WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.040 --> 00:00:02.960 And welcome to Cindy Stampo tough his nails on WBZ 2 00:00:03.799 --> 00:00:06.679 and I'm in studio tonight with Jesse Foster. 3 00:00:07.120 --> 00:00:08.000 Nice to have you again. 4 00:00:08.240 --> 00:00:08.919 Thanks for having me. 5 00:00:09.000 --> 00:00:11.919 Jesse's learning the ropes because Sammy's got a life besides 6 00:00:12.000 --> 00:00:16.000 just giving up every Saturday night to be on radio. 7 00:00:15.640 --> 00:00:18.480 And who's in the studio and you are? 8 00:00:18.679 --> 00:00:21.640 I'm maryon Ryan. The privilege of being the district Attorney 9 00:00:21.640 --> 00:00:22.640 in Middlesex County. 10 00:00:22.719 --> 00:00:24.559 What does that mean and how long you've been there? 11 00:00:25.039 --> 00:00:29.399 I have been the district attorney for twelve years, and 12 00:00:29.679 --> 00:00:32.640 it means that my primary mission is the protection of 13 00:00:32.640 --> 00:00:36.799 the public safety in Middlesex County and that comes primarily 14 00:00:36.880 --> 00:00:40.359 through the investigation and prosecution of cases. 15 00:00:40.840 --> 00:00:43.560 Has that been a hard job when you're from the 16 00:00:43.560 --> 00:00:46.039 best in the world, the best job in the world. 17 00:00:46.079 --> 00:00:47.759 I'll say the same thing about my job, but I 18 00:00:47.799 --> 00:00:49.840 will tell you I think it was hard for me 19 00:00:49.880 --> 00:00:50.479 at the beginning. 20 00:00:50.600 --> 00:00:51.840 Was it hard for you at the beginning? 21 00:00:51.920 --> 00:00:52.159 Yes? 22 00:00:52.439 --> 00:00:57.000 Yes, The learning curve is steep, and when I started 23 00:00:57.039 --> 00:01:00.799 doing this work, it was a very different world, I 24 00:01:00.840 --> 00:01:01.439 think for women. 25 00:01:01.960 --> 00:01:06.519 So you're saying here that when you first started it 26 00:01:06.599 --> 00:01:09.680 was tougher obviously, was it that you're a woman or 27 00:01:09.760 --> 00:01:12.040 you were just had to learn a lot more. 28 00:01:12.079 --> 00:01:16.079 There's a lot to learn, and there were many fewer 29 00:01:16.120 --> 00:01:17.760 women doing this work. 30 00:01:17.879 --> 00:01:20.400 So you come in, were you respected or you had 31 00:01:20.400 --> 00:01:20.879 to earn that? 32 00:01:21.120 --> 00:01:21.959 You had to earn that. 33 00:01:22.159 --> 00:01:24.599 I think, you know, anybody who's a trial lawyer has 34 00:01:24.640 --> 00:01:28.480 to earn that respect. And you've got to understand the 35 00:01:28.519 --> 00:01:31.079 seriousness of what you're doing. You know, the prosecutions we 36 00:01:31.200 --> 00:01:35.280 do can cause people to learn, lose their liberty, and 37 00:01:35.480 --> 00:01:38.680 be incarcerated. So you've got to be thinking all the 38 00:01:38.719 --> 00:01:40.239 time about the seriousness of that. 39 00:01:40.719 --> 00:01:42.519 Have you ever looked back in your career and said, 40 00:01:43.760 --> 00:01:46.319 or any deeds anybody that has stood in your position 41 00:01:46.439 --> 00:01:49.760 said maybe that person shouldn't have went to jail, or 42 00:01:49.799 --> 00:01:52.959 maybe that person should have went to jail, both vice 43 00:01:53.079 --> 00:01:53.680 versa or no. 44 00:01:54.159 --> 00:01:58.799 Well, I think, you know, we obviously subscribe to that 45 00:01:59.079 --> 00:02:02.519 view in this country that it is better that somebody 46 00:02:02.560 --> 00:02:05.079 who is guilty be found not guilty than that we 47 00:02:05.120 --> 00:02:08.039 get the wrong person and put them in jail. But 48 00:02:08.360 --> 00:02:12.599 I think one of the pieces to me is that 49 00:02:12.639 --> 00:02:16.159 we really understand that, like any other profession, we're fallible, 50 00:02:16.520 --> 00:02:19.520 and that's why the first thing that I did when 51 00:02:19.520 --> 00:02:22.599 I became DA was to create a conviction integrity unit 52 00:02:23.120 --> 00:02:26.639 so that if someone were saying I shouldn't be here, 53 00:02:26.759 --> 00:02:29.159 this is wrong, You've got it wrong, we had a 54 00:02:29.199 --> 00:02:30.400 way to be looking at that. 55 00:02:31.680 --> 00:02:35.639 Okay, oh that's a tough job. I like my job, 56 00:02:35.680 --> 00:02:37.960 and in your job, there's too much more stress in 57 00:02:38.000 --> 00:02:38.439 your job. 58 00:02:39.080 --> 00:02:41.520 Hey, we're all. All of us are good at different things. 59 00:02:41.759 --> 00:02:42.560 See my promise. 60 00:02:42.639 --> 00:02:45.240 I have too much empathy, Like I would feel bad 61 00:02:45.280 --> 00:02:47.120 for the person that killed the person, and I feel 62 00:02:47.159 --> 00:02:49.520 bad for the person that got killed, And why is 63 00:02:49.560 --> 00:02:51.719 that person so sick that they kill the person? 64 00:02:53.439 --> 00:02:56.159 All those people I know, these guides, and that's a 65 00:02:56.240 --> 00:02:57.840 balance we are always working on. 66 00:02:58.719 --> 00:03:02.000 We're eating kit Catcher, crime Junkies and all those crime 67 00:03:02.080 --> 00:03:04.520 shows like that is my number one favorite thing to watch. 68 00:03:04.879 --> 00:03:07.879 And then that's the other thing is mental illness out there, 69 00:03:07.879 --> 00:03:09.759 which is a lot right now, right. 70 00:03:09.639 --> 00:03:15.680 So mental illness and substance abuse are probably present in 71 00:03:15.719 --> 00:03:19.560 some combination in all cases eighty percent of the people that. 72 00:03:19.520 --> 00:03:22.080 Wow, that doesn't surprise me though. 73 00:03:22.319 --> 00:03:23.280 And what comes first? 74 00:03:23.360 --> 00:03:26.120 I always say that mental illness comes first and the 75 00:03:26.120 --> 00:03:31.560 addiction comes afterwards. That's my personal my personal beliefs being 76 00:03:31.599 --> 00:03:33.680 in construction for as long as I have and watching 77 00:03:33.719 --> 00:03:34.919 the epidemic of it in my. 78 00:03:34.919 --> 00:03:38.639 Business union non union. 79 00:03:39.319 --> 00:03:43.159 There's always an underlining problem before I see the guy 80 00:03:43.240 --> 00:03:47.120 move over to the painkillers and then to the opio, 81 00:03:47.240 --> 00:03:50.719 you know, to the and there was either he was shy, 82 00:03:50.800 --> 00:03:55.360 or he was not popular, or there's always a different story. Yeah, 83 00:03:55.439 --> 00:03:59.120 sexual molestation came out later on life, right. I seem 84 00:03:59.159 --> 00:04:00.879 to be like the mother to all the guys. They 85 00:04:00.879 --> 00:04:02.879 come tell me their stories, but not they're wise. I'm like, 86 00:04:03.680 --> 00:04:05.319 you need to tell you wife this. No, I can't 87 00:04:05.319 --> 00:04:05.919 tell my wife this. 88 00:04:05.960 --> 00:04:08.080 But because you're one of the guys, you know, they trust. 89 00:04:08.479 --> 00:04:11.240 I just, you know, I just I believe that eighty 90 00:04:11.280 --> 00:04:13.560 percent of the things bad people do is because they're 91 00:04:13.639 --> 00:04:15.319 under and then there's just a twenty percent. 92 00:04:15.360 --> 00:04:16.879 Then there's just bad people. 93 00:04:17.720 --> 00:04:20.959 They just do bad things because it's just Google crazy, right. 94 00:04:21.439 --> 00:04:24.560 I don't like Google crazy people. Those people just whatever. 95 00:04:24.959 --> 00:04:28.360 Some days, I'm okay. Jesse is in training on co hosting. 96 00:04:28.839 --> 00:04:32.519 I ask, I mean, I got the question. First of all, 97 00:04:32.560 --> 00:04:34.639 I have so many questions. I think your your job 98 00:04:34.720 --> 00:04:38.800 is so important and so interesting. What are the biggest 99 00:04:38.879 --> 00:04:41.959 challenges that you have that you face on daily or 100 00:04:42.040 --> 00:04:43.079 weekly basis. 101 00:04:43.480 --> 00:04:46.879 I'd say one of the biggest challenges right now is 102 00:04:47.439 --> 00:04:51.920 the lack of really effective available. 103 00:04:51.439 --> 00:04:52.360 Mental health treatment. 104 00:04:52.680 --> 00:04:57.120 Oh gosh, so even for people who have insurance, their 105 00:04:57.160 --> 00:05:00.480 ability to find a treatment that's going to be effective, 106 00:05:01.319 --> 00:05:04.279 be able to get into that treatment program when they 107 00:05:04.319 --> 00:05:08.000 need to go, right, you know, because when people see 108 00:05:08.040 --> 00:05:10.519 a moment when they're willing to do treatment. 109 00:05:10.160 --> 00:05:11.079 You've got to strike. 110 00:05:12.600 --> 00:05:16.000 And also because leaving people out of treatment can often 111 00:05:16.240 --> 00:05:18.360 put them in danger, put other people other nature. 112 00:05:18.439 --> 00:05:18.560 Right. 113 00:05:18.720 --> 00:05:22.480 Yeah, but again, we don't have enough people to run 114 00:05:22.519 --> 00:05:25.839 these treatment centers. How do we don't have enough psychiatrists? 115 00:05:26.000 --> 00:05:30.360 We don't have enough psychologists, and psychiatrists aren't getting into 116 00:05:30.399 --> 00:05:30.879 this field. 117 00:05:32.360 --> 00:05:33.800 They're not coming out of medical school. 118 00:05:33.839 --> 00:05:36.720 Do the statistics on how many people are becoming a 119 00:05:36.720 --> 00:05:38.839 psychiatrists think about that job. 120 00:05:38.879 --> 00:05:41.639 You're listening to. 121 00:05:40.519 --> 00:05:43.000 Other jobs that aren't like you know, you don't necessarily 122 00:05:43.079 --> 00:05:44.279 have to be like a psychiatrist. 123 00:05:44.439 --> 00:05:48.720 Or I think we have to think more in reimagining 124 00:05:48.759 --> 00:05:51.319 how that works. Because you know, even if we took 125 00:05:51.360 --> 00:05:55.519 people today and decided, Okay, these hundred people are willing 126 00:05:55.519 --> 00:05:58.360 to be psychiatrists, you're looking at you know, probably a 127 00:05:58.360 --> 00:06:01.480 seven eight year window right before they're ready. 128 00:06:01.240 --> 00:06:03.079 To do training. 129 00:06:03.240 --> 00:06:06.319 And it's anything in life though, any job, any career, 130 00:06:06.480 --> 00:06:08.120 you got to work towards it. But how do you 131 00:06:08.120 --> 00:06:10.720 get to that level being able to truly help these people. 132 00:06:10.439 --> 00:06:12.800 Through these Well in the meantime, you've got people right 133 00:06:12.839 --> 00:06:15.560 now who need help. Right we also have to be 134 00:06:16.519 --> 00:06:19.399 thoughtful enough about it. You don't want somebody who isn't 135 00:06:19.399 --> 00:06:23.480 really qualified in a spot because getting bad treatment is 136 00:06:23.560 --> 00:06:24.160 even worse. 137 00:06:24.399 --> 00:06:26.079 If I'm going to sit here and I'm going to 138 00:06:26.160 --> 00:06:28.160 talk to you as a psychiatrist, and I'm going to 139 00:06:28.199 --> 00:06:30.360 pay you four dollars an hour whatever you're going rate is, 140 00:06:30.839 --> 00:06:32.519 and you want to see me on zoom, I have 141 00:06:32.560 --> 00:06:35.319 a problem with that. I have a problem with that. 142 00:06:35.560 --> 00:06:38.319 You need to watch my mannerisms. You need to see 143 00:06:38.319 --> 00:06:41.639 if my leg is shaking? Am I doing this? Am 144 00:06:41.680 --> 00:06:42.680 I what am I doing? 145 00:06:43.240 --> 00:06:45.439 Like? You need to feel me. You gotta that. 146 00:06:45.839 --> 00:06:48.560 I don't understand how you can help people on zoom 147 00:06:48.639 --> 00:06:51.120 now once you know your patient, right, fine. 148 00:06:51.279 --> 00:06:52.639 I mean they're off that way. 149 00:06:53.120 --> 00:06:55.360 There is a balance because one of the things that 150 00:06:55.399 --> 00:06:59.800 we did see through COVID is I represent Middlesex which 151 00:06:59.839 --> 00:07:00.519 is large. 152 00:07:01.560 --> 00:07:02.600 There are parts of our. 153 00:07:02.480 --> 00:07:06.399 County that are incredibly rural where public transportation is not 154 00:07:06.439 --> 00:07:09.399 an option. And the other piece that we forget about 155 00:07:09.519 --> 00:07:14.000 is even when you have public transportation, it's expensive, especially 156 00:07:14.040 --> 00:07:15.759 sometimes if you've got to take a couple of kids 157 00:07:15.759 --> 00:07:17.360 with you, or you got to do some you know. 158 00:07:17.759 --> 00:07:22.040 So I had many people who were able to get 159 00:07:22.079 --> 00:07:27.879 treatment during COVID who weren't able to get to treatment before, 160 00:07:28.439 --> 00:07:30.240 and that became an honest I can't. 161 00:07:30.079 --> 00:07:33.279 Believe this has become part of your job. This has 162 00:07:33.399 --> 00:07:36.680 changed drastically when I look at this. You guys are 163 00:07:36.720 --> 00:07:41.319 taking and recovery. You're teaching kids how to go into trades, 164 00:07:41.439 --> 00:07:44.120 the building trades of New England. What's that all about? 165 00:07:44.160 --> 00:07:46.920 What are you doing what I've been doing the last 166 00:07:46.920 --> 00:07:50.720 fourteen years, trying to get kids into the trades, teaching 167 00:07:50.759 --> 00:07:53.680 that plumbers, electricians and HVAC guys make more money than 168 00:07:53.720 --> 00:07:56.160 the average doctor, average lawyer, average accountant. 169 00:07:56.680 --> 00:08:00.279 You know. The trades are fourteen They're an interesting. 170 00:08:00.240 --> 00:08:04.360 Peace because they are very forgiving for somebody who's had 171 00:08:04.439 --> 00:08:07.759 some difficulties, maybe has some a prior record. 172 00:08:07.879 --> 00:08:09.720 The trades are one place that's. 173 00:08:09.639 --> 00:08:12.360 Very forgiving, for sure, correct to give them a job 174 00:08:12.399 --> 00:08:15.839 where they can make good money, they can get benefits. 175 00:08:15.959 --> 00:08:19.040 If they need treatment, they can be doing that. It 176 00:08:19.160 --> 00:08:22.279 is also a place where we have seen the number 177 00:08:22.319 --> 00:08:26.720 of people who suffer from opioid misuse or an overdose 178 00:08:26.920 --> 00:08:27.680 is very high. 179 00:08:28.199 --> 00:08:29.519 Of the people. 180 00:08:29.240 --> 00:08:33.799 Between the ages of sixteen and sixty five who suffer 181 00:08:33.840 --> 00:08:38.600 a fatal overdose, one sixth of them have been in 182 00:08:38.679 --> 00:08:40.879 the trades, you know, for lots of reasons. 183 00:08:41.240 --> 00:08:43.000 Pay that thought for me was going to break. I'm 184 00:08:43.000 --> 00:08:43.679 Cindy Snowpoint. 185 00:08:43.679 --> 00:08:45.799 You listen to tapes Nails on WBZ, would be right 186 00:08:45.840 --> 00:08:48.440 back and welcome back to tapest Nails on WBZ, and 187 00:08:48.480 --> 00:08:51.559 I'm here with Jesse Foster. 188 00:08:51.360 --> 00:08:55.879 And Marion Ryan. That is the what the Middlesex district attorney. 189 00:08:56.240 --> 00:08:59.559 You think people dislike people that are district attorneys when 190 00:08:59.559 --> 00:09:01.960 they hear that. That's when I asked you, I'm going 191 00:09:01.960 --> 00:09:04.519 off by ninety five for a second here, I think like. 192 00:09:04.480 --> 00:09:07.120 Oh my god, she's just a whole journey. Yikes. 193 00:09:07.120 --> 00:09:09.679 Really meets us in a happy moment. 194 00:09:10.080 --> 00:09:12.879 Either something bad has happened to them, something bad has 195 00:09:12.879 --> 00:09:16.159 happened to somebody in their family. They've witnessed something and 196 00:09:16.200 --> 00:09:18.759 now we're trying to get them to be willing to 197 00:09:18.799 --> 00:09:22.039 cooperate with us, or somebody they love is accused of 198 00:09:22.039 --> 00:09:23.679 a crime, and I think. 199 00:09:23.639 --> 00:09:25.000 That, I'm so happy I've got to meet you in 200 00:09:25.039 --> 00:09:25.639 all good terms. 201 00:09:25.960 --> 00:09:28.120 That piece doesn't even know it's coming down the road. 202 00:09:28.159 --> 00:09:30.039 But right now, all the other things we do. 203 00:09:30.360 --> 00:09:32.000 Okay, so get it. 204 00:09:32.039 --> 00:09:34.600 You're saying one six of the people in my business 205 00:09:35.240 --> 00:09:37.519 are in drugs, opioids, whatever it is. 206 00:09:37.600 --> 00:09:38.039 Alcohol. 207 00:09:38.159 --> 00:09:38.679 That's a lot. 208 00:09:38.960 --> 00:09:42.720 If you could wave a magic one, no more alcohol, 209 00:09:43.440 --> 00:09:46.360 no more drugs, would you do that? 210 00:09:47.960 --> 00:09:52.919 I think there's you know, everybody, no, look at drugs, right. 211 00:09:53.519 --> 00:09:56.799 The same drugs that people use, these opioids, for instance, 212 00:09:57.679 --> 00:10:02.440 also do amazing things for people when they use properly, 213 00:10:02.600 --> 00:10:05.360 like what you know they use for the treatment of 214 00:10:05.440 --> 00:10:06.879 chronic pain, for instance. 215 00:10:06.919 --> 00:10:09.000 Sometimes they make life bearable for people. 216 00:10:10.159 --> 00:10:12.759 How long as you think you could take those before 217 00:10:12.879 --> 00:10:15.080 you are now stuck on them. 218 00:10:15.000 --> 00:10:15.440 I don't know. 219 00:10:15.519 --> 00:10:19.519 I think it depends on the person, the dosage, the problem, 220 00:10:19.679 --> 00:10:20.799 how well you monitor. 221 00:10:20.919 --> 00:10:23.720 They say two weeks you can become addicted to any pain. 222 00:10:23.799 --> 00:10:26.919 Oh, you can certainly become addicted, And it depends, but 223 00:10:27.480 --> 00:10:30.559 that assumes a success. 224 00:10:30.600 --> 00:10:32.360 I get pain in my seat. I could take a 225 00:10:32.360 --> 00:10:34.399 pain call. I'm gonna take three, and I'm gonna take 226 00:10:34.399 --> 00:10:37.519 three advalle. I'm gonna keep taking three advil blow my stomach. 227 00:10:38.200 --> 00:10:39.600 But I've never had a drink in my life. 228 00:10:39.639 --> 00:10:41.960 You've never You don't have an addictive personality like for me, 229 00:10:42.039 --> 00:10:44.039 for instance, I fell and hit my back like we 230 00:10:44.080 --> 00:10:47.679 do have in my family, like slight addictive personalities like 231 00:10:48.279 --> 00:10:50.960 I probably wouldn't even take that medication in fear of 232 00:10:51.000 --> 00:10:56.360 like I might like depend on this, I might say. 233 00:10:56.559 --> 00:10:59.159 I always said to my kids, if you never try it, 234 00:10:59.519 --> 00:11:02.159 you'll never know if you like it. If you try 235 00:11:02.200 --> 00:11:05.960 it one day, it's fun time, prior time, and then 236 00:11:06.120 --> 00:11:09.440 it's it owns you. Yeah, so if you never try it. 237 00:11:09.480 --> 00:11:11.080 So I never drank. I never had to drink marian 238 00:11:11.159 --> 00:11:13.919 because I was afraid. I worked in my father's nightclub. 239 00:11:13.919 --> 00:11:16.279 I was like, oh boy, these girls are making fools 240 00:11:16.279 --> 00:11:18.799 of themselves. I don't want to coming up to the bar. 241 00:11:19.039 --> 00:11:20.879 I'm seventeen. We could serve of liqu back that at 242 00:11:20.919 --> 00:11:23.399 sixty and a half, go home with that guy lesson 243 00:11:23.480 --> 00:11:25.960 you don't remember, like, Okay, this is something I don't 244 00:11:25.960 --> 00:11:26.399 want to do. 245 00:11:26.879 --> 00:11:29.480 That was my choice right. It made an impact on me. 246 00:11:29.559 --> 00:11:33.440 But to see that you guys are doing so much 247 00:11:33.480 --> 00:11:36.960 to help the community, it's wonderful, Well you have to 248 00:11:37.039 --> 00:11:40.639 do this is just mind blowing to me. I never 249 00:11:40.720 --> 00:11:43.759 realized that you guys are doing all of this work. 250 00:11:44.320 --> 00:11:49.320 It's really my hope that we take terrible things and 251 00:11:49.440 --> 00:11:52.799 learn from them and then put those lessons to work 252 00:11:52.840 --> 00:11:53.519 to help people. 253 00:11:53.960 --> 00:11:56.600 But Maria does a leopard change his spots, you. 254 00:11:56.559 --> 00:11:57.320 Know, recovery. 255 00:11:57.440 --> 00:12:01.080 We see people who I've We've seen people that I 256 00:12:01.240 --> 00:12:05.240 have seen at their lowest points, and I have seen them. 257 00:12:05.120 --> 00:12:06.759 Get to successful recovery. 258 00:12:08.000 --> 00:12:11.559 I think right now of somebody that we prosecuted many 259 00:12:11.759 --> 00:12:16.759 many times, who hit as far down as you could go, 260 00:12:17.720 --> 00:12:20.759 and there were lots of offers of treatment, lots of 261 00:12:20.799 --> 00:12:25.480 taking of treatment, treatment that wasn't successful, and then they 262 00:12:25.519 --> 00:12:28.919 found the right treatment program. That person has now been 263 00:12:29.240 --> 00:12:34.639 sober for years and is involved in a program of 264 00:12:35.720 --> 00:12:39.000 helping people themselves now running treatment programs. 265 00:12:39.279 --> 00:12:40.799 Wow, unbelievable. 266 00:12:41.240 --> 00:12:46.480 So when you, I mean, what do you think would 267 00:12:46.600 --> 00:12:50.000 keep someone in a program or how can we get 268 00:12:50.039 --> 00:12:54.639 someone to say they finished the program, they leave not 269 00:12:54.799 --> 00:12:56.320 come back into that program. 270 00:12:56.440 --> 00:12:58.919 I think you have to be realistic about the fact 271 00:12:58.919 --> 00:13:05.840 that recovery includes some slips and bed missteps. And I 272 00:13:05.840 --> 00:13:09.200 think it's taken people a long time to realize that. 273 00:13:09.320 --> 00:13:12.519 You know, for instance, in drug court, you know, when 274 00:13:12.559 --> 00:13:15.480 somebody is in the program and they have a misstep, 275 00:13:15.600 --> 00:13:18.600 yes there are consequences, but we don't kick them out 276 00:13:18.639 --> 00:13:21.399 of the program. Good you know, because every when you 277 00:13:21.480 --> 00:13:24.759 become educated about recovery, you know there were going to 278 00:13:24.840 --> 00:13:27.720 be some returning to bay. 279 00:13:28.159 --> 00:13:30.840 Yeah, right right, Wow, It's it's wild. 280 00:13:31.039 --> 00:13:34.320 Do you think that COVID had an impact on these 281 00:13:35.080 --> 00:13:37.600 like the rate at which people like whether it be 282 00:13:37.639 --> 00:13:43.440 mental illness skyrocketed or using drugs or just whether it 283 00:13:43.519 --> 00:13:46.840 be recreational or what have you like, did that increase 284 00:13:46.960 --> 00:13:48.840 in your experience or in your opinion? 285 00:13:49.240 --> 00:13:52.200 I think it did in that people were isolated for 286 00:13:52.240 --> 00:13:55.080 a long time. I think we know from many people 287 00:13:55.120 --> 00:13:58.639 that suffer from, you know, some form of some different 288 00:13:58.639 --> 00:14:01.000 forms of mental illness. Isolation is not a good thing. 289 00:14:01.480 --> 00:14:04.440 I think we all kind of lost the ability to 290 00:14:04.600 --> 00:14:06.879 socialize and connect, you know. 291 00:14:07.080 --> 00:14:07.919 I mean, I think for. 292 00:14:07.919 --> 00:14:12.399 Everybody, people are still they they operate socially a little 293 00:14:12.440 --> 00:14:12.960 bit differently. 294 00:14:13.000 --> 00:14:14.200 I do. I don't want to I don't want to 295 00:14:14.240 --> 00:14:14.759 be crowds. 296 00:14:15.039 --> 00:14:15.200 Right. 297 00:14:15.720 --> 00:14:17.480 If I'm a crowd, I want to be outside. I 298 00:14:17.480 --> 00:14:21.960 don't want to be inside going to any event inside. 299 00:14:22.080 --> 00:14:23.919 I don't be around all the I'm not a germophobic, 300 00:14:23.919 --> 00:14:26.039 but I don't want to be around all these German people. Right, 301 00:14:26.200 --> 00:14:29.399 And I see a baby with running nose and get 302 00:14:29.399 --> 00:14:29.799 the baby? 303 00:14:29.799 --> 00:14:30.240 Wait from me? 304 00:14:30.360 --> 00:14:32.320 Like who I also said about babies like that because 305 00:14:32.360 --> 00:14:33.679 they're a little German sponges. 306 00:14:33.720 --> 00:14:36.120 But no, people, people change? 307 00:14:36.159 --> 00:14:37.519 It did change, Yeah, I do. 308 00:14:37.720 --> 00:14:40.320 It ruined like that social aspect for me a little 309 00:14:40.320 --> 00:14:42.159 like and like I'm less willing to go out and 310 00:14:42.159 --> 00:14:43.919 hang out with people now because I'm like, man, I 311 00:14:43.919 --> 00:14:45.679 could just stay home and watch Netflix, like I don't 312 00:14:45.720 --> 00:14:46.360 need to go out and. 313 00:14:48.159 --> 00:14:52.200 Right, or you can get on I sit on on 314 00:14:52.279 --> 00:14:55.360 an app called Chatter, right, and I sit on the 315 00:14:55.360 --> 00:14:59.480 board and I run rooms and I love it because 316 00:14:59.639 --> 00:15:03.000 we'll have rooms on It doesn't matter. It could be mindset, 317 00:15:03.159 --> 00:15:05.639 Like there's words I don't use that this generations all 318 00:15:05.679 --> 00:15:06.080 the time. 319 00:15:06.440 --> 00:15:09.159 What's the other word? What's my other word? 320 00:15:09.720 --> 00:15:10.279 Manifest? 321 00:15:10.320 --> 00:15:12.320 Oh yeah, I'm going to manifest on a twenty five 322 00:15:12.440 --> 00:15:15.240 right now. And I'm a supermodel and I'm going to 323 00:15:15.320 --> 00:15:18.080 be six y three. Oh hold on, I just opened 324 00:15:18.120 --> 00:15:20.120 my eyes. Oh I'm still looking the way I look. 325 00:15:20.159 --> 00:15:23.120 I can see myself, so you look stunning. 326 00:15:23.159 --> 00:15:23.919 I just think that. 327 00:15:26.039 --> 00:15:29.440 We get on these apps and they're great because this one, 328 00:15:29.519 --> 00:15:33.320 this chatter one, you go right on camera. You can 329 00:15:33.399 --> 00:15:36.039 have twenty people on camera and we're all debating each 330 00:15:36.080 --> 00:15:38.559 other on certain things, right, and it's fun. 331 00:15:39.200 --> 00:15:41.159 I actually, but you have to have the person. 332 00:15:41.200 --> 00:15:43.799 I want to do that too, right, So I'll run 333 00:15:43.879 --> 00:15:47.159 a five o'clock business room during the week almost every 334 00:15:47.279 --> 00:15:49.720 you know, every night at five o'clock, and then just 335 00:15:49.799 --> 00:15:53.320 keeps building and building and building. And I'm just realizing 336 00:15:53.799 --> 00:16:00.919 through social audio, not social like Instagram, Facebook, social audio, 337 00:16:01.000 --> 00:16:04.000 there's so many lonely people out there. They come home 338 00:16:04.039 --> 00:16:07.120 to an empty house, they don't have anybody. And I 339 00:16:07.200 --> 00:16:10.120 know now the drinkers, you know what I mean. I've get 340 00:16:10.120 --> 00:16:14.000 to know the people on there, and I'll be like, Okay, Shelley, 341 00:16:14.080 --> 00:16:16.720 I see you've had your third drink. Cut the drink 342 00:16:16.759 --> 00:16:21.000 out right because you can see they're getting you know, animated. 343 00:16:21.679 --> 00:16:24.159 Okay, how much? And Billy, how much part of you 344 00:16:24.240 --> 00:16:24.879 smoke tonight? 345 00:16:25.039 --> 00:16:25.240 Right? 346 00:16:25.399 --> 00:16:28.879 Like as the night goes because the mom can run. 347 00:16:28.919 --> 00:16:31.799 Sometimes from five o'clock I'll step out some it will 348 00:16:31.799 --> 00:16:32.399 take over for me. 349 00:16:32.480 --> 00:16:34.879 I'll come back at eight, nine o'clock or stay right 350 00:16:34.919 --> 00:16:35.200 through it. 351 00:16:35.320 --> 00:16:37.799 You can see and I'll say, okay, yeah, I'll say, guys, 352 00:16:37.879 --> 00:16:39.279 get you, I'm shutting down the room. 353 00:16:39.279 --> 00:16:39.720 I'm tied. 354 00:16:40.159 --> 00:16:42.679 No, don't shut down the room. And then like on 355 00:16:42.720 --> 00:16:45.000 a Friday night, it's like, okay, everybody just released. But 356 00:16:45.440 --> 00:16:48.519 there's a lot of lonely people up and they depend 357 00:16:48.519 --> 00:16:53.559 on those those people that they can look up to. Right, 358 00:16:53.799 --> 00:16:56.919 And I'll say, guys, look, I keep it real, like 359 00:16:57.080 --> 00:17:01.200 I'm not perfect. I'm out here making the same mistakes. Mistakes, 360 00:17:02.120 --> 00:17:04.799 don't you can't look at my life now, thirty seven 361 00:17:04.880 --> 00:17:07.519 years later. I've got battle scars that are bigger than 362 00:17:07.519 --> 00:17:08.559 most people in this room. 363 00:17:08.599 --> 00:17:10.319 Okay, So like. 364 00:17:11.839 --> 00:17:14.480 They want to see you today, they don't want to 365 00:17:14.519 --> 00:17:17.200 see the pain that you've put into your career and 366 00:17:17.240 --> 00:17:19.680 the guilt as a mom and the things that you've 367 00:17:19.720 --> 00:17:22.960 missed being a mom. Right, everybody just thinks it's easy 368 00:17:23.000 --> 00:17:25.279 you just get there. You don't just get there. It's 369 00:17:25.319 --> 00:17:28.799 hard work. It's tenacity, it's pushing that rock up that mountain. 370 00:17:28.880 --> 00:17:34.359 Every day. And if you happen to be oppressed with empathy, 371 00:17:34.400 --> 00:17:36.599 it's hard to do your job. It's even hard to 372 00:17:36.599 --> 00:17:40.400 do my job because you want to just keep forgiving 373 00:17:40.400 --> 00:17:44.039 and forgiving and forgiving, but you can't. And you're a 374 00:17:44.079 --> 00:17:47.759 line of work because somebody's gonna get hurt. But I 375 00:17:47.839 --> 00:17:50.440 do not believe that we just put people in jail. 376 00:17:50.480 --> 00:17:53.559 That's not the answer either. If they have an alcohol problem, 377 00:17:53.559 --> 00:17:55.759 if they have a mental problem, let's not just stick 378 00:17:55.799 --> 00:17:58.279 them in jail. But we're gonna put in a hospital. 379 00:17:58.279 --> 00:18:01.319 But if you don't have insurance, self played at McLean's 380 00:18:01.359 --> 00:18:05.160 is crazy money, right, So wh is the answer? What 381 00:18:05.319 --> 00:18:08.759 is the answer? We closed down all the state hospitals 382 00:18:08.759 --> 00:18:11.359 and what year do you remember, like some of the nineties. 383 00:18:11.480 --> 00:18:13.599 Yeah, before that, really they started. 384 00:18:15.039 --> 00:18:17.880 Do you know why they closed down these hospitals? Can remember? 385 00:18:17.960 --> 00:18:22.480 I don't think there was and this was appropriate in 386 00:18:22.559 --> 00:18:23.359 many respects. 387 00:18:23.359 --> 00:18:23.839 There was. 388 00:18:24.160 --> 00:18:27.799 There were many people who suffer from a mental illness, 389 00:18:27.839 --> 00:18:31.319 for instance, who still have civil rights, and they should be. 390 00:18:31.440 --> 00:18:34.160 They were able to make some decisions for themselves, some 391 00:18:35.559 --> 00:18:38.039 ability to have some ability to how they want to 392 00:18:38.079 --> 00:18:41.240 live their life. You know, we had some places where 393 00:18:41.319 --> 00:18:46.039 the conditions were wonderful, and the problem is we've had 394 00:18:46.079 --> 00:18:48.920 a hard time trying to strike a balance from all 395 00:18:48.960 --> 00:18:49.240 of that. 396 00:18:49.960 --> 00:18:51.000 Okay, well that thought. 397 00:18:51.079 --> 00:18:53.799 This is Cindy Stumbley listened Toughest Nails in WBZ and 398 00:18:53.839 --> 00:18:56.000 welcome back to Toughest Nails on WBZ. 399 00:18:56.119 --> 00:18:57.079 And I'm here with welcome. 400 00:18:57.119 --> 00:19:01.039 Welcome Jesse Foster and Marion Ryan, the district attorney in 401 00:19:01.079 --> 00:19:01.960