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Speaker 1: UFOs nuclear missiles and a twenty year old kid alone

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in the fog at two in the morning.

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Speaker 2: It's foggy. It's very foggy. There's a large stadium type

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light over the missile site to light it up, and

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so the figure started walking towards me and I realized

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there was something wrong here. I backed into the guard shack.

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Felt like a trapped animal, trapped in a corner.

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Speaker 3: And when he woke up, he wasn't on the ground anymore.

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Speaker 2: Inside this circular room, I'm on my knees and looking

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out that window.

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Speaker 3: And before they brought him back, they had a message.

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Speaker 2: We're not going to lie you to out of nuclear war,

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but if we have to intervene, he says that it's

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between us who's going to get the spoils.

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Speaker 1: So what really happened at Vandenberg Air Force Base in

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September of nineteen sixty four. Let's find out. Hey everyone,

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I'm Matt Ford, and welcome to the Good Trouble Show Tonight.

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Speaker 3: We have two very special guests.

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Speaker 1: On your left is a man whose story Robert Hastings

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considers one of the most remarkable he has ever documented.

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In September of nineteen sixty four, Richard Barth was a

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twenty year old Air Force security guard stationed at Vandenberg

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Air Force Base in California, the epicenter of American nuclear

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missile testing. What happened to Richard on a foggy night

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that September has stayed with him for over sixty years. Richard,

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thank you for being here and for your courage and

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telling this story now on your right as a man

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who needs no introduction to our audience. Robert Hastings is

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the author of UFOs and Nuke's Extraordinary Encounters at Nuclear

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Weapons Sites. He has interviewed over two hundred former Air

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Force personnel about UAP incursions at nuclear weapons facilities, and

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he has been a friend and guide to this show

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since our very first conversation on this topic.

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Speaker 3: Gentlemen, welcome to the show.

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Speaker 1: So, Robert, you have spent decades collecting testimony from Air

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Force personnel about UAP incursions.

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Speaker 3: At nuclear weaponsites.

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Speaker 1: I think it's what over two hundred witnesses or even

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more than that.

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Speaker 4: Now, I'm sure I've spoken to several hundred, but the

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core of the interviewees I number one hundred and sixty nine,

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Richard being the one hundred and sixty ninth. But yes,

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many many Air Force veterans who were involved in nuclear

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weapons related UFO incidents. I began in nineteen seventy three,

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and about five or six years ago, because of advancing

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age and some health issues, I really got out of

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the investigations business, so to speak. But recently I've been

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approached by three individuals, including Richard, who have amazing stories

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that really need to be followed up on and equally

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important need to be publicized. Richard's story is quite dramatic

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and very integral to what I've done for all these years.

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Speaker 1: I absolutely agree, and again so happy to have you

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back on the show. You've been such a great friend

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to me and especially to the show and the people

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that you've brought along on what I think is one

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of the most important elements of the whole UAP discussion

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is the tie to nuclear nuclear weapons. So Richard, welcome,

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Welcome to the show, and super super glad to have

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you on.

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Speaker 3: Walk us through.

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Speaker 1: How you ended up at Vandenberg Air Force Base in

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nineteen sixty four.

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Speaker 3: I understand you were a young man in Los Angeles.

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Speaker 1: How does someone end up starting off in LA and

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ending up guarding various missiles at an Air Force base.

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Speaker 2: Well, I was a student at Pasadena City College on

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a pre med major, but my grades weren't very good,

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and I graduated the CEA average, and back in those days,

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if you didn't have a B plus average, you weren't

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even going to transfer to a university level. So I

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decided join the Air Force and as a medic actually,

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and he said, well, you have a two year college degree.

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You know, we have a program here. We're going to

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train some undergraduate navigators and would you be interested in that. Well,

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I was really interested in that because I had been

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in Civil Air Patrol and very interested in flying. So

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he said, we'll go down and take the test and

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we'll see you go from there. So they sent me

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down to LA. It was an all day test. It

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covered everything from psychological spatial relationships to map reading. It's

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just very extensive and I passed that. So after that

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they sent me for the flight physical, which is very extensive.

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I passed that and he says, well, you're in. We

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just need to have a class for you. That took

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couple of months to have an opening in the class,

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and that came and I went to James Connley Air

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Force Base in Texas and was an aviation cadet for navigation. Unfortunately,

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when we got to the celestial navigation part, I was

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starting to have difficulty. I was transposing a lot of numbers.

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They gave you two chances to pass your flight test

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and I failed both of those. So basically I washed out.

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And when I joined, I was under selective service. I

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joined under selective service. That was a enticement to go

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for this program. So I had served a total of

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two years plus reserve time. Well, and cadets said served

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eleven months before I washed out, so I had thirteen

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months left. That was not a lot of time for

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training into a particular field. So they said, you know,

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you can choose your base or you like to go.

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So I chose Vandenburg Air Force Base primarily because it

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was close to my home, about a four hour drive

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and I can take my time off and go home

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and be with my friends.

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Speaker 5: Was the incentive to go there.

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Speaker 1: I would imagine with today's traffic in LA, that four

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hour drive would probably be more like a six hour drive.

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Speaker 5: Sure it would be yeah, go go ahead, sor back

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then it wasn't that bad.

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Speaker 1: It was yeah, yeah, oh, I'm yeah, it's a hate

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la traffic. So Richard, describe Vandenberg for our audience. Paint

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a picture of what this place actually was like in

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nineteen sixty four, what you were guarding, and what was

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the scale of what they were doing.

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Speaker 3: Let's say that I have no idea what happens at Vandenberg.

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Speaker 2: Well, Vandenberg had originally been an army base. In the

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nineteen sixty it was converted, it was transferred over the

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Air Force and became a missile base. And primarily what

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they did was test missiles and then they did some

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satellite launches. The spy satellites were coming into vogue back then,

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and we had a lot of like the Thor missiles.

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During the Cuban Missile crisis, we were or we took

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the Thor missiles out of Turkey and we sent them

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all to Vandenberg. And they were ideal for launching satellites

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because they were intermediate range. They weren't ICBMs, but they

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could get a satellite into the lower orbit where they

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wanted them, and that was one hundred miles hundred and

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fifty miles or so. But we also had other missiles

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that we were testing the Atlas missile which they used

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for the Gemini program, and that's what John Glenn flew upon.

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That was an outdated ICB, but it had a lot

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of uses for the heavier satellite launches and some testing.

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We could test warhead re entries, you know, I don't know,

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I'm sure you know Robert Jacobs, since that was an

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Atlas myth, so that he was following, and that was

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to test the warhead itself.

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Speaker 5: And then.

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Speaker 2: We had Titans, which for the current ICBN. The advantage

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of Titan it was solid fuel, or not solid fuel.

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It was liquid fuel, but it was room temperature so

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he could start in the silo without having a fuel

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it just before launched, so it could be launched immediately.

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And then of course a minute Man, which was our

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front line ICBN. It was solid fuel. We could launch

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straight out of the silo at about a five thousand

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mile range, and it was it was. We haven't changed

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it that much. We're still using basically the same missile

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right now. The missiles were never armed, mostly because Vanderberg

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was very vulnerable. You can drop a bomb in the

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bay on the ocean, just create a tsunami and take

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take the base out, but it was excellent for testing

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because it was on the ocean. You can launch over

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the ocean down the Pacific Test range, and so it

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was ideal for testing in north south satellite launches, which

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put an advantage over Cape Canaveral because they did east

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west we did, and that gave us more coverage of

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the Soviet Union.

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Speaker 3: So Richard, this sounds like this.

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Speaker 1: This Air Force Base Vandenberg strategically was very important to

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the United States of America.

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Speaker 5: Oh.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, almost anything that we put out actively first was

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tested at Vanderberg.

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Speaker 1: In terms of missiles, now tell us about the night

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shift at a Minuteman missile site. So you spoke about

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the older missiles, So now we're talking Minuteman. Because I

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think people kind of sort of think of a facility

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like that as kind of like a you know, high alert,

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dramatic situation. But from what I understand, it was actually

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quite different.

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Speaker 3: When you were there on guard.

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Speaker 5: No, it was not very high alert.

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Speaker 2: There wasn't certain areas, but it wasn't particularly on most

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of the missile sites, and they would put a single

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guard on each of the sites. If it was high alert,

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you'd have double guards, one man to watch the other

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everything with double man policy, but Vandenberg or the minimen

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site was basically just one man on the missile site.

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Vandenberg was very stretched along the coast between Point Salad

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and Point Aguilos, so there's about a twenty mile stretch

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that that ace covers. The minute men were all the

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way to the north by Point Style, the last of

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the silos. They were right on the ocean. We had

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about ten missile sites there and they were and the

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launch center so that there would be one guard in

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each missile. We split our shifts so that you did

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three swings, three nights, three days, three off, so we

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weren't always on the night shift. But being on the

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ocean at night, it was often very cold, often foggy,

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and you're about a quarter of a mile half a

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mile from the next side of so you're really out

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there in the middle of nowhere. And that was not

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considered cushy duty by any of us, and we didn't

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like to get out.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't sound like it, So at the beginning of

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your shift, would everybody just load up in a pickup

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truck and they would just drop everyone off at their

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guard shack.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, that was we had a guard mount.

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Speaker 2: Then we had four squadrons, three squadrons on duty and

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one squadron off at the time, and they covered the

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different swings nights in days, and so I was on nice.

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We'd have guard mount, then we'd load our weapons and

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then we'd get on the pickup truck and we'd go

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out to our sites. Mostly we carried thirty eights. We

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had we qualified and in one carvings which were wead

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ten tons after an hour slinging that on the shoulder.

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But so we all went and qualifying for thirty eight

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police specials.

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Speaker 1: But it so what you know while you're on duty.

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It's not like people are driving by all the time.

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You're just kind of dropped off and you're alone for

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most of the evening.

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Speaker 5: Not on the night shift.

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Speaker 2: The only one you're going to see the whole night

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is you're started to drop by and give you your

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box launch and then take off and you won't see

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him till morning when they pick you up.

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Speaker 1: Wow, I don't think I would have lasted in that job,

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would have fallen asleep on duty.

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Speaker 3: So let's jump to September of nineteen.

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Speaker 1: Sixty four, walk us through that night as slowly as

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you can what you saw, what you thought, and when

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you realized this was not what you initially assumed it was.

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Speaker 5: Well it was.

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Speaker 2: It was a foggy night, which is not a typical

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the launch sights. We had a little guard check in

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front of a fence that guarded the actually garden. MESSO

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had ADT alarm system and so nobody was really going

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to get in there without triggering the alarm. But they

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had us sitting at the gate at the entrance gate

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and a kind of a broken down on guard check

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it was, and most of them didn't even have electricity.

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But we did have a telephone in there, so technically

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we were supposed to call make a call every half

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hour to command post, but it was very boring and

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command posts was bored and we didn't make those calls.

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Usually we just, if anything, just to keep awake, we

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would call each other's post and try to keep awake.

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So between the guards we didn't really understand why we're

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00:14:33,039 --> 00:14:38,200
even out there, because it was you know, if they

241
00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:41,440
had a missile that was ready to fire or arm,

242
00:14:41,519 --> 00:14:45,440
they didn't mean put a guard on it, so but

243
00:14:46,159 --> 00:14:48,600
they did so, and I think they were just copying

244
00:14:48,639 --> 00:14:53,200
what was going on in malsterm or something. So it's foggy.

245
00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:57,960
It's very foggy. There's a large stadium type light over

246
00:14:58,039 --> 00:15:02,399
the missile site up and that created what was like

247
00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:05,919
a dome. From where I was sitting in the guard shack,

248
00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:09,320
I can see probably thirty yards in front of me,

249
00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:13,240
and naturally the missile sight behind me was let up.

250
00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:16,879
So the sergeant had just come by given me my

251
00:15:17,000 --> 00:15:19,879
box launch, which had been roughly two o'clock in the morning,

252
00:15:21,039 --> 00:15:25,600
and he just left. And so I'm sitting there. I

253
00:15:25,759 --> 00:15:28,639
ate my lunch and then I have nothing to do.

254
00:15:28,759 --> 00:15:33,919
So I'm sitting there and I could see this figure

255
00:15:34,240 --> 00:15:36,639
in the fog in front of me about thirty yards away,

256
00:15:36,879 --> 00:15:40,120
which looked like and it was coming out of the fog.

257
00:15:40,159 --> 00:15:42,480
And I thought, well, the sergeant came back, but why

258
00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:44,440
would he walk back?

259
00:15:44,480 --> 00:15:49,120
Speaker 5: Why didn't he drive back? Because this was about a.

260
00:15:49,200 --> 00:15:52,600
Speaker 2: Hundred yards off the road, and there's a little entrance

261
00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:55,720
road that came from main road to the this is

262
00:15:55,759 --> 00:15:57,559
so I didn't see why I just didn't drive down

263
00:15:57,639 --> 00:16:00,240
like he did when he delivered the box lunch.

264
00:16:00,679 --> 00:16:02,480
Speaker 3: Are you hearing like footsteps?

265
00:16:02,519 --> 00:16:06,320
Speaker 2: Like I could just see this shadow that's basically it's

266
00:16:06,559 --> 00:16:12,000
a shadow, and it was wearing like a trench coat

267
00:16:12,120 --> 00:16:16,279
or similar to the raincoats that the officers had, and

268
00:16:16,399 --> 00:16:19,320
he had had a garrison type cap on. So I

269
00:16:19,399 --> 00:16:22,399
just thinkured, well, that's not a sergeant. So I wonder

270
00:16:22,399 --> 00:16:25,679
if one of the officers is just checking up on us,

271
00:16:26,679 --> 00:16:30,440
and because there was some moral issues out there, and

272
00:16:31,440 --> 00:16:34,919
so the figure started walking towards me, and I realized

273
00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:37,879
there was something wrong here, and I kind of felt

274
00:16:37,879 --> 00:16:41,120
that it was I felt his presence. It was not

275
00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:43,399
like it was just there, but I felt it inside

276
00:16:43,399 --> 00:16:46,279
of me. And I got scared and I was going

277
00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:50,200
to pull my gun, and my right arm was literally paralyzed.

278
00:16:50,200 --> 00:16:54,720
I couldn't even move my right arm pulling my weapon,

279
00:16:55,159 --> 00:16:58,879
and the figure just kept coming at me. And then

280
00:16:58,960 --> 00:17:03,519
I became terrified, and so I backed into the guard

281
00:17:03,639 --> 00:17:05,839
scheck and at the back we had don't know show

282
00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:09,279
where they had the telephone, and I backed into that

283
00:17:09,400 --> 00:17:12,640
and I remember literally trying to back push the back

284
00:17:12,680 --> 00:17:16,039
wall out to get out. I felt like a trapped animal.

285
00:17:16,279 --> 00:17:20,519
I trapped in a corner. And when the figure came

286
00:17:20,599 --> 00:17:27,119
towards me, it had normal humanoid features on height, but

287
00:17:27,240 --> 00:17:30,359
I cannot remember the face. There was something about that

288
00:17:30,400 --> 00:17:34,559
face that terrified me. But if my brain just won't

289
00:17:34,839 --> 00:17:38,200
take it, just i'd see a blank when I can't

290
00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:41,839
see that face even now. But whatever it terrified me.

291
00:17:42,079 --> 00:17:45,400
And the next thing I knew, I just passed out.

292
00:17:45,440 --> 00:17:50,480
Speaker 1: I was out since that something was wrong about him

293
00:17:50,599 --> 00:17:53,759
as he was approaching. Was this something you picked up

294
00:17:53,799 --> 00:17:57,920
on before you sort of felt his presence.

295
00:17:57,480 --> 00:18:01,160
Speaker 3: In your mind? Was it maybe his gay or some

296
00:18:01,279 --> 00:18:03,359
kind of us He.

297
00:18:03,119 --> 00:18:07,799
Speaker 2: Was controlling me. You have to obviously control my right arm,

298
00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:13,000
and I felt like he had control of me. There

299
00:18:13,079 --> 00:18:16,400
was It's hard to explain, but I just didn't feel that.

300
00:18:16,559 --> 00:18:20,839
I just felt he was a threat that he obviously

301
00:18:22,039 --> 00:18:25,200
paralyzed my right arm. I couldn't pull my weapon. I

302
00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:29,680
felt like he just inside my head, and probably was

303
00:18:29,799 --> 00:18:32,119
he was controlling me. He had the inside my head

304
00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:33,799
somehow telepathically.

305
00:18:34,079 --> 00:18:38,640
Speaker 1: Did that feeling intensify as he got closer? And do

306
00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:40,839
you recall trying to fight the sensation?

307
00:18:42,680 --> 00:18:44,160
Speaker 5: I was just pure terror.

308
00:18:44,200 --> 00:18:47,119
Speaker 2: I couldn't describe what the terror was like other than

309
00:18:47,119 --> 00:18:50,359
the say I could my analogy to a rat trapped

310
00:18:50,359 --> 00:18:54,519
in a corner from the cat. You know, you can't

311
00:18:54,599 --> 00:18:57,720
get out of where you're going, and there's nowhere to go,

312
00:18:57,759 --> 00:19:01,799
there's no fighting flight response, can't fight, and you can't

313
00:19:02,119 --> 00:19:05,000
can't flee. So it was terrible. It was just pure terror.

314
00:19:05,079 --> 00:19:09,119
That's all I can say. Enough that I passed out.

315
00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:14,599
Speaker 1: Do you recall thinking all that this was something not

316
00:19:14,759 --> 00:19:17,799
from here or did your mind even have the time to.

317
00:19:18,160 --> 00:19:21,039
Speaker 2: I didn't have time for that. I was just terrorized,

318
00:19:21,079 --> 00:19:24,000
that's all I could tell. I was so terrorized that,

319
00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,680
you know, I just went blank. I remember trying to

320
00:19:28,720 --> 00:19:31,960
push the back out of the guard shack, and I

321
00:19:31,960 --> 00:19:34,440
remember that shelf digging into my back, and then I

322
00:19:34,559 --> 00:19:35,279
just go blank.

323
00:19:36,920 --> 00:19:40,759
Speaker 1: Do you recall this being saying anything to you as

324
00:19:40,799 --> 00:19:41,559
you're approaching.

325
00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:43,680
Speaker 5: No, it wasn't.

326
00:19:44,759 --> 00:19:48,319
Speaker 2: It wasn't really communicating with me, with me when it

327
00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:51,960
came came towards me. It just had control of me,

328
00:19:52,039 --> 00:19:54,079
that's all I could say.

329
00:19:54,839 --> 00:19:57,559
Speaker 1: So you pass out, and the next thing you know,

330
00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:01,079
you're somewhere else entirely tell us where you are and

331
00:20:01,079 --> 00:20:03,119
what you see when you sort of come.

332
00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:07,240
Speaker 2: To Okay, Now, the next thing I know, I'm inside

333
00:20:07,279 --> 00:20:11,680
this circular room probably fifteen feet across ten feet fifteen

334
00:20:11,720 --> 00:20:15,480
I'm not real good at judging distance, and I'm on

335
00:20:15,519 --> 00:20:19,200
my knees the floor. It's kind of concave, and there's

336
00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:22,720
about a three foot three and a half foot circular

337
00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:25,759
like a window right in the middle of the floor.

338
00:20:25,759 --> 00:20:29,039
And I'm leaning and looking out that window, and all

339
00:20:29,039 --> 00:20:32,640
I can see is fog, basically, and I'm aware of

340
00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:37,119
the presence of this entity on my right. And now

341
00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:41,640
the communication is and it's telepathy. Don't look over it, mean,

342
00:20:41,799 --> 00:20:46,279
just keep looking out the hole. It looked like a hole.

343
00:20:46,519 --> 00:20:48,839
It didn't look like it was covered with glass or anything.

344
00:20:48,839 --> 00:20:52,880
But one thing I did notice. I expected some cold

345
00:20:52,920 --> 00:20:55,720
air to be coming through something, and it wasn't. So

346
00:20:55,799 --> 00:21:01,000
there was a barrier, some sort of barrier between myself

347
00:21:01,039 --> 00:21:04,480
and the in the outside. You know, I'm not even

348
00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:07,079
sure it was project It could have been a projection

349
00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:09,079
for all I know. But it looked as like a

350
00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:13,000
like a round window that you're looking through and there

351
00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:15,559
you could just see the fog that was it, and

352
00:21:15,599 --> 00:21:19,039
there entity to my right saying just keep looking out

353
00:21:19,079 --> 00:21:21,400
the window, don't look in my direction.

354
00:21:23,039 --> 00:21:27,799
Speaker 1: Did you sense any sort of vibration, motion, altitude, or

355
00:21:28,319 --> 00:21:31,119
any anything that would have maybe given you a clue

356
00:21:31,160 --> 00:21:34,680
as to where you were right away.

357
00:21:36,119 --> 00:21:39,759
Speaker 2: But as I'm looking out this window, the fog began

358
00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:44,960
to separate, and I'm looking down. Now I'm about one

359
00:21:45,039 --> 00:21:47,519
hundred and one hundred and fifty feet up. Again, I'm

360
00:21:47,559 --> 00:21:52,000
not that great at touching distances, but I'm on a

361
00:21:52,079 --> 00:21:54,359
post that's down the road, about a quarter of a

362
00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:58,720
mile across the street. It was designated D eleven. I

363
00:21:58,799 --> 00:22:02,200
knew all the posts by because I'd guarded all of them.

364
00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:07,119
And the light is just starting to get light. It's

365
00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:12,519
like early dawn, and I can and I'm looking straight

366
00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:18,440
down and I could this flatbed Air Force type truck

367
00:22:18,480 --> 00:22:18,920
pulls up.

368
00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:20,200
Speaker 5: It's loaded with pipes.

369
00:22:21,079 --> 00:22:24,559
Speaker 2: And then the guard comes out of his shack and

370
00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:27,079
he's on the right side of the track the truck.

371
00:22:27,759 --> 00:22:30,079
He goes over to the window, I assume the teck id.

372
00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:33,279
He goes opens the gate, lets the truck in. He

373
00:22:33,359 --> 00:22:37,119
goes back in his shack, and the fog closes in.

374
00:22:38,519 --> 00:22:41,440
So now I'm just still looking down this hole with

375
00:22:41,759 --> 00:22:44,640
or at this hole with the with the and it's

376
00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:46,960
foggy again in the end, and he says, now, don't

377
00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:47,480
look at me.

378
00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:50,079
Speaker 5: But I was.

379
00:22:50,079 --> 00:22:53,079
Speaker 2: Curious where I was, and I kind of raised my

380
00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:55,279
eyes to the top of my head, and then I

381
00:22:55,319 --> 00:23:00,920
could see across this round room and there were about

382
00:23:01,079 --> 00:23:04,640
ten feet away from me, maybe a little less. There

383
00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:08,119
were four figures sitting down there, and they were small

384
00:23:09,279 --> 00:23:14,559
humanoid figures, but disproportionate. They had the large sheds and

385
00:23:15,799 --> 00:23:17,839
probably you know, it's hard they were sitting, so I'm

386
00:23:17,839 --> 00:23:20,119
going to guess right around four feet tall or something

387
00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:26,240
like that. The room itself was the light that came

388
00:23:26,279 --> 00:23:28,200
in there outside of what made it come up through

389
00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:31,960
that hole was back lit, and I'm assuming that was

390
00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:36,359
from the wall because there was a common texture light,

391
00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:41,400
dark and gray is what it was. And so the

392
00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:45,000
figures were kind of sillowetted. There's enough that I can

393
00:23:45,079 --> 00:23:47,519
kind of make out some of their features, which was

394
00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:52,480
primarily the large eyes and there it was a round head.

395
00:23:52,519 --> 00:23:53,240
Speaker 5: It didn't have the.

396
00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:55,880
Speaker 2: Point of gin like you see some of the picture.

397
00:23:55,920 --> 00:23:59,519
But it looked like a baby, a newborn baby. It

398
00:23:59,559 --> 00:24:02,319
was purpor some of me, like a newborn baby, except

399
00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:07,720
it was no hair, no ears, large eyes, and from

400
00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:10,440
what it can make out, very small nose and mouth,

401
00:24:10,519 --> 00:24:15,440
but not real clear. It's more like silhouetted figure, just

402
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:19,880
barely visible. And they just sat there They didn't do anything.

403
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:24,920
They just sat there. They were between the figures are

404
00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:30,599
two and two, and between them was a little gap

405
00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:32,799
I assumed might have been a door or something to

406
00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:34,759
the room, which means because I felt like I was

407
00:24:34,799 --> 00:24:42,200
in a room inside something larger. And so at that point,

408
00:24:44,319 --> 00:24:46,319
that's that's the end of that next thing. I know,

409
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:49,400
I'm back in the guard Jack, except I'm on the

410
00:24:49,559 --> 00:24:53,640
floor on my back with my head on an entity's lap.

411
00:24:55,039 --> 00:24:56,519
Speaker 5: And now the.

412
00:24:56,559 --> 00:25:00,680
Speaker 2: Entity is communicating with me, and it's basically Paul that

413
00:25:00,759 --> 00:25:04,960
it had scared me so badly, and it kind of said,

414
00:25:05,119 --> 00:25:09,039
but we needed we needed to get some information.

415
00:25:08,599 --> 00:25:13,480
Speaker 5: From the missile site. Now, how they got that, I

416
00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:13,880
don't know.

417
00:25:13,920 --> 00:25:16,640
Speaker 2: How they got past the ad T into the into

418
00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:21,920
the computer section, I don't know, but they that was

419
00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:22,799
what they were after.

420
00:25:22,920 --> 00:25:25,119
Speaker 3: Apparently, I want to jump back to when you were

421
00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:25,799
in the ship.

422
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:29,200
Speaker 1: So when you look at the four figures, did any

423
00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:31,240
of them react to you being observed?

424
00:25:31,799 --> 00:25:34,240
Speaker 2: No, they just sat there. You could tell their posture.

425
00:25:34,319 --> 00:25:36,519
Their heads were on their knees and they just sat

426
00:25:36,559 --> 00:25:40,559
there and like they were observing me, but not interacting

427
00:25:40,599 --> 00:25:41,000
at all.

428
00:25:41,279 --> 00:25:45,000
Speaker 1: So you come to inside this craft, was was there

429
00:25:45,039 --> 00:25:45,799
any noise.

430
00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:48,400
Speaker 3: Did you smell anything in particular.

431
00:25:49,039 --> 00:25:52,279
Speaker 2: No, it was it was quiet. I expected it would

432
00:25:52,799 --> 00:25:55,240
be cold from the hole in the appeared to be

433
00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:58,960
a hole in the floor, but it was quite comfortable. Actually,

434
00:25:59,039 --> 00:26:04,680
I was, you know. My observation was that it was comfortable,

435
00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:08,079
and I wondered why, because that it didn't look like

436
00:26:08,119 --> 00:26:11,519
it was covered with glass. It just looked like a hole.

437
00:26:11,559 --> 00:26:15,200
But the one thing I noticed there was no embarkation

438
00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:18,839
between the room itself looked like it was molded, and

439
00:26:19,079 --> 00:26:22,240
the bench that they sat on was just an extension

440
00:26:22,279 --> 00:26:25,559
of the wall that was behind them. And the floor

441
00:26:25,759 --> 00:26:30,240
It's just like it was molded, And there was no

442
00:26:30,279 --> 00:26:38,839
real embarkation between the circle, the clear circle, and the floor.

443
00:26:39,359 --> 00:26:42,799
Didn't look like there was a joint or anything like that.

444
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:44,880
It looked like it was all the same material, except

445
00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:47,839
for the circle was clear and the rest of it.

446
00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:48,440
Speaker 5: Was dark gray.

447
00:26:51,799 --> 00:26:56,920
Speaker 2: My impression was because I knew I had been so scared.

448
00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:01,720
I could remember what had happened, but very calm, like

449
00:27:02,079 --> 00:27:04,319
I don't know if they in the interim they had

450
00:27:04,319 --> 00:27:08,480
sedated me or somehow. I just felt very calm. I

451
00:27:08,559 --> 00:27:12,000
wasn't afraid. I wasn't afraid of the figures. I was

452
00:27:12,079 --> 00:27:14,960
just very calm. Now, I'm just kind of curious of

453
00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:17,680
what's going on here. I have no idea why they

454
00:27:17,759 --> 00:27:21,000
showed me some idea eleven other than they wanted me

455
00:27:21,039 --> 00:27:23,799
to see it, maybe just show where I was or something.

456
00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:26,880
Speaker 1: So do you think that that calm was something you

457
00:27:27,519 --> 00:27:29,880
arrived at naturally or do you think it could have

458
00:27:29,920 --> 00:27:30,559
been induced?

459
00:27:31,319 --> 00:27:32,359
Speaker 5: I think it was induced.

460
00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:34,720
Speaker 2: If you go from that degree of terror to call

461
00:27:34,799 --> 00:27:40,000
you don't do that, I mean that was I was terrorized.

462
00:27:40,079 --> 00:27:41,680
The next thing I wake up, and you know, at

463
00:27:41,680 --> 00:27:43,640
the point I black out, and then I wake up

464
00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:47,200
and I feel calm. The only thing I'm totally aware

465
00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:50,279
of is the figure to my right saying don't look

466
00:27:50,319 --> 00:27:53,680
over it and just keep looking through the hole.

467
00:27:54,839 --> 00:27:56,960
Speaker 1: Do you think the figure on the right was the

468
00:27:56,960 --> 00:28:00,440
same being that approached you on the ground.

469
00:28:01,279 --> 00:28:05,720
Speaker 2: I think, so, okay, good, look, so I could I

470
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:07,319
felt like it was the same thing.

471
00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:12,079
Speaker 1: Yeah, while you're on the ship, do you recall how

472
00:28:12,119 --> 00:28:14,680
it felt and what I mean by that? Did it

473
00:28:15,039 --> 00:28:17,519
feel like you're in any sort of dream state or

474
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:20,559
as real as you and I talking right?

475
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:20,839
Speaker 3: Yes?

476
00:28:21,519 --> 00:28:25,279
Speaker 2: Just like no, it's very conscious, very awake. I'm very

477
00:28:25,319 --> 00:28:28,279
curious to what's going on here. Even when I saw

478
00:28:28,319 --> 00:28:31,359
the figures, they didn't scare me, and they just looked

479
00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:36,839
at me. And just I must have been sedated, you know,

480
00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:39,880
because I didn't really have much reaction to what was

481
00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:43,279
going on. But I was aware of what was going on.

482
00:28:44,440 --> 00:28:47,279
Speaker 1: So it wasn't like sedated like when you go to

483
00:28:47,799 --> 00:28:49,839
the doctor had to have some procedure done and you

484
00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:50,720
feel a little high.

485
00:28:51,319 --> 00:28:54,079
Speaker 2: I was just I just felt okay, and I just

486
00:28:54,079 --> 00:28:57,640
felt horrible. I felt felt at ease, the best way

487
00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:00,960
to put it. I just felt at ease. I wasn't scared.

488
00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:02,240
I wasn't.

489
00:29:03,079 --> 00:29:03,519
Speaker 5: I wasn't.

490
00:29:03,880 --> 00:29:06,000
Speaker 2: I just felt at ease. That's all I could see.

491
00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:09,839
A little curious is why you wouldn't let me look

492
00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:12,200
at him? I was a little nervous about this figure

493
00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:15,759
on my right, but I wasn't going to look at

494
00:29:15,799 --> 00:29:18,640
him because he kept communicating go look at me.

495
00:29:18,839 --> 00:29:21,039
Speaker 5: But I wasn't threatened by him either.

496
00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 1: And while your while your head is in this being's lap,

497
00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:27,319
what did that?

498
00:29:27,759 --> 00:29:28,279
Speaker 3: Do you recall?

499
00:29:28,319 --> 00:29:32,200
Speaker 1: What that physical contact felt like? Was their warmth? The texture?

500
00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:35,240
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, it was warmed. I mean I could feel

501
00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:37,799
that I was in his lap. It's you know, the legs,

502
00:29:37,799 --> 00:29:41,240
and that it's like laying down in somebody's lap, you know,

503
00:29:41,279 --> 00:29:44,319
on their legs. I'm on my back, I have my

504
00:29:44,400 --> 00:29:49,079
eyes tightly shut, and again this telepathic message, don't open

505
00:29:49,119 --> 00:29:50,599
your eyes, keep your eyes shut.

506
00:29:51,559 --> 00:29:52,119
Speaker 5: And then.

507
00:29:53,599 --> 00:29:57,960
Speaker 2: Again it was almost to the other extreme. He was

508
00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:03,559
apologizing for an ecloony because you know, originally my impression

509
00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:09,240
was it was Neil and I.

510
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:12,279
Speaker 5: Just felt wonderful.

511
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:15,440
Speaker 2: Really, it wasn't just at ease, and now I felt really,

512
00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:19,480
really good. The only thing I could describe it is

513
00:30:20,599 --> 00:30:23,920
I felt like a baby would feel when it's suckling

514
00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:27,480
at his mother's breast. He just feels like almost a

515
00:30:27,559 --> 00:30:30,119
euphoric type feeling that I was feeling at the time.

516
00:30:30,759 --> 00:30:35,720
Speaker 1: And it apologizes for scaring you. And then what else

517
00:30:35,759 --> 00:30:36,720
does it communicate?

518
00:30:37,599 --> 00:30:42,160
Speaker 2: Communicated that it's necessary that they get some data out

519
00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:47,000
of the missile stylo, and basically that they couldn't allow

520
00:30:47,119 --> 00:30:49,279
us to go to nuclear war, and that it was

521
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:53,000
necessary for them to find a way to stop us

522
00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:59,039
from launching these missiles. And so he explained why they

523
00:30:59,039 --> 00:31:02,319
were there. But so said one other thing. Are communicated

524
00:31:02,359 --> 00:31:07,920
with everything he says, you know, you're very lucky. We're

525
00:31:08,079 --> 00:31:12,359
very benevolent, he says, but we're not all benevolent. So

526
00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:16,039
that suggested that there's more than other people out there.

527
00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:20,000
And he said, we're not going to lie you to

528
00:31:20,119 --> 00:31:23,160
out of nuclear war, but if we have to intervene,

529
00:31:23,799 --> 00:31:26,680
he says, then it's between us who's going to get

530
00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:30,359
the spoils. So that gave me the impression that between

531
00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:32,920
them they didn't get along all that well. They had

532
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:36,400
some sort of agreement and unless we launched these missiles

533
00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:41,519
that they weren't going to do or intervened, But that

534
00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:43,759
didn't sound like they all got along to me.

535
00:31:44,839 --> 00:31:47,160
Speaker 3: Now here's what I keep coming back to in my head.

536
00:31:47,240 --> 00:31:51,079
Speaker 1: So they didn't leave you unconscious on the ground they

537
00:31:51,119 --> 00:31:55,039
come in, or this being comes in, you're in the guard.

538
00:31:54,799 --> 00:31:56,440
Speaker 3: Shack and you pass out.

539
00:31:56,799 --> 00:32:00,440
Speaker 1: But as opposed to sort of leaving you there, at

540
00:32:00,440 --> 00:32:03,960
that point, you're incapacitated. You're not going to be interfering

541
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:07,160
with whatever they're trying to do at the launch facility,

542
00:32:07,559 --> 00:32:11,279
they take you aboard that craft, and again they could

543
00:32:11,279 --> 00:32:13,920
have simply incapacitated you and just you know, kind of

544
00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:16,759
gone about their business. Do you think you went from

545
00:32:16,799 --> 00:32:19,880
being an obstacle to being an opportunity.

546
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:23,799
Speaker 2: I don't know, you know, sometimes I look back at

547
00:32:23,799 --> 00:32:26,039
it and I wonder if if you know, I've heard

548
00:32:26,079 --> 00:32:31,039
of people dying or you know, from fear, and you know,

549
00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:35,039
the possibility I went into cardiac arrest and they had

550
00:32:35,039 --> 00:32:38,240
to revive me. Maybe the reason they took me aboard

551
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:41,319
the craft, But I don't know. That's just speculation. All

552
00:32:41,359 --> 00:32:43,880
I know is that I went from the guard shack

553
00:32:44,039 --> 00:32:47,559
to the to the craft and then back to the

554
00:32:47,559 --> 00:32:52,119
guard shack, you know, the guard check on the floor

555
00:32:53,279 --> 00:32:56,880
when the minute, and I wasn't incapacitated at that time,

556
00:32:57,000 --> 00:33:00,559
other than I was just communicated don't open your I

557
00:33:00,599 --> 00:33:03,319
could move, you know, I wasn't paralyzed or anything.

558
00:33:03,359 --> 00:33:04,400
Speaker 5: I'm just comfortable.

559
00:33:05,000 --> 00:33:07,759
Speaker 2: Then he said I'm leaving, he says, but don't open

560
00:33:07,799 --> 00:33:11,400
your eyes. He says, I'll be leaving and just stay

561
00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:15,000
there and don't open your eyes. So I complied. I

562
00:33:15,119 --> 00:33:18,640
just laid there for ten fifteen minutes and IM sure

563
00:33:18,799 --> 00:33:22,599
he was gone. I really didn't want to see him,

564
00:33:22,759 --> 00:33:26,640
you know, and I wanted to be sure he was gone.

565
00:33:26,640 --> 00:33:30,119
So then I got up, and now the sun's coming up.

566
00:33:30,119 --> 00:33:35,039
There's a ridge of mountains at the at the east

567
00:33:35,079 --> 00:33:42,319
of the missile complexes and meta that area, and I

568
00:33:42,519 --> 00:33:45,119
could see the ocean. It was it was beautiful because

569
00:33:45,119 --> 00:33:46,920
the sun was just coming up and I kind of

570
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:49,680
lit up the ocean. And then I looked down and

571
00:33:49,720 --> 00:33:54,400
I saw this little chipmunk and I felt, that's such

572
00:33:54,440 --> 00:33:56,720
a sense of love for that little chipmunk, like I

573
00:33:56,759 --> 00:33:59,640
was really connected to it. It was just like an

574
00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:03,759
epicy you know, we're all all here together, we're all

575
00:34:03,839 --> 00:34:06,920
living forms, and a little chuck monk looked at me,

576
00:34:07,319 --> 00:34:10,119
and I looked at it, and I got that feeling

577
00:34:10,159 --> 00:34:14,559
of connection, and it just scurried away. And then probably

578
00:34:15,599 --> 00:34:20,079
twenty minutes half hour later, my relief came. And now

579
00:34:20,119 --> 00:34:23,880
the memory's starting to fade, and I guess that's my suggestion.

580
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:29,000
So the guard came down the little connection road. I

581
00:34:29,039 --> 00:34:36,880
went up. I could have These were cab pickup trucks.

582
00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:40,079
They had the backseat to them with four doors, and

583
00:34:40,719 --> 00:34:43,639
I could have gotten inside, but I didn't want to.

584
00:34:43,679 --> 00:34:46,639
I got in the bed of the truck and I

585
00:34:46,679 --> 00:34:51,920
just leaned against the cab and I was well aware

586
00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:56,440
that something happened. But now the memory's fading, and I

587
00:34:56,519 --> 00:35:00,960
can't place. It just awareness something something went on, but

588
00:35:01,039 --> 00:35:03,639
I didn't know what. And the other guards that were

589
00:35:03,679 --> 00:35:06,440
riding back there, they kept calmenty how quiet it was,

590
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:10,199
because usually that's the jovial time when everybody finally off

591
00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:12,199
duty and you know, now we're going to go back

592
00:35:12,239 --> 00:35:16,280
and get some brakfast and there's some some joking and talking,

593
00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:18,280
and I just sat there quiet, and they said, what's

594
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:22,400
wrong with you, Bart, you know? And I just that's

595
00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:23,920
all right, just leave me alone, you know.

596
00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:28,159
Speaker 1: Sure, But the other people weren't in that same state

597
00:35:28,199 --> 00:35:30,960
of mind, so whatever happened likely just happened to you.

598
00:35:31,639 --> 00:35:33,960
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, And at.

599
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:36,400
Speaker 2: Least in that time, they could have happened another guard

600
00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:40,920
that Roberts, might have some other incidents that occurred to Vandenberg,

601
00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:42,880
But this was my night.

602
00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:43,559
Speaker 6: I guess.

603
00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:47,840
Speaker 1: How much how much time do you think passed between

604
00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:52,960
when this being left and you see this chipmunk? Is

605
00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:55,039
it a matter of minutes or is there some amount

606
00:35:55,039 --> 00:35:55,960
of time that passes?

607
00:35:56,480 --> 00:35:56,719
Speaker 5: Well?

608
00:35:56,760 --> 00:36:00,920
Speaker 2: I lay there for about ten fifty minutes that I

609
00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:06,360
got up. You know, notice how beautiful the scenery was

610
00:36:06,400 --> 00:36:09,039
with that ocean. It just impressed me that I saw

611
00:36:09,039 --> 00:36:12,000
the little chick monk sitting there. So that was the

612
00:36:12,119 --> 00:36:15,079
time lapse between the time I lay there with my

613
00:36:15,159 --> 00:36:18,880
eyes shut and decided to get up. So ten fifteen minutes.

614
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:21,239
It went long after the being.

615
00:36:21,079 --> 00:36:26,000
Speaker 1: Left, and after the being left, did the thought come

616
00:36:26,079 --> 00:36:28,360
to you, I'm going to get on the phone and

617
00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:32,599
tell tell my superiors what occurred? Or were you in such

618
00:36:32,639 --> 00:36:36,079
a state of shock that that was was.

619
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:38,960
Speaker 2: A state of uphoi. I saw that little chipmunk. I

620
00:36:39,039 --> 00:36:43,719
love that little chickmunk. I couldn't I couldn't explain how

621
00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:46,880
much I love that little chipmunk. I just felt deep,

622
00:36:46,960 --> 00:36:50,599
deep love for that little chipmunk, and I felt connected

623
00:36:50,639 --> 00:36:55,800
to it, like there's a spiritual connection between myself and

624
00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:56,920
this little chipmunk.

625
00:36:57,159 --> 00:37:01,079
Speaker 5: It was. It felt good. It just felt good and tired,

626
00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:02,679
really tired and exhausted.

627
00:37:04,519 --> 00:37:08,599
Speaker 1: It almost sort of sounds like after anesesia from a surgery.

628
00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:11,079
Speaker 3: You know, you're erephoric, you're.

629
00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:13,599
Speaker 1: Happy, feels like no time has gone by, and then

630
00:37:13,639 --> 00:37:16,599
after some period of time, your memory of all of

631
00:37:16,599 --> 00:37:17,320
that experience.

632
00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:20,119
Speaker 3: I mean, you certainly don't remember the surgery part. No.

633
00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:25,199
Speaker 2: I just felt tired, exhausted, couldn't quite remember what went on,

634
00:37:25,800 --> 00:37:29,519
And it kept by the time I got in the truck,

635
00:37:29,599 --> 00:37:33,519
I really couldn't remember much anything. I just was tired

636
00:37:33,519 --> 00:37:36,760
and exhausted, yet aware, you know what happened? Why do

637
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:40,400
I feel this way? Something happened. I was aware something happened,

638
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:45,159
but I couldn't detail it at all. Just knew something

639
00:37:45,199 --> 00:37:49,320
that happened, and so I just wanted to be by myself.

640
00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:52,239
I wanted to contemplate why did I feel that way?

641
00:37:53,199 --> 00:37:56,559
Speaker 1: Now two weeks later, the memory floods back all at once.

642
00:37:56,679 --> 00:38:00,719
Speaker 3: What was that like? Waking up and suddenly having the

643
00:38:00,719 --> 00:38:01,920
full experience return?

644
00:38:02,719 --> 00:38:07,719
Speaker 2: It was like watching the movie almost just from the

645
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:12,599
time I saw the shadow and the coming out of

646
00:38:12,639 --> 00:38:15,880
the fog until the time I was on the floor

647
00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:18,679
of the guard shacked looking at the little chipmunk. It

648
00:38:18,840 --> 00:38:22,320
just played out like a movie in three sections. There

649
00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:26,639
was the section where the figure came to the guard shack,

650
00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:31,559
the figure, the inside the craft, and now laying back

651
00:38:31,599 --> 00:38:34,360
on the floor of the guard shack seeing the chipmunk.

652
00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:38,800
That I'll just played right out and vivid detail. It

653
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:41,119
wasn't like like a dream.

654
00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:43,199
Speaker 5: State at all. It was very vivid. It was just.

655
00:38:44,039 --> 00:38:47,079
Speaker 2: And I looked over at my roommate because now I thought,

656
00:38:47,159 --> 00:38:51,639
oh God, something really happened. And I looked over my

657
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:55,000
roommate and he was asleep, because I wanted to right away.

658
00:38:55,039 --> 00:38:58,800
I wanted to say, hey, now I remember what happened.

659
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:02,360
Back then, I had this nagging feeling that something happened,

660
00:39:02,360 --> 00:39:06,039
but I couldn't remember what it was. But there was

661
00:39:06,079 --> 00:39:10,000
a nagging feeling like ever since. Between the incident and

662
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:13,280
the time I recalled it, there was this nagging feeling

663
00:39:13,400 --> 00:39:15,920
like something that happened, but what you know, I didn't know.

664
00:39:16,960 --> 00:39:19,400
And then it was like, oh, this is what happened.

665
00:39:19,400 --> 00:39:24,119
And I wanted to tell my roommate right away, but

666
00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:26,840
he was asleep. So I got up and I got

667
00:39:26,920 --> 00:39:32,719
dressed and got one near that breakfast is the prayer route,

668
00:39:33,119 --> 00:39:34,880
one of the early things. And I was walking to

669
00:39:34,920 --> 00:39:39,960
breakfast and I got to tell somebody about this, you know,

670
00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:42,159
I got to report this to hire authority.

671
00:39:43,159 --> 00:39:44,880
Speaker 5: And then two things with me.

672
00:39:45,079 --> 00:39:47,199
Speaker 2: One I thought, no, they're going to think I'm crazy,

673
00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:49,239
you know, how can I tell them?

674
00:39:49,639 --> 00:39:51,719
Speaker 5: And then it was like don't say.

675
00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:54,840
Speaker 2: It was like I had a command, You're not going

676
00:39:54,880 --> 00:39:56,000
to tell anybody about this.

677
00:39:56,840 --> 00:39:57,639
Speaker 5: You keep quiet.

678
00:39:58,599 --> 00:40:01,639
Speaker 2: And so I've I felt that now that I was

679
00:40:01,679 --> 00:40:05,000
aware that something had happened and that they had some

680
00:40:06,639 --> 00:40:09,760
telepathy with me. I felt, okay, I'm going to listen,

681
00:40:10,199 --> 00:40:13,719
I'm hearing this or feeling this, or I'm not going

682
00:40:13,760 --> 00:40:14,519
to say anything.

683
00:40:15,519 --> 00:40:18,760
Speaker 5: So I didn't. I just kept it to myself.

684
00:40:19,920 --> 00:40:21,840
Speaker 3: And for how long did you keep it to yourself?

685
00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:24,400
Speaker 5: Well, for a long time.

686
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:28,920
Speaker 2: First of all, when I was discharged, I had signed

687
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:34,159
a non disclosure agreement about anything I saw or heard

688
00:40:34,199 --> 00:40:36,360
on Vandenburg Air First Base, and that was that.

689
00:40:36,719 --> 00:40:38,880
Speaker 5: Twenty year window to it.

690
00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:44,920
Speaker 2: And second, anytime I felt like I wanted to tell somebody,

691
00:40:44,960 --> 00:40:48,119
it was like I had a pre command, no, don't

692
00:40:48,119 --> 00:40:53,840
say anything, like I was hypnotized in not saying anything

693
00:40:53,840 --> 00:40:57,320
about it. And then I had the threat of a

694
00:40:57,480 --> 00:41:01,800
non disclosure agreement which could beal time. So I just

695
00:41:02,119 --> 00:41:08,360
didn't say anything for twenty years until that expired. Yeah,

696
00:41:09,280 --> 00:41:11,199
go ahead, No, it's just.

697
00:41:13,280 --> 00:41:13,760
Speaker 5: That was it.

698
00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:17,280
Speaker 2: I just waited twenty years. I was aware all the time.

699
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:22,480
In fact, at that point I started reading science Isaac Asimov,

700
00:41:22,519 --> 00:41:23,880
which is good science fiction.

701
00:41:24,599 --> 00:41:25,440
Speaker 5: Anything I could.

702
00:41:25,320 --> 00:41:28,599
Speaker 2: Find on UFOs, I would look into it and see,

703
00:41:28,599 --> 00:41:31,519
if you know, try to find some sort of answer,

704
00:41:31,559 --> 00:41:36,320
because I full knowledge, you know, from the time it

705
00:41:36,320 --> 00:41:40,320
came back to me. That stayed with me. It never

706
00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:43,480
went away, and that was very disturbing to have that

707
00:41:43,519 --> 00:41:47,639
in my background and keeping him buried inside of me.

708
00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:51,880
It was so I'm very interested. I didn't have real

709
00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:55,639
strong UFO feelings or sense of that before I went

710
00:41:55,679 --> 00:41:58,440
to that happened. You know, I was aware of Betty

711
00:41:58,559 --> 00:42:02,079
and Marti Hill. I've read that, but I had no

712
00:42:02,199 --> 00:42:07,880
real thing about extraterrestans. It wasn't something that really interested

713
00:42:07,960 --> 00:42:10,440
in me. Now I wanted to know everything about him,

714
00:42:11,320 --> 00:42:15,840
and so, you know, there was a major Kiho he'd published.

715
00:42:15,840 --> 00:42:16,960
I think around that time.

716
00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:20,199
Speaker 5: I read his book and I wanted to know. I

717
00:42:20,239 --> 00:42:22,920
wanted to know what happened and who knew about it,

718
00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:26,039
And then Roswell came out.

719
00:42:27,199 --> 00:42:31,800
Speaker 2: I think that was probably the first, you know, public

720
00:42:33,239 --> 00:42:37,239
sense that there's other people of credibility that could come

721
00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:43,639
out with some information, and so I just carried it

722
00:42:43,639 --> 00:42:45,320
with me. That was all I could tell you. It

723
00:42:45,360 --> 00:42:48,119
wasn't comfortable carrying it with me, but I didn't want

724
00:42:48,159 --> 00:42:49,119
to tell anybody either.

725
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:55,000
Speaker 1: Do you remember the first person that you actually told

726
00:42:55,039 --> 00:42:56,719
about all of this twenty years later?

727
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:02,719
Speaker 2: The first one I told in detail with my friend

728
00:43:02,840 --> 00:43:06,400
Lonnie because she was a she had a DHD in

729
00:43:06,480 --> 00:43:15,679
psychology and she's actually regressive hypnosis with her specialty. And

730
00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:18,159
I actually thought maybe if I told her, she would

731
00:43:18,480 --> 00:43:20,360
want to do something to help me out, you know,

732
00:43:20,519 --> 00:43:24,000
maybe regress me. But she kind of didn't want to.

733
00:43:24,280 --> 00:43:30,519
She just felt that it is not she did past

734
00:43:30,599 --> 00:43:35,000
life experiencement. She wasn't into this type of thing. She

735
00:43:35,079 --> 00:43:39,800
just didn't feel qualified at the time, but she believed me.

736
00:43:39,920 --> 00:43:42,280
I mean, she's very good at body language.

737
00:43:42,280 --> 00:43:42,639
Speaker 5: She thought.

738
00:43:42,679 --> 00:43:46,440
Speaker 2: I was obviously quite disturbed when I was telling her

739
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:48,840
about it, and she said, well, I could tell you're

740
00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:51,480
disturbed just talking to me. So said, she said, I

741
00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:57,840
believe something happened to you. And she was probably the first,

742
00:43:59,199 --> 00:44:06,360
and that happened not too long after Whitney Streamer wrote

743
00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:08,000
this book. I think that was one of the things

744
00:44:08,000 --> 00:44:13,079
that kind of I read his communion, I guess with

745
00:44:13,159 --> 00:44:16,960
the name of this book, and his experience was similar

746
00:44:16,960 --> 00:44:19,719
in terms of the entities that he claimed to have seen,

747
00:44:20,719 --> 00:44:24,239
and so that brought it like I wanted to tell

748
00:44:24,320 --> 00:44:29,840
somebody at that point after I read Whitney Streemer's book.

749
00:44:30,679 --> 00:44:33,440
So I told Lonnie, I don't know how much later

750
00:44:33,559 --> 00:44:37,199
that was, but it was somewhere in the ninety thirty nineties.

751
00:44:37,239 --> 00:44:40,480
Speaker 3: That is what is to be a real relief.

752
00:44:40,519 --> 00:44:44,079
Speaker 2: I would think, oh, yeah, that was a great relief

753
00:44:44,119 --> 00:44:47,880
because first of all, that Lonnie believed that. She didn't

754
00:44:48,440 --> 00:44:51,480
go on to say that she believed by interpretation of

755
00:44:51,519 --> 00:44:55,920
the experience, but she believed that something definitely disturbing happened

756
00:44:55,920 --> 00:44:57,320
to me along the lines.

757
00:44:57,000 --> 00:44:58,079
Speaker 5: That I explained to her.

758
00:44:59,519 --> 00:45:03,639
Speaker 2: She's a trade psychologist, so she's going to jump to conclusion.

759
00:45:03,760 --> 00:45:08,199
She's just you know, except that I have a story

760
00:45:08,480 --> 00:45:11,679
that I believe by the story. Because I believe by

761
00:45:11,719 --> 00:45:14,920
the story, she's going to believe what I believe.

762
00:45:16,159 --> 00:45:19,079
Speaker 1: I want to talk about how the two the two

763
00:45:19,119 --> 00:45:22,039
of you found each other, So Robert, before Richard tells

764
00:45:22,119 --> 00:45:24,000
us how he came to you, I want to hear

765
00:45:24,119 --> 00:45:27,239
your side. I understand you were being interviewed on Coast

766
00:45:27,239 --> 00:45:29,639
to Coast AM, which of course is one of the

767
00:45:29,679 --> 00:45:33,840
most listened to late night radio shows in America, when

768
00:45:34,039 --> 00:45:36,760
a caller came on the line tell us about that.

769
00:45:38,880 --> 00:45:41,480
Speaker 4: I think Richard remembers it much better than I, but

770
00:45:41,599 --> 00:45:44,559
I think it was twenty eighteen. I was interviewed by

771
00:45:44,599 --> 00:45:48,960
George Nori on Coast to Coast and Richard indicated I

772
00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:52,639
was just talking about my nuclear weapons related research involving

773
00:45:52,679 --> 00:45:58,800
military veterans and who had UFO experiences. And Richard apparently

774
00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:03,559
called in was describing something that happened to him this incident.

775
00:46:03,960 --> 00:46:06,800
But I don't have any clear memory of that. Frankly,

776
00:46:06,880 --> 00:46:09,599
it's been too many years. So I'm seventy five now

777
00:46:09,639 --> 00:46:12,400
I'm starting to have memory issues. So that's about all

778
00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:13,320
I can contribute.

779
00:46:13,400 --> 00:46:16,840
Speaker 1: So I know that feeling. I'm a bit younger, but

780
00:46:16,880 --> 00:46:19,159
i'm having it. I can't remember what I did two

781
00:46:19,199 --> 00:46:21,400
days ago. So Richard, we'll hand it over to you.

782
00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:25,440
Tell us about you calling in to Coast to Coast.

783
00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:26,480
Speaker 5: Well, I was.

784
00:46:27,280 --> 00:46:30,719
Speaker 2: I listened to Coast Coast if they had something I

785
00:46:30,760 --> 00:46:34,000
was interested, and when it came to UFOs, I would

786
00:46:34,199 --> 00:46:38,079
stay on the program. And then Robert Hastings came on.

787
00:46:38,280 --> 00:46:41,599
I didn't know him at the time, but he had

788
00:46:41,639 --> 00:46:44,239
mentioned vanden Bergh and I thought, well, he'd be interested,

789
00:46:44,320 --> 00:46:49,519
so I called in and I started telling part of

790
00:46:49,559 --> 00:46:53,199
the story, and his comment, well, that's very interesting, that's

791
00:46:53,280 --> 00:46:57,159
very interesting. Then he asked me the question, and he says, well,

792
00:46:57,280 --> 00:47:01,280
do you recall having any lost time? And while I

793
00:47:01,320 --> 00:47:04,159
was answering that question, we were shut off the air,

794
00:47:04,239 --> 00:47:06,800
I mean, and I didn't know how to get back

795
00:47:06,840 --> 00:47:12,239
on at that point, and so the line was lost

796
00:47:12,320 --> 00:47:15,440
or shut down or whatever, and so I just let

797
00:47:15,519 --> 00:47:19,039
it go at that point. And so that would have

798
00:47:19,079 --> 00:47:23,920
been around twenty eighteen. I guess I was having done that,

799
00:47:24,039 --> 00:47:27,159
having gone out public with that. Now I started telling

800
00:47:27,159 --> 00:47:30,639
a few select friends that it had happened. That kind

801
00:47:30,639 --> 00:47:34,960
of set set the pathway for me to tell somebody

802
00:47:34,960 --> 00:47:38,880
else at that time. So I started. After Coast to Coast,

803
00:47:38,960 --> 00:47:44,880
I started telling other people what had happened to Lonnie

804
00:47:44,960 --> 00:47:49,199
before that, but that was a special situation because of

805
00:47:49,239 --> 00:47:54,199
her her status. But I started telling friends. I didn't

806
00:47:54,239 --> 00:47:57,159
want I didn't want the stigma. You know, that's kind

807
00:47:57,159 --> 00:47:59,639
of weird to start telling your friends, Oh, it was

808
00:47:59,639 --> 00:48:01,519
the board, the UFO, you know, what are they going

809
00:48:01,599 --> 00:48:04,840
to think of you? And so I but now I felt,

810
00:48:06,119 --> 00:48:08,639
I felt, oh, I set it on Coast to Coast

811
00:48:08,719 --> 00:48:11,599
and I might as well start telling people. So I did,

812
00:48:12,440 --> 00:48:14,440
and I started telling a few friends.

813
00:48:15,000 --> 00:48:17,239
Speaker 3: When do you decide to reach out to Robert?

814
00:48:19,519 --> 00:48:23,400
Speaker 2: Robert was being interviewed just not too long ago by

815
00:48:23,880 --> 00:48:28,559
Ross Colthart. Yeah, yeah, okay, I was watching. I watch

816
00:48:28,599 --> 00:48:30,320
a lot of YouTube, and I watch a lot of

817
00:48:30,320 --> 00:48:33,400
it comes back to the UFOs, I'll watch that. And

818
00:48:33,559 --> 00:48:39,400
Robert was being interviewed, and so he gave his email

819
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:44,159
address at the end of the our website. I don't

820
00:48:44,159 --> 00:48:49,960
know anyhow he gave a contact something going to contact,

821
00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:52,559
and so I thought, way he might be interested in

822
00:48:52,599 --> 00:48:55,920
this story. I didn't connect him with Coast to Coast

823
00:48:55,960 --> 00:48:59,760
in twenty eighteen, It just this was now. And so

824
00:49:00,000 --> 00:49:05,000
I contacted him, I think my email and said I

825
00:49:05,000 --> 00:49:09,400
had this experience and Robert said, well, can you write

826
00:49:09,400 --> 00:49:11,960
it up and send it to me? So I wrote

827
00:49:11,960 --> 00:49:14,360
it up and sent it to him and writing, and

828
00:49:14,400 --> 00:49:18,039
then he got back to me, and I said, well,

829
00:49:18,079 --> 00:49:22,000
this is fascinating and it fit right into his, you know,

830
00:49:22,079 --> 00:49:26,960
his research, and there he had one hundred and sixty

831
00:49:26,960 --> 00:49:29,159
eight cases and I'd be one hundred and sixty nine,

832
00:49:29,599 --> 00:49:33,920
and he wanted to know more about what was going on.

833
00:49:34,440 --> 00:49:36,320
You know what my experience was.

834
00:49:37,599 --> 00:49:40,960
Speaker 1: And Robert, you did some vetting of Richard correct when

835
00:49:41,000 --> 00:49:41,840
he reaches out to you.

836
00:49:43,280 --> 00:49:46,119
Speaker 4: I always asked the veterans who I interview for their

837
00:49:46,199 --> 00:49:50,000
d D two fourteen, which is their service record. It

838
00:49:50,119 --> 00:49:52,880
confirms basically when they were in the service and where

839
00:49:52,920 --> 00:49:55,840
they were stationed, so I can at least establish that

840
00:49:55,960 --> 00:49:58,559
it's not going to go into any detail about any

841
00:49:58,599 --> 00:50:03,320
anomalous experiences they had. But Richard was proactive and when

842
00:50:03,360 --> 00:50:06,519
he first contacted me via email, he did send me

843
00:50:06,599 --> 00:50:10,760
his DD two fourteen as an attachment. So he had

844
00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:13,159
either heard me say that to Ross Colthart, that I

845
00:50:13,239 --> 00:50:16,599
do do that, or he just took it upon himself

846
00:50:16,679 --> 00:50:18,639
thinking that I would probably ask him for it. So

847
00:50:18,679 --> 00:50:22,480
that's how we were introduced in October of twenty twenty five,

848
00:50:23,119 --> 00:50:28,639
and I was immediately impressed with the story. I contacted

849
00:50:28,679 --> 00:50:32,519
him my phone. We discussed it again and again, all

850
00:50:32,559 --> 00:50:35,840
sorts of details and so on, and I'm.

851
00:50:35,679 --> 00:50:37,599
Speaker 6: Absolutely sure he's telling the truth.

852
00:50:38,480 --> 00:50:41,519
Speaker 4: Of the one hundred and sixty nine military veterans that

853
00:50:41,559 --> 00:50:45,800
I've interviewed, eight Richard being the eight of them have

854
00:50:45,960 --> 00:50:49,920
described being abducted by non human entities in the course

855
00:50:50,119 --> 00:50:54,960
of the incident that they experienced involving nuclear weapons, and

856
00:50:55,039 --> 00:51:01,239
so you know, I am so glad that he's come forward.

857
00:51:01,320 --> 00:51:04,920
I think since I've ever interviewed. I find a specially

858
00:51:04,960 --> 00:51:10,239
interesting the telepathic communication that he was receiving after coming

859
00:51:10,280 --> 00:51:12,480
back to the guard check, where he was being told

860
00:51:12,480 --> 00:51:16,039
by this human appearing entity that there were multiple races

861
00:51:16,119 --> 00:51:19,280
working together, and he describes us in detail in the

862
00:51:19,280 --> 00:51:22,519
written statement that he sent me, and what he was

863
00:51:22,559 --> 00:51:25,519
being told was we value the earth, we will not

864
00:51:25,639 --> 00:51:29,199
let humans destroy the earth with a nuclear war, and

865
00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:31,119
if we have to, we will intervene.

866
00:51:31,599 --> 00:51:33,719
Speaker 6: And he was further told that.

867
00:51:33,639 --> 00:51:37,920
Speaker 4: These entities, these races that are working together, don't always

868
00:51:38,159 --> 00:51:39,280
agree or get along.

869
00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:42,639
Speaker 6: So this is very intriguing information.

870
00:51:43,800 --> 00:51:48,400
Speaker 4: As some of your viewers will know, I came out

871
00:51:48,440 --> 00:51:51,719
as an experience er as an abductee in twenty nineteen.

872
00:51:53,320 --> 00:51:57,400
I began investigating this in nineteen seventy three by seeking

873
00:51:57,480 --> 00:52:02,840
out and interviewing military personnel, and by nineteen eighty one,

874
00:52:02,880 --> 00:52:06,039
I felt I had enough of a case for the

875
00:52:06,079 --> 00:52:10,639
reality of all of this nuclear weapons being monitored and

876
00:52:10,760 --> 00:52:14,480
even interfered with by non human entities aboard UFOs.

877
00:52:14,880 --> 00:52:16,760
Speaker 6: I felt the public needed to know the facts.

878
00:52:16,840 --> 00:52:19,679
Speaker 4: I went out on the college lecture circuit and spoke

879
00:52:19,719 --> 00:52:23,519
it over five hundred schools over a thirty six year period.

880
00:52:24,119 --> 00:52:28,440
Colleges and universities in the United States. But in nineteen

881
00:52:28,480 --> 00:52:32,159
eighty eight, August of eighty eight, long story short, and

882
00:52:32,199 --> 00:52:35,719
we we discussed this on my previous appearance with you.

883
00:52:36,000 --> 00:52:38,920
But I was abducted, that's the long end the short

884
00:52:38,920 --> 00:52:43,960
of it, with two other people. And eventually, over about

885
00:52:44,000 --> 00:52:46,679
a twenty year period, I had five more of these

886
00:52:46,800 --> 00:52:50,800
encounters that can only be described as alien abductions. And

887
00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:52,679
so I know the reality of it. I know the

888
00:52:52,719 --> 00:53:00,480
reality of telepathic communication. And I knew, having spent so

889
00:53:00,519 --> 00:53:05,360
many years trying to establish credibility for the nuclear weapons cases,

890
00:53:05,400 --> 00:53:07,840
I knew that if I suddenly went public with my

891
00:53:08,159 --> 00:53:12,360
face to face encounters with these entities to say, in effect,

892
00:53:12,400 --> 00:53:14,800
I was an alien abductee, that I would lose a

893
00:53:14,800 --> 00:53:19,679
great deal of credibility in certain members of the public,

894
00:53:19,920 --> 00:53:22,719
large numbers, probably as well as the media. So I

895
00:53:22,800 --> 00:53:25,840
kept my mouth shut. I didn't talk about this until

896
00:53:25,840 --> 00:53:29,239
twenty nineteen. But it's real, it's part of the picture.

897
00:53:29,800 --> 00:53:32,679
And as I said, Richard is now the eighth Air

898
00:53:32,679 --> 00:53:38,639
Force veteran who's described the experience involving nuclear weapons, in

899
00:53:38,679 --> 00:53:41,639
his case, guarding a nuclear missile on our nuclear missile

900
00:53:42,639 --> 00:53:47,119
and also having an abduction, so it's part of the

901
00:53:47,159 --> 00:53:48,119
overall picture.

902
00:53:49,360 --> 00:53:52,559
Speaker 1: Now, Robert in September of nineteen sixty four at Vandenberg,

903
00:53:52,960 --> 00:53:55,800
so Richard has his experience with these beings who tell

904
00:53:55,840 --> 00:53:59,599
them that they need data from this missile and will

905
00:53:59,599 --> 00:54:03,239
not allow nuclear war as I understand that that same month,

906
00:54:03,360 --> 00:54:05,840
Bob Jacobs, who's also been on our show, films a

907
00:54:05,960 --> 00:54:09,239
UAP shooting what appears to be a directed energy weapon

908
00:54:09,360 --> 00:54:13,360
or laser or something at a dummy nuclear warhead. And

909
00:54:13,519 --> 00:54:16,079
at the time these two men didn't know each other,

910
00:54:16,840 --> 00:54:19,199
but am I correct that this was the same base,

911
00:54:19,599 --> 00:54:20,480
same month.

912
00:54:21,039 --> 00:54:23,760
Speaker 4: Same base, same month, and that was one of the

913
00:54:23,800 --> 00:54:26,199
intriguing things when Richard reached out to me, I went,

914
00:54:26,280 --> 00:54:28,920
holy cow, you know, that's the same month that Bob

915
00:54:29,000 --> 00:54:33,000
Jacobs was engaged in or involved in, the so called

916
00:54:33,039 --> 00:54:37,440
Big sur Ufo incident. It's been very well publicized, but

917
00:54:37,719 --> 00:54:41,760
for what members of the audience that haven't heard about it.

918
00:54:41,840 --> 00:54:45,159
At that time, Lieutenant Bob Jacobs was the head of

919
00:54:45,159 --> 00:54:49,599
a photographic team charged with tasked with i should say,

920
00:54:50,039 --> 00:54:54,159
filming missile launches from Vandenberg, various missile tests out over

921
00:54:54,199 --> 00:54:58,280
the Pacific and the remote missiles or the remote telescope

922
00:54:58,320 --> 00:55:02,360
site was that big up on the California coast, about

923
00:55:02,360 --> 00:55:08,440
one hundred miles north northwest of Vandenberg. That site allowed

924
00:55:08,440 --> 00:55:11,480
missiles to be filmed from a side view as they

925
00:55:11,480 --> 00:55:15,159
were going out into space, which is why they established

926
00:55:15,159 --> 00:55:19,760
that there. And in I've established it was September fifteenth

927
00:55:19,840 --> 00:55:25,519
of nineteen sixty four they filmed this atlasmissile launch. The

928
00:55:25,599 --> 00:55:28,079
film was sent back to the base and developed. A

929
00:55:28,199 --> 00:55:31,400
day later, Jacobs, Lieutenant Jacob Schta call from a man

930
00:55:31,480 --> 00:55:36,760
named Major Florenz Mansman, who was the base photo analyst

931
00:55:38,199 --> 00:55:41,440
who was analyzing the films and so on, and he said,

932
00:55:41,480 --> 00:55:43,639
you need to come to my office once you're back

933
00:55:43,679 --> 00:55:48,079
on base. And when Lieutenant Jacobs showed up at Mansman's office,

934
00:55:48,400 --> 00:55:51,360
there were two men in gray suits standing there or

935
00:55:51,440 --> 00:55:55,880
sitting there perhaps, and a movie projector, sixteen millimeter movie

936
00:55:55,960 --> 00:56:00,440
projector was set up, and Mansman said, Lieutenant Jacob's watch this,

937
00:56:00,639 --> 00:56:03,559
and then they screened the film that had been shot

938
00:56:03,599 --> 00:56:07,000
a day maybe it was two days prior, and Jacob

939
00:56:07,039 --> 00:56:11,679
sees the missile in the film frame and the dummy

940
00:56:11,719 --> 00:56:15,719
warhead separates from it. The missile drops away and as

941
00:56:15,840 --> 00:56:19,239
the warhead is flying down range, and we've estimated it

942
00:56:19,280 --> 00:56:22,519
was about four hundred miles from the telescope site. There

943
00:56:22,599 --> 00:56:28,519
was some trigonometry used to serve estimate these distances. While

944
00:56:28,559 --> 00:56:33,960
they're watching this dummy warhead flying in space leaving Vandenberg

945
00:56:34,400 --> 00:56:37,880
at this great distance, suddenly a disc shaped object with

946
00:56:37,920 --> 00:56:42,280
a dome flew into camera frame and suddenly circled the warhead,

947
00:56:42,360 --> 00:56:46,119
and at four different junctures shot what looked like probably

948
00:56:46,159 --> 00:56:49,760
a plasma beam of light. Lasers can't be seen in space,

949
00:56:50,559 --> 00:56:53,199
so it had to be a plasma discharge.

950
00:56:52,599 --> 00:56:53,880
Speaker 6: Of some kind, I'm guessing.

951
00:56:54,920 --> 00:56:58,559
Speaker 4: And suddenly the war had started tumbling after these four

952
00:56:58,920 --> 00:57:03,480
beams of light hit it, and Major Mansman said to

953
00:57:03,519 --> 00:57:06,599
Lieutenant Jacobs, you know what were you guys screwing around

954
00:57:06,679 --> 00:57:09,880
up there? And he said, no, sir, And he said,

955
00:57:09,920 --> 00:57:11,559
what do you think that is? And he said it

956
00:57:11,559 --> 00:57:15,119
looks like we got a UFO on film and Mansman said,

957
00:57:15,440 --> 00:57:18,639
Lieutenant Jacobs, you're never to say that again, and he

958
00:57:18,760 --> 00:57:21,719
was dismissed. Now, what he didn't know until years later

959
00:57:21,960 --> 00:57:25,440
was those two men in gray suits were CIA officers.

960
00:57:25,920 --> 00:57:29,599
As soon as he left the office, the film was

961
00:57:29,719 --> 00:57:34,719
clipped out off the real the key footage and confiscated

962
00:57:34,760 --> 00:57:39,639
by the CIA agents and they told Major Mansman this

963
00:57:39,760 --> 00:57:44,960
was now top secret. Jacobs didn't have that information, and

964
00:57:45,039 --> 00:57:47,719
so in nineteen eighty two, thinking that enough time had

965
00:57:47,760 --> 00:57:50,559
gone by, he wrote a magazine article about all of this,

966
00:57:51,159 --> 00:57:53,800
and suddenly he began getting death threats over the phone

967
00:57:54,639 --> 00:57:56,559
because of what had occurred.

968
00:57:56,599 --> 00:58:00,559
Speaker 6: Now. The last thing I'll briefly mention. In twenty two twenty.

969
00:58:00,280 --> 00:58:04,599
Speaker 4: Three, Lou Alizondo, who I know, confirmed for me that

970
00:58:04,840 --> 00:58:08,000
when he was with a tip, he watched the Big

971
00:58:08,039 --> 00:58:11,039
Surf film. It was on a DVD at that point,

972
00:58:11,199 --> 00:58:13,679
and he said it shows exactly what Bob Jacobs has

973
00:58:13,719 --> 00:58:16,719
claimed all these years, that it showed a UFO shooting

974
00:58:16,760 --> 00:58:18,480
down on a Dumby nuclear warhead.

975
00:58:19,159 --> 00:58:22,599
Speaker 1: Richard tell us what that first meeting was with, What

976
00:58:22,639 --> 00:58:25,440
that was like with Bob Jacobs, when you call him

977
00:58:25,519 --> 00:58:26,920
up or do you two meet in person?

978
00:58:27,000 --> 00:58:28,199
Speaker 3: How does that happen?

979
00:58:29,079 --> 00:58:29,400
Speaker 5: Robert?

980
00:58:29,760 --> 00:58:34,599
Speaker 2: Robert had given me Bob Jacobs as his email adjusted

981
00:58:34,880 --> 00:58:38,280
thinking he'd be interested because we were both at Vanderburgh

982
00:58:38,280 --> 00:58:41,960
at the same time. So I contacted Robert. We got

983
00:58:42,000 --> 00:58:45,480
together on the telephone and we had quite a conversation

984
00:58:45,679 --> 00:58:50,960
that they It was the same month, and so it

985
00:58:51,000 --> 00:58:54,440
could have been the same entities that were exploring the

986
00:58:54,519 --> 00:58:57,719
vase at the particular time. I told him that I

987
00:58:57,800 --> 00:59:00,719
had a similar experience, but it was much late, probably

988
00:59:00,760 --> 00:59:07,400
may have of sixty five, eight or nine months later,

989
00:59:08,719 --> 00:59:11,960
they were launching a Atlas missile, which would have been

990
00:59:12,000 --> 00:59:16,760
the same, probably the same project that.

991
00:59:17,320 --> 00:59:21,280
Speaker 5: Robert was or Bob was photographing.

992
00:59:21,320 --> 00:59:26,360
Speaker 2: But again it was a warhead, dummy warhead that they

993
00:59:26,400 --> 00:59:31,159
were testing the configuration of down the Pacific test range.

994
00:59:31,719 --> 00:59:38,360
And from where I was standing, which was straight behind

995
00:59:38,400 --> 00:59:42,400
the missile some distance away, and we're watching this missile

996
00:59:42,760 --> 00:59:46,239
and this yellow orb comes over and starts tracking the missile.

997
00:59:47,199 --> 00:59:49,920
It didn't move around it or anything. It just stayed

998
00:59:49,920 --> 00:59:52,159
with the missile. First of all, I thought I was

999
00:59:52,199 --> 00:59:54,320
going to have a fuel leak and it was going

1000
00:59:54,400 --> 00:59:58,239
to blow off, but it didn't. And then the first

1001
00:59:58,280 --> 01:00:01,239
stage dropped off and the yellow or kept following it,

1002
01:00:01,960 --> 01:00:03,800
so it couldn't have been a fuel leak. It had

1003
01:00:04,280 --> 01:00:07,239
so I'm not sure what it was, but it wasn't

1004
01:00:07,320 --> 01:00:10,239
a fuel eak, and it was something that tracked dismissile.

1005
01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:14,800
Found out later that was not an uncommon occurrence to

1006
01:00:14,880 --> 01:00:18,360
happen that UFOs would come over and track these nestles

1007
01:00:18,440 --> 01:00:23,639
during launch without intervening. So the next day I was

1008
01:00:23,679 --> 01:00:26,119
down at the launch site that was my post the

1009
01:00:26,159 --> 01:00:28,960
next day, and I asked the sergeant there.

1010
01:00:28,800 --> 01:00:30,559
Speaker 5: I said, what happened yesterday?

1011
01:00:31,440 --> 01:00:33,400
Speaker 2: Said, you know, if I were you, i'd keep my

1012
01:00:33,480 --> 01:00:36,960
mouth shut and talk about that. So I kept my

1013
01:00:37,000 --> 01:00:39,519
mouth shut and didn't talk about that one either.

1014
01:00:40,440 --> 01:00:45,000
Speaker 1: Sure, now, Robert, the message that Richard received that these

1015
01:00:45,039 --> 01:00:50,440
beings are gathering intelligence on our nuclear systems and tend

1016
01:00:50,440 --> 01:00:52,440
to intervene, does that, you.

1017
01:00:52,360 --> 01:00:54,000
Speaker 3: Know, if we were to go to nuclear war?

1018
01:00:54,119 --> 01:00:57,599
Speaker 1: Does that align with other witnesses across your two hundred

1019
01:00:57,599 --> 01:00:59,960
plus cases that you've reported that that sort of messa

1020
01:01:00,639 --> 01:01:02,400
consistent message, It seems.

1021
01:01:03,719 --> 01:01:03,960
Speaker 6: Well.

1022
01:01:04,119 --> 01:01:07,159
Speaker 4: The veterans that I've interviewed, of course, were at the

1023
01:01:07,199 --> 01:01:10,440
field level. Very few I can only think of a

1024
01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:13,360
handful were at the Pentagon. They were all in the

1025
01:01:13,400 --> 01:01:16,800
field at missile sites or weapons storage areas, so they

1026
01:01:16,800 --> 01:01:20,559
wouldn't have had that kind of information. But they've certainly

1027
01:01:20,599 --> 01:01:24,280
speculated to me over the years that first what they

1028
01:01:24,320 --> 01:01:29,519
saw was an extraterrestrial craft and the working hypothesis, which

1029
01:01:29,559 --> 01:01:33,760
I've shared since the seventies is that this surveillance of

1030
01:01:33,800 --> 01:01:37,800
our nuclear weapons and temporary interference from time to time

1031
01:01:38,559 --> 01:01:41,760
by the UFOs shutting down or even activating our missiles

1032
01:01:41,800 --> 01:01:45,559
and the Russians missiles, which are incidents that are now

1033
01:01:45,679 --> 01:01:50,079
documented and well established. I always consider that to be

1034
01:01:50,119 --> 01:01:53,199
a warning of some kind or a threat, them wagging

1035
01:01:53,239 --> 01:01:55,960
the finger at humans saying, you know, do not use

1036
01:01:56,000 --> 01:01:59,239
these weapons, get rid of the nuclear weapons. And what

1037
01:01:59,440 --> 01:02:03,880
Richard and Essence is confirming, he was telepathically told that

1038
01:02:03,920 --> 01:02:07,960
they planned interviewing to prevent a major nuclear war. So

1039
01:02:09,159 --> 01:02:12,039
you know, it just fits right in, and you know,

1040
01:02:12,119 --> 01:02:15,440
it's just intriguing to me, and I do believe as

1041
01:02:15,480 --> 01:02:18,360
I said, I think Richard's absolutely on the level. So

1042
01:02:18,480 --> 01:02:21,079
he's sort of got an inside glimpse, in effect through

1043
01:02:21,159 --> 01:02:25,599
his narrative of what many people, including myself if speculated

1044
01:02:25,639 --> 01:02:28,440
for decades about what's going on and what the motivation

1045
01:02:28,639 --> 01:02:32,280
is behind the UFO activity at nuclear weapon sites.

1046
01:02:33,079 --> 01:02:35,119
Speaker 3: Because we also have the Momstrom cases.

1047
01:02:35,159 --> 01:02:37,920
Speaker 1: So Robert Sallis, who's been on the show as well,

1048
01:02:38,199 --> 01:02:41,119
with the Echo flight, he had ten minute men missiles

1049
01:02:41,119 --> 01:02:46,400
going offline simultaneously Richard's experience predates Momstrom.

1050
01:02:46,440 --> 01:02:48,320
Speaker 3: I think what by about three years.

1051
01:02:48,360 --> 01:02:51,639
Speaker 1: So does that suggest there was kind of an escalation

1052
01:02:51,800 --> 01:02:55,679
of their engagement, in your opinion, with nuclear.

1053
01:02:55,320 --> 01:02:59,239
Speaker 4: Weapons, Yes, I think you know, it was just a

1054
01:02:59,280 --> 01:03:02,239
pattern of activity that began with the missiles in the

1055
01:03:02,280 --> 01:03:07,039
early sixties and continuing on through the decades, the seventies

1056
01:03:07,039 --> 01:03:10,679
and eighties. Many of the interviewees, the veterans, have told

1057
01:03:10,679 --> 01:03:14,639
me they were involved in incidents in the eighteen or

1058
01:03:14,679 --> 01:03:18,559
excuse me, nineteen eighties and nineteen nineties and two thousands.

1059
01:03:18,599 --> 01:03:23,199
So it's been an ongoing thing. Since you mentioned Bob Sallas.

1060
01:03:23,840 --> 01:03:26,519
I earlier mentioned that eight of the veterans whom I've

1061
01:03:26,559 --> 01:03:30,199
interviewed have said that they are also abductees. Many people

1062
01:03:30,280 --> 01:03:33,599
don't know that Bob Salas came out in twenty thirteen

1063
01:03:33,800 --> 01:03:37,280
and said that many years after his incident at Malmstrom

1064
01:03:37,360 --> 01:03:40,639
in sixty seven, he was in bed with his wife

1065
01:03:40,639 --> 01:03:43,760
in nineteen eighty five at their home in California, and

1066
01:03:43,880 --> 01:03:47,079
suddenly the room filled with a blue light, and he

1067
01:03:47,599 --> 01:03:50,480
sat up and saw a small figure enter the room,

1068
01:03:50,679 --> 01:03:53,559
and he was about to react and suddenly was paralyzed,

1069
01:03:54,239 --> 01:03:58,079
and he ultimately had he remembered that much. He ultimately

1070
01:03:58,159 --> 01:04:02,679
had hypnosis done where he apparently was taken by multiple

1071
01:04:02,840 --> 01:04:05,719
entities who had come into his bedroom, taken through a

1072
01:04:05,760 --> 01:04:09,639
closed window, which is one of the elements that many

1073
01:04:09,679 --> 01:04:13,760
abductees described being taken through closed doors and windows. I

1074
01:04:13,920 --> 01:04:16,800
myself was taken through a ceiling, but that's another story.

1075
01:04:18,400 --> 01:04:22,800
So and Sallas describes going on board a craft, which interestingly,

1076
01:04:22,920 --> 01:04:25,320
one of the things he described about the craft was

1077
01:04:26,199 --> 01:04:29,199
he at one point was examined by what he called

1078
01:04:29,280 --> 01:04:34,159
gray entities, and then following that he was led to

1079
01:04:34,320 --> 01:04:37,880
like a cordor and sat down on the bench. And

1080
01:04:37,960 --> 01:04:40,920
the bench, according to Bob Sallis, was molded right into

1081
01:04:40,920 --> 01:04:46,079
the wall, just exactly how Richard is describing. And so,

1082
01:04:46,400 --> 01:04:51,119
you know, anyway, whether you know the abduction phenomenon is

1083
01:04:51,280 --> 01:04:54,679
very controversial, but it's real. I can tell you it's real.

1084
01:04:54,880 --> 01:04:58,239
Richard can tell you it's real. Some small percentage of

1085
01:04:58,239 --> 01:05:02,079
the military veterans that I interviewed again to be redundant

1086
01:05:02,119 --> 01:05:04,960
and have described being abducted as well. So it's as

1087
01:05:05,039 --> 01:05:07,519
part of the overall picture. Whether people want to believe

1088
01:05:07,519 --> 01:05:07,920
it or not.

1089
01:05:09,599 --> 01:05:13,159
Speaker 1: I wonder sometimes this seems to be a thread in

1090
01:05:13,199 --> 01:05:17,559
abduction stories that I hear that you know that they

1091
01:05:18,079 --> 01:05:23,000
kind of apologize after the fact. So maybe they insert

1092
01:05:23,119 --> 01:05:25,559
something into their nose and you experience a lot of

1093
01:05:25,559 --> 01:05:27,679
pain and they're like, oh, sorry, we didn't mean to

1094
01:05:27,719 --> 01:05:31,679
do that, and then everything's okay, or in this instance,

1095
01:05:31,800 --> 01:05:36,880
this being terrifies Richard and then at the end apologizes

1096
01:05:37,000 --> 01:05:39,639
for it. You know, you would think that these entities

1097
01:05:39,920 --> 01:05:42,159
would know ahead of time how it's going to go,

1098
01:05:42,320 --> 01:05:44,280
that they're going to terrify the people, that if they

1099
01:05:44,639 --> 01:05:47,639
stick something you probe, up their nose or whatever to

1100
01:05:47,760 --> 01:05:51,000
put in an implant, that it's it's going to cause pain.

1101
01:05:51,320 --> 01:05:52,760
Speaker 3: I sometimes wonder.

1102
01:05:52,599 --> 01:05:57,800
Speaker 1: If, if if it's intentional, the fear and the trauma

1103
01:05:58,400 --> 01:06:02,599
is a necessary sort of part of the experience.

1104
01:06:02,639 --> 01:06:04,760
Speaker 3: Is that something that's ever crossed your mind.

1105
01:06:07,159 --> 01:06:11,880
Speaker 4: I relating to my own experiences, my memories of them

1106
01:06:11,960 --> 01:06:16,239
are fragmentary. However, I do recall on more than one

1107
01:06:16,239 --> 01:06:18,159
occasion interacting with one.

1108
01:06:18,119 --> 01:06:21,119
Speaker 6: Or more of what we would call Grace, and.

1109
01:06:22,800 --> 01:06:25,800
Speaker 4: The impression I had was basically, they were just going

1110
01:06:25,840 --> 01:06:28,199
about their business. They had a task to do, they

1111
01:06:28,199 --> 01:06:31,000
were going to do it. They didn't really care whether

1112
01:06:31,199 --> 01:06:38,000
I was being traumatized or whatever. But the handful of

1113
01:06:38,039 --> 01:06:43,440
telepathic messages that I recall receiving during those incidents, some

1114
01:06:43,679 --> 01:06:49,360
requiring hypnosis, others I had ready recollections of suddenly, for example,

1115
01:06:49,400 --> 01:06:53,360
being in a hotel room and having suddenly a distinct

1116
01:06:53,400 --> 01:06:55,880
impression that they were there, even though I couldn't see

1117
01:06:55,880 --> 01:06:58,440
them or sense them. But the message I had in

1118
01:06:58,440 --> 01:07:01,440
my mind was we are here for you. You have

1119
01:07:01,559 --> 01:07:05,480
met us before, and then the abduction process began. So

1120
01:07:05,519 --> 01:07:09,599
it's just very business like, very straightforward, no nonsense, not

1121
01:07:09,679 --> 01:07:12,880
a lot of elaboration of any kind. I don't recall

1122
01:07:12,960 --> 01:07:16,960
ever being apologized to for the trauma they, you know,

1123
01:07:17,000 --> 01:07:20,880
imposed on me. But so I think there's a variety

1124
01:07:21,119 --> 01:07:27,039
of experiences within a subset of experiences within the overall experience.

1125
01:07:27,159 --> 01:07:30,199
Speaker 6: Not everybody's reporting the same kind of thing, Richard.

1126
01:07:30,239 --> 01:07:35,519
Speaker 1: We spoke earlier about Bob Jacobs, well actually Robert talked

1127
01:07:35,960 --> 01:07:40,079
spoke about that, the threats and whatnot that that Bob

1128
01:07:40,159 --> 01:07:44,480
Jacobs underwent. You know, a mailbox was bombed. I mean,

1129
01:07:44,800 --> 01:07:47,800
it was just just horrible. I'm curious, since you have

1130
01:07:47,880 --> 01:07:51,760
gone public, have you had any kind of harassment or

1131
01:07:52,480 --> 01:07:54,360
odd phone calls or anything like that.

1132
01:07:55,679 --> 01:08:00,559
Speaker 2: No, no, no good. Maybe it's probably oh no, because

1133
01:08:00,599 --> 01:08:04,719
I was almost expecting. But sure, so I went public

1134
01:08:04,760 --> 01:08:08,119
with Robert. But nothing's so far, nothing's happened.

1135
01:08:08,559 --> 01:08:09,920
Speaker 6: Let me interject something there.

1136
01:08:10,239 --> 01:08:13,280
Speaker 4: When I tried to put him in touch with well,

1137
01:08:13,320 --> 01:08:15,960
when I tried to put Bob Jacobs and Bob Sallace

1138
01:08:16,039 --> 01:08:19,359
in touch with Richard, they told me that they emailed

1139
01:08:19,399 --> 01:08:22,520
him multiple times and at one at that point, he

1140
01:08:22,600 --> 01:08:25,560
had not received their emails. So apparently their emails were

1141
01:08:25,560 --> 01:08:29,760
being intercepted. So I eventually I conveyed that to Richard.

1142
01:08:30,439 --> 01:08:32,840
I've had problems like that for decades, so it was

1143
01:08:32,880 --> 01:08:36,079
no surprise. But anyway, once I learned that they had

1144
01:08:36,079 --> 01:08:39,359
attempted to reach him and someone was preventing their emails

1145
01:08:39,479 --> 01:08:43,439
reaching him, I got them together by telephone, and so

1146
01:08:43,479 --> 01:08:44,199
we moved ahead.

1147
01:08:44,199 --> 01:08:45,039
Speaker 6: From that point.

1148
01:08:45,359 --> 01:08:48,199
Speaker 1: Robert, between two thousand and three and two thousand and five,

1149
01:08:48,720 --> 01:08:52,399
five separate UAP incidents at Vandenberg that we know of

1150
01:08:52,479 --> 01:08:55,880
the triangular craft larger than the football field, a glowing

1151
01:08:55,920 --> 01:08:59,680
red square over missile defense sites. I mean, this is

1152
01:09:00,000 --> 01:09:03,760
seems to be like, over forty years after Richard's experience,

1153
01:09:03,800 --> 01:09:06,399
that this kind of stuff is happening. What does that

1154
01:09:07,399 --> 01:09:09,840
persistence of activity sort of.

1155
01:09:09,800 --> 01:09:13,039
Speaker 5: Tell you, you know, just I.

1156
01:09:12,960 --> 01:09:14,560
Speaker 6: Mean not knowing the answer to that.

1157
01:09:14,640 --> 01:09:17,560
Speaker 4: Really, all I can say is that whatever we're doing

1158
01:09:17,600 --> 01:09:21,520
in the way of possessing and threatening to use nuclear weapons,

1159
01:09:22,279 --> 01:09:25,640
Vladimir Putin is threatened to use his nuclear weapons. You know,

1160
01:09:25,720 --> 01:09:28,760
whoever they are in these crafts, they're still monitoring the

1161
01:09:28,800 --> 01:09:32,079
situation one way or another. They're still showing up at

1162
01:09:32,560 --> 01:09:37,680
various missile bases and other facilities relating to nuclear weapons.

1163
01:09:38,520 --> 01:09:43,359
You know, the thing has to be emphasized. I'm sure

1164
01:09:43,399 --> 01:09:45,680
I know one percent of the number of cases that

1165
01:09:45,720 --> 01:09:48,359
have occurred over the years. I mean, when I track

1166
01:09:48,439 --> 01:09:50,520
down a veteran, if I've heard something that they were

1167
01:09:50,560 --> 01:09:54,560
involved in, or they approached me as Richard, did you know,

1168
01:09:54,560 --> 01:09:58,159
it's catch as catch can. There's no systematic way of

1169
01:09:58,800 --> 01:10:03,760
investigating every site, every incident. Rather that's occurred at every

1170
01:10:03,800 --> 01:10:07,000
base chronologically over the years. I'm sure there's a great

1171
01:10:07,039 --> 01:10:09,960
many more cases than I will ever know about, but

1172
01:10:10,359 --> 01:10:13,560
it's ongoing. Obviously. Whatever we're up to, the entities are

1173
01:10:13,600 --> 01:10:16,479
still keeping an eye on us, and from time to time,

1174
01:10:16,520 --> 01:10:20,920
I'm sure still interfering with the weapons. Other than the

1175
01:10:21,000 --> 01:10:26,520
three people who've contacted me, including Richard, in the last year.

1176
01:10:27,479 --> 01:10:30,479
There was a several year gap where I didn't seek

1177
01:10:30,520 --> 01:10:33,520
anyone out and no one approached me. So I'm sure

1178
01:10:33,560 --> 01:10:35,760
things went on over the last decade that I will

1179
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:36,199
never know.

1180
01:10:36,199 --> 01:10:39,239
Speaker 1: About now, Robert, the UAP Disclosure Act has now been

1181
01:10:39,359 --> 01:10:43,800
blocked twice from the NDAA in the FY twenty twenty

1182
01:10:43,800 --> 01:10:47,840
six Defense Bill. As I understand from Congressman Eric Burlison,

1183
01:10:47,880 --> 01:10:53,560
they're still trying to kind of resuscitate the whole thing.

1184
01:10:54,199 --> 01:10:59,960
And I'm curious, how important do you think, especially given

1185
01:11:00,119 --> 01:11:03,479
Richard's story and what you've heard from so many of

1186
01:11:03,479 --> 01:11:06,439
these other Air Force personnel that dealt with the nation's

1187
01:11:06,600 --> 01:11:09,479
nuclear weapons, how important do you think it is for

1188
01:11:09,600 --> 01:11:15,319
Congress to address the fact that UAP are clearly tampering

1189
01:11:15,359 --> 01:11:18,840
with our nuclear deterrent And if a member of Congress

1190
01:11:19,039 --> 01:11:21,560
happens to be watching this show now, what would be

1191
01:11:22,000 --> 01:11:23,239
your message to that person.

1192
01:11:24,239 --> 01:11:28,600
Speaker 4: Well, obviously it's a real situation, it's an ongoing situation.

1193
01:11:29,239 --> 01:11:33,119
I think it's self evidently important that Congress investigate the

1194
01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:38,159
investigate all of this as much as possible. But realistically,

1195
01:11:38,199 --> 01:11:42,319
I know the history of the in particular CIA's influence

1196
01:11:42,399 --> 01:11:46,479
on Congress in terms of suppressing this information over the years.

1197
01:11:46,800 --> 01:11:49,399
I don't think that's changed. I think behind the scenes,

1198
01:11:50,119 --> 01:11:53,119
the people who have harassed Dave Grush, for example, after

1199
01:11:53,159 --> 01:11:56,880
he's testified about the very dramatic things he knew about,

1200
01:11:58,039 --> 01:12:01,039
there are people within government now that don't want this

1201
01:12:01,119 --> 01:12:06,039
to happen. They're postponing the inevitable, in my opinion, and

1202
01:12:06,079 --> 01:12:10,399
I think they have a certain degree of influence, probably

1203
01:12:10,399 --> 01:12:15,039
a great degree of influence on Congress, and so I

1204
01:12:15,039 --> 01:12:17,439
don't think any of us should really expect a dramatic

1205
01:12:17,439 --> 01:12:22,119
breakthrough anytime soon. On the other hand, Trump is so

1206
01:12:23,039 --> 01:12:27,159
unorthodox in the way he approaches things. If anything's going

1207
01:12:27,239 --> 01:12:30,520
to suddenly break open and there's going to be any

1208
01:12:30,600 --> 01:12:36,199
kind of public acknowledgement of the reality of UAPs and nhi's,

1209
01:12:37,560 --> 01:12:39,039
it could be Trump who does it.

1210
01:12:39,079 --> 01:12:41,479
Speaker 6: But who knows. I'm just speculating.

1211
01:12:41,560 --> 01:12:45,000
Speaker 1: Obviously, Richard, you've kept the story to yourself for the

1212
01:12:45,039 --> 01:12:46,439
better part of sixty years.

1213
01:12:46,439 --> 01:12:48,000
Speaker 3: You've now told it publicly.

1214
01:12:48,399 --> 01:12:50,439
Speaker 1: What do you want people to take away from what

1215
01:12:50,600 --> 01:12:54,399
happened to you on that foggy morning in nineteen sixty four.

1216
01:12:55,600 --> 01:13:00,880
Speaker 2: Well, my particular is just another piece of the puzzles

1217
01:13:00,920 --> 01:13:04,760
since at number one sixty nine and Robert still research

1218
01:13:04,840 --> 01:13:09,920
and you know, one of the big problems that I

1219
01:13:10,000 --> 01:13:13,359
can't verify what I've I can only go by my character,

1220
01:13:14,079 --> 01:13:16,359
and I think I've had pretty good character. I've been

1221
01:13:16,520 --> 01:13:20,640
a registered nurse for over forty years. I was at

1222
01:13:20,720 --> 01:13:25,119
the nursing at the college level, so most of my friends,

1223
01:13:25,119 --> 01:13:28,439
and Robert and his vetting have contacted several of my

1224
01:13:28,640 --> 01:13:33,279
friends that will vouch you that I'm a pretty honest guy,

1225
01:13:33,319 --> 01:13:36,399
that I not climb, you know, not inclined to make

1226
01:13:36,479 --> 01:13:40,760
up stories. But the problem is I can't verify that

1227
01:13:40,840 --> 01:13:45,239
this actually happened to me, and so I just wanted

1228
01:13:45,359 --> 01:13:48,319
to be part of the big picture if they can

1229
01:13:48,439 --> 01:13:51,399
just you know, I was thinking the other day with AI,

1230
01:13:52,039 --> 01:13:56,399
artificial intelligence, they need to feed all these stories into

1231
01:13:56,479 --> 01:14:00,680
one AI program and find the similarity and come up

1232
01:14:00,720 --> 01:14:04,920
with a more complete picture. And I'm sure now that

1233
01:14:04,960 --> 01:14:07,760
we have that capability, I think that's something that needs

1234
01:14:07,760 --> 01:14:11,199
to be done. And you know, mine will just be

1235
01:14:11,279 --> 01:14:13,479
one piece of the puzzle, that's all I expect it

1236
01:14:13,520 --> 01:14:16,520
to be. But it's an important piece in my mind,

1237
01:14:16,520 --> 01:14:20,479
an important piece of the puzzle. I was very aware

1238
01:14:20,560 --> 01:14:26,600
of Robert Solace's incident dured three years after mine, and

1239
01:14:26,840 --> 01:14:30,000
and I did get hold of him thanks to Bob

1240
01:14:31,119 --> 01:14:34,479
or Robert and uh, you know, we had we had

1241
01:14:34,520 --> 01:14:37,960
a little talk on that and it just all fits together.

1242
01:14:38,039 --> 01:14:42,439
And I think between all the stories out there, there's

1243
01:14:42,560 --> 01:14:44,960
a lot that are not credible that need to be

1244
01:14:45,039 --> 01:14:45,479
thrown up.

1245
01:14:45,479 --> 01:14:46,840
Speaker 5: But there's a there's a lake.

1246
01:14:47,600 --> 01:14:50,960
Speaker 2: I think a I will establish that lake and come

1247
01:14:51,039 --> 01:14:54,479
up with a very accurate picture of what's really going on,

1248
01:14:54,720 --> 01:14:58,720
and that may be outside of converse or outside the government,

1249
01:14:58,760 --> 01:15:03,000
because that can be done by by private corporation or

1250
01:15:03,000 --> 01:15:07,119
private It'd be interesting if we can just collate all

1251
01:15:07,199 --> 01:15:09,359
this information come up with a big picture.

1252
01:15:10,359 --> 01:15:12,199
Speaker 3: I think it's it's just a matter of time.

1253
01:15:12,239 --> 01:15:17,279
Speaker 1: I read recently that the current models of AI were

1254
01:15:17,439 --> 01:15:20,319
actually written by the previous model of AI.

1255
01:15:20,600 --> 01:15:23,359
Speaker 3: So AI is writing.

1256
01:15:23,199 --> 01:15:27,199
Speaker 1: The next version in full without without a human sitting

1257
01:15:27,199 --> 01:15:30,079
there programming it. So if it's doing that, that wouldn't

1258
01:15:30,199 --> 01:15:32,920
surprise me at all. So, Robert, what is next for you?

1259
01:15:33,000 --> 01:15:35,079
And where can people find your books?

1260
01:15:37,159 --> 01:15:40,319
Speaker 4: My first book, UFOs and Nukes is available at Amazon,

1261
01:15:40,840 --> 01:15:42,920
as is the second book that I co wrote with

1262
01:15:43,000 --> 01:15:46,560
Bob Jacobs where we came out as experiencers.

1263
01:15:46,640 --> 01:15:47,760
Speaker 6: That's called confession.

1264
01:15:49,039 --> 01:15:52,319
Speaker 4: I you know, just playing it by your day to day.

1265
01:15:52,560 --> 01:15:54,920
I'm trying to work on a third book that deals

1266
01:15:54,960 --> 01:16:01,199
with non human entity contact with humans slogan, but we'll see.

1267
01:16:01,239 --> 01:16:03,920
That's my main project for twenty twenty six to try

1268
01:16:03,960 --> 01:16:04,399
to get.

1269
01:16:04,199 --> 01:16:05,000
Speaker 6: This book done.

1270
01:16:05,640 --> 01:16:08,800
Speaker 3: Awesome, Well, thanks to you both for coming on the show.

1271
01:16:08,840 --> 01:16:11,760
Speaker 1: Really appreciate it. Richard, so nice to meet you. Robert,

1272
01:16:11,880 --> 01:16:14,079
always good to see you and hear what you're up to.

1273
01:16:14,720 --> 01:16:18,920
This has just really been fantastic. I appreciate really the

1274
01:16:18,960 --> 01:16:22,439
bravery of you both. This is certainly not an easy

1275
01:16:22,720 --> 01:16:26,439
topic to talk about without some kind of negative consequence.

1276
01:16:26,479 --> 01:16:29,119
Speaker 3: That seems so especially you, Robert.

1277
01:16:29,920 --> 01:16:32,560
Speaker 1: I've told many many a friend this that I do

1278
01:16:32,640 --> 01:16:35,359
not think we would be where we are at in

1279
01:16:35,479 --> 01:16:39,680
this disclosure conversation had it not been for your work.

1280
01:16:40,000 --> 01:16:41,560
Speaker 3: So my hat is off.

1281
01:16:41,399 --> 01:16:43,239
Speaker 1: To both of you and Richard, thank you, sir for

1282
01:16:43,920 --> 01:16:46,319
your service, and look forward to having you both back

1283
01:16:46,359 --> 01:16:47,199
on the show at some point.

1284
01:16:48,199 --> 01:16:49,720
Speaker 5: Thank you, Thank you,