WEBVTT 1 00:00:02.160 --> 00:00:05.839 Meaning a live man like this man letting butterfly flapping 2 00:00:05.879 --> 00:00:07.440 his wing big down in the forest. 3 00:00:07.480 --> 00:00:10.279 Man, it gonna cause the tree fall, letting five thousand 4 00:00:10.279 --> 00:00:10.839 miles away. 5 00:00:10.919 --> 00:00:18.480 Man, nobody seen, nobody else. See, you don't need to 6 00:00:18.519 --> 00:00:22.399 know many pluck you a little story and you got 7 00:00:22.399 --> 00:00:25.519 back to fle like that. That's the win, Man blackly 8 00:00:25.559 --> 00:00:27.839 dag on the panel. Man, Man, you don't matter. 9 00:00:27.920 --> 00:00:37.840 Man all right, Thomas, welcome back to Jay burd and 10 00:00:37.840 --> 00:00:38.439 show how you doing. 11 00:00:38.479 --> 00:00:40.600 Man doing very well? Thanks for hosting me. 12 00:00:41.960 --> 00:00:44.759 Yeah, Man, I'm glad to have you back on. It's 13 00:00:44.759 --> 00:00:47.520 been a little while since you and I spoke on air. 14 00:00:48.240 --> 00:00:51.399 Now we got to hang out at uh the Secret 15 00:00:51.439 --> 00:00:53.759 O t C Bunker. Yeah, a good time. 16 00:00:54.439 --> 00:00:54.920 Uh. 17 00:00:55.079 --> 00:00:58.079 But we're back to it. And this is a big one. 18 00:00:58.479 --> 00:01:01.240 You know. This is one that I'll be it maybe 19 00:01:01.320 --> 00:01:05.079 is a little more obscure here in America, but is 20 00:01:05.879 --> 00:01:08.000 top of the line if we're talking about this issue, 21 00:01:08.000 --> 00:01:10.640 particularly in the UK. So I'll let you introduce at Thomas. 22 00:01:10.920 --> 00:01:14.719 Yeah, and I'm still getting over being ill. So just 23 00:01:14.799 --> 00:01:23.719 forgive my boys for faith failing me. Yeah. There's something 24 00:01:23.760 --> 00:01:29.599 that Jimmy Saville. It's it's not presented in any thorough 25 00:01:29.640 --> 00:01:35.480 capacity and media and such that it is discussed. It 26 00:01:35.560 --> 00:01:38.200 is presented as a sort of laundry list of depravity 27 00:01:38.239 --> 00:01:41.159 of this famous guy who became who was a pedophile, 28 00:01:42.159 --> 00:01:45.439 who's hiding in plain sight. That that's not really what 29 00:01:45.480 --> 00:01:50.439 we're talking about. I mean, yeah, Jimmy Savile was. He 30 00:01:50.519 --> 00:01:55.079 was a voracious rapist of both boys, girls, men and women. 31 00:01:56.159 --> 00:02:03.439 The claim is that some BBC presenter, and this sentiment 32 00:02:03.439 --> 00:02:08.599 was echoed in the Irish Times, suggested that there was 33 00:02:09.000 --> 00:02:12.719 you know, one off instances of several assaulting males. I 34 00:02:12.759 --> 00:02:15.800 guarantee he assaulted as many boys as he did girls. 35 00:02:16.159 --> 00:02:19.159 It's just that men are are shamed to report that 36 00:02:19.280 --> 00:02:26.000 kind of thing for obvious reasons. You know, he didn't discriminate. 37 00:02:26.039 --> 00:02:29.120 He was a voracious predator literally until the day he died. 38 00:02:30.199 --> 00:02:35.439 But and there was a there was a biopic made 39 00:02:35.520 --> 00:02:42.360 of him, I think called a British horror story like it. 40 00:02:42.360 --> 00:02:44.840 It was featured on one of the streaming sites here 41 00:02:44.840 --> 00:02:49.039 in America or streaming services, and I watched it and 42 00:02:49.240 --> 00:02:53.680 the guy who played several I thought, nailed it. And 43 00:02:54.680 --> 00:02:58.159 to the credit of the filmmakers, it got into several's 44 00:02:58.719 --> 00:03:02.479 necrophilia he was. He was literally an avid necrophilia too. 45 00:03:03.479 --> 00:03:06.080 That was a major aspect of his depravity and his 46 00:03:06.280 --> 00:03:14.879 ritualistic transgressions. But where they failed is they basically presented 47 00:03:14.919 --> 00:03:19.800 Savo as this man with a bizarre upbringing who was 48 00:03:20.000 --> 00:03:24.120 told who was an out of control sexual deviant, and 49 00:03:24.360 --> 00:03:28.439 they basically that was it, and they cast his his 50 00:03:28.560 --> 00:03:35.560 strange fixation on charity as him trying to atone for 51 00:03:36.800 --> 00:03:43.439 these depravities. That's that sort of deliberately obscure, is what 52 00:03:43.439 --> 00:03:46.719 we're talking about here, And what really jumped out to 53 00:03:46.759 --> 00:03:54.240 me when the man died, you know, he passed away 54 00:03:54.280 --> 00:03:58.879 in a twenty eleven Savo was born on Halloween in 55 00:03:59.000 --> 00:04:03.039 nineteen twenty six, and he'd make a big deal about that, saying, 56 00:04:03.080 --> 00:04:07.280 claiming indebtorous, that he was a warlock and that he 57 00:04:07.479 --> 00:04:10.800 was some sort of a cult addict or a sort 58 00:04:10.800 --> 00:04:14.280 of dark version of Merlin, some sort of liminal figure. 59 00:04:16.040 --> 00:04:20.720 And he died on October twenty ninth, twenty eleven. It 60 00:04:20.759 --> 00:04:23.040 was reported that when he was found in his apartment, 61 00:04:23.160 --> 00:04:27.519 he was lying in bed, grinning and the fingers on 62 00:04:27.600 --> 00:04:38.959 both of his hands were crossed, and his funeral was 63 00:04:39.040 --> 00:04:46.360 excessive by any metric and it was almost as if 64 00:04:49.360 --> 00:04:52.560 a sitting president or prime minister had died, or some 65 00:04:52.639 --> 00:04:59.439 beloved royal had died. It was totally bizarre. You know. 66 00:04:59.600 --> 00:05:05.560 Spokes in for for then Prince Charles, you know, uh 67 00:05:06.360 --> 00:05:13.160 issued this kind of maudlin and and glazing eulogy, you know, 68 00:05:13.800 --> 00:05:16.199 and and Charles himself said that Sabel was a great 69 00:05:16.319 --> 00:05:19.519 mentor of his and a great Englishman and just a 70 00:05:19.560 --> 00:05:29.399 great man. And this funeral went on for days. He 71 00:05:29.600 --> 00:05:33.160 was laid the rest in a gold coffin, this huge 72 00:05:33.160 --> 00:05:39.000 gold coffin, and it was driven to this hotel the 73 00:05:39.040 --> 00:05:44.000 city center of Leeds that was Saville's hometown. Okay, it 74 00:05:44.079 --> 00:05:46.600 was this, this huge gold coffin. It was driven to 75 00:05:46.600 --> 00:05:49.199 this hotel in the Leeds city center and then it 76 00:05:49.240 --> 00:05:53.959 was placed in the foyer and almost looked like this altar. 77 00:05:54.959 --> 00:05:59.680 And uh it was draped in this blue velvet shroud 78 00:06:00.199 --> 00:06:09.759 and it dorned with a cascade of white roses. There 79 00:06:09.839 --> 00:06:13.480 was a Royal Marine Honor Guard that was carrying the 80 00:06:13.480 --> 00:06:17.199 coffin around when it was transported and ultimately when it 81 00:06:17.240 --> 00:06:20.959 was interred. But there there was this endless procession of 82 00:06:21.000 --> 00:06:24.639 people coming by, you know, it was almost like I 83 00:06:24.680 --> 00:06:29.560 remember when I was a kid, when I uh, when 84 00:06:29.600 --> 00:06:34.319 Sharon Anko died and he was the last he was 85 00:06:34.360 --> 00:06:40.879 the last man interred in the Kremlin mausoleum, and there 86 00:06:40.920 --> 00:06:44.600 was this I remember they showed clips of it on 87 00:06:46.639 --> 00:06:48.920 on the new on the news, and there was this 88 00:06:49.040 --> 00:06:54.120 endless procession of Russians, you know, paying their respect. It 89 00:06:54.120 --> 00:07:01.160 almost reminded me of that, you know, and uh as 90 00:07:01.279 --> 00:07:05.120 uh the confidence to the cemetery, there was this there 91 00:07:05.160 --> 00:07:15.639 was this huge uh tear it in you know, the 92 00:07:15.680 --> 00:07:19.160 site where he was buried at it took up three plots. 93 00:07:19.920 --> 00:07:24.199 So there was this marble headstone that was basically three 94 00:07:24.279 --> 00:07:35.240 headstones soldered together or whatever, you know, befitting again ahead 95 00:07:35.240 --> 00:07:44.319 of state or something. And he uh savel and Saville 96 00:07:44.439 --> 00:07:46.800 was a Catholic. I mean, I I don't believe he 97 00:07:46.839 --> 00:07:51.360 had a belief in God. I mean, he he definitely 98 00:07:51.399 --> 00:07:53.279 works up strange guys. I don't I don't believe for 99 00:07:53.279 --> 00:07:58.199 a minute he was a Roman Catholic in any meaningful sense. 100 00:07:58.279 --> 00:08:00.800 But he made a big show of going to Mass, 101 00:08:00.800 --> 00:08:10.120 and the Roman Catholic cathedral where he'd been baptized, was 102 00:08:10.800 --> 00:08:17.839 where the service was held, and the bishop of leads. 103 00:08:19.000 --> 00:08:25.199 A Reverend Arthur Broke performed the service and made a 104 00:08:25.240 --> 00:08:29.920 big deal about several's good words and in order an 105 00:08:29.959 --> 00:08:36.720 exemplary person he was, and the requiem mass was attended 106 00:08:36.720 --> 00:08:41.039 by seven one hundred people. You know, when it just 107 00:08:41.080 --> 00:08:42.759 went on and on and on and on and on, 108 00:08:46.919 --> 00:08:49.519 you know, and uh again this this went on for 109 00:08:49.600 --> 00:08:55.000 three days, this sort of national mourning. Some mean, that's 110 00:08:55.159 --> 00:09:00.240 that's strange enough as it is, okay, And then you know, 111 00:09:00.399 --> 00:09:06.360 just weeks after Savile was buried, after this almost deranged 112 00:09:07.600 --> 00:09:15.720 imperial mourning for this man, all memory of him began 113 00:09:15.759 --> 00:09:19.440 to be ritually dismantled. You know, for the first time, 114 00:09:19.519 --> 00:09:24.159 it was openly reported that he'd raped dozens of women, 115 00:09:24.679 --> 00:09:31.679 he'd he'd assaulted dozens of little boys and girls, that 116 00:09:31.759 --> 00:09:35.639 he was engaged in necrophilia, that he was essentially a 117 00:09:35.679 --> 00:09:36.600 career criminal. 118 00:09:37.600 --> 00:09:43.720 He well, Thomas, if you could, I think it's relevant 119 00:09:43.879 --> 00:09:48.879 to mention why Savile was so prominent in British culture 120 00:09:48.919 --> 00:09:52.080 to begin with, sure before any of this darker information 121 00:09:52.200 --> 00:09:52.559 was known. 122 00:09:52.960 --> 00:09:55.519 Yeah, I'm kind of starting from this point because it 123 00:09:55.879 --> 00:09:59.639 I think it's it's illustrative. I'll get into Saville's early 124 00:09:59.720 --> 00:10:03.720 life and that's sort of a deep dive into that Savill. Basically, 125 00:10:04.240 --> 00:10:07.039 he was born in Leeds. He was other War generation. 126 00:10:07.279 --> 00:10:11.480 But and that's Savile's family. That's that's Jimmy uh On 127 00:10:11.519 --> 00:10:18.440 the uh second from left, the older boy is Vince 128 00:10:18.519 --> 00:10:22.840 Savill and uh he Vince Saville was something of a 129 00:10:22.840 --> 00:10:26.320 local war hero because he was trapped in Malta during 130 00:10:26.360 --> 00:10:29.639 the Siege of Malta in World War Two. So he 131 00:10:29.720 --> 00:10:32.919 came back and ultimately he put in something like thirty 132 00:10:33.000 --> 00:10:35.639 years in the Royal Navy. But he was a he 133 00:10:35.759 --> 00:10:37.919 was an evil son of a bitch too, and he 134 00:10:37.960 --> 00:10:42.320 was he was feared locally and a lot of people 135 00:10:42.399 --> 00:10:46.200 speculate that when Savile first started managing night clubs and things, 136 00:10:46.679 --> 00:10:49.240 Vince was the muscle behind it. And Vince was an 137 00:10:49.279 --> 00:10:55.240 avid uh sex offender too. He was a rapist, cal molester, 138 00:10:56.320 --> 00:11:00.159 just like his little brother. But Savil was the youngest 139 00:11:00.159 --> 00:11:07.080 of I think, uh yeah, he had he had seven 140 00:11:07.080 --> 00:11:11.200 of older brothers and sisters, so he came late in 141 00:11:11.240 --> 00:11:14.799 life to his parents. You know, he was sort of 142 00:11:14.840 --> 00:11:18.639 an accidental baby. He used to quip that he was 143 00:11:18.679 --> 00:11:22.799 a not again child. But he didn't get conscripted into 144 00:11:22.840 --> 00:11:27.000 the military. He got drafted h in the labor service 145 00:11:27.759 --> 00:11:31.559 and sent to work in a mine. And he made 146 00:11:31.600 --> 00:11:33.360 a big deal about this later, kind of trying to 147 00:11:33.360 --> 00:11:36.759 present him self as this sort of like working class hero, 148 00:11:37.240 --> 00:11:41.799 but that doesn't really tell the whole story. The Saviles, 149 00:11:41.879 --> 00:11:47.279 UH where they weren't at all wealthy, but they didn't 150 00:11:47.320 --> 00:11:52.360 live in poverty. Saville's father, he was essentially an unlicensed accountant, 151 00:11:52.360 --> 00:11:59.039 and he made book for a local gangster, you know, 152 00:11:59.360 --> 00:12:04.480 and UH that was part of Saddle's ingress and into 153 00:12:04.519 --> 00:12:07.960 how to hustle and you know, manage people and and 154 00:12:08.120 --> 00:12:16.159 sort of gray market activities and things. But Saddle sort 155 00:12:16.200 --> 00:12:22.159 of by accident of fate and convergence of circumstances sociological 156 00:12:22.159 --> 00:12:26.039 and historical, you know, the UK diminished as it was 157 00:12:26.799 --> 00:12:33.799 after the war. Britain, UH really was at the forefront 158 00:12:33.919 --> 00:12:36.679 of of kind of global pop culture before there was 159 00:12:36.720 --> 00:12:43.960 even such a thing, okay, and before even UH, radio 160 00:12:45.720 --> 00:12:48.480 was the medium by which new music was exposed to 161 00:12:48.519 --> 00:12:54.519 people and markets were created. Dancehall culture was a real thing, 162 00:12:54.879 --> 00:12:58.159 like the equivalent to here would be sock hops and 163 00:12:58.200 --> 00:13:03.559 stuff for the fifties. But Saville was one of the 164 00:13:03.559 --> 00:13:07.679 first guys who was able to finagle early access to 165 00:13:07.799 --> 00:13:14.200 newly released records, and he was one of the first 166 00:13:15.159 --> 00:13:19.279 professional DJs as we think of it, okay in the UK, 167 00:13:20.559 --> 00:13:24.279 and he had a good eye for what was gonna pop. 168 00:13:25.440 --> 00:13:30.519 So he developed a heavy rep as this DJ that 169 00:13:30.559 --> 00:13:32.879 people wanted to see because he was always gonna spin 170 00:13:33.039 --> 00:13:36.600 stuff that was fresh and that you hadn't heard before, 171 00:13:37.360 --> 00:13:42.559 and you know that was uh, you'd be the first 172 00:13:42.559 --> 00:13:50.120 to hear it, you know, and he had uh there 173 00:13:50.159 --> 00:13:53.080 was there was always a ton of girls at the 174 00:13:53.120 --> 00:13:57.559 clubs he managed, and uh, they had a reputation for 175 00:13:57.639 --> 00:14:03.159 having liquor that wasn't watered down. And like I said, 176 00:14:03.200 --> 00:14:06.600 people apparently were terrified of his brother events and some 177 00:14:06.720 --> 00:14:11.960 events's rappies who had and so would joke about like 178 00:14:12.039 --> 00:14:15.039 brutalizing people and like literally torturing them if they acted 179 00:14:15.159 --> 00:14:17.480 up in his night clothes. And that's nothing about Saddle. 180 00:14:17.639 --> 00:14:20.559 Like that's why I object to this notion of you know, 181 00:14:20.679 --> 00:14:22.960 this man hid his real nature from us, Like, no, 182 00:14:23.000 --> 00:14:29.720 he didn't. He'd joke about molesting girls. There's this awful 183 00:14:29.879 --> 00:14:32.440 footage of him, it's literally on an episode of Top 184 00:14:32.480 --> 00:14:35.840 of the Pops from the seventies he's obviously got his 185 00:14:35.919 --> 00:14:38.360 hand down this girl's pants since he's desperately trying to 186 00:14:38.399 --> 00:14:40.879 like fend him off, and he's like laughing about it 187 00:14:40.960 --> 00:14:43.639 while he's like going through the you know, the litany 188 00:14:43.720 --> 00:14:47.039 of of prompts and things. You know. It's like, yeah, 189 00:14:47.039 --> 00:14:51.399 everybody knew what this guy was about, you know, and 190 00:14:51.440 --> 00:14:56.720 that's what's so creepy about it, you know. And uh 191 00:14:57.360 --> 00:15:02.279 So when he died, like I said, it was it 192 00:15:02.360 --> 00:15:04.440 was like the Emperor had died or something. But then 193 00:15:04.480 --> 00:15:10.200 within weeks, you know, there's this equally sort of ritualistic 194 00:15:10.279 --> 00:15:15.159 condemnation of him, you know, in this endless reporting of 195 00:15:15.200 --> 00:15:20.399 his crimes, and witnesses are finally feeling safe to come forward. 196 00:15:20.639 --> 00:15:23.240 It's like people were terrified of this man even in death. 197 00:15:23.440 --> 00:15:26.440 It's like you weren't even sure if It's like he 198 00:15:26.519 --> 00:15:29.360 had to be dead for a few weeks before they 199 00:15:29.399 --> 00:15:34.440 could feel safe. And in discussing openly what he was, 200 00:15:36.399 --> 00:15:40.039 I can't think of a comparable phenomenon, you know, and 201 00:15:41.279 --> 00:15:44.200 what I've done, because this is a huge case, okay, 202 00:15:44.679 --> 00:15:53.679 that spans sixty years quite literally in broad strokes, I 203 00:15:53.679 --> 00:15:59.840 think I think that there's three major phases of Samuel 204 00:16:02.360 --> 00:16:13.559 Criminal acts what Saville did as he made the transition 205 00:16:13.759 --> 00:16:20.679 to television from radio because his dance all gig. One 206 00:16:20.679 --> 00:16:22.759 of the first real rock and roll stations in the 207 00:16:22.840 --> 00:16:30.159 UK was called Radio Luxembourg because it was based on 208 00:16:30.240 --> 00:16:37.159 the continent and like literally in Luxembourg and they'd play 209 00:16:37.240 --> 00:16:41.159 rock and roll records and Seville I mean just speaking honestly, 210 00:16:41.399 --> 00:16:44.639 when he was young, at least before his chain cigar 211 00:16:44.720 --> 00:16:46.960 smoking kind of ruined his voice, he had a really 212 00:16:46.960 --> 00:16:51.840 good radio voice. So being a dance all DJ, it 213 00:16:51.840 --> 00:16:55.799 was in demand, led to him getting a job with 214 00:16:55.919 --> 00:17:00.919 Radio Luxembourg, and from there he got he got a 215 00:17:01.000 --> 00:17:04.000 job as the MC of of this program Top of 216 00:17:04.039 --> 00:17:08.839 the Pops, which was kind of like a cross between 217 00:17:08.839 --> 00:17:17.000 American Bandstand and uh you know, uh one of those 218 00:17:18.000 --> 00:17:18.640 go ahead. 219 00:17:19.000 --> 00:17:22.160 Yeah, and not necessarily structure wise, but it's sort of 220 00:17:22.200 --> 00:17:24.920 a as far as I understand, sort of a pro 221 00:17:25.160 --> 00:17:27.839 proto MTV, where it was a huge taste maker and 222 00:17:27.920 --> 00:17:31.839 sort of a mark of having made it so for instance, 223 00:17:32.319 --> 00:17:35.759 and like I said, this was you know, bigger across 224 00:17:35.799 --> 00:17:38.480 the Atlantic than it was here. But if you go back, 225 00:17:39.119 --> 00:17:42.759 you know to all of your kind of classic you know, 226 00:17:43.119 --> 00:17:47.799 rock favorites. Oftentimes one of their early breakouts will be 227 00:17:48.160 --> 00:17:50.359 a Top of the Pops. So, for instance, there's a 228 00:17:50.759 --> 00:17:53.519 very famous recording of the Beatles. You know, there's some Zeppelin. 229 00:17:53.759 --> 00:17:59.039 Point is, as often these figures tend to do, he 230 00:17:59.119 --> 00:18:02.319 was in sort of a a gatekeeper role. I elude 231 00:18:02.359 --> 00:18:03.880 at that back to you, Thomas. 232 00:18:03.720 --> 00:18:05.920 Oh huge, yeah, and no, that's a good point. It 233 00:18:05.960 --> 00:18:08.160 was kind of like across the American bandstand and for 234 00:18:08.240 --> 00:18:11.920 the millennials, it was almost like total request live before 235 00:18:11.920 --> 00:18:14.799 there was TRL you know, and yeah, it was a 236 00:18:14.880 --> 00:18:20.039 huge deal. And yeah, Finn Lizzy did Top of the Pops, 237 00:18:20.200 --> 00:18:23.480 Iron Maiden did Top of the Pops. Everybody at the 238 00:18:23.480 --> 00:18:33.039 Top of the Pops slayed and yeah that's and it's uh. 239 00:18:33.279 --> 00:18:36.839 But as he made the transition, you know, to television, 240 00:18:36.880 --> 00:18:42.759 he became this, uh, this huge celebrity. And because he 241 00:18:42.839 --> 00:18:45.759 was so closely affiliated with the music industry in rock 242 00:18:45.799 --> 00:18:50.720 and roll, you know, he kids, especially be starstruck by him, 243 00:18:51.079 --> 00:18:53.640 you know, and which is understandable, you know, especially in 244 00:18:53.680 --> 00:18:59.680 those days. And there was the school called the Duncroft School, 245 00:19:00.319 --> 00:19:05.000 and this is this is bizarre, okay, but it was 246 00:19:05.119 --> 00:19:08.519 established as the school for troubled girls. It was kind 247 00:19:08.519 --> 00:19:12.400 of one part finishing school but also one part reform school. 248 00:19:13.559 --> 00:19:16.880 And the girls who were sent there was girls who 249 00:19:16.880 --> 00:19:21.319 were centered by their parents for you know, being just 250 00:19:21.400 --> 00:19:24.279 kind of angsty teenagers. There was girls who'd gotten caught 251 00:19:24.400 --> 00:19:27.359 up and in genuine crime, who had been ordered by 252 00:19:27.359 --> 00:19:34.960 the court. A very strange institution. But Savill simply started 253 00:19:35.000 --> 00:19:38.559 showing up there saying that, and he's telling the head 254 00:19:38.559 --> 00:19:41.680 and mistress, Oh, well, I get fan letters all the 255 00:19:41.720 --> 00:19:44.960 time from you know, the young ladies who attend this school, 256 00:19:46.240 --> 00:19:50.359 and this became one of his regular hunting grounds. He'd 257 00:19:50.359 --> 00:19:52.839 just show up there with a bunch of cigarettes and 258 00:19:54.759 --> 00:20:00.519 brand new records and cash, and he'd he load these 259 00:20:00.519 --> 00:20:02.759 girls into his jag or his rolls Royce and like 260 00:20:02.799 --> 00:20:06.640 take them off and have his weight with them, you know. 261 00:20:06.759 --> 00:20:11.319 And uh, but like think about this too. The alibi 262 00:20:11.359 --> 00:20:13.960 again is like, well, we thought Jimmy was odd, but 263 00:20:14.079 --> 00:20:15.880 we didn't think anything on tour it was happening. This 264 00:20:16.000 --> 00:20:19.559 is a fifty year old guy going to a girls' 265 00:20:19.599 --> 00:20:22.519 school and hang around fourteen fifteen year old girls and 266 00:20:22.559 --> 00:20:24.759 taking them off the premises, Like what do you think, 267 00:20:24.759 --> 00:20:26.519 what do you think he's doing with them, playing checkers, 268 00:20:27.559 --> 00:20:34.799 you know, advising them on on their career ambitions, you know. 269 00:20:36.119 --> 00:20:38.240 So that was kind of the first phase of his 270 00:20:38.480 --> 00:20:49.480 truly above board dedicated offending. What happened subsequent and this 271 00:20:49.640 --> 00:21:01.920 is really the most unbelievable. In nineteen eighty law enforcement 272 00:21:02.559 --> 00:21:09.839 had a mold taken of Saville's teeth, his bite because 273 00:21:09.880 --> 00:21:14.279 there was a serial killer who was known as the 274 00:21:15.400 --> 00:21:20.319 Yorkshire Ripper. He was convicted of killing thirteen women. His 275 00:21:20.400 --> 00:21:27.519 name was Peter Sutcliffe, and Saville was strongly enough suspected 276 00:21:27.599 --> 00:21:35.240 of being a Ripper suspect that, you know, he was 277 00:21:35.279 --> 00:21:40.119 actively investigated and his bike profile was compared to bite 278 00:21:40.119 --> 00:21:46.079 marks that were on the victims. So this man was 279 00:21:46.119 --> 00:21:53.039 a suspected serial killer. And yet somehow that didn't kill 280 00:21:53.079 --> 00:21:57.119 his career or anything. And then later when the Yorkshire 281 00:21:57.200 --> 00:22:04.519 Ripper was identified and apprehended, he uh Sadville started hanging 282 00:22:04.519 --> 00:22:08.920 around with him and saying he's a dear friend, you know, 283 00:22:09.079 --> 00:22:17.319 and and visiting him at the high security UH hospital 284 00:22:17.319 --> 00:22:20.680 for the criminally insane that he'd been committed to. I mean, 285 00:22:20.680 --> 00:22:23.680 think about that. That'd be like, like imagine, imagine Carson 286 00:22:23.759 --> 00:22:27.559 Dailey if he just started hanging around some some serial killer, 287 00:22:27.720 --> 00:22:30.839 I mean like that, and people have sort of acted like, oh, 288 00:22:30.880 --> 00:22:33.400 that's just that's just Carson being eccentric. He's odd. 289 00:22:34.359 --> 00:22:40.119 Imagine if famous, famous director Peter Jackson started hanging out 290 00:22:40.119 --> 00:22:42.680 with a guy who got out of jail for ritually 291 00:22:42.759 --> 00:22:43.680 killing three children. 292 00:22:43.839 --> 00:22:48.400 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, no fair point, yeah yeah, him 293 00:22:48.480 --> 00:22:54.319 him becoming buddies with them, with Damien Echols, who yeah, 294 00:22:54.400 --> 00:22:56.559 and Tay I think again, flying him out to his 295 00:22:56.759 --> 00:22:59.440 home and things. But yeah, I mean a pattern emerges here, 296 00:22:59.440 --> 00:23:04.559 and I'm gonna get into that next episode. But sort 297 00:23:04.599 --> 00:23:09.160 of the most sort of the zenith of savills organized 298 00:23:09.680 --> 00:23:18.000 offending Sable somehow insinued himself into the National Health Service, 299 00:23:18.920 --> 00:23:23.640 despite having having no medical background obviously or anything that 300 00:23:23.640 --> 00:23:30.720 would qualify him to be so situated. He uh became 301 00:23:30.759 --> 00:23:34.240 a volunteer porter at Stoke, Command of the Hospital, at 302 00:23:34.319 --> 00:23:39.240 Leeds General Hospital and at broad More Psychiatric Institute, and 303 00:23:39.519 --> 00:23:43.960 in nineteen eighty eight he was appointed director of what 304 00:23:44.079 --> 00:23:47.519 was called the broad More Task Force. That this is 305 00:23:47.559 --> 00:23:51.440 a disc jockey and he's being put in charge of 306 00:23:51.599 --> 00:24:00.119 this task force mandated with reforming the administrative and and 307 00:24:00.440 --> 00:24:04.640 treatment regiment of a psychiatric hospital, and he had full 308 00:24:04.759 --> 00:24:08.000 the four of the hospital. He had a room on premises, 309 00:24:08.640 --> 00:24:14.480 he had literally the keys to the entire building. And uh, 310 00:24:14.920 --> 00:24:20.240 it was at these hospitals that he committed dozens of 311 00:24:20.240 --> 00:24:27.480 assaults on the patients. And as became clear, one of 312 00:24:27.519 --> 00:24:32.599 his primary interests was access to the morgue. Saville was 313 00:24:32.680 --> 00:24:37.319 utterly obsessed with death and corpses. It was this ongoing fascination. 314 00:24:37.480 --> 00:24:42.519 And in is Uh there's this bizarre autobiography Saville wrote 315 00:24:42.559 --> 00:24:44.920 and you can tell that he wrote it. It wasn't 316 00:24:44.920 --> 00:24:49.359 a ghostwriter because it's written in this really strange colloquial dialect. 317 00:24:49.839 --> 00:24:54.880 It's a combination of of sort of like Northern English. Uh, 318 00:24:55.279 --> 00:25:00.160 you know, uh slang speak. It's got it's it's got 319 00:25:00.240 --> 00:25:04.000 unconventional grammar. Like it's clear he wrote it, Okay, and 320 00:25:04.279 --> 00:25:09.480 Uh he's talking about how his first job as a 321 00:25:09.519 --> 00:25:13.440 twelve or thirteen year old in Leeds was you know, 322 00:25:13.559 --> 00:25:16.599 basically sweeping up at this nursing home and how it 323 00:25:16.680 --> 00:25:19.519 was great because these these old people would die all 324 00:25:19.519 --> 00:25:21.359 the time, and before they got taken away, you know, 325 00:25:21.440 --> 00:25:23.640 you could go in and see them and as he 326 00:25:23.680 --> 00:25:29.799 put it, spend time with with these dead people and he, uh, 327 00:25:32.279 --> 00:25:40.440 he was engaging in necrophilia at these hospitals. And one 328 00:25:40.480 --> 00:25:43.759 of the a couple of the photos I sent you is, uh, 329 00:25:44.039 --> 00:25:49.000 you know, said I always wore these chunky rings and necklaces. Well, okay, yeah, 330 00:25:49.319 --> 00:25:52.559 that's a that's not an evil eye ring or something 331 00:25:52.759 --> 00:25:55.759 that's literally a glass eye that he he stole out 332 00:25:55.759 --> 00:25:59.200 of a course that he was molested. Okay, And yeah, 333 00:25:59.240 --> 00:26:04.720 that's another one. So this idea that Sevill, nobody knew 334 00:26:04.759 --> 00:26:07.599 this man was a monster. Okay. He's literally taking trophies 335 00:26:07.599 --> 00:26:11.119 from his victims, making them into jewelry and then flaunting 336 00:26:11.119 --> 00:26:16.640 them on on on national television. I that's about as 337 00:26:17.319 --> 00:26:23.440 flagrant as you can get, you know. And it's uh, 338 00:26:23.799 --> 00:26:32.000 it's that there's something to that beyond mirror. Uh you know, 339 00:26:32.039 --> 00:26:34.960 that there's something that beyond the mirror fetishism and exhibitionism 340 00:26:35.519 --> 00:26:39.200 that you know, some sort of sexual sadists and evil 341 00:26:39.400 --> 00:26:44.599 devian takes pleasure. And I believe and I'll get into 342 00:26:45.400 --> 00:26:47.359 the evidence for this as we get on with this 343 00:26:47.480 --> 00:26:52.000 sort of treatment of Sevil. You know, he very much 344 00:26:52.160 --> 00:26:55.319 was was an a cult practitioner, and I he thought 345 00:26:55.319 --> 00:26:57.680 he was deriving power from what he was doing to 346 00:26:57.720 --> 00:27:07.039 these people. And this this ritualistic uh abuse of the dead, 347 00:27:07.880 --> 00:27:11.839 as we've discussed in other capacities in this series, that 348 00:27:12.759 --> 00:27:22.839 very much partakes of a a commitment to transgressive acts 349 00:27:22.880 --> 00:27:29.160 as a way of of transcending ordinary psychological and moral 350 00:27:31.240 --> 00:27:39.240 barriers to uh, you know, human conduct that you know, 351 00:27:41.920 --> 00:27:46.000 suppose they confers power upon the adept. And this uh, 352 00:27:46.799 --> 00:27:48.640 this goes way back. You know, like I said, there 353 00:27:48.720 --> 00:27:53.559 was some of these dark and what we consider heretical 354 00:27:54.000 --> 00:27:59.160 and within our traditions, like there within Tibetan Buddhism, for example, 355 00:28:02.519 --> 00:28:06.599 there was people who worshiped death and terror gods. But 356 00:28:06.720 --> 00:28:10.839 also there are people who'd avail themselves to uh you know, 357 00:28:10.880 --> 00:28:14.759 not not just deprivations of the flesh, but you know, 358 00:28:15.000 --> 00:28:19.200 uh wallowing and filth and things to overcome their aversion 359 00:28:19.279 --> 00:28:23.680 to this kind of repellent and repulsive stimulus. Because by 360 00:28:23.720 --> 00:28:30.000 doing that, they were you know, overcoming human instincts that 361 00:28:30.000 --> 00:28:39.240 that that that tend to uh you know, preclude uh 362 00:28:39.839 --> 00:28:47.799 entire categories of conduct and and action. You know, this 363 00:28:47.839 --> 00:28:52.480 isn't uh something that will just peculiar to stab, but 364 00:28:52.519 --> 00:28:56.960 where I can just be chalked up to a discreete 365 00:28:57.319 --> 00:29:00.559 individuated fetish is what I'm getting at, you know, and 366 00:29:00.599 --> 00:29:04.880 if if you look at the entire pattern of conduct 367 00:29:04.960 --> 00:29:11.519 over a literal lifetime, I think this becomes fairly clear 368 00:29:11.640 --> 00:29:17.279 to anybody who knows what they're looking for in this case, 369 00:29:18.400 --> 00:29:29.599 in cases like it. But the uh and when I 370 00:29:29.640 --> 00:29:33.920 say it, really I'm jumping around a bit. But it's 371 00:29:35.799 --> 00:29:39.960 even as Saville sort of reached the end of his relevance, 372 00:29:40.359 --> 00:29:45.599 you know, Top of the Pops by the nineties, it uh, 373 00:29:48.000 --> 00:29:53.400 it wasn't It was no longer a weekly program. I 374 00:29:53.400 --> 00:29:57.599 mean not just because the traditional music charts had We're 375 00:29:57.640 --> 00:30:03.640 already losing relevance, but that that kind of that sort 376 00:30:03.680 --> 00:30:09.960 of format was becoming antiquated. I think the last Top 377 00:30:10.000 --> 00:30:12.839 of the Pops was some sort of Christmas special in 378 00:30:12.920 --> 00:30:18.359 two thousand and four, which Saville hosted. But you know, 379 00:30:18.440 --> 00:30:26.240 he remained uh, sort of that center of uh British 380 00:30:26.279 --> 00:30:30.559 media life because again he was constantly raising huge amounts 381 00:30:30.599 --> 00:30:34.799 of money for charity. And I don't think that's mysterious 382 00:30:34.799 --> 00:30:37.480 why he's doing that. Again, I found it a bit 383 00:30:38.759 --> 00:30:42.880 ridiculous that there's even a conversation about that. Obviously, that 384 00:30:42.880 --> 00:30:44.759 that kept him in the public eye. And there's all 385 00:30:44.839 --> 00:30:48.920 kinds of there's all kinds of ridiculous people who are, 386 00:30:49.119 --> 00:30:51.359 you know, contemptible in their own right, but not nearly 387 00:30:51.440 --> 00:30:54.200 the degree of savile, you know, who make a big 388 00:30:54.240 --> 00:30:56.880 show of, you know, you know, starting up some charity 389 00:30:56.920 --> 00:31:04.680 for you know, for a you know, a victim, mascots 390 00:31:04.759 --> 00:31:06.759 or for sick people or whatever. I mean, look look 391 00:31:06.880 --> 00:31:14.079 like that billan Wendy Gates Foundation. But famously Louis Threau, 392 00:31:14.319 --> 00:31:18.880 who in the nineties to the early two thousands, I've 393 00:31:18.880 --> 00:31:25.119 always found him to be a really smarmy, grotesque, uh individual. 394 00:31:25.400 --> 00:31:29.599 He reminds me of a he reminds me of a 395 00:31:29.680 --> 00:31:33.200 Robert Donney Junior's character in Natural Born Killers. You know, 396 00:31:33.200 --> 00:31:35.000 I mean, he's almost that ledge of a caricature and 397 00:31:35.039 --> 00:31:44.440 he he Uh. In two thousand, he did this uh 398 00:31:44.960 --> 00:31:47.920 special on on Jimmy Saville when his his sort of 399 00:31:47.960 --> 00:31:52.440 life and times, where Louis Threau spent a weekend with 400 00:31:52.519 --> 00:31:58.160 Saville and that will you know, travel to some gala event. 401 00:31:58.240 --> 00:32:02.240