WEBVTT 1 00:00:16.679 --> 00:00:20.199 Welcome to this edition of The High Strangers Factor, copyright 2 00:00:20.239 --> 00:00:23.239 in on the Paranormal UK Radio Network. I'm your host, 3 00:00:23.280 --> 00:00:26.600 Steve WD along with Susie Bastile and Andy Mercer. The 4 00:00:26.679 --> 00:00:29.239 High Strangest Factor was created about half a dozen years 5 00:00:29.280 --> 00:00:33.280 ago and we have covered all aspects of the paranormal. 6 00:00:35.159 --> 00:00:38.079 Andy and Susie tell us a little bit about yourselves 7 00:00:38.119 --> 00:00:47.119 and what's going on and how people can can contact you, ladies, Well. 8 00:00:48.000 --> 00:00:52.000 People can't contact me, sorry about it, but anyway, I 9 00:00:52.000 --> 00:00:56.719 had questions for you guys actually before we started, so 10 00:00:57.799 --> 00:01:03.240 yesterday I was thinking about Lemon spaces and the theories 11 00:01:03.399 --> 00:01:08.000 that paranormal activity happens in these liminal spaces because it's 12 00:01:08.040 --> 00:01:12.359 an area of transition and things like that. And I 13 00:01:12.400 --> 00:01:15.439 was wondering, do you think that's why there's so many 14 00:01:15.480 --> 00:01:18.239 toilet ghosts and bathrooms. 15 00:01:21.480 --> 00:01:23.040 That may be an American phenomena that. 16 00:01:24.879 --> 00:01:29.040 You don't have to I'm glad somebody thought to ask 17 00:01:29.120 --> 00:01:29.640 that question. 18 00:01:33.159 --> 00:01:34.519 Any number of reasons for that. 19 00:01:36.560 --> 00:01:40.200 Well, let's let's hope they're not around. They have no 20 00:01:40.239 --> 00:01:44.920 business being there. But anyway, Uh, go ahead and tell 21 00:01:45.000 --> 00:01:47.680 us a little bit about yourselves. We already already just 22 00:01:47.680 --> 00:01:50.480 found a lot out a lot about Susie, but we'll move. 23 00:01:50.400 --> 00:01:54.280 On disconcerting at least. 24 00:01:55.599 --> 00:01:57.280 Well as you know. I'm still plugging. Like one next 25 00:01:57.319 --> 00:02:00.239 book I'm working on at the moment, which should be 26 00:02:00.280 --> 00:02:04.000 out of mid spring. It's a transcription of a handwritten 27 00:02:04.439 --> 00:02:07.920 GRIMWAF from the eighteen hundreds which hasn't been published before, 28 00:02:07.959 --> 00:02:11.080 so I'm working on that and discovering the various other 29 00:02:11.199 --> 00:02:13.439 versions of it that are out there, and compiling a 30 00:02:13.560 --> 00:02:16.080 sort of an essay that will go with the book, 31 00:02:16.280 --> 00:02:19.319 talking about the development of this particular manuscript, which is 32 00:02:19.400 --> 00:02:21.159 keep me very busy, which I've enjoyed. 33 00:02:21.240 --> 00:02:21.400 You know. 34 00:02:21.479 --> 00:02:24.199 I'm quietly living in the West Country, in a little 35 00:02:24.240 --> 00:02:27.000 village away from the bright lights of London and Essex 36 00:02:27.039 --> 00:02:29.120 where I used to live. I'm enjoying the piece and 37 00:02:29.199 --> 00:02:32.599 quiet out you which is very cool. Because my wife 38 00:02:32.599 --> 00:02:35.599 Many is away for the weekend. She's off rain dark 39 00:02:35.960 --> 00:02:39.240 costly music view once, I have the house to myself, 40 00:02:39.280 --> 00:02:40.120 which is very nice. 41 00:02:40.159 --> 00:02:45.360 In need SUSI, so I don't. 42 00:02:45.400 --> 00:02:47.240 I don't have too much of anything going on. My 43 00:02:47.360 --> 00:02:50.159 muggle job has been getting in the way of having 44 00:02:50.199 --> 00:02:54.960 too much fun and I'm about to be an empty nester. 45 00:02:56.360 --> 00:02:58.199 In the next couple of months. My son will be 46 00:02:58.240 --> 00:03:05.159 going off to college in deserting me, but hopefully, you know, 47 00:03:05.240 --> 00:03:07.800 getting rich so he can support me in my old age. 48 00:03:07.840 --> 00:03:09.120 So I can't complain too much. 49 00:03:10.360 --> 00:03:15.360 You're getting into your excursion season where you go exploring 50 00:03:15.439 --> 00:03:19.039 now with the weather getting a little bit more easy 51 00:03:19.120 --> 00:03:19.439 to take. 52 00:03:20.080 --> 00:03:24.439 Yeah, it was the air outside no longer hurts your face. 53 00:03:24.800 --> 00:03:28.759 So hopefully I can get in a weekend adventure soon 54 00:03:29.479 --> 00:03:33.599 and actually probably usually the first stop of the year 55 00:03:33.759 --> 00:03:38.400 is Anawon Rock, which is up in Rehoboth Math, which 56 00:03:38.400 --> 00:03:41.919 is part of the Bridgewater Triangle. It is it's near 57 00:03:42.000 --> 00:03:47.800 where the Redheaded Hitchhiker is spotted. But Anon Rock has 58 00:03:48.120 --> 00:03:53.360 known for like phantom drumming, and there's been phantom fires 59 00:03:53.400 --> 00:03:57.280 there as well. Of course I haven't seen anything there, 60 00:03:57.400 --> 00:04:00.120 but that's generally my first stop in the springs. So 61 00:04:01.400 --> 00:04:03.960 if I finally do see something, you guys will be 62 00:04:04.000 --> 00:04:04.560 the first to know. 63 00:04:05.560 --> 00:04:08.439 Well, you be an exclusive for the high strangeness factor. 64 00:04:09.560 --> 00:04:16.759 I attended the Frogman Conference yesterday in Loveland, Ohio. The 65 00:04:16.800 --> 00:04:19.000 story goes back in seventy two. There were two different 66 00:04:19.000 --> 00:04:23.160 police officers separated by I think two weeks Ray Shockley 67 00:04:23.199 --> 00:04:25.639 I think was one of them. They saw this strange 68 00:04:25.720 --> 00:04:30.040 amphibian creature climb out of the Little Miami River. Somebody 69 00:04:30.120 --> 00:04:34.959 had seen something like that in nineteen fifty five. And anyway, 70 00:04:35.600 --> 00:04:39.079 these guys barely show up and they've got their own festival. 71 00:04:39.600 --> 00:04:42.720 And yeah, you know, Mothman took decades to get his festival. 72 00:04:42.759 --> 00:04:47.240 It just doesn't seem right somehow. But it was interesting. 73 00:04:47.360 --> 00:04:51.720 You know, it's just the fourth outing. It's just incredibly crowded, 74 00:04:52.399 --> 00:04:57.000 and people are dressed in wearing frog ears and wearing 75 00:04:57.040 --> 00:05:00.600 frog costumes and so forth. There's a lot of books 76 00:05:00.600 --> 00:05:04.360 and artwork and so forth being sold, and some pretty 77 00:05:04.360 --> 00:05:07.639 good speakers too. Chad Lewis is someone I know from 78 00:05:07.720 --> 00:05:10.920 the Van Meter Visitor Festival, and he talked about the 79 00:05:11.120 --> 00:05:18.519 connection between strange lights and some cryptids, and James Trivett 80 00:05:19.680 --> 00:05:23.879 he talked a lot about various folklore in Ohio. So 81 00:05:24.000 --> 00:05:26.279 it was I didn't see all the speakers, but it 82 00:05:26.360 --> 00:05:31.319 was really a good time. So now let's introduce our 83 00:05:31.360 --> 00:05:32.800 guest if I can just find. 84 00:05:35.759 --> 00:05:37.439 I have to say I'm very jealous of you guys. 85 00:05:37.439 --> 00:05:40.560 All these conferences you have almost every weekend is very 86 00:05:40.560 --> 00:05:42.480 little like that over here we have the occasion conference 87 00:05:42.480 --> 00:05:44.920 I spect on a few weeks ago, but the sheer 88 00:05:45.120 --> 00:05:47.839 volume number of you guys have in the States just 89 00:05:47.879 --> 00:05:49.959 astounds me off. I'm quite jealous. 90 00:05:50.519 --> 00:05:53.720 Well, I might begin by making a comment on Anawan 91 00:05:53.879 --> 00:05:59.800 rock that's not too far from the location that h 92 00:06:00.040 --> 00:06:05.199 he Lovecraft went to to observe Howie's comment in nineteen ten, 93 00:06:06.879 --> 00:06:11.279 a little bit closer into to Providence than the Ino 94 00:06:11.319 --> 00:06:14.920 one Rock. But he also was in his teenage years, 95 00:06:16.399 --> 00:06:20.199 he and some friends at a clubhouse out not all 96 00:06:20.240 --> 00:06:23.360 that far from in a one Rock, where they would 97 00:06:23.399 --> 00:06:28.600 go and uh and have fun. I don't know that 98 00:06:28.720 --> 00:06:34.800 he ever store any any spirits or phantom fires or anything. 99 00:06:34.839 --> 00:06:38.040 However, I don't think he's a strict non believer. 100 00:06:38.079 --> 00:06:39.759 If I remember correctly left Craft, I had no real 101 00:06:39.839 --> 00:06:42.959 belief in any of the paranormal, was caught supernatural or anything. 102 00:06:43.000 --> 00:06:44.240 From what I remember reading. 103 00:06:49.160 --> 00:06:55.319 He was quite a materialist. I had sent him a 104 00:06:55.360 --> 00:06:59.319 montage of book covers, and he may be getting into 105 00:06:59.360 --> 00:07:01.160 trouble trying to display that. 106 00:07:01.680 --> 00:07:02.279 I don't know. 107 00:07:02.600 --> 00:07:06.439 Okay, every time, I guess I was able to do this. 108 00:07:06.560 --> 00:07:09.160 I was able to find Horace's intro. It's a great 109 00:07:09.160 --> 00:07:15.240 intro and without losing my image. But Horace, why don't 110 00:07:15.279 --> 00:07:17.439 you just tell us a little bit about yourself? Since 111 00:07:17.480 --> 00:07:21.480 I can't seem to. I keep disappearing, which is not 112 00:07:21.519 --> 00:07:22.000 a good thing. 113 00:07:24.160 --> 00:07:28.639 I grew up in Connecticut, not all that far from 114 00:07:28.639 --> 00:07:33.959 where SUSI grew up, though, though in the metropolis of 115 00:07:34.720 --> 00:07:41.000 willamant It, Connecticut, and got an education in astronomy there, 116 00:07:41.720 --> 00:07:48.480 and astronomy has been my career professor of astronomy and 117 00:07:48.560 --> 00:07:52.480 physics here at Michigan State University up until the point 118 00:07:52.519 --> 00:07:57.120 I retired and became an emeritus professor, and eventually they 119 00:07:57.199 --> 00:08:00.399 kicked me out of my office. I'm just working from home, 120 00:08:01.160 --> 00:08:06.879 but have interested in a variety of subjects, from strange 121 00:08:07.120 --> 00:08:12.680 things seen in the sky to historical astronomy to more 122 00:08:13.680 --> 00:08:21.319 academic sub such as post sitting stars. And I became 123 00:08:21.439 --> 00:08:25.040 very interested in HP Lovecraft at a rather early age, 124 00:08:25.240 --> 00:08:30.319 and was particularly interested in his own interest in astronomy. 125 00:08:32.200 --> 00:08:34.480 Many of you may know, in case you have any 126 00:08:34.679 --> 00:08:38.679 people in the audience who don't know, it should be 127 00:08:38.679 --> 00:08:44.000 Lovecraft was one of the foremost writers of weird fiction 128 00:08:44.399 --> 00:08:48.080 in the first part of the twentieth century, and has 129 00:08:48.360 --> 00:08:52.559 influenced a lot of people subsequently, but it's not always 130 00:08:52.639 --> 00:08:57.960 viewed favorably by some because he was rather xenophobic in 131 00:08:58.039 --> 00:09:05.000 terms of not approving of the melting pot of American culture. 132 00:09:06.320 --> 00:09:11.679 And it is well one of the things disappoints one 133 00:09:11.759 --> 00:09:15.720 when if one is a Lovecraft fan. But nonetheless I 134 00:09:16.360 --> 00:09:22.200 thoroughly enjoy his writings and I've tried to track him 135 00:09:22.240 --> 00:09:25.399 down a little bit, and that is the origin of 136 00:09:25.440 --> 00:09:30.200 one of my books with co author Edward Guiemott, who 137 00:09:30.240 --> 00:09:33.879 I think was at one time on Susie's old show 138 00:09:33.960 --> 00:09:34.799 as well, wasn't he? 139 00:09:35.799 --> 00:09:42.080 And I actually I just went to a Nearer conference, 140 00:09:42.159 --> 00:09:49.279 a New England's Antiquities Research Association, and it was out 141 00:09:49.320 --> 00:09:52.639 of college, and I kept saying, I know someone who 142 00:09:52.799 --> 00:09:55.279 works here, And the whole time I'm there, I'm thinking, 143 00:09:55.320 --> 00:09:57.639 I know, I know someone that works here. As soon 144 00:09:57.639 --> 00:09:59.759 as I got home, I realized it was Eddie, and 145 00:09:59.799 --> 00:10:02.320 I so upset that I didn't take that chance to 146 00:10:02.399 --> 00:10:05.639 visit him there. But yeah, he was on the show. 147 00:10:05.879 --> 00:10:10.240 He told he told the story of the what it 148 00:10:10.279 --> 00:10:14.279 is the Gloaucus, which is a local cryptid here in connected. 149 00:10:14.399 --> 00:10:20.799 Yes, yes, well it's now I believe chairperson of the 150 00:10:20.840 --> 00:10:26.840 Department of History at Bristol Community College, not far from 151 00:10:26.960 --> 00:10:35.039 the the Bridgewater Triangle there, and he is just finishing 152 00:10:35.159 --> 00:10:40.600 up a book on the history of I'm trying to 153 00:10:40.600 --> 00:10:43.279 remember the title of it. I think it's the Power 154 00:10:43.519 --> 00:10:47.519 of the Flat Earth, idea about people through history. I 155 00:10:47.639 --> 00:10:53.679 believed in the Flat Earth, and that will be coming 156 00:10:53.720 --> 00:10:59.440 out next year by I think Paul Grave McMillan, publisher. 157 00:11:01.080 --> 00:11:02.960 And how did you first discover this year? 158 00:11:03.039 --> 00:11:08.879 Now, Lovecraft, I may have read one or two short stories, 159 00:11:09.000 --> 00:11:15.639 but mainly in nineteen seventy I walked into a department store, 160 00:11:16.759 --> 00:11:19.919 found the rack of paperback books sitting on the shelf 161 00:11:20.799 --> 00:11:24.120 and said, this is a pretty cover. And it was 162 00:11:24.200 --> 00:11:29.200 The dream Quest of Unknown Cadaf, which is one of 163 00:11:29.240 --> 00:11:36.320 his kind of Dunsanian works where it's kind of a 164 00:11:36.399 --> 00:11:41.279 dream world. And I read it and said, wow, I'm 165 00:11:41.279 --> 00:11:44.360 going to read some more of these and others. Some 166 00:11:44.399 --> 00:11:48.399 of the other things were quite different in style than 167 00:11:48.440 --> 00:11:53.240 that one, but it was great fun to read. I'm 168 00:11:53.279 --> 00:11:57.799 not even sure whether it was published in the real 169 00:11:57.879 --> 00:12:01.480 publication during his lifetime. A number of the of his 170 00:12:01.679 --> 00:12:09.000 longer work it's like, ah, I remember the case of 171 00:12:09.039 --> 00:12:12.639 I was dext Ward were not published in in any 172 00:12:13.320 --> 00:12:18.759 widely available source during his life, and he was mainly 173 00:12:18.840 --> 00:12:22.480 known for short stories that appeared, many of them in 174 00:12:22.559 --> 00:12:26.480 Weird Tales magazine and a number of them, a few 175 00:12:26.519 --> 00:12:31.919 of them in what was it Astounding science fiction at 176 00:12:32.000 --> 00:12:34.639 the time, And toward the end of his life he 177 00:12:34.720 --> 00:12:38.200 began to be shifting perhaps a little more toward science 178 00:12:38.240 --> 00:12:44.440 fiction with public with stories like at the Mountains of Madness, 179 00:12:44.919 --> 00:12:48.600 but not the kind of science fiction that many of 180 00:12:48.600 --> 00:12:49.919 the people at the time are writing. 181 00:12:52.120 --> 00:12:58.919 Imber, go ahead, go on. I had the first story. 182 00:12:58.960 --> 00:13:01.000 I think it was in the seventies. I can't remember 183 00:13:01.000 --> 00:13:04.200 the name of the paperback company, but they started reprinting 184 00:13:05.000 --> 00:13:07.679 a lot of Lovecraft. And prior to that, I know 185 00:13:07.759 --> 00:13:13.440 that August Drylth had created Arkham House and it was 186 00:13:13.480 --> 00:13:17.480 republishing Lovecraft in a lot of hardcovers. And then they 187 00:13:17.600 --> 00:13:20.000 started to go out of print and started to just 188 00:13:20.120 --> 00:13:24.320 you know, skyrocket. But I had a collection. My first 189 00:13:24.399 --> 00:13:27.840 story was Late at Night was The Color Out of Space. 190 00:13:28.440 --> 00:13:31.600 And I'm reading this and I'm thinking, you know, this 191 00:13:31.679 --> 00:13:34.399 is a it's like a horror story, but actually when 192 00:13:34.440 --> 00:13:37.720 you boil it down, it's science fiction, so he had 193 00:13:37.720 --> 00:13:41.639 this interesting blend of horror and science fiction in many stories. 194 00:13:45.240 --> 00:13:47.519 Right. The Color Out of Space is one that he 195 00:13:47.639 --> 00:13:52.879 particularly thought well of. Begins with a person walking by 196 00:13:53.240 --> 00:13:57.240 going by an old town that's been flooded to make 197 00:13:57.279 --> 00:14:01.879 a new being flooded to make a new reservoir, and 198 00:14:02.000 --> 00:14:06.240 these gets hearing old stories as to what had happened 199 00:14:07.360 --> 00:14:11.120 in the later eighteen hundreds. This was set in the 200 00:14:11.200 --> 00:14:14.080 nineteen twenties, that would be the time when he wrote it. 201 00:14:14.519 --> 00:14:20.120 Lovecraft himself was born in eighteen ninety died rather young 202 00:14:20.159 --> 00:14:23.559 in nineteen thirty seven. In fact, in one more week 203 00:14:24.320 --> 00:14:29.759 it'll be eighty nine years since he passed away, And 204 00:14:30.200 --> 00:14:33.399 so he was writing these stories, in many of them 205 00:14:33.399 --> 00:14:36.879 in the nineteen twenties into the nineteen thirties. That was 206 00:14:36.919 --> 00:14:40.840 the contemporary time he was writing about. But in this story, 207 00:14:40.960 --> 00:14:45.919 The Color Out of Space, he's securing old tales from 208 00:14:45.919 --> 00:14:50.159 the late eighteen hundreds where the strange meteorite had fallen 209 00:14:51.279 --> 00:14:56.200 on the town outside of town, on this farm, and 210 00:14:56.320 --> 00:15:00.120 the whole story is what happens to the people on 211 00:15:00.159 --> 00:15:05.519 that farm in the time after the meteorite falls, and 212 00:15:05.919 --> 00:15:08.559 it's not like the blob they don't they don't pick 213 00:15:08.639 --> 00:15:12.960 up the media right and get this blob growing on them. 214 00:15:13.080 --> 00:15:17.120 It's it's a little more subtle than that. But it's 215 00:15:17.240 --> 00:15:20.240 a very interesting fun story to read. 216 00:15:21.600 --> 00:15:24.840 Uh when when we talk more about the When the 217 00:15:24.879 --> 00:15:27.919 Stars Are Right by H. P. Lovecraft? And would you 218 00:15:27.919 --> 00:15:35.799 pronounce your co author's last name again please? Okay, that's 219 00:15:35.919 --> 00:15:36.679 that's my favorite. 220 00:15:36.799 --> 00:15:42.440 Well, that hit that punched every button. 221 00:15:43.200 --> 00:15:46.720 I mean, I just just love it. The uh the 222 00:15:46.759 --> 00:15:50.000 references to other you know, science literature and science fiction 223 00:15:50.600 --> 00:15:54.440 and uh, I I never never realized that Lovecraft was 224 00:15:55.360 --> 00:15:58.720 so fascinated by astronomy, and you know, it's it's such 225 00:15:58.720 --> 00:16:03.799 an interesting time. Well, they didn't have uh you know, 226 00:16:03.840 --> 00:16:06.039 there were there were some powerful scopes in other parts 227 00:16:06.080 --> 00:16:09.240 of the country. There was one in California. Nothing matched 228 00:16:09.240 --> 00:16:12.919 what we have today, and so they were really kind 229 00:16:12.919 --> 00:16:15.879 of in the dark ages. But you know what it 230 00:16:15.960 --> 00:16:18.960 meant that they I guess they Your book says that 231 00:16:19.320 --> 00:16:21.600 they didn't even know if there was more than one galaxy. 232 00:16:22.480 --> 00:16:24.240 They didn't know about the life of stars. 233 00:16:24.960 --> 00:16:29.639 That's right. When when when Lovecraft? Lovecraft started out as 234 00:16:29.759 --> 00:16:35.399 an amateur astronomer, when he lived in Providence, the town 235 00:16:35.600 --> 00:16:40.720 he always loved, and he had his own small telescope, 236 00:16:41.159 --> 00:16:44.559 but he used to go visit the lad Observatory, which 237 00:16:44.639 --> 00:16:49.000 is still there today it's part of Brown University, has 238 00:16:49.039 --> 00:16:56.080 the telescope, which to him seemed very large, was not 239 00:16:56.360 --> 00:16:59.279 large compared to what we have today, had a lens 240 00:16:59.399 --> 00:17:05.799 twelve inch is in diameter. And he would became friends 241 00:17:06.039 --> 00:17:11.759 with the the director of the observatory, who allowed him 242 00:17:11.759 --> 00:17:17.039 to come in and not so much use the telescope. 243 00:17:17.079 --> 00:17:20.799 I think it is used the library, and he used 244 00:17:20.799 --> 00:17:25.920 the self. After that, the self publish his own astronomy 245 00:17:25.920 --> 00:17:30.240 and science magazines that it would he and right hectograph 246 00:17:31.160 --> 00:17:35.559 back in the day. Is anyone remember hectographing? I remember 247 00:17:35.720 --> 00:17:42.079 still when I was in school, occasionally instead of getting mimeographs, 248 00:17:42.680 --> 00:17:49.039 would get the even more simple method of hectograph. Well 249 00:17:49.119 --> 00:17:53.000 more laborious probably, but but could be done with just 250 00:17:53.119 --> 00:17:57.920 a without a meograph machine. And he would make maybe 251 00:17:57.960 --> 00:18:01.480 twenty five copies of these magazin scenes that would go 252 00:18:01.519 --> 00:18:08.200 to friends and relatives and fortunately for us, and many 253 00:18:08.240 --> 00:18:14.400 of them are kept today at the at the Library 254 00:18:14.559 --> 00:18:17.960 of Brown University and our online and you can read 255 00:18:18.000 --> 00:18:22.039 them today if you want to see what a teenage 256 00:18:22.920 --> 00:18:27.920 HP Lovecraft was penning in his youth before. He was 257 00:18:27.960 --> 00:18:33.400 also doing some early stories at this time, but didn't 258 00:18:33.440 --> 00:18:37.039 really get into the stories. He wanted to become an astronomer. 259 00:18:37.960 --> 00:18:42.920 He had dreams of becoming an astronomer, but he said 260 00:18:42.920 --> 00:18:48.440 he ran into mathematics and. 261 00:18:47.279 --> 00:18:51.160 That he was. 262 00:18:52.960 --> 00:18:57.920 Couldn't get beyond had trouble with algebra, and so he 263 00:18:57.960 --> 00:19:02.039 couldn't get beyond that. And in fact, some people think 264 00:19:02.079 --> 00:19:07.000 it was that that was partly responsible for a kind 265 00:19:07.000 --> 00:19:10.759 of a mental breakdown he had in nineteen o eight 266 00:19:11.960 --> 00:19:14.519 when he realized that he would not be going on 267 00:19:15.480 --> 00:19:21.400 to become an astronomer. He never actually even graduated from 268 00:19:21.759 --> 00:19:27.400 high school in Providence, let alone made it into Brown University, 269 00:19:28.039 --> 00:19:33.000 and he was rather for the few years after that breakdown. 270 00:19:33.519 --> 00:19:35.680 This maybe the only time that he could really be 271 00:19:35.759 --> 00:19:41.440 considered something of a reculus. But as in later years 272 00:19:41.519 --> 00:19:44.720 he had a lot of friends by letters, he was 273 00:19:44.759 --> 00:19:49.240 one of the world's greatest letter writers. He is reat 274 00:19:49.359 --> 00:19:54.359 thousands of letters to friends, many of which have been 275 00:19:54.559 --> 00:20:01.079 published today. And I think Eddie Gimont said that if 276 00:20:01.079 --> 00:20:04.359 you were alive today, you can see him writing all 277 00:20:04.480 --> 00:20:09.160 kinds of things on Facebook and oh Instagram, and being 278 00:20:09.200 --> 00:20:12.359 a real social media person. I don't know if that's 279 00:20:12.640 --> 00:20:18.559 true or not, but he was certainly use the ability 280 00:20:18.720 --> 00:20:23.920 the techniques of the time to to spread his thoughts to. 281 00:20:24.039 --> 00:20:28.200 Friends, probably Yelp reviews for sure. 282 00:20:29.720 --> 00:20:30.799 He may, he may. 283 00:20:32.440 --> 00:20:35.480 I have a volume of letters with here with Clerk 284 00:20:35.519 --> 00:20:40.480 Ashton Smith, another one of my huge favorite writers of 285 00:20:40.960 --> 00:20:44.039 weird fiction bizarre short stories. I have a lot more 286 00:20:44.119 --> 00:20:46.559 questions on this book, but I want to I know 287 00:20:46.599 --> 00:20:49.480 that both Susie and Andy have some questions for you, 288 00:20:49.599 --> 00:20:52.240 so I'm gonna step back a little bit, but I 289 00:20:52.279 --> 00:20:54.160 want to get back to when the stars are right 290 00:20:54.839 --> 00:20:59.519 just and the fascination that Lovecraft had with the Uh, 291 00:21:00.119 --> 00:21:03.200 with Venus and the moon and so forth. But guys, 292 00:21:03.200 --> 00:21:05.559 go ahead and ask some questions. 293 00:21:07.000 --> 00:21:10.400 So, Horace, when you were on my show, we talked 294 00:21:10.400 --> 00:21:17.880 about your feelings towards Charles Fort, and I was just 295 00:21:18.240 --> 00:21:21.400 right now, as we're talking, I was reminded that I 296 00:21:21.400 --> 00:21:28.119 had an archaeology professor that had similar feelings towards Lovecraft 297 00:21:28.160 --> 00:21:34.000 as you do towards Charles Fort. New England, we have 298 00:21:34.160 --> 00:21:39.319 what we call New England lore or Yankee lore around 299 00:21:39.480 --> 00:21:43.000 the stonework in New England and there's rumors that it 300 00:21:43.079 --> 00:21:49.000 was built by the Phoenicians or Irish monks is another 301 00:21:49.039 --> 00:21:54.079 big one, and he attributed a lot of that to Lovecraft, 302 00:21:54.720 --> 00:21:59.640 but never explained why. So I'm curious to know if 303 00:21:59.759 --> 00:22:02.200 you know why he would feel that way. 304 00:22:03.480 --> 00:22:10.400 Not quite in the sense that Lovecraft didn't have stones 305 00:22:10.440 --> 00:22:15.880 in New England built by people sailing in from from 306 00:22:15.920 --> 00:22:18.839 Europe so much, but he did have in some of 307 00:22:18.880 --> 00:22:25.200 his stories, like the Dunnich Horror, he would have stones 308 00:22:25.279 --> 00:22:29.440 on mountaintops, but there was supposed to be old stones 309 00:22:29.559 --> 00:22:36.920 going back to ancient times and around which supernatural events 310 00:22:38.000 --> 00:22:45.000 and the rituals could be held. So the stones, in 311 00:22:45.039 --> 00:22:51.799 that sense were were not natural, but they weren't anything recent. 312 00:22:53.000 --> 00:22:56.640 And in some of his tails there were mountains where 313 00:22:56.680 --> 00:23:01.359 the people supposed to stay away, as in The Whisper 314 00:23:01.400 --> 00:23:06.759 and Darkness, because they were visited by the Migo, these 315 00:23:06.960 --> 00:23:13.440 alien creatures that kind of interacted with the early Native 316 00:23:13.480 --> 00:23:19.240 Americans who learned not to go near those places where 317 00:23:19.240 --> 00:23:23.440 the migo. Well, although the Migo did interact with some 318 00:23:23.640 --> 00:23:29.839 people and had their minions to do their work, so 319 00:23:29.960 --> 00:23:36.839 I wouldn't think that directly one should think of Lovecraft 320 00:23:37.200 --> 00:23:41.000 as being responsible for that many of these old tales, 321 00:23:43.680 --> 00:23:50.039 constructions by the people coming over from England or the Vikings, 322 00:23:50.640 --> 00:23:55.079 go back long before Lovecraft's time, back many of them 323 00:23:55.480 --> 00:24:01.160 into at least the nineteenth century, if if not earlier. 324 00:24:02.039 --> 00:24:05.279 So I think Lovecraft is getting a bit of a 325 00:24:05.279 --> 00:24:10.720 bum wrap in that from your professor. Now, on the 326 00:24:10.720 --> 00:24:16.920 other hand, Charles Fort, Charles Ford, if you've never read him, 327 00:24:16.960 --> 00:24:21.359 he wrote, lived in from the eighteen seventies to he 328 00:24:21.400 --> 00:24:26.200 died in nineteen thirty two, so he did overlap with Lovecraft. 329 00:24:27.359 --> 00:24:31.079 And he became most famous for the book The Book 330 00:24:31.160 --> 00:24:37.240 of the Damned, which is a collection of strange things 331 00:24:37.720 --> 00:24:41.160 that he thought had been damned by science that is 332 00:24:41.200 --> 00:24:47.039 not included in the usual corpus of scientific knowledge. And 333 00:24:47.079 --> 00:24:50.079 he had some other books after that, like New Lands. 334 00:24:51.680 --> 00:25:01.680 But astronomers were Charles Fort's real, real bete noir where 335 00:25:01.799 --> 00:25:05.440 he was. He didn't think much of astronomers and what 336 00:25:05.480 --> 00:25:09.480 they professed to know about the solar system of the universe. 337 00:25:10.640 --> 00:25:14.480 And as an astronomer, I feel obligated to return the 338 00:25:14.680 --> 00:25:23.839 sentiment and uh, say Charles Fort, Uh, astronomy, much of 339 00:25:23.880 --> 00:25:27.920 astronomy has been proven right since your time. So take 340 00:25:28.000 --> 00:25:36.920 that you Charles for I wrote a little thing about 341 00:25:36.920 --> 00:25:40.039 that once, but I never got it published anywhere, so 342 00:25:41.000 --> 00:25:41.920 I just still haven't. 343 00:25:41.960 --> 00:25:43.079 Known my files. 344 00:25:44.279 --> 00:25:46.880 I just sent my mother a copy of your book, 345 00:25:46.880 --> 00:25:52.039 Williemann Exkui's Ah, and she she had a couple of stories. 346 00:25:52.079 --> 00:25:53.279 She wanted me to tell you. 347 00:25:53.759 --> 00:25:55.519 This is very important happy. 348 00:25:56.160 --> 00:26:00.319 So she thinks these both took place in the late 349 00:26:00.359 --> 00:26:05.319 fifties early sixties. But the first one was her mother 350 00:26:05.599 --> 00:26:08.839 had sent her out. She grew up on a dairy 351 00:26:08.880 --> 00:26:11.839 farm and they had an outbuilding where they kept milk. 352 00:26:12.000 --> 00:26:14.400 Her mother had sent her out to go get a 353 00:26:14.440 --> 00:26:20.519 bottle of milk, and she had seen a meteor shower 354 00:26:21.119 --> 00:26:24.319 when she went out to get that milk. Now, this 355 00:26:24.599 --> 00:26:29.200 was obviously well before the Internet, and she had no 356 00:26:29.279 --> 00:26:33.599 idea what a meteor shower was, and she thought it 357 00:26:33.680 --> 00:26:37.599 was some kind of like signed from God, right, because 358 00:26:37.599 --> 00:26:40.480 that's she I think she was. She would have been 359 00:26:42.079 --> 00:26:46.799 like single digit age at this point. And then there 360 00:26:46.880 --> 00:26:50.000 was another time where she went out at night to 361 00:26:50.200 --> 00:26:55.519 use the outhouse and saw it. Yes, because we didn't 362 00:26:55.519 --> 00:26:58.160 have indoor plumbing and lebanon yet Horace, they only had 363 00:26:58.200 --> 00:27:04.480 that in Willimane. But she saw what she now knows 364 00:27:04.640 --> 00:27:08.160 is the northern lights, but at the time thought it 365 00:27:08.359 --> 00:27:10.759 had to have been some other kind of you know, 366 00:27:11.119 --> 00:27:18.759 celestial signal, because she just had no idea that was 367 00:27:18.799 --> 00:27:19.839 something that happened. 368 00:27:20.960 --> 00:27:26.400 The nineteen fifties were a great time for northern lights 369 00:27:26.720 --> 00:27:30.599 because it was a peak of solar activity. There was 370 00:27:30.680 --> 00:27:34.880 one of the strongest peaks of solar activity that we've had. 371 00:27:35.640 --> 00:27:41.319 And in about nineteen fifty seven, my mother took me 372 00:27:41.359 --> 00:27:45.920 out on the back steps and pointed to the north 373 00:27:46.559 --> 00:27:50.400 where I could see these rays rising up in the sky, 374 00:27:50.440 --> 00:27:53.200 going up and down, and I was told there were 375 00:27:53.240 --> 00:27:57.400 northern lights. And within the next few years I was 376 00:27:57.440 --> 00:28:00.519 able to see a number of displays. When I was 377 00:28:00.519 --> 00:28:06.319 a dusty kid and mostly just dragged out and pointed up, 378 00:28:06.640 --> 00:28:14.039 there was some brilliant displays with bright red showing overhead, 379 00:28:15.440 --> 00:28:20.759 some really fun northern light displays that I I didn't 380 00:28:20.759 --> 00:28:23.559 know they were anything that all that spectacular. I mean, 381 00:28:23.599 --> 00:28:26.759 as a little kid said on northern lights, hmm, that's 382 00:28:26.839 --> 00:28:29.799 that's pretty Uh, those of us happen all the time, 383 00:28:31.640 --> 00:28:35.880 but uh, but I've been following them ever since. And 384 00:28:36.039 --> 00:28:43.359 here in Michigan we've had a few nice displays of 385 00:28:43.519 --> 00:28:46.359 the past few years some have been strong enough to 386 00:28:46.400 --> 00:28:49.680 go into the south and and I don't know whether 387 00:28:49.880 --> 00:28:54.319 Steve has seen any lately or if if any of 388 00:28:54.359 --> 00:28:57.480 you have seen them in the past couple of years. 389 00:28:58.079 --> 00:28:59.920 Of course we have to in Michigan, we have to 390 00:29:00.119 --> 00:29:04.559 hope it's a queer sky too, yeah, exactly, which is 391 00:29:05.200 --> 00:29:08.079 far from being the case on many occasions. 392 00:29:09.039 --> 00:29:14.960 First time sights in Connecticut the last couple of years 393 00:29:15.359 --> 00:29:17.640 in England in the south, which is very unusual. 394 00:29:17.880 --> 00:29:19.720 It's not uncommon to get him in Scotland or out 395 00:29:19.720 --> 00:29:22.640 the other the country, but down southwest it's very unusual 396 00:29:22.680 --> 00:29:26.039 the last couple of years, if you were visible, which 397 00:29:26.079 --> 00:29:27.160 is surprising. 398 00:29:33.400 --> 00:29:36.400 My first time seeing them was the horse was up 399 00:29:36.440 --> 00:29:39.960 on Voice Blank Island in the Straits of Mackinaw, you know, 400 00:29:40.039 --> 00:29:44.359 not too far from obviously Mackinaw Island and the bridge. 401 00:29:44.880 --> 00:29:47.440