story that you have with Clark.
And Martha.
Speaker 1: So I tend to think maybe a lot of a
lot of Clark, these kinds of stories that we read here. Anyway,
so he entraps this woman.
Speaker 2: Let's see what her name was, Leonora Hines. She was
a lonely spinster.
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is exactly like Martha, and I think she
ends up killing her. So one of these women ends
up killing killing herself because unliving because of the the trauma.
Now some of these people the situations get really tense too,
because they're forced into working for these entities and they're
told if they don't then they will.
Speaker 2: They will be put in some.
Speaker 1: Sort of prison Lubianca or something, or they will be
exposed in their home country.
Speaker 2: So that's of course the point of the lot of
the entropment. But he notes that.
Speaker 1: The recruiting and training of espionized agents, including swallows and ravens,
it is a unique aspect of the Soviet system. In
the United States, they do not obtain recruits from excuse me,
the United States and Western countries obtained recruits from the
military or from selected men and women of all walks
in life who combined their espionage activities with regular normal
ways of making a living.
Speaker 2: During the Cold War. Russians, however, chose.
Speaker 1: Chose their people very carefully acquiring all the necessary background
information and submitting their potential spies to a rigid course training.
Speaker 2: So you get to.
Speaker 1: Go to to Hump school, which you get your bahd
at pu.
Speaker 2: I went to Hump School, got a pH d, got
a pH d and d.
Speaker 1: Y'all laughing like like it's fun over here, coughing, I
can't wait to get on a life stream.
Speaker 2: And cough haha, I'm gonna cough at them people.
Speaker 1: Y'all just mad because I got I'm a validict I'm
a validictorian of Hump School.
Speaker 2: I'm trying, man, I'm trying. I don't know what you
want me to do. I'm trying my best over here.
I got a pimp andhose degree, a PhD, a nkv D.
Speaker 1: I got a PhD from the nkv D or a
valedictorian d.
Speaker 2: And we just dropped one hundred people for that joke.
Where do y'all? Where are you going?
Speaker 1: There's nothing else going on tonight. I assure you of
that this is where it's at. Anyway, The majority of
spies for Russian and Communist nationals of the country in
which they operate, following the two categories those who believe
strongly in the ideology and they are willing to or
those who are willing to betray, or those who could
be blackmail. This is very common. This reminds us of
what m i CE. We went into detail recently on
several podcasts on this. Actually, Pearl actually asked us a
bunch of questions about m CE. You guys, remember mice, money, ideology, compromise,
and ego. Those are typically the things that are used
to compromise people. Now, this also recalls the Americans this
chapter because he says that there was the Marx Ingles
sex school set up outside of Moscow.
Speaker 2: This is pretty crazy. Have you ever heard of this.
I've never heard of this.
Speaker 1: Let's see if we can find this the Marx, we
might get some else. Maybe I shouldn't type that in, right,
but it's just.
Speaker 2: Pretty wild that you know, nobody knows about this and
yet this was like a huge part of our history. Okay,
so nothing comes up.
Speaker 1: But of course you can't trust any of this Wikipedia
stuff anyway, because I mean they don't even pull up
I mean, basically, the search engines don't hardly work anymore.
But if you remember in The Americans, there was that
key sequence where they flashed back to the training of
the main guy and Kerry Russell, and they were trained
in a completely synthetic Soviet version of America. So the
Soviets would build these entire American neighborhoods in towns to
train their illegals operatives, and the Americans, as you guys know,
is about the illegals, the illegals being director s of
the KGB where they were trained to come over into
and embed themselves and live in America as Americans. Their
entire life almost become an American family, uh, and to
you know, engage in really important operations, espionage, spying, whatever
was needed. Now, according to Mark, the illegals were not
the ones that, for example, would engage in assassinations. There
was a whole other arm of the KGB that was
dealing with assassinations. But in the movie, in the Show
of the Americans, they kind of combine it into this
kind of unrealistic situation where basically Carrie Russell's like sexually
entrapping somebody, She's going and assassinating somebody else, and then
she's driving home to make dinner for her family, like
in the same day. I mean, come on, that's a
little a little much. But now, why are we talking
about this in the fake neighborhoods? Because think about the
extent to which the Soviet version you could say of
mk ultra here. Think how extensive and in depth this is.
They're building entire fake American neighborhoods, and this is real,
so that these agents would go and they would live
in these American neighborhoods when they're young. In this story,
they're paired up Carrie Russell and I forget the guy's name.
They're paired up and put into the neighborhood which has
them all a movie theater like a school apartment, and
they lived there for two or three years. They learned
English everything about American culture. I wish I could pull
up the maybe I could let you know what, you
guys should watch that scene. Let's see if there's a
clip of that, and I'll put it in the chat
for you guys. You guys can watch it later. But
let's see the Americans fake fake neighborhood. Let's try that.
Because I don't remember which episode it is.
Speaker 2: Oh, here we go now stand discovers Philip as a spy.
That's famous scene.
Speaker 1: Let's see the Americans Soviet All right, Well, I don't
think anything's gonna come up, but you get the idea.
Now here's the thing about the fake neighborhoods. I was
getting at, Because if they're going to that extent in
terms of training their operatives in sort of fake American neighborhoods,
then we find out, as Boer writes in his book,
that they made a masterful study, so to speak, of
everything to do with SCX, to the extent that well,
let me read what he says. Those enrolled in these
schools received lectures on everything to do with the habits
of the target country where they're going. In these fake cities,
they live in surroundings built to stimulate the towns and
the areas in which we'll be operating, very much like
a Hollywood movie set, supermarkets, movie theaters, shops, people where
the costumes of their adopted residents to become part of
that everyday life. Meticulous attention is given to every detail,
how to purchase a bus, ticket, tickets to the movies,
ordering a meal, the proper amount to tip in that country,
men's magazines or studies studied.
Speaker 2: This is back in the Cold War.
Speaker 1: Prawn movies are imported and are shown regularly to the operatives.
Why is this well, men chosen to be ravens are
required to sleep with their girlfriends to lose all inhibitions,
and are ordered to make and to indulge in skittles
activities with other men. All of the students learn how
to drug to take care of people in emergency situations
with unliving cigarettes, candy or whatever can be used. Soviets
who enter this branch of the KGB are unaware of
the kind of training they will undergo, to the extent
of the degradation that they suffer by offering themselves to
the service of their country or ideology Marxism. And from
the beginning, these agents are taught that the use of
sex as an espionage tool is a patriotic duty.
Speaker 2: So did you.
Speaker 1: Notice that they're intentionally degraded? Now think about this. If
the Soviets had figured out ways to create entire fake
neighborhoods and sex schools to degrade and mind control their
operatives into being this, do you think that the West
and the CIA and the pop stars and the other
intelligence agencies in the West. Do you think they wouldn't
be doing the same thing? Of course they would. Are
there any morals? I mean, come on, they're not constrained
by So everybody in Eurasia is immoral and everybody in
the West is moral?
Speaker 2: Come on, are you that naive? This is silly.
Speaker 1: In other words, this is another attestation to the reality
of perhaps people even in the pop scene, undergoing similar
types of things.
Speaker 2: Do you see what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: If agents can be trained in foreign countries to be
handled sex slaves, it does seem plausible that it could
occur in our country as well via.
Speaker 2: I don't know, like a Brittany or something. You see
what I'm getting at.
Speaker 1: Let this has honey in it, So I'm trying.
Speaker 2: I'm trying to do my best.
Speaker 1: Now we don't know if Now I think the fake
cities and the sex sex schools were real. Do you
guys remember we covered we did an analysis back at
the time, uh of Red Sparrow.
Speaker 2: I did not think this was a very good movie.
Speaker 1: I think it was a lot of propaganda, but it
did have some elements to it. Remember with Jaylaw. Remember Jaylaw.
This movie is about what I'm talking about. And did
nobody watch this? It's a thirty three million views. Nobody
remembers this. Come on, y'all, know what's up where y'all at?
So Jaylaw is she's a Russian you know, ballerina or whatever.
And she's recruited into this school or one of these.
She's sent to one in Kazakhstan, right and uh, you know,
then this is her being sent on her first mission
to h to entertain this diplomat or whatever. I forget
all the details of it, but here she is flashing
back when she sent to her.
Speaker 2: School.
Speaker 1: And then they got this woman that's like Rosa Club.
I think they actually intentionally chose like a Rosa Club
type woman. Now, if you don't remember, this is her
right here in the old James Bond stories. That's why
Ian Fleming put Rosa Club in this very position.
Speaker 2: And in the one with.
Speaker 1: The Turkish intelligence guy bay by e Y that Bond
goes and talks to and Constantinople is that doctor No
Rosa Cleb is the handler to the blonde woman that
Bond I don't know he does he flip her to
the West. I can't remember. But it's been a while
since I've watched Doctor No. But I think that's Doctor
No with whe where he goes to Turkey. Right, But
it's very similar to this, and these things are both
of these situations are based in reality. So you have
this sort of Rosa club woman and Rosa clubs intended to.
Speaker 2: Be a L E. S B I A N like
my glasses, right.
Speaker 1: Because the idea is that in these sex schools, people
are being taught this and they're being degraded and initiated
into this operative role. Of course, Jylaw is you know,
she's super soldier, slay queen and she you know whatever.
And then what's this guy's name, I forget his name,
he's a Russians or whatever.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Sure, but now.
Speaker 1: Remember the the the West, of course, is a super
moral about oh we're so moral or so moral, and
then yet the West pushes all the most dgen stuff.
Speaker 2: Right, so so.
Speaker 1: It's like, oh look, how look how evil uh n
KVD was And yeah, I think the nk v D
was evil. This is evil to put it's evil to
put people into this, to ruin their lives and do
this kind of stuff, right, government funded you know, mind control,
sex control. Right, and yet our entire apparatus in the
West from the top down, the corporate elite down pushes
stuff worse than this. So where's all the moralizing. Actually,
it makes no sense. They're both bad. As my point,
are you kg be up? No, I'm saying they're both.
You can't understand that two sides are bad. So he
goes a few cases like this of kind of stories
that are kind of boring. I'll pass because just basically
people being manipulated at a basic level about you know,
being lonely and looking for companionship, and it's usually just
some naval engineer guy who's nerdy, and again this hot
Russian chick or hot German chick, you know, chats him
up and he's like totally entranced because he thinks he's
a mac daddy when he's like a boring bloomer beta.
Speaker 2: Man and he falls.
Speaker 1: But the next most interesting element that I did not
know that did surprise me. Oh, by the way, there
was a story too where the kg BE engineered a
fake r ape case.
Speaker 2: And it was somebody high pro fall. Let's see who
it was.
Speaker 1: Oh, this was the Philip Latour guy. So this was
the French guy we were talking about earlier, and they
gave him a bunch of drinks of wine.
Speaker 2: He was chatting it up with this babe, and.
Speaker 1: They put a woman around him when he passed out,
when he was drugged, and he woke up and she
ran away claiming that she had been R A p
E d. So then the KGB had this apparent R
A PE situation and they were blackmailing this guy to
get information on whatever radio technology he was working on
during the Cold War for the French government. But I
think this guy had disclosed what happened, so he didn't
actually he lost his job in his security clearance, but
he didn't end up, you know, destroyed by the KGB.
So that's very reminiscent in the Americans in the episode
where they entrap and stage a scenario with I think
he's a Polish diplomat. If I recall and there's like
a un meeting, maybe it's supposed to be something akin
to lack of Alessa. I don't think it's intentionally like MELLSSA.
I think in the Americans it's like somebody who works
with like Melessa and the KGB, Carrie Russell or.
Speaker 2: Somebody like does this type of thing. Now here's the
really crazy part. Did you know? I did not know this.
Speaker 1: I don't know a whole lot about Chay Gavara. I'm
not super well studied on Latin South America, you know,
operations and all that.
Speaker 2: I know a little bit.
Speaker 1: I've read Servondo Gonzalez's book, but Savondo's book is about Castro,
so I don't know much about Chay.
Speaker 2: But it turns out Chay was being spied on and
was being.
Speaker 1: Kind of, I would say, manipulated, But the intention was
to man late Cha via his girlfriend, this Latin American.
Speaker 2: What did this guy called her?
Speaker 1: His steamy, steamy Latin American girlfriend or Bolivian girlfriend. Let's
see who she was, Laura Martinez, Ladra Martinez, Abrol Abrol.
Speaker 2: You better get this, You better get his steamy girl
out of Hebro. She's barely gonna spy on me.
Speaker 5: Bro.
Speaker 1: She was sent by the KGB to spy on Chay
because Chay was not following everything that the Soviet party
line wanted.
Speaker 2: And I've heard some other dudes pretty well studied in
the history of Chay.
Speaker 1: Again, I don't know that much about Chay, but they
were arguing the same thing that actually Chay was a
little more off script than Castro, and this is actually
the reason why Chay was taken out. And this girlfriend
was a big part of this.
Speaker 2: So she was in forming and spying on him the
entire time to the KGB, and they wanted to make
sure that they kept Chay in line.
Speaker 1: And uh, Boward says, after a matter of month, she
had built up a substantial army. However, the Soviets were
concerned that Chay was preaching a creed of Marxism that
the USSR didn't exactly want.
Speaker 2: He was becoming a.
Speaker 1: Little too powerful, and the girlfriend was given orders to
betray the Gorilla Revolution. So excuse me, Uh, this is
a difference. This is a different girl, Tanya. Let's see,
I thought we're talking about Laura. Let's hold on, I'm
getting confused with Chay's girlfriends here, all right, Okay, I'm sorry.
So Tanya is Laura Martinez's code name.
Speaker 2: Excuse me, That's why I was confused. So it turns out.
Speaker 1: She was spying on him, She was informing on him,
and the kg BE could putting pressure on her to
get him in line or to undermine his revolution, and
it ended up.
Speaker 2: Not working. It says Tanya was giving orders to betray Chay.
In nineteen sixty seven, she passed information to General one
Jose Torres, the.
Speaker 1: Bolivian chief of staff, giving away the location of Chay's
Gorilla camps. Chay was captured and shot by the Bolivian
Army sergeant and Tanya was then reportedly killed in an ambush,
but her body was never found, so the whole So
basically Chay got screwed over by this chick, and that's
why his whole thing failed. And I'm guessing that she
leaked his location to the right wing government, which is
ironic because.
Speaker 5: Uh, let's see who that was, the Bolivian leader, Juan
Jose Thoris.
Speaker 2: April.
Speaker 3: But you better get his chicata, bro, she's barely going
to betray you, man, but for real, like, she's barely
gonna betray you, Jose.
Speaker 2: One Jose Thoris.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he definitely looks like a right wing leader. No socialist,
he's not, so I guess he's a rival to Chay.
Speaker 2: Fiftieth President of Bolivia. He was murdered in.
Speaker 1: The frame of the United States backed Operation Condor. By
the way, of course, Pope Francis participated in Operation condor
if you didn't know.
Speaker 2: Aiding.
Speaker 1: Let's see, though most military leaders in Latin America have
been associated with the right wing, Torres was a left
wing socialist. But I guess he didn't like Chay Interesting
all of this Latin South American Cold War stuff. It's
like a giant.
Speaker 2: Thing.
Speaker 1: I don't know that much about all that's not that's
not my I mean, I know a little bit, but
it's it's his own just I mean, it's it's you
guy spent your whole life on like CIA Soviet operations
in Latin South America anyway,