Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to Batflips and Nerds, the Baseball podcast
Speaker 1: with a British twist.
Speaker 2: I am your host this evening.
Speaker 1: Russell lieson and if we have another interview for you
Speaker 1: today and another one with some Slate Red Sox connection,
Speaker 1: but somebody who also has a massive connection to this podcast,
Speaker 1: someone who has been a guest. I think we're now
Speaker 1: on episodsumber five times that they've joined us on this podcast.
Speaker 1: Definitely a record as the set records all around baseball
Speaker 1: with what they're doing right now. Delighted to be with
Speaker 1: Liam Carroll, who is now the manager of Hi a
Speaker 1: Greenville Drive, who has obviously also been part of the
Speaker 1: Salem Red Sox in the past couple of seasons as
Speaker 1: well as the gb national coach, as well as many
Speaker 1: of things in British baseball with the London Mets or
Speaker 1: Bracknell or Bournemouth and many of other places in between.
Speaker 2: Liam, Welcome, it's a pleasure to have you once again.
Speaker 3: Thanks us.
Speaker 4: Well, it's crazy to be back. It's been too long,
Speaker 4: so we really looking forward to the chat.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so for our long time listeners, most of you
Speaker 1: will know Liam, but I think it is kind of
Speaker 1: worthwhile doing a whistle to stop tour of since we've
Speaker 1: probably last had you up to two thousand and four.
Speaker 1: So Liam, like you were, obviously he'll have an American dad,
Speaker 1: a British mum brought up in like the UK, but
Speaker 1: baseball was still something like that you wanted to do
Speaker 1: even though you had very little access to it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, no doubt, just incredibly fortunate with there being enough
Speaker 4: British baseball where I was, and also my dad getting
Speaker 4: involved in various British baseball circles.
Speaker 3: And I mean really cutting to the.
Speaker 4: Chase, it was the British baseball giants, the likes of
Speaker 4: Kevin Marshall, Alex Malahoudis and Nick Carter who inspired me
Speaker 4: to want to go and play in the States. Went
Speaker 4: Delta Community College, where Nick and Gavin went. Realized soon
Speaker 4: into my coaching all my playing career that I wasn't
Speaker 4: cut out to be very good at playing, so by
Speaker 4: the end of my college career had begun to coach effectively,
Speaker 4: and rather than finishing my collegiate eligibility as a player,
Speaker 4: took an opportunity to join the coaching staff at UNLB
Speaker 4: spent in all five seasons there that ended in twenty ten.
Speaker 4: There's national team involvement throughout this part of my career
Speaker 4: twenty ten to the last until COVID basically national team,
Speaker 4: BSUK Academy, High Performance Academy, some London Mets as you mentioned,
Speaker 4: and then just incredibly fortunate, largely through relationships built to
Speaker 4: have had the opportunity.
Speaker 3: To join the Red Sox.
Speaker 4: This is now my third season after two in Salem.
Speaker 4: Excited this year as you mentioned, to move up to
Speaker 4: Hi A and join the Greenville Drive.
Speaker 1: So yeah, obviously let's start with Salem then, like that
Speaker 1: is this something that you obviously we know I took
Speaker 1: to you personally. It is something you were very much
Speaker 1: aiming for as a possibility. You wanted to push as
Speaker 1: far as you could in this coaching and this managerial
Speaker 1: world within baseball. But for how long did you think
Speaker 1: it was a realistic target to be like, to get
Speaker 1: into like my league baseball.
Speaker 4: Really only the two or three seasons proceeding getting hired.
Speaker 3: It was something I never thought.
Speaker 4: Was possible, as the walls of professional baseball were pretty solid,
Speaker 4: and if you hadn't had a professional playing career, it
Speaker 4: was rare that a coach got a look in and
Speaker 4: that certainly changed dramatically in the last decade or so.
Speaker 4: Andrew Wright is our director or our field coordinator. I
Speaker 4: met Andrew at the ABCA convention a few years back
Speaker 4: while he was still a college coach. Then he got
Speaker 4: in with the Yankees invited to apply there, so for
Speaker 4: the next two or three years applied but.
Speaker 3: It never really went anywhere. So, okay, this is cool.
Speaker 3: It's nice to have a conversation and interview. And then
Speaker 3: suddenly he moved.
Speaker 4: To the Red Sox and I ended up with a job.
Speaker 4: But was really only despite always having the professional baseball dream,
Speaker 4: it was really only something that became a legitimate goal
Speaker 4: within the last few years.
Speaker 3: And I think as the national.
Speaker 4: Team has success, especially since the advent of the World
Speaker 4: Baseball Classic and British baseball being under a microscope a
Speaker 4: little bit more, I think it always seemed inevitable that
Speaker 4: national teamers would get the opportunity with so many caliber people,
Speaker 4: and so no surprise really that more recently Drew has
Speaker 4: ended up in professional baseball as well, and I expect
Speaker 4: and hope that there will be more in the future.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's amazing to see this kind of like can
Speaker 1: continue to through and because for everybody it's almost in
Speaker 1: all regards, it's like if you can see someone do something,
Speaker 1: it becomes a possibility for like, this is something that
Speaker 1: I can attaint to. We have players who want to
Speaker 1: be players in Major League Baseball, but for some people
Speaker 1: who are thinking that like oh my my time is up,
Speaker 1: like there's no chance of being involved in this, there's
Speaker 1: still opportunities for people to continue to grow and develop,
Speaker 1: and it's amazing to see that. With you kind of
Speaker 1: coming into like that situation in a ball it was
Speaker 1: probably quite different to what you've been doing for the
Speaker 1: last few years with British baseball, where you're effectively chasing
Speaker 1: I don't know, you know, probably chasing and calling like
Speaker 1: two hundred guys to be like, please come play at
Speaker 1: this baseball tournament and then actually spending like a week
Speaker 1: with some guys, maybe two weeks with some guys and
Speaker 1: getting to get to work out what do I do
Speaker 1: with these people? How do I get them to play
Speaker 1: the best baseball in like two weeks to being like,
Speaker 1: oh now I've got like a year to look develop
Speaker 1: sort of players. How did that like mentality for you
Speaker 1: change and how did that style of actually having coaching
Speaker 1: impact you in that first year in Salem, you know, it.
Speaker 4: Was a lot of similarities, but definitely the differences. And
Speaker 4: one of the things that is fantastic is just a
Speaker 4: caliber of the player, the depth of talent, and that
Speaker 4: myself nor any of our other uniform staff need to
Speaker 4: spend any time worrying about the players where they come from.
Speaker 4: The scouts that we have are absolutely incredible, and the
Speaker 4: caliber of players remarkable. That's obviously true across all thirty organizations.
Speaker 4: Sort of show up every day and have these elite athletes,
Speaker 4: elite baseball players, really is a privilege. The similarities, I mean,
Speaker 4: there are still people and and ultimately, while the baseball
Speaker 4: specifics are fun and of course they're critical, you're building
Speaker 4: relationships with people from different backgrounds, from different countries, with
Speaker 4: different likes and dislikes, different interests and disinterests.
Speaker 3: So that hasn't changed.
Speaker 4: That's just the same as running an academy session in Coventry.
Speaker 4: So I've enjoyed it thoroughly, and I think while the
Speaker 4: difference of doing it every single day is the biggest difference,
Speaker 4: planning an academy practice for one hundred and twenty kids
Speaker 4: in Coventry or in Milton Keynes and figuring out how
Speaker 4: it works and working with others, because it takes a village,
Speaker 4: working with others to figure out how to solve that
Speaker 4: problem so that the kids in Coventry or Milton Keynes
Speaker 4: have a great experience that's very similar. And as a
Speaker 4: minor league manager, while I do have various hats I
Speaker 4: need to wear, arguably the biggest one is making sure
Speaker 4: that this sedule works every day so that our coaching
Speaker 4: staff can do their job, so that our players can
Speaker 4: do theirs.
Speaker 1: And I think about like some of the conversations that
Speaker 1: we had between the two of us sat in maybe
Speaker 1: like pass Yanks or Homer and house where we were,
Speaker 1: we were coming up with ways for you to analyze
Speaker 1: the baseball that dB could play with the limited amount
Speaker 1: of data that we have to work out, like the
Speaker 1: if we do everything small right, then we should win
Speaker 1: more games than like we lose, or we were looking
Speaker 1: for all of these small statistics. I imagine now some
Speaker 1: of that still is the same, but you have such
Speaker 1: a plethora of information at your at your fingertips. Now,
Speaker 1: how how do you kind of work together with that transition?
Speaker 1: How do you start to think about, well, what's important
Speaker 1: and what's not important, even because you now have potentially
Speaker 1: too much data.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I.
Speaker 4: Think one of the things that we as an organization
Speaker 4: do very well is bridge the gap between what's available
Speaker 4: and what we can crunch, if you will, to making
Speaker 4: that useful for the player and useful for the code.
Speaker 4: As you've referenced, like anything imaginable technology wise, data wise,
Speaker 4: analytics wise isn't there or being built or at least
Speaker 4: is an idea. And it was quite intimidating at first
Speaker 4: having some insight into the new wave of how baseball works,
Speaker 4: but never having any hands on experience. A little bit intimidating,
Speaker 4: thrown in at the deep end. But again, we have
Speaker 4: a great education within the organization, great people that help
Speaker 4: bridge the gap. And each year we've got a little
Speaker 4: bit better and that's enabled me to be a little
Speaker 4: bit better ensuring that I can leverage the technology, leverage
Speaker 4: the data. And we're also we're very clear on what
Speaker 4: we think is required in terms of being successful as
Speaker 4: a big league team, being successful as a big league player. Uh.
Speaker 4: And because we have that understanding, we can be very specific,
Speaker 4: very directed, very intentional about how we try and improve
Speaker 4: those things at the minor league level.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think the Red Sox as a whole
Speaker 1: has had not necessarily like an organizational shift, but with
Speaker 1: their changing at the top and then they're bringing in
Speaker 1: of people like Kyle Body, it feels that like this
Speaker 1: and was it just a Wilford and a few others
Speaker 1: to kind of actually bring this ethos across like the
Speaker 1: whole entire organization of like this is what we're aiming
Speaker 1: for and how we're going to do it together. We
Speaker 1: had Kyle on here a few weeks back, and he
Speaker 1: really talked about culture being almost like the most important
Speaker 1: side of that. How have you've seen the culture of
Speaker 1: analytics or the culture of kind of like within professional
Speaker 1: baseball like be different to like that maybe that's like
Speaker 1: culture of coaching at the national team level.
Speaker 4: Like the biggest difference from my perspective is while, of
Speaker 4: course every game we have for play, we want to
Speaker 4: win it, and we will play to win, but we're
Speaker 4: not going to do certain things at the expense of
Speaker 4: player development. At the end of the day, it's a
Speaker 4: bonus if in Salem we win. I don't think I
Speaker 4: lose my job if we have a losing season. Then
Speaker 4: my first season we did we had a losing season.
Speaker 4: My second season we won more than we lost. Every
Speaker 4: time that you play a national team game tournament, you're
Speaker 4: trying to win, and that it is a significant difference
Speaker 4: now where.
Speaker 3: There's so many layers to that was.
Speaker 4: It's it's been great how the national team's success has evolved,
Speaker 4: and one of the one of the reasons for that,
Speaker 4: I think is having depth at the national team level.
Speaker 4: Looking at the most recent World Baseball Classic team, you
Speaker 4: did have options off the bench. You could play matchups
Speaker 4: a little bit based on the information that you have,
Speaker 4: and I never really had that privilege. I guess that
Speaker 4: depth when I was managing the national team and again
Speaker 4: peeling back another layer. While there is all of those
Speaker 4: benefits in terms of depth at the national team level,
Speaker 4: now you don't necessarily have the data because while.
Speaker 3: There is more money in the program, there's not.
Speaker 4: As much money as Boston Redtucks have. Hopefully, with the
Speaker 4: injection from the UK's four ahead of the LA Olympic cycle,
Speaker 4: true In his team can really start to leverage technology
Speaker 4: a little bit more to create those margins because it's
Speaker 4: difficult to win an international baseball game, let alone one
Speaker 4: against Timmy USA or the Dominican Republic or Japan.
Speaker 1: I think it's really interesting that you talk about the
Speaker 1: culture of not winning not being important, because I imagine
Speaker 1: that's also foreign to all of the players that you get,
Speaker 1: because you've got guys that have been coming out of
Speaker 1: college where they want to get to that college World Series.
Speaker 1: They want to they want to get that kind of
Speaker 1: like that feather in their cap because it'll probably help
Speaker 1: their draft capital. But then you get them and it's like, Okay,
Speaker 1: this is not as important anymore. Is that a difficult
Speaker 1: discussion to have? Are there some people that potentially struggle
Speaker 1: with the fact that, like, winning isn't the beal and
Speaker 1: end all anymore?
Speaker 4: Yeah? I think I think everyone gets it. I think
Speaker 4: there's certain situations that become frustrating. I think a key
Speaker 4: a key a keynote to address It's not the winning
Speaker 4: is not important, it's that it's not as important as
Speaker 4: is something else. A great example, an easy example would
Speaker 4: be it's let's say it's a Wednesday, Thursday, Friday game
Speaker 4: middle of the week, which is when you're more likely
Speaker 4: to give a top prospected day off, and it's a
Speaker 4: close game, and you know that they're the best bat
Speaker 4: you have on the bench, and maybe if they pinch
Speaker 4: hit in the ninth your chances of winning the game.
Speaker 3: Improve that priority player.
Speaker 4: That prospect is not going to pinch hit in that situation,
Speaker 4: certainly not in the lower levels of the mind. We
Speaker 4: have to respect the off day rest is critical to
Speaker 4: their development. Likewise, if a prospect was going through a
Speaker 4: slump and there might be a better option on the
Speaker 4: bench because someone else is hot, I'm not taking the
Speaker 4: prospect out of the game. So while in the moment
Speaker 4: there might be some frustrations in some corners about not
Speaker 4: pushing those button, Certainly you hear it from the fans,
Speaker 4: why are you not doing this? From the armchair quarterbacks,
Speaker 4: everyone in the room, while there might be some frustration
Speaker 4: in the moment, really does get it. And I think
Speaker 4: ultimately we have a strong belief that all of the
Speaker 4: things that we believe are important, whether it's driven by data,
Speaker 4: whether it's a more traditional baseball thing, what we preach
Speaker 4: to our players, what we encourage our players to buy into,
Speaker 4: the reasons we draft and develop different players. Winning will
Speaker 4: take care of itself.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that sounds like a really important thing to
Speaker 2: get through everybody.
Speaker 1: The thing that jumps in my mind sometimes is what
Speaker 1: things that you have to do manage that other people
Speaker 1: don't have to do.
Speaker 2: Is you have to take people on injury assignments.
Speaker 1: Potentially they're coming down from like higher levels or even
Speaker 1: the highest level that they'll drop down to do that
Speaker 1: because of the proximity or just the right day to
Speaker 1: get somebody to play.
Speaker 2: Did you get.
Speaker 1: Anybody like major in either of your couple of years
Speaker 1: at Salem.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 4: We actually had Zach Kelly on a rehab assignment two
Speaker 4: years ago and it was very cool.
Speaker 3: It typically wouldn't happen.
Speaker 4: I think it's it's very rare that a major league
Speaker 4: rehab assignment happens in low Way. But Nack is from
Speaker 4: Rowan Oak, which is next door to Salem, and.
Speaker 3: He specifically requested it. And what an experience that.
Speaker 4: Was for our players to rub shoulders, which they have
Speaker 4: some opportunity to do that during spring training, but to
Speaker 4: spend a week in the fire in the dog days
Speaker 4: of August rubbing shoulders with a big leaguer and the
Speaker 4: chance for the players to pick the brainer, that's incredibly powerful.
Speaker 4: And while we do have phenomenal coaches with very different backgrounds,
Speaker 4: some of which to include professional and big league backgrounds.
Speaker 4: I think it's a little bit different when a younger
Speaker 4: player gets to talk to an older player. Incredibly powerful
Speaker 4: and while of course the primary reason for Zach being
Speaker 4: in Salem for a series was his own rehabilitation, it
Speaker 4: was massively impactful for players too.
Speaker 1: And everybody surely expects a nice lunch on Zach as well, yeah,
Speaker 1: or nice dinner.
Speaker 3: Yeah there was. There was The post game spread was
Speaker 3: taken care of.
Speaker 2: And I guess that's something.
Speaker 1: Obviously, you've only been part of major league baseball and
Speaker 1: minor league baseball since a lot of the improvements have
Speaker 1: had been had on the minor league side, but you
Speaker 1: probably know you've talked to players, you've worked with players
Speaker 1: who have been in want It's like horror stories of
Speaker 1: the past, but like single be I mean, it must
Speaker 1: be a completely different world to what it used to
Speaker 1: be five years ago, let alone ten years ago.
Speaker 4: No doubt, and the changes were needed, they were arguably
Speaker 4: over to you and incredibly important. And as you said,
Speaker 4: my frame of reference is non existent other than what
Speaker 4: you've heard, but it's safe to say that the players
Speaker 4: are looked after pretty well now, and that makes perfect
Speaker 4: sense given we want these players to become big leaguers.
Speaker 4: The hotels are pretty good, about as good as you
Speaker 4: can expect in the sort of towns that you're staying in.
Speaker 4: They get fed well, and of course all those things
Speaker 4: add into increasing the chances that.
Speaker 3: They can reach their potential.
Speaker 4: So well, I'm sure there could be some things improved,
Speaker 4: and everyone continues to look for an edge. The sleeping
Speaker 4: and the eating arrangements are pretty good right.
Speaker 2: Now, Yeah, I guess so.
Speaker 1: I think one of the questions I have around about
Speaker 1: to say how your career is, but rest is, like
Speaker 1: all the things that you're like coaching, is I feel
Speaker 1: quite unique in certain scenarios. But also then you're doing
Speaker 1: the same things again and again and again in other scenarios.
Speaker 1: Like what are you what are you taking from the
Speaker 1: times that you were running like training sessions in like
Speaker 1: the David Beckham Academy, like in London, and now how
Speaker 1: you're running those sessions in in Salem or in the
Speaker 1: spring training as you are are in Florida right now.
Speaker 3: I think it's it's we we are given a license
Speaker 3: to be creative. We know what we believe, we have.
Speaker 4: Certain method method methodological Did they say that right? I
Speaker 4: don't know certain principles that we're going to adhere to
Speaker 4: because we believe that that is the best way to
Speaker 4: acquire skills and get better at baseball. But within that framework,
Speaker 4: we're given flexibility. We're given, as I said, license to
Speaker 4: be creative, which I think is the perfect place to be.
Speaker 3: If you were.
Speaker 4: Coaching in Great Britain, and all of us who've done
Speaker 4: that have needed to be creative because of the space,
Speaker 4: because of the equipment, because of the the ratio of
Speaker 4: floor space to people. And then when you apply that
Speaker 4: creativity where the resources aren't necessarily unlimited, but they're they're plentiful,
Speaker 4: that's that becomes a lot of fun. Whether that's now,
Speaker 4: how can we how can we make sure that we're
Speaker 4: investigating all avenues to develop a player, whether we're just
Speaker 4: trying to because we're one hundred games in keep it fresh,
Speaker 4: or when it is when the rain hits and we
Speaker 4: have to be forced into the cages or spend less
Speaker 4: time outside. It's been beneficial for me to have that
Speaker 4: background and British Spaseball, where I would argue that creativity
Speaker 4: is a prerequisite for being a successful.
Speaker 3: Coach in Great Britain. And then that also the Tops
Speaker 3: push the envelope. We like, I think this is an
Speaker 3: emerging team.
Speaker 4: We believe what we believe to be true in terms
Speaker 4: of player development and producing winning big leaguers and winning
Speaker 4: big league teams.
Speaker 3: But that doesn't mean that we're going to be complacent
Speaker 3: with where we're at.
Speaker 4: We're always going to try and push the envelope and
Speaker 4: find out even better ways to do what we need
Speaker 4: to do.
Speaker 1: Without divulging any secrets here, like how bespoke would you think,
Speaker 1: like the average person's like weekly training is is it
Speaker 1: kind of they're all eighty percent, like all of the
Speaker 1: second basement are doing the same thing, but then they've
Speaker 1: got like twenty percent of their time doing something that's for.
Speaker 2: That individual or some sort of other ratio.
Speaker 4: It's it's it's bespoke as we can possibly make it.
Speaker 4: And I think if you were, if you were to
Speaker 4: watch from the stands, you might not be cognizant. You
Speaker 4: might think, well, they're all doing the same thing, but
Speaker 4: the subtle variation that is driven by the combination of
Speaker 4: the data tell us this, you need to work on this.
Speaker 4: And then what we as coaches see with their eyes
Speaker 4: and the conversations we have with different departments, the strength
Speaker 4: coaches input, for example, it becomes pretty nuanced. So it
Speaker 4: often looks like they're all doing the same thing, but
Speaker 4: the way that we set up their routines and their
Speaker 4: work on the field is very very individualized. The thing
Speaker 4: that kind of adds a layer to it, especially during
Speaker 4: spring training where you have so many players, is things
Speaker 4: will emerge where certain players can be bucketed together. And
Speaker 4: if you've got a critical massive players that you can
Speaker 4: group together because they're all working on the same thing,
Speaker 4: then that becomes makes it a lot easier to run
Speaker 4: a baseball session, and especially so during spring training.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so how much you be seen like that's of
Speaker 1: impact players that come through with you like to maximize
Speaker 1: the potential to go for maybe talking about some Red
Speaker 1: Souff examples, things like Campbell, things like just many Garcia
Speaker 1: and Andike Blake way up, they've all come through and
Speaker 1: I think as pop kind of like prospects and they're
Speaker 1: seemingly right now they're still on to be like everything
Speaker 1: that we thought they like they would be or even more.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, first of all, great people with strong
Speaker 4: work ethic, very clear about their vision and understanding of
Speaker 4: the work that needs to go in Obviously, then incredibly
Speaker 4: talented players. If you perform based on what the expectation
Speaker 4: or what the understanding is of what is required to
Speaker 4: be successful.
Speaker 3: At the next level, then you're going to move up.
Speaker 3: I don't think that's a secret.
Speaker 4: I think that will be true for all organizations and
Speaker 4: from all organizations level to level. Combine that with their
Speaker 4: individual goals, which they'll have in all of the key
Speaker 4: areas of their performance. Pitching obviously a little bit more
Speaker 4: straightforward hitters, but then we'll have to add and the
Speaker 4: defensive uh and based running aspect as well. But they
Speaker 4: had goals set based on what they needed to do
Speaker 4: from what we believe to be important.
Speaker 3: They hit their goals, they moved.
Speaker 4: Up, and that is one of the most rewarding parts
Speaker 4: of the job when you when you get to have
Speaker 4: the conversation after the game to tell the player that
Speaker 4: they're moving up. That really is one of the coolest,
Speaker 4: coolest things that I've got to do thus far in
Speaker 4: my career in pro ball.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we'll stick with a couple more Red Sox
Speaker 1: specific questions to make John and a few of us happy.
Speaker 1: Like the system that the Red Sox have right now
Speaker 1: is widely regarded as one of the best systems in
Speaker 1: baseball by all of the by even by MLB prospect
Speaker 1: Analysis and by fangrapts and by other things. How does
Speaker 1: having like Anthony and Campbell and Mayer and even someone
Speaker 1: like Cassis who's are in the majors or already having
Speaker 1: these young players, how does that impact the people further
Speaker 1: down like the chain to be like, hey, like I'm
Speaker 1: in the same system with like these guys or the
Speaker 1: these are the people that like I'm aiming to be
Speaker 1: better than.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's really cool and there is a
Speaker 4: tremendous balance within our organization of while that's pretty cool
Speaker 4: I get to be on Roman's team with the competitive
Speaker 4: aspect that they're all they're all really good. That there's
Speaker 4: so much focus on the big three, rightfully so, but
Speaker 4: there are so many good players and it's really cool
Speaker 4: to see the depth and it's there on the pitching
Speaker 4: side too, and.
Speaker 3: It really is just exciting.
Speaker 4: I'm excited for the breakout game this week, fortunate to
Speaker 4: be involved in that just as a great opportunity for
Speaker 4: these young men to showcase their abilities. Obviously, we've had
Speaker 4: the Big three in big League camp and they've been
Speaker 4: playing in big League games throughout spring training. But not
Speaker 4: everyone's got to do that. So for the other ones,
Speaker 4: especially to be to be playing under the lights on
Speaker 4: national TV is pretty exciting.
Speaker 3: It really is.
Speaker 4: I do occasionally just I see an item of the
Speaker 4: Red Sox secure that we're given and just kind of
Speaker 4: start laughing, Like I worked for the Boston Red Sox.
Speaker 3: We're really good.
Speaker 4: We have some amazing players, and today I get to
Speaker 4: go and help them Frank get better.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and obviously with the with the Salem Red Sox
Speaker 1: being the Red Sox as well, it's kind of you
Speaker 1: have that a blazoned all the time to give you
Speaker 1: that that that reminder. Obviously, now you're going up to
Speaker 1: to the Drive, you're gonna get a whole new set
Speaker 1: of uniforms to to put that through. Say you have
Speaker 1: you built yourself a nice closet of of a baseball
Speaker 1: uniforms over the last couple of years.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Well, I think one of the biggest differences. I
Speaker 4: didn't coach third base in Salem, so I almost never
Speaker 4: wore the jersey I coached. Our third base coach Jossie Javez,
Speaker 4: who's the new manager in Salem.
Speaker 3: Absolute rock story.
Speaker 4: He wasn't with us for a few days, so I
Speaker 4: had to coach third base, so I had to wear
Speaker 4: the jersey. Otherwise is give me my Red Sox hootie.
Speaker 4: So this year I will be coaching third day, so
Speaker 4: I will have to wear the jerseys. Greenville has a
Speaker 4: phenomenal uh set of uniforms, so.
Speaker 3: That's the bright set of it.
Speaker 4: Well, I'll at least look pretty good thanks to other
Speaker 4: people's design skills this season.
Speaker 3: But we are we are the Red Sox top to bottom.
Speaker 3: Uh so Uh.
Speaker 4: It's it's the Red Sox that that pay my bills,
Speaker 4: not the Greenville drive And and all of the Red
Speaker 4: Sox gear we're given every spring training will be worn
Speaker 4: loudly and proudly throughout the season in Greenville.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I imagine you've got a Red Sox big kind
Speaker 1: of like douffle bag that you probably carry around as
Speaker 1: much as you used to carry around those the the
Speaker 1: WBC ones that we you got back in the day.
Speaker 4: Exactly right, and it's it's one of the coolest things there.
Speaker 4: The ORG is incredibly generous with with what we're given
Speaker 4: and and it's spring training is always cool just showing
Speaker 4: up for so the first day of school, so to speak,
Speaker 4: and seeing your friends, seeing the players.
Speaker 3: But it is always a pinch fitty moment.
Speaker 4: When you see a locker for the first time in
Speaker 4: February full of new gear.
Speaker 2: And one thing that you.
Speaker 1: Have as a manager in a low AID or a
Speaker 1: low division in the minors is that you get to
Speaker 1: get sampled some new rules in baseball. How does it
Speaker 1: feel too kind of it's wrong to say guinea pigs
Speaker 1: because of like, but you are sampling sometimes a lot
Speaker 1: of the rules that are thinking about kind of like
Speaker 1: going into the majors. How have you had any thoughts
Speaker 1: on kind of having to do challenges yourself? Obviously that's
Speaker 1: existed for a while, but like the ABS system, have
Speaker 1: you felt being involved with.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we don't. We don't have it in low A.
Speaker 3: I don't think we have.
Speaker 4: It in high eight either. The biggest one for us
Speaker 4: has been the pitch clock.
Speaker 3: Always interesting.
Speaker 4: They don't have the pitch clock in the complex leagues,
Speaker 4: so it's off than a player's first experience when they
Speaker 4: get to low A, So that can be interesting. I thought,
Speaker 4: as a kind of quasi baseball traditionalist that I would
Speaker 4: not like the pitch clock, that whole day baseball doesn't
Speaker 4: have a clock.
Speaker 3: But I love it.
Speaker 4: It's absolutely fantastic, especially when you factor in that in
Speaker 4: Lowe you're gonna have some very very young players. You're
Speaker 4: gonna make more mistakes players in the big leagues who
Speaker 4: are just trade up better than they are in Lowa.
Speaker 4: That's not a surprise. We're gonna make mistakes, We're gonna
Speaker 4: have days where we can't throw a strike, but at
Speaker 4: least we have the pitch clock to keep things in order.
Speaker 4: And I think it's better for the fans too, So
Speaker 4: I am a huge fan of the pitch clock. I
Speaker 4: watch as much international baseball as they can so watching
Speaker 4: European tournaments last year when I could, it was like,
Speaker 4: your WBSC needs the pitch clock. European baseball needs the
Speaker 4: pitch clock. It makes such a difference, UH and keeps
Speaker 4: fans engaged, and ultimately, we do need fans to come
Speaker 4: and watch games.
Speaker 3: So go pitch clock.
Speaker 1: I'll tell you the single A, double A, triple A
Speaker 1: and NBL baseball in the UK needs to pitch block.
Speaker 3: Let's do it. Let's find a way. Even if you
Speaker 3: got someone on a stop.
Speaker 2: Watch on the side, just shouting at people.
Speaker 1: Obviously in that first year, was there any standout moments
Speaker 1: of kind of like obviously that first time that you
Speaker 1: you are managing like a game, what was it kind
Speaker 1: of like the pinchby moment that happened to you, kind
Speaker 1: of like in that game.
Speaker 3: Well, it's casting my mind back.
Speaker 4: I was definitely nervous, probably the most nervous I'd been,
Speaker 4: uh in a baseball uniform since the World Baseball Classic
Speaker 4: qualifier in Brooklyn. I can't I can't point to any
Speaker 4: specific moment. I just there's thing things that stand out
Speaker 4: from that that first half and or first half of
Speaker 4: my first season. And I mean seeing Roman Antony as
Speaker 4: a very young player with very little experience in the
Speaker 4: grand scheme of things, be so good and move so fast,
Speaker 4: and now he's in big league camp and the Stones
Speaker 4: throw away from his big league big league debut.
Speaker 3: It's just how cool is that? Ah?
Speaker 4: And just generally speaking, just these players are so good
Speaker 4: and I got to just remember, I get to do
Speaker 4: this again to tomorrow you have a w b C
Speaker 4: talking about Brooklyn again. And that was a good team
Speaker 4: we had in a team of good a tournament of
Speaker 4: good teams, whether that was on other side having basing
Speaker 4: Jason marquee Ah twice or on our side, gaes Chisholm
Speaker 4: was our shortstop. But it lasted lasted a week, not
Speaker 4: even a week. So just that that feeling of I
Speaker 4: get to do this again tomorrow is really cool and
Speaker 4: really special and and continues to to be inspiring.
Speaker 2: Will rum and be probably the first player that you
Speaker 2: like actively coached that might make that major league or
Speaker 2: is there somebody already up there?
Speaker 4: Nobody already up there, but we had Zach Kelly for
Speaker 4: five days, doesn't that doesn't count. Ryan's Fernandez came through
Speaker 4: on a rehab assignment as well, and is was rule
Speaker 4: fived two years ago. I think it wasn't been in
Speaker 4: the big leagues. It doesn't count. So as in, when
Speaker 4: the first true Salem red'st makes the big leagues, it's
Speaker 4: going to be pretty cool. And I wouldn't want to
Speaker 4: put money on who that was. For one, that would
Speaker 4: not be allowed, so I'd never do that.
Speaker 3: But there's an.
Speaker 4: Exciting crew, and I mean Justins and Garcia the password
Speaker 4: another one that spent significant time with who's now on
Speaker 4: the forty man Luis Paralas another one that has come through,
Speaker 4: certain another forty man player.
Speaker 3: It starts to get a little bit more real.
Speaker 4: I remember our mental performance coordinator Jake Chaplin at the
Speaker 4: end of our season, it might have actually been after
Speaker 4: our last game of the twenty four season, commented, next
Speaker 4: year is going to be different, and it's starting to
Speaker 4: sink in. Why he told me that because we're getting
Speaker 4: close to the point where the players you spend significant
Speaker 4: time with breakthrough and get their big league debuts. So
Speaker 4: looking forward to that and hopefully the game times work
Speaker 4: out where we can watch it in the clubhouse.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and so talking about play it progression, your progression,
Speaker 1: you had two seasons down in Hey and now you're
Speaker 1: up to Higgay. How is the how is that disc
Speaker 1: How was that call for you? The call from the
Speaker 1: manager's office. He probably was during the holiday, so it
Speaker 1: wasn't a walk into the office the same way you
Speaker 1: would have done with your players.
Speaker 3: Yeah, really really cool. I was.
Speaker 4: Ready to go back to Salem and would have been
Speaker 4: perfectly perfectly happy to do.
Speaker 3: So.
Speaker 4: It was a great experience and we had a really
Speaker 4: great season in terms of how things are supposed to work,
Speaker 4: in terms of I referenced earlier the daily schedule big
Speaker 4: part of my job.
Speaker 3: It just worked. And the staff in Salem this year
Speaker 3: wouldn't have been identical.
Speaker 4: But would have been pretty similar. So would never say
Speaker 4: I would be comfortable, but certainly confident in going back
Speaker 4: into Salem and it's gonna work again and we can
Speaker 4: get even better. So it does feel a little bit
Speaker 4: like the first day of school again, going into a
Speaker 4: new environment where it's a new coaching staff, it's a
Speaker 4: new stadium, it's a new front office.
Speaker 3: How's this going to work.
Speaker 4: One of the most exciting things is, well, there will
Speaker 4: be players that I haven't yet got to be teammates with.
Speaker 4: There will be a lot of players that we've had
Speaker 4: in say them, these last two seasons, and we've had
Speaker 4: some tremendous players come through, some really cool people come through.
Speaker 4: So that continuity is really exciting. And I don't necessarily
Speaker 4: view it as a promotion. I think if you have
Speaker 4: a job in professional baseball, it's awesome. And the work
Speaker 4: that goes on in the Dominican Academy is phenomenal and
Speaker 4: is critical. The work goes on here in Florida during
Speaker 4: extended spring training and then the Complex League season and
Speaker 4: the Bridge season is critical, and some of our best
Speaker 4: people are in those levels. But I guess it is
Speaker 4: a promotion of sports and that's cool too. And people
Speaker 4: just rave about Greenville. I got to spend about three
Speaker 4: days there in January. It lives up to the hype.
Speaker 4: The stadium is amazing, the town's amazing, So so looking
Speaker 4: forward to those aspects as well.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think what you say is perfectly right that
Speaker 1: in a lot of these institutions there are so many players,
Speaker 1: players and coaches in the certain areas that make the
Speaker 1: difference that you've never even heard the name of. Because
Speaker 1: kind of that's not where the fan focus kind of
Speaker 1: like is directly aim towards. But it would be remiss
Speaker 1: of me if I didn't ask you personally. Is like,
Speaker 1: is has the dream shifted? Like it's not the dream
Speaker 1: of being in professional baseball? Now is the dream of
Speaker 1: being a major league coach or manager?
Speaker 3: Yeah? I haven't quite.
Speaker 4: Decided, but there are absolutely his the pull of the
Speaker 4: big leagues.
Speaker 3: It would be pretty cool. Huh.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'd be on all.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I just know I need to decide. I don't
Speaker 4: think I need to decide today. I remember vividly. The
Speaker 4: first year that the High Performance Academy existed. Will Lintern,
Speaker 4: whose spear headed that program, did a great job with
Speaker 4: the leadoff event, which was more of a classroom and
Speaker 4: testing day, and there was a session about goal setting
Speaker 4: and the players were a little bit nervous to speak
Speaker 4: up on their goals, and Gavin spoke. He was there,
Speaker 4: and Gavin is a phenomenal goal setter and has achieved
Speaker 4: many of his goals. But I remember saying, just really
Speaker 4: to try and spirit the conversation a little bit, I
Speaker 4: will manage Great Britain baseball in a World Baseball Classic.
Speaker 4: If we count the qualifiers, then that happened, and really
Speaker 4: not that long later. So I think I need to
Speaker 4: decide whether I want to work at the big league level,
Speaker 4: knowing that if I decide to do it, then I
Speaker 4: probably will yeah, and I.
Speaker 1: Will I will echo that sentimentally, and everything that you
Speaker 1: have put your mind towards, I've seen you strive towards
Speaker 1: and actually achieve, So I personally I would love to
Speaker 1: see you dream to go that far, because then not unprofessionally,
Speaker 1: we can ride on your Tokyo coattails for even longer.
Speaker 3: Sponsorle free tickets, saying, yeah.
Speaker 1: It's a little bit easier to get to Boston than
Speaker 1: it is to Sailorm or Greenville.
Speaker 2: But but let's talk about Grooveville.
Speaker 1: You're you say it is a historical town with with
Speaker 1: some major significance when it comes to kind of like
Speaker 1: the motor industry. But obviously the stadium that they have
Speaker 1: there pretty much a Fenway replica. Like, how did that feel?
Speaker 1: Kind of you had a look at the stadium yet
Speaker 1: to kind of to get a feel of what that's
Speaker 1: going to be like to be like, oh, actually, this
Speaker 1: is the point now where we start to care really
Speaker 1: about that defense and get your players used to having
Speaker 1: to deal with that monster.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think we're in a privileged situation in.
Speaker 4: The org where Portland also has a monster, Greenville has
Speaker 4: a monster. So the players do they hopefully are more
Speaker 4: prepared when they do get to Fenway having had that experience.
Speaker 4: It's an amazing facility. This year, the Greenville Drive celebrate
Speaker 4: twenty years. I think the stadium has been around for
Speaker 4: nineteen of those. You couldn't tell it is pristine. The
Speaker 4: front office group, the ownership group, mister Brown and his team,
Speaker 4: they do a phenomenal job. It's interesting. We actually had
Speaker 4: a meeting just a couple of days ago with our
Speaker 4: big league based coaches, Hoddy and Flow Houdi at third,
Speaker 4: Flow at first, and one of the things we were
Speaker 4: talking about is as a third base coach, navigating not
Speaker 4: necessarily the Monster, but that the left field line is
Speaker 4: hidden from view from the third base coach's box, and
Speaker 4: just how do you navigate that in Boston? Is I'm
Speaker 4: going to have to navigate that in Greenville? And as
Speaker 4: something for fans to look out for this year, I
Speaker 4: guess is be prepared for your runners as they round
Speaker 4: third base to actually be outside of you, as you
Speaker 4: might be on the baseline or even spend a little
Speaker 4: bit of time in fair territory.
Speaker 3: So as long as the players know that.
Speaker 4: They should expect sometimes to be running around you rather
Speaker 4: than inside you, it's the smart way to do things.
Speaker 4: And it's it's going to be one of those nuances
Speaker 4: of not just coaching third base for the first time
Speaker 4: regularly in a little while, but doing it where this
Speaker 4: these nooks and crannies make it more challenging.
Speaker 3: So it's exciting, it's different.
Speaker 4: And I guess, wrapping up that thought, not that it
Speaker 4: was the primary crux of this segment. It's really cool
Speaker 4: that we're getting to spend that time with our big
Speaker 4: league coaching staff. It's one of the benefits of a
Speaker 4: spring training site where major and minor league role on
Speaker 4: the same footprint, which isn't all way the case. If
Speaker 4: if if some didn't know that, for example, the Blue
Speaker 4: Jays and the Yankees have spring training sites with the
Speaker 4: minor leaguers and big leaguers or in different places. So
Speaker 4: we're we're in the same place here in Fort Myers
Speaker 4: and just yesterday got to spend about thirty minutes picking
Speaker 4: the brains of our big league coaching staff, which was great.
Speaker 2: Oh that's amazing.
Speaker 1: I feel like if I would personally with you, one
Speaker 1: of the pinch me moments that I would be having
Speaker 1: is just looking at how pristine all of those fields
Speaker 1: are to be when I was when I was lucky
Speaker 1: enough to at Arizona and Miami during the WBC last
Speaker 1: year to just go and look at like a professional
Speaker 1: field and just be like.
Speaker 2: Oh, this is this is what baseball.
Speaker 1: Could be, and not the turnip fields that we've we've
Speaker 1: played on where you can be like, oh, that ball
Speaker 1: is going to bounce and it's gonna come up to
Speaker 1: basically just a batter my chest tight or not see
Speaker 1: a ball that bounce is immediately over you or scuts
Speaker 1: right between your legs. It's that would be the pinchery
Speaker 1: moment for me.
Speaker 4: No, that well, we'll come to Fort Myers sometime and then,
Speaker 4: I mean, I know that you've been searching for a
Speaker 4: new groundskeeper forever. Hopefully they find one, because I think
Speaker 4: I think Forum Park could be as good as our
Speaker 4: backfields are.
Speaker 3: As long as as long as the money it's being spent.
Speaker 4: It sounds like it is going to be spent, But
Speaker 4: as long as the standards are in the right place,
Speaker 4: then there's no reason for a field not not surely
Speaker 4: to be the same caliber as Funway Park, but to
Speaker 4: be as good as.
Speaker 3: It can possibly be.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I do have to say that, Yeah, the
Speaker 1: fields of Funham Are are beautiful. Obviously, we're used to
Speaker 1: kind of the second fields that we get here there
Speaker 1: and everywhere where. We've got football pitches to deal with,
Speaker 1: and we've.
Speaker 3: Got the occasional.
Speaker 1: Dog mouthfeasance to have to worry about something that you
Speaker 1: don't have to worry about. As as managed going forward,
Speaker 1: hopefully not so now you're obviously you're in spring training.
Speaker 1: As you've said a couple of times, what's the difference
Speaker 1: between like for you coaching now compared to when it
Speaker 1: comes to the season.
Speaker 4: A hand so the first, but I've been over three weeks.
Speaker 3: Very little so far to do with managing.
Speaker 4: I've been an infield and outfield coach and a base
Speaker 4: running coach for the last three weeks. We have players
Speaker 4: cycle through days of different intensity, so they'll have a
Speaker 4: high day where they're really getting after it.
Speaker 3: They'll have a low day which.
Speaker 4: They'll still work, but it'll be lighter in duration, fewer reps,
Speaker 4: a recovery day, and then a moderate day in between.
Speaker 4: So we're preparing and delivering activities suited to those intensity levels,
Speaker 4: and some of our other coaches responsible for assigning each
Speaker 4: coach to each group on each day, so we all
Speaker 4: get to work with the players regardless of We're not
Speaker 4: only working with infielders on high days. We're working with
Speaker 4: infielders and all of their days. We're working with outfielders
Speaker 4: and all of the days, so that's been the primary
Speaker 4: part of the job. Minor league spring training actually only
Speaker 4: officially began last week so three weeks here, but Minor
Speaker 4: league spring training began a week ago. More focus on
Speaker 4: base running now, more focus on team defense.
Speaker 3: So lots of construction.
Speaker 4: Pease, that's well, PFPS. I've not worked with a picture yet.
Speaker 4: They tend to do their own thing. I interact with
Speaker 4: the pictures when we get to live BPS towards the
Speaker 4: end of the day, and we just continue to add layers.
Speaker 4: Next up we will begin playing games. March twelfth is
Speaker 4: the day that we start playing other teams, so the
Speaker 4: managerial side starts to enter the fray. And that's really
Speaker 4: just in lineup construction. We're not pushing buttons into training.
Speaker 4: We're just creating lineups so the players know where they're
Speaker 4: supposed to be and when they're supposed to be there.
Speaker 4: But soon enough we'll be finishing STROM training and have
Speaker 4: a better center for a team.
Speaker 3: We'll want to make sure that the.
Speaker 4: First week or so of the season is pretty much
Speaker 4: dialed before it starts. So the managing layers of that
Speaker 4: onion is starting to rear their head.
Speaker 1: And do the coaches take some secret BP hacks themselves
Speaker 1: when everybody else has disappeared?
Speaker 3: Some Do I think the way we have so many leaderboards.
Speaker 4: There is a leaderboards for coaches exit Velow. I'm not
Speaker 4: on it, but I've not taken a swine. Maybe I
Speaker 4: would be if I took a swine.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you gotta have that.
Speaker 1: Or you've got like arm speed on then off the mound,
Speaker 1: or from third to first or something like that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, if you can think of a leader board for anything,
Speaker 4: we've probably got it.
Speaker 1: That's brilliant because I we have few things over here
Speaker 1: where we have Tom all the time saying that, like
Speaker 1: he thinks that he can beat people from home to
Speaker 1: first based on some of the statistics that we have nowadays,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, you don't realize how fast some of
Speaker 1: those guys actually are.
Speaker 2: Even if you think that there's.
Speaker 3: Luck, no doubt. Although I'd like to see Tom try,
Speaker 3: I think there should be video.
Speaker 1: We'll have to work on magic for the for the
Speaker 1: next London series in next year's time, to see if
Speaker 1: we can get him on the field and time him
Speaker 1: after taking some hacks.
Speaker 3: I think it would be I would think about making
Speaker 3: the trip back if I could. For that.
Speaker 1: You'd be like, oh, can I have like two weeks
Speaker 1: two days off in the middle of the season just
Speaker 1: to watch some English important things. Yeah, it's a it's
Speaker 1: a personal issue that I that I need to return
Speaker 1: to it just to be laughing as Brigle falls over
Speaker 1: as he tries to run to first base as fast.
Speaker 3: As he can.
Speaker 1: William, it's it's been an absolute pleasure to have a
Speaker 1: chat with you, obviously, kind of like this season is
Speaker 1: going to be hopefully amazing for you and for all
Speaker 1: of your players. This is the time normally where we
Speaker 1: would be invite our guests to say where they can
Speaker 1: find them online and stuff like that, but that's not
Speaker 1: quite the your forte.
Speaker 2: We should be watching Greenville.
Speaker 3: Drive with.
Speaker 1: Renewed or new new eyes to basically see how they're doing.
Speaker 1: I feel a lot of British fans watched seahows saw
Speaker 1: how Salem was doing, even though it wasn't necessarily the
Speaker 1: team that we supported as a whole, And now we
Speaker 1: will switch to Greenville to be our next team to support.
Speaker 3: Very kind, very kind.
Speaker 1: So yes, as always, listeners, you can find more from
Speaker 1: us on Batflips, Underscore Nerds on Twitter and batflops and
Speaker 1: nerds dot com. And if you were listening to this,
Speaker 1: you do now know that you can watch these videos
Speaker 1: on YouTube, so if you wanted to see me and
Speaker 1: my resplendent GB jersey from the twenty sixteen World Baseball
Speaker 1: Classic then or you can you can do so. I
Speaker 1: imagine Liam's one is probably kept somewhere very safe.
Speaker 4: Yeah, no doubt, no doubt, treasured cool.
Speaker 1: Cheers Liam, Thank you very much for your time and listeners.
Speaker 1: I hope you have enjoyed.
Speaker 3: Thanks Russell