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<v Speaker 1>Have you ever found yourself feeling well stuck caught between

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<v Speaker 1>two really powerful forces in the IT world, Like, on

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<v Speaker 1>one side, you're pushing hard for that lightning fast delivery,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, the agility of a startup, but then on

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<v Speaker 1>the other you're grappling with these established processes and let's

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<v Speaker 1>face it, the absolute need for stability and control.

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<v Speaker 2>It's a real tension, isn't it a common one?

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<v Speaker 1>Exactly? It feels fundamental. Well, you are definitely not alone

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<v Speaker 1>if you feel that. We've got a fascinating deep dive

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<v Speaker 1>for you today exploring exactly how to reconcile that tension.

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<v Speaker 1>We're diving right into the intersection of ITYL and debops. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>our focus today is based on Abynav Krishna Kaiser's insightful book,

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<v Speaker 1>Reinventing IYLE in the Age of Debops.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right, And our mission here really is to unpack

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<v Speaker 2>how these two powerful approaches, which let's be honest, often

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<v Speaker 2>seem like they're contrasting. Yeah, how they can not just

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<v Speaker 2>coexist but actually thrive together. Think of it as a

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<v Speaker 2>shortcut maybe to understanding this critical evolution in IT service management.

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<v Speaker 2>We want to explore those perceived conflicts sure, but more

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<v Speaker 2>importantly reveal some innovative techniques to make processes genuinely agile

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<v Speaker 2>and relevant for today. So you get the clarity you

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<v Speaker 2>need to navigate this landscape without feeling overwhelmed.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so let's start there. Then let's unpack this apparent

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<v Speaker 1>clash because yeah, on the surface, they can really seem

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<v Speaker 1>like oil and water. So on one side we have DevOps. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>most of you listening are probably familiar with the push

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<v Speaker 1>for DevOps. It was borne out of this craving for

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<v Speaker 1>fast turnarounds, solving those painful agility problems and really dramatically

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<v Speaker 1>increase in productivity and quality and software delivery.

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<v Speaker 2>And it's fundamentally cultural, wouldn't you say?

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<v Speaker 1>Oh? Absolutely, it's a cultural transformation, a powerful union of

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<v Speaker 1>development and operations teams. We saw it evolve clearly from

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<v Speaker 1>that old sequential waterfall model, which oh man felt like

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<v Speaker 1>trying to build a skyscraper without seeing the blueprint for months. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>to the agile manifest show back in two thousand and one,

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<v Speaker 1>which really emphasized fluidity and small, manageable iterations at its core.

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<v Speaker 1>DevOps kind of lives by that Calmo's acronym culture automation, lean, measurement,

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<v Speaker 1>and sharing.

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<v Speaker 2>And culture's key, Like Peter Drucker said, culture eats strategy for.

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<v Speaker 1>Breakfast exactly, and DevOps it's truly about overhauling behavior, changing

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<v Speaker 1>how people work together. And just to give you a

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<v Speaker 1>sense of the sheer speed and scale DevOps enables, think

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<v Speaker 1>about Amazon back in twenty eleven, over one thousand deployments

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<v Speaker 1>per hour per hour. That's not just faster. That's a

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<v Speaker 1>different galaxy of speed.

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<v Speaker 2>It really is. And what's fascinating is contrasting that with

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<v Speaker 2>the other side of this perceived divide. It TEL now

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<v Speaker 2>many listeners will know, IDEL is the backbone for traditional

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<v Speaker 2>IT service management. It was really established in that earlier

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<v Speaker 2>waterfall era where stability and control were.

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<v Speaker 1>Absolutely paramount, right, the focus was different totally.

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<v Speaker 2>Eyetel is fundamentally service centric. Its official definition emphasizes delivering

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<v Speaker 2>value to customers by facililitating outcomes they want without them

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<v Speaker 2>awning the specific costs and risks, and the framework itself

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<v Speaker 2>is structured around a service life cycle with five sequential

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<v Speaker 2>phases service strategy, service design, service transitions, service operation, and

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<v Speaker 2>continual service improvement. You have to go through them in

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<v Speaker 2>order sequentially. Yeah, and crucially for our discussion today, ITIL

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<v Speaker 2>defines functions, which are essentially specialized teams like networking or

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<v Speaker 2>Java teams. These often maybe inavertently create those silos we

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<v Speaker 2>hear so much about. And it defines processes, these very structured,

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<v Speaker 2>predictable sequences designed for control and stability. Inputs triggers, outputs,

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<v Speaker 2>very defined.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so we've got these two powerhouses, but they seem

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<v Speaker 1>built on different foundations. So what happens when they collide

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<v Speaker 1>in an organization? The book points out some big ticket

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<v Speaker 1>conflicts things many of us have probably felt. First That

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<v Speaker 1>core difference sequential versus concurrent.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's a big one.

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<v Speaker 1>Idle strictly sequential phases, you must finish strategy before design,

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<v Speaker 1>design before build. That can feel like hitting a concrete

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<v Speaker 1>wall when you're trying to move fast.

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<v Speaker 2>Right, Absolutely, While DevOps is inherently anti sequential, it's iterative,

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<v Speaker 2>expects output almost right away, often in parallel.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's like building a house floor by floor versus

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know, starting the plumbing while the foundation's still setting.

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<v Speaker 1>It's a different mindset completely. Then there's batch sizes. Idle

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<v Speaker 1>often leads to one big piece of delivery after a

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<v Speaker 1>really long cycle, and we all know how risky that.

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<v Speaker 2>Can be huge risk. If it fails, it fails big.

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<v Speaker 1>Whereas DevOps champions small batches sprints. The whole idea is

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<v Speaker 1>to reduce that risk and allow for quick, continuous changes.

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<v Speaker 2>Delivering value incrementally. It's like small gifts daily versus one giant,

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<v Speaker 2>risky present once a year.

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<v Speaker 1>Good analogy, and Third, feedback, IDLE traditionally formalizes feedback way

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<v Speaker 1>at the end in continual service.

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<v Speaker 2>Improvement, often too late to make meaningful changes to what

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<v Speaker 2>was just delivered right.

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<v Speaker 1>DevOps, though, demands rapid feedback every step of the way,

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<v Speaker 1>constant tests demos, often within those tight two week sprint cycles.

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<v Speaker 2>You're getting feedback almost constantly.

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<v Speaker 1>Then we have the silo culture versus the single team

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<v Speaker 1>aisle's functional silos, just by their nature create boundaries and handoffs.

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<v Speaker 2>Which leads to delays, misunderstandings.

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<v Speaker 1>Exactly dev ups pushes for that one team, one software approach.

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<v Speaker 1>Tear down the walls, remove the confusion, the miscommunication, the

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<v Speaker 1>mistrust between dev and.

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<v Speaker 2>OX, get everyone pulling in the same direction.

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<v Speaker 1>And finally, there's this perception that well continuous deployment makes

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<v Speaker 1>release management irrelevant because changes just go street to production

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<v Speaker 1>without all the traditional heavy governance steps, right, Like.

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<v Speaker 2>The need for a formal release team just vanishes.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>We'll dig into whether that's actually true later.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's a really interesting point.

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<v Speaker 2>But you know, despite these apparent conflicts, and they are

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<v Speaker 2>real conflicts in many places. Yeah, the core argument in

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<v Speaker 2>the book and what we're seeing in practice is that

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<v Speaker 2>it PO can adapt, It really can't. DevOps isn't necessarily

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<v Speaker 2>about throwing out decades of ityl learning. It's more about

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<v Speaker 2>creating a union of mindsets.

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<v Speaker 1>A union of mindsets, I like that.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, adapting the framework to the digital age, taking the

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<v Speaker 2>best of iipel's governance and stability, but supercharging it with

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<v Speaker 2>devops' speed and agility.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so how do we actually do that? This is

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<v Speaker 1>where it gets really interesting, right, because the key to

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<v Speaker 1>bridging this divide seems to lie in three common elements

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<v Speaker 1>that enable that DevOps cultural change, people, process, and technology

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<v Speaker 1>a classic triad exactly. Let's start with people, specifically, those

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<v Speaker 1>team structures. Traditionally, itol functions group specialists, technical management, application

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<v Speaker 1>management into separate silos that often created those us versus

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<v Speaker 1>them dynamics. We just talked about walls between teams, but

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<v Speaker 1>in a DevOps world, the shift is towards building teams

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<v Speaker 1>around an application. You bring all the necessary roles developers, testers,

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<v Speaker 1>opspos into a single.

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<v Speaker 2>Team, one team responsible and to.

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<v Speaker 1>End right, this team becomes the Alpha and Omega, as

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<v Speaker 1>the book puts it, for both developing and maintaining that application, and.

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<v Speaker 2>That structure naturally fosters a flat hierarchy. Shared responsibility replaces

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<v Speaker 2>those old many hierarchies within silos.

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<v Speaker 1>Which fundamentally removes a lot of the conflicts of interest,

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<v Speaker 1>doesn't it No more pointing fingers down the line precisely.

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<v Speaker 2>And this model also brings in key agile roles. You've

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<v Speaker 2>got the product owner.

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<v Speaker 1>The customer's voice, and the team.

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<v Speaker 2>Exactly embedded in the team providing constant feedback, steering the

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<v Speaker 2>direction based on business value.

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<v Speaker 1>And the scrum master.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, the scrum master acting more like a servant leader

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<v Speaker 2>whose main job is clearing away impediments, helping the team

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<v Speaker 2>focus purely on delivery.

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<v Speaker 1>So it's not just changing job titles. It's a really

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<v Speaker 1>profound shift in accountability and how people collaborate.

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, and once you have the right people in these

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<v Speaker 2>new collaborative structures. The next question is, well, how do

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<v Speaker 2>we orchestrate their work efficiently that brings us squarely to

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<v Speaker 2>process or what the book calls Agile integration. DevOps introduces

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<v Speaker 2>some specific processes on top of basic Agile methods to

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<v Speaker 2>really accelerate delivery. First, you've got continuous integration or CI.

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<v Speaker 2>This is where developers merge their code changes back into

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<v Speaker 2>the main branch frequently, often multiple.

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<v Speaker 1>Times a day, and the key is automation right totally.

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<v Speaker 2>These integrations are immediately verified by automated builds and tests.

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<v Speaker 2>It drastically minimizes conflicts and catches errors super early. Think

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<v Speaker 2>of it like a constant automated sanity check for the codebase.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, CI, then what Then?

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<v Speaker 2>You have continuous delivery CD. This means that every change

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<v Speaker 2>that passes all the automated tests is automatically pushed to

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<v Speaker 2>a staging or pre production environment. The binaries are qualified

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<v Speaker 2>for production deployment.

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<v Speaker 1>Qualified, but not necessarily deployed yet exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>The actual deployment to production still needs a manual trigger,

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<v Speaker 2>a human decision. But your software is always ready to

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<v Speaker 2>go live. It's sitting in a launch pad button ready.

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<v Speaker 1>Got it ready? But waiting for the go ahead.

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<v Speaker 2>Right, and then finally there's continuous deployment. This takes continuous

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<v Speaker 2>delivery one step further. Every change that passes all the

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<v Speaker 2>tests is not just qualified, it's automatically deployed all the

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<v Speaker 2>way to production.

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<v Speaker 1>Whoa, so the button press is automated too.

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<v Speaker 2>Essentially, Yes, every successful build automatically goes live. That really

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<v Speaker 2>pushes the envelope on speed and requires a huge amount

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<v Speaker 2>of trust in your automation and testing. Wow.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, that distinction between continuous delivery ready to deploy and

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<v Speaker 1>continuous deployment actually is deployed automatically. That seems crucial. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>defines the level of automation.

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<v Speaker 2>And well trust, it really does.

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<v Speaker 1>And these processes ci CD they obviously rely heavily on

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<v Speaker 1>technology automation tools.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, the third piece of the triad.

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<v Speaker 1>The book rightly emphasizes that technology is often seen as

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<v Speaker 1>the most important bit for getting those rapid results.

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<v Speaker 2>Because it's tangible.

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<v Speaker 1>You can buy a tool, right, But as you said earlier,

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<v Speaker 1>it's pretty useless without the right people and processes where

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<v Speaker 1>and sync.

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, but the tech has been a massive enabler. Automation

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<v Speaker 2>has completely changed the game for infrastructure.

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<v Speaker 1>Like infrastructure as code.

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<v Speaker 2>Exactly, instead of manually building servers over weeks, you can

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<v Speaker 2>spin up complex environments from code in minutes than cloud

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<v Speaker 2>platforms aws, Azure, Google Compute Engine. They make this dynamic

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<v Speaker 2>provisioning possible.

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<v Speaker 1>So no more waiting weeks for a server hopefully not.

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<v Speaker 2>And then there are specific tools for different parts of

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<v Speaker 2>the pipeline. Distributed version control like GIT is huge. It

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<v Speaker 2>provides that safety net for rapid changes, letting teams experiment

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<v Speaker 2>collaboratively in ways older systems like SVN just couldn't handle easily.

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<v Speaker 1>Branching is so much easier.

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<v Speaker 2>Much easier. Then you have orchestrators like Jenkins or Bamboo.

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<v Speaker 2>They're not just scheduling tasks, they're codifying your entire release pipeline,

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<v Speaker 2>turning complex manual handoffs into predictable, repeatable, transparent.

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<v Speaker 1>Workflows, making the process visible.

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<v Speaker 2>Visible and automated configuration management tools like Puppet and Chef

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<v Speaker 2>automates server setups, application can figs ensuring consistency everywhere. No

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<v Speaker 2>more works on my.

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<v Speaker 1>Machine, huh, We've all heard that one in.

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<v Speaker 2>Automated testing tools like Selenium or Cucumber provide those crucial

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<v Speaker 2>quality checks, ensuring speed doesn't rex stability quality gates exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>And one more important distinction the book makes artifact repositories.

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<v Speaker 2>These store the machine readable binaries, the deployable units. They're

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<v Speaker 2>distinct from source code repositories, which hold the human readable

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<v Speaker 2>code and scripts. Both are critical, but for different stages. Right,

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<v Speaker 2>one holds the recipe, the other holds the baked cake,

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<v Speaker 2>ready to deliver perfect analogy precisely. So to really see

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<v Speaker 2>this union of mindsets in action, we need to get

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<v Speaker 2>a bit more granular. Now, let's zoom in on how

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<v Speaker 2>some of idyl's most critical processes are being fundamentally reinvented

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<v Speaker 2>when you infuse them with these DevOps principles.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, yeah, let's do that. Where should we start. How

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<v Speaker 1>about service transition, managing changes in assets?

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<v Speaker 2>Good place. So change management in idle definistion is the addition, removal,

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<v Speaker 2>or modification of anything that could have an effect on

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<v Speaker 2>it services. Historically, it acted as.

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<v Speaker 1>A gatekeeper and often felt, let's be honest, pretty rigid bureaucratic.

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<v Speaker 1>Lots of approvals, cab meetings.

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<v Speaker 2>It could definitely slow things down. But here's where the

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<v Speaker 2>book offers a really a potentially game changing insight. It

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<v Speaker 2>talks about maximum agility with standard changes.

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<v Speaker 1>Standard changes, Okay, what does that mean in this context?

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<v Speaker 2>It's about intelligently segmenting your change workload. The analysis suggests

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<v Speaker 2>that a huge chunk, maybe sixty seventy percent of all

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<v Speaker 2>changes are actually low risk, low impact and highly repeatable.

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<v Speaker 2>Think patching minor can figure up dates.

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<v Speaker 1>May think you do all the time, exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>So the idea is identify these, define them clearly, test

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<v Speaker 2>the process thoroughly, and then preapprove.

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<v Speaker 1>Them preapproved so they bypass the usual CAD.

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<v Speaker 2>For the most part. Yes, they bypass multiple time consuming

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<v Speaker 2>approval steps. This significantly boost productivity and lets the change

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<v Speaker 2>management process focus its energy on the truly complex, high

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<v Speaker 2>risk changes.

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<v Speaker 1>That makes a lot of sense, freeing up cognitive load exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>The book even mentions an anecdote and organization saved over

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<v Speaker 2>half a million dollars annually just by properly implementing standard changes.

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<v Speaker 1>Wow, but how do you build the trust needed for

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<v Speaker 1>that pre approval? Doesn't it still feel risky to some

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<v Speaker 1>parts of the business.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh? Absolutely, it requires a cultural shift towards trust, yes,

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<v Speaker 2>but also really robust automation and monitoring to prove that

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<v Speaker 2>these standard changes truly are low risk and well tested,

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<v Speaker 2>And it's not about abandoning governance entirely. It's about shifting

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<v Speaker 2>where you apply it.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, So how does that work with continuous delivery or deployment.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, with continuous delivery, where there's still a manual trigger

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<v Speaker 2>for production, you might still have a COIB approval for

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<v Speaker 2>that specific deployment. But with continuous deployment, where everything is automated, yea,

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<v Speaker 2>the change Advisory Board often shifts its focus. Instead of

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<v Speaker 2>approving individual deployments, they approve the pipeline itself. If the

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<v Speaker 2>whole automated process, the testing and the quality gates. Once

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<v Speaker 2>the pipeline is trusted, it can run, allowing multiple daily

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<v Speaker 2>deployments without individual cab blessings for each one.

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<v Speaker 1>So the governance moves upstream to the process itself exactly Now.

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<v Speaker 2>Still within service transition, there's Service Asset and Configuration Management sacm.

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<v Speaker 1>AH, the CMDB, the heart of service management. Some call it.

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<v Speaker 2>It is the configuration management database, tracking all those configuration

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<v Speaker 2>items cis and their relationships. In the old world, it

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<v Speaker 2>could sometimes feel like a static inventory, maybe only updated quarterly,

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<v Speaker 2>a bit dusty sometimes, but in a DevOps world. The

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<v Speaker 2>CMDB isn't just for auditing production anymore. It becomes critical

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<v Speaker 2>for dynamic environment provisioning, spinning up test environments that mirror

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<v Speaker 2>production accurately. It's vital for rapid impact assessment. If this

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<v Speaker 2>component changes, what else is effected across all environments and

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<v Speaker 2>managing dependencies. Knowing application B relies on service C.

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<v Speaker 1>So it becomes a living map integrated into the workflow.

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<v Speaker 2>Precisely and alongside the CMDB, the Source Code Repository SCR

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<v Speaker 2>like it becomes that single source of truth for all

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<v Speaker 2>the code, the infrastructure scripts, the configuration files. It enables collaboration,

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<v Speaker 2>tracks every change, and provides that safety net for experimentation.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so the CMDB and SCR become active, vital parts

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<v Speaker 1>of the pipeline, not just after the fact records. That's

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<v Speaker 1>a big shift, huge shift, all right, Moving on from transition,

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<v Speaker 1>what about service operation keeping the lights on, keeping things

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<v Speaker 1>running smoothly. Let's talk incident management.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay. Itill's goal here as simple, restore service to its

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<v Speaker 2>normal state as quickly as.

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<v Speaker 1>Possible, minimize the disruption. Right.

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<v Speaker 2>The typical flow is identify the incident users, calling monitoring tools,

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<v Speaker 2>firing it staff noticing, then analysis, maybe escalation L one

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<v Speaker 2>to L two L three.

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<v Speaker 1>The usual path. How does DevOps change that?

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<v Speaker 2>What's really transformative here is that the DevOps team itself

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<v Speaker 2>often acts as L three support for incidents related to

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<v Speaker 2>their applications, code or recent changes.

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<v Speaker 1>So the people who wrote the code are fixing it directly.

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<v Speaker 2>Often yes, the resolving incidents in parallel with their development work.

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<v Speaker 2>They might pull the production codebase onto a separate branch,

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<v Speaker 2>diagnose the issue, fix it, test it, and deploy the

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<v Speaker 2>fix rapidly through the same automated pipeline.

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<v Speaker 1>Wow. Their intimate knowledge must lead to much faster resolution.

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<v Speaker 2>Times, incredibly faster. Usually it's like having the architect in

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<v Speaker 2>the builder on site immediately when a pipe bursts, instead

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<v Speaker 2>of calling a separate maintenance hotline and waiting. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Makes sense, But even with that speed, some idel disciplines still.

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<v Speaker 2>Matter, right absolutely. Even though the pace is fast, itil's

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<v Speaker 2>robust knowledge management process is still vital, capturing learnings from

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<v Speaker 2>incidents quickly making them searchable. That, coupled with good configuration

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<v Speaker 2>management data from the CMDB, is crucial for quick analysis

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<v Speaker 2>and effective resolution. You don't want to solve the same

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<v Speaker 2>problem twice.

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<v Speaker 1>So capture the knowledge, use the CMDB for context.

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<v Speaker 2>Got it and related to incidents. But distinct is problem.

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<v Speaker 1>Management ah, the detective work exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>This is the investigation unit, the CSI of IT service management.

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<v Speaker 2>Its role isn't just to fix the immediate disruption that's

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<v Speaker 2>incident management, but to find the underlying cause of one

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<v Speaker 2>or more incidents to prevent them from happening again.

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<v Speaker 1>So differentiating is key incident disruption, problem root cause precisely.

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<v Speaker 2>Example, the application crashes frequently, that's a series of incidents.

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<v Speaker 2>The unknown bug causing the crashes, that's the problem. It's

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<v Speaker 2>the difference between constantly mopping up a leak versus finding

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<v Speaker 2>and fixing the leaky pipe.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, and ITIL has techniques for this.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, things like the five Y technique just keep asking

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<v Speaker 2>why until you get to the route, or the Ishikawa

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<v Speaker 2>diagram the fishbone diagram to map out potential causes. These

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<v Speaker 2>are still incredibly useful.

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<v Speaker 1>So how does problem management fit into the fast pace

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<v Speaker 1>of dubops.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, things like unresolvable defects those bugs found during development

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<v Speaker 2>that maybe have minimal impact but still need a proper fix.

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<v Speaker 2>Eventually they become direct inputs to the problem management process.

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<v Speaker 2>The problem manager, who might be part of a shared

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<v Speaker 2>services team or even embedded within larger DevOps teams, works

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<v Speaker 2>to prioritize these problems. The resolution then gets fed back

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<v Speaker 2>into the development backlog, planned into sprints.

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<v Speaker 1>Ah, so the fix becomes a work item for the

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<v Speaker 1>DevOps team.

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<v Speaker 2>Exactly. The solution is developed, tested through the CICD pipeline,

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<v Speaker 2>and deployed like any other feature or fix, ensuring permanent

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<v Speaker 2>solutions are rolled out efficiently.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, that integration makes sense, and that leads us nicely

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<v Speaker 1>to release management, actually delivering these changes and fixes with

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<v Speaker 1>speed and control.

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<v Speaker 2>Right ITIL traditionally defined releases as a collection of changes,

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<v Speaker 2>often bundled into release units or release.

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<v Speaker 1>Packages, and deployment approach is varied.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you had the big bang, everything goes out at once,

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<v Speaker 2>high risk, high reward. Maybe be risk definitely or the

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<v Speaker 2>phased approach, which is much more common now deploying to

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<v Speaker 2>specific regions or user groups in stages. Think about how

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<v Speaker 2>iOS updates roll out.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, not everyone gets it on day one exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>That phased approach is great for managing risk, learning quickly

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<v Speaker 2>from a smaller group, and minimizing the blast radius if

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<v Speaker 2>something does go wrong.

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<v Speaker 1>So how does this look in DevOps? Releases still exist, right, Oh.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, but release management becomes much more iterative. For longer

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<v Speaker 2>projects or coordinated releases across multiple teams. You often see

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<v Speaker 2>planning done through agile release trains arts, a concept from

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<v Speaker 2>the scaled agile framework.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, but here's another one of those provocative points from

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<v Speaker 1>the source material. Automation has simply killed the release management

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<v Speaker 1>team for the repetitive stuff.

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<v Speaker 2>Uh. Yeah, that's a bold statement, but there's truth to it.

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<v Speaker 1>So if the machines handle the gruntwork, the building, the testing,

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<v Speaker 1>the deploying, what's left for humans and release management.

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<v Speaker 2>It's the cognitive work, the planning, the strategic thinking, the

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<v Speaker 2>risk assessment, coordinating dependencies between teams, the final GONA GO reviews,

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<v Speaker 2>the communication, the post release and analysis. These things still

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<v Speaker 2>absolutely require human intelligence and judgment. Automation handles the how

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<v Speaker 2>humans focus on the what, why, and when.

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<v Speaker 1>So the role evolves, it doesn't necessarily disappear. It becomes

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<v Speaker 1>more strategic, exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>It's a powerful shift in focus. And this transformation also

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<v Speaker 2>brings deployment strategies like blue Green deployment to the forefront.

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<v Speaker 1>AH blue Green explain that quickly.

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<v Speaker 2>Sure, it's a fantastic way to achieve deployments with effectively

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<v Speaker 2>zero downtime. You run two identical production environments in parallel.

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<v Speaker 2>Let's call them blue and green.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, two identical setups.

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<v Speaker 2>Right, one say, Blue is live serving all your user traffic,

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<v Speaker 2>the other, Green is idle or passive. You deploy your

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<v Speaker 2>new release to the green.

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<v Speaker 1>Environment while Blue is still running the old version exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>You can then thoroughly test Green smoke tests, integration tests,

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<v Speaker 2>maybe even route some internal traffic to it. Once you're

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<v Speaker 2>completely confident, you flip the switch. You redirect all the

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<v Speaker 2>live traffic from Blue to Green. Green is now live

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<v Speaker 2>serving the new version. Blue is now idle and becomes

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<v Speaker 2>your rollback environment if needed, or the staging area for

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<v Speaker 2>the next release.

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<v Speaker 1>Slick like having a standby runway, always ready for takeoff.

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<v Speaker 1>Continuous availability.

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<v Speaker 2>That's the goal.

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<v Speaker 1>And this brings us to another really significant role transformation

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<v Speaker 1>mentioned in the book, the product owners. They're emerging as

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<v Speaker 1>the new release managers.

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<v Speaker 2>That's a fascinating point.

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<v Speaker 1>Why them, Well, think about their position. They're already close

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<v Speaker 1>to the business understanding the value proposition. They're deeply embedded

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<v Speaker 1>with the development team understanding the features, and they need

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<v Speaker 1>to coordinate with operations for smooth delivery, so they have

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<v Speaker 1>that end to end view exactly. They're ideally suited for

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<v Speaker 1>that end to end release ownership, managing not just the

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<v Speaker 1>scope but also the cost, the schedule, and the quality

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<v Speaker 1>what the source calls the quadruple constraints of project management.

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<v Speaker 2>So it's not just about what features are in the release,

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<v Speaker 2>but the entire delivery package. Right.

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<v Speaker 1>It signals a fundamental ship embedding that business context directly

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<v Speaker 1>into the release process, moving away from it acting as

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<v Speaker 1>a separate gatekeeper towards being an integrated value delivery partner.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, so if we pull all these threads together, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>the big picture here isn't about choosing ITIL or DevOps.

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<v Speaker 1>Now it seems much more nuanced.

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<v Speaker 2>It really is. It's about leveraging idol's foundational strengths, the governance,

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<v Speaker 2>the service centric view, the process discipline, but infusing it

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<v Speaker 2>with DevOps emphasis on speed, agility, collaboration, and crucially automation.

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<v Speaker 2>This combination allows organizations to actually meet the relentless demands

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<v Speaker 2>of the digital age.

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<v Speaker 1>Without throwing the baby out with the bathwater, Without sacrificing

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<v Speaker 1>stability or control precisely, Yeah, because this adaptation, this synergy,

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<v Speaker 1>it seems to provide the ability to deliver fast and

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<v Speaker 1>to minimize the number of bugs. As the book says,

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<v Speaker 1>you get speed, but you also maintain those robust controls,

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<v Speaker 1>the transparency, and that relentless focus on customer value.

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<v Speaker 2>It's about being pragmatic, you know, cutting the unnecessary bureaucracy,

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<v Speaker 2>the performative processes and truly empowering teams to deliver their

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<v Speaker 2>best work.

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<v Speaker 1>Which ultimately makes it a much more strategic asset, doesn't it.

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, this evolution ensures that even with all these rapid

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<v Speaker 2>continuous changes, the core objectives service, stability, quality, business alignment

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<v Speaker 2>are still met. It helps it become a true integrated

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<v Speaker 2>partner in the business, driving value, not just a support

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<v Speaker 2>function reacting to tickets.

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<v Speaker 1>Proactive, not just reactive.

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<v Speaker 2>Exactly, it's an evolution that makes it far more strategic.

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<v Speaker 1>So, reflecting on all this, what stands out to you

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<v Speaker 1>as the most maybe profound transformation seeing itel reinvented through

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<v Speaker 1>this DevOps lens and for you listening what existing maybe

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<v Speaker 1>seemingly unchangeable process in your own work could actually benefit

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<v Speaker 1>from this kind of integrated agility first approach. That was

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<v Speaker 1>a really really enlightening deep dive seeing how two philosophies

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<v Speaker 1>that seem so different on the surface can actually come

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<v Speaker 1>together to create something incredibly powerful and frankly pragmatic. From

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<v Speaker 1>reinventing team structures, empowering those product owners to streamlining change

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<v Speaker 1>and release, the synergy between ITIL and DevOps is clearly

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<v Speaker 1>changing the game for IT organizations everywhere.

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<v Speaker 2>Indeed, and the insights from up and of Krishna Kaiser's

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<v Speaker 2>book really drive home that continuous improvement isn't just one

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<v Speaker 2>phase in the ITIL life cycle. It's a fundamental mindset

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<v Speaker 2>that has to apply it to the frameworks.

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<v Speaker 1>Themselves, adapting the adapter.

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<v Speaker 2>Pretty much, the world of IT is constantly evolving faster

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<v Speaker 2>than ever, and our approaches to managing it simply must

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<v Speaker 2>evolve with it becoming more adaptable, more efficient, more value focused.

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<v Speaker 1>So as you go about your day, maybe think about this.

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<v Speaker 1>If even these established foundational frameworks like IDOL can be

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<v Speaker 1>so fundamentally reinvented for agility and speed, what long standing,

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<v Speaker 1>maybe seemingly rigid process in your organization might be ripe

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<v Speaker 1>for a similar DevOps inspired transformation. What's the biggest bureaucratic

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<v Speaker 1>hurdle you could potentially automate or streamline away. Thank you

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<v Speaker 1>so much for joining us on this deep dive. Until

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<v Speaker 1>next time, keep learning, keep questioning, and keep innovating.
