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Speaker 5: Are now listening to True Murder The most shocking killers
Speaker 5: in true crime history and the authors that have written
Speaker 5: about them Gasey Bundy, Dahmer, The Night Stalker DTK. Every
Speaker 5: week another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and infamous.
Speaker 2: Killers in true crime history.
Speaker 5: True Murder with your host journalist and author Dan Zupanski.
Speaker 4: Good Evening. Henry Lewis Wallace parries Charlotte, North Carolina from
Speaker 4: May nineteen ninety two to March nineteen ninety four. Wallace
Speaker 4: prayed on lower economic class black women between seventy five
Speaker 4: and thirty five years old. He knew most of his victims.
Speaker 4: Some threw his job at tuckle Well and gained their
Speaker 4: trust with his friendly demeanor and gentle nature, concealing a
Speaker 4: monster fueled by drug abuse and rage against women. A
Speaker 4: rarity in that he was an African American serial killer.
Speaker 4: His murderous rampage spurred controversy throughout the city. Community members
Speaker 4: accused the local police of ignoring the murders because of
Speaker 4: the victim's race. Wallace attended the funerals of many of
Speaker 4: his victims and offered condolences to families. The ensuing investigation
Speaker 4: became the largest in North Carolina's history. Wallace was eventually
Speaker 4: found guilty and convicted of nine counts of murder, but
Speaker 4: he admitted to more killings while incarcerated. He is potentially
Speaker 4: responsible from anywhere from twenty to ninety deaths of black women.
Speaker 4: Wallace continues to appeal and awaits his execution at Central
Speaker 4: Prison in Raleigh. Bad Henry The Murderous Rampage of the
Speaker 4: Taco Bell Strangler by Ron Chepsik offers valuable insight into
Speaker 4: the psychology of serial killers and shed's light on issues
Speaker 4: surrounding race and policing. The book that we're featuring this
Speaker 4: evening is Bad Henry The Murderous Rampage of the Taco
Speaker 4: Bell Strangler, with my special guest, journalist, author, and filmmaker
Speaker 4: Ron Chepzier. Welcome to the program, and thank you very
Speaker 4: much for this interview. Ron Chepziek, Thank you, Ben, I
Speaker 4: appreciate it, Thank you so much. Let's talk right away
Speaker 4: about the bad beginning of Henry Wallace, and you talk
Speaker 4: about his mother, Lottie, and that Henry's father walked out
Speaker 4: on Lottie when she was pregnant, and it made her
Speaker 4: bitter and she would viciously take out her frustrations on
Speaker 4: her children. Tell us about Lottie and Henry Wallace's childhood upbringing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Lotti was his mother, and she had a pretty
Speaker 2: tough life, you have to say that for that. She
Speaker 2: worked in a textile factory. She didn't have much success
Speaker 2: with men. She had a boyfriend named Parker that actually
Speaker 2: Henry really liked, but he left her because he was
Speaker 2: married and he thought that it wasn't After a while,
Speaker 2: he had second thoughts about having an affair with the
Speaker 2: woman when he was married, so he walked out on
Speaker 2: that sort of stuff. And she tended to take her
Speaker 2: frustrations and her anger out on her children. Henry had
Speaker 2: a sister named Evon, and they lived in a really,
Speaker 2: really incredibly poor I guess you'd call it a building.
Speaker 2: It was like a shack, right, and there was no
Speaker 2: indoor plumbing. His mother made her made him harry out
Speaker 2: buckets of feces which he keptain kept in his bedroom
Speaker 2: by the way, and she would get frustrated and she
Speaker 2: would have Henry and Yvonne beat each other up, you know,
Speaker 2: and she dressed him up in a girl's clothes and
Speaker 2: let him go out into the neighborhood. And so, you know,
Speaker 2: Henry had this incredibly traumatic background and then the top
Speaker 2: of all of that, he was abused sexually abused by
Speaker 2: some of the younger girls in the neighborhood. But he
Speaker 2: ended up going to school and being very normal, like
Speaker 2: everybody liked him. You know, he ended up on the
Speaker 2: student counsil. He was a cheerleader. There was like fifteen cheerleaders.
Speaker 2: I talked with one of them who was shocked when
Speaker 2: she found out that Henry was a serial killer. She
Speaker 2: said he was one of the nicest guys she'd ever met.
Speaker 2: You know, he drove the bus for the students, and
Speaker 2: he was a confidant a lot of the cheerleaders, you know,
Speaker 2: for the cheerleaders, you know, he listened to their complaints
Speaker 2: about their boyfriends, and he advised them on certain things
Speaker 2: in life, and he was very popular. All of this,
Speaker 2: I guess was building in him, and it was creating
Speaker 2: a rage within him that eventually it would explode and
Speaker 2: he would take it out on some of the women
Speaker 2: that he came in contact with throughout his life.
Speaker 4: You talk about his mother and his mother had a
Speaker 4: maybe for the time, a strange reading the some of
Speaker 4: the reading material was to be considered strange.
Speaker 2: Oh yes, two detective magazines you know, that came up
Speaker 2: in the trial, the two detective magazine and they mean
Speaker 2: a lot of that. Of course, not everybody that reads
Speaker 2: true detective magazines ends up as a serial killer. So
Speaker 2: that was kind of controversial. But some of the psychologists
Speaker 2: try to connect it to Henry's problems.
Speaker 4: Now you talk about him in school and despite his poverty,
Speaker 4: you say that and this trauma from his childhood, people
Speaker 4: didn't see that. And he was a friend and a
Speaker 4: confidant to people, and he got along and he was
Speaker 4: considered over and over again as charming.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, a very nice guy.
Speaker 4: So tell us about his entry into the navy, and
Speaker 4: more about what happened in high school and the kind
Speaker 4: of grades he got and his behavior that he exhibited.
Speaker 2: Well, he was pretty normal in high school. He was,
Speaker 2: you know, pretty average. He had good enough grades to
Speaker 2: get into college. He wanted to go to Winthrop College
Speaker 2: that ironically, that's the place where I worked as a
Speaker 2: professor for several years. But his mother didn't want him
Speaker 2: to go, and so he stayed closer to home on
Speaker 2: that and he decided to go into the Navy about
Speaker 2: nineteen nineteen eighty five. And actually his career was pretty good.
Speaker 2: He was involved with petty crime, and when he was
Speaker 2: out on the West coast in Seattle, he got caught
Speaker 2: for shoplifting and had a two year suspended sentence, and
Speaker 2: he had probation officer that sort of supervised him, and
Speaker 2: he said he never came into the meetings at all.
Speaker 2: And it was sort of like the lack of accountability
Speaker 2: in Henry's life, which would follow him and allow him
Speaker 2: to do a lot of the crimes that he did.
Speaker 4: You talk about the college that he wasn't advised to
Speaker 4: go by his mother, but he did attend college for
Speaker 4: a time. What happens after college?
Speaker 2: He got a job at disc jockey for Barnmore Radio station.
Speaker 2: He did very good. The woman seemed to like his soft,
Speaker 2: soothing voice. He went to college, and then he married
Speaker 2: his high school sweetheart in nineteen eighty five, a woman
Speaker 2: named Maretta Bradham, who had her own problems. She was
Speaker 2: raped and had sexual problems. I discussed in the book
Speaker 2: a little bit in there. And then he went into
Speaker 2: the Navy, and that's when he started to use drugs,
Speaker 2: you know, that's when he started to his cocaine. He
Speaker 2: had already started to drink. He said in one of
Speaker 2: his reports for the psychiatrist that he was drinking like
Speaker 2: sixteen to eighteen beers a day in his teens. But
Speaker 2: I think it's a little bit overstated. I don't think
Speaker 2: anybody could drink, drink that much liquor and still be
Speaker 2: functioning on that sort of thing. But anyways, he began
Speaker 2: to use drugs and that started to lead to the crime,
Speaker 2: the petty crime. Yeah, he was involved with several burglaries
Speaker 2: in around the Seattle metro area and I was arrested.
Speaker 2: Of course, like I said, breaking into the hardware start
Speaker 2: and he played guilty to second degree burglary. I judge
Speaker 2: sent him for two years supervised probation on that.
Speaker 4: Now you talk about his marriage breaking up, and they
Speaker 4: were separated but never divorced, but they were separated you
Speaker 4: say by ninety two.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: At one point he goes to live with his sister, Yvonne,
Speaker 4: who he was always close.
Speaker 2: With, Yeah, in rock Hill, the city where I'm living
Speaker 2: right now, Yeah, which is a suburb of Charlotte. It's
Speaker 2: about the thirty thirty miles from downtown Charlotte are I'm
Speaker 2: living on that And he already committed his first murder.
Speaker 2: He committed his first murder in barnwall There was a
Speaker 2: woman named Deshanda de Thea. She was eighteen years old
Speaker 2: and she was a high school student and Wallace had
Speaker 2: a thing for her, and he kept bugging her about
Speaker 2: getting together and all that, and they finally ended to
Speaker 2: get it together, and then he put the move on
Speaker 2: her and he asked her, you know, he backed off
Speaker 2: when she got a little frightened, and he asked her
Speaker 2: if she was going to report in, and she made
Speaker 2: a mistake of saying yeah. So he ended up killing her,
Speaker 2: and he strangled her and threw her body in the water,
Speaker 2: and should have been he should have been charged because
Speaker 2: he was one of the last people scene with him.
Speaker 2: And I talked to a couple of the cops that
Speaker 2: then investigated that case, and they said they knew he
Speaker 2: did it, but they had no way of proving it
Speaker 2: on that. So that was his first escape from the law,
Speaker 2: so to speak.
Speaker 4: That first crime forensic experts right checked his car and
Speaker 4: they found absolutely nothing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is he was very smart. He always cleaned
Speaker 2: up the scene of fingerprints and all that. As he
Speaker 2: went through life and was killing, his drug used increased
Speaker 2: and he got more careless later on, and that's what
Speaker 2: really did him in. They did find his palm prints
Speaker 2: on a car trunk, which was part of the evidence
Speaker 2: that they presented against him and actually led to his arrest.
Speaker 4: You write about back to a thea that she was
Speaker 4: found a couple of weeks later in the water, and
Speaker 4: a detective commented that water does terrible things the DNA. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 4: and so Henry Wallace was aware of ways to make
Speaker 4: sure that he was not apprehended.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. Like I said, he was a born criminal.
Speaker 2: You know, he really understood the physiologia crime and he
Speaker 2: knew like you know, for example, later on he killed
Speaker 2: one woman and he put the temperature down so that
Speaker 2: it was cooler and that sort of slowed the body
Speaker 2: from the decomposing, so that would throw off the timing
Speaker 2: when the crime was committed.
Speaker 4: You write about March thirty first, nineteen ninety and that
Speaker 4: there was a woman named Ertha Brown, a sixteen year
Speaker 4: old and she's a friend of the Shandapathea and she
Speaker 4: had reported to police that he had put a gun
Speaker 4: to her head and tried to rape her. What happens
Speaker 4: from that report to.
Speaker 2: Police, nothing nothing. He was actually suspected of killing a
Speaker 2: woman in Allendale Conde and tempting rape of another one,
Speaker 2: and he was also suspected of raping another woman in
Speaker 2: Barnwall County, and nothing happened. Nothing really happened. And what
Speaker 2: he did was, he said one stepped ahead of the law.
Speaker 2: His marriage was failing, he got fired from his job
Speaker 2: because he was stealing, and he ended up murdering this woman.
Speaker 2: And so what he did was that that's when he
Speaker 2: went to rock Hill, South Carolina. He decided to get
Speaker 2: out of Dodge and he left the city.
Speaker 4: You rite that Charlotte is one of the fastest growing
Speaker 4: cities in America and with it comes a dramatic increase
Speaker 4: in crime. You cite some statistics about the difference in
Speaker 4: three years between murders forty two and three years later
Speaker 4: over one hundred. So that's what this police department was
Speaker 4: dealing with in this area. And also you write about
Speaker 4: the lack of detectives and the lack of people sharing
Speaker 4: information even at that time.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was a fast growing town, but they still
Speaker 2: had a small town attitude, and the city government really
Speaker 2: would increase the police force or give them the resources
Speaker 2: that they needed. And top it off, there was crack.
Speaker 2: Crack was sweeping the country and that was leading to
Speaker 2: a really surgeon crime and the detectives that they had
Speaker 2: on the forest, there was like seven detectives that were
Speaker 2: supposed to handle all of these murders which are increasing,
Speaker 2: and so it was a perfect background for a guy
Speaker 2: like Henry Wallace to begin committing his crimes.
Speaker 4: You write about May nineteen ninety two and a Sharon Nance,
Speaker 4: a thirty three year old. Yeah, she has some police
Speaker 4: record for drugs.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was kind of disputed, but I think it
Speaker 2: was pretty accurate.
Speaker 4: She has found beaten to death, and again the police
Speaker 4: find little forensic evidence and have no clue. In fact,
Speaker 4: Sharon Nance's death was never classified as a murder even
Speaker 4: that's right.
Speaker 2: She was found a few days later and he just
Speaker 2: left her on the side of the road and that
Speaker 2: was it. You know, nothing ever happened. There was no
Speaker 2: follow up, no real investigation and all that that of
Speaker 2: course gave him growing confidence that he could get away
Speaker 2: with murders. So to speak, and that's what he did.
Speaker 2: I mean, one of the things that we see is
Speaker 2: that you know, would he would he would commit a crime,
Speaker 2: and he realized like how outrageous it was, and he
Speaker 2: would go home and wait for a report on the news,
Speaker 2: on the television news, and nothing happened. There was no report, nothing,
Speaker 2: and so that sort of encouraged him, you know, made
Speaker 2: him a little bit overconfident as well that he could
Speaker 2: get away with murder.
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Speaker 4: You say he felt invincible and also a very important
Speaker 4: thing happens in terms of he moves in with a
Speaker 4: woman named Sadie McKnight.
Speaker 2: That was his girlfriend, and Katie mckknight had a friend
Speaker 2: called Caroline Love who became his second victim in Charlotte,
Speaker 2: and he took her body from the house and he
Speaker 2: dumped it on an abandoned road and it took two
Speaker 2: years for her to be discovered on that. And it's
Speaker 2: interesting because Caroline Love lived with McKnight and they were
Speaker 2: concerned when Carolin Love disappeared, and Henry was there, you know,
Speaker 2: he was talking with them, sympathizing, speculating, and they all
Speaker 2: went down to the police station to file a missing
Speaker 2: person's report. Henry did that with them on that and
Speaker 2: it wasn't until he was caught later on that Caroline
Speaker 2: Love's body was discovered.
Speaker 4: You're right that Love was the third woman to go
Speaker 4: missing in Charlotte.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there were a couple other other mystery women and
Speaker 2: all that, and they found i think one of the
Speaker 2: other ones. But it was showing that there was a
Speaker 2: beginning of a crime problem happening in Charlotte, and then
Speaker 2: the police were really clueless about what was going on.
Speaker 4: Now you introduced Seanna Hawk, a twenty year old Her
Speaker 4: mom d Sumpter and Walter Hawk Junior. They all lived
Speaker 4: together and she worked at the nearby Taco bell and
Speaker 4: of course Henry Wallace was the manager. He had hired her.
Speaker 4: He had known her for five six months, you write,
Speaker 4: and they became good friends and even dated.
Speaker 2: And her mother liked him. Yeah, you know, I interviewed
Speaker 2: her and she said that, you know, Wallace had completely
Speaker 2: fooled her and she dated for a while. And yeah,
Speaker 2: he ended up. He ended up. I think it was
Speaker 2: an impulse murder. He decided to just kill her, and
Speaker 2: he did that. He strangled her, put her in the water,
Speaker 2: washed her body, get rid of the evidence, and left her.
Speaker 2: And the family was concerned. She was supposed to pick
Speaker 2: up an nephew, I believe, and she had disappeared. She
Speaker 2: left her purse at home, which is not very unusual,
Speaker 2: the Sumpter said. And they didn't realize that. All the
Speaker 2: time that they were looking, they were calling everywhere, her
Speaker 2: body was in the bathroom of their house. And Daryl
Speaker 2: finally when looking through the house and he discovered the
Speaker 2: body in the bathtub, her eyes open, and she was naked,
Speaker 2: and she was dead on that And in this case,
Speaker 2: Wallace actually showed up at the funeral. Yes, yeah, he
Speaker 2: went to the funeral, and he looked kind of weird.
Speaker 2: Everyone was saying that he was really weird. He was
Speaker 2: sitting in a you know, just staring ahead. Nobody, of course,
Speaker 2: knew they had anything to do with her dad.
Speaker 4: In fact, D Sumpter considered him possibly a suspect, but
Speaker 4: then after seeing him at the funeral, Yeah, she thought
Speaker 4: he looked so concerned, sitting there by himself, overwhelmed, maybe
Speaker 4: even looking a little weird. Yeah, but also that she
Speaker 4: had seen him another time and it just in her
Speaker 4: mind there was no way that Henry was responsible.
Speaker 2: Well, she actually saw him at a mall and he
Speaker 2: walked up to her and said, I'm very very sorry
Speaker 2: miss Sumter or the death of your daughter. We all
Speaker 2: liked her and we're very sorry to see her go.
Speaker 2: I mean, this guy was incredible, incredible actor. And she
Speaker 2: suspected that it had to be somebody that knew shown
Speaker 2: because there was no forced entry, nothing, And so she
Speaker 2: put all the guys that her daughter knew through her mind,
Speaker 2: and she came across a Wallace and she sort of said, Wallace, No, Henry, No,
Speaker 2: sweet Henry, no, and she just sort of put it
Speaker 2: out of her mind that he would have anything to
Speaker 2: do with her daughter's murder.
Speaker 4: A friend thought D needed a new purpose, and so
Speaker 4: they formed an organization. Mother mother is a murdered offspring, right, Mamo. Yeah,
Speaker 4: So she set fourth to be able to do something
Speaker 4: on behalf of her daughter, this new purpose, to be
Speaker 4: able to find the killer and to make some changes
Speaker 4: she felt were necessary in the police force moving forward.
Speaker 2: She was really devastated by her daughter. She was really
Speaker 2: close to her daughter, and she was really devastated and
Speaker 2: she wasn't getting over it. And it was like a
Speaker 2: month later and her friend Judy Williams said, you got
Speaker 2: to get over this, you know, and she talked her
Speaker 2: into forming this organization to help other people that had
Speaker 2: offspring murdered. And that began the organization and it's still
Speaker 2: an operation today and still thriving, although d has stepped aside.
Speaker 2: She's not really associated with the organization anymore.
Speaker 4: Now you say that, of course, Henry Wallace's crack problem
Speaker 4: is getting to the point where can't hold down work,
Speaker 4: but he's also just needs more money and he needs
Speaker 4: to resort to theft, and he can only think of
Speaker 4: his friends for a source, some things to steal from.
Speaker 4: And then you introduced Aubrey Spain, twenty four year old,
Speaker 4: a manager at Taco Bell and she also hung out
Speaker 4: with Henry and also SHAWNA Hawk. She was also friends
Speaker 4: with shawna Hawk as well. Right now, this is June
Speaker 4: twenty fourth, nineteen ninety three. He turns up her apartment
Speaker 4: and they had been friends and they would go out often.
Speaker 4: What happens at her home? What does he say to her?
Speaker 4: How does he react?
Speaker 2: It was an impulsive murder. And one of the things
Speaker 2: that he did he had a technique called the Boston
Speaker 2: choke where he would put his hands around her neck
Speaker 2: and strangle them and he waited for them to turn
Speaker 2: around when they're totally unsuspecting, and then he would apply
Speaker 2: this technique and that's what he did. He applied that
Speaker 2: to her, and of course he raped her. I don't
Speaker 2: think that the race were essentially less. I think it
Speaker 2: was rage, you know, against against a woman that he
Speaker 2: had killed on that and he left the place and
Speaker 2: got away with it. You know, nothing happened. Yeah, this time,
Speaker 2: the police were not really connecting any of these cases.
Speaker 2: All these cases happened within a five mile area, by
Speaker 2: the way, which is not a large space, you know
Speaker 2: where you have these murders being committed. But each of
Speaker 2: the cases that were happening the police were handling individually
Speaker 2: and evidently they didn't really make a connection between the
Speaker 2: various cases. They never talked about it, which sounds incredible,
Speaker 2: but that's what that was the case. And there was
Speaker 2: only seven of them. And like I said, the murders
Speaker 2: were increasing, as you pointed out, you know, they were
Speaker 2: increasing substantially over the early nineteen nineties.
Speaker 4: You're write that nothing had happened to Henry after he
Speaker 4: had killed his first incredibly five victims in Charlotte, and
Speaker 4: his arrogance grew. And then you introduce Valencia Jumper. They
Speaker 4: had been friends. She'd been friends with Henry for over
Speaker 4: a year and she was came to attend c. Smith College,
Speaker 4: majoring in computer science.
Speaker 2: Yeah, she was very ambitious. Her parents are very proud
Speaker 2: of her. She came to Charlotte, and for some reason,
Speaker 2: Henry changes his method of killing. He tried to set
Speaker 2: her on fire to cover up his crime. And she
Speaker 2: was also a friend of his sister's and which was
Speaker 2: really amazing, but anyways, he tried he tried to set
Speaker 2: her on fire and the coroner misdiagnosed the crime. He
Speaker 2: said it was accidental fire, which was quite amazing. And
Speaker 2: so again he got off the hook, you know, no accountability. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and again he went to a funeral. He went to
Speaker 2: Valencia's funeral and he even sent the family condolences. So,
Speaker 2: you know, no one suspected anything about this guy. You know,
Speaker 2: this guy was a regular. They all thought he was
Speaker 2: a regular, nice guy, which is kind of frightening. When
Speaker 2: I was writing this book, I was saying, Holy Mac,
Speaker 2: I said, there must be other people out there like
Speaker 2: this that can that can operate at this level, you know,
Speaker 2: this this murderous level and get away with it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it takes psychopathic mindset to even a different level.
Speaker 4: And it's not strangers, it's people you really know and
Speaker 4: are friends with.
Speaker 2: You and asked you.
Speaker 4: You introduce Michelle Stone, twenty year old, and it's interesting
Speaker 4: she talks about or he had experience and met Henry
Speaker 4: when she was pregnant and he had helped her. He
Speaker 4: was very helpful, he had taken the child out out
Speaker 4: of daycare. He was a very helpful person when she
Speaker 4: needed him most.
Speaker 2: And she worked with him at tackle Bell. You know
Speaker 2: she worked with is another example of the connection to
Speaker 2: the crimes. You know, like Shawanna Hawk, she worked at
Speaker 2: tackle Bell and he raped her and then he strangled
Speaker 2: her and stabbed her in front of her own son,
Speaker 2: you know, her eldest son, which was quite quite amazing,
Speaker 2: quite chilling.
Speaker 4: What I was going to say, too, is that we
Speaker 4: didn't gloss over it. But there's all of these cases
Speaker 4: where these people are killed in their homes. It takes
Speaker 4: a little bit for people to discover their bodies, and
Speaker 4: it's usually family members that have to uncover this horrifying scene.
Speaker 4: It's very interesting when a neighbor comes in sees that
Speaker 4: Michelle Stinson is on the floor and weirdly enough, her
Speaker 4: two young sons are calmly just watching the television set.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, and Henry never touched them, which was quite remarkable.
Speaker 4: You write that the Charlotte police asked finally the FBI
Speaker 4: for help. What was the FBI's response.
Speaker 2: They weren't really helpful. They didn't think there was a
Speaker 2: serial killer involved, and a gentleman named Wrestler, very prominent
Speaker 2: FBI agents said, if you know, if Wallace was trying
Speaker 2: to be a serial killer, he was going about it
Speaker 2: all wrong. And they just never really helped. So the
Speaker 2: Charlotte police were on their own, you know, trying to
Speaker 2: figure out what was going on.
Speaker 4: You write that on February fourth, nineteen ninety four, Wallace
Speaker 4: is arrested for shoplifting, and it's very close to where
Speaker 4: the bodies were discovered, the dumb sites.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and they never made a connection between him and
Speaker 2: any of the murders on that. And the thing I
Speaker 2: found out is that all this information was in a
Speaker 2: central database. If the cops would have checked the database,
Speaker 2: they would have found all this stuff on Henry Wallace,
Speaker 2: suspicion of murder, the shoplifting charge, his crimes in Seattle
Speaker 2: when he was in the military, on all that, but
Speaker 2: for some reason they never had. They never checked his database.
Speaker 4: You introduce Sergeant Gary McFadden. He's an African American and
Speaker 4: he is appointed to lead the investigation. So there is
Speaker 4: some political pressure. There is incredible pressure from the public
Speaker 4: on the police to do something. Gary McFadden is appointed,
Speaker 4: and they also wanted to put it seemed a black
Speaker 4: officer in the head of this to stem the criticism
Speaker 4: that they weren't doing enough because the victims were black.
Speaker 2: And Gary recognized this too. He called himself a skipecoaver,
Speaker 2: you know. So if the investigation continued to be screwed,
Speaker 2: out he would get to blame for it, and he
Speaker 2: was a black officer, so they could say, you know,
Speaker 2: look we appointed a black guy and nothing has changed
Speaker 2: on that, so he can't blame us on that. But
Speaker 2: it was very confident, and he eventually, you know, he
Speaker 2: had a lot of conflict would be at first people
Speaker 2: because she thought a desumpter trying to Hawk's mother because
Speaker 2: she thought that the police were very slow on the investigation,
Speaker 2: and she was right, I mean, they weren't doing anything. Really.
Speaker 2: She told me about an officer that said, look, i'll look,
Speaker 2: I'll keep you informed and all that sort of stuff,
Speaker 2: and I'll get in touch with you if we have anything.
Speaker 2: He never did call her, you know, on that then,
Speaker 2: which led to her frustration, and she became sort of
Speaker 2: the face of these growing series of crimes. She tried
Speaker 2: to keep it in the public eye. She wrote an
Speaker 2: open letter to the killer, which of course Henry Wallace,
Speaker 2: which appeared in the press, telling him to give himself up,
Speaker 2: you know, and what he was doing was really wrong
Speaker 2: and he's missing up a lot of lives and that
Speaker 2: he should really give himself up. And nothing, of course
Speaker 2: happened out of that.
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Speaker 4: February nineteen ninety four, you introduced Vanessa little Mac and
Speaker 4: she has two daughters, and she works at the Carolina
Speaker 4: Medical Center. And Henry had invited her on a date
Speaker 4: that went okay. They had a second date July ninety three,
Speaker 4: and she invited her sister, Leslie, And you write that
Speaker 4: he became like a brother to to Vanessa Mack.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And of course you know, she didn't suspect
Speaker 2: anything when he ended up their apartment in West Charlotte,
Speaker 2: and again unsuspecting he turned around. Now he was a
Speaker 2: big guy too. He was like six'. One at one
Speaker 2: point when he was in, prison he weighed three hundred,
Speaker 2: pounds but he was normally like two hundred and forty. Pounds.
Speaker 2: Yeah of course these were small, women so he was
Speaker 2: pretty powerful and he ended up strangling her and then
Speaker 2: raping her and strangling her and leaving the.
Speaker 4: Apartment you write that police and like many of these
Speaker 4: other crime, scenes they said there was no forced. Entry so,
Speaker 4: again could police get surmised that the victim knew the? Killer?
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah and you would figure that they would check
Speaker 2: the backgrounds to find out if there was any, connection
Speaker 2: and finally they. Did gary mcfatten asked of some of
Speaker 2: the people in you the, victims like who would she?
Speaker 2: Invite who would she let into her apartment unsuspectingly on that,
Speaker 2: then and he asked several, people and the only person
Speaker 2: that really show up on all the lists Was Henry.
Speaker 2: Wallace you're.
Speaker 4: Right march, ninth nineteen ninety, Four Vernice Lamar woods was
Speaker 4: in his. Apartment he was friends With Henry, wallace but
Speaker 4: he also lived with his, Girlfriend Brandy, henderson who was
Speaker 4: eighteen years, old and they had a ten month old
Speaker 4: son Named. Tyresse now tell us about this Where henry
Speaker 4: goes to the apartment And woods is taken care Of,
Speaker 4: tyresse and how it comes that he Meets Betty buckholm that.
Speaker 2: Day what happened was he went to the apartment he
Speaker 2: was intent on getting. Money he was. Desperate now his,
Speaker 2: Girlfriend datie McKnight was sped up with him and his
Speaker 2: drug habits and she kicked him out and he had
Speaker 2: begged her to come. In he hadn't watched for a.
Speaker 2: While he had sold all of a lot of his
Speaker 2: personal possessions and he was really hurting for a, fix you,
Speaker 2: know for a crack. Fix he was going to. Go
Speaker 2: he decided that who did he? Know so he decided
Speaker 2: That Brandy henderson would be his next, victim and he
Speaker 2: went to her house And Squeaky woods was there and
Speaker 2: he didn't expect, that and so that threw him off
Speaker 2: and he had to, leave make an excuse and leave the.
Speaker 2: Apartment he just said that he was leading town and
Speaker 2: he just wanted to come by and say hello to,
Speaker 2: him take goodbye to him before before he. Left so
Speaker 2: he left that apartment and he, said, well else did
Speaker 2: he know in the. Neighborhood he really needed the money
Speaker 2: and all, that and he ended up figuring That Betty
Speaker 2: bocam lived somewhere in that, area and finally he figured
Speaker 2: out where she lived and he went to see. Her
Speaker 2: And bacam And wallace's girlfriend were co workers At bojangles
Speaker 2: where she was an assistant, manager and he thought that
Speaker 2: she would have some money or she would have access
Speaker 2: to the to the safe At, bojangles and he put
Speaker 2: pressure on her and ended up murdering. Her he took
Speaker 2: a considerable amount of valuables from her house and then
Speaker 2: he left the apartment with her, car and he pawned
Speaker 2: everything except the. Car and that is where it started
Speaker 2: to get to get, weird because he had HER atm
Speaker 2: card and he went to THE atm and the car
Speaker 2: eventually got THE atm videotape and they couldn't See, wallace
Speaker 2: but you recognize an earring on one of his, years
Speaker 2: and that was part of the identification which led to
Speaker 2: his eventual.
Speaker 4: Arrest you, say, though that he's in the midst of this.
Speaker 4: Rampage he's, paranoid he's, desperate he has nowhere to, live
Speaker 4: nowhere to, go and he goes back to The woods
Speaker 4: apartment And Brandy, Henderson.
Speaker 2: Yeah and then and then he decided for some reason
Speaker 2: to go, back and of course she was. Unsuspecting he
Speaker 2: knew That Bert Squeaky Woods Arness woods would be at,
Speaker 2: work and so he showed up on that and he
Speaker 2: eventually murdered her too as.
Speaker 4: Well you write that he demanded, Money she said she
Speaker 4: only had fifteen. Dollars she, said CAN i hold my?
Speaker 4: Son he, said that's not a good idea for what
Speaker 4: we're going to be. Doing and he told her to
Speaker 4: take off her, clothes and she start, praying and he
Speaker 4: said to, her, despicably of Course i'm not going to hurt.
Speaker 4: YOU i got WHAT i, wanted And i'm. Leaving and
Speaker 4: he asked her for a, hug and she, did and,
Speaker 4: then of, course in his trademark, fashion he goes to
Speaker 4: the washroom and gets a towel to be able to
Speaker 4: use to choke, her and so she, asks though she
Speaker 4: grabs her son at some point and lays him across
Speaker 4: her chest and turned his head so he couldn't see
Speaker 4: what was. Happening and meanwhile he uses his towel around
Speaker 4: her neck till she her eyes are bulging out and
Speaker 4: she's red in the, face and he strangles her dead
Speaker 4: and puts her clothes.
Speaker 2: On then the child started making, noise and he tried
Speaker 2: to shut up the kid and almost strangled it to
Speaker 2: death on, that and then he left the.
Speaker 4: Apartment, yeah it's it's. Extraordinary he puts the towel around
Speaker 4: the kid's. Throat the silence the, kid not knowing whether
Speaker 4: he's going to strangle him to. Death he leaves them.
Speaker 4: There the door is a, jar and then of Course
Speaker 4: lamar comes home and has this horrifying so the first
Speaker 4: thing he sees is his son struggling to, breathe and
Speaker 4: then of course Discovers brandy on the. Ground credible.
Speaker 2: Scene but by this time he was totally out of.
Speaker 2: Control wallace was and he was desperate because he was
Speaker 2: killing these people not getting. Money he ended up one last,
Speaker 2: victim Debrand, slaughter and he was a co worker of
Speaker 2: his Girlfriend city, McKnight and this shows you how out
Speaker 2: of control he. Was he ended up stabbing or something
Speaker 2: like thirty eight times in the stomach and chess on
Speaker 2: that and he left the. Apartment but by now the
Speaker 2: police were Intensifizing paroles And. Charlotte they were taking the
Speaker 2: case much more. Seriously they got on To wallace with
Speaker 2: the pomp print And Betty bockham's. Car you, know he
Speaker 2: had wiped he had wiped everything off except that he
Speaker 2: had to close the, trunk and he forgot that he
Speaker 2: didn't have gloves, on and he closed the trunk and
Speaker 2: that led to a pomp print which police were able
Speaker 2: to analyze and they connected To. Wallace and then the,
Speaker 2: police LIKE i, said we're really, understaffed and they had
Speaker 2: a backlog of rape. Kits and finally some of the
Speaker 2: victims were tested FOR dna and they found some of
Speaker 2: that related To. Wallace on that and they discovered that
Speaker 2: he had been arrested for shoplifting thirty eight dollars shirt
Speaker 2: out of a, shop and they use that as the
Speaker 2: excuse to go out and arrest. Him and then they
Speaker 2: found him at an apartment of a, friend hiding in the,
Speaker 2: bathroom and they arrested him and brought him in right.
Speaker 4: Away you write about this questioning and right away, detectives
Speaker 4: Including Nick, fadden they confront them with the evidence they
Speaker 4: have about all these, women but in particular About Tashanda
Speaker 4: bathia And Sharon. Nance so they're questioning him and he's
Speaker 4: resistant and doesn't know anything about. It what happens to
Speaker 4: make him?
Speaker 2: CONFESS i just think that the pressure of the investigation
Speaker 2: plus all of his, troubles you, know he was under tremendous.
Speaker 2: Pressure he needed money for drugs and all, that and
Speaker 2: the weight of all the killings on. HIM i think
Speaker 2: he just added. Up he just got, tired you, know
Speaker 2: of playing playing this, role and he just opened. Up
Speaker 2: and he ended up talking for, hours WHICH i used
Speaker 2: a large part for my, book which were. Amazing the
Speaker 2: trial records themselves were not. AVAILABLE i don't know what
Speaker 2: happened to, them and which made me kind of really,
Speaker 2: worried BECAUSE, I i'll, say, well how WAS i going
Speaker 2: to do this? Book how WAS i going to get
Speaker 2: into his mind and all? That THEN i discovered, these,
Speaker 2: uh these transcripts of the of the interviews with, him
Speaker 2: and that served as the basis for the. Book but
Speaker 2: he reneged a little bit ways through the interviews and
Speaker 2: he claimed that he had nothing to do with the
Speaker 2: murders and all. That but he, talked he, talked and
Speaker 2: he really confessed to the. Murders and then they tried
Speaker 2: to get the interviews thrown out out of court when
Speaker 2: he went to, trial but the judge didn't go for.
Speaker 4: It as you just, mentioned you use these details throughout
Speaker 4: the book to tell us what, happened of, course for
Speaker 4: there was no eyewitness Except Henry. Wallace So Henry wallace
Speaker 4: tells us how he gains their trust how they turned,
Speaker 4: around how he asked them for a glass of water
Speaker 4: and then choked them and then out and then raped.
Speaker 4: Them and so we're going to have. This we're going
Speaker 4: to have the. Sex and a couple of these friends,
Speaker 4: cried a couple of people, prayed and there was no
Speaker 4: remorse from this person. Whatsoever he wanted to have the.
Speaker 4: Sex he wanted to have that. Crack in, fact his
Speaker 4: Last Deborah, slaughter he, left sold some of her items
Speaker 4: for a certain amount of, money bought, crack and came
Speaker 4: back and smoke crack right near the body back in that.
Speaker 2: Apartment we went back into the bathroom past the, body
Speaker 2: and he did the. Drugs and it was just quite
Speaker 2: amazing on that and what made you, know what makes
Speaker 2: a person like?
Speaker 4: This you?
Speaker 2: KNOW i finished the. BOOK i had NO i had no.
Speaker 2: IDEA i just knew that it was one of the
Speaker 2: most amazing stories THAT i ever. Read AND i, said
Speaker 2: there's got to be other people out there like that
Speaker 2: that that we don't know anything. About AND i, said
Speaker 2: that's the chilling part about.
Speaker 4: It you read about how careful he was to DESTROY dna. Evidence, however,
Speaker 4: afterwards and this seems incredible to the victims'. FAMILIES i
Speaker 4: would imagine is that the police had used rape kits
Speaker 4: to collect evidence in all the, murders except the results
Speaker 4: were missed in a massive backlog of.
Speaker 2: Evidence exactly there, was and finally they got around to.
Speaker 2: It they checked the murders because of, course they gave
Speaker 2: it a priority because Of wallace's, arrest and they found
Speaker 2: they found evidence Connecting wallace to the murders on. That, so,
Speaker 2: yeah so this, guy you, know he got away with
Speaker 2: it with all of his. Life you, know he's always
Speaker 2: one step ahead of the. Law it, seemed whether he was,
Speaker 2: shoplifting breaking into into a, store or murdering young woman on. That,
Speaker 2: now all the, VICTIMS i, mean he was black and
Speaker 2: all the victims were. Black and somebody, ASKED i, mean
Speaker 2: of course did he do that because on the supposition
Speaker 2: that the police wouldn't be as interested in investigating the,
Speaker 2: murders AND i don't think. So you, know they were
Speaker 2: just the people that he, knew and there was really
Speaker 2: nothing you, know racial about the murders at.
Speaker 4: All you're, right do you provide a statistic that was very.
Speaker 4: INTERESTING i thought that that the black population makes up
Speaker 4: thirteen percent.
Speaker 2: And twenty percent of the back serial killers are.
Speaker 4: Black you were saying that actually thirty three percent were.
Speaker 4: Black where they're popular in the, population they only represent thirteen. Percent, yeah, right, right,
Speaker 4: right so a thirty three. Percent it's, dramatic especially, given like, you,
Speaker 4: right the myth that all serial killers are predominantly all
Speaker 4: serial killers are, white where you say that's not the truth.
Speaker 2: Exactly and now there's an interesting. Part you, know they
Speaker 2: claimed that he was the first serial killer that knew
Speaker 2: all of his, victims because it's not usual for a
Speaker 2: serial killer to kill people they, know. Right AND i
Speaker 2: had a woman on my radio show that had done
Speaker 2: a book on his serial killer Named Jerry, marcus and
Speaker 2: he was. There he committed his crimes Before, wallace and
Speaker 2: he had actually known all the. Victims and they were
Speaker 2: striking similarities in the cases Between marcus's case And wallace's.
Speaker 2: Case they were both gentlemen.
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Speaker 4: Details now you write about this, trial and of course
Speaker 4: because of the nine and actually ten murders that he's charged,
Speaker 4: for that the death penalty is on the, table and
Speaker 4: there has been some fight on the constitutionality of the death,
Speaker 4: penalty but at this, time the death penalty was still
Speaker 4: available for these.
Speaker 2: Murders, yeah everybody thought that he was going to be put.
Speaker 2: Today he was going to be, executed and the average
Speaker 2: time was about nine years for somebody to go on
Speaker 2: death row and go through the. Appeals of, course the alwis,
Speaker 2: appeal and in this, case he exhausted his appeals by
Speaker 2: two thousand and. Five but he's still. Alive AND i
Speaker 2: understand that there was a moratarium put on the death
Speaker 2: penalty In North carolina because of its, controversy and right,
Speaker 2: now no date has ever been. Set AND i, asked you, know,
Speaker 2: PEOPLE i, said, well you, know when is he going
Speaker 2: to be put to put to? Death and the answer
Speaker 2: was who.
Speaker 4: Knows you, Know, desumpter you right found out about the
Speaker 4: arrest from the, news and as Did henry's, Mother Lottie
Speaker 4: may and his Sister, yvonne and they were.
Speaker 2: Shocked, yeah the police never informed, Him AND i don't,
Speaker 2: KNOW i don't know if that was if you could
Speaker 2: blame him for, that because you, know there was so
Speaker 2: much activity going around the murders at that, time but
Speaker 2: you would think that they would inform the relatives of
Speaker 2: the dead. People, yeah you would.
Speaker 4: Think so you write about how outraged the public was
Speaker 4: and critical of the police not making a connection through
Speaker 4: all that time and also not warning, anybody but also
Speaker 4: they never made a connection to be able to warn.
Speaker 2: Anyone, yeah, yeah it. Was it was only like about
Speaker 2: three days before they Arrested wallace that the cops even
Speaker 2: alerted the public In East charlotte that there was possibly
Speaker 2: a serial killer in their. Midst so they're out to
Speaker 2: lunch right up until the very.
Speaker 4: End you talk about that spring soon after mums of
Speaker 4: mothers of missing offspring asked The Charlotte city to investigate
Speaker 4: the police, department.
Speaker 2: And nothing really ever happened of, that although they the
Speaker 2: crime and all the controversies around it did help the
Speaker 2: police to finally get the resources that, needed it got
Speaker 2: technology that it. Needed the number of police detectives was increased.
Speaker 2: DRAMATICALLY i understand they're about twenty five now investigating murders
Speaker 2: and there were only seven at the time on. That
Speaker 2: and then they implemented some other policies too to better
Speaker 2: coordinate activities between law enforcement. Agencies so it had a
Speaker 2: positive impact in the long run On charlotte.
Speaker 4: And also De sumpter's organization that she founded would end
Speaker 4: up and the police were agreeable with us to work
Speaker 4: with the police department to help them sensitivity training and
Speaker 4: also especially in terms of how they would deal with
Speaker 4: the victims' families during an. Investigation, yeah.
Speaker 2: Heartening part of the stories that there was a lot
Speaker 2: of friction Between garry McFadden and D, sumter but they
Speaker 2: eventually ended up being friends and according To gary, McFadden
Speaker 2: he told me, that you, know they talk about once
Speaker 2: a week on, that but he's very he was a
Speaker 2: good guy to have in that. Position he was very
Speaker 2: community oriented and he believed in talking to the people
Speaker 2: in the, community which was unlike the police in general
Speaker 2: In charlotte at the. Time and D.
Speaker 4: Sumter goes on to have an appearance on the famous
Speaker 4: talk Show donahue In.
Speaker 2: Chicago, yeah, yeah she. Did, yeah the trial, like she
Speaker 2: did a good job keeping it in the public, eye
Speaker 2: you know WHAT i. Mean and she's very, articulate very
Speaker 2: very nice, person and she did a, LOT i, think
Speaker 2: to publicize the crimes and help with its.
Speaker 4: Solution you say that this trial began nineteen ninety six
Speaker 4: after a two year, delay and of, course because this
Speaker 4: is a death, penalty there's a public defender and a
Speaker 4: qualified public defender ready to fight for this person to
Speaker 4: get off death row and to save them from the death.
Speaker 4: Penalty and you have a defense Counsel Isabelle day And
Speaker 4: Jim coopley And Judge hyatt at that. Time and of
Speaker 4: course the prosecutor is a person Named Marcia, goodenow and
Speaker 4: she is tenacious and very determined that this guy get
Speaker 4: the death penalty for these.
Speaker 2: Crimes, right she did her, job and chief are rejective on.
Speaker 2: That And Isabelle day was a kind of interesting. Woman
Speaker 2: wallace after he was convicted and he was in Prison
Speaker 2: Central prison In. Raleigh that that's where he's. Now and
Speaker 2: he ended up beating a psychiatric nurse at the, prison
Speaker 2: woman Named Rebecca, perios and evidently, they you, know fell
Speaker 2: in love and he married. Her And Isabella day was
Speaker 2: it was one of the witnesses at the, wedding and
Speaker 2: she was twenty three years older than, him and she
Speaker 2: sort of disappeared off the face of the earth because
Speaker 2: she's not living In raleigh Or, charlotte AND i couldn't find.
Speaker 4: Her it was a hard time trying to find. Her
Speaker 4: you talk about his life in. Prison he didn't just
Speaker 4: stay quiet in, prison did. He there was some disciplinary.
Speaker 2: Problems, yeah he played with a guard locked him into
Speaker 2: a D l. Cell Caroline love's, brother who was up
Speaker 2: on a drug charge at the, time knowing that he
Speaker 2: had murdered his, sister picked a fight with him and
Speaker 2: there was an altercation there and there was supposed to
Speaker 2: be a fire in his cell that they thought that
Speaker 2: That wallace was involved. With so, yeah so you, know
Speaker 2: he did cause some serious problems on, that but he
Speaker 2: sort of. Disappeared he doesn't really want to talk with
Speaker 2: anybody about. IT i talked with THE abc. Producer they
Speaker 2: did a special on the on the case FOR, abc
Speaker 2: The news, network AND i talked with the producer of
Speaker 2: that show and she, SAID i, said why didn't you
Speaker 2: Get henry to? Interview and he, said we, tried but
Speaker 2: he didn't want to talk to. Us SO i, REALIZED i, said,
Speaker 2: well if he's not going to talk to, her he's
Speaker 2: not going to talk to. Me AND i, SAID i
Speaker 2: make better use of my. Time SO i decided not
Speaker 2: to pursue trying to get an interview with him because
Speaker 2: it would have been two time consuming AND i didn't
Speaker 2: think the chances were that good of getting.
Speaker 4: It it's a foregone. Conclusion but was the actual Sentence january,
Speaker 4: second nineteen ninety.
Speaker 2: Seven, well he got convicted of all the, murder the
Speaker 2: murder charges and the rape, charges but the most important
Speaker 2: part is that he got the death. Sentence you, know
Speaker 2: all that other stuff was gravy.
Speaker 4: Now as it is with many of these serial. Killers
Speaker 4: did he gain notoriety behind prison? Walls were there are
Speaker 4: people interested in him as a?
Speaker 2: Celebrity, WELL i understand that he's living in solitary pretty
Speaker 2: well most of the, time and he's protected like most
Speaker 2: prisoners like, That AND i have not heard of any
Speaker 2: attempts on his life or any attempts to harm him at,
Speaker 2: All so he sort of like.
Speaker 4: Disappeared, Interesting and what did you get from this that
Speaker 4: you haven't gotten from many other true crime books and
Speaker 4: other books that you've. Written you've written so many so,
Speaker 4: far and you've done your podcast for years Now True Crime.
Speaker 4: Podcast tell us what you got from this that was
Speaker 4: that you didn't find out or didn't determine something of
Speaker 4: value from this investigation in this.
Speaker 2: Book, well this is the first BOOK i did about
Speaker 2: a serial, killer which was kind of. DIFFERENT i usually
Speaker 2: the Books i've done are on drug, traffickers you, know
Speaker 2: organized crime figures and stuff like. This it was quite a.
Speaker 2: Different BUT i just couldn't have believe that a guy
Speaker 2: like this could operate in society and for two years
Speaker 2: end up killing ten women and, nothing nothing. HAPPENS i,
Speaker 2: mean he just gets away with, it you, know the
Speaker 2: police don't catch on and all, That and it just
Speaker 2: makes me wonder how many other guys are out there
Speaker 2: like that that are operating, now that are actually smarter Than,
Speaker 2: wallace that didn't have a drug, problem didn't have his psychiatric,
Speaker 2: problems but are out, there you, know murdering. Woman and
Speaker 2: then when you look at the number of people that have, disappeared,
Speaker 2: right there's thousands of. People you, see the odds that
Speaker 2: happening are pretty.
Speaker 4: Good you talk about that well in the, introduction we
Speaker 4: said that he's potentially responsible from anywhere from twenty to
Speaker 4: ninety deaths of black. Women they never proved.
Speaker 2: THAT i talked With gary mcfatten and he said That
Speaker 2: wallace held that. Up he sort of dangled that that
Speaker 2: if he got a better sentence and maybe he would
Speaker 2: expose some of these. Crimes BUT i don't know if
Speaker 2: that's true or. NOT i don't know If wallace ended
Speaker 2: up murdering a lot of because they've done some, checking you,
Speaker 2: know in The seattle area where he, operated he was
Speaker 2: doing those crimes and all, that and they really haven't
Speaker 2: found anything that connects him to. THAT i mentioned the
Speaker 2: murders In, allendale one woman Named, riddle she was murdering her.
Speaker 2: Apartment they thought that he may have something to do with,
Speaker 2: that but they never worked out, out you, know the
Speaker 2: any we are able to prove anything on. That SO
Speaker 2: i don't know if if there are that many murders
Speaker 2: that he, committed like twenty to. NINETY i don't think.
Speaker 2: So to, me it would seem like very difficult to
Speaker 2: get away with, it you, know to do that many
Speaker 2: murders and get away with, it especially when they know
Speaker 2: that you've killed ten women, already you, know and they're
Speaker 2: looking for for other. Cases, yes.
Speaker 4: ABSOLUTELY i want to thank you very much Ron chepsick
Speaker 4: for coming on and talking about your latest Bad henry
Speaker 4: the murderous rampage of The Taco Bell. Strangler for those
Speaker 4: that might want to find out more about your other,
Speaker 4: work do you have a website and do social?
Speaker 2: Media, YEAH i got the. Website it's www dot Ron
Speaker 2: CHEPSICK C H e P e si uk dot.
Speaker 4: Com also tell us about your podcast and what's new
Speaker 4: for you in.
Speaker 2: Writing, yeah the podcast is Crime beat In operations in twenty.
Speaker 2: Eleven we deal with all kinds of crime on. That
Speaker 2: we've had over six hundred and forty shows since our.
Speaker 2: Beginning and as far as personal, Stuff i'm working on
Speaker 2: a book On Dallas khnman in the oil and gas
Speaker 2: industry with a fellow, producer a film, producer and we're
Speaker 2: hoping To we got the book. Contract wild repressed for,
Speaker 2: that and then once we finished the, book we're going
Speaker 2: to write a screenplay on it and it'll be something
Speaker 2: like The wolf Of Wall. Street very very.
Speaker 4: Interesting, yeah we'll look forward to. That thank you so,
Speaker 4: much Ron chepsick Or Bad Henry The Murderous rampage of
Speaker 4: The Taco Bell. Strangler thank you so much for this,
Speaker 4: interview and you have a great. Evening good.
Speaker 2: Night thank, You, DAN i appreciate. It thank.
Speaker 3: You