Speaker 1: I want to welcome everyone back to the Peaking Yanda Show.
Speaker 1: Thomas seven seven seven is back with us. How are
Speaker 1: you doing, Thomas, I do it well. Thanks for hosting me. Yes,
Speaker 1: we are going to take a break from the Continental
Speaker 1: Philosophy series and talk about something that's in the news.
Speaker 1: New York Post is reporting on it. I have their
Speaker 1: article pulled up from yesterday the infamous picture from World
Speaker 1: War Two entitled the Last jew of Anitsia. It seems
Speaker 1: that through AI and facial recognition, they have figured out
Speaker 1: the name of the officer from the famous picture. I
Speaker 1: will share a screen on the picture for those who
Speaker 1: don't who aren't familiar with the picture, well they're familiar
Speaker 1: with it, they just don't know exactly what I'm talking about.
Speaker 1: So there is the picture, and it seems that the
Speaker 1: the shooter has been identified as jacobis Onen, a teacher
Speaker 1: born in Germany in nineteen o six. And yeah, I
Speaker 1: contacted you about this this morning, and you'd made the
Speaker 1: suggestion that we might talk about this and should lead
Speaker 1: into some wider revelations about the war that most people
Speaker 1: either don't know or don't realize. So I'm going to
Speaker 1: hand it over to you. Thomas.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think a lot of people don't. Well, first,
Speaker 2: there was a bunch of people on I wouldn't call
Speaker 2: it the revision aside because they're not people who are
Speaker 2: serious into historical research. But people are sympathetic the heterotopic
Speaker 2: viewpoint saying this was a fake photo. It was not fake,
Speaker 2: it's real. And other people are saying why would they
Speaker 2: take photographs? Well, all kinds of reasons. If you were
Speaker 2: an Eindsets group commander, you filed an after action report,
Speaker 2: this was your mandate. You need to produce a body count.
Speaker 2: And there was also men in the field who take
Speaker 2: snapshots as souvenirs. Okay, if people think this is outlandish,
Speaker 2: I'm not passing judgment one or the other. I've seen
Speaker 2: photographs of guys in Vietnam, American soldiers literally holding up
Speaker 2: severed heads like for fun. Okay, I mean again, I'm
Speaker 2: not feigning moral outrage over that. But this idea that
Speaker 2: it's somehow unheard of for photographs to be taken of
Speaker 2: questionable activity or the shooting of non combatants, that's very naive.
Speaker 2: But also what's going on in that photo is very
Speaker 2: above board. It's not the kind of thing that was
Speaker 2: being shown in movie houses in Berlin or Hamburg. But
Speaker 2: it was a major component of operational doctrine in theater,
Speaker 2: and that's characteristic of modern war. I include a whole
Speaker 2: chapter on this in my manuscript that I'm writing. I'm
Speaker 2: not gonna try and turn this into a show piece
Speaker 2: for my own work product, but I think it's conceptually relevant.
Speaker 2: There's this book by Christopher Browning, who I used to
Speaker 2: have a lot more respect for, but then he testified
Speaker 2: against David Irving, which I thought was really grimy. But
Speaker 2: he wrote a good book called Ordinary Men. It was
Speaker 2: about this. It was about Organum Politz Battalion one zero
Speaker 2: one in Yolt's Foul of Poland. I'm sure I'm butchering
Speaker 2: that pronunciation. And they were an einsts group battalion, and
Speaker 2: he talked to a bunch of veterans and who were
Speaker 2: pretty candid about what went on. I made a lot
Speaker 2: of demanded anonymity, which is understandable. But you know, I
Speaker 2: juxtaposed Brownings the testimony of these men and his original
Speaker 2: research with the Senate Subcommittee hearings, among other things, on
Speaker 2: the mass occurred in MELI four. This is something that
Speaker 2: happens in modern war, and in the twentieth century when
Speaker 2: war became when ideological imperatives became the causes belly of
Speaker 2: scale conflict. You know, the categorical annihilation of human beings
Speaker 2: became a military imperative. That's just a fact. This is
Speaker 2: why the Holocaust religion is bullshit. It's not because things
Speaker 2: like in that picture didn't happen. It's because that's the
Speaker 2: face of modern wark and this idea that the Germans
Speaker 2: are the epitome of evil and they hate Jewish people
Speaker 2: for no reason, and this is a case of the
Speaker 2: martyrdom of an entire race, and this is something that's
Speaker 2: never happened before. Since that's what's a bullshit about it.
Speaker 2: Not this didn't happen, it's the emphasis on it in
Speaker 2: the way that it's characterized, is no centrality of it,
Speaker 2: and the bigoted chauvinism of it. That's what's problematic. You know,
Speaker 2: I'll add too. You know, people have this idea, I
Speaker 2: think from the movies or something, that Meli in Vietnam
Speaker 2: was the secret and then you know, the civilian press
Speaker 2: got wind of it or something, or some brave witness,
Speaker 2: you know, like the guys in that uh Huey Chopper,
Speaker 2: who intervened, you know, went public about it. This was
Speaker 2: published in Stars and Strikes. They said, this was a
Speaker 2: great victory. Look at this great body count at me lie,
Speaker 2: you know, go America Division. This wasn't a secret. That
Speaker 2: was a free fire zone. These people were fair targets.
Speaker 2: You know, anybody in a free fire zone in Vietnam,
Speaker 2: regardless of age, sex, overall health, they're an enemy. You
Speaker 2: can kill them, and you're encouraged to kill them. You know,
Speaker 2: that's not any different. I mean, I'd argue that it
Speaker 2: was a lot more in humane what the Pentagon was doing.
Speaker 2: Contra okw no, but no, no regular army guys in
Speaker 2: the German Army you got drafted or being ordered to
Speaker 2: do this kind of stuff. You know, you you were,
Speaker 2: you were asked to volunteer. And if you couldn't handle
Speaker 2: it and you refuse to do it, no one was
Speaker 2: your shot. You're getting locked in prison, your career was over.
Speaker 2: And if you were an enlisted man, you you'd probably
Speaker 2: be looked at as a coward and a punk. But
Speaker 2: no one's getting course marceled for this, you know. In contrast,
Speaker 2: and you literally had some nineteen year old draft d
Speaker 2: being told you had to waste the women, kids and
Speaker 2: oldsters in a free fire zone. That's really really messed up,
Speaker 2: you know. And I mean, I'm sure that there's gonna
Speaker 2: be patriotypes who say, I'm like some big liberal or
Speaker 2: something we're saying that or whatever. But that's a fact,
Speaker 2: you know. And it's also people don't they don't really
Speaker 2: understand what they don't really understand the third right and structurally,
Speaker 2: if you want to understand that Ross and kreeg es.
Speaker 2: But I mean, beyond the fact that Ross and Creek
Speaker 2: was part of like an overall policy imperative that framed
Speaker 2: this mass campaign that was Barbara's, there was this weird
Speaker 2: institutional agonism between between the army the SS. Then there
Speaker 2: was a the Gestapo actually was the legacy organization of
Speaker 2: the Prussian Secret police, and they always resented being under
Speaker 2: the number of the SS. So Himmler's notion was he
Speaker 2: established the SD the cigarette fenced, which was technically the
Speaker 2: SS's internal security force. But they had trouble establishing a
Speaker 2: mandate because they were resented by the police and by
Speaker 2: the intelligence apparatus, which was the OBVER, which was horribly compromised.
Speaker 2: But that's a whole other subject from Heuter. So the
Speaker 2: SD didn't really get its institutional mandate until Barbarossa. And
Speaker 2: then when the race were kicked off in Earnest and
Speaker 2: the r s h A was the umbrella organization and
Speaker 2: the army, even guys who were pretty dogmatic National Socialists
Speaker 2: in the General Officer Corps, they said an uncertain terms,
Speaker 2: you're not gonna you're not gonna involve my men in
Speaker 2: this bullshit. You know, you're you're not gonna have my
Speaker 2: people doing this kind of dirty work. And I don't
Speaker 2: think that's particularly admirable. Okay, It's like, look, if we're
Speaker 2: going to war, you're saying you're gonna wash your hands.
Speaker 2: But like these guys got to do it because that's
Speaker 2: what's coded into their into their mandate as policemen or
Speaker 2: whatever or you know, as uh something less than soldiers.
Speaker 2: I take exception to that, you know, and not just
Speaker 2: playing devil's advocate like I mean, I actually find that objectionable.
Speaker 2: And to be clear too, the man in that photograph
Speaker 2: he was later KI eight because a lot of Einstein's
Speaker 2: group officers and enlisted got killed in hostile action because
Speaker 2: in addition to ethnic cleansing and categorically annihilating Eastern Jewelry,
Speaker 2: then cleansing other racial enemies. They they were on anti
Speaker 2: partisan duty, you know. So these guys weren't just doing
Speaker 2: really kind of horrible things, you know again like warriors. Hell,
Speaker 2: what they did is no worse and no better than
Speaker 2: what the Allies did or their Japanese coliberance did. But
Speaker 2: you know, on top of the stress of this kind
Speaker 2: of activity, they were fighting this really brutal part, you know,
Speaker 2: anti partisan war, and a lot of them were dying.
Speaker 2: You know, so these guys weren't These guys were every
Speaker 2: bit as much soldiers as there as their counterparts. And
Speaker 2: in the here and the assess and uh, this also
Speaker 2: plays under the fact there's this mythology and people have
Speaker 2: this idea again a plant ushed you know, they claim, oh,
Speaker 2: the Nazis were evil because they, like Hitler, wanted to
Speaker 2: quote like wipe out all Slavs or something like. There
Speaker 2: was as a dejire, there was no category of slav
Speaker 2: in the Third Reich. You know, there were another Nuremberg Codes. Obviously,
Speaker 2: Jews are stripped of all political and civil rights beyond that,
Speaker 2: you know, Uh, non Jewish Auslanders were treated like anybody else,
Speaker 2: assuming you they weren't derived of a population that was
Speaker 2: an enemy of the Reich like Poles, you know, and
Speaker 2: there was a race war under way between the Germans
Speaker 2: and the Poles. And despite you know, I I've we've
Speaker 2: recorded Kanya on this, the Poles were ethnically cleansing Germans, Jews,
Speaker 2: Ruthenians and anybody else they didn't like, and they were
Speaker 2: particularly singling out Germans. They slaughtered something like thirteen thousand
Speaker 2: of them. You know, this was the cause of belly
Speaker 2: of the nineteen thirty nine war. Okay, So this idea
Speaker 2: that one day Adolf Hitler or Rhyodhydrich or you know,
Speaker 2: Hans Frank just like randomly decided he hated Slavs, that's asmine.
Speaker 2: You know, it's such that such that that was like
Speaker 2: a real prejudice. There was a habsburg of Austrian I mean, granted, yeah,
Speaker 2: he in a lot of ways he thought like a
Speaker 2: Prussian in terms of his historical sensibility and things. But
Speaker 2: you know, it wasn't it wasn't Austrians and Bavarians who
Speaker 2: who had this uh kind of enduring prejudice against the Poles.
Speaker 2: I mean that was like a that was a Prussian thing,
Speaker 2: you know, so it uh, but you know, the entire
Speaker 2: rays on detra national socialism aside, I mean in power
Speaker 2: political terms, you know, the internal situation and trying to
Speaker 2: curate cultural palagenesis and all, you know, negotiate the future
Speaker 2: shock of midernity. I mean, yeah, obviously that is that
Speaker 2: was essential aspects of the constellation of values and conceptual
Speaker 2: factors that made a national socialism. But the grand historical
Speaker 2: mission and national socialism was for Europe to survive, it
Speaker 2: had to become a superpower, you know, and it had
Speaker 2: to consolidate and unite. And Europe's an indefensible peninsula. It's
Speaker 2: this tiny little sliver basically on this giant land mass
Speaker 2: of Eurasia. And the view of people like Hilary, of
Speaker 2: people like Rosenberg, of people like Max fun Shooting and Richter,
Speaker 2: you know, the Alconfert who died in you know, a munit.
Speaker 2: This was actually pretty conventional geopolitics, geopolitical theory, and the
Speaker 2: understanding was that the heartland of Indo Europeans or i
Speaker 2: mean the Aryan race if you want to be less
Speaker 2: delicate about it. You know, it was the Cacassus, which
Speaker 2: is true, and out from that world island, you know,
Speaker 2: civilizations spread, you know, carried by these Bronze Age conquerors.
Speaker 2: Over time, though the Barbarian East and particularly the Mongols
Speaker 2: pushed everybody out to the periphery, including the White Race,
Speaker 2: and thus you had Europe. You know, that's basically the
Speaker 2: Garrison Peninsula where Europe fought off the Orient. You know,
Speaker 2: but it's been fighting this desperate kind of rear guard action,
Speaker 2: position of vulnerability for a millennia. That's why one of
Speaker 2: my very favorite books is UH, the History of the
Speaker 2: Mongols by Michael Proudon. That was that was required reading
Speaker 2: at the s. S. Junker Seul and Yak and Piper.
Speaker 2: He wrote his UH. He wrote his thesis to graduate
Speaker 2: on the doctrine of Yasa. Yasa was the oral law
Speaker 2: the Mongols. It was, and it was it was. It
Speaker 2: was very much completed and the complexity of it was
Speaker 2: UH was curated under Genghis Khan. It's one part military doctrine,
Speaker 2: it's one part moral law. It's one part you know,
Speaker 2: a statement of the rights between the casts within Mongol society.
Speaker 2: It's and it's fascinating because this was all this was
Speaker 2: all part of an oral tradition. So any Mongol warrior
Speaker 2: like any and had full status owing to his capacity
Speaker 2: to bear arms and ride as a horseman. He hadn't
Speaker 2: memorized this the entire body of Mongol law essentially. But
Speaker 2: Piper wrote about Yasa because any SS officer candidate, he
Speaker 2: was inculcated with a deep understanding of the Mongol Empire
Speaker 2: and the Mongols as a people for two reasons. The
Speaker 2: similar said, the reason we are here in Europe is
Speaker 2: because of the empire created by these people, which was
Speaker 2: the biggest empire the world has ever known. And in
Speaker 2: Himmler's estimation, the Mongols were the greatest martial race that
Speaker 2: ever existed. And essentially, you know the role of an
Speaker 2: SS officer is going to be the lead European manhood
Speaker 2: against the descendants of the step Mongols to reconquer what
Speaker 2: was the Indo European homeland. And uh to do that,
Speaker 2: not only does European manhood and the new warrior Yaleman
Speaker 2: re which is going to lead the SS that, not
Speaker 2: only do they need to understand the kind of ancient
Speaker 2: heritage related to the soil that is being reconquered. But
Speaker 2: to fight in that environment, that to fight a total
Speaker 2: race war, you've got to understand the what animated warrior
Speaker 2: races like the Mongols, and the European man has to
Speaker 2: come to emulate that and curate that tendency within himself.
Speaker 2: So the idea was as when Czechoslovakia fell apart, and
Speaker 2: made no mistake, it did fall apart. You know, I
Speaker 2: was writing some short from the other day, this idea
Speaker 2: that Hitler was some sorcerer who could make Czechoslovakia failed
Speaker 2: state or through Ledrid mean to see everybody into appeasing him.
Speaker 2: I mean that that's that's an infantile way of looking
Speaker 2: at human affairs, vague power political ones. But you know,
Speaker 2: Bennett Hitler had a particular acts to grind with Bennie,
Speaker 2: who was a real, very perfect and weasel like individual.
Speaker 2: But you know, when Slovakia succeeded, that was the nail
Speaker 2: in the coffin of the contrivance with Czechoslovakia. And of
Speaker 2: course Slovakia was a very close ally of the Reich,
Speaker 2: you know, and they they were very much part of
Speaker 2: the Axis alliance. But you know, historically there's no love
Speaker 2: loss between the Czechs and the Germans as uh as a,
Speaker 2: Bohemia and Moravia were incorporated into the Greater German Reich
Speaker 2: and the Czechs of the rump UH Czechoslovakia were incorporated
Speaker 2: into the Greater German Reich. Himmler UH wanted to implement
Speaker 2: what he viewed as, UH this kind of resettlement program
Speaker 2: of ethnically cleansing the Czechs and then settling SS officers
Speaker 2: there and providing them with, you know, fiefdoms within the
Speaker 2: rich agricultural area contained within the protector. Hitler had talked
Speaker 2: about deporting at least six million Czechs to UH the
Speaker 2: eastern hinterland subsequent you know, obviously when like war was underway.
Speaker 2: And but the problem was that UH, the Skota Arms Works,
Speaker 2: which was a rival to Krupp in terms of its
Speaker 2: quality and its productive potential. And despite what a lot
Speaker 2: of people think the German armament's industry, it was very
Speaker 2: localized and almost uh and very much you know, the
Speaker 2: production the fixed capital was in the form of a
Speaker 2: like a shop set up almost that there weren't giant factories.
Speaker 2: So the Germans needed the scot To arms works, and
Speaker 2: they needed the checks that were working there, and UH,
Speaker 2: you know, fighting a race war with the vestigial chess
Speaker 2: check population and then deporting the people who man this facility.
Speaker 2: I mean that would have a non starter.
Speaker 1: But leyah, can I interrupt you? Okay, Well, a couple
Speaker 1: of things. One question I wanted to ask is when
Speaker 1: did how early and when was his decision made the
Speaker 1: realization that in the in the National Socialist cadre that
Speaker 1: they were in a race war. And can you when
Speaker 1: most people think race war, they think people who look
Speaker 1: blacks against whites, and they think inter European doesn't sound
Speaker 1: like a race war to them. So can you address
Speaker 1: both of those?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I I mean it was coded into Hitler said
Speaker 2: as early and I was getting that. Hitler said as
Speaker 2: early as nineteen twenty five. And it's one of the
Speaker 2: few things that's worthwhile. In mine Kamp he said that
Speaker 2: the Germany needs to look eastward because capturing that continental
Speaker 2: land mass, the world island, is what is going to
Speaker 2: make Europe a superpower. And it's it's a fool's errand
Speaker 2: to try and play the game of colonies or to
Speaker 2: you know, try to expand west. And also, you know, Hitler,
Speaker 2: like every other European of the time, you know, he
Speaker 2: he viewed the Westphalian consensus as a moral imperative. You know,
Speaker 2: you don't you're not gonna ethnically cleanse France and capture
Speaker 2: as Laban's wrong. Obviously, why do the Germans view Slavs
Speaker 2: and Jews is a different race? Because they were like
Speaker 2: this idea, this idea that race is group anatomy. Nobody
Speaker 2: thinks that way about Americans, you know. And if you
Speaker 2: look at, uh, the Russians as a people, they they've
Speaker 2: got a totally different lineage, they write in a different alphabet.
Speaker 2: They uh, they've got a totally different heritage. Russia's an
Speaker 2: incredibly racial, like ethnically and racially diverse place, you know,
Speaker 2: and it always has been, you know, the uh, the
Speaker 2: German view of race, and I've written about this, everything
Speaker 2: was biologically coded. Then that's the way everybody thought about things.
Speaker 2: Is this like materialist, reductionist perspective. You know, America thought
Speaker 2: that way, in France, and the UK in in Japan,
Speaker 2: like everybody thought that way. So that's when the Germans
Speaker 2: talk about, you know, this biological criteria determining ethnoics or whatever.
Speaker 2: I mean that that's why it's because that was the Zeitgeist.
Speaker 2: But nobody, nobody in your up viewed uh Eastern Orthodox
Speaker 2: people from the step as white people. And even if
Speaker 2: they were, it's like they you know, they wouldn't even register.
Speaker 2: They're okay, great they're white people. They're still a different race.
Speaker 2: And there are our enemy, you know. And like I said,
Speaker 2: the whole it's coded fear of the East is coded
Speaker 2: into was coded into Europeans. And for a good reason,
Speaker 2: you know, I highly recommend Praudence book. Like I said,
Speaker 2: if people want to understand this, they should read it.
Speaker 2: It's not an accident. It became essential reading in the era,
Speaker 2: you know. And it's I've probably got a bias for
Speaker 2: traditional anthropology because the thing is just more complete, you know.
Speaker 2: And uh, and aside from that, I mean, it's not
Speaker 2: the population genetics is basically validating these observations and the
Speaker 2: kind of mapping of these things based on cultural ephemeraa
Speaker 2: and and ethno linguistic patterns and things of behavior and
Speaker 2: and cultural production and and things like that. But I
Speaker 2: mean that that's that's why, and it uh but it's
Speaker 2: also too I mean, people had to you know, and uh,
Speaker 2: you know, the Soviet Union especially, I mean adding to
Speaker 2: the alienage of it. This was essentially an uprising such
Speaker 2: that there was a European character to the Russian Empire,
Speaker 2: and there was in terms of its leadership cast. You know.
Speaker 2: That's that's what Peter the Great, you know, his whole
Speaker 2: ambition was to European eyes in Russia. And uh, in
Speaker 2: a lot of ways, uh, the uprising that created the
Speaker 2: Soviet Union, once the bolshemk caadres were able to kick
Speaker 2: off the megacitl you know, activity of of of the
Speaker 2: body politic, it basically was a way of wiping out
Speaker 2: the European element that was viewed, not incorrectly as kind
Speaker 2: of an overcast. So there's that too, you know. And
Speaker 2: the Soviets are animated by this aggressive military doctrine of
Speaker 2: of proletarian revolution, and they openly stated they're not bound
Speaker 2: by the Geneva Convention. They don't recognize international law as
Speaker 2: defined and permissively implemented by by the capitalists, you know,
Speaker 2: they they they they categorically removed themselves from the European
Speaker 2: Moral Consensus, even had they been party to it previously,
Speaker 2: and I don't think they were. So it's all of
Speaker 2: those reasons. But the test case if you will, for
Speaker 2: what became racial policy in the East. It started in
Speaker 2: Bohemia Moravia and then the Polish general government enter Hans
Speaker 2: Frank because you know, Poland had to be UH. Poland
Speaker 2: was slated for annihilation, not just owing to you know,
Speaker 2: convenience of geopolitics and you know, and imperatives they're in,
Speaker 2: but also because there was there was genuine ethnic hatred
Speaker 2: in between the polls and the Germans, you know, and
Speaker 2: uh Hitler wanted to punish the polls. There's a deliberate
Speaker 2: violence behind that, and it went beyond the fact that
Speaker 2: you know, settlement of the Danzig Corridor and the fortification
Speaker 2: of it, you know, and and made the mistake like
Speaker 2: when when the Reich invaded the the people at Danzig
Speaker 2: rose up, and you know, they they viewed themselves almost
Speaker 2: like almost like woid Zimbabwe did, as this beleaguered UH
Speaker 2: population that you know, was hated by this super majority
Speaker 2: and that was always at risk of it being ethnically Clinton.
Speaker 2: So you know, there was that too. And and these
Speaker 2: people obviously, you know, they a lot of them were
Speaker 2: like very art national socialists, you know, when they're the
Speaker 2: like okay, it's on, you know, we're we're going to reclaim.
Speaker 2: We're going to reclaim this land for the Reich, and
Speaker 2: you know, we're gonna punish these people who, in their arrogance,
Speaker 2: you know, thought that they could, uh thought that they
Speaker 2: could ethnically cleanse our people from their midst you know.
Speaker 2: So it became what it became what the what the
Speaker 2: foreign ministry, the military, the right chancery came referred to
Speaker 2: as a territorial policy, you know, and that was exclusive
Speaker 2: to the East. In a nineteen twenty eight in talking
Speaker 2: about you know, future racial warfare, you know, Hitler said,
Speaker 2: whether they're gonna have to, you know, in a war
Speaker 2: of conquest, we're either going to have to sterilize foreign
Speaker 2: elements to ensure that they can't contemd you know, continually
Speaker 2: adulterate the conquering element, which is us or quote removing
Speaker 2: them all together, and uh make over to its own
Speaker 2: people the land thereby released, and which is exactly what happened.
Speaker 1: And so how how uncommon a an attitude was that
Speaker 1: towards the enemy at the at the time, I.
Speaker 2: Mean, it was very common. And like I said, the
Speaker 2: polls were the Poles were ethnically cleansing the Germans not
Speaker 2: just on the frontier, but you know they anywhere anywhere.
Speaker 2: They were found in appreciable numbers, and you know, thousands
Speaker 2: were killed, you know, and really and horrible stuff happened,
Speaker 2: you know, on on a par with the kind of
Speaker 2: stuff that happened on the Eastern Front, you know later
Speaker 2: between the Russians and the Germans. You know, the when
Speaker 2: the when the Wehrmacht uh across the frontier, you know,
Speaker 2: and uh, this is documented. You know they found, uh,
Speaker 2: they found people with nails driven into their eyes, guys
Speaker 2: who'd have been severely tortured, and uh, they had their
Speaker 2: genitals cut off and stuffed in their mouth. I mean,
Speaker 2: like like horrifying stuff. I don't get me wrong. I
Speaker 2: mean the Germans returned to serve like like like massively
Speaker 2: and killed a lot of people. But you know, the
Speaker 2: Poles are doing barbaric stuff. You know, this isn't and
Speaker 2: Polands were all bout this crazy military hunda. You know,
Speaker 2: it's like Ukraine one point. Oh, it's like there's this
Speaker 2: crazy houta. It's whacking Jews, it's technically cleansing Germans. It's uh,
Speaker 2: it's technically cleansing Ruthenians and Hungarians and and anybody they
Speaker 2: just don't like, you know, they then they got then
Speaker 2: they got this totally deranged, senile you know, war guarantee
Speaker 2: from the UK, so that they didn't bold them even
Speaker 2: further to do crazy things. You know. This wasn't people
Speaker 2: are acting like Poland was somehow like Sweden and of
Speaker 2: the of A of the East or something. It's like this.
Speaker 2: This was a totally out of control state that was
Speaker 2: behaving as as as a as a rogue government. You
Speaker 2: know it's not.
Speaker 1: Uh, Russia and the Russian Czars had a history of
Speaker 1: dealing with this percent years.
Speaker 2: Well, it's also I mean this pot say too. It's
Speaker 2: you know the reason why Stalin uh, I mean it
Speaker 2: was twofold. Obviously, the the Reich didn't want to open
Speaker 2: a general war up of the Soviet Union. So when
Speaker 2: when ribent Troup approached, you know, it's counterpart in Molotov,
Speaker 2: you know, the Russians, the Russians, Uh, their pretexts and
Speaker 2: I'm gonna it wasn't really pretextual. It was they were
Speaker 2: they were looking to defend their own people in the
Speaker 2: East because the Poles doing the same thing to the Russians.
Speaker 2: You know, I mean, it's not this idea that Poland
Speaker 2: was this great place full of peace loving progressive people
Speaker 2: who were marvelous neighbors. And they had this incredible progressive
Speaker 2: society within normal democratic government. And so that's why the
Speaker 2: Soviet Union and the German Reich just didn't beaded them
Speaker 2: for no reason. You know. It's and I mean for
Speaker 2: context too, and I don't wanna, I don't want to
Speaker 2: derail this into a discussion of the of September nineteen
Speaker 2: thirty nine. But the Reich offered the Polish hunta unconditional
Speaker 2: They said, look, we make no demands other than we
Speaker 2: want some kind of dedicated access route to Danzig, you know,
Speaker 2: and we want some sort of you know, mutual defense
Speaker 2: agreement you know, contra the Soviet Union, because we don't
Speaker 2: coordinate deployment patterns an event of a threat, you know,
Speaker 2: we're both at risk, you know. And and the Polish
Speaker 2: response to that was to start ethnically cleansing the German population,
Speaker 2: you know, for all private persons declare that they they
Speaker 2: it wasn't incumbent on them to negotiate with anybody, you know,
Speaker 2: like I said, it's like Ukraine one point zero, you know,
Speaker 2: it's you're met with grunze threats and obscenities when when
Speaker 2: you when you try and talk to talk to people
Speaker 2: like like men, you know, And I'm not and I'm
Speaker 2: not saying you're saying, I think it was cool or
Speaker 2: a good thing that Poland was a pro brag purpose
Speaker 2: is annihilated by the German, right, But I mean that's
Speaker 2: that that's race war and the if the stakes. And
Speaker 2: to be clear too, what the this. I mean you
Speaker 2: could argue that this is categorically arbitrary, but Aryan elements
Speaker 2: in Poland were treated like any other Europeans, you know,
Speaker 2: or and obviously you know a lot of people were
Speaker 2: bilingual or multi lingual. Clearly people who could physically pass
Speaker 2: as you know, European and we're willing to speak German.
Speaker 2: You know, kind of got along, okay, But you know
Speaker 2: the reality is I'm not suggesting people need to look
Speaker 2: positively on this or something, but you know, in context,
Speaker 2: that was a situation where a basic callousness and brutality
Speaker 2: was characteristic of decision making. But also too, I mean
Speaker 2: again the I think the point of people again and again,
Speaker 2: you know, one of you know, the NBAH, you know, Croatia.
Speaker 2: First of all, I mean the Germans and the Croats
Speaker 2: are always thick as thieves. I mean they always have been.
Speaker 2: They were in the Thirty Years War, you know, Helmet
Speaker 2: Cole immediately recognized Tujmon's independence and ninety one. You know,
Speaker 2: the Croats are very Slovic and who are the only
Speaker 2: people who uh we're not just formally assimilated into the Wehrmacht,
Speaker 2: but they were the only non German element cause ativity
Speaker 2: the Leade Assault group at Stalingrad. It was a bunch
Speaker 2: of Croatians, you know. So it's like, so the Germans
Speaker 2: hated Slavs, yet you know they they were treating the
Speaker 2: Croats as you know, not as fellow nancial socialists, but
Speaker 2: you know they're racial brothers in arms. You know. It's
Speaker 2: you know, the Slovaks too were very uh you know,
Speaker 2: uh Hitler had great respect for Tisso and there was
Speaker 2: a basic affinity between the Slovak uh clerical fascist state
Speaker 2: in Germany. Oh. Delio glibacin that cool get into in
Speaker 2: a minute, because he played an important role in in
Speaker 2: the territorial policy of the SD. He was he was
Speaker 2: a Bulkan slam you know, I mean, there ain't no
Speaker 2: Germans named Gilio globatchnig and he was the equivalent of
Speaker 2: a he was he was the equivalent of a of
Speaker 2: a full colonel in the s S. You know, I
Speaker 2: mean I it's examples are legion, you know, it's there
Speaker 2: wasn't a you know again. But the main thing is,
Speaker 2: like I said, there was there was no category the
Speaker 2: jury of slav That's that's not really it's a cultural
Speaker 2: and linguistic category. But ind of itself, it's not it's
Speaker 2: not it's not a it's not a racial designation anyway,
Speaker 2: nor is it viewed that way in those days. But
Speaker 2: the big if you want to put a date and
Speaker 2: then forgive me that was very much a digression, if
Speaker 2: you want to put a date on when was Ross
Speaker 2: and Kree against policy formalized. The over Salzburg meeting on
Speaker 2: always twenty second nine. This is when it became clear
Speaker 2: that war with Poland was inaudible. Hitler called a meeting.
Speaker 2: He summoned a bunch of elements from ok W, as
Speaker 2: well as UH Himmler and some of the higher SS
Speaker 2: leaders and uh von Bach veedor von Bach was a feldmarshal.
Speaker 2: He said that Hitler openly stated that the coming war,
Speaker 2: the things are going to be done of which German
Speaker 2: generals would not approve, you know. And he said, therefore,
Speaker 2: I'm not going to burden the army with necessary liquidations.
Speaker 2: And it's also you know, like I said, the Himmler
Speaker 2: was an old fighter and uh Hitler was respected him,
Speaker 2: and he wanted to kind of test the apparatus Hitler
Speaker 2: was presiding over in the in a territorial policy that
Speaker 2: was being curated, and Himmler was ominous as the task
Speaker 2: was was more than happy to abide it because it
Speaker 2: gave him this tremendous mandate, you know. And this this
Speaker 2: is the birth of the eset scrup And that's when
Speaker 2: Hitler literally gave Himler the task of forming the inset scruping.
Speaker 2: Not to be clear, because this becomes an issue of controversy,
Speaker 2: and this is actually this, this really was at the
Speaker 2: core of the Irving trial. Irving's claim and I accept this.
Speaker 2: Irving's claim is that there was no fear order that
Speaker 2: ordered the final solution. There was no mass conspiracy from
Speaker 2: the top down to exterminate European jewry that was being
Speaker 2: managed and directed by Hitler. That should be obvious, like
Speaker 2: to claim otherwise, that's like saying that Lynding Johnson ordered
Speaker 2: the Meli massacre and he was pouring over body count
Speaker 2: reports and demanding to know, you know, what what the
Speaker 2: ratio was in free fire zones and Vietnam. That's just
Speaker 2: not how executive power works in the modern state. You know,
Speaker 2: incident to a territorial policy, obviously you're gonna need elements
Speaker 2: that deal in very bloody and grim things like ethnic
Speaker 2: cleansing and like antipartisan duty, which honestly, there's this gray
Speaker 2: area between what constitutes the antipartisan duty and what is
Speaker 2: just ethnic cleansing. Okay, this isn't semantics or word games.
Speaker 2: This is a fan act. And uh the earliest iteration
Speaker 2: of what became the Einsets group and during the during
Speaker 2: the anslus Hydrich deployed with order police and sd elements
Speaker 2: that have been design formerly designated SAUNDER commandos literally Special
Speaker 2: Detachment elements, and uh they went into Austria to basically
Speaker 2: protect the rear echelons and uh handle constabulary duty with
Speaker 2: an eye for deep security. You know, communists and uh
Speaker 2: Jewish agitators and other people who were you know, axiomatically
Speaker 2: opposed to the Reich and uh the Sunda commandos deployed
Speaker 2: again when Czechoslovakia fractured, and you know, the protectorate was
Speaker 2: declared and and the Wehrmacht moved in to the Czech
Speaker 2: rump state. But once once the immediate task at hand
Speaker 2: was over, they'd kind of been like reabsorbed into this
Speaker 2: like subordinate element accountable to the Gestapo and the the
Speaker 2: sd generally. So it was the over Salzburg meeting in
Speaker 2: August thirty nine that was the birth of the Eindsetts
Speaker 2: group in formal terms. And that is and we're talking
Speaker 2: about ethnic cleansing and ross and krieg and the territorial policy.
Speaker 2: The other important the other important event and day is
Speaker 2: October forty three. Read the posts and speeches where Himler
Speaker 2: openly he doesn't dwell on it, but he talks about,
Speaker 2: you know, in the conics of territorial policy. He assembled
Speaker 2: higher s asent police leaders. He says, we're talking about
Speaker 2: the annihilation of the Jewish people. He openly says that,
Speaker 2: you know, and people can argue semantics with me on that.
Speaker 2: But I like, again, why I don't know why people
Speaker 2: who identify as revisionists try and take this kind of
Speaker 2: perspective of none of this happened. That's silly. And it's
Speaker 2: also it's not the issue, you know. It's the issue
Speaker 2: is this is characteristic of modern war and it doesn't
Speaker 2: represent some rarified evil or something. And foundationally too, it's
Speaker 2: not an accident, I mean nineteen thirty nine obviously something
Speaker 2: we haven't addressed in discreet terms yet. We've been talking
Speaker 2: about the territorial policy and the Ross and Kreeg between
Speaker 2: you know, the Eastern Slavs and the Germans. We haven't
Speaker 2: specifically talked about, you know, the ethnic cleansing of of
Speaker 2: the Eastern European Jews. The UH I mean obviously coded
Speaker 2: into national Socialists ethics, you know, it is the understanding
Speaker 2: that Jews are the enemy in existential nontological terms. But
Speaker 2: it was in January nineteen thirty nine, that's when it
Speaker 2: Hitler issued the speech before the Reichstag, so eight months
Speaker 2: before your Salzburg meeting. That's when he said, quote today,
Speaker 2: I'm going to once again be a prophet if the
Speaker 2: international finance Jewry, if international finance Jewry inside and outside
Speaker 2: of Europe manages once more to precipitate the world into war.
Speaker 2: The outcome will not be the bolshivization of the earth
Speaker 2: and the consequent triumph of Jewry, but the annihilation of
Speaker 2: the Jewish race in Europe. End quote. Now, this was
Speaker 2: when this was in response to, according to most people
Speaker 2: who know the lower immediately prior Heim Weisman, who was
Speaker 2: an essential figure or a key figure, and what became
Speaker 2: the focus. He'd written a letter in Evil Chamberlain promising
Speaker 2: that all Jews everywhere stood with the UK and on
Speaker 2: the side of anybody who fought the Third Reich. And
Speaker 2: the Times published that letter, and that's the source of
Speaker 2: that headline. You know, world Jewelry declares war against the
Speaker 2: German Reich. So that's the context. And January nineteen forty two,
Speaker 2: and Hitler referred to that Weisman's statement on more than
Speaker 2: one occasion. And then January thirtieth, nineteen forty two. I
Speaker 2: don't accept the vance conference narrative. We can talk that
Speaker 2: at some point. Why I I think it. It was
Speaker 2: part of the narrative aspect of the case in chief
Speaker 2: for a specific intent homicide. So it was a and
Speaker 2: if you know anything about the way prosecuting authority structure cases,
Speaker 2: it's based on narrative. So I don't accept that, but
Speaker 2: it is clear the Einstins groupmen became active in Earnest
Speaker 2: in the opening weeks and months of ninety forty two,
Speaker 2: and it was January forty two he said, he said,
Speaker 2: for the first time, we're implementing ancient Jewish law, eye
Speaker 2: for an eye, tooth for tooth. You know, we're against
Speaker 2: the tribe. Obviously, the you know, the intended sentiment being
Speaker 2: the Jews started this war, and so now they're reaping
Speaker 2: the whirlwind, and they they're waging a racial war on Europe.
Speaker 2: We are waging a racial war against them. In kind.
Speaker 2: I place a lot of emphasis on direct testimony and
Speaker 2: declarations of key personages. I mean, whatever the subject matter is,
Speaker 2: probably because my background in part is in the law,
Speaker 2: but the essential understanding the perspective of the fear, and
Speaker 2: particularly because this is an issue that's specifically put in controversy,
Speaker 2: you know, about not just executive intent, but the degree
Speaker 2: to which policy was being driven by individual decisions, you know,
Speaker 2: and obviously no decisions of a political sort in war
Speaker 2: and peace especially or are rendered in isolation. So this
Speaker 2: is it wasn't just an afterthought or you know, Hitler
Speaker 2: taking the kind of rhetoric that was common to people
Speaker 2: like Carl Luger and just implementing it at scale because
Speaker 2: he was crazy your head, some sort of homicidal prejudice.
Speaker 2: It was very it was inextricably bound up with I mean,
Speaker 2: don't get me wrong, like the fact that there was
Speaker 2: this racial war going on in the East. That absolutely
Speaker 2: is a brutalizing effect. And once you cross that threshold
Speaker 2: you can't not only can not go back from it,
Speaker 2: but it also changes things, you know. And this is
Speaker 2: also when that became clear. You know that the Allies
Speaker 2: intended to destroy Germany, you know, and it's okay, this
Speaker 2: is an existential fight, and you know, the Jews have
Speaker 2: openly declared war on us. And to be claire too,
Speaker 2: whether you accept this or not, I mean not you personally,
Speaker 2: I mean whether anybody accept this or not. Not just
Speaker 2: Adolf Hitler, but the entirety of the German Reich leadership
Speaker 2: class really their military element. They viewed the world Jewish
Speaker 2: population as a combatant actor. The fact that there wasn't
Speaker 2: a Jewish national state didn't matter, you know. They viewed
Speaker 2: him as a party combatant to hostilities. You know, So
Speaker 2: if you're going to burn our cities to the ground
Speaker 2: and set fifty thousand women, kids and old people on fire.
Speaker 2: When we find you in Belarus, we're going to kill
Speaker 2: all of you and kick you into a ditch. I
Speaker 2: mean that was the you know that that's pretty awful stuff,
Speaker 2: but you know that that was the mindset. That's uh
Speaker 2: the reality. You know, this stuff wasn't just spontaneous, and
Speaker 2: you know it's also and it's convoluted too because speaking
Speaker 2: of uh like speaking of Globok or Paul Global actually
Speaker 2: but uh, you know Global, it was claimed he was
Speaker 2: responsible for the Bobby R massacre, like what was claimed
Speaker 2: that the casualties claimed at Bobby are that's literally not possible,
Speaker 2: you know, So, I mean there's all this you got
Speaker 2: to wade through this bullshit too gross, the exaggerator just
Speaker 2: crazy claims. So then that further convolutes the issue, and
Speaker 2: that also encourages people to doubt the entirety of what happened,
Speaker 2: you know, and things like that. So they wanted to
Speaker 2: mention uh, the low guy of that photograph to bring
Speaker 2: it back the uh the Lublin district in the East, Glibashnik,
Speaker 2: Heidrich and Himmler himself. They had an idea of creating
Speaker 2: German settlements and what was formerly Poland in Ukraine and
Speaker 2: then ultimately you know, uh Russia proper. You know, they
Speaker 2: wanted to create these settlement areas where s S Man
Speaker 2: would be given a life fiefdom, like a life estate
Speaker 2: and h you know, they they'd be this kind of
Speaker 2: warrior yeo memory like the opponent, like de fact m Rhyn,
Speaker 2: but of the Eastern frontier, you know, and they'd they'd
Speaker 2: be this professional warrior element. But you know, they'd also
Speaker 2: preside over these big agrarian of states and that would
Speaker 2: be the bread basket of you know, Western Europe and
Speaker 2: uh Veninsia. There's this que quadrilateral sort of territory bounded
Speaker 2: by Lublin, zittomir Veninzia, and Levov. Each was a special
Speaker 2: or a special each was There's a lot of s
Speaker 2: S activity in particularly Einsts group and activity in each
Speaker 2: of those low Guy and Lublin specifically, that was the
Speaker 2: Glibashnik's headquarters the rights here S S. Himmler. His command
Speaker 2: HQ was at Zamyr and during the first phase of
Speaker 2: first phase of Barbarossa, as the Wehrmacht made rapid advance.
Speaker 2: There was a settlement center that Hitler set up for
Speaker 2: German Ukrainians, you know, to basically corral the Ukrainian folks
Speaker 2: Deutsch and give them first choice on where they wanted
Speaker 2: to live, and you know, try and curate a vanguard
Speaker 2: population of Volkstutsch, you know, as the hostilities r under way,
Speaker 2: to beef up security in the rear areas. But also,
Speaker 2: you know, the Germans realized they were racing the clock
Speaker 2: even if nbcy A get realized. In you know, December
Speaker 2: forty one, Carl Wolf wrote about this. You know, was
Speaker 2: was SS adjuctant to Hitler. It was just an interesting
Speaker 2: guy and he he is I if you come across interviews,
Speaker 2: one of which from around nineteen eighty one was really fascinating.
Speaker 2: But he he said some interesting stuff and he uh
Speaker 2: he made the point that you know, everybody in the
Speaker 2: control element around the fere and he was in a
Speaker 2: position to know because I mean he was literally the
Speaker 2: SS adjutant to the theory realized we were racing the clock,
Speaker 2: you know, and that's one of the reasons why the
Speaker 2: the R s h A and the s D in
Speaker 2: the Aisis group and became so active, you know, the uh.
Speaker 2: But yeah, the they kind of polish up the Polish
Speaker 2: Ukrainian frontier for ethnic reasons, for geostrategic reasons, for reasons
Speaker 2: that arable land, and because historically that was the heartland
Speaker 2: of folkstoutsch in the east. You know that this this
Speaker 2: all magnified the significance of this area. So that's that's
Speaker 2: part of it too. And Glebashniks an interesting figure. He
Speaker 2: was a bad guy like he uh. I mean I
Speaker 2: mean that I'm not being judgmental in some petty stupid way.
Speaker 2: I mean, you need, you need bad guys to get
Speaker 2: things done at war. But he he was very much
Speaker 2: a gangster. He murdered some guy, some jeweler in Vienna,
Speaker 2: and he was a wanted man. And the fact that
Speaker 2: the National Socialists were at war with the Dolphus regime,
Speaker 2: I mean, they ended up murdering him, you know Dolphus. Uh,
Speaker 2: that's one of the things that kind of spared him
Speaker 2: from being held to account for it. But you know,
Speaker 2: he also uh, he got he he got in trouble
Speaker 2: for graft and he actually he got I think he
Speaker 2: actually did time in a concentration camp for for for
Speaker 2: graft and theft. And Hidrake intervened to get him sprung
Speaker 2: because you know, he was exactly the kind of man
Speaker 2: one needed for this kind of duty. But yeah, it's
Speaker 2: really interesting and uh thanks. Uh. I don't want to
Speaker 2: tell a good ghoul, but this this stuff's really in
Speaker 2: my wheelhouse, and especially because right now I'm it directly
Speaker 2: tracks with the manuscript that I'm working on, so it's
Speaker 2: the forefront of my mind. I saw that news a bit,
Speaker 2: I shout it out out some stuff about it on
Speaker 2: social media. That's photograph, you know, and it's an upsetting photograph,
Speaker 2: you know. And I I realize it's probably not a
Speaker 2: topic a lot of people what when I get into
Speaker 2: or think about over their lunch breef or something. But
Speaker 2: what it's important, and it's it's it's it's important not
Speaker 2: just to people who have kind of esoteric interests and revisionism,
Speaker 2: but it's important just in general terms to understand, you know,
Speaker 2: the the conceptual environment relating to the war and things
Speaker 2: and as it evolves.
Speaker 1: It's also not for I mean, most people aren't even
Speaker 1: equipped to study this because they've we the social engineering
Speaker 1: regime has made it so that talking about this is
Speaker 1: uncouth and you're yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And also people just don't because of what we've been
Speaker 1: taught for so long, you know, And the reality is
Speaker 1: of modern warfare being basically from the sky and from
Speaker 1: drones and dropping bombs on people. This as foreigns everybody.
Speaker 1: And also you're trying to you're trying to project American
Speaker 1: values and you know, whatever American values are now upon
Speaker 1: something that happened eighty years ago, and you know, ninety
Speaker 1: years ago, that is a completely different world. And everybody
Speaker 1: just wants to judge something from the past through Oh,
Speaker 1: we're so much better than that now, and you know
Speaker 1: I would say, no, we're not, No.
Speaker 2: Not at all. Yeah, And that's what you know, like
Speaker 2: I said, in the kind of stuff, identical stuff. Albeit
Speaker 2: again the the the rationale within the parameters of of
Speaker 2: of the conflict were different, but you know, this kind
Speaker 2: of categorical homicide was the norm. Apparently it's okay if
Speaker 2: Israel does this, but you know that owing to you know,
Speaker 2: a special special dispensation. So no, it's very it's very dishonest,
Speaker 2: you know. And this, you know, like I said, I'm
Speaker 2: not this stuff's important. That's why I I mean, I
Speaker 2: basically dedicated my professional life to researching this now. And I,
Speaker 2: like I said, I wasn't trying to be a shill,
Speaker 2: but I I believe in this nnuscry of them writing.
Speaker 2: I think it's important. The subject matter is not an
Speaker 2: important and I appreciate having a chance to talk about it.
Speaker 2: And like I said, it was timely because that I
Speaker 2: was fancy it too. By that facial recognition software identifying
Speaker 2: the man in the photograph, that's that's wild.
Speaker 1: Well, it'd be interesting if we could use that to
Speaker 1: identify some people in some Russian or Ukrainian photographs from
Speaker 1: the Bolshevik Times. And oh but I'm sorry you they
Speaker 1: get a they get a pass because yeah you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, so probably gonna be I'm not
Speaker 2: trying to be flippant, but there's a does this This
Speaker 2: is gonna make it harder for people to like run
Speaker 2: from their past if they've if they've done bad things.
Speaker 2: The guy captured on video or some girl made a
Speaker 2: mistake years back and did like some some squeezy porn
Speaker 2: movie or something. I like, I'm not kidding this, this
Speaker 2: does have potential. I guess. I guess the rebuttal people's
Speaker 2: claim it's like deep fake or something, but it's I no,
Speaker 2: it's it's got for historical research. That's it's tremendously useful,
Speaker 2: and it's gonna it's gonna it's gonna resolve uh something
Speaker 2: during mysteries. Definitely.
Speaker 1: All right, thank you, thank you for this, and uh,
Speaker 1: I encourage everybody to go over to Thomas's substack. That's
Speaker 1: real Thomas seven seven seven dot substack dot com and
Speaker 1: to yeah, what's your the website again, what's the address
Speaker 1: on the website.
Speaker 2: It's uh it's Thomas seven seven seven dot com. Miss
Speaker 2: number seven each on me seven seven seven dot com.
Speaker 2: It was briefly down for like twenty four hours, but
Speaker 2: it's up again, and there's my my newest contents like
Speaker 2: posted up there. So yeah, check out the website. And
Speaker 2: from the website, you should be able to navigate to
Speaker 2: everywhere I'm at, you know, like Instagram, social media, you
Speaker 2: know all that stuff. And yeah, I appreciate you hosting me, ma'am.
Speaker 1: Oh it's Thomas, thank you very much. Appreciate you