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<v Speaker 1>Welcome back to The Path Went Chili for part two

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<v Speaker 1>of our series about the unsolved disappearance of Marie Blee. Robin,

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<v Speaker 1>do you want to catch everyone up on what we

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<v Speaker 1>talked about in our previous episode.

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<v Speaker 2>I sure will, but before I do that, I just

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<v Speaker 2>want to give a shout out to a nice little

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<v Speaker 2>website out there called feedspot dot com. They have recently

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<v Speaker 2>put up a list titled the top twenty family friendly

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<v Speaker 2>true crime podcast on the web, and they were nice

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<v Speaker 2>enough to put The Path Went Chili on there, and

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<v Speaker 2>they sent us all an email to let us know,

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<v Speaker 2>so we greatly appreciate that. I think this might be

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<v Speaker 2>the first time that The Path Went Chile made a

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<v Speaker 2>list on the internet. So, and it's nice that they

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<v Speaker 2>call us family friendly even though we're talking about gruesome

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<v Speaker 2>subject matter. But we still greatly appreciate it. So be

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<v Speaker 2>sure to check out their website feedspot dot com. So,

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<v Speaker 2>getting back to the Marie Blee case, This took place

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<v Speaker 2>in November of nineteen seventy nine in the town of Craig, Colorado.

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<v Speaker 2>A fifteen year old Marie Blee went to a party

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<v Speaker 2>and was accompanied by an eighteen year old friend from

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<v Speaker 2>high school. Named Monty Doolin, even though they were not

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<v Speaker 2>exactly a couple as far as I can tell. But

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<v Speaker 2>Marie never came home, and when her parents tried to

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<v Speaker 2>report her missing to the police, they just said that

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<v Speaker 2>she probably just ran away and return home eventually. But

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<v Speaker 2>then a few days later, Monty Doolan sent in a

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<v Speaker 2>fake ransom demand for five thousand dollars for her return,

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<v Speaker 2>and when he was caught, he eventually said, oh, I

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<v Speaker 2>just did that to give the parents hope that she

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<v Speaker 2>was still alive somewhere, but I don't actually know anything

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<v Speaker 2>about her disappearance. And of course he got charged with

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<v Speaker 2>a misdemeanor for the whole thing. And of course the

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<v Speaker 2>police didn't really they do much of an investigation for years.

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<v Speaker 2>They didn't really like to look at it seriously until

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<v Speaker 2>nineteen ninety nine, twenty years after the fact. And by

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<v Speaker 2>that point, when they tried reinterviewing a bunch of witnesses

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<v Speaker 2>who were at the party, they all kept giving like

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<v Speaker 2>conflicting stories about Marie's whereabouts because their memories were foggy,

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<v Speaker 2>so it's tough to determine the exact last time she

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<v Speaker 2>was confirmed to be alive, but multiple witnesses said that

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<v Speaker 2>she was last seen in the company of three men,

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<v Speaker 2>Monty Doolin and two friends of his name, max Abel

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<v Speaker 2>Garcia and Steven Skufka, And of course they've all denied

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<v Speaker 2>any involvement in her disappearance, but Monte Doulin and Steven

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<v Speaker 2>Skoffka had a history of troubles with the law. I

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<v Speaker 2>know that Monty was charged with attempting to sexually assault

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<v Speaker 2>another young girl a couple months before Marie's disappearance, and

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<v Speaker 2>Steven Skuffka got charged with a bunch of drug related

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<v Speaker 2>crimes and was pretty much told when he went to

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<v Speaker 2>prison that if you tell us what happened to Marie,

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<v Speaker 2>we will reduce your sentence, but he refused to say anything,

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<v Speaker 2>and he served his time and then died from a

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<v Speaker 2>fall down on the stairs after his release from prison.

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<v Speaker 2>So police have pretty much said that as long as

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<v Speaker 2>it wasn't murder, then if there were any charges related

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<v Speaker 2>to Maurice's disappearance, if her death was an accident or something,

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<v Speaker 2>the statute of limitations has expired, so if you come forward,

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<v Speaker 2>we will not press charges against you. But this has

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<v Speaker 2>not led to a resolution. Everyone has continued to remain silent,

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<v Speaker 2>and we have now almost reached the forty five year

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<v Speaker 2>anniversary of Marie's disappearance, and sadly, she is still a

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<v Speaker 2>missing person. So, as you probably know, I've covered a

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<v Speaker 2>number of cold cases from the nineteen sixties, seventies and

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<v Speaker 2>eighties involving missing teenagers, and whenever I researched them, it's

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<v Speaker 2>usually inevitable that I'll let out a huge sigh once

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<v Speaker 2>I learned that the police initially wrote off these victims

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<v Speaker 2>as runaways. We mentioned this on a respective podcasts several times,

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<v Speaker 2>but sadly, there was once a time when, unless direct

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<v Speaker 2>evidence existed that foul play had taken place, law enforcements

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<v Speaker 2>to fault attitude for a teenager or young person going

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<v Speaker 2>missing was that they ran away, thank you. Only this

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<v Speaker 2>attitude is not as prevalent today. But it's always heartbreaking

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<v Speaker 2>to look up a missing person's case from three or

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<v Speaker 2>four decades ago and realized that it could have been

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<v Speaker 2>solved relatively quickly if law enforcement had been on the ball,

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<v Speaker 2>and the Marie Blee case was a particularly egregious example

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<v Speaker 2>of this. We have a fifteen year old girl who

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<v Speaker 2>by all accounts was a model teenager, who was very

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<v Speaker 2>close to her family, but when she didn't come home

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<v Speaker 2>one night, the local police told her parents that she

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<v Speaker 2>probably just ran off and would return home shortly. But

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<v Speaker 2>of course that idea is completely shot down when the

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<v Speaker 2>Blee family received a ransom call from Marie two days later.

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<v Speaker 2>Even though the ransom demand turned out to be a hoax,

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<v Speaker 2>the fact that it was perpetrated by one of the

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<v Speaker 2>last people to see Marie alive should have been a

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<v Speaker 2>major red flag for investigators, but sadly it sounds like

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<v Speaker 2>they were much more concerned with red tape rather than

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<v Speaker 2>red legs, as the jurisdictional issues really hampered the investigation,

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<v Speaker 2>and it seems like no one wanted to take full

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<v Speaker 2>responsibility for handling the case. To be fair, of different

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<v Speaker 2>law enforcement agencies decided to form a jurisdictional task force

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<v Speaker 2>in nineteen ninety nine. They seemed to take the whole

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<v Speaker 2>thing very seriously and were quite dedicated about finding out

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<v Speaker 2>what happened to Marie. Given the circumstances, they probably did

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<v Speaker 2>the best job they could. But the big problem, of course,

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<v Speaker 2>was that twenty years had passed. This sounds like a

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<v Speaker 2>case we're interviewing key witnesses and investigating key suspects as

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<v Speaker 2>quickly as possible was crucial. It seems pretty obvious that

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<v Speaker 2>something happened at the party Marie attended which led to

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<v Speaker 2>her disappearance, but getting a couple dozen people to accurately

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<v Speaker 2>recall their memories of this event two decades after the

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<v Speaker 2>fact was a challenge, to say the least. If these

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<v Speaker 2>witnesses have been interviewed while their memories were still fresh,

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<v Speaker 2>there might have been a clearer pitchure of what took place.

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<v Speaker 3>When you exactly when you look at this idea that

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<v Speaker 3>at the time we know, the last person to really

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<v Speaker 3>be seen with her, he had picked her up for

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<v Speaker 3>a party, is the one who's making this ransom call.

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<v Speaker 3>And it's pretty clear that Marie goes to a party

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<v Speaker 3>where she's one of the younger attendees. There's well over

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<v Speaker 3>I believe they said one hundred people coming and going

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<v Speaker 3>from this trailer park area, and literally Marie's telling her friends,

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<v Speaker 3>go leave me, I'm gonna hang out here. If it

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<v Speaker 3>was my guess, she's a young girl with older people

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<v Speaker 3>who are doing adult things like drinking, doing drugs, and

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<v Speaker 3>she's feeling like she's validated important, she's getting attention from

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<v Speaker 3>older people, and so I would not be shocked if

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<v Speaker 3>one or all three of the suspects that have been

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<v Speaker 3>discussed were present at the time Marie was injured and

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<v Speaker 3>or killed and they all know exactly what happened but

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<v Speaker 3>aren't speaking.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, because all three of those guys who were a

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<v Speaker 2>couple years older than her, like she was fifteen and

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<v Speaker 2>they were around eighteen, nineteen years old, and she probably

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<v Speaker 2>thought that was cool at the time. I'm with these

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<v Speaker 2>older boys who were paying attention to me. But when

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<v Speaker 2>you couple with the fact that she had never been

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<v Speaker 2>at a party like this before and there was drug

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<v Speaker 2>use and alcohol loose than a use, then you can

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<v Speaker 2>see how things might have gotten horribly wrong.

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<v Speaker 1>When I was going through our first episode, I was

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<v Speaker 1>listening and Ashley said that Marie felt like similar to

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<v Speaker 1>what she said today validated and that she probably felt special.

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<v Speaker 1>And the way that she described it I think would

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<v Speaker 1>speak to most women that have been teenagers at some point,

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<v Speaker 1>Because when I listened to her say it when we

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<v Speaker 1>recorded it, it was different. But when I listened to it

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<v Speaker 1>after the fact, it really hit me in the gut

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<v Speaker 1>because she so succinctly and so perfectly summed up what

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<v Speaker 1>it felt like to be a teenage girl and to

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<v Speaker 1>be hanging out with these older guys, and how validating

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<v Speaker 1>it can seem. You do feel smart, you feel pretty,

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<v Speaker 1>you feel special, and it's probably exactly how Marie was feeling,

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<v Speaker 1>hanging out with these older guys, not knowing the danger

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<v Speaker 1>that lurked. So let's start from the beginning and try

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<v Speaker 1>to figure out a timeline. We know that Marie attended

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<v Speaker 1>a day that night with Monty Doolan, who subsequently drove

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<v Speaker 1>her to the party at the Shadow Mountain Village mobile

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<v Speaker 1>home park. What's interesting is that even though Monty has

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<v Speaker 1>been referred to as Marie's date in some accounts of

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<v Speaker 1>the story, it's not exactly clear what kind of relationship

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<v Speaker 1>they had. We do know that Monty was an eighteen

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<v Speaker 1>year old high school graduate and that Marie was three

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<v Speaker 1>years younger than him, though I don't get the impression

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<v Speaker 1>they were officially boyfriend and girlfriend. Would Their age difference

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<v Speaker 1>becomes a much bigger red flag when you learn about

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<v Speaker 1>some of the other crimes that Monty is alleged to

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<v Speaker 1>have done. So Monty's story is that he last saw

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<v Speaker 1>Marie at the party sometime between one point thirty and

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<v Speaker 1>two am, after she told him she was planning to

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<v Speaker 1>get a ride home with another guy whom she never identified.

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<v Speaker 1>Even if by chance, Monty is telling the truth, it

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<v Speaker 1>still doesn't reflect well on him since he was leaving

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<v Speaker 1>a fifteen year old girl alone at a party which

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<v Speaker 1>was mostly attended by older guys whom she did not know,

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<v Speaker 1>and there were supposed ample amounts of drugs and alcohol.

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<v Speaker 1>On the surface, it might also not reflect well on

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<v Speaker 1>Marie's female friends that they left her at the party

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<v Speaker 1>once they became uncomfortable, But in their defense, it sounds

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<v Speaker 1>like they did everything they could to convince her to

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<v Speaker 1>leave with them, but she just refused to go. Even

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<v Speaker 1>though it sounds like Marie was a good kid who

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<v Speaker 1>never caused her parents any trouble, even good kids will

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<v Speaker 1>sometimes decide that they want to rebel every once in

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<v Speaker 1>a while, so Marie may have decided that she wanted

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<v Speaker 1>to kick back and have fun at what was likely

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<v Speaker 1>her first grown up party.

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<v Speaker 3>Jules, like you said, I think we've all been there,

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<v Speaker 3>done that. I was a huge nerd and a great kid,

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<v Speaker 3>and I remember my friends been like going to a

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<v Speaker 3>place like a fraternity party or something like that, and

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<v Speaker 3>I didn't know anybody except my girlfriends that I went with,

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<v Speaker 3>and I remember distinctly saying, oh my gosh, so and

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<v Speaker 3>so is giving me attention, like seriously, you've got to go,

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<v Speaker 3>like let me be or they'll say, hey, Ash, we're leaving,

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<v Speaker 3>and I'll be like, I know, I'll get a ride home.

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<v Speaker 4>I'll get a ride home.

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<v Speaker 3>Because we quote know all these people even though I

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<v Speaker 3>don't know anybody, you know, they're all acquaintances somehow, and

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<v Speaker 3>it's so naive and in many ways ignorant, but I

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<v Speaker 3>simply just didn't know. At the time, I felt like

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<v Speaker 3>I was a grown up, I'm smart and aware of

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<v Speaker 3>my surroundings and made a really dumb decision and thank

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<v Speaker 3>god nothing happened. But I wasn't the only one of

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<v Speaker 3>my friends who did that. It was commonplace where we'd say,

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<v Speaker 3>come on, we're leaving, and someone would have a reason

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<v Speaker 3>why they didn't want to go with us. And so

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<v Speaker 3>you can only do so much. And I do have

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<v Speaker 3>an issue with the young man who drives her to

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<v Speaker 3>the party though, and Manty's saying, hey, I was responsible

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<v Speaker 3>enough to come pick her up.

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<v Speaker 4>But then this fifteen year old little girl.

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<v Speaker 3>I just have zero responsibility towards her later in the

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<v Speaker 3>evening and supposedly leaves and doesn't know what happened to her.

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<v Speaker 3>It just seems bizarre. But then he wants to implant

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<v Speaker 3>himself in the investigation. I can't stand his character in

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<v Speaker 3>this story. I would truly love to rewind time and

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<v Speaker 3>have them hone in on him more and investigate this

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<v Speaker 3>more at the time it occurred. Because so much time passed,

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<v Speaker 3>it just it's very difficult to get people's recollection back and.

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<v Speaker 4>People to come forward. It's just tough.

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<v Speaker 2>The story goes at the host of the party, Michael O'Brien,

215
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<v Speaker 2>was only planning to hold a small get together, but

216
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<v Speaker 2>everything spiled out of control once word spread and dozens

217
00:11:25.440 --> 00:11:29.000
<v Speaker 2>of other people decided to crash the event. O'Brien always

218
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<v Speaker 2>insisted that he only provided beer to the guests and

219
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<v Speaker 2>that he never saw any drugs, but other witnesses have

220
00:11:33.919 --> 00:11:36.879
<v Speaker 2>claimed there was drug usage there. But when you consider

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<v Speaker 2>that anywhere between fifty and one hundred people attended this party,

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<v Speaker 2>many of whom are likely high or intoxicated, it's easy

223
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<v Speaker 2>to see why investigators have had a difficult time constructing

224
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<v Speaker 2>a concrete narrative for all the events. There really is

225
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<v Speaker 2>no official last confirmed sighting of Marie that night. We've

226
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<v Speaker 2>got sightings of her at a convenience store, but it's

227
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<v Speaker 2>not clear if these sightings are accurate or at what

228
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<v Speaker 2>point during the night they supposedly took place, And there's

229
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<v Speaker 2>at least one siding of Marie at an entirely different

230
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<v Speaker 2>party I know. One of the most prominent theories is

231
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<v Speaker 2>that Marie succumbed to a drug overdose, but we can't

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<v Speaker 2>even be certain if Marie took drugs that night. While

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<v Speaker 2>she was allegedly seen doing drugs inside the bathroom of

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00:12:14.799 --> 00:12:18.000
<v Speaker 2>the mobile home, others insisted that she remained outside the

235
00:12:18.120 --> 00:12:21.159
<v Speaker 2>entire time she was there, But overall, it seems like

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<v Speaker 2>one consistent eyewitness account, which investigators seem to put a

237
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<v Speaker 2>lot of stock into, is that Marie left the party

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<v Speaker 2>with three men. This is a part of by the

239
00:12:29.840 --> 00:12:32.759
<v Speaker 2>fact that three specific men have been publicly named as

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<v Speaker 2>persons of interest.

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<v Speaker 3>Again, there's no way to know that without having her body,

242
00:12:37.559 --> 00:12:41.919
<v Speaker 3>without having concrete evidence of what occurred, Because Marie could

243
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<v Speaker 3>have been fifteen and naive and silly and used drugs

244
00:12:46.200 --> 00:12:48.919
<v Speaker 3>with these adults. Wanting to fit in. But she also

245
00:12:48.960 --> 00:12:50.720
<v Speaker 3>could have gone and said like, I'm just going to

246
00:12:50.799 --> 00:12:52.960
<v Speaker 3>be here. I'll have my faculties to me. I'm not

247
00:12:53.120 --> 00:12:55.440
<v Speaker 3>doing any of this stuff, so I'm not quote doing

248
00:12:55.480 --> 00:12:58.240
<v Speaker 3>anything bad, but I like the attention and I want

249
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<v Speaker 3>to be here with these people. And so we just

250
00:13:01.519 --> 00:13:05.279
<v Speaker 3>don't know if she did, you know, try drugs. But

251
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<v Speaker 3>if she did, keep in mind, this would, to our

252
00:13:08.840 --> 00:13:11.960
<v Speaker 3>best knowledge, be the first time she's done so. And

253
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<v Speaker 3>so is it possible that people took advantage of that

254
00:13:15.919 --> 00:13:19.080
<v Speaker 3>and knew, hey, that she's never done this almost a

255
00:13:19.240 --> 00:13:21.879
<v Speaker 3>joke of how much they could give her, or she

256
00:13:21.960 --> 00:13:24.679
<v Speaker 3>doesn't understand how much she's taken and she justs too much.

257
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<v Speaker 3>So it is possible that she easily overdosed with it

258
00:13:27.519 --> 00:13:31.440
<v Speaker 3>being her first time using. Also very possible she's sober

259
00:13:31.480 --> 00:13:33.559
<v Speaker 3>and decides to leave with these three guys who quote

260
00:13:33.559 --> 00:13:37.559
<v Speaker 3>care about her and they had other nefarious purposes in mind.

261
00:13:38.480 --> 00:13:40.679
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, given that she had a great reputation with her

262
00:13:40.720 --> 00:13:42.879
<v Speaker 2>parents and never cause them any trouble, I am willing

263
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<v Speaker 2>to wager that she had probably never done drugs before

264
00:13:45.559 --> 00:13:48.679
<v Speaker 2>that particular night, and if she did, she could have

265
00:13:48.759 --> 00:13:51.399
<v Speaker 2>had a bad reaction and wound up overdosing. But I

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00:13:51.399 --> 00:13:53.879
<v Speaker 2>think if that is what happened, that only a limited

267
00:13:53.919 --> 00:13:55.759
<v Speaker 2>amount of people knew about it, because I think that

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<v Speaker 2>if she had overdosed at the party in front of

269
00:13:58.279 --> 00:14:01.120
<v Speaker 2>fifty to one hundred people, that someone would have talked

270
00:14:01.120 --> 00:14:01.559
<v Speaker 2>by now.

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<v Speaker 1>Anyway, the three individuals who have been named as persons

272
00:14:07.440 --> 00:14:10.799
<v Speaker 1>of interest, which will come as absolutely no surprise to you, Ash,

273
00:14:11.120 --> 00:14:15.600
<v Speaker 1>are Monte Dulan, Steven Skufka, and max Abel Garcia. So

274
00:14:15.639 --> 00:14:18.360
<v Speaker 1>we know quite a bit about Doolan and Skufka's backgrounds,

275
00:14:18.399 --> 00:14:21.200
<v Speaker 1>but not much is known about Garcia, aside from the

276
00:14:21.240 --> 00:14:24.399
<v Speaker 1>fact that he eventually moved to Portland. It seems like

277
00:14:24.440 --> 00:14:28.320
<v Speaker 1>investigators don't necessarily believe Garcia had direct involvement in what

278
00:14:28.399 --> 00:14:31.399
<v Speaker 1>happened to Marie, but at the very least they suspect

279
00:14:31.440 --> 00:14:34.759
<v Speaker 1>that he knows something but hasn't talked. What we do

280
00:14:34.960 --> 00:14:37.519
<v Speaker 1>know is that both Doolan and Skufka had their fair

281
00:14:37.559 --> 00:14:40.480
<v Speaker 1>share of run ins with the law, and Skiffka's criminal

282
00:14:40.519 --> 00:14:45.480
<v Speaker 1>history is particularly extensive. What's particularly interesting is that Skufka

283
00:14:45.600 --> 00:14:48.919
<v Speaker 1>was facing a twelve year prison sentence for various offenses

284
00:14:49.360 --> 00:14:52.120
<v Speaker 1>and could have potentially shaved time off that sentence if

285
00:14:52.159 --> 00:14:55.879
<v Speaker 1>he'd been willing to cooperate with investigators and reveal everything

286
00:14:55.919 --> 00:14:59.759
<v Speaker 1>that he knew about Marie's disappearance, but Skufka didn't provide

287
00:14:59.799 --> 00:15:03.320
<v Speaker 1>them with any information and took the full sentence. Now

288
00:15:03.360 --> 00:15:06.360
<v Speaker 1>it's worth noting the police had stated that if Marie's

289
00:15:06.399 --> 00:15:09.879
<v Speaker 1>death was the result of an accidental drug overdose and

290
00:15:09.919 --> 00:15:12.919
<v Speaker 1>one or more individuals attempted to cover the whole thing

291
00:15:13.000 --> 00:15:15.399
<v Speaker 1>up by disposing of her body, then they would not

292
00:15:15.399 --> 00:15:18.519
<v Speaker 1>face prosecution for it, since over twenty years had passed

293
00:15:18.840 --> 00:15:22.399
<v Speaker 1>and the statute of limitations on those particular crimes had expired.

294
00:15:22.919 --> 00:15:26.159
<v Speaker 1>So if Skufka had admitted that Marie overdosed and he

295
00:15:26.200 --> 00:15:28.639
<v Speaker 1>played a role in covering it up, he would not

296
00:15:28.720 --> 00:15:31.720
<v Speaker 1>have received any additional jail time for his involvement, and

297
00:15:31.759 --> 00:15:33.960
<v Speaker 1>he probably would have had his sentence for his other

298
00:15:34.080 --> 00:15:38.279
<v Speaker 1>charges reduced. But since Gefka remained silent, that says to

299
00:15:38.320 --> 00:15:42.440
<v Speaker 1>me that either a he legitimately didn't know anything, or

300
00:15:42.600 --> 00:15:45.799
<v Speaker 1>b what he did know about Marie was so terrible

301
00:15:45.879 --> 00:15:48.240
<v Speaker 1>that he felt like serving twelve years in prison was

302
00:15:48.279 --> 00:15:52.120
<v Speaker 1>still a better option than coming clean. Of course, Skufka

303
00:15:52.120 --> 00:15:54.559
<v Speaker 1>had died of an accidental fall down the stairs a

304
00:15:54.559 --> 00:15:57.759
<v Speaker 1>few years after he was paroled, and his mother maintained

305
00:15:57.799 --> 00:16:00.600
<v Speaker 1>that even though he was not a perfect individual, he

306
00:16:00.679 --> 00:16:05.240
<v Speaker 1>was unfairly implicated in Marie's disappearance. She's always insisted that

307
00:16:05.279 --> 00:16:07.679
<v Speaker 1>her son came straight home from the dance that night

308
00:16:08.120 --> 00:16:11.240
<v Speaker 1>and never even attended the party. But of course it's

309
00:16:11.279 --> 00:16:14.279
<v Speaker 1>not unprecedented that parents might be willing to lie for

310
00:16:14.320 --> 00:16:17.600
<v Speaker 1>their children and give them a false alibi in order

311
00:16:17.639 --> 00:16:21.879
<v Speaker 1>to prevent them from potentially going to jail. In Skiffka's defense,

312
00:16:22.039 --> 00:16:24.759
<v Speaker 1>Michael O'Brien, the host of the party, also claimed that

313
00:16:24.759 --> 00:16:27.480
<v Speaker 1>Skifka was never there. But could he really be one

314
00:16:27.559 --> 00:16:31.159
<v Speaker 1>hundred percent certain? Remember, between fifteen and one hundred people

315
00:16:31.159 --> 00:16:34.720
<v Speaker 1>were in attendance, most of whom were uninvited, So could

316
00:16:34.759 --> 00:16:38.759
<v Speaker 1>O'Brien accurately recall who was or wasn't there. I know

317
00:16:38.840 --> 00:16:42.240
<v Speaker 1>that Skiffka allegedly made some comments to incriminate himself in

318
00:16:42.320 --> 00:16:45.960
<v Speaker 1>Marie's disappearance over the years, and other witnesses did recall

319
00:16:46.039 --> 00:16:49.080
<v Speaker 1>seeing them together at the party, So I'm not sure

320
00:16:49.440 --> 00:16:51.720
<v Speaker 1>Skefka would have been named as a person of interest

321
00:16:51.799 --> 00:16:55.200
<v Speaker 1>by law enforcement unless they were absolutely certain that he

322
00:16:55.279 --> 00:16:58.120
<v Speaker 1>was there. What is still not clear just how much

323
00:16:58.159 --> 00:17:02.440
<v Speaker 1>culpabilities Skufka and max Abel Garcia might have had in

324
00:17:02.480 --> 00:17:04.079
<v Speaker 1>regards to what happened to Marie.

325
00:17:05.079 --> 00:17:08.559
<v Speaker 3>Okay, was he actually responsible for her death? Maybe not.

326
00:17:08.960 --> 00:17:12.160
<v Speaker 3>He did have the party that night, and I don't

327
00:17:12.200 --> 00:17:16.000
<v Speaker 3>necessarily think he can truly be relying on for who

328
00:17:16.119 --> 00:17:18.799
<v Speaker 3>was at the party or not. Like you said, fifty

329
00:17:18.799 --> 00:17:21.759
<v Speaker 3>to one hundred people when he was expecting a small gathering,

330
00:17:22.119 --> 00:17:24.680
<v Speaker 3>There's no way he knows all of them. It's very

331
00:17:24.720 --> 00:17:27.920
<v Speaker 3>possible that a friend shows up with three acquaintances that

332
00:17:28.119 --> 00:17:31.039
<v Speaker 3>he has no idea their names or where they're from.

333
00:17:31.200 --> 00:17:33.720
<v Speaker 3>And so I think the party gets so large and

334
00:17:34.039 --> 00:17:37.400
<v Speaker 3>drugs and alcohol are present that there's just not an

335
00:17:37.440 --> 00:17:40.000
<v Speaker 3>opportunity to say I'm one hundred percent sure he was

336
00:17:40.000 --> 00:17:43.880
<v Speaker 3>not here, especially when you have other partygoers saying that

337
00:17:44.079 --> 00:17:47.640
<v Speaker 3>Marie was there, He was there, right, All these different

338
00:17:47.680 --> 00:17:49.799
<v Speaker 3>people were there. I just don't think that you can

339
00:17:50.799 --> 00:17:53.920
<v Speaker 3>trust the mother's statement. And I just don't think Michael

340
00:17:53.920 --> 00:17:55.880
<v Speaker 3>O'Brien can be confident of who was at his party.

341
00:17:56.000 --> 00:17:58.839
<v Speaker 1>Think of those high school parties like I can remember back,

342
00:17:59.000 --> 00:18:02.200
<v Speaker 1>and they're be parties where there would be a house,

343
00:18:02.319 --> 00:18:04.559
<v Speaker 1>and then it would extend to like a bonfire, and

344
00:18:04.599 --> 00:18:07.160
<v Speaker 1>it would be pitch dark outside, and there might be

345
00:18:07.160 --> 00:18:09.720
<v Speaker 1>between fifty and one hundred people. And if you would

346
00:18:09.759 --> 00:18:12.279
<v Speaker 1>have asked me the next day who was and wasn't there,

347
00:18:12.640 --> 00:18:17.200
<v Speaker 1>could I accurately report most of the people probably, But

348
00:18:17.400 --> 00:18:20.000
<v Speaker 1>all of them I don't think so. I think that

349
00:18:20.240 --> 00:18:23.000
<v Speaker 1>when you involve drugs and alcohol when it's dark and

350
00:18:23.039 --> 00:18:25.200
<v Speaker 1>when not all of the people can fit in the dwelling,

351
00:18:25.319 --> 00:18:27.559
<v Speaker 1>and we know that they can't because it's a trailer.

352
00:18:28.119 --> 00:18:31.079
<v Speaker 1>So I just think that O'Brien could have missed seeing

353
00:18:31.160 --> 00:18:34.920
<v Speaker 1>Skuffkap because other witnesses reported seeing him at the party

354
00:18:34.960 --> 00:18:37.359
<v Speaker 1>with Marie, and especially when it looks like we've got

355
00:18:37.480 --> 00:18:39.200
<v Speaker 1>multiple people reporting that correct.

356
00:18:39.279 --> 00:18:42.079
<v Speaker 2>Robin, Yes, definitely correct. A couple of people saw him

357
00:18:42.119 --> 00:18:45.319
<v Speaker 2>there and talking about the issues with his alibi and

358
00:18:45.359 --> 00:18:47.640
<v Speaker 2>how his mother said that he arrived home that night.

359
00:18:47.839 --> 00:18:50.160
<v Speaker 2>We talked in our last episode that Skuffka said that

360
00:18:50.200 --> 00:18:53.160
<v Speaker 2>he attended the dance with his sister, the same dance

361
00:18:53.200 --> 00:18:56.839
<v Speaker 2>that Monty and Marie had gone to, and Skuffka said, well,

362
00:18:56.880 --> 00:18:58.839
<v Speaker 2>it was boring, so we just decided to go home

363
00:18:58.880 --> 00:19:00.720
<v Speaker 2>and we spent the rest of the night there. But

364
00:19:00.799 --> 00:19:02.920
<v Speaker 2>we mentioned our last episode, that's kind of odd that

365
00:19:02.960 --> 00:19:05.319
<v Speaker 2>he would go to a dance with his sister, because

366
00:19:05.319 --> 00:19:08.480
<v Speaker 2>it's very uncommon for people who are teenagers in high

367
00:19:08.480 --> 00:19:12.240
<v Speaker 2>school to attend social events like dance with their siblings.

368
00:19:12.599 --> 00:19:14.799
<v Speaker 2>But his sister and his mother backed them up. But

369
00:19:14.920 --> 00:19:17.160
<v Speaker 2>can we really one hundred percent rely on them.

370
00:19:17.519 --> 00:19:19.920
<v Speaker 1>I would love some context as to why he went

371
00:19:19.960 --> 00:19:22.440
<v Speaker 1>with his sister, Like did his sister not have any

372
00:19:22.440 --> 00:19:24.119
<v Speaker 1>friends and the mom said, if you're going to go

373
00:19:24.160 --> 00:19:27.079
<v Speaker 1>to the dance, you have to bring your sister. Or

374
00:19:27.119 --> 00:19:30.039
<v Speaker 1>did he have no women or young women that were

375
00:19:30.039 --> 00:19:33.319
<v Speaker 1>interested in him and so he decided to go with

376
00:19:33.359 --> 00:19:38.160
<v Speaker 1>his sister. I just can't see an explanation. Just make

377
00:19:38.200 --> 00:19:39.160
<v Speaker 1>it make sense.

378
00:19:40.440 --> 00:19:43.079
<v Speaker 2>Now. Manty Doolan. On the other hand, where do we

379
00:19:43.119 --> 00:19:46.319
<v Speaker 2>start with this guy? Regardless of whether he is innocent

380
00:19:46.440 --> 00:19:48.839
<v Speaker 2>or guilty of what happened to Marie, he pretty much

381
00:19:48.880 --> 00:19:51.759
<v Speaker 2>flushed any sympathy away when he phoned up Paul and

382
00:19:51.799 --> 00:19:54.799
<v Speaker 2>moanably two days after their daughter went missing and made

383
00:19:54.799 --> 00:19:58.279
<v Speaker 2>a five thousand dollars ransom demand. Now, sadly, this is

384
00:19:58.319 --> 00:20:01.160
<v Speaker 2>not the only case I've seen which some cruel Hoaxter

385
00:20:01.359 --> 00:20:04.400
<v Speaker 2>contacted the family of a missing person and provided them

386
00:20:04.400 --> 00:20:07.240
<v Speaker 2>with a phony ransom demand. But these acts were usually

387
00:20:07.240 --> 00:20:09.480
<v Speaker 2>done by strangers who just wanted to make a quick

388
00:20:09.519 --> 00:20:13.000
<v Speaker 2>buck or a craving attention. But not only did Monty

389
00:20:13.079 --> 00:20:15.039
<v Speaker 2>Doolan go out on a date with the victim on

390
00:20:15.079 --> 00:20:17.160
<v Speaker 2>the night she went missing, but he took her to

391
00:20:17.200 --> 00:20:19.640
<v Speaker 2>the party where she disappeared from and was one of

392
00:20:19.680 --> 00:20:23.240
<v Speaker 2>the last known people to see her alive. Needless to say,

393
00:20:23.359 --> 00:20:25.839
<v Speaker 2>it's pretty unsettling that he would decide to toy with

394
00:20:25.920 --> 00:20:29.880
<v Speaker 2>Marie's family like that. When Monty was caught, his reasoning

395
00:20:29.920 --> 00:20:32.039
<v Speaker 2>was that he fabricated the whole thing in order to

396
00:20:32.039 --> 00:20:34.960
<v Speaker 2>give Marie's parents hope that she was still alive. But

397
00:20:35.079 --> 00:20:37.960
<v Speaker 2>that defies all logic, and I'm sure it was incredibly

398
00:20:38.000 --> 00:20:41.000
<v Speaker 2>stressful for Paul and Mona to believe their daughter had

399
00:20:41.039 --> 00:20:44.440
<v Speaker 2>been kidnapped, forcing them to put together five thousand dollars

400
00:20:44.480 --> 00:20:47.240
<v Speaker 2>in a short amount of time. I do can see

401
00:20:47.240 --> 00:20:50.000
<v Speaker 2>that Monty likely wasn't trying to extort the bleaze and

402
00:20:50.079 --> 00:20:53.480
<v Speaker 2>had no intention of collecting the five thousand dollars, but

403
00:20:53.559 --> 00:20:56.000
<v Speaker 2>I do suspect that he was making a deliberate attempt

404
00:20:56.000 --> 00:20:59.599
<v Speaker 2>at misdirection and wanted to lead everyone down the wrong trail.

405
00:21:00.559 --> 00:21:02.799
<v Speaker 2>Monty knew that the last place Marie had been seen

406
00:21:02.799 --> 00:21:05.359
<v Speaker 2>alive was at the party, and if he made everyone

407
00:21:05.400 --> 00:21:08.400
<v Speaker 2>believe that she was kidnapped for ransom, then he probably

408
00:21:08.400 --> 00:21:11.079
<v Speaker 2>hoped investigators wouldn't put too much focus on what might

409
00:21:11.119 --> 00:21:14.000
<v Speaker 2>have happened at the party. When you consider that the

410
00:21:14.000 --> 00:21:16.759
<v Speaker 2>local police initially wrote off Marie as a runaway and

411
00:21:16.799 --> 00:21:20.440
<v Speaker 2>had not even launched a proper missing person's investigation before

412
00:21:20.519 --> 00:21:23.519
<v Speaker 2>Monty made his phony ransom call, then it seems like

413
00:21:23.559 --> 00:21:26.279
<v Speaker 2>this was a desperation tactic on his part, and I

414
00:21:26.279 --> 00:21:28.839
<v Speaker 2>don't believe he would have attempted something like that unless

415
00:21:28.839 --> 00:21:31.640
<v Speaker 2>he had something he wanted to hide. But the big

416
00:21:31.720 --> 00:21:34.279
<v Speaker 2>question is was Manty trying to hide the fact that

417
00:21:34.319 --> 00:21:37.559
<v Speaker 2>Marie died of an accidental overdose or was it something

418
00:21:37.640 --> 00:21:38.319
<v Speaker 2>a lot worse.

419
00:21:39.440 --> 00:21:41.599
<v Speaker 3>Also, when you think about the idea that he says, hey,

420
00:21:41.640 --> 00:21:44.039
<v Speaker 3>I was doing it to give them hope, you're at

421
00:21:44.039 --> 00:21:46.920
<v Speaker 3>the jerk who took her to the party, so the

422
00:21:47.000 --> 00:21:50.799
<v Speaker 3>parents already placed responsibility in you. Why you would then

423
00:21:51.200 --> 00:21:55.839
<v Speaker 3>reinsert yourself into the situation. Wouldn't you want to kind

424
00:21:55.839 --> 00:21:59.039
<v Speaker 3>of disappear and back away like you're known to have

425
00:21:59.119 --> 00:22:00.000
<v Speaker 3>been with her that night.

426
00:22:00.119 --> 00:22:02.000
<v Speaker 4>You're known to have been seen with her.

427
00:22:02.240 --> 00:22:05.720
<v Speaker 3>And you were actually responsible for the young lady you

428
00:22:05.720 --> 00:22:08.440
<v Speaker 3>went and picked up and delivered to this party.

429
00:22:08.519 --> 00:22:11.880
<v Speaker 4>And so you would think he would be very.

430
00:22:11.759 --> 00:22:14.839
<v Speaker 3>Self aware of Oh my goodness, that really makes me

431
00:22:15.000 --> 00:22:16.240
<v Speaker 3>number one suspect.

432
00:22:16.680 --> 00:22:17.480
<v Speaker 4>I'm going to try to.

433
00:22:17.480 --> 00:22:21.519
<v Speaker 3>Just carefully back away. If he truly had nothing to

434
00:22:21.559 --> 00:22:24.000
<v Speaker 3>do with it. Now, if he had something to hide,

435
00:22:24.160 --> 00:22:27.480
<v Speaker 3>like you said, then trying to throw the police off

436
00:22:27.559 --> 00:22:31.359
<v Speaker 3>of his scent and say, hey, there's this crazy person

437
00:22:31.359 --> 00:22:35.279
<v Speaker 3>who wants money from the parents, that might make more sense.

438
00:22:35.440 --> 00:22:37.240
<v Speaker 3>I don't see him just doing it on a whim,

439
00:22:37.319 --> 00:22:39.720
<v Speaker 3>because if he has any sense at all, he knew

440
00:22:40.400 --> 00:22:41.720
<v Speaker 3>I'm already.

441
00:22:41.240 --> 00:22:42.480
<v Speaker 4>In the mix of suspects.

442
00:22:42.519 --> 00:22:45.720
<v Speaker 3>I've got to keep quiet, keep my head down, and

443
00:22:45.960 --> 00:22:48.599
<v Speaker 3>hope it passes because I didn't do anything. When you

444
00:22:48.640 --> 00:22:50.920
<v Speaker 3>have a guilty conscience, I feel like you continue to

445
00:22:50.960 --> 00:22:53.599
<v Speaker 3>try to cover for yourself and it makes it work.

446
00:22:53.960 --> 00:22:57.720
<v Speaker 1>Sounds like an incredibly impulsive choice made by somebody who

447
00:22:57.759 --> 00:23:00.319
<v Speaker 1>was hoping to benefit financially off of the c that

448
00:23:00.400 --> 00:23:01.400
<v Speaker 1>he likely committed.

449
00:23:02.799 --> 00:23:06.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, definitely, And I always wonder how this investigation would

450
00:23:06.079 --> 00:23:08.200
<v Speaker 2>have gone if he had not made that ransom call,

451
00:23:08.279 --> 00:23:10.720
<v Speaker 2>because the police weren't doing anything at first. They just

452
00:23:10.720 --> 00:23:13.480
<v Speaker 2>said Marie was a runaway and probably wouldn't have looked

453
00:23:13.519 --> 00:23:17.400
<v Speaker 2>into anything at all until this incident raised some red flags.

454
00:23:17.839 --> 00:23:20.000
<v Speaker 2>And if they had just interviewed Moni and he says, oh, yeah,

455
00:23:20.000 --> 00:23:22.200
<v Speaker 2>I was at the party and Marie was there, but

456
00:23:22.279 --> 00:23:24.039
<v Speaker 2>I left and she said she was going to get

457
00:23:24.039 --> 00:23:25.799
<v Speaker 2>a ride with someone else, and I don't know what

458
00:23:25.839 --> 00:23:28.440
<v Speaker 2>happened to her afterwards. Perhaps they might have looked at

459
00:23:28.519 --> 00:23:30.920
<v Speaker 2>him in an unflattering light because he left Marie there,

460
00:23:31.000 --> 00:23:33.279
<v Speaker 2>but they wouldn't have thought of him as a suspect.

461
00:23:33.559 --> 00:23:36.799
<v Speaker 2>But because he inserted himself into the investigation and toyed

462
00:23:36.799 --> 00:23:39.599
<v Speaker 2>with the family, that made him pretty much the number

463
00:23:39.599 --> 00:23:43.359
<v Speaker 2>one guy from the very outset and made everyone believe

464
00:23:43.359 --> 00:23:46.920
<v Speaker 2>from that point on he must know something about Marie's disappearance,

465
00:23:46.960 --> 00:23:48.519
<v Speaker 2>and he's trying to deflect.

466
00:23:49.599 --> 00:23:49.960
<v Speaker 4>Well.

467
00:23:50.119 --> 00:23:53.160
<v Speaker 1>Monty's connection to this case became a lot more troubling

468
00:23:53.400 --> 00:23:56.000
<v Speaker 1>when he was charged with first degree kidnapping in twenty

469
00:23:56.119 --> 00:24:00.000
<v Speaker 1>fifteen for allegedly luring another teenage girl into his vehicle

470
00:24:00.279 --> 00:24:04.920
<v Speaker 1>and sexually assaulting her in the year prior to Marie's disappearance. Yes,

471
00:24:05.000 --> 00:24:08.079
<v Speaker 1>the charge against Monty was eventually dropped, but it sounds

472
00:24:08.079 --> 00:24:10.839
<v Speaker 1>like this was due to a technicality, not because he

473
00:24:10.920 --> 00:24:14.319
<v Speaker 1>was proven innocent. For all we know, the alleged sexual

474
00:24:14.359 --> 00:24:17.359
<v Speaker 1>assault could have played out exactly as the victim described,

475
00:24:17.759 --> 00:24:21.640
<v Speaker 1>but because the statute of limitations had expired, Monty could

476
00:24:21.680 --> 00:24:24.799
<v Speaker 1>not actually be charged with sexual assault, and the best

477
00:24:24.880 --> 00:24:29.559
<v Speaker 1>investigators could hope for was a charge of first degree kidnapping. However,

478
00:24:29.640 --> 00:24:32.759
<v Speaker 1>if the victim did originally climb into Monty's vehicle of

479
00:24:32.759 --> 00:24:35.359
<v Speaker 1>her own free will and he let her go after

480
00:24:35.400 --> 00:24:38.160
<v Speaker 1>sexually assaulting her, then it would have been hard to

481
00:24:38.200 --> 00:24:41.240
<v Speaker 1>prove if his crime met the legal definition of kidnapping.

482
00:24:41.880 --> 00:24:44.680
<v Speaker 1>I think one of the main reasons that Colorado's fourteenth

483
00:24:44.720 --> 00:24:48.440
<v Speaker 1>Judicial District attempted to indict Dulan on this charge after

484
00:24:48.519 --> 00:24:51.559
<v Speaker 1>so many years is because they were hoping it might

485
00:24:51.599 --> 00:24:54.519
<v Speaker 1>help pave the way for uncovering his potential involvement in

486
00:24:54.599 --> 00:24:59.000
<v Speaker 1>Marie's disappearance. Since the Casey Gainston was dismissed, this never

487
00:24:59.039 --> 00:25:02.680
<v Speaker 1>came to fruition. But if the allegations against Monty in

488
00:25:02.720 --> 00:25:05.519
<v Speaker 1>the sexual assault case are true, then I can see

489
00:25:05.559 --> 00:25:09.079
<v Speaker 1>a similar situation unfolding with Marie. Perhaps Monty tried to

490
00:25:09.119 --> 00:25:12.119
<v Speaker 1>sexually assault her as well, but she fought back against

491
00:25:12.160 --> 00:25:14.920
<v Speaker 1>him and things escalated to the point where Marie wound

492
00:25:15.000 --> 00:25:18.319
<v Speaker 1>up being killed. We have learned that Monty served time

493
00:25:18.359 --> 00:25:21.680
<v Speaker 1>in jail for a completely different sexual assault, but we've

494
00:25:21.680 --> 00:25:25.319
<v Speaker 1>been unable to find any specific details about that particular case.

495
00:25:25.680 --> 00:25:28.599
<v Speaker 1>But this pattern of behavior does lend a disturbing amount

496
00:25:28.640 --> 00:25:31.079
<v Speaker 1>of credence to the idea that Monty could have killed

497
00:25:31.119 --> 00:25:34.880
<v Speaker 1>Marie because she resisted his attempts to assault her. When

498
00:25:34.960 --> 00:25:38.119
<v Speaker 1>you consider that Manti was eighteen and Marie was only fifteen,

499
00:25:38.480 --> 00:25:41.440
<v Speaker 1>and they were attending a wild party with drugs, alcohol,

500
00:25:41.480 --> 00:25:43.480
<v Speaker 1>and a lot of males who are older than her,

501
00:25:43.880 --> 00:25:45.680
<v Speaker 1>then you can see how this would have been a

502
00:25:45.680 --> 00:25:46.759
<v Speaker 1>recipe for disaster.

503
00:25:48.039 --> 00:25:50.599
<v Speaker 3>Absolutely, And you think about this idea of what if

504
00:25:50.640 --> 00:25:54.519
<v Speaker 3>he wasn't actually attempting to kill her, but he's sexually

505
00:25:54.559 --> 00:25:58.599
<v Speaker 3>assaulting her, and let's say, is strangling her because she's screaming,

506
00:25:58.680 --> 00:26:01.400
<v Speaker 3>or covers her mouth because she screaming, and he accidentally

507
00:26:01.440 --> 00:26:04.559
<v Speaker 3>suffocates her or hits her head against something because he's,

508
00:26:04.839 --> 00:26:08.240
<v Speaker 3>you know, being rough and trying to take advantage of her.

509
00:26:08.440 --> 00:26:11.400
<v Speaker 3>There's a million ways that a sexual assault could quickly

510
00:26:11.440 --> 00:26:15.359
<v Speaker 3>turn into a murder that was not pre planned, and

511
00:26:15.640 --> 00:26:19.599
<v Speaker 3>or there could be such a panic after the commission

512
00:26:19.599 --> 00:26:22.119
<v Speaker 3>of a sexual assault, there could be a purposeful murder

513
00:26:22.119 --> 00:26:25.119
<v Speaker 3>to cover it up. So there's multiple scenarios if he

514
00:26:25.279 --> 00:26:27.839
<v Speaker 3>was going in, especially like with the wolf pack mentality,

515
00:26:27.920 --> 00:26:31.720
<v Speaker 3>if all three men helped isolate Marie, there's a very

516
00:26:31.720 --> 00:26:35.720
<v Speaker 3>strong possibility that she was hurt during an attempted sexual

517
00:26:35.759 --> 00:26:39.039
<v Speaker 3>assault and then we have to kill her, or now

518
00:26:39.079 --> 00:26:40.960
<v Speaker 3>we have to kill her so that she won't talk.

519
00:26:41.359 --> 00:26:44.559
<v Speaker 3>A very very dangerous situation when you get to that

520
00:26:44.599 --> 00:26:47.400
<v Speaker 3>point and you realize, Okay, she's going to ruin my life,

521
00:26:47.519 --> 00:26:49.799
<v Speaker 3>or she's going to tell on me, or you know,

522
00:26:49.839 --> 00:26:51.440
<v Speaker 3>people are gonna know what happened.

523
00:26:51.920 --> 00:26:52.720
<v Speaker 4>A lot of times.

524
00:26:52.559 --> 00:26:55.319
<v Speaker 3>People will panic and you have this, you know, either

525
00:26:55.359 --> 00:26:58.519
<v Speaker 3>an incredibly brutal assault or a homicide. And I think

526
00:26:58.519 --> 00:27:01.680
<v Speaker 3>that's a very probable impossible for what could have happened here.

527
00:27:02.359 --> 00:27:04.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it definitely would make sense, particularly when you look

528
00:27:04.680 --> 00:27:07.680
<v Speaker 2>at his alleged previous assault, which took place about a

529
00:27:07.759 --> 00:27:10.759
<v Speaker 2>year earlier. I mean, in that particular case, he did

530
00:27:10.839 --> 00:27:14.119
<v Speaker 2>let his victim go even though she could have implicated him.

531
00:27:14.160 --> 00:27:17.079
<v Speaker 2>But I get the impression that she decided to stay

532
00:27:17.119 --> 00:27:19.680
<v Speaker 2>silent for many years and did not come forward until

533
00:27:19.720 --> 00:27:22.640
<v Speaker 2>decades after the fact, and that's why they arrested him

534
00:27:22.640 --> 00:27:25.279
<v Speaker 2>in twenty fifteen. So he may have thought that the

535
00:27:25.279 --> 00:27:27.559
<v Speaker 2>same thing would happen to Marie. But perhaps she said

536
00:27:27.599 --> 00:27:29.279
<v Speaker 2>I'm going to tell on you, I'm going to go

537
00:27:29.319 --> 00:27:32.000
<v Speaker 2>to the authorities, and that's when they decided that they

538
00:27:32.039 --> 00:27:33.519
<v Speaker 2>had to kill her. I mean, it might not have

539
00:27:33.559 --> 00:27:36.759
<v Speaker 2>been Monty's idea, but maybe one of his other two accomplices,

540
00:27:36.880 --> 00:27:40.640
<v Speaker 2>Skufa or Garcia, if they were involved, decided that it's

541
00:27:40.680 --> 00:27:42.440
<v Speaker 2>too much of a risk to let her go, and

542
00:27:42.480 --> 00:27:46.200
<v Speaker 2>that's why she wound up dead. Now, personally, I have

543
00:27:46.359 --> 00:27:49.680
<v Speaker 2>my doubts that Marie's actual death took place at the party,

544
00:27:49.960 --> 00:27:52.799
<v Speaker 2>as there were between fifty to one hundred people in attendance,

545
00:27:53.079 --> 00:27:54.880
<v Speaker 2>and I don't think that many people would have been

546
00:27:54.880 --> 00:27:58.119
<v Speaker 2>able to remain silent for over forty five years. But

547
00:27:58.160 --> 00:27:59.920
<v Speaker 2>I'm sure there might be quite a few people out

548
00:27:59.920 --> 00:28:02.440
<v Speaker 2>of that party who know or at least heard about

549
00:28:02.440 --> 00:28:05.000
<v Speaker 2>what happened to Marie, even if they did not personally

550
00:28:05.000 --> 00:28:08.200
<v Speaker 2>witness it. Remember a few months after she went missing,

551
00:28:08.519 --> 00:28:11.160
<v Speaker 2>the police received an anonymous phone call from a man

552
00:28:11.319 --> 00:28:14.000
<v Speaker 2>who claimed that at least eleven people, including his own

553
00:28:14.039 --> 00:28:17.119
<v Speaker 2>two children, knew the truth, but were too afraid to

554
00:28:17.119 --> 00:28:20.240
<v Speaker 2>come forward. But once again, I have a feeling that

555
00:28:20.279 --> 00:28:23.599
<v Speaker 2>only a small handful of individuals were actually present when

556
00:28:23.680 --> 00:28:27.240
<v Speaker 2>something happened to Marie. While there were so many contradictory

557
00:28:27.279 --> 00:28:29.599
<v Speaker 2>and jumbled statements from eye witnesses who were at the

558
00:28:29.640 --> 00:28:32.759
<v Speaker 2>party that night, investigators do seem to believe that one

559
00:28:32.759 --> 00:28:35.559
<v Speaker 2>of the most likely scenarios is that Marie left at

560
00:28:35.559 --> 00:28:40.240
<v Speaker 2>some point alongside the three primary persons of interest Monte Doolin,

561
00:28:40.440 --> 00:28:42.960
<v Speaker 2>Steven Skofka, and max Abel Garcia.

562
00:28:43.759 --> 00:28:44.440
<v Speaker 4>I believe the.

563
00:28:44.400 --> 00:28:48.000
<v Speaker 3>Most common situation that would have occurred here if all

564
00:28:48.079 --> 00:28:51.079
<v Speaker 3>three men are involved, is that they see Marie as

565
00:28:51.079 --> 00:28:54.599
<v Speaker 3>this vulnerable young girl, and they really do enact the

566
00:28:54.960 --> 00:28:58.960
<v Speaker 3>quote wolf pack action plan, which is, hey see that

567
00:28:59.000 --> 00:29:02.319
<v Speaker 3>girl over there, Wanner, y'all help me isolate her. So

568
00:29:02.359 --> 00:29:04.440
<v Speaker 3>they go over, they buddy buddy with her, they kind

569
00:29:04.440 --> 00:29:06.000
<v Speaker 3>of get her away from her friends, which we know

570
00:29:06.079 --> 00:29:08.960
<v Speaker 3>they successfully did because she tells her friends leave, I

571
00:29:09.039 --> 00:29:11.119
<v Speaker 3>have people I'm hanging out with I have a ride,

572
00:29:11.599 --> 00:29:14.559
<v Speaker 3>just leave. So they isolate her away, They make her

573
00:29:14.559 --> 00:29:18.880
<v Speaker 3>feel really special. They oftentimes, like you said, remove her

574
00:29:18.920 --> 00:29:21.640
<v Speaker 3>from other people being there. So maybe they get her

575
00:29:21.640 --> 00:29:23.400
<v Speaker 3>in a car, or they take her into the woods

576
00:29:23.440 --> 00:29:26.359
<v Speaker 3>or something like that, and then one or all of

577
00:29:26.400 --> 00:29:30.599
<v Speaker 3>them sexually assault her, and then it only takes one

578
00:29:30.640 --> 00:29:32.160
<v Speaker 3>of those people to panic for there to.

579
00:29:32.079 --> 00:29:32.640
<v Speaker 4>Be a murderer.

580
00:29:34.240 --> 00:29:37.359
<v Speaker 1>Again, if Marie's death was the result of an accidental

581
00:29:37.400 --> 00:29:40.039
<v Speaker 1>drug overdose, and the only thing those three men did

582
00:29:40.079 --> 00:29:42.759
<v Speaker 1>wrong was justpose of her body, then they were in

583
00:29:42.799 --> 00:29:45.720
<v Speaker 1>no danger of being prosecuted after a certain amount of

584
00:29:45.759 --> 00:29:49.319
<v Speaker 1>years because of the statute of limitation. Of course, some

585
00:29:49.319 --> 00:29:51.839
<v Speaker 1>people never want to admit that they were responsible for

586
00:29:51.920 --> 00:29:54.799
<v Speaker 1>something like that, even if they know they're unlikely to

587
00:29:54.839 --> 00:29:58.200
<v Speaker 1>receive any punishment. But I can't overlook the fact that

588
00:29:58.240 --> 00:30:01.039
<v Speaker 1>Steven Skufka had the opportunity need to make a deal

589
00:30:01.160 --> 00:30:04.319
<v Speaker 1>and shave time off a completely unrelated prison sentence in

590
00:30:04.400 --> 00:30:07.960
<v Speaker 1>exchange for sharing everything he knew, yet he still declined.

591
00:30:09.000 --> 00:30:11.680
<v Speaker 1>As you well know, there is no statute of limitations

592
00:30:11.680 --> 00:30:14.960
<v Speaker 1>on murder. So if Marie was the victim of a homicide,

593
00:30:15.039 --> 00:30:17.680
<v Speaker 1>then I can see why certain people have continued to

594
00:30:17.720 --> 00:30:20.759
<v Speaker 1>remain silent after all these years and might still be

595
00:30:20.799 --> 00:30:24.640
<v Speaker 1>afraid to come forward with information. My personal theory is

596
00:30:24.680 --> 00:30:27.920
<v Speaker 1>that Monty Dulan was likely responsible for Marie's death, and

597
00:30:28.000 --> 00:30:31.000
<v Speaker 1>that even if Stephen Skyfka and max Abo Garcia were

598
00:30:31.039 --> 00:30:34.799
<v Speaker 1>not directly involved, they at least know what happened and

599
00:30:34.880 --> 00:30:38.319
<v Speaker 1>assisted with the cover up. Since Skufka is now deceased,

600
00:30:38.480 --> 00:30:41.079
<v Speaker 1>the one thing which could still potentially break this case

601
00:30:41.119 --> 00:30:44.640
<v Speaker 1>wide open is if Garcia finally decides to talk and

602
00:30:44.720 --> 00:30:48.640
<v Speaker 1>reveal what he knows. In retrospect, given what we now know,

603
00:30:49.240 --> 00:30:51.960
<v Speaker 1>it seems like law enforcement could have potentially solved this

604
00:30:52.039 --> 00:30:55.440
<v Speaker 1>case within a week of Marie's disappearance, after Doulan was

605
00:30:55.519 --> 00:30:59.039
<v Speaker 1>arrested for his extortion attempt on the Blee family. If

606
00:30:59.079 --> 00:31:01.599
<v Speaker 1>law enforcement had put more pressure on Dulan or some

607
00:31:01.640 --> 00:31:04.319
<v Speaker 1>of the other people who attended the party, they might

608
00:31:04.359 --> 00:31:07.119
<v Speaker 1>have been able to uncover the truth. But because of

609
00:31:07.119 --> 00:31:09.680
<v Speaker 1>the different sheriff's offices seemed to be immersed in the

610
00:31:09.759 --> 00:31:13.319
<v Speaker 1>jurisdictional red tape at the time, this opportunity slipped through

611
00:31:13.319 --> 00:31:13.960
<v Speaker 1>their fingers.

612
00:31:15.119 --> 00:31:19.559
<v Speaker 3>Yep, it's politics and a lack of motivation. Again, at

613
00:31:19.559 --> 00:31:23.160
<v Speaker 3>the time, it was not uncommon for them to say,

614
00:31:23.359 --> 00:31:25.240
<v Speaker 3>she's a young kid who went to a party and

615
00:31:25.279 --> 00:31:28.759
<v Speaker 3>she didn't come home. That's clearly a girl who's being

616
00:31:28.839 --> 00:31:31.359
<v Speaker 3>young and silly and is going to be back home soon.

617
00:31:31.839 --> 00:31:32.039
<v Speaker 4>You know.

618
00:31:32.319 --> 00:31:35.319
<v Speaker 3>To their credit, that actually wasn't uncommon at the time.

619
00:31:35.400 --> 00:31:38.079
<v Speaker 3>Right People would hitchhike, people would do all kinds of things.

620
00:31:38.119 --> 00:31:42.960
<v Speaker 3>But Marie's family immediately said, something's wrong. She has never

621
00:31:43.000 --> 00:31:45.720
<v Speaker 3>been that kind of kid. We need your help, and

622
00:31:46.200 --> 00:31:49.440
<v Speaker 3>they just stuck to their you know, the traditional story

623
00:31:49.440 --> 00:31:51.720
<v Speaker 3>instead of saying, you know what, let's give them a

624
00:31:51.759 --> 00:31:53.680
<v Speaker 3>little bit of our resources and see what happened. Let's

625
00:31:53.680 --> 00:31:55.200
<v Speaker 3>go talk to the people that were at that party

626
00:31:55.240 --> 00:31:57.519
<v Speaker 3>and see did she leave with somebody.

627
00:31:57.480 --> 00:31:58.839
<v Speaker 4>And had they done that?

628
00:32:00.240 --> 00:32:02.720
<v Speaker 3>Like you said, Jules might have been very easily soft,

629
00:32:02.759 --> 00:32:06.400
<v Speaker 3>But unfortunately, you get one shot and if you do

630
00:32:06.599 --> 00:32:11.319
<v Speaker 3>not execute that opportunity, you lose your chance to really

631
00:32:11.319 --> 00:32:14.920
<v Speaker 3>get the most valuable information. What is really interesting in

632
00:32:14.960 --> 00:32:17.200
<v Speaker 3>this case is, like you said, there has been so

633
00:32:17.279 --> 00:32:20.759
<v Speaker 3>much time that passed that many people could come forward

634
00:32:20.759 --> 00:32:23.920
<v Speaker 3>and not get in trouble. But the moral weight and

635
00:32:23.960 --> 00:32:26.039
<v Speaker 3>the way that I guarantee you they feel like they'd

636
00:32:26.079 --> 00:32:29.279
<v Speaker 3>be publicly shamed for assisting in a cover up or

637
00:32:29.480 --> 00:32:32.880
<v Speaker 3>hiding a body or those kinds of things would almost

638
00:32:32.920 --> 00:32:35.519
<v Speaker 3>be as brutal is sitting through a murder trial, because

639
00:32:35.920 --> 00:32:38.880
<v Speaker 3>I think even though legally it's not as severe, if

640
00:32:38.920 --> 00:32:41.960
<v Speaker 3>you think about I helped bury a fifteen year old

641
00:32:41.960 --> 00:32:46.519
<v Speaker 3>little girl, my goodness, right, this is how many years later?

642
00:32:47.039 --> 00:32:47.640
<v Speaker 2>Forty five?

643
00:32:49.000 --> 00:32:50.160
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, forty five.

644
00:32:50.240 --> 00:32:52.240
<v Speaker 3>So these are individuals that might have been eighteen or

645
00:32:52.319 --> 00:32:55.519
<v Speaker 3>nineteen and high at the time or whatever, and now

646
00:32:55.759 --> 00:32:58.960
<v Speaker 3>they're in, you know, approaching sixty, their grandparents and all

647
00:32:59.079 --> 00:33:02.079
<v Speaker 3>kinds of things. So it'd be pretty intense to come

648
00:33:02.119 --> 00:33:04.200
<v Speaker 3>forward and say, oh, yeah, I actually helped bury her.

649
00:33:04.640 --> 00:33:06.519
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. We talked about this in our last episode. The

650
00:33:06.519 --> 00:33:11.119
<v Speaker 2>potential social stigma, and theoretically for someone like max Abel Garcia,

651
00:33:11.200 --> 00:33:13.680
<v Speaker 2>like he may not have directly killed Marie, he may

652
00:33:13.720 --> 00:33:16.400
<v Speaker 2>have just been present when her death took place and

653
00:33:16.400 --> 00:33:19.119
<v Speaker 2>assisted with the cover up. But even though he's probably

654
00:33:19.119 --> 00:33:21.759
<v Speaker 2>would not face any criminal chargers or spend any time

655
00:33:21.799 --> 00:33:24.920
<v Speaker 2>in prison for his involvement, he would probably be shunned

656
00:33:24.920 --> 00:33:27.960
<v Speaker 2>and like have serious damage done to his reputation because

657
00:33:28.039 --> 00:33:32.480
<v Speaker 2>unlike Monty Doulin and Steven Scuffka, who have extensive criminal histories.

658
00:33:32.519 --> 00:33:34.640
<v Speaker 2>I don't hear that about Garcia. All I know is

659
00:33:34.640 --> 00:33:36.559
<v Speaker 2>that he moved out of state and has been living

660
00:33:36.559 --> 00:33:39.279
<v Speaker 2>a normal life. And even though he's probably like in

661
00:33:39.279 --> 00:33:41.319
<v Speaker 2>his sixties now, I could see him not wanting to

662
00:33:41.400 --> 00:33:44.440
<v Speaker 2>uproot all that to finally come forward and to admit

663
00:33:44.480 --> 00:33:46.680
<v Speaker 2>his complicity in the death of a girl that took

664
00:33:46.720 --> 00:33:50.519
<v Speaker 2>place forty five years ago. Anyway, Paul and Mona Blee

665
00:33:50.559 --> 00:33:53.039
<v Speaker 2>have worked NonStop at keeping their daughter's case in the

666
00:33:53.079 --> 00:33:56.240
<v Speaker 2>spotlight and searching for answers these past four decades. But

667
00:33:56.279 --> 00:33:58.519
<v Speaker 2>they're both now in their eighties, and I'm not sure

668
00:33:58.559 --> 00:34:00.799
<v Speaker 2>how much time they have left to cover the truth.

669
00:34:01.599 --> 00:34:04.160
<v Speaker 2>I mentioned earlier that they are no longer interested in

670
00:34:04.200 --> 00:34:08.119
<v Speaker 2>seeking justice and putting the responsible party behind bars. They

671
00:34:08.199 --> 00:34:10.079
<v Speaker 2>just want to find out what happened to Marie and

672
00:34:10.119 --> 00:34:13.280
<v Speaker 2>bring a remains home. Sadly, this is far from the

673
00:34:13.320 --> 00:34:15.880
<v Speaker 2>only missing person's case in which I've heard of victim's

674
00:34:15.880 --> 00:34:19.000
<v Speaker 2>family say something like this, as the uncertainty of not

675
00:34:19.119 --> 00:34:21.639
<v Speaker 2>knowing what happened to your loved one is pure torture.

676
00:34:22.440 --> 00:34:25.039
<v Speaker 2>We've just passed the forty five year anniversary of Maurice's

677
00:34:25.079 --> 00:34:27.840
<v Speaker 2>disappearance and it still seems like there are people out

678
00:34:27.880 --> 00:34:30.400
<v Speaker 2>there who probably have the answers, and all it would

679
00:34:30.400 --> 00:34:32.440
<v Speaker 2>take to bring full closure to this case is for

680
00:34:32.480 --> 00:34:34.960
<v Speaker 2>them to come forward. So if you have been to

681
00:34:34.960 --> 00:34:38.480
<v Speaker 2>have any information about the unsolved disappearance of Marie Bleed,

682
00:34:38.880 --> 00:34:41.920
<v Speaker 2>please call the Route County Sheriff's Office at nine seven

683
00:34:42.039 --> 00:34:45.719
<v Speaker 2>zero eight seven nine one zero nine zero. That's nine

684
00:34:45.760 --> 00:34:50.559
<v Speaker 2>seven zero eight seven nine one zero nine zero, Jules Ashley.

685
00:34:50.719 --> 00:34:52.159
<v Speaker 2>Any final thoughts on this case.

686
00:34:53.239 --> 00:34:56.320
<v Speaker 3>It's pretty much the same final thoughts for all of

687
00:34:56.360 --> 00:34:58.559
<v Speaker 3>these where you sit back and you say, look at

688
00:34:58.559 --> 00:35:00.000
<v Speaker 3>who the champions are.

689
00:35:00.079 --> 00:35:04.239
<v Speaker 4>In this case, it's Paul and Mona Blee. They're in their.

690
00:35:04.159 --> 00:35:07.559
<v Speaker 3>Eighties, like you said, and they've continued to carry the

691
00:35:07.639 --> 00:35:09.599
<v Speaker 3>torch and advocate for their little girl.

692
00:35:09.960 --> 00:35:11.039
<v Speaker 4>They knew Marie.

693
00:35:10.719 --> 00:35:13.760
<v Speaker 3>Better than anyone else. She was fifteen, She did a

694
00:35:13.760 --> 00:35:16.039
<v Speaker 3>lot of fifteen year olds. Do they go out to

695
00:35:16.119 --> 00:35:19.800
<v Speaker 3>a party to be with quote friends. You trust that

696
00:35:19.800 --> 00:35:21.880
<v Speaker 3>the people there with are going to help get them

697
00:35:21.920 --> 00:35:26.199
<v Speaker 3>home safely, and Marie never came home. They knew the

698
00:35:26.199 --> 00:35:29.679
<v Speaker 3>moment that happened that something was wrong, and they have

699
00:35:29.719 --> 00:35:35.159
<v Speaker 3>spent forty five years continuing to advocate for just peace

700
00:35:35.199 --> 00:35:38.719
<v Speaker 3>of mind and having her remains back in their care.

701
00:35:39.440 --> 00:35:40.360
<v Speaker 4>That's pitiful.

702
00:35:40.760 --> 00:35:42.840
<v Speaker 3>And add on top of it what they went through,

703
00:35:43.239 --> 00:35:45.639
<v Speaker 3>not just with media coverage and things like that, but

704
00:35:45.760 --> 00:35:48.480
<v Speaker 3>this ransom call that they get a few days into

705
00:35:48.519 --> 00:35:52.360
<v Speaker 3>it and they desperately scramble to gather the five thousand dollars,

706
00:35:52.719 --> 00:35:55.199
<v Speaker 3>only to find out it's a hoax by someone who

707
00:35:55.239 --> 00:35:58.199
<v Speaker 3>calls himself one of her friends. There's a lot of

708
00:35:58.280 --> 00:36:01.119
<v Speaker 3>trauma at it on top of already your daughter disappearing.

709
00:36:02.119 --> 00:36:04.840
<v Speaker 3>For a parent to not know what happened, I would

710
00:36:04.880 --> 00:36:07.159
<v Speaker 3>need to have her body back, and I would need

711
00:36:07.239 --> 00:36:09.960
<v Speaker 3>answers because my imagination would get the best of me.

712
00:36:10.519 --> 00:36:15.239
<v Speaker 3>So my prayer would be these parents get those answers

713
00:36:15.920 --> 00:36:19.000
<v Speaker 3>before they pass away. And while they might not, I

714
00:36:19.000 --> 00:36:21.280
<v Speaker 3>have no doubt they'll be reunited with her in heaven

715
00:36:21.400 --> 00:36:21.960
<v Speaker 3>pretty soon.

716
00:36:22.880 --> 00:36:26.519
<v Speaker 1>I truly hope that Abel Garcia decides to come forward

717
00:36:26.599 --> 00:36:29.639
<v Speaker 1>sometime in the future to be able to give Paul

718
00:36:29.679 --> 00:36:33.000
<v Speaker 1>and Mona those answers about where Marie is. And I

719
00:36:33.239 --> 00:36:36.280
<v Speaker 1>just keep coming back to the fact that when given

720
00:36:36.320 --> 00:36:40.559
<v Speaker 1>the opportunity to share the information about Marie's death, and

721
00:36:40.880 --> 00:36:43.239
<v Speaker 1>you know, if it was an accident and they disposed

722
00:36:43.280 --> 00:36:45.960
<v Speaker 1>of the body. They likely would have had to have

723
00:36:46.239 --> 00:36:49.800
<v Speaker 1>let law enforcement to Marie's body. But there must have

724
00:36:49.880 --> 00:36:53.920
<v Speaker 1>been something about her body or her bones that made

725
00:36:53.920 --> 00:36:57.840
<v Speaker 1>Steven Skifka uncomfortable that may have pointed to murder and

726
00:36:57.920 --> 00:37:00.760
<v Speaker 1>not an accidental death, and they keep going back to that.

727
00:37:01.320 --> 00:37:03.440
<v Speaker 1>So I just don't think that it was an accident.

728
00:37:03.599 --> 00:37:06.440
<v Speaker 1>I don't think that it was an overdose. I think

729
00:37:06.480 --> 00:37:10.719
<v Speaker 1>that Ashley's explanation of this, like they basically whooked packed

730
00:37:10.719 --> 00:37:14.519
<v Speaker 1>her and Monty Doolan sounds like he was the ringleader,

731
00:37:14.559 --> 00:37:18.440
<v Speaker 1>but it sounds like Abel Garcia and Skiffka were responsible

732
00:37:18.480 --> 00:37:22.679
<v Speaker 1>as well, because I'm just amazed at how Skiffka took

733
00:37:22.760 --> 00:37:26.119
<v Speaker 1>that full sentence and didn't try to even lie and

734
00:37:26.239 --> 00:37:29.960
<v Speaker 1>say some kind of explanation for what happened it wasn't true,

735
00:37:30.039 --> 00:37:31.800
<v Speaker 1>just so he could get a lower sentence. He just

736
00:37:31.920 --> 00:37:32.559
<v Speaker 1>clammed up.

737
00:37:33.559 --> 00:37:35.719
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I totally agree with you here that I do

738
00:37:35.800 --> 00:37:38.400
<v Speaker 2>think that this was not an accident, and I think

739
00:37:38.400 --> 00:37:40.519
<v Speaker 2>that the truth of what did happen to Marie is

740
00:37:40.559 --> 00:37:44.000
<v Speaker 2>so horrible that it'll explain like why all the people

741
00:37:44.039 --> 00:37:47.159
<v Speaker 2>who are involved have stayed silent all that time, even though,

742
00:37:47.199 --> 00:37:50.079
<v Speaker 2>like you said, Steven Skiffka could have shaved time off

743
00:37:50.079 --> 00:37:53.000
<v Speaker 2>his prison sentence, But as you know, there's no statute

744
00:37:53.039 --> 00:37:55.199
<v Speaker 2>of limitations on murders, so I have a feeling that

745
00:37:55.239 --> 00:37:57.519
<v Speaker 2>if he had come clean, he probably never would have

746
00:37:57.559 --> 00:37:59.639
<v Speaker 2>gotten out of prison because what he did to Marie

747
00:37:59.760 --> 00:38:03.000
<v Speaker 2>was so horrible. But yeah, this is just a tragic case.

748
00:38:03.039 --> 00:38:05.519
<v Speaker 2>We've gone over how it could have been solved back

749
00:38:05.559 --> 00:38:08.119
<v Speaker 2>in nineteen seventy nine, if the police had been on

750
00:38:08.159 --> 00:38:10.679
<v Speaker 2>the ball from the very beginning, if they had pushed

751
00:38:10.719 --> 00:38:13.840
<v Speaker 2>Monty Dueling harder after he made the fake ransom call

752
00:38:14.159 --> 00:38:16.519
<v Speaker 2>and interviewed all the witnesses who were at the party,

753
00:38:16.559 --> 00:38:19.719
<v Speaker 2>whetherough memories were still fresh, and not waited twenty years

754
00:38:19.719 --> 00:38:22.320
<v Speaker 2>to do something, we may have had someone crack or

755
00:38:22.360 --> 00:38:24.559
<v Speaker 2>provide some piece of evidence or a key piece of

756
00:38:24.559 --> 00:38:28.320
<v Speaker 2>information that led to the recovery of Marie's remains and

757
00:38:28.360 --> 00:38:31.599
<v Speaker 2>the people who killed her being brought to justice. On

758
00:38:31.639 --> 00:38:34.480
<v Speaker 2>our last episode, I shared a story that shortly after

759
00:38:34.519 --> 00:38:37.400
<v Speaker 2>I released my Trail Went Cold episode about this case

760
00:38:37.440 --> 00:38:40.280
<v Speaker 2>six years ago, I went to crime con and these

761
00:38:40.320 --> 00:38:42.320
<v Speaker 2>people came up to my booth saying that they know

762
00:38:43.000 --> 00:38:45.480
<v Speaker 2>Paul and Mona Blee personally and said, they were such

763
00:38:45.559 --> 00:38:49.079
<v Speaker 2>nice people and have fought valiantly for so many years

764
00:38:49.119 --> 00:38:51.280
<v Speaker 2>trying to find answers about what happened to their daughter.

765
00:38:51.679 --> 00:38:54.280
<v Speaker 2>And there was even one incident where police were acting

766
00:38:54.360 --> 00:38:57.199
<v Speaker 2>on a tip that Marie's remains were buried in this

767
00:38:57.639 --> 00:39:00.559
<v Speaker 2>mine in this remote area, and they performed to search,

768
00:39:00.599 --> 00:39:03.079
<v Speaker 2>they found nothing, And it cost Paul to break down

769
00:39:03.159 --> 00:39:06.119
<v Speaker 2>and say, why isn't someone telling me what happened to

770
00:39:06.119 --> 00:39:09.199
<v Speaker 2>my little girl? Because, like we said, they don't even

771
00:39:09.239 --> 00:39:11.800
<v Speaker 2>care if the perpetrators go to prison after all this time,

772
00:39:11.840 --> 00:39:14.480
<v Speaker 2>they just want to recover their daughter's remains and give

773
00:39:14.519 --> 00:39:17.360
<v Speaker 2>her a proper burial. But because people have remained silent

774
00:39:17.480 --> 00:39:21.119
<v Speaker 2>and the original investigation was batched so much, that hasn't happened.

775
00:39:21.199 --> 00:39:23.519
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, the Bleaese are still here as far as

776
00:39:23.599 --> 00:39:25.840
<v Speaker 2>I know. They have not passed away yet, but I

777
00:39:25.840 --> 00:39:28.159
<v Speaker 2>do hope at some point before they leave, they can

778
00:39:28.199 --> 00:39:30.440
<v Speaker 2>finally get answers about what happened to their daughter.

779
00:39:32.159 --> 00:39:33.639
<v Speaker 5>Robin, do you want to tell us a little bit

780
00:39:33.639 --> 00:39:35.119
<v Speaker 5>about the Trail Went Cold Patreon?

781
00:39:35.880 --> 00:39:38.239
<v Speaker 2>Yes, the Trail Cold Patreon has been around for three

782
00:39:38.320 --> 00:39:42.039
<v Speaker 2>years now, and we offer these standard bonus features like

783
00:39:42.159 --> 00:39:45.519
<v Speaker 2>early ad free episodes, and I also send out stickers

784
00:39:45.559 --> 00:39:48.400
<v Speaker 2>and sign thank you cards to anyone who signs up

785
00:39:48.400 --> 00:39:51.039
<v Speaker 2>with us on Patreon if you join our five dollars

786
00:39:51.039 --> 00:39:55.119
<v Speaker 2>tier Tier two, we also offer monthly bonus episodes in

787
00:39:55.159 --> 00:39:58.280
<v Speaker 2>which I talk about cases which are not featured on

788
00:39:58.360 --> 00:40:01.159
<v Speaker 2>the Trail Went Cold's original feat so they're exclusive to

789
00:40:01.159 --> 00:40:04.360
<v Speaker 2>Patreon and if you join our highest tier tier three,

790
00:40:04.400 --> 00:40:07.079
<v Speaker 2>the ten dollars tier. One of the features we offer

791
00:40:07.360 --> 00:40:11.800
<v Speaker 2>is a audio commentary track over classic episodes of UNSAWD Mysteries,

792
00:40:12.039 --> 00:40:15.000
<v Speaker 2>where you can download an audio file and then boot

793
00:40:15.079 --> 00:40:18.280
<v Speaker 2>up the original Unsolved Mysteries episode on Amazon Prime or

794
00:40:18.320 --> 00:40:21.719
<v Speaker 2>YouTube and play it with my audio commentary playing in

795
00:40:21.760 --> 00:40:24.840
<v Speaker 2>the background, where I just provide trivia and factoids about

796
00:40:24.880 --> 00:40:28.320
<v Speaker 2>the cases featured in this episode. And incidentally, the very

797
00:40:28.360 --> 00:40:31.199
<v Speaker 2>first episode that I did a commentary track over was

798
00:40:31.199 --> 00:40:34.000
<v Speaker 2>the episode featuring this case. So if you want to

799
00:40:34.039 --> 00:40:36.760
<v Speaker 2>download a commentary track in which I make more smart

800
00:40:36.760 --> 00:40:39.800
<v Speaker 2>ass remarks about Jewel Kaylor, then be sure to join

801
00:40:39.880 --> 00:40:40.599
<v Speaker 2>Tier three.

802
00:40:40.800 --> 00:40:42.320
<v Speaker 5>So I want to let you know a little bit

803
00:40:42.320 --> 00:40:44.119
<v Speaker 5>about the Jeweles and Nashty Patreons.

804
00:40:44.199 --> 00:40:46.920
<v Speaker 6>So there's early ad free episodes of the Path Went

805
00:40:47.039 --> 00:40:49.840
<v Speaker 6>Chili we've got our Path Went Chili mini's, which are

806
00:40:50.079 --> 00:40:52.400
<v Speaker 6>always over an hour, so they're not very mini, but

807
00:40:52.400 --> 00:40:54.800
<v Speaker 6>they're just too short to turn into a series, and

808
00:40:54.840 --> 00:40:57.519
<v Speaker 6>we're really enjoying doing those, so we hope you'll check

809
00:40:57.559 --> 00:40:58.519
<v Speaker 6>out those patreons.

810
00:40:58.559 --> 00:41:00.199
<v Speaker 5>We'll link them in the show notes.

811
00:41:00.559 --> 00:41:02.480
<v Speaker 2>So I want to thank you all for listening, and

812
00:41:02.559 --> 00:41:04.960
<v Speaker 2>any chance you have to share us on social media

813
00:41:05.000 --> 00:41:08.000
<v Speaker 2>with a friend or to rate and review is greatly appreciated.

814
00:41:08.119 --> 00:41:11.360
<v Speaker 2>You can email us at the Pathwentchili at gmail dot com.

815
00:41:11.440 --> 00:41:14.079
<v Speaker 2>You can reach us on Twitter at the Pathwin. So

816
00:41:14.199 --> 00:41:16.760
<v Speaker 2>until next time, be sure to bundle up because cold

817
00:41:16.840 --> 00:41:19.320
<v Speaker 2>trails and chili pass call for warm clothing.

818
00:41:19.519 --> 00:41:22.679
<v Speaker 1>Music by Paul Rich from the podcast Cold Callers Comedy