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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to the Trip Cast.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Eleanor Klibanoff, thrilled to be joined this week by,

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<v Speaker 2>as always, editor in chief Matthew Watkins.

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<v Speaker 1>How are you doing, Matthew doing?

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<v Speaker 3>All right?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 2>We are very excited for both the theme of today's episode,

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<v Speaker 2>where we'll be talking about the big upcoming Senate race

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<v Speaker 2>in Texas, and especially excited about our guest, our former

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<v Speaker 2>friend turned mortal enemy, Patrick's v Tech Patrick.

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<v Speaker 3>How are you come back on? I appreciate it.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Patrick is currently a reporter on the Washington Post politics

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<v Speaker 2>breaking news team. Most of you probably know him from

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<v Speaker 2>his nine year stint covering politics for us here at

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<v Speaker 2>the Texas Tribune. Patrick remains, I believe you can correct

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<v Speaker 2>me if I'm wrong on this. The most prolific Texas

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<v Speaker 2>Tribune reporter in history.

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<v Speaker 3>That's probably true. Yeah, yeah, I don't have numbers to

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<v Speaker 3>back that up, but I'm going to say yes.

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<v Speaker 2>Last year, you know, he left us for the Washington Post,

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<v Speaker 2>but we're thrilled to have him back here on the

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<v Speaker 2>Trip Cast. Patrick, Before we jump into the race, what

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<v Speaker 2>do you miss most about Texas? What could what can

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<v Speaker 2>we send to you in DC? If we could transplant one,

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<v Speaker 2>one thing from Texas to d C.

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<v Speaker 1>What would you have?

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<v Speaker 4>Oh? Man, h just HB in general? Probably you know,

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<v Speaker 4>there's specific products I could call out, but yeah, there's

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<v Speaker 4>the grocery stores in d C did not compare to

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<v Speaker 4>HIV in general, I would say, So that's one thing,

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<v Speaker 4>And then there's plenty of restaurants and taco places that

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<v Speaker 4>I could list off for you, especially coming from San

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<v Speaker 4>Antonio to DC.

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<v Speaker 3>Saw that coming a mile away.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, Patrick, you'd be sad to know about all the

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<v Speaker 5>coffee shops closing around our office start time. I'ms out

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<v Speaker 5>out here in Congress.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I will say I lived in d C for

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<v Speaker 2>I went to college in DC and lived there for

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<v Speaker 2>a while after. And uh, maybe it's changed since, but

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<v Speaker 2>when I lived there, at least the tex mex was

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<v Speaker 2>like egregious, like egregiously bad, very few options.

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<v Speaker 4>There's serviceable Mexican food to text mex at least in the.

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<v Speaker 3>DC proper area.

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<v Speaker 4>In parts of Maryland there's really good Mexican food, I

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<v Speaker 4>would say, outside of DC, but in the in the

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<v Speaker 4>district itself, Yeah, you got to you gotta put in

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<v Speaker 4>some work to find the good places.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, well, I'm sure you are missing HIV and tex

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<v Speaker 2>mex maybe more than the Texas legislature, which we are

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<v Speaker 2>knee deep.

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<v Speaker 1>In right now.

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<v Speaker 2>But we are going to look ahead to a forthcoming

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<v Speaker 2>political showdown, potentially one of the biggest political battles in

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<v Speaker 2>recent Texas memory, as long time incumbent Senator John Cornyn

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<v Speaker 2>faces down the insurgent arm of the Republican Party in

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<v Speaker 2>the physical form of Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton. This

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<v Speaker 2>is shaping up to be a vicious, expensive primary in

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<v Speaker 2>which Texas is Republican in fighting will be laid out

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<v Speaker 2>on the national stage for all to witness. Feels a

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<v Speaker 2>bit like, you know, when someone comes over to your

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<v Speaker 2>family's house and sees your family fighting.

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<v Speaker 1>It's all embarrassing.

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<v Speaker 2>But we're you know, gonna be a gonna be a

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<v Speaker 2>big people know what to expect when they come visit

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<v Speaker 2>our family.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's true.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't think Texas is fighting it. They're the family

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<v Speaker 2>like having the fight.

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<v Speaker 3>At the in the front line.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, exactly, Patrick, You've covered both of these figures for

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<v Speaker 2>a long time. Let's start with Cornyn and tell us

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<v Speaker 2>a little bit about you know, John Cornyn as a

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<v Speaker 2>as a character and sort of what his profile looks

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<v Speaker 2>like coming into this race.

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<v Speaker 4>Sure, well, I guess, you know, from the perspective in Washington,

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<v Speaker 4>and he's coming into this reelection campaign after coming up

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<v Speaker 4>short in something that he has long wanted to do,

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<v Speaker 4>which is lead Senate Republicans. He narrowly lost the Senate

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<v Speaker 4>Majority leader race to John Thune from South Toda right

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<v Speaker 4>after the November election in twenty twenty four. For I

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<v Speaker 4>think years before that, he had made clear that that

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<v Speaker 4>was something that he had wanted to run for if

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<v Speaker 4>it ever, you know, if Mitch McConnell ever stepped aside

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<v Speaker 4>from that leadership position, and you know, he made a

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<v Speaker 4>good run for it, and you know, I forgot what

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<v Speaker 4>the final count was, but he you know, it wasn't

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<v Speaker 4>like a blowout, and so it was kind of a

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<v Speaker 4>disappointing loss for him. But he made pretty clear right

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<v Speaker 4>after that that he planned to run for reelection, telling

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<v Speaker 4>reporters that in DC, and then you know, officially launched

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<v Speaker 4>his reelection campaign in March. And for now, it seems

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<v Speaker 4>like he has a lot of fight left in him,

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<v Speaker 4>or at least he's trying to project the image that

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<v Speaker 4>he has a lot of fight left in him. I mean,

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<v Speaker 4>he is coming out of this coming out of the

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<v Speaker 4>gates swinging at Paxton, which sured you know, I guess

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<v Speaker 4>the generous interpretations. It shows he has a lot of

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<v Speaker 4>fight left in and but it also shows you know,

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<v Speaker 4>the very vulnerable position that he's in in this primary,

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<v Speaker 4>that he feels the need to go negative on Paxton

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<v Speaker 4>so quickly. And so that's kind of I think John

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<v Speaker 4>Corny summed up over the at least the recent several months.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and then Matthew, I'll give you the tougher question,

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<v Speaker 2>which is, how would you summarize Ken Paxton?

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<v Speaker 3>How would I summarize Kein Paxton?

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<v Speaker 5>So, Ken Paxton, of course has been Attorney General since

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<v Speaker 5>twenty fifteen.

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<v Speaker 3>He is a you know, a.

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<v Speaker 5>Controversial and a figure who brings up a lot of

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<v Speaker 5>passion on both sides and has for that time. You know,

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<v Speaker 5>I think people view him as very closely aligned with

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<v Speaker 5>Donald Trump, famously filed a lawsuit in twenty twenty and

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<v Speaker 5>seeking to overturn the election results. He's been very aggressive

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<v Speaker 5>in you know, pursuing causes favored by the kind of

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<v Speaker 5>hard line right of Texas that can range from you know,

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<v Speaker 5>anti abortion initiatives, targeting what he perceives to be is

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<v Speaker 5>voter fraud, and you know a lot of sort of

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<v Speaker 5>like social issues, things related to trans kids, all that

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<v Speaker 5>kind of stuff that if you if you see it

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<v Speaker 5>being talked about on Fox News, Ken Paxson has probably

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<v Speaker 5>filed a lawsuit related to it in the court. He

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<v Speaker 5>of course, also has carried with him a lot of

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<v Speaker 5>you know, ethical baggage. Famously, you know, was under indictment

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<v Speaker 5>for a long part of his early part of his

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<v Speaker 5>tenure because he was accused of securities fraud. That case

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<v Speaker 5>has since kind of gone away, and then you know,

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<v Speaker 5>more recently many of his top lieutenants resigned and accused

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<v Speaker 5>him of bribery. That case was investigated by the FBI,

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<v Speaker 5>but we learned recently that just before Trump took over

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<v Speaker 5>the FBI, the Department of Justice dropped that case. And so,

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<v Speaker 5>you know, he he remains he has those close ties

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<v Speaker 5>with the base, He has those close ties as with

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<v Speaker 5>the with the Trump administration. There are definitely people in

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<v Speaker 5>the Republican Party who try to keep him at arm's

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<v Speaker 5>length though, because of some of those other kind of

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<v Speaker 5>areas of baggage in the world.

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<v Speaker 2>That was a very phenomenal recounting, you left out one

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<v Speaker 2>major chapter other than that, which is he was impeached, right,

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<v Speaker 2>of course he was not, unlike you know, our president

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<v Speaker 2>right now, was impeached by the House, the Texas House Representatives,

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<v Speaker 2>and then after having a lengthy trial in the Senate,

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<v Speaker 2>the Texas Senate voted to acquit him and restore him

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<v Speaker 2>to his role.

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<v Speaker 1>So other than that, that's.

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<v Speaker 3>Really maybe the most important thing.

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<v Speaker 1>But you know, you know, we got all the rest

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<v Speaker 1>of the details.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, Patrick, how I mean, there's long been the

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<v Speaker 2>joke about attorney's general, like, not just in Texas but

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<v Speaker 2>nationally right that it stands for like aspiring governor. It

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<v Speaker 2>is often a jumping point to more to higher office.

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<v Speaker 2>How surprised are you to see Paxson getting to this race, Like,

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<v Speaker 2>how do we get here with paxton challenge in Cornan?

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<v Speaker 4>You know, not surprised at all. I mean, Paxton had

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<v Speaker 4>telegraphed for months that maybe even over a year, that

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<v Speaker 4>he would maybe one day be interested in challenging Cornan.

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<v Speaker 4>Cornan has been one of the few statewide elected Texas

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<v Speaker 4>Republicans who has at least been blunt in observing Paxton's

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<v Speaker 4>legal challenges. It's not like Cornan has necessarily been a

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<v Speaker 4>vocal critic of Paxson's legal challenges, but you know, among

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<v Speaker 4>other state wide elected Republicans, they've been largely happy to

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<v Speaker 4>just kind of look the other way and try to

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<v Speaker 4>remain neutral. As Paxton has encountered all these other you know,

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<v Speaker 4>all these legal and ethical issues. So Cornan has stood

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<v Speaker 4>out I think for at least acknowledging or expressing some

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<v Speaker 4>concern about the legal and ethical issues that Paxon has had,

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<v Speaker 4>and he's gotten sharper over the years. There was obviously

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<v Speaker 4>that you know, tweet from Cornin to Paxton I think

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<v Speaker 4>last year where he said it's hard to run from

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<v Speaker 4>prison Ken, So clearly he ran, you know, one from

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<v Speaker 4>expressing concern to throw in some actual political jabs. But

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<v Speaker 4>Cornan has stood out, I think in that regard. And

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<v Speaker 4>I think there's some real personal animosity between these two men,

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<v Speaker 4>and I think that's what's keeping Cornyn going here a

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<v Speaker 4>little bit.

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<v Speaker 2>You know.

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<v Speaker 4>You know, I mentioned earlier that Cornin seems to be,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, showing some real fight from the outset of

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<v Speaker 4>this race. I think that that's inspired by a little

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<v Speaker 4>bit of personal animus, you know, toward Paxton. And you know,

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<v Speaker 4>even though in this day and age, in the Trump era,

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<v Speaker 4>I think corn And probably feels like he can't say

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<v Speaker 4>this out loud because of Trump's own scandals and the

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<v Speaker 4>general tolerance for scandals inside the GOP. But I think

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<v Speaker 4>Cornan believes that the Texas GOP should be embarrassed about Paxton.

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<v Speaker 4>And so I think that's kind of what personally maybe

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<v Speaker 4>keeping Corny and chugging along in this case, even though

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<v Speaker 4>it looks like he's in the final you know, he's

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<v Speaker 4>in the latter years of his political career, I.

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<v Speaker 5>Should just pause and ignowledge that for those of us

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<v Speaker 5>who cover texts politics, who are involved in you know,

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<v Speaker 5>the media world, this is just delightful, right whether or

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<v Speaker 5>not we you know, yeah, we may not have a

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<v Speaker 5>dog in the race, but we love interesting and exciting races.

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<v Speaker 5>And I would say this one is probably the highest

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<v Speaker 5>profile Republican primary in the state since maybe twenty ten

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<v Speaker 5>when k Bailey Hutchison, then a sitting senator I believe,

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<v Speaker 5>challenged the incumbent governor Rick Perry. And what everyone was

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<v Speaker 5>super excited about, you know, this being this huge kind

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<v Speaker 5>of heavy whiteweight fight in that race, it didn't really

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<v Speaker 5>turn out to be that much of a fight. It

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<v Speaker 5>turned out to be something of a pummeling, you know,

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<v Speaker 5>Rick Perry winning by more than twenty percentage points in

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<v Speaker 5>that race. But I think we see this as two

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<v Speaker 5>people who loom very heavily over Texas politics going right

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<v Speaker 5>after each other. Whether Cornyan would agree with this framing

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<v Speaker 5>or not, I think a lot of people are viewing

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<v Speaker 5>it as sort of the more traditional Republican, the one

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<v Speaker 5>who has been you know, in leadership in the Senate

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<v Speaker 5>for a very long time, you know, was kind of

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<v Speaker 5>around before we saw this dramatic shift to the right

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<v Speaker 5>in the state Republican Party, in the Republican Party in general,

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<v Speaker 5>versus the sort of new type of Republican, the one

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<v Speaker 5>who really ties the line close to Trump, who is

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<v Speaker 5>you know, always kind of scrapping for a fight, and

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<v Speaker 5>you know, Frankly is like less concerned about the traditional

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<v Speaker 5>norms and rules that govern politics. And I think we're

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<v Speaker 5>going to watch this and I think a lot of

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<v Speaker 5>people are going to frame this is a sort of

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<v Speaker 5>fight over you know, the future of the Republican Party

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<v Speaker 5>in Texas, and in.

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<v Speaker 2>Many ways, like Ken Paxton has been the standard bearer

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<v Speaker 2>for that movement, right, not just in that he is

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<v Speaker 2>the most and I wouldn't even as I say, and

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<v Speaker 2>so he is like sort of the most extreme in

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<v Speaker 2>that in that side of the party, but he's certainly

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<v Speaker 2>the most local, the most I mean, we saw this

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<v Speaker 2>in like judicial races in the last election, where you know,

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<v Speaker 2>Attorney General Paxson was very unhappy with the ruling and

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<v Speaker 2>said basically, I'm going to go get you know, the

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<v Speaker 2>judges I want. It was pretty open about that, Like,

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<v Speaker 2>I don't think he would dispute that that framing, and

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<v Speaker 2>with the Court of Criminal Appeals unseated three people put

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<v Speaker 2>on judges you know, in at least two cases who

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<v Speaker 2>who are very closely allied with him, So he seems

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<v Speaker 2>pretty you know, in many ways. I think he's been

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<v Speaker 2>preparing for this fight for for a long time, and

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<v Speaker 2>you know it's going to be a big national.

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<v Speaker 1>Route.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, I am curious, though, Patrick, what is your

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<v Speaker 2>sense of how outside of Texas maybe and even within

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<v Speaker 2>you know, tech the Texas GOP, how much appetite is

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<v Speaker 2>there for this big, bloody, vicious, potentially expensive primary in Texas,

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<v Speaker 2>a state that you know otherwise you know, I think

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<v Speaker 2>people think corner maybe could could you know, walk into

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<v Speaker 2>another term if you wanted to, if you didn't face

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<v Speaker 2>a major challenge.

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<v Speaker 4>Sure, I mean, I think from Republican you know operatives

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<v Speaker 4>in DC who are aligned with corn In or sympathy

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<v Speaker 4>to Corny, and you know, they view this as a

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<v Speaker 4>waste of time and money during a midterm cycle where

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<v Speaker 4>you know, historically the trends are against them, but they

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<v Speaker 4>do have a three seat majority in the Senate and

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<v Speaker 4>some opportunities to grow that majority. And so I think

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<v Speaker 4>even Cornan himself has voiced this concern. It's obviously a

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<v Speaker 4>self serving concern, but you know, the concern that we're

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<v Speaker 4>going to spend tens of millions, over one hundred million

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<v Speaker 4>dollars on a statewide primary in Texas when at least

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<v Speaker 4>some of that money could be going to trying to

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<v Speaker 4>flip open Senate seats in places like Michigan, New Hampshire, Minnesota.

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<v Speaker 4>So I think that's the pro you know, corn In

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<v Speaker 4>view in DC. But obviously, you know, the Senate Republican

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<v Speaker 4>conference has become just more and more trumpy. It's still

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<v Speaker 4>not as trumpy as House Republicans are. Obviously House Republicans

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<v Speaker 4>are very pro Trump rowdy bunch. But you have seen

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<v Speaker 4>the remaking of the Senate, you know, Republican conference into

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<v Speaker 4>definitely a more pro Trump body, and for people who

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<v Speaker 4>want to see it continue in this direction, this is

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<v Speaker 4>a very pivotal fight in that.

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<v Speaker 2>Trend and how much of this comes down to the

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<v Speaker 2>big man himself the endorsement from President Trump.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I mean, I was going to say earlier.

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<v Speaker 4>I mean, we could spend hours talking about all the

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<v Speaker 4>different dynamics of this race and the pros and cons

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<v Speaker 4>of each candidate, But really, I think this is going

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<v Speaker 4>to turn on what Trump ultimately chooses to do in

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<v Speaker 4>this race. You know, he had I think he weighed

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<v Speaker 4>in on this race for the first time publicly last weekend.

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<v Speaker 4>He told reporters that he, you know, knows and respects

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<v Speaker 4>both men, or knows and likes both men, but would

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<v Speaker 4>make an endorsement at quote the appropriate time. Paxton himself

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<v Speaker 4>has said, I think in one of his post announcement interviews,

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<v Speaker 4>that he doesn't expect Trump to endorse until closer to

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<v Speaker 4>the primary in March twenty twenty six. So right now,

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<v Speaker 4>the vibes are clearly that Trump is not itching to

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<v Speaker 4>jump into this race, And I think for Paxton one

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<v Speaker 4>of his immediate challenges in this race is to try

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<v Speaker 4>to keep out a credible third candidate, whether that's someone

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<v Speaker 4>like Wesley congressman from Houston. I know, Beth Van Dyne,

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<v Speaker 4>congresswoman from the Dallas area. Her name also gets tossed around.

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<v Speaker 4>So Paxton, you know, I think he's got some short

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<v Speaker 4>term He's got some you know, short term tasks he

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<v Speaker 4>needs to fulfill, and then some you know in terms

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<v Speaker 4>of keeping out a third credible candidate, and then maybe

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<v Speaker 4>some medium term tasks in terms of trying to lock

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<v Speaker 4>down trump endorsement or continue to keep Trump out of

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<v Speaker 4>the race, which I'm sure he would view as a

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<v Speaker 4>win in a way as well. So that's I think,

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<v Speaker 4>you know what Paxton's to do list is right now.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, you kind of contrast this race to the lieutenant

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<v Speaker 5>governor's race, right where Dan Patrick announced reelection and Trump

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<v Speaker 5>immediately endorsed him, right, you know, we at least don't

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<v Speaker 5>have that situation in Texas. You know, it seems like

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<v Speaker 5>Cornin has made some efforts in the past year or

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<v Speaker 5>so to sort of mend some fences with some of

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<v Speaker 5>the people in the grassroots who have fought against him.

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<v Speaker 5>There's kind of this famous moment in the twenty twenty

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<v Speaker 5>two State Republican Convention when Cornan spoke on stage and

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<v Speaker 5>was essentially booed off stage. You know, he has We

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<v Speaker 5>had an article from Matthew Choy a few months ago

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<v Speaker 5>talking about how he's kind of tried to repair that relationship.

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<v Speaker 5>You know, he has voted with Trump, He backed most,

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<v Speaker 5>if not all, of Trump's nominees. This you know, this

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<v Speaker 5>year early in Trump's terms, So you know, can he

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<v Speaker 5>kind of keep that relationship friendly enough to keep Trump

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<v Speaker 5>out of the race. I think is definitely an interesting question, right.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, and we've talked about this on the state level,

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<v Speaker 2>Like you know, the thin fine like distinctions we draw

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<v Speaker 2>between different candidates. Right, Cornyn, as Matthew has reported on

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<v Speaker 2>for US, like voted with Trump's agenda ninety two percent

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<v Speaker 2>of the time during his first President Trump's first term

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<v Speaker 2>and supported all of his nominees. Like, certainly Cornyn has

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<v Speaker 2>been very aligned with President Trump. He is I think

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<v Speaker 2>a little haunted by he was. I believe it was

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<v Speaker 2>in twenty twenty three when he said ahead of the

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<v Speaker 2>twenty twenty four election, you know that Trump's time had

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<v Speaker 2>passed him by. He has done a lot since then

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<v Speaker 2>to sort of try to work his way back in.

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<v Speaker 2>He posted a photo on x like a couple of

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<v Speaker 2>weeks ago before Paxston got in the race of him

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<v Speaker 2>like reading the art of the deal, which I felt

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<v Speaker 2>was a.

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<v Speaker 1>Little on the nose personally, but you know, people.

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<v Speaker 2>Like it, so yeah, I think certainly a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>like you said, a lot of this speculation really comes

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<v Speaker 2>down to one man.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 5>The other thing people really hit Corning on was his

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<v Speaker 5>involvement in a really the only gun safety bill to

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<v Speaker 5>pass the Senate in recent years. This was in twenty

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<v Speaker 5>twenty two, after the Uvaldi shooting. It was a bill

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<v Speaker 5>that increased funding for mental health and incentivized states to

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<v Speaker 5>pass laws that keep guns out of the hands of

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<v Speaker 5>people who are found by the courts to be thrust

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<v Speaker 5>to themselves or others. Are you know, known as red

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<v Speaker 5>flag laws. You know, I think a lot of people

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<v Speaker 5>looked pointed at that and said, you know, this is

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<v Speaker 5>a very very very modest gun safety law. But anytime

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<v Speaker 5>you pass anything that can be called a gun safety law,

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<v Speaker 5>you're gonna engender kind of push back from the Republican right,

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<v Speaker 5>and that indeed did happen.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm sure we'll see.

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<v Speaker 5>That be brought up during the legislative I mean during

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<v Speaker 5>the primary this year.

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, there's another person in this you know, little family

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<v Speaker 2>feud we've got going on, which is Senator Ted Cruz,

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, Patrick, what do you anticipate.

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<v Speaker 1>Are we going to see.

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<v Speaker 2>An endorsement from him? Does that endorsement carry much weight

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<v Speaker 2>and sort of what do you think his role will

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<v Speaker 2>be in all of this?

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I think Cruz will probably stay out unless Trump

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<v Speaker 4>gets in and a real front runner emerges by the

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<v Speaker 4>filing deadline. But I think Cruz otherwise probably has, you know,

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<v Speaker 4>no political incentive to get deeply involved in this primary

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<v Speaker 4>with a formal endorsement or campaigning for anyone again, unless

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<v Speaker 4>it's clear that Trump is going to back someone, and

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<v Speaker 4>then that candidate kind of pulls away with it, whether

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<v Speaker 4>it's corn And or Packston or even you know, another candidate.

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<v Speaker 4>So Cruse is staying out of it, and it's you know,

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<v Speaker 4>a course, it's very politically awkward for him because he's

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<v Speaker 4>had this very fragile, you know, alliance or I don't

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<v Speaker 4>know if i'd call it an alliance, a relationship with corn

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<v Speaker 4>In over the years. I mean, he previously declined to

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<v Speaker 4>endorse Cornan in his uh, I'm trying to remember, in

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<v Speaker 4>his last in one of his last competitive primaries. But

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<v Speaker 4>then Cornyn did campaign for Cruz and his one of

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<v Speaker 4>his hard fought re election campaigns. And so, you know,

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<v Speaker 4>Cruse has a lot of I think, you know, it's

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<v Speaker 4>important to know Cruise has a lot of overlapping relationships

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<v Speaker 4>here when it comes to elected officials, donors, grassroots activists,

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<v Speaker 4>and so I don't think it's necessarily him Him declining

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<v Speaker 4>to endorse Cornan is necessarily, you know, should be read

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<v Speaker 4>as an explicit endorse, you know, de facto endorsement of Paxton.

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<v Speaker 4>But you know, Cruse is now, like you know, Cruise

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<v Speaker 4>has now served quite a long time in Texas, has

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<v Speaker 4>built up a lot of relationships in Washington, in Austin

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<v Speaker 4>and Houston, and so CRUs is deeply I think, you know,

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<v Speaker 4>many political conflicts of interest in this race.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's an interesting he's he's sort of an interesting role.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, certainly when he came into the Senate was

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<v Speaker 2>such a scene as sort of I think, in many

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<v Speaker 2>ways the standard bearer of this more insurgent movement, and

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<v Speaker 2>now there, you know, I wouldn't say the movement has

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<v Speaker 2>like moved beyond him necessarily, but like if, certainly, if

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<v Speaker 2>we had a Senator Paxton, I think Senator Paxton would

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<v Speaker 2>maybe take up the role of like a flame thrower

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<v Speaker 2>in Texas's flamethrower in chief.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, and you know, for what it's worth, Paxston is

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<v Speaker 4>doing all he can to kind of butter up Cruise

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<v Speaker 4>for a potential endorsement maybe down the line. And every

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<v Speaker 4>media interview that I've seen from Paxston since he launched

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<v Speaker 4>his campaign, he you know, constantly says, we have a

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<v Speaker 4>conservative fighter and Ted Cruz we need another conservative fighter

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<v Speaker 4>in that other Senate seat. And so you know that's

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<v Speaker 4>a contrast that really helps, you know, Paxton make the case.

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<v Speaker 4>But it could also, you know, try to lay the

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<v Speaker 4>groundwork for a Cruise endorsement down the line if Cruz

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<v Speaker 4>does decide to get off the sidelines.

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<v Speaker 5>So, knowing we were going to talk about this today,

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<v Speaker 5>I sat down and sort of tried to prepare in

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<v Speaker 5>my mind the case for and against Cornan Can I

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<v Speaker 5>do this and get y'all to react to it?

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<v Speaker 2>All?

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<v Speaker 5>Right? So I'm going to do the Paxton case first, Right,

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<v Speaker 5>it's Paxton. The polls pretty consistently show is the more

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<v Speaker 5>popular politician in Texas. The most recent UT Texas Politics

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<v Speaker 5>poll showed a thirty percent approval rating for Cornan thirty

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<v Speaker 5>seven percent disapproved, so minus seven percentage points there. Paxton's

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<v Speaker 5>approval rating was thirty seven percent thirty four disapproved, so

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<v Speaker 5>a plus three percent.

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<v Speaker 3>Right. Both have some.

425
00:21:34.720 --> 00:21:39.319
<v Speaker 5>Kind of no opinion you know or unknown type people there,

426
00:21:39.440 --> 00:21:43.519
<v Speaker 5>But among GOP voters the difference is even bigger. Paxton

427
00:21:43.599 --> 00:21:47.400
<v Speaker 5>a plus thirty five percent net favorability according to a

428
00:21:47.480 --> 00:21:51.599
<v Speaker 5>u of H poll in February, Cornan a plus eighteen

429
00:21:52.119 --> 00:21:57.160
<v Speaker 5>net favorability. That's for people who have voted or should

430
00:21:57.160 --> 00:22:00.000
<v Speaker 5>be expected to vote in the GOP primary next year.

431
00:22:00.559 --> 00:22:02.480
<v Speaker 5>And then, as we are sort of already talked about,

432
00:22:02.680 --> 00:22:07.240
<v Speaker 5>Paxton just represents more of what the Republican Party is

433
00:22:07.519 --> 00:22:10.839
<v Speaker 5>right now than John Cornyn does this. He seems to

434
00:22:10.880 --> 00:22:14.519
<v Speaker 5>be the type of politician that people in that party

435
00:22:14.680 --> 00:22:18.359
<v Speaker 5>want right now compared to the more traditional John Cornyn.

436
00:22:18.680 --> 00:22:20.359
<v Speaker 5>What else am I missing there? What am I missing

437
00:22:20.359 --> 00:22:22.079
<v Speaker 5>in the Paxton case?

438
00:22:23.000 --> 00:22:24.759
<v Speaker 1>I think that anything else on the past, I mean.

439
00:22:24.680 --> 00:22:26.440
<v Speaker 4>I think that was the case for Paxton.

440
00:22:26.519 --> 00:22:28.079
<v Speaker 3>That's case Pax, right.

441
00:22:28.079 --> 00:22:29.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I will say, like, and then I do want

442
00:22:29.960 --> 00:22:31.680
<v Speaker 2>to hear the case for Cornyn. But like we sort

443
00:22:31.680 --> 00:22:33.880
<v Speaker 2>of saw a preview of this right when it turned

444
00:22:34.240 --> 00:22:36.960
<v Speaker 2>Paxton was challenged by George P. Bush, right, like a

445
00:22:37.000 --> 00:22:40.160
<v Speaker 2>little bit more of that slightly more old school versus

446
00:22:40.440 --> 00:22:43.039
<v Speaker 2>and that was when Paxton was in like the heat

447
00:22:43.240 --> 00:22:46.279
<v Speaker 2>of the you know, his legal challenges, and he won

448
00:22:46.400 --> 00:22:50.599
<v Speaker 2>by quite a healthy margin. So certainly there's a case

449
00:22:50.640 --> 00:22:53.400
<v Speaker 2>to be made for voters love them right, Yeah, all right,

450
00:22:53.440 --> 00:22:53.960
<v Speaker 2>so let me.

451
00:22:53.960 --> 00:22:56.279
<v Speaker 4>Then, well, I think the big caveat there is and

452
00:22:56.319 --> 00:22:58.799
<v Speaker 4>I think for those of us who follow politics closely,

453
00:22:59.240 --> 00:23:02.960
<v Speaker 4>that twenty two primary and primary runoff was especially frustrating

454
00:23:03.000 --> 00:23:06.640
<v Speaker 4>and kind of inconclusive because he was running against the

455
00:23:06.680 --> 00:23:10.680
<v Speaker 4>Bush and in Republican circles, primary electric circles, the Bush

456
00:23:10.759 --> 00:23:13.079
<v Speaker 4>name is just the beginning and end of conversation for

457
00:23:13.160 --> 00:23:15.920
<v Speaker 4>some voters. And so you're really looking at that twenty

458
00:23:15.920 --> 00:23:19.680
<v Speaker 4>two primary because of the opponent, you really wonder if

459
00:23:19.720 --> 00:23:23.119
<v Speaker 4>that is actually an accurate gauge of what a real

460
00:23:23.240 --> 00:23:27.279
<v Speaker 4>race against Paxton looks like, just because again, for some

461
00:23:27.319 --> 00:23:30.519
<v Speaker 4>Republican primary voters they just hear the name Bush and

462
00:23:30.559 --> 00:23:32.079
<v Speaker 4>they just plug their ears.

463
00:23:31.759 --> 00:23:32.359
<v Speaker 3>More or less.

464
00:23:32.440 --> 00:23:35.400
<v Speaker 4>So it's always interesting to think about how instructive that

465
00:23:35.519 --> 00:23:36.200
<v Speaker 4>race really was.

466
00:23:36.519 --> 00:23:40.000
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, and additionally, Paxton was the incumbent, right and in

467
00:23:40.039 --> 00:23:42.519
<v Speaker 5>this race, Paxston will not be in the incumbent exactly.

468
00:23:42.519 --> 00:23:45.319
<v Speaker 5>But also just the history of Republican primaries, I mean

469
00:23:45.359 --> 00:23:48.519
<v Speaker 5>Cornyin actually now I'm moving into the case for Cornin here,

470
00:23:48.960 --> 00:23:53.000
<v Speaker 5>but has a better history. Right that twenty twenty two primary,

471
00:23:53.039 --> 00:23:55.759
<v Speaker 5>kN Paxton, in the first round of voting won forty

472
00:23:55.799 --> 00:23:58.880
<v Speaker 5>two point seven percent, which means that more than half

473
00:23:58.920 --> 00:24:02.200
<v Speaker 5>of the primary voters voted against Ken Paxton in that race,

474
00:24:02.400 --> 00:24:04.839
<v Speaker 5>those same voters who are presumably going to be voting

475
00:24:05.119 --> 00:24:09.400
<v Speaker 5>in this election. Right now, let's talk about Cornan's last

476
00:24:09.400 --> 00:24:12.440
<v Speaker 5>three primaries. He faced challengers in each of those. In

477
00:24:12.480 --> 00:24:14.960
<v Speaker 5>two thousand and eight, he had eighty one percent of

478
00:24:15.000 --> 00:24:18.480
<v Speaker 5>the vote against Larry Kilgore. In twenty fourteen, he got

479
00:24:18.480 --> 00:24:22.519
<v Speaker 5>fifty nine percent of the vote against Steve Stockman, a

480
00:24:22.519 --> 00:24:25.279
<v Speaker 5>former congressman, who pulled in nineteen percent of the vote.

481
00:24:25.319 --> 00:24:28.480
<v Speaker 5>So Cornyin won that race by forty percent. In twenty twenty,

482
00:24:28.640 --> 00:24:31.599
<v Speaker 5>he got seventy six percent of the vote. Admittedly, none

483
00:24:31.640 --> 00:24:34.400
<v Speaker 5>of those were as strong of opponents as George P. Bush,

484
00:24:34.440 --> 00:24:37.480
<v Speaker 5>but I mean those are resounding victories, something that Ken

485
00:24:37.519 --> 00:24:41.160
<v Speaker 5>Paxton decidedly did not get in the first round of

486
00:24:41.200 --> 00:24:44.519
<v Speaker 5>voting the last time. In addition to that, you know,

487
00:24:44.920 --> 00:24:48.079
<v Speaker 5>the argument against Paxton in that primary was all his

488
00:24:48.119 --> 00:24:50.960
<v Speaker 5>ethical concerns. There seemed to be some success in that,

489
00:24:51.160 --> 00:24:53.359
<v Speaker 5>but also just Cornin's going to have a lot more

490
00:24:53.640 --> 00:24:56.519
<v Speaker 5>money and that's going to be the top race in

491
00:24:56.559 --> 00:24:59.200
<v Speaker 5>this race. He is going to be able to really

492
00:24:59.240 --> 00:25:04.359
<v Speaker 5>message those concerns in this race. Since that race, also,

493
00:25:04.799 --> 00:25:09.039
<v Speaker 5>Paxton was impeached. Sixty of the eighty five Republican members

494
00:25:09.200 --> 00:25:12.559
<v Speaker 5>voted to impeach him in the House. Admittedly, he then

495
00:25:12.880 --> 00:25:16.039
<v Speaker 5>was acquitted in the Senate, but that's notable and people

496
00:25:16.079 --> 00:25:19.400
<v Speaker 5>will say like, okay, but yeah, then the next Republican

497
00:25:19.400 --> 00:25:22.880
<v Speaker 5>primary for the House members was a bloodbath, right, But

498
00:25:23.839 --> 00:25:26.640
<v Speaker 5>when you kind of break down the numbers, it's a

499
00:25:26.680 --> 00:25:29.200
<v Speaker 5>little bit more complicated than that, because, of course Ken

500
00:25:29.279 --> 00:25:31.839
<v Speaker 5>Paxon was going against the Republican members who voted to

501
00:25:31.880 --> 00:25:35.079
<v Speaker 5>impeach him, but Greg Abbott was also going against the

502
00:25:35.119 --> 00:25:38.079
<v Speaker 5>Republican members who voted against him on the voucher bill,

503
00:25:38.279 --> 00:25:41.119
<v Speaker 5>and if you look at the numbers, Greg Abbott actually

504
00:25:41.160 --> 00:25:43.119
<v Speaker 5>seemed to have a lot more success there.

505
00:25:43.200 --> 00:25:43.440
<v Speaker 3>Right.

506
00:25:43.519 --> 00:25:46.920
<v Speaker 5>So there were sixteen Republican members running for reelection who

507
00:25:47.000 --> 00:25:51.400
<v Speaker 5>voted against school vouchers in the twenty twenty four primaries.

508
00:25:51.720 --> 00:25:54.119
<v Speaker 5>Nine of them lost their seats to more than half.

509
00:25:55.400 --> 00:25:58.519
<v Speaker 5>There were forty Republicans who voted for who were running

510
00:25:58.519 --> 00:26:02.720
<v Speaker 5>for reelection and voted four school vouchers, but also voted

511
00:26:02.759 --> 00:26:06.400
<v Speaker 5>to impeach. So that basically means that Paxton was going

512
00:26:06.440 --> 00:26:10.200
<v Speaker 5>against them, but Greg Abbott was not. Only five of

513
00:26:10.240 --> 00:26:14.559
<v Speaker 5>those for forty lost their primaries, that's thirteen percent. Okay,

514
00:26:14.680 --> 00:26:19.359
<v Speaker 5>So what people on Cornan's case, who are on Cornan's

515
00:26:19.359 --> 00:26:24.119
<v Speaker 5>side would say is that Paxton actually did not demonstrate

516
00:26:24.119 --> 00:26:28.599
<v Speaker 5>an ability to be that effective in affecting the Republican primaries.

517
00:26:28.680 --> 00:26:31.400
<v Speaker 5>It was Greg Abbott who proved to be incredibly effective.

518
00:26:31.720 --> 00:26:35.880
<v Speaker 5>And so there is all this record of Paxxon actually

519
00:26:35.960 --> 00:26:38.720
<v Speaker 5>not doing that well in these primaries over the last

520
00:26:38.759 --> 00:26:42.559
<v Speaker 5>couple of years. Tell me evaluate that case.

521
00:26:43.440 --> 00:26:45.319
<v Speaker 1>Patrick thoughts, Yeah, no, I agree with that.

522
00:26:45.359 --> 00:26:47.559
<v Speaker 4>I mean, I've told anybody who will listen, you know,

523
00:26:47.599 --> 00:26:50.799
<v Speaker 4>in the past year that I don't think nearly as

524
00:26:50.799 --> 00:26:54.279
<v Speaker 4>many State House Republicans would have lost their primaries if

525
00:26:54.319 --> 00:26:56.240
<v Speaker 4>the State House would have just gone ahead and passed

526
00:26:56.599 --> 00:26:59.400
<v Speaker 4>school vouchers last session and gotten that over with. I mean,

527
00:26:59.480 --> 00:27:02.079
<v Speaker 4>in fact, Feelin would probably still be Speaker in my

528
00:27:02.200 --> 00:27:06.000
<v Speaker 4>view if that had happened, because I really believe that

529
00:27:06.440 --> 00:27:10.160
<v Speaker 4>the majority of those races were incumbents lost. The primary

530
00:27:10.200 --> 00:27:14.440
<v Speaker 4>factor was definitely the opposition, the money, the campaigning that

531
00:27:14.519 --> 00:27:17.839
<v Speaker 4>was brought against them because of their position on school vouchers.

532
00:27:18.559 --> 00:27:21.880
<v Speaker 4>You know, Paxton did not in these races that he targeted,

533
00:27:22.440 --> 00:27:26.039
<v Speaker 4>He did not bring nearly as much in some cases

534
00:27:26.079 --> 00:27:28.319
<v Speaker 4>any you know, outside money to the table in the

535
00:27:28.359 --> 00:27:31.039
<v Speaker 4>way that Abbott was able to bring his own campaign

536
00:27:31.039 --> 00:27:33.920
<v Speaker 4>funds and then outside campaign funds to the table and

537
00:27:34.000 --> 00:27:36.440
<v Speaker 4>races that were being targeted for school over the school

538
00:27:36.480 --> 00:27:40.279
<v Speaker 4>vouchers vote. So yeah, I agree that Paxton was not

539
00:27:40.559 --> 00:27:43.359
<v Speaker 4>a driving factor or impeachment I don't think was a

540
00:27:43.440 --> 00:27:45.960
<v Speaker 4>driving factor. And the eventual outcome of a lot of

541
00:27:45.960 --> 00:27:47.519
<v Speaker 4>those primaries where House.

542
00:27:47.400 --> 00:27:50.920
<v Speaker 2>Incumbents lost, yeah, I think it's sort of I think

543
00:27:50.920 --> 00:27:54.440
<v Speaker 2>forever the question right now in Texas Republican politics, at

544
00:27:54.480 --> 00:27:57.319
<v Speaker 2>least right which is like we have this extremely loud,

545
00:27:57.480 --> 00:28:05.240
<v Speaker 2>extremely sort of a media dominant group of insurgent Republicans,

546
00:28:05.279 --> 00:28:08.160
<v Speaker 2>grassroots Republicans, whatever you want to call them.

547
00:28:08.240 --> 00:28:09.359
<v Speaker 1>But how effective are they?

548
00:28:09.440 --> 00:28:09.559
<v Speaker 3>Right?

549
00:28:09.559 --> 00:28:11.079
<v Speaker 1>I mean, they didn't win the speakers vote.

550
00:28:11.079 --> 00:28:14.240
<v Speaker 2>They didn't wait like there's been a number of several

551
00:28:14.279 --> 00:28:18.000
<v Speaker 2>of them, you know, who voted to impeach maintain their seats.

552
00:28:18.000 --> 00:28:20.759
<v Speaker 2>To your point, so in some ways, like to go

553
00:28:20.799 --> 00:28:23.000
<v Speaker 2>back to where we started, this is a question of like,

554
00:28:23.640 --> 00:28:27.960
<v Speaker 2>this Ken Paxton led insurgent movement is very loud, they're

555
00:28:28.079 --> 00:28:31.240
<v Speaker 2>very dominant, they're very you know what.

556
00:28:31.279 --> 00:28:32.200
<v Speaker 1>We talk about a lot.

557
00:28:32.480 --> 00:28:35.079
<v Speaker 2>This will be a test of like, well, how much

558
00:28:35.079 --> 00:28:38.000
<v Speaker 2>of the elector do they have on their side?

559
00:28:38.240 --> 00:28:40.240
<v Speaker 4>I think to be clear, I think impeachment was very

560
00:28:40.240 --> 00:28:43.640
<v Speaker 4>helpful to Paxton's personal narrative, especially going into this primary

561
00:28:43.680 --> 00:28:47.000
<v Speaker 4>challenge to Cornyn. But if the question is like how

562
00:28:47.000 --> 00:28:49.920
<v Speaker 4>determinative was that in the last election cycle with those

563
00:28:49.960 --> 00:28:53.200
<v Speaker 4>incumbent losses, I don't think it was factor number one.

564
00:28:53.480 --> 00:28:56.599
<v Speaker 5>Can we talk about the impact of this race on

565
00:28:56.759 --> 00:29:00.240
<v Speaker 5>the general election. We don't actually know, of course, who,

566
00:29:00.720 --> 00:29:03.759
<v Speaker 5>if any prominent Democrat is going to choose to run

567
00:29:03.759 --> 00:29:05.680
<v Speaker 5>for this office. I'm sure they'll find someone. Whether all

568
00:29:05.720 --> 00:29:08.160
<v Speaker 5>the equality candidate I think remains to be seen, right,

569
00:29:08.240 --> 00:29:11.920
<v Speaker 5>But I mean, I remember in twenty twenty four, all

570
00:29:12.039 --> 00:29:15.839
<v Speaker 5>my sort of non politically focused friends would be like,

571
00:29:15.960 --> 00:29:18.720
<v Speaker 5>is Colin Alred like actually gonna win the US Senate race?

572
00:29:18.759 --> 00:29:20.279
<v Speaker 5>And I was like, no, he's not going to win

573
00:29:20.319 --> 00:29:22.599
<v Speaker 5>the US Senate race. And if you were hoping for

574
00:29:22.640 --> 00:29:26.359
<v Speaker 5>a Democrat to win a statewide race, I would tell them,

575
00:29:26.400 --> 00:29:29.079
<v Speaker 5>here's the path for that to happen. It's Donald Trump

576
00:29:29.279 --> 00:29:33.240
<v Speaker 5>winning in twenty twenty four, creating a then mid term

577
00:29:33.279 --> 00:29:38.599
<v Speaker 5>election that inevitably goes backlash against the Republican who won

578
00:29:38.680 --> 00:29:43.240
<v Speaker 5>the previous year, and then Ken Paxton successfully primarying John

579
00:29:43.279 --> 00:29:46.160
<v Speaker 5>Cornyn in that race. I thought at that time that

580
00:29:46.160 --> 00:29:49.359
<v Speaker 5>that was actually maybe a credible path for a Democratic victory.

581
00:29:49.440 --> 00:29:53.519
<v Speaker 5>I was not expecting Trump to trounce to win Biden

582
00:29:53.839 --> 00:29:58.279
<v Speaker 5>at the amount you know, exactly in Texas that he did,

583
00:29:58.359 --> 00:30:02.039
<v Speaker 5>so I kind of maybe regret telling that to people.

584
00:30:02.240 --> 00:30:06.160
<v Speaker 5>But I'm curious what you think, Patrick, about how vulnerable

585
00:30:07.319 --> 00:30:11.759
<v Speaker 5>might can Paxton be in a general election in the

586
00:30:11.799 --> 00:30:14.680
<v Speaker 5>political climate that we might see in twenty twenty six.

587
00:30:16.319 --> 00:30:18.480
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I mean, I think the polling bears out that,

588
00:30:19.119 --> 00:30:21.240
<v Speaker 4>or at least my gut feeling is that he's more

589
00:30:21.319 --> 00:30:25.200
<v Speaker 4>vulnerable to political competition in the general election than Cornyn is.

590
00:30:25.240 --> 00:30:27.440
<v Speaker 4>I don't know if that's you know, the hottest take,

591
00:30:27.759 --> 00:30:29.680
<v Speaker 4>but I still think he is. He enters the general

592
00:30:29.720 --> 00:30:32.519
<v Speaker 4>election as the favorite, given that the given the political

593
00:30:32.519 --> 00:30:35.440
<v Speaker 4>moment that Texas is in with the state, you know,

594
00:30:35.519 --> 00:30:40.160
<v Speaker 4>getting appearing to get redder in statewide elections. So, you know,

595
00:30:40.200 --> 00:30:45.359
<v Speaker 4>I think Democrats are in Texas are always kind of

596
00:30:45.359 --> 00:30:48.319
<v Speaker 4>self negotiating over what the best opportunity is. It's like, oh,

597
00:30:48.319 --> 00:30:51.079
<v Speaker 4>if we just get you know, this nominee after a

598
00:30:51.119 --> 00:30:54.839
<v Speaker 4>bruising battle versus this nominee, you know, maybe we can

599
00:30:54.880 --> 00:30:56.640
<v Speaker 4>win it. And and sure, like I just acknowledge, I

600
00:30:56.640 --> 00:30:58.160
<v Speaker 4>think he would be a more you know, you would

601
00:30:58.200 --> 00:31:01.240
<v Speaker 4>create a better opportunity for them, But I still think

602
00:31:01.240 --> 00:31:03.000
<v Speaker 4>he would be the favorite in that general election.

603
00:31:04.160 --> 00:31:08.079
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think that's probably the reality is.

604
00:31:08.119 --> 00:31:10.960
<v Speaker 2>You know, it's there's not a really as much as

605
00:31:10.960 --> 00:31:12.920
<v Speaker 2>that path I think probably did make sense, like before

606
00:31:13.000 --> 00:31:17.960
<v Speaker 2>the election, you know, the I don't know that the

607
00:31:18.000 --> 00:31:21.880
<v Speaker 2>backlash that I'm sure some Republicans are preparing for in

608
00:31:21.920 --> 00:31:23.839
<v Speaker 2>the midterms is going to make it to Texas.

609
00:31:24.279 --> 00:31:24.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

610
00:31:25.119 --> 00:31:27.359
<v Speaker 5>The other fun thing about this is now we get

611
00:31:27.359 --> 00:31:31.079
<v Speaker 5>a primary for attorney general as well. My favorite thing

612
00:31:31.079 --> 00:31:33.799
<v Speaker 5>to talk exactly exactly, and you know there are already

613
00:31:33.799 --> 00:31:37.440
<v Speaker 5>people in that race. John Bash, a prominent conservative attorney

614
00:31:37.480 --> 00:31:40.799
<v Speaker 5>who has done some work for Elon Musk. You've got

615
00:31:40.839 --> 00:31:47.279
<v Speaker 5>May's Middleton, prominent senator. I saw that. Joan Huffman, another

616
00:31:47.599 --> 00:31:51.640
<v Speaker 5>member of the Senate, told Brad Johnson from The Texan

617
00:31:51.720 --> 00:31:55.359
<v Speaker 5>Today that she's seriously considering her run. I think Brian Hughes,

618
00:31:55.400 --> 00:31:58.960
<v Speaker 5>another senator, has come up a lot. Mitch Little, who

619
00:31:59.039 --> 00:32:02.559
<v Speaker 5>represented Ken, extended that race. We could have a really

620
00:32:04.279 --> 00:32:07.799
<v Speaker 5>crowded and interesting primary for that race too.

621
00:32:07.839 --> 00:32:10.640
<v Speaker 2>You talk about like things political reporters love, It's like, sure,

622
00:32:10.799 --> 00:32:13.039
<v Speaker 2>we love We'd love a corn In and Paxton battle.

623
00:32:13.400 --> 00:32:17.519
<v Speaker 2>We love a crowded attorney general's race where everyone gets

624
00:32:17.519 --> 00:32:20.559
<v Speaker 2>to sort of litigate what they think the attorney general

625
00:32:20.559 --> 00:32:22.599
<v Speaker 2>should do, what they think see that role as I mean,

626
00:32:22.599 --> 00:32:26.480
<v Speaker 2>Texas's attorney general plays such an outsized role in national

627
00:32:26.559 --> 00:32:28.920
<v Speaker 2>conservative politics, which.

628
00:32:28.720 --> 00:32:29.680
<v Speaker 1>Has not always been the case.

629
00:32:29.759 --> 00:32:32.759
<v Speaker 2>I you know, Will I won't belabor this, but you know,

630
00:32:32.799 --> 00:32:35.440
<v Speaker 2>twenty five years ago when John Cornant the first Republican

631
00:32:35.480 --> 00:32:40.319
<v Speaker 2>attorney general since reconstruction in modern Texas history. You know,

632
00:32:40.400 --> 00:32:44.039
<v Speaker 2>before that the attorney general's you know, was basically a

633
00:32:44.079 --> 00:32:47.240
<v Speaker 2>bureaucratic workhorse, and now we have, you know, this conservative,

634
00:32:48.240 --> 00:32:52.000
<v Speaker 2>very ideological office. And I think we can safely assume

635
00:32:52.359 --> 00:32:55.359
<v Speaker 2>that the Republican candidate, at least in that election will

636
00:32:55.400 --> 00:32:57.960
<v Speaker 2>be cut from the from the same cloth.

637
00:32:58.160 --> 00:33:00.400
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, And there's just a lot of pent up and

638
00:33:00.480 --> 00:33:02.440
<v Speaker 5>in the Republican Party right now, because there's a lot

639
00:33:02.480 --> 00:33:04.079
<v Speaker 5>of people who have been holding their office for a

640
00:33:04.160 --> 00:33:07.279
<v Speaker 5>very long time, and other people who see themselves as

641
00:33:07.400 --> 00:33:10.240
<v Speaker 5>a governor someday or a statewide official some days. Seeing that,

642
00:33:10.400 --> 00:33:13.559
<v Speaker 5>of course, controllers race, there will also be something there

643
00:33:13.599 --> 00:33:15.519
<v Speaker 5>because of Glenn Hager going to A and M. So

644
00:33:15.720 --> 00:33:19.279
<v Speaker 5>it's going to be a very after you know, honestly,

645
00:33:19.400 --> 00:33:21.680
<v Speaker 5>like a pretty boring twenty twenty four election.

646
00:33:21.519 --> 00:33:22.720
<v Speaker 3>Like this is going to be a fun one in

647
00:33:22.720 --> 00:33:26.559
<v Speaker 3>twenty twenty six. I yes, certainly on the AG race too.

648
00:33:26.759 --> 00:33:28.720
<v Speaker 4>I'm not ready to you I mentioned Democrats in the

649
00:33:28.759 --> 00:33:31.400
<v Speaker 4>Senate race earlier. I'm not ready to say that Democrats

650
00:33:31.400 --> 00:33:33.039
<v Speaker 4>may have a better shot in the AG race. But

651
00:33:33.079 --> 00:33:36.039
<v Speaker 4>I do think the dynamics going into that general election

652
00:33:36.480 --> 00:33:38.799
<v Speaker 4>could be a lot different than the dynamics going into

653
00:33:38.799 --> 00:33:42.200
<v Speaker 4>the general election for Senate this AG. This Republican primary

654
00:33:42.240 --> 00:33:45.119
<v Speaker 4>for AG could produce a nominee who no one really

655
00:33:45.160 --> 00:33:48.920
<v Speaker 4>knows statewide in a general electric right, And so you know,

656
00:33:49.920 --> 00:33:52.279
<v Speaker 4>especially compared to a Paxton or a corn And entering

657
00:33:52.319 --> 00:33:55.519
<v Speaker 4>a general election, they have pretty broad statewide name ID.

658
00:33:56.000 --> 00:33:57.960
<v Speaker 4>But like, you know, this is just an example, but say,

659
00:33:58.000 --> 00:34:01.680
<v Speaker 4>like Joan Hoffman is the Republican nominee for AG, not

660
00:34:01.799 --> 00:34:04.880
<v Speaker 4>a very well known name statewide, And so it'll be

661
00:34:04.880 --> 00:34:08.480
<v Speaker 4>interesting to see if that Republican primary produces someone who

662
00:34:08.519 --> 00:34:10.400
<v Speaker 4>is able to make it through the fire of the

663
00:34:11.119 --> 00:34:15.119
<v Speaker 4>party's primary but then is like pretty unknown statewide to

664
00:34:15.159 --> 00:34:16.119
<v Speaker 4>a general electorate.

665
00:34:16.519 --> 00:34:19.119
<v Speaker 5>And I'm sure you know, Democrats will try their hardest

666
00:34:19.440 --> 00:34:22.880
<v Speaker 5>to make this about like abortion enforcement and everything like that,

667
00:34:22.960 --> 00:34:25.360
<v Speaker 5>you know, and an issue that they've not really been

668
00:34:25.400 --> 00:34:29.719
<v Speaker 5>able to wield to their wield effectively up until now.

669
00:34:29.719 --> 00:34:32.360
<v Speaker 2>Right, And like I'm no political consultant, but I do

670
00:34:32.400 --> 00:34:34.800
<v Speaker 2>think like Democrats do sort of have an opportunity to say,

671
00:34:34.840 --> 00:34:37.119
<v Speaker 2>like the Attorney General's office is supposed to be doing

672
00:34:37.119 --> 00:34:39.360
<v Speaker 2>all this bureaucratic stuff, like it is not supposed to

673
00:34:39.400 --> 00:34:43.400
<v Speaker 2>be this ideological you know, weapon and like restoring you

674
00:34:43.400 --> 00:34:46.280
<v Speaker 2>know a little bit of like we'll just enforce child

675
00:34:46.360 --> 00:34:49.280
<v Speaker 2>support and we'll do medicaid fraud and we'll do you know,

676
00:34:49.400 --> 00:34:53.760
<v Speaker 2>crime victims compensation and like leave the partisan litigation to

677
00:34:54.280 --> 00:34:55.320
<v Speaker 2>you know, private litigants.

678
00:34:56.159 --> 00:34:57.199
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, well we'll see how that.

679
00:34:57.400 --> 00:35:01.280
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, but love here's I know. Promoters love

680
00:35:01.360 --> 00:35:03.559
<v Speaker 1>for they love bureaucracy.

681
00:35:04.039 --> 00:35:07.239
<v Speaker 2>They love Yeah, particularly in Texas, they love We're not

682
00:35:07.280 --> 00:35:11.480
<v Speaker 2>going to do Trump s bidding that works every time. Well,

683
00:35:11.519 --> 00:35:14.119
<v Speaker 2>we will be watching all of that and all of

684
00:35:14.159 --> 00:35:17.960
<v Speaker 2>this as well on what promises to be a very

685
00:35:18.079 --> 00:35:20.599
<v Speaker 2>very exciting run up to March twenty twenty six, which

686
00:35:20.639 --> 00:35:24.400
<v Speaker 2>is actually kind of a long time away. Patrick, thank

687
00:35:24.400 --> 00:35:26.400
<v Speaker 2>you so much for joining us. We really really appreciate

688
00:35:26.440 --> 00:35:28.119
<v Speaker 2>having you here, Missy.

689
00:35:27.880 --> 00:35:28.880
<v Speaker 3>Patrick, thanks for having me.

690
00:35:29.960 --> 00:35:33.159
<v Speaker 2>Yes, that's it for today. You can find all episodes

691
00:35:33.159 --> 00:35:35.519
<v Speaker 2>of the trib Cast on YouTube or wherever you find

692
00:35:35.559 --> 00:35:38.519
<v Speaker 2>your podcasts. Be sure to like, subscribe and share the

693
00:35:38.559 --> 00:35:40.880
<v Speaker 2>podcast on all of your platforms. If you'd like to

694
00:35:40.880 --> 00:35:42.519
<v Speaker 2>get in touch with the team, you can reach us

695
00:35:42.559 --> 00:35:46.880
<v Speaker 2>at Tribcast at Texastribune dot org. Our producers are Rob

696
00:35:46.880 --> 00:35:49.840
<v Speaker 2>Avila and Chris Bobada. Our theme music is composed by

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00:35:50.000 --> 00:35:52.239
<v Speaker 2>Rob and we will see you next week.