Speaker 1: From the historic Memart Parks in Los Angeles, California.
Speaker 2: I'm Tavis Smiley and I'm so glad to see you
Speaker 2: and me Ah back in stride again. Before we get
Speaker 2: started with today's show, I mean not you to follow
Speaker 2: me on Facebook and Instagram at the Real Tavis Smiley
Speaker 2: and get updates on x that's formerly Twitter at Tavis Smiley.
Speaker 2: By the way, should you miss any product today's program
Speaker 2: or want to catch up on previous shows, you can
Speaker 2: always visit the Tavismileyshow dot com.
Speaker 1: That's the Tavismightyshow dot com or.
Speaker 2: Wherever you get your podcast and listen to the Tavismodley
Speaker 2: podcast version of this live program at your leisure.
Speaker 1: Another great show on tap for you today.
Speaker 2: It's Thursday, so we'll check in with doctor Cornell West
Speaker 2: on the top side.
Speaker 1: Of our two as per usual.
Speaker 2: On the b side of our too, a new study
Speaker 2: from cal Berkeley which finds that DEI policies resulted in
Speaker 2: no financial penalties for companies that did not abandon their
Speaker 2: commitment to diversity, equity and inclusion. So for all that talk,
Speaker 2: ain't nobody been harmed by not abandoning This corrective program
Speaker 2: called de e I, and we'll talk to UC Brooklyn
Speaker 2: Professor Jacob Grumbach uh uh on the backside. Uh and
Speaker 2: I should say in in our two there you go
Speaker 2: get it right, Doctor West top side, it's it's been
Speaker 2: a long week. Dr West on the top side of
Speaker 2: our two. Professor Jacob Grumback on the b side of
Speaker 2: our two.
Speaker 3: And then in our third hour, I'm just crazy, vow you.
Speaker 4: You make me feel so good. I am about to
Speaker 4: rouse my word, trying to find.
Speaker 1: Any way I can see here next to.
Speaker 4: You word I found rely fund follow to satisfied Cray.
Speaker 1: Say that you be Mody.
Speaker 2: Common Lundy was named the twenty twenty six National Endowment
Speaker 2: for the.
Speaker 1: Arts jazz Master.
Speaker 2: This year, we will celebrate Common Lundy when she comes
Speaker 2: live in studio and our third and final Holaday to
Speaker 2: talk about this high honor and her new album, It's
Speaker 2: called Notes from the Wine Cellar. Carmen Lundy twenty twenty
Speaker 2: six Jazz Master comes live in studio today in our
Speaker 2: third hour.
Speaker 1: I'm looking forward to that. But in this first hour.
Speaker 2: When we come forward, we'll talk politics and more with
Speaker 2: Ztail Media cognist Justin berg On.
Speaker 1: We'll start with if you're not for me with the tail,
Speaker 1: We'll let Justin first tell you about ztail. You can
Speaker 1: look it up.
Speaker 2: It's a great online site for news and information. So
Speaker 2: we'll talk about zatel to begin with. And there's so
Speaker 2: many issues to get to. Uh, this was yet another
Speaker 2: history making primary week, So when we come forward, we'll
Speaker 2: start by talking about how these progressive wins, to Justin's
Speaker 2: mind at least, are shaping the primaries this year. You're
Speaker 2: listening to Tavis smileing. Just burg On is the Tel's
Speaker 2: media comminists. Please to have him on the start our
Speaker 2: program today, Justin, how.
Speaker 1: Are you, sir?
Speaker 5: I'm doing fine? How you doing?
Speaker 2: If I complain, i'd being in great. I am doing
Speaker 2: well and pleased to have you on the program. Tell
Speaker 2: me about ztel for those not for me with the
Speaker 2: with the platform, let's let's start there and we'll we'll
Speaker 2: push forward.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I would say the TEO is what you would
Speaker 6: call an unapologetically progressive news site, but still based in fact,
Speaker 6: it was started by Mehdi Hassan, as your audience may
Speaker 6: know him from his show on MSNBC and Al Jazeera,
Speaker 6: and it's been growing quite a bit over the past
Speaker 6: year and a half and we've broken quite a bit
Speaker 6: of news, made quite a bit of news, and I
Speaker 6: believe we'll keep doing that.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 2: What's it mean for a Zeteo. I know what it
Speaker 2: means for our station here in La. What's it mean
Speaker 2: for Zetello in a moment like this to be unapologetically
Speaker 2: progressive unpacked?
Speaker 5: That?
Speaker 1: For me?
Speaker 5: Well, I think.
Speaker 6: At this moment, when when you have a the return
Speaker 6: of a Trump administration, but a more vindictive Trump administration,
Speaker 6: that's that's really trying to put its foot on the neck.
Speaker 5: Of the media to begin with that.
Speaker 6: You need you need news outlets that are going to
Speaker 6: provide a different perspective but also aggressively pushed back against that.
Speaker 6: And I believe that's what we're doing here. You know,
Speaker 6: not you know, having any fear of favor when it
Speaker 6: comes to calling out what's going on in the day
Speaker 6: to day part of our politics and society, whether it
Speaker 6: has anything to do with you know, our wars overseas,
Speaker 6: what's going on in Israel and Gaza, what's going here domestically,
Speaker 6: what's going on with people's pocketbooks.
Speaker 5: I think.
Speaker 6: You need to have an independent style media that isn't
Speaker 6: going to have a corporate over that's going to be,
Speaker 6: you know, curring favor with this administration.
Speaker 5: That's the way I look at it at least.
Speaker 1: YEP. So we all saw the news a few days ago.
Speaker 2: Just a couple more inside baseball media questions and we'll
Speaker 2: get to the issues of the day.
Speaker 1: We saw the news. We shall the news few days ago,
Speaker 1: ABC suing the FCC.
Speaker 2: And I sort of laughed at that when I saw that,
Speaker 2: because here ABC now has grown a pair.
Speaker 1: And they want to sue the FCC.
Speaker 2: But wasn't ABC like one of the networks he started
Speaker 2: us down in his rabbit hole in the first place.
Speaker 6: Yeah, That's what I had remembered too. Back in December
Speaker 6: twenty twenty four, right after Trump had won his second term.
Speaker 5: You know, of the many media.
Speaker 6: Organizations that Trump was taken aim at in suing even
Speaker 6: before he got back in the office, was ABC News
Speaker 6: over the George Stephanopolis interview with Nancy Mason, which Stephanopolis, uh,
Speaker 6: you know, multiple times during that interview noted that Trump
Speaker 6: had been adjudicated for rape, you know, found liable for that,
Speaker 6: and that that was more of like a semantics argument,
Speaker 6: to be honest. Even the judge had pointed that out,
Speaker 6: and what he was referring to was the Eging Carol,
Speaker 6: you know, the ruling in that, you know, where Trump
Speaker 6: was found liable for sexual abuse in battery as well
Speaker 6: as defaming eging Carrol, and you know, the sexual abuse
Speaker 6: and rape, it's more on just you know, it's just
Speaker 6: a figure of speech almost for the way that the
Speaker 6: judge it pointed. I was like, you know, for all
Speaker 6: intents and purposes, sexual abuse is rape, but you know,
Speaker 6: Stephanopolis has said rape. Immediately after that, Trump decided he
Speaker 6: was going to sue ABC News for defamation once he
Speaker 6: wins office. Disney decides they don't want to have this
Speaker 6: hanging over them anymore. It's time to maybe play low
Speaker 6: ball with the new administration. So they decided to just
Speaker 6: settle with him for fifteen million dollars to Trump's presidential
Speaker 6: library and a million dollars at Trump's lawyers.
Speaker 5: So then he gets to.
Speaker 6: Win, and then you know, they even issued essentially an
Speaker 6: apology over what Stephanopolis had said. So I remember at
Speaker 6: that time writing or speaking to different First Amendment experts,
Speaker 6: journalism professors, media executives on how you know Disney by
Speaker 6: doing this they were opening a door for a greater
Speaker 6: chilling effect on freedom of speech and press that this
Speaker 6: wasn't this was going to really allow Trump to go
Speaker 6: forward and you know, wage his full fledged war against
Speaker 6: the media, specifically the media he doesn't like that, you know,
Speaker 6: And that's exactly what it happened. I mean, we saw
Speaker 6: so many different lawsuits harassment of media organizations and you know,
Speaker 6: attempts to bring them to heal or you had capitulation
Speaker 6: by other outlets or media owners, whether it be the
Speaker 6: Washington Post or the Los Angeles Times, where they decided
Speaker 6: where they decided that they were going to push their
Speaker 6: newspapers into a more conservative friendly direction. And then we
Speaker 6: also had you know, we see the situation that happened
Speaker 6: with Paramount and CBS News and how that they essentially
Speaker 6: turned CBS News into like a Fox News Light after
Speaker 6: David Allison purchased Paramount, but even prior to that, you know,
Speaker 6: to make sure that that merger went through between Paramounts Skidands,
Speaker 6: the old owners made sure to settle a meritless lawsuit
Speaker 6: with CBS News. So yes, long way around, ye Disney
Speaker 6: did start this.
Speaker 2: What's amazing about it is not just that they caved
Speaker 2: and paid Trump almost twenty million dollars over the issue
Speaker 2: that you raised earlier about Stephanopolis.
Speaker 1: They paid him all that money.
Speaker 2: Then then you fast forward some months, the administration goes in.
Speaker 1: Donald Trump goes in on Jimmy Kimmel. What does ABC do?
Speaker 2: They sideline Jimmy Kimmel, and everybody's up in arms about
Speaker 2: what happens to Jimmy Kimmel. A few weeks later, a
Speaker 2: few days later, whatever, Jimmy Kimmel comes back, and now
Speaker 2: that same ABC is now soon the FCC overholding onto
Speaker 2: its license.
Speaker 1: So there are number of ways to read this. ABC
Speaker 1: a long time to get here.
Speaker 2: The other way to read it is that you know
Speaker 2: when their license is on the line again, ABC finds
Speaker 2: a spine and now they are suing the FCC. I
Speaker 2: don't want to study this too long. I guess the
Speaker 2: question is if I'll move on whether or not this
Speaker 2: is literally about ABC trying to save its license, or
Speaker 2: whether this is an example of a media network after
Speaker 2: cow towing and bowing the knee bending the need of
Speaker 2: Donald Trump has again finally reversed its course.
Speaker 5: I mean, I would also say.
Speaker 6: This is coming after they've seen the situation with a
Speaker 6: number of different law firms that decided not to bend
Speaker 6: the knee to Donald Trump over certain issues. I think
Speaker 6: they were like whether it's DEI or a myriad of
Speaker 6: issues of where Trump had said that you know, they
Speaker 6: had done great damage and they needed to, you know,
Speaker 6: provide his administration with hundreds of millions of dollars of
Speaker 6: free work, and the ones that decided, know, what you're
Speaker 6: doing is essentially unconstitutional, but you don't have the law
Speaker 6: on your side, and then his executive orders were tossed out.
Speaker 6: His attempts to push these law firms to you know,
Speaker 6: bend the knee, as.
Speaker 5: You said, didn't work.
Speaker 6: Once you see that happening, you're like, wait a minute,
Speaker 6: this administration where he may be a little more toothless
Speaker 6: than we thought.
Speaker 5: And maybe we were a little.
Speaker 6: Bit hasty in trying to capitulate and acquiesce to him.
Speaker 6: And I think that's part of what's going on here.
Speaker 6: You know, you obviously, yes, they're going way too far.
Speaker 6: They're you know, they're taken an authoritarian, almost fascistic push
Speaker 6: against these media organizations, specifically against Disney, which they are
Speaker 6: doing retaliatory. They are doing a retaliatory camp pain, as
Speaker 6: they say in their lawsuit, because you know, they want
Speaker 6: to make the view either go away or.
Speaker 5: You know, be more Trump friendly.
Speaker 6: And they want Jimmy Kimmel to no longer be there
Speaker 6: because he says being things about Trump. So you know,
Speaker 6: those are things that are going on there. But yeah,
Speaker 6: is it about them trying to say their license? Sure?
Speaker 6: Is it?
Speaker 5: You know they're standing up for the First Amendment.
Speaker 6: Maybe, but I think a lot of it is now
Speaker 6: maybe we didn't need to have any fear against them
Speaker 6: because they're also they're seeing what's going on in all these.
Speaker 5: Cases in the courts.
Speaker 6: I mean, the thing is the Trump administration is losing
Speaker 6: tons of cases in the courts.
Speaker 1: I want to just remind this audience.
Speaker 2: I tried to a moment ago at least remind the
Speaker 2: audience of the ABC backstory. And I asked, justin a
Speaker 2: moment ago, whether or not this is just ABC trying
Speaker 2: to save their hide or whether not ABC has found
Speaker 2: its spine. The reality is that this is not about
Speaker 2: ABC protecting First Amendment rights.
Speaker 1: That is what this is about.
Speaker 2: This is about ABC, as I said, try to hold
Speaker 2: on its license. So when you consider the backstory, and
Speaker 2: that ABC is the network that started us down this
Speaker 2: rabbit hole.
Speaker 1: Now they're s in the FCC, and people.
Speaker 2: Are reporting this as if ABC is leading the charge
Speaker 2: against the administration.
Speaker 1: Stop it, stop it, stop it.
Speaker 2: This is not, I repeat, about protecting our First Amendment rights.
Speaker 2: They could have done that a year or two ago.
Speaker 2: This is about ABC try and hold on to its
Speaker 2: broadcast license. I'm done with it, but I want to
Speaker 2: make sure that people understand that particular distinction. As I
Speaker 2: pushed toward a conversation about this week's primaries and how
Speaker 2: these progressive wins, to Justin's mind, are shaping the primary
Speaker 2: season and what that means for the midterms and beyond,
Speaker 2: since he mentioned Donald Trump and his sexual assault situation.
Speaker 2: Not sure if you've heard this news, but there's a
Speaker 2: new story out about this today. FBI agents execute did
Speaker 2: search wants targeting former Democratic Representative Eric Swalwell and have
Speaker 2: seized his electronic devices. One of the wants was executed
Speaker 2: after Swallwell landed at San Francisco inter National Airport. The
Speaker 2: second targeted his residence in d C. And so they
Speaker 2: are seizing devices, smart devices from Eric Swalwall.
Speaker 1: Now why does that matter? Because earlier this week, as
Speaker 1: a matter of fact, do you have a winter in
Speaker 1: that race?
Speaker 5: Yet?
Speaker 1: I didn't even check if I came on the air yet.
Speaker 1: Somebody tell me right quick.
Speaker 2: Earlier this week, the race was too close to call
Speaker 2: in the special election here in California to replace Eric Swalwell.
Speaker 2: You know the story of Eric Walwell, longtime member of Congress,
Speaker 2: Donald Trump nemesis running for governor in California. Sexual allegations
Speaker 2: come up, he has to drop out of the race.
Speaker 2: He's the front runner at this point. As front run,
Speaker 2: he has to drop out of the race. And so
Speaker 2: now sometimes you think you drop out of a race
Speaker 2: and your problems go away.
Speaker 1: Not really. He dropped out.
Speaker 2: His career has completely imploded, and the FBI is now
Speaker 2: seizing his electronic devices.
Speaker 1: Again.
Speaker 2: We expected that because again he was a nemesis of
Speaker 2: Donald Trump. So Trump's FBI is going after Eric S. Walwell,
Speaker 2: and we shall see how this plays out. But it's
Speaker 2: just fascinating that they seize his devices in the same
Speaker 2: week that there's a special election to replace him in Congress.
Speaker 2: And I don't know again whether or not there's a
Speaker 2: winner declared in that race. Hit somebody would tell me
Speaker 2: I'll get to you as soon as I know it.
Speaker 2: But anyway, that was on Tuesday of this week, along
Speaker 2: with other primaries that happened across the country. So what
Speaker 2: are these progressive wins? These DSA wins just insane to
Speaker 2: you about the way our politics are being reshaped, redefined.
Speaker 1: If you don't like those words, choose your own.
Speaker 6: I think it's at the very least it's redefining what
Speaker 6: Democratic voters want now that maybe that they they're rarely
Speaker 6: embracing many of these progressive values that these candidates are
Speaker 6: are pushing. I think that's part of it. But I
Speaker 6: think the main thing that's happening here is what they
Speaker 6: want are fighters, right. They want people that aren't.
Speaker 5: For lack of a bear word, like squishes.
Speaker 6: People that you know that they don't want the same old,
Speaker 6: same old that just that it had lost two elections
Speaker 6: to Donald Trump, that lost the House, that lost the Senate. Right,
Speaker 6: they don't want, you know, that, that style of politics anymore.
Speaker 6: So they're looking for something more. And this is all
Speaker 6: happening as you know, we are dealing with a growing
Speaker 6: economic problem that that seems to be looming even more
Speaker 6: in the distance.
Speaker 5: When it the economic inequality. You see gen z.
Speaker 6: Uh having a worse you know, lifestyle than than their predecessors.
Speaker 6: So they're wanting change and you look for change ages
Speaker 6: and this is why DSA is doing well now. At
Speaker 6: the same end, I would point out that you know
Speaker 6: a lot of DSA candidates aren't winning their primaries, but
Speaker 6: they're they're putting up you know, heavy challenges. So so
Speaker 6: I think, you know this, What do I see here
Speaker 6: is again they want fighters. They want people that won't
Speaker 6: just you know, try to get along, to play along
Speaker 6: and all that.
Speaker 2: To your point about wanting fighters, just some new data
Speaker 2: out here in California. This program is heard across the country,
Speaker 2: as you know, uh and as I always say, for syndication,
Speaker 2: national syndication, I'm grateful. But we're based in LA and
Speaker 2: there are a couple of major races in LA.
Speaker 1: In California. People are watching, obviously the governor's race.
Speaker 2: It was quite a journey, but Javio Versara and Steve
Speaker 2: Hilton are going to go at it in November. And
Speaker 2: here in LA there was a big mayor's debate last night,
Speaker 2: the first of the season. Everybody watching this mayor's race
Speaker 2: to see whether this DSA candidate, city council Woman Nythia
Speaker 2: Rahman can unseat the incumbent mayor, Karen Bass, longtime mainstream
Speaker 2: establishment Democrat. So we're going to see what happens here
Speaker 2: in California. There's a new data out here in the
Speaker 2: Golden State which suggest that most voters feel favorably toward
Speaker 2: progressive candidates with less enthusiasm for mainstream Democrats. That's new
Speaker 2: data that most California voters favorably look toward or look
Speaker 2: at progressive political campaigns and candidates with less enthusiasm for
Speaker 2: mainstream Democrats. I believe that mainstream Democrats. I believe that
Speaker 2: establishment Democrats in this cycle and even beyond are in trouble. Now,
Speaker 2: if this trend holds, the question is what this means
Speaker 2: for the demomocratic primaries come twenty twenty eight. If this
Speaker 2: trajectory continues. If this trend holds, we'll see what it
Speaker 2: means in November. But if Democrats across the country, even
Speaker 2: beyond California, are looking for fighters, They're looking for folks
Speaker 2: who are more progressive, They're turned on by the message
Speaker 2: of these DSA candidates. What does that mean for the
Speaker 2: kind of primary season we're going to have when people
Speaker 2: start announcing they're running for president, if you're an establishment Democrat.
Speaker 1: Should you just stay home.
Speaker 2: Not even not even foul papers to get in the race,
Speaker 2: because that seems to be where the party is headed.
Speaker 2: We'll talk about that to do more than we come
Speaker 2: forward here on Tavis Smile. Indeed, Justin berg go On,
Speaker 2: who is the media cognist for the TAO, in our
Speaker 2: first hour of pushing toward our two, which will kick
Speaker 2: off for Doctor Cornell West as it does every Monday
Speaker 2: and Thursday. Can't wait to get the doc. But Justin
Speaker 2: is our guessing the first start kicking us off, and
Speaker 2: I'm glad to have him. I have a colleague here
Speaker 2: in La on my station, Justin, who hosts an amazing,
Speaker 2: brilliant relationship show every night.
Speaker 1: His name is Zoe, and Zoe is a solo host.
Speaker 2: But he's fond of saying because he has a great
Speaker 2: playlist every night, and he's fond of saying that my
Speaker 2: playlist is my co host. That's Zoe Williams. My playlist
Speaker 2: is my co host. My version of that is that
Speaker 2: my audience is my research team. My audience is my
Speaker 2: research team. I asked for information and low and behold,
Speaker 2: within two minutes, fifty five folk around the country are
Speaker 2: texting me the information or emailing me or posting on
Speaker 2: social media the information that I've asked for. So I
Speaker 2: asked moments ago, what's happening in the Eric Swalwell race,
Speaker 2: and everybody started sitting me information.
Speaker 1: Thank you all. But I do that all the time.
Speaker 2: If I'm on the air and I need something right quick,
Speaker 2: I just shout it out and everybody gets to me
Speaker 2: right away with the data. So this fourteenth Congressional District
Speaker 2: here in California, Eric Swalwell's former seat, that race is
Speaker 2: still too close to call. We are told that there
Speaker 2: are only sixty two percent of the votes that have
Speaker 2: been counted. And so the race at the moment again
Speaker 2: stay Senator Aisha Wahab is backed by the Democratic Party.
Speaker 2: She leads the race at the moment fifty one to
Speaker 2: forty nine percent over Melissa Hernandez, who is supported by
Speaker 2: a Pax Main super pac. So here you have another
Speaker 2: race at the moment. Stay with me, I'm gonna I'm
Speaker 2: gonna connect some dots here, or if my preacher says, stay.
Speaker 1: Withhi me, I'm going somewhere with this I'm going somewhere
Speaker 1: with this.
Speaker 2: I want to connect these two things up in a second. So,
Speaker 2: in this race of game to replace Eric Swalwell in
Speaker 2: Congress fourteen Congression of dis Security in California, his campaign
Speaker 2: imploded while running for governor, Senator Stay Senator Aisha Wahab
Speaker 2: is backed again by the Democratic Party. She sits right
Speaker 2: now in fifty one percent, and Melissa Hernandez, supported by
Speaker 2: APAX Main super Pac, is trailing at forty nine percent.
Speaker 2: We shall see how this all works out. Now, let
Speaker 2: me connect these dots. As I said a moment ago,
Speaker 2: I was reading a story today before coming on the
Speaker 2: air in the La Pergrim. Let me just read a
Speaker 2: couple of paragraphs if I can of this story, and
Speaker 2: then I'll get Justin's.
Speaker 1: View on what I want to share here.
Speaker 2: So the headline in the Li Progressive for this article reads,
Speaker 2: a PAC money meets changing Electric In twenty twenty six midterms,
Speaker 2: the Iran war, US support for Israel, and soaring campaign
Speaker 2: spending are colliding with voters growing anxiety about gasoline, groceries
Speaker 2: and the cost of living.
Speaker 1: I could go on. I think you take the point
Speaker 1: of the article.
Speaker 2: This APAC money, they've been spending money, you know, so fastidiously,
Speaker 2: so aggressively in campaigns all across this country. APAC's been
Speaker 2: pouring in money, pouring in money in their track record
Speaker 2: up until now has been pretty good. But now I
Speaker 2: they've hit the skids, and this money is not necessarily
Speaker 2: doing the trick, as I just evidence in the story
Speaker 2: I share with you about how this race to replace
Speaker 2: Eric Swalwell is playing out. But there are other examples
Speaker 2: too many to list right now that we've discussed on
Speaker 2: this program during this primary season where the APAC money
Speaker 2: did not necessarily make the difference. And so this article
Speaker 2: is pointing out that this APAC money has finally met
Speaker 2: a changing electric and that the Iran war and that
Speaker 2: the US is support for Israel soaring campaign spending, as
Speaker 2: I said, are colliding with voters growing anxiety about gasoline groceries,
Speaker 2: the cost of living, everyday issues, pocketbook issues, kitchen table
Speaker 2: issues that matter to them, so that the APAC money
Speaker 2: is not having the impact that it once had.
Speaker 1: That's to set up justin take it and run with it.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I agree with that for the most part. I
Speaker 6: mean what we saw in Michigan a couple of weeks
Speaker 6: ago right where Abduel Sayid, I mean Hailey Stevens, his
Speaker 6: primary opponent, had a ton of APAC money behind her.
Speaker 6: I believe I don't have the status right in front
Speaker 6: of me, but that he was outspent something like nine
Speaker 6: to one, maybe even more.
Speaker 1: Than I got. I got it right here, I got
Speaker 1: it right here.
Speaker 2: There was sixty million dollars in outside spending in that race.
Speaker 2: That's just the outside, the outside spinning number. Sixty million
Speaker 2: dollars in outside spending money all for Hailey Stevens and
Speaker 2: abduce else I steel pulled that off.
Speaker 1: Please continue.
Speaker 5: Yeah, And.
Speaker 6: It does feel as if almost a candidate being backed
Speaker 6: by a pack specifically, and a lot of that is
Speaker 6: going to depend on the electorate itself, but that it
Speaker 6: it backfires when you're seeing.
Speaker 5: That that that that candidate is backed by a pack.
Speaker 6: It's what you have is the fact that Israel, the
Speaker 6: war in God, the Israel's involvement with our war and Iran,
Speaker 6: all of that, just the state of Israel itself has
Speaker 6: become extremely unpopular here in the United States, specifically among
Speaker 6: Democratic voters. So when APAX involved, and and we'll say
Speaker 6: will point out that APEX spending almost all the time
Speaker 6: with their super PACs are not bringing up Israel as
Speaker 6: an actual issue. When they're they're doing the ads for
Speaker 6: these for their candidates, it's usually just negative ads on
Speaker 6: the other candidate. But it ends up the you know,
Speaker 6: the electorates pretty spart and they can see who's who's
Speaker 6: paying for this, even if it's not saying specifically.
Speaker 5: By APAX it and I'm getting reported.
Speaker 6: But when you're seeing all these negative ads, you're like, well,
Speaker 6: why are they spending so much against that specific candidate?
Speaker 6: And then you see that as a pack and you're like,
Speaker 6: there's a reason for all that outside spending, and it
Speaker 6: it tends the back part, but not always.
Speaker 5: Now, I haven't looked.
Speaker 6: At, you know, Angie Nixon and Alexander Vidman in terms
Speaker 6: of what the spending is there, I mean, in terms
Speaker 6: of how APAC played there. My belief there was that
Speaker 6: Angie Nixon was just somebody that Florida Democrats, the normal
Speaker 6: Florida Democrats, understood who she was. Felt like she was
Speaker 6: an actual Floridian and buddy who had gained fame somehow
Speaker 6: somewhere else and was part of what you would just
Speaker 6: call resistance one point zero and they just rejected Alexander
Speaker 6: Vitman in that style of democratic politics.
Speaker 5: Despite the huge spending.
Speaker 1: She was she was on she was on this program.
Speaker 2: Any Nixon was on this program on primary day as
Speaker 2: a matter of fact, or maybe the advance of primary day.
Speaker 2: I can't recall exactly what day she was on, but
Speaker 2: she was on this program a few days ago.
Speaker 1: Uh, and you know, talked about that.
Speaker 2: So she was wildly outspent in that in that particular race,
Speaker 2: and there was a PAC money in that particular race.
Speaker 2: I don't have the exact numbers either, uh, but here again,
Speaker 2: Angie Nixon is another example in this primary season of
Speaker 2: people who beat back that a PAC money and won
Speaker 2: these races anyway. And so again the money that APAC
Speaker 2: has been spending is not having the impact that it
Speaker 2: once had. And I take Justin's point. When you see
Speaker 2: these A pack ads, they never say Israel, It's it's
Speaker 2: It's it is negative campaigning aimed at the person they're
Speaker 2: trying to defeat for the reasons they want to defeat them,
Speaker 2: but they never there's no truth in advertising, if I
Speaker 2: can use that phrase, there's no truth in advertising when
Speaker 2: you see an APAC commercial. So again I think people
Speaker 2: have figured it out, and they know what they're seeing
Speaker 2: when they see it, whether or not it says brought
Speaker 2: to you by a pack, whether it mentions Israel or not.
Speaker 2: People have started to figure this out. But again they
Speaker 2: got long money, but the victories are not coming as
Speaker 2: easily as they used to. When we come forward to
Speaker 2: that question that I posed, a moment agoe that we
Speaker 2: ain't really tackled yet, which is how all of this,
Speaker 2: how these progressive wins, how these DSA wins are shaping
Speaker 2: the primary season that we are now in. But even
Speaker 2: more so, if this trend I repeat continues, If this
Speaker 2: trajectory continues, what is what we are seeing right now
Speaker 2: say about the cons of folk who ought to stay
Speaker 2: home in twenty twenty eight. If this trend continues and
Speaker 2: you are one of those mainstream establishment democrats, shouldn't you
Speaker 2: just not even fil papers. We'll talk about that when
Speaker 2: we come forward on Tavis I's find justin Bergona as
Speaker 2: the Tales media columnists. So we've been talking here for
Speaker 2: a little bit now about the way this primary season
Speaker 2: is shaped up. This was yet another week of primaries
Speaker 2: in where Alaska and Florida and other places around the country.
Speaker 2: So these Tuesday primaries are I don't think we're quite
Speaker 2: done yet, we're getting here. Matter of fact, I need
Speaker 2: to look at a calendar and see when we will
Speaker 2: be through the entire primary cycle, uh.
Speaker 1: In this particular season.
Speaker 2: But it seems that every other Tuesday we're spending the
Speaker 2: day talking about races and states all across the country.
Speaker 2: And so we are seeing the way this thing is
Speaker 2: taking shape. And so the question, justin is how these
Speaker 2: progressive wins, how these DSA wins, to your mind, are
Speaker 2: shaping our politics moving forward.
Speaker 6: Uh.
Speaker 5: Well, I would also say that.
Speaker 6: Some of these people, some of the progressives that are winning,
Speaker 6: aren't necessarily DSA, but they get like DSA adjacent or
Speaker 6: they get associated with it, like Abduell's yet actually is
Speaker 6: on DSA exactly. But you know, to to you know,
Speaker 6: the Fox News is of the world that it doesn't matter,
Speaker 6: they're all gonna get painted with that brush. But uh,
Speaker 6: and obviously, you know, both mainstream media and conservative press
Speaker 6: are are trying to.
Speaker 5: You know, use ds A as like a maejorative here.
Speaker 5: I've noticed that a lot on CNN as well, But
Speaker 5: you know.
Speaker 6: Getting past that, uh, just saying I would say, going
Speaker 6: with the overall you know, progressive candidate wins here, what
Speaker 6: does it say, Yeah, I'd say after the you know,
Speaker 6: after we get to the mid terms, we'll see how
Speaker 6: those candidates fare in comparison with you know, more mainstream candidates.
Speaker 5: Uh say abdu Wels.
Speaker 6: Right, he's going to be you know, in that Senate race,
Speaker 6: uh for you know, against Mike Rogers. If he wins,
Speaker 6: but he wins in more of a like a nail bitter,
Speaker 6: you know, will that be used, as you know, a
Speaker 6: way for mainstream Democrats in the overall political press to say, look,
Speaker 6: you know, progressivism and the DSA style candidates are they
Speaker 6: are an anchor on the Democrats here going forward. But
Speaker 6: if he were to win by the same margin or
Speaker 6: a larger margin against Rogers, who is a well known
Speaker 6: candidate there in Michigan, somebody who served as a congressman
Speaker 6: before in his run for higher office there recently, then
Speaker 6: it kind of it takes that narrative away from them.
Speaker 6: But you know, to your point, what does that say
Speaker 6: for twenty twenty eight?
Speaker 5: Right?
Speaker 2: Oh, that thought We'll talk about twenty twenty eight when
Speaker 2: we come forward on Tavis Smile, You're Indeed, I'll put
Speaker 2: this same questionnaire dot twenty l West in about five
Speaker 2: minutes at the top of the second hour.
Speaker 1: Not the wish ran for president as an independent.
Speaker 2: I'm curious as to what this moment, this primary season
Speaker 2: says to him about the kind of person that ought
Speaker 2: to stay home and the kind of folks that need
Speaker 2: to show up in twenty twenty eight. We'll let doctor
Speaker 2: West opine on that in just a few moments. I
Speaker 2: got two minutes left here just to Mike quick for you.
Speaker 2: What's your read of what this primary season is for
Speaker 2: is for telling about what twenty twenty eight ought.
Speaker 1: To look like.
Speaker 6: Well, I think first off on my mind here is
Speaker 6: that Gavin Newsom should not run. I know he will,
Speaker 6: but everything I've seen is that he just keeps falling
Speaker 6: in voters' perspectives, and whether it's polls or prediction markets
Speaker 6: or any of that, it just seems that there's not
Speaker 6: going to be an appetite for.
Speaker 5: Somebody who's made that kind of name in politics.
Speaker 6: And I'll be you know, as much as Gavin could
Speaker 6: probably portray himself as a progressive, I don't think that
Speaker 6: there's going to be any appetite for him.
Speaker 5: Running.
Speaker 6: Same with folks that like Ram Emmanuel, probably Josh Shapiro
Speaker 6: in Pennsylvania. These are ones that their names have been floated.
Speaker 6: I just don't think that there's going to be any
Speaker 6: appetite there. Same with you know, Kamala I don't think
Speaker 6: even though she might be the presumptive favor going in,
Speaker 6: you know, the thought is going to be that you know,
Speaker 6: she lost, and even if it's not totally you know,
Speaker 6: on her, because she was thrust into it late, there's
Speaker 6: not going to be that appetite to have somebody that
Speaker 6: represents the previous administration that lost the White House back
Speaker 6: to the Trump to.
Speaker 5: Represent the Democrats in twenty twenty eight.
Speaker 6: I do think it'll be somebody, you know, like an
Speaker 6: AOC that'll end up grabbing onto that nomination.
Speaker 5: Uh.
Speaker 6: We've seen a lot of movement from John Ostoff lately,
Speaker 6: who seems to understand the style of aggressive politics whilst
Speaker 6: still portraying himself as a thoughtful person.
Speaker 1: It's gonna, no, I think, are the ones. No, it's
Speaker 1: gonna be fascinating, fascinating campaign.
Speaker 5: Uh.
Speaker 2: We gotta get past these mid terms first come November, Uh,
Speaker 2: and see what the impact is, see whether or not
Speaker 2: these DSA and progressive candidates can actually win in November.
Speaker 2: The jury is still out on that. But once we
Speaker 2: get past that, but I think I think the die
Speaker 2: is set. The die has been cast rather uh, and
Speaker 2: the frame is set. What people are interested in, what
Speaker 2: they are looking for. They want fighters, they want progressives.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 2: And we'll talk about that, Doctor Cornell Western. We come
Speaker 2: forward here on Tavis Smiley.
Speaker 1: Thank you, Justin