WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.120 --> 00:00:03.919 Jerry Dyer, the mayor of Fresno, has issued a statement 2 00:00:04.160 --> 00:00:07.320 saying that Fresno Police is not going to work with 3 00:00:07.440 --> 00:00:11.359 the Border Patrol or with ICE agents on any kind 4 00:00:11.400 --> 00:00:17.640 of deportation raids. This is coming as the Trump administration 5 00:00:17.800 --> 00:00:22.600 is obviously trying to institute the policies that Trump ran 6 00:00:22.679 --> 00:00:29.559 on that received that have large popular support for mass 7 00:00:29.640 --> 00:00:37.320 deportation of illegal aliens and the rhetoric from Dire There's 8 00:00:37.320 --> 00:00:39.479 some things too, I kind of agree with in some 9 00:00:39.560 --> 00:00:42.719 things where I'm like, all right, let's let's pump the brakes. 10 00:00:42.840 --> 00:00:45.560 I must admit on the immigration on a lot of 11 00:00:46.439 --> 00:00:53.960 immigration enforcement issues, There's parts of me that are conflicted 12 00:00:54.000 --> 00:00:56.240 with some of the things Trump has done. For one 13 00:00:56.280 --> 00:00:59.840 of the executive orders that were issued by the Trumpets 14 00:01:00.000 --> 00:01:04.920 administration was getting rid of certain kinds of protections, saying 15 00:01:04.959 --> 00:01:09.799 that ICE or Border Patrol agents could not arrest people 16 00:01:10.480 --> 00:01:14.599 on the grounds of churches or schools. Now, on the 17 00:01:14.680 --> 00:01:18.319 one hand, there's a part of me that does not 18 00:01:18.359 --> 00:01:22.799 really like this policy. I Okay, someone might take advantage 19 00:01:23.000 --> 00:01:28.799 of a church well in order to avoid deportation. I mean, 20 00:01:28.840 --> 00:01:32.239 they're not going to live at the church, And I'm 21 00:01:33.319 --> 00:01:35.319 i don't know. I don't like the idea of law 22 00:01:35.359 --> 00:01:38.000 enforcement being able to come onto the premises of a 23 00:01:38.079 --> 00:01:44.040 church and arrest someone initiate deportation proceedings just because someone 24 00:01:44.079 --> 00:01:46.239 happened to go to the church. On the other hand, 25 00:01:48.079 --> 00:01:50.280 if you've got someone who's like what, you've got someone 26 00:01:50.280 --> 00:01:53.599 who's a genuinely really bad guy who's taking advantage of 27 00:01:53.640 --> 00:01:56.920 the fact that churches and schools whatever are kind of 28 00:01:56.959 --> 00:02:02.519 safe zones or safe havens, that is also not good. 29 00:02:04.079 --> 00:02:09.000 So I'm a little conflicted on that front. There's a 30 00:02:09.000 --> 00:02:12.759 part of me that would like protection for this, but 31 00:02:12.879 --> 00:02:19.639 I think Mayor Dyer's attitude is kind of bizarre, So 32 00:02:20.000 --> 00:02:25.759 he writes he says this. Dyer said he remains committed 33 00:02:25.800 --> 00:02:29.400 to ensuring a safe and welcoming place for everyone who 34 00:02:29.479 --> 00:02:33.879 calls this city home. Why why is that his job? 35 00:02:36.360 --> 00:02:39.080 Why is he committed to ensuring that Fresno is a 36 00:02:39.080 --> 00:02:47.280 safe and welcoming place for everyone who calls the city home. Everyone, 37 00:02:47.560 --> 00:02:49.599 You're not committed to making it a safe and welcoming 38 00:02:49.639 --> 00:02:53.000 place for criminals? Why are we making it a safe 39 00:02:53.000 --> 00:02:56.400 and welcoming place for people who are not legally permitted 40 00:02:56.439 --> 00:03:03.159 to be in the United States of America. My primary responsibility, 41 00:03:03.240 --> 00:03:06.719 DIYer says, is to ensure the safety of everyone, regardless 42 00:03:06.719 --> 00:03:16.840 of their immigration status. Wouldn't checking people's immigration status help 43 00:03:16.879 --> 00:03:19.759 with safety If someone is not legally supposed to be there, 44 00:03:21.680 --> 00:03:24.080 doesn't that make them more of a I mean, we 45 00:03:24.199 --> 00:03:33.319 haven't properly vetted them as a result for their criminal history. 46 00:03:33.360 --> 00:03:39.479 He goes on to be even more emphatic. In twenty sixteen, 47 00:03:40.199 --> 00:03:43.039 Dyer told The Bee that officers are not interested in 48 00:03:43.080 --> 00:03:46.879 a person's immigration status, but only whether they are involved 49 00:03:46.879 --> 00:03:51.840 in criminal activity. That was, in twenty sixteen a quote 50 00:03:51.840 --> 00:03:53.719 he gave to The Bee when he was a chief 51 00:03:53.759 --> 00:03:56.280 of police in the city of Fresno. Why would the 52 00:03:56.280 --> 00:04:00.319 police not be interested in someone's immigration status only if 53 00:04:00.360 --> 00:04:04.439 they've committed crime? First of all, again, being in the 54 00:04:04.439 --> 00:04:10.800 country illegally is unlawful activity. Secondly, if they are also 55 00:04:11.080 --> 00:04:15.759 here illegally and they have committed a crime, isn't that 56 00:04:15.840 --> 00:04:22.199 an even greater incentive to get this person out of here. 57 00:04:26.920 --> 00:04:30.480 Dyer continues to say, we have worked hard to earn 58 00:04:30.560 --> 00:04:34.759 the trust of our immigrant community and to ensure that 59 00:04:34.920 --> 00:04:39.199 they feel comfortable reaching out to law enforcement when they 60 00:04:39.240 --> 00:04:45.279 need help or to provide information to officers if federal 61 00:04:45.319 --> 00:04:49.920 mandates require local law enforcement to participate in immigration enforcement. 62 00:04:50.680 --> 00:04:54.120 I want to be very clear, Presno, will not sacrifice 63 00:04:54.160 --> 00:04:56.920 the trust we've worked so hard to build with our community. 64 00:04:57.600 --> 00:05:02.199 All Right. I will admit the question of can the 65 00:05:02.240 --> 00:05:05.920 federal can a federal agency common deer a state or 66 00:05:06.000 --> 00:05:09.800 local police agency, or direct the work of state and 67 00:05:09.879 --> 00:05:13.720 local agencies to insist that they cooperate with federal authorities, 68 00:05:15.040 --> 00:05:20.279 that that is a tricky question of federalism, quickie, tricky 69 00:05:21.120 --> 00:05:27.360 sort of con law question. To what extent can the state? 70 00:05:28.399 --> 00:05:33.079 Can state authorities cooperate? They can voluntarily cooperate, but if 71 00:05:33.079 --> 00:05:35.120 they don't want to cooperate, to what extent can the 72 00:05:35.120 --> 00:05:39.879 federal government actually coerce local agencies to work with them? 73 00:05:40.000 --> 00:05:43.959 I agree it's a disputed constitutional question. I could understand 74 00:05:43.959 --> 00:05:50.360 maybe a state or local elected official or law enforcement 75 00:05:50.399 --> 00:05:54.720 official being jealous of rightly jealous to protect this sort 76 00:05:54.759 --> 00:05:58.519 of constitutional ordering of things, this federalist principle that no, 77 00:05:58.720 --> 00:06:02.680 the federal government can't tell us to do as far 78 00:06:02.680 --> 00:06:06.560 as immigration enforcement issues. But I feel like Diyer's going 79 00:06:06.639 --> 00:06:09.040 way beyond that. I think Diyer's going to the point 80 00:06:09.040 --> 00:06:16.079 of saying protecting the immigrant community, that our affection for 81 00:06:16.079 --> 00:06:19.120 the immigrant community is more important than a legal mandate 82 00:06:20.040 --> 00:06:25.519 to cooperate in immigration enforcement. And I guess I find 83 00:06:25.600 --> 00:06:32.759 that to be wild. Dyer knows full well what percentage 84 00:06:33.680 --> 00:06:38.240 of people locked up in California jails and prisons are 85 00:06:38.240 --> 00:06:40.680 not in this country illegally, or the very least he 86 00:06:40.720 --> 00:06:47.959 can make a very educated guess on that front. And 87 00:06:48.000 --> 00:06:51.399 this is what I hate about the immigration debate. I 88 00:06:54.879 --> 00:06:59.839 the pro I guess, the standard liberal position is just 89 00:06:59.839 --> 00:07:04.920 totally okay with this situation where million, hundreds of thousands 90 00:07:04.920 --> 00:07:08.319 of people are coming over the border with no vetting whatsoever, 91 00:07:09.040 --> 00:07:12.240 and yet they want to engage in just these broad 92 00:07:12.319 --> 00:07:15.439 generalizations and cliches about well, you know, we're a whole 93 00:07:15.519 --> 00:07:18.720 nation of immigrants, says Margaret Brennan. Was you know, trying 94 00:07:18.720 --> 00:07:23.199 to explain to JD. Vance and Jdci Okay, yeah, we're 95 00:07:23.199 --> 00:07:24.680 a nation of immigrants. It doesn't mean we have to 96 00:07:24.720 --> 00:07:28.800 have the stupidest immigration policy known to man. We're a 97 00:07:28.879 --> 00:07:31.720 nation of immigrants and these people are just here to work. 98 00:07:32.079 --> 00:07:34.199 Some of them are just here to work. But you 99 00:07:34.279 --> 00:07:38.600 have no you have done no vetting to establish that 100 00:07:38.439 --> 00:07:41.879 that's the problem with this system. You have not vetted 101 00:07:41.920 --> 00:07:51.279 this person adequately. You don't know. You don't know when 102 00:07:51.319 --> 00:07:55.480 a person has overstayed their visa, when this person came 103 00:07:55.519 --> 00:07:58.680 across the border unlawfully, when this person made a phony 104 00:07:58.720 --> 00:08:01.439 asylum claim and is never coming back for their court date, 105 00:08:01.519 --> 00:08:09.519 and god knows, you don't know. So this idea that 106 00:08:09.639 --> 00:08:12.639 dire is taking this posture. We've worked hard to earn 107 00:08:12.720 --> 00:08:15.920 the trust of our immigrant community and to ensure that 108 00:08:15.959 --> 00:08:19.120 they feel comfortable reaching out to law enforcement when they 109 00:08:19.199 --> 00:08:22.439 need help or to provide information to officers. It really 110 00:08:22.480 --> 00:08:26.079 feels like this Jerry Dyer way of focusing on small 111 00:08:26.160 --> 00:08:30.639 picture thinking without having any kind of big picture concepts, 112 00:08:30.639 --> 00:08:35.159 like he wants to be sure that Latinos would feel 113 00:08:35.159 --> 00:08:38.720 okay calling the police about something, as opposed to the 114 00:08:38.759 --> 00:08:42.919 bigger picture question of Hey, if all these people shouldn't 115 00:08:42.960 --> 00:08:46.720 be here, shouldn't be here and are the ones committing crimes, 116 00:08:46.759 --> 00:08:56.519 maybe you wouldn't have this problem to begin with. Fresno 117 00:08:56.600 --> 00:08:59.279 will not sacrifice the trust we've worked so hard to 118 00:08:59.279 --> 00:09:04.759 build without community. Our community. Whose community, what do you 119 00:09:04.799 --> 00:09:08.000 mean our community? They're not even in the country legally 120 00:09:08.960 --> 00:09:17.360 and that's specifically who we are talking about. Again, I'll 121 00:09:17.399 --> 00:09:20.240 admit I'm not crazy about the church and school thing. 122 00:09:20.480 --> 00:09:25.000 I maybe I've got just a soft liberal heart in 123 00:09:25.039 --> 00:09:29.919 my old age, or you know, I'm listening to the 124 00:09:29.960 --> 00:09:31.440 Catholic Church on this. I'm going to talk about the 125 00:09:31.440 --> 00:09:33.360 Catholic Church, by the way, because there's been a lot 126 00:09:33.399 --> 00:09:36.799 of stories about this that I think are phony with 127 00:09:36.840 --> 00:09:40.360 regards to the Catholic Church's alleged role in illegal immigration. 128 00:09:42.159 --> 00:09:50.559 But I find this attitude on the left to be 129 00:09:52.039 --> 00:09:56.679 somewhat ludicrous of no, no, well, no, this is our community, 130 00:09:56.679 --> 00:09:59.759 we're gonna make it well if these people have come 131 00:10:00.080 --> 00:10:04.320 into the country illegally, are we just taking the posture 132 00:10:04.360 --> 00:10:08.679 of absolutely amnesty for all of them? That's what we want, 133 00:10:08.759 --> 00:10:11.480 Just absolutely amnesty for everyone who came into the country illegally. 134 00:10:11.559 --> 00:10:16.120 Absolutely amnesty for everyone, because they might have children, because 135 00:10:16.159 --> 00:10:19.159 they might have roots in the community in some way. 136 00:10:19.240 --> 00:10:23.480 After a certain period of time, that all the other 137 00:10:23.559 --> 00:10:28.240 considerations that are involved with an orderly regulation of the 138 00:10:28.279 --> 00:10:32.720 immigration process, that all of that goes away, that no 139 00:10:32.960 --> 00:10:39.279 enforcement is permitted. I just find that to be excessive, 140 00:10:39.279 --> 00:10:45.039 and I find Dyer's attitude strange. I mean, I guess 141 00:10:45.080 --> 00:10:48.399 he's just kind of committed to this. He's a cop, 142 00:10:49.799 --> 00:10:52.639 he has a cop. He wanted the immigrant community to 143 00:10:52.960 --> 00:10:55.240 be able to call the police about stuff, and so 144 00:10:55.360 --> 00:10:57.200 he wants to maintain trust and make them not be 145 00:10:57.200 --> 00:10:58.759 afraid that they're going to get deported if they call 146 00:10:58.799 --> 00:11:01.120 the police. But what if it's someone who should be deported? 147 00:11:05.399 --> 00:11:09.759 Dire is also, I'll concede working with a complicated legal framework. 148 00:11:09.840 --> 00:11:14.480 So he's got federal mandates. Well, he's got federal executive 149 00:11:14.519 --> 00:11:19.759 orders from the Trump administration to do certain things, but 150 00:11:20.240 --> 00:11:25.240 he's also in California. California has legal mandates on law 151 00:11:25.320 --> 00:11:30.600 enforcement agencies. We are a sanctuary state by you know, 152 00:11:30.759 --> 00:11:37.080 state statute. California law enforcement agencies are limited in their 153 00:11:37.120 --> 00:11:42.080 ability to cooperate under state law, limited in their ability 154 00:11:42.120 --> 00:11:44.360 to cooperate with ice and border patrol and other kinds 155 00:11:44.399 --> 00:11:49.759 of federal immigration enforcement agencies. And that is something that 156 00:11:50.440 --> 00:11:58.600 Fresno PD, for example, is required to follow. Some people, 157 00:11:59.200 --> 00:12:01.440 What do you mean for us to follow state law 158 00:12:01.519 --> 00:12:07.360 but not a federal executive For local governments and local 159 00:12:08.200 --> 00:12:12.240 police are creatures of state government. They are extensions of 160 00:12:12.279 --> 00:12:15.840 state government. They have to follow what the statement, what 161 00:12:15.919 --> 00:12:20.279 the state mandates. They're local governments don't have the kind 162 00:12:20.279 --> 00:12:22.960 of independence from state governments the way that state governments 163 00:12:23.000 --> 00:12:26.960 do from the federal government. Okay, local governments have to 164 00:12:27.080 --> 00:12:32.000 follow state mandates. It's a very clear precise thing. When 165 00:12:32.600 --> 00:12:37.559 if you've got a federal executive order telling Fresno PD 166 00:12:37.720 --> 00:12:41.600 what to do, this is not really a federal versus 167 00:12:41.720 --> 00:12:45.320 local thing. It's ultimately a federal versus state thing. What 168 00:12:45.480 --> 00:12:48.320 do these state officials Fresno PD? And that's what they 169 00:12:48.320 --> 00:12:51.320 are there. Yes, they are a local police department, but 170 00:12:51.360 --> 00:12:57.000 they are extensions of state government. That that's what this is. 171 00:12:57.399 --> 00:13:00.360 So Dire is sort of a little bit caught in 172 00:13:00.399 --> 00:13:05.159 the middle. I think he has to follow state law. 173 00:13:05.320 --> 00:13:09.519 President ped has to follow state law about not cooperating 174 00:13:09.519 --> 00:13:11.759 with the federal government. But now we've got these federal 175 00:13:11.799 --> 00:13:15.679 mandates coming out that are I think of, you know, 176 00:13:16.240 --> 00:13:19.799 highly disputed. Again, this is a highly disputed constitutional question 177 00:13:19.840 --> 00:13:24.480 whether a federal immigration agency can sort of command a 178 00:13:24.519 --> 00:13:28.360 local law enforcement agency a state ultimately a state law 179 00:13:28.399 --> 00:13:33.559 enforcement agency to do something. And Dire I think is 180 00:13:33.639 --> 00:13:37.480 clearly realized. I think Dyer is making the strategic decision 181 00:13:38.000 --> 00:13:40.600 that his bread is going to get buttered more by 182 00:13:40.639 --> 00:13:45.679 the Democrats in California state government than by the federal government. 183 00:13:46.960 --> 00:13:51.200 I think Dyer is basically just decided this. He needs 184 00:13:51.240 --> 00:13:53.639 Gavin Newsom to follow through with giving him all that 185 00:13:54.639 --> 00:13:57.360 you know that two hundred million dollars we're still waiting 186 00:13:57.399 --> 00:14:00.840 for in downtown Presno infrastructure. He's not going to do 187 00:14:00.919 --> 00:14:03.000 things to tick off Gavin Newsom. And I'm sure nothing 188 00:14:03.039 --> 00:14:06.679 with tick Gavin Newsom or Rob Bonta off more than 189 00:14:07.120 --> 00:14:09.639 Jerry Dyer all of a sudden announcing, oh, yeah, we're 190 00:14:09.679 --> 00:14:11.440 going to follow this executive order. We're going to do 191 00:14:11.480 --> 00:14:17.000 what whatever President Trump says. So I guess I understand 192 00:14:17.000 --> 00:14:22.279 the pressures around Dier and the legal mandates that Presno 193 00:14:22.279 --> 00:14:29.879 PD are working under, but his attitude is just really aggressive. 194 00:14:30.080 --> 00:14:35.559 It seems like very this is not a conservative approach 195 00:14:35.639 --> 00:14:39.559 to immigration that the Dyer is embodying here. And I 196 00:14:39.559 --> 00:14:42.919 don't know if Dyer has any designs or sites set 197 00:14:43.600 --> 00:14:47.200 on any kind of higher public office beyond being the 198 00:14:47.240 --> 00:14:51.399 mayor of Fresno. I don't know that he's ever indicated such, 199 00:14:52.639 --> 00:14:55.679 but I wonder if he's trying to carve some kind 200 00:14:55.679 --> 00:15:00.240 of future like that. For himself. I'm not sure when 201 00:15:00.240 --> 00:15:06.559 we return the humanitarian issues surrounding immigration. On the other 202 00:15:06.600 --> 00:15:13.360 side of it, the problems associated with unrestricted immigration, that's 203 00:15:13.399 --> 00:15:17.279 next on the John Girardi Show. I'm going to level 204 00:15:17.320 --> 00:15:20.000 with you guys that I'm a little bit conflicted about 205 00:15:20.039 --> 00:15:23.039 what's going on with immigration enforcement policy, probably a lot 206 00:15:23.039 --> 00:15:27.639 more than most conservative talkers are. I want to take 207 00:15:28.919 --> 00:15:35.120 the statements of Catholic leaders seriously. I am a Catholic. 208 00:15:35.200 --> 00:15:38.559 I'm first That's what I try to be, first and 209 00:15:38.639 --> 00:15:42.360 foremost in formulating what I believe and what I think 210 00:15:42.399 --> 00:15:47.720 and how I talk about it. And I think that 211 00:15:48.759 --> 00:15:51.039 one of the things to understand about Catholic teaching is 212 00:15:51.080 --> 00:15:54.440 that it's not a complete handbook for answering every single 213 00:15:54.480 --> 00:15:57.639 political question under the sun. The Catholic Church basically gives 214 00:15:57.759 --> 00:16:03.759 various kinds of ideal and principles, and it's the duty 215 00:16:03.799 --> 00:16:06.759 of Catholics in the here and now to suss out 216 00:16:07.200 --> 00:16:10.840 how those ideals and principles apply in our present day situation. 217 00:16:11.679 --> 00:16:17.720 The opinions of people like bishops, even the Pope on 218 00:16:19.639 --> 00:16:27.120 those kinds of changing, historically contingent, factually contingent questions are 219 00:16:27.159 --> 00:16:30.919 not infallible at all. In fact, there are very few 220 00:16:31.519 --> 00:16:37.679 times when what the Church is teaching is Catholics would 221 00:16:37.720 --> 00:16:40.080 deem it to be infallible. And it's usually just kind 222 00:16:40.080 --> 00:16:42.720 of core stuff that's repeated again and again and again 223 00:16:42.759 --> 00:16:47.039 over the course of the church's history. So it's not 224 00:16:47.080 --> 00:16:49.559 that every Catholic has to agree on every single issue 225 00:16:50.000 --> 00:16:51.960 all of the time. But I do want to take 226 00:16:52.000 --> 00:16:54.559 these things seriously because it's not just like, ah, you 227 00:16:54.559 --> 00:16:56.279 can just believe whatever you you know, just believe whatever 228 00:16:56.279 --> 00:17:00.240 you want about this contingent historical circumstance. Well, no, if 229 00:17:00.240 --> 00:17:07.640 people are being seriously treated unjustly or justly, it really matters. 230 00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:10.240 It really matters what you think about these things and 231 00:17:10.279 --> 00:17:15.759 how you fall on these things. Is Donald Trump's Immigration 232 00:17:16.119 --> 00:17:22.319 Enforcement Grand Plan inflicting serious acts of injustice on large 233 00:17:22.400 --> 00:17:25.720 numbers of people. If it is, then that's bad. If 234 00:17:25.720 --> 00:17:30.400 it's not, then that would be good. And I have 235 00:17:30.519 --> 00:17:35.039 seen I will note in all of this that the 236 00:17:35.079 --> 00:17:38.359 American bishops have received some criticisms that are fair and 237 00:17:38.400 --> 00:17:40.240 some that are not fair. First of all, I think 238 00:17:40.279 --> 00:17:42.680 some of the criticisms about all the Catholic bishops are 239 00:17:42.680 --> 00:17:47.920 getting rich off of they're getting rich off of illegal 240 00:17:47.920 --> 00:17:51.519 immigration because they get all these grants for like refugee 241 00:17:51.559 --> 00:17:57.440 resettlement and stuff like that. Well, yeah, they get grants 242 00:17:57.440 --> 00:18:02.240 for refugee resettlement or immigrant resettlement that they use on 243 00:18:02.279 --> 00:18:08.559 immigrant resettlement. They're not getting rich off of this, okay. 244 00:18:10.160 --> 00:18:12.839 And by the also, when we say the Catholic Church 245 00:18:13.960 --> 00:18:16.920 or the bishops, we mean a number of different things. 246 00:18:18.000 --> 00:18:19.559 For one thing, a lot of a lot of it 247 00:18:19.599 --> 00:18:23.599 is Catholic nonprofit agencies sort of Catholic charities types entities 248 00:18:24.039 --> 00:18:28.960 type entities in various areas. They have gotten a lot 249 00:18:28.960 --> 00:18:31.000 of these grants, and a lot of these Catholic charity 250 00:18:31.160 --> 00:18:33.839 type entities are not always directly under the control of 251 00:18:33.880 --> 00:18:38.160 a bishop. For example, Fresno Catholic Charities, which does really 252 00:18:38.200 --> 00:18:42.279 wonderful work with poor people, by the way, is not 253 00:18:42.480 --> 00:18:44.640 directly under the control of the Bishop of Fresno. It's 254 00:18:44.680 --> 00:18:54.119 actually a separate corporate entity. So and basically nobody's getting 255 00:18:54.240 --> 00:18:57.440 rich off of this scheme. Okay. These are non profit 256 00:18:57.599 --> 00:19:04.759 entities with not highly paid staffs and executives, and the 257 00:19:04.880 --> 00:19:10.200 money they're getting for immigrant or refugee resettlement is less 258 00:19:10.200 --> 00:19:13.440 than what they have to spend, so they're not like 259 00:19:13.759 --> 00:19:18.160 making sweet bank off of this whole thing. I think 260 00:19:18.160 --> 00:19:22.519 that's a misconception that certain kind of conservative Catholics have 261 00:19:22.559 --> 00:19:24.799 been trying to promote, just as because they have this 262 00:19:24.839 --> 00:19:27.079 sort of hostile attitude against bishops, thinking that they're all 263 00:19:27.079 --> 00:19:30.279 a bunch of liberal squishes, and certainly there have been 264 00:19:30.400 --> 00:19:35.599 liberal squishy bishops. I don't know that this is necessarily it. 265 00:19:38.599 --> 00:19:44.400 And I think the attitude of priests and bishops and 266 00:19:44.519 --> 00:19:50.200 pastors who are directly pastoring churches that are full of 267 00:19:50.200 --> 00:19:53.480 immigrants is gonna be one of concern. These are people 268 00:19:53.519 --> 00:19:55.720 that you see at church and whose confessions you hear, 269 00:19:55.759 --> 00:19:58.880 and babies you baptize, and sons and daughters you marry. 270 00:20:00.119 --> 00:20:03.000 And to see people in that situation distressed about whether 271 00:20:03.240 --> 00:20:07.960 or not they're going to be deported, that's a difficult 272 00:20:08.079 --> 00:20:11.440 human thing to be dealing with. And they have concern 273 00:20:11.480 --> 00:20:16.599 and a protectiveness towards that. And I can see the 274 00:20:16.640 --> 00:20:21.000 frustration on the part of Christian leaders to especially over 275 00:20:21.039 --> 00:20:23.720 the last look at the last six years. We go 276 00:20:23.839 --> 00:20:27.680 from the Trump administration Trump one point zero, very restrictive, 277 00:20:27.960 --> 00:20:29.880 not letting a ton of people in, then all of 278 00:20:29.920 --> 00:20:32.480 a sudden we have this total one to eighty with 279 00:20:32.519 --> 00:20:34.880 the Biden administration comes in and basically with a big, 280 00:20:34.880 --> 00:20:39.279 wide open door, everybody come on in. People rely on 281 00:20:39.359 --> 00:20:44.119 that they come in, and in some cases it's because 282 00:20:44.119 --> 00:20:48.000 the United States is either openly or tacitly waving them in. 283 00:20:49.559 --> 00:20:53.519 The ridiculous CBP one app where people are sort of 284 00:20:53.559 --> 00:21:00.079 pre getting their asylum claim court date in place. I 285 00:21:00.119 --> 00:21:04.119 mean the Trump administration, the Biden administration just signaling that 286 00:21:04.160 --> 00:21:07.480 they're not going to take border enforcement seriously. People come 287 00:21:07.519 --> 00:21:11.519 in based on relying on that, and now all of 288 00:21:11.559 --> 00:21:14.400 a sudden, here comes the Trump administration with the most 289 00:21:15.240 --> 00:21:21.960 relative to that, the complete one eighty draconian mass deportation policy. 290 00:21:22.599 --> 00:21:28.160 I can understand the whiplash that someone in those shoes 291 00:21:28.240 --> 00:21:37.880 might feel, so I get the human side of that 292 00:21:37.960 --> 00:21:40.920 to see people who are upset. On the other hand, 293 00:21:41.480 --> 00:21:43.200 and I think I'll dig into this when we return. 294 00:21:44.240 --> 00:21:47.960 I think the problem is that it should be in 295 00:21:48.359 --> 00:21:51.519 some sense, it makes sense, it should be the role 296 00:21:51.599 --> 00:21:55.440 of the position, the attitude of the Catholic Church of hey, 297 00:21:55.720 --> 00:21:58.839 we're just here to help people. We're here to provide 298 00:21:58.839 --> 00:22:02.119 them with food or to provide them with shelter, to 299 00:22:02.240 --> 00:22:06.640 teach them about Jesus Christ to you know, we're not 300 00:22:06.880 --> 00:22:11.000 gonna be cracking down on the immigration status of people 301 00:22:11.039 --> 00:22:14.240 we're trying to serve in the midst of our nonprofit organization. 302 00:22:14.319 --> 00:22:17.519 That's not what we're trying to do. I mean, you know, 303 00:22:17.640 --> 00:22:20.640 even within the context of my Obria clinic that I started, 304 00:22:20.920 --> 00:22:23.000 I don't want my Obria clinic. I don't want to 305 00:22:23.000 --> 00:22:25.920 be like I don't need to be the immigration police 306 00:22:26.079 --> 00:22:28.680 for our patients to see are you here legally or not? 307 00:22:28.799 --> 00:22:32.079 If they've you know, hey, you can get medical now 308 00:22:32.200 --> 00:22:36.160 if you're here in the country illegally in the state 309 00:22:36.200 --> 00:22:41.000 of California. Ah. I don't think that's necessarily a wise policy. 310 00:22:41.079 --> 00:22:42.960 I think that's a bad incentive. It's a bad way 311 00:22:43.000 --> 00:22:45.400 to incentivize people to come here. But in the context 312 00:22:45.400 --> 00:22:47.480 of our clinic, where we're serving lower income women with 313 00:22:47.519 --> 00:22:50.039 prenatal care, I don't want to have to be the 314 00:22:50.039 --> 00:22:53.480 one concerned with that. That should be immigration authorities who 315 00:22:53.559 --> 00:22:56.319 should have taken care of that problem on the front end. Frankly, 316 00:22:57.640 --> 00:23:00.640 and I can see the position of the Catholic Church 317 00:23:00.680 --> 00:23:02.559 to say with you know, in response to this executive 318 00:23:02.640 --> 00:23:07.440 order from the Trump administration that no immigration enforcement actions 319 00:23:07.440 --> 00:23:11.079 can actually happen at churches or schools. I could see 320 00:23:11.079 --> 00:23:14.880 the Catholic Church saying, you know what, that that sucks. No, 321 00:23:15.160 --> 00:23:19.359 we don't want people are here to worship. Maybe they 322 00:23:19.559 --> 00:23:21.960 did dumb things in the past, maybe they made bad 323 00:23:22.000 --> 00:23:24.400 decisions to get here, but they're here now and they're 324 00:23:24.400 --> 00:23:26.759 worshiping here, and we don't want our church to be 325 00:23:27.200 --> 00:23:32.119 the place where immigration enforcement happens. I completely get that 326 00:23:32.160 --> 00:23:34.640 perspective from the Catholic Church, and frankly I agree with it. 327 00:23:35.880 --> 00:23:38.359 Now when don't we return? Though, I want to push 328 00:23:38.440 --> 00:23:42.680 back against some of the soft Christian attitudes about characterizing 329 00:23:42.720 --> 00:23:45.960 immigrants as all being wonderful assault of the earth people. 330 00:23:46.240 --> 00:23:48.440 Many are, but many are not. That's next on the 331 00:23:48.480 --> 00:23:52.799 John Frodi Show. We've learned over the course of American 332 00:23:52.920 --> 00:23:56.119 history that a kind of bigotry that sort of pre 333 00:23:56.599 --> 00:24:00.599 judges has prejudice against a certain group of people, that 334 00:24:00.640 --> 00:24:03.480 they all have a certain kind of characteristic, they all 335 00:24:03.480 --> 00:24:07.039 engage in certain kinds of bad behaviors, is something that 336 00:24:07.160 --> 00:24:11.279 is harmful to broader society. Having a certain kind of 337 00:24:11.319 --> 00:24:14.599 assumption that all black people are bad, therefore I'm not 338 00:24:14.680 --> 00:24:19.440 hiring any black people is harmful and malicious and prejudicial 339 00:24:19.519 --> 00:24:23.200 and bad for society. Having these kind of preconceived notions, 340 00:24:23.839 --> 00:24:27.680 these kind of preconceived bigotries can in many cases be 341 00:24:27.920 --> 00:24:34.079 really really harmful. Something that I think is also true 342 00:24:34.599 --> 00:24:37.200 on the flip side, that is more in the realm 343 00:24:37.279 --> 00:24:42.440 of rhetoric and political argumentation and sort of pious ideas 344 00:24:42.480 --> 00:24:46.599 that people believe is characterizing any one group of people 345 00:24:46.680 --> 00:24:53.839 as all being saints. This often happens with jobs and professions, 346 00:24:54.680 --> 00:24:57.160 where you'll get some politicians talking about. 347 00:24:56.880 --> 00:25:01.559 Our teachers are teachers, and they're just all all. Our 348 00:25:01.599 --> 00:25:04.319 teachers are just the hardest working. We're here to back 349 00:25:04.359 --> 00:25:07.400 our teachers. You don't support teachers, You don't want to 350 00:25:07.440 --> 00:25:09.319 support increases in teacher pay. 351 00:25:09.640 --> 00:25:13.799 Our teachers in California are doing amazing, heroic work, to 352 00:25:13.799 --> 00:25:15.720 which are respond All right, Maybe maybe a lot of 353 00:25:15.759 --> 00:25:18.000 teachers are good. But I think, much like any job, 354 00:25:18.319 --> 00:25:20.680 I think there are some teachers who are excellent. I 355 00:25:20.720 --> 00:25:22.880 think there are some teachers who suck, and I think 356 00:25:22.880 --> 00:25:24.319 there are a lot of teachers in the middle who 357 00:25:24.359 --> 00:25:27.440 are okay. And I think that's true of any job. 358 00:25:28.599 --> 00:25:30.680 Conservatives do the same thing, by the way, with their 359 00:25:30.720 --> 00:25:36.200 favorite professions. You know, military members or. 360 00:25:36.160 --> 00:25:41.039 Men and women in uniform serve and protect, so thank 361 00:25:41.160 --> 00:25:42.400 you for your service. 362 00:25:43.960 --> 00:25:47.960 And anyone who's been in the military will tell you, okay, yeah, 363 00:25:48.119 --> 00:25:50.200 on a certain level, we've all made a kind of 364 00:25:50.240 --> 00:25:54.920 fundamental commitment to sacrifice ourselves for the sake of the country. 365 00:25:56.039 --> 00:25:59.559 But there are like people in the military who suck, 366 00:26:00.119 --> 00:26:06.079 Like there are great military members, soldiers who are really smart, 367 00:26:06.119 --> 00:26:10.319 guys are smart guys, hard working, good dudes, whatever, And 368 00:26:10.359 --> 00:26:13.359 there are some people in the military who stink. And 369 00:26:13.400 --> 00:26:16.359 there are a lot of people in the middle. I 370 00:26:16.400 --> 00:26:20.599 think anyone who's actually in one of those professions will 371 00:26:20.640 --> 00:26:24.480 actually be one of the first to vigorously nod their 372 00:26:24.519 --> 00:26:27.680 head and affirm that yeah, not everyone in every in 373 00:26:27.720 --> 00:26:35.119 my profession is great at their job. I think we 374 00:26:35.200 --> 00:26:38.599 have a real problem in America that one side's way 375 00:26:38.799 --> 00:26:45.200 of arguing about the immigration debate is totally dominated by 376 00:26:45.240 --> 00:26:50.279 that attitude when it comes to immigrants, treating immigrants as 377 00:26:50.319 --> 00:26:54.759 a whole and refusing to distinguish between people who immigrated 378 00:26:54.759 --> 00:27:00.200 illegally versus people who immigrated legally versus people makeing a 379 00:27:00.200 --> 00:27:03.319 phony refugee claim coming under some sort of cover or 380 00:27:03.400 --> 00:27:08.720 color of law. I think we have a problem that 381 00:27:09.200 --> 00:27:14.880 the political left, because of their perception that this group 382 00:27:14.960 --> 00:27:19.200 of people will ultimately vote for them because they'll need 383 00:27:19.240 --> 00:27:21.720 more social welfare services and they're the party that offers 384 00:27:21.720 --> 00:27:26.440 more in social welfare services, that the political left is 385 00:27:26.519 --> 00:27:32.519 going to characterize all immigrants as good. The way that 386 00:27:33.400 --> 00:27:36.519 people in politics will try to characterize all teachers is 387 00:27:36.559 --> 00:27:38.759 good for some kind of political end. The way that 388 00:27:39.839 --> 00:27:42.880 people in politics will characterize all members of the military 389 00:27:43.039 --> 00:27:45.119 is good for some kind of political end, or all 390 00:27:45.240 --> 00:27:47.079 the members of the FBI is good for some kind 391 00:27:47.119 --> 00:27:51.720 of whatever it is. And the fact of the matter 392 00:27:51.839 --> 00:27:56.759 is that if you're coming into the country illegally, you've 393 00:27:56.759 --> 00:28:05.559 already done one thing that's not great, okay, And so 394 00:28:05.759 --> 00:28:11.519 much of illegal immigration is connected with crime. I'm not 395 00:28:11.559 --> 00:28:15.519 saying every illegal immigrant or most illegal immigrants are here 396 00:28:15.759 --> 00:28:17.880 to murder people, or rob people who rape people, or 397 00:28:17.920 --> 00:28:23.400 transport drugs or narcotics or whatever. However, So I learned 398 00:28:23.400 --> 00:28:26.200 this talking to an immigration lawyer who's a friend of mine, 399 00:28:26.319 --> 00:28:32.200 and he, you know, this is coming from experience working 400 00:28:32.240 --> 00:28:37.519 and talking with these people. He told me basically to 401 00:28:37.680 --> 00:28:41.960