Speaker 1: In August of twenty seventeen, two people boarded a privately
Speaker 1: built submarine in Copenhagen, a Swedish journalist who set out
Speaker 1: to write a story on the vessel and the captain
Speaker 1: who had built it. However, within hours, that vessel had
Speaker 1: sunk and only the captain was found, claiming he had
Speaker 1: dropped off that journalist safely hours ago. However, as investigators
Speaker 1: examined the evidence, that story began to fall apart, and
Speaker 1: what they uncovered instead was a case built on contradictions,
Speaker 1: forensic evidence, and a bloody crime scene that unfolded in
Speaker 1: complete isolation under the surface of the ocean. This is
Speaker 1: the story of the submarine murder of Kim Wall.
Speaker 2: My name's Ben, I'm Nicole, and you're list listening to Wicked.
Speaker 1: Ingrim, a true crime podcasting the following mature audience listener discretion.
Speaker 2: There we go.
Speaker 1: You got it.
Speaker 2: This is like my first drink in basically a week.
Speaker 2: It's gonna hit good.
Speaker 1: This is my first, nope, third drink today. I was
Speaker 1: gonna say it's my first today, but.
Speaker 2: It's my realized it was your third drink today.
Speaker 1: Holy for well, I had that mimosa and then I
Speaker 1: had a glass of wine with dinner, and now I've
Speaker 1: got a little glasses scotch here. Uh so I'm living
Speaker 1: my life today.
Speaker 2: I was super sick. I don't know. I feel like
Speaker 2: I hit it very well on the last episode. You
Speaker 2: did so, but yeah, I was sicker than sick. So yeah,
Speaker 2: I kindly, or I kindly. I finally am kind of
Speaker 2: back to myself.
Speaker 1: Which is a bit nice. And you went to the
Speaker 1: gym today I did.
Speaker 2: It's crazy, though, just being sick for a week basically,
Speaker 2: well not even five days or so, how much it
Speaker 2: impacts you, Like I couldn't even lift the same amount
Speaker 2: of weights that I would have previously. Yeah, that's just
Speaker 2: odd to me.
Speaker 1: But it's being sick does a number on a person, It.
Speaker 2: Sure does, it does. Yeah, so today's episode sounds kind
Speaker 2: of interesting, you think.
Speaker 3: So.
Speaker 2: I don't think that someone could pay me to go
Speaker 2: on a submarine.
Speaker 1: No, No, I would never go on one.
Speaker 2: I love water, but I think it's just very like
Speaker 2: deep bodies of water that I have kind of a
Speaker 2: fear towards.
Speaker 1: Well, rightfully, so they're terrifying.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because you have no idea what the hell is
Speaker 2: in there?
Speaker 1: What is it? We've only explored something like five percent
Speaker 1: of the world's oceans or something like, we have no
Speaker 1: clue what.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so the thought of just going because they're mostly
Speaker 2: in oceans, are I guess maybe like super big lakes.
Speaker 2: But I just yeah, I don't think I would ever
Speaker 2: say yes to that.
Speaker 1: I think I would say yes, like really, like immediately,
Speaker 1: like without hesitation.
Speaker 2: Really yes.
Speaker 1: I would feel safe on board a submarine.
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, that surprises me.
Speaker 1: Actually really yeah, I would not feel safe, Like it
Speaker 1: depends on the journey. If someone's like, hey, you want
Speaker 1: to go to the bottom of the ocean and see
Speaker 1: the Titanic and I'm going to control our submarine with
Speaker 1: this little game controller that happened a few years ago
Speaker 1: with a billionaire, Yeah, I wouldn't be comfortable in that situation.
Speaker 1: We all know how that turned out. But if it's like, hey,
Speaker 1: let's just go for a chill ride in a submarine,
Speaker 1: I'm totally down.
Speaker 2: But you so say if it was a legit, well
Speaker 2: that probably was. I don't know how to work this,
Speaker 2: but say someone did offer for you to go to
Speaker 2: the Titanic and it was just like the top of
Speaker 2: the notch, like this couldn't be any safer.
Speaker 1: Oh if it couldn't be any if I was like
Speaker 1: guaranteed and there was nothing sketchy about it, Yeah, I
Speaker 1: probably would. Yeah, I probably do it.
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh. No, I don't think I would want to.
Speaker 1: No.
Speaker 2: I would probably just like increase our life insurance money
Speaker 2: a little bit before you left and then stay home.
Speaker 1: Increase your life our life sure insurance.
Speaker 2: I feel like it's super sketchy and like things can
Speaker 2: go wrong.
Speaker 1: I might probably be packing me a sandwich. Go ahead
Speaker 1: on the submarine, ben, It's okay, I increase life insurance on.
Speaker 1: You do your thing. I may or may not see
Speaker 1: you when you get back.
Speaker 2: But the thing is even what driving to work, you know,
Speaker 2: has some risks to it.
Speaker 1: So technically speaking, just existing has risks. Maybe you could
Speaker 1: fall out of the sky at any moment.
Speaker 2: Who knows, right, But I'm just saying i'd probably skydiving
Speaker 2: and fricking submarine or bungee jumping.
Speaker 1: See I'm opposite. Okay, I'm definitely opposite. But now our
Speaker 1: subject to this podcast. She was certainly fine with getting
Speaker 1: on board a submarine.
Speaker 2: Okay, Well, I'm very interested in this one.
Speaker 1: I thought it was interesting and when I learned about
Speaker 1: it immediately, I was like, all right, I'm covering it.
Speaker 1: So Kim Wall wasn't the kind of journalist who stayed
Speaker 1: in one place for long. By the time she was
Speaker 1: thirty years old, she had already built a career that
Speaker 1: took her across multiple continents. She was covering stories that
Speaker 1: didn't always make headlines, but they carried weight in a
Speaker 1: lot of other ways. She was drawn to what she
Speaker 1: described as the undercurrents of rebellion, you know, situations where culture, politics,
Speaker 1: and everyday life intersected in ways that honestly are just
Speaker 1: kind of overlooked now. Her reporting reflected that focus that
Speaker 1: she had. She had worked in postwar Sri Lanka. She'd
Speaker 1: written about tourism in Haiti after the earthquake, explored underground
Speaker 1: tech culture in Cuba, and reported on the long term
Speaker 1: effects of nuclear testing in the Marshall Islands. Her work
Speaker 1: appeared in major publications including New York Times, The Guardian, Vice,
Speaker 1: and The Atlantic. And the way she approached these stories
Speaker 1: while they always stayed consistent, she spent time with people.
Speaker 1: She asked questions that went deeper than surface level narratives,
Speaker 1: and she tried to understand systems rather than just events.
Speaker 1: Now that approach that she had started very early for her.
Speaker 1: She grew up in southern Sweden in a household where
Speaker 1: journalism was part of everyday life. See both of her
Speaker 1: parents were journalists and the home was filled with newspapers, conversations,
Speaker 1: and constant discussion about what was happening in the world.
Speaker 1: From a young age, she showed the same kind of
Speaker 1: curiosity that would later define her work. She paid attention,
Speaker 1: she asked questions, and had a tendency to follow ideas
Speaker 1: further than most people ever would. Now as she got older,
Speaker 1: that turned into something much more focused. She studied international
Speaker 1: relations at the London School of Economics, then went to
Speaker 1: the Columbia University of New York, where she completed graduate
Speaker 1: degrees in journalism and international affairs. After that, she continued moving,
Speaker 1: working in different countries, taking on assignments that required her
Speaker 1: to adapt quickly and operate independently. By the summer of
Speaker 1: twenty seventeen, she was living in Copenhagen, Denmark with her
Speaker 1: boyfriend Ole. Now Together, they had built a life there,
Speaker 1: but it wasn't meant to be permanent. In fact, the
Speaker 1: two of them were preparing to move to Beijing within days,
Speaker 1: planning to continue their work and start something new. But
Speaker 1: before she left, she had an interview she scheduled for
Speaker 1: August tenth, which wasn't unusual for her. It wasn't a
Speaker 1: high profile assignment or anything like that. It was not
Speaker 1: something that really stood out as particularly risky either. It
Speaker 1: was simply just another story, one that fit her pattern
Speaker 1: of finding interesting people doing unusual things and taking time
Speaker 1: to try and understand them from her perspective. It was
Speaker 1: going to be a short trip. It was close to
Speaker 1: home with someone who was already relatively known. Now that
Speaker 1: man was Peter Madson. Now, Peter was a very interesting character,
Speaker 1: to say the least. He had spent years building a
Speaker 1: reputation around projects that sat outside the unusual boundaries of engineering.
Speaker 1: He wasn't formally trained in the traditional sense, but he
Speaker 1: had managed to position himself as a very serious figure
Speaker 1: in Denmark's amateur aerospace and engineering scene. He even co
Speaker 1: founded Copenhagen's Suborbitals, which is a group focused on building rockets,
Speaker 1: and he became known for taking on large scale projects
Speaker 1: that most individuals would never attempt on their own. In fact,
Speaker 1: I watched the documentary on this case, and he was
Speaker 1: often referred to as like kind of like an Denmark's
Speaker 1: Elon Musk is how many people described him.
Speaker 2: Oh really so honestly, spending any time or doing anything
Speaker 2: like an interview on him, would you would not think
Speaker 2: it would be risky whatsoever.
Speaker 1: No, he's a very public figure. Okay, now I know
Speaker 1: Elon Musk doesn't exactly have the best reputation these days,
Speaker 1: but to get the idea of, you know, an innovator
Speaker 1: and a scale of a well known name. Now, the
Speaker 1: most visible of these projects that he had made was
Speaker 1: the UC three Nautilus. It was his third build of
Speaker 1: a privately built submarine. It was crowdfunded in fact, and
Speaker 1: it had drawn attention from both the public and the
Speaker 1: media alike. By twenty seventeen, he'd become something of a
Speaker 1: local celebrity. He gave talks, participated in interviews, and was
Speaker 1: often described as unconventional but very driven, someone who pushed
Speaker 1: ahead with ideas regardless of whether they fit the established systems.
Speaker 1: The kind of profile that he had made him a
Speaker 1: very appealing subject for journalists, especially those interested in people
Speaker 1: working on the edges of innovation, and that's how Kim
Speaker 1: came to learn about him. He was a man building submarines.
Speaker 1: He was building rockets outside of institutional support, and it
Speaker 1: was the kind of story that she was naturally drawn to.
Speaker 1: It was unusual, self directed, and connected to broader questions
Speaker 1: about ambition, independence and how people carved out space for themselves.
Speaker 2: I do have to say, Kim seems like she lives
Speaker 2: an incredible life, like very experienced one hundred percent.
Speaker 1: A very experienced individual is a good way of saying it,
Speaker 1: and I think that's what it was. She lived a
Speaker 1: very thorough life, not only through herself but through her
Speaker 1: work and the people she talked to, which I honestly
Speaker 1: hold it a really high regard. I really respect that.
Speaker 1: Now she reached out him to arrange an interview, and
Speaker 1: initially he agreed, but actually setting it up between the
Speaker 1: two of them proved to be a bit difficult. Dates
Speaker 1: were suggested and then postponed, and communication went quiet for
Speaker 1: stretches of time too, And as the weeks passed, with
Speaker 1: her planning to move Beijing getting closer, it started to
Speaker 1: look like the opportunity might not come together. And I'm
Speaker 1: sure we can all sympathize, you know, trying to make
Speaker 1: plans with friends and stuff. Things get in the way.
Speaker 1: It's like, well what about Tuesday, But I can't do
Speaker 1: Tuesday at work? Well what about Wednesday? No, not good
Speaker 1: for me. I got dinner.
Speaker 2: Like you know, everyone is so busy exactly.
Speaker 1: So trying to set it up was kind of a
Speaker 1: similar situation. So by early August, she had largely accepted
Speaker 1: that she might have to just move on and not
Speaker 1: get the story. But then on the morning of August tenth,
Speaker 1: Peter contacted her once again. He asked if she was
Speaker 1: still interested in doing the interview and suggested that they
Speaker 1: do it that very day. He had time now instead
Speaker 1: of meeting on land, though, he actually proposed that she
Speaker 1: come aboard the submarine itself. He said that they can
Speaker 1: go out in the harbor, they can talk a while
Speaker 1: on the water, and then you know, go submerge for
Speaker 1: a while, so she can get the experience and then
Speaker 1: be back on land within a couple hours. Now, it
Speaker 1: was short notice, but it was also exactly what she
Speaker 1: was hoping to arrange. He suggested she come down to
Speaker 1: the dock that evening and join him on the submarine
Speaker 1: for that short trip, then could be back by about
Speaker 1: nine point thirty which would still leave her enough time
Speaker 1: to return home before dinner. The timing was an ideal,
Speaker 1: but it was workable. Kim spoke to her boyfriend Olay
Speaker 1: about it. She asked if he was okay with her
Speaker 1: stepping out for a few hours before dinner, and he was.
Speaker 1: Opportunities like this weren't unusual for her, especially when it
Speaker 1: was something she'd been trying to arrange for a while,
Speaker 1: so she agreed to meet him that evening. At one point,
Speaker 1: while she was getting ready, she admitted that the idea
Speaker 1: of going out in a homemade submarine made her feel
Speaker 1: a little uneasy, and it wasn't something she had done before.
Speaker 2: I get that.
Speaker 1: There was a moment where she actually considered whether it
Speaker 1: was even worth it now Ole her boyfriend offered to
Speaker 1: go with her, but she decided against it, saying no, no,
Speaker 1: it's no big deal. There was still work to do
Speaker 1: for the evening, and from her perspective, this didn't feel
Speaker 1: like a situation that required any sort of caution.
Speaker 2: Oh gosh, I feel like she has a bit of
Speaker 2: a gut feeling that she's not listening to right now.
Speaker 1: It's not so much that it's just it's a weird situation.
Speaker 1: It's different like she's worked in far more unpredictable environments, right,
Speaker 1: like literal war zones and true right, So for her
Speaker 1: it was just like a new situation, any sort of thing.
Speaker 1: The plan was straightforward. She was going to go down
Speaker 1: to the dock, spend a couple hours on the submarine,
Speaker 1: complete the interview, and return for their for their late
Speaker 1: dinner together. So at around seven pm, Kim arrived at
Speaker 1: the dock in Copenhagen where the UC three Nautilus was moored.
Speaker 1: Now the submarine itself wasn't hidden or difficult to find.
Speaker 1: In fact, it was kind of stood out with something
Speaker 1: people in the area already recognized. You know, you don't
Speaker 1: see a submarine parked at a dock very often, right, No,
Speaker 1: you don't. So it was also like the identity around
Speaker 1: around Peter. He'd built this identity. It was very public,
Speaker 1: very very well spotted. It's that low in the water.
Speaker 1: It was sleek and black, long and narrow, with a
Speaker 1: small upper hatch that protruded upwards. And this is where
Speaker 1: people could stand above the surface before submerging. So you're
Speaker 1: in this little spot. You can close the hatch and
Speaker 1: go down in submarine and then it goes under. When
Speaker 1: Kim met him that evening, he was very friendly. There
Speaker 1: wasn't anything unusual about their interaction, and the two of
Speaker 1: them were both very excited. The interview, she said that
Speaker 1: she was trying to set up for months was finally
Speaker 1: happening at that very last minute, and for Peter he
Speaker 1: got to show off his homemade submarine. Soon she found
Speaker 1: herself stepping onto the vessel, and not long after that
Speaker 1: the Nautilus began moving away from the dock. Now, this
Speaker 1: vessel was seen by people on passing boats as it
Speaker 1: departed into the ocean waters. One recording actually even shows them.
Speaker 1: That evening shows both Kim and Peter above the surface,
Speaker 1: standing in the open section near the hatch. Kim appears
Speaker 1: calm looking out across the water, and it looks exactly
Speaker 1: exactly what you picture in your mind. The small submarine
Speaker 1: off in the distance, two people poking out and they
Speaker 1: go down inside, and that's where she was going to
Speaker 1: be beginning the interview. The submarine then moved further out
Speaker 1: into the harbor and it gradually disappeared from view at
Speaker 1: around eight thirty pm. Kim sent a message from the
Speaker 1: submarine by that point, she'd been on board for roughly
Speaker 1: an hour and a half, the interview was underway, and
Speaker 1: from everything in the message, the situation just appeared normal.
Speaker 1: There was no urgency in her wording, no indication that
Speaker 1: anything had gone wrong. She had wrote the message to
Speaker 1: her boyfriend Olay, and it said quote still alive as
Speaker 1: a light, almost playful line to.
Speaker 2: Her boyfriend, oh man, oh gosh.
Speaker 1: And then she joked that there was cookies and coffee
Speaker 1: on board, and then she added that they were about
Speaker 1: to go down, referencing the submarine going and submerging in
Speaker 1: the water. Before ending the message, she told Olay that
Speaker 1: she loved him. After that, there was no further communication.
Speaker 1: There were no follow up messages, no calls, and no
Speaker 1: indication that the submarine had resurfaced or returned to the dock.
Speaker 1: Now it's important to clarify once a vessel goes underwater,
Speaker 1: it would lose signal entirely, and so delays weren't necessarily
Speaker 1: unusual for a situation like this. Kim was expected back
Speaker 1: at around nine thirty PM, and at first there was
Speaker 1: no immediate reason to ascern assume that anything was wrong.
Speaker 1: When she didn't show up on time at home. Sure,
Speaker 1: interviews can run longer than normal, especially when they're unfolding
Speaker 1: in an unusual setting like a submarine, for example. There
Speaker 1: were also practical limitations once submerged. They would be no
Speaker 1: signal and the lack of communication. It didn't stand out
Speaker 1: right away to Olay, but by around ten thirty he
Speaker 1: started to feel a bit uneasy. He tried reaching out
Speaker 1: to her, expecting the submarine might have at least surface
Speaker 1: by then, but there was still no response. The dinner
Speaker 1: they had planned was waiting and hadn't returned any sort
Speaker 1: of message or update of any kind. As more time passed,
Speaker 1: the silence began to carry much more of a weight.
Speaker 1: Then by midnight, the delay was no longer something that
Speaker 1: could be dismissed as you know, something that was just
Speaker 1: a scheduling issue, And the longer it went on, the
Speaker 1: fewer reasonable explanations there were. Oleay continued to contact her,
Speaker 1: or at least try, but nothing went through. By around
Speaker 1: one forty five pm, after several hours without any contact,
Speaker 1: no sign of the submarine returning nothing, Olay decided to
Speaker 1: call the police and report her missing, and once that
Speaker 1: report came in, the response moved.
Speaker 2: Quickly, so she was supposed to be home about nine thirty, correct,
Speaker 2: and at this point it's one forty five correct. You
Speaker 2: would be losing your frickin' shit at this point. That
Speaker 2: is probably terrifying.
Speaker 1: Yep. And the fact that it's like, well, there's not
Speaker 1: even a response that you know, she's at surface level. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so okay, maybe the submarine gets to the surface and
Speaker 1: then you got to you know what more at the dock,
Speaker 1: and then you got to get home, so maybe an
Speaker 1: extra half an hour after it even surfaces. So you're
Speaker 1: sitting here thinking, one forty.
Speaker 2: Five still no response, Oh my god.
Speaker 1: Which means she's going to be home around what like
Speaker 1: close to two thirty.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that is way too long. Like I feel like
Speaker 2: in this kind of scenario, tops two hours and then
Speaker 2: I would just be frickin' beside myself.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good actual timeframe. I agree with that. Now,
Speaker 1: the fact that Kim hadn't simply just failed to return home,
Speaker 1: but instead she had actually last been seen boarding a
Speaker 1: homemade submarine with Peter that was now unaccounted for, well,
Speaker 1: this all changed the scale of the response. From the
Speaker 1: very start, the Danish police began coordinating with the Coastguard
Speaker 1: and the Navy, and a search effort was launched across
Speaker 1: the waters surrounding Copenhagen. Patrol boats moved into the harbor
Speaker 1: and went out along the expected route that the submarine
Speaker 1: was supposed to have taken, or at least thought to
Speaker 1: have taken. Helicopters were sent up to scan from above,
Speaker 1: covering a wider area and looking for any sign of
Speaker 1: the vessel breaking the surface. Attempts were made to establish
Speaker 1: contact with Peter over the marine radio, but there was
Speaker 1: just no response.
Speaker 2: They're taking this very seriously right off the bat, which
Speaker 2: is so good.
Speaker 1: They are they are. I mean, you have a missing persons,
Speaker 1: but you also now technically have two missing persons and
Speaker 1: a potentially failed vessel missing submarine. Yeah, so this is massive.
Speaker 1: It's honestly a catastrophic scale, even if you don't go
Speaker 1: along the side of murder, because this has environmental issues
Speaker 1: going along with it. With a vessel capsized or sunk,
Speaker 1: it could potentially be debris in the waters which could
Speaker 1: capsize another vessel. So there's a lot of things that
Speaker 1: can go wrong in this situation like this. Now, as
Speaker 1: the night went on, the search expanded sonar equipment was
Speaker 1: used in an effort to try and locate the submarine
Speaker 1: below the water, while Cruz checked surrounding sh shorelines in
Speaker 1: case something had been washed up or come up unexpectedly.
Speaker 1: And the longer the search went on without finding anything,
Speaker 1: the more concerning the situation became. By the morning of
Speaker 1: August eleventh, after hours of searching with no contact, the
Speaker 1: UC three Nautilus was finally located. The submarine had surfaced
Speaker 1: in the waters just south of Copenhagen. Boats in the
Speaker 1: area moved toward it after a distress signal was reported,
Speaker 1: and when the boats reached within eyesight of the vessel,
Speaker 1: they could see Peter. He was already outside, standing on
Speaker 1: top in the hatch, waving his arms. He was calling
Speaker 1: for help before he dove in the water and was
Speaker 1: soon rescued by one of the nearby boats. Kim, though
Speaker 1: she was nowhere to be seen. It was just Peter.
Speaker 1: There was no explanation for her absence either, and before
Speaker 1: any detailed questions could be answered, the situation shifted once again,
Speaker 1: as the submarine that Peter had just abandoned did not
Speaker 1: remain floating. It began taking on water and slowly sank
Speaker 1: beneath the surface. Witnesses later described how it didn't drop
Speaker 1: suddenly or break apart. It slowly settled downward in almost
Speaker 1: a controlled way, disappearing below the waterline until it was
Speaker 1: completely gone. By the time the authorities arrived, the Nautilus
Speaker 1: was no longer visible. Peter was brought back to the shore,
Speaker 1: where police were already waiting for him. When he was there,
Speaker 1: they asked where Kim was, and he gave a very
Speaker 1: direct answer. He said that nothing had happened to her.
Speaker 1: He said that he had dropped her off safely on
Speaker 1: land earlier the evening, before before any problems with the
Speaker 1: submarine even began. Now, at that moment, there was no
Speaker 1: immediate evidence to contradict anything he said, but the situation
Speaker 1: already carried a problem, one that couldn't be ignored, and
Speaker 1: that was the fact that Kim was still missing. Within
Speaker 1: minutes of stepping ashore, Peter was placed under arrest and
Speaker 1: taken in for questioning.
Speaker 2: Oh really, because see, just as someone like listening to
Speaker 2: this or hearing this, I wouldn't think that that story
Speaker 2: doesn't not make sense.
Speaker 1: Well, there's a lot wrong with this because Kim is missing,
Speaker 1: right right, No one can get a hold of her.
Speaker 1: If she was dropped off on shore safely last night,
Speaker 1: where is she? He is the last one who's seen
Speaker 1: her live. I guess who allegedly dropped her off.
Speaker 2: What happens if something happened to her on her way home,
Speaker 2: you know, from him dropping her off or something.
Speaker 1: It's very potential. But there's things about it that don't
Speaker 1: quite add up. Why hasn't she texted Oley at all?
Speaker 1: Why has no one said anything. He also didn't really
Speaker 1: say exactly where he dropped her off right away.
Speaker 2: Oh okay.
Speaker 1: Then there's a few other suspicious things that happened. The
Speaker 1: way the submarines sank, it didn't sink in what many
Speaker 1: professional opinions were in a dramatic sense of an accident
Speaker 1: or a failure. It almost looked like it was going
Speaker 1: in a die in a very controlled way, almost like
Speaker 1: it was done on.
Speaker 2: Purpose, Like he was sinking it on purpose.
Speaker 1: Yes, and this is coming from professionals who watched it
Speaker 1: go down, and immediately as they're seeing it go down,
Speaker 1: say they're saying, this isn't right. He could have stopped that.
Speaker 1: Something's wrong.
Speaker 2: Okay, So it didn't need to It wasn't going down
Speaker 2: like it wouldn't have sunk if he didn't do something.
Speaker 1: That's the suspicion. Okay, not only that. Now, this again speculation.
Speaker 1: I don't know if there was a sample taken from
Speaker 1: this or what. But there is camera footage of him
Speaker 1: arriving on shore. People are interviewing, asking questions, and he's
Speaker 1: being taken away by police and all this sort of stuff.
Speaker 1: So if you watch that footage and look at some
Speaker 1: of the photos that were taken when he came ashore,
Speaker 1: there's something that appears to be a smudge on the
Speaker 1: end of his nose and it appears to be blood.
Speaker 2: Oh okay, okay, well right there, that would do it, yes,
Speaker 2: without anything else. Just the fact that he is some
Speaker 2: potential blood on the tip of his nose is not okay.
Speaker 1: So there's a lot that's not adding up. So the
Speaker 1: fact he was taken into custody is not just a
Speaker 1: matter of oh, well, your last person who's seen her.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of question marks already in the air.
Speaker 2: It makes sense.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Now. During questioning, Peter said that problems with the
Speaker 1: submarine happened after he had dropped Kim off on shore
Speaker 1: the night before. He described a technical failure that had
Speaker 1: caused the vessel to take on water. There had been
Speaker 1: no emergency involving Kim, no accident, and no reason to
Speaker 1: believe that anything had happened to her while she was
Speaker 1: on board. It was a straightforward story, and if it
Speaker 1: were true, then Kim was in fact somewhere in Copenhagen
Speaker 1: and the situation would shift away from the submarine entirely
Speaker 1: when she was found. But even in those first interviews,
Speaker 1: there were details that still didn't line up cleanly. When
Speaker 1: he spoke about the night, he focused heavily on the submarine,
Speaker 1: on the mechanics of what went wrong, the loss of
Speaker 1: the vessel, the sequence of events that led to its
Speaker 1: scene thinking, and when it came to Kim, his answers
Speaker 1: were noticeably very less so specific. It didn't provide a
Speaker 1: clear location even where he dropped her off, as I mentioned,
Speaker 1: and there was no way for police to immediately confirm
Speaker 1: that part of the account.
Speaker 2: Okay, devil's advocate here, though, if he's the man that
Speaker 2: built this vessel, I could understand him kind of being
Speaker 2: fixated on it a little bit more because of the
Speaker 2: amount of time he's spent on building that and now
Speaker 2: it's gone and that would mean a lot to him.
Speaker 1: For sure, for sure, but it's really hard to portray
Speaker 1: how he was acting and reporting this. There's interviews of
Speaker 1: people saying how they knew him very closely, how he spoke,
Speaker 1: how he acted about things like this, and he was
Speaker 1: almost a very over the top poetic individual. But it
Speaker 1: seemed like how he was speaking in these terms was
Speaker 1: very detailed and matter of fact, not poetic, not being
Speaker 1: like the submarine went down and it's the way life is,
Speaker 1: and I'm excited for moving on in the ventures to
Speaker 1: take me forth. He's not speaking like that like he
Speaker 1: normally does. It's more of there was a failure and
Speaker 1: the vessel took on water. I couldn't control it and
Speaker 1: it went down, almost like he's rehearsed specific points to
Speaker 1: hit in a story that very robotic boom boom, okay.
Speaker 2: Like he's gone through a checklist.
Speaker 1: Almost per se. Yeah, and then when it comes to Kim,
Speaker 1: he's not supposed to have a checklist, so there's nothing
Speaker 1: to say. So it's very almost rehearsed, very prepared, robotic.
Speaker 1: I guess now at that point there was no direct
Speaker 1: evidence to prove that he was lying, but there was
Speaker 1: also nothing to support his version of events either, So
Speaker 1: it was kind of this neutral zone of which it's true. Now,
Speaker 1: even before any physical evidence was recovered, parts of the
Speaker 1: situation were already starting to raise a lot of concern.
Speaker 1: People with experience around submarines began pointing out that what
Speaker 1: had happened to the UC three Nautilus didn't make sense
Speaker 1: as an accident, something I already discussed. A vessel like
Speaker 1: this doesn't typically just take on water and sink without warning,
Speaker 1: especially not in calm conditions over a short timeframe. The
Speaker 1: way it had gone down slowly, with a hatch left open,
Speaker 1: it suggested something else entirely. Submarines are in fact designed
Speaker 1: to keep water out. Now, there were also questions about
Speaker 1: Peter's calm and focused behavior once he was rescued. Now,
Speaker 1: as police began trying to verify Peter's account, the first
Speaker 1: real cracks appeared almost immediately. The first thing his claim
Speaker 1: bolt where he had dropped Kim off safely on land.
Speaker 1: If that were true, there should be some record of it.
Speaker 1: The harbor area where he soon said he dropped her off,
Speaker 1: it wasn't isolated. There were CCTV cameras everywhere. There were
Speaker 1: also boats and people moving through the area regularly. It
Speaker 1: wasn't the kind of place that someone could simply appear
Speaker 1: with a submarine and disappear without being seen. Investigator started
Speaker 1: pulling that CCTV footage from locations along the waterfront, focusing
Speaker 1: on that time window when Peter said he had returned
Speaker 1: Kim to the shore, but there was nothing. No footage
Speaker 1: showed her disembarking, no sightings from witnesses, nothing showed that
Speaker 1: she had ever left the submarine after boarding it that evening,
Speaker 1: no sightings of the submarine even in the area that
Speaker 1: he claimed either. At the same time, there were no
Speaker 1: signs of her anywhere. She hadn't contacted anyone, she hadn't
Speaker 1: returned home. Her belongings were even still unaccounted for, and
Speaker 1: within a short period, the original explanation that she'd been
Speaker 1: dropped off safely clearly no longer had any support in
Speaker 1: the last confirmed place that Kim Wall had been seen
Speaker 1: while was still on the UC three Nautilus. Soon efforts
Speaker 1: shifted towards recovering the submarine and examining what had happened
Speaker 1: on board. The submarine was soon located on the seabed
Speaker 1: and eventually brought back up to the surface after securing
Speaker 1: the heavy equipment able to do the job. Once it
Speaker 1: was accessible, though, investigators began a detailed inspection of the interior.
Speaker 1: One of the first conclusions was that there was no
Speaker 1: clear mechanical failure that would have caused it to sink
Speaker 1: on its own. The systems didn't show any sort of
Speaker 1: signs of a sudden breakdown at all. Instead, the way
Speaker 1: the vessel had taken on water pointed towards something being
Speaker 1: done intentionally, like someone left the water flow, let the
Speaker 1: water just flow into the vessel, or something now inside.
Speaker 1: They also began to find some physical evidence too. They
Speaker 1: found traces of blood aboard. They also found personal items
Speaker 1: that belonged to Kim that were in fact still there,
Speaker 1: including clothing that had not been removed from the submarine
Speaker 1: before it went under.
Speaker 2: Holy shit, like if he had dropped her off, she
Speaker 2: would be taking those with her exactly.
Speaker 1: At this instance, the focus of the investigation had shifted fully.
Speaker 1: The question was no longer where Kim had gone after
Speaker 1: leaving the submarine, but now it is what had happened
Speaker 1: to her while she was still on it. The investigators
Speaker 1: presented their new findings to Peter, you know, the blood,
Speaker 1: her clothes, the CCTV footage that showed she did not
Speaker 1: get dropped off where he said she did. And while
Speaker 1: at that point his account of what had happened changed,
Speaker 1: Peter admitted there to investigators that she had in fact
Speaker 1: died on board the submarine and he had lied about
Speaker 1: dropping her off. According to him, there was an accident
Speaker 1: on board the vessel. He said, the heavy hatch on
Speaker 1: the submarine was open at one point while they were
Speaker 1: up on the surface, and it had fallen, slamming shut
Speaker 1: while she stood in the way, and it struck her
Speaker 1: in the head, killing her unintentionally. Now, instead of contacting
Speaker 1: authorities or trying to bring her back ashore, he told
Speaker 1: investigators that he chose to dispose of her body at sea,
Speaker 1: described placing her in the water himself, framing it as
Speaker 1: something that he did in a state of shock rather
Speaker 1: than a calculated decision, and at one point he characterized
Speaker 1: it as some kind of burial, saying that he put
Speaker 1: her in the sea, you know, as almost like a
Speaker 1: form of respect sort of situation. According to this version
Speaker 1: of events, everything that followed her death, moving the body,
Speaker 1: you know, removing it from the submarine and leaving it
Speaker 1: in the water. It was all the result of panic
Speaker 1: and an inability to deal with what had happened, but
Speaker 1: all in all, for the first time, Peter was placing
Speaker 1: her death inside the submarine, and he acknowledged that something
Speaker 1: had happened while they were alone together, but the explanation
Speaker 1: was still framed in a way that was something outside
Speaker 1: of his control, a sudden, unplanned accident. It was an
Speaker 1: unlikely story, but certainly not impossible, and they had no
Speaker 1: way to prove it otherwise either.
Speaker 2: I feel though, if it's if that's what actually happen,
Speaker 2: why would you go about hiding.
Speaker 1: It because he said he panicked, which.
Speaker 2: I guess, but I feel like maybe you would serve
Speaker 2: some time. I don't know. But also if it's just
Speaker 2: an accident, probably not. And then just releasing her body
Speaker 2: into the sea that as respect or something that's actually
Speaker 2: like the opposite. It's completely disrespectful when her family is
Speaker 2: not now going to be able to lay her to rest.
Speaker 1: Now, I'm not saying he said he did it in respect,
Speaker 1: though I want to clarify that he almost like made
Speaker 1: it seem like it was a.
Speaker 2: Respectful, a respectful way of letting her bee free exactly.
Speaker 1: But he framed it in that sort of sense, but
Speaker 1: he didn't say it was a respectful thing.
Speaker 2: Okay, Well, geez, I don't know. Just listening to this,
Speaker 2: I'm like, how does this buddy think that he was
Speaker 2: going to get away with this shit?
Speaker 1: Well, it gets even worse, okay, because on August twenty first,
Speaker 1: eleven days after kim Wall disappeared, the case changed once again.
Speaker 1: A cyclist was riding along the shoreline through Copenhagen and
Speaker 1: came across something sitting in the water near the edge
Speaker 1: of a beach. Authorities were soon called to examine what
Speaker 1: was found on the shoreline, and they confirmed that what
Speaker 1: was found was a human torso. It had been cut apart.
Speaker 1: There were no arms, there were no legs, and there
Speaker 1: was no head attached. It had also been deliberately weighed down.
Speaker 1: Metal objects had been attached to it in a way
Speaker 1: that suggested it had been placed in the water with
Speaker 1: the intention of keeping it submerged. But despite that, though
Speaker 1: it had resurfaced still shortly after the discovery, investigators were
Speaker 1: able to identify the remains as belonging to Kim Wall
Speaker 1: through DNA analysis.
Speaker 2: He has some explaining to do because that doesn't make
Speaker 2: any sense I was thinking it was. I was like, oh,
Speaker 2: my goodness, thankfully her body has come to shore. But
Speaker 2: you would not expect it to come ashore that way.
Speaker 1: Definitely, not not dismembered, not weighed down.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Now, with this discovery, the investigation focused on coordinating their
Speaker 1: search of the surrounding waters for the rest of Kim's remains.
Speaker 1: Divers were sent out repeatedly to comb through the areas
Speaker 1: where currents were likely to carry anything released into the sea.
Speaker 1: The work was slow and very methodical. Visibility underwater was
Speaker 1: extremely limited, and the search area was vast. Teams had
Speaker 1: a map of currents and estimated drift patterns, and they
Speaker 1: returned to the same locations multiple times. A dismembered body
Speaker 1: didn't line up with Peter's story at all either. He could, however,
Speaker 1: possibly claim something like maybe animals did it, or a
Speaker 1: boat propeller or getting tangled and fishing equipment. Who knows,
Speaker 1: Who knows what sort of story he could come up
Speaker 1: with to try and explain this away. So police knew
Speaker 1: what they had to do was focus on proving his
Speaker 1: claim of Kim being hit in the head, and they
Speaker 1: needed to prove it wrong. So if this was true,
Speaker 1: if that hatch on the submarine had contacted her head
Speaker 1: and killed her, she would have suffered blunt force trauma
Speaker 1: to the head and likely a massive skull fracture. So
Speaker 1: if they find the rest of her remains, they could
Speaker 1: see if there was such trauma to her head. Well,
Speaker 1: if there wasn't, it would prove he was lying. So
Speaker 1: over the following weeks they searched diligently through the waters. Then,
Speaker 1: with the help of experts in the water currents, they
Speaker 1: focused on one specific area where he believed it would
Speaker 1: likely carry her remains. They are under the water in
Speaker 1: the murky depths. One diver came across something. It was
Speaker 1: a bag, then there was another. Inside each bag were
Speaker 1: Kim's remains, her head, arms, and legs. They were all
Speaker 1: found separate, placed in bags, and weighed down in the
Speaker 1: same way that the torso was. Each discovery confirmed that
Speaker 1: the body had not come apart naturally, it had been
Speaker 1: intentionally dismembered and distributed through the water in ways that
Speaker 1: suggested planning. They were in Begs Hole.
Speaker 2: That is just such an eerie picture to go about
Speaker 2: finding that, and then also it's right away. It's like
Speaker 2: we got you.
Speaker 1: Along with the remains, investigators also recovered items connected to
Speaker 1: the crime, including tools consistent with cutting, such as a
Speaker 1: saw and knives. The pattern was consistent across everything that
Speaker 1: was found. The body parts had been treated the same way,
Speaker 1: prepared and weighed down the same way before thrown into
Speaker 1: the sea, and there was no indication of panic or
Speaker 1: improvisation in how they had been handled. Now in forensic
Speaker 1: examinations were completed on the rest of Kim's remains, there
Speaker 1: was no evidence of the kind of injury Peter had
Speaker 1: claimed occurred, no skull fractures, and no blunt force trauma
Speaker 1: that matched what he had described, which meant he was
Speaker 1: clearly lying. If we it wasn't obvious enough already, But
Speaker 1: the one fact he did provide was proved wrong.
Speaker 2: This guy, what on earth is he doing? Well?
Speaker 1: If that wasn't enough, After they confronted him with this information,
Speaker 1: he changed his story again.
Speaker 2: Oh frick I don't know. I don't even understand how
Speaker 2: anyone could take this man remotely seriously, Like he's obviously.
Speaker 1: Nuts, he's bonkers.
Speaker 2: He cut up some innocent woman's body, and his frickin' submarine. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 2: this is this is just mine.
Speaker 1: This is literally a horror movie, is what this is?
Speaker 2: Pretty much? Actually, this could totally be turned into that. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it is that.
Speaker 1: Now. Peter claimed that Kim had died now from carbon
Speaker 1: monoxide poisoning while he was on deck, suggesting that she
Speaker 1: had been overcome by fumes inside the submarine during another
Speaker 1: mechanical failure while she was below and he was above.
Speaker 1: But that explanation didn't hold up either. There was no
Speaker 1: toxic evidence found in her body that would indicate she
Speaker 1: had been exposed to lethal levels of carbon monoxide either.
Speaker 1: Each version Peter gave conveniently place the cause of death
Speaker 1: outside of his control, and each one presented the situation
Speaker 1: as an accident, and each one directly contradicted the physical evidence. Now,
Speaker 1: there was still more that they found regarding the condition
Speaker 1: of her remains, too, though that raised even further questions.
Speaker 1: The dismembermentt you know, it had been done in a
Speaker 1: way that was not urgent or with any sort of panic.
Speaker 1: Of course, there was the weights, the separation of body parts,
Speaker 1: and the way it had been disposed, right, we understand that,
Speaker 1: But the remains also showed multiple other injuries that could
Speaker 1: not be explained by any accounts Peter had given. For example,
Speaker 1: there were several puncture wounds consistent with repeated stabbing, isolated
Speaker 1: to the lower torso and vaginal area on Kim's remains.
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, this guy is batshit crazy.
Speaker 1: Along with this, there were also indications that Kim had
Speaker 1: been restrained. Holy frig these injuries were not random, just
Speaker 1: like the dismemberment was not random, and they couldn't be
Speaker 1: explained by anything Peter attempted to come up with. Then,
Speaker 1: to top it all off, DNA evidence connected everything back
Speaker 1: to the submarine. As I mentioned, blood was found inside
Speaker 1: the UC three Nautilus submarine, and the DNA confirmed that
Speaker 1: it was in fact Kim's blood. It was clear that
Speaker 1: whatever happened to her had taken place within that confined space.
Speaker 1: At the same time, Peter's DNA was found on her
Speaker 1: remains too, though I was unable to determine through my
Speaker 1: research exactly if it was blood or seamen or something else,
Speaker 1: but I do know his DNA was found. The traces
Speaker 1: of Kim's blood were also recovered from inside the submarine,
Speaker 1: as I mentioned, but also on his clothes. Further, reinforcing
Speaker 1: that the vessel had been the scene of the crime.
Speaker 1: To put it in simple terms, there was no longer
Speaker 1: any question about where this had happened or what had happened.
Speaker 1: It was only a matter of how it had happened.
Speaker 1: Peter had attacked and killed Kim on the vessel, period,
Speaker 1: full stop. She would have been in an isolated and
Speaker 1: confined space under the surface of the ocean, alone with
Speaker 1: a person who attacked and killed her, with no hope
Speaker 1: of escape.
Speaker 2: Oh man, well if you didn't if you wanted to
Speaker 2: go on a submarine before, do you want to now?
Speaker 1: Well, not this one, that's for sure.
Speaker 2: Scary scary stuff like this, poor girl. Yeah, I cannot
Speaker 2: even imagine what would have like. That's just horrifying.
Speaker 1: Even imagine this. So she can't run anywhere, right, she can't.
Speaker 1: There's nowhere for her to go. She's in a confined
Speaker 1: space below the ocean like that's it, very.
Speaker 2: Much so out of her comfort zone. She has no
Speaker 2: weapons or nothing.
Speaker 1: So her only hope of survival is to overpower him.
Speaker 1: Now if she overpowers him, now what oh, Now, she
Speaker 1: can't drive this thing, She can't get back to the surface.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I didn't even go there. So she's just like,
Speaker 2: what between a rock and a hard place? Really?
Speaker 1: Yeah, So if she does overpower him, it's not like
Speaker 1: he's going to let her back to the surface. Okay,
Speaker 1: I guess we're just down here then you know what,
Speaker 1: I'm not letting you go like sorry, Wow, so she
Speaker 1: is fucked.
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is just terrible.
Speaker 3: Now.
Speaker 1: As investigators continued their investigation and expanded beyond the physical
Speaker 1: evidence on hand, a second layer of the case began
Speaker 1: to take shape, one that focused on what had been
Speaker 1: happening before Kim ever stepped onto the submarine at all.
Speaker 1: When they examined Peter's digital activity, they found material that
Speaker 1: add context to the violence already established through the forensics.
Speaker 1: They found several files of videos and photos, all this
Speaker 1: sort of stuff on his computer depicting women being subject
Speaker 1: to torture and killings. No many of these were pornographic
Speaker 1: snuff films, which is a genre of pornography where women
Speaker 1: are abused and killed in a sexual context.
Speaker 2: Holy shit, So this guy is a nasty asshole.
Speaker 1: Yeah he is. Alongside that, investigators also uncovered messages and
Speaker 1: communications in which he had described violence scenarios in detail,
Speaker 1: including ideas about him wanting to harm someone on board
Speaker 1: the submarine. He had Bill.
Speaker 2: Solely frick this. This story is mind.
Speaker 1: Blowing, Yeah it is. And I have no idea how
Speaker 1: this fucking douche Canoe thought he was going to get
Speaker 1: away with this.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, like, is he's stupid because there really is
Speaker 2: no way that he I mean, okay, like some of
Speaker 2: his stories, I guess I could kind of understand, you
Speaker 2: know that the hitting the head thing, but then it
Speaker 2: doesn't make sense that you wouldn't, you know, bring your
Speaker 2: summarine in and get help and just release her body instead.
Speaker 1: Yeah, But.
Speaker 2: But then the fact that I don't know, did he
Speaker 2: not think that anyone.
Speaker 3: Seem like discombobulary right now, because it's just all flashing
Speaker 3: in my head, like the fact that he cuts up
Speaker 3: her body and then disposes of it that way and
Speaker 3: he thinks that's just going to stay in the freaking
Speaker 3: Ouchian forever.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because he did a shitty job. For the fact
Speaker 2: that the torso came to shore.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 2: So I don't know. This guy is just he's disgusting,
Speaker 2: he's stupid, and.
Speaker 1: He's just a prick, and he's just a prick.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Now, investigators also uncovered messages. I already said that part
Speaker 1: my apologies. So these messages, they weren't vague references, you know,
Speaker 1: saying that he wants to do these things, these violent
Speaker 1: scenarios and everything. They outlined very specific methods and were
Speaker 1: tied directly to the environment that he had controlled. And
Speaker 1: now it also became clear that Kim had not been
Speaker 1: the only person Peter had tried to bring on the
Speaker 1: submarine who In the days leading up to August tenth,
Speaker 1: he had contacted multiple women inviting them to join him
Speaker 1: on the submarine under similar circumstances. Now, each time the
Speaker 1: condition was the same. He wanted them to come alone
Speaker 1: and enjoy the ride sort of thing. But for various reasons,
Speaker 1: none of those meetings happened. Kim, though, was ultimately the
Speaker 1: one who agreed. Investigators also looked at what had been
Speaker 1: brought onto the submarine that night. There were tools consistent
Speaker 1: with cutting saws, knives, things that had been present. These
Speaker 1: were not items that you just find in a submarine.
Speaker 1: They were items taken onto the vessel and were later
Speaker 1: recovered in the water. In fact, there are videos of
Speaker 1: Peter because he's, you know what, like an engineer type,
Speaker 1: and he's online, he does interviews, all this sort of thing.
Speaker 1: There's videos of the saw they recovered hanging in the
Speaker 1: background his shop, the very same saw they recovered from
Speaker 1: the bottom of the ocean. These formed a pattern that
Speaker 1: went beyond simple opportunity. It was something that had been
Speaker 1: thought about in advance, and the case against Peter, honestly
Speaker 1: at this point is staggering. It also caught a lot
Speaker 1: of people off guard that Peter was capable of something
Speaker 1: like this, and when words spread, they were taken aback.
Speaker 1: He had spent years presenting himself as a very smart, driven,
Speaker 1: unconventional engineer, for sure, But he had spent years presenting
Speaker 1: himself as a smart, driven, unconventional engineer and known for
Speaker 1: taking on projects outside traditional systems, you know, building rockets
Speaker 1: or submarines with limited resources, and surrounding himself with people
Speaker 1: who were drawn to that kind of ambition that he shared.
Speaker 1: He spoke confidently about his work, positioned himself as someone
Speaker 1: operating beyond normal limits. But the closer investigators and witnesses looked,
Speaker 1: the more that image began to shift. People who had
Speaker 1: interacted with him began to describe a pattern of control
Speaker 1: he preferred to set. The terms of every situation where
Speaker 1: meetings took place, who was present, how conversations unfolded, and
Speaker 1: when those conditions were met. He could come across as
Speaker 1: engaging and focused, but when they weren't, his behavior could
Speaker 1: change extremely quickly. Several women who had been in contact
Speaker 1: with him also described similar experiences. He would invite them
Speaker 1: into environments that he controlled, often isolated settings like the
Speaker 1: submarine or his workshop. Now, the interactions didn't always escalate,
Speaker 1: but there was a consistent pattern in how he structured
Speaker 1: those encounters now By the time the investigation in this case,
Speaker 1: there were also indications that his behavior had been shifting
Speaker 1: in the period leading up to the events. In August
Speaker 1: of twenty seventeen, some people noted increasing instability, along with
Speaker 1: a stronger focus on themes in both his private communications
Speaker 1: and digital activity. During legal evaluations, he was described as
Speaker 1: having narcissistic and psychopathic traits. He was not found to
Speaker 1: be delusional or detached from reality, but instead he was
Speaker 1: considered fully aware of his actions and capable of understanding
Speaker 1: the consequences behind them, and that distinction was important. It
Speaker 1: meant that what had happened inside the submarine could not
Speaker 1: be explained as a loss of control in the moment now. Eventually,
Speaker 1: the case went to trial in March of twenty eighteen
Speaker 1: in Copenhagen, and all the findings in the investigation were
Speaker 1: presented in full peace by peace. Over the course of
Speaker 1: several weeks, more than forty witnesses were called. Investigators outlined
Speaker 1: the submarine, how it had been recovered and examined, and
Speaker 1: explaining why the sinking could not be attributed to mechanical failure.
Speaker 1: Forensic experts detailed the injuries found on Kim's body and
Speaker 1: explained why they were were inconsistent with any of the
Speaker 1: explanations Peter had. Divers and search teams described the recovery
Speaker 1: of the remains and the tools that had been weighing
Speaker 1: them down and discarded in the water. Digital evidence had
Speaker 1: also been presented, including the material found on his computer
Speaker 1: and the communications that outlined violent scenarios connected to the submarine.
Speaker 1: And then Peter himself chose to testify. During his time
Speaker 1: on the stand, he repeated the versions of events he
Speaker 1: had settled on, that Kim had died accidentally while on
Speaker 1: board and that everything that followed had been the result
Speaker 1: of panic. He spoke in detail, often focusing on technical
Speaker 1: explanations and attempting to account for sequences of events in
Speaker 1: ways that distance himself from intent. But the explanations continued
Speaker 1: to conflict with the evidence. Where he described a single
Speaker 1: accidental incident, a forensic finding showed multiple injuries and proved otherwise.
Speaker 1: Where he described panic, the disposal the body and tools
Speaker 1: suggested a series of controlled actions. Each time his account
Speaker 1: was compared to what had been recovered, and it failed
Speaker 1: to align. Throughout the proceedings, he remained composed, at times detached,
Speaker 1: and showed little visible reaction to the details being presented.
Speaker 1: The tone of his testimony did not change even as
Speaker 1: the evidence against him became more direct. But no matter
Speaker 1: what he tried to say, it was obvious that Kim
Speaker 1: boarded the UC three Nautilus on the evening of August tenth,
Speaker 1: and remained on the submarine as it left the harbor.
Speaker 1: There was no point after that where she was ever
Speaker 1: seen leaving the vessel, and no evidence that it returned
Speaker 1: ashore before the events that followed. At some stage after
Speaker 1: her final message was sent to her boyfriend Olay, the
Speaker 1: situation inside the submarine changed. Then at some point in time,
Speaker 1: while on board, she sustained multiple injuries that were not
Speaker 1: consistent with a single accidental event, occurred over time within
Speaker 1: a confined space where no one else was present, only
Speaker 1: her and Peter. Then, at some point after her death,
Speaker 1: her body was dismembered, weighed down, and discarded. This reconstruction
Speaker 1: did not rely on speculation. It was reconstructed directly from
Speaker 1: the evidence that had been recovered. Kim entered that submarine alive,
Speaker 1: and everything that happened to her occurred inside, and she
Speaker 1: did not leave it alive. On April twenty fifth, twenty eighteen,
Speaker 1: the court delivered its verdict after reviewing the full body
Speaker 1: of evidence, the forensic findings, the digital records, and the
Speaker 1: recovery of Kim's remains, and the multiple conflicting accounts given
Speaker 1: by Peter. The judges rejected the explanation that her death
Speaker 1: had been accidental, and Peter Madson was found guilty of murder,
Speaker 1: aggravated sexual assault, and desecration of a corpse. The court
Speaker 1: determed that the attack had been pre planned and carried
Speaker 1: out with intent, not the result of a sudden or
Speaker 1: uncontrolled event. As a result, he was sentenced to life
Speaker 1: in prison.
Speaker 2: Okay, good, there is no world where he would have
Speaker 2: gotten away with this.
Speaker 1: No, definitely not. And I do want to say this
Speaker 1: so too, before we get off topic, it's important to
Speaker 1: note that in Denmark, a life sentence does A life
Speaker 1: sentence doesn't always mean like a fixed number of years,
Speaker 1: but it does represent the most severe punishment available and
Speaker 1: can result in incarceration for the remainder of a person's life.
Speaker 1: But there's no specifics around what life really means.
Speaker 2: Okay, but I mean, let's just hope that he's in
Speaker 2: there for the rest of his life.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Now, Peter of course appealed the verdict, arguing that
Speaker 1: the sentence was disproportionate and the circumstances did not support
Speaker 1: the conviction for premeditated murder, but that appeal was denied. Now,
Speaker 1: for years after the conviction, Peter Can continued to maintain
Speaker 1: that Kim's death was not intentional, even after the evidence
Speaker 1: that had been presented in court. Even after the verdict
Speaker 1: and sentencing, he still held that version of events that
Speaker 1: framed what had happened was an accident, saying he didn't
Speaker 1: do it on purpose.
Speaker 2: He's obviously freaking delusional.
Speaker 1: He is. The details shifted over time in the story
Speaker 1: that he was telling though, like he like, well this
Speaker 1: or well that, but basically what he's saying he didn't
Speaker 1: mean to kill her all in all.
Speaker 2: I mean, he is good at storytelling, I'll give him that,
Speaker 2: but I can't see the escalation of this. Her body
Speaker 2: now being in like different garbage bags at the bottom
Speaker 2: of the sea and stuff. But yeah, he didn't mean
Speaker 2: to do it. I don't, just know.
Speaker 1: I disagree. As a storyteller myself, I disagree and say
Speaker 1: he's a terrible storyteller. Okay, I gotta say that.
Speaker 2: Well, I mean I can understand. I guess I screwed up,
Speaker 2: like I'm not going to get away with this, like
Speaker 2: going to hide it, and you kind of your body
Speaker 2: just maybe goes through these emotions, but not the motions
Speaker 2: of dismembering a body. I don't think. I don't know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but there's there's what two different avenues you can play.
Speaker 1: One it was an accident I panicked, or two I
Speaker 1: blocked out. They literally proved he could not call it
Speaker 1: I blocked out scenario, So he's literally he's only going
Speaker 1: with the other option. Yeah that, Oh, it was an accident,
Speaker 1: which is one of the most obvious and shitty cover ups.
Speaker 2: Ever, Yeah, and it's so interesting too to just I
Speaker 2: don't know. At one point, just like admit it, admit
Speaker 2: that you're a frickin monster and you did this well.
Speaker 1: In twenty twenty, while in prison, Peter took part in
Speaker 1: a documentary project in which a journalist recorded hours of
Speaker 1: conversation with him, and during one of those interviews, he
Speaker 1: was asked directly whether he killed Kim. He said yes, okay.
Speaker 1: He stated that he was responsible for her death and
Speaker 1: acknowledge that he had committed the crime, and this marked
Speaker 1: the very first time he admitted that what happened inside
Speaker 1: the submarine that day was in fact intentional. So he
Speaker 1: did come out and admit it eventually. Now he didn't
Speaker 1: have anything to gain. He didn't have anything to lose
Speaker 1: at that point either.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: After the trial and sentencing, Peter was placed in a
Speaker 1: high security prison to serve his life sentence. So I
Speaker 1: guess that, combined with a bit of time to sit
Speaker 1: on it, made him feel like you could finally speak
Speaker 1: the truth.
Speaker 2: Well, honestly, at that point, I do, I feel like
Speaker 2: you would have maybe something to gain, because then you
Speaker 2: can be like admitting your actions and then show remorse
Speaker 2: and continue and like start your rehabilitation. And that may
Speaker 2: look good.
Speaker 1: For you potentially, but there's something coming up here that
Speaker 1: will directly disagree with that statement.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: Now, whether he spoke about the truth or not, either way,
Speaker 1: the truth was already out there. People already knew that
Speaker 1: he had killed her. He just finally admitted it, both legally,
Speaker 1: you know, and in the emittance. And now his time passed,
Speaker 1: things surrounding the story just kind of started to settle.
Speaker 1: And then in October of twenty twenty, that very same
Speaker 1: year when he admitted it, Peter made another move. He
Speaker 1: escaped from prison.
Speaker 2: Oh okay, was not expecting.
Speaker 1: That, which directly contradicts him trying to be a model prisoner.
Speaker 2: And Hooks sure does.
Speaker 1: Now, while behind bars, Peter managed to create for himself
Speaker 1: something that looked like a gun while in prison. Now
Speaker 1: it wasn't, but it was convincing enough that he was
Speaker 1: able to threaten officers inside the prison and get them
Speaker 1: to let him out. CCTV footage captured shows Peter fleeing
Speaker 1: from the prison with officers pursuing behind him, and thankfully,
Speaker 1: he didn't make it.
Speaker 2: Very far, oh thank goodness.
Speaker 1: However, it still wasn't over see. He also created a
Speaker 1: bomb replica that he strapped to his body, again not real.
Speaker 1: So while he was held at gunpoint with literal snipers
Speaker 1: pointing the barrel at him, he was sitting on a
Speaker 1: patch of grass, surrounded, nowhere to go, and police worked
Speaker 1: with the situation and eventually figured out that it was
Speaker 1: not real. They were able to put him in cuffs
Speaker 1: and back behind bars. Now, after everything that had happened,
Speaker 1: for Kim's family and those who knew her as well,
Speaker 1: the focus did not stay on the way that her
Speaker 1: life had ended. Instead, it shifted back to the work
Speaker 1: she had spent years building. Kim had made a career
Speaker 1: out of telling other people's stories, often people who didn't
Speaker 1: have a PlantForm or whose experiences were overlooked, and that
Speaker 1: approach became the foundation for how her story would be
Speaker 1: carried forward. The goal wasn't to define her by what
Speaker 1: had happened to her on the submarine on August tenth,
Speaker 1: twenty seventeen, but instead it keeps the focus on who
Speaker 1: she had been and what she had contributed to Her
Speaker 1: family established the Kim Wall Memorial Fund, which as an
Speaker 1: initiative design to support female journalists working on projects that
Speaker 1: reflect the kind of reporting that she had pursued. The
Speaker 1: Fund provides grants for independent reporting around the world, continuing
Speaker 1: the same type of work that had defined her career,
Speaker 1: stories rooted in curiosity, persistence, and willingness to go further
Speaker 1: than surface level narratives. In the years following her death,
Speaker 1: her work has continued to be read, shared, and translated
Speaker 1: all across the globe. The stories she has already written
Speaker 1: remain part of public record, and new attention has been
Speaker 1: brought to the subjects that she has already covered. But
Speaker 1: for those closest to her, the focus remains consistent. They
Speaker 1: choose to speak about her as a journalist, about her
Speaker 1: as a person, and as someone who has spent her
Speaker 1: life trying to understand the world and explain it to others.
Speaker 1: What happened to her became part of her story. Yes,
Speaker 1: that's true, but it did not define it. And from
Speaker 1: one storyteller to another, I want to name Kim Wall
Speaker 1: the badass of the day today because that's her story,
Speaker 1: the story of Kim Wall.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, what an incredible woman. Definitely this story, Yeah,
Speaker 2: this is like a bizarre one, it I mean, it's
Speaker 2: kind of sad too, because you just think like, there's
Speaker 2: no way that she would have thought something like this
Speaker 2: would have happened to her in a situation not a chance, right,
Speaker 2: So she just had no way of protecting herself or
Speaker 2: even knowing I guess you know that she could have
Speaker 2: potentially been in danger. And that's just really sad.
Speaker 1: There was no foresight in the situation. I mean, she's
Speaker 1: literally been in war ridden third world countries and for this,
Speaker 1: this was just a night out to go and this
Speaker 1: is small town reporting to her sort of thing. It's
Speaker 1: a small story. She should have been safe.
Speaker 2: Well, because especially this guy being known too write exactly.
Speaker 2: It just I feel like no red flags other than
Speaker 2: I guess going on a submarine would have been going off.
Speaker 1: No, not a one, especially considering there's there's already articles
Speaker 1: out there, there's already news casts and and things going
Speaker 1: on with interviews with Peter and everything. Why would she
Speaker 1: think otherwise people have talked to him. What's different She's
Speaker 1: going to be another one to talk to him, maybe
Speaker 1: look at a different angle, maybe get a different experience
Speaker 1: or different quote. Sure, but it's been done. Why would
Speaker 1: this one be any different? Yeah, as far as safety,
Speaker 1: goes anyways, I'm sure her perspective, her story would have
Speaker 1: been different, but safety should have been the same.
Speaker 2: But at that time he had just decided to just.
Speaker 1: He was a perverted piece of shit.
Speaker 2: Well, and it escalated, right, and he decided this was
Speaker 2: going to be the time that he let it get
Speaker 2: go too far.
Speaker 1: Yeah, act out as fantasy.
Speaker 2: Finally, gosh, oh the poor thing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I hope that man rots. There is a website
Speaker 1: you can go as well and read Kim's articles and everything.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's Remembering Kim Wall. So if you want to
Speaker 1: go there and check out, you know, some of her writings,
Speaker 1: and it's got tributes and things like awards and all
Speaker 1: that sort of things on there. I do recommend it.
Speaker 1: It's a great website. I went through a few of
Speaker 1: her articles. I'm going to go through more to say
Speaker 1: the list.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean those short like way too short. Her
Speaker 2: life was way too short. I mean, one silver lining
Speaker 2: is that she did it seems as though she lived
Speaker 2: a very beautiful life she did prior to this, right,
Speaker 2: So I mean maybe that that does it gives you
Speaker 2: a little bit of comfort, I suppose, But still this
Speaker 2: should not have happened.
Speaker 1: No, it shouldn't have. She lived her life well, but
Speaker 1: she should have lived far longer.
Speaker 2: Yeah, she had a lot more. They were just about
Speaker 2: to move. She was so close right to just this
Speaker 2: not happening. So it's really too bad.
Speaker 1: It is, but thank you for being here. Hopefully you
Speaker 1: guys get a chance to go check out our website
Speaker 1: and read some of her work. Like guys, like I said,
Speaker 1: it is good. I could. I wish I could write
Speaker 1: like she does. I strive to hopefully one day. But yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm going to drink the rest of this drink in
Speaker 1: the name for King Kim Wall and I'm just gonna
Speaker 1: leave it at that. Thank you for being here, and
Speaker 1: until next time. Until next time, stay wicked bo